questions-2

[plush pelican]

Speaking of Zustandspassiv from earlier: https://dict.leo.org/grammatik/deutsch/Wort/Verb/Kategorien/Genera/NoPassiv2.xml?lang=de

Die folgenden Angaben geben nur Tendenzen an. Gerade beim Zustandspassiv ist oft schwierig zu erklären, weshalb es bei gewissen Verben üblich, bei anderen eher unüblich und bei wieder anderen gar nicht üblich ist.

Es ist allerdings schwierig zu bestimmen, bei welchen Arten dieser transitiven Verben das Zustandspassiv nicht üblich ist. Es gelten die folgenden Tendenzen, die nicht immer eingehalten werden:

"These are the tendencies, that work...most of the time...it's hard to explain..."

and apparently they can build Zustandspassiv at least some of the time:

[signal cipher]

I think I should take a break for this topic and study related ones. Because my mind mixed up so much.

[plush pelican]

Yeah, this is pretty advanced stuff

You'd be better off working on more basic things

[signal cipher]

I don’t know why. Sometimes when I take a break and turn back to a topic, I understand it easier.

Maybe my brain keep thinking it, filtering it.

[plush pelican]

Btw, here they simply say (without explaining why):

• intransitive verbs with "haben" as an auxiliary verb, can't use Partizip 2 as an adjective (and therefore can't do Partizipialsätze with it)
• intransitive verbs with "sein" as an auxiliary verb likewise can't do that, if they don't describe a completed change of location or condition.

That being said, I intuitively understand the first example

"Die Kinder haben gespielt."

"NICHT: die gespielten Kinder"

If you did "die gespielten Kinder", that sounds like the children themselves are being "played"

[signal cipher]

So Verbs with sein also can’t be used like that. Just location, station changing verbs are exemptions

[plush pelican]

like they are the object and not the subject

[long whale]

Yeah, like der gegangene Mann vs. der gegangene Teig

[plush pelican]

I don't know how big the two groups are:

1. verbs with sein that have a completed location or condition change
2. verbs with sein that don't have a completed location or condition change.

So it's hard to call it "exemptions", because the first group might be bigger than the 2nd, 😄

[signal cipher]

There is a movie called gone girl

Why not gone man

[long whale]

der verschwundene Mann ✅

[plush pelican]

"der gegangene Teig" = spoiled?

[long whale]

No, leavened dough

risen dough

[plush pelican]

🤔

so the dough "went" up? 😄

[gusty silo]

aufgehen is the verb indeed

[plush pelican]

so why isn't it "der aufgegangene Teig"?

[gusty silo]

i don't use the phrase one way or the other because i don't have enough to do with bread making, i cannot answer :p

[signal cipher]

What about bagels

[long whale]

To me, both are possible: der Teig ist aufgegangen/gegangen

(DWDS agrees as to "gehen" being used for rising dough, btw)

[gusty silo]

oh yes certainly

[plush pelican]

Du hast Brotverbrechen begangen. Jetzt musst du ins Brotgefängnis 👮

[long whale]

*ein Brotverbrechen 😹

[plush pelican]

doch, mehrere

😄

[plush pelican]

Jeder Tag ohne Brot ist ein Brotverbrechen

[long whale]

Ein Serienbrottäter! Verhaftet ihn!

[gusty silo]

i happen not to have heard or used the attributive participle use of gehen but in other uses yeah, even i have heard unprefixed gehen often enough

in the context of baking/cooking

[fervent kernel]

Das Gesetz verlangt von ausländischen Studenten den Nachweis der Zulassung.
When verbalizing a sentence is it always the first noun in the genetiv that gets verbalized?
How would I know if it's eine Zulassung nachwiesen or einen Nachweisen zulassen
Like in this sentence
Das Gesetz verlangt von ausländischen Studenten, dass sie eine Zulassung nachwiesen

[plush pelican]

Maybe translate the nouns into English (or your native language) and think about it for a second

Hmm. Although in this case the words are kind of annoyingly similar

😅

[fervent kernel]

Yes
But the first noun of the genetiv isn't a rule or smth right?

[plush pelican]

Aktuell fordern die deutschen Behörden einen Nachweis über 934 Euro pro Monat bzw. 11.208 Euro pro Studienjahr.

Dieser Finanzierungsnachweis soll sicherstellen, dass internationale Studierende ihr Studium eigenständig finanzieren können. Denn sie haben in der Regel keinen Anspruch auf staatliche Hilfen in Deutschland.

[plush pelican]

Usually, I think the meaning makes it a lot more obvious

I'm not sure

Voraussetzung für die Zulassung zum Studium an der Universität Osnabrück in einem ersten, berufsqualifizierenden Studiengang (=Bachelorstudiengang oder im Studiengang Erste juristische Prüfung (Staatsexamen)) ist eine dem Abitur gleichwertige Vorbildung. Eine weitere Bedingung für die direkte Zulassung ist, dass Sie über sehr gute Deutschkenntnisse verfügen. Zum Zeitpunkt der Bewerbung müssen diese bereits in der Regel auf dem Niveau C1 nach dem Gemeinsamen Europäischen Referenzrahmen (GER) vorhanden sein.

[swift bough]

that's kinda crazy btw, back when I studied in Germany they only required 10k not 11k

4 years ago

[plush pelican]

Inflation go brrrr

[swift bough]

but when I studied that's not how it worked bc it was a partnership with my American university and so I was there as an "American student" and not technically enrolled in the German uni there

I didnt have to fulfill that requirement

I can't even remember how I dealt with money back then

[long whale]

"etwas zulassen" = to permit/allow -> doesn't work

[plush pelican]

Ah, thinking about the verbs I think makes it easier.

"zulassen" = to allow or admit.

Does the law require from the students that they allow a proof (einen Nachweis zulassen), or that they prove an admission (eine Zulassung nachweisen)?

[plush pelican]

I was almost there!

https://tenor.com/view/crying-emoji-gif-21922016

[long whale]

It might be... 🤔

Das Backen von Brot ist nicht einfach -> Es ist nicht einfach, Brot zu backen (come on, give me a few more examples, we'll work out whether it's a rule!)

[plush pelican]

More sentences in Nominalstil could test the theory

[long whale]

Die Zubereitung eines Essens erfordert Zeit -> Es erfordert Zeit, ein Essen zuzubereiten

[fervent kernel]

I meant when both nouns can be verbalized...

[long whale]

I realized: #questions-2 message

die Anwendung des Gelernten -> das Gelernte anzuwenden

die Anfertigung von Produkten -> Produkte anzufertigen

die Korrektur eines Schreibens -> ein Schreiben zu korrigieren

der Ruf nach Hilfe -> um Hilfe zu rufen

[fervent kernel]

Why is the n dropped

Das Gelernte

[long whale]

https://www.dartmouth.edu/~deutsch/Grammatik/AdjectivalNouns/AdjectivalNouns.html

Adjectives made into nouns they keep their annoying habit of needing the appropriate adjective ending.

[fervent kernel]

Thank u

[plush pelican]

It's still an adjective, with adjective endings. It's just also simultaneously a noun

der große Mann
ein großer Mann

der Große
ein Großer

[fervent kernel]

Yeah I hear it often
Alles gute
Das gute ist...

[long whale]

Yeah. Alles Gute, though

Das Gute daran ist...

Please note I had a brain fart up there - now corrected! Nominalized Verbs are always neuter. Nominalized Adjectives can be any of the 3 genders. However, if you want to talk about the abstract concept, or "things" with a special characteristic, it's usually neuter: Schönes, das Schöne (beautiful [things]; the beauty)

@fervent kernel

[fervent kernel]

Got it. No problem
Thx

[long whale]

🧠 💨 @plush pelican ;)

[signal cipher]

Die zum Picknick kommen werden Schülerin, sind da.
Is this correct

Die Schüler, die zum Picknick kommen werden, sind da

[long whale]

No.

Please check the rules for making Partizip I.

[signal cipher]

Tried to make one with future

[long whale]

Doesn't work.

[signal cipher]

Die morgen zum Picknick kommen Schüler sind da.

[long whale]

What about the form of Partizip I?

[signal cipher]

Die morgen zum Picknick kommende Schüler sind da.

[long whale]

Better, but still not correct. You've used the Partizip I as an adjective without giving it its proper ending, see?

[limber nacelle]

Die Schüler, die morgen zum Picknick kommen, sind hier.
Die morgen zum Picknick kommenden Schüler sind da.

[signal cipher]

But should it be nominative? They come

They do the coming

Do we write in accusative?

[plush pelican]

die großen Kinder

[long whale]

It is Nominativ. What about if you say "the good students"? In Nominativ?

[signal cipher]

Always -en I see

[plush pelican]

well, if preceded by "die", yes

[long whale]

You need the -[n]d ending to make Partizip I. But it still requires the appropriate adjective ending if you use it as an adjective. 🌻

[plush pelican]

with strong declension, it's just -e

große Kinder

[signal cipher]

I thought plural is -e, -e, -en sorry.

[plush pelican]

common mistake

[signal cipher]

Wrong die 😄

[plush pelican]

people get used to feminine and think it transfers to plural. Only later do you realize the two really do have significant differences

Of course, if you use more dative case, you'll realize that as well...

[signal cipher]

But we write the name in nominative right?

I didn’t mix that up?

[plush pelican]

die Schüler?

[signal cipher]

Yes

[plush pelican]

Take out the adjective, and look at the sentence

Die Schüler sind da

[long whale]

das Nomen (the noun) ;)

[signal cipher]

They are synonymous on Turkish sorry.

I mix them up so much.

Homophones

Mixed that up also 😦

Not synonymous, homophones.

[long whale]

Interesting. - Do you need me to point out that even though the sentence is now correct, it isn't really idiomatic?

[signal cipher]

There is future version in Turkish. I wanted to check if there is in German too, since it is possible.

[plush pelican]

Do you mean just because of the Partizipialsatz rather than a Relativsatz?

or something else?

[long whale]

Well... if you wanted a Partizipialkonstruktion, the normal one would be "Die zum morgigen Picknick erwarteten Schüler sind da"

I'd say.

[broken oasis]

Do anyone know a website, that shows if a conjunction is a subordinating conjunction or a coordinating conjunction?

[plush pelican]

🤔

But that's not the same thing

[plush pelican]

Have you tried googling "German subordinating conjunctions and coordinating conjunctions list"?

[signal cipher]

https://youtu.be/wfqDFzIt1AY?si=0zhzpP87PQrSDFUt

[long whale]

If you want to nitpick, there might be a slight difference (if I'm expecting you, that means you're probably coming/on your way, doesn't it?), but as I said, this would be an idiomatic sentence. To me, at least, the one with "kommend" doesn't sound at all natural. 🤷

[broken oasis]

@plush pelican Yes, and I could not find the conjunction "falls".

[plush pelican]

Did you try googling "German conjunction falls"?

https://deutsch.lingolia.com/en/grammar/sentence-structure/dependent-clauses/conjunctions

[long whale]

https://www.linguee.de/deutsch-englisch/uebersetzung/falls.html

[green oracle]

I am not sure if I understand this sentence. I am wondering why it is "das machen" instead of "das Machen". If it's a noun, the "m" has to be capitalized, right?

[long whale]

Correct.

(Besides, you'd usually use a different noun: die Herstellung/das Herstellen; die Anfertigung/das Anfertigen.)

[plush pelican]

In other words: Sometimes German translations of games aren't the best, 😅

[green oracle]

ah, okay, so it's just bad translation?

Okay! Thanks for the replies! Guess I shouldn't play it in German, then...😂

[long whale]

... or choose something else to help you learn German. 😄

[signal cipher]

Fun fact there is a window type called vasistas (was ist das?).

[long whale]

That's in French, AFAIK. 🤔

Oh, in Turkish as well, I see.

[signal cipher]

I always found this funny 😄

It seems like it is named because of a misunderstanding 😄

[long whale]

Well, yes. However, this is #questions, so...

[hushed dawn]

i dont get what phrasenhaft mean ? and in what context we use it

is it true it means someone is just talking nonsense ?

[long whale]

No, it doesn't mean talking nonsense. It's when you say or write something but it's clear you're just using a template, e.g. some example letter/speech you found on the internet. Does this help?

[gritty gyro]

"Dieses Weingut gilt als Erfinder des Verfahrens, nach dem die meisten alkoholfreien Weine produziert werden."

Is "dem" the relative pronoun?

[long whale]

Obviously. 😄

[gritty gyro]

:)

[signal cipher]

I couldn’t understand this:

“Du kennst dich jetzt aus, falls du jemals auf ihn stoßen solltest.”
Auskennen sich - knowing something, being familiar with something. But it’s used with jetzt?
And sollten is soft sollen. It looks weird in this sentence. If/in case of stoß. I understand this part. But what sollten adds?

Is it: now you know what to do if you come across to it?

[dull jackal]

"You now know the situation, so you should be able to handle it if you run into it."

Someone told you how violent that part of town is, and how to tell if you are in danger. So now you know what to look out for and how to react if you notice the signs...

Thats what I get from it.

[fervent kernel]

Er stellte bei der Arbeit fest, den Text fehlerhaft zu übersetzen.
Is this grammatically correct?

[whole portal]

I'm not sure if it's grammatically correct, it might be? But it doesn't make any sense whatsoever

[spiral vapor]

"should you come across him" (it's like "in case")

[whole portal]

What are you trying to say

[fervent kernel]

I'm trying to verbalize this sentence
Er stellte bei der Arbeit eine fehlerhafte Übersetzung des Textes fest

[whole portal]

Wdym verbalize

[spiral vapor]

turn into a verb

[whole portal]

🤔

[fervent kernel]

Eine fehlerhafte Übersetzung des Textes
I have to turn this into a sentence that contains a verb

[whole portal]

Ein Text, der fehlerhaft übersetzt wurde?

[long whale]

No, it isn't.

[fervent kernel]

Could you tell me what the mistakes are?

[long whale]

You need a dass-clause. It simply doesn't work with a zu-infinitive.

And as yoshi suggested here: #questions-2 message, you'd use Passiv.

[fervent kernel]

I didn't understand how the sentence can be formed with passiv though

[long whale]

At work, he found that the text had been translated erroneously

[long whale]

Please note the original German sentence could never relate to "Situation", which is a feminine noun. 🌻

[fervent kernel]

Bei der Arbeit stellte er fest, dass der Text fehlerhaft übersetzt wurde
?

[long whale]

Yes, or "übersetzt worden war".

[fervent kernel]

Thanks

[dull jackal]

AH thanks

So that was literally a caution against someone.

Hey you know xyz about HIM, so if you are with them, be aware?

[long whale]

I'm puzzled by your idea of "sollten" being "soft sollen" (whatever that is supposed to mean). "sollten" usually translates to "it would be a good idea" or "should". "sollen" usually translates to "to be supposed to".

[long whale]

Yes, that sounds a lot more likely. 🌻

[dull jackal]

thanks

Oh no...its another Chris...

[signal cipher]

@spiral vapor @dull jackal Danke schön

[signal cipher]

I thought it’s like wollen Möchten difference

[radiant igloo]

I've wrote a Motivation in my Profile " Deutsch ist schon eine komische Sprache, eine Sprache voller aneinandergereichten Buchstaben, die irgendeinen Sinn ergeben sollen." So my Question is, what mean "aneinandergereichten " in this Case?

[signal cipher]

Why we add should

[long whale]

Nothing. It doesn't exist.

It's probably a serious spelling mistake and ought to be: aneinandergereihten

[radiant igloo]

But i thought, that's every Word in German have own meaning .

I meine denn, dass alle deutschen Wörten eigene Bedeutungen haben.

[long whale]

I still don't know what you mean - or rather: what this has got to do with the fact that aneinanderreichen doesn't exist. You can't just put a random prefix on a random verb and expect it to make sense. 🤷

[signal cipher]

So I have just learned conditional should in English. So Falls+Sollten equal to it?

[radiant igloo]

I got this Motivation from a Deutsch Teacher on YouTube and i thought, that it could be perfekt, if i know an every each meanings of German Word.

[long whale]

I think we mostly use "falls + sollten" when we feel a situation isn't all that likely to occur. If I gave you a present and suggested you could return it to the shop if you didn't like it, I'd probably just say "Du kannst es zurückgeben, falls es dir nicht gefällt", instead of "... falls es dir nicht gefallen sollte".

[acoustic tendon]

can you leave out "falls", "sollte es dir nicht gefallen, kannst du es zurückgeben" i think I've seen that somewhere

[signal cipher]

There is wenn for less likely things. Why I need falls Sollten

[long whale]

Yes.

[long whale]

wenn = very much possible, if not pretty likely -> why would I give you a present you probably won't like? 🤕

[signal cipher]

I didn’t understand. I will search about it.

[plush pelican]

When you have something like that, where the conjugated verb is in position 1, it's actually a hidden "wenn"

Wenn es dir nicht gefallen sollte = sollte es dir nicht gefallen

[acoustic tendon]

yea it's neat, you can do that in English too

[plush pelican]

You can also do "als ob" and replace the "ob" with the conjugated verb

Du verhältst dich, als ob du der klügste Mann der Welt wärst.
Du verhältst dich, als wärst du der klügste Mann der Welt.

[acoustic tendon]

true

[serene mountain]

Stupid question but how do you stop forgetting stuff you have learnt 😭

[plush pelican]

What I do is: I answer questions for people on Discords for German learning 😅

[serene mountain]

Amazing

I forgot the word for occuptaion despite learning in multiple times this week

Arbeit is job/work which I have remembered

[plush pelican]

Do you do "spaced repetition" for vocabulary?

[serene mountain]

What's that?

[plush pelican]

So you know, you can't just look at a word one time and learn it. You have to review it repeatedly

[serene mountain]

Yeah, I am going through Duolingo and Busuu at the same time

[plush pelican]

but then the question is: Okay, but how often. Like, if I review it 20 times a day, that's obviously way too much. How can I review it the fewest number of times possible, and yet still have it stick in my brain?

"spaced repetition" is basically just the idea that you review vocabulary repeatedly, but at slowly increasing intervals

First, you review it once every day, then once every 2 days, then once every 3 days, etc etc

If you ever can't remember it, you reset your interval a bit and make it more frequent again

an app like Anki on Android does this for you automatically

other apps also do spaced repetition, but I've only used Anki personally

[serene mountain]

Is it like flashcards?

[plush pelican]

yeah

you review flashcards, at increasing intervals

[serene mountain]

Yeah ok

I probably should start that

I guess I will need to input all the words I have learnt into it

[plush pelican]

There are pre-made decks you can download, but because it's all free, the quality of the flashcards will vary

[acoustic tendon]

there are decks available on the website

[serene mountain]

You can make custom ones though?

[acoustic tendon]

yes

fully customizable

[serene mountain]

Why isn't bitte at the end of the sentence?

[plush pelican]

It doesn't have to be at the end

[serene mountain]

Surely grammatically it makes sense to ask for something and then say please at the end?

[plush pelican]

https://german.stackexchange.com/questions/1550/where-to-place-bitte-in-a-sentence

[plush pelican]

It is grammatically valid to put it at the end, but not actually the normal spot for Germans

Read the link

[serene mountain]

So you can just plug it anywhere?

[plush pelican]

At the beginning, at the end, but then in the middle I think there's 1 specific spot for it

[serene mountain]

Would you say it's natural to have it at the front of the sentence?

[plush pelican]

Did you click on the link and read the comments?

I think the most natural position is the one in the middle of the sentence

[serene mountain]

Yeah, that's what I gathered but it seems they can just plonk it anywhere

[plush pelican]

I swear I saw somewhere the exact position for it in the middle of the sentence, trying to find it

I think it counts as a modal adverb (adverb answering the question "wie?/how?")

So if you look on this chart for the spot labeled "modal" (a bit more than halfway down)

That would mean it comes:

1. after pronouns

2. after nouns with definite article (den Hund)

3. after temporal and kausal adverbs (wann? warum?)

4. but before nouns with indefinite or no article (einen Hund, Hund)

[vernal ermine]

Ich denke,..... -> after comma does it follows nebensatz without dass?

[plush pelican]

it can, yes, because "denken" is part of a group of special verbs where you can have that "uneingeleiteter Nebensatz", the unintroduced dependent clause.

Did you see before I linked this pic?

hmm, it's not actually listed in there, but it's in the group of "bridge verbs"

[calm raptor]

hallo
could anyone tell me which verb one uses to mean something like "bring in" (I'm not even sure of the verb in English)
like, if I brought some appliance/piece of furniture to an apartment (by carrying it with me), how would one say it, e.g., "I brought this chair [in?]"?

[whole portal]

I mean there's reinbringen but that sounds more like mitbringen to me

[fervent kernel]

Sie hat ihm gesagt:"Sei pünktlich"
How would I form the sentence in indirekte Rede
Sie sagte ihm, dass er pünktlich solle?

I'm not sure if I should add sein to the sentence

[long whale]

You must, yes. If you do, it's correct.

[fervent kernel]

Sie sagte ihm, dass er pünktlich sein solle

Correct?

[plush pelican]

Are you doing like a C1 course or something? Just wondering

[plush pelican]

I think so

[plush pelican]

You can also do the weird "Nebensatz without dass" thing

Sie sagte ihm, er solle pünktlich sein.

[vernal ermine]

Can we add dass with denken?

[plush pelican]

Yes, you can do either

Ich denke, dass mein Hund mein Eis gegessen hat.

Ich denke, mein Hund hat mein Eis gegessen.

[vernal ermine]

What is bridge and non- bridge verbs bro?

[plush pelican]

"bridge verbs" are the ones where you don't have to have "dass" afterwards, like "denken"

Don't worry about "non-bridge verbs"

[vernal ermine]

Do ja oder nein takes o position in a sentence?

[plain umbra]

If you mean as an interjection, basically it just exists by itself outside of any clauses.

That's just how interjections work.

[vernal ermine]

Is there any possibility that I can use verb immediately after ja or nein,

[vernal ermine]

Do you have any sentence for that?

[plain umbra]

Not in the same clause.

[plush pelican]

Ja, ich habe einen Satz.

😄

[plain umbra]

You can start a new clause and that clause can start with a verb.

For example, if it's a question.

[vernal ermine]

I couldn't able to understand it without a sentence bro

[plain umbra]

What do you mean?

[plush pelican]

They don't understand what you mean and want an example sentence

[vernal ermine]

I would like to have some examples. I feel this concept is new.

[plain umbra]

Sure.

"Nein, kannst du Deutsch?"

"Nein, mach zuerst deine Hausaufgaben."

[vernal ermine]

So it works only for question and imperative sentence only bro?

[plain umbra]

Any clauses which can start with a verb, bro.

If you have a different one, feel free to suggest it.

Konj II for example.

Ja, hätte ich Zeit ...

[vernal ermine]

What type of sentence is this , bro?

[plain umbra]

Konjunktiv II.

Hätte ich Zeit = Wenn ich Zeit hätte = If I had time

[vernal ermine]

Is it good to use k2 as a substitute of Wenn and if?

[plain umbra]

It's not a substitute. It's just how you express hypotheticals.

[vernal ermine]

At which level we use this concept bro

[plain umbra]

You mostly learn it in B1 but you learn a few Konj II verbs in A1.

A1 Konj II verbs: wären, hätten, könnten, würden, möchten, sollten.

[vernal ermine]

Yeah bro k2 learned

[vernal ermine]

Could you give this full sentence bro so that I can understand it's meaning

[plain umbra]

Ja, hätte ich Zeit, würde ich mitmachen.

[vernal ermine]

So only we have 3 cases where a verb comes first bro? @plain umbra

[plain umbra]

As far as I can think of right now.

[vernal ermine]

@plain umbra Vielen Dank ❤

@plush pelican Vielen Dank dir auch ❤

[hushed dawn]

Yess, thank you Susana

ausführen vs durchführen ?

[fervent kernel]

A sentence in the video
Das kann Laura gewesen sein
I don't understand why we formed the sentence this way when it's in the past tense

[plush pelican]

Subjective meaning of modal verbs

[fervent kernel]

Yes

[plush pelican]

Das ist Laura.
Das kann Laura sein.

Das war Laura. = Das ist Laura gewesen.
Das kann Laura gewesen sein.

You can't do Präteritum if something else is the conjugated verb already

So you have to break it out into Perfekt-like structure

[fervent kernel]

Das konnte Laura sein
Geht nicht?

[plush pelican]

🤔

I don't think so, but I'm not sure

Get a native in here, I need to sleep 😄

[fervent kernel]

It's mentioned in the vid...

[plush pelican]

Konnte?

😮

[plush pelican]

I guess you can do both, and it's just a matter of matching to whether the rest of the text is using Perfekt or Präteritum

😵‍💫

I have to go to bed

Doch?

https://deutschegrammatik20.de/spezielle-verben/modalverben/subjektive-modalverben-zeitformen/

Here, they seem to indicate subjective meaning only works with the Perfekt-like structure, and the Präteritum structure is objective usage

Idk who to believe

[rain talon]

To say "looking back" as in "Looking back, I was wrong"
Is it more common to say im Nachhinein or rückblickend?

[hushed dawn]

Der Patient wurde eine Operation unterzogen
Der Patient wurde eine Operation überzogen

what is the difference ?

[pure crescent]

Der Patient wurde EINER Operation unterzogen
= the patient received a surgery

Der Patient wurde eine Operation überzogen = nonsense

[buoyant meadow]

Ich means individual?

[icy flax]

A: und noch dazu: wenn es so wichtig wäre, wäre es uns durchgedrungen.
B: ne, nah?

wie wäre es auf ein artikulierteres Deutsch, "ja, genau so wie meine Meinung! Sehr gut gesagt!"?

[icy flax]

ich means "I in English", "yo in Spanish", "eu in Portuguese", "我 in Chinese".

[prisma hearth]

Warum sprechen viele Menschen, die aus der Türkei kommen, Deutsch?

[plush pelican]

Weil es eben viele Türken in Deutschland gibt, es gibt eine dauerhafte (komplizierte) Beziehung zwischen Deutschland und der Türkei.

In den 1960ern und 70ern wurden viele Türken nach Deutschland eingeladen. Damals wurde gedacht, das alles sei vorübergehend, um einen Arbeitermangel zu bekämpfen. Aber viele dieser Türken sind in Deutschland geblieben, sodass 2,9 Millionen Menschen mit türkischem Hintergrund heute in Deutschland leben.

Das sind viele Leute, die dann eine Brücke zwischen der Türkei und Deutschland bauen

[prisma hearth]

Oh danke

[pallid talon]

How i can enjoy roooms

[plush pelican]

Be patient

New users have restricted permissions

[delicate tiger]

kommt ganz auf den Ton an, kann z.B. auch ein sarkastisches "ganz tolle Erkenntnis" sein

[plush pelican]

@delicate tiger can you do subjective meaning of modal verbs in the past using a Präteritum like structure? See conversation above

#questions-2 message

Concrete example:

Das muss Laura gewesen sein.
Das musste Laura sein.

The first is subjective meaning of "müssen"; is the second? Or is that objective use? Does the 2nd work als eine Vermutung?

[delicate tiger]

Does the 2nd work als eine Vermutung?
aren't both?

[plush pelican]

Well, I know the first is

But I've seen several things saying only the first is how you construct subjective meaning in the past

And then this one video where she uses the 2nd

Try it with other modal verbs

Das kann John gewesen sein.
Das konnte John sein.

[delicate tiger]

"musste" -> "müsste" works in both (less certainty)

[plush pelican]

Not ü

musste

Präteritum

[plush pelican]

Here is the sentence in the video

Here is the video:
https://youtu.be/V3EaDpAMMWE?si=Rm6BlFZ3lZ_r_TYl

[delicate tiger]

you can replace "musste" -> "müsste" in both to make it less certain

[plush pelican]

I am not asking if Konj. 2 Präteritum works. I know it works.

I am asking if Indikativ Präteritum works, musste, konnte

starting 13:45 or so, she explicitly says you can do this

but I haven't seen this elsewhere

[delicate tiger]

less common, but works

[plush pelican]

😮

Why haven't I seen this anywhere else?

[delicate tiger]

because it's almost never useful

[plush pelican]

alright, well danke. Today I Learned

[fervent kernel]

Er forderte, über die strittigen Punkte offen zu diskutieren.
Is this correct grammatically?
Just wanna check if the position of "offen" is correct

[delicate tiger]

nicer without "über"

[fervent kernel]

Thx

[fervent kernel]

Die Presse kritisierte den Politiker, der an der Demonstration teilgenommen hat.
Is this grammatically correct?
I'm tryna verbalize this sentence
Die Presse kritisierte die Teilnahme des Politikers ab der Demonstration.

[pallid talon]

Ja

[long whale]

Looks fine to me. (Although I'd probably use Plusquamperfekt: teilgenommen hatte, since he first participated, then got criticized)

[pallid talon]

Korrekt

Nur auf deutsch

Bitte

Ja

[fervent kernel]

Thanks

[long whale]

Please try to get used to seeing answers written in English. 🌻

[fervent kernel]

Also here
When verbalizing a sentnce, is it correct to always use dass, or are these times when it doesn't work

[long whale]

I think it doesn't always work, or there might be an additional da-word required. 🤔 E.g. if the thing you need to verbalize is the reason for something, you might have to use "weil", don't you think?

Ehh... thinking hard, trying to come up with an example...

In der Hoffnung auf ein Geschenk warteten die Leute vor der Tür des reichen Mannes.

[fervent kernel]

Or falls if it's a condition, right?

Beim guten Wetter, geht man spazieren

[long whale]

Yes, wenn or falls.

*Bei gutem Wetter (no comma) geht man spazieren.

[fervent kernel]

Thanks

[plush pelican]

Are you currently doing a C1 course?

Or just learning on your own?

[long whale]

Does the 👍 mean you were just absent-minded, or would you like me to explain why "beim guten Wetter" - although correct, grammar-wise - doesn't really work?

[fervent kernel]

I thought you corrected me cuz it's grammatically incorrect**

[long whale]

No, the problem is: das Wetter is uncountable, i.e. it has no plural. And you know we usually only use plural nouns without any article when talking in general: "Reife Tomaten schmecken gut". But for nouns which don't have a plural, the article is dropped in singular when talking in general: "Ungeschälter Reis ist gesund." "Frische Milch hält sich nicht lange." -> "beim" contains the def. article, but we're talking about good weather in general, because people go for walks whenever the weather is good -> bei gutem/schlechtem Wetter, bei jedem Wetter, bei Regenwetter. Does that help?

(We'd only use the article when talking about the weather at one specific time: Bei dem/diesem guten Wetter wollen wir wandern gehen und nicht zu Hause sitzen!

[fervent kernel]

Yes it does
I didn't know the articles is dropped in singular when talking in general

[long whale]

Much the same as in English, I think. ;) "Clothes are (generally) more expensive in Europe than elsewhere", "Ripe tomatoes (generally) taste nice", etc

[fervent kernel]

Understood, thanks

[scenic siren]

When or why would you include "den" in this sentence:
...aber gleichzeitig ist es nicht so, dass die Menschen enge Beziehungen zu [den] Einheimischen aufbauen.

or why would you not include it?

[long whale]

Lacking further context, I'd say it works exactly the same way it does in English. 🤔 Without the article, it sounds very general (nowhere, ever). If you include it, it sounds as if you're talking about a specific place/country.

[scenic siren]

@long whale danke schön

[vernal ermine]

Ich werde nicht kommen , da habe ich schon etwas vor . Does this sentence order is correct?

[gusty silo]

yeah it is 👍

[vernal ermine]

How bro , with da there would be nebensatz but here no change and same as it.

[gusty silo]

ah i see what you mean

it's not the "because" meaning of 'da', which would require a different order

it's the "there" meaning. I won't come, i already have something planned then, at that time

you could of course also say "Ich werde nicht kommen, da ich schon etwas vorhabe" - I won't come, because I already have something planned

(you can even combine the two and say "Ich werde nicht kommen, da(because) ich da(then, at that time) schon etwas vorhabe"

[vernal ermine]

@gusty silo how you recognize : da gives then meaning? @gusty silo

[gusty silo]

distinguishing the "because" from the "there" meaning works based on word order and regular meaning, the "then, at that time" meaning is simply a contextual form of the "there" meaning

[vernal ermine]

Vielen Dank bro ❤ @gusty silo

[gusty silo]

Kein Ding 👍

[copper orchid]

Früher arbeitete ich als Rezeptionist. Das Hotel sah sehr groß und modern aus. Normalerweise machte mir mein Tagesablauf viel Spaß. Zuerst ging ich zu meinem Schalter und checkte ein paar Kunden ein. Danach zeigte ich ihnen ihr Zimmer. Normalerweise waren sie beeindruckt. Danach hatte ich eine Besprechung, die circa 2 Stunden dauerte. Danach machte ich Mittagspause und aß mit anderen Kollegen. Zu guter Letzt arbeitete ich an der Hotelbar. Danach beendete ich meine Dienstzeit.

Oh and I just noticed

Shouldnt it be Die dauerte?

[gusty silo]

yes good question, this is one of those things that are very annoying to explain i find

yes the matching gender would call for die, but this is really commonly overwritten in german when you can construe this as just referring to the situation as such, rather than the word you used to describe the situation

oh i just saw you have a comma there! my mind ignored that in reading because you capitalise die

you have to choose, do you write:

• Danach hatte ich eine Besprechung. Die(/Das) dauert circa 2 Stunden.
  or
• Danach hatte ich eine Besprechung, die(and never das) circa 2 Stunden dauerte

so your original word order could have been fine but then it'd have to be die not das as you originally wrote and you'd have to write it with a small letter. or you keep the capitalisation and can use either die or das, but this requires a different word order

depends on whether you want to make this a Nebensatz/subordinate clause or a Hauptsatz/main clause

[copper orchid]

Ah makes sense I dont really know why I capitalized it in the first place

[gusty silo]

:p

[copper orchid]

Anything else I should add?

[gusty silo]

you ought not capitalise "Mein" in the third sentence, that's another thing

the only remaining thing is that the many sentences with Danach XYZ sound repetitive, you could either look for a different adverb (like dann) or change the word order in a few ones (Danach zeigt ich ihnen ihr Zimmer to Ich zeigte ihnen danach ihr Zimmer, or whatever)

[plush pelican]

If it is "da = weil", then it will have a subordinate clause word order, with "da" at the front as a conjunction and the verb(s) at the end.

[gusty silo]

but this is stylistic and maybe not necessary for your exercise at all

[copper orchid]

ah okay done

@gusty silo Thank you for the help!

[gusty silo]

👍

[copper orchid]

If you notice anything else please let me know

[gusty silo]

hm, no, this looks good to me

[fervent kernel]

Darauf, dass er kommt, freuen wir uns.
Is it grammatically correct to put da+präposition at the beginning of the sentence

[gusty silo]

i feel like this can be grammatical but sounds really weird in this particular case?

or rather, i think this splitting of clauses sounds unusual, which you can use for emphasis, but here it just falls flat and sounds odd

[plush pelican]

It almost feels like the other usage of "dadurch", where it acts like a two-part conjunction

Something like

Dadurch, dass er kommt, macht er uns glücklich.

[plush pelican]

@gusty silo now what about if we move darauf to the right of the Nebensatz?

Dass er kommt, darauf freuen wir uns.

(as opposed to him bringing presents being what we're looking forward to)

[gusty silo]

still sounds weeeeird (weirder, even). like these are grammatical in the usual sense of that word, these don't sound like they violate a grammatical rule, but the syntax/parseability definitely suffers

but this is tied to the specific example to an extent i think, i believe that a grammatically identical sentence with other words can be fine

[plush pelican]

Freut ihr euch auf seine Geschenke?

Dass er (überhaupt) kommt, darauf freuen wir uns.

[gusty silo]

this certainly sounds like something that could be said and would be unremarkable, but would be interpreted as being "unoptimally phrased", the sort of "say things in the order that they occur to you" thing that also leads to some horribly displaced adverbs sometimes

[rich prism]

would it better to just separate it then.

[plush pelican]

There's some thing where you can repeat a subject or a noun phrase at the beginning, right?

I forget the name

[gusty silo]

probably?

(to argus)

[plush pelican]

I think Hammer's talks about it, one sec

[gusty silo]

(i don't know what exactly you are imagining imo, but since you are typing i think i will find out soon)

[rich prism]

Wait I don't get it

If you separate ot it sounds like something is missing

[gusty silo]

indeed, that's why i was unsure what you were going for

[gusty silo]

aha thought so, yes

this feels very related to these sentences, i agree

[long whale]

IMO, it would be more like "Dass er kommt, darauf freuen wir uns. Dass er drei Monate bleiben will, ist uns ein bisschen lästig." 🤔

[gusty silo]

yeah

i could imagine this sounding better with an example along the lines of "Dass wir gewinnen, darauf kommt es an"

as a repeating structure like in the screenshot

similarly also: Darauf, dass wir gewinnen, kommt es an

unusual, but conceivable to me

[rich prism]

So dass er kommt, darauf freuen wir uns is correct?

[plush pelican]

Like, the reason why you have the weird verb order with Nebensatz + Hauptsatz is that the Nebensatz is considered a part of the Hauptsatz.

But if that is true, and we can highlight parts of the Hauptsatz by putting them out front, that means we could highlight a Nebensatz by putting it out front, right?

[gusty silo]

i think so, mhm

[plush pelican]

How natural is that sentence dMn?

[long whale]

It's correct, anyway. Whether it's going to sound natural or well-phrased is a different question - it would be context-dependent, see?

[rich prism]

How would you say it then

The fact that he's coming, that we are happy about

[plush pelican]

Put the Nebensatz last, normally

[long whale]

Wir freuen uns darauf, dass er kommt. Wir freuen uns auf sein Kommen/seinen Besuch.

[rich prism]

Ohh

[gusty silo]

this is all a very funny case of sentences where people would not question the grammaticality so much as the felicity(as a technical term. which people don't have. so they'll phrase it differently)

[rich prism]

But this sentence has like a tone, does that not exist in german

[gusty silo]

like, i know abstractly that grammaticality and felicity aren't entirely unrelated, but here it really feels that way

you can apply this stress pattern to the german case too

[plush pelican]

Who's Felicity? 😄

[gusty silo]

"just" stress the da very strongly

[plush pelican]

No but really, I'm only vaguely aware what "felicity" means

[gusty silo]

yes i know

give me a second

[long whale]

The love of your life, when it comes to writing German prose. ❤️

[gusty silo]

it's pretty unironically the "this one sparks joy. this one does not spark joy" meme as a linguistic concept

[plush pelican]

Natural-sounding-ness?

[gusty silo]

like felicity is just latin for happiness. i don't know what the actual abstract noun used in linguistics is, but we speak of sentences being felicitous (literally "joyous") or unfelicitous

acceptability~naturalness, yeah

[fervent kernel]

Die Prüfungsergebnisse wurden vom Professor bekanntgegeben.
When nominalizing this sentence, is this a possible answer?
Die bekanntgegebene Prüfungsergebnisse durch den Proffesor

[long whale]

You adjective is missing its appropriate ending. Plus, yours is not a full sentence since it's missing a verb.

[fervent kernel]

The book's answer is "Die bekanntgabe der Prüfungergebnisse durch den Proffesor"

[long whale]

Bekanntgabe and Professor

Okay, so, you don't have to make a full sentence? 🤔

"Die durch den Professor bekanntgegebenen Prüfungsergebnisse" would be a possibility, but that's called Partizipialkonstruktion (and you may not have heard about that yet)

Here, you make the clause into one single, long adjective: The by-the-professor-announced exam results

[fervent kernel]

Nah normally it's a full sentence

Like this
Allerdings sind die größten gesundheitlichen Probleme darauf züruckzuführen, dass viele Menschen rauchen und Übergewicht sowie einen mangel an Bewegung haben

[long whale]

Ah, so, the bit about the professor is missing the rest of the sentence?

[long whale]

Okay, so, the answer is: no. This is not viable in the context of Nominalisierung. 🌻

[fervent kernel]

It was an example on how to nominalize
It's not a full sentence

[long whale]

Yes, I got that now. Still, the answer is no. 🌻

[fervent kernel]

Thanks

[manic matrix]

Any good places for learning German vocabulary? I have grammar books but I need to know what the words mean, first

I might just look at Quizlet

[long whale]

Yes, quizlet, memrise, anki (faq for this in #botchannel ) are all pretty good. Just be aware it's usually an excellent idea to make your own deck - making the cards goes a long way to memorizing their content, you know? Also, avoid having the German word come up first. You want/need to be able to come up with the German word when seeing the English one. (Yes, that's a pro tip.)

[rich prism]

I have alot of quizlet flashcards on german words

[manic matrix]

Anything for conversational German? I have German friends I wanna connect with more

[rich prism]

Idk, what counts as conversational vocabulary?

[manic matrix]

Basic building blocks for German sentences

[rich prism]

Like basic words

[manic matrix]

Sure

I’m like very new to this

[rich prism]

Unfortunately my flashcards are abit more advanced

Bit there are alot that are more basic though

[manic matrix]

Hey, trial by fire is how I do things. I’ll take it if you’re willing to share

All I know how to say is “My name is” and “I want to eat ham”

[long whale]

Well... if you're working through one of the courses from https://learngerman.dw.com/en/learn-german/s-9528, plenty of conversational building blocks will crop up.

It's also an excellent idea not to go "This is what I'd say in English, now, how do I say the same thing in German?" Instead, dumb things down as far as possible, then put the sentence into deepl - if you're trying to imagine what you'd like to say to your German friends in advance. Which is a really useful thing to do. ;)

[manic matrix]

Sounds good, thanks for the advice

[rich prism]

I actually just learnt this tip actually

I thought I was learning but then I switched it around and was like huh

[long whale]

Yeah - I only recently realized people need to be told about this. 😅

[rich prism]

It's definitely more difficult thay way, I wonder why

[manic matrix]

Another question: can I still have your Quizlet since I don’t have other places to learn German vocab?

[long whale]

active vs. passive - same reason why reading is so much easier than writing, speaking is so much more difficult than listening. 🤷

[rich prism]

It's fretnot3

But again, the words are abit advanced

[manic matrix]

I’ll take it, thanks!

[rich prism]

Not for beginners

[manic matrix]

For later haha

[long whale]

Feel free to try whatever you like (after all, language learning is a very individual thing). But from experience, I can tell you it's more efficient to learn vocab you've seen in context - that's actually the reason this is how it's done in course books. 🌻

[manic matrix]

Yeah, like earlier my German friend used lüften in a sentence or something and told me what it meant

Luften? Something

It was just outta nowhere

[long whale]

No, it's lüften (to air a room, clothes, bedding).

[manic matrix]

Yeah, that

[long whale]

Comes from "die Luft" = air.

Which reminds me - if you make your own cards, don't forget to add the article/gender, and while you're at it also the plural of nouns.

[manic matrix]

Yeah I heard about that. Makes it easier to remember if it’s masc, fem, or neuter

[rich prism]

You could ask chatgpt to list some words and then create your flashcards

That's what I did, at least so I didn't have to type them out individually

[long whale]

Why? Why would you do that? 🤔

[manic matrix]

I don’t trust chatgpt

It makes mistakes a lot

[long whale]

Excellent!

[rich prism]

For vocabulary I use it, plus to rate my writing

[manic matrix]

Listen, I made an 800+ Quizlet of all my Spanish vocab by myself, I think I’m good

[rich prism]

But I don't ask It grammar related questions

[rich prism]

I'm way too lazy for that, lol

[manic matrix]

I was bored in class haha

[rich prism]

So I dont have to type

[long whale]

Ehh... And then, you study random words ChatGPT's come up with? How's that working out for you? Or do you give it a topic, like "Give me 20 words related to weather"?

[rich prism]

it works out well generally

Plus I read alot of books so when I come across words it's like oh I know that word

And then it sticks

Like that

[long whale]

Interesting.

[rich prism]

Yea its just random words 🤷‍♀️, I don't give it a topic

[vernal ermine]

Guten Tag Freunde! Please share me some common meaning of doch.

[long whale]

I get how/why this method works for you - now, that is. But my guess is this isn't the way you started out? Because I really don't think it would be a good method for an absolute beginner. 🤔

[rich prism]

I've been using it for quite a while

Idk, that's just how I learn

[long whale]

https://www.thoughtco.com/doch-and-other-tricky-german-words-4081252#:~:text=Doch has many other uses,that (after all).”

[rich prism]

I just know the word, if I'm unsure about context I'll check it

But

Words in context don't really make much of a difference to me

Cause I use forget the context anyways

And just remember the word

It might not seem effective, but that's what works for me😅. Same with other subjects

[long whale]

I think you only think you forget. 😄 (Reading shitloads of books is how I learnt most of my English vocab, and I'm convinced it's seeing words in different kinds of context which more than anything else makes you develop a 'feel' for how they're used.)

[rich prism]

Also cause with books I cant go back and look at it

So there isn't much repetition like flashcards

So I forget it easily

[vernal ermine]

Das ist doch - what you think about the meaning of doch in this sentence. @long whale

[fervent kernel]

Why züruckzuführen?
I don't understand the use of zu+infinitiv in this sentence

[long whale]

sein + zu + infinitive -> etwas ist zu machen = something can be done OR something is to be done/must be done

(special kind of construction)

[fervent kernel]

So Passiverstazformen right?

[long whale]

Yes... https://www.deutschplus.net/pages/Modalitatsverben

[fervent kernel]

Thx

[long whale]

If that's all there is, then it's like "But that's...!", as in "But that's really unbelievable/intolerable!" (depends on context)

Gibberish.

[pure crescent]

Tone, register, placement in sentence construction, words commonly used alongside them... Only context imbues words with all that.

[long whale]

Mind you, people sometimes say "Er ist gegangen worden" to mean "He didn't leave of his own accord, he was forced to leave". But that's a joke-y kind of thing to say.

Same as in English - the other person might just say "So?" or "How'd it go in/with X?" 🤷

[sweet surge]

Yo

Sister stupid

Are you guys there?

[long whale]

Well, apart from that, the normal thing would be "Warst du [nun] in/bei X [, oder nicht]?"

[sweet surge]

Wtf the fk you guys talking about?

[plain umbra]

This is a channel for asking questions about German language.

[sweet surge]

Oh I understand 😊

Like Google translate?

[fervent kernel]

Ganz andere Faktoren als früher bestimmen heute darüber, wie die Gesundheit oder Krankheit der Menschen in Deutschland ist.

I'm trying to verbalize this, "Ganz andere Faktoren als früher bestimmen heute über Gesundheit oder Krankheit der Menschen in Deutschland".

[rich prism]

man I wanna write like this🫠

[long whale]

nominalize, you mean...

[fervent kernel]

Yeah sorry

Does 👍🏼mean that it's correct?

Thx

[fervent kernel]

Mir sind leider, als ich das neue Programm installiert habe, wichtige Daten verloren gegangen.
Why is it "mir sind"?
And isn't there supposed to be sind at the beginning of the second part of the sentence?
Sind wichtige ...gegangen

[vernal ermine]

Vielen Dank❤

[long whale]

It's the construction required by the verb "verloren gehen": jemandem (Dativ) geht etwas (Nominativ) verloren

Think of it as "something is/gets lost to someone"

As to your 2nd question, think: What is the main clause? What is the subordinate clause? Hint: the main clause got split up, the subordinate clause got inserted in the middle.

[fervent kernel]

Many data are lost to me
Right?

[long whale]

Well... what tense is it, do you think?

[hushed dawn]

Im christlichen Mittelalter galt die Einteilung der Menschen in eine dreigliedrige Ständeordnung: Klerus, Adel, freie Bauern und Bürger.

what is the meaning of galt here ?

[long whale]

"gelten" has several meanings. In such cases, you simply need to go over the dictionary entry: https://de.pons.com/übersetzung/deutsch-englisch/gelten (you're in luck here, it comes up pretty early on)

[fervent kernel]

I think I get it
It's the same as "Sie gehören mir"

[long whale]

The construction is the same, yes. But in your sentence, the tense is not Präsens.

[fervent kernel]

Perfekt mit sein

Thx

[vernal ermine]

Das hat mit gut gefallen. Is this sentence correct ?

[long whale]

No. Maybe it's a typo? Have a look at your sentence...

[vernal ermine]

Yeah I checked but the text was like this. I think mir will come. What you think?

[long whale]

Correct. mit mir

[vernal ermine]

👍Ok, Danke

Peter isst Fleisch .Peter isst Fisch.

I think, others will help but I have not came across sentences like you mentioned.

[rich prism]

i think he is right. Sowohl, als auch cant stand on their own separately,they must be together

its just 1 clause i think

[acoustic tendon]

we're going deeper down the clause rabbit hole

[hushed dawn]

hochgestochen meaining ? it translates to pompous but im not sure what that is ?

er spricht / sprach hochgestochen z.B.,
is it the same as hochmütig ?

[serene mountain]

Why is the 'never' part at the end of the sentence?

Why not Nein, ich nie koche?

[acoustic tendon]

V2 word oder, the verb has to be in position 2

[pure crescent]

In addition to that, which is elementary (for normal Hauptsätze), here's why nie goes where it goes in your sentence:

Adverbs and adverbials, including expressions of time, usually come right after the verb in German.

nie expresses time, so the default position is right after the verb.

[serene mountain]

V2 word order?

[delicate tiger]

conjugated part of verb at position 2, subject at position 1 or 3, non-conjugated part of verb at end, other elements mostly freely movable

[acoustic tendon]

wikipedia,

[rain talon]

Can you use unterwegs in a figurative sense?

Like
Unterwegs des Einkaufens habe ich meine Portemonnaie verloren

[long whale]

This totally doesn't work. 🌻

[rain talon]

Okay

[long whale]

"unterwegs" is an adverb not a preposition

[rain talon]

Then
Ich war beim Einkaufen und habe unterwegs mein Portemonnaie verloren

[long whale]

Yes, although I'd either remove "beim", or go for "Ich habe beim Einkaufen mein Portemonnaie verloren"

Remember >faq omittance of movement verbs in #botchannel ? "ich bin einkaufen" = I'm out shopping

[acoustic tendon]

ich muss mal

[rain talon]

Idk if that's the explanation really since there's no modal verb or preposition

[long whale]

Arrgh! Total brain fart on my part! >faq Absentiv

[rain talon]

In the sentence you phrased

[long whale]

faq Absentiv

[stoic mauve]

Absentiv

What on earth is absentiv?

Theo ist einkaufen
Absentiv (or absentive in english) is a grammatical aspect (like how konjunktiv ii is also an aspect) in German. It is used quite commonly in spoken / colloquial standard german, and almost never in formal / written german. As the name 'absentive' might suggest, it is used to express someone's absence in combination with an activity that is the reason for their absence. Key parts of this include the implication that the person will eventually return from their absence, and that the action they're partaking is is something that they do regularly. E.g. hobbies, occupations, etc.

The absentiv is not a progressive tense

Unlike the 'am-progress' Theo ist am einkaufen, the absentiv makes no comment on the state of progress or completion of the activity the subject is doing. It only states that they are not in the current location due to the mentioned activity: for all we know Theo might have already finished shopping and currently be on his way home, or he might only just have arrived at the store.

Page 1/2

[rain talon]

Ok!

[fervent kernel]

whats this

[long whale]

Have you tried using deepl to translate what you don't understand?

[fervent kernel]

ja

idk if i can put arbeiter of if thats specific profession

[delicate tiger]

sounds like "basic unqualified physical worker" to me

[fervent kernel]

which would be the word for ‘i got job is IT’

in*

[delicate tiger]

are you an employee (Angestellter) or freelancer (Selbstständiger)? a programmer (Programmierer)...

[fervent kernel]

programmer

danke schone

schon

on the income section do they expect u to put gross or net?

[delicate tiger]

"Nettoeinkommen"

[icy flax]

wirklich?!

Ich dachte mir, man will immer das Brutto wissen

Vielleicht deswegen bekomme ich auch kaum eine Antwort zurück haha

[pure crescent]

Die können doch gar nicht wissen, was dein Netto sein wird. Sie erwarten Bruttoeinkommen.

[delicate tiger]

In dem Fall steht es explizit auf dem Screenshot

[fervent kernel]

Bei der Vorbereitung dieses Kurses habe ich viele neue Aufgaben erstellt.
If I wanna verbalize this sentence do I have to add für?
Als ich (für) diesen Kurs vorbereitet habe, habe ich viele neue Aufgaben erstellt.

[spiral vapor]

Als ich mich für diesen Kurs vorbereitet have
Als ich diesen Kurs vorbereitet habe

There is a difference in meaning. I think the second option reflects the original sentence better.

[fervent kernel]

Thanks

[vernal ermine]

75 prozent Personen in der Welt sind traurig / 75 Prozent Person in der Welt ist traurig. Welche ist Richtig?

[long whale]

2nd is wrong. 1st isn't quite correct, either: 75% aller Menschen auf der Welt sind traurig OR 75% der Weltbevölkerung sind traurig

[vernal ermine]

Vielen Dank❤ @long whale

[vernal ermine]

Does aller und der coming after 75% follows dativ

[fervent kernel]

In passiv, the dummy subject "es" is used when the verb doesn't take accusative right?
So prepositional verbs or verbs that take dative or verbs that don't take an object like tanzen for example

https://yourdailygerman.com/meaning-es-ist-german/

This here?

Thanks

[long whale]

Genitiv

[stray nacelle]

when to use in, im, an?

whats the difference

[long whale]

faq contractions

[stoic mauve]

Contractions

A contraction (Verschmelzung or Schmelzwort) is a shortened form of a word or group of words created by omitting letters and sounds. Common examples of contractions in English are:

I'm = I am
won't = will not
let's = let us
-'re = are (e.g. we're walking home)

Contractions are often used in German, especially with prepositions and definite articles that take the accusative or dative (never the genitive). For example, zu dem is often shortened to zum, as seen here:

Pferd geht zum Zahnarzt.

Some contractions with prepositions are so common (see below) that they are effectively manadatory in normal speech. Writing the full form has the effect of emphasising the definite article, indicating that you are referring to a specific object. For example:

Pferd geht zu dem Zahnarzt, der ihm gestern empfohlen wurde.

Common contractions in German

These contractions are used very often and are acceptable in formal German.

ans = an das
am = an dem
beim = bei dem
im = in dem
ins = in das
vom = von dem
zum = zu dem
zur = zu der

Additionally, the pronoun es is often contracted when it comes directly after the verb in certain set phrases. For example, the greeting Wie geht es dir? is often contracted to Wie geht's dir?

Contractions in informal German

Contracting the article das to -s in prepositions is very commonly used in informal, spoken German, and sometimes appears in formal German in set phrases.

aufs = auf das
durchs = durch das
fürs = für das
übers = über das
ums = um das
unters = unter das

Contracting the article dem to -m is relatively common in spoken German with almost all prepositions. For example:

hinterm = hinter dem
überm = über dem
unterm = unter dem

Contracting the other articles can also occur, but this is relatively rare.

[stray nacelle]

okay thankj u <3

[vernal ermine]

Danke 🙂

[fervent kernel]

Das Wahlergebnis lässt sich erst in vier Jahren korrigieren.

Das Wahlergebnis korrigiert sich erst in Vier Jahren.

Das Wahlergebnis ist erst in vier Jahren zu korrigieren

Do they all mean the same?

[uneven inlet]

There are small differences: Das Wahlergebnis lässt sich erst in vier Jahren korrigieren, you or someone else are able to correct the election in four years. Whereas the second one is more like, the outcome of the election will correct itself.

[plush pelican]

lässt sich = können, so the first one is "it can be corrected only after 4 years"

the 3rd one, "ist + zu + infinitive" sometimes that means "können", sometimes it means "müssen", sometimes it means "sollen"

I'm not sure here if it reads more like "können" or more like "sollen"

[plush pelican]

With the 3rd one, do you see that as more können or more sollen/müssen?

Are you a native speaker?

[uneven inlet]

I see the 3rd one more like "können" as in "it can be done" but its not an obligation. I am a native speaker.

[fervent kernel]

Sein+zu+infinitive could mean sollen, können and müssen?

[plush pelican]

yes

[fervent kernel]

And sollten as well right?

[plush pelican]

From C-Grammatik:

[fervent kernel]

Thanks

[plush pelican]

It kind of depends on the meaning of the sentence as to how you read it

Usually, the context will help make it clear which meaning it's doing there

for the "müssen/sollen" meanings, it's often used in more formal/elevated speech, in order to avoid having to explicitly say "müssen" or "sollen", so you can make a demand, without explicitly making a demand, 😄

[fervent kernel]

Oh ok, got it

[fervent kernel]

Im Dezember heißt es wieder, die Winterkleidung herauszuholen.
Which modal verb is it here?

[plush pelican]

wider or wieder?

[fervent kernel]

Wieder

[plush pelican]

They mean "sein + zu + infinitive" = a modal verb like können or sollen or müssen

[fervent kernel]

This is Ersatzformen

[plush pelican]

Except this here isn't "sein + zu + infinitiv"

This is an Infinitivsatz

[fervent kernel]

Es gilt/es heißt

[plush pelican]

Not sure, 🤔 sometimes it's necessary, sometimes not, and it's often not clear to me why

I know, I'm saying I'm not sure with this example

[plush pelican]

Gosh, I'm not sure

Maybe sollen?

https://deutsian.tumblr.com/post/181781957887/c2-es-bedarfgilt-constructions

Müssen or sollen, ahh

[fervent kernel]

I phrased the question incorrectly, my bad.
I think es gilt/es heißt could mean sollen, sollten or müssen.
Just wanted to know which one, cuz I couldn't decide

[plush pelican]

This is a separate thing from "sein + zu + infinitive", my bad

This is C2 level stuff, 😲

[signal cipher]

You won’t understand the explanations but you can check the examples.

[plush pelican]

They don't say if "es heißt" is the same as "es gilt", though

Here it says they can both be used as replacement for "müssen"

https://www.wirtschaftsdeutsch.de/lehrmaterialien/grammatik-passiversatzformen-A.pdf

[fervent kernel]

Yeah
This is " es gilt" with zu+infinitiv.
A bit different

[plush pelican]

The new one has Infinitivsätze

I'm not sure I've actually studied this bit before, so I'm learning with you, 😮

[fervent kernel]

Passiv+müssen/sollen/sollten : Die Aufgaben müssen gelöst werden

Es gilt/heißt+zu+Inf: Es gilt, die Aufgaben zu lösen.

[solemn radish]

Wann verwendet man sollen anstatt muessen?

Ohh

So muessen is must

and sollen a softer must?

I see

[plush pelican]

Among other things, apparently

do you mean "obviously"?

I was referring to the above

apparently, "es heißt, X zu tun" = "X muss/soll getan werden"

I myself didn't realize this until looking it up just now

"oblivious" is a word, but it means something different, 😄

[fervent kernel]

I'm trying to form this sentence in passive
Nach einigen Tagen Trocknen in der Sonne verpackt man den Rohkakao in Säcke und verschickt ihn in die Länder wie z.B. die Schweiz, wo man ihn weiterverarbeitet.

Is this how the sentence would look like in passiv?
Nach einigen Tagen Trocknen in der Sonne wird der Kakao in Säcke verpackt und in die Länder wie z.B. in die Schweiz verschickt, wo er weiterverarbeietet wird

[steep galleon]

yes

[fervent kernel]

Thanks

[crisp marlin]

*werden die Kakaos
vielleicht?

[fathom raft]

nope, Kakao in this case is like an uncountable thing like "the sand is transported" sort of thing

Kakao Bohnen would be plural but Kakao is like a cumulative thing

to dry something

They are dried

[crisp marlin]

stimmt <33

[fervent kernel]

I think it means after days OF DRYING...
so not a verb

[crisp marlin]

it's a gerund

a verb functioning as a noun

[serene mountain]

This is probably quite fundamental

But

Why isn't it schwimmst?

As you are talking about the cat and not yourself

[charred harbor]

Schwimmst is for du

For that you need third person singular, which is the er/sie/es form

er/sie/es schwimmt -> die Katze schwimmt

[serene mountain]

Ah ok, so if you are talking about something else it's the he, she, they form not the you form?

[charred harbor]

Yes

[serene mountain]

[plush pelican]

Did you ever read that long section I sent you? 11.6.1(a) talks about this

Sorry, I got interrupted

I was just saying: this is one of those ways the English Gerund converts into German

is you have a nominalized verb

das Zuhören
das Skilaufen (= ich laufe Ski, but as a noun)
etc

Like I said before, translating from the English -ing to German is tricky, 😄

and it varies

"das Skilaufen" is not just a nominalized verb, but a compound thing, it has taken the Verbgefährte with it when it became a noun

That's another quite tricky thing

Hammer's 11.4.1(d) and 20.2.3(b) talk about this

oh, actually all of 11.4 wait

Hammer's German Grammar 11.4:

[serene mountain]

Why not 'Sie ist in gut drauf'?

[plush pelican]

"gut drauf" is not a noun

"in" is a preposition

there would be no object of the preposition

[serene mountain]

Ok, I probably need to learn what makes up a sentence again

[plush pelican]

Literally, it's like, "She is good on it" or something

drauf = darauf, which is like auf + das

[serene mountain]

Where do you recommend where to learn what parts make up a sentence?

[plush pelican]

How much do you know about English parts of a sentence?

Nouns, verbs, adjectives, adverbs, prepositions?

[serene mountain]

Probably just these three ngl Nouns, verbs, adjectives

[plush pelican]

in German, most adjectives also can function as adverbs, and vice-versa

[serene mountain]

You actually never needed to learn how a sentence is structured after primary school lol

[plush pelican]

😄

There's a book I've heard that might be good for this

"English Grammar for students of German"

https://www.amazon.com/-/en/Cecile-Zorach/dp/0934034311

If you really want to learn about how stuff works, that's a 150 page book on it

[serene mountain]

Bruh ok

Well, it would probably make it easier

[plush pelican]

You could probably also find resources online

Maybe look at the table of contents of that book, and then find articles on those concepts online, 😄

[serene mountain]

I know this is very anti-culture but it would be so much better if we all just learnt one language

[plush pelican]

Technically, even German isn't just "one" language

A lot of people speak in dialect, to where people in Switzerland and people in north Germany can't understand each other's dialects, although both are speaking "German"

[serene mountain]

Yeah

[plush pelican]

But that's when talking to people from your area

when talking to people from other areas, or foreigners, they use Standard German

[serene mountain]

It's incredible that you have to learn a sub-language for your language

[plush pelican]

It's the natural tendency of humans to fragment and splinter their language, it's the same reason why there are multiple languages to begin with

[serene mountain]

We have nothing like that really in English, bar minor differences between American English and English eg crisps and chips having opposite meanings

[plush pelican]

Modern languages, to the extent that they are uniform, are mostly artificial efforts made starting in like the 1600s+ in order to help centralize and nationalize a country and get everybody on the same page

that also required suppressing minority languages/dialects, which often continued into the like 1950s

[serene mountain]

Thank god we did not pick Latin because from what I have heard, it is very hard to learn

[long whale]

I know this isn't much help to somebody who's just started learning, but once you start getting to grips with a foreign language, it allows you to see the world from a different perspective. Which, if you let it happen, can be an endlessly fascinating thing. 🌻

[serene mountain]

Yeah, I am committed to learning it. I know the path is long but I feel for three weeks I have made substantial progress

I have always found it so cool when someone can speak or read another language

[plush pelican]

Idk that you can go from noun to verb

[untold trellis]

Hm. People from Scotland are also very hard to understand. And that's a bit similar to Northern German and Switzerland. Different languages that played a role in the history of the language.

[broken oasis]

When do you use the personal pronouns in genitive?

[long whale]

Rarely, and only ever in (formal) written German.

[fervent kernel]

I think maybe just in titles like "die besten Schauspieler aller Zeiten"

[long whale]

This is simply Genitiv - which shows up quite frequently. 🌻

[sweet surge]

I have questions , how German make money online?

If someone know please 🥺 contact me

[long whale]

-> #1033125270217048246

[fervent kernel]

oh yeah, so stuff like meiner, meines, deiner, deines

I don't think I've ever seen anyone use that when talking but usually they use von

[long whale]

If there is a verb requiring Genitiv (sich jemandes/einer Sache bemächtigen; jds/einer Sache bedürfen, etc.), then using "von" won't work. But in speaking, we'd simply use a different verb. 🌻

[fervent kernel]

what's the verb in that regard

[hushed dawn]

Griffen im Jahr 2007 noch 22,6 Prozent der Menschen zur Zigarette, waren es im jüngsten Erhebungsjahr nur noch 19,6 Prozent, wie aus dem diesjährigen Tabakatlas [...1...], den Wissenschaftler der University of Illinois in Chicago und die Organisation „Vital Strategies" herausgeben.

MCQ Frage;
Antwort möglichkeiten

angibt
ergibt
herauskommt
hervorgeht

Bitte können Sie die richtige Antwort auswählen und erklären warum die anderen nicht geeignet sind ?

[long whale]

I'll try to show you how to find the right answer yourself: The thing to watch out for is the preposition in "... wie aus dem diesjährigen..." This means you can discard 2 of the verbs outright, since they either don't work with the preposition "aus", or they'd need a different construction, Now, you just need to choose between the remaining 2. One of those can be used with "aus", but really only in a spatial sense, so, you can discard that one as well.

[hushed dawn]

das ist herauskommen ? dann die Antwort ist hervorgeht ?

Danke Sehr !

[serene mountain]

Yeah, I guess that is true

[vast violet]

Sapir Whorf Hypothesis. There's actually a movie on this as well called Arrival.

[long whale]

Wasn't that the idiot who thought since German doesn't have a continuous tense, Germans didn't have the concept of continuous action? 🤔

[vast violet]

I don't know about that tbh, I just heard about it from the movie

What an odd stance to have

[solemn radish]

So learning 20 words a day is a very effective strategy?

I should start doing that too

I see

Do you note down new words you learned in a list or something

If I learn 5 new words on one day, I'll probably forget them within a couple

I see

Thanks for all the advice

👍

I'll definitely check them out, learning the words from a list can indeed mix up my mind

[whole portal]

Is that true

[solemn radish]

The categorizing similar words is really useful

[whole portal]

Wait no those units make no sense

Ohh no the issue is the lack of the indice for the R I took it as resistance lol

And P as power not pressure

Should be lowercase

Now I see it xd

[worthy sinew]

Hi, I've been learning German for 7 years, but I don't know how to make sentences. Because my teacher tells me that the verb is in the wrong place. Do you have advice?

[plain umbra]

Sure. What's your current understanding of where the verb should go?

[worthy sinew]

In the second position

[plain umbra]

Right. Do you have an example of a sentence where you got it wrong?

[umbral hedge]

Hallöchen

[worthy sinew]

no, I don't have one in mind

[plain umbra]

Do you know where the verb goes in questions and subordinate clauses?

[worthy sinew]

In fisrt place?

[plain umbra]

For questions, yes. What about subordinate clauses?

[umbral hedge]

Speak anyone hier german?

[plain umbra]

If you don't know what that is, it's like, for example, wenn-clause or dass-clause.

Or relative clause.

[worthy sinew]

I don't know 🤷‍♀️

[plain umbra]

Okay, so maybe that's where the gap in your knowledge is.

For subordinate clauses, the finite verb is at the end of the clause.

[long whale]

All the yellow people are native German speakers. Please note the question channels are for questions about the German language (vocab, grammar, usage). 🌻

[worthy sinew]

What is a subordinate clause?

[plain umbra]

Subordinate clauses are clauses started by a subordinating conjunction, as well as relative clauses.

[acoustic breach]

In German, it's called Nebensatz

[worthy sinew]

I thought it was only when there were two verbs

[long whale]

Let me ask you something - does a sentence like Gestern, ich bin ins Kino gegangen look right to you?

[worthy sinew]

So it's like in French? 🤨

[plain umbra]

Sorry, I don't know French.

But try Susana's question.

[umbral hedge]

I want to upgrade my language (German) und my accent

[worthy sinew]

It's the word "gestern" that disturbs me.

[rich prism]

Remove the comma, does it look right

[rich prism]

You could find a study partner on the same level as yoy

[worthy sinew]

I really don't know 😭

[plain umbra]

That's not a correct correction but please let the person asking the question try to understand first.

[rich prism]

So it is wrong

[rich prism]

Or try Nicos weg, provided you're a beginner

[plain umbra]

@umbral hedge @rich prism Susana isn't asking a question. She's helping Elie with a question, so please have patience and wait until it's resolved first.

[long whale]

Yes, well, it's wrong. 😅 It's just that this is a typical beginner's mistake. It ought to be "Ich bin gestern ins Kino gegangen" or "Gestern bin ich ins Kino gegangen" - if those look good to you, I'm not sure where the problem is. 🤷

[rich prism]

I only said it cause the comma can throw some people off slightly. It might seem like the beginning of a sentence.

[plain umbra]

That's part of the question.

[worthy sinew]

So Gestern is in the first place and I have to put the verb right after?

[long whale]

Either "gestern" or "ich" - German doesn't really do that thing English does, where you start a sentence with "However,..." or "Last summer, ..."

[plain umbra]

The verb has to go in the 2nd position, like you said yourself. The first place doesn't have to be gestern, but the second place has to be the verb.

What might be useful is if you go here and scroll down to the word order and conjunctions section and do a few worksheets: https://www.nthuleen.com/teach/grammar.html

If you come across ones you don't understand or get wrong, then you can show us those ones and it will be easier to help.

[long whale]

German allows you to put almost anything in Pos. 1, but the verb comes right after - as pointed out by Basementality.

[worthy sinew]

Okay but what about the subject? Is it "Ich"? That's why the sentence was wrong.

[long whale]

It is "ich", yes. The sentence doesn't have to start with the subject, though.

[worthy sinew]

And do you have exemples?

[long whale]

Very often, the subject will be either in Pos. 1 or in Pos. 3, but not always. Well, the "Gestern bin ich ins Kino gegangen" shows you the subject can be in Pos. 3, doesn't it?

[worthy sinew]

Thank you very much, but I think now I understand

[worthy sinew]

Yes

[icy flax]

Oh, klar! Ich dachte du meintest es wäre eher ein kulturelles Ding

[fervent kernel]

Hello. I have a quick question. What is the best way to learn German for a complete beginner?

ok thank you

[delicate tiger]

please ask only in one channel

[acoustic tendon]

is nicht viel von jemandem/etw halten always negative?

can it be neutral

and what about nichts von jemandem halten? is this always negative, i feel like tbis what you say when you don't like someone

[floral dune]

Well, you can of course say it as a joke

"Von dir hätte ich eh nicht mehr erwartet" while laughing but in the end it'll be negativ

[delicate tiger]

"von dem (davon) halte ich sehr viel" would be positive

[acoustic tendon]

i see thank you

[wet dawn]

What's your question?

Sorry I can't help you, I'm not sure what you're asking

[acoustic tendon]

"you don't have all the cups in the cupboard anymore" this is a german way of saying you're nuts, you have a loose screw etc

you can shorten the saying to "you don't have it all anymore"

du hast sie nicht mehr alle

[wet dawn]

du hast sie nicht mehr alle (... also die Schrauben oder so?)

[warped oriole]

This is the short form of "du hast nicht mehr alle Tassen im Schrank" -> Du hast sie nicht mehr alle.
It means that the person you are saying this to is crazy or something like this.

[acoustic tendon]

here is the entire saying

[signal cipher]

Danke schön.
How would you translate mehr in this sentence

[acoustic tendon]

"nicht mehr" = "not anymore"

i do not like him anymore = ich mag ihn **nicht mehr **

[signal cipher]

Danke schön

[serene mountain]

I thought 'Das Restaurant' would go to 'Ein Restaurant' or am I wrong?

Why is it 'Einem'

[crisp marlin]

dativ!

there's no movement, so "Restaurant" is in Dativ

[serene mountain]

Oh dear, I think I am going to have to learn this too as well 🥲

I have no idea what a Dativ is

Thank you though for the answer 🙏

[charred harbor]

German has four cases which is basically a system that works alongside gender

[bright vortex]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_EWNRkvkZY&ab_channel=LearnGermanwithAnja

[bright vortex]

Best dativ video on youtube

lol

It has a lot of views

I still remember the song till today

[serene mountain]

Ah, ok thank you. I will have to learn what all the stuff on the left but this is a good start

[serene mountain]

I will give this a watch later

[charred harbor]

Here's the rule (with "in")
If you're going from one place to another place (directional) you use accusative case
If that's not the case and you're just in or doing something in one location you use dative case

[serene mountain]

Is this why 'Wo' goes to 'Woher' or is that something completely different?

[charred harbor]

Woher is like from where

Compared to wohin which is to where

[serene mountain]

Does that follow similiar rules as to above?

[charred harbor]

Yes

Wohin gehst du?
-> Ich gehe in <Akkusativ>

[serene mountain]

Ok, I should probably learn the fundamentals of what makes a sentence tbh

[crisp marlin]

Bewegung = Akkusativ (usually)

[charred harbor]

To give an example for this
If you were going into a nice restaurant you'd say "ich gehe in ein schönes Restaurant" (because you're moving inside it from your current location)
But if you're just chilling there you'd say "ich bin in einem schönen Restaurant" (no movement involved)

[serene mountain]

Why is the German language like this?

Like what is the point of changing ein to einem?

Similarly, with schönes to schöonen

[charred harbor]

They can convey different ideas

If you said "ich gehe im Park" people would imagine you walking around a park
If you said "ich gehe in den Park" people would imagine you outside the park and wanting to go inside it

[serene mountain]

But surely the verb would explain the process. Eg, if you say you are going to a restuarant, it is presumed that you are not already in it?

[bright vortex]

Top explanation

[charred harbor]

Gehen can mean walk as well
So you could just be walking while inside of a place

[delicate tiger]

by having the function marked with endings, you gain the ability to move elements around

[serene mountain]

I totally understand what you are stating. However, for the first example, why could you not change the verb to 'walk'?

[charred harbor]

That is the verb for walk :D

[serene mountain]

Bruh 🥲

Well thank you for the explanation though

[plush pelican]

Here is a playlist on cases in German: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLKCEuz6wxDQk_EIj2hea3GbXiBdXfd3MW

The basic idea is: German has a looser word order, things can move around.

In order to tell which noun is the subject, which is the object, which is the object of the preposition, etc, you use cases to help mark the nouns.

[serene mountain]

Danke

I am barely remembering die, der, das, ein, eine, mein, meine, dein, deine and now I have found out there are many more 😭

[charred harbor]

It's not as bad as it seems, I promise

[plush pelican]

practice, practice, practice!

[rich prism]

When you learn , do exercises immediately

[plush pelican]

The more you read and write German sentences, the more you get used to it and internalize the words

[serene mountain]

At what stage did you guys start reading German media or get more involved with the language?

[rich prism]

Very early

[serene mountain]

For example, it would be completely pointless someone who just knows a few words starting to read German because they will not understand any of it

[plush pelican]

I started reading media pretty early, but I'm into politics, so it was fun for me.

But it was definitely not as early as you are

[rich prism]

It was very early for me

[plush pelican]

I knew about the cases and basic word order and stuff before I got into news

There is a website that's supposed to be a bit easier for news: https://www.nachrichtenleicht.de/

But even that is probably too advanced for you currently

[rich prism]

Maybe cause the stuff I found interesting in german was for my age anyway

[plush pelican]

Mostly because you simply won't have the vocabulary necessary to recognize the words

[rich prism]

So it was basic and I could understand it

[plush pelican]

working on vocab is quite important

There are youtube videos with simple German sentences that you can do instead of news. This kind of stuff: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLK8j5XkNJexsxILwJzEcMP3FepS8Rh6QL

@serene mountain

Or search "Deutsch lernen durch Hören a1"

[serene mountain]

Looks good thank you

[plush pelican]

The other thing is: you're going to miss things. You're going to only understand the "gist" of things. That's normal for a beginner. Just keep working on vocab

[charred harbor]

Btw every language has things that are needlessly complicated and pointless tbh
If you try to look for a practical purpose behind everything (especially with German) you're gonna be REALLY disappointed xD

You could argue the whole gender system is 100% pointless, it doesn't matter, it just is

[serene mountain]

It most definitely is but I know it's just something I am going to have to live with

[serene mountain]

Yeah that's what I'm doing but it's good to know why things are the way it is

[charred harbor]

Haha that's the spirit

[fervent kernel]

How can I nominalize this sentence?
Allerdings sind die größten gesundheitlichen Probleme darauf zuruckzuführen, dass viele Menschen rauchen und Übergewicht sowie einen Mangel an Bewgung haben.

Allerdings sind die größten gesundheitlichen Probleme auf das Rauchen vieler Menschen und das Übergewicht sowie ein Mangel an Bewegung zurückzuführen. ?
(I know I've probably sent this sentence many times)

[long whale]

What about (das) Übergewicht? It's kind of 'free-floating' in your sentence, isn't it? Also, as I said, try to transcribe faithfully - there is an ending missing in your original sentence, and it's also missing in your nominalized version...

[fervent kernel]

Thanks
The einen Mangel haben part confused me, I thought it was only for Übergewicht

[long whale]

No, "das Übergewicht" literally means sth like 'surplus weight' -> I'd put it right after "Rauchen". Do check words in a dictionary if you aren't sure about their meaning - trust me, it's important in more than one respect.

Welcome to the server! Please note the question channels are for questions about the German language (vocab, grammar, usage). 🌻

[fervent kernel]

Sollten Sie kurzfristig von der Reise zürucktreten, werden ihre Kosten leider nicht züruckgezahlt.
Why does sollten here mean falls/sofern?

[hushed dawn]

Das Gehirn muss im Schlaf sich widersprechende Bedürfnisse in Einklang bringen

i dont understand why is it reflexiv ?
and i dont understand the full meaning, can someone explain

[signal cipher]

Falls
Falls sollen
Falls sollten

Sollen
Sollten

[hushed dawn]

the brain must put negative needs in harmony during sleep. what does that mean, if i translated it correct ?

[fervent kernel]

Wdym?