avatar-rigging

[pale pumice]

oh boy

do you know what modifiers are in Blender?

[low pine]

like i said, this is my first time

[pale pumice]

like I said, I'm not teaching

[low pine]

ok i know what they are, what do i do with them

[pale pumice]

add an armature modifier to each mesh you want to attach to the armature

[low pine]

like this?

[pale pumice]

that

now weight paint

[low pine]

it aint working

[pale pumice]

that's a useful statement

[low pine]

how many spine peices are required?

for a vrc avatar?

[pale pumice]

hips, spine, chest, neck, head. upper chest is optional

[balmy delta]

Shoulder, upper arm, lower arm, wrist are required bones
Fingers are not

Upper leg, lower leg, ankle are also required
Toe technically isnt but recommended since in unity bones only have a single point unlike blender which as the base and end points

[low pine]

this

work?

[robust crescent]

hips, spine?, chest

[nova shard]

someone told you this earlier but theres a pin that shows the correct rig setup, your screenshot looks like you're missing a Chest bone which isnt optional

[low pine]

.

[nova shard]

upper chest is optional

chest isnt

[low pine]

the big bone IS chest

[nova shard]

then wheres your spine?

[low pine]

the groin bone

[pale pumice]

don't forget that I am not an authority here, anything I say you should research and confirm for yourself 🙂

[nova shard]

okay then wheres your hip

you've got 2 there and ya need 3

[pale pumice]

Also that was in order from the root

[marsh herald]

Created duplicates of armbones and meshes because I wanted to add extra limbs, I'm not sure about rigging, i've tried ctrl + P and automatic weights but nothing, help? u.u"

[pale pumice]

if those are separate parts still, just rename the vertex groups for attaching to arm bones to the new arm bone names

[marsh herald]

The thing is that the bones are not exactly on the same places so whenever i move them they kinda break

[pale pumice]

Yes, of course

you'll probably need to do some weight paint touch-ups

[marsh herald]

Hmm alright alright

[rare moon]

an easy way to do that is to duplicate the arms so that each new pair is a different object. Then duplicate the armature for each new pair and assign it accordingly. Also make sure to parent "with armature deform" each arm pair to its respective armature. Make sure that when you move the arms down that you do it by an exact number or copy the value. Then you can use this exact value to move the bones in edit mode for each respective armatures. This also will help with even spacing. Since you'd also have the appropriate bones selected at this point, you can press ctrl+i to invert your selection and delete the rest of the bones in the armature. Do this for each duplicate. Now you can rename the bones in each duplicate armature. Next join the duplicate armatures to the main armature, and parent the arm bones correctly. Lastly, join the arm meshes to the main body mesh

the main benefits of doing it this way are:

• your spacing will be even
• your bones will be perfectly aligned with your arms
• you only have to rename the bones; the vertex groups will rename themselves

[marsh herald]

I just saw it, sorry and will try it, but duplicating it sometimes proves to be difficult doing it correctly

[wintry jetty]

hello im trying to set up physbones for my toes and im curious if anyone knows where i can set the limits for how they rotate and behave

[robust crescent]

limits and angle limits

[wintry jetty]

pitch roll and yaw refer to what axis? im so used to x y z i dont know what those mean

[robust crescent]

can test that and see wich way it goes, my skirts/hair/tail usually have ? (dont remember) one of them

dont need colliders much if you use angles

edit it while in play mode you can see where it goes

cone also shows it

[pale pumice]

if you play with these limiters while gizmos are on, you can figure that out from the visuals provided on the bones

but generally they're based on the position of the bone, in the direction it faces (head to tail). Defaults for pitch/roll depend on bone roll settings (which you can configure in blender).

[brisk cloud]

neck/head gets detached from the body on full body, also view point gets lower. tried lockin on head but no luck, please helps

[wintry jetty]

why does his mouth stay open wide like this? it isnt like that in the unity preview of my project

[pale pumice]

unmap the jaw bone if you aren't using it for speaking

[wintry jetty]

well i am planning on using it to speak. just dont know what tab to get into for adding the jaw flap descriptor

[pale pumice]

oh then set that up in the Avatar Descriptor

[wintry jetty]

yeah. in blender i use both shape keys and flap bones but it seems i can only do one or the other in unity

[pale pumice]

correct

well... you can do bone via the descriptor and animate using the Viseme parameter

might get messy or desynced though

[wintry jetty]

well i will have to work on the shape keys and make them more expressive. i useually work on the assumption that if its not to my liking i can use the bones i the rig to do the finer adjustments to how i want it

[pale pumice]

you could pose the bones then turn that into a shapekey

[wintry jetty]

yeah but that takes a lot of extra work. plus i only have the jaw flap bone

[pale pumice]

yep

[wintry jetty]

i could use it to make new shape keys and overwrite the old ones. eventually

working with what i have but making the jaw flap part of the shape keys instead of relying on my bones to do that

[severe magnet]

so i downloaded a Crowbar prefab from POINTLESS on Gumroad and i was just wondering- do i just put the constraints in the wrist ends or do i have to edit something for them to work

[pale pumice]

did it not come with instructions that explain this?

[severe magnet]

yeah, i forgot-
i placed the constraints on the wrists and now they won't work cuz the avatar doesn't have hands

[torpid ermine]

beginner question, why does some avatars have their upper leg bones Z axis point towards the front and not the back?

or does it matter?

[pale pumice]

a lot of avatars aren't made well 🙂

ideally you want the bone roll for all the major humanoid bones to be 0

[torpid ermine]

what do you mean roll? do you mean for the upper leg bones, should be Z pointing to the front?

[pale pumice]

roll is one of the parameters for bones, you can see it in the 'item' tab of the 'n' popup thingy in Blender when editing the armature

I forget what that translates to for orientation in Unity

[sterile orbit]

not sure if this is the right channel to ask but i think its the way its rigged. my avatars proportions look okay for where my feet and hand trackers are, but in game when i straighten out my arm it gets locked straight but my irl arm is still bent. how would i fix this? i tried stretching out the arms a little bit in blender but that didnt really solve the issue

[umbral shale]

pretty sure its the proportions

theres one thing I kinda need help with though that I couldnt find anything that helped, im trying to rig this dreamcatcher necklace inspired by death stranding

but I am not sure what im supposed to do to create my own physbones or how I would attach it to the avatar

[umbral shale]

im figuring ts out nvm

[lyric ginkgo]

Hello

[azure wedge]

im not sure how to rig this model, i want the body to be the full body, and i wanna have physics on the tail. Anyone can help or explaib how i could rig this?

plus theyre different objects, not all joined

(except for the tail parts)

[prisma radish]

Is rigging hard to learn?

[nova shard]

make it a normal armature but attach the fish/tadpole's body,eyes (mouth if thats also a sepereate mesh) to the Head bone (or a Hand bone if you want it to be a puppet avatar) then just create a bone coming out from the head/hand bone to be your tail's bone so that you can add phybone physics. i highly suggest merging them into a single mesh for optimization's sake though do it after the model is rigged to make it easier to weightpaint

[nova shard]

only really hard if you dont already know how blender works imo

[prisma radish]

So is it easy to learn rigging and how blender works?

[nova shard]

easy to learn how blender/rigging works: yes especially if you use google/youtube/this server to look up specifc issues you're running into

easy to actually do both after learning them: it varies depending on how the model is setup

[static parcel]

Are there any sources about how unity humanoid rigging works with advanced hand tracking, such as vr gloves?

I'm trying to do a character with fingers that have one joint instead of two, but I worry they won't move accurately for the person using the tracking.

[balmy delta]

I mean its just the finger bone moving?

less bones less precision

[static parcel]

That's my concern. I could just put the last bone on the intermediate or distal slots, and that would be fine with regular controllers and index, but it might be notible with 1:1 hand tracking?

I guess I could set it to bend the one joint more, to match up?

[balmy delta]

not what I mean

less bones less points of rotation

itd be like trying to put your hand at a specific location but then trying it again without bending your elbow
suddenly you go from having a big range of motion to a much smaller one
same would happen with less bones in the fingers
sure you can open and close them but you wouldnt get as much articulation

[rare moon]

I mean you could always make 2 sets of finger bones and use rotation constraints to match the rotation so that the total amount the fingers bend is the same as the person's finger

[static parcel]

That might be a better option, yeah

[harsh bobcat]

anyone ever get an issue where their hands are like 90 deg rotated in? it looks normal in unity and when i use gesture manager but in game its broken

[autumn grotto]

Thanks for all the people helping each others to grow their skill and sharing solution with them

[drowsy horizon]

my shoulders keep getting fucked up when importing to unity

does anyone know how to fix this?

[uncut breach]

most likely not unity, it's just the weight painting on the shoulders are bad

do the same pose in blender's pose mode and you'll see the same

[pale pumice]

sometimes the shoulder bones are weirdly long, or pivot from an awkward place. but yeah, not a unity thing

[torpid ermine]

what determines the height of the floor in relation to foot/toe bones? must the foot and toe be flat and touching the ground in T-pose?

[torpid ermine]

like what happens if my shoe has high heels

[chilly ether]

dont think it has to be flat besides when the bones are setup in unity/blender
heels i think are just rotated using a blenshape (usually?)

[pearl rover]

the legs keep shifting to the side, everyththing is mapped correctly and the orientations are perfectly mirrored

[robust crescent]

is this in playmode with av3/ect ? , it will shift slightly cause of locomotion

[pearl rover]

im using gesture manager

the animations seem fine

theres probably nothing wrong and im just used to working on shorter avatars

💀

[robust crescent]

its not your rig, its locomotion

try with base set to -none- it wont do that in playmode

[pearl rover]

thanks

[crystal sinew]

Hey! I'm creating an avatar from scratch and running into an issue with my thumb bones. Unity says they aren't aligned properly in a T-Pose, but I don't want to force a strict T-Pose. Is there a workaround for this in Blender?

I want to learn how to avoid it in the future

[candid solstice]

Why dont you want to force t pose?

[crystal sinew]

well, nothing wrong with doing it. I just want to know how I can avoid it

[candid solstice]

But why? I dont think there is a way to avoid it, or any good reason to. Its just one button press.

[crystal sinew]

I get that forcing a T-Pose is easy, but I want to understand the rigging process better and avoid misalignment issues from the start

if its possible ofc

[candid solstice]

Okay. I was just asking to understand what problem you were trying to solve. But I dont have any useful information for you, perhaps someone else will.

[crystal sinew]

No worries! I appreciate you asking 💖 Hopefully, someone else might have some insights on this

[torpid ermine]

Unity assumes your imported model is in t-pose, if you don't t-pose, it will bend things as if you have a t-pose (as far as i understand)

Actually, scratch that

it is not unity, i think it is VRChat controllers for animation and body tracking requires a t-pose

so, you MUST t-pose for vrchat I believe

[robust crescent]

A or T , if any of them fails straighten the bones slightly should make it behave ( unmap that jaw bone if you arent using it )

T is very handy when you want to add things to avatar

[torpid ermine]

If A or T works, would Y also work?

[prisma radish]

what is thumb 1 and 2

[torpid ermine]

the first bone and second bone, i assume

[languid swan]

Umm, does anyone know how to fix this?

Before, there were vertices that weren't connected In the middle, and the tail was curved instead of straight, but I fixed that, and now I don't know what's wrong :0

[pale pumice]

what do you think is wrong?

[languid swan]

Well, a couple of points on the tail that don't move with the rest deforming which makes me believe that it's not rigged correctly in that part

-This is an avatar that I'm making from scratch without much prior practice btw ^^"

[pale pumice]

ah you mean the mesh not moving how you want along with the bones?
that means do more weight painting.

[languid swan]

Ooh ok ok, I'll try 👌

[warm dragon]

hi, im very new to making vrchat avatars and this is my first time. im not too sure what to do about this, could anyone please help me?

it says character is not in t-pose. i remember seeing how to force a t-pose but i dont remember where that is

alright i found the force t-pose and clicked apply then done. but it reverts back as soon as i click done. i'm not sure what to do

[timber wraith]

It's complaining about 2 bones that're named the same (Shoulder.L)

uhhh try renaming one of those bones to like

so theyre all unique

[warm dragon]

the rename is greyed out

[timber wraith]

you gotta do it in the fbx you imported

So

Blender

[warm dragon]

oh okay

alright everything looks fine now. but how do i add a animator?

@timber wraith do you know?

[timber wraith]

No clue sorry

[brazen island]

add animator component on the root. 2nd field (uuuh avatar definition?) should be filled, i think it will be filled automatically. first field doesnt matter.

[timber wraith]

@warm dragon

[warm dragon]

i got the avatar looking are working well. i just need to fix the eyehight now

[prisma radish]

What does the pop out message mean? also how to fix it?

[pale pumice]

it means the automatic weight painting you tried didn't work and you'll probably have to do some manual

[prisma radish]

how to do it then?

[pale pumice]

the hard way

[prisma radish]

ok i fucking hate level 5 inc

[pale pumice]

haha yeah it's not fun

[prisma radish]

is there a way to fix it though?

[pale pumice]

I don't know, I haven't found any automatic weight painting tools that do more than get you started. I've always just done it the manual way.

there's some complicated process I've seen using bone envelopes, but it still only gets you close

[prisma radish]

so how to rig manually in the first place im justing watching yt tutorial

[pale pumice]

that's what I'd suggest doing

ha

[prisma radish]

???

[pale pumice]

silly bots.

[prisma radish]

?????????????????

[prisma radish]

wait so what is the condition for using automatic weights?

[pale pumice]

I really don't have any useful info about using automatic weights, sorry.

in my experience it hasn't really been worth putting any effort into if it doesn't work.

[prisma radish]

dammit i dont have a better mesh already

i might need to download ykw4 dumps then

[robust crescent]

id remove hair and skirt, throw it into mixamo to get basic weightpainting, then merge hair/skirt back(to avoid them get weighted to legs / arm if too close)

[pale pumice]

that seems like a decent start

[prisma radish]

tysm i will try

[outer cosmos]

Yes try that

[tough robin]

is there a way to have more than 4 weights per vertex that vrc supports?

[tough robin]

I have vertex groups that dont contribute to the rigging but are used for modifiers in blender, but upon export because of these vertex groups I am exceeding the 4 weights per vertex limit and unity decides to ignore some other vertex group that does actually contribute to the rigging :D

[rare moon]

afaik unused vertex groups don't get exported in fbx files

try importing the fbx from unity and checking what vertex groups a problem vertex is assigned to

[tough robin]

why didnt I think of that..

sadly my guess of it being a weight problem isnt the case... so now I am even more confused. The fbx looks correct when imported back into blender, it just looks incorrect in unity...

I dont understand why

the vertecies have identical weights (literally a duplicate from the original mesh)
But once exported to unity theres a hole between them.
If I reimport it back to blender theres no hole...

[deep tartan]

try merging by distance?

[tough robin]

they are separate meshes, that will do nothing

they are separate on purpose, its a toggleable part

[deep tartan]

that may be the issue then

[tough robin]

"that" being?

[deep tartan]

them being seperate meshes

[tough robin]

what part of that would be the issue?

[deep tartan]

its not fully connected

[tough robin]

But why would that matter?

weights are the same, rig is the same,

[deep tartan]

if the vertices aren't properly connected, there are gonna be holes. The only way I've found to fix that is merging the vertices by distance to make sure the mesh is connected smoothly

I had a similar issue once when I tried to swap out the genitals of a base

[tough robin]

but youre providing no reason why that would be the case. That makes no sense to me, Ive done this before without holes

[deep tartan]

Im not entirley certain what causes the mesh to not line up properly, I just know merging them by distance fixes it

[tough robin]

vertex positions are identical, weights are identical, pose is identical, rig is identical. Export settings identical
The second mesh is a 1:1 copy of the geometry from the first, mesh, why it is acting differently?

What your suggesting is not a fix because it defeats the purpose of the mesh, its suppose to be separate to be toggleable

[deep tartan]

I would work around it depending on what kind of toggle you want, I would just make a shape key

[tough robin]

not an option, the purpose is to swap out the geometry in that area for a completely different mesh

[deep tartan]

There may be some form of modifier you could use to fix it but I'm not certain. You could always have one avatar with one mesh and another avatar with the other mesh.

[tough robin]

its not a blender issue, its a unity issue, the inconsistency can not be recreated in blender even if I import the FBX back

I dont really want a second body mesh because that would mean having to do essentially every geometry edit twice.

[deep tartan]

what'd ur fbx model settings look like?

[deep tartan]

i mean in unity sorry

[tough robin]

oh you mean in unity

[deep tartan]

yeye

[tough robin]

before you say anything humanoid doesnt make a difference

as the model is retargeted to the avatar skeleton with vrcfury

[deep tartan]

oh my

Yeah im not sure i'll be able to help you there as I typically do everything manually, I dont really use vrcfury for much at all so Im not very good at troubleshooting problems with it

[tough robin]

this isnt a vrc fury issue either though

this issue is visible even outside of playmode

ah great I found the issue lol

now I feel dumb for not checking this earlier

the avatar creator edited the pose in unity instead of blender, so the default poses are inconsistent.

thats.. frustrating

[torpid ermine]

shouldn't it be humanoid rig? in the rig tab

[earnest crown]

is there some way for blender to automatically assign bones? everything here is already rigged how i want it but when i try to export it as a vrm file it doesnt assign them. im completely new to this so i have no real idea what needs to go where

also is there a way to test the model in blender to see if the bones that are assigned are correct

[torpid ermine]

pose mode?

[earnest crown]

how do i do that

[torpid ermine]

(i forgot...)

top left?

[earnest crown]

also whats up with the thing above the model, it doesnt seem to have any interactivity

[tough robin]

me when I dont read.

[earnest crown]

what do i use for the spine, spine 1 or 2

or should it be 3

[uncut mulch]

can someone help me with the full body and IK tracking error?

[torpid ermine]

can you post your hips and thigh bones?

[uncut mulch]

The first image is labeled as "HLP" or "HLB" something like that

But the bone in the middle is labeled as "waist"

2nd image is obviously thigh bones, and this is edit mode by the way

[torpid ermine]

looks like your bones are zero length and all pointing in same direction

when it should look like an actual skeleton with bones that are a certain length going to another bone

hips bone should point up to go towards the spine, and thighs should point down for legs

hence the 180

[pale pumice]

there's a diagram in the pinned messages

[torpid ermine]

IRL the hip bone where it meets the spine, is a bit higher than the joints for the upper legs. But is it better to also move it back a little to mimic IRL bones?

is there a diagram showing what the VRChat bones maps to a IRL skeleton?

or are they not supposed to be the same?

[pale pumice]

the diagram I refer to should do this

[copper halo]

in unity dont think of the bones as real bones.... they are points.. and they are essentaly the bending place/ rotation point of everything weightpainted to it....

[pale pumice]

yeah Unity only really "sees" the bone heads

[copper halo]

id put the hip bone somewere in the center of were the real hip would be tbh.... cause the hip itself on the avatar does not bend... but everything else is attached to the hip, and those bones bend/rotate

[torpid ermine]

is the hip bone just a singular point where the spine begins?

if i understan correctly

[pale pumice]

in Blender it's a normal bone, going vertical. But in Unity yes, basically

[copper halo]

kinda yea! but its not were the spine begins.... its the origin point of the entire avatar... think of the avatar as a tree with brances... the hip is the stump/stem, the legs and spine are the branches

[copper halo]

i mean... depends on the displaymode you have your bones set to... they can look like dots in blender sometimes aswell

[pale pumice]

ah, that's true

[thin crystal]

I really need some help TwT
Im trying to make a VRCfury asset and i want these to link to tailbones, but I can't figure it out for the life of me!
How would you guys go about linking this?
It doesnt want to ''latch'' it onto the tail with vrcfury...

[outer cosmos]

1. Check Bone Hierarchy – In Unity, ensure your asset is a child of the correct tail bone (Tail_01, Tail_02,Drag and drop it in the Hierarchy to parent it properly.

2. Use VRCFury – Select your asset, add VRCFury Hinge or VRCFury Transform, then set Parent Bone to the correct tail bone. Enable Latch Mode if available.

[tired agate]

Throwing it here if my request counts here: #avatar-help message

[uncut mulch]

could I also just make the model into a T-pose?

[uncut mulch]

nevermind, i found an unrigged version of the model and used mixamo to auto-rig it, thanks everyone for ur efforts, but I'm good now

i'm not getting that error anymore so yeah

[eternal ruin]

how would i go about setting up a model for substance? Making it so it keeps the pose when i import it, is there a spacifc way to export it?

[pale pumice]

It'll keep whatever the default pose is. I also usually export mine with a few duplicates of various parts I might want to paint separately.

[eternal ruin]

So itll kust keep T-pose? Cause when i post it so i can paint in the mouth and in between fingers and such it reverts to that

[pale pumice]

yeah, this is kinda what I meant. For the mouth I'd duplicate the head and shift it over say, x+0.5, and pose it so it's open.

probably you could duplicate the whole thing and pose the model then apply the armature modifier to "affix" the pose, in Substance you only care about the mesh anyway.

[eternal ruin]

yeah

[strong hedge]

Hi, I'm having difficulty subtracting weight paint from a specific bone or vertex group. I either select the vertex group item or I ctrl shift select a bone from front bone view, either way, when I click and drag the curser around the effected area of the mesh, the subtract doesn't affect the area. Accumulated is unchecked, Auto Normalized is unchecked, Draw is the only option that works with subtract. Note: Just as I can't subtract weight, I can't add weight either. What am I doing wrong? I've adjusted the Radius, Strength, Weight toggles, everything, nothing is working.

[jaunty chasm]

AHHHHHHHHH

[prisma radish]

wow i love rigging.

[atomic fossil]

Guys do you know how I can link the armature I created with this model?

[pale pumice]

Armature modifier on the mesh object(s)

[atomic fossil]

where do you see that?

[pale pumice]

I don't, but that's what you need if you don't have one

[atomic fossil]

i don't have an armature and i added an armature from Mixamo (T-pose) that I put on the thing, now how do I make this the armature for my character?

[pale pumice]

Again, you put an armature modifier on the mesh object(s), referencing your new armature

(and then of course, you deal with weight painting)

[atomic fossil]

mh i doesn't let me do anything

[pale pumice]

sorry, I don't know what you were doing and can't read that

[atomic fossil]

did parent and automatic weight

shit won't move

[velvet canopy]

Do you have the armature modifier?

On the mesh?

It should have auto’s but Blender sometimes doesn’t do what it needs to

[queen granite]

is this better to be posted in this chat or there? #avatar-help message

[pale pumice]

there probably, since it's about building the avatar rather than rigging the parts

[queen granite]

ty

[tropic grove]

Hi, is it possible to merge the head part of a model with the body of another, merge the bones and their weight paints, merge the meshes together, yet, not broke the weightpaint?

I tried to do so very carefully at every step, but once I've finished merging the bones, I end up having to parent the bones and mesh together, which generate a new weight paint that is not good, and for some reason the head and necks bones had no weight paint on it.

(maybe I should post this on #avatar-help instead? sorry if I made a mistake)

[balmy delta]

if the bones are named the same then you can just reparent the mesh to the other armature

[tropic grove]

Thank you for the fast answer. Can you tell me a bit more please? What do you mean by reparent the mesh to the other armature?

[balmy delta]

in blender

just reparent the mesh to the other armature

[tropic grove]

Yes I know in Blender, what exactly you mean by reparenting? How do you do that? Just slide it in the same armature on the Outliner panel, or use Ctrl+P "Set to Parent" Menu?

[balmy delta]

however you want to reparent

[pale pumice]

update the armature modifier to point at the correct armature too

[tropic grove]

Damn I've been stuck on this for hours, thank you so much!

[pale pumice]

sometimes it's the little things 🙂

[tropic grove]

Right! 🥲

[tight birch]

is tehre a way to preview/test vrcaht poses adn animations in blender?

[rare moon]

gesture manager emulator or AV3 emulator

[pale pumice]

That's for Unity, there isn't in Blender other than manually posing. Though I haven't looked to see if it's possible to import the animations

[rare moon]

oh yeah sorry i misread 😅

[tight birch]

the gesture manager is still very useful nontheless, thank's for helping me discover it!
... Now that I found the issue:
How can I best make it so my avatars legs don't go through the back of my spine when crouching/ walking while crouching

when I crouch and walk the legs are behaving extremly weird

for one thing they are more curled inwards than on other avatars, and when I walk crouched they jump pretty high

[pale pumice]

might have to see it happening to understand what you mean, and a shot of the rig in idle pose

[tight birch]

I'M getting teh screenshots

here are some helpful screenshots

the first image is the problem

[pale pumice]

what are you doing when the avatar gets into that pose?

[tight birch]

physically crouching

[pale pumice]

the clipping is certainly a weight painting issue

[tight birch]

so should teh caved in section of the back be affected by the leg bone? should the part that is sticking out be less affected by teh leg bone?

[pale pumice]

I'm not sure why the leg would push that out, but it's hard to understand what's happening from here

[tight birch]

I recreated teh pose in blender, same thing happening here. I'm not at all sure how I should approach this problem

[balmy delta]

Its not physically possible to bend your leg like that irl

[pale pumice]

right, but this is VRChat 🙂

[balmy delta]

Just dont crouch that far down to the point the avatar's ik tries to fix it by making your torso go horizontal while trying to stand

[tight birch]

yeah that's what I figured, crouching seems normal when I don't go that low

[pale pumice]

ok yeah that seems kinda normal

[static flax]

does anyone know why i always have extra vertices no matter how many times i try to symmeterize the mesh on this model?

its like its adding a whole new set of vertices but when i delete them it effects the mesh

[balmy delta]

looks more like its stretching the mesh

[static flax]

I deleted half of it and symmeterized the other so it would be symmetrical for weight painting and it just don’t work

[pale pumice]

I've done that with the mirror modifier, seems to work fine

this all assumes the mesh object's origin is at x = 0

[static flax]

Let me double check and try that

x=0 and its still doing it with the mirror modifier

it does it on both sides too even tho the vertices should be symmetrical

[pale pumice]

hmm not sure what the issue would be then

[static flax]

its like theres invisible vertices or something

[pale pumice]

make sure everything is shown, that you're on the basis blendshape

and everything is on one side of X

[static flax]

ok im not super knowledgeable in blender how do i check the blendshape

and what do you mean on one side of x

[pale pumice]

you're trying to make a symmetrical thing right? have all of it on one side of the mirror

if you don't it mirrors both sides

[static flax]

oh yeah it is when i mirror it

oh i think i know what it is

theres layers of vertices

but wouldnt they still move if it was symmetrical

i think this model might just be bad

[pale pumice]

it's always fixable, just might not be worth the effort 🙂

[static flax]

i think i got a work around

im just gonna assign vertices to vertex groups instead of weight paint

honestly might be easier since its a robot

[pale pumice]

that's basically what weight painting is 🙂

[static flax]

Yeah but I’m doing it the non weight painting way

[rapid mulch]

So, im making a character from cookie run kingdom and ive ran into a rigging issue.

Im trying to rig the highlighted object which is a cloth that drapes down/around his arm and i have NO idea how to rig this correctly in a way where i can add physbones to it

ive rigged clothing and like tailcoats before but i have like no idea how to rig this, any help would be appriciated

also dont mind the unfinished head, im procrastinating bc i hate modeling heads </3

[static flax]

I would just rig it like a normal cape then add physbone colliders in unity, but there’s probably a better way to do it

[robust crescent]

very hard to explain in text weight transfer from body , seperate the arm bone parent it back again thats the one you can use a physbone and it should never clip or need a collider as long as you use angle limits and rotation pitch

exsample skirt , but its the same for a cape/ect

half of it weightpainted to legs and using its own bone parented to each leg, thats where physbone goes , would be very hard too make it clip

[rare moon]

i would suggest doing what Thulen has said as well as adding a bone in the middle and using rotation constraints to move it 50% between arm and chest. This will help with deformation when moving your arms down by your side

[rapid mulch]

Thank you so much!! I’ll try out your suggestions once I get home!

[static flax]

Does anyone have a way to cheat not having mapped shoulders? the model im using is a b1 battle droid and having shoulders would mess up the model kinda

my rig has shoulders they just dont have any weights

[rare moon]

you could always have the shoulders be really small so that it doesn't offset the position of the arms

[static flax]

Like the actual bone size?

Is that gonna affect how the rig functions with fbt at all?

[rapid mulch]

@arctic hedge (asked me to show him)

[rare moon]

yeah so the distance between the shoulder and the arm is really small. It won't affect most FBT setups since most people don't have shoulder tracking, just elbow tracking (if they have arm trackers at all)

[static flax]

What exactly does that look like because no matter where the shoulder is it’s always moving the arm

this is my rig rn for reference

[rare moon]

yes it is always moving the arm, the idea is to limit the positional movement of the arm so that the shoulder still rotates the arm, but doesn't move it out of place

[rare moon]

take the head of the bone (thicker part closer to the chest) and move it towards the tail so that the bone is really small

[static flax]

oh ok yeah that works

[hollow quartz]

it could also be unapplied transforms to the mesh

[somber cliff]

my avatar faces the wrong way when I go to edit mode for the bones. Any explanation for this and how to fix it???

[pale pumice]

redo these two but with the "Item" tab of the 'n' popup showing

also not sure why your armature has a 90° transform?

oh I guess that is that display I was asking for, hah

also the scale is weird?

it's not clear which mode the left image is in

I'd apply transforms to all objects, it seems you haven't.

[somber cliff]

sorry for cross posting, just thought I'd get out of the other channel cuz other ppl needed help.

But uh, left image is Edit Mode, second image is Object Mode.

The scale is deffo weird, but I'll fix that upon export/in unity.

I'll try that last bit

[pale pumice]

it's not clear what that 90 rotation applies to

[somber cliff]

oh, when I set it to 0, my character falls on their face. Don't know why it's like that.

[pale pumice]

I'm still going to say apply transforms

[somber cliff]

ok, I did

what do I do next?

[pale pumice]

might want to go into pose mode for the armature and clear all transforms there too

[somber cliff]

how do I do that?

[pale pumice]

I suspect you can probably make an educated guess, let me know if you get stuck 🙂

[somber cliff]

I did it lol

[somber cliff]

now the model...is facing backwards in pose mode 🤔 So do I just rotate it in pose mode to fix this?

[pale pumice]

you probably don't want it posed in a weird way by default

go back to object mode, and if it's not right there, turn it and apply the transform.

[somber cliff]

wew, it seems to be fixed now! Even in edit mode. Anything else I should do to be safe or should it be good now?

[pale pumice]

nah, that's probably all you need

[somber cliff]

ok, thank you sm!

[somber cliff]

update: it didn't work

[pale pumice]

?

[somber cliff]

avatar is still facing the wrong way in edit mode

[pale pumice]

got any transforms on mesh objects?

[somber cliff]

Like, the top right window?

[pale pumice]

no, in object mode for each mesh object

[somber cliff]

seems to be all at zero

[pale pumice]

good

[somber cliff]

where to go from here?

[pale pumice]

I don't know what's wrong

those two pics there look right though?

[somber cliff]

yeahhh

to add, it also looks right in pose mode

maybe I can edit the pose mode to apply to edit mode to fix it...

[pale pumice]

you can absolutely apply a pose - you apply the armature modifier which causes the pose

[somber cliff]

I fixed it finally

I had to apply the armature, then go to pose mode and apply pose as rest pose ugh

so complex for something so simple aghhhh

still, thank you!

[pale pumice]

you're welcome!

[somber cliff]

Update: Loaded in like this during build and test, what couldve caused this lol?

[pale pumice]

not oriented properly in blender, incorrect export settings in blender, incorrect import settings in unity, a number of things

[somber cliff]

could be the export settings, because you saw the earlier pics in blender, it's clearly standing up on the axis correctly, right...? I did mess with export settings in blender, could be that...

[pale pumice]

without knowing what you did, I couldn't possibly guess. I just use all defaults except setting "apply scalings" to "FBX All", turning off leaf bones, and setting Geometry->Smoothing to "face" (assumes you import normals in Unity).

[somber cliff]

all I did was apply FBX units to scale

[somber cliff]

I figured it out, I accidentally applied armature modifier again after putting it through CATS

it's fixed now that I essentially remade the model

[royal sapphire]

so it says parts of the model arnt mapped but them i check anx they are, yet the bones are red and when i click enforce t pose it just goes all cattywampus

[pale pumice]

do you have this in Blender? I'd check bone roll first

[royal sapphire]

i do

bone roll?

[pale pumice]

ideally it should be 0 for most humanoid bones

and eyes

[royal sapphire]

how would i heck th boe rol?

[balmy delta]

is that mmd model allowed to be ported to vrchat?

[royal sapphire]

check the bone roll*

[pale pumice]

edit mode for the armature, inspect each humanoid bone, it's shown in the 'item' panel of the 'n' popup.
But yeah... what Diven said.

[royal sapphire]

i didnt know there were restrictions

[balmy delta]

mmd models usually are only allowed to be used with mmd

[royal sapphire]

ht does thatbmean? and why not use it else whre

what does that mean? and why not use it elsewhere? *

[balmy delta]

creator tos

[royal sapphire]

alriht then ill delet it u guess

[royal sapphire]

where in it does it say that?

[balmy delta]

idk I cant read japanese

[royal sapphire]

link?

[balmy delta]

why are you asking me for one

you are the one that downloaded it

[royal sapphire]

i ddn see anythig anywhere saying i couldn

[balmy delta]

whered you get it

[royal sapphire]

dont remember the name, it was in Japanese and i cant use my browser rn

but when i read it it didnt seem like n isue

i wont touch it till i find where it sys i can

[ruby zealot]

Heya not exactly sure if this is the right channel but. Im new to blender and im trying to make a blendshape for the clothing. The FBX that i had bought has severe amounts of faces. Is there a way to close the distance between the selected faces in edit mode or would i have to move them all manually?

[robust crescent]

miHoYo is one of the game companies that freely distribute their models for any use (except nsfw) on their page , their models abit of a mess , like using the same texture in 2 places just slightly different (guessing its for some other material) , recommend merging those , just run it through cats mmd fixes and you wont have any issues

no reason for this model to have more then 1~3 materials either

[royal sapphire]

in read over it and im allowed to

[royal sapphire]

oh cool

[royal sapphire]

yeah it was kinda confusing lol

[steep trellis]

do i neeed to do anything with the arms?

[pale pumice]

weight the mesh to the bones

also you need shoulder bones

[steep trellis]

sorry, more specific. the bones aren't connected in any way

hit enter too early

but that answers my question

[pale pumice]

they don't need to be "connected" as blender thinks for Unity

[steep trellis]

wait... can i join bones?

[pale pumice]

not "join" exactly - what do you mean?

[steep trellis]

oh you just said i dont need to have them connected right?

is it like a merge verticies by distance thing

[pale pumice]

specifically "connected" as Blender thinks, which is the child's head attached and moves with the parent's tail

generally you do want humanoid bones connected 'cause well, you the human have connected bones 🙂

[steep trellis]

that brings up my other question, the little tail part wont cause any issues being reversed will it?

[pale pumice]

but it's not strictly necessary for them to be actually connected

reversed?

bones rotate at the head end, which is the fat one in octahedral mode

So your tail bones should probably be pointing down

(pointing means head -> tail)

[steep trellis]

btw, you CAN join bones and F works just like with meshes, in this case it makes a bone between ur two points

and alr

i gotta hope there's a handy "Reverse bone" feature or else i gotta remake all the bones

[pale pumice]

huh I'm not sure I've ever tried to make a bone via fill, that's neat

[steep trellis]

idk how to delete them and x doesn't work

[pale pumice]

x should work but not quite how you expect probably unless you're deleting bones at the end of a chain

[steep trellis]

strange

[pale pumice]

removing a bone in the middle of the chain fills in the gap

[steep trellis]

i'm having trouble i'm just gonna redo the bones

it wasn't too difficult anyway

i actually dont need a bone for the tail i dont think

i can just bind it to the spine bone

fixed

[pale pumice]

ah I figured you'd want to have it dangle around.

Also - not sure what you have going on at the top of the legs, you don't need any per-leg bone there, just have the upper legs direct children of the root (hips) bone

also your spine bones should be pointing UP

again, check out the diagram pinned in here. You can leave out "upper chest" though.

spine should be root (hips) -> spine -> chest -> neck -> head

shoulders come from chest.

[steep trellis]

bruhh

also i have a weird ass issue where this one mesh object just doesn't exist when editing

i can move it around in object mode but otherwise it's not real

nvm i'm dumb

[pale pumice]

it's probably a mirror modifier on another object

[steep trellis]

it was hidden

[pale pumice]

or hidden, yep

[steep trellis]

i knew immediately after i typed that i needed help

[pale pumice]

hehe

[steep trellis]

i feel like this will be easier than i thought

[robust crescent]

π looks funny pasted, easy to change after

[steep trellis]

??

[ocean surge]

anybody have magic tricks to weightpaint chains in blender? i'm putting chains on my avi's tail and horns for a ball and i'm doing it an unoptimized way to make it smoother but the way i weightpaint chains is i hide the links im not weightpainting, paint it to the bone, then unhide and move to the next portion and continue, is there an easier way to do this? i do it so that the link cannot warp or bend, so the physbone is what moves the whole chain

[robust crescent]

paint one, copy paste

[pale pumice]

if you have one bone per link you can simply "set weight"

but that's a lot of bones too 🙂

[ocean surge]

that is what i'm doing, i just dont know how to isolate the weightpaint to a single link when i cannot select parts of the mesh while in weightpaint mode

and yeah it is a lot of bones, im very lucky this event doesnt require a poor or better avi this time XD

[pale pumice]

you tab back to edit mode, select what you want, then tab back to weight paint and enable masking, iirc the hotkey is 1

[ocean surge]

i love you

thank you that makes it a kabillion times easier

[pale pumice]

all I've done is read more of the blender manual than you 🙂

[ocean surge]

faster at least

[steep trellis]

wtf??? where's my head bone???

gimmie my bone stupid software!!!

what did i do wrong? i exported using fbx

someone help me pls i'm so close to getting this done

this head is the LAST issue i have

[pale pumice]

Bones in unity don't really have length, if your head has no child bones, you won't really see it looking like a blender bone.

if it's still in the hierarchy, it's fine

[steep trellis]

it's not even there though

it's just gone

it says there's no head bone

[ocean surge]

hate to bug yall again, but i used masking to weightpaint (worked amazing, already done!) but when i go into pose mode and rotate any bone the loop at the base moves and i'm not sure why

[pale pumice]

that's quite strange

[steep trellis]

maybe i exported wrong

i was told to use copy, then check the icon for materials, then apply transforms and make sure to disable leaf bones

[pale pumice]

set "apply scalings" to "FBX All"

[steep trellis]

?

oh

[pale pumice]

also I don't touch path mode, auto is fine.

[steep trellis]

moment of truth

[ocean surge]

sorry im an idiot, somehow i weightpainted the top part to the bottom bone

[steep trellis]

the head is still gone

so, no head?
...
throws phone /ref

oh, also importing with auto path and whatever the fbx all is improved the performance lol

found the issue

the head is connected to the hips for some stupid ass reason

i think i fixed it

???

[pale pumice]

those are required bones

[steep trellis]

why

[pale pumice]

because VRChat says so - not sure who said to look there but it's a little misleading, since that's Unity and not VRChat.

[steep trellis]

of course

i better not need to re-paint my weights

[pale pumice]

just split the spine bone into two

[steep trellis]

alr

wow i can use subdivide lol

[pale pumice]

yep!

[steep trellis]

YOOOO

ok ok i gotta set up the eyes n stuff now

do i need to map chest AND upper chest?

i'm just gonna assume yes for the time save of waiting

ok that's a no

it just doesn't work anyway

OH WAIT

BRUH

i dont have permission to build the avatar

how do i get permission

[pale pumice]

?upload

[tough forge]

You must obtain at least "New User" Trust Rank in our Trust and Safety system in order to upload content. You can get this by just spending a few hours in VRChat, hop some worlds, and make some friends. Give it some time and you'll be able to upload content in no time.

As an aside, you must have a VRChat account to upload content. That means you can't use a Steam account, Oculus account, or Viveport account to upload content like worlds or avatars.

Source: https://docs.vrchat.com/docs/frequently-asked-questions

[steep trellis]

ah

alr

is "a few hours" reachable in 100% worth of battery?

bec my headset charges really slowly so i dont wanna have to use the battery twice and then upload tmrw

[pale pumice]

How long is a piece of string?

[steep trellis]

pluh

[steep trellis]

it is equal to the string's length /silly

[pale walrus]

how do I fix the weights for this happening

and this

wait I think I figured it out

[pale pumice]

smoothing

[deep tartan]

Trying to set up eye look on an avi im tryna rig for a friend and the eyes are goin kinda fucky wucky in unity but rotate fine in blender

[robust crescent]

are they straight up in blender

[deep tartan]

no they are pointing with the eyes

[robust crescent]

gotto get them straight up

[pale pumice]

that's why, they should be straight up with 0 bone roll.

And they pivot around the head (the fat end), so put that at the center of rotation

[robust crescent]

cats have/had a test with it newer cats have a make bone straight up click

easymode

[pale pumice]

that's cool

[deep tartan]

uhh

[pale pumice]

they look kinda low there

[deep tartan]

struggling

[pale pumice]

if the eyeballs are spheres, you could put the 3D cursor at the center point of one, then snap the bone's head to that point. It's usually what I do.

[deep tartan]

they are like weird points

I think i fixed it for the most part

[amber kestrel]

Anyone have an idea why my model's hips drop whenever I walk? The torso stays level and straight at the same time, so I get this weird bent knee t-rexing going on. Pictures attached are standing vs walking

Rig for reference (most bones hidden)

[tight birch]

might want to check the rotation of the boned. enable Axis in the viewport settings of teh amature and make sure teh z axis is alligned properly. It might also have something to do with your avatars descriptor view

my avatars chest doesn't bend the same way as it does in blender. why is that? the weights should be the same right?

here's a view from the front

[brazen island]

weights are the same, but humanoid armature is driven by animator. you might want to reposition your bones

well, and probly not the case, but speaking about same weights, vrchat allows only 4 bones to affect a vertex

[tight birch]

Ahh I see. Is there a good reference for how vrchat expects humanoid bones to be positioned?

[brazen island]

uh, pins? also mixamo produces very decent autorig for fbt, so you might want to run through it to reference

[amber kestrel]

Define properly

Torso points forward, legs point backward, roll is zeroed, hips line up on Y axis with upper legs, both are straight vertical

[tight birch]

this looks good actually

I have no other ideas, sorry

[amber kestrel]

I know. That's why I'm puzzled

lol

I've never had this problem before

been making avatars for years

[spark zinc]

Your model’s hips dropping while walking may be due to incorrect weight painting, rigid pelvis constraints, improper hip rotation, leg IK or foot placement issues, or unnatural animation curves. Ensure smooth weight transitions, allow natural pelvis movement, verify proper hip rotation, adjust stride length and IK settings, and introduce subtle vertical motion for a more natural walk

[amber kestrel]

Weights are fine, no constraints on the pelvis, hip is 0 roll pointing straight up, leg IK looks fine (although the upper leg seems short?), no animations used apart from the default VRC locomotion

[robust crescent]

its locomotion, when you move it goes abit down to lean avatar

[fallen grotto]

Doing some research right now but does vrchat support corrective shape keys via driver's from blender? Video below with example
https://youtu.be/1WmFaBlDBHs?si=zEaa8fsg2dqCIPWP

[brazen island]

direct drivers are ofc impossible, since they have nothing to do with exported fbx. perhaps you can do stuff via contacts.

[pale pumice]

Yeah, contacts and bone constraints can work quite well. I do quadricep and bicep muscles via those

And have been using contacts as part of a digitgrade leg systems

[steel halo]

The weights may actually not be the same

Unity has a limit of 4 influences per vertex, and if you have an upper chest bone you can easily run into issues around the shoulder area as it fights for shoulder, arm, chest, upper chest, and spine influence

That limit can be removed by changing a Unity project’s project settings, but we don’t exactly have access to changing VRC’s settings

[brazen island]

@steel halo bruh i literally said it next message, 🤓

[steel halo]

Ah yeah I see that now, thanks for the nerd emoji

[hidden bridge]

i guess this is more of a blender question but my model doesnt really work with the extra bones youd need for the humanoid rig so im kinda lost

[pale pumice]

split the upper spine bone into two, make a neck bone

you must have hips -> spine -> chest -> optionally upper chest -> neck -> head

(if you want it to be treated as humanoid)

also you need shoulders

[hidden bridge]

i made a neck bone

im trying to keep everything its own mesh without deformation btw

am i making the shoulders/neck bone just pretty much to make the rig happy? bc rn its been rigged how i want it to move already

[pale pumice]

and the other spine bone, yes

you don't have to weight paint the shoulders

[hidden bridge]

ok i need to split that chest bone

[hidden bridge]

hmm

should i name bones differently than meshes

add bone to the end

[hollow quartz]

Make sure your bones are parented to the proper parents. I see your arms are not children of the right bones

Like forearm parented to the first arm bone parented to the shoulder bone parented to the chest bone

Same with the legs

[hidden bridge]

ya i was gonna work on it next

[pale pumice]

you must name humanoid bones different from meshes

[hidden bridge]

okay

[hidden bridge]

this is how theyre set up

[hollow quartz]

Ok you do got it, nice. Maybe that's the mesh then. I was lookin at the dotted lines

[hidden bridge]

im gonna be entirely honest i have no idea what theyre pointing to and while thats never been an issue in blender we're about to find out if its an issue in unity 💀

alright we're getting somewhere

it now sees the T pose and its not blasting me with errors lmfao

it wants a head bone

this one right

not the neck

it all says green so im assuming we're good

[hidden bridge]

thx guys

we're so back

[steep trellis]

would adding a bone here ruin the humanoid rig type? i wanna have this bottom part lag behind the avatar when moving and have them float

also i imagine weight painting will be a million times easier now because of the simplified geometry

[pale pumice]

no, so long as you have the hmanoid bones, you can add extras wherever you like

[steep trellis]

o cool

[pale pumice]

I'd do a chain so it moves like a tail

basically just treat it like one, use gravity on the physbone

[steep trellis]

no clue what any of that means this will only by my 2nd time doing a rig 😭

[pale pumice]

you will, don't worry 🙂

[steep trellis]

i'mma ask now so i can add more bones if i need to do that

[pale pumice]

add as many bones as you want to have

no rules about non-humanoid bones

[steep trellis]

i want this E to bend when grabbing things, do i need bones for that?

[pale pumice]

probably

[steep trellis]

alr

how many bones would it want in a finger?

idr the checklist

i'mma just get the vrc creator companion open to see

alr it's 3 per finger

[steep trellis]

do you know what to search up for a yt tutorial?

idk what i specifically need

i dont know what i dont know

two questions

1. will the top being the index and bottom being the thumb with no other finger bones break the hand?
2. will the current placement of bones not register as a hand? or does it not matter

[pale pumice]

uh, maybe rigging?

you don't need hands but if you have them having fingers outside of the norm is going to make them act weird

[steep trellis]

i can just add dummy bones like for the legs that dont do anything

it'll just be a bit strange

i'll only do that if it behaves poorly tho bec i dont wanna do the extra effort for that to actually cause an issue vs solving it

i have everything but the tail weight painted bec i wanna have the tail lag behind when moving

[pale pumice]

yes, and you can also have them rotate along with other bones

if you want it to move, it should be weight painted. You do want to do the tail.

[steep trellis]

ok but do i need multiple bones for it to bend smoothly?

oops forgot to un-reply

[pale pumice]

anywhere you want a bend, you put a joint

[steep trellis]

alr so then after that how do i make it lag behind?

[pale pumice]

tails have multiple bones

[steep trellis]

and after weight painting*

[pale pumice]

physbone in unity

[steep trellis]

is that simple? if it is then i can prob just figure it out

i'm assuming it's as simple as changing a type field to physbone

[pale pumice]

there are lots of videos on how to make tails move realistically, that's basically what this is

[steep trellis]

oops, added more bones but found out that it didn't add more vertex groups...

can i redo the parrenting with add empty groups again?

[pale pumice]

why? stuff should already be parented

[steep trellis]

i need the vertex groups so i can weight paint

[pale pumice]

a) you can make them manually
b) they automatically get created when you select a bone and start painting

[steep trellis]

handy that

i only just now knew i could manually select bones

this entire time i've been locking and unlocking them to see which one it was

38 bones

funny, unity said fuck you to my leg bones.

[pale pumice]

yeah if there's nothing weighted to them, it thinks they're unnecessary

[steep trellis]

how do i stop that from happening?

this model obviously has no legs

[pale pumice]

what bones are mapped in the rig setup?

if it missed some, add them yourself

[steep trellis]

i looked and it straight up doesn't have the leg bones

it's what you said, they aren't weight painted so they got removed

but i need to keep them

[pale pumice]

oh! right - there's an export option in blender, or an import option in unity

I forget which though, haven't used this myself

[steep trellis]

i'm using blender to make the model

[pale pumice]

something about don't export unweighted bones

[steep trellis]

it's gotta be import bex export has nothing

i cant get any help online (i dont know what i dont know) but they DO exist

they just dont show up in the slightest

how do i make them display

[pale pumice]

wait, they are in the hierarchy?

[steep trellis]

yeah

[pale pumice]

oh, good, that's fine then. go do the rig setup

put the right bones in the right slots

[steep trellis]

i'm kinda dumb for not trying that

i was just like "well they dont appear so they must not work"

i cant use the bones i have bec the fingers aren't straight by default

i think i know how to fix that but it's gonna be a pain in the ass to redo everything

nvm i dont

i'll just ignore them for now

[deep tartan]

For some reason when I put one arm up the other goes down instead of also going up. Can I fix this without having to re-rig the arms? They are weight painted just fine and parented fine
Im just so confused lmao

like their movement is opposite of each other and its driving me insane

Both arms should be up but instead the other arm goes the opposite direction it's supposed to

might just say fuck it, delete arm bones and re-rig
everything else seems fine tho so idek

[deep tartan]

Yeah this fixed it but if anyone knows why this happens I'd love to know lol

[hidden bridge]

how can i make the controller be in the right spot?

[pale pumice]

controller? you mean the gizmo that lets you rotate the bone? It's at the bone's head.

[hidden bridge]

okay

[pale pumice]

move it in blender, don't move humanoid bones in unity

[hidden bridge]

ya

its too early for me to figure this out lmao imt rying to get a 2 segment arm working with 4 parts needed for unity to be happy lol

[pale pumice]

you don't have to weight paint all the bones, they just have to be there

[hidden bridge]

oh yeah lol

i had to kinda rerig it a little

[hidden bridge]

how can i make my eyes not rotate but still follow the movement of the bone

[pale pumice]

you'd have to make some kind of complex animation for that

[hidden bridge]

rly? i cant just have some sort of ik or constraint?

[pale pumice]

you could probably play with FinalIK to do something like this

[azure crest]

can some one help me add a rig to my model

[pale pumice]

that's what this channel is for

[azure crest]

idk how to rig like i said so idk what im doing

[pale pumice]

have you watched any tutorials yet?

[azure crest]

yea but im still confused

[pale pumice]

if you have specific questions, that'd be a good place to start

[azure crest]

do i need a armature

for the model

[pale pumice]

yes

[azure crest]

ok

also if a neck is like this how would i rig it

[spiral cloak]

stretch the texture

into the size confines shrink the body

[pale pumice]

... what?

[spiral cloak]

... what?

[pale pumice]

not sure what that has to do with rigging?

[spiral cloak]

-89u[j'm/

[pale pumice]

if the neck is too long for it to be reasonably humanoid, you could make a second set of bones that you weight paint, and use rotation constraints to drive them off the normal neck/head bones which you put into the humanoid rig.

[azure crest]

what about hair

[pale pumice]

what about it?

[azure crest]

nvm is a rig and a armature the same

?

[pale pumice]

yes basically

[azure crest]

can i dm you for it to be easier to talk

[pale pumice]

no, in here others may chime in or benefit

[azure crest]

ok

is this a rig or is it diffrent

[pale pumice]

looks like it is, though not humanoid in the way vrchat would want it. There's an image of one pinned in here

[azure crest]

when i import in unity theres no rig though

[pale pumice]

watch basic avatar setup tutorials, you have to actually set that up

[azure crest]

in unity or

[pale pumice]

?

yes you have to set that up in unity

[azure crest]

ok

[tame willow]

can someone help me rig this model?

[torpid ermine]

what model?

[balmy delta]

need more information than "can someone help"

[tame willow]

ive got the mesh, i need help rigging it....

[balmy delta]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDeB4tDVCGY

[rare moon]

position constraint

if it's 100% flat

you can also use position constraints + contacts to get x and y position and feed it to a blendtree so you can animate the eyes yourself

[copper rover]

Is there a way to get great looking finger rig that's even and aligned correctly? Adjustments are unintuitive and it's one of those situation it's unclear how to improve on a hand rig. I'd like to avoid muscle setting because it doesn't address the underlying rig issues.

Issues:

• Finger is slanted fist
• Large gap between Middle and Ring finger

If there is a method to incrementally improve on hand rig that would be appreciated. Right now there is a lot of unexpected results from changes. It's hard to say what would and wouldn't influence index controllers fingers.

The debugging process is pretty complex as well. Right now I need to make a fist in VR in an index controller in order to test this. If there is a way to check in blender it would make this a lot easier to figure out.

[copper rover]

Attempted to manually copy Unity's enforce t-pose over to blender but in the case of the thumb Unity will continue to offset the thumb's rotation. So you can't try to clone unity does the pose.

[fading verge]

Im just now realizing that there is a reason that those bones on the left might be rotated 90 degrees t on purpose? Does it offer improvements to FBT? when i search for techniques related to this i seem to find a old fix back in the day for vrchat to have a second armature that is constrainted to a normal humanoid one but thats to allow control of a quirky sized avatar. Can someone point me in the right direction why this might be a superior method?

[copper rover]

It has no impact on tracking afaik. By default SteamVR hand rig uses something similar. Only the location of the joint matters for movement.

[tardy grail]

Does anyone know a good method for hip leg bend area so it looks nice and plum on all sides instead of being bendy

[signal grotto]

how would i get this piston to function normally in vrc

[pale pumice]

Yeah, that's not really going to work out how you think. I'd just import the FBX into Blender and treat the blender -> unity path as one-way.

[balmy delta]

give it a bone then use an aim constraint

[pale pumice]

Aim constraints are so underrated

[light moon]

Is there a substitute for this? FinalIK is whitelisted but ironically this specific component is not

I'd like to avoid using something like FABRIK/CCD because it would be unwarranted levels of complexity for what can be achieved with this more simple type

[light moon]

Oh, it seems LimbIK is whitelisted which may be roughly the same

[tardy grail]

will this be functional in vrchat? will it cause issues

[pale pumice]

your humanoid skeleton should match your human self. To do digitgrade you do a second set of bones and use rotation constraints or other methods to make them move.

I mean, or you can stand in exactly that pose IRL, but that's tricky 🙂

[charred gulch]

anyone know why it does this when i merge? idk how to even discribe this to try and google for an answer

the head decides to connect to the elbow?

[hollow quartz]

try applying transforms to the bone before merging/parenting

[charred gulch]

Not 100% on how to do that but I was able to separate and then move back where it was supposed to be and then reconnect to the neck. Was a weird pain but I got it fixed. Thank you!

[undone wadi]

hii!! first i didnt make this model and like.. i wanna upload it because i like the game + the character itself.. idk HOW to rig and this model came w some sort of rig?? everything looks fine but its giving me errors

there is a version w/o a rig but i really do NOT want to learn how to rig/ more prefered 😥

[pale pumice]

It looks like you have the wrong bones in the slots. Neck should not be in Upper Chest, for example

[undone wadi]

ill try

i thinksies i did that last time too and it gave me some error

gimme a sec

[pale pumice]

"some error" - share it, it's difficult to help otherwise

[undone wadi]

im sorry i dont remember what it was before 😭 hang on

[pale pumice]

'sokay - if it happens again, share

[undone wadi]

so should i leave upper chest blank? since its like an unnessasary bone

good lord i cannot spell

[pale pumice]

Yeah it's optional for VRChat

[undone wadi]

ok coolieo

the one error popped up again ill show\

i remember how to fix it

[pale pumice]

also upgrade your Unity

yeah so it should go hips -> spine -> chest -> shoulders and neck

if your avatar isn't setup that way, you'll need to rework the armature

[undone wadi]

yes yes i got that

[undone wadi]

ive been so lazy to i did at one point and like it completely corrupted on me

i gotta redownload stuff n what not i hate waiting tho

[pale pumice]

well unity thinks you don't so either you don't or you've got the wrong bones in the wrong slots in the rig setup

[undone wadi]

it SHOULD be fixed i see no other errors but i will check

[undone wadi]

yeah the rig setup was weird her shoulders were connected to the neck

[pale pumice]

yeah that's not right

[undone wadi]

yeah

i fixed that tho.. one think i finally know how to do bc vroid models used to be the same but with the leg bones

alrighty i gotta fix and optomize some textures and hopefully shes good to go

tysm!!

oh wait nvm we may be cooked

its saying the rig isnt even humanopid when its selected as humanoid 😭 what the fart

[pale pumice]

if there are wrongly mapped bones, it'll do that

[undone wadi]

i feel like im decoding some egyptian language

[pale pumice]

no idea which bone "axel" is here

[undone wadi]

oh oopsie

axel is shoulder

[limpid bridge]

what language lol

[narrow roost]

Does anybody know a lot about Pumkin tools? I am having an issue with it

[balmy delta]

State your issue instead of asking to ask

[clever ledge]

how do i get started with rigging its soooo harddd 😭

(please ping me wheen replying or i will forget)

[balmy delta]

just add an armature and start adding bones

extrude the same way you extrude vertices

[clever ledge]

the thing is... i tried that with the legs on my character, and they didn't move the legs

[balmy delta]

well you need to parent the mesh to the armature then weight paint

[clever ledge]

okay, well the parenting seems easy enough but what in mount olympus is weight painting

[balmy delta]

you paint weight to the mesh saying "hey track this bone by this much between the value 0 and 1"

[clever ledge]

mkay

any videos you recommend, the only reason i didnt use on for the other stuff is cuz it was confusingh

[balmy delta]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDeB4tDVCGY

[clever ledge]

okay

and ive seen that ppl usually have armature in the main body for movement in there

Would i have to add it for smth like this?

i mean, i only rlly need the legs and tail to move

[balmy delta]

you need all the bones to make it humanoid

they dont need to be weighted but they need to be there

[clever ledge]

mkay, so, does that mean i also need floating arm bones?

Cuz vro has no arms

[balmy delta]

they dont need to be weighted but need to be there

[clever ledge]

mkayy thxx, ill come back if i run into any problems

does it matter if the unused ones are centered with the mesh

[pale pumice]

you really want the rig to look proper, there's a pinned message in here with a diagram

of course, you also don't have to rig that humanoid, but then you'd need to make your own locomotion system

[clever ledge]

Does this look descent enough?

Also when the legs move, the body deforms as well, how would i fix this?

[pale pumice]

don't weight paint the body to the leg bones

and that doesn't really look like the diagram

[clever ledge]

well i didnt go off the diagram, but would it work for this avatar?

[pale pumice]

do you want it to be humanoid? use the diagram.

[clever ledge]

sigh

[hollow quartz]

the point is, you can't make the avatar work without the armature being set up correctly to be "humanoid"

otherwise it literally will not work, and will not play animations. basically, it'll t-pose and that's it

[clever ledge]

yeah i figured that out, i had to redo it

[pale pumice]

click "configure" and put the right bones into the right slots

[clever ledge]

is it not sposed to show the armature as it would in blender cuz its hard to make out the bones

[pale pumice]

unless you're in the rig setup mode (when you click "configure" there), you won't see actual bones in Unity

(you can still manipulate them though)

[clever ledge]

sobs

why must this be so harddd

[pale pumice]

because your bones have silly names. Name them better and it'll be obvious where they go

[clever ledge]

i didnt even name em, and how would that fix the error?

[pale pumice]

I have no idea what the cause of the error is without seeing the hierarchy, but naming them nicely will probably help that a lot

[clever ledge]

mkay

[dawn torrent]

What would be the best way to rig digitigrade/animal legs? Or does it not really matter much?

[pale pumice]

there are a bunch of tutorials, if you want this to work nice in vrchat. it's definitely not trivial.
I righ mine like the right side (but with the knee a bit more forward), but also do a set of plantigrade bones to drive the digitgrade bones via rotation constraints, since IRL I am plantigrade.
Obviously adjust this plan if you are somehow otherwise 🙂

[dawn torrent]

Thank you 👍

[pale pumice]

I think I've done this 3x now, the first two really badly 🙂

[radiant scaffold]

Hey so is there ever being a huge update on VRChat

[pale pumice]

there are updates frequently, check in #announcements

[radiant scaffold]

Oh thanks

[jade sail]

Hey guys i have a request, could one of the developers bring back the old home room I miss the OG days

[nova shard]

this isnt really the correct channel to be requesting anything this is for avatar rigging...

[jade sail]

I couldn't find the right one so I selected random

[pale pumice]

#feature-requests if you wanted to discuss it, canny if you wanted to submit it officially. Also read channel topics, it should be pretty clear this isn't the best place for that.

[nocturne flame]

this might be a bit of a dumb question but how do i go about rigging a character with no visible arms, neck or legs? would i just give it bones that connect the limbs together with no weight painting?

[brazen island]

yes, you need a full set of humanoid bones (except fingers) for it to work at all.

[nocturne flame]

thank you

[slow lily]

I'm trying to simplify the rig by removing unnecessary bones and merging some, but I can't see which bone I'm selecting

Manually re-rigging the model is a non-starter because I've tried that before and got NaN weights so I gave up. https://youtu.be/dvybkDbR-kY/

[hallow quartz]

you're in object mode (top left under edit/render), with the armature selected
press tab to go into edit mode (or click where it says object mode, should be a dropdown). this should allow you to see which bone you're actually selecting. edit mode will also allow you to "dissolve" bones into each other, so that final bone should have the combined weights of the old bones.

[pale pumice]

You can also select bones in the hierarchy, and see which is highlighted in the 3D view. Sometimes that's way easier too.

[wintry jetty]

this may not be the propper channel but instead of using bones for the eyes i want ot use shape keys for eye tracking. is that a possible thing i can do or am i wasting my time thinking about setting it up that way

[brazen island]

native eyetracking is bones only. you can do some weird setups with a bone moving some sender and you reading it via proximity contact, but ofc thats not perfect

[jagged python]

So I'm new-ish to rigging new bones (mainly due to I just came back to vrc and I've forgotten a bit about creating things from scratch). For some reason this bone is giving me a hassle and I wanted to see if someone could tell me if I'm doing this right. I've researched a crap ton of videos and none of them are working. I'm basically trying to rig the chains so they move, right. I created the bone, have it parented to the chest and then I parented the chains to the new bone. When I test it in pose mode, it works fine. Then once I import it into Unity and test it, its detached. I've tried reparenting and got the same results. I am also confused why the relationship lines are in the center, could that be part of the problem?

[pale pumice]

relationship lines mean the origin for that mesh object is not the origin. Select it in object mode, ctrl+a, all transforms.

(there are reasons you may not want this, but probably that doesn't apply here)

[jagged python]

Oh sweet, that parts fixed at least 😅

[glad temple]

i have no idea how this happened. I just mesh transformed and suddenly this happened

[gloomy bloom]

Anyone got any examples of Prosthetic or Robotic Arms?
I'm trying to gauge what I got for it's articulation

[heavy pendant]

i've never rigged bones before but does it look ok? im new to 3d modeling so any input will help.

[pale pumice]

There's a diagram pinned in here as to how it should look if you want your armature to be treated as Humanoid by VRChat.

in specific, you need more than one spine bone, you need hips -> spine -> chest -> upper chest (optional) -> neck -> head

[heavy pendant]

i wanted to have the head/ torso static and move with my head movements (kinda like pac-man) would that be possible?

[pale pumice]

Sure, you can weight paint mesh to whatever bones you want, you still need to have those bones in the rig.

[heavy pendant]

Oh ok!

[static parcel]

Do blendshapes count as rigging? I was wonder if there's a good way to make changes to the basis, that will carry over to the different shapes.

[pale pumice]

change basis then in the vertex menu, with vertices selected, you can pick "propagate to shapes" and the position of those vertices will be applied to other shape keys

you can also do it the other way with the "blend from shape" option - apply other shape key's vertex positions to the current key

[static parcel]

Thanks

[royal canopy]

Hate rigging

Finished the skeleton

[pale pumice]

you'll need hand bones if you want that to be humanoid in vrchat

[balmy delta]

they dont need to be weighted but they need to at least exist

also you didnt need those pelvis bones only the leg bones

[pale pumice]

yeah I was wondering if the position of those and the shoulder->upper arm joints would be an issue

[balmy delta]

well

bone positions not really if it at least lets you rig it as tpose

[pale pumice]

yep, true

[royal canopy]

It won't, the arm is not connected, the parent is just the shoulder, also thank for telling me about the hand

[pale pumice]

shoulder still moves the arm, but yeah, try it out.

[slow lily]

Is there an easy way to find out which bones don't have any weights assigned to any vertices?

[coral obsidian]

Can someone help me set this up?

[pale pumice]

If there is no vertex group in your mesh with the same name as a bone, that bone is not used to deform that mesh. if there is and it's empty, same.

[cold cliff]

is it normal that when grabbing the child of a multi-child physbone, pulling it doesn't turn the root at all? (even in 'average' mode?)

[open tundra]

Okay i give up, why is my view position over my shoulder now ?

[robust crescent]

you have value on x means avatar isnt at 0.0.0

move it to 0.0.0 pos/rot , then edit your viewpoint again

[open tundra]

Unfortunately did not work

This is the only warning i'm getting if this could be a culprit

[robust crescent]

should never need a value on X in viewpoint that means your av isnt centered

[open tundra]

Okay i think i see what you're getting at but this is my first crack at unity, still quite new. Can i just move the model over to center or will i break things?

actually wait that looks promising, i'm gonna compile and see what happens

Thats better, think i just need to do the same to Z

[open tundra]

Can anyone help me figure out why the rig seems to be off balance?

[arctic matrix]

I made this rig and I’m wondering what would be the proper names for it and if there’s anything that I need to change on it

[pale pumice]

it's not humanoid so you can basically do whatever and name bones whatever you want, but you'll have to build your locomotion layer from scratch.

[balmy delta]

in order to have tracking you need to give it a full humanoid rig

they dont need to be weighted but just exist

[wintry jetty]

https://tenor.com/view/shrek-lord-farquaad-gif-4571295

[buoyant ginkgo]

who knows how to rig an unusual shape?

im really bad at that and i fr need help

😭

hol up im getting an image of it

yes im tryna import roblox avatar

idk how to even make a rig

[deep tartan]

I do this constantly, you rig it just like any other humanoid honestly

Ppl commission me to turn their roblox avatars into vrchat avis all the time lol

[buoyant ginkgo]

like im asking how to do a rig$

ive been searshing online all day

idk how to do that

[buoyant ginkgo]

thats why im asking for help

[deep tartan]

https://youtu.be/FzRLR8SGVK0?si=OtDlEa6kW7zmcq-J

[buoyant ginkgo]

my textures are all weird

how can i fix that

[deep tartan]

Not sure? I always just use the textures that the roblox avatar comes with on export

[buoyant ginkgo]

lemme show you

the textures are like sideways