manga-theories

[lapis prairie]

Stating theories as fact is assuming. I also said I think that too. I think you should evaluate the way you type, it comes off super confrontational.

[inner swift]

Also of quick note is that Aokiji doesn’t seem to hate or resent Robin or the straw hats, however he’s more than likely aware of Blackbeards relationship with Luffy, and by proxy the straw hats. Aokiji has a lot of respect for Garp too, meaning he’d be an even less likely candidate for the “10th titanic captain” as he wouldn’t want to do something like that to his old friend.

it’s all a theory of course, just as yours is, with a level of speculation and guess work, simply trying to draw some connections.

[lapis prairie]

I didn't mention anything to do with that. It just erked me that you would berate people for headcannon then state theories as fact, which is like the same thing, you know?

[inner swift]

Ok, sorry the slow mode makes stuff a bit annoying

[lapis prairie]

not you

Yeah I agree. You were just being mean. No worries

[inner swift]

The only other theory I could possibly have is that Aokiji is doing something no one has ever considered. He’s going solo. He’s still keeping some levels of connection to the people he knew like Smoker, whilst also being in contact with someone of note like Blackbeard to accomplish whatever it is he strives for.

[echo plank]

I feel like both Law and Aokiji hold up, but I feel like Aokiji holds up more because Law has already shown his allegiances quite strongly, right? Unless he is that good of an actor.

[echo plank]

but also Law is doing the marines a favor by defeating big mom, i'm thinking that she isn't gonna go down fully because of this though.

[inner swift]

I tend not to let my personal bias weigh in on my theories too heavily, but I disagree, I think Big Mom shouldn’t come back, but instead focus more on the remnants of the family and what happens in regards to leadership, perhaps in the future we’ll see the straw hats contributing in some way to the new leadership of the family. Perhaps through Katakuri, or he’ll be rivalled by someone like Cracker, Oven or Perospero

[fathom matrix]

Looking at it, I don't think Luffy needs to use gear 2nd for fire anymore?

Cause I can't recall Luffy as of late using gear second for red roc or red hawk, and I think him learning ryou helped that

I know Luffy uses speed and armament haki, but do you think Luffy uses his ryou training made his movements faster or intensifies that power more.

[forest onyx]

I don't think so, I think that gear second is like a transformation of his fruit like others Zoan that grants him more speed and fire abilities

Does someone think that advance conquer haki has the ability to be beyond everyone? Becoming all ppl with a weaker ambition than haos haki user till a tiring state

[round pebble]

What do you guys think of Enel in Wano (like seriously)?

[jaunty sluice]

most of the people there are scewed

[desert obsidian]

rest in piss everyone lmao

[gritty warren]

zoro>every character in op

[static lance]

bellamy>>

[steady prism]

Theory: Ohara’s Perception of the World

This theory is an exposition of how Ohara's perception of the world can tell us the current state of the world and the dynamics/relationship/disposition behind some of the most powerful entities of the OP world, including the Gorosei, Imu, Nikka, and the ancient weapons.

Looking back at Ohara’s Tree of Knowledge, we can see that they have a model of their universe that is geocentric in nature; their “Earth” is the center of everything.

Based on what we’ve learned in Skypiea, we can identify two planets in this model with high confidence:

• Vearth: Basically the Earth in the center
• Fairy Vearth: Basically the Moon, which is the closest celestial body from the Earth

I looked around for a ‘credible’ (i.e. good enough) geocentric model and found one (https://explainingscience.org/2017/11/10/geocentric-cosmology) that showed the following planets/stars that are in reference to its proximity from Earth:

• Moon
• Mercury
• Venus
• Sun
• Mars
• Jupiter
• Saturn

Okay, so how can we reconcile this theory with Ohara’s model? Well we’ve established the parallels with the Earth and Moon, so if we decide to omit the Sun, we get our “best match” using this geocentric model (see pics below).

So what can we infer from this? Well we get more questions than answers:

1. Is this comparison accurate?
No, there are quite a few holes in this comparison:
a) First, the Sun isn’t included in the Ohara model, which could be for many unknown reasons
b) Second, Jupiter in our world should be a massive celestial body, much larger than the Earth. But here Ohara’s researchers deemed it to be smaller than the central blue planet. I doubt they’ve been able to perform intergalactic travel yet to confirm the planets’ sizes, so don’t take these matches literally. Rather think of them as inspirations of how the OP universe is designed.
c) Thirdly, some planets are sharing the same orbit; we have 5 orbits but 6 planets (see red circles below)
d) Fourthly, there's one orbit that doesn't have a single planet in it....why's that? (see blue circles below)

2. Is this knowledge taboo?
Given the WG’a keen interest in the knowledge Ohara was learning, I think it’s fair to say that this model is not “taboo” knowledge in any way.

3. Why isn’t the Sun a part of their model?
Well given what we’ve learned about the Sun God Nika, perhaps “they” (i.e. WG) considered that this “light” has been successfully “extinguished” and so it doesn’t need a position in this model...kinda flimsy reasoning, I know. But that single orbit that has nothing in it is so strange.

4. What else is missing?
Interestingly enough, the missing planets are the ones named after the ancient weapons: Uranus, Neptune (Poseidon), and Pluto (Pluton)...For these 3 planets to be missing along with the Sun is a veeeeeery convenient missing piece of the puzzle.

5. What kind of symbolism do these planets have to the OP story? I believe that each planet symbolizes an “entity” that rules the world of One Piece. In our world, most of our planets have been named after Roman Gods, which were based on Greek Gods:

• Mercury was named after the Roman God Mercuris, the messenger of the Gods. Greek equivalent was Hermes, the swiftest diety (just like how Mercury moves the fastest around the Sun).
• Venus was named after the Roman Goddess of love. Greek equivalent was Aphrodite.
• Earth was not named after a God. Another name it has was "Terra Firma", which means "firm land", after the Goddess of the Earth. Greek equivalent was Gaia.
• Mars was named after the Roman God of War. Greek equivalent was Ares.
• Jupiter was named after the Roman God of the Sky/Lightning and the king of all Gods. Greek equivalent was Zeus.
• Saturn was named after the Roman God of Wealth and Agriculture and the father of Jupiter. Greek equivalent was Cronus.
• Uranus the first planet to be discovered with a telescope. Since it wasn't recognized as a planet by ancient observers, it was not named after a typical Roman God (Caelus). Rather, the discoverer decided to name this planet after a Greek God of the Sky (which is the foil to Gaia/Earth), the father of Cronus (Saturn) and the grandfather of Zeus (Jupiter).
• Neptune was named after the Roman God of the sea. The Greek equivalent is Poseidon.
• Pluto is named after the Roman God of the Underworld. The Greek equivalent is both Hades and "Plutus"

Why are we going through this? If we eliminate the Moon from Ohara’s model, we have 6 planets left: Mercury, Venus, Earth, Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn. What’s convenient is there are 6 entities that control the world of One Piece: the Gorosei and Imu. Oda likes inverting classical definitions, what if he has given these 6 characters names/dispositions that mimicked the planets they’re based off of?

6. What other symbolism can we find?
Well, I also believe the missing planets/stars are of huge importance, both to Ohara's geocentric model and to the OP story. Using the Greco-Roman lore from each of these celestial bodies, we can actually infer quite a lot of questions/suspicions, such as:
a) the lack of the Sun in this model has something to do with the cleansing of Nikka's devil fruit from the annals of history
b) the relationship the 3 ancient weapons have with each other as well as the rest of the OP world (specifically the WG) can be perceived using their planets’ namesakes
c) assumptions on ancient weapons' presence in the OP world alongside their custodians/protectors both before and after the void century can be perceived looking at their planets’ namesakes

To conclude, some other people have already drawn parallels to the Gorosei/Imu and planets and what I'm trying to focus on is fleshing out the original premise that brought forth those ideas. To be fair, a lot of this theory is hinging on a single OP panel/scene, which means we're in headcannon territory. However, in my opinion, the lack of a Sun-like celestial body in their model (or at the very least a traditional depiction of a sun) sparked the idea in me that perhaps Oda is trying to tell us something important that is supposed to be rooted in real-world astronomy. I believe we can learn more about what will happen in OP by looking at what has already been shown in the past. For that reason, perhaps the Ohara incident is using celestial bodies (or lack thereof) to foreshadow the personification of these entities and their role in the story. Perhaps this backstory is trying to provide some crucial yet innocuous information that will become painfully clear in a couple of years.

That's all for me, I might post a follow-up theory on Pluton & Uranus but we shall see. Hope you guys enjoyed this.

[echo plank]

Cool theory. Maybe the 5 elders are named after those planets? This is a stretch, but what if the ancient weapons are named after fallen elders? (8 elders) Idk what significance that would have to the story though.

[steady prism]

Thanks! As of right now I’m almost certain Oda named the 5 elders based off these planets’ Greek/Roman archetypes. I mean for example, one of the 5 elders looks like Ghandi, who is traditionally known to be a pacifist, but is also the only Elder who holds a weapon and keeps it ready at all times, kinda like the God of War Mars. Oda’s merging two polar opposite archetypes together, which make this even more difficult/enjoyable to put the pieces together

Perhaps these elders used to sit on the same roundtable as the 3 ancient weapons and the sun god Nika in the Ancient Kingdom. I don’t think they’re considered “elders” tbh back then but definitely prominent figures

[paper sable]

thats a big theory

[hidden briar]

wow

[sacred lynx]

was Rogers a black blade user? Because we know he had a very powerful sword, but nothing is actually known about his weapon...... theories about that?

[paper sable]

yes he was. did you watch the fight between whitebeard and rodger.

anyways this would be cool if it was true lol https://onepiece.fandom.com/f/p/4400000000000068489

[timber silo]

sadly it's not his swords name is Ace

[pure raven]

@steady prism great theory

[desert obsidian]

roger had didnt have black blade at WB vs roger

[lapis horizon]

Hy dont you guys think when they show that warlord system is gone and some people were crying in an island which is alabasta and makino and dadan crying because they saw sabo

Here is what i think
Morgan said that there was death
I thinks ita vivis father and vivi maybe is still in MG
Which when the strawhats see the new paper thet going start a war again with the world government to save her

[limber holly]

Why does some people keep saying Blackbeard will appear on Whole cake 💀

[forest venture]

We haven’t seen him in a long time. People are earning for Blackbeard action

[lunar topaz]

[pure raven]

because theres a road poneglyph with no yonko protecting it

[sand thicket]

He can also kidnap pudding as he has no one atm to read poneglyphs

[muted finch]

Luffy bounty will be 5.6 billion after wano mark my words

[steady prism]

Thanks! Feel free to poke some holes in it if you find any

[limber holly]

Pudding can read poneglyphs?

[sand thicket]

if her 3rd eye activates properly, she should be able to. Thats why big mom has shown interest in her.

[limber holly]

Oh thats interesting

[sand thicket]

i am not sure if black beard is aware of this but he could be through underground means. WCI is pretty much unguarded now without big mom (and i dont think sweet generals can deal with him tbh), so its a ripe opportunity for him to steal pudding.

[limber holly]

Bet sanji gon save her

[inner swift]

Also calling it, if BB does attack whole cake, Oven dies and Jesus gets the fruit. I can elaborate but I won’t.

[vale relic]

As of now I think there is more to choppers fruit that just "human human" I hope it isn't some sort of God of the forest but it's definitely not a regular human.
Unless it takes human aspects and takes them to the extreme

[sacred lynx]

Probably isn’t a god model? But we learn the name when the power awakens…. Is choppers power awakened? We know it isn’t just a human human fruit because there has to be a subtype due to luffy also having a human human fruit and there are no 2 same fruits (idk with smile tho that’s kinda confusing)

[pure raven]

the one piece is real

[grim stone]

Chopper using his Giant form could be a type of forced awakening. Also, his model was just Human. unlike Buddha, Nika etc.

Coz, zoan awakenings made zoan users mindless super strong fighters. Chopper was like that before timeskip. Now he is in complete control.

[sacred lynx]

But he can’t transferrer his power to other things as traditional of awakening, like Turing stuff to rubber or string…. I’m confused by the awakened law and kid fruit, unless that’s not their awakened when they kill big mom

[visual merlin]

yes what they used on Bm was awakening

Kid's awakening so far allows him to turn people and things into magnets

[grim stone]

Law's awakening - allowed him to use new techniques that effected Big Mom from inside
Kidd - he was able to apply magnetic properties to other things, including living things like BM

[visual merlin]

and Law's allows him to make special rooms one of whihc at least can go around his sword to do cool stuff

[sacred lynx]

True, but choppers “awakening” shows up really early, and when luffy awakens he is in control of himself

[grim stone]

in Laws case, he wasn't able to use his normal techniques properly due to tremendous haki from BM and Kaido. Awakening somewhat shows he was able to bypass that with KROOM technique.

[sand sail]

He didn't bypass that with Kroom

[sacred lynx]

What are cases of other zoan awakenings I can’t recall any

[sand sail]

His techniques worked fine, he just couldn't move them around with his fruit directly. He had no trouble at all affecting them otherwise, just no cuts or movements.

The Jailer Beasts from Impel Down are the only other zoan awakenings in the series so far

[grim stone]

that awakening effect could vary from fruit to fruit.
Luffy was constantly laughing throughout the fight, so much that he would also lose focus at times and then get surprised.

[sand sail]

Luffy never lost focus from laughing, he'd just react cartoonishly over the top to things because it's funnier

[visual merlin]

There were just certain techniques he couldn't use on them, and he still can't even with awakening

[sacred lynx]

Didn’t think of that one, I thought it had to do with him being joyboy tho

[sand sail]

^ His awakening just allowed him to apply a Room outside of himself

[visual merlin]

It may be a little more than that if R room is an awakening power

[sand sail]

For Kroom it was onto his sword, for R Room it was just onto Big Mom herself

Well the rooms would have certain effects I'm sure, but ultimately that's the awakening, he's throwing them on other objects/people instead of only around his immediate radius

With Kroom making the object malleable as well seemingly

[sacred lynx]

I honestly thought that was typo, why is zorro called zolo

[visual merlin]

I guess what I mean is the full description may be more of "Special rooms that he can put on other things" rather than just being able to put them on other things, but same idea either way I guess

[sand sail]

Yeh, that's just the basic bit, like the way Kid can apply magnetic fields onto anything seemingly as well

But then with that he can do Punk Crash and such

[grim stone]

Zuneisha later said "he is like joy boy" We are yet to see what unfolds in terms of Joy Boy and how much Luffy resembles him

[sacred lynx]

it definitely has smt to do with joyboy because roger and crew laughed when they found out about -------- and i am pretty sure joyboy laughed about it too and thats why they named the island laugh tale... laugh tale, luffy laughs when he awakens. Direct correlation.

[sand sail]

Well yes, the correlation is Joyboy had nika's fruit and was probably known for his laughter too

If it's doing this to Luffy, it did it to him

[grim stone]

+1. Also the implication of Zoan fruits having their will/soul of their own. So Nika's influence is strong in awakening.

[sacred lynx]

oden joined rogers ship, yamato gona sail with the straw hats???????

[primal cargo]

Check out my theory on Law's awakening from back then : #manga-theories message
I think there's an element of automation to it. Like when he applies Kroom to his sword he "sets up" an attack (Shock Wille) which is then performed "by" the sword
If that's the case then R Room (it didn't exist at the time) could be an automatic process that methodically affects every air molecule to stop the sound, or something like that

So, there could be a wide range of techniques that can only be used with Awakening, regardless of the "apply to other things" part

[sacred lynx]

"some powers have rare occurence" some powers, not all fruits can awaken? (probably not the case)

[sacred lynx]

main flaw, kidd makes bm temporarily a magnet. Law makes his sword a temp operator. luffy makes other temp rubber along with other stuff, doflamingo makes objects temp string (temp=temporary). Also, it seems luffy can awaken at will. he is fighting kaido, then kaido says he must be getting tired. luffy goes back to normal then re awakens.

[primal cargo]

Yeah all of them are temporary, what's your point ?
I do propose that the immortality surgery is an extension of that, but it's a special case where you would have to give your life in exchange for making the effect permanent

[sacred lynx]

sorry forgot to finish my point.

doflamingo says it is a rare occurence, but it appeares he is not entirely correct. We do not know of anyone who is immortal through previous operators, how does mingo know this? Where did this info come from? What does immortal mean? invincible or can life really long but can be killed? The immortality may be a mere rummor. So what Doflomingo says may only be partially right, maybe fruit can not have indefinet effect

[pine oasis]

Could imu be the immortal person?

[sacred lynx]

i dont actually know who imu is, I did anime only to last episode then picked up on manga where anime left off, skipped most of punk hazard

[primal cargo]

Well there has to be someone immortal out there somewhere, at least that's what most of the community has been assuming because of precisely what you said
I think we can safely say the immortality surgery has to be real, otherwise why even bring the idea into the story ?

[pine oasis]

Did u watch the reverie arc?
Cus that’s where imu was first shown

[sacred lynx]

i think so. ya, isnt imu the leader of WG????? the most powerful person maybe in the WG? I am very confused by it??? existence because it was only the shadow of it if i recall right. But if it is the "king" of the WG, I agree it might be immortal(it cause idk if male female or something different all together)

[tough pond]

i think if anything the whole arc of the immortal idea and corazon eating the ope ope just goes to show what an absolutely selfish twat Doflamingo was, he didn’t really know if the surgery would work but he did know he wouldn’t mind sacrificing his brothers life for his own

[manic rune]

Interesting

[sacred lynx]

I am very interested in this video theory:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQsGCgrmYF0&ab_channel=AnimeBallsDeep

he talks about the return of the god from skypiea ark and some races descending from the moon.

[sacred lynx]

In theory, his brother would only die if he could perform a surgery that kills the operator. Thus, if the only operations that can directly kill the operator is the immortality, coraozon can only die if he performs the surgery. If it does not exist, then the non existent surgery can not kill him.

[tough pond]

i don’t think doffy knew for certain but he wouldn’t mind sacrificing his brother to do so

[sacred lynx]

for sure

[compact hedge]

https://www.reddit.com/r/OnePiece/comments/uav2jh/luffy_will_lose_his_devil_fruit_chapter_1047/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

I think this theory is worth reading because it seems very interesting. I don't maybe think blackbeard will fully take his df, maybe just nullify it but even if he does, it will be interesting.

[fathom matrix]

There's been a lot of theories about Luffy's mom, but what if she just dipped?

I know Oda may not care that much, but what if Luffy's mom just didn't want to be involved with the whole Revolutionary Stuff, getting in trouble with the marines, or anything. Left Luffy with Garp and buggered off?

Heck, what if she's aware of what her son's doing, but that only makes her more so want to distance herself from him, cause she doesn't want any of that.

[pure raven]

I feel that she’s not an important character. She may never be mentioned

[lunar wren]

Have there been any theories on Luffy's true dream?

My initial guesses are drink sake with everyone, make friends with everyone, throw the biggest party, or laugh with everyone. Cuz he must have made it when he was young and it it something inherently too hard to achieve if ppl call him a fool for it.

[lunar wren]

Same thing with dragon, dragon is important and is his dad but he didnt care and it doesnt affect him too much

[pure raven]

The party ones sounds right

[lunar wren]

My other prediction is momo staysbin wano and acts as the king and connection to luffy like Vivi in alabasta. Cuz its clear that slowly everyone is becoming his ally

[sacred lynx]

Bois let’s think about cleshay story wrighting. His mom may be imu or the leader of WG while dad is the head of the revolution. Remeber luffy didn’t even know he had a dad so he knows nothing about mom. But I dragon grarps son or is luffy s mom garps daughter?

[tough pond]

ain’t no way you spelt Cliché like that?

[lunar wren]

Is that what it was?

[sacred lynx]

😭😭😭 I’m not going to get a good sat score

[lunar wren]

Ah hell nah, wrighting lmao. Like I said prior luffy wouldnt care who is mother is. "Oml u the bad guy are my mom? And ur stopping my dreams? Catch these hands"

By rule thats consideree spoiler for other series. Just in case

[sacred lynx]

How do you tag spoiler

[lunar wren]

Use | "text |

[sand sail]

Do not talk about other series details in this channel

[sacred lynx]

|“test” |

[sand sail]

That includes in spoiler tags

Keep them out entirely

[sacred lynx]

My bad

[inner swift]

THEORY DEBATE TIME: What do we think Kid took from Big Mom, and why was it such a big thing to her?

From my guess, something related to Rocks or at least her time in the Rocks pirates. Perhaps maps for where they buried treasure, or where John did, as there is many parallels between Kid and John.

[lunar wren]

Just for informative, dont add the quotes. I added them so you could see the bars otherwise they wouldnt have shown

[outer matrix]

joyboy/luffy theory

||the will of d is the clan that was started by joyboy and anyone related to him has the will of d the straw hat shows the people with the highest potential from the previous user and luffy has to be joyboy which was confirmed from zunesha which the only thing that i could see luffy in joyboy having in common is the sun god model nika fruit awakened and i dont remember where i saw it but i heard that all mythical zoans have minds of their own meaning joyboy and luffy had the same personality also meaning that we dont even have to have anything from oda saying luffy and joyboys personality were the same because we know that zunesha thought they were the same person||

[sacred lynx]

Or just the same presence

[delicate crow]

I have a theory about Shanks my theory is that he has ate a devil fruit ik we've seen him in the water (knee deep) but the scar scared away a massive sea monster so i'm thinking its a Mythical Zoan that allows him to talk to animals and other living things that don't speak a human language.

[desert notch]

So in your opinion,what could be the source of sanji’s new powerup? I know that germa genes and everything,but i mean how did he get blue flames. Literally the only theories i hear are
-He is Lunarian
-Just the germa genes
-He has Passion
-Idk dude he’s just that horny

[lyric berry]

I have been thinking about it for a while but I don’t think what you’ve listed is what it is, imo that would be a bit cheesy and underwhelming. If it was any of those things I don’t see why Oda would hide it/censor it for a big reveal later on

[desert notch]

I mean yeah. Oda isn’t really one to hide basic things like that. Saying “my dreams are finding the one piece and having fun with my friends” wouldn’t really change the plot in a way where you would need to hide it

[inner swift]

That was conquerors Haki my guy. Shanks is confirmed as a non-fruit user. In fact, supposedly his crew has no DF users.

Something else to bring up, Oda said he didn’t want Luffy to just beat Kaido with a “big punch” as he tends to do with villains.

Any guesses as to how Luffy beats Kaido?

(Also, this was stated by Oda after the Nika reveal, so it isn’t in reference to Luffy awakening, rather what he does after it)-apparently I was wrong

[quaint frost]

this was stated by oda like 7 years ago

[inner swift]

Fuck was it?

Even still, I don’t think it’s in reference to gear 5th, that’s just a fancier punch

[upbeat coral]

Vegapunk is Kizaru, opinions?

[vestal orbit]

based

[sand sail]

You should read the channel description.

[lunar wren]

I thought the reason sanji had blue flames was because nornally he cant get it that hot due to hi s human body but because of the titanium bones and germa body he can simply withstand higher temperatures and thats why it was blue now.

[lunar wren]

Luffy and roger must share it, its childish or laughed at, roger most likely couldnt do it cuz he said he was too early

The biggest party just makes sense to me because all the islands and friends luffy has made along the way. Them reuiniting and throwing the biggest party in the all blue where the red line is destroyed so the east blue friends could meet the new world friends

[upbeat coral]

How do I find it?

[upbeat coral]

Wait found it, also I was serious. I genuinely believe Kizaru is vegapunk, I was having a discussion and wanted to get a general opinion on it! If it's only meant to be for chapter 1047 then I do apologise!

[sand sail]

It's more that that's a theory for one of the other manga channels, unless you can expand on it with some decent detail

[upbeat coral]

Ahh my bad, I'll try not to get lost next time (or have some time to write a few paragraphs as to why). Thank you for the heads up :)

[sand sail]

[pure raven]

vc

[lyric berry]

I’m not buying the party bc luffy at that time knew a total of maybe 10 people by name and hadn’t really had a party at that point. Parties and banquets are a thing he grew to love during his adventure. Maybe an argument could be made that he enjoyed partying with shanks crew but that’s not really been pointed out or emphasized in the story at all

[lunar wren]

My other idea was family but that is just big moms and makes no sense for them to share that dream

[lyric berry]

The friendship thing maybe? Since he did want to make friends with ace and didn’t want to be alone. I just think it’s a bit cheesy to say he wants to befriend the whole world haha but maybe Oda can present it better

[lunar wren]

Because this was when sabo was still alove and I was basing it off of the sake events.

The weird counterargument is why does oda need to hide it if its something so simple so trying to think what it could ne that wasnt so simple and a child could think of

[final plaza]

I think kaido is gonna get a new form in chapter 1048

[merry sparrow]

idk how anyone could think momo and KIKU would join over carrot? if anything Yamato is doing a parallel of Oden and Carrot would be doing the paralleling the role of Neko/Inu. However even tho I would like Carrot to join, I feel as though Yamato is the only character that genuinely MAKES SENSE to join the straw hats without much reaching needed

also your message from a week ago was open on my PC and that's how I saw it XD i usually check this sub on my phone

[formal bridge]

Family was whitebeard's dream big mom just want all species under her flag and calls that twisted delusion a family because of caramel's influence

[hollow grove]

Is there any kind of information that dragon father is rocks and he was son in law of garp cause garp never told that he was his son

[umbral creek]

that sounds like a stretch if ive ever heard one

[pure raven]

crzy

[sand sail]

No.

Dragon being Garp's son is confirmed in the vivre cards

[hollow grove]

Vivre card how so

[sand sail]

I'm not sure how to expand on that information further tbh, the vivre card lists Dragon as being born to Garp some time ago

[hollow grove]

I have never heard that vivre card can tell about these things is it some kind of information that leaked cause I haven't heated about that theory

[sand sail]

It's not a leak, the vivre cards are an official databook analog for the series. In it, they have canon facts about the characters that aren't directly mentioned in the manga, such as Dragon's birth

[hollow grove]

Bro you aren't meaning the vivre card from the anime or is it a logbook outside the anime

[sand sail]

It's a databook from the series

Extra material that doesn't fit or is otherwise just unmentioned in the manga proper

[dense carbon]

speaking of vivre cards, do you guys ever come across people who swear up and down its not canon info

[desert notch]

That’s also whitebeards. It would be weird to share dreams with those people,since they don’t have that connection to luffy roger had

[paper sable]

What if Blackbeard steals Luffy's fruit, and Luffy has to beat him with pure haki like Rodger and Garp did with Rocks? What do you guys think about this possibility? Idk if it would happen but its definitely a possibility

[desert obsidian]

ive heard people say this and i agree with it but luffys fruit will be disabled during the fight so he doesnt lose it perm

[limber sundial]

I would honestly not mind that too much. It would be cool seeing Luffy fight without his devil fruit, instead with just straight boxing with haki.

[paper sable]

yea it would force him to focus on his haki

[inner swift]

Not gonna lie, the idea of Luffy both losing his fruit to Blackbeard and beating him solely with Haki is the single worst theory of all time. IMO

First off, fruit powers cant be straight up stolen, its highly likely that what BB done was just redirect the spirit of WB into himself to gain the fruit

Secondly: Luffy isn't known as "the haki guy" he's been a rubber man (well, Nika man) since chapter 1, and the thought of him ending the series without his iconic power set straight up sucks.

[abstract pond]

"is the single worst theory of all time. IMO"
A little bit exaggerated don't you think?xd

[inner swift]

That's like saying "what if Goku used a gun instead of super saiyan"

[runic mantle]

I agree, since, well, I remember in A SBS, Oda once said that he wanted Luffy to be goofy, and making him only use Haki won't really achieve that

[inner swift]

I'm dead serious, you can get really stupid theories, but this one just makes so much of the series pointless.

[abstract pond]

I have seen worse. Like the theory of Luffy having a tree fruit that turns him into a woman with the radiation in Amazon Lily

[desert obsidian]

i thought it would be better if just for that fight

[inner swift]

That's the catch though, what's the point of all that training and sacrifice to be stripped of most of his powers? With only a few exceptions (Garp, Sanji and Koby come to mind) most Haki only fighters tend to either be swordsmen or just straight up use a weapon to harness their haki

Luffy's entire moveset is based off of him just stretching or extending parts of his body to have various effects, so forcing him into simple basic punch fighting against what i'm assuming would be a triple fruit user just sounds so lame.

[inner swift]

I'm aware that that's not a perfect description of his fighting, but you still get what I'm trying to say though.

[terse fog]

I think depending on how Luffy’s devil fruit awakening works based on it being able to make other people cartoon like and it’s surroundings rubber despite being a zoan might have some way to be a counter to Blackbeard’s dark-dark fruit. Or maybe Blackbeard’s devil fruit can’t affect awakened devil fruits, I am not sure if luffy is going to have a counter I would say it is not likely however he 100% has to find a different way to fight that fits him and not just throwing punches as @inner swift said

[unique isle]

i think blackbeards fruit is actually a mythical zoan moon moon model thats what ace infered when they fought

[inner swift]

Also I’ve came up with a guess as to how an awakened logia works.

As far as we know, of the 12 canon logia users, none of them ever awakened their fruits, but I think I’ve figured how it works.

So we know for a fact that Logia users can transform into, create and control their respective elements.

However, an awakened fruit could allow the user to become the element itself.

For example, if Enel shot a bolt of lightning out, he himself could become that bolt of lightning, and then reappear using it when it hits its target.

The user itself doesn’t transform their body into the element, they just are the element.

That could explain how we’ve never seen an awakened logia, despite characters like Kizaru, Akainu, Aokiji, Ace and Crocodile have a completely solid mastery of their respective element, but are not considered awakened users.

Just imagine Crocodile turning into an entire desert.

[modest skiff]

!theories @desert obsidian

[lone hedge]

Please refrain from using #manga-theories for joke theories, casual chit-chat, or low-effort memes. This channel is for serious discussion- please read the channel description.

[inner swift]

I know we made a couple jokes there but most of that was theory discussion. Why’d you delete it?

[modest skiff]

Because it was low effort joking ish theory discussion. Chit chat along those lines, especially when it is from a less serious theory, goes in the manga channels. We have slow mode in this channel to encourage long form serious discussion

[inner swift]

Part of the start of our conversation was covering my theory on awakened Logia fruits though, I understand after that point it got a bit jokey but not too the point where it wasn’t a regular theory discussion. Not defending the entire conversation, but some of it could have been left.

[modest skiff]

I get what you mean, sorry if I deleted more than I should have. I may have missed what stuff was from your logia theory

[inner swift]

It’s alright, just a bit at the start after my last post in the channel was the real part of the conversation.

[inner swift]

Something of strange interest just came to me.

Does anyone feel as if something is off about Kizaru?

He seems pretty clueless at times but he’s more than relentless in combat, and he was clearly respected enough to achieve Admiral rank, though he came across as far less clued in or concerned as Aokiji or Akainu.

We know he had a sibling as he has a nephew, so did something happen to that sibling that made him act the way he does? I dunno, he’s just such an odd character it feels.

He’s a complete combat beast with an S-tier DF to boot, although compared to his colleagues, he’s always just came across as somewhat unprofessional. Even joking around and acting really apathetic during the events of Marineford.

Maybe I’m looking too far into his personality, as Oda can just write goofy characters, though his more important ones (like a literal navy admiral) always tend to have some kinda backstory as to why they are the way they are.

For example, Aokiji comes across as incredibly lazy and uninterested in events in the pre-time skip present, but we know he acts this way as the Ohara incident changed his perspective significantly from what it was prior about the navy, after Akainu’s civilian massacre. So there was a reason behind his semi-goofiness

[lavish snow]

What is the craziest theory that actually ended up being true

[green dawn]

Sanji being a prince and having several brothers, somebody called it all the way back in Alabsta

[tacit veldt]

There sure were crazier, but a guy on Youtube predicted that Kanjuro would be the alliance's traitor based on that little comedic scene where he covered Kinemon's eyes for a joke, causing them both to fall down Zou, and that was his way of trying to prevent the Minks from joining the samurais

[sinful dock]

then after that, the traits about using his non-dominant hand for drawing pre-reveal was a really good catch.

[inner swift]

I mean...Luffy being Nika...

Not the most out there with all the setup, but still.

Also, I think someone theorised that Enel and his armies observation haki was somehow linked later to Shanks scaring off the sea king, and then later again for when he'd be using it on the Moby Dick. By that point we didn't even know about haki.

Also also, I think someone guessed about Crocus being a Roger pirate before Rayleigh confirmed it.

[inner swift]

I get the royalty references, but what was the evidence for him having siblings, or more specifically brothers?

[green dawn]

Japanese numbers! Oda does love his name puns. From Japanese the numbers 1-4 go ichi, ni, san, yon - Ichiji, Niji, Sanji, Yonji. People speculated about Sanji being the third sibling due to the san in his name, and with Reiju (rei means 0) being the first sibling the theorizers were almost completely correct.

[inner swift]

Huh. I mean, I knew about the fact his name is 3, but I didn’t think about it in a sense that he was being numbered.

[inner swift]

At least, pre-WCI

[dense schooner]

zoro theory: Ive been wondering what really happened with Kuina, We know the village they were at has some connection to wano at least with the elder swordsmith who was hanging out. The way she died by falling down stairs onto her sword? doesnt make sense considering she was better than adults at handling her sword. I think a few things could potentially be happening

1. Kuina is the sword itself, and the sword is some special blade that ate a Nika Nika Hito Hito no mi fruit of some model
2. Kuina's soul is in her sword after she "died" and that's who zoro might be meeting (searching internets real quick came across someone with similar theory ||https://www.opfanpage.com/2022/01/02/kuina-was-killed-by-wado-ichimonji/||
3. Kuina was sent away by her farther and gave her amenisa and is actually just Tashigi.

[lyric berry]

She didn’t fall on her sword she just died falling down the stairs

[inner swift]

Which is arguably more embarrassing

[lyric berry]

Woo D. Stairs

[inner swift]

Almost as strong as random D. isease

Or the far more terrifying and vile…

Thir D. Eye

[shadow pike]

https://preview.redd.it/cwrx0pkglzw81.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=1774c9f85dde0270d2620c41b9e3e47d73e3b83d

[inner swift]

No.

[amber oar]

No.

[inner swift]

Just because Oda draws a couple of characters with similar designs, it doesn’t always mean they are related. Are Roger and Crocodile related cause they both have black hair? No. Are Rayleigh and Crocus brothers because they both wore glasses? No.

Also I don’t think the age gap matches up, but let me check first.

Brook was 38 when he died and 88 when we first meet him, and then 90 post time skip

Aokiji is 47 and then 49.

That means that Brook would have likely had to have been a young father, and then his son a young father too. It’s way too reliant on that one factor.

The age gap is roughly 41 years for anyone wondering.

[slate mirage]

to be fair, black is a very common hair color

[inner swift]

True. Especially in OP.

[formal bridge]

1. Hito hito no mi not nika nika fruit

[dense schooner]

thank you, I was spelling it out in my head as hito, but typed nika for some reason lol

[bronze sluice]

Yes and the mother is the mole women from alabasta 😗

[shadow pike]

@bronze sluice really?

[bronze sluice]

Wouldn’t be the most outrageous theory to exist so why not 🤷‍♂️

[worn sigil]

Yes

[shadow pike]

*Logel and Clocodire

[formal bridge]

So how does kilo kilo fruit or ton ton fruit works here is my theory. These fruits work by increasing the weight of df user. So W=mg either the df increases their mass or gravity on that specific df user increases.
If the mass of df user increases that means their density(m/V) also increases with their weight but if we go by thinking that gravity on that df user increases then the density of the df used won't increase with their weight .
But if df affects the mass of df user then they won't have to make use of an object to fly high they can just fly high by decreasing their density which would be directly proportional to mass . But if the df power only affects the gravity on the user then it is not possible for them to fly without the help of an object. Hence, i think that these fruit affect the gravity on the df user.

[inner swift]

That’s a pretty decent actually scientific theory. Huh. Just kind of a shame that both of those fruits are just kinda…meh.

[formal bridge]

Btw it could be effective against bb because he uses his yami yami fruit to attract people using blackhole so these df user can affect the attraction from df.

[inner swift]

Didn’t think of it like that either. Pretty sweet IMO, mostly because I’m the only person that’s almost entirely convinced BB really just has a Logia (or Paramecia)

[formal bridge]

So you think that bb doesn't have gura gura no mi

[amber oar]

I am too. Yet anooooooooooooooother mythical fruit would turn out redundant and tired. Yes I know it's not like a normal logia. It was addressed in-universe by Teach himself. That's the point, it's an odd one among Logias - making it yet another Mythical Zoan would break that uniqueness.

I don't know why fans are obsessed with unique things stopping being unique - They do the same thing trying to find Lunarianas everywhere. And they do the same with Luffy/Nika himself - there totally MUST be a handful of similar god zoans. Can't be just Luffy.

[inner swift]

No, it’s the purpose of the Yami Yami, which people are stating is a myth Zoan.

[formal bridge]

Yeah i think it's logia too

[inner swift]

Yeah, don’t get me wrong, some of the theories on the Zoan fruits sound really cool! (Except for that stupid stealing Luffy’s Nika fruit one) but there’s just a lot less value in pulling the same twist.

[formal bridge]

I mean luffy has to be unique to be a protagonist can't just have a common guys as protagonist

[amber oar]

I'm addressing these people who think because Luffy has the Sun God Nika zoan, there must be a moon god, sky god, ocean god, tree god etc etc

[inner swift]

The only other counter I’ll make here is that I’ve noticed a long running pattern of opposing DF’s, specifically with Logia, though there are a few other alt fruits, which makes sense for people expecting other god fruits.

[formal bridge]

Yeah me too it could be only just luffy has such fruit other gods can be just normal gods not df or df users

[inner swift]

The one big thing I wanna say about my opposing fruit theory is that there will be another Logia user if I’m right. Specifically with something the opposite to Enel(lightning)

[formal bridge]

I used to have a theory about god fruits like how they will be a opposite to df and will not curse them to be unable to swim. But that was way before during baratie arc.

[inner swift]

How long have you been into the series?!

[formal bridge]

Since start been about 15-16 years

[inner swift]

So you’ve been a fan since like Skypeia?! Pretty cool man. Only just got into it this year.

[formal bridge]

No i started since start. I was into it when cartoon network aired it

[inner swift]

Wait really?! Fuck man that’s even cooler.

[formal bridge]

Sorry i don't remember when cartoon network first aired it but i have been seeing it since then maybe 15-16 is exaggerated

[inner swift]

It’s still really cool to talk to someone who’s been into the series for quite a few years though.

[late pier]

"the way she died by falling down stairs onto her sword?"

Honestly if she didn't die by falling, then I'd say that her Father probably lied about her death because her conversation with Zoro led her to to do something or challenge someone she shouldn't have and she lost and died and her Father didn't want Zoro to throw his life away trying to get revenge for her. Or something like that.

I also like the theory that the sword killed her because she was too weak to handle it, especially considering it is supposed to be an equal to enma. The reason she "fell" was due to the sword's "curse".

[lyric berry]

I’m with you 100%, the community bandwagons so hard on half baked theories

[late pier]

I first started reading the manga around water 7 arc, because I finished the anime and that was where they were currently at lol

Man that was a long time ago

Talking 2005/2006 lol

[mental wagon]

Idk if this is a popular theory or not but just something I thought of
I think that when Blackbeard killed whitebeard and took his fruit he absorbed the devil in his darkness as it was leaving whitebeard, and in order to use it he just releases a little bit of the devils power, so technically he’s not a user of wbs fruit, he just stole the devil inside of it

[tacit zephyr]

There are 3 Blackbeards so they can have 3 fruits everybody knows that 😎

[mental wagon]

The three souls theory is also good, maybe he absorbed other souls yk? It still has yet to be explained

[tacit zephyr]

My (very far fetched) Blackbeard theory:
Luffy needs a reason to fight Shanks who's his friend, he also need stronger enemies after beating Kaido 1v1 which would be difficult (except maybe Imu).
Which leads me to - Blackbeard will turn Shanks evil using his darkness fruit. There will be a Shanks retrieval arc where Shanks/Blackbeard are the main antagonists

[quaint frost]

shanks fought white beard

shanks dosnt need a reason to fight other then they want and luffy to

[mental wagon]

Luffy isn’t gonna fight shanks

[sacred lynx]

if she is the sword how can she be human form and wield her sword form at the same time? She wields herself? we know she wields the sword at least once and is seem with and without more than once

[tacit zephyr]

luffy: 'i'm planning to take down all of the yonkou' https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-4f8d266654d7130a026242ec8b602add-pjlq

[modest skiff]

@tacit zephyr we ask people make zero other series references outside of #other-series also @warm edge

[dense schooner]

if she is the sword how can she be human form and wield her sword form at the same time? She wields herself? we know she wields the sword at least once and is seem with and without more than once
@sacred lynx Valid, but we have seen a boat drive itself due to a spirit inhabiting (going merry).

"the way she died by falling down stairs onto her sword?"

Honestly if she didn't die by falling, then I'd say that her Father probably lied about her death because her conversation with Zoro led her to to do something or challenge someone she shouldn't have and she lost and died and her Father didn't want Zoro to throw his life away trying to get revenge for her. Or something like that.

I also like the theory that the sword killed her because she was too weak to handle it, especially considering it is supposed to be an equal to enma. The reason she "fell" was due to the sword's "curse".
@late pier I like the death by sword absorption as well like Enma, maybe her father ruined her dream and she doubted her self and this sign of weakness showed the sword she wasn’t worthy.

[sacred lynx]

was that confirmed? I like vaguely remeber that but idk anything about the spirit |(I am getting flash back to water 7 rn)|

[inner swift]

Damn it feels so weird talking to people who’ve been fans for something for so long. Like for a while the person I knew who was in a fandom for the longest was a mate who’d been playing Smash bros since 64

[mental wagon]

Luffy isn’t gonna fight shanks (out of malice), moreso just a friendly fight probably

[amber oar]

I've been playing Pokémon games since 2001... but let's leave the chitchat here or mods will come and kick us

[inner swift]

Happened earlier to me and someone here lol

[dense schooner]

not sure how confirmed it was, but heavily hinted, and sailed itself from W7 in that heavy storm to Enies lobby

[inner swift]

Anyway, short theory: Luffy and Sabo will beat Akainu together, however, Sabo would get partially scarred further as proven by the whole fire losing out to magma. I could go a step further and say he’ll die against Akainu, but I don’t see the point in Luffy losing two bros to Sakazuki.

[sacred lynx]

if I recall usopp litterally sees the ghost and talks to it

[sacred lynx]

He used magma with haki probably so i would not say fire "lost" to magma

[inner swift]

Not exactly, it’s implied that the magma can overtake the fire, and it’s not unheard of for similar Logia fruits to be on different levels.

Magma>Fire
Ice>snow

[sacred lynx]

rubber>all

[inner swift]

Also was gonna bring up, we can all agree that Dragon has a Paramecia fruit, right? He’s more than likely not another Mythical Zoan user, and due to the control of lightning being shown whenever Dragon is around we can tell it’s not a Logia, as he and Enel couldn’t possibly have the same fruit.

[inner swift]

Not a logia, though it’s still really useful.

[modest skiff]

Let's save power comparison discussions for the manga channels please

[sacred lynx]

“Manga” theories?

[tribal sky]

Hey, I have a general theory for everyone. I know going around there's the theory that either Yamato or Carrot is going to join the Straw Hats. But, what if it ends up being both?

[sacred lynx]

What is the paramecia type?

[tribal sky]

I don't know how many times Oda has done it, but I'm sure he's set up expectations for something and done something unexpected, hasn't he? I know we're in for at least ONE MORE crewmate once the Wano arc completes. I'm personally hoping for Yamato, but, I wouldn't put it past Oda to give us both Yamato and Carrot as crewmates.

[inner swift]

Not doing a power comparison, was using the examples of pre-established powers to back up a theory.

[inner swift]

We can’t know for certain yet, but something that grants weather control based off his flight and the fact he summons storms.

[tribal sky]

I mean, it would be fitting too, since it would kind of round out the crew for inclusion of all the races in the OP world to my knowledge.

[modest skiff]

"Who will join the crew" is also a topic we ask people to discuss in #also-manga or #manga

[inner swift]

There’s enough evidence to support either being the next crew member, and I think everyone’s just caught up on Oda stating that 10 members is a perfect crew size. Doesn’t mean he’ll end at 10 (aside from Luffy)

[sacred lynx]

Rogers and white beard had a crew of over 10 so it is valid

[tribal sky]

I'll move it over to one of those channels

[inner swift]

Through Luffy, Oda said having crew members was the perfect number, so people think that means that after Jimbei, they’ll only be one more.

[sacred lynx]

Anyone notice BB and luffy have similar crew size?

[inner swift]

There’s clearly some kind of link. Cause it’s 1 captain/commodore then the current 9 (soon to likely be 10+) members and 10 titanic captains (though number 10 is a mystery(and not Aokiji))

[sacred lynx]

It seems paramecia fruits are the strongest. Luffy, dark dark fruit, quake quake ect

[inner swift]

Paramecia is arguably the worst class IMO. Although it’s likely the Yami Yami could actually be a Paramecia it isn’t, and Luffy is a myth Zoan, so really there’s very few super OP ones. Logia and Myth Zoans are considered the top two, with the strongest para (Gura Gura) being compared to logias in terms of power.

[sacred lynx]

Perhaps, but yami yami I’ve heard to be a para and It may be similar to the mucus mucus fruit being a para(like turning things to mucus ect)

[inner swift]

You likely heard me say that at some point

[sacred lynx]

Maybe, I saw yami yami under para on wiki and had that thought just now tho

[lyric berry]

I hate the idea that Oda is gonna retcon every fruit in the series now to be something else

[balmy mica]

Didnt bb say that yami is the only logia that ppl can hit without haki?

[left sun]

because its probably not a logia

[sacred lynx]

Retcon?

[halcyon tusk]

it’s allegedly a logia but he can’t become intangible

[sacred lynx]

Weakest and “most” powerful “logia”

[halcyon tusk]

if it is in fact a logia. we mustn’t get ahead of ourselves.

In theory it could very well be a mythical Zoan

[dense schooner]

any thoughts on luffy's awakening allowing him to do this? is it his rubberization of kaido, or something more? https://gyazo.com/4be0d564013bf5e59ce78a074b765d48

[halcyon tusk]

i think it’s just for comedic effect

[main sphinx]

Is that possible luffy's bounty after wano 5 billion fix (5000000000) ? Based on whole cake island forshadow (luffy prisoned inside a book with nami)

[dense schooner]

IMO it should increase a lot post wano 7.5B+, if the government acknowledges the joy boy connection to the world, otherwise it will just be for beating kaido and becoming an official emperor.

If they do acknowledge the joy boy connection then I think Luffy's bounty will be a reward more than just money, imo it would be becoming a Celestial Dragon.

[echo plank]

for symbolism luffy is not surpassing roger until eos

[dense schooner]

true

[halcyon tusk]

I figured it would go up to a little more than where Kaido currently is post Wano whereas on the flip side BB will be a little more than where Shanks is. i’ll let yu put 2 and 2 together for what that would entail

also the WG wouldn’t draw unnecessary attention to the joyboy/nika factor. they don’t want everyone and their momma knowing about it and if suddenly Straw Hat Luffy becomes the most wanted pirate to date without even at the very least done what Roger did then interested parties would find that curious and might dig into the details.

my point i suppose is that given the information the Navy would have, all that is notably new in regards to Straw Hat is that he defeated kaido. they won’t know about the nika thing

[amber oar]

some people are getting utterly disappointed with some bounties

I give 3B for Luffy give or take. Maybe 2.8B because half gomu. Luffy's final bounty will be 5.6B, it's very obvious.

And yes I'm taking in account the gomu has a different name. But the name gomu isn't going anywhere, Luffy's move names and associations won't change at this point

[dense schooner]

idc what the actual price is, more into the reactions of everyone

[halcyon tusk]

i feel like at this point for most of luffy’s peers both on and off the Sunny, whatever incredible thing he pulls off is to be expected

in my opinion.. the collective world at large had better batten down the hatches and just try and ride it out because the world government botched possibly the only chance they were given to quiet the storm that is Monkey D Luffy.

[proven monolith]

at the end of series Luffy and strawhats won't have a bounty at all if they successfully took down WG

[halcyon tusk]

the navy does the bounties. the WG just operates in the shadows orchestrating things to play out in favor of their oppression

[proven monolith]

not bad guys to the entire world anymore WG is

[steady prism]

It makes perfect sense. Luffy in G5 rubberized Kaido’s face and punched him. That’s it. The manga coloring was fanmade and it was clearly wrong (ie easily misinterpreted) in how it was colored. This wasn’t weird at all. This was a point of confusion for a lot of ppl for a while fyi until we saw the next chapter

[halcyon tusk]

i chopped it up to comedic effect and didn’t pay it no mind. i’m indifferent about a lot of things people seem to get caught up on

what’s happening with Zoro is of particular interest to me though. but i have an idea of what COULD be going on but i can’t be sure that it definitely IS what’s goin down

[lapis prairie]

Agreed! It's a shame we gotta wait for the LuffyXKaido fight to end, and probably a bunch more to happen before we learn about Zoro's situation

[halcyon tusk]

i believe it to be more of a good thing than bad.

[dense schooner]

true, but was it officially stated that the coloring was wrong? https://gyazo.com/0f3c64d88fa869314c2ec5b2ef7d4aad in the original his fist/arms are same color, it should be black unless the manga artists made a mistake coloring?

[lapis prairie]

I mean there are parallels with Luffy and his powerup. Both him and Zoro sort of died. It seems like that's maybe necessary for a Zoan awakening. (like Why Kaido wants to). Not sure what it may do to Zoro, besides maybe a black blade thing

[halcyon tusk]

there are…other…possibilities but nothing is outright off the table

[lapis prairie]

Yeah, I guess I jump there because death and the colour black have symbolism. Also I'm not sure what benefit would come to Zoro here. - shoot

[halcyon tusk]

let me bounce something off ya

[steady prism]

It isn’t officially stated until we get color volumes that cover this chapter. The original black/white is fine, I think of that white part as skin; Kaido’s skin isn’t the same color as his hair. Again, a manga artist didn’t do the coloring. A fan colored this panel (probably @Greiish on Twitter?) in partnership with TCB I believe. Feel free to bounce that question in #manga and see what others think if you don’t believe it. Anyway this reasoning makes the most sense to me, especially since Kaido doesn’t have a hole in his face next chapter

[halcyon tusk]

what if Enma has eaten a zoan fruit. potentially even a mythical model. oda is just cheeky enough to pull that on us

hito hito no mi mythical model king of hell

[lapis prairie]

Unless the model is of a sword, I don't know why we wouldn't have seem something like that. Plus it seemed like getting an object to eat a fruit was a VEgapunk thing, which would mean it would have to be scienced, plus even with that model, I mean the the elephant sword looked like an elephant

[halcyon tusk]

an elephant isn’t mythical either though. and not necessarily. in most mythologies, some entities can take on any form they wish.

[lapis prairie]

No, but it would have to have human proprieties

You would need quite a bit of evidence to make me even close to consider it a possibility

[halcyon tusk]

or Zoro could just have come face to face with the manifestation of Enma’s Will

[lapis prairie]

That seems cool

[halcyon tusk]

so then they must come to an agreement of some kind. perhaps Oden had to do this as well.

[lapis prairie]

Yeah I don't dislike that at all

[pure raven]

Hmm i have something in mind.. Now that luffy is using his real powers...then what are the fruit's base powers.. Like now his is in awakened mode.. But what are his normal powers...

[halcyon tusk]

i think the whole point of Awakenings is that the need to differentiate is redundant

especially so considering what we’ve been led to believe about his Awakening specifically

[lapis prairie]

You mean his default powers would be upgraded because he knows what his powers can be? I don't know... He can already slow down by filling himself with air. Maybe he can manipulate the world around him without turning white, but it feels like he can't, right? Zoans are maybe different than Logia and Paracemia that can seemingly use their awakened powers whenever necessary. This is mostly uncharted territory for us

[halcyon tusk]

and you have to consider how so far luffy has displayed properties of both Paramecia and Zoan types

[lapis prairie]

it's more like Human Zoans would give off paramecia properties

[pure raven]

Hmm.. Ah...like rubber is just a small part of his devil fruit.. And we are directly faced to the awakened form.. But but that will be his powers without awakened..

[halcyon tusk]

if he can turn to … dare i say it… resin… then he’ll have the intangibility of logias

[sand sail]

Zoans are different awakenings in general, clearly mythical is a toss up. Without awakening, Luffy hasn't changed. His powers are exactly what they've been for the last 1040 chapters before he got his awakening

[halcyon tusk]

i’m not sure what yu are getting at. yu mean everything we’ve seen prior to said awakening

[lapis prairie]

You're assuming here. Remember when Gear 2 was an activated thing? Now he can just use it. Why not for this

[sand sail]

I'm not assuming. We not only know the rules for awakening in a very general sense at this point, we were given the explanation for his abilities already.

Luffy's body is made of rubber and when he awakens, that body gets stronger and he can make other things into rubber as well.

[lapis prairie]

You are assuming. You're stating a fact that you can't confirm. Now, I'm not saying I think he'll be able to use it willy nilly, but there is reason to think it's possible in the future - When?

[sand sail]

I'm stating a fact literally told to us, in fact

These aren't assumptions, it's what the manga told us. Luffy has a rubber body, and when he awakens he gets more.

Which is perfectly consistent with all of the rest of One Piece.

[halcyon tusk]

sometimes things aren’t as they seem at face value.

[sand sail]

Which isn't something really worth considering at this point

[lapis prairie]

Right, now that Kidd is awakened he can do the special magnet thing when he wants. Why not Luffy now that he's awakened

[sand sail]

Because he's a zoan, he needs to transform to access it

But he can, in fact, access this whenever.

[halcyon tusk]

i agree. i was merely suggesting a bit more open mindedness regarding the “taboo” things

[lapis prairie]

Which he can maybe do on a whim, easily, without it even being clear like gear 2? And you're basing this on all the evidence we already have on the subject?

[sand sail]

No, not at all

Luffy is a zoan, not a paramecia

His awakening is this Nika transformation that lets him rubberize things, without it he's just his regular fruit, which is what we've had the entire rest of the series

Luffy can access this form whenever he wants, but it's the form he's accessing, not the powers directly

[lapis prairie]

Right, but you don't know, you're assuming

[sand sail]

No, i'm going by the literal rest of the series and the words of the Gorosei

[halcyon tusk]

speculation based on sufficient evidence though

[sand sail]

These aren't assumptions, this is the actual information we have on hand presented to us as facts

Luffy's awakening is his zoan transformation, and without being awakened his powers are his rubber body and whatever freedom of fighting he chooses to use for himself

[lapis prairie]

Assuming through context.

[sand sail]

No, these are direct statements.

You understand we were given an explanation of his powers as he awakened, right?

I suppose you could say I'm assuming the Gorosei were correct, but there's not really a point in making that distinction either since there's no reason to assume they weren't

[lapis prairie]

The one you linked? They didn't mention how the powers work.

[halcyon tusk]

limited only by the imagination is how they work

[lapis prairie]

Which is how his powers, in retrospect, have always worked

[sand sail]

They're not really limited only by imagination, it's more they get to be the most creative and happy folks

[pure raven]

Like marco can use fire just like luffy can use his rubber body.. But marco have other abilities too.. He can use the ability of the phiniox(sry if the spelling is wrong) even without awakened...so my point is.... What are the abilities of the sun god nika.. Obviously sun god nika will have other abilities of his own aside from being a rubber.. If the awakened form allows him to make everything like rubber.. Then it's just normal gum gum no mi fruit.. But given that the real of the fruit is different..

[sand sail]

No, not really. Luffy's powers have always had some concrete basis in what he could do

[sand sail]

No, that is the fruit

[halcyon tusk]

he has been known to just come up with things cause he saw someone do something cool. there’s nothing concrete about that sort of resourcefulness

[sand sail]

As far as we can know or tell, there's no difference. Luffy's fruit hasn't actually changed beyond us now knowing it's a mythical zoan instead of a paramecia. Even his powers now are only different because he has to physically transform to gain them

[sand sail]

You literally just pointed out the concrete part of it

[lapis prairie]

He takes in air and floats. Also, I'm done trying to have a conversation with you when you can skip the 1m limit and I can't This is borderline an abuse of your powers.

[sand sail]

We can take this to another channel if you'd like, there's really not much to argue when we were in fact given all of this information up front. The thought that his fruit would be any different than it has been the entire rest of the series is completely unfounded, they only changed the name.

[halcyon tusk]

how by reinforcing my own previous point of him being limited only by imagination

[sand sail]

No, by showing that he's doing it being inspired by something, not just imagining it and it working because he thought it up. Luffy's been creative, it's not like his body just turns into whatever he thinks about before he's awakened

[pure raven]

If everything is same as Usual.. Then there is no point changing the name.. Sun god nika is not feared just coz he is made of rubber.. There must be more to it..

[sand sail]

Incidentally, so did Wadatsumi. The biggest mistake you and many others are making is thinking that you can look back to the series, point at stuff that doesn't really make scientific sense to us, and say that it's something with Luffy's fruit when that's just Oda writing Oda.

[halcyon tusk]

i think yu might have the suspicion that i’m referring to him having actual looney toon hammer space type shit. i’m not

[silver swan]

Maybe you’re right but I’d also argue being made of Rubber vs being a rubber diety of Yonko+ status is reason

[sand sail]

He's feared because of the freedom he inspires when awakened, it's pretty damning against law and order

[vestal orbit]

unless oda just changed his fruit to be nika on a whim

[sand sail]

No, I'm saying he's never had any kind of bodily power that worked just because he thought it up. That comes with the awakening, before it's just he's rubber and can fight creatively, the whole "only limited by imagination" was a translation error

Being a zoan means Luffy can actually get back up to fight without it being against the rest of the series, tho

[pure raven]

I think ur not getting my point.. I must learn more English.. 🤦‍♂️

[silver swan]

Luffy being a Zoan would probably explain his advanced healing. Even if he’s not awakened, even Kaido displays hella durability without being awoken.

Having an awakening that lines up with being in line with the Will of JoyBoy also explains why Luffy would be able to get a rage boost power up when he was ready to die freeing Robin against Lucci.

[pure raven]

Like golden buddha fruit.. He is not just having gold body.. Else it will just like that gold gold fruit from the movie.. But it's called to buddha fruit coz it have power of buddha.. Wait.. Now I'm thinking.. What if he get awakenned.. 👀

[sand sail]

Luffy doesn't get any kind of rage boost in the series, all he can ever do is drag out the very last of whatever he has until it almost kills him. That's why he goes from barely moving to almost complete paralysis or a coma so often

[silver swan]

I’d argue that Lucci was kind of a rage boost, but it’s also the only time during the series you’ve seen it happen. Luffy overcame a giant wall to beat Lucci

[sand sail]

Yeah, Sengoku could very well be the first example of an awakened mythical zoan. It's hard to say, we were given Luffy's powers and that's the only reason we can definitively say he's still the same with new awakening abilities on top, but that's his mythical fruit. Kaido seems to imply that every mythical zoan should have the same kind of awakening when he calls Luffy's weird, so maybe it is.

Nah, Luffy didn't really overcome anything but his own imminent exhaustion. He was already just as strong (a LOT stronger with Gear 3rd) as Lucci, all he had to do was bring all of it out and not stop till he literally couldn't move anymore

[pure raven]

So then what are sun god nika's power without awakened

[sand sail]

I'm pretty sure I've answered that multiple times now

[halcyon tusk]

you have

[sand sail]

We don't know what the entity/race of sun warrior/gods Nika has innately, but we know what the model of fruit gives Luffy

[silver swan]

Fine, next theory: Weevil’s mom didn’t get with white beard...

Weevil’s dad is Shiki

[vestal orbit]

nika's a race?

oh

why though? don't think there's like a buddha race or a monk race or w/e running around in one piece and don't see why nika would be particularly different

[sand sail]

Nika probably isn't the name of it, but yeah, they're part of some race lol

[sand sail]

This is the wrong channel for that

[silver swan]

This is the manga theories channel

[sand sail]

Read the channel description

[pure raven]

1047*

[halcyon tusk]

that was my argument too when it was me. it’s no use trust me

[sand sail]

Go ahead and ask that in #also-manga if you'd like

[sand sail]

Buddha is a race, yeh. Or, a station rather. But your mistake is thinking "running around in One Piece" is a thing for these at all, mythical creatures don't have living beings

[pure raven]

Buddha is not a race... Buddha is so god

[sand sail]

Buddha is a title, not a god

The Buddhas are above the gods

[vestal orbit]

so you're saying that there was a race of every species that a mythical zoan is based off of before they went extinct and became myths?

[sand sail]

No, I'm saying the exact opposite lol

That there were never any races of anything mythical, and the fruits were created with some way to create those powers. Or, these singular beings were around and were trapped in the fruits maybe? Those are the big questions, ultimately lol

[pure raven]

Buddha was someone's name who was a god

[sand sail]

A Buddha is a station achieved, not just a being

This isn't an opinion man, there are hundreds if not thousands of Buddhas

[pure raven]

Buddha is only one

[sand sail]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhahood

[halcyon tusk]

buddhists refers to the cooperative collection as a whole. buddha was the inspiration for the beliefs

[vestal orbit]

huh alr, thought you meant that there was a race of rubbery nika-people that were the basis for the nika fruit

[pure raven]

I know when not to argue.. Ur right

[sand sail]

Buddha refers to anyone who achieves their awakened/enlightened state

The Buddha just happened to be the poster child for it

[halcyon tusk]

nirvana actually

[sand sail]

Yes, same thing. Their ultimate enlightened dissolution of self

Because there's a common misconception that the Buddha is only one singular entity when it's a title of attainment, which is important because mythical zoan fruits have displayed both full races and singular entities now.

Incidentally, i'll thank you not to be so derogative toward a religion. I'm not sure why you inserted the rest of that opinion, but it most definitely wasn't needed, so I'm going to go ahead and delete it.

[halcyon tusk]

as is your prerogative. i meant no offense but i won’t say it isn’t how i see it based on my own values. that said, i understand the cause for concern with it and indeed it shouldn’t be allowed to stand per se.

i will go on however to acknowledge that this isn’t the time or place for such debates and i do apologize

[pure raven]

.. Any idea how many chapters will it take for luffy to defeat kaido@sand sail ur a mod.. Any inside news 👉👈

[sand sail]

That's a question more for one of the other manga channels, this one is for strictly expansive theory discussion

[ripe geyser]

https://www.reddit.com/r/OnePiece/comments/uh0roj/yamato_mother_theory/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Y’all should check this out

[dense schooner]

gonna think of it as kaido's bald spot

[hazy totem]

Johnny and yosaku will join the grand fleet

[grizzled spear]

well you know sun god nika right ? ofc so sun god nika one of the 4 acient gods and i believe that it has something to do with dragon luffy's father so in logue town he saved luffy with a green wind storm but we dont know how he did it must be one of the acient gods its rain forest god thats why the wind was green and strong and i badly want to know garp's powers and yeah all of this is just a theory not true.

[outer portal]

it can be taht d family only has that ancient god powers

[grizzled spear]

M A Y B E

[outer portal]

well probably

[grizzled spear]

maybe garp is water god

[outer portal]

maybe garp is fire

[grizzled spear]

thats luffy

[outer portal]

oh wait I forgot also luffy is sun not fire

[grizzled spear]

Luffy : sun/fire
Dragon : maybe rain forest/earth?
Garp : unknown
Kong ( garp father ) : unknown

[azure dust]

Garp father tf

[pastel thistle]

Kong? Garp's Father? tf?

[silver swan]

Kong isn’t Garp’s father

[peak coyote]

who tf is kong

[grizzled spear]

oh shit

[silver swan]

Kong is Garp’s boss before Sengoku, the guy he always tells to F off when they try promoting him to Admiral

[grizzled spear]

yeah and @peak coyote kong is the world government commander-in-cheif

[peak coyote]

Kong offered Garp admiral right?

..

[grizzled spear]

yes in the age/era of gol d. roger he offered him admiral many times and he respected garp and garp ngl deserves fleet admiral like i mean sengoku and garp in their prime are op asf i am not saying garp is stronger

[peak coyote]

didnt he decline the offer though..

[grizzled spear]

he rejected it and luffy iq is -100 but battle iq beyond infinite

[peak coyote]

Some common synonyms of reject are decline, refuse, repudiate, and spurn. While all these words mean "to turn away by not accepting, receiving, or considering," reject implies a peremptory refusal by sending away or discarding. rejected the manuscript as unpublishable. but true though his will and determination is beyond infinite

copy paste is my bestfriend

[river nest]

j

[cyan berry]

@cedar venture keep dumb memes out of this channel

[inner swift]

Gonna post a logia fruit theory/explanation that covers some stuff I’ve theorised about before, albeit in far more depth and intricacies

Though it’ll take a few minutes to right it all out

[fathom matrix]

So, people ask the reason for going to Elbaf

What if as soon as they find Kaido's, set sail from wano and go onto the sea, they realised they need to find the last one, but ask "do any of the other yonkos have it?" and they try and look for as much information as possible, but Usopp suggests Elbaf perhaps.

Maybe Luffy, Zoro and Nami suggest either Shanks or Black Beard has it, but Usopp suggests they should at least take the safest option first before just heading off into dangerous territory.

Maybe Zoro agrees with Usopp saying "we just got finished fighting a war, all of us aren't in the best condition to be fighting 2 emporers, let alone one" so they try elbaf first

[inner swift]

Not bad. Definitely makes sense thst they would keep of emperors for a bit especially after Luffy leaves G5 cause he’ll be exhausted no doubt

[fathom matrix]

Plus, Zoro might even say to Luffy that even if Shanks is his friend, he's probably not just gonna hand over the ponoglyph on a silver platter, and if you do fight him for it, you gotta be at your best

[inner swift]

Also have to consider that Shank’s ties to the WG would make things even more hostile

[fathom matrix]

Cause for all we know, Luffy probbaly can't use Gear 5th after wano and maybe has to learn to tap into it and master the form

[inner swift]

Yeah. He learned gear 4th though we know that for a fact gear 5th is just kinda new to him so he’ll take a while to perfect it

[fathom matrix]

Maybe, I don't think he has ties to the WG, but more so the WG is aware of his power and simply going after him isn't a good idea.

Heck, Rayleigh is well known to the marines and they know exactly where he is, but because of his power, they don't dare to cross him

[inner swift]

Rayleigh is likely on par with Admirals and could arguably be at Yonko level, and I know he's not canon, but if Bullet was on par with Rayleigh and we saw how broken Bullet was...

Anyway, my full Logia theory. So Logia fruits have 3 central skills regarding their element. Transformation, Creation and Control. Transforming their body into their element, producing that element and controlling it when it is around them. Every Logia is good at doing at least 2 of these things. Here is a list and why.

Transformation and creation: Akainu, Enel, Aokiji and Monet. For these characters to tap into their element in the environment it has to be relatively specific conditions, as these elements tend not to be as readily available, as Enel and Monet can depend on the weather and Akainu isn't likely to find Magma out in the open.

Transformation and control: Caribou, Crocodile and Ceaser. Yes, these characters can produce large masses of their element but in most cases, it's more useful to transform or control than produce more.

Creation and control: Blackbeard. I've stated before that if BB was to turn his body into darkness he'd straight up die as his body is becoming nothing at all, though his proficiency otherwise is spectacular.

ALL 3: Kizaru, Ace/Sabo and Smoker. These characters have amazing proficiency in all 3 as their element is far more accessible or useful to become.

However, not being proficient in a certain category or as proficient as others doesn't negate the value of the fruit. Logia is still considered by most the strongest class, only competing with the likes of Mythical Zoan's. Just because Enel and Akainu aren't as good at manipulating the element in the environment doesn't make their fruits bad.

And Smoke is arguably the second or third worst element out of the Logia we've seen. Gas, sludge and snow also being particularly weak in contrast.

Also, every Logia tends to have an opposing element to itself. Magma=Ice, fire=snow, sand=sludge, gas=smoke, Light=dark

You may notice that i didn't mention Enel, and despite their being 12 canon logia users, 2 are dead, and Sabo and ace have the same fruit, so therefore there is not a 12th element.

So, before the end of the series, we will see 1 more Logia user at least, with another natural element which exists in tandem with or opposing lightning.

[limber lintel]

True

[inner swift]

However, I have a slight guess as to what 12 may be. So in contradiction to my previous statement, several Logia fruits exist as similars, Magma+fire, snow+ ice, sludge+sand(again), smoke+gas(also again) and light+lightning

This leaves Darkness unpaired now, but it should be similar to something that would exist as opposition to Lightning. If I was to guess who wields this fruit, I'm not sure yet, though Ryokuga could be a highly possible candidate.

This stems from the fact that of the 5 admiral's in the series, 3 have Logia, and the only one who doesn't (Fujitora) exists in slight opposition to the WG at times. Leaving Ryokuga as an open ended possibility.

[balmy mica]

Ok this is not rly a theory, but kind of foreshadowing from Oda. Shanks will die. This video is from the end credits of Strong World and since Oda directed the movie it makes it legit. The lyrics translates to “It’s too late to mourn now…” and we immediately see Whitebeard show up on the screen followed by Ace and Shanks. This movie was from pre timeskip and we now know Ace and Whitebeard died so next is Shanks. It’s also strange why they would show WB Ace and Shanks in the end credits since they had nothing to do with the movie itself so I can only assume it was foreshadowing.

[inner swift]

It would also fit as in the four way square of Lightning, light, darkness and mystery. As light opposes dark which is allied with mystery which opposes lightning which is allied with light.

This 4 way graph also exists with the other 8 logia, as there is fire+magma+ice+snow and sand+sludge+gas+smoke

So in summary, there is a 12th as yet unseen Logia fruit, which is similar to darkness but the opposite of lightning.

Any thoughts on my mad pinboard rant/potentials for fruit number 12?

I have now posted this all to the subreddit, if any of you wish to find it their i can send a link.

[balmy mica]

Send pls

[pure raven]

||is joy boy really confirmed to be luffy||

[vocal iris]

Mystery isn't really an element you can become

[inner swift]

You get what I mean though

[sand sail]

He is turning his body into darkness.

[inner swift]

https://www.reddit.com/r/OnePiece/comments/uhhv7i/full_logia_theoryexplanation_of_how_they_work_i/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

[sand sail]

It manifests as some smoke, but that is what defines a logia, he does indeed become his element. His element just isn't fluid in any way since it draws everything to it.

[inner swift]

Hey, at least I didn’t say it’s a myth Zoan.

[sand sail]

This pairing doesn't seem to be something that Oda is trying to do for every logia, I don't think we'll end up having a lesser darkness fruit down the line. "Mystery", you should probably find a more concrete thing to use there, that's not really something that can even be explained

Yeah, I'm tired of seeing the "maybe they lied about this fruit too" theories, haha

[inner swift]

That’s because thinking of something similar to darkness but contrasting lightning is sort of confusing

[sand sail]

Because it's probably not really a dynamic in the series, these fruits exist but not in opposition to each other any more so than the fact that natural elements do exist in duality

[inner swift]

Maybe your right, I dunno, there’s just a lot of similarities between the Logia fruits and how they can potentially contrast/coincide with each other

If you couldn’t tell, I’m a big fan of Logia fruits, so that’s why I put the level of though into it thst I did.

So far I’ve heard one response to my post and that’s it’s a wind based Logia, which kinda makes sense, as Enel is like the god Raijin and Fujin is his twin brother (I came up with that bit there actually) but I’m not sure how it would differ from Smoke and Gas in terms of visual appearance

And also a lot of its powers may just end up being too similar to Enel in that sense

[sand sail]

There wouldn't be a "wind" logia, more likely, if there's already a "gas" logia I imagine

[desert notch]

anyone got a theory why this random side character from roger's crew called jacksonbanner looks awfully similiar to gear 5? is it just a coincidence?

[lucid frigate]

What y'all think about Kid getting Whitebeard's title of the strongest man in the world?

[sand sail]

Both of those messages are better placed in #also-manga

Let's try to stick to strictly theory chat today

[inner swift]

Agreed

[desert notch]

late reply. he will probably have the strongest kick,but not yet. kizaru can kick at lightspeed

[inner swift]

Kizaru is lightspeed

[iron lion]

incorrect, Kizaru is still limited by human limits of recognition. he is still a glint-glint MAN

[desert notch]

i mean he might have an awakening ig? akainu too. i don't see logic in "akainu won't be a big enemy for luffy" theory because akainu is literally one of the only people luffy holds a grudge for

[sand sail]

Entirely unprovable assumption, no one can say this one way or the other. Given the trend of fruits, it's unlikely this is a hindrance in any way for him.

This is really better for #also-manga as a topic, though.

[inner swift]

I think now that there’s a decent enough level of fact to suggest that DF eaters are not the same as humans or whatever their species was

[rain root]

What’s y’all theory on the “will of D”

[haughty wharf]

The kouzuki clan(momo) will apologies to the kurozumi (orochi and kanjurou) for the persecution by their clan and country men towards the kurozumi because of the crime of a single person.

Orochi and kanjurou will be imprisoned in udon regardless because of their own actions towards the people of wano.

[hasty hawk]

My theory is that D. means either Demon or Devil, as they are the enemies of Celestial Dragons who are considered Gods

[rain root]

Ohh that may be true, I also think that the people with D in their name we’re descendants of celestial dragons who rebelled and so the name devil ties in

[hasty hawk]

You think Garp has Conqueror’s Haki?

[late pier]

Perhaps those with the will of D are those who are descendants from the people who lived where the devil fruits first came, and the celestial dragons and the World government were formed from the alliance of kingdoms that wanted to conquer them and obliterate them so they could take the power of the devil fruits for themselves.

[late pier]

No way Garp is contending with the likes of someone like Roger without it.

[hasty hawk]

It makes sense

1. Garp reacted to Luffy’s usage of Conquerer’s Haki with the line of "You inherited too" , which also means Dragon got Conquerer’s, but also from Garp

2. Ivankov confirmed Dragon had Conquerer’s when he compared Luffy to Dragon, which adds up to Garp’s line

3.How the hell was Garp able to battle Roger without Conqueror? His mastery of Buso doesn’t mean anything against Roger

[rain root]

Then my question is there are 10 descendants of the celestial dragons currently but there was originally 20 kings who formed the world government, what happened to those other ten

And also only ten people with the name of d were told in one piece luffy,garp, dragon, law , xbec, Rodger, rogue, ace, teach , and Saul

[amber oar]

what? the whole Mary Geoise population is CDs and their slaves, there should be hundreds or thousands. Where does the 10 number come from? The known ones? Of course they aren't the only ones

[late pier]

Just because something is being used by you to justify your theory, it does not mean it HAS to be addressed for theories outside yours to be "true".

Why does those 10 people matter at all in this regard? That reveal could be related or not at all. We already know that there were celestial dragons who gave up their title and privledges, and kings who chose to not join WG. There are many ways that those 10 could have been dwindled down. Perhaps they intermarried, combining areas of cover and reducing number of "descendant" families. Perhaps there was infighting and some killed the others.

[rain root]

Google I searched how many celestial dragons are there and it said 10

[amber oar]

10 known - the 5 elders, Rosward, Charloss, Shalria, Jalmack and Mjosgard

[rain root]

Maybe true im just throwing out a possibility

[rain root]

Ok then why do very few people have the d in their name I feel like there’s a bigger meaning to it

[late pier]

Well if they are descendants of the nation that devil fruits came from that was conquered by the WG, and the WG sees them as enemies the small number would make sense. As they would be continually hunted. Notice most people with D name are pirates, or wanted by the WG.

[amber oar]

They're basically the only CDs with lines in the manga. Of course they aren't the only ones
There are 19 families (the 20th is Nefeltari, who were part of the alliance but refused to move to Mary Geoise) and each must have dozens of members

[rain root]

Where did you get this nation of devil fruits I wanna read about it

[amber oar]

That must be a theory, there's nothing said about a "nation of devil fruits"

[steady prism]

You’re right, those are the 10 known D clan members. Tbf when Saul was introduced, he mentioned that his entire family had a “D” in their names. So it shows that there’s a subgroup of giants that were a part of the D clan. Anyway just FYI

[amber oar]

And again, you're considering only the named ones, those who have a known name and lines. There must be dozens of unknowns scattered around the world, living relatively normal lives like Law's family did before Flevance fell

[rain root]

Maybe but I highly doubt it

[amber oar]

so, basically, you're headcanoning there's nobody except the ones named in the manga.

[rain root]

Yea unless oda says otherwise, I doubt oda would go and introduce a bunch more people with d in their name

[amber oar]

Oda can't introduce every citizen in the world, doesn't mean they don't exist

actually, we know Saul had a family. Rouge, Roger, Garp, Teach etc probably didn't just pop out from the ground either

[rain root]

But to add to that theory celestial dragons are considered gods right, and the people of d seem to rebel against the these gods, so to use a reference in Christianity the devil was once and angle who rebelled against god and in doing so he was expelled out of heaven. and in one piece heaven would be marijoise and the people casted out were the people with d in their name.

[rain root]

And that’s why there are 10 currently know celestial dragons and 10 currently known people with D in their name

[amber oar]

wait, what does that even have to do with their numbers

[rain root]

Cause there were 20 kings who formed the WG

[amber oar]

you're making zero sense.

It's been stated that out of the 20 kings who formed the WG, 19 of them went to live in Mary Geoise and one (Nefeltari) stayed at home

Like, it was actually said by the old farts

[rain root]

Oh but he is still considered a celestial is he not

[amber oar]

The Nefeltaris? Not. All the opposite. The Elders regard them as "traitors"

[rain root]

What does the rolling will not ceased mean

[amber oar]

Basically that they can't catch a break

[rain root]

Ok but I still feel like it’s not a coincidence that the 10 10 are only known

[amber oar]

lol not even true, multiple CDs have appeared in the background in several occasions. First panel has Mjosgard's dad, second has multiple CDs questioning Homing's decision, third is a CD on the phone whose features don't match any of the known ones

As for the D side, I already mentioned Saul's family for example

Also from the 10 Ds you mention, multiple aren't alive and others are part from the same family, as the Monkeys, Roger/Ace, etc
Basically the only currently alive known Ds are the three Monkeys, Law and Teach. And I doubt they'll be the last ones we hear of

[rain root]

True they are all still in the same families except Rodger and rouge

[iron lion]

No. Absolutely not. Gold Roger is NOT a Celestial Dragon, Portgaz D Rouge is NOT a Celestial Dragon. Not every character in one piece is a secret celestial dragon. It makes much more sense for the people of the D to be the those who were once part of the Ancient Kingdom/ nobility of said kingdom given it seems to be a title of sorts.

[sacred hawk]

What if act 3 ends after Kaido's defeat, but the intermission is about the world reacting to the defeat of Kaido and Big Mom

And then, once Wano's borders are opened, the first newspaper to enter the country turns out to be the bounty posters for the strawhats

[late pier]

What bout the WG sending all those forces to Wano. Wano's borders cant be opened without addressing it, and no way WG just gonna leave.

[vestal orbit]

zunesha might just sink the entire fleet

[pure raven]

Hey guys chapter 1048 out yet?

[lime stirrup]

probably not until thursday at the earliest

[orchid star]

46 hours patience please

[orchid star]

Isnt "all those forces" relative think most we saw was like 4 ships of the world government no navy & when it comes to it zunesha can wipe em samurai wont just switch from being controlled by kaido to being controlled by WG so they will fight to

[fallow karma]

So, I'm curious what other theories are out there on Zoro's interaction what looks like the grim reaper.

My bet is that it's a manifestation of Enma, being the sword of hell and all.

[barren fox]

last I remember brook was nowhere near and didn't had those clothes but they have the same skull/face. And franky took zoro. If zoro was dead, franky would've noticed, he's not an airhead. But zoro survived the kuma painball on thriller bark so... he ain't dying. But with the treatment he got, he's not gonna be very good for the next arc, like sabondy.

[fallow karma]

Oh, obviously he stays alive, he has to fight Shiryu. It being brook is a good idea though

[barren fox]

which reminds me, isn't the new world so similar/paralel to first half of grand line? Sabo got captured, I'm sure of it... (speculation)

so... how does this sound, next arc luffy meets shanks, quick short fight, shanks gives him the last poneglyph but sabo gets captured and afterward comes the "big great fight" that whitebeard was talking about and oda hyped it. We got some mention of straw hat allies doing something at the doflamingo arc end.

[grizzled fog]

It can’t possibly be brook. The reaper appeared in 1038, this is brook in 1040. Running through the flames with robin in a totally different outfit. That would mean he managed to escape all those flames, dress up as a reaper to scare zoro who was already on the brink of death for some unknown reason, then go back into the castle with robin.

[fallow karma]

I think I wrote that in a very poor way.

It won't BE Brook, so much as it is some form of soul manifestation. Brook could probably see/interact with it.

Now that I've done some more thinking, it may be a manifestation of Enma, but moreover, it may be something to do with Black Blades.

It's said that blades only turn black after many battles infused with Haki, and that the transformation raises the blade's grade by a single tier.

Both Enma, having been wielded by Oden, and Wado Ichimonji, having been wielded since the start of the series, have a long history of battle.

This may be the thing Zoro needs to overcome to turn his blades black, or simply a a manifestation of Enma he needs to force into submission in order to properly use the swords.

[grizzled fog]

It being an illusion or manifestation of enma somehow is possible, we know it was literally killing him by draining all his haki during the king fight, but it seems like after that fight giving into enma and letting it use his haki is the way to properly use it. He just needs to be stronger to withstand it. I think it’s possible it’s just an illusion representing how close to death zoro is, from multiple factors, king, enma and the mink drugs all of which have completely devastated his body.

[lyric berry]

Might be a bit off topic but I think Oda dropped the ball on Zoro this arc. Whether it’s death or enma I don’t care that much since we got G5, same goes for his parentage. Had he explored this stuff before it Id be a bit more invested 🤷

[digital crown]

Hope zoro dies but doesnt die

[delicate crow]

I hope the first part

[digital crown]

Yes

[late pier]

Based on the reaction from the CP0, I don't think they were just sending a "small number of ships. "

On top of this, it seemed like their plan was to take over Wano regardless of whether or no SH or Kaido won, and while they might still be dumb enough to underestimate Luffy, I don't think they'd just send 4 ships in an attempt to take Wano away from Kaido. Otherwise why wait till now.

[sand sail]

Their plan is to take over Wano specifically if Kaido goes down, it's not an either or situation for them.

[iron lion]

Kinemon: We need to open Wano's Borders!
World Government: Hey lemme in
Kinemon:

[tranquil relic]

That would make sense honestly

[lime pasture]

i like this one that was pretty funny

[lone nymph]

Heres a theory. Everyone stared in horror at the newspapers mentioning Sabo because now he is just a human candle

[gusty sierra]

!cl

[junior cape]

The rest of the bombs are gonna get washed out of the castle, fall down the hole, and go boom. The Flood water is gonna wash out onto the performance floor, soak everyone, and quell the fighting for a hot minute. That'll also be how everyone gets out of the castle.

Once the castle is clear, itll all be over

[junior cape]

As for blowing onigashima away, I think itll just be luffy smashing the castle apart to signify the end of Kaido's rule.

And for killing Kaido, I think momo will drop an island on him

Or Kaido will also be sent down the hole, so its ambiguous, and onigashima will seal it

[orchid star]

they said in the event "extremely unlikely case" that kaido loses they wil take wano thats why the ships were on standby and waiting when zunesha rolled up

[formal bridge]

Yeah they didn't expect zunesha to come

[dense schooner]

If I recall I thought the WG was too busy with the reverie incident/after math to send troops there (wonder if it’s fujitora since he’s banned from marine Ford until he captures luffy) wonder what changed?

And then, once Wano's borders are opened, the first newspaper to enter the country turns out to be the bounty posters for the strawhats
@sacred hawk yep and after that on the following page us the announcement of Sabo’s execution.

[terse wren]

I saw a theory from *GrandLineReview" on YouTube about this. He suggested enma has a DF of something like "king of hell" or something, and that the grim reaper is enma's awakening.

[cedar venture]

Sabo’s marriage

[sand sail]

The marines were too busy, the World Government had its own agenda. Nothing's changed there, they haven't sent marines to Wano.

[dense schooner]

Ohhh the marines and WG are 2 different organizations? (access to their own troops)

[sand sail]

Yep, so the marines are dealing with their thing, but at the moment there are World Government and/or Cipher Pol ships and personnel that pulled up

[rain root]

[small creek]

Theory: Zoro's sword Enma 'ate'
the Mythical Zoan Fruit Hito Hito
no mi Model: Hell King/God Enma.
Enma is the judge in the Buddhist
underworld. The Grim Reaper is
Enma and has a will of his own.
Swords with a Devil Fruit become
Black Swords after they awaken
their fruits

[clever arrow]

It could be, but we also know from Brook's fruit that there is an afterlife in One Piece because his soul had to return to his physical body from somewhere, he wasn't just revived on the spot

[dawn jetty]

could be
im rewatching baratie with a friend, and there's a section with krieg saying mihawk had to have a devil fruit to survive the grand line
i doubt mihawk himself has one, but it could imply his sword has one as well

[terse wren]

Question: I've seen theories as to what luffy's new bounty will be after wano, and at the end of the series, but I don't totally agree. If you are invested at all in the bounty system, what's your opinion?

[lapis horizon]

Yo what if the awakening of copy copy fruit is copying the person and their devil fruit power . it would be op

[silent wren]

Im guessing 4 billion after wano

[urban talon]

5 bil

[old ingot]

🤔 probably 3.5 to 4 billion ig

[sand sail]

This is more of a question for #also-manga guys

@pure raven Read the channel description, you've been here more than long enough to know this isn't the place to shitpost.

[wild turret]

Any thoughts on next chapter being Elbaf since luffy used new giant mode ?

Next arc *

[cyan berry]

@weak ridge keep tiktok garbage out of this channel, this channel is for well thought out theories you have made, not just posting random tiktok garbage made for clicks

[weak ridge]

I’m sorry sir please I’m down bad let me live

[lyric berry]

Objects “eating” DF is a recent phenomenon speculated to be attributed to Vegapunk (I don’t believe it’s hard confirmed he discovered this). Either way, Miss Merry Christmas implies it’s a pretty recent thing. Even if it predates Vegapunk, I don’t think Shisui “ate” a devil fruit

[winter heron]

I bet luffys bounty will be around 2 billion around blackbeards level

[terse wren]

My bad

[lapis prairie]

I've seen a lot of people say this, so I assume it's from some youtube guy?

[urban talon]

2 bil is too low, the man is on the verge of taking down the strongest creature in the verse. Bb became a yonko after winning to the remmenants of the wb crew who there strongest member was marco. Also luffy awaikend the devil fruit the wg wants most not to be awaikend and is near finding the one piece. I would say 5 bil

[lapis prairie]

I think the idea falls apart in a few ways, so I'm curious where you guys got it from

[terse wren]

I got it from GrandLineReview on YT

[terse wren]

Same here, I have a feeling that luffys bounty will raise beyond 6 billion by the end of the show. Especially since the mito mito no mi Model: Nika shows a large threat to WG. They've already shown their worry in the previous chapters. (I don't really build theories so I'm sorry if this is poorly written)

[modest skiff]

Bounty discussion is more of a topic for #manga and #also-off-topic

[lapis prairie]

I should stop watching OP people on youtube. So, I think the idea that it's a human model is dumb. The one sword we saw was an elephant, so it looked like an elephant. Enma doesn't look like a human. I'm not saying it can't have a DF (Even though I definitely think it shouldn't) but the 'hito-hito mythical model' idea is just reactionary bullshit to seeing Luffy's fruit unveil.

[modest skiff]

My assumption with mythical hitos is that you only get the transformation after you awaken it. Until then, you essentially get a normal devil fruit power.

[lapis prairie]

A black blade having a DF is also stupid because it takes away the prowess of its wielder. Two swordsmen have assumably turned a black blade - Mehawk and Ryuma. Those are the greatest swordsmen known to OP. That people are now saying it's not them, not their ability to be the GOATs of swordmanship, but some luck with their sword chopping a fruit? That's almost disgraceful. Like it makes them not the greatest, they had the greatest sword. When Zoro is the greatest swordsman of all time it won't be a DF battle of 'mine beats yours' (which is why OP turned into being about Haki, and why we had the ultimate rock-paper-scissors relatively early in the manga). When Wado turns black it won't be of some luck, but Zoro reaching that level of swordsmanship, and when he fights Mehawk there won't be some external force of Mehawk's sword being something Zoro couldn't get on his own. I mean, especially after learning Roger didn't have a DF, people are jumping to the idea that Zoro sudo has one? Come on.

[small creek]

But we saw lassu hes a gun and he ate a fruit

[lyric berry]

Yea that’s when we got all the exposition about objects eating fruits. That was in present day, miss merry Xmas talked about it like it was a pretty recent discovery in the grand line. I don’t think it’s related to black swords because that would imply that shusui “ate” a DF back when ryumma was alive and I doubt wano had that kind of tech or science back then

[lapis prairie]

Possibly, but then - this is a bit of a tangent - it would be assumed that a mythical fish fruit would not transform into a dragon without awakening. Which MAYBE Kaido did. Momo for sure didn't (you could say that's why it was a failure, but like no, that would make it incredible).

[lapis prairie]

Are you're using that to defend the sword being hito-hito? Does that mean all the black blades ate mythical hito-hito fruits?

[modest skiff]

I am not using it to defend anything really. I do not think black blades ate mythical hito fruits. That is basically totally inconsistent with Mihawk directly telling us blades turn black from use. He says any blade can turn black. For that to mean any sword can eat a fruit would be extremely stupid.

There are a few ways to approach the idea of Momo's fruit being a failure:

1. Vegapunk lied because he is allied with the rev army, per my theory here: #manga-theories message

2. Vegapunk is a perfectionist and it kept turning out pink. It being pink is considered a failure because its the wrong color.

3. Momo has a different set of powers from Kaido's. Perhaps rather than fire breath, it has some kind of healing ability

I am undecided whether or not Kaido's fruit is awakened. But @ashen surge has a good theory on this topic and they likely have something to say on the topic

[lapis prairie]

First, gonna quickly rely to say "Got it". Your post read like a reply to mine so I wanted to treat it as such.

[lyric berry]

@modest skiff I read your Vegapunk theory, p interesting. I actually do kinda think Kuma is dead though but could see him maybe staying alive like how you mentioned. Curious what your theory is on the pacifistas in general and how/why they all look like kuma copies

[lapis prairie]

Yeah, Vega as a rev seems to fit best. I don't see another reason why Kuma would do that. That they plan on turning against the WG is a neat idea. We would probably need to meet Vega first, or at the same time, else it would feel a little disjointed.

[modest skiff]

I think Kuma's power was necessary for VP to iteratively develop pacifistas. I think having the same size/shape as Kuma made his power, however he was using it, work better.

I think there are a lot of unanswered questions around why Kuma was necessary for VP to make pacifistas. When you think about it, it doesn't really make sense. There is clearly a lot we don't know about Kuma's power(s).

For me, the completion of the SSG, dissolution of the warlords being exactly when revs strike is too coincidental.

[forest prawn]

So, I guess it is confirmed that Haki is the ultimate power in One Piece and that even the strongest DF eaters can be defeated by the person wielding the stronger Haki.

[lapis prairie]

That was sort of confirmed years ago when Garp was chasing Roger around the grand line, when it was assumed Roger had a DF. Us learning he doesn't have a DF changes the situation but not the outcome.

[manic heath]

i have a theory that luffy awakened his fruit after he died and we found out his devil fruits true powers and name and i think that blackbeard is the exact opposite of luffy and that has the hito hito no mi model Shinigami and that he has already died and is able to eat two devil fruits because he has died and is no more alive and his soul has been taken over by the shinigami.

[modest skiff]

This is a topic for manga channels, not theories, but I would say that is not confirmed at all

[lyric berry]

Do you think it’s possible Kuma “cloned” himself with his pushing ability some way

[lapis prairie]

Awakening Zoans after death seems right if only because it gives reason to why Kaido was trying to kill himself. The rest is a stretch

[lyric berry]

Like VP finished working on him and Kuma used his power to somehow make a copy of himself but each copy has no personality? Or maybe the more he does it his personality gets fragmented or split or something until it essentially becomes nothing

[lapis prairie]

He is able to pull out pain, maybe consciousness too? That's a neat idea.

[lyric berry]

I got no clue haha

[modest skiff]

yeah, that's the gist of what my theory i linked is saying. Kuma's consciousness is somewhere else right now

[lapis prairie]

I think it fits. It would be a reason why it would be Kima that got 'cloned'

[lyric berry]

It could also be something related to Germa since Judge figured out how to make clones

[ashen surge]

It could also be that Momos fruit stayed in PH because it just didnt actually the serve the purposes why those studies were initiated by the WG.

[granite quiver]

I read that Luffy's Gear Fifth could be shortening his lifespan. Anyone think that's true??

https://www.sportskeeda.com/anime/one-piece-theory-will-luffy-lose-life-due-gear-fifth

[glossy snow]

I wouldnt be surprised. most of the things he has done has not had his lifespan in his thought process. Take Impel Down, Marineford, and Enies Lobby for examples

[granite quiver]

Marineford??? What did he do there that shortened his lifespan? Oh same thing as in impel down. Rejuvenation hormone right?

[glossy snow]

correct

[ripe crag]

Theory: Luffy's bounty will lower after wano. His bounty will be so low that noone will believe that he beat kaido.
The Gorosei/Marines would do this to keep the peace in the world and bring everyone's attention off of luffy.

[granite quiver]

That's sooooooooooooooooo saddddddd. after awakening his df and fucking up the strongest creature in the world. Kaido tried to kill HIMSELF and failed. Luffy DESERVES acknowledgement.

[tacit zephyr]

there will be too much evidence that he beat him to hide that fact. luffy will be declared as the 3rd yonko after wano (together with blackbeard and shanks)

[glossy snow]

everyones up to their own opinion, but i feel as though thats just poor storytelling on oda's part, considering most of the crew admires their bountys

[ripe crag]

i believe expectation subversion can be great story telling. I also think it be too on the nose for his bounty to instantly rise after wano and it be hilarious if it actually lowers instead

[glossy snow]

thats fair but this is on a much higher scale than any fight luffy has been in, it would seem almost like wasted potential not to

[agile tangle]

https://worstgen.alwaysdata.net/forum/threads/quick-theory-the-ancient-kingdoms-allies.25665/

[echo plank]

I doubt they can pull it off, fight is well documented

[gusty sierra]

Yamato will die protecting Luffy just like ace did

Then it will trigger luffy anger and beat kaido so bad that he could not be stop because it flashback the time ace died in front of him.

And it will make kaido sad and because yamato is her only child

[visual merlin]

why are you saying this in multiple channels

[echo plank]

Because it is a great theory and deserves to be seen by as many people as possible.

[idle dew]

Agreed

[sand sail]

Theories only need to be posted in one channel.

Incidentally, unless there's some expansion, @gusty sierra your theory is better placed in #also-manga

It's an interesting one

[gusty sierra]

My bad bro

[fathom matrix]

Do you think DFs taste bad because they're spoiled?

Like, when fruits become devil fruits, this changes the fruit but also kinda rots it in the process? So the price for power is eating a fruit that tastes horrible?

The reason why smiles taste okay is because they're grown whilst incorporating the power, but also they're failures, because they don't use the natural process or ceacer didn't do what Vegapunk did

[lapis prairie]

Where does it say that they taste okay? I checked the wiki, but only cursorily

[naive wolf]

as long as i love Kuina's character and really root for her to be alive, i gotta say these 3 option are outrageous i can't see them happening at all, yet....

[vestal orbit]

Ebisu town residents talking about why they ate the smiles iirc

[lapis prairie]

I think they were just starving

[amber oar]

just an anime mistake and not even the only one toei made in that episode. Fourth time this week!

you guys just should stop buying bullshit from charlatans

[bold trail]

Probably 500 mil but added an extra zero.His bounty was 500 million in whole cake island after all.and i dont think his final bounty is gonna be all zeros

[amber oar]

ye it was exactly that.
Now someone is scattering the notion that this mere production mistake somehow means fOrEsHAdOw

[bold trail]

One piece theories are dumb these days everything thinks every single thing is for shadow they they don't even theorize they just say it's confirmed.like when luffy used monkey god gun they says Hanuman fruit confirmed.like...its already confirmed that he got the Nika fruit wtf

[agile tangle]

What do you guys think of this theory? It isn't mine but I thought it's quite interesting

[devout hazel]

how i get colored manga?

[plucky kiln]

google it

[river skiff]

damn

[plucky kiln]

I thought too how Joy Boys crew would like. I figured Poseidon, Wano Shogun, a Minks Duke must have been part of it. Maybe even a Shandorian Warchief

I think a Nefeltari King/Queen must have some relations as well with Joy Boy

[agile tangle]

Ye he probably had a diverse crew

[placid bay]

I don't think poseidon was part of it, since he wrote a letter of apology to her so it wouldn't make much sense if she was part of crew. I think it would make more sense for her to be an ally like current poseidon is to Luffy.

[plucky kiln]

Makes sense but I still hope they went on some adventures. Maybe during the times where poseidon was only a princess and her parents controled the kingdom

[small creek]

THEORY
What if the 5 elders and imu are
immortal and passed the 900 years
and killed joy boy if this is really true
we can assume that they are very
strong and any scars they have are
very mysterious.They didn't even need
guards when they were in a room with
Shanks..

[plucky kiln]

The 5 Elders talked about other WorldGovernment Generations before them so its likely that they aren't immortal

"In every era, the WG has attempted to recover the gum gum fruit and not once has it ever succeeded" ~ Gorosei dudeChp. 1044

[small creek]

Maybe and theory on zoro

As we know not only humans can eat
DF but also objects and what if
Zoro's sword Enma ate one because
Zoro's arm was sucked dry when he
used it it could be when the DF is
awakened Zoro will be the King of
Hell

[near ridge]

I mean u are right but we don't k own untill we find out cuz no one knows what oda sensei has in his mind

[plucky kiln]

I guess Swords are still shrouded in mystery. But looking at Ame no Habakiri which stands for cutting heavens down I think the wordplay about Hell is just a words play

and by King of Hell zoro might refer that he will be the strongest wielder of the weapons capable of cutting down hell

[bold trail]

i mean yea we can speculate but ppl go around saying its confirmed and like make ppl who dont usually know about theories think its true haha.there are like really solid theories but after like foreshadowing was becoming more and more popular everyone started talking everylittle thing as a thoery

[near ridge]

Yup that's not a good thing

[plucky kiln]

Theory: After Wano Zoro might end up keeping Enma. Maybe he will even change his Kitetsu against the Nidai Kitetsu. After all he has showed interest in it and Tenguyama might be nice enough to trade. That way Zoro will have Nidai Kitetsu, Wado Ichimonji and Enma. And he might blacken the swords

and thus they would become 3 surpeme grade swords

[ashen surge]

That would also work thematically, one that has sentimental personal value that set him on the path, one that was given him as a thanks of a virtuous deed because he understand the value of Shushui and one that only the greatest swordsman in the world can conquer

[plucky kiln]

What I still find interesting till today is that the Shusui, being wielded by the most powerful swordman does not belong to the supreme grades

I mean isn't wano the country known for their insane sword crafting abilities. Except Shodai Kitetsu all of the supreme grades we are aware of have no relation to wano yet.

Mihawk, Whitebeard and Roger must have blackened their swords which lead to them going up a grade. but if Ryuma blackened his shusui does that mean shusui orignally was only a skillful grade

[plucky kiln]

yes this is what I prefer about zoro. I dont want him to be the king of hell or something

as a character he is as cool as he already is. I like the symbolism of him way more than him as a strong person

[placid bay]

How did you come to the conclusion Whitebeard's sword was blackened when we clearly saw in marineford that it wasn't blackened.

Also when a sword is blackened does its official grade also upgrade, I tend to think it does not because what happens to TOP 12 swords that are blackened, what grade are they then. So IMO shuusui is a TOP21 prior to blackening which would explain why it was implied it was so much stronger than wado ichimonji.

[ashen surge]

Well as I have understood, blackening a blade might upgrade it's grade

[ruby token]

has a nice ring to it

[late pier]

Gear 2 is still activated, it is just that like with any exercise the more Luffy practices and uses it, the more efficiently he can do it. Add in its not special anymore so the manga/anime don't waste time showing if off every time and bam, you can understand why we don't see him activating it.

Them not wasting time showing him activating it everytime, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

[late pier]

I think this is a poor assumption. Nothing in the manga states that Zoan's can only use their awakening if they transform.

I would also argue that his awakening could indeed have effects on his other gears and moves.

Kaido stated awakening is when your mind and your DF powers are on the same wavelength, giving the ability to use the DF to its fullest potential. Wouldn't his ability to use his DF to its fullest potential also possibly mean he can do even more powerful moves, even when not in Gear 5, since he would be more in sync with the DF powers even when in Gear 2-4.

On top of this I would argue that the awakening is just Luffy and his DF becoming "one in spirit" and that people are confusing Gear 5 and "awakening" as being the same when I don't think they are the same.

In order to become JoyBoy (which is Luffy's Gear 5) he needed to be able to awaken his DF, but the awakening of the DF wasn't Gear 5, but rather Gear 5 is something that was unlocked due to his awakening. It is very likely his awakening also unlocked other abilities, or at least use of abilities, in his other gears.

[placid bay]

Hmmm I quite like this logic that awakening doesn't only give another OP transformation but it also makes your overall fruit abilities stronger which for me makes a lot of sense. This would also explain why donflamingo's fruit was so OP (and maybe how Law's fruit was so much stronger after timeskip)

[ashen surge]

Gear 5 is just Luffy's naming convention

[placid bay]

Gear 5 is the transformation luffy got from awakening and not the awakening itself, at least thats how i understand it

[ashen surge]

And could just be a personal thing since nika gives so much freedom, Joyboy and Luffy probably looked completely different

[late pier]

I am not sure your point, I never said Gear 5 was anything else and not sure why you are being nitpicky about me using Luffy's Term for his Joyboy transformation when talking about it.

As for Joyboy and Luffy looking alike, at no point did I make this argument (second time you rallied against something I did not say). The Joyboy from 800 years ago and Luffy probably do look different. However, I don't think Joyboy is a "person" so much as a title for a person that awakens the 'DF formely known as Gomu Gomu' and perhaps there was a JoyBoy before the one 800 years ago.

What I did argue is that the "awakening" and Luffy's ability to transform into "joy boy" or go into "gear 5" aren't the same thing, but rather "gear 5" is a byproduct of the awakening and is not the awakening itself; on top of this I argued that Luffy's awakening may also affect his abilities when in his other "gears" (as Luffy likes to call them) since he is now completely in sync with his DF.

On a side note, if you could please not make up arguments to argue against, and instead address the things I did argue that'd be great. Thanks!

[ashen surge]

Ummm who are you and why are you writing defensive paragraphs to my passing remark?

[sand sail]

I'm not sure what you were responding to with this post, it's been 3 days. I'll ping you in another channel for the other one.

[late pier]

You just so happened to make those remarks which just so happen to perfectly align up with a comment I made, and are so perfect to the conversation at hand and to the content of my previous comment that its almost like they were a direct response, but yeah you didn't notice my comment at all and just randomly made those statements in the chatroom without any understanding of what comments were stated before it despite how perfectly they fit lol

That reminds me, there is this bridge someone wanted to sell me. I should go check it out! 😉

[dire obsidian]

Enies Lobby was built over the great kingdom. Going off Tekking’s theory, Joy Boy and the D clan was being invaded by the newly formed world government so Joy Boy used his fruit to create a barrier between the island and the invasion. Ultimately, the D clan was still defeated and the world government made a base where the ancient kingdom used to be so that on one could come in and find artifacts and history of the D clan. That explains the weird geography and how the buildings in the center contrast world government’s design and aesthetic so much

[late pier]

What if Marco's awakening is resurrection, for himself, or someone else, but it can only be used once.

Luffy and Shanks fight because they gonna and Luffy wins, killing shanks and Marco, who is there for whatever reason, uses his awakening to ressurect Shanks, but he is reborn as a baby and Luffy raises him on his ship, much like Roger did before.

needs some fleshing out but figured id drop and see how bad you guys tear it apart lol

[obsidian jacinth]

Marco is prolly getting killed by weevil ig, that would make sense because oda has to tie weevil into the plot somehow and I think marco's death would cause some shit and since weevil is also looking to end the remnants

[weak finch]

Luffy's devil fruit is based on Indra

• Indra, in Hindu mythology, the king of the gods. He is one of the main gods of the Rigveda and is the Indo-European cousin of the Greek Zeus and Roman Jupiter.
• He is associated with the sky, lightning, weather, thunder, storms, rains, river flows and war.
• In another interpretation by Hillebrandt, Indra is a symbolic sun god (Surya) and Vritra is a symbolic winter-giant (historic mini cycles of ice age, cold) in the earliest, not the later, hymns of Rigveda.
• Like the post-Vedic Hindu texts, Indra is also a subject of ridicule and reduced to a figurehead status in Buddhist texts, shown as a god that suffers rebirth and redeath.
• Indra's iconography shows him wielding a lightning thunderbolt weapon known as Vajra, riding on a white elephant known as Airavata.
• Indra is the most referred deity in the Rigveda. He is celebrated for his powers, and as the one who kills the great evil (malevolent type of Asura) named Vritra who obstructs human prosperity and happiness. Indra destroys Vritra and his "deceiving forces", and thereby brings rains and the sunshine as the friend of mankind.
• Vritra is a Vedic serpent, dragon or demon in Hinduism, the personification of drought, evil and chaos and adversary of Indra.
• Indra's Roman equivalent is Jupiter.
• The adjective jovial means pertaining to Jove or Zeus or being under the influence of the planet Jupiter (considered a source of happiness).
• The adjective jovial also means merry, cheerful or joyful (Joy Boy).

Picture: Indra on Airavata, holding the lightning weapon to attack Vritra

[torpid canopy]

link to the tekking theory?

[solemn ruin]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1eB4q09n99M

^Parvisions new theory which explores the real nature of Luffy's awakening, and awakenings in general. Honestly an amazing watch, he's onto something huge

[obtuse trellis]

what are y’alls theories about the reverie

[slim igloo]

this aint even a theory its legit what hes based on

[lime stirrup]

not sure why shanks would be a baby tho, or why marco would sacrifice himself to revive shanks, if he couldnt even do it to revive wb or ace

[late pier]

A phoenix is about rebirth. The person resurrected, would be reborn.

As for WB and Ace, maybe he might have but knew they wouldn't want him to. As for shanks, perhaps he by that time since the WB pirates are no more and is not of this generation thinks its worth it at that point since he has nothing to lose. The reason for saving shanks could be determined at any time, not like backstory isn'y a thing put in all the time

[lime stirrup]

most zoan awakenings are just powerups, i think luffy is kind of a special case

[faint plinth]

Honestly if resurrection is Marco’s awakened power I could see him using it on Luffy at the end of this arc

Luffy may defeat Kaido but he may very well die in the process, can’t have that. Would give Marco a great sendoff

[modest skiff]

@grizzled wedge please no jokes in this channel

[late pier]

Luffy just died, I don't see him doing it again.

[real stone]

He's got as many final attacks as law

[abstract turret]

I think white beard is dead and marco hasno where ro ga

[edgy kiln]

Was that kaidos awakening?

[slim kayak]

(bit of memeing) in the next chapter the punch will hit at the end and the final panel will be of a child (presumably kaido) but we'll see only his back and there will be a speech bubble saying something like "what is strength" or something dumb like that

[granite narwhal]

Laugh Tale Theory:

Luffy & Blackbeard will reach the island at the same time (at this point Blackbeard has already killed Shanks, Dragon has defeated the 'corrupted' Marine alongside the Gorosei & Coby is the new Fleet Admiral).
There, it'll be the final battle between BB Pirates V SHs. Winner of 1v1 Match-ups are not all from one side and the winner of Luffy V Blackbeard will be the next Pirate King.

[oblique onyx]

I have one problem with that theory. If Blackbeard killed Shanks Luffy would go after him as soon as he heard the news; unless they learn of it otw to LaughTale alongside BB’s crew.

[neat talon]

Blackbeard won't kill Shanks.

Final 'boss' would just be a friendly fight between PK Luffy, Shanks and Zoro, Mihawk.

[analog sun]

BB will most likely kill someone else though, and it has to be impactful. Other than an actual strawhat, i don't see anyone better suited than shanks who can't possibly be getting that hat back at this point in the story

[vestal orbit]

sengoku since luffy's got that son wukong theme and sengoku's got the buddha fruit

[snow herald]

Bb was the reason, ace got captured and killed. Akainu killed ace. You don't see luffy rushing to those two.
If BB killed shanks. I doubt luffy will just rush to BB.
Luffy knows this aint a game and pirates will kill.

[analog sun]

That was 11 years ago, the fans need a reminder that BB is endgame

[modest skiff]

!theories @neat talon @autumn plaza @latent zodiac @barren sigil

[lone hedge]

Please refrain from using #manga-theories for joke theories, casual chit-chat, or low-effort memes. This channel is for serious discussion- please read the channel description.

[latent zodiac]

Im just legit shocked that maybe they could have at least tried to go fot his heart instead of cutting his heads off they know can grow back.

Unless the scabbards are waiting for something.

[burnt forge]

did roger laugh at laughtale his first or second time around?

[latent zodiac]

Second time? What second time

[brisk mirage]

Yeah he only went once lol

Also Im starting to think Big Mom is gonna come back and help Kaido escape after he loses to Luffy.

So that both of them will be present at the “final war”

Cause she wasn’t really KO’ed, just shoved into a hole lol

[pallid kite]

Big Mom and Kaido era needs to end for Luffy and Law to become the new Yonko with Shanks and BB. Luffy, Law, and Shanks form a new alliance to take down BB and Imu.

[scarlet zenith]

it was twice. they went a second time after God valley

[solemn river]

ive had this theory for awhile, that Imu-sama and Luffy are spiritual descendants of old lovers or something. no idea the specifics but I think that when the sea kings and such say stuff about how everything happens when the two rulers meet i think theyre talking about imu and luffy not any of the ancient weapons

[astral harness]

I don't know if this theory has been mentioned before or not but what if Rocks D. Xebec is actually alive (since there was no info of him actually pronounced dead) living as an entity within Blackbeard since we all know that Luffy and Zoro refer to Blackbeard using "they". This would also prove that the Yami Yami no mi he ate was actually Xebec's devil fruit within Blackbeard and the Gura Gura no mi being the fruit Blackbeard actually ate. Thus, not killing Blackbeard after eating 2 devil fruits. This could probably be connected to his split peronsalities. I'm not so sure honestly 😄

[wet vine]

So just throwing this out there and sense some older characters are coming back into play like akinu akoiji I this that enel will come back not to fight the sh pirates but maybe to join the marines his df is really strong and enel if he learned haki would look cool

[low swan]

Is there a break next week?

[tough wadi]

nope

[steady prism]

I’m feeling pretty vindicated with chapter 1048. It is now even more likely that the Damiyo of Ringo (Shimotsuki clan head) has that 8-petal tsuba sword! (tbf it’s still a little ambiguous but he does seem like the only one with an unsheathed sword)

This can mean one of two things:

1. Hitetsu has the former Damiyo of Ringo’s sword. He took it when the Damiyos decided to escape from that cave that had kid Yamato on Onigashima
2. Hitetsu’s sword and Shimotsuki Damiyo’s sword are the same flagship sword but from different generations, like Kitetsu swords

[raven knot]

Damiyo of Ringo kinda looks like Zoro…

[amber oar]

yes it was mentioned in-universe, I think it was Hyogoro

[raven knot]

Hmmm

[gloomy otter]

I have a theory.

What if nika is inspired from loki, god of mischief

[lapis prairie]

The giant blade does have that hole, it's what the dongle falls out of.

[keen field]

Ringo has to be Zoro’s daddy or uncle

[fossil frost]

that’s what i also speculated

the resemblance is insane

[ruby token]

yeah they are related for sure maybe we'll get all that lore aft the raid is over

[indigo widget]

that would make yasuie’s death/taking care of toko that much more impactful. then again oda has a way with fathers just abandoning their family

cuz they’re (yasuie/toko) also shimotsukis

[gusty sierra]

I think that's impossible as they don't know that there are many countries aside from wano as they never set sail on other island.

[keen field]

But his lineage is basically unknown, the sword smith from Wano was on his same island so it’s not crazy. And there was already the mention that he looked exactly like the old samurai a while back

[gusty sierra]

Yeah, But come to think of it how would zorro comes to east blue and while ringo never been in the boat to sail on other island.

[keen field]

It’s a good point. Maybe not - maybe Zoro just happens to look similar. Depends if Ringo’s hair is green lol

[gusty sierra]

Yeah bro hahaahaha. I think it just a coincidence that ringo and zoro resemblance.

Come to think of it bro, Some of the father/Mother-sons/daughters characters has no resemblance.

[idle dew]

Nico robin and her mom???

Wait you said some not all, sorry

[gusty sierra]

Oh yeah, But is there someone else?

AHAHAHA that's okay

[amber oar]

Ringo was the region's name, not the daimyo's. His name is Shimotsuki Ushimaru. And Oda already said he's not Zoro's dad BUUUUT that doesn't discard a different relation, like grandfather, uncle, etc. Or they simply share an ancestor (Ryuma?)

[idle dew]

Usopp and Yasopp aren't direct copies but it's kind clear I think

[indigo widget]

“Furthermore, in Japan, 49 is an unlucky number because it sounds like the words that mean "pain until death"” guys i have a theory the next ch is going to be gut wrenching

[lime pasture]

oda love his numbers and puns

[swift panther]

But 49 is 7 squared

[plucky lance]

This chapter was so boring

[paper bloom]

So far orochi's head got cut 3 times

[lucid frigate]

Alvida

[narrow spade]

it is technically 8 times
1 by kaido
6 by scabbards
and lastly by denjiro

[lucid frigate]

But he had 9 heads..

[formal pond]

Yo guys in ch 1048 did anyone notice that kaido's new form is a drum in Kanji and luffy is gonna "beat the drum" literally.... also luffy's attacks getting referenced to hanuman feels apt because hanuman can vary his body size at will according to Hindu mythology.

[narrow spade]

no, orochi's df fruit is hebi hebi no mi mythological zoan devil fruit model yamata no orochi which is literally translated into 8 headed snake

[lucid frigate]

I thought it was 9 headed snake

I must be confusing it with Catarina DeVon's fruit which is the 9 tailed fox

[narrow spade]

Yamata/Yamato no Orochi/Orochi (Japanese: 八岐大蛇 OR やまたのおろち) is a famous eight-headed and eight-tailed serpent in Japanese mythology known to enjoy alcohol and human flesh.

since he was cut 8 times already, the one denjiro cut should be his last one already.

[lucid frigate]

Yeah finally dead

[late oxide]

||Ringo’s daimyo seems familiar.. cant remember tough, does anyone know if we’ve seen him before? ||

[lucid frigate]

he was jailed with other daimyos, there was a theory of him being Zoros father when he first appeared

[late oxide]

Ahh that is why, i could not remember haha. Tyfm

[plucky kiln]

but is that really the end ?
perhaps if his DF awakened he gets an extra life

[opal grove]

Is Kaido's Flame Dragon form an awakening?

[jaunty wyvern]

Perhaps none of those 8 heads are his

[open solstice]

we dont know

[digital crown]

L

[daring ether]

I think in windmill town somewhere or ELobby

[agile widget]

I THINK I FIGURED OUT HOW THE BLACKBEARD = 3 PEOPLE THEORY WORKS

He ate his two twin brothers against their will with the yami yami no mi, allows one to pop out and eat WB’s fruit, wields both powers because his brothers soul is absorbed into him.
But if he is able to do that, why wouldn’t he be able to absorb anyone’s soul and steal their DF, and have a billion DF powers?
I think it only works with his brothers because they are triplets. This means their lineage factor is identical, and we all know devil fruits work by altering your lineage factor

[ornate ore]

bro from where did this triplet theory even come

[amber oar]

doesn't work. He defected from WB's ranks immediately after getting the yami yami, but Marco knew he has a weird body, which means he already had a weird body beore eating the DF

[agile widget]

there’s a lot of theories that Blackbeard is 3 people this one just makes the most sense imo

[agile widget]

Forgot Marco said that. There goes my theory. Would have been cool asf honestly but oda is probably just gonna say some shit about how he has three souls or something

[zealous grail]

I mean maybe 3 souls is what Marco meant by weird body. We don't know what's wrong with Blackbeard tbf

[agile widget]

There’s also another theory, being that he already ate a devil fruit before the yami yami that is some type of “combo combo fruit” that allows you to combine people or something

[agile widget]

Wait doesn’t Marco say this in marineford, technically he could have reached that conclusion after BB’s deflection based on some other encounter or MF itself

[amber oar]

no, he talked like something the crew knew. He's also the crew's doctor, remember

[coral vine]

.i think its a snatch snatch no mi

[amber oar]

It's different saying "he did this, he must have a weird body" to say "as you know, his body is weird"

[agile widget]

Oh yeah the wording pretty much gives it away

[amber oar]

there's also the fact he doesn't sleep and already didn't during Oden's flashback

[coral vine]

so he just snatched away wb soul and got the powers

[coral siren]

What if god valley disappeared because of Whitebeard's Quake quake power? He can deal tremendous earthquakes enough to shatter the island and sink it.

[coral vine]

i dont think so cause i think there would be an arc on that like lougtown

[coral siren]

Why would there be an arc on a past island that disappeared because of the defeat of Rocks Xebec?

[coral vine]

because i think rocks is alive and captured there and roger is guarding it because the island has powers that lets roger stay there and be alive

[coral siren]

BRO HE WAS EXECUTED

[coral vine]

so you saw

[pure raven]

My theory is ace(Roger's cutlass) is in raftel beside the one piece. When luffy comes to raftel luffy grabs the sword and he uses it kill zoro and mihawk thus making him the strongest swordsman

[coral vine]

nobody actually dies in mangas i may be false but lets see

[agile widget]

What the fuck

[coral vine]

i think big mom will die a revolutionary will obtain her df and once she might have collected ace soul and then the user would bring ace back

[stark narwhal]

u good?

[coral vine]

no

[agile widget]

this could work, it would be cool if the one piece made roger insane/evil from immortality and Luffy destroyed it

I like the idea of the one piece actually being a bad thing

[coral vine]

i have another crazy theorie of axe return so get your ears ready to bleed

[ornate gale]

Ace be like

[fathom matrix]

Hell, Marco's part of the medical staff on the WB crew, so maybe when he was conducting some tests or something he had some odd results.

HELL, since zoans can effect the user physoically, for all we know he had a zoan fruit back then and they just assumed he was built weird.

OH SHIT YEAH, EVERYONE FORGETS MARCO'S A DOCTOR, SO HE PROBABLY BANDAGED UP AND DID REGULAR PHYSICAL EXAMINATIONS FOR CREW MEMBERS, ESPECIALLY TEACH

[ripe pilot]

So…

[fathom matrix]

IDK, we could get some more information from Marco on why Teach has a weird body. IN FACT, since he's in wano RN and if something involved BB comes up, he could say "I was the WB Crew's first division commander sure, but I was also the ship's head doctor".

So he could explain the weirdness of Teach's biology, stating he never sleeps, his diet's weird, maybe something about blood pressure, damage, recovery time, maybe some off stuff

[amber oar]

Teach couldn't have had a devil fruit before. If he had a previous DF, 1) it would have been obvious from his inability to swim. You can hide it for only so long. 2) the Yami Yami would have been already his second, and thus the shock of a multiple DF user would have come right after he got the Yami Yami, not at the moment he showed the Gura Gura.

[ripe pilot]

Oh ok, but I think teach is just a squid tbh so, he just has short 20 second sleeps throughout the day

[amber oar]

And 3) Marco would have pointed out Teach's original devil fruit (if it existed), rather than that cryptic "odd body" comment

[fathom matrix]

We don't know how often pirates go into the water, and we never saw BB during his WB days in any body of water.

He could have maybe kept it well hidden for a while and maybe he's still hiding it as a trump card, not wanting to reveal all his hands just yet.

PLUS, I'm not entirely sure what marco could have done to detect him being a devil fruit eater. He could have asked Teach and Teach could have lied. I mean, everyone believed him for a while and thought of him as a brother before....he killed Thatch

[amber oar]

We don't know how often pirates go into the water

Come on

Specially when the non users have double the work to compensate for users - be fishing, searching treasures, saving falling crewmates. How many times the non users in the SHs have had to dive in a few months? Teach spent 25 years under WB's wing

[fathom matrix]

What I meant by that, we don't know how many times their ships sink, their ships get wrecked or they're pushed, and considering the WB crew was one of the strongest crews back in the old days, I'd assume not a lot of members fell into the ocean or got the chance to be thrown off their ships into the water and it's never said "oh we fall off all the time" or "we rarely"

Fishing, and going into small boats to sail, of course. They'd need to be closer to the ocean then

And TBH, I'm sure even some Yonko crew members, always fall off or are kicked off the ship during attacks or waves, but we don't know how often or if it's every members

and we have seen it, but as for ships like WB's, Shanks or even Roger's back in the day? Not entirely sure. ALTHOUGH Buggy has. You could argue "oh well, it's buggy" but again, it is likely as you said crew mates will fall into the ocean at times.

IDK how many times or if BB even was thrown off, kicked off or fell into the ocean, when he was on Newgate's ship

HELL, for all we know, he could have been careful and somehow avoided it.

On the one hand, I can't prove he hasn't but on the other, we can't prove he did. It's likely either way

[amber oar]

Dunno, the idea that someone can hide their inability to swim for 25 years when pirates spend like 99% of the time near sea, is absurd

[clever lintel]

I wonder if the cover story will have Pudding leave Tottoland with the Germa. I think her devil fruit and the 3ETribe will have a role in the future. Perhaps the 3ET's poneglyph reading is something that involves memories and Pudding's devil fruit can be used to show said memories to someone like Robin if the poneglyph language was once the spoken language in the void century.

[modest skiff]

Here is my summary so far of the kraken/squid theory, which I think is extremely bad:

Theory 1 - Kraken - BB ate a devil fruit which made him some form of octopus.

1. 4 bones on his flag cross and form 8 points. Octopuses have 8 tentacles, so he is an octopus.

**Counter: **Kaido’s flag also has 4 bones forming 8 points. The skypiea, Wano, Alabasta and FMI arcs all contain 8 pointed imagery. Kaido has been shown to not be an octopus despite also having 4 crossing bones on his flag.

2. BB’s flag has 3 half skulls on it. Octopuses have 3 hearts, so he is an octopus.

**Counter: **The number 3 is found in many other parts of the universe other than number of octopus hearts.

3. Devil fruits rely on a heart to be used in some way. Since BB will use 3 devil fruits, he must have 3 hearts, so he is an octopus

**Counter: **A teapot and a sword have used a devil fruit. Neither object has a heart, nor any discernible biological qualities. A devil fruit must not require biology.

4. Creatures in snowy places do not sleep. Since Shanks and Buggy never noticed BB sleeping, he is from a snowy place

**Counter: **We have seen Chopper sleep.

5. Surume is from the north pole, which has snow. Since BB doesn’t sleep, he must be from a snow place which the north also is, so surume = BB

Counter: Places with snow other than the north pole exist.

6. Octopuses edit their RNA, which allows them to make proteins other than the ones encoded in their basic DNA. Since BB can use multiple fruits, it must mean he edited his RNA so that he can eat multiple fruits, which must mean he is an octopus

**Counter: **There is no reason to believe this at all and it is pure headcanon

7. BB chased Luffy up the upstream. An octopus was used to glide down from the sky islands. Since these 2 things are opposite in some way, it means BB is an octopus

**Counter: **The whole idea of everything being opposites or whatever is not well supported and we have no reason to think this.

8. Luffy is friends with Surume, which is a kraken. Since Luffy is not friends with BB, and since duality, that must mean BB is a kraken

**Counter: **Again, the duality thing happens here and there but since there are many areas where there is not duality, we have no reason to assume everything is duality.

[ripe pilot]

It just a joke 😅

[modest skiff]

Please don't post jokes in this channel, per the channel description

[ripe pilot]

I’m sincerely sorry mohdoo, but you seriously made good points👍

[sick raft]

Blackbeard is such a huge mystery

I wonder if he really does have any connection to Rocks

[sharp anvil]

At least we have enough to say there might be a light/dark side now. Do you guys think BB actually had a light side though?

Or even has it is just suppressed

[sick raft]

not a light side per say but he has light side elements to him but he doesn’t let them get in the way of his plans .. like how he explained to Ace that he truly didn’t wanna kill Thatch cause he was his friend but he had to

[modest skiff]

I don't think we have enough reason to see BB as some kinda bond villain antagonist and I still label him an anti-hero rather than an antagonist. We have more indications that he sides with the AK than anything else

[sharp anvil]

Personally I think there is and actual innocent soul attached to him somewhere and whatever the hell else is up with him uses it to fool the likes of Shanks or WB

Light and dark doesn't necessarily have to pertain to plot points

Darkness is also more often than not antihero as well

[sick raft]

it’s hard to figure out cause he’s been scheming since a little kid lol like ever since we’ve seen him in the story he’s been plotting , even when he first met WB lol

[sharp anvil]

It is so hard to think of him as one person lol

[sick raft]

i mean i guess it’s possible he could be like Cavendish, just a little different

[inner swift]

Aight

So we know that jacket man just kinda disappeared in Dressrosa, but I think Burgess kidnapped him to take his OP fruit.

We know the BB pirates are all seeking DF’s, so here me out here……..

Pizzaro Jacket

[odd canopy]

Do you guys think kaido will get beaten up next chap?

[visual merlin]

Funny and all but lets keep this channel to serious theories

[paper barn]

Is it possible that zoro has CoC because he spent a lot of time around luffy? if the nika fruit affects everyone around luffy, so maybe it changed zoro too?

[visual merlin]

nah

Zoro just has it because he has the qualities for it. Luffy's fruit doesn't really affect people, he just does weird stuff that they either are shocked by or laugh at

among other issues, thats why that can't be the case

[fossil socket]

why is this channel dead

[tulip hedge]

Because people think luffy has some too force powers of imagination

[sand sail]

@fossil socket @tulip hedge Both of you should read the channel description. The channel isn't dead, it's for a specific kind of discussion. If you don't have a theory to either create or talk about, it's best taken to one of the other manga channels we have.

[fossil socket]

ok

[timber verge]

How many chapters y'all think will be till luffy defeats kaido, i say 2 more

[inner swift]

Theory/discussion topic that I brought up briefly in #also-manga

Could strong enough Conquerors kill someone?

Think about it, a force of will so great and powerful it can shatter someone’s mind entirely. It seems highly likely.

[lyric berry]

I mean getting knocked out that way can’t be good for one’s overall health. Maybe CotC won’t kill someone immediately but could create lasting long term health issues lol

[inner swift]

Potentially, but I feel that there’s at least potential for lethal conquerors Haki

[lyric berry]

It is certainly possible but given how little Oda kills anyone thru any method I doubt he’d do it. That would also be insanely OP since CotC is virtually unavoidable

[inner swift]

Yeah, but imagine how impactful that reveal would be, that any of the users could go that far with their power.

[fathom matrix]

I could see Pudding getting kidnapped by thr Germa, but then she realises how bad Tatland is and what would happen in her mom comes back, and she begs not to return.

Maybe she think she can see Sanji again if she stows away or is taken with them

[sharp anvil]

Wouldn't you think the weaker folk passing out to CoC would have already experienced this had it existed

Edit: Oda also kills he just had Kaido wipe out a bunch of slaves

[inner swift]

I mean if it’s in the hands of the greatest Conq user though, Luffy likely doesn’t have the strongest, but someone like Kaido for example could just annihilate someone’s mind (not saying he is, but hes an example)

[sharp anvil]

I think combined with the right fruit it might be this way and absolutely devastating

[inner swift]

Absolutely. Maybe thats why Rocks was so feared…

[sharp anvil]

It did take alot of combined willpower to take him out

[inner swift]

Garp can’t user conquerors I think though

[sharp anvil]

Maybe he was debilitated by Rocks 🤷‍♂️

Edit just like how you're saying lol

[inner swift]

That could explain it, the whole island was likely destroyed and the massive Haki clash was likely a factor

[sharp anvil]

Imagine a full release of a user's unused Haki all at once

[inner swift]

Thst would just be awesome

[modest skiff]

@pure raven @echo plank conversations regarding power up hopes/discussion should go in #manga in the future. Thank you!

[lapis prairie]

To people who think that Kaido's getting defeated in the next few chapters: Where do you think his backstory is going to go, or do you think we already saw all of it?

[eager frost]

Seems like the perfect time and place to reveal more info about Joyboy. Flashback to when and just how much Kaido knows about this subject would be my bet as much as I would like to see flashback from god valley.

[pure raven]

Possible arcs and arcs that could be coming/will come:

Elbaf Arc - (75% chance of happening, Elbaf is cool but seems unlikely of a destination to go to unless a Yonko or something big happens in Elbaf)

CP0 Arc - (CP0 in general might intervene in arcs just like they did in Onigashima but may have their own seperate arc)

Sabo/Revolutionary War Arc - (99% chance of happening, something happened to Sabo during the Reverie and Luffy will hear about the news)

Blackbeard Arc - (99% chance of happening, its time for Luffy to face Blackbeard, I have a theory that Koby and Luffy may team up just as Roger and Garp did in their youth)

Shanks Arc - (99% chance of happening, Luffy finally meets Shanks to give back the Straw Hat)

Zoro Backstory Arc - (60% chance of happening, Zoro gets a full backstory as Sanji did in Whole Cake Island Arc, seems unlikely to happen as Zoro doesn't seem to be leaving or disappearing anytime soon)

One Piece/Laugh Tale/Raftel Arc - (100% of happening, Luffy finds the one piece)

[nova kettle]

Wow

[silver swan]

I remember saying 2.5-3 chapters a week ago and I got mad shit on for it -__-

[pure raven]

https://youtu.be/G7P8_4i3Me0

what do u guys think of this video?

[iron lion]

What sort of order do you think these arcs will appear in?
My personal "Bet" is that the end of wano will spark the beginning of the Final Saga and the end of One Piece

so it would be in a sense Elbaf->Shanks->Blackbeard-> Laugh Tale-> Final War Arc-> Epilogue
this is largely because I really don't think blackbeard could even come close to the threat of Im as a final villain.

[pure raven]

If it was on all the arcs I've listed then

Sabo/War Arc -> Elbaf Arc -> CP0 Arc -> Zoro Backstory Arc -> Blackbeard Arc -> Shanks Arc -> One Piece Arc

Honestly these are unlikely since Oda says the story is basically about almost complete but I do like to think of what could finish off One Piece :]

But I do think Elbaf Arc could be for good character development like Ussop as he says he wishes to go there to become a brave warrior. I do think that Luffy is basically coveted after the defeat of Kaido and Big Mom, all that's really left is Blackbeard and he could be possibly a powerhouse

I've also had a theory that maybe Shanks' base resides at Elbaf there was this scene in the anime of Shanks facing off in the sea for remastered Luffy backstory and the terrain looked just like Elbaf's for Big Mom's backstory

So that could tie in with one another

[digital crown]

Yup

[gaunt fractal]

Yamato could be the test tube baby of Kaidou and Big mom it is especially possible given one of the disaster is queen who is a highly skilled geneticist so it could be possible Kaidou wanted a heir and chose big mom because of her great strength and during a battle with big mom pirates in the past collected DNA from Big mom then combined it with Kaidou's DNA to create Yamato

[pure raven]

Stop it, big mom confirmed herself that she consider kaido as little brother and kaido also acts like tsundere little brother, they have a nice love hate relationship don't ruin it. And I don't understand that why someone like kaido cannot have proper relationship

[gaunt fractal]

fair point

[opal siren]

Gotta say that Katakuri does not look his age

[unreal egret]

How old is he??

[opal siren]

48

[tranquil orchid]

I have a theory about something small but was never fully explained

Milk and Teeth theory

So remember back when Luffy and Brook drank milk and suddenly regained their missing teeth? For Brook it was expected since he's all bone and those nutrients have to go somewhere, so it all went to his damaged bones, but Luffy had no solid reason for his to return.

Now that we know what his actual devil fruit is, we can assume that Luffy's been using Toon logic, like how Popeye believes that Spinach gives him strength, Luffy believes in the power of milk in it's ability to heal and strengthen bone. With the Nika fruit being about imagination as it's power we see Luffy somehow tap into it even before awakening.

[opal siren]

never mind

[tranquil orchid]

It's not a serious theory but the whole scene really wasn't explained, so it had to be pointing to something that wasn't revealed at the time.

[tulip hedge]

I personally think it has nothing to do with toon logic, I'll keep saying it but Luffy's power isn't imagination neither did they ever say it was imagination, maybe it depends of the translation but they say that his rubbery powers are only limited by imagination, you can go look for the panel for confirmation
For his teeth I think it's just a case of it being a manga, so fiction, his teeth get knocked out so ofc they gotta come back somehow unless you expect Luffy to have 1 tooth at the end of the series, or his teeth to not fall out no matter what so they made it into comic relief by showing that milk grows back teeth

[tranquil orchid]

But the reaction from Bege's henchman definitely showed it wasn't normal and applied it to devil fruit users being weird, Nika's whole thing is to bring joy and laugther and since you said it was showed as comic relief it can also correspond to Nika's abilities, it's stretching I know

[pale pivot]

Remember the five kids from fishman island Ichika, Nika, sanka, Yonka and Yonka 2
Well we know there are four gods so, just a brief thought

[cyan berry]

No

[leaden valley]

kidd is shanks son and kidd is angry at shanks for abandoning him

[obsidian ridge]

Elbaf is the most likely location the Straw Hats are going to visit after Wano if the Grand fleet makes an appearance in the Wano Arc to support SH's in the situation where Luffy defeats Kaido.

Marines/WG will most likely step into the situation to capture pirates especially Straw Hat Luffy & Robin.

** Since Wano is a landlocked country, it will be difficult for SH to move to the next Arc without facing the Marines/WG. **

The most likely situation is :-

1. Grand fleet following the 'Vivre Card' of Luffy or may be God Ussop 😆 when they find Luffy's Vivre Card disappeared & reappear.

So in this situation they surround the Marines & eventually marines let SH's escape however Marines/WG take control of the situation in Wano & aid the injured & provide food to other civilians of Wano.

2. If Grand fleet won't arrive then SH's might use 'Coup De burst' to move out of Wano.

However I believe SH's will move out of Wano in style & pride 😆 with the Grand fleet.. & open the borders of Wano for everyone!

[vagrant bear]

But they have a giant elephant helping them, why would hey need a grand fleet?

[obsidian ridge]

Good point, Zunesha is also there to help them 👍🏻

[late token]

Pretty sure some of this will all be combined in one big final arc.

[whole charm]

Hi

[random ember]

Kaido the red Gyarados

[dusky notch]

If kaido gets defeated by next chapter without having a backstory , then I think his backstory will only be revealed just before they go to laugh tale, probably coz it has something to do with the void century

[uneven tide]

Are Enel and king related to each other?

[edgy lagoon]

Nothing has been said about it, but no. Enel is a human and king a lunarian

[pure raven]

How will you explain kidd when he was imprisoned in udon with luffy he also had similar situation

[copper frost]

Enel is a Birkan, another Sky Islander. King obviously is a Lunarian

[whole raptor]

gonna use the theory theory no mi here but, i feel like law may potentially be killed off or used in some way, as they had stated in the past about how at the cost of the ope ope no mi users life, they can grant immortality to one person

might not be the case, open to discussion on it though

[dim sky]

Idk if this is common knowledge cos it seems so clear to me but I believe there is one final Poneglyph on Laughtale and heres why. First off Poneglyphs are these seemingly indestructible square pillars and whats another thing these poneglyphs have in common with squares? square numbers. there are 4 road poneglyphs (2x2), 9 rio poneglyphs (3x3) and that leaves us with 17. now what is 4x4? 16 and that leaves us with 1 left the holy grail of poneglyphs, the one waiting for the strawhats on laughtale!

[inner vector]

Do you think BB Pirates are in Totto Land or are Reiju and his brother who I don't remember his name?

[timber silo]

it would be cool if it's the BB pirates. Imo i don't think Oda would hide reiju and the brother and draw them as silhouettes. Clearly seems like some other forces are infiltrating choclat town. The mayor then again looked very calm. I'm guessing cuz he realized those faces as friendly maybe.

[tranquil orchid]

You're referring to when they both disinflated after eating so many dumplings right? Best explanation I can give is Kidd's metabolism being as fast as Luffy's here tbh.

[zinc meteor]

guys, i found out something huge. How the hell does dressrosa only occured within a day?!

dressrosa arc took 118 episodes
considering that an episode consists of 24 mins each -5 mins of intro = 19 mins each.

118 x 19 = 2242 mins
2242/ 60 = 37.37 hrs

one piece world has more than 24 hrs per day

[iron lion]

...Or the anime repeating the same shit over and over and again makes it last longer

[hoary edge]

He may give immortality to a certain character

[ornate gale]

Blame those stupid arena scenes

[desert obsidian]

i hate that theory tbh

[hoary edge]

Tbh I think it will happen, ope's main value is the immortality operation

[desert obsidian]

dont like law being killed off to make luffy immortal

[hoary edge]

It could be anyone not just luffy

[desert obsidian]

if not luffy then who? cant think of anyone who law will perform immortality operation besides luffy since law has no friends/family i can think of who he would possibly perform the operation on

[ornate gale]

Luffy doesn't want to be immortal

[sand sail]

All of you need to read the channel description.

[icy sapphire]

zoro will finish off kaido

[iron lion]

Conjecture: The abolishment of the warlord system was not the first time the kings and queens present at reverie went against the Gorusei's wishes. Case in point-the enslavement of Fishmen and other beings was abolished around 200 years ago by the World Government. Could be this a result of a resolution passed at a Reverie 200 years ago?

I'm sure this resolution was resisted by the gorusei and only accepted once there were carve outs for the CDs still having slaves. However, it does seem like the Gorusei of the present are more "progressive" than the Gorusei of 200 years ago given they selected Jimbei as the next Warlord of the Sea in hopes of reconciling humans and fishmen along with accepting the Ryugu's Kingdom's application for reverie.

[serene terrace]

im overthinking abt nami's real parents ;-:

[glacial vessel]

they are dead no need to think

[serene terrace]

what i meant is where does nami gets her high iq does it come from her parents or she just born with high iq

[cyan berry]

IQ isn't inherited, and Nami does not even remember her parents

So there's even less chance she got anything from them

Nami's parents were just normal people that died in a terrible war

So were Nojiko's

[serene terrace]

oohh now im not gonna overthink :))

[cyan berry]

That is all we need to know

[sand sail]

@static mortar Not the channel for that.

[static mortar]

that gif has foreshadowed the last bouts of the battle though...

[sand sail]

@static mortar Go ahead and read the channel description.

[static mortar]

sorry then

[loud mountain]

what do people think happened with Vivi and Sabo

[hoary edge]

Sabo got framed for killing vivi, maybe

[glacial vessel]

why did people link what happened to sabo with what happened to vivi