pzwiki_editing

[proud cobalt]

Because it uses the old style of tile article

Oh that's fair, i'll try update that today

[proud cobalt]

Ok uploading all the news images, there may be some duplicates as they use the same image across multiple blogs, this will take some time to work out

[digital helm]

Either Rework or Note work here, but yeah, best to not make major changes to fishing at this point.

Fishing is under the animals subproject for the b42 project, but what you've added is good. The project will need a bit of a rework anyway once we get our hands on things

Sorry for the delay. Yes, this looks good.
I've got all the changes to the page version template ready here https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Vaileasys/sandbox_5 just needs the logic added.
@languid kayak for the revision oldid I'm pretty sure Calvy has already done all the hard work with it. It won't really take up any more space on the mbox. I imagine this'll only be temporary until b42 goes to stable

Feel free to update/rework and change the name. I'm still a little out of it

[proud cobalt]

Yep definitely. Hard to plan for the unknown

[proud cobalt]

Oh that sandbox will come in handy. Cheers

[digital helm]

It'll change depending on the parameters used. I don't remember what we discussed previously, but I'm assuming it'd be oldid (b41 revision) and maybe an autogenerated (disclaimer) one?

[proud cobalt]

The script adds |2={revisionid} to the page version template for the B41 revision. I thinks that all I had planned

[lucid junco]

Hey, is salad model broken in vanilla?

[rotund echo]

I thought it was just my mods

It is like that for me too bro

I don't even run cooking or any food mods

[lucid junco]

I thought the same with my mods 😄

I have an anim fixer, so thought that it could be non vanilla

[rotund echo]

I didn't pay it much mind, maybe it was just my mods, but it turns out it wasn't only me

Too lazy to debug, you do that for me, k

[languid kayak]

Yeah, I changed it to note and reworded so at least for now it won't ask for anything in https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Site_maintenance 😉

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Army_barracks @naive imp Can you say something about the page?

[naive imp]

Looks good. The only thing I'd change is that the description for the location table is used to describe roughly where the location is, relative to landmarks and such

But Doe Valley is kinda featureless so idk how you'd do that

It's all just kinda flat farmland

I'll take a look at the individual locations later tonight and see what's up about it but other than that all looks good to me

[serene sage]

@proud cobalt there doesn't seem to be a distribution table for Shooting Glasses, which has the item tag Base.Glasses_Shooting, or is it the same as the Reflective Sunglasses? Referring to this: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Glasses#Location

[digital helm]

That'd work. Think I'll prioritise getting the logic done, so we can just copy-paste when we're ready

[proud cobalt]

Added now, it didnt have a table previously because it was done in outfits and special foraging. Should auto update now

[serene sage]

dang they're pretty rare

[rotund echo]

What the hell are shooting glasses

I don't think I've ever seen them before

Though I think I have seen reflective glasses that have the same icon

[serene sage]

I have shooting glasses in my (abandoned) two month run

I'll take a screenshot hold on

[serene sage]

they're basically orange reflective sunglasses, and honestly I think they're the coolest piece of eyewear in the game

as you can see I'm also flexing with the short skirt

[rotund echo]

Nice lol

Ngl I wonder why the short skirts aren't choosable in creation

You can choose every other skirt length "Mini", "Knee", normal, and "Long"

[serene sage]

I was thinking maybe Kentucky's a modest place, but then you can pick the mini skirt

[rotund echo]

Boob tubes are also an option in creation 😭

[serene sage]

what's weird is that they don't spawn in wardrobes

though that's also the case with the mini skirt

[rotund echo]

Short Skirt?

[serene sage]

yeah

[rotund echo]

Huh... Every time I remember finding one, it was from an office worker zombies or something

[serene sage]

they do spawn in elementary school "wardrobes" though

[serene sage]

that's one of the only ways

I massacred the Finnegan Research Group building to get it

[lucid junco]

Ill fix it to resemble other pages more closely if you haven't already

[naive imp]

If you want to, go ahead. I meant to take care of ot tonight but I muscled tires all day at work and am just fuckin exhausted

[lucid junco]

Currently also on my list are: Hardware store, Produce warehouses

[naive imp]

Brother go off

This week I'll be more active as it's coming down to the wire. I admit I've been slacking but no more of that crap

[lucid junco]

You can tell that Im a project history leader

[naive imp]

Hey I'm a project l&m leader and did a ton of shit for vehicles

All good

[languid kayak]

Yeah, guess that'll work and make our life easier, forgot some details about that discussion and sandbox of yours (I think I saw it?) but yeah, looks fine 😄

[languid kayak]

I remember some fishes being like that, I'll test if I won't forget or someone else beats me to it

[languid kayak]

I think glasses should be split too? @proud cobalt

[proud cobalt]

Getting there

[languid kayak]

There's always exceptions 😄

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/K%26B_story

That doesn't look right

I think the code explicitly states chance "0"

[proud cobalt]

@serene sage
https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=K%26B_story&diff=413633&oldid=413015

Im sure he had reasoning for it

[languid kayak]

there were some diacussion about it, can't say for sure but I think someone cobfirmed it spawns and that code never triggers

[proud cobalt]

Here's the discussion @lucid junco

[lucid junco]

Ooh

I see

[quartz bear]

Nooo don't remind me how I brainfarted and forgot how exclusive random works

[lucid junco]

Is it 31% then?

[rotund echo]

I swear this is one the worst survivor homes I've ever seen

[quartz bear]

It is

[lucid junco]

I swear it was something like "chances to spawn 0" or something in the code

[quartz bear]

I gave you the LOC

here

[lucid junco]

@naive imp Ive added in location desc along with the short building descriprion
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Army_barracks

(Like this)

So Im thinking that we can delete the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Army_barracks_(Rosewood) page

Ive already included every barrack that is currently on the map along with this one

And, as much as I love having pages for businesses/locations that can be useful to the player, this is kinda an overkill and doesn't have that much value to justify having it separated now

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Tool_store
Page created

[serene sage]

I have no idea on the exact chance, but people have found the story naturally while playing so it’s definitely not a chance of “0”

[lucid junco]

So I though, setChance0 means there is a 0 chance of it spawning

[rotund echo]

Turns out, the zombies can set the explosives off for me

[serene sage]

serves them right

[rotund echo]

I made great care to avoid the fire from spreading

Also, rain came in clutch right after the house was engulfed in flames

[serene sage]

nice

[naive imp]

Yeah absolutely delete that and replace the link to new page, I'll mark it shortly

By the way, we typically don't include the details of the building in the location table since most locations are so different. Readers can click on the coordinates and look for themselves if they wanna see imo

[naive imp]

Page looks good, but once again I'd say to remove the building details from table and change the name to hardware store, as it's more inline with the other parts of the wiki

Happy to discuss though if you disagree 😀

[naive imp]

@digital helm the collapsible element on the "building" section or "infobox location" doesn't work

It stays uncollapsed no matter what

Pinging @proud cobalt too for that

[lucid junco]

I thought having a small description about the business interior is a good compromise of not having a separate page

Ive been doing that on almost every location page now 😅

(Locations as Grocery store, General store, Convenience store and others)

[naive imp]

Well we don't do that for anything else but now that I think of it, it would be helpful to have a way of describing them

Plus having a separate section for that would he cumbersome too

Ykw consider my concerns about the table dismissed I think your approach is good. Just not for business chains tho I think, only the general pages

You okay with changing tool store to hardware store @lucid junco?

[languid kayak]

@proud cobalt seems you used some compression on the images?

https://pzwiki.net/w/images/9/93/Tinker_tester_server_zed_image1.png vs https://projectzomboid.com/blog/content/uploads/2021/01/featured-image.jpg

Seems gif-like, excessive color banding

https://projectzomboid.com/blog/news/2019/08/twisted/

EP has been up to some very cool stuff! It’s all still in the early experimetal phase of poking at the car model system, so no guarantees if it’ll be in the IWBUMs but its way too cool not to show:
08.2019
😄

[languid kayak]

similar here:
https://pzwiki.net/w/images/2/22/Wishing_you_a_very_zombie_christmas_image1.png
https://projectzomboid.com/blog/content/uploads/2012/12/4_spiffomascot_winter.png

[languid kayak]

even https://pzwiki.net/w/images/c/cc/Sprites_spiffo_and_sea_lions_the_mashpotassium_story_image4.png vs https://pzwiki.net/w/images/f/f7/MashPotato.png

[digital helm]

Yeah, that's just for the normal way of spawning. K&B story had its own unique way of spawning. I forget the file name it's defined in

[digital helm]

That's weird... I'll take a look late today

[proud cobalt]

Fixed that, was just an issue in some of the closing brackets

[proud cobalt]

^

[proud cobalt]

This one zoomed in looks particularly bad, though at full size i wouldnt say its noticable. I used pngquant with quality 95. The spiffo one i genuinely cant see a physical difference even zoomed. Then with the mash one its only zoomed in that you can see the compression

[rotund echo]

What is this, a 41 Thursdoid?

God damn it why did they never added animated car doors? We wouldn't have had that stupid "bite-through-car-door" shit

[lucid junco]

I was really unsure which one to choose

While hardware store is used more frequently, and some of the stores have hardware in their name

And throughout the wiki its a common term used for these stores

Tool(s) store is a roomdef in game. It is also currently used in the navbox and some stores have tools in their name

Currently Tool store is a main page name and Hardware store is a redirect

Im fine with changing it if you want to

[lucid junco]

Obviously not for chains since they have their own pages

Just for unaffiliated ones that will not have any page in the future

[languid kayak]

yeah, the models are still in the game IIRC and there are mods. Some day™

[languid kayak]

ah, pngquant explains it 😄

also the png sizes are higher than jpg because of that 😛

png isn't really fit for lossy compression 😄

[rotund echo]

Vanilla Vehicles Animated is kinda clunky with the clipping and all that, but the author has admitted it was done in a rush, I think

And also, still, being able to see if your car doors or hoods are opened are nice QoLs

[languid kayak]

it's not so terrible indeed, but something was off 😄

[rotund echo]

In 42, they better animate the cars

They literally have always had indoor, and under-hood textures for vehicles

[proud cobalt]

Oh? All the ones i checked were lower

[languid kayak]

61K PNG, 19K JPG 😛

[proud cobalt]

Ok most things split now, ive made a couple decisions not to split a few, things like bandana. I will do shirts though

[languid kayak]

I think I originally marked them to split cause of the body locations? But probably best to leave them all at one page, yeah.

We still have to separate the body locations from body parts (protection zones), since we have blatant errors with what things cover for the purpose of protection/thermal/water protections 😄

[languid kayak]

oh funny https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Obt is actually called Operation Big Tree https://projectzomboid.com/blog/news/2016/05/obt/

[naive imp]

Yeah hardware store is the more common way of saying it in the USA, idk about everywhere else tho

[naive imp]

BTW @lucid junco when you request a redirect for deletion, please don't remove the redirect from the page, only add the deletion notice. Having that redirect still there makes it a bit easier to trace what the page originally was 🙂

No big deal tho

[lucid junco]

Thats weird

Why does GOG logo black on Citizen, but white on Vector?

@languid kayak @digital helm

I thought it was missing the first time I saw it

[languid kayak]

I think the Citizen class require tweak for it, as it's inverted by CSS, pinging @digital helm for that too

[lucid junco]

Hardware is only used in zac's hardware logo

Room def is toolstore

and toolstore storage

[naive imp]

Yeah but irl the only "tool store" I know that's marketed as such is Harbor Freight Tools

Every other place is marketed as a hardware store or "home improvement store"

But that could just be choice of vocabulary

[naive imp]

Ngl I can't fucking stand the citizen skin

I hope we don't get rid of vector 2022 because that's the best one imo, super simple

[lucid junco]

Citizen is very good on mobile

[naive imp]

No it is not at least in my opinion

I prefer vector on both mobile and desktop personally

[lucid junco]

If there was an option to have vector on pc and citizen on mobile then Id happily use it like that

[naive imp]

But tbh it's just a factor of opinion

[lucid junco]

But yeah, I find citizen really not fitting for pc

[naive imp]

Tbh I don't think it should be the default

[lucid junco]

When you don't have a restricted screen size to work with, then there is no reason to use panels

[naive imp]

Maybe we should have a vote or a poll or something?

@languid kayak @digital helm opinion? ^

[lucid junco]

Its just a waste of clicks and clumsier to navigate with just your mouse

Drop down menus are not for desktop

But I can see how they can be used on the devices with smaller screens

[lucid junco]

Maybe a little bit early for that? Another year perhaps

[naive imp]

Why do you believe so?

[lucid junco]

It was untastefull sarcasm 😅

[naive imp]

I was about to say whatever you tried to joke with just flew over my head

Maybe the train wreck of an election the USA had man idk I don't wanna get into that lol

[lucid junco]

I was the same opinion when citizen first was introduced

I don't think theme that prefers mobile users in the wiki about pc only game is the one that should be on default

Since there are no console players (yet) that may not have a pc for internet scrolling, I don't think there are enough mobile users to justify citizen being the default theme

[serene sage]

citizen looks too spaced out imo

and too generically “modern”

[lucid junco]

It is

Because of the fact that vector uses just the middle of the screen

While citizen uses the whole screen with its side menu

[serene sage]

citizen also broke my user page banner

had to delete it

[lucid junco]

Some say that "you can just use LARGE font menu", but it will still utilize the whole screen due to the side menu

The whole "customization" gimmic does not help the fact that it will still take up the whole screen

[serene sage]

citizen just makes uploading multiple files more tedious

it already is with vector

citizen makes it tougher with the hidden sidebar

[lucid junco]

Side bars are not for desktop

If you have enough space to put everything from the side bar on the screen then just do it

While there are shortcuts to access the options in the menu, they are not written anywhere

So anyone who doesnt know them will have to navigate through the menus with just the mouse

[serene sage]

right

[proud cobalt]

Maybe i can look at revamping the body location template? Is that something we're interested in? @digital helm i think it's your template

[proud cobalt]

The names are grabbed from the URLs

[proud cobalt]

Vector was chosen for its mobile usability and dark/light mode switch, something vector didn't have until after citizen was implemented (and still doesn't have on our install). Our dark mode vector implementation was a hack job by @digital helm. Until Kirrus updates the wiki and skin i don't think there's any use in going back. Though i will be staying on citizen anyway

[languid kayak]

we will remove the quirks for dark skin, though OTOH it will get dark mode from MediaWiki too eventually, just no ETA

[languid kayak]

https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content="tool+store"%2C"hardware+store"&year_start=1800&year_end=2022&corpus=en&smoothing=3 not enough results for tool store in ngram for books 🤔 Trends is favorable to hardware store too https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=now 1-d&q=hardware store,tool store&hl=en

PZ is full of British terms too, though hardware indeed sounds more familiar.

[languid kayak]

not easy one really, I got used to citizen, though there was some quicks I had to go through

[proud cobalt]

The updates to V22 have made it a much better experience on mobile since July this year which happened to also be right about when we moved to citizen. Though at the start of the year we were on vector classic

[languid kayak]

the problem with vector is that dark skin was hacky solution, it'd be best to at least see what the new mediawiki brings, and LTS should be this year (no ETA when Kirrus will do an update though)

[proud cobalt]

Though it shouln't be that hard to find out how many people visit on mobile vs pc. It's probably just a matter of asking Kirrus

[languid kayak]

Though I see issues the current Wikipedia's vector is going, not sure if I prefer the new Vector or Citizen at this point lol

[languid kayak]

me and Vail have the stat access too, let me see

59.5% Desktop, 36.8% Smartphone, rest are tablets/phablets/other devices

[languid kayak]

https://tenor.com/view/gabe-newell-time-crowbar-half-life-gif-15650818

[proud cobalt]

So 60/40 except one guy on his TV 😆. Pretty even split

[languid kayak]

I think Vail started parsing the data, but not sure hiow far went with it? IIRC it's on one of his sandboxes still?

or maybe it is just the location that's pasrsed? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Vaileasys/sandbox

[languid kayak]

Actually, there's been over a dozen folks on the TV and two on a smart speaker! (and that's not a joke :D)

but yeah, overall close to 0% for these lol

[proud cobalt]

Alexa, how much damage does an axe do to trees

[proud cobalt]

Pretty sure the wiki parser does it already, Vail was just working on formatting it for the list pages. That's how we get equipped in infobox

[languid kayak]

Anyway, back to the discussion with the skin, I guess it's all valid points, though other than most of us taking time with stuff, there's two caveats if we'd make the poll

1. I'd wait for the wiki update anyway
2. If we'd make a poll, would it be better pre or post 42 with the influx of people? Also asking on any other place than here I guess, as default is mostly for folks not doind the edits (as logged in editors can change the skin), so I'd say you'd have to ask on place like Reddit I guess?

[flat sun]

i guess i'm the only one using timeless then 😅

[proud cobalt]

🫡 #pzwiki_editing message

I have converted to Citizen. / to search is too useful

[naive imp]

Well I hope vector 2022 isn't removed in its entirety, I quite like the dark mode current implementation too, shame to see it removed

[proud cobalt]

It won't be. It's the default mediawiki skin

[naive imp]

I hope it's not reverted until kirrus pushes the update for drak or light

[naive imp]

Ok good

[proud cobalt]

It's just that for the update i think the customization has to be removed? I think Vail said something like that when he was doing it. Keep in mind this was like March

Well before there was even a hint it would recieve dark mode native

[naive imp]

Well won't it have dark vs light after the update? Unless I misunderstood

Like as a core function

I'm not a web developer

[proud cobalt]

Yeah natively, it will be different to Vails implementation

[naive imp]

Ok that's what I thought

[proud cobalt]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Zomboid

Click dark mode on the right

[naive imp]

God I gotta learn coding to get with the flow of yall if ima get more into this

[proud cobalt]

Tbh you don't really, no way to automate stuff like locations

Also the langswitch is almost done, i think Vail just needs to finish the css for each skin
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:LangSwitch

Will be part of the header template

[naive imp]

So will that be added the same way with how the old {{languages}} used to be?

At the top of pGe

Page

[digital helm]

Exactly what Faal said. I'll make a note to take a look and fix it. The themes got a lot more complicated with the latest update, so I may have missed something

[digital helm]

Vector 2022 will stay and will only be updated to the latest version (which has its own citizen-like theme options). You can see it in action on Wikipedia. All the changes I made will be removed to be default

[digital helm]

Every time I go to finish it, something keep coming up irl

[naive imp]

Bro story if my fucking life

"Oh lemme do locations"

CALL FROM GIRLFRIEND

[digital helm]

Need more hours in the day

[naive imp]

Need to not work 14:00 to 22:00

[digital helm]

You can upload multiple files if you go to any page and just click and drag them in. No need to save the edit. If you edit a category, it'll automatically add those images to that category

[serene sage]

https://tenor.com/view/themoreyouknow-star-rainbowstreak-nbc-gif-4884642

[digital helm]

I used to work hours like that. I'd do nothing in the morning 😄

[proud cobalt]

Lol that's always how it goes

[proud cobalt]

Tell me about bad hours dude. I work a 24/7 roster down to the minute. I might start 1527 to 0013 one day and 1921 to 0400 the next

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Yummmers

https://tenor.com/view/yummers-a-train-homelander-the-boys-fat-gif-27701858

[languid kayak]

The only thing that itches me is that it adds underscores to category; was always wondering what causes it before figuring it's MsUpload adding those 😄

[quartz bear]

interesting

I can't see anything that puts underscores in msupload or moxie

looks like the underscores are there due to the wgPageName property

https://github.com/wikimedia/mediawiki-extensions-MsUpload/blob/e9301506790fbeee83e8e380fc534e0334efcc49/resources/MsUpload.js#L228

that's all I can say

[proud cobalt]

T shirts have been split, it was quite the task. I also made T-shirt and T-shirt (decal) separate articles. They all link together through variants

I'm not too worried about the bombs, not sure i'll get to them

[languid kayak]

Calvy to the rescue

[proud cobalt]

I'm also a little iffy on this one. I dont know enough about fishing to feel confident splitting it
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Fishing_Rod

[languid kayak]

@digital helm were you working on splitting the bombs already? If not, I could get into it, but not sure when I'll find some time; might have busy weekend and the rest of the week 😩

[proud cobalt]

I think Vail was just doing one as an example

He's trying to finish the Lang switch and tooltips afaik

[languid kayak]

There are two rod types:

• regular - results fishing rod without line
• crafted - results in stick

I tried to test it in debug but the fishing rods can't be broken reliably 😄

[proud cobalt]

Yeah but crafted isnt in this article 😆
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Fishing_Rod

[languid kayak]

I'm not sure how it was with the fishing rod line; I think it gets the same ID? Not sure anymore, I know I ressearched it back then

[proud cobalt]

The broken one is

I think broken having a different model is more of a bug

[languid kayak]

I think it's mostly fishing rof without line that would be split now? Ironically it was merged at one point 😄

[languid kayak]

yeah, hopefully it'll be fixed in b42, if not we'll have toreport it properly for fixing

I kinda hope the b42 release will be smooth enough for themajor blocker bugs as I'd gladly have the quirks reported fixed, but I got a feeling the first week of it unstable may be more of a focus on biggest stuff, unless it was already fixed internally as we're not aware 😄

[proud cobalt]

I think it would include any bug fixes part of the main branch

But thats a guess

Gee this was a while ago
#pzwiki_editing message

#pzwiki_editing message

[digital helm]

Yeah I did one as an example. I intended to get to the rest eventually, but didn't. Feel free to do them

[digital helm]

This year has gone too quick

[digital helm]

I've always thought it shouldn't be split, but then things could change in b42. The crafted fishing rod is already separate. It's just a different ID depending on the line used (twine or fishing line).

[proud cobalt]

Oh yeah with b42 fishing changes i probably wont split

[languid kayak]

oh right. And yeah, models are wrong iirc

oh right. And yeah, models are wrong iirc

oh right. And yeah, models are wrong iirc

Discord sent it thrice? lol

[lucid junco]

All work and no play makes Faalagorn a dull boy😄

[lucid junco]

Same feeling

Feel a bit left out during the code talk, though I have some basic knowlege of coding

[lucid junco]

@naive imp https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Produce_warehouses
page created

[naive imp]

Bro wth how

I bet that wreaks havoc on your sleep schedule

[peak valve]

Added section itemType;Count to https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Scripts_guide/Recipe_Script_Guide##Source#
Feel free to change the wording. I haven't tested it yet but semi-colon may also consume ThirstChange.

For reference = does will only effect quantity of Type = Food, items, not how much HungerChange (represented in-game with 'Hunger: -X') they have left. So Sugar=30, would consume 30 sugar items, regardless of the nutrition remaining.

[lucid junco]

I think Ive got all of them

[proud cobalt]

It definitely can, i was on late nights for 3 months, then finished at 2am, started the next day at 5am, did that for 2 weeks, then finished at 11am and started the next day at 7pm

[proud cobalt]

Finish the documentation of {{Infobox item}}, including linking to parameters from the Scripts guide/Item Script Parameters (the pages might be renamed before, though, see bot tasks and Project Modding). Is this something we still feel is neccesary? Particularly the second part? @languid kayak @digital helm

[proud cobalt]

Is this page soley based on a logo? Do we even know if this will be added? @naive imp It was created by you know who
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Outreach_Center

[rotund echo]

No one ever found it in the game world, or on the Zomboid Map Project?

[lucid junco]

Its just a logo in the game files as far as Im aware

And this gets its own page but not Fort Knox?

Fort at least has some info about it

[rotund echo]

I have the idea of creating articles, (or one all-encompassing article) for all the bodies of water in the game xD

[proud cobalt]

I havn't and i've been on the map quite a bit lately

[lucid junco]

All we know about outreach center that its in the Church tiles category

[proud cobalt]

Seems this one slipped under the radar

[rotund echo]

It has the vibe of an entertainment or fitness place though lmao

[lucid junco]

I say, remove the outreach and create the fort knox page

Aka doing the opposite we have now, with fort knox being where ever it is currently mentioned on the bottom of some page and outreach has its own empty page

[rotund echo]

Most of them don't even have stated names in the game, so any name I give them, its based on irl name and satellite imagery

[digital helm]

documentation should be done. The scripts links I think was just a nice to have that @languid kayak suggested

[lucid junco]

Thats everything we have about it

[rotund echo]

Thoughts?

[proud cobalt]

We do link them in history which is nice

[proud cobalt]

They don't particularly have any value, and i don't think we should name them without evidence

[lucid junco]

Nay

[proud cobalt]

We do have one for the river
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Ohio_River

[lucid junco]

If you really feel enthusiastic, sandbox it and show the class

[lucid junco]

Ohio river at least is commonly mentioned

[digital helm]

Pages for individual bodies of water might be a bit much. And as Calvy said, naming should be based on in-game or blog posts.
Might be something better suited for e.g. fishing, which may have some relevance with what's a good spot to fish. But other than that, I don't think so.
@naive imp your thoughts?

[lucid junco]

And is a significant part of the map

[lucid junco]

I think Ill put a del notice and quickly throw something together about fort instead

[proud cobalt]

We deleted the last one, maybe make a sandbox first
#pzwiki_editing message

To be fair, the last one was an extreme stub

Like one sentence stub

[lucid junco]

You know what else is a one sentence stub

[rotund echo]

Okay... Names should not come from real life equivalents, only from official materials or directly from the game world...

[lucid junco]

They can be as a trivia though

[proud cobalt]

Lmao im not defending that page 😄 But this is what the previous fort knox page looked like

[lucid junco]

At least for places thats completely fine

[rotund echo]

"Deerhead Lake" and "Knob Creek" are said in the game world though, lol

[lucid junco]

Nah, there are at least 3(!) sentences that can be wrote about it

[rotund echo]

"Salt River" is only the real name and the name is nowhere mentioned in the game world...

[lucid junco]

There is a https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Fort_Knox_Documentary

A https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Operation_Fort_Knox

Its mentioned in the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Knox_Event

There is also an interview from someone, who had escaped the Fort Knox contamination facility

And it was referred to by devs

So yeah, it definitely deserves a page imo

And it also has a logo

[lucid junco]

Is it me, or the lake looks nothing like a deer head

[rotund echo]

I have no idea lol, perhaps its northern side can be seen as an antler or something?

[lucid junco]

It looks more like a wishbone

[rotund echo]

If you look at it at an angle I guess it looks like a deer head or some other cervid?

The big island kinda looks like the eye and the small island looks like a nostril

[lucid junco]

Yeaah, kinda

[proud cobalt]

Looks like a goat to me

[lucid junco]

Feels like a Rorschach test lol

[rotund echo]

Dunno, but that's it's game name

"Deerhead Lake"

[lucid junco]

"Now what do you see on this picture"

[rotund echo]

I have no idea, it looks like a demon lol

[rotund echo]

Technically, Fort Knox kind of exists in the game, but only the dorms (March Ridge)

[digital helm]

Should be fixed now (these citizen media queries will be the death of me)

We good to add LangSwitch to the header template now? (so a language bar to every page)

Example here https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Vaileasys/sandbox_4

[proud cobalt]

No issues here 😄

[digital helm]

@languid kayak any issue?

[proud cobalt]

Ok B42 Preparation project renamed to B42 Update in line with B41 update. I think I got everything moved over including user boxes. Mainly pinging @digital helm as interim project leader

[digital helm]

thank you

[proud cobalt]

I'm going to add the revisions to the page version template, it wont actually do anything until we implement the logic and update the page past 41.78.16

[rotund echo]

What are you exactly doing in 42 Preparation

[proud cobalt]

Preparing for B42

In actuality, quite a lot

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/PZwiki:Project_Build_42_Update

Basically the entire wiki parser came as a byproduct of preparing for B42

[rotund echo]

Bolt cutters?

Finally an alternative instead of just sledging down the Louisville fences one by one

Claw hammer? That's already a thing in 41!

[proud cobalt]

Yeah looks like its getting renamed

[rotund echo]

It should be imo

I never call it by just "Hammer", I call it Claw Hammer, cuz it has an important distinction that other hammers don't have

Same goes for the hacksaw , or "Saw" in the game

[proud cobalt]

Or as they call them

Saw and Saw2

[rotund echo]

You know, initially I was genuinely confused "why can't I saw off shotgun with garden saw?"

So I looked for a hacksaw, found one, and it let me saw off the shotgun

[proud cobalt]

Which irl makes sense

But "Saw" and "Saw" doesn't help with that distinction

[rotund echo]

I thought in the game they did exactly the same things

I don't know what garden saw can do that hacksaw can't

So I always prefer hacksaws over garden saws

[digital helm]

going to look at playing with the logic tonight

I hope Axe gets renamed to Fire Axe. Would make the skill page name on the wiki more straightforward

[proud cobalt]

Pleaseeeee

[rotund echo]

Same

[proud cobalt]

Everyone already calls it fire axe

[rotund echo]

Personally I always just called it "Fire Axe"

Hell that reminds me

I made a minor error in the Rosewood strategy page

I said it was a good idea to begin axe-based character in Rosewood

[digital helm]

Almost have to call it fire axe, to not get it mixed up with the skill

[rotund echo]

But I accidentally linked the Fire Axe page instead of Axe skill page 😭

[languid kayak]

oh yeah, some were not renamed due to collisions, you should be able to rename them now.

[rotund echo]

Also, Rosewood is NOT low population as it is often said it is

[proud cobalt]

Ok revisions will be done in about 6 hours 😆

[languid kayak]

Also, I think I didn't announce it publicly, but thanks to Kirrus giving me and @digital helm sysops, @proud cobalt and @naive imp got the admin rights!

It's mostly for the convenience of deleting pages and their edits becoming autopatrolled, so I don't have to click through them, but they also have other rights. That is at least until we will set up more fine-grained roles in the future for the trusted user role (no ETA on this though, require modifying some files so not something me or Vail can do ourselves.)

The list of admins will probably be updated in the future with the PZwiki history being added to the wiki as a part of project history, and I will announce it properly in the summary next month too. 🙂

[languid kayak]

It was done previously by the beliefs it exist somewhere; it doesn't so I'm not sure we even need it. It's even less important than the Fort Knox page we redirect to future versions and I think the tile is not movable too.

[languid kayak]

this exactly 😄

[languid kayak]

That actually could become handy? As it's important to know for fishing (I think in b42 you won't be able to fish in smallest bodies of water, such as pools though). We already have Ohio River page

[languid kayak]

I'd go that route too, yeah.

[proud cobalt]

I think it goes on the new fishing page, more than having their own pages. Unless the fishing is complex enough that they should be split

[languid kayak]

Listing them on one page is what I meant too I believe. Though a list on fishing may be more visible indeed.

[digital helm]

I agree. Ultimately depends on b42 fishing

[rotund echo]

Albeit some major bodies of water don't have their own game names

• Large lake near Riverside city
• West Point river
• West Point lake by the mansions

Some bodies of water like Deerhead Lake and Knob Creek have their own game name though, or at least referenced

[digital helm]

At the very least, if they're named, they could be mentioned on the region pages

[rotund echo]

Actually, I mentioned "Salt River" in the Louisville page despite having no game name

[proud cobalt]

In my friend group fallas lake is called cock and balls town 😆 I don't think that will fly on the wiki

[languid kayak]

I think not? Though I didn't went through it too much tbh :F

[rotund echo]

In reality, I think it's called "Allen Lake"

[languid kayak]

setting all the redirects will be a PITA, that's where splitting comes handy though

[proud cobalt]

Send it @digital helm what's the worst that could happen

[digital helm]

Latest changes was just, only the most popular languages (with readers and editors) were added, so as to not take up too much space at the top of the page, and we decided on localised language names

[proud cobalt]

Lines up pretty well. I'm still hesitent without an in game reference, but i think you're correct

[digital helm]

It is done 🙏

[proud cobalt]

Chefs kiss
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Axe

Much more intuitive than hidden in the sidebar

[digital helm]

That should help a lot with getting people into translating

[proud cobalt]

And just tell people, hey, this exists in your language

[rotund echo]

It is the only one that matches up at all, hahaha

[proud cobalt]

@languid kayak I was playing around with ECT and i couldn't get anything over -9 to make any difference. Are you sure its iterations not quality?

[proud cobalt]

To me its clear cut. All we need is @thin cloud to confirm it. Is the creek that comes off the river at west point 'Salt River'

[rotund echo]

The small creek in Valley Station, I think it is called "Knob Creek"

Unlike "Salt River" though, that one has an actual game name

[thin cloud]

It's not lore until the name is mentioned in-game

[proud cobalt]

Ty

[digital helm]

Page version template is ready https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Page_version/sandbox so when b42 drops we just need to copy-paste the sandbox to the template (excluding doc stuff)

I already had pretty much all the logic done 😄 been so long I've forgotten what I've done. Was mostly just a case of copy-pasting the text

[proud cobalt]

I know it flies by

[digital helm]

@proud cobalt @naive imp you'll now have access to update this template (among others) https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Current_version#Updating it'll update the version everywhere such as the main page and templates that use it. Since build releases can go through periods of being quick, frequent and unexpected, feel free to jump on this and update to the latest!
In the past it was quite monotonous to update and easily forgotten (since there's so many other things happening)

And if anyone else notices it's outdated, ping them, myself or @languid kayak

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/LBMW_-_Kentucky_Radio#July_13_1993
Huh

I mean, there is only one base and its a Fort Knox

But there is also a research lab

[digital helm]

I believe they're referring to Fort Knox

[lucid junco]

Also fun fact

Fort Knox logo uses real life logo

W/o a tank sadly

[proud cobalt]

For now 😉

[rotund echo]

How come this "Outreach Center" has its own page just because it has a file in the game, but Fort Knox doesn't?

[lucid junco]

Thats what Im asking

And currently fixing

It had one sentence about it

But then became a redirect to the planned features page

[proud cobalt]

It shouldn't, thats why i brought it up. Fort knox doesnt because nobody had actually made an article with text yet

[rotund echo]

I wonder why they not gonna add Fort Knox in 42

Tbf the place looks like its own city

I guess the found it was easy to just add the dorms of Fort Knox because they can just copy paste the same house many times and call it a "town" (March Ridge)

[lucid junco]

https://x.com/lemmy101/status/1504124747914829830

I hate twitter since I cant see the content without logging in

[rotund echo]

Ok, so they want actual living peoples at Fort Knox?

Not just a huge zombie infested shithole?

[proud cobalt]

It will probably be defended

[rotund echo]

Because Fort Knox sounds exactly like its gonna be infested with tons of zombies, like the prison or Crossroads

[lucid junco]

He said the forbidden name

https://tenor.com/view/throwing-tomatoes-spongebob-meme-gif-26952964

[rotund echo]

Hell March Ridge has shown us that they're gonna cram tons of zombies in the rest of Fort Knox

[proud cobalt]

https://tenor.com/view/there-is-no-war-in-ba-sing-se-dai-li-agent-avatar-the-last-airbender-atla-gif-16455523

There are no zombies in PZ

[rotund echo]

Do not fucking say T#####wn P##za

Or V####y St####n

Those are triggers

[lucid junco]

Oh

It was deleted

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Fort_Knox
Page Created 2.0

@naive imp @languid kayak

For some reason <br> does not work?

[digital helm]

At least until the 13th of July 😉

[digital helm]

should've been a reply 😆

[digital helm]

line breaks work weird on citizen. Use double return/enter

Assuming this is what you were after? https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Fort_Knox&type=revision&diff=649723&oldid=649633

[lucid junco]

Yep

[digital helm]

Page looks good at a glance btw

[languid kayak]

yet

[languid kayak]

It's reserved for (military) NPC, at least from what we heard before

[languid kayak]

yeah this 😄

[languid kayak]

new posts should be on bluesky too (which I'd love to link more than X (formerly known as Twitter) too 😄

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Unknown_location – currently just the Outreach center is sitting there; the only possible use would be so the tile isn't unused as sharpgolden already stretchedi t out, but other than that, there's little value in the page indeed

Especially as we don't have any confirmation if/when it's going to be used at all

[lucid junco]

I call it (E)X Twitter

[proud cobalt]

Looks good

[rotund echo]

Should I reference March Ridge in that page, or no

[digital helm]

I would. I've always seen March Ridge as housing for Fort Knox

but I don't think there's any in-game confirmation of that. Other than a potential security gatehouse

[lucid junco]

You know, Im also an admin of sorts. I wish for pages to be deleted and they magically get deleted after some time

https://tenor.com/view/you-know-im-something-of-a-scientist-myself-scientist-donald-kimball-gif-14910706

[rotund echo]

Knox Military Apartments, but that's just a name

Might mean something though

[languid kayak]

There's a military apartment

[languid kayak]

name and loot with annotated map

[naive imp]

I meant to make that a redirect to planned features too but forgot

[naive imp]

Looks alright I suppose, more of a lore page than location

[languid kayak]

Location
South of Louisville
is it confirmed? Also pinging @lucid junco

[naive imp]

Don't think so but don't quote me

[rotund echo]

I mean, that's where the real Fort Knox is located

[naive imp]

Yeah but if I recall correctly they wanted to tie March Ridge to Fort Knox

Like as a suburb of the base

[rotund echo]

Yes

Actually, no, March Ridge irl WITHIN Fort Knox

Satelitte imagery shows that the place is made up of cookie cutter houses!

[languid kayak]

https://pzwiki.net/w/images/1/18/Knox_County_Prospect_Map.jpg

[naive imp]

Just like the actual one!

In the game I mean lol

[rotund echo]

So yes, technically Fort Knox exists already in Zomboid

[naive imp]

That's a reach lol

[languid kayak]

from https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Knox_County_Prospect_Map.jpgI think it was from some Mondoid?

[rotund echo]

*a part of Fort Knox

[lucid junco]

Its more of a lore location rn

That is commonly mentioned

[naive imp]

Well that's like saying that you technically have a pie but it's just the crust in the oven

Nothing in a completed state

[naive imp]

Agreed

[lucid junco]

At least it has something going for it

Unlike the outreach

[naive imp]

I totally forgot about that place lol

[lucid junco]

How could you

Its the most famous location

Or.. Sign.. In the game

[naive imp]

Source?

[lucid junco]

It has its page

Not every sign is worthy enough to become a wiki page

But the outreach has

Obv due to the popular demand

[naive imp]

Well there's a bunch of other signs too

Not just that one lol

But I agree tho

[lucid junco]

Sadly Ill be the party killer

And put the deletion notice on it

Sorry outreachers

You weren't centered enough

[rotund echo]

ok, updated Fort Knox page

Added March Ridge to it

[lucid junco]

Still forget the difference between its and it's

[rotund echo]

"it's" = "it is"

[lucid junco]

IELTS 8.0 guys

[rotund echo]

"its" is like, a possessive pronoun lol

[rotund echo]

Why must you discriminate

Even something like the West Point dentist sign gets its own article

We must also create an individual article for "Crossroads Mall" logo

And all other building logos and labels in the game!!!

[lucid junco]

The what mall logo?

https://tenor.com/view/goku-prowler-goku-goku-mad-goku-dbs-dbs-gif-11120329515669448575

[lucid junco]

Yeah, I know, but sometimes I write it as "it's"

[serene sage]

obviously the one from dawn of the dead

totally not the smaller mall in project zomboid just outside of louisville

[languid kayak]

Does it still need improve? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Brandenburg#Businesses

[languid kayak]

huh, these apparently were sharpened @lucid junco? https://projectzomboid.com/blog/news/2021/07/its-coming-to-roam/

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Family_dentistry_logo.png https://projectzomboid.com/blog/content/uploads/2021/07/dentist.jpg
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Deep_fried_heaven_logo.png https://projectzomboid.com/blog/content/uploads/2021/07/dfh.jpg
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Juke_Box_Bowling_logo.png https://projectzomboid.com/blog/content/uploads/2021/07/bowling.jpg
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:News_now_network_logo.png https://projectzomboid.com/blog/content/uploads/2021/07/NNN.jpg

Though these are jpg

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Juke_Box_Bowling_logo.png https://projectzomboid.com/blog/content/uploads/2021/07/bowling.jpg
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:News_now_network_logo.png https://projectzomboid.com/blog/content/uploads/2021/07/NNN.jpg
(sending again for miniatures)

[languid kayak]

btw https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Special:WhatLinksHere/Scarecrow is already in the game

[languid kayak]

I found that https://projectzomboid.com/blog/news/2014/02/drake-onian-measures/ pretty much confirms that the Drake is a reference to Rathlord, I'll updated https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Easter_eggs#The_Indie_Stone accordingly

[proud cobalt]

Thats a different page, its for the tiles themselves

[proud cobalt]

Not used though right? Only mannequins?

[languid kayak]

yup

[languid kayak]

is shows 😛 https://pzwiki.net/wiki/8953

or https://pzwiki.net/wiki/7192_2

and https://pzwiki.net/wiki/7539_2

[languid kayak]

https://projectzomboid.com/blog/news/2022/04/41-69-unstable-niiice/

[lucid junco]

The main issue is that damn checkboard bg

Used a programm to remove it for now

Looks good in my opinion

Or at least fine

[naive imp]

Looks better imo

What functional purpose does the checkerboard serve?

[lucid junco]

Reminder to install cs source

[lucid junco]

@naive imp @languid kayak

Juke box is more complicated and will definetly require me to do manually

These are the best results I got

And none of them I can call good

[naive imp]

I literally can't tell the difference

You must be a perfectionist lol

[languid kayak]

It's so all colors and transparency as visible. They just seem to use a weird color scheme

[languid kayak]

3rd one looks the best imho

[lucid junco]

Yes

I think you could tell a difference if you were looking for it

Mainly the gaps in the letters and note

[naive imp]

Bro

99 percent of people will not care lol

[serene sage]

I still can't see the difference

they're the same picture

[lucid junco]

I mean

No one complained about how signs made by you know who looked

Id nevertheless want wiki readers to have the best experience possible

And not have eyes of people like me burn off just by the look at it

[naive imp]

Your work over Ikips is definitely noticeably better but I don't think most people are as meticulous as you, referencing the bowling sign lol

[lucid junco]

Huh

https://map.projectzomboid.com/#12639x1914x4062

Ive never noticed that life and living shows are in the same building as NNN

Maybe L&L is a part of the NNN?

[proud cobalt]

Do we refer to it as Knox Event or Knox event? As in should event be capitalised?

Page is currently Knox Event

[rotund echo]

I guess decapitalize the first e

Usually for incidents/accidents/disasters, they don't capitalize

"Chernobyl disaster"
"Three Mile Island accident"

[lucid junco]

Its capitalized in the Twitter The Knox Event in Real Time posts

Its also capitalized in the radio broadcasts

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/LBMW_-_Kentucky_Radio#July_9_1993

[languid kayak]

Yeah, I'm the picky one too 😄

[languid kayak]

I think we had a note that they share studio somewhere?

[languid kayak]

Knox Event, title case

The only instance it's lowercase it's in survival guide, and it's probably a typo:

lua/shared/Translate/EN/SurvivalGuide_EN.txt:15: -- ///<LINE> <H1> PLACING INVENTORY ITEMS <BR> <TEXT> Right click on most inventory items for a 'place item' option. This will allow you to place the item wherever you want outside of a container. (Larger movable world items like furniture can also be picked up and placed using the 'movables' option at the top left. See page 5 of this guide for more information). Remember to keep the Knox event tidy! <BR>///
Pinging @thin cloud if it's not already fixed for B42 😄

[thin cloud]

Is a typo

[languid kayak]

@serene sage you better update the build 42 when on your page btw 😄

When Build 42 according to my credible source
November 28, 2024

[languid kayak]

oh, a milestone (kinda)

[lucid junco]

Devs should release b42 for that milestone

[languid kayak]

well, there's over 4200 English pages for a while, hint hint

@proud cobalt is this correct that both https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Reflective_Sunglasses and https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Shooting_Glasses have the same model?

[proud cobalt]

Oops nope fixed 😄

Wait crap fixed the wrong one

Ok both should be right now

[languid kayak]

btw, I love how https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Image_improvement_needed has been shrinking 😄

[proud cobalt]

It hadn't moved in quite some time, and when it did it was growing lol. I got a few models done

Also some Logos done by Sharp that hadn't had the Mbox removed

[languid kayak]

ah, apparently we missed https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Belly_Button_Ring as it's had It's variants., apostrophe and a full stop 😛

[proud cobalt]

I only added it a few days ago

[rotund echo]

Hey guys, here's my take on how I think Valley Station can be zoned into separate "districts", lol

[languid kayak]

Do we have a page about the camp below crossroads?

[lucid junco]

Yes

There was a guy named "sharpgolden" that had created it

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Summer_camp_(Valley_Station)

He is really sketchy though

I think he just took the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Camp_Busy_Beaver
as a template

Id check if the page is good enough if I were you

[rotund echo]

So the "Riverbanks Valley Station" is where the highway goes through, and all the stuff built near or next to the highway are at, and of course that's the place that is bordered by the Ohio River

"Knob Creek" is like, this little neighborhood place within the trees, it has the hunting lodge, that's where I got the name from

Crossroads Mall is self explanatory, also includes the upscale houses and construction sites nearby

"Inner Valley Station" is well... Random farmlands, homesteads, deep forests...

[languid kayak]

that's a neat guy!

[rotund echo]

Is the far western side of the map (Deerhead Lake, far western pit stop) still considered as "Doe Valley"?

[languid kayak]

Technically, shouldn't it be "Knob Creek Hunting lodge" or "Knob Creek Hunting"? Since lodge isn't part of the sign? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Knob_Creek_Hunting_Sign

[rotund echo]

But the actual building itself says "Knob Creek Hunting Lodge"

[lucid junco]

Yes

[rotund echo]

Seems weird by me, the farmlands ends there

[lucid junco]

I think entirety of the Deerhead lake belongs to Doe Valley currently

Mostly due to inclusion of the western highway pitstop

[rotund echo]

But then again it's decently far away from the farmlands

[lucid junco]

Eh, its fine right now I think

Later on we can either make Deerhead lake a separate thing or incorporate it into the other area

[lucid junco]

Knob creek maybe should be a bit bigger?

[rotund echo]

I guess it should encompass the entire creek, hahaha

[lucid junco]

I think at least the entire forest area around the hunting lodge

Since there are hunting cabins there

[rotund echo]

I think those are towers?

[lucid junco]

There is a cabin separated by the fence near the upper houses

And a tower near the edge of the forest

[rotund echo]

Yes, I see those

[lucid junco]

Id extend the knob creek hunting zone then to the edges of the forest

[rotund echo]

Sure

[rotund echo]

I also included the inn, bar, soup kitchen, cafe, and neighborhood in the "Knob Creek" zone though hahaha

[lucid junco]

I think its fine

[serene sage]

right, gotta go check my crystal ball again

done, it's december 17

very credible, I know

[lucid junco]

It drops january 7th

https://tenor.com/view/flute-dome-jay-easy-mega-man-megaman-listen-gif-6959961882371481712

[serene sage]

your predictor is inaccurate

[languid kayak]

41.78.16 was 20th, so after that it'd be 2 years without updates

[serene sage]

2 years is a long time to not have any updates

[languid kayak]

yeah, indeed, my bad 😄 https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Knob_creek_hunting_lodge_logo.png

which I think should be main logo?

as the other is just the entrance sign?

I think I'll go forward and update

[lucid junco]

Debatable

Not by me, but by the fact that entrance signs are used for other businesses

Namely https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Mccoy_logging_co_logo.png
And
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Pony_Roam-O_logo.png

[languid kayak]

Technically the page is about the building, but on the other than there's just this

You want me to revert?

Although for McCoy and Pony Roam-a there's no signs on buildings

Speaking of McCoy, is that reversed in game too? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Franklin_Valuline_Mccoy.png

[languid kayak]

Did we ever reached a conclusion on that? @naive imp @lucid junco? I think hardware store would be more fitting despite the E.P. Tools and Nails & Nuts Tool Store ? Thoughts?

[lucid junco]

https://tenor.com/view/ace-attorney-hold-it-wait-wright-phoenix-gif-11598650

https://map.projectzomboid.com/#5666x9208x153

[naive imp]

We never reach a conclusion but I agree yes

[languid kayak]

sex act

[lucid junco]

Damn, whoever wrote it should be ashamed

Oh

[languid kayak]

WE have the and Fallas Lake, so quite fitting.

[lucid junco]

So, there is another logo that is used for mccoyloggingco

Its found on containers and buildings

I guess no one bothered to put it on wiki

Or it was made by you know who, then got deleted due to being unused

I think it would be more appropriate?

Its more widely used than sign

Where its only seen near the main logging/production facility

[languid kayak]

loc should be https://map.projectzomboid.com/#10338x9315x9750 but indeed

[languid kayak]

I didn't really deleted any, so I guess no one simply put one?

[lucid junco]

I dont remember assembling it either

Ill look in the straight files sheets when Im done backing up my data

[lucid junco]

Fine with both

Hardware would be more appropriate, since tools aren't the only thing that is sold there

[lucid junco]

Pony roam has an advert with better(?) quality that can be used as a sign

Though ThinkDock said nay and Im not so sure myself

[languid kayak]

Since we have movables now, we have a separate page for pickable signs https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Pony_Roam-o_Sign so maybe we could reconsider? Idk

[lucid junco]

Its movable?

[languid kayak]

seems so?

I didn't check in-game

[lucid junco]

Oh, it also uses legless, straight version

[languid kayak]

the pages were made automatically based on game files

not all tile images were uploaded, mind you

especially the multi-tile ones

(especially since there's no easy way to stitch them automatically)

[languid kayak]

wait, it was actually December 12th! So by your prediction we'll be 2 years without updates 🙀

[lucid junco]

I mean, Ive uploaded all of the sign images that Ive worked on I think

[languid kayak]

I had a plan to compare the zip you shared, but I never did 😄

[lucid junco]

It will become outdated the second b42 drops

Since Ill be redoing most of them

[languid kayak]

I found that https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Knox_Country/es is based on the old version of the page, and there's quite some red links to English pages, though I wouldn't want to straight out delete parts of the pages, as it's all translated 🤔

I found the page when looking what uses https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Secret_Base.png (now marked for deletion)

Actually, I may hold off a little, as https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Secret_Facility.png has no trees

[languid kayak]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Trait#Overview – I guess that 41.50 part could be verified? Look outdated when we're nearing b42

[flat sun]

this is sort of misleading, it's not a bug that it's not applied, it's a bug that it's shown

it used to be more ambiguous but late in b41 they added a sandbox option to set whether the bonus gets applied, which defaults to off so obviously that was always the intended behaviour

it should probably be rewritten to say that it shows even if you have it disabled

[languid kayak]

(which also is a default state), sound sane, yeah

btw, seeing all these kind of links, as I'm currently going through the region pages, cleaning up a little:

<span class="plainlinks">[https://map.projectzomboid.com/#10629x9441 10629x9441]</span>
Shouldn't we have a template for PZmap so these are easier to type? Like {{Loc|10629x9441}}? Pinging @digital helm for this

[languid kayak]

I guess we should add Businesses table to https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Abandoned_town#Businesses as well?

[languid kayak]

I was about to respond to somehting else, but found this too; seems we still don't have the other logo except the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Chevalier_Nyala_Taxi2.png and the only one is Spiffo's one 😄 https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Taxi_adverts

And this one is the one I wanted to reply to originally, since I'm improving the region pages now, the red link on https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Exclusion_Zone_border still stands 🤔

btw @proud cobalt you plan on updating oldids once right after b42 finally drops or most of my edits nowadays would be followed by that https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Fallas_Lake&type=revision&diff=652471&oldid=652469 :P?

[proud cobalt]

I can run it after/when B42 is given a date/time, it should only update pages that have actually changed so shouldn't be a 19 hours process like it was the first time

[digital helm]

We do. Just doesn't get used. Has the world icon too though. It's Template:Coordinates

Happy to modify/create a new one

[proud cobalt]

Can you link me a page with this? I can do it

[proud cobalt]

Unless we're happy with this

[rotund echo]

Revamped Valley Station district map

[languid kayak]

oh right, I forgot about it, definitely should be used on the location pages. Maybe better to do that with a bot than manually? Possible bot task for @proud cobaltBot?

[proud cobalt]

Can you link me a page with how it's used? I will look at swapping it

[languid kayak]

I'd assume <span class="plainlinks">[https://map.projectzomboid.com/#13110x1508 13110x1508]</span> to {{Coordinates|13110x1508}} – there may be typos when first and the second number doesn't match, but these should be addressed manually

Probably best to see in sandbox first?

[proud cobalt]

Will look into it now

[languid kayak]

in case the world icon will make tables too large

(then we can adjust the coordinates template)

[frosty forge]

So when will you update?

[proud cobalt]

Not sure what you mean

[languid kayak]

IMHO it's fine https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Louisville&type=revision&diff=652479&oldid=652473

[frosty forge]

I say game update

[proud cobalt]

We are not the developers

[languid kayak]

it's #pzwiki_editing channel, and we're just players just like you

[frosty forge]

Does it mean a specific time or not?

[rotund echo]

Are you more editor than player though? XD

[languid kayak]

it's about the edits on https://pzwiki.net/ – a wiki for Project Zomboid based on the info we have.

[proud cobalt]

https://tenor.com/view/madagascar-skipper-weve-been-ratted-out-boys-ratted-out-penguins-of-madagascar-gif-22640063

@languid kayak Check if you're happy with this
https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=User:Calvy/sandbox2&diff=prev&oldid=652483

Otherwise i can make removing the icon a param?

[languid kayak]

no point in bumping the oldids then, as I think bots would still pick them up as a new edit 😄

[proud cobalt]

It also cuts 40,000 bytes off the LV article 😆

[languid kayak]

There are two grocery stores in Riverside – is that correct? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Riverside#Retail_&_Commercial Both are Riverside's but the second one doesn't have the page?

[languid kayak]

yeah, looks fine to me 😄

[languid kayak]

and shouldn't businesses be split here too? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Scenic_Grove_Mobile_Home_Park#Businesses

[tulip kiln]

Ye it's got a few grocery stores hang on, lemme get em. https://map.projectzomboid.com/#5980x5354x3286 There's 2 right there. https://map.projectzomboid.com/#6144x5369x3164 The Milk n More near Spiffos, and this in the downtown area, https://map.projectzomboid.com/#6344x5296x9086

Although some of em are called convenience stores in pzmap instead. Not sure if there's too much of a difference.

So to my knowledge, at least 4 grocery stores/convienece stores in the town.

Wait, 5 if we're counting GigaMart

[languid kayak]

I wonder if it should get a new page then 😄

But well, I assume the coords are right and it's linking the generic page, so I guess it's fine?

[tulip kiln]

Well it depends, pretty sure there's actually a difference between grocery stores and supermarkets irl. But I dunno if we care about that.

I'd say GigaMarts should stay under their own pages since they're drastically different from the standard grocery stores if that's what we talking bout

[languid kayak]

Either way, gonna hop off to sleep now, will continue later. I just finished going through the locations, adjusting tables so the widths are no longer limited, should be wider whichi hopefully should be better for larger screens. I did some cleanups too.

Before that, I updated the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Brandenburg https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Ekron and https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Irvington giving them a proper infobox and tables based on info we have, I'll probably do some further things tomorrow (like add Crossroads Mall and Grand Ohio Mall to infobox)

[rotund echo]

So, what do you guys think?

[naive imp]

I think it looks good

[rotund echo]

Nice

[pure osprey]

Hell yeah

[lucid junco]

Ill upload it roughly this evening

[lucid junco]

Same answer for this😅

Ill throw something together

[lucid junco]

Loot table difference mainly

Convenience stores cant spawn groceries

And they have meds unlike grocery stores(I think)

[lucid junco]

Gigamart is a general store

It has its own Gigamart roomdef that is also used in general stores

[rotund echo]

Its how I found a sledge in one lol

[lucid junco]

Gigamart is currently in the hypermarket category

[rotund echo]

But yes, GigaMarts are general stores, like irl supermarkets

[lucid junco]

While some like https://pzwiki.net/wiki/My_Sunday_Market
Are definitely supermarkets

[lucid junco]

It seems like definition of supermarket has to be decided upon for us to reach any conclusion

[proud cobalt]

Done

[rotund echo]

Ok fair

[proud cobalt]

Grocery store: Only sells food
Supermarket: Sells food and 'household goods'. IRL this would be cleaning supplies, etc
Hypermarket (Department store?): Sells everything, Wallmart equivalent. Tools, Food, Clothes etc

Is that how we want to go for PZmap

I added the MilkNMore in Riverside to the map too

[lucid junco]

Corner store/convenience store - sells meds, but no groceries

[proud cobalt]

Snacks and drinks too, but no fresh food

[lucid junco]

I think the in game difference is the size, grocery stores have just the store part, while supermarkets also have cafe/butchers/bakery

[naive imp]

Agreed

[naive imp]

Well the GigaMart would be a supermarket

The only hypermarket I can think of in pz would be at the grand Ohio Mall there's a multilevel department store

Like a sears or something

But I'd say put as dept store not hypermarket

[lucid junco]

I mean, hypermarket is the type of supermarket

[proud cobalt]

I got CalvyBot working on my NAS so i dont have to run my pc all the time, especially during B42. Idk how you daily drive linux @languid kayak it's so foreign to me 😆

[languid kayak]

Going from Windows to Linux without dual boot was a month of so getting used to, but payed out in the end 😄

Especially dealing with the Windowses in my work lol

[digital helm]

If the icon is an issue, we can add a parameter to remove it. I'll also create a shorthand template for it that'll be coord. Never got around to it because it wasn't really used
@proud cobalt

[proud cobalt]

Looks good to me, I like that it has the Tooltip I think it adds to the pages. Have a look at Louisville if you wanna see how it looks

[proud cobalt]

Yeah it's CLI debian, just a very different experience. Even simple things like copy pasting it all just requires actually knowing the commands

[digital helm]

I like it. I think the icon is good

[languid kayak]

loc would be shortest, but nam os different so idk?

otoh we don't really have to shorten it that much, it's not ll after all

[languid kayak]

desktop de arw a bit different, I just ctrl+shift+v stuff, on windows I remember oddities too, though it was before powrrshell

[languid kayak]

oh yeah, about the new towns:

• https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Brandenburg#Businesses – this one's the most complete with most of research done, not much to do there until b42, unless someone want to move other locations to proper table (which will happen after b42 anyway)
• https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Ekron#Businesses this one technically could be filled guesses on guesstimates by the roads that's why I left this section as a stub, but it's much work for little benefit, given the b42 release.
• https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Irvington#Businesses not much to add until b42. Coords would be a total guesses.

[proud cobalt]

How long have you been using Linux full time for? Ive played around with lots of cmd (making prank bat files as a kid) on Windows and raspi stuff which is debian. But never seriously like my NAS. The only part I really struggle with is permissions, groups and users and how programs interact with stuff. That's all really new for me. Don't tell anyone but I just chmod 777 stuff I don't care about 😂

I have a samba share for local access and even that still messes with me

[proud cobalt]

Yeah me too. Idk if we need it shortened though

[lucid junco]

https://map.projectzomboid.com/#2681x6312x34154
Have you included the small liquor store in the mobile houses area

I dont see it in the list

[proud cobalt]

@languid kayak do you have plans on going through the Help and style guide before B42? I'm thinking of putting together a little FAQ for when people ask questions here too.

Boilerplate item looks good. Maybe @naive imp wants to take a quick look at boilerplate locations? Locations will be the main area of manual additions.

[languid kayak]

I had plans yes, I actually remembered there was something else to change, but forgot what – but whether I'd do it is questionable as I will have stuff to do irl and I'll probably do something lighter on wiki with spare time 🤔

Boilerplate locations are Thinkdock's yeah.

We could update the instructional images for help pages too, since the skin changes – despite the discussion with @naive imp and I think it was @lucid junco prefering Vector, I'd say it'd be best to keep the Citizen for now, and pospone the changes post b42 (and see what new mediawiki lts will bring; it's not yet finalized).

(Also, back to discussion as far as Citizen skin goes, the good stuff is that keep in mind they are open for ideas, we actually had an issue fixed quite fast https://github.com/StarCitizenTools/mediawiki-skins-Citizen/issues/845 – just took us to update since Kirrus had to update manually, so if there are just minor gripes, that's a plus if we want it fixed the GitHub issue is a good option, not sure how MediaWiki skin is on that matter).

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Special:Version#mw-version-skin we're at 2.29.0 btw, https://starcitizen.tools/Special:Version#mw-version-skin they are always on latest release (2.39.2 as of writing), and also mediawiki lts so if there's a pressing improvement, we should be able to upgrade.

[languid kayak]

feel free to add 😄

it wasn't me who made the list btw for Brandenburg

seems it was Roudrick https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Brandenburg&diff=434495&oldid=434463 – not sure they're here with us on Discord?

[languid kayak]

more than 8 years now: https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/User:Faalagorn

The fun part is, that I never really planned on switching, was using Windows 98 SE, ME, XP, Vista, 7, 8, 8.1 and 10 and were happy with all of them (ME, Vista, and 8.0 included), but what irked me is that it started changing things automatically for me (was some minor nuance, like disabling regedit fix for skipping welcome screen).

On the other hand, I had really tiny experience with Linux (literally just using live CD Knoppix when I was a kid and lessons at University), and I deep dived to manually installing Arch Linux without a desktop environment after a couple of beers (true story lol), wiping windows totally.

Wife followed shortly after, but she kept dual booting for a while. I only tried VM passthrough and then a second 80 GB drive just for Escape from Tarkov, but nowadays I decided I won't bother for this game alone (online won't work due to them using custom function from BattlEye and both BSG and BattlEye are not responsive on that; we tried as a community on several occasions – we have Discord for that, I'm an admin there now and game runs fine offline, but online clearly it's like hitting the wall, so we all lost the interest).

Which is funny as in 2016 it was basically just the native game on Steam Linux, until DXVK popped and Valve took interest in reinvigorating linux as a gaming platform :D. Though I've been eyeing https://gamingonlinux.com/ for a while before a switch

[proud cobalt]

Yeah absolutely happy to have this discussion when we go to the new LTS version and have the updated Vector22 skin. But let's just get through B42 first while we wait on Kirrus for that

Hopefully we will get visual editing at that time too. It's a waiting game

[languid kayak]

yeah, not itching me personally, but editors could surely use it

especially the new ones

[proud cobalt]

The dulling down of windows has been awful for power users and enthusiasts. Particularly the half passed effort with settings. Control panel still exists, but thoroughly nerfed, half of its moved to settings app. But some of the buttons in settings app just open the old windows anyway like the xp network window or sound settings

The one thing that would make me consider switching, would be SteamOS desktop support, and a really good search tool. Windows search sucks so bad now, even with tweaks.

Oof I fell you on tarkov. I don't personally like it but my friends do. What a mess. Especially Linux. EA completely wiping Linux from apex legends too. Siege banned a huge amount of innocent Linux players (using battleye).

But it's scary 😆 Linux is just scary like that. All I've known is Windows

[proud cobalt]

Yeah it's fine for me now, just using preview when I was new. But much nicer with visual editing for new users

I'm on Windows 11, have been since the first day it released into the stable early channel. Thank God within 24 hours there was a tool to reinstate the right click panel. I actually forgot they had changed it until I used my partners pc.

[languid kayak]

I use everything for searching on Windows, but there are some other minor quirks like

• NTFS being the default file system, and it's ancient, defragmentation doesn't have to be done manually and it's less issue on SSD, but there's constantly a work on the drive
• closing down taking ages (they circumvented it with normal shutdown not closing the whole os lol)
• huge area for vulnerabilities (at least there's firewall and defender does something, but still, also causes forced updates)
• no option to disable tracking fully (there are mods for that, but they disable windows update)
• no way to reliably update all apps (the whole system update on arch for several gb of software takes less than one update on windows)

[proud cobalt]

I tried using a spotlight type search tool for Windows, but just couldn't build the habit. Maybe I should try again.
I have most of the call home features disabled, but no mods so it still does its things. I know wine has gotten better particularly in the 20s, or so I've heard. Maybe I should look at switching 🤔

I found today that CalvyBot can search about 8x faster on an I7 7700 VS my Ryzen 5800X now that it's on Linux. That one kind of opened my eyes.

Also Nvidia recently committed to open source Linux drivers, at least partially, which is a huge step forward

[languid kayak]

yeah, I've been running wireshark with VM once, to see what it sends 😄 Not end of the world, but it's definitely a peace of mind when you at least can in theory have control (OTOH, I use Android which technically is open source, but calls Google for everything, so yeah) waht your OS is doing.

There's been rumors Valve may push SteamOS ecosystem further for something like steam machines 2.0, so we'll see how it goes. They have the ecosystem for it set properly at least now, learned from their mistakes.

[digital helm]

A wiki FAQ would be good. The style guide has slowly gotten bigger, and a bit cumbersome for.

[languid kayak]

I had impression it'd be FAQ for something like Reddit or Discord, but nevertheless an easy to copy short welcome guide to get up to speed would be nice on wiki anyway

[proud cobalt]

We have {{Welcome}} which does a decent job. I was also thinking a discord pin

If we get onto using welcome for new editors, it could have the same effect

[languid kayak]

The only issue with {{Welcome}} is that I don't distribute it 😄 But if anyone want to take care of it, I'd be welcome indeed 😉

[proud cobalt]

I updated it a little, I'll try start using it. Maybe start giving out freshling too

[languid kayak]

not sure these two should be categorized Pzwiki? Not sure what category they should be though 😛

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Project_Zomboid_Map_Project
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Undeniable.info

The first one is a heavily underlinked page about Pzmap, redirect from map.projectzomboid.com POI guidelines, the other is revamped sidebar so we won't lose nolan's links (also not really linked to)

[proud cobalt]

OK here's the FAQ. I'll edit the message for anything else we want to add

Wiki FAQ and how to help!

Thanks for taking interest in helping PZwiki. Here are some answers for common questions:

Q1: How can I help?
A: Read our getting started guide here:
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Help:Contents

Then our localised effort for B42 can be found here:
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/PZwiki:Project_Build_42_Update

Q2: Why is the wiki updating already?
A: This was a hard decision. We are a small community of volunteers. Starting now gives us the best opportunity to have the wiki up to date for each stable release.

Q3: How can I see information for Build 41?
A: Click the link in the banner that shows the page version, or open the page history to see each version of the page.

Q4: I don't like how the wiki looks
A: You're in luck! The default skin has support for user preferences without login. This includes light and dark mode, page width, and text size.

Q5: I still don't like how the wiki looks
A: The old skins are still available to use in user preferences. However, this requires an account. Wiki accounts do not require email verification, and can be made in seconds.

[digital helm]

Pzwiki is the best for now, unless we wanted to create a new one imo

[languid kayak]

btw, I kinda feel I should upload the images with visible text before totally replacing the vehicle images from https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Pages_requested_for_deletion but are we good to replace the icons? Should we do that with bot or manually? Pinging @digital helm and @proud cobalt for that

[proud cobalt]

I don't trust the image swapper currently, so would say manually

[languid kayak]

Guys, I'm not sure about our style guide anymore, are traits lowercase too? @digital helm

[dull escarp]

Hello everyone I have a problem, I want to put a zone with spawn loot in the trash, but after I put the zone, walls appear. The floor is set, how to make sure that the walls do not appear and do not block the trash

[lucid junco]

Probably better to ask in #1019767076094758924 I think

[dull escarp]

thanks

[languid kayak]

or maybe #mod_support

[languid kayak]

I've been sitting on this one by @rotund echo – are we sure which building is the "correct" one? They are indeed twice. Pinging @lucid junco and @naive imp for opinions as well https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Oak_Park_Apartments&curid=28399&diff=634203&oldid=527793

Also @lucid junco are you sure that's the reference? For me it seems farfetched, or maybe it's just a saying I don't hear? https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Mead,_Drink_and_Bloody_Merry&curid=28443&diff=652249&oldid=602067

For me it sounds like a similar sayings like, "Sex, Drugs and Rock & Roll" (which I think may be closer in this aspect?)

[languid kayak]

I made some screens in debug with plans to replace the radial ones without the text with the ones with text at
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:VehicleGas1.png and https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:VehicleGas2.png but I'm having second thoughts now; maybe the one without text would be better overall as the text is English only?

[naive imp]

Whatever building has the sign on it is the correct one. If the building is an exact copy I see no reason not to state so

Can leave it as is imo

[digital helm]

I hadn't heard that one before either. Sex, drugs and rock & roll seems more likely to me. Or even this https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wine,_women_and_song

[digital helm]

I think what we have in the style guide is fine (may be reworded though). Similar situation as items imo. Capitalised in lists, but lowercase in sentences.

[languid kayak]

both have the sign 😄

[rotund echo]

Not only that, they both have the same interior furniture layout

So its just a straight up copy and paste

[languid kayak]

Took longer than expected, but https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Pages_requested_for_deletion is back to being empty now 🎉

All the table icons are now used exclusively from https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Table_UI_icons too.

There are still three icons that could be redone to 32x32 colorful in-game icons, like the rest:

• https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Wireless_icon.png (probably the easiest one, at worst can just rotate the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:UI_Noise.png and remove the ear)
• https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:UI_Frequency.png
  and potentially https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:UI_BodyPart.png (I tried scaling it down, but it looks terrible as 32x32, too much detail)

[proud cobalt]

Awesome work!

[languid kayak]

oh and maybe https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:UI_Stomp.png too (colorful boot instead of a white one)

[languid kayak]

that's done now btw

Things left from my backlog to do for me for tomorrow or someday:

• rename/move/split/clarify the AI/NPC confusion we talked with
• Mention Tooks as an Easter egg

And hopefully settle the Mean, Drink and Bloody Merry reference, I think we don't really have to put it as Easter egg at all? Too many sayings to compare.

Then maybe I'll help with splitting Fishing Rod, take a look and move the remaining pages with / in script guide (or maybe rename it to something less guidey in name, so the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/PZwiki:Tasks#One-time_bot_tasks task for it can be removed once and for all.

Then I guess I'll mostly focus on https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Site_maintenance (some autogenerated pages, improves, stubs and verifies are not so hard to achieve) from there on, but maybe switching to Project History a little too or something else in between patrolling for changes and responding here.

Anyway, off to sleep now 😴.

oh and I'm not sure anymore what's an error here: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Pages_with_reference_errors

[proud cobalt]

Fixed
https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=PZwiki:Project_Build_42_Update&diff=660387&oldid=660127

[lucid junco]

I think its in general play on phrases that mean "everything" then

Lock, stock and barrel means "everything"

[languid kayak]

would ne more fitting to a gun store though I guess 🤔. Not sure if it was a clear inspiration there 😄

[lucid junco]

Ill reword it then to something closer to the Blue plate's diner trivia

Also, I've angled the mccoys white text, but not straightened it

[lucid junco]

Going back to this, I think by the in game definition, Gigamart is its own category

Supermarkets like the one in Riverside or South LV are literally just big grocery stores

With a large "grocery" roomdef

[lucid junco]

@languid kayak @naive imp Which logo should we use as a main for McCoy?

The sign is only found around the main facility

And the white text is found on containers and buildings

[languid kayak]

I vote for second, the sign will fit the gallery for both the company and the movable tile I'd say?

[languid kayak]

(btw, the movie title was not attempted to even be translated in Poland, it's called "porachunki", so more like "settling score" :D)

https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porachunki_(film_1998)

[lucid junco]

Our translation was technically accurate but meaningless

"Карты, деньги, два ствола"
Or Cards, cash and two barrels

[lucid junco]

@languid kayak Could CGE Corp be a reference to CGEmpire?

[languid kayak]

huh, never though of that

not sure though

[digital helm]

Pretty sure I did this one already. I'll have to take a look and upload. May have others too

[languid kayak]

I added Tooks to the Easter eggs list: https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Easter_eggs&type=revision&diff=660559&oldid=652251 – most info can be found here https://projectzomboid.com/blog/?s=tooks – I assume it was someone close to TIS judged by the early posts. Not sure if The Fryer Tooks Fish N' Chips is a reference too

Also updated https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Tooks – this and https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Incontileve are very barebones, but not sure anything else to add there.

Have we decided what to do with https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Outreach_Center btw? It's not marked for deletion, but I guess we wanted to remove it? It would make https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Unknown_location able to be deleted too

[languid kayak]

The possibleNPC confsuion should be solved too, now we have https://pzwiki.net/wiki/AI and NPC redirects to survivors 🙂

[rotund echo]

I'd say for things like this, we should go with whatever is on the actual building

[languid kayak]

@proud cobalt @digital helm will we be (re-)using https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Version for b42? It's not really used currently at all, sitting at 0 pages, so I'm not sure?

[proud cobalt]

I think we should, more question for @digital helm i think

[languid kayak]

I also cleaned up https://pzwiki.net/wiki/PZwiki:Tasks a little – I think we may be able to get rid of Infobox section, I'd just love to link the script item parameters (not so huge task), and not sure if "Retire and potentially remove obsolete/unused parameters." is still relevant?

Then the most tangible one are mostly tasks from "Item and boilerplates" left, but not sure how much more effort will we spend on it. Splitting's mostly done, with just the bombs and fishing rod left in https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Articles_to_be_split (I saw you gave up on splitting the belly ring Calvy :P).

The table icons are mostly done, not sure we'll get more for clothing too, depends on Vail I guess.

The boilerplates for other item types is something I wanted to do, but not sure I'll ever do.

The rest like navboxes, item lists, item images is something we'll spend more time after actual b42 I believe.

I also think this is done @proud cobalt?

Remove empty/unused infobox parameters (empty models, icons, 0 protections, unused parameters (also see #Bot tasks)).

[proud cobalt]

Belly button ring has been split 😄
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Belly_Button_Ring

Fishing rod and the bombs though 😆

[proud cobalt]

Yeah the updater script should do that, can't verify 100% but they get removed as editors find them anyway. No need for a task imo

[digital helm]

Yeah I think we should. Although less relevant currently, it'll be helpful once updates start coming

[digital helm]

Looks good. I like pages like this

[digital helm]

I think the outreach center can go. At most it should be a tile page for the sign, but even that is unnecessary imo, since it's not even that afaik. It's just a sprite

[proud cobalt]

Yep not even a tile, consensus is pretty clear we don't want it

I've marked it for deletion in case you need to do anything before it goes @languid kayak

[digital helm]

I might just go ahead and add the links to the script item parameters. Should have time tonight.

The thing I was unsure about with bombs was the sensor tiers. Were we happy to combine them or best to split?

Here's what I had https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Aerosol_Bomb_with_Sensor

[languid kayak]

that would probably get rid of the whole section of tasks, I asume

Retire and potentially remove obsolete/unused parameters.
can go as well?

I think I'll finally get rid of https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Mods/Greenfire too.

It actually was updated to build 41 contrary to version notice

⚙ Build 41 and IWBUMS
and the last meaningful edit by an author being in march 2022 so b41 timeline https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Mods/Greenfire&oldid=66855

but I guess it's unlikely it will be updated for b42, and we'll get changes to smoking with b42 anyway (maybe not weed, but some things may overlap).

The work was pretty much only done by the author, contribution history for reference: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Special:Contributions/Gigsim

I'll keep https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Mods/Hydrocraft as it's not that bad-looking and kinda on life support with the link to discord I added, not even adds many images and doesn't use the old recipe table, so no harm there.

(oh and I just realized that Spiffo icon from https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Page_version should not be used as a preview icon)

[rotund echo]

"medium" difficulty, or "hard" difficulty?

Cuz, when I showed up, I had quite the welcoming committee, to say the least.

My character has Nimble and weapon skill though, so more or less its just tedious having to kill so many zombies. I haven't even explored March Ridge that much but I have killed like, 1000 zombies already (2.0x)

[digital helm]

I'm not too sure what that one means, so I guess so 😅 I'll take a closer look tonight

[rotund echo]

Though I can definitely say, it's now one of my favorite Zomboid cities, lmao

[digital helm]

I'm happy with removing greenfire (and specific mods in general too).
Things like a mod list, used tile defs, IDs, etc. I think are good to have. But maybe we should draw the line with whole mods?

[languid kayak]

guess we'll see how things will go after b42, but greenfire is good to go definitely

I remember asking, but got no reply to this, but @proud cobalt (and @digital helm kinda too), wouldn't it be better to name outfits like

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/1_RJ_Test instead https://pzwiki.net/wiki/1_RJ_Test_(female_outfit) when there's no collisions with NPCs? I can rename the pages if we agree – I think that way they are easier to find (and link to)

[digital helm]

Yes, I agree. As a general wiki-wide rule too. I think Calvy had it autogenerated.

[digital helm]

I think medium is reasonable. I'd say hard is more for high zombie pop like Louisville.
Difficulty is a bit subjective anyway

[proud cobalt]

Happy for renames, there are only a few unique ones

[languid kayak]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Mods/Autotsar_Tuning_Atelier and especially https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Mods/Silent_Hill_Mod/ru could go too I guess

[rotund echo]

Nay in most parts of Louisville I don't think its very hard

I'd personally rate Louisville as "medium-high"

\

[languid kayak]

kinda sad to see these all goes, otoh there are thousand mods like this adding icons, and holding it all on wiki would be impossible with current staffing lol

[languid kayak]

welp, both gone. Just Hydrocraft left for now, we'll see how it goes from that on

[languid kayak]

Okay, I guess it'll be that for today. Not sure how much time I'll have tomorrow, but my plan for things would be

• Renaming outfits
• Going through blogs
  Then maybe going through that too https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Autogenerated_articles_(tags) which also should skip (tags) if no collisions are there I guess.

I started going through https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Special:ListDuplicatedFiles changing the icons to redirects, but that broke the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/PZwiki:Item_list for some reason, but not the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Faalagorn/sandbox for some reason. If anyone have an idea why, let me know!

[languid kayak]

These two could probably be improved too, not much to add but one's stub and other one's improve:
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Knox_Telecommunications
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Premium_Technologies

anyway, off to 😴

[rotund echo]

Premium Tech don't have the walkie talkie documented there

And it should be mentioned that Premium Tech stuff is more advanced than their lesser counterparts... (Premium walkie-talkies have more range than ValuTech or Toys-R-Mine, Premium radios have CD players, Premium Ham Radios have more range than makeshift ones)

Also the Premium Technologies Television looks better than the ValuTech, who wouldn't want a big wide flat screen TV??

[naive imp]

I'd class Louisville as medium just based on the sheer quantity of loot

I'd say medium, not hard. There's about as many guns as west point with less zombies and the Knox Military Apartments has a lot of loot

That location is particularly hard but I don't think one location should influence the whole town's difficulty

[rotund echo]

Tbf March Ridge is mostly just tedious, lol

I feel like there's more density there than Louisville suburbs

[naive imp]

Lv is weird

Lots of zeds here none there etc

[naive imp]

The suburbs I thought had a density comparable to rosewood

But they're so big ot may have been bc its so spread out

[rotund echo]

The fence area is pretty mellow, except St. Peregrin area (hospital, interchange)

Most parts of LV are moderately dense, only really starts ramping up in the downtown.

[naive imp]

Agreed

[rotund echo]

Welp at least March Ridge isn't Rosewood or Valley Station. The heatmap is dense but concentrated

[naive imp]

That hospital is a clusterfuck

[naive imp]

Yeah and by the time you go to March Ridge I feel like you'll usually have enough loot and skills to deal with the zeds without too many problems

Almost every town has at least one good place for melee weapons and guns can be found practically everywhere

[rotund echo]

I had 7 month game, began in West Point and lived Louisville

I pass by the hospital a lot, but eventually got around to shooting up the interchange. I never bothered to even look at the hospital (due to how building spawn mechanics)

[rotund echo]

Most of the melee weapon loot are short blunts like hammers, and the occasional nightstick on a cop zombie

The bulk of March Ridge loot is guns and food, but I've heard people also getting machetes in the Knox Military Apartments

[digital helm]

As I said, I think giving locations an overall difficulty may be a bit too subjective. There's too many variables, and each person's opinion can vary wildly. I'd consider mentioning the zombie pop, spread and loot distribution instead, then allow the reader to make their own conclusions on how difficult they think it'll be.
One location may be easy to someone but hard to someone else. Not to mention the variation in sandbox settings, character builds and the stage of the game

[rotund echo]

ThinkDock once told me the "audience" for pzwiki.net are mostly noobs/average skill players

Labels like "hard", "medium", or "easy" I guess plain and simple for such folks? I mean, towns like West Point or March Ridge do have quite the notoriety amongst most players

[fair leaf]

Hello Vaiileasys! do you remember me? I asked you for help about the schedules of Knox Events, for a video on Youtube. It was 2 years ago. I ended up switching accounts. 😂 I even sent you a friend request again, because your profile is now private, but it didn't work. And sorry guys, it's the wrong channel for this.

[digital helm]

Hey, yeah I remember. My DMs should be open

[rotund echo]

Cowpoke... Nice name boah

XD

[digital helm]

I'd say that's probably accurate for the most common users. But the target audience should still be everyone.

To be clear, I'm not necessarily against it. I just think it could be difficult to reach consensus

I'm often the devil's advocate too 😄

[rotund echo]

Yeah I don't think pzwiki.net should conform to popular beliefs/myths/noobs

Hell, the reason why I edit pzwiki.net is that I'm a gamer trying to spread my knowledges to others

The best information is what is factually correct, and what comes directly from real game experience

[digital helm]

Perfect way of thinking for editing any wiki

[rotund echo]

I usually only edit articles of things that I have real experience with, so I'm gonna edit the West Point/Louisville articles, but I won't really touch Muldraugh article

[proud cobalt]

I think easy, medium, and hard are also restrictive and place a level of expectation on a reader. Nothing is easy for a new player in PZ. Even moving can be difficult to grasp your head around in an isometric game, for some.

But taking out hoards in Louisville, simple as for an experienced player

[rotund echo]

Ngl Fallas is also not a zombie-free utopia. There's a surprising amount of zombies in that place

[proud cobalt]

100% not zombie free

[rotund echo]

Its labeled as "easy" difficulty

[proud cobalt]

I've lived in that mf

[rotund echo]

But usually a couple shotgun fights and the village will be deserted

[proud cobalt]

Man when am I gonna get that damn Katana

[proud cobalt]

They always crawl their way back

[rotund echo]

I never found a Katana man zombie before in real gameplay

[rotund echo]

Damn, usually when I go there I only stay for a couple days, I don't stay for long

Too small for my taste

[proud cobalt]

Having helicopter on sometimes helps/doesn't help depending how you look at it

I lived there once, had a nice place. It's quite conveniently between muldraugh and riverside

[rotund echo]

Fair enough, and it has good natural resources, three lakes/ponds in the area

The gas station there is cozy, I was always gravitated to it every time I went to Fallas

[digital helm]

I've added the item script parameter links to the item infobox doc.

I assume the remove obsolete/unused parameters task was the same as the bot task. I've kept these as deprecated in the doc, just in case we or someone stumbles upon them and wonders what it is

[proud cobalt]

Oh in the documentation! That makes so much more sense. I thought it meant linking in the Infobox itself. I was so confused on how that was going to work

[digital helm]

oh nah, that would've been awful 😄

[proud cobalt]

Hence my confusion 😆 I was just going to trust the process

Add legends for icons in tables, see Fallout wiki, see User:Vaileasys/sandbox. Was there more of these to be done? @digital helm @languid kayak

[lucid junco]

@languid kayak https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Mccoy_logging_co_logo.png
logo updated

[digital helm]

Yeah these https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Legend_firearm#See_also
It was mostly waiting on better icons

[proud cobalt]

Are we happy to call this finished? @languid kayak Move all the models from gallery to infoboxes and remove galleries (unless they host unique items). In progress by User:Faalagorn and other editors.

[digital helm]

I was looking at this. I think so

[proud cobalt]

Ahh ok

[proud cobalt]

Me too, I havnt seen any in a long time. I'll let Faal remove it if he's happy

Change the order of model→icon→icon_name and add missing fields when needed in infoboxes. This should be done by CalvyBot already. Maybe check if there's any that are wrong otherwise worth removing @languid kayak

[digital helm]

New icons added
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:UI_Stomp.png
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Wireless_icon.png

[digital helm]

Fixed this. It was from the Mod mbox

[proud cobalt]

Man we really entered ultra clean up mode with B42 announcement 😆

[digital helm]

Thoughts on this (or something like this) for changes to Trivia in the style guide? Anything that should be added or removed? @languid kayak

*'''Trivia''': A list of interesting facts directly related to the subject of the article.
**Only include meaningful facts unique to the subject that aren’t already covered in this or a more suitable article.
**Facts should remain interesting and accurate over time.
**Keep each point clear, concise, and neutral, using plain language.
**Avoid personal opinions, speculative language, or subjective statements, and stick to verified facts.
**Maintain a consistent bullet-point style without unnecessary embellishments.
**Avoid using the section as a catch-all for minor or speculative details.
**If unsure whether a fact is appropriate, propose it on the talk page first.

This is what we currently have

*'''Trivia''': A list of interesting facts directly related to the subject of the article. Try not to duplicate information already included in the other sections of the page, and avoid points that may be considered common sense.

[proud cobalt]

Looks good to me

[languid kayak]

Are we doing anything with https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:UI_BodyPart.png or leaving it as is?

If not, then that'd be all for now, unless we will plan on adding more icons 😄

[lucid junco]

Bringing this up again
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/L%26B_Warehousing
Could be a reference to L(emmy)&B(linky), especially their old blogs
And
C.G. E Corp could be referencing CGEmpire

Can I get a yay or nay on those?

[languid kayak]

I'd start with "trivia should be concise, try to keep it to one-two short sentencs if possible and don't duplicate information present in cited sources such as Wikipedia, and instead redirect readers to further reading"

or something like that. Alternatively the Wikipedia linking part could be omitted, but I often found trivias that rephrased what Wikipedia already said in detail needlessly.

[languid kayak]

I'd say yes, just add "possibly" or "most likely" unless we'll get/find a direct confirmation from devs 🙂

[lucid junco]

Alrighty

[proud cobalt]

Currently I'm not. I'd like to do something with it and the template eventually. But likely no time soon

[languid kayak]

you mean the image? Either way, can stay at it is, it's looking decently enough even if scaled down to 32x32 anyway, though for the body locations we have a bigger ones that aren't white 😄