pzwiki_editing

[languid kayak]

https://media.moddb.com/images/games/1/15/14517/PZ_Poster_Hires2.jpg

It's still there 🙂

Desura died, but the database still lives on https://www.moddb.com/ https://www.moddb.com/games/project-zomboid

though technically that's an old banner, it's using the old logo

Well, it's created for folks that like to print their own covers, or use for some launchers that use it to recreate 3D box art

PZ was never rated by PEGI too since it was never released 😄

Terraria was, as it was released.

I think it has to be self-rated by TIS to be able to be sold on I think Brazil? As that's required by Steam to sell it there. Similar one is supposed to come to Germany, but it isn't effective yet.

[lucid junco]

Still makes a bit less sense, since the only actual pz copy that would work is from GOG I think

Huh

Thats a bit dated

[languid kayak]

and needlesly repeated, I was also talking a look at it 😄

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/The_Indie_Stone#Members is the updated one

[lucid junco]

For starters, Zach Beever is no longer a composer

Armin Hass is the current(?) composer

Who is nowhere to be mentioned on both pages

And Im unsure about helping development teams, Vertex Break, Formosa Interactive UK/former Noiseworks and TEA Games/The Tea Division/former The Eccentric Ape

[languid kayak]

Armin Hass is mentioned here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Zomboid but agree on PZwiki

I linked to pzwiki accounts for folks that don't have the pages over time, but I might missed some. Some would require writing their own pages eventually, most notably https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Special:WhatLinksHere/Romain_Dron

[lucid junco]

[lucid junco]

Also Im curious where this list comes from

Is it from the credits?

[languid kayak]

yeah 😄 I had discussion about this particular file with Vail in private two days ago 😄

[languid kayak]

Nothing private, I coulv'e discussed it here actually, but funny that you bring it now 😄

I went and finished redoing the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Vehicle_indicator_icons – I had to improvise with fuel indicator ones as they are special; instead of being color-modified in Lua, they are just redrawn :D. Funnilty there is an empty one but it's not used. I took the colors off rj-vehicle_fuelgauge images and applied to icon_lowgas_light.png, the red and orange are different ones because of that.

others are modified like that

    local alpha = self:getAlphaFlick(0.65);
    local greyBg = {r=0.5, g=0.5, b=0.5, a=alpha};

Though the game does some rounding 0,5×0,65×100 = 32,5 in r/g/b which translates to #535353 and actual color in https://pzwiki.net/w/images/c/cb/VehicleDashboard.png for gray is #525252 which is 32,2. Can compare other colors with the game and do offsets if we'de be really anal about it.

I marked the rest for removal. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Pages_requested_for_deletion

I'll be going through Controls page since I did it. Oh, and the respective info was moved from https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Vehicles&type=revision&diff=459313&oldid=459307 since it was duplicated.

[languid kayak]

I think it was just assembvled over time? But the credits are mirrored in https://www.mobygames.com/game/66026/project-zomboid/ too if you want easy access (I think these are shipped in plain text with game files and they cycle when you boot the game)

Funny they use this one: https://www.mobygames.com/game/66026/project-zomboid/cover/group-105296/cover-284579/ as a cover as I was taking a look at it too https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Poster.jpg

[languid kayak]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Spiffo8.png

[lucid junco]

Thats.. a bit longer than the list on the wiki

[languid kayak]

Spiffo Plushies are nice, but next one I want an RJ one 😄

[lucid junco]

And still doesnt include helping development teams

[languid kayak]

from projectzomboid/media/lua/client/OptionScreens/MainScreen.lua

[lucid junco]

So its a direct copy, I see

[languid kayak]

Should be, unless it's from older version, but it also benefits from some developers being linked to other games

Though I see it's gated after MobyGames pro nowadays 😩

But you can click each developer anyway

[lucid junco]

https://projectzomboid.com/blog/about-us/ Still bugs me a bit

What are those other teams that are mentioned in the "Development Best Friends" and who is exactly a part of them

[languid kayak]

credits will probably change in b42, as teams has changed, but we have them mostly thanks to @tulip kiln

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Formosa_Interactive
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/General_Arcade
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/The_Eccentric_Ape
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Tanglewood_Games

We had Vertex Break being discussed here: #pzwiki_editing message

TEA seems to have changed their logo, so feel free to improve these if you want too 😄

I have it all somewhere in the back of my mind, but finding-other-things-to-do always takes priority ;D

[lucid junco]

I think they are TEA Games, no?

[languid kayak]

seems so, slight rebranding 😄

[tulip kiln]

Actually did a shit ton of checking, a decent amount of it, there might be a few names missing but generally I think vast majority of devs on that list got included. Most of the special infected and special thanks sections are just community members

[lucid junco]

Aight, thanks. Now all we have to do is figure out how to put all of this on the actuall game page

[languid kayak]

huh, the funny part is that GOG uses slightly different banner as well 😄
https://images.gog-statics.com/f22cca6055f2bf8c76cdda5602a28ac739226efa491041014ddd446313fb431e.jpg vs https://shared.cloudflare.steamstatic.com/store_item_assets/steam/apps/108600/library_600x900_2x.jpg

[lucid junco]

@languid kayak How should we go about adding this list, at least partially?

[languid kayak]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/The_Indie_Stone#Members is fine, no need to duplicate it in Project Zomboid, I'd just link to it

As far as actual linking, I guess it depends how article will shape :D. I think {{See}} will be best unless you want to delete the section

[lucid junco]

Oh, I thought about adding in multiple tables with mentions of all teams and Special mentions

So that it also contains members of TEA Games, Formosa Interactive ect

[languid kayak]

on one page?

There are ways to just maintain it once by abusing includes… but I'm not sure it's the right way 😄 They get hard to maintain

I think it's best to just link to them?

[lucid junco]

..Yeah.. 😅

[languid kayak]

like {{See|Formosa Interactive#Members}}, though {{See}} template doesn't accept many variables 🤔

[languid kayak]

btw, the artwork is probably as old as the game itself, but I think it's the only one we have actual street name 😄

[lucid junco]

Or at least linking them

[languid kayak]

slightly differenty spot 😄

[languid kayak]

Anyway; wanted to say that earlier, but I updated the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Desura page – not sure if anything else meaningful can be added, especially PZ-centric.

It's a page similar to https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Steam and https://pzwiki.net/wiki/GOG (this one needs more content, seems the GOG version can't play on the same servers as Steam and it's not noted how IWBUMS work here, a lot of info on FAQs is Steam-centrict)

Desura's database of old game version, licence ownerships, keys and revenue for the unlucky developers is gone with both Bad Juju games and then OnePlay going bankupt, I linked the ModDB page which still hosts the community/game info. Relevant: https://www.gamingonlinux.com/2015/05/desura-are-in-a-bit-of-trouble-with-not-paying-developers/

For those curious, there is still a dead now https://www.reddit.com/r/Desura/ that saw some updates from the community over times

They also have inactive Facebook I didn't link to https://www.facebook.com/Desura

As far as history goes, I didn't try going too deep, but for those curious, the website states semi-accurate info:

Launched in 2010 by DesuraNET, Desura later became part of Linden Lab's. By June 2015, Bad Juju Games had acquired the platform, and the following year, it transitioned into the hands of OnePlay, a digital subscription service based in Denmark. The platform underwent another change in ownership in 2020, revitalizing its mission and establishing itself as a leading portal for leisure gaming enthusiasts. Desura is now based in Helsinki and has a large team working on our gaming platform. Our main goal is to create the perfect online gaming platform for everyone.
Apparently Desura was announced at the end of 2009 and Bad Juju bought in 2014: https://web.archive.org/web/20160516190049/http://www.badjuju.com/bad-juju-games-acquires-desura-from-linden-lab/

Then it traveled to OnePlay: https://www.gamingonlinux.com/2016/10/desura-indieroyale-and-dailyroyale-now-have-new-owners-who-plan-to-revive-them/ and after that it's hard to say if it was the current owner of something else, as it's hard to say if Friv is a part of the current owner, it was changed 7 months ago on GitHub to this: https://github.com/desura/desura-app/commit/a2d8e5d11aba6c0b7e6e65dfa7153465a776015b

And the friv website doesn't have any info to connect both.

Funnily, there was a (surprise) unsuccessful Kickstart campaign from a guy from Finalnd that more-or-less matches what's in the current website: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/dmitriigar/desura-the-ultimate-online-games-platform?ref=6f5ez3

I also thought of adding Desura for https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:User_platform but it's kinda meaningless as you can't access the files now 😄

If someone wants to add based on that, feel free, else I guess it's fine as it is 🙂

Moving on to https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Wiki_admin_images

I think I spoke about it briefly with Vail too some time ago (or maybe it was on a public chat? Not sure), anyway as a part of https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Wiki_admin_images clearing and part of icon updates https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Vaileasys/sandbox I thought of using in-game icons (I think item icons, but we can use something from https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:UI_images too or https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Spiffo_images or a tile in all of the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/PZwiki:Mboxes

Currently there's three to be replaced:

• https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Imbox_content.png – used for https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Deprecated, so I'd say some https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Removed_features item icon (not all are there)
• https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Imbox_deletion.png – used for https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Deletion, some trash can I guess?
• https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Imbox_notice.png – used as a notice for transclusioness templates, but not sure what'd be the most appropraite?

Feel free to give feedback 🙂

oh there's https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:AutoTranslated_icon.png too but not sure if anything would replace that

[languid kayak]

Took me a while to get into it, but I now started going through the logos, got the https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Trailer_adverts created it's missing https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Base.TrailerAdvert.png and https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Base.TrailerAdvert-2.png and I think that's it, have you exported them?

[languid kayak]

Also categorized these: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Billboards – was relatively easy to find as they all had the same dimensions, is there anything else lacking?

Also, is I ❤️ Wok & Rolls the only logo in the Taxi or are there more? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Chevalier_Nyala_Taxi.png

[languid kayak]

apparently missed that, one pixel off 👀

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Spiffos_Get_Stuffed.png

and https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:LBMW_Billboard_Advert.png

[proud cobalt]

Wait @digital helm is in the credits surely he gets a page 🤔😉

[digital helm]

Not sure if something's been done already, but I'd use something like {{Main}} or {{See}} to link to the TIS page. Or, reverse it and have the members on the Project Zomboid page. Then have only Binky, Lemmy, Mash and Will on the TIS page and have {{See}} to link to the Project Zomboid page

[lucid junco]

Its the only one, there is a spiffos one, but its unused

[lucid junco]

Yeah, Vaileasys is in the list of Tis members, why is his nickname still white

[tulip kiln]

Some of the TIS members here don't have roles on the discord, like Kirrus.

I'd imagine they probably don't want the mod role since they'd get bombarded with people sending em reports or something.

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Advertise_Here_Trailer_Advert.png
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Vote_Fairweather_Trailer_Advert.png

[lucid junco]

I think something is up with the way taxis are implemented

There is vehicle_cartaxishell.png , which is present in game and has Wok&Rolls advert

There is also a vehicle_taxi_yellow.png , which isn not in the game and has Spiffos advert

Though it seems less detailed and polished

[lucid junco]

Citr8 is missing

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Citr8_Wave_Billboard_advertising.png

Off by 2 pixels

Im consistently inconsistent ig

[woven portal]

"Contrary to popular belief, disease does not truly spread from plant to plant. When plants experience growth, they check for disease once again for every diseased plant (not including Flies) within a 1 tile radius (including diagonals). If nearby there is a case of Mildew and a case of DWF (can be same plant), then the main plant will check 3 times for disease instead of once. Ensuring your crops are spaced properly will help greatly in avoiding the spread of diseases, should they show up."

what does this mean?

[digital helm]

🤔 the first sentence seems to contradict the rest of it.
Other than that, every time the growth stage changes, if an adjacent crop has a disease there is a random chance that the crop in question will get the disease. If both Mildew and DWF are adjacent, the random chance runs 3 times instead of once. Therefore leaving a gap stops this spread, but I assume there's a separate random chance for crops to catch a disease irrespective of adjacent crops.

This is my interpretation of that. I've never actually looked into how crops work.

[thin cloud]

Unknown. Looks like the shooting range.

[woven portal]

thats what i also interpreted it as

very unclear though

[digital helm]

could definitely be clearer. Farming has always been a bit of an after thought on the wiki

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Grave

https://tenor.com/view/jerma-slavicskipper-what-gif-21452349

What a page

[digital helm]

The gold standard

[languid kayak]

oh true, now I remember we had that talk

[lucid junco]

Ups box truck

[languid kayak]

I wonder if these are spawnable? in debug mode?

[digital helm]

If not, just ask and I can render them

[lucid junco]

Nope

[lucid junco]

Interesting

There is a weird grave in the LV

[lucid junco]

Which category grave would be in?

Misc?

[languid kayak]

Graves are not movables, right? Though we definitely would like to cover them as they can be player-made

[lucid junco]

They arent

[languid kayak]

btw @digital helm (or sharp, as you might know it too), where is https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Slurp_Burp_Logo.png from? A billboard?

[languid kayak]

Seems like we missed a reference: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Mashie_Signs_%26_Paintings – it seems to refer Marina (MashPotato)

pinging @tulip kiln for that

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Milk_N'_More – should it be Milk N' More or Milk 'N' More or something else?

[robust latch]

Milk N' More

[digital helm]

Yeah it's a billboard

[digital helm]

I think Milk 'N' More. That's how the sign is and is correct grammar

[lucid junco]

Its from a billboard I believe

[languid kayak]

just noticed your reply, after moving the page literally second ago (missed the reply yesterday), you think it should be single ' as it was before? Keep in mind we have similar venues that don't follow the naming either like https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Gas_N_More

Can move the page back if we want? Maybe pinging @naive imp for opinion as well?

Though it seems at least one thing 'N' has a page on Wikipedia too: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/More_'N'_More_(I_Love_You)

or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monk_'n'_More

[proud cobalt]

The sign has 'N'

Its short for and so would require one before and after to be grammatically correct. But business names are also business names not sentences

[digital helm]

We discussed naming for locations/businesses recently, and ended with titling them as per the logo. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Help:Style_guide#Page_titles
Iirc Pat also chimed in and said to follow the logo

[languid kayak]

good point actually

[languid kayak]

yeah, think I'll keep it as https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Milk_'N'_More and proceed to update the links now 😛

[proud cobalt]

Got a couple days off coming up finally, will try get to those double redirects

[languid kayak]

nice, thanks! Was wondering if I should do it manually 😄

[proud cobalt]

Definitely not

[languid kayak]

btw @naive imp I guess you want the images like https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Milk_N'_More_(Louisville_next_to_A.A._Ron_Hunting_Supply).png to be moved as well?

[proud cobalt]

I just finished working on relevance ranked see also sections for autogenerated articles, though now i realise its not alphabetical. This means we wont just have placeholder red links

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Calvy/sandbox2

[languid kayak]

Yeah, I was wondering whether the alphabetical one is always the correct one 😄 Easier to do I guess, but OTOH it seems the most important ones should be on the top. It's just something not as straightforward.

Can always change our mind, common procedure for us at this point 😆

[proud cobalt]

The beauty of wiki is being able to change our mind on everything at all times

I think with more variant sections see also will be less important so alphabetical is best

[languid kayak]

I just sometimes think how it is for SEO or people's habit, but so far I didn't see any complains :D.

I often like not to leave too many redirects, though gotta remember folks might have it bookmarked (or linked to it in chats), so at least I try to leave some message where the page was moved

[proud cobalt]

I think the majority of radical changes has finished now, things are quite stable on the wiki currently. B41 will have large gameplay changes but should mostly be additions for us

[languid kayak]

true, for items and things like that it's less important, for things like skills and metapages sometimes it makes no logical sense. Forgot what page I edited last was it that made me curious

[languid kayak]

B42, thugh B41 was the most radical so far 😉

[proud cobalt]

Yes B42 is right 😄

Been typing 41.78.16 for so long

[languid kayak]

But yeah, wiki's more-or-less feature complete to what we have in game. I was surprised we got to cover even things like annotated maps and survivors.

The only areas that are technically not complete are the ones most of us want to touch but is probably overwhelming 😛

1. Splitting items (great work on that though few bigger ones will be a hurdle :P)
2. Adding movables (I think I should get finally bring myself to move it I guess)

Then there's some skill pages that are still out of date and some meta pages, I slowly work on the latter 👌

Finally there's some categorization of images

[proud cobalt]

You guys have been going crazy on categorising images, has been fun to watch

[lucid junco]

#pzwiki_editing message
I think we started doing that after that message?

[digital helm]

That'd be right. "recently" - 2 and a half months ago 😄

[digital helm]

redirects also help with search

btw, should we update this redirect to the border? I'm guessing this was from before the border page was created

[languid kayak]

yeah, those too

[languid kayak]

Was it someone else :D? Though I already said to Vail, I focused on that instead of patrolling changes so some recent stuff I will have to catch up as it slipped under my radar 😛

[languid kayak]

I think I asked the same question some time ago?

[digital helm]

Everyone has done an incredible job to get it to this point. Mostly just housekeeping tasks and going into more detail. There's always the minor features that could be added, but the bulk of it is there.

Along with the new features, it should be a lot easier to update any changes too, being as up-to-date as we are

[digital helm]

Maybe I'll just change it. I'll also add redirect for exclusion zone since that gets no results. A bit annoying that the search is case sensitive.

[languid kayak]

can't find it, maybe I forgot to post it but I had similar issue where updating a link somewhere 😄 Maybe I typed it in the edit reason

and yeah, go on and change it 🎉

[lucid junco]

You did and it went unanswered

[naive imp]

If the page was moved then yeah they images should be moved too. By the way I don't have permission to move without leaving redirect? Is that locked behind sysop?

That's why I leave all those deletion notices

[digital helm]

It is, unfortunately. There is a separate right for it though, which is nice, so it could be added to a new user group suppressredirect

[naive imp]

"Frequent movers" user group maybe

But wouldn't kirrus have to do that?

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Grave
Page revamped

Checking it out again, Strugatsky is a surname of two famous russian writers, Arkady and Boris Strugatsky

Though it may be a reference to MMM?

[languid kayak]

The premise? As the names clearly does not match

[lucid junco]

Nor do the dates, it was open in 1993-94, a bit after the knox event.
But its an "investment company" with two brothers as ceo's and in the moskow/kremle

A decade after the collapse of USSR is a bit of a mess to dig in

[languid kayak]

not sure if it's a real refence then or a stretch?

[lucid junco]

I think a stretch tbh

[robust latch]

I think these need {{ll|}} instead of classic brackets [[]]:
|[[{{{tag}}} (tag)]] }}{{#if:{{{tag2|}}} |<br>[[{{{tag2}}} (tag)]] }}{{#if:{{{tag3|}}} |<br>[[{{{tag3}}} (tag)]] }}{{#if:{{{tag4|}}} |<br>[[{{{tag4}}} (tag)]] }}{{#if:{{{tag5|}}} |<br>[[{{{tag5}}} (tag)]] }}{{#if:{{{tag6|}}} |<br>[[{{{tag6}}} (tag)]] }}{{#if:{{{tag7|}}} |<br>[[{{{tag7}}} (tag)]] }}{{#if:{{{tag8|}}} |<br>[[{{{tag8}}} (tag)]] }}{{#if:{{{tag9|}}} |<br>[[{{{tag9}}} (tag)]] }}{{#if:{{{tag10|}}} |<br>[[{{{tag10}}} (tag)]] }} }}
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Infobox_item is under protection so cough can someone try it out 😄 . Also I did wrote briefly about it if you want to see further explanation: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template_talk:Infobox_item

[robust latch]

Feel free to edit the page (or other media pages) if anything sounds off

I googled Strugatsky it gave me the writer brothers

Thats all tho

[robust latch]

So instead of [[{{{tag10}}} (tag)]], this: {{ll|{{{tag10}}} (tag)}} I reckon.

[languid kayak]

You can always try it on /sandbox and then use sandbox on the page to see if it works 🙂

When I'm too scared to touch highly used templates, I do that too 😛

[robust latch]

Yeah it does work, just another feature, I never use this /sandbox. Will have to use it tho for infobox item atleast

[robust latch]

Also we deprecated function parameter in infobox item right?

[digital helm]

Yeah, it's on his to-do list

[digital helm]

Yeah, it was an invitation to write every little thing the item can do

[digital helm]

I'll add it in about 9 hours or so, unless Faal gets to it first

[robust latch]

I wont be waking yp until then

[robust latch]

I am having issues displaying {{sup}} in Turkish in my templates. Created this ->https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Navbox_stats/sandbox for this -> https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Skill/tr#Ayrıca_bakınız to find a solution. Any help is deeply appreciated.

[digital helm]

Hmm 🤔 I'll have to take a close look for you

[languid kayak]

go on, unless you already did 😛

[digital helm]

added

[lucid junco]

They are fairly popular, but not sure if that's relevant

[digital helm]

Ok, there may have been some confusion with how these templates work. So to clarify:

• tt gets the translation for a string (arg1) as defined on the language code subpage of the template defined as name. It'll only get the translation for the appropriate language that the template is used on. English is the default.
• ll just changes the text to a link with /xx for the language code of the current page. So {{ll|Skills}} is actually just [[Skills/tr]]. Translation is only from the display title of the linked page.
• lcs only adds the language code for the current page. So, on Skills/tr it'll just add /tr
• sup won't automatically translate. Needs to be translated manually. So instead of {{sup|removed}} it'd be {{sup|kaldırıldı}}

The 'translation' element for sup allows the input string "removed" to be translated to display the appropriate colour. So, for Turkish, kaldırıldı = red, gelecek = green. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Sup/tr

So, if you want it to be translated, you need to manually translate it, so instead of {{sup|removed}} you would do {{sup|kaldırıldı}}, then on a tr page it'll display as Kaldırıldı, but on an English page, it'll default to: Removed.

To use it in templates, you'd have to use {{tt}}. But not if it's a template ONLY for tr.
So on the English page we'd do: {{sup|{{tt|name=TEMPLATENAME|default=removed|arg1=removed}}}}, then on that template's language code subpage (e.g. Template:TEMPLATENAME/tr), you would have:

{{#switch: {{lc: {{{1|}}} }}
| removed = kaldırıldı;
}}

This displays it as that translation. So, Kaldırıldı instead of Removed on tr pages. And because we've defined kaldırıldı on Template:Sup/tr it'll be red.

Here's an example, which'd be the primary use https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Template%3ANavbox_stats%2Fsandbox&type=revision&diff=461659&oldid=461655

Let me know if I need to clarify any of that. I'll do my best

Oh, and here it is on that skills page. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Skill/tr#Ayrıca_bakınız under Beceriler

[languid kayak]

yeah, even note says it might be, though if I ever hear Strugatsky, they come to mind for me too 😄

[robust latch]

From this I am understanding that we have to write sup's like so for every instance in a template -> {{sup|{{tt|name=TEMPLATENAME|default=removed|arg1=removed}}}}. Also the translation guide would have to be updated for such templates?

With your codes I managed to get atleast a Kaldırıldı but without a colour

Problem might be connected to navboxstats/tr not containing sup template itself, unlike the original english navboxstats

[digital helm]

there's semi colons. That'd be why

| removed = kaldırıldı;
| future = gelecek;

Should just be

| removed = kaldırıldı
| future = gelecek

[robust latch]

I have tried that too

Let me try again

Yeah basically whatever I write after = , it gets displayed (without colour)

[digital helm]

I'll have to play around with it then. It doesn't seem to work like I'd hoped

[robust latch]

You got it

[digital helm]

fixed. It was because you had 2 switches. Should only have one. So it was as if it was written on the page as [[Category:Incorrect template usage]]kaldırıldı

That's a relief. I wasn't sure how I was going to get it to work if it wasn't something simple 😅

[robust latch]

Well back to ice age we go in that case: copy paste and translate everyting 😄

Ok so I am changing every sup to {{sup|{{tt|name=TEMPLATENAME|default=removed|arg1=removed}}}}. Navbox stats and Navbox regions are the only two that I am aware of that has this issue. Also I'll update translation guide for these two

Is there any other sup using navbox out there (I dont think there is)

[robust latch]

Thank you a lot

[proud cobalt]

Very early in testing, but heres some completely automatically generated 3d model gifs

[robust latch]

Looks neat

[digital helm]

Not that's translated I don't think. Did we discuss removing features that are 'removed' from the navbox @languid kayak I remember something about that 🤔

[languid kayak]

yeah, we're fine removing them from navboxes

[languid kayak]

have you taken a look at tf2's javascript approach?

[proud cobalt]

Yeah it seems interesting, i dont have much experience in js and cant play around with it to test anyway

https://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/File:Dead_Ringer_Alt_3D.jpg

[languid kayak]

the big thumbnail issue tf2 wiki has applies to us too 😄

[proud cobalt]

@digital helm Thoughts on feasability? Worth the time and effort to try? Will have quite a bit of maintenance. (I dont really know how to find the js files on mediawiki)
https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/index.php?title=Template:3D_Alt_Viewer&action=edit

Id prefer a full 3d control version, but seems impracticle

[languid kayak]

I'll tske s look too, should be doable

just not sure when 😄

[proud cobalt]

Theres a couple extensions that support STL or OBJ files

Pz is natively FBX or X files though

https://en.crystalls.info/Template:Cube

https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:3DAlloy

[languid kayak]

depends on Kirrus I guess, javascript would probably be better in the end though harder to actually prepare 😄

[digital helm]

Well, it's possible... but a little over my head. Here's how the TF2 wiki does it

[languid kayak]

yeah, was gonna post it

https://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/MediaWiki:Common.js

not sure what license is tf2 wiki, though it's Valve's-hosted (kinda similar to pzwiki): https://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/Team_Fortress_Wiki:Terms_of_Use

[digital helm]

It'd be much easier to resort to a button on each side to rotate each direction. But still that's over my head 😅

[languid kayak]

Though I think the code isn't really copyrighted though 😄

Seems it was added here, but the css was minimized back then https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Common.js&diff=699268&oldid=675295

https://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/User_talk:WindPower#3D_Models 🤔

I wonder how's active they are nowadays, but that;s an option too 😄

[lucid junco]

Filthy larry

Oh wait, its already in the easter eggs

[stray jewel]

psafaa

im high af

[proud cobalt]

Double redirects are fixed

[languid kayak]

food for though, if ThinkDock is working on renaming logos and we have a set of naming patterns for the models too, maybe we can just add one parameter (name) for infobox and the model.png or logo.png would be added automatically? I saw some other wikis using that.

[languid kayak]

Okay, took me some time, but I pretty much got myself to categorize the logos in https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Logos

Few remaining, mostly pinging @lucid junco for that are the ones to need straighetning:

1. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:StMichaelsCathedral.png
2. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:West_maple_country_club_logo_2.png OR https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:West_maple_country_club_logo_3.png (no point in keeping both)
3. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Beever's_live_music_sign_logo.png (similar to https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Red_Owl_Inn_logo.png )
4. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Loans_cash_jewelry_pawn_shop_sign.png OR https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Loans_cash_jewlery_pawn_shop_2.png (no point in keeping both here too) – they are similar to

However, there's a few inconsistencies too with some that had removed bars:
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Worm_of_books_logo.png is example with how they should look like (look at the history)

1. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Sweet_eats_logo.png (bars in the middle)
2. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Waites_motel_logo.png (bars altoghert)

Not sure you're up for the task 😄 @lucid junco

I'll also get back to the raws you uploaded, I noticed some of the logos that use neighest neigbor, not sure if you have the original projects saved?

Maybe I'll get myself to upload the missing tiles too

oh and I was wondering, should we keep the poles in here? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Louisville_music_festival_1993_logo.png

Maybe I'll do some compression of them aftwards now that they are sorted out 🙂

[lucid junco]

Not like I have anything better to do currently :P

What do you mean by "original projects"?

[languid kayak]

btw, 378 here: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Straightened_logos – though some I put in the recreated category 😛

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Recreated_logos

Most are Vail's works, but there's also two remade for the newspapers teased by TIS, the Hit Vids from Pohly and the thunder gas one that's only on decal form 😛

[lucid junco]

I have saved all* sprite sheets, both as a file and a .xcf

But separate ones were only saved as .png's

[languid kayak]

as in gimp files before extracting to png?

[lucid junco]

oh

only sprite sheets

[lucid junco]

I was a bit unsure about removing poles and bars due to them being a part of "aesthetic" or something

||And due to being lazy||

[languid kayak]

the worm of books has bars removed though and sweet eats has the side bars removed, so I'd say if you want you can remove them all 😛

[languid kayak]

for comparison (but like I said, some are probably in recreated); unless we missed some

29 are missing

[lucid junco]

I have.. 410 in my folder, though that with billboards

And those that were recreated

[languid kayak]

from your another folder:

[languid kayak]

I was surprised you actually went ahead and removed the bars in worm of books and sweet eats 😄

seems we miss some like this as it was recreated by Vail https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Dixie_Logo.png

If we don't, ideally we'd have bothand one in the gallery 🙂

btw, huge work by Vail to actually recreating some of those ;D That was all pre-b41 though so probably less overwhelming

[lucid junco]

Looks fine?

[languid kayak]

ah, missed this one: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Welcome_to_fort_knox.png

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:West_maple_country_club_logo_3.png
Updated

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:StMichaelsCathedral.png
Updated

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Loans_cash_jewelry_pawn_shop_sign.png

Updated

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Sweet_eats_logo.png
Updated

[languid kayak]

Neat, now the only https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Beever's_live_music_sign_logo.png is left tiled

[proud cobalt]

This would be ideal, so long as every model follows that pattern, along with every icon

[proud cobalt]

Yes I think it's an important part of the sign as it's one of those long plastic banner type signs

[digital helm]

I like the idea, but I guess the problem is items that have the same name but different icons/models. E.g. Water Bottle and Fishing Rod.
We have the model and icon pretty much automated now though anyway.

[languid kayak]

Icons use the in-game names though

Actually, not sure about the models, as we have texture names too?

[languid kayak]

Yeah, I guess it'd be best to keep for locations then, especially as that's not automated, and having red image link with a proper name for location image and logo

1. Allow the editor to easily upload the image by clicking the red link
2. Assure proper names
3. Prompt users to actually go ahead and do the screenshot for new locations

Just have to make a proper fallback set up so the placeholder image could be set if it's missing one.

Speaking of which, I think pages like https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Knox_Telecommunications could be better with the placeholder image.png? That or another placeholder images like the survivors that were only mentioned

[digital helm]

Could add the fallback fairly easily, then I guess just make it a link to the missing file so it can be uploaded

[digital helm]

A placeholder image could be good. I wonder what alternative image we could use... we have the survivor and the region one

[languid kayak]

yup, exactly that 😄 Just probably gonna wait till at least most images will be semi-accurate name, though technically we could probably automate it? Would ease ThinkDock's some work, too

[digital helm]

How's this? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Infobox_character
If the image doesn't exist, it'll display the default, which is a link to upload the missing file. It'll also add it to https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Pages_with_broken_file_links
If no image is defined, it'll use the default, and the link will be the name parameter, else the page display title. It won't add it to the category (this is to avoid filling that category up with pages where an image doesn't exist)

Here's an example of the latter https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Kevin_Spifenmeister

[languid kayak]

sounds fine I think, but why https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Infobox_character is there? By design or by accident

[digital helm]

What do you mean? Infobox_character is where I added it to

[languid kayak]

oh, by there I meant https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Pages_with_broken_file_links 😄

[digital helm]

Oh, the category. That's just for the example. I was going to remove it after

I'll add it to the item and regional infoboxes then sometime this weekend. Those ones because we have a default image for them

[languid kayak]

yeah, I wanted add navboxes for Brandenburg, Ekron and Irivington with the placeholder image, just never got to it 😄

[naive imp]

I can handle the logos no problem, just keep in mind that they are being done along with the revamps of all location pages so may take a while to actually be done.

Also if b42 drops before I'm done they will be on hold along with all existing locations until we have the new towns and basements sorted out

[naive imp]

@languid kayak @digital helm So I was thinking, we have {{improve}}, but maybe a {{rework}} might be helpful as a second mbox? Rimworld wiki has a version called rewrite.

https://rimworldwiki.com/wiki/Template:Rewrite

Because a lot of stuff will need to be reworked for b42 and a seperate mbox may make it more clear

[proud cobalt]

I think that would be handy, just depends if we think outdated covers that or not

[proud cobalt]

@languid kayak @digital helm Which style is prefered? I'm assuming Soup. I want to start on recipe ingredients

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Stew
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Soup

[lucid junco]

Stew looks more intuitive with hunger reduction table, soup is more compact and neat

[proud cobalt]

Yeah i thnk soup is newer as it uses the new template

[lucid junco]

I think its better

[digital helm]

Soup, but I'm bias

[digital helm]

Rework sounds good. It could be specific than just 'outdated' or 'improve'. Sort of like an invitation to completely scrap what's currently there

[naive imp]

Great. Not home atm but when I am I'll see about working on getting it set up

[bright phoenix]

is this right? is disorganized supposed to be in the positive traits group?

same goes for pacifist

[lucid junco]

Its positive, wdym 😄

@languid kayak

Axe Man also lacks (occupation trait) tag

So does Desensitized

[languid kayak]

Soup

[languid kayak]

Guess it depends where do we cross a line between improve 🤔 We currently have a bunch or articles in that category https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Articles_in_need_of_improvement and it indeed can be pretty vague

[naive imp]

I just think it'll be helpful for clarification's sake. I mean we have a lot of {{improve}} on articles that have been there forever with no reason on the mbox

So we don't really know why it was added

I think a separate template would be good to establish specific reasons as to why, especially because the improve is a little vague

Also people don't like putting reasons up I've noticdd

I don't think it'll be too much of a maintenance burden

Plus me working on a template would be good for my technical knowledge and help get me up to speed with templates

[proud cobalt]

Fixed thanks

[proud cobalt]

Because its unique whereas Amateur Mechanic for example has both the occupation trait and normal trait

[digital helm]

I agree. I think this would be a good start for you. Don't worry about the complexities of the other mboxes. We can worry about that after you have it working, and are comfortable with the basics.
Start with this: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Mbox
And add parameters {{{1}}} https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Templates#Parameters
Message me if you need help

[languid kayak]

oh nvm, I noticed that Vail is fine, then go on with it @naive imp feel free to choose an icon, if not we'll get a matching one later 🙂

[naive imp]

I will let you both know when I have something of note

Gonna sleep tho, got work tmrw

[languid kayak]

np 😄 (I just woke up 😆)

[proud cobalt]

Lunch time here 😆

[lucid junco]

Oh, aight then

[languid kayak]

the name in between paranthesis is more like there's two traits with the same name, hence the (occupation trait), I see Calvy fixed the two other ones though

[quasi thunder]

Hey, does anyone know how to fix this text?

[proud cobalt]

Could you provide a link please

[quasi thunder]

Link to the article? If so, it has not been created yet.

[proud cobalt]

All good, whats causing the text to show? Is it a template?

Are you translating this section of occupation?

[proud cobalt]

Seems to be the table reformatting the text due to the size of the window/ length of the text. is your window full sized?

You could force both words to go under the image by adding <br> before the image
[[File:profession_burgerflipper.png|link=Burger Flipper]] <br>[[Burger Flipper]]

[quasi thunder]

Okay, one moment...

ahahahah

I have a new meme

short blade/uk

O

everything is super

I fixed it

Thanks

[languid kayak]

you can try adding   between the texts, it would casue the text to go below image. Other than that, the width is too small for the element I guess

oh nvm, seems fixed 😄

but yeah, <br> works too

[quasi thunder]

Ahahah, yeah. But thx)

[languid kayak]

Different resolutions is the reason I changed icons to be a different table in some pages like foraging IIRC recently 🙂

[quasi thunder]

This affect the position of the text?

[languid kayak]

if there are in two different rows, then they are aligned 😄

columns*

[quasi thunder]

What is <ref> and </ref>?

[languid kayak]

references, when used below see also and after navbox you have to add

==References==
<references />

They allow text to have marks like [1] or [2] that can be clicked so the reader can verify the source and see where it came from, like a dev blog or a youtube video.

https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Cite I think we should have a link to it in our help too (if not we have to update it :D)

It's actually mentioned in here: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Help:Style_guide#Article_sections but maybe should be more visible

[quasi thunder]

I got a little confused about the text 'cause of <ref>, but now everything is more clear)Although I don't understand why things like "main" or "about" don't have a full ukrainian translation and are displayed partly in uk and party in en :/

[proud cobalt]

@languid kayak @digital helm Thoughts on naming scheme for evolved recipe pages? Something Oatmeal (crafted) or Oatmeal (evolved recipe), theres some where it gets more complicated like Rice (pot) Rice (pan) or Rice (pot crafted) Rice (pan crafted). Im leaning towards crafted for all pages, and additional descriptors like pot or pan where required

Also on moving recipe ingredients to evolved recipes

[languid kayak]

If there's just two, then one would be Oatmeal and another Oatmeal (whatever) and {{See}} on both pages. If there's few, the Oatmeal would link to disambig and both would be Oatmeal (whatever) and Outmeal (whenever)

I think (crafted) and (evolved recipe) would work though? As the (evolved) could be too inconclusive?

but yeah, naming can get complicated indeed 🤔

[proud cobalt]

Its mostly pasta and rice that will have 3 pages

[languid kayak]

Though I did got a question from @lucid junco today actually about the naming of perks. WE kinda follow what Wikipedia does and I like it, but if you guys want (names) for some articles it could work too, as long as redirects are kept

as people will just search for "Oatmeal" anyway. Either on google, on the wiki iteslf or less likely (though I do it), by modifying the URL

and any potential future bots would do too

just like the one from undeniable back then

[quasi thunder]

Sorry for interrupting, but... I noticed something...
what is it? And how do you fix it?

[languid kayak]

Speaking of which, I never really touched the idea on public, but once we have all the splits a bot would be a good idea 😄 Not sure I'm on the task, but wikis like Tarkov wiki has a Discord bot , and I'm pretty sure other games too, and like I said, undenabile wiki bot was linked in here in the past once.

[languid kayak]

try clicking edit and previewing; sometimes exact error is shown on preview

[languid kayak]

Other than that, there's something wrong with the template usage and the page is autocategorized, but the error is not shown if it's done by us. We autocategorize them to this category so they are picked easier, see https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Site_maintenance

… and it might be the second case here 😄 I have some catching up to do but it seems it was the infobox change by @digital helm? If you can't figure it out, don't worry too much, it's mostly to communicate us (which got me thinking, do we have hidden categories set up?)

[quasi thunder]

[languid kayak]

But yeah, the recent change was a change to the infobox images done by Vai it seems 😄

[quasi thunder]

Infobox. Mh

If I understood

[languid kayak]

okay, I made the category to be hidden by default, so if you don't have the "Show hidden categories" in https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-rendering-advancedrendering it won't be shown here but still tracked for us or other editors to fix 🙂

Speaking of which, any other categories missed from https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Site_maintenance should be hidden by default? Pinging mostly @digital helm for that, but anyone's free to throw ideas. These won't show with that option disabled (which is default for unregistered or newly registered accounts), I always enable it so forget about their existance :D)

As in, do you think stubs or pages to improve should be categorized as such for unregistered/new accounts? I think so, as we have mboxes for it and just more technical issues should be "invisible" by default

[quasi thunder]

https://tenor.com/view/larry-clash-royale-twerk-twerking-cl-gif-25874642

[languid kayak]

(documentation here's btw: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Tracking_categories )

[quasi thunder]

Ahahah, uploaded the information, and then this: forget it🙂

I do the same when I explain something not understood by others. Now I understand my interlocutors))

Have you been an admin for a long time?

[languid kayak]

depends how you define long time 😄 I'm administering pzwiki since 1 February 2023, Vail's been there from July 2018

Though my first pzwiki edit was back in 2016, was more like on-off editing back then

And wikis in general is as old as 2005 lol

Though I have to say, while I know the basics I've never been a template wizard 😄

[quasi thunder]

Ahahah

[languid kayak]

But yeah, for the most tasks, you basically just have to have a basic text editor knowledge, some are not even available for non-admin accounts, so a lot of things while discussed here, should be transparent to someone editing here and then 🙂

[quasi thunder]

I still don't understand if I can somehow fix the article so that there is no "Incorrect template usage" tag?

[quasi thunder]

I would prefer to translate the wiki into uk on my own, as it is sometimes annoying to redo the crooked translation of others... But it's too much... toooo much...

[languid kayak]

Yeah 😄

[proud cobalt]

The english wili will grow by at least 1/3 the size with B42, if not more

Which is scary itself, let alone translating

[quasi thunder]

[languid kayak]

Even worse with the ever-developing nature of the wiki. We've been trying to improve the translation as much as possible, and there's still some tricks planned, but no ETA if/when they'll be, so it is what it is right now, though some improvements are being under way, see https://pzwiki.net/wiki/PZwiki:Project_Translations but most things are on hold

[proud cobalt]

We're about to hit 6,000 articles, id guess we have over 10,000 by the time b42 is stable

[quasi thunder]

ohhh.....

[languid kayak]

There were attempts in automatically translating some stuff (like item names) from what's in the https://github.com/TheIndieStone/ProjectZomboidTranslations (and hence game files, though keep in mind the game's translations are frozen till b42, see pinned messages in #translations ), and there's plans to get back to it, some initial ones can be be seen in https://pzwiki.net/wiki/PZwiki:Item_list/tr and https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Localized_link – I think Vail (or Calvy?) works on automatically importing the transcripts too

[quasi thunder]

What is Speakers count?

[languid kayak]

it's people who decided to put https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:User_language on their page

see my page for example: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Faalagorn

[quasi thunder]

And what does this placement give?

[proud cobalt]

It's mostly personal, but also lets people know your native language, so they may ask for your help one day for something in your language

[quasi thunder]

Okay. By the way, can I work on the translation of the game somehow? Because he's quite crooked there...

[proud cobalt]

Once B42 releases community translations will open, #translations will be more help with that, but translations are on hold until then

[quasi thunder]

Damn

[proud cobalt]

You can work on fixing current translations if you want, and you can use those in your own game, but theres no promise it wont be a waste of time when B42 releases

[quasi thunder]

Ahahahah

very calming)

Is eng your native language?

[proud cobalt]

Yes im a native English speaker, its the only language i speak

[quasi thunder]

Only or not only, but all pzwiki and pz in English)

[quasi thunder]

By the way, I still need an answer)))

[proud cobalt]

I dont think theres anything you can do to fix that, has to be fixed on the template side

[quasi thunder]

🤔

[lucid junco]

God old slavic ")))"

[robust latch]

That being said I highly recommend focusing on finished locations such as Rosewood, Riverside. Or things that won't change with the arrival of b42 such as; weather, fire, knox infection etc. @quasi thunder

[quasi thunder]

Translation is not correct only in the context of subjects. Drinks, food, weapons, tools, glass fragments... And a complete lack of TV translation.

[robust latch]

As Calvy suggested you can always start working on unfinished untranslated articles but thread carefully when it comes to items and tiles I'd say, they are subject to change or are changing currently

[proud cobalt]

Waiting for cache to fully update, but we're over 6k now with the evolved recipe pages

[quasi thunder]

Full update?

[proud cobalt]

The wiki uses a lot of caching that can take quite some time to update

[languid kayak]

Well, the ones what use Cyrylic keyboard 😄 Took me a while to figure

okay, will catch later, gotta go now

[lucid junco]

Its the most prominent clue that can help you figure out if you are talking to average slavic person

The urge to type ")))" is hard to overbear)))

[hollow finch]

sui

[naive imp]

Was written at midnight my time lol timezones are wack

[naive imp]

If you want to translate in-game locations, I'd suggest sticking to Rosewood, Riverside, Muldraugh, and West Point for now, along with their associated articles. They are the most high traffic location pages amd have been finished for some time.

However, keep in mind that once b42 releases, everything is subject to change, and the translations will need to be manually updated to match the English version, as that version is the version everything else should be based off of.

Feel free to ping me with any questions. Welcome, and I hope you'll stick around! 🙂

Do keep in mind a LOT is on hold currently, as others have discussed.

By the way, @languid kayak what exactly is on hold and for what reason may I ask? I know the gist is that work has paused but what are the specifics if you do t mind me asking?

I'm nosy lol

[quasi thunder]

I'll take note and if don't forget, I'll contact you)

[languid kayak]

Well, we're slavic as well, but not using Cyryclic keyboard 😄

[languid kayak]

you mean as far as translations goes?

That'd be MLEB and pretty much everything Vibrance worked on

[lucid junco]

Like keycaps or just Cyrillic language

[proud cobalt]

I never considered Poland would be Slavic but I guess that makes sense. Maybe it's problematic that I thought Poland was more Germanic considering the history there 😄

[proud cobalt]

Polish is written in Latin script

[languid kayak]

Actually, our language has not really much connection to the Germanic languages

[proud cobalt]

🤔 Interesting. The only time they brought up Poland in school was 1939. But we spent years on Western Europe

[languid kayak]

~~https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Special:Contributions/Sharpgolden~~ is an intersting conept

EDIT: not sure what I wanted to paste, but that's definitely not that lol

[naive imp]

Damn this shit complicated but I think I'm beginning to understand

@digital helm So for parameters, they're just listed in the template {{{like this}}}? And then if they're named, you just put in the template?

Ex. In order to get: {{Rework|reason=outdated}}, I would put in the template code:

{{{reason}}} as a parameter, and then the template recognizes it and uses it in the above example?

Obviously we'd do the noinclude and whatnot once the code is finalized to make way for the usage and documentation too, as as I understand? But that won't come till later

[proud cobalt]

yep {{{reason]}} is the variable that the user inputs, then you just display that

[naive imp]

Ok. From what I understand we use anonymous parameters the most though? Is that right

Looking at other mboxes it's the {{{1}}} {{{2}}} etc

I think I'm starting to grasp it

[proud cobalt]

Yeah theyre just not named so you can do {{Rework|outdated}} in this case {{{1}}} would be the first parameter given which is outdated

[naive imp]

Ok that's what I thought

Pardon my inexperience lol

I ask like a million questions lol

[proud cobalt]

Nah its all good, templates can get complicated quickly, for example this mess
https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Template:Recipe&action=edit

[naive imp]

@digital helm @languid kayak So from learning from looking at the source of other mboxes and that mediawiki help page I put this together so far https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Rework

I havent texted it yet

*tested

what y'all think

[digital helm]

It looks good. I see you even used if statements 😄
Just note having a pipe | in a parameter like {{{1|}}} will display it as whatever is to the right of the pipe, so in this case it'll be nothing. Which is the same as {{if: {{{1|}}} | {{{1}}} }} which you've done for content. So just doing {{{1|}}} here is more efficient.

Other than that it looks great. We'll worry about translating later, which is its own beast.

[naive imp]

I appreciate the kind words. I tend to pick things up rather quickly when I have hands on experience and good examples to study

What other things could we add later down the line?

[digital helm]

<noinclude> and <includeonly> you'll need to do first before it'll be useable. When you do {{rework}} on a page, it transcludes EVERYTHING on that page, unless you use the noinclude and includeonly tags. anything wrapped in noinclude won't be included when it gets transcluded. Anything wrapped in includeonly will be transcluded, but won't be displayed on the source page (Template:Rework).

So, you'd wrap wip in noinclude and the template in includeonly.
Then if you include {{rework}} in the noinclude, it'll display it exactly as it would on a page

When I say wrap, I mean <noinclude>text here</noinclude>

[proud cobalt]

Ok so with recipe specific information moving to individual recipe pages, how do we feel about just having a mega table for those that still want to cross check (for some reason). Its grouped by food type by defualt, then can be sorted by header. It's one hell of a table though. Splitting was pretty unweildly and still had tables that were too wide. With good linking i think this will work

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Calvy/sandbox2

By splitting i mean having a table for each food type

[naive imp]

SO THATS WHAT THATS FOR

[digital helm]

Yes, I like this. I guess the alternative is splitting the table by recipe. But this is probably better.

We will need to split the table by spice too I think.

[naive imp]

I always wondered that lol

[proud cobalt]

Yeah its for transcluding same with how the items pages work

[digital helm]

There's also onlyinclude, which we use on the item pages. But don't worry about that

[naive imp]

https://tenor.com/view/smoke-hair-smokey-gif-16042039

Lol this is kinda fun I like this

Under the hood work like this is neat

[proud cobalt]

https://tenor.com/view/zach-mdx-mandala-exchange-gif-21603734

[digital helm]

Hacker man

[naive imp]

Hac

(The meme man meme)

I don't have it saved lol

Holup

[languid kayak]

should be able to use item icons for columns I guess? Would save some space

https://tenor.com/view/hacker-hackerman-kung-fury-gif-7953536

[digital helm]

True, icon column would match other lists we have

[languid kayak]

looking at Wikipedia, it seems that even stubs are hidden category there 🤔 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Stubs

Though as far as various game wikis I checked, it seems sometimes inconsistent what's hidden and what not.

IMO the non-hidden categories would be what users would be using to navigate. The hidden category are what allows editors to find pages that need to be worked on so pretty much everything from https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Site_maintenance . Yet again mboxes are visible to everyone equally, so not 100% sure.

[languid kayak]

is this true btw? That it's lounder when backing? I guess it's because of the beeper? Are there any other vehicles would need that note then? https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Chevalier_D6&curid=9682&diff=457369&oldid=434581

[languid kayak]

Also maybe language categories like https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:En should be hidden by default? Pinging @digital helm for though

[digital helm]

I've got to catch up on that discussion, then I'll let you know my thoughts

[digital helm]

Sorry for the delay with this. I'm happy with (crafted), then (pot crafted)

[digital helm]

I think we stick with the 'main' one (if there is one) without the brackets, so Oatmeal and Oatmeal (whatever). If neither would be considered the main one (and there's a significant amount of pages it could be referring to), then Oatmeal would be a disambig page.
For food items/evolved recipes, I'd say the non-crafted one is the main one.

[languid kayak]

both are crafter, one's regular and one's ecolced recipe I think

[digital helm]

yeah, so I'd consider the non-evolved one the main one

[digital helm]

I think you did, and I think I was against it, for all the spam we had 😄

[proud cobalt]

Yeah id agree, non evolved/non crafted items take priority on naming

[proud cobalt]

I went with Pasta (crafted pot) but happy to change if needed, all still wip

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Evolved_recipes

Also i overrode this page as it is the name of a recipe. In case you want to keep it somehow @languid kayak
https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Hot_Teacup&oldid=445239

[digital helm]

This is fine. It's the same item. Just got changed from a normal craftable item to an evolved recipe item. Will need to add back that history though

[digital helm]

crafted pot is good. Correct grammar is probably preferred here

[digital helm]

Sorry, I overlooked this. Remember we can't add/remove tt to existing templates. If we do, it also needs to be added to every language for that template, otherwise it'll break the template for those languages, adding them to https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Incorrect_template_usage #pzwiki_editing message
I've fixed the other languages now. Just something we need to remember

[proud cobalt]

Which style do we like best? (All are not polished or finalised, just a basic idea of layout)
Style 1:
https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=User:Calvy/sandbox2&oldid=463049

Style 2:
https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=User:Calvy/sandbox2&oldid=463051

Style 3:
https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=User:Calvy/sandbox2&oldid=463053

[digital helm]

Table definitely. "Main" is intended to be used after a heading. E.g. if a heading is called ==Soup== {{Main|Soup}} would be used after the heading.

[digital helm]

This was fixed here #pzwiki_editing message it was a problem with the template. If "Incorrect template usage" category is added, it's usually because there was either a mistake in the way a template is used, or a template is missing a translation. In this case it was the latter.

[digital helm]

IMO the non-hidden categories would be what users would be using to navigate. The hidden category are what allows editors to find pages that need to be worked on so pretty much everything from https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Site_maintenance
I agree. Same with the language code categories.
I completely forgot __HIDDENCAT__ was a thing, I don't think I've ever used it

[quasi thunder]

So, does that mean I need to check every template to see if it's used correctly?!?!?! Because my article has that tag, but everything is translated.

[digital helm]

What's the article? There are often several templates that are used, so can be difficult to decipher which one. Some will have Translation error: Translation string missing from source. in bold red

If it's an occupation, trait or moodle, I fixed the uk navbox template which would've added it. https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Navbox_stats/uk
Just needs removed and future to be translated. So the right side of the equals symbol

| future = future
| removed = removed

[quasi thunder]

Oh... All is well... The article is no longer on the list.

[digital helm]

Oh good. Would've been part of that fix then. Although it still needs to be translated https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Navbox_stats#How_to_translate

[quasi thunder]

Alright, I'll take care of it now.

[digital helm]

There doesn't seem to be anything specific to reverse noise in the vehicle scripts, just general engine loudness, so I'd assume this is a global vehicle thing. I wonder if there's a debug option to test this

[robust latch]

It really is, but IDK how the game processes the sound, might just be louder for players but quieter for the game itself

Oh my god lol

[digital helm]

wow lol

[quasi thunder]

I was going to do it yesterday, but I didn't understand what it was or if it was worth touching

[robust latch]

But all they have to do is translate the translation guide I updated that too

It works for Turkish

It will work if they translate removed and future args

(And have a sup tempalte too I think)

[digital helm]

yeah, but it'll be broken until it's fixed. So fine with adding it in English

[robust latch]

OK I understand

[proud cobalt]

Ok currently the page is looking like this. Im not a huge fan of how wide it is still

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Evolved_recipes

[robust latch]

Looks good, this will include Everything?

[digital helm]

Hmm, a bit wide on mobile. Maybe we can go without 'description'? But it's also fine as is imo

[proud cobalt]

Its a reference to have everything in one place as i expect people will not be happy if that gets removed. But the main way to see the data would be going to the actual page of the recipe
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Evolved_recipes

[digital helm]

Main page, as in https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Stew

[robust latch]

Another handy meta page for something colossal, I like the idea

[proud cobalt]

Thanks Vail, got timed out for using markdown on accident lmao

[digital helm]

Are you planning on having this on the Recipe ingredients page under "Evolved recipes", or be a separate page?

[proud cobalt]

The table with values is the transcluded subpage, while the new table is directly on evolved recipe

[quasi thunder]

My head is boiling from that article. I'm not sure what to translate and what not to...

This is porridge

[proud cobalt]

You shouldnt need to edit that

It will add /uk to the end of every page

[quasi thunder]

And what is it?

[languid kayak]

Well, the Discord bot iself doesn't have to be present in this server (up to nasko I guess), but server owners could invite it to their servers, something like https://github.com/the-hideout/stash

[languid kayak]

Thanks! Can it be spawned still? Or was the code removed altogether? Base.HotDrinkTea

[languid kayak]

Yeah, I like table the best, so style 1

[languid kayak]

yeah, we never did 😄 We can take a look if we need all the tracking categories, but I created them back then. You can disable them by simply entering - https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Special:TrackingCategories

https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Tracking_categories

I may take a look later, but right now a bit tired/lazy tbh, catching some recent changes, really, really slowly.

[proud cobalt]

Not sure actually

A bot would be cool, ive experimented with discord bots before. Trouble is hosting

[languid kayak]

Speaking of translations, I think we miss the Ukrainian translation for the new skin? I never pinged other editors so we only have a few languages, you'd have to send it to me or Vail to add, as it's admin-only.

https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Citizen-footer-desc&action=edit

The message is:

PZwiki is the official wiki dedicated to sharing information about {{ll|Project Zomboid}}. It covers all content relating to its gameplay, lore, and development. This is an official site of {{ll|The Indie Stone}}, and is maintained by volunteers.<br>Want to contribute? Start on the {{ll|PZwiki:Community portal|community portal}}. For copyright information, please see {{ll|PZwiki:Copyrights|copyrights}}.

[languid kayak]

I think there is an option to say noise ranges, but not sure how exactly it works, especially with vehicles

[languid kayak]

Icons would make it smaller

[languid kayak]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Recipe_ingredients will be a redirect eventually, right?

[proud cobalt]

Yeah i think thats best, make it a redirect

[proud cobalt]

True, are they explicit enough though

[languid kayak]

We can add legend table

[quasi thunder]

Yeeeeep

[digital helm]

You only need to edit this https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Navbox_stats/uk and translate everything on the right side of the equals sign. This is just the instructions on how to translate the template https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Navbox_stats#How_to_translate the "paste" part of it has already been done

[quasi thunder]

Finally, I revised the article, and now it makes sense!

[digital helm]

Means there's a template loop. So a template that calls itself, causing an endless loop

[quasi thunder]

I've already corrected

WOW 2/9!!! Almost everything!

[digital helm]

Looks good. I've fixed a mistake. The includeonly tag wasn't closed

[quasi thunder]

Oh, thanks!

Now I better understand how to work with this.

[digital helm]

oh, right. Of course 😄 I think I forgot because it's not a subpage, in wiki terms

[quasi thunder]

It's "/", right?

I somehow forgot about it

[digital helm]

Yeah, open without it and close with it

[quasi thunder]

Perhaps it would be better to continue translating Navboxes rather than regular articles...

[digital helm]

Templates in general are a good start. They're pretty much the building blocks for articles

[digital helm]

I think it's actually the same item. I can't find it at all apart from when it was added as an evolved recipe item in b41.65 (earliest I can find any reference to "Teacup"). Unless I'm missing something?

[digital helm]

Oh, for the ingredient values table? I think that could be good. It's mentioned what each icon is in the pre-cooked ingredients table anyway. Only problem is when the icon gets used more than once, like soup and stew

[proud cobalt]

At that point i think we just keep the titles

[digital helm]

@proud cobalt not sure what you had planned, but I've added all the models for the evolved recipes. Just baguette is missing one, because it doesn't have a worldstatic model (probably has an x file one)

[proud cobalt]

Yeah i planned to add them thanks

[languid kayak]

we can modify the icons I guess; similar to what you did with the weapons tables

[languid kayak]

as in no model in-game or can't be exported?

or is this a model when eating?

[robust latch]

Should we add all navboxes in here https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Category:Navbox, to here https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Navbox_see_also

[quasi thunder]

For some reason, two columns in my article(navbox items) are not switching to the uk version, even though everything is done the same way as in the previous one, and it works there... And adding /uk just breaks everything. Does anyone have ideas what's wrong?

[proud cobalt]

Which items, they probably have a pipe in the Navbox so it will show the same English page no matter the language. Also navboxes are a little outdated currently

[quasi thunder]

[naive imp]

Welcome to pzwiki. Hardly anything is 100 percent smooth here but we try our best (and fail very often)

[naive imp]

Navbox locations is long overdue for a rework but I want everything to be done first

Which will likely take several months

[quasi thunder]

Ahahah, okay, I understood you

[digital helm]

Sure. Except for /row and /sandbox.

[digital helm]

No worldstatic model defined, which is for placing on the ground. It probably has a model for animations (eating) which are X files (unless something changed I'm not aware of). I hadn't checked

[digital helm]

I'm fine with either. Happy to leave decision to @proud cobalt

[proud cobalt]

Pretty sure they still are

I'll do some testing, want to get this page right

[proud cobalt]

Bro come on

Pls pz gods

Hi all, after some discussion for expanding the scope of the bot. All opinions welcome, also pinging people who are directly related.

After some very brief discussion with Vail, I brought up the possibility of using the newly updated script-parser (possibly more info on that in the upcoming wiki news) to maintain language pages alongside English pages.

The bot, using the script has been maintaining English pages for the past month or so, ensuring as accurate as possible information for readers, without the burden of manual reviewing. It also has the capability to generate new articles based on this same information. Currently these generated articles look like this (possibly with some minor changes).

https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=User:Calvy/sandbox2&oldid=461287

At the same time the parser has been built with the ability to use the games translation files to output language content. With some tweaking the article generator would be able to do the same for articles in any language.

What I propose is using the parser to generate item articles in languages that don't currently have these pages, and using the bot to upload them. Then the bot would also maintain the information in the infoboxes and CodeBoxes as it currently does on the English wiki. This would also add code boxes back to language pages, as they are automatically maintained.

The idea for roll-out would be to have a trial with a language that is not currently maintained, I suggest German, then if we're happy roll out to the languages with active/semi-active maintainers, Turkish, Russian, French, Brazilian Portuguese. Then rolling out to all the popular pz languages, such as Spanish, Chinese, etc.

I don't believe it would be possible to support right to left languages.

Ideally I would love to support every possible translation, but unless something is done about the API rate limit this isn't feasible. With just 20 languages it could take 2 weeks non-stop to update the entire wiki.

This would significantly increase the searchability of the wiki, as someone who speaks Russian could find an item in their own language, and may be prompted to update the written information in their own language, instead of having to create the entire page from scratch.

For clarity this would be for item pages only, not locations, skills, etc.

Pros
*Near 100% basic information in every language for all items
*No need to maintain infoboxes or CodeBoxes in language articles
*May encourage new editors to maintain their language, instead of having to create it from scratch

Cons
*A lot of the bot is private source currently. This is mostly because I use hard coded file paths (aka I'm lazy). But happy to get something that could be shared publicly working.
*Wider scope, could 10x the size of the wiki practically overnight
*Longer bot times
*More reliance on bots
*More translation templates to maintain

If we're interested I'll try get a language example for people to look at. Vail also has the ability to create the item lists in other languages for referencing.

Obviously this is a huge and completely new undertaking, and directly affects all editors, and the translation project which has been simmering away for a while so all feedback welcome.

@languid kayak @digital helm

That's all I can tag sorry, pz discord is not happy with me right now

[lucid junco]

https://tenor.com/view/darkviperau-where-achievement-gif-26036947

Where are the pings

[digital helm]

eaten up

[proud cobalt]

Trying to ping people but automod not happy. If you got pinged please read above

Won't try ping anymore

[lucid junco]

I think its fine as mass page maintenance or as a first step of creating/translating the page

Though I'm curious how it would handle gender based language

[digital helm]

Most translations would be taken directly from the game translations. All other translations would need to be done by editors, or taken from existing articles. E.g. Condition here would need to be translated https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=User:Calvy/sandbox2&oldid=461287#Condition

[proud cobalt]

How do articles work in Russian? For example English
'An' Axe
'A' Bowl

[proud cobalt]

Condition could be set up the same as other templates though right? Where a translator could just add the translation?

As the numbers are the same for all, it's only the header

[digital helm]

That's true

[lucid junco]

Axe
Bowl
Dont remember the technical term for those prefixes but we dont use them

[digital helm]

'article' is the term

[lucid junco]

Oh

[digital helm]

Makes it convenient if they're not used 😄

[proud cobalt]

Distribution could just have the blurb translated, as items can use ll and the rest is a direct usage of item and room ids not translatable

[proud cobalt]

Ahh OK. That makes it easy to be generic

[languid kayak]

You can pick Polish; I can then proofread it, as I'm native speaker. Also Polish is mostly in a bad shape.

RTL languages are not supported by the game yet, though some hacks on #translations exist for Arabic, so we'll see

[lucid junco]

Though russian often changes the word structure itself, which can come up as a problem

[lucid junco]

As an example "The condition of an axe/a spoon/a knife"
We get "Прочность топора/ложки/ножа"

[digital helm]

yeah we'd have to get entire sentences translated, rather than sections. We'll have to see though, since every language can be different

[languid kayak]

Polish is gender-based too, though if you want Russian it'd work but I don't know Cyrylic sadly

[lucid junco]

Though as I said, if used as a first step in the page creation - its good

[languid kayak]

For automated ones it has to be worked out by using things like : or – to sound correct, but it's nowhere near natural.

But yeah, just having the page would be a right step to push folks into correcting it. Besides, there are tons of plain grammar errors on Polish pages anyway, done 10+ years ago. I sometimes corrected some, but they still have outdated info anyway.

[languid kayak]

in Polish it's the same, see
https://sjp.pl/topór (male) or https://sjp.pl/siekiera (female)

ten topór (this axe [male])

ta siekiera (this hatchet [female])

The tables linked also say how to say it in different parts of the word:

P topora, toporem, toporowi, toporze
S toporów
Z toporach, toporami, toporom
z topory

M siekierą, siekierę, siekiero, siekiery, siekierze
N siekierach, siekierami, siekierom
n siekier

[proud cobalt]

Plus if the page name is correct, and it has an up to date accurate Infobox, that's what people are going to care about

[proud cobalt]

That would be good if you're happy to use polish to test

[languid kayak]

yup, unless Sharpgolden want to test Russian, similar structure. Or someone elses want to another language obviously 😛

[proud cobalt]

If we get it working well I'm happy to slowly expand it, Russian would be good to go to as pz is very popular in Russia

[proud cobalt]

Interesting (although I can't read a word in those links) is there any rule to what is female and male?

[languid kayak]

not really

you just know it by heart 😄

or instinctively

or use a dictionary like that

https://sjp.pl/sl/en/

[proud cobalt]

Is there any way to write generically
"[[X]] is an [[item]] in [[Project Zomboid]]" where gender is excluded?

[proud cobalt]

Like French

[languid kayak]

it's the biggest most active Polish dictionary btw combined from people's contribution and most polish dictionaries so most complete/up-to-date and used for pretty much all spell checkers

[proud cobalt]

So there's pronunciation differences across polish speakers?

[languid kayak]

There's an inclusive variant too https://isjp.pl/en/

it contains all the new pronouns not used in the common speak, but slowly going to publications or translations

[languid kayak]

not really, least not so much

you can read more about that in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grammatical_gender btw

[proud cobalt]

Oh interesting, it is hard to do in a gendered language. Hard for me to grasp the nature of gendered language as an English monolingual

Like why does I'm hungry require gender

[languid kayak]

and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_type_of_grammatical_genders

[proud cobalt]

So what do the letters in the table mean?

[languid kayak]

yeah, translaations are hard 😄 You really have to get through hoops if you don't want to say someone's gender explicitly

[languid kayak]

not sure there's a legend somewhere 🤔

[proud cobalt]

#pzwiki_editing message

[languid kayak]

It's a flags that were described here it seems? http://www.koalar.com/literaki/sjp_flagi.html

Initially the dictionary was used for Literaki (Scrabble equivalent), it just grew

the website's not loading though, gotta check the web archive

Some are these too: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_grammar#Declension

apparently it was some old flags which doesn't seem to be used now https://web.archive.org/web/20190417030510/http://www.koalar.com/literaki/sjp_flagi.html

I mean the page was about the old flags 😄

The new ones lack legends, at least I can't find it?

I'll take a deeper look somewhere later, maybe after sunday though unless I find some time during the week

Also some other languages have other rules, like German writing each nouns starting with a big letter.

plural numbers are complicated too, but majority of software doesn't even handle that: https://www.unicode.org/cldr/charts/45/supplemental/language_plural_rules.html

Do keep in mind that when it comes to Mediawiki's interface it should be supported

[proud cobalt]

What I'm feeling is we do our best then slap AutoT on it

[digital helm]

Finally, a use for AutoT 🙌

[proud cobalt]

Even if we include conditions and fixing in English to start with. At least it's there, someone can use Google translate or a translator can ask how to translate it

[digital helm]

So honestly trying to translate sentences may be more effort than it's worth. Just stick with English with links using {{lcs}} or the language code

[lucid junco]

I think English also has enough weird grammar and exceptions that throw me off

[proud cobalt]

The only rule in English is that there's exceptions to every rule 😂 that's what they always told me growing up

[proud cobalt]

Thank God we moved to ll for see also. See also basically won't have to be changed

[lucid junco]

Though that can be said about any language tbh

[proud cobalt]

Yeah it just depends what we're comfortable with. At that point why not redirect to an English page

This is using gpt, how bad is it @languid kayak "Topór jest przedmiotem w grze Project Zomboid."

This is Google translate for comparison "Topór jest przedmiotem w Projekcie Zomboid"

[robust latch]

This is both scary and promising at the same time which is why I agree using this on a non-maintained language first. Also since you share this I am assuming everything is going to your perfect liking with English pages, right? Hence the languages suggestion?

[proud cobalt]

Yeah the bot is doing great on the english pages, there were some kinks to work out but its doing great. The best way to do it would be to check for English pages that exist, and upload the language version of that. That way we don't end up with pages that shouldn't exist like a bandaged arm which is technically an item worn by the player.

[robust latch]

I see

[languid kayak]

Both are correct, yeah.

[languid kayak]

Categories should be next?

[languid kayak]

The rules are not so clear, there are at least two or three different styles of writing based on the popular academics/newspapers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Style_guide

not to mention language differences like UK, US and so on 😄

[languid kayak]

@robust latch you will want to translate this section again, as it's not a magic word and page title https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Template%3AHeader%2Ftr&type=revision&diff=463541&oldid=462667 – thanks for brining it up btw, though you can also write in here, more likely (and faster) for me or Vail to pick up there 😄

[robust latch]

I feel like we discuss so many things here so it makes sense to sometimes discuss less important or less urgent matters on wiki talk pages.

[robust latch]

Translated

[languid kayak]

Well, I do get to see them when patrolling, but otherwise might be missed, and it's just me 😄 Vail kinda misses them and some edits (currently just admins and bots) may be autopatrolled, so they could be missed.

I guess wiki talks are good for folks not on Discord mostly

[proud cobalt]

Things move so much faster on discord, it definitely helps

[robust latch]

@lucid junco you reckon we can call https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Mahoney complete? It seems to me. If so we can officially put the survivors task on the shelf. Pinging @languid kayak also

[lucid junco]

There isnt that much info about him, so yeah, thats pretty much everything

[languid kayak]

I'd say so, yeah. Glad to have it done 🙂

btw, not sure what you tested on https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Infobox_item/sandbox but I think it's not needed anymore @robust latch? Can keep it though if you want to

though the main template got some changes since 😄

[naive imp]

This is the way

That way it's very obvious that it may need work and we may get new translators that way

Because people like to fix things that are minor and that can blossom

That's what happened with me, I joined originally just to fix a car spawn point if you look st my oldest edits

Now I got all this

[naive imp]

Totally all for this.

I've also been maintaining a small amount of mboxes that are common copy pastes translated by other languages lately, and am looking to expand. It's on my PasteList subpage

Of my userspace

I gotta ask our more common translators but everything is indeed on hold so who knows of they're even still active

My little way of contributing to translations

[robust latch]

You can delete it

[robust latch]

this

[naive imp]

Alright I think I did this right, @digital helm @languid kayak what do yall think? Ready for deployment? If so I'll delete the underconstruction

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Rework

@proud cobalt too

[languid kayak]

did some minor fixes (changing the color to the screwdriver too), other than that I guess it's fine?

[quasi thunder]

How are you doing wiki-guys? Guys... Is this word used at all? Because I've only heard it on YouTube.

[languid kayak]

Yeah, it's used, but doing fine 😄

[quasi thunder]

Got it. What time do you have?

[languid kayak]

10pm, so late evening-ish, but we have editors from all over the globe 😄

[quasi thunder]

22:43?

You're in Europe, right?

[robust latch]

Do you reckon documentation of this is good to go for translations? Asking because its gigantic and IDK if its done or not. Seems done tho. ----> https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Infobox_item

[languid kayak]

I just plan to link some things in documentation to the script guide, though I didn't get to it

btw @robust latch this is needed still or not as well? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Navbox_stats/sandbox

[robust latch]

Feel free to delete that aswell,

[robust latch]

Ok I ll hold fast for now

[quasi thunder]

🙌👍🤏👌🤲🤘🫸👎🫶🤛🤝🫸✌️🖖🫵🙏

[quasi thunder]

I hope I didn't say anything bad...

[digital helm]

Also note it's likely to change for b42

[digital helm]

Looks good. Just missing translations now. Happy for me to add that? Otherwise you can give it a stab if you'd like

[naive imp]

Go crazy with it

I'm proud of myself lol

I thought it'd be super hard but it actually wasn't that bad

[robust latch]

Yeah thats a given

[proud cobalt]

Tarkov wiki does this for updates, shows on every page similar to our site notice

[digital helm]

The idea is fine. It'd need some JavaScript so it can be closed and stay closed, rather than popping up on every page. To me it makes it feel less like a community wiki though. We could look at doing something similar though. Also concerned about popups like that, since it's a bit intrusive on mobile

[proud cobalt]

They show it anyway 😂, I don't like popups it's just another way of doing it. I think Site notice would be enough

Or page version really

[digital helm]

Could still look at closing the site notice in a similar way, it annoys me sometimes

[languid kayak]

Yeah, I noticed it too. Though won't site notice will do it for us? It's not closable, the closable ones require extra extensions IIRC

but yeah, if we could find a way to make it closable notice instead, it'd be an improvement

(and yeah, page version too :P)

[proud cobalt]

I think Site notice and page version is good enough. It doesnt have to be up all of IWBUMS. Even if it's for the first week of each unstable patch or something

[languid kayak]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Wooden_window - shouldn't it be Wooden Window if that's a movable name? Or is it a generic name not spotted in game?

[languid kayak]

btw, when browsing recent change sstumbled on this: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Deaf#Effects – I think both can be verified relatively easy?

Just can't do it now, but if no one beats me to it, I will get to it eventually

[proud cobalt]

It doesn't have a movable name, but likely just got missed when they all went up as sentence case to start with

[languid kayak]

Do we need that info? Seems redundant, but maybe the info is not clear enough since an example was given? https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Organized&curid=37723&diff=454039&oldid=445755

[proud cobalt]

I also can't check it but it seems that's how it should work

[languid kayak]

guess we'll check it later :D. Just something to have in the back of the mind

[proud cobalt]

I don't think it's needed

[lucid junco]

Nope, deaf cant wake up from the alarm clock

just tested it

They can even sleep when alarm clock is active

[lucid junco]

They can still hear ambient sounds?

[lucid junco]

You can hear players talk in mp

Both via radio and proximity

[languid kayak]

that's interesting and probably not planned, will probably require verifying back in b42 but I'll adjust the notes if you didn't already.

IIRC playing on splitscreen with one person deaf doesn't really make a difference if you're sticking together as you hear the other player sounds anyway 😄

[languid kayak]

I remember we had a discussion about it with @robust latch and @digital helm, but I'm getting back to it – are we keeping the note or removing? If kept, it probably shouldn't be a subheader I guess and added to other vehicles that have the same situation 🤔

[languid kayak]

I see you removed them, thanks, I added the notes back so it's clear and reworded the section, but now I'm not sure – can you only hear the voice chat and not the written one? (including text transfered through walkie-talkies?)

Also, can't check now, but IIRC the music doesn't play as well?

Anyway, feel free to check and correct me or reword the section. Wasn't sure if I should split it further to lists of * or maybe create a new section (trivia), as effects are usually concise bullet points.

[lucid junco]

Weirdly I heard ambient in the mp

But not in sp

[languid kayak]

might need clarification then?

and text written by other players is shown or just the voice chat? or you didn't test that?

[lucid junco]

I saw my text, but havent tested other's\

[languid kayak]

I also think the exploitbox is too harsh

Exploit warning! This section contains unethical tactics that are not intended gameplay.
I guess let people play how they want, as long as it's not cheating in MP

[languid kayak]

I may want to retest that later, if I won't forget 😄 Unless someone beats me to it again 😄

but maybe not this week, I'll see

[digital helm]

I haven't gotten around to seeing if I can test it. If it's the same for all vehicles, I'd remove it and put it on the vehicles page. If only some vehicles, then maybe an 'engine sound' or 'vehicle noise' heading instead.

[digital helm]

Maybe, but I'd still say doing that is a bit cheesy. That's kind of the point of the exploit box. It's not cheating, but it's not intended gameplay, and could ruin the experience. Some people prefer not to know about those things. A bit like cheats in age of empires, once you start using Photon Man, you can't stop, and the game is ruined.

[languid kayak]

yeah, mbox is fine, just rewording it to be less judgmental I guess 😄

especially the "unethical" part ;D

[proud cobalt]

Unethical is rough. Unintended is more accurate

[naive imp]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Faneto

@languid kayak @digital helm looks like spam? Account has no other contributions.

Was going through recent changes and stumbled upon it

[languid kayak]

yeah, we're aware. They also uploaded some images, wasn't sure what to do since it wasn't something harmless per se but weird indeed, seems they didn't contribute since, we had similar cases before too

[languid kayak]

from the video 👀
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nB8t96LFv6k

oh wait, it was from before

so there's build 42, we're done let's go home 😄

oh and I just realized it's uploaded in Vertex Break channel https://www.youtube.com/@VertexBreak

We'll also get new map features, from https://youtu.be/o1X7d34_c8Q

and a new crafting interface @digital helm https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37aM8yEhkXg

[languid kayak]

Also not something terribly useful, but another shot for the newspaper stands compared to https://pzwiki.net/w/images/c/cf/Build_42_newspaper_benches.png in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4B7_EEuKcrY&t=133s

[digital helm]

Yeah it's likely spam. I was going to give them a couple of weeks to see if they actually contributed, then delete

[digital helm]

True. I may have gone a bit too far with that wording 😅
Unintended is good

[languid kayak]

btw, does b42 being without multiplayer for a while change our view of jumping straight for b42 once it drops iwbums even if it's just single player? We have history now, I guess the most annoyance will be item renameds unless we want to keep some b41 items

[proud cobalt]

I think we still should, we are set up to have the B41 revision links

[proud cobalt]

So i set up the ingredients this way because these are the food types used by the game. Such as when it says "Add random meat" but i dont think i like it. Wondering if we should sort by hunger value change instead?

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Stir_Fry_(griddle)

Otherwise im decently happy with this
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Evolved_recipes

[lucid junco]

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Axe_Man
Isnt it 25% for everything but zombies?

[digital helm]

It does separate it a bit too much to me. I think removing the subheadings would be good and sorting by hunger. Using these headings may be better where there's significantly more items

[proud cobalt]

I think i keep other seperated? Have one heading for ingredients and one for other? Other is mostly condiments... are condiments ingredients?

[digital helm]

Still not sure about the width of the ingredient values table https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Evolved_recipes#Ingredient_values
If you scroll across to the right, you don't know which item the values are for.

[digital helm]

Usually spices. Spices should be separated

They act differently to normal ingredients. They reduce unhappiness and boredom instead of hunger

[proud cobalt]

Me either, i dont think using icons will fix that

[digital helm]

yeah, table is too big for that

[proud cobalt]

I agree, splitting by recipe will tripple the length of the article

[digital helm]

I wonder, do we need it on this page? We have it on the recipe page and the individual pages, so is it needed here? It's a ridiculously long table as it is

[digital helm]

Is swing speed not the same regardless of what you hit?

[proud cobalt]

I think we'll get the same response as changing any of our other table heavy pages...

Also first prototype of a polish generated page. Keep in mind the sandbox is english so header and templates wont auto translate @languid kayak @digital helm
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Calvy/sandbox2

[digital helm]

I know, but 50% of this table isn't usable imo

[proud cobalt]

Yeah i know, its not good. The only reason i kept it at all is for the pushback when we remove tables. All the info is on the needed pages

[lucid junco]

I dont think so?

I need to test it out

[digital helm]

Awesome! Seeing this gives more reason to use a template for the distro tables. At least for the headings. So they can be easily translated, and don't rely on storing it

[lucid junco]

Or someone has to look into the code

[proud cobalt]

i was just thinking this

[digital helm]

can't find anything to do with attack speed, but I found that it also increases damage to trees by 50%
IsoTree

      float var4 = (float)var2.getTreeDamage();
      if (var1.Traits.Axeman.isSet() && var2.getCategories().contains("Axe")) {
         var4 *= 1.5F;
      }

and here's calculateCombatSpeed in IsoGameCharacter.class

      if (var3 != null && this.Traits.Axeman.isSet() && var3.getCategories().contains("Axe")) {
         var2 *= this.getChopTreeSpeed();
         var1 = false;
      }

and getChopTreeSpeed

   public float getChopTreeSpeed() {
      return (this.Traits.Axeman.isSet() ? 1.25F : 1.0F) * GameTime.getAnimSpeedFix();
   }

Essentially, increases attack speed by 25%

But still good to test in-game to confirm

[proud cobalt]

So the template would just be this? Or can we have it update translations automatically like infoboxes?

    <div>Axe distribution
        <span class="mw-customtoggle-togglebox-Axe" title="{{int:show}} / {{int:hide}}" style="float: right; padding-right: 30px; padding-top: 4px; font-size: 0.7em; font-weight: normal;">{{int:show}} / {{int:hide}}</span></div>
    <div class="mw-collapsible mw-collapsed" id="mw-customcollapsible-togglebox-Axe">
    Effective chance calculations are based off of default loot settings, and median zombie density. The higher the density of zombies in an area, the higher the effective chance of an item spawning. Chance is also influenced by the [[lucky]] and [[unlucky]] traits.    <div class="toggle-content">```

[digital helm]

Yeah, we'd add the translations like other templates

table headers too

[proud cobalt]

Table headers are more complicated as its divided between the tables

[digital helm]

I mean having as a separate template.
So this is one template

    {| class="wikitable theme-red sortable" style="margin-right: 15px; width: 95%;"
    |+ {{ll|Containers}}
    ! {{tt|name=TEMPLATE|default=Building/Room|arg1=room}}
    ! {{tt|name=TEMPLATE|default=Container|arg1=container}}
    ! {{tt|name=TEMPLATE|default=Effective chance|arg1=chance}}

[digital helm]

Is the reason you didn't use https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:ToggleBox to simplify creating tables inside the template? And could you use that instead of most of this

[proud cobalt]

I remember trying to get it to work in togglebox was a nightmare

This would be a great candidate for lua

[digital helm]

like 90% of our templates 😄

[proud cobalt]

[languid kayak]

item→przedmiot

[proud cobalt]

Do we want to use direct links or ll?

[digital helm]

direct links in the text body

[proud cobalt]

So [[Project Zomboid/pl]]?

[digital helm]

yeah

[proud cobalt]

For items with multiple IDs are we happy if the bot uploads the file for the first id? That way we have more than nothing? @digital helm @languid kayak

[digital helm]

for creating pages? Yeah, I think so

[proud cobalt]

Yeah for the automated language pages

[digital helm]

ah, yes

[proud cobalt]

Tested the bot uploading on my sandbox page, seemed to work

https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=User:Calvy/sandbox2/pl&oldid=463857

[proud cobalt]

Ok i think we could do this with 2ish templates, one would contain

    <div>Axe distribution
        <span class="mw-customtoggle-togglebox-Axe" title="{{int:show}} / {{int:hide}}" style="float: right; padding-right: 30px; padding-top: 4px; font-size: 0.7em; font-weight: normal;">{{int:show}} / {{int:hide}}</span></div>
    <div class="mw-collapsible mw-collapsed" id="mw-customcollapsible-togglebox-Axe">
    Effective chance calculations are based off of default loot settings, and median zombie density. The higher the density of zombies in an area, the higher the effective chance of an item spawning. Chance is also influenced by the [[lucky]] and [[unlucky]] traits.    <div class="toggle-content">```
and would require a parameter for the id of the item. This is what would handle the translations. Then another that would accept 4 parameters, container, vehicle, zombie, and foraging, that would have the start of each div.
```<div class="pz-container">
<div id="containers" style="flex-basis: 30%;">
    {| class="wikitable theme-red sortable" style="margin-right: 15px; width: 95%;"
    |+ {{ll|Containers}}
    ! Building/Room
    ! Container
    ! Effective chance
    |-```
This is where the translations would be for the headers too

So usage be something like

{{LocationTable/header|container}}
    | Bag_ToolBag
    | {{ll|Bag_ToolBag}}
    | 0.44%
    |}
</div>
{{LocationTable/header|vehicle}}
    | Carpenter
    | {{ll|Truck Bed}}
    | 1.75%
    |}
</div>
{{LocationTable/header|zombie}}
    | All
    | 15
    | 2
    |}
</div>
{{LocationTable/close|Base.Axe}}```

Unless we just used parameters for the part of the box that should be used?

{{Location Table|section=vehicle}}
{{Location Table|section=close}}```

[proud cobalt]

Ok so i went ahead and got this going, are we happy with this? Will require me to update the distribution script to output in this format @digital helm
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Location_table

And update all the current ones

[digital helm]

The idea seems good. Can't take a good look at it right now though

[naive rock]

whats the point of the first table?

Seems to me all it'll do is mislead people

[proud cobalt]

Ok everything is working other than the formatting of the tables in the box
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Calvy/sandbox2/pl

This is with the distributions script^

[proud cobalt]

That's how its meant to work and thats how it is in the code. it's just different in practise

[proud cobalt]

I have fixed the formatting issue

[languid kayak]

Just a minor nit I realized; wouldn't it be better to have starting item first and then the producet in the table here? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Evolved_recipes#Recipes

[languid kayak]

I still think we should switch to icons + tooltips + legend, just didn't get to it yet 😄

[languid kayak]

ah you mean even with items it'd be too wide? That could be it too

[proud cobalt]

Shouldn't be an issue to change

[languid kayak]

btw, I realized, with that in mind we're back to having code on pages? If it's automated and well maintained, shouldn't be an issue indeed

[proud cobalt]

Yep should be no trouble with automation, makes the wiki more accessible to speakers of other languages

[languid kayak]

I remember that cuttont trees is kinda bugged, as in "attacking" trees loses less axe durability than using cut tree action. Might be the same for damage

[proud cobalt]

This is the updated prototype
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Calvy/sandbox2/pl

[languid kayak]

initially we avoided using ll for two reasons

• confusion of editors coming from other wikis / ease of writing just [[
• amount of notes and page load speed (performance)
  But I'm undecided now, as it make stranslations easier

I see a lot of pages leaving just the default links linking to English pages instead of redlinking language ones

[proud cobalt]

I spoke about this with Vail, in body we will just use [[item/pl|przedmiot]]

[languid kayak]

you took the traits from the translation files, right?

[proud cobalt]

As it's automated, its not an issue for the script

[digital helm]

Also capitalisation. As it'll change to the page name

[languid kayak]

true

[proud cobalt]

Everything is parsed from the current translation files, but i plan on asking around in #translations for anyone who has better translations that aren't pushed

[languid kayak]

Technically [[Item/pl|przedmiot]], but I guess it doesn't matter 😄 (Capital I as per https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Help:Style_guide#Preferred_code_style )

[proud cobalt]

Oh true, thats an easy fix

Im using a dictionary system that it will pull from. Used GPT for testing while you were asleep

    "pl": {
        "intro_template": "'''{lowercase_name}''' to [[Item/pl|przedmiot]] w [[Project Zomboid/pl|Project Zomboid]].",
        "headers": {
            "Usage": "Zastosowanie",
            "Condition": "Stan",
            "Location": "Lokalizacja",
            "Code": "Kod",
            "See also": "Zobacz także",
            "Consumable properties": "Właściwości konsumpcyjne",
        },
        "help_text": "Pomóż PZwiki, dodając informacje do tej sekcji.",
        "translate_reason": "Przetłumaczone za pomocą plików tłumaczeń gry.",
    },```

[languid kayak]

Yeah, there's no glaring errors, it's short sentence so unless something is confused, it spews correct translations 😄

I got a feeling we're running circles but in a different way because we used to have translation database for common words in the past hosted on the wiki 😄 We just moved to scripts

[proud cobalt]

It will never be perfect, as it needs to be so generic that it works for every item. Its just a starting point for translators. And so long as its understandable it should be ok

[languid kayak]

btw https://tarkov.dev/ is similarily constructed – it pulls all the item, quests and traders name from the game files and the rest is translated here: https://github.com/the-hideout/tarkov-dev or here https://poeditor.com/join/project/YA8ZrCsxTi

For the "lucky" and "unlucky" perks you should use these, though Gerras did it so they are nouns and not non-gendered

https://github.com/TheIndieStone/ProjectZomboidTranslations/blob/master/PL/UI_PL.txt#L1417
https://github.com/TheIndieStone/ProjectZomboidTranslations/blob/master/PL/UI_PL.txt#L1453

[proud cobalt]

That would be part of this right? It's not done by the script
https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Template:Location_table/pl&action=edit

This was also done with gpt for testing so havn't verified it

The open/close arrow is gone for some reason 🤔 @digital helm
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Location_table

[languid kayak]

yeah, that's exactly the translation table we used to have, just smaller 😄

[proud cobalt]

This is just for location tables (Going to start calling them that now) template though

[languid kayak]

did some improvements: https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Template%3ALocation_table%2Fpl&type=revision&diff=463953&oldid=463933

[proud cobalt]

Awesome thanks

[languid kayak]

Wasn't sure what months_available bonus_months and malus_months are for, is it foraging?

btw, I assume the eastern/western change in https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=West_Point&curid=3363&diff=460023&oldid=457353 is correct? If not I can confirm on in-game map, as I always get confused on isometric one 😄

[proud cobalt]

Yes foraging, bonus and malus increase/reduce how often

[languid kayak]

oh and btw, not sure you noticed, but a nice reference for you @naive imp

However, what we do have is a new modding architecture which will help a lot in the transition, that’s heavily inspired by the way that a certain game that’s set on a World out on the Rim does it.
from https://projectzomboid.com/blog/news/2024/08/tidy-up-time/
😄

oh btw and @thin cloud I think it's Will doing the actual Thursdoids, but since you write for some other news, can you change at the very bottom in "The Centralized Block of Italicised Text would like to direct your attention to the PZ Wiki should you feel like editing or amending something." both the name and link to PZwiki?

name from PZ Wiki to PZwiki as that's the name we settled with and unified to
and
the link from http://pzwiki.net/wiki/Main_Page to https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Project_Zomboid_Wiki? (redirect still works, but we moved from the main page to the new name some time ago 🙂

Wiki's already well-known, but I guess it could help SEO a little more, too 🙂

[proud cobalt]

Could you sanity check this please @languid kayak
https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Template:Consumables/pl&action=edit

[languid kayak]

gotta use https://github.com/TheIndieStone/ProjectZomboidTranslations/blob/master/PL/IG_UI_PL.txt#L448C34-L448C40 for unhapiness as that's how geras translated it

[proud cobalt]

Oh i didnt know these had official translations, thanks

[languid kayak]

and https://github.com/TheIndieStone/ProjectZomboidTranslations/blob/master/PL/Tooltip_PL.txt#L203C24-L203C31

and https://github.com/TheIndieStone/ProjectZomboidTranslations/blob/master/PL/Tooltip_PL.txt#L207C28-L207C34

and a few more 😄 https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Template%3AConsumables%2Fpl&type=revision&diff=463983&oldid=463981

But yeah, all can be pulled from the translations actually

Wasn't incorrecy, mind you, it's just synonyms or improvements over the original translations

[proud cobalt]

Yep just used those versions

Should be updated now

[languid kayak]

but yeah, hard for chatgpt or any translation pick a correct version often, as they don't know context. Like "czerstwe" is fine, but pretty much only for bread 😄

[proud cobalt]

Yeah expected with machine translation. Glad you sent those ill be bale to use them as a starting point now

[digital helm]

Weird. Nothing has changed in the CSS. I'll take a look when I can

[proud cobalt]

I think it has something to do with the documentation closing early due to the closing curly brackets for the tables? The best I got was it showing the close arrow when open, then disappearing when closed

It is line for line the exact same as the manual box 🤷‍♂️

All the code is in English, is it worth adding translatability to CodeBox and CodeSnip?

the Code header will be in the translated language

Could you please translate this @languid kayak
https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Template:AutoT/pl&action=edit

[languid kayak]

done

There are some issues since the name of the page is automatically embedded :/

[proud cobalt]

Ty, Not sure if its feasible to change that

[proud cobalt]

Two last ones, if you could check this,
https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Template:Durability_weapon/pl&action=edit

Then translate this
The {name} has a maximum condition of {condition_max}. Its rate of degradation is influenced by the {skill_type} and [[maintenance]] [[skill]]s. The chance of losing [[durability]] can be simplified to the following formula: <code>1 in (35 + maintenanceMod &times; 2)</code>. Where \"maintenanceMod\" is calculated using the {skill_type} and maintenance skills.<br>\n\n

[languid kayak]

{name} ma maksymalny stan {condition_max}. Na szybkość degradacji mają  wpływ [[Skill/pl|umiejętności]] {skill_type} i umiejętność [[Maintenance/pl|konserwacja]]. Szansa na zmniejszenie [[Condition/pl|stanu]] może być uproszczona do następującej formuły: <code>1 na (35 + maintenanceMod × 2)</code>. Gdzie "maintenanceMod" jest obliczony używając {skill_type} i umiejętności konserwacji.<br>\n\n

[languid kayak]

Few issues though:

• It's condition instead of durability
• {name} would start lowercase (there's no "The " in Polish)
• {skill_type} would probably be uppercase

Also {skill_type} wouldn't be declinated

[languid kayak]

Hm, I thought the blueberries and blackberries could be poisonous, has this changed? We have contradicting info in one page indeed: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Talk:Berries

[proud cobalt]

Hows this?
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Calvy/sandbox2/pl

[languid kayak]

These two should be settled

siekiera strażacka could be made to start with uppercase, page isn't pulled from translation at all, even when using ?uselang=pl 🤔

(and also starts with lowercase)

[proud cobalt]

Oh yeah thats fine i just meant for the condition template

[languid kayak]

Alternatively I can skip the automatic page/file naming I guess?

[languid kayak]

oh yeah, that's fine, minor nit is "Gdzie" should be uppercase, I missed the full stop 😄

btw, not sure you're aware yet but the links in the repairing table are wrong

[proud cobalt]

Nah that was me, ill fix that

[proud cobalt]

They are too, ill fix that too

[languid kayak]

https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Klej_do_drewna/pl&action=edit&redlink=1

instead of Wood Glue/pl

[proud cobalt]

Yeah just saw that

[languid kayak]

actually Wood Glue/pl|Klej do drewna

btw @proud cobalt seems https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Location_table is uncategorized and has some syntax error

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Location_table/pl is fine

[proud cobalt]

There's definitely an issue with at least the documentation, i need vail to help me with it when he's free

[languid kayak]

Just realized I translated it before, just differently 😄 https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Template%3AAutoT%2Fpl&type=revision&diff=464023&oldid=463997

Well, these translations will need some ironing out down the road anyway

[languid kayak]

and yeah, just seen it https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=User:Calvy/sandbox2/pl&diff=next&oldid=464033

Was supposed to change the case of a single word and changed them all it seems 😄

@digital helm I think we had this but I removed it as it was done manually, maybe we can automate it? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Talk:Water_containers

(and yeah https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Talk:Water)

ah, I just realized we lost the subheaders following the removal of the headers in https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Tiles#Baths_and_showers @digital helm

Though the page is due to be updated/revamped, along with renaming back to furniture, thing's that long overdue 😩

[proud cobalt]

Ok i found the issue its in fixing.py @digital helm the links use ll but also the translated display name. I'll change it to not use ll as its in body

Actually they should use name/pl|translatedname

[languid kayak]

I'm going to assume that info in https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Hyperthermia&type=revision&diff=463899&oldid=428001 by https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Special:Contributions/Goodnames is correct as per the talk page in https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Talk:Hyperthermia unless someone want to reccheck – if so, interesting where the previous values came from 🤔. Was it older b41 build?

(or there's some code that is not being implemented correctly/as expected)

I moved Fuberti's change to https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Talk:Survivor_stories but @serene sage you want to check it? Is it indeed a story we miss or just a random zombie spawning?

I also cleaned up's new addition on thise, I suppose Fuberti's info that there might be three zombies and that none can reanimate are correct? https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Flipped_Crash&type=revision&diff=464079&oldid=427473

[proud cobalt]

Ok i fixed the start, and the fixing usage. How's this?
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Calvy/sandbox2/pl

[languid kayak]

yeah, saw that, seems fine, minor nit would be ability for "Siekiery" skill name to be lowercase

which should be doable?

btw @robust latch you still need https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Navbox_stats/sandbox ?

[lucid junco]

I think thats just a clothing thing

[proud cobalt]

I fixed this specifically idk how it came back lmao

[lucid junco]

Zeds in certain zones can spawn with predefined clothes

Since churches are big, there will be a lot of zeds within the building already, in costumes and dresses

[languid kayak]

That's what I thought, want to reply to that or should I?

(was also wondering whether to ping you for that too :D)

[lucid junco]

Lemme check it out just in case in an hour (or two)

[lucid junco]

Also this one

If you haven't already

[languid kayak]

Verifying? No, I did not.

Just cleaned the note out

[lucid junco]

Ill check them both out

[robust latch]

Nope

[proud cobalt]

Ok actually fixed now
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Calvy/sandbox2/pl

Should i start the first few uploads with the bot?

[languid kayak]

nah, that touches other words as well 😄 https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=User:Calvy/sandbox2/pl&curid=55699&diff=464117&oldid=464081

Guys, is https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Exclusion_Zone_border classified as Louisville or a separate location?

like https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Burnt_town

[robust latch]

I think its safe to assume so

Yep

[lucid junco]

Technically its neither lv or valley station

Though we technically have LV border

If you remember the broadcast cutoff mechanic, where if you get into lv too early into the game almost every tv station gets cut off

Since it has a predefined zone, we can find out where lv starts

And its roughly half way into the refugee camp

So technically Burnt town and Exclusion Zone border isnt in LV

[proud cobalt]

Ok, now fixed again again
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Calvy/sandbox2/pl

[digital helm]

How is this? https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:Location_table/sandbox It's simplified a lot. Closing the divs and tables is contained within the template. It's a single template now, and I replaced sections with parameters. Should be a lot cleaner on pages

Also uses https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Template:ToggleBox

[digital helm]

All berries are treated equally last I checked. Blueberries and Blackberries don't exist anymore, as they're all just "Berries" (Winterberry, beautyberry and holly berry are not part of these).

A disambig page/link could be helpful here, as this page is just about the items called "Berries".

[proud cobalt]

Definitely cleaner, if you want to merge this ill adjust the script

[digital helm]

You're not using it on any content pages are you?

[proud cobalt]

Nope only my sandbox

[digital helm]

ok, I'll move now

[digital helm]

Found your missing arrow btw 😆

[proud cobalt]

HUH

[digital helm]

I think it was caused by the foraging part. The </div> at the start I think was closing a mediawiki div prematurely

For container, vehicle, and zombie, doing:

{{!}} warehouse {{!}}{{!}} {{ll|metal_shelves}} {{!}}{{!}} 1.75%
{{!}}-

Instead of:

{{!}} warehouse
{{!}} {{ll|metal_shelves}}
{{!}} 1.75%
{{!}}-

Should make the page a lot shorter. Can still indent if you want, that may still help

[languid kayak]

as in assume being part of LV or a separate location?

If part of LV, I'll adjust the category. If separate, it would need a new category and so on

[languid kayak]

good point

[languid kayak]

I guess it'd be enough to make it a separate location then?

[languid kayak]

I suppose "Siekiery" will just be uppercase 😄

Do you guys think this should stay? I'm uncertain https://pzwiki.net/w/index.php?title=Metagame&curid=2875&diff=462981&oldid=435567

[proud cobalt]

Wait i was looking at the wrong word

Siekiera vs Siekiery

[languid kayak]

You mention the actual berries called "Blueberries" and "Blackberries" or a "Berries" with BlackBerry and BlueBerry icon and ID?

[languid kayak]

I think berries are still due to be split (same with Mushrooms)

Okay, these should be settled now. All are split and named/categorized properly. I'm sure some of the maps in between are missing and a higher quality could probably be obtained/extracted from old game version, but so far we have these (also interesting to take al oop how PZ map evolved):

https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Knox_Country_map_(build_23).png
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Knox_Country_map_(build_38).png
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Knox_Country_map_(build_39).png
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Knox_Country_map_(build_41.65).png
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Knox_Country_map_(build_41.71).png
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/File:Knox_Country_map_(build_41.72).png (being the final map export used for the fianl b41 version, the one featuring early Brandenburg and Ekron)

Also removed the duplicates

There is one build 39 difference I didn't moved yet, not sure if we want it? It's kept in a history, mostly new Doe Valley areas being added:

https://pzwiki.net/w/images/archive/d/da/20180527103554!Knox_Country_map_(build_39).png vs https://pzwiki.net/w/images/archive/d/da/20180528052154!Knox_Country_map_(build_39).png

[languid kayak]

I think the old maps could be added to respective builds, I'll also add them to gallery on https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Knox_Country

[digital helm]

Speculation. If it was a news helicopter I'd expect to see it on the tv or radio. You could also assume that it's a military chopper but it doesn't come back because it runs out of fuel, or crashes. Or maybe a civilian helicopter that's looking for a safe place. There's not enough evidence to determine who or what it is. (maybe it's General McGrew coming to save us 😃 )

[languid kayak]

so remove/reword?

(and if so, which one :P)

[digital helm]

After some digging, it looks like they're right.

   public void initPoisonousBerry() {
      ArrayList var1 = new ArrayList();
      var1.add("Base.BerryGeneric1");
      var1.add("Base.BerryGeneric2");
      var1.add("Base.BerryGeneric3");
      var1.add("Base.BerryGeneric4");
      var1.add("Base.BerryGeneric5");
      var1.add("Base.BerryPoisonIvy");
      this.setPoisonousBerry((String)var1.get(Rand.Next(0, var1.size() - 1)));
   }

They're not referred to as blueberries and blackberries in the game anymore though. So I'd use the icon to describe them instead

[digital helm]

I'd remove, personally

[languid kayak]

funny how PoisonIvy berry can be not poisonous 😄

[digital helm]

Yeah. When it was added it was always poisonous, and it was the only one. Guessing this was changed as there was no reason to eat it

[proud cobalt]

Ok implemented this into distributions

[languid kayak]

which is kind a shame IMO, and folks who never played the game would still eat them.

[proud cobalt]

Ok @digital helm Sanity check for location table please
@languid kayak I fixed siekiery
https://pzwiki.net/wiki/User:Calvy/sandbox2/pl

[lucid junco]

Yeah

[proud cobalt]

This cuts down significantly on page length too

1/3rd the length basically

[digital helm]

I assume the attack speed would've been from this, which is a modifier for movement speed and combat speed. I don't see anything to adjust it to 50% (caused by hyperthermia)
Thermoregulator.class
getMovementModifier

         var2 = this.player.getMoodles().getMoodleLevel(MoodleType.Hyperthermia);
         if (var2 == 2) {
            var1 = 0.66F;
         } else if (var2 == 3) {
            var1 = 0.33F;
         } else if (var2 == 4) {
            var1 = 0.0F;
         }

getCombatModifier

         var2 = this.player.getMoodles().getMoodleLevel(MoodleType.Hyperthermia);
         if (var2 == 2) {
            var1 = 0.66F;
         } else if (var2 == 3) {
            var1 = 0.33F;
         } else if (var2 == 4) {
            var1 = 0.1F;
         }

I can't find anything for affecting thirst.
Tiredness seems like it should be endurance instead. Endurance is increased at level 2 and 3 hyperthermia, and increased a lot at level 4 hyperthermia (modifier is doubled). updateEndurance in IsoPlayer.class

This doesn't mean the change is wrong. I just can't find anything to confirm it.

[digital helm]

Looks sane to me

[robust latch]

Sorry I should have been clearer 😄 . That border should definetely be considered as a part of Louisville

[languid kayak]

yeah, thing's fine 👌

btw, we have https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Leafhill_Heights and https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Evergreen_Hill but no dedicated page for Central Louisville which technically is named in here: https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Central_Louisville_Community_Center

The https://pzwiki.net/wiki/Louisville#Businesses have even more suburbs. Pinging @naive imp for it, but I think someone else did actual splitting, was it Sharpgolden?

[proud cobalt]

I think we decided a minimum of 2 signs were needed to solidify a suburb location

[languid kayak]

But apparently it's not 🤔 as per #pzwiki_editing message and so is burnt town (which is technically a part of Exclusion Zone border now in the same manner Fallas Lake is part of Doe Valley)

[proud cobalt]

I pushed for the suburbs to be seperate but dont think i actually did it myself, could have been Ikip to make the pages