assassination

[echo geyser]

it wont matter what u play even up till like 27 28

[viscid spear]

I'm happy just getting 2k, now I can do M+ for drops instead of having to get rating

[gusty mirage]

And I suck

[alpine latch]

Yeah, I think Seli is like 3k as Sin

[gusty mirage]

[bleak sky]

flexing io just like that huh

[gusty mirage]

Aren’t you almost 2700?

[bleak sky]

stop flexing my io

tf

[gusty mirage]

I’ll never see 2.6 because I get griefed weekly

Unfortunate

[bleak sky]

slap your teammates

[alpine latch]

I'm more concerned about just getting some fucking Mythic gear. Running 20s at 246 item level seems tough (I need better trinkets for sure)

[gusty mirage]

What teammates

I stopped running with every group

[bleak sky]

oh you're in the pug life?

[gusty mirage]

The last tank I had thinks this week is easier than last week lol

[alpine latch]

@bleak sky What's your 5-man comp?

[bleak sky]

252s from vault should be more than enough to run those 23s 24s 25s

[bleak sky]

whatever pug is available

[alpine latch]

hahaha

I thought you might have a group

[gusty mirage]

Pugging 23s and 24s is actually miserable

[spice spire]

That’s cuz ur toxic af

Papi damn

[gusty mirage]

Yeah for sure

[spice spire]

But pugging 22+ seems miserable

[alpine latch]

I haven't gotten any 252 upgrades in a while, just because I have gotten really shitty 252s in my vault

[gusty mirage]

I’m the reason my old tank said “this game sucks I’m going to pvp”

[bleak sky]

somehow playing with a group made it harder to time keys even though we were in the same io range

[alpine latch]

And everything sims higher using my heroic Dom shards than 246 m+

[gusty mirage]

Nailed it

[spice spire]

Don’t let mister minalba hide the truth from u. He’s simply built diff

[bleak sky]

that's riptack

[spice spire]

Then you also went to pvp, checkmate

[bleak sky]

one day I'll catch them

[spice spire]

Nine vault enjoyer rn

[bleak sky]

yeah but the rank 1 sin on area 52 is 10/10Heroic

249s ilvl

it really doesn't matter

[gusty mirage]

@bleak sky when you going to be my push tank

[alpine latch]

Yeah, I just need an excuse for being bad

[bleak sky]

[spice spire]

Minalba is a damage terrorist when he tanks

[gusty mirage]

I saw you out dps a 2300 io sin rogue on your DH

[bleak sky]

[spice spire]

Tbf it was a combination of him, survival hunter icebladesx, and ww monk agreon that were dps terrorists

[bleak sky]

next season I'll try to keep a tank (bdk/vdh) as close in io as possible to the rogue

[gusty mirage]

Discounting my 4k dps on my 224 hpal, weird

Sorry can’t heal, dumping holy power into shield of the righteous

[bleak sky]

quake just tries to downplay you on every opportunity, insanely toxic

[gusty mirage]

Tank didn’t die, I did my job

[bleak sky]

[gusty mirage]

Use defensives better or something idk

[gusty mirage]

He actually hates me

And pretends to be my friend

🐍

[spice spire]

True

All rogues are snakes, don’t ya know?

I was actually just tilted that I couldn’t mage and cold snap my barrier again :/

[solid mica]

It's called RP

[subtle kiln]

excuse me, I am not a snake.

[alpine latch]

No but you can be

you have the power!

[spice spire]

Imagine not having the corgi critter shape as the default

[clever kindle]

the fuck

I just hit buttons

pretty sure im doing it wrong

dps go brrrrr

[glass tulip]

I just CT once and run to pull next pack, even if tank says no

That's how m+ works, right?

[bleak sky]

gotta keep the bleeds rolling

[clever kindle]

[bleak sky]

whatever it takes

[clever kindle]

I actually thought that was in relation to raid

or is it

idk anymore

[bleak sky]

if they're talking mfd I'd say raid yeah

and that's MA window as well

unless it's a very degen M+ build

[coral forge]

question for raid without having my shards am i better off using dashing or doomblade?

[clever kindle]

I normally just try to slam 2 envenoms off MA crit window after a 5 pt rupture then mfd env

[bleak sky]

I guess that's something you could sim

[clever kindle]

Pretty sure its doomblade

Theyre close with shards

[alpine latch]

Dashing typically doesn't take over until r4 Frost. Your mileage may vary, but that's typically when it starts to outperform Obe. Can't say for Doomblade though - haven't ran that in ages.

[clever kindle]

its all the same shit were walking aura buffs

[coral forge]

aight thats pretty much what i figured just wanted to make sure

[gusty mirage]

do you press them as hard as you can?

[alpine latch]

I'm also concerned about whether or not you hit your envenom keybind 6 times during the GCD to make sure it casts ASAP

If you're not hitting your keyboard 400 times a minute, are you really even playing?

[clever kindle]

yes my number keys are flaking theyre now just burning beacons of RGB in the middle of my keyboard

[clever kindle]

howd you figure out my outlaw rotation

[alpine latch]

Simple, I played Outlaw

And felt like I had 97 buttons to press every GCD

[gusty mirage]

what a GAMER

[timid cloud]

People aren’t just raw dogging their buttons?

Don’t have key caps anymore, I’m just hitting the switch now.

[clever kindle]

[thorny pond]

faster actuation

for sin?

[alpine latch]

Is it normal that my dslice is lower DPS than my ST?

Or is my dungeon gear just that bad?

[gusty mirage]

what are you simming at ST and what are you simming at dslice

also consider that ST has dom shards enabled and dslice does not

[alpine latch]

Dslice: https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/uL47g7oMybk2xFgUDEngAU
Patchwerk: https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/krQpmfWhxDEWUwarY9y6G3

Yeah, it just seems odd to me but maybe because I'm comparing it against a monk who gains like 2.2k by going to dslice

[proven saddle]

Shards of Domination are not active in DS sims.

[alpine latch]

Yeah, I know

Ohh, like even the standard shard effects?

[proven saddle]

Just the set bonuses.

[gusty mirage]

the standards are active

[alpine latch]

Yeah - I turn those off as to not bring the sim

I assumed since I'm multi-targetting for 3m in the dslice that my overall total would go up

Instead it goes down

[gusty mirage]

well dslice isn't just multi targeting

it also has a boss encounter

[alpine latch]

Yeah

I know CT is a damage loss (as is Sub > MA), but I figured the extra targets would make up for that

[gusty mirage]

lemme see if I can remember my raidbots login at work

[alpine latch]

I just remember your password is "damnoxiusexy"

But I forget your email

[gusty mirage]

true no one would ever guess that

because I'm ugly

[timid cloud]

.

That’s not true, King.

[thorny pond]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-squarepants-you-gave-me-the-ugly-patrick-star-gif-8498054

[gusty mirage]

I already apologized

[thorny pond]

Think moral of the story is to shower

[spice spire]

Mr. beach why are your eyes red

And speak clearly into the microphone

[thorny pond]

you said I'd be conducting the interview

[spice spire]

All rogues are snakes, sorry king

🐍

[thorny pond]

my soulshape is George

Goodboi

[spice spire]

Wait he’s mine though

[alpine latch]

Is anyone actually progging as NF? Or is everyone just going NF for 9.2 and re-clears?

[thorny pond]

NF is inting rn

[alpine latch]

That's what I thought ... lol

[spice spire]

Enjoying my final time as Necrolord

[bleak sky]

it's dead let it die

is it actually worth to port out of dos to swap talents into single target for muezallah?

or nah

[oak sky]

X

Maybe on another class

[bleak sky]

thanks

[timid cloud]

If I’m leveling NF it’s just Torghast, Emmis, & World Bosses.

[gusty mirage]

not if you pvp

Glad when? @spice spire

[spice spire]

You or me? For me never

For you, February

[oak sky]

oxi going for the mount or the title or?

[jaunty kayak]

is it possible to add KA into sims?

[spice spire]

Yes

external_buffs.kindred_affinity=0/45/90/135/180/225/270/305

That’s the line

[oak sky]

start at 5 tho

5/50/95/140/185/230/275/310

[jaunty kayak]

but it has to be advanced sim right?

[spice spire]

That’s if you’re venthyr remember

[oak sky]

oh

[spice spire]

And no you can quick sim

[oak sky]

duh

[spice spire]

Plug it down uh

[oak sky]

wait does it matter

thats to sync with first vendetta

[spice spire]

There

[spice spire]

It should sync either way. Iirc you don’t want to line it with your MA Window because as venthyr you’re already overcapped, or close on crit

I could be lit tho

[jaunty kayak]

i am venth dw.. can it be applied to top gear sim too? :(

cuz i got traded a myth sylv chest .. thats why i was wondering if its possible

[echo geyser]

yeah u just go to custom apl

[jaunty kayak]

ah im stupid xd cheers

[echo geyser]

[jaunty kayak]

didnt realise the custom api is in other sim options also xd

[spice spire]

Yep, thank you mr. ramfam

[winter vapor]

for the nine, are we holding flag for when the 3rd boss comes down?

or pressing on CD

[echo geyser]

do u want a PI to go with that or u fine with KA?

[spice spire]

I know the PI line as well papi

You think an unethical gamer such as myself doesn’t have sauce?

[oak sky]

[jaunty kayak]

cheers but not needed, i dont get PIs.. just KAs xd

[echo geyser]

that will be 15.29$ plz

[spice spire]

Can I just t3 sub 🥺

[chilly grove]

obedience or doomblade for m+ and raid? don't have money for both 😦

[spice spire]

Obedience if you can only make one.

[echo geyser]

just go obedience

[oak sky]

[spice spire]

Ideally you’d have obedience and dashing scoundrel - but obedience is good for both

[chilly grove]

ty ❤️

[clever kindle]

obedience is for venthyr simps were faerie gang now

[hexed frost]

Zyldock gang needs love too

[spice spire]

[reef axle]

Aaaand he’s gone lol

[balmy condor]

thanks for the pings

[limber lion]

Who the fuck

[slow marsh]

Cev not quick enough on the trigger

but im pretty sure it doesn't matter cuz only SBs can ban now that i think about it

[trail locust]

@limber lion hey saw yourguide whats best covenant for doing 14 keys in 9.2.5 with necrolord leg/+?

[limber lion]

maybe arbiter

[trail locust]

ok ty

[alpine latch]

So Cev already schooled me on going Bolstering in PF keys. I know some people run Dashing in ToP. Are there any other "one offs" that you guys are doing in higher keys?

[gusty mirage]

What’d I miss

[bleak sky]

dashing in top

[gusty mirage]

Take bolstering on any explosives week in any dungeon

[bleak sky]

I smell nochill

[alpine latch]

I'm just going off of subcreation

[bleak sky]

what keys are you running right now palmer?

[upbeat needle]

what level keys are you talking about

[alpine latch]

Just 19-20s right now, but I'm also trying to learn to make the choices now as we start to push. We are just putting together a push team now to see how high we can get by 9.2

[bleak sky]

keep playing obedience honestly

[alpine latch]

I'm going to fuck around in 15s to get a feel for Sub because I'm tired of only being able to play 1 spec. But I also want to push as Sin so I'm trying to learn as much as I can

[pallid bough]

dw sub is a 2 button spec

[bleak sky]

I'd only swap to maybe doomblade/zoldycks on plaguefall if I'm the only possibility of necro

[pallid bough]

and I am saying this as a sub enthusiast player

[bleak sky]

everything else is just obedience

[alpine latch]

this is literally my situation for PF/ToP keys right now

I'm the only with Necro leveled until the monk gets geared

[bleak sky]

what class tanks/heals for you?

[alpine latch]

Guardian Druid, Resto Shammy, BM Hunter, me, Enh Shaman (going WW for keys)

[bleak sky]

druid can play necro just fine

druid can play all covs

[alpine latch]

Yeah, can and does aren't the same thing

I'm fine going Necro for 2 dungeons. It's not the end of the world

[upbeat needle]

just play game use obedience

easy time

[alpine latch]

Our healer hates both PF and ToP so whatever it takes to keep her happy I'm down for

[upbeat needle]

besides bolstering on explosive weeks it's pretty simple

[alpine latch]

Yeah, Cev mentioned to go Bolstering on PF specifically since ever boss spawns adds

Which makes total sense

That's why I was asking if there's any other things that I should be doing outside the norm

[upbeat needle]

on PF only Tyr though

fort not really worth

[bleak sky]

nah obedience all day everyday, necrotic dagger + champy brand and that's it

[upbeat needle]

bosses die too quick even at 20

[alpine latch]

Isn't Bolstering just flat out better on trash though?

Since it's basically a permanent 15% damage bonus?

So on PF it would just remain better regardless, right?

[upbeat needle]

eh

[bleak sky]

eh

[upbeat needle]

i go dagger brand

dagger axe on tyr in other dungeons

[bleak sky]

I still take dagger champy brand on tyr everywhere

[alpine latch]

You actually go Axe? Everyone said that's super bad

[upbeat needle]

bolstering only really good bc orbs will give you stacks and yea the adds in PF help

[sudden hound]

bolster only really usable on explosive and spiteful weeks really. but your job isnt aoe as a rogue.

[upbeat needle]

^

[alpine latch]

Yeah, we funnel into prio target

[upbeat needle]

naw axe is pretty meh

[sudden hound]

like the other two have said. 99% of the time just go dagger and brand, and if its a really tough boss tyran dungo go dagger axe

[upbeat needle]

sometimes I have faith though

can be decent on high tyr bosses when they live for fucking ever

dagger on NW works when you're downstairs too

[alpine latch]

So many like a Spires (3rd boss) or PF you might run axe on Tyranical weeks?

[upbeat needle]

on last boss

[bleak sky]

at 24s boss still feel like they kinda flop (2:40ish bosses) so idk if I would take axes ever

i wonder if seli takes axe

[alpine latch]

IDK - I was hoping he'd be around but I hate pinging people

[upbeat needle]

@marble hemlock

there u go

did it for u

[alpine latch]

[upbeat needle]

depends on who you got too

[echo geyser]

@marble hemlock plays sub now

[bleak sky]

that's fair

[sudden hound]

ymmv but i run axe on dungeons where bosses scare me. so for me personally i take it in soa, top, and sd

[bleak sky]

seli is dark side rogue now but still a sin gamer

[marble hemlock]

what?

[upbeat needle]

Palmer wanted to know if you took axe Seli

in keys

[bleak sky]

would you ever take axe as sin on tyr keys?

[marble hemlock]

sometimes

[alpine latch]

Technically, Minal asked if he took axe

lol

[bleak sky]

even if they're lower

[upbeat needle]

oh yeah

minal

[balmy condor]

if he can ping me about a dead covenant with a dead soulbind and send me down a rabbit hole for the 15th time this expac you can ping him for a sin question, stay strong brother

[bleak sky]

@balmy condor kyrian good with pelagos make it good now

[alpine latch]

I just want to know when I should take something outside of the norm. I'm only on 19-20s right now but I'm trying not to suck

[bleak sky]

orbs = mastery = big bleed = big dam trust

[gusty mirage]

[balmy condor]

yeah let me just pull gains out of my ass

[upbeat needle]

19-20s honestly I'd just focus on getting better as a group if you're w a team

[bleak sky]

thanks you da best xoxo

[balmy condor]

if you give me enough time with the sims I'll get sin to 18k sims

trust

[upbeat needle]

Routing

optimizing paths etc etc

[bleak sky]

if you find 1% gains everyday

[echo geyser]

@balmy condor have we checked if theres any secret kyrian gains in the apl

[gusty mirage]

Not you too

[bleak sky]

we get to 490k dps sim in a year

[hollow escarp]

the brightness in Bastion keeps you awake

[bleak sky]

[gusty mirage]

[hollow escarp]

if that's worth anything

[echo geyser]

nah jk i dont want a steward

soulshape is bae

[balmy condor]

no but I have to check at some point because the shiv thing for fae is a downgrade for the other covenants and that means we'll need to get covenant variables going for shiv

[upbeat needle]

@bleak sky mood

[bleak sky]

[upbeat needle]

lmfaooo

[bleak sky]

I gave up on title tho

I just wanna pass riptack at this point

[upbeat needle]

my group quit

can't find another one

rip

[balmy condor]

damn I just go ratiod

[bleak sky]

pugging is poggers

[alpine latch]

Seli, teach me to be good 😦

[marble hemlock]

Idk

How would I know?

[upbeat needle]

had 2600 io tank get slapped off the edge on 1st boss of SD on a fucking 21

like buddy

come the fuck on

[alpine latch]

I mean you're better than me

[marble hemlock]

But regarding Axe, I play it sometimes, depending on dungeon

[alpine latch]

By a lot

[marble hemlock]

I.e. I wouldnt play it in SD, but its bis in mists imo

casue last boss mists is pain

[bleak sky]

any specific level of keys you'd start taking axe on tyr though?

[marble hemlock]

top for sure too

[bleak sky]

would you bother taking it on 24s 25s?

[gusty mirage]

What shitty dps powers should I take in m+

[gusty mirage]

Nah he’s washed

[past belfry]

Woah, is NF actually going to be a thing in 9.2?

[marble hemlock]

hopefully not

[alpine latch]

roflmao

[past belfry]

Is it already a thing and I’m just out of touch?

[echo geyser]

soulshape is coming

[bleak sky]

nf is bis

bis in slot bae all day

[alpine latch]

best in slot in slot

[gusty mirage]

It’s okay I’ll be holding group therapy for sin rogues once we get closer to 9.2

[alpine latch]

I don't think you have the time for that

[gusty mirage]

True my guild is switching to 3 days a week

[past belfry]

Oh boy, I better get renown farmin

[alpine latch]

I'm trying to get my guild to tack on 30 minutes so be a 2.5h 2-day guild. I feel like an extra hour overall will help us a lot

[bleak sky]

3 day kinda cringe ngl oxi

[gusty mirage]

The fact that you don’t love me kinda cringe ngl

[bleak sky]

I do though? tf

you're thinking of quake

[nimble tartan]

3 days

best in slot is 2 days or all days 4 fun bro

[bleak sky]

omr is objectively correct

[gusty mirage]

[echo geyser]

isnt kpb someone in this discord

kinda recognize the name

[bleak sky]

are you thinking of pxb?

oh nvm

I think Kpb = Kieron

[balmy condor]

yeh

kpb is kieron

[echo geyser]

hes boosting me rn

[bleak sky]

[alpine latch]

Wow, it's hard out here when Ram is getting boosts

[bleak sky]

gearing alts is pain

[hollow escarp]

it's not pain

it's pretty cheap now

[bleak sky]

oh no

I mean actually playing the game to gear alts is pain

[echo geyser]

200k for PL

[bleak sky]

getting boosted is chill super chill

[alpine latch]

Are they doing the "don't do the intro and farm BFA dungeons on repeat from 50-60" trick?

[hollow escarp]

that's the fun part about character progression

[echo geyser]

yeah im gonna eat food and watch series

[bleak sky]

I feel like that's only fun when you have some gear

if it's fresh 60 is pain

but maybe that's just me

[echo geyser]

hard part is getting invited to +15s for gear farm

[glass tulip]

Big oof

Always funny how hard it is to get into low keys compared to 20+

[bleak sky]

if you're having troubles I'm

yeah let's not invite this 210 mage or whatever that has 3.2k io on main

[solid mica]

Clear one trick

[glass tulip]

3.2k io? Link KSM buddy or no invite

[dim estuary]

on tyrranical weeks is it worth considering poison bomb instead of CT ?

[glass tulip]

Aotc lead, link exp

[glass tulip]

No. Always CT

[lyric crater]

CT u be aoe 90% if the time

u think they change the neco lego as is it just sucks

[bleak sky]

Can't tell, maybe

[spice spire]

Necrotic wake axe for final boss

[lyric crater]

ill take it increase damage taken by 10% or increase the dot it does by 50% or some thing like that

[viscid spear]

playing with a healer that dispells debuffs immediately on instinct

[spice spire]

I meant more for when you get sent down. You hurl axes from a million leagues under the sea

But also just insta cloak and blame healer

E

Z

[viscid spear]

I've been in groups where the person sent by Exile is gone for ages, idk what's happening

[bleak sky]

they sucky sucky

[spice spire]

Depends on class. I can say the most exhilarating thing is being sent down as a frost mage, getting there, and pressing frost bolt 8 times because no procs

But also dodging swirlies that one shot you while attempting to cast

[viscid spear]

I mean, it's just run through two kinds of bad swirlies and slap an add to click on the kyrian, didn't think it was hard

[bleak sky]

yeah but quake is right, frost mage sucks downstairs

[viscid spear]

[spice spire]

Trust it’s not a good time

But also if you proc on the first fb, you’re chuckling

[potent dagger]

Can someone tell me if the fae legendary proc of vendeta trigger the 4Pc effect ?

[oak sky]

no, because the fae legendary only procs vendetta on outlaw and sub

and tier sets are locked to spec

[spice spire]

You don’t get vendetta off the 4p as sin?

Yeah, what agreon said

[potent dagger]

Ok thanks for the info ^^

[lucid birch]

@balmy condor whats leech dr

[balmy condor]

Tertiaries have no Dr

[lucid birch]

[marble hemlock]

Avoidance caps at 20%, speed starts DRing at 13% or 18% iirc, leech has neither a cap nor DRs

[timid cloud]

Leech only loses value for healers past 10%

[balmy condor]

speed dr's?

[echo geyser]

source on avoidance cap?

[lucid birch]

explain?

[echo geyser]

also are u sure leech doesnt DR?

[timid cloud]

That’s the way it was before.

[balmy condor]

avoid cap is def 20%

leech shouldn't DR

[echo geyser]

but where does it say tho

[balmy condor]

I didn't know about speed tho

[bleak sky]

imagine having anywhere near to 20% avoidance

[echo geyser]

i gone above 20% avoidance

[marble hemlock]

Ye

Twice

[echo geyser]

in previous expacs u couldnt go over 20% in tooltip

but in SL u can

[balmy condor]

WAT

[marble hemlock]

Hard to go above 19% speed with just tertiary

[echo geyser]

im rly not sure about the none leech dr

sounds busted

[marble hemlock]

It is

It's why I've asked for the removal of leech since legion

Cause i was playing 40% on some bosses

[lucid birch]

is it different for healers or across the board

[marble hemlock]

That's kinda ridiculous

Didn't know that

[echo geyser]

i mean tooltip goes above 20% at least, but it would be weird if its still capped right

would make no sense

[marble hemlock]

Maybe they changed speed as well then. But we tested in bfa with the aoe speed gain azurite trait

Had like 7 rogues all use Sprint, adding an 8th gave like half a percent extra at that point

They added the dr on speed after legion

[echo geyser]

lego plate boots

[marble hemlock]

Cause people were running >100% move speed sets with legendary boots

[timid cloud]

• 10% Leech: 20% DR
• 14% Leech: 40% DR
• 17% Leech: 60% DR

Healers only, IIRC.

[marble hemlock]

Ye

Might be similar for dps then

I'd have to check

[balmy condor]

tertiaries are weird man

[timid cloud]

@lucid birch

[marble hemlock]

Just remove all of them

[timid cloud]

Sorry, was getting ready for raid.

[marble hemlock]

Tertiaries are awful design

[timid cloud]

Farming avoidance was cringe.

[marble hemlock]

Unless you can get them reliably somehow

I liked them as dom shard or the enchant for cloak atm

Cause you can pick which one you want

[timid cloud]

I’m pretty sure the move if you get an avoidance piece is that you wear it even over ilevel in higher keys.

Cause the DR outweighs the stamina gained.

At least on low value pieces.

[echo geyser]

thats why i buy boe's with tetiaries every season

[timid cloud]

Crit mastery pants. 🤢

[echo geyser]

those stats are fine on sub

[timid cloud]

You right.

[marble hemlock]

Depends

Avoidance doesn't work on a lot of shit

Cause if feint doesn't work, avoidance doesn't either

[timid cloud]

Stomp from the mini boss in TOP

Fear of god within me.

[surreal prism]

The only thing that doesn't dr stats is fixed stat percentage buffs like Bloodlust/Lichborne/Evasion. Basically anything that has a % sign in it. If it says raw stat numbers, like Occular Gland, it can dr.

[balmy condor]

evasion

dodge is a dumb mechanic too

while we're at all

why isn't evasion a phys immunity

[surreal prism]

cause you can get hit from behind duh

You can't dodge what you can't see

gotta have that fantasy rp

[strange python]

So my buddy who mains a DK found a DK ring from their dcord are rogues getting one?

[bleak sky]

we don't have that info yet

[strange python]

Okay didn’t know if I missed it

[dawn ivy]

prrrrrobably not? the rings are strictly for DKs and for Priests

as of now we have no information on any other class/spec specific loot

+the rings drop off anduin so its all a bunch of lore flavor

[oak sky]

we could potentially get something but probably not a ring

[viscid spear]

The ring concept is nice with Hope and Despair.

[thorny pond]

We get DN

[clever kindle]

Always had em

[zenith coral]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[viscid spear]

Deez Nuts?

[bleak sky]

btw that new ambush single target tech when subterfuge is talented is

[viscid spear]

[limber lion]

It actually feels pretty nice ngl

[viscid spear]

Are we sticking to Theo or is Nadja decent?

[bleak sky]

for what ash

[viscid spear]

Raids

Reading through Cev's Limit guide and it's recommending Nadja but it hasn't been updated since October

[bleak sky]

they're both decent, theo probably sims higher with crit/haste tea

nadjia is good if you know the procs aren't gonna happen in a bad time (painsmith intermissions / something else)

[viscid spear]

Rolled Agi tea

[bleak sky]

yeah that's a nadjia then

[viscid spear]

but I like tea

Knew I should've starting rolling this morning

Able to upgrade my Dashing & Obed to 262

Easier when the vessels aren't 200k apiece

[surreal prism]

I mean just wait till 9.2 to upgrade

Your going to have to recraft/upgrade them to new rank then anyways

[bleak sky]

yeah being on an actual realm is nice

[viscid spear]

60k is a lot more manageable, yeah

[limber lion]

Really depends on the encounter

I would honestly just recommend Theotar for most content nowadays, it's a more safe pick

[lyric crater]

damn ash what sever u on i pay 50k for a 262 vessel\

[bleak sky]

ash was on a dead realm

alliance

[viscid spear]

Bladefist-Kul'tiras

"Connected Bladefist", as it's otherwise known

[lyric crater]

damn and its 200k wow

[viscid spear]

That's if they're even available

[thorny pond]

Time to come to Stormrage baby

[lyric crater]

o low pop sever

[bleak sky]

ash is malganis now

[thorny pond]

Even better

[bleak sky]

take your hands off them

[viscid spear]

I'm already Horde on Mal'ganis, Beach

[thorny pond]

I see now “was”

There used to be dozens of us. Think there’s just 12 now

[indigo totem]

What's this ambush tech with subterfuge I keep hearing about? Can't seem to find it 🤔

[limber lion]

#916546791472783371 message

We just use the Ambush procs from Subterfuge and Sepsis instead of ignoring them.

[viscid spear]

[bleak sky]

and it feels real nice on dungeons

[viscid spear]

More NF stuff to remember, ugh

[bleak sky]

played with it a bit and it gud

[bleak sky]

It goes for venthyr as well if playing subterfuge

[viscid spear]

Subterfuge in raid?

[bleak sky]

m+

[viscid spear]

But I slap Garrotes with Iron Wire

[bleak sky]

yeah but single target situation in m+

bosses / affix

[indigo totem]

Oh dope, thank you, good thing I have one rogue in each

[balmy condor]

You what

[balmy condor]

Get ready for covenant specific shiv cases

[viscid spear]

[bleak sky]

here's the guide ash, straight from the minalba factory

send everything on cd always doesn't matter what it is
parse grey
cry
come back to read whispyr's guide

thanks for coming to my ted talk

[viscid spear]

[thorny pond]

We gotta hold shiv now wtf

back to sub

[oak sky]

[balmy condor]

The shiv stuff I posted in #9.2 Feedback and Discussion

Turns out

Only good for fae

(Who would’ve thought since it’s all sepsis logic)

So we gotta go and make shiv work for venth and necro and kyrian

[thorny pond]

building a spec around borrowed power wtf

aura buff me

[balmy condor]

Weird how making a mediocre button with no burst crazy strong

Changes how we use it

[surreal prism]

Just wait till you have to sim rando cdr shit from other people to see how much of a buff it is

[thorny pond]

Just give KA and PI

[bleak sky]

KA + PI + double fairies

[craggy basin]

so my guild is just now getting to mythic guardian. I was wondering if its still viable to go BS/DS since its a pure ST fight .

[bleak sky]

perma vendetta uptime

[placid pagoda]

Yes

[thorny pond]

KA NF gives haste

big 4pc windows

[bleak sky]

it's the only fight you can go bs/ds yeah

"can"
you can do anything if you believe hard enough but you get it

[craggy basin]

awesome, thanks for the info

hahaha thanks for believing in me 😉

[surreal prism]

don't forget autumn from the nf pallies

[thorny pond]

kek

[fleet anchor]

Yeah idk might be some stuff there with Venthyr. Kinda doubt for Necro and Kyrian since slamming on CD is probably still fine for them. Sepsis has always been a bit special because of the bonk in terms of gaining more from syncage.

[balmy condor]

For sure but I have to take a look at venth since the sepsis shiv stuff is -0.5% for it

And then seli is holding me at gun point to look at LBe

So might as well try and find kyrian stuff too

Just one world tour of shiv optimizations

[fleet anchor]

Yeah probably some of the sync logic is kicking in when it shouldn’t. I noticed that on some quick comparisons also.

[balmy condor]

I assume there might be something there for holding shiv for vend/flag stuff with 15% vers 30% haste

• the compression on vend

Sounds good

Lots of multipliers

Always a good thing

[fleet anchor]

I mean Shiv syncing with Vendetta should always happen generally it’s more a question on the non-Vendetta Flags

[balmy condor]

Yeah definitely

But the current best idea on venth is sending everything on cooldown all the time

And I’m wondering if there’s something there similar to the sepsis stuff

Where it’s not holding

[fleet anchor]

I mean realistically that more or less what it already does since with shorter CDs the waste equation will probably always kick in until the last cast. Unless they very closely align.

[balmy condor]

Yeh

[fleet anchor]

Necro I think it’s hard to see much there tbh

Even putting aside the legendary issue. There’s just not a lot of timing specific stuff to tackle really.

[viscid spear]

3/10M now

[fleet anchor]

Same with Kyrian since ER won’t really interact much here should kinda just be vanilla Vendetta sync if anything

But we’ll see I guess

[viscid spear]

@spice spire

[oak sky]

@limber lion @arctic walrus forgive me father for i am about to sin 😔

[glass tulip]

Ash is zooming

They grow up so fast

[limber lion]

Good luck, make us proud

[viscid spear]

We 1-shot all three, and I didn't die at all

[glass tulip]

GAMING

[viscid spear]

Died like 5 times on Tarra trash tho

[glass tulip]

lul

That is the mark of a true mythic raider

Wiping on trash, living on bosses

[viscid spear]

I probably jinxed myself tho

[oak sky]

i wish i had windfury

[viscid spear]

I wish you had windfury

[oak sky]

@limber lion he doesnt have the leggo

[clever kindle]

I wish you wished I had windfury

[arctic walrus]

take 1 log away from me

see how it works out for you

[oak sky]

well

i have to wait until next week now

oh we had no dh on the nine

thats just peachy

[viscid spear]

🍑

Here's what I mean about the cloak prices

[oak sky]

@arctic walrus full orange soon fr

if i ever get in on fate

if i ever get externals on guardian

[viscid spear]

The 249 leather helm vessel is 250k

The 262 one is 134k

Madness, I tell you

[craggy basin]

is it cloak and evasion on gurdian soak or cloak and feint?

[bleak sky]

you just cloak

[craggy basin]

thanks 😄 was trying to prove a point i was right with just cloak haha love non rogues telling me what to do

[echo geyser]

enjoy

[thorny pond]

jebaited go buy 40

[oak sky]

oh yeah

forgor

to buy

[thorny pond]

you owe me some coke

[oak sky]

:pjsugar:

[arctic walrus]

https://tenor.com/view/blocked-message-discord-morgen-morgenstern-gif-23992745

[oak sky]

just leveling

im not committed

[bleak sky]

you tell yourself whatever you need friend

[viscid spear]

Is Pepsi okay?

[oak sky]

i feel like

ive lost my mojo

[viscid spear]

Better travel back to the 70's

[oak sky]

exactly

this is so annoying

i have no covenant ability and im doing the world bosses

just realized i shouldve gotten the weekly anima quest

oh well

[dawn ivy]

i sped through 20 renown today and now i have nothing but torghast left

so now im leaving the game LOL

[oak sky]

exactly

lol

im probably gonna do the campaign and stop

after world bosses

[viscid spear]

Do you find groups for the world bosses? I never can find a group bigger than like 6-7 people

[oak sky]

yeah

always

[viscid spear]

I don't know what Twilight Zone episode I'm in then

Join a group, it's like 0/1/6, it stays that way for half an hour

[oak sky]

idk might depend on time

[bleak sky]

nf campaign

[oak sky]

ive never done it

[bleak sky]

good luck it's boring af

[oak sky]

at least i can fly around and instakill stuff

[viscid spear]

The only thing good about me leveling my NF Renown is I was NF during Nathria and already completed it

But still I have to level it

[static pier]

inb4 9.2 cov campaign skip

[balmy condor]

Inb4 no daggers from raid

Not even no special effect or no high ilevel

Just no daggers

[timid cloud]

Seeing you go NF

I just ghosted you. @oak sky

[static pier]

fuck, i name-changed my character and didnt connect my bnet to rio first so the addon doesn't know what i've timed

[oak sky]

bruh you have to do torgy

for this

[thorny pond]

Yes

Or just slow grind. Like 5-10/week will get you there. It’s not viable now, do it casually and not burn out

[spice spire]

Agreon always in the grustle tho

[oak sky]

not really tbh

i fell off

big raidlogger past 2 weeks

[balmy condor]

L

[oak sky]

does this campaign shit even give renown anymore

[viscid spear]

Each chapter should be a guaranteed point

[oak sky]

i thought they made it 2

[bleak sky]

that depends on how much renown you have i think

[oak sky]

bro

[viscid spear]

Yeah, if you're very low on Renown it'll give 2

[fiery fable]

is dashing scoundrel still bis raid leggo?

[glass tulip]

With higher ranks of frost shards, yes

Otherwise I think obedience will sim higher

[heady bluff]

does sin generally sim higher or lower than sub

[hollow river]

lower generally

[heady bluff]

ok makes sense

i guess the difference in my sim is probably not having r5 frost for assas

but r5 blood for sub

[scarlet warren]

yeah but ig once you have all ur bis raid gear for sub i dont think sin will ever beat it (in sims)

but sin is probably just as strong as sub in single target in reality so its not bad by any means

[gloomy knoll]

were the sin night fae sims done with niya

the sims links on the spreadsheet don't work

[bleak sky]

Too many optimizations were found, I wouldn't worry about the spreadsheet sims

[gloomy knoll]

i'm just curious for testing

which soulbind is used lol

guess i'll try niya and dreamweaver

[bleak sky]

dreamweaver is queen

korayn if there's something like soulrender

[gloomy knoll]

word

ty

do you know if the covenant conduit was used in those @bleak sky

[gusty mirage]

Ye triple potency dreamweaver

With septic

[gloomy knoll]

so covenant wps and lethal poisons?

[bleak sky]

https://mimiron.raidbots.com/simbot/report/uYibdX5dSvJzBRgdxqHRuU/simc

[gloomy knoll]

interesting

[bleak sky]

here is the sim that's currently the base stuff for fae

[gloomy knoll]

oh ty

do you know what some of the gains were for fae @gusty mirage ?

[bleak sky]

septic shock, wps, lethal poisons

[bleak sky]

#916546791472783371 message

you can read from there

[gusty mirage]

Actually yeah whispyr broke them down fully a bit ago, one sec

[bleak sky]

already linked + L + slow + not glad

[gusty mirage]

Cev found 0.3% from ambush
Duskwalker variable change 0.7%
Shiv+sepsis 1.1%

@gloomy knoll

Kindly take this L because that post doesn’t break it down as clean @bleak sky

[bleak sky]

I'm suing you for that comment

[gloomy knoll]

interesting

ty

[gusty mirage]

2nd post below the one he linked better explains the sepsis shiv logic

[gloomy knoll]

what's the ambush thing?

the shiv makes sense

[bleak sky]

ambush thing = you press ambush now

[gusty mirage]

Ambush after snd in opener and yeah you just use ambush now

[bleak sky]

after the sepsis proc and during subterfuge

[gloomy knoll]

waduheck

so what's the oper?

[bleak sky]

but that's 9.2 stuff as fae

[gloomy knoll]

*opener

yea i'm doing ptr testing

[gusty mirage]

Gar > snd > ambush iirc

I’d have to open up the sample sequence table in the sim

[gloomy knoll]

you don't pandemic garret?

interesting

so you rupture after the shiv?

[gusty mirage]

Best I could do on mobile

Pls forgive me

[bleak sky]

thanks oxi

[gloomy knoll]

this is interesting

time to hit some ptr dummies

ty 🙂

[bleak sky]

have fun

[gloomy knoll]

how much is deeper stratagem over vigor / mfd

cuz i hate that shit on sin lol

also do you use ambush in the vanish subterfuge / pandemic garret with the vanish @gusty mirage

[gusty mirage]

Scanning the sample sequence it seems that you ambush for the last bit of subterfuge every time

And I have no idea what the dif is between vigor/deeper/mfd tbh

That’s a better question for Cev or whispyr because they’ve been the main forces behind all of this

[gloomy knoll]

interesting

dude this is fun

ngl

fae fits way better than venth with the tier set

[oak sky]

wouldnt dreamweaver be king

🤨

[bleak sky]

fuck did I assume their gender

I thought it was a she just like lady uwu

[hollow escarp]

all 3 fae soulbinds are female

[oak sky]

i thought dreamweaver was a dude

[hollow escarp]

you probably thought heimir is also a dude

[oak sky]

i didnt

because i play with sound on

[hollow escarp]

[bleak sky]

heimir is not a dude?

[oak sky]

heirmir female dreamweaver male

L ratio

[bleak sky]

I take that L

I fell off

[oak sky]

i didnt know korayn actually

didnt know either way

i think i thought dreamweaver was a girl until i heard his voice in game one time randomly

forget the context

[gloomy knoll]

dude i am actually

heavily fucking with night fae sin

this is fun

[bleak sky]

[small nymph]

Am I mistaken, or does Sin Rogue just don't have a AoE Spender without talent points 🤔

[balmy condor]

Correct

[small nymph]

Its just weird 😂

Didn't realise it until I did Sub for some dungeons last night

[oak sky]

Yep its one of only a couple specs that has to talent into any aoe spender

[small nymph]

What's the other ones?

And have they said anything on why Crimson Tempest isn't baseline? 🤔

[oak sky]

Shadow priest

I think feral as well?

[hollow escarp]

yeah, feral has an aoe finisher talent

well

[kindred rapids]

I actually got it

[bleak sky]

gz gz gz

[kindred rapids]

thanks 🙂

couldn't believe it, only my second kill

got the mount too 😂

I finally convinced my guild to let me use CDs on the P2 burns instead of adds

we pushed like a percent lower

[gloomy knoll]

yep i'm sold

may venth sin rot in hell

night fae is de wae

[hollow dirge]

😂

Rgb butterfly rogue ftw

[versed mica]

night fae sin can eat shit

gonna bite venth sin's dust

[gloomy knoll]

Have you actually played both builds on ptr

Cuz night fae is metric fuck tons more fun

[limber lion]

Venth will be eating our dust instead

NF is actually an intuitive covenant to play

Instead of the stupid SEND SEND SEND playstyle of Venth

[gloomy knoll]

It’s hella fun the rotational changes it implements are actually enjoyable

[limber lion]

But each to their own.

[gloomy knoll]

We even get to throw in some spicy ambushes

[limber lion]

Don't have to play anything you don't want

Go Kyrian with Pelagos if that's your jam

Just never show your face here again

[gloomy knoll]

Just need them to buff night fae conduit now for gigaomegasuperburst

[hollow dirge]

Well, tbh, now that we can mixmatch the mogs from each covenant no matter which one we play, going away from venth is actually not so bad 😂😂

[small nymph]

If I'm right, we don't go NF as soon as 9.2 hits? Its better to run as Venthyr/Obedience build until we get 4pc or unity or both?

[timid cloud]

Cap.

Something something master poisoner.

[bleak sky]

pelagos master poisoner tech?

[hollow escarp]

with ||venom rush||

memes aside, swapping covenant is not hard at all anyway

might want to farm some renown just to have all options ready

[timid cloud]

Full conduits & full renown’s already at the ready...

[astral canopy]

wait, so we go nf next patch?

[bleak sky]

most likely yeah

but idk

wait for more info

[astral canopy]

ye

[timid cloud]

I’mma not get gaslit into it again. Tbh.

[astral canopy]

might as well

[timid cloud]

It never 9.0 Night Fae Sub being the best! Then all it got was...the bench.

[astral canopy]

lol

[timid cloud]

[rocky escarp]

What two leggos are we looking at if we go NF? Dusk or Dashing?

[carmine vigil]

Dusk

[bleak sky]

bruh

[hollow escarp]

yeah, do some aoe bro

[bleak sky]

like the frost mage and ele shaman aren't gonna do enough

[hollow escarp]

bribe the tank to kite a lot so both of them don't do aoe

[bleak sky]

I bailed the key

felt like trap

[small nymph]

Maybe it was a fire mage

[timid cloud]

Weirdo mode.

[quasi grotto]

Suppose I should level my renown and get some practice in ptr

See alot of love for NF

[hollow dirge]

Soulshape is certainly better than unbinded door of shadows 😂

[carmine vigil]

Is nf better than venthyr even with double lego?

[quasi grotto]

I have it binded but find 0 use for it 😂

[jade minnow]

where do i send petition for no high ilvl/special effect daGGer

[kindred rapids]

Huh?

[hollow dirge]

It has it’s use on sylvanas atleast, but that’s about it😂

[jade minnow]

Next patch

[gusty adder]

anyone know how to sim kindred affinity?

in advanced sim i guess

[desert wagon]

idk how that would work with a sim cause part of the bonus damage would be dependant on the druid

[spice spire]

external_buffs.kindred_affinity=0/45/90/135/180/225/270/305

It’s actually easy to sim

Also add 5s to those numbers if you’re venthyr iirc

Or maybe it’s ten
I’m Necrolord so it’s less necessary as overcapping crit during MA, not really a thing since I get vers

[limber lion]

5s to every number as Sin

Regardless of covenant

No point using KA at the beginning when you're setting up garrote, rupture and slice (and SBS)

[gusty adder]

Thanks! It worked. About 1k dpsincrease. A bit higher if you added 10 sec instead of 5 sec

no touching the string was worst

but going from adding 5 sec to adding 10 sec only increased the damage by 10

inbe4 I messed simple adding-math up

[spice spire]

Actually my string fucked up on the final 270-315 combo

Because it has 305, so that was corrected.
For NL, it ended up being a 7 dps upgrade; however, it’s usually around 3s when the tank pops it for me anyway, and mine rushes it

[gusty adder]

sublety FAQ had some sweeet cheatsheets btw
Kindred Affinity Values(9.1.5): http://tiny.cc/vpiiuz
Kindred Affinity Values(9.2): http://tiny.cc/2b9nuz

[limber lion]

We also have those pinned in #wow-general

The charts are also very misleading

Some of the apl's haven't been updated and some of the sims are just flat out incorrect.

Assa for one does not sim 13.2k baseline lol.

[gusty adder]

you mean the 9.2 ones?

9.1.5 sims assass flat at 11,9

which is like 700 higher than me, sure, but as i said - cheatsheets :b

Also nice - never really used wow-general

[spice spire]

Yeah 9.2, as that’s where they have NF sim at 13.2

And I assume a ton may change between now and then given everything in flux

[gusty adder]

Well ye - I was also mostly interested in the 9.1.5 one :b but thanks alot guys

[limber lion]

Ah yeah, that on the other hand is a bit on the low side

[gusty adder]

High side for me

[alpine latch]

Timed my first +20 last night. Man that was a good feeling. Now I have to review our +20 Mists and figure out wtf we did wrong

How do you guys manage CDs on the first boss? Alternate CDs on spaghetti boy?

[limber lion]

By saving cds for the big burn

[spice spire]

For mists, I’ll usually only use vendetta during the burn phase of inga.

[alpine latch]

We did a +20 DoS right before the Mists (my key turned into a 21 Mists). We ripped it on the first boss so we dropped to a 20

It took us 3 phases for the first boss

Pulled extra maze trash only to have a long maze, so we over-pulled and still went into the final boss with like 30s on the clock

I definitely think we could have timed it if we didn't overpull and fixed our CD usage

[spice spire]

Three phasing as in first phase, burn phase, kill inga before shields?

Or three burns?

[alpine latch]

Uhhh, I think 3 burns. Pretty sure he got the shield off with like 7% left 😦

[gusty mirage]

Wdym over pulled in maze? That’s technically the most efficient trash in the dungeon

[spice spire]

Oh it’s hard to do a 3 burn timer

[alpine latch]

We technically over-pulled after boss 2. We didn't notice that we were higher on percentage than normal

[gusty mirage]

Yeah but you have a rogue, you can just skip almost everything at the end

[alpine latch]

Yeah, but we didn't

We pulled at least 1 extra pack at the end

I also ate everything I could have, which didn't help

My team wanted to do one more and I was yawning before we ripped the 21

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/LdnHKvYZjh6rA283/#fight=last

[pure moth]

Is battle axe good this week for the affixes? i see you used it in the logs

[alpine latch]

I used it for both 20s because we wanted the extra damage for bosses

A few people said they use it in higher keys so I wanted to try it

[spice spire]

11–11-almost 10 is really low on inga. That’s problem A. Gotta do more dam to him

[alpine latch]

Our hunter used CDs on spaghetti boy

And me and the shaman used CDs on the burn phase

I also think we aren't using enough of the room

There was several times I couldn't cleave because of puddles

[steel ridge]

@limber lion hey prophet, why is sepsis on a 90 second cooldown 😦

[limber lion]

why is Flag on a 90 second cooldown

Why is ER on a 45 second cooldown

All valid questions

[spice spire]

Yeah your boss damage was really low this run - over 1/3 of the timer is spent on bosses, which doesn’t leave as much as needed for trash killing

[steel ridge]

all of them feel horrible with vendetta on 60 seconds cd :/

[limber lion]

Why

[timid cloud]

For Ingra I think you should probs be doing 20k & above.

[spice spire]

4:03 inga, 3:30ish butterfly, 3:10 tredova

[limber lion]

You press Sepsis on cooldown, at 3 minutes they sync up again

And 6 minutes

And 9 minutes

[spice spire]

That depends on when you’re killing. First burn, absolutely.

Your damage drops off tremendously after

[steel ridge]

mhhh good point

[weak plover]

Night fae sutn feels good and all until you get the invis ability proc and can't hit normal buttons.

[spice spire]

My invis bar is the exact same, except shiv is sap, and kidney is cheap shot

It was something I did back when were NF originally

[steel ridge]

i am kinda considering going fae for 9.2.... our moonkins apparently need fae assa rogues

simping for kindred spirits :>

[echo geyser]

[nocturne geode]

😏

[echo geyser]

imagine if rogues get that instead of real classes

[spice spire]

NF fine covenant. Soul shape is bis, the soulbinds kinda suck. But the rest is fine

[weak plover]

My stealth bar has garrote in place of rupture when subterfuge is talented.

[steel ridge]

well dreamweaver is consistent tho... no random thrillseeker proccs

[echo geyser]

unless we start doing 20k st as well

[weak plover]

I keep trying to refresh rupture and not being able to lol + garrote on cooldown

[spice spire]

Current evaluations are slightly sketch on the kyrian spreadsheet

[steel ridge]

heard something about a benefit for the moonkin if the kindred friend is melee?

[echo geyser]

i guess at the end of the day they will link whoever benefits the most and not doing the most dps

also correct stat for them ofc

[spice spire]

Yeah

[echo geyser]

could be us