assassination

[limber lion]

Yeh, he probably just played Sub and then switched to Assa and logged out with Finality still on

[frail fossil]

most of the times those are fucky tbh

usually if u have a m+ legendary question or smth, u can ask here or Ryfie got his own discord

[balmy condor]

I wish more people used the desktop app tbh

[frail fossil]

more likely to get good answers

[balmy condor]

would help fight the armory mismatching

[limber lion]

Yup

[whole mason]

Hi guys, may I ask if anything update in ptr considering new legendaries?

[balmy condor]

deathspike if you're necro

maybe dashing if the socket stuff is strong

[frail fossil]

they could also just put doomblade on more slots

[balmy condor]

yeh

[frail fossil]

like they did with some other legendaries

[balmy condor]

who knows what they're doing

[limber lion]

Hopefully won't.

[balmy condor]

the whole domination sockets in general are really disgusting

[limber lion]

Yeh, they're funky

[balmy condor]

seems like right now it works like a normal gem

so once you slot it

it's in

and it gets destroyed on replacement

[final star]

Layers upon layers of borrowed power

[limber lion]

Is the source of the gems known?

[balmy condor]

so if if you gotta upgrade it, rather than it just dropping at a higher rank or some shit

they're just boss drops afaik

[limber lion]

Ah alright

[balmy condor]

and you gotta farm a currency from killing bosses

to upgrade it

but it doesn't make sense

[limber lion]

So you get the first gem at r1

Then you farm currency for the max rank

[balmy condor]

cause it seems like it needs maybe 30 kills for a max rank

[limber lion]

Because you can't upgrade it and have to replace it

Why would you go rank by rank if you're forced to destroy it instead of upgrading it

[balmy condor]

well depending on the strength during prog

[limber lion]

Yeh true.

[balmy condor]

you might not have the luxury of just sitting on a rank 1

so you would get a rank 1

and then maybe hit a wall

equip rank 3's

and then farm for rank 5's during farm

it's honestly such a giga scuffed system atm

idk who thought it was a good idea

[final star]

Borrowed power is what blizzard do best

Or worst, depending on how you look at it

[limber lion]

Yeah, sounds awful.

They have to add an upgrading feature to it, it does not make any sense like that.

[balmy condor]

they could've just made it like essences

where it unlocks

and you slot it

and then you're good

[frosty bridge]

So the new dagger is crit haste and has a unique effect that gets empowered at low health

[balmy condor]

yes

[frosty bridge]

9.1 can't come soon enough

[balmy condor]

I definitely think it can

looking at the convoluted nightmare of systems it is atm

[frosty bridge]

sigh

[final star]

Have fun putting it into simc

[frosty bridge]

A shame really

[final star]

[balmy condor]

I honestly have no clue how I'm gonna do pins

[final star]

"just sim it plz"

[balmy condor]

yeah that's simply not an option

[whole mason]

Why,

[final star]

Because people are lazy

And want to be told the answer

[balmy condor]

a lot of people also don't understand how to sim

[final star]

People still don't know how to use raid bots and that's essentially 1+1=2

[whole mason]

If it is complex enough, "sim it" would be good pins and responsible.

[balmy condor]

that gives 0 info

the whole point is to give info

[frosty bridge]

To be fair, if you haven't play WoW before you wouldn'T really expect to use simming to know your best build

Not sure if there are other games you sim stuff in.. I guess PoE and stuff

[whole mason]

Not really, it only means a pin for sim is needed beforehand.

[limber lion]

Where would we be if we didn't have you to update the pins?

[balmy condor]

probably the same place

I don't understand why you would change locations over something like pins

[limber lion]

Yeh, no one looks at the pins anyways. Doesn't change much.

[balmy condor]

seems really weird

[limber lion]

kek

[sacred isle]

Alot of ppl dont understand pins 🤷‍♂️

[balmy condor]

sure but a lot more people understand arithmetic than do calculus

[limber lion]

I don't even know what arithmetic means

[whole mason]

True, but too many parameters in play makes rather intuitive for understanding if only limited info is given in brief fashion.

[balmy condor]

I've read that like 7 times

and it's still just a soup of buzz words to me

but aren't pins literally the info in brief fashion

[final star]

Me make computer do numbers

I pick biggest numbers

Zug zug

[final star]

I can visualise the hands without it even having hands

I can also hear it

[tribal marlin]

that shit is refreshed when dot ticks

Making the unholy stuff even better

[dark crag]

0%

[misty zenith]

So just to be sure Opener for raids: Mute - SnD - Mute - Garrote(need to wait for energy) - Vendetta/Flag - Rupture - Shiv - Vanish - Mute - Evenom - ....

[balmy condor]

yep looks good

[misty zenith]

When i vanish for that mute, do i care that it gives me max -1 CP? Or just evenom straight away to get MA buff?

[balmy condor]

you would build until max-1

[misty zenith]

Oh ok, but then i might lose MA for evenom sometimes

[peak sandal]

It just says that so you don't mut at 4/5 when cap is 5/6

[misty zenith]

it is on dummy so, no raid buffs

[balmy condor]

you're playing deeper most likely

[peak sandal]

And overcapacity on cp

[balmy condor]

so you're never getting 2 envenoms in

no configuration will give you 2 envenoms with deeper

if you vanish on 5 cp

you mut once, get a max of 4, can't finish, need to mut again

if you vanish on 0cp, you mut once, get a max of 4, can't finish, need to mut again, then envenom

if you vanish on 2cp, you mut once, get 6, then envenom and mut after

[exotic rose]

Hey guys, when running crimson tempest on dungeons, do we use it when there is only one enemy? e.g boss

[balmy condor]

yep

[hazy ruin]

Oooo special dagger boys

[fiery mauve]

Have y’all accepted necrochad yet

[dawn ivy]

most have

[somber stump]

What talent setup is this

[dawn ivy]

assuming they need to wait for energy id bet DS/BS

[misty zenith]

Yes

[hazy ruin]

Anyone see what the finisher damage increase is for the daggers?

[dawn ivy]

not testable yet i think

[stiff geyser]

Knowing blizz it’s probably some shit like 0.4%

[odd hazel]

thats still gonna force us to get that dagger

especially since its crit/haste

[stiff geyser]

Unless I can upgrade with valor points

[odd hazel]

i mean

imagine not taking a increase to CT

or envenom

its also

[stiff geyser]

I’m imagining it

[dawn ivy]

it doesnt need an effect for us to want it

[odd hazel]

gonna be a few extra ilvl higher then everything else

[dawn ivy]

it will be highest ilvl weapon

[odd hazel]

^

[dawn ivy]

like the effect could be cosmetic and be BiS

[stiff geyser]

I’m not a mythic raider tho sadge

[odd hazel]

i mean

even so

[dawn ivy]

get heroic daggers

[odd hazel]

you'll cuck your self a bit not taking that dagger.

[stiff geyser]

You know in my 3 months of running nathria through heroic I never had a weapon token drop

[dawn ivy]

dont do that next tier then

find one 🙂

[stiff geyser]

True I’ll ask the game

[odd hazel]

i've only ever had the lash conduit drop off sire

i did a full clear on my lock

and only got 1 item

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[stiff geyser]

Lmao

[odd hazel]

thats my only issue with the raid

you never get ANYTHINNGGG

i have yet to see SLG shoulders drop

so why im currently using doom on shoulders with my 226 gloves

[dawn ivy]

cant get all the gear in one week

[odd hazel]

:^)

[limber lion]

We got 3 of those yesterday

[dawn ivy]

gotta do m+ spam and full clear raid every week

[odd hazel]

i get that man but

10 bosses, and i get nothing? whats that % drop rate at?

[dawn ivy]

4 items for a 20 man

[odd hazel]

well rng needs to get a new whore because i cant do it for free any more lol

[spice spire]

233 dagger check?

[odd hazel]

[spice spire]

It’s not BM, he was supposed to run it yesterday and I GOTS TO KNOW

[dawn ivy]

[spice spire]

I’m a 220 MH shitter still

[odd hazel]

my MH is currently 223 and im upgrading to a 220 OH

both tanglewoods

[spice spire]

213 OH GAMING. Still haven’t looted a weapon outside of week 1 vault. All been given

[odd hazel]

why not just upgrade it ?

[spice spire]

Can’t upgrade raid weapons

[limber lion]

Big negative.

[odd hazel]

ah

i was running double crit/mastery daggers for a while

it felt bad

[spice spire]

FUCK.

Soon ™️

[limber lion]

I hype myself up for failure. I should stop doing that.

[spice spire]

Same though

“The vaults got me this week, I’ll finally have a decent dagger”

[limber lion]

I still need to do the prove your worth quests for Venthyr so if I get a token I can swap covenants to Venthyr for my dagger

[spice spire]

Damn you’re out here really min-maxing sheesh

[limber lion]

It's like 10 dps

huge

[dull cloak]

why not rbg for a fat dagger, its so easy as rogue

[limber lion]

Because it requires time and patience

[dark crag]

Have you tried rbg at this point?

It's dead

Mate tried to push to 2.4 some days ago. The same team all night

Next day the same team again

[stiff geyser]

I cba with RBGs

[teal bloom]

Do covenants have different secondary stats on their raid daggers or why is the venthyr dagger better?

[limber lion]

Yes they do.

Venthyr is crit/haste

[odd hazel]

so what you're saying is

i should go necro and do the return quests for Venth until i get a dagger.

:^ )

[limber lion]

Definitely not.

I'm just joking, I'm definitely not swapping jsut for the dagger lol

[wind totem]

Hey guys. If you are playing with CT on Sire to pad for logs, how do you incorporate it into your ST rotation? Do you keep it up on 1 target or only if there is more than one? How does it work for the rest of the fight basically.

Talking about mythic btw

[limber lion]

Yes, you keep it up on single target outside of Shiv windows.

In AOE you just keep it up at all times.

So in P2 you pretty much want to keep it up at all times

[wind totem]

So even in p3 you would want to try and keep it up?

[sinful cradle]

yes

outside of shiv windows

[wind totem]

Alright. Thanks

[cerulean nest]

that sylvanas dagger is looking tasty

[limber lion]

Sure is

[stoic needle]

Make zoldyck work with shadow damage

So we can execute with the execute daggers

[limber swallow]

since the dagger effect works with finishers, I wonder what that'll do to CT

and black powder for that matter

[cerulean nest]

it'll be nuts for sub it feels like

[rotund oak]

and toxic onslaught as well

like u get some weird allignment of shadow blades or something

[stoic needle]

Nobody will play toxic onslaught

[rotund oak]

😦

its ym wet dream

[stoic needle]

Sorry that your dream is trash

[limber swallow]

I didn't even know what that was....

[limber lion]

just like mastery stacking

[stoic needle]

[dawn ivy]

lmfao i had to google toxic onslaught

no shot we're playing NF into the NF leggo ahhaahahah

[dull cloak]

NF leggo could be ok if it gave you all 3 cd for like 10secs

[dawn ivy]

maybe for outlaw it would be good

[limber lion]

Negative

[cerulean nest]

do any other bosses drop weapons?

besides sylvanas

[stoic needle]

yes

[solar torrent]

In aoe situations isnt it worth to keep using crimson tempest even htough the dot is allready applied rather than envenom since the initial damage is higher after like 3 adds?... didnt say in the wow head guide

[stoic needle]

you can refresh crimson tempest with up to 5 seconds remaining on the dot but not earlier than that

[solar torrent]

but the inital withough taking the dot into effect is better in +3 targets isnt it

?

[stoic needle]

yes but the envenom buff makes envenom better

and doing another rupture is more damage than both

[granite thistle]

Waking up to a dagger effect. Pogchamp

Is there a weapon vendor on PTR?

To test daggies

[stoic needle]

don't think so

[granite thistle]

F

[rugged wren]

Hi all, this might be a silly question but can someone explain to me why a 220 item + socket sims higher (only +11 dps) then my current 226 item.
I mean does that +16 2nd stat makes that much a difference? even tho you are losing some primary stats. I according to the stat weight sim my primary stat is 3.02 where my crit (in this case) is 1.29

[untold nest]

Anybody tested necro leggo with assa on ptr? How does it fare compared to outlaw?

[cobalt pelican]

significantly less goodly

[untold nest]

Was thinking that assa with ST burst in its toolkit and that leggo might make it more competitive in keys

[cobalt pelican]

and it depends what the items are vaynes, different slots gain different amount of stats per ilvl, what secondaries are on both pieces matters etc

[mellow pier]

@untold nest no lego will change why u prefer outlaw over sin

[cobalt pelican]

st burst isn't really a required damage profile for keys

outside of very niche stuff like mists first boss or something

[untold nest]

Mists, dos, top, spires all have

[cobalt pelican]

there are basically no places in spires or dos where st burst is your desired damage profile for key speed

[mellow pier]

Just play assassination if that’s your preferred spec to play

[untold nest]

Hakkar, to unload your cds to skip shield phases, spires on 3rd boss dmg amp phase

Some examples

And also overall ST of assa is higher than outlaw

[mellow pier]

Rogue is not brought for those damage profiles. Other classes would do them better

Like spriest

Or boomkin

[untold nest]

Correct, but im a rogue so im lookong at my class and what i can do to help facilitate a smoother key in my group

[cobalt pelican]

hakkar very quickly becomes a boss you end up having to slow play, which assassination is like.. fine but not great at

[mellow pier]

But to 99.9% of people in here, myself included, Sin is fine to play

[stoic needle]

Yes, sockets are worth about 30 dps each

[cobalt pelican]

spires 3rd boss is so insignificant in the overall time of the key

[untold nest]

Go try 22 tyran and lets see your healer healing that for 3 mins :p

[mellow pier]

There’s no reason to do a 22 tyrann atm

So I’ll pass lol

[cobalt pelican]

it's really not that hard

definitely not hard enough that you're like 'i want to specialize in making this easier at the expense of other things'

[mellow pier]

Damage profile of outlaw is much better for keys, assassination for raids

It’s just how it is

[cobalt pelican]

i think generally assassination is pretty good in keys overall, but i think if you're going to play it you just end up playing the most overall dam you can do unless your group very much values like, low pack size prio target damage or something

and in those cases you wouldn't play deathspike anyways

[mellow pier]

I have to actually play the game again to level my necro 😦

[cobalt pelican]

because if your job is just to sit a goliath or something so that the pack dies at the same time to in theory make it faster (doesn't usually work out anyway tbh) it won't be the best for that

[nimble tartan]

i dont want to level cov please god

[gusty mirage]

Then don’t, the solution to your issue is quite simple

[nimble tartan]

midmax is a lifestyle

u know when u go to the gym and u like dam this next set gonna be hard af but u still do it for the gains

thats just like cov leveling

[gusty mirage]

I don’t go to the gym, I’m a min-min kinda guy

[rugged wren]

Ok thnx

[candid mountain]

While dueling a frost mage is there a way to make it so I resist a snare like their ability Cone of cold?

[hollow river]

#pvp would know better

[candid mountain]

Oh ok. Thanks.

[pale fossil]

Thoughts on PB for M Sire P3? I figure he moves to much but was curious.

We had two 5% wipes yesterday so thinking about where to squeeze out a bit more damage.

But it's probably just more practice on mechanics and we're good.

[tulip nacelle]

pb is more p3 damage

[chrome mirage]

New dagger effect

[pale fossil]

So it's not really an issue that he moves as much as he does?

[tulip nacelle]

not really

there was a discussion yesterday about this

you get most of the ticks on him

[pale fossil]

Ok cool. I think my swaps will be PB for CT and Zoldyk for DB, then, since I'll have enough ash for max zoldyk.

[royal lantern]

the thing is simply

CT does slightly more dmg then envenom over its entire duration

and you have quite some downtimes and movment during p3+the boss himself moves

+fuck PB

[pale fossil]

I like PB more because I'm a noob and not amazing at keeping uptime on everything haha

[alpine latch]

PB is the worst when the tanks move shit

No reason to move at all, "better run this just outside of range"

[stoic needle]

there was a discussion but no proof was offered

i dont think it's conclusive yet

ct also allows you to deal damage when you're forced to stop attacking like during blood prices or when soaking

one person saying "yeah well in my logs most of the ticks hit" isn't really convincing evidence that pb is more p3 damage than ct

[icy ember]

best lego as of 9.1 for a sin rogue is? the venthyr lego?

[stoic needle]

no the venthyr legendary sucks for sin

still doomblade

[limber lion]

Or maybe Dashing

[pale fossil]

I'm reviewing logs and man I apparently use Crimson Tempest way too much lol

[icy ember]

what does dashing do?

[limber lion]

You don't want to spam it. If you keep the bleed up during pandemic, you're not overusing it

[pale fossil]

@limber lion Would you mind looking over logs for me?

Or anyone else qualified.

[limber lion]

Energy from poison procs, it's our 2nd best legendary for single target but with the new domination sockets it might change things around

[limber lion]

Sure thing when I get home. I'm in the grocery store atm

[pale fossil]

I'm just comparing mine to a top necro parse (without PIs) and his uptime on CT is about 30% for the whole M Sire fight. Mine's around 70%. I have roughly twice as many casts as him haha

Whereas he has more than double my Envenom casts haha

[limber lion]

Yeah that's fair enough, umderstand the concern, I'll take a look when I'm home

70% uptime might be quite high for m sire

[pale fossil]

Yeah. I'm sure a lot of the dps gap is just mechanical/execution, but that looks like the big application difference. I could also get a few more SBS out of better use on adds, I think.

[hollow river]

Isn’t envenom and ignoring CT in ST only like a 15 dps loss

Maybe throw CT on boss when you know you’re about to have downtime etc

[pale fossil]

Yeah, and it's probably a DPS gain when my dumb ass is letting SnD drop to get CT up, so I have to cast SnD again.

[hollow river]

Oof

It happens

[pale fossil]

Just something I noticed myself doing yesterday. I also run BS/DS so those decisions hurt a bit more.

[stoic needle]

its dps neutral with doomblade as necro

ep probably slightly better for p3

[hollow river]

Well there ya go

[stoic needle]

esp as necro

[pale fossil]

I should sim it. One sec.

[hollow river]

ESP with zoldy

[stoic needle]

it will sim worse

but you are forced to pool energy several times during p3 which lowers the value of BS significantly

[pale fossil]

I have DB atm, but planning on crafting Zold next Tuesday.

So you'd recommend EP/DS?

[stoic needle]

yeah or ep/vigor

[pale fossil]

All the top parses run EP/Vigor but I assumed that was just because you get more P1 and P2 damage from them.

[stoic needle]

you do

[pale fossil]

I may want that anyway to compensate for moving from DB to Zold.

[stoic needle]

like i said, bs sims the best, but the specifics of p3 make it slightly different from the sim

[drowsy coral]

I'm sure this has been said somewhere but I can't remember: what comes down to choosing between zold and doom on Sire ?

[pale fossil]

Yeah, makes sense. I just want to know how big the tradeoff looks in a sim.

[drowsy coral]

Was it Zold for progress oriented vs doom for higher damage output or smth ?

[pale fossil]

Ok, so EP/Vigor is only a 12 dps loss for me in ST, so I should go that route I tihnk.

[alpine latch]

Man, I put in my info in the WCL recruitment tool. It found zero guilds. lol

[pale fossil]

PB is a +130 dps gain, but I think I'm still leaning towards CT.

[stoic needle]

zoldyck is best for p3 damage, doomblade is better for overall damage

if your guild isn't consistently phasing in p2 you can go doomblade to help kill adds and push the boss

zoldyck for killing in p3

[quaint carbon]

ima try the theotar potion thing today on HC, shouldi get agi potion or phantom ?

[stoic needle]

phantom

[nimble tartan]

i like agi

pf hit or miss agi a nice consistency

[stoic needle]

if you're cheesing phantom fire is the way to go

[hollow river]

Oo SBS gonna scale off crit too in 9.1

[dawn ivy]

????

[hollow river]

The bleed

[dawn ivy]

hows that scaling with crit

my brian is small

[hollow river]

Right now I think it’s only scaling off haste/mastery so the bleed ticks aren’t critting maybe

So like your ticks will have a chance to crit

[dawn ivy]

yeah it scales off of mastery/vers/haste

the conduit is what makes it "crit"

[dawn ivy]

https://tenor.com/view/surprise-chris-pratt-parks-and-recreation-parks-and-rec-shocked-gif-5571450

wait doesnt that make bone spike for sure better than flag?

[charred wraith]

so sbs bleed can crit now?

[limber lion]

Still loses in single target.

It's a gain of around 50 dps for some profiles.

[odd hazel]

But it’s certainly less yeah ?

Like how close is it ?

[dawn ivy]

it was already sub 100 difference pure ST

[odd hazel]

So only 50? Might as well take it then even if you want ST since raid is barely ST

[charred wraith]

well i would say its a very enjoyable change for 2+ targets in the scenario

[thorny pond]

Someone who's smarter than me: Will that Sylvan dagger be more beneficial for haste/Venth builds since they're getting finishers or did I smoke myself stupid

[stoic needle]

i'm not sure that venthyr builds get more finishers than necro

because necro is cheap cp

[thorny pond]

When I formulate more articulate thoughts and math it out I will repropose my idea. Thank you oshosi

[dawn ivy]

also venthyr or necro will only give you a couple more finishers through a fight

so like one covenant might end up getting one more finisher than the other which is gonna equate to a merginal error

[limber lion]

It's more the case between talent choices. Vigor means more but weaker finishers, Deeper Stratagem means less but stronger finishers.

[dawn ivy]

oh i havent thought about that

vigor might just be the choice when you have those daggers

[limber lion]

As a Necrolord it most likely is anyways.

[thorny pond]

It's already close as necro

So I guess EP will gain value if that ability blasts

since it looks like an execute anyways

[stoic needle]

i think we get enough haste on gear next tier that we stop using vigor

[thorny pond]

I already hit 1k to see if I could

[limber lion]

Doesn't necessarily mean that we would stop using vigor just because we get more haste.

But yeah, it's likely that we'll see EP/DS next tier.

[thorny pond]

EP/DS is going to be filthy

Give us a new T6 ability too plz

[stoic needle]

what other reasons would there be to stop using bs and vigor? crit?

[thorny pond]

Yea since both our best stats directly translate to more CPs eventually EP and DS just will outshine the extra ambush CP

[limber lion]

Crit, covenant choice, legendary'

Dashing for example gives more energy, which will likely value DS more.

[thorny pond]

^ that too jfc I feel like at some point we'll be too flush with resources. Which I guess opens up good problems

[hidden hound]

Hello, noob rogue here, wanting to make rogue my alt for 9.1 and only really enjoy assassination. What covenant and lego do I want to go for? Currently venthyr iirc

[thorny pond]

Venth is fine. What content are you doing?

[gusty mirage]

Necro or venthyr, doom for ST, zold for aoe

[limber lion]

It's looking like Necrolord might be the play for 9.1. I highly recommend at least leveling the renown up on that covenant ready for 9.1 so you can choose between the two

[thorny pond]

How is necro looking for sub?

[stoic needle]

Ehh

Not very good

[thorny pond]

sub is smashing venth right? I still feel like sin will have the better outcomes because execute and bleed scenarios + ease of use

[stoic needle]

There's no reason to use sbs when shadowstrike and shuriken storm exist

So you only use it outside of dance

And dance uptime is higher in 9.1

[thorny pond]

True. I still don't like the flavor of dance but to each their own

[limber lion]

Venthyr just fits the kit much better

[thorny pond]

I don't think we'll see many more changes. PTR is closing soon yeah?

[alpine latch]

Did we ever find out what those "rogue legendary" changes were that they put into the PTR vague as fuck but nothing was actually on the PTR about?

[limber lion]

Who knows

[limber lion]

Rogue legendary changes?

[alpine latch]

Yeah, there was a PTR note change about it

[limber lion]

Did I miss something?

[alpine latch]

But nothing on the ptr

One sec (it was a few weeks ago)

[limber lion]

Can you link it

I mean, they did add covenant legendaries for us

[thorny pond]

Arnold Palmer been spiking his drinks again

[alpine latch]

No, after that

[limber lion]

A long while back

[alpine latch]

We talked about it

And joked that we might see the "changes" in 9.2

[limber lion]

I don't recall having that conversation

[gusty mirage]

It was the patch notes where they said “added rogue legendaries to PTR” which was essentially nothing lol

It happened early may iirc

[alpine latch]

I know it was something vague as shit

I can't find the convo

But our legendaries were already on the PTR when it was in the notes

So it made zero sense

[gusty mirage]

Yeah there were no new changes in that build. It was likely a typo

[limber lion]

Ah okay, I missed that then

[gusty mirage]

Or an oversight

[limber lion]

First time I'm hearing about it

[gusty mirage]

I’ll see if I can find it for you @limber lion

[agile geode]

What do you think about new dagger?

[alpine latch]

It wasn't a long convo. We joked about it for like 15 messages

[limber lion]

It's okay, if it's not anything important, I can live with it :p

[limber lion]

It's looking pretty spicy. We don't know the numbers yet, so it's just pure speculation at this point.

[full breach]

Lol why is it impossible to get invited to Mythics lol

[limber lion]

Tell me about it.

Killed my mood for m+ progression. Really need a group to push keys with

[full breach]

Lol like a 184 and cant even get into a +2....

[agile geode]

You dont need to replace a leggo for equip that right??

[thorny pond]

Push your key that early

[limber lion]

No

[agile geode]

Noice

[limber lion]

It's going to be a necessity for all sin/sub rogues pretty much

[agile geode]

Y ofc

[thorny pond]

OH for outlaw?

[limber lion]

Maybe, maybe not.

The sword might be better for them

Or Pox.

[gusty mirage]

https://www.wowhead.com/blue-tracker/topic/us/chains-of-domination-ptr-notes-may-18-updates-966963

[thorny pond]

Which sword?

[gusty mirage]

It was nothing

[alpine latch]

Hell yeah Oxi. I just found the date too, lol

[gusty mirage]

We received zero changes. Not even a tooltip change

[thorny pond]

Fine with me. Less community drama around us the better

[limber lion]

Ah, well that's the usual case of Blizzard padding the patch notes with nothing.

[alpine latch]

Yeah, it definitely seemed out of place.

[thorny pond]

Let us skate by near the top and not be in a constant state of Flux and panic

[limber lion]

[visual prairie]

• garrote now lasts 18.0 seconds. (was 18)

[thorny pond]

CS Majors are happy I guess

[visual prairie]

what sword does outlaw want?

[hidden hound]

Probably gonna be doing dungeons and eventually alt runs in raid

[thorny pond]

Personally I'd go necro and zolds then

[hidden hound]

Which one is zolds? Is that the bleeds and poisons do more damage? I think that's the one I have created

On boots iirc

[thorny pond]

The execute one

[visual prairie]

these boots were made for dotting

[hidden hound]

I would look at armory but I'm specced to sub cause I was trying it out

[limber lion]

Yes sir.

Necro + Zoldyck is the best choice for m+. Very solid for raiding as well.

[alpine latch]

Necro seems even better if the dot can crit and with the new leggo

[alpine latch]

Probably dual Poxstorm from PF, but ask in #outlaw to confirm

[hidden hound]

The bone spike is a permanent dot right? I'm not at home so I'm limited lol

[visual prairie]

they made it sound like there was a new or different sword from pox

[alpine latch]

It is

[limber lion]

Yes, it is.

[limber lion]

There is in 9.1.

A unique sword.

[tulip nacelle]

sire weapon and pox

[thorny pond]

If that Banshee blight stacks from CT holy hell watch out boys

[gusty mirage]

Meffer fighting the good pirate fight

[alpine latch]

I mean, if someone is asking about what the best weapons are

It's safe to assume they aren't getting Mythic Sire weapons

[thorny pond]

I think we were referencing 9.1

[alpine latch]

Yeah, I was commenting about how Sire weapon is better. They aren't getting a 233 weapon from Sire. They're going to get a 226 at best from GV

[visual prairie]

i just wanted to see the new sword that was unique in some way

but i can't find it

[alpine latch]

It looks solid

[tulip nacelle]

yeah it's probably good

[thorny pond]

Link to this sword?

[thorny pond]

Oh.

The fist

[visual prairie]

ok, that's not a sword, but I guessed maybe that was it

[thorny pond]

I was like "Is there a sword I missed?"

[tulip nacelle]

yeah ppl just call onehanders swords

[visual prairie]

only thing i saw for outlaw

[alpine latch]

The first comment is a typo

I believe that should say, "While you're behind your enemy and (their movement is impaired or they are suffering from loss-of-control), then your attacks have a high chance.."

[hidden hound]

Call me dumb but do the sylvanas daggers have any special effects other then looking badass imo

[limber lion]

Incorrect

[alpine latch]

Your attacks apply Banshee's Blight, giving your finishers a chance to deal X shadow damage. Banshee's Blight stacks up to 4 times the more injured the target is.

[limber lion]

It's either of the 3

[alpine latch]

Yeah, I re-read it

[visual prairie]

yeah, i think all those conditions are "or", so you just need to be behind the target

[alpine latch]

I left it there to show my stupidity

[limber lion]

:p no worries

[limber lion]

#subtlety message

[pale fossil]

I think I know the answer to this, but in ST, UDK's are better PI targets than us right?

[hidden hound]

Oooooo last I heard they didn't have any effects, I've been avoiding most of the ptr stuff so I don't spoil anything lol but it's fine for minor things like that

[slow marsh]

During army yes

After army I believe we are better but it's honestly subjective

[pale fossil]

I think we give it to one of our MM Hunters or UDKs usually, just was curious

And our Mage once?

[slow marsh]

Yeah makes sense. If it were pure ST then it's be different but I'm assuming you're talking about sire prog

[pale fossil]

Yeah, Sire P3.

[slow marsh]

Is PI able to target people underneath? Or do you have a prjest going thru mirror

[pale fossil]

Oooh, did not think about that. I have no idea.

[slow marsh]

Yeah I'm not sure about that either cuz I know both groups have to hero separately so I figured the PIs would be ranged only for p3

[pale fossil]

Yeah that's probably right. Nix that idea then

[stiff geyser]

I have a feeling we about to be the executioner overlords with that dagger

[weary marten]

have you guys read that : Toxic Onslaught Your ability used from Stealth Your stealth ability used while Sepsis is active grants you one of Shadow Blades, Adrenaline Rush, or applies Vendetta to your current target for 8 sec.
Does this mean nightfae will be first again ? x)

[limber lion]

This is correct. You cannot heal, buff or interact with the other side whatsoever.

[limber lion]

That legendary is the worst legendary we have.

Literally the worst out of everything.

[dawn ivy]

barely a gain lol

[weary marten]

oh ok i didn't associate it to a legendary, i thought it was a soulbinds

thanks for the light on this

[limber lion]

Yeah no worries

[weary marten]

i'm currently NL after kyrian and venthyr, didn't want to switch again x)

[limber lion]

Necrolord is perfect.

[weary marten]

it's more fun that i expected when i got the ability when leveling

[dawn ivy]

i had fun with sepsis in beta....

a heavy dot that reset if it the target died

[limber lion]

Yeah, it was pretty interesting back when it still had the vanish component as well.

Too bad it was a mess.

[weary marten]

yeah the loss of the vanish effect definitely made it pointless (in a pure pve perspective)

[sleek pollen]

!opener

[gusty mirage]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[gusty mirage]

^ check any of those @sleek pollen

[sleek pollen]

ty

[frosty bridge]

Emeni vs Heirmir for Council paddz?

[gentle rapids]

maybe a stupid question, but if I use SnD before a raid encounter, does the buff get removed?

[tulip nacelle]

it doesn't

[gentle rapids]

Awesome, thanks

[astral tiger]

Does necro ability count as an extra bleed for doomblades?

[frosty bridge]

Yes, it does

[astral tiger]

aight ty

[random fossil]

hello boys, judging by what we know is venthyr bis for 9.1?

[limber lion]

Not sure yet, Necrolord is looking to be the better choice overall, but who knows.

[limber lion]

Emeni

[stiff geyser]

Necrolord is the least appealing cov to me

It’s so bland

Cool gothic vampires, angelic warriors, avatar creatures with great particle effects, or looks at notes skeletons

Skeletons with swords* my b

[gusty mirage]

Then play one of the others

You don’t have to go necro Venthyr is still really good

[limber lion]

Necrolord has the best covenant ability though, so it outweighs all the bad stuff.

[gusty mirage]

As is fae

[limber lion]

But it literally doesn't matter if you don't care about your dps.

[stiff geyser]

Meh unless it’s a huge difference I’m staying venth

[limber lion]

If all you care about is lore, pretty colors, flying unicorns, then have at it my boy

[stiff geyser]

1-3% isn’t worth it

To me

[limber lion]

But

[gusty mirage]

The dif in multi target and aoe is a good amount but nothing crazy that’d require you to absolutely have to switch

[limber lion]

What is it that you value in terms of dps?

[gusty mirage]

It’s not like boomie not playing fae, ya know?

[limber lion]

5 minute patchwork sims?

Because nothing in the current game is a 5 minute patchwork fight

[gusty mirage]

They value that sick venthyr mog that I miss dearly

[limber lion]

"I will not choose Necrolord because it's 2% worse in single target"

Pumps in AoE

Pumps in any fight with adds that reset SBS

But yeah, just play whichever covenant you want. It doesn't honestly matter lol

[limber lion]

I enjoyed the Venth tmog options, even though I never used any of them

[late grove]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/26#class=Rogue&spec=Assassination&combatantinfo=Covenants

why patchwerk should be taken with a grain of salt. still good for simming but data like this can illustrate how they perform in raid

[nimble tartan]

huh

[gusty mirage]

That chart confuses me

[drowsy coral]

What is this

Idk how it supports any arguments at all but maybe i'm mentally challenged

[late grove]

what's confusing abt the chart, maybe i'm the one that's mentally challenged

[gusty mirage]

Night fae assassination is less dps than baseline assa dps? I’d the “assassination rogue” bar an average among all covenants?

[late grove]

what's baseline assa

[gusty mirage]

I don’t think you’re the mentally challenged one I think the website’s lack of information is the challenged one

[late grove]

oh the UI on this page is definitely bad lol

[limber lion]

I mean the information is below the chart

[late grove]

the thing labeled as assa rogue is just an aggregate of the diff covenants

[gusty mirage]

You calling me dumb?

[gusty mirage]

Okay now it makes more sense

[limber lion]

But yeah, if you're not an avid user of WCL, then the graphs can seem a bit intimidating and odd

Like if you look at that graph

You'll notice that it doesn't even list Kyrian

[late grove]

correct because "no one" uses it in mythic raid

<5% of parses

[limber lion]

Yep

[late grove]

damage to bosses isnt even that far off for necrolord

[nimble tartan]

can u check hungering for me

[late grove]

1.1%

[limber lion]

You can just check it yourself.

[late grove]

you can change it up top lol: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/26#combatantinfo=Covenants&boss=2383&class=Rogue&spec=Assassination

[limber lion]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/26#class=Rogue&spec=Assassination&combatantinfo=Covenants

[nimble tartan]

i cant rn

[late grove]

you can even get this breakdown for trinkets/soulbinds/etc

all pretty useful

[nimble tartan]

im using voice to text my hands are tied up ill just wait until my dom unties my hands

[limber lion]

Man's got kinks

[drowsy coral]

Does that mean that on this precise sample there is 1.72% kyrian ?

How do i get their autographs

[limber lion]

Yes.

[pale fossil]

You're probably not looking to be convinced, but I also hated the Necro aesthetic and swapped just for DPS, and ended up really liking it now. SBS is just a really fun button and Gemstone is a fun passive to play with.

[limber lion]

Champs

Necrolord is bis covenant solely because of SBS. Everything else is trash

The sanctum is bad, the transmogs are bad, the aesthetic is bad

But SBS

That's

[pale fossil]

I liked the Night Fae aesthetic, but Sepsis is insanely bland to use and even though the soulbinds are powerful, they don't feel as impactful as maximizing a gemstone window.

[drowsy coral]

Hey the purple necro tmog set is actually good

I'd get it if i wasn't lazy

[limber lion]

[pale fossil]

That feeling of entering P3 against Denny and every SBS giving you 5 CP is amazing

[limber lion]

Definitely

SBS is just an amazing ability all around. Can't wait to play around with Deathspike.

[gusty mirage]

[stoic needle]

It's the least terrible of the necro mogs

[pale fossil]

^

I'm not gonna grind anima for it but it looks fine.

[limber lion]

Imagine just not using the same tmog that you've used for 5 years now

[nimble tartan]

mfs in necrolord crafting on some flesh thats too sussy for me

[limber lion]

jk, I had to switch my tmog for the first time in forever because I got a new mount and I had to find a fitting tmog for it

[candid mountain]

Are there any Assassination Rogue Weak auras I could use?

[limber lion]

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[candid mountain]

Ty.

[limber lion]

I personally use Afenar's pack.

I've just modified some things here and there and added quite a few weak auras to fit my need

[candid mountain]

Is there a way for me to have one show how many combo points by showing a bar?

[limber lion]

I would recommend also getting a weakaura for Gemstones if you're necrolord.

[candid mountain]

Ok.

[limber lion]

Yes, the Afenar's pack has combo points.

It has pretty much everything you need.

You can just delete stuff that you don't want to see if you don't want all of that cramping your screen

[candid mountain]

Ok.

Might think about also getting a bigger screen but not yet. Anyways thanks.

🥰

[drowsy coral]

That's an interesting solution to weak auras scales

[pale fossil]

You can also go the route where this stuff is displayed on the boss's health bar, but that's a bit trickier to set up.

[limber lion]

My pleasure

[pale fossil]

My UI is probably an abomination but it works for me lolol

[limber lion]

That's all that matters :p

[candid mountain]

Ok. Thanks.

[limber lion]

There's quite a few hideous UI's out there but if it works then what the hell.

[pale fossil]

I have my two keybind bars up higher, Red Rogue's progress bars beneath them, and debuffs shown on Plater.

[candid mountain]

Just almost about to get into the Shadowlands and want to have good weak auras for when I enter to make my rotation better.

Is there any macros?

[limber lion]

No, assassination doesn't really use macros.

You don't need anything.

Just get a good weak aura pack, a good nameplate addon/profile and you're gucci

[pale fossil]

Mouseover/Focus macro for interrupts, Mouseover macro for SBS maybe

[candid mountain]

Ok.

[pale fossil]

More complicated stuff if you want to pvp.

But peep #pvp for that

[limber lion]

You don't honestly need any macros for PvE.

[candid mountain]

Ok. I just use a distract macro I felt I was missing one. But it looks like I wasn't.

[pale fossil]

I should maybe learn to actually use Distract and Tricks

[limber lion]

You pick it up quick when you start.

You can just spam tricks everywhere

[drowsy coral]

Not using tricks

[limber lion]

And just use Distract in M+ a few times and it sticks.

[pale fossil]

What can I say, I like to Evasion tank

[drowsy coral]

Your tanks will send you death threats

[pale fossil]

They already do. It keeps me on my toes.

[limber lion]

More like the healers when you get slapped by melees

[drowsy coral]

I never seem to encounter healers that complains

Maybe i'm lucky

It's always tanks crying

[pale fossil]

I also definitely use Vanish to drop aggro in that situation which I'm sure causes all kinds of chaos

[limber lion]

But if your tanks are crying - does that mean that you don't use tricks?

[pale fossil]

But I've never gotten a peep from the tanks or healers about it.

[compact pumice]

Just macro it to your stealth button or something and make it go on @focus,exists,noharm,nodead

[pale fossil]

And I'm KSM at least

[limber lion]

You weirdchamp people for not using tricks, but tanks constantly cry to you

[compact pumice]

I have a specific keybind at least

[drowsy coral]

that means the mage combust too hard

[limber lion]

I just have tricks bound on tilde

[pale fossil]

We had a boomkin die in P1 yesterday because they got a fat convoke on pull and got aggro lmfao

[drowsy coral]

They don't cry to me specifically 🙂

[limber lion]

Fair fair

That's good

[drowsy coral]

Happens with our feral on sludge too for some reason

[pale fossil]

So I just set my Focus to my tank and just do that the whole M+ run? That seems easy enough.

[drowsy coral]

1/5 times he gets the aggro on pull

[pale fossil]

So 1/5 times he goes splat

[limber lion]

Yes. I wouldn't macro it on any random button though

[compact pumice]

Yeah I just use it between packs

so I can go ham right away

[limber lion]

Just have a separate bind for it

[drowsy coral]

Don't macro it

[compact pumice]

Never have problem with threat that way

[drowsy coral]

You won't have it when you need it

[limber lion]

Yeh, it's not exactly 100% uptime.

You still need to have it ready for when you need it.

[compact pumice]

my macro is /cast [@focus,exists,nodead,help][] Tricks of the Trade

[pale fossil]

Yeah but I don't want to have to actually target my tank haha

[drowsy coral]

Especially for stuff like PF if you do the plagueborers strat and you pull for your tank

[compact pumice]

Oh wait I added @mouseover as a second one

but pretty much never use it

hmm or @targettarget is pretty good too

[limber lion]

Yeah, you can still use a focus macro without binding it to another ability lol

[pale fossil]

I won't macro it to stealth, I'll just macro it to tilde or whatever.

[drowsy coral]

You just bind it to a button, and use a set focus

[limber lion]

That's not "macroing it to" something

That's just setting it on a bind

[slow marsh]

Yeah I just use focus macro Trix and set tank as focus and spam Ctrl g on cd

[limber lion]

Macroing something to something means macroing 2 abilities on one button

Like:
/cast stealth
/cast tricks of the trade

[pale fossil]

Ahh, I thought someone was saying don't macro it at all, and I was like "I'm not manually clicking on the tank every time I want to cast this shit"

[limber lion]

Yeh no.

[drowsy coral]

Nah sorry, I meant not to an another ability

[limber lion]

You definitely should have a Tricks macro

Just don't macro it to mutilate, stealth or anything

Just have it as its separate thing

[sharp panther]

look on wago for weakaura that works with a macro to auto target tank

[drowsy coral]

don't do that aswell, you might end up tricks'ing your mage

[noble valve]

https://wago.io/rdRQBLKGX

[pale fossil]

Ooooooh

[noble valve]

this is the big brain WA for my tricks homies

[slow marsh]

Remember when tricks increased damage. Those were the days

[sharp panther]

yeah that

[limber lion]

Awful

[stoic needle]

https://wago.io/OPG-27Bnm

[slow marsh]

It was awesomely awfully

[stoic needle]

using focus for your tricks is kind of a waste

[limber lion]

Why is it a waste?

[stoic needle]

because then you can't use focus targeting for actually targeting important things that you need to CC

[drowsy coral]

What do you even loose from setting a set focus macro lol

[compact pumice]

i guess you can use a kick focus

[slow marsh]

Which is how I know how my priest feels always being asked for pi

[limber lion]

Imagine even using /focus ever

I'm gonna be honest

I've played this game since TBC with breaks on and off

And I've never ever used focus on anything

Except PVP

[sharp panther]

i use focus for kick macro when the thing i need to kick isn’t the thing i’m currently damaging

[tulip nacelle]

I use focus so much

such a great tool

[drowsy coral]

I'm doing fairly high keys, and i've never ever used it too

[stoic needle]

it's still useful for things even if you personally don't take advantage of it lol

[pale fossil]

SL is my first wow experience, and often when I've used Focus macro it's instead broke the spell haha

Like I couldn't get it to cast

[slow marsh]

I only ever focus tank

[pale fossil]

So I mostly stick to MOs now

[compact pumice]

no point using it in PVE

well

[limber lion]

Everyone has their preferences

[compact pumice]

I haven't found a use for it

at least

[limber lion]

But it's definitely not a necessary thing to use

[plain thistle]

hmmm

focus kick

focus blind?

[stoic needle]

focus kick is really useful

[plain thistle]

how its not useful for pve?

[tulip nacelle]

focus kick on sire

[compact pumice]

Mouseover kick is a lot more useful

[pale fossil]

I do Focus Kick on Council

[sharp panther]

it’s super useful in keys

[compact pumice]

imo

[limber lion]

Who said it's not useful for pve?

It is useful

[drowsy coral]

Why focus blind when you can mouseover wth

[limber lion]

But it's not necessary

I've never used it.

[plain thistle]

anno did

[stoic needle]

i just think that using focus for your tank for tricks is a waste when you could use it for other things

[pale fossil]

But I don't understand how to set Focus quickly, so I don't use it for my interrupt on the horseman's add.

[limber lion]

Welp

[tulip nacelle]

mouseover focus

[stoic needle]

there's a keybind you can set to set focus

[limber lion]

You bind it to a key

[plain thistle]

I cant imagine doing something like first boss of temple of sethalis without focus kick

[pale fossil]

That's a mouseover kick with additonal steps

[tulip nacelle]

no

[limber lion]

First boss of ToS?

Why would you need a focus kick for it

[tulip nacelle]

if you miss mouseover kick it's way worse

[plain thistle]

you can mouse over ofc

[tulip nacelle]

than missing a focus set

[pale fossil]

That's true

[plain thistle]

because if you swap target and auto attacked him you died?

[pale fossil]

Sometimes I commit the unforgivable sin and just tab target my interrupt on P2 Sire lol

[desert inlet]

bosses are easy because you can mouseover the boss frame to kick

[plain thistle]

auto attack by mistake, focus/mouseover was the safe option

[limber lion]

You auto-attack in 25 degree cone in front of you, but you can use abilities in a 90 degree cone or some shit

So you can just kick sideways

And apply bleeds sideways

But yeh, that's fine

[plain thistle]

sure, focus/mouse over still safer

[limber lion]

Sure is

[alpine latch]

When you just tricks'd another rogue and they tricks'd you? lol

[limber lion]

Everyone has their preferences

I simply don't have any open binds for focus kicks.

[slow marsh]

Pretty much

[pale fossil]

Ok I have Tricks set up and I'm gonna run a random M+ to learn it haha

[nimble tartan]

this is why i use foot pedals

[limber lion]

Good luck

[pale fossil]

Inb4 the WA thinks my healer is my tank

[alpine latch]

I just have a kick macro. If my focus target is hostile, it kicks that. Otherwise it's just a mouseover kick

[slow marsh]

It was actually boring AF

[plain thistle]

for tricks I would use target=tank_name actually, if you run with a group

than you have focus free for adds and w/e

[sharp panther]

lol i’ve never had a problem with the tricks weakaura dw

you won’t tricks healer :p

[compact pumice]

When do you use focus in m+ unless its on tank?

[limber lion]

You can just use a weak aura for that as well, so you don't need to input the tank's name at the start of every dungeon

[dull cloak]

but u gotta change name everytime its new tank. too mach work

[frosty bridge]

Kicking?

[sharp panther]

kick target

[drowsy coral]

I guess they're using it for each pack so the main kick prio is on focus

[limber lion]

Quite a few players use focus kicks.

[compact pumice]

just extra work to swap Focus

[alpine latch]

You focus a new target every pull in m+?

[drowsy coral]

Which I found insanely annoying to do

[compact pumice]

Just mouseover

[plain thistle]

"if you run with a group" I assume its the same tank everytime

[frosty bridge]

Not in a pack with 20 adds lol

[sharp panther]

why would you need to swap focus?

[alpine latch]

Because mobs die and you need to focus a new target

[plain thistle]

not every pull, but any pull that has target to kick yes

[warm parcel]

Easiest is to just not kick

[compact pumice]

Then you would prob target that thing

[warm parcel]

Let the others handle that shit

[frosty bridge]

Not always

[alpine latch]

That sounds awful ...

[late grove]

i use mouseover for everything, shiv, mfd, sbs, kick, blind, kidney

[limber lion]

Actual 5head take

[stoic needle]

[plain thistle]

I have a mouseover macro to focus

[alpine latch]

kicks are a waste. Just stun 4head

[slow marsh]

Just vanish garrotex4 and you never have to kick

[pale fossil]

I use MO for MfD, Kick, and Blind, but why would you use it for Shiv?

[limber lion]

I just hard-target my kick targets.

[plain thistle]

shift + f = focus my mouse over, and ctrl + q is kick focus

[pale fossil]

^

[late grove]

oh sorry shiv on outlaw that is 😄

[limber lion]

Nothing matters and everything is preference.

[late grove]

for de-enrage

[oak sky]

shift f focus is bis

[late grove]

forgot where i was

[frosty bridge]

Personally I don't use the focus kick, i switch to it and kick it buuuuut

[pale fossil]

Ahhh ic

[frosty bridge]

Ideally you use focus

[pale fossil]

Yeah I just swap to them with tab targeting

[limber lion]

Same

[pale fossil]

I have an MO Kick but it's a last resort

[slow marsh]

Do they make a weak aura for tabbing and kicking ?

[limber lion]

I have nameplates setup so I know which mobs have important spells to kick.

[compact pumice]

I haven't felt the need at all in any pull in m+ currently at least

[pale fossil]

Same

[limber lion]

So I'm always seeing the important casts go off

[dull cloak]

there is usually one mob that needs kicked per pack so focus that

[limber lion]

And can easily swap

[frosty bridge]

I mean, in large pulls in NW a focus kick can be quite useful

Goresplatter, drain fluids for example

Or the Necromancer packs frostbolt volley etc

[late grove]

if an important cast goes off just link the interrupt meter and blame your ranged, no big deal

[drowsy coral]

Also if you play with a team, usually you know who kicks what and you can preselect your kick target if there's no prio

[pale fossil]

Yeah, and big bug pulls at the ends of Mists. There are a few but I've not had too much of a problem just tab targeting.

[limber lion]

Or you just hard-prio the target until he casts the ability, you kick then swap targets.

[drowsy coral]

Otherwise just click on frames 4head

[frosty bridge]

Absolutely, all I am saying is that it's technically "not ideal"

[slow marsh]

Just do keys with a prot pally and then blame all non-kicks on him

/her

[limber lion]

Yeh, but it's also not ideal playing Assassination in m+ to begin with.

[slow marsh]

/them

[limber lion]

[slow marsh]

Reeeeeeeeeeee

[frosty bridge]

So true

[slow marsh]

No but really kicks are not usually a big deal at all if you're running with a group anyways. It's not rocket science. I just click and kick/tab kick. You usually are calling kick order anyways so you have plenty of time to be ready for it

The only times kicks are dicey are pugs and then you just blame whoever is from quel thalas

[compact pumice]

Oh wait I'm playing outlaw in keys so usually I just hardtarget one guy and have him kicked or whatever until dead lol

[alpine latch]

right?

[limber lion]

As long as you keep kick on cooldown and actually use it on something, then you're good to go.

[compact pumice]

Maybe if I played assa in keys I'd want focus macro

[frosty bridge]

B o l s t e r i n g

[compact pumice]

Lol

Not my problem

[frosty bridge]

true

[compact pumice]

It's better to stagger anyway

😄

[slow marsh]

Sin is nice tho for the silence x4 on open and then if it's a prio pack you can vanish silencex4 again in pandemic

[limber lion]

3x

[frosty bridge]

Bolstered adds = fight lasts longer = more chances to reset cooldowns as outlaw

[sharp panther]

i play with a prot pally our group kick calls are usually like “tank... tank.. still tank.. still tank”

[drowsy coral]

Don't spoil the secret, tanks may be listening

[frosty bridge]

By the way, from where does the term "Pandemic" originate for Dots?

[compact pumice]

Warlock skill

[frosty bridge]

I was confused as fuck reading that when I started playing

[limber lion]

It used to be a passive for Affliction Warlocks

[frosty bridge]

refresh at ... during pandemic

i was looking through my spellbook feeling like a complete noob

[slow marsh]

True it's a weird term

[limber lion]

Yeh it's pretty common to not be aware of the mechanic when you start.

[compact pumice]

It's just WoW never named it, so the name that was before stuck

[limber lion]

I got CE from Argus without ever using pandemic.

[warm parcel]

https://wowwiki-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Pandemic

[compact pumice]

Carried

[limber lion]

I was top dps

[compact pumice]

ok you carried them then!

[limber lion]

Pandemic is just a mechanic to smooth out the rotation

I do remember how much easier assa suddenly became in bfa when I figured it out

[compact pumice]

True, it's not really needed per say

[limber lion]

[compact pumice]

Yeah assa is very... logical

[frosty bridge]

Did you refresh Dots as they expired?

Lel

[limber lion]

Yep.

[compact pumice]

Never feels like the rotation has rough spots or whatever

It's not like Sub where you sometimes end up backstabbing for half a minute feeling like you're doing nothing

[drowsy coral]

Outlaw is very well made too

[compact pumice]

RTB is too random

[limber lion]

God I was a beast even back then

[drowsy coral]

Hate the theme but love the playstyle in m+

[slow marsh]

I hate the theme but I'm over it

[limber lion]

Back when we used to do damage with poisons

[drowsy coral]

Kingsbane

[limber lion]

PB only 12%

[slow marsh]

My issue with outlaw is that it completely revolves around rtb and it kind of takes away from the identity in my opinion

[compact pumice]

Combat basically didn't have a theme, so I don't really mind the whole Pirate shit

It's just a bit... cringe

[drowsy coral]

What do you mean by "completely revolves around rtb" ?

[compact pumice]

wish they went with Ninja or Samurai or something instead

[alpine latch]

Combat is a more agile warrior. That's it

[drowsy coral]

You just cast hit and try to get conduit procs

[compact pumice]

RTB is not really played around except for Broadside. But it affects DPS way too much to be so random

[slow marsh]

The entirety of outlaw is based around rtb is exactly what I mean

Like

[drowsy coral]

I disagree that it affects it too much, at least in m+

never felt like it, and anyway you reroll the snd uptime and energy

[compact pumice]

Dude you can do godlike DPS if you get a 5 roll and fuck up a pack with all CDs

[slow marsh]

It doesn't affect too much directly but at the same time it's the foundation of the spec

[compact pumice]

and you have all cds for the next big pull and do way less

since you dont have 5 cp every second gcd

[slow marsh]

Without rtb there is no outlaw

[limber lion]

Outlaw with 5 buffs feels pretty fucking smooth ngl

[compact pumice]

Yea

5 buff is just way too good

[drowsy coral]

Yet our damage stay consistent from packs to packs regardless of rtb buffs

[compact pumice]

No way it does

[drowsy coral]

Sure you can go high with good procs, but it's still good without

[compact pumice]

5 RTB is insane dps

[drowsy coral]

Yeah oookay but 5rtb is like 2%

[compact pumice]

or roll 2-3 and get a broadside on outlaw

[drowsy coral]

it barely ever happen

[limber lion]

1%

[polar cape]

5buff into 5buff best feeling

[noble valve]

yeah but a bad roll wont kill your dps, its just that once in a hundred casts youll get to do more dps than usual

[compact pumice]

But that's even worse....

If it is insane but happens less often

[drowsy coral]

this

[balmy condor]

what I miss

[limber lion]

Imagine talking about outlaw in #assassination

[slow marsh]

I'm not really talking strictly dps I'm talking about identity

[limber lion]

Ew

[slow marsh]

And outlaw identity is rolling pirate dice

[pale fossil]

Jury's out on tricks so far

[warm parcel]

Just a wa template for tricks that seems like it could be used for automation to me

[pale fossil]

The tank is mad that I keep pulling for them

[warm parcel]

No biggie