assassination

[spice spire]

The only thing you guys are more impatient about when it comes to realms is when it comes to new sims

[shadow helm]

what

servers going up in a few minutes?

[balmy condor]

it's fire and forget, super simple, doesn't have any weird interactions with downtime or whatever, soulshape is good, etc etc

[spice spire]

1 PST is estimated. I know it’s usually sooner but not like 5 hours sooner usually

[balmy condor]

no use recommending something else to the masses when it does it's thing perfectly fine within 2%

[mental laurel]

Probably Doomblade since Bonespike counts as a bleed for the Evis damage (edit: Envenom)

[dense bramble]

is it modified by zoldyck also?

[frozen jasper]

yeah true. I think im going to switch for now and then look what playstyle is more fun to me personally. thank you very much

[balmy condor]

the dot part I believe, but not the instant

[dense bramble]

i see, but the dot part is negligible right? not worth get attention to

[mental laurel]

The dot itself is kind of meh unless on multiple targets I would say

[balmy condor]

it's about half of the damage

[dense bramble]

5% more on envenom should be a lot better then, thanks!

[balmy condor]

maybe like 40% dot 60% instant after the buff to make it mastery affected again

[dense bramble]

but instant can crit now

[balmy condor]

yes

[limber lion]

Triple sbs opener with MA

[spice spire]

of course

[mental laurel]

I actually wonder what the opener is for necro with doomblade

Lots of things to consider

[quick vale]

should I refresh my bleeds in my vendetta window ?

[loud silo]

yes

[silent breach]

@balmy condor thanks for doing all the sims and answering ppl's questions all the time, big respect to you

[iron orchid]

with ma probably SBS, snd, SBS, rup, gar SBS/vendetta, shiv ,vanish mut env mut env

[dense hamlet]

dude this chat is so chill compared to the #outlaw chat

[stoic needle]

shhh

they're gonna come in here

[mental laurel]

Where does Shiv and Vendetta fit in all that?

[iron orchid]

with subterfuge sth like gar sbs snd vendetta mut rup sbs sbs shiv env mut env

[solid vapor]

Maybe I just read notes wrong... bc someone said necro blade ability doesn’t go away unless the target drops combat right? The way I read it just now is it still goes away on combat drop or full heal but doesn’t give a charge back unless they die

[dire spoke]

:whispyrGachi:

[balmy condor]

@wild lantern

[wild lantern]

Make it

do it

that's your T2

done

[dire spoke]

imagine swapping to sin the first time in SL just to sim it for fun and it just outscales my sub gear

[balmy condor]

it does what

[dire spoke]

S C A L E S

[balmy condor]

[dense hamlet]

out aura buff ur sub gear u meant i think

[balmy condor]

I'll kill you

[dire spoke]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/646460756904116235.gif?v=1

[indigo ginkgo]

Fixed an issue that prevented Envenom's buff from retaining up to 30% of its duration when refreshed.
?

[balmy condor]

yup

envenom no pandemic, now it pandemic, very good

[clear lynx]

Does anyone know if a Subertfuge-Garrote, cast from Stealth with the Master Assassin legendary, is supposed to generate 2 combo points via Seal Fate?

[spice spire]

Yes

[indigo ginkgo]

well other buff

[spice spire]

If it crits

[quasi ledge]

Garrote will only give 1 combo point still, it doesn't do direct damage

[dire spoke]

hm

[clear lynx]

Right, ok, gotcha. Thanks.

[dire spoke]

there is ambush in my spellbook

do I need that

[honest lake]

Man , i want to know how high is the simmed dps of sin compared with the other MDPS

[fossil wraith]

any thoughts on covenant for m+ only? is the new venthyr/necro going to be better than Night Fae?

[balmy condor]

why would you troll the man like that

[balmy condor]

garrote does not seal fate

[indigo ginkgo]

https://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/T26_Raid.html

[indigo ginkgo]

https://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/T26_Raid.html

[spice spire]

Because I’m an idiot and read seal fate extra combo point

Don’t give advice while reading medical records 🙂

[honest lake]

ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, i didn't know they updated it already

[quick vale]

Should I try to fit 3 Envenoms into my Shiv window ?

[balmy condor]

webpage gets re-simmed every morning between 7-10am PST

[dire spoke]

o_ o oh no

[honest lake]

oh thx!

[balmy condor]

I mean, yes, but you don't change your rotation to make it happen

[quick vale]

okay brilliant thanks for the answer

[slender berry]

what if you loose like 2 seconds of rupture uptime for it?

[balmy condor]

does that change your rotation

[alpine garden]

Does Doomblade being good change any of our conduit choices?

[honest lake]

there is a sceneraio that sashing scoundrel outperfom totally doom?

[stoic needle]

no

[spice spire]

Maim mangle when

[balmy condor]

maim becomes better, but not bis

[dire spoke]

do I have to macro vanish>ambush

I guess huh

[timber pawn]

How them Sin changes feeling so far

[balmy condor]

what?

link sim

[signal gulch]

take ambush off bar if you arent blindside

[stoic needle]

servers arent up

[balmy condor]

very good, we're waiting for servers to come up

[dire spoke]

that's the normal nightly apl dude

[balmy condor]

link it tho

[timber pawn]

oh well then carry on

[dense hamlet]

u need a keybind for it tho when u get like free ambushes and stuff from mut and blindside

[timber pawn]

thought theyd be up by now

[dire spoke]

wait how the fuck does it ambush without vanish

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/q4EodjPyZ6ogHuueV39wYZ/simc

[balmy condor]

blindside

[dire spoke]

oh

shit 🙂

[limber lion]

Hmm

[void gazelle]

What is the optimal opener with MA legendary as night fae?

[timber pawn]

Is there a way to Macro Mutilate and Ambush together for when you get blindside procs?

[dire spoke]

okay this rotation is outta control

[spice spire]

!bs

[prisma monolith]

Macroing Ambush to Mutilate only works with the use of a addon.
It comes with the downside that it often requires multiple key presss.
Suggested addon to use(Gnome Sequencer):http://tiny.cc/mxb6tz
Showcase Video: #assassination message

[placid kraken]

Did they make it easier ti swap Covs with 9.0.5? or is it the same as before?

[balmy condor]

also the reason it ambushed there is because of a blindside proc

[balmy condor]

same

[grizzled turtle]

Hey guys, new to the group, so what is the best legendary for sin going to be? I’m venthyr btw

[balmy condor]

pins

:)

[dire spoke]

fuck putting stealth stuff on my nonsealth bars

[limber lion]

pls don't macro/mod muti/ambush together

[dire spoke]

[timber pawn]

@grizzled turtle Doomblade is currently looking Meta with Zold close behind

[dense hamlet]

feelssubman

[limber lion]

Just don't use stealth bars

[dire spoke]

omegabrain

[timber pawn]

Rogues don't need stealth

just more poisons and bleeds

[dense hamlet]

facts

[spice spire]

Ambush goes on R

[gusty mirage]

Despite an awful morning at work, I get to come home soon and log on and do stabby stabby things 🙂

[limber lion]

My bars don't change when I go into stealth. Stealth bars are shit

[spice spire]

Servers supposed to be down for another 4 hours

[reef axle]

Was the change always like this of had something changed 🤔?

[gusty mirage]

Happy 9.0.5 day fellow NAers. EU guys we’ll get the beta testing done for ya

[gusty mirage]

[pine aurora]

Question, is it the haste from flagellation that makes venthyr pull ahead of necrolord or does it have to do with soulbinds too?

[gusty mirage]

New flagellation hits for a lot

[limber lion]

Cheers, get rid of the bugs and nonsense for us, will ya?

[gusty mirage]

I’ll do my best

[spice spire]

Haste and flag actually deals damage now

[gentle gyro]

I assume the CP do not need to be spent on the initial target, yes?

[spice spire]

Soulbinds are meh

[limber lion]

Any 220 Phial speedrunners here?

[pine aurora]

I'm just suprised that a persistent bleed that triggers doomblade damage and also scales with mastery is behind that intitial damage of flagellation

[gusty mirage]

As soon as servers are up I’m running my ass straight to plaguefall

[stoic needle]

[pine aurora]

I recognize that it sims better its just weird to me

[gusty mirage]

Unless I get a 226 from my GV

[limber lion]

Yeah I was thinking of just getting it myself

Like Shia used to say

[gusty mirage]

Imagine not getting haste mastery trash from the vault

[limber lion]

Just do it

[spice spire]

Phials only today bois

[gentle gyro]

time to spam plaguefall for a trinket and mists for a weapon

[spice spire]

You kings deserve it for the hardships we went through. But now we’re good for half a patch

[balmy condor]

I already win, 226 from the vault ez

[spice spire]

I hope you never get that HoA 15

[limber lion]

[gusty mirage]

You were blessed for all the simming you do for us potatoes

Wait you need a 15 halls? I got you dood

If someone in my group gets a halls we’ll save it for you @balmy condor

[icy crater]

Just a reminder from last week for yall

[limber lion]

He's not allowed to do it

[gusty mirage]

Oh

[timber gale]

I have KSM on my main - if I’m hunting 220 trinks from dungeons what do y’all think would pair best with a Phial?

[gusty mirage]

Nvm then don’t kill me guys

[stoic needle]

Die

[gusty mirage]

Why must you make me hate you?

[cunning musk]

Damn you lol

[gentle gyro]

that's not a nice thing to say

drop dead

is way more eloquent

[timber gale]

Does sin want an IQD? Or is there a better on use for us

[stoic needle]

[icy crater]

😄

[limber lion]

I hope you have a great day

Bitch

[gusty mirage]

Iqd kinda meh

[balmy condor]

there's a 3 letter acronym to tell someone to die, which I find to be the best

[stoic needle]

I hope you step on a lego today

[gusty mirage]

You ideally want phial/dread fire if I’m not mistaken

[spice spire]

None of the other trinkets from dungeons are that great. Inerva trinket, sludgy, and sire all are good

[gentle gyro]

na man too edgy

[icy crater]

gonna kms in minecraft later

[spice spire]

But everyone here loves the gargoyle trinket too

[stoic needle]

Dreadfire is the best on-use but iqd is pretty damn great

[timber gale]

Yeah I’m more asking for ones from dungeons so I can valor upgrade them

[gusty mirage]

Kraft Minecraft stuff?

[stoic needle]

No we don't, it just sims well

[sleek sparrow]

Dreadfire

[balmy condor]

yeah but it's also filtered I was trying to bait people into it

don't tell anyone

[icy crater]

!bis

[spice spire]

That was sarcasm homie come on dog

[frosty bridge]

Is Necrolord decent on Sire compared to venthyr? you can keep a spike on remornia, sire and then have the adds etc right?

[icy crater]

????????????

[stoic needle]

Heraldry

[balmy condor]

yeh

[spice spire]

All my homies hate shriekwing

[gentle gyro]

https://i.imgur.com/sOrm7LV.png

[sleek sparrow]

All my homies hate bis lists

[gentle gyro]

you have sth against my trinkets?

😠

[stoic needle]

Yes

[gusty mirage]

What’s a bis list?

[stoic needle]

I have the same ones

[spice spire]

Wait actually same

What the fuck

[gentle gyro]

[gusty mirage]

Here I am with my 213 hateful chain and 210 phial

[spice spire]

I don’t mind SLH

[sleek sparrow]

Imagine getting trinket drops from raid

[lapis warren]

https://imgur.com/SgponY6

[limber lion]

Same. But why do you have 2 ilvl addons

[stoic needle]

Hardstuck HC crew

[gentle gyro]

i don't actually

[gusty mirage]

REEEEEEEEEEEEE

[icy crater]

I got 2 226 trinket in 1 day omegalul

[gusty mirage]

Why do you hate me?

[icy crater]

inerva and vial last week

[stoic needle]

[gusty mirage]

You know what I got from inerva?

[gentle gyro]

i have no idea why there are two numbers, has been like that for years

[strange python]

That thing is horrible, constantly breaking cc/aggroing packs

[gusty mirage]

Fucking anima power

[spice spire]

Same

[gusty mirage]

I’ve never had hateful break cc or aggro packs

[sleek sparrow]

Never inerva ring, never inerva trinket

[gusty mirage]

Just stand in mechanics so it heals you instead 4head

[limber lion]

I have both from vault KEK

[stoic needle]

I want the ring so bad

[gusty mirage]

I got inerva ring from vault last week

[limber lion]

Ring with a socket as well

[gusty mirage]

So that’s kinda nice

[gentle gyro]

ok as it turns out oilvl also shows ilvl in the character window

[stoic needle]

I still use a 207 ring

[sleek sparrow]

Same

[gusty mirage]

But but ily

[signal gulch]

2 226 socketed rings gang 😃

[gusty mirage]

I can’t be friends with someone who uses a 207 ring

[gentle gyro]

i got the one from Sire, can live with that

[sleek sparrow]

My sin set uses a chain and a 226 iqd

[spice spire]

I pulled 2 223 rings in a row. So that was neat.

[gentle gyro]

I want Inerva to give up her ring though

[spice spire]

Inerva ring is pretty good. I had the normal versions forever

[strange python]

https://www.wowhead.com/item=184026/hateful-chain?bonus=6805#comments

unless they hotfixed it

[limber lion]

Nah still does

[strange python]

it still breaks cc and aggros packs within 40yrds

[gusty mirage]

That’s actually hilarious, I just blame the hunters for pulling anyway

[limber lion]

Breaks cc on Shades of Barghast and PvP

[gusty mirage]

“idk how that pulled” “CUZ YOU WERE TOO CLOSE”

And it was me the entire time

[spice spire]

They’d know if they checked logs

They’re bluffing

[icy crater]

I'm frothing at the mouth wanting to check my box

[radiant fossil]

!bs

[prisma monolith]

Macroing Ambush to Mutilate only works with the use of a addon.
It comes with the downside that it often requires multiple key presss.
Suggested addon to use(Gnome Sequencer):http://tiny.cc/mxb6tz
Showcase Video: #assassination message

[sleek sparrow]

Maybe you should see a doc

[icy crater]

im just a gambling addict

[grizzled turtle]

So I was reading the pins and I’m trying to better understand why doom is better on hands and not shoulders

[dense hamlet]

slg

[outer siren]

SLG shoulders.

[polar apex]

!bis

[strange python]

you get shoulders from legion mythic

[icy crater]

!bis

[dense hamlet]

lmao

[stoic needle]

Truthfully it doesn't matter

[strange python]

assuming you get that far this tier

[spice spire]

SLG drops shoulders at 233. There are no gloves at that point

That’s it

[grizzled turtle]

Okay

[spice spire]

But they share stat weights so just vibe it out my dude

[balmy condor]

aight aight I fixed it, try it again

[icy crater]

!bis

😦

[sleek sparrow]

[dense hamlet]

[icy crater]

!bis

[balmy condor]

[spice spire]

Fuck

[dense hamlet]

N

[bold hearth]

I mean you can see the of gear the top herodamage combo uses if you're really curious. https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/combinations-1l/1t-t26-assassination

[outer siren]

[icy crater]

gonna try assa for the first time since bfa on prog tonight wish me luck

[balmy condor]

yo don't blame me, blame the discord lag

[vagrant brook]

hey bois

[gusty mirage]

[stoic needle]

May you step on many legos today my friend

[gusty mirage]

Sick skulkers

[dense hamlet]

oh no the bat wing trinket thingy

[balmy condor]

definitely 100% isn't perhaps the bis set why you gotta share secrets like that

[sleek sparrow]

Only my healers get skulkers

[shadow helm]

server up br0s

[sleek sparrow]

[shadow helm]

??

[bold hearth]

I hate to spoil it for yall, but agi bis stat

[balmy condor]

no

[icy crater]

why would u say server up

with no "?" on the same line

thats a ban imo

[dense hamlet]

cuz they deserve such a dogshit trinket

[shadow helm]

SAD

[stoic needle]

Crit mastery leggings

[outer siren]

@balmy condor do i combust before or after my pistol shot?

[shadow helm]

you sohuld convoke after imo

[balmy condor]

yeah I actually think that one was mystler just grabbing a random leg, I don't have that in my profile

[shadow helm]

never waste an opportunity proc

[gusty mirage]

I’m a strength guy myself

[stoic needle]

It's obviously mastery stack bis

[gusty mirage]

Stronger character = harder melee swings

[balmy condor]

the default was zold on legs, so he had to replace it with something when doomblade hit the ground

[icy crater]

how much you squat

[balmy condor]

so I guess that one won

[gusty mirage]

Well I have +15 str to gloves so I’d say a lot

[balmy condor]

wouldn't make much of a difference either way

[bold hearth]

Has hateful chain always been this high up for trinkets

[balmy condor]

yes

[silent dune]

So what’s the new BIS lego with the changes? Duskwalker seems good...and doomblade too

[balmy condor]

[spice spire]

Abyssal disharmony breeches tho

[bold hearth]

Weird, Innerva trinket always simmed higher for me.

[dense hamlet]

check !bis

[icy crater]

!phial

[balmy condor]

what's stronger, random question in the chat, or the hours whispyr spent on pins

[sleek sparrow]

Random questions in chat

[balmy condor]

true

[spice spire]

Random question in the chat, 100000000%

[dense hamlet]

imagine checking pins

[balmy condor]

random questions kinda swole

[upbeat umbra]

Random question in chat is bis

[balmy condor]

been working out a lot during quarantine

the questions, not me, I'm a stick

[sleek sparrow]

If you can survive being a mod/tc in a wow class discord you can survive anything

[tacit pebble]

how much cdr will the new duskwalkers actually get

[stoic needle]

I mean tbh rh have the power to fix this problem but they refuse

[spice spire]

Not enough for sludgy boi

[icy crater]

they put something in the water in the outlaw chat today

idk wtf is going on

[tacit pebble]

i was more thinking for potentially shriek but i doubt it does anything there either

[plush oasis]

Push to rank 4 zold, or get rank 2 doomblade this week? (I'll sim it okay, just want thoughts.)

[tacit pebble]

what boss are you doing

[balmy condor]

I would rank 2 doom

tbh

[gusty mirage]

Idk man people are mean over there

[spice spire]

Do you have r3 zold?

[icy crater]

zoomer outlaw players

[tacit pebble]

if its anything other than sire p3 than i'd do doomblade

[plush oasis]

I was thinking doom. Using sin for m arti

[spice spire]

Either way

[fading wigeon]

servers back?

[spice spire]

Legendary power > ilvl

[icy crater]

LOOOL

[spice spire]

Holy shit that’s dank

[gusty mirage]

Bully us boomers

[icy crater]

WHO WROTE THAT

[limber lion]

Lmao rip Guy

[balmy condor]

random reddit user #1298

[gusty mirage]

Lmao guy’s not even bullying, he’s just got a blunt tone that comes off as combative

[fading wigeon]

LOl rip

[icy crater]

when you answer the same question for the 38743rd time yeah I mean, I fucking get it lmao

[gusty mirage]

Poor guy, I would’ve ripped my hair out if I was him. The vigor debate alone has earned that man the benefit of the doubt. I woulda started straight up flaming people

[stoic needle]

That sim was without the envenom fix

[spice spire]

Ahhhh

Still do Zoldyck’s for sire papi

[gusty mirage]

Ah yes pikabrew, the untouched vessel that Pika plays once a full moon

[toxic tusk]

I just realized how pins work.

[viral aurora]

So fellas, your personal opinion on best leggo for m+ plays? Zoldyck?

[balmy condor]

yep

[stoic needle]

Zoldyck or MA

[spice spire]

That’s my pick. MA also very good if you can stealth

[viral aurora]

I have to say, I dont love MA.

[balmy condor]

welcome to civilization friend, reject monke, embrace society

[polar apex]

I tried MA it is icky with subertfuge

[void pecan]

ape together strong

[stoic needle]

I have to say I like ma a lot after giving it a chance

[fading wigeon]

oh man dashing and doomblade so close

[proud ore]

i been playing ma assassin because i been forced to last few days and im surprised to read its a thing because its been performing

[gusty mirage]

🐒

[toxic tusk]

But smash

[limber swallow]

but what if I like monke?

[viral aurora]

This tbh

[gusty mirage]

Zug zug

[spice spire]

I never reject monke

[icy crater]

monke together strong

[stoic needle]

What's wrong with 4 seconds of subterfuge garottes critting?

[viral aurora]

How do you open with MA on packs anyway?

[signal gulch]

mention monke and the whole zoo erupts

[polar apex]

because you spend the first 3-4 seconds just using garrote anyway

[balmy condor]

the same way you do without it

[stoic needle]

The same way as you normally would

[gusty mirage]

Garrote EVERYTHING

[spice spire]

Use subterfuge and garrote it all

[gusty mirage]

Garrote the tank too

[proud ore]

with MA wouldnt u just dispatch spam

[stoic needle]

Garotte does huge damage

[icy crater]

hey oxi

[balmy condor]

the what now

[gusty mirage]

Dispatch?

[icy crater]

can you send me your ilvl parses so I can tell if you're good or not

[gusty mirage]

Yes sir?

[balmy condor]

in aoe?

[icy crater]

dont send me overall though

[toxic tusk]

@balmy condor Just so I don’t spam the chat every couple of weeks wondering if my build/rotation is still up to date, do you update those in the pins as well?

[spice spire]

Sir, this is an assassination discord channel

[stoic needle]

MA gives you the option of bursting a priority target with vanish instead of just refreshing subterfuge

[shadow helm]

DISPATCH GANG

[balmy condor]

if they need an update, they will be updated

[gusty mirage]

You want my pathetic mythic ones or my decent heroic ones?

[viral aurora]

This is super boring innit? Put bleeds Up, vanish again go envenom multi spam?

[gusty mirage]

See my fat 2nd 10 parse on inerva

[icy crater]

I want the ones that are like 98 ilvl with 6 other people in your bracket

[stoic needle]

You know how many times you vanish to refresh garottes and they don't live the whole duration? With MA you can just obliterate a dangerous enemy instead

[icy crater]

[gusty mirage]

Oh shit I don’t got any of those, I suck

[viral aurora]

Btw, i played ASSA almost all BFA, crunk to get to play it again.

[gusty mirage]

My ilvl parses are garbageo

[spice spire]

Shit rogue gang

[stoic needle]

Shiv to 5cp vanish envenom MFD envenom mut envenom

[proud ore]

@viral aurora i was surprised playing it this week that its actually already decent tho

[balmy condor]

for reference, during the PTR cycle, I had sims up in the pins usually same day as the notes (given implementation from koji/mystler obviously, the sims don't update themselves), or at least made a note about it

[stoic needle]

MA very good for prideful

[icy crater]

assassination sim dps following the same gains as gme 👀

[gusty mirage]

STONKS

Whispyr can we start a GoFundMe for an AI that sims everything for you?

[sleek sparrow]

did someone say shitty ilvl sin parses

[balmy condor]

when I swapped, I was bugged on a covenant quest, didn't have a soulbind for raid, simmed 5200 without it. Today, with r4 doomblade, I sim almost 6400

my raid actually won't know what hit them

[gusty mirage]

They never did

[signal gulch]

i had to do a calling to start the campaign

[icy crater]

I simmed like 5900 without conduits and 220/213 daggers

[gusty mirage]

I have to log in and make sure Draven doesn’t hate me anymore

[cunning musk]

👍

[gusty mirage]

I did his stupid quest. I ran halls like 3 times

[icy crater]

Hopefully its a lot better with my dagger im pulling from the vault today and toxic blade

[viral aurora]

And venthyr is the way to go for Dungeons guys?
I appreciate the feedback from experienced players

[balmy condor]

there's actually been attempts at that, but things like herodamage use something we call a combinator, which is basically just a big fuck-off list of everything imaginable, and it just runs for like 3 hours and then spits out the big lists you see on the site

[gusty mirage]

Jesus

That’s so many doge coins worth of computing

[icy crater]

oh shit i forgot i had doge

[brittle pawn]

you have to account for all the smoke breaks it takes in that time

[balmy condor]

for example the combinations list that someone posted earlier:

[sleek sparrow]

i knew i forgot to do something last night

didnt prep my callings to turn in

[rapid mirage]

Guys... I'm excited to play my main again.

[gusty mirage]

wait you ABANDONED us?

[rapid mirage]

I'm sorry!

[woven needle]

I was simming over 6100 in outlaw curious to see what I pull in sin

[brittle pawn]

is 4 targets our ideal pull in a dungeon?

[bold hearth]

I have too much vers to sim high in Sin.

[gusty mirage]

its okay I still appreciate you

[marsh mortar]

Doom now bis lego?

[balmy condor]

yeh

[marsh mortar]

Ty

[woven needle]

@balmy condor are you running stratagem or vigor?

[balmy condor]

not actually how that works

[marsh mortar]

What about m+

[balmy condor]

strat cause I'm venthyr

[limber lion]

Yuk

[bold hearth]

Okay, I have poorly optimized gear for Sin.

[balmy condor]

if you don't have a ton of haste on non-venthyr, you're gonna stick with vigor

[woven needle]

I am too but I have low haste

[limber swallow]

what's "a ton"? 20% 25%?

[woven needle]

Vers crit are.my top sadly

[balmy condor]

I think you need like 10%ish haste on venthyr, and 25%ish on non-venthyr for strat to win

[gusty mirage]

you play strata if you're playing the conduit right? Or regardless if you play DD or conduit?

[balmy condor]

very roughly speaking

[woven needle]

Oh I'm good then

I have like 18% haste

[dim temple]

@balmy condor If i am 27% haste.. that ok

[woven needle]

And venthyr

[balmy condor]

you should sim

[icy crater]

are u vamp boi now

[spice spire]

Extra low APM spec

[dim temple]

ty

[bold hearth]

15% haste, 24% vers

[woven needle]

Whisp is your rogue whispyr?

[near lark]

I run vigor at 19% haste. Ooops

[gusty mirage]

yeah I talked to draven on sunday and killed Wilt Chamberlain 3 times to make him like me again

and I'm BACK baby

[woven needle]

Curious to compare gear

[balmy condor]

yes but you'll never find me, I don't stream, or post my sims, or link my wcl ever

[icy crater]

god dang

[heavy skiff]

i like the low apm... can eat cookies while doing dps

[woven needle]

Rip

[limber swallow]

I was running vigor at 21%, been venthyr all expansion because I'm a masochist... I'm hoping I can drop it now and not feel starved.

[near lark]

VAMP BOYS FOR LYFE I'M GLAD I NEVER SWAPPED

[woven needle]

Imma armory you

[polar apex]

low apm is nice, easier on my fingers

[dim temple]

man this raid is slow.. Reown 12 Ventyr .. Runing normal raid damn its slow

[gusty mirage]

my eyeballs already thanked me for switching from Kyrian back to my home of Sinfall

[icy crater]

gf doesn't want me to switch from outlaw... but

[balmy condor]

that's a joke btw, I'm very public with my garbage

https://raider.io/characters/us/area-52/Whíspyr

[near lark]

Great success

[gusty mirage]

AREA 52 GANG

[spice spire]

Found you first try though

[icy crater]

SAME?!?

[spice spire]

Fuck

[gusty mirage]

here are my trash mythic logs :3 https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/area-52/oxxi#partition=1

[balmy condor]

#outlaw <- this way

[gusty mirage]

But I'm reformed @balmy condor take me back pls

[near lark]

Dumb question can I sim sin accurately now?

[gusty mirage]

I was misguided

[sleek sparrow]

smh oxi

[mental wing]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/eu/eredar/meloneneis#partition=1

[gusty mirage]

I gave up on sub too

[woven needle]

https://raider.io/characters/us/alleria/Ohnobro

[sleek sparrow]

not even doing reclears as sin

[near lark]

You wore Oxi 👀

[gusty mirage]

we don't do reclears anymore 😦

[woven needle]

@balmy condor yr just to compare

[spice spire]

Sir across all bosses I see every spec but sin

[topaz saffron]

We dropping vigor now? 🤔

[spice spire]

I’m going to need you to go to the appropriate chat

[gusty mirage]

I even went Orc I am a whore

[balmy condor]

depends on what that means

[woven needle]

? I'm switching today

[spice spire]

Only if you’re venthyr and over 10%+ haste

[near lark]

YOU WHORE 😭😭😭

[bright girder]

orc ftw oxi

[sleek sparrow]

imagine not commiting to a life of memes and playing vulpera

[woven needle]

I'll be going sin in about 6 hours

[gusty mirage]

wait are servers really not going to be up until 6pm?

[spice spire]

My thing was at oxi, you’re good. He’s a regular

[gusty mirage]

REEEEEEEEEEE

[gentle gyro]

burn all furries
i mean I'm accepting of all people

[woven needle]

Ah

[topaz saffron]

Echoing reprimand feeling stale af now

[balmy condor]

still 1pm

[near lark]

Ah I'm just trying so sim sin properly. I haven't done anything outside of base 5min aims to check relative gear upgrades. I also don't know when they update raidbots for patches

[edgy sierra]

Can we sim the new patch on topgear yet? I'm too lazy to name my advanced sim profiles >_>

[strange python]

Hey with assassination in PvP, what is kind of the goal? I feel like the burst is less than sub, but the consistent dmg is there. We just hanging in there trying to do as much dam as possible or what?

[woven needle]

I've been in this disc for years just don't talk much @spice spire

[mental wing]

Im happy US doing the beta logs for me to look what talents and so on i will play in raid

[brittle pawn]

kill the other guys

[spice spire]

Yeah, you’re good definitely not going to be elitist here, I welcome all who join us

[gusty mirage]

I've earned my assa stripes:
https://raider.io/characters/us/area-52/oxxi#season=season-bfa-3
https://raider.io/characters/us/area-52/oxxi#season=season-bfa-4

[spice spire]

Unless they’re on that mastery stacking nonsense

[near lark]

Senpai where would I be without you

[woven needle]

I used to be good now I suck

[balmy condor]

probably on raidbots, not reading the big yellow banner

[near lark]

This is my first patch playing rogue and it's showing 😂

[brittle pawn]

[near lark]

Big tru

[woven needle]

I've been rogue since vanilla

[gusty mirage]

Welcome to our dysfunctional family

[strange python]

Why play rogue when you can play boomkin

[torpid spoke]

@balmy condor should we wait a bit before yolo legendary?

[near lark]

Cause who wants to be op

[balmy condor]

nah just slam doomblade

all good on that front

[near lark]

I'll just beat them with my inferior spec 😎

[torpid spoke]

okay soujnmds good

[gusty mirage]

and we're the coolest class by far

[stoic needle]

@gusty mirage @icy crater i'm thinking about transferring to a52 do you know any good guilds recruiting

[gusty mirage]

I can pickpocket disguise myself

Just take my raid spot so I can focus on m+ and arena

[royal halo]

No one recruiting rogues.

[blazing arrow]

@balmy condor will do chief

[torpid spoke]

well AFTER THE BUFF

[spice spire]

It’s true. No one wants them lol

[torpid spoke]

MAYBE

nah not really

[woven needle]

I left zuljin for a low pop server

[gusty mirage]

I'm the last rogue standing in my guild

[royal halo]

What "buff"?

[gusty mirage]

the other 2 rerolled fire mage and dk

[near lark]

Oxi I'm just mechanics bitch 😔

[spice spire]

Even then. People want ranged

[balmy condor]

?????????????????????????

[spice spire]

I’m soon to be the last rogue in mine

[gusty mirage]

tbh same

[near lark]

It's like oh we need something to do x

HEY OZY YOU DO IT

[torpid spoke]

i top dps on innerva tho

[stoic needle]

[balmy condor]

you're in the sin channel, and you're unaware of buffs?

[slow marsh]

I am disappoint

https://raider.io/characters/us/proudmoore/Icebladesx

[torpid spoke]

🙂

[near lark]

But but but.. Mage?

[royal halo]

Is the venthyr buff that big?

[gusty mirage]

"Yo go clear traps on xymox and orbs on hungering"

[icy crater]

i apped to a guild before i transferred, only been on here for a couple weeks

[spice spire]

One rerolled to tank other is going hunter

[sleek sparrow]

the ones in my guild got either benched/rerolled/quit

[signal gulch]

we only got 8 buffs, pretty understandable to not know

[sleek sparrow]

now i finally hit the bench on sludgey

[strange python]

Limit has to make a video saying rogue is needed - then guilds will take us

[stoic needle]

nope we're still shit

[gusty mirage]

There's a lot of solid guilds on a52

[balmy condor]

MY DOOD we got cttc, legendary buffs, venthyr buffs, 3 aura buffs since 9.0.2, and like 3 hot fixes

[stoic needle]

rogue literally inting

[brittle pawn]

simulationcraft sims ranking

[torpid spoke]

@stoic needle where is that?

[gusty mirage]

I bet that sim profile isn't stacking mastery @stoic needle

[torpid spoke]

sim rankings?>

[brittle pawn]

quickly, go frost mage

[outer estuary]

wait what is thaz cursed graph

[stoic needle]

https://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/T26_Raid.html

[torpid spoke]

this is with buffs?

[gusty mirage]

yes

[balmy condor]

only slightly cursed because of implementation and stuff

[outer estuary]

enh this far up

[blazing arrow]

@outer estuary

[last cedar]

spriest strong on paper, never find pug strong

[outer estuary]

fuck this

[blazing arrow]

qq my man

[outer estuary]

shites cursed

oh no

not you

[gusty mirage]

omg maybe now my guild will recruit an enhancement shaman

[primal zinc]

what was the envenom bug?

[gusty mirage]

and I can get windfury

It didn't pandemic

[near lark]

Oxi

[gusty mirage]

it would just overwrite

[balmy condor]

it wasn't pandemcing, now it does

[near lark]

I already have one 😏😏😏😏

[primal zinc]

ty <#

[near lark]

BE JELLY

[gusty mirage]

@near lark

[primal zinc]

❤️

[gentle gyro]

more envenom uptime

[brittle pawn]

oh wow

[torpid spoke]

is it possible for

100% uptime?

[balmy condor]

no

[brittle pawn]

flag be THICC

[gusty mirage]

WE HAVE A STRONG COVENANT ABILITY NOW

[near lark]

ENHANCE BABY

[balmy condor]

not even close

[spice spire]

Also osh, you should hit up a recruitment discord. You’ll find a guild stupid quick

[gentle gyro]

na that's unrealistic

[gusty mirage]

PRAISE THE DEVS

until we get nerfed next week

😦

[spice spire]

To trial for at least

[torpid spoke]

what was uptime before and after buff?

[royal halo]

What's the raid legendary for sin now?

[gusty mirage]

dooooooom

[balmy condor]

78% and 90% after

[stoic needle]

there are recruitment discords?

[balmy condor]

pins

[stoic needle]

i thought i had to use wowprogress like a neanderthal

[blazing arrow]

@stoic needle just apply to all guilds you can think of on a52, illidan, zul'jin, tichondrius

[spice spire]

Yessir I’ll dm you

[torpid spoke]

thx @balmy condor you always answer my stupid question ❤️

[gusty mirage]

Now you can use the discord like a neanderthal

🙂

[balmy condor]

that's what I do

[blazing arrow]

Illidan is the top raiding server NA but this is really a topic for #wow-general

[stoic needle]

true

[icy crater]

hows sin as PI target with doom

[gusty mirage]

as a what target?

[brittle pawn]

a doomed PI target

[dire spoke]

xd

[gusty mirage]

sorry I thought I read PI and rogue in the same sentence

[wide ridge]

haha good one

[surreal torrent]

Don't fall for the DPET graph above too much. There's a difference between damage per execute and damage per execute time.

Convoke is a 4s channel. So comparing those in there is simply misleading

[mental wing]

Well Assa might be the strongest target now for patchwork fights, except or something like that

[brittle pawn]

so is flag ~1/4 the dmg?

[outer estuary]

@balmy condor how far off r those sims off reality

[mental wing]

except mages

[serene basin]

is there one for M+ grup?

groups*

[spice spire]

Plenty

I just know the recruitment one

Let me see if there’s one pinned here

[languid totem]

So, doom blade got triple buffed in that it now counts SBS dot, it went from 30%-45% and isn’t affected by armor anymore?

[timber pawn]

servers up?

[serene basin]

noup

[blazing arrow]

Servers are not up till later

[timber pawn]

waaaaccckkkkk

[tight ravine]

Nah they're gonna be slower today

[serene basin]

try again at 6pm

[blazing arrow]

4 est I think

[icy crater]

servers probably wont be up 4 hours early

[balmy condor]

exactly 3.620197%

[gusty mirage]

damn thats exact af

[wide prism]

Is Necrolord decent for Assass since SBS gets empowered by damage bonus from Doomblade and it gets affected by Mastery?

[somber hill]

@balmy condor what was teh envenom fix? the 30% poison application buff?

making it actually work?

[blazing arrow]

Pandemic

[outer sorrel]

do Skulker's Wing interact with Master Assassin?

[wide ridge]

pandemic

[gusty mirage]

it wasn't applying pandemic properly

[wide ridge]

was scuffed

[blazing arrow]

They fixed pandemic

[serene basin]

are you a computer? or just Spock in real life?

[icy crater]

envenom got covid

[gusty mirage]

it was overwriting the original envenom buff

[icy crater]

and it works now

[gusty mirage]

@icy crater is that why it's so potent now?!

[outer siren]

Not anymore.

[oblique flare]

man, can you NA guys get your server running already?

Me, EU Andy wants to see le flag memes

[somber hill]

interesting

[wide ridge]

how do you even break envenom pandemic

[icy crater]

get a vaccine

[blazing arrow]

It happens. Spaghetti code and whatnot

[gusty mirage]

@oblique flare I'm trying to beta test it for you guys and blizz won't let me

[oblique flare]

vaccines cause bad logs

[balmy condor]

nah he asked a stupid question, so he gets a stupid answer

[oblique flare]

and 5g causes corona ofc

[gusty mirage]

GOD DAMN

[timber pawn]

Is Flag like fully broken now?

[gusty mirage]

define fully broken

[oblique flare]

yes, if you go flag, you get R1

[gusty mirage]

because it was pretty ass before, now its good

[timber pawn]

head and shoulders better than NF

[icy crater]

like ER first week of expac?

[torpid spoke]

okay actually a quick question, do trinkets work with master assassin talent?

[balmy condor]

no

[wide ridge]

stop bringing attention tot he fact that flag is broken, let us have a good covenant ability for once

[gusty mirage]

@oblique flare I'd settle for duelist tbh

[normal mist]

no

oops

[torpid spoke]

no

[simple wadi]

@surreal torrent maybe i'm reading too deep into the data from the sims but how stable are the within simulation variance differences between things like covenants, legendaries?

[fiery cape]

hey folks... I've been running sub with a focus on pvp.. interested in pushing some m+ and also swapping to venthyr... is sin recommended for m+ these days?

[timber pawn]

I don't wanna re-roll cov's

keep Sepsis strong

[gusty mirage]

then don't

[steep gust]

would you guys upgrade zoldyck or doomblade to rank 4 first?

[blazing arrow]

@fiery cape no.

[gusty mirage]

sepsis is still strong

[celest drift]

do we have an ETA on the raidbots update? wanna sim before switching

[icy crater]

outlaw is better for m+

[wide ridge]

sepsis is not strong, niya is. change my mind

[torpid spoke]

sepsis is strong for pvp

[polar apex]

Niya's barbs are legit ridic

[timber pawn]

Outlaw well player in M+ is a tier

[primal zinc]

can some1 link me the doomblade changes from wowhead plz?

[torpid spoke]

that explosion + crit legendary = op

[fiery cape]

uhg... but but but... I only have daggers... 😫

[blazing arrow]

@steep gust if you're playing outlaw for cleave then go doomblade.

If you need a leggo for sire then go zoldyck.

[surreal torrent]

define stable and in what sims in particular?

[brittle pawn]

www.wowhead.com

[wide ridge]

[polar apex]

i delete other weapon types so i can never be asked to play outlaw

[fiery cape]

lol

[gusty mirage]

not wowhead but here: https://news.blizzard.com/en-us/world-of-warcraft/23639755/updated-march-8-9-0-5-update-notes#item7

[steep gust]

oh i thought celerity was best for outlaw tho?

[fiery cape]

I hvent played outlaw since early bfa days

[blazing arrow]

????

[cloud reef]

what this sim for?

[blazing arrow]

@steep gust if you play outlaw in cleave. Craft doomblade for sin

What

[simple wadi]

For example, variance for MA legendary sims is much smaller than DASHING* (you also see some similar things in outlaw sims for venthry 5 target theotoar + lash compared to other specs)

[timber pawn]

Slightly less shit

but still shit

[dire spoke]

fuck you hataro

[steep gust]

sorry im dumb

[blazing arrow]

@steep gust it's ok friend

[steep gust]

reading is complicated for me obviously....

[icy crater]

didn't ask for new.blizzard.com did I?

[blazing arrow]

@dire spoke why dont you try crafting sogon?

[gusty mirage]

I can't do ANYTHING right, I WISH I WAS NEVER BORN.

[outer sorrel]

i don't mean Mark of the Master Assassin, but Master Assassin, so is it worth to delay trinket and use it with vanish ?

[wide ridge]

sogon

[tight ravine]

You didn't end that sentence with a period oxi

[gusty mirage]

shit you right

[tight ravine]

Can't even have existential dread right

[icy crater]

should that not be an !

[near lark]

I had to work couldn't meme 😭

[tight ravine]

Xoxoxo jk I l u

[gusty mirage]

I'm going to go play in traffic

[distant furnace]

Hey, for Zoldyck better to choose leg or feet ?

[steep gust]

so i do plan on jumping between outlaw and sin... is it optimal to go venthyr or necro for both?

[blazing arrow]

Legs

[wide ridge]

legs

[gusty mirage]

RP some frogger

[simple igloo]

Do we want to reapply Bone Spike sometimes now?

[distant furnace]

thx

[surreal torrent]

right but what kind of answer are you expecting? variance is a statistical thing

[gusty mirage]

@simple igloo yes

cheap combo points

worth it imo

[outer estuary]

sin rogue in aoe is still cursed imo

[blazing arrow]

Uhh it's really up to you tbh

[gusty mirage]

cuz blizz won't fucking give us crimson tempest baseline

buncha trolls

[polar apex]

it is but it's fun to do 360's and bone spike people

[blazing arrow]

They're so close to one another and each have their respective strengths.

I'm staying fae anyway

[stoic needle]

Man I did torghast last night and had pb + ct at the same time

[toxic quail]

Buff poison bomb like in legion.

[stoic needle]

It was so glorious

[wide ridge]

imagine giving sub a baseline aoe finisher but not giving assa one.. cringe @blizzard

[brittle pawn]

nobody wants that rng shitfest

[simple wadi]

Whether those reflect real world differences in underlying mechanics (maybe doomblade is just more stochastic), ease/thoroughness of apl implementation, or maybe that variance isn't even stable and should be disregarded

[toxic quail]

The dmg was so much better. Are you crazy?!

[outer estuary]

i dont wanna maintain a million garottes

ree

[polar apex]

dmg is not gameplay

[gusty mirage]

It wasn't fun to play

[brittle pawn]

and if it didn't proc? have fun in the basement

[icy crater]

doing damage feels good though

[blazing arrow]

Seli made a good point about fae vs venthyr on his stream.

Venthyr will be punished harder for being off the boss than fae.

Sims are sims. How close they are in an actual raid is different

[gusty mirage]

Maybe doing damage doesn't though

[stoic needle]

Shiv rank 2: your next envenom on your shivved target procs poison bomb

[toxic quail]

You get CT baseline and legion poison bomb. It already does no dmg anyways.

[stoic needle]

Ez fix

[polar apex]

gross

[toxic quail]

Anything is better than it now.

[polar apex]

congratz you got 1 extra poison bomb every 20 seconds

[wide ridge]

just rework poison bomb

[solid vault]

legion poison bomb was a thing

now it's just

[somber hill]

Do we have a sim for assass doombladee w SBS vs flag, cus im wondering how the added bleed impacts it

[solid vault]

meeh

[stoic needle]

That's better than it being rng

[toxic quail]

I mean that is a good option. Rework that shit.

[lone crescent]

legion poison bomb + MA

[wide ridge]

reduce poison bomb dmg but make it always proc on 5cp envenoms or something

[brittle pawn]

not really since you're hitting shiv on cd, could come at a shit time same as rng

[surreal torrent]

well that is the point of sims. to remodel what the game does to give results. i feel like you're more or less asking "are sims reliable" to which i have to give the biased developer answer "generally yes", lol. in practice variances can matter for some cases and we might have bugs but i currently don't see any particular reason to worry

[wide ridge]

having it be rng sucks dongs

[polar apex]

It means nothing though, just getting crimson tempest baseline would be good and then tying it into venomous wounds

[stoic needle]

There is no shit time for poison bomb to proc. It's about making it controlled instead of rng

[gusty mirage]

Warms my heart knowing developers have their own "go-to" answers

[toxic quail]

I wouldn’t even be opposed to bomb being baseline and like how starfall is or was.

Just give us something.

[gusty mirage]

you'll take hidden blades and LIKE it

[solid vault]

i dont think they will change it

they're lazy

[torpid spoke]

crimson tempest baseline

[wide ridge]

you guys think we're getting new legendary effects on 9.1?

[torpid spoke]

IMO

[gusty mirage]

like when they copied and pasted alacrity into sin without allowing CT to refresh it?

[solid vault]

it's easyer to just "buff all abilities in x%"

[gusty mirage]

KEK

[blazing arrow]

@wide ridge probably not

[toxic quail]

The devs get to that row of talents and just check the yes box on their questionnaire and send it to Ion.

[torpid spoke]

i think we can equip multiple legendaries IMO

similar to Legion, we got to equip 2

[peak smelt]

how about 100%crit has no variance its 100% which makes the overall variance less?

[stoic needle]

It's more like the fact that there is no rogue dev so there's no one who actually cares about our class

[simple wadi]

Oh I think the sims are reliable - I'm just wondering how to interpret the relative width of the outcome distributions. For example, in some work I do on ion channels - variance in outcome measures usually reflect the leakiness of the channel (so you care about both the average conductance as well as the variance)

[blazing arrow]

I think their focus in 9.1 is the new conduit upgrades but who knows.

[wide ridge]

we got to equip 2 leggos on legion pretty late into the xpac, wasnt it? don't remember

[blazing arrow]

Only blizz knows at this point

[stoic needle]

I'd say we're gonna get new legendaries and a way to empower our current ones with more ash

50% increased effect or w/e

[simple wadi]

@surreal torrent but like I said I'm probably more interested in it intellectually than I am from a gameplay standpoint

[solid vault]

nops, before second raid/second raid

[wide ridge]

really? interesting

[blazing arrow]

They talked about an advancement of the conduit system. Allowing you to "empower conduits." Whatever that means we'll find out soon

Ptr for 9.1 should be in the next few weeks

[polar apex]

"empowered" conduits sounds like diablo 3 runes to me

[solid vault]

the game changer will be a new legendary/conduits

[gusty mirage]

can we empower maim maingle and poisoned katar to not be shit?

[plucky flume]

Inb4 Legendary conduits

[gusty mirage]

that'd be pretty cool

[stoic needle]

Empowered maim mangle adds shrouded suff

[gusty mirage]

YES

[surreal torrent]

i see. i don't think there's much to interpret into them right now. the only variance based decision i feel one could make is "if you want top parse, go outlaw and roll 5 buff due to higher possible max from variance" if that makes sense. otherwise always looks close and i guess it's fair to use means for general data

[gusty mirage]

PLS

[stoic needle]

Empowered poison Katar adds echoing blades

[gusty mirage]

BLIZZARD LISTEN TO THE CRAZY MAN

[wide ridge]

during SL Beta i think maim mangle had like 40% numbers on the lowest level, crazy shit

[blazing arrow]

I'm hoping. That it is a system that changes how the spells function.

And not "poisons do even MORE % increased damage."

[stoic needle]

Empowered zoldyck: envenom is now affected by the execute damage bonus

Honestly blizzard should just hire me

[odd flax]

Best leggo for raid prog?

[stoic needle]

This shit is so easy

[gusty mirage]

I just want shrouded suff back 😦

[wide ridge]

shrouded suffocation was so good

[burnt star]

rofl, "dps variance from the sim website" outlaw is the highest (no surprise) and assa is the lowest 😉

[simple wadi]

Appreciate the responses - that makes sense. I guess I might play with the APL to see if there are ways to fudge the variance to get some sense of where it comes from (outside of outlaw RTB). Thanks again.

[wide ridge]

opener was fire

[burnt star]

me likey

[torpid spoke]

in the sim link on https://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/T26_Raid.html.
how do you know what weapon buffs (oils / stones) they applied?

[gusty mirage]

it was so smooth too

[oblique flare]

https://tenor.com/view/finished-elijah-wood-lord-of-the-rings-lava-fire-gif-5894611

[wide ridge]

doomblade is currently simming highest dps on ST, but zoldyck's execute dmg is very good for prog

[brittle pawn]

let me try - empowered mark of the master assassin: instantly kill any target from stealth

[balmy condor]

the variance on the sims is just a measure of the minimums and maximums that was found during the simulation (due to the thousands of iterations that get run). So a spec like outlaw or frost, with a lot of inherent rng, will have a bigger spread just by nature of the spec. You sim 1000 iterations, you're bound to have one that sucks, and one that's crazy

[stoic needle]

Tbh I don't think it matters, the difference between all of the options is like 20 dps

[balmy condor]

it's not actually a variance in the simulation as in an "error", it's simply the spread that occurs naturally through playing the spec, or in this case simming it

[simple wadi]

Right - i understand what the variance reflects. I'm just interested on how/where variance differences arise from things that to me aren't super different in their inherent variability.

[surreal torrent]

a lot of variance in wow is natural because of all the rng elements. that starts with auto attack ranges, goes to the 5% variance on abilities, continues with things like crit chances and related stuff (Seal Fate) or Roll the Bones for outlaw.

[burnt star]

ya outlaw has too much variance and that what i hated from the spec in raid scenario

[balmy condor]

ah I see

[bold hearth]

If you look on the gear it shows what enchant, it's double weapons stone for the Sin one.

[worn path]

Does new flag apply a combo point?

[sand dirge]

why is my sin sample ability log telling me the sims used ambush after sepsis finished when we should actually ignore the 1 stealth ability after sepsis?

[simple wadi]

Absolutely (and again thanks for entertaining my questions) - I'm just intrigued about these variance differences in the edge cases where I expect lots of those variables to be consistent across comparisons. Again, an edge case that is probably only valuable for my interest.

[balmy condor]

sims still use ambush from sepsis because it hasn't been shown to be a gain/loss either way

me and koji have gone many rounds on it

(me arguing for ambush to not be used, koji arguing for it to be used)

[torpid spoke]

can you import a rotation into hekilli into sims or vise versa?

[sand dirge]

okay, was a bit confused. thanks for your answer.

[balmy condor]

what a cursed question

there are rotation helpers like herorotation which use the APL to begin with

[wide ridge]

sharpen weapon>shadow oil on ST now?

[brazen ferry]

Im about to finish Mythic Sludge and havent touched assassination so far this xpac. Considering that ill probably play outlaw in SLG, is it worth investing my soul ash in Doomblade or Zoldyck for M Denathrius?

[balmy condor]

but I'm not sure how you would get the rotation in or out of that

[torpid spoke]

interesting thanks

[balmy condor]

zoldyck on sire is huge

[surreal torrent]

it's usually hand-maintained

[balmy condor]

especially after the buffs, sin is most likely the strongest spec in execute

[surreal torrent]

APL parsers can technically be done but usually come with issues

[tribal marlin]

Oh we're not the best melee ST dps

we are beaten by .... enhancement

[gusty mirage]

THEY CAST SPELLS

disqualified

[balmy condor]

enhancement implementation is also kinda questionable from what I understand

the shaman APL's are still a little shambly from when their TC broke in pre-patch

[brazen ferry]

@balmy condor I guess ill just stay sub on farm and get Zoldyck for Sire then. Should be able to get at least rank 3 leggo by the time I start progression there

[wide ridge]

which means they are gonna exist now, and we can get windfury

[brittle pawn]

it's not a huge loss to use r2 instead of saving for r4

probably less dps loss than playing sub

[normal mist]

Quick question about covenent swapping: does clearing the dungeons gives %?

[pulsar sluice]

If we get windfury wouldn't that make us numbah one

[normal mist]

For rejoining ofc

[balmy condor]

Sims are run with full buff I’m pretty sure, so wind fury is already included

[rocky ruin]

@normal mist you get renown for pretty much everything, but not always

[normal mist]

I'm not talking about renown

I am a venthyr OG that then joined the NF, and want to go back to Venthyr

:P

[sand dirge]

@balmy condor but will i always line the last sepsis tick with vanish, vendetta, shiv?

[strange python]

It’s okay - we don’t have to worry about enhance they have a ranged spec

[tribal marlin]

Well if their sims are accurate and not tigh to incorrectly implemented spells

they are really pupming xD

[wide ridge]

na servers back in 3hours right

[strange python]

Nobody plays enhance anyway

[vestal wren]

apl's cross class/specs can vary in quality

[drifting imp]

thx for your hard work @balmy condor

[vestal wren]

also tc's of diffrent classes often have diffrent aims

[stoic needle]

personally i prefer sharpening stones and agi pots because phantom fire has really high variance

[vestal wren]

e.g. its possible that one class cares about optimizing for multiple targets, whle a other one does not

or not popular talents

[tribal marlin]

I don't see how an apl bug could make theim oversim. If they oversim it must be related to simc core implementation no ?

like the Envenom bug

[tight ravine]

Whysper is great

[wide ridge]

when we were progging M kael my phantom fire pot wouldn't proc ever on his 6s shield

i ditched that shit

[vestal wren]

thats rarely the case

[stoic needle]

yeah man like i had it do 20k on one boss and then 5k on another

no thx

[vestal wren]

i think what you talk about is the apl playing unrealistic

[onyx wind]

Phantom fire? more like phuck outta my binds

[tribal marlin]

oh ok I see

[wide ridge]

I like some consistency myself

[vestal wren]

but we don't make the apl unreasonable

whats humanly possible is def. also relevant

[blazing arrow]

???

[onyx wind]

The meaning of theorycrafting is making an argument for PI

B)

[wide ridge]

do your guilds have drama over PI too?

[onyx wind]

Nah we have two PI's, one is spriest and one is going to our arcane mage

[blazing arrow]

Oh I see you were responding to Osho

I still use phantom fire + sharp cause it sims better for me

[wide ridge]

imagine playing a dps spec and having your dps cooldown be used on someone else

must feel like shit

[brittle pawn]

arcane mage

[wide ridge]

[onyx wind]

Phantom fire did banger dmg in sims compared to on my logs

maybe im just the unluckiest person in the world tho

But it did noticeably less dmg on avg

[blazing arrow]

I'm not risking my parses to test it

[brittle pawn]

i generally get 30-45k per use

[wide ridge]

wtf that's a lot

[brittle pawn]

closer to the 30k side

[onyx wind]

jesus man

[wide ridge]

I get 20k on a good day

[onyx wind]

i got like 10k-15k

wait lemme see if i have any logs from then

[brittle pawn]

im looking now, too

[onyx wind]

i used phantom fire in r1 log

it did 13k

XD

[blazing arrow]

What fight?

[wide ridge]

sludge

[onyx wind]

sub 5 min shriek

[stoic needle]

yeah fuck that

agi pots all day

[onyx wind]

agree

but some fuck just made them triple in price

should go all GME on them

[wide ridge]

sucks that widowbloom price is high because navigating in revendreth sucks big dick

[limber lion]

Good thing I bought 200 a few days ago

[onyx wind]

I started potting in m+ :(

[blazing arrow]

The r1 sub log is chinese

[stoic needle]

theres a spot in revendreth where they hyperspawn

[stoic needle]

imagine not

[blazing arrow]

Are you Chinese?