gray fjord
I even made the assassination leggo video today
#assassination
balmy condor
yuh
stoic needle
just in time before reset 😰 I really hate torghast sometimes
i'm going full hail mary, hoping they buff sin and the legendaries too
if they don't change the legendaries i'll get zoldyck though probably
grim mason
What trinket is everyone using
balmy condor
quantum device
knotty bear
some combination of these
stoic needle
decanter and pvp badge because that's all I've been able to get
balmy condor
shadowgrasp also good
grim mason
totem one?
balmy condor
yes
sonic yacht
!fuu
prisma monolithBOT
Fuus Shadowlands evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/uxr1tz
grim mason
full mist run no loot feelbadman
trail thunder
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery
worthy slate
balmy condor
all our covenants are good
or all are bad
depending on who you ask
the point is, the difference in damage isn't that big
supple compass
jesus spectral agi pots nearly 1k each on my server
@balmy condor what say you, do you pot heroic?
balmy condor
depends on your guild tbh
supple compass
what do you do personally
supple compass
ok, so not like the entire night, only when a kill is close?
balmy condor
yeah
food/pots aren't going to get you a kill if your raid still can't move from the bad right
supple compass
alright thats a bit more stomachable
are you balling out on agi or just fire
is it normal that the agi one is so much more expensive
bfa was the opposite
stoic needle
Why not use bfa pots?
fallow otter
Because they are worse
Bfa feast seems worth atm though
Keep quiet though
No nerf plz bliz
delicate trench
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
calm dome
@balmy condor I can see only the Kyrian nerf ... nothing related to the spec , right ?
balmy condor
its also only in pvp 
grim mason
lol
calm dome
... but we can hope and see some changes like you said after the week ?
calm dome
Thanks a lot
balmy condor
np
grim mason
I think I got all the rogue legos in one day, after I was telling a friend how this was my 3rd 60 and havent seen a lego
calm dome
I am hoping to get full haste gear in Mythic + during the week and be ready and strong enough for the raid friday night
grim mason
next day boom everything I looted gave me a lego
calm dome
aiming the 30% haste
calm dome
?
strange python
... but we can hope and see some changes like you said after the week ?
Focus on the word hope. Many classes/specs are expecting buffs, but not all are going to get them.
calm dome
You got a good point . As a SIN since the begining, now the only thing left for us is HOPE
real bay
issue is more likely getting buffed enough than not getting buffed at all. blizz isn't blind to how a spec is performing
a smaller buff would do if they nerf the top performers
fossil slate
Whispyr I can feel it in my bones, the buff is coming 
balmy condor
can you? 
fleet whale
shiv initial damage buffed by 150% (assassination only)
tiny toxic blade leggo now meta
fossil slate
can you? <:gachi:674609135781806106>
I can!
balmy condor
fleet whale
would a 150% initial shiv damage buff
even make TTB viable
this is just one article that shows how few sin players there are
if just using these numbers, sin is currently 2nd to last in terms of overall players
(at level 60)
(and only looking at dps specs)
rugged horizon
I'm seeing third with survival and demonology having less
fleet whale
nah i did the math, demo just barely overtakes sin
demo players that have chosen a covenant: 14727
Assassin players: 14245
outer lodge
warm olive
can i destroy double conduits or is something useful upcoming for that?
drifting imp
Such a 
feeling beeing sin rn
balmy condor
can i destroy double conduits or is something useful upcoming for that?
you can destroy
warm olive
ok thx
stark crescent
Dont worry sub wil get a nerf next week
old snow
sure, but what about assa buff😢
hazy iron
drifting imp
Thx for this discord, it feels good knowing I'm not the only person that loves sin 
balmy condor
stable urchin
Sin forever!
dense cedar
Sin was the most played rogue spec for 2 expansion in a row
I'd assume people liked it
vestal wren
sin was the best tuned spec for rogue for 2 xpacs too
vestal wren
so it was less a question about liking/disliking the spec but it was about it just being the best rogue spec for raiding for 2 xpacs (or 4 years)
vocal cloud
feel like pure shit just want sin back
drifting cloud
real bay
yeah m+ definitely needs some more focus
low girder
M+ needs mechanical changes of some sort, or at least SL systems stuff to support it
ST/raid yeah i agree
just numbers
stoic needle
So why don't we like dashing scoundrel again? It sims really well and the extra energy seems amazing
low girder
it's good but it's really close to zoldyck which is better in things that aren't pure ST
balmy condor
cause its garbage in aoe
like it drops hard in aoe
if you don't need the energy from dashing, cause you're rupture sniping, or multi-dotting for extended periods of time
dashing becomes kinda tragic
dense cedar
So Whispyr
low girder
think akaari vs finality
dense cedar
Did you find out how long execute has to be?
balmy condor
no XD
dense cedar
alas
balmy condor
I'm not actually looking into that, I have more important sims to do
dense cedar
Smh
stoic needle
Ah yeah spamming fok hoping for deadly poison procs doesn't sound super nice for aoe lol
pearl canyon
try to put 1 envenom here and there to increase the proc chance drastically
echo cargo
playing sub is so fucking depressing
pearl canyon
its just an opinion of a dude who has not played the spec for like 6 years, no offense
pearl canyon
playing sub is so fucking depressing
si
echo cargo
prayers for some Sin tuning because Sub still feels like the most arrhythmic shit ever
strange python
M+ needs mechanical changes of some sort, or at least SL systems stuff to suppor...
Any idea how the other DoT -specs are doing in m+?
restive spire
does anyone in here know if master assassin is better on wrists or ring
balmy condor
aff seems okay
strange python
It could be a general problem with DoT:s that m+ is shitty.
balmy condor
does anyone in here know if master assassin is better on wrists or ring
ring, but big disclaimer tho
pearl canyon
it requires high hp mobs which isnt the case for m0s
strange python
(since they need time to tick & m+ is played vs the timer)
balmy condor
Mystler12/02/2020
There is no definitive answer to what slot is best. Depends on what you have, where it's bigger upgrade, and if you're thinking long or short term. Even then those two slots are close. Wrist can be a main stat boost, ring allows tailoring secondaries.
pearl canyon
yet dots tick whether u can hit the target or not
spare nimbus
How does master assassin stack up against subterfuge in dungeons? I've been using subterfuge, but the multi garroting feels weird when you throw going back and applying bone spike into the mix after the subterfuge window ends.
balmy condor
subterfuge stomps
pearl canyon
Whispyr have u tried a lot of m0s with assa in sl? how is your overall dps? approximately
sorry for asking such strange questions i just want to be set with the spec =/ whether it is at least semi viable(if any more experienced players can make it work) or not
pearl canyon
why?
balmy condor
why it'll help or why I won't play it
pearl canyon
why wont u play it i mean
balmy condor
because unless they target specific things, which is super unlikely
sin ain't catching up
prime stirrup
too much effort to do less dmg than the other specs.
balmy condor
like 15% aura buff, is about the dream buff we're looking at atm
would put us only slightly under sub in ST
ahead in cleave
like that's the D R E A M
and we'd still be 15% behind in aoe
pearl canyon
so i guess if i need to decide which spec to play in order to be able to boost some 15s i need to stick with outlaw =/
super duper sad
low girder
xd
prime stirrup
LOL
pearl canyon
XD
low girder
outlaw is def the one i would look at if you're primarily doing keys
unless you hate it
sub is still fine
pearl canyon
i hate sub more
balmy condor
sub is similar to how sin was in 8.3
if you know how that m+ meta played out
basically take the m+ meta of 8.3, switch sub and sin
and then make sin even worse
that's what we're looking at
pearl canyon
thanks for the info, really appreciated
spare nimbus
Anyone have any tips as far as tab targeting goes? I feel like I can't predict it with any accuracy anymore and it makes multi dotting a pain.
balmy condor
seems fine for me
restive spire
same
pearl canyon
tab is the next one you haven't targeted alraedy
balmy condor
tab targeting works in a very small PoV in front of you as well usually
restive spire
it prioritizes closer stuff first as well im pretty sure
balmy condor
yeah
spare nimbus
Got it. Thank you everyone
opaque tree
Kyrian> Nightfae I'm seeing. This is current, at least with what testing we have?
I really really hate how that covenant ability feels, so clunky
balmy condor
more like Kyrian ~= Nightfae ~= Necrolord >= Venthyr
opaque tree
okay so, going with Nightfae is plenty viable
balmy condor
its actually what a majority do, yeah
opaque tree
okay, that is good to know... makes me a bit happier in all this assassination sadness
thanks
balmy condor
popularity wise you see nightfae well ahead of kyrian, well ahead of necro, and then a couple odd venthyrs
opaque tree
Venthys does seem kind of fun I guess, but I dunno
also not sure how far behind it is, but nightfae looked the most promising
opaque tree
haha
low girder
venthyr will be totally fine as of tomorrow IMO
kinda rough when things die in 8s
maybe more people will come around on it then
strange python
venthyr will be totally fine as of tomorrow IMO
Is venthyr getting a buff? 😮
low girder
nah, just you need a bunch of finishers to make it good
and you can't do that in a m0 environment
so you get like 5 stacks and your target's dead
unless it's a boss
strange python
Ok thanks ^__^ so it's a shift in the environment that makes V more playabl.e
low girder
yeah. like i'm not under the illusion it'll be bis suddenly but it probably won't feel so shit anymore. it'll prolly be pretty good
granted, i'm fae so
¯_(ツ)_/¯
verbal mantle
yes
plain thistle
arctic cove
'
real bay
not good son
plain thistle
urban thistle
@balmy condor Looks like this quest also is having energy issues
uncut schooner
woeful wigeon
now i got lost
they say zoldic and dasching scouundrel are b i s
why doomblade beating them up ?
serene basin
zoldick is good on a long execute phase
dashing and doomblade are better at ST
with a ''shorter'' fight
inner lagoon
are a lot of you sticking it out with Sin for now? or playing sub/outlaw for now
rich yew
Tried to play sin, tried harder to like it. But currently I'm sticking to sub/outlaw. For now playing sub feels fresh, maybe after tuning or with different gear sin feels better later on 🙂
inner lagoon
i have 3 memories to choose from Clerity/Doomblade/Master assassin i may do master assasin as i can use for all... i donno gotta choose
rich yew
😄
dusk lodge
!fuu
rich yew
crafted MA myself, must say it makes wq's alot of fun. Just dashing around one banging everything with MFD bursts
Two-banging actually
inner lagoon
yeah i thought baout that honestly
serene basin
hopefully we can get zoldick after reset
sick scarab
y
lofty pecan
🙏 we can only hope now
static badger
Guys
strange python
there is some pretty nice mythics gear with high haste, I want to give a shot mixed with raid gear and see what happens with vent haste stacks
bracing for failure
sub/outlaw is still feelin pretty fresh tho, no biggy if we have to wait longer
inner lagoon
is this weeks Torghast the one with the Zoldick?\
real bay
it is on 3 week cycle so yes it should be
inner lagoon
oh ok i may hold off crafting me legendary when i log in then
and wait to see if i can get it on floor 3 today
spice spire
Don’t forget floors 4-6 also unlock today
inner lagoon
oh yeah that is true too, !
do you think there is a chance we get cut to the chase back? or kingsbane brought back or something?
verbal sparrow
oh my god i just switched to assa to try it out since pre patch and that energy regen gave me a stroke
inner lagoon
yeah even with Vigor/SnD/venemous wounds its sad
verbal sparrow
im kinda sad because assa was my fav spec all the time
inner lagoon
i am still gonna run it i also chose necrolord so im a legit meme
verbal sparrow
its even hard to stack venthyr buff, like legit and even when you somehow pop 30 stacks, that regen is still so bad
normal olive
Do you guys know if we have to start from layer 1 or do we get to jump into layer 4 instanty?
normal olive
hopefully
inner lagoon
cuz that is how it was for this week vs last week
verbal sparrow
i think you have to just go 4 (4-5-6 + 6)1-2-3 will be already unlocked
inner lagoon
i wonder how bad 4 will be lol
willow osprey
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
strange python
i'm wondering how the energy regen will feel with like 600 haste
- the vent buffs
i just remembered how much i hated the energy regen too haha
woeful wigeon
isnt it haste versa crit mastery for sin rogue cause even the sim says to go verssa before cirt ?
azure gate
does exang interact with bonespike?
blazing swift
nope i tried it
azure gate
sadge
plain onyx
Guys, any specific options i should setup on Raidbots to sim my character for mythic dungeons?
spice spire
Probably just dungeon slice?
plain onyx
dungeon slice, alright got it. thanks
fervent scroll
!bis
plain onyx
is it Dungeon slice or Hectic add cleave ?
spice spire
Both can work. Every situation is different so both are fine interpreters as nothing will get it to an exact science
ornate dawn
!bis
prisma monolithBOT
Whispyrs Bis list: http://tiny.cc/76r5tz
grim mason
So if you missed out on capping ash and Torghast the past 2 resets you are just behind now?
versed palm
i believe so - haven't seen or heard of any way of catching up to anyone who maxed it the first two weeks
i capped this past week but couldn't dedicate the time during week 1, so i'm in that same boat
strange python
same
spice spire
You’re not super duper behind unless you did sub 50% both week, if you could make a legendary last week or come within 210 of it, you’ll be on par with everyone this week.
Since it’s 2k to get a rank 2. And you can get 960 this week thanks to the new floors opening iirc
grim mason
bahaha I like these system
Legion tower was the best
I spent hours in that place on multiple toons
and all it gave me was a skin, imagine tha t
balmy condor
I cleared sin and sub on the first day, and then there was no replay system or harder difficulty for the tower
So I just sat there for like 3 weeks, watching my guildies do the fights
grim mason
after the intro to the tower I had no interest
lol i did a few, but not interesting enough, ash didnt even motivate me lol
balmy condor
Lmao no
echo gust
damn
balmy condor
Because I prefer playing with my garbage can friends and having fun rather than pushing raids
velvet terrace
💛
balmy condor
I’m mostly an m+ andy, but even then I’m not really too giga
I was like 3300io in nyalotha
5/12 mythic
I’m really not a giga gamer
echo gust
i dislike the must be 20 to mythic lockout style
and guilds fall apart if they dont have 20 raiders
shrewd pivot
its up to us!
to live forever and be the last rogue alive
i'm going to need to test if kidney shot talent procs on raid bosses
the bleed, not the stun
balmy condor
Nope
shrewd pivot
orly
balmy condor
Bleed only exists if you stun
shrewd pivot
whackkk
no wonder why sin rogues are suffering kinda
that would put em up like 1000
balmy condor
Definitely not
grim mason
surely not because of KS 🙂
shrewd pivot
that's a whole finisher not utilized
balmy condor
Internal bleeding isn’t really that strong
shrewd pivot
and mostly free damage + ticks
balmy condor
Well that’s the thing
balmy condor
What
grim mason
wait huh
balmy condor
Are you high
grim mason
u dont use garroe in riads?
calm dome
Garrote is the base of your gameplay
balmy condor
Run that by me one more time
shrewd pivot
well it scales from top to bottom
balmy condor
Give me a reason to not delete that
shrewd pivot
sin doing good? if KS applied sin would be doing the best.
its probably not for raid bosses
gotta talent swap
grim mason
o.0
balmy condor
Even the feelycraft is wrong my dude
grim mason
someone make it stop
shrewd pivot
#hope numbers lmao
balmy condor
Let’s say that idk, internal bleeding, even if it is incredibly strong
vocal cloud
what is going ON
balmy condor
Let’s say it’s 500 dps
balmy condor
That would make it your #1 damage source
balmy condor
then exsanguinate would be meta
You’ve said enough dumb shit please let me explain first hold on
vocal cloud
i cant believe outlaw's messing with us
balmy condor
If it did 500 dps, it would be your #1 damage source
But even then right
Youre using those combo points for kidney
When you could’ve used it on an envenom
shrewd pivot
i could get by snapshotting rupture
balmy condor
So the gain is actually less than that
shrewd pivot
as long as i dont lose out on bleed ticks
stoic needle
shrewd pivot
then i can use exsanguinate for more dots
grim mason
I am sure he is trolling
shrewd pivot
vendetta man
stoic needle
You had me until the snapshotting rupture
shrewd pivot
assassination must be strong as fuck then wtf
stoic needle
For a while I thought you were just some savant assassination player making up new strats
shrewd pivot
how people simming so low
i am literally an adult savant level player bro
like na #1
balmy condor
@shrewd pivot it’s at this point I remind you that intentionally spreading misinformation and trolling is against the rules :)
echo gust
outlaw is bumping with sub apparently with some aoe fights
stoic needle
velvet terrace
A true veteran pogU
balmy condor
Thanks jerry :)
We find that sub is enough of a mess right now
We don’t need the same trolling and random misinformation in this channel
shrewd pivot
well, my opinion is that sin rogue can be #2 once people figure out bleed mechanics
balmy condor
And I for one don’t take too kindly to it
That opinion is wrong
And I’m willing to explain to you why
shrewd pivot
ok
balmy condor
But every time I talk to explain to you
stoic needle
If you were able to use 2 legendaries, would you run zoldyck and doomblade?
balmy condor
You come up with another wild accusation with no basis in reality
balmy condor
If you were able to use 2 legendaries, would you run zoldyck and doomblade?
No testing has been done for that
stoic needle
Garotte, rupture and mut bleed is 15% extra damage on envenom... That's 5% more than symbols of death's damage bonus 🤔
balmy condor
So idk
stoic needle
Yeah I know I'm just thinking about the future
Do you plan to craft multiple legendaries for ST or cleave, or just pump zoldyck up to r4 ASAP?
balmy condor
Uh, right now I don’t plan on crafting zoldyck at all
stoic needle
balmy condor
I’m not crafting until end of this week
stoic needle
Okay, in a few weeks post tuning when sin is okay what would you do
shrewd pivot
ok well
stoic needle
I'm thinking about a long term plan
Crafting zoldyck is a given
But after, do you pump it to r4, or do you get other legendaries to improve your performance for other situations
spice spire
Impossible to think long term on incomplete information or no information. Long term would come after tuning week I think
shrewd pivot
long term would be like a skill change honestly
balmy condor
Pump to 4
indigo tusk
Im alone assa on SL 
?
balmy condor
For sure
If the only difference is sin is viable
Like let’s say everything stays the same
But all the specs get nerfed to sin
Then I think r4 zoldyck is the play
stoic needle
gotcha. don't mind me, i'll just be over here in the corner desperately wishing for doomblade to be good
blazing swift
For dungeon aoe assass is suppose to be garroting like 4 targets with subterfuge then spreading ruptures right?
shrewd pivot
😕
blazing swift
then the 1 normal garrote though right?
stable vector
Is there some rally simpel assasination guides?
balmy condor
You can, I guess
stable vector
really
balmy condor
!guides
prisma monolithBOT
balmy condor
All these are good
shrewd pivot
blind is better for solo queue.
verbal mantle
balmy condor
Pvp guides don’t really exist yet
stable vector
hmm ok
blazing swift
you use leeching poison and hidden blades in araena?
balmy condor
you use leeching poison and hidden blades in araena?
No
storm forum
usually use elusiveness in arena over leeching
balmy condor
Elusiveness/PB for sure I would think
balmy condor
Yeah I’ve resorted to just ignoring what he says
storm forum
exange in pvp? is that real?
bitter aurora
that might be for rbgs?
balmy condor
Exsang isn’t good either unless there’s some weird meta I’m unaware of
bitter aurora
it is birsttier than aalacrity
blazing swift
then you're just using that energy to reapply them
shrewd pivot
i like the burst
bitter aurora
whats your cr normaally
blazing swift
storm forum
time traveler?
balmy condor
It’s the 8.3 sin rogues that played one patch of exsang at 230% haste
And now think that sin is some crazy snapshot spec
balmy condor
You’re telling me vers snapshots?
storm forum
doesn't exsang only snapshot haste values?
shrewd pivot
yeah bet it's additive
shrewd pivot
i can't tell you what i'm studying without the game open
i think damage formula type too
balmy condor
Damage formulas are multiplicative
storm forum
is there an authority we can report this dude to?
shrewd pivot
but vers is added when?
balmy condor
What does that even mean
shrewd pivot
you have a fixed percentage that adds itself as a fixed number
balmy condor
is there an authority we can report this dude to?
I’m the authority now lmao
storm forum
vers is a stat, it's not fixed, it changed based on gear and buffs
oh you have a green name now, grats
is that a thing I should be grats'ing?
balmy condor
Why does the order matter
grim mason
Wait wut....bro can we give this guys a time out
balmy condor
is that a thing I should be grats'ing?
Yeah I got a lot of grats :P thank you
shrewd pivot
fuck. ill theory craft with those dudes
verbal mantle
shrewd pivot
i think vers takes final damage formula and adds itself as a final buff
its like +3% or something more total damage per hit
storm forum
+3% means *1.03
balmy condor
^
shrewd pivot
but i don't think in ratios
balmy condor
Hold me back
shrewd pivot
which adds up to a lot of fixed damage.
shrewd pivot
snapshotting is a mechanic with vendetta i need to test out
left relic
Maybe he works for blizzard
balmy condor
Vendetta doesn’t Snapshot
verbal mantle
soothe Whispyr rn 
spice spire
^
shrewd pivot
you can press exsanguinate after vendetta and it gives like a million energy + damage
balmy condor
That’s not what snapshotting is
storm forum
I've got numbing poison on and my Shiv comes off CD in 2 sec
shrewd pivot
its supposed to apply damage formula after you press the button
balmy condor
It does
grim mason
lmao
blazing swift
this is hilarious LOL
shrewd pivot
im bfa meta as fuck
storm forum
"im bfa meta as fuck"
shrewd pivot
do you want my rotation
craggy wave
yeah
shrewd pivot
i need the game open for actual numbers
balmy condor
I wouldn’t suggest it
shrewd pivot
but i'm not min maxing
grim mason
Servers are down andhe is bored, trolling 🙂
shrewd pivot
i can probably derive each damage formula into stat priorities
like your bfa meta daddy
blazing swift
i swear he's trolling
placid dawn
maybe he was in hist firs math class at uni this week
storm forum
he's trying to be raidbots
shrewd pivot
well i just need rogue numbers
lean marten
dots auto update dmg based on ur current buffs/stats, only thing that "snapshots" is exsang haste
shrewd pivot
sim is for pre-determined rotations
they do the same thing but its en masse
thats why they're popular
i can sim based on my own math.
balmy condor
!warn @shrewd pivot please do not spread misinformation and blatant trolls after being told to stop.
storm forum
but... why?
shrewd pivot
i'm a raid leader.
lean marten
my god
shrewd pivot
its necessary if this expac raid has enrage mechanics.
verbal mantle
blazing swift
he's a raid leader guys
lean marten
i bet your raids have a lot of issues with dps checks huh. NOBODY USE CDS WE GOT A MECHANIC COMIN UP
shrewd pivot
im meta scientist asf
placid dawn
excellent troll man, giving me a good laugh
shrewd pivot
wheres your calculations then
storm forum
if you're a raid leader, your time is valuable. You should be doing things other than napkin math emulating a well respected simbot
shrewd pivot
show me ur work breh
my napkin math will make me the na #1 assassination rogue
bet on it
verbal mantle
I think you should stop here man :/
shrewd pivot
no man hold me back bro!!
lean marten
shrewd night
@shrewd pivot Do we have a problem?
shrewd pivot
jk
grim mason
so wait this guy beenhere for over an hour saying all this nonsense, I go to #offtopic and post lf Leather grp and get insta warned!
blazing swift
RIP Jerry
plain onyx
where do i get popcorn here ?
shrewd pivot
honestly i have assassination rogue down to a science.
shrewd night
This is no the place for trolling or "haha jk". Put that in offtopic. Dont make me come here again.
grim mason
o.0
shrewd pivot
everyone reading is like assassination 2deep4me
balmy condor
We just want a channel that isn’t as messy as sub
shrewd pivot
sub is a volatile spec in nature
shrewd pivot
once people know how to play sin they'll probably jump ship lmao
pearl canyon
what overall dps is considered great in shadowlands in dungeons? according to beta
if someone knows
placid dawn
its hard to say
placid dawn
depens if tank pulls big or not
pearl canyon
got it
placid dawn
if the tank pulls mobs 1 by 1 than you ll do super low damage
main forge
Are you talking M+, M0? or just grinding it out?
pearl canyon
M+s on beta, i know its not a standard and something could have changed but still
main forge
We about to find out today... but yeah pushing 4k and above is probably a good goal to set. Although I don't think Ass rogues are going to pull that easily.
shrewd pivot
dependent on tuning today
balmy condor
Yeah sin probably gonna struggle getting to 4k
There’s not gonna be much tuning today sadly
Hotfixes maybe for bugs
main forge
I hit 4k spikes on ST fights, but it don't last long.
balmy condor
But you won’t see spec tuning until later in the week
pearl canyon
i bet they wont fix crimson tempest not proccing alacrity
main forge
I bet they won't touch assassination until 9.3
pearl canyon
nerf it
storm forum
sin rogue has pretty good sustained AoE/multitarget with CT, but their burst is pretty 😦 so it'll depend on how long the packs last too
balmy condor
The aoe ISNT good though
pearl canyon
yeah at least with the current numbers
shrewd pivot
assassination is high liability cause of scaling due to legendary
balmy condor
The only thing you can argue is maybe acceptable on sin is 2-3 target
shrewd pivot
my bet on exsanguinate + maybe ur CT playstyle.
balmy condor
assassination is high liability cause of scaling due to legendary
That’s not how it works
Exsanguinate is also really bad in pve
shrewd night
shrewd pivot
its good for energy management.
shrewd night
wat
balmy condor
That doesn’t make it a good talent
main forge
our talent choices aren't exactly talent choices. that's not good
pearl canyon
do u guys even use crimson tempest or just stick to poison bomb in dungeons
small isle
Do we bother with slice n dice in aoe rotations
shrewd pivot
crimson tempest is probably meta
pearl canyon
until 5+ targets afaik
shrewd pivot
if you take exsanguinate lmao
balmy condor
Do we bother with slice n dice in aoe rotations
Yes, until 5
balmy condor
if you take exsanguinate lmao
Exsang is not meta, don’t use it
main forge
Exsang gives you a bunch of energy so you can rupture more
balmy condor
Kabrai why would you feed him
main forge
or cast SnD
shrewd pivot
yes!
ember mural
small isle
Thanks
main forge
I do not.
sinful island
what seccondary missive should I use in my legendary?
shrewd pivot
i need to calculate each bleed tick energy refund
storm forum
I like CT in dungeons (but recently I'm just playing sub in dungeons cause nothing lives long enough for a full rupture), in prepatch I was maintaining CT bleed on 2 or more targets, but IDK if that was right
main forge
Rupture/SnD need buffs. Bad. Like we have 2 finishing moves that do pretty much nothing. They are just static +dps buffs.
spice spire
what seccondary missive should I use in my legendary?
For assassination, it’s vers and haste right now
balmy condor
I like CT in dungeons (but recently I'm just playing sub in dungeons cause nothi...
Yep, on 2
Snd is also fine, I can agree that rupture is maybe a little weak
sinful island
how is vers better than mastery for example? especially with Zoldyck isn't it any kind of good synergy?
balmy condor
No it won’t
Mastery is our worst stat
And the bis gear reflects that by avoiding t
main forge
Which is why we naturally have a ton of mastery
stable urchin
hey, hows look sin in raid ?
shrewd night
sudden canyon
amazing
main forge
We are above the tanks... sometimes.
sudden canyon
re-roll
balmy condor
A large portion of our damage isn’t affected by mastery, auto attacks being one of them
So vers will give you more overall damage
storm forum
hey, hows look sin in raid ?
so bad we're expecting sin rogue buffs
main forge
Hoping, and Praying.
stable urchin
so bad we're expecting sin rogue buffs
I hope they will buff , sin is amazing spec ❤️
balmy condor
@shrewd night
storm forum
I don't mind the only press a button every second or third gcd (I played and enjoyed sin in legion when we hated haste) but it feels bad to do all that pooling and be 15% behind sub
shrewd night
balmy condor
main forge
r/wow had a thread about state of the game... and the rogue portion was interesting... many people are enjoying SnD being back...
blazing swift
Jerry has been assassinated
main forge
Our buffs will be... 25% Crimson Vial and 15% leeching poison(in pve)
shrewd night
@uncut schooner 
uncut schooner
balmy condor
No that’s the right tag
uncut schooner
@balmy condor I need emotional comforting.
balmy condor
Oof
shrewd night
How 
uncut schooner
57 sign-ups 😦
balmy condor
He plays rogue
main forge
Rouge is overpowdered pleas nerf
storm forum
r/wow had a thread about state of the game... and the rogue portion was interest...
I like SnD with sub's premed, and it makes sense/feels okay to apply rupture/SnD between Shadow Dance windows. But sin has always had a sorta consistent rhythm to it that feels displaced with SnD, especially with lower haste. I played with SnD all through prepatch and I got used to it, but it was just something boring that I could do without. Now with like 10% haste it just feels awful to apply/reapply it over a rupture or envenom.
balmy condor
Rogue is melee pls fix
shrewd night
f i f t y s e v e n 
uncut schooner
Yeah, there's two raids running. Can't make the second one sadly, so I'm pugging this first week.
small isle
Prob 2 tanks 7 healers and 48 dps
fleet whale
even if you don't press SnD that much as sin throughout a fight
balmy condor
Prob 2 tanks 7 healers and 48 dps
Classic talk belongs in #classic-discussion
main forge
I like SnD with sub's premed, and it makes sense/feels okay to apply rupture/SnD...
It wasn't so bad in Wrath when SnD was refreshed when you envenomed.
fleet whale
it still fucks with the rhythm imo
main forge
yeah there isn't a flow
small isle
What classic talk?
balmy condor
It’s a joke lmao
small isle
Oh over my head
main forge
nor is there like an extra proc or ability that SnD or Rupture give that changes our rotation
balmy condor
Classic raid comps are hella wild
Like 5 tanks and 12 healers
And all sorts of crazy shit
uncut schooner
That sounds complicated.
spice spire
Four horseman fight 😡😡
storm forum
man if there was a talent to add 10 seconds of SnD every time we used envenom I would be over the moon
uncut schooner
My smol brain isn't built for that kind of processing.
balmy condor
World first kelthuzad had 12 healers I think
main forge
Exactly. Something that rewarded good rotation playing
main forge
Nah... its just like "HERE LET ME STEAL YOUR COMBO POINTS SO YOU DON"T SEE BIG NUMBERS"
balmy condor
I would argue baking snd into envenom is actually the opposite of rewarding good gameplay
pearl canyon
agreed ^
balmy condor
It’s trivializing a choice of finisher
main forge
Having one or two of our talent rows give bonuses to rupture and snd would be interesting... each one having its own pros and cons.
storm forum
maybe baking it into ambush makes more sense then, idk, I just want something like sub's premed to make refreshing SnD feel like less of a chore
fleet whale
SnD was never a big part of sin so idk why blizz chose SL for it to be that
main forge
Like having an empowered rupture, or a SnD that gives an added bonus to something.
fleet whale
It was always basically passive since WoTlk
fleet whale
yes but cut to the chase was in wotlk
and was their through mop
until they made snd flat out passive in wod
storm forum
oh did anyone do the math for sharpening stones vs shadow core oil?
balmy condor
Stones > oils
storm forum
thanks, but also why do guides say oil?
main forge
guides say stone from what i see
storm forum
!guides
prisma monolithBOT
storm forum
RH says oil, Wowhead says sharpening stone, IV says Oil for ST and sharpening stone for M+
balmy condor
Great 
main forge
^
main forge
Yeah, I don't trust RH too far... even if this is the discord for it.
uncut schooner
Whispyr took me from being a grey parse smol brain to a purple parse, still a smol brain tho.
storm forum
strange python
!fuu
prisma monolithBOT
Fuus Shadowlands evaluation Spreadsheet: http://tiny.cc/uxr1tz
main forge
They aren't updated as often. Like that was fleshed out in the beta.
spice spire
Navi’s new opener is a banger, he swaps to sub before the fight starts.
main forge
Icyveins is similar in that regard, they aren't updated as often either, but they are a good thing to compare against. Wowhead typically feels the most up to date to me.
uncut schooner
Funny, I've seen Whisp use a similar strat on stream...
stoic needle
Make envenom apply SND if and only if rupture, garotte and your deadly poison are already on the target, or if you have 3 bleeds up on different targets
uncut schooner
stoic needle
If you want to reward good gameplay
spice spire
Maybe he’s a savant now
main forge
Whispyr is the reason I am still playing assassination rogue. I guess mistakes were made.
stable urchin
so hows look roatation on sin now ?
storm forum
part of me hopes Whispyr is actually a grey parsing normal raider cause that would be hilarious
uncut schooner
Nah, part of what makes me think Whisp genuinely knows what he's talking about is how in-depth he goes into the explanations.
main forge
The rotation currently for sin is.... roll sub and press face on keyboard and you'll do more damage than sin.
strange python
!bis
prisma monolithBOT
Whispyrs Bis list: http://tiny.cc/76r5tz
strange python
!stats
prisma monolithBOT
**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery
uncut schooner
Was a gigantic help back when I was learning how to sim and understand multipliers.
Even though I don't focus on Assa, its helped me a lot as a player.
balmy condor
Nah, part of what makes me think Whisp genuinely knows what he's talking about i...
And maybe cause I’m green now, or that my bis list is a command, but yeah, I talk a lot, that’s probably it
stable urchin
The rotation currently for sin is.... roll sub and press face on keyboard and yo...
DOnt like sub ...
storm forum
it works for outlaw too
uncut schooner
Part of the reason I've remained loyal to playing rogue so long 😛
balmy condor
so hows look roatation on sin now ?
!guide
prisma monolithBOT
strange python
I want zoldyck on legs, right?
uncut schooner
Though I am trying to dabble in other classes now.
balmy condor
I want zoldyck on legs, right?
Yes
strange python
❤️
balmy condor
I ran a dungeon with some random guy I found yesterday he was on a rogue alt
Went from 1.5k overall to 2.4k in one dungeon
Very proud of that man
balmy condor
That’s me
uncut schooner
Do I cave in and impulse buy a 190 boe to replace my 155 offhand dagger.
Or do I hold off.
balmy condor
main forge
Does a 190 offhand really help us that match?
balmy condor
Yeah, but the 190 dagger when m+ is going to open and allow you to farm 203’s
Go for it mate
uncut schooner
I mean, it'd techincally go mainhand.
I'm using a 184 in my mainhand atm.
The only gear I have that isn't mythic is my 171 helm
And this 155 offhand.
spice spire
^
main forge
I bought the dagger at 180k on the like 2-3 day
balmy condor
Sell them to idiots with too much money
uncut schooner
I lack gold.
stable urchin
+1
main forge
at this point... i wouldn't as it is just going to be replaced
balmy condor
Well then it’s omega not worth
uncut schooner
I've never owned more gold than the amount on my character right now.
main forge
Gold is so easy the first month to make
uncut schooner
(194k)
main forge
I made 194k the first week.
spice spire
Skin???? Profit
stoic needle
Just stealth around the maw with herbing and mining
uncut schooner
Nightshade has tanked pretty hard on my server oshosi.
stoic needle
Really? It's still the most expensive herb on mine
main forge
mine is still at 300-400g a pop i think
uncut schooner
140-ish g on mine
stoic needle
They're 200g each
main forge
but Widowbloom and Marrowroot are the ones that are going to raise... 120-150g each
stoic needle
It's not amazing but it's still better than most farms
main forge
The great thing about it... is I find a ton of it.
I can't say the same for anchorweed
stable vector
any1 who goes with marked of death
stoic needle
Also I've been spamming mists to level my alt with skinning and skinning all the bugs... That's huge profit right there. Every blue callous hide is 2k
balmy condor
It is as this point the fun police would like to direct all auction house goblins to #wow-general to keep the channels on topic
:)
stoic needle
spice spire
main forge
back to complaining about assassination guys... so yeah... don't buy the 190 dagger
you'll replace it faster than assassination will get buffs.
balmy condor
Actually true
frail birch
Why do you say such hurtful things
balmy condor
Can’t even argue with that
spice spire
Too real :/
main forge
#truthhurts
stable vector
Marked for death viable?
frail birch
balmy condor
Marked for death viable?
Yes, it’s the go to for m+
stoic needle
I like mfd a lot, it helps smooth out the rotation a bit for multi target
stable vector
how bout pvp
storm forum
it's great in PvP
gray hazel
Does crafting legs or feet for the Zold legendary matter?
balmy condor
You always take it in pvp
uncut schooner
Don't think I've ever heard or seen a guide not recommending you pick mfd for pvp.
main forge
it's great in grinding out farms too
balmy condor
Does crafting legs or feet for the Zold legendary matter?
Legs are slightly better
stoic needle
Essential for globalling people in pvp
gray hazel
Thanks Whis!
storm forum
Does crafting legs or feet for the Zold legendary matter?
legs is better cause it gives more stats
gray hazel
And Lan!
main forge
damn I was just thinking... MFD might be really good for torghast too... I usually go for the other two when I get that bonus talent power
stable vector
this mist dungeon sucks
main forge
what sucks about it?
stable vector
Fells like i've seen this a hundred times
balmy condor
Have you?
stable vector
no only 7
main forge
I honestly can say I have not encountered a single fight in M0 where I hate the boss and think its gimmicky or have issues with the dungeon itself.
balmy condor
Yeah I like the dungeons
main forge
Even coming in 8.3 to BFA, with overpowered gear and friends.... some of those dungeons I hated.
stable vector
Well this isnt bad but i've seen enough of these druid ish dungeons
main forge
The only one I can recall is the one from legion....
balmy condor
Had completely different colors as well
And the mechanics aren’t really close either
main forge
and there might have been one in WoD... but I don't recall anything like it from wrath/cata/mop
main forge
Tom Cruise Control for cool
balmy condor
WoD had everbloom
stable vector
Maybe this is just a personal hatred
main forge
playing too much classic? too much marudon?
Sanguine Depths and Theater of Pain are going to be the annoying dungeons from what I can see so far.
main forge
yeah, I am enjoying them all
stoic needle
Lots of places to do roguey things instead of it being an aoe fest all the time
main forge
here's a better question 2 months from now... when you are doing M+ what dungeon do you think you will pass up on going to if it really came down to it.
stable vector
Its something that has made me hate all these emerald dream looking dungeons
main forge
Guild will give the most honest answer... pugging will give you a different answer
balmy condor
here's a better question 2 months from now... when you are doing M+ what dungeon...
My money is on spires
spice spire
Second boss on spires kills it for me
main forge
Yeah that will be a pug destroyer
spice spire
Pugging, that one, guild, probably none
real bay
one shot by a dark bolt, cant wait
main forge
first boss of plaguefall has a chance to make groups just fall apart from the get go.
err i said plaguefall, meant necrotic wake
spice spire
Yeah, necrotic wake first boss was a rude awakening to m0 as a 157.
main forge
It still is at higher levels too if you don't handle the puke and worms properly.
and then wind up pulling more trash.
uncut schooner
Do I even bother reading into the raid mechanics fully tonight :/
main forge
my raid is supposed to go in "blind" to discover the mechanics ourselves.
uncut schooner
I mean, I'm condemned to pugging it for this week so.
inner lagoon
i get my MA today after doing my first Torghast so im a bit happy about that
uncut schooner
Not sure if a deep read is even necessary at this point.
As long as I know where I'm going.
inner lagoon
i saw a lot of stuff on WoWhead video wise or cheat sheet wise for raids
balmy condor
@uncut schooner na Horde?
main forge
I'm frankly just going to be interested in what to Feint/Cloak/Evasion. As Top DPS shouldn't be my goal... I plan on learning to be the person to do mechanics
balmy condor
Damn
main forge
Because if I can at least hit the top ... errr bottom of damage taken chart that makes me happy.
spice spire
Mood.
echo gust
wtb servers
serene mauve
anyone staying assassination for pve raids or yall switchin to sub?
echo gust
will sell whispyr
balmy condor
low girder
I got like 4:30 hours today
Same
spice spire
Despite better judgement, I’m staying sin.
uncut schooner
I'll be diving into Sub, as much as I wanted to run in with Assa haha.
I will be crafting my Assa legendary after Sub though.
For the hopes it returns as a good spec.
uncut schooner
That's the plan.
main forge
I'm starting with Sin, until I don't want to be number 17 on damage done chart.
uncut schooner
Won't take long realistically anyway.
uncut schooner
Once we have all layers unlocked its like a what.. 3 week process?
To hit the soul ash req. for rank 4s.
It's capped out at 8k anyway.
low girder
people from sub channel overflowing into outlaw ugh
Welcome to fotm town
Til it gets nerfed anyway
supple compass
ik ik
balmy condor
Just wait till we see sin buffs