assassination

[main forge]

I got lucky and Well-Placed Steel dropped at 184 or whatever

its okay... none of them seem to be as spectacular as other classes seem to be... but i could be wrong there....

if there was one that gave us energy for not pressing buttons... it would probably be top tier right now.

[restive spire]

did the sepsis stealth ability get hotfixed to work with garrote

[atomic gate]

So we getting buffed? Friend thinks tuning is for sure today. He's tank DH and thinks he's getting the bat

People on twitch calling for rogue nerfs but that's probably more about PvP

[vestal wren]

iirc there are 3 op pvp specs

[real bay]

doubt anything happens today

[vestal wren]

but ye, i can see why ppl cry for rogue nerfs

i had 8 rogues + 2 night elfs /druids + 1 dh sitting on a interesting world quest and just onehot everything that comes along

this is the worldpvp blizz anticipates, its what people seemingly love to do and what allowes them to show their skill in worldpvp 👍

[sweet pecan]

as soon as there are rewards involved people will look for the exploits to get them there easier/faster

[vestal wren]

probably something related to warmode, i never saw horde camp a questpoint

i know its unpopular opinion, but warmode is a big failure

the entire "pvp engagement" just comes from people wanting the wm bonus while the entire promise of warmode was to only give people who do pvp rewards

[fallow otter]

fuu soz wrong channel but for sepsis sub sim, is there a reason that we dont ss, sepsis, rup instead of ss rup sepsis? seems to line up better in practice, assumption is that the bit of time we after dance is good for pooling?

[vestal wren]

the design seems to have the only purpose to have a strong pvp statistic, when the majority would just turn wm off if there was a lot of effort in getting rewards bc. only pvp enthusiasts would play it

sepsis should proc after dance

what makes the use quite good

[fallow otter]

ya it does but its a bit of a wait if you do sepsis before rup

[vestal wren]

also sepsis is outside of dance, what gives you another global in dance

[fallow otter]

im finding a no dance window between sepsis proc and dance ending

with the ss rup sepsis opener

a no sepsis proc no dance window

is it a haste thing?

[vestal wren]

i had no issue when i tested it

[vestal wren]

i rly hope that sin gets a buff, would like to see this channel more active 🙂

[real bay]

missing sin already, requirement to think is missing w outlaw in dungs xd

just blast

fewer buttons but more thought is more fun

[sweet pecan]

outlaw? what is this you speak of

ass, sub and combat are the rogue specs

[real bay]

don't wanna call the current "combat" combat lmao

stupid pistol hero

[summer marten]

as far as i know it silences since day 2, but thats about it

[marble magnet]

What would you replace the pistol with. For aesthetic

I do wish that more than broadsides changed the rotation.

[quaint dragon]

at how many targets do i start using fan of knives instead of mutilate

[woven summit]

3+

I think

[marble magnet]

I feel like three is universal.

Most specs use aoe at 3 targets

[raven karma]

i m wondering if ass spec could be better than in actual simulations with mastery prio stat + boost nature damages by legendaries / conduits / master poisonner talent

someone tried this way ?

to create synergy around poisons / envenom

[restive spire]

No envenom is very low damage rn, auto attacks and the poison instant damage from auto attacks are like 40+ percent of our damage so just haste vers rn

Also our conduits are kinda dog if I’m being honest

Compared to other classes at least

[lost sentinel]

some of the sin legendaries look cool

[trail mica]

Im missing sin rogue every second i play outlaw or sub, especially sub...

and the zoldyck lego sounds cool paired with blindside

its like arms warrior levels of execute

[real bay]

buff bleeds and it feelsgoodman

[maiden wolf]

@vestal wren - there was a big jump in the sim numbers (20-25%) across the board from a few days ago, do you know what caused it?

[frigid kestrel]

What enchants and Iols are we supposed to get

or did i miss that in th epins?

[obtuse anvil]

we're rooting for you sin chat

hang in there

[plain thistle]

[vestal wren]

hard to say "when" but i assume you mean the implementation/addition of the enh totem

or the implementation of a trinket

rly hard to say

[maiden wolf]

gotcha, i was just curious about what changed

[tough skiff]

Outlaw is a double spec, have many assasin stuff. Even in Thorgast our Ambush apply rupture

[quaint dragon]

Is there bis list from castle narnia?

[serene basin]

there might

but sim yo self lol

[plain thistle]

!bis

[prisma monolith]

Whispyrs Bis list: http://tiny.cc/76r5tz

[plain thistle]

there you go 🙂

[spiral bobcat]

Is it worth getting assasin legendary or sub still gonna be the move ?

[sick scarab]

question for Whyspyrs.. in bis list there is dashong scoundrel instead zoldick.. it is new thing ?

[serene basin]

i think if you have the 100% crit one, is a good choice for a 1st legendary if you are not decided on what to play.. my guess

[worldly fable]

You can also wait for heroic week tuning

[rain estuary]

yes

[sinful island]

you have to keep bleedings from garote and raptur on targets with poison, it regain you energy each tick

also keep slice and dice on

[rain estuary]

aight ty (:

[sinful island]

remember to buy thistle tea as well

and use vendetta at longer combats

[balmy condor]

In terms of raw single target, dashing was consistently ahead by a little, bloodfang and zoldyck were also very close. I still would recommend zoldyck, it goes into the same slot (feet) as dashing as well

[mint kindle]

Is assassination viable in BGs?

[quaint dragon]

no

[vale quest]

is assassin still shit?

[urban marsh]

Yep

[vale quest]

when sin is bad i barely play WoW. its my fav spec lol.

[honest lagoon]

Is this how it feels to main sub all these years?

[vale quest]

itll problly be good in 2 weeks

they never let sin stay bad too long

[bleak fractal]

Hello, lads. Quick question for you Ass rogues. I'm currently Sub and was thinking about trying assassination for a few days this week. How does the spec feel right now to the more experienced assassination players? Is the dps under tuned, is it fun, does it bring anything unique to the table in mythics/raids?

[craggy wave]

ass rogues

[pure heron]

@bleak fractal its terrible

come back after the next round of tuning

[craggy wave]

In my time playing at 60 and my experience only being heroic dungeons and questing, I am constantly energy deprived

[bleak fractal]

ah man, really? I played assassination in wotlk pretty hardcore and I haven't really played that spec since

[craggy wave]

and struggling to keep up with people who are similarly geared

[bleak fractal]

That's disappointing to hear.

[vale quest]

does Sin have no annoying streamer who complains to make sure it doesn't release like this. Ret had Savixx

[pure heron]

yeah its sub if youre a meta slave or outlaw if you wanna be a hipster and not pay too much of a dps loss for it

[balmy condor]

I’m on it boss just need to spec back out of sub

[bleak fractal]

Well shit. If/when they get a buff I'll be back seeking advice lol

[balmy condor]

Nah but honestly if you played wrath sin, it’s basically that

Just really undertuned

[bleak fractal]

gotcha. Thank you.

[gleaming eagle]

@craggy wave have you been keeping up with your slice and dice?

[balmy condor]

Slice honestly doesn’t help much

[vale quest]

Slice and dice is like taking your vitemens and eating your vegetables. u dont want to but u gotta

[gleaming eagle]

for 173 my sim is pretty low, its probably my talents

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/mQgK6Cfcx9KdJuPFXkgiHp

[balmy condor]

Yeah

MP is the worst talent in that row

Subterfuge is fine if you want to run that

Ma still very slightly higher

[gleaming eagle]

i see

im used to subterfuge

being able to start with ambushes

is nice

and for pvp too

[balmy condor]

Sadly ambush sucks

[gleaming eagle]

better dmg than mutilate though

[balmy condor]

Well

If you look at the casts in that quick sim

You’ll see it mutilates after the garrote

[gleaming eagle]

ya

[balmy condor]

No ambushes

[gleaming eagle]

at 173

whats a good number to reach

3k?

i saw some ppl hitting 4k

and here i am at 2.5k

lol

[balmy condor]

Well you’re also playing sin

So you’re automatically like 600 behind

But I think if you hit 3.2ish you’re solid

[gleaming eagle]

i see

[supple compass]

Where does Zoldyck come from

[sharp notch]

torghast next week probably

[balmy condor]

Yeah next week torg I would assume

[woven summit]

You guys focus on dungeons or PvP gear?

Guess dungeons is better for sin

because too much vers and haste in PvP

but maybe vers ain't that bad either

[balmy condor]

Haste Vers is our best stat

But you want a healthy sprinkle of crit and some mast as well

Haste Vers is really good though

[spice spire]

Ahh yes the two lowest stats on the gear I’ve found

[placid dawn]

!bis

[prisma monolith]

Whispyrs Bis list: http://tiny.cc/76r5tz

[lapis ice]

are some legendarys not out? the duskwalkers patch doesnt show on loot for me off mistcaller

[small steppe]

Nope. Our bis are next week

[balmy condor]

duskwalkers drops for people

[small steppe]

well one of them at least 😄

[lapis ice]

im specifically looking for duskwalkers patch

is that only M+?

[balmy condor]

no

people in here have posted that they've gotten it

[lapis ice]

ic so blizzards thing is bugged

[balmy condor]

it doesn't show from mistcaller

[lapis ice]

yeh

[balmy condor]

hm

[lapis ice]

its ok as long as its confirmed it drops

[balmy condor]

check your filters

its definitely there

might not be on rogue

[lapis ice]

oh rofl

ic

i wasnt aware the items dropped based on loot spec

[balmy condor]

they don't

but if you're not looking at rogue gear, it won't show rogue legendaries

like if you accidentally have it set to druid

won't show the legendary

if you have it set to all specs

should still show

[lapis ice]

gotcha

ty

nice ppl in a class discord isa first for me

[balmy condor]

np

we try to keep a good vibe in here :P

we don't venture into the darkness of #subtlety

[small steppe]

lol

i just don't enjoy the way it plays, i couldn't bring myself to swap. plus the addition of shiv into our rotation was really interesting

[balmy condor]

its just weaker tb

which is sad imo

[small steppe]

i'm just glad theyre giving us slightly more class fantasy. we applied poisons and that was it before

haha

sepsis is quite a nice addition too

(i wanted to be a necrolord badly)

[balmy condor]

so why didn't you?

[small steppe]

i really liked sepsis lol

[balmy condor]

aha

[radiant onyx]

You guys who actually play assassination, how does it currently fair compared to sub?

For raids and m+

[balmy condor]

poorly

[radiant onyx]

😦

[small steppe]

haha

[radiant onyx]

But it's so much more like a true rogue. Can't wait for 9.2 when assassination gets buffed and outscale sub omegalul

[balmy condor]

we don't say the S word

that word is cursed

[radiant onyx]

sorry

[balmy condor]

"scale" is such a bait

I wish we did lmao

[alpine garden]

what ilevel do heroic dungeons unlock?

[balmy condor]

155 to queue

[alpine garden]

Ta

[balmy condor]

na

[hexed copper]

Hey people, how's the assa spec doing?

[balmy condor]

#assassination message

[hexed copper]

Sad!

[glacial helm]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[drifting cosmos]

When is the mythic week spec tuning?

Is it next week ?

[balmy condor]

this week is still m0, then next week is heroic raiding, and tuning will happen at the end of that week, going into the mythic week

[drifting cosmos]

Oh

So S1 starts next week?

[balmy condor]

yes

[drifting cosmos]

I see, it seems many popular specs in BFA are falling behind atm

Would be interesting to see post tuning

[deft vault]

Does the doomblade legndary count bonespike and its own bleed as bleeeds ?

So you could have 4 wwith rupture garrote bonespike and dooomblade bleed

[balmy condor]

no

[deft vault]

So its only rupture and garrote?

[balmy condor]

and CT technically

yeah

[small steppe]

i was curious and tried sub

good lord

[balmy condor]

good lord bad?

[small steppe]

so much more dmg

for so much less effort

i hope they fix sin soon

[dark token]

hello fellow sin rogues

how do you deal with spec diff depression

[balmy condor]

crying helps me

[old snow]

you guys going with 190 or 210 legendary

[balmy condor]

waiting for zoldyck for sin, and waiting for finality for sub

[languid totem]

Been trying to farm master assassin. 40 runs and counting atm

[knotty bear]

ouch

got it first mythic lols

unsure if i will even craft

[cunning urchin]

Wait

Can people get 210 this week?

[balmy condor]

no

[cunning urchin]

I did all my runs todat and obly got 1.4k

[balmy condor]

190 this week

210 next

[cunning urchin]

Gotcha

[wide ridge]

wait, we can 210 next week already?

[balmy condor]

well yeah, next week is heroic raid

[wide ridge]

holy shit i won't craft my 190 then

[balmy condor]

so if you do splits with your guild

you can be like

212 ilvl

by the end of next week

[wide ridge]

does anyone know like, what is necessary to upgrade a legendary 190 to 210?

is it expensive

[balmy condor]

its the difference in cost

crafting rank 2 and upgrading 1 to 2 is the same

[wide ridge]

a

gotcha

so the only thing not letting us craft rank 2 this week is soul ash cap

right

[balmy condor]

yes

[wide ridge]

thanks whispyr

[balmy condor]

no problemo friend

[summer marten]

its difference in ash cost + higher rank base item too, so you use rank 1 and rank 2 if you go upgrade route

[minor turtle]

Guys what is the actl best Sub Legendary?

[balmy condor]

finality

but also wrong channel

[minor turtle]

i mean assa sry

my english is not the yellow from the egg

xD

[balmy condor]

zoldyck is the recommendation

dashing is slightly better single target, but zoldyck will win when you have multiple targets

[minor turtle]

zoldyck but not for assa or?

[balmy condor]

what?

zoldyck is sin specific

[fleet whale]

looks like you can make doomblade this week but it doesn't seem worth

[balmy condor]

It worth single target I guess

doomblade/zoldyck/dashing are all crazy close

so technically could craft rank 1 doomblade this week

[fleet whale]

yeah but zoldyck is more worth

[balmy condor]

and then zoldyck next week

if you're so inclined

[fleet whale]

idk what i should do, I might just save my ash until tuning happens

cause if sin can become somewhat viable again, i won't make sub leggos first

[balmy condor]

I'm waiting for finality

for m+

and then if sin viability happens

we'll craft zoldyck

I don't see m+ viability

so its a finality for me

[fleet whale]

i'm not a huge M+ player though, i enjoy raiding far more

if they could at least make sin as "good" as it was in M+ as it was in legion, i would be ok with that too

[balmy condor]

yeah I'm a bigger m+ player than I am a raider

[glacial helm]

I think it was said earlier that the Doomblade +5% to envenom did not apply for Serrated Bone Spike or its Mutilate bleed. Does anyone know if Zoldyck applies its 30% increase to Serrated Bone Spike?

[balmy condor]

no

as a baseline rule, there is no interaction between legendaries and covenants

[prime schooner]

Anyone changed covenant? there is any difference doing it today instead of tomorrow? (EU)

[balmy condor]

I changed earlier this week and caught up within like a day and a half

I think you might be able to get 1 renown farther?

but you're not catching up to 6 I think regardless

[prime schooner]

Damn then rip i guess

[balmy condor]

you can catch up the week after

[placid dawn]

is sub better for m+ than outlul?

[balmy condor]

depending on situation maybe

but probably not

[placid dawn]

hopefully sin gets a good buff

that way i only have 1 set of gear for m+ and raid

[bleak glacier]

is there any chance we'll see buffs before mythic?

[real bay]

yes

[balmy condor]

a very good chance

[vale quest]

aoe buff too?

[balmy condor]

a less good chance of that

[real bay]

maybe a slight if they decide to buff bleeds n poisons

[balmy condor]

I'm like 90% sure they just slap an aura buff on and call it a day

anything more is a big win

[fossil slate]

I hope they do because I do love be some Sin

I'd really enjoy getting to play all three specs

[frozen epoch]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[topaz saffron]

What armor piece are you guys sticking your zoldyck insignia on?

[balmy condor]

feet

[hollow escarp]

you can only craft it on boots or legs anyway

[marble hemlock]

why feet

@balmy condor

:<

[fleet whale]

wait so envenom isn't buffed from the doomblade bleed? wtf in Nighthold it did!

[normal olive]

he wanted to google feet but wrote in discord instead

[balmy condor]

dashing also goes in feet

[hollow escarp]

[balmy condor]

so ez swap for me

[marble hemlock]

but legs better

than feet

both irl and for zoldyck

[normal olive]

ey

[fleet whale]

whisp has a foot fetish

[normal olive]

no kink shaming

[balmy condor]

I mean

it isn't

[marble hemlock]

i dont kink shame. feet fetish is the exception

higher stat budget?

[balmy condor]

within margin

[marble hemlock]

thats a pretty big margin sir

its over 20agi and 40 secondary

thats a big margin sir

[balmy condor]

meh

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/gASXFGoE6guWL9xzXXfruH

0.3 in ST

I guess not margin

wait jank talents

but I guess so

[stoic needle]

!bis

[prisma monolith]

Whispyrs Bis list: http://tiny.cc/76r5tz

[pure spade]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[west glacier]

we cant get Zoldyck Insignia this week right?

[balmy condor]

nop

[west glacier]

awesome

[atomic gate]

Sweet system

Next week for sure tho

Unless....

[west glacier]

so I gotta stomach not having a legendary for week

it is what it is I guess

[balmy condor]

most people aren't crafting this week anyway

[atomic gate]

If the wing it drops in isn't next week then rip u

7 wings, 2 per week

Small chance the wing you need isn't until the 15th

[knotty bear]

nothing to do this week except M0s anyway

[strange python]

Is SIN still viable in arena ?

[balmy condor]

not really

[strange python]

Anyone rest it out ? Booo not happy to hear that lol. Would kyrian be bis even if I still push with sin rogue in PvP ?

[balmy condor]

yeah

[strange python]

Ok thx

[worldly fable]

Is sin viable anywhere other than world content?

How low can it go

[balmy condor]

I wouldn't do it in world content either

sub just does it better there too

[atomic gate]

Sin will for sure get buffed

[normal olive]

[strange python]

You guys think they would buff it? I think they may nerf sub so that sin would be similar !

[balmy condor]

sin is undertuned

sub isn't overtuned

therefore buff sin

[atomic gate]

Sub might get the bat a little

[umbral rapids]

I ageee

Agree

It’s good

It’s not busted

[balmy condor]

maybe very lightly

but there's like 6-7 specs that are still higher

[atomic gate]

PvP Sub has crazy cc, burst, wound poison, and is top 3 in pve dps

[main forge]

Yeah I doubt sub will get a nerf, unless it shows up being as broken as other classes.

[balmy condor]

its definitely not top 3

[umbral rapids]

Well nothing manes sense in pvp right now lol

[strange python]

Thing is as ww sub one shots me in one stun ! I don’t feel like that’s normal

[atomic gate]

What's top 3

[umbral rapids]

Hard to say this early what’s top 3

[strange python]

I have to trinket karma and wall to live lol

[main forge]

PvP is in a weird spot with the covenant abilities playing a factor right now.

[umbral rapids]

But sub doesn’t seem as an outlier by any means

[balmy condor]

if you're putting it above hunter mage spriest

then we got issues

[umbral rapids]

MM hunter yeah

Fire mage

Most likely atm

[balmy condor]

arcane and frost are good too

[umbral rapids]

But again, hard to say

[balmy condor]

spriest is good

[strange python]

Ya hunters and sp even ret play seem all crazy atm

[balmy condor]

I think you can make an argument for #5

but top 3?

HEAVY doubt

[umbral rapids]

I mean

[main forge]

DPS DK are also doing well from what I have seen.

[umbral rapids]

Only reason it could be top 3 is because of being a rogue

[balmy condor]

that's a downside, not an upside

[umbral rapids]

So you could see fire mage / mm / sub or outlaw be meta

For m+ i mean

[balmy condor]

well yeah but ranking specs for m+

is a little yikes imo

[umbral rapids]

But that’s just our class being overloaded in that type of content

Wdym

[main forge]

Might be Meta for M+ but it won't be due to DPS ranking.

[umbral rapids]

I speak about what I know about ^^

[balmy condor]

cause there will be a comp that evolves

[umbral rapids]

That was my point actually

[balmy condor]

and one of them will most likely be a rogue because of utility

but that doesn't determine ranking

[umbral rapids]

Sure

[balmy condor]

just because X comp is the strongest, doesn't make X spec in that comp really good

so if we're ranking by spec

[umbral rapids]

That’s not what i said whispyr

[balmy condor]

I don't think m+ is really worth anything

[umbral rapids]

Like

My point was that, the only scenario where it could be « top 3 » would be m+ and it would be because of the class, not necessarily dps

[balmy condor]

I guess

[willow vine]

How is layer 3 of the new halls compared to last weeks?

[balmy condor]

I found it about the same

[umbral rapids]

idk with warlocks priests hunters and mages around...

[balmy condor]

the assassin one was a little annoying

but the other one was pretty whatever

[fleet whale]

well ST wise warlocks actually aren't all that special

demo and destro are both bad atm while affliction is middle of the pack

obv aff shines in multidotting though

[north pewter]

should i take venom rush over alacrity? is it worth it for the energy regen?

im dying

[balmy condor]

alacrity is much better

even in single target

venom rush doesn't do anything in aoe, so not really worth mentioning there

[supple edge]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[fleet whale]

blizz buffing venom rush from 5 energy to 8 energy proved to me that none of there devs play assassin

[north pewter]

lmao

3 MORE ENERGY

that'll do kids!

[fleet whale]

it should have been a new talent all together

[balmy condor]

I mean, it made a pretty good dent in the difference between alacrity and venom rush

Went from a really really bad talent to just a bad talent

[fleet whale]

it may have made the talent "better"

[balmy condor]

But yeah, they need to rethink the entire tree at some point

[fleet whale]

but in reality, the talent should've been something entirely different

[stoic needle]

what is sin currently lacking that keeps it behind sub? does it need just a number increase, or does the spec have fundamental flaws?

[balmy condor]

there's fundamental issues with aoe

but single target, its just numbers

[fleet whale]

damage and some fundamental issues

[balmy condor]

single target is perfectly fine

[fleet whale]

the st issues will solve itself with crit, in terms of feel

[dense cedar]

They should just revert Energy rush

[fleet whale]

but aoe has huge problems

[balmy condor]

but in aoe and m+ there's some design flaws

[stoic needle]

is the aoe rotation just awkward?

[fleet whale]

it just does no damage

[balmy condor]

it just doesn't really function the way its "intended"

[fleet whale]

and fok barely generates cps

[balmy condor]

the issue is that the aoe damage wants to be poisons with poisoned katar, but EB in bfa wanted fok damage, and shrouded wanted bleed damage

[stoic needle]

I'm suprised they didn't give sin an ability similar to warlock's malefic rapture, instantly doing some of your dot damage or smth

[fleet whale]

sin's aoe was carried by borrowed power in BFA

[balmy condor]

it wants to be everything

and it can't choose

[stoic needle]

ah yeah i know that story too well

[fleet whale]

does Poison katar even do anything with poisons anymore

i just got a conduit with it

and it read more Fok damage and more fok crit

[balmy condor]

so we're stuck halfway between "does fok do damage? does rupture multi-dotting do damage? do poison applications do damage? is it subt garrotes? hidden blades? CT?"

there's no cohesive concept for what sin aoe should look like

[fleet whale]

hidden blades was a waste to bring back

[balmy condor]

which makes it a mess

[stoic needle]

yeah i see what you're saying

[fleet whale]

again, another decision that shows the devs don't actually play the spec

[stoic needle]

that's a bummer =/

thematically i like sin more than sub

[fleet whale]

i personally think merging shiv and toxic blade into the same thing was a mistake

would rather just see TB baseline, and shiv can stay for utility

[balmy condor]

a lot of people like sin more than sub honestly

[fleet whale]

don't bring it up, but sub is actually at its current state

very similar to havoc dh

[stoic needle]

lol

it does feel kinda spammy

i also don't like being pretty much useless outside of shadow dance

[fleet whale]

it's main punishment comes from using your burst cds at the wrong time

so it hurts your dps in that regard

but the actual dps rotation is very simple

[stoic needle]

yeah it's very hit or miss while learning new content

the best times to blow CDs aren't always apparent

[fleet whale]

you can even take premed as sub

[frail fossil]

if i'm not mistaken, the shiv nature damage debuff is permanent on the target right ?

[stoic needle]

i love premed as sub

[balmy condor]

no

its not

[fleet whale]

it aint lol

[balmy condor]

its 9 seconds

like its always been

[fleet whale]

that's a tooltip error

[balmy condor]

not even a tooltip error

[fleet whale]

it's a perk tooltip error

[balmy condor]

that's a wowhead being dumbasses error

[stoic needle]

ugh

[frail fossil]

idk like last time i checked

[stoic needle]

their legendary calculator says it costs 100 soul ash to upgrade a legendary

[fleet whale]

nah it is a blizz error

[frail fossil]

it was like just 20% nature damage debuff

[fleet whale]

but it only shows that when it's greyed out as a perk

[frail fossil]

without any mention of duration

[stoic needle]

so all day I thought I could craft like 4 legendaries this week

[normal olive]

[fleet whale]

and it's nine seconds

[balmy condor]

yikes

spaghetti everywhere

[fleet whale]

and you can take premed as sub, and almost take SnD out of the rotation

while not taking that big of a st loss

and the loss becomes less with more adds

[stoic needle]

i like premed because it feels like the enemies are dead by the time I get SND and rupture up on 1 target

[fleet whale]

i hate how backstab feels when i press

it's so unsatisfying

[stoic needle]

more like badstab

[fleet whale]

buff gloomblade

[stoic needle]

so it seems like they need to shift the power in the sin aoe rotation somewhere because currently it's kinda all over the place and thus none of it is particularly good?

[fleet whale]

it could use a shake up on it's talent tree

[rancid heath]

does it matter if i opt for legs or boots for zoldyck?

[fleet whale]

that's for sure

legs give you more stats

[rancid heath]

cool, ty

[stoic needle]

anyone trying out MA the first week?

[balmy condor]

Waiting for zoldyck

[viscid locust]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[stoic needle]

I'm gonna do lvl 1 MA to start because it's a good all-rounder, and I like to PVP, M+ and raid. And it works well enough for both sin and sub

by the time nathria comes out and I get the drops i'll have enough soul ash for finality or zoldyck

[fleet whale]

well i was able to solo custodian thonar

it was tight though lol

[knotty bear]

fighting him now, tips?

thought i was cruising then he started meleeing me for 20% chunks

[fleet whale]

he hits really hard, basically a dps race

interrupt his rook

kite him around the room, so you arent' standing in green stuff

make full use of your cc

if needed, buy the health pot from the broker

since it doesn't share a cd with a regular pot

[shadow tulip]

Wowhead says, buy smoke bomb from vendor

[hearty needle]

Does Internal Bleeding talent still proc if the target is immune to stun?

[fleet whale]

no

yeah it looks like the smoke bomb cheeses him a bit, but note his melee's still hit hard

[balmy condor]

I didn't really have an issue with it

just dps, if you get slow hit evasion

[fleet whale]

i mean i one shot him and my anima powers weren't that great

but it wasn't like a walk in the park lol

at least for me

[balmy condor]

I had an okay run

[shadow tulip]

Depends on the powers you get, I guess

[balmy condor]

and it was super comfy

[fleet whale]

what i found annoying about that zone

were the assassins that spawned

such a nuisance

[balmy condor]

yeah

[fleet whale]

got deathly shadows though.. not a great lego but i have it

will try the other place soon to get doomblade

[shadow tulip]

I think I'll craft MA too, maybe the best for outdoor stuff? Guild only starts mythic raids after new years

So got plenty of time till then

[fleet whale]

does the doomblade damage increase with maim mangle?

since doomblade says 30% of mutilate damage

[shadow tulip]

Mut=/= ambush tho

Oh, nvm

Perks of night shift, I'm not the sharpest atm

[fleet whale]

i wonder since the potency conduits for sin are all close anyway

if doomblade would actually make main mangle "best:

[balmy condor]

maim is the one that's behind

but I can sim that for you if you'd like

[fleet whale]

yeah, but when i simmed a 158 Maim compared to a 158 WPS

Maim was only like 12 dps behind for me

i just wonder if doomblade could push maim's value up even if slightly

[balmy condor]

I don't think they interact

yeah

maim still behind

[fleet whale]

it's sad that they don't

blizz is basically giving sin no interactions with any of these powers

[lean zodiac]

how is sin in its current state? know sub is better but looking to play sin as long as its not one of the worst specs in game atm

[royal lantern]

well,about that

its 1 of the worst specs in the game atm :/

[lean zodiac]

big oof

what problems does it have at max level? still leveling so dont know whats holding it back atm

[fleet whale]

low damage

[steady sinew]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[olive egret]

Saw someone in the Sub section say that assass with be a top tier spec by the end of the expansion, I hope he's right :)

[fallow otter]

Im honestly expecting sub nerfs

But hoping none come

[olive egret]

Pikaboo's basically one shotting people on stream right now with MA lego, so it's possible

[fallow otter]

They need pvp nerf not pve

So no doubt that is coming

Im just hoping they don't get pve aswell

Because if they don't buff sin in the process I tiredly see no reason to play rogue over lock

Outlaw brings no on demand dmg that I usually need

For prog

[fleet whale]

two of the lock specs are kind of bad right now but affliction is good

[south umbra]

is it at all pos to make a macro that casts ambush when blindside procs and mut otherwise?

[shadow tulip]

Gnomesequencer

[fallow otter]

I hate to say it but they got a bunch of balancing pretty good between covs legends etc

But sin got the shaft

At least rogue has 2 good specs

[brisk flicker]

Sin is feeling really bad in Torghast... either that or I'm super bad... which is a possibility.

[shadow tulip]

It is bad

[balmy condor]

torghast is actually the one place where sin isn't straight trash

[brisk flicker]

I feel ok in Mythic and feel not complete garbage in ST, but Torghast... I'm struggling. I got to 6th floor layer 3 and just could not down Observer dude. Felt like I did no dmg.

[stoic needle]

Sin seems amazing for torghast because of how easy it is to kite

[tough skiff]

I love some anima orbs. The one that sapped and blinded target get 50% damage while u attack other mobs without breaking it. I sapped the elite protecting the portal and he end up with 30% hp left lol

[mental laurel]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[barren bane]

why does sin feel bit weak? im leveling up atm always the 3rd dps in dungeon

[balmy condor]

because its the weakest rouge spec

by a sizable margin

[barren bane]

wait we have to go through phase again? sin been weak all over again

[balmy condor]

not sure what you mean by that

[barren bane]

i mean we start weak at the beginning of the expan then become very strong at the end of expan

[balmy condor]

that talking point is bait as fuck

"sin scales" is actually trolling

[barren bane]

i was doing really good in bfa

[balmy condor]

sin was crazy with exsang during emerald nightmare, sin was crazy with SS in uldir

we've been kings for basically 2 expansions straight, give or take a couple fights

I think its okay to be bad for a little

[barren bane]

any buff coming for sin?

[serene basin]

rt

[serene basin]

hope so

[balmy condor]

yeah I hope so too

[serene basin]

im doing some dmg in dgs

but cant really go against other classes

single target is ok

but sub outperforms

[balmy condor]

pulls are also short enough to where subt garrotes carry really hard

keep that in mind

[serene basin]

true

tho im using MA leggo

so im rinning nightstalker

running*

[barren bane]

what covenant u guys chose?

[serene basin]

kyrian

fits well in rotation

tho im thinking about venthir for raiding

if they get some buffs

xD

[barren bane]

im leveling up atm so trying all the covenants

[wet thistle]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/167129041772478464/783562965445509150/unknown.png

Anyone have this interaction

in Torghast?

[balmy condor]

havent seen it personally, is that the name of the anima power?

[wet thistle]

yeah

Sepsis Deals 15% of the targets max HP to enemies around, but i used it ST on a boss

[balmy condor]

oh

poison spores

yeah

that one I know

[wet thistle]

but 1.60M dmg is a lot more that 15% of the bosses HP

[balmy condor]

yeah idk

[wet thistle]

the tick chunked about 65% of his HP

[cedar flume]

!bis

[prisma monolith]

Whispyrs Bis list: http://tiny.cc/76r5tz

[balmy condor]

btw I don't think you'd run nightstalker even with MA

[serene basin]

really? im thinkin about the large envenom

[balmy condor]

oh yeah def not

if anything you would nightstalker a CT I would think

but 3 garrotes from stealth is still just better

1 garrote from subterfuge is better than 1 nightstalker rupture in single target

[serene basin]

cool, got it

even the 7cp rupture?

[balmy condor]

I think a 7cp would probably make it roughly equal in single target

but making that lineup is just ridiculous

[serene basin]

it is indeed

tho im in a luck streak

either way

i'll try the subterfuge

[gleaming eagle]

wait so is kyrian better

than night fae for assa?

[balmy condor]

the difference is irrelevant

[gleaming eagle]

yeah i picked night fae for sepsis

thinking it go well with shiv nature dmg buff

[fallow otter]

If only that was enough

[frozen epoch]

Whats the best legendary for sin?

[balmy condor]

zoldyck as an overall

[frozen epoch]

ty

[fallow otter]

I recommend fatality or celerity

Ok it's getting old now, it's making me sad

[strange python]

cant get zoldyck until next week tho 😦

[balmy condor]

so then wait

[iron orchid]

I'va had this happen to me in torghast too yesterday. I think this happens when you kill a target that was affected by this 15% poison spore thing. As to why it does that, i have no idea.

[deft vault]

So how does changing covenant work ?

[balmy condor]

the first time you change to one, you just switch

[deft vault]

I restart at renown 0 with my new covenant ? Do i lose all my conduit ?

[balmy condor]

if you want to go back, its 2 weeks of quests

the renown is saved per covenant

so if you have 0 in that covenant, it'll be 0

[deft vault]

what a fucking awful system

[balmy condor]

the only conduit you lose is your covenant conduit

[fallow otter]

Lol

No pleasing

[deft vault]

And is there any catchup mechanic on renown ?

[fleet whale]

how did you all do in your torghast runs?

[balmy condor]

there is a catchup

[fleet whale]

also, sin can craft deathly shadows now

prolly still bad though for sin

[balmy condor]

its bad yeah

[fleet whale]

shame i actually loved it as a tier bonus back in HFC

but it was kind of a product of its time if you know what i mean lol

[south drum]

Does anyone know how the legendaries drops in dungeons, are they tied to loot specs are will they drop for all spec?

[balmy condor]

they drop for all

[south drum]

Cool and I'm guessing it will be the same in raid?

[balmy condor]

most likely so, yes

[raven karma]

and conduits in dungeons ? we have to switch loot specs or not ?

[south drum]

Great I only got a sin legendary so was wondering if I need to change loot spec between bosses

Conduits drops for all specs

[raven karma]

ok

[jaunty crystal]

oh lol

I've been loot spec swapping for conduits

[restive spire]

171 well placed steel vs 184 main mangle??

[balmy condor]

sim it

[restive spire]

conduits arent working in raidbots are they

[balmy condor]

yes they are

[fleet whale]

yeah you have to use top gear though

[cold rampart]

should i create master assassin ? or wait for zoldyck

[balmy condor]

waiting for zoldyck is probably better if it comes next week

!bis

[prisma monolith]

Whispyrs Bis list: http://tiny.cc/76r5tz

[lament dove]

why is Heirmir the best...? I guess I'm blind and don't see something

[balmy condor]

marrowed gemstone pretty gud

but really its like 0.2-0.3% single target, and that's if you believe in LBE sims

the merits of which can be debated

[lament dove]

but gemstone sacrifices a conduit

[balmy condor]

that's fine

[lament dove]

hm, ok, thanks

[balmy condor]

gemstone > conduit

that actually proves true for all the best soulbinds as well

except pelagos

you sacrifice for dauntless duelist on nadjia, for burrs on niya, and gemstone on heirmir

[dark token]

bis list with dashing scoundrel

[balmy condor]

as opposed to?

[dark token]

zoldyck

[balmy condor]

but zoldyck is strictly lower in single target

[dark token]

oh i know, but not by much and its waaay better in every other scenario

[balmy condor]

sure

but that's why the dungeon slice section uses zoldyck

I want the single target section to show true single target bis

[sturdy bobcat]

is there a rotation guide somewhere?

[balmy condor]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[balmy condor]

choose your favorite

[dark token]

i always like the wowhead guides as mystler seems to write them directly from simc apl and they are up to date more often

[restive spire]

im interested to see how main mangle + doomblade is

[balmy condor]

they don't interact

so its just doomblade with a worse conduit

which is... worse....

[restive spire]

oh right assassination isnt allowed to prosper in shadowlands

[balmy condor]

to be fair, conduit/legendary interaction usually isn't allowed

the shadow damage increase conduit on sub was crazy strong because of it

and it got changed

[lapis dragon]

@balmy condor Doomblade counts with Serated Bone Spike? or not really?

[balmy condor]

nope

[lapis dragon]

Assassination is left on draft in every way..

but ill play it just in spite to Blizzard 😄

Sin against the world

[balmy condor]

well its left on draft because it got ignored after they removed borrowed power

not because interactions that shouldn't exist, don't exist

I think blizzard made it very clear from the start they don't want covenant/legendary/soulbind combinations to dictate each other

master assassin + sepsis was an early example

got changed because it forced things like ma, subterfuge, etc

[lapis dragon]

yeah.. that would be fun to have combinations to chose.. but its difficult to blizzard to make that all in balance 🙂 so theyr idea like always is make one direction build that everyone will play and thats fixed 😄

less work for them

[balmy condor]

I don't know what your complaint is

we had a lot of cookie cutter in the last couple expansions

and now we have 4 covenants that are super close, 3 legendaries in single target that are super close, 2 in aoe that are super close

you can actually pick combinations you want

and that's no good either?

hell, even wps/lethal poison is close, and maim isn't far behind

you can even pick the conduit you want

nightstalker, subt, ma are closer than they've ever been

EP isn't bad, blindside is viable

you have so many choices right now to play how you want to without taking big dps hits

[lapis dragon]

also without dealing big dps hits tho

😄

will see how it goes after raid is released

[sturdy bobcat]

Did most rogues of night fae?

[balmy condor]

I think a lot went fae, yeah

[charred wind]

I went necro because its cool

[balmy condor]

lured by the promise of 1% more dps later, and the seductive playstyle of "hit this button on cd and win"

and then there's the sin players that like it because shiv interaction

[outer lodge]

Does sepsis count as a bleed to work with doomblade?

[south drum]

I went fea because it was the ability I liked the most and I'm also sticking it to Blizzard and playing Sin

[balmy condor]

also no

[low girder]

Sepsis is a poison

[outer lodge]

yeah, since it corrupts the blood was just making sure

Kinda torn between dashing, zoldyck and doomblade, kinda leaning doomblade since i think it will be much better in pvp too.

[old snow]

Doomblade does seem kinda nutty to me, we sure zodyck is better? Id still pref zoldyck for hxh refrence

[balmy condor]

yes we are

dashing, doomblade, and zoldyck are all very close in single target

[old snow]

Kk just checking

[balmy condor]

zoldyck crushing doomblade with more

[round rover]

Just a question to all, how did everyone get on with Layer 3 in Torghast Wings this week, (Soul Forge and Upper Reaches) I wasnt able to clear them, even with 165 ilvl.

[old snow]

Leeching poison helps

[balmy condor]

Get another 15 ilvl, and get luckier with torg powers

Would be my suggestion

Hard to tell if you’re actually playing wrong

[round rover]

Haha, yeah I know its a little vague of a comment, I was using leech already and had already maxed out my Mythics but got unlucky on the gear, it was mainly the bosses that slapped too hard, like 5% of HP every 5 seconds plus him hitting for like 2-3K a swing, even with defences and health buffs from Anime Cells, felt a little up against it.

[scenic fox]

Can rogue get something like the 3 million hits mages get in torgast aswell?

[balmy condor]

No

The best you can really do for a “one shot combo” is play sub, and then get super lucky with evisc,/shadowstep powers

And buff that way

[round rover]

Our Pool of buffs seems very small and useless against the bosses most of the time, just my opinion like.

[balmy condor]

But I wouldn’t suggest trying to one shot like that

The covenant powers are very strong

There’s also the jack of all trades one that gives you shadow blades, vendetta and adrenaline rush when you cast one of them

That’s very strong

[round rover]

Yeah only seen that once in all 6 layers across the two wings

[balmy condor]

Hm

I’ve definitely seen it more than that

[oak wren]

Whats the best legendary powers for Assassin?

[balmy condor]

The covenant ones alone are pretty solid

[balmy condor]

Best would be zoldyck

[oak wren]

Hmm.. wouldn't Doomblade be good for ST?

[balmy condor]

It is

Dashing is also good single target

But they both drop off with more targets

[round rover]

Yeah got the sepsis buff a far few times but like the big hitters rarely see, always getting greys and blues around the soulsshift (vulper form)

[balmy condor]

When you get 3 targets, doom blade is actually just a stat stick

[balmy condor]

Sounds like an unlucky run tbh

[oak wren]

Thanks for the help

[balmy condor]

Np

[round rover]

Pfft tell me about it, let's hope this week is better, I want to enjoy it. Well I did for the first 2 layers but layer 3 just was like a cliff face

[hasty hamlet]

If I want to play both sin and sub in different content (raids, dungeons + pvp) is mark of the master assassin gonna be the best bang for my buck until I can craft multiple leggos

[balmy condor]

Yes

[hasty hamlet]

ty ty

[balmy condor]

Np

[real bay]

actually disgusting how easy layer 3s were on my warrior

one shot all

[calm wedge]

did layer 3 with 2 rogues, one sp and one DH as a group

[real bay]

with 150gear

[calm wedge]

was litteraly puking blood

[balmy condor]

I one shot them all on my rogue as well, the first one at 140, which was a little rough

All I play is rogue though

So idk how much of an easier time other classes have

[real bay]

can't get much easier than condemn knockdown with 100% usage

boss does nothing

[balmy condor]

Yeah idk what those words mean

[real bay]

top gameplay

it's like execute but venthyr version

[balmy condor]

Aha

[round rover]

Does in a way feel that unless the powers go in your favour, you struggle, i mean having to 5 man Layer does seem a little crazy, but we are a little gear staved at present.

Well I am atleast.

[restive spire]

duo them with a tank or healer and theyll be a lot easier

some bosses are just

way stronger than others

[round rover]

Yeah does feel that way, i cant recall if Torghast does scale or not?

[restive spire]

yeah theres more mobs in groups with more people and healers and tanks get 40% mob health reduction

disc priest prot pallies blood dks vengeance dh and anything similar can just plow the whole thing regardless of powers

[round rover]

Fair, i thought it would of scalled but if it's just mobs not raw power of the mobs thats not too bad

[dusk lodge]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

**Shadowlands: ** Haste > Versatility => Critical Strike => Mastery

[sick scarab]

we we have doomblade legendary this reset..

[blissful crescent]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[prime schooner]

How you made the 1000 anima today?

There is any new dungeon quesst?

[strange python]

idk about dungeon quests but theres new campaign quests

[stone locust]

!BiS

[prisma monolith]

Whispyrs Bis list: http://tiny.cc/76r5tz

[strange python]

Level 90: Toxic Blade

huh

[placid dawn]

for some reason im getting fucked by the assasins in that one torgast wing, they seem to pop off on me very time 😐

maybe im just trash

[strange python]

they're pre annoying

you're gonna have to use cooldowns

you can kite them a bit with crippling poison

to by time till crimson vial etc

[placid dawn]

yea, trhe problem is that they come more often than I have cooldowns :/

it sucks

[magic fossil]

guys, long story short, we are fucked rn?

[languid totem]

@placid dawn they only come when out of combat. Can cheese it a bit by staying in combat as long as possible to reset CDs. Also, don’t use CDs unless you need to. Namely I held onto vendetta and evasion.

I had at least one floor where they never spawned because I was perpetually in combat. Would try to sap one guy and get in combat with him by killing his friends near by. If I needed sap for a future pull, I’d break the old one. Kite the mob to the next hard pack and repeat.

[hazy crater]

In a pinch can Blind a Mawrat and do something similar to keep yourself in combat, but yeah, couple places where I was putting myself into combat specifically so that assassin would NOT show up.
This week was tougher than last, IMHO, with the end boss that spawns the 3 harm channeling adds being very rough to solo.

[strange python]

I couldn't even down the abomination boss, in fractured chambers, the one who drops poison spread, and at 10 stacks is immune to CC

He was the final boss for me on layer 3 of FC

I'm also ilvl 152 rn, so hopefully once I get better gear this week I can down him

[languid totem]

I had the kyrian combo and found him easy. Resetting, 5 combo point generating kyrian ability is broken and I’ve gotten it every time I’ve done torghast. The 4 runs last week and 2 this week.

[strange python]

ah I'm NF,

I had kind of shit anima power RNG that run anyway,

I'll probably be able to do it next run, if I get decent anima

[languid totem]

If I didn’t get the kyrian ones it would have been hard, but there doesn’t seem to be a lot of variety so it feels pretty consistent.

Throughout the run I feel like I see every common/uncommon/rare power at least once each. Only the epic ones felt unreliable.

[strange python]

Oh yeah its the rares and epics that can make or break a run

and that run I had subpar anima for sure,

What ilvl are you @languid totem

[lament dove]

so what if I'm still undecided between assa and sub and want to make master assassin lego, how do I use that in a dungeon with assa? just start FoK-ing from stealth?

[serene basin]

long time no see, wow

but yeah, buttfucked rn

[pliant wing]

Not better to wait until next patch to craft leg ?

[serene basin]

yeah, depends if you have a priority add on the pack

then you go multilate, since if you open with ambush it only gives you 3 cp

but FoK all long the way

[lament dove]

yeah, but tbh I don't dislike either spec, now that I'm playing sub I kinda like it as well so dunno... and I'm also more into casual m+ nowadays and not sure about raiding so MA is kinda some jack-of-all-trades possibility for me

[pliant wing]

Yea im gonna go try sub too so im not gonna craft a spec leg, MA seems the go to for both pve/pvp

[gleaming eagle]

anyone know a good burst combo that sin can use in pvp ?

that start from stealth

[raven karma]

what mean rn when you say "152rn" plz ?

[languid totem]

I assume rn = right now. 152 might mean ilvl 152 right now.

[gleaming summit]

!bis

[prisma monolith]

Whispyrs Bis list: http://tiny.cc/76r5tz

[lunar whale]

is sin any good rn?

because i feel like i see no sin rogues

[raven karma]

not at top. i think blizard should buff the sin mastery and shive debuff to up our nature damages

[old snow]

what i feel like is going to happen, is instead of buffing sin they might just nerf sub, a lot of people crying that sub is broken

[raven karma]

i dont understand why they said that when you see others classes. some are great

[old snow]

cause sub can one shot pretty much anyone

[serene basin]

doesnt make sense nerfing down sub to sin lvl

buffing sin looks more appropriate

[old snow]

thats not abotu sin being bad, its about sub being too good

they dont care about us sin plebs, they just cry about being one shotted through defensives

[serene basin]

it is a leggo mechs

not a spec

that was the same in legion

they did nothing about it

[bronze lark]

I've always play sin, should I level up with it or should I go sub?

mostly doing campaign until almost 60

[blissful crescent]

I think sin is broken, too white hits and much time between pressing keys for skills... we need a lot of haste and right now it isn't possible.
I will continue playing sin, but if you want level up a new rogue the best option is sub. No doubt.

[fallen crypt]

I leveled as Sub, very smooth, but play what you like

[bronze lark]

tyvm

[bronze lark]

tyvm

[sour helm]

!guides

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
RH: https://www.ravenholdt.net/guides/assassination-rogue-guide-shadowlands-raid-dps/
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide

[primal zinc]

whats the best chest ench?

agility or shadow dmg?

[polar vigil]

!bis

[prisma monolith]

Whispyrs Bis list: http://tiny.cc/76r5tz

[primal zinc]

it doesnt say about the enchant

[floral cradle]

i didn't max out soul ash - how fucked am i?

[primal zinc]

guys

doe any1 know the best ench for chest raid content?

stats or shadow dmg?

[floral cradle]

it does, you have to click the item links - you can see 'enchant 6214' on the chest, which if you click it, is Eternal Skirmish (agi)

[primal zinc]

oh sorry

and thanks

didnt notice

plz love my stupidity

❤️

[serene basin]

@balmy condor i simmed my toon and got minimal diference in dps with NS and with Subterfg. But subterfuge got on top

but it says the soulbinds and covenants are not being included in the sim

[inland ridge]

How does sin faire against sub atm?

Played sin in legion, skipped bfa mostly

[real bay]

badly

needs a big buff

[serene basin]

Sub wins

[strange python]

anyone wanna do normal ToP first boss farm for legendary? forming a group just now

[ripe gulch]

sin is ded 😦

[balmy condor]

Subt, NS and MA are all super close. If you’re simming from armory, it won’t include covenant stuff so much sure you always import for the addon

[fleet whale]

you can farm heroic Theater now for the leggo, heroic dungeons no longer have a daily lockout

and evidently leggos have a higher drop rate on heroic

[sturdy bobcat]

Sin will get a buff and be top 😉

[fleet whale]

who knows

[balmy condor]

Probably not

[fleet whale]

Sin isn't even the lowest simming spec atm, which is unfortunate

blizz may not even buff it

[quaint dragon]

Can u get zoldyck this week?

[balmy condor]

No

[ripe gulch]

sin was the best for raid since they killed sub tho

last expansion

and it does scale with haste

so later down the line its gonna be strong

[balmy condor]

Oh my god

[low girder]

Oh no not the scaling again

[balmy condor]

When will it end

[fleet whale]

can people please stop saying this scaling shit

first off, scaling in SL is entirely different

[balmy condor]

Don’t ever say this again please

[fleet whale]

every secondary DR's hard at a certain point

second off, "stat scaling" hasn't been a thing since like MoP

it almost should be a pin imo