assassination

[deep quartz]

Noice

[pulsar zealot]

outlaw isn't the go to rogue spec atm?

[royal lantern]

totaly non-biased opinion btw

[slim hamlet]

dom is

[balmy condor]

haha, bad

[marble hemlock]

You'll get a different answer in each of the 3 spec channels

[slim hamlet]

Yep

Incredibly bad decision

Can still make T5 with the concentraded infusion thingy with inspiration next week tho

[royal lantern]

i mean, we could be honest and say "the best spec is probably affliction, destruction or demology"

[slim hamlet]

Just did the math

[pulsar zealot]

is exsanguinate still taken after it was made a 3 min cd?

[slim hamlet]

No warlock is bad

and should be buffed

[royal lantern]

for KB build yes

[deep quartz]

I main DH and have played mage, pally, hunter, and warrior. I’ve always stated away from rouge because it seemed overwhelming since the dots thing and combos but I’m gonna being giving it a full send this season

[slim hamlet]

So yes always because DTB is illegal 🙂

[flint ridge]

Whispyr you think with exsang dtb perform better if I'm a troll?

[slim hamlet]

Oof be careful about saying you main DH in this chat

[trim dirge]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[balmy condor]

I mean you certainly would be trolling

[deep quartz]

Why peeps hate DH cuz it’s the easiest class lol

I just enjoy the class Illidan is awesome

[slim hamlet]

Because they click hunt in you in world pvp and legit destroy your entire pc setup

[deep quartz]

True

[next arch]

I just don't like dh's because they're edgy illidan fanboys

[royal lantern]

bruh, hating dh is cringe

[pulsar zealot]

wait so according to the spreadsheet, DTB is better than KB?

[slim hamlet]

If Tryan says it it's true

[deep quartz]

XD it’s true tho

[royal lantern]

different dmg patterns and strenghts, cant just say "X is better always"

[flint ridge]

i think rogues hate DHs because in arena they can unstealth us. and also in class fantasy-wise, we feel our place as the agility type melee threatened by their existence.

[swift dagger]

at bis gear at least

[slim hamlet]

In numbers ye

[pulsar zealot]

got it. but do y'all still prefer KB over DTB?

[slim hamlet]

Yea

[shadow breach]

dhs are way too easy for the rewarding numbers they pull KEKW

[royal lantern]

stop bringing up difficulty

[slim hamlet]

More execute and more fun, but I believe they're so close it really doesnt matter

[royal lantern]

[deep quartz]

I wana main rouge specifically assassin I just don’t really know anything about them and I don’t have any friends in my guild who main rouge

[slim hamlet]

Make us

[next arch]

Just jump in and learn

[deep quartz]

In every fantasy rpg I play I always go rogue

But wow is sweaty

[royal lantern]

the most difficulty part is ||deez nuts||

[slim hamlet]

Fuck

Well I'll be switching to DH to get off this discord

[marble hemlock]

@balmy condor are the nerfs to assa rogue fine considering we scale better than the other specs? Maybe we're just supposed to be worse in the first tier

[slim hamlet]

gl in df

[marble hemlock]

Please don't ban me

[tacit otter]

and dont forget the haste!!! the haste will come back to us big time scaling

[atomic temple]

can i use shadowlands weap0on enchants or is it not good?

[royal lantern]

we only scale better after we reached 34%crit seli

[slim hamlet]

Even hit him with the ping

Will more gear impact our opener @balmy condor

[balmy condor]

pretty sure they don't work

[atomic temple]

o

[swift dagger]

they dont work

[marble hemlock]

I already have that

Not scaling

Bug

[royal lantern]

seli reached S C A L I N G

[dense cedar]

scaling is waht the dragons do

🦎

[slim hamlet]

[royal lantern]

so you are telling me, when we get dracthyr rogues, we scaled even more???

[slim hamlet]

x2

[dense cedar]

why do you have to be so mean, such poor behaviour smh

[slim hamlet]

[plucky thistle]

I cant figure out Deathmark and Exsanguine. I read guide on wowhead but basicaly you want to do opener and do Exs with Vanish and on last sec use Vanish after used Exs use Garrote and after that Deathmark? When do i use proc trinkets? How Deathmark work do i need apply bleeds after Deathmark or i can apply bleeds + kingsbade and after that Deathmark ecalculates them with that 100% buff? What is this sentence of dealing 100% of normal damage? So if i apply Garrote from Vanish and use Deathmark it dont count that Vanish Buff but count as normal Garrote?

[royal lantern]

uuuuhhhh

thats alot of words

[plucky thistle]

Yeah strugling with Assa on Dragonflight 😄

[dense cedar]

[true pelican]

it's possible, I can 100% a 405 with embellishment + missive

[royal lantern]

you mean how you use exsang and dm?

[plucky thistle]

y

[dense cedar]

Deathmark simply updates based on your current bleeds

Deathmark counts as a bleed also

[royal lantern]

basicly, you want to use exsang before DM

[dense cedar]

so you can't use exsang during its duration

[royal lantern]

and never exsang DURING DM

[dense cedar]

or you half the full power of it also

[royal lantern]

cus exsang cuts DM's duration in half

[dense cedar]

since its all tied to its bleed

[slim hamlet]

Whispyr will come for you if you use exsang in dm

[royal lantern]

and when you use exsang, you let the exsang bleeds run out, cus when you apply new bleeds, the exsang speedup is gone

so tl:dr is

you vanish->garrote(stronger garrote)->exsang->dm

you let that garrote run out, and when it reaches 0 you instantly apply a new one

[plucky thistle]

dont you want vanish->garrote(stronger garrote)->exsang->garrote(stronger garrote)>dm?

[marble hemlock]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1019199475421552651/1046273672937230466/unknown.png

[marble hemlock]

Straight from the faq

[dense cedar]

the new garrote won't have exsang

[balmy condor]

if you exsang->garrote you overwrite the exsang and waste the cd

[dense cedar]

so u just deleted it

[plucky thistle]

Ok i get it so get that EXS Garrot to 0

I check that faq ty

[royal lantern]

tbf

you want the empowered garrote to run out aswell

instead of overwriting it

[dense cedar]

yeah at your next 2 minute

you'll vanish and garrote before DM

you want that to also completely fall off

[royal lantern]

empowered dot=you dont overwrite, let it "fall off"

[dense cedar]

fall off like Tryan 😩

[plucky thistle]

And one question about haste? I have 6% now and i run out of energy sometimes in M+ talents . Do i need more haste or is it normal?

[flint ridge]

man so the best ST on paper is the least fun one with no kingsbane, exsag snapshot, kyrian into rupture. 😦

[royal lantern]

haste does almost nothing for energy reg

assa is just a slower spec overall

[plucky thistle]

Ok ty

[lofty bluff]

how good is tempered M+ build relative to IC?

[flint ridge]

it's now slightly worse due to poison bomb nerfs. it used to like be the better option on tyrnanical weeks

[slim hamlet]

Enough to where youre bricking yourself

[topaz bluff]

It's slightly worse numbers wise, but it does offer an easier playstyle (imo) that is still completely viable.

[rapid forum]

any macro shenanigans to combine mutilate and ambush or 2 seperate binds?

[flint ridge]

just checked the spreadsheets and the current DTB doesn't use shrouded suffocation (I might be tripping). so this means this opener is innacurate atm. pls correct me if i'm wrong.

[limber lion]

Just use 2 separate binds

[balmy condor]

Not that isn’t omega jank

[limber lion]

It's not worth the hassle

[balmy condor]

Yep, gar sbs snd

Waiting on new visuals

[copper hazel]

dadsen too busy dancing on England football graves

[balmy condor]

@verbal mantle real?

[topaz bluff]

I didnt find GSE too bad, but the visuals might throw you off until you get use to it

[verbal mantle]

Im not that evil

[analog anchor]

!guide

[prisma monolith]

Assassination Guides:
Wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/assassination-rogue-guide
IV: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pve-dps-guide
Method: https://www.method.gg/guides/assassination-rogue

[royal lantern]

you are french

[flint ridge]

Gar sbs snd gar kyrian into rupture vanish gar dm?

[analog anchor]

!sims

[prisma monolith]

Simulations:
Herodamage: https://www.herodamage.com/rogue/
Bloodmallet: https://bloodmallet.com/index.html

[analog anchor]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[balmy condor]

definitely not

That second gar isn’t empowered

You just gar sbs snd mut mut rup deathmark shiv er env

[sour mango]

I find myself running out of energy frequently on assass what could be the problem? am I not supposed to dump into mutilate envenom?

[balmy condor]

The problem is that you think it’s a problem

[sour mango]

it's not a problem?

[balmy condor]

No that’s literally just how the spec works

[royal lantern]

its litearlly how assassination works

[amber sand]

Pool energy unless bursting it’s not outlaw

[royal lantern]

you playe the zoomer adhd assa version rn

normaly it has WAY more frequent downtimes

[sour mango]

I am very new Im sorry and am reading up on alot of the stuff

[balmy condor]

Yeah

[trim zinc]

Pooling??;-;

[balmy condor]

Assassination is slower

[sour mango]

so basically after burst dont use thistle tea?

[balmy condor]

Thistle tea for energy yeah

[amber sand]

🏊‍♂️

[sour mango]

It feels kinda like fire mage and thats my old main but u know what happened to fire mage

[balmy condor]

How far BEHIND? I guess it’s -1.5% behind

[sour mango]

always wanted to play assass gave me a reason to 🙂

[balmy condor]

It does not

[sour mango]

Is there anyone willing to watch me smack a target dummy and give me some tips?

[amber sand]

@balmy condor is your wowhead or FAQ channel the same? Or is one more updated/recent?

[balmy condor]

FaQ is always quicker to update

[amber sand]

Sweet thanks

[balmy condor]

Wowhead is getting a big update on Monday though

For the upcoming season 1 changes

It’ll include the exsang nerfs and pb nerfs and all that

[trim zinc]

but like, do we actually pool energy at some time, or like just smash things when u have energy for it??

[sour mango]

Im not sure but i think we pool when we have things line up

or have at least one TT for a cd

major cd-

[balmy condor]

If you got ep and envenom running and don’t need to refresh anything, you can pool

[dense herald]

You’d want to pool to space out EP and envenom

[sour mango]

what is ep?

[balmy condor]

It’s super min-max though

[balmy condor]

Elaborate planning

[sour mango]

ok tysm 🙂

[dense cedar]

Read the talents in your builds please

[sour mango]

I have I just dont know the phrasing for them yet

[trim zinc]

like other day i asked if waiting to max the ep uptime would be good, same thing right?

[balmy condor]

Yeah

But it’s like 0.3%

Or some shit

It’s so meaningless

Should you do it? Sure I guess

But if you don’t know what you’re doing

It’s whatever

[trim zinc]

make sense, its like u have better things to worry about first i guess

[balmy condor]

It’s always very interesting

[oak pulsar]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[balmy condor]

Cause on the one hand I’ll get questions like “if I’m 3 target aoe and there’s 2 adds spawning in 10 seconds and 1 of the 3 mobs dies in 5 seconds, is it worth clipping pandemic on rupture to snipe the energy so I can pool combo points for the spawn?”

But then 30 seconds later it’ll be like “why don’t the builds take subterfuge? Doesn’t it buff garrote?”

And you have to tell them to read the talent

It’s quite a whiplash sometimes

[tacit otter]

whats the answer to the first question?

[balmy condor]

The answer to the first question is please leave me alone

[earnest imp]

lmao

[trim zinc]

LMAO

[topaz bluff]

lol

[dense cedar]

@balmy condor if I’m 3 target aoe and there’s 2 adds spawning in 10 seconds and 1 of the 3 mobs dies in 5 seconds, is it worth clipping pandemic on rupture to snipe the energy so I can pool combo points for the spawn?

i am dead

[balmy condor]

Keep Yourself Safe buddy

[royal lantern]

@balmy condor do you want a hug

[trim zinc]

but @balmy condor whats the haste and crit breakpoint??

[subtle tundra]

so after the pb nerf is outlaw better in m+?

[balmy condor]

Working on it but it’s pretty much whatever

If you don’t have ss, don’t Double garrote

If you do, double garrote

If you take exsang, max pandemic

Figure out the rest from there

Kinda hate the talent tree from a guide writing perspective because there’s too many damn variables

Dragon tempered
Kingsbane
Dragon tempered cleave
Kingsbane cleave
dragon tempered exsang
Kingsbane exang
Dragon tempered cleave exsang
Kingsbane cleave exsang
Dragon tempered m+
Kingsbane m+
Dragon tempered m+ exsang
Kingsbane m+ exsang
With sbs
Without sbs
With ss
Without ss

Like

Bruh

Fucking end me

[outer lodge]

Yeah, that seems miserable

[balmy condor]

“What’s opener if I take kingsbane sbs and no ss and dance instead of er and no tea?”

Bro idfk

[royal lantern]

you forgot "change to 12 talents happend 6min ago, why no updates????"

[marble hemlock]

whats the opener if i dont assign any talents?

[balmy condor]

Yeah the strat is basically just “there are dtb and kingsbane in st and m+, if you decide to do something different, figure it out

[royal lantern]

ambush->sinester strike until full cp->eviscerate

i should be a guide writer

[sick aspen]

Did you ever figure out the tinker from stream the other day Whispyr?

[balmy condor]

The what

[royal lantern]

ah yes, the warlock approach

[topaz bluff]

but when do I use CT?

[balmy condor]

[royal lantern]

when do i use tea?

and when sbs?

[vocal seal]

just use it lol 😂

[sick aspen]

nelth tinker I think it was?

[balmy condor]

Idk what that is

[sick aspen]

ok

[royal lantern]

the flamethrower

[balmy condor]

Oh

That shits GARBAGE

[royal lantern]

people see big number=its good

+they still want that BEST PROFESSION FOR PROGRESS????

[mellow dagger]

hi @balmy condor , I could find the pre raid bis trinket list but not the raid trinket bis list. is there one?>

[balmy condor]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[mellow dagger]

@balmy condor thank you

[outer marten]

Me, as engi for bots and whatnot, hoping tinkers get buffed because I chose to spec for bracers/goggles

[royal lantern]

they will rather nerf them lol

[balmy condor]

same image

[brazen zodiac]

lol

[topaz bluff]

For most of us embellishments dont make a big enough difference to matter. They'll likely flip-flop on a content by content basis. Everybody need crafted daggers and wraps this cycle, next cycle it might be some silly belt or engi thing.

[dense herald]

You need to sign someone on for an apprenticeship to do the writing

[subtle tundra]

i wanna get a mug with a wow related logo on it, maybe ravenhold logo?

[lethal heart]

any smart person knows how to sim multiple races at once

[balmy condor]

its not that I need help writing it's that I need people to stop expecting answers for every situation with every talent build imaginable and do some thinking on their own

[lethal heart]

[balmy condor]

I try my best to teach people how to play

but sometimes it feels like I'm just giving answers to the test

rather than teaching the material

because people insist on just having the answers

rather than understanding

[dense herald]

Teach a man to fish feed him for a lifetime

[balmy condor]

yeh it's tricky

cause it's a lot quicker to give a man a fish

and I don't have time to teach 300 men how to fish

but I do have time to give 300 fish

[royal lantern]

free fish

[dense herald]

Doesn’t make it easy when tuning keeps happening and new optimisations keep being found im sure. Once things are a bit more stable I’m sure it’ll be easier

[balmy condor]

pins in #wow-general

[balmy condor]

100%

[dense herald]

Just rough as for you now

[balmy condor]

one of the hardest things about launches is trying to keep everything updated

cause it just aint possible

takes enough time to update the spreadsheet and put new stuff into the faq

but then having to update wowhead and method on top of it

and people expecting it to be done within like 4 hours

just ain't happenin

oh exsang is 3 min now?

find all 73 places where you talk about exsang

and update all of them

[topaz bluff]

then mythic raid tuning happens, yay!

[balmy condor]

don't remind me

[storm zinc]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[lethal heart]

@balmy condor give me free fish for iskaar rep

[balmy condor]

[trim zinc]

lmao

[balmy condor]

that's quite a long way back

how bout we don't ping him for something from 2 days ago

[trim zinc]

mb

;-;

[topaz bluff]

and now we got embellishments to min/max over too. Maybe we'll get more things like cowl+ring so we can ask whispyr to figure out the procs on procs on procs and if its another 0.03% gain!

[balmy condor]

getting tuned

can't win

[slim hamlet]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[dark token]

Wait if you craft a shit dagger then recraft it with r3 mats for quality 5 don't you save a ton of gold

Since recraft materials required is less than original, you are providing less rank 3 mats?

[royal lantern]

yes

with a good crafter, dont even need rank3 mats for the re-craft

🙂

[dark token]

Yeah let me find someone who can craft 405 embellish dag with crit mast and rank1 mats

[royal lantern]

i can

[dark token]

Pic wtf

Wowhead needs to make a crafting calc

It would be pretty easy to code up

Just needs a lot of game data

[fluid steppe]

why is assa rogue keep getting nerfed? i dont get it

[dark token]

Cause we are too strong

[fluid steppe]

yeah before the nerfs XD

[dark token]

... exactly

[fluid steppe]

they could at least do exsanguinate 2min cd for the line up with deathmark

now it feels wanky with the 3 min cd on exsanguinate

[next arch]

But that wouldn't have been a good enough nerf

[deft flicker]

Make it a 50% tick rate increase with 2min cd

A bit weaker compared to current one, but easily combined with mark

[fluid steppe]

yep

how good is the tier-set for assa rogue?

[slim hamlet]

So do we just use Algethar puzzle box before deathmark

[fluid steppe]

before your burst

[teal bloom]

I think it's before deathmark or before exsang if talented

[slim hamlet]

Yeah if not talented do you know if we wait to use it to sync with dm or we just flip it on cd

[plain flax]

Dude with ex Sam nerf still slapping dw

[slim hamlet]

what?

[fluid steppe]

it does yeah but the problem is after that

[strange python]

Guys elusive is recruiting again should I join

[plain flax]

Why if things stay like this single target is sick cleave and stuff has been ok im@running dtb build mythic and does well and raid be fine don’t worry

Have faith in the dots

[fluid steppe]

i was hoping that assa gonna be the best rogue spec for raiding

https://tenor.com/view/kill-yourself-killing-me-smalls-bowing-godfather-xoxo-gif-13754720

[slim hamlet]

no idea what that is

[plain flax]

Well I think it is in my view …but I hate people giving in shiz depends on the player .

[slim hamlet]

I will prob run dtb in m+ tbh

[strange python]

40 hour overtime to get hall of Fame guild that's a big fan of yelling the n word during raid

[slim hamlet]

At least until I know the dungeons better, cba thinking about 20 things at once

[fluid steppe]

wtf?

[slim hamlet]

Sounds bis

[strange python]

Lol they're well known

[plain flax]

@slim hamlet im running it and can do like near 40k overall which is sweet in my view

[slim hamlet]

Even tho KB + IC should be better im also doing 5-10k more overall with dtb currently

Will prob be better in keystones

[plain flax]

I liked kb and ic but was talking with whisper and said give it a go and love it I have less to think@about and still do nice damage more time to focus on cx etc ya know ints

Cc

[fluid steppe]

yeah

[slim hamlet]

The whole reason i tried sin out instead of outlaw was because of IC

and now it just feels weird

Also PB is just crisp

[dark token]

everyone says should be better

[slim hamlet]

adrenaline when it hits

[dark token]

its not better

sims the same

or worse

and harder to play

[slim hamlet]

it is simming like 1-2% better

[dark token]

with tier set maybe

[plain flax]

I guess it’s nice to just do what’s right for you . Ya know

I like seeing poison bomb under loads of ads 🙂

[slim hamlet]

same

[plain flax]

We see when raid and m plus goes right just gotta keep the faith I haven’t seen anyone put any Assis rogue footage on YouTube or anyone doing anything which sucks hopefully more come up with something to boost others and show can do great dps

[slim hamlet]

sin youtubers dont exisrt

[plain flax]

That’s it I’m doing one haha

[austere steppe]

@marble hemlock hijacking my hunt group

[outer lodge]

If i crafted a dagger earlier this week with no adornmnet, can i recraft it now with a higher ilvl and attach an adornment?

[oak pulsar]

adornment are still broken im pretty sure do not put one on yet

[solar tangle]

is there any way to track via WA if a improved garrote is on the target or the normal one?

[dark token]

yes

check luxthos WA

!wa

[prisma monolith]

Assassination WA's:
https://wago.io/SJLQKGjMM (Afenar's Group)
https://wago.io/LuxthosRogueDragonflight (Luxthos's Group)
https://wago.io/ByzCxPq-m (Devlin's Group)

[dark token]

grab this one + garrote + rupture WA if you dont want his pack

[marble hemlock]

more like carrying

[gentle roost]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[austere steppe]

https://gyazo.com/70c35487ceeae9cb419235fefe124f57

u w0t m8

kidding

1 last hunt and done

[marble hemlock]

i popped cds on the previous one, didnt even see you on meters there

[austere steppe]

i was afk outside the cave tbf

i've been at this for too long my brains fried

[flint tusk]

So how much DPS loss in terms of sims would be deamed "acceptable" to replace puzzle box?

[acoustic sky]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[livid bronze]

sorry for the question that has been probably asked alot but didnt see a pin for it, is exsang still a good point with the cd nerf or have we moved it elsewhere coupled with the PB nerf?

[drifting light]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[drifting light]

u can check for yourself how it stands as of now

[hasty vale]

is this the correct DTB build to be running?

I've just seen two floating around so I was wondering which was the correct build

[drifting light]

the one that sims better, so probably this one

there is a second one with SS instead of 2 points into zodiac i think, but it sims a tiny bit lower

[plain flax]

That’s the raid one gier I think

I didn’t know Pb got a nerf only saw exsan on wowhead

[hasty vale]

Ya pb got hit as well.

Also ty for the answers.

[plain flax]

Where is the info to that ? And how hard was it ?

[drifting light]

check pins

[hasty vale]

Poison Bomb’s chance to trigger reduced to 4/8% per combo point (was 5/10%).

[plain flax]

Hmm could still be play able then I feel

Check when back away right now

[outer marten]

Think sims said PB nerf was like 1-1.5% overall loss st?

[hasty vale]

Im still in the air as to either playing sub or sin.

[sullen hedge]

question.. if i have my dots rolling, and then i got a proc, like an agility and a master proc, do i need to reapply my dots to get that benefit or will the current dots be buffed?

[outer marten]

My plan is to play DTB unless there’s an amp phase or long execute boss

[teal bloom]

Dots are dynamic, no need to reapply

[sullen hedge]

okay awesome

[outer marten]

Only dots that still snapshot are feral bleeds iirc

[sullen hedge]

ahh okay

[plain flax]

I love ass can’t change just wondering if pure st to use in on. It yes prob stay Dtb once in excite we catch up on damage

[teal bloom]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[plain flax]

To be fair though first raid so I’d go in use one build if wipe try the other and just switch for feel right

[outer marten]

Question: does CB on an ability like KB only effect initial hit, or dot applied as well? Essentially, would the 100% crit snapshot the dot, and would it continue to apply through amping the dot?

[worthy stone]

!stats

[prisma monolith]

The following is a general recommendation, but you will always get more accurate results through simming your gear through Top Gear.
Crit >= Mastery > Haste > Versatility
Note: In high mythic+ keys, you may want more Versatility to survive. While you may see this on high end players gear, this is generally worse DPS. For pure DPS, Versatility is mostly avoided.

[teal bloom]

@outer marten no the dot isn't affected, it would be very over powered if entire kb dot could crit :D

[outer marten]

I didn’t figure so, but was unsure because of how it interacts with sectec

[teal bloom]

I think they fixed the interaction with sectec

[outer marten]

Since sectec is essentially a short burst dot.
They fixed the unintended interaction yes, but it’s technically a buff.
Previously wasn’t being applied to initial hit which is physical, and then would bug. So the slight delay play meant the two clones crit, and then next ability would consume.
Now it’s just used before sectec and affects the whole ability

[teal bloom]

Okay 🤔

[indigo ginkgo]

what are the best leather boots from craft ? the ones that -hast and blast toxic or nthe ones thats - stamina ?

[outer marten]

On the back of your question: it seems that items with predetermined effects count towards embellishment limit?

[balmy condor]

They’re both bad

If you’re going to craft boots just craft one of them

And then get rid of them later

[indigo ginkgo]

pre raid gear of curse

[balmy condor]

There’s just better embellishments

[indigo ginkgo]

can you name ?

[outer marten]

Bronzed grip wrappings are the best, but can’t get yet. Pattern is boe drop from Vault

[indigo ginkgo]

thanks

[outer marten]

2nd best is Elemental Lariat neck

[strange python]

Until blizzard buffs them by 800% in week 6 and makes everyone annoyed

[plain flax]

@balmy condor have you done any testing on dtb mythic plus and the kb and if after pb nerf still around similar damage overall if don’t mind your say buddy

[balmy condor]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[balmy condor]

PB nerfs aren’t live

Kinda rough to test anything

My spreadsheet is updated though

[plain flax]

Ah my bad I presume just from weds right

Yeah I saw thank you for adding it just wonderd on your personal view

[balmy condor]

I don’t think the change does anything

Just make dtb a little worse in keys

Wont really change much

[plain flax]

Fair one thank you

[balmy condor]

Np

[strange python]

Do we have any idea what the embellishments tuning gonna look like?

Or just casual no communication from blizz

[balmy condor]

nop

[slim hamlet]

hopefully they buff instead of nerf

[balmy condor]

idk

[slim hamlet]

would be sad if embellished is not that much better than bis

[balmy condor]

I think embellishments are fine where they are

[slim hamlet]

Like professions being useful even very late

[weak horizon]

is the tuning going in at reset?

[balmy condor]

if it's more then it's just why bother

crafted gear paywall for dps pog

right now at least you don't lose much really

[slim hamlet]

Yeah what I meant is I hope they make shitty embellish on par or close to the best ones

instead of nerfing the best ones

so embellishment isnt just like .1% dps increase here you go

But tbh making them yourself really aint expensive

[outer marten]

I’d like to see an expansion on the embellishment idea.
Like corruptions lite, but crafted

[slim hamlet]

I'm at a loss of like 5k max for getting 80 skill on bs

[strange python]

I assume they want to make LW stuff not-awful as the tuning. But who knows

[slim hamlet]

I love crafting being a thing

[strange python]

65 is the soft cap on professions and it's an enormous pain in the ass to get higher

Imo a huge miss

[slim hamlet]

For Blacksmithing yes

and LW i believe?

Tailoring prob too

But everything else if fine right?

[outer marten]

Me too. Ive always been a crafter/gatherer. I’ve gotten so much out of the changes.
Tbh, it’s a bit frustrating that I can’t do what I’ve always done though.
By this time, I’d have every single prof maxed out, making money

[strange python]

LW yes. At 65 you only rank up with epics, toys that cost 200 leather, and the armor kits that cost 6k to make each.

[balmy condor]

I love crafting being a thing as well, but I think if they're more than 1% over bis per slot

kinda fucking ridiculous

[slim hamlet]

As long as it is 1-2 pieces max I think it's fine

If it werent unique it would be

kinda insane

[outer marten]

Imo, simply solution: crafters should be able to recraft any item to add embellishments

Eh, maybe not. Would diminish the whole idea of how crafted gear works.
Carry on, idea wasn’t thought through

[cloud moat]

Why is vanish popped after deathmark and not after kingsbane? What am I missing here

Don't you delay kingsbane by popping vanish after deathmark (and presumably using the ambush from the dropped stealth?)

[strange python]

Which build and rotation are you referring to

[cloud moat]

St raid kingsbane build

[strange python]

You pop vanish before deathmark there? To refresh garrote before exsang

[cloud moat]

Does vanish give a buff I'm unaware of

[pure spoke]

vanish garrote then deathmark

[cloud moat]

Maybe I read something wrong initially lol mb

[strange python]

I don't know what the optimization is for the second vanish, but I would be shocked if you didn't hold vanish for second exsang

[keen spruce]

do we still let exang buffed bleeds run all the way to 0 before refreshing?

[strange python]

Yes

[keen spruce]

[trim zinc]

imp garrote and ss

[strange python]

Vanish in the DTB build without exsang gives much less benefit

[slim hamlet]

Does mastery work on PB?

[balmy condor]

yes

[trim zinc]

just vanish on cd to imp garrote right?

[strange python]

Probably. Right before or right after DM, though again, gut says the exact timing there probably isn't the biggest deal

But no shrouded suff makes it a much smaller cd

[bold lodge]

is there a way to get a 370+ dagger without crafting and while being saved to m0? I've been farming blisterhide but im stuck with a 350 dagger

[tacit otter]

rares are scaled around your ilvl, so yeah

[dull crypt]

Pyrhus dropped a dagger for me

[outer marten]

If you can get a matrix, upgrade the standard dagger instead of wasting spark like I did

Alt has shortblade smithing, got matrix from world quest. Q4 dagger at 381 with crit+mast

[dark token]

its not a waste, recraft next week

but yes i think matrix IV craft is better due to embellesh bug

[reef frigate]

What is more significant for our dmg? Pots or phial?

[balmy condor]

phials

kind of a weird thing to ask tho ain't it

they aren't exclusive

you use both

[reef frigate]

I'm planning my alchemist build.

[balmy condor]

I see

[strange python]

That assumes dagger stays bis

[outer marten]

Aye, I should’ve phrased the statement better. Don’t use spark because of bug lol

[royal lantern]

chances are high, that assassination will still use daggers until next tier

[strange python]

Unless it's nerfed or others yet omegabuffed

[outer marten]

Wait, why wouldn’t we use daggers?

[cyan surge]

Is a 72k crit on kingsbane normal or should it be higher? I'm m0 geared at 30% mastery.

[royal lantern]

it was a "assa is using daggers as its only weapon" stupid joke

[strange python]

The crafted one might get nerfed. Or other crafted pieces might get nerfed

[outer marten]

Ahh lol. Went right over my head

[strange python]

I mean I crafted a 405 with fang, so clearly I see value in using spark there. But people should be aware the dagger/fang/wrappings might get nerfed after the first tuning pass

[royal lantern]

oh no

then you only have a high ilvl weapon for progress

and the emblishment now does 0,2%less dmg then the next best one

the horror /s

[strange python]

You're being obtuse.

[slim hamlet]

true tho

[strange python]

There's a nonzero chance blizzard makes boots and neck better and some people wouldn't want to have used their spark

[royal lantern]

you act as if the spark next week is the final one for the entire tier

when we get a new one in 2weeks

[cloud moat]

Holup what embellish bug

[slim hamlet]

pin

[strange python]

I'm not. You're just being argumentative

[cloud moat]

Ty

[royal lantern]

and then unlock the "endless" sparks somewhere later

[gray crest]

"youre just being argumentative" yet everytime i see you talking in this discord youre arguing with someone

[royal lantern]

@strange python i know what you mean man, trust me, but for me its more like, people in general make way to much fuzz about that stuff when in reality we talk about such extremely minor differences

[strange python]

There's a lot of bad information in this channel.

[royal lantern]

i really doubt that blizz will decied "oh, we nerf fangs and bronze by 50% and buff leather snowballs by 300%" in 2 weeks (yes, that is an exaggerate example if you didnt notice)

[strange python]

Heroic raiders see whispyr say something and then repeat their own version of it without context

[cursive igloo]

alwas does

[royal lantern]

like, is there even a big reason to expect a "big emblishemnt change"...?

or is there something im missing here? if yes, my fault

[balmy condor]

they're tuning it

we know they are

[strange python]

Other than max saying he heard it from blizzard?

[balmy condor]

we just don't know to what

[strange python]

That's pretty fucking reliable

[royal lantern]

then you just craft a new one on your stuff....?

[cursive igloo]

cant yet with the bug

[strange python]

Holy fuck man

How can you expect me to not make at you for this

[cursive igloo]

but i still crafted the dagger regardless cause ill slap the embelish on when i can

[royal lantern]

dude, when they change the stuff, they will also fix the bug, like bruh

[slim hamlet]

If max says it then it happens

lets be real

[cursive igloo]

oh deff 100%

let alone like you said no use crying over small %'s

[smoky phoenix]

Idk what to do, wait till next week for raid + m+?

I dont really wanna farm keys now that basement is fixed

[strange python]

No one's crying jfc

[smoky phoenix]

Im in tears tbh

[strange python]

People ask if they should craft now. They get told to wait. Then people spew misinformstion about how it doesn't matter.

It's the same thing every four hours

And it's usually one of the four same people

[worthy timber]

how have you gotten your renown that high? i seem to be struggling

[slim hamlet]

I just simply dont have a life

[cursive igloo]

it was easier till they nerfed it lots and lots of dirty farming

[strange python]

Most reps are spammavle

[royal lantern]

by that logic, we should never tell people anything, cus stuff will change

[slim hamlet]

I've done everything in the game for rep besides mindnumbing grinds

[worthy timber]

i havent even hit 10 on any of them yet

[hollow river]

why are we waiting? higher ilvl and multiple sparks required for it?

i'm curious

[slim hamlet]

I have not farmed anything besides half a renown for hunts

[cursive igloo]

pin

[strange python]

Sparks

[hollow river]

oo

[cinder grotto]

Are there any good items to craft for Sin or is it all just tier in the end?

[slim hamlet]

Did loremaster on my rogue, hit 10 with them all

[cinder grotto]

Leatherworking

[strange python]

Would feel bad to spark on dagger now then need boots and neck

[slim hamlet]

then did all ofthem with darkmoon + 100% extra until 10

on alt

[strange python]

Two weeks isn't so bad to wait but again. People are asking and they should be aware

[topaz bluff]

The part that doesn't matter is that even if the numbers were to stay what they are for embellishments it would still have such little impact 99% of the player base could pick what they want and it's likely not going to effect their outcomes.

[hollow river]

yeh idm waiting who needs more ilvl for WQs

[light goblet]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[slim hamlet]

Also im hitting tuskarr 18 in 10 mins, so only need half a renown with valdrakken, which I would have had if wq's for them werent bugged

[grim tangle]

even if the dagger with embelishment ends up not being BIS, it's still probably the best thing to craft first since it's probably by far the biggest upgrade

but it won't be BIS in 2 months? who cares

[cursive igloo]

especially for lack of daggers atm

[royal lantern]

but that is literally the "very minor difference that doesn't make a real difference for 99,999999999% of players" part man

yes, you play at a higher lvl, you are telling me that the dagger emblishment beeing 0,3%worse then boots, and they dont have it then for 2 weeks, will now actually affect anything except sim dps for the normal wr 300-1000 guy that plays the game and is in a class discord asking questions?

[worthy timber]

guess i need a guide lol cause i feel so lost trying to find quests and wq's

[cursive igloo]

and if your rng isnt doing well

[smoky phoenix]

I just wish i didn't have to be rep 13 with tuskar to get the cool fin tail for dragon

[strange python]

People like to optimize. The type of person who comes in here asking what the optimal craft is should get the context of what's happening instead of being told "lol it doesn't matter fuck u"

[slim hamlet]

when im done with my dung i can explain more i guess

[topaz bluff]

We expected some tuning (at least I did) back at the start when I asked whispyr to check the cowl and it turned out to be a DPS loss, 😂

[royal lantern]

thats some "you need to play night elf or you are trolling as outlaw" stuff

[strange python]

No

[topaz bluff]

It is

[slim hamlet]

Yeah

[cursive igloo]

people ask people should know they change but a majority

[slim hamlet]

reportable

[cursive igloo]

just want a goal

to work towards

[strange python]

It's someone asking "what race is best for outlaw" and someone says "night elf but it's not that big of a deal" and tryan showing up to spew bad information

I don't understand why the four of you have such an issue with people being given context

[balmy condor]

that's just cause it doesn't proc from grieftorch, but it does from the ring

because.... reasons

[slim hamlet]

Everyone knows highmountain tauren is 10% dps increase

[royal lantern]

my bad information in that case beeing "it doesnt make a difference cus its so minor, play what you want"?

[cursive igloo]

damn i thought it was all about being Vulpin

[topaz bluff]

It's the same for embellishments, wraps+neck, but it doesn't really matter...

[strange python]

They're asking what's best. "do whatever you want" is the most useless edgelord opinion you can have. If that's your opinion, why not shut the fuck up and let people give them context

[cursive igloo]

It does to that person they also came in here the other day cussing people out cause they hated crafting

they want their pink parse and think everyone is the same mindset

[slim hamlet]

It's something you need to remind people

some come in here and think some things are big deals

But arent

[hollow river]

assa chat rn

[slim hamlet]

It's just a disclaimer

[topaz bluff]

Nelf or dorf or tauren, but it doesn't really matter

[slim hamlet]

Not somethingto rally about

[fluid glade]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[strange python]

99% of the time the response is "dagger but you should wait just in case" and I don't understand why that bothers tryan so much other than wanting to be annoying

[royal lantern]

til: me saying that something wont really make a big difference in the end is a "ussules edgelord opinon" that makes a random guy on the internet salty enough go on a rant

[slim hamlet]

yeah fuck u

[strange python]

Yes because it's an entirely unhelpful edgelord opinion

[cursive igloo]

i almost rerolled cause i went Belf but i find arcane torrent useful in some stuff let alone some more energy here and there

[slim hamlet]

do you know what edgelord means btw?

[cursive igloo]

dont worry his discord account is fresh too

[strange python]

@balmy condor it honestly might be worth pinning crafting

[topaz bluff]

It's in the spreadsheet

[slim hamlet]

It is

[topaz bluff]

Piece by piece

[slim hamlet]

"If you haven't crafted your spark item yet, just hold off until we get more information from Blizzard."

[strange python]

The spreadsheet is something a new user wouldn't know exists.

[cursive igloo]

its almost

like there's an faq with all the info

[topaz bluff]

In a world of 96k or 100k + it's like 2k sways iirc.

I know for sub the best combo vs worst combo is less than 1k difference overall in dslice...

[smoky phoenix]

People hard spam !Whispyr all day in here tho

[strange python]

Christ almighty y'all sound like Moonkins with how intentionally unhelpful you want the discord to be

[slim hamlet]

read this

Swar you always ignore my messages

[topaz bluff]

It is helpful! We have the best listed embellishments and the worst for those who want it. It's not unrealistic to tell people who ask, its not really going to make a difference for them overall though... Not to a meaningful point.

[slim hamlet]

This disc is def the most useful outthere

[cursive igloo]

it really is

especially compared to other classes

[topaz bluff]

Warlocks best discord

[slim hamlet]

Also I'm insane

[cursive igloo]

you really are grats

[green harbor]

whispyr and fuu are hard carries

[slim hamlet]

I asked them a week ago if we use seeds on 2 targets, and 4 people said no before someone shit on all of them with facts

Was pretty great

[topaz bluff]

Whispyr and Fuu stocking up on redbull in prep for the embellishment+mythic tuning coming at them head on like a run away train.

I greatly appreciate those two, but in no way envy them

[cursive igloo]

to be someone who min-maxs everything would be such a headache with how much stuff changes

to squeeze out that .2%

[gusty mirage]

thank god, it wouldn't be nice to send them on an envoy without their consent

[strange python]

They do their best until the room temp iq users start trying to answer questions at the start of every new tier.

[topaz bluff]

Ducking auto correct

[gusty mirage]

🦆

[reef frigate]

The pvp one? Remove your Reputation contract and then enter the wq area.

[strange python]

Would you like to join elusive they are recruiting

[gusty mirage]

no

[strange python]

Rip

[brazen zodiac]

🦌

[slim hamlet]

Why you talking to me

at least @ me

[slim hamlet]

Wait is that really it

Imma try that

If it works I only got scammed off of 360 rep

[topaz bluff]

It's the tusk rep worse to grind than the centaur? Cause I just got 20 with centaur and feel like... Maybe ol' Nessing wasn't such a bad dude after all the animals these people are making me murder.

[strange python]

It's not as spammable

You have to wait for soups to come up, or just fish for the repeatable turning

[slim hamlet]

Maruuk - Expedition/Tuskarr - Valdrakken

[strange python]

Turnin*

[slim hamlet]

Easiest to worst to grind

[topaz bluff]

Ugh

[slim hamlet]

Or at least how fast you can do it

Valdrakken is also fine if you wanna to key farm but fuck that

[topaz bluff]

I've just avoided that stupid zone due to lag so much...

[slim hamlet]

Maruuk is BIS, just join big group and watch netflix

Also removing contract worked

thanks m8

[topaz bluff]

I went there for soup then I peaced out for the longest time lol. Completely unplayable for me. Haven't even checked since the supposed "fix".

[slim hamlet]

Never had lag there tbh

[topaz bluff]

Your EU is showing

[slim hamlet]

Only in the eastern part of azure span and rightrwhen you enter valdrakken

[light goblet]

Am I stupid? How do I put the bronze grip wrappings on the dagger in the Work Order

[slim hamlet]

EU servers BIS

[topaz bluff]

Called it

[slim hamlet]

In embellishment but Bronze grip isnt obtainable yet

Recipe for it that tailors needs drops from raid

[light goblet]

oh okay

so if making dagger now just do dagger with crit/mastery missive

and upgrade it next week (hopefully)

[slim hamlet]

Yeah, but there is currently a bug with embellished

It's in pings, but more or less right now you cant add embellished while recrafting, which is highly likely a bug, but blizzard hasnt said anything yet

[light goblet]

hmm

suppose I'll wait then and just make the neck now? lol

[slim hamlet]

Idk for now that's the 2nd best so probably, but i dont even know what I want to do yet

[cursive igloo]

Can we make the neck now

[slim hamlet]

Oh yeah also that

[light goblet]

yeah

[cursive igloo]

No i don't think the pattern is out yet

[slim hamlet]

Elemental Lariat is a recipedrop from primal storms

[light goblet]

ah yeah, so cant make anything until tuesday lmao

or at least shouldnt make the dagger without embellish until blizz says something

[cursive igloo]

I made my dagger with no ebelishment

but im willing to play the odds cause rng been pretty bad for me

[light goblet]

putting a lot of faith in blizz. spooky call

[slim hamlet]

I will prob wait until 2nd week of season

[cursive igloo]

i mean i dont lose anything

worst comes to worst its a core i just wait 2 more weeks for another one

after the first 5 its rng on them so we just have to see were people are on crafted gear anyways

[cursive igloo]

you're probably right though with how they been nerfing us

[slim hamlet]

Surely they will fix fast

riiiiight

[light goblet]

at least pb nerf wasnt too bad

[dark token]

If it's on wowhead, if it was a fast fix it would be same day or next day

If it's not, tht means either a hard fix or intended behavior

[slim hamlet]

It isn't like that for all gear slots right?

There is no way it's intenttional at least

[cursive igloo]

this was the last article today about it

https://www.wowhead.com/news/how-to-use-the-recrafting-system-to-improve-crafted-gear-in-dragonflight-330417?webhook

saying we should be able to add to it

[sour wraith]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/33KWcw9ocbQY8MkJqtXXne any reason why the sim only uses puzzle box once over the entire duration?

[open rapids]

Is Sin going to be able to compete with Sub and Law in M+ this season? I keep seeing conflicting opinions. I’m so sick of be forced into law for keys to complete in damage.

[balmy condor]

it's trying to sync to deathmark but you got double on-use trinkets with really long cooldowns so it's a little confused

really niche case where the double on-use stumbles over itself

[balmy condor]

yeah it'll be fine, worse, but fine

[sour wraith]

ok, so actual practice would be send puzzle box w/ deathmark and then use cannon once 2x use cd is up

[balmy condor]

yeh prolly

[drifting cloud]

you can try again and swap trinkets in slots

[balmy condor]

I'm gonna look at the apl real quick

shouldn't be a difficult fix

[cloud moat]

So, what do you lads reckon will be more worthwhile for mythic week 1 proge, Embellished Neck or raw dagger

((opinions allowed))

[royal lantern]

time to make my fav gray name angry

[royal lantern]

will you push higher m+ keys

[cursive igloo]

how edgelord of you

[crisp shard]

Why would you do raw dagger?

[cursive igloo]

well we have two sparks tues

so id have both

[royal lantern]

if yes and you can farm them/are lucky with drops to get a weapon drop, probs neck, otherwhise dagger i gues cus weapon ilvl tends to be 1 of the biggest possible upgrades you can have

ussules opinion done o/

[cloud moat]

Oh shit I somehow remembered second spark coming a week after raids

[cloud moat]

Certainly

[cursive igloo]

we didnt get 2nd this week so it should be mon/tues

[balmy condor]

pog

[whole mason]

So, NS is still bugged?

[balmy condor]

yes, fixed soon

[whole mason]

and DP not affecting KB?

[balmy condor]

dp works on kb

[sour wraith]

huge

[vocal oracle]

anyone have a macro that uses mutilate normally but changes to ambush when blindside procs?

[celest ruin]

!bs

[prisma monolith]

Ambush/Mutilate Macro:
You can macro Ambush to Mutilate using a advanced macro addon.
Further Explanation/Details:
#assassination message

[fluid glade]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[open marlin]

did anyone try out corrupting rage or static empowerment on the beta in raid to see if they're actually viable? should we just stick to glacial fury on single target for ease of use in prog?

[royal lantern]

corruption rage works, static empowerment is simbait

[open marlin]

SE being sim-bait makes sense, i'm more curious about unavoidable aoe damage in the new raid since i haven't actually stepped inside yet

[urban minnow]

Is dungeonslice accurate for m+? After doing all 3 specs using dungeon slice I’m getting 51k for sin, 61k for outlaw and 63k for sub

[slim hamlet]

sounds right

[gusty mirage]

depends on what you mean by accurate

[urban minnow]

Roughly accurate?

[gusty mirage]

it won't be an accurate representation of your end of dungeon dps

[open marlin]

in my experience they are pretty nail on the head for how I run most low to mid level dungeons, if you hit higher levels or a tank that does GIANT f'in pulls, they get a little out of whack

[balmy condor]

the number dslice spits out shouldn't be taken as gospel

[hexed root]

similar to outlaw, does it matter if we use sophic or frost devotion?

[balmy condor]

but the comparison within a spec is accurate

like you shouldn't look at dslice and go "wow this is 10k lower assa is bad"

but you can go "oh this trinket is 1.5% better than this other trinket"

that's fine

[balmy condor]

should use sophic everywhere

[rapid prism]

why do these say offhand

why not mainhand?

[hexed root]

apparently for outlaw it's frost devo now

[balmy condor]

because there's a higher level mainhand from mythic

[hexed root]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bT7cbEoB1iyEVdPSUkdpWg

[rapid prism]

ah so its just in anticipation that a higher level will go in main? if its the highest one i have its fine in main until replaced?

[balmy condor]

okay but I'm not talking about outlaw?

[gusty mirage]

ye always use highest ilvl in MH

[balmy condor]

why are you linking me outlaw shit

you asked if we should take X or Y

[hexed root]

sorry when you said "sophic everywhere" i figured that was in reference to everything rogue

[balmy condor]

I said take X

[hexed root]

you said take x everywhere

[balmy condor]

yes

[hexed root]

😦

[balmy condor]

for assassination

you take sophic

[slim hamlet]

How dare you

[balmy condor]

in every situation

[hexed root]

ty

communication is hard 😦

[vocal oracle]

THANKS!!! this is awesome

[gusty mirage]

fair warning, it's very janky

[balmy condor]

[gusty mirage]

strongly recommended to just find another bind for ambush

[balmy condor]

idk if I would be that ecstatic about a janky macro-addon work around that fails sometimes and needs to be mashed constantly

[vocal oracle]

i'll refine my keybinds...is there any way to macro for blindside events?

[balmy condor]

but I guess if it works for you

there is not

the only way to macro ambush/mut together

is through that jank ass addon

[slim hamlet]

i dont understand how it is not just like sub with shadow dance and shadow strike

[balmy condor]

I've honestly considered getting rid of that command tbh

every time it's linked we tell people it's not recommended

feels like a waste to even have it

[slim hamlet]

There is never a single reason why you would choose to use mutilate over ambush right

[autumn beacon]

multilate can generate up to 4 combo point ambush can only generate up to 3

[balmy condor]

I mean in theory it was found that you could get some minor gains from not consuming blindside procs during KB+DM in execute

but putting that technicality aside

no, you would always want to ambush over mut

[slim hamlet]

Yeah but then it also deals 2x the dmg

[balmy condor]

3x

[slim hamlet]

This is fun fact

[balmy condor]

ambush hits like a truck

[slim hamlet]

Well doesn't make it better arguement then xd

[balmy condor]

even with doomblade and systemic failure and vicious venoms it's like 1.5x or something

ambush big

[hexed root]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[hexed root]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[trim zinc]

is it cuz mut can apply 2x the poisons for kb? or am i wrong?

[balmy condor]

yeh

but it's like 50 dps

it's not even in sims

it's just one of those super jank "I guess this is maybe a thing?" type situations

there's a bunch of stupid logic that doesn't make it into sims cause it's completely irrelevant and hard to prove it's even better, or it's just a nightmare to play around

like I had a CT line for dungeonslice

that refreshed CT depending on the time remaining according to the targets present, if poison bomb was active, the energy intake you had, the time to die on the targets, and the stacks of amplifying poison

which like cool I guess

it was 1.5%

but it's impossible to play as a human

[slim hamlet]

Watch me

[trim zinc]

my brain hurts pls no

hehe

[balmy condor]

you can't sit in a 5 target situation and go "okay so CT has less 2 + spell_targets x1.3 seconds remaining, but my main target has 11 stacks of amp poison so -2.5 but also I have poison bomb so I need to do another -2 + spell_targets x0.6 seconds, so really I need to refresh CT at less than (2+6.5)-2.5-(2+3) seconds left, so simplifying down that means if CT has 8.5-7.5 seconds pog I maintain CT deep into pandemic to get 1.3 extra envenoms in the next 4 packs, the sim says that's 0.3% better I win"

no one is going to do that

so I scrapped the whole line

[slim hamlet]

I'll bring my calculator

[trim zinc]

but like feels bad to dont ambush for that "gigA dmg"

[balmy condor]

I mean

then dont?

sims are pressing ambush

[trim zinc]

i mean im just saying
not talking serious hehe :3

[hexed root]

so dumb question, it was kinda talked about yesterday with DT being better but KB having better execution phase, so is it still recommended to go KB?

[balmy condor]

if you value the execute, sure

if you don't, probably not

[hexed root]

think there's a threshold of player type that values execute? seems like everyone should during prog?

[slim hamlet]

General rule is that execute is strong in raid right?

[hexed root]

^

[balmy condor]

I mean

I've had this talk like a billion times

so I'm a little sick of it at this point respectfully

but execute isn't just good because execute

you have to have a reason for execute to be good

denathrius was a good execute fight cause it was a whole phase in execute that was really stressful

[hexed root]

pin it?

[balmy condor]

there don't seem to really be any types of fights like that in this raid

[royal lantern]

i like KB cus when i see KB beeing high on details, my small brain sends out happy happy signals and i feel good

[hexed root]

Explaining that I get what you're saying.

[slim hamlet]

kb is a beautiful button

[balmy condor]

people can argue "execute is always valuable"

or they can argue "the execute in this fight isn't valuable cause it's not anything special"

and they're both right

and I can't make that decision for people

I just tell people KB is stronger in execute

and if that's what they value in a damage profile

then I guess they do that

[slim hamlet]

Too much information, I'll just go IC in raid

[hexed root]

i am bender, please insert girder

i just want to be a strong dps for my guild/raid but my brain don't work good so i copy paste

maybe I should stick with classic where 90+ parses are easy to get

is bottle of spiraling still a S tier trink for us or always in sims we trust? have a 379 shell.

[slim hamlet]

i just look at number higher in sim

higher number is higher coolness

[hexed root]

big num make brain feel good

[peak bobcat]

!fuu

[prisma monolith]

Rogue Spreadsheet - Light: http://tiny.cc/2bq0vz / Dark: http://tiny.cc/xdu1vz

[hexed root]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/wxnrEZnsr6CQMBKENXWsba

but I'd have to use a blue ring, gross

[slim hamlet]

!whispyr

[prisma monolith]

Whispyr's Simulation Spreadsheet: https://tinyurl.com/292m89ev

[whole mason]

it seems not in a dynamic interaction. I'll try to get some logs

[hexed root]

man my sin and sub spec simming at just 500 dps difference. crazy how close

[slim hamlet]

We scale

we win lategame

no ff

[hexed root]

hype

my kb and dt difference just 100dps. won't want to mess up KB's rotation

[slim hamlet]

Wait @balmy condor why is SBS taken over SS in the DTB ST build? SS sims .7% higher

Well actually, might just be some weird stuff with my gear I guess

[hexed root]

whats sbs?

[slim hamlet]

serrated bone spike

[balmy condor]

just ss instead of sbs?

[slim hamlet]

ye

[balmy condor]

nothing else?

[slim hamlet]

hmm

[balmy condor]

def a gear thing

[slim hamlet]

Weird

Ye

[balmy condor]

can you link the sim

[slim hamlet]

I simmed it because i wished i could do ss over sbs

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/dKcLo8hJdnHtUmzFdFaWwD

[hexed root]

our bleeds scale off mastery right? I'd assume the bone spike is something else initially?

[slim hamlet]

Wait

its dungeon slice

xd

[balmy condor]

x d

good shit

[slim hamlet]

Man

it's almost 6 am

let me be

[hexed root]

sounds like bed time

[slim hamlet]

yeah

good idea

[hexed root]

im trying to see if i can get my sim to break 52k

[balmy condor]

just cheat

anything's possible if you cheat

[hexed root]

oh hey: https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/ifWFqHaYsLNprsc99b6yhM

[rapid yacht]

with nerf to poison bomb in dungeons is it safe to say that we should just stay away from DTB Mythic build?

[gusty mirage]

Can you make me sim over 70k at 382

[balmy condor]

it's still fine

[hexed root]

just go outlaw for m+ and sin for real content

[rapid yacht]

what fun is that

[open marlin]

the fun of doing big dam?

[balmy condor]

is that the only condition

[gusty mirage]

Dunno I just wanted to share my sim

[balmy condor]

cause i definitely could

but I would have to cheat

[gusty mirage]

[teal bloom]

How much would power infusion for the whole fight gain 🤔

[balmy condor]

maybe 12%?

[drifting cloud]

sounds made up

those damned blades at it again

[balmy condor]

it's an educated guess

[hexed root]

is this new? does it not sim the options selected for enchants or just force it to replace the ones listed?

[open marlin]

it's not new, if it isn't clicked and you have an enchant on say a ring, it won't sim the other ring enchants you may have selected

[hexed root]

weird. Use to it where you select the enchants and it simmed what was best amongst the selected vs needing to check the box to make it do that.

[balmy condor]

well if you have un-enchanted items

it will still add the enchants

you just need to tick the box to compare items that are already enchanted

[hollow river]

!bs

[prisma monolith]

Ambush/Mutilate Macro:
You can macro Ambush to Mutilate using a advanced macro addon.
Further Explanation/Details:
#assassination message

[grim briar]

Does the opening look any different for builds without shrouded suffocation?

[balmy condor]

no double garrote

[tawdry flare]

Did i miss the storm here too?

[balmy condor]

we have fan of knives

storm is subtlety

[tawdry flare]

You're so cute

[balmy condor]

thanks babe

[tawdry flare]

Np hun

Great pins btw

[jaunty lotus]

Would you not double garrote to get pandemic duration on the improved garrote?

[balmy condor]

not without ss

[jaunty lotus]

Okay, was playing that wrong then

Do we vanish before deathmark still?

[balmy condor]

you can if you want to sync

[jaunty lotus]

Hm, does improved garrote work off of shadowmeld? I may just save that for syncing

[sharp falcon]

whispyr what is meaning of life

[balmy condor]

I've been told it's 42

[sharp falcon]

is that what sims say

[balmy condor]

I guess the computer in the book could be loosely defined as a simulation

[tawdry flare]

The meaning to life is BiS gear.

[distant mesa]

is the exsang nerf really that much to put below outlaw/sub in raid?

[proper tapir]

Here we go, strap yourselves in!

[balmy condor]

it's still above