boots basically needed today or tmr anyway so it won't go wrong
#pvp
waxen meteor
and tmr we will have the 2nd craft available to choose
I am not pushing rogue ranking this week since there are too many bugs, so i am sitting easily to decide what to buy with conquest after vault tmr
vocal surge
That's Aggregate Using Normalized Scores thou
wise breach
Yeah, idk, I'm sure Blizzard has better data and they can see what needs adjustments, I'm not really worried
It's also very possible assa damage needs to be lowered a bit in PvP, but it's so hard to say with DH warping the meta
halcyon timber
“I can’t read or dig into stuff but i see a yellow bar on top, nerf rogues blizzy “ - warlock psyops
tribal badger
sins also the top simp spec
waxen meteor
t2 - does not exist
tribal badger
like all guilds r PIing/auging sin
its in a weird spot
its not OP in sims
or probably even real unsimped performance
but it scales super hard with PI and such
wise breach
I recall there was a PvE buff a couple seasons ago (or maybe in SL S4?) that had corresponding PvP modifier adjustments
Not sure those are still around
So maybe they can revisit those
On an unrelated note, does anyone know how exactly the Kingsbane initial hit scales? I had another rogue crit me for ~350k
I'm still working out the best setup for it etc
I know you want Shiv, Dance, and then Kingsbane, but that number still seems ridiculous
jolly sierra
but it scales super hard with PI and such
always thought PI should be removed from game
too much unfair advantage from an ability
halcyon timber
Made personal only like priests have suggested
vocal surge
oh my goodness
jolly sierra
also, its a meta revolving spell
vocal surge
he got caught out from stealth by DH
and when I sapped his war buddy
he tried to return back to Shuriken Storm me
and I caught him in a Cheap Shot and BTE'd him to death
100 to 0
halcyon timber
jolly sierra
kek
jolly sierra
KS
vocal surge
That damage creep up lel
jolly sierra
yeah, at least the guy died fast to make the match fairer
prime zenith
Kinda struggling to get past 1500 as sub in solo shuffle. Should I give another spec a try? I'm a barely 1800 type player.
twin burrow
panda you have ui bloat 😦
vocal surge
elfin maple
I played sub in solo shuffle, was struggling at 1.5k or smth also, insta swap to assa, now easy 1.7k so far
waxen meteor
Kinda struggling to get past 1500 as sub in solo shuffle. Should I give another ...
it's end of s2 minus 200-300 MMR now
waxen meteor
so if you were 1800 MMR last season end, you are roughly 1500 now
i don't think sub is super OP or something that helps you elevate your rating by a ton compared to your normal range as of today.
maybe it could after two major bugs are fixed
thick slate
I was a sub main in s2
i tried sub this season
lost 0-6 on my first solo
went to outlaw
got 1.8
elfin maple
solo shuffle is just something else, its zug zug fiesta, people dont care about drs, nothing so as sub you just try to be disruptive and setup things, but if your dps buddy does not connect the dots and simply does not do dmg when needed, you cannot one tap people before your healer or w/e dies
thick slate
true, exactly the issue sub faces
its way too setup based for a bracket like solo shuffle
thats why outlaw fits perfectly into it
cant wait to see what ill be able to do with 4p
elfin maple
or assa, as assa i just spread dots everywhere and look people going me, you spam that feint and shadow step your teammates, you fucking run all game if needed and let the bleeds to the job, legit never fight in open, always hug pillar and watch some poor bastard line his healer, kidney, smoke, deathmark KABOOM
thick slate
what cr are you on assa ?
elfin maple
right now im sitting on 31 wins in 49 rounds, 1712 rating
goal is to get 1.8k and fuck off entirely 😄
wintry dew
right now im sitting on 31 wins in 49 rounds, 1712 rating
i'd imagine you'd be 1.8 already with that ratio
bcs i went 35-25 and got 1.8
elfin maple
dunno, never been higher
i think there were a lobby or 2 where i went 1:5 or smth
so that dropped me some mmr
thick slate
my mmr was crazy high so i got 1.8 as 24/27
24-27*
and its my first time playing outlaw in pvp so yeah
waxen meteor
Sin is quite good dmg wise, but as you said, we need to defense a lot, and also i think sin doesn't get comfort lobbies now because too many DHS
indigo ginkgo
What's the set/conquest piece I'm snagging right now? gearing sub for pvp only
vocal surge
aite we out this week
Gratz
This poor fire mage let me reset lol
3 different times around a pillar
and then when running away from me walks right back into range of my BTE
analog crater
Alright, coming back to rogue after having not played it since cata, so might as well be new, what spec yall suggest for a newbie in ss?
sharp sierra
outlaw is the most fun ive had in this game in a long time
vocal surge
Depends on what you want to play
analog crater
sorry, for got to put like, newb friendliest of them all lol
vocal surge
Can't speak for Sub or Sin
But atm noob friendly wise, prob Sub
Every reroller and new rogue plays Sub
analog crater
Scale 1 to 10, where would you put outlaw?
vocal surge
1 being unfriendly and 10 being friendly?
vocal surge
Rotation 8
Depth 4
Difficulty 2
Avg: ~4.6
This is including that you can keep up with Procs and everything else going on with Outlaw (its really fast)
analog crater
Seems like a lot of the rotations for rogue are on the higher end
vocal surge
Outlaw's rotation is simple to learn
But pulling it off in PvP is difficult
Theres also alot of small things to keep in mind while playing
in order to maximize your DPS output
analog crater
Think it would be more beneficial to just start with outlaw and learn that way, or maybe start off with like sub to more so learn the basics of rogue, then move on to outlaw when I've got a better grasp? From pally to rogue is definitely a difference in playstyle lol
vocal surge
1hr 12mins in SS queue 
I honestly consider Pally and Rogue very similar
The transition from Rogue to Pally was nonexistent for me lol
went in full greens and non pvp blues
and walked out full PvP Gladiator purples w. 1800 set really fast
analog crater
Gear might be skewing my perspective, I'm in like, a mishmash of different pieces I got randomly.
one major difference i am feeling is tied to defense. like i feel like with my pally i can go in and steamroll, where with rogue i feel like im dying quite often and not doing a ton of damage and have to pull back more then im use too
vocal surge
Yep
I got to 1400 on my ret paladin in, like I said, world quest gear and a off meta talent build
but to get 1400 on my rogue, I had to be super sweaty with maxed enchants, gems, and as best of a gear advantage as possible
analog crater
Alright. think im just gonna stick it out with outlaw, hopefully get some gear on him and start seeing a difference
whats the common sentiment when it comes to KS? guessing they changed it with the recent rework?
vocal surge
Killing Spree is good vs certain classes
Step + Killing Spree into War (Die by the Sword), Monk (Fist of Fury), Rogue (Evasion or Cloak of Shadows + Veil of Midnight), etc. can allow you to bypass those defensive parameters
Killing Spree on a target re-entering stealth snapshots their location as you're moving with them until KS ends
Its situation but it deals less DPS than going GSW
over time
sharp sierra
what do you drop for KS?
vocal surge
Killing Spree is more of a dueling ability
than a rated ability
Because of the properties above
Talent Points are tight for the bottom row of Outlaw's tree
indigo ginkgo
How am i supposed to get bloody tokens, there HAS to be a better way than praying for an assist in the 1 shot fest in azure span
indigo ginkgo
just fly around the 4 zones till 1 drops
how do I know where they are?
thick slate
probably the only time ill see my name on the front ladder page 
analog crater
how often do people actually user blade flurry in pvp? guessing its good for when you are cleaving but not like, core part of the rotation?
glass bear
probably the only time ill see my name on the front ladder page <:OMEGAKEKW:8290...
nice congrats
steel skiff
It actually does a decent bit of damage, and with Grand Melee it can add a decent amount of pressure...definitely wouldn't sleep on it
analog crater
and one more question for now and then im done with newbie questions for a bit, how often should i be popping shadowdance?
vocal surge
Its the most unfun thing I've played because of the amount of bubbles there are going out
If you're getting put in CC chains, avoid Shadow Dancing
till the DRs kick in
Because if you Shadow Dance and you get CC'd
That's a ton of CDR gone
poofed out
analog crater
Alright, so avoid if heavy cc, but pretty much pop it on cd?
ember beacon
new to Rogue (outlaw in partic), this spec feels like it has so much going on
vocal surge
Ye
ember beacon
super fun
do you know if there's a good guide aroud for it? looking to clean up my opener, rotation and burst
vocal surge
Doesn't look like there's guides online made for Outlaw specifically
Best you can do is practice your rotation on a training dummy and skirms
Your main burst comes from Subterfuge, Vanish, and Shadow Dance w. BTE Crackshot
and GSW (if you got it spec'd in and are able to weave it in over Ambush)
ember beacon
What's GSW?
analog crater
ok i guess one more question lol, how often do yall actually use blade rush for pvp?
vocal surge
Greenskin Wickers
analog crater
greenskins wicker
analog crater
ok, wasnt sure with the whole increase to damage with BF bit on there
ember beacon
ohhh
tribal badger
its stricly an energy genner or gap closer
tribal badger
u dont use it for damage
u can run alot of things with that last point
cto, kspree, gsw
cto is the top pve one so alot of people pick that
vocal surge
You should rarely run out of energy as Outlaw unless bad RNG kicks in or you forget to reapply SND
so make sure to keep Slice and Dice up
duels
ember beacon
killing spree gives you the FLASH
thick slate
you can also macro prismatic bauble to it and you fill the area with rainbows
tribal badger
i take kspree vs double wizards/rsham that r gunna spam root me
just to have as a root break
ember beacon
if i'm running Killing Spree and Ghostly Strike, would it be bad to just macroo them together?
tribal badger
xd i prefered the old one tho
yea cause u wanna use ghostly nearly on cd or for crackshot windows
and u dont ever wanna cast kspree during those windows
ember beacon
a i see
vocal surge
Ghostly is primarily a Crackshot window buffer lol
big damage
Killing Spree not so much
analog crater
still not the biggest fan of RTB, but overall just with the questions you have answered its already feeling smooth, so thank you guys
ember beacon
I'm confused, is Outlaw Versa > Crit or Versa > Mastery?
i'm seeing so much conflicting info lol
sharp sierra
i heard crit is better but most have mastery cause it works for all 3 specs
surreal barn
The queues suck
vocal surge
Decided to call it for grinding rating this week
after waiting 1hr 30mins for a SS queue
and then getting a prot pally lobby
waxen meteor
strange stag
Guys is assa/bm/x viable glad range or stick to outlaw? Not into sub
surreal barn
Decided to call it for grinding rating this week
55 min queue into pally DH unholy
vocal surge
F
rose wigeon
Rogue Hunting :3
holy fuck this is top 3 worst UIs iv ever seen, i love that for you lmao
fast cargo
Guys is assa/bm/x viable glad range or stick to outlaw? Not into sub
Assa/sp assa/lock or assa/mage best bet for assa. If you got a solid dk, then assa/dk/disc could wreck shit but I’m sure every dk would rather play with dh lol
stoic spruce
We still have a couple hours
tribal badger
kek
vocal surge
da 2s rated
surreal barn
You could say elves have quite the “upper hand” as outlaw
Are you two doing double law lol
spring bough
we are smoking people
surreal barn
Stream I’ll watch
jolly sierra
Guess who racechanged to an elf!
i was scared
jolly bear
dumb question how are yall managing with only 100 energy?
vocal surge
Stream I’ll watch
we're streaming
wary spire
Hope we won't suffer for pve's sins.
lusty lichen
For a Sub Rogue that is kinda new in pvp, whats the best team mates i can look for 2s and 3s?
peak agate
I still don't understand why outlaw gets extra health and cdr and sub gets w.e the fuck it gets but sin is "lul, don't get focused too long"
gleaming pawn
Glass canon style, though most other glass canons these days are more canon and less glass. Sin just has to play a bit more defensively when the enemy is pushing
gleaming pawn
Which requires your team to help, so it’s harder in SS
peak agate
I think SS is trash. I mostly do 2s, but 2s is mostly warriors and DHs currently.
Being a class cannon is fine if your ramp up time is fast.
gleaming pawn
It’s not as simple as “just step lol” but really, when you need space you should be stepping to your healer. Not only does it get you away from the melee but it can also lead to you getting a cheeky restealth
peak agate
It’s not as simple as “just step lol” but really, when you need space you should...
I do, I run but eventually something hits me for 200k plus and I die or my healer runs out of CDs.
peak agate
https://www.bluetracker.gg/wow/topic/eu-en/478124-pvp-tuning-incoming-22-novembe...
Thank you sweet baby thrall
gleaming pawn
Yeah our nerfs are justified and mostly fair. But other specs didn’t get hit at all or hard enough, as per usual so once again, rogues aren’t allowed to do damage 🙂
sharp sierra
Outlaw
Crackshot now causes Between the Eyes to Dispatch the target for 50% (was 75%) of
normal damage when used from Stealth.
spring bough
yeah thats def not bad at all lol
sharp sierra
RIP outlaw
spring bough
160k BTe still lmao
sharp sierra
Perforated Veins damage bonus reduced to 40% (was 50%) in PvP combat.
this is pretty big too
peak agate
9 percent nerf to Kingsbane which was my highest hitting move...ah well. Sometimes the moon aligns and I get 260k envenoms.
quaint cedar
I'm just happy outlaw didn't get dumpstered
And a lot of other specs got nerfs too so it evens out
Even with the nerf Crackshot should still feel strong so I have no issues really with the change
tribal badger
@thorn cosmos while doing 250k dps on aoe pulls the neck was 0.5% of my dps
which is 0.2% more then its doing in ST sims
idk why my discord just brought me in here when i opened it sorry for the ping in here xd
ember beacon
RPS chads win again 
waxen meteor
Mage and SP both big boosts
sharp sierra
wait til the pve nerfs happen too
these nerfs are the icing on the cake. once world first is done
more nerfs 100%
overlapping pvp nerfs
peak agate
I wonder if those DH will be enough to calm them down. I'm surprised no warrior nerfs
waxen meteor
DH nerf probably just pushes to another build
quaint cedar
I'm not. Warrior never gets nerfed
waxen meteor
Crazy thing is decree and barrage after 20% nerf is still quite big
Not sure if it’s enough to shift talents away
stoic spruce
It looks like there's no weekly tuning?
Told you
stoic spruce
Just crackshot too
waxen meteor
Other than warrior got nothing most adjustment makes sense
stoic spruce
Even with the nerf Crackshot should still feel strong so I have no issues really...
Dispatch could do 20% from bte in stealth and I really wouldn't care lol
I hope its dk
The bad ones stick out like a sore thumb
Pets on auto stun 🥰
Ibf at 10%
stoic spruce
Yeah they're more popular
vocal surge
and easy to play
quaint cedar
Dispatch could do 20% from bte in stealth and I really wouldn't care lol
Don't give blizzard ideas
Nerfing outlaw is already their favorite thing to do
quaint cedar
You see blizz? This is what over 6 months of being bottom tier does to someone
tawny kestrel
You see blizz? This is what over 6 months of being bottom tier does to someone
outlaw was good all of kara season tho
quaint cedar
outlaw was dogshit beginning of last season
vocal surge
^
tawny kestrel
it was alright, after the 5% buff it became good
quaint cedar
by the time we got buffed over halfway through the season everyone had already quit
ember beacon
what stats does Assa prefer? Versa > Mastery > Haste > Crit ?
quaint cedar
it was manageable, sure. even my derp ass was able to get 2100 with it before the buffs. but holy shit was it miserable to play
even when you win you were miserable
wise breach
Hey, PvP gear got a PvE buff
Kind of
the Elite piece from 1600 is now Hero track
I'm guessing vendor gear remains Veteran track, but vault gear can be Champion/Hero based on rating
muted abyss
Not sure if it’s enough to shift talents away
There are other talents that play more traditional dh playstyle, but honestly these nerfs are nothing for dh. Still gonna be s tier
quaint cedar
especially pre buff it was pretty awful
you must have much more patience than me then lol
peak agate
Sad girl needs something... She needs BIG DAM!
worthy crag
i dueled the kill target low and this DH just scored a kill on my healer with elysian decree + hunt + fel barrage
in under 4 sec
Tbh I dont mind their dmg but their blur lasting 10 sec and vault giving them cc immunity as long as they extend their flight is total bs
oh wait, we got patch notes on them
neat
peak agate
Something something hero class.
lucid citrus
so these nerfs to rogue is not bad right?
peak agate
so these nerfs to rogue is not bad right?
Considering how hard some of these abilities hit... No
worthy crag
oof these sub nerfs
quaint cedar
oh that makes sense. Makes waiting for queue times a lot less frustrating
peak agate
Arms is only easy if the healer is dumb
exotic dove
yeah FW will still be around
quaint cedar
fair enough. DH nerfs in general are good for the game. they are absurd right now
stoic spruce
I'd argue dh nerfed into obscurity is even better for the game
quaint cedar
Yeah that's the other thing that sucks about DH is that they are a terrible partner for us when they end up on our team in shuffle
They stun everything and break all our CC
worthy crag
Oh, you are waiting for that stun DR to expire in 4 seconds? well fuck you, here's Chaos Nova
lol just do dam bro
sharp sierra
Is assa dead
radiant glen
we escaped unharmed
sharp sierra
Lol
waxen meteor
I hope they do fix sub's bug as well
sharp sierra
Which
jolly sierra
https://www.bluetracker.gg/wow/topic/eu-en/478124-pvp-tuning-incoming-22-novembe...
meh the just a 9%
peak agate
Any sin rogues with 2 pc? I feel like it's going to supe up Kingsbane procs.
proven field
Crack shot nerf sounds like a bummer but rest don’t seem so bad
jolly sierra
think so
at least the nerf isnt high
so if i hit 290k with a KB
now ill be like 260
K E K
worthy crag
its mostly cuz ppl crying about it are in 2s skirms with double dps where the rogue pops every cd on opener and oneshots
exotic dove
Yeah I dont think the Assa nerfs are really big at all
out of the three the Sub ones seem to be the biggest but I dont think even that is all that bad but I will have to see tomorrrow
halcyon timber
They will fix that crud, uncool
jolly sierra
Yeah I dont think the Assa nerfs are really big at all
minimum tbh
if im able to do 290k crits w KB rn without tier and purple gear then is pretty meh
maiden gull
Outlaw Nerf feels pretty unnecessary tbh, was fun while it lasted
halcyon timber
As long as we don’t get turned into cc bots with constant nerfs because afk damage classes don’t think its fair
maiden gull
Cant have fun in this Game for Long as always
Should have just nerfed it for shadowmeld and gg
maiden gull
If you get 5 back to back procs of ace burst was good, but this Happens once in 100 Games.
Dont think anyone even asked for that Nerf, Always the Same shit
Now pve Tuning will come and Outlaw is a CC bot again, cycle repeats
vocal surge
DH out here pumping +100k
w. Aug
and Outlaw's topping only 100k at best w. top tier rng
maiden gull
U did No damage to plate and now even less, cba anymore with this shit
stoic spruce
No YOU did no damage
I do damage
I am based
You are cringe
I'm up here
You're down here
formal delta
Quick question: Is upgrading green pvp items just upgrading their pve ilvl? Doesn't affect pvp level right?
gritty heart
Quick question: Is upgrading green pvp items just upgrading their pve ilvl? Does...
ye doesn't affect pvp its only about pve
formal delta
Okay thought so. First season really touching pvp and I have full greens now but was approaching flightstone cap lol
cursive umbra
oof these sub nerfs
these sub nerfs arent bad are they?
10% isnt to bad
i dont like it but it doesnt feel like it makes or break the spec
cursive umbra
yeah agree
sturdy zealot
best build to fuck with people in korraks as sin?
idk anything about pvp im a virgin pve player
proven kayak
Nerfs are ok but shadowstrike bug needs to be fixed
sharp pumice
What are people getting the second tier piece from this week
1600 and?
Like it's a catalyst piece obv but how is it 489 I guess is what I'm asking
wintry dew
Like it's a catalyst piece obv but how is it 489 I guess is what I'm asking
1600 piece will be max pvp rank, (elite coloration aswell)
Unless people are getting a conquest piece this week that isn't a dagger, the second piece comes from catalyst, using it on a wpvp item, usually gloves
The upgraded version obviously
It will be 3 pvp ILVL behind a normal conquest item
cursive umbra
we thinking infurious boots upgrade with 2nd spark? seems juicy?
worthy crag
didnt most people use the first spark for that
cursive umbra
i used first spark for helm
proven kayak
I used it on boots
proven kayak
spec?
stoic spruce
Wtb pre-df outlaw
maiden gull
anyone tried just using 1 point Vigor and put 1 point in lethality as outlaw with gsw?
stoic spruce
Not a bad idea. I will try that tomorrow.
halcyon timber
just wish theyd fix shadowed finisher and shadowstrike teleport tho
If it were any other class missing 30% damage that would have been fixed already. Shadowstrike bug also sucks ass. God forbid charge bugged and warriors were stuck running in place or something.
stoic spruce
okay lets not act like blizz doesnt like rogues
you can make a case for dk/surv/enh
minor cape
idk, surv is fine but very skill based
but yeah imagine wanting to play fdk in pvp lolololo
not allowed
stoic spruce
idk, surv is fine but very skill based
its also a melee in a ranged class AND they dont get hunter leggos
stoic spruce
the odds of an Agility polearm becoming a leggo is pretty low
minor cape
cause he might be super good and then im stuck running around the arena for 3 minutes till he kills me
stoic spruce
im not saying its bad, I'm saying it frequently gets forgotten
and goes a long time without tuning
minor cape
but if surv is a bad player, he just gets two shotted in opener so no big deal lol
minor cape
im not saying its bad, I'm saying it frequently gets forgotten
true
grizzled basin
is shadowdance (vs. ER) the right call now for assa in SS ?
More survivability / cc I guess
sharp sierra
outlaw nerf doesn't look too bad does it?
stoic spruce
Nah
sharp sierra
yea I just finished reading up here since patch notes were released
btw I keep reading ace here what do ppl mean by that?
maiden gull
outlaw nerf doesn't look too bad does it?
its ~25k per global, so i think its pretty bad and unnecessary but
sharp sierra
could've been worse ? I guess
maiden gull
There was no reason to nerf outlaw to begin with
they could have nerfed ace by 1% per or smth
ember beacon
does anyone know where to go for trying to learn things like gear, stats, rotation, etc for Assas Rogue?
i'm trying to figure it out via murlok.io, but i'm convinced everyone is running their own build lol
cursive umbra
There was no reason to nerf outlaw to begin with
i think there was, and with this said others need it to, but outlaws a bit to strong compared to the majority in my opinion
maiden gull
First Time this Addon Outlaw could kill someone on their own while popping all cd´s and have a bit of procc luck
in a stun
cursive umbra
yeah but we shouldnt have that + everything else (again my opinion)
also again, others need harder nerfs, but outlaw was/is def in a really good spot and that nerf wont make or break it
maiden gull
DH, DK , Warro, Demo Lock, and BM Hunter are all much worse and require much less RNG and Skill to pull it off
imho
DH will just switch specc´s and nothing changed
cursive umbra
agree, but that still leaves a vast majority of specs behind and saying that outlaw isnt top is just lying
yeah they will 🙂
and we will hat eit for another week, until blizz gets their thumb out their asses for real
maiden gull
Adn don´t forget: the PvE nerfs for Outlaw will come and as alwqays will impact PvP aswell
cursive umbra
what are people actually running in RWF?
maiden gull
Always the same cycle when the class is fun
cursive umbra
ive seen loads of subs top meters? or maybe ui mistake
gritty heart
sub is best always
cursive umbra
so dont main sub (i am and i wont leave!) 🙂
stoic spruce
Ugh another "it nEedS a Nerf" to their own class
#outlaw
#assassination
#subtlety
If you want to nerf your class, go do it with the ones that advocate for it.
proven kayak
Is mmr broken again ?
stoic spruce
Broken how?
untold remnant
Nerfs are ok but shadowstrike bug needs to be fixed
Why is this taking so long >_>
Unplayable
tender ferry
Shadowed finishers, too. That’s a big chunk of damage we’re missing
untold remnant
True, but the shadowstrike unstealthing so far away is dumb xd
thick slate
Yeah sub isnt worth playing right now
i got 1.8 as outlaw and apparently im top 36 EU Outlaw lmfao
sharp sierra
interesting that is has such low representation
wary spire
As a person who just tried outlaw one time - you have to look for so much shit it's insane.
Don't mess up prepop, don't mess up bte spam, procs +the base high speed of the spec felt overwhelming.
surreal barn
They say outlaw mains are good at Bop-It
thick slate
They say outlaw mains are good at Bop-It
at what ?
maiden gull
yeah but outlaw gets nerfed
warrior and ret just stay
dh nerf will change nothing, they just use another spec
thick slate
What are your criterias in choosing a class to main? Mine is that it should be capable to perform AND feel good in all contents of the game. M+/Raiding/Pvp
Warrior feels bad in pve and gets outperformed badly by other melees
Rogue seems to take the cake at that
its doing really well in everything right now
you got 3 dps specs that are still in a good spot
which is very rare to find in a class
sharp sierra
As a person who just tried outlaw one time - you have to look for so much shit i...
I started 3 days ago, first time ever touching the spec. 1st day I had 0 clue what was going on, someone here gave me basic burst & rotation and then it started making sense, now it's super fun
wary spire
Maybe I'll give it another shot. But generally my motto is "if it doesn't work on the first try - instantly give up".
wintry dew
That's the smart way to go
Tried sub day 1, it's bugged, insta switch assa, got 1.8 day1
surreal barn
That’s how you do. This assa with dance doesn’t feel too diff than sub in some ways which is nice
karmic summit
Tried sub day 1, it's bugged, insta switch assa, got 1.8 day1
did the exact same thing brother
why did they nerf sub
sadge
sharp sierra
stupid question what does assa do in the dance window?
is it for dmg like outlaw or
sharp sierra
I c
wintry dew
Although to be fair, on my quick journey to rival, (10 queus), I was never the guy doing God plays
jolly sierra
have a nice day and a lot of win
SEXOOOOOOOO
nova viper
SEXOOOOOOOO
SEXOOOOOOOOO
wintry dew
Sexo is good
wintry dew
Que pasa hermano
nova viper
Genial, amigo
jolly sierra
nada lol
just went to work my polish friend
2 hours later cuz i guessed bad the schedule
REEEEEEEEEE
nova viper
sadge
Big question - the rogue's sin rotation in pvp is like this: I use garrote, mutilate, rupture, dm, shiv, echo, kingsbane and I renew rupture with garrote?
and use evenom ofc
jolly sierra
well i dont use echoing anymore, but if i recall
when i wanted to do a quickie as starter
was MFD (F, just use cheap shot) > garrote > rupture > shiv > echoing > deathmark > envenom
the deal with kingsbane is using it in a separate window
u will have enough time w that small rupture
but w echoing just try to match the dots in envenoms, if u wanna be safe with one point just match it w poisoned knife
nova viper
jolly sierra
untold remnant
DH so stupid broken, I'm 2236 cr in shuffle on it xd
jolly sierra
i know is disgustingly broken
im still amused how tf healers thinks i would win most of SS rounds as assa w a dh in the lobby
jolly sierra
do they really know how squishy rogues usually are?
yeah i can kill ppl in a global
but its hard to do something if the dh does 150k in a tick from deadly sweep
waxen meteor
For me DH is still not like that 3 days of ret lol
vocal surge
Btw
meta prediction of this week
Arms Warrior, Ret Paladin, Warlocks (except Aff), Frost Mage + Fire Mage (SSS), and Boomie
waxen meteor
Big question - the rogue's sin rotation in pvp is like this: I use garrote, muti...
the beauty of PvP is there's no such 'rotation'.
overal, you try to maintain full bleed + bone on two targets is already a lot.
You can use shiv + kidney + one CD for burst
waxen meteor
Arms Warrior, Ret Paladin, Warlocks (except Aff), Frost Mage + Fire Mage (SSS), ...
Solo Lobbies I guess, (None Rogue)
A+ Melee: DH, Arm, Ret
A+ Caster: Demo Lock, SP
A Caster: Mage/Boomie
Mage probably will never be A+ because it sucks hard against other casters and hunter
spring bough
Arms Warrior, Ret Paladin, Warlocks (except Aff), Frost Mage + Fire Mage (SSS), ...
Forgot outlaw in here 😆
waxen meteor
Aff Lock dmg is too low now tbh
sharp sierra
pls no lock meta
vocal surge
Lol
Outlaw isn't as strong as all of those
not to mention we're getting a slap on the wrist for being good once
waxen meteor
demo lock could stand cast most specs burst, and kill them now
but obviously demo lock has to use defensive at the same time
untold remnant
Shadowed finishers, too. That’s a big chunk of damage we’re missing
Actually huge that this is not implemented xd
waxen meteor
yeah that's huge
but in dmg details! sometimes i do see the shadow part
i am not sure if it's 100% broken or just sometimes broken
sharp sierra
BM hunters have fairly disgusting dmg output no?
waxen meteor
i wanna see how meta will shift w those nerfs
I don't think that's enough
DH stays on top tier
but could be fairly okay top tier
not broken tier
jolly sierra
I don't think that's enough
it is for the FOTM rerollers
waxen meteor
tbh the nerf is dumb
jolly sierra
so a decent chunk will drop now
waxen meteor
Elysian Decree damage reduced by 20% in PvP combat.
This skill is not crazy
it's just a 120K aoe with 1 min CD
jolly sierra
I don't think that's enough
DH dead im switching to frost REEEEEEE
waxen meteor
the problem is all addons don't seperate skill dmg and the DH's multiplier talent
people possting screen shots for Elysian Decree doing 500K dmg
the real reason is the multipier talent
jolly sierra
im still surprised dhs are getting the kyrian cov ability in havoc
waxen meteor
chaotic disposition was not shown in details, it was like, 150k the hunt + 60k chaotic disposition + 60k chaotic disposition + 60 k dispotion dead
but instead you see 500k hunt or 500k decree
waxen meteor
yeah any skill can be multiplied
untold remnant
Death sweep can hit for 280k 😄
jolly sierra
Death sweep can hit for 280k 😄
oof even worse
waxen meteor
*1.17 ^ 7
I am not sure if the 7.77% chance is calculated correctly, but when this gets triggered multiple times on a big dmg skill
people are deleted
jolly sierra
so, that is the real issue?
waxen meteor
and the fel barrage
jolly sierra
yeah multipliers are disgusting af in pvp
waxen meteor
but other skills are normal
jolly sierra
barrage through neitherwalk?
waxen meteor
like decree, people crying about 500k dmg, but really it's the chaotic dispostion triggered multiple times
if the dmg is normal range, in netherwalk or not is a smaller problem
waxen meteor
yeah multipliers are disgusting af in pvp
it's kinda opposite of their general design direction isn't it?
i like from df, they are trying to remove random high numbers in pvp
and they reworked DH with this thing out..
untold remnant
oof even worse
Immo Aura > Eye Beam > Fel Rush > Essence Break > Death Sheep > Meta > Death Sweep
Insane burst
That is without decree and fel barrage
I'm playing that build at 2250 now, and will still be strong tomorrow
Only 15% nerf to damage bonus of Essence Break
waxen meteor
yeah that's the new build
untold remnant
And Inertia to 12%
waxen meteor
Essence Break is not really nerfed 15% iirc
untold remnant
No the damage bonus went from 65% tot 50% in pvp combat
spring bough
BM hunters have fairly disgusting dmg output no?
They do. It will be worse with four set because then their dire beats do kill command so 3 pets will be popping off
untold remnant
So chaos strike and blade dance will do 50% instead of 65
waxen meteor
yeah
jolly sierra
Immo Aura > Eye Beam > Fel Rush > Essence Break > Death Sheep > Meta > Death Swe...
O O F
waxen meteor
overall i think people will move away from Inertia
jolly sierra
god dammit
waxen meteor
i think the key is just to lower Inertia as they did, then just lower barrage
spring bough
Bout to go level my DH just to become a menace
waxen meteor
and cap that crazy multipier
untold remnant
If you now play Momentum, which stacks the stacks. You can have perma 6% damage increase
waxen meteor
Regardless, i think with tier set DH will move to eyebeam sooner or later again
I am expecting a second nerf on fel barrage
jolly sierra
so, how many abilities away is dh from turning into the avatar w 4 cov abilities?
jolly sierra
they have pasture, the hunt and elysian now
waxen meteor
it lasts same as dragon breath
jolly sierra
i rlly hate dhs w me
waxen meteor
i get you
jolly sierra
are like warriors but worse w drs
waxen meteor
actually from s2 i found this
jolly sierra
w that fkn stun
waxen meteor
when DH is in same lobby as sin, sin suffers too much
sucks on same side, and sucks on oppposite side
jolly sierra
or he beats u or he screws ur ccs
waxen meteor
most times i don't know what i was doing as DH and sin already dying
like DH lobby against ret/sin, I was, let's go ret (only because i main rogue)
then sin died
spring bough
Good luck on this vault today y’all may god bless with some phat loot
jolly sierra
assa dies in cleave usually
waxen meteor
I feel I feel quite relaxed this season for vault
jolly sierra
Good luck on this vault today y’all may god bless with some phat loot
ty, i capped 4 already
lets see what happens
spring bough
Yeah but still can get 4 pieces
Then login next Tuesday and convert and boom four set
waxen meteor
Yeah next week could be
I am not really excited
Stat on tier sets is not that appealing to me
jolly sierra
i am when i check all the vaults
spring bough
I’m going for the crit on use trinket today for my conq piece
jolly sierra
even lfr tier would be ok for now
spring bough
Maybe I’ll try to get tier lfr gloves and upgrade the hell out of them I am swimming in crests lol
waxen meteor
If our tier set is good
i am leaning towards changing some rings enchant and gems to be more vers
especially sin
jolly sierra
im sure assa will just use 2 set
waxen meteor
doesn't lots of people said 4 set reads horrible but plays super decent?
jolly sierra
tried it
hits like 40k in single target
imagine in multi (150% multiplier wont trigger)
chrome schooner
Thing is it has good stats
So might as well equip it you know
If it ever triggers it's free damage
waxen meteor
ha?
i thought tier set this season doesn't have much vers nor mastery
I am okay with non mastery, but i feel sin does need some vers
chrome schooner
Well imo the way to play is mastery versa crit then haste, at least with Dance + Lethality builds
2 parts are mastery crit
2 are versa crit
So
waxen meteor
you can also say 2 parts are wihtout vers, 2 parts are without mastery..
wintry dew
Outlaw players are happy with all the crit
chrome schooner
<:peeposcared:879405496199704607> you can also say 2 parts are wihtout vers, 2 p...
But it doesn't really matter, does it ?
You're not going to play infinite versa anyway because it drs and you get more value from other stats
So you just get versa mastery everywhere else to compensate for the two pieces without
and you end up with a lot of crit, a lot of mastery, and sufficient versa
and it's good!
jolly sierra
are u sure isnt better to just pick legs and gloves and then craft versa mastery stuff?
waxen meteor
You're not going to play infinite versa anyway because it drs and you get more v...
purely from return of investment yeah
but in solo, i feel we do need to overstack vers... in a way..
mystic shoal
what are we crafting today if already have boots
chrome schooner
you can actually survive decently by cycling vanish meld and dance to put some damage red on big thead while also dealing a lot of damage yourself
and weaving feints into that
waxen meteor
I will craft chest or ring
waxen meteor
you can actually survive decently by cycling vanish meld and dance to put some d...
makes sense
mystic shoal
I will craft chest or ring
why chest
is tier chest bad for all 3 specs
also no, its prolly not
i got tier chest w my 1600 piece
crit vers i think
waxen meteor
i haven't queued with sin yet this season, just based on people talking here and the dead sin players in other lobbies haha
mystic shoal
yeah I'm OL
and may dabble w sin later down the line
yeah outlaw survivability pretty decent
waxen meteor
Oh you are outlaw haha
chrome schooner
I actually think all specs run w/o head
mystic shoal
what's head stats
jolly sierra
haste mastery
waxen meteor
Head we have good conquest one
mystic shoal
mast heavy?
jolly sierra
haste heavy
mystic shoal
ahhh
chrome schooner
haste heavy yeah
mystic shoal
I think it'd still b good for assa even in dance no?
jolly sierra
nope
mystic shoal
hmmm
chrome schooner
& crit has more value through lethality + seal fate
jolly sierra
crit is even better
mystic shoal
0 haste as ass sounds cringe
jolly sierra
to trigger lethality
chrome schooner
why would it sound cringe, as long as you aren't out of energy it doesn't matter :p
it's not like we get shorter globals or anything
mystic shoal
Idk I have ptsd of no haste Sin from PVE
Oh shit you take tea in that build too
yeah
fuck haste
means I can swap whenver I want then since I'm just stacking crit vers atm
Sucks that OL Mastery is dogshit now man
waxen meteor
why would it sound cringe, as long as you aren't out of energy it doesn't matter...
anytime i put crit after crit nerf sounds cringe haha
chrome schooner
it's not about the damage itself
well it kind of his thanks to lethality
but seal fate is also a big factor
basically you can consider that if you crit enough, then it makes up for the lack of haste since you generate more resource, although in a different way
But you get damage with it
waxen meteor
that's true
jolly sierra
well, the pvp use trinket this season will be a very nice dmg boost tho
w that chunk of crit
sharp sierra
how lucky are you
vocal surge
pain bad vault
sharp sierra
to get set and weapon in one vault
waxen meteor
very nice, i got my first socket lol
mystic shoal
very nice, i got my first socket lol
pain
vocal surge
Had to get glove lol
untold remnant
Good pick a socket
vocal surge
since its 700 conquest, the shoulder is a very minor upgrade (3 ilvl) and trinket is 525 conquest
glove has mastery (I want crit ;-;)
lucid citrus
Are using crafted head for Sun and Sin?
jolly sierra
lucky fuck that is the good one
jolly sierra
talking about this
btw forgot today is tuesday and tomorrow will get vault, work confuses me a lot lol
steel scarab
Hi folks! I'm pvping with my gf this season, we tried to pvp last season with me as Assassination rogue and her as protection pally and it didn't go well lol. Is holy pally + assassination a good combo this season?
steel scarab
Also, we both got a full set of honor gear. What's the gear track to get upgrades for PvP? Just get 1 piece out of the vault each week?
untold remnant
Nice, good to force the DH
jolly sierra
I got two shadewalker to choose from
shadenox said sure, but pick anything but head
pale storm
titles not out this week?
lusty meteor
Any idea what we are doing for second crafted piece for sub?
vocal surge
since its 700 conquest, the shoulder is a very minor upgrade (3 ilvl) and trinke...
The glove was worth 2% crit xD
spring bough
Stack that crit baby
fast cargo
someone link their stealth sap macro
#showtooltip Sap
/cleartarget
/targetenemyplayer
/cast [harm, nodead] sap;
mystic shoal
#showtooltip Sap
/cleartarget
/targetenemyplayer
/cast [harm, nodead] sap;
I found it in my notes
but ty ❤️
Is outlaw 4pc dogshit
topaz delta
What 2 pieces should we be crafting with our sparks? Was forced to take tier helm today in vault. Was the only thing worth a damn. It gives me 3P
lusty meteor
I was wondering the same from what I see it might be boots and helm?
topaz delta
No helm craft for me unfortunately since I have tier there. Maybe ring?
jolly sierra
nobody knows 100% the second embelishment yet
topaz delta
But first should be boots right? I didn’t craft anything last week
cold jewel
just make wrists
topaz delta
I also goofed and didn’t buy wep last week, I got the strife dagger and bought conquest gloves to convert to tier :/
light estuary
in 2s as outlaw, do you sap healer, RtB, AR, SnD, cheapshot kill target, ambush, BtE spam?
jolly sierra
But first should be boots right? I didn’t craft anything last week
ye
jolly sierra
I also goofed and didn’t buy wep last week, I got the strife dagger and bought c...
oof im thinking in do the inverse this week
and maybe will get a mastery versa cloak from malicia , it is juicy af w mastery
topaz delta
Is 4 piece good on both sub and sin? Should have 4p today
thorn pond
I dont think the 4 set is worth on sub
surreal barn
I feel neutered
Bleed dam doesn’t feel the same today
I know they only touched kingsbane but something is diff
topaz delta
That bad zeiss?
surreal barn
I mean, maybe it’s just me?
jolly sierra
ill see tomorrow
light estuary
any re-cheap shots? or just the 1 is ok?
ty! also do you have a priority list of things to do?
- keep SnD and good rolls up
- Kidney on CD
- BtE on CD
- pistol shot proc
- ambush proc
- etc?
exotic dove
For once in my life this expansion my Rogues were blessed with something great. One got a weapon the other got the mastery tier gloves. Thank God it wasn't crap for once even my dks got good stuff. Never happened to me before so the rest of the season will probably crap knowing my luck.
spring bough
I’m praying for that tier chest in this vault in a couple of hours
halcyon timber
Yehhhh boy
surreal barn
I’m praying for that tier chest in this vault in a couple of hours
I had chest and head show up
Anyone know when that next tier converting token is released?
Thought it was weekly
spring bough
I had chest and head show up
Lucky. Im def staying away from the tier helm and getting a crafted crit/vers one w the new crit embellish
elfin maple
I mean, maybe it’s just me?
i was so close to 1.8k on assa, but now people suddenly realise they need to train me 😭
also the dmg kinda does feel a bit off, but maybe im just focused hard
surreal barn
I was 1780 myself and the last couple solos I really wasn’t doing bad, the spread was there - but as you said I got dusted. The damage was not even comparable
lol I think I was lowest
waxen meteor
This week people also get geared up a bit
surreal barn
Yup
waxen meteor
I am so ducking tired about sub ss bug
surreal barn
Paladins and warrs got their 2Hs
elfin maple
locks and bm hunters are insane tho
waxen meteor
Just want to throw keyboard away
Yeah locks are super good
Just not that broken as DH
So they escaped
elfin maple
i got in a lobby with ele shamy and bm hunt on a blades edge, thats like insane unlucko
can you share your build btw?
worthy crag
is there a list of all embellishments and their names for 10.2? alot of em that I can find on google are outdated
waxen meteor
is there a list of all embellishments and their names for 10.2? alot of em that ...
Regardless they are all bad
I am crafting helmet now
since i got a socket
lol
spring bough
Socket on week one 🪦
surreal barn
🪦
waxen meteor
OH YEAH
SUCK HARD
If i play outlaw it would be two picks
got the crit neck and crit belt
spring bough
Join the dark side
waxen meteor
too late, already picked socket
DH -> Weapon
Ret -> Chest for Tier
Lock -> Leg for Tier
Rogue -> lol socket
mystic shoal
hellbloom weps or conquest weps?
waxen meteor
For us, I think conquest
tribal badger
i took the hellbloom dagger to use for law and sin/sub
sin its optimal for law and still a high ilvl dagger for sin/sub
(plus theres not really any dagger with good stats for them)
or w/e the crit dagger is
i might have it reversed
mystic shoal
I mean for MH
tribal badger
for mh u want ilvl
mystic shoal
yuh
tribal badger
so conq
mystic shoal
prolly go conquest mh
tribal badger
hellbloom is 3 lower
mystic shoal
helbloom oh
spring bough
If yall pvpers didn’t hear. Run some kazzak kills. Chance at Mount thru December 7
spring bough
Oh that’s even better more chances
tribal badger
everyone ive talked to got theirs on first kill
yea all the vanilla bosses are up
or almost all of them
mystic shoal
what mount
spring bough
Azure Worldchiller
mystic shoal
ah nice
spring bough
You can buy the doomhawk for 5k timewalk tokens too
vocal surge
rogue's 4pc?
waxen meteor
If yall pvpers didn’t hear. Run some kazzak kills. Chance at Mount thru December...
what is kazzak kill
waxen meteor
didn't first kill 100% dorp?
jolly sierra
got it at 1st try
waxen meteor
yeah i thought it's a must drop
sharp sierra
its either very high % or 100%
waxen meteor
aniverisery is normally 100%
rancid merlin
in PVP talking pve mount drops......what is happening
rancid merlin
Good shit bro!
the math for the system still confuses me
you can get 6-0 and only get 72 pts, but go 2-4 and get -62pts
regardless of mmr
idle root
does the 1.6k token turn into the elite mog?
they said it wouldnt for this season but the vendor shows it with the elite mog
sharp sierra
did evnom get nerfed?
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/blizzard-complete-patch-notes/1718288 this guy is claiming we were nerfed more then we were let on lol
says evenom was nerfed by 40%
and wasn't documented
steel scarab
😨
Pre-patch my envenoms were already hitting really weak, so I'm hoping this isn't true
sturdy dune
what embellish we going for after boots?
waxen meteor
I might go blue linen for helmet
But I might choose no embellish
Or I might go for the s1 1% dmg head
What you guys think
waxen meteor
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/blizzard-complete-patch-notes/1718288 th...
Lol for real?
RIP assassin
worthy crag
so as outlaw do I want to not press snd on the first opener?
Like is snd worth a global during subt
stoic spruce
Adrenaline Rush, BF, SnD, stealth, in that order.
When gates open
Otherwise they'll fall off immediately
You're not losing a lot of burst though
spring bough
does the 1.6k token turn into the elite mog?
Nope. It’s LFR or normal if I remember right
stoic spruce
Its one bte for globals you don't have to press later
unique bramble
Is kingsbane dispellable
wary spire
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/blizzard-complete-patch-notes/1718288 th...
Yeah don't know.
Will have to wait til wowhead or blizz comes out with the clarification.
waxen meteor
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/blizzard-complete-patch-notes/1718288 th...
Lots of salty responses from rogue haters (aka losers)
stoic spruce
Well the hate to sub is deserved
gleaming pawn
Will have to wait til wowhead or blizz comes out with the clarification.
Sadly if it’s only effecting pvp then no one is going to confirm a thing
gleaming pawn
Reroll outlaw
rustic raptor
any ideas on crafted item for outlaw this week? already have the boots
gleaming pawn
Crafted outside of boots isn’t going to mean much, most suck at this point
wary spire
Reroll outlaw
All my gear is mastery vers goddammit 
gleaming pawn
Would still perform better than Sin if those numbers are accurate 🙂
jolly sierra
me too
gleaming pawn
Probably not but also would not be the first time undocumented nerfs were pushed through
spice lichen
last time i played wow was 9.1 , coming back to rogue this patch having pretty much all ccs nerfed like what
how do i cope
surreal barn
You do battlefield blitz where flag caps are back to 5 seconds
fervent cobalt
shadowed finishers fixed? I know ss is not
storm spade
im new to rogue im playing sin what crafted piece should i make for pvp?
slimy boots?
rustic raptor
which embellishment for outlaw head piece?
storm spade
this discord sucks peak of serenity is bis
gleaming pawn
I’d expect nothing less from a Monk main honestly