RenoDX: Wuthering Waves

[cosmic hearth]

How should I test it?

[astral night]

locks are probably more stutter than avg frame rate. in theory no reason to be slower, except margin of error

new is top?

[frank heart]

new is bottom

it's probably within margin of error

[hard cedar]

thats why capframex

is the best way to capture

it draws graphs and shit

the detection is a meme but

you can see stutter in the graph

[frank heart]

how fast can i get capframe working

[hard cedar]

just install capframex,

[frank heart]

speedrun it for me

[hard cedar]

disable RTSS

and press the record button

with capeframex open

literally that sit

[astral night]

https://tenor.com/view/super-smash-bros-melee-hack-ready-go-smash-bros-items-go-gif-22893388

[frank heart]

😡

[hard cedar]

if you keep rtss enabled

both use presentmon

more presentmon threads = bad

[frank heart]

just need to disable it for the game?

none in RTSS

[hard cedar]

disable it entierly to be safe

[astral night]

https://github.com/CXWorld/CapFrameX/releases

[frank heart]

how do i disable RTSS without quitting afterburner again

[hard cedar]

find an area thats very static, not a lot of dynamic stuff going on, and take a 10-20 second capeframex capture of:

-> no reshade/no addon -- just the game

-> reshade + old addon

-> rshade + new addon

[hard cedar]

idk; I dont use rtss

just kill the process?

[frank heart]

afterburner will just re-open it

[cosmic hearth]

🥵

[hard cedar]

I install afterburner w/o rtss

so idk

maybe there is an off setting in rtss itself idk

you dont want it to hook into the game

[frank heart]

nvm

thanks google

or reddit

[cosmic hearth]

I use another software to monitor the frame rate, which is called Game Plus
I am currently testing

116~114

Without Reshade

[frank heart]

@hard cedar can't seem to search for process, not sure what im doing wrong here

[hard cedar]

just open the game

and press f10

[frank heart]

yeah but its not detecting the game

it's been scanning for processes for a whilenow

[hard cedar]

just press f10 anyway

you should hear a beep

[frank heart]

it says no process detected

[hard cedar]

oh

[frank heart]

thats what the woman says

[hard cedar]

time to scroll through the ignore list

but that should be built in

ohh

the anti cheat

might not let it hook

run capframex as admin maybe

capframex is just presentmon recordings though, doesnt need hooking

[frank heart]

capframe already asks for admin perms when it first launches

[echo jackal]

works without running as admin

[frank heart]

the hell

😭

[echo jackal]

i'm not really cpu limited though, its capped 120

[frank heart]

hard to test cpu limited on a

[cosmic hearth]

Reshade is available, RenoDX is not installed
Long term 117~115, sometimes 117~104

[frank heart]

9800x3d

[echo jackal]

yeah

5800x is a good one to test, when i had my 5900x it was very bottlenecked

[cosmic hearth]

Using RenoDRT
Long term 111~109, occasionally 112~108

I won't participate in the testing anymore
I'll leave it to you guys
I'm not professional

[visual sand]

Whar are we testing anyway?

[subtle warren]

And how long till it's complete?

[cosmic hearth]

Test RenoDX performance loss

[subtle warren]

So far what's the performance loss compared to spécial k hdr?

[hard cedar]

show the line graph

[hard cedar]

will be slightly higher; but you cant compare the two

[cosmic hearth]

Based on my experience using RenoDX, it can consume 15 frames per second in the most complex scenarios

[hard cedar]

sk is just post process hdr, its not doing anything "low level"

its just taking the sdr image, and making it "look nice"

which is fairly cheap

reno has to upgrade resources, replace shaders, etc -- all that stuff has a slight perf hit in dx12 (techinacly dx11 too; but its basically negligible now) -- but imo its worth it

[cosmic hearth]

YES

A visual feast, definitely worth it

[frank heart]

wait

are you sure

you're not hitting the

framerate cap

[echo jackal]

since i ran it already heres the data but prob not useful because of the 120 fps cap

[frank heart]

whenever someone fixes the output shader

[hard cedar]

uncapped fps please

I thought that would be obvious when benchmarking

but I guess I'll write everything out

[sly plank]

The game has a 120 fps cap

no matter what

[frank heart]

we're testing for cpu bottleneck here

what cpu do you have

yeah you can't really test this then LMAO

and my ass can't get capframe working

[echo jackal]

dlaa would just make it gpu bottlenecked, but what we want to test is cpu bottlenecking which unfortunately we're limited by the undefeatable 120fps cap

[frank heart]

actually there is a way to uncap

for both of you

turn on frame gen

🤣

[echo jackal]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1150106241608204370.webp?size=64&name=kekw~1

[frank heart]

for some asinine reason turning on frame gen removes the hard 120fps lock

🤣

thats what i heard anyways i dont use the game's built in fg

still cant get capframe working rip

[echo jackal]

lol nice it does capture framegen, but all its doing is doubling the fps so still not bottlenecked

[frank heart]

damn wtf

now i know why my RTSS wont close

my capframeX launches RTSS

wtf lol

[echo jackal]

oh capframex adds its overlay to rtss

neat

[autumn jetty]

new settings again, 0 grading strength is broken lol

there are areas where it turns skin pink

[echo jackal]

feels like the grading is a lost cause to get it looking great in all scenes, like septimont looks drastically different from previous areas

[frank heart]

@hard cedar i give up on CFX, i can probably do a couplle more runs on rtss but im prettysure its within margin of error between old a new ue

[autumn jetty]

yea 60 grading str seems to be fine so far

0 was fine until I started exploring spetimont more

lol

that's 60

ktm off itself is wrong looking to my eyes unfortunately I can't edit colors / highlight saturation to look correct no matter what

and correct = sdr like

for example carthetya's slash attack vfx should be near white at he edges and it's saturated to light blue with ktm off it looks wrong

[echo jackal]

this is my main issue with ktm off as well, and i wasn't able to fix it with the sliders

[autumn jetty]

I don't think that it's possible to fix it

ktm off's raw untonemapped look can be adjusted to be less visible but it's not fixable I think

or well I can't fix it

[frank heart]

looks good 2 me

[autumn jetty]

ktm on is wrong because it desaturates highlights and it's not really fixable either xD

[autumn jetty]

looks wrong

those effects are not supposed to be cyan colored at the edges

[frank heart]

cuz its blown out in SDR

[autumn jetty]

that's the correct look yes

but you can't really blow then out like neon lights with ktm off

[echo jackal]

those kinda things need custom renodx mod to fix

[autumn jetty]

yea unfortunately

[frank heart]

nah HDR means u can see the colors that was blown out or details that were clipped bc sdr

if u wanna blow it out

then gimma a sec

just don't restore any sat

[autumn jetty]

yes and no, you "see" more colors but not to this extent

[autumn jetty]

not better you desaturated everything

[echo jackal]

basically the kinda thing they were tweaking for stellar blade #🧩renodx-dev message

[autumn jetty]

plus the edges are still cyan colored lol

there is no transition between the blue part and the white part of the effect it's just blue with ktm off

[frank heart]

im gonna need an SDR reference

[autumn jetty]

it desaturates into white

not everything is white

if you turn that white part blue then you change the intended look of the vfx

#1383049193186136216 message this is too desaturated unfortunately because ktm on is like that no way to fix it

[hard cedar]

rip, thanks for trying

[autumn jetty]

but ktm on looks closer to the "correct" intended look imo

it's starfield all over again with ktm off

people lowed how colorful the gravdrive effect looked without tonemapping

but it was 100% wrong

[frank heart]

i don't consider this an issue but at least i get what you mean

[autumn jetty]

I mean it's not "bad", people like that look too, but it's technically wrong looking

[echo jackal]

a lot of things blowout to white as they get brighter and effect is lost with ktm off

[autumn jetty]

yes

blue and reddish tones are the most affected

i can't find the grav drive example, but this shows my issue

focus on the engine starter sparkles

it's not this bad in wuwa because you can adjust the sliders to mask the issue

[cosmic hearth]

It's too bright

[frank heart]

looks pretty white to me

[autumn jetty]

umm no XD

it's the same raw cyan

I mean it's better

but not perfect 😄

[frank heart]

no

you just need to think outside the box

they're asking for things to be blown out more to white

so

just move peak brightness to 4000

[autumn jetty]

idk how to describe it, you desaturate into cyan instead of white

[frank heart]

the center is white

[cosmic hearth]

I need to remind you that in this software, it cannot display high dynamic images

[autumn jetty]

I mean it's better yes

[cosmic hearth]

The pictures it posts are different from what it sees in the game

[autumn jetty]

but it's super bright too

clipping bright

[cosmic hearth]

It's difficult for us to understand the same color and meaning

[frank heart]

yes that's the intent

since it's technically clipping bright for SDR too

it's a cope if you really wanted it though

[cosmic hearth]

[frank heart]

if there was a custom mod

[autumn jetty]

well yea but it's not a good one 😄

[frank heart]

you would let only the sword VFX blow out earlier

only for certain characters

[autumn jetty]

it's not just the sword vfx

[cosmic hearth]

I think that modifying HDR based on SDR primary colors has contrast, highlights, and details. This should be correct

[autumn jetty]

all bright character vfx

changli's flame is similar too

[frank heart]

cause its clipping in sdr yes

[autumn jetty]

but changli's goes to yellow instead of white

[frank heart]

it's a feature for me not a bug

[cosmic hearth]

Not based on primary colors, modify your own preferences, this is just your own standard

[frank heart]

rover sword VFX

is mostly intact

[autumn jetty]

😄

because it's bright yellow by default

no deep colors

[frank heart]

no

aero rover

[autumn jetty]

ah

[frank heart]

try it

[autumn jetty]

I doN't want to switch back to kuro off XD

[cosmic hearth]

HDR， It's for high dynamic range, not changing the color

[autumn jetty]

rover is green tho

just like ciaconna

green is usually fine

[frank heart]

what

rover is blue

[cosmic hearth]

That is to say, we should be using SDR based primary colors to increase highlights, contrast, and dark details

[frank heart]

aero sword vfx is blue

the difference is

[autumn jetty]

ah hmm I cant remember I have to switch to her sec lol

[frank heart]

they design the white edge effect

right into the texture

whereas carth is just blue but brighter

and then rely on tonemapper

[autumn jetty]

it's only her banner thats green yea

[frank heart]

to blow it to white

[cosmic hearth]

Isn't it? You have used HDR, and changing the contrast and highlight will slightly alter the color

[autumn jetty]

this is with ktm on

[cosmic hearth]

It's difficult to maintain the original color

Is this an overexposure issue?

[autumn jetty]

I have to restart the game to switch 😩

[frank heart]

white edge is baked into the effect, yea, check my video

[visual sand]

Okay which NVIDIA driver do I use for the game not to constantly crash?

[frank heart]

go to start of post

[cosmic hearth]

572.83

[frank heart]

scroll down a few lines

[frank heart]

^

[visual sand]

Aye thanks

[autumn jetty]

yea rover is mostly unaffected

[frank heart]

nothing you can really do about it

it is what it is

rover is just a lucky case because they bake the white right in

[cosmic hearth]

I think Rover should be affected, that's not right.

SDR， It is the original color
HDR， Based on SDR, highlights, high dynamics, contrast, and more dark details have been added, resulting in different special effects. I think this is reasonable

Unreasonable is overexposure

[frank heart]

rover is affected but you get all the benefits with none of the downsides

[cosmic hearth]

To think like this, that's too much of a bug

[frank heart]

when the devs made these effects they intend the look for it to turn gradually white as it reaches the edge and they used whatever methods that achieved the desired result

carthe is just make the blue brighter

[cosmic hearth]

Unless Kuro produces native HDR, they decide what color the special effects are

[frank heart]

rover is actually having the edges be white

[cosmic hearth]

hiccup

Difficult to understand

For example, the cloud. In SDR, it lacks highlights and unclear light and dark details.
In HDR, clouds have highlights, brighter white, and distinct brightness and darkness.

Therefore, HDR keeps the original colors unchanged, which is incorrect and unreasonable

[frank heart]

the best you can hope for is whoever made rover's effect keep the same style and they do every other characters

[cosmic hearth]

Yeah, so adding highlights, contrast, and more dark details based on the original colors makes the brighter the brighter and the darker the darker

No, my English level is too poor, and at the same time, my understanding of English is too poor

Sleep sleep
Good night, everyone

[autumn jetty]

good night

I did too much testing I should focus on echo farming for Carte

😩

[frank heart]

you can try the 4000 peak trick if you want that blowout

Not gonna completely solve ur issues

And I did that trick with kuro off so its gonna look even more blown tf out with kuro on

[autumn jetty]

yea no thx lol

I will just live with 60 grading str for now

or I will switch to inverse tonemapping later

but I would hate to do that

[frank heart]

Carthe impact frames still need 2 be fixed tho 😔

Actually curious how they achieved that effect when if u draw only the shader for the impact frames its just white

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1258174618129137764/1383177512695365804/2025-06-14_00-24-57.mp4?ex=684f2971&is=684dd7f1&hm=5d3e79b79a6cc0e3295a6c18f77314982aef0498d605f9a10d9c037356cd0d33&

From that

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1383049193186136216/1383137974627074048/2025-06-14_00-36-02.mp4?ex=684f049e&is=684db31e&hm=e88e51625f4708ca648eb2e917edcc6396b89688416938b23eb396be32249314&

To this

[autumn jetty]

it looks like this now?

xD

[frank heart]

No

Still need to be patched

I made it work by putting UI to 400 nits

Cuz its tied to UI

Else it'd look like this

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1383049193186136216/1383123031500652564/Wuthering_Waves_2025.06.13_-_12.23.38.04.mp4?ex=684ef6b3&is=684da533&hm=4ee88b105ae98477fac1b43fa800de65d971b5db743b66dd53031202e98a2588&

[autumn jetty]

ah yea I see

what are the other shaders that need to be fixed?

[frank heart]

#1321685184852135967 message

Its actually 1 shader really

The other three fixes clamping in the boss arena

But it could honestly be skipped cause its really just one area thats acting weird compared to the rest of the game

[autumn jetty]

and what about the ktm on issues?

[frank heart]

wdym ktm on issues

[autumn jetty]

you said that there are more shader issues with ktm on

[frank heart]

^

The clamping only occurs with kurotonemapping on

[autumn jetty]

ah ok

thx

[subtle warren]

Is scene grading 100 good on your settings? @frank heart

[autumn jetty]

effects darkening the whole image hmm

was it like this in sdr too?

I cant remember

I mean attack vfxs

[nocturne lava]

oh shit this fixed my issues with sk, tyvm

I think this looks okay

I mostly stole your settings lol

my poor oled is not liking this area

but hmmm dropping game brightness drops the highlights a lot too I think

[frank heart]

Vanilla / Old tune / New Tune

Vanilla / Old Tune / New Tune

[cosmic hearth]

第三张好看

The third one looks good

[autumn jetty]

the third one looks weird from the first set of pictures, but the fire looks a lot better, contrast is too high tho 😛

[frank heart]

I like my contrast

Generally its more of the vanilla tones from the test i've made

Less red tint shift on highly saturated colors

Otherwise its the same as my older presets

Less neon bleed on shore keeper as well

[autumn jetty]

btw

Pumbo's auto hdr with hue conserving.. 😄

OKLab is not good when it comes to colors lol

it's probalby not this simple but still, it's oklab that causes the white skin issue

[frank heart]

Looks like the same hue

As my new tune

[autumn jetty]

nah 😄

but its close

[frank heart]

I could probably match

With a bit extra sceje grading strength

[autumn jetty]

I can see that weird orange hue in yours but it's close yea

plus the middle of the fire is still not bright enough

the brightest part is barely brighter/different in color

[frank heart]

I mean obvious yeah cause thats detail we recovered

Unless u intentionally clip

Just trying to hue match

If u want i can prob try

To do a grade

With kuro on

[autumn jetty]

but I don't want to recover details that are not meant to be recovered 😭

[autumn jetty]

the problem with kuro on is the white skin issue I don't think that you can get around that unfortunately, we need a different hue processor

white skin/edge lighting being white

with kuro off the UI gets unclipped too which makes some of the UI effects blinding bright

that's not good either

especially when you use an OLED screen

[frank heart]

Nah bro thats actually based

I like UI VFX that r unclipped

Really cool

Esp in zenless zone

The default UI VFX is super clipped

U can see even in SDR

Honestly goated

[autumn jetty]

it looks weird imo, it's not dynamic at all, the static part is fixed UI brightness, then the VFX part is unclipped

[frank heart]

Yeah thats exactly what i like

The fire effect they ovwrlay

Etc

Unclipped

The actual 2D art is UI brightness controlled

And thats fine

[autumn jetty]

I don't want my forte bar to be 500 nits lol

[frank heart]

Wtf

Fake HDR fan

[frank heart]

Ill try my hand in a bit

Hue with kuro off with new tuning is almost perfect now

well

As good as it can be without going custom

You can prob copy my preset increase strength, and then reduce contrast

[autumn jetty]

I hate HUD in the first place, I want minimal hud in all games 😄

[frank heart]

Use the UI hide shortcut?

[autumn jetty]

I use it

if I know my rotation then I can fight without UI

it can be annoying tho

[frank heart]

If u want adjustable UI

Someone could probably implement it

The UI shaders are toggleable

Via the devkit

Its segmented quite nicely

[autumn jetty]

yea but we are playing with fire

[frank heart]

I can do only show forte bar for example

[autumn jetty]

even now

Kuro does not ban paying "customers" even if they detect weirdness, but I don't really want to risk it even more 😄

[frank heart]

We could probably ask one of the devs how to do it

Make a toggleable shader

[autumn jetty]

that would be awesome

horizon forbidden west style

[frank heart]

How about u do it

[autumn jetty]

I will contant Kuro then lol

[frank heart]

https://tenor.com/view/thanos-gif-25117042

[frank heart]

I mean actually putting it in this mod

@hard cedar if we know the UI shaders we could add it in as a toggle option under the mod right

[autumn jetty]

I only need this part

nothing else tbh

[autumn jetty]

I don't play ZZZ so idk maybe it's better there

I dropped the game in 1.0 lol

[autumn jetty]

for filmic preset lowers only tho 😄

[autumn jetty]

yea I will test it, but idk I was very disappointed with kuro off yesterday

[autumn jetty]

Btw back to the "recovering" details from flames argument:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ieNfIk3Ruo

There are very bright spots in natural flames in a real fire which are near white/very bright yellow, "recovering" details from these bright parts makes no sense if we want to mimic what we can see in real life. Without these bright spots, a bonefire is not a bonefire.

Yea sure anime fire is never going to look like real fire, but still, we know how burning wood looks, and it can look very weird when it's not looking "normal"

[frank heart]

https://youtu.be/jECIZpEsX5s?si=nafu_-kCwFTu8Iw2

[autumn jetty]

this is not a slow burning bonefire 😅 and it actually looks weird. The camera is fighting with the fire to capture it

[frank heart]

Cuz its exposed for the fire

Not fighting with fire

[autumn jetty]

I mean make a bonefire outside and check the flames lol

[autumn jetty]

yes, your eyes are not like that

[frank heart]

i know

[frank heart]

Just lit one this afternoon

[cosmic hearth]

？

？？？

[frank heart]

Urs is correct if the surroundings is dark

But if its like afternoon with lighting its not out of the question for the fire to not look white like that

[autumn jetty]

You can call it personal preference, but they would have changed the sdr version to be more universal orange if they wanted it to look like the flames in your video

[frank heart]

taking creative liberties r fine because if they had the ability to do HDR theres no saying they'd would still let the fires blown out like that

[autumn jetty]

but you don't need hdr to make orange fires

[frank heart]

Orange without proper brightness wont look very good

Like how u can tonemap everything so SDR range so no detail is lost

[autumn jetty]

exactly and ktm off flames are not bright enough

[frank heart]

But it would look off

[frank heart]

Theyre bright enough except in nighttime

[autumn jetty]

well yea

[frank heart]

^

I could say having the flames be pure white during the day is wrong too ehe

[autumn jetty]

ofc pure white flames are wrong

ktm on is wrong too

but less wrong than ktm off 😄

capturing flames is tricky we can find examples for both, it depends on the exposure, white balance and ai trickery

[frank heart]

Id say off is only inaccurate if you're looking at night

[autumn jetty]

cameras use nowadays

[frank heart]

I just lit a fire this afternoon and its definitely not like ur bonfire video

[autumn jetty]

in pure daylight? ofc not

[frank heart]

No

I did say afternoon

[autumn jetty]

but #1383049193186136216 message

this is at night 😄

[frank heart]

Sky is kinda blue

Sunset dusk ish

[autumn jetty]

anyways, nigh time fire looks weird in wuwa with both ktm off/on but it's objectively more "wrong looking" with ktm off

it's just not bright enough

we can agree that we prefer very different looks when it comes to HDR 😂

[frank heart]

I can get behind that

@tough ember i saw ur msg in the renodx channel whatu doin bud

R u gonna give us a mod 😅

[autumn jetty]

I should actually continue playing the game now xD

[subtle warren]

I think it depends by your monitor/tv

If the monitor u have is bright enough

[autumn jetty]

it's the game unfortunately

[nocturne lava]

I think I came up with some very natural feeling settings with ktm on

oh hmm this was a terrible place to take screenshots, the night got darker and the whole back half of the shadows got completely different

Highlight saturation can maybe be a bit higher

[nocturne lava]

what settings are you running here?

[autumn jetty]

@frank heart your super high peak brightness methode can actually work to fix my highlights issues with ktm off

I just need to use Lilium's tonemapper shader on top of reno

[autumn jetty]

100 grading strength? nice

[cosmic hearth]

My settings only add some highlights, contrast, distinct bright and dark details, while pursuing vanilla's natural colors

[autumn jetty]

you turned off kuro tonemapper right?

[cosmic hearth]

ON

[autumn jetty]

ah ok

[cosmic hearth]

open

I'm not sure if my settings are helpful to you. Because I am a MiniLED monitor

[frank heart]

Ironic

Cuz default game is ue tonemapping + kurotonemapping

And now ur fixing it by

[nocturne lava]

I'll try them on my miniled in a bit. I have one miniled and one oled

[frank heart]

Applying another tonemapper

On top of renodrt

🤣

[autumn jetty]

but at least you can control it, that's the best we can do atm

[frank heart]

Yeah just find the parallel funny

[autumn jetty]

it is funny yea 😄

[frank heart]

https://tenor.com/view/i-used-the-stones-to-destroy-the-stones-thanos-wood-minecraft-endgame-gif-7824767983135848606

[subtle warren]

What's your max nits?

[autumn jetty]

around 800

rising peak to 4000 does not "fix" the fire, it's a VFX issue

it's a lot dimmer than attack VFXs

[frank heart]

@tough ember if ur gonna tackle this its a good idea to make the kurotonemapping into a slider with strength 0-100 or at least a toggle so we dont have to reset the game every time we need to compare the two

[autumn jetty]

custom reno for wuwa ? 😄

[frank heart]

Also bro patch the fleur shader 😔

i mean keeping in the generic UE mod is good if u can do it

Since u dont have to rebuild every time the generic UE part gets an update

And marat added custom upgrades depending on filename

Last i remember

[subtle warren]

Even if you put it at 4000 nits, your max peak brightness is 800, so if you hit the slider to 4000 it's gonna stay at 800

[autumn jetty]

if you increase the peak, you lower the highlight contrast, so everything is 800 nits even dimmer highlights

but the fire vfx does not really change even at 800 nits

while attack vfxs turn pure white because the effects are clipped

aka the fire vfx itself is dimmer than most of the effects in-game

when it should be a lot brighter

[subtle warren]

Because mine is more than 1000 nits and the fire looks fine

Looks "bright" enough

[nocturne lava]

this looks pretty good on miniled

I think that's how I will play the septimont quests

my poor oled is not liking the desert aesthetics lol

[peak geyser]

What monitor?

[nocturne lava]

okay I'm downgrading to 572.83 this is ridiculous

[nocturne lava]

msi 271qpx

[peak geyser]

RT ON?

[nocturne lava]

yup lol

[peak geyser]

Yeah. RT has been broken since 2.4 went live.

[quartz leaf]

How is the oled compared to the miniled btw

I been wanting to try oled 😫

[peak geyser]

Better blacks on OLED. But if you don't play/watch a bunch of dark content it might not be that big of an upgrade.

Once proper QD-OLED monitors start coming out it might be worth though. Right now most have trash peak brightness.

[nocturne lava]

strongly depends on the content. for dimmer very shadowy content with small highlights it looks outstanding. stuff like the first map of stellar blade for example looked excellent on the oled. But for brighter daytime stuff like in septimont in the new wuwa patch the the dimming gets really out of hand 😦

[quartz leaf]

Hmm yea was concerned about brightness

[peak geyser]

The dimming is ABL. It's a monitor specific issue. I don't get it with my Asus OLED unless I go too crazy with th ebrightness. But proper calibrated it's a non-issue.

[quartz leaf]

I might wait for upcoming tandem WOLED. Supposedly peak 1500 nits 👀

[peak geyser]

The next gen QD-OLED they showed at this years trade shows look hopeful. Pushing 2k peak brightness. I'd wait.

[nocturne lava]

my miniled is ips so even with the local dimming you still get some ips glow in shadowy content and small highlights get dimmed a bit. However it looks absolutely amazing in daytime stuff or nights with bigger light sources

[quartz leaf]

I got Samsung odyssey neo g8 miniled

[nocturne lava]

that's the thing, there just wasn't a combination of settings I could find where I could really see well

[quartz leaf]

Was thinking of going to a 1440p oled but yeaaa idk

[peak geyser]

Personally I'm not touching mini LED. Micro LED once it matures will probably be best of both worlds.

[quartz leaf]

In 10+ years yea

🤣

[peak geyser]

Probably. XP
Till then QD is best. Not sure why monitors have such issues. My QD TV hits like 3k peak brightness.

[nocturne lava]

there are some games where it looks amazing to be fair. But sometimes it just kinda falls apart hard too

[peak geyser]

Problem with HDR in general is if you don't go through the effort of tuning it right it can actually look worse than a good SDR monitor. 😦

[quartz leaf]

Windows hdr kek

[peak geyser]

Nah. Windows is fine. It's the games themselves.

[nocturne lava]

well, I can't really calibrate around the panel limitations

unless I end up doing like 80 paper white

[quartz leaf]

I have also noticed that sdr looks so good already on my monitor

[peak geyser]

True. If you have poor brightness or aggressive ABL built in it's tough.

[quartz leaf]

Any of you use hdr analysis tool in reshade?

[peak geyser]

Lillium's, yeah

[quartz leaf]

Cuz it was reporting like 1500nits in ghost of tsushima hdr

But my monitor ain't that bright. I think

[peak geyser]

Probably true. Goes back to most games having shit HDR implimentation.

Is a big reason why Reno mod is so important for HDR users.

[quartz leaf]

Ye

[peak geyser]

I've heard that CP2077 has ass HDR and Reno is a game changer for it. But I haven't gone back to that game yet to try Reno

[nocturne lava]

iirc the hdr is basically stretched SDR from like 300 nit peak

reno adds a lot more detail in

[peak geyser]

That's crazy.
Yeah, I just played wiht the stock HDR. Don't remember having an issue with it. But never found it crazy impressive either. (Your description is probably why. lol)

[quartz leaf]

I'm gonna check peak brightness on wuwa

[peak geyser]

WuWa doesn't have HDR. So it's gonna be like 400 or less I bet

[quartz leaf]

With reno enabled

[nocturne lava]

it's very contrasty and cyberpunk's lighting looks amazing so you probably just found it fine

but it looks a lot clearer with reno

[quartz leaf]

Or does it not work like that

[peak geyser]

The colours make the brain's chemicals happy. XD

[peak geyser]

Reno adds HDR. So it will go up to whatever you set the peak slider to.

[frank heart]

alright

got back to my rig

finally able to see image without streaming compressions

KuroTonemapping Off preset

new final

all even numbers no odd numbers

Vanilla / RenoDRT

[quartz leaf]

ktm 0 yea?

[frank heart]

yes

Vanilla / RenoDRT

[peak geyser]

@frank heart You ever figure out good KTM settings?

[frank heart]

this is tuning with KTM off

wdym good ktm settings

[subtle warren]

You think this one is better than your previous ?

Can you compare your previous with your new?

[peak geyser]

Thought you were working on settings with Kuro Tone Mapping on at one point.

[frank heart]

working on that currently

okay

i might have an idea

[cosmic hearth]

Perhaps I should give up on Strength 100

[frank heart]

Vanilla / RenoDRT

so far so good at hue conserving

aight

Vanilla / RenoDRT

you could say this is vanilla plus

[peak geyser]

Looking a lot better. Will be interested to see the final settings.

[frank heart]

I'm probably done

[autumn jetty]

with kuro tonemapping off? post pictures please

[frank heart]

for kuro on I'll have vanilla+ if you feel the need to keep the game's original contrast

and vanilla ++ if someone put a gun to my head and force me to play with kuro on

it's the same as vanilla+ with two sliders changed

[subtle warren]

I will do that tomorrow cause I'm not currently home, tell me the spot you want me to take picture of

[autumn jetty]

it looks nice! The highlights hues are still a little off but it's not too bad

[autumn jetty]

yea the fire looks fine here

[autumn jetty]

Septimont torches for example

[frank heart]

thats cuz its kuro off

whoops looks like wrong image uploaded

[autumn jetty]

You are trying to win me over I knew it! 🤣

[frank heart]

Vanilla / RenoDRT (Vanilla+) / RenoDRT (less washed out)

[frank heart]

you could say i love a challenge

[autumn jetty]

your new preset is nice, I mean it's still too contrasty to my taste but the colors are nice

[frank heart]

you could just use the vanilla+ one

[autumn jetty]

yea true

it needs a little bit of extra saturation I think

[frank heart]

only very minor contrast adjustments

[autumn jetty]

but yea vanilla+ is nice

[frank heart]

Vanilla + / more contrast vanilla + (60 highlights and 40 shadows please, i have it flipped)

[autumn jetty]

I updated Lillium's HDR shaders and I'm not sure how I feel about the new analyzer, it's a lot less readable

[frank heart]

you could probably do that yourself bc changing it to an odd number will tick me off

[autumn jetty]

oh no 0 grading?

how does the septimont boss area look like?

[frank heart]

oh wiat i have it flipped

[autumn jetty]

I was happy with 0 grading until i started exploring septimont xD

[frank heart]

oh true

that's a different lut used

LOL

[autumn jetty]

it's pink

xD

[frank heart]

snowflake area

all trouble arises from there 🤣

okay

hmm

now that I look at it

the boss area might be the only area with no kurotonemapping

so my grade works with the expectation

that you have kurotonemapping on

and it looks normal everywhere

everywhere except the boss area

[autumn jetty]

I love how inconsistent Kuro is with these stuff, I fear the day when they decide to add HDR support

yea grading 0 looked really good mostly everywhere

[frank heart]

if you have kuro on and strength 100 essentially it goes through ktm + UE grading lut

so its like

double blowout

so i put it at strength 0

you only need to deal with KTM

except in the boss area where they decided to

not use it

and you;'re getting all the wack colors underneath

[autumn jetty]

str 50-60 was fine but yea 0 was better everywhere else

[autumn jetty]

I guess some new guy was tasked with making the boss area

[frank heart]

🤣

it's funny though

one step outside boss area

[peak geyser]

Kuro intern

[frank heart]

one step inside/ outside

[autumn jetty]

rofl yea

[frank heart]

hmm

can someone without the mod running confrim

actuallyy it's broken vanilla too

[peak geyser]

Artistic intent XP

[autumn jetty]

itt looks fine in SDR

i checked it

[frank heart]

this is vanilla

[autumn jetty]

yea it's normal

[peak geyser]

I actually think the messed up one looks more like a boss area with the exaggeration. lol

[frank heart]

look at the fire

on changli

[autumn jetty]

oh rofl yea

[frank heart]

it might be broken but im not sure if it's reno or the game

[autumn jetty]

leme check

sec

[peak geyser]

Yeah, that fire is busted. XD

[frank heart]

one step outside in vanilla

[peak geyser]

Yeah, so even without the Reno settings it's just goofy in the game in general I guess?

[autumn jetty]

this is no reno

it looks fine hmm

[frank heart]

so it's actually a reno bug?

[autumn jetty]

could be yea

[peak geyser]

Hmmmm

[autumn jetty]

this area looks really cool btw

I love the sky

it's very dimm tho

[frank heart]

it's probably a reno bug

if you switch 0x3b22b2cc which is the output shader used when you enter the area

back to the original version

the issue goes away

[autumn jetty]

oh nice catch

[frank heart]

so for once

its not kuro jank

it's our jank

🤣

[autumn jetty]

but this means that I can start using 0 grading, this arena was the reason I stoped using it i was afraid that there will be other areas like this

I thought that it's Kuro jank yea XD

[frank heart]

flame becomes deep red

look at changli's flames

wanna tackle this lul

shortfuse originally patched this shader so maybe u can ask him for some pointers

[peak geyser]

You thinking of not using the Kuro tone mapping now?

[frank heart]

I think he means using kuro with 0 grading

[peak geyser]

Ah, yes

[autumn jetty]

@astral night Can you help us wit this issue? #1383049193186136216 message the flames on the character's clothes turn deep fried red. Switching 0x3b22b2cc back to "original" fixes it.

[autumn jetty]

yup

ktm on with grading str 0 looks really good

[astral night]

Original with Vanilla? Then yeah that's a decompiler bug

If Original doesn't look like the Vanilla tonemap option, usually means a bad decompile

[autumn jetty]

it looks wrong when it's on "add-on" and looks correct when it's set to "original"

[frank heart]

yeah setting the tonemapper from RenoDRT -> vanilla doesn't fix it

changing the shader from add-on -> original in devkit does

so a bad decompile?

[astral night]

Yes. We outsource our shader model 5 decompilation to 3dmigoto

SM6 shaders I wrote the decompiler

[visual sand]

What settings you using?

[cosmic hearth]

#1383049193186136216 message

[visual sand]

Kuromapping on or off

[cosmic hearth]

on

[visual sand]

Left or right

[cosmic hearth]

You can try them all and see which setting suits your preferences

[peak geyser]

Kuro tone mapping enabled?

[cosmic hearth]

YES

[frank heart]

Enabled

[visual sand]

Is the white outlines on characters normal?

[frank heart]

yes

Its the edge lighting

[visual sand]

Also you do guys mess with the peak brightness or leave it alone

[frank heart]

Peak set to your display

If your display can do 1000 set to 1000

[visual sand]

Aye

[cosmic hearth]

Oh, it's too late. It's time for bed
Good night everyone.

[visual sand]

Night

[astral night]

5.x means both 5.0 and 5.1

5.0 for DX11 and 5.1 for DX12. It relates to constants injection

(cbuffers)

DevKit doesn't support 5.x

The system that loads shaders from disk isn't automatically aware if the usage is DX11 or DX12. Just loads it into memory for another system to inject.

[visual sand]

I guess there's no way to fix that right?

[astral night]

I load from another folder and call it 5.1 and test in DX12 with the addon running. You can choose original, addon, or file.

The addon will push the shader constants which will allow sliders to work

DevKit doesn't have any information related to how to push constants, but it won't disrupt an loaded addon's ability to push constants. That said, addons don't know when to push constants except for what's in that addon's list of shaders

Meaning, if you try to load a shader from devkit the addon doesn't know about it won't have pushed constants in some cases

[visual sand]

So are we still trying to make RenoDX work with this update?

Is it usually like with every patch or just this one in particular cause of the graphics update

[autumn jetty]

you mean the pure white edge lighting? it looks better with kuro tonemapping off, it's not supposed to be pure white and it's not white in SDR either. you can kinda fix it by increasing highlight saturation and by lowering grade strength to 0-50

yes especially if you keep grade strength at 100

[visual sand]

How much does the game change with Kurotone mapping off?

[peak geyser]

So do you suggest using kuro tonemapping or not with hdr?

[astral night]

Shader model 5.1 supports DirectX12 push constants. 5.0 doesn't support DX12 push constants. If you're not trying to use the addon's pushed constants (cbuffers) it doesn't matter. if you are then it's not going to work if you mismatch the versions

[autumn jetty]

Neither options are perfect:

• Kuro tone mapping off: It removes the clamping, but as a result VFX highlights that should desaturate into white stay "colorful", HUD effects can reach 500 nits+ brightness which looks cool but not that great for OLED screens imo.
• Kuro tone mapping on: Closer to the vanilla SDR look/colors, if you want to keep the original look then this is your only option, but keeping grading strength at 100 blows out highlights, skin looks super white as a result

kuro tonemapping off is probably better because you can fix the white skin issue

and no need to lower screen grading if you don't want to

[visual sand]

Yeah I have an OLED and that's a huge issue for me

Like skin looks way too bright now

[astral night]

Could mess with lower exposure

But grading is just one of things that takes a lot of fiddling

[autumn jetty]

skin is considered highlight in the game and character models are excluded from lot of the calculations so skin is always bright

so yea there is no perfect solution

skin brightness is actually controllable with inverse tone mapping by adjusting shoulder start

[visual sand]

Where is the engine file located

[autumn jetty]

Wuthering Waves\Wuthering Waves Game\Client\Saved\Config\WindowsNoEditor

[visual sand]

Aye

[autumn jetty]

This is a nice preset imo the vanilla+ version:
#1383049193186136216 message

[visual sand]

Right or Left?

[autumn jetty]

left

but it's a 0 grading preset

aka it disables the LUTs

[peak geyser]

Sounds about right. But it's nice to get another opinion on things. ^^

I don't find the Strengh setting too different between 50 and 100. But if what people were saying about peak brightness counteracting the color issue of higher strength settings that could explain why I don't find it too washed out. My peak is @ 940 atm.

[autumn jetty]

50-60 strength is a good compromise yea

0 looks the best, but it's not really vanilla with the LUTs disabled

[peak geyser]

0 just seems too dim to me.

[autumn jetty]

depends on the location

if you set it to 0 peak brightness stays the same everywhere

aka you can increase the highlights slider until you find a value you like

[peak geyser]

Can call me crazy but this Is what I'm using after playing with everyone else's presets. Probably not technically optimal but /shrug

[visual sand]

Okay this is mine

What did you guys do for the ingame brightness settings?

[peak geyser]

Is there a way to fix the checkerboarding of the mist or is it just how the game is?

[peak geyser]

Mine is 20. Anything higher is washed out

Makes sense. Might be part of why I find the game too dim with Reno Strength set to 0

[visual sand]

I have the opposite problem where the game is too bright

I did turn down Expoure and it looks bette rnow

But then you have white skin and white outlines

[autumn jetty]

kuro toenmapping on/off?

[peak geyser]

On
In game colors 20/60/50

[autumn jetty]

thats's weird, which DLSS preset are you suing and at what resolution?

[visual sand]

Like a seperate file?

[peak geyser]

DLAA Preset K, 1440p

NV Sharpen (Old) set to 15 exaggerates it for sure. But the game is too blurry w/o it imo.

[autumn jetty]

yea just use OptiScaler if you want sharpening

I had problems with preset K

artifacts around the character and during idle animations

[peak geyser]

Still there with J. Didn't really change anything

[autumn jetty]

what about with E?

[peak geyser]

Can try next

[autumn jetty]

it looks like a low resolution volumetric effect tho

problably not DLSS related

the first looks okayish

I mean I prefer the first

the second with the LUT applied is fine too I guess but it needs fine tuning

[peak geyser]

Preset E does seem to be better at least. Still there. Think it's just a low res effect.

[autumn jetty]

yea it's insane haha

and it varies by location

it can crush shadows too

compared to 0 str

yea end not just the player bright objects too

yup

some kind of bloom/lens flare

[visual sand]

Are we thinking of making a specific Wuwa Renodx Branch?

How long do you think this whole thing will take?

[astral night]

Nothing truly different than just handful of custom shaders. Overall process is the same

It would be separation for no real benefit

You'd have to migrate changes back and forth between both. Like Marat added white clip, no reason all UE can't have that

[visual sand]

You think they'll every add Native HDR?

[frank heart]

Its not a bug its a feature

dont know why you wouldnt want it as it makes the outline glow nicely in hdr

[frank heart]

Use DLSS CNN

game is not officially made for Transformer and this is one of the issue it causes

it will be even worse in the avinoleum area

@tough ember add all the UI as toggles?

[peak geyser]

CNN reduced the checkerboarding. But then I have NPC ghosting everywhere.
I'll deal with the worse smoke. ^^;

[frank heart]

sure

LOL

how did you add the sliders

i might try to do something myself

i know all the shaders i want to toggle

just need to put them in

u go ahead brah

if u want 2 i can also give u all the UI related shaders

label all of them

I wonder if we can add a keyboard or a controller shortcut

because this UI disabling stuff

is very crude

[frank heart]

if i disable it to this which would be my preference I'll need a shortcut to re-enable it

because the shader includes all the visible text

so if you open the quest menu you'd want to re-enable

nice

pics?

[echo jackal]

would be cool if we could piggyback off stuff ppl already made for 3dmigoto mods, its got the shaders and stuff in there i believe but no idea how transferable they would be to renodx https://gamebanana.com/mods/525176

[frank heart]

yeah i was about to link that

LUL

[echo jackal]

also was testing engine.ini stuff and seems like renodx no longer breaks with disabling chromatic abberation and vignette

r.SceneColorFringeQuality=0
r.Tonemapper.Quality=0```

[frank heart]

0xa21ac2cd (white circle indicator when a button is pressed)

you mean this ? #1321685184852135967 message

on vs off at both strength values

0x03354fcd and 0x1214a47d ( circle indicator for available ult)

should be

ue4 tonemapper applies with ktm on from what i can see

you have a compare pic?

i mean the shaders you suspecting of disabling ktm

i aint disabling no blur

0x9744f4ac

that one can be safely disabled though

since its not all the text UI

but luckily only the unecessary ones

yeah flash thats tied to UI

I can give you the exact shader

if you want to tackle that

let me quickly dump it

cuz i forgot the shader name lmao

have fun bud

it's gonna be a pain cause this shader only triggers with fleur

ult

for like 2s during the impact frames

u can replay the trial

to qiuckly test

just general loss of definition compared to ktm off

oh that was lucky

i matched it shot for shot subconsciously

left is ON

right is OFF

you can see on the tree highlights on the right

this is in the portal at lorelei boss area

but you see what i mean right

ktm on the details are very blown out even though it's in HDR

off looks a lot more like if you look at trees irl

if you know what i mean

the glow is pretty natural

if you can maybe do a scene grading "2"

that specifically works for KTM

but not only strength

all the hue saturation

you know all the settings underneath strength in scene grading

they don't work with KTM on

yeah just a hunch but it's bc the KTM applies before all of that is applied

KTm already kills all the colors

so theres nothing to restore

not sure if that;s true or not though

the shaders u found that r related

are they before the final ouput shader?

yeah

ktm off is pure unreal so all the lutbuilder mods

would apply

all the sliders work with ktm off

ktm on is probably acting as it own SDR LUT

probably put somewhere in the pipeline so that you can't get the stronger hues from untonemapped

here's how shortfuse described the pipeline fyi

yeah sorry i mean the end effect

[cosmic hearth]

Waiting for you

[visual sand]

Is this a test one?

[frank heart]

i dont think these are related to kurotonemapping but just the shaders that does the bloom probably

because these still work with kurotonemapping off

lol

it's still helpfukl

Post processing blur
Highlights -> Strength (or Intensity) = Overall intensity slider for how much bloom is applied
Bloom -> Shape = controls the shape of the bloom emitted by the object. Higher value = circular boom, lower value = vertical bloom
Blur -> Spread = controls how localized the bloom is

they dont

hence strength

I think if that's what you're looking for

then its just the actual

output shader

shortfuse patched

I need to turn on kurotonemapping again to confirm

one second

sorry did not mention this yesterday though

lol

got you on a wild goose chase

at least u got the bloom slider working

aight

you know the shader after the lutbuilder right?

kurotonemapping is in here

if you switch this to original while in kurotonemapping off, the images changes a bit but it doesn't clamp your detail

if you switch this to original while in kurotonemapping on, rip all the highlights

for reference with kuro off

[echo jackal]

Agreed that the sliders are all controlling bloom. I would suggest we go with terminology a lot of reshade shaders use for bloom that are easily understood:
Highlights -> bloom strength/intensity
the bloom and blur sliders appear to both be parameters that adjust bloom radius and spread/blend

[frank heart]

u can see it still changes but the peak highlights are not all clamped down to just under 205 nits

but it just gets slightly less peaky

i think its more like some code is still in there even with ktm off

but it's just bundled in

and nothing it's doing is clamping the image

🤣

I wonder if you can spin up

a private server version

that doesnt run ACE

[cosmic hearth]

I feel that BLUR controls the light emission range. The smaller the value, the smaller the light emission range, and it also appears to emit more concentrated and brighter light

[frank heart]

yes

i documented all what it dose here

#1383049193186136216 message

[cosmic hearth]

Spread

Spread， This is great, easy to describe

[cosmic hearth]

I looked at it and your description is correct

Okay, I overthinked it. I thought the blur value had shrunk to 0. So when turning on RT mode, there shouldn't be such a situation. But in reality, it still exists

[frank heart]

probably same as KTM off

since I just quickly switched between the two to demonstrate that shader

I wonder

if we add all of these shader indiscriminately

like if we don't use the bloom sliders but we still replaced the bloom shader

its gonna hurt perf right

since its not free on dx12 iirc

yeah but if you want to play at stock

like at all strength 100

is that still going to hurt perf

since you still replaced that shader

[cosmic hearth]

The BLUR function is a fantastic thing that makes the entire screen look dreamy

[frank heart]

You gotta a recordig

Or pics?

[subtle warren]

So is this the more recent version of renodx?

[frank heart]

@tough ember #1383049193186136216 message

Copy this but with kuro on

Since i didnt change anythinf its just on/off

[subtle warren]

Alright!

[autumn jetty]

I'm tempted to get this outfit, it fits the Septimont Roman style

[frank heart]

looks like capframe decided to work today

[visual sand]

GL

[visual sand]

ACES curve?

[peak geyser]

Hmmm... might be time to turn ktm off then if that is the case.

The vibrancy hurts the eyes. ^^;

[frank heart]

Retune after using ktm off

Though the idea with this update is to have it on

But you can turn it off or adjust the intensity via slider

[peak geyser]

Maybe I'll just wait then. ^^;
Idk

[frank heart]

Use my off preset

Sure

guess you can mostly leave engine ini untouched now

Unless you want to change other thung

Wdym

The boss arena thing ah

2688 is the ordinary shader used for most things

B2cc is the one bugging out

According to shortfuse its decomp error

By 3dmigoto

#1383049193186136216 message

Only happens when that output shader is used

The lutbuilders marat fixed are all fine iirc

Did you ever patch up

The fleurdelys shader

[subtle warren]

@frank heart so is ktm on best or off?

Aight bro

[frank heart]

Personal preference

I play with it off

[misty brook]

So is there a specialized build now? 🤔