csla_iron_curtain

[low orbit]

24.2.2025
OPERATION REVIEW after Feb 22nd
Our operational group launched the rapid attack on a radio tower on the south, just close the Lipno dam.
After a quick combat, all units were transferred close to the Rotstein castle which was captured very quickly too.
Next advance was headed to the close military base where our troops take advantage of the forest and ambush the enemy there.
Then we advanced to the north, where forrest Lumber mill U Smetanu was recognized as a next target.
After a short but intensive fight in this area, our troops attacked unfinished HQ on Stozec hill.
During our effort for position of Stozec hill, enemy take the opportunity and capture the village Dobra.
So, our counterattack was headed immediately to this area.
Then we were moved to the area of Ceske Zleby, where was taken the advantage of incoming evening and the area was captured very quickly.
During the full night, using an NVGs our troops easily captured Ceske Zleby Lumber and Ceske Zleby Garrison.
From this area, still taking advantage of the night, our troops attacked new radar base located close to the highway.
There was a hard combat as enemy sent a lot of armoured and paratrooper units into counterattacks, but all of them were defeated.
In the meantime, a lot of enemy activity was reported.
They gained again the control over the area of Dobra and new counterattacks on Stozec hill and Bischofsreut were reported.
Later on, all these counterattacks were successfully repelled,
so our troops continued to liberate the Philippsreut and near radio tower.
These areas were captured easily, but the enemy launched another counterattack on the new radar base close to the highway.
So, our operational group retrieved there and take defensive positions.

EXPECTATIONS
In upcoming days, we are expecting heavy fights in direction of Strazny, Dobra and Bela.
The enemy feels our preparation to cross the Vltava river and start to occupy the eastern part of Gabreta.
So, now it's time to prepare FOBs on the North (area of Strazny) and on the South-East (area of Bela).

CONCLUSION
Our troops did not met projected targets from previous days, but the loss of already gained areas is minimal.
Now the units are regrouping and reinforcing their resoureces to be ready for the next advance during the weekend Feb 28. - Mar 1.

[low orbit]

Join us again this Fri-Sat / March 1.-2. in continuous MP session on Liberation of Gabreta on official Arma 3 server. Devs included 😉
#905529869260169226 message

Pic by SlovakianLynx

[autumn goblet]

ℹ️ mission in progress right now, feel free to join at [ OFFICIAL ] Arma 3 CSLA Zeus EU 04

[carmine lily]

Hello, is there templates for retexture CSLA vehicles? 👀

[cunning anchor]

Creator SPOTREP! 🚨

FROM: CSLA Studio
TO: Arma 3 Creator DLC Users
UNIT: ČSLA Iron Curtain
ACTIVITY: Update 1.2.1 Hotfix
SIZE: ~4.4 GB

More info here: https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/107410/view/521960587877417397

[tired adder]

Also live for Mac clients

[cunning anchor]

⚠️ Since the cDLC stable build has just been updated with the hotfix for 1.2 update, we've also updated the compatibility data on the Steam Workshop
-# Visit this link to see the full changelog: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/changelog/2503886780

[turbid summit]

⚠️ Official Arma 3 CSLA CDLC servers were updated with hotfix 1.2.1 https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/107410/view/521960587877417397 ping me if there are any issues

[south lintel]

Great to see the new release -- just a question, seems the T72 commander faces opposite to the periscope, is that intended?
i.e. if the periscope faces forwards then the commander faces backwards, and vice-versa.

[compact pendant]

a choice between gameplay and reality. In reality, the machine gun is on the opposite side of the periscope.

[south lintel]

hmm i'd much prefer that

right now it seems a bit disorienting

but don't know if it's fixable or if you want to fix it... what are the gameplay advantages of the commander facing backwards from the periscope?

[odd parcel]

Hi there, I distinctly remember playing 2 mission that I am almost certain are from the CSLA Iron Curtain DLC which consist of you flying both the AH-1 on a base attack mission, in which you go in alone, destroy the base, then RTB. The start of the mission has you flying low to avoid RADAR contact.

The second mission involves you flying a MI-24 and attacking a village that has enemy troops and a convoy inside, I don't remember as much from this mission as I didn't play it as much.

I'm almost positive that it was not a workshop mission set but at this point I could be completely wrong and have conned myself out of finding it, however I am 90% certain that it was part of the DLC, can anyone instruct me on how to find these missions or what happened to them?

[cunning anchor]

hello.. if you mean Nimrod and Operation Abort, those are part of the core cDLC and can be found in the singleplayer mission list

[odd parcel]

Ah, see these are the exact 2 missions I was looking for, however in the months of me searching for these 2 missions, I never once noticed that the drop down menu for the scenarios was up, and not showing me what I was looking for, and that is in fact really embarrassing, thank you so much

[cunning anchor]

oh, no worries.. enjoy the missions! 😊

[cunning anchor]

hi, I just found that this has already been reported on our discord

[compact pendant]

periscope straight and delete the machine gun, or leave the machine gun and periscope to the rear.

[south lintel]

Ah okay, thanks!

[low orbit]

Update of OPS Pack is here!
Contains a bunch of new SP missions and a lot of updates in previously released content.
One of the main additions is a new SP campaign Operation COMPASS.
Deep in the enemy territory, execute the sensitive tasks in all directions. But note that, in some missions, to have an advantage over the enemy, you will need to have some treasures previously found across the Gabreta.
Enjoy!
Subscribe here: http://shorturl.at/ekzT4

[radiant venture]

I'm thinking of getting CSLA, but when load the compatibility data, I can't see the map in the editor like with other compat data.

[willow frigate]

I can say Gabreta terrain was worth the price of admission to me. Such a beautiful map.

[low orbit]

Get the Arma 3 Creator DLC: CSLA Iron Curtain in 62% WEEKEND SALE and don't miss the famous OPERATIONS PACK for FREE.
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1294440
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2719101174

[misty vault]

hello there any plans on adding a UH-60A with m60s?

[short vortex]

It's there somewhere on the list of TODOs. Though, it has a low priority at the moment.

[misty vault]

no worry's looking forward for your next update

[low orbit]

Alert on Iron Curtain!
Get the Arma 3 Creator DLC: CSLA Iron Curtain in 62% SALE and don't miss the famous OPERATIONS PACK for FREE.
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1294440
https://t.co/fyi8DiDI2s

[jade cedar]

This is something I have noticed RHS and I think GM do, but for CSLA tanks why is it for the gunner the first weapon is the coax

[radiant venture]

Why would it not be like that?

[jade cedar]

idk I kinda just expected that hte main weapon would be selected first, like how for helicopters the gunners the first selected weapon is the nose gun

or well actually base game merkava does that, main gun first then coax

its just a pattern i noticed across a mod and 2 CDLC's is all

[radiant venture]

I feel like it makes sense that the coax is first because you usually use it more.

[unkempt totem]

Is it worth getting this cdlc now?

[radiant venture]

Yes!

[unkempt totem]

There is a lot of negativity surrounding it though

Is it still bad

[cunning anchor]

I recommend to download the compatibility data for non-owners (https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2503886780) from our Steam Workshop and make your own opinion, there was an update a few months ago

[crystal parrot]

First impressions stick, and the first impressions of the CDLC were not great. Doesn't matter how much future updates and patches improve it (and have improved it already), the initial reputation will always stick.

With that said, yes, I'd say it's definitely worth it

I've racked up quite a few good hours of gameplay with it, and I'd say it was completely worth the price

[radiant venture]

No!

[maiden fjord]

So true. I expected it to be at the level of GM but for two other factions. But it was not ready for release.

[unkempt totem]

Idk man the textures of the us soldiers are bad

Anyway to improve it

[crystal parrot]

The models are old. But the Czech models have been improved over time. I have hope for the US ones too 😁

But tbh, the CDLC has so much quality stuff (especially vehicles, and the map), that I think it's silly to get hung up over that

Plus a crap ton of playable content

[unkempt totem]

Hmm

I mainly wanted a quality us faction

[unkempt totem]

I'm not gonna lie the assets aren't of high quality at all

[sour ginkgo]

But in sales it is ridiculous cheap. At that price, I think there is no room for complaints. Also they probably deliver the most missions (and three campaigns) via the workshop items. Yes, the voice overs are not great, but the content is there

[radiant venture]

Just use like any mod ever to be made for Arma 3. There are hundreds of "quality" US faction mods.

[unkempt totem]

Only thing I'm really finding an issue with is the pasgt texture the helicopters since they use default rotor sounds and yeah

[fringe granite]

Is there a preferred place to post/discuss "bugs" with CSLA? I'm having a game freeze problem that the mdmps are pointing back to CSLA and trying to see if I can (help) get it resolved.

[radiant venture]

The CSLA Discord has bug report and help forum channels.

[fringe granite]

Thanks. I know you're trying to point me in the right direction and I appreciate that...but that's been the problem, I haven't found the actual CSLA discord link.

[radiant venture]

The invite is in #channel_invites_list message.

[fringe granite]

Thanks...I really loathe Discord, but I know it's where we're at now...

[jolly lantern]

Every CDLC also has their own bug tracker category on the feedback tracker https://feedback.bistudio.com/project/view/59/

[midnight echo]

Is this DLC worth it at $5? Even the recent reviews are negative

[sand bough]

Try Compatibility Data to check it out for free

[willow frigate]

Worth MORE than $5. If you love the CW era, I think it is a msut have. The gear and vehicles are beautiful. The map Gabreta and the bonus map in the free addon is completely underrated. I love it more than Livonia and Tanoa, which is worth it's full price in gold. Mix this with GM and CRW3 to create some kick ass missions.

Sad there is no OFFICIAL ESCAPE SERVER UP! Hint Hint..

[midnight echo]

I bought it. It's absolutely terrible. Not worth the $5

[haughty smelt]

that just 1 opinion

[midnight echo]

To me, it's the only opinion that matters. 😄

Really a ripoff DLC.

[haughty smelt]

like i said just 1 opinion

my point still stands

[sand bough]

You managed to ignore this post, I guess

[willow frigate]

For testing, is the compat data set the same as the full cDLC except for the SP/MP missions and the terrain?

[sand bough]

Basically yes

[willow frigate]

So we can edit missions with OTHER terrains and apply the CSLA Units, Weapons and Vehicles for testing? I had a thought to mix in some of the CSLA gear with CWR3/CUP and maybe RHS to showoff the gear for non cDLC owners.

[sand bough]

Yes, that's how it works

[simple quiver]

the data in the compat packs is the same as the one you'd download as an owner, no more no less, same restrictions as normal DLCs apply

[inland grove]

$5 is basically a single cup of coffee in this economy. You're a truly strange fellow and a very shortsighted one.

Not much else to say. Steam is full of frash for $5, anyways. Not to mention the insane console market and Nintendo's prices.

[midnight echo]

I've enjoyed cups of $5 coffee longer than this DLC though

[nimble quarry]

#first

[shy ibex]

please...

[viscid flame]

Wow another paid mod

[sand bough]

[cobalt shale]

hola!

[cedar timber]

[placid wind]

Das gut :)

I love CW 😁

[obtuse mulch]

[jolly lantern]

Sneak Preview (older version, not fully representative of current state): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tr7-4NCsrt8&feature=youtu.be

[mortal ice]

The CDLC looks really cool and I'm excited to get to play it also I'm in the top 15 of messages

[jolly lantern]

http://csla-studio.blogspot.com/ has a ton of screenshots of planned vehicles and buildings (again not fully representative of current or release state) but it gives an idea

[inner jackal]

Does anyone know whether the HouseBlock city terraced buildings have been opened up in this CDLC?

[graceful tinsel]

excited to see a new CDLC! :)

the buildings look pretty cool! Actually something different

[dense jolt]

@low orbit + @hasty bison congrats boys, well done

[hasty bison]

@dense jolt Thank You 😉

[fading snow]

Nice

[frigid gorge]

Nice

||but when are you adding X, Y, and Z??||

[shy ibex]

@frigid gorge what do you mean? is the mod only 2D? 😋

[sonic grove]

What actual year are they going for though? I see the post says "1980s", but theres a vast difference between 1980 and 1989 in terms of equipment.

[frigid gorge]

@shy ibex ive heard from trustworthy sources its 8bit only 👀

[fading snow]

Not sure but I think if you are going Campaign wise it's probably a fixed year, for equipment it probably will be from CW I'd say

[shy ibex]

well it has M1A1, so that sets the tone

[swift path]

Can I ask, the the vehiclas have the option to change there National flags and signage?

[inner jackal]

M1 or M1A1... if the latter then late 80s

[shy ibex]

blogpost says M1A1

[inner jackal]

Ah, didn't see that

[sonic grove]

Not sure but I think if you are going Campaign wise it's probably a fixed year, for equipment it probably will be from CW I'd say

The Cold War is considered to be between 1947 – 1991.

[inner jackal]

Certain gear sets a certain date range within the CW though...

E.g. M1A1 would be 86-91

[graceful dagger]

does anyone know if tanks and such will have interiors?

[copper monolith]

They've showed interior pictures of the LAV-25 before, but nothing so far about the MBT's.

[sonic grove]

I know its just me being nit picky, but you have to understand that equipment like the UH-60, while entering service in 1979, would not have been the (for lack of a better word) dominant (most numerous maybe??) helicopter in the 1980s. That role was still filled by the venerable UH-1.

[inner jackal]

Hmm... just noticed this in the store description... "caverns, mines"... Hmm

[copper monolith]

http://csla-studio.blogspot.com/2019/06/june-update.html
They published the pictures here.

[sonic grove]

I'd be disappointed to not see an M151

[shy ibex]

TBF (and i might be wrong/unfair) - us army content looks very bare bones and is only there to provide some opponent that does not rely on mods or A2 stuff...

[sonic grove]

quite possibly.

Either way, I'm buying it

And will donate a few to my team members.

[inner jackal]

Quite a bit of US Army gear in their blog posts.... HMMWVs, Trucks, M1A1, M113

[bold iron]

tbh, I know a few people have said they'll be using DHI regardless. It's hard to beat DeltaHawk's work.

[inner jackal]

See another motorbike in one of the screenshots too... 😋

[tame root]

maybe i should get started with pub-server missions again ...
this all starts looking very damn good with more and more content landing for stuff one can do in fancy missions

[trail elbow]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[swift path]

Can I ask, the the vehiclas have the option to change there National flags and signage?How about just Blank equipment for proxing? Like what GM does?

[sand bough]

Was just answered in CSLA Discord

vehicle symbols and nationality markings are customizable via editor.

[swift path]

Sweet!

[sand bough]

Probably that's how to paint FIA markings there 🙂

[swift path]

Wait a second.....

That’s a Diana SPA in one of the screens!

Holy cow I love that unit from Wargame

[surreal vortex]

congrats to the whole team. looking forward to what you cooked up for us

[trail elbow]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[cunning anchor]

https://discord.gg/Y8dW7Ag

[jolly lantern]

Yes

[exotic copper]

Glad to see some US cold war equipment finally. 5T Truck, M113s, CUCV all look awesome.

[shy ibex]

btw - friendly reminder, that if you want to support the devs as best as possible with your purchase, get the key on BI's webstore, not on steam.

[foggy pike]

Are they bringing games back to the store?

[lost cliff]

Gabreta is Homeland?

[low orbit]

yes

[trim zinc]

For the map, what does that area divide to into for the play area of the map?

[graceful dagger]

16x16 km

no wait I misread nvm

[low orbit]

@trim zinc As the CDLC is named Iron Curtain, it contains this "iconic thing" to divide the map to approx same areas

[trim zinc]

Sorry, my sentence structure was terrible.

What I met is what is the demensions of the player map how Gordon put it?

Like 40km x 40km?

[shy ibex]

its 16x16km =256km²

[trim zinc]

ah sweet.

[copper monolith]

https://arma3.com/dlc/creator

What a beautiful sight. Turning Arma 3 into the ultimate cold-war simulator. 💪

[upper galleon]

wasnt the terrain named "homeland" ?

[inner jackal]

Time for GM to concentrate on BAOR then 😉

[low orbit]

wasnt the terrain named "homeland" ?
@upper galleon Yes, in the development phase was the codename for map "Homeland"

[vivid kelp]

Turning Arma 3 into the ultimate cold-war simulator.
...I want to make a gamemode now, where two teams send threatening letters to each other but never actually fire a shot.

[copper monolith]

https://cdn.cloudflare.steamstatic.com/steam/apps/1294440/ss_70ec817637d3cfa25e7b21fa6bb2c9216a1e677b.1920x1080.jpg?t=1600778560

Is the tractor there part of the CDLC?

[fading snow]

It better be or I'm not buying

[inner jackal]

There's even a model of a tractor in a farm with a cover over its engine if my eyes are not misleading me @copper monolith

[copper monolith]

Farming equipment is crucial!

[bold iron]

Isn't that the Contact tractor.

Which is, what, the updated A2 tractor?

[vivid kelp]

Farming equipment is crucial!
Farming sim in Arma?

[inner jackal]

As the meme goes ... FArmA 😉

[fading snow]

It would be FArma

it's not ArmA

[upper galleon]

Yerevan Radio News, 1969:
There was an armed conflict on the Soviet-Chinese border. Two Chinese tanks attacked a peacefully plowing Soviet tractor. The tractor returned the fire and neutralized both tanks. After then he flew back to the kolkhoz. The chairman of the kolkhoz, Lt. Col. Yerremmenko, told a press conference that if the incident was repeated, harvesters would be deployed in the area.

[tame root]

making a farming sim out of arma should not even be that hard
biggest problem imo is the visual feedback tho 🤔
and that "attachTo" is not really suitable for pulling something behind one

[trim zinc]

I imagined if some one was to do something like a combine, you would make the harvesting tool portion itself a turret.

[tame root]

i am happy enough if basic farming equipment actually is present

might actually do give it a try then

just need like a tractor, basic moaw thingy, gruber and all that

and at best, some basic ground "textures" that i can use for growing crops

and whoopsiwops

a mod would get born that could be 100% scripted

😄

[limpid wraith]

http://ofpr.info.paradoxstudio.uk/8373-farmer-simulator-for-ofp.html there was thing thingy for ofp

I remember it was actually quite cool to harvest 😄

[tame root]

ever played farming sim? that thing is bad ... still made ton of fun

for some reason it just is :3

[trim zinc]

I think it would fantastic to do a Laws of War style mission were your a farmer dealing with a war going on. Tanks rolling over your fields, dealing with less and less supplies and food, ect.

[tame root]

if i just was actually any good at creating vehicles ... or delving configs ... the scripting part i should be able to get done rather quick

but that ain't the heavy lifting here

[trim zinc]

Farming CDLC X39? I can Configs in my sleep.

[tame root]

now we just need someone with modelling capabilities 😄

and audio

[trim zinc]

*Grabs banjo

Oh, other audio...

I can model too, it's just every time I get into it, I got dragged into config work. Rather cleaning configs, or writing them out because by god some people overkill them.

[meager dome]

czech dlc and everyone talks about farming

sounds about right

hope there will be bonus potato

[tame root]

would be important that farming is addable as module tho
otherwise, how to add it to your generic pub missions
or your milsim stuff?

[dawn pasture]

I want Bavarian Voice lines

Would be accurate

As Bavaria was the only Westgerman state to Border CZSV

[trim zinc]

@meager dome Hey now, got to have your unit do something on these cold war DLCs during downtime 😄

[inner jackal]

Better be vodka...

[trim zinc]

Farming by day. Vodka induced border incursions by night.

[trail elbow]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[upper galleon]

So far the vehicles look very good in screenshots, but I'm a little bit worried about weapons

See this https://arma3.com/assets/img/post/images/arma3_dlc_creator_csla_screenshot_featured_05.jpg

I'd like to know if that FAL and CZ550 are upgraded A2 port or not

[upper galleon]

Ooo iron currain?
Take my money pls

[dawn pasture]

Yes

[hollow cloak]

excite

[compact lichen]

Do the CSLA team have an official Discord?

[mortal ice]

I havent heard of one yet

[elder minnow]

Can this dlc be added to the base game and not be like contact and global mobilization where i have to check a box?

[sand bough]

Check the pinned message for the Discord

[elder minnow]

@sand bough where cause i dont see any discord notifications

[sand bough]

?

[mortal ice]

That wasnt for you @elder minnow , that was for @compact lichen

And thanks Pol

[elder minnow]

ah my mistake then my bad

[sand bough]

This and every CDLCs won't be added to the base game

[compact lichen]

@mortal ice Thanks

[graceful ether]

confused

[sand bough]

What confuses you?

[compact lichen]

Check the pinned message for the Discord
@sand bough Thanks

[upper galleon]

I know whats confusing me 👀

[placid wind]

Dis. of ČSLA:
https://discord.gg/TNZAGrU

[jolly lantern]

Is already pinned here

[mystic spoke]

Does the DLC contain new stuff for the civilian faction?

[fossil condor]

from the looks of it yes

[mystic spoke]

When can I start throwing cash on you?

[meager dome]

i mean, you can always throw cash at my paypal

[inner cloud]

Is CSLA our yet?

Out*

[sonic grove]

RELEASE DATE: coming soon

See the original post. https://arma3.com/dlc/creator

[upper galleon]

will fixed wing aircrafts make its way into release or will they come with patches?

[nimble dove]

Congratulations on having the work on DLC finalized!

Looking forward to try the SP scenarios. 🙂

[inner cloud]

SP scenarios are really the only reason I want to buy it

[thorn root]

This new CSLA mod looks cool, but will it be better than the RHS mods?

[nimble dove]

Should be of better quality I assume, and they also have a map

[short vortex]

Fixed wing aircraft will not be a part of initial release. It might appear in future updates, if that happens.

[copper monolith]

Is there a timeline available for these in weeks/months after the initial release?

[low orbit]

Timeline is available but not for a public share.

[copper monolith]

Ah i see the message was reworded, it sounded like these were a certainty. 🙇‍♂️

[low orbit]

you, know ... asteroids, Covid, women ... anything can happen 😄

[fickle narwhal]

I call women. You guys can take the asteroids and covid.

[kind fulcrum]

Onya @fickle narwhal 👍 😜

[visual leaf]

This could've been a CDLC for the other CDLC!

[upper galleon]

Nope the women are mine, i always wanted a gf in arma

Maybe a4 will finally give me women

[compact lichen]

Dude don't give me hope. I really want female characters to come back to Arma and hopefully now be capable of fighting too in vanilla.

[upper galleon]

I just want to trade in my irl girlfriend
An arma one wouldnt tell me to get off the game/play pubg

[exotic copper]

As long as you get the F-5 out please! 🙂 ARMA needs it badly. RHS already has a nice Mig-29.

[ionic flame]

I miss my Fatima - much like Frankensteins monster we created her from parts in A2

her mum was a bit of a nightmare though

scene from the wedding

[vivid kelp]

I just want to trade in my irl girlfriend
An arma one wouldnt tell me to get off the game/play pubg
@upper galleon Sounds like someone needs to buy their girlfriend Arma 😄

[upper galleon]

@vivid kelp Unfortunatenly I have the misfortune of having a girlfriend that plays mobile games. so Arma isnt an option yet

And yea its pubg mobile before you ask, I didnt know that was a thing either

[vivid kelp]

That seems... why is.. you know, some questions are better off not asked.

[void musk]

if bohemia included these new DLC's as part of the base game I would actually buy, otherwise no reason to buy a DLC no-one else will have.

[nimble dove]

They don't include it just due to big data size (many 10's of gigabytes).
But as I understand, just like with GM mod, you will be able to download the compatibility data as a mod, I don't understand how it affects your decision. @void musk

[void musk]

Sure the DLC will be fun in singleplayer for a while, but once I get bored of playing alone, none of the official severs for the DLC will have players.

Same thing happened with GM

[lyric mortar]

but you then have private clans and groups of friends who play.

i'm running my third or so GM campaign with friends throughout this month, we're about 10 or so peeps a mission(with rotation of friends due to availability, etc).

Personally i just wish i could disable/enable the CDLCs in-game since restarting the game is way more of a bother to people.

[void musk]

I agree with that.

Restarting the game and installing it is like a barrier to entry.

[fossil condor]

you people have no idea what gaming was like when large games were on 10x floppy disks

[lyric mortar]

yes, yes, i get it, we used to live in inconvenient times, but we have to at least move ahead.

[void musk]

I hope enfusion engine supports hot-loading content.

[lyric mortar]

trust me i'm certain that people go and see "oh there's a few people on BI GM servers right now" and then consider whether or not it's a worth-it endeavor to restart arma and enable GM just to join the server, when it could just be an unenjoyable mission and a waste of time for them.

sure in the long run it's 3-5 mins depending on your hardware but it still puts people off.

[fossil condor]

but if people learned to be content for how far we have come from the distant floppy disk times already and just enjoy gaming while waiting for the next improvements the server would have more people playing.

be the change you want to see

[nimble dove]

Restarting the game and installing it is like a barrier to entry.
Just like with any other mod

I hope enfusion engine supports hot-loading content.
That would be cool for development reasons too

But really there is no other way, it can't be added to the game due to big size, unless SSDs become several times cheaper out of nowhere :/

[fossil condor]

Hot loading would still take about the same time too btw

it wont magically just load the stuff when you click on it

the same initialization has to be done on the mod content

[sonic grove]

At the end of the day, its all about enjoyment. If you want to constrain a game to specific FPS / Benchmarks /etc. you'd have a good career in Science.

[trim zinc]

I do think, and yes I mentioned it plenty in the past. Fixing the launcher to servers in regards to the CDLC compatibility packs would help fix a good chunk of that problem.

I mean it seems like a minor issue. But the launcher was all about click on a server and load mods in, same logic should apply to the CDCLs and the compatibility packs.

[meager dome]

i lol at this, because some games don't have any mod compatibility at all

being able to drag and drop more than one mod at a time is not the standard, even today

[ionic flame]

We should all be grateful we can enjoy a game six years after release with thousands of free mods and some nice dlcs, and no effing season pass or in app purchases

Bohemias strategy is actually so generous to players and people forget that because its the norm here

Paying $20 a year to own all of the content for this game is a steal

[nimble dove]

Paying $20 a year to own all of the content for this game is a steal
"But mods provide all this for free" argument by some people won't go away anyway, forgetting that the platform for those itself must be funded too.

[ionic flame]

sadly, you're right

honestly if bohemia said they were running out of cash and needed $30 from everyone to keep going, in return for a single stock certificate, i'd buy 10.

because imagine a world without them...

[obtuse mulch]

I'd imagine being able to add the CDLCs as demos outside of the workshop could possibly help with that @trim zinc

like civ 5 has done for their DLC https://store.steampowered.com/app/235580/Sid_Meiers_Civilization_V_Brave_New_World/?curator_clanid=3734187

for example

[trim zinc]

No, the issue is how it checks for mods when joining the server.

It doesn't recognize the compatibility pack as a acceptable option when not having the CDLC.

So users have to manually load the pack, then start Arma, then join the server.

[meager dome]

which makes total sense

you load the compatibility data like any other mods and done

[ionic flame]

it's clunky but it's no different from any mod

and it works ok

like anything in life, you have to workaround limitations

people who play arma know this well

anyone who can play "an FPS" with over 150 keybinds can handle loading a mod

it's not ideal but it is never going to change in A3, so no point worrying about it

still better than the days of keeping a set of command lines foreach scenario in a notepad file on your desktop

😉

[uncut rose]

BI has to improve their A3 launcher if they want to support CDLCs properly for the average guy

right now the "compatibility mods" for a CDLC serve little purpose

you have to use a 3rd party or vanilla terrain, or ppl not owing the CDLC cant participate

you have to use a 3rd party factions (infantry, weapons, vehicles) basically too as the ads become too annoying over time

so its unlike to the A3 CDLC policy of A3 - as the base game provides for everyone a platform. you are only excluded from paid exclusives

[thick parcel]

I think it's more of a demo you can load in your virtual arsenal for free to check the goodies before purchase

[uncut rose]

currently it is essentially. yet its not communicated as such and also not seen as such by most people arguing the situation being good as is

[violet knoll]

they should just add a function to the a3 launcher, for non owners of creator dlc's, would solve all the chaos.

[surreal vortex]

could you run a mission with a few base unit slots? so a coop op with NATO woodland against LDF on cherna2020, or NATO pacific vs syndikat on PKL, but throw in basic slots for everyone that hasn't bought the DLC. can't be driver or gunner, but as only infantryman how bad are the ads?

just curious how that would work, have bought the dlc and never seen the ads

[thick parcel]

Isn't it the same as with other BIS DLCs?

If you're using anything from the DLC, you get popups?

Plus passenger-only restrictions in vehicles?

[surreal vortex]

never seen them myself, only accidentally opened ad menu with wrong shortcut. just wondering how viable "cheap seats" in a mission could be

[lyric mortar]

If you combine some 80's arma mods in, sure

Like the 80's soviets mod and RHSGREF and the likes.

[mystic spoke]

I wouldn't start developing a CDLC for Arma now that I've seen how the current system works. I fully agree with @uncut rose. On the other hand, I think it's better than nothing, and hopefully serves as a testbed for more advanced stuff in the next Arma (yes, I assume there will be one)

[ionic flame]

current strategy works best with full conversions

[jolly lantern]

and to be frank, noone yet attempted a non-full-conversion.
so for all we know, BI would handle smaller CDLC's differently

[little gulch]

well, no air vehicles -> I skip this CDLC then

uncomplete stuff and there can be compatibility problems when mixing with other stuff that has what's missing

[bright rain]

Wut? There's an Mi-17, UH-60 and an An-2 in the pictures

[sand bough]

Also Blackhawks

[bright rain]

aye, forgot those

[sand bough]

But no Fixed wing fighters/attackers so far? I think I never seen them in actual promo images

Maybe there were some WIP images in their blog, but that's it?

[bright rain]

Yeah, there's an F-5 in images from a project by the same team. But I imagine if that was included people would similarly whine "why no fighter jet for Czechoslovak forces? DLC is unbalanced, unplayable, no servers will run it now, the sky is falling..."

A couple of poorly armed transport aircraft has a decent equilibrium

[vivid kelp]

They said that fixed wing would be coming in a post-release update, I think

[short vortex]

Actually, we'd need a proper US fighter to counter the Mig-29...

[bright rain]

Well, once upon a time the US thought the F-20 Tigershark would be adequate for equipping NATO allies for that task before they agreed to export the F-16. Slap a GE F404 in on the F-5 and you're good to go 😄

[short vortex]

I'll remember that. Then tell the community it was your idea 🤣

[fading snow]

I also don't understand why so many people dislike CDLC's Arma 3 is 7 years old an still receives updates and gets supported by BI.
After such a long time BI could have also left, quickly release another Arma title and milk the cow.
Instead they give Community Creators the ability to earn some money and get some recognition as a development team.
Also CDLC's increase the provided content and add more possibilities for the community to play with.
What I really like about CSLA that it could be combined with GM and open up a larger Cold War scenario.

[nimble dove]

That's how you see it

Lots of people see it as 'oh no, paid mod! I can get same for free!'

And make noise on that

[urban acorn]

I think paying authors for their hard work is fair, if you say you can get the same for free no one is stopping you from making your own assets with no remuneration

[dense jolt]

no one wants to do that anymore, they expect others to do that from them, and also respect their personal requests

[meager dome]

best one is "i'd rather donate to mods"

always gets a lol out of me

[dense jolt]

if i had a penny for each time i heard that one...

[little gulch]

I remember there was a Mig-29 in CSLA in A2

[trim zinc]

As long as the stuff is on bar with BI quality I welcome it all.

Although redudancy might be a problem with future CDLCs, IE how many m-16s will we get?

[vivid kelp]

If we do get duplicate weapons from the CDLCs, might be worth doing a compatibility update to both make them use the same mags.

[little gulch]

a lot of vehicles are ported from original A2 and I suppose their interiors and textures quality could be same as in A2, which would be said to pay for something like this

[vivid kelp]

Then at least if there's a big bucket of the same gun, they at least play nicely together.

[trim zinc]

Are the vehicles for this imported?

[little gulch]

civilian cars, An-2 plane and other stuff I've seen are from Arma 2

don't know if they've reworked them, for better visual quality

Mig-29 is also from Arma 2 CSLA mod

[trim zinc]

I mean for the record I heavily disagree that any CDLC should be allowed to use BI assets.

But from what I saw those just seemed background things. Although I agree they give a false sense of advertisment.

[little gulch]

don't know how it work in this case

[trim zinc]

Also OT but it's weird seeing you outside the hardware channels Groove XD

[little gulch]

like in at least one quality mod, a lot of stuff was ported from A2. not from the game itself, but from the same mod that existed already in A2
but a lot of stuff was reworked for better visuals at least, to better correspond to A3 visuals and functional quality standards

don't know if it will be the case with CSLA

[bright rain]

@vivid kelp Arma 3 already contains common magazineWell for 5.56mm AR-15 type rifles, 7.62x39 and 5.45x39 AKs that would easily allow magazine compatibility across common weapon types in CDLC

[swift path]

Just tell me this....

Are we getting a m60 tank at all?

[midnight briar]

probably not considering there's already an abrams

[swift path]

(Cries in Corner)

[trim zinc]

pfft M60

I been waiting since GM for one these CDLC's to produce me a Hind-24

[fading snow]

Who knows what the futur holds

[frail trench]

There is a M60 tank in CUP however a higher quality version would be nice.

[graceful dagger]

3CB factions has a nice quality M60

[frail trench]

Vehicles i would of liked in this DLC would be the "Mil Mi-4", but given the fact this is in the 80s the "Mil Mi-4" would be a bit too vintage for that decade.

[ionic flame]

making a fully functioning plane is a lot of work.

every time a CDLC is announced i think everyone hopes to see new planes.

Understanding how to make really good planes is a sacred art (HUD/ MFD/ gear animations/ pylon systems/ ejection seats/ damage model/ sensors/ cockpit anims/ flight model/ sounds/ air weapons models and configs)

There aren't that many people who know how to do it, compared to the less complex vehicles

in the time taken by one team to make a plane they can probably make 3-4 APCs or trucks

[meager dome]

personally i dont get the hype for planes. the a3 terrains usually arent big enough for planes

it's just odd using them

[lyric mortar]

I don't get the hype for roleplaying on arma when there's games that do it better yet Arma Life is the most played Arma 3 gamemode.
Things like these don't necessarily make sense.

[upper galleon]

i dont understand role playing in general but to each their own

[lyric mortar]

Though in the concept of air assets i'd argue people are interested in more variety gameplay or feel they enjoy aviation moreso than infantry combat.

Even with its restrictions.

[upper galleon]

the hype is based around the fact you can press R and kill most of the targets on the map. and also the random Large amount of people from reddit that says haha a10 go brrt

[lyric mortar]

Well personally i don't necessarily see appeal within fixed wing but rotary wing and drones I do.

[upper galleon]

because imo vanilla aa outside the defender is a bit useless. at most youll just make the jet pop flares once or twice

[lyric mortar]

Rotary wing for the different type of challenge and a lot of responsibility that rests upon you, together with having the need to make operation-changing decisions with AFM

For the drones you just get the movie feel of providing intelligence and assisting in the small parts when you can.

I think the main attractor now that i think about it for fixed winged pilots on arma is Top Gun, if anything.

[nimble dove]

I don't get the hype for roleplaying on arma when there's games that do it better yet Arma Life is the most played Arma 3 gamemode.
Things like these don't necessarily make sense.
I guess it just comes from the fact that the game can host your custom roleplay game mode with custom money, custom levels, custom whatever roleplay. I'm not into roleplay myself.

It's same and has been same for GTA as a platform for roleplay servers. There are lots of GTA roleplay servers.

[lyric mortar]

well with GTA i understand it better as i believe that GTA has a good platform for roleplaying. Arma however, does not.

and it shows because any people who actually roleplay on life instead resort to other games for this enjoyment.

the only thing that arma life is ACTUALLY for is mayhem and the ability to engage in deathmatch at will.

not to mention that making things actually look well visually and work well in arma in roleplay context is way harder than doing so in GTA or Space Station 13.

[ionic flame]

Dp-27Today at 05:57 because imo vanilla aa outside the defender is a bit useless

hey! don't forget my baby

[sand bough]

Is that your baby?

[ionic flame]

I created both, but the Rhea is my favourite, as I got to name it.

[sand bough]

Pretty! Everyone surely loves them for great objective to blow :)

[ionic flame]

grrrrr

with both defender and rhea you could reskin them to look like state of the art US and russian SAMs

[sand bough]

One thing I actually miss is the way to tow them, but that's something most unlikely at this stage

[ionic flame]

engine limitation

towing and physx, forget it for a commercial quality product

[dense jolt]

I created both, but the Rhea is my favourite, as I got to name it.
@ionic flame when you say create, you mean actually modeled it, or at least made the concept art?

[upper galleon]

oh congratz on making that thing. i blew up many aircraft with it

[ionic flame]

i designed it, working closely with Luiz, the modeler.

It's usually a 2-man team for most professional creations in Arma - producer/ encoder and 3d/texture artist working together to design the concept, functions, animations and overall look and feel.

I was really pleased when I got to name it, and the Cronus radar.

[mortal ice]

personally i dont get the hype for planes. the a3 terrains usually arent big enough for planes
it's just odd using them
@meager dome Depends a lot on the kind of plane imo, those super fast jets from the jets dlc that fly over altis in a minute if that arent much use imo but stuff ike WW2 prop planes can make a lot of sense

Also I personally like having planes because its just really cool to hear a plane circling overhead and then see the enemy position blow up

they add a lot to the game imo

[ionic flame]

yeah using them for calling air support is great fun

even if you're not a big pilot

and dennis' sounds are so darn good

we cloned them onto a lot of our unsung planes

[dense jolt]

i designed it, working closely with Luiz, the modeler.
@ionic flame figured....

It's usually a 2-man team for most professional creations in Arma - producer/ encoder and 3d/texture artist working together to design the concept, functions, animations and overall look and feel.
@ionic flame well aware of what is needed, but encoding is not i created material

[ionic flame]

each to his own lol

[simple quiver]

planes are fun but somewhat niche, i think ground attack planes are what works best for arma

after all what most players end up doing is grunts, therefore planes are usually functional to that

[lime helm]

It's usually a 2-man team for most professional creations in Arma
Really?

Lots of "Ideas men" do say that.

[ionic flame]

I'm all for CAS planes.

[meager dome]

Lots of "Ideas men" do say that.
@lime helm nah, if you hire from "outside" then the 3d model guy usually needs someone to actually port the object into the game

[lime helm]

you missed the point but nice to see you leap to just your alt 😉

[meager dome]

?

[lime helm]

Sorry should be "mate"

[meager dome]

it can be hard to find folks to make stuff. so at some point you likely search outside the arma community. that's usually when you will be forced into the position of porting the new objects into the game yourself.

[lime helm]

You could always take the time to learn yourself. But there is a long history or plagiarism in this case/game.

[meager dome]

eh.. no

wasting time on trying to learn something that someone else can do better right now is not a good idea when it comes to cdlc development

[lime helm]

And there we go.... nothing else i can say to that 😛

[meager dome]

it's just how it is. there is so much production related stuff to take care of ... expecting to learn making full blown, modern looking 3d models at the same time is kinda out of the picture

[lime helm]

As someone who made a living for a while making 3D models, developing and producing content. I would say your statement there perfectly defines what it is to be an "Ideas man" and I do use the term in a pejorative sense.. Having worked as a Producer of said content, I was always very careful to ensure that the real authors and contributors were properly credited and publicised before claiming any of the spot light for myself.

[meager dome]

how the hell is giving credit falling into this now

[lime helm]

I think you've missed the nuances of the discussion above 😛

[meager dome]

all I was saying is that sometimes you hire people who cannot into arma shenanigans and then you have to do it yourself. thus the model suddenly becomes a 2 people job.

[simple quiver]

unless you work with someone that is exceptionally proficient at modeling stuff for arma (or videogames in general) already you'll have to do a lot of handholding, especially on complicated assets like vehicles/planes

it's not enough to just 'hire a guy' to make a model for you and expect it to go flawlessly

[lime helm]

There is a lot of info out there and especially recently great guides popping up in discord/youtube/forums etc. I do agree modelling is a skill that takes years to develop but that wasn't the point of my comment. There are also lots of cases of "Ideas men" finding people to do the work for them. Then taking the credit as the "owner" or "Producer" etc

But i also dispute that making a plane of other addon is a two man job - look at 90% of the addons out there. Released by individuals. yes they were supported by others for info and bug hunting etc but not full partnerships.

[thick mica]

There are also lots of cases of "Ideas men" finding people to do the work for them. Then taking the credit as the "owner" or "Producer" etc

Is that not a case of the people who do the "actual work" just needing to step up and take the credit or do things on their own.... I think this could all be summed up in a simple people work differently and each way has it's benefits. Who cares which way people choose to work if stuff gets made.

Separately, very much looking forward to this CDLC and thinking we certainly got out monies worth buying the Supporter edition all the way back in 2013. Looking forward to some more cold war shenanigans.

[meager dome]

i just find it hilarious to expect someone with no real 3d modeling background to learn 3d modeling for the cdlc creation

and next up i can already hear the "waah, waah, quality so bad, why didn't they hire someone else"

but what do i know, i'm just an ideas guy 😄

[bright rain]

This has all been a bit OT for the CSLA channel today though, hasn't it? There's a more general CDLC channel

[short vortex]

To get a bit more on track, I do agree that CAS aircraft are very useful when it comes to ArmA. Right next to light and medium transport planes.

[fading snow]

Arma*

[simple quiver]

😄

medium transports are probably more versatile as you can do both paradrops and airdrop vehicles

[thick mica]

A400m anyone? (bit modern for this CDLC) 😐

[fading snow]

I know Kola was working on one

[trim zinc]

I think there is a good line between 'cool moment' things and utility.

Like what gets more use? A helicopter or a plane?

[sonic grove]

Depends on its usefulness. I'd take a Skyraider over Black Hawk any day.

[ionic flame]

making things fun is key yeah

I can say from a lot of experience flying it, the A1 is a whole heap of fun.

That rear wheel steering is a bitch though, to get it to work well in physx, but that's for another channel.

I guess a quality Mig-23 would fit well with early 80s scenario.

[sonic grove]

As would Wld's A-4's

Nothing like getting your TV aerial knocked down by a low flying A-4 Skyhawk to create a lifelong love for them.

[simple quiver]

for its size the a4 has a stupid high payload

would be nice to have a new model in arma

my favorite plane after the harrier

[ionic flame]

a quality A4 would indeed be cool

[stable yoke]

Hello friends! I’m happy to say we’re looking for more people to participate in the Closed Beta for the recently announced CDLC: CSLA Iron Curtain. We’re doing a very limited giveaway for some folks from this Discord to join the beta. Participants will be the first to see the new content of the Creator DLC, with the expectation that they will review technical issues and provide valuable feedback. This will be a great opportunity to help polish elements before its final release.

If you believe that you have the technical know-how and time to help test drive this upcoming DLC, then we invite you to fill out the following form to express your interest in becoming a closed beta participant. There is a very limited number of those that can participate so for those who are interested we advise you to act quickly. Anyone accepted to take part, we will send you information via email on the next steps and guidelines to participating in the beta.

https://forms.gle/58UT1bjXZY9m2PgH7

[mortal ice]

[upper galleon]

roger

[upper galleon]

roger roger

[zealous cave]

roger roger roger

[mystic spoke]

well with GTA i understand it better as i believe that GTA has a good platform for roleplaying. Arma however, does not.
@lyric mortar GTA is better for hardcore roleplay. Arma has its benefits in casual roleplay (which is something that many RP/Life devs haven't realized)

[lyric mortar]

I definitely wouldn't call GTA roleplay hardcore, but that's my own opinion.

[mystic spoke]

I'm not saying that Arma can't be a nice platform for HC RP stuff

I mean that GTA has better potential for hardcore roleplay

I'm playing as an paramedic on a hardcore server (or rather used to play) and it really was hardcore

I'm looking forward to the next Arma so that I can start working on my passion project related to RP/Life...

[lyric mortar]

In truth i haven't participated in GTA RP and i can't wage on it but Space Station 13 for sure passes it on hardcore roleplay terms. Also, this is getting a bit off topic so if you want to discuss further you can contact me on DMs.

[mystic spoke]

Let's move to #game_design

[blissful vapor]

arma is best for rp😋

[blissful bone]

I wonder what the beta program greenlighting process from BI was like. That's very exciting to allow a beta like that on primarily singleplayer content, i hope you get useful feedback!

[dense void]

First time i saw the new CSLA:Iron Curtain DLC i remebered Chernarus and Utes and the Chedakis

[fading snow]

flashbacks intensify

[dense void]

lol

Eagle wing: Its time for cleaning up

[fading snow]

[dense void]

Imagine someday and out of nowhere someone decided to make a remastered campaign for Eagle Wing :0

[fading snow]

☝️ please

[dense void]

I mean its a short campaign and fun,And the assets modules are ready to be used for this purpose why not making it and with different endings because i decided to play EW campaign again and then i killed the Russian dudes and hopped on the boat and then the mission somehow messed up

That's why we need the remaster because they must bring up the secret ending

[cyan dawn]

I'll finally have to release my Utes remaster so I can play CSLA on it

[upper galleon]

nice

i love Utes

[thick parcel]

Shame it's so small :/

[dense void]

Shame it's so small :/
@thick parcel Small but it has its own memories

[meager dome]

that's what she said

[ionic flame]

love that map

[dense void]

Eagle wing was a great campaign and sad ending for ArmA 2

[meager dome]

i think it was great because of the story twist. i did not expect at all what happened

the whole setup in the beginning with the intro and the title text blending in, etc

pretty well done. but the last mission felt a bit like a drag to me

[dense void]

i think it was great because of the story twist. i did not expect at all what happened
@meager dome I agree

And it didn't need to explain a lot like some other games,It explains it self slowly in every part of the campaign same thing with ArmA 3 in the East Wind campaign which is also called EW for short,Bohemia got their winning card which is the fictional story but secret,dark and also easy to understand if you wanted to do so but in other way.

[meager dome]

the EW text moving into Eagle Wing and later Electronic Warfare, etc. was hella smart

i remember it till today and i havent played it in ages

[dense void]

Yup

[thick parcel]

Directed by Hideo Kojima

[sand bough]

Keep it mind not to share any specific things in this CDLC publicly

[violet knoll]

hell i wont.

[nimble dove]

i remember it till today and i havent played it in ages

EW was designed by Karel Moricky, so was the Laws of War campaign, both are most impactful missions for me. This guy is a genius of such things.

[violet knoll]

coop apex mission was nice, damn played it 100 times

[meager dome]

laws of war is heavily based on CJs stuff tho :p

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=774507042

[thick parcel]

Karel Moricky is the Kojima of Arma

He's been making some seriously top of the shelf missions and content since OFP

[ionic flame]

he's the man alright, and a lovely guy to meet. top bloke.

[thick parcel]

In Laws of War you can find an old OFP laptop with one of his old missions loaded

A nice easter egg 🙂

[ionic flame]

that's deeply cool

[nimble dove]

Wow

[inner cloud]

is CSLA mostly stuff from CUP? I’ve seen screenshots and it just looks like CUP vehicles and units

[sand bough]

No. It's impossible

More like the same source, different things. CUP ports many of A2 assets, so (probably) do CSLA

[meager dome]

players likely wont differentiate

I can already see the "but CUP does the same and is free"

[nimble dove]

We could already see that the day it was announced

[meager dome]

we could even see that with GM and that doesnt use anything from a2 :>

[south sonnet]

TBF, CUP has even started making new assets, sooo...

[nimble dove]

It doesn't seem like there is a solution for that problem

Unless CDLC designed guns n' tanks from 2035 fictional era

[sand bough]

And people won't realize that CUP has done the thing that worth of pay

[nimble dove]

And I don't think there is a solution to that either

Well, people can stop development of their mods if they feel like it's not giving much fun or other reward any more 🤷 Perhaps it might make players realize

I mean it's also problem of developers if they do that for their own apparent loss.

If they do it for their fun then it's up to them of course.

[cursive parcel]

IMHO if you're doing anything like that for the sake of praise and admiration from the community, then you're not going to last very long at it. Anyone who does this stuff seriously does so for their own sake, because they enjoy it.

and the vast majority of people doing this for fun will tell you that getting paid for it sucks the fun out, because then it's a job and people will start wanting releases on their timeline, not yours, they'll stop overlooking flaws and start yelling at you for it instead.

[nimble dove]

this feels like a situation where labour unions are possible by mod makers 😄

oh by the way! I like how it's made at bandcamp, where you can declare your work 'pay your own price', and customer can choose the amount of payment

[simple quiver]

i can confirm you we (CUP) did not share any asset with CSLA

some of our assets (mostly vehicles still, and of course terrain data) come from the a2 source files, so if they are the same as in CSLA, well, do the math 🙃

[tame root]

and the vast majority of people doing this for fun will tell you that getting paid for it sucks the fun out, because then it's a job and people will start wanting releases on their timeline, not yours, they'll stop overlooking flaws and start yelling at you for it instead.

need to quickly go offtopic here and call this out
that simply ain't true, never saw anybody say no to donations or something like that in the modding scene. What you mean is taking money on a monthly basis from sorta "investors" which then expect something in return. That is a whole different story though. And the people yelling for releases in time are those you get for free without compensation either already ...
Getting paid to do the stuff also can keep people in the modding scene, like ... i left because i barely play arma anyways nowadays and got an actual job i need to spend my "spare time" in, besides the other stuff i do obv.
TL;DR: it ain't all black and white and i hate the "paid mods are bad" or "mods should be freeeeee cuz it breks te fun" attitude

[meager dome]

it's not the donations but specifically getting paid for a task. for lots of people this instantly sucks the fun out of it and turns the hobby into a job

getting money for something you made without wanting money originally is a different thing entirely

also to note, people rarely donate to mods anyways :>

[nimble dove]

also to note, people rarely donate to mods anyways :>
If, once you push 'subscribe' button, there was a popup "this creation has cost a team of XXX people XXX hours total, here's the donation link", it would be different

[meager dome]

I doubt it

folks like talking about donating to mods, but actually doing it is a different thing ..

[nimble dove]

🤔 🤔 🤔 🤔 This seems like a good solution. You don't monetize it, yet you can add more aggressive advertisement of that.

Well it's one thing if I need to search the mod page then search for the donation link somewhere at the bottom of it. It's different if it throws the donation thing right into your display.

[meager dome]

it is on nexus mods, afaik, and it doesnt help at all

[nimble dove]

Yes? How does it look?

idk what nexus is, sorry

[meager dome]

you click download and a popup with that shows up

[nimble dove]

is nexus a mod or a platform?

[meager dome]

problem is that at this point you haven't tried the mod yet.

it's a platform

[nimble dove]

is it like a workshop alternative?

[meager dome]

just google it

all I'm saying is, it doesn't work. people wont donate more

[nimble dove]

🤔 then there should be some pop-up or link in-game

all I'm saying is, it doesn't work. people wont donate more
Still the more people know about the mod development effort and such, the more likely they will be to think of it

IMO it's totally fine to be more aggressive about donations. Youtubers do it all the time, they have patreons and such, and they easily remind you to subscribe to their patreon at the end of each video.

[thick parcel]

You'd turn it into a mobile game

'Pay 5 euro to make ads go away'

[south sonnet]

I've donated a few times on Itch.io, but it's easier to rate a game as worthy of donations than a mod.

[dense jolt]

@nimble dove how many mods have you donated to?

[nimble dove]

two

[dense jolt]

and the vast majority of people doing this for fun will tell you that getting paid for it sucks the fun out, because then it's a job and people will start wanting releases on their timeline, not yours, they'll stop overlooking flaws and start yelling at you for it instead.
@cursive parcel it’s only partly true. people who are invested into cdlcs are, mostly, modders as well

two
@nimble dove amount?

[smoky prawn]

Those are rookie numbers, you got to pump them up!

[nimble dove]

@nimble dove amount?
can I not disclose this?

I mean, just make your point 🤷

[dense jolt]

no offense, but while we had a paypal up, the 0.99cents one time donations were worse than no donations = there was a year with a grand total of under 10$ or so

[south sonnet]

problem is that at this point you haven't tried the mod yet.
@meager dome Plus, I think it'd work better if the mod developer pitches the donate button with a text they write themselves, like describing how long they've been working on their mod, what sorts of efforts they've gone to for the sake of making the mod good, etc.

[meager dome]

I made about 20 bucks in 15 years :)

granted, it could mean my stuff is just bad. but on the other hand, I get thousands of comments about how good it is, so I dunno.

[nimble dove]

🤔 I think we should do marketing classes, perhaps this was all invented before us

[fading snow]

Good idea ^^

[south sonnet]

granted, it could mean my stuff is just bad. but on the other hand, I get thousands of comments about how good it is, so I dunno.
@meager dome As I just mentioned, I think it's easier to look at a game and say "This is worth my investment" than to look at a specific mod for a game among over a dozen installed mods and say "This is worth my investment". But yeah, some form of more aggressive advertising would probably be good.

[nimble dove]

@meager dome Plus, I think it'd work better if the mod developer pitches the donate button with a text they write themselves, like describing how long they've been working on their mod, what sorts of efforts they've gone to for the sake of making the mod good, etc.
yeah, some personal text helps IMO, like "I've been struggling for weeks to make the polygons on this AK look the way they are", etc

[meager dome]

feels like whoring out :>

[nimble dove]

agree but eh, why don't youtubers and twitch people feel like this?

On the other hand, some cool projects are only possible with funding

[meager dome]

well, I dont do this to make money in the first place, so I guess I just dont care enough

[dense jolt]

most people don’t do it for the money. it’s a very time consuming hobby, just like scale models is for instance

[tame root]

this heavily leans into #offtopic_arma by now

[dense jolt]

a lot of people don’t get 2 things
a. just because it is released for free doesn’t mean it has no commercial value
b. because it is released doesn’t mean anyone owes the user anything, or the other way around (including donations), minus respecting the license, obviously

@tame root true, but you are the one who went ot...

[sand bough]

The fact won't change the fact we should take this convo to somewhere else

[nimble dove]

I can take the blame for going OT initially 😄 Don't point fingers please. Let's move out.

[tame root]

also said it leans heavily onto #offtopic_arma with me posting it here because it was a direct response
just wanted to note it again

[dense jolt]

@sand bough true and fair enough

[cursive parcel]

@dense jolt Note I did say "Vast majority" not "Everyone" and those getting into the CDLCs are no doubt not those I was speaking of.

and yes, I wasn't talking of Donations which most people go out of their way to give even if you don't solicit them. I took a lot of donations for my open source work, I never asked for them, never even put up a 'donate' button anywhere and still people managed to find a way to send them. However because I hadn't asked for the donations, those giving them had no expectations in return, so I was happy to accept.

The moment you start to solicit donations, or go a Patreon type route, a lot of those contributors will expect something for there investment. If you can't finish whatever you were working on because life gets in the way, as it often does, then they are less than sympathetic. Even if your benefactors are an entirely reasonable bunch and don't make demands of you, you will still feel pressure to deliver some value to them.

[little gulch]

Not the right place for this and for many other discussions here

Offtopic or general chat for this

[simple quiver]

#offtopic_arma is where the discussion moved to

[thin phoenix]

Nobody excited for the trains ? 🤨

[meager dome]

it's just the a2 stuff

probably why nobody talked about it

[thick parcel]

There's no trains

They're just props

[dense jolt]

prop trains he means

not usable that is

[meager dome]

screenshot makes it look like an "active" train, though. this is why i dont like such promo material

it's a borderline lie, imo

[dense jolt]

i doubt anyone knowing this engine would imagine that being possible engine level

without scripted workarounds

[meager dome]

yes, we know this is just a prop, but the generic player might not

i will probably never forget the "melee combat mechanics" rumor about tac-ops dlc when we didn't knew anything about it yet 😄

because, you know, spec-ops are using knifes, and tac-ops sounds like spec-ops 😄

[dense jolt]

no, that's actually wishfull thinking to be honest

and spec ops using knives is movie driven, doesn't actually happen all that often anyways

[meager dome]

generic player might wish for driving train :p

[thick parcel]

I mean there's the ATC(?) mod that enables trains

[dense jolt]

generic player won't get this game, or the cDLC to drive a train

[thick parcel]

Making it theoretically possible on a certain level

And the promo pics really push the train idea tbh😄

Like its a smart screenshot composition if it appears in like 1 screenshot

But at this point...😄

[dense jolt]

Making it theoretically possible on a certain level
@thick parcel and it is possible, but it just isn't possible directly from configs, there is no train class type

[trim zinc]

RHS trains when PuFu 😛

To be fair at this point though. If the props are destructable, the new motion tween system makes it very easy to pretend a train is goign. Almost no real scripting needed.

[copper monolith]

I miss the old days when you could just attach a thing to a camera and move that via camCommit. ☺️

[meager dome]

just use the keyframe system :>

[thin phoenix]

yes, we know this is just a prop, but the generic player might not
@meager dome This is exactly what happened ^^

I mean there's the ATC(?) mod that enables trains
@thick parcel Ik, but it is really old & and I just thought the DLC has trains so I went for it xD

There also was something in the description about a large railway system, so I thought: "What do you want to do with a large railway system without trains?" And as you said the pictures rly did not make it better. ^^

[meager dome]

yeah, it's same as the problem with the contact dlc

"vast underground network" == players will think there are tunnels to walk through

i knew players would think that the second i read the line

and it's exactly what happened. even days after release i was still reading comments about "where are the tunnels?"

[thin phoenix]

Yeah had too much hope there ... xD

[dense jolt]

@trim zinc trains, not planned, tracks on the other hand....
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/515286891516395531/668515686875791360/ru_tracks_types.png

[thin phoenix]

Weird...

[sand yoke]

There still useful for crossing

[inner cloud]

Why do the friendly squad AI not die at all in the missions lol

[placid needle]

lol wrong cdlc bro

[mortal ice]

trains, not planned, tracks on the other hand....
I hope the track system is complete enough for it to be used for logistics with the atc mod

That'd be interesting

[nimble dove]

That picture made me think that it's a paper model 😄

[dense jolt]

@nimble dove can assure you it isn't

[mortal ice]

Fancy

[cursive parcel]

Interesting, is it the same gauge as the tracks on Tanoa?

[mortal ice]

Btw I like the 1.9k fps

[dense jolt]

max doesn't display FPS counter correctly if there is no movement in the viewport btw

[vivid kelp]

Trains in Arma has been attempted a few times before FYI

https://www.armaholic.com/page.php?id=16784

https://forums.bohemia.net/forums/topic/203170-advanced-train-simulator-ats/

[ionic flame]

vilas built a working trainset too

[dense jolt]

@vivid kelp for the 3rd time, i am not saying is not possible with scripted workarounds, i am saying is not possible directly at engine level

[vivid kelp]

Wasn't specifically for you PuFu, just something for the people above interested in working trains to have a look at! :)

[inner jackal]

ATS works pretty well but the rails have to be laid properly on a map... Even has a beta version for the CUP trains that works with the same caveat

[dreamy trench]

Just look how they butchered AEF 😦

[upper galleon]

Question

Why isnt there a trailer for the iron curtain

[sand bough]

In its launch

[upper galleon]

Oh

[fringe aspen]

Will there be era correct mocap?

[sand bough]

“era”?

[fringe aspen]

ArmA3 anims only fit 2015 and later navy seals.

[sand bough]

Ah meant... I got that

[fringe aspen]

If they change the animations for running, walking, combat pace on/off etc I'll buy it immediately. I'm asking if there's any plans for that.

[sand bough]

Before you wondered, although I was an tester, can't say

[fringe aspen]

If anyone know if anims will/won't be changed please @ me.

[dense jolt]

@fringe aspen there are no changes to character animations

mocap is not something a modding studio has easy access to btw

[fringe aspen]

I'm aware of that but since it's an official DLC that'll cost ~10-30 euro it wouldn't be impossible. Thanks for the reply!

[dense jolt]

it is an official cDLC

[sand bough]

^ It's not an official DLC

[dense jolt]

not really the same thing

[sand bough]

No Bohemian helps available to make the thing

[fringe aspen]

Since it's a product that'll cost ~20 euros it wouldn't be impossible.

[upper galleon]

@dense jolt out of curiosity, did you guys ever think to make rhs cdlc?

[dense jolt]

@upper galleon we did think about it, yes

[sand bough]

Did?

[dense jolt]

past tense, yes

[meager dome]

Since it's a product that'll cost ~20 euros it wouldn't be impossible.
@fringe aspen we don't know the price yet

it doesnt have to be ~20

[copper monolith]

mocap is not something a modding studio has easy access to btw
It is actually surprisingly affordable. 😄

[thick parcel]

A pain to integrate tho, I'm sure

Wink wink MG3 gunner

[meager dome]

i remember in the early cdlc announcement days that it was said the BI MoCap studio would be available for hire

[copper monolith]

It always is and was. 😄

Character animations are however one of the least understood (and therefore least documented) aspects of the mod-world in arma. It's very complex, wierd, unforgiving and doesnt support live-loading, meaning figuring it out takes time and dedication.

[thick parcel]

Can't spell dedication without depression

[fringe aspen]

Regarding pricing I was just going off previous pricing as that's all we can do.
Let's hope arma 4 in 3025 has a minimum of three anims. One for civ (untrained), one for regulars (trained), one for sf (super trained c clamp arma 3 anims ported)

[graceful dagger]

c clamp looks dumb af, please no

[sonic grove]

Once again, no future Arma title has been announced, so ALL of the "Arma 4" comments are borderline spam.

[dense jolt]

@copper monolith not around here it isn't

[ionic flame]

gotta spend your time wisely, some things are unaffordable due to time rather than cash

[trim zinc]

There is one person I know that has truly made a custom skel rig and animation set up. But he retired from modding.

[ionic flame]

von knudenberg made combat women in A2

sadly he has had so much on his plate he hasn't been able to transition to arma 3.

[copper monolith]

There is one person I know that has truly made a custom skel rig and animation set up. But he retired from modding.
@trim zinc dont forget about https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=854964321
The sources for this (including blender) are available on the BI Forums. 🙂

[trim zinc]

lol I forgot about the blockheads XD

[dense jolt]

lol I forgot about the blockheads XD
@trim zinc also, @fossil condor doggo

[fossil condor]

and my walker

and my armawomen

😛

[trim zinc]

I should say I only know one person who has made a truly interactive playable unit with it's own custom rig that was released 😛

[fossil condor]

😛

actually my walkers alpha was released for MANW!

bwahahaa

its not available anymore though

[jolly lantern]

You don't like interacting with doggos and blockkos?

[trim zinc]

I like them both, but when some one truly says a custom made unit skeleton. I defer to his as he had almost 80% animations roughly

[dense jolt]

who’s dat

[trim zinc]

Panzer's Space Marines

[fossil condor]

I may have had a bit of a hand there too

what are we talking about btw?

[trim zinc]

Probably stuff that can go into #arma3_animation or #arma3_model. But to recap, just the idea of a custom rig and how feasable it was for A3 in relation to some ones CSLA suggestions.

[fossil condor]

its a lot of work and has some engine related problems

most things work

the animation action system supports multiple skeletons just fine, weapoan animations can be set for each skeleton type, equipment is probably the most problematic one as I dont think there is proper way to restrict the gear between different shaped characters

which is why panzers marines were not finished.

Halo mod also has scaled up master chief

dont remember if it had all animations set up too

its pretty good though

extra man shaped characters with unique actions sets is possible too

but again, a looooot of work

[trim zinc]

I can tell you a bit of some cool stuff we found out of it, but what channel works?

[fossil condor]

can continue on #arma3_animation I suppose

its closest for the topic

[upper galleon]

do we have a set date yet?

[fickle narwhal]

no

[compact lichen]

You'll know when the release date is disclosed.. your Arma 3 Steam community discussion board will be lit the heck up.

[mortal ice]

People use the Steam Discussions ?

[nimble dove]

Took me four seconds to recall that these exist

[shrewd lodge]

Hello, how to become a tester ?

[mortal ice]

You cant apply anymore, the applications were only open for a very short time @shrewd lodge

[shrewd lodge]

Oh... thanks for your answer ! 😄

[cloud fractal]

how do I gain access to the chat for the dlc testing? I got access but don't see the chat

[meager dome]

isnt the testing phase done

[short vortex]

It is. The chat is still active, although I'm not sure for how long. If you're part of the beta testers and want to join the channel, then DM to Dwarden might be your solution.

[shrewd lodge]

Release is planned for 2021 right ?

[low orbit]

Release date has not been announced yet

[sand bough]

It says 2020 in the Steam Store IIRC

[thick parcel]

"Soon(tm)"

[upper galleon]

If I had to guess I'd imagine we'll either get a Holiday 2020 release or something in February or March of 2021.

[neon steppe]

Czech army mod here? :P

[placid wind]

Yeah!

[manic steppe]

cannot wait for this mod im so pumped its gonna bring be back to the OFP days

[sand bough]

“mod”?

[little gulch]

It was one

[neon steppe]

?

Ooo he is waiting for the new csla

In steam store IIRC

[placid wind]

cannot wait for this mod im so pumped its gonna bring be back to the OFP days
@manic steppe This is a DLC created by the Arma 3 community.

[manic steppe]

yeah im aware

its a creator dlc

but still cold war lol

[placid wind]

So what?

[manic steppe]

youve lost me all i said i was excited for it..

[neon steppe]

In ofp its mod but in here its DLC

That make sense

Little bit

[manic steppe]

i know its a paid dlc i just said mod as its not made by bohemia it doesnt really matter what i call it lol i just said i was excited for it

i wont bother next time lol

[fading snow]

I mean yeah. Just watch out as this will easily confuse people, As you said not made by bohemia doesn't mean it's a mod. Remember Jets DLC? Which was made together with 3rd Party Bravo Zero-One.
And in this case it's called CreatorDLC

[manic steppe]

yeah but i didnt think people would rip apart a compliment that badly i mean its petty lol it was just a compliment and it was butchered because i said the wrong word

[fading snow]

Well they didn't rip apart your compliment they just chewed on the word leaving out any relation to your compliment which is more of a happy expression.

[manic steppe]

yeah lets just leave it at that haha ill start over

Im looking forward to this 😄

[short vortex]

The creator part IMHO relates more to the fact that the original idea was to have the cdlcs made by long-term comunity members whose main job is not game development.

[exotic copper]

Cdlc = paid mod

[thick parcel]

I mean

It's paid content

Mods are content

DLC are content

This whole debate imho is just about wording

CDLC are an opportunity for the community to get extra content that should be QA'd for quality standards, therefore win

At the same time, it's an incentive for modders - win

Unless weapon skins and lootboxes start popping up, I'm pretty happy with the current model 😄

[nimble dove]

Cdlc = paid mod
@exotic copper Ok so what now? You don't support the idea of paying for game content or what?

[simple quiver]

why pay when suckers will make mods for free

😛

[nimble dove]

It will be of higher quality, it will be QA'd, it will have more work in it overall.

Same as why you would buy a game instead of playing some "hey look at my Unity game prototype"

[simple quiver]

(i was just kidding 🙃 )

[nimble dove]

I know

There is a part of joke in any joke 😉

[gaunt agate]

Cdlc = paid mod
@exotic copper You get bragging rights to say you own every single arma 3 DLC

[plucky tinsel]

I own all mods, because it's free, so I can own it

But spending years of development on high quality content up to AAA standards is indeed the same as a free mod.
Tbf... Some well known games produce worse quality...

[thick parcel]

Since games are getting more complicated each year

Development takes up more resources

You can see it in practice - every new Arma game gets less user made content than the last

It's just more demanding

This could be a way for us to get more toys to play with

And offset the trend

[ionic flame]

you get more toys and fun and we get the chance to attract artists and programmers and actors from elsewhere to participate. what's not to love?

so many voices decry the idea without really thinking it through

gotta let it mature

so we're below the capability of a full salaried game studio?

and you get to pay less for our content?

but still we can create something you might enjoy, and you have an option to buy it or not?

why would a guy complain about that?

unless he was demanding and entitled and unable to allow others the freedom to develop their vision, which may attract enough fans to develop into something really special.

seems to me like this whole "paid mods" debate is frankly missing the point.

you choose to buy it or not.

you don't need to judge the program, just allow it to be and maybe something really cool will come along.

is it causing a brain drain of modders from the scene? no, i don't think so.

i spoke to at least 30 artists from the arma community in the past year who said thanks but no, i'd rather keep it as a hobby.

and likewise i recruited and retained 35 artists of whom only about 10 were from the arma scene.

so we have a net influx of talent into arma, not a brain drain

[nimble dove]

modding IS game development, when people realize this, the debate will be over IMO

[ionic flame]

some guys will always mod some will seek to make money from it. who will be successful is decided by you, the paying public. no need for philosophical debates, you vote with your wallets or subs

[nimble dove]

no need for philosophical debates, you vote with your wallets or subs
There must be debate because we also seek to persuade people that this is the way to acquire game content for their games.

I want content creators to get benefit, that's one part of motivation, like my vision of the right thing.

I also don't want to buy the DLCs to never play them again because nobody of our friends wants/cares to buy them.

[little gulch]

I'm for example willing to even pay for mods, as long as quality is there.
When you have stuff that was already there, in A2, it's also ok, since that's what's missing in A3.
But when content visual quality is exactly same as in A2, this is a no go for me. Should be at least A3 quality standards level or even higher, like RHS stuff

nobody cares that it takes a lot of time and that there are just few people working on a whole mod.
people simply see what they see and judge based on content quality they experience

if I see something that doesn't look nice, telling me that they're just few people for so much stuff to do and even this quality of content took them years to make, it doesn't change the fact that it looks like it looks.
hope you understand

[nimble dove]

It works with indie games on the other hand

Well... it depends on artistic style of course. Arma is of highly realistic style.

[little gulch]

I talk about textures and 3D models quality only

[nimble dove]

sure, me too

One can choose a lower scope of the project. So it looks nice, but maybe there isn't as much variety of art.

[little gulch]

I understand the even "simply" taking stuff from A2 and "just porting" it into A3 is not that easy at all and requires a lot of time, knowledge and testing, but if it looks like in 2009 and in 2009 A2 visual quality was not better than in some games of like 2007 and then seeing this in 2020/2021, for $$$, no, thanks

[nimble dove]

You've said it already

[little gulch]

if just few people try to make it all, terrain, gear, vehicles and air, it results in what it results, even after so many years of hard work, because they're so few working on it

[nimble dove]

Well it results in either long development time, or poor quality

[little gulch]

or both

in RHS, for example, there is stuff that even exceeds A3 visual quality standards (3D model fidelity vs. real counterpart + poly count and textures res).
And that's great, since we're not in 2013 anymore.
Not even talking about 2009

I can only imagine how hard all the work is to do as modder, but it doesn't help me to know this,a s customer

[hasty bison]

Sorry, but as it has been written several times, who does not want to buy, so do not buy and who likes our project, so he will buy it and support us ... we do not force anyone to do anything. We are not professionals and we do it as best we can.

[little gulch]

understandable, sure, Since I'm in Arma since 2001 and know how many years you've been working on CSLA

[hasty bison]

Next year it will be 20 years 😉

[little gulch]

22 June

Hope for A4

would be nice, 20 years and next and true successor

cold war realoaded

[hasty bison]

If community amateur creators stop creating content and just start buying addons from professionals/semi-professionals, because of the pursuit of extreme quality, I think the end of the community for this great game will begin....

[little gulch]

true

I feel like in OFP, ArmA and ArmA II times, mods visual quality was on par with base game or even better

now that visual quality increased that much over the years, in general, not only in Arma, it's more difficult to keep up

I even see that before games had better mechanics, story, gameplay, since there was not much you can do on graphics side and so much more time could be spent on gameplay/story

[jolly lantern]

I just hope more mod creators open themselves for donations. And that more players actually appreciate and do donate for what they feel is important

[little gulch]

now that we have so powerful GPUs and graphics tools, a game either looks extremely good, but no MP and very short SP time or it has a lot to offer in gameplay and story, but graphics are sacrificed then

or mix of both, like Arma

or if you want MP, story, gameplay mechanics + graphics, it has to be a 1000-3000 people studio or something like this

[nimble dove]

I just hope more mod creators open themselves for donations. And that more players actually appreciate and do donate for what they feel is important
It will come eventually, it's a mix of traditions and social norms in the society I think, and the gaming industry is still quite new.

[little gulch]

and when you have to pay 1000-3000 employees, game must cost more and must be "refreshed" every year or two, to be able to pay and advance

[hasty bison]

Donations we received over the nearly 20 years would not be enough to even rent a dedicated server for 1 month to support MP for our projects 😉

[little gulch]

usual situation

[nimble dove]

Donations we received over the nearly 20 years would not be enough to even rent a dedicated server for 1 month to support MP for our projects 😉
same here (although I have several months to extrapolate, but still)

[little gulch]

people are used to always ask for more, preferably for free or crack stuff to not pay, breaking studios' incomes, making it difficult to pay regular costs + have a buffer to dev next title

we have our servers since A1 and people don't see why they should donate to keep the servers they like running

always complaining

[nimble dove]

we have our servers since A1 and people don't see why they should donate to keep the servers they like running
😦

[little gulch]

and if the server has to go offline, because of $$$, well, they will look for another one

and ask for more, for free of course and still keep complaining, not having donated even once or helped with mission development or testing

[nimble dove]

Digital goods (servers, artwork, software, maintanence) leaves the illusion that it's all etherial and has no material value, unfortunately

[little gulch]

and when you tell it's a private server that monthly costs a lot of money to run, unlike official ones, then you're told - nobody asked/obliged you to open one and if you still did, then it's your problem

[hasty bison]

BTW, and when it comes to visual quality...I'm personally old school and prefer gameplay over pointless hi-res graphics. if everything was governed only by the pursuit of the most realistic visual, then such a Minecraft or Lego would never be created, for example 😉

[little gulch]

the only reason why we have our different servers is only because we also play Arma and didn't like what was already available, mission and server/difficulty settings wise

[nimble dove]

BTW, and when it comes to visual quality...I'm personally old school and prefer gameplay over pointless hi-res graphics. if everything was governed only by the pursuit of the most realistic visual, then such a Minecraft or Lego would never be created, for example 😉
sure, but you're always bound by the artistic style of the chosen project. It's fine for minecraft to look like squares because everything looks like squares in its game world. But it's not true for arma.

[little gulch]

if Arma's visual quality didn't improve over time, nobody would have said anything about its mods visual quality

[hasty bison]

If the whole project looks uniform, then I think it's okay. I rather mind if there is a different quality within one product, which is disruptive for me.

[little gulch]

this sure

but also if a project for the base game looks not on par with the base game, it's same, for me

if it was for A2, no questions there then, but since it's for A3 and A3 looks better than A2, overall..

[hasty bison]

if the project is standalone and does not need the original game, then I do not see a problem in that it looks compatible graphically or with gameplay.

[little gulch]

partially true, yes, for me

but you know, when you get used to visuals quality progressively improving over time, when you have to make a step back, it feels so unnatural

[hasty bison]

I still don't understand why those constant allusions to A2.

[little gulch]

and I'm the guy playing exclusively Arma since 2001 and no other games and I say this, having experienced OFP's visual quality and it was more than fine for its time

for the only reason (already mentioned), that visuals not only don't correspond to 2020 standards, despite A3 being capable of better visuals than in vanilla, but not even matching base game standards

it's like when you try a Porsche after Folkswagen and don't want to get back to Folkswagen

don't know ho to explain

[hasty bison]

All our assets used in the upcoming CDLC use A3 technology.

[little gulch]

if in the base game itself, visuals remained same as in the previous title, it wouldn't have bothered me at all. but since we were nicely surprised by slightly increased visuals in A3, it's difficult to make the step back

technology, sure. I'm only talking about visuals.

[hasty bison]

Visual is the subjective view of each player.

[little gulch]

like in RHS you had for example Kamaz "taken" from A2, but it didn't look nice vs. the rest, so they had to "upgrade" it to better correspond to the rest

[nimble dove]

It seems of quite good quality judging by screenshots, @little gulch , I am not sure why you keep implying that CSLA DLC is of Arma 2 quality 🤔 Unless I misunderstood you.

[little gulch]

sure and it's my point of view only, by no mean representing the majority

well, I've seen cars and other stuff from A2 and I can hardly imagine that their textures and/or 3D models were improved

when you enable grass, have a certain distance and angle when making screenshots, even previous title stuff looks nice, as long as you don't approach it too much or sit inside it, looking at the interior's textures and buttons etc

[hasty bison]

@little gulch We got to the beginning of our discussion again. If you do not like the quality/visual level of our project, then no one will force you to buy it or waste your time with it in any way 😉

[little gulch]

I had high hopes on it, until I saw the screenshots, since GM also hasn't impressed me, unfortunately, since I always compare everything to overall base game quality, which is by no mean false way to do

[hasty bison]

I don't know exactly which vanila A2 car you mean.

[little gulch]

was happily playing OFP and A2 with a lot of mods, that were even of better quality that the base game itself

An-2, UAZ 469, Praha V3S, Mi-8, Lada 2103, Škoda 105, BTR-40

they all look very similar to A2 onces

and I have no reasons to believe they're somehow different from A2 counterparts

[unique wedge]

@little gulch Why did GM didn't impress you? All it's assets are top quality, even better than 2014-2017 vanilla assets. (Some of them still lack interiors tho...)

[little gulch]

since quality of everything is not uniform across all the stuff

something is done better, other stuff not so good and things missing to make it a complete mod, not requiring to mix it with other mods and thus running into compatibility issues and highly increased storage space requirements, because you only need certain stuff from other mods, but have to download the whole other mod or even several other mods, to compensate for stuff missing in the one you're most interested in

[nimble dove]

I think you have too high requirements, GM looks amazing for me 🤷

[little gulch]

then you're only look at it as regular player

[hasty bison]

@little gulch I can't prove to you at the moment that the vehicles you listed are different from the A2, so we have to wait until the release.

[little gulch]

you don't have to prove me anything, but I also don't see why they would look different/better, since almost nobody would take additional steps to improve existing stuff and rather take existing stuff as is, just making it work in A3

also have my suspicions for T-72 and Abrams, only based on screenshots, of course. don't remember if there was M-113 in A2. maybe in Takistan army

[hasty bison]

@little gulch With a clear conscience I can write that it is not as you wrote 😉

[little gulch]

because the terrain itself and time setting interest me a lot, to be honest, since I liked OFP the most

so if overall it will be good, from my point of view, of course, I will buy it without hesitating even 1 sec

I would have helped with testing and reporting, but since I'm already too busy with administrating on several servers and also looking a lot for A3 vanilla bugs, to 100% repro them and report (vids, screens and very detailed descriptions), no much more time I feel I'm ready to invest into A3 and stuff related to it

[hasty bison]

As I wrote ... wait and see if our project is worth spending your money on. If you are satisfied with the result (or anyone else), we will be happy, because we do not do it primarily for money 😉

[little gulch]

same as me, running several servers and spending thousands of hours in A2 + A3 to repro and report bugs )))

if only it was part of the base game itself... but I know, it doesn't depend on you, at all

severely limiting the online on severs running cDLCs

checking you youtube vids to have a better impression on the project

even if it will give me only partial impression

custom buildings and vegetation look nice

the terrain overall looks good

nice campaign would be nice, so it's worth playing it even in SP only, since there will be almost no MP servers with it, considering it's not part of base game

[short vortex]

The problem with any asset modelled to a real life counterpart is that every single iteration o new version will still look alike. Unless there's like two generations of games between them (or more).

The problem of asset originality is more in-depth than many people seem to realize. An asset that looks top quality can just as easily be updated stock model with new unwrap. And then you would not be able to say if it's from scratch or not. The same way you can add tons of detail to an old model and fit them to original uv map and texture set. That could lead you to a conclusion that it is the original asset where it is not. Also, an asset that might seem to be perfectly detailed and of great quality can very easily turn out to be an overdone model with high res texture that is filled with nothing else than plain color texture.

All in all, the beauty seems to be truly in the eye of beholder and everyone is free to pick (and pay) their favourite style.
🙂

[little gulch]

no importance if it's a revamped original, 3D or textures, as long as it improves visual quality

[upper galleon]

The only reason im purchasing this is because of the epic traffic jam screenshot. Who doesnt want to make all your friends stuck in a massive traffic jam? (im joking of course)

[hasty bison]

@upper galleon 🤣

[lone raft]

I’m an super excited for this DLC

[manic steppe]

Yeeee same!

will it have a campaign etc?

[hasty bison]

More detailed info about the content will probably be just before the release.

[manic steppe]

thank you

[unique wedge]

How long until release. Like months or weeks? Any clues we can get?

[thick parcel]

Current plan is within the next 2 months, according to Steam page

[upper galleon]

Obviously just speculating here, but I wouldn't get too tied up around that 2020 tag on the Steam page. With COVID and all I wouldn't be surprised if it gets pushed back a bit. Fingers crossed for a 2020 release though of course.

[upper galleon]

They better delay the dlc, let them have time man. Modders make my arma fresh anyway

[teal coyote]

is there any chance at all that this will be added to the base game as default dlc like the tanks,marksman,jets and laws of war, or will this be a DLC like global mobiliztion where people are sad that they can play much with it?

[sand bough]

Never. That's how CDLC works

[teal coyote]

😦 so its a $30 single player DLC?

[sand bough]

Nobody says it's 30 USD and Singleplayer only

[nimble dove]

Technically It's a paid mod if it helps with explanation.

🤔

actually not exactly

CDLC will have compatibility data for non-owners. It will be a separate mod too. If you download it, you will have weapons and vehicles, but they will be protected with watermarks or locked.

[teal coyote]

^thats what i wanted to know

CAN i bring weapons and such from the DLC to severs that i play, invade and annex

[uncut rose]

if the server allows it, yes

[teal coyote]

from what i have been told either the sever allows it and only people that have can play, or the sever dont allows it and the randos can all play

[nimble dove]

you see, if you are playing with a mod which adds new assets, then all people on the server need to have it, else they will not see your weapons

so you can estimate the most likely server setups from this

[teal coyote]

YEA so this is a mod so to play on a sever using this you would need the have it downloaded, unlike the watermark dlcs that are apart of the base game

[nimble dove]

yes you are correct 👍

[teal coyote]

sad

[mortal ice]

It'd be nicer if it was integrated into the game but if its a similar size to GlobMob on release that would just make the game too big

[teal coyote]

why not just cut off a few parts an add it the the main game as a water mark DLC with just a few things that the fan base could vote on

[mortal ice]

that sounds like it would
A) Make it even more confusing
B) cause atleast some problems with dependencies

[merry geyser]

It'd probably be okay for stuff like buildings/props used for Gabreta. Radio protocols would fit into this too.

Everything else...not so much.

[short vortex]

ČSLA Is about one third in disk space required compared to GM.

Although I'm not sure how much weight did GM gain after the last update.

[sand bough]

GM has 22 or 24 IIRC, so 6 or 7 or so?

[merry geyser]

That's a pretty impressive reduction. I guess that means there's not as many texture variants for each vehicle compared to GM?

[short vortex]

Last time I checked we were somewhere between 8 and 9 iirc.

Not sure what 'as many as' means. But US vehicles in m general have two texture variants. There's some for FIA and civilian vehicles.

[merry geyser]

I meant as in the number of different textures you can apply to a vehicle in the editor/Virtual Garage. GM's Typ 1200 for instance has like 27 or so texture variants alone.

[sand bough]

They're procedural so shouldn't kick filesizes IIRC

[short vortex]

That is the same thing. We're more concerned with military vehicles though. With civilian cars, we've kept the colors to those commonly used at the time.

[copper monolith]

The Typ1 civilian textures make up a combined total of 6,7mb. 🙇‍♂️

[upper galleon]

Will you need gm to play this mod when it comes out?

[sand bough]

No

Also this is not a MOD

[nimble dove]

technically it is

[copper monolith]

The CSLA Iron Curtain Project is unaffiliated with GM, but we're anticipating that it will be compatible anyway. (Speaking as GM Dev here)

[thick parcel]

Here's hoping! 🙂

[short vortex]

Will you need gm to play this mod when it comes out?
@upper galleon You will not as CSLA is a separate cDLC.

[solemn terrace]

So will we be playin as East or West?

[thick parcel]

Well

I mean

Whoever the mission sets it as 😄

ČSLA adds U.S. troops for West, ČSLA for East and FIA as Independents

Take your pick

[slim bridge]

I guess he means the campaign? Will there even be a campaign? 🤔

[thick parcel]

No campaign mentioned on store page

[solemn terrace]

I want a campaign that covers the eastern experience in modern era

you know, play as the russians, see their side of the story

[golden flint]

Don't know if the question was asked before, but will there be an M1 Abrams with 3D Interiors ?

[short vortex]

The tanks have viewport s modelled only.

[swift path]

Hey, I’m just happy to get a new Abrams model

In Cold War colors

[obtuse storm]

We're getting the Hind and Cobra still yeah?

[short vortex]

Hind and Cobra are not part of the i itial release. There are Mi-17 and U/MH-60A variants present.

[wintry berry]

wHEN IS THIS GOIING ON SALE?

[sonic grove]

https://www.whenisthenextsteamsale.com/

but first, it needs to be released

[wintry berry]

When will; it be released?

put it on sale now so i can give you money

[tulip pilot]

We don't know when it will be released yet

[short vortex]

Release date is yet to be set.

[scenic cove]

As of now it'll be in 2021

[upper galleon]

Did they say what quarter

[merry geyser]

No. Which means the release timeframe could be anywhere between 1st of Jan 2021 to 31st Dec 2021. Only Art of War had a specific timeframe announced (sometime in "early" 2021).

[bold mulch]

I hope it will take long enough so the uniforms wouldn't look like from Arma 2 (vide last video about CSLA)

[upper galleon]

No. Which means the release timeframe could be anywhere between 1st of Jan 2021 to 31st Dec 2021. Only Art of War had a specific timeframe announced (sometime in "early" 2021).
@merry geyser I’m assuming q1 2021 then for art of war; what does that even add?

I hope it will take long enough so the uniforms wouldn't look like from Arma 2 (vide last video about CSLA)
@bold mulch wdym?

I’m starting to think they just aren’t working on anything

Arma 3 related

[merry geyser]

Some uniforms, vests, editor props and backpacks. It's a charity DLC that becomes free for everyone in September 2021. Mind you, it's different from CSLA since it's not a Creator DLC and is "official" content.

[upper galleon]

Ok, sound good thanks for the info