livonia_feedback

[wild hare]

content can't be free

[lament tangle]

The Livonia/contact bundle is apparently still around btw. Only 15% off though. https://store.steampowered.com/bundle/12653/Livonia_Bundle/

[wild hare]

money splits the community
@opal vortex I more hate how community is always split based on some weapon or faction of choice, "I don't like 2035 generic rifle so I will only play with 2010 generic AK rifle", "vanilla gear is always terrible so I will only play with modded weapons", "I don't have hard drive space to install modded weapons", etc, in the end noone plays anything :/

[opal vortex]

sorry, i forgot /s

(sarcasm)

[wild hare]

what you said is quite true

[opal vortex]

well, tbh:
i don't care much. i'm part of a team that provides over 20GB of free content. no monetization allowed. some say this splits "the community", some say it doesn't.
we can do this because it's our hobby and we don't have to pay bills with it. a company like BI on the other hand has to pay bills and their workers, so selling a DLC with a terrain is what they can and have to do.

[wild hare]

Didn't mean to bring CUP mod size into the discussion, I know it gets brought up often

I more meant that people are too picky about what to play with

[opal vortex]

no problem. just wanted to point out what one mod brings of free content. now imagine what else is on the workshop. so a few bucks for a terrain by BI is no issue imo

[bitter needle]

Didn't mean to bring CUP mod size into the discussion,
audiocustoms just likes to brag about how big his mod is 😉 (kidding)

[opal vortex]

not just the mod 😉

[wild hare]

Didn't mean to bring CUP mod size into the discussion,
Didn't mean to bring CUP mod size into the discussion, but god it's huge! 😲

[opal vortex]

that's what she said

[sullen arrow]

Another + on Livonia, despite the power stations not being destructable, having the nice empty interior to install generators and stuff you could potentially blow is nice.

The only other thing I wish was the bridges would be removable

As of now, I don't think there is any way to get rid of them?

[hollow pilot]

They could be foldable so that boats could pass

[sullen arrow]

I mean if you really want to take a boat through them all I believe the the smaller ones can go under every bridge.

[viral belfry]

no problem. just wanted to point out what one mod brings of free content. now imagine what else is on the workshop. so a few bucks for a terrain by BI is no issue imo
@opal vortex I wish it'd be not locked behind paywall. It'd be better if you could enter the server with DLC terrain and game simply nagged on players who doesn't have DLC. I bought Livonia and ALL the DLC, including that Cold War one. But I am playing KOTH on Altis and Malden and sick of the repeat. Servers which tried to run Livonia never took off due lack of players and that's same with older DLCs as well (Tanoa). If game allowed playing on DLC terrains online - ppl would get tired of nagging and be more likely to pay. From my perspective Livonia has been total waste of money.

[opal vortex]

Ok

[viral belfry]

Btw with your free content: no monetization policy blocks from using free mods as effectively as paywall. At least that's how it's seem to have worked out

[wild hare]

I doubt that people eager to pay to get access to life servers will be eager to also donate to mod creators whose content is being used. So it doesn't change anything to mod creators to the worse. But adds more justice.

"Hey we've made this content for free, play as much as you like just don't earn money on our work' seems fair to me.

If I understood your complaint correctly.

[viral belfry]

Understandable. But with larger pvp servers it kinda stops server owner from funding the upkeep of the servers. People are much less likely do general donation than exchange money for special vip status involving 'premium' skins or reserved slots

I believe that's surely been discussed before and discarded as an argument. Bringing it up only because I had run-in with the case recently myself

No-monetization policy has for example put stop on development of RHS KOTH, since for the dev of the mission it's dealkiller. Few servers get funded only because 1 player agreed to cover the cost for one server and head admin is running bunch of other servers that are running vanilla and monetized- so he took money from their "pool" to pay for the upkeep of non-monetized one. Long term, not sustainable

An example

It's OT anyway

[merry night]

I think Arma 3 would gain more popularity if there weren't so many DLC's that restrict you to use things inside the game, like jets. I think it would be better if half the shit was free for new people

[crimson cairn]

Have you ever seen the Steam Workshop? So much free content without limitations, and some of it is at BI level or even better.

[merry night]

@crimson cairn i mean original game content

[crimson cairn]

Well, Arma 3 is popular enough even with non-requiring DLC's (like Jets).
Only thing which could be free are terrains, although I don't mind paying for them since they add a lot of worth to the game.
Especially when looking at other AAA titles and their DLC's

But this is going off-topic (it's not related to Livonia in any way), so should be continued in #offtopic_arma

[unreal solstice]

like there's never been a discount

[jagged sage]

well if you REALLY wanna play arma 3 2035 with vanilla equipment and not anything else then why not just buy the dlcs?

[viral belfry]

One thing to make mods more viable would be to integrate mod-management straight into game's server browser (even if it needs whole game restarting). Many players are simply TOO STUPID to figure out how to enter modded servers.

[autumn root]

And what does that have to do with livonia 👀 ? @viral belfry

[viral belfry]

It was answer to argument about A3 having plenty of free mods like bare 5 posts higher.

[harsh star]

I have this wierd Problem,

Everytime im on livonia

Espetially in the north

There tends to be a wierd Occurence of misplaced Trailers

Inside houses

And in the floor

[limber raft]

A l i e n s

👽

[harsh star]

Its spoopy indeed, espetially while playing Ravage in the fog

You be Hearing spoopy Sounds then boom, Floor trailer

[viral belfry]

bruh its aliens lol

[little moat]

hey is there a thing like dsaz but for arma

[autumn root]

#arma3_questions @little moat

[zinc vine]

could be nice. or sell it in a pack

and milsim

we played on it last year

when I joined. hmm wait I think it was actually this spring 😂

You've got point

The problem could be that Contact is not at the price point of the rest of ARMA

different customer base that is buying

maps might make sense to separate from the rest of the dlc

because people would still want to buy kit. But some would just buy the map and nothing else

[autumn root]

I wish BI used a better DLC model for maps, but I also dont know one thats better

doing the old 'worse textures for the free version' is just gonna cause people to complain how bad arma looks

[limber raft]

It's a 7 year old game, there aren't that many ppl playing on public servers anymore anyway...

Either way, Contact pricing will probably eventually be lowered, if ppl are still playing then, more ppl will get it

[autumn root]

That doesnt really help with the player numbers when it gets released, or most of the time after that, though

[paper oasis]

Would be dope if BI allowed players to join servers hosted on maps they don't own yet not allow them to host/play on the map by themselves... That way we would see more Livonia Servers and even more sales since players would "taste" the map and want to play the campaign...

[round badge]

You mean so that people can just run their own local dedicated server and play on terrains they don't own as much as they want to?

[viral belfry]

Yes you can; pub Zeus on Livonia as one example

[viral belfry]

No shit. Haven't had chance to play Livonia MP in A3 at all. Just in DayZ SA. Despite having bought both.

[paper oasis]

No I meant severs with the license from Bohemia to do so. So for example if BI runs a Livonia server any player can join (Even without the DLC), but the players themselves can't host (dedi or local) if they don't own the DLC

Additionally, It could be so that If a player owns the DLC and hosts a mission on the map their friends can join his server even without themselves owning the DLC. That way you motivate server hosters to buy the DLC while their players can "sneak peak" into what they would be getting by buying said DLC

Of course BI should find a nice middle ground there but seems like a way to promote more sales and more content (mods and missions) for maps like Livonia that do not get much content otherwise

PS: I am just thinking out loud, don't take this as a suggestion and/or request but more of a community brainstorming of sorts

[round badge]

"motivate server hosters to buy"
You didn't know that the Arma dedicated server includes all DLC terrains and can be downloaded by anyone even "anonymous" user?

[paper oasis]

I know that it includes everything but did not know if it allows them to host on maps they don't own too...

[round badge]

Dedicated servers can be hosted without owning Arma

[paper oasis]

And can Livonia be hosted by Dedicated servers without owning the DLC too?

[round badge]

You don't need a steam account to host a server

No matter what terrain including CDLC

Otherwise hosters like Nitrado wouldn't work

[paper oasis]

Ok so for my suggestion to work there would have to be some sort of ownership check done on the server...

perhaps too much work

[round badge]

Servers have no steam accounts assigned

[paper oasis]

I see... well that renders my suggestion kinda hard to implement

[viral belfry]

Getting workshop mods set up in your dedi server without owning Arma3 is fair pain tho. Much easier to log into server box with existing steam user owning Arma3 and use that to get the mods off workshop, then just link the folders.

[mossy scroll]

yeah, unfortunately mods are locked for accounts not owning A3

yet missions can be downloaded without owning it on account 🙃

[broken cedar]

Contact DLC is awesome

[slim epoch]

definitely

[crystal sonnet]

Can u play contact co op?

I havent touched the sinlge player yet

[autumn root]

Dont think so

the campaign that is

[flat halo]

First Contact is designed only for singleplayer

[median crater]

it'd be sick with the alien objects publicized to the platform

would be making some sick missions that way.

[sullen arrow]

I assumed the reason they didn't add the alien stuff was more about how intuitive they are. It takes a bit more work to get them to work with their AI and I doubt they could of done that easy with the more casual Zeus crowd

[brave sedge]

any mods to increase fps in forest ?

have 30-40 fps with modern hardware on board

[flat halo]

Most unlikely

[viral belfry]

the 30-40 fps part ? 😛

[opal vortex]

If there where mods that magically boost performance / fps, don't you think BI would have looked into it already?

[flat halo]

People still thinks Arma 3 is something similar with Minecraft 🙂

[sullen arrow]

Just make a mod that forces only 1600m view distance and low terrain detail. Boom FPS Booster mod.

[opal vortex]

first public version was a literal CPU melter 😄

[paper oasis]

That never changed

[opal vortex]

but it got ray tracing now

so... melting CPU with a glare

[somber ivy]

Livonia is a beautiful map its a pity more servers don't use it for game play

[paper oasis]

Not enough players own it to warrant making a server for it I guess

It is truly sad

[sullen arrow]

I wouldn't say there isn't enough players, more like it would just take some time to gather enough peeps who like Livonia. We are a very scattered community

[limber raft]

It might also have to do with how much of a performance hog it is

I have no problem running any kinds of missions all over Altis, even Tanoa. But I find myself under 30 fps in Livonia with the simplest mission

[opal pine]

and livonia is kinda small

so anything with helicopters or like an A10 woudent really work

[sullen sapphire]

Eh, it's bigger than Chernarus, no?

[bitter needle]

It's smaller in terms of total map size. Not sure it is on landmass though

[lament tangle]

10% smaller landmass, if I recall correctly

[queen sun]

livonia fps is terrible in the towns, something really wrong

[heavy pond]

even on altis/tanoa it feels waaaay to small to use a jet effectively, takes 5 seconds to cross the map

[opal pine]

yea true, that's why I propose a map of the taiga biome

Once in a while a Russian prison

[queen sun]

they needed a turbo prop cas plane

https://i1.wp.com/militaryleak.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/29-super-tucano-preflight.jpg

[potent kelp]

The best terrain by far. A nice blend of forest and open ground. Its not nearly as performance heavy as Tanoa and i would love to see more with a few rivers and lakes.

[hollow kayak]

i have a lower FPS on Livonia than on Tanoa though 😒

[opal vortex]

exactly what to expect

[viral belfry]

Same thing for me and I run a 10700k and 3080

Lowering my settings doesn't help, if I bring sampling down back to 100% I'll gain maybe 5-10 at most

[brave sedge]

that's sad, I bought contact dlc only for this map...

[rotund meteor]

You should be grateful its 30-40 fps,especially on livonia.

[arctic hare]

Livonia is literally full of trees. If it ran really well I'd be hailing BI as a god of performance

[limber raft]

I mean, so is Tanoa

And it runs better

[opal pine]

livonia doesnt have a clear border 😔

[novel bluff]

At least it isn’t rocky island #474739, I like having a place like that

[limber raft]

The Livonia terrain is only a section of the country of Livonia

It's not the entire country. So, since it's inland, there's no borders

[viral belfry]

boring as hell dude

i mean its cool but, its small af

[opal vortex]

ok

[novel bluff]

Isn’t really that small unless you do air stuff

But why would you do air in a place as good looking as liv?

[limber raft]

Livonia is a hell of a great terrain. So much detail and micro terrain. It looks stunning, and has amazing spots for missions

[azure patrol]

livonia has the coolest buildings

[novel bluff]

It has the only unique buildings

[molten steppe]

Thanks Dayz

❤️

[viral belfry]

Facts

i still love the old map

i forgot the name because i have simply not played dayz in a year

[stoic marten]

It's not a good map because it has the performance of a potato running Crysis. They got carried away making the map and the objects count is waaaay too high to make people actually play it and have stable performance, at least not in COOP MP :/ Looks great, plays bad 😦

[viral belfry]

i think other wise

[stoic marten]

Do you play with 100+ Enemies on a dedicated server with people from around the globe? Performance is bad, outright. Optimization is bad simply, compared to Altis it's a huuuge lagfest :/

[paper oasis]

Yeah I was getting 20 to 30 FPSs while playing Livonia with just 10 friends versus Altis were I get 60+, hell even Tanoa I run on 50+

[stoic marten]

Yeah man tell me about it, I get good FPS watching the birds in the sky on Livonia but looking down that shit TANKS 😄

[viral belfry]

i didnt Play dayz on pc

[novel canyon]

I really liked the spooky atmosphere and ambience of night livonia in contact dlc campaign. Is it available in any other livonia scenarios/missions from workshop? Or it's the campaign exclusive only?

[languid gazelle]

you can make it yourself. it's just a bunch of environment variables

[novel canyon]

@languid gazelle thanks for encouraging. But i have zero scripting knowledge 🙂

[languid gazelle]

well you can make your own scenarios in Eden editor. You don't need scripting knowledge to set up a mission

if you want to have that atmosphere in other people's missions then yeah, you need scripting

[novel canyon]

Ok. Never ventured into editor so far. May be will try someday. Btw, do you know anything similar (scenarios) from the workshop?

[languid gazelle]

no 🤔

[novel canyon]

Ok. No problem. Thanks anyway.

[languid gazelle]

if you happen to need help with that, you can ask in #arma3_editor and #arma3_scripting

[novel canyon]

Ok.👍

[wintry frigate]

Why the livonia environment sound is sooooo LOUD?
I can even hear anyone if i got the effects on the max volume.
Wind.. Rain.. etc..

since the release of the DLC until today they haven't fixed it, is there any special reason?

The only way to play there with heavy weather conditions is reducing the Effects sound (The General sound) or enableEnvironment false;

(Just put the same Volume of Altis, Malden, Tanoa, Stratis)

[autumn root]

since the release of the DLC until today they haven't fixed it, is there any special reason?
Did you create a feedback tracker ticket? @wintry frigate

[wintry frigate]

I did a few seconds ago.
With so many patches I really thought that someone had already reported it.
Either way goes later than never. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

https://feedback.bistudio.com/T159519

[autumn root]

thank you!

[wild hare]

Or make arma 3 free, it's too good not to be part of everyone's steam library

[crimson pelican]

Buy just the dlc

If it is that good price is justified

[paper oasis]

Even better, learn to map, use the Livonia assets in Arma 3 and make your own Livonia 😉

[viral belfry]

Bohemia Interactive owned

[formal thicket]

I mean it is on sale every other month so grab them when they go on sale...

[viral belfry]

Yeah

Thats what i did

Being polish and all

Having my shitty currency that prevents everyone from becoming incredibly poor

[wicked saffron]

i thank you the map maker of Livonia.
north part of livonia is outstanding, it makes me drop tears for how good it is.
it has that feeling of home and family in it.

thank you dev team

[viral belfry]

thats cool

[viral belfry]

Then annoying cod kids would join lmao

[swift prism]

sparker are we gonna talk about how bohemia needs money to yk, function?

[real lily]

I say a free weekend/week sometimes would be a good in between.

[supple crescent]

it would definitely help with people trying out or discovering arma 3 for the first time

now that argo is dead

[pure kiln]

Arma is kind of to big of a game to go ftp tbh

[onyx gyro]

I mean, it's only 7 bucks on sale...

Also, if it went free I'd assume dlc would not be

[viral belfry]

Argo has been dead since launch

Literally

[supple crescent]

arma 3 on the Argo model is not something I want to see

[light gate]

Yeah the game doesn't deserve to be free, but they made massive sales anyways, i wont be surprised if they made the game free for a limited time on Epic

[autumn root]

wat? epic?

[pure kiln]

They arent even on epic arent they

[light gate]

yep, im not surprised if they just randomly releass their game on epic

[autumn root]

Why would they tho?

Arma wouldnt be nearly as great without the steam workshop, which wouldnt be available on epic

[light gate]

yeah

[timid arrow]

Is it a known bug that the fire geometry on some of the livonia structures doesnt follow the visual geomtry, for example cant throw a grenade through an open door

[wintry frigate]

https://feedback.bistudio.com/

[timid arrow]

done already:
https://feedback.bistudio.com/T161544

[round badge]

Yes, Groove_C collected a bunch of these into a ticket once

[timid arrow]

Oh, alright. Should i delete mine

[round badge]

you can't delete tickets

but maybe link it to Groove's

[timid arrow]

This needs to be a feature... 😩

[stiff gulch]

Is it just me or Livonia is very low framerate

I play around in Altis Stratis Malden Tanoa , my framerate was nice 30+ stable but then as soon as I load into Livonia my framrate noped out 😂

Well maybe a little lower framerate on Altis but rather smooth. I have problem with Livonia and I wanna know why 😂 😂 😂

Is it because of the trees???

[trail cove]

It is poorly optimised comparing to other official maps so might be. However other maps using Livonian trees, like Chernarus 2020 which is bigger and has a similar density, works much better.

[pliant temple]

yep, wish there were more such maps. Cherno is old, livonia is unplayable. Yet assets are beautiful

[upper quartz]

virolahti =)

[pliant temple]

too flat, unfortunately :C

[turbid maple]

Check chen redux

[onyx gyro]

Chernarus Redux is beautiful, love it

[pliant temple]

the closest one to livonia currently is cherno2020. Redux = old assets low fps. Again, it's cherno all over again(14 years old map) no matter how you tweak it .
There are were some good maps in works close to livonia vibe, but unfinished

[viral belfry]

huh? can't really complain over livonia's performance. way better than many mod maps have and uniformly consistent-looking.

[trail cove]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[pliant temple]

no idea what kind of modded maps you play..

[viral belfry]

Try playing X-Cam for example. It should be renamed "FPS drop", especially in big cities

CUP-based maps often would look just ugly.. Mostly because change between lod's is sudden and while up close maps may even look fairly nice, starting from, dunno,100m, grass suddenly wholly dissapears, replaced by some flat texture of odd green, creating disjointed impression.

[pliant temple]

x-cam is outdated and has higher buildings density.
Livonia has vast open spaces & doesn't have such density, hence why people are confused regarding perfomance. South part of the map with mainly forests is the worst(check Swarog) and comparable to bad optimized modded maps.

[wicked saffron]

i wonder what's different between Livonia map in ARMA 3 and DayZ

[humble stream]

1 has brain dead zombies on it and the other is on DayZ

[bitter needle]

You can kind of see the differences here if you compare it to the A3 one: https://dayz.ginfo.gg/livonia/

Biggest ones I know about are military/hazmat bases and a castle prison south of Gliniska on the hill

[grizzled tendon]

Or you can also compare the "Contact map" and "DayZ Livonia map" in BI store:

https://store.bistudio.com/img/products/228/images/zODFssSA.jpg
https://store.bistudio.com/img/products/234/images/Hch1Had6.jpg

Although all I can say is that "these maps were accurate at some point in time" 🙄

[languid pine]

Hey, had a nice run today on Livonia with a bunch of people. I really love the map, wish it was more in public use other than just as DLC. My favourite map although the FPS is kinda low ye, but atleast it looks nice 😄

// I love the nature, remind me of home.

[storm widget]

Yeah, Livonia is so nice. The grass, the anthills, the mushrooms...

[queen sun]

how is the FPS these days on livonia ... still tanking in towns?

devs ever provide a reason for the unusual fps drop in towns?

IMO livonia should be moved to the "free to play" list of terrains now so it actually gets played. cut the cost of Contact DLC in half and expose the terrain to everyone.

Everyone who bought Livonia actually wants to play on it, and would happily play alongside people who didn't buy it (but can still play on it). If you understand how multiplayer works, people gravitate to populated servers with lowest barrier to entry

with the broken FPS in Livonia, devs have perfect excuse to release as free. "sorry community, this does not meet our QA in 2022 and so we are releasing free for all."

[viral belfry]

Livonia is a great map but the fps issues ah

[flat halo]

I don't think broken = must be free...

[round badge]

I haven't experienced actual big fps issues on Livonia

I could try looking into it but if I can't reproduce bad fps that'll be a waste of time

[paper oasis]

Even if the devs manage to identify the culprit of these FPS issues that a very high % of the steam reviews reported already, it will be most likely unfixable by now due to lack of resources and/or human talent remaining allocated to our good old A3. A similar and quite crippling stutter issue related to big rocks was reported, tested and confirmed many months ago and it has remained unfixed and will most likely remain like that even thou it affects a sizeable number of workshop maps and custom compositions that rely on these huge rocks. So there...

[round badge]

I fixed a big part of large rocks slowness issue months ago. But it was the AI part, not the physics part

[fallow comet]

isnt the fps impact from more demanding vegetation and objects from Enoch? [or less optimized]

[queen sun]

it is reproducible in the editor in the big town, just fly around it and youll feel it. far worse than kavala or georgetown

@round badge what was the rocks issue

regarding livonia FPS, as example:

My FPS in Kavala is 80, empty editor

My FPS in Topolin is ~55

in editor okay thats playable, but in multiplayer it only goes down from there

And Topolin is small compared to kavala

viewdistance 1000, object view distance 1000, shadow distance 200

position: [1796.48,7329.09,0.00136757]

47 for blank editor is unacceptable . 9700k 2070s 32gb 3200mhz m.2 ssd

[flat halo]

47 in Kavala, 30 in Topolin on my potato. But whatsoever, broken FPS never leads it to be free

[rich frost]

Tone down the render distance and frames are a non issue

[wicked saffron]

With map like Livonia render distance of 3000 is enough

[paper oasis]

Now that we know that it was the Ai (we speculated that too but the issue was also present when player was driving near the rocks and not only when Ai units get shot near the rocks), is it fixable?

[round badge]

The AI thing was fixed.
The other thing is physics.
Of course it's fixable but not worth the time

[paper oasis]

So the rock thingy was fixed and the Ai thingy was fixed. Probably the stuttering is gone now. Gonna test soon.

[queen sun]

the render distance of the above example is 1000

[viral belfry]

problem is: few ppl to play it with, due it being behind paywall. Essentially becomes useless for those buyers who'd like to play MP on it.
Its not only Livonia's issue, same problem with Weferlingen, Gabreta.. basically didnt bother buying SOG because I KNEW there would be nobody to play it with after first week or so. Core issue is content restriction when it comes to terrains - its also subtly punishing paying dlc buyers. Watermark it, nag with popups, dont please paywall..
I have all Arma 3 DLC/CDLC, except SOG. Even bought Livonia for DayZ, just to see map - have played that game maybe 20h tops..

[autumn root]

The question is how the dlc system could be improved, which isnt easy to answer

[viral belfry]

Subtly punishing paying customers isn't the correct way tho. Include terrain in compatibility packages. Who'd play cdlc content on other maps than the ones they are meant to be played on?

It's like selling car without engine or wheels..

[vague ember]

Why arma3 is so laggy? Optimize It, please! RX 590, Ryzen 5 2600X, 64 GB RAM- 44 FPS on LOW

[flat halo]

1. Low makes it worse
2. No big optimizations will come anymore
3. Is this related to Livonia?
4. 44 is pretty fine to play...

[paper oasis]

1. Indeed Low settings and also a low resolution makes the game throw all the workload to the CPU. If you have a decent GPU it is better for your FPS to set everything to HIGH at least.

2. Some scripting commands that were often used in missions and perhaps the Livonia Campaign got recently optimised by Dedmen. FPSs might not go up but you will get less stuttering for sure.

3. If he runs Livonia at 44 then he probably runs Altis at 70+ FPSs

4. 44 is indeed good enough for SP. 44 with stutters is no fun thou.

[trail cove]

if you blink with the frequency of stutters you don't even notice them

btw I was somehow able to mitigate the stutters through bluntly "releasing"/flushing the memory, in my case feature comes with MSI board software and I'm not sure what's the counterpart for others but for sure it worked