creator_dlc_discussion

[knotty ore]

make the plan

count the time and costs

[jaunty stump]

Alright

[knotty ore]

then you might start to see yourself where the realism is at

[young geyser]

Exactly, those vary greatly from country to country thou... where are you working from?

[knotty ore]

you cant share that though I think.

or publicly be "im making a dlc"

if you make a pitch its hus hus

[jaunty stump]

Okay

[knotty ore]

as in same way as all other dlcs have been made

[jaunty stump]

When you make a pitch for a CDLC are you supposed to already have some of it done

[knotty ore]

prototype probably wont hurt

you can technically pitch with a plan drawn on a napkin

but I doubt that goes well

the more you prepare the better chances you have

[jaunty stump]

Okay

Thank you

[steady nest]

AoW was not a CDLC, and what you call for would require the third-party devs to give (up) the assets to BI, no take-backsies

[steady nest]

Problem there is that just as you talked trough with THP801 the appropriate size/efficiency of CDLC content amounts, the CDLC teams themselves may have crunched the numbers and determined that this low content amount (too small CDLC) is what they need in order to turn a profit in the foreseeable future within the constraints of Bohemia's CDLC contract terms... looks at Reaction Forces being a separate CDLC instead of a Western Sahara update

[lunar socket]

RF's (at least partial) point was to "increase our income for future projects" and "even the 1.1 update gave barely a return in value" so I think large updates to small CDLC are out of the question, but new tiny CDLC aren't.

[steady nest]

By a return in value I guess you mean that Rotator Collective saw very little sales increase of Western Sahara relative to how much it cost to do the 1.1 update, to the point that it may lost money 😬

[rich mist]

imo get rid or minimize planes in such a CDLC

They often get little to no use and end up being a total waste of time

People looooove jets yet the amount of times jets show up in missions(or are enjoyable in any capacity) when the majority of time people play as ground assets is incredibly low

they just operate on a far larger scale than infantry-focused gameplay really cares for

And as for unique conflicts the Korean War would be a better fit than Falklands, you'd have far less overlap with any other existing conflict

[steady nest]

That's an elephant in the room when it comes to fixed-wing in Arma

[jaunty stump]

I doubt that, there really aren’t that many British or European Cold War assets

I can’t name a single mod that has a Vulcan, a unimog or a Stalwart

[jaunty stump]

That just seems like US bias. There would be way more overlap with a Korean based CDLC with other American Cold War CDLC’s

[grave osprey]

CWRIII has a stalwart!

[rich mist]

If US Bias is a concern then there's significantly more conflicts to draw from

[rich mist]

Like the hundred or so Africa-related conflicts, Bush Wars, Chinese Civil War, Middle-Eastern conflicts, etc.

[grave osprey]

The Falklands War was the last near-peer conflict before Ukraine. One of the few nation-on-nation conflicts of the Cold War. Plus the equipment featured would be relevant to all the other conflicts you listed, seeing as the UK was covertly involved in most of them.

SAS CDLC ftw.

[rich mist]

technically the last near-peer conflict was the georgian war of 2008

If we're talking purely based on numbers.

[mild rain]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1284731930&searchtext=Global+Mobilization+-+Demo+Vehicle

[jaunty stump]

That’s so cool

[mild rain]

Let's hope that Vertexmacht will carry on their work for Arma 4

[random crane]

EF wasnt prohibitively expensive to finance but it was all out of pocket from me, on top of that you still need to consider that the burden for carrying the project to the finish line is entirely on your shoulders and its not easy to cope with this responsability

there's lots of fun stuff, seeing assets come to life is awesome, but there's also a lot of really menial, tedious, boring tasks

you'll be working for 2-3 years in silence to deliver a project and you won't see a dime until it's out, so there's that too to keep in consideration

i think now its really late to make a pitch for a DLC, let alone a big one like "the war in the falklands"

if you asked me the week EF released i would've said there was still time, then the following week reforger dropped on PS5 and the playercount skyrocketed, so there's that

i dont expect A3 to die anytime soon, i think it will retain a stable playercount well into A4's release, same as A2 did with A3, but you should ask yourself if it's worth jumping into a project like that now

also the tools are a huge pain to work with and by now everything feels like a chore, everything takes ages to compile (it's gotten a lot worse since the latest a3/mikero tools patch, i dont think i'd have been able to deliver EF if it was like this 2 years ago), tbh i just want to be done and move on to enfusion 😬

thank you for coming to my ted talk 🙃

[coral ledge]

I disagree, you've got a lot of overlap with already existing DLCs (Spearhead and SOG)
Falklands would be interesting in that there's:

• few modded assets (DLC-quality map is nonexistant, not to trash on anyone's work), ergo it'd be unique to what's out there, paid and unpaid
• less of a US-bias that CDLCs tend to have
• hopefully a naval focus

in a hypothetical scenario i think the falklands would just be far more interesting, but thats just due to the fact that with the usage of SOG and Spearhead, or even just SOG with some retextures, you can basically do the Korean War with little trouble

in my opinion though (if i had the experience, money, and motivation to do this) i'd love to do some 70s/80s cold war africa stuff. the south african border war comes to mind
i understand the consensus for CDLCs is to minimize the work/assets needed, but actual genuine South African gear + Cubans and SWAPO/PLAN would prove to be one of the most unique CDLCs we'd (theoretically) have

SADF-clones of the galil and FAL, mirage 3s and Angolan MiG-21s, cuban troops, bunch of eastern weaponry from the 1940s to 1980s

would overall be an insane amount of work just in the assets alone, let alone the map, but would still be really cool

[young geyser]

Great Ted talk if you ask me. Completely agree on all points. Any upcoming CDLC should release at least one year before Arma 4 does to ensure player retention until break even

[steady nest]

@jaunty stump #creator_dlc_discussion message

[steady ravine]

release on arma 4 release date cuz why not

[young geyser]

Better yet, release on GTA VI release day! Zero players guaranteed 😂

[lunar socket]

Maybe you could have an update after A4's release to bring attention back.

[young geyser]

Yeah, good luck with that. Arma 4's release would have to be a severe flop if anyone wants to bring attention to Arma 3 afterwards....

[lunar socket]

I doubt it. I feel like half of A3 players would be crying that Enfusion will kill Arma and that they want their 2000's era stuff back that they claim is modern.

[young geyser]

What is "their 2000's era stuff back"?

[random crane]

its safe to say that whatever A4 is going to have, modders and community creators will fill in whatever they want to see

you can see it in reforger already, there's no shortage of modern content and the base game is set in 1989

[lunar socket]

I know, but people will complain regardless. "They" already complain that Reforger is cold war.

[young geyser]

There is no avoiding that but if Arma Reforger is of any reference players who weren't sold on the timeframe just played modded or stayed with Arma 3... So complainers didn't last long

[random crane]

you dont have to listen to everyone who writes on the internet 😇 you're allowed to disagree

or just filter them out

[lunar socket]

I'm focusing on the stayed with A3 part. IMO people will keep playing it for a loooong time.

[young geyser]

Even then, the Arma Community has less complainers than the average game in my oppinion. Mods basically silence any complaint as anyone can find whatever the would like with mods....

[lunar socket]

That's half the reason why I don't play Call of Duty and stuff.

[young geyser]

As long as BI keeps supporting the game players and server hosts will exist... that is the key point really

[steady nest]

Remember that Arma 3 dropped five days before GTA V did...

[steady ravine]

and starts picking up players when GTA V released on PC

[coral shore]

Agreed - I do way less programming/arma stuff than you but I have some fairly elaborate stuff for zeus ops and frankly I'm tired of the tools/SQF - it works(TM) which is about the best thing you can say about it but as someone who's day job is programming it's just not very pleasant to work with for extended periods (which is to take nothing away from the brilliance that it clearly is in allow you to do the things you can do but it's at absolute best a necessary evil). I'm likely to ride A3 into the A4 era because I remember A3 at launch 😄 and I'll give it a year or so to settle out first 😄

[random crane]

yes i think i haven't met a single programmer who had a good opinion of SQF 😄 i guess you can say it's just a product of its time, which is fine

now i see plenty of people, including many newcomers, get into enfusion and bring all sorts of content in game which makes me hopeful the new tools will be much easier and more pleasant to work with, with a lot less downtime too (test>adjust>repack>relaunch>retest cycle is finally gone)

[coral shore]

💯 a product of its time and it's simply a niche language - I don't expect the tooling to be as advanced as a mainstream language but eh still doesn't negate the pain and SQF is generally an odd language 🙂

[steady nest]

It was a language which, like the Arma franchise itself, was never supposed to be this relevant/last this long

[olive vortex]

SQF is great.

[random crane]

know that i saved this

[tepid lance]

When your introduction to programming is SQF, and your introduction to 3D modeling is Oxygen2. 😬

[random crane]

also visitor3 for terrains

🫠

[knotty ore]

Visitor3 road tool ❤️

[sinful cape]

not a problem if you are in the year 2015

[tepid lance]

Yeah, 2015, right, sure 😅

[jovial locust]

hey sqf is a great language to learn in 2025 you dont run into anything weird

||https://community.bistudio.com/wiki/createHashMapObject||

[feral river]

At least some sort of OOP in SQF. Better than nothing 😆

[olive vortex]

One of few commands that's forbidden in any of my code bases. Also in CBA and ACE.

[olive vortex]

Good, I honestly believe it's great language for scripting gameplay related features and most of the issues people have is due to lack of skill or projecting their experience with "normal" languages.

I won't deny it's weird lang though. And ofc with limited capabilities. But it's a great little thing.

[native matrix]

The language and language features themselves aren't that great in SQF. Its the lack of syntax sugar, reflection, operator overloading and such language features that makes it kinda nice. For a beginners there isn't as much "magic" that isn't easy to explain as in other languages.

But generally the stuff that is good about SQF is not the language, but rather the huge amount of abstraction the script commands do.
Many things one would need are just 1-2 script commands away.

"most of the issues people have is due to lack of skill or projecting their experience with "normal" languages."
I mean there is a good amount of mental overhead to not make simple mistakes in SQF that in other languages you can't even really do at all. Due to magic values, using arrays to pass data into functions/commands...
Yes its all simple mistakes, but that is why it feels tedious/annoying/less enjoyable.

[pastel pendant]

what a bunch of nerd talk

i want to know when the next big guns cdlc will come out

https://tenor.com/view/assasin-mode-gif-10004245741319730508

[random crane]

hell yea brotherrr

[feral river]

We are on military simulation sandbox game's discord sever, of course talk is gonna be nerdy 😂

[pallid raptor]

yeah I completely agree. imo enfusion should have something like SQF too for mission scripting

[clever dust]

I think it would be a very different very unique but also a very niche product

(Insert Obligatory plug for my mod though)

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3266412790

[feral river]

I'm curious why are HashMap objects forbidden in your code?

[earnest knoll]

The last Falkland map is really good, you don't intend to trash, but you do. Maybe stop talking and make a better map.. if you can..

[coral ledge]

notice how I said DLC-quality map

there are few, if any, maps made by modders that are anywhere near similar in quality to SOG PF's map for instance. or weferlingen for that matter

in just sheer amount of work put into it, details, etc

i'll voice whatever i want about the falklands map. i don't dislike it, nor do i love it

i'm glad it's a thing, but if a DLC variant existed, you'd be crazy not to believe it would probably be better than the modded map

[earnest knoll]

Because DLC maps are fantasy maps, made to be pretty. The Falklands aren't pretty; it's an inhospitable, cold area with no trees

[knotty ore]

I would guess he means there are differences in the technical quality. Which is to be expected with differences in maker experience. However a modded map can be just as "good" if made with enough time and effort. DLC expectations likely higher though.

[earnest knoll]

I showed the map to a veteran, and he said it was like being there. If the same can be said for a DLC map, that's great.
I don't know the map's creator; he's from Argentina, but we finally have a good map.

[lunar socket]

What do you mean fantasy map?

[grave osprey]

Ah, one of the bad guys 🤔

[knotty ore]

no need to bring politics into this

[lunar socket]

I think it's a joke.

[coral ledge]

as horriblegoat said, technical ability. there will almost always be a difference in user created maps and maps that are going to be actually sold as a product. there's a certain set of expectations there that are nonexistent with a user created map posted on the workshop downloadable for free

the large map pack full of falklands maps are great, and as I said I don't mean to trash on them (i'm literally using them as we speak), but there's always improvements to be made, and a team of experienced modders working on a paid CDLC will inevitably beat it in terms of quality aswell.

i'm genuinely grateful for the Falklands map pack existing, but I think it is entirely fair to say that a paid team with (likely) more experience in map-making is generally more likely to produce a higher quality map

[coral ledge]

i find this really weird though? what do you mean by fantasy maps?
Weferlingen, as far as I'm aware, is pretty close to reality. SOG's Cam Lao Nam only quirk is the massive amount of points of interests in such a compact map (not that I personally have a problem with it)

I also don't recall Spearhead 1944 having any sort of "fantasy maps" by any means lol

I can maybe understand your point if you choose to talk about the 2035 armaverse maps (Tanoa comes to mind) but nonetheless, the discussion is about CDLCs so that feels irrelevant

[lunar socket]

Scaled down by 50%, but that's it.

[coral ledge]

not much of a fantasy map then

[crimson tiger]

A bad and pathetic joke.

[sinful cape]

"realistic" maps arent really fun in arma

huge swaths of nothing, or a full terrain with always the same stuff going on at every corner

[lunar socket]

Even Weferlingen?

[hallow parrot]

I do believe Weferlingen is done on purpose. Both accuracy and armored combat. But overall Arma, it sucks like really

More like realism in Arma does not automatically mean fun

[young geyser]

Completely agree! Realistic maps can get repetitive, Normandy (from the CDLC) is an example that comes to mind.

Instead, maps inspired by real locations but that add iconic, recognizable but unique locations are the ones that stand out the most

[grave osprey]

It’s not really political. A country invaded another country in 1982 against the wishes of the population. Pretty clear cut.

[feral river]

In Arma hilly terrains like Altis and Stratis are so much better than flat ones like Weferlingen

Weferlingen has really nice buildings and their interiors thou

[tepid lance]

Yeah, deliberate design decisions. All the other previous Arma maps never really allowed for great long distance tank operations. Weferlingen was made to allow for exactly that.

[crimson tiger]

A country re took the islands from invaders that occupy it since 1833. And the opinion of the occupation population is irrelevant, all the civilize world agree on that.

So yea, is not really political, a pirate country took by force what is not hers.. and they have the audacity of poiting the russians as the bad guys.

[knotty ore]

this is why I said no politics

[crimson tiger]

I didnt start it

[knotty ore]

maybe, just MAYBE. dont continue it

[pastel pendant]

doesnt matter who took what from who when and why, what matters is the flag waving on the territory, that's it

this is war

[crimson tiger]

I will defend my country, maybe tell them to stop

[knotty ore]

I told no politics

[pastel pendant]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jcehv7VBXs

[crimson tiger]

Yes, Hitler said the same

[knotty ore]

aaand there we go

time to cool off for a while then

[pastel pendant]

🤣

[crimson tiger]

Yea, cold of the argentine guy, let them flame mine country.

[pastel pendant]

wait, did you call me argentinean?? 😠😠😠😠😠😠😠😠😠😠😠😠😠😠

[knotty ore]

@pastel pendant also not helping

so dont

[pastel pendant]

sorry, just wanted to do the arma 3 reference

[grave osprey]

Your country lost. And would lose again. And again. The people of the Falklands voted 98% in favour of remaining a British Overseas Territory and that’s the end of it.

[zealous moat]

!ban @grave osprey 30d politics-flaming after being told not to 👋

[unkempt ridge]

*PewPewPew!!*
RIP @grave osprey
ando9231#0000 now has 5 infractions.

[zealous moat]

so, yeah
don't do that

back to the topic at hand! 😊

[steady ravine]

I will defend Nogova at all cost!
Nogova anthem starts

some old micronation and other arma nations are lacking national anthem

[rich mist]

Wait for the Nogova CDLC

[wind dagger]

has anyone ever seen an issue where someone buys the cdlc and its shown in steam and the launcher, but the folder in the directory is just missing?

searching online has yielded no result, repair and reinstall did not fix it 🤔

nvm, seems to be a steam problem 🤔

[knotty ore]

hear that happen sometimes

steam can get stuck with download and install

[wind dagger]

the person now says they can buy it on steam and steam doesnt think they own it, might be something else afoot here lol

thanks for the reply tho 😄

[olive vortex]

try restarting steam or whole pc

[knotty ore]

steam tech support is where one would seek help with that I think

[wind dagger]

yea, thanks nontheless

[pseudo finch]

Do you have, by any chance, new information about the status of this?

[red saddle]

Its enabled in the next dev-branch build.
But still not really been tested

[ebon sedge]

Yaay

[spring matrix]

im so happy yall i finally got GM AND prairie fire!

i thought i would only get one and after 7 months of checking the prices. i finally got both

[compact pecan]

someone should be interesting to reach me ? to reach multiplayer DLC CLSA iron curtain coop,, ''end game '' or other mission coop,, ?,,,, anytime with me,,,, feel less alone on mission '''end game ''''or ,,,,,clsa dlc,,,, or dont be shy with ad me . ,,,,i accept either youre suggestion .,,,,,,dlc ,,Global mobilisation either accepted .

[bright hull]

Check/post in #looking_for_game

[waxen lynx]

did some testing with this - havent followed the discussion much back then, so my assumptions how its ought to work may not be in line what was implemented

going by this comment primarily

How high is the chance to adjust the Arma 3 Launcher in the way if you use a CDLC on the server that, if it detects that either the DLC itself or the Compat Data is not installed, the Launcher installs and subscribes the Compat Data from the Workshop?

I believe that there are many, many people (including me) who wants to use the CDLC on their servers but due to that limitation, it's hardly possible as users have to manually install the Compat Data. And, sadly and honestly speaking, some users fail to do that.

first off my DLC/CDLC ownership

and non-owner mods subbed

one preface comment - why in hell 12 years in (less for A3L), does it have still this wrong DLC matching? 😦

this is wrong, misleading, confusion and unnecessary, aka a flawed design - the only thing to check with DLC would be:

does the current mission use APEX/Tanoa and then check if you own that DLC

advanced mod matching would be based on mission.sqm/addons[] for actual assets used (in regards to say Tanks DLC ownership required), yet the A3 system never went that far (aka if you need a DLC [or mod] for a mission - aside from terrain requirement])

so to CDLC matching now:

it can detect CDLC needed for the server (from the modfolder used I'd assume). however its not trying to load the CDLC - seems a bug?
[also the DLCs vs optional DLCs seems a flawed/faulty naming/distinction - might be naming only, and not technical, but would be still very misleading]

for CSLA it suggests two optional mods - not sure why these are optional? -serverMod?

for SPE it appears to "work" - aka it seems to work only if you have the compa mod, yet not for CDLC ownership?

however suggesting it as optional is wrong - bug?

as said havent followed how its supposed to work

CDLCs dont seem to require a mod.cpp (most have it, but not all) - technically bikey/bisign matching could be the most reliable but rather "low level" approach, yet i'd assume tho its rather modfolder name pair matching? (SPE to @Spearhead 1944 - Creator DLC Compatibility Data for Non-Owners)
on the client side this is probably good enough, yet for servers mods often get renamed (spaces, lowercase, shortening, etc) - there only mod.cpp/meta.cpp or bikey matching would be reliable i would think

TLDR: no idea how its supposed to work; seems to work to work only with compa mods, but not CDLCs itself, and not set as required mod but only as optional

---

wishlist: put the A3L source on github, so either people can submit patches with fixes/adjustments/refactoring, or make a "modded clone" as non official download

if the code is that horrible, maybe no one will touch it, but you never know

[waxen lynx]

@ebon sedge @pseudo finch @hallow parrot @sinful cape @rich mist
ref: #creator_dlc_discussion message (CDLC compa mod support in A3L)
do you mind testing with latest dev branch and report back your finds please 🙏

[pseudo finch]

Will do this night. Report back via DM or here?

[rich mist]

How do I even go about faking the lack of ownership?

Actually I do have one CDLC I don't own so nvm

[rich mist]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/554986444998049793/1389691974193250426/image.png?ex=68658b01&is=68643981&hm=d1b2bd0f3711f082dfdbdcc9e1f7c66b2ec42c54a69cba074894003ed3ff30bf&

When clicking more details on a server with CSLA

[waxen lynx]

here please

[rich mist]

Trying again works fine

prompts me to load the compat data which is good

If I own the CDLC it just does not prompt me for anything

Launching the game to join a server with CDLCs I own does not load them at all

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/554986444998049793/1389693513809264781/image.png?ex=68658c70&is=68643af0&hm=fa01c5ca3415451129885467b70bebbb82a3f6bf6f4a91db25c7e2618ceecebd&

[waxen lynx]

ok. same as for me. however i cant tell if this was different before as i havent used the A3L since ages 😄

[rich mist]

On main branch you don't get told to enable CDLCs if you own them

If you don't own them it shows you to buy them

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/554986444998049793/1389706012604502046/image.png?ex=68659814&is=68644694&hm=aff91278e5251329126c36909399c5c2ef866ec3d5e92c75be3b5bb8fb7e6e20&

[pseudo finch]

How should I join a server with latest dev branch anyway? Or am I missing some quirks 😄

[rich mist]

Just supposed to see what the launcher shows and does

No reason to actually join since it's just to test the Launcher update

[pseudo finch]

Well, I tried with my server account where I have absolutely no (C)DLCs. Launcher just tells me to buy them, no option to load Compat Data.

[rich mist]

does it say development on the arma 3 launcher?

[pseudo finch]

Yep

[waxen lynx]

@pseudo finch thanks. maybe it works only if you already have a compat mod? or do you have some subscribed already?

[ebon sedge]

Will do if I get around to it before going on work trip

[hallow parrot]

Latest as in 1.5.152859?

[pseudo finch]

Nope. Not subscribed. I just did it like a regular user would do. Because, that's how I asked it to be. The Launcher should detect if the DLC is installed or not. If installed, load DLC. If not, download Compat automatically.

[feral river]

You can also uninstall optional DLCs. Under DLC tab in game properties in Steam

Tested it on stable. Launcher just says not installed and can't load

[hallow parrot]

So, I uninstalled Reaction Forces CDLC (as in not Compat File)

• Even though being Dev-Branch means can't join actually, JOIN is only highlighted
• There is no join anyways button etc, which makes me impossible to join with just few clicks
• There is no direct link to install Compat File
• There is no direct instruction to install Compat File
• After I load Compat File in Mods tab, it still is JOIN, which means I can't join
• In DLC tab there is also no direct instruction to install Compat File under Reaction Forces, just INSTALL DLC which basically is ticking DLC in Steam, I am not sure what happens without owning CDLC as I own them all
  Launcher also crashed while I test

[waxen lynx]

@hallow parrot Thanks for testing!

Its enabled in the next dev-branch build.
But still not really been tested

I had tested with perf branch actually. It would be good to know if its really just on dev branch (2.21) or also on perf branch (2.20).
Or rather on what A3L version.

@pseudo finch @hallow parrot In regards to expectations how its meant to work (in the details) - did Dedmen mention it anywhere?

[hallow parrot]

What I know is "Next Dev should at least work some to make it less janky" or something. It was on hold for a while due to localization not being ready

#creator_dlc_discussion message
#creator_dlc_discussion message

[pseudo finch]

Nope, nothing mentioned. Except what POLPOX wrote above me.

[waxen lynx]

Ok. These posts i saw - but there was also a discussion before that, wasnt it?
As said i have followed it in detail, so i cant say.

I guess lets wait till Dedmen finds some time to both clarify what branch(es) its available, and what is to be different now.

[hallow parrot]

What exactly do you mean by now? We had no Dev-Branch update for a while

[waxen lynx]

Overall mod matching is quite complex. In EMM we tried to cover all cases (but we didnt get to mod sync - aka only showing mismatch but not initiate the download [via A3L]).
Can't tell how simplified/sophisticated the system for mod matching is implemented in the A3L.

[waxen lynx]

Now in - dev branch is supposed to be different to stable branch at least, right?

[pseudo finch]

I'm getting a bit confused here when you mention A3L. Do you mean the Arma 3 Launcher or the external tool which is commonly referred to A3L?

[carmine cove]

different as in older, yes
that message about "next dev branch" was june 4th, last dev was 29th of may

[waxen lynx]

I mean Arma 3 launcher - community tools arent relevant here (i only mentioned EMM as reference/our experience dealing with the challenges).

@carmine cove so we need a new dev branch build 🙏 (or better yet for ease of testing also be made available in perf branch)

[carmine cove]

well it is wednesday

[waxen lynx]

no idea whats the current schedule with dev branch - isnt it just whenever its to be done for a specific reason, or is there still some regular schedule?

[carmine cove]

The "goal" is every wednesday when there isn't something with higher prio (or the dev builds are broken, or there is no notable changes, etc, etc)
We just had the 2.20 update + hotfix so thats obv higher priority

[rich mist]

Clicking more details doesn't ask you about installing compat?

[hallow parrot]

It doesn't. Clicking Reaction Forces there leads to https://store.steampowered.com/dlc/107410/ instead (not even the direct link to RF!)

[carmine cove]

Well yeah its slightly hardcoded (even for non cdlc)

[pseudo finch]

So, I tested it again with latest dev.

1. I can't join a server with CDLC running, join is shown as JOIN
2. When clicking on "More details..." in "Optional DLCs:" the Launcher is throwing an error. A file was generated on my Desktop.
3. Clicking on "More details..." in "Mods:" it wants subscribe the Compat Data, but not able as I can't join the server to set up mods
4. Trying step 2) again works now, same result as 3)
5. Downloading Compat is not possible, as join is not possible to click

Would post images, but not possible. Guess no rights 😄

[red saddle]

You click on server, say load mods (don't remember how) and it offers you to load the compat data instead, if you do not own the CDLC.
You are testing while owning all the CDLCs? So that wouldn't work

[red saddle]

Why would you want to install the compat file if you OWN the DLC, that doesn't make sense.
If you own the DLC, you should download the DLC itself, not the compat data.

[red saddle]

Its a launcher change, perf branch does not have launcher changes, only the game exe's

It should be available now in yesterdays dev branch, but it was forgotten in changelog

Mh it should also have ben in earlier, it was done early april

The main thing about the feature is, that you can only test it when you do NOT own the DLC.
Messing with compat data while you actually own the DLC to get the data directly is nonsense

[hallow parrot]

Your point is true but we think our point is still true, despite we tried with actual CDLC access

Our point is just "it is not fluid to access CDLC (compat) without prior knowledge"

[feral river]

Wouldn't it make sense to use compat data over DLC itself to save up on disk space? Let's say I just want weapons and I don't need terrain nor missions?

[hallow parrot]

use compat data over DLC itself to save up on disk space
and
I just want weapons and I don't need terrain nor missions
are unrelated

[red saddle]

the compat data is the exact same data as the DLC itself. Saving disk space makes no sense

[feral river]

Ok, nevermind. I thought it's kinda like Apex where non owners have smaller installation

[hallow parrot]

No...?

[steady ravine]

still better than A2 DLC system-ish tho

[carmine cove]

But Apex is also not like that
all DLC's besides CDLC and Contact are always installed

[hallow parrot]

Contact (contact) is not, Contact (Platform) (enoch) is

[feral river]

Do compat data exist just because Steam wouldn't allow non-owners to install DLCs?

[rich mist]

compat data exists because people don't want to install content they can't use

Game had a bunch of storage and DLC complaints show up even when we just got into Post-Apex territory

[feral river]

That's answer to question: "Why are DLCs optional?"

[sinful cape]

yes, steam only allows to download dlc that you own

without this limitation, compat data wouldn't be necessary

[red saddle]

yes

[pseudo finch]

It would be easier, if possible, to let users join the server instead of greying it out and at this point the Launcher should check if CDLC installed or not. If yes, load CDLC. If not, check if owned (if yes install), if not sub to Compat. Currently you can't do anything qs mentioned in my post earlier (tested with an actual account without any DLC)

[olive vortex]

With a different setup too, but too late for that. The DLC data could be the optional ones you can "buy" for free like some games do with 4k texture packs and the license to use them could be a separate paid product.

But it's possible there were some issues with that approach I'm not aware of.

[waxen lynx]

We had actually asked for that, and it was considered - one challenge seems to be that this requires unique "steam ids" (cant recall the correct term) and Valve doesnt hand them out easily/only in small quanitities at a time

[waxen lynx]

With "greying it out" - do you mean the X due to game version mismatch (2.20 vs 2.21), or something else? [was a screenshot posted of this]

[pseudo finch]

Oh.. actually, maybe that's why join is not possible. I completely ignored that tbh

[pseudo finch]

I've set up a server with dev branch to rule out the mismatch of version. The join button is still unavailable (it's blocked with a cross, like when you want to join a server without owning DLC). Clicking "More details..." on DLC option throws out errors and created a text file on the Desktop (for me 3 times in a row). Also, for whatever reason I don't know, in the mod set up list, SOG Compat is shown three times and all the "32-bit only" version (maybe because the Launcher is 32-bit? Platform is set to Default (64-bit)). I've sent kju some screenshots and the crash file.

[waxen lynx]

@pseudo finch cant do anything with crash logs. Dedmen will need those 🙂

[final mulch]

Hi, Is it possible to re-upload part of a "non-owners compatibility pack of cdlc" to the workshop? So that all players don't have to download the entire 5gb package, which we don't actually use at all, but only use, for example, sound/post-process effects. which is approximately 100 MB max.

[knotty ore]

no

[lunar socket]

Why?

[final mulch]

I wanted to reduce the storage load for our community so that they wouldn't have to download 5GB when at best 100MB of the entire DLC would be used. Unfortunately, I own most of the DLC, but most of my community has almost none except for Apex. Because our modpack already exceeds 110 GB+. but this is OT..

[lunar socket]

I meant why isn't it allowed. You REALLY should work on reducing it.

[steady ravine]

arma 3 dlc and cdlc are rather cheap during sale

[final mulch]

Yes, they are... 😄 But people are people...

If someone does not have cdlc/compatibility mod enabled, will they see the post process that is from cdlc? when someone turns it on, for example from Zeus, who owns the DLC

[lunar socket]

It might just be a config thing you can make yourself to be similar.

[knotty ore]

Whats 5 in 110+

drop in ocean

[final mulch]

😄 Some members have 1-2 GB of free disk space, otherwise we would reach the 140 GB limit (which is the maximum server space...).

[red saddle]

at this point the Launcher should check if CDLC installed or not. If yes, load CDLC. If not, check if owned (if yes install), if not sub to Compat.
That is what we're doing. Or whats intended

[red saddle]

"why" - Copyright and Workshop agreement.

[pseudo finch]

This wasn't really working when kju asked me to test. Launcher always threw errors (I've sent you what I got a while ago)

[red saddle]

Ah still left on unread. Maybe next month (The one after the one that starts next weekend)

[tepid lance]

2035 😎

[umbral lintel]

Give my boy BigChungus his own CDLC for r forget he makes better guns than vanilla

[fossil gazelle]

Since when does Reforger have a CDLC program? not, and everyone with a good pitch can apply for the Arma 3 CDLC program https://arma3.com/dlc/creator#FAQ but so far as what i have heard many tried and only 7 got really to the stage of becoming a Arma 3 CDLC.

[teal kindle]

BI can't honestly still be taking CDLC pitches with Arma 4 coming in 2027.

I would think if we don't see an announcement for a new CDLC in the next few months, that there likely won't be any more new ones. I'm holding out hope that we'll get one more new one before the program ends for Arma 3.

[steady ravine]

CDLC is a great way to keep end of life Arma 3 alive after A4 released

giving it to the community (hopefully also samples)

[rich mist]

no samples, never

[ashen geyser]

There'll be at least 1 more

[lunar rivet]

Do we have an idea of what it could be yet?

[sweet edge]

Banana CDLC

can't say anything more, though, the NDA...

[steady ravine]

so ACE then?

[sweet edge]

🤫

[steady ravine]

gimme NDA

NDA only expires once the thing out right?
nvm can't say due to NDA

[ashen geyser]

Ask Rotators

[lunar rivet]

Hmmm.... noted

[teal kindle]

So another little CDLC with a few guns, and a vehicle. I was hoping for something a little more significant, but I guess at this point we can't really expect much more. Hopefully it will be cool, I do like their other CDLCs.

[lunar socket]

(From Lexx in reference to the unannounced project)
I swear all you're capable of is complaining and finding new ridiculous things to complain about.

[teal kindle]

Strange take as I said I hope the next cdlc is cool, and that I like Rotators' other projects.

Please don't hijack this discord to make personal attack against other users. If you don't like what I have to say, feel free to ignore, or block me, thanks.

[hollow garden]

World War One CDLC would be a fire last major CDLC for Arma 3

[teal kindle]

I wouldn't mind something like that, but it's hard to do proper trenches in A3.

[hollow garden]

Yea i saw that there was a team that attempted it but didn’t make it pass the last hurdles

Having WW1 uniforms, weapons, vehicles in CDLC quality tho would’ve been fire also would, in a way fit in with Spear Head 1944

[lunar socket]

Wait, were you really not complaining?

[random crane]

afaik it never got past the initial stages, Sokolonko was the one working on it, he shared some screenshots in the past

[hollow garden]

Oh yea it was the initial stages, It sucked when I heard about the news

[waxen lynx]

@hearty arrow might be relevant for you

@rotund echo can you provide the server names you tried?

[hearty arrow]

hello, which official CDLC server (need IP:port) is it all or some of them ?

hmm, that would indicate it might be some specific server ... if it keeps happening please let me know exactly which one fails, ty

[stable lintel]

Can anyone at BIS give me a tip? I want to know CDLC map ownership numbers, for deciding which will allow largest player base on server.

[feral river]

Take a look at number of user reviews on Steam

[rich mist]

looking at the number of user reviews and then assuming it's like 20% of the amount of people who actually bought the DLC is a good way to gauge it

Alternatively just put up a survey for your playerbase

Much easier and way more accurate

[stable lintel]

If it was 20% then only 5k bought any of them.

[rich mist]

yeah

[lunar socket]

But there are 28k subscribers to S.O.G. NS which requires S.O.G. PF.

[rich mist]

You'd be surprised at stuff people will download or subscribe to and try to use without knowing whether or not the mod actually works in arma, I've seen some pretty dreadful modlists.

But I do agree that it's a pretty bad approximation

[final mulch]

Thousands of people have mods that they can't even use because they don't have the DLC content that the mods require... (but this is because some mods don't actually need the DLC content, but on paper they require it... or only part of the mod's content is dependent on it).

[rich mist]

The most common thing I've seen people mess up with modlists is using both RHS and CUP Weapons/Units/Vehicles at the same time

[sinful cape]

it's pretty terrible way, tbh 😄 for example ws and rf have extremely low review turnouts.

[steady ravine]

yet gained 50 Armallion players til today

[faint parrot]

Should I get the Wester Sahara DLC ?

I can't decide

[final mulch]

yep

[faint parrot]

aight

[sweet edge]

Get all of them if you can afford it

[mild rain]

Expeditionary Forces, Reaction Forces and Western Sahara fit very well as an addition into Arma 3 2035 timeline.

If you think about Western Sahara, get Reaction Forces too

[faint parrot]

Alright man

[faint parrot]

Thanks

They giving discounts so am just choosing what to get or no

I got expeditionary forces

I'll get reaction forces and Western Sahara then

[mild rain]

If you like the 2035 theater get all of them

[faint parrot]

Maybe in Dec
Christmas time

[faint parrot]

Alright man

Thanks

[sweet edge]

there might be a Halloween sale too.

[faint parrot]

I literally got arma last Christmas lol

[faint parrot]

Oh fr ? Better

[nimble lagoon]

Is the SOGPF team here? I have a problem with the cDLC. I cannot join any servers with the cDLC and getting a not valid signed key error. I have validated the game a few times already and are the latest build from Dec 10th 2024 1.31.

I checked the keys folder and the bikey is physically there. It was working 2 weeks ago and now servers cannot validate it.

[knotty ore]

Try delete the file and then verify game files. Sometimes files can get corrupt with no immediately apparent reason

[nimble lagoon]

I deleted both the VN and KEYS folder, so Steam can redownload the SOFPF cDLC, but still getting the same error:

"mulitple xxx.ebo are not signed by a key accepted by this server. To play on this server, removed listed files or install additional accepted keys."

This occurs even on the official SOGPF server. I can connect to non SOGPF servers, including the ones that use other cDLC.

SP works fine and I am at wits end on why this is happening with no mods loaded for MP.

Would being on the profile branch have anything to do with this?

[knotty ore]

it is possible yes

[nimble lagoon]

I will revert back to production branch and test again.

[nimble lagoon]

It was the profile branch updates! Reverting back to non-beta resolved it! Reporting this to the performance branch team. Thank you!

[carmine cove]

Would it be possible to test profiling again at some point? the last ~10 prof builds have had an issue we didnt notice V34 has that fixed

[red saddle]

Start game with -checkSignaturesFull parameter, and turn off noLogs if you have that.
Try to join server, fail at it, then send me RPT of that run

[nimble lagoon]

I've always been OPT INTO the profile branch up until yesterday. The SOGPF cDLC was last updated ~ December 10th, 2024 and I noticed it recently. I can test profile again now if it has been updated since yesterday.

[nimble lagoon]

ALL without any mods:

OPT IN to PROFILE, connect to official SOGPF server with -checkSignaturesFull enabled: https://pastebin.com/BmP68Ppk

OPT IN to PROFILE, connect to ESCAPE SOGPF server with -checkSignaturesFull enabled:
https://pastebin.com/wViJh5iB

OPT IN to STABLE, connect to official SOGPF server with -checkSignaturesFull enabled and hangs on loading:
https://pastebin.com/iEcKPZPG

OPT IN to STABLE, connect to official SOGPF server withOUT -checkSignaturesFull and can log in successfully:
https://pastebin.com/RNMxrBA3

Note I can join most others servers with PROFILE and same settings without this login issue.

Let me know if you need anymore testing.

[red saddle]

-noborder parameter doesn't exist
-w and -h don't either.
There is
-x=3840 -y=1080 to set width and height.

16:58:49 Signature tests for F:_Steam\steamapps\common\Arma 3\VN\addons\3den_f_vietnam.ebo PASSED!

16:48:43 Proper signatures not found for F:_Steam\steamapps\common\Arma 3\VN\addons\3den_f_vietnam.ebo. Test FAILED!
There is the problem. On profiling, it doesn't find the signatures.
As if the bisign files didn't exist.

Stable is weird that it hangs.. Probably some bug we fixed by accident.

Now gotta find out if I can reproduce or find out why it does that..

[nimble lagoon]

Thanks for the parameters update. I copied those from Half Life 2. Can we add a no borders windowed option to NOT burn a white bar on my OLED display?

[red saddle]

Probably yes, I'll take a look tomorrow

What do you need it for? Why not just Fullscreen?

[rich mist]

there is one in the settings...?

[nimble lagoon]

I have a 1060 GTX so not enough power to full screen on 4K. I use a window to have 1:1 pixels to the screen plus I get a wider FOV. TY for considering this.

[feral river]

Render resolution of 3D can be lowered if I remember correctly

[red saddle]

No there isn't

[red saddle]

But makes everything look like blurry mush.

[rich mist]

Well rather in the in-game video settings you can change Arma into Borderless Windowed.

[red saddle]

"Fullscreen Window" is not "Borderless Windowed"

[rich mist]

Isn't it mechanically the same?

[red saddle]

Yes, fullscreen window is also borderless window (Because you cannot see the border), but forced to fullscreen

[rich mist]

I've yet to see a borderless function that isn't fullscreen frankly

[red saddle]

Have you ever used Discord on desktop?
Or have you ever seen the Arma 3 splash screen?
Or have you ever opened the Steam client on windows?

[rich mist]

I mean I wouldn't exactly call them borderless unless you equate "borderless" as to "not having any standard OS provided program borders"

[red saddle]

That is exactly what borderless means

[rich mist]

I only ever took it for the literal meaning of the word, I guess when you put it that way it makes sense

[red saddle]

@nimble lagoon
-noWindowBorder start parameter in next #perf_prof_branch
Still working on the signatures thing, but should be fixed in next prof too.

[feral river]

Interesting definition of bordeless. I always thought window means game runs in window with borders, full screen means full screen and Windows(OS) is not rendered, borderless means no borders, can be both full screen and not full screen and Windows(OS) is rendered

[red saddle]

There is borderless and bordered.
Fullscreen and not fullscreen (windowed).

You can also make a bordered window fullscreen, such that the borders are outside of the screen.
So the window is at Y coordinate like -20.
You don't see the borders, but they are still there, off-screen. And the window in total, is larger than your whole screen resolution.
And if you move the window you will see them, and then struggle because you cannot move the window back because your mouse cursor cannot go outside of the screen area

[vestal bear]

y'all

they should totally make a War of the Worlds DLC

Tripods

[hallow parrot]

ok

[nimble lagoon]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=386095175&searchtext=uncom

[vestal bear]

i meant something like this

https://tenor.com/view/war-of-the-worlds-gif-6494849701918915519

[nimble lagoon]

This exists in Garry's Mod Steamworkshop so maybe ask someone to port it, if legal?

[knotty ore]

not legal

[vestal bear]

how come?

[vestal bear]

and btw

the script in Gmod is LUA, but in ARMA 3 it is SQF

[knotty ore]

someone either owns the content or its ripped from somewhere.

its not "free for all"

[rich mist]

Only reason it exists on Gmod's workshop is because Gmod's devs cannot be bothered to moderate and filter through all the content

Which is too much effort considering the workshop's size

I imagine this is one of the reasons S&Box(Gmod's successor) uses its own system for mods and assets

[nimble lagoon]

You might be able to code up a config to use the UN-COM Tripods but apply the WotW Tripod death ray effects and maybe sounds. Visually, it would not look the best, but you get the effects.

Also, this guy made a bunch of WotW 3D models including those cool 1898 versions. You can probably cobble something up and just use the UN-COM effects with these models:

https://sketchfab.com/Cool_Horror_Models

[knotty ore]

In any case,this is veering way offtopic now.

[stray osprey]

Is there a specific CSLA feedback/discussion channel or separate discord?

[lunar socket]

The Discord is listed in #channel_invites_list message. The channel here is #csla_iron_curtain.

[stray osprey]

Thanks. I didn't see it earlier.

[silk dirge]

from today year 2025 in review

"there are entirely new Creator DLCs in the works."

[teal kindle]

There's been a rumor for a while now that Rotators has been working on a new cDLC. I would expect to hear something in the next 3-6 months about the new project.

[faint mortar]

https://tenor.com/view/sticker-yung-joc-crying-meme-man-crying-meme-thebeyonderrrr-gif-828328460466032722

[silk dirge]

Russian Army 2035? would be the cherry on top

[teal kindle]

If it's Rotators, it would likely be a very small cDLC, as they just finished their last cDLC about a year ago, and wouldn't have time for a large scale project.

Arma 4 is (supposed) to release in 2027, that doesn't leave much time for sales for any future Arma 3 cDLCs, so I would expect to hear news on the new project soon-ish.

[lunar socket]

I wouldn't be so sure.
IIRC, RF was made to get funding or something a new project (I can't find where so I'm not sure), which would mean that it has been planned or worked on for a while. Also, Rotators' "unannounced project" says "we always strive towards new horizons."

[teal kindle]

I would love to see another cDLC, large, or small scale, it doesn't really matter to me.

With that said, I just don't see a large scale cDLC at this point, but I'd be happy to be wrong.

[lunar rivet]

I remember BI saying somewhere that they were fine supporting CDLCs for Arma 3 for many years to come even after Arma 4 is released. That statement was made within the last year.

It would work continuing to support CDLCs for Arma 3 after Arma 4 comes out. They'd just need to maintain the skeleton crew they currently have.

[teal kindle]

The average player count for Arma 3 has been steadily dropping for years, and is at the lowest it's been in the last 12 years. The player numbers are likely to plummet once Arma 4 comes out, I just don't see anyone releasing a cDLC for A3 once A4 comes out.

[nimble lagoon]

If someone makes great content for ARMA 3, people will buy it.

[sinful cape]

and yet player numbers are still pretty good, and they sold around 2 million copies of a3 stuff in 2025. numbers are fine.

[silk dirge]

there are so much stuffs in Arma 3 that Bi already can do, with minimal effort, to sell the game for years and and CDLC creators as well, Arma 4 in 2027 (31/12?) is still a dream

[pastel pendant]

Arma 3 will be different enough from 4 that there will still be people who prefer it

[silk dirge]

I prefer Reforger for the animations lights etc... but in Arma 3 I have all contents, to me for, at least, 5 years there is a market for cdlc

[faint mortar]

I think there will still be a lot of people on Arma 3 for a few more years at least, even if A4 releases.

Think about it, there's gonna a number of reasons why someone might not jump to Arma 4 straightaway. For me, I imagine A4 won't have as much content on release as Arma 3 had in its first couple years, and it will take me a while to upgrade to get my hands on A4. I also love the 2035 setting, so I might not enjoy A4 as much if it's not building on that.

Though, with Reforger, it's more likely that Arma 4 is going to be content-rich and much more accessible on release lol. It's good hope for the future.

I'm excited and keeping my eye on A4, but I'm absolutely all for more Arma 3 content. It still has a few years of life in it.

[teal kindle]

I agree, based on the direction the Arma series is moving in with reforger, A3, and A4 are likely to be quite a bit different.

With that said, barring a catastrophic release for A4 like reforger had, I would think most of the players will move over to A4 within 3-6 months.

The Arma series will be very disjointed once A4 comes out, with the community spread across three games. I expect BI to do what they can to move the player base over to A4 as soon as they can. One of the obvious steps to achieve that, is to stop all development on reforger, and A3.

[lunar rivet]

Reforger is mostly a test bed for the game engine they want to use for Arma 4. The moment A4 comes out most if not all dev support for it would be pulled.

Like I said in my OG post, A3 will get the bare minimum support from their devs to make sure CDLC projects operate smoothly. Similar to how things are working now for A3. Main branch A3 only really got updates to fix issues and support CDLC updates and releases.

That performance update was a God send. I'm still running a upper mid-tier PC from 2018-19. 😅
The new PC build later this year is going to kill me. 😭

At the end of the day BI can generate profit with little input on their end. I'm happy with the CDLCs we've gotten so far and I'm looking forward to more later down the road.

[random crane]

the community was split even with a2+a3

some communities waited 2yrs before moving on

[lunar rivet]

I remember those days. I got A3 at launch but found it to be super buggy; so I stuck with A2 for 8-14 months and then switched to exclusively playing A3.

[fossil gazelle]

Well it was early acces for a reason 😅 but yea same for my community back than, took a lot of time before our dedicated players moved from Arma 2 over to Arma 3, and i believe some of them took 2 years to make a full move over as at that point the Arma 2 server/mission nights were lacking the amount of players to keep it going.

[nimble lagoon]

I remember Arma 3 Alpha and AllInARMA mod... So I hope .Kyu and BI will have something like that for ARMA 4 Alpha... or is that Reforger? LOL... I need my DLC and cDLC to be ported eventually or at least accessible from with ARMA 4.

[lunar socket]

The Global Mobilization guys tested putting one of their models in Reforger and I believe Chair of Expeditionary Forces is now or already has moved on to Enfusion, so I'm quite optimistic about what we'll have for A4.

[teal kindle]

A2, and A3 shared the same engine, that's not the case for A3, and A4, so don't expect to see the current cDLCs in A4. Yes, some of the cDLC teams could create projects in A4 at some point in the future, but these would essentially be all new projects.

[random crane]

not yet

with a2>a3 some stuff worked almost with drag and drop at first, enfusion is a completely new engine that works completely differently from RV4 and models can't be recycled easily, even if that was something i wanted to do

[feral river]

With the amount of A3 mods we have now. Tool which would make proccess of converting models from A3 to AR easier, would save a lot of time.

[knotty ore]

nobody but the mod author could not do such conversion anyway

but its not really possible to automate fully anyway

[random crane]

the way assets work is fundamentally different, even the textures would have to be remade in most cases

[nimble lagoon]

When Arma 4 Alpha comes out, give us a cDLC supporter edition (premium price) but at a portion of the total cDLc release, so we can used the asset legally. It would be missing the missions and campaigns due to SQF code compatibility but we can ARMA on our favorite terrains and use the gear. Same for the DLC. I need my Vipers in ARMA 4.

[steady ravine]

CLDC assets ownership are shared between BI and respective CDLC Dev, giving it away for public is quite a spite to the face of the CDLC Dev

[knotty ore]

Not possible

Unless you are mistaking CDLC with normal vanilla DLC

[nimble lagoon]

I'm not asking to "give" it away. I am asking to "allow" owners of DLC/cDLC to be able to access the content, not the missions, in ARMA 4 Alpha for a price, like a paid for AllinArma4 on top of ARMA 4 Alpha. The revenue can be split to cDLC teams based on how many existing ARMA 3 cDLC owners opt in.

Something like an ARMA 3 to ARMA 4 upgrade pass.

[knotty ore]

The vanilla Arma3 data has a public release data pack in the works. Just no eta when it releases.

CDLC data is not possible to release like that though.

[red saddle]

Upgrading assets is a lot of work.
You wouldn't have the money to pay for it.

It's not like you can just load a Arma 3 mod in Arma 4 and get all besides the scripts.

[steady ravine]

SQF can be used in Enfusion?

[red saddle]

What kinda question is that. Re-read what I said.

[steady ravine]

hmm my mistake

[nimble lagoon]

Looking at impact of CUP and other mods over and beyond the life of ARMA 3 proves there is a market for it, even with cDLC to help all the modders monetize their efforts.

I think a future "veterans" DLC for ARMA owners (any version) offered against potential ARMA 4 buyers would create something to enable it. Even if 10 USD/Euros, and it receives 100K buy ins, that is 1M budget just for it.

Even DayZ had enough buy in to warrant its own game.

Or when ARMA 4 Alpha is near release, the modding tools like Reforger Workbench should be released ASAP, bugs and all, so the community can start playing with it, using their own content until ARMA 3 assets can be released.

Maybe one of the mods would be an SQF middleware to allow playing native Operation Flashpoint, mission script and modules, in ARMA 4 one day!

We can vote in what would be port forwarded but I think ARMA 3 2035 lore should be made available, when ARMA 4 users hit a critical milestone - 100K online average for example.

[hallow parrot]

It's not the same situation A2 to A3. A3 to AR/A4 is totally different situatuion. It requires more effort to establish the workflow. Ded literally said so

Nobody talks about the impact of that project you claim. Sure it will do have impact to the community. But no that's not how it works. So won't happen, at least easily.

[nimble lagoon]

You mean the impact of CUP? Maybe it is something to look into in terms of marketing. Hard to measure it because there is no mechanism, such as a buy in, but you can see the usage and installation on Steam Workshop as a market share and mindshare indicator.

Something similar to measure might be Unsung installation and usage vs SOGPF ownership or conversion.

[hallow parrot]

...You really shouldn't read what I didn't wrote and expand your own theory

[random crane]

CUP has been in development for 12 years and had dozens of developers behind it ober the years, i don't think you understand the kind of effort involved nor the kind of money involved to develop something comparable if it were commercial

It's like an old car, you can do the best maintenance in the world but at some point when it has 300k km and is rusting and falling apart it's just time to replace it with a new one

[hallow parrot]

AiA was anyways a golden tribute to A3 Alpha days which is actually limited to do anything. But it was possible to do in weeks or months because on the same engine

[random crane]

On top of that, dlcs or mods don't exist in a vacuum, they need all the data from the base game so porting a dlc would mean in most cases porting forward everything else, so you can imagine how big of a job it becomes

[random crane]

Yea exactly and even then the vehicles were really broken because of the new physx engine

[hallow parrot]

I still remember the hype of AiA Terrain trailer. Sometimes I even stare and adore it

[nimble lagoon]

Appreciate the effort of the CUP team and acknowledge the enormous task to get to this point, and my comment was ARMA 3 base game assets and official DLC such as Apex. I believe Contact is cDLC/DLC hybrid and Dedmen clarified about cDLC assets.

[hallow parrot]

In this context there is no difference on DLC/CDLC/Mod. Like at all. At all

This is not about IP or rights. This is about technical and resources limitation. Not about the expected impact or such

[nimble lagoon]

Horrible Goat mentioned A3 base assets under consideration and DLC/cDLC ownership belongs to creators teams so might not be available. That was what I was referring to so if BIS offers a paid for AIA3 to ARMA4, it would be on the base assets or whatever they own.

Again ,noted on the time and costs of such project, already mentioned.

[hallow parrot]

Dedmen did not said ownership anything in this channel lately.

[nimble lagoon]

Mybad, it was horrible goat.

[hallow parrot]

You say:

I am asking to "allow" owners of DLC/cDLC to be able to access the content
HG says:
CDLC data is not possible to release like that though.
You say:
Something like an ARMA 3 to ARMA 4 upgrade pass
Dedmen says:
It's not like you can just load a Arma 3 mod in Arma 4 and get all besides the scripts.

[nimble lagoon]

Correct. HG advised that ARMa 3 assets might be made available and cDLC cannot. Noted on this point.

The comment about upgrade pass would be a paid DLC from ARMA 3 to ARMA 4, from BIS or DLC creators. There is no contradiction to what can be made available. This refers to us ARMA 3 owners may pay for an upgrade.

IF the creators want to, they can poll the user base to see if it would be viable. Hence the followup comment about comparing CUP usage, and Unsung to SOGPF as an example.

[hallow parrot]

Dedmen said no

[nimble lagoon]

Understood A4 unable to load A3 content and it will take a ton of work. Hence the possibility for us users to pay for it. It is OK that it is not a priority or thought from BIS or the creators.

All good. I will look at the assets if when release and wait to see what ARMA 4 offers. Thanks for the discussion.

[steady ravine]

what's the end point of these?

[red saddle]

I can see the possibility of a DLC that forward ports some Arma 3 assets.
Simplest would be buildings and terrains, maybe props. Livonia, Altis, Stratis, Malden forward ported, would be doable, probably like 15€ DLC. There might be licensing issues with terrain data for Altis/Stratis.
Weapons are harder but viable.
Vehicles are basically unviable.
Scripts, no chance.
Campaigns, don't even think about it.

But, the Arma 3 licensed data pack is planned anyway. Which would give people permission to forward port the terrains, assets, props to Arma 4, for free (Just like it was done with Arma 2 assets, see AiA/CUP). So... that makes the proposition of a paid DLC kinda nonsense.

[steady ravine]

what is the priority of it (a3 ldp) anyway? since we are nearing the release year of Arma 4 2027

[red saddle]

beepy boopy

[steady ravine]

ah sure boopity bop

[rich mist]

I mean we still don't have samples for Arma 3 still nor permission to modify vanilla content so I doubt we'd be seeing the A3 LDP until like a year after Arma 4 releases imo

[knotty ore]

Given how much work it would be to put those assets into an official A3toA4 DLC you would not see the DLC any time sooner either.

[red saddle]

Arma 4*
And the A3 LDP was already planned to go out by now, but IT issues delayed it, then other issues delayed it further.

[ionic pivot]

God I wish the 2035 cdlcs were added to the base game. I'd love to be able to use some of those vehicles/weapons in Warlords/Koth/I&A

[sweet edge]

no chance

[dull mauve]

Is there another CDLC coming before A4?

[lunar socket]

https://arma3.com/news/year-in-arma-3-2025

In 2026, we're still working hard on supporting Arma 3 live ops in its 13th year! We will continue our maintenance and support of the game as we have in previous years. We are closely collaborating with Creator DLC studios to update their existing projects, and there are entirely new Creator DLCs in the works.

[dull mauve]

Oh goody

[ebon sedge]

I remember hearing years ago that the a3 ldp is just about ready to release lol

[quaint gale]

Wonder when the new CDLC will be announced

Hopfully somthing CSAT related

[hallow parrot]

When it's done. Rumors and some reports say they are preparing for more CDLCs in 2026, but nothing more is unveiled yet

[oblique sonnet]

Which one is the best for singleplayer campaings/scenarios?

Arma 3 Creator DLC: Western Sahara DLC
Arma 3 Creator DLC: S.O.G. Prairie Fire DLC
Arma 3 Creator DLC: Global Mobilization - Cold War Germany DLC
Arma 3 Creator DLC: Expeditionary Forces DLC
Arma 3 Creator DLC: Reaction Forces DLC
Arma 3 Creator DLC: Spearhead 1944 DLC
Arma 3 Creator DLC: CSLA Iron Curtain DLC

[rich mist]

Well the only ones with singleplayer-specific campaigns here is Glob Mob and Expeditionary Forces

[dark steeple]

Whats not singleplayer specific for WS Extraction? (Asking for a friend)

[rich mist]

What do you mean? You're looking for open world like extraction or?

[feral river]

It can be played in SP

[rich mist]

If that's the question then yes it can be played singleplayer

[steady ravine]

technically SPE's coop campaign can be played alone with multiple replayability due to how many playable units in one mission

[oblique sonnet]

What is SPE?

[steady ravine]

Spearhead 1944

[teal kindle]

CSLA Iron Curtain has a single player campaign as well. Also, the SOGPF camapign missions can be played in SP with the SOGAI mod.

[frigid edge]

In fact ExpForces has a short SP campaign and ReactionForces a couple of SP scenarios.

The Spearhead campaign didn't feel at all convincing to me in SP but there are some great SP scenarios on the workshop

Same for (some of) SOGPF. One example - both of those are supported by the classic Forgotten Few 2 (which can be run as a campaign).

[nimble lagoon]

Man, I love CSLA... underrated due to the wonky gun sounds but there are mods to resolve it.

[waxen lynx]

Spearhead campaign didn't feel at all convincing to me in SP

[coral shore]

Across The Fence (which is in open beta) is really well done if you haven't check it out yet, it's from SGD

[red saddle]

Injecting 2035 is not recommended. For more information ask your doctor or pharmacist.

[hallow parrot]

But can we inject 2035 into my veins?

[scenic hemlock]

You already have a high tolerance for it, so you'll probably be fine.

[urban coral]

Hei can somebody help me please :

**The goal - **when i join in server i want to load my favorite CDLC (Reaction Forces) and join with it in the server as client ( with one click in the luncher )
The proublem - when i start the luncher and load it in CDLC section and come back to server list and join 100% everytime my CDLC is unloadet ( so far my only way to get in any server with my CDLC is to load it and join the servers not tru the luncher but from the browser in the game itself )
Maybe this is impossible, but I really have to try to find a solution 🤞

[rich mist]

If you're joining through the launcher it will always load the CDLCs the server has enabled only

[random crane]

most public servers don't have CDLCs loaded

[jovial temple]

is CDLC supported on linux yet?

[red saddle]

Have been since release as far as I know

[random crane]

wasn't linux behind a few months usually?

[feral river]

Native Linux version hasn't been updated in very long time. These days we just play Windows version though Proton

[jovial temple]

Ighty

[plush quest]

Linux game client is indeed only via Proton now (i.e. in sync with Windows).
Mac is the client port that's usually behind (currently in sync).
But CDLC doesn't care about client platform unless it requires something in the engine platform update (f.e. a new script command).
So when a CDLC releases a normal data update, all platforms should work by default.

[random crane]

i understand, thanks

[west jungle]

Hey how much of the "pass" profits go to cdlc creators?

Let me guess - nothing?

Just wondering

[pastel pendant]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/571686143117230110/1227143978688708668/ezgif.com-optimize.gif

[young geyser]

Well, at least the extra 💸 can help the devs work on the game a while longer which ends up helping creators who can get more tickets taken care of 😉

Additionally, many subscribers might end up getting some of the CDLCs after their subscriptions is done (Subscription ends up being like a paid demo for some)

Don't get me wrong, I hate subscriptions models but for an old game like Arma 3 it might work out in its favor as an invitation for players to try everything there is on offer before buying

I hope they don't even think about something similar for Arma 4 until it is End of Life

[scenic hemlock]

Of course the CDLC teams are getting a share of the revenue. Why else would they have been included? We consulted the third party studios behind the CDLCs before moving forward with the pass. We felt their inclusion would not only give a better value proposition to people who might subscribe to the Pass for a month or so to try everything out before buying what they liked (most likely during a sale), but also revenue for the hard working CDLC teams.

[rotund echo]

We should probably make sure Chair gets his 5 minute break from the BI coding sweatshop

https://tenor.com/view/was-forced-to-play-arma3-gif-26207791

[steady ravine]

Chair? are you sure you're not talking about Dedmen?

[rotund echo]

Him too

[random crane]

😬 still a free agent, sort of

[rotund echo]

It would be cool if there was a cluster bomb that instead of dropping exploding bomblets was used to deploy minefields. I know the vanilla ones can leave uxo, but it would be funny to box in people and have their engineers try to get them out of that situation

I havent seen anything like that in arma

[rich mist]

Any of the Mechanized SPGs have cluster mines

Vanilla ones that is

[rotund echo]

Oh thats right. Thank you

[lunar socket]

RHS USAF has something like that and it's very funny.

[teal kindle]

When then, I guess it's time for you pitched BI your next cDLC idea.

[smoky gorge]

Can someone please leak the next cdlc ideally with a release date I wont tell anyone

[steady ravine]

No.

[rich mist]

I've heard it's going to release this decade

It will likely contain a gun

It will also release on steam

[young geyser]

2027, it is called Arma 4 😅
But honestly if there is anything left it will probably be released before A4 so its sales do not suffer from the "exodus"

[teal kindle]

Rumors are it's from Rotators Collective, so it's likely a 2035 setting. I would expect to hear something in the next few months.

[teal kindle]

I wonder if we'll get some news about A4 on June 22???

I agree that any cDLC in the pipeline would need to release before A4, or it's sales will suffer. If I were a cDLC team, I would want my dlc to release a minimum of one years before the release of A4.

[lunar socket]

AFAIK, almost all of a cDLC's sales is right after release, so I think a little closer would be fine.

[teal kindle]

Yes, most sales come in the first few months, but some people only buy when there are 20%-30% or higher discounts, so I would want a year to get as many of those buyers as possible before the release of A4.

[rotund echo]

https://tenor.com/view/make-it-rain-money-money-make-it-rain-flick-money-gif-1661833468939292218

[red saddle]

Arma: Farscape, Release date 01.04.2028
A secret CSAT base on the back of Mars is discovered. With Ben Browder and Claudia Black voicing the main characters.
Special feature is a hexagon shaped portal that allows travel between Galaxies.

[steady ravine]

Finally Take On!: Mars

/J

[silk dirge]

the spaceport vould be a cool asset
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=902042257

[young geyser]

Does Take On Mars uses the A3 engine? Or is it an early Enfusion?

[red saddle]

FAQ: Creator DLC FAQ: https://arma3.com/dlc/creator#FAQ

Community FAQ:
Will you need to own the DLC to install it on dedicated servers?

• No. Dedicated servers get the content they need for free. Same as with Apex DLC and Tanoa.

Will the Creator DLC's be free for people who bought the Supporter Edition?

• No. Creator DLC's are not included in the Supporter Edition.

Will we be able to buy the upcomming dlc's in a bundle again?

• Too soon to say. Can't do a bundle before the DLC's are released, because you can't tell people what to expect, and also can't guarantee that you'll release the DLCs that were planned in time.

Can people who have the Creator DLC loaded play on servers which doesn't use it, with people who don't have the DLC?

• Not known yet. It will certainly create problems though if a DLC owner takes a weapon that neither the server nor other players can see. Still waiting for definitve answer from BI on this question.

[zinc bluff]

Please use this channel for general discussion regarding Creator DLC. The #global_mobilization is created for the specific mod.

[lone smelt]

So I think this sums up the major issues with how this is being implemented. https://twitter.com/Dslyecxi/status/1118520142227484672

[vivid lynx]

will creator dlc be part of future steam sales? I guess some members will wait for those

[dry leaf]

All people who want this dlc for free = GDR sympahtizers

[narrow cradle]

Would really like clarification on what happens if people without the DLC try and join a mission that uses DLC content. Will they be able to ignore the warning/error message and join anyway? Will they be unable to connect ro kicked? etc.

[red saddle]

I think I already read Homesick saying that it will be part of sales.. Just need to find out where he said it..
https://discordapp.com/channels/105462288051380224/568041153241284609/568070137635143690 Mondkalb did

[dry leaf]

Commies pls leave reee

[vivid lynx]

yep

mondkalb confirmed

[lone smelt]

Also how would this be handled this long term? Inevitably some of the community creator DLC will come out that some people will not be very interested in however it's in the best interest of the servers running the community creator DLC to have it implemented. This means that those without now have a choice between not buying it and not being able play on the public server or buy it and literally never use it. Have this happen with a few DLC and it can easily turn them off from this sort of content which means they will not buy more of the DLC that comes out in the future.

[vivid lynx]

Mondkalb Today at 15:47
Remember steam sales are a thing if the regular price is a bit too much for you. :smiley: No hard feelings from us about it.

thanks @red saddle

[red saddle]

That's a consideration yeah.
I see Servers popping up that will focus on specific DLC's.
The potentially next Creator DLC that will come out is also something that only attracts a limited group of people I'd say (can't tell you what it is).

[lone smelt]

That means there will be people separated out more and more and most people just join servers that are highly populated

[red saddle]

I'd personally say Arma isn't that much about public servers anyway. And the big vanilla servers will stay

[vivid lynx]

randomly joining servers? 🙀

[lone smelt]

Life servers and Invade and Annex have something to say about that @red saddle

[mild solstice]

lol

[dry leaf]

Life is not arma, we dont talk about life

[lone smelt]

Oh and King of the Hill

[dry leaf]

UwU

[scarlet sable]

Players can't join a server with the optional DLC installed if they don't have the "OPTIONAL" dlc installed themself.

this is stupid

what the hell

[knotty ore]

they join other server then?

[scarlet sable]

why isn't it like other DLC?

[knotty ore]

why would they want to play on that server if the content is not what they want

[narrow cradle]

they can join, unless they don't have the map being played or "require exact DLC" is set in the server config

[scarlet sable]

where you can still join the server but not use the content

[dry leaf]

Its optional because you dont need it to play the game lol

[zealous moat]

to avoid tons of GB

[lone smelt]

Thing is though that if there are servers just focusing on specific DLC then that means you will lose potential profit from future DLC that might not be as popular. If no one wants to play with said DLC I am unlikely to buy it since that means I wouldn't likely be able to jump onto a server that is populated or find people who do want to play. it because there isn't a lot of interest in it.

[zealous moat]

explained in the FAQ

[scarlet sable]

wrong move from bohemia

nice job guys

[dry leaf]

Its just a normal dlc

Literally how everyone does it

[mild solstice]

Why would BI want Arma 3 to have a bunch of Cold War German assets and terrain that might not be balanced against the existing A3 content, to be in the game all the time?

[narrow cradle]

everyone except BI you mean

[mild solstice]

You either force the content creators in to a very strict scope, or you make it optional

[dry leaf]

I just really don't get why this is controversial lol

Its not even expensive, cheaper than Apex for more content

I understand the fear of the community fragmenting

But like, this is industry standard

[lone smelt]

Implementing this like Apex where you cannot go onto the Tanoa map or use the equipment in the DLC but can still join a server running otherwise normal stuff would solve the issue. If there is a major concern about how much room it would take up then just have it be like normal mods where they simply would be invisible. If you are extremely concerned about people getting killed by an invisible tank then have a low res vech be a stand in.

[opaque gate]

"Come join my community, $100 entry fee"

[dry leaf]

The main issue is that this mod is not related to vannila arma 3 at all

[scarlet sable]

@opaque gate exactly that

[dry leaf]

Its not like you will see a leopard 1 in a 2035 server

[lone smelt]

I'd love to fight an Angara in a Leopard honestly

[knotty ore]

you will if you own the DLC 😉

[opaque gate]

You can play with the DLC, and other mods you know

[lone smelt]

Would be a super a super hard fight but would be a blast

[red saddle]

Keep it optional download like a mod. But also get some of the content for free.
I agree that it doesn't fit into arma enough to be part of a mandatory download

[mild solstice]

Exactly, it's more of a Total Conversion scenario than typical BI DLC

[dry leaf]

The only solution for this i can think of is like red orchestra

Dont buy the dlc, you can only play as riflemen

[scarlet sable]

Well servers won't want this $20 mod if normal a3 players cant join

[dry leaf]

My only issue is that i feel map assets should be free

Thats i think was where BI dropped the ball

Also, reminder there are cs go skins that cost more than this dlc

[narrow cradle]

tbh the map assets and map are the lesser problem

the gear/vehicles are more of an issue

[dry leaf]

Why?

[obtuse pond]

how many third party DLC are in the pipeline?

[dry leaf]

We arent sure yet

Guess it depends on how well this goes

[mild solstice]

Look at it from the perspective that you're either playing GM/Creator DLC or you're playing Arma 3. Creator DLC will most likely not be 100% balanced with Arma 3 so is in effect a total conversion and creates its own game environment. Likewise if you want to run mods with GM or another CDLC, you'll most likely find they wont be 100% balanced either. So you're either scaling your play around the CDLC or you are not

[narrow cradle]

because it's easier to say "we'll run this map, and only people that own it can play, but can use the gear/vehicles on other maps like with the other DLC"

[opaque gate]

Just because things are one way, doesn't justify something else
There are text editors that cost more than this DLC as well, that's not relevant here
Just because this is the industry standard model for DLC doesn't mean that it's a good DLC model

[mild solstice]

We run in to people complaining all the time about how RHS etc. doesn't scale well with Arma 3. Well guess what? Some of these CDLCs probably wont either

[dry leaf]

No, but it means its nothing shocking

[narrow cradle]

yeah but to quote you @mild solstice , Heaven forbid mission editors might have to do some gameplay design 😛

[dry leaf]

Its not like a subscription model or something fucked up

[wraith sleet]

we're not debating about whether it's shocking, we're debating about what should actually be done

[dry leaf]

Just a normal expansion

[lone smelt]

Overall I don't think communities will want this since not everyone will have it, player wise people like to be able to pop onto normal servers and use Apex weapons and vechs, and server wise you are going to have to decide if you want more players on or the DLC and in order to justify server costs you need a good amount of players. All of this will end up in a loss of potential profits thanks to the fact that people won't want to buy something they are unlikely to use.

[dry leaf]

By the ways you are acting yeah, it seens as if this was super shocking

[wraith sleet]

#makemapfree

[dry leaf]

Also, i doubt anyone can use arma 3 dlc stuff due to that accursed watermark lol

[narrow cradle]

i dunno we manage to integrate it fine

[mild solstice]

Then they are designing scenarios for the CDLC, no? The game mode/server then becomes designed around that CDLC, so why is it a problem that you cannot attract people without the CDLC?

[dry leaf]

Another issue is that this dlc is pretty huge

[narrow cradle]

Problem is then it becomes a thing that only the DLC owners can play

which isn't great for large or open communities

[dry leaf]

I mean, my community requires apex

[narrow cradle]

besides, we get like 15 people show up to session, or less

[lone smelt]

Look at Tanoa, not a lot of servers host it and not a lot of communities use it. Those servers that do have fewer people on then vanilla servers.

[narrow cradle]

if we play GM only sessions it'll probably be 5 people 🤷🏽

[lone smelt]

This will only get worse in the future as more and more of these DLC come out

[dry leaf]

A shame,Tanoa is an excellent map

[narrow cradle]

@dry leaf Apex and GM are different in how they operate, we use Tanoa too, but could take a few months to mandate it.

[dry leaf]

But tbh Apex is more expensive

[narrow cradle]

It's way cheaper on sale

[dry leaf]

But GM is cheaper normaly

[narrow cradle]

...so?

[dry leaf]

Less price = more buy

[narrow cradle]

cheaper than Apex without sale, not Apex on sale.

[dry leaf]

GM will also go on sale

[narrow cradle]

Anyway, price is only a part of the equation

So i'm not sure what the point is of focusing on it

[dry leaf]

Nah, price is the main issue here

[narrow cradle]

Nope

[lone smelt]

Also a lot of people only buy DLC they are likely to use. If they don't think they will use it they won't buy it.

[dry leaf]

If this was free would anyone be complaining?

[narrow cradle]

Price just prevents it from being an impulse buy

[inner oyster]

Well no because it coincidentally fixes the actual issue as well as the price thing

[dry leaf]

No, price is the thing that controls how much the community fragments

[narrow cradle]

The problem right now is "hey, we don't mind paying but it's a pain in the arse the way it's being implemented"

[dry leaf]

If this was like 50 bucks i would be angry too

[inner oyster]

I mean I have no issue paying what they ask

but I can't expect everyone else I play with to also be fine with it

so if my group can't all buy it, none of us can play it

[narrow cradle]

Look, if you want to dismiss everyone's concerns and make it look like like the concern is something it's not, then i can't help you

[dry leaf]

I dont want your help

[narrow cradle]

Apex wasn't free, yet it was easier to integrate

[dry leaf]

I'm just kinda puzzled at this reaction

[narrow cradle]

The comparison is with apex

[quaint carbon]

hint @narrow cradle do not feed the trolls

[narrow cradle]

Yeah... probably should stop now

[dry leaf]

C'mon im not a troll, im a Russian bot

[narrow cradle]

he's basically been dismissing the whole thing from the start of this channel

[dry leaf]

Beep boop

Yeah because i just dont see why this is so divisive

Sorry if im comming off as demeaning, but i just feel as if im missing something

[opaque gate]

We are attempting to explain it to you, yet you keep ignoring what is said to return to price as the issue, which it is not

[dry leaf]

Mind explaining what you think the main issue is?

[lone smelt]

I play DCS and not a lot of people buy the training aircraft or Cold War aircraft even though they are cheaper but do buy stuff like the F-18. Reason is they probably won't use it a lot especially when they know they will definitely use the F-18. In DCS the Cold War servers are nowhere near as populated because of this. Now block off people using those aircraft with other aircraft when they come out and soon there will barely be anyone buying the new DLC.

[quaint carbon]

The root issue is idioticly simple: up until now, everybody could use the assets (in the sense, that they could see and actually use them for a brief moment)
now, you have to explicitly buy that stuff or cannot join such servers at all

the concern is about community separation

not price

[inner oyster]

Yeah I guess it's a niche mod making itself more niche

I like the mod

a lot

but if my group can't all get it, I'll never play it with them

and it doesn't have the mass appeal to just be an expected DLC/mod

[opaque gate]

I feel really bad for the GM guys right now, because I think their content looks amazing, but their announcement has to get wrapped up in this change in DLC model instead of just celebrated

[inner oyster]

I'm sure there are gonna be groups that run GM with no issues, but as an admin of my group I can't force people to spend money based on my own desires

[dry leaf]

Yeah but thats the thing, i don't get why having go pay for something to use it is bad

[inner oyster]

It's not

[quaint carbon]

not price``` to repeat myself

[dry leaf]

Yes but what causes community separation?

[inner oyster]

paying for something isn't bad, the side effect is that unless everyone has it, nobody will

[dry leaf]

The fact it is a paid dlc

[quaint carbon]

up until now, only the map was requiring the DLC
understandible
but now, even using any asset (eg. a tank) will separate the community

[lone smelt]

Because people will literally be separated between have and have nots

[quaint carbon]

and force everyone who wants to participate into buying that stuff

or leave out

[inner oyster]

I like the mod, but if my group doesn't all get it, we won't use it
if we don't use it, why would I buy it

it's like a self fulfilling prophecy

[cunning nacelle]

I mean wasnt the apex assets dlc requirement changed for that exact reason?

[inner oyster]

there's nothing negative about the mod here

[dry leaf]

Also, another thing is that i dont play with my group 24/7

[inner oyster]

it's an amazing mod and the devs are getting a lot of undeserved flak right now

[dry leaf]

In that we agree

[inner oyster]

but yeah groups are almost entirely not going to be running GM due to the previously mentioned downfalls

[dry leaf]

But just like Apex, as time goes on more people will own the dlc

[lone smelt]

Before a person without the Apex DLC could still pop onto Malden and work in a fire team with someone using Viper gear. With this people wouldn't be able to play with someone using an MG3 simply because they don't own the DLC. It's extremely different from the DLC in the past and will separate people.

[inner oyster]

and public servers are less incentivised to run it because of the limited playerbase

[dry leaf]

I see your point now but i still dont see it as something worthy getting worked up like this

Still, thanks for explaining

[median lintel]

Many people ask during application process if Apex is required, because they don't own it. We don't require, nor use it, because otherwise we'd have to tell people they can't join in on the fun for that event.

[inner oyster]

I mean I'm not gonna lose sleep over it either

it just is what it is

[cunning nacelle]

imagine 10 more paid dlc like this and it becomes a problem

[dry leaf]

Problem is Apex is not a total conversion

[inner oyster]

the biggest thing for me is that 10 hours ago we thought it was a free mod

[dry leaf]

GM is

[inner oyster]

and getting that sprung is just a bummer

[muted narwhal]

lol

[dry leaf]

I cant really think of a way to implement it besides like red orchestra

Or

[muted narwhal]

free things expected ftw

[dry leaf]

The PMC and bAF dlcs from arma 2

You get everything, but low quality

[wind axle]

Well my two cents to it.

I find the setting intresting. That my beloved G3 from other games finally comes into Arma 3 makes me happy. Sadly i whished for more modern vehicles. But hey some German vehicles!!! ^^

[muted narwhal]

emphasis on expectations

[median lintel]

That's a strawman, and I think you know that

[dry leaf]

I actualy wished for older vehicles, this dlc will fill a great niche i was lacking om

[lone smelt]

@dry leaf We will take low quality if that means we can still have everyone playing on the same servers

[inner oyster]

Yeah it's not expecting it to be free, it's being lead to believe it was free right up until it wasn't

they can make it a paid mod, there's no problem with that

[dry leaf]

Yeah, i wonder if that is a possibility

[inner oyster]

just the negatives of it being paid make it less likely that my group will play it and that's kinda sucky

[dry leaf]

It would also really lighten the download size

[lone smelt]

I was just expecting to be able to work with other people on Invade and Annex. I plan to buy the DLC but I wouldn't be able to my G3 on a normal sever.

[inner oyster]

but yeah a lot of people talked about the A2 style

making low res free

[dry leaf]

Remember when arma 2 was f2p? Lmao

[median lintel]

Alternatively, they could have implemented the system they use for the current ArmA 3 DLC.

[cunning nacelle]

oh god reinforcements

[inner oyster]

yeah the current DLC style is fine

[lone smelt]

That's extremely annoying since I want to work with other people but also have the fun new equipment

I am paying for it afterall and that's how the DLC worked in the past

[wind axle]

Mhmm i would wait witch judgements of the DLC since Bohemia want to keep the high quality

[dry leaf]

My main issue is that i will miss the platform updates

From official dlc

[lone smelt]

This should be really easy to fix but if they don't it doesn't make sense to buy and use the DLC community, server, or player wise

[dry leaf]

I also really hope we get more 2035 stuff

[wind axle]

Mhmm the platform Updates will still happen. It maybe won't have big changes anymore. But i somehow think maybe bohemia will suprise us since they seem to take suggestions of the Creator DLC People serious.

[delicate pumice]

@inner oyster Yeah it's not expecting it to be free, it's being lead to believe it was free right up until it wasn't who led you to believe this?

[knotty ore]

buy all the dlcs when they come out and fund more platform updates 😛

[wind axle]

Thanks Goat.

[inner oyster]

I ain't mad that it's a paid mod btw, I already bought it

[wind axle]

But i am not sure if the money goes to Arma 3 or better bohemia

[inner oyster]

it's 50/50 ARMA and the devs isn't it?

[knotty ore]

some of it goes to BI

[dry leaf]

When we getting the FARMA CDLC

[wind axle]

Well then

[dry leaf]

The solution is simple, make the German government buy the dlc for everyone

[wind axle]

Eh we have other probs right now we don't need that one too.

[mint depot]

@delicate pumice https://forums.bohemia.net/forums/topic/211229-global-mobilization/ It was posted in the mod forums in 2017 when third party mods weren't a thing yet

[wind axle]

Still i hope that there will be soon other DLCs with more modern vehicles again.

[mint depot]

so I can see where people got the impression it was going to be free

[dry leaf]

Modern as in 2010s or 2035?

[wind axle]

2010s

[dry leaf]

Hm

[inner oyster]

Yeah it's my bad for not asking about the paid/not paid status of the mod

but last I heard it was free and then heard nothing up until now

[dry leaf]

My only issue is that we already have alot of modern mods

[inner oyster]

still bought it though

[dry leaf]

Still, more content is always nice

[muted narwhal]

@inner oyster not certain about the 50/50, steam takes 30% first 😉

[inner oyster]

it's 50/50 of the remaining 70% then I'd assume

[wind axle]

i mean a mix of old and modern vehicles is nice. No Country in the World takes the old things out when new happens makes it even more realistic

[muted narwhal]

it depends on how each negotiated their contracts

[dry leaf]

Weirdly enough CUP does a good job at that

It adds modern vehicles to vannila factions

Including cursed things like the csat T-55

[wind axle]

Mhmm Cup is not that modern.

[dry leaf]

CSAT T-55 is unholy

[muted narwhal]

not enough tactical gloves

[dry leaf]

I mean, if your weapon does not have 4 sights, 3 grenade launchers and a flamethrower

[random crane]

ANGERY

[dry leaf]

Is it modem?

[muted narwhal]

i am told that makes a difference

[inner oyster]

I hope ARMA 4 has a gloves slot tbh

[muted narwhal]

why does that matter so much to people

[wind axle]

@dry leaf i talk about the vehicle site weapons are good.

[random crane]

dont want to get blisters from rubbing on your boyfriend's shaft

[lethal canyon]

i heard the word gloves

[inner oyster]

look if you aren't wearing OakleyTM brand gloves while operating, are you even truly operating?

[dry leaf]

What's up with gloves recently

[lethal canyon]

triggered

people demand gloves as much as RPK.. but ima end it there getting off topic

[lone smelt]

Because gloves are one of the best things ever invented. Been using this pair of soft leather and wool gloves for years and they are great for field work. I can grab barb wire, keep my hands warm, get a way better grip, not having rope or plastic bite into my hands as I try to hold something heavy, and more

[random crane]

just be a man and do it bare handed

[muted narwhal]

do you use a glove with that mouse?

[lethal canyon]

OOF

[random crane]

back in my days barbwire doubled as field rations when we were in the field

[muted narwhal]

what difference does it make ingame?

[lone smelt]

Hell I've even grabbed logs that are on fire and covered in ash and moved them about. Hands felt a tad warm after and that's it.

[dry leaf]

Cowboy hats > gloves

Fuck the sun

[wind axle]

I am intrested how it will continue Arma 3 in the future. There are in my opinions lots of little things which could be worked on ^^. Espacially Scripting side to identify objects. I still hope that Mines will get a little more love.
Other things would be loadout of vehicles like planes. Or a small Logisticsystem where we could built onto it.

[muted narwhal]

3rd party dlcs won’t feature platform updates

[dry leaf]

Actual support for manualy cycled weapons and shotgun pellets

[lone smelt]

But yes really hope they fix this stuff since this is going to cost them money if they don't.

[muted narwhal]

reloadEH is available on dev branch ^

[dry leaf]

Dw they just need to add lootboxes and no more money troubles :)

[wind axle]

@muted narwhal i don't think about the integration from 3rd Party devs. I more think about paralell development from BI since they didn't want to stop it ^^

But honetly i wouldn'T be suprised if all the effort goes into a more powerfull engine (enfusion) which would be able to handle all those things better. Especially the Physics site.

[muted narwhal]

the vast majority of developers for a3 moved to other projects already

dev blogs ^^

[wraith sleet]

I got a response from homesick - looks like they intend to make this a separate branch so you need to follow a particular branch to opt into it, but homesick does not even know if non paid DLC content can be played on the server by non DLC owners.

[muted narwhal]

old man dlc is the last official push, might include sensible platform changes but that’s about it

[wraith sleet]

So technically the details aren't even known by BI yet 😩

[wind axle]

@muted narwhal so i read to but i will still hope ^^

[muted narwhal]

on topic, 3rd party dlc will not include platform updates

[wraith sleet]

I think honestly this is just a paid mod, required on client and server and that is how this is going to work.

[muted narwhal]

yes ^

[radiant cedar]

From my understanding, this DLC adds several Cold War assets?

[wraith sleet]

These aren't DLCs in the same way the prior ones were.

[muted narwhal]

yes ^

[radiant cedar]

🤔

[wraith sleet]

That makes things awkward. If your entire community doesn't buy it then for a subset to play it looks like you'll need a whole other server install on a different branch running in parallel to play it.

[muted narwhal]

all prior ones included (and that for me was a ton more important than the content they provided) major changes to engine

[knotty ore]

or you know, new game groups will arise

like with any mod

or today we will play with the DLCs

tomorrow vanilla

[muted narwhal]

i don’t get why it is so hard to grasp that these sort of dlcs are handled differently

[untold oracle]

my only gripe is that it goes against what BI was saying about DLCs for so many years, can say it's not "BI DLC" or whatever, it's part of Arma 3, so it's an Arma 3 DLC ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[muted narwhal]

and why it was expected to be behaving the same as before

[wraith sleet]

The other interesting thing is they couldn't yet tell me it will be ensured to work onto the future, that future platform updates wont break it.

[knotty ore]

what future platform updates?

[muted narwhal]

^^

[wraith sleet]

Arma 3 is still receiving patches.

[muted narwhal]

yes, one more to be precise

so not patches but patch, singular

[wraith sleet]

Presumably with a future creator DLC there may be other platform updates.

[knotty ore]

no

[untold oracle]

no, they are pure content DLCs

[wraith sleet]

You would have thought that is how BI would answer that question, but they didn't they said they don't know how that will work. I don't think they genuinely do plan to do no further patches at all, that is a very odd response if that is the case because it is easy to answer if it is.

[untold oracle]

yeah...

[red saddle]

"yes, one more to be precise" where did you get that from? didn't hear anything about that yet

[untold oracle]

one question, it was said Creator DLC is very hard to get approved and released right? so what's the worry of going Apex way if there will be so few Creator DLCs?; related to what Dwarden said about "too many GBs of game"

[muted narwhal]

@wraith sleet they said that before, when they announced the pitch
a. it will happen at the end of arma’s official development
b. the vast majority of developers moved on to other projects
c. 3rd party dlcs will not come with engine updates

[wind axle]

Yeah 3rd party by itself this doesn't change Bohemias sight. Maybe no 3rd Party dev will be able to release one but bohemia itself could consider it.

[dry leaf]

Its a bit sad, but the game still lives on

Just hope we get something good on it

[untold oracle]

something good and something bad in everything, as long as feedback is taken into account in the future

[valid saddle]

I see there is a party going on here

[regal shuttle]

take care, people die at this party

I have seen blood and found boddies in the water closet

[wraith sleet]

boddies

[valid saddle]

The moment I saw "Germany" in the title I was sold

Or is it actually part of my season pass?

[regal shuttle]

no you'll have to pay

game is over

😄

[muted narwhal]

if you mean supporter edition

[valid saddle]

Nah i have dlc bundle 1 and 2

[muted narwhal]

then nope, 3rd party are separate

either way these are separate

[valid saddle]

Well okay, then my statement is still valid

That.

[random crane]

the season pass offer is over too btw

[wind axle]

Well i talked short to Rob. He tries to gather information and wants to realease it when he has it. If i got him right things aren't so dire as it looks like to some right now. I will wait now for his informations ^^

[valid saddle]

It it just me or does this dlc actually contain more content than the other bi dlcs released?

[random crane]

they never looked dire 😃

[untold oracle]

lots of content @valid saddle but only content 😃

it is indeed a lot, and that's great!

[muted narwhal]

i don’t generally agree with @random crane here, but things were never dire to begin with

[random crane]

a broken clock is still right twice a day 😛

[valid saddle]

lol

[wind axle]

@random crane some sounded like that shrugs

[untold oracle]

always do in large public discussions

[wind axle]

I will keep that in mind :D

[tepid lance]

Technically we did get a platform update! Custom compasses and watches, of which we made extensive use. 😛

[muted narwhal]

@tepid lance bah, was that requested by you directly?

[untold oracle]

it's a platform update either way, just like BI's DLC used platform update to showcase and make use of the platform update 😛

[worldly lodge]

Looking at the quality and quantity of the GM dlc, i fully 100% support it

pls no ban for being positive 😦

[untold oracle]

GM is great, no one was saying it's not 😃

[red saddle]

What I see working well as Creator DLC would be something that would be a clientside mod. Like JSRS 🤔
Problem is only that JSRS is already free

[inner oyster]

Yeah I don't think anyone has anything negative to say about the quality standards of the mod, it's amazing to say the least

[prisma mountain]

So question based on reading the SITREP. Will the DLC act like a additional mod in terms of hosting it? Like if I have some peeps that just want to play a session on the new terrain. Will there be a launchable @option for it? Or will I basically need a separate server for it?

[red saddle]

BI doesn't really know yet themselves it seems. I heard talk about needing to be on a seperate branch (like dev/perf/prof branch) which would mean you need a seperate server

[delicate pumice]

Custom compasses and watches that's really quite cool, have often thought this type of object was under-utilised, would be great for radio interfaces.

[mild solstice]

@prisma mountain the launcher has a specific DLC page now where you can load Creator DLCs as you would do with mods, so I assume it will work from .exe launch options like mods do

[prisma mountain]

Yea I would be fine with that.

Is it sad I'm mostly in it for terrain/German radio protocol?

[mild solstice]

Nah. Apex was pretty much all about the terrain so it's fine to only be hyped about that.

I probably wont be bothering with it though, since I know I will rarely launch it. I only bought the BIS DLCs to be fully appraised of all the stuff that ships with the base game for modding purposes (i.e. I regret not buying the supporter's edition)

[graceful willow]

"The revenue generated by Creator DLC is split 50/50 between the developer and Bohemia Interactive. Also note that, of all purchases on the Steam store, a portion of the revenue goes to Valve."

So 35 % of total revenue goes to DLC devs (assuming that Steam cut is around 30 %)

[valid saddle]

@prisma mountain Nein

[prisma mountain]

Ow god...the life RP servers

East and West Germany for real XD

[valid saddle]

Ja

[red saddle]

Wonder how good life servers would run... That have a 20€ 22GB download entry barrier.

[prisma mountain]

Eh, Takistan life was booming back in A2 days. Just takes a good youtuber.

[valid saddle]

For having a german police car? I think all the players from my community will get it

[red saddle]

Yeah.. But you could buy just A2OA. without A2

[prisma mountain]

True that.

My wallet is secretly crying as it slowly realizes I'm not just going to buy DLC for me but like 3 copies for the community.

[knotty ore]

perhaps you need a bit of crowdfunding

[prisma mountain]

We have a budget.

But I'm a impulse..."Lets have a competition!" kind of person so I just buy them myself.

419 square kilometers of usable area. Wouldn't this make it the biggest map in A3 so far?

[red saddle]

Australia is bigger

[prisma mountain]

I kind of D/Q Australia at this point, due to lack of development, and stolen CUP stuff.

[cedar chasm]

scratch that

I think that's more of a guesstimation than anything

nothing about price is mentioned in announcement

[worldly lodge]

7:52 PM] Midnight: I think that's more of a guesstimation than anything
[7:52 PM] Midnight: nothing about price is mentioned in announcement

its confirmed prices

[cedar chasm]

on sale at 19.99 EUR / 22.99 USD / 16.99 GBP.

[worldly lodge]

2:18 PM] Mondkalb: USD 22.99 / EUR 19.99 / GBP 16.99.

[cedar chasm]

WOaH

It reminds me a lot of A1

https://discord.gg/XbhfF37

[red saddle]

^ is now pinned in #global_mobilization

[knotty ore]

@covert sluice see the channel below this channel?

[cedar chasm]

👍

Anyhow, I don't think this is going to split the community at all.

[muted narwhal]

😄

[red saddle]

Will be same as Tanoa. People will just not play it and not care ^^

[cedar chasm]

A lot of people thought Apex might, but after almost 3 years, it's doing fine

[muted narwhal]

take 3 on the day

[inner oyster]

I mean yeah people who would have their group split by it simply won't use it

and those that wanna play it will find servers

[cedar chasm]

it might be niche, but it'll be fun for those who want to organize it / chase it

[stable raft]

where's my ducking BLITZKRIEG

[timid mountain]

anyone here buying salt? selling by the pound.. told users of my mods they will require GM from now on... surplus salt here... vary cheap

[cedar chasm]

bludclot no..

[stable raft]

this DLC pack also includes Denmark as a smaller but viable military faction.

@timid mountain

How much?

I have 1,62 Euros

[timid mountain]

you will need a van

[red saddle]

Tac Ops DLC van? @timid mountain

[stable raft]

I own all Dlc'

s

except the newly launched one

[timid mountain]

no

gokart dedmen

almost everyone can afford

[inner oyster]

Bludclot with the GM assets for your maps

[stable raft]

i HOpe

the new campaign comes with east german propaganda music if not

[inner oyster]

any plan to leave up legacy versions for non GM users?

[stable raft]

im I'm gonna be real dissapointeed

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tAxadstFhzo

this is a song that would be ok

[cedar chasm]

Legacy versions? What?

[inner oyster]

Well Bludclot said he wanted to us Gm assets in his maps

So I'm wondering if he'll keep the versions of those maps before the GM assets are added for those who don't have it

[cedar chasm]

I am going to say that it was a half baked joke

[inner oyster]

I'm just curious is all, he makes amazing maps so I'd definitely be interested to see what he does with the assets

[timid mountain]

if i did, it would never again be updated

GM has the so far best vegetation of any official content

nobody needs dated a2 trees anymore

i'd be an idiot not to use them

[inner oyster]

Yeah I figured if you were to keep pre GM maps up, they'd no longer be updated

[timid mountain]

with GM i can make my euro and not yet announced projects actually look like the regions they represent

[muted narwhal]

https://tenor.com/view/salt-bae-sprinkling-salt-gif-7535412

[inner oyster]

Only shame is they don't plan to do with GM what they did with the Tanoa assets

[wraith sleet]

Do we know the price of the DLC?

[red saddle]

$22/20€

[little rampart]

communities complaining "wah wah community separation" ... yet at same time run ace and rhs and stuff on 90% time because it's quality and it's a "non scifi" scenario, and play huge scenarios that only run well on high end machines. Along comes quality+quantity (vehicles units terrain everything) in a damn good scenario ... except with a paywall that is not unreasonable. "oh no but the separation". Put your money where your mouth is...

[random crane]

plus campaign, plus music, plus dubbing

thats probably a more complete game on its own than a lot of other stuff on the market for full retail price

[timid mountain]

all i know is, now, as a terrain maker, now we can make almost any type of terain in arma

not just onees around equator

[little rampart]

aye... i highly dislike the altis buildings. They just dont fit on many maps.

[timid mountain]

i havea bigger issue wiith the plants

they are way more important imo

[little rampart]

that too, yeah

[wraith sleet]

I take it there wont be restrictions on referring to assets? IE we can make custom terrains and missions relying on its presence?

[timid mountain]

well

kind of

the lords in the bi office don't want us to

so assets are encrypted

meaning we can't use them as is with the bi tools

you have to use proxy objects to pack terrains

[little rampart]

you need placeholders basically

[timid mountain]

which suck entirely if you use buldoezr

[wraith sleet]

I am wondering if it will come with a more extensive EULA or not that some how puts more restrictions on mods using it

[timid mountain]

no

[little rampart]

why would it?

BI assets (models) are already as restrictive can be - cant touch this

[wraith sleet]

A lot about this isn't a usual DLC, so given we know the rules are different I am wondering how much and where

[timid mountain]

except what i just outlined

nothing

i also know the guys who made it did extra steps to make retexturing and such easy

iirc they also provide templates

[wraith sleet]

I'll stick the question on the topic anyway and hopefully when homesick answers my other two that BI isn't sure about they will pick that up too

OK good, just want to ensure all is well and ensure BI has thought about it.

[timid mountain]

i know for a fact they did 😉

[sinful cape]

ugh placing objects via proxies

i can understand why that is... otherwise shit will get ripped out... but still sucks