#ip_rights_violations

1 messages · Page 72 of 1

karmic root
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TFL

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TFC

plain rivet
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I literally bought A3 for the amount of mods it has. Don’t want to play vanilla anymore? Go play modern, or redacted or X!

karmic root
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L&S

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NSW mod from Keats

runic wraith
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Hmmm, lets use some logic here. Porting ripped models vs making your own from scratch. Oh yeah totally makes sense now, porting takes sooo freakin long.

plain rivet
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ARMA, while it does have its quirks, has almost limitless modding potential

karmic root
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Im just saying. That people want mods. Mods are made. There shouldn't be such a massive freakout over creators in general.

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unless they're selling stolen assets.

sinful pivot
karmic root
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Like who?

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none of the names I mentioned do that..

plain rivet
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I can name like, at least 50 off the top of my head in the halo community alone

karmic root
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oh idk about the halo/star wars stuff

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im sure its bad there

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im talking about the mil gear community

sinful pivot
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I read that as just using stolen assets, in which case all of them are

plain rivet
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Starsim had some big mods be taken down for ripping all their assets

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Apparently it’s too hard to make original content

karmic root
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I just commission models.

spare osprey
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I think the issue, people put a lot of work into something and after it gets stolen time and time again.

If you look at the h-60 mod there is about 180k of man hours. I would make the model public access but I know there would be 100 versions for he same day

karmic root
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Whats wrong with people trying to improve off of your platform?

plain rivet
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Ripping the shit is no bueno

karmic root
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Thats like the most flattering thing

spare osprey
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Joining the team is

plain rivet
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Modifying and creating their own version, with 0 ripping is good

manic laurel
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asking for permission, for starter, is a good idea.

plain rivet
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That too

sinful pivot
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not when they just steal parts and claim it as their own. That fancy crye backpack you see on the TFL AVS was ripped from the Aussie Commando Gear mod, that turned them off of Arma modding entirely, and now we don't have any of their assets

plain rivet
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My first released workshop item was a custom faction with a bunch of combined halo and vanilla stuff. With requirements to the other mods that were used to make it

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It’s that simple

karmic root
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I mean at this point we can all realize there's nothing that can be done to prevent it from happening. No encryption or DMCA has ever stopped it before. Instead of putting time and effort into "suppressing" them, why don't ya'll just keep making what your making and make a good mod.

plain rivet
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People make good mods

manic laurel
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because it kills motivation

plain rivet
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Dumbasses rip them

karmic root
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It shouldn't.

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Thats life lmao, deal with it and keep going.

manic laurel
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@karmic root so take the piss too when you get DMCA'd, easy as that

karmic root
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I don't get DMCA'd

manic laurel
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you went from "what's wrong w/ ripping" to "can't stop it"; shifting the goalpost means you dropped the ball on the first point.

manic laurel
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and people do that on their own time, so seeing a community that doesn't care, steals from them, BI not caring… you sure people will keep wanting to mod? spoiler, no. that's not a theory, that's what is happening

karmic root
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I'm just looking at it from a realistic perspective man. Its not going to stop, might as well just forget rippers exist and keep working.

plain rivet
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So, turn a blind eye?

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Yeah

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You’re taking the piss

manic laurel
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maybe it's at an acceptable level thanks to the watch
"let's accept your car can get stolen, it's life" sure, remove cops, law etc!

karmic root
manic laurel
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sure, ripping will always happen or be thought of, can't deny that
now should we indeed turn a blind eye… no.

spare osprey
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Lol

manic laurel
spare osprey
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No this is why I can’t look at models because people steal things…

chilly silo
karmic root
karmic root
chilly silo
karmic root
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Why do you think every picture on the steam community screenshots is from mods likes TFL, TFC, TFB, L&S.

karmic root
plain rivet
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It’s expensive as fuck to have lawyers for this type of shit

manic laurel
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so should it be re-enforced or de-enforced? I don't follow you
should IP be enforced? I am told I should turn a blind eye here

keen trout
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or their steam workshop upload permission disabled 🙂

karmic root
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Its kinda ironic you guys think the mod ripping issue is ripping from other mods lol, Majority of the mods from those groups are commissions or ports.

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like what lmao

manic laurel
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again, what's your point because if someone is telling me "it's ok to rip", he's out there by the window

karmic root
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No one is ripping USP and actually using it...

chilly silo
# karmic root make mods.

And why do you think that is?

it used to. A1 and A2 there were literally hundreds of legit original mods. A3 era and its 80-90% ripped content.

Most of my mates have left the community over it.

spare osprey
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There is a monetary value behind mod . It cost man hours why do you get to take that when you didn’t do any of the work.

It’s going to be interesting to see what happens with IP rights when NTF’s gain more traction

manic laurel
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wrong comparison, with weed you only eventually hurt yourself (and the state for a lack of tax)
here, it's about defending a creative community

karmic root
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War on drugs moment

manic laurel
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"let's accept it" is not an acceptable answer I'm afraid.

karmic root
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just gonna have to agree to disagree

manic laurel
plain rivet
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IP Lawyers would love to have a chat with you NME

spare osprey
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I think the same thing happened with movies and songs…….

karmic root
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At the end of the day its a game that we all enjoy. Not worth arguing over.

chilly silo
karmic root
karmic root
manic laurel
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let's hinder sharing because of thieves, and praise those for their audacity… not 😉

chilly silo
karmic root
manic laurel
karmic root
sinful pivot
manic laurel
karmic root
karmic root
manic laurel
spare osprey
manic laurel
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you're ill-informed then, and discussing it is worthless now

karmic root
dull moon
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pretty much one of the highest quality to get if it comes to modded assets

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you're a freshy, right?

karmic root
karmic root
dull moon
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not really. there is only a hand full of mods that reach the same level

spare osprey
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It would be great if people would support the official, version. Or be in a position to take over when the lead dev gets burnt out and keep the project alive .

karmic root
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Again, it would be.

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But thats not the reality of the situation.

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Modding tools are pathetic and most tutorials lead people nowhere. Its also something that people won't put in the time for, when they can rip instead.

runic wraith
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This whole conversation is worthless, not even sure why anyone is trying to reason with them. Its obvious they support the idea of ripping content from others, and are involved with doing that themselves. To be honest, not even sure how this conversation has lasted this long.

karmic root
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Its a hard pill to swallow.

spare osprey
karmic root
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@spare osprey @manic laurel I appreciate you guys being civil.

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I'm just saying what I think.

faint nacelle
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@karmic root its very easy to stop ripping

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people stop using those mods

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and the people doing it stop because they dont get audience

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you saying nothing can be done is totally false

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you can start by not using those mods and then encourage your fellow gamers to do same

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ummm

karmic root
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This lol

faint nacelle
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ripped content is not new. its stolen

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you guys just need to grow some backbone and do the right thing

karmic root
manic laurel
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ripped from community = no more new content from the community
stop using ripped stuff = more new content from the community
I mean, that's really how it is

karmic root
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Simple as that.

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If a ripper stops a modder from making stuff, then its over.

manic laurel
karmic root
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Thats like clothing companies shutting down because some chinese sweatshop is selling knockoffs.

karmic root
faint nacelle
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I just told you the solution?

karmic root
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@frail smelt Feel like a lot of people who complain about ripped mods dont play lol

faint nacelle
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I guess these guys are out of reach of reasoning.

karmic root
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Its a hard pill to swallow I guess.

chilly silo
spare osprey
chilly silo
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Either support the legit modeers or just walk away.

faint nacelle
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Like I said you guys if you wanted to could start a revolution by being example of gamers who tell rippers to shove their private mod links up their asses instead of endorsing them and claiming here nothing can be done,

manic laurel
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your stance:

  • meh, ripping happens, let it happen

answer:

  • no can let it happen, for legal reasons, for moral reasons and for community reasons.

our stance:

  • let's defend the community and fight ripping with what we have

answer:

  • you're unrealistic!

guys… really, stop if you don't have arguments.

spare osprey
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Your logic makes no sense. How old are you ?

manic laurel
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nooope, let's not make it personal 😬

sinful pivot
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Looking at it in a purely logic driven way will lead you to the argument "Ripping happens, but that doesn't stop you from making mods". Looking at it from an emotional view has "Well, I made something and someone stole my work and claiming it as their own, fuck this". These are both the extremes, but the later is happening more and more, and for a large amount of people who only use the workshop, their options become more and more limited, because not everyone is that dedicated to arma to go looking for private mods, or like what they have. I don't support ripping, nor do I think it can realistically be stopped, but at least giving some sort of safety net for people to protect the assets that they made to remain "official"

karmic root
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Like I said earlier. Good luck.

chilly silo
manic laurel
karmic root
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It isn't lol

sinful pivot
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something >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nothing

spare osprey
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What point are you trying to make ? Are you talking about ripping from other games or other mods? I don’t get how ripping fixed the arma mod scene

chilly silo
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But more ripping drives modders out of the scene...

faint nacelle
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more ripping = less mods

pure minnow
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more instances of someone's work != more mods

spare osprey
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Where does the content come from ? If you say there are no mods but you rip a vest from RHS and reupload it how does that help?

faint nacelle
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Like I said, these guys are here just to waste time.

woeful quarry
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better to have an open discussion at least

faint nacelle
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there is nothing productive in this discussion, these guys are adamant supporters of ripping

spare osprey
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I’m not trying to be a dick. I want to understand the opposite side of the argument. But I haven’t really seen one.

woeful quarry
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i get what they're going for, which is that the attempts to stop it dont seem to stem the tide, but i also dont really understand whats accomplished then

spare osprey
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You think I have morals

woeful quarry
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blackout exactly how does stopping the DMCA's and stuff benefit the community

chilly silo
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LMAO - I think you have that backwards to justify your own opinion.

woeful quarry
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so what are you accomplishing by saying this

wheat belfry
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To weigh in my two cents here. A big problem with it (from my point of view and experience) is that the whole us vs them thing is way disproportionate. Rippers are not people who use ripped mods. I personally don’t care about mods ripped from other games (it is illegal but I show complete indifference to it). I do however disapprove of ripping from other mod makers. The problem with the toxicity in the arma modding community is that people categorise the guys who use the mods as villains when 60% of them have no clue where the mod they’re using is coming from. A lack of gear from the public modding community, led to people doing it their own way. People who don’t do the modding stuff as a profession or hobby and thus just Lego together stuff in Obj Builder.

I’ve seen instances of people who have no clue that a mod they’re using is ripped getting crucified for it, not spoken to like a person because the modders are sick of ripping and refuse to compromise on definition of ripper. I had an experience where I was confronted by a public modder and called a ripper because my mates joked about it (as I had used ripped mods). Was on holiday and it was infuriating knowing that I hadn’t done any of the shit accused of and it was all based on ‘what was heard’

Another thing is the gate keeping of mod knowledge. There are so many talented modders in the community that could easily release a tutorial on how to mod for arma. My experience with BI wiki was abysmal, didn’t learn a thing. Hopped in a call with a mate and I did. It’d be so easy for someone to make a video and it’d encourage people doing stuff in the community massively.

My personal opinion, not to step on toes.

woeful quarry
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the gate keeping thing is true, sometimes its incredibly difficult to get information because people are so close with it

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it applies to other communites as well but I've found it incredibly difficult to learn a lot of things here because of the lack of tutorials and guidance

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seems most of it is second hand

wheat belfry
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Arma community is just toxic in every part of it

faint nacelle
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gate keeping?

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so were blaming the mod makers now

sinful pivot
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People like a26mike are trying to help fix that, he's got an entire discord of references and assets to help people get into modding for arma, but I do agree that up to date knowledge is hard to find

faint nacelle
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for not being 247 support and spending their time writing tutorials instead of making the stuff they want to make

woeful quarry
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i mean.. yeah? When someone refuses to share their knowledge with others it can be very frustrating

spare osprey
wheat belfry
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I’ve asked modders how to do things before and been blanked, or linked a shitty article on the wiki

woeful quarry
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well that's just a personal choice saying "I don't want to do this" and then they're shocked when people take what they've made because they're incapable of making anything good themselves

woeful quarry
faint nacelle
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All the information I had to use 8 years ago when I started modding is still available

woeful quarry
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I'm glad he's helping though

faint nacelle
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its completely learnable

chilly silo
# wheat belfry To weigh in my two cents here. A big problem with it (from my point of view and ...

There are so many talented modders in the community that could easily release a tutorial on how to mod for arma.
It takes a lot of effort to make tutorials. But the other side of the coin here is almost no one actually asks for Tutorials.

Again 20 years in this community and hundreds of mods and models done (as well as tuts) my experience is people will just take the lazy route and rip rather than take the time to learn.

And that is self defeating because the people with the knowledge are so f'd off from having their stuff stolen they just cant be arsed to make the effort to make tutorials for selfish people.

woeful quarry
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a lot of things have changed in 8 years and honestly I can barely learn shit with the materials already provided on youtube that I'm trying to accumulate

half cosmos
woeful quarry
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they're all incredibly low views too

spare osprey
faint nacelle
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@half cosmos yes. BI forums still exists

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and wiki exists with double or triple the pages it had back then

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I do understand that there is steep learning curve

sinful pivot
faint nacelle
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I spent about 6 months trying out stuff to get stuff working right

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but to say this stuff cant be learned is just big WTH for me

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though youtube tutorials mostly dont help

spare osprey
woeful quarry
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the easier you can help people learn the complexities and basics of making their own mods and models and such, the less need for ripped mods there would be in my mind

sure people are always going to do the easy route but

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It's at least an option

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teach a man to fish and all that

faint nacelle
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would you be surprised most people dont like that

sinful pivot
woeful quarry
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wdym goat

spare osprey
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I do agree many are dated

faint nacelle
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many have enough wrong information to mess up beginners work

spare osprey
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If you have any suggestions, that you recommend I can add them to my list

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But we are going way off topic now

faint nacelle
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unfortunately I dont, I have limited time to do modding and I dont keep up with tutorials

spare osprey
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No worries thanks for everything you do

faint nacelle
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That said, for people saying modders sit on their knowledge, consider this.

A guy has been slowly learning modding for 5+ years and is in position to now make stuff he wants.
Due to the time spent in learning hes now got life obligations and limited time to do the modding he enjoys.
Now he could also spend his time (days, weeks maybe) putting together a tutorial of what he knows (of which he would not enjoy doing because writing comprehensive and easy to understand text is hard) OR
he could spend his limited time creating new things which he enjoys.

Now where in this is the toxicity?

wheat belfry
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It was never said the act of modding knowledge being gatekept was toxic. Could argue that BI should’ve made an in depth tutorial for modding into arma. But the point I was trying to make is that knowledge is not publicly available and can only hinder the mod community because less can get involved

faint nacelle
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But there is vast amount of knowledge available completely public

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nothing is hidden

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sure its not curated into 1 easy to comprehend place

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and Lou will spank us tomorrow for all the offtopic spam

spare osprey
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I agree

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The thing with arma it has quarks that take awhile to understand or even know.

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My favorite line is this should work but it doesn’t

sinful pivot
wheat belfry
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Yeah I agree with you there

stable zealot
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Anyone taking the angle of "Stop focusing energy on DMCA!" Does not understand how fast and easy it is to DMCA

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It literally takes 10x longer for someone to reupload a mod somewhere than it does to DMCA. That's a net positive in favour of the original creator

coral egret
stable zealot
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Devils advocate, 99% of the reason I look in this channel is to laugh. There is some hilarious shit that happens here

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But anyone that reckons they're "outsmarting" a DMCA by reuploading, you're having to work way harder than anyone on the other end just FYI

wispy frost
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meh i got pinged but no message there. have looked 3 times

carmine folio
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can you guys just get a life?

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honestly. taking stuff from other modders is crappy, but nobody cares if a dent is put in activision's yearly revenue

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all of the USP guys and your henchmen sorting by new on steam for private mods to DMCA

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i swear if they actually spent the time making new stuff and sorting out their arsenal and loading time problems, as well as making good assets that people actually want

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TFL and the likes would not be a problem because everyone would be using their stuff

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some of you genuinely need to actually mind your own business, get a life, and just let BI actually handle the IP violations that are genuinely important

stable zealot
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While ever the mods have our content in them, it is our business

carmine folio
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what business?

haughty torrent
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If yall so against rippers, wasnt ardy a dev for usp. The man the myth the legend behind ST11

carmine folio
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are you profiting from it?

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no

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are the rippers profiting from it?

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no

carmine folio
stable zealot
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Drop USP content out and USP has zero reason to DMCA. ezpz

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I'm not involved in that side of things but I believe there are gloves, boots, mag pouches, MGP gear and some other stuff

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I'm not really up to speed, I only really make mods stuff I don't really buy into the "legal battle" side of things

stable zealot
carmine folio
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how is this a reasonable excuse to destroy the modding community?

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i just dont get this dumb shit of DMCA

stable zealot
carmine folio
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why should modders of all people care about legal stuff

stable zealot
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I've said it a hundred times, but if TFL and a lot of those other mods dropped all the ripped shit they actually have some really quality content. There's literally only like 20% ripped shit in there, I don't know why it hasn't been dropped out because TBQH it wouldn't be a bad stand alone mod with the stuff that's actually been made or commissioned

carmine folio
stable zealot
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It's super easy and people don't do it

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So it's easier to just DMCA and walk away

carmine folio
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and destroy the modding community

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seems logical

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destroy is harsh

stable zealot
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It's not the modding community, it's the reuploading community

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The people making shit keep on going fine

carmine folio
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this DMCA walk away

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makes the community toxic

stable zealot
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It's a result of an already toxic community, the roots are far deeper than that

haughty torrent
stable zealot
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As was being discussed the other day, people used to try and educate or ask nicely and it didn't get you anywhere at all. People would just laugh at you and keep doing what they were doing

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Just DMCAing isn't toxic, it's just refusing to engage at a deeper level

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With my own personal mod ACWP I don't really go chasing DMCAs myself, when I do find people have reuploaded it I just jump in their discord and I let them know when an update comes out they might have issues updating so it would be better if they just added it as a dependency, but that works for me because 95% of the people who want to use an Australian mod are... Australians

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And it's super chill

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I've found anything involving certain other nationalities just gets really, really hostile really fast

carmine folio
stable zealot
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If you guys think the Arma community is toxic, don't go anywhere near the Halo community lol

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I got banned off the Halo discord for saying the new Armour looks bad, Arma is literally watered down as anything

stiff jasper
hallow idol
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People who think Arma Community is toxic haven't seen what toxic is. The most "toxic" parts of arma community are the IP people vs reuploadeds, where one side thinks a copied file is as bad as pedofilia while the other think that they are the funniest troll in the world for uploading 'speshäl förses möd #6382'. And it isn't toxic, its literally just personal drama against each other, which seems to have started a few years ago being kicked off with some extremely unlikely people trying to make themselves relevant by removing mods for "theft", with a few of the things being removed being actual original content.
I had no connection to either of the sides back then, and as an outsider I saw that as somebody taking something personal to a community level, and abusing their position to have a bigger hammer to swing. If I, random person n9631 sees that, means others do too, and other people felt that as their awakening to start a holy crusade against those IP people, both good and bad.

sinful pivot
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I think this discussion won't really get sorted here ever, since most of the time the discussion is between "by the book" modders, who follow the guidelines and discuss things in here, and the "private modders" who are going against the guidelines, and are not participating directly in discussion here. So you end up with people from two echo chambers trying to discus a point where neither side is going to really sway. You get people coming in here crusading on behalf of private modders and rippers, who all argue the same points: "the mod looks cool and adds stuff people haven't yet. You don't get paid for it, what's the problem? etc. etc..." and the same answer is given out time and time again to the point where the SOP for people championing groups like TFL is purge ban on sight, cause it's all going to go the same way.

The stance from the admins here and BI staff is set in stone, and their responses are never going to change until BI and Steam's stance does, and people coming in here and asking the same questions over and over isn't going to do that. It doesn't help that the perception of a lot of these private groups gets tainted by people coming in here, acting like children and then cry out like it's a direct attack on the private groups, cause there are groups out there that I'm sure have assets that they made for their group, that they just don't want to share, and that's fine.

hallow idol
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By reuploads I don't mean rippers, I mean people who do nothing but copy PBOs and upload them to the workshop, adding nothing to value to "proper" modders or "ripper" modders

stable zealot
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The other thing is people seem to have a warped perception of how many hours we spend DMCAing stuff that could be spent making new shit. If you're looking for something to blame for USP not moving faster blame work, study, kids, wife, other hobbies and generally being older than 25 and not having an insane amount of spare time to give to arma anymore. I think a vast majority of IP shit is hilarious, some of the things that are borderline illegal I don't love but there's some hilarious content that comes out of it

hallow idol
stable zealot
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The way I personally view the dynamic is someone uploads the same copy of TFL to steam with 127 pictures of rats in the files, I laugh, it gets DMCA'd. It pops up again somewhere else

sinful pivot
hallow idol
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I personally think its not true, since how easy it is to fill a DMCA, and is just one of the many cope-tier excuses used, its still what most people see, and they believe the words of the people on top I guess

proud basalt
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i think 99% of the people here need a beer

stable zealot
sinful pivot
stable zealot
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haha

proud basalt
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ninja fixed blobdoggoninja

hallow idol
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That's the point, it's not life changing. It doesn't hurt the modder to do a DMCA the way the reuploaders think it does

stable zealot
hallow idol
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However, people think it does because of how much of a big thing IP people make it

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Like in a divorce, both sides are always at fault

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And both sides are always to stubborn to see it

stable zealot
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To me where IP shit is a bigger deal is when it's made some guys remove their shit and leave

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Like there was a sick Aussie Commando kit mod, it's where a lot of the TFL stuff comes from

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The Crye back panel, the AVS, the BFG pouch, the juggernaut case

hallow idol
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That is also a cope tier excuse. I personally don't believe that is the reason most of the people say they leave is

stable zealot
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The really sad part is because people kept ripping their shit, those guys abandoned the project

hallow idol
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Some might be the case, but most use it as an excuse to stop modding where they already wanted to in the first place

sinful pivot
hallow idol
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"some", I know the aus mod is serious about that claim

stable zealot
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They were mostly professional CG artists who were doing it for fun. So they fucked off to a different game engine

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I'm only really caught up about the Aus mod, because I am Australian and now I've got fewer cool mods to choose from as a result

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It's literally one of the only holdups I have in the whole situation

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Shits me off because it's a niche area and now there's even less variety than before

hallow idol
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But the most who use that excuse probably want to stop modding as a whole in the first place, and simply use it as an escape or cope since they don't believe themselves to want to quit. But some people simply don't have the same time to mod as in A1 and A2 days, because, simply - time has passed

stable zealot
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Agreed

hallow idol
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People now have families, jobs, and other activities that are (hopefully) more important than modding

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So they simply have no more time (and it takes lot) to mod the game

stable zealot
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That's where the USP bottleneck is

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There's a dozen or more guys involved and only 2-3 active at any one time

sinful pivot
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some times it's the last straw that broke their back, but you could argue that if it wasn't the case they might still be working, but this all ends up as personal decisions, there is really no objectivity in these scenarios

hallow idol
#

Arma is a boomer game, most of the active players are old people, especially those from A2 and before days - that is why most vets here say "modding is dying", while the rippers saying the opposite - "its the most alive it's been"

#

People see the different sides of the same coin, old players seeing old players leaving, young players see young players joining

stable zealot
#

From a completely objective POV I just don't think ripped shit looks good. People say they're churning out shitloads of assets and sure they might have a high count but most of them just look really unpolished

hallow idol
#

Quality vs quantity

stable zealot
#

Going back to TFL, I honestly think the best looking bits are the parts they made in house or commissioned

onyx iron
#

It is kinda interesting how "over the top" copyright is.
The innovation I've spent years making? Not protected at all, if I make a product out of it I can patent it with much extra work and only if I haven't released it beforehand.

The two lines of code I have on github? Copyright until 70 years after I'm dead. So well into 2100s (fingers crossed).

stable zealot
#

Shit from Tarkov or COD just looks jarring in arma, it doesn't fit

hallow idol
#

Inhouse is indeed the best looking parts by far, and I was under the impression at this point 99% of it is inhouse already, but different ppl say different things so can't be sure

stable zealot
#

I think we are all pretty much on the same page of "I just want to use cool shit in arma"

#

I think you just named two of my big problems too lol, good at modelling and consistent

stiff jasper
#

I remember someone saying that RHS mags or pouches are "adapted" because those should be open-source, noone wants to make those small details over and over again having thousands of variations within the workshop.

stable zealot
#

We have a lot of models from OMA but still need a lot of work done to get polycounts decent, do LODs etc etc

#

And I know MY consistency sucks ass

#

I've been working on our MCX for fricken AGES

sinful pivot
#

meanwhile scripters are a dime a dozen and have such varying quality that everyone uses, cause if you don't know you just kinda accept that this small headlight mod completely destroys server performance

#

but there's also a massive difference in culture between artists and coders. Coders for the most part have always been on the more open side of copyright, since there's no point in re-inventing the wheel for the millionth time, especially for single parts

hallow idol
#

I came from working and studying 3D modeling before I started doing Arma, and I didnt understand it for a long time. Somebody using my assets would be flattering for me

#

Later down the line I think I've got it, since it's a difference in mentality. People don't have the same views in life, so some feel like doing X is bad while others would never see how that could be ever the case

sinful pivot
#

most of the artists I've met don't mind their work being shared, but they really draw the line at their work being taken and/or modified and then being passed off as not theirs anymore

hallow idol
#

A very big part of that is nationality/race/etc. Some people are simply more prone to mindlessly following a rule because 'it's a rule', while some are more likely to say 'a rule is only a rule when you get caught'

#

And obviously everything in between those two

carmine folio
hallow idol
hallow idol
# carmine folio yea

Synder reminded me of a big case for national differences. Stalker modders for Arma (and in general) give 0 damn about what is done with their mods, they even encourage it. "want an English translation? Make it yourself", and the community seems to be friendly too. Probably would say its the polar opposite of e.g. Arma starsim, a good example of different mentalities on similar matters

#

I've seen people pay for vanilla .paa files
👁️ 👁️

compact stump
#

What you're seeing is likely a jaded effect that has been going on much much longer.

I cant say for certain but it seemed to me to really begin taking effect with later iterations of "life" mods.

proud basalt
#

Makes you wonder why they dont play battlefront2/halo

woeful quarry
#

I'm surprised how much this is in contention

#

there's an equal amount of people who dont care about ripping and who do care

#

or at least it seems that way

#

fun to read

stable zealot
# woeful quarry fun to read

Basically why I'm here. I don't really care too much aside from a few edge cases so otherwise it's just a fun read for me

hallow idol
woeful quarry
#

they keep bringing up different points

#

so its at least interesting to browse

#

since i have no kind of say in this conversation anyways as i dont use ripped mods nor make any

#

i just kinda take mods off the workshop and that's that lol

stable zealot
#

I feel like I'm pretty in the middle as far as these things go

#

Some people get very, very lawyer-y about it all

#

My fucks to give basically extend as far as my own shit, australian shit and I also find any star wars shit insanely funny to watch go up in flames

#

I think we can all agree, there's nothing better than watching starsim people try and defend their point

woeful quarry
#

thats honestly a fair take even if its selfish in nature

stable zealot
#

I just want to avoid fighting battles that are not my own

woeful quarry
#

i'm never goign to touch australian equipment so that doesn't really matter to me but

#

the general conversation of "these popular guys might leave if this keeps up" is worth talkinga bou

hallow idol
#

Arma lifers

stable zealot
#

it's not my business what people do to other IP, it's not my copywrite to defend

#

So there's no point in me getting worked up about it

woeful quarry
#

fair take

stable zealot
#

Eg; I could be like "Reeeee you're taking activisions IP!!!"

woeful quarry
#

i'm mostly here to advertise my unit

#

but this is at least an interesting chat

autumn glacier
#

For me personally, it's simple. Someone creates something in their spare time and makes it available to the community for free. In return, I abide by his conditions and respect his terms.

#

And even though I sometimes read "But others do it too", that's not a free pass to violate applicable laws or terms and conditions. Because just uploading mods on Steam, for example, you explicitly confirm that you own the rights to the work you upload.

stable zealot
#

Basically

compact stump
#

a bit off topic here but are 3d modellers really that scarce?

hallow idol
#

Good, consistent, and dedicated ones are

#

Anybody can download bl*nder and make a square

#

Not everybody can do that in a reasonable amount of time, make it properly, and actually deliver it

wispy frost
# compact stump a bit off topic here but are 3d modellers really that scarce?

to specify. yeah.
for arma its even harder. u usually need someone who knows his job, and who does not scam you. as T00T said.
in arma its even a bit harder since u have more specific stuff to do and you also need someone who knows what arma needs to make it a proper thing ingame. the best 3d model can look like crap ingame if it doesnt fits the game needs.
and yeah next point is the money. to get someone like this you usually have to spend loads of money if you arent friends with someone who can do this for you

stable zealot
#

As far as a surface level consumers system to just browse mods and play them, it does the trick

#

We use A3sync and Git for our unit shit for obvious reasons

onyx iron
#

It's not about being smart, the workshop gives you free storage, bandwidth and easy access. Why bother setting up a3sync and teaching everyone how to use it for a single mod.

spare osprey
#

You are free to allow people to reupload your stuff. It’s not flattering to reupload something because you changed a skin or something. My whole point is to join the official team and or contribute, it’s not a hard concept. Im about open development and letting the community contribute. What I’m against is people having the audacity to think they are special because they can rip something or the “I’m not charging so I can do what I want mentality”. The time that creators spend making assets when they can be doing other things should not be dismissed as insignificant.

stable zealot
# onyx iron It's not about being smart, the workshop gives you free storage, bandwidth and e...

Version control, the ability to roll back updates, the ability to choose when you update large mods (especially if they update 30min before op night starts), the ability to host unit mods without needing to upload them to the workshop, the ability to quickly and easily make changes to your data repository and have everyone on the same version, easy to get new people on board with unit mods, easy to define mod folders to dictate what mods should always be loaded, what mods are optional (Whitelisted) and what mods are for specific events

#

If you have the tech ability, hosting an A3sync is the best way to curate unit mods without a doubt

#

There's just a decent "tech knowledge" barrier or entry

#

The workshop is a nice "bandaid fix" that "just works" for people who just want to load mods and go but as far as being user friendly or boasting features it's not where I'd stay TBQH

onyx iron
#

I only disagreed with the "being smart" part. Yes a3sync is superior but it comes with some significant set up time (if you aren't familiar) and you need a server to host it all.

stable zealot
#

Agreed

novel goblet
#

Don't forget that the official launcher dumps mods into the same game folder, and you have to move each manually.. I symlinked (junction) that off to a separate disk...

hallow idol
#

Steam Workshop > Change Visibility > Friends Only

spare osprey
#

I think the frustration with the other side is they started as a rip then put years of work into something, but it not allowed because it has ripped content

hallow idol
#

*boom*

#

Mind blown, and you don't need A3Sync

stable zealot
hallow idol
#

No

stable zealot
#

To me the big, big thing is still version control

#

Nothing worse than ACE updating out of nowhere and fucking all your shit up right before an op

hallow idol
#

I was told crawler doesn't find anything that is unlisted, friends only, or private

#

And from the (very little) testing I did, it didn't either

manic laurel
#

yeah, that's also not the channel's topic so let's halt it there.
and let's NOT defend ripping here, thank you 👀

echo orchid
#

some people here don't even understand what ripping means in the context

chilly silo
# echo orchid some people here don't even understand what ripping means in the context

I struggle to see how it can be confusing tbh

Rippers = Someone that 'rips' aka steals content from existing addon or other games.
Re-uploaders = Someone that reuploads existing content without editing it.
Screenshot maker = Someone that uses publicly available content to make screenshots.
Dodgy Screenshot maker = Someone that uses ripped content (some of the time) to make screenshots. Sometimes unknowingly or with fulll knowledge of what they are doing but usually after they've been "educated" previously.

Anyone else think we need to define any more terms?

runic wraith
# carmine folio all of the USP guys and your henchmen sorting by new on steam for private mods t...

Actually we only go after mods which contain our assets, which is 100% our business. We don't dmca on behalf of Activision or anyone else. Don't care if its just one model, the uploader can remove it very easily and then you don't have to worry about us taking it down. But in the case of TFL, which also contains RHS assets among others, its not only us that will be throwing dmcas their way. If its not your upload or your assets then it sounds like you are the one not minding your own business and have no say in the matter.

molten kraken
chilly silo
manic laurel
chilly silo
manic laurel
#

argh, it does not exist anymore (Valve reply) Ded'!

manic laurel
soft egret
#

ehhh

#

I'm pretty sure that was the screenshot that Rock posted

#

Yes it was the message and screenshot posted by Rock in here in may this year, he seems to have deleted it and with it the attached image

languid elbow
echo orchid
echo orchid
echo orchid
runic wraith
#

Ok? That makes what difference to me? Did you have a point in stating this?

#

Regardless where they go, or where they download their mods from, if it contains our assets it will still be taken down.

chilly silo
devout umbra
runic wraith
dapper lotus
#

I think the leniency some devs offer with their original content is often taken for granted, which is why it's mild culture shock that someone is invested in protecting theirs. But, it does belong to them and they have every right to

soft egret
#

"How do they dare to protect their own hard work, unbelievable, we need to boycott them!" 🙄

steady hatch
soft egret
#

I think we would all appreciate new well made non-ripped content

steady hatch
#

Ok then I will remove every ripped from tfl and upload it

runic wraith
manic laurel
#

also, a DMCA that is not filed by the owner is moot and quite frowned upon in here too.

steady hatch
runic wraith
steady hatch
stuck ledge
#

there's a difference between asking first and just doing, more than likely if you ask before doing, people will be a bit more chill towards allowing it

steady hatch
#

I’m a neutral party

faint nacelle
manic laurel
#

don't play dumber ^^

runic wraith
# steady hatch I’m a neutral party

Seeing your comments here leads me to believe otherwise. But in any case, no permission will be given for TFL or any of its affiliates to use any assets of ours

carmine folio
#

I know Webknight had tons of people requesting that stuff for his Melee content recently too

steady hatch
manic laurel
runic wraith
#

USP is poop anyways, why would you guys need anything from us?

carmine folio
runic wraith
# carmine folio facts /s

Just strange that you guys require our assets to complete your mod, must be used to using shitty stuff.

carmine folio
#

what you mean you guys?

#

i'm not in TFL, or any of the other splitoffs

steady hatch
#

Same here

carmine folio
#

i don't make my own ripped mods either

runic wraith
#

Thats fine, I still bundle you all together

carmine folio
#

fair

#

i mean to be honest with you, i do actually think that a lot of the higher up guys in this community are kinda douchebags and quite unsavory figures

steady hatch
manic laurel
#

!ban @carmine folio 90d lame trolling 🤡 bring arguments next time, thank you for participating

edgy coralBOT
torpid hull
#

Mans got called a douchebag and banned him 😆

steady hatch
#

I don’t think that’s trolling

manic laurel
#

name-calling is against the rules, trolling as well

steady hatch
#

Ok

runic wraith
#

Welp, anywho, I believe this conversation has extended beyond anything IP related, so good day to you.

hallow idol
#

It was a conversation until people started attacking others

manic laurel
#

let's not have a conversation about the conversation 😄

steady hatch
#

Try to improve yourself and your mod

manic laurel
#

!ban @steady hatch 90d lame trolling 🤡 thank you for participating, if you have an interesting thing to say don't hesitate next time

edgy coralBOT
winged lintel
runic wraith
#

Honestly, that sums it up perfectly.

woeful quarry
#

i mean

"it doesnt matter if you don't utilize ripped mods, you're all the same to me" is how you incite people to react

#

like that

manic laurel
woeful quarry
#

how are they known to do that? they in a server?

manic laurel
#

yes, and names go 'round too

runic wraith
#

Yeah they aren't the most secretive crowd, couldn't even keep their mod 'private' for long. But that can be expected when they continue to try and draw attention to themselves

analog pine
manic laurel
analog pine
manic laurel
spare osprey
#

I wasn’t trying to cause drama over posting of the mod. I don’t spend my time looking for ripped content, however if I do find obviously shady. I’ll drop a link in here so if it effects anyone including BI some one can take the appropriate actions if they feel it’s necessary. There are reupload’s of the H-60 mod that I haven’t taken action against because I understand the intent and it wasn’t malicious.

I’ve been threatened with a ban over the fort Jackson map (I had full permission), This channel has significantly improved since then.

I appreciate @manic laurel @carmine foliomen and the other BI devs/ moderators that continue to go above beyond what’s needed in this channel and Arma in general. From dedmen making all the impressive updates to the engine, to Lou and all the work he has done to the wiki. They are the reason why arma modding is as great as it is today, not rippers.

echo orchid
#

There are reupload’s of the H-60 mod that I haven’t taken action against because I understand the intent and it wasn’t malicious.
There is a difference between re-uploading (no modification) of certain pbos and direct ripping meshes and parts of meshes and including these as your own,

hushed niche
#

Oh he’s banned banned did not realize that for a minute

spare osprey
# echo orchid `There are reupload’s of the H-60 mod that I haven’t taken action against becaus...

Im assuming the early comment of not understanding the difference was directed at me. I understand the difference its not a hard concept. I don’t see the value correcting me on a moot point. My use of the term was correct this case.

Regardless of the sub classification of ripping vs reuploading, permission needs to be attained from the author prior to any action.

If I read into your comment the wrong way, I apologize. RKSL rock made a great response regarding difference and further explaining it, to anyone that might not know.

chilly silo
# spare osprey Im assuming the early comment of not understanding the difference was directed a...

If I read into your comment the wrong way, I apologize. RKSL rock made a great response regarding difference and further explaining it, to anyone that might not know.
Its easy to forget we are often dealing with many different languages and people with different skill levels all translating into English. Not everyone has the same level of comprehension.

Defining terms seems like the best way to go...so many people mis-use the terms. its one of the reasons i started the IP blog page.

... I'm talking to a guy in Taiwan via google translate atm. The results are both hilarious and frustrating at the same time. So perhaps a bit of patience on all sides would not a bad thing. And it would help a lot if some people would stop trolling and just be honest about their own agendas.

spare osprey
#

All good points, I was mildly frustrated this morning and I didn’t understand why a term I used correctly, definition was explained to me. I took it as polite you don’t know what your talking about and I’m going to correct you response.

As far as this channel and the discussion I enjoy to see all side of the argument. I didn’t know what IP or a licenses was when I started modding. While some view points are extreme on both sides, there is value to the conversation.

As far as the trolls go, I wish more people were mature enough to have a conversations and change their viewpoint. On the other side there are of alot of Dunning-Kruger effect lawyers in this channel.

chilly silo
#

The problem is most people seem to believe that their view and only their view is correct. They aren't willing to do the research or take a moment to look at the issue from someone else's point of view. Or they are simply desperate trolls trying to confuse the issue so that they can justify their own actions. or they just want to feel special and important for a few minutes in their otherwise very dull and sad lives. They got off on trying to stir up trouble.

Re the implementation of the rules here: I'll be honest, a lot of what get said here makes me uncomfortable for varying reasons and I now only tend to post when someone makes the most outrageous claims. Or i feel that i can help by adding an explanation or correction. I don't typically to follow the issues here but most of what is said when it comes to interpreting the law is either factually wrong or misguided at best. I'm not a lawyer but I do have experience of IP issues and contracts and I do post links to prove my statements - unlike some Trolls i could mention 😉

I just think its important that everyone understand the terms. I don't see anything wrong with making people aware of the reasons for DMCA's, the law behind it all and why ripping is not helping anyone. But for me it boils down to simple ethics. Stealing anything is wrong and I just don't see why people don't ask questions if they don't know how to do something.

i seem to keep saying this - I would not know half of what i've learnt over the years if the people in this community had not answered my questions and guided me towards resources. Nor would I have made as many friends as I have in the process. You will always get more by talking to other creators than you will by ripping them off.

haughty torrent
runic wraith
# haughty torrent That could be said about both sides of the argument, like someone stated earlier...

Whether they care or not doesn't make it any less of an issue when dealing with IP theft. If they truly didn't care then they wouldn't accept someone dmca'ing their content, its only pixels right? But of course they back down when faced with actual legal action because they know they are in the wrong and would lose that case. Free content or not, its still owned by someone which holds all the rights to it. Anyone thinking otherwise is just being ignorant and playing dumb to the facts.

half cosmos
haughty torrent
plain rivet
#

To quote someone from the Steam Workshop, “Ripping ain’t bad, it’s just another style”

#

That’s the mind set of these thiefs

manic laurel
#

I prefer to say before anything goes down again:

if we are to discuss whether or not ripping is OK or not (from a modder or another game)
it is not
and it is not to be debated here.

haughty torrent
#

yeah but we already got into discussion on "thief's" and asking for permission is asking for permission. That means the entirety of IP rights which include trademarks

haughty torrent
half cosmos
#

i don’t have an argument

hushed niche
#

I think the point he’s making is that this channel isn’t to discuss the philosophical implications of ripping in general, there’s more to IP then just rippers

carmine folio
lapis stratus
manic laurel
#

!ban @carmine folio @lapis stratus 0 name-calling, flaming and defending IP theft

edgy coralBOT
manic laurel
#

enough BS, back to business

haughty torrent
manic laurel
#

yep - he also says nothing for 2 months and appears when someone states something against rippers 😉

haughty torrent
#

I feel Thats a reach and he was more so banned off of speculation, but this is the wrong channel to discuss that and there doesn’t seem to be a channel to voice those complaints so guess it is what it is

manic laurel
#

(and if I made a mistake, I will admit it and amend it, but here, it is let's say… highly unlikely)

echo orchid
echo orchid
runic wraith
# haughty torrent My argument isnt supporting rippers

Guess its just coincidence that you only choose to bring your arguments when ripped content and those using it is discussed here, and always presented in a way that makes it seem like you are defending them...or at least trying to. 'Permission is permission' One has no relation to the other, so why would you even keep bringing this up? Its almost as though you are suggesting that since some of us legitimate modders haven't acquired permission to use the trademarks in our artistic representations of a companies products (which is quite far from causing confusion among their consumers, which to my understanding seems to be a big part of what courts look for in cases dealing with trademark infringement), then that makes it okay by your thinking for rippers to take what they like (which has absolutely no good reasoning behind it or way in which it can be considered ok apart from spoiled children not accepting being told 'no you can't have this'). And last I checked, BI makes the rules here, so what they choose to tolerate for their game isn't your call to make.

onyx iron
haughty torrent
hushed niche
haughty torrent
# runic wraith Guess its just coincidence that you only choose to bring your arguments when rip...

I do not post rip content on the workshop, it has all been legit so it seems like yall do a lot of speculation here. You are also assuming what i am suggesting from either miscommunication on my part or you just enjoy reaching. My points have not defended ripping in anyway, every argument i have had was to keep this channel relevant and not biased or cherry pick towards IP rights. If we expect permissions, that should be across the board

haughty torrent
runic wraith
# haughty torrent I do not post rip content on the workshop, it has all been legit so it seems lik...

Maybe not on the workshop...but I won't go into that here. No need to speculate when I have proof saying/showing otherwise. Anyhow, I guess if you want to keep circling around to the idea that if we don't get permission for trademarks then rippers don't need permission to use our assets, then by all means. Not here to make you understand the vast difference in those two things. So in reality its down to whoever wishes to enforce protecting their IP. We could be served a C&D for using a trademark just like those mods on the workshop could be served with a DMCA by Capcom or Activision, but unfortunately for the thieves, we will enforce protecting our IP as do others here in this community.

haughty torrent
# runic wraith Maybe not on the workshop...but I won't go into that here. No need to speculate ...

the only idea im circling is u cant cherry pick the law, you are either with it or against it. To flat out ignore permissions required is "theft" so yes in my eyes rippers and modders who cut corners are equally responsible for deliberately ignoring laws put in place. Just because it doesn't match your agenda doesn't make your cherry picked interpretation any better. I do not respect those that cut corners for their own benefit while bashing others for doing the same. That is where the hypocrisy comes from, but i dont expect anyone here to agree. As this is the small place where yall unite.

runic wraith
hushed niche
# onyx iron Not sure about US law but in Germany (should be similar enough) trademarks are o...

It’s actually really interesting how far some companies have managed to push what can be protected, I had no idea that individual game mechanics can and have been patented before until recently. Namely Crazy Taxi, The Mass Effect dialogue wheel/system, and the Nemesis System from Shadow of Mordor are patented and protected designs

I find the Nemesis system one to actually be quite frustrating seeing as it’s such an amazing piece of tech and it’s really disappointing only one company is allowed to use or innovate it

glacial fox
#

@manic laurel On a banning rampage...

manic laurel
grim dagger
hasty gale
#

given how old the game is its likely not a rip probably an ip issue tho

vivid wave
#

Also the link https://vk.link/arma3_3d_models shows a lot of models in sale

fallen gale
#

p3ds?

vivid wave
#

The description says it's Arma ready

faint nacelle
hasty gale
#

didnt watch the video looks like it probably is was thinking it was higher quality for no reason

half cosmos
#

Yeah, the pictures almost look high quality but the video proves they’re 1:1 from the game.

echo orchid
# haughty torrent **Trademarks are protected by intellectual property rights** straight off the WI...

let me rephrase, considering i have miss-used some terms in haste

  • Intellectual Property is indeed the sort of umbrella that covers indeed more than digital creation, or creative work.
    that being said, just like as i said, things are not to be confused, considering
    a. trademarks - are (at least in US, EU, AUS) registered at a local trademark body, and can be accessed/verified worldwide
    b. patents - are also registered, and covers inventions. Also, the exclusive registration has an expiration date
    c. copyrights - where this is about - copyrights is provided (most of times) without direct registration. Proof of ownership needs to be provided in all cases, if it comes down to lawsuit.
#

in short, while i understand the general concern, you do not seem to understand that most people around here have checked with different weapon/gear manufacturers for some sort of permission to use their trademarks if possible.

delicate hamlet
faint nacelle
#

occasionally BI purges obvious stuff like that from Workshop

delicate hamlet
#

Thats what I though. But yet the RE8 mod is still up.

keen trout
wispy frost
#

i said i totally understand why it is as it is.
but then i have a question regardin this topic. is "referencing" allowed? like its often done in movies. doing references to other mods and so on.

#

also wouldnt be, for example, arma star wars mods also be a kind of infringement?

hushed niche
#

We really need to start pinning some of these topics because they are answered literally every other day

#

Just search Star Wars in the search bar or scroll up or something

#

But technically yes it is

wispy frost
#

ok thanks

hushed niche
#

None of them have been removed because Disney hasn’t DMCA’d any of them, though I think SWOP was at one point

wispy frost
#

i fear games workshops warhammer banhammer

hushed niche
#

I don’t think they will actually go through with that policy change, at least in the current iteration, it’s like PR suicide for a company with a renowned homebrew scene to just nuke the entire thing, it would destroy their brand

#

There’s no way they’ll actually do it

wispy frost
hushed niche
#

Anyways that’s my opinion on that matter I am going to sleep because this conversation has drifted far from Arma

keen trout
faint nacelle
onyx iron
#

Mainly problems arise when people make money from established IPs without obtaining proper licences from IP owner.
One could argue that is the main purpose of IP laws.

manic laurel
#

that and/or damaging a potential market
and/or damaging the license's representation

e.g Disney wants to make a Star Wars shooter, but people are not interested because Arma does it so well and it's free = no sales

or people make a mod where Master Chief gets ridiculed all the time/shown as useless = "hurting" IP's reputation

money may be the main reason but these are close second ones

compact stump
#

They shouldnt let EA make the next battlefront then

onyx iron
wispy frost
#

i do totally understand that gw has the rights to do so but their way of doing it is not very lucky. making about nearly the full fanbase angry on you seems to be not that succesful tho.
im also a believer of that thing if there is good fanmade content the fans are more interested in the content from wg themselves and the community feels more accepted.

@compact stump i wouldnt allow ea to make any game. would rather prefer some other studio or even some indi

#

by the way wasnt warhammer a humorous (sorry i dont know how to write that word) attempt to mock and make fun of older scifi-stuff like starwars? i remember the first inquisitors name was obiwan-sherlock-clousseau

carmine folio
#

hello

#

I want to ask a question

#

How is ripped assets from COD modern warfare allowed in gmod

manic laurel
carmine folio
#

does COD care about it?

manic laurel
#

most likely, you can report it to them

carmine folio
#

thats fine

#

it looks cool, even though it rips assets

manic laurel
#

@carmine folio we don't do that here.
praising ripping content gets you out fast

carmine folio
#

authors done some dumb shit as well

manic laurel
carmine folio
#

?

manic laurel
#

exterminate, exterminate
that's all there is to do

carmine folio
#

why tho

#

its not hurtin anyone

echo orchid
#

lol

manic laurel
carmine folio
manic laurel
carmine folio
#

I can say this about youtube as well

#

"Youtubers show gameplay on their channels so for devs = no sales"

amber furnace
manic laurel
#

@carmine folio last warning, it's not here to be discussed
read, get informed, period.

carmine folio
hushed niche
manic laurel
hushed niche
manic laurel
#

thankie! 👍

carmine folio
edgy coralBOT
manic laurel
carmine folio
compact stump
#

look away for a minute and folks get obliterated

carmine folio
halcyon basalt
#

Can I file a complaint against a server that uses my modification, and the server financialy benefiting without permission from bis and me like mod creator?

manic laurel
wispy frost
#

I have a question about the screenshot section? what kind of ip rights are there i shouldnt violate? i really think there is a lot of awesome stuff and i would like to use some of this if possible (for wallpapers etc.) What do i have to do to be able to do so?

carmine folio
wispy frost
carmine folio
#

i dont understand what you mean by that

#

are you saying that do you have to take permission from the creator of the screenshot so you can use it as a wallpaper?

wispy frost
#

im asking what i have to do to be able to use those screenshots

carmine folio
small nacelle
#

Can anyone file a DMCA request against you or only the owner of the mod

wispy frost
#

i suppose not. would be stupid tho

runic wraith
# small nacelle Can anyone file a DMCA request against you or only the owner of the mod

Needs to be someone who has full rights to the content in question, which usually is just the owner. In some situations though rights are transferred or granted to others which may act on their behalf. This is quite important because if the DMCA is challenged/countered, the one filing the claim would need sufficient rights to be capable of filing a lawsuit from there. That's my understanding of it anyways.

wispy frost
#

exactly this

small nacelle
#

Oké cheers thanks I got a DMCA email that I used content in my modpack but I asked permission if I could use it in my pack so that’s why I was asking also got proof with the maker of the mod saying I could use it

wispy frost
#

thats one of the points. otherwise any user could say "oh my god guy b took the stuff from guy a" but maybe guy b got the rights. this is why it would also be kinda stupid to allow everyone to file a request

small nacelle
#

Yeah or if you have a isseu with someone you can be like DMCA here

runic wraith
small nacelle
#

Yeah I will probably remove it anyway since I don’t want any problems/insult anybody thanks for all the information I will just wait it out already sended the proof to steam in a support ticket with the modmaker saying I could use it it’s even on the discussion page of the workshop item I thought I was doing nothing wrong since I got permission

faint nacelle
#

did you get permission from the original maker or possibly someone who already reuploaded it

small nacelle
#

Im pretty sure he is the original maker since there is only one mod of that kind of stuff

faint nacelle
#

also its possible you do have the original mod maker but the content in it is taken/ripped from somewhere else and not by the person you have talked with

#

its not easy stuff for sure

#

but there are also false reporters out there

small nacelle
#

Oké hard material complex but learned from it just need to wait for support ticket then I really appreciate it for all the information given

runic wraith
# small nacelle Oké hard material complex but learned from it just need to wait for support tick...

While it doesn't hurt to seek support from Valve as you have done, it is very, very unlikely that they will have any involvement. They handle the dmca process in a way where they keep themselves out of it and only relay the appropriate information between the conflicting parties. Its not their place to revoke a dmca, deciding who has or doesn't have proper permissions, or take any action aside from following standard procedure to ensure they aren't held liable in any way. They don't wish to be caught up in anyones legal disputes. So in essence, once the claim is filed, it is out of their hands and up to the uploader and one filing the claim to get it resolved.

small nacelle
#

Is there any other thing I can do to solve this there is a email adress of the owner in the email I don’t think removing the mod from steam will resolve it or should I get a lawyer or just wait what happens

wispy frost
#

i dont know what kind of mod this is but if its not a total conversion or something comparable a lawyer would be kind of "overkill". i suppose if your mod wasnt deleted from the workshop until now that you should just wait. if it was removed before i would contact the support if youre kinda sure you had all the rights and it was a false accuwhateverthiswordis

runic wraith
# small nacelle Is there any other thing I can do to solve this there is a email adress of the o...

All depends how you wanna proceed. You could contact the email they provided you with from the person which filed the dmca, if its legitimate. You could contact the content author and ensure that they aren't the one filing the dmca, and if not and you still have permission to use the content, you counter the claim and shouldn't have anything further to worry about. You could remove the content and reupload without it, again resolving the claim. Or if you just don't do anything then Valve will remove your workshop item after 15 days iirc automatically. The only reason you would need a lawyer is if you counter a claim against a person who has full rights to the content, which is why I say its probably a good idea to check with the original author to be sure this wasn't their doing or that of someone who has rights to act on their behalf.

#

This is what's tricky about uploading content that you are not the owner/creator of, even when given permissionto do so. You will have to do some digging on your side to be certain the owner is not the one filing the claim. Keep evidence of your conversations. Fraudulent dmca claims are a thing, and has happened plenty of times before, but these can usually be easily countered and 99% of the time they will not provide their real information in the claim (to keep themselves from getting into legal troubles for filing under false identity).

#

Also keep in mind if the person which gave you permission is not the actual creator of the content, then they also don't have IP rights over the content. So they don't have the rights themselves to grant others permission or revoke it.

small nacelle
#

I currently have contact with the owner of the mod to solve this isseu he did say he filed some applications

#

Its sorted he is not proceeding legal stuff

runic wraith
# small nacelle Its sorted he is not proceeding legal stuff

Well just for future reference, a DMCA claim is essentially the same as a Cease & Desist order (look it up if you are unsure what this means). It is the first form of contact between an owner and someone infringing on their rights. It is NOT followed by legal action unless you counter/challenge the claim or do not comply with the order. This way it can be presented in court that they did contact you first, asked you to stop/remove their content, and you did not comply.

onyx iron
#

Big difference being a Cease & Desist order has to be approved by a judge. Anyone can file DCMA claims (meaning the burden of proof should be on the claimant once you decide to dispute it).

#

I believe @runic wraith is talking about a C&D letter which has no binding legal power but is the lawful way of saying "we told them to stop before going to court".

small nacelle
#

Oké thank you all so much for the information give it helped a lot

runic wraith
chilly silo
echo orchid
#

indeed, the letter is an order in this case

onyx iron
chilly silo
#

True but "orders" issued by a judge are "Court Ordered Cease and Desist". In the scenario mentioned by @runic wraith "a letter is the equivalent of a DMCA etc". Whereas an order is only issued after a Court judgement. - (edits for clarification)

#

We are being pedantic now. He miss-used the term. But in the context of the conversation the he is correct in everything but the use of the word "order".

onyx iron
#

Yes, agreed, I was just pointing it out to avoid confusion for other readers.

solemn coral
#

Wait, I know that taking assets from Arma 2 to put into Arma 3 is good under bohemias licenses, but what about South Asia from ToH? I'm pretty sure that Bohemia said that the assets were only to be used in the Take On series, not arma.

chilly silo
#

Please note that TKOH data are licensed for creating derivatives for both the Take On Helicopters and Arma games.

soft egret
#

I know that taking assets from Arma 2 to put into Arma 3 is good under bohemias licenses
Its not.
Taking assets from the released, licensed data packages is good.
Taking content from A2 that is not in these packages is not good.

solemn coral
#

@soft egret That's what I meant by " under bohemias licenses"

#

@chilly silo Thanks. I must have missed that part.

twilit pilot
#

I found this mod here that contains a bunch of assest from the Call of Duty franchise. Some Atlas Corp vehicles, uniforms, vests, etc.

keen trout
#

Contact Activision for any Call of Duty IP infringement

carmine folio
#

Trying to prevent IP violations. Anyone have a IP rights form that legally hands me the property rights once a person signs it. Worried about a modeler of mine trying to throw me a IP violation for the work I paid him to do.

echo orchid
#

??? make a contract for what you are paying him to do

#

or make a contractual license deal

#

in any case, always do it before paying someone to do anything

zinc tinsel
#

The old one

#

All the assets from that werr from cod

#

It got deleted fairly quick

runic wraith
#

@pliant oar I'd like to request a workshop ban against the following 2 individuals which have now reuploaded content of ours (USP) through 3 different workshop items.

https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561199060634327
2 reuploads of our content from this user were successfully DMCA'd on 9/18/21 at the following links:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2604074191
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2604082501
The third is currently under another DMCA which was filed today:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2604201436

https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198105365109
All 3 of our DMCAs filed against this user were done today and still pending takedown:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2604638000
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2609773463
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2607227732

pliant oar
runic wraith
crystal talon
#

TFL is banned from here right?

#

Just wondering because a quick search shows some units advertising it as part of their modset here, and some people asking for units that run it

runic wraith
#

TFL (TFB/TFC), FLB, NSW, Taxer, Viking; all mods/groups with similar ripped content shared between them.

leaden cipher
# crystal talon Just wondering because a quick search shows some units advertising it as part of...

Sometime the units using them write them in the "required modset" and they get a warning or deleting of their post in that channel (think that happened last week). But moderators don't have the time to scroll through all
the modlist links, they are a small team and the 2 most active on communities (Lou/Dedmen) are also BI employees and do the moderation besides they regular BI tasks (so a full work week and many hours, not office hours, keeping track off the discord).

I also try to contribute with keeping track of the 1x per 14 days rule, but my schedule is also getting more and more busy and not having enough time to help out, or even check modlists as i use my phone 95% of the time.

crystal talon
#

If you just don't have time to police it, should it instead be posted here or to a moderator when it is encountered?

#

Or just leave it be.

manic laurel
runic wraith
#

@pliant oar I'd like to report yet another user which is repeatedly reuploading ripped content of ours, as well as doing his best to get all the other CoD/private ripped packs on the workshop. With the 2 DMCAs filed today, this is our 4th time having to take down uploads from him.
https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198866763125
9/8/21: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2596860403
10/17/21: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2629483257
10/17/21: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2629028907

If there is some other way you would rather have me reporting these repeat offenders, please let me know. Not sure if its worth setting up a channel specifically for reporting people for workshop bans. But when this is one of the few options we have at our disposal to take care of situations like this, our team is certainly going to make use of it.

fallen gale
#

If USP doesn't report me, I think this mod will always be here
sounds to me they may have ripped your stuff? thonk

runic wraith
dusty nimbus
#

I find the Private mod community intriguing tbh

#

I know it looks cool but there's a line to draw

manic laurel
#

who, about what?

fallen gale
#

pretty sure this:

the fact that they steal content and claim it's their own also boils my blood

manic laurel
#

waiting confirmation/correction from the author

fallen gale
#

@manic laurel ?

manic laurel
#

!purgeban @strange vector 90d name-calling. PS: read up about these "alpha" stuff: it's bs. An alpha male is simply a male that is released too early to the public. PPS: respect IP rights, or one day you will even have nothing to rip. Use your brain, for once

dull moon
#

🍿

edgy coralBOT
plain rivet
#

This channel is always a joy to watch. Anyways, back to business

queen thistle
#

ok what
disney is going around cancelling people for making fan content?
even if they make their assets from scratch

#

unless ive got this wrong

hasty gale
#

would be a IP violation since they do not strictly allow if its taken from the files of a game then that is another layer of illegal

#

if someone else takes the files and sells them to you, you can still get in trouble as well if its in your mod

fallen gale
keen trout
queen thistle
#

so any fan content for anything in any medium or form is auto illegal unless it's said otherwise...?

#

where's the line between IP infringement and your own stuff then?

dull moon
#

no. it means that disney does not allow to use their IP / trademark

#

and yet another one who has no clue what fair use actually means....

queen thistle
dull moon
#

no

queen thistle
#

explain? @dull moon

#

if it's not the same name and world it's not the same IP
unless ive screwed this up too

dull moon
#

because the whole star wars design and resembling content is protected by trademark

queen thistle
#

where's the line between resembling and different, then?

#

this whole thing is extremely vague

dull moon
#

according to disney, there is no difference

queen thistle
#

what.

dull moon
#

jup

queen thistle
#

triangle-shaped space ships of any kind (even irl) are auto illegal by that logic

dull moon
#

iirc disney at one point tried to sue a kid who has rebuild the death star with lego / roblox and posted images and a tutorial online

queen thistle
#

LOL

dull moon
#

¯_(ツ)_/¯

queen thistle
dull moon
#

¯_(ツ)_/¯

queen thistle
#

lulz

#

well we're all gonna get sued now
we talked about it

#

very logical indeed 10/10 👍

dull moon
#

i'm not the one making the rules

queen thistle
#

never trust the americans to make good laws ig

dull moon
#

it's not just the US making IP laws...

sharp void
#

I'm still (very) new to this topic but what about artistic representation? Eg. you create (in this case) a Death Star but you make it more cartoonish, the basic idea, shape, etc is there but stylistically it's different. Would this still be disallowed by Disney? Just trying to get an idea of how far this goes since now I'm interested lol

dull moon
#

in theory an artistic creation is legal. but since disney trademarked the design and resembling designs, there is a very high chance that refering to an artistic (re)creation will not hold in court

sharp void
#

That's interesting, thank you

dull moon
#

to give you the perfect quote: i have the high ground (disney)

sharp void
#

...Well played lol

queen thistle
#

not rlly
100000 million ppl have the low ground

#

i feel like at least 80% of stuff gets away with infringing on their draconian trademarks

dull moon
#

maybe, but do you really want to get caught in the cross fire once disney starts a carped bombing run with law suits, potentially killing everything in it's path including the whole arma modding community and maybe even the whole BI franchise?
i don't......

#

and yes, disney is not really known for precision strikes... they fire cluster shells and hope to hurt as much as possible... even the innocent who can't fight back due to lack of money for extended law suits

queen thistle
#

well we all know how carpet bombing wastes millions of taxpayer dollars, hits civilians, and only solves the problem for a week

stiff jasper
# queen thistle where's the line between resembling and different, then?

disney has enough money and lawyers to nuke every thing that even slightly resembles whatever content they have in their hands. Do you know that "funny" youtube cartoon with Mickey and Goofy in Vietnam? Yep, there was a ton of legal disputes between Shitsney and the videomaker regarding how the characters look, how they speak and what is the target. Videomaker had to change them to human(oid)s and basically all new videos are not really the same thing

runic wraith
#

Ya know, discord takes a very strong stance against racism/racist slurs. Quite easy to report a server where that is going on or the individuals doing it. Can't fix a problem if no one is trying to do anything about it.

elfin shuttle
#

This was after aqusition by disney.

manic laurel
#

and I have this that goes the other way
https://www.koburgerlaw.com/blog/2020/7/29/thinking-before-moddingplayers-dont-own-what-they-make

sooo yeah, an official statement would be nice.

kbl
Thinking Before Modding—Players Don’t Own What They Make — Koburger...

As the Games Industry grows ever larger and as game engines’ modding tools become increasingly accessible to the average player, game modding is not just more common, but practically ubiquitous. This presents a problem for both developers and the players who mod their games. In this article, we will

dull moon
#

@elfin shuttle
who is this "TKAzA"...?

chilly silo
# elfin shuttle Info on Star Wars stuff copyright: https://www.moddb.com/news/lucas-arts-copyrig...

I was shown that quite a while ago. The original post is from 2014... polices change as does case law.

My understanding is that is MODDB's own policy on Star Wars/Disney IP. (Please correct me if you know different) NOT an official stance from Disney or Lucasfilm.

The best information I have (I have been looking into it and Disney has not officially replied to me) is that Their view is that Every Disney IP is Trademarked and copyrighted. They will take action when they are aware of an infringement and when it suits them. Just like that screenshot says. However, that email does NOT come from an official source so should not be taken as a "green light".

From what I've found so far; on the face of it there are at least 5 contradictory statements in Disney's IP policy. When you dig deeper into it you find that they are less contradictions but relate to different "product types". Ie Cups and t-shirts, plushies etc, toys board games and Video Games in particular. My working theory so far is that there are too many infractions to prosecute. And the revenue they generate is relatively small. And since it very hard and expensive to kill them all. So they made the policy/statement about claiming all IP no matter who makes it. But when you do get into it and look at the past cases a lot of action re Mods/Fan made content it usually gets legal when you step on Disney's toes. Either directly competing with their interest or you are damaging their brand.

So the question is not "is it legal?" - Because its not. It may seem like its "tolerated" because they dont take action against everyone, but when you look into how often Disney does contact small vendors and "fan creators" with Cease and Desist letters its actually quite scary.

The question really should be "Is it worth the risk?" - because there are enough people out there that have come up against Disney's IP Protection Team...and lost.

Again, only my opinion based on my own research.

chilly silo
#

It seems the ModDB link is somewhat out of context. The statement originally dates from this post in 2012 and relates to Porting content BETWEEN Lucas Film games.

Note between Lucas Film Games and mentions nothing about other non-Lucas film properties.

sudden nest
#

That is from our old, very old Designated Days forum. The EULA has since then been updated regarding content between LucasFilm/old LucasArts games as recently as this year, as to my recollection, so that thread is heavily outdated. (I'm RevanSithLord BTW and will very soon be project lead of that mod I've just mentioned) I apologize for any confusion that may have brought. I seldom go to that forum anymore, but I ought to update that thread with the more recent EULA regarding Star Wars related content between Lucas Arts/LucasFilm titles. I'm afraid that I've seen people porting Star Wars content to non-LucasFilm titles such as Men of War: Assault Squad 2, and others, so I am not sure what Disney/LucasFilm LtD. thinks of that in terms of IP violations. Ultimately, I guess it doesn't matter what I think here, but if someone doesn't want a legal battle that they can't afford, I highly suggest they don't pick a fight with them.

sudden nest
#

Oh, not this last year I guess, but in 2016. Further back than I thought. But between Star Wars games, it's generally been okay. DICEFront was generally off limits until this year when the EA exclusivity was decided recently that it was going to end, so those and any Disney/LucasFilm game are pretty much on the table for anyone within the Star Wars fandom to use between Star Wars games, or Star Wars animations. Of course, they would probably not exclusively go after someone if one or two assets leaked to another game outside of that umbrella that the new agreements cover, however if they notice a fair chunk of content that happened to be used, they may start having problems, especially if people started charging for it. Once the lettuce is involved, that's when the mouse curbstomps you. https://jkhub.org/forums/topic/7857-updated-eula-regarding-porting-content/

runic wraith
carmine folio
#

doesnt he make shirts

#

how is that ripping? (idk im genuinely asking)

queen thistle
runic wraith
# carmine folio doesnt he make shirts

Must not be talking about the same guy then. The Taxer I have mentioned doesn't make anything apart from stealing other peoples work and combining it together.

carmine folio
#

made shirts, some middle eastern dresses and backpacks

#

the website is down now tho

runic wraith
carmine folio
runic wraith
#

Our mechanix gloves mixed with the uniforms he had

carmine folio
#

or a few of them

runic wraith
#

Not sure if it was all or not, but even if it was just one is enough for a DMCA

carmine folio
#

ok

cedar flint
#

Anyone know who uses
TFN
TFL

#

in their PBO names

stiff jasper
#

why would you need that

cedar flint
#

Why do you think... this is the IP rights channel...

dull moon
#

@cedar flint
"Task Force Leviathan", notorious for ripping other people's content

cedar flint
#

Thought so

dull moon
#

(google is awesome)

cedar flint
#

I only found a reddit thread, so wanted to check here 😉

manic laurel
#

let's not have this conversation here. ☁️ 🧹

carmine folio
glacial lagoon
#

75th Rangers (full pack) aka PowerRangers
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2601175778

3den Enhanced
16AA Immersion Sounds
GoPro helmet camera (New)
Enhanced Movement
WMO
Enhanced Soundscape?
KKA3 Anims
O&T Expansion Eden
TFL Glasses
USP Objects, Animations``` 
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2602584203


```JSRS
DEVGRU Red Squadron```
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2607982016


```VCOM
3den Better Inventory
3den Enhanced
16AA Immersion Sounds
ANZ Heli Dust EFX
O&T Expansion Eden
TFL Glasses
KKA3 Anims
USP Objects, Animations
GGE Core, Canting, Captives
LAMBS 
PiR
Immerse, Suppress```
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2627062583
raven jacinth
charred basalt
sonic dagger
#

If you download a pbo that's under GNU GENERAL PUBLIC license can you use it's contents in your mod which is closed source?

soft egret
#

I think for GPL its sufficient if you give out the source code when asked for it?

sonic dagger
#

hmm the source of that pbo?

unreal verge
#

If a part of a project contains gnu license, that part has to be made open including any derivative such as API calls for it and such. This can easily grow to overcome the project as a whole if you use the gnu licensed code a lot.

sonic dagger
#

It's actually a animation that I need from the pbo

novel goblet
#

Are you the author of the PBO or did you just download it? AFAIK, just because you downloaded the PBO under GPL, does not necessarily mean (although thatmight be the case) that the author itself is bound by GPL.

sonic dagger
#

it's not mine but I could use one animation from it

novel goblet
#

In any cases, the best first action to take would be to try and contact the author, and ask.

sonic dagger
chilly silo
#

As long as you dont alter the original pbo anyway.

sonic dagger
faint nacelle
#

simplest would be to just remake that one animation yourself

lethal vessel
#

Good day gentlemen, I’m not entirely sure if it’s the appropriate channel to ask this but I was wondering: Is selling Arma 3 scripts as a service legal per bohemia policies ? I’d like to know cause I’ve seen people proposing to develop scripts against payment on a server where I do moderation. Thanks in advance 😉

faint nacelle
#

selling text files is allowed if I remember right but I doubt those people just write the stuff without testing it so might be grey area. Also ready pbos are not allowed to be sold.

lethal vessel
vivid wave
#

Yes

#

IIRC selling SQF and/or CPP is completely fine. Just not some binarized/processed so Arma-Ready, is nono

lethal vessel
vivid wave
#

Yes. That's not what Arma 3 Tools involved so its EULA

lethal vessel
vivid wave
#

Since yeah, SQF is just a text file and never processed by Arma 3 Tools so it's okay to do. P3D, RTM, WRP, PAA, other Arma files, are bad to sell

lethal vessel
stiff jasper
soft egret
#

PAA is a proprietary format, and reverse engineering is forbidden by the EULA's, so it has to be assumed that they came from the A3 Tools

fallen gale
soft egret
#

Pretty sure I didn't say that

fallen gale
#

forbidden by the EULA
so they're breaking the EULA then? thonk

soft egret
#

Someone at some point did something illegal to make this tool possible.
I'm very sure the makers of that tool didn't

fallen gale
#

I know. I was just asking meowsweats

soft egret
#

Why ask something that you already know :u

fallen gale
#

I'm very sure the makers of that tool didn't
I know this meowsweats
not if that site is "illegal" or not

soft egret
#

That would be something to ask our Lawyer, but the answer will be "we tolerate it" anyway

onyx iron
#

(not a lawyer, don't pirate games, just saying)

keen trout
#

You agreed to the EULA when you installed the game

onyx iron
#

true, goes to show how much attention the average user pays to all the "confirm" buttons upfront 😄

coral torrent
manic laurel
#

wasn't there a study saying that one would lose a month per year or so if he read each and every EULA he "accepts"? 😄

coral torrent
#

I am sure this will provoke some people but there is a legal basis for things like .PAA in photoshop viewer. European copyright law; Directive 91/250 of 14 May 1991; Article 6 states:

1 . The authorization of the rightholder shall not be
required where reproduction of the code and translation
of its form within the meaning of Article 4 (a) and (b) are
indispensable to obtain the information necessary to
achieve the interoperability of an independently created
computer program with other programs, provided that the
following conditions are met :
(a) these acts are performed by the licensee or by another
person having a right to use a copy of a program, or
on their behalf by a person authorized to to so ;
(b) the information necessary to achieve interoperability
has not previously been readily available to the
persons referred to in subparagraph (a) ; and
(c) these acts are confined to the parts of the original
program which are necessary to achieve interoperability.

https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/PDF/?uri=CELEX:31991L0250

#

This has to be treated with a grain of salt though. There are lots of explicit black and whitelist cases also mentioned in this and later iterations of the directive. And this is not a "its 100% allowed all the time". This is just a mere guideline for a court to rule in such a case. If the interests of the person who does the RE are determined to not fall under any of the protected use cases it might still very much be illegal. One example they list in article 6 is to make a competing program that is similar to the one you are REing.

#

I will have to also give you a citation to back this up, possibly from a ruling that explicitly mentions this, but I am 90% sure that any EULA can not overrule the EU law here. The only thing that can indirectly stop a legitimate RE of a software of the explicit permitted cases would be a NDA that simply hinders you from sharing your results.

#

In this US this is VERY different. Not allowed there. So if any of you US citizens feel like this can't be true, be aware things are different here in the EU

#

Commercial use is yet another story though. I was primarily arguing how mikeros tools, pbo manager, and the gruppe adler tool in question could possibly be existing without getting sued - besides BI obviously not having an interest to hurt community contributions that are not in conflict with any of their commercial interests.

#

Out of experience: If BI has a problem with something, they will let you know. They give you the chance to sort it out with them and there would be not much of an interest to peruse that any further then from their side. If you ignore them or decline, they will try the minimal effort ways to make content unavailable by contacting hosters and or filing DMCAs to get it removed from online platforms such as github, forums or the workshop.

I personally have commercialized my arma work for years now and simply avoided the topic by making non script files available publicly to exclude them from the commercial process. I know others who want to rely on the tools being non BI an thus not having to follow the non commercial rules. Until we have a legal case that covers this very situation either from another company or BI we can't know for certain

#

With future games possibly utilizing more industry standard file formats this topic should become less relevant hopefully.

onyx iron
#

EULAs contain plenty of unenforceable stuff that is overruled by consumer protection laws in the EU. EULAs have been known to ban reselling, reverse engineering and much more followed by European courts invalidating said sections. They are more of a "best case what the company selling the product wishes to happen if consumer protection wouldn't exist".
Slightly off topic in here anyway? meowsweats

coral torrent
#

Oh well yeah we are in violations ... wasn't there a discussions channel about arma ip in the past? Well I said what i wanted to. Not much more I can add to it anyway.

onyx iron
merry kestrel
stiff jasper
#

If you want it down, you'd have to report it to Capcom because it's their IP.

pure minnow
#

front page of workshop with 5 star ratingmeowhuh

faint nacelle
#

steam community is wildlands

lilac sun
faint nacelle
#

its against the rules and insult to anyone making mods that do not break the very simple rules of dont steal someone elses stuff @lilac sun

lilac sun
#

Right. Whatever. I would like to hear kongs answer to why he would report something that thousands of players want and doesn't affect him whatsoever

#

No hate against you whatsoever @faint nacelle

dull moon
#

where did he say "take it down"??

lilac sun
#

He reported it=pls take dwn

dull moon
#

no...?

#

you're making stuff up which is dangerous in this channels

faint nacelle
#

this channel can be used to discuss possible violations

#

and "thousands of people wanting something" is not valid reason for this kind of thing

lilac sun
#

Allright boys

plain rivet
#

Ripped assets is illegal and will result in consequences

#

Simple

gusty hedge
#

Is stuff like this enough to ban someone from ever posting on the workshop again? Asking for a friend.

faint nacelle
#

yes

#

this tells its deliberate violation

gusty hedge
#

Exactly

#

Yet I keep seeing this trash posted everywhere. It's tiring trying to find cool mods for ArmA3 when the workshop is cluttered with bullshit like this. At least they get banned though, right?

faint nacelle
#

sometimes yes.

#

@pliant oar if you got a naughty list thats not long enough the above item and uploader could be put onto it. The description already says that the heads are taken form other games (the chinese translated through google)

carmine folio
#

Let's be honest here, Funny always does this. Lmao

faint nacelle
#

Lmao

carmine folio
#

Possibly. Lmao. Or it's possible he'll either create new steam accounts or go the other route

#

Seriously don't see the point in going through all the trouble though

faint nacelle
#

its the right thing to do.

carmine folio
#

Oh, I don't disagree.

carmine folio
#

In kinder words, I compare people that rip to prepubescent children that can't get what they want so they don't stop until they get it even if it means stealing for it.

tough lagoon
#

sigma grindset. Steal what you can't own. Ignore IP laws

runic wraith
carmine folio
#

True enough, Siege. Lol

earnest mirage
#

One could almost say Their ignorance is...

#

Funny

#

||(meant the Modder that keeps ripping stuff Not BI)||

manic laurel
earnest mirage
#

Its ironic, He mostlikely meant it Like "Woah Look at this Strong Man, Who ignores laws!" (Sigma meaning a man whos "too good for women", from the Alpha Male mythos

#

that theory was disproved by its own Theorist

earnest mirage
austere marsh
#

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2440071244 BlackHawks by Yura Petrov ported by me from AA2 mod. I have no permission to share from author, and port was never released but aniway was leaked due to my mistake. But now this "author" B r e a c h e r posted it in Steam workshop on his own behalf. I checked the files, this is definitely my work. Even the Russian name of the folder (Новая папка) was not deleted by this unfair user.

soft egret
#

If there are things in there you made, DMCA it

#

If all of it is from Yura, then not much you can do

austere marsh
#

I just feel a great responsibility for my act in front of Yura Petrov. And it hurts me every time that such releases compromise him. Cause, he had reason not to give permission to share my version of his work.

soft egret
#

If there is stuff in there that you made, you can DMCA that, just exactly specify what parts your DMCA actually affects

austere marsh
#

Okay, I'll just try to contact Yuri first.

runic wraith
raw cove
#

guys someone stole my identity who do i report it to?

vivid wave
#

Define what it is

raw cove
#

who i am

#

someone stole it

vivid wave
#

In where?

raw cove
#

everywhere?

vivid wave
#

If you want just to troll, just bag it up and door is there

carmine folio
#

@vivid wave 🐶 DevilAjit

scarlet patrol
#

damn skinwalkers

carmine folio
#

this entire community is wildlands

carmine folio
dull moon
#

any mod upload that violates common IP and copyright is trash

carmine folio
manic laurel
# dull moon any mod upload that violates common IP and copyright is trash

@maiden scarab @strong aspen @carmine folio
just asking for permission is the basic step that 99.9% of people don't even try.
so yes, it's trashy to go publish something without even trying to get permission.

I suppose you see it only from one side of the stick, but imagine how bo(the)ring it can be for the original creator - imagine doing something yourself (only for it to be taken apart and "copyrighted/claimed" by someone else)

maiden scarab
#

I literally just laughed at the sentence, idk why you tagging me for this

umbral nymph
dull moon
#

K

manic laurel
maiden scarab
#

and yeah I know how annoying it is. I made a simple retexture quite a while ago and that already was a pain in the butt

#

if anyone stole it with no permission I would get mad too

manic laurel
#

then why laugh at IP enforcement? if I got it right ofc

maiden scarab
#

wasnt laughing at IP enforcement

carmine folio
#

I do find it funny that people really don't understand Steam Subscriber Agreement though.

#

If people did understand it, they may think twice about doing something stupid.

dull moon
#

many of those actually do understand it, they just don't give a F

carmine folio
#

I guess they'll get it if Steam decides to terminate their account one of those days.

carmine folio
#

nobody bothers

#

and when shit goes faceup they complain about nobody informing them of this and that.

carmine folio
#

Oh well. Lol

faint nacelle
#

btw. The workshop publisher now has very clear message you have to click away about what one can upload. so there is no way to miss it anymore.

grim dagger
#

guy is trying to sell a ripped vest from arma 3 for 8 bucks

compact stump
#

You are positive it is the same model?

mint ridge
soft egret
charred basalt
random marsh
# charred basalt https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2650409571 is this rippin... 
@David
I think you dont understand what you are talking about.
Boxes and containers are not licenced by tarkov (the designs exist outside of the game), the names may be but even then we can still put any licence on this we want since it has all been made from scratch and no tarkov assets were used whatsoever```

From the author. Luca works on the Alpha Group Equipment mod, so I doubt they'd be publishing stuff with ripped assets.
faint nacelle
#

smart person would not then use some other games name as their mod name...

charred basalt
#

^

onyx iron
#

if its a descriptor...

cinder ridge
#

Its not ripped, the guy that made is @glacial lily, you can check his artstation he may have images of it there and if not you can still ask him directly.

glacial lily
#

Hi 🙂

#

100% done from scratch verified

glacial lily
faint nacelle
#

No, but Id say its just as bad name if you make a mod called Star Wars Storm Trooper from BattleFront 2

#

the name implies the models would be from tarkov

glacial lily
#

Hmmm I see your point but I don't fully agree

faint nacelle
#

could be boxes inspired by Tarkov or something along those lines

#

if you wanted it to be less missleading. but in anycase, since they are scratch built its kosher.

glacial lily
#

Again, I see your point, but I think the description is pretty clear

#

And you can always go into my profile and see my previous work as well as my portfolio

#

takes less time to do that that coming here and reporting the mod xD

faint nacelle
#

Id believe what you had to show left the initial poster in doubt. blobdoggoshruggoogly It can happen.

glacial lily
#

may be

wispy frost
#

still its funny how the first people instantly flame like "haha nice ripped content" before even asking. also if they have the time to comment they should rather first use their time to read the description since thats clear af about who made the models lol

gray siren
#

@wispy frostmost people here get a hard on when they see something that smells like it is ripped contented

glacial lily
#

Yeah is quite sad to spend time doing assets for the community and then they down vote it just cause they don't read the description, and this has happen with other mods of Luca and I like AGE where people just reports it because the models look "too nice to not be ripped"

wispy frost
sly knot
#

Jota makes some insanely nice stuff completely from scratch. Are we to condemn him for doing TOO good a job?

glacial lily
maiden scarab
#

Jota's models really are good looking

#

Fr thanks for making such a good mod

runic wraith
# glacial lily Yeah is quite sad to spend time doing assets for the community and then they dow...

About as sad as spending time to make new assets for this community only to have others rip, upload, claim as their own, and get upvotes/praise for it just because they are incapable of making things themselves or can't achieve the same quality. Not directing that towards you or your mods, as I don't know anything about those, but just saying its a screwed up world all around and plenty of bullshit every modder has to deal with. Rippers are the main ones responsible for everyone being so touchy when it comes to where models originated from or their legitimacy.

runic wraith
#

Just like I don't think rippers and 'IP vanguards' are one in the same when it comes to not asking. Guess we all have our own thoughts about things and how they should be, doesn't always mean anyone else cares to hear them.

carmine folio
faint nacelle
carmine folio
dull moon
#

!

carmine folio
#

?

manic laurel
#

.

hallow idol
#

Nice summarization of an average debate in this channel))

manic laurel
#

good thing this channel is not up for debates but discussions (about BI's IP breach)

hallow idol
#

Mb; Nice summarization of an average discussion in this channel))*

austere marsh
faint nacelle
#

Did he repack them?

dusty nimbus
#

does anyone know how to contact CUP devs? I think someone might be selling one of their 3d models.

faint nacelle
soft egret
native sun
#

"All rights belong to the developers of Arma 3 Creator DLC: Western Sahara" in the description. wow, great.

#

looks like this is the ebo files, so at least not a straight rip. will have to see what we do here.

uneven roost
#

who would've guessed the camels would be the biggest attraction

native sun
#

actually i had a good guess 🙂

#

i just didnt thought about how easy it is to rip them out. now it's a philosophical question if he did something illegal or not, because technically the same files are also in the compatibility data. he just reduced the download size to 150mb. players would not see any dlc adverts either way.

hasty gale
#

they took the actual files even though they remain encrypted, unless the licence says that they can do that is illegal

#

assuming what was said is correct

native sun
#

i have no experience with this stuff, but i guess the usual "don't reupload"-rule applies here the same way.

soft egret
#

it does yeah

atomic edge
#

No reuploads. Never. Leaving one online is risking to have all the content shared outside of the original mod (or CDLC) and having a lot of problems in the process. It's even worse for a CDLC.

crystal talon
dusty nimbus
dusty nimbus
crystal talon
#

I'm pretty sure we bought that one somewhere

compact timber
#

those things were long before they were in cup on several 3d websites for sale

dusty nimbus
#

Nvm then

manic laurel
#

@olive sparrow ↑ ?

olive sparrow
#

thanks Xeenenta, reported to BI legal.

#

wow what a crock of shit!

# 
Sending it to us doesn’t solve the problem, even if we try to remove all of the posts and links and ban users, they could register a new account in our site and share the links again, so it’s not really possible, and also removing the text links and pages is useless there are lots of cached pages on the internet, and we don’t have access to those free-hosts, so we can’t remove those shared files from free-hosts.```
#

good luck surviving the lawsuit

dull moon
#

a C&D should make them remove the listing tho... or not...?

olive sparrow
#

yeah in realpolitik they haven't got a leg to stand on. that disclaimer was written by a teenager or an idiot

soft egret
#

remember to actually also DMCA the filehoster

scarlet patrol
#

apparently the person that keeps ripping games on the workhop is doing it on commission
thats fun

stiff jasper
#

you mean the one with chinese nickname and RE ports?

earnest mirage
#

Wasnt there Like 29 different people uploading REV rips all at once?

onyx ermine
#

wtf is this channel for?

dull moon
#

just read the channel description.....

long idol
#

it's for clothes shopping

#

undoubtedly

carmine folio
#

like the RE8 stuff or??

scarlet patrol
carmine folio
#

aight

grim dagger
vivid wave
#

Please include a description

#

Well I know, it is most likely a ripped content...

fallen gale
#

I think it's because it debinarizes the vanilla p3d and modifies them

golden dune
onyx iron
#

but he said

Thanks to all the Moders for their Great Work!
😄

grim dagger
faint nacelle
#

kek. workshop access restriction would serve him right.

onyx ermine
manic laurel
#

gents, the sharpest spoon in the drawer!

carmine folio
#

Ive gotten way more laughs out of this channel than i'd get from a circus.
Although things have gotten much more civil in this channel compared to a few years ago 👌

hallow idol
#

He's got a point, there is a large amount of clowns reacting to his message..)))

wise hound
#

some clowns reacting to your message too

oblique quartz
#

Also: Hitman Weapons?
You mean the real life weapons that Hitman based their weapons on can also be used to base your own weapons on?

Hitman doesn't have an exclusive right to draw inspiration from real life lol

stiff jasper
#

I think you don't understand the difference between creating stuff based on real life and ripping things from games.

#

in this case you see the second part.

half cosmos
wispy frost
golden dune
#

There are no credits nor a list of content on the mod´s workshop page.
"Thanks to all the great moders" is neither.
Comments are disabled on the mod, too.

There is a patreon link on the workshop page, though.
That is pretty inappropriate, since there are clearly ripped assets in the modpack.

#

Oh, i stand corrected :

The mod´s workshop page now has "Links removed" where the patreon and discord links were, but the line "Go to Discord or Patreon for more Info Screens Support etc..." is still here.

#

And the mod "creator" has a total of three _packs mods with the same text and presumably ripped content.

#

If you really, really insist on this modpack having non-ripped assets, ill fucking download it again and take screenshots.

golden dune
#

Sorry to spam
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1365945010

After checking stuff out in the arsenal, this mod pack has content/assets from:

Kickass/KA weapons (e.g. flamethrower, crossbow, silver baller, suitcase nuke asset, others)

HLC (e.g M134 Epilator)

OPTRE (Well... practically every gun, explosive, misc items like biofoam and medikits, grenades , with some assets clearly displaying "made by Article 2 studios" or tagged for their individual creators within OPTRE)

Maxjoiner (melee system melee weapons)

Dragonkeeper (The tactical banana?)

CSW Team (Taser, other guns i dont know)

SWT / Six Consolidated Industries (Star wars guns)

sga (Star gate Staff and Handgun)

There are more weapons and assets like grenades that i cant really categorize.

While also having/had patreon links on the modpacks and comments disabled from the get go.

wispy frost
#

i dont see any spam here man. great research man

golden dune
#

Its not really research if i did just check the arsenal in the first place.

vivid wave
#

It's called research isn't it

golden dune
#

I´d say research would be trying to verify where the assets with classnames i dont find on the workshop or "unknown author" are from.
But at this point, its pointless.
The mod pack is a pure asset rip with patreon link (at the time of the first post about it), while the modder has two more questionable modpacks with the same look.
E.g. comments disabled, "great thanks to all the moders", no content and no credits on the page, but most likely ripped assets for vehicles and gear, per mod pack.

#

Though, thank you.

wispy frost
#

yeah tbh im the opinion that sometimes the sharing of stuff should be more easily to help the community progress. but just ripping assets and then not even giving full credits or any credits at all is bad.

golden dune
#

I mean, i would not mind having access to gear or weapon only packs from large mods like the 40k or halo ones.

But that would involve asking for permission to repack the assets and properly crediting it, as well as quite possibly not having a donation link on the modpack.

carmine folio
#

Even by asking to repack assets it's still not okay. Lol. By uploading to the Steam Workshop you're stating you own the content. Even when you upload content to Steam Workshop it's no longer yours. It's Valve's. They can terminate your account for any reason if they so chose to as well.

manic laurel