ip_rights_violations

[vocal patio]

see the upload dates for both changes

there is no way this could've been ported before BI Licensing

[dull moon]

to clear things up:
i generated ToH source files (with BI permission) before ToH files where publicly available

[vocal patio]

So Joker originally got the files from you?

[dull moon]

so, you can go on as you wish, CUP-L applies and not APL-SA
as i told you on the CUP discord, Jocker gave me his files so i could complete my port which was stuck due to config complications
end

[vocal patio]

but Joker's files came from the LDPs

which are SA

[dull moon]

not his configs

like model.cfg and so on

[vocal patio]

but any SA data is still SA

[dull moon]

not.his.configs

and not my source data

[vocal patio]

can you explain in a little more detail?

[dull moon]

#ip_rights_violations message

[vocal patio]

so your saying he gave you configs?

[dull moon]

he gave me his source data, and i used what i did not have: configs

[vocal patio]

ok i think i get it slightly now

the models and other data are covered by CUP-L, and the configs which don't use the LDPs are from Joker

[dull moon]

yes

[vocal patio]

so this still means that Joker's mod isn't compliant by using models from the LDP?

not CUP

[dull moon]

i don't know what source he used, you'd have to ask him

[rustic copper]

Just out of interest, but what is the meaning of this conversation? Because I really don't understand it 🤷‍♂️

[vocal patio]

Take On Helicopters Licensed Data is available to the public only under Share Alike Licenses

Joker who contributed to cup parts of the ToH Medium has a mod which adds that Helicopter under APL-ND

which doesn't conform to the license according to Pufu

[dull moon]

you don't know his source, stop assuming

[vocal patio]

if he rips it from the game its still violating the ToH EULA

the only other way to get it is from the LDPs

[dull moon]

not if prior agreement with BI was made

see, you are missing a ton of information. you're jumping to conclusions

[rustic copper]

But CUP is not just "the public", as audio already told you (and is widely know by the community).

No idea who this joker is, or how/why/if he got into this discussion, but it seems way beyond the purpose of this channel.
If you believe he did something wrong, feel free to contact BI with proof of wrongdoing.

[vocal patio]

So can we get clarification from BI as to whether there is an agreement with Joker

[dull moon]

ask Joker

[vocal patio]

the problem isn't with cup

that was miscommunication

[vocal patio]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1707773570&searchtext=ToH+medium

[rustic copper]

Just send an email to BI (see email address in channel description) and provide the proof you have about any violations you have.

[vocal patio]

will do

[vocal patio]

problem solved sorry if I initially sounded like an arse

[paper prawn]

By the way, if you actually read the description for Joker's mod, you will see he credits BI for the model from the Samples pack, not the LDP. The samples pack is not APL-SA (or in fact, APL anything), which at least suggests that they probably contacted BI for permission to use in ARMA 3, it's not like this mod has been a secret since 2017...

[vocal patio]

by the Samples pack are you referring to the Sample Models pack?

[paper prawn]

This one: https://community.bistudio.com/wiki/Take_On_Helicopters:_Samples

Contains the medium helo model

[vocal patio]

https://community.bistudio.com/wiki/Take_On_Helicopters:_Samples#License

Bohemia Interactive grants to you a personal, nonexclusive license to open and modify the models for the purpose of designing, developing, testing, and producing non-commercial game content for PC game Take On Helicopters.

[paper prawn]

Unbinarized. As I noted it is TOH only, which at least implies that permission was sought... But unrelated to APL-SA which is what you've been talking about

[vocal patio]

we don't know if he asked

and anyway i've already sent an email to BI asking if its ok to publish the data in that way

[paper prawn]

In this case, either permission was obtained and they can make it ND if they want or it wasn't in which case it's irrelevent because it would be taken down for license infringement. Either way, the point you've been making for a while is not at all relevent.

Your whole thread is that it must be APL-SA cause the LDP is. But the LDP wasn't used so it doesn't have to be

[vocal patio]

He has the textures from ToH though which do not appear to be in the pack

anyway im just going to wait for BI to respond to the email at this rate because everyone's right we've just devolved into a whole bunch of speculation

[paper prawn]

Which textures?

[vocal patio]

The Military version on the cover for the addon for a start

also he has the other versions of the model present in ToH, where as the one in the samples is the armed version tbf he could have made the model from the sample

[paper prawn]

Anyway, enough on this from me, either the mod will be removed from the workshop or it will stay as it is.

[echo orchid]

if the sources are from apl-sa data packs, it doesn’t. But most data packs are newer then a3 release date. And BI has helped directly various people before any data packs were available

old farts and larger mods have if you want different relationships with BI than the average lad, and that’s expected. Let’s end this, BI is the one to answer your question if they deem necessary

[indigo axle]

Thank you for posting this! ball_cap, gold_hats_base, and skeetIR are all ours.

[dusk dagger]

What

[indigo axle]

What do you mean "what"?

The mod he(?) linked contained unauthorized uploads of content from my group

[midnight iris]

Quick question. If the ACE Compat pbos are licensed under the GNU license, that means I am allowed to repack them, right?

[keen trout]

making a repack yes but publishing to workshop would be Steam Workshop EULA, which is different from GNU

[frozen dome]

strange how this channel that was most likely originally intended to be used by small creators to protect their own work from being stolen has devolved into the religious adherence to copyright scripture in the name of multi-million dollar corporations that are more than capable of handling these things themselves

[pseudo yarrow]

i agree

[stiff jasper]

was most likely originally intended
ah yes, another hot take by a person not following this channel at all and having no idea about IP rights. This channel's intention has always be the same and it's written in its description, IP laws and protection are the same for everyone, budget or size do not matter. If you have nothing to say, just don't be clown and don't start a 100th meaningless discussion where you don't listen to anybody from its beginning, because you already created your vision of some gaming industry robin hood farce.

[upbeat tinsel]

i agree

[sweet thunder]

i have no idea whats going on but i concur that sometimes IP right violations be cringe

[faint nacelle]

so then

Howabout we dont start this crap again.

[frozen dome]

I'm familiar with what rights people have over their own creations. I just find it amusing that 20-somethings spend so much time prowling Arma 3 on behalf of corporations that don't care, and then are forced to care to retain their copyright after it's reported, lmfao

[faint nacelle]

@frozen dome I refer to my previous statement.

[elfin heron]

sounds like someone had their mod taken down

[knotty radish]

As someone with no mods, bitches, or real stake in this, I do find some reactions to people like sundown here rather humorous like Hongers for instance. but, this aint the place for it I know.

[willow flax]

If there is what appears to be a deprecated mod project, how would it work if someone wanted to potentially take up that same project and patch/update it? Would that be kosher?

[marble coyote]

Depends on the license of said mod, and if there is no license at all you have to ask the mod author for permission.

[willow flax]

And if the mod author never responds, then the de facto answer is "no", I presume?

[elfin heron]

correct

[faint nacelle]

config patch mod can be written and the original mod can be used as dependency

as long as it is already on the workshop

basically all configs from the original mod can be replaced if wanted in non invasive way

models and textures cant though

[willow flax]

Cool. I've noticed a couple mods that I'd like to explore for use on a server, but the issue seems to be that the project died for any given reason. It makes more practical sense to me to attempt a patch rather than a true-blue rewrite. Since the issues seem to be stability and bug-related, it doesn't appear that there'd be any real problem.

Thank you

[carmine folio]

i agree on that this what ive been trying to say but eh its lost cause i wont argue anymore im too stupid really

[carmine folio]

ill be honest this is like modern day adults now imagine like youre 20 and youre like this really like imagine worrying over like 3d stuff or digital stuff over like real world issues

but eh thats all i can say

im done

[faint nacelle]

Digital stuff is very much real and many people make their living from it.
Imagine like you're 20 and respect others and not just think of yourself and your fun

[carmine folio]

said im done

[echo orchid]

then be done

[echo orchid]

i’m 36yo, i earn a good chunk of my otherwise very good living from 3d stuff and digital stuff, and have been doing it for the last 10+ years
if you cannot understand that ip rights is a real thing, then you’ve been living under a rock

also offtopic, want to discuss it further, see #other_ip_topics

[cedar flint]

@echo orchid https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2860064518&searchtext=
Doubt this mod adds the 'Z' but it has other mods as dependencies that do by the looks of it

[frozen dome]

yeah some guy repacking assets from an 10+ year old AAA+ game to make a neat little mod for arma 3 is taking money directly out of the pockets of already-paid developers

little known fact, but they get chargebacks any time something like that happens

[frozen dome]

are we protecting the copyright of the russian armed forces now

[cedar flint]

#ip_rights_violations message
#ip_rights_violations message
#ip_rights_violations message

^Pick one. Clearly states the reason why RHS assets are not to contain the Z.

[faint nacelle]

You cant pick and choose whose rights you violate and whose you dont.

[manic laurel]

for a very young account you are quite vocal in the IP section, and not in the good way.
immediate disclaimer, you will not have the ability to defend ripping here, try and you will get removed gracefully.
Enjoy the rest of the channels

[faint nacelle]

@elfin heron no need to prod people like that either thanks.

[tiny jacinth]

why link this mod specifically and not link the dependencies with the actual ripped content?

[cedar flint]

As the links above show.
Depicting screenshots included war symbols aka 'Z' is against RHS's license agreement

[tiny jacinth]

maybe im blind, but i dont see any Z in the screenshots on the mod page

[cedar flint]

Every single screenshot/image of vehicles has Z on them...

[tiny jacinth]

ah, its on the vehicles, are you sure its not just a Z

it seems fairly easy to make

[cedar flint]

Oh yes a white Z on Russian vehicles. Must be a coincidence.
its not like the description states this
This mod includes vehicle crew members of the Russian military during the 2022 war in Ukraine. Includes 5 different variations of crew members with white armbands and vehicles with Z markings.

[tiny jacinth]

alright, fair, then why not link the mods that actually contain the 'Z' instead?

[cedar flint]

In fact @echo orchid That users' workshop uploads are full of various Ukraine war related mods many (if not all) have Z's

[tiny jacinth]

referring to "Doubt this mod adds the 'Z' but it has other mods as dependencies that do by the looks of it"

[cedar flint]

because.
Screenshots of the mods page contain Zs which are not allowed.
Regardless of the mod they come from.

[tiny jacinth]

even so

[cedar flint]

@faint nacelle

[faint nacelle]

https://tenor.com/view/goat-gif-10344461

Pufu's been notified he checks it out and handles whatever gets found accordinly.

[cedar flint]

@'d you in regards to continuation of this #ip_rights_violations message

[faint nacelle]

I dont quite follow how that is connected to the latest exchange but youve notified RHS representative about the problem so they will likely look into it.

[echo orchid]

in case someone missed this - https://www.rhsmods.org/page/EULA#no-depiction-of-russian-invasion-in-ukraine

[bleak adder]

"We, the development team of RHS unanimously condone any real life wars, past present and future."
rhs pro-war

[echo orchid]

@bleak addersay what\

[bleak adder]

forgot a word or two I'm guessing

[echo orchid]

@bleak adderis says do NOT condone for me, can you please check?

[bleak adder]

yup, fixed now

[echo orchid]

@bleak adder thanks

[hardy nova]

@echo orchid regarding this mod, one of its dependencies also use rhs https://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/?id=2816240214 (visible Z and V on vehicles)

[hardy nova]

I saw ping here

[urban hatch]

@runic wraith is any of my stuff on the workshop being taken down by usp?

The artwork covers?

[runic wraith]

Artwork covers? I have no idea if anything of yours is being taken down unless you wanna link some of it for me to check. If it was, wouldn't have anything to do with artwork, and would be based around reuploading or rips of USP content.

[runic wraith]

And just to clarify, that does include if you have reuploaded mods such as TFL, FLB, TFB, Gatekeep, etc. Since those have been known to contain ripped USP assets, among others.

[glacial moon]

So any mod that has been uploaded and doesnt have permission from the original owner is a violation right?

[vivid wave]

Yes

[glacial moon]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=909893746

Pretty sure this is a copy pasta from arma 2

[honest gust]

Did you read the description

Bruh

[glacial moon]

never got permission

just gave credits which isn't permission

doesnt make it right

[plain rivet]

And you’re sure they didn’t?

[glacial moon]

im sure, if he had permission he would have said so instead of just giving credits and thinking that would be enough.

Its the law.

[faint nacelle]

You'll have to report it to the original author.

We don't want IP theft approving spam here thanks.

[glacial moon]

Unfortunately the original creator has disappeared, don't know if he's dead or not but nevertheless the copyright is still active. Didn't know whether or not you guys could do something about it.

[molten kraken]

There are author "just" asking for credits on their parts, you're assuming he doesn't have permissions because he "just" gave credits that's not a certainty until the author says something or the suspected mod author give proofs.

Did you try contacting the original author on the forums?

Even though his last visit is from 2012:
https://forums.bohemia.net/profile/744985-gigan/

[glacial moon]

The original Author is from the Arma 2 community and is no longer active on the internet as far as I could find. If I couldn't get any response via email as well as other people trying and getting no response I highly doubt that this person was able to.

[molten kraken]

I assume that's a "yes" to my question then

[glacial moon]

Do i need to spell it out for you?

[elfin heron]

Can you find the original mod

[glacial moon]

https://sites.google.com/site/giganarma/gcam

[elfin heron]

I'm on mobile but it looks like the source files are included there?

[glacial moon]

yes

[pulsar jackal]

It was sarcasm directed at old mate and his spam

[elfin heron]

Normally people who don't want their content modified don't include source files

Mod ip is down to mod authors not BI

[glacial moon]

so anyone can reupload a mod as long as they can hide it from the mod author?

[elfin heron]

..?

[glacial moon]

With your logic as long as the mod author never finds the reupload then it cant be taken down. Correct?

[elfin heron]

What on earth are you on about

[glacial moon]

the mod creator has to report it correct?

so if the mod creator never finds the mod or is completely unaware of its existence then the mod cant/wont be taken down

[vivid wave]

"Permission" is still a thing if none of authors aware

[elfin heron]

No, there are PLENTY of tools to find reuploaded files on the steam workshop

[glacial moon]

then this workshop mod should be taken down

it very clearly violates Copyright

[elfin heron]

Ok, contact the mod author if you think so

[glacial moon]

the mod author is no longer on the internet or any chat forums

so back to my point

[elfin heron]

BI do not handle it and they are even more unlikely to take down a mod which included the source files in its original download lol

[glacial moon]

if the mod creator is unresponsive, cant find the mod, or is unaware of the mods existence then no one can take it down

am i wrong?

[elfin heron]

you are correct

[glacial moon]

so I can modify this mod and upload it and then no one could do anything about it? because the mod creator is no longer active in the community or online for all we know

[elfin heron]

you are correct and its made easy for you because they uploaded the source files 🙂

[glacial moon]

im not talking about that brother

hoooolllyyyy

[elfin heron]

Have you ever considered that somebody who uploaded the source files several years ago to their mod and is no longer in the community doesn't particularly care..?

[glacial moon]

its still the law and should be enforced

[elfin heron]

ok, contact the mod author 😂

nobody can issue a dmca on behalf of somebody else

[glacial moon]

good luck i already tried

[elfin heron]

if you cannot find anyone with rights to it then nobody can issue a dmca 😂

it's really not a hard concept to grasp

[sharp void]

Technically BI could remove the mod from the workshop without a DCMA (they have the ability to do so as has been demonstrated previously). However that is reserved for repeat offenders and other similar mods. I do not believe they will do it with GCam but I don't speak for 'em.

[elfin heron]

They don't do it for reuploads of other mods, only ripped content

[sharp void]

Hence the last bit

[glacial moon]

There is literally a mod creator with the rights, he just cant be reached.

[elfin heron]

great, so you cannot find anyone with rights to it..?

[glacial moon]

I'm gonna go try to contact some mod authors and see if they don't reply. hopefully they don't.

[elfin heron]

there are wheels that go around in worse circles than this conversation jfc

[glacial moon]

youre brand new and we were talking about Copyright until the last message

[carmine folio]

yes i was trying to look for the channel

cos i had to scroll so much 😭

[glacial moon]

actual troll

[glacial moon]

what does that even mean?

[elfin heron]

that explains a lot

[glacial moon]

There are wheels that go around in circles worse than this conversation jfc*

is what you meant to say

[elfin heron]

no it is not

[echo orchid]

you can flag that, steam will look into it. Steam workshop requirements state that in order to upload to their platform the one uploading needs to own ip rights over the content he uploads

[pulsar jackal]

So what’s next, go thru every mod on steam? How about step one contact the author, no response then contact BI. No need to go on virtue signalling on a discord server. And I’m the one accused of spam….🤔

[hallow idol]

Or if the original mod author allowed you the uploader to upload it

[rustic copper]

incorrect; it's still not allowed, and someone else can report it to Steam or put out a DMCA in his/her name to force a takedown.
And BI can take down the upload as well if they have seen enough proof of illegal content.

So even when the copyright holder is not doing anything, there are still a lot of ways to get rid of crap on the internet.

[elfin heron]

why would you include the source files if you didnt want it to be modified 💀

hello everybody here is my mod you can have the option of just source files or source files and pbo

[rustic copper]

Just because something is open source, doesn't mean you can just do whatever with it...

[echo orchid]

irrelevant unless there a license attached to said files

[elfin heron]

hi guys look at what ive made
im now going to leave the community and be uncontactable
dont use my open source projects 😱

[echo orchid]

open source does not mean i freely share my ip rights with everyone

[echo orchid]

if you keep on trolling like you currently are you’ll end up trolling someplace else

[elfin heron]

how is that trolling

it is literally what is happening

he has shown everybody what has made

has left community and is uncontactable

and now apparently nobody is allowed to use his open source projects

[echo orchid]

irrelevant - he still ownes ip rights over his work, and i see no license stipulating that he is sharing his ip freely with everyone else

[echo orchid]

they can do that, they cannot upload to places like valve’s steam workshop where they require the uploader to share ip rights with valve, ip rights no one but the original author owns

how hard is to grasp that?

[elfin heron]

hes also been helping people out fix his mod on his youtube btw

[echo orchid]

oi! do you understand the legal part of what i’ve been writing here? what does youtube have anything to do with this channel, sw or the topic at hand

[elfin heron]

because its the mod author helping people port his content to the new arma title..?

[rustic copper]

I had to search and wait 3 months till a guy could respond to me so I could take over his project because he left the community and didn't include an open license. But I did get permission (with proof).

And all my projects are open source, but with licenses which don't allow you to simply steal it or reupload it. But still people do that...

I use Open Source to HELP others understanding the logic and give ideas/solutions, and hopefully feedback and bugfixes. Not to have weeks/months of work taken and butchered for their own profits...

[echo orchid]

last time - you cannot upload to sw stuff you do not own ip rights for. end of.

[elfin heron]

what has this got to do with sw

this is about gcam

[echo orchid]

this has everything to do with it, and is the start of the topic at hand

#ip_rights_violations message

[elfin heron]

???

disney dont own gcam last time i checked

[echo orchid]

disney?

[molten kraken]

He probably read sw as star wars and not steam workshop

[hallow idol]

Nobody in the world, but a few people in this channel, write "steam workshop" as "sw", and I believe full-well knowing how much confusion it causes and has caused for years))

[hallow idol]

It is still illegal accord to the laws n rules of the workshop that a mod is uploaded without specific permission given, regardless of absolutely anything else. So even through this hurts nobody and is literally the will of the creator - the most hardcore ip warriors will see to take this down

Even worse case sometime ago - a workshop mod was edited & reuploaded, which was allowed as its own license said "You are allowed to edit & reupload my mod" - but they still banned the re-uploader because he didn't get personal permission from the author

[echo orchid]

read the channel topic.
The question was about the legality. Said mod can be hosted anywhere else where the hosting platform does not required sharing of ip rights

[hallow idol]

Yeah, it's correct, I am not arguing that - what is done is indeed illegal

[echo orchid]

hardcore ip warriors is an euphemism. Try and stay away from such classifications.
No one but the author can fill a DMCA. Anyone else can flag it for review.
Question is was asked, answer was provided. There is no middle ground, no matter what your own personal opinion is.

[cedar flint]

Can this be pinned? Considering how often this gets brought up?

[ember field]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2857836568 feels like a mash of different mods

[knotty radish]

Yeah I've noticed this too, SW is almost universally recognized as Star Wars. I've only seen PuFu and Dwarden abbreviate the workshop as sw.

[steel rivet]

Why has GCAM been on workshop for years when it violates the rules?

[manic laurel]

nobody reported it until then most likely

[steel rivet]

And if Steam doesn't take it down?

[manic laurel]

I don't get the question

[tiny jacinth]

isnt it illegal to file a DMCA for someone unless you're the copyright owner (or someone authorized by the owner)

[manic laurel]

it is illegal to file a DMCA on behalf of the rights owner yes

(well, unless you are its legal representant ofc)

[tiny jacinth]

ok word

[manic laurel]

?

[steel rivet]

What if Steam doesn't take it down? Does that mean it's allowed?

[tiny jacinth]

just clarifying, but i also use "word" synonymous with things like "cool"

[manic laurel]

still no; it is not "if not removed then it must be legal"

if it is illegal it is illegal therefore it is illegal 😃

[manic laurel]

ah ok, thanks
but just for clarification, everybody can report an Intellectual Property breach or a ripped content
just the DMCA process itself can only be done by the IP owner 🙂

[echo orchid]

steam workshop has been abbreviated SW way before there were any star wars (ripped) mods infringing on Disney ip about…

[tiny jacinth]

makes sense

[tiny jacinth]

im gonna be real, i have literally never in my life seen SW in reference to steam workshop

[molten kraken]

apart from in this channel

[knotty radish]

im just talking in terms of general consciousness: people who see SW will more than likely read it as Star wars. as Star Wars is more popular than Steam Workshop. thats all I was trying to say my friend.

[manic laurel]

@echo orchid what about SWS for Steam WorkShop later?

[tiny jacinth]

that could clear up some confusion about the abbreviation usage^

for sure

[knotty radish]

^

[steel rivet]

If it's illegal then why wouldn't it get removed?

[manic laurel]

exactly

[steel rivet]

So if I reported it now. Steam would have to remove since it's illegal right?

[manic laurel]

well if illegal, yeah?

I really do not know where you are going with that

[frozen dome]

I love Gcam

Good luck with the crusade btw I will be inconvenienced by it being taken down

[molten kraken]

you could always analyse what the original script does and do the same in arma 3 for yourself

[frozen dome]

Ah yes, let me learn how to code SQF to make my own version of something that's already existed for years

There's a weird expectation in the community that everyone who plays arma should and does know the intricacies of sqf

hey speaking of IP rights, are Ace and RHS paying royalties to the brands and governments that own the vehicles they depict (and represent by their actual name)?

Seeing as they either rename Arma vehicles to their real world counterparts or add vehicles that are certainly patented and copyrighted by, for example, General Dynamics, in the case of the Abrams tank?

Maybe a licensing fee? (Has to be something, we've covered in here that there is no such thing as a free use or open source permissive usecase for similar or hand made content that replicates things belonging to anyone else)

[manic laurel]

they have permission, because they asked for it

[frozen dome]

Pause, from every MIC company from the multiple countries they represent? Including the ones in Russia, Serbia, etc?

I'm dead serious by the way, that seems like a leap in allowability just based on watching the topics that come up in here day by day.

[manic laurel]

oh my, are you trying to pull them down to feel better about yourself?
some people do it right, get over it and try to do the same instead of joining and immediately complaining in this very channel.

[sharp void]

Whoa Lou

[frozen dome]

No, I'm not pulling anyone down and I don't need to feel better about myself at all. I'm genuinely curious if they have the rights to use the assets or if they should be flagged for review. If on one side Bohemia allowed it because Bohemia is confident there won't be legal trouble from the Russian/Serbian government over depictions of their properties, that's one thing

I imagine there's a reason vanilla Arma 3 uses faux names for their representations of real world content

But if "doing it right" is producing content without a personally dictated license from all of these rightsholders... I don't follow the logic.

[manic laurel]

If on one side Bohemia allowed it because Bohemia is confident there won't be legal trouble from the Russian/Serbian government over depictions of their properties, that's one thing
that's your assumption. check with the respective teams for all the paperwork

[sharp void]

In regards to US military equipment you are allowed to use the military designation freely as far as I know.
Eg.
You can use M4 but not a brand name like BCM

[frozen dome]

That's why I'm asking here - the RHS rep seems to be pretty active in here

[manic laurel]

if "doing it right" is producing content without a personally dictated license from all of these rightsholders... I don't follow the logic.
exactly, doing it right is obtaining permission, indeed.

[frozen dome]

without

[manic laurel]

I know, I am correcting you
doing things right = with permission

[frozen dome]

I'm giving the benefit of the doubt anyways and will back off because you're a greenname, but I think the point I raised is exceptionally valid, considering how seriously the same point is taken when it's brought up regarding smaller or younger mod creators.

Even including CUP, which was targeted a few days ago.

[manic laurel]

will back off because you're a greenname
wrong reason really.

but trying to tackle down peeps that have been doing things properly for the last decade(s), you are stooping(?) low.

[frozen dome]

Was just making a point about the process here, that's all. There's nothing I could do in this channel that could cause problems for RHS, I don't own the rights to the various patents and materials they represent in their mods, and I also don't have the time to spend tracking down the terms of each company for each vehicle represented and battling on their behalf for free to ruin the work put in by RHS. Also yes, that's the right context for using stooping

[manic laurel]

as we stated earlier, you cannot DMCA but you can report still

and thanks for the "stooping" thing, all I get is the Gotye song for reference 😬

[sharp void]

It should be noted just because you do something right for a period of time doesn't mean you shouldn't be scrutinized (in regards to the topic of this channel) the same as someone who is just starting out.

I doubt RHS doesn't have license and such but just because it's "RHS" (or any other big name) doesn't mean you shouldn't question if they do.

[manic laurel]

correct - still I don't see them throwing everything out the window like that.
checking from time to time not being a bad thing ofc

[manic laurel]

this paragraph seemed to me very "hey, let me nitpick about everything so we cannot criticise others until they are clear" - especially after telling you they asked for permission

without seeing any other potential meaning to it that I see now; so sorry for lashing out earlier and not giving the benefit of the doubt

but also, do not assume either they went for one permission and said "oh ok, let's go with it"

[coral thorn]

Will attempt to verify certain patents and models through Russian state government, civic code, and corporations on their individual intellectual property rights to further understand their stance and confirm that the use of Russian Intellectual Property rights will not be infringed, wish me luck 👍

[echo orchid]

paying royalties would imply that RHS is be a commercial entity, making money from a product, and it isn’t, and it doesn’t.

[frozen dome]

Maybe a licensing fee?

[echo orchid]

a 3d model is an artist representation, much like a painting if a real world object.
Even GM, that has a trade dress for their humvee, lost the lawsuit against activision for reason explained here numerous times

patent wise - none are for 3d models. that are a representation of said real life thing. please don’t make this more of a laughing matter than needs it to be.

[frozen dome]

I'm not sure how and where this became a laughing matter - in my eyes not a really good look to look down your nose when you receive the same scrutiny with which you place on other users and their content.

[echo orchid]

sure, no problem with that.

but considering what you wrote above (including patents and royalties and licenses from governments) you do seem to confuse a lot of the terms and legal base

[frozen dome]

So RHS did contact each government affiliated manufacturing entity responsible for the various vehicles and weapons and got explicit permission to represent them in Arma?

[echo orchid]

nope, of course not, because RHS does not need to

do you need to contact lamborghini and the italian government in order to take a picture of that car / draw that car?

sure, if you were to actually make a car and compete in the same segment, while also using patented gearbox, then you’d be in a different kind of trouble

[frozen dome]

Well, I see the same argument against other original depictions of other IP in arma mods here before. I just hope you've covered all your bases.

[echo orchid]

again, confusion on your part

[frozen dome]

E.g. "It doesn't matter what their policies on recreation or use of these assets are, I think it's against the rules..."

I'm not confused, I'm just making a point. If you're confident you have no gaps in your armor, all power to you.

[echo orchid]

you confuse disney stance, a business that competes in the same sector, with a completely made up ip, with a real life product

[frozen dome]

Your representations arguably compete with any other military shooter that has these depictions in-game (and don't use the real-world names).

Under that logic anyways

[echo orchid]

we had various email exchanges with various manufacturers, explaining both the non commercial product we produce, as well as the scope of tge product (for copyright / branding reasons) we have also checked the legality of virtual representation of real life military assets with 2 separate lawyers.

[onyx iron]

Funnily enough they considered that in france for public buildings...

[echo orchid]

only one i know is eiffel tower, and that is because the the lights, not the structure. also afaik, it is in regards to selling said picture(s), not publishing it

[echo orchid]

we don’t have licensing deals, we have written permissions from manufacturers for using their brands on our representation of their products. Most are smart enough to understand that by provision said permission for a non-commercial product, that is free advertising since there is no money to be made anyways

i am honestly concerned that you are telling me that the people here have ever said - no you cannot model that real life whatever (especially military fielded gear) - because patents

[frozen dome]

ip rights, ownership of designs, property, symbolism, appearance, etc., i'm not arguing explicitly about patent #15299 being xyz

[onyx iron]

Nope it covers any public building in Belgium and France and its pictures on any public website, copyright can be pretty stupid at times.

[frozen dome]

as has been discussed in prior conversations, particularly when it comes to copyright, legal does not always equal good

nor illegal bad

[echo orchid]

also, generally speaking, if you wanna get into an argumentative discussion on a subject, instead of just typing random words here, you better do your homework about it and actually learn what these means

[frozen dome]

not something worth investing time into

i was presenting a bad faith argument towards you and RHS in the same way other randoms in this channel scrutinize smaller mods just for their own amusement

and to my point, there was still support in this channel over reviewing your content, rather than understanding you probably have your ducks in a row

[echo orchid]

i heard that is being contested

[manic laurel]

don't, for it is spam and not "very serious" as you stated earlier.

[knotty radish]

may I ask how presenting a critique on the regulatory zeal that some members here posses towards certain projects over others is considered Spam? not looking to continue this, honestly just curious as to the thought process here. thank you for your time.

[manic laurel]

if critique is to be provided, it should be happening in #discord_server and not joking around in #ip_rights_violations pretending to be serious, that's trolling

[knotty radish]

ah, I see, so its mainly due to the channel in which the discussion is taking place.

[manic laurel]

RHS isn't above checking, CUP isn't above checking, heck even BI isn't above checking.
but hitting them in an attempt to defend rippers… that's little

[manic laurel]

and the action itself; criticism and suggestions themselves are otherwise welcome

[knotty radish]

I see. well, its no secret this channel is quite... divisive, at least from my experiences. but I wish y'all the best of luck with moderating it.

[manic laurel]

thank you, appreciated
the end goal is really not to make everyone backstab each other by reporting every little thing… but if at least the most blatent rips could be nuked and some educated global mindset could rise from all this, it would be nice for everyone and would support even more creativity and community content

[knotty radish]

On your second point, why not make a PowerPoint or other such document describing IP law as is generally understood here, so people looking to get involved could better understand what is allowed and not allowed and be better prepared? If that makes sense.

[echo orchid]

there is a wiki page

[crimson ingot]

yeah it's literally on pinned messages

#ip_rights_violations message

[knotty radish]

Ah, so it is. Apologies, i was looking for pdfs and the like.

[faint nacelle]

A big problem we have faced so far with this stuff is that there are numerous people spreading misinformation and malice towards whats happening here and their followers believe what they are told without making sure facts are right.

[tiny jacinth]

even in context, i believe that some of the topics in this channel are a little goofy, but i also on occasion, gain more insight on things

i think a big problem is people being biased towards each other - ie long standing members vs newer - and instead of taking the time to actually read and deliberate, forming an opinion off the first sentence and responding to that

and its only harder to differentiate between people who are genuinely discussing or people who are trolling, since there are so many people who flock here specifically to stir the pot

[manic laurel]

yes
this is why the Intellectual_Property wiki page was made, in an attempt to educate people who are actually willing to learn.
of course, due to the abuse of rippers feigning ignorance, we made this channel conversation-free. if you have a question, you can ask it, but it is now not a place for debate or what ifs etc. Sad because as you said, education is always better - but we simply cannot moderate all that.

[tiny jacinth]

isnt there a channel specifically for discussions about things posted in ip_rights_violations

[manic laurel]

#other_ip_topics exists yes

[native sun]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2864514264

this looks fishy?

"This is vanilla living version of buldozer - BIS have some problem with authotisation of this model license (source model and textures are from A3 - but whole config of model and model mechanics is done from 0) so they block last relase of it without any detailed explanaton"

same with this other mod from him: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2864536445

[ember berry]

I remember that mod being shown here before... I guess he didn't understand which parts were not okay for him to use.

Seems he also still has the trawler uploaded on the Workshop, which was also shared here and looks awfully a lot like the one from the base game.

Probably something for @pliant oar to look at as the uploader seems to be a repeat offender?

[coral thorn]

I see, so modifying and using Arma 3 files is not allowed but using say, Arma 2 files isn’t? Interesting

[manic laurel]

what are you saying?

[coral thorn]

Should rephrase hold on

[soft egret]

Arma 2 files is also not allowed.
But there is the "Licensed Data Pack" which has source files released with a license that allows modification (I'm summarizing, read the license in detail if you want to know what it allows)

[coral thorn]

modifying and debinarizing Arma 3 files is against the EULA but not forwarding Arma 2 into Arma 3 files?

or is Arma 2 going into Arma 3 not considering modification

[soft egret]

^ This.
If you take it out of the licensed data pack, you can port it to A3 (following the license terms).

But you cannot take things from Arma 2 and port it to A3
You can take things from specifically the Licensed Data Pack, NOT from the game.

[coral thorn]

I see

[chilly silo]

@frozen dome Have a read of this - https://arma3practicalipguide.blogspot.com/

It answers every one of your arguments with a nice explanation and links to the law where needed.

[manic laurel]

don't bother @chilly silo, as you can see through his answer there his whole action was motivated by "providing entertainment" and not learning things and doing them right.

[frozen dome]

Definitely not "providing entertainment," I said that nowhere.

[chilly silo]

@manic laurel Regardless, he no longer needs to ask questions because he has a nice reference now. And those that he was "Entertaining" have the link too.

[frozen dome]

Were you paid to work on this documentation?

[manic laurel]

just for their own amusement

[chilly silo]

No, I got pissed off with answering the same questions over and over. So I wrote the site

its an ongoing epic

[frozen dome]

This was in reference to the people that lurk in this channel for any opportunity to throw new mods, or old ones they've suddenly found a crack in, to the piranhas. I was referring to the people that abuse this channel and copyright systems just for the sake of griefing.

[echo orchid]

who is the piranhas?

[frozen dome]

Anyone in here that isn't an official Bohemia rep, or a representative of a different corporation serving the interests of their own copyright.

Anyone who obsesses over the finer points of IP law debate*, I should say.

E.g. the guy that tried to open an investigation into CUP.

[chilly silo]

Oh the irony 😛

[manic laurel]

oooh, calling people names because you don't adhere to their thinking, smort
now now, name-calling is bad, don't

[frozen dome]

🤨

[echo orchid]

https://tenor.com/view/laugh-laughing-drink-and-laugh-drinking-laugh-rajabets-gif-22201520

[manic laurel]

yeah, it's in the #rules

[crimson ingot]

So what's the end point here?

[frozen dome]

People can choose how to spend their time, I just don't think it's the responsibility of randoms on the internet to defend the int prop of multi-million dollar corporations. Even here, I was only baited into this conversation by further prodding.

On a personal level I hold a lot of disagreement with the general state of copyright law across the world. Like I've said a few times before, legal != right.

[chilly silo]

I think you have it ass backwards. The majority of people here are defending their rights to their own work. Or they are trying to understand why or how something they worked on is not going to be allowed. The consequence of that is a wider understanding of how Copyright works and the Rights of others. Including the likes of Disney, Microsoft, Paramount and thousands of other groups, companies etc

Like it or loathe it, it is the law. And honest decent people like staying on the right side of that line.

[frozen dome]

I think people defending their own work is exactly what a channel like this should be used for, but I have been in this server at various times throughout the years, and I've never once seen a conversation brought up that had anything to do with someone's own content being stolen. Nor have I ever heard of this channel being used for that purpose. I don't think anyone disagrees that the people that need the help are small creators.

[manic laurel]

!ban @frozen dome 0 lame IP troll

[edgy coral]

*PewPewPew!!*
RIP @frozen dome

[chilly silo]

I've never once seen a conversation brought up that had anything to do with someone's own content being stolen.
Ah then you have not actually read enough then.

[manic laurel]

I've seen enough, that's it

[chilly silo]

And did you just call me a Nazi?

[crimson ingot]

0 what? is this permanent?

[manic laurel]

yes.

likewise

[crimson ingot]

yep back to arma

[knotty radish]

ah wonderful, I was just talking about something like this yesterday!

So long as everything in here is agreed upon by the shotcallers here, That could be a very nice pin IMHO.

[manic laurel]

wait, isn't it already?

[knotty radish]

is it?

ah

it is, my apologies.

[manic laurel]

if it hadn't, I believe it is linked in the Intellectual_Property wiki page anyway

[manic laurel]

no need to, improvements are always welcome 👍

it's still better than this channel's usual shitstorm 😄

[knotty radish]

yeah so I have seen. I know you have #other_ip_topics, perhaps it would be beneficial to move it under the Creative discussion grouping, so that way those who come on to contest or complain about their mod can go there easily by just looking slightly below this channel, and leave this place to soley rely on the reporting side of things?

[manic laurel]

it might be a rich idea - @pliant oar? ↑

[pliant oar]

done

[pliant oar]

if it's something of our IP stolen / ripped / abused etc. , first always make report to the email in sticky pinned / channel description , it needs to be listed in our system for other staff

[tiny jacinth]

im goingto respond to this in #other_ip_topics , to keep this channel uncluttered

[kindred loom]

idk if this is the real channel for this questions, but is the map Taviana still DMCA protected in Arma 3?

[rustic copper]

Well, Tavania is an Arma 2 terrain which, without consent of the creator, got ported to Arma 3. So in short, it's not allowed to modify, upload, share, etc the terrain unless you have explicit permission from the creator. Which means that if you do it anyway it can be DMCA'd (or worse)

[kindred loom]

Well, there are multiple upload in Steam Workshop that's why.

[rustic copper]

Doesn't mean it's allowed, and can be removed without further notice

[kindred loom]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2275262563

Martin also posted on third page that he requests a takedown

[soft egret]

posting a comment is not filing a DMCA takedown request

Uh nice hot take

People like you ruin this community
Yeah modders creating terrains that many people want to use are ruining this community :kek:

[kindred loom]

I just asked because ppl asked for a Taviana server, but I know the discussion from back 2017 when Taviana first showed up on Arma 3 and the owner of Taviana A2 didn't liked that it was ported and DMCA'ed it.

[pliant jolt]

Well it's gone now anyway

[manic laurel]

*poof*

[carmine folio]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2871276226

Looks like this was taken w/o permission

[plain rivet]

Inform the veteran mod team

[finite zinc]

Why was I pinged here.

[plain rivet]

Ghost ping?

[manic laurel]

@plain rivet did then deleted

[plain rivet]

I did? I didn’t ping anyone

Besides Rivera

[manic laurel]

(river) logs state otherwise 🪵

ah no, mb

Rivera

[plain rivet]

I pinged Rivera to inform them to contact the original mod team. That’s about it

[manic laurel]

@carmine folio did, @finite zinc not @plain rivet
I skipped a line while reading logs 😄

[manic laurel]

mb mb ✋

[plain rivet]

All good

[carmine folio]

I accidentaly pinged you haha

I apologize

[manic laurel]

not good enough!! you should wire all of us money now

[carmine folio]

buy goatkart dlc 4 times

[grim rose]

Another great "build" addon for Russian server with monetization without specifying the authors and violations of APL and APL-SA. DMCA Violations

Link:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2816063163

Inside is:
TFAR, USAF, ALiVE, Enhanced Movement, Discord Rich Presence, GRADs stuff, Lambs, zen and bunch of others things.

So, @tropic steeple @half holly @opal fox maybe you wanna DMCA this one?

[grim rose]

By the way, can anyone suggest whether it is realistic to do something about the servers that are based and administered by real war criminals?

The server that uses the addon above for example is literally based and administered by a war criminal from the Wagner PMC. They "play" in the setting of the current military conflict in Ukraine and of course the server is monetized.

I have another one like this as an example. But as I understand the only thing we can do with them is to nail them for monetization (license violation).

[molten kraken]

Being a criminal has nothing to do about the administration/hosting of servers unless there are special laws about what you're hosting that conflicts with your criminal record (otherwise a lot of people wouldn't be able to host anything). Breaking EULA on the server (monetization most likely do) can bring the rights holder to do things.

[grim rose]

And another one. Violation of APL-SA for @spark bay 3den enhanced and bunch of others mods (KKA, TWA, GRADs) inside another Z Russian "modpack". No authors provided, re-upload, monetisation
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2856405388&searchtext=AoW_core

Second one from this guy. Same violations. But in this time it's HAFM mod Aplion and bunch of others that I didn't mention
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2856602978&searchtext=AoW_mod

Third one. Same as before but in this time it's mostly LAMBS that was stolen from @half holly
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2856426035&searchtext=Aow+Castom

[grim rose]

I emailed Bohemia with complaint about commercial use. Let's see what comes out of this, I hope they take it seriously.

[glossy nymph]

As the creator of the aforementioned server, I can safely say that there is no monetization and no microtransactions on the server. I will be very happy to provide all the evidence, because even in the support channel for paying for hosting on my server, the following is indicated:

"This offer is not a public offer, contributions are a voluntary donation (Article 582 of the Civil Code of the Russian Federation), are not a purchase and sale, delivery or other transaction.
When making a donation, the user consents to the processing and storage of personal data (indefinitely, unless otherwise specified in the message), confirms his legal capacity.
Please note that in accordance with paragraph 1 of Article 1062 of the Civil Code of the Russian Federation, the claims of citizens and legal entities related to the organization of games and betting or participation in them are not subject to judicial protection, except for the claims of persons who took part in games or betting under the influence of deception, violence, threat or malicious agreement of their representative with the organizer of the games and betting, as well as the requirements specified in paragraph 5 of Article 1063 of the Civil Code of the Russian Federation."

The mod was created as a collection of such beautiful mods precisely without claiming copyright by anyone from my community, just to make it easier to connect to the server itself.

[glossy nymph]

«Russian» server is nothing more than an attempt to discriminate against Russians.

And for all the moderators of this discord, as well as for the copyright holders of mods, I can say that this person @grim rose , none other than my former colleague, the creator on his server, is my friend and the owner of my hosting. And the shield on that server was nothing but an executive director. By the way, they used the same mod assembly, under a similar name, but his server closed yesterday due to lack of online, and he began to blame and try to shit on all the servers he only knew, arranging raids with cheats, blocking the server and writing information that all Russians should die from Himars and be executed.

[glossy nymph]

Golden words! He's just trying to shift the blame of his failures to someone else, although he himself also used all the same mods on his server and he, I want to say, actually had donations

[vocal pumice]

Good afternoon, before considering this situation further, I want to show you a little, let's say, a human creation, namely @grim rose, at 22:40 Moscow time I see a lot of pings in the discord, then I go to and see that there are screenshots of the players on which it says (sorry I can't attach screenshots)

1. Ma won't rest until we destroy your junk! Promised? Take it!
2. You are fucking war criminals and The Hague is waiting for you.
   I go into the server logs and see the ID, which later came not only to me, namely 76561198150250253, when searching, Steam comes up https://steamcommunity.com/id/shield2282
   But I have only one question, what did I do to you? I have players from Ukraine and guys who fought against each other in the SVO, and then rode together on armored personnel carriers in the armа3.

Are all Russian military-themed servers outlawed now?

[vivid wave]

We do not do anything with a server that depicts the current conflict. RHS dudes may, though.

[vocal pumice]

I learned my mistake, I will continue to be more careful, but note that my contacts were indicated, and I also wrote that I am not the author of the mod,
Я правда не понимаю тебя...
На счёт "inside another Z Russian "modpack" " к тематике СВО сервер себя не относит, никаких зетак на технике и тд, а так грубо попрошу не выражаться, тк компания у нас сирийская...

[vocal pumice]

You have the best mods :3

[soft egret]

Whether monetized or not doesn't change the fact if there are reupload without permission in there.
If monetized however it elevates it to another level

[glossy nymph]

Almost every server has its own collection of mods

[vivid wave]

It doesn't make the move innocent 🤔

[glossy nymph]

Download 120 mods through the launcher with more than one mod, anyway, it's not rauional and not convenient, and even more so to download them all in the steam separately

[glossy nymph]

May be

And what about specifying in the assembly links to provaoblodatel and the schedule of the composition of the server mod?

Can I try to do this?

You're trying to support the arma community, which is already dying in the Russian segment, almost every server player has all the necessary DLC and CDLC to support arma, but such a small oversight is inflated to such a scale

[soft egret]

That the person reporting your (potential) missbehaviour having stated to "take you down" also doesn't invalidate his claims in any way..
It just shows that you are aggressive and want to fight against anyone trying to report your wrongdoing by trying to discredit them

[glossy nymph]

Did we deserve such an attitude, especially because of the inflated conflict that was created by a man who violated all the same things, only later decided to give a shit about those who still voluntarily manage to pull up community games in their region

[soft egret]

If you did what he says you did, yes you do.
If not, then no you don't. But if you didn't do anything wrong you could just say so, instead of attacking and trying to discredit the reporter.
It shows that you likely have something to hide

[glossy nymph]

So a person does all the same nasty things, besides pinching the murders of Russians

[soft egret]

You have the time now to fix it though, take down your illegal uploads, and stop monetizing (if you do it).
It's in your hands what will happen

[glossy nymph]

No, you just didn't see what was happening on our servers yesterday, how they broke hosting services with calls to kill Russians on the whole screen, and when we turned on anti-cheat and corrected everything, he started trying to crush us by writing here

[glossy nymph]

kk

[vocal pumice]

Alas, this is not so, this person helped me with the installation of the database, and today I see this + deDos attack on the server from his side, while I didn’t do anything to him ... I don’t feed bad news or something else, I saw my own mistake and go to fix it, but why he made a DDOS attack is not clear to me...

[soft egret]

Ok. But still how is that related to this if what he's saying is the truth.
Or even if he's not saying the truth, you can just say so without attacking him

[glossy nymph]

I am not alone, here representatives of two servers are accused at once, since people from his exactly the same server preferred to play not with him, but with us. He missed everything and started hitting me in the back

[glossy nymph]

I am not attacking, but constructively defending myself

And my community, which he is trying to discredit with such an appeal

And also the skif server community

[soft egret]

You are trying to defend yourself against your wrongdoings, by trying to discredit the person who's reporting it.
And also above, by trying to justify your wrongdoing (which to me seems like what they reported has some truth to it)
That's a weird way of defending.

Please, if what he says is wrong, then say so, but don't go attacking the person that's reporting.
Attack the report, not the reporter

[glossy nymph]

We didn't do anything wrong to him, but he staged ddos attacks on our servers with calls to kill Russians and shut down the server. And since our tech admins have fixed everything, he tries to destroy us in such a nasty way

[soft egret]

And is that our business, no.
Is it in any way changing whether what he reported is the truth or not, no.

So keep it out of here

[glossy nymph]

Friend, we have nothing wrong with him, we are trying to explain the situation and what he is doing so that you understand that he has malicious intent with his reports and is not a white crow

[glossy nymph]

Kk

Isn't breaking other people's servers with the help of game flaws punishable at the developer level?

[soft egret]

Whether his report was with malicious intent towards you or not.
Doesn't change the fact that if it's true it's very wrong, and if it's false, it will be checked before taking any action anyway.

Lots of people intentionally ignore and don't report wrongdoing if they like the people who are doing it, and only report it when that changes.
Doesn't change the fact that it's still wrong.

[soft egret]

Game flaws? If there are game bugs then please create tickets for them

[glossy nymph]

All right, I suggest we hush up the topic, and just peacefully disperse pretending that nothing happened and we don't know each other

[glossy nymph]

The problems of the fact that anti-cheat and signature verification lets people with integrated malware on the servers into the servers is considered a bug of the game, or not?

[soft egret]

Yes.
If you know how to reproduce it please create a ticket and we'll take a look

Probably a private ticket

[vocal pumice]

I collected various small mods in a bunch, indicated that I was not the author, now I am writing to the mod developers and making a list, don't get me wrong, I just sincerely can't understand...
I am a person who has always tried to resolve conflicts with language, and here, first, from the side of a person, DDOS with Shevenist slogans, and then a report ...

[glossy nymph]

We will come up with something on this occasion, it is tedious to hold a meeting of techadmins and think collectively. Let's make arma much better together

[glossy nymph]

Same

🤙

[glossy nymph]

@vocal pumice @soft egret

[glossy nymph]

Just check the link, there is nothing on it

[vocal pumice]

DDOS servers are bad 😠

[glossy nymph]

+++

We are not touched by the fact that he is talking about our, in his opinion, wrong actions, but by the fact that he is trying to hooliganize and spread hatred towards Russians in the community, emphasizing that the servers are Russian and arranging ddos attacks on them with fascist slogans

That’s the reason of these conflict

[soft egret]

I collected various small mods in a bunch
Then make a collection, thats what they are for.
Sorry but you can't justify to me that you took other peoples stuff without permission, without even asking, and then didn't even give credit (not that it would have made it much better).
The best way is to say "sorry, we didn't think about that" and then fixing the mistake.
But what I see here instead is trying to justify wrongdoing and attacking the person reporting it. Not the way to go.
You did wrong here, so you darn better say sorry and fix it and nothing else.

the fact that he is trying to hooliganize and spread hatred towards Russians in the community
Excuse me if I'm blind, but as far as I can see he never spread any hatred in his messages.
That was all brought up by you, not by him.

Ah I see I missed two messages.

is literally based and administered by a war criminal from the Wagner PMC
Thats defamation against a single person

[manic laurel]

@glossy nymph that's enough
DDOS = your issue
IP infringement = our issue
period

[manic laurel]

@autumn jewelsee above.
if you have evidence, provide it in DMs and we ban people doing raids.
on your end, fix your mod issues.

[autumn jewel]

okey

[echo orchid]

@vocal pumice- https://www.rhsmods.org/page/EULA#no-depiction-of-russian-invasion-in-ukraine

[glossy nymph]

his server is not about such conflict in ukrain

[manic laurel]

not the issue here - the Z symbol on RHS vehicles would be.

[glossy nymph]

He doesn’t have any

[manic laurel]

then good, don't feel threatened by this if everything is by the book

[grim rose]

It's not a bug. Those guys just did not have signature checking enabled on the server, which they are aware of as far as I know.

These servers were reported on a couple of Ukrainian servers. So maybe some people went to them and executed scripts on the client level. But back to the topic.

Regarding the @vocal pumice server, I apologize for providing incorrect information. There is NO monetization on this server, only donations. Aside from DMCA violations, there is everything in order.
P.S: Also as far as I know nobody DDoS'ed you. Maybe you should verify it with your server ISP?

[cedar flint]

Still need this pinned (or something like it) @manic laurel plz ❤️

[manic laurel]

not sure it is exactly relevant to the BI channel itself - though it is a point that is raised quite often

[cedar flint]

hence the hope for a pin. Much easier than trying to find it every time it gets mentioned

[knotty radish]

Im with eagle on this one.

[echo orchid]

i would have pinned it myself, but then again, it is in the very same place where the eula is

[grim rose]

Look. Apart from my attitude to your server (and yes it is negative of course, you're playing for war criminals, but let's leave it on that). There are licenses of mods and ArmA EULA and you have no right to violate them.

Your server violates APL licenses like I said above, the RHS license and the game's monetization policy.

Regarding the APL I said everything above but as for the RHS license you are literally playing on a mission called "Gostomel" about the Ukrainian conflict. Here's the proof at the link
https://www.battlemetrics.com/servers/arma3/16427777

You monetize your project in every possible projection. Here is the proof. Translation of the screenshot from your server and the original.
Translation to ENG: https://i.imgur.com/2WyweF9.png
Original in RU: https://i.imgur.com/qdd9T8t.png

Eliminate the violations or leave. Thank you

And please don't re-upload everything you stole. Cause that's I heart you want to do. Create something unique and without violating licenses. It's more interesting :)

[cinder ridge]

Seeing how there is a screenshot (not even made by them but by a friend of mine) depicting some of my content in that donation channel I am wondering if they just use screenshots of my mod or also the mod itself, so do you happen to still have a list of all the addons that used to be on that reupload and/or more information on that server/community that you could share with me so I could possibly investigate a bit further?

Either in DMs or here, both works for me.

[grim rose]

Can you please share some PBO names with me to check out?

[cinder ridge]

Everything pretagged with "AGE_".

[glossy nymph]

I, as the guilty party, am completely open to dialogue, all the shortcomings are in the process of correction

DM me pls

[cinder ridge]

Well you could start by letting me know if you used my mod on your server, AGE/Alpha Group Equipment.
If you did, then please present me written permission to use it on a monetised server/reupload it, something we (me and the other dev) do hand out usually to people asking us. If not then I must ask you to remove our mod from your server and abstain from using it unless permission is granted for monetising your server BI and all other mod authors of which you use any mods.

Furthermore, if the statement regarding your server depicting the war in ukraine and/or endorsing any sort of warciminals/warcrimes is true, which I can hardly check on nor can judge with the information given, I'd kindly ask you to remove my mod and never make use of it again in the future for I am not in support of the war, nor is my mod made in support of it.

Should this not be the case feel free to use is if the other things are corrected as mentioned above.

[grim rose]

Sorry. Steam deleted it from my A3 Folder so I can't confirm it. I think I saw it earlier but I can't give you any proofs

[glossy nymph]

No, your mod was suggested, but not used

There is nothing to worry about

Only RHS+3CB

None of other equipment mods

[cinder ridge]

Alright as there is contradicting statements now from both of you folks I'll leave it at that.
Thank you both for your answers.

Going forward for you @glossy nymph should you make the decision to make use of it on your server in the future and any of what I wrote above is true please abstain from using it. We do issue takedowns on reuploads which we did not permit. Thanks for clearing things up.

[glossy nymph]

My apologies for using your screenshot

[cinder ridge]

No need to apologize for that, I dont mind it at all. It is just what got me curious whether my mod was used/reuploaded or not. Feel free to remove or keep said screenshot, I dont care about that either way.

[grim rose]

Just for the record on your second request.
I think calling people "Ukroreich" is directly promoting war. But come on, that's offtopic for this channel. I think we should end there.

ENG: https://i.imgur.com/zPM7pkr.png
RU: https://i.imgur.com/jZzdZvn.png

[cinder ridge]

Possibly, but as you said it probably does not belong here.

In the end I dont judge people for "playing" ongoing conflicts, I just dont want my mods to be associated with it and since according to Slon (and battlemetrics server list) that is not the case I do not worry about it any further from here.
Thanks anyway.

[manic laurel]

contradicting this statement then

[vocal pumice]

I realized my fault, I am correcting

[vocal pumice]

We are 2 different Russian servers, with different themes...

[manic laurel]

ok

[soft egret]

only donations.
But real donations yes?
Not people actually selling stuff but calling it "donations" even though they are not? (Lots of servers like to do that, just label a "sale" as "donation" and think its fine)
For a donation, you get nothing in return.
So no "donate and you get access to special skins or reserve slots"

If they do such a thing, then thats something for monetization/infringements department to deal with
And potentially for our Discord Moderators too, EULA violators are not welcome here

[grim rose]

I couldn't find evidence of monetization on Skif resources before I was banned, apparently for posting to this channel. Also, I heard a rumor that these guys even banned people just for knowing me, but that's offtopic :)
All I've found on the public Discord of the Skiff server is a request for a voluntary donation.
If there is any monetization, it's not public. And there is no evidence to believe that there is.

[grim rose]

The server player "Slon" actively monetizes his server in violation of EULA and I wrote about this and another server in support of your company, but so far no response.

The proof is in the post to which I am responding.

[echo orchid]

so who is the owner of sion thing then, considering RHS has a non monetization policy, i wanna report that towards BI legal

and slap a c&d

[grim rose]

@glossy nymph

[echo orchid]

short version - RHS has a strict non-monetization policy, you can read that here
https://www.rhsmods.org/page/EULA#no-monetization

we laso have a policy in regards to depiction of RU invasion in Ukraine, that's a big no no
https://www.rhsmods.org/page/EULA#no-depiction-of-russian-invasion-in-ukraine

as such, i strongly suggest you take the necessary steps to correct that before i come knocking

[glossy nymph]

For the third day you have been walking like children in one place and discussing the same thing, how many times do you need to say that all the shortcomings have been eliminated?

[echo orchid]

let's define shortcomings in your view or in this particular context?

because it sounds less like shortcomings but rather a breach of both BI's and RHS EULA...

[glossy nymph]

What shield is talking about is "server monetization"

"This offer is not a public offer, contributions are a voluntary donation (Article 582 of the Civil Code of the Russian Federation), are not a purchase and sale, delivery or other transaction.
When making a donation, the user consents to the processing and storage of personal data (indefinitely, unless otherwise specified in the message), confirms his legal capacity.
Please note that in accordance with paragraph 1 of Article 1062 of the Civil Code of the Russian Federation, the claims of citizens and legal entities related to the organization of games and betting or participation in them are not subject to judicial protection, except for the claims of persons who took part in games or betting under the influence of deception, violence, threat or malicious agreement of their representative with the organizer of the games and betting, as well as the requirements specified in paragraph 5 of Article 1063 of the Civil Code of the Russian Federation."

[echo orchid]

what i am talking is tangent to that, and you cannot monetize servers without written approval from all authors who's mods you are using

[glossy nymph]

Friend, do you read the chat at all? I have already said probably 7 times that it has already been deleted, removed

The server has not been working for 3 days and no one is playing on it, since we were engaged in stinging everything that violates the rules

[glossy nymph]

And even if people "bought" something for money, I would be prosecuted by the law of the country. But this is considered from the legal side by the fact that they just voluntarily throw money on the server, for nothing, and the administration just allegedly gives them additional equipment at the event, or access to Zeus, because she decided so, and not for the transfer of money, as well as the players transferring do not expect to receive everything. The legal aspect is taken into account here

But, in view of our dialogue, it was removed

[glossy nymph]

Is this message at the entrance to the server competent on your part in this situation?
@echo orchid

[soft egret]

Just stating that doesn't mean its not a donation.
As I said many people like to label things as donations that are not

The good old "no I'm not selling you stuff, you are donating money to me and then I give you stuff for free as a reward"
yeah nah, thats a sale

[glossy nymph]

But by the Russian law it’s not)
However, it’s deleted yet

[soft egret]

But by the Russian law it’s not)
You are playing a Czech game though

If all is fixed then all is well, just keep it in mind for the future too

[manic laurel]

I do not think Russian law applies here

[glossy nymph]

Lmao

[manic laurel]

excellent argument, now step aside 😉

[glossy nymph]

.

So, in conclusion, guys thx for your work and game.

[echo orchid]

i couldn’t care less about the russian laws. You are either respecting a product’s eula or you don’t. And where RHS is concerned, donating and getting something in return = sale = no bueno

if that is not the case, then all fine

[vocal pumice]

@echo orchidGood afternoon, I would like to clarify if the server has manitization exactly
Money-things or services
This is monetization and is not subject to discussion?

Did I understand correctly?

[plain rivet]

Any server profiting off a mod or mods is not really good. It can get people into trouble and is usually not allowed at all

[coral torrent]

If people can send you money and get anything in return in-game and the mod in question does not allow monetization you can't use it.

[echo orchid]

yes, in regards to RHS, we have a non-commercial (that includes monetization) policy. It’s nothing new, we have it in our EULA.
You need to be approved by BI anyways, and you need explicit permission prior to any approval from all authors of the mods you intent to use

https://www.bohemia.net/monetization/faq

[midnight iris]

@echo orchid don't wanna really bug you but I'm really curious, I was checking out the EULA for RHS and there's a rather oddlt list of items I am not allowed to retexture. Wasn't really interested in retexturing those either way, but why have they been exempt from retexturing permissions?

[elfin heron]

likely just the permissions behind the individual items -- some contributors may not want their contributed items retextured

[plain rivet]

Retextures can also get pretty cringe

[echo orchid]

each of our developers has full IP right over the content they produce. They can allow (or not) other to mess with their content. Also, generally speaking retexturing are tolerated, not allowed

[grim rose]

The epic with @vocal pumice and @glossy nymph continues.
They just re-uploads their mods with violations. Re-uploads without permission (DMCA) and no credits given

In the case of Skiff, the violations are as follows

1. A3 Paddle mod from Feint
2. EFT_Uniforms from "Escape from the Tarkov" game.

I haven't looked any further. Maybe something else if someone wants to take the time to check everything.

Link to his mod here: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2872181120

In @glossy nymph case, it's the same. Violations unchanged

Enhanced Movements
Discord Rich Presence
Horror Mod
Diwako DUI
Enhanced Soundscape @lunar sentinel
GRADS
LAMBS
USAF

Link here: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2871888378

[grim rose]

In case of "1111" mod (first link in the message above) PBO named EFT_Uniforms have uniforms from Escape from Tarkov game which in direct violation of paragraph 4 item 4.2.2, 4.2.3, 4.2.4 of User agreement from Escape from Tarkov game
https://www.escapefromtarkov.com/legal/license_agreement_en.html

So I think it's more up to BIS to remove it?

[elfin heron]

send to dwarden, he moderates workshop

[soft egret]

@glossy nymph do you want to fix it or not?
If not then please just say no so we don't have to waste too much time discussing this

[glossy nymph]

I will

[grand vector]

hey i made song that i found in mp server

can i reprot

pls

?

[plain rivet]

If it’s your property and you don’t want them using it, tell them. If they refuse, take action

[grand vector]

no like dev have it server using

idk how to talk to you guys

[plain rivet]

I’m having a bit of trouble understanding what you’re saying

[warm idol]

Fairly certain opposition got taken down for a good reason so unsure if this is allowed.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2871496281&searchtext=

[small nexus]

bruh

Those are all original assets

[pliant jolt]

Doesn't matter, its IP infringement

[ruby plaza]

Everything is IP infringement if you dig hard enough

Because I have filed a copyright on war itself

[earnest mirage]

You are a Copyright infringement

[faint nacelle]

Cleanup or moderation action?

[small nexus]

How is it may I ask?

[echo orchid]

if you have nothing to post on the topic of this channel, just don't.

[soft egret]

Really? that'd be a first for the opposition team

[small nexus]

My apologies, my brain did a thing and I thought it said JMax

[small nexus]

I'm just asking him to clarify, cause there's a difference between an IP violation and an IP infringement which would be stepping on the SST IP

[keen trout]

All thanks goes to the oppisition team for making this mod, i am sorry if you did not want me publishing this but i just don't want the download to be too complex

so both in this case? 😛

[small nexus]

yeah oops

This argument has been done to death and what I'm saying isn't even an argument, it's just saying so I'm just gonna drop it

[echo orchid]

wasn’t directed towards you

[small nexus]

Oh, sorry then

[grim rose]

It is obvious that he is not going to fix anything. The only thing that happened in 24 hours was a threat to me in the PM from his server administrator named Haise. This mod had a single update, it was on the sixth of October.
This person literally uploaded it without any changes after it was deleted by Steam.

[grim rose]

So @opal fox sorry for another ping but this man again re-uploaded your work without any changes or credit.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2871888378

[opal fox]

Thanks, but I'm not a developer for ZEN - just their community manager. I'll pass this along 🙂

[grim rose]

Thanks!

[glossy nymph]

Read the chat before reporting

You’ve already reported reuploading

So wait until I have time apart from work and war to delete it

I’ve already answered BIS moder that it’s gonna be deleted asap

@grim rose

My server is not working for a week

[obtuse ravine]

Can I find the regulation regarding the use of the texture file in the ARMA 3 sample?

[stiff jasper]

Everything falls under BIEULA, see https://community.bistudio.com/wiki/Arma_3:_Asset_Samples, including Some samples have a specific license, such license is provided in the folder of the given sample

[soft egret]

I think the samples files are missing the license file? That's been a topic before

[carmine folio]

If I upload a mission that uses multiple mods - How do I best go about stating what mods are in use within the mission, and where to get them? Never uploaded anything to the workshop before and want to have all my stuff in order and correct before I do.

I'm not sure if missions that use modded assets count like this because they're missions that use a mod, not mods that directly reupload content, but idk if modders can also say "Please do not use my stuff in publicly available missions" and I wanna be sure I can upload my missions to the workshop when done without infringing on anything.

Thanks in advance!

[keen trout]

you can set workshop dependencies on the workshop page

see for example https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=468210218 that has 6 dependencies marked as required items

[carmine folio]

Gotcha. Thanks!

[gleaming plank]

Mission dependencies are different than derivatives, right?

I know some people got in hot water over mods expanding on and requiring others (such as rhs, I know they have a strict eula when it comes to this). I don't have any plans on releasing missions (I do singleplayer stuff for myself anyway lol), but I've just been curious if I'd need to go out and ask permission from the various mod teams before making and publishing a scenario, or if this only affected "mod" works in specific

[soft egret]

Derivative is taking something, and changing parts of it, textures, scripts, configs n stuff.
Not just loading a mod and placing down a unit.

If you take the mod as is and don't make changes to it (which in a mission you can't really do)

[harsh scaffold]

RHS vehicles with the z symbol https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2874319074

[onyx iron]

from a mod that has the above listed as an dependency:

... You will need a private mod...
Gee I wonder why 🤔

[manic laurel]

Cc @echo orchid

[echo orchid]

cheers @manic laurel + @harsh scaffold

[dusty nimbus]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2859377058 this mod reuploaded my assets. How do I DMCA it?

[indigo thorn]

https://steamcommunity.com/dmca/create/

Welcome to the club....

[elfin heron]

@dusty nimbus check their profile, reuploaded https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2852899836

[dusty nimbus]

Yeah

[spice kettle]

Hey there! First off, I'm sorry if this is the wrong place to ask, I just joined the server because of this.
But I got a question regarding Arma modteams/modders with a Patreon. Especially if they promise people access to their mods, before a public release.
Ontop of that, the team in question also stated that they wouldn't continue work on their mod, if they wouldn't make any money from the mods.

The Patreon page itself is also a bit misleading, as its saying that its only to support the individuals 3D art, but its under the name of the entire mod-studio/team.
They also lock their suggestions channel behind the patreon, but I don't think thats an important detail here, since thats a discord thing and not directly related to Arma-Modding.

The mod-author has also stated that depending on the amount of Patreon-Subscribers they get, they'll produce a different amount of assets in a months time (those being 2 - 1 helmet per month, 10 - 2 helmets + weapon per month, 20 - 1 full armour set + backpack per month, 30 - Main mod art production "continues as normal", 40 - Dune mod art production "continues as normal", 50 - planned Star Wars the Old Republic Mod art production will "continue as normal") these goals are all directly linked to the Arma mods development.

I do have a bunch of screenshots/images from both the modteams server announcement stating that the work would halt, if they dont make any money from the Patreon, as well as from the Patreon page. If any of the mods require them for a verdict, I'm more than happy to provide them.

Thank you for the read!

Edit: I forgot to link the actual Patreon page! My bad~ https://www.patreon.com/user?u=22478610&fan_landing=true&view_as=public

[elfin heron]

What actually is the question

[spice kettle]

Oh sorry, I must have forgotten to actually write that out as well!

Are teams/modders allowed to use such practices to generate an income from their mods? I know that the Arma tools don't allow you to earn money through things created with them.

Since this team/person somewhat tries to dance around that area by saying its for their personal 3D art but links the patreon to directly mod-related goals, I'm a bit on the fence.

So how fair-game is this behavior/practice?

[vivid wave]

Please donate, will boost our development! <- good
Please donate so you can check our early access Mods! <- bad since it is a paywalling

(This is just my understand, you probably need to wait until more professional guys arrive)

[coral torrent]

What @vivid wave said is correct. Short answer for this situation is: No not allowed.

The long answer is: They are free to say "we do not develop unless you support us via patreon, as we need the money for assets or because it replaces a full time job", and they can totally lock a feedback channel in discord or what ever behind a paywall, BUT as soon as somebody has to "donate" money to gain access to any non plain text file to be able to use the mod that is a violation of any BI game EULA. This is a simple rule but has a lot of consequences. You can't for example import (and optimize) models or textures into Arma 3 or Arma Reforger specific formats without the use of the BI tools that do not allow commercial use. They can only "sell" anything that no BI software was involved in. So anything that is not part of the mod files (pbo or pak) and not a violation of the in-game server monetization rules can be sold. In reality it is really really difficult to produce any kind of content for A3/AR that does not touch any of the EULA protected software. There are a few cases like writing purely .sqf/.c scripts and offer those behind a paywall, but that is roughtly all you can do.
Now one might say "they only donate, it is not commercial use". Time and time again people fail to understand: If you need to send money to gain access to an otherwise restricted piece of information or product it is not a donation - it is a purchase. In legal terms a donation must never be a requirement and or directly tied to an otherwise unobtainable good. You can give people an exclusive item or what ever as thanks for the donation - but only on a voluntary basis. After the donation they might or might not get it. If donation "guarantees" you to get something it is not a donation.

Locking access to a mod even if only for latest preview dev build is explictly forbidden in the monetization rules for BI.

[spice kettle]

The way it worded, it sounded like any work on the mods would be suspended until they gained donations

[coral torrent]

They can stop work, ask people for money and when they are done they can release the mod for everyone at the same time for free, but anything else will be off limits.

The patreon page does not explicitly mention access to the mod during beta or something or am I missing something?

[spice kettle]

Ah interesting! Thank you for clearing that up for me!
Would that make the team saying "Once we have 10 Patreons, we will release 2 helmets and a weapon to the mod every month" a purchase instead of a donations, as its directly receiving ingame content in exchange for money? Even if those releases will be public for everyone

[spice kettle]

indeed, that was said in the discord in one of the messages, I'll check my screenshots for it and forward it to you, if you want me to

[coral torrent]

You can't sell items in-game. Explicitly forbidden by BI. They can "sell" the fact that they will patch them into the mod for everyone to use at the same time then. Which in turn makes it a donation and not a purchase because you must not have paid to get the item as a non donator after the update.

They say on the page

I want to be clear that this Patreon is NOT a paywall for a mod; All my mods are public and free.
Which I think assumes the case described above. They can only afford to continue mod development if people help them out with donations - which is both legal and reasonable. No problem with that. As long as there is no exclusivity involved it is all good.

[spice kettle]

Indeed, but they also state in the post announcing the patreon that, and I quote "All patrons will get early access to the latest version of any one of my mods, or SC's latest update which I have been working on for a few weeks now, before the public release"

(https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/831910149492572211/1030378873545830430/unknown.png)

[knotty radish]

They also released another announcement later clarifying exactly what Arkensor stated. id post a screenshot, but I appear to be unable to post images in here for some reason using normal methods.

[knotty radish]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1030459081992970300/1030459100770873404/unknown.png

there we go.

I swear the second a patreon gets announced theres always a battle lmao

[cinder ridge]

That is flat out wrong, it depends on how it is done and at what stage of the mods development, as well as the way it is being worded and brought to the community.
Saying "I'll stop developing the mod unless X people pay me" is obviously going to be received much more negative than "We are working hard on the mod, if you want to support us here you can find our patreon".
So really not something you can generalise.

[knotty radish]

apologies for inciting such a strong reaction from you man, im just going off of my experience across several different games whos modding communities have had split opinions on Patreon's tied to mods. you are completely correct that it does matter how it is done and how it is worded to the community. usually I find that the devs struggle on the wording side of that equation. but again, #notalldevs, lmao

[cinder ridge]

Did not intend for it to seem as a "strong reaction", so if it did I apologise.
I just wanted to clarify that the community does not always receive modders setting up a patreon as something negative and that it mostly comes down to the devs themselves and their communication, and that asking the questions that are being asked here about the legality of things are a fair thing to do as well.

[elfin heron]

Basically you cannot give money in exchange for exclusive access to something produced using arma 3 tools, even if it is planned to be public later on

[coral torrent]

Yes this. I am not sure if the discord message poster on the screenshots is aware that eve nearly access to something everyone gets a week later is still not allowed. Cause the two screenshots contradict each other.

[knotty radish]

so the first screenshot was posted 2 days ago, with the one I sent being posted yesterday. furthermore, nothing on the patreon page says anything about early access. My best guess is it started out as something claiming early access, but then he changed it to just helping with mod development instead, probably after someone told them exactly what you and KJW said.

[elfin heron]

Yes, if it is exclusive access at any point it is not allowed

[knotty radish]

as a hypothetical then: if a mod dev makes a patreon, makes early access a perk (which is not allowed as we have discussed) for lets say a week, but then later changes it after being made aware of the rule, is their mod still liable for takedown, or is it not anymore due to them no longer selling it? the wording of this has me slightly confused.

[elfin heron]

Unsure, but I doubt BI would chase them for a simple error that has since been rectified in either scenario

[delicate hamlet]

Oh, this is oddly familiar. Same thing happened with another community/developer that did had to change the wording because of how the patreon was structured

not so long ago, I believe even Dedman and Horriblegoat commented on that

but it is quite unfortunate the way Moose worded the first message, it does really feel like he intends to paywall the content at first instance

[knotty radish]

thats why I think its not a violation.

[small nexus]

I don't think it would be. He's only having it up to suggest, which in itself is wrong in the BI terms and conditions of the workshop but it's also allowing the community a bit more say in what gets made. But overall, very bad and very cringe move

[vestal hazel]

So to clarify on the questions above about my Patreon for my 3d art.

1. No one has been given any early access content in exchange for money, the only rewards that have been given out are suggestion power in my discord community which are listed on my Patreon.
2. People who support my patreon decide on the 3d art I make as a reward (suggestion power).
3. As @elfin heron theorized, It was a simple error. I was misinformed about what was allowed, and after learning it was not, about 32 hours later from the first post, it was rectified (not a week as someone above is suggesting); And as I said, right now the only rewards my Patrons have is the ability to suggest and vote on the 3d art that I make. Nothing is paywalled. Neither is the mod monetized, however I am monetizing my 3d art.
4. All the mods which contain my 3d art, whether or not I was paid to do the art for them, are free and public on the workshop.

[pine rampart]

so for clarification you'll still develop the mod and 3D models and not wait until you hit the patreon goal in order for you to release said content? also you don't have a current back log your waiting for said goals to be hit before releasing?

also confirmation that its 100% your work and not others being published / included within this paid support and if they are being paid for it

[plain rivet]

Is anyone familiar with the NIArms mod?

Just wanna make sure nothing is ripped from there before I post screenshots with the content in it

[vivid wave]

NIArms is made by Toadie2k herself. It is even open-source

[plain rivet]

Ah, perfect

Just making sure

[echo orchid]

in regards to patreon - what toadie does, and what moose seems to be doing, is all fine.
Generally speaking you can prioritize things based on patreon suggestions / payment, you can also provide access to discord just to patreon people. Yoi cannot however limit mods to certain paying people (due to tools license)

[pine rampart]

@vestal hazel seeming a bit quiet, need clarification on what i posted since you've got a lot of posts bothin your discord and else where stating otherwise

[faint nacelle]

is there a problem?

[pine rampart]

the problem atm is a few things, what hes actually doing vs what hes doing on paper is very different. Outworld Studios isn't just Moose's content but other people content that goes past 3D models. hes actively either put other peoples content hostage who dont want to have it in Scion conflict and threaten legal action and also having others contributions put behind a paywall since it wont be put in until the patreons vote on it whom are paying for that vote.

[faint nacelle]

perhaps those contributors will want to pull their work from such project then and put them to use somewhere else.

I dont think this is the right forum to air such grievances though

[pine rampart]

you've approximately had 10 people under "Outworld Studio" alongside copying other people concept arts 1:1. if you wanna talk about it DM cus I doubt this is the channel for such a talk

[pine rampart]

I believe some of them are and have been banned / removed from their discord for doing so making them unable to say anything about it, I personally joined and was banned within 30 seconds during this.

[vestal hazel]

You're the one making these claims on public channels not me. Anyway I don't have to explain myself and my 3d art to you. Getting blocked now.

[pine rampart]

Shame, thought you’d atleast be able to defend against the claims without having to resort to insults and blocking me because you know what I’m saying true

[hallow lark]

Did you post factual proof of said claims?

[chilly silo]

Right gents, this seems personal. May I suggest you take it to DM's. The public side of this is done.

Assuming the DMCA has been filed all the relevant parties now have the details.

[pine rampart]

Oh I’ll post them when he decides to defend it, atm we are gonna go through all the stuff he’s copied and stolen and let the relevant parties know so really I have no need to any more since he’s taken this route

[pine rampart]

Sadly man has blocked me and banned me from his discord with no chance to speak so that’s fallen through

[chilly silo]

Has he actually taken any of your IP then? if not all you can do is inform the original authors you may know and then move on. Life is too short.

[pine rampart]

Again, taking action outside

He’s not being cooperative so no choice

[chilly silo]

Well from whats posted on here you seem to have a personal grudge. And thats not appropriate for this channel. I've only seen your accusations and no proof either. Again not appropriate for this channel. So my suggestion is you drop it or take outside of this discord.

If you have any proof contact the original authors. Only they can take any Action against someone infringing their work.

(And for the record, legally its up to the accuser to prove their claims. And its the defence's right to refuse to answer.)

[pine rampart]

From your own words I’ve attempted to remove it from this channel however it kept being called back by yourself

[chilly silo]

Im not seeing much effort on your part 😛

[pine rampart]

And since he didn’t wise to take it outside, we will deal with it outside

[pine rampart]

Attempt 1 was here

Just for the record

I’ll be taking it outside from now on, apologies for the unneeded talk in here

Wise you all a great day

[ruby plaza]

Makes allegations against popular mod creator
Refuses to elaborate
Leaves

[pine rampart]

makes allegations against popular mod creator who fucked over other popular mod creators
supposedly popular mod creator turns to insults and blocks without any attempt of resolving issue and hoping it blows over
unable to deal with the issue
leaves

good one lad, good one

[elfin heron]

spot the people from the sc discord

[rustic copper]

Do you have any proof of your claims? Because other than "he did something" I haven't seen anything related to illegal content or IP infringements.
And did he take or do anything from/to you? Which can't be handled by a DMCA?

Because I have the feeling he DMCA'd you or a mod you like and you're now on some warpath to take him down while he didn't do anything wrong other than standing his rights.

[pine rampart]

This can’t be handled by DMCA which is why it’s being dealt with outside this channel

[pine rampart]

Was stated here that is what is going happen

[pine rampart]

So I would appreciate unnecessary comment like this yknow not said

[rustic copper]

You're the one bringing it to this channel / Discord, and you're the one making claims without proof...

Since BI can help if you're claims are right by removing his mod(s)

[pine rampart]

yeah, but its best kept to DMs atm

[vestal hazel]

His claim is that because I use reference art to make 3d art that it's a 1/1 copy. However none of my stuff is 100% 1/1 and furthermore 50% of using reference art I have to create the backside of the 3d model which is not available in a 2d image so its original 50% original. His claim is that because I use reference art I'm somehow stealing problem is even if I did do 1/1 he doesn't know transformative copyright is a thing and protected. So even if he thinks I did what I did which he isn't the first to do or think and try to get me taken down and fail, I am protected because of transformative copyright law. That being said. The closest item I did a 1/1 of I actually have permission from the artist himself to use the reference art lol and the other 1/1 item is a creative commons art that can be used by anyone in anyway. So again this guy is going to have a rude awakening once he does a false dmca. Because I've already been down this road with jealous people who have no talent and have gone down a warpath to take down my mod just because I make my own 3d art. He is just misinformed and had no idea about my community until he found out about my patreon for my 3d art. Thats what this is about, that im monetizing new 3d art i make. But I look forward to seeing what he is going to try and do because all my 3d art is copyrighted and timestamped and in my portfolio. Even if he did a dmca I would just counterclaim and take him and his little group of talentless shitheads to court.

[pine rampart]

proof of permission?

[chilly silo]

Proof of your accusation?

Seriously guys, this seems just to be between you two

[vestal hazel]

It's in the history of my community announcements so get 1 of the many starsim folk you have sent to infiltrate my server to go take a look. You and the starsim community are toxic af and have been harrassing me in my dms ever since i announced i was going to monetize my 3d art. Go back months ago in the announcements and see for yourself. Im not gonna tell you where to look but it's there. I'd rather make you waste your time looking for it just to prove you wrong when you do find it. I could easily share the screenshot I have of my conversation with Pearson. But that would be making it do easy for you. Again you're just some outsider who wants to me down because im monetizing my 3d art. You're not the first misinformed person to try and get me taken down because I use reference art either. Matter of fact I have screenshots of my conversations with BI admins saying it's perfectly okay as a 3d artist to use reference/concept art. The 1/1 copy claim is a gorss exgarration as the majority of my 3d art in SC is made up by head. And as i said for the few items that are almost 1/1 the mpml and watchdog armor, i gave permission for.But again I won't share these with you because to me you are a sad pathetic no body who wants to take down a genuine 3d artist who works on all his shit because you are jealous. Go look for these screenshots that has the proof.

[stable spire]

man writing his whole life

[pine rampart]

crazy amount of proof, also didn't you DM us?

bonkers

[chilly silo]

Its not uncommon to use 3d reference. As long as you do not copy 1:1 and create a new unique version that is 100% your own work the "transformative work" does not come into it unless the creative design is used ie Star Wars IP etc.

[vestal hazel]

Yep I never do 1/1 and always make changes

[chilly silo]

This is just playing out as a grudge match that doesn not need to be here.

[rustic copper]

I don't see any reason why this "issue" has to exist, since there is none... Without actual proof of anything illegal there's nothing that can be done, or will be done...

[vestal hazel]

The one thing that is 1/1 the author made a creative commons art for that can be used in anyway

The rest of my stuff I make from my head

[pine rampart]

I think all the SW stuff would change that but yknow

[vestal hazel]

Eli is the one that is slandering me here so I'm just defending myself. If and when he takes legal action I will be ready with the evidence. I am not obligated to defend myself here which he thinks he is entitled to.

[chilly silo]

OK lets bottom this out:
@pine rampart Is any of the work you claim he is "stealing" your work?

@vestal hazel please wait for Eli to reply

[pine rampart]

if you read anything I put i never stated ownership, i also stated it is being dealt with outside this channel and attempted to remove it from this channel. This last part has honestly been for my own enjoyment since people didn't wanna let it go outside this channel.

[chilly silo]

OK so you have zero claim to any IP involved. Why are you pushing this topic so hard? What is your agenda here?

You just enjoy trolling Moose?

[chilly silo]

f you read anything I put i never stated ownership, i also stated it is being dealt with outside this channel and attempted to remove it from this channel. This last part has honestly been for my own enjoyment since people didn't wanna let it go outside this channel.
Because this is all i am getting from this.

[pine rampart]

nope just tryna get him to actually talk to the people hes fucking over

considering he removed and banned them

bascially allowing no comms between

[chilly silo]

Well since you have no claim to the IP and have no proof to offer here there is nothing anyone here can do. And all you are doing it now is Trolling. Which can result in you being banned.

I strongly suggest you drop it. And let the actual IP owners sort it out

[faint nacelle]

problem has been presented and correct procedure to continue (DMs etc between offending parties) have been offered. Nothing this channel can do more in this case.

[fading cypress]

So, I wanted to retexture assets from this MOD and make some epic screenshots, but I'm guessing this is all ripped content? I might be wrong, but just wanna make sure before I do anything and get in trouble.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2694833285&searchtext=SWAT

[faint nacelle]

correct, dont touch. it will likely get axed at some point

[fading cypress]

Alrighty

[soft egret]

There is precedence of parts of the Ready or Not team giving permission to use their assets

[chilly silo]

The problem is they don't own the rights to the content. Legally its the Studio and Publisher's call. Not the individual developers. So any claim of Dev X gave me permission is always going to be on unsafe ground regardless of how credible.

[soft egret]

Yes but they did get a process to get written approval by the studio itself

That is of course no indication whether that actually happened here or not

[chilly silo]

Well thats a different story. If they have official consent from the Studio via Dev X then its all good. But An individual dev saying something on a forum isnt something that would stand up in court.

[faint nacelle]

The above is different people and the previous permission stuff was left in inconclusive state if I remember right. Leaning towards not possible since a lot of the assets seemed to be licensed from external vendors and not made in house.

[dusty nimbus]

Didn’t RON devs permit the porting of their stuff to arma?

[faint nacelle]

it is not clear if they can do so

like you might buy a model for a product but the license you have bought may not permit you to share the model beyond your product

[dusty nimbus]

Fair enough

[faint nacelle]

a big difference between inhouse assets you have complete control over VS bought assests

[elfin heron]

As well as a handful of assets being from arma 3 mod teams who do not want their stuff taken out of it

[terse wadi]

Seriously What is the train of thought that led to this?

[echo orchid]

why would that matter in any way?

[terse wadi]

because if you are going to DMCA everyone who uses your mod to show a real life conflict maybe Mil-sim isn't the right genre for you

[faint nacelle]

Milsim has nothing to do with real life conflicts, its style of gameplay. And Arma is completely fiction too

and this is all well off topic anyway

[echo orchid]

it doesn’t say any real conflict, it does point to a very specific one. Secondly, you can choose NOT to use this mod that is published for free but with conditions if you don’t like said conditions.

Also very offtopic, nothing to do with the channel’s topic, feel free to disagree with our views by not using the mod, or making your own instead and use it as you see fit

[terse wadi]

wait now I'm really confused why not this conflict but others are fine? and its defiantly on topic for this thread

[echo orchid]

because. we don’t owe anyone any explanations, especially if such entitlement is shown

[mint ridge]

RHS has banned the letter Z from the alphabet

[echo orchid]

on RHS vehicles that is

[twilit pilot]

Jesus I cannot even begin to tell you how much this mod takes.

https://prnt.sc/Lye91KTCu0F8
https://prnt.sc/d1FDUfuaoLHV
https://prnt.sc/aZojDsK0Nn48

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2112083436

[runic wraith]

Our team will be filing a DMCA against this mod (as well as any other reuploads of the same content). The PVS31 model belongs to us, donated to Void for RoN, and they never had our permission to allow others to 'rip and use' as they please. Their agreement was supposed to only allow the usage of their older (in-house) assets, not all the stuff which has been donated/purchased.

[pliant jolt]

Had no idea you guys donated stuff to Void. That's sick

[runic wraith]

Probably won't anymore

[spice yacht]

Hello, I noticed on the workshop there is a lot of content that are re-skins of vanilla arma 3 content. I was wondering where I could find information about the appropriate licenses regarding this subject. I did some digging thru the pinned messages and couldn't find anything. I have an interest in starting my own project, if licensing permits.

[plain rivet]

You’re allowed to retexture arma 3 assets. Most, if not all ARMA 3 assets have hiddenSelections. Just don’t rip the models

[spice yacht]

What about the original .paa textures? I saw a lot of mods have what I assume is the original .paa that they edited

[plain rivet]

You need to grab the paa’s to retexutre the assets. You turn the paa’s into pngs, edit with your favorite 2D editor and then back to paa

[spice yacht]

Yes I understand that, I'm just wondering if thats permitted or if ripping the .paa are also just... well... not allowed

[plain rivet]

You can rip the paa’s and configs. The only thing you aren’t allowed to rip is the p3ds

[spice yacht]

[plain rivet]

Happy retexturing

[native sun]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2874663182

this guy really doesn't understand

kinda funny how oblivious he is

on the other hand it also seems like nobody really cares, since his buldozer and harvester is up since september now, so whatever i guess 😄

[steep spire]

didnt know those are vanilla content

[plain rivet]

Might be worth getting BI to bring Dwarden in to ban him

[soft egret]

It's technically a derivative.
Bohemia didn't put a license on these files so technically you're not allowed to.
But we are modding friendly and tolerate it. Though if you do something bad with it, the tolerance may stop

[maiden frigate]

out of curiosity - what is the issue with it?

[native sun]

a3 model that has been decompiled

same with the harvester and the other stuff

[maiden frigate]

And that is a no-no. Allrighty.

[native sun]

if he gets away with it, there is no reason for the rest of us to not just do the same

sure he spends lots of time on making it work, etc. but he shouldn't have started working on it in the first place

[maiden frigate]

So you are not allowed to decompile A3 assets and reuse them in A3? Guess there are reasons for it, but yeah its a bit sad. Seems like a genuinely cool project.

[hallow idol]

I wonder if these two messages are an exact quote from many years ago in OFP, right before the start of the entire modding scene in Arma 🤔

[native sun]

well, but the rules are clear here. that was the case already for a2 as well

[hallow idol]

Of course, I only ask since it sounded familiar)

[native sun]

if he gets away with decompiling and reusing unreleased (for public use) a3 assets, then there is no reason for me to not break the rules as well.

once the sample models are released, it's different and free game

just my 2 cents on this, since there are lots of things i'd like to do with the a3 models as well, but have to jump through hoops to get access to them even if just for cdlc use.

[hallow idol]

Can't you just ask for permission?

[native sun]

yes. and he doesn't have to ask, he can just take.

[hallow idol]

Other CDLCs where given permission to use A3 content

[hallow idol]

I meant in relation to you saying "jump through hoops" - is there a more annoying process than asking permissions here?

[native sun]

you don't just ask and get stuff. it usually has to get cleared and go through some steps of whatever kind.

but that's not the point here anyways. he doesn't ask, he just does stuff and then later QQs that he doesn't understand why his workshop items got removed. if it were me, i'd ban him from the workshop by now simply because he sets a precedence that, yes, you can just use a3 assets right now and do whatever.

[ember berry]

Dwarden wants such infringements to be reported to [e-mail] so the BI team responsible can take the proper steps to deal with it.

[native sun]

can't someone from BI do that in obvious cases? 😄

[ember berry]

Or we cut out the middle man of "someone from BI" and the reporter can report directly to that email. The only thing that changes is the person that sends the email.

[soft egret]

it is being handled, but email is easier

[spice yacht]

I promise to keep my reskins very stylish to avoid any complaints 😄

[slate hare]

I got warned by the bot:
"Hello!
You have been issued a formal warning by the Moderators of the ARMA server for the following reason:
posting screenshots of ripped content (Call of Duty). We don't tolerate content theft, this will be your only warning."

I have no idea what post the bot is even referencing.

[crimson ingot]

'posting screenshots of ripped content (Call of Duty).'

and why u post this in #ip_rights_violations ?

[echo orchid]

@slate hare - wrong channel. move to #discord_server

[slate hare]

Much appreciated

[grim rose]

So instead of fixing things @vocal pumice just went to re-uploading his "modpack" with "stealth" name third time in a row.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2877147371

From the start I saw Paddle mod by Feint. Didn't look further because probably he re-uploaded same mod that was taken down before.

Doesn't Steam ban you from uploading things to workshop when you received multiple DMCA takedowns? Because looks like this guy just doesn't care about licenses.

[elfin heron]

Send to the mod creators & dwarden, there's not really much need for it in here any more

[light lintel]

Are we meant to just contact dwarden about this kind of thing?

[echo orchid]

for steam workshop upload restriction, yes

[light lintel]

Solid; I've dropped him a note.

[elfin heron]

This channel is more for establishing whether or not it needs to be emailed in the first place

[light lintel]

Well alright since basic and non-accusatory pointing it out resulted poorly and due to his repeated public actions against us:

Scion Conflict (https://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/?id=2478080991#:~:text=Scion Conflict is a far,known as the Scion Conflict.) released by Outworld Studios (Moose) had formal request of removal of content from a creator on the 13/10/22. Upon this request, Moose (well within his rights) requested the removal of his own content from that creators mod - . Although handled poorly by the creator, this was removed from the mod same day with a hotfix (Not before moose proceeded to breach discord guidelines (3,1), but besides the point). Moose was quick to threaten DMCA over his own content if it wasn't removed the same day - however his update on the 16/10/22 removed CREDITS for the content that was requested to be removed, but the content is still there and publicly available - not only without permission but now also without credit.

[vestal hazel]

Last communication I had with Jenna which I had on her on her server, she said "fine you can keep the script" in exchange for me allowing the House Kandosii unit to keep using my female mandalorian armor. Jenna would have to come to my discord and request in general chat to change otherwise since she has been blocked for discussing stealing my 3d models in my dm's. But then House Kandosii would also have to pull all my 3d art/p3d work out of there mods. https://www.artstation.com/artwork/nEBz5K

so if she wants it taken down, let her know to pop into the SC discord to talk with us 😉

I have no problem taking it down if she changed her mind again. Just know that all use of my 3d art work from House Kandosii will be revoked.

which FIY insiders from her unit already dm'd me she had no intention of removing my stuff upon request, and would simply hide the mod, which is in fact stealing.

After a formal take down request. So yeah let her know @light lintel if she wants to discuss the script (which she told me she got from Webknight so its not really hers) she can pop in my discord to chat.

stuff like this is why the starsim community has a bad reputation, accusing me of stealing when in fact Jenna and House Kandosii threatened to steal my 3d art work. Yall are a sad bunch really.

[light lintel]

Just to note this for anyone reading this in the future -

This is the mod creator doing a few things:

1. openly lying about permissions given.

2. Refusing to accept removal of consent to use content unless its done in his own, controlled area in which the creator has no access.

3. Lying about the response to his own content removal - you can even see currently the mod does not contain your content.

[knotty radish]

ok, so both of you are stating the other is a liar. can either of you produce proof to back up your claims?

[light lintel]

Sure!
The Scion Conflict K2 mortar backpack script was asked to be removed. Moose has confirmed it's our script. It is not removed, even though the mod was publicly updated (as seen in link) on the 16/10/22.
You'll also note in the credits (as seen in link), Moose isn't crediting the person he repeatedly refered to here as the creator of the script.

[vestal hazel]

Yeah cause Jenna last gave me her permission on her server which I already left. She herself would need to communicate that with me. I got no problem taking it down if she lets me know, its not that important anyway.

So just let her know she can issue the take down request here, or on my discord. As of right now the last communication I got from Jenna, she said yes.

oh wait thats right Jenna is banned from this discord

so she can't

[light lintel]

Again,
Here we see the mod creator again refusing to accept removal of consent unless done in his own terms - most interestingly of which I find now he's having to backtrack as he realises he's blocked and banned the original creator. Fascinating.

[vestal hazel]

she is also banned here, I wonder why 🤔

Also you can see my change log and conversation with Jenna, Ill post here. My changelog of the mod shows I removed it, and then reuploaded after the last communication where she said fine I can use it. So again, if she wants it removed she can simply join my discord and request it.

[knotty radish]

so if all this is over the k2 mortar backpack script, @vestal hazel why dont you unblock jenna and get this sorted instead of making it some public affair? personal feelings on the person/people be damned, I do gotta say that there are easier ways to end this other than asking for a takedown request in places that you are aware they can't access.

@light lintel Id reccomend having screenshots of the confirmation of script ownership and proof necessary to back up the (as of this moment) accusations in your 3 point post a little ways up. at least in the american legal system, the burden of proof is on the accuser.

overall this can be solved rather quickly and with far less public drama I feel.

[light lintel]

The discord you banned her from.

See, again, content creator refusing to accept recinded consent.

[light lintel]

Can't post pictures in here. Have all of 'em here. Would you like them in DMs for personal confirmation and curiosity?

[stiff jasper]

I don't think anyone wants or cares about your affairs, if you want to DMCA something, fill in the Steam form thing or send an email to BI, it's in channel description.

If DMCA/C&D terms were not fulfilled, take it to the court, simple as.

This channel is for discussion, not for reports or throwing accusations, lol

[vestal hazel]

actually no I did not ban her, she left after I made a 9/11 to remember the victims. She can return at any time.

[knotty radish]

sure.

[knotty radish]

but I do gotta agree with Honger here.

[vestal hazel]

sure thing, I'll do that right now actually

[knotty radish]

if yall refuse to settle it outside of a professional context, send out a takedown request. this isnt really the place to throw around public drama (despite it happening a frankly humerous amount of times)

[jovial crown]

dude... just show evidence , or the person afected can speak for her self...
i have fun reading the drama ngl... but you really need to take care of this on private and just present evidence here

[knotty radish]

exactly

[light lintel]

Also, hey I cleared this Dwarden prior to sending it here to confirm it was the right place.

[jovial crown]

im not sure on this channel, but if you paste the link of a image, the image is shown

yep, you can

[knotty radish]

you dont have to convince me of whether or not you have the right to post here. just whatever mods decide to walk in on this.

[knotty radish]

nice choice of test image lol

[light lintel]

Which evidence would you like?

She's banned from here, from his discord, and blocked. She can't really voice her own concern.

Moose has admitted directly to it being hers, and simply refuses to accept her telling him to remove it.

[knotty radish]

he has the right to ban anyone from his discord. I am curious as to why they were banned from here, however that wouldnt be able to be posted in here.

[jovial crown]

i dont know why she is banned here, i guess you can talk to the discords admin and allow her to join and explain herself

[knotty radish]

this, really. proof of this claim.

[vestal hazel]

Problem solved

[knotty radish]

and claim 3 here.

[vestal hazel]

Jenna is pulling all my stuff per her own testimony, including my female mando armor, p3d work I did for her, and retextures

I am pulling her script

end of story

[light lintel]

Evidence of him confirming ownership. Don't even need a picture for that one

[knotty radish]

mind posting proof here of the agreement just to dissuade further discussion on the matter?

keep in mind I got no idea if it violates any rules of this place.

[vestal hazel]

sure

https://ibb.co/JQqSZpw

[jovial crown]

afik you dont need to prove innocence, but it wont be a bad idea in this case

[knotty radish]

I think it should be fine, it would fall under rule 7

ok, so assuming this is all of the content in question from this particular claim, then the matter is settled, correct?

[vestal hazel]

Yep

[light lintel]

For now.
Judging by others in the community credited and not, Scion Conflict might become a regular feature.

[vestal hazel]

Sounds like a threat?

[knotty radish]

then those who wish for their work to be removed can contact moose and settle it outside of here, unless it becomes an issue.

[vestal hazel]

since SC is all in house assets, goodluck with that.

[light lintel]

I'm not credited and anything I've ever done for you was under GVI v2 - meaning I can't rescind my permission.

[knotty radish]

otherwise, no need to continue this, if yall wish to continue with the venom-tipped comments, yall can do it elsewhere I reckon.

[vestal hazel]

nothing you did has been added to the mod.

like ever lol

dont be delusional now

[light lintel]

Exactly - I can't rescind permission for anything. So it's hardly a threat.

[knotty radish]

pfft well that was fast

[light lintel]

Bot or good mod? Lol,
. Anyway. I literally physically can't do anything resulting in any content being removed on permission grounds - you can even use my scripts I gave to Nightwolf and I still can't because of the licence I operate under (you can screenshot this for proof if you'd like!)

[knotty radish]

bot.

[vestal hazel]

wouldnt want to anyway

[knotty radish]

aight, no need to keep talkin bout it then, the both of ya. no further violations here then it looks like (as of 10-20-2022)

[jovial crown]

now really, you all made this amazing job making all this content, to send all this to garbage for some pointless dispute?

i really think madders need to take some "emotional" responsibility of the posted content, a lot of ppl is enjoying the content, and tearing apart a mod in this way, beside is "legal" is wrong

[light lintel]

American dates fry my head something fierce. I thought that was a time.

[knotty radish]

fair enough.

[knotty radish]

Madders. I love it.

[light lintel]

Anyway. Shift over somewhere designed for general chatter?

[knotty radish]

however lets all just walk away.

[jovial crown]

it was a happy accident

[vestal hazel]

the k2 mortar was broken anyway and Ptd and jenna had only ever contributed that to the mod. The rest of SC has nothing to do with them so that will be the last from them on a contributer basis making claims here.

i did way more for them than they did for me anyway. it is honestly quite dumb. This is all a vendetta because I announced I would make a patreon for my 3d art.

but it does not surprise me most of the people making attacks like PTD,Jenna, Eli the Starkiller are from the starsim community and they have a nasty, toxic reputation at this point.

[light lintel]

And as a said in my original post - I agreed with you until you started doing real shaddy stuff.

Regardless I don't think my character is an ip violation.

[vestal hazel]

yes profiting off my 3d art is "shaddy"

[knotty radish]

ok guys, both of yall just walk away from this channel. stop trying to get one last word in. this is now just onto drama between yalls communities. I dont want mods to get involved just to tell yall to clear off.

[light lintel]

I don't think that's an ip violation.

[knotty radish]

it would be silly.

[echo orchid]

@vestal hazel + @knotty radish + @light lintel + @jovial crown - this is NOT the place to vent your own dramas or whatever else sort of quarrel you got going. Re-read the channel's description

[light lintel]

Affirm. Started as a request for discussion if that situation constituted an ip violation.

[knotty radish]

wait why am I being slapped here

[light lintel]

Im only mildly legally aware, unfortunately.

[echo orchid]

@knotty radishdon't exaggerate, slapping is something i have not (yet) done. It was a written notification

[knotty radish]

figure of speech, my apologies.

[patent plume]

I am here to report that, I have found two mods with TFL stolen assets, COD, RHS assets and A bunch others. Do with this information as you wish...
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2871790696
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2871790696

[plain rivet]

@echo orchid

[echo orchid]

@patent plume@plain rivetcheers

[patent plume]

No problem just thought yall would want to know

[cedar flint]

both links are the same btw

[patent plume]

Hmmm

They shouldnt be

[cedar flint]

https://i.gyazo.com/99c7702670d263039478bb9853d055b7.png

this is the one I presume you meant https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2874519170

[patent plume]

Yes

[patent plume]

Those are the two

Excuse my mistake, did this at midnight my time😅

[glossy nymph]

I'm going to report on the illegal use of the game. This server https://discord.gg/AykQWTprgg uses a mod that contains mods from other developers without their consent. In addition, the representatives of this server had an idea on 03.10.2022 to add monetization by selling weapons, equipment, units from mods, which again is unacceptable from the user agreement of Bohemia. In view of the fact that the other day two similar servers were blocked by developers, I insist on fairness and the imposition of sanctions in the form of blocking on this server as well.

92.53.90.68:2302

[manic laurel]

contact [e-mail] for the game server, and report the Steam mod on Steam/here

[grim rose]

You should provide more information if you want somebody to do something.
What mods they're are using within modpack? Links to workshop and names of files that was stolen?
Screenshots of messages with facts about commercial use?

Because I checked that server some time earlier and everything was in order. But it was a month ago

But if you're correct then indeed contact [e-mail] and report mods here

[glossy nymph]

I have enough proofs, but can’t get to my pc rn

[uneven nest]

yo if i release a mod with a model from squad for example but the textures are different, how would someone prove its an ip violation? cant the model just be very closely copied

[sharp void]

It's quite hard to "closely copy" another model. Simple way is just comparing them, but there are other ways to tell.

Simple solution is just not to do it

[uneven nest]

true

what if i dont have a studio etc and enough time or money to create a model for a certain vehicle?

[sharp void]

You could ask someone to make it or buy the model. You'd still have a ton of work to do to make it Arma ready though.

[faint nacelle]

If you can't aquire it in legit way as in make yourself or commission someone to make then you can't have it.

[uneven nest]

Tru although I have no money

[faint nacelle]

Sometimes that happens and then you have to use mods that are available and hope one day you have money or time to make the thing you wanted

[spark oasis]

I suggest searching on Sketchfab for models free use | CC:BY license (free use with attribution towards author)

Some models however even if bought aren’t allowed to be published in a mods .pbo file since others still have access to the p3d (model) even though binned can still be “stolen” - read licenses before publication-

Tons of ways to go about it, I make my own and I use CC:BY models (mainly for more complex models / stuff); just depends on your skill and how far you want to go.

Assets imported still require a bit of work to get fully moved over to Arma however, since you have to rework how Arma will read the models geometry and such

[echo orchid]

modding is a hobby. If you don’t have the resources for it (skill, will, time, money) you can very easily choose not to do it

[uneven nest]

Ok thanks guys

[indigo thorn]

Time is always an issue but if you really want to do something, this isn’t really an excuse. You will find the time if you really want to. Motivation is the bit we’re often struggling to get enough of to overcome obstacles.
I learnt to mod while still working 3600+ hours a year with my main job.
Unfortunately, although I have a lot more time now, my motivation is not as high hence not churning out mods at high speed!
As PuFu says, it’s a hobby....

[raven glade]

So I recently started taking on some commission jobs. So I am very ignorant on the legality of certain areas. My one question is. Lets say I make a piece of clothing for someone. I finish it, they pay me and I've sent all the file. Once the transaction is done I assume I no longer have the rights to that model, texture, etc. Is this correct?

[chilly silo]

Depends on your contract or how you chose to licence it

The way I choose to work is offer the client two options:

1. "Deed of rights" - They own everything, the rights, model, source etc - They pay one price and its all theirs to do with as they wish.

2. "A specific Use License" - The customer buys a licence to use my model for their one specific need. They cannot re-sell it, allow it to be shared or deeded to anyone else in an unprotected form.

I rarely do commissions for Arma3 work. But the principle is the same no matter the market. Licence 1 = Higher price than Licence 2 obviously.

[patent plume]

These mods have been reuploaded as i have been alerted that it has been. The authors will continue to upload them....

[echo orchid]

will see about it

[raven glade]

This is a good way to go about it. Do you have specific documents that you give them to sign?

[chilly silo]

I do, but they tend to be more of a negotiated thing so rarely standard. I used to do a lot of commissions for large companies, Defence Agencies and TV production etc.

[raven glade]

Gotcha. Thanks for the lesson haha, much needed.

[chilly silo]

NP - ill add this topic to the list of things to cover in the next update for https://arma3practicalipguide.blogspot.com/

There might be some stuff in there to help you understand the rules

[lapis quiver]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2589556457&searchtext=CALL+OF+DUTY

Not my mod. but it needs to get deleted. Btw dont kick me again i learned my lesson and im doing "Legal" Mods now

[plain rivet]

Report to whoever the hell made Ghosts. Their IP

[glossy nymph]

@manic laurel got some work for you

[manic laurel]

unlikely

[glossy nymph]

are you responsible for moderating workshop or for [e-mail]?

[manic laurel]

neither, you should email directly

[glossy nymph]

I have a denunciation of the misuse of the game, the sale of in-game content without permission, campaigning and creating manuals on how to hack DLC, as well as a bunch of mods in one without the permission of the authors. Mention those who are responsible, sent everything to the email already.

💜

[manic laurel]

if the email has been sent, it's cool - thanks for the report

[glossy nymph]

[e-mail] - is correct?

[manic laurel]

correct - if in doubt, it is in written this channel's description.

[glossy nymph]

kk

[knotty radish]

yall always seem to sound peeved when we bring up ip rights violations, even though this is the place to talk about potential violations before bothing BI legal bout this. why is that? honestly curious.

[jovial crown]

accusations with out proof and drama are quite common on this channel, moderation job is quite hard enough.
also mention moderators is a bad habit, much more if the mention the wrong one lol

[echo orchid]

it is for discussing it, not for reporting towards BI legal, if it is BI legal dep who needs to take care of it

[pastel bane]

Isn't there some sort of PBO search tool? I thought I recalled hearing about this.

[sharp void]

The Workshop Crawler?

[pastel bane]

That sounds like it. Thanks

[sharp void]

Link to the crawler:
https://sqi.workshopcrawler.com/

[pastel bane]

Looks like the my mods are not indexed yet. I was mostly curious no issues at this time.

Some people mentioned "bugs" in my mod which sounded like day one release issues like they were somehow running an old version. I speculated a reupload may have caused the issue.

[coral torrent]

Or they are private on the workshop. We only scan public mods

[lapis quiver]

Question if i use models i buy on royalty free liscene im safe right ?

[chilly silo]

If those licenses allow for free redistribution yes. If not then no. As an example Turbosquid has a very transparent license system now. You are looking for something that allows you to use the content in a game or redistribute without royalties etc.

https://blog.turbosquid.com/turbosquid-3d-model-license/

[lapis quiver]

well i have most of my models from CGTrader and i talked to the creators of models and they said its okay to use in my mod

[chilly silo]

Then aslong as you have that documented and the "Creators" are really the creators. (CGTrader has a very bad rep for ripped content - ive DMCA'd over 50 models myself) you are all good.

[lapis quiver]

i thought Turbosquid have bad rep

[chilly silo]

Since they were bought out they have cleaned up their act.

They introduced a new transparent licensing system and a new legal protection for buyers and penalties for fraudulent sellers.

[lapis quiver]

thats interesting, and thank you for the insight

[chilly silo]

np

[broken hornet]

Just triple checking, but there is no way to submit a DMCA without providing a legal name correct? Someone is using my armbands in their mod and isn't accepting my steam requests to discuss
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2796861628

I'd like the content taken down but it seems like there is no way to do it without effectively doxxing myself

pretty sure its not possible but worth an ask I guess

[molten kraken]

if you mean step 4 of this guide:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=837929245
It shouldn't be sent to the mod poster, but you're using legal measures and Steam need someone to be accountable if you make a false claim

[tawny berry]

My lawyer I had for another purposes was willing to do the work for 1/2 hours billing,