💣┇weapons-gadgets

[hardy dust]

If 93r and med/heavy long range options like repeater and bfr get nerfed then maybe m26 would see more play

M26 is such a fun weapon to use

[potent thorn]

I know I am asking for an edge case but like, reducing the sprint to ready speed of the lockbolt by like 0.1 second would be very funny

[dry widget]

You can't convince me the M26 is good.

[royal pier]

Well...it is. You can disagree with reality if you want.

[dry widget]

On stats maybe. In reality, it's mid.

[royal pier]

Chunk damage meta. BRF + M26 = most things dead instan.

[dry widget]

https://tenor.com/view/stacie-conrad-pitch-perfect-shrug-whatever-eh-gif-24698756

[shell sonnet]

Am i the only one thats slightly put off by the interchanging

From [x] to [y]
And
To [y] from [x]
?

[foggy fjord]

For a heavy, why chose C4 over rpg?
They seem to have around the same cool down...

[shell sonnet]

you can have 2 c4 out at once, covering a larger area
you can pre plant c4 on a pot and carry it with you (combined with a recharged in reserve, a total of up to 3 in quick succession)
you can remotely detonate it, rather than requiring line of sight (good for stalling) (also means it can also be stacked on mines for 1-shots)
deals more damage (i think slightly above 150, so it can 1 shot lights if manually detonated on top of them)

[minor wind]

Hi everyone, is there anyone who can help with some challenges I have to do regarding trophies in the game? A trophy that requires killing three people in less than 10 seconds with different gadgets and I find it quite hard to do so if people want to help me and concentrate on that, come in private. I have a solution so that we can all join in the same public online game.

[foggy fjord]

got it, makes sense then, ty

[normal condor]

they didn't happen to change the xp54 spray pattern by adding a dumbass right adjustment to the start and a straight up pattern in the middle and roughen the recoil without telling anyone did they?

cus i could swear those were not there or at least nearly as prominient

and it's honestly messing up my low sens play cus muscle memory does what it does

[indigo nexus]

no, it has not changed in a long time

[shell gorge]

i think that p90 is just the m11 for mediums

[granite folio]

fr

[muted condor]

Hmmmmm, yes the smg is made of smg

[low sphinx]

Is the Pike trash now?

[long nymph]

trash? no

[muted condor]

Not trash but not as good

[frank sorrel]

I'd say it's close to trash tho. It's really shines at long range and the new scopes feels really good. But the dmg nerf has made it enough to make you almost always lose a 1v1 close range (unless ur a God with it).

Imo it needs a better hipfire, to be a decent weapon. Could be wrong tho, I started experimenting with it couple 1-2days ago.

[stoic garden]

i think it still kills faster than model btw

[rough coyote]

model needs a bullet load time buff

its animation could be half a second faster & itd be way better

things kill too quick for it to do any good & peak shooting means nothing

[hoary sable]

k

[minor wind]

Hi, is anyone available with a group to just help me for five minutes to get a trophy on The Finals that requires killing three people with different gadgets? We just put ourselves in the same team and I kill my two teammates and I kill myself with another gadget and it will be good

[muted condor]

Running rpg and pyro mines on heavy is a easy way to get gadget kills

[hardy dust]

Yeah that's why I mentioned afterburn

[deep mason]

@fossil willow shorter fuse and it's a fire damage dealer not destruction

[merry rampart]

Wat is the best build for median class

[hoary sable]

k

k

[muted condor]

I’d say 3

It’s a really nice middle number

[merry rampart]

No like game wise

[royal pier]

I've never liked it. It's the opposite of how I've seen every other studio do it.

I've hit actively cloaked Lights and it didn't de-cloak them.

[hardy dust]

Weird. It could be possible they're recloaking the moment they get hit too though

[hardy dust]

Run both. C4 can be activated from anywhere, which makes it very strong for cashout stalls. Plus you can have 2 down at the same time.

They fill different roles. Generally c4 is a very defensive item for setups and stalls while rpg is a very offensive item for good initial teamfight damage and finishing weak opponents, but is very versatile aswell.

[south plinth]

RPG + C4 + Dome shield is probably the best ranked heavy loadout right now

You could probably swap RPG or C4 for lock bolt

[compact tundra]

Or rpg/C4 for anti grav cube, I've been seeing people talk bout how good antigrav is if used right.

[versed finch]

Anti Grav + Dome + Minigun is unbeatable for me

It's basically just free kills, especially on PS (Which is basically all I play)

[hoary sable]

kk

[compact tundra]

I mean it's good on Cashout as well. Antigrav, if used well, forces players to be open to steal, and that's right where minigun wants them

[versed finch]

Exactly

Anti Grav is just slept on, I don't get why more players aren't using it

[compact tundra]

Also works well with M60, Lewis and ShAK

[versed finch]

People forget that 90% of guns' accuracy plummets midair

Unless you're running like Model, CL40, or MGL, or any melee

[compact tundra]

I mean yea but that mostly affects hipfire, I don't think ADSing is affected by movement/airborne bloom

[hoary patio]

Is the riot shield bug fixed? The one where you can shoot through the shield

[versed finch]

Could be correct, but when I used to run CB, I couldn't hit anything mid air. Of course usually when I was in the air from anti grav, i had bigger problems anyway

[versed finch]

Believe so, they kind of made the shield sit vertically so the model matches the hitbox

[placid slate]

No patch has been pushed out yet so I doubt it

[versed finch]

If I ever see an anti grav nerf i'm going right back to pyro mines

[placid slate]

I doubt it (although I personally believe the downtime between cubes is too fast, I use I btw so don't start yapping at me)

[versed finch]

Hopefully. I do see how the 5 second downtime can be a bit oppresive, but I didn't really see a problem before hand

But Embark being Embark will probably do a full blown Nerf fest after the Majors...

[placid slate]

Yea downtime is too much. What I wanna see is the cube getting more health, but it's duration is based on its hp so you can essentially cook it if you play smart

[versed finch]

That's actually a really good idea...

[placid slate]

Cube should be the thinking man's gadget

[versed finch]

Very curious about the upcoming Barricade rework as well. Barricades are easily one of the best gadgets in the game (besides for the times where it wouldn't place even though the outline was blue)

[placid slate]

The what?

[versed finch]

I think I heard about Embark potentially reworking the barricades in a Season 7 stream

Could be completely wrong for the matter though, so take it with a grain of salt

[placid slate]

You thinking of the commentator from the closed quals?

[versed finch]

I may be. I'm just grabbing what I remember if im being honest

Either way, a barricade rework (while I don't really see it necessary), if it's real, could make it a tad bit easier to use, not like it isn't right now of course

Maybe a nerf to barricade by making it so when you pick it up, it still has a cooldown, but based on how many segments are remaining rather than instant charge recovered

[proper elbow]

Yeh they said something about reworking it

[placid slate]

Jutd make it destroy small objects when you try to place it

[proper elbow]

Make it divide the entire map when placed

[blazing maple]

Ive been trying to get my friends play this game but they are not having fun with your extremely unbalanced heavy metas. Im pretty fed up too and dont know if i want to stick with this game if you keep taking this game to this direction. MAKE A PRIVATE MATCH AND TRY PLAYING AGAINST WINCH, LOCKBOLT, RPG, SHAK, BFR AND STREAM IT!! SHOW US HOW YOU HAVE PLANNED THAT COMBO TO TURN OUT FUN

[finite agate]

#👂┇game-feedback

[shell sonnet]

this kinda shows what im thinking
even if you actually get close and try to get them to damage themselves, just bhopping reduces self damage by a lot or can sometimes outright deny it
i feel like if this downside wasnt as easily circumvented we might actually be able to buff it in some other way

[night raft]

Anybody have any tips or loudout advice for trowing knifes?

[glossy bloom]

Griefing player that said he is so scared to get a ban for throwing ranked

Trying to add photos but it won’t let me

[shell sonnet]

need to level up, we got videoreports tho, im not sure if restrictions still apply there

also got a clip of one of the vaulting/mantle problems i have

i didnt even know you could vault over that, much less try to do so intentionally
yet it throws me off course, makes me an easy target and leaves me vulnerable

id much rather have it be a separate interact button, that is then made more lenient (possibly alongside/being shared with climbing ladders)

[finite agate]

are there any weapons on light y'all wouldn't recommend pairing with H infuser?

[misty heart]

How does one do the goo tech to get under vents?

[muted condor]

I play very little light but I feel like sniper I wouldn’t

[ashen grail]

theres a tech for that?

[compact tundra]

Hey I'm coming up with utility ideas that could use the reload button on melee weapons, what would be some good ideas. The only one I have rn is that dual blades will get a combat roll bound to their reload button.

I think sword and sledge will be the most difficult since they're in the most delicate balance spots. Riot shield might be a close 3rd because of how much utility it naturally holds

[stoic garden]

i don't think one exists, maybe double barrel since your chances of killing someone then dying are much higher so you provide less heal value

[finite agate]

something about spear and throwing

[compact tundra]

That gets so much hate here I don't wanna use spear throw, plus it doesn't particularly fit well into spears current playstyle

[finite agate]

honestly i thought it'd be neat if spear lunge could hook someone (probably on a cd) but people hate winch as-is

[compact tundra]

I thought about that too but spear is already the best pressure melee besides sword, I think giving the longest ranged melee a hook would either break it or make it a pub stomper

[finite agate]

yeah, thinking of util for the r key is harder than it seems. dual blades being able to scale walls with the blades would be more of a passive than an activation

[compact tundra]

Yea it's hard, I think a combat roll for dual blades is perfect tho, even let's us scale back the reflect damage a bit since if dual blades work consistently they are pretty punishing against new players

[finite agate]

definitely, doubly so in solo queue. i notice im cooked if i cant demat the floor under them

[compact tundra]

Yea I've found there very frustrating to fight for some players and I think buffing the consistency and attacks, giving them a combat roll, and nerfing reflect damage to be 0.8 might be a health spot for them

[finite agate]

riot shield could be a quick shove, light damage, actually moves people a tad? seems counterintuitive but idk, could have some niche use. or a funny win condition where you corner someone and keep shoving them and they cant fight back bc the shield's in the way

[compact tundra]

I thought about a shield bash but I'ma talk to someone I know mains riot before pitching ideas for that weapon. Riot already has so much utility inherently that it makes me want to tread carefully

Sledge is also in the same condition but a bit worse. Sledge is a really strong weapon in the right scenarios and already has the destruction utility, so that one is gonna be difficult, I want to make the heavy hit more reliable maybe via a set up move, but not inescapable.

[finite agate]

press r to prime two overheads in a row lmao, or making raising the hammer also hit

[compact tundra]

Kinda wanna give sledge a suplex that can setup into heavy hit if they don't react quickly enough but I don't know how that would go over with sledge mains or the game in general.

[finite agate]

huh, come to think of it im a bit sad CNS and spear dont interact

a spear charge sounds fun but is probably oppressive

which ones do u have ideas on already outside of dual blades?

[compact tundra]

Just dual blades. Trying to brainstorm the others since they need to fit into the weapons existing playstyle and not be too wacky, while also being useful and balanced so they don't break the weapons

Sword will be hardest cause I'm obviously gonna ask for clamp to be changed into a sensitivity max but sword is already a pretty strong weapon with that change alone.

[finite agate]

dagger feels like another tricky one no? its playstyle seems so rigid

[compact tundra]

It is but I had an idea for it. If you've ever played risk of rain 2 then I want to give dagger a short ranged throw option that crits on back, like the alt move for bandit in RoR2, but that might be equally as dumb as spear throw, gotta ask some dagger mains

[finite agate]

have it bleed like bandit, probs gonna be less inciting than a burst

[compact tundra]

Na bleed isn't in the game and I don't want to add a new mechanic. Also now that I think about it a throwy criting on back is cool but I don't know how well this really meshes with daggers playstyle

[finite agate]

might be equally dum now that i think abt it tho lmao

damn this melee shit complex

[compact tundra]

Yea, I might have just thought about the cool idea and not how it meshes with the weapon or game

[forest birch]

Why is the heavy grenade launcher the worst weapon in the game

[compact tundra]

It's aight just takes a lot of skill to get use out of. Has a weirdly high skill floor for a GL

[hardy dust]

Kills slow, very inconsistent, has a weird way of actually doing damage and has huge weaknesses, notably being terrible at close range

[static hinge]

so.. what kills faster in a 1 on 1 confrontation, FCAR, AKM or P-90? 1st 2nd and 3rd

[hoary patio]

They should give heavy dashes then lights will know the pain

[exotic kraken]

P90 fcar akm

P90 fast fire rate , Fcar higher damage , Akm balance between both

[finite agate]

addendum here is p90 only beats fcar TTK in effective range, so if youre inconsistent at being in close range i'd recommend using fcar over it

[eager wasp]

not worst but up there yes bc its just a silly really niche pick that has more downsides than it does upsides

the bounce before exploding, small mag, not good closer up like cl is, ofc not like shoot at your feet type of thing but still better etc

[silver thunder]

the mgl fits heavy's theme so well, but the playstyle it encourages would almost be more suited to medium

[hardy dust]

P90 kills faster than fcar or akm

In akm vs fcar it depends, bodyshots only and akm wins, headshots only and fcar wins

The difference between akm and fcar is almost negligible

[analog pewter]

i actually really like the design of the recurve bow, I like that it doesn't quite require every shot to be a headshot, you can really get away with max draw on most shots, it pairs well with like tracking dart and quick melee and basically any additional source of damage

[placid slate]

Now mfs unironically want throwing knives reskins oh hell nah

[indigo nexus]

marginally!

it isn’t much different to an average difference between the AKM and FCAR

[hardy dust]

Tbf its like 0.1s instead of 0.01s

Which actually makes a substantial enough difference

But yeah, the overall ttks are very similar since they're all medium automatics

[analog pewter]

was anyone else originally devastated when they realized you couldnt shoot thermal bore at someone and stick it to them

i tried between multiple matches to hit someone with the bore and i eventually checked the wiki and had a joker moment when i read it cant hit players directly

[inner root]

that was so me

[indigo nexus]

The difference is only really more significant if you assume virtually no possibility for headshots

[vagrant nymph]

Oh dude same here

My disappointment was immeasurable

[indigo nexus]

for reference

[warped talon]

What would y'all run with KS23 and goo gun? Personally I was thinking barricade, cube and dome

[indigo nexus]

I wouldn’t take barricade as googun can do its job, I’d rather take C4 or pyro mines in that slot

[warped talon]

Interesting, that was my thought too but I noticed some goo gun + sledgehammer users run barricade anyway. Thought there might be something I was missing there

[shell sonnet]

What happens if a moving platform hits a loose piece of debris?

Cant recall ever seeing it, only ever static intact buildings

Does it push them?
Destroy them?

[muted condor]

It destroys anything they touch

[rugged terrace]

I wish we could get more nama tama theme gadgets

[sudden pewter]

You want breakfast

[vernal folio]

moving plats dont stop moving or get affected by anything ever

[low sphinx]

I actually just found out the Famas is cracked when you lean how to use it properly. I'm so late to the party haha.

[sudden pewter]

Do you think we’ll ever see the return of the heavy hitters sledge primary attack? It seems like for a lot of these limited time events namely just heavy hitters and heaven or else we’re getting soft weapon rework or at least something new tied to the weapon.

I really like the idea of using limited time events as a testing ground for potential changes

[shell sonnet]

Love what theyre doing with em

[blazing flume]

I mean I feel like that’s been the whole point of at least some LTMs, for example the snowball blitz being a test for TDM, and I’m sure there’s more that I can’t name off the top of my head and I’m kinda in a rush rn

[shell sonnet]

I was honestly a little scared people would shit on TDM because it was 1 all-class weapon and a single gadget, killing it off eventhough it was clearly for different reasons

[placid slate]

Why would you unironically want knockback on a melee

[oblique crypt]

I've been running it more recently even with goo gun, partially cause it goes well with KS. It covers goo's weakness to fire and is a little quicker to place in a pinch I think. There's also the psychological damage of making it through a mountain of goo just to find the door still blocked by a barricade.

[languid sage]

REWORK WINCH

Winch shouldn't be free damage for all weapons. Its such a crutch for heavy and its the counter for all specials. They also balance all weapons around winch claw instead balance the weapons.
Idea for a rework is instead of a predictable line when winching a player, instead it should be like winching a cash out and not have a predictable line for free damage. the player will be launched at you and the velocity will be determined how the player is winch, like if they get caught on an object. the player will not be stun and be able to shoot back. will be able to still isolate a player but not have a free damage. you should not be able to use precision weapons and close weapons with winch because its just good across the board. if they rework winch like this they would have to revert all the nerf winch has been delt and balance the weapon again.

[compact tundra]

So like this isn't a feedback channel, that's #👂┇game-feedback. I mean you can post it here but I don't think devs read this chat, and we all know, most people in this chat want winch reworked

[languid sage]

🦶

[compact tundra]

Fair enough

[finite agate]

nerf winch but make it make lights that are hit hit that femboy yelp instead of doing damage

a fair tradeoff

balanced winch

lights get something awakened in them

[placid slate]

Rework winch into crack needle

[finite agate]

lights just want winch nerfed because they don't want to confront the tingling down under they feel when they get hit 😔

[compact tundra]

I like both of these takes, either way I get a femboy or some crack

[finite agate]

little bratty uwu dash bottoms

[placid slate]

Mfs are not stroking their m11 to getting sent flying towards a giant gorilla

[finite agate]

astol(ight)fo

[compact tundra]

Speak for yourself, I live getting winched by a big strong glistening heavy

[finite agate]

light main getting winched

i say this as someone trying to learn light

[compact tundra]

I don't know the reference and that makes me scared to comment

[finite agate]

o the guy basically sells himself to the old man to secure war funding for his army, iirc

[compact tundra]

I can teach you sword or double barrel, that about all I got

[finite agate]

been a while since i've seen berserk

[compact tundra]

Oh it's berserk, nvm I'm definitely not gonna comment

[finite agate]

lmao funnily enough all the close ranged weapons give me more success since it makes sense in my head to burst and secure the kill then dip out

it's things like the LH1/bow where you have to play range that fucks me up since it's more about harassing and being annoying than it is getting a pick

my throwing knife games are hit/miss too but that's probs an aim issue, my brain stops working trying to hit quick left-right strafes on a projectile weapon

[compact tundra]

Eh, most the "long ranged" light weapons are typically played at mid range anyways. try ARN for a bit and then transition into harder weapons like bow. LH1 is stupid easy once you learn it, you just click them to death at any range really. I'd say equip thermal bore so you can create openings for yourself to shoot through, this should help you learn the weapon

[finite agate]

yeah im contemplating dropping h infuser for thermal bore. arn works for me but the others dont as much xP

[sudden pewter]

Just the animation babygirl I don’t want a FaN Melee

Waiter! Waiter! Weapon mechanic that actively removes enemies from its effective range please!

[blazing flume]

Make winch have no cooldown and reaches an additional 30 meters

[rugged marten]

Make winch have 3 charges

[inner root]

meow

[verbal atlas]

i want you

[verbal atlas]

i mean this lol

[sudden pewter]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/437863525965365249/1399490368285835475/mauzy.carrd.co_watermark_dupecut_20fps.gif

[versed finch]

Add a 1 shot gun with a 30 second reload time

Also everyone in the game gets pinged when you scope in

Season 10 better add a nuclear airstrike

[sudden pewter]

Season 10 AlfaActa sponsor confirmed???

(Nuclear Silo in the living room)

[shell sonnet]

flashbangs everyone on the map for x seconds
ctrl + alt + delete's 1 area of the map

[sudden pewter]

Flashbang skin that flashes “Skill Issue” when fully blinded

[tall prairie]

THATS NOT REALISTIC THO

Though*

[sudden pewter]

Neither is Light mains breaching Gold 2

[rugged marten]

Get nullified nerd

[sudden pewter]

But it happens, long live Embark (glory to Oscar dynasty)

[tall prairie]

Nah

[sudden pewter]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-shoo-away-gif-13653609800890535042

[rugged marten]

Real talk when is the m60 going to get a legendary skin

Preferable a coconut shooter

[loud monolith]

Dear @pseudo pike please would you consider adding green flame in preparation for Halloween for the flamethrower

[rugged marten]

Wrong channel embark doesnt read this channel, should be in game-feedback

[loud monolith]

Thank you kind sir

[sudden pewter]

Please don’t directly ping devs either, poor taste

[loud monolith]

I didn't know

[sudden pewter]

If anything, bother a CM. Birdie in particular seems to be very patient

[shell sonnet]

i think heaven or else is making me believe in genuine irl plot armor

[glad shoal]

Each team had to play through open qualifiers. There was no special treatment for anyone

[verbal atlas]

everytime I want to get mad i just start up this game easy as that

thats better

[sweet orchid]

Bro I just got back into the finals after the CNS season, what did they do to the taser dowg 😭 they massacred my boy.

[sudden pewter]

Stun Gun was reworked in S6. It’s now a nullifier

[placid slate]

Yuh it's pretty useless now, if not useless just nerfed the shit out of

[vocal dome]

Is there a glitch where u can’t join friends lobby rn on the finals?

[compact tundra]

I ran into it before, restart your game or have them join you

[vocal dome]

Ok

[cunning slate]

Still kinda sucks, tho. It needs friendly fire to let it help teammates, like vanish.

[sudden pewter]

FF would introduce grief potential, and reverting the rework would bring it back all related issues.

[jagged pumice]

Why is it so hard/long to level the healing emitter?

[sudden pewter]

It has a niche use case (turning 3v3’s into 2v3’s) and that’s fine

[sudden pewter]

Because the XP has a decimal multiplier that makes its gain super fucking slow.

[cunning slate]

True, and griefing would be an issue. I just thought that if you could nullify a teammate, it'll let them reset or something.

[jagged pumice]

[sudden pewter]

It’s only 3(?)s of safety, in which they can’t respond to threats

It’s delaying the inevitable, rather than preventing it with other gadgets

It’s a powerful gadget but it doesn’t mesh well with the current meta atm

[jagged pumice]

Can we make a petition to raise the xp multiplier?

[sudden pewter]

Or get rid of the decimal multiplier entirely. 100 health = 100XP

[cunning slate]

Either way, Im not a light main. What do I know.

[muted condor]

Can we keelhual defib users?

[sudden pewter]

Gadgets & Weapon XP needs a pass regardless, not all of them are equal

[jagged pumice]

Yeah, why not that

[sudden pewter]

Some gadgets get XP via deployment while other don’t, it doesn’t make sense

[placid slate]

Keelhaul P90 meds, them throw them into a woodchipper

[cunning slate]

1. What?

2. No. Its probably the only way I can use the damn P90 without getting curbstomped by some db light.

Aside from turret, but thats not the point.

[placid slate]

You are a dead man, woman or child over the age of 7

[cunning slate]

Whats it to ya?

[placid slate]

P90 user

[cunning slate]

*Cerb

[sudden pewter]

Even worse

[placid slate]

Not worse currently

[stoic garden]

yes worse

[sudden pewter]

Much worse

[placid slate]

Equally bad?

[cunning slate]

Balenced

[stoic garden]

tensions between @sudden pewter and @placid slate are high

[sudden pewter]

Cerb isn’t balanced, definitely needs a push to be better without being overtuned

[placid slate]

Can't touch damage

[sudden pewter]

Not sure what metric they could alter, maybe spread?

[cunning slate]

I can kill gas in one shot. Its a fair trade.

[placid slate]

Needs to take more effort to use

[stoic garden]

reload ☢️

[sudden pewter]

Yes let’s make the shotgun skillbased

KS23 cries in the corner
Surely nothing could go wrong

[stoic garden]

nah increase pellet size

[placid slate]

I would say it's a spear situation but the ks23 actually gets changes

[sudden pewter]

KS23 is getting meaningful changes, but none are enough to push it into relevancy

[placid slate]

Fiddle with the rpm, you can get it into akm ttk territory without much balance issues, then adjust ammo economy from there

[sudden pewter]

They buffed the demolition damage: Still can’t compete with sledge(nor should it) and it’s not effective enough as a weapon to make use of it

They increased the accuracy: Still inaccurate enough to beef shots due to the weapon

[stoic garden]

long range demolition seems pretty good to me tho

[sudden pewter]

I agree I’d like to see the RPM tampered with if they’re never going to give it perfect accuracy

[placid slate]

I did the maths a while ago and it almost perfectly can emulate akm ttk without nuking lights

[sudden pewter]

I would personally like to see the RPM increase as the magazine drains, it would be another light buster tool though

Fuck em though

[placid slate]

It gets in and around 0.6 second ttk on lights, so it'll be fine

Put that at 0.55 and its 1:1 akm ttk on med and heavy almost

[compact tundra]

Hey could you show me the ttk charts for lewis v M60 and lewis v ShAK. When you get a chance

[indigo nexus]

here

[compact tundra]

Thank you

[compact tundra]

Is your program accessible online or just by you, and if so is it up to date with 8.3?

[indigo nexus]

Just by me currently, and yes

I would want to get it "properly" done before I publish it anywhere...

[compact tundra]

Damn, fair enough. Just would be a helpful tool for looking at balance

[indigo nexus]

right now it's super inefficient for completely accurate computations

[compact tundra]

How so?

[indigo nexus]

it does a ton of repeated computation which isn't actually needed at all

I thought it was when I first made it, but realised I was wrong, but didn't bother to fix it

[compact tundra]

Oh so it just runs inefficiently, the calculations are fine

[indigo nexus]

yeah

it's verifiably accurate in almost all cases... there's some issue with the quick-melee estimator which only shows its face for the CB-01 sometimes (??)

very weird why it's inconsistent

and spread isn't modelled perfectly, which I could also fix

[compact tundra]

Does this account for weapon spread. Cause I thought it was presuming 100% accuracy with 25% headshots

[indigo nexus]

Yes, that's why the shak's line curves up at the end

[compact tundra]

Ok so what percentage of shots are being hit, or is it simulating the gun firing at a dummy

[indigo nexus]

it's assuming all shots are lined up correctly
so any missing is just due to spread

[compact tundra]

Oh ok, that's what I was looking for

[indigo nexus]

which is sort of simulated against a "dummy", but not a very good one

[compact tundra]

Oh, so it's presuming no recoil, how many would hit?

So does this simulate hipfire only or ads as well

[indigo nexus]

Yes

I don't have a good way to simulate how a player controls recoil

[compact tundra]

You said it accounts for spread, how so. Cause I don't think weapon spread works while ads, so is it pressing the weapon is hipfired

[indigo nexus]

It can be set to do hipfire

[compact tundra]

So if set to ads then it presumes 100% accuracy?

[indigo nexus]

Shak has spread. P90 actually appears to have a slight spread

[indigo nexus]

each gun has a separate ADS and hipfire inaccuracy

[compact tundra]

Huh, that doesn't make a lot of sense to me balance wise. Weapons have a spread even while ADSed? But there's no indicator for spread while ADSing in game and no way to toggle one on

[indigo nexus]

Well, you can see the shak's shots deviate, but for the P90 I only noticed it by chance when testing its range values

And for weapons like the KS it's shown by the dispersion reticule

[indigo nexus]

I was tap firing single shots, where the gun perfectly reset after each shot. And at longer ranges, it would sometimes just not hit. And when it did hit I could clearly see the coin effect in different places

[tawny kraken]

What would you say is the best light weapon right now?

[compact tundra]

That is weird. But helpful to know

[compact tundra]

So like, if I were to hand you a big ol' list of guns, how annoying would that be to run. Cause I'd love to have a list of ttk values for reference with my balance sheet but I don't need them, just nice to have.

[indigo nexus]

if you want it for a specific distance then it would be pretty immediate, I'd just need to modify the script

it only becomes slow to preserve accuracy when the damage or hitrate drops a lot due to range

[compact tundra]

Na not really, the ones you show here are what I would want, ttk over different ranges. It helps show what is better in what scenarios

If that would be annoying or tedious then I wouldn't bother

Just might occasionally ask for charts when I'm at a group of weapons where that is important

[indigo nexus]

I would have to leave it for a while but not a super long time, still need to modify it.

Unless I allowed it to get a little wobbly, in which case it would be very quick

[compact tundra]

Want me to just write up the list and you tell me whether or not it'd be a pain in the ass?

[indigo nexus]

how'd you want it formatted? There'd be 3 lists of 60 elements per gun

[compact tundra]

What does that mean

[indigo nexus]

what exactly would you like me to produce - how should the results be presented

[compact tundra]

1 min

[proper raft]

Here's some ideas for the Data Reshaper.

• Reshaper cycle on the tablet
  Or
• Copy paste function. Where you can use triggers/mouse buttons for copy and paste respectively.
  Or
• Make the cannister "balloons" reshapable.
  Again just some ideas.
  Love the game, love you Embark.
  ❤️

[compact tundra]

Presuming it can only do 1v1's, if it can take groups then this simplifies significantly

XP v ARN
XP v M11
XP v 93R
XP v Throwing knives (?)
93R v V9S
93R v LH1
Matter v V9S
Matter v M11
Matter v Double Barrel
Sniper v LH1
Sniper v bow
LH1 v ARN

Fcar v FAMAS
Fcar v AKM
P90 v AKM
P90 v Cerb
P90 v CL-40(?)
Model v Cerb
Model v Repeater
Repeater v pike
Repeater v revolver

SA-12 v Sledge
SA-12 v Flamethrower
SA-12 v ShAK
ShAK v D-eagles
Lewis v D-eagles
Lewis v Minigun
BFR v D-eagles
BFR v KS-23

Again this is NOT needed, just creates a cool reference sheet for weapons that compete with each other

[indigo nexus]

oh, you just want a load of charts? Okay, er... there is a much better solution that I could implement to this end that would make this much nicer.

There is an issue here in that I never fully implemented damage over time, I just need some free time to finish all this... problem is that if I can motivate myself to code something it really should be my uni work rather than this stuff

[compact tundra]

The damage over time for flamethrower and Cerb is not needed, also if you could be doing uni work instead of giving me a bunch of charts to reference once then definitely do the uni work

[compact tundra]

You should post this in #👂┇game-feedback, I don't think they read this chat but game feedback back gets read by devs I think

[proper raft]

Gotcha, thanks for letting me know.

[flint stone]

I feel like they have to mentally prepare themselves for most of the dogshit takes that get posted

[stoic garden]

visit the channel with a blindfold

[ionic mason]

The single secondary swoosh on the spear in heaven or else feels so good, it kinda makes me wish we had the option in the main game.

[placid slate]

Better be a testbed for it or I'm going to spear spin the embark offices

[sudden pewter]

A wall of Heavy players graaaaaghing through their doors and dealing demolition damage in their office

[heady briar]

can you grapplehook into the BFR titan?

[sudden pewter]

Can you winch players and shoot them with the BFR? Yes

[heady briar]

but like it is a huge delay

[sudden pewter]

No.

Winching can ensure a headshot

[heady briar]

no? Ive feelt that. Maybe im just doin it wrong

[potent thorn]

Yes you can winchclaw into the BFR, draw a 7 from where your crosshair hit them and it should be a headshot. If needed, try to get a melee in

[heady briar]

thx bro

[versed finch]

Beautiful Shak-50 Animation glitch

You literally shoo the bullets away

[shell sonnet]

How did you even do that??

[crimson wedge]

Riot shield is annoying but easily countered, maybe too easily.
If you could shield surf it in air when blocking downwards to not be punished for aerial movement and block upwards phalanx style it'd shave some of its many weaknesses.
I also wish you could swap which hand holds the shield and baton, less so for lefty reasons and more so to change the direction in which people can choose to bishop (moving diagonally without blocking but still being shielded)

[versed finch]

I tactical reloaded, then opened mesh, and before it deployed, went back to weapon

After you reload the best glitch is over, but the animations are still messed up, it's just not as funny

Fixes by using a gadget or spec ofc

[warped talon]

Would you swap out dome shield for barricade? Or do dome shield + barricade?

[analog pewter]

barricade with goo is actually hella useful in a pinch, but I mostly run it with the sledgehammer rather than KS

[cunning slate]

can you give anyone other than heavy an lmg?

[oblique crypt]

Nah I don't need no dome shield

Sometimes I swap chuck for dome shield though

[warped talon]

What would you run with KS?

[warped talon]

Fascinating. Also by chuck you mean C4?

[oblique crypt]

Chuck is saddened by your ignorance

(It's the heal orb)

[marsh panther]

the guns do no damage, so now everyone just runs around withs swords and spears eating bullets for breakfast and making the guns a rather pointless part of the game\

[clever storm]

tfw i lie

[muted condor]

This is ether some wild bait or delusional on a different level

[analog pewter]

mesh shield, goonade I think

[flint stone]

Me when I self report being bad

[static hinge]

how much faster?

[hardy dust]

About 0.1s faster

[frank yew]

Yeah

[warped talon]

Oh damn, idk if I can do it. I feel like I just need to have goo gun with KS thanks for the tip though

[verbal atlas]

WE NEED PUBLIC CHAT I CANNOT STRESS ENOUGH

I NEED TO TALK TRASH

[eager wasp]

we do not need this, i don't need to see everyone whining in chat

[verbal atlas]

you never rage?

[eager wasp]

not in chat and not that much, just slightly irritated

[stoic garden]

impostor self reported in electrical 😟

[hardy dust]

They do damage when you can aim 💔

[trail ridge]

https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZP8AUraJg/

[turbid vault]

i am not clicking that tiktok link bruv

who just told me to go here just to not say anything

[muted heron]

The joke is I haven't sent a singular message here besides this one

[finite agate]

anyone got tips for heaven or else? i want the rewards but i dont enjoy it

[eager wasp]

have patience, and you'll get it done eventually

i don't enjoy it but now im done with all contracts and im happy as can be that i don't have to play it anymore

[finite agate]

the dailies feel obnoxiously put in place to pad out engagement stats instead of letting the mode perform apropos of its quality

it's obnoxious tbh, so much of the game's contracts kind of let you play how you want and give you options, then there's this

[eager wasp]

wdym the dailies feel abnoxious?

[finite agate]

oh, wrong wording. the LTM contracts

[eager wasp]

the contracts really aren't that bad, the only sort of "grindy" one is the wins contract, and even then its only 10, you are bound hit get a few here and there

[normal condor]

the fact that you thought of "shoo" before anything else like idk germany is insane

[finite agate]

yeah it's just extremely time waste-y which runs counter to everythign that hooked me into this game 😒

like the matches also devolve into one group camping one platform, it's dogshit

[eager wasp]

true, but all it takes is one good healing emitter throw/cns and bye bye team

[finite agate]

riveting

[eager wasp]

very! who woulda thunk that the better weapon would be the healing emitter, an item used to heal your team!

[finite agate]

i think that's the mood the whole mode gives me, "riveting" (squidward style)

[eager wasp]

every ltm they've put out except cashball:

[finite agate]

they really gotta stop doing these dumbass ltms then

"lets distract from the innovative main game mode we made with... checks notes shitty smash bros"

[vocal flume]

why cant i healing emitter+lokcbolt then toss people off the platform or map

[cinder owl]

there is a problem with the shinku's reckoning skin for the ARN it costs 2999 multibucks and you cant equip or buy it

[placid slate]

Would care to look at the ttk values of guns and compare it to melee weapons

[cinder owl]

@placid slate i still think melee does more damage when someone elese is using it

[tawny kraken]

Hey guys , is there any reliable kind of source where I can check which weapons perform better for each class ? I’ve been watching some videos but the opinions differ a lot and I was wondering which combination is better for me as a light to climb up from Silver since my positioning matches were a disaster

[errant eagle]

Just try everything out and find your own suitable style, it’s not only about guns and kills. For medium cover range i find ARN 220 an amazing gun, M11 for close range does also massive damage. Good thing about this game is that you have a variety of loadout builds regarding your play style preference and the opposite teams loadout

[strange socket]

Ive coached someone before basically i run 1v1s see any flaws or mistakes then i mention them and help to correct if you interested dm me and we can organise something its free ofc im not saying im the best player but i think i can help i even helped a duo to identify their flaws when playing together basically learn maps, positioning how to escape how to infiltrate how to be consistent and able to adapt based on ehat your team needs

[tawny kraken]

Thing is I like throwing knives but I read everywhere that they are not “meta”. Just don’t want my team to blame me because I use the “wrong” weapon.

[strange socket]

Bro fuck the meta I use the most random shit possible ome match im sniper next im m11 next im on bow sometimes 93r, maybe ill play heavy spear, or maybe bfr, or possibly p90 on medium or maybe even cerb, at the end of the day it is entirely up to you, if you good with it stick with it practice with it play quick cash or tdm until you feel you understand positioning and how to attack in a way that doesn't leave you vulnerable know when to fight and when to leave it simple stuff that completely changes the entire game for you

[inner root]

fr bro Pyro and Gas is the meta

[tawny kraken]

Thanks, I’ll try that !

[strange socket]

Lol id go to say gas is actually better than pyro, you just gotta be alot more strategic with it, any weapon works if you know how to use it and ehat gadgets and specialisation make it easier to use

[inner root]

no im saying the both of them in one kit

[strange socket]

Oh, personally i only use one then go for more tactical items rather than lethals

E.g. i use invis, stun gun and gas or maybe portal rather than stun gun

[indigo nexus]

Worry about the meta once you get to high platinum maybe

[strange socket]

Fr, thats how it should be

[indigo nexus]

the meta is typically defined in regards to high performing players, if you are not performing highly it literally does not apply to you.

And I don't mean that in a "just play to have fun" sense, the meta is literally different based on the skill level in question, and your personal characteristics

[flint stone]

You can still win and beat meta picks if you're not awful as well

[strange socket]

It does to am extent, it just changes with each skill ceiling so a high skill ceiling means stuff like famas is great in ruby but not many people use it in silver or gold

[indigo nexus]

kind of, but if skill ceiling was the be-all and end-all we'd be in a sniper meta :p

things that are in the meta are, in most cases, there because they don't perform well enough at other skill levels to warrant a nerf

there may be exceptions to this such as dome shield and RPG which are just really strong in general... but that's for the purpose of maintaining class identity and balance

[flint stone]

Imagine a sniper meta

[strange socket]

Snipers easy to kill imo

They generally just camp out or are getting up close nothing good accuracy and movement cant stop

[indigo nexus]

If a sniper player played well enough the only weapons that could fight them would be those that could one or two-shot them

[flint stone]

Well ya bad sniper players

[indigo nexus]

(and winch claw, if they were close)

[strange socket]

All of them tbh, the goods ones are easy to predict they all play similarly, and the bad ones cant hit you if you stood still

[analog pewter]

I want an umbrella gadget for light. Slows your descent, lifts you up if deployed above fire 😋

[indigo nexus]

sniper isn't meta because it's not really within the scope of a human player to use it in a perfect manner, while for some weapons a human can reasonably get very close

[indigo nexus]

this sounds useless

[flint stone]

https://tenor.com/view/deadlock-mina-sexy-vampire-valve-gif-3042027530807616352

[strange socket]

Or we could just quick melee all match which personally i believe is the true meta and i also believe it should do 5000 dmg per hit as well as knock back all opponents in a 40meter radius and destroy buildings and stuff, as well as kill yourself and teammates and any people within a 20m radius, fairly balanced i think

[analog pewter]

Then you're not a creative gamer

[strange socket]

Tbh no fall dmg would defeat the point of slow falling, it would make you an easy target and wouldnt in general be used

[flint stone]

Low gravity already annoying as fuck

[strange socket]

It always comes on at the worst times, im tryna jump through a window to escape and next thing i know im hitting the roof and am stuck

[sonic zephyr]

give the ks-12 buckshot. No point in it being slugs now that the BFR is in the game

[ionic mason]

HATE. Let me tell you how much i've come to HATE pyro grenades...
Not because they're strong, no. The exact opposite!
They're absolute dog water but people keep using them anyway! Especially in powershift where they destroy the actually useful gas!
Please, i beg you, use anything else. A frag does better damage all at once and in a bigger area! Gas has a huge aoe range! just anything else is better than running three nades!

[stoic garden]

deal damage with fire contract:

[shell sonnet]

tbf, using pyro when you gassed the platform while an enemy owns it is just bad gameplay, they could be doing so many other things that harm the team
at least it can clear gas when you own it

[stoic garden]

i like fire on ps cuz it sticks on surfaces like idk barricades

no matter how much the platform moves ❤️

[indigo nexus]

I like pyro nades for the near guaranteed opening damage they give you in fights

[stoic garden]

i cant believe bro has lore on his name

[shell sonnet]

realistically, how do you stop a defib like that?

[ionic mason]

the humble frag nade:
(Also just shoot the guy, it does more damage than you waste throwing a nade and switching to your gun)

[inner root]

bring back 2 nades vroo

[inner root]

pyro

[shell sonnet]

by the time you have it out and thrown, defib is already fully charged
even if, it deals chip damage at most
and the defibbed doesnt take any damage due to i-frames

[inner root]

you can just hit the statue then dummy

heavies have the farthest

[shell sonnet]

and that helps how exactly?
it deals barely any damage, if at all, in the time the medium needs to be close to it

[inner root]

vro 😭✌️

not to do damage but to prevent the revive

[shell sonnet]

it doesnt even prevent the revive

[inner root]

lost cause bro 😞

[inner root]

it prevents the revive by making the medium miss the defib

[shell sonnet]

you mean by visually obscuring it?

[inner root]

no you can hit the statue and it will go flying

you can physically interact with statues with a melee

[shell sonnet]

that nudges it like maybe 2 meters
and the medium can more than make up for that by walking, since, yk, you arent shooting them

[inner root]

no it doesn't

but since im wrong you could have used the goo barrel to block

skill issue at the end of the day tho

[shell sonnet]

i guess one could argue hoping for barrel rng is part of the skillset
not that goo grenade wouldve been any better, since it takes just as long as pyro

so, youre trying to use goo, now what?
you also cant shoot them if theyre behind goo, so you just moved their cover closer to their target, an active detriment to you
unless you use it to not block them off completely, which only makes them need to walk 2 meters more, which doesnt buy nearly enough time

[stoic garden]

charge and slam the moment u see him duh

[indigo nexus]

Frag nade is avoidable and may detonate after the fight is over

Whether shooting the guy deals more damage depends on your aim and the weapon being used

[shell sonnet]

thats something i could actually see working
thing is, it can be sidestepped
had i been any further away than this, i couldnt have done it in time
and i do want to run other things, many of which dont help

[indigo nexus]

Also something important to mention, is enemy notice

If you have the more covert position, then the enemy’s ability to fight back is determined not so much by how fast they die from now, but by how much time they have to fight back once they’re engaged with you. This same reasoning is why it can be a good idea to wait before attacking players in some circumstances.

If you toss a pyro nade at more than a few meters distance, by the time it’s landed you’re already shooting them and contextually, its damage was free, time-wise.

Hence I sometimes run pyro nades, even though I more often run frag

As a person with below average aim, it changes my ambush attacks from mediocrely effective (I often lose the gunfight even if I got the drop on them) to almost always effective

Plus, it’s quick damage for when you’re out of ammo. Frag nades only work well for this in some circumstances.

[sudden pewter]

I personally wouldn’t factor enemy notice or ad when calculating DPS or balancing weapons

Better to balance around even footing and let the weapon differences (or skill differences) express themselves

[drifting forum]

winch OP for 5 straight seasons, yall refuse to do anything about it. typical L embark

[royal pier]

They need to not have attacking with Spear's regular attacks slow you to a crawl, allowing people to just sprint away.

[torn solstice]

mediums should get a g18

[flint stone]

I just luv handguns and its sad we don't have more

[torn solstice]

if the other 2 classes get 2 handguns why dont mediums yk

[swift raft]

weapons are good in this game

[compact tundra]

This is my first time playing sledge hammer since season 2 I think, shits fun

[compact tundra]

Honestly I thought if something similar as a spec for light, its basically the glider from shadowrun. But honestly the umbrella athletic fits the game better and would be a super cool spec

[fringe arch]

real

[shell sonnet]

Does looking up get you further?

[compact tundra]

From what I can tell it's moving your cross hair up as you jump, it's more noticeable on sword lunges

[shell sonnet]

Ive seen that but couldnt correctly replicate it

[compact tundra]

On normal slide jumps it's minor so probably not easy to tell via replication, but I feel like it's more noticeable the more momentum your working with

[muted condor]

I’m playing sledge hammer in bf6

[compact tundra]

Only battlefield I've ever played was battlefield 1 and I've played like a total of 4 online matches

[muted condor]

Bf1 is timeless

It still holds up today

[royal pier]

Ok so my rework for Goo Gun would be:

• Enemies hit with the goo anywhere on their body causes it to encase their feet for roughly the same duration as it is now.

• Explosions and melee reliably hit them during this.

• the projectile is bigger and faster.

This makes it easier for the one hit to defend themselves, but makes the jank of landing the goo less arduous.

[sudden pewter]

I played BF3 when I was 10 and it’s where my father taught me how to teabag

[finite agate]

asia e-sports scene banning ks23 is crazy

[hollow delta]

Y'know what's even better, giving it a cooldown like every other spec in the game. Cause a 1.5 second Reload on a mobility stopping, bullet blocking, wall building ability is not punishing. Especially when it doesnt have nearly as much jank as other things in the game and has 20 shots.

[shell sonnet]

Goo gun needs a lot of ammo tho to function

[boreal laurel]

I hope they never hard-nerf goo gun because I hate literally all of the other heavy specs

I mean I can use them but I only really enjoy goo gun

[hardy dust]

They should do something with the alt fire

Ive seen a lot of people throw out the idea of multiple blobs in 1 right click

[grim jasper]

Not the sa winching you like he's gonna win that fight 😂

[compact tundra]

Honestly winching a sledge with SA isn't the worst play from my experience but you can't just stay still after it. He just winched and walked back.

[hardy dust]

If they have good tracking with sa its not too bad but its definitely better to cancel the sledge m2 with winch

Especially if you get a full 4 burst off first so the delay doesn't completely screw you over

[analog pewter]

spec would be fine but it would be a shame not to be usable with like, grapple

I think it would be more interesting as a gadget personally, and probably easier to balance with the specs
if they did a gliding spec I'd rather see like, a wingsuit type thing. holo-wingsuit, mesh shield type aesthetic

[gleaming kindle]

mgl NEEDS a buff its useless

[flint stone]

I pray it'll get a rework, some people are gonna tell you it's a skill issue when they play against awful players w no idea what's going on

[timber sequoia]

Question as a player who hasn’t played since season 2 what balance chamges should I expect from my favorite weapons (riot shield, sledge hammer, dagger)

[flint stone]

Dagger still kinda whatever, sledge is fine and riot shield is actually playable

[timber sequoia]

it was always playable

does this mean it got a buff tho? If so Im excited

[stoic garden]

sledge got its qm combos removed completely

m1 attack from 115 dmg to 100, m2 from 200 to like 175

this was one to accomodate for winch claw existing, fuck that specialization

also dagger got a bit of a rework, right click can now be held but it slows you down, deals slightly more dmg if you miss backstab i think, but backstab angle was reduced from 180 to 150 degrees

riot shield got some sorts buffs to hitbox, then got nerfs to lunge distance to chase enemies, and the first person weapon model reflects mostly how your enemies see it, which blocks part of your sight

also apparently there's Bugs revolving the shielding, so people might be able to hit you despite literally blocking their bullets

[flint stone]

The hold thing was something we had in the open beta </3

[stoic garden]

i know og

[indigo nexus]

Bit of an exaggeration. It isn't very good but it's fine outside of high elo

[bitter surge]

Repeater top 3 weapons rn

[sudden pewter]

It’s a very solid gun

[flint stone]

If you're playing against new players probably

[indigo nexus]

mm, it's used rarely enough that no players are really that experienced against it

it's just players with vs without much common sense, I guess. Which is vaguely correlated to skill

[flint stone]

Well yeah but most things are good against people w no common sense

[indigo nexus]

This is a common problem where people conflate a shared correlation between two things as some sort of "counter" to someone pointing out that one thing has a strong correlation in that regard

the MGL is more sensitive to this than almost any other weapon

anyway, I suspect AJ isn't at a level where MGL is actually unusable (It's just unlikely)

[misty heart]

Why is everyone complaining about the 10 win contract, its really not that bad?

[teal basin]

What’re people opinions on the throwing knife’s?

[sudden pewter]

Same boat tbh, 10 wins isn’t a huge ask but if someone is actively trying to win (especially in an LTM as chaotic as this) I understand being frustrated

“Yeah maybe don’t try to 1v5 if we’re trying to win” type of stuff

[gleaming kindle]

Is there any other weapon with less usage and less potency?

[sudden pewter]

Dagger 🤣

[gleaming kindle]

dagger has a 1 shot kill if you get the "backstab"

[sudden pewter]

And?

DB might be a more apt comparison tbh (Dual Blades not Double Barrel)

[gleaming kindle]

seem pretty potent to me. you do need to have great mechanics and positioning to achieve that but the MGL needs perfect positioning for a multishot kill unless you hit a c4, mine or barrel

[gleaming kindle]

yeah i guess, but at least dual blades you get the deflect

[sudden pewter]

GL can deal damage at range, to take advantage of the backstab the dagger needs to close the gap and roll the dice on wether the server recognizes it or not

[royal pier]

Removing the ability to fire semi-auto was so unnecessary considering the alt fire is just unused.

[sudden pewter]

The greatest sin of the GL is that you’re encouraged to shoot at the environment rather than opponents due to the second bounce detonation rather than contact with enemy gamers

It’s not unusable, far from it. It isn’t weak, far from it, but it is frustrating to use. So I understand why you see it that way

It’s slated for a rework but Embark marked it as low priority which is lame but given the current state of melee (as a whole) I can see their reasoning

[royal pier]

It needs improvement, but useless isn't accurate.

[royal pier]

That's what makes it interesting though. The issue is that it's a bit too slow and the projectile weirdly small.

MGL32 needs:

• Slightly larger projectile.

• Slightly faster projectile.

• Remove the tactical reload and make that 2.85 sec the default.

• Less bounce when fired at close range and from height to more reliably hit close enemies and those far below the user.

• 5-10 damage from the projectile directly impacting an enemy.

• Impact detonation on Mesh/Dome Shield.

• Minimum damage raised to 32-35 in exchange for the AoE going back to 3.75m.

• Projectile breaks all props and terrain decoration. For example: ceiling tiles, bamboo, shutters, pots, chairs, etc. without bouncing/exploding

• "Aiming" shows the initial arc of the projectile

These next ones are more "would be nice" suggestions.

• Remove projectile collision from objects like small rocks/pebbles and otherwise insignificant objects.

• Have the projectile treat all stairs and similar surfaces like a flat slope instead of individual steps.

[gleaming kindle]

For sure. I may have exaggerate, but compared to the over effectiveness of other weapons i think it feels pretty bad in most circumstances

[gleaming kindle]

would be great

[royal pier]

Takes time to learn the tricks. I'm worried if they do change it, they'll just make it a mild variation of the CL-40 that will then get nerfed to being worse than before due to backlash.

It's OK for some weapons to remain something a relatively small number of sickos use.

Pretty sure the balance team forgot it exists though.

[indigo nexus]

Less usage? I don’t know. Less potency? I’d say dual blades for sure

[gleaming kindle]

yeah i think there are plenty of aspects of it that make it a really fun weapon. i personally enjoy it but its not something i would consider playing in a competitive mode

[royal pier]

See, of esports doesn't totally crash and burn, I kinda wanna make a triple MGL32 team lol.

I wanna force people to deal with all the explosions.

[gleaming kindle]

i would love to watch that

[royal pier]

Imagine getting past the open qualifiers. SSG or some shit having to strat around a constant barrage of nades from off point while fighting another team.

[indigo nexus]

would be cool

[royal pier]

Cause I would have us almost exclusively third party.

[indigo nexus]

I’ve used the MGL a decent bit in ranked recently and you do get a lot of very cool moments with it

[royal pier]

I should have taken more clips from this tournament.

[gleaming kindle]

that's a beautiful thing

[royal pier]

One thing MGL32 does better than any other weapon is splash damage.

Unironically a weapon with the best chance of winning a 1v3 if you play right.

But I shouldn't have to guess if that hitmarker I got on a nade bounced around a corner did 83 damage or 1. Make the minimum 32-35 and put the splash radius where it used to be.

[potent thorn]

Damage numbers near the crosshair could fix that

[royal pier]

I'd still rather have less splash range for more reliable damage.

Cause I'd want that 32-35 damage minimum to go out further than it does now. The drop-off is harsh.

[shell sonnet]

That looks fun

Also:

https://tenor.com/view/flashbang-gif-22572243

[royal pier]

It is, even if you lose you know the enemy is just in a state of panic.

Rare to set up though.

[shell sonnet]

Needs people dont somehow make them land in australia

[royal pier]

Wish I had tried to get COPE or POPE as a club tag early on. Could make an actual group.

[shell sonnet]

Tho i guess the distraction and spam might be enough for 1 good shot to wipe em up

[royal pier]

It's possible some variation of Pope is still available I doubt it's that big of a "get."

[shell sonnet]

Finally got a few good matches today after a dry streak

[shell sonnet]

Is that an mgl in your pfp?

[royal pier]

Yes but dont look too close lol.

I used my phone to make stickers of the MGL32, then one of my head on top of it, then of my fingers.

[royal pier]

It looks fine at pfp size, more obvious in full-sized.

The monochrome also made it look less fake.

[finite agate]

i can never get my slide bhops that clean god damn

[compact tundra]

It just takes time, I've been a sword main since season 1 so I got a good head start

[analog pewter]

in a game where you choose your weapon only when you hard-respawn, it's hard to justify using a weapon that only works well once you already have a position established to defend.
it could be better if you could swap to it when being rezzed, but that would fundamentally change the game's balance

[finite agate]

does the looking up do anything for the tech or is it a force of habit thing/being aware of your surroundings?

[compact tundra]

From my understanding and limited testing looking up as you hit the jump gives you more distance

[finite agate]

oh huh, thought that was exclusive to the word lunge techs for some reason. ty

[compact tundra]

Could be but even then with me maining sword it's good to have the muscle memory down

[analog pewter]

They should make hitmarkers have additional "prongs" for each like, 25 damage they deal maybe
idk might get confusing to track when hitting multiple targets on the same tick tho

[analog pewter]

we have roulette wheel lewis gun... when is slot machine MGL? the cylinder has a slot machine screen and you pull the lever to reload it....

[faint pier]

What's your opinion on swords?

Personally I get annoyed when I play against them

[muted condor]

Sword or dual blades?

[faint pier]

sword

[onyx hawk]

No offense to who ever made the new sword ballon skin but i could of made that shit pop. I been doing ballon animals for a few years and if they added a few more balls around the guard part of the sword id buy it even faster

[muted condor]

It’s a little annoying to fight but I run decently high sensitivity for controller so it’s not a problem. I could see someone with a lower sense having a problem

[compact tundra]

Never in my days did I think I'd hear someone complain about the quality of a balloon model(?), sculpture(?), whatever the fuck it is in this game. Honestly tho I dig it, fuck their low quality balloon twisting(?), should have hired a consultant

[compact tundra]

https://tenor.com/view/goku-prowler-goku-goku-mad-goku-dbs-dbs-gif-11120329515669448575

[slow linden]

It's time for retirement 106

[analog pewter]

give medium or heavy a meteor hammer NYAOW

[jade meadow]

I'm here for data reshaper cause I like being a barrel wizard

[hoary patio]

They should give heavy class 2 charges of explosive mines grenades and c4

[flint stone]

no

[hoary patio]

Why not? It’s the heavy class therefore it should carry more gadgets should it not

[flint stone]

Heavy has enough good util. Mines are strong enough, carrying more would just be overtuned on a class that doesn't need anymore strong util

[sudden pewter]

It’s the Heavy Class is definitively one of the statements of all time

[hoary patio]

Then why does light get 3 breach charges or glitch nades?

[sudden pewter]

Only Light has access to Breach Charges or Glitch Grenades. What rationale are you trying to use?

[hoary patio]

Heavy is the only one with c4 but we can’t give 2 charges?

But again heavy class is a very muscular class which you can make the assumption that they should carry more charges of certain gadgets should they not? Light should only get 1 charge for gadgets. Medium is in between depends on the gadgets and heavy should carry more

[muted condor]

The light and heavy charges are different gadgets

The heavy c4 is much bigger and deals more damage

[sudden pewter]

C4 deals high damage and makes big holes. It’s not comparable to the breach charge!

Giving gadget charges based on size is definitely an interesting take though, a new one for sure

Also, you can have two C4 active at a time! You can only have one charge at a time though

[static osprey]

Embark can we please revert the changes made to the demateralizer cuz it is now unusable especially with the delay it has when you deploy it

[indigo nexus]

It’s a very good gadget

Its charges were reduced for a reason

I do not think realism-focused weight constraints should overrule sensible balance strategies

[analog pewter]

if you see people making arguments toward realism when it comes to gameplay design and balance, it's because they've never actually once imagined multiplayer game balance as something that matters beyond the power fantasy.

it's all about the personal fantasy, it's never about how things feel to play against or interact with as someone not using them , it's about how they want to feel using any given thing

it's why I'm so hard on snipers, because they're a persistent example of a design feature that feels terrible to play against, consistently, in almost every game they've been in. They're a demonstration of what happens when you put the power fantasy over gameplay design, and how putting them in your game creates an impossible balancing task

[icy forge]

It makes place for some variety in specs for medium, not a bad change imo

[past parcel]

Nerf repeater
Nerf bow
Nerf DB

[indigo nexus]

I think they should fix the delay but the change in general I think was fair

[wide stratus]

Give heavy a big sword that can do aoe damage but takes longer to use

[hardy dust]

Also c4 is already way better than breach charges

C4 is already meta and doesn't need any buffs

[flint stone]

We didn't have variety bc the other specs sucked ass, no one used demat when heal beam was strong

Heal beam meta + heavy running double shields was so ass

[icy forge]

Yeah, I am not saying that I agree with the change, I'm just saying that it is not that bad. Overall Light not getting a single nerf while Heavy received a lot big ones and medium quite a significant number of nerfs is just stupid, I hope that Embark is aware of that.

[flint stone]

Light has consistently struggled to be viable outside of casual modes lol heavy was so fucking broken for the first few seasons, heavy is in a good spot I'd say

[icy forge]

No

[flint stone]

Light always has been the class that noob stomps but struggles against actually good players

wdym no xd

[icy forge]

I have 500hrs on TheFinals, to me the class is not ok

[flint stone]

ok? Your hours don't make what you're saying right, heavy is fine now compared to what it used to be

Early seasons heavy was so overtuned it wasn't even funny

[icy forge]

I literally said "to me", it's MY opinion

[flint stone]

heavy is fine tho xd

[icy forge]

I don't have the time to argue, I'm just expressing my opinion, I don't care

[hardy dust]

Thats cuz light was the weakest class by far on release and heavy was the strongest

And recently light has had the most impactful nerfs to specs honestly

Cloak got gutted and replaced by dash because the nerfs were so harsh

[icy forge]

Yeah but one class does not get to be stronger than the two others, that's not fair, I agree on S1 Heavy but nerfing Heavy was not the right move imo

[flint stone]

If they nerf dash I pray they just add a delay in between dashes instead of dropping a charge

[hardy dust]

Rn there isn't really one class that's stronger though

[flint stone]

The classes are the most balanced overall, light is just lagging behind a bit

[hardy dust]

Light is a bit weaker overall but still in a decent spot

[flint stone]

I was a light player on release and holy fucking shit it sucked

[hardy dust]

Yeah 😭

Light hasn't really been meta until like 2 seasons ago

Before that it was literally just mediums and heavies. HML was still viable but less consistent

[flint stone]

Light is just genuinely harder to play when you're against good people

[flint stone]

Now imagine if light was meta during double shield heavy </3 it would have never existed

[hardy dust]

Light depends the most on the enemy skill level. If they're bad you can do better, if they're good you'll end up doing worse

[hardy dust]

Literally just glitch nades

That was the one reason to run light iirc

[flint stone]

Glitch didn't pop on impact w shields then iirc

Shit bounced off </3

[hardy dust]

Yeah but the duration was 2 times longer

[flint stone]

The issue was mostly shield health imo

[hardy dust]

Didnt dome have like 1k hp at some point

[flint stone]

The fact that medium was just rewarded for playing mercy from overwatch

[indigo nexus]

500

[flint stone]

And people defended that play style bc it made them feel like good players to just look at people and heal beam 🥰

[hardy dust]

Yeah smth absurd

[indigo nexus]

4x (or even 5? not sure)

[hardy dust]

Could've sworn it was only 2x

[indigo nexus]

it was 20s

now is 5s

[hardy dust]

It was 10s

2.2.0

Im looking at the patch notes and there was a single glorious patch where it detonated on shield impact while also having 10s duration

Also im looking at the patch notes and dome had 350 hp at max

[indigo nexus]

2.0.0, decreased from 20s to 12s

[hardy dust]

Oh wait we're getting confused

[indigo nexus]

I was fairly sure that this was changed in open beta, but I cannot find evidence for it so I may be hallucinating

[hardy dust]

Im talking about glitch nade duration not dome

[indigo nexus]

oh

[flint stone]

It was def mesh being the biggest offender

[hardy dust]

Yea

1.2k hp, plus there was nukes and rpg doing enough to 1 shot light

I swear rpg used to do 180 but apparently it was 165

[flint stone]

I remember this server in the early seasons, the amount of people defending heavy was insane

[hardy dust]

I thought it was 180->150->140->100 but ig it was 165 not 180

[hardy dust]

Yeah 😔

[flint stone]

I wanna know what they were smoking to think RPG was healthy at 165 dmg

[indigo nexus]

I'm quite sure it was 180 in open beta

[hardy dust]

Okay that might have been it

[hardy dust]

Bro all the people defending 150+ dmg rpg with their lives in this server 😭

That pissed me off so much

[flint stone]

"nukes are easy to counter, it's a skill issue if you die to them"

[stoic garden]

people complaining about billion heavy nerfs while still being the most impactful class

[shell sonnet]

stupid idea, but what if cl-40 had its damage ramp up the longer its projectile is in the air?

point blank, defending yourself would be harder due to low damage (but does also help with accidentally hitting a wall near you when you didnt intend to)
at some point, it would deal its current damage for its distance
and later on, it might get increased higher than now for long range skill shots

would this be bad?
could this work?

[viral gulch]

add poop jar skin for gas pls

[stoic garden]

i like the dedication all you fellas put into these ideas but... i think weapons are best kept somewhat simple

[shell sonnet]

fair
but cant hurt to consider the options

[stoic garden]

for what reason should cl40 even do that lol

[indigo nexus]

I don't see this being good. CL-40 doesn't need to be good at long range and it doesn't need to be super low potency close up either

[shell sonnet]

being complicated is a little problematic

[stoic garden]

cl40's already decent at longer ranges if you know the trajectories (mostly just bombing people below u tho), and at closer ranges you want to be at least semi dangerous even if it kills you

such weaknesses should be left to very long range weapons imo

repeater is a good example of this, great poke potential but worse than average ttks with semi slow reload

[shell sonnet]

preventing b-hop cheese point blank
helping against accidental self damage
maybe opening up a potential option for a buff?

mainly just throwing shit at a wall that might work

[stoic garden]

i kinda like the fact cl40 is a weapon that lets you jump whilst using it, it's sort of a tech or at least a unique trait that allows it to mitigate the obscenely high self dmg

[shell sonnet]

true
but maybe cl-40 could work similarly

[stoic garden]

if your rework idea were to be implemented, what subsequent buffs would you give cl40

[shell sonnet]

i do think its a little problematic that it can sidestep a downside this trivially tho

[shell sonnet]

im not sure
reload/ammo makes it spammier

i mean, giving it the s4 damage back, but only at decently far ranges might be an option

and since the counterplay is more pronounced, it might end up being fine

a little related, but i do think projectiles should pass through dome shield

where this would also help flush them out/destroy it

[shell sonnet]

what do you think might help make it balanced?
several minds are better than one

[stoic garden]

i feel that it is already "balanced" in a way, what's your goal? make it viable at higher levels? make it less casual stomper? both?

btw for both i think you'd have to lower max splash damage somewhat and increase direct hit dmg, maybe increase splash radius to 0.65m to compensate

[shell sonnet]

it is somewhat decently balanced, but not perfect, but im looking for ways to potentially making it better both ways (better to fight, better to fight with)

i am personally a bit annoyed how abuse-able the self damage reduction is at times
but it could still use being a tad bit stronger

problem is that most approaches only go one of those ways

[stoic garden]

so what should we do? maybe reduce accuracy while jumping severely?

ngl this jumping shit only became a thing after embark swapped to gradual explosion falloff

[shell sonnet]

that doesnt impact the 1 area that annoys me, since shooting your feet minimizes the variation

if anything, it might actually make it better for that, since it reduces teh chances for it to randomly hit the enemy in your face, rather than the floor next to them, which reduces self damage

[shell sonnet]

i was/am kinda hoping for more reliable close range self damage
but that also makes accidents more costly again

hence i wanted to explore the reverse fall-off idea

[chilly stone]

M1 Garand skin for LH1?

[quasi rapids]

yto

[next axle]

15 shot m1 garand would be insanely cursed

[sudden pewter]

Feedback wild

[flint stone]

who's that cute little red role 🥰

[sudden pewter]

https://tenor.com/view/i-love-it-gif-18812641

DELETE WINCH! by now, everybody im running in to who is using a winch im gonna report. its overpowerd, its ruining the game and it demoralizes me to play. There is no other specialisation which makes you able to control somebody's movement so extreemly like winch does. Goo does it a littlebit, but you can still run away from that. Walking is the game is the way that makes you deside where to go, its the fundation of the freedom of the game and heavy is able to control that which is again, stupid, overpowerd and just a cheat, again, delete it, sorry winch lovers but this isnt fair, the game is pretty unbalanced when there is a heavy able to control the the thing which is crazy important. Also, make DEMAT like season 7 again, who's idea was it to change it, it was fine. Embark, you are making wrong choices ( im copy pasting as much as i can till you guys are gonna delete it)

[edgy sphinx]

Hello
i too have come to cry for attention because am angy etc
While i have lots of opinions and such, for now I would just want to see model 1887 have it's reload fixed, it's currently in such a terrible state as it stuffs you into a horribly long animation for it's tactical reload that you can't interrupt properly, which hurts someone in the habit of almost constantly reloading whenever possible.

[sudden pewter]

You can gadget swap to cut the reload animation short, I too would like its reload to be interruptible but Embark is currently hyper focused on the melee rework (supposedly)

[indigo nexus]

if the current reload cancelling was just easily predictable it would be ok

[sudden pewter]

I can see that

“Did he reload two shells or one”

[opaque shard]

I think winch is fine

[flint stone]

It's what someone posted in the feedback chat

[misty heart]

Rework taser is crazy 😭

Winch isn't bad except the pull-in otherwise just play against it..

[flint stone]

People have a hard time thinking when they play

[sudden pewter]

I died to it = It must be OP

[flint stone]

That's how half the game works

[next axle]

Truth nuke

[next axle]

Image saved

[potent thorn]

Just… Don’t go looking for the other previous photos. Serious.

[flint stone]

Hey I just posted that

[sudden pewter]

Nuh uh, read again

[flint stone]

It's longer but :(

[sudden pewter]

Ofc it’s longer 😤

Above Average Even

[misty heart]

It doesn't have infinite range just don't ape 😭

[languid lark]

Winch feels so much better after that accuracy update. I whiff my winches more often and actually have to aim at the model instead of in the general area.

[sudden pewter]

Flamethrow-inator

[hoary patio]

I disagree I have had winches go straight through people and not winch

[sudden pewter]

Latency is certainly a component

[cunning slate]

You think they'll give medium brass knuckles?

[sudden pewter]

No, I think the addition of any melee weapon in the near future is off the table until Embark does a group huddle and figure out how to handle melee weapons

Not at all against the idea though, just a lot on their plate already

[oblique crypt]

If anything I think a specialization is due, but they seem hard to balance

[sudden pewter]

Specializations definitely take the most work of any potential addition, they’re the equivalent of new characters.

[icy forge]

I hope that we will get a MGL buff/mini rework in S9, having something like 8 grenades and an alt fire like the Loose Canon from TF2 to not be destroyed in really close range would be cool

[sudden pewter]

The MGL is slated for rework but it’s low priority

Probably the same priority as the barricade

[feral pivot]

Ok new loadout for my heavy

Charge
Lewis
Rpg
Lockbolt
Cube

[feral pivot]

Experts please properly dissect this

[sudden pewter]

The cube is a very niche choice, any reason in particular you chose it?

[feral pivot]

Cashout also it's epik

[sudden pewter]

It’s handy to have in reserve for sure, but odd to have it in the main loadout

Why not use lockbolt instead? Offers similar utility & the ability to lock down groups

[oblique crypt]

I love anti gravity cube.

[sudden pewter]

Same, on Kyoto Suspended Structures it’s a must have

You can sit on the structures and when enemies use the launch pads to push, you can use the GC to keep them in the air and unable to move

[oblique crypt]

Good for stopping steals too.

[sudden pewter]

Potentially, not ideal

Stalling steals absolutely, stopping them? Not so much

[next axle]

I love gc stall

It’s so based and epic

But alas I am a meta slave so I must run dome c4 rpg

[sudden pewter]

If you have C4 I’d consider swapping RPG if there’s something else you’d like to bring

[next axle]

My honest reaction:

[sudden pewter]

Dome is quintessentially Heavy and I never leave the lobby without it so I understand that. But RPG (while a staple) is probably the best thing to swap if C4 is present

[next axle]

Not sure if I like c4 or rpg better

I only started using c4 recently tho I was a gravity cube enjoyer but got bored

[sudden pewter]

I swear by C4:

• Stall without LoS
• Shorter cooldown than RPG
• Instagib Lights

[next axle]

How much dmg does c4 do max?

[sudden pewter]

RPG is a 45s CD & C4 is 30s iirc

[sudden pewter]

C4 does 155 max

[next axle]

And you don’t have to reload c4

I can handle a long cool down but it’s the reload that fucks me 90% of the time

[sudden pewter]

You need to wait for it to arm, but if you’re retreating you can throw it ahead of you and by the time you’ve passed it, it’s armed and ready to remove any cocky lights chasing you from existence

I particularly like to put it on ceilings or doorways since Lights never look up

[next axle]

Basically just grenade but better

[sudden pewter]

I wouldn’t say it’s a better grenade but it can serve similarly with drawbacks

I’ve been using C4 offensively to much success as well

Won’t gib anyone but Light however that burst sets up kills nicely

[next axle]

I’d say c4 has way more util while filling a similar enough role to make grenades a bit undesirable for H

[sudden pewter]

Grenades in general are a very niche pick, C4 (aside from being unique to Heavy) has significantly more utility and use-cases

Not sure if Grenades getting the second charge back would bring them back into relevance but we’d definitely see them more often

[next axle]

Bring back 2 nades embark

[next axle]

They’d be harder to spam now since they have that bright light now

I understood the hate for grenade spam since they were hard to see but now that it simply isn’t the case anymore I would love to see 2 charges on grenades again

[sudden pewter]

The indicator is nice, doesn’t stop spammability though

[next axle]

Just move ezpz

[torn solstice]

g18 medium gun when

[icy forge]

Just use KS23 and you don't have to play around the suspended structures

[trim garnet]

yall remember when c4 and an explosive barrel was a nuke?

[next axle]

Fuck a g18 give us a g11

A g11 would go so insanely hard idc what class it goes on

[sudden pewter]

Not wrong! Definitely it’s most ideal scenario

[icy forge]

I often try to keep it in reserve just in case

[trim garnet]

bfr is just better than the ks23 no?

[sudden pewter]

Absolutely

[icy forge]

I used to main the ks, the bfr is better overall but, you can't destroy anything with it and the accuracy is worse

[sudden pewter]

KS23 has been getting buffed consistently but it still isn’t in the spot it was prior to S5 with the manual changes

If you want to get kills the BFR outperforms the KS no contest

[trim garnet]

what do you mean by you cant destroy anything with it?

[sudden pewter]

KS deals demolition damage, it can break walls and other structures with ease at range!

[trim garnet]

oooh I see.

[icy forge]

KS destroys every wall, ceilling, ect with 2 shots

[trim garnet]

Ive been maining the mgl lately, lots of fun.

[icy forge]

Same

[trim garnet]

good to know

[sudden pewter]

You should put that in #👂┇game-feedback

Would probably warm a devs heart to see it isn’t unanimously hated by the community at large beyond clip farmers

[torn solstice]

whats a g11

[next axle]

Experimental Cold War weapon

[torn solstice]

ehhhhhh g18 would fit more so every class has 2 handguns

i know what the g11 is i played black ops 1

[icy forge]

I don't hate it and I don't find it THAT niche, I mean, my two most played weapons are KS23 and Spear and I think they are playable so I don't know if my opinion is valid

[sudden pewter]

I make it a point to use everything (the only exception is the flamethrower)

MGL can be frustrating to use due to the second bounce detonation but beyond that it’s a fantastic weapon, I hope it’s soft rework arrives soon

[placid slate]

I've seen stuff like m2 detonating all grenades that are in flight which could patch up its reliance on CnS

[sudden pewter]

Not sure I like giving a ranged weapon an alt-fire (for the sake of setting a precedent) but I’m not against the idea

At least not until I think about it a bit more

[placid slate]

Kid named throwing knives:

[indigo nexus]

I don’t think an alt fire which weakens the weapon’s specialisation so heavily is a good idea.

[icy forge]

If Embark does that, beware of the demoman memes

[placid slate]

Stick traps aren't gonna suddenly appear

[indigo nexus]

I think that change would just turn the MGL into a better CL-40, and then it’d get nerfed.

[placid slate]

It doesn't though? It just patches up a weakness that limits it heavily

[indigo nexus]

It should always have that weakness. Allowing arbitrary detonation removes the downside of the bounce gimmick.

[placid slate]

It's manual detonation, only 1 grenade would realistically hit on target, and if the timing is off it won't do shit

[indigo nexus]

It makes the bounce optional

[placid slate]

Bounce is still yonne be king due to it being a faster way to kill

[icy forge]

The way it works now give you more creativity and skill expression than on the CL40

[placid slate]

You'd have to shoot then manually detonate each grenade, which would massively slow the ttk if you solely relied on it

[indigo nexus]

So the alt fire is supposed to be slow? That could work I guess

But I don’t like it weakening the weapon identity.

[placid slate]

Yeah, it detonates every grenade bro, and as you know, right now you generally have more than one on the field

So only 1 would realistically connect, the rest present would be harmless since they haven't traveled to the target yet

[indigo nexus]

At longer ranges, sure, but not in general

[placid slate]

So in order to not fuck your ammo economy, you would shoot 1, detonate, repeat, slowing it down

[placid slate]

I mean the change is supposed to fix its issues close up where you'd generally rely heavily on charge

It'd fall off in effectiveness heavily past like 8 to 10 metres

[indigo nexus]

Maybe 25m it would start to fall off.

[placid slate]

I'd say 15m, since that's around the distance it let's you shoot off another greande

[indigo nexus]

This is much too far, with how you’ve presented it currently. Even if it wasn’t for the RPM difference at range this would be a change biased towards closer range combat

[placid slate]

I mean yeah it's biased for cqc, that's kinda the issue with it rn

[indigo nexus]

You are making it biased^2

[placid slate]

Biased² if you will

[indigo nexus]

It should never be good in CQC, it should just be usable

[placid slate]

So no buffs to it then?

[indigo nexus]

If you consider it usable then yeah

personally I don’t think it really is, given you have to be in the right environment for it to be feasibly effective at very close ranges

[placid slate]

I mean you shoot the floor

[placid slate]

Anywhere that's not flat open terrain

[indigo nexus]

Unless you get pretty lucky you also need a low roof over your head, and even then it stops working usefully if they get super close

[placid slate]

I mean you seem highly against it being solid at super close

[indigo nexus]

yes, it shouldn’t be

it should be in an in-between state. Just a bit more reliable than it is now.

Still not something you would want to, er… “run and gun” with like you would with an SMG, I guess

I think that the self damage modifier could be reduced and that the hitbox could be more lenient to collisions with players, and that might be satisfactory

[static hinge]

i realise bro p90 is HORRIBLE at mid range. 0 damage

close range vs something like an AK, its a monster but 10+ meters its just buns

[frail stone]

really? i havent tried it that much yet

[static hinge]

its damage dropoff is horrendous and very close. begins at 10 meters

[stoic garden]

wasnt it 170?

[frail stone]

recoil is pretty nice though no?

[sudden pewter]

It’s literally the only exception (as I’ve pointed out before) and I personally don’t want more as it opens the doors to the idea of alt fires

[sudden pewter]

Perhaps? I’m going off the wiki & the knowledge that I’ve removed Lights from play with it

[placid slate]

God forbid embark adds nuance to some guns

[sudden pewter]

So true bestie 💅

[static hinge]

yes but AKM is easy to controll once u learn the pattern. legit annihilates the p90 at mid range. past 10 meters the p90 sucks. you WILL NOT win against a p90 close range hipfire tho.

[dense lily]

hi

[sudden pewter]

https://tenor.com/view/i-know-what-you-are-cat-sus-suspicious-cat-side-eye-cat-meme-gif-11842087146493734807

[dense lily]

what

[sudden pewter]

Putting hi in every channel ain’t slick. Keep spam in #⚡┇the-finals-chat
This is sacred ground

35 messages isn’t that big of an ask for basic functionality

[dense lily]

im trying to make a conversation

[sudden pewter]

In the channel with 6h slowmode?

[dense lily]

i didnt know it has slow mode of 6h

[sudden pewter]

https://tenor.com/view/dog-walk-away-weirdo-touch-gif-26494423

[muted condor]

We should beat him with crow bars

[dense lily]

not nice

[sudden pewter]

Spear launch him off Nozomi

[muted condor]

Double lock bolt him in gas cloud

[sudden pewter]

Put him in a goo tomb

[dense lily]

dont forget your flamethrower

[muted condor]

Triple winch him between 3 flamethrowers

[sudden pewter]

Give him the Light special

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1281411010846265374/1368840910577860628/IMG_4648.gif

[shut wraith]

Buff riot shield

[peak wind]

Which is better for BFR, iron sights or red dot

[glad spade]

Buff skill level

[sudden pewter]

I personally prefer the red dot, but it’s up to preference

[flint stone]

I wish KS was better

its such a fun gun to run around and make little holes

[sudden pewter]

Ye

[echo olive]

im currently in silver, i want to raise my elo but i dont know what the comp loadouts are. Can anyone help me out on this?

[sudden pewter]

In Silver anything can work, rather than fussing over your loadout Id focus more on gamesense, aim, and decision making

[flint stone]

decision making is the biggest thing for this game, so many people run around like bots bc they dont know how to play around cashouts

[sudden pewter]

Lots of lower ELO players treat QC like TDM and focus on killing rather than the objective

Also wise to consider if a fight is worth taking anyhow, if you’re already first and 3 or 4th place steal, it might be worthwhile to just let them and potentially grief second place or avoid wiping

[proven agate]

any tips on climbing ranked with mini gun? i manged to climb all the way to gold 1 but im hard stuck at gold 1 . Idk if its just a playsyle issue or there being much better guns to choose than the mini gun

[flint stone]

minigun needs your team to play around you bc you arent able to move as well as them to take or disengage from fights

[proven agate]

welp im solo queuing so do I just try and follow my team at all times? cause i understand positioning and plying a defensive playstyle are the where the mini gun shines

like lets say I manage to get someone or multiuple people low but they run away what should I do? its something I notice more often in gold 1

[misty heart]

I cant figure out my heavy loudout 😭. I wanna use c4, rpg, and dome but at the same time I want emitter and lockbolt /gravity cube

[flint stone]

its more your team has to play around how kinda slow you are, so ideally for what you said youd have your team to pressure for kills but honestly if youre solo queuing youd wanna prob swap off minigun xd

[proven agate]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/230118965077082123/1379716497638686720/image0.gif

mini gun so fun tho :c

[flint stone]

yeah its fun but w how fast the game kinda plays out you really need a team oriented around it

[proven agate]

well if thats the case any other weapon/loadout suggestions similar tot he heavy mini gun playstyle?

[flint stone]

I just run shak, it fux

[proven agate]

im seeing a lot of winch flame throwers in my gold 1 games but idk if its like not as good as mini gun

[flint stone]

M60 is good tho if you want a similar vibe of a shit ton of bullets

[proven agate]

ok thx

[sudden pewter]

Minigun is great but can only confirm kills when LoS is retained for long periods of time. Competent players will avoid this whenever possible, but you can treat suppression as a tool for your teamates to confirm kills (if they’re competent enough)

Minigun has to be respected and your opponents are forced to play around you, if your teamates do the same you’re set for success

Grapple Light with an ARN is fantastic for cleaning up wounded foes escaping the Miniguns wrath

[boreal laurel]

I actually have fair success solo-queuing with minigun, but it’s definitely not for the faint of heart. Very much a feast-or-famine type of thing. I usually just lock down specific areas with my suppressing fire and ALWAYS run emitter

[shell sonnet]

Hmmm, stupid idea

Tracking dart for heavy

Helps mgl
heavy can blow up walls they know enemies are behind to chase
Idk

[sudden pewter]

Why tho

That utility is already covered by Lights sonar grenade + tracking dart, with how impactful Heavies gadgets are, is the tracking dart even a viable option?

[flint stone]

mgl sux even w tracking dart

[shell sonnet]

Kinda cant make a light use it and coordinate for it
At least like this i could make sure its there when i need it

But i didnt call it a stupid idea for nothing

[sudden pewter]

What if Light had more scouting tools that benefit the team as well as the light

[shell sonnet]

Well, im open to ideas
Got anything?

[sudden pewter]

Suicide vest.

[past parcel]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1182329984723976283/1425219354319912981/ChargeNChargeNChargeNSA1216.gif

[shell sonnet]

There is the "display all gadgets in radius" but that would be both broken and useless

[shell sonnet]

No 🙂 👍

[sudden pewter]

Infidel

[shell sonnet]

We dont need no heat-seeking auto aim nuke

[sudden pewter]

At last, Lights will have a use. A glorious JiHaad!

[shell sonnet]

A wild heavy main trying to assert his dominace over light mains with a brutish display of force

[sudden pewter]

I was thinking about the staggering amount of war criminals with Nobel peace prizes, and it occurred to me that it’s strange Light doesn’t have access to mines. For a scouting class you’d think they have some avenue of trap

Maybe not the explosive mine, but perhaps gas or pyro?

They’re going ahead of their team and will likely enter the soon-to-be battlefield before anyone else, I wouldn’t want to give them any chip damage tools or anything that qualifies as defensive

[shell sonnet]

I think i would have shared gas mines with them
(And give them to heavy too while were at it)

Tho i do get the whole idea of light not having straight up defensive options, at least in this way

[shell sonnet]

But that very synergy might be too strong

[sudden pewter]

I’m trying to come up with a scouting tool that could fill a niche that light lacks, but doesn’t:

• Feel too defensive, that’s Heavy
• Feel like it would be at home on Medium

[shell sonnet]

I wonder, if we went far more strictly after class role, how would the game develop?

Like, imagine all heals on medium
Probably gateway too (since movement support)

All mines + destruction like breach go on heavy, etc.

[sudden pewter]

My immediate thought would be some sort of Sensor* mine? Perhaps to offer information to the team when trying to hold the OBJ

The issue being it’s often advantageous to abandon the immediate area of the OBJ in favor of taking Highground

[shell sonnet]

How would it be different from motion sensor

Or more like sonar mine, and it cant be deactivated without triggering it?

[sudden pewter]

Motion sensor is exclusive to the Heavy, and Heavies other gadgets are generally far more powerful.

Honestly I wouldn’t be entirely against moving the Motion Sensor to Light

It would certainly be more applicable to the archetype with freedom of movement than it would the slowest

[shell sonnet]

Wait, am i dense?

I couldve sworn its all-class/ M + H atm

[sudden pewter]

I might have to eat my shorts, I can’t recall

[shell sonnet]

Sensor is rather defensive tho, so i kinda like it on heavy

Covers the speed downside decently, since you get to prepare for attacks

[sudden pewter]

It is indeed on Medium & Heavy

Fuck it, give it to Lights. Make it a true universal gadget like the Goo Grenade

Would have more uptime than the Sonar Grenade at the cost of being more sensitive to positioning

[shell sonnet]

Might as well imo
It used to be on lights anyways

Ok, stupid idea

What if recon was just a proximity sensor that doesnt care about walls and indicates its range with an aps-esq aoe (so you can attempt to stay outside and avoid it)

I guess its pretty much the same?
Would likely suffer similar issues...

[sudden pewter]

Why not just wire-frame its radius? Visible to both teams

[shell sonnet]

Whats that?

[sudden pewter]

Like a Camera, anything in its vision when activated (namely geometry) will become a wireframe you can see through, and it would work both ways

Idk, the information would be to the benefit of both parties, but it’s up to the individual players to act on it

[shell sonnet]

Like demat? (Visually)

Im not sure if that would work in this game
Could get taxing

[sudden pewter]

A cleaner demat, I imagine it would just be a textureswap akin to damage textures

But I’m not a developer, not sure how realistically feasible it is

[proven agate]

so what ur saying is play within close range and dont take fights farther than that LOS is obstructed by either range or cover?

[sudden pewter]

Heavens no, you can chip at long range and reliably make a difference at medium range.

[shell sonnet]

Gonna try and mentally work on this
gonna take a while

[sudden pewter]

Hell, you can designate LoS by breaking walls with the Minigun (it does in fact deal demolition damage)

Minigun offers accuracy by volume

[shell sonnet]

Ok, stupid idea
And way too complex, but

What if recon was a set of 3 seperate ping generators
And combined, they form a cube between them?

Inside the cube, you are pinged
You can see the cube like the trigger lines from the removed tripwire and turrets vegas varient

Destroying any of the 3 generators disables it

Its skillful to use, because you want to maximise space, while making sure its still safe

The enemy knows beforehand, and can attempt to engage in a way that leaves them at an advantage
And being 3 seperate blocks helps assure there is at least a decenr chance 1 can be destroyed

[sudden pewter]

I didn’t make it past the second sentence.

[shell sonnet]

Were done for

[sudden pewter]

Keep it simple, we don’t need LoL levels of complexity.

[shell sonnet]

Just an idea

Is it really that bad tho?
It just the corners of a cube
Shouldnt be that bad, riiiight?