suggestion-discussion

[lucid root]

"Greetings mortals" is something I imagine you saying

[lusty wren]

Hidden information? Its in the first line of the games description on the front page of steam. You said "People that go to the Steam page are getting confused."

Now its hidden? 😄 if people are confused its not the devs fault

[wintry forge]

Why's it hard to agree they should show PvP in a trailer and screenshots?

This is a useless discussion. New topic.

[lusty wren]

Because its a silly proposition that people are being "confused" by the steam page as you suggested

[wintry forge]

They are getting confused.

[lusty wren]

Who are they? that cant read the first line of the description on the page they are looking at

[lucid root]

#d-and-d-suggestions message
You already can't see shit so I feel like this is kind of overkill

[smoky yoke]

the game isn't even out yet, there may be other trailers. lol

[lusty wren]

Creating trailers for absolutely no reason is silly

[smoky yoke]

devs may work first to the foundamental of the game, then they can polish up the trailers ect

[lusty wren]

I am sure closer to release or EA there will be another trailer

[wintry forge]

There's an obvious reason they should show PvP in a trailer and screenshots.

[lusty wren]

Until then read the description if you are interested in the game like a normal human

OH also, the handy PVP tag on the game in steam helps 😄

Or the battle royale tag

[smoky yoke]

because they are busy, they are working to the game to make it sure they deliver a nice game to you.

[lucid root]

The game is so hardcore they lure unsuspecting pve fans in for the slaughter

[smoky yoke]

then later, perhaps there can be more nice trailers, showing more content, pvp ect

[lusty wren]

Im so confused why this game tagged as pvp has pvp in it 😄

[smoky yoke]

bosses as well... maps ect

[wintry forge]

Proxys just being stubborn arguing that people don't need to see PvP in action, which makes no sense. I'm done arguing about this.

[lusty wren]

1m+ players at the last PT tells me they dont need to see pvp in the trailer 😄

[smoky yoke]

let's change to a new topic if you wish

[lusty wren]

I do agree though, silly conversation topic so best to move on

I like the idea of having some torches turned off

ATM you see a torch off and are immediately on guard

[smoky yoke]

apollo said that in HR there's by default it seems like

that

[lusty wren]

I didnt notice that in my experience

but its possible I guess

[smoky yoke]

me either, but better trust of a rank #1

[lusty wren]

If so would be a great change to push over to normals

[lusty wren]

Theyve been wrong before like casting time on chain lightning 😄 BUT so have I LOL

[smoky yoke]

i guess it does make sense that HR dungeons some torches are off by default

randomly

it would even make sense to turn them on lol

so enemies think the opposite but you are doing the mind of the mind trick

[lusty wren]

lol

[smoky yoke]

turning on torches so people think no one passed here

[lusty wren]

ya more mind games the better

[smoky yoke]

i discovered something cool about chain lightning, perhaps some cool strategy

[lusty wren]

Do share

[smoky yoke]

a barbarian with full magic resistance and the wizard hitting barb while he charges ahead to other real human players
and the range it is seems to be effective

because you hit your barbarian friend and then it can chain to enemies
🤔

[lusty wren]

Oh so using ur partner as a lightning rod?

[smoky yoke]

yes

[lusty wren]

That would be fun

[smoky yoke]

it is cool and seems like effective

[lusty wren]

I love it when teams build around fun things like that

[smoky yoke]

some troubadour are very pros

[lusty wren]

adds so much to the experience to be able to do

[smoky yoke]

yea

many tactics

[open ermine]

i did this by accident once

shot a skeleton, it chained to my friend, then chained to an enemy player for the kill

[smoky yoke]

lol

saw here btw

#dnd-content message

[open ermine]

i hope one of my buds runs barb like that cause that sounds like a legit fun strat actually

meatshield barb that suddenly shocks people

[smoky yoke]

yes

[open ermine]

that was great

[smoky yoke]

yes, true

the secret builds

[open ermine]

if there is one spell i would love to see added for mind game potential though for wizard

gotta add "Weird"

[smoky yoke]

[open ermine]

Makes targets within an area see illusionary creatures that attempt to kill them(all in their head)

[lucid root]

I still like my 'dissapearo!' Skill idea, the wizard just yells that and takes his clothes off

I'm going to have nightmares of wet feet slapping if I don't get to play soon

[opal sparrow]

Are you a walking censor bar after you dissapearo?

[lucid root]

I'll leave that up to your imagination

[fair copper]

Ayy we back!

[opal sparrow]

Add virtual gf ranger on valentines day 😩

[runic musk]

My guy go socialize outside

[opal sparrow]

You are something else if you think im serious lol

[runic musk]

Everything on the internet is dead serious you know

[wintry forge]

Can I customize my virtual gfs appearance?

[frosty creek]

Hi guys i put a lot of thought into this one why downvoted it ?

[upbeat pewter]

your suggestions are all bad.

[frosty creek]

why u say this...

[upbeat pewter]

because its true. im not trying to bm or anything, but i barely have to look now (but i still do, sadly)

seems liek you're extremely desperate for p2w and mechanics that only add annoyance.

this current one has no counterplay, and only really serves to annoy the player with non relevant debuffs.
really, the game has to stay in debuffs that are caused by something specific, and only effect the current fight to keep things away from frustration

[frosty creek]

ok i will think about it

what if debuff is from dying a run ? instead of winning ? and the debuff its from how u died
so u died in darkness = ptsd
or u died from mage fireball = anxiety if ur play with a mage or if u see a mage (so if u see a mage in game then u will move slower)
etc

[upbeat pewter]

but why? whats the point of them? how are they something thats fun to interact with?

it sounds mostly like a buff to mages, and extra downside to something thats already bad enough

[frosty creek]

its buff to every1 if u die to barb head shot axe then u will fear barb

[upbeat pewter]

but whats the point of it? why should it exist?

[frosty creek]

i think its realistic ? the character only get stronger with level up .. why not weaker also some times ?

[rocky oar]

Stop trying to add such big mechanics from other games into this game. Make a suggestion that builds upon what the game already has instead.

[upbeat pewter]

^

[rocky oar]

This goes to other people trying to add stuff from other games, it's not just you Darknesse.

[upbeat pewter]

it doesnt actually add anything valuable. its just realism for the sake of your realism. i doubt its even realistic in general.

huh? im not adding anything

[rocky oar]

Just like how people keep trying to make this EFT, go fucking- play EFT instead of trying to make another game into what u want

[upbeat pewter]

im explaining why the suggestion was bad

[frosty creek]

also devs said they will lower the gold from dungeon runs bc its too easy

so why dont add this system instead of lower gold ? still gold sink but realistic

[upbeat pewter]

the devs didnt say that. they said progression and loot was accelerated for the current tests.

so that people could experience all content in a week.

[frosty creek]

ok so why dont keep progression same speed but put this for slower it ?

[upbeat pewter]

because.. there are far better ways to do it than being annoying. highroller was a good gold sink, and there can be plenty of consumables that could add to that, or just things in general to buy from the store, and they could just tweak shop values to be lower.

right now we progress far faster than intended, in a system that hasnt been developed more than being functional

[smoky yoke]

Please be polite and please do not try to bypass banned words, thank you.

[opaque slate]

we cant swear?

[rocky oar]

Yea, kinda weird

[smoky yoke]

Profanity is fine by default, but using profanity to insult or otherwise attempt to hurt or get a rise out of an individual it is not tolerated, sorry.

[rocky oar]

I've always hated how it's seen as derogatory when it's not being used in a derogatory way

[opaque slate]

i mean they were just using it as an adjective

[rocky oar]

Also, profanity isn't allowed my default. My message is literally deleted instantly just for saying fucking-

Lol, fuck- gets insta deleted as well

[opaque slate]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[rocky oar]

I'm military and it becomes a norm to say fuck- every other sentence for me cause it's just how I talk but, it's not directed towards anyone and it's not used in a derogatory way

[shrewd dune]

this isnt the military... read the room and respect the Wardens decisions. not that hard.

you can get your point across without profanities. its not that hard to just stay on point.

[rocky oar]

Yea, you're right

[wintry forge]

PTSD involves anxiety. You could lump those two into one category. I like the thought of getting debuffed when encountering the last enemy type that killed you.

[wintry forge]

I'd also like some way to lose progression. This game is progression based, but when you're max level it feels more empty. I'd like to need to fight to keep my levels.

[real trellis]

Yet another user baited into a warden warning by the troll suggestions

But yes as Tenragen said try to avoid profanity, especially when dealing with a super dumb suggestion. There's a handful of people who love posting the most dogwater troll suggestions ever then they come around here hoping to bait someone into being rude to them so they can call a warden, so just don't risk it.

[coral solar]

yep.. make it back hardcore - lvl reset after death

[real trellis]

A special hard-core mode would be interesting... something you opt into, possibly with its own queue.

[rocky oar]

I feel like that only works in Diablo because you are fighting only AI but in DaD where there is PvP, you finna be resetting a lotttt

[real trellis]

I don't like the idea of putting hard-core players in the same lobbies as people playing normally because well... nobody is going to think twice about being a murder hobo in normal lobbies, but in hard-core you might weigh your risks

Yeah pvp and hard-core modes do not typically go well together

[karmic zenith]

or maybe while creating your character you can choose between normal or hardcore difficulty; which the latter will delete your character on death and make it so trading isn't allowed.

[real trellis]

I feel like it's too easy to die in this game for something like that to be worthwhile

haha oops two wizards and a ranger just saw you, better make a new character

[rocky oar]

lol

That's honestly really funny

[real trellis]

In other games that do hardcore modes like PoE, deaths are largely "on you" but any instance of other players being in the mix completely blows that out of the water

[karmic zenith]

Exactly, that would make it more extreme and fun, for the more veteran and hardcore players.

[rocky oar]

Especially if you happen to run into a cheater ranger shooting 20 arrows in 5 seconds.

[reef cosmos]

You guys think this game has potential for 3v3 pvp arena mode?

[rocky oar]

Ye

[reef cosmos]

out in the open or with some cover on the arena?

[rocky oar]

Cover

How fun would it be if you got shot by rangers without any counter-play

[jaunty rose]

Халоу

[smoky yoke]

here please #ru-общение

🙏

[frosty creek]

good idea ! i also want ppl to lose progression.. but maybe its too much for new player ?
maybe if a player extract 2 time on a char he become "veteran adventurer" then he will start lose level or maybe get injured when he lose a run

[lucid root]

Would be kind of cool if goblin mobs fight with undead if they get near each other

[carmine path]

wish there was a goblin mob

[lucid root]

Me too, like a goblin enemy faction

They build crude defenses like stick walls and spikes

Little camp spots where a group of 3 of them are sitting at a campfire

Then cave trolls just reck everything

Would add a nice ambience hearing some goblins garbling to each other

Chance of a merchant being held captive at a goblin camp, get to use his shop in the match if you help him

[restive rock]

Now that's a fancy idea, micro-ecology systems inside of dungeons.

[smoky yoke]

i approve that clerics should be able to use also some longswords

[restive rock]

[lucid root]

Holy water sprinkler

That's not a sword though, I just like that weapon

[smoky yoke]

cleric can even use iron helmet, and other metal plates so makes sense some sort of longsword

it could kinda fit

[surreal plover]

The probably only use bashing weapons as apart of their faith

[lucid root]

I kind of want to have a 1 day test where everyone can use any weapon

[surreal plover]

Be broken

[lucid root]

Oh I know

[quaint ivy]

i need a pvp practice duel arena bro!

[smoky yoke]

oh in the previous playtests usually I did some pvp as soon i started a match with my friends just to understand better, had no items so you don't really lose nothing

but i agree it needs some sort of training area perhaps

[quaint ivy]

what is it now, 16 days?

Soon ~~~~

[elder heart]

pls no ping system feels too arcade imo

[lucid root]

Ping system?

Oh I just read the suggestion

[surreal plover]

Agreed, it doesn’t fit the game we all love

[smoky yoke]

not sure what there is to ping about also in game 🤔

[surreal plover]

Items and enemy locations but this isnt a shooter nor an arcade like game

[smoky yoke]

it doesn't fit very much in fact, at least to my opinion

[lucid root]

Like have blips show up on the minimap?

[smoky yoke]

something i suggested before and had many positive thumbs up was like a social wheel associated with voicelines of characters
things like "come here!" or "thank you!" "wait"
but since devs they said they may implement Voip, i guess it's ok

it could be still useful for the people that may not use voip, or because they simply don't have a mic

so something like about gestures, but linked to voiceline samples
it could make the chars feel more alive imo

[lucid root]

Could make an immersive callout system instead of pings, like if you aim at a skele and press a key your character points it out and whispers something like "enemy ahead"

[opaque slate]

need more emotes ong

[smoky yoke]

also so far, when receiving damage we don't emit sounds of pain or some sort

[lucid root]

That's true, need more death screams

[opaque slate]

the gas coughing 🙂

[smoky yoke]

lol

[open ermine]

payday has that in a way, could look at enemies press f i think the default key was for your character to audibly warn teammates of a nearby patrol if in stealth or special units in loud missions, also marked them with a red silhouette outline

[lucid root]

I think just an audio cue would work

I just want to be able to say stuff like "there's a dirty rogue over there..."

[granite plinth]

No one plays cyberpunk here?

[smoky yoke]

I'd like to see an improvement for the walls in dark and darker, adding or improving the tessellation in the settings, that's something that makes the walls more realistic and natural

[lucid root]

Can probably do all that with udk blueprints

[smoky yoke]

I hope, because it could give more depth to the walls.

not sure if many people are aware about tessellation in games, but it make the walls and bricks look more realistic.

[lucid root]

Parallax mapping and stuff

[smoky yoke]

yes also

something worth to be suggested

[lucid root]

Add an experimental settings tab for all that

Where we can enable all the crazy effects

This game would be terrifying in vr

But very immersive, especially as a rogue sneaking around in the shadows

[lusty escarp]

i'd agree with this if it was a perk.
call it "Templar" or something, gives access to longswords/arming swords and plate helmets perhaps?

[smoky yoke]

technically cleric in dungeons and dragons have a subclass called templar and warpriest apparently
this for the 4th edition

so yea, it could really make sense some templar class as subclass for the cleric, if they plan to do subclasses

but they said also they want to do their own unique classes in future, because is dark and darker after all
and it's fair

[mossy ruin]

It is VERY reasonable they do subclasses, separating playstyle by having specializations like that is absolutely awesome. It might not be blatant 'subclass' but to let us 'spec' into different things to be unique is very fun imo.

[lucid root]

They should do odd one-off events like one where anyone can use any class skill

I think it'd give some insight into what works, what's completely broken, etc

[mossy ruin]

Maybe end wipe silliness, but idgaf personally

[open ermine]

i could see that as like a gag april fools thing

[opaque slate]

wizard barb 👀 or rogue barb

[open ermine]

depending on how the multiclass function goes you might see that anyways

[smoky yoke]

yes

[neon meadow]

Multi classing is pretty OP, would probably be busted af

Ambush + felling axe

[lucid root]

and somehow a wizard purist would still beat everyone

[wintry forge]

The devs will balance it. People keep talking about class balance now, which doesn't matter since the game isn't finished.

[neon meadow]

I mean is multi classing even a things the dev's have mentioned?

[lusty wren]

Agreed, I hope they do not go this route or at least use a very gentle hand with it

[open ermine]

"Q: Will we ever be able to upgrade characters past level 20?
A: There are a few plans for this. All I can say currently is we are interested in multi class, but we are going to approach it with caution. "

[lusty wren]

@wintry forge Do you think this really needs an entire new "mode"? Id say just the option and then still be queued with everyone else would work much better

[wintry forge]

https://discordapp.com/channels/988365908009447485/1057013969279266937/1057041419157639209 sdf said he's interested in multiclass.

[wintry forge]

Either or.

[mossy ruin]

seems like itll be small reasonable side classy things, like get a portion of specialization rather than class merge

[lucid root]

it'll be like WoW, every new season the level cap goes up lol

[lusty wren]

I think if it splits the playerbase I do not like it, if it does not I do like it 😄

[open ermine]

until it goes down

[wintry forge]

HR is already splitting the playerbase. It's just a suggested mode. Ironmace can work out the further details if they like it.

[lusty wren]

Yes, just because they do it once does not mean they should continue to split the playerbase. Keep splitting it and queue times will suck

[open ermine]

it'll probably be based on the D&D model if i had to guess so yeah, you have your lvl20 w/e and you can either take a prestige point to put in the talent tree to empower your core class, or take a level into another class

[wintry forge]

But any of the current game modes can also be changed.

[wintry forge]

Could just be added to HR?

[lusty wren]

Ya id like to see it be within the same queues we have now personally

[lucid root]

here's a stupid idea, another game mode thats exactly the same as what we have now, except you start on the bottom floor and make your way back up to the forest 😂

[pliant halo]

Stupid it is

[wintry forge]

And all of the monsters have already been killed.

[lucid root]

you're just running into people trying to make their way down

the only loot you find is what people didn't want from the dead bodies

could you imagine the difficulty spike if there were no extract portals and you just had to go to hell then make your way back up manually

and everyone you run into while going back up are players trying to go down

that would take so much time, an hour per match?

[wintry forge]

Well I can't adjust my suggestion for another 5.5 hours, so whatever. The devs said they read the suggestions, so they could just decide to add that to HR even if the suggestion is down voted.

[lucid root]

#d-and-d-suggestions message
i was going to say let the devs hold a thing for fan-made trailers but theres no modding kit lol

i don't think any kind of trailer would do it justice though

its really about the feel once you're in the game

maybe just some stylized in game footage or something

dramatized/stylized idk

#d-and-d-suggestions message
soul merchant was already suggested, i like the idea

soul collector rather, sounds better

[shadow scaffold]

very nice suggestion all around

👍

[lucid root]

poe collector from ocarina of time o_o

#d-and-d-suggestions message
Magical?

[rocky oar]

He probably means particle effects on magic spells I think

[lucid root]

I think those are fine already idk

[rocky oar]

He's asking to have it in for those that wanna change it because of FPS issues

Particle effects in most games tend to destroy FPS hard

I was fine but, not everyone has a top spec PC ya know

[lucid root]

Oh I thought he wanted more particle effects

[rocky oar]

I don't think so.

[lucid root]

But an option to disable any particular effect is always nice

[rocky oar]

If he does however, he wasn't specific enough

[lucid root]

Except for things that make it easier to see through the dark

I'm for low spec settings, but keep shadows locked down so you don't have an unfair advantage

[rocky oar]

Shadows has the same issues all games has

Shadows takes more FPS than particle effects

[lucid root]

Unfortunately

[lusty wren]

I honestly believe the PVP feels much better than it looks. I wonder if this is part of the reason to not show any in the trailers

[open ermine]

i still think the reasoning is they made the trailer really early and just didn't have any kind of pvp footage, and now they're just in super dev time mode so there's not much wiggle room to update it yet

[lusty wren]

That is possible also ya, I personally do not see the need for a new trailer yet. Though I do think a early access release trailer would be nice

[open ermine]

definitely not yet but sometime during EA towards launch an updated trailer would be good

[mossy ruin]

the game had insane media coverage, i think they can chill on adverts

Im sure the way the zone is and that it feels BR-y is a placeholder mechanic for now and will be fleshed out later. Atm it forces us into each other and gives a nice general area to find blue portals, the whole system works together but is likely not final.

I mean, in terms of content within the map, there are some very interesting locations that are in the swarm at first circle half the time, I consider this unlikely to be favorable for map design since an interesting part of map isnt explorable often.

[granite plinth]

guys my suggestion will improve game 100%
#d-and-d-suggestions message

[wintry forge]

@serene glade I think the portals and swarm are gimmicks. It feels like the devs are building the lore around gameplay mechanics instead of building the gameplay mechanics around the lore. I hope they change direction.
#d-and-d-suggestions message

[mossy ruin]

I mostly agree ^

[wintry forge]

PvE doesn't look good either.

[serene glade]

That's what I think as well.

[lusty wren]

Which is why they are such small clips of the kill and not the entire mob fight

[white cliff]

Define gimmick.

[wintry forge]

Are you referring to streamers?

[lusty wren]

We should probably use THE definition 😄
"a trick or device intended to attract attention, publicity, or business."

[white cliff]

Therefore I don’t feel like they’re gimmicks.

[lusty wren]

Neither do I

[white cliff]

They’re just mechanics.

The game deserves it’s fair criticism don’t get me wrong.

That analysis just seems misplaced.

[white cliff]

Streamers, gaming website coverage, 100k peak players topping steam charts, ect.

It has really good exposure.

[lusty wren]

1m+ unique players

😄

ya I agree got lots of great exposure

[wintry forge]

They're building lore around gameplay instead of gameplay around lore. I wish they'd write their lore first and then make gameplay decisions that fit the lore.

[white cliff]

Can you give me an example?

[lusty wren]

Where do you get this idea? How much lore have we seen that shows this?

[white cliff]

You’ve just redefined your first statement.

With different verbiage.

I don’t really get what you mean about lore either?

[mossy ruin]

Yes

[white cliff]

If anything it’s meant to be a game they want to play first, and that doesn’t exist.

[open ermine]

only lore i remember off the top of my head is from the tutorial book thing that said the swarm is some curse trying to eat your soul

[white cliff]

It’s based off fantasy tropes; 3e specifically sure.

[lusty wren]

Not just streamers either, every gaming news place put out multiple articles on the game

[white cliff]

But other than that I’m not sure what you’re alluding to.

[mossy ruin]

They are building the game with inspired ideas THAT fit their vision.

[boreal sun]

I think they explained it pretty clearly already
something like the dark swarm doesn't feel like it came naturally, more that it was created as an excuse to have a closing ring like a battle royale

[wintry forge]

How do portals fit the traditional fantasy dungeon crawler theme?

[runic musk]

Someone suggested changeing the swarm, i think doing something different than the fortnite circle on different maps would do wonders

[boreal sun]

which, this happens in many games
you could call it a gameplay contrivance, but at the end of the day games are nothing without their gameplay

[lusty wren]

Why do people think Fortnite created br 😄

[runic musk]

No its just funny to say

[rocky oar]

Gameplay 1st, Lore 2nd.

[mossy ruin]

Yeah, a lot of games use it to force gameplay b3cause its easier and its a familair concept nowadays, reasonable placeholder, of which it does feel like one.

[lusty wren]

Portals are pretty fantastical 😄 Id assume its easier than creating actual stairways down.

[mossy ruin]

Because no one played the original fortnite

[runic musk]

Would be nice to have the swarm moving you left to right cross a swamp and as you enter the dungeon it moves towards a centerpoint

Becasue just the circle seems kinda shitty imo

[boreal sun]

I mean it can be done well
you could say that the entire reason Dante from devil may cry is a stylish, confident guy who taunts his opponents is because the designers of the game wanted gameplay that rewarded you for being stylish and taunting your opponents

it's not a bad thing to base your lore on the gameplay you want to make

[mossy ruin]

Its fine that its shitty, its clearly not permanent

[boreal sun]

really it just depends on how well they do in hiding the contrived nature of it all

[runic musk]

If they can make different styles for differenr maps itd be great

Ik its early development but would hate to see it keep going with the circle for all future

[mossy ruin]

Lore first isnt relevant here anyways, its not a game with lore intrigue, its about fantasy style combat gank pvp

[faint dirge]

nobody does care about lol

[mossy ruin]

and full loot

[faint dirge]

only few roleplayers

[lusty wren]

I dunno having some added lore snippets would be nice and im not a RPer 😄 But Def does not need to be done first. Gameplay is vastly more important

[mossy ruin]

Id like it down the road, but yeah, its tertiary at best to the games core

[boreal sun]

the game's attracted a pretty big and passionate audience without a huge focus on lore

[smoky yoke]

Also the devs said they don't want aim for a battle royale

[boreal sun]

but that's what the game basically is

at least, as of now

[mossy ruin]

The audience was attracted BY gameplay surely, so im sure itll continue to keep them attracted

[lusty wren]

BR only one team lives

Extraction whoever extracts lives

Not a br

[smoky yoke]

sdf's answer:

Battle royale is not the direction we are aiming for. Circles are just tools.

you can all check sdf message

[wintry forge]

What are they aiming for, and are they set on keeping the portals?

[rocky oar]

Bruh, it's not a BR anyway even with the circle in the game

[smoky yoke]

it is available for everyone

[mossy ruin]

If they remove the SWARM the game still works, the swarm is just a good way to make it flow until they flesh out the real mechanics

[runic musk]

Its still kinda plays like one

Even though you can extract

[lusty wren]

Extraction game just naturally has some feel of a BR but they are substantially different

[smoky yoke]

refrain from pinging sdf, of course, just as friendly reminder.
in case you would like to check the original message in the search bar

[runic musk]

Dont agree, its closer to a survival game like day z

[boreal sun]

it's still a big free-for-all with a restricted playspace that gets smaller over time
maybe that'll change once they flesh out whatever their true vision is, if the circle is just a 'tool' then that means it's likely a placeholder for something different that'll come later

[runic musk]

Since you arent forced together to fight but there are hotspots for action

[smoky yoke]

anyway things can always change

[wintry forge]

If everyone doesn't have a chance to get out alive it's more BR than extraction.

[lusty wren]

WHAT?! So you think its closer to a open world survival game with no extracting?

[smoky yoke]

i kinda do agree as well, the game doesn't feel a BR.

[runic musk]

Well most survival games you have bases you return too

[runic musk]

Parts of it do

Would like to see different swarm behaviours to make it feel a bit less like one

[lusty wren]

Yes, I am a huge survival fan, and DaD felt nothing like it from my experience.

[rocky oar]

I think the circle should stay to be honest anyway

[runic musk]

Was talking about the exshooter genre

[lusty wren]

I hated the circle at first, but its grown upon me. The game is so vastly different than BR's though it just feels nothing like one to me. Yeah you have one common mechanic but meh just didnt feel very BR to me

[agile condor]

To me the style of the game/format is most closely related to Hunt Showdown

[lusty wren]

Id agree with this

With a bit of a tarkov mix (the looting)

[agile condor]

Yeah

man I wish Hunt had some looting/item tiers XD

[lusty wren]

Yeah, I felt looting was very much so missing from hunt

[agile condor]

Progression in general for hunt feels lacking

[rocky oar]

lol just like how people keep saying it's "another EFT game" all because it has looter shooter in it

[lusty wren]

Ya, I think a game can have elements from others and feel VASTLY different. Very little does this game feel like tarkov

It feels very unique to itself

[agile condor]

I also grew to appreciate the circle to keep the pace of the game up

[rocky oar]

There is no game like EFT at all.

[lusty wren]

Marauders is pretty dang close

[smoky yoke]

and dark and darker will be more unique the more they will add missing features as they hinted multiple times officially

[lusty wren]

I call it a casuals EFT in space 😄

[smoky yoke]

it is just an alpha for now, so there will be many things more

[runic musk]

Ofc, alot of time to test things out

Anyways my point was would be nice to differentiante swarm on floors

[rocky oar]

I hate this take cause EFT is known for it's realism and hardcore aspect, not because it's a looter shooter

[spice pawn]

steal from BioShock and add Big Daddy's to one of the map sets

[lusty wren]

I do get that. The feel of the game is just closer to EFT but ya it lacks alot of the realism that is very prevalent in EFT its a good point

[smoky yoke]

could be cool, it was something i was thinking as well

[rocky oar]

I forget what the new CoD looter shooter is called but, I hated how people literally kept trying to compare that to EFT and it went and showed how people obviously don't play EFT at all.

[smoky yoke]

either visually or mechanically at least 🤔

[runic musk]

Exactly

[lusty wren]

DMZ ya I hated people comparing them to because DMZ feels so lacking comparatively

[smoky yoke]

just to make things fun and fitting with each floor

[runic musk]

Would feel alot cooler to get into another zone with new obstacles

[lusty wren]

Ya, I think they could do a lot of unique stuff with the zone to make it feel different

[wintry forge]

But what about the portals? Everyone here love them?

[lusty wren]

I am indifferent to them

If they implemented something else I am fine with it. If it stays I am fine with it

[open ermine]

not much of an opinion on them really, they serve their purpose

[rocky oar]

I like them a lot

[lusty wren]

Portals though do not seem like they are "out of place"

[open ermine]

i do like that it's not an activate and you leave, but it opens a portal that anyone could use though

[rocky oar]

It's no different than CoD using a heli to extract or EFT going to a location to extract

[lusty wren]

Yes I love some of the implications of it. Having portals stolen, having to interact with something to leave etc

[wintry forge]

Just seems like an easy and cliche choice for exiting the map (like also in VT2).

[lusty wren]

Now that I think about it though. I think I do infact love the portals 😄 Portal stealing, opening portals and finding others for ur friend then hoping its still there when you come back. I dont know how you replace these things without them

They create some of the funnest situations in the game. Getting portal stolen and being forced down into hell in unsatisfactory conditions.

Everyone gets hyped when they steal a portal

[quaint ivy]

Yeah I love the portal stealing

It's pretty good, and I also like the paid tri portals for high roller lol

[slate tartan]

It's kinda the opposite, no fixed location, not really campable like those 2 games and an unspecified amount of extracts, it plays well, especially for solo's

[rocky oar]

In a way it is fixed though, they always show up in the last 1-2 circles which are relatively small circles still and people always end up showing up at end and either they leave right away or camp the portals for someone to show up which they do almost every single time

@slate tartan

[slate tartan]

No one knows the exact location of said portals though, there are earlier portals than that too. No one goes into the dungeon with the intention to extract camp as it requires rng, whereas that's basically what half the player base does in those two games. Vastly different

[pseudo wing]

my 3 man has gone to the middle and protected the central portals a decent amount. it's a good way to find pvp

[rocky oar]

I don't think you played enough. The portals that show up earlier are always single portals and are never enough for 3 mans. The portals that show up in groups enough for 3 mans are in the last 2 circles. The last 2 circles are small enough for people to out right camp them which I've seen a lot my guy

[slate tartan]

120hrs in the last playtest was enough for me

[rocky oar]

Then idk what your doing because that's all I saw was people camping last 2 circles

[slate tartan]

I don't play squad, just solo, see how different the extracts are from eft/dmz?? I ran into into rarely, accepted the loss or fought and got out, it's nowhere near the same as either of those games you mentioned but we can agree to disagree

[rocky oar]

Lol

"Solo" is all needed.

[pseudo wing]

it is much easier to extract away from center as a solo of course. I actually felt like playing as a duo was hardest way to play assuming u both stay til u have 2 portals next to eachother

[rocky oar]

Solo is always gonna be easier to extract cause you don't need to wait for more portals for your teammates and you could even extract a lot earlier with earlier circles

[lusty wren]

Some of those portals were way to early tho

[rocky oar]

Solo is just very different since you can extract extremely early into the game.

[lusty wren]

I remember seeing em at like the 7-8 minute(remaining) mark and I think that is to early with how short the raids are

[rocky oar]

With groups however it is just like EFT or CoD where you will more than likely run into other people trying to extract and fight and/or deal with campers

[pseudo wing]

they made less portals initially last test and ppl complained A LOT and they gave in and added more. i thought less was better tbh

[rocky oar]

What you mean?

2nd Alpha had triple portals and 3rd alpha had single portals

[lusty wren]

"camper" is a hard term for me in this game. Like we always tried to be near center as early as possible to ensure we didnt get left with not enough portals. But we always were looting and such in those areas, didnt run into many teams "camping" a single room or something. Was few and far between in my experience

[rocky oar]

It was wild for me

[lusty wren]

Second half of PT had more portal spawns than the first half

[rocky oar]

The moment it came down to last 2 circles people would sit at portals to kill others

[lusty wren]

Ya, I didnt see that alot, but maybe it was cus we always tried to be center as early as possible So maybe we fought them before they could lol

[long dawn]

The loot was too good in HR even when I went in with pvp rat plays in mind I still just found myself knee deep in a chest looking for legendarys

[rocky oar]

This convo been had a dozen times. TLDR: Devs already said loot will be nerfed.

[vague barn]

Thoughts on Monk class?

That would be fun

[wintry forge]

Keep the swarm but have the portals spawn in random locations including inside the swarm. That will reduce camping in the center of the map, and people can risk going into the swarm to find a portal. What do you think?

[lusty wren]

THis happens

[rocky oar]

Btw, I don't think camping is much of an issue compared to CoD and EFT. You can hear people in other rooms much better in this game and you won't just get straight one tapped without being able to reposition unless they are legit already on you before you even know it.

[open ermine]

coming at some point

[opaque shore]

There is something about it in #dev-qna-archives and It will be a fist fighting class! Can't wait to see some martial arts killing rogues 😭

[rocky oar]

Another class for me to fireball

[open ermine]

"Q: What about druids, monks, or a necromancer?
A: We want to have them. We want druids to be able to turn into animals. If we add monks, we will have to think about how we punch and kick in the FPP view. As for Necromancer, I don’t know if that’s what the name will be, but there must be something like that. It’s fun. " it's an if but still within their scope i'd say

[opaque shore]

Yup. It's so nice, I hope it makes it in-game, I love martial arts.

[open ermine]

i imagine they just want all the base classes from D&D to available, cause sdf did tease way back in the discord a list of all the classes they wanted which seemed to just be all the core stuff

[rocky oar]

They are basing of 3e or 5e?

[pliant halo]

They are basing on FPS

[rocky oar]

FPS?

[rose lantern]

3e from what i've heard

[open ermine]

yeah i've seen 3e/3.5e thrown around more but i can't see a blue post about it specifically

[lusty wren]

Ive heard alot of both, but no one ever has a source 😄

[rocky oar]

I know right

I just assume 5e

Since that's the current one

[lusty wren]

Between the interviews and the QA Id think theyd mention it if it was specific

I think people are just talking out their ass

[rocky oar]

I'm assuming 5e straight up based of the spells in the game and the name of some of the abilities

Mind you, I don't know anything about 3E btw xD

[lusty wren]

Ya, I do not know enough about DnD to tell 😄 But because they have not specified from what ive seen, id guess its just a general inspiration from DnD and that they would do possibly even a mixture

[rocky oar]

I've played 5e a lot

[open ermine]

i'll take it as 5e if we see warlock pop up since that is base it seems in 5e

[rocky oar]

Yup

[lusty wren]

Ya, everything we have now is also in 3e correct?

[rocky oar]

Classed I think

But idk about the spells

But all the current classes is in 5e as well

And they did say ranger will have spells in the future which is what 5e has

[opaque shore]

Hey chat 👋

[lusty wren]

3E does also have ranger spells (someone pointed this out to me the other day)

[rocky oar]

Ah ok

[open ermine]

yeah they did

[rocky oar]

I would have to research

[open ermine]

is icebolt a 5e spell?

[rocky oar]

ye

[open ermine]

cause i don't...remember that being a spell in 3.5?

i might be misremembering or it could be in a side book

[lusty wren]

Google says 5e

Oh wait nvm

3.5r ice mage has ice bolt

says google

I dunno

😄

[rocky oar]

JK

5e doesn't have Ice bolt but they have Ice Knife

Oh btw

Who knows if they are taking homebrew into the game lmao

[lusty wren]

TRUE! 😄

[rocky oar]

Cause Ice Bolt as a homebrew spell in 5e does exist

[lusty wren]

Depends on their experiences with DnD id say

[open ermine]

they could be doing some copyright free spell versions yeah

[rocky oar]

Most people who play DnD play homebrew

Almost all spells in dnd is copyright free

and has been proven already

[open ermine]

ment that more as a joke like Great value™/dollar store brand spells

but yeah homebrew is extremely popular so maybe they just took some inspiration for their own stuff

[rocky oar]

Time to watch anime with wife. Talk to ya later about this

[smoky yoke]

have fun

[lucid root]

living the dream

[wintry forge]

"The Long Dark and Darker". Anyone here like The Long Dark?

[lusty wren]

Yes its a good game

[vague barn]

I KNOW IM LATE TO SEEING THIS BUT YES YES YES YES 💯

IM #1 MONK FIST FIGHT LOVER

THIS IS INCREDIBLE NEWS

[iron flame]

just remeberd rouges got smoke bomb

shuld thay make it toxic

:/

[wintry forge]

Should make it blur your vision (if you go inside it) for a few seconds after you come out.

[iron flame]

i only tried it one time and it feels super weak

xD

so ya any buff is probably a good thing

[wintry forge]

It never helped me at all.

[iron flame]

y

[wintry forge]

It never seemed to affect other players.

It'd be cool if Rogue could see in the smoke cloud but other classes can't, and it blurs their vision for a few seconds after they come out of the smoke.

[lusty wren]

You just drop way to much power to pick up smoke bomb IMO

and its underwhelming

But even if it was good, Id not want to drop something for it

[wintry forge]

Smoke bomb is meant for Rogue builds that are thieves and not fighters. Ironmace wants to give players that option, but right now the skills and perks that would allow Rogue to avoid combat are too weak.

[tender magnet]

Agreed

I personally would LOVE to be a thief

if it was somewhat viable

[visual goblet]

I really want more invisibility mobility on rogue, smokescreen needs to be reworked entirely imo

Like how can the wizard use invisible + haste + ignite dagger while the rogue just walks 10 steps stealth bugs me

[tender magnet]

Yeah, there needs to be some change

but it will come

[agile condor]

@rapid terrace kinda what I was thinking as well #d-and-d-suggestions message

[lucid root]

I'm wondering if they're going to have a dedicated healer class

No offensive abilities, can't use weapons, maybe some shit ones

Like staffs or something

Priest: can only wear robes/frocks can only wield staves and wands

The wand would just amplify the heals, staff is for terrible support dps

The more I think about the less I like it though

It would make teams too strong, forcing you to kill priests first

[quaint ivy]

i like their idea of support so far, i would hate to see Cleric / Priest metas evolve lol

I think Cleric / Bard will be perfect for Support

[lusty wren]

I think cleric is as close to a full healer id want

[lucid root]

Thats the thing, I think Priest would make cleric obsolete, allowing you to go with 2 bursties and 1 Priest

[quaint ivy]

= if there was a priest with better heals for sure

[lucid root]

Kind of a downside to the holy trinity, it's too strong

Makes class design boring

[quaint ivy]

i dont mind the trinity, with how they are going about it so far, i do think armor needs to provide a little more survival though, cause at the cost of all that move speed

they die pretty fast...

[tender magnet]

Idk, I've seen some videos of high armor peeps taking poke damage from some nice shots

Maybe a easier curve of low armor doing more

[quaint ivy]

Full plate set still was getting 2-3 shot by barbs and rogues lol

but yeah depends i guess

[lusty wren]

Defensive gear needs to scale better

[quaint ivy]

yeah the higher tier stuff for sure

Spear was overshadowing almost all the other melee weapons lol

and made armor obsolete

the longsword was dope though

[lucid root]

As long as it isn't scaling for magic defense

[quaint ivy]

lmao, as a mage i agree.

[lucid root]

If I'm not one shotting with fireballs something ain't right

[quaint ivy]

if im not one shotting full teams, something ain't right boy

[lucid root]

You're God damn right

[wintry forge]

Are you guys suggesting there should be a bigger difference in scaling between armor qualities? Imo it's too much already.

[tender magnet]

I'm suggesting a better low side

A lot of this armor I'm taking off for speed anyway

[lucid root]

At the start anyway

[lusty wren]

Low side is absolutely fine

that shit does not scale nearly as hard as weapons

It needs a bit of a tune up

high end armor vs high end weapon is like wearing paper

[open ermine]

yeah i think the deminishing returns on armor needs to be raised

[lusty wren]

white armor vs white weapons is in a great spot

Just needs a tune up as you go up the chain

[tender magnet]

Yeah diminishing returns on + damage stats too

shit gets whacky fast

[lusty wren]

well if you reduce weapons you dont have to tune up armor as much also

[tender magnet]

Agreed

[winged venture]

i feel like the weapon dmg from last playtest was better

[pseudo wing]

it's hard to do though because you don't want someone in legendary armor taking 10 hits from someone with a green wep either. (or at least I don't want that =))

[tender magnet]

Those people asking for ptw do

[lusty wren]

This is why a mixed approach is probably best, tone down weapon scaling and give a small boost to defensive scaling

[pseudo wing]

ya I do agree ttk is a little fast in top end gear on avg. tho it depends on class. Like if barb has to be slow and slow himself even more when he swings he probably should 1 shot.

[winged venture]

i can say the rogue did a little too much DMG

[strange sable]

[verbal marsh]

I think 2h just needs a lunge, shouldn't be getting swing penalty w/o appropriate reach.

[quaint ivy]

I think we are all in agreement then, Buff Wizard, give them an ability to conjure blue portals, and nerf all magic resist by 400%

lol, cant wait for this game to drop!

[frosty creek]

hi all i made suggest this one its easy for dev to put
and its fun

what do u think

[wintry forge]

@tender magnet Your wording is confusing to me. Are you just saying the pits shouldn't stack?
#d-and-d-suggestions message

[tender magnet]

Multiple health pots shouldn't stack, Or they should all stack

no matter rarity

@wintry forge

[eager sable]

This command has been disabled on this server

[rancid pebble]

https://discordapp.com/channels/988365908009447485/1048759403819577486/1066224886521012315

This seems out of touch, arent the clerics already pretty much the most versatile class?

Ive seen so many amounts of different cleric builds compared to falchion/arming sword and shield, or bow users, or spears

[rocky oar]

The issue with cleric is that their buffs and heals are so damn important and good that most really good groups have their cleric dedicated to just that unless they are absolutely forced to take their weapon out in a PvP fight

[rancid pebble]

true, but I feel like those are different scenarious

3v3/ PvP groups need heals, but clerics can still play dps in less try hard scenarious

same ways you dont have a ranger go rapier, it just doesnt make sense for PvP

Idk, im a little drunk and this suggestion made me visually angry

[rocky oar]

I'm just saying. That's what my clerics are dedicated to doing anyway cause body blocking happens so much and it's less likely to happen with having one person stand back and just heal. Btw, the other scenario I would imagine Cleric taking out their weapon is if your teammate starts kiting back and the enemy chases them they can just bonk them cause the more than likely the Cleric is just full health which was the case for my group 9/10 times.

[rancid pebble]

I can't imagine how this suggestion would change and make him 'more' versatile thoough without sinmply nerfing his heals

[rocky oar]

That's just another scenario but more than likely they will just keep healing unless they are literally out of heals

[rancid pebble]

which like If he just said nerf heals I probably would hav been fine because they are op in some scenarios where teams have a cleric vs those that dont

we have said scenarios too many times

im going to sleep, cleric will have to wait

[rocky oar]

lol

[granite plinth]

Guys we need cyberpunk update

I watched the anime it was soo cool

[frosty creek]

Hi

i want a feedback on my suggest ? why its downvoted ?

[rocky oar]

To be honest with u, I think some people just down vote just to do it

I actually think it's a cool idea. I would personally change it though. It shouldn't be when you first enter a match because some people will just leave and re-enter matches to try to your curse match. I would make it so that a down portal will take you to the curse floor instead making people actually play the match as normal and making it a risk on whether the next floor is normal or cursed.

[neat dragon]

I like the idea of rare random effect dungeons, I think they should be more interesting than "more or less portals" though

[rocky oar]

Yea, I think that should change too

Overall, it's a neat idea

[neat dragon]

every chest is a mimic, but they have double loot or something

triple enemies, but they're all spiders

[rocky oar]

Um

no

lmao

[neat dragon]

ok, archers

[rocky oar]

I'm more okay with that

Spiders are horrible

[neat dragon]

they're supposed to be horrible, they're spiders

[rocky oar]

The amount of body blocking they do is insane

[verbal marsh]

I think down portal should be a variance of continued matches, and extended difficulty

Say, only one team goes in down portal, they basically start a new match on cryptv3 with the next lobby, but when they have multiple going down to next lv, then you get the basement 3 challenge.

[lusty silo]

Because you forgot schizophrenia

[verbal marsh]

I would just give a bonus to loot find or something to the party repeatedly matching.

[cosmic thistle]

You must not have enjoyed the spider nest room in b3 inferno level.

[verbal marsh]

That way having the bonus, and going down to basement three would be ideal.

[rocky oar]

Brooooo, I've spawned their so many times I've learned how to deal with them as fast as possible before they got out of control

[lusty silo]

They should add a rat vase, faster and smaller then spiders and they give you the plague

While we’re at it spiders should poison you

[rocky oar]

🙅‍♂️

[cosmic thistle]

In the b1 layer there might be animals since its above ground (maybe). So rats would make sense.

[lusty silo]

Rat vase 🏺

[verbal marsh]

the death variant should poison, and have elite's hitpoint pool. Those things are ridiculous to kill.

[lusty silo]

You need to buy a cat to eat them $5 in game shop

[verbal marsh]

black spider, you mean cockroach right?

[cosmic thistle]

Hey can someone else post my holy water idea. I got another 2 and a half hours on my slow mode.

[frosty creek]

i think portal number is good starting point because if everyone know there is only 4 portals, people will hunt other player instead of pveing

[verbal marsh]

they did that last playtest; you can see the exit %'s along with number of people who went down.

will be more interesting when b1 links to b2 most people didn't want to deal with boss.

[rocky oar]

I won't lie

That is annoying as hell having almost all the portals spawn in the boss room

[wintry forge]

I like part of your suggestion, but I don't like the whole thing, so I can't up vote it. 0.1% chance of a variable difficulty is far too low, and the maps don't need to be made easier, only harder. Also, what Linsung said. People will leave if they know the map is cursed. So, don't tell them, and don't make it happen near the start of the match.

[verbal marsh]

Only part of that suggestion I liked is dungeon variation.

lol

I would rather see a mechanic like: Turning on 3 skull laterns make next down portal lead to the liche lords domain, and he is the boss.

Or stealing from the control room releases 'false hope', where players can no longer tell whether its an exit or down portal.

which could also be avoided if you disarm the trap via another room. hrm

[tender magnet]

#d-and-d-suggestions message
I agree with wanting to know their thoughts some more

[ionic mango]

@tender magnet you can already close chests

[faint dirge]

can we please get him banned

#d-and-d-suggestions message

he only wastes time with these suggestions

[tender magnet]

Re read the suggestion.
the perk addition should close chests automatically after closing the menu,
though this isn't good enough to be a standalone perk, so should be added to something

[ionic mango]

well closing after looting takes like 1 more click and an extra 1 sec, i tought u just didnt know u could close them by the suggestion so thats why i came here to share

[tender magnet]

For sure, but perhap make it quiet, or something, I got it from general chat, so it wasn't fully baked

[opaque shore]

If you dislike or disagree you could always just ignore it

[faint dirge]

most npc answer ever

[opaque shore]

Thanks, I think of myself as a very good npc.

[faint dirge]

probably a happy one, but not liked by people because you like wasting time

[opaque shore]

I just think everyone should have their turn and suggestion, even If they're disagreed upon 👍

[eager creek]

boom a made it a suggestion

his arent suggestions

just trolls

[faint dirge]

banger

on point suggestion

will be most liked for sure

[ionic mango]

wasnt it mentioned multiple times before that troll ones would be removied?

[eager creek]

yes but they dont do it

[ionic mango]

why are you always going back on that

[eager creek]

?

[ionic mango]

the mods bruv

[opaque shore]

We have dealt with the troll suggestion, my apologies on my delay.

[ionic mango]

big win

[boreal flint]

I probably wont play if they end up not introducing some shop system where you can buy items for $....

some people have lifes you know...

dont have time for farming items all day

[ionic mango]

so if you cant pay real money to get an advantage, you wont play?

oh no, youll be very much missed, anyways

[tawny lagoon]

If they keep the stash size the same most people won’t have super gear every game

[boreal flint]

its waste of time man.... whats the point playing vs full gear ppl when u only have starter equip every game? i dont have time ......

[tawny lagoon]

Kind of understand what you mean, there should be a mechanic to avoid super geared players to stomp in normal lobbies

But making the game P2W is not the way lol

[ionic mango]

are you committing to not playing the game if theres no way to buy power then?

[upbeat pewter]

its pretty funny seeing people complain about not being able to p2w

[opaque shore]

There won't be pay to win aspects, you can read up more about IRONMACE's philosophy in gaming right here:
https://www.ironmace.com

It would be nice not to enter the topic of P2W both here and in #d-and-d-suggestions, they are trollish as they go against IRONMACE's best wishes.

[ionic mango]

im liking nessi more and more by the minute

[pliant halo]

There are many games in the water

[amber perch]

bet the guy hasn't even played the game. You can easily merc some well geared people and get their gear. Just takes a bit of skill and teamwork from your trio. huge opportunities, if you can only win through pay to win. big lmao, I go in solo and 1v3 all the time.

[granite plinth]

never say never

[granite plinth]

🫵 🫴

[boreal sun]

at the end of the day, different games are for different people
they demand different skills or different time investments, and not every game has to be for everyone
it's your decision whether you want to play a game despite your limited time, or if you'd rather find another game that suits your needs
but asking the game to change to suit your needs isn't really reasonable, especially if your demands counter the dev's stated philosophy and the opinion of the game's audience

[opaque shore]

[uneven thunder]

Zweihander's alternate move should be a toggle able weapon wielding for half-swording that trades range and damage for speed and a different moveset.

[opaque shore]

I can see this working as a perk for Fighter, but other than that no

[agile condor]

Good to see no complete troll suggestions this morning but we may want to further limit the suggestion length 😅 20 suggestions in 1 post is rather meaningless to vote on at least

[clear fox]

I just have so many shitty opinions! lol

If they reduced the time to make suggestions that would be viable

[lusty wren]

Its more of a wish list than a suggestion 😄

[opaque shore]

Please try to make only one suggestion per post! 😄
We increased the time to avoid complete spam, and that the suggestions can be easily discussed.

A problem with your suggestion is that It's hard to discuss all about it, and especially If each is not well thought out before sending, It seemed to me you had a bunch of ideas and wanted to share, but be aware that the game needs indepth suggestions more than not.

I respect everyones opinion, but I would totally say more well thought suggestions would be better instead of many at once.

[upbeat pewter]

Yeah, basically any suggestion thats bloated with more than a single idea ill skip entiewly or downvote

[blazing vapor]

The best chance of getting your idea upvoted and seen is to have it on its own 🙂

[lusty wren]

Some of the individual ideas are good though

Anti cheese needs to be a priority imo

[upbeat pewter]

They should be on their own then

[lusty wren]

One of many anyways

[blazing vapor]

I like ideas in that list and others I don't, so I can't really vote yes to it, because I'm not voting yes to the whole list. You'd likely get a lot of positive feedback by listing them seperately

[upbeat pewter]

What cheese is actually a problem?

[blazing vapor]

I'm guessing he refers to when you stand above an enemy and they have absolutely no way to reach you and stand there until dead

[upbeat pewter]

Im amazed people actually worry about that. Its more than easy enough to dodge everything without doing that already

[opaque slate]

🧢

[upbeat pewter]

I assume enemies breaking objects will be implimented at some point

[opaque shore]

Don't give them ideas
Cheese lovers square up, we gotta defeat the anti-cheesers!

[uneven thunder]

how about a claymore class lock for barbs. I know scottish clans ran no armor w/ claymores.

[agile condor]

I’d like to suggest a deployable box that I can jump on top of

[opaque shore]

Define "Class lock"

[opaque shore]

Now you're speaking my language. (You could do this with Pavises last playtest)

[smoky yoke]

i could see enemies breaking the chests

[carmine path]

does the pavise have infinite health?

[smoky yoke]

for now, it seems like yes

[carmine path]

they should do something about that then

[smoky yoke]

I agree

[uneven thunder]

exclusive weapons for that class. like the bow with exceptions coming from fighters weapons perk.

[smoky yoke]

because it is possible to cheese in many ways with the pavise, especially in inferno maps

[carmine path]

also in pvp'ing

[upbeat pewter]

Its a matter of fact really, they'll get around to it. I just doubt its a priority atm. But it would add a lot of flavour to enemies attackinf.

[opaque shore]

Oh, I don't think claymores should be exclusive to Barbs, Fighters and Warriors from all time alongside many cultures have used them

[upbeat pewter]

Id honestly love fighter to be balanced around all weapons unlocked.

[faint dirge]

for sure, but that is such a balancing nightmare

[upbeat pewter]

Weapons being locked seems weird to me. Abilities should be tied to weapons, so that classes will be innately better with certain weapons.

[faint dirge]

yes but no

[upbeat pewter]

Idk if it would be that hard to balance.

[faint dirge]

i see what u mean

[lucid root]

which kinda claymores we talking about? 😏

[faint dirge]

but if i hear a ranger being able to run with a book and cast spells just sounds so awful and weird

[upbeat pewter]

They dont have a spell list prepared, so they obviously wouldnt have spells to use

Ranger should have a spell talent tree though.

Throwing away most ranged benefits for it, ofc

[lucid root]

minor spells fits fine in the universe i think, like enchanting your arrows with different elements or something

[upbeat pewter]

Yeah. Utility mostly

[lucid root]

in the end i don't think they really need any spells to be interesting though

[upbeat pewter]

Not at all. It could honestly just be an elemental choice on a skill. It really depends how they want to drive each class, and how different they'll all be with talent trees.

Id love 2 different choices to change each class a lot.

[opaque shore]

As a ranger main, I would absolutely not want spells in Rangers.
I think It defeats the purpose of a Ranger, a marksman which has trained their whole life to have pinpoint accuracy

[open ermine]

even though they had a spell list in D&D i think here it's fine to leave them without since sdf said they're looking into adding artifacts/scrolls so non spellcasting classes can have the option for something

[opaque slate]

shii id love a claymore in the game later

[upbeat pewter]

Rangers in dnd are not ranged specialists.

[uneven thunder]

hell yeah brother

[opaque shore]

Then I dislike Rangers in DnD

[upbeat pewter]

They are not devovted to archery, they are devoted to being a ranger, like park ranger irl.

[lucid root]

zweihanders

[upbeat pewter]

Meaning that melee and ranged should be viable (with different trees), and spell could be another.

Youd pick one, not all.

[opaque shore]

If something like spells perks / skills come to Ranger I would absolutely not use them
My roleplaying with Rangers and almost every class is devotion to their expertise

[upbeat pewter]

Masters of tracking, beasts and the outdoors. Is the ranger theme.

Why would you not use ranger just because they'd have that option? You could just do a different ranger than that.

[opaque shore]

I mean use the spells.

[upbeat pewter]

Expertise is how you build your character.

[opaque shore]

I would still play Ranger, I would just never build them with spells

[upbeat pewter]

Yeah, thats fine.

Id assume most people wont use all talent trees for their classes.

I love playstyle variation.

[opaque shore]

The game is way more fun to me when I focus my roleplaying on devotion since in real life I'm a Jack of all Trades

[lucid root]

depending on how robust the new talent tree is i might build multiple wizards

[upbeat pewter]

Id likely play rogue wizard

Assuming warlock isnt in

[opaque shore]

I'm a pretty much crazy erudite, so I don't like being a Jack of all Trades in games 😭

[lucid root]

probably you can just reset it for free so might not have to

[open ermine]

lock is coming at some point

[upbeat pewter]

Yeah, i know

[lucid root]

min/maxer?

[lusty wren]

Id like this to cost

something

not gold

[opaque shore]

Explain?

[lucid root]

if not gold then what

[lusty wren]

Not sure, maybe a specific in raid action

[upbeat pewter]

Id probably play ranger as a melee if that were a solid option.

[lucid root]

min/maxing is going for the most efficient build

[upbeat pewter]

Right now you cant really.

[rancid pebble]

Erudite and not liking jack of all trades doesnt necessarily mean min max

[lusty wren]

Spear?

[open ermine]

really? i see people complaining about spear ranger immensely

[rancid pebble]

but also min maxing is so fun in games like DnD

[upbeat pewter]

You can use spear, but its mostly bow and spear.

[opaque shore]

I was about to say this 👆

[open ermine]

like yeah it's not a core focus but it's still there

[upbeat pewter]

Abilities dont really synergise with spear

[opaque shore]

I would love to just make a cool build myself and use it, without min/maxing or picking things from guides

[open ermine]

right ok that's understandable

[rancid pebble]

people complained about spear ranger?

[upbeat pewter]

People complain about everything

Because they suck

[rancid pebble]

Spear is a really good weapon, but not many rangers used them unless in geared lobbies

[open ermine]

in general chat typically yeah i see people call out spear being op/strong etc but yeah

[upbeat pewter]

Yeah, spear needed its nerfs

[open ermine]

this

[lucid root]

not much build diversity, but i like having fewer and more functional builds than more builds that are mostly gimmicky

[rancid pebble]

spear ranger is lowkey not the best build, probably a bit trolly of a build tbh, a fighter with spear is so much better

[uneven thunder]

Would it be so bad if rogue gets the pocket sand ability

[upbeat pewter]

There isnt much room for build diversity atm

That will come with talent trees

And more weapons

[lucid root]

thats what i'm saying when the talent tree comes

[rancid pebble]

spear may be, but spear ranger is simply misusing the ranger to his best abilities

anyone here ever seen the game battle brothers

[upbeat pewter]

Exactly this. Spear is a crutch

[open ermine]

ah i probably misread the context of the complaints then

[opaque shore]

Soon they will complain about Bards playing "Move B" by Ludacris while they go around killing players with a buffed team

[rancid pebble]

I hope the skill trees are similar to battle brothers

[rancid pebble]

lol

[lucid root]

nah they're going to play Tribute by tenacious D

[rancid pebble]

tbh if I see a ranger using a spear vs a fighter I am instantly like 30% less worried

[lucid root]

need javelins, then bring back the javazon

[rancid pebble]

https://discordapp.com/channels/988365908009447485/1048759403819577486/1066391114774487110

[rancid pebble]

gimme pila and javs pls

[open ermine]

nah bring the sling so we can dome people with rocks

[upbeat pewter]

Bolas would solve a lot of the games problems

[rancid pebble]

the suggestion I linked, do you guys think these are the scrolls that will become like one off spells?

[upbeat pewter]

In slowing people down

[rancid pebble]

you should be able to bring a trebuchet into the dungeon

[open ermine]

yes actually i think so

[lucid root]

i was thinking that too, the scrolls will be single use spells

[open ermine]

the ancient scrolls felt like a placeholder item

[lucid root]

they take up way too much space to just be a sellable

[upbeat pewter]

Yeah, scrolls i assume are from DnD. One use

Wands multi use

But i doubt wands will exist, unless just extremely rare

[rancid pebble]

might have to divine them tho

[lucid root]

i thought wands were coming

[rancid pebble]

using the unused attribute right now on I forget what it is called

the like item identification speed thing

[upbeat pewter]

They may be

[open ermine]

yeah wands and scrolls were in the Q&A

[upbeat pewter]

I imagine scrolls will have static damage

And effect

Based on rarity

[rancid pebble]

I love wands bro, can't wait to be an abracadabra wizard

[open ermine]

they want to use them to supplant classes without having to give them a full spell list it seems

[upbeat pewter]

Wands on wizard would be meh

[smoky yoke]

scrolls, wands apparently

[rancid pebble]

it will be interesting I think

[upbeat pewter]

They'd likely be able to use the spells anyways

[rancid pebble]

back on what this channel was discussing earlier, if they don't add spells to every class this should help

[smoky yoke]

it was mentioned also a gem system socket 🤔

[upbeat pewter]

Rogue with ignite scroll.

[smoky yoke]

rip

[rancid pebble]

finally rogues will taste the power wizards have

[upbeat pewter]

Rogue can already 1 hit without that

[rancid pebble]

cap

[upbeat pewter]

More damage to add to the multi

[rancid pebble]

with magic resist being more prevalent I doubt we will see geared one taps with rogue

[upbeat pewter]

Rogue doesnt use magic damage in the one shot

[rancid pebble]

your cooldowns wont have as much of an impact in next pt unless they rework how the damage is calculated and make bleed physical damage

[upbeat pewter]

Bonus damage was all phys

[rancid pebble]

rupture and poison I am fairly sure are considered magic damage to the code

back stab is physical damage thuogh

[upbeat pewter]

Sure, but neither are part of the one shot

[rancid pebble]

do you use uncloack extra damage after hide

[upbeat pewter]

Its 50% out of stealth, 50% weak point

[rancid pebble]

and back stab?

[upbeat pewter]

And backstab

[rancid pebble]

I see, that may work then

Ive never been one shot by a rogue and I played two of the lowest armor classes; wiz and ranger

rupture and poison fans ig

[lucid root]

i've only been one shot by a barb so far

[rancid pebble]

^

[upbeat pewter]

It was a decent problem. 30-40 damage daggers, 2.3x damage non headshot.

[rancid pebble]

yea and it always is terrifying

[upbeat pewter]

It wasnt common, but might be next playtest

[rancid pebble]

damn where you getting 40 damage daggers

what perfect roll unique is that

[upbeat pewter]

• damage on gear

Can be greens

Could get it easy last playtest.

[rancid pebble]

true true

completely forgot about that

I always do what the dagger does + the extra damage

I think the best dagger can roll like 36

[lucid root]

everyone saying rangers were one shotting them but i never experienced it

[upbeat pewter]

You could get 30 damage daggers green or blue.

[rancid pebble]

tbh I only one shot people when they were in my trap with a longbow headshot

[upbeat pewter]

I saw a unique 44 flat

[rancid pebble]

yea blue castillon rolls 28 on max

so plus any damage buffs and it can do a lot

[upbeat pewter]

Its the offhand dagger that does the most.

[agile condor]

You’re correct, rangers are fine, relax people, no nerfs 😊

[upbeat pewter]

Had higher rolls.

[rancid pebble]

and most people have around 100 health so, 30 *2.3 would be 69

you would need back stab

[upbeat pewter]

Non headshot

2m3 includes backstab

[rancid pebble]

Im checking the wiki rn and the best rolls are posted

[upbeat pewter]

2.3*

[rancid pebble]

ranger mains stick together

[upbeat pewter]

Yeah? What was the best roll offhand dagger?

[rancid pebble]

what do you mean offhand dagger

like dual wielding?

or your second slot

[upbeat pewter]

Castillion was main hand, right?

Second slot only

[rancid pebble]

Im confused why those would roll higher, they both are just daggers the only difference is where you equip them

https://darkanddarker.wiki.spellsandguns.com/Weapons#Daggers

[upbeat pewter]

They are seperate weapons.

Each weapon has its own rolls.

[rancid pebble]

Sure, but they cant roll higher than the rng damage just because they are in a different slot

[upbeat pewter]

You cant put any dagger in main hand, or any in offhand

The ones specificallu for offhand happened to have more damage

[rancid pebble]

yes, but they dont stack, if you hit with both daggers thats a two shot not a one shot

[upbeat pewter]

Yeah, castillion is offhand

No, fhey dont stack

You cant hit with both anyways

[rancid pebble]

ye ok I think I understand now

Im still confused because I was posting the highest possible damage of all daggers which was the 'off hand ones'

and still the math doesnt seem to workout to one shot

[upbeat pewter]

Im noy sure the wiki is right. I definitely saw higher rolls than that

[rancid pebble]

unless it is against a naked rogue or wiz

[upbeat pewter]

So, 30 damage, 2.3 multi

67?

[rancid pebble]

perhaps its wrong, all of the bow ones they have info on seem accurate and I am more familiar with them

69

[upbeat pewter]

Headshot brings that up by 50%

Thats without + damage gear

[rancid pebble]

103.5

[upbeat pewter]

+damage fear was selling real cheap, so realistic to get

[rancid pebble]

seems doable, Im shocked more rogues werent one shotting me

then again I always just triple shot insta killed them, poor rogue mains

[upbeat pewter]

And you could get +2 damage blues.

Not sure about rares and uniques.

[rancid pebble]

or +3 all att greens

Also am I the only person that thinks a damage scaling similar to dark souls would be better

feels odd that all weapons scale with strength including wiz damage

finesse or agility would make sense for bows and daggers/rapier

[upbeat pewter]

Bows str makes sense

You have to be strong to use one. Str matters more usually.

Agi doesnt make you hit harder. But faster.

Makes sense to me.

[rancid pebble]

str for long bow makes sense

those things are incredibly hard to use

but like a recurve or survival bow are pretty easy, the average person could draw one I hope

[upbeat pewter]

Could draw, maybe. But reliably and fast? Not really.

Hold it? Probs not.

Im not sure i could, im pretty weak irl

As for wizards, they should be relying on magic for melee damage, so will

[faint dirge]

just identify as strong and your problems are solved

[rancid pebble]

real and true, worked for me

[faint dirge]

same

[rancid pebble]

most people nowadays draw compound bows and think they are strong, some random english peasent in the 1200s had gigachad back muscles drawing 100 pound longbows

[faint dirge]

well

i think the least people draw compound bows

[soft relic]

Really depends on the recurve bow. But as far as physics go, the draw weight and pull length of the bow are going to determine how fast an arrow is going out of a bow, be it survival, recurve or longbow. A person's strength is going to determine how heavy of a draw weight they can handle, so it makes sense for strength to affect the damage.

There were 100+ lb recurve bows, too.

[dire needle]

Should make a solo only mode for high roller

[wintry forge]

That's sci-fi. This is fantasy. They can make a similar sci-fi themed game next time. Just my opinion.

[wintry forge]

Auto close doors and chests.

[serene snow]

Can I get some upvotes on this idea? Hopefully we can turn this around. ty
#d-and-d-suggestions message

[wintry forge]

I don't know. Ironmace is very vague about what they think "exploitative" is. What they said can be interpreted many ways.

[wintry forge]

I think some people just haven't figured out they'll likely get down voted if they put too many suggestions into one post.

[grand lichen]

I swear there are like 3 people making shutty suggestions all the time and I can't tell if they are trolling or not

[opaque shore]

Context matters We’ve seen first hand how corporate game companies sell their soul for the easy payday. We are disappointed to see them doubling down on more and more exploitative practices, becoming more like casinos instead of bringing joy to gamers.
"Easy payday" is a clear cut towards microtransactions

[serene snow]

microtransactions spread out the "payday" over a longer period of time. if they sell the game and lots of people buy it then they have no reason to keep working on the game because they already got all the money they will make off it

i dont want this game to die

[opaque shore]

You don't need exploitative microtransactions

You can easily do with cosmetics only

[serene snow]

i agree, they can do microtransaction in a nonexploitative way

i think it should be subscription based or else it'll be overrun by cheaters

[wintry forge]

I think of the classes as only being able to use certain weapons/abilities because that's all they've trained with.

[wintry forge]

Aragorn from LoTR is a ranger. He doesn't only use bows.

[open ermine]

tbh the only issue i see with cosmetics in this game is people may be adverse to it since seeing enemy players gear to gauge their strength is a thing, maybe if they could make it so cosmetics only mask grey rarity gear then they could have free reign over how much they wanna put in

[serene snow]

once the game goes on sale for <$5 cheater companies will mass buy the game and sell cheats for $50 each and make bank off ironmace

[opaque shore]

Subscription base is exploitative

[serene snow]

the devs will need to spend lots of time and effort to keep cheaters out of the game. i think it's fair to pay them for that

[opaque shore]

Not everyone has that kind of money, much less from countries where Dollar or Euro or any of the big currencies isn't the main currency.
5$ a month would be 30R$ for me, keep in mind that 12 years ago, 5$ would be 7R$ in here. It's a crazy jump in inflation and It's almost impossible to support any subscription based from outside.
I don't have Netflix, Amazon Prime, etc.

[wintry forge]

The wiki says unique daggers are 36 max.

[serene snow]

maybe they could region lock the game. if they sell the game once then all the legit people will buy the game once. then cheaters will get banned and buy the game again and again. after a couple years cheaters will be the only ones buying the game and incentivize the devs to keep it going that way. there wont be an incentive to prevent cheater, but to let them buy the game and then ban them after the account can no longer be refunded

[opaque shore]

There's no need for region lock, usually bans are IP bans and even If they buy a new game after being banned for cheating, they wouldn't be able to play in that IP.

[smoky yoke]

i think it may not be updated that wiki, but i may be wrong

[zinc frost]

Can’t you used vpns to avoid being up van

[serene snow]

you can /release /renew your ip address in most cases

[opaque shore]

If you are banned on VPN that VPN IP is banned correct. The suggestion he told, has nothing to do with this.

[opaque shore]

This won't change your static IP.

[serene snow]

static IPs are mostly used for website hosting. hackers have dynamic ip addresses

[opaque shore]

This has nothing to do with what you said though, your "Region lock" idea does not help against cheaters.

[serene snow]

it could allow cheaper subscription prices in certain regions

[wintry forge]

I disagree. The only way I'd agree subscriptions are exploitative is if they charge too much. If it costs $5/month and you play for a year, that's $60. That seems reasonable to me. If people aren't interested in playing that long then they pay less. They could even offer a discount if you pay up front for 6 months or a year. Say like instead of paying each month and the total coming to $60, if you pay up front for a year it only costs $50.

[opaque shore]

That's not how it works, they'd have to go through a long process with Steam for that in every region, and even then, It wouldnt be that much more cheaper.

[opaque shore]

They are exploitative for this simple fact: It gatekeeps many poor users from being able to play.

I'm currently saving $60 for a GPU. It's not easy out here.

[wintry forge]

Okay. I just read your other post where you mentioned that. They could charge less depending on your region though.

[open ermine]

i would say WoW leans into exploitative behavior from my last exp with it since they started putting in severe timegates for content that seemed more geared towards pushing players into subbing for 1 extra month to get to said content

[opaque shore]

I would have to pick between playing Dark and Darker or saving for a GPU.

The GPU would be less expensive than Dark and Darker

Even with charging less, It's not that big of a margin you guys think It would be.

A one time payment with cosmetics that can be bought at any time is the perfect way to balance microtransactions without gatekeeping an entire game

[serene snow]

with that model hackers will take over the game in my opinion

[opaque shore]

Are Hackers taking over Fortnite or Valorant? They're both F2P with microtransactions, which is much less than A one time payment with microtransactions