[Ada Wong] New Unit Megathread

[proper tree]

When it involves a double banner which is the norm, having 400 pulls hoarded is basically guaranteeing you will pickup both units

[hushed quest]

For the normal pick-up banners, 30-60 is pretty typical. First 10 pull is also fairly common. One and done and then handle the duplicates from the wishlist. That's mileage steadily built up over time that is saved for the 1% banners where going 70-160 and not getting anything is typical.

In the long run, if you're not wasting gems/tickets on the 1% banners, that's pulls you save for the 2% banners which accumulate mileage for seasonals and pilgrim/OS banners.

It is counter-intuitive.

[hollow idol]

https://imgflip.com/i/a902tk

80 pull ada 200 pull jill btw

[hushed quest]

Maybe someone has an actuary table showing I'm wrong, but anecdotally it works out a lot better for me pulling on every banner and mileage the 1% banners.

[hollow idol]

tbh you end up getting more non banner ssr when u pull pilgrim since 1% so if ur specifically trying to get every unit its better to pull 2%

[proper tree]

It’s funny, but, it’s very RNG dependent on how things work out

Say someone thoroughly skipped Crust and Sora, thinking they suck

Not even 0LB, they’re unrecruited. Not even wishlisted.

Then while pulling on Ada Wong banner, they get both plus Ada Wong in 40 pulls.

What then?

Not to mention molds, friendship pulls

[hollow idol]

my rule of thumb has always been "will i regret not having this unit in a year?"

if yes, pull

because its happened a few times i havent gotten unrecruited nikke for 1-1.5 years off wishlist

to this day i wouldnt regret skipping k crust sora

i think i would rather pull wishlist ordinary banner than sora even

[placid phoenix]

Crust treasure soon allegedly

I already started her advise

[exotic arch]

that was wrong

the way poeple interpret datamines for treasures is they see a value for each skill changing and they try to interpret it which happened for crust

but it was just a wording change

[placid phoenix]

[gilded path]

Yep

[cunning shadow]

It's safer to skip weak normal banners and focus stored gems on seasonal/collab dupes

Because yeah, if you're luck is good/normal, you'll get the rate up within 50 pulls

But, as an example, I pulled 230 on Tia and still didn't get her, so I ultimately used mileage

I think giving every unit 10-30 pulls is a safe tactic, but saying to actually acquire every unit is extremely dangerous

One of my alt accounts is at 18k gems right now, so probably going to have to mileage xmas units unless I get lucky

And that's from doing one copy of every unit

Meanwhile another that skips anything not hard meta is at 89k

[floral tendon]

at a certain point you don't have luck anymore

it's all balance out

2 people playing for 2 years will have roughly the same amount of SSR, assuming their pulling number and behavior isn't too far off

the luck part in that case is getting the more useful SSR

[hollow idol]

my on banner pull average is back up to 100/banner unit since eva1

and thats with me one tapping entirety of TU and bade

[finite steeple]

No. If you have to ask being a Top 200, you suck.

The tier list is made in the mindset of Top SR, like Top 30-200 at least.

There are differing opinions on what a tier list should look like.

But ours is mostly about, "Should we invest in X?" Basically, SSS gets higher priority than SS, S, then A, etc, in the scope of SR (Bossing).

It's not solely damage.

Rather, a combination of everything, including damage, chance of being used, synergy chance with current and future units, applicable niche(s), replaceability, etc.

Ada Wong may not have the brightest damage, but she has niche(s) where she is the BiS.

As long as her niche is required, and she is not powercrept in that niche, she will be used in the next few Raids.

[cunning shadow]

This is where the criticism lies tho If it's based on top rank usage, it's not actually helpful for the players that need it most

[finite steeple]

It actually is.

Tier List is not a Priority List.

A beginner needs a Priority List.

Not a Tier List.

[cunning shadow]

Like Mari has been a meta unit in top scores, but she's useless for top 3%

[finite steeple]

She's not, if you use her.

Top 3% can use other units.

Which I call compromises.

You can even use Crust if you want.

For Idk Water-weak.

[cunning shadow]

Blanc is straight-up better than Mari for top 3% players

[finite steeple]

Or Novel.

[finite steeple]

We can't take account of everything.

It depends on investments too.

And skill level.

[cunning shadow]

Oh, Prydwen actually has Blanc above Mari

[finite steeple]

Tier list is based on perfect skill level @ "logically" max investments (not out of reach).

[cunning shadow]

nikke gg doesn't

[finite steeple]

I am sure that's not the case for Bossing.

[cunning shadow]

Tied for bossing

[finite steeple]

There are no sub tiers inside a tier.

[cunning shadow]

Blanc is SS S S SS while Mari is S S S A

[finite steeple]

Yes, and there is nothing wrong with that.

Your example was Blanc being better for 3% on Bossing.

[cunning shadow]

Yeah, I agree in this case. Meanwhile I disagree with nikke gg

[finite steeple]

Mari being better for Top 200.

Sounds fair they are tied.

[cunning shadow]

Mari has higher damage ceiling, but Blanc keeps the team alive

And Blanc is cheaper to invest in

[hollow idol]

wym i ask all the time

[finite steeple]

You just ask for confirmation.

[hollow idol]

[finite steeple]

You already have a hunch.

[cunning shadow]

Yeah, asking to verify is different. I do that, too

[hollow idol]

but sometimes i could be brain farting u know

[cunning shadow]

Kits can also be tricky

as can translations

[hollow idol]

im pretty good with kits

[finite steeple]

Everyone does.

[hollow idol]

not so good with brain fart

[cunning shadow]

EN did a good job with RE units' kits

[finite steeple]

I am better at looking at the bigger picture and ignoring the intricacies.

[hollow idol]

they just forgot damage interval on jill as a whole

[cunning shadow]

That was on all languages

Not just EN

[finite steeple]

When I read Jill, I was like shit maybe B tier. And everyone here, including Reddit, was going into war about her damage, math, and "Shooting Range scores" versus Ein.

[cunning shadow]

The only thing that could've saved her was a stacking system on her S2

As soon as they did the skill clarification change, her fate was sealed

[finite steeple]

We know that wasn't gonna happen anyway.

I am actually very confident with our Bossing tier list (B+). B- is not maintained.

Story and PvP haven't been updated awhile.

I think Bossing C-D are pretty good, though, at quick glance.

Story below SS is a mess.

Maybe if Surface became a large game mode, we can ditch Low Deficit?

[hollow idol]

its intersting because realistically only 40% of people play soloraid challenge mode at all

but for the most part i think if u run a high deficit team u will probably clear low deficit as well

aside from the player not knowing how to burst gen

if anything full auto vs manual would be bigger than deficit

[finite steeple]

Yeah, I am planning to ditch Low Deficit if Surface requires its own Tier List.

I have communicated this "opinion".

Maintaining two Story Tier Lists is complicated as hell.

[young quarry]

That's fair.. I found both sites useful for a variety of things over the years.. skill break points etc. I dont need someone to tell me helm is going have way more use/return on investment vs milk (both in same tier).. but maybe some do (redditors mostly lol)

I think that's what me and the guy were discussing.. even if its a top 200 i do still find milk being in the same tier as helm a bit odd btw

[cunning shadow]

Same. I'd put Helm above B Milk without question

[finite steeple]

Good point.

[young quarry]

Anyway need to finish one more SR.. so I can chill and see eu get shit tomorrow

[hollow idol]

clearly u should just seperate into 5 different tierlists one for each element

would probably be most accurate

but most work cuz maintaining 5 lists

[finite steeple]

No.

[cunning shadow]

That complicates supports/support DPS units

[finite steeple]

That's dumb.

It won't work.

[hollow idol]

does it tho, supports can just be near top of every element

cuz they are

[finite steeple]

Congrats, you just multiplied the tier list by 5.

And now beginners dk which one to read.

Congrats!

[hollow idol]

[finite steeple]

You solved nothing but complaints!

I know elemental needs distinction, but it's just for a few units.

If any, what you need is not a tier list.

It's a FUCKING RAID GUIDE.

[hollow idol]

also keep in mind ~40% of people actually click challenge mode

people that actually try will drop from there

targeting minority of the minority

[hushed quest]

It would be nice if the pages defaulted to Bossing, but I understand why they don’t. Defaulting to high deficit might be better for new players stuck on Normal campaign.

Even though at high deficit for them is not usually 20+%.

Hard to convey to new players why their Cindy isn’t working on those stages because they can’t usually diversify yet.

Ah, discussion got moved elsewhere.

[hollow idol]

im pretty sure every good high deficit unit works in low deficit as well

[cunning shadow]

every unit works in low deficit

[hollow idol]

like if u take any decent team u can form with high deficit list and take it low deficit itll prob be at worst equal to low deficit list formed team

bar like idk mari b2 clearing a wave for some reason cuz blue cp

[hushed quest]

New players could use some team comp basics a little beyond b1-2-3 to understand synergies. We want new player retention as much as ShiftUp to make raids easier between 201 and 3%.

They try to force Cindy (or RH or anyone else they’ve gone all in on) to work where she can’t.

[cunning shadow]

You mean I don't just click auto-fill and let the game leave me with a 40s B1 and B2 that I levelled first because waifu?

[hushed quest]

That’s the leviathans who still can’t manage coop.

Learning to use a unit like Ada competently is good for people who started from the collab.

[cunning shadow]

Real UR cooks I've seen in my union in the past

[hushed quest]

Prydwen’s team comp suggestions/examples are really good guidance for that.

[hushed quest]

Are those “green means green” Or “green means Wind Weak” comps?

Laitance comes in lots of flavors.

[cunning shadow]

That player only uses mono-element teams no matter what

[timid cobalt]

the average player does not care enough to actually build good teams

I regret back reading

[cunning shadow]

Average player plays with one hand

[timid cobalt]

the only ones that truly enjoy the game

[floral tendon]

back reading a chat that involve Kisenix

[timid cobalt]

if you say so