no clue but cn version will rebalance every new character that comes out
#[Arcana] New Unit Megathread
static vale
stone palm
first collab Nier
and what did we have?
something forgetful
at least Makima has some fun in CA
tight condor
@static vale Yeah i heard stuff like Dorothy very good and alice nerfed to the ground.. but nothing concrete in terms of skills.. hopefully one day we can get the CN rework chars.. rather then waiting 6 months for 4 character buffs (most of which are meh)
static vale
we will never get cn's balance changes
that game has its own team working on it
different story different visuals different balance and different release schedule for everything
their balance also isn't necessarily better because a changed balance also means that characters we do use are actually shit for them it is just different
left dome
Probably more balanced across the board.
Chinese devs are pretty good with balancing. If there is something off balance, it's likely intentional.
static vale
i don't have much chinese experience except for hoyo and all their games have whack balance
tight condor
Maybe.. i feel at some point.. they are gonna have to stop pumping out a nikke every 2 weeks.. and maybe they can work on rebalancing/rerunning banners.. All though the problem there is that anyone who has played a bit (let alone spent a decent amount) has most of the non limited characters
static vale
that sounds like a surefire way to destroy the profits they are enjoying right now
this system makes them money why would they rebalance something people already own
tight condor
Other gachas do.. and yeah its true they would have to make money in other ways (skins idk).. all though there is a decent $$ cost for them in having to design/skill test/make events/bonds etc every 2 weeks
static vale
they did want to rebalance but not for free and treasure was their answer to it which originally was planned as mlb until people complained and they lowered the requirement to lb2 bond 30
treasure was a good answer to both rebalance + keeping profits high
left dome
i don't have much chinese experience except for hoyo and all their games have wh...
It's intended.
Old HoYo was pretty good.
So it's obviously designed for money now.
So depending on how much Tencent wanna milk CN players.
In Nikke.
left dome
Maybe.. i feel at some point.. they are gonna have to stop pumping out a nikke e...
Can't.
This game is boring already a few days after a unit's release.
The only thing that keeps exciting people is the thrill of getting new units.
static vale
Old HoYo was pretty good.
good? hi3 was always a big mess
left dome
good? hi3 was always a big mess
Old HI3 was good.
static vale
herrscher of the void completely overtuned
left dome
Well, if you have good resource management skills.
left dome
herrscher of the void completely overtuned
That's the same as saying Rapipi is better than everyone.
static vale
destroying content she wasn't even meant for overshadowing characters you otherwise with good balance would've pulled for
static vale
we just disagree what good balance means then
left dome
We literally have Cindy destroying everything.
static vale
i played hi3 for years i'm pretty up to date with how that shit worked
and how awful it was
left dome
I played HI3 too.
Was the best balancing (in terms of cost/performance ratio of things and F2Pness) I've encountered so far.
peak spindle
Is Arcana a good pull then?
static vale
i don't really rate balance in terms of how good it is for f2p players tbh
this game is excellent for f2p too but i don't consider the balance good
left dome
If you want balance, go play MOBA bruh.
wintry vine
Is Arcana a good pull then?
if u wanna build isabel, yes
if not, no
static vale
If you want balance, go play MOBA bruh.
then i think with this we both agree the balance is bad
peak spindle
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm okay pull Arcana it is
wintry vine
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm okay pull Arcana it is
she is only for electric raids
left dome
then i think with this we both agree the balance is bad
No, asking balance from gacha games is dumb because they need money from pulls.
MOBA is different because usually the money comes from sponsorship and, well, skins.
So my expectation/standards for balance in gacha games are lower.
I agree with you that if we use MOBA's balance (or most competitive games') as standard, most if not all gacha games are technically not balanced.
However, with my lowered standards, I found HI3 having the most reasonable friendliness to F2Ps since you could skip some units and wouldn't miss out on anything. That's because you only needed one team for one element, so you could get A, skip B, then get C, and so on. Their Red Lotus, which was easy to retain by sober F2Ps, gave 95% of the gem income to whales (excluding other sources, making whales not that ahead in pay grade at all). Not sure how HI3 is looking right now, though, since I quit.
With NIKKE, you either get units or you get fucked potentially permanently because there is no rerun and you need 3-5 teams for Raids (not to count different elements, meaning 25 if we want to nitpick). And Top 10, Top 100, Top 1%, and Top 3% are so diverse in gem rewards, so whales become richer and the poor becomes poorer.
So, when someone says NIKKE is the most F2P gacha game they have encountered so far, it either meant: they have been playing greedy gacha games where everything is behind paywall or the devs are stingy, or they haven't played more F2P friendly gacha games. I'd say NIKKE is decent. You could definitely survive as a F2P or a dolphin, but not as much as you would in those friendlier gachas. You definitely need to be able to resist temptations to pull/MLB and skip some units/make compromises.
tight condor
Brown dust 2 is almost too free player friendly.. nikke is much worse in comparison.. but better then stuff like 7ds, tower of god, dokkan (this one i played ages ago tho)
left dome
Brown dust 2 is almost too free player friendly.. nikke is much worse in compari...
You never know until you try.
Sometimes, ignorance is bliss.
Personally, I am looking forward to NTE, Ananta, Azur Promilia, and one more thing I forgot. I hope they are not too greedy, or if they want to be a little bit stingy, then make it not competitive—not like NIKKE.
static vale
No, asking balance from gacha games is dumb because they need money from pulls.
i don't disagree with you
my original point was just that cn and global have different balance but i don't agree that cn is better at balance i think their shit out of balance too
you can say that it's on purpose i'm not saying it's an accident but it's still not balanced
and that let me to saying cn is balanced differently neccesarily better
tepid night
If guilty copies your strongest unit's attack, does she also copy the giga buffs from arcana Isabel?
tepid night
Treasure guilty when
I guess I'd have to run her with rapi but then I don't have any buffers
worn cipher
Guilty duplicates only pre buffs attack?
long canyon
Same skill as Global
They were aware
of Arcana in the making
because Vesti, got changed
and her Burst power was Doubled
because her Burst duration isn't halved anymore
on CN
tepid night
5s burst meme is so dead
tacit forge
it was never alive
tepid night
Vesti powwr
normal tundra
Such blatant divergence
solid gate
worn cipher
Woah
static vale
they should make her a clip
livid geode
who would watch a clip of Vesti?
forest karma
ssk x vesti
fringe lagoon
Clip of Vesti sounds like something that will be on American news 
left dome
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1354791617642631228/1355067508641628311/1...
Still shit though
Although CN Alice is weak
Dorothy is a different story tho
long canyon
Although CN Alice is weak
Not sure what you mean
She's untouched on CN client
stone palm
Not sure what you mean
She's untouched on CN client
what's her attack modfier?
69% 350% charge time?
dapper tulip
why not Arcabel
astral furnace
fleet heart
Jp malder is trying Isabelcana comps
any verdict yet?
astral furnace
worn cipher
ARCANA COMMUNITY winning
worn cipher
Rapi can go back to chair
She never left it
livid geode
The best thing is Rapi can't headshot Arcana and kill her, because her head is empty.
rocky girder
Segs?
bright summit
normal tundra
Not sure what you mean
She's untouched on CN client
We probably shouldn't worry about CN client. It's virtually an independent copy of Nikke sanctioned by ShiftUp. The one ShiftUp directly develops and has control of is the real Nikke
coral wagon
What the reason for the kit change anyway? story, it understandable maybe because censorship
tacit forge
dorothy is the rumored to be the debut banner
and aint nobody gonna roll for a powercrepted unit
hence the buffs
normal tundra
It's not even about balance though. They just want to release and sell characters. It's their revenue.
They didn't want to skip Dorothy and go straight to releasing Siren.
They'll probably eventually run a Mother Whale raid for their first Solo Raid. That is best countered by bringing Dorothy.
🤑
storm gale
meme team
stone palm
kit change sends a strong signal
this server won't follow what you know
else people will skip even Modernia these days
forest karma
watch them making the most broken kit for Modernia
normal tundra
watch them making the most broken kit for Modernia
adds piercing to Modernia AoE
radiant rain
*adds piercing to Modernia AoE*
Burst dealing similar ST damage in the circle, with much bigger circle. Reload to max before burst and you can force FB to end when reload
livid geode
@dapper tulipHmm, do you consider open thread for CN's NIKKE? units that have a new change, so we can rage... talk about it.
dapper tulip
ask snake, i won't do it
dapper tulip
create yourself 
fleet heart
don't think it's needed, how many CN players realistically gonna use discord
fleet heart
wintry vine
<@684751911907360838>Hmm, do you consider open thread for CN's NIKKE? units that...
No
Go to #nikke-chat-cn
It's dead so make use of it
Any research lab posts made here will be about the current version of the game
Just cuz they have some qol doesn't mean that they're not 2.5 years behind us
radiant rain
it's for us to complain at them
that's so childish tbh
tepid night
that's so childish tbh
how, if we don't complain about cn getting QOL we'll never get it
although the only way to make shift up do anything is to get sky to make a video on it
someone rizz him up
radiant rain
there are already channels to complain though
radiant rain
although the only way to make shift up do anything is to get sky to make a video...
i am sure the video is coming
radiant rain
shareholder ain't gonna like it if the company is actively trying to tank their value, i really expect something from SU tomorrow
radiant rain
anything more than tmr, thw fire will become an inferno
any half decent person would have expected this firestorm
tepid night
shift up won't give you anything unless you start a shitstorm about it and tencent makes them do it to make the public shut up
it keeps happening
forest karma
player historically have very short memory span
same shit happen with Lilith and AFK journey
they kept doing shit, community outcry, then they quietly swept things under the rug
radiant rain
their community had already been used to it, right now its SU turn to see whether they want to take this risk and test their playbase
not forgetting, Nikke is an overwhelming % of their revenue
static vale
i think shift up will do very well financially once they release in cn
can't really see the shareholders getting mad ngl
also stellar blade releases soon
different game but still shareholders are invested in the entire company not just nikke global
radiant rain
even so, alienating a 10m monthly playerbase isn't painless
static vale
the financial hurt company wide will be felt a lot later than this summer i think
radiant rain
also stellar blade releases soon
my worry is SB sales gonna be impacted due to this
and upcoming collab
leaving a bad taste in people's mouth even before you collect the moolah
people might just ask steam to refund
tepid night
what do you get out of screaming at shift up about qol we know they can do because of CN when there's a big event they want you to spend on coming up?
forest karma
what do you get out of screaming at shift up about qol we know they can do becau...
what is this sentence
tepid night
what is this sentence
we might get nice things by getting really angry at shift up before their big collab they want you to pull on
bright summit
where's the arcana discussion 
tight condor
my worry is SB sales gonna be impacted due to this
Eventually this stuff will start affecting there bottom line.. I dont see it happening anytime soon.. but if it does.. that's a good thing..
It does seem they are going the blizzard type route of pure greed and just ignoring feedback or complaints. I wouldn't be suprised if 2.5 was neglected because they know they have surefire hits in pc stellar blade and nikke cn
coral wagon
but who's going to build an isabel <:kekmorbL:1009482229312929863>
Me, but not today
Beside, it's too late too applied most of great thing happen in CN version to global beside some QoL
tepid night
I don't think most people even want the buffs
Just the qol like faster loading and stuff
coral wagon
Yeah
But that 100% mold
Player already ask that since day 1, but you know what happen
worn cipher
I WAS EXPECTING SOME ARCANA TALK NOT SOME WHINING
Someone tell me why arcana with isabell in neutral campaign is bad idea
coral wagon
Because she's not good dealing with mobs?
I don't think there's shotgun which good for late campaign anyway.
static vale
isabel is a shotgun
sg can't hit fucking shit
in blanc noir for campaign nobody was relying on noir actually hitting targets from mid range and further
normal tundra
Someone tell me why arcana with isabell in neutral campaign is bad idea
Basically, there are more than a few stages that will pit extreme distance combat at you.
Things like tiny discs, balls, and seahorse-like stuff.
Not to mention, the urgency of having to core-hit a distant miniboss or boss with focus fire over 10 seconds to kill it before deaths or timeout
So for every stage you feel like Isabel is a goddess, there will be that one stage where you're frustrated because she can't actually hit (or core hit) the distant target with most of her pellets, when it counts.
Similar reason is holding back Cinderella (she's mighty, but her arcing shots don't make for reliability if you're trying to thread the needle through a crowd of enemies to a wave boss that must die asap).
Also the old reason that BS Scarlet wasn't favored (distributed damage dilution). This reason disappeared when Volleyballs appeared. At least you can try to thin the crowd for her.
forest karma
Someone tell me why arcana with isabell in neutral campaign is bad idea
very low burst gen
night bough
attack+ based on caster's atk isn't affected by atk% OL right? or is it?
livid geode
OL is invisible buffs, not base stats
If it's invisible, why do we see a difference score in Solo Raids 
worn cipher
K you need to save arcana
chilly hound
just skip both
tepid night
Reak
worn cipher
just skip both
What if I got arcana
chilly hound
🚮
worn cipher
Noooo
sturdy hazel
just skip both
i'm doing that
hope that SB doesn't disappoint me
primal geyser
I tried building Arcana and Isabel
Basically all level 10 skills
Scarlet and Isabel OL
Scarlet SR10 doll
Isabel SR5 doll
First burst Liter-Arcana-Isabel
livid geode
I can't believe you guys fall for SU's scam on advertising Arcana 
Isabel won't get a treasure.
little karma
Who think isabel gonna get a treasure anyway
That arcana is the treasure
They refuse to upgrade pilgrim in any other ways so its already expected
stone palm
I just roll Arcana and leave her there
no need to invest in both yet
not like Scartrina we need to do right away for pee ve pee
livid geode
You twos are a bunch of simps, disgustang... can say the same to me.
tepid night
Who think isabel gonna get a treasure anyway
That arcana is the treasure
They re...
You need 2 dupes to get treasure so I'd probably rather have this than pilgrim treasures
Of course they could just remove the stupid affection requirement because it makes no sense anyway but uhhhhhhhhhhh
neat dock
Frankly, it works thats about it, but i dont see anyone should do this
SR15'd 10/10/7 Fully Overloaded Isabel
3 ele 2 atk 4 ammo
worn cipher
Frankly, it works thats about it, but i dont see anyone should do this
Yeah better show asuka stats
radiant rain
Frankly, it works thats about it, but i dont see anyone should do this
When a supporter dealing double your damage even after you getting gigabuffed:
astral furnace
Taken from skyjlv's video
Some people will read the top line and conclude that the team is bad
neat dock
u would get way more from hyper buffing isabel with tove and drake
its alr doing more than my bsoda sg team
by a good amount on neutral even
if its iron weak just use bsoda
but everything else isabel would be kinnda go to rn in the context of a SG team
astral furnace
Main issue with that is that you literally dont have any sustain for the team and would need a B2 CDR to rotate properly.
B2 CDR that buffs SGs and heals when?
indigo coyote
I mean there's also opportunity cost
I gain damage from having sanis/xmaiden elsewhere
My ein would quite like sanis xmaiden
For example
Or K sanis seems to be their current push
Think about it this way with damage numbers close like that, would you be willing to invest in an sanis xmaiden equivilent
storm gale
Frankly, it works thats about it, but i dont see anyone should do this
was able to do the same 
pretty good off ele damage without shotgun buffs
storm gale
QQ should cooldowns affect skills already in cooldown? It looks like even when this is active Isabel won’t use her first s2 until 2:45 in the fight
normal tundra
QQ should cooldowns affect skills already in cooldown? It looks like even when t...
I think it instantly resets it, but it’s just secondhand information I’m sharing
In other words, if true, Isabel instantly uses her S2 and is on the new CD time
I think it’s easy enough to test
storm gale
some testing on land eater since its shotgun friendly
this the team im going with tho for the hit tomorrow
storm gale
on mother whale, isa s2 clears the mobs for the most part
regular electric by comparison
rocky girder
