Tom And Jerry

[stoic schooner]

Marvin didnt do anything wrong

People who lose to him cry about on twitter

[trim zealot]

I don’t understand what you mean by “can’t do that”.

[subtle lotus]

He got true combo loops like T&J up to 70 or 100%

[stoic schooner]

No?

[subtle lotus]

Do you khow why they nerf lebron

[subtle lotus]

If you dont khow about it dont talk

[stoic schooner]

Lebron didn't do anything either

[stoic schooner]

Rich coming from you

[subtle lotus]

Lebron got an loop

And thats why the nerf him

Marvin got an loop and they nerf him

[stoic schooner]

No?

[stoic schooner]

Bc people didnt know how to fight him

[subtle lotus]

Bro stop saying no, you can ask to anyone and they will tell you the same

[trim zealot]

It was a surgical nerf, basketball now only hits downward once. What you want to happen to T&J is nerf our main combo tool into the dirt.

[subtle lotus]

Bfo they nerf lebron bc he got an loop

Pfg said that

[stoic schooner]

Marvin did not do anything wrong

[trim zealot]

He still has 100% consistent combos that do good damage. It’s fair.

[subtle lotus]

Marvin got an loop with down air into button

Lebron got an loop too

Iron giant got an loop

[trim zealot]

That’s what I meant. The loop started from air down special.

[subtle lotus]

And all of them got nerfed

[subtle lotus]

They nerf him bc of that

He got an loop, with his jab I think

Pfg by himself said that

I didn't saw it, but you get the point

They don't like the consistent loops

If that were the case

They'll keep the iron giant jab into nair loop

I'm just hoping they don't remove it

Just make it unconsitent

[trim zealot]

In a better way than what you’d suggest should be done to Tom. LeBron’s down special was made to not hit more than once, eliminating the loops, but keeping good combos and neutral. All while making it still 100% consistent.

[subtle lotus]

Tom just need to be unconsistent bc you khow how pfg its with loops

[stoic schooner]

They even said they wanted to keep the characters identity (just means wants to make them usable

[subtle lotus]

They hate them

[trim zealot]

We shouldn’t have to roll coin flips to deal damage/kill.

[subtle lotus]

All that ik its that his going to get his loops removed or unconsitent bc the people it's complaining

And they dont like consistent loops

[trim zealot]

And you make the problem worse. Stop complaining, learn how to counterplay up tilt.

[subtle lotus]

Its the same history on every character

[subtle lotus]

Theres a way to do it with light characters and i alr khow

But you can't counter bc its impossible as I said with heavy ones

[trim zealot]

You can do the combo, cool. Now learn to not be hit by it.

That means don’t whiff attacks, and win neutral.

But mainly don’t whiff.

Then punish up tilt because it takes like 10 years to end on whiff.

[subtle lotus]

Its an 50/50 situation

Its not about getting hit or not

Not even an 50/50 tbh

Bc he can just hold the paddle and wait to you dodge

And thats impossible to counter with heavy character

If you dont dodge you will get hit anyway

[trim zealot]

Dodge into it, that is. But that’s your fault if it happens.

[subtle lotus]

And if you dodge you will get hit by the paddle bc its an dodge punish

[trim zealot]

You can parry, use armor to trade, and stay grounded to avoid it.

[subtle lotus]

Did you see my message?

[subtle lotus]

You cant stay grounded

If you do nothing

You get hit by the paddle bc you just release it

[trim zealot]

Why not? This ain’t smash ultimate where aerials are the only option.

[subtle lotus]

Its bc if you stay walking

You will get hit

I need to send you an example on clips

My god your not understading

😑

[trim zealot]

I’ve been holding off on this, but your grammar sucks. I understand if your first language isn’t English, but it’s hard to understand your messages sometimes.

[subtle lotus]

Nobody cares about grammar on discord

I dont mind about that

If that's your argument that sucks even worse than my grammar

[trim zealot]

Let me use telepathy to understand you then. What’s your mind address?

[subtle lotus]

What the heck are you talking me about?

Lets stay on the topic, il give you some example of the mix up

Il tell you smth about the paddle that its done by pro players, and the reason bc almost nobody can dodge it if your character its heavy

Or light

[trim zealot]

All I have to go by as far as interpreting what you mean is the words on my screen. If those words are poorly typed, then I will not understand you too well.

[subtle lotus]

So there's an 50/50, doing 3 jabs with T&J

So after that all you need to do its holding paddle and wait till your opponent dodge, walk, or try to attack you

Bc your alr holding it, it release even faster

[trim zealot]

The longer we wait the longer the move lasts, which means we have a larger window to be punished when it whiffs.

[subtle lotus]

So you can get the paddle start up almost all the time

[subtle lotus]

When you get the 3 jabs you don't have any options

If you try to walk you get hit

[trim zealot]

Just move faster than my grandma and you’ll be fine.

[subtle lotus]

If you dodge you get hit

Bro its an lit pro tip

You cant escape of that

[subtle lotus]

Alr let's 1v1 to show you

[trim zealot]

Can’t rn. But I would like to sometime.

[subtle lotus]

Well I'm really tired of talking about this

Just let's wait to see, what happens

In 2 days it's the betlejuice gameplay trailer and we should get some buff and nerfs

So let's see👀

[trim zealot]

T&J won’t get nerfed, but if they do, I will partially blame you.

[subtle lotus]

Its not my fault, everyone its complaining about him

[trim zealot]

Sadly.

[subtle lotus]

I actually did an buff and nerfs to get this character as strong as i can

And keep the people happy

T&J Nerfs:
Paddle:

Paddle its more easy to escape and the di on certain
character has been adjusted to make them escape easily so now it's an real 50/50, not an 80/20.

Paddle:
If Paddle whiff's the Tom and jerry no longer has the ability to cancel the paddle and escape.

Paddle:
If the T&J whiff's the paddle it wont pull you back, so the hitbox of the paddle will be at the top of the paddle.

Buff:

Jab 2 and 3, startup window increased.

Dash attack startup window increased.

Jerry have instead of 3 corks, now he have 4 corks

[trim zealot]

My words probably don’t read as happy, and if other T&J players don’t like the sounds of your nerfs, then they won’t be either.

Grass wizard wasn’t thrilled either.

[subtle lotus]

This was my best attempt to keep the people happy and T&J mains happy

I wish they just do that

And not kill the character

[trim zealot]

It probably wouldn’t have worked if you were a dev.

[subtle lotus]

Bro everyday people are more mad about this

They wont stop

Till he get nerf

[trim zealot]

They could. But if they don’t, up the move staling, don’t nerf the up tilt. The combo wouldn’t be as bad but the move would still hit.

[subtle lotus]

They agree with my buffs and nerf, will be almost the same just a lil bit, less consitent

[trim zealot]

Let’s see a petition then.

[subtle lotus]

If people keep complaining like this they will do the batman treatment, they will nerf paddle and now you can't cancel it

💩👎

[trim zealot]

Better than the move having a chance to drop halfway through.

[subtle lotus]

Il put my buff, nerfs on the wishlist channel, i wish they dont nerf the paddle like batman

☹️

[trim zealot]

Your “worse” idea was, ironically, better than your first idea.

[subtle lotus]

That was, what im saying

We need the move to be less consistent atleast to keep it alive

And if we get nerfed on that aspect we need more combo routes

Some frame data buffs

[trim zealot]

No, I meant not being able to cancel it AT ALL would have been better than it dropping on a 50/50.

[subtle lotus]

It won't be better

[trim zealot]

Then think of some before crying out for a paddle nerf.

[subtle lotus]

The paddle its alr an diable move and he got a lot of endlag if you dont cancel it

The point it's to keep alive the paddle cancels

Idc if now it's an 50/50

If you can cancel the paddle its ok

[trim zealot]

That wouldn’t solve the issue you have with the move. The combos would still be there, only now the character feels worse to play.

[subtle lotus]

Yea I want the combo to still there

That was my point at the beggining

I said that they need an lil adjustment on the di of paddle to be an actual 50/50

[trim zealot]

Why not a 100% chance to hit with less damage from the combo?

[subtle lotus]

Maybe

[trim zealot]

How have you not considered that before trying to get paddle nerfed like that?

[subtle lotus]

But not having dmg its bad

Its better to have an 50/50 with an lot of dmg

[subtle lotus]

They will nerf the paddle anyway

I just want them to keep the paddle cancelable

[trim zealot]

How? I’d much rather feel like I can hit my combos than them dropping. It’s just less fun to not hit your attacks.

I don’t care if it does like 50 or 60%.

Just keep the combos. They’re fun.

[subtle lotus]

This its what we need to care about

[trim zealot]

Sheik (smash ultimate) has managed to stay A-S tier in smash despite tickling opponents for hitting them a bunch.

[subtle lotus]

If they nerf this, all it's over

[trim zealot]

She still has good damage output because she gets fast attacks, aka easier neutral wins.

[subtle lotus]

We need the lil adjustment and im happy

The move will stay as the same, just less broken, and less consistent

[trim zealot]

As long as I’m not gambling on my combos I’m happy.

[subtle lotus]

Its not about gambling, you got an visual aspect to identify the di

When they are in the paddle you can see the direction where they are di'ing

Di its directional influence

All that the can do its change there direction while they are in the combo

So you got to follow it

That's all

[trim zealot]

At that point what’s stopping the opponent from DI’ing to the closest ledge to limit how long our combo lasts?

Instead of hoping we drop it from reversing.

It’s not a well thought out nerf.

[subtle lotus]

If your character its heavy enough they can't get our of it, that's the main deal

Of they simply remove that

All will be the same

[trim zealot]

They shouldn’t. They are heavy, they take more damage, but live longer.

[subtle lotus]

That's why the want to nerf him you khow

Its either doing that or removing the paddle cancels

[trim zealot]

I never said I wanted Tom nerfed.

I think he’s perfectly fine as is.

[subtle lotus]

He its if you dont fight him for the first time with someone like superman or jason

I though the same

[trim zealot]

Jason could easily punish up tilt, you know? Machete attacks have mad disjoint.

[subtle lotus]

That its if you mash the up tilt

If you use it on an real 50/50 situation like I said it's impossible

And if you get hit by the paddle

You can't get out

And that's the main reason why people are complaining

[trim zealot]

But heavies should not need to live even longer. Even after reaching 100% I’ve had many who still survive up airs and a couple other moves.

[subtle lotus]

Well it's not about living longer

[trim zealot]

The realistic kill % on heavies is 120% plus.

[subtle lotus]

Its about escaping from an combo

You could use that argument with the iron giant loop back in the day

[trim zealot]

Which means less damage, so why not decrease the damage dealt instead of making it less consistent?

Same nerf, but more fun.

[subtle lotus]

I'm going for doing my adjustment, and the people who complain about him, agree with me or simply add an better attack decay and an system to lock out loops

Like figtherz

[trim zealot]

The system is already there. We can only go for about 3-4 “loops” of our combos at max.

Other characters have decay too. And it’s the only thing stopping Harley Quinn from being the menace she used to be.

[subtle lotus]

I get like 8 rep by game

You khow if you do an same combo over and over the opponent have less hitstun

So you cant do all the time the paddle into jerry shot, down angle

[trim zealot]

Exactly why it doesn’t need to be nerfed.

I have to be creative to make it last longer.

Which means a higher skill ceiling, which is more fun.

[subtle lotus]

Hes not an high skill character like he used to be

[trim zealot]

Better than a lower skill ceiling from a chance to drop a combo.

[subtle lotus]

Atleast if they do my changes, Tom and Jerry will be actually hard, like it should be

[subtle lotus]

Its not lower skill lv

[trim zealot]

What? Most people don’t play them, but if they’re so OP, like the community says they are, why not play them?

They are high skill. Difficult to learn, and to master.

[subtle lotus]

Its not about an chance of dropping your combo

Its your ability to read your opponent wich means more skill

Lower skill ceilings are just doing up tilt into jerry shot wich your opponent can't escape of it

[trim zealot]

That’s the same thing, depending on the amount of hitstun. But even then the average human reaction time comes nowhere close to what would be required to successfully react to the opponents DI.

It’s not realistic to expect us to react to a few frames of info in time to do anything about it.

[subtle lotus]

Idk why your complaining about reading on an platform figthers

Its really common

[trim zealot]

Not in combos it isn’t. Unless you’re Finn for some reason.

[subtle lotus]

It is

For example scythe in brawhalla has no true combos

So its based on full reads

And its one of the best weapons on the game

In smash bros you need to read the di of an character to do an combo

In this one too

Di its super visible and easy to identify

[trim zealot]

That’s brawlhalla. MVS should be different, other characters should, on average, get the same damage as Tom loops from a neutral win. The solution shouldn’t be nerfing Tom, it should be buffing others.

[subtle lotus]

You really need to improve your khowledge on platform figthers tech

Maybe your saying that bc your new on this

I got like 7 years on this

So i cant talk about it

[trim zealot]

Been playing since closed beta, try again.

[subtle lotus]

Platform figthers on general bud

[trim zealot]

Also played smash for years beforehand.

[subtle lotus]

So if your an high ranked smash player

Yo should khow that

So you cant complain about those things

[trim zealot]

Yes I can.

[subtle lotus]

Its lit smth usual

All figthing games have 50/50

[trim zealot]

Not all should though.

[subtle lotus]

If your not good doing it, its not my fault

[trim zealot]

They are not as fun as 100% guaranteed combos.

Games should be fun.

[subtle lotus]

Game should take skill

[trim zealot]

And be fun.

[subtle lotus]

So add 50/50

[trim zealot]

Skills no use if you torment yourself by playing the game.

[subtle lotus]

Bro the paddle its an 50/50 alr

The combo its an 50/50 only on light characters

Theres lit no problem on doing it on heavy characters

As I said

Its either doing that or nerfing the paddle canceling

[trim zealot]

That’s how it should be, it should be 100% guaranteed to work (the combo). But deal less damage because of staling on light characters (smaller hurtboxes).

[subtle lotus]

No.

They wont do an nerf or buff on your benefit

[trim zealot]

Why is that?

[subtle lotus]

No one wants those changes

Even pro players are complaining about it

[trim zealot]

Really? Ask around.

[subtle lotus]

Il just sit here and wait

[trim zealot]

No changes are ideal for us T&J mains, but what do we know?We only play the character more than others.

[subtle lotus]

Everybody wants the paddle to get nerf

I'm not talking about T&J mains

Obviously we want buffs bc its our character

But the combo its simply not fair with some characters

And that it's not balanced in anyway

[trim zealot]

I don’t want T&J buffs. We’re strong enough as is.

[subtle lotus]

Ik, but they will nerf him anyway

You cant have an 0-100% combo with only one archetype of character

That's extremely unfair

[trim zealot]

Why not? Pikachu has those in Smash ultimate, but no one complains about them.

[subtle lotus]

Bc maybe they are diable or smth

[trim zealot]

They aren’t. They are true.

[subtle lotus]

As you said this its not brawhalla, its not smash either bro

People simply don't like that bc its unfair

Maybe the Pikachu thing it's an situational combo

[trim zealot]

Therefore it should be like neither. So a character dealing 100% off of one combo could be the norm.

[subtle lotus]

Im tired of discussing with you

[trim zealot]

No. It can be started from a projectile that travels the whole stage.

[subtle lotus]

Il wait for the buff or nerf idc

Il see what we can do with the balance changes

I hate this community crying about everything

And still winning

But they got an point, its unfair to have those stuff in the game

[trim zealot]

Then stop being part of the problem.

[subtle lotus]

No matters what i say

[trim zealot]

If you have no problem dealing with the combo, then leave it be. You don’t have to be an ambassador for anyone.

[subtle lotus]

This its just an lil chat

With an lil community

People are complaining in every social media about this

Twitter, YouTube, Twitch...

Obviously discord

[trim zealot]

How noble of you, standing up for the masses of social media.

But they are already doing their end.

[subtle lotus]

And I just want pfg to make my changes to keep the character a lil bit nerfed

[trim zealot]

They don’t need you to echo their concerns.

Present your own.

[subtle lotus]

To keep it more balanced and strong than killing the move

[subtle lotus]

I'm alr saying my own they lit want to remove the loop from the game

[trim zealot]

So you want to as well?

[subtle lotus]

I dont want it to be removed, i need it to be unconsitent

Not removing

[subtle lotus]

Ofc i dont, I think you wasn't reading all of my messages

[trim zealot]

Need? Or want? Big difference.

[subtle lotus]

I want it

But it's better to keep it unconsitent than killing it

[summer rivet]

PLAYER FIRST GAMES ‼️‼️‼️ DROP ANOTHER TOM AND JERRY EMOTE 🔥AND MY LIFE IS YOURS ‼️‼️🔥🔥🗣️

[trim zealot]

Phone died.

[drowsy nexus]

Men. I am proud to say....Mission Complete.

(If you've been paying attention to me for the past week you'll understand.)

[ember monolith]

@summer rivet Tom needs a Legendary Skin

[drowsy nexus]

But then I'd have to grind MORE!

[ember monolith]

that's your issue not mine

[drowsy nexus]

Lol cold but harsh reality

[summer rivet]

YOU'RE SO RIGHT

(and different animations for their different skins 💀)

[ember monolith]

I was thinking reskinning both them into Slyvester and Tweety bird from Looney Tunes

or the fencer skins would be cool as well

[summer rivet]

lol that's nice, I can imagine instead of the cheese trap it'll be just bird seed

[ember monolith]

Yea, both duos share the same dynamic anyways

[summer rivet]

The fighter fit T&J more but I can see it tbh

[ember monolith]

I'd feel like reskinning exsisting characters into new ones will make it easier to add more characters

[summer rivet]

I agree but idk if Sylvester and Tweety will fit personality wise if that makes sense 💀

but yeah, PLAYER FIRST GAMES ‼️‼️‼️ GIVE US THE SLYVESTER AND TWEETY SKIN 🔥AND MY LIFE IS YOURS ‼️‼️🔥🔥🗣️

[summer rivet]

That's what they did with Cake and The Batman who laughs tbh

[ember monolith]

That’s what I’m saying, it’s not that far fetched

Also they did that with fern if you wanna count that

[summer rivet]

oh yeah trueee

[summer rivet]

you're so right

speaking of-

PLAYER FIRST GAMES ‼️‼️‼️ GIVE US THE FIONNA SKIN 🔥AND MY LIFE IS YOURS ‼️‼️🔥🔥🗣️

[ember monolith]

the funniest reskin will be turning batman into daffy duck

[trim zealot]

Congratulations. I didn’t think it was possible, even with the extra gleamium from being a returning player.

[summer rivet]

Honestly, I feel like Tom and Jerry need new Team interactions too

My top pick would be Bugs and Rick

lol, like it's Rick confusing Jerry for Jerry and just instigating them into fighting more

[trim zealot]

I can hear it now “oh, sorry, wrong Jerry.”

[summer rivet]

"At least your Jerry is competent"
Or "Atleast your Jerry isn't a weak, snivelling little mouse too, yours is just a mouse"

I could see Rick being a cat person tbh

[summer rivet]

wooo lvl 15

[drifting pollen]

streaming tom and jerry if anyone wants to help me get better

[summer rivet]

sure

[ember monolith]

Watching old Void beta multiversus T&J gameplay makes me wanna go back 😭

[summer rivet]

SAMEEEE

i miss the old mvs but i feel like im sort of getting used to new one

[ember monolith]

I want to get into 1s but 1s is so cancer

and I'm getting burnt out of 2s

[summer rivet]

1s feels so SLOW and campy
like idk if it's because of the increased stock count or maybe the fact that the CAMERA GIVES NO BREATHING ROOM 💀

like poor jerry getting left behind

[ember monolith]

My main complaints are no shield, the 30 frame input buffer, and the infinite wall jump and no grabbing onto the edge

also the camera angle is so zoomed in

[summer rivet]

then at that point it'd just be smash

I rlly love the different recovery style in this game tbh, it's different and unique but still fun in it's own way

[summer rivet]

FOR REAL, it's not even dynamic 😭 it covers my cooldowns and doesn't let me see the stage

[ember monolith]

but that's the point if they wanted no Edge grabbing, shield, etc. They should've kept the movement speed the same in the beta

also team attack needs to be a thing to prevent toxic combos

[summer rivet]

Or preferably just amp it up a couple of notches

maybe

idk

[ember monolith]

as a light character sort of, heavier characters struggle though

[ember monolith]

Multiversus was perfect in beta with the exception of some perks, and the dodge meter being close to infinite

[summer rivet]

maybe up to get out of the paddle range or down

[summer rivet]

I MISS THE OLD PERK SYSTEM SM 😭 my beloved Coffeezilla is gone

also yeah i can see that with the old dodge meter but it felt fair since dodging was a part of movement in the game

np, using low hitting attacks with t&j most of the time work since they're a low to the ground character (also that's how u avoid the paddle in the first place, it only hits up)

[ember monolith]

Yea but perks like the 3 jump perk though it was fun kinda felt broken IMO

[summer rivet]

true true true

i just liked being able to have variety with my options

[ember monolith]

yea, it felt like it catered to more playstyles IMO

but if they wanna keep the slow methodical pace of Multiversus they need to add team attack for 2s, and an increased dodge meter for 1s

because the punishing game on Multiversus is brutal

[summer rivet]

or maybe just add it so that attacks fill the dodge meter (even as it's filling back up)

[ember monolith]

that could work but if you're out of dodges, you're usually the one getting combo'd usually

[summer rivet]

I mean atp, you ran out of dodges, that deserves to get punished

[ember monolith]

when the punish is being 0 to death in some cases, that feels way too fatal IMO

[summer rivet]

if you're at 0 and out of dodges, that's WILD

and like attacking helps fill up the dodge bar, but it'll still refill passively ig

if you're just dodging and not attacking that should be punished that way yk?

[ember monolith]

maybe if they added tilts to the game I'd feel better with that

[summer rivet]

i feel like getting out of the mindset that this is smash bros might help

[ember monolith]

Then they should've left Beta the way it was

it's so tilting to be punished due to limited options when dealing with attacks

[summer rivet]

Give Jerry a taunt and a idle animation

that's my number 1 idea

[summer rivet]

im ngl, i didnt like the models at first but the more i look at them the more i get used to them

like the render is GODLY and the models are meh in comparison but the models are mostly cute

like jerry is so derpy looking sometimes

[drifting pollen]

Real stuff tho I be playing ranked and I swear I see the same 3 characters like their wasn’t a whole roaster they can pick from

[trim zealot]

They technically have an idle animation. If you stand still for a bit Tom grabs Jerry, but that’s about it.

[summer rivet]

yk, something that happens when he's left alone for too long yk?

[trim zealot]

Yeah. I’m thinking the only reason we don’t already have that is so WB can tell PFG to make those into taunts which you would need gleamium for.

Like how we used to have the toe hurt taunt as the base taunt, but in the “full” release the base taunt is the handshake animation from the character select screen.

[odd wadi]

Sleepy taunt

[trim zealot]

That’s new, but yeah, it would be perfect for an idle animation.

[summer rivet]

I just had an idea, what if when Tom and Jerry got rung out
They return on the respawn platform damaged, bruised, or even beated out of shape? 💀

that seems fun, and it can be unique sometimes depending on who rung them out cause they don't have any ringout voicelines

[odd wadi]

Yeah it's just Tom with two or three different screams. It sounds like you really want visible player damage which would be cool. I know 100% I'd not use it but I'm sure people would like it

[summer rivet]

not visible player damage, but it's just when tom and jerry are on the platform
and when they drop down they're normal again

[odd wadi]

Oh okay gotcha. You ever play that t&j house game where you gotta knock the other out with traps and weapons?

Top tier game

[summer rivet]

no i dont think i did tbh, Multiversus is probably the only playable Tom and Jerry I've played

[summer rivet]

amazing

[odd wadi]

Oh okay. It was a ps1 or ps2 game but I had the time of my life on that game

[primal tangle]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1177052180306464819/1257761951610699928/maxresdefault.png?ex=66bd9d59&is=66bc4bd9&hm=cd4a049bd66e33d4842a6d81ac69a274db8a418ea09ee82104f45618132ecfc3&

this?

[odd wadi]

https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/wvee9l/did_anyone_else_have_the_pleasure_of_playing_tom/

This one

[primal tangle]

ah. I haven't tried this one tbh

[odd wadi]

It's good if you got an emulator I recommend.

[tardy scaffold]

Finally learning Tom & Jerry for the first time (I have like 6 other variants of them lol)

[odd wadi]

Welcome 🙏

[tardy scaffold]

I have no idea what some of these moves are though lol

Fishing pole in particular

[odd wadi]

It lost some control going from beta to now but just throw it out in casuals until you get more comfy with it

[tardy scaffold]

Ah

Okay then

[odd wadi]

I only say that because I used to lovvvvve it. In the closed beta and such but it feels different now but still good. You can skip to the end to see the one example I know is here
#clips message

And mute to avoid my controller noises

If you hold it forward it'll go further, hold it in the direction you wanna go. It's not as free as before but it's still got some good control to it. I like to throw it at the floor in front of me sometimes when people wanna rush me down but it's risky because it might not go right in front of you but that might be me having sloppy inputs

[tardy scaffold]

Interesting

Thanks for the advice

[odd wadi]

I love trying to help no problem. It was my favorite move and it has really good kill power if you hit the sweet spot. It has a weird sound to it you'll know it when you hit it. I think you wanna hit the actual hook part and if you have Jerry it does even more. Good luck

[tardy scaffold]

I just think Tom & Jerry are cute characters who have probably one of the most creative movesets in the game

[odd wadi]

Honestly it feels like if you can imagine it you can do it. While having Jerry out if you use the rocket you can use it defensively too instead of always offensively to mess up the enemy approach. Tennis balls can be hit back and forth and if you're fast enough you can racket Jerry into different directions and reflect all projectiles that aren't heavy. (No giant shaggy sandwich)

[worldly stone]

Can someone train me?

Im losing every time in 1v1

Any tip?

[odd wadi]

send a clip of your best game or one you felt you did good

that'll help

[worldly stone]

Sure

Can't post here

Can I send to you?

[odd wadi]

you can post it in clips then copy the message and send that here

long as you're okay with others giving "advice" or seeing it

[summer rivet]

i think that too fr

[subtle lotus]

Omg guys

Ajax saw my balance changes

I think maybe I save T&J, made the best that i can

This will keep the charactef skillfull and almost the same

#wishlist-discussion message

[subtle lotus]

This its my balance changes to T&J

#wishlist-discussion message

[subtle lotus]

And this its Ajax response🥳

[stoic schooner]

THERES NOTHING WRONG WITH THE PADDLE

IF YOU CONSTANTLY GET HIT BY IT ITS ON YOU NOT US

MY BRAIN HURTS READING THAT

THAT'S LIKE SAYING T&J IS OP DUE TO THEY LOST TO THEM

ARE PEOPLE THAT SCARED OF MU EXP?

OUR BIGGEST WEAKNESS IS LOSING JERRY AND OUR LIGHTWEIGHT

THERES NO REASON NERFING THE PADDLE

[subtle lotus]

Its not about that stupid

The paddle its an true combo on heavy characters

[stoic schooner]

NO?

[subtle lotus]

And an 50/50 on heavy characters so I fix that

[subtle lotus]

Yes it is

You cant escape atleast your at 100%

[stoic schooner]

THATS THE POINT OF HEAVY CHARACTERS THEIR STRONG BUT THEIR COMBO FOOD

[subtle lotus]

No bro

You cant just do that

That's super unfair

[stoic schooner]

IN WHAT UNIVERSE THEY SHOULD NERF IT

[subtle lotus]

Its not even an huge nerf

It will keep almost the same

[stoic schooner]

OH IM SORRY I WANT TO HAVE A GOOD COMBO TOOL

[subtle lotus]

I did some buffs

[stoic schooner]

DOES DI SCARE PEOPLE THAT MUCH?

[subtle lotus]

To give him more combo routes

[subtle lotus]

Its impossible to di with heavy characters the paddle

Their hitbox and his gravity pulls them back to the paddle

[stoic schooner]

DHDIDHDJEHDRJBRRJRBR THATS THE POINT THEIR COMBO FOOD AND TANK DAMAGE

[subtle lotus]

Atleast you leave them at 100%

[subtle lotus]

Bro you cant just do that

In any figthing game its approved having an if you get hit you die character

[stoic schooner]

MY BROTHER IN CHRIST I CAN BEAT A T&J WITH JASON

[subtle lotus]

For example the Gun guy in guilty gear strive, was an touch of death machine and they nerfed him

[subtle lotus]

Maybe his bad

So bad

I'm at masters

And its lit impossible for an jason to win an good T&J

They can di but it's so easy to follow the di of heavy characters

That can be said that its an true combo

Almost an true combo

Like 80/20

[stoic schooner]

... Anyone can win with any character they even said they wanted to keep their identity

[subtle lotus]

That will keep the identity

In the first place paddle by himself its an 50/50 move on di

So i dont see the problem

And pfg was going to eliminate the paddle cancels tbh so i made my changes to stop it

[stoic schooner]

OH WERE SORRY WE WANT AN GOOD COMBO MOVE I MIGHT DROP THEM IF THEY MAKE THAT DECISION AND GO BACK TO BUGS

[subtle lotus]

Bro your crying so much bro

The combo will keep the same

Its an lil adjustment to keep people happy

So they have an chance to win

And made buffs for a lot of combo routes for him

[stoic schooner]

BC PEOPLE ARE SCARED OF PATIENCE

[subtle lotus]

What you want me to do bro

[stoic schooner]

READING THIS IS MAKING MY BRAIN SCREAM

[subtle lotus]

They are super mad

I got to save T&J after they kill him

[stoic schooner]

WELL THATS ON THEN

[subtle lotus]

This its the better alternative

[stoic schooner]

THEIR GONNA KILL THEM ANYWAY BC PEOPLE ARE CRYING ABOUT THEM BC THEY LOST TO THEM

[subtle lotus]

You need to read all of my post

[subtle lotus]

If they do my changes, the paddle combo will keep the same but a lil bit less spamable

Like you need to think to do it

Not spam it all the game

[stoic schooner]

We need to COMBO WITH IT

[subtle lotus]

And instead I gave more jab combos

And more combo routes

Even more jerru startup window

And speed

See my changes here:

[stoic schooner]

THE STARTUP IS FINE

[subtle lotus]

Excuse me Ajax, but I was checking twitter and you said about you could tell your ideas for the game so this its mine, also sry for the ping idk if its smth that cant be done or not, so if it is pls forgive me
T&J Nerfs:
Paddle:
Explanations:
T&J felt into paddle spam into the ground bounce jerry shot, so the main problem its that with light characters its smth like an 50/50 but with heavy weight characters its more like an true combo, so to make this move less spamable and consistent, i make the following changes:

Paddle its more easy to escape and the di on certain
character has been adjusted to make them escape easily so now it's an real 50/50, not an 80/20.

Paddle:
If Paddle whiff's the Tom and jerry no longer has the ability to cancel the paddle and escape.

Paddle:
If the T&J whiff's the paddle it wont pull you back, so the hitbox of the paddle will be at the top of the paddle.

Buff:
Explanations:
So after making T&J paddle unconsitent and overall and high risk move, we are giving T&J more combo routes with better frame data, so now you could jab 3 into jerry shot, jab 1 into jerry shot, and also true on Di.

Jab 2 and 3, startup window increased.

Dash attack startup window increased.

Jerry startup frames increased.

Jerry speed while in the air increased.

Up special in the ground(with jerry), now can cancel the animation by jumping or doing the racket so you can redirect the rocket with jerry, also buffing the speed with the racket hit.

T&J tennis balls now refreshes when you get jerry from the ground, like corks.

And yeah i hope you see my changes bc Tom and Jerry its not that good if you eliminate the ability to cancel his paddle, so i make these solution.

Ajax if you read all of my message, i really appreciate it, so if you could share this with nakat would be even better, I want to khow your thoughs, thx and have an good day

Read all the changes

[stoic schooner]

THEIRS NOTHING WRONG WITH THEM

[subtle lotus]

And you will see that its not that bad

And he its even better than before

I just made the paddle less spammy to avoid people getting mad

[stoic schooner]

I SWEAR IF THEY KILL T&J BC PEOPLE ARE THAT SCARED OF MU EXP IM GONNA BE SO ANGRY

[subtle lotus]

Ajax alr respond my message so I hope they do my balance changes

Would be so good

[stoic schooner]

no

[subtle lotus]

Bro crying so much for the paddle its such skill issue

When you play T&J, you do other thing that its not paddle loop?

I'm giving him more compensations

[worldly stone]

Hi, is it good to use the fishing rod for recover, in fall damage?

[subtle lotus]

And the paddle string its still there

[stoic schooner]

THE PADDLE IS A GOOD COMBO MOVE OFC WERE GONNA USE IT

[subtle lotus]

Yea but not spam it

[subtle lotus]

You can use the paddle and the combo with my nerfs and it's the same

Just less spammy

So you got to think about it

[stoic schooner]

WERE NOT SPAMMING IT WE ARE USING IT AS A COMBO MOVE

[subtle lotus]

Read all of the message first bro

[stoic schooner]

I DID IT DOESNT MAKE IT ANY SENEE

[subtle lotus]

Doesn't make any sense?

Bro you need to be an silver or gold bro

Paddle its not your unique move in the game

I said the combo will keep the same

The paddle its the same

[stoic schooner]

WHO ON GODS GREEN EARTH USES THAT

[subtle lotus]

Just less spammy

The paddle its the same move

I made it less spammy ad more an 50/50, dodge read option

Like it should be at the first place

And I compensate you with Jerry speed increased

Even jab 3, jerry shot true combo

[stoic schooner]

ITS A COMBO MOVE WE COMBO WITH IT DOES THAT GO THROUGH YOUR IGNORANT BRAIN

[acoustic belfry]

https://images.app.goo.gl/GQCYtyzcUMr4Bcf7A

[subtle lotus]

Yea its an combo move that you spam a million times even if you fail

[stoic schooner]

IF WE MISS IT WE ARE EXPOSED

[acoustic belfry]

Guys, since you're talking about retro Tom and jerry games, have you tried this one?

[subtle lotus]

Your not

You can cancel the paddle

That's the main problem

That's what I fixed

[stoic schooner]

NO IF WE MISS IT WE CANT CANCEL IT

[subtle lotus]

The paddle string its lit the same

[subtle lotus]

Now I see with more reasons that you don't khow how to play the character

[stoic schooner]

RICH COMING FROM YOU

[subtle lotus]

I'm not an bronze noob

I alr played T&J for 400 hours

[stoic schooner]

i honestly don't care

Who cares about your rank

Honestly

No one cares

[subtle lotus]

Bro who cares about your skill

Honestly

[stoic schooner]

😐

[subtle lotus]

Your lit crying about my paddle nerfs

Bc thsts the only move that you use

Lit jerry by himself its better than the paddle

And I didnt do that much to the paddle

I SAID THAT ITS THE SAME COMBO

AND THE SAME MOVE

[stoic schooner]

ik how to play the character ive played them in the beta

[subtle lotus]

PADDLE WILL KEEP THE SAME BUT LESS SPAMMY

YOU CAN GET PUNISH IF YOU FAIL

So you cant cancel it

[stoic schooner]

THATS ALREADY IN THE GAME

[subtle lotus]

Bro you can cancel the paddle

[stoic schooner]

AM I TALKING TO A BRICK WALL?

[subtle lotus]

By jumping if you whiff

Or dodging

If you whiff the paddle you can still cancel it

So that's why I'm making that change

And you can cancel it even with moves, like DA, jab whatever you want

Paddle its an cancelable move on whiff or not

So that need an nerf

Bc in first place it's not supossed to be cancelable if you whiff

So you cant get punish at all

[stoic schooner]

YOU CANT CANCEL IT YOUR STUCK

IF YOU MISS IT

[subtle lotus]

Bro seriously you think that

Bruh

[subtle lotus]

If you miss it you can cancel it

Go to training

[stoic schooner]

YOU CANT CANCEL IT IF YOU MISS IT

[subtle lotus]

So now your going to spam the same argument if its in the game

You can cancel the paddle anytime on whiff

[stoic schooner]

ITS NOT IN THE GAME

[subtle lotus]

Go to training mode

And prove it

[stoic schooner]

IT DOESN T WORK

YOU CANT CANCEL IT IF YOU MISS IT

[subtle lotus]

Incredible, you dont khow how to play him

You can ask to anyone here

[stoic schooner]

READ THE DMS

[subtle lotus]

Bro

You can cancel the paddle on whiff

[stoic schooner]

...

[stoic schooner]

No

[subtle lotus]

By jumping

Or dodging

I do it in all my games

[stoic schooner]

I SENT YOU A VIDEO

[subtle lotus]

If I whiff

You didnt jump

Or dodge

While you was at the animation

You did paddle then jump

🤦‍♂️

[stoic schooner]

... YOU CANT CANCEL IT IF YOU MISS IT

[subtle lotus]

When im free il send you an clip

Its really stupid that you didn't khow that but ok

[stoic schooner]

Master rank pfft

[subtle lotus]

Bro dont you dare to say me that

It will be super satisfying how stupid you will look when i show the paddle cancel on whiff

Also bc you dont khow how to do it

I'm not stupid, you don't khow everything in the world

[stoic schooner]

😭nahh bro got offended

At a rank placement

[subtle lotus]

Pfft I was annoyed on that

Let me finish of working

[stoic schooner]

Rich coming from you

[subtle lotus]

Then il send you an tutorial how to do it

[subtle lotus]

Your not even at an higher rank to told me what can be done with my character

If I manage to get this far, I alr discovered all of his tools

I almost get an new tech on him

[stoic schooner]

💀 bros discriminating at ranks

[subtle lotus]

But idk how to get it consistently

[subtle lotus]

Tell me smth that idk about him

You dont khow how to cancel the paddle

On whiff

[stoic schooner]

BC YOU CANT

[subtle lotus]

Ypu can

[stoic schooner]

No?

[subtle lotus]

You can bruh

Yes

[stoic schooner]

You really cant

[subtle lotus]

I need to work, I promise when I'm free il send you the clip

[subtle lotus]

You can, but you need to mash it, on the third hit

You can't cancel it, like for some frames but then you got the option to do it

If you fully charge the paddle and then mash dodge away you can cancel the animation

[stoic schooner]

YOU CANT CANCEL IT MASTER RANK NAHH

[subtle lotus]

Oh god

What i get if i show you that you can cancel the paddle

That your stupid and talk nonsense or smth?

[stoic schooner]

...

[subtle lotus]

I can't play right now

But il search in my clips

If i get an match when i do it

Yea I alr got it

Got the clip

Il send it to you stupid, trash talker

[stoic schooner]

Really? You hit the paddle you didnt miss it

[subtle lotus]

I didnt

I was to far of the jack

Ofc I miss it

I send you the clip

You can do it, with fully charge paddle to cancel it if you miss it

Its at the end

Don't try to change the things and lie

So yeah you can cancel the paddle on whiff so that needs an nerf

I think you can cancel it into moves, but i dont remember, Il check it later

I want the ability to cancel the up special animation with jerry at the ground to hit with the racket the rocket

Someone khows how to do it

Idk how to cancel that animation

Its strange

[subtle lotus]

If you want to lie atleast do it with smth convincent, I send you the clip its at the last part, I cancel the paddle when I was far away of the jack lol

@stoic schooner you khow what bro, forgive me I was really mad, but there you go we all learn new things 🙂

Also sry, for calling you an idiot, you was very annoying but yeah forgive me it's ok

I understand

And you didn't have to change your name and identity

[stoic schooner]

I didnt like my old one tbh

[subtle lotus]

I liked the yoshi one most

Its ok bud

I'm just sitting here very sad, for my nerf bc of this toxic community

Bye bye Tom and Jerry, I really love this character

Lets see how betlejuice would be

[stoic schooner]

Your droppint them?

[stoic schooner]

What yoshi one

[subtle lotus]

Im not dropping I got since day 1 using it

I think il try to discover new combos and see if its usable

[stoic schooner]

Well its either life or death for us mid season patch is upon us

[simple hamlet]

(Happy chaos)

[odd wadi]

I feel this hard. I Main both but it annoys the hell out of me because of that. Even if I DI correctly it won't matter unless they mess up.

[stoic schooner]

We need to talk about the mid season patch

[subtle lotus]

Yep

Ajax alr saw my changes for T&J

So i hope he do my changes instead of killing it

#wishlist-discussion message

This are my balance changes btw

T&J Nerfs:
Paddle:
Explanations:
T&J felt into paddle spam into the ground bounce jerry shot, so the main problem its that with light characters its smth like an 50/50 but with heavy weight characters its more like an true combo, so to make this move less spamable and consistent, i make the following changes:

Paddle its more easy to escape and the di on certain
character has been adjusted to make them escape easily so now it's an real 50/50, not an 80/20.

Paddle:
If Paddle whiff's the Tom and jerry no longer has the ability to cancel the paddle and escape.

Paddle:
If the T&J whiff's the paddle it wont pull you back, so the hitbox of the paddle will be at the top of the paddle.

Buff:
Explanations:
So after making T&J paddle unconsitent and overall and high risk move, we are giving T&J more combo routes with better frame data, so now you could jab 3 into jerry shot, jab 1 into jerry shot, and also true on Di.

Jab 2 and 3, startup window increased.

Dash attack startup window increased.

Jerry startup frames increased.

Jerry speed while in the air increased.

Up special in the ground(with jerry), now can cancel the animation by jumping or doing the racket so you can redirect the rocket with jerry, also buffing the speed with the racket hit.

T&J tennis balls now refreshes when you get jerry from the ground, like corks.

And yeah i hope you see my changes bc Tom and Jerry its not that good if you eliminate the ability to cancel his paddle, so i make these solution.

[odd wadi]

Not sure why they ever removed hitting ground up special with racket

[sturdy yarrow]

Why more startup on dash attack it sucks

[odd wadi]

Startup windows I think means it starts sooner

Wait I read that wrong

Idk I'm lost 😂

[sturdy yarrow]

Same with jab 2 and 3 Tom has the worst jab in the game no need to make it even worse

Also Jerryshot is his best move again why make it slower

[odd wadi]

I wouldn't agree with that but it won't matter for me

[subtle lotus]

Oh it's less startup I think

[subtle lotus]

Its an buff

I mean less startup

[hidden verge]

Oh my yap

[subtle lotus]

Idk to much about frame data tbh

[stoic schooner]

And the opp can fall out of the jab if the opp isnt playing a big character

Plus the pan needs more kill power off stage

Or am i wrong

[subtle lotus]

Pan its broken off stage

You could iad into down air

Its broken bc of his hitbox

[stoic schooner]

Tom needs more Dynamite when he using Dynamite split it will give him more stage control

[subtle lotus]

Idk its to weird

[subtle lotus]

Yea

Maybe less cooldown

[stoic schooner]

Im tryna figure out the IAD

My tech arsenal isnt great

[subtle lotus]

Ok keep practicing

[stoic schooner]

Does anyone have a tech guides DM me if you have one

[odd wadi]

Okay so I do follow

[tawdry panther]

Tom and Jerry need a Sylvester and Tweety skin.

https://tenor.com/view/tweety-bird-looney-tunes-gif-26997238

[subtle lotus]

Prestige store 100k skin

[drifting pollen]

anyone know the loop or so that can watch my stream or join call and help me out

[ember monolith]

I already like the Defualt and Pirates skin but I'd cop that skin instantly

[sturdy yarrow]

Just give us the cowboy skin already it's been teased since the beta

[daring fable]

Thank you guys for being chill
I just played tennis with a tom and jerry as taz

[formal bane]

Any good Tom and Jerry’s want to team up in ranked tomorrow add me on Multiversus or pm me and I’ll get back to you tomorrow I’m a iron giant plat 2 really could use the help getting to masters my friend kind of shafted me after I got him to masters😓 so I need Good teammate and daily Multiverse partner

[daring fable]

#clips message

[primal tangle]

if they actually add the tennis balls refresh to tom it's gonn be so broken XD

infinite projectiles

[trim zealot]

I’ve tried convincing them as well. I don’t understand why they insist on such a specific nerf, but it’s not worth getting heated over. Unless T&J actually get hit with such a nerf, only then can we crucify them for this campaign against our up tilt.

[stoic schooner]

Yea is one of our best Combo moves

Im just tired of people complaining about it

[odd wadi]

Yes and there's a perk for it to be even better at recovery though I don't recommend

[odd wadi]

Show me shiii I don't think I knew

[subtle lotus]

Damm those messages are old lol

Yeah I can show you smth

So you can paddle your rocket

I learn how to do it

So when your doing your rocket with jerry

All your going to do its press dodge and neutral attack at the same time

[odd wadi]

[subtle lotus]

Also ijust discover that you can cancel the animation on an exact frame

To do whatever you want

Like paddle canceling

Il send you some clips

[odd wadi]

So does it do an immediate racket swing?

[subtle lotus]

No

It wont work

When you do up special with jerry

The rocket

When the animations of the rocket its complete

And its launching

Do an neutral dodgd

Dodge, and that will cancel the animation of the controller

So you can paddle the rocket

[odd wadi]

Is the direction it flies set?

[subtle lotus]

I need to send you an clip

To you understand

Its not that hard

[odd wadi]

I can wait

[subtle lotus]

Ok i alr send it

@odd wadi so what do you thing about it?

[odd wadi]

Where did you send?

[subtle lotus]

To your dm

But i can't send it to you

Il put it on clip channel

[odd wadi]

I don't think you sent it to me

[subtle lotus]

Idk you don't receive it

I send it on clip channel

@odd wadi check the clip channel

[odd wadi]

This is good

You've answered my prayers with tech

[subtle lotus]

Np, il always help my T&J mains

But tbh im so decept about the new T&J players, spamming paddle, that should get an nerf

But an lil one

To make it less spammy

I'm tired😑

When I use other character besides T&J and I get matchaked by one

Lit unga bunga paddle spam

[odd wadi]

I don't like that they spam it either

They're such a cool character that you can be super creative with and they've been widdled down to. I spam paddle and trash can lids

[subtle lotus]

I think I got an new one that no one have discovered but im not getting it consistently

[odd wadi]

[subtle lotus]

Il tell you if I manage to get it more consistently then il teach it to my T&J mains

Also i will be reviewing the mid season patch changes for T&J and looking for Combo routes and etc

[odd wadi]

Doing the work of the heavens

I'm glad we have you and not the superman or black adams

[formal bane]

Any Tom and Jerry mains want to team up in 2v2 I’m an iron giant plat 2 NA

[vital hedge]

Infinite Combo is broken af

[hidden verge]

Cry harder bum

[odd wadi]

Why are you temp tom and jerry main

[hidden verge]

Because he’s fun

I don’t abuse his loop

You just suck

He’s one of the lightest characters in the game

[odd wadi]

Lol well why be a temporary main if you like playing them?

[hidden verge]

Oh no

My user

Is Temp_Rot

[odd wadi]

Ohhhhh

[hidden verge]

And I main TnJ

Top 100 TnJ

[odd wadi]

Cool cool.

[primal tangle]

you might wanna add a separator, or a comma

[odd wadi]

I'm like 800 or something I play Jason most of the time and I'm trying to learn velma.

With Jason I'm top 200 though. 277 as of yesterday but probably back in 300 now

[trim zealot]

“Np Il always help my T&J mains”. Please share. I would like something new to lab on this character.

[hidden verge]

Still

[trim zealot]

You want to know too?

[subtle lotus]

I post an new tech and I share it with courage

Yeah i love this character, but im very upset with the people using it

All its paddle spam, paddle needs some lil adjustment to stop being an spammable move

Like just an lil bit

[hidden verge]

Still

[trim zealot]

Is that a yes or no? If you have already posted it, would you mind @ me on another. The clips/combo chats get filled quickly.

I only use paddle to whiff punish, so if you have any objections because of what you assume is my playstyle, I don’t spam it, I just use it to punish missed aerials.

[subtle lotus]

Im not talking about your play style

I was talking about T&J on general

But sure dont worry

Il explain you here how to do it

[formal bane]

Any Tom and Jerry mains want to team up with a iron giant

Na plat 2

[hidden verge]

Chat I got 1-3ed in a ranked match by a joker while playing TnJ bro made me get off my phone won both games 3-1 is that a W he also sent hate messages🤣 he spammed salt had to lock in

[stoic schooner]

Stand proud and throw him into the salt mines to cry about it

[cunning basin]

🤝

[tardy scaffold]

They are very fun to play

But they are extremely claustrophobic in Free For Alls

[odd wadi]

big W

[hidden verge]

Gamers

Look at my clip in #clips

[worldly stone]

Thx

Can someone train me with Tom and Jerry?

I think im good

I always win

But when a Samurai Jack or Jason appers

<:)

[latent thicket]

Jason is t&j's best mu

I don't see how t&j can lose that without being skill diffed

[tardy scaffold]

I'm not good at all with Tom & Jerry, but every once in a while, everything comes together and I destroy my opponents

When the Fishing Pole gets a KO from all the way from the left blast zone to the middle of the stage 🙏

[stoic schooner]

Same with IG

[trim zealot]

If you rely on fishing rod to kill, i recommend practicing some kill confirms. The 2 most simple I can recommend are down air> up air, and up tilt> up air. For up tilt> up air, you have to cancel the move on the 4th (final when uncharged) hit instead of the 3rd.

At some %s you can also do up tilt> down air> up air. This one you will need to cancel up tilt on the 3rd hit.

[tardy scaffold]

You can cancel the paddle ball?

[trim zealot]

During or after the third hit, yes.

Into a jump, grounded attack, dodge, or special.

[worldly stone]

Can you?

[tardy scaffold]

Neat

[trim zealot]

It’s integral to most of our combo routes. Just don’t get into the habit of using up tilt too recklessly, since it cannot be canceled if the move misses.

[latent thicket]

Can I what

[subtle lotus]

So bc of this new tech

The paddle loops are not true

And now requires reading

[subtle lotus]

Guys we got no loops now

We will get buff

[drowsy nexus]

Ehhh I can see a nerf to paddle still

[primal tangle]

u can still loop big characters twice

[subtle lotus]

Nope

You cant

Now the ground bounce have an mechanic when you can just dodge

[subtle lotus]

Nah, paddle wont get any change, that was the main problem

Only 1

You cant cancel the paddle if you whiff

[primal tangle]

you can after 2 ground bounces

if u use paddle into dtilt slingshot u can do it twice in a row before they can tech

[subtle lotus]

They can dodge it anyway

[drowsy nexus]

Paddle would still be strong I think because you can still scoop people up and do dair into up air

[primal tangle]

I am not sure about the loop numbers, but I think doing it twice before they can dodge is at least 35-40 no?

[subtle lotus]

Down air with paddle its super unconsistent so that's not an problem

[subtle lotus]

Its does like 20-25 dmg

[primal tangle]

hoping this nerf will bring tom n jerry winrates down so we can receive buffs on other aspects of the character.

[worldly stone]

Show me TJ combos

Or better perks

[latent thicket]

Perks I use that's flammable doc, speed for assist and pugilist

T&j doesn't really have too many combo differentiations

I'd just learn how to do down angle jerry shot after paddle and dair and you should be good enough

[trim zealot]

That was kind of a soft cap on most characters before anyways, so I’m pretty happy with it if it’s true. Those combos still do a lot of damage.

It’s kinda funny, Gogeta has nothing but complaints about this change even thought it is far better than what they had in mind prior.

In addition, if this is universal, most characters will not have to worry about having infinites, or overly long loops anymore, unless they don’t involve bounces’ extending of hitstun.

[valid star]

i swear did they get rid of tj's ability to reflect projectiles at an angle?

every time i try and angle it it never works

[ember monolith]

for tennis balls and corks no, I don't know about other projectiles though

[sturdy yarrow]

Nah you can hit jerry rocket at an angle also RIP Jerry loop

[stoic schooner]

We can still hit it just pray that it misses

The tech

[sturdy yarrow]

The tech is automatic

You can hold left or right to tech in a direction if not you tech in place

[stoic schooner]

God damit

[ember monolith]

it's a broken loop to be fair especially on Jason, and Superman

[sturdy yarrow]

Oh absolutely I just hope they have given him something else because the loop is pretty much all he has

[winged viper]

how do I do the loop 😄

[primal tangle]

mash jump

infinite loops got 3-4h left on them being a thing anyways.

[odd wadi]

Had one of y'all try to loop me while I was Jason yesterday. You earned that Teabag L

[stoic schooner]

Who was he called?

[odd wadi]

I'd have to check my history

I didn't get any cool kills on him so I probably didn't save or screenshot anything

[worldly stone]

Sometimes they kill Jerry with one hit

How I can stay with Tom?

[latent thicket]

When jerry is out,most of the time you're protecting jerry

By either using rocket or tennis balls or your boxing tools

[winged viper]

I need to get tom to gold before the patch tho!!!

[primal tangle]

wait u said do not get out of the loop. just try paddle into dtilt slingshot on the third paddle hit

that's when u can cancel it into other moves

[winged viper]

oh alright ty

[full glen]

Not how that works but ok

[ember monolith]

Loops are still possible brah

[subtle lotus]

Im talking about the new patch tech

Well they alr added some tech to escape the loops of superman and T&J

So they wont nerf the paddle and that things you khow

[ember monolith]

ground bounce combos are broken to be fair

[subtle lotus]

Bro they did an stream yesterday nerfing all the groundbounce tech

And combos

We got no inf

Now we need to read after 2 groundbounce

[full glen]

Oh no boo hoo we have to read give us buffs

[subtle lotus]

Oh yeah

[full glen]

As if there’s nit a ton of characters that gotta read and don’t get the same value as T&J bounces anyway

[ember monolith]

he's saying that because that was Tom's only good combo

[full glen]

He’s got plenty of value outside of it imo

[subtle lotus]

I think il buy betlejuice instantly

And check the changes with T&J

[ember monolith]

I don't think any nerfs can get me off of Bugs and T&J

[subtle lotus]

Besides the Paddle Jerry shot up to 100% combos, theres jab 3 into dtilt that can be di at higher percent and the jab 1 into dtilt

Tom and Jerry dont need any nerf tbh

After they reveal that tech they indirectly nerf him

[ember monolith]

I think paddle needs to be nerfed with buffing his Side Air or Nair

but yea he's pretty balanced

[subtle lotus]

No

[subtle lotus]

That's pretty stupid to say

We need to keep the paddle the same

But with better hitbox

And no whiff canceling

That's all

[ember monolith]

you just made a change to it

and paddle is a nightmare for bigger characters

[cyan whale]

Even some medium sized characters really struggle to get out

Honestly, I just want more T&J players to actually use the moves in his kit with Jerry shot setups, dynamite plays, etc instead of just being paddle loop bots

[ember monolith]

THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING

they should nerf it, and buff side air or nair

[cyan whale]

I play T&J as my third most played character and I don’t use paddle loops because they’re cheap and don’t actually help learn the game

[subtle lotus]

That's an nerf to the hitbox bro, and an adjust to the di on heavy and medium characters

And yeah that's it

[ember monolith]

dog, that's still a nerf

[subtle lotus]

Yep

But we need like an very lil one

To keep the game fair

Big characters can't lit play the game

[cyan whale]

Honestly, I’ve noticed with a few characters that you can’t even jab punish T&J while they’re stuck in paddle because the hitbox is a lot lower than you’d expect and it hits you before your jab hitbox comes out

[ember monolith]

Playing both as and against Tom his paddle is annoying to deal with

[unkempt sinew]

It is character dependent but most characters have some other way to punish, usually with their dash attack or down attack. Unless you're like... Jason or Giant

[sturdy yarrow]

I'm happy for them to do away with the loop just as long as they give is stuff back the loop is the only combo he has

[ember monolith]

anyone else figure out how to use the Launch from the Rocket Blast viable

[trim zealot]

The only hit of paddle I’ve been consistently able to hit grounded opponents (who aren’t massive like Jason or IG) is the last one, I think it just has a larger hitbox than the rest, excluding the scoop at the start of the move.

That’s not accounting for any hurtbox shifting during attacks though. It’s going to be character dependent. Basically, just punish with armor, disjoints, and projectiles.

Most characters have at least 1 of those.

Besides, it’s not like trading is very punishing for anyone to try against us. Tom loses like 9/10 trades between bad frame data on melee attacks, and poor disjoint, if any.

[cyan whale]

Shaggy jab loses 9/10 times when trying to punish paddle because he sticks his hand out before the hitbox begins and gets caught by the multihits

And his only armor attack without rage is neutral attack which is way too slow to punish paddle because T&J can just walk away and avoid it

[subtle lotus]

Well no changes

They indirectly nerfed our loops and superman got his nerfs too so yeah keep him the same its ok

[sturdy yarrow]

Tom survives although the higher blast zones are a direct nerf to our kill power considering Rocket and up air are our best kill moves

[ember monolith]

you're actin like it ain't effecting others either 💀

[cyan whale]

No you’re misreading the patch notes. It doesn’t affect you if you’re in hitstun. It’s if you jump close to the blast zone to try and save dodges. Previously, you’d just explode if you touched the blast zone after jumping, but they’ve added a separate “grace zone” where you can be in the blast zone after jumping but not immediately die

I’ve seen this multiple times from people who tried to jump to escape a follow up hit and just died because they were too close to the top blast zone

It’s kinda funny when it happens, but it’s also pretty frustrating

[sturdy yarrow]

Ahhhh OK fair enough we are goof then

I'm feeling charged cork is gonna be really good for tech chase situations

[storm smelt]

Did they just nerf the infinite with the new ground tech change?

[ember monolith]

yes

[storm smelt]

Unfortunate

[trim zealot]

It was never an infinite, but yes. It’s still a good combo though.

[odd wadi]

Fortunate is the word you're looking for

Didn't want my main nerfed or butchered over that

Though you can still use it to start some nice combos anyway

[ember monolith]

Tom has more than that loop you know

[storm smelt]

I don’t think I ever implied that was all he had lol

[ember monolith]

then why would it be unfortunate?

[storm smelt]

Because he lost a useful tool? I don’t think I even implied anything near like that he was unplayable or something because he lost it 💀

[odd wadi]

He'd have gotten a paddle nerf or a pan nerf or slingshot nerf to remove that it needed to go.

[primal tangle]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1271408995013230592/1275506794852122624/image.png?ex=66c623c5&is=66c4d245&hm=996bf2437a43140b226c04c603c7554f2f9963c5581e1cec97a2bb91b8fa9dca&

lmao what's this?

[ember monolith]

Yea idk why they gave Jerry's bottle a buff

[tacit isle]

corks fly weirdly low now

slide on the ground almost

[primal tangle]

yeah it does

the gravity grabs it lower much faster than before

[odd wadi]

???

[ember monolith]

it's a joke

[odd wadi]

noted

[ember monolith]

it was PFG's way of showing where Jerry was off screen lol

[open crypt]

Good lord PFG this is a family game for christ sake

[drifting pollen]

I mean the loop was one of the best things he got

[cyan whale]

Can Jerry still fire corks mid air?

After Jerry shot

[ember monolith]

yes

[trim zealot]

We still have shorter versions of the combo. The only concern I have is how competitive we are with Rick, Morty, and especially Arya now. Those characters have weird animations while being hit which makes said combo much harder to perform on them. Otherwise, most of our matchups are pretty much the same.

We also still have (in my opinion) the best projectiles in the game, second only to Bugs’ safe.

It’s probably a good thing we lost the “loop” because with all the whining about it before, I was worried we’d catch a worse nerf than just having the combos shortened.

So now there’s a decent chance we might get some projectile buffs.

[valid star]

Did official patch notes ever drop

[ember monolith]

yes

[drifting pollen]

Well to me it wasn’t the easiest to land which just might be a skill issue for me but it’s how I racked damage if I did manage to hit ik theirs other ways but like it feels like 3 hits from some other characters and I have taken so much more damage

[ember monolith]

https://multiversus.com/en/news/1-2-2-mid-season-patch-notes