Shaggy

[frozen geyser]

Jake sair

Velma megaphone

All from beta of course

Alpha Taz nado

Actually, that one is probably the best

[merry kiln]

superman was an S for at least 95% of the game

[frozen geyser]

It reflected projectiles

[frozen geyser]

I personally thought he was closer to A+

But he was insane for sure

[merry kiln]

number one in eu and na was a superman for at least 70% of the game

with wave dashing, all the armor and movement I think he was an easy S

[frozen geyser]

Idk if I ever made a tier list for beta MVS

I must’ve at some point

Yeah, I don’t have a full tier list saved anywhere

[dusk geyser]

I think I've pulled it off mainly around low percents, getting to mid it gets finicky.

I check clips a lot for your combos, I been trying to use Shaggy a lot more offstage.

Started holding my 2nd air special after seeing your stuff. Reactively I used to go for Jab 1,2 > Utilt > Uspecial > and try to go for another cheesy Uspecial but people are expecting it now.

What they don't expect is a side kick afterwards : p least in my elo

[frozen geyser]

Jab 1,2 stomp dash attack is one I’m using more

[dusk geyser]

do you know what percent it falls off around?

[frozen geyser]

No

I think it depends on how stale stomp is tho

[dusk geyser]

is reverse utilt combo out completely now with the last patch?

[frozen geyser]

I think so

[dusk geyser]

I never got a chance to learn it because I felt like it was gonna be patched asap

[frozen geyser]

I haven’t downloaded it yet because I’m still at work, but that was a change they directly stated in the call

[dusk geyser]

was the same with jab 1 2 nair

neat : >

[frozen geyser]

I feel like the jab 1,2 nair loop was a bit different

If nair was stale, it was an infinite

The jab 1,2 utilt up b was just a consistent confirm at 60-80 depending on character weight but requires a DI read at higher percents

I thought if anything they’d nerf it, not remove it

[merry kiln]

any amount of weakened or over 100, it sometimes works after that as well

[merry kiln]

uptilt into up special? you can still do it but it’s useless when it does no knockback

[dusk geyser]

might be nice to use as just a mixup

guh, my sf and tekken days are long over if I cannot even do a simple reverse utilt anymore.
Gettin old 😔

[frozen geyser]

How bad is the aerial up b knockback nerf?

[merry kiln]

there’s no point in using it unless in a read

it feels like beta up special

if that makes sense

[dusk geyser]

is it still kill confirm at 100 and over?

[frozen geyser]

Wait wait

[merry kiln]

ground up special was not touched

[dusk geyser]

neat

[frozen geyser]

I just realized this might make airwalker insane now

He might still have some confirms that kill stupidly early with that because grounded up b wasn’t touched

Might need to experiment

[hearty sedge]

Didn't they screw over air walker perk in this patch by accident?

[merry kiln]

up tilt has less knockback there’s no point in going for airwalker

less hitstun too

you’re better off tickling them

[hearty sedge]

When they gut characters they gotta buff another part of their kit to atleast try to shape the character in a different direction.

[frozen geyser]

Can you combo anything out of it?

I’d hope at least uair

[merry kiln]

it's the same

[haughty cobalt]

Huge Shaggy buff: he has red pants now

[merry kiln]

how's shaggy going for y'all?

I'm out here getting matched up with g3 in asia 😄

[dusk geyser]

Is there a lot of players in asia? I'm assuming matchmaking will be against ppl closer to you before it branches out to the west

[merry kiln]

no they're mostly new but it's clearly not working out

everyone's teleporting lmao

[haughty cobalt]

Why does our up air suck so bad 😭

[dusk geyser]

can we not juggle and fastfall with it no more? I used to do that a bit if they were low percent and out of dodge meter

[haughty cobalt]

if out of dodge meter, sure

it also feels like our sair got some hitstun or same move lockout increased cuz I can't hit g. up attack -> sair -> dodge jump sair any more

[merry kiln]

everyone's teleporting and my jabs keep falling off

I think they're trying some sort of new netcode

[bleak roost]

just noticed shaggy's pants are actually red now

[dusk geyser]

its the hemorrhoids

[merry kiln]

y'all shaggy might be below top 10 now.. 💔

[dusk geyser]

long as I get shark hat shaggy I ain't mad

[prisma skiff]

Shaggy still in the top 10 I think, we still got combos, and jab 1 2, up special always gonna be a solid kill confirm

Certain matchups def got a lot tougher now that we can’t kill them at 40 though

[bleak roost]

i got murdered by a shaggy 7 0

definitely not below man

[placid kettle]

Hangry man got a huge nerf wow

[glad marten]

Shagworthy having a unique spawn animation is cool

Unless Shaggy just has a new animation in general

[deft viper]

also a new win one

very cool, he deserved it

[cursive field]

Shaggy FEELS FUN AGAIN

I feel like beta shaggy a little

[glad marten]

Does he? Is he finally not crunchy?

[cursive field]

I been just comboing and getting conversions of dodge reads that actually feel good.

[frozen geyser]

Beta Shaggy be like: stomp

[cursive field]

I say beta as in he feels fluid

I’m happy I don’t kill at 60 anymore

[frozen geyser]

I know what you mean

[cursive field]

I stopped playing him cause u didn’t have to work for kill and he felt janky

[frozen geyser]

I’m still not a fan of harming his combo game over the sake of one OP confirm

[cursive field]

Yeah he’s still crazy but he has to at least work now

What’s wrong with his combos

He’s great

Jab12 reverse uptilt up air into dodge read maybe nair side special

I can freestyle with him

[frozen geyser]

Utilt was a pretty big combo extender than doesn’t reliably combo anymore into anything besides uair

[cursive field]

That’s cool

That’s actually great

He still gets amazing stuff out of dodge read

[frozen geyser]

Dude everyone has good stuff out of a dodge read

[cursive field]

I like him like that

Yeah but nair covers stupid amount of options

So it’s 70/30

Can’t even call it a read

[frozen geyser]

I don’t think any options cover jump except the guaranteed uair

Which is just some extra damage I guess

So at least it’s something

[cursive field]

Shaggy combo game is fine right here

He shouldn’t be getting no more buff

[frozen geyser]

I mean, his combos that don’t involve utilt are still intact

So like it’s not the end of the world sort of speak

But like his jab is way worse now because he can’t jab into aerials and jab into utilt has hardly any guaranteed damage

At least he still has jab jab up b as a kill confirm at 100

120 against tanks

[cursive field]

I’ve seen u in this sub since beta

[frozen geyser]

And at least he keeps the mid percent jab jab stomp dash attack

[cursive field]

When I tell u. Ur takes blow my mind😂😂

What more do u want

60 dmg confirms??

Like bro

[frozen geyser]

I’m not asking for 60+ damage confirms

[cursive field]

He has super Saiyan, sand which can play around many matchups

[frozen geyser]

I’m asking for more than 25 damage confirms

And then nerf his kill power

[cursive field]

He actually doesn’t need it cause his knockback automatically puts him in advantage state

Against opponents

[frozen geyser]

I don’t mind the aerial up b nerf because it kinda was OP

[cursive field]

Bro his kill power already nerfed

He’s good

He dont need more combos jus play around with him more

[frozen geyser]

I mean I agree with what they nerfed just not how they nerfed it

Aerial up b nerf is good

Utilt nerf is misguided

[cursive field]

I swear if he got anything of uptilt like dair we would be in a dark place

[frozen geyser]

Personally, I would’ve drastically lowered the knockback scaling of utilt instead so it retains its combo ability without sending too close to the top blast zone for cheesy kills

[frozen geyser]

Dair got a massive hitstun nerf compared to beta, so it’s unusable at low percents

[cursive field]

Ngl

Thank god u not a dev

[frozen geyser]

It’s more of a mid percent combo tool

[merry kiln]

can’t really approach people who run away with projectiles anymore

[cursive field]

@merry kiln u must of never played beta shaggy

Projectiles always were hard

[frozen geyser]

I’ll bet you were a Batman downplayer in beta

[cursive field]

I was a Batman hater

[merry kiln]

was #2 global actually

[cursive field]

I only played Batman after 3rd nerf

Or 2nd

[merry kiln]

dodge movement made it so nothing was impossible for shaggy

[cursive field]

I didn’t play shaggy on re release he was too broken

I just picked shaggy back up after this nerf to play fr

[frozen geyser]

No no no

Iron Giant was too broken on rerelease

[merry kiln]

knight in shining armor

[frozen geyser]

Shaggy was just a bit overtuned

[cursive field]

Fax I felt like Captain falcon back then I miss it

[frozen geyser]

I’m not really a fan of the sair change

[cursive field]

Same

[frozen geyser]

It was cooler in beta when it was a combo starter

[cursive field]

I miss when sair combo

[frozen geyser]

Now it’s literally just Falcon knee

[merry kiln]

sair into nair into sair was a zero to death offstage

[cursive field]

😂

[merry kiln]

a lot easier to read in the beta too

[frozen geyser]

Wow Hangry Man is useless now

[glad marten]

MultiVersus is healing

Anyways, @frozen geyser how do you think combo game could be improved? Longer hit stun? Faster attacks? Less endlag?

[frozen geyser]

Lower knockback scaling with the same hitstun

If extended combos are a problem, nerf the damage

[frozen geyser]

Alright, I finally decided to get the Shazam ringout

I was holding out for if they potentially added a Shaggy skin in the prestige shop, but I doubt they will for a little while and I can always get more prestige points

[glad marten]

I doubt we'll be seeing many more Shaggy skins tbh

Especially not one they think is good enough for prestige store

[frozen geyser]

Unfortunately yeah

I will say the buffer and deadzone options are nice tho

It finally doesn’t feel like I’m making 16 successive misinputs if I press one wrong button

[glad marten]

Deadzone options were always there werent they?

I dont think those ever got removed

Unless they've been changed

[frozen geyser]

I thought they said they added an additional deadzone for right stick

Unless I’m mistaken

[glad marten]

Maybe they have

They might have

Now that Shaggy doesnt have utilt, does he have any real combos?

[frozen geyser]

I just checked and they directly mentioned it as an added feature in their patch notes

[frozen geyser]

He can still combo utilt into uair

But uair has no follow ups, so that ends the combo

He can still do jab jab stomp dash attack

I killed with that because my opponent wasn’t ready to DI dash attack and died at like 100 post hit

But that combo will never kill with good DI

It stops being true at the point where dash attack would kill

Hangry Man nerf is really really bad tho

I get it definitely needed to be nerfed

But not this much

It went from giving Shaggy a half second charge to only taking off a half second

I wanna say full rage charge is like 4 seconds and Hangry Man is like 3.5

Maybe 3 but I doubt it

This means that Shaggy likely now loses to Finn again

Because Hangry Man was the only thing keeping Shaggy from losing the matchup

[glad marten]

Man Shaggy got gutted hard
Is he really super carried by his specials killing way too early?

[frozen geyser]

Yeah

But instead of buffing his combo ability to make up for losing kill power, they nerfed it

Shaggy isn’t bad, but he’s certainly not an S tier

[glad marten]

Pfg please save Shaggy 🙏

Please stop making a game for noobs that just mash buttons 🙏

Give characters a skill factor 🙏

[frozen geyser]

Certain characters do

Just not Shaggy

But that’s ok because he’s designed to be easy to pick up and play

I think the real issue is that the characters that are harder to play with a much higher skill floor are just notably weaker than the easier characters

Rick and T&J being the two biggest examples

[willow beacon]

I mean great for you my guy, but I think we ain't never getting that BETA Shaggy power again

[glad marten]

This Shaggy is actually debatably stronger

Just not as fun

[willow beacon]

Fair point yeah

Are his charged attacks at least still brutal, like the knee and the charged fist?

[glad marten]

They hit like a truck

For no reason

[merry kiln]

y'all I just beat wxvyy 3-0 but I had no idea who they were before that game

[waxen pine]

That’s huge LFG

[glad marten]

Is wxvyy an Arya player?

[dusk geyser]

still no shark hat shaggy

[cursive field]

Are u serious after this balance patch Tom and Jerry is probably S. The top tiers got really nerfed and they were already sleeper.

[frozen geyser]

Idk like in theory they seem like top tiers, but I haven’t seen it in practice at all

Not even VoiD thinks they’re top tier

And I don’t think he downplays his own characters like Nakat

[cursive field]

Well I’ve seen someone get top 8 pre patch in stacked tourney

I can only imagine how well they’ll do now

[glad marten]

I hate Nakat for that

WW got zero nerfs because of him

[cursive field]

WW still got loops bro

[frozen geyser]

Yeah I’m sorry but a 5 second cooldown nerf to her armor is not enough

She’s still top 3 minimum

[cursive field]

Its impossible to take away her sauce

Lasso, nair,

Realistically nair is what makes everything combo

[glad marten]

Joker and WW were 2 of the only 3 characters where they openly acknowledged they're busted and they didn't do anything meaningful to them with the one major patch for the next 2 god damn months

[dusk geyser]

community managers should not have input on balance changes

Especially if they participate in streams and tournies

[cursive field]

She can never be bad unless nair is bad

[glad marten]

Its like they dont even care about balancing

[cursive field]

WW will never not bet top tier unless they rework nair someone will always find something

[frozen geyser]

I mean, at least Joker side b x3 uair zero to death is gone

[glad marten]

One of many

[frozen geyser]

But that doesn’t stop the fact that he’s still top tier

[cursive field]

Joker still has ladders

And on certain stages still 0 to death

[frozen geyser]

Oh I’m aware

[glad marten]

Yeah he has 0td routes still they didnt fix him

Bad dev team

[cursive field]

I read the patch notes thinking life was good

[frozen geyser]

They only did half the job

[cursive field]

Bro everything was below expectations

[frozen geyser]

Dude even with the buff to Velma, the stealth nerfed the range on her megaphone

And didn’t list it on the patch notes

[cursive field]

Is no one talking about how they straight up buffed taz??

[glad marten]

PFG hates success and a happy playerbase

They love failure and a dead game

[frozen geyser]

Dude Taz players have been the biggest downplayers ever

[dusk geyser]

I don't understand the Taz buff... he was already strong

[frozen geyser]

I can’t believe they got him buffed

[cursive field]

Taz don’t need nothing

[frozen geyser]

Literally every Taz player says he’s low tier

[cursive field]

Bro some characters have 0 counter play to him

Unless u have projectile

U can’t counter tornado

And his scramble is OD edge guard

[frozen geyser]

Even tho he has a top 5 win rate with insane combo game and kill power

[dusk geyser]

My tin foil hat theory is that these characters either got some major upcoming skins or they're being used in upcoming tournaments that have cash prizes.

[glad marten]

Reindog has had roughly the highest wr since Iron Giants removal

[frozen geyser]

The only real nerf to Taz was the neutral attack angle change stopping the infinite if you DI up

[cursive field]

As I’m hating I just got shark hat taz😭😭😭

[frozen geyser]

No one plays Reindog tho

[glad marten]

Fair enough

[frozen geyser]

Generally, the lower the pick rate, the better the players on average because all the bad ones swap off

Reindog isn’t broken. His playerbase is just good

[cursive field]

Yep Ive still beat every top reindog tho

[frozen geyser]

I mean, Reindog still is a mid character

[cursive field]

True

They only beat people who are impatient

[frozen geyser]

But his playerbase actually knows how to play the game and not just spam like a lot of popular characters

[cursive field]

Cause they camp and zone all game

[frozen geyser]

Yeah

[frozen geyser]

I will say tho regarding Taz is that apparently they broke his anvil perk and you just can’t pick up his anvil anymore for some reason

[merry kiln]

how do you guys deal with marvin?

[frozen geyser]

You don’t

I don’t think I’ve beaten a single good Marvin

[glad marten]

"This character is killing too early, how can we fix this?"
"Lower the knockback on his kill moves?"
"Good but not enough, he needs to stay overpowered for casuals."
"Gut his only combo?"
"Perfect, oughta give you a promotion!"
Player First Games balancing team discussing Shaggy, probably

[dusk geyser]

time to protest outside of PFG HQ to bring back Shaggy combos. I'll get a plane ticket and pack some sandwiches we can throw

[willow beacon]

Fr bro, gotta read every damn move my opponent does

[frozen geyser]

Alright, we definitely lose to Finn now with the Hangry Man nerf

[glad marten]

Everyone loses to Finn

[willow beacon]

They really didn't need to nerf it that hard imo

[frozen geyser]

Yeah I said like a half second nerf would be fine

But they nerfed it like 2 whole seconds or more

[merry kiln]

give it the old duration but give it a 15 or 20 second cooldown

[frozen geyser]

Honestly, that’s a better idea

But probably more like 20-30 seconds tbh

[merry kiln]

30 seconds since it lasts 30 seconds

[frozen geyser]

Oh is there actually a timer on rage?

[glad marten]

Yeah its really long though

[glad marten]

I think it's currently at the same speed as beta base charge

[frozen geyser]

Aka not practical to use

[glad marten]

Mqke it beta hangry man

[merry kiln]

nobody used hangry man in the beta

it takes the same time as the normal charge with getting a sandwich out in mind

[frozen geyser]

I’d argue that beta Hangry Man is better than Hangry Man now because at least in beta you could hold onto sandwich indefinitely

[merry kiln]

that’s a fact, not much to argue with

[willow beacon]

I don't get why we can't attack with the sandwich in hand anymore, I get not spawning with one but having to throw it instantly I just don't

[dusk geyser]

like spike's dynamite and harley's batbomb for some reason they don't want you holding onto items indefinitely to trip up the other opponent.

which doesn't make that much sense since things like batarang, garnet gauntlets, etc. are held indefinitely until the opponent decides to throw it out

[frozen geyser]

No, they changed Harley’s bat bomb to be like sandwich

In this update

[orchid wave]

Ok can we just recognize that shaggy is dead

Like

What the hell do we have

Utilt is nigh worthless

Dtilt is hard to get use out of

Our starters no longer have extenders

Like am I the only one seeing these as titanic nerfs or something

[glad marten]

Still probably the best kill power in the game

Everyone will still die to Shaggy at 80% at latest

[orchid wave]

Utilt jump shoryu got gutted so I’d hardly agree with that

[glad marten]

But they'll nerf that too and conpletely gut him

[glad marten]

Up b kills early still

Sair hits like a truck still

He's still strong

Just on the edge of being bad

[orchid wave]

Nah he is

Like

His whole thing is getting in, doing a big combo, and then killing you off the next interaction

Now he can’t even do that

I genuinely don’t see him having a gameplan now

[glad marten]

It would be cool if the devs listened to community input or something and buffed his combo game at the expense of kill power

[frozen geyser]

No that’s probably Taz

Or Jason

[glad marten]

Top 3 at worst

Still pretty strong

[frozen geyser]

Jason with fixed hitboxes from the 2 hours he was available was apparently significantly better

[orchid wave]

Genuinely what is shaggy supposed to do atp

[glad marten]

Hit two attacks and then run away

[frozen geyser]

But then he had a bug where he could cancel his grounded up b to stick the opponent to him

[glad marten]

Nair > sair is sometimes true

Dair > nair is true every once in a while

Dair > sair is usually true

Jab 1,2 > anything always works

Maybe jab 1,2 > IAD dair > sair might work

[frozen geyser]

We still have jab 1,2 -> dtilt -> dash attack

But it’ll never kill with good DI

[glad marten]

I cna never get dtilt hitting

Even buffering it

They always have a dodge window

[frozen geyser]

It’s a mid to higher percent combo

Around like 50%

Works from like 50-90 give or take

[merry kiln]

reads

[orchid wave]

EVERY CHARACTER HAS THAT

[frozen geyser]

If they DI in, jab 1,2 -> dtilt -> sair is true and kills at around 90 ish

[orchid wave]

Like legit the one thing we have rn is just super

[glad marten]

BG does it better

BG really is just a better Shaggy atp

[frozen geyser]

Yeah but he’s more bland

[merry kiln]

you never get the chance to completely nair someone and when you do by the time you notice it hit you can't really think of anything other than a jab

[glad marten]

You humans will never compare to me

[frozen geyser]

Zypten robot confirmed

[merry kiln]

that is true because I don't think anyone can comprehend why you decide to troll the way you do

[glad marten]

I never troll everything I say should be taken at face value as a 100% genuine statement

[orchid wave]

“Shaggy’s kill power is too high, losing to him can feel like it’s coming out of nowhere, so we killed his combo game so now losing to him feels even more random.”

-PFG

I genuinely cannot fathom the reason behind almost any of the changes made to shaggy throughout the full release besides exactly getting rid of jab Nair loops

[glad marten]

"What if we gut everything that made Shaggy fun and in return we make him a super strong noobkiller so casuals keep whining and we keep nerfing him?"

[orchid wave]

Genuinely

He’s like Little Mac if Little Mac had potential to be cool

[prisma skiff]

just got 65th in the thousand year blood war tournament out of 587 going all shaggy

think hes still good just requires way more reads and has some god awful matchups

[orchid wave]

Good work fellow Zoinker

[prisma skiff]

im considering picking up rick for gizmo arya and iron giant rn

[dusk geyser]

how do you do against finns?

[prisma skiff]

but idk anything about rick just seems like it would be easier

[prisma skiff]

im really unsure but i think its maybe +1 finn, its not too bad but if finn is able to get started its rough

i try to just space dairs in nuetral on him

im also a massive sandwich user which helps a lot, most finns try and side special through sandwich so it makes a great bait

also landing against finn is hell but thats not really shaggy exclusive

[orchid wave]

https://x.com/sirstack_/status/1568059716563001346?s=46&t=HeK4jRmu_qUh5mu-yTpFYw

I didn’t know how good I had it

[frozen geyser]

I’ve been playing Rick myself and he seems pretty decent. I’m probably gonna use him against Marvin from my experience playing that matchup

Marvin is pretty rough for Shaggy especially with his one blaster shot that has armor break completely negating Shaggy’s rage specials

It doesn’t have a purple effect, so it either counts as a grab or does a double hit

But Rick’s gun shoots very slightly above Marvin’s own blaster but still low enough to hit is head

So you can actually counter-zone him

[frozen geyser]

It went from like +1 to -2 for Shaggy because of the Hangry Man nerf imo

Anytime Finn charged grounded attacks, you could get free rage

It was so huge in the matchup imo

[prisma skiff]

Oh yeah I will say I wasn’t using hangry man in any 1s matchups pre patch anyways, so I was not aware of the benefits

I just platform camped him lmao

[frozen geyser]

Now Hangry Man sucks, so we’re back to just getting hard outranged

Finn has more range and a better combo game than us now…

[prisma skiff]

Yeah that’s currently the story of shaggys life, a good Arya is actually just uninteractable

[frozen geyser]

Like dude what was PFG smoking with some of the changes on this patch

[prisma skiff]

Outranges by almost everyone 🥲

[frozen geyser]

Unfortunately Rick doesn’t seem like he wins against Finn

That matchup seems pretty rough but at least you can portal out of disadvantage to avoid the cheesy up b setups if you run out of dodges

He does better than Shaggy for sure tho

[glad marten]

Unironically does Shaggy have the ability to do well at high level? Good players aren't just going to let kill moves hit them and Shaggy can only deal like 12-20 damage per interaction while everyone else is capable of 30-40 at least

[prisma skiff]

I’ll keep rocking shaggy for Finn it honestly doesn’t feel the worst but he’s probably the character I have the most mu experience against too, as well as not having the opportunity to fight the top Finn’s aside from 1 or 2 of them

[frozen geyser]

Shaggy isn’t bad, but he’s definitely not top tier

He only has a few matchups that are truly abysmal

[glad marten]

He feels really bad and playing against anyone that isn't brain dead is really challenging

[prisma skiff]

The classic combo into upspecial is still true from about 10%-50% btw, just gotta read di

That’s a nice chunk of damage

[glad marten]

I get hit and take 40 damage, I hit them and deal 12 damage and then my "combo" just ends there

[prisma skiff]

And I’m really just killing with sair or jab jab upspecial at like 90

[frozen geyser]

Marvin, Finn, Joker, WW, and Morty are all pretty bad

[glad marten]

Jab 2 > reverse utilt > up b? Because that doesn't work

Utilt doesn't have the hitstun

[frozen geyser]

It technically still works, but the percent window is very very small

[prisma skiff]

Yeah it’s true in those ranges still

Learned it from tamunokoro

[frozen geyser]

It’s like a 20% window compared to the like 50% window

[prisma skiff]

I just steal all his tech fr

[frozen geyser]

So I guess it’s not very small

[frozen geyser]

Here’s something to steal from Jenette: jab 1,2 -> stomp -> dash attack

Mid percent combo that works from like 40-80

[glad marten]

So you can hit it one time per stock unless you used any other attack before it?

[frozen geyser]

With bad DI at ledge, it kills

[prisma skiff]

I’ve heard that combo before but thought it was just super early percents, 40-80 is a great range actually

[frozen geyser]

I caught a Finn with dash jab and he died at 80 to that combo because his DI was awful

[frozen geyser]

Depending on how they DI the stomp, you can get sair at high percents

[prisma skiff]

I mean it’s like 40ish % (can’t fully remember) and shaggy really only need to get people to 90-100 most of the time

[prisma skiff]

Oh that’s amazing

[frozen geyser]

So like on Dexter’s with its high ceiling, you can go for jab jab stomp sair at like 90 if they DI in at ledge

If they DI out, you get nothing tho

[prisma skiff]

Di out puts them in a rough situation probably atleast, which is nice

At ledge ofc

[frozen geyser]

Yeah

The percent window range is shifted higher for heavy characters tho

[dusk geyser]

still no shark hat shaggy...

im cryin peein poopin in the club rn

[frozen geyser]

I got him on day 2

But there’s way more than 8 shark hat characters

So idk how we’re supposed to get the others

[dusk geyser]

How many days are left?

I gotta go home and pray I get him tonight

[frozen geyser]

Tomorrow is day 8

[dusk geyser]

The fact that he keeps his glasses on if he doesn't die is enough to motivate me to get the skin

[frozen geyser]

Yeah it’s a nice touch

Other characters don’t get sunglasses

[dusk geyser]

I was super carried by up special. My win rate dropped down to 30% 🫣

[frozen geyser]

Yikes

[dusk geyser]

sat at a good 80% before

[frozen geyser]

I was carried by utilt combos

Jab jab reverse utilt up b can still work, but it’s a very small percent window

[dusk geyser]

I had a feeling it'd be nerfed so I never bothered to learn it.

I really don't know what I should do during neutral other than sandwich spam. I feel like his dash cancel punch uses too much meter to justify getting a small combo off

[frozen geyser]

The nerf to Hangry Man is extremely detrimental in a handful of matchups

Like it definitely should’ve been nerfed

But not by this much

Hangry Man was the only thing saving us from losing the Finn matchup

Now we get bodied

Finn has better combos and more range

[dusk geyser]

I'm sure they'll bring him up eventually because Shaggy is PFGs baby.

But if they're only doing 1 midseason patch per season then Shaggy is gonna be in a bad state for a looooooong time.

[frozen geyser]

I mean, the season ends at the end of July

If Shaggy is worse for a month, that’s ok

[dusk geyser]

😔 what characters do you enjoy playing other than him?

[frozen geyser]

You can thankfully still get a lot off of reads

[frozen geyser]

I’ve been playing a lot of Rick recently

[dusk geyser]

ooooh I been lookin at Rick too. Beta Rick left a permanent scar in my brain

Overall Garnet seems to have what I currently want in a fighter. But they nerfed her combo game last patch too.

Might just be maining Jason when he returns and Samurai Jack when he gets released until Shaggy gets a bit more love

[frozen geyser]

Jason is a lot of fun

He was fun even when he was awful

But the hitbox buffs I’ve heard were huge before he was removed

[dusk geyser]

All I wanted was the fixes to his machete but they did a lot more than I thought they would 👀

so thats nice

[frozen geyser]

Well most of his combos were incredibly inconsistent because his hitboxes don’t match his animations

Jab 1 was the worst offender

[dusk geyser]

I didn't get to try him before he went back in the box lol

My biggest serotonin with him was whenever I'd face a Bugs and they'd jump to the other side of the safe not expecting the Axe grab.

[frozen geyser]

But I’ve been rotating between Shaggy, Batman, Jason, Taz, Iron Giant, Stripe, Rick, and Superman

[dusk geyser]

Superman got a nice 0-60% rn

[frozen geyser]

Yeah and that’s the move that caused him to be removed

You could dodge out of his axe grab and your opponent would get stuck to you

[merry kiln]

love when I beat anyone with shaggy and they call me awful

[frozen geyser]

Then you just mash on them and finish with any grab that then brings them out of the glitched state and kills them

[dusk geyser]

and people still calling for ranked with bugs like this still out lol

[merry kiln]

it’s a shame no one is brave enough to admit they got beaten

[frozen geyser]

If you gimmicked me and then declined rematch, you’re not good

If you beat me in BO3 without fishing for gimmick cheese the whole game, you’re better

Simple as that

[merry kiln]

can’t really cheese with shaggy

[frozen geyser]

Not anymore

[dusk geyser]

Is the asian playerbase getting any better?

[merry kiln]

I don’t go against asians anymore

after the patch it’s been putting me against everyone everywhere

oce na and eu

[frozen geyser]

Wack

I’ve been noticing a lot of laggier matches this patch

I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s because I’m playing with EU and Asia

[merry kiln]

they mostly teleport but with certain people in eu and na it feels pretty good

[dusk geyser]

wack

Guess matchmaking takes priority for connection stability over any form of mmr or region specific matches

[frozen geyser]

If that were the case, I wouldn’t get laggy matches while in NA

2v2 and FFA I can understand lag and teleporting

But not 1v1

[dusk geyser]

maybe complete rng and im looking too much into it lmao

[frozen geyser]

I think something broke with the regional matchmaking and it’s more lax than it should be

[merry kiln]

you’re na?

most of the more popular people I played against didn’t feel anything, it was all just me fighting teleporting demons

[frozen geyser]

Yeah

Maybe it was just a bad time to be playing but for me like every 5th game has people teleporting

2v2 and FFA still have that one guy randomly disconnect and then the game just keeps going as they’re stuck endlessly running into the blast zone

[merry kiln]

I haven’t tried ffa yet but the game is getting very boring and time consuming for me

[dusk geyser]

might be good for a break time

[merry kiln]

I said I was gonna try ranked before I uninstall it completely but really I just feel like I should do it sooner

[frozen geyser]

I haven’t really been playing as much either

Mainly just completing some daily challenges in rifts

I’m at like 14/20 rifts for unlocking Agent Smith

But rifts can get a little stale after a while

[dusk geyser]

I cannot bring myself to play PVE. Expectations were too high thinking it would be like Subspace Emissary.

should've known with more characters being introduced each season it'd be toned down

least the cinematic teasers are crisp

[haughty cobalt]

I've done up to insanity on all rifts but surf's up, so I could be at 15/20 and I haven't played megalodog, so potentially 18/20 until Agent Smith rift
I just need to actually do them haha

[merry kiln]

I’m on 4 lmao

seriously cba

[frozen geyser]

It’s still better than World of Light in Smash Ultimate

[dusk geyser]

gru

tru

[glad marten]

You're not

They give us some free skins and then we get the luxury of buying the rest

[frozen geyser]

Oof

Well, at least I got Shaggy

[dusk geyser]

finally.
100,000 premium saved

I am ready for the Shaggy skin whenever it drops

[frozen geyser]

I bit the bullet and figured we wouldn’t be getting a Shaggy skin in the prestige shop for a while

So I got the Shazam ringout instead

[dusk geyser]

nice! Yeah probably won't get it for a while but I'm probably gonna take a break until something big like ranked comes.

Play every once and a while so I don't burn myself out. Just nice to know I don't gotta worry about prestige points whenever they decide to work on his prestige skin

[frozen geyser]

I’m hoping more characters than just Joker and Harley get prestige skins

[dusk geyser]

Next up seems to be Rick. He got the best designed costumes at the moment

like 2-3 good ones

[frozen geyser]

The Sargent/Commando Rick skin seems pretty cool

[dusk geyser]

ngl I'm drooling over the Crow one

and the mecha was leaked for a while now

[frozen geyser]

Oh, I haven’t seen any of the leaked skins for anyone

[dusk geyser]

it's on either subreddit, can't link here because rules : (

[glad marten]

Not happening

Shaggy has a matrix code skin and thats all

Thats his final skin

[dusk geyser]

Rick, Superman, Taz, and Stripe seem to be getting the most love for upcoming skins

[dusk geyser]

damn 😔 time to strike PFG HQ

[glad marten]

Yeah what Shaggy has now is what he gets

[dusk geyser]

imma still hold onto my copium that he'll get something for S2

If not then least I got premium/gleamium for garnet future skin whenever they decide to dish that out

[glad marten]

What would they even give him?

He has a Chuck Norris and Bruce Lee skin so mene fighters aren't available options, he's got Shagworthy so alt characters are dead, he got NOTHING

Shaggy cosmetics are DEAD

[frozen geyser]

Goku skin

It’s so obvious

Shaggy with a gi and spiky hair that changes color when he has rage

And we could still get a green tier red shirt Shaggy

[dusk geyser]

Man they gave Taz a dress and 90s hiphop fashion.

They can pretty much slap anything on Shaggy

Do a Shaggy Yakuza skin with a suit and a dragon tattoo when he uses the emote to rip his shirt off

Could do Cyberpunk Shaggy, they already got some skins for Rick and Morty in that style comin out

His model isn't intrusive so the possibilities are endless

[glad marten]

Pretty sure R&M have skins in that style from the show though

[glad marten]

I can smell the copyright claims

[glad marten]

This would actually be really fire ngl

[dusk geyser]

PFG make me your skin ideas guy and I'll give the cast some good costumes 👌🏻

Velma would only get Mindy skin tho

[frozen geyser]

You can turn Lars in Tekken into a Goku-look-a-like so I don’t see how it would be an issue as long as it still looks like Shaggy

[dusk geyser]

Mecha Shaggy that gets little thrusters on his side kick and uppercut. Thrusters flare out more when it's a raged special

[half current]

When and why does shaggy lose his glasses for his shark hat variation

[frozen geyser]

He has his glasses for his first stock. If you get rung out, he loses them for the rest of the match

[dusk geyser]

on the 8th day of Sharkweek PFG gave to me..

1 Shark Hat Steven

I am going to uninstall I s2g 😭

this only further solidifies my hatred for this stupid little space rock kid

I hope Connie realizes she can do way better

[frozen geyser]

Isn’t there another shark week skin for one of the events?

The daily missions one

[glad marten]

Cant wait for the devs to nerf Shaggys kill power and make him the worst character in the game

Hes so bad now

[dusk geyser]

i did not know...

[frozen geyser]

I mean, you can check to see what skin is the final reward

I thought it was another shark hat skin, but I could be wrong

[half current]

That’s so dumb

his shark hat + glasses is easily his best variation and to take that away is silly

[frozen geyser]

Think of it this way: you’re rewarded for not dying

[half current]

I think it’s a silly premise to believe that in a competitive scenario you won’t die atleast once

[dusk geyser]

Found out why I lost the Arya matchup frequently. Shaggy's Jab 2 hitbox is bugged against her. Thought I was trippin

https://www.reddit.com/r/MultiVersusTheGame/s/HbHbAwNvtf

When she reels her head back after Jab 1 the Jab 2 will miss lmao

[frozen geyser]

I’ll be honest, I think it’s more likely a bug

[frozen geyser]

Yikes

[glad marten]

Great game with no bugs and incredible balancing

[merry kiln]

I thought my jabs were falling off because of the new teleporting connection technology

[merry kiln]

no one shows up in the match and it disconnects now, what's new with y'all game?

I'm actually uninstalling

[glad marten]

The games dead, hope this helps!

More than half my recent matches have been bot matches

And matchmaking is taking 30+ seconds

The game died so fast

[severe dragon]

Which perk is better for shaggy now since hangry man is nerfed, olz or 5%? Or would running hangry man still be the better option.

[glad marten]

Hangry is fine but its not broken, I prefer OLZ

[severe dragon]

its better than both in 1v1s and 2v2s right now right?

[glad marten]

Maybe idk

I dont play Shaggy a ton anymore

He's so ass

[severe dragon]

IMO olz is better than both in ffa

[severe dragon]

thats true

[merry kiln]

5%

[severe dragon]

oh ok

olz is better in ffa tho, right?

[glad marten]

FFA is a crappy mode based on whoever hits the last attack on each kill

FFA has no skill factor or strategies

[glad marten]

Why do you think 5%?

[severe dragon]

thats true but its unique so I play it sometimes.

[merry kiln]

kills early, that's all

for example someone that would die at 125 would die at 100 with it

[glad marten]

There's no way thats true

[merry kiln]

it is lol

[glad marten]

Give me VIDEO EVIDENCE of this TOMFOOLERY

[merry kiln]

video evidence is TK :3

[dusk geyser]

Zypten allergic to TK tho

[haughty cobalt]

Can confirm, I'm an allergy

[dusk geyser]

hey do the PokemonGo dance

[merry kiln]

tk called me best shaggy my multiversus life is complete

[glad marten]

I want actual comparisons

He only runs 5%

I cant use him to verify anything at all

[merry kiln]

I have lab videos about it

but I'm not sending them do your own research zypten

[glad marten]

I also cant do anything myself because I'm just not allowed playing the game ig
Fails to authenticate

[glad marten]

Or you can just send them :3

[merry kiln]

no

[dusty drift]

Has anyone else seen Uncle Shagworthy's new victory and defeat outros?

[glad marten]

How does Shaggy have such a high win rate lmao most Shaggy's are absolute garbage

[willow beacon]

It's that Shagster clutch

[merry kiln]

shaggy is still easy enough to win with

[deft viper]

noob stomper

[dusty walrus]

How do y’all feel about the Batman matchup? It feels hard to get out of disadvantage against him

[frozen geyser]

We definitely lose against Batman

He’s light, so you can kill him pretty early, but his advantage state with aerial up b makes it really hard to land

If you run into a Batman that uses grapple a lot, you can parry on reaction

But Batman and Shaggy are generally looking for the same things. It’s just that batterang is a significantly better projectile than sandwich for his neutral game and Batman has bigger hitboxes all around

[merry kiln]

side special also beats grapple if you time it right

[strange yoke]

batman can cancel the grapple with a jump to bait parries and burn your dodge meter out

[dusty walrus]

Yeah I usually do that if they’re being aggressive

My issue with him is that it’s just very hard to contest him in neutral bc his hitboxes beat out most of my normals, so I have to resort to callouts on his movement

Also Batarang is hard to deal with especially because he can use it and then approach you from a different angle

Dash attack is also annoying, but that’s more so just Batman’s dash attack being really good in general

[merry kiln]

they just changed his down attack with his dash

batman is really annoying and for no reason

also alongside the unnecessary weakened

[frozen geyser]

Dash attack cancel with Batman is better than Harley’s slide combos ever were

[merry kiln]

remove weakened from the game

[frozen geyser]

Batman basically has pre-patch Harley slide

You get weakened, it combos into literally anything, he low profiles, it has that same body block affect that Harley’s used to have, etc

[strange yoke]

its death on whiff now. he actually has to wait a few frames after fully standing up. you can punish with jabs and such as long as you dont do it too early

[frozen geyser]

Dash attack -> bat bomb cancel -> dash attack -> dair -> sair -> bat bomb explodes -> uair

And now you’ve taken like 60 and have like 3 stacks of weaken

[frozen geyser]

That doesn’t matter because the body block can still screw up your punishes

Like it’s easier to punish than it was before, but the risk reward for using it is so heavily in Batman’s favor

[dusty walrus]

Keep it on Shaggy tho fr fr

[frozen geyser]

Especially because Shaggy’s combo game is noticeably worse with utilt having less hitstun

[strange yoke]

you should be punishing the move consistently now

[dusty walrus]

Did they nerf that btw? I feel like up tilt -> sair doesn’t really work consistently anymore.

[frozen geyser]

It doesn’t

[dusty walrus]

:(

[frozen geyser]

Utilt has less hitstun

[dusty walrus]

R.I.P.

[frozen geyser]

You can only true combo into uair the majority of the time

[dusty walrus]

That’s what I thought

[frozen geyser]

There is a very specific percent window where reverse utilt to up b is true

But it’s honestly not worth going for anymore

[dusty walrus]

Also, does nair not true combo into jab anymore? I swear it did last patch.

[frozen geyser]

It’s DI dependent

[dusty walrus]

Ah

[frozen geyser]

If they DI up or up/in, you get no follow ups at low percents

[dusty walrus]

Crying

[frozen geyser]

Jab doesn’t reach high enough and utilt is too slow

[dusty walrus]

This character is basically just DI and dodge reads now

[frozen geyser]

Correct

But at this point, Jason does it better now with better hitboxes

[dusty walrus]

Unfortunate

[frozen geyser]

But Jason is really slow, so Shaggy can actually whiff punish

[dusty walrus]

True

[frozen geyser]

In comparison

But yeah a lot of Shaggy’s combos are DI dependent now

If your opponent DI’s out, they get hit

If they DI in, you get no combo and have to go for a read

[dusty walrus]

Does Shaggy make good use of dodge cancels? I haven’t labbed it at all, so idk

[frozen geyser]

There is exactly one combo I’m aware of that is only guaranteed on DI in and that’s jab 1,2 -> dtilt -> sair at like 90+

[frozen geyser]

On DI out, you can combo nair at later percents with dodge cancel jab

At mid percents, jab 1,2 -> reverse utilt -> uair

You need to dodge jump the uair on DI out

[dusty walrus]

I see

[frozen geyser]

But generally, you’re only gonna use dodge cancels as an approach option

Just don’t be too trigger happy because Shaggy in burnout is really bad because he has no good landing options

[merry kiln]

no, shaggy is unbearable with weakened

[frozen geyser]

Weaken is far and above the most OP status effect

Max stack weakened is 25% extra knockback

[merry kiln]

it’s true most of the times if you do it right, even at like 80-100

dodge sair after it if you read their dodge or di is pretty good as well

can kill if you fully charge and they don’t expect it

[frozen geyser]

Max weakened + 5% + snowball + pugilist = 47% extra knockback which is just not ok for moves with high base knockback

[orchid wave]

Bigger lies have never been spoken bro what is this

[dusty walrus]

Yeah but it helps me cheese stocks

[dusty walrus]

I gotta start chasing with dodge sair more

I don’t use dodge that much

[glad marten]

Okay but most shaggys genuinely just mash side b is jumping that hard?

[willow beacon]

We shall pray that The Shag gets some buffs in the near future. I'm okay with them myb nerfing the charged attacks, those are too brutal at too low

[frozen geyser]

Anyone done enough rifts to get Smith yet?

I know it’s literally day 1

[dusty walrus]

Ngl I haven’t done any rifts

I just hop on, play some 1s and then hop off

[bleak roost]

ngl kinda grinding them rn

does each difficulty have it's own cauldron?

[glad marten]

Yeah

There's so much grinding in rifts though its just not fun

[bleak roost]

god

u right

im at the computer thing rn

good thing i found an exploit

the matrix shaggies just kill themselves if you go off stage

[frozen geyser]

I’ve competed 16/20 so far

I still have one more I can complete, but I don’t have enough gem levels for insanity yet

Rifts are ok

The earlier difficulties are a complete pushover

And they’re too easy to be enjoyable

[frozen geyser]

Yo wait the daily reward can be 20 gleamium

[spring tiger]

zoinks

[orchid wave]

I AM SO ANGRY

THEY TOOK DOUBLE SHORYU FROM SHAGGY AND PUT IT ON AGENT SMITH

NOT ONLY ARE THEY STRIPPING EVERYTHING AWAY FROM THIS CHARACTER, THAT'S NOT ENOUGH, THEY'RE GIVING IT TO OTHER CHARACTERS

That being said I am switching over to Agent Smith

[deft viper]

same lol

unless he gets some more love

[dusk geyser]

thats power creep for ya

[dusty walrus]

Sobbing

All I want is for nair and up tilt to be reliable combo tools

[frozen geyser]

I decided to grind out some more rift stars to get more gem levels

I’m at 19/20 now and just need more red gem levels

Some of the insanity difficulty rifts are absolutely unfair with how insanely buffed the NPC’s are

The Agent Smith + Matrix Wonder Woman with thorns enabled legitimately took like 40 minutes of tries because you just explode if you get hit even at the proper gem level

I can only imagine how awful that stage is gonna be when loony difficulty is out

[merry kiln]

just beat g3 twice

[placid kettle]

It feels like Shaggy got nerfed more

[dusk geyser]

Shaggy ain't in his prime from what he used to be.

Agent Smith has his old double shoryu and even Superman has his old jab 1,2 > dtilt combo.

It's sad my soul enjoyment out of Shaggy rn is using his infinite sandwich projectile to snipe people off stage

[crystal ibex]

I mean, in his prime or not, he is still essentially an auto play character

just like Banana Guard

[half current]

Please keep shaggy like he was on release. Of course he was an S+ tier character, but there will always be characters like that, especially with further expansions with the roster. He wasn’t insanely broken like iron giant and needed nerfs. His moves were predictable and punishable. Please revert shaggy 🙏

[dusty walrus]

I’m fine with current Shaggy for the most part

Easy to play and still has good damage and killpower

I just wish he had some more true combos

Because his advantage state is mainly reads now

[frozen geyser]

Buff combo damage and nerf kill power

[dusk geyser]

Give both

[frozen geyser]

Maybe I should rephrase it

Buff combo ability and nerf kill power

[dusty walrus]

I agree with this

[merry kiln]

guys new shaggy tech is spam up air until you reach the ground then jab

[mild fjord]

Is shirt rip just broken right now?

[dusk geyser]

yeah

[mild fjord]

[dusk geyser]

I feel like its been broken since beta in one way or another.
Shaggyworth still couldn't rip his shirt off after full release

[glad marten]

Only 2 skins can rip their shirt off

Shaggy basic and Shaggy valentine (tooniverse too probably)

[bleak roost]

that explains why i got 1500 fighter currency randomly

[glad marten]

No it doesnt

The daily reward is something you claim in the shop

It's gonna be small values of items

60 fighter currency, 100 gem XP, 20 gleamium

Things like that

[bleak roost]

oh i was thinking of the rift daily thing

[frozen geyser]

This yeah

[bleak roost]

still confused on how i got that though

[hollow quartz]

Is shaggy shirt rip working for yall?

[hollow comet]

It does not work since a couple patches.

[hollow quartz]

That's trash

[glad marten]

"A couple" lol

It broke in the midseason patch

That was the last patch so far

Until season 2, even

[hollow comet]

A small fix happened afterwards I think

[tranquil perch]

does anyone know if shaggy's Shirt Rip emote works on all of his skins? or just his base/toon skin

[frozen geyser]

Just base, toon, and valentines I think

I don’t have the valentines skin, so I can’t confirm tho

[tranquil perch]

ah damn, would've been cool to have a shirtless shagworthy or bearded shaggy

[frozen geyser]

But I heard it works on that one

[frozen geyser]

Missed opportunity tbh

[tranquil perch]

mainly wanted the emote just so i could have a shirtless cowboy shaggy, but i guess that's not possible (yet) :(

[glad marten]

Its unlikely to ever happen, unfortunately

The devs are too lazy to create a second model for every Shaggy skin

[tranquil perch]

damn :((

[safe knot]

Would you consider Shaggy a Top 5 character right now?

Or Top 3?

[glad marten]

Nah

His kill power is ridiculous

But thats it

Just watch his jab and sair

[waxen pine]

Idk shaggy might be just outside of top 5 for me, like 5 or 6 maybe

[dusk geyser]

i'm tripping

I've always had such issues with Finn as Shaggy.
But I played a ton of Jason v Finn games recently and Finn just crumbles..

Harley is even more of a pain though lol

[waxen pine]

I really struggle against Finn as stripe

[frozen geyser]

Top 10

[merry kiln]

I agree

[dusk geyser]

Honestly, out of all the current 27 playable characters...

Shaggy is one of them

[unique crag]

Just noobs that rely on side b majority of shaggy players

[subtle vault]

Why does grounded down-neutral have a second, optional attack to it-

[frozen geyser]

It does

But the stomp itself has more lag than you’d expect, so you might be trying to buffer the second part too quickly

[subtle vault]

No I mean, why does the second attack to it exist.

It just seems kinda pointless, idk.

[sterile orchid]

I've gotten kills with the clap

[glad marten]

It used to apply slowed

[stray ether]

yo dudes, what perks are you guys running for 2v2's?

[willow beacon]

One last zoinks

[frozen geyser]

5%

[delicate latch]

Nerf this character

[stray ether]

And for the other perks?

[frozen geyser]

Snowball, last stand, pugilist

[stray ether]

Thanks dude

[dusk geyser]

@graceful breach You stomped me the other day as Jason. GGs my guy : )

sorry I didn't 5th RM, my dog wanted to go out for a walk

[fast aspen]

I wanna find the first guy who made an “uLtRa InStInCt ShAgGy!” meme, force him to play 24 straight hours of you imbeciles running away and charging the “this meme hasn’t been funny since 2019”-o-meter, and then force him to apologize profusely to the universe

[glad marten]

Unfathomable skill issue

Shaggy is a mid tier at best rn

[fast aspen]

Yes but he’s a very annoying mid tier that makes me hate things I normally love like Matthew Lillard and pot dealers

And he’s based on a meme so outdated it makes me realize there’s a genuine chance of us getting a big f*cking Chungus skin in this game

So I’m going to complain, and if you want to stop me pay me

[glad marten]

Who do you play

[waxen pine]

Shaggy is not mid tier lmao

[glad marten]

Stfu holy crap dude I'm trying to downplay to get some buffs to his combo game let me cook

[waxen pine]

I thought you played joker because shaggy was lame as hell or something

[glad marten]

I dont even play this game anymore tbh
I log on once a day to do my dailies for whatever lame event they have in 5 minutes and then I stop playing

[waxen pine]

Then why do you care dude, do you really think they care what some random dude says in some hidden corner of their discord

[glad marten]

These events have just been copy paste with different skins as final rewards its so sad

[glad marten]

If I can convince enough people he's actually not good then eventually the devs will smell it and buff him trust the process

[waxen pine]

But why would you care you just said you don’t even play the game anymore

[glad marten]

Because I'll play in season 2

I still have a battlepass token to spend

And 4 seasons worth of character tickets

[waxen pine]

All you talk about is how the devs don’t do anything for the game and are ruining it by the day so why would you wait around for season two, why not just uninstall then

[glad marten]

I don't let anything go to waste fr

[waxen pine]

Whatever you say man

[delicate latch]

Buff Shaggy? Bruh never cook again 😭🙏

[glad marten]

Nerf Shaggy's kill power and damage and compensate with combos

[delicate latch]

Thats a good rework

[glad marten]

That's what I'm saying but Mr. Hank over here hates the idea of Shaggy not killing at 2% or whatever

[waxen pine]

All I said was he isn’t mid tier bro

Zypten back on the clock at it again

[stray ether]

shaggy's sandwiches are s tier

[mild fjord]

People really hating Shaggy for being a simple character

[waxen pine]

eh, I don't really mind him

[delicate latch]

For being good on everything?

And having tools for a mage

Bruiser

Tank?

For having a move that kills at 60?

That has armor and long range?

A strong projectile that he can use when he wants and its super fast?

Hm idk why hr needs a nerf

[mild fjord]

Lebron has that too, what are you talking sbout

[delicate latch]

But LeBron doesnt kill pretty early and actually takes skill

His projectile is just annoying and cant really kill

But Shaggy has everything

Thats his problem

[mild fjord]

Shaggy really does not

[delicate latch]

Why? Because u main him and u scared he gets nerfed?

Tell me

[waxen pine]

I don’t main shaggy and I think he’s in a decent place rn

[mild fjord]

I've already said it before; i dont even main him. Is that all you guys can accuse people of?

[delicate latch]

Its because u have never found a good shaggy

[waxen pine]

Lmao alright

[delicate latch]

Shaggy has tools for everything and everyone its crazy

He can also kill really early for no reason

[mild fjord]

What does Shaggy do against projectiles?

Or characters faster than him?

And big hitboxes?

[waxen pine]

He’s got good simple tools and a good simple gameplan sounds like an awesome introduction to the game character, which he was designed for

[delicate latch]

These are Jason problems not shaggy lol

[mild fjord]

At least Jason has one move or two that helps him

[delicate latch]

And shaggy too?

[mild fjord]

What move helps Shaggy?

[delicate latch]

He is fast he can get near

[waxen pine]

Jason definitely struggles more against projectiles due to his size and speed but shaggy doesn’t really have any anti projectile tools either

Also because Jason is bottom tier and shaggy is A tier for sure

[delicate latch]

Hig A tier yeah

[waxen pine]

Sounds balanced to me

If he has tools for everything why isn’t he top tier

[delicate latch]

Because Iron Gigant is in the game

And Joker too

[waxen pine]

That doesn’t mean anything if shaggys good at literally everything like you said then he should be better than both of them

[delicate latch]

Dont believe me fine when u lose against a Shaggy dont cry

[waxen pine]

Alright, but I wasn’t the one who came here to complain about him

[stray ether]

Shaggy is the top tier of sandwich making

[waxen pine]

Nobody does it like he does

[glad marten]

Nope

Shaggy has the base weight

Not a tank weight

He has high kill power and damage but no combo game

[delicate latch]

I mean that he can counter pretty much every tank

[glad marten]

He has a whopping 1 small projectile idk what your issue with that is tbh it's not that crazy

[stray ether]

> 🥪

[delicate latch]

And? Why have a combo game when a single attack does more dmg than a entire combo? Lol

[glad marten]

I think he more needs a rework than nerfs

[glad marten]

Are you only getting hit by side b lmao

[delicate latch]

Its Really Fast and counts as heavy for some reason

[glad marten]

Its not heavy lmao

Its light or medium

Unless you mean his super sandwich

[delicate latch]

It is actually attacks like Mortys dirt cant destroy it with 1 hit

[glad marten]

But that one sucks

[delicate latch]

I mean yeah every single move i miss they do thwt attack that does 12 dmg and has a stupid long range

[glad marten]

Getting whiff punished by a side b spammer is unreal 😭

[delicate latch]

Its not a spammer i can win against spammers its someone who actually knows what they are doing

[dusty walrus]

Shaggy is a good character

He’s just kinda lame because he has no combos

I like beginner characters (I literally main Mario in Smash), but I also enjoy when they have a little more to them that still lets the player have fun as they get better at the game

While Shaggy’s moves do a lot of damage, not having really any true combos doesn’t make for a very fun advantage state once someone makes it past the beginner stages of the game.

Tbh all I want is for like nair and up tilt to have some kind of combo utility

I’m not asking for loops to come back or anything, but it would be nice to at least be able to try doing cool things in advantage

[glad marten]

I doubt the devs will ever change it honestly

PFG said they wanna get rid of "the skill gap" of this game

Stupid statement to make imo

[dusty walrus]

💀

Dawg that’s just asking for your game to die

If there’s no reward for getting better, then why even play the game

[glad marten]

But the noobs! The players that aren't good at the game! How will they ever win tournaments if better players have better chances?!

[dusty walrus]

😭

Can’t believe people actually have this mindset lmao

[delicate latch]

Main Morty

[dusty walrus]

I’m good

Mashing is more fun

[delicate latch]

Off corse shaggy main

[dusty walrus]

You understand 🙏

[dusk geyser]

Shaggy would be really good working at Subway

[frozen geyser]

Dude coming in here to complain about Shaggy while playing Morty is insane

If you’re losing the Shaggy matchup as Morty, that’s a skill issue because that matchup is cheeks for Shaggy

You out neutral him so hard with dirt and grenades and your combos deal more damage than his does. Shaggy’s only benefit in the matchup is he has more kill power

If you’re still exploding when Shaggy touches you after they nerfed his utilt and aerial up b to be significantly less effective, you’re probably getting hard read

[waxen pine]

I don’t even know if I can say that with how strong Morty’s up air is

[frozen geyser]

The weaken from dirt makes uair that much stronger

[dusk geyser]

If Shaggy can pull sandwiches out of the ground that means he could singlehandedly solve world hunger.

But instead he decides to beat up a 14yr old boy in a yellow shirt and various animals.

He should get a villainous tag imo

[frozen geyser]

True

[glad marten]

Why solve world hunger when you can punch a senior citizen in the face?

[dusk geyser]

That's why Shaggy is the 🐐

[fervent gust]

Do we have a new combo list for shaggy

[glad marten]

Jab > jab > 3rd hit of your choosing

Thats it

Thats his whole combo

Thats all of them

[waxen pine]

What about nair jab jab third hit

[glad marten]

Oh yeah that probably works too

[dusk geyser]

so could you nair > jab 1 > jab 2 > dtilt > dash attack

that might be shaggy's longest combo...

[glad marten]

Might be

[frozen geyser]

Also nair -> jab 1,2 -> utilt -> uair (his only move that can combo out of utilt)

[willow beacon]

Shaggy's biggest combo rn is mind reading

[late tree]

Is sandwich perk nerfed?

[frozen geyser]

Yes

It’s borderline useless rn

[pastel knoll]

has shaggy's down air special been nerfed? I used to remember being able to do it and it couldn't be interrupted lol

[willow beacon]

I think it had some kind of armour in beta, but now it's pretty easy to counter

[frozen geyser]

In beta, air down special had armor while falling. In relaunch, they took that armor away

They also removed the slow effect from dtilt 2 for no reason

[waxen pine]

That was a lame change

Move had no other redeeming qualities

[dusk geyser]

i've joined the dark side.
I might have just become a bugs main last night 😩

stage control is just too strong

[delicate latch]

U played Shaggy u were always on the dark side 🙏😭

[dusk geyser]

True, I guess this is the darker side 😔

[frozen geyser]

The even darker side would be becoming a WW main

[dusk geyser]

ngl... she lookin kinda spicy

I have forsaken Shaggy

[waxen pine]

I left shaggy for stripe and im ngl im pretty glad i did

Shaggy was a lot of fun but there are some characters in this game with a lot more depth and I think that’s just what I’m looking for

No shade to shaggy players though

[dusk geyser]

Yeah I know exactly how you feel. He's what PFG wanted him to be, a basic character that new people can pick up.

The skill floor is low but the skill ceiling only goes so high without any real combo routes.

[waxen pine]

I think he does a good job at that too

Good all rounder brawler with a good projectile and a clear weakness without being underpowered

I think what really did it for me was doubles

I play doubles mostly with a Steven and Shaggy just hardly interacts with his partner in doubles in a unique way, whereas Steven has so many ways to interact with his doubles partner, so it felt a bit one-sided, but playing Stripe I’ve got so many ways we can interact with each others kits and it makes it a lot more enjoyable for me

I would def keep Shaggy as a secondary if he didn’t suck at almost the exact same matchups stripe does

[dusk geyser]

Good point. Doubles he doesn't really do much other than kill. Even then, I feel like I'd rather pick a character that can kill and has good team interactions.

For now I'll play him in 1s from time-to-time. Or if he gets a new skin, thematically he's still my favourite because of Dragonball

But something about Bugs setups and hearing the whistle of the rocket coming down just ignites the neurons in my brain

[waxen pine]

I get exactly what you mean

#clips message I landed this clip the other day and using gun like this to secure stocks and apply pressure just feels so awesome

[dusk geyser]

ooooooo spicy clip

nice job

[waxen pine]

Thank you

Just stuff like that where I’ve got stuff to work on a learn

[dusk geyser]

Yeah that's sick indeed. Most Stripes I've fought immediately blow their entire cartridge the moment they see that reticle pop up lol

[waxen pine]

That’s a waste

[frozen geyser]

I definitely need to use reverse gun more when I play Stripe

[waxen pine]

There’s so many things you can use bullets for

Turning buzzsaw around mid air, down gun into the bottom blast zone, off the top blast zone, reverse gun sair or up air in neutral, jab gun dash loops

[dusk geyser]

That alone gives him leagues of depth more than Shaggy 😩

[frozen geyser]

I should make a season 1 Shaggy matchup chart before the start of season 2

[dusk geyser]

What you think his worst is? I could never fight a Finn. WR against him as my Shaggy was probably 20%

I have no problems with Finn as Bugs or even Jason

[frozen geyser]

Morty is definitely his worst

Shaggy has no answers to dirt

You just get out neutraled and out comboed so hard in that matchup

But Finn is also really bad

Hangry Man was the answer to Finn because you could basically always get rage any time Finn charges a ground attack

But now you can’t and so you just get outranged and out comboed