💬│palia-discussions

[midnight flame]

At risk of repeating myself in a troublesome way: Can we please get some acknowledgement of the accessibility issues and a game plan for dealing with it?

[lilac tartan]

If I had a nickel for every time this server frustrated me, then I might be able to afford the cosmetics

[raven orbit]

To put this into perspective, the cloud pet and most recent tool skin are $24 CDN (not accounting for tax) each

[crystal lagoon]

This; why continue to pour money into a game where they're using it to just make more cosmetics? Pay that internet bill bb, they deserve it more 🫶

[raven orbit]

Please

[loud axle]

I think the general sentiment seems to boil down to the fact that even for a F2P game, there needs to be an incentive to play in order to want to spend money at all.

Some outfits that are completely separate from the cash shop but earnable from grinding out the major skills would go a long way towards giving people not only something to work towards and a reason to keep playing the game, but some nice free options for outfits as well.

[fallow saffron]

Straight to the dungeon

Oh gods is this the dungeon

[vale trout]

Why is asking for accessibility settings repeatedly after they've been ignored for a literal year even a bad thing idgi 😭

[scarlet hazel]

yeah we need more accessibility. you can say its being worked on but without proof after multiple patches, its not believable by word at all nymore

[steady fox]

Don't worry, I have been!
I guess I'm just trying to say that I would love to support Palia, but they make it so unreasonable, and I think that's why people get so worked up.
If these aspects were actually considered, I'd have no problem spending here! But I just can't justify spending that money on a single thing in the store

[worn snow]

wow! that's a lot of money that could go a long way-- can i ask also what min wage is where u live? no worries if not.

im just generally used to thinking of transactions in terms of "oh it would take me x hours to pay for this" so it would help lol

[vale trout]

Like let's make the game actually playable for everyone lmao

[azure delta]

It would be nice but I also don't expect games to be that nice or cater to my specific needs truthfully. Most games deafen you just starting them up these so I've grown used to muting the sound until I get to the in-game menu to adjust it. Games cater to their general player base so I've learned work around in order to game comfortably. Like having a weighted mouse to help my aim since my hands shake in shooting games. It sucks sure but it's the reality of playing video games. Not saying it's bad for everyone to advocate for more accessibility so players aren't limited! Just my personal learning experience in my 20 years of gaming.

[crystal lagoon]

It's not, and I am so sorry for the people affected and who have actually ended up in the hospital for their lackluster response to what every other game would consider fixed asap.

[frosty imp]

okay but the incentive should be provided through quests and not outfits XD If you play a game to look nice in it, there's plenty of games that offer that already

[vale trout]

Every other game that cares about the safety of their players

[steady fox]

I think minimum wage is currently $15.50

[waxen mauve]

If repeating this gets us yelled at I will gladly get yelled at. We need an accessibility issue statement and roadmap.

[crystal lagoon]

If they released content with the cosmetic money, okay that's fine.

If they made the cosmetics more affordable for the average joejane, there'd be a lot less complaint.

If they made any way at all to make your own clothes, dye system etc. There'd be less complaint.

The problem is, we can buy pretty clothes but with no where new to sport them what's the point?

PoE does it right.

[normal saddle]

The Wii era and their games really broke me of having my devices all the way up lol

[steady fox]

Also, this is all coming from someone who HAS purchased from the premium store. I am fortunate enough to have been able to do that, but that does not make it reasonable.
I'd love some more things, but I just can't justify it. The one time I did spend, it was a birthday gift to myself.

[worn snow]

in mmos a major part of the game is looking cool to other players

[azure delta]

The Wii start sound will forever haunt me

[fiery isle]

I always have said I'd have spent more total if the prices were lower - I do mean it

[crystal lagoon]

Being able to afford things, shouldn't prevent you from wanting more and better things for the rest of the community. Period.

[frosty imp]

Okay, the fact that people could afford to support this game but choose not to is completely separate from people wanting to express themselves with outfits

[scarlet hazel]

i like feeling pretty in games. i just feel basic in palia

[loud axle]

It's a life sim though, so as Ori said earlier being able to express yourself really is a big part of the core gameplay.

Honestly I would probably be less concerned about having more free options if I found Palia's gameplay more... deep and meaningful, but unfortunately that's not the case. Even for being F2P, there just isn't enough to keep me playing right now.

[frosty imp]

show me an mmo where the coolest people didn't pay a load of money to look coolest

[vapid pendant]

Coughs Infinity Nikki Coughs Join us Coughs

[scarlet hazel]

wizard101. you can farm th cool gear by yourself.

[umbral lynx]

Oh let me show you my hunter goblin from wow... Wears a wrath free outfit

[raven orbit]

I know folks, myself included, have openly said that the lack of F2P options is what makes us not want to pay

[steady fox]

Honestly, even if they did something like add the ability to purchase parts of a cosmetic set as well as the full set. Imagine the influx of sales

[crystal lagoon]

WoW? The biggest MMO still to exist to this day. Even in their release year they had more options for hats than Palia does in the entire game for clothes.

[worn snow]

coolEST? yeah ofc ur right.

cool? no i looked cool in mmos easy, just had to get smth to show off

[scarlet hazel]

i dont like games where i cant make my own character so it isnt for me 😔

[loud axle]

Whales will always be the main source of money, but most MMOs (and even a lot of gacha games) have ways to slowly earn currency, upgrades, outfits, skins, etc.

[umbral lynx]

My once human character looks good in both free and paid outfits and that game is F2p

[fiery perch]

And what about when people finished the quests? Or the people who can't continue the main story, for accessibility reasons, quest being broken, etc?

And even then, it isn't the fact that people want incentive that is specifically outfits-- there isn't much incentive for self-expression at all. That's mainly the problem. Earnable outfits would just help with that.

I've talked about it before, but being able to have a character that slowly learned the culture, the world, different fashion tastes from the NPCs, and being able to incorporate that into your clothes?? god. It would be really nice, and also help with immersion and feel like my character is there in the world.

And genuinely, when people say incentive/earnables, people think about either a skill towards it (obviously), but even just... guild coins or leveling your own skills to unlock specific clothing pieces! Do you know how nice it'd be, to show off I like a specific skill, because I actually earned it and worked towards it? That's something I love.

[vapid pendant]

Fair enough

[raven orbit]

GW2, WoW. Honestly ESO if you get lucky with drops /gen

[lilac tartan]

The problem is that a lot of us are longtime players who already beat every single quest, completed all/ most objectives and achievements and now we have nothing left to do. The focus on high priced cosmetics and not new quests for us to partake in is extremely frustrating. If there’s nothing left to do and nothing we can afford to buy, then what is the point? /nm!

[umbral lynx]

Gw2 dye system though

[west marlin]

Warcraft. The silliest and ugliest gear is for purchase, all the cool stuff is earnable

[celest maple]

Agreed and of the same opinion. I can afford things from the premium store but I want people who cannot to actually be able to get cosmetics too.

[fiery isle]

I'd even take GW1 dye system at this point

[scarlet hazel]

in WoW you can look like the silliest warrior or the most coolest mage in existence.

[umbral lynx]

Unless it's mail armour I cry every times

[scarlet hazel]

fr. i have yet to do mail or plate cause so much is just.... ugly 😭

[west marlin]

SO true ugh

[azure delta]

They really do need to fix it and other bugs on the list. There's no avoiding the fact S6 is lacking on QoL updates as it's the major frustration I have currently. It has potential if they decide to put in the work to make it a polished game.

[livid lagoon]

This is what baffles me the most. Bugs happen, sometimes things slip through... but that, despite it having been reported and talked about a lot, it takes having to cause a stink in here for things to be recognized.

[raven orbit]

There's nothing better than doing fashion shows in MMOs and seeing where everyone got their gear from, but with Palia you can't do that. It's just "oh this person paid $50" instead of "this person finished X quest or did X dungeon/other event thing"

[umbral lynx]

I crave it palia would work wonders and give jel a reason to walk around or whatever he does... Currently there is 0 reason to interact with em

[livid lagoon]

And it feels like we have to do the quality assurance for them... for free.

[worn snow]

i feel like i understand non-earnable stuff (kinda, i feel like one outfit for every skill would still be cool) nowadays, but the free options need to be expanded.

the gap between the free and paid stuff is really wild rn

[crystal lagoon]

The concern is too that people have made a stink, ended up in a hospital... and yet where's s6? "NEW PREMIUM PRETTY FLYING DRESS WITH TOOT CLOUD NOW AVAILABLE POR PURCHASE"

[finite dagger]

For their 20th anniversary, WoW had an event with a mini event inside where you could show off your transmog (outfits) AND one to show off your special mounts. It was awesome and really let you showcase your cool stuff!

[ivory vessel]

i just realized you talked about purchasing separate bundles -- you're right, that would save me some cash, though it's some work. i was talking about this bundle in specific in my message. still, let's be frank. 55 moneis for the cloud? it doesn't do anything. i went out to dinner in a fancy restaurant for my mom's birthday tonight and paid 56 the best risotto i've ever eaten in my entire life. just putting it in perspective.

[gentle hill]

holy molly thats a big story

[steady fox]

I would love to support Palia more, and I'll hold out hope despite myself that some real research will be put into it.
It's not just that I choose not to support anymore, it's that it's super unreasonable for me to do so. Should the prices reflect cost of living just a little bit, so many of their problems would be solved. *And I would be more than happy to support again!

[fiery isle]

is that 7 paragraphs of you telling people to shut up? lol

[midnight flame]

I will not be reading all that lmao

[crystal lagoon]

I couldn't even get past the entitlement of the first two sentences.

YOU can't fix it, but the devs can and choose to not do so. Yikes.

[gentle hill]

true like what the holy cow

[waxen mauve]

white knighting for a company because people are asking for reasonable things is what's wild

[lilac tartan]

Yeah I’m done, see yall soon chat

[midnight flame]

In fact, I'm going to go ahead and block you ❤️

[raven orbit]

People have been using support tickets and feedback forms. There is an unwillingness to listen to feedback and a lack of priority for addressing concerns - it's the exact reason why the snowball flash took over a year to get fixed despite being reported back in beta. /gen

[steady fox]

No ace why did you send that faster than me

[umbral lynx]

[gentle hill]

its just a game

[warm python]

[late sage]

https://tenor.com/view/mr-krabs-violin-boohoo-sarcasm-sarcastic-gif-287286086050988918

[supple marsh]

{f}

[crystal lagoon]

Please tell me how advocating for more options to be accessible to lower income individuals, and griping about how people have gone to the hospital over their lackluster response is entitled?

Please.

[scarlet hazel]

so us asking devs to fix things is... entitled...? /genq

[tribal field]

Holy crow guys it’s ok for people to like Palia as it is.

[raven orbit]

This is also a discussion channel. You can discuss things without calling people entitled or what not.

[warm python]

I wonder if I still have that little bottle of wine I took off the airplane last trip I had, water is not enough right now /j

[gentle hill]

well we need bug fix no new bugs

[waxen mauve]

and we're just asking for things we think will improve the game, which is what S6 purportedly wants us to do

[azure delta]

We are beta testers so we're meant to give feedback or am I missing something?

[west marlin]

Exactly

[fiery perch]

I'm sure I missed some messages, because chat has definitely been going pretty fast. But I know at least some people have been also trying to get clarification on some things that have been said.

I can't respond to everything you said, but uh... a lot of folks here are passionate about the game, and it's why they are trying to get clarification or even talk about stuff with other players. We aren't asking for everything to be free, either. We understand things need to be premium.

And people have been also trying to get some of those bugs, that you mentioned, fixed! We all hope for that.

[delicate rain]

Its not what you are trying to do its the way you are doing it lol. You are literally arguing with people who does not agree with you right now.

[glacial knot]

uh oh, gen chat got into discussion chat lmao

[worn snow]

someone going karen on you necessitates they have privilege over u in some way... we're all just chatters...

also, complaining shouldn't inherently make you feel unsafe. we're all having pretty reasonable discussions, actually

[steady fox]

I'm not even gonna lie, despite the obvious accessibility issues and the lackluster staff transparency, I love Palia and I'll continue playing as is. Should they ever consider adjusting their store to actually reflect cost of living around the world, then I'd forever be happy to have more pretty things.

[ivory vessel]

i been saying

[umbral lynx]

ah shizzles i had to go to a&e cas of a game that wanted to play games with my health and didnt give warnings till months of pointing it out rip

[gentle hill]

yes ok but getting worked on it is bad its game to relax and play at your own time

[scarlet hazel]

yeah but if things arent being talked about or accessability keeps being ignored then... that's an issue

[crystal lagoon]

You mean I disagree with you, and you continue to tell us how the game has enough and people should be content.... ? LMAO.

[west marlin]

I would strongly advocate for people in this chat to ignore people instead of escalating things because this is probably what they hate about us tbh

[gentle hill]

ciri help here pla

[lilac tartan]

Is that not what you are doing too?

[warm python]

And that's good! Like genuinely! A lot of people want to get to that point again too, hence a lot of the feedback/venting. People want to be able to love the game as much as people who currently do do

[lilac tartan]

Pot calling the kettle black.

[ivory vessel]

einarbot you leave ciri alone THIS INSTANT

[warm python]

EinarBot's getting a workout today lmao

[scarlet hazel]

well anyway, wonder where wizardcrab is? he hasnt typed in a bit now

[raven orbit]

I do think it would be cool if they implemented a thing like Dead By Daylights battlepass. There's a free version and a paid version, both get cosmetics but the paid one gets more

[gentle hill]

i do think the deve are working with it its not like they not fixing it bcoz it takes time coding not easy

[midnight flame]

I noticed that yeah

[fiery perch]

genuinely i just want this game to be a game that people can play again lol. Some people can't due to the White Flashes, or some other accessibility concerns, like not being able to fish, not being able to do gales, etc.

i just want people to have their comfort game back. and i want the game to be a safe and comforting place for other people who are looking for a game like that.

[delicate rain]

And thats fine, asking for things and being passionate about the game, thats a part of why the game is still around. But there is a lot of ways of doing this. And im not saying people should not bring issues up, or ignore things I'm saying that people need to do it in a calm and proper way instead of starting a riot in chat that makes some people uncomfortable or unsafe. People should be able to disagree as well without getting straight out attacked or made fun of.

[ivory vessel]

granted i think he was waiting for my message, but also this random person stirring discussions on a different subject is very beneficial for him...

[steady fox]

Yes!! People do not get worked up over things they don't want! If these players did not like Palia, they would not still be here trying to better it, like we're supposed to be doing in a beta game.
I will continue to do my thing and enjoy what I can enjoy, and should some real feedback be taken in and considered, I'd be more than happy to support Palia once more.
Everyone needs to make a living - it's gatekeeping people's ability to do that for S6 that is weird to me

[west marlin]

No one's rioting we are vibing

[rare pine]

Who got attacked?

[west marlin]

No one

[lilac tartan]

I believe the guy who joined this chat during update day.

[crystal lagoon]

You feel unsafe because people disagree with you and your stance that "I have money, so people can't complain about what's in the game"?

You literally left the chat with "You people are wild"

[delicate rain]

Are you kidding me? you all went directly on me since my very first message for not agreeing with you xD

[raven orbit]

Genuinely, I just want to be able to play the game that was marketed as being inclusive. /gen

[glacial knot]

the only people getting attacked are the ones who are venting and giving feedback from what i always see

[warm python]

For real for real. If we keep getting told it's a beta game, that's the exact time you should be giving feedback and bringing up issues

[scarlet hazel]

well hopefully he'll be back. i want to ask him about accessibility a bit more and see if gifting in the shop would be a thing in the future

[fallow saffron]

I have lost the plot

[delicate rain]

never said I felt unsafe, nor did I say I have money to spend

[warm python]

There was a plot?

[west marlin]

Strongly suggest to just move on

[steady fox]

You can buy those from badruu

[brisk spruce]

forgive me if I'm missing something because I'm in & out of discord atm (playing a game as well) but..

You are sitting here complaining left right and center about an issue none of us can fix for you.
except... "it doesn't mean feedback here isn't helpful too" directly from a dev?

we only got the snowball flash fixed this year because we complained up a storm in here, after it got ignored for an entire year when we went through support tickets & feedback the first time.

sometimes support & feedback doesn't work because the devs don't understand the full gravity of what's happening when we're being courteous to support staff instead of really letting it out.

[west marlin]

Talk about ducks instead

[waxen mauve]

not enough of them

[delicate rain]

I agree, have a great night everyone.

[umbral lynx]

i mean i didnt even know this was still in beta when it came to steam since it didnt say till i loaded the game in tiny tiny text

[gentle hill]

this is the first game where i felt so positive energy but recent events people are just being mean and grumpy to join their lure

[steady fox]

Never enough..

[crystal lagoon]

I am fairly certain, unless it was another individual with a like name that you said you were fortunate enough to be able to spend money in this game. If that was incorrect, then I apologize.

However, the arguing is non existent. People can be passionate about an issue, that doesn't make it arguing because you dislike it.

[warm python]

y'all distracting me from Graveyard Keeper

[ivory vessel]

oh i'm rioting. people are getting banned without warnings or explanations because S6 suddenly decided we are no longer allowed to discuss things in discussion channels. they refuse to do better then act deffensive when we point it out. this game is gonna d-word and it's suddenly going to be our fault because we refused to buy overpriced cosmetics in a game that some of us can't even play because the lack of accessibility fixes puts out literal lives at risk. and yet other players think they have the right to come tell us we're overreacting and deffend a lazy company

*edit sorry ciri it slipped i mean no harm i'm just mad

[glacial knot]

which is ironic since its usually coming from the people claiming that the feedback is too aggressive or whatever and trying to spread 'positivity'

[steady fox]

Oh my god I have seen so much of this in here but not yet in game.
Please I beg if anybody ever sees me throwing a lure down JOIN IN. the more the merrier

[lucid hornet]

All of this feels like a déjà vu.
I am pretty sure we already were at a point where people got mostly unnecessarily timeouted/banned.
The biggest difference between that time and now is that its blatantly expected to not repeat the same issues?
They arent going to vanish from pretending they dont exist.
Who would have guessed that ignoring mostly constructive feedback and discussions would lead to a point people are going to vent and lay off the nice face to all the negative feels which simply got ignored.

And rowing back that only spam was meant doesn't really help.

Gimme a bonk for opening a topic which seemingly already stopped to exists..

[fiery perch]

I genuinely think we should move on, because it's going into circles, and I think the screenshot and stuff that ozma was talking about is very important.

[west marlin]

Listen, I'm not saying your wrong, I'm just saying the feedback needs to go to the right place and that's not public discussion unfortunately and I don't want anyone here to get banned

[worn snow]

does anyone wanna explain to me who this duck person is bc i kinda wanna join whatever thing

[supple marsh]

quack

[gentle hill]

Yes more the merrier I never say no to people but I have seen bad side of people I was having good time and positive vibe not anymore they are just crzy

[livid lagoon]

I'll just say that this is how it feels like; this game is in Schrödinger's Release Schedule: It both is and isn't in beta depending on when it is convenient. Monetization that's so aggressive it acts like a fully released game, and unlike a beta feedback is only taken seriously when the pitchforks are out. But when problems arise, then it's a beta.

[west marlin]

This is my biggest critisim of the community tbh

[worn snow]

as long as no one's anti eyore... i am curious i dont yet walk talk or quack like a duck

[crystal lagoon]

I miss when games were released complete

[steady fox]

People are strange around release times like this.
I'm sorry you encountered that! Worst case scenario, jump servers or report if you need to - don't let their vibe colour your day.

[fiery perch]

if you are actually curious about the duck stuff, i can dm you. dont want to derail the convo any more than it has been

[raven orbit]

I'd agree with this. I think the fact some platforms say its in beta while others, including official ones, don't makes it worse too

[supple marsh]

i got whinnie the pooh key caps

[ivory vessel]

i agree feedback needs to be forwarded to the right place and it has. but they don't hear it. right now the only place we can be heard is here when devs (specifically appypie) are around to collect . plus the whole reason for this revolt are the measures they're inflicting on the discord, so... we gotta discuss on the discord

[fallow saffron]

[red spire]

its an online beta game that is activly being worked on?

[worn snow]

it has felt like this since august of the year before last, tbh. no offense wc buddy love ya

[scarlet hazel]

you know what would be cool? a pokemon farming mmo.

[crystal lagoon]

I'm gonna sound ancient here, but back in my day even MMO games were released complete and bugs/tweaks were made along the way. 💜

[narrow narwhal]

Yeah, and I really don't want to harp on this more. My actually point was that we will not action if people, accidentally or on purpose, say a price that's not fully correct. But yeah it's a big relief to me that the prices are not incorrect in Brazil. The dev team has a good way to check this but my ways are pretty limited and I wouldn't want to bother people on a Friday night unless there was confirmation.

Side note: totally feel you about having an amazing dinner and that being a better use of money than buying an outfit in Palia. I think that's pretty common and I think that's okay. Hopefully things like Zeki's Loyalty Club and/or the right Sale might make something the right price for you, but I also totally understand that even with those discounts outfits in palia are just not worth the money to many folks.

[west marlin]

I would suggest dming wizard crab privately because unfortunately discussion of moderation action is against the rules

[worn snow]

i was hoping it woudl mostly lighten the vibes up but yes i would love that :]

[scarlet hazel]

what about gifting outfits? it would help both sides out!

[waxen mauve]

is it? actively being worked on?

[gentle hill]

well i try to do that but then again we are people in grop and if i report them as i dont want anyone losing their play time bcoz they might have given efforts i know bcoz i also have done it

[red spire]

thats crazy world of warcraft had tons of bugs on release and took months to patch and you bought the game? this game is free? not seeing why a starting company running an online game is fixing minor bugs is a problem

[red spire]

there fixing issues and some take longer than others.

[fallow saffron]

Ahhhh

[gentle hill]

agreed

[steady fox]

I'm not going to lie I respectfully laugh snorted at the idea that WC thinks an outfit equals a nice dinner
My guy, it equals a week of groceries

[lethal granite]

wdym? i’ve never experienced that so it must never happen!

||<- dead and hoh ||

i have found accessibility and phobia settings are actually there by default in a lot of new releases! even smaller studios (lookin at you, luma island, i see ur arachnophobia mode and was v grateful for it) are able to do it. that’s part of why the lack of accessibility options for palia which people have been asking for for so long going ignored is so rough.

i hope for both of our sake, the trend towards built-in accessibility continues.

[tribal field]

Yes

[crystal lagoon]

When games were released, there was no such thing as "beta for years with no updates". It was a released game, with content for you to complete while they fixed bugs, or released more content.

Or games were fully released and the bugs that existed were merely funny things that people would point out all the time.

What's been new about this game, to where we can actively say it's being worked on?

[loud axle]

The problem is old bugs keep finding their way back into the game after being patched out months prior.

Like the paver bug that was recently re-introduced.

[livid lagoon]

Let me just ask: Will S6 start looking at the actual value proposition of cosmetics? Instead of roundabout ways of getting Palia coins, just looking at the pricing itself and looking into the community feedback about this? Maybe I've missed a post or three, but I haven't seen anything that indicates there is any genuine looking into changing the pricing itself (as opposed to the extremely convoluted "workaround" that ZLC is).

[ivory vessel]

...crabs and i aren't friends, i'm not gonna DM the guy about the new rules of the server. he (or anyone else who's responsible for this dumpster fire, for that matter) will hear it from me and others here D: sorry i don't mean to be rude to you, we can agree to disagree and move on!! kindly

[waxen mauve]

what issues are being fixed? we don't know because we aren't told what's going on until it happens

[scarlet hazel]

like, if people could gift others outfits they want, then it could bring the community closer and help people get things they want. and people who have already bought outfits but want to support the game more can end up doing just that!

[steady fox]

But enough about that from me I respect the fact that this discussion has been actually chill and not wild. Good job folks

[narrow narwhal]

We would LOVE gifting. The full version of gifting is way out of scope right now because there's so much behind the scenes you need to do (for UX, fraud, etc). We actually have a much easier to implement version of premium gifting coming out, which will help some folks, but definitely won't satisfy many.

[red spire]

is that a problem? like the game is free. why do they need to tell you when an update is gonna happen. your the consumer there the provider.

[fallow saffron]

[warm python]

The game isn't completely free, it's F2P, which is an alternative form of monetization. The point of it being free to download is that they're planning on (hopefully) making their money via getting people to spend money in microtrasnsactions. It's a business strategy. Not always a good one, not always a bad one, but it's a business strategy

[raven orbit]

I don't think anyone disagrees that dev takes time. The issue is that some issues are not addressed at all, like the snowballs for example which were reported in 2023 and just recently got a fix. There is also a lack of basic accessibility features that should be in the game and just aren't which is, honestly, wild in 2025 /gen

[crystal lagoon]

The game is free but wanting us to suppor them for "more content" by pushing nothing but updates for new outfits.

The game isn't complete. WHERE IS THE WEATHER??

[waxen mauve]

lol yes it's a problem.

[red spire]

when ever they update the game it brings in old bugs. happens with everything from wow to runescape.

[ivory vessel]

babes kindly read the room 🫶

[worn snow]

truly

[glacial knot]

whose side account is that? lmao

[west marlin]

I don't take it rudly at all don't worry
I just want things to be better

[tribal field]

I would love to gift people outfits and such. It would be really cool! Or trading outfits with other players.

[scarlet hazel]

as long as it lets people gift others outfits, even if it has to be put on a cooldown would be amazing. and when it does come out, a channel could be made for people looking for outfits + those who are wiling to buy 😄

[livid lagoon]

Interesting. Are we gonna get any info about this in advance, or is this yet another "we must keep secret until the very last possible moment" so no one can provide genuine feedback and reception on the system in advance, risking it falling completely flat?

[red spire]

lol you guys are all complaining about a free game. if you want to quit just quit or put your feedback in the feedback channels?

[warm python]

I do get the fraud issue, at least... FFXIV had to stop gifting on a bunch of cash shop items because of the credit card fraud/chargebacks so that point is a pain

[fallow saffron]

This is the..

[fiery isle]

probably teh 7 paragraphs of shut up guy from earlier tbh

[narrow narwhal]

The paver bug is so unfortunate. It'll be fixed next patch but it really sucks in the meantime.

[midnight flame]

Awesome. Can you acknowledge the many requests for a game plan/Road map of accessibility features in the game? Taking a survey of the ones people feel are necessary and specifically making a high value support ticket for accessibility features which are dangerous to health would be great things to hear your view on.

[crystal lagoon]

Did you really just join this discord to cause discourse? LMAO.

[ivory vessel]

bestie don't bother-

[warm python]

[west marlin]

This um... This is the feedback channel?

[raven orbit]

What do you mean by full version vs premium of gifting? /gen

[late sage]

Did you just come in this discord to cry?

[waxen mauve]

you clearly aren't listening but: people have said over and over again they DO submit feedback, but the only way anything gets addressed is if folks raise a big enough stink about it in here

[warm python]

They removed the feedback channel at some point so this is the defacto one

And people have been submitting feedback via the forms for ages too

[west marlin]

Technically this is palia chat 2

[fallow saffron]

[waxen mauve]

this, please, 10000000x

[supple marsh]

yes

[scarlet hazel]

well if we could get an explanation of what it would be and how it would function when its almost ready o release would be good. being secretive about everything has only caused mass confusion. so being upfront and completely honest could lead to something better!

[delicate rain]

It is unfortunate but it doesn’t hurt us. I’m happy it’s being fixed as soon as possible but it doenst make the game unplayable. Thank you tho for reinsuring us that it’s being fixed soon! 🩶

[warm python]

oh kdjahsd one sec water boiling over brb

[loud axle]

Totally understand if not, but can you give any insight into why the team chooses to push patches that have known bugs in them?

Is it due to needing to verify with Nintendo ahead of time, and then those bugs are later found during internal QA?

[red spire]

maybe try a new way?

[worn snow]

i'm old enough (/j been here long enough i mean) to remember the actual forum thingies

[fallow saffron]

Tokyo Drift

[waxen mauve]

this is the way, so no

[fiery isle]

we're trying the way that workrs

[marsh depot]

Free game isn't a charity, it's a business strategy. If you don't have any more arguments aside from "omg it's free stop complaining" and aren't willing to listen to anyone else, I don't know what you're doing aside from stirring the pot.

[celest maple]

Wizardcrab, are you really sure that cosmetics cannot be made to be made that are earnable in-game? Even just achievements or something that could be hard to earn like with PoE or even pets like with quests. The Kitsuu would have been perfect as a quest earnable especially with rewards aside from furniture that people could show off in-game as a way of showing how much time they've spent or done in-game.

[ivory vessel]

this is the last time i'm gonna engage with you, please read the other messages. this channel is the way. have a nice timezone

[gentle hill]

cry no buddy we came to tell the issue so that we can play in better vibe

[pulsar meteor]

Did we discover the soup emergency?

[red spire]

clearly its working lol

[west marlin]

Okay
Guys don't take the bait 🙄

[midnight flame]

Also no game is "free" it costs time at minimum and if a company wants us to spend Time then they have to make their product usable. Complaining is perfectly valid and was encouraged by the dev currently talking to us.

[neat compass]

I see that you're new here, but you may want to try to make your contributions to the discussion here a little more constructive. They're apparently going to be cracking down on this sort of thing.

[tribal field]

All I know is like. New players seeing this are just going to bounce which sucks. Palia is an amazing game and I will gladly encourage more people to play it

[glacial knot]

yeah i was gonna say something but theyre baiting. just ignore

[waxen mauve]

yeah i'm just blocking them, it's easier than dealing with that

[scarlet hazel]

ok i need to go back to gardening before it hits 6am game time

[red spire]

cracking down on what? there doing a decent job at the game

[waxen mauve]

can we make the topic the accessibility issues?

[raven orbit]

I actually submitted a quest idea to feedback a bit ago that was a quest with tau to get a free plumehound pet - i'm still hoping it falls into the hands of someone and they implement it

[worn snow]

people like complaining socially. (pls dont take this the wrong way discussion besties ily). this is the route to complain socially. leave us be in our swamp like einar we're having fun.

this is my oneness is complaining about things 😌

[glacial knot]

ignore the troll

[celest maple]

Bless you and I hope so too

[warm python]

Crisis averted

[gentle hill]

so true

[lucid hornet]

Don't get me wrong, this should not sound attacking in any way.
But from reading that, it sounds like you took note of gifting in Riot's LoL. If thats right, i'd say "won't satisfy many" is a understatement and I really hope I am wrong with my assumption.

[red spire]

this is a discussion thread not a complaing thread maybe bring up ideas? not put people down

[narrow narwhal]

Yeah we're going to be coming out with a roadmap, closer to Elderwood launch.

[warm python]

Thankfully the soup (well, instant ramen) was not in there

[livid lagoon]

I have said this a fair few times in the past, but even comments that aren't really constructive and does nothing but present a sentiment (even if that sentiment is anger or memeing about S6's failures) is still something one can gleam something constructive from. I don't think anyone said this, but just as an example, "the store is just cash-grabby utter trash, S6 doesn't know what the heck they are doing" isn't really constructive per se and is borderline rude, but it still says how something has been received, and just how badly people feel about it, etc.

[waxen mauve]

but also, it's effective. it's what's got us responses because we don't hear anything back from feedback submitted via the website.

[supple finch]

Is the mushroom glider really only available if you unlock with switch?
Like I have the privilege of having a switch and I still managed to lock myself out of gaining what is probably the most popular theme of items in the decade

[normal saddle]

Oh hey, not related to the current conversation but it's been eating at me for a couple days. What's up with everyone having something duck related in their user name on here? Coincidence or did I miss something?

[crystal lagoon]

To be honest, I started playing this game when it was FIRST released and came back a year later and was like "there's... still nothing new?" 😭

[sinful birch]

Speaking of accessibility issues... individual sound sliders, please.
That tuning fork ting is painful. I want to mute that thing.

[red spire]

i think a road map is a great idea. do you guys by chance do weekly blogs

[ivory vessel]

welp. everything changes, nothing changes; VFX toggle is still a lie and now we can't discuss the game anymore at the risk of it being repetitive, which renders this entire channel useless. tech help's been banned without warning, so good luck, yall.

[raven orbit]

Can you confirm if this roadmap will mention accessibility?

[livid lagoon]

Closer to Elderwood? We're almost in March mate. You have Q2 targeted. Even with late Q2, this just reeks of yet another "oh hey, here's the roadmap, Elderwoods release is next week".

[fallow saffron]

I’m also having ramen! Gluten free because allergies

[worn snow]

that too. but even if it didnt do anything i would think it was okay to just be whiny babies (not that i think... ykwim. i dont think that but if i did it would be okay.)

[waxen mauve]

i have the sound basically off for these reasons

[warm python]

boooo allergies

[sleek abyss]

A dev is here replying which hardly ever happens so obv it is

[normal saddle]

Dang, a sad life you live without gluten. I can somewhat relate because i'm alergic to chamomile and that stuff smells so good

[supple finch]

Lmao I just joined this server but love Streisand effect of making an announcement about complaint that is sparking people complaining out of frustration

[sinful birch]

I need the sounds loud on and up for most resources... like that's how I have 100+ heatroots is from hearing their sound. but then other sounds are just outrageously and unnecessarily loud in comparison. Sliders would be greatly appreciated.

[scarlet hazel]

now im thinking of a cozy farm sim with pokemon with being able to be a human or a pokemon.... mmmmmm i doubt there's a game or server out there like it 💔

[worn snow]

it actually happens a lot w wc. i say this very neutrally but of the mods and devs and cms he's been the best at communicating thus far imo

[west marlin]

Classic

[red spire]

yes and yet people are still complaing while hes talking? maybe they should start talking about updates/ bugs /whats in store/ weekly Q&A etc.

[lyric night]

I rly hope u considered ur masculine representing/non-binary players as well for the gifting feature u guys worked on

most are already upset about the lack of outfits to choose from anyways

[supple finch]

I want to turn off the bug sparkle noise so bad

[raven orbit]

Having explicit confirmation that the roadmap will address accessibility would definitely ease concerns about feeling of lack of concern for it /gen

[fallow saffron]

Ah I love chamomile. Gluten is everywhere! I have to check my lotions and shampoos to make sure they are gluten free. Gluten is even in dry wall sometimes 😭

[crystal lagoon]

It doesn't exist yet publicly for download but look up PokeForce, it is actively being coded ❤️

[midnight flame]

Absolutely this

[waxen mauve]

i fully agree sliders would be preferable and help a lot with this, it's unfortunate that i HAVE to have the sounds basically off because i cannot handle some of the sounds

[vapid pendant]

It's in drywall?! I thought it was a food thing!

[gentle hill]

alright guys i have nothing more to cry about so i will go and put lure and hunt and get good people around for it

[waxen mauve]

and *some of us enby folk would like more gender neutral outfits, please

[red spire]

@narrow narwhal is there any future updates to expand the clothing directory for people that do not purchase from the store?

[warm python]

Drywall what--- Well, at least it shouldn't be hard to not lick drywall /j (in all seriousness I imagine it's the dust from it, that sucks)

[vapid pendant]

And without chest bounce please

[fiery isle]

what was that warning... is drywall a banned topic now? I can't keep up

[normal saddle]

Shampoo?? Drywall?! Dang, bread really is the basis of human civilization. Although, the thought of buying a house and asking the sales person "Hey, is this house gluten free?" is sending me

[worn snow]

i always quote froggies on this bc i always think ab him talking ab this once, but the longer s6 puts off accessibility concerns the harder they'll have to work to put them in later :// i already worry it's too late but im a pessimist sometimes

[sleek abyss]

Lol, they're asking questions and clarifying everything he's saying. Nobody is refuting everything he's saying. Players are voicing out and glad a dev is actually taking the time to answer and have this conversations. You're the only one seeing anything negative about this exchange. Obv players are displeased and are rightfully so?

[late sage]

ok no more baiting im just gonna buy things in the shop byyyyyyyye

[fallow saffron]

Gluten can be in drywall, playdoh, envelopes, toothpaste.. there’s so much

[west marlin]

Who are all these people

[waxen mauve]

please. i would really like some less dysphoric options 😅

[glacial knot]

industry plants

[fallow saffron]

[livid lagoon]

Ehh, to put it like this: Let S6 show their hand. Their instructions are vaguer than the difference between Eggshell White and Yesterday's Eggshell White. Let them do their warning and banning, show where their line truly lies.

[west marlin]

Tourists

[vapid pendant]

I feel sorry for you Ace really

[narrow narwhal]

So one point of clarity is that essentially every live software product has known bugs in every release of the product. The bugs are categorized into severities, and depending on context you might do different actions based on that. If it's really bad and unfixable you might cancel or delay a release. If it's really bad but fixable you might do a "release integration" where you put a fix into an already cut build. This is in itself a very risky thing to do because you're introducing changes AFTER most of the testing has already occurred, so you only do this with non risky fixes for high severity issues. Other problems are caught during final phases of testing might be labeled "known shippable" if the fix is too risky or the severity isn't high enough.

QA is a whole big discipline with a lot of science and experience behind it, but that's a quick primer on how known bugs get into patches.

[supple finch]

Yesss they have my haircut free by some miracle but literally nothing I want to wear. Mostly because on the outfits I do like the tops red color swatch has purple in it for some reason and the bottoms don’t

[normal saddle]

plsss! yes! The closest I get is being a rooten tootin cowboy or pretending im a war overlord in the red and silver "Harness your power" outfit

[west marlin]

Amen

[raven orbit]

This. This is my fear. The longer you put off accessibility, the more work making the game accessible will be, which means the more the excuse of "oh well its too much work/it takes time" will be used to try and shut down disabled players.

There needs to be explicit dialogue on accessibility, especially in regard to if it will even be addressed on the roadmap.

[marsh depot]

Genchat must be real boring rn if people are jumping into discussions

[waxen mauve]

if you're already working on responding to this ignore me, but can you also clarify that the roadmap will definitely include what accessibility features/issues are being addressed/planned to address?

[late sage]

better?

[supple marsh]

the bald boys of bahari find us on shinori yorus twitch

[fallow saffron]

I’m slowly replacing my foods with gluten free stuff so that’s good! The other day I ate an entire fruit

[narrow narwhal]

Yes, but not super soon.

[warm python]

[vapid pendant]

Yay!

[scarlet hazel]

nodding along. and yeah. is accessibility still being developed? there are a lot of things that are keeping the game from being accessable and each update gets a little worse. has feedback about it been read?

[neat compass]

I don't see an issue with people jumping into discussions even if they've never been here before. You don't need to be a "regular" to talk about the game. But if negative feedback needs to be constructive, then I think the same should be required for positive feedback

[fallow saffron]

I can never have another McDonald’s fry

[marsh depot]

I'm just side eyeing what's happening here while watching Baby Driver but it's certainly been a day that will go down in Palia discussions history

[raven orbit]

It might have gotten lost in the sauce, but can you say if the planned roadmap will explicitly address accessibility?

[supple marsh]

why?

[worn snow]

and then it's that picture of that cycle of inaccessibility bc they'll also argue that there aren't enough people who need example accessibility option and...ahhhh then it takes longer and is harder

[ivory vessel]

what accessibility? S6 doesn't do that

[supple finch]

I’m intolerant to fruits that aren’t berries or citrus

[glacial knot]

Have yall ever considered a test realm to try stuff out before releasing it? Because I work in QA and we won't push updates before testing it thoroughly

[scarlet hazel]

that would be my nightmare. mcdonald fries are so good

[vapid pendant]

And the nuggies!

[west marlin]

Yes WC has mentioned it before and said it's not feasible

[loud axle]

This is very good! Do you think it'll just be free and immediately accessible or are you / the team more receptive to some cash-shop-separate, earnable free cosmetics after hearing the feedback?

[glacial knot]

ah okay, bummer. im not sure how there's a downside though

[supple marsh]

real concern: when can i lay on the damn ground? im tired

[warm python]

burger king fries are the best to me, mcdonalds are fine, wendys are way too soggy

anyway I'm getting off topic sorry--

[waxen mauve]

the answer that i saw was there will be a roadmap released closer to Elderwood, but a) we don't know when that is, b) it was not clear that accessibility will be addressed in the roadmap

[west marlin]

#💬│palia-discussions message

[sinful birch]

Releasing a roadmap might just cause the same amount of chaos, if not more, because there'll be people that read that list as set in stone promises and then rage if things aren't implemented as listed.

[celest maple]

Agreed, positive and negative echo chambers are both equally bad ( I say this as an in-general statement )

[narrow narwhal]

I can't promise any particular level of granularity. We're still figuring out what format the roadmap will take. But there's no reason why accessibility features would be specifically excluded.

[crystal lagoon]

It just means we can hold them accountable

[normal saddle]

okay but legit I want to be able to lounge on the loungewear and my bed

[waxen mauve]

you can't promise that accessibility are among the things that are being addressed and thus would be in the roadmap?

[loud axle]

(Previously I know it was the position that there was going to be a clear line between earnable cosmetics and what not but I wonder if there could be a grey area for stuff that ISN'T in the cash shop, but still considered a cosmetic.)

[fallow saffron]

McDonald’s fries aren’t gluten free and I’m allergic

[scarlet hazel]

its felt like they've been ignored for awhile. Key point: the snowball issue. that took a year to be fixed and was emt with a... lot of silence.

[supple marsh]

like let me stargaze on my picnic blanket!

[west marlin]

That's a professional level non answer 😂

[narrow narwhal]

We are open to feedback ❤️

[marsh depot]

Yeah I dont blame you, I've been staying away too because these past days have been something. Remember your wellbeing comes first always!

[vapid pendant]

And nearly killed some of our friends by putting them in the hospital!

[lethal granite]

a precious typo was pointed out to me, so i do need to clarify: i am not dead.

[supple marsh]

oh god i just ate them for the both of us then

[pulsar meteor]

Yer a lurker, Ciri

[normal saddle]

https://tenor.com/view/homer-homer-simpson-simpsons-worst-day-of-your-life-so-far-bart-gif-11689059539835963602

[fallow saffron]

Taking one (fry) for the team

[waxen mauve]

to clarify my above question: when you were asked about accessibility issues being addressed, your answer was that the roadmap would be released closer to Elderwood. when asked to clarify that accessibility would be included in that roadmap, your answer is that you can't say it will be?

[raven orbit]

I sure hope accessibility would be on the roadmap...there's been no acknowledgement of it thus far and a roadmap would be a perfect place to let folks know you're finally going to prioritize it /gen

[crystal lagoon]

unimportant but i immediately without pause read that in Hagrid voice 🥹

[worn snow]

to be fair, because they have (been ignored/forgotten) in the vast majority of patch notes thus far.

i gave up a long time ago but iirc froggies and valk and i had a running joke of when s6 would mention accessibility in patch notes. @raven orbit (sry for ping) do u rmbr this?

[scarlet hazel]

maybe making a more put together feedback form would be helpful? i know the feedback form is okay right now but something where do know our feedback is being taken and read, that would be very reassuring.

[warm python]

Them keeping their cards close to their chest and not addressing anything fuels the powderkeg, unfortunately. They don't have to commit to a date or anything, but if people at least know things are in the pipeline, it helps.

Not knowing anything leads to assumptions, then people are going to get angry anyway about things being or not being in the game. Or how they're implemented. Roadmaps aren't perfect but in my experience they help a lot more than hurt

[west marlin]

Oh for sure, my comment was just eye brow raised at brand new accounts that joined an hour ago and immediately got hostile in discussions kinda engagement

[midnight flame]

Can you tell us if accessibility issues are currently being worked on? Is there a team focused on these issues which can at times injure and disadvantage your disabled players?

[loud axle]

So, this was kind of the response we got when asking for a roadmap early on in development.

My take on a roadmap: it's a good OUTLINE - not specific - but also a good way to hold the company accountable for what goals they do and don't meet. It's totally acceptable to need to push some things back or something comes up later that one or two things aren't feasible, but if half the list isn't completed... THEN that's not a good sign.

[crystal lagoon]

a master list of suggestions. X if they can't be implemented type thing would be AMAZING.

[raven orbit]

I don't remember a specific joke, but I know every time I've read the patch notes I've hoped they would mention accessibility and they never have

[fallow saffron]

Oh no D:
I’m technically not supposed to consume too much citrus since they mess with my antidepressants but- orange juice

[neat compass]

Oh for sure, I'm on the same page don't worry lol. That is the very nonconstructive "positivity" I was referring to.

[raven orbit]

I get not wanting to say "yes we are doing X thing" but I feel like it's pretty easy to say "yes, we're working on accessibility" or "no we aren't working on accessibility at this time" /gen

[crystal lagoon]

🫂 I just started this journey with another med and feel this in my soul. I wish I could chug OJ for us.

[supple marsh]

🫡

[waxen mauve]

this is clear, and concerning when "general accessibility issues" are apparently something they haven't decided whether they're working on or not

[west marlin]

I agree it goes both ways and everyone gotta be accountable to high standard

[polar elbow]

when I read the monetization blog for the first time, I assumed that the "you can't buy what you earn, can't earn what you buy" line applied on a per-item basis. (example: fairy outfit is in cash shop so it can never be earned) I felt that was a reasonable line to draw, and assumed there would be earnable options too, just not the same ones as those in the cash shop.
When I learned that the "bought, therefore not earnable" line applied to cosmetics in their entirety I was baffled.

[livid lagoon]

The one thing that was asked but wasn't actually addressed here is the choice to not push back patches. Why aren't patches pushed back to address things before release? I understand there is more or less no such thing as bug-free releases, but a fair bunch of the issues that have gotten into release branches are rather extreme... yet someone in the company signed off on sending it with these bugs present rather than pushing it back to fix the worst of these.

For this specific patch, while pavers isn't as high a severity bug as something like proper crashes, corruption and whatnot, considering how much decor is part of the core gameplay loop of the game why was the patch not pushed back a week to deal with this for instance? This does make certain projects impossible to do, and has even made people go "yeah, I can't bear to deal with logging in to my plot". Not to mention the extreme flashing (Z-fighting) this produces with some builds.

[fiery isle]

I think the silence implies they are not 😦

[ivory vessel]

einarbot for the love of all things holy it's just periods. for dramatic pause

[fiery perch]

I dont remember a specific joke either, but honestly we also would make jokes together a lot as a whole. And Accessibility is something that I rarely see mentioned, and it always made me saddened. I always hoped for it to be mentioned.

That aside, I do know we have talked a lot about too, about how the longer accessibility gets put off, the harder it'll be to implement or the less likely it seems it might be. I think Froggies talked about that a bit earlier

[warm python]

Like yeah at the risk of constantly repeating myself, it's all about communication, and people are going to be less presumptious and bitter if they feel more aware of what's going on. Especially in a beta, where communication should be at its highest!

[tribal field]

Was it epilepsy?

[pulsar meteor]

Piggybacking off this, maybe periodic updates of how many form submissions or different topics y'all received and maybe a snapshot of biggest ask, so folks have more confidence it's at least going somewhere?

[narrow narwhal]

More like I won't promise anything in the roadmap at all right now. It would be deeply unfair for me to sign my team members up for public commitments in this moment that they have not agreed to. EDIT: agreed to be signed up publicly for

[crystal lagoon]

I do worry the dev is responding to everything else except the accessibility which is more than game quality of life, it has to deal with actual life.

[waxen mauve]

heck i'm just asking if they plan to include what they ARE doing for accessibility on the roadmap, not what they're planning to do

[neat compass]

Definitely! Also I feel the need to tell you I did not mean to repeat "oh for sure" right back to you. It looks like I was mocking you and I most definitely was not, my brain just isn't braining today

[warm python]

if I had a penny for every time I got bonked for long elipseses I'd be rich

[west marlin]

Don't worry I didn't even notice 😂

[glacial knot]

personally i'd like to know how a test realm isn't feasible, but piling up on bugs is a better option

[ivory vessel]

one could assume that they don't care about accessibility, right? winkwonk
*edit typo

[raven orbit]

So if accessibility is on the roadmap it's something that is likely bare bones or just being addressed since it's not even known if it will be addressed, got it /gen

[warm python]

Beta is the prime time there ought to be back and forth between the game and the community

[west marlin]

Don't take this the wrong way, but I think accessibility would be the one thing that's agreeable and something for a game Dev team to commit to...?

[vapid pendant]

For my friend yeah I don't know about the other Kres mentioned though

[red spire]

what kind of accessibility are we talking about?

[waxen mauve]

why is this not something the team has an answer for, though? this is an issue that has been heavily discussed and there is a ton of feedback about accessibility problems, it's something i have mentioned to you before and i know other people have as well, it should be something that you have a canned response for whether accessibility is on the roadmap

[lethal granite]

previous* oh lordt

[narrow narwhal]

We don't have bugs because we lack a test realm. The vast majority of the bugs people experience or mention here are known. The limiting factor is much more often the dev time required to fix them, solidly and permanently, and without making other bugs.

[worn snow]

i will say that accessibility playing a large part in the roadmap is important to earn back trust after it's been ignored for so long

[crystal lagoon]

visual, audio. There's flashes and sounds that trigger people in the game. Adding sliders, fixing the flashes or making an epilepsy mode is quite dooable

[midnight flame]

So that's a "no" to currently working on accessibility. That's fair enough, if you don't want disabled players to be comfortable and safe playing your game I will take my cash and time to a game that doesn't skirt the issue this hard.

[crystal lagoon]

I think it would go a long way to say "Hey I am not experienced in this, but it is important so I'll bring it up to them asap."

[raven orbit]

I'll be completely honest, if accessibility doesn't end up being on the roadmap I think it will be the last straw for many of us. If there is ever a time to mention accessibility, its on the roadmap leading up to your incredibly hyped-up release. /gen

[red spire]

pretty sure this is in the terms and conditions ?

[west marlin]

😭 I feel like that's the one thing that's easy to commit to

[loud axle]

What's the team size these days? Have more people been brought back on since the acquisition?

[celest maple]

Same, tbh. Probably just gonna be lurking and emoji'ing people mostly

[waxen mauve]

the inability to commit to it being on the roadmap - just generally, not even specifically what issues would be - is enough to make me feel very done, right now, with Palia.

[fiery isle]

I don't think we're asking whether they could get sued - just what's right. If they're causing literal harm, that is bad.

[vapid pendant]

Farm Folks and Infinity Nikki let me know if you want in

[sinful birch]

Oh I agree, just with how this server tends to explode during patches / updates / etc... I forsee roadmap talks getting rough in here... which their latest announcement makes out to seem they want to avoid that.

[scarlet hazel]

well if that isnt feaseable, what about accessability like everyone else is asking about? its really disheartening that this game says its inclusive but... no mentions of accessability are around oranything.

[narrow narwhal]

yes more people have been brought back on since the acquisition, but I'm not sure that we talk about overall team size

[livid lagoon]

Genuine question you might not want to answer honestly: Is the game just spaghetti code? Has it been mismanaged so much it is suffering from major scope creep and tech debt even before coming out of beta?

And I know it's not a flattering question, but hoping for actual honesty about tough to have to say things.

[red spire]

no if you sign the terms and conditions then you cant sue?

[fiery isle]

you are not listening

[warm python]

Honestly aside from the inevitable initial explosion, it'd cut down a bit on the explosions every patch so people at least can set some expectations

[west marlin]

No one is talking about sueing...

[waxen mauve]

ignore/block them, it's not worth it

[ivory vessel]

... my brother in [insert preferred deity here], what do you mean you don't have people testing stuff before it goes live

[lethal granite]

genuinely wondering cos this is my area of expertise but i do not work in gaming specifically: is the game not impacted by the European Accessibility Act?

[worn snow]

it's also really broad too, like it could mean a ton of things from sound design to controllers. saying there will be accessibility mentioned somewhere on the roadmap could mean anything.

[loud axle]

That's not entirely true.

Even if you sign your life away, if you can still prove willful negligence / malicious intent you could still sue pretty much anyone.

[red spire]

no i am. if you have eplispy and you choose to play the game after the terms that is your fault.

[warm python]

Anyway

[west marlin]

Okay

[waxen mauve]

it's based in the US to my knowledge, so i don't think it is

[narrow narwhal]

I honestly just don't want to put my foot in my mouth. I can speak more candidly about the premium content because that's my area. I'm much more hesitant to speak about other people's areas. But I think the point of "we want to know what you're working on for accessibility" is something I can take back to the team and work on. It'd probably get integrated into the roadmap discussion but maybe there's an earlier beat we can talk about it?

[crystal lagoon]

Or, the devs could make a game that doesn't send people to the hospital for having a medical condition

[waxen mauve]

can you commit to getting us an answer from the team about whether accessibility specifically is going to be on the roadmap?

[west marlin]

Don't take the bait

[fiery perch]

Accessibility is definitely something that should be prioritized. There's been cases where people can't do specific skills, play, etc. I know you have been trying to at least fix some when it gets brought up relentlessly (the white flash for example, snowballs.) However, it still needs to be worked on.

I know there are some people who can't fish due to mobility issues, not being able to stay still (so needing to bounce, move around, restless for one reason or another). Some people can't hunt, bug hunt, etc, for similar reasons. There are also folks who are locked out of gales because of mobility issues, or for other reasons (like mine, where i just cant do it due to my crippling fear of heights).

There's also audio issues with the game-- as in, some people struggle processing it. Having a individual sound sliders would help with this- being able to toggle which one is louder than the other. I also will always suggest what Fortnite has, with the audio indicator around on the screen, to pinpoint where specific things are.

UI slider/improvements. Being able to change font. (dyslexic friendly font please. <3)

I know this is already mentioned, and I brought it up before, but of course having a photosensitivity warning when you load the game. Turning off visual effects, etc. There's def a lot that can be worked on to make the game feel more like 'home', inclusive, and overall a more safe environment for a lot of folks. There's other things that can help, too, of course.

I typed more than I meant to, but ah well. I cant help it sometimes when it comes to this stuff. I just hope this at least gets noted down, or something.

[fiery isle]

yeah I have to block them before I say something that gets me banned.... what a bad person

[marsh depot]

Don't bother, this is the same kind of person who blames the victim. Ignore/block and report.

[neat compass]

I can understand why WC wouldn't want to make a statement on behalf of his team if he can't be certain of the answer. He doesn't code the game, so he shouldn't promise that the people who do work on the code will or will not deliver something. However, it's concerning that we receive so many answers regarding many other developmental things such as the nonexistent VFX toggle, snailgate, bugs, etc, but the prioritization of accessibility is the one topic he appears to be unable to address.

[west marlin]

The fortnite audio indicator is incredible

[lethal granite]

the EAA is applicable to anything released in the EU, so anything available in the EU is subject to the law regardless of where the dev team is based. i just do not know if games are affected by it and to what extent.

[crystal lagoon]

Literally. I ignored them lmao. They are anti-accessibility which shows they are privledged. I am glad it's accessible for them, but wanting all of our friends to be able to play is fair.

Because someone has a condition should not bar them from experiencing a game. Period.

[scarlet hazel]

well having the person or people in charge of accessability coming in here to talk about it would be very reassuring tbh.

and well, aside from gifting, more simple designs like the omata outfit would be appreciated. simple outfits and hairs that fit into the world would be amazing to see so much more of as it grounds them into the worlds lore. more furniture doing that, houses, etc would be amazing too!

[fiery perch]

It is literally so helpful. And I think it would work well in palia, with helping to show where some forageables might be, bugs, huntables. It'd really really help, I think. I recommend it so much and have tried to suggest it when I can!

Same with minecraft subtitles. That would probably help too!

[waxen mauve]

i would love if the person in charge of accessibility would come talk to us

[midnight flame]

This would be amazing

[west marlin]

I think what people want to hear and be reassured of is that s6 values accessibility and prioritizes it enough for it to be even mentioned on a road map

[marsh depot]

I am not a disabled person myself but I can't imagine lacking basic empathy for people who just want to be able to play a game without putting their health at risk.

[glacial knot]

well i know that's not the initial reason for the bugs. but having a way to test helps you catch things beforehand. i'm not going to tell, nor am i trying to tell you how to do your job. i figured since there are soooo many known bugs, why not find a way to circumvent the cycle? thanks for responding though

[worn snow]

(is there a person who's the head of accessibility at s6?)

[raven orbit]

I think it should be stressed that people really just want the bare minimum - to be shown you actually care. No one wants specifics like "yes this feature will be out in 2 patches", we just want to know that you're actually working on it. We've been here since 2023, some since alpha I'm sure, getting ignored so we really just want the bare minimum /gen

[scarlet hazel]

yeah. like just anything and proof of it would be amazing

[waxen mauve]

this would be a good time to find out

[west marlin]

Is that person Vega? I know they have been an advocate for accessibility in the past

[neat compass]

I think Vega primarily works on narrative/writing for the game but I could be wrong

[fiery perch]

They do!

[west marlin]

I thought so too but they were active in #♿│accessibility-discussions

[waxen mauve]

yeah, at no point was i asking what specific issues are being addressed in the roadmap, i just want to know THAT accessibility is on the roadmap at all. a lack of commitment to that is so worrisome.

[crystal lagoon]

I would love that so much for the access dev to come chat. I do not have epilespy, but incredibly sensitive eyes due to lack of a specific type of vein, as well as conditions that make sounds/lighting unbearable.

It doesn't affect my livelihood, but it gives me a basic understanding that this should have been the priority from day one. If it affects me, minorly handicapped.. I can't fathom what it does to people who are more medically challenged.

[raven orbit]

WC mentioned a bit ago that they were doing accessibility consulting but there's little information about if they actually have an accessibility consultant or if they just hired for a one-off (which accessibility consulting is something that needs to be consistent, not a one off thing)

[narrow narwhal]

Vega is not responsible for accessibility, but has been a wonderful advocate. I think it goes without saying but please don't go hound them for answers ❤️

[worn snow]

honestly (again no offense to anyone specifically) s6's stance on accessibility has been kinda.... ehhh flakey and a bit wishy washy from the get go

[fiery perch]

And I know Vega at least has talked to me (and others here) about ways to hopefully improve temples on the accessibility front. I appreciate them SO much. And feel free to tell them that, WC-- that theyre appreciated when it comes to that stuff.

[brisk spruce]

fun fact: epileptics aren't the only people who are sensitive to flashes. and not all flashes affect every person, even those with the same conditions

[marsh depot]

Everyone benefits from a game having accessibility options, because we never know when we might need them. We often take these things for granted until we are in actual need of them.

[scarlet hazel]

yeah we dont want to hound people for anwsers. but someone who is close or working on accessability features coming in here to talk to us would be great and a very good reassurance that it is a concern s6 knows about and is working on.

[narrow narwhal]

I think we can make a conversation about accessibility a priority. I do not know what form that will take yet. It might still be "it'll be part of the roadmap and the discussions surrounding the roadmap," but I can figure out an answer and get back to you all.

[lyric night]

maybe it would be possible to do an accessibility talk in ur next devblog bcs it was mentioned in the last one that u want to do those updates more frequently again

would definitely be a nice topic to fill a devblog with

[worn snow]

im gna grab reciepts just bc i fear im misremembering (a girl w two thumbs has ocd. this one.)

[polar elbow]

WC, if you can't commit to saying that accessibility will be on the roadmap right now because you don't want to speak for others in the team, can you at the very least say that you can bring it up as a priority issue to said team members and consider making a statement on the matter once the team has had a chance to talk about it? It should absolutely be stressed to the team as a whole how important it is for so much of the community here.

--ooops I type slow, I think you just answered that lmao

[waxen mauve]

can we get an audience with the person we can talk to about the concerns we have regarding accessibility in game? or at the very least a commitment to go and talk to the team and bring back a definitive answer as to whether it's on the roadmap at all?

[ivory vessel]

we don't hound on anyone but you make yourself available here so we speak /gen

[fiery perch]

Yep! myself, and im sure others, don't have epilepsy but might just get overstimulated, are just sensitive so we get headaches for one reason or another, or something else. And even people who don't? Sometimes those flashes can still get to an individual.

[pulsar meteor]

Reading between the lines of their architecture blog and how some bugs have manifested, it sounds like their build management and external server connection process would make it extremely difficult to do a public test server

[scarlet hazel]

just anything that doesnt make accessability feel like a second thought or even like a joke would be amazing and that continuing going forward

[crystal lagoon]

this. migraine triggers are real and debilitating

[livid lagoon]

This here. As you say, it's not his field, and it's totally fair that they can't just make all kinds of promises and have knowledge about everything outside their position. That said, they come here as a representative from the company, and for the time being - lacking CM - seems to have that de facto mantle. But what they do have is access to the relevant people. If the question can be answered, there could be a "I'll fire off a quick request to the team responsible for accessibility on Monday, and try to come back with an answer next week".

[raven orbit]

It really would be nice to know if the constant screaming into the void was amounting to anything /gen

[scarlet hazel]

ill brb. need to put laundry in the drier and then put stuff up

[brisk spruce]

my partner normally has no sensitivity to flashes but the WSOD and snowballs still managed to give him headaches

[west marlin]

I get motion sick from stuff like that

[lethal granite]

at one point, i would have loved to be AN accessibility advisor (more should be required anywhere that does anything user-facing, but i’m the only one with that role “officially” where i work in my team. i just work with awesome devs who care a lot about it, and i doubt that’s exclusive to my team.)

but i can’t. cos i can’t play the game…

[narrow narwhal]

What I'll say is that I absolutely cannot sign up any individual dev to talk directly to the community. That works great for some folks, but its really uncomfortable for others and not a reasonable expectation. But getting answers back to you is a reasonable expectation.

[crystal lagoon]

omg same. Any game that has motion blur, I turn it off immediately. But that's an accessibility option. :D

[fiery perch]

I get major migraines and headaches. And other times I just get very overstimulated, to where I can barely think & it's a struggle. It's rough. It's also why i try to avoid Maji during fireworks if I can. Same with the pop-a-chapaa, bc overstimulating is... yep.

[tribal field]

As someone with epilepsy, I am extremely careful with what I play and watch. Thus far Palia hasn’t given me an issue minus some random flashing glitches but thankfully I’ve not had an episode. I think there are times where I have to take personal responsibility too. I’ve stopped playing games because of my medical issues. I don’t think it’s the fact that they dont care. It’s just a lot of work that goes into making things work properly.

[limpid root]

This is literally all most of us are asking for.

[crystal lagoon]

I can relate and am so sorry you deal with that. It's not fun to want to do something but have to sit it out because one thing in it can send you to bed.

[crystal lagoon]

Most games have a simple "turn flashes off" option, and I do hope they add that for individuals who suffer from this. You deserve to play games too. 💜

[west marlin]

Genuine question, how do you get to a point where the accessibly concerns from the community get resolved if no one is going to interface with the community that needs it.

[brisk spruce]

I think that a snowball flash issue/bug that was reported to them existing for over a year proves that they don't actually care, but I do generally agree. I'm epileptic and sit out of most games. I've had to sit out of Palia a LOT because of these bugs. it feels like they just keep getting worse/more of them stacked on top of each other though

[ivory vessel]

you know what most games also have? photosensitivity warnings, when it applies.

[west marlin]

Because what we've seen is that being vocal about critical issues was the only way to get things changed but now that might be against the rules

[waxen mauve]

I definitely don't think you should be signing anyone up for anything they didn't ask for, and I don't think anyone here is expecting that. An "I can look into this for y'all and get back to you" would genuinely be sufficient. I am also hopeful that your last sentence means you will be doing that, as an anxious autistic who doesn't do well with passive statements 😅

[raven orbit]

The fact that it takes so much just to even have accessibility be asked about doesn't help with people's feelings of being ignored either

[crystal lagoon]

Yeah.... asking for a simple pop up window that says "this contains flashes" type ordeal doesn't seem overly complex and yet...

[livid lagoon]

I'll be honest and say I was about to jump at this after the first half, but thankfully you had that last sentence. We understand you can't just throw anyone in here against their will, that would be bad, but reaching out to them and letting us know you are would be better than the vague drips we keep getting. As said, saying "I'll message them on Monday and try to get back to this next week" rather than just "I can relay the feedback" and then everyone waits for another two months in silence as frustration grows again.

[marsh depot]

The problem is that they're really sending the opposite message by having had let so many issues fly under the radar despite extensive feedback, such as the snowball flashbang and WsoD, without any actual acknowledgment or warnings for the longest time too. This is why communication goes a long way.

[ivory vessel]

thank you, i've been meaning to try and shift the subject back but i didn't wanna cut through a very important conversation about a topic that's been silenced for too long (accessibility)... but we cannot forget that we are forbidden of literally speaking about what we want now

we literally have a news tab in the game that doesn't get used for anything actually relevant, like safety warnings and patch notes.

[worn snow]

finally, found it (everyone's moved on? i know. peace of mind, friends, peace of mind.)

Q: "How accessible will the game be for people who are sensitive to flash, or have hearing problems, as well as for people with reading difficulties? Will you use a dyslexic friendly font?

Can the game be played on adaptive controllers? As some people with disabilities have difficulty playing games."

A: We want everyone who comes to Palia to be able to play! This involves a lot of work, though, and we definitely won’t be able to get to it all at launch. While there are some known issues that we are committed to getting into our launch scope, there are still areas we need to educate ourselves on, and getting feedback from players on what hinders them enjoying Palia is always a great start. We expect to continually add features to support accessibility, and we expect to continually get feedback from our players on how we are doing and how we can improve in that space.

We will be testing the game for visual sensitivity as well as making sure we have individual volume controls to help with audio clarity. There are other features we have planned in regards to both visual and audio difficulties (like colorblindness mode), but depending on the scope some may or may not make it in time for launch.

For controls, we do plan on allowing for free key binding which should allow for integrating with other devices, but full controller support may come at a later time.

TL;DR Accessibility is always part of the conversation, but we will be rolling out bits and pieces as we go.

[marsh depot]

Nintendo did it on the Wii back then. It's really not that hard.

[steady fox]

If my watering can can spam me with messages, so can flashbang warnings.

[fiery perch]

Warnings get put there sometimes, but some people have the announcements turned off unless something new gets posted-- and even then, I still dont have it pop up on my screen for some reason. Even if it did, when something gets edited in, it doesn't mark or pop up again to give said warning.

[narrow narwhal]

It's not that no one is here to interface, it's that it's not everyone's cup of tea to talk directly to community members, nor should it be. Talking directly with the community is super stressful, and a completely unreasonable thing to ask of most people who just want to do their craft. But they can still read the feedback and act accordingly.

[raven orbit]

Of those we have colourblindness settings and...half broken brightness settings

[worn snow]

whenever the game design philosophy "ask the team archives" was made.

[late sage]

@narrow narwhal could I ask how many people are on the dev team?

[crystal lagoon]

I think there was a question to the game being spaghetti coded, and I think it was a genuine question with so many hands in the pot.

Dev mentioned that there are new hands on board which could cause more issues since they aren't up to date on the game.. but with fresh people comes fresh eyes.

There's no reason accessibility shouldn't be a priority. Over cosmetics, over content. Hurting people and ignoring that makes the company complicit in that individuals harm.

[west marlin]

I wouldn't want to pressure anyone into that either

[tribal field]

Palia has a warning on the switch, and I think most games have an epilepsy warning in general. : “WARNING: If you have epilepsy or have had seizures or other unusual reactions to flashing lights or patterns, consult a doctor before playing video games. All users should read the Health and Safety Information available in the system settings before using this software “

[ivory vessel]

oh, i meant directly in the game. the news tab, where we get potato pods, stickers and other useless junk. it should be used to inform all players of relevant things, instead of gatekeeping it to the discord- but that's a convo we've been through a couple of times and oz forbid we repeat subjects now

[crystal lagoon]

Isn't that just the nintendo generic warning?

[fiery perch]

OH! I understand what you mean now, yes. whoops

[fiery isle]

that'd explain why I hadn't seen one on PC

[red spire]

so your telling me people are by passing this warning and still playing and having this issue?

[lethal granite]

just realized my question likely can’t be answered bc it’s probably a legal issue. unfortunate, but it’s fair that i can’t get a response. i hope the EAA has been on your radar tho, cos… if it affects games, you might have a whole… situation on your hands.

[tribal field]

Yes it is, but it’s something that I always look for before playing any game.

[steady fox]

I could be commenting on something that has already been spoken about - but if this is such a concern, why don't you open up channels for people to post feedback (a private one, even) and have a team of people who reply to that feedback?
The lack of response is where people get so frustrated. It's not impossible, many games do it in FAQ/Ticket systems. The posts can be anonymous as well as the replies, and it would save a lot of drama/repeated questions if it were actually posted somewhere.
Y'all don't have to actively talk one on one with the community to hear us. You only need to see it and reply accordingly.

[west marlin]

Don't take the bait

[fiery perch]

Palia does not have a warning, at least not on PC. I can guarantee you.

It gives it ONCE when you make your account, but this is important for me to mention, because at the time for some players, there was not as many flashes or anything in the game whatsoever. That slowly and gradually got added in overtime.

[crystal lagoon]

If it is a nintendo generic warning, it happens before every game not making it specific to Palia is what I am getting at, if that makes sense 💜

[worn snow]

this is also kind of the most recent "roadmap" we've gotten from s6 regarding accessibility which is sad bc idk when it was that it was made, but it says it was updated 2 years ago

[ivory vessel]

good one einarbot

[warm python]

Ignoring the troll, I see the epilepsy warning on most games I played, even games I dont think really need it. Not on Nintendo, just in general

heck a game I playtested in a super rough state earlier this year already had it in

[steady fox]

[west marlin]

Yikes

[trail pendant]

wait gluten

[crystal lagoon]

The fact this is standard and Palia ignores it is wild.

[worn snow]

it simply doesn't feel like accessibility is always part of the conversation ://

[red spire]

theres a issues and feedback channel on the left hand side of discord. if they just scroll down. this is the discussion channel not for feedback

[steady fox]

I am discussing

[worn snow]

i am discussing with wizardcrab in fact!!

[tribal field]

So would it make everyone feel better if S6 put an epilepsy warning as the game opens?

[warm python]

Yeah I was kinda surprised not to see it, especially what with everything coming to a head now (which in part isn't new, i.e. the snowballs being a thing from last year)

[steady fox]

Actually, this would be a very simple way to placate people, yes.

[worn snow]

as a start, yes indeed

[narrow narwhal]

I cannot stress enough how stressful it is to reply to the community, anonymous or not. It's one of the big reasons why CMs exist. It's also why we need a CM (like y'all have been saying), and why we're hiring someone for that role. I know that's not the most satisfying answer but that's where we're at.

[west marlin]

Yes but that's really not the point of asking for accessibility improvements

[vapid pendant]

Well duh yes

[fallow saffron]

Yup gluten in the drywall

[warm python]

It wouldn't fix the accessibility issues at heart but it is at least the bare minimum tbh

[red spire]

then stop bringing up the accesibility issue? like bring up what you want in the game not something that theres already a clause for. theres issues and we get it.

[fiery perch]

It was be one step in the direction. I've tried to let them know about this for a while, yes. it's a start.

[trail pendant]

the fact that I rejoined jsut to reply to that message

[glacial knot]

they want accessibility options in game

[narrow narwhal]

Seems reasonable, but I cannot make any promises. But I'll look into it.

[neat compass]

How is this constructive?

[vapid pendant]

While you're here can you block this idiot?

[midnight flame]

It isn't, just put them on ignore.

[brisk spruce]

I want less flashing bugs in the game, because without the bugs I can play the game fine. the actual intended features are safe for me

[waxen mauve]

please just ignore them, they're trolling to distract

[warm python]

Might help someone playing the game for the first time pause and do some research into it if they think they'll be affected by it to see what the deets are

[sleek abyss]

This ableist is so annoying

[glacial knot]

Yup, just blocked

[marsh depot]

Don't take the bait, they're victim blaming. Reminder modmail exists so we don't have to deal with this.

[crystal lagoon]

It makes me sad for people who were affected because what someone mentioned before, is that there may have been one warning but never again on PC. I honestly don't remember the warning but I made my account when it released.

That being said, updates happen, bugs happen and it's not hard to have warnings on things. It's not hard to code in a pop up box, spaghetti code or not.

There's a lot of negligence here on behalf of S6 that has been ignored so much, and tip toed around that it's very clear it isn't a priority.

Every game these days, has this warning whether it's necessary or not and with most games I have to click past this every time I log into the game. Get with the times, Palia or admit you don't care about individuals with medical disabilities so they can move on.

[neat compass]

Hey I'm fine with ignoring people, but if S6 posts telling us to be constructive with our negative feedback then I expect the people who are here just to antagonize to be held to the same standard.

[scarlet hazel]

has no one reported them to modmail...? or is modmail not working, again?

[red spire]

yeah throwing a smoke bomb around a stared bug that glows is the problem?

[tribal field]

It took me less than 30 seconds to find the epilepsy warning on google, even if it wasn’t on the front of the game screen. Not every game will give me that courtesy and I know that so I go and look myself most times. Not that it’s ok or anything. But most people won’t cater to my epilepsy and I’ve learned that I have to live with that.

[marsh depot]

I have already, will have to wait.

[waxen mauve]

i agree, but report them instead of engaging - it's not our job to police

[steady fox]

In the most respectful way possible, I'm very aware of how stressful it is, I did the same job for a community for several years while studying - it is absolutely not reasonable to expect someone to do all of that. It's one of the most mentally taxing things to do, and I currently work in the Social Work scene.
That being said, there are ways to listen and respond to your community without putting all of that public pressure on one person's shoulders.
In the meantime, the most simple way would be somewhere we can exclusively see genuine replies to issues in one place, rather than them getting buried.
If continuous issue spam is the problem, put the answers somewhere easier to find

[fiery perch]

Hi, my name is Ori and I do my best to advocate for accessibility for myself and others. Nice to meet you. I will keep talking about this and advocating it when I can, especially because I have done it in a constructive manner. If you're going to continue talking like this, please don't. We're trying to be constructive, get clarification and answers on some things, becuase it's important for a lot of the playerbase.

And with that, i'll def do my best to ignore you. But nice to meet you nonetheless o7

[pulsar meteor]

In fairness, some of the effects we've seen in Palia have been (presumably unintentionally) much more abrupt or severe than in other games, especially those in the cozy sim genre, so it's not unreasonable to want more than the legal boilerplate cover

[vapid pendant]

Yeah! Get them Orii! 😁

[worn snow]

the accessibility stuff has been a problem since before wc was the only cm, too. just... so we all temper our expectations... idk it just continually seems like Not a Big Priority to them

[waxen mauve]

like we literally just want someone to tell us that they're going to go talk to the team and let us know that accessibility is on the roadmap or not, lol

[glacial knot]

Agreed. Very little gets done about the hecklers but the ones giving feedback have been banned

[red spire]

stop beating a dead horse. i know people that have these issues and others and they dont seem to mind. they understood the rules and play within there comfort

[scarlet hazel]

wait evan, why havent you muted them yet? /genq

[west marlin]

Just ignore them

[marsh depot]

How about you just move on then?

[west marlin]

They're not acting in good faith

[steady fox]

Don't get me wrong, I'm grateful for the random drop ins, but for someone who has minimal time to be here, the only way I get any answers to issues right now is the very occasional pop up of staff and hope that I'm here to see the message.

[brisk spruce]

I love ableism in my cozy games

[red spire]

no i have asked decent questions and you guys just keep bagging on this guys for this one issue regarding eplispy. like this is annoying

[narrow narwhal]

Super fair! Does anyone have any good examples they can share from other Discords that have done this well?

[fiery isle]

I thought there was a new rule about not repetitively saying stuff if it doesn't contribute to the discussion, surely someone telling everyone to shut up over and over again should count?

[crystal lagoon]

It's so soul soothing to see "blocked message". This individual doesn't seem to have the capacity of empathy for other people, it's not worth responding to them nor is it constructive.

[brisk spruce]

you keep ignoring that it isn't just about epilepsy. more people are affected by flashing than only epileptics

[waxen mauve]

multiple CMs would be a good start as it would reduce the individual load and make it easier and less stressful for each person responsible

[tribal field]

Accusing a game team of being ableist is pretty messed up. I don’t think they are purposely sitting back and hoping people suffer in their game

[fiery perch]

I don't think they're talking about the game team.

[west marlin]

Kali isn't talking about s6

[tribal field]

Oh

[brisk spruce]

I was referring to Fly Bloke actually 😉 thanks for taking my message in the most negative way possible

[marsh depot]

You haven't. People have explained it you already and you're only beating the subject because you don't want to admit you just don't care about people who have disabilities. You're not acting in good faith so I'm going to continue ignoring you.

[crystal lagoon]

This. I do not have epilepsy but I have several other diagnosis that make it difficult and/or painful to handle some of these in game things. This is for everyone, including epileptics who may feel harm from the game due to visual or audio effects.

[steady fox]

If you do a search of any general ticket system bots, many can have question only channels for staff, and reply only channels for people to see. Many can be altered to be anonymous. It doesn't all have to be up to one person to carry the weight of an entire community. Sometimes being anonymous IS all it takes to find that comfortability.

[scarlet hazel]

i didnt even know about the ignore feature. is that brand new?

[waxen mauve]

but also, ableism isn't just "sitting back and hoping people suffer." it's also refusing to address accessibility issues because they don't feel as "important."

[crystal lagoon]

There is suggestion bots where people can ONLY put in a suggestion through a bot that can be upvoted or downvoted by the community; I think that would be amazing and could give an easy over view to what people want.

Similarly to Marvel Rivals discord

[red spire]

currently playing with eden and she has eplispy... shes talking in the chat and you guys just ignore it

[steady fox]

And there is absolutely no way it should be down to a single CM. if you're bringing people in to help hear your people, you need more than one.

[narrow narwhal]

Awesome I'll check out Rivals.

[scarlet hazel]

ye ye. that's pretty cool. hopefully its unlimited

[crystal lagoon]

Absolutely! If you'd like, I can send you a screenshot of what I mean if it's more helpful through DM. No other messages warranted/needed 💜

[brisk spruce]

many people, myself included, are responding to Eden and you're continuing to speak in bad faith to claim otherwise

[tacit bough]

Same with Disney dreamlight valley could help

[narrow narwhal]

yes please!

[marsh depot]

Yeah, it is upsetting when stuff like this isn't nipped in the bud from the get go.

[scarlet hazel]

this is feeling a lot more positive then the last time

[west marlin]

Rivals team does a great job at communicating

[steady fox]

Sometimes you just need a team. Even if small.
People to discuss with, understand and assist in your downtime is detrimental to any CM position. Hiring just one is asking for a dumpster fire.

[warm python]

When I was in the latest Bitcraft alpha (which yeah, alpha and not beta but beta still counts in these regards), I recall there being a few different team members there on the discord, answering questions and taking feedback. I may not have agreed with everything some of them said but I always felt I was at least being heard. I think spreading the load is very important when it comes to this! so instead of it just being you or one other person coming in and everyone tossing a giant wad of paper that's been building up for a while at you, it's more evenly spread apart over time and over people

[sleek abyss]

"1 ignored message" omg that's loads better

[polar elbow]

In one game discord I follow, feedback is shared through a forum channel. While the CMs don't always respond to any given topic, they will still react to the thread with a specific emoji for any topic that they've read and passed on to the team.

[waxen mauve]

genuinely it's made this conversation a lot easier lol

[brisk spruce]

is there any reason to ignore over block? (I havent used ignore yet I only know what block does)

[waxen mauve]

it just says "1 blocked message - Show" if you block

[red spire]

would you guys be open to a weekly or monthly Q&A maybe streamed live on twich to answer questions?

[finite dagger]

IIRC an ignore doesn't let the other person know they've been ignored. A block can be figured out via reactions, etc.

[sleek abyss]

Not really sure i just found out about this feature just now

[lethal granite]

have persons who does it as their job
o.o

[scarlet hazel]

actually how is hiring CMs going? there has to have been at least one or two people who fit the bill at this point, right?

[narrow narwhal]

We've talked a bunch about this recently actually. It's just a lot of work and all the relevant people are pretty heads down for elderwood. But we may still do something like this.

[steady fox]

It's like bringing in a single person to run a call center. They could do it, sure, but they'd enjoy it a heck of a lot more with some co-workers to sit with.

You're asking for burnout, expecting that from one person

[warm python]

Cause yeah as it stands with it just being you, WC, coming in alone sporadically (though more than previously), everyone's gonna end up spamming you since there are so few chances to actually talk to someone. Which just makes the conversation super hard on both sides.

Like heck take appy for example, pops in randomly, we shoot off some stuff and that's stuff that doesn't necessarily have to be thrown at you as well. Gotta spread that load

[glacial knot]

blocking means they cant send you messages or see your profile info. ignoring means they can still do that stuff. ignoring is the nicer way of doing things

[ivory vessel]

WC isn't a CM, he's just cosplaying as one while we don't have a real CM

[pulsar meteor]

Sometimes folks can accept new perspectives, and we're also mindful of the potentially hundreds of people watching silently who may be influenced. Otherwise I can't talk about specific mod actions being taken or not

[narrow narwhal]

I can't talk about that, sorry. Major HR violation.

[brisk spruce]

got it, thank you!

[west marlin]

I would recommend the farm folks team if you're looking for inspiration
They're in development right now but are very engaging with sharing what they're working on. Perhaps the exact opposite of what palia does lol they show works in progress and silly bugs they run into and aren't afraid to talk any what works and what doesn't

[red spire]

i think this would be super cool in the future and hopefully you guys find time after elderwood. I know a couple of games that do this to give there consumer base more in depth updates and it seems to help the player base.

[tribal field]

Just wanna say thank you for all you do for this game. I really love Palia and so do lot of people. I’m thankful to have this game because it really is my cozy escape from life game. So thank you for the fun!

[scarlet hazel]

oof alright. well i hope some people fill the role soon. it would be great.

[narrow narwhal]

Me too! ❤️

[glacial knot]

things were tense but i appreciate the communication. it's all we really want lmao

[tacit bough]

Mhm

[west marlin]

[crystal lagoon]

People will say things when things go unheard. Venting is healthy, and so is discussion. Transparency is so important and respected in the gaming community; it goes a long way. I hope s6 chooses this route.

[warm python]

[late sage]

@narrow narwhal thank you and the whole team for the game I have loved yall game so far and look forward to the futur of the game. keep it up buddy!!!👍

[scarlet hazel]

tbh the last couple of times I've seen this whole convo thing go on it was really... well yknow how last time went. but this time it feels like everyone is now level headed. ill be honest and say that the whole "grateful for prices" comment rubbed me the wrong way a lot, but!

the convos today and everything is defo how it should of gone from the get go and hearing how gifting is in the works is amazing and everything else too is super reassuring

[waxen mauve]

tbf, it isn't all we really want, because communication without seeing the effects of said comms down the line somewhere is just going to further sour people. so communication+ maybe, lol?

[sleek abyss]

[narrow narwhal]

Thanks for the kind words; I'll pass it along! Means a lot to the team. ❤️

[crystal lagoon]

I think it's important to remember too that not everyone communicates the same way, and frustration can come across as aggressiveness. I do sometimes, and don't mean to... and sometimes I do! I love that majority were able to come together and feel a little bit happier about the game. I think THAT is healthy and great.

[tribal field]

You guys are wonderful! ❤️

[scarlet hazel]

yeah. i defo do come across as aggressive sometimes myself sadly.

[glacial knot]

yeah i get you, im not trying to downplay any of this cause im def on yalls side with the lack of action just to be clear

[west marlin]

Calling in the whole squad

[sleek abyss]

Group hug!! im jk

[crystal lagoon]

https://tenor.com/view/friends-gif-24442888

[warm python]

I'm just an old woman yelling at clouds sometimes especially That cloud but

[waxen mauve]

i'm still mad about the cloud lol

[crystal lagoon]

I'm not :( I like hugs sometimes

[west marlin]

The cloud gets no hug boxing from me

[vapid pendant]

I'd rather lick a cheese grater

[crystal lagoon]

tbf, that cloud is something to be mad about. What are those eyes 😭 When I saw it I was like omg I can make that much money with copy pasta anime eyes???

[sleek abyss]

https://tenor.com/view/hug-hugging-group-hug-gif-24163392

[supple marsh]

about his hat hair? yes

[waxen mauve]

please do

[late sage]

yeah go ahead

[ivory vessel]

it depends, are the jokes constructive?

[fallow saffron]

[warm python]

I don't think I'm physically capable of stopping myself from clowning on the cloud

[tribal field]

The cloud is ugly in a cute way lol

[crystal lagoon]

I missed the hat hair, I have to go look 😭

[neat compass]

If someone can spew ableist comments I don't see why you can't joke about a cloud

[warm python]

Einarbot out for blood today

[glacial knot]

omg it wasnt my language it was the emote name lmao

[supple marsh]

the cloud is just wonky shaped

[crystal lagoon]

It honestly reminded me of a blown up version of ☁️ <-- literally blown up and traced

[fallow saffron]

[west marlin]

Nope you know what I'm just going to say this to mod mail lol

[tribal field]

He’s doing his best lmao, he just has ✨issues✨

[warm python]

omg I can't use some of my favorite emotes cause the keywords get Einarbot angry, whether it be cause of all caps or too many of the same letter in a row

[late sage]

girl ur seeing things

[waxen mauve]

not the interrupting foot emoji

[supple marsh]

✨ dont we all✨

[livid lagoon]

Just a sidenote: The new announcement has taken affect. 😄

[warm python]

that's the face of someone who's actually dying on the inside and trying to hide it

[supple marsh]

i wish cries in blind

[gritty socket]

I don't hate that goofy 'lil cloud

[fallow saffron]

[umbral lynx]

All I learnt was no clue what's allowed and what's not... And it's OK to be ableist well ok then learn something new everyday huh

[ivory vessel]

oh it sure has. tech help has been cut in half

[supple marsh]

i love him bc hes wonky

[vapid pendant]

Yes Ace I said that I love cheese

[west marlin]

Don't glaze the cloud

[arctic coral]

what did i miss 🫠

[tribal field]

He’s just like the pet fart I always wanted

[warm python]

https://tenor.com/view/crowley-list-long-supernatural-longlist-gif-5591035

[arctic coral]

LOLL

[lethal granite]

i worry if you’re only hiring one tbh. things have clearly gotten quite charged here. and things have def gotten out of hand sometimes (i’m genuinely sorry about some of the comments that were made recently about/towards you, absolutely unacceptable). i can’t imagine being hired to a new job and walking into… all of this though.

at the end of the day, people are so emotionally charged because we love the game and want it to succeed. same as the people who are working on it want it to. but i’m really not sure a single CM will be sufficient atp.

idk what’s going on in your personal life, but i’m sorry it’s been a rough week and i hope things end up as best as they can.

same thing i hope for the game and communication from yall.

[late sage]

do it

[fallow saffron]

I got some news.. I can’t have dairy right now either, along with being gluten free

[crystal lagoon]

Ignore the poor quality because it's zoomed out but this is the PoE1 cloud and it has stars that move through it, lightning that comes out of it, galaxies in it -- and it costs $3 LMAO

[fiery perch]

Genuinely, there were some comments made earlier that rubbed people, myself included, the wrong way, because they were definitely dippin' in the ableism category, esp because it continued even when we tried to explain. But I'm doing my best to ignore that now, and going to just move on. (Just wanted to hopefully give some form of context.) 😇

[scarlet hazel]

omg thats so cool

[lethal granite]

tfw i spent so long typing everyone has moved on

[fiery isle]

nah say it

[scarlet hazel]

you know what would be fun? something like the chaos pet from runescape. a silly little guy with bunny ears or smth

[late sage]

ive been there

[crystal lagoon]

I agree! It's BEAUTIFUL in game as are all the celestial cosmetics. It just goes to show you can produce a free game and people will buy cosmetics if they're reasonably priced -- enough so for you to build an entirely new game PoE 2

[ivory vessel]

we'll never know because they won't clarify and banned people can't speak, often don't even know why they're banned~

[vapid pendant]

Jesus christ Ace

[arctic coral]

thatd be another $20 :[

[lethal granite]

i did! then i came back to
unserious chat and was like, o i guess that’s no longer what we are doing??

[crystal lagoon]

you get a potato pod

[fiery isle]

oh yeah there was some hardcore trolling going on that derailed tihngs a bit

[fallow saffron]

I am literally a demon

[crystal lagoon]

is it the premium one?!

[vapid pendant]

Satan then. Are you ok?

[warm python]

You're so much stronger than me because I would literally spend all day crying in a corner

I think I'm losing some of my tolerance to lactose as I get older and just that makes me wanna cry

[fiery perch]

like kate said, please say it, etc. things def ended up derailed, but what you said was valid

[crystal lagoon]

my friend, I feel you. Is it beyond the help of lactaid? :(

[dry swift]

Goodnight everyone! Hope you all are doing okay 🙂

[livid lagoon]

I will say though, since mods are in here, genuine feedback for the Palia server itself: You might want to look into your bot. If you're gonna warn, fair enough, but maybe you should actually add a proper note on what triggered the warning. Was it a bad remark? Was I too aggressive? Some examples of the kind of behaviour I've contributed that you don't want? You probably can't discuss my warning in public, but the point is: The warning was so generic, and I assume this means others too are getting the same generic messages: how then will people know what it is you want people to fix about their behaviour here? So yeah, bot tweaks needed.

[crystal lagoon]

Very possible as well for the bot to send a DM of what was wrong, and having a channel to appeal said ban/mute etc.

[fallow saffron]

So my gluten is an allergy, but the diary thing I think is an intolerance for me…? No dairy past age 30 it seems

[young plank]

i hate that i had to do errands and discord decided to set itself on fire while i was gone so now im sitting here confused and kinda debating if its okay to even talk now LOL

[fallow saffron]

I haven’t tried that yet actually! Thank you for reminding me :D
ill try to get some this weekend <3

[warm python]

Absolutely. I can't get into any details because I don't wanna get warned either but the need for proper communication/transparency extends to the server as well as the game! all around /nodnod

[warm python]

Yeah once I got into my 30s my lactose tolerance started going downhill and if I can't eat an entire wheel of cheese than is life really worth living

[crystal lagoon]

this is just self reporting but, I can't personally have direct milk like ice cream or straight milk with lactaid, but it makes the tummy aches more bearable for those moments you want to really enjoy some dairy infested foods

[west marlin]

It should be easy enough like they're specfic messages that get deleted just tell people what those are and what rule they broke

[finite dagger]

If you have a Costco nearby, they sell a TON for a good price and they always work great for me, though admittedly I'm only lactose sensitive, not intolerant.

[ivory vessel]

that would require good communication skills, which we know for a fact they're lacking 🤧

[crystal lagoon]

I sent Wizard some info on a bot they could use for feedback for us to upvote/downvote (a general area for feedback). I hope they use it, I think it would help so much.

[fiery isle]

I heard about that one lady who microdosed powdered milk until she could tolerate things again.... that sounded BRUTAL. Anything to avoid that!

[warm python]

I need to get my hands on some lactaid. I will never stop adding a mountain of parm to my pasta

[crystal lagoon]

that's WILD. If I have any protein powder I die. I couldn't fathom 😭

[livid lagoon]

Fair, although I have no plans of appealing. I'll take my warning, at least we might finally get some clarity to the vagueness of the announcement that way. But yeah, it's more that if I get a warning with that little info, others will surely be in the same boat. It's a bit like I said elsewhere:

It's like the police stopping me while I'm out walking, handing me a fine, and just saying "it's because you're not doing things right" then walking away. 😄

If I've done something bad, fine me, fair enough... but kinda helps knowing what set it off if you want me to avoid doing it again.

[fiery isle]

it may not even be something they want you to stop doing, that's the sad part. Like the person who said a mushroom name starting w/ S

[worn snow]

the funniest (by funny i mean horrible) thing is this is ableism too

[crystal lagoon]

A fair and mature response. I don't know entirely what you did to warrant a warning, but you've spoken and held yourself very professionally not even being apart of the team trying to get answers while others came here to put people down, and did it without warning for a long time.

I think having a strike against you would be unfair in this, while trying to get clarity on what is considered "wrong". But this is just my advocating.

[supple marsh]

wild take

[lethal granite]

it is esp troublesome when what started the whole many folks typing conversation that was just was an unclear message from s6

mods are doing their best and i know it’s unpaid labor. but i hope they take it into account cos not knowing why smth happened is… p ridiculous.

(that being said, i know the bot has been acting up a lot lately, so… idk. might’ve been caused by that.)

[red spire]

your right. seeing is now ableism.

[tribal field]

I’m disabled and I didn’t see this comment as ableist. They probably weren’t here for any comments made.

[west marlin]

Don't take the bait

[supple marsh]

id say i see your point but i cant cries in blind

[marsh depot]

I'm surprised this conversation is still going on.

[crystal lagoon]

Sometimes it's best to not discredit something you weren't present for

[red spire]

ohh no ❤️

[fiery perch]

They actually told me they were here when I responded to them!

[marsh depot]

Almost! Internets been trolling me sadly

[red spire]

@worn snow just climbed 30 minutes of chat to make the comment...

[lethal granite]

the movie?

[worn snow]

dont mention me.

[red spire]

@worn snow no problem

[livid lagoon]

To be fair, I've had my moment that are probably less than stellar. I can think of at least one comment I made in recent times that, while I think it should be acceptable, might have been triggering. But I'm critical, harsh in my tone toward S6, and I know I've been harping on a few things more than once mostly because it seems to me S6 likes to sidestep or avoid those points.

[ivory vessel]

well crabs is gone and we still don't know what exactly we're forbidden of doing in the server now. good one, team S6!

[fiery perch]

Honestly, their chat might of been scrolled up without realizing, tbh. It happens. I've had it happen without me realizing it

[marsh depot]

I meant to say, I'm surprised you're still here.

[scarlet hazel]

and the block feature too

[fallow saffron]

Ohh thank you! I’ll check their <3
I’m not sure if my issue is lactose intolerance or sensitivity. This started happening after I went gluten free a month ago (due to my allergy) and apparently it’s happened to others after going gluten free :')

[worn snow]

yeah this also it was only 12 minutes not 15

[red spire]

yeah just find this convo funny. good friday night

[crystal lagoon]

I feel like we sound similar to one another, but there's a difference in frustration and passion versus being any sort of pessimistic/trolling.

The fact that it's still going on in here is crazy. You didn't deserve that warning and I'm wondering why the mods are allowed ableist jokes to go back and forth.

[late sage]

yeah shes right I was here when "logical" people were calling the devs ableist for something players said

[west marlin]

No one called the devs ableist

[marsh depot]

As in, I'm watching Baby Driver and my internet is disconnecting constantly.

[fiery isle]

oh good, we're still misinterpretting the conversation in the most malicious way

[supple marsh]

pass the bag bestie

[young plank]

of course!

[red spire]

what about calling other people ableists?

[fiery perch]

We weren't trying to call the devs ableist but rather some comments from someone else. But anyways. moving on.

[supple marsh]

tyty

[tribal field]

Anyways Hodari is the best part of Palia

[livid lagoon]

I'll be honest enough to say I was active in yesterdays talks. Those talks did go off the rails. While I didn't feel I crossed the lines, some may have felt I did. But I mean, without knowing properly what it was, all I can do is take wild guesses at what they don't want me doing. And, danger zone, a bit like I feel we are all doing after that announcement. Having to guess what is and isn't okay.

[west marlin]

Well of course they are just trolls

[young plank]

Lets try to take a breather okay? todays been a little chaotic so to speak

[swift token]

Can Ash be brought back? (If they'd want to come back, of course.)

[steady fox]

are we still hating plushie drops because I would probably sell my soul for a crab one

[fallow saffron]

“Dairy infested”
I am enjoying oat milk! And the ice cream too. Cannot find a good dairy free cheese tho

[fiery isle]

it's just disappointing that even with the new rules the trolling is allowed (and on brand new alt accounts)

[west marlin]

Yup, Lucky us

[crystal lagoon]

I see that, but I also see jokes still flying and snide comments being made. It makes it feel as if it's allowed.

[supple marsh]

or rays!

[west marlin]

For some reason they always want to punch down on accessiblity too....

[ivory vessel]

oh, didn't you hear? trolling is fine! the one thing you can't do is give feedback/criticism, because it hurts their soft kind little hearts /sarcasm

[warm python]

oh god y'all have had me distracted for so long with my music off, at some point I fiddled with the volume knob and just hit play on spotify to get Nightwish destroying my ear drums

[crystal lagoon]

OKAY but I disovered oat milk > almond milk. It's actually SO GOOD and almonds are bad for the economy/water

[fallow saffron]

Once I got into my 30s my everything went downhill
Knees cracking. Can’t stand up too fast. Can’t have cheese.

[west marlin]

Rip

[fiery isle]

oat milk shaken espresso is so good

[tribal field]

Lots of people in this server are here to trolls. From new accounts to people who don’t even play the game anymore but just stir the pot

[fiery perch]

misread Nightwish as nightcore, and was like oh, that is not the vibe rn-

[finite dagger]

Silk's is super yummy, and Aldi has a store brand one that's my fave 💜

[steady fox]

I would sell my soul to not have a ray plushie do you know how hard that'd be 😭
They'd be so cute but I keep thinking about how many rays I've caught thus far and it is just not there

[worn snow]

it seems like baiting isn't considered trolling which is just. very frustrating

[crystal lagoon]

I am in Canada no aldis here but I'm familiar with Silk, I'll look for that thank you!!

[fallow saffron]

Love oat milk :D
also now I gotta find out about almond milk and why it’s bad :o

[marsh depot]

Tbf, a lot of people here who don't play the game anymore are sharing constructive criticism, unlike those who are just jumping here to troll and be unsympathetic towards others.

[finite dagger]

Chobani has a tasty one too :D

[lyric night]

ashe has settled on a new job

[west marlin]

Good for her!

[ivory vessel]

good for them, honestly

[supple marsh]

the grind would be horrible but they would look so good as throw pillows

[sleek abyss]

https://tenor.com/view/palia-tau-dog-bark-gif-11870911794040348924

[supple marsh]

hear me out fairy mantis plush^

[sleek abyss]

im so bummed what is happening to the gifs

[crystal lagoon]

most of our almond milk comes from California and requires a LOT of water to make, and Cali has been in a huge drought so even with the wildfires/water usage rules; water still goes to the almond milk plants

[waxen mauve]

@narrow narwhal I know you're not on right now but since you were asking earlier, Coral Island's discord has a great feature called "developer diary," which is just an announcement channel like our info & updates channels where they do a near-daily update on what the devs are working on/fixed/updated/etc

[steady fox]

I can't even deny that, you're so right. The blue spotted ones would be so cute

[timid sage]

Just had to come cry about my very first long nosed unicorn fish hook getting away to an audience that understands 🥲🥲🥲🥲

[crystal lagoon]

wait chobani makes oat milk??? SOLD

[west marlin]

Noooo

[fiery isle]

that's the worst 😦

[tribal field]

I want a crab plush, but make it HUGE

[steady fox]

This happened to me with my first ancient fish the other day. A starred one. Totally unprepared, lost it a foot from shore.
I'll pray for you

[timid sage]

Ty for your commiseration I am devastated

[west marlin]

I reported it to the mods but 😔

[late sage]

Im begging give me a giant stink bug plush

[supple marsh]

the spotted mantis would be so cute and half the grind of butterfly

[fallow saffron]

Oh no D:
ty for telling me! /gen
gonna start hissing at almond milk in the store now

[gritty socket]

Instructions unclear; a giant crab plush is now terrorizing Bahari Bay

[steady fox]

Yes my god please give me plushy crab

[tribal field]

YEESSS. Think the giant spider crab from animal crossing

[steady fox]

I will continue pushing crab plush until it is heard

[west marlin]

Oat milk is best

[steady fox]

My goal is gaining traction. The crab plush is imminent

[west marlin]

I'm shocked wizard crab didn't ask for one yet

[fallow saffron]

It is! I have it everyday

[crystal lagoon]

You know what? I want a crab plushie too. A big one that can sit outside my house and grab people that come to visit the plot

[red spire]

kinda want the princess ladybug.

[narrow narwhal]

This is how you know I don't control development. If it were up to me there would have been a crab plush a long time ago. Multiple probably.

[steady fox]

Crabgate when

[narrow narwhal]

I'm not biased though /j

[west marlin]

Time to call in a favor

[tribal field]

Ok ok ok but hear me out. GIANT centipede plush

[steady fox]

Look, WC, I'm just saying, should you weasel your way in and plant the seed for the crab plush, we wouldn't be disappointed

[fallow saffron]

Crab rave

[gritty socket]

So... we're missing out on crabs and spellcasting then, going by your handle

[young plank]

if it moves im screaming

[crystal lagoon]

omg the size of a body pillow minimally that can sit on the bed

[waxen mauve]

oh hey i just tagged you a minute ago on a thing you asked for earlier - please scroll up, ty! ❤️

[fiery perch]

im still wanting craftable ducks, not gonna lie. but WC already knows this. I have already told him too about how I just want to hide them all over my plot & make a "I spy" or "hide and seek" kind of vibe.

[supple marsh]

but no flashing lights of course

[west marlin]

I need 300

[fiery perch]

300 and tintable

[tribal field]

I would literally cry and scream over the giant centipede lmao

[narrow narwhal]

Sounds like my nightmare but if it's what the people want...

I got my first lantern bug plush this week and let me say I DO NOT like.

[fiery perch]

i'll take them off your hands /silly

[crystal lagoon]

Bugs are not my favorite but something about centipedes are just... wholesome

[supple marsh]

widard crab rave

[tribal field]

Join me in the underground, I’ll give you a rainbow butterfly plush

[late sage]

crack an egg homie

[fiery perch]

what

[fallow saffron]

[steady fox]

[supple marsh]

the recipe to get duck lol get egg

[swift token]

May I ask what game discord is this?

[steady fox]

I'll continue mentioning crab plush every day until it comes. That's how this works, right? /j

[marsh depot]

Day 4501 of asking for crab plush

[gritty socket]

...I should really log on and put one of those rubber ducks in its rightful place on the tub wall

[steady fox]

We're on day 5 and it's just started gaining traction - we persevere

[fiery perch]

my duck, Felipe, is currently on a date with his boyfriend, Harry

[west marlin]

How romantic

[marsh depot]

I love that it's named Felipe Reminds me of a comic I used to read as a kid

[supple marsh]

harry got that rizz

[narrow narwhal]

Really? I'm tempted... but maybe I'm thinking I should wait until one day they make a crab plush and save all my trades for those

[steady fox]

A valid response.

[supple marsh]

potato pods but crab addition with little hats

[late sage]

gamble for frogs peak trades

[tribal field]

I have 7 rainbow butterfly plush now, I’m MORE than happy to give you one!

[narrow narwhal]

Seven?!?! how is that possible?!!

[waxen mauve]

since you were asking earlier, Coral Island's discord has a great feature called "developer diary," which is just an announcement channel like our info & updates channels where they do a near-daily update on what the devs are working on/fixed/updated/etc

[tribal field]

I have no life lmao

[steady fox]

I've given up on trying for that guy until the hype dies down a little. I haven't even got the other bug plushies yet, no point hoarding for the new one

[supple marsh]

hey guys im here in my garage with my 4 butterfly plush...knowledge

[fallow saffron]

Me and who

[steady fox]

I'm sure it is a figment of my imagination.. butterfly doesn't exist

15 lures the first time, no plush
One rogue bomb at a snail an hour later, plush
Ten more lures, no plush

They really just don't like me

[polar elbow]

Yeah, the game is called Mabinogi.

[young plank]

i heard mabinogi

[steady fox]

I am not going through that pain for the butterfly maybe spawning

[fallow saffron]

@late sage why did you give me milk and is it dairy free

[scarlet hazel]

ive tried that game. i got bored quickly with it tho so i havent gone back

[late sage]

inside joke and yes it is dairy free

[west marlin]

🤔

[young plank]

well after todays events i uh dont know what to to say... im off to nikki ❤️

[west marlin]

Real

I'm leaving too, rivals time

[fallow saffron]

Me too byeeee

[young plank]

oh yeah i still plan on being here maybe just not as much?

[steady fox]

Byeee all that are leaving, have happy days

[marsh depot]

Something something empathy goes a long way I guess.

I am off to Nikki too however. I may have become too obsessed with taking pics.

[warm python]

This is now the Infinity Nikki chat /j

[narrow narwhal]

uhhhhhhh

[west marlin]

Let's see ur best dress wizard crab

[celest maple]

Jerma when

[fiery perch]

this made me snort

[west marlin]

I know nothing about that game other then it has dresses

[marsh depot]

Sovereign of Crab

[narrow narwhal]

I was rocking the fairy one from the first banner tbh. but I don't want to contribute to this getting off topic. but happy to talk about that game as it relates to palia!

[young plank]

confirmed hes one of us

[west marlin]

That's based actually

[lethal granite]

i was (and am) agreeing! i really don’t want to worry about what i’m typing cos i do try to be genuine when im in here. i’m just saying the mods are unpaid and have to deal with this mess, which is a LOT. i couldn’t keep up with this chat the past… three hours? i can’t imagine having to try to mos it DX and that the bot has been real testy as of late so id hope that not being told what you did is just bot being bot and not the typical behavior?

if it is, that is A Problem. esp in light of what s6 said today :c

[steady fox]

Unrelated, but I appreciate your time spent here today actually listening and responding with reason.
I know it isn't easy to be the face of an entire company to a community this big.
From someone who is rarely around to see these discussions, the general idea I'd been given in terms of staff support was much less significant than it has been today.
Thanks for changing that image, at least a bit.
Have a blessed day

[marsh depot]

I'm salty I joined in after the fairy banner

[umbral lynx]

I got a well dressed crab for you

[waxen mauve]

i'm salty i've been trying to make a suggestion of another discord to look at how they manage stuff like this and getting nada

[west marlin]

Charming

[young plank]

oh me too were in the same boat. i got the left oar if you got the right LOL

[umbral lynx]

Yeeclaw

[lethal granite]

it’s ok! maybe i can bring it up next time someone from s6 wanders in.

[supple marsh]

its ormuu so maybe?

[fiery perch]

That's fair! I also know the chat has been moving really fast.

[swift token]

That's great to hear!! ✨️/gen

We need to clone them and hire the new one 😄 /jk

[gritty socket]

I can work with that! So, you know how Infinity Nikki has little Lore snippets for each outfit item? Could we possibly get descriptions for things like premium outfits and pets? It's a small thing, but little in-game rationales for stuff like the Fairy outfit or the Drake pet would probably help with some of the "how does this tonally fit in the game" critiques

[lethal granite]

the generic versions seem to also be effective, according to my frens who can’t lactose!

[livid lagoon]

Either bot being iffy, or a mod failing at giving warning messages properly (either which should be addressed). I know they work for free and that it is a mostly thankless job the mods do having to mop up the messes that happen in the wake of the kind of sub-par and unclear statements and announcements from S6 we get in here.

Technically what the announcement said today isn't new really, technically all they said today was already covered by the basic rules. It's just that it also happens to say "when it comes to the subjective interpretations of parts.... well, where you lot thought the line was, that isn't where the line is" and attempts at clearing up hasn't made it much clearer, so now they get to enjoy a community afraid of heavy tone policing and walking on eggshells.

[ivory vessel]

if we get them warning DMs yeah

edit: if

[crystal lagoon]

As a volunteer mod for a huge community, it's just that. They offered to do it knowing that this is a community of people who may get upset from time to time. I feel little sympathy sadly.

[narrow narwhal]

Oh yeah we wanted this for launch actually but it got cut. I'll be honest though some probably aren't going to tonally fit regardless of any lore justifaction. If you hate the cloud you're gonna hate the cloud.

[swift token]

@narrow narwhal
On the topic of people wanting to know what they got warned for...

Star Stable Online has a server called SSO Embassy.

There is a channel controlled by a bot that publicly shows who was warned, the message in question's time/date, and what the specific issue with that message was.

It also shows if this was your 1st warning, 2nd, etc. At your 3rd warning, it will display a banned notice instead + the reason, etc.

Some people have direct messages blocked, but this is a way around that..

[steady fox]

I'm not gonna lie, I don't even hate the cloud that bad if we excuse the fact that he's for sure caked up
It's the price of it that got me

[ivory vessel]

you know what, crab man, you're right... nothing could persuade me about the dang cloud...

[lyric night]

the price is probably the only issue for most ppl

especially compared to the other pets available

[west marlin]

The store picture for the cloud does him extremely dirty, it. Just looks so cheap

[marsh depot]

It still looks cheap in game ngl

[gritty socket]

Oh, yeah, that's just the nature of the beast re cosmetic items... the justifications for some of the more out there cosmetics in ESO are always kinda funny

[west marlin]

I couldn't fathom paying for it so I wouldn't know

[livid lagoon]

I know that some of the mods are good and fair people. Admittedly an assumption, but I assume most of the current mods volunteered back when S6 had a CM team, things were managed properly, and the tone was much better in here. Well, then CM team got fired, and it seems S6 left the mod team and this Discord for the most part fend for themselves. Honestly, if they (edit: the mod team) had walked out like they, in my opinion, should have after the way S6 mismanaged this community I would have understood it... but it also means this community wouldn't have existed by the time I joined, and I wouldn't have had the friends I have today. I don't hate the mods, and I do feel bad for some of them... but they too need to be held to a certain standard.

[ivory vessel]

i've had the displeasure of seeing one in the wild

[fiery perch]

is this the dyno bot? because im pretty sure they use dyno already. it's just aclled something diff here.

[lethal granite]

i maintain that if they absolutely INSISTED upon making an epic bug drop a plush, it should’ve been fairy mantis.

[swift token]

I wouldn't know.
Where is the app/channel here?

[marsh depot]

I wouldn't either but I saw some in the wild already and a streamer using it. At least the other pets jump around and stuff, the cloud is just existing there right next to you like a bad photobomb

[fiery perch]

they have that stuff private and for only mods to see.

[swift token]

Ah. So why do people not know why they were warned?

[celest maple]

Only have interacted with Naz before but definitely appreciate him a lot for the few times I have

[fiery perch]

the bot will send the warning in dms. but it doesn't actually say what you got warned for. it just quotes a rule (from what i understand), but not what specific comment breached said rule.

[west marlin]

One person never even got a bot message. But sometimes they are extremely vauge and hours after the fact

[lethal granite]

my arachnophobia says pls no, but is ok with crabs with less thin legs (and says hello to them when i wander over to the tide pools. they’re super neat.)

[livid lagoon]

Either something broke with the bot, or moderator forgot to actually add a warn message, or they've set the bot to not give the proper warn message. Hard to say which one applies.

[gritty socket]

IME, Discord bots are notoriously flaky

[lethal granite]

almonds and avocados ||theres a reason i only ptb 😭 ||

[swift token]

Maybe it's a different bot then.

For this, whether it's a irl moderator or the bot catching something, the reason is always clear.

Also, for the SSO server, some people wouldn't get the warning because they have DMs closed, as I mentioned.

That's why it's a public channel.

[fiery perch]

They definitely use the Dyno bot.

[gritty socket]

This is why I will always rally for a return to internet forums for as long as I draw breath

[narrow narwhal]

All the actions as far as I can see have messages attached. But they're not public - we don't think it's fair to air that for everyone.

[limpid root]

Part of the issue is sometimes folks don't ever actually see them. Due to DM restrictions or whatnot.

[swift token]

Unfortunate! Thanks for replying 🫰

[ivory vessel]

someone got banned tonight and never got a message informing the ban or explaining the reason or allowing them an appeal. nothing. just disappeared from the server - yet their old messages are still here. we can't discuss these things publicly per rules, but they told me on DM

[crystal lagoon]

However when you sign up for a position in a company, whether it be changed or not, they at that point would simply be keeping their name for the role.

if they did their job then, great! but times change, and not stepping down if you're disinterested or don't have the heart is wrong.

Treating the community like they're unimportant unless it upsets them is even worse. I think we've seen enough of that today to say it's justified.

[pulsar meteor]

i wanted to send this earlier, apologies, but if anyone ever has questions on any mod actions they may receive - warns, mutes, message noms, any of that - please feel free to reach out to ModMail. We will gladly discuss those actions with the users in question in more detail

[crystal lagoon]

This is to not say that every mod is that way, for transparency but there is a point and time where a change of leadership should occur, and perhaps applications opened for such a volunteer role could be beneficial to the health of the server instead of relying on individuals who may not have the best interests at heart anymore. Not necessarily their fault with all the game changes/team changes, but it can make you not care anymore.

[ivory vessel]

genuinely - does that still work in case of ban? how to go about it if the person never got the warning from einarbot and now they aren't part of the server anymore to use modmail?

[swift token]

Is this option available to them if they've been removed from the server already? /gen

[livid lagoon]

I guess we'll have to partially agree then. I know that some of the mods do genuinely care about the community, and some of them know what they are doing and are what keeps this place together at all. For those of the mod team I am appreciative.

But hey, at the end of the day, they are forced to follow S6's pipe.

[crystal lagoon]

Yes definitely! And that's exactly why I went back and touched on that here because it was vague and kinda rude out of context hehe #💬│palia-discussions message

[pulsar meteor]

any of those messages (except the mini-bonks in channel) will come as a DM from the bot, so if a user has the bot blocked or refuses all DMs, they may not receive it. Specifically with bans, those appeals are handled via a bot form (not modmail) and if someone never received the link, one of their friends can certainly reach out to us to get it on their behalf

[marsh depot]

I want to genuinely ask, earlier on there was a user who was acting in bad faith, I sent a modmail and the user continued to repeat their behaviour with seemingly no action being taken. I get you guys have a hands full managing the server and whatnot but it leaves a bit of a bad taste considering what transpired last night and a good part of today when certain behaviours are not nipped in the bud, but others get muted with no warnings.

[fiery isle]

Then the bot may be broken

[crystal lagoon]

Relying soley on a bot could be problematic as technology does fail and could potentially leave someone without being able to contact the server.

I hope there's logs of individuals who were in trouble, as well as the mod actions that were taken -- mods realistically should put in a message themselves when putting in a ban so that the individual knows. (edit removed an extra word)

[livid lagoon]

ModMail asks me to give my password, so that's a big no, never gonna happen. Why some get asked for that and others don't, I don't know, not my job to figure out. I've gotten a warning, I'll take that warning, still don't know what it is for other than the generic "conversations that become attacks or otherwise derails or becomes hostile", but I'm not gonna go crawl into mod DMs begging for scraps. Bot warned, bot didn't give details, I've said it here that it failed to give any more specifics so now the mod teams know. And while I know this sounds harsh, to give an honest reason: I've spent enough time doing other people's jobs in here, and I've spent enough time doing guesswork and asking for clarifications. There is a limit to how much I should have to put in.

Also, let me add, this is not a dig at you personally. I have no beef with you.

[waxen mauve]

why would anything ask for your password? that's wild. - to be clear i am not questioning that it did, i am just baffled

[fiery perch]

it really shouldn't. but for some reason modmail has been known to ask for passwords from some people. it baffles me too

[livid lagoon]

I should state I know there is at least one other user who also gets asked for password, so while I'm probably in a minority, I'm at least not alone in getting that.

[pulsar meteor]

we try not to give too many specifics, but we do use more than one bot, we have multiple ways to track notes and actions on users, and unless it was a right-click ban (which we only do to purge the occasional spammer that gets through filters) there should always be a message sent. it may not be detailed enough (which is definitely feedback for us to hear)

[fiery perch]

Yeah, same. I know at least one other person (other than you.) It's really weird.

[scarlet hazel]

i think asking for a password is a big security risk

[narrow narwhal]

That's super odd yeah

[west marlin]

There wasn't a message sent and this user has no way of appealing now unfortunately.

They allow dms and don't have the bot blocked

[crystal lagoon]

This isn't meant to sound hateful, but is there a particular reason the banning methods can't be gone into detail? I think again, transparency is super respected and knowing exactly what's going to happen could be beneficial.

I understand not discussing other peoples' bans, but how the ban process works should not be a secret.

[limpid root]

They might quantify it under 'discussing moderation actions' or something.

[crystal lagoon]

I think if they ban people without allowing them to know why, and without an understanding on how to recover from that is horribly detrimental

[pulsar meteor]

if you are willing to pass the link on to them, go ahead and ping modmail and we'll see what we can do

[limpid root]

I'm not saying it isn't detrimental. I'm just saying that might be why they don't talk about the process.

[fiery isle]

Sorry, what link?

[crystal lagoon]

I just don't understand that response. The moderating process should be visible, outside of actually giving warnings to people.

Knowing what a moderators job is, isn't unheard of. And knowing what a rule hierarchy is that might get you instabanned or allow a troll to continue on for hours is somewhat important.

Relying on a bot to DM someone is wild practices

[pulsar meteor]

it's never our intent to ban without giving a reason, it's certainly possible something else interfered with the message. we don't want to just leave people out in the cold.

[narrow narwhal]

All bans come with messages. There were some problems with the bot this morning (unrelated to us) that were supposed to have been resolved but maybe weren't fully? In any case if you want to tell this user to DM I can share the ban message they should have gotten, and the appeal link if @pulsar meteor can help me with that.

[ivory vessel]

wait, do i help them via ModMail or directly DMs? i'm confused now.

[crystal lagoon]

I understand that, and that's what I mean with adding a bit of a personal touch to the removal of people from the server. It doesn't need to be a bot, the community isn't millions large. But that's not really my place to discuss, I'm just concerned at people disappearing whom seemingly done nothing wrong while others remain. Where's the actual hierarchy of rules of what gets you tossed out instantly and what gets you a slap on the hand?

[livid lagoon]

As I figure this is useful to the community and in order to resolve what is a potential issue for more users than just me, as well as accountability... and seeing as it contains nothing personal or specific in this message, only the generic rules reminder message: That is the full extent of my "conversation" with EinarBot and my warning. As you can see, there is nothing specific here. There's nothing about me having made a bad remark, or that for instance I've too aggressive, or repeat too much, or whatever it is.

But yeah, it needs to be addressed so people actually get the proper messages. Can't improve something if you don't know what you're supposed to improve.

[narrow narwhal]

Either

[ivory vessel]

great, we'll do ModMail, it feels safer and more impersonal. thanks.

[crystal lagoon]

that is woefully vague x_x yeah

[lucid hornet]

never used modmail, but generally speaking (not even specifically addressed to u):
most discord bots use discord’s authentication. If it wants your discord password, obviously don’t enter it there, but you can try to go the official discord website, login there and try to use modmail/the bot link after that again.

[polar elbow]

For what it's worth, saying this now and for the future: if anyone here ever needs to contact the mods but isn't able to use modmail for whatever reason, feel free to reach out to me in DMs and I can send a message on your behalf
just keep in mind that if you're no longer in palia discord at the time of reaching out, you may have to send me a friend request (possibly twice as I tend to reject rando friend requests if I don't recognize them or any servers they're in... but I'll almost certainly accept the second time lol)

[crystal lagoon]

This. I've never had a bot ask me for my password and if it does, it's likely a scam / one of those many discord scams.

[livid lagoon]

Exactly. If I've been aggressive, made people feel unsafe, or if I've made a personal attack or remark. Fair enough, I'll take the warning... but that isn't a warning that a user can really action on.

[fiery perch]

As far as I know, warnings have always been like that. It definitely would be helpful that, if/when youre warned, it gives an example (like what the person said or did) that breached said rule so they know what to not do again and so they can better understand what happened.

[swift token]

@fiery perch Is this the bot you were referring to earlier?

[crystal lagoon]

I wonder if they tested these bots on each other before releasing it into the wild public... D:

[fiery perch]

It is one of them, yes.

Like I said, they use dyno but it is called something different.

[livid lagoon]

For the record, EinarBot seems to run on Dyno (well, it "plays" dyno.gg according to its own profile)

[swift token]

The format looks very different.

[marsh depot]

And once again, I would like to know why no immediate action was taken when someone was acting in bad faith earlier on, and all I got was the generic bot response to my report in Modmail We got that message today regarding unproductive conversations, yet when someone was being completely unproductive and only baiting, no apparent action was taken.

[umbral lynx]

Oi. You forgot to add this is the only one that asks for my password I tested it... Lucky for me some of the other server mods were like... Chill about it

[fiery perch]

Okay. I don't rly know how to respond to this.

[swift token]

That's okay!
I'm not sure how to respond to some of your earlier message either, so we're even 😅

Whatever they're using, the one I showed from the other server is definitely an upgrade.

Hopefully things get better ^_^

[narrow narwhal]

I'm breaking policy saying this, but this is important. There was action. You just won't see it. We don't discuss mod actions against others with people. Your feedback is incredibly helpful in identifying issues, but that doesn't give you any special visibility or right to know if they were actioned against. This is important for privacy and to give folks a chance.

[crystal lagoon]

This is just merely a suggestion but when a single person makes an entire group uncomfortable, I think leniency in this rule could go a long way. Perhaps up for discussion to your team?

[west marlin]

they certically were making others feel excluded from being able to participate in the conversation which goes against your desire to create a welcoming space.

[fiery perch]

And I think that's understandable. I think more people were wondering why a mod or anybody didn't just tell them to at least stop publicly, so that everyone knows that isn't okay. If.. that makes sense?

[limpid root]

iirc paid dyno lets you change the name, icon, etc

[fiery perch]

It does, yes. Which is what i was meaning by called something different-- I prob shoulda been more clearer. It's getting late lol

[west marlin]

If someone joins an opt-in channel on a new account and immediately starts to be aggressive that's like one of the few scenarios where its obvious they're acting in bad faith

[marsh depot]

We usually get a mod jumping in when there are certain users behaving a certain way/asking people to disengage and remind of the server rules. This time around however, the user kept making certain remarks long after I had already reported it. So I don't see how there was any action taken. I'm not asking to be told the user specifically got sanctioned, just that nothing happened as it was happenning.

[crystal lagoon]

Anyway, I'm glad there was action taken minimally. I think there could be strides made to be better, but not my place. I'm merely a complainer who hopes the community gets heard. I am gonna go play some games. I hope everyone has an amazing night, and hope we get some answers on accessibility soon. 🫶

[fiery isle]

And that was while a mod was active in the channel