・lore-basement

[thick oyster]

Yeah but he was walking away from it

[wild marsh]

||no bro, he said goodbye because dottore died 😭. what kind of twisting of the situation are you making here||

[thick oyster]

The only way to access Irminsul directly ||is through Nahida's sanctuary||

||How would Pantalone sneak into Nahida's sanctuary||

Which burned

Of money

[wild marsh]

idk why you think this is all he does when it was not only shown but stated he is more than just that.

[thick oyster]

||They couldn't access the heart of Irminsul, where Dottore burned||

[thick oyster]

Being able to control the economy would be very valuable

[wild marsh]

I never said that it wasn't

[thick oyster]

||You mean the god of Irminsul has higher access to it?||

[wild marsh]

you are the one saying that's all he does tho

when it isn't

[worldly rain]

Not relevant ||nahida and the gang had to use Aaru to gain access
If tree was gateway they should have just entered from there no? But they didn't because that not how it works ||

From where?

[thick oyster]

||Only she could do that because the Sanctuary is the only place with access to it||

With Aaru

And Deshret's tech

No it would have

Because it's still Irminsul

It was just dying

[worldly rain]

We literally have cutscene of how she went|| it was a bridge between Aaru and Tree||

[thick oyster]

Still had power

[thick oyster]

That too

||Nothing says that that changed after it started burning||

||Where does it say that burning would change it||

[worldly rain]

Yes that's the point ||you can't just walk and gain access to tree you need special mechanisn aka Aaru in this case and Nahida being the Administrator herself||

[thick oyster]

||He died before Irminsul fully burned, wouldn't remove Irminsul's powers||

[worldly rain]

Why not indeed... Then why didn't they?

[thick oyster]

You would have to die

He got eaten by Roland

[worldly rain]

Yeah that's not how it worked...

[thick oyster]

Would still not remove its restrictions

[worldly rain]

If it worked like that then literally 70% of quest was meaningless

[thick oyster]

Roland was fused with the Ley Lines via Abyss and transported him there
Very very different

[worldly rain]

Because ||Aaru now replaces it|| it has no relevance anymore
It's just a corpse if anything

[thick oyster]

||They had the special akasha||

[thick oyster]

||To prevent Dottore from spying||

[worldly rain]

Easier for ||pantelone||? How?

[thick oyster]

Still

[worldly rain]

And it has no relevance as connection has been cut off

[thick oyster]

Like Capitano

||Yeah so why didn't they enter through the Ley Lines then?||

||Yohual could get him through
Nicole got Nefer through||

[worldly rain]

Leylines are temporary files which has to be stored in mainframe aka Irminsul
||with mainframe gone and replaced with another new mainframe|| you can keep surfing through temp files doesn't mean much

And|| Pantelone has no access to mainframe||

[thick oyster]

||Because you claimed it would be easier||

No I think it already did I'm pretty sure

[worldly rain]

No it was in mainframe ||which got burned||

[wild marsh]

no

they came before

[thick oyster]

Let me check

Yep

[worldly rain]

And ||the person that connected that old mainframe to new one and was responsible for transferring files didn't see anyone or anything|| so where does ||pantelone|| fit here...

[wild marsh]

just to let u guys know, pi knows they are coping, but they will believe anyway.

||but i dont know if they will end it with the pyro gnosis actually disappearing/being the cost of burning irminsul so I think it still needs to be explained where it is, and how it moved.||

My only explanation I could provide here is ||Pantalone wasn't tangible, so he could have gone through the same soul-data transmission process Dottore went through, but then idk how do u get the gnosis out.||

[worldly rain]

I'm still waiting for another "God's limit"

[wild marsh]

||the humble Asmoday trailer ending with her holding it.||

[worldly rain]

Alright here's hoping

[queen prawn]

||Shade took it because they said they will intervene ||

||now they delayed Tsarista, mission successfully ||

[worldly rain]

God's limit was 10 days before Livestream and then nod krai teaser was 3 days after Livestream
So when's Livestream for 6.7 again?

Oh another thing I always thought project stuza ||would involve burning Irminsul but that's well over I guess
So it's something else now and likely related to 3rd then||

Another thing which is more confusing now...
Is Inverted tree the same as Irminsul?

Exactly so what happened to the egg, the eagle etc...

Unless they're not the same

[wild marsh]

||Ever since that trailer, I figured Irminsul burning was like, a Dottore thing, not a Fatui thing. Since it was his "experiment", seemed like a personal mission.||

[thick oyster]

It has to do with Capitano no doubt
Because, well, "Millistein"

[worldly rain]

Nope they didn't there's a note on that as well which is why it says this story might not be true

[queen prawn]

||the missing gnosis:||

Also didnt you said ||fate system is still there so there shouldnt be any difference ||

Fair

[worldly rain]

So I looked and it was leonard who invented wind gliders back when musk reef was still part of pilos peak which venti blew away
He lived thousands of years ago
Remember that 1.1 event? (Probably not)
Anyway and snow king lived long before wind gliders were invented so..

Well I guess the story is old old

So this snow king from silent wings lore is not Belyi

Yeah and that boy who helped him could be 3rd

Ok not boy but traveler and his frost spirit

But yeah definitely 3rd

But that's still wierd because pakku was servant of Frostmoon scions...Not really a king

Right it says servant of forebears

But still wierd because according to glider snow king himself wanted to go into the tree
And there he was even trapped
But hymns make him sound like some villain...

Hymns says he tricked
But glider says he was a hero who wanted to unite the fae
One is painting him to be villain
Other a hero...
Something doesn't add up here truth probably lies somewhere between then

[thick oyster]

Belyi isn't Pakkaisukko

[worldly rain]

I wasn't saying they are

[thick oyster]

Well...he isn't

The snow king is Belyi Tsar

Doesn't have to be a Descender

Just calls them a traveler from beyond the walls

[worldly rain]

Snow king vanished
Belyi didn't
Can't be the same

[thick oyster]

We don't know how Belyi died

The wing glider says that it's how he died

The glider doesn't say the snow king was forgotten

[worldly rain]

No it's not about him dying it's about him being alive around cataclysm(he died there officially at least)
While snow king lived long before wind gliders existed which is thousands of years ago

And snow king was trapped there too according to glider and he vanished

[thick oyster]

No he died when he shattered the egg

Hm

Either just shorthand for him being dead

Or it's the cryo Sovereign's death instead

[worldly rain]

Point is snow king lived and died or vanished doesn't matter long before belyi would die

[thick oyster]

The king of the fae is the Tsar

So it has to be him

No it isn't

Hm

Because we have the history of Snezhnaya already and it doesn't mention a prior king

And the Belyi Tsar was made from dragon bones

[worldly rain]

Snow king failed
Belyi didn't

[thick oyster]

Tsaritsa and The Tsar

[thick oyster]

Belyi died

[sly bison]

What do you think the Tsarista will look like

[worldly rain]

During cataclysm yes
Snow king died thousands of years prior

[thick oyster]

From the new artifacts you mean?

No
Ew

I mean who else could it be

[sly bison]

Use the actual OG one

[thick oyster]

Besides Tsaritsa

[sly bison]

https://tenor.com/view/elysia-clap-clapping-happy-herrscher-gif-7672063076198997640

[worldly rain]

Also I was talking about uniting fae here
Snow king wanted to do so he failed
Belyi actually united fae under him

[thick oyster]

I thought Aksinya might be the Tsaritsa instead
||But she's a world quest character so nevermind||

Yeah so idk

World Quest characters can only be important 4 years after they debut

Evil Jeht

[queen prawn]

[thick oyster]

That's why he's just that guy
Kukulkan technically had to wait 0 years if he was the three scholars Capitano talked to

[queen prawn]

Also why Traveler is using gun in the ||Shadow Realm||

||Is that place disconnected and have no elemental power||

[thick oyster]

And Illuga is only relevant in world quests

[queen prawn]

The cope is high

[sly bison]

Honkai impact 3rd ye

[queen prawn]

It kind of is when ||Dottore basically told Pantalone how he could "return"(with lobotomy )||

[sly bison]

A huge exaggeration according to my fellows
She loves everyone

[queen prawn]

Trend

The bow

[worldly rain]

Lots of different factors and she became the escape goat

Yes scapegoat but escape goat sounds better

[thick oyster]

She's HSR Mavuika from what I've heard
So a Mary Sue

[worldly rain]

Nope

[thick oyster]

I'm just agenda posting

I don't really know

[sly bison]

They don’t hate Elysia

They just didn’t vibe with Cyrene

[worldly rain]

This was the og which was there from day 1
Then last patch we got "expy"

[sly bison]

Elysia has a strong af fanbase

[queen prawn]

Ain't they the same..

[worldly rain]

They did the HoC thing a bit differently here

[sly bison]

No

Cyrene is based on Elysia

[worldly rain]

No that's cyrene

Yeah this smolrene and bigrene are the same because of causality time loop thing they did

But also different

But also same

[queen prawn]

Miliastra

[worldly rain]

Eh different kinda

No like closing the loop so you go back in time and play the role again and again to keep the causality

[queen prawn]

Always

[thick oyster]

They're DottoreHQ. They hate you if you like any other Harbinger

No they hate him

It was mainly around Natlan time
They still despise him and usually put him at the bottom of most rankings

[wild marsh]

they hate all the harbingers who "turned", who aren't like, outright villains I guess. They all had a preconceived notion about what Fatui are

[thick oyster]

They also hate the Tsaritsa especially

[wild marsh]

I saw a post and they posted the clip of the end of the lazzo teaser and were like "what happened to this fatui" like, idk what they even mean. I think they just made up an idea of the fatui in their head

and are mad they interpreted them in a narrow view

when nothing was ever really disclosed about them

[thick oyster]

It's funny how badly they switched up on Arlecchino too

They went from constantly glazing her to despising her with all their souls because she went against Dottore

Like they genuinely don't understand why she wouldn't like him

[worldly rain]

"They did dottore dirty the story is so bad the writing is shit"
Why?
"Because he's not playable"

Literal argument in that sub btw

[thick oyster]

I saw someone literally say that word for word
"Dottore's pet" was their name

[wild marsh]

did they play the AQ

interesting take

[thick oyster]

And he wasn't in Sumeru?

So when you actually got to know him you disliked him

[wild marsh]

||feel like this would've been a good take if they didn't read his dialogue, or if he was revived again.||

but I disagree

with him being a cheap villain

[thick oyster]

The time stop was the only problem

Idk why he didn't use it again
The only thing I can guess is that the fake moon marrows was worse than the real deal

[worldly rain]

I literally saw them glazing how good dottore is written and then literally next line say hoyo writing is shit
And when pressed say why isn't he playable

They have no argument... It's just signora tier seethe

[thick oyster]

He's a fail boy
Truly

Huh?

Isn't that a good thing?

Could have been worse

https://tenor.com/view/homelander-homelander-begging-homelander-on-his-knees-the-boys-season-5-homelander-ill-suck-gif-18180832744766558344

[thick oyster]

Could've gone down like this

Shocked we haven't gotten a redraw yet
Looks like I'll have to do it

[worldly rain]

||his backstory literally reveals he doesn't care for results
Otherwise his segments would've helped him||
You can say this was revealed too late but that's different complain and not related to his character

[thick oyster]

I suck at drawing 😞
I had a drawing class planned soon but it canceled

[worldly rain]

I don't know you could read the diary ||he mention that was his plan from beginning||

And in his own ways he did succeed

[thick oyster]

And Datatorre wanted to drag the Traveler down with him

[worldly rain]

He knew his ||death was coming and he could no longer escape so he laid down the plan to make it a grand affair|| and he succeeded there

[thick oyster]

They wanted Dottore to get some kind of satisfaction in death I suppose
If he didn't then his fans would have been really mad

What did you want?

[worldly rain]

What were you looking forward to anyway? And no him winning is not on the cards... So what else?

[wild marsh]

idk it sounds like you're complaining about everything

[worldly rain]

He wasn't really a philosopher himself so..
And his opponent was nahida literal God of wisdom and a descender
I don't know man...
I think he was matched fairly

[wild marsh]

and you think he wasn't?

because he said ||I only care for results?||

?

oh ye mb

wrote it wrong

but

lol

idk

||its the ramblings of a sore loser. I'm surprised you put so much stock in that.||

Yeah

he

kinda is pathetic

lmfao

His whole character arc starts from him being insanely mad he got expelled

[worldly rain]

I think people are forgetting that this wasn't a beginning it was end
He had a proper fight already with moonttorre
||This was just his own way of burning the world with him aka last farewell||
At least that's what the story wanted to show and that's how I saw it as well
And the fact that he ||went in his own terms especially when fighting against fate|| that's not really underwhelming to me

How many in this game can even say that they || went in their own terms while fighting fate||? Very few and he's one of them

That was already established when his own ||segments disected him||

[thick oyster]

Capitano can but he actually won

[wild marsh]

I think a lot of people expected him to be an Aizen-esque character. ||I definitely don't think he intended to lose (he may have intended to die as moonttore, im not sure about that), but people didn't want his story to end, because he was larger than life in a sense. Always a contingency, always something goes his way, how can this guy truly lose. but I am glad that he wasn't, I'm so glad that he was essentially just "how far can I push myself against fate". but he did it in a cringe way that exposed himself as mad at the world I feel. which is why I like the ending to his character, but not the stuff inbetween.||

[worldly rain]

he got support from others....imagine if LotN just refused him and called him a villain..

[thick oyster]

She wouldn't cause she needed his immortality

Plus angels are predisposed to obeying humanity

[worldly rain]

||he just exhausted his time and in the end decided for himself how he wanna go
he lost to the fate but still had his own hand in his finale||

[wild marsh]

to who? rhinny-chan?

[thick oyster]

B?

Yeah she's the only Hex who appears in his quest

[worldly rain]

|| "I perceive a truly magnificent scene: one half of my soul enters the Ley Lines through death, while the remaining half is injected as pure data. My two halves would then navigate those pathways to converge with the information of the past. It would be possible for me, in this manner, to achieve the preservation of my memories.
We might consider that as one of death's rare oversights.
Something that is even more eternal than eternal life itself?
Hehe... An immortal record would certainly satisfy that definition, of course."
this was his plan btw from beginning ||
@odd thicket

he did yeah that's why they had to ||burn the Irminsul||

||he created eternal memories of himself that's why to defeat him they had to burn the whole tree just to erase him||

yes ||but that book is residue from the burnt tree|| it's a record but one not found in ||Aaru for example||

a bit different i guess ||Deshret made golden slumber as a way to store memories of his people away from the influence of Irminsul but in dottore's case he used Irminsul itself to store himself permanently||

[onyx fossil]

man i must be pretty popular if i keep getting pinged

[thick oyster]

||My Dottore-Deshret theory grows ever bigger||

Kaveh is more Deshret than Alhaitham honestly

Deshret was famously driven by emotion

Or so we think
Ba fragments exist

I mean it would explain why he's so crazy

[wild marsh]

sorry buddy. ||Dottore loses when Alhaitham is the one who cooks up the plan... Alhaitham when he tries...||

[thick oyster]

That's just what he thinks

[worldly rain]

||while deshret wanted to severe the influence of Irminsul and fate dottore used that to his own advantage and went full virus mode inside Irminsul lol||

[wild marsh]

[thick oyster]

That's why Deshret failed
Yaoibait will always triumph over hetslop

[wild marsh]

dont diss my goat

deshret gave up

he could do it if he tried

[thick oyster]

Remus was right there and he was blind to it

For the tax benefits

[worldly rain]

||deshret gave up yeah his project wasn't finalized||

[thick oyster]

That one yaoi proportions meme but with Pants and Zandih

[worldly rain]

we're talking about ||Aaru he would've created a parallel fate if he hadn't stoped because of his promise to Nabu and Rukha||

and then the whole FK event just happened and well he died there so gg

[thick oyster]

Damn

[wild marsh]

insane cope

1.5x is a lot

[worldly rain]

also this narrative of his ||love being one sided should end now when Nabu literally stole the tech from celestia and risked it all just to fulfill his desires and died as well||

[thick oyster]

Yes I saw

Dottore could be wearing stilts

[thick oyster]

||I mean she's an angel essentially programmed to serve everyone||

Also the colors are different too

[wild marsh]

nah i dont think this is the same board, or same place.

[thick oyster]

They would degenerate if they ever did

Most buildings in the desert look yellow though

[wild marsh]

|| https://x.com/neuvillettefan2/status/2057982949921087894 || ||oh this makes sense lol. teyvat guide...||

🦦Daily Neuvillette/ New Valet 🌧️ (@neuvillettefan2)

Like I'm so dumb dude, it was so obvious this WHOLE TIME. She was a guardian angel, not Asmonday, not a Shade, not Phanes. She's an angel, I'm so fucking DUMB

X · May 23, 2026, 12:32 AM

[worldly rain]

Koitar did and she's didn't became selee
besides we got new info now not everyone had the same deal

[thick oyster]

Yeah but no building in the desert looks like this
Even the modern ones

[thick oyster]

Koitar is special

[wild marsh]

different number of shelves, the board is in front of a disproportionate shelf, which isn't as big.

[thick oyster]

She got sealed in her palace

[wild marsh]

it's either a different board, or a different place

[worldly rain]

so are those who didn't become Selee and retained their form

[thick oyster]

Like who?

No

[worldly rain]

Nabu, Sybilla, LotN, Nicole...Zibai

[wild marsh]

but the background doesn't. that could just be a generic board that they've swapped out for a bigger one.

[thick oyster]

They weren't sealed in their palaces

[wild marsh]

yeah

[worldly rain]

what does this have to do with them becoming Selee when we know only those who gave up wisdom became Selee
and none of those I mentioned ever gave up wisdom

[thick oyster]

I meant that Koitar was special because she got cursed to be sealed in her palace by Phanes

[thick oyster]

So she might have a different curse or something

[wild marsh]

yeah. I think its still interesting that she has possible connections to angels

and shades both

yeah. i think hybrid is possible. some amalgamation?

[worldly rain]

Imo she's a record made to store Traveler's journey and depending on which side she is it could be both bad or good thing lol

or trapping him to fate

[wild marsh]

what do we consider Nihilita and Melanta as? are they like, pieces of a shade? similar to something like Venti?

yeah but as beings

what are they

[sly bison]

Do we like Nicole in this channel

[worldly rain]

but not the PO

but do we...

[thick oyster]

No they're the Demiurge

They're painfully unaware of how insignificant they are in the grand scheme of things

[thick oyster]

Yes that's what I said

Wdym

Possible

But they're like Melanta
Still sticking to their set of rules even if they explode

He wished he was like Nihilata

But he never abandoned his perceived duty

[wild marsh]

as far as I understood, that was after we beat him, he came to the realisation that it was pointless.

and yeah, at that point it was too late.

when is hoyo gonna give us WQ travel log we can look up in game.

[thick oyster]

Well Nihilata went to the mortal realm

So maybe that was his "eye opening"

[wild marsh]

i mean... its text

[thick oyster]

Their eye never opened

[wild marsh]

yeah but im talking the same thing they do with the AQ and SQs

which is just text

and audio

but WQs dont have voiced dialogue

so it'd just be text

[thick oyster]

They're asleep

[wild marsh]

menu > archive > travel log

oh. nahh. i think that would be way to complicated, and like, idk how do you chronicle that

like, what's the chronological order of WQs lol

[thick oyster]

Maybe

But I think Dottore would have seen them

Hroptatyr will probably appear in Snezhnaya if I had to guess

||Don't be rude to the tree||

And it's in a desert too 💔

Considering his connection to Pierro

They're just going to outsource water from Fontaine duh

Especially if they're split personalities

Furina bath water

Her death water

Protocols of the elders of Fontaine

[worldly rain]

||"The paperwork is the worst. I'd much rather be running around outside—— Hey, Kleiner! Over here!"
Alice sprang to her feet and waved vigorously. The figure in the distance, who was juggling eight paper bags, waved back with equal enthusiasm.||
Match made in heaven can't wait to see the goofball

[graceful lagoon]

this part is so weird
||Nahida just told us to go to caravan ribat, then we went there, then Paimon went with hat guy, then somehow we cut back here and both Paimon and us are with Nahida||

[queen prawn]

My friend fanfic is next level

We bully him a lot for his shit take and lore skipping take

https://tenor.com/view/collei-genshin-impact-genshin-impact-dendro-gif-26533199

Collei should have keep ||"her" power|| for any future catastrophic event ngl

[worldly rain]

Parable being talked about saying how God of light made a body in it's own likeness...Which was stolen by king of darkness

Bp story telling how there was a glorious kingdom in heaven and from there came crown heir who was tasked to get the Genesis pearl from kingdom of darkness but was deceived in the end

Both sounds connected...

[worldly rain]

No they're the primordial humans created by heavens aka PO in their likeness (light realm likely)

As for who these two heirs are well we have two siblings who lost their memories so that's the likely candidate

Why would they be children they themselves would be the og

[sly bison]

Let the girl ||recovering from PTSD live her life a “normie” and the GOATs like Liloupaur have their thematic send-offs||

No one did it like her

No prescence

Merely a statements farmer

Cmon pisquare

Call me when she has lasting aura for generations carried for years in the game like Deshret or Nabu Malikata

[sly bison]

Too late

Now the Teyvat chapter is almost ending 😭

Tell the her to pick up the pace before she gets blown away like dust

[thick oyster]

Damn the new Kagura Bachi chapter was crazy
Also it's my birthday 😃

But back to Genshin lore

[thick oyster]

It has like three more years left bro

Potentially more if they break Khaenri'ah into two parts like they did with Snezhnaya

She also created fat fuck

She also gave us Boreas who indirectly gave us Varka

She gave us so many baddies

[sly bison]

The real khaenrian chapters are the dainslef disappearances we made along the way

[thick oyster]

Don't be so sure

Nod-Krai 2

Yeah it is a little odd

Capitano and Pierro would make good links

She hates the Abyss so yeah

It had to rebirth itself to be free from fate

Yeah that one is unclear

Yes

It's probably been altered somehow already

Yeah not fully is what I meant

A false solution

The Abyss is a universal constant

How

Octavia thinks the universe is doomed

The other ones don't have as much knowledge

From what though
We don't know

She could be a chronicler too possibly

Exactly

I imagine they were all there for her birth or something

She kinda gives me jellyfish vibes
And we know the chroniclers aren't chordates

I imagine she would have met Octavia at least once

Yeah

And Andersotter

It would be a ghost version though

Not the real deal

She's like 12 I think

Since she's implied to be the same age as Prune

[sly bison]

Too busy preserving the game’s revenue with Chinese Roblox

[sly bison]

I wonder how much of her concept design she’s gonna keep upon being playable

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/powerscaling-genshin-impact/images/a/a9/Octavia.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/605?cb=20251127202523

iykyk

All good king Sovereign

Keep the hate alive and burning

*Soveriegn

[thick oyster]

Too much skin covered
They're gonna turn that shit into a crop top at least

Also remove her hat

For no reason

[sly bison]

She’s gonna be Promeia from ZZZ

[thick oyster]

Her design is so fucking funny man

[sly bison]

https://tenor.com/view/promeia-zzz-zzz-zenless-zone-zero-promeia-ult-zzz-ult-gif-920563503510200299

She Naruto run

https://tenor.com/view/gtg-omw-gotta-blast-naruto-run-gif-5552832

[queen prawn]

Finally someone respect Liloupar🤞

It was kind of deserved

Also why are we spoiler her lore

[sly bison]

Like it should go without saying that Liloupaur isn’t high tier bc what she did/how she remarks people she belittles is sth that should be condoned (quite the opposite)

She’s high tier bc the narrative does not beat around the bush of the person she is/was while also developing her as a character. It doesn’t downplay how multifaceted she is. How she grows to respect people like Jeht who are willing to rise above and beyond her circumstances is fascinating along with her dynamic with her. And how her brief time with her, Traveler, and Paimon ultimately brings her to reconcile/come to terms with herself is just too good.

Man 3.x Genshin was sth else

-# except the lack of underground maps at the time screw that

[full pasture]

Was nibelungs will already great enough to be counted as a descender or was he descender status by virtue of the power of the abyss he returned with

[graceful lagoon]

you mean the milky way?

it was visible during archon quest

[worldly rain]

Not their child
Child of humanity as in all human descent from primordial human
This one was created in the likeness of God of light and stolen by Gold of darkness later assuming the parable is real

[graceful lagoon]

the milkyway yes?

it was visible during desert part

but you have to clip through the wall to see it

ye

[worldly rain]

Yes
But again it doesn't fit well or something different is going on I guess
I was just wondering if both are connected somehow and that led to thinking about siblings but I don't think it does connect well as you said

[graceful lagoon]

normally it's not the skybox for desert but in some part of story they don't change the skybox

tbh i don't think it has any deep meaning

[full pasture]

but how does that answer if he was descender status before the abyss or because of it

why didn’t that make the moon sisters or trilune bina a descender than?

[worldly rain]

That wouldn't make sense as PO is the one who created heavens not the other way round
Besides then who would be the God of light in this case?

[full pasture]

so if being able
to govern the rules and laws of the world didn’t make trilune bina a descender, what does nibelung being the OG authority and handing it down to the sisters prove he was descender status before the abyss

[worldly rain]

But dragons didn't create humans that's established already
Kukulkan already mentions humans only arrived after PO came

Then dragons would know of this primordial human they don't even acknowledge

There's other fact that primordial human was born of both light and darkness
That's again not possible in the time of Nibelung as darkness (abyss) only arrived in teyvat after he returns

But humans already existed long before that

Then how did nibelung create him if he already left

And where's the abyss juice coming from

In case of PO I can think of abyss because they've been hinted to be of both Constitution just like traveler
But nibelung didn't touch abyss until he went outside

Well PO is the descender that's as light as it can be

"Primordial one may have been Phanes" This line from BSAM might be the hint that PO and Phanes are the two side of same coin aka day king and night king stuff

Which would lead to PO being light king and Phanes being darkness king

But again primordial human is their creation which is entirely different entity

Or maybe hoyo is just fucking with us using their cryptic lore and turns out nothing is real here

[worldly rain]

Would love if they could bring back delusions again

Especially now that we're going to Snezh

Also is the wheel behind her different from usual fatui one?

That's a lot of those faction then

[wild marsh]

only ones we know there are fae and fatui right

left and right of fatui both look like crowns? at least the left one does

so im guessing royal families

not sure what 2 left is. its very fontaine, so im guessing like, research/manufacturing. some kind of private contractors fatui use for their tech maybe?? or a specific branch of fatui that has its own thing.

and then the one hidden by her key...

[worldly rain]

Every one thinking lizard being dottore but it was Abbas

Now who the fk is this guy

[thick oyster]

The introduction being her eulogy makes me think Sandrone just gets up out of her coffin right afterwards

Everyone get in the coffin now! Ah what the this is the dress shortener!

https://tenor.com/view/impossible-this-isn't-the-car-jjba-car-meme-we're-leaving-this-town-now-everyone-get-in-the-car-jjba-english-dub-gif-3307861192517773106

His only impact on the world

He failed at that

Also I have a new copium

Not thanks to him

The Confederacy forced Lincoln's hand into ending slavery that doesn't mean we're giving the credit to the Confederacy for ending slavery

Alright so I think they're straight up lying to us about 6.7 being the final Nod-Krai version
I think they'll be a secret 6.8 that will have the first Snezhnaya quest just like how 5.8 had the first Nod-Krai quest
And that 6.8 will have the Dainsleif quest

So technically we will be going to Snezhnaya in August it'll just be through the AQ and not directly

I mean they are Hoyoverse

No I don't think so

Nah

The Sinners PV will be in Snezhnaya if I had to guess

No
In preparation for Khaenri'ah

Yes but towards the end

So from 7.4-7.8

Or so

They're probably celebrating

But they also probably took the pyro gnosis for Yohualtecuhtin

[wild marsh]

idk, he is a catalyst for the events that caused them.

status quo is maintained without him doing something

[thick oyster]

Yeah not through a PV though

[wild marsh]

what's the point of this tho

[thick oyster]

Bait

[wild marsh]

can you answer in terms of someone who isn't a brainrotted internet leech in their 20s would say

because that isn't an actual point

for them to do it

[thick oyster]

No need to be a jerk about it man

[wild marsh]

its not a dig at you specifically, just your entire generation.

[thick oyster]

There's still that deal with Yohualtecuhtin

[thick oyster]

How old are you?

[wild marsh]

what is it subverting? the expectation of it being called 7.0 instead it's Lunar 9?

[thick oyster]

They would rather do it for an AQ though

[worldly rain]

@odd thicket I have a feeling Askinya might be Ivanovna...

"The silver-haired maiden was once among them, though in those days she had yet to become a mage in the shadows..."

[thick oyster]

So from the generation born with a spoon in their mouths?

[thick oyster]

Ivanova had no magic

They haven't done that before

Feels a little messy

[worldly rain]

She became part of Hex...

[thick oyster]

Yeah but she had no magic
She herself says so

But it happened in a quest

That was just foreshadowing not the plot happening for the game in its stead

[worldly rain]

Mage might just be hex witches for all we know
Wouldn't be first time hoyo uses different words for same thing

[thick oyster]

Ivanova didn't have any magic while Aksinya did

Fair
But the AO giving over the Pyro Gnosis is the type of thing that would happen in game

Mhm

[wild marsh]

oh my b. sry. didnt see that

[worldly rain]

Askinya got magic when?

[thick oyster]

"mage in the shadows"

[worldly rain]

Yeah I'm saying that's a way of saying hex aka different words
Her being part of hex means she was witch doesn't matter if she had actual magic or not

[thick oyster]

No it's referring to The Belyi Tsar recruiting her for his blasphemous experiments

[worldly rain]

Aksinya didn't gain magic
Her becoming mage is what I'm saying referring to her becoming hex not literally wizard

I'm saying hoyo is using different words for same thing
Like they did with morning star dawn star

Anyway just a theory

[thick oyster]

Her name isn't even Ivanova

[worldly rain]

Could be her name before she joined hex
Not like Aksinya was her own name it was likely given by Tsar

[thick oyster]

The Tsar raised her

Of course he gave it to her

[queen prawn]

Doubtful

They already done with Snezhnaya by now

[thick oyster]

I know

But I do genuinely feel like something is up

Idk what though

[queen prawn]

The thing is that 6.x is promoted as song of the welkin Moon,will be weird to have Snezhnaya in 6.x and have song of the Welkin Moon

[thick oyster]

I don't think Snezhnaya will be in 6.X.

I just think we'll get the first Snezhnaya AQ in another nation like what Nod-Krai got

Remember
5.8 had the first Welkin Moon quest technically

[queen prawn]

Even so, there is|| summer event in 6.7 and it is permanent ||

[thick oyster]

||Did it say that it was permanent?||

||There was also a leak that said there would be a Dainsleif quest||

[queen prawn]

||it is tied with Sandrone resurrection ||

I will check later

[thick oyster]

||We haven't gotten any Dainsleif quest leaks though
Have we ever gotten missing data during the initial leaks?||

[queen prawn]

No

[thick oyster]

Fuck

[graceful lagoon]

and we got Sumeru anyway

[thick oyster]

||https://www.reddit.com/r/CapitanoMainsGI/comments/1tn3w0n/yohualtecuhtins_condition_the_pyro_gnosis_how_it/ Posted a Capitano theory here||

[vivid wasp]

Hello

I finished the Archon Quest

Here are my quick thoughts
||It was fine I guess. I enjoyed the first act more then the second, the many callbacks to old Sumeru quests were really neat, like it truly all tied everything together so that's cool. But then the second act was filler. Like, seriously what was the point of the whole bullshit with Kaveh and Alhaitham aside from fanservice. I wouldn't have minded it if was like 2 minutes of converstion but my God did it piss me off how long it was. Cool cutscenes I guess. The Pyro Gnosis is gone so that's interesting as well. I didn't like it overall, just the first act. No Natlan crumbs, and Mavuika was there so that automatically makes it suck. 10/10 on the first act 4/10 on the second.||

I just want the Mare Jivari man

Oh yeah and Sandrone drip marketing

Her new design sucks balls

Whoever redesigned her deserves death by firing squad

I have nothing else to say, overall it's been a mid version

[thick oyster]

Eh it isn't that bad

[vivid wasp]

I hate it

[thick oyster]

The biggest fucking shit is ||Pulonia being gone||

That sucks ass

[vivid wasp]

Seriously

God I have no hope for Snezhnaya
I never had to begin with but whatever

I just want the Mare Jivari I just want the Mare Jivari I just want the Mare Jivari I just want the Mare Jivari I just want the Mare Jivari I just want the Mare Jivari

[thick oyster]

||My only cope is that he could at the very least be alive and just not in Sandrone's kit but shit idk||

[thick oyster]

Eventually

Eventually

Just like Capitano

[vivid wasp]

I'm tired of these "eventuallys"
They wrapped up Sumeru's quest
They said that the Nod-Krai patch was meant to be where they would wrap up all the existing storylines
Where the fuck is Natlan
God

[thick oyster]

That's the problem with games like this I suppose

The wait sucks

[vivid wasp]

Have there been any leaks about when the Mare Jivari might come out

[thick oyster]

Alongside the rampant gambling promotion

[thick oyster]

No

At least not in recent times

[vivid wasp]

😂 🔫

[thick oyster]

||I just wanted a Dainsleif quest man and we didn't even get that
The Moon map looks really good at least though||

[vivid wasp]

||yes, the moon map looks amazing, I do agree|| 6.7 leaks

[thick oyster]

||There are supposed to be meeting spots there apparently too? But those haven't gotten leaked yet||

[vivid wasp]

||Meeting spots? Wdym||

[thick oyster]

||It was a questionable leak though so I doubt it was true||

[thick oyster]

You know how a bunch of characters in Nod-Krai got those things you could donate the sigils too and get primogems and little interactions with the character?
Yeah the same as those ||but for the moon||

[vivid wasp]

Ohhh

Actually

Well uh

I did see a video ||showcasing the new area||

And well, small spoiler I guess? ||there was an icon for a meeting point location, so there's that||

Also holy fuck the ||new area really is huge||

[thick oyster]

||Yeah there are those but none showing the characters||

[thick oyster]

Yep it is

Crazy considering how fucking puny the recent areas have been

[vivid wasp]

?

[thick oyster]

It won't I promise
I won't let it happen

https://tenor.com/view/dark-souls-collapse-defeated-gif-14214156

[vivid wasp]

Honestly I kind of hope its true because I'm so fucking pissed at the game that atp I don't want any stories to be good until Natlan's story is good

[thick oyster]

C'mon man please don't jinx it 😭

Have mercy

[vivid wasp]

There will be no mercy until the Mare Jivari releases

[thick oyster]

Which one was it again?

[vivid wasp]

Uhh I found it on youtube

[thick oyster]

Ah ok

I just want more fucking Capitano crumbs
But Sandrone should provide those at least

[vivid wasp]

She'll have a voiceline talking about him going to the tea parties and it will be nothing we don't know already

[thick oyster]

At least it'll be in present tense

That's big

[vivid wasp]

Uhh, one more thing I guess?

Nicole has an interesting voiceline

[thick oyster]

Oh yeah I saw that

||Edited Ursa's wiki page myself lol||

[vivid wasp]

I mean, aside from the implications of ||angels turning into Dragons|| the reason why I found it interesting was because ||Ursa the Drake is kind of connected to the Mu-Natlans... because Venessa's tribe was attacked by it 1,000 years ago. So there's that. Not that it means anything I just feel so fucking miserable right now.||

[thick oyster]

Sure I guess

[vivid wasp]

I wanna be put into a coma and wake up only when the Mare Jivari releases

[thick oyster]

If only

[vivid wasp]

?

Explain

Is it about the ||Primordial Humans|| right?

Well, I heard from Amgelus that the part about the ||Primordial Humans creating the Angels is a mistranslation, and the Primordial Human part is meant to be the Heavenly Principles||

But Nicole's voiceline on Albedo is also very interesting

But what was that thing about like Gnosticism

That you said if I was there I could add to it

[vivid wasp]

Hmmm
Idk what to think of/add to lol

I'm not 100% well versed in Gnosticism, I only know the stuff with the Demiurge and Sophia really

For your theory on the twins being representative of Sophia and Jesus, I have seen people theorize that as well

But personally I'm partial to my Natlan theory

Men of Lithin is apparently about Natlantea though right?
I guess thats something

Hmm well Natlantea is dragon lore and I'm not well-versed in that

I've said it before but I'm really only interested in the Mare Jivari and the Mu-Natlans

Idk anything about Och-Kan and the likes

Huh
How does the Primordial Human tie into the Mare Jivari?

Ah right

But that doesn't necessarily tie the Mare Jivari to the Primordial Humans I feel
Though I do believe the whole Primordial Human deal might tie into Natlan

The fertile soil thing is interesting because it reminds me of Enkanomiya

Damn I'm really not caught up

Regardless I don't think that like, the Mare Jivari will tie in to the lore of the Dragons so much so?
I mean, I know the Mu-Natlans were like followers of Och-Kan or whatever but I don't know

The reason why I think Natlan could be related to the Primordial Humans was more so because of me thinking like
The Primordial Humans are the "first" humans
And like, Natlan is partially inspired by Africa, and humanity started in Africa

We don't know that for 100% certain, there's so little info on them is the thing

Mickey is sleeping
He's been doing well, not shy anymore
He wakes me up at 6 in the morning everyday to give him food and demand attention

Well, there's also no record of the 7th tribe either is the thing, at least no one in current Natlan mentions it

Hmm yeah, that would tie in to the parable of the God of Light right?
So the God of Light could supposedly be Nibelung or Xiuhcoatl

My question is how would they have the blueprints on creating humans is the thing
Unless the "humans" they created were only in name, but not like the humans we might think of

They're beings of light

The Angels are technically "Dragons" as well
||especially with the new reveal||

And the Angels are pretty human like

I mean really they're just humans with wings appearance wise

Which is boring

Yeah but its possible that they just sort of, took that form to be more appealing to humans
Its hard to know

[brave marten]

reminds me I wish they showed the shades in some sort of Eldritch form like they did Ronova in Natlan before dropping their human designs in gods limits

[vivid wasp]

I'm honestly glad they didn't because it will just make me even sadder at how good their designs could have been

[brave marten]

fair enough

gods limits was nice but seeing Ronova made me

I don't think I can put what I felt into words

at least Pierro was tuff

[thick oyster]

Rerir mogs her so hard it's not even funny

[brave marten]

she wouldve been so fine with an Arlecchino esque design

but welp

[vivid wasp]

Literally every character mogs her

God I hate the designs of the Shades so much

[odd thicket]

Rhine ?

[vivid wasp]

Whoever approved of their design deserves to be castrated

[odd thicket]

😔

[odd thicket]

true that

[vivid wasp]

They're all ass idc what anyone says

[thick oyster]

I like Istaroth

[odd thicket]

he out divas her

[thick oyster]

They're both death gods and he's ten times better

[odd thicket]

Vedrfolnir should have sicced him on Ronova instead of Istaroth

[odd thicket]

he looks dressed for the part

[vivid wasp]

I hate Istaroth's design

[odd thicket]

https://tenor.com/view/rerir-rerir-genshin-genshin-impact-genshin-rerir-rerir-genshin-impact-gif-4657355405765468450

[vivid wasp]

They are all copy paste of each other it pisses me off
I mean I getttttt ittttt they're like the shades of this one guy so ofc they're all gonna be similar but my fucking God

[odd thicket]

all of them could have been weird

https://tenor.com/view/full-moon-bloodborne-gif-13663686

but then theres a kicker

[thick oyster]

Asides from the boob window

[odd thicket]

Shades are based off of PO
but so are the watchers and they are weird

[odd thicket]

nono thats the best part

[thick oyster]

I didn't say it wasn't

[odd thicket]

Fair

[vivid wasp]

Anyways I got a question

What was up with the "false moon" anyways
This is related to like, how I talked about a while ago about the welkin moon lady and how she's replaced by Columbina if you have her
But like really who the fuck is she

She looks too much like the statue of the omnipresent God for me to rule it out as me overthinking ok

[thick oyster]

The false moon itself was a projection

[vivid wasp]

But like
Why didn't they make the projection look like the actual frost moon...?

Ion get it

[thick oyster]

Well the Frostmoon got turned into a weapon

So maybe it looked different back in the day

[vivid wasp]

The whole moons being turned into a weapon thing is still kind of something we don't know about right

[thick oyster]

Yeah it's a little mysterious

[vivid wasp]

Anyways
I'm just looking for excuses to hate on Columbina but like genuinely I wanna know more about the OG Welkin Moon Lady because wtf

[thick oyster]

Might be Zibai? Or Canon maybe?

Idk

[vivid wasp]

Highly doubt its Zibai, doesn't look like her
Doesn't look like Canon either

[thick oyster]

Yeah I suppose

[odd thicket]

no we do

tri lune together forms a death star

i cant seem to find the gif smh

[vivid wasp]

Ah ok

[odd thicket]

Its the laser she unleashes to destroy Moontorre

Nibelung had used the same with a larger scope to trash the planet

[brave marten]

wow Bina used a planetary laser to kill Dottore

Dottore upscale

[odd thicket]

He was at ||50% || too

[brave marten]

I'd say even less considering the marrows lost most of their powers with Bina in teyvat

[odd thicket]

I think marrow powers are independent of Bina

Marrows were essence of the sisters

Whereas Bina bypassed Marrows with her Tri Lune

[brave marten]

that's what I meant

@vivid wasp do you like Sandrone's new design

[vivid wasp]

#・lore-basement message

[brave marten]

😭 😭

real shit

bro there's this guy who makes a minute reviews

on genshin designs

[vivid wasp]

Like what the fuck were they thinking

[brave marten]

and he crashed out so hard when he saw Sandrone's design

I need to show you wait

[vivid wasp]

WHY did she even need a redesign in the first place

Her original design was perfect

God

I've said before and I'll say it again I have no hope for Snezhnaya

Mare Jivari will be the only thing to save me

[brave marten]

you don't get it bro the skirt being shorter means she's developing as a character

[brave marten]

me neither after the new AQ

I haven't played since the new update if Snezhnaya is a disappointment overall I'm never playing this again

[vivid wasp]

Good to know I'm not the only one who thought it was mid at the very least, even if I'm just pissed because there's no Mare Jivari crumbs 😭

[brave marten]

that's why you thought it was mid? 💔

[vivid wasp]

Well more than that

I put my full thoughts up above

[brave marten]

can u uh tag me

show me

[vivid wasp]

I enjoyed the first act, but hated the second

#・lore-basement message

[brave marten]

oh I see

well

for me it was the lack of consequences

the burning not being attributed to Dottore was also lame

the lazzo teaser made it look like it was him with the smirk and all

but I liked his writing overall except one line that ruined it for me

when he said it was all about the process than the results

I expected more to happen between him and Scaramouche

[thick oyster]

I mean it's called a misdirection

[thick oyster]

People genuinely saying it's because the longer dress would have been "harder to animate" 💀

https://tenor.com/view/genshin-ayaka-tcg-genshin-genshin-impact-ayaka-kamisato-gif-17773340334972015572

[brave marten]

well I don't think it was handled well then

they teased it twice

[thick oyster]

2.0 character btw

[thick oyster]

Twice?

[brave marten]

yeah

the second time in the animated Sumeru animated teaser

[thick oyster]

Once in Lazzo
The second time?

[brave marten]

with the traveler

[thick oyster]

When was the first

[brave marten]

staring at the tree

while it's burning

[brave marten]

hold on let me find it

[thick oyster]

That was in Lazzo

[brave marten]

the traveler I said

[vivid wasp]

NO FOR REAL

[brave marten]

not Dottore

[thick oyster]

I have a friend saying this God love them
They're chill but they're a dumbass

[brave marten]

https://youtu.be/zZEpU-DbzZU?si=sUD8NI9t4s3QFR9n

around the 30 second mark

[vivid wasp]

Yeah that pissed me off too
They built it up for so many years and then it was just that? Really?
There were no consequences whatsoever in the end.
And the whole last minute thing about Dottore finding out about who Scaramouche was is even dumber, it's just there for fanservice honestly.

[thick oyster]

Yeah I saw
Dottore didn't appear there though

[brave marten]

yeah the traveler did

it didn't look like something they did

[thick oyster]

Do nothing saying that Dottore did it

Could have been Scaramouche for all we knew back then

[brave marten]

Dottore smirking makes it look like he did it while traveler staring in defeat like that

[brave marten]

yeah and honestly I was expecting

Dottore to bring back everyone's memories

[thick oyster]

Dottore appeared?

[brave marten]

for Scaramouche

and other stuff

but that didn't happen

I don't get why

just saying that fate is more flexible now is not consequences

[brave marten]

no Dottore in lazio and traveler in the that promo

[thick oyster]

Ok

[vivid wasp]

That too
Like, I was told there was a leak saying thats what was going to happen but it turned out to be fake I guess

[thick oyster]

Yeah I thought the pyro gem would finally be revealed

[brave marten]

||it was by the most credible leaker we had in years too, his track record is like 95%||

so idk what's up with that

[vivid wasp]

I can't believe I'm about to say this but I'm kind of glad that was not the case
Like, I was sweating about starting the Archon Quest because I was like "Oh God please don't let it be revealed in a completely unrelated Sumeru quest"

[thick oyster]

Fair lol

I was most nervous about the pyro gnosis
If Pantalone or Dottore got it I would have been pissed

[brave marten]

I'm thinking Pantalone might have got i

t

[thick oyster]

No way

He couldn't have

[brave marten]

where else could it be

[thick oyster]

The Abyss Order

Khaenri'ah was at the very base of Irminsul

[brave marten]

yeah idk about that bro

the story is clearly setting up for all the gnoses to get in the Tsaritsa's hands by Snezhnaya

[thick oyster]

Pantalone would have literally -1% chance to get it

[thick oyster]

Yeah and that will happen in Snezhnaya
Probably

[brave marten]

how long will the quests last for in Snezhnaya for the abyss order to beinvolved and a potential battle to happen between them and the Fatui to get the last gnosis

meanwhile there's shades involved

and a lot of the harbingers stories are still unresolved

[thick oyster]

How would Pantalone, a normal ass dude (mostly) even get the pyro gnosis in the burning husk of the center of fate?

[thick oyster]

They'll be resolved in Snezhnaya

[brave marten]

yeah but that's gonna take a while

involving the abyss order

at this rate

Snezhnaya's quest will end by 7.6

at least

• there's definitely mare jivari in the Snezhnaya patches

[thick oyster]

Could be a Amphoerous situation

[vivid wasp]

My hope is that the Pyro Gnosis will tie in to the Pyro Gemstone and the Mare Jivari because at this point I have nothing left to live for

[thick oyster]

Where it lasts the whole patch cycle

[brave marten]

if that's the case

[thick oyster]

Exactly so the Pyro Gnosis will be obtained then

[brave marten]

I hope the pacing doesn't suck

[thick oyster]

Hopefully

[brave marten]

Amphoreus was a pain in the ass

to go through

[thick oyster]

I haven't played it so I wouldn't know lol

But there's usually break patches in Genshin

[brave marten]

wait let me put you through a hypothetical

imagine Capitano telling Dottore about choosing the next 10th harbinger

and their conversation lasts the entire quest with cuts in between for others characters while saying something like "I think the traveler would be a good candidate" they'd make it sound philosophical and make it last 5 lines instead

idk if u get me

but the dialogue was a real pain in my ass like get to the fucking point using hard words doesn't make it sound smart

[thick oyster]

Yeah that would be lame

[queen prawn]

||since fate is still around but with more possibilities now,I have a feeling Paimon is the one who is holding it up so future story would involve Traveler defending Paimon rather than fight her like some people think||

||Right now hoyo is trying to develop Paimom character,Paimom in Sumeru AQ asked if she is useless,Traveler care for Paimon after dottore captured us and more, this is not a coincidence, Traveler is attached to Paimon so is Paimon to Traveler,it is a great twist that Paimon is the one holding the world fate unknown to her.||

||Paimon being a guide somewhat makes sense too,it mean Paimon is guiding Traveler to the right direction of fate. "Let explore the area ahead of us later" might not just be out of bound prevention but have some significant,but I said she might not know of her ability,well it is a might, she might know it but like the Shade,is rebellious ||

[vivid wasp]

||I personally think Paimon is going to turn out to be some sort of weird clone of what Nahida is to Rhukkhadevata but to the Primordial One. Idk||

[white spade]

I fucking knew they were gonna send 'em off that way. I came back and started paying attention to the story for a little bit. I predcit all the crap that be going on in this game.

Also, this story was a banger this update!

YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO THE KING LOOKS SICK GUYS

[odd thicket]

||https://www.reddit.com/r/DottoreMains/comments/1tnvsje/thoth_and_lizard/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button || @thick oyster

what do you think

also compound it with ||Dottore wanting to move on, not desiring to be stuck as a 35 year old ||

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It does help my Dotteshret theory

Should probably get to updating that someday

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yeah

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Also fits with Deshret's obsession with time

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while Deshret wanted to live in the past

yeah

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Deshret also wanted humanity to be built off the tomb of the gods
So he intentionally sacrificed himself into ba fragments so that humanity would thrive on their own building off of him

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is the ba fragments thing confirmed

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||Which ironically came true through Aaru||

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didnt he erase himself wholly

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No
Just my theory

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His body was eaten

But his soul is unknown

Also playing through Nicole's second quest
||She's pro Koitar and Seutervoinen lol||

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soul too should be corrupted

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shame, but at least shes anti PO

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Probably yeah
That's why Dottore became so messed up

Also why his eyes are red

Red eyes happen when you have forbidden knowledge remember?

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no
he had them as a kid

his red eyes are meaningless

lohen and illuga have it too

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Yes because ba fragments could only be obtained as a kid

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This is different
Dottore is in Sumeru's context

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Dottore is messed up because he was permanently stuck in one time for eternity

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He was messed up always

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something bad happened when he was 8

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He himself admits he lost his compassion at age 8

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yeah

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Or it was a combination of factors

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we know he was chased out with pitchforks and threats of death

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We don't know when that happened though

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true

still
should have happened together

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Could have been at age 16

Or older

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but then he was a forest dweller

how could he have come across fragments from the desert

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No he's an eremite
Probably

Look at his mask

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no, hes clearly a forest dweller

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There are white eremites

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that came afterwards

no

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It shows his heritage

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the outfit 8torre wears

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Hm oh yeah

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he was also from a merchant family

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Still
Doesn't disprove he got Deshret fragments
In fact it would be more ironic if a forest dweller got them

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meaning he lived either at Oromos, Sumeru city or Bayda Harbour

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Cyno was raised in the forest despite having Hermanubis fragments

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hes a total human though
if he had divine aid, it defeats his whole theme

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No it doesn't

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yes it does

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Capitano is the total human

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khaenrians are different

dottore is the first one in the overworld to be this cracked

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He has a bunch of parallels with Deshret though
That's what you were just arguing

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parallels yes

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Ignoring the Sinners and Irmin

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but he Zandik is and always was a human

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Doubt it

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him getting divine aid for his endeavours even unknowingly defeats his theme

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He would still be human even with the ba fragments

It would be a parallel to Collei too

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his very theme is heretical

he despises divinity

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A parallel to Collei
The divine power only brought him pain

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Yet he became a god

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no
it would make him a fool off the bat

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....say that again?

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a human climbing to the post of a god through own merits

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Capitano did that

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https://tenor.com/view/genshin-fatui-dottore-il-dottore-dottore-fatui-fatui-harbingers-gif-26179929

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Stole the Moon marrows you mean

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yeah

and made one

his story only works if he began as a human

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No

He could have been haunted and made sick by the god power inside him
So he actually became a god in spite of the divine power ailing him
Think of it like that

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There has to be something deeper to his backstory

Wrong reply

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one of the reason the deshret parallel works is a random completely random child walking his path start to finish while rest of the world is unawares

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Because he had ba fragments shoved in him

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the pillars would have sussed it out right away

or nahida

thats the issue

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No they were trapped in Aaru
Also idk if the segments still have them

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they still would have sensed it

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They may have died with OG Zandik

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thoth met OG Zandik

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Thoth was in Aaru

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Nahida can verify using Irminsul

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So he couldn't

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the fragments of the very god who sealed them would be very noticeable

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Nobody sensed Nabu Malikata's fragments in Collei until the latest quest

Could be like that

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Nahida did but didnt divulge

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She sensed something but she didn't know it was Nabu

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still you get it

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I'm trying to establish parallels between Zandik and Collei
It would make sense

Also you think Deshret had any connection to Khaenri'ah?
They were neighbors

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Dottoreshet's biggest draw imo is rest of the world being oblivious to both's ambitions, pursuits and motives and relying on material familiarity to pin it

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Could tie into how Deshret was preserved

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even the pillars didnt fully realise his vision

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The world was not oblivious to Deshret's ambitions

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and nobody until wanderer bothered to even think of Dottore's

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they didnt fully understand it
like we see when the ||Aaaru|| proposal comes up

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Also Dotteshret is a parallel to Wanderer kind of
Scaramouche was tormented by his nature as a divine puppet

His divine connection tormented him too

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i am certain that if Zandik returns in a future quest, it would be about his past and parallels with Deshret, and only then we see Deshret in flesh

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honestly, no

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Yeah when it reveals how he was experimented on to imbue him with Deshret's soul fragments

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deshret soul fragments would bring on super eleazar so no

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This would be different
Same as Hermanubis fragments

Only children could accept them

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children can still get eleazar

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Collei's god fragments repressed her eleazar remember?

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deshret was choke full of FK

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But the god power in him would counter it

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evidently didnt

his body and soul were utterly tainted

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Also doesn't Eleazar give you scales?
You're the biggest Lizardtorre fan

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he was the epicentre

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Eleazar happens when elemental energies counter abyss in the living person's body

it wreaks havoc on their person

hmmmm

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So if it was merged with God fragments the result may be different

Hm

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said god fragments also would be tainted

thats the hurdle for you here

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But they would have the power of a god in them too

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like the crimson moon marrow

forever tainted

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Yeah
So it could be a similar situation to her
It gives power but also a curse

Dottore having Eleazar would make sense considering how obsessed he was with curing it
Abbas, Collei, Collei's friends

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if zandik had deshret fragments corrupted or uncorrupted it would have wreaked havoc when he went into the Withering or straying close to Gurahbad

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Plus might explain why ||dissecting him let the other Dottores figure out the immortality elixir||

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Maybe he already figured out how to repress it at that point

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alternatively it could be that Eleazar was unique in its properties and required knowledge of the human constitution like no other

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Possibly yeah but there feels like there's something deeper there

Considering how he had two separate projects to cure it over several centuries

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||85 was doomed by Time to die , could also be that
the elixir worked for pantalone long before 85's birthday||

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||Dissecting the OG is what let them perfect it entirely though||

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true
easy way out is his obsession with human constitution

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||Before that it just slowed Pantalone's aging didn't it?||

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is it stated ?

hmmm

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In one of the marrows I believe

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not sure
i think it readily worked for him

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I don't have em all yet though

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its up on the wiki

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||They say that dissecting OG is what helped them perfect it though||

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hmmm

||OG was also the imperfect subject for the elixir, not necessarily needing to do with the Ba fragments ||

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Yeah
||"We should be able to develop a drug that works better on us since we're experimenting on our own body."||

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also

i noticed in his cutscene that

||Omega fills in with details that are factual, like when Pantalone objects to what he felt when OG died||

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||Didn't Dottore lie that the immortality worked and the OG didn't die?||

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They were waiting for him to die

Yes

Dottore is an unreliable narrator too

Fuck

We need his backstory in full

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Eventually

I just fucking want Capitano's backstory man

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It would be bland if you make him goody two shoes

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He has to be Anfortas
I refuse to believe he isn't

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That his thing though
Honor and shit

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He can be adopting it at wake of cataclysm to undo past errors

Forever repaying for his sins underground

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No he was always honorable
Since Guthred was his counterpart and he was much less honorable

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He committed no sins

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Which Guthred

The real or fake

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Real

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Hmm

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I mean more so for aiding the Eclipse Dynasty

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We don't know what he did

In the eclipse dynasty

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If the top 3 harbinger - simulanka theory is right, all of them return after death with a personality change

And deep self enlightenment

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Huh?
That shit ain't true

Columbina didn't get much of a personality change at all

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Association is still a subject for condemnation

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Not in every scenario

Like this

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I mean we have not seen her after Act 8

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To be seen

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u think she gonna change

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She seems the same in the Selenic Chronicles

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I hope they reveal it so Captain is more human

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Fair

Shame

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||She's getting more screen time in 6.7||

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I hope so

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He's the pinnacle of humanity