・lore-basement

[tranquil flax]

7 - Hydro, I was originally thinking of an unwavering form of Justice, but im leaning towards receiving and accepting great responsibility. An example of this can be seen in Ayato, when his father fell ill, he basically had to accept that he had to become the new head of the Kamisato clan, he had to take that responsibility very seriously because if anything happened to Ayato he would risk his family and their future, as people were already trying to get the leaderless clan (that was extremely powerful) out of the picture. Nilou, she had to accept in dancing, the dancer must be responsible to showcasing the meaning and art of the dance, even though she herself didn’t believe that she was capable of meaning, Barbara in her vision story had to accept that “Never having sung before is no reason to abandon a child in their time of need”, basically, even though she may have been uncomfortable with something, she must still do it, as that is her responsibility, if it can help others. Similarly, now that Nuvillet his the hydro sovereign at his full potential, the reason why Focolar made Nuvilette as the judge for the last 500 years, was because she wanted him to accept his love for people, and basically take over the responsibility of watching over them.

idk i hope I made it make scense

[reef axle]

Eh, seeing the same issues there as most vision theories: Themes that "work" for 90% of the characters... but fall apart with 10%.

That and people who fit under mutliple because the definitions are very general

Like people love to go "Anemo = dead friends" while forgetting that Sayu and Sucrose seem to be doing just fine

The cryo = contradictions one is the only one I've seen that seems consistent enough and specific to the cryo characters

[lilac coral]

Then you also have geo that's all over the place and electro that usually gets grouped in with "people with (political)power" and ignore the like 20 characters that aren't electro and are in positions of power

The extreme loyalty was a new one but almost every character in the game has extreme loyalty to someone else or something

I feel like, at the start, they didn't know how they wanted to group vision users by element, then tried to, then gave up

[dense moss]

kek i accidentally clicked on genshin help when i was commenting on bennet's parents

i was a bit annoyed that it appeared that their sacrifice meant nothing cause they are just sentient asha but no they gone now

[tranquil flax]

see thats why i said "something died" not a friend lol, for sucrose it was a failed experiment...something that may have motivated her to push further in alchemy, though sayu is interesting yeah...

[odd thicket]

The issue i see with this is i could name one or many contradictions to each one

[tranquil flax]

i would argue...not really, yeah characters are loyal...but not as an electro character, bc in alot of times we have met electro units, they really did have this extreme loyalty towards something or someone, Keqing is very loyal to her principle of "humans over gods" yk, like she hated that she got a vision originally. Geos those are the most interesting because they have no "similar" factor, other than the fact they seem like those u can come to with any problem like a parent for a group...so thats why i gave a definition of being a rock

[odd thicket]

For pyro, mualani

Likewise mavuika could have gotten a hydro vision

Electro has well… Dori and Razor who arent entirely affiliated to an organisation or idealogy

Anemo has lynette and Lan Yan and Ifa

Dori could also be Geo

[tranquil flax]

dori is all for money lol, she has this not loyalty but she like chases money, Razor...he is very loyal to his way of life, lisa couldn't teacher him anything lol

[odd thicket]

Dendro also has Kirara, Yao Yao, etc

I think in 2025 we need to let go of how visions relate to personalities

[tranquil flax]

yeah, personal growth lol....bc Yaoyao did get a vision originally she didn't know why, but she kind of accepted it and countinues using it for good

[odd thicket]

You are relating to the archons who themselves were vision holders at one point

The seven sovereigns on the other hand have more relevance imo

Xiuhcoatl was called the “true face of Death “ by Gosoytoth

[tranquil flax]

well yeah, but we have no idea for most...only nuvi who we can actually build on

[odd thicket]

Apep created the first plants and flowers of the world

All nameless and identifiable with smell

[odd thicket]

We have many

Old Hydro Sovereign held dominion over life

Electro sovereign is imprisoned underneath Inazuma (allegedly)

[odd thicket]

Also by your definitions Aino should be an anemo user

She longed and longs for a family

But got her Hydro vision first

Before Ineffa

There is another issue here

Other vision holders could qualify for the title of Pyro Archon

And could use the power of the pyro throne and sacred flame

[tranquil flax]

see, mualani, though applicable to becoming a pyro, received her vision when she was protecting her people even though she didn't necessarily know how to fight, not really having a large passion towards something passed down to her....Mavuika according to the lore got her vision after she made a goal for herself to protect natlan an idea passed down to her by her parents who also fought in the Night Warden War

[odd thicket]

It is incredibly random

rana got her dendro vision after waking up

At the end of aranyaka

[tranquil flax]

well like i said, i believe there was some personal growth

[odd thicket]

We have no concrete info until when we get some reveals such as why we got no new electro vision users in years

Ever since the game began

[odd thicket]

But you can say that for everyone

[tranquil flax]

but also, Aino...I haven't read her vision story...so i wouldn't really know lol...and comparing Ineffa would be werid bc Ineffa has a moon wheel, not a vision

[odd thicket]

We know her backstory via trailers and Ineffa’s dialogues

Yeah am not comparing ineffa

Or flinns

Or lauma

Moon wheel users are completely different and beholden to the moons instead of Celestia

Speaking of celestia

Thus far our only info on their vision qualifier is that the ambition should reach the heavens

[tranquil flax]

in the scenes of accepting something within themselves for one or another thing im not quite verse to Rana, but something, or somewhere we should know that she was to my idea...yeah everyone had a moment of growth...but in alot of the dendro stories had to do with something about accepting a part of themselves just as is...

[odd thicket]

There are so many people with their own stories and reasons that neatly separating them into 7 elements is cumbersome

Which vision do you think Rene would have gotten ?

[tranquil flax]

yeah no i agree, but my theory is more so not because of a word or phrase, its more so what the path of a archon was...

[tranquil flax]

see...i don't really know, bc she didn't really tell us a vision story, yeah reconnecting with ur childhood friend is nice an all...but it could be the personal growth of realized that relationships don't disappear (💀) when they aren't upheld...idk im grabbing on small bits of what i could find, but its not really applicable to her...tbh

[odd thicket]

Not Rana, rene de petrichor

[tranquil flax]

oh...um anyways...but also we don't even know him? like yeah we did a quest and everything...but we have no information regarding his past or what are his motives are....

[odd thicket]

we do tho ?

we have a whole record from the moment he joined Fontaine Institute of Natual Philosophy and to the end of Narzizzenkreuz Ordo

[tranquil flax]

records, like anywhere, show what they did, it doesn't really give inner monologue

[odd thicket]

we know he was very ambitious in wanting to divert Fontaine from its foretold doom

and also rushed his projects to avoid recieving a vision

[tranquil flax]

well, if that was his "whole" ambition he might have gotten a hydro, bc he accepted a great responsibility, he wasn't given it or anything nor was he forced. Anio could be applied to the same idea, yeah we don't know anything about her, but she could have had to create stuff after her family disappeared for reason(s) (idk i don't know Anio lore to be completely honest with u)

its hard to apply it to a character we don't really "know" that well, again records aren't diaries, they just say what one may have done or why they did it...maybe Rene's goal wasn't to save Fontaine, or he lost something when he was young, that lead him to become who he was today

or until he dissolved

[odd thicket]

he did lose his father alongwith jakob;s father to the cataclysm

[tranquil flax]

then u can argue he might have gotten a anemo of pyro vision depending on what his dad has done for him, if after his loss he stayed close to his principles but it was like his inner motives to solve the doom then it might have been anemo, however if his dad was researching how to solve the doom and passed down what he knew to his son before passing, and Rene took this with pride and (as i would assume) was extremely passionate about it, then he could be pyro

[odd thicket]

his dad was the mayor of petrichor/ poisson

Rene became a researcher alongside other orphans through the Fontaine Institute'

[tranquil flax]

well...that doesn't necessarily limit one from researching does it...
But also consider Rene was a prodigy, so yes research was his future basically, maybe once Sandrone comes out we might find out more about him

again, just cause ur dad died doesn't automatically give u a anemo vision, its what this loss has caused u, nor does one obtain a pyro vision after receiving something that was passed down to them, we can't really say for sure what a npc had in their life before they obtained a vision, i mean in HSR we don't really know much about the Aeons, yeah they are a path that ppl can follow, some can follow them accidently but thats still a path ur following, my argument can't really argue for npcs bc they aren't playable, we can't find out more about them to prove how this theory holds, my argument is more so, how archons have some similarities in their story to characters of similar elements, sovierns most likley have something to do with vision handling, and we know archons aren't directly responsible for not giving visions to people

but they have to be linked, u can't say that electro visions not being granted and Raiden Ei's vision hunt aren't related

[odd thicket]

they arent

because even raiden is surprised when she was asked

[tranquil flax]

not directly, yeah, ei was suprised bc she doesn't give them out, to be completely honest i would be surprised too, but no matter how u turn it, its just can not be a coincidence that no electro visions were granted when the electro archon was doing something that could have affected celestia

she proved that archons aren't involved in who gets visions, but like in HSR, characters can follow a path...but they could also not know they are following it AND in addition, there is no information regarding Aeons really knowing either, they can be appealed by a follower and grant them more powers of said path

[lost quail]

Imagine the amount of people who still think they do in gane

[fickle ore]

Spoiler Decree

Reminder that any and all new content that comes under the list [here](#・announcements message) should be clearly spoilered with context.

If you want to post freely without any restrictions, your one stop shop is #・genshin-spoilers. Failure to spoiler content will result in mutes.

[lost quail]

Game

“Thank the pyro archon for this pyro vision sweet heart”

Meanwhile Mavuika.

https://tenor.com/view/happy-birthday-happy-birthday-to-you-gif-2300798319403427428

Poor Klee, still thinking the pyro archon gave her the vision

Wonder how she’d feel about Mavuika

[odd thicket]

she would set her own hair on fire

[queen prawn]

I'm homeless until copium return

[odd thicket]

Copium is gone ?

#copium

Damn

[odd thicket]

Well
She does not get to decide it

Its the electro throne

Thus far she has not done anything to it

The sakuku decree was her feeble attempt to preserve Inazuma as it was

Operating within the rules of celestia

[odd thicket]

I gave your stuff a thought

Like

You could be right, but currently there’s no info supporting and theres so much to conflict with yours

The criteria could go anywhere from “most comfortable with” tobest element vision to aid their ambitions”

[queen prawn]

Apparently will be back but required role access

[odd thicket]

Why

Rven

Even

[queen prawn]

friend(new mod) told me they are deciding name

[odd thicket]

Oh

I never went to copium once

Wonder how it was

[deft vault]

It was amazing

[odd thicket]

explain

was it better than tcl

[deft vault]

Dude i can’t explain

Really

Everyone was bestie

[queen prawn]

Too bad we got Irminsul's wiped

[odd thicket]

Mods done dropped a nail

[patent cloud]

Wait wtf, they deleted copium?

[queen prawn]

Archived,us mortal can't see it or chat in it

[patent cloud]

Did they say why?

[queen prawn]

Inactive

It was there for a day at least

[patent cloud]

Got a link to the message saying this?

And who said it

[queen prawn]

it is in copium channel

So can't do it

zeo,he is a new mod

Also regular in copium

[patent cloud]

What about zeo?

Was the decision theirs?

[queen prawn]

He told us,but it is best to ask another mod because that all I know from him

[patent cloud]

I see.

What kind of mod are you talking about btw?

[queen prawn]

Junior warden

If you mean other mod then any

[patent cloud]

Mostly wondering who is archiving cozy channels and for what reason.

[frail loom]

It was a decision made by the team not a single person

That the channels that aren't active will be archived

[rain otter]

It bites :(

[patent cloud]

Why was this decision taken?

[frail loom]

The server is undergoing a revamp

[patent cloud]

Will archived channels be made open to the public?

Because right now the public that were using these channels essentially lost access to potentially up to 5 years worth of conversations between them and their current or former friends.

Alongside the actual channel space to talk itself.

[frail loom]

They will be made available to the public as a view only channel in case anyone wanna look into old conversations

[queen prawn]

[patent cloud]

Will replacement channels be created to fill the niche these smaller channels provided?

[burnt gazelle]

you can already take the role from role chat

its called ley lines

gives you view perms for all the old stuff

we did this for the reason you just said

[crimson storm]

and for this, we still have plenty of channels available and all things formerly posted here, so all copiums or flexing can already go in other chats and often did as part of conversation

there is nothing you were able to discuss in any of these channels that you can’t in any existing lounge

[patent cloud]

Correct. But with whom you discussed it with changed.

That was the primary reason to have separate channels.

It is also why lauma-tc is now often used for random conversations people that don't want to talk in tcl wanna do at the time.

[crimson storm]

i understand that, however rather than being small private server this is big server and it’s hard to justify hoarding channels just to be used by 3-5 people

we still offer like 4-5 lounges, i’m sure everyone can find place for themselves

[patent cloud]

Is there a cost for the server to have separate channels?

[burnt gazelle]

yes unironically actually

[crimson storm]

and we won’t ever go in one lounge and say “hey go somewhere else to talk about this”

[burnt gazelle]

apart from the fact that discord tends to break the more channels there are in a category, put bluntly the insane bloat these chats have is one of the reason new members are lost when joining

god knows how many times ive had to reorder some internal chats bc they dont even fit in my screen

and they got shuffled for no reason

[crimson storm]

also how it becomes easier for mods to miss potential bots or trolls, because it requires checking so many channels all the time that are not even active

[burnt gazelle]

ill get to this in a bit lmao i wanna bring back a concept

u will see

[patent cloud]

Well, why couldn't copium just be grouped up alongside tcl?

To make it easy to find.

[burnt gazelle]

because its literally bloat for the tc category?

😭

[crimson storm]

its also not really part of tc

[patent cloud]

It sounds like a categorization issue, rather than bloat.

[crimson storm]

we are looking to reduce channels in tc as well, not to add more

[patent cloud]

Newbies didn't find it because it was buried under layers of channel groups.

[patent cloud]

Neither is tcl.

tcl is the epitome of general chat here in wfp nowadays, and has been for years.

[crimson storm]

not anymore true but tcl has been there for a long time as tc- lounge and especially prior to merge, under jurisdictions of tc staff

and tcl and copium can’t be compared in activity

[patent cloud]

For example, we're currently talking about server issues in the lore basement. People are not very strict with channel use. Trying to force them to do that requires a lot more moderation than is currently applied.

[crimson storm]

in the same way you talk for copium, someone talks about fns and some other people do about gh lounge and so on

we just archived objectively channels that didn’t have enough activity to keep them around in order to make server look more organized and also easier to manage

that is only reasoning behind it

[patent cloud]

I see. Well, it is a genuinely fantastic way to displace people that found community with smaller groups of people.

[odd thicket]

and also to group these disconnected groups together ?

[crimson storm]

if in the future need arises for more channels, we can definitely consider adding it but atm we don’t have activity for huge amount of channels we had

[crimson storm]

if people want to connect that is great, if not i’m not going to force anyone

but we still have 7 lounges

[burnt gazelle]

if smaller groups of people means 2 or 3 then dms are a better place to speak ngl

[crimson storm]

i assure you there is plenty of space for everyone

[burnt gazelle]

which is often done

[crimson storm]

and goal kinda is talking to more people here, that is difference between server and small group chats

[burnt gazelle]

check dms btw

[patent cloud]

Sometimes tcl is full of really cringe people that others don't want to talk to.
Having alternatives is important.

Copium has had a chill vibe for like 3+ years.

Sure, it wasn't super active, but it had its regulars.

[crimson storm]

i understand, i believe part of reason is tcl being on top where all newbies join instantly

we are working on general chat that will be on top and moving tcl more down so its not directly in the way and first chat everyone sees

[lost quail]

WHO???

[crimson storm]

but also majority matters

if majority is not cringe, those people will feel misplaced and not you lmao

and i want to stress again, we have 7 channels for chatting

so there ARE alternatives

[patent cloud]

Which ones are these?

[odd thicket]

klee

she would want to emulate the rowdy mav

https://tenor.com/view/motorbiking-mad-max-fury-road-driving-a-motorcycle-warner-bros-entertainment-warner-bros-pictures-gif-10859011524638989559

or do this after stealing the flamestrider

[crimson storm]

#・tc-lounge #・genshin-talk #・lore-basement #・uma-lounge #・hsr-lounge #・zzz-lounge #・wuwa-lounge

7 atk with possibility to add 8th chat in general category as just general chat

[odd thicket]

https://tenor.com/view/bike-stunts-motorcycle-motorcycle-stunts-stunt-rider-trick-rider-gif-11749113

klee when mav forgets her keyys

[patent cloud]

tcl: general chat
genshin-talk: notorious for having extremely cringe people sometimes
lore-basement: lore discussion only iirc, so not a lounge
uma, hsr, zzz, wuwa lounges: specific game channel, not a general talking channel.

So in practice, we have 1 general channel to talk in.

Hence why tcl got so crowded.

Ergo, having copium around as a 2nd channel for general talk between people that didn't want the cringe was sometimes useful.

[crimson storm]

ok then we go with copium being tjere to post copiums and not channel for talking

we never moderated what people talk about as long as everyone is having good time lmao

[crimson storm]

we will work on getting second general chat

[patent cloud]

Considering people got banned very recently for talking back at moderators, I would not say this is true.

[crimson storm]

it’s something we have already been discussing but as you can see stuff is still getting moved around so we didn’t manage to sort everything

[patent cloud]

That was why the entire exodus happened after all.

[crimson storm]

who? if it was unjustified ban i would be willing to look into it

[patent cloud]

The whole kerfuffle in tcl that went down. I stayed out of it so I don't have the specifics unfortunately. But it left such a sour taste in so many people's mouths that a lot of people just left.

[crimson storm]

not sure i know what specific situation you are talking about, there was ely ban that was fixed immediately, also toshi ban that we felt wasn’t justified, it was changed and toshi got apology from the moderation team

and other ban i remember is someone from gtalk last night who was just harassing staff no matter if they had anything to do with changes or not

i aknowledge that mod team had fair share of mistakes and i can promise you we are actively working on better approach and relationship with the community

[patent cloud]

Archiving beloved channels without warning is not a good way of going about it.
That said, I do appreciate the explanations you, Ac1d and zeo have provided here.

[crimson storm]

yes things could have been communicated better, but we are trying to work with members on compromise, i have been listening to both dms and when people ping me in channels which is how we came up with ley lines category

because majority of people expressed that even if they are not active in channel anymore, they felt sad about lost memories

so read only channel was way to give people at least that

[patent cloud]

Ac1d telling me about leylines was the first time I heard it existed. Perhaps making a bigger announcement or sticky post about it could help.

[crimson storm]

we will the issue is we had issues with perms

it exists for like 2 days but there was no point announcing it before we managed to make it work

perms literally got fixed like an hour ago

[patent cloud]

Oh.

Well then. That's good at least.

[modern plover]

LMAO

my first thought of the island is "so its a bar pro max"

E rated bar for sure for sure

[odd thicket]

They took bennett inside a bar

And his father watched while twerking behind him

[lost quail]

AUNTIE MAVUIKA LOLOLOLOL

I bet it would be just like hanging out with her mom for a short bit if Mavuika baby sat.

Her and kachina would be best friends for sure

[lost quail]

Right it’s definitely E for everyone but it shouldn’t be. Surprised I didn’t see no one else throwing it back

Also, I keep thinking about Daditano and Arlecchino

Theyd have the best dad and daughter relationship you can’t tell me otherwise

I also thought about Arle and Childe. I hope they develop an implied sibling type closeness

I wanna write a fic where he calls her big sister by mistake snd she’s like

https://tenor.com/view/applejack-mlp-eyebrow-raise-really-excuse-me-gif-9387552033153383886

[odd thicket]

Would she

I imagine her figuring it out before him

[lost quail]

OH SHE WOULD

[odd thicket]

Idts
Klee would collapse children of echoes’ den

Klee would terrify or impress Mav

And ask xilonen to get her a mecha

https://tenor.com/view/ineffa-mecha-tengen-toppa-tengen-toppa-gif-3696632241884390677

[lost quail]

Theyd spar one day, hed lose snd hed be like “it’s like getting my butt kicked by my more tactful older sister”

“You already view me that much don’t you?”

“…..I-“ bros trying to figure out how she knew

[odd thicket]

Animation budget would be too much

[lost quail]

She’s do both.
Klee has the spirit of Natlan in some degree

[odd thicket]

I have seen this trope somewhere

I cant remember this

[lost quail]

It would be too much

[odd thicket]

https://tenor.com/view/hillichurl-genshin-genshin-impact-anime-animation-gif-20447678

Cant beat these guys

[odd thicket]

She would do something with phlogiston and destroy a quarter of natlan

Wont be her first time terraforming

[lost quail]

If Childe managed to scratch Arle hed be so proud of himself

Hed tell everyone

[odd thicket]

He possibly could

[lost quail]

“GUYS GUYS I FINALLY DID IT!!!”

[odd thicket]

He could get it on pre buff Neuv

Arle should be within his range

[lost quail]

Pre buff what?

https://tenor.com/view/shady-glare-newyork-gif-7701947

[odd thicket]

https://tenor.com/view/tartaglia-childe-tartaglia-genshin-impact-childe-gif-3083104092929101618

[odd thicket]

https://tenor.com/view/childe-neuvillette-genshin-impact-fontaine-fight-gif-8561285205839725279

Oh the gif isnt here

[odd thicket]

Before he became full soveriegn

[lost quail]

He could possibly could get a scratch on her face but beat her is out of the question

And don’t say “H-he could!!” No. I already know youd say it

[odd thicket]

Nah

[lost quail]

NEUVILLETTE DIDNT GIVE A FUCK LOL

[odd thicket]

Hes ranked 11 for a reason

But he has the most potential

[lost quail]

So does she

That’s why think they should have a closer bonfire

Bond*

Bitch….

They’re secretly the most chaotic in the group

Arle is just very very subtle about it

He’d try to spar with her and lose but that one scratch would make him so fucking happy

[odd thicket]

abyssal power that can possibly transcend teyvat’s laws vs nibelung’s powers

Hm

Only one being even achieved the former so arle should still end up stronger

[odd thicket]

He would definitely get her to use all four limbs

At the least

[lost quail]

yeah, she’s just be out of reach.

BRO I CANT WAIT FOR THEM TO INTERACT MORE.

I’d be like “THE SIBLINGS FOREVER”

AND SHE STICKS UP FOR HIM TOO “I see no need to judge him so harshly”

Meanwhile Childe:

“I fucking hate her.”

[odd thicket]

His judgement of character is poor

He still thinks pulcinella is a good guy

And that surtologi is an even cooler teacher

Afterall he borrows the latter’s outfit time to time

[lost quail]

So Arle was right about him

He sees the good in people

Yet it gets taken advantage of

Whereas she’s made a wall so no one could ever take advantage of her

DO YOU SEE THE PICTURE IM PAINTING

THEY WOULD BE SO CUTE TOGETHER AS PSEUDO SIBLINGS

I DUNNO HOW ELSE TO PHRASE THAT

AND THEYRE GONNA ACTUALLY INTERACT MORE TOO

So many harbingers feel like they have to interact

Columbina and Arle
Childe and Arle
Pantalone and Dottore
Dottore and Sandrone

[odd thicket]

Dottore and Pierro

Pierro with everyone

Actually

[lost quail]

Right

Hes the first

[odd thicket]

He has something to do with everyone

[lost quail]

Pierro is so interesting

How did he even get in the harbingers

[odd thicket]

With capitano- both khaenrians high ranking
Dottore- both scientists
Columbina- khaenriah moon connections
Arlecchino- same as above
Pulcinella- idk
Scaramouche- possible assessment for their end goals
Sandrone- same as above
Signora- shared purpose
Regrator- idk
Childe- he should know surtologi personally and recognise him in Childe

[odd thicket]

He founded them

And their leader

As a former royal mage of khaenriah he would aware of the means to aid tsaritsa’s goals

[lost quail]

Whats with this lady hiring ex Khaenrians

[odd thicket]

She wanted people with relevant work experience

And show up to work everyday for the next 500 years

[lost quail]

Then there’s the two children

She hired

Ngl compared to everyone else

Childe and Arle are babies

[odd thicket]

three

with scaramouche

and regrator/ bina possibly

[odd thicket]

they should be glad they got a job in terrible market

[lost quail]

They’re both grown tho. I’m just saying theyre the youngest. Both chronologically and physically

Columbina looks their age but I think is 500??

No

300

[odd thicket]

no inffo

better not to speculate her age now while at the cusp of finding out soon

[lost quail]

True

[odd thicket]

capitano effect

[odd thicket]

fair enough

but i say add scara

hes for sure not grown up

https://tenor.com/view/genshin-impact-genshin-genshin-wanderer-genshin-impact-wanderer-genshin-scaramouche-gif-27240479

[lost quail]

Ngl I still ship arlebina. I’m dead ass a sucker for mortal x immortal

[lost quail]

They don’t remember him

[odd thicket]

they can hold hands forever

[odd thicket]

me too

[lost quail]

LMFAO

[odd thicket]

who is that guy

[lost quail]

I’m like “if they’re both adults I don’t see the issue, especially when the immoral physically looks as old or a year or two younger younger than the mortal.

And they probably didn’t even meet until Lazzo

Their my otp

I don’t care

[lost quail]

His va is hilarious

[odd thicket]

the honda ad ?

[lost quail]

He used to do music with Childe’s VA

[lost quail]

The what

[odd thicket]

or was it dominoes

leme check

yeah here

https://youtu.be/AH-EZkEAr6I?feature=shared

[worldly rain]

https://youtu.be/eYUj8oGGwJY?si=vyByNJcx1cVuYV_g

[odd thicket]

she finally released ?

[worldly rain]

@odd thicket her timeline aligns with mine which is that
||nibelung arrived after the voyager rebellion ended||
Also other pretty interesting stuff too in this video

[odd thicket]

hmmm

my timeline was that the rebellion was set aside when nibelung brought the black tide

[odd thicket]

ill watch

now

[worldly rain]

Her argument is the same as I used which was ||moon sisters were alive when rebellion ended and only died after nibelung arrived
Hence nibelung can't have arrived earlier than rebellion ending||

[odd thicket]

but you mentioned a grace / grim period between rebellion end and nibelung;s return

didnt you ?

[worldly rain]

Nope I agreed that both events happened in very minimal timeframe
Basically one after the other

[odd thicket]

so like, a really short graceperiod

[worldly rain]

But what happened after and what happened earlier was clear

[odd thicket]

where the sisters summoned nibelung ?

[worldly rain]

Yeah not at the same time but shortly after
might even be really really short

Although time in between the two event is speculation because we still don't know exactly how shortly nibelung arrived
But his arrived later than rebelion ended is clear

[odd thicket]

my timeline for that period was essentially nibelung being summoned during the rebellion

[worldly rain]

Nah there was no summon he just came back lol

[odd thicket]

the lovers retreating to the moon palaces for a short break during the height of the rebellion when

nibelung re enters teyvat and immediately begins tearing apart the moons

[worldly rain]

Watch the video might get some insight there see if you agree or not

[odd thicket]

aight

[odd thicket]

kukulkan mentioned he was summoned or wished back

of some sort

wait

[worldly rain]

This is also speculated by ashikai that this might not be the case

[odd thicket]

hmm

then i really should continue this convo only after watching the video

[worldly rain]

Yeah

[odd thicket]

i find it hard to believe that Nibelung was aware of PO's existence before setting off into the abyss

like aashikai says here

[worldly rain]

He wasn't though?

Only thing he was aware was that his world would be destroyed as the voyager told him

Ashikai didn't even say that lol

[odd thicket]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYUj8oGGwJY

it was here

at this time stamp

oh wait

https://youtu.be/eYUj8oGGwJY?feature=shared&t=450

[worldly rain]

?

The timestamp you shared is where she's discussing nibelung's return

[odd thicket]

yeah
but she mentions an intermediate return

before he returns fr with the abyss

[worldly rain]

Right but you said nibelung knew PO before he left which isn't the case here

[odd thicket]

no i meant aashikai said he did

that he saw his world being colonised and then heading to take the FK and return

there is no known info on his actions after leaving teyvat and then returning

a 1000 and 40 odd years of radio dead silence

as far as the info currently is Nibelung only knows his planet is doomed but not hw

[worldly rain]

Ok i think you got confused here

So ashikai says nibelung left first time after vogager left you're saying this is where he knew about PO but he didn't...

Then she says he came later saw moon sister betrayal and left again for forbidden knowledge and yes here I agree with you that this is not mentioned in the lore and she might have extrapolate here

[odd thicket]

ye

sorry for not pputting this in clearer words before

[worldly rain]

Yeah his return and again going out I think she got mistaken here because lore only support one time return so far

Because the gap between rebellion and nibelung arrival is still missing from actual lore...

Like yes nibelung arrived after rebellion ended BUT how much later? That stuff is missing from lore

And this is where she might have speculated that he again went back to space

[odd thicket]

the rebellion ending is also weird

i agree with you on there

it says the PO caught them -A

but also B - Nibelung overturned the lunar and solar chariots and began the cataclysmm

there on voyager and PO had to work together to take him down

either A happened right before B

and before PO punished the lovers

OR

A took place after B

A gives the small break between the rebellion and war of vengeance

[worldly rain]

Not really
So sun chariot is basically nibelung
And when he left teyvat he passed that duty of cycles to moon sisters aka lunar chariots
All this happened before PO

Now voyager and first angle after the rebellion ended were caught and their memories stripped yeah?
And when nibelung arrived later with war happening the moon sister shattered right?

So to stop the destruction voyager aligned with PO basically

[odd thicket]

wouldnt the sun chariot be PO

Nibelung crashing onto PO

[worldly rain]

Also the main reason for saying nibelung arrivee after the rebellion is very clear

One, moon sisters saw the end to rebellion

Two, it's only after nibelung arrived that moon sisters died

[odd thicket]

yeah

[worldly rain]

According to ashikai no it's nibelung
But it's still a theory so you can still believe sun chariot to be PO until it's proven otherwise

There is no wrong choice here

[odd thicket]

its got to be pO

PO

because teh sun chariot was

helped by the locals to be repaired

and warmthly and happily sent back to the skies

and also
is responsible for the Jade ores of Yu valley and Chen Yu Vale (allegedly)

hold on

oh nvm

i think the warmthly and happily part is wrong

It cant be nibelung because abyss has never been described as a star except to steal or quelll one

[worldly rain]

Ahsikai says that teyvat legend says the sun chariot was replaced by lunar chariot at some point
According to her nibelung being the original creator of fate means he is then the sun chariot of legend
And later when he created the moon and passed the fate to them means they are lunar chariots of legend

Also moon sister after PO arrived submitted to him and indirectly gave their authority over fate system to him like they worked for him and that's when moon wheels got created

One other interesting thing she mention that I found interesting was that remember neuvillette saying that after war of vengeance PO lost his function?

She says this function refers to moon sister who govern the fate and since they died PO lost the control over fate that day

[odd thicket]

yeah

[queen prawn]

Lost the absolute authority,he can still control fate using the divine throne

[worldly rain]

They really need to bring nibelung around in the main story atp

[queen prawn]

But you did said “that day” so far enough

Still,it is mentioned he only lost the full control

[odd thicket]

@worldly rain i went to the last section were she brings up hindu mythos

PO is defo not indra

Indra was just king of the devas or gods

[worldly rain]

She's comparing both be saying irminsul is indra net
And might be used to replicate the og fate system of moon sisters

[odd thicket]

pretty minor in the scheme of things and never tried to usurp the big 3

but

there were other rakshasa who attempted to

there were so many

hmm
okay the last section convince me on it

[worldly rain]

A lot of replacement can be seen here...
Og moon fate system replaced by Irminsul
Og moon wheel replaced by vision
Sounds like when PO lost moon sister authority over fate he created his own using whatever remained

[odd thicket]

ye
and surviving

but this begs a question

what happens to visions holders who ascended to celestia ?

[worldly rain]

Gnosis too using 3rd descender corpse
Ashikai says she's coming around to the identity of 3rd being nibelung... I still don't think so unless neuvillette is indeed unreliable narrator

[worldly rain]

That's the only info available lol
Like vision holder ascension to Celestia and that's it there's literally no other info right now

So can't say much

Something to do with wish and how visions are related to them?

Like visions are part of fate and so when a vision holder ascend it might mean they got hold of their own fate somehow?

[odd thicket]

That doesnt seem right

Rene specifically avoided relieving a vision and grew paranoid as that wont allow him to challenge fate or will of the world

[worldly rain]

For example like mini durin got out of story book and became a creation of teyvat right so in a way he ascended?

So people of teyvat who ascended might just be the one who got outside the fate system?

Does it make sense? Maybe lol

[odd thicket]

But simulanka was created to be a mirror of teyvat

Durin’s fate inside the book was the same outside

We just mashed him into our dead Durin

[odd thicket]

Like, Andersdottir’s view of his fate

[worldly rain]

Yeah but he did change within the story
He became mini durin before he was just durin lol

[odd thicket]

Could be in the blind corner of the perspective of the gods

[odd thicket]

I didnt play simulanka

But that didnt necessarily challenge his fate though did it

[worldly rain]

No basically durin in story book was bound to repeat the same fate as durin outside the book

[odd thicket]

Just diverted it to a different path and reach the same fate

[worldly rain]

Until we literally changed his fate and he became mini durin

Us being descender has to do a lot here

But anyway I'm not saying mini durin ascended literally
I meant just like mini durin came out of his own world
Ascended vision holder might be same that they got out of teyvat fate system or something

Od course we won't get ascended vision lore until we go to Celestia so it's whatever

[odd thicket]

Hmmm

[worldly rain]

You know how venessa when she ascended was symbolised as bird soaring into the vast sky
Implying she's finally free or something...

And of course it could be entirely different thing and ascended vision holder are just fuel for PO consumption to regain his power

Although breaking free of fate has been the symbolism for lot of genshin story so it kinda makes better sense

[odd thicket]

Surtologi’s words contradict it

Vedrfolnir and all five others could break away from their fates

Maybe

They escaped, but became strong enough to escape the PO’s claws in their newfound freedom ?

[worldly rain]

Surtolgi is still bound by fate as told by vedrfolnir that he'll die by his pupil which acted as self fulfilling prophecy and made surtolgi leave teyvat to find this person
And we know this person is skirk so he's still playing into his fate

Leaving teyvat physically doesn't conflict with fate basically

He's still bound by it

[odd thicket]

And fate is also represented by .. stars

[worldly rain]

Even neuvillette who has the authority to discard fate is still willingly bound by it because he sees his purpose here in teyvat

[odd thicket]

Inside teyvat

First it was Childe

Then Bennett

[worldly rain]

Neuvillette can literally see his own constellation

He just doesn't do anything because he thinks he has a role to play

[odd thicket]

What of wanderer
He doesnt get to change his fate does he

[worldly rain]

So fate is not something physical as in leaving teyvat doesn't do much

[worldly rain]

He interacted with Irminsul to change the perception around his fate but his fate still remains

[odd thicket]

||Rerir||, Vedrfolnir and Rhine are still within Teyvat but defied Fate

Dain couldnt break off his fate yet judging by the lines in his trailer

[worldly rain]

As I said maybe ascension is just that you get yourself out of this fate system
A lot of people might have done that
But until it's explicitly stated we can't be sure

I'm not sure about sinner though and how they get around fate
Hex members also do that so it's not something that hasn't happened

[odd thicket]

Comparing teyvat to a theatre

[worldly rain]

No I understand that they have freed themselves from fate

[odd thicket]

Ascension seems like taking out your best actors and felicitating them

[worldly rain]

I'm saying we don't know how they did it..

In case of sinner it could be forbidden knowledge

But what about hex

[odd thicket]

And then
Retirement from forever acting ?

I agree with you in there

[odd thicket]

Moon / Voyager cheatcode

Hold on

Maybe something like this

Seeking power through the cracks of PO’s indra net ?

Like barbeloth?

[worldly rain]

Yeah using space-time where gods don't have control is how I see it then
Remember that area where we trained with skirk? That place exist within abyss and so outside the gods gaze so to speak

Hez members might travel within such spaces to escape teyvat fate maybe

I mean it's fair right not evey thing will be controlled by PO after all

[odd thicket]

Or just within god’s own spaces

[worldly rain]

Khanerria itself exist outside this fate system too I think before it got obliterated lol

[odd thicket]

They literally cannot see the whole of it

[odd thicket]

Idts

They were angry at celestia for a reason

The crimson moon got overthrown after the true sky was revelaed:/ discovered

[worldly rain]

They weren't actually they just kept advancing where they saw through the illusion and then decided to shatter it (just like voyager did with angels in the past)
And then they got punished for it

Also Crimson moon dynasty was destroyed by eclipse dynasty it has nothing to do with PO
It was internal feud of khanerria

It has less to do with anger and more to do with ambition

Remember that line from sustainer?
Something something human arrogance
That's what khanerria was about lol

[odd thicket]

I get you now

One thing about genshin is to go through all existing records once more to piece together rationally again

[worldly rain]

It's the same with deshret Or even remus they were filled with ambition and wanted to take control of their own fate
Of course they also failed but that's another thing

Genshin is a story about how fate constraints and how vision holder will rise and take control over their own fate

[odd thicket]

Isnt it the opposite
That they bind themselves to it

Both the fatui and khaenrians despise it for the same reason

[worldly rain]

Yeah I'm joking I don't know what happens with ascension

Although being in proximity of a descender things might change for better so who knows

Just wait for nod krai I guess when we'll get more vision lore

[odd thicket]

They just thank you feeding them knowledge and helping them ascend to celestia iirc

[worldly rain]

Although not sure how much visiond actually play a role here because even non vision holder are part of fate system so not like you get bound because you got vision specifically

[odd thicket]

visions also help celestia spy on its user

I think i should just begin a repo for fate and compile all known info

as it is now, collectiing it like papers flying in the wind is annoying af

[worldly rain]

It's like you give part of your soul and you get to wield these cool elemental powers
Maybe that's what rene was talking about that selling your soul was equivalent to selling out or something

[odd thicket]

never being able to challenge the will of the world

never being able to challenge the will with dragon powers restricted for usage by the same will

and also the same device spies on you ?

and uses your soul (story) to create its frame ?

[worldly rain]

Most powers whether it's moon wheel or vision are from the dragons

PO do use them to control for now but they could also hide the powers to overthrow the system itself

And that might just be where descender comes into picture

Clearly visions are more than meets the eye and we still need more info

[odd thicket]

also

i wanted to ask

have electro visions begun appearing ?

or rather

resumed

[worldly rain]

Yes

[odd thicket]

when ? and with whom ?
varesa ?

[worldly rain]

I don't know lol but wasn't the conclusion of inazuma just that that things went back to normal
People who lost their vision were given back

[odd thicket]

but raiden does act surprised afterwards when learning about no electro visions

hmm

need to skeem through all inazuman events and electro characters post inazuma;s vision stories for this

[worldly rain]

Yeah I don't remember much there either
Something to do with her locking herself in plains of eythumia or something?
Yeah I don't know...

I'm sure there's a explanation there just need to re read some stuff

[odd thicket]

this was the easiest abyss in a while

[lost quail]

Me reading Arlecchino lore

Me reading Mavuika lore as well

Skirk too

[lost quail]

See now I’m just gonna block people who still think Arle is pure evil in 2025 as well as Childe

Cuz you can’t fucking read

That’s it.

I’m doing it

Im making my own Arle analysis cuz these people CANNOT

READ.

[delicate parcel]

do you think flower feather clan's proximity to ochkanatlan might contribute to getting worst hit in act iv of natlan

[lilac coral]

Wdym

What happened in act 4 again

[odd thicket]

You mean act three

[odd thicket]

The abyss war

[odd thicket]

Maybe

But it was so high up ?

[delicate parcel]

its act iv

[odd thicket]

Wasnt act iv the interlude ?

[delicate parcel]

no, the interlude is own stuff

[odd thicket]

Hm

[odd thicket]

Then maybe

Yes

Night wind had spirit portals to move around asap

FFC was perched atop a cliff

[odd thicket]

Easy to single out

[delicate parcel]

and also means lack of escape

= more casualties

[odd thicket]

Scions’s defences had been breached but they gave the evacuation beforehand

[odd thicket]

Yep

[delicate parcel]

and those who played the ochkanatlan quest knows its a hotbed of abyssal energy

[odd thicket]

Collective of Plenty had Varesa and other warriors reinforce and won with their uphill advantage

[delicate parcel]

the ancient dragon city below the volcano helped in suppressing the abyssal creatures as other pointed out

[odd thicket]

I wonder if easy breeze resort had similar problems

[odd thicket]

Hmm

I missed this

[delicate parcel]

they are very far away

[odd thicket]

But i get it

[odd thicket]

Its right next to the mare jivari though

Or rather

Physically the closest

[delicate parcel]

granted all the tribes are battle ready, but they seem to be the most physically fit

[odd thicket]

I suppose Tenoch’s seals saved the resort

[delicate parcel]

i think the ppl at the resort when act iv happened were the luckiest mfs alive

[odd thicket]

And nobody would have been on the resort save a few

[odd thicket]

Wpuld have been scary though

[delicate parcel]

every member in that tribe is seen working out, doing pushups and whatnot

[odd thicket]

Theres no one to come and save you asap

[delicate parcel]

or are the most unluckiest ones

[odd thicket]

Yep

[delicate parcel]

unless they board the little boats

[odd thicket]

Other than hilichurls we dont see any abyss presence there

[delicate parcel]

the hilichurls are easy to deal with

[odd thicket]

Save at one place: the cave of enigmas

[delicate parcel]

they are more of a everyday nuisance

[patent cloud]

islanders during the war

[delicate parcel]

yeah, im surprised they didnt touch on the events of act iv

when we were chilling at the resort

[odd thicket]

I suppose the seal saved them and kept the abyss from infiltrating tenochzitoc

[odd thicket]

The twerking asha kept the abyss away

[delicate parcel]

imagine coming home from vacationing and find out your tribesmen or family members died in act iv

[patent cloud]

Asha explo meta was too powerful for the abyss...

[patent cloud]

thankfully ronova enabled devmode during most of it

[delicate parcel]

i mean those who died before it happened

[patent cloud]

mhm

[delicate parcel]

ppl like chuuyu,etc

[patent cloud]

natlan lost what, around 2000 iirc?

before the devmode

[delicate parcel]

yeah

ykw whats the worst part

what we saw in act iv is just a micronosm of the actual cataclysm 500 years ago

[patent cloud]

i actually havent read exactly what happened back then

so to preface: the abyss we fight in natlan is the same abyss khaenriah's sinners summoned to fight during the cataclysm?

separate from the abyss order who are some other randos

[delicate parcel]

the abyss order formed after the cataclysm

so i assume thats the case

if act iv alone is dark enough, just imagine when they show the full picture of the cataclysm

[patent cloud]

hm

what i dont get tho

why didn't the shades devmode the abyss away during the cataclysm?

we know ronova used her powers to chokeslam khaenriah

but why not chokeslam the abyss?

[delicate parcel]

considering even the HP dreads the abyss itself to send nails, i assume they feel the same

they kinda did with khaenriah (which i assume was overran by abyss atp)

[patent cloud]

ronova when shes tired of khaenriah's bs

[reef axle]

they chokeslammed what they could, but the Abyss is implied to be much bigger than Teyvat, and also extremely hard to wipe out. Most they could do is push out what was in Teyvat and restore the "barriers of this world"... the same barriers that Alice remarks have grown weaker "these past few years"

[delicate parcel]

i have a feeling all the shades arent happy about punishing khaenriah

but their hands are tied

[patent cloud]

we know teyvat is an antfarm that the shades control directly
but apparently the abyss is not able to be controlled directly by them

right?

[delicate parcel]

its a do or be damned situation for them

[patent cloud]

since otherwise why couldnt istaroth just stop time for them

[delicate parcel]

if ronova dont place the immortal curse, the leylines will be polluted

and i have a feeling naberius is behind the curse of wilderness

[patent cloud]

that's not true is it? what stops ronova from ctrl+alt+del all the khaenriahn souls?

like we see her do with that demiplane book

[odd thicket]

And A Space and Time for you showed Natlan during it

[odd thicket]

Because the abyss rocked the foundations of the world

[patent cloud]

what does that mean

[odd thicket]

Maybe
Ronova seemed dispassionate or terrified , depending on accounts

[odd thicket]

Irmin attacked the leylines

Directly

[delicate parcel]

its stated somewhere in last act of natlan

[odd thicket]

Could be two shades

Naberius to morph humans

Ronova to ban them from leylines

[delicate parcel]

the last time she helped xbalanque and the night angel to defend natlan from abyss, she got punished

[odd thicket]

It means she still gives them “death”

[odd thicket]

Yep

[odd thicket]

Getting rid of them via istaroth is better

[patent cloud]

hm

Mocking Mask

Since the stain of my compatriots' blood cannot be cleansed, I shall become The Jester, who laughs in the face of fate.
Since my level of learning could not compare with the sages, I failed to earn the favor of the previous ruler.
So too did I fail to stop them from tearing away the veil of sin, ushering in a tide of divine wrath, destruction, and foolishness...
Then I shall become instead a fool, a Fatuus, and devote myself to Her Majesty, who understands my pain...

My name is Pierro, The Jester. Please listen to the words I have to say:

Proud Fatui comrades, I know your hearts harbor both the fires of rage and the cold of eternal winter.
Each one of us has borne witness to the absurd callousness of the foundational principles of this world.
So, let us don our masks in mockery of the world as we go forth and rewrite the rules of destiny.

Is the veil of sin the planet shield?

[odd thicket]

The false sky

Yes

[patent cloud]

So that's one thing Khaenriah did

[reef axle]

TL;DR: Teyvat's current setup (at least the human part) is implied/described as something artificial, a "system" imposed on top of the original Teyvat the dragons had set up.

This system makes the world habitable for humans by breaking down the raw elemental energy, gives Celestia control over the authorities of the dragon sovereigns, and also "separates" Teyvat from the outside world where it's implied the Abyss is wiping out countless civilizations.

The Abyss is trying to get in, and the false sky is the barrier set up to try and keep it out.

[delicate parcel]

and for the shades

[patent cloud]

Right.

[delicate parcel]

i have a feeling istaroth did the time loop thing not for celestia

its prob a piece in a bigger plan we dont know

[reef axle]

personal take is still that it's gonna come down to Fischl lore in the end

[odd thicket]

Always has

[delicate parcel]

the og fischl

[patent cloud]

wait

[odd thicket]

Her signature weapon has lore about the moons

[delicate parcel]

not the playable fischl/amy

[patent cloud]

Is that what's wrong with her?

She's multiple ppl?

[reef axle]

Nah

Her character is roleplay based on several books

Those books are sus

[odd thicket]

Flowers of princess fischl and legend of the shattered halberd

[odd thicket]

Idt a time loop exists

[reef axle]

so Book Fischl vs roleplay irl Fischl

[odd thicket]

Teyvat is a dreamscape/ theatre

[delicate parcel]

no,its in the latest dainlseif quest

[odd thicket]

Idt its a time travel as conventionally as we know it

[patent cloud]

i legit had no idea about this
fischl's mental problems being tied to the world literally being fictional is rly cool ngl

[odd thicket]

The witches deliberately left us the imaginarium theatre for some reason

[patent cloud]

if istaroth had to do some history rewriting shenanigans or something

[delicate parcel]

i have a feeling istaroth wants traveler to be the savior of teyvat

the time loop thingy is prob her way of keeping traveler around

just like how khaenriah considers the sibling as the savior

[odd thicket]

The time loop thing wont be possible solely coz of istaroth

Its two shades

[reef axle]

Her books actually gave us some lore years before we found out about it in the rest of the game.
Ex: Irmin's name, what Khaenriah did, the exact fate of 2 of the moon goddesses, and more 👀
We only started getting those details around Sumeru, while Fischl's books/weapons were around since 1.0

[odd thicket]

Asmoday and Istaroth

[patent cloud]

HP probably an extremely powerful being, from whom the shades draw their power
HP needs to remain for the power to remain, so the shades are prisoners

especially if HP is not a good person, and the shades disagree with HP's decisions

[odd thicket]

Istaroth is the god of moments, can take a moment from anywhere in history and place it anywhere else

[delicate parcel]

yeah, i read somewhere that both shades wanted traveler to stay in teyvat to save the world, in their own way

[odd thicket]

Asmoday is the god of space

What i suppose happened was

[delicate parcel]

and going by the four shades trailer, asmoday is pretty much fed up and left

[odd thicket]

Asmoday and istaroth collaborated to temporarily bring the moment of didyieth to present day via asmoday’s domains

[patent cloud]

so asmoday is fully on traveler's side

[odd thicket]

To collide with the time space of present day

[patent cloud]

istaroth is secretly fully on travelers side

ronova is just trying her best not to let the world fall apart

[reef axle]

Not being on the side of the other shades/HP doesn't neccesarily mean being on our side. We're an outsider too

[delicate parcel]

yeah, she def kept traveler in teyvat bc they have potential to save teyvat

[patent cloud]

and rhinedottir IS trying to make the world fall apart

[odd thicket]

We witness Dirdyieth not being able to view our space
And we couldnt see hers until the end

But both of us were at the same moment

[odd thicket]

Idts

[patent cloud]

but unfortunately for rhinedottir she has a devmode 2nd consciousness overriding some of her wacko thoughts

[odd thicket]

She cant do that anymore

As memeber of hexenzirkil its against her interests

[delicate parcel]

i mean, if they werent on our side they wouldnt have done all these stuff

and idt the shades are happy about the fall of khaenriah either

[odd thicket]

Istaroth is collaborating with Asmoday

[reef axle]

"On our side" implies wanting to support us/what we want.
She could just as easily plan on using/sacrificing us for some goal of theirs.

[odd thicket]

And doesnt reveal her folly to the other two

[patent cloud]

rhinedottir when she isn't allowed to literally destroy the world

[odd thicket]

But it is literally against her interests to do it ?

[patent cloud]

ok fine
literally USURP* the world

better?

[delicate parcel]

they are 100% keeping an eye on rhineberius

they dont rlly fw her in that trailer

[reef axle]

lowkey Rhine feels like magic-y Dottore to me.

Not actively seeking world destruction, just... curious and with 0 filter on "is this ethical to research/try?"

[odd thicket]

Nah
Shes trying to achieve perfection still

And we dk what perfection is

That these sinners crave

[patent cloud]

so the sinners are literally part of the simulation originally

then they hacked the mainframe of the antfarm

broke free of it

[odd thicket]

Yes

[patent cloud]

that's wild ngl

you'd think HP would have installed some kind of failsafe if such a thing were to happen

btw, are we allowed to talk HSR lore here?

[odd thicket]

No we execute u

[reef axle]

"Nuke Nail it from orbit. It's the only way to be sure"

[patent cloud]

because honestly, isn't what the sinners did EXACTLY what phainon did?

[odd thicket]

https://tenor.com/view/exterminatus-explosion-overkill-planet-killer-wipeout-gif-2255562371502138943

[patent cloud]

phainon:
part of a simulation having been run a morbillion times
finally gathers enough power to break out of the simulation and scratch an aeon

bro is a sinner

[reef axle]

Luofu and Penacony made me give up on trying to follow HSR tbh. I still play the game, but the lore is just... so messy

I just vibe with the character moments instead of trying to follow some wack overarching plot that makes it really hard to tell what's important and what's not.

[patent cloud]

only reason i care a bit about hsr is because hoyo might be doing a funny crossover thing here

amphoreus shares a lot of lore elements with teyvat

[patent cloud]

funny detail:
there's only one nail left

im sure that's not gonna come up in the future...

[reef axle]

Funny you say that

cause

Fischl lore

Fearing the madness that would ensue following his death, the God King made one final Divine Halberd

[patent cloud]

yeah im starting to think that what the fatui will realize soon is that HP has been dead for eons..

all that's left are his shadows

[reef axle]

Abyss Order and the Shades both seem confident they're just sleeping

[patent cloud]

if he's sleeping it sure is one deep sleep

[reef axle]

(Traveler's Sibling): Yes, for five hundred years now, ever since the cataclysm in Khaenri'ah. There's been no sign of activity...
(Traveler's Sibling): Not long ago, you witnessed the Hydro Archon destroy her divine throne, yes?
(Traveler's Sibling): Such a flagrant disregard for the "rules," and still Celestia took no action... I suppose that's proof enough of the Heavenly Principles' situation.
(Traveler's Sibling): However, the Heavenly Principles will awaken... We just don't know when that will be, or what might trigger it.

[patent cloud]

@odd thicket I would like to pitch some exploration TC lore...
what if Nicole's artificial human body and her wings being made by Rhinedottir will literally allow her to devmode her way to permanent flight?

[odd thicket]

Abyss, the Abyss Order, Fatui, Shades, Nahida all betting on him sleeping

[queen prawn]

Traveler regain power and becomes Hp vessel

[odd thicket]

No she needs full constellations to fly forever

Otherwise too strong at C0

[patent cloud]

like

[odd thicket]

Traveller gets back power of reason, smacks Dain with it

[patent cloud]

if her wings are artificial sinner tech

then they might be able to ignore the laws of teyvat right?

[reef axle]

Then we finally get to Celestia and it's like:

https://tenor.com/view/genshin-genshin-impact-cutscene-ningguang-genshin-impact-ningguang-zhongli-gif-24844798

[patent cloud]

bro got judged

[queen prawn]

Traveler touches the gnosis and talk to HP,awakening HP in the process

[patent cloud]

traveler is definitely being set up to become the circlet piece yeah

4 shades, flower feather sands goblet

and then traveler as the circlet

[queen prawn]

For real,how many times did Traveler get gifted a cirlet/hat

[patent cloud]

...that's an interesting point ngl

[odd thicket]

If she is frostmoon made she already should be able to

[odd thicket]

Or a sword

[queen prawn]

Is sutarlogi the one using sword

[patent cloud]

the DNA wings look very much rhinedottir coded

[queen prawn]

They aint gonna make a character fly forever

[queen prawn]

Apep also have DNA pattern, nahida too.

[odd thicket]

No, hroaptatyr and rhine do

[queen prawn]

Why are there two

[odd thicket]

Not denying that

[odd thicket]

For rhine its just a tiny sword

But for hroaptatyr its important

As he mirrors reason

[patent cloud]

this is about as obvious as it gets

[glad crypt]

what is celadon mare's relation to istaroth?

[odd thicket]

shes an angel under her

thus far not mentioned in azurelight or polar star's descriptions

very secretive

[patent cloud]

wait

azurelight description is CRAZY

[glad crypt]

it is

[patent cloud]

so

did Istaroth destroy Remuria then?

"Still another shall shrink into the dark, into bone-piercing hostility, until the promised tides arise to play out one final melody."

After a period of prosperity known as the golden age (or Pax Remuria),[3] Remuria eventually fell due to Remus' attempts to avert its prophesied destruction: particularly, by his sharing of power and authority with the four human Harmosts he had appointed to govern the empire.

prophesied destruction

[odd thicket]

nah

[patent cloud]

Istaroth writing fanfiction about all their enemies that then becomes canon

[odd thicket]

it was a self fulfilling prophecy

[patent cloud]

"Gee it sure is weird how every empire not under direct HP control gets prophesied to explode."

[odd thicket]

sybilla gave him a choice btw

[worldly rain]

I like how every God that tried to defy fate had an angle besides guiding them
Angles are really salty over PO curse on them

[patent cloud]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYUj8oGGwJY

sick video tbh

basically a full walkthrough of teyvat history + extra stuff

[odd thicket]

And each one failed

Angels need to get a MBA certification first tbh

[modern plover]

is delusion as strong as vision?

or is it still inferior, firepower wise

not talking abt the fact it steals your life force

oh nvm

[odd thicket]

play emilie story quest

to acccess elemental power via delusion, it drains your life force

in return

[modern plover]

i havent play

thats the story quest i try to avoid

literally

cuz why mhy make me share the same birthday as her

also my english name is literally Emil.

coincidence?

[odd thicket]

yyes

[modern plover]

i went through so many emotions the moment she is announced. of all the name u can choose for her. of all the birthday you can choose for her

[odd thicket]

https://tenor.com/view/good-morning-emilie-genshin-impact-genshin-gif-860784984258147042

[modern plover]

its my birthday. and the female version of my name

[odd thicket]

shes cute

ngl

[modern plover]

i like her older design more

[odd thicket]

maybe if you play her quest

hoyo would make her likeable and have her appear more often

[modern plover]

[odd thicket]

well
We make do with what we have

[odd thicket]

So i finally played that previous Arlecchino “crucabena” related quest today

Hidden one obv

Our arlecchino seems really tame in comparison

[sweet dune]

arle has hidden quest...?

[queen prawn]

Inazuma hidden world quest

[odd thicket]

Crucabena

[sweet dune]

which one i think i didn't do this

[queen prawn]

I forgot the full details but you basically have to go to the shrine,get the stick a few times, then need to get lucky stick when the requirement is reached,also it is the same one that unlocked the hidden lux chest down the mountain I think

[odd thicket]

Its the fortune slip quest

Gendou Ringo

[sweet dune]

Oh

what

THAT HAD CRUCABENA?

[queen prawn]

Just info

[worldly rain]

When I did it back in the days there was no crucabena
The arle was an old man lol
Did they change something there?

[odd thicket]

The head fatui was acting on his own accord

[odd thicket]

Arlecchino was still a lady

The old man was just a bitter fatui who didnt mesh with Peruere

And choose to follow his own vision of House of the Hearth

Under her

He wanted to poison Waatatsumi island and blame it on Narukami Shrine

[sweet dune]

o.o

[odd thicket]

You can kill all the fatui under him optionally

Across inazuma

[worldly rain]

Nah pretty sure arle was called him when I did it
Maybe they changed it then

[odd thicket]

SHe didnt

His underlings wondered why he was operating on his own

And he was behaving like his own arlecchino as well

He practically raised his whole squad

[worldly rain]

Yeah I remembered wrong...

It was Lord arlechino that was mentioned in the quest and at that time arle wasn't revealed so everyone assumed this "Lord" to be male

Nvm then

[sly bison]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/902599132609413121/1404852919752196197/image0.jpg?ex=68a2a17c&is=68a14ffc&hm=59700222cbee4c6f85623b9155fd392f41dd98e2e4d9cc76a232a011261fb754&

Since 1.4

@odd thicket

[odd thicket]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-gif-18404091

[sly bison]

Just you wait dude

[odd thicket]

Me with reportaire of memories achievement card since 5.6

Or

[sly bison]

When we get to see the ‘true’ Sandrone actually being Alain confirmed

[odd thicket]

Remuria music = godly power

[sly bison]

No one had better doubt again

[odd thicket]

I think that is obvious no

[sly bison]

[sly bison]

That’s what I said

[odd thicket]

Teyvat’s first trans character

Sorry, second

[sly bison]

But some folks aren’t so easily convinced

[odd thicket]

https://tenor.com/view/little-ica-honkai-star-rail-fat-fuck-hsr-hyacine-little-ica-jumpscare-gif-6601659822966555424

[sly bison]

Well there are two paths they can take

the literal ventriloquist route
the marionette gains sentience route

[odd thicket]

Me when i said durin would be playable
Or
Venti is really strong and on par with ei or zhongli

[sly bison]

But going the first rout would be cooler

[odd thicket]

Yeah

[odd thicket]

Idts

It would be really creepy for some

[sly bison]

Skill issue

[odd thicket]

Hoyo would take the second route

Via a sob story quest

[sly bison]

They’ll just kill Sandrone off

Let’s be real

[odd thicket]

Like they did for scaramouche and then gave us wanda

[odd thicket]

Also

[sly bison]

She’s gonna be out next but hopefully better Signora

[odd thicket]

Dottore

[sly bison]

New Segment

[odd thicket]

Already claimed the spot for redemption

[odd thicket]

Yes

[odd thicket]

Yes

[sly bison]

I know people love their edgelords

[odd thicket]

I cant see her making out of NK unscathed

[sly bison]

But let’s be real

[odd thicket]

Tru

[sly bison]

Even Hoyo knows how cooked they are both ways if they put a literal human trafficker, child killer, and absolute disregard for human life guy on a playable roster

It’s just not gonna happen in the CN market

The best they can do is give him great characterization and a send off

[odd thicket]

Its a kids games too

[sly bison]

On his own merits

[odd thicket]

Yep

[sly bison]

And that will be good enough tbh

[odd thicket]

Maybe a segment if they wanna risk it

[sly bison]

His Sement doesn’t necessarily have to be a good guy either

But he’ll def not be nearly as long gone as the Alpha Dottore is atm

[odd thicket]

Yes

[odd thicket]

The fatui trailer cannot come sooner

It is allegedly tomorrow

[sly bison]

Genshin when they mention Lynette’s backstory in a AQ

[odd thicket]

Wriothesly’s back story
Or even
Sumeru world quests and desert lore

[sly bison]

Scaramouche having a history with ||su*cidal|| thoughts

[worldly rain]

Saw a theory some time ago that said sandrone looking for Alain secret research in that one Fontaine world quest is proof that she isn't Alain cause why would Alain needs his own research lol
Or even that Alain died and she's just trying to follow after his footsteps

[sly bison]

At least we long dropped Guizhong = Sandrone theories

[worldly rain]

There was such theory? lol

[sly bison]

But she’s def not Mary Anne

That much I’m super certain of

[worldly rain]

Yeah Mary Ann is also checked out

We literally met her soul version too

[odd thicket]

Old Mondsdadt lore

Too

[odd thicket]

Tru that is very possible

[odd thicket]

Didnt she travel out of her home

To sneznaya

[worldly rain]

That theory btw also said that Alain was considered a genius but sandrone throughout has been seen making mistake with her research something Alain wouldn't
Made me believe the theory somewhat

[worldly rain]

She did but I don't remember whether it's sheznaya Or not

[odd thicket]

Yeah

Scaramouche trash talks her works

While Alain has only ever received praise

My rationalisation for her to be him despite this was that he began to lose himself to grief after that confrontation at Elynas

[worldly rain]

Might be the case that she was indeed made by Alain but since he died and no longer exists sandrone is just trying to chase after his legacy since he is her creator
Like Mary Ann similarities do exist so can't deny the association there but maybe it'll play out bit different here

[odd thicket]

Albedo will fix this by combining them both into one being like he did for Durin

[dense moss]

if it's citlali asking i aint even hesitating

[modern plover]

i finish speedrunning summer event

it may be my fav of all summer events ngl

2.8 being the 2nd. then simulanka, 1.6 and the 3.8 one at last

5.8 for 10/10 story. 2.8 for music, exploration and puzzle, simulanka for its scenary and debut of mini durin and other lore important stuff. 1.6 for nostalgia and 3.8 (i forgot, thats why its my least fav)

[lucid monolith]

let's be honest 5.8's summer event had all the things you mentioned. Excpet for the last part, it didnt have anything forgettable

[patent cloud]

ok so nicole might be one of the most interesting people in teyvat

nicole lore tldr:
she might be a machiavelli-tier schemer who is presumably fully against HP and everything they stand for. she is not bound by Teyvat's fate rules and maneuvers said fate as best she can. she nudges the right people in the right directions to achieve her goals

[odd thicket]

She is still bound by fate

Its just she gets to steer it on her own to some capacity

[patent cloud]

so she isn't bound by it

[odd thicket]

Finding the corners where god’s vision is limited

[odd thicket]

She still is

Simplest explanation is that celestia’s 2D only vision of fate while everyone under it get a 3D system that is tough to navigate

[modern plover]

Ehhh….. u r right but that doesn’t mean that I like all of them equally

2.8 for example tackles very different plot compare to 5.8

Also the environment of each of the summer event is vastly different

[patent cloud]

@odd thicket https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flGVZxQnjbY

What do you think about what she says here?

Is she telling us Scara is cooked and his original form will come back?

[modern plover]

The reason why I forgot 3.8 is cuz is cuz my vision is dying by the time I play that summer event

[odd thicket]

Neither

She is telling that histories might change

But what is done is done