fallout-tv-series

[white lake]

I wonder if the Mojave chapter of the BOS will be in season 2.

[soft magnet]

Most factions in new Vegas were doomed during the ending regardless of what you do, so I wouldn't be surprised if they're gone or joined another chapter and abandoned their post at the Mojave

[teal dune]

The BoS pillaging farms has already been debunked

[soft magnet]

Have you played FO4 if so go to the armory they'll give you a pillage farm quest

[teal dune]

And at no point does the BoS try to slaughter non-feral ghouls

[teal dune]

No, they give you a quest to obtain resources where you can choose to be evil and pillage the farm

At no point does Proctor Teagan explicitly condone pillaging them

You can pay them, persuade them or threaten them

Like many other quests.

If this was a grand statement about the Brotherhood, it wouldn't just be a radiant quest

[soft magnet]

Yes same thing your forcing settlers to give their stuff to the BOS, and you could choose to pay but all choices are Threats, and they are willingly choosing to hand over resources their forced and clearly unhappy which is understandable

[teal dune]

...all choices are threats?

Have you actually played the mission?

I'm not even a fan of 4's BoS

[soft magnet]

Yes I have 3 choices are speech checks

[teal dune]

But I know this isn't a well-backed argument

[teal dune]

And only one of them is a threat

On the same note, you can threaten Kessler to gain Bunker Hill as a settlement

Does this make the Minutemen pillagers?

[soft magnet]

They give you the settlement at the end of the game

[teal dune]

People complain about the lack of evil options in 4, this is just one of them

[soft magnet]

When you defeat the institute

[teal dune]

And just like with the BoS, one of the dialogue options is to threaten her

[teal dune]

It's after the Battle of Bunker Hill, but close enough

What I'm saying is that the option to be threatening & coercive is player choice, not a statement about the Brotherhood

Because it exists with the Minutemen too.

We should move this to #fallout-4-chat

[zenith flicker]

Anyone else think squire Thaddeus isn’t a ghoul? I suspect that serum is a bit more sinister… maybe he’ll become a super mutant.. hmm 🧐

[teal dune]

Nah, I think it's pretty much the same as with Hancock

[novel plank]

Yeah, he doesn't actually care how they are acquired. You can be a living saint, so long as it gets him food he doesn't care. People are overly sensitive and/or far too quick to misinterpret. I remember reading articles where people said: "I liked the BoS until I met this guy, then I killed them all." Says a lot about those players.

[teal dune]

I don't think Fo4's BoS are saints, but they're not raiders either

And the opportunity to be either good or evil when on a quest rarely indicates the character of the questgiver

[novel plank]

Exactly. It's a mirror upon yourself and it's kinda odd how quickly players punished a powerless NPC for merely suggesting an option that can be denied.

[soft magnet]

2 theories, either yes he's a super mutant like you said or he has a Mutation

In fallout 76 you can get mutation serums one is called "healing factor" which heals you outside of combat, could be he got that mutation

[teal dune]

Again I think it's pretty much the same drug Hancock took

[iron vector]

Researched that scene and SOS knew exactly what he was giving.

[teal dune]

SOS?

[errant crow]

And the Minuteman as they were shown in Fallout 4 actually have pretty no ideology at all. It is shown as ad-hoc self-defense movement. And that's actually it's main problem that once AFAIK eventually was it's undoing.

[teal dune]

Well, that's largely because you command them and are supposed to decide their ideology through relations with other factions

If you help the Institute, the Minutemen are basically puppets and enforcers of their will.

If you help the Railroad defeat the Institute, the Minutemen work to form the foundations of a synth-friendly society while the Railroad does the more covert work.

And if you help the Brotherhood defeat the Institute, the Minutemen become basically a militia force supplementing a stronger army

For me, the Minutemen are basically an organized collective of settlements sharing resources & acting as peacekeepers to prevent further war (esp. between Railroad and BoS)

But yeah, your faction choices & leadership style determine the ideology of the Minutemen more or less

[errant crow]

Not so drastic with the Institute. Since coursers are the Institute go-to enforcers and those are pretty good at what they do. So it would be more like trying to maintain the "don't question the Institute and for-Heavens-sake don't even try to dabble in Institute's affair or bad things will happen" policy.

[errant crow]

As i had just said. They are basically an ad-hoc self-defense movement. And that's their main problem - as they grow, conflicting opinions on "how the future of the Commonwealth should be shaped" will start to appear. And then - strife and internal conflict.

[teal dune]

The Minutemen have faced plenty of internal conflict, mainly due to lacking leadership and Institute-related paranoia

With both issues resolved I don't see there being that much strife

[iron vector]

Chicken fornicator.

[teal dune]

Ah, haven't heard that acronym before

[iron vector]

That's just the usual situation. The Minutemen are the only faction with a chance for democracy, so what you feel is strife and internal conflict is just healthy disagreements that also give them the flexibility to address them, rather than force anyone into a particular mould.

[iron vector]

Just the first letters of Snake Oil Salesman.

[teal dune]

I don't necessarily see the Minutemen themselves being democratic, but rather them allowing for the process of democracy to take hold

My headcanon involves things such as the upper stands residents (who were put in their position by McDonough) being evicted and their property seized, ghouls being permitted into Diamond City once more, and the eventual formation of a new CPG with each major settlement having a vote at the table (Diamond City, Vault 81, Goodneighbor, Bunker Hill, Sanctuary, The Castle, Vault 88, Nuka-Town, Far Harbour)

[orchid rune]

Would far harbour and nuka be part of it. They’re close to the commonwealth but they aren’t in it. I don’t see the minutemen being expansionist…at least not yet

[valid copper]

Arthur Maxson clearly wants to restore Roger Maxson's original vision for the Brotherhood of Steel, of preserving (and in some cases improve) technology, while also acting as a fighting force to protect people from threats. But it seems like the West Coast hasn't fully bought into his ideology yet. And now Elder Quintus has his sights set on becoming the new High Elder of the Brotherhood, something I'm sure Maxson was hoping to achieve.

[novel plank]

Funny thing there - in 76 we learn that Maxson had originally intended the BoS to be like what Elder Lyons converted his chapter into over in DC, and that the 'traditional ideals' were what dissenters who basically outvoiced him, including his own child, wanted.

[valid copper]

I have a hard time seeing the Minutemen as being the canon ending to Fallout 4, simply because of how weak they are in the game. They're basically just a bunch of rednecks with guns. Whenever you come across Minutemen patrols, they're usually armed with only pipe weapons and laser muskets, with little to no armor. They're almost always killed by Raiders, Gunners and Synths. It just doesn't seem practical that they could take out the Institute single-handedly. They only succeed in the game because your character is essentially a one-man army. Unlike the Brotherhood, you just can't see them winning without your help. If the game had given you the option to coordinate a Minutemen/Brotherhood assault, then I could see it.

[valid copper]

Future Elders went on to "revise" the Codex to better reflect their isolationist and xenophobic worldview. They may have respected Roger Maxson as the Founder of the Brotherhood, but they scoffed at his vision. This is what lead to chapters like the Mojave being the way they were.

[novel plank]

Yeah, I just think it's funny.

[valid copper]

It's sad really. Roger Maxson may have been the founder and savior of the Brotherhood, but he was alone in his worldview. Even his own son didn't respect his values. The moment his father passed away, he changed the direction of the Brotherhood.

[novel plank]

That's what's funny about it. His memory is upheld as exactly the opposite of his intentions. I mean, of course it's sad, but the irony is deep.

[valid copper]

I wouldn't say he's like Lyons. Lyons prioritized charity above all else, even technology, and that got them into a lot of trouble. His overly altruistic style of leadership almost ran his chapter into the ground. By the events of FO3, they were ill-equipped, and lacking in man power. By asking for nothing in return, they had to scrape the bottom of the barrel just to stay in the fight. It was only because of the Lone Wanderer that they managed to defeat the Enclave and gain the technology & resources needed to build the Prydwen. Everyone loves Owen Lyons, but the truth is, he wasn't that great a leader.

[errant crow]

And there is again a problem. In a democracy such policy disagreements are resolved via elections - would-be-leaders present their ideas to general populace and then said populace cast their votes. Whoever gains the majority gets the power to see his ideas through. The rest become the political opposition, they scrutinise those people who won the power so that if they do not a good job the opposition could, via criticism and offering better solution win the next election. But Minutemen didn't feature any elections (Preston bestowes the title of general upon Nate/Nora without even asking the others (Sturges, Mama Murphy and so on...) and there is no indication that any elections were at any time part of Minutemen's operations, unfortunately

[plain turtle]

i mean id argue its quite hard to form a functional democracy during a big apocalypse

[errant crow]

Upper Stands residents were mostly caravan trady tycoons, not corrupt buraucrats. So it would first come to the question of what sort of economy you would try to built - a capitalist one or a socialist one. Upon thats hinges the question of Diamond City's upper stands. The Goodneigboor is even more of a problem... many of it's populations were not banished from Diamond City for racial bias (for being ghouls), they were banished for being raiders. And I suspect many of those folks still are raiders. Unfortunately.

[errant crow]

Diamond City was a democratic city-state for example

[iron vector]

This is only true if you believe democracy can only be a liberal democracy in the current style.

Which is funny, because at no point did I suggest the Minutemen form such an organization.

[teal dune]

Is there a source for the latter claim?

[errant crow]

Then I suggest you share what are the qualifying features of democracy up to you?

[iron vector]

A form of government where power is derived from the people in general, not any specific class, for the benefit of the people in general, rather than any specific class. The precise form it should take, how said form is formed and chosen, and other technicalities are second to these principles.

What you describe is one, very specific form of democracy, one that's very popular, but also prone to corruption: Modern liberal democracy. Apart from me wondering why you insist that such a form must instantly materialize in this specific way, I also wonder why you think this is the only possible form of democracy.

[errant crow]

There isn't much of paid full-time buraucracy in Diamond City at all. There is the mayor (he/she is elected), mayoral secretary, school teachers, some maintenance workers like Abbot, and Diamond City security force. That's all for full-time paid city servants. Then there are City Council but they meet periodically are not paid and are elected.

[iron vector]

For instance, I consider Shady Sands in 2161 to be just about the most democratic community in the Falloutverse, bar none, despite them not having formalized elections or a strict power structure. Everyone works together and the elder is elected by popular consent from among the community.

I'm reminded of this brief quip from Deus Ex: A system organized around the weakest qualities of individuals will produce these same qualities in its leaders. Shady Sands is organized around the strongest qualities, and the elder leads - not rules, leads - at the discretion of the community.

[teal dune]

I never claimed they were paid bureaucrats, and I was asking about Goodneighbor being mostly raiders

They were literally put in the upper stands by McDonough, it's his policy that so sharpens the wealth divide

Likely because he was ordered to by the Institute

Banning ghouls and placing the wealthy in a segregated district both accomplished the same purpose; worsening class & race tensions thus making the prospect of a new CPG less viable

[iron vector]

Something that occurred to me: I really wish Titus was made a Paladin, and the guys in red tunic weren't "petty officers" but straight up Knights. Or at least an explanation given for why the Brotherhood is like it is - apart from the BRotherhood War, that is.

[digital copper]

yeah, the totally unexplained changes in rank structure and addition of a new class that seems to have replaced scribes is... weird

i imagine they'll go into it in future seasons, but it's frustrating having such big and obvious changes and not having any indication of where they came from

[bold pendant]

I think clerics are to scribes what paladins are to knights

[lofty prairie]

What's the squire version of scribe

Also squire?

[shadow heath]

Yeah, he definitely ain't a ghoul. Unless ghouls can suddenly survive arrows through the throat and regenerate limbs. 🤷‍♂️

[zenith flicker]

Maybe the serum gave him the Photosynthesis perk. 😅

[shadow heath]

Scribble.

Jokes aside, I think it'd just be an initiate -> Scribe. It makes sense for Knights to have squires, because they'd need field experience before actually becoming knights. Scribes can, for the most part, just stay behind in whatever their HQ is and learn the ropes there.

[shadow heath]

It isn't ''pillage farm'', it is ''obtain food''. Teagan gives you carte blanche - but Teagan is also mad that everyone in the Brotherhood is so focused on ''rules''.

Ergo, him not caring ''how you acquire the food'' seems more like just Teagan being Teagan. But even there, you still have the option to pay for the food. Or persuade for it.

[soft magnet]

But still you loose caps in the process, you loose either 1,000 or 500 and even then you only gain 100 caps for the quest, most people when Playing wouldn't pay caps if they're losing resources from the quest rather than gaining

So the only option that doesn't involve a loss is persuade

[lofty prairie]

Oh lmao I believed you!

[soft magnet]

As much as I hate the BOS in 4 though there are some times where I try to like them, their ranking system is probably my favorite thing about the BOS even though the rank "lancer" and it's ranks doesn't really make much sense especially when reading into the rank, it isn't an experienced pilot rank it's just a rank given to vertibird or air pilots and they don't even need training so they can be inexperienced and still get Promoted which I found kinda dumb

[iron vector]

My head rationalization is that it's a result of the devastating losses sustained in the Brotherhood War. Perhaps even Lost Hills itself fell? With no Elders, the Scribes reformed to combine leadership and scientific roles.

I mean, Paladins might not be a thing because they all died.

[hasty stone]

So anyone else feel like the whole "oblivious vault dweller" stereotype seemed to be mostly brought on from the show?

I dont remember getting that vibe when playing the games from NPC dialogue and all

[digital copper]

Yeah, I was thinking the next season might reveal that Hank and his cronies nuked more than just Shady Sands -- Maximus and others do mention bombs, plural.

I'd say he probably took out pretty much every major power player in southern California. Hub, Shady Sands, probably Adytum and Dayglow, too... and that includes Lost Hills. Brotherhood opened up because of it, dove into their religious roots in the same way the survivors of Shady Sands became weirdo blood-drinking cultists (still dislike that, they had an ancestral religion primed to go with Dharma :P)

Only issue is that even as of NV, which Todd insists the bombs fell "right after", southern California is like... the main powerhouse of the NCR. We've got no indication that NorCal is anything more than a frontier territory similar to the Mojave, albeit perhaps a better-secured and more developed one. Which goes against the repeated reassurances to fans that actually the NCR is alive and well outside LA guys, don't worry

[digital copper]

New Vegas and 3 got into it a little.

You had some dialogue in Megaton where you could be comically oblivious (most notably with Moira where you can exclaim with awe that the "main room" is so big that you "can't even see the ceiling!", which based on her worried response seems to be you being entirely genuine) And NV had some hints of it with Sarah Weintraub, her brother Michael, and the fate of Vault 3's inhabitants.

But the show does indeed really play up the "comically sheltered and out-of-touch" aspect further than any prior instances I can think of, yeah

[novel plank]

It also depends on the Vault in question: The ones in 33 believe they are being raised to restore America, and have a bright, cheery disposition as a result. Other vaults seem more dour by comparison.

[iron vector]

I feel that it's not necessary to actually nuke every place of power. One of the things that I realized while going over the refs for Shady Sands was how centralized NCR became. Pretty much everything of note was in Shady Sands, and it doubled as a massive logistical hub. Nuke that and... Like, the centrifugal tendencies already present would go ballistic.

[digital copper]

They're centralized in some respects, but you have to remember that like any nation they were a complex web. Adytum and the Hub were both equally important as the economic and industrial hearts of the nation; they could survive and theoretically recover without Shady Sands. Heck, IIRC plenty of NPCs in NV argue that the Hub is where the real power is concentrated, in terms of money flowing into the pockets of senators and major, increasingly-monopolized businesses that have stakes across the nation's territory

[iron vector]

In a way, yes, but with the nuking they lose their entire executive, legislative, military command, logistics, and so on and so forth. In a non-Internet setting. It's not just a scratch. It's an apocalypse.

[digital copper]

Fair enough!

[ebon current]

In my opinion… not sure about this part tho, but it is a possibility.

I haven’t delved deep into the Fallout lore as a whole, since I am only a 4 and 76 player, but for some reason, I think there is a possibility for that, since Vault-Tec is all about control.

But in the same time, I find it a bit paradoxical, since Vault-Tec and all the other companies to profit off the war using the vaults (Except for Mr. House if memory server right), rather than vying for control over the Wasteland.

I’m not 100% sure tho, I see that Vault-Tec wants that quick cash grab and a chance of experimenting, but feel free to give me more clarification.

[little linden]

Hanks speech entails a power grab - he's paraphrasing Hobbes Leviathan.

[errant crow]

Fallout 1's Shady Sands is actually indeed that. It is ruled by mostly direct democracy actually. However, it is then should be noted that FO1's Shady Sands at that time was basically a pre-industrial level commune of farmers and individual craftsmen, with labour done either in family units or collectively with it's fruits shared. It was also rather small. Couple - several hundreds of inhabitants or so (the latter being maximum) - give or take. Knowing the size of the community it is not surprising that it could be ruled by directly assembling all adult townspeople to decide on whatever matters needed communal decision and also electing an Elder (no formal ballot was actually needed since all voters were assembled in one place). The Elder, who is respected and most importantly known to almost everyone in the town. And vice-versa, the Elder knew most of his fellow townfolks. Also, the size of the commune and the nature of it's economy resulted in there be not that much of issues that needed any governance or policy decisions. However, should we look at, for example, 2281's (FNV era) NCR, we unfortunately find that such system could not work in 700 000+ people Republic. NCR president Aaron Kimball, even if he wished, could not personally know most of 700 000+ permanent residents of NCR, nor most of NCR's folks (700 000+ people) personally know president Kimball....

[errant crow]

Quote: "Which goes against the repeated reassurances to fans that actually the NCR is alive and well outside LA guys, don't worry" - but it is actually mr. Todd Howard who gets a final say on the issue of what would become canon, so....

[little linden]

Or the showrunners / writers room

[little linden]

It's not solely a scale issue. Representative democracy is simply a different kind of thing. Countries have tried to scale up tribal councils. Indonesia for instance. But the intent wasn't democracy itself but preserving the traditional leadership structure. (Because of there were representative elections the Communists would win)

Easy historical comparisons are awkward because the post-war world has advanced technology - but like maybe bronze age population levels

[novel plank]

||The Enclave and Vault-Tec kinda go hand-in-hand at the highest levels, and there were a lot of people who 'knew' something was about to happen at the nuclear exchange level -which is why the US President is on the Oil Rig in Fallout 2 and Vault-Tec executives are frozen in Vault 31. Also, it's important to note - the scene in the series was not about 'profiting off the war' it is about investing in the vaults. The vaults are the plan for a cleansing of the Earth, and rebuilding an ordered society that is only them (which sounds very Enclave-like). It's an evil, genocidal plan to conquer the planet, not one to make a buck. The reason they speak of investing is, if nothing happens, they are then just a lot poorer for no reason.||

[errant crow]

Except they were not put there by him. McDonough only exploited the already existing wealth divide to get himself elected as mayor. And he did so actually by the deplorable means "instead of trying to address wealth divide I will use racist rhetorics to mask the problem up by turning some racial minority into scapegoats". That's why Diamond City rich folks voted for him, tipping the overall balance, he put the potential heat of them and redirected it onto ghouls. And overall McDonough before he was outed as synth was considered to be a good mayor by most of both rich class and working class Diamond City folks.

[errant crow]

Goodneighboor was founded by those banished from Diamond City for the sake of criminal behavior, and long before McDonough banning ghouls from Diamond City in 2282.

[gray beacon]

What’s the place shown at the end of the show, is that the Mojave?

[foggy fulcrum]

Yup

[iron vector]

I'm not sure why you interpret my point as saying the entire Republic should be structured like that or assume that I ignore complexities. The point was that I find modern liberal democracies to be undemocratic - and the NCR's adoption of this system is or was at the root of the deteriorating democratic situation. The very thing you mention, the division into those in power and the opposition, the reduction of democratic participation to mere act of voting every few years, and detachment of politicians from the people they're expected to lead, is something that can be avoided.

For example, keep everything as decentralized as possible and establish the new state as a confederation of communes, with only affairs requiring their collective effort delegated to a higher level; keep those in leadership roles accountable by giving each commune the ability to recall their chosen representative at any time, not just at fixed intervals. In general, do everything to establish consensus politics, not competition.

[gusty seal]

How did the scientist dude come from teh enclave I thought they were all dead

[foggy fulcrum]

Not Dead, just no longer a powerful Military force and are now in hiding across the US in various remnant groups.

[gusty seal]

Are they still a reasonably powerful force? How would they fare if the BoS found them

[foggy fulcrum]

In some cases depending on the group yes, but ultimately they are still spread out and by no means a whole entity atm. With nobody really taking the reigns to reunite the Enclave it’s pretty much everyone doing their own thing whether it be leaving that life behind or finding a way to secure power for the Enclave in other places to start scratch from.

[hybrid bolt]

I'd give ya one of these cherry tomatoes.....but you got a hole in your neck

[little linden]

In episode 2 Titus calls them remnants, just as they are referred to in New Vegas, except he doesn't take them seriously. Takes it as a waste of time to be ordered to hunt one down.

That said some of the dialogue in episode 1 gave me the impression they are a known place. like the high cleric: "It is believed that a denizen of the Enclave has escaped." imo might imply their location is known, but well defended, like they have become a literal geographic enclave

But atleast one aspirant didnt know the enclave was even real,

[silent summit]

So the way SS was destroyed tells me that vault tec has Abombs, but not missiles.

A crater is not usually done by a atomic bomb, as they are detonated in the air. This means that Vault-tec lost or was not able to acquire a missile to launch it from.

[gusty seal]

Is vault tec still a functional company? Until I watched the show I thought they were gone and the vaults were the only thing left of them

[lofty prairie]

Yeah they pretty much were setup like the Enclave, in a sense. ||That was the point of the Vaults from the TV show.||

Many Vaults allude to a procedure where an "all clear" signal is given, and Vault-Tec representitives supposedly came and released the people.

Other Vaults had different procedures, or completsly lacked them. Such as Vault 15, which had an automatic opening, yet was delayed, as the expirement was about putting a bunch of people who differed massively in beliefs together. Another was Vault 11, ||which had a computer that would open the door, if the people stood up to it, for demanding sacrifices every year.||

Vault 31 and 51 were two prongs left of Vault Tec. ||They were to house existing Vault-Tec personell, and create new leaders for the post nuclear war world||

[gusty seal]

How are they going to lead

With what army?

[lofty prairie]

||Remember in the show, how they were undiscovered? I think the point is that they want to build their world as the puppet masters. The war they wage is a war of ideology, not guns. I think thats the point. They controlled the residents of Vault 33 without anyone knowing about it||

The world of Fallout heavily plays on the concepts of a Corperatist economic, and political model. Essentially a Capitalist society, but the governing parties are people invested in companies, like CEOs, Owners, Shareholders, etc.

[gusty seal]

Like libertarianism?

[lofty prairie]

Kiiiiiinda, but more like Fascism, in a sense. Fascism as the political model, where its a free market, except its governed by a small enclave or a single individual. Think like, if a monopoly was a governing entity.

This is why the world blew up, becuase of that reason. ||The show pretty directly alludes to Vault Tec being the ones to launch the nukes||

[white lake]

I’m currently on episode 5 and I just gotta say, great show, but why tf is Maximus such a compulsive liar?

Like when Lucy ask for his name he lies and says he’s knight Titus.

[little linden]

This is also touched on in fallout 2 ||the enclave is that force, though the extent of separation between vault-tec and the enclave is unclear, 2 references a "Enclave Vault-Research Control" which in online during the events of that game.- it would almost certainly fit the portrayal of vault 31||

[lofty prairie]

I thought that was ||vault 51 in Fo76||

||Vault was not fully automated meaning someone was telling ZAX what to do. And ZAX spoke like MODUS so it makes me think it's that Enclave Vault||

But I could be way off here lol 😅

Or it's the Vault under ||Whitespring and I'm over thinking||

[little linden]

||that would imply it's someone telling from outside of 51. But the vault control is online in 2241, so i doubt it's anywhere in 76||

[lofty prairie]

||While MODUS and ZAX could both live that long. I doubt 51 is still active and communicating much||
Couldn't the one under ||Whitespring still be it though?||

Your idea does have merit, especially considering who was in there 👀

I just thought I had this mystery solved before the show came out lol

[little linden]

remember ||white springs lost contact with the rest of the enclave, unless contact is reestablished, that would mean it's not connected to the computer system featured in 2||

[lofty prairie]

I am an idiot lol how'd I forget that 😅

[valid copper]

Scribes can't become Elders though. The only time that ever happened was with Father Elijah, because he was a technological genius.

[valid copper]

True. I think that the Brotherhood will dedicate all their new resources, including Cold Fusion, to go to war with the rest of the NCR, or what's left with it. They seem intent on building their own nation, now that they have the means to achieve it.

[shadow heath]

I mean, they can, it's not like they're barred from becoming Elder. But it's just not common for that to happen.

[raven wolf]

So you’re describing oligarchy

[odd kettle]

I just want Veronica from NV to have a cameo. Hopefully she finds peace after all. Bro deserves it.

[raven wolf]

It’s pretty clear that Veronica and the rest of the companions get their peace at the end of New Vegas

[odd kettle]

No matter how her questline ends she’s at “odds” with the Mojave Chapter. Regardless if Christine survives dead money she doesn’t return to Veronica. Also still can’t make her wear Vera’s dress so her ultimate goal is achieved.

[little linden]

This is basically the series 90's era perspective on corporations. They are all interlinked, competition between mega corps isn't real, and line between them and the American government is hazy to inexistant

[raven wolf]

So oligarchy

[little linden]

Ye

[tender elm]

So I’ve recently finished the show and was curious how the games are. I’ve never played Fallout before but the show was dope. So I see 76 is currently still being supported, and Fallout 4 just got a next gen update. But I see a lot of ppl saying to start with 3. Im on ps5 so if anyone could help me out

[novel plank]

They're all self-contained stories. If you want the indicative modern experience, play 4. 76 is an MMO and, while fun, isn't very representative of the franchise.

[tender elm]

Yeh 4 seems like the choice rn.

[proven juniper]

4 is the best one gameplay wise, though is a bit lacking in storytelling, compared to older titles imo

Also the settlement mechanics are pretty fun

[novel plank]

4's best quality for someone coming from the TV show is the TV show looks just like it.

It will be familiar.

[proven juniper]

Very true

[lofty prairie]

No an oligarchy doesnt imply corporate entities as governing parties. Classic oligarchys are similar yes, because of a small enclave or group of governing people. However the difference is the "elected officials". Fascism walks a fine line between a dictatorship and a election system.

Because of these reasons I dont call a "Corporatism" either.

[raven wolf]

It isn’t a dictatorship. It’s an oligarchic system you’re describing even if it doesn’t imply corporations.

[lofty prairie]

The difference between an oligarchy or a monarchy and a oligopoly or a monopoly as governing parties is the elected officials. A classic monarchy, or oligarchy is they arent elected. Its basically fascism with extra steps, and safeguards. But fascism implies a more dictatorship model, but also has economic implications, in the sense that the government has unlimited control and power over the economy. It is this reason I attribute a corperatism akin to Fascism. The difference, however is a very fine line, because a corperatism in practice always ends up corrupt, with a small few people capable of reaching governing office.

Its hard to explain

I dont really care for the comparison between socialeconomic and political governing systems because they both have the same fundemental principles.

With political and socialeconomic models youll find how it works on paper is vastly different than how it works in practice.

In the sense of the TV show, yes they are still a Capitalist Democracy" on paper. But in prsctice its more like what North Korea calls their "Democracy", which isnt really a democracy because there is only one person who will ever win.

[raven wolf]

How are you inferring that from the show?

[lofty prairie]

Because it was the enclave of CEOs and Rich people that had more power than the government.

[raven wolf]

Sure but that was a contingency plan after the nuclear war. The Enclave weren’t in power yet, they were just a secret society akin to freemasons but governmental.

[lofty prairie]

CEOs and Rich people arent "elected" to gain their status as CEOs and Rich People.

The problem is that when they become CEOs and Rich people, it generally breeds greed and hunger for power. It is this exact reason that ||Vault Tec launched the nukes, they were so hungry for power that they ended the world for the almight dollar, and the power it holds||

The whole scene ||in the last part of the show paints the picture im talking about. Great cinematography btw, dark room with a big exaggerated table, really paints a picture. It didnt look like a business meeting, more like a governmental meeting because they were talking about ending the world, instead of something like... I dont know, when the new Xbox is rolling out||

[digital copper]

just as a head's up, the "next-gen" update to 4 is really bad honestly, especially for console users. introduced a lot of really severe bugs and barely fixed any of the existing ones, no measurable increase in graphics quality or performance, while breaking most mods that existed to fix the things that, as mentioned, it doesn't fix :p

[tender elm]

Yeh I think imma just play 76. Seems like everyone says 4 is better modded.

[digital copper]

Just understand the 76 is a lot more grindy and requires a much higher time investment than 4; it's also multiplayer only unless you pay for a subscription so that you can run a private server

[lofty prairie]

||Not just ending the world either, they were talking about performing sick expirements on people during the great war. Controlling people, and treating them like cattle, and lab rats, to suit their own purposes. Thats not something a corperation does, more like a government||

[tender elm]

Thts fine with me lol, but should I be getting Fallout 1st? I don’t want a private server but is the rest of the benefits worth it?

[digital copper]

ehh, not really IMO

[lunar hawk]

The scrapbox and the tents are worth imo. They're super helpful

Feel free to join us over in #fallout-76-chat if you have more questions

[lofty prairie]

Agreed, first is good, and im not typically a fan of subscription services.

So much so that I moved from Console to avoid them

[livid leaf]

Knight Titus does a good job of
MAKING POWER ARMOR LOOK USELESS

[tardy shoal]

lol fr if we could get some PA scenes where it’s going more than look menacing, that would be great

[hexed helm]

So I do like this show, but there some weird lore inconstancies. for example ||power armor not needing jet packs, they just fly like iron man in the span of 9 years, meanwhile brother hood does not have a single laser weapon of any kind. Not to mention how we meet ghouls with no history of this drug (like a kid we find in a fridge)

I also think its weird how the scientist speed walked past an enclave gatling turret with the dog.

Not to mention someone from the vault managed to find a nuke, aim it at shady sands which looked pretty recoverd and just make it a crator. I thought the point of the vaults were so they can make "massive profits" but its hard to do when the wife of the overseer rebuilds society somehow.

Also apparently non feral ghouls are super resistant to damage, our favorite ghoul eat lead like a super mutant in that one gun fight scene.||

Alot of inconstancies, some might have answers but overall if these could be explained future seasons and not brushed over that be great.

A great theory I seen for example of why the bos has power armor, more orthadox in its practices is that the BOS is made up of remnant ceasers legion following the defeat of hoover dam. Granted i'm not sure how they would train house, and prepare them networking them with a ship marked the actual pridwin early on with no word of maxon from fallout 4

As ceaser was very against energy weapons and drugs, but verry focused on discapline, fitness, loyalty, ect

There is an attempt made

but it never follows through

meaning in new vegas no matter what or who you support you cannot make it such that the legion takes energy weapons, tho this thread is explored in mods. It also seems to be under the command of a centurion rather than ceaser himself

new vegas was very well written and consistant

The lady who held the deal was the leader of the van graffs though no fan of the ncr, her cut throat buisness double crossed the legion after taking the money and lead an ambush cooped by the ncr

[foggy fulcrum]

And you think the show is just that? Low Quality Slop?

Just know your in the minority on that, not that it matters to some of us in the end

[hexed helm]

Lots of good questions, I'm honestly willing to give it a chance as it seems the "retconning" could still be done well in a way that makes it believable and respects previous lore. Alot of companies I find fail to implement such new lore and it gets rejected by fans or ignored entirely. For example (fallout 76)

I find the ghoul serum, interesting. If they framed it as giving some fev esk toughness and agility at the risk of fast forwarding feralfication Id believe it meaning you could be a ghoul without the serum for a long time and the serum does in fact make you stay a super ghoul but its not needed

also the comments on the new bos chapted involving former ceaser legion is also interesting and explains well the nature

[foggy fulcrum]

You realize Lucy is losing her naivety as time goes on right?

[digital copper]

and what does goiym mean

[hexed helm]

old habbits die hard, honestly she was loosing her innocence and naitivitiy, but even so you probably desire some good deep down in you even if its not there in such a brutal world

also I saw that bridge scene as an attempt in a charisma check

more specifically

the pacify skill in fallout 4, even if some liberties were taken

in future fallouts I hope they allow us to use the pacify and command to make former enemies into followers even if it is a set of generic back stories along some unique for things like former named foes, but that just me wishing a game thats probably wont be the same system as fallout 4 and I pray not as 76. I despise what an mmo has done to fallout gameplay loop. but let me go back to the tv show

she was born and raised in a vault for x years of her life, somethings are hard to change

||we see that with some of the other vault residents deciding what to do with captured raiders||

||and even when they find that other vault with the mutants||

[lusty oasis]

I have no opinion other than power armor was nearly as perfect as FO4

[hexed helm]

[foggy fulcrum]

Btw looking back on an earlier comment, the original devs planned on having nuking Shady Sands in the cancelled Van Buren Game

[hexed helm]

If your asking me as a gamer, this is an unmodded vanilla 4 esk fallout experience yes, with mods it be a different matter entirely they would probably be "rehabilitated" taking a page from elija

[lusty oasis]

esque* 🤓

[hexed helm]

interesting how slaves/slavery dissapered from fallout games

[lusty oasis]

probably became a touchy topic

[hexed helm]

in a wasteland

[lusty oasis]

in real life

[hexed helm]

after a apocalpyse, I think people bringing in modern day in fiction to hard at that point.

[lusty oasis]

the reception to slavery in the modern games would be pretty nasty

knowing how people care a lot

I personally don’t it’s a literal nuclear wasteland but yknow

[hexed helm]

idk fallout new vegas did pretty well and fallout 3

cause it made sense

[digital copper]

still curious what that word means could you elaborate

[foggy fulcrum]

XD

[digital copper]

cool

[lusty oasis]

yeah but that was 14 years ago

people have gotten sensitive you know

[digital copper]

curious about that myself

[hexed helm]

Thats probably a reflection based of social credit/karma/egs score and how playing a victom and pandering opens not only monitized doors for you but also opens clout to use to prove your really a good person or better than the other person your beefing with. It's quite sad honestly.

[lusty oasis]

I agree

[foggy fulcrum]

https://tenor.com/view/mark-wahlberg-smh-shake-head-no-nope-gif-17582268

[lusty oasis]

it’s just an annoying topic to not have in an anarchic wasteland because people whine

[foggy fulcrum]

https://tenor.com/view/wtf-what-do-you-want-pig-turn-around-looking-gif-18737565

[hexed helm]

I guess in a believable wasteland there wouldnt be raiders just road men who politely take your caps and engage in tickle fights because murder and violence is bad.

[foggy fulcrum]

Anyway as for Slavery in Fallout Games, 76 still does it so really it’s no problem

[true ocean]

https://tenor.com/view/flipping-through-notes-tiger-king-checking-notes-reviewing-cramming-gif-24216267

[hexed helm]

I doubt fallout 76 would legitmately be considered.

[digital copper]

homie really thought he was being slick lol

[trim quest]

Drop it... move on

[digital copper]

I know, I am, just thought it was funny

[foggy fulcrum]

Pretty sure it is, it’s the one adding content and lore atm.

[hexed helm]

The sand box were xXxjoeXsmoxXx griefs you with a nuke, or funny enough depending on how long you played did x. y, z exploit or somehow your level 70 wasterlander gets replaced with a level 10 character

what a cruel joke

at least redfall had a vacume to fail

needs to be put in the bin with fallout bos

[digital copper]

yeah i do not comprehend people thinking 76's (shockingly good at times) lore somehow isn't canon just because it's also got a bunch of dumb gamey stuff

[hexed helm]

I'm waiting on fallout 5, and if people could just have the neurons connect, allow obsidian to have another fallout shot before I die of old age or the talent retires or dies

[foggy fulcrum]

They are busy with Avowed and Outer Worlds 2 atm

[hexed helm]

they got the time. all they need is a slot

[digital copper]

also very few of the key creative staff from NV still work at Obsidian AFAIK lol

[foggy fulcrum]

Which people forget for some reason.

[digital copper]

so you'd be getting an entirely different creative vision from the one you fell in love with them for: not that I think that's necessarily a bad thing but people seem wrapped up in the idea that Obsidian is a monolith that can do no wrong and that a potential fallout game from them in the future would be designed and written identically to NV. it probably wouldn't!

[hexed helm]

the sad part is because of 76 we probably wont get a fallout game with coop or invasion similar to how from soft does it. because a fallout with multiplayer could be great, but not mmo. not like they originally scoped

[foggy fulcrum]

Not only that but even they make mistakes, which I feel people get blinded from nostalgia to realize, Game companies do research on lore but even then they may not always get everything 100% when making content.

[hexed helm]

but thats what mods are for i gues

[foggy fulcrum]

76 isn’t an MMO

Do you even know what classifies as an MMO?

[hexed helm]

can I play this fallout offline?

[digital copper]

fun fact: the art for the plasma caster in FO1 and FO2 clearly shows that it's a pistol grip rifle style weapon lol. see screenshots in a sec lol

[foggy fulcrum]

Otherwise Call Of Duty is an MMO

[digital copper]

Yeah MMO is a very specific genre, 76 has a lot of qualities from it but it's sort of a weird mixed bag hybrid thing

I don't entirely disagree with classifying it as such though

[hexed helm]

i'll concide that its limited to active people on any given server up to 32? players was it?

[foggy fulcrum]

It’s similar to ESO in that regard, it’s also canon yet people would rather ignore the lore it introduces because it’s not Singleplayer, wish that mentality would die already

[hexed helm]

but other than that, it is very much considered an mmo so much more than call of duty it is a stream compared to a great lake.

I think we are going off topic tho

lets go back to the show

I don't believe the ncr would be 100% gone, ||even with the capitol nuked||

It was so big and had corruption, more likely it splintered.

[foggy fulcrum]

It’s definitely not, especially with Todd making it clear they aren’t, however Season 2 would have to go more in depth regarding that.

[hexed helm]

I think bethesda is gonna have some fun with the ncr

I hope to see some super mutant and ghoul ncr troops

knowing the ncr they probably take former synths to.

If it can provide a service and pays taxes, then its fine with them

[foggy fulcrum]

Well Synths are all the way out East but considering cross country travel has always been possible in Fallout some may end up there

[hexed helm]

If our buddy Ede can do it

I believe 🫡

[digital copper]

ehh, in ESO's case I actually understand the impulse and it runs deeper than that; there's a lot of really cool and weird lore that ESO effectively retcons as "oh people were just telling tall tales and the reality is more mundane" which is the most boring way to handle that in fantasy setting (not that ESO doesn't introduce some fantastic lore of its own at times)

but yeah, getting off topic heh

[foggy fulcrum]

Except that makes sense, the whole point of Elder Scrolls is the Unreliable Narrator where some things have always been exaggerated, some lies, some truth.

[hexed helm]

I'm not a big fan of comics, but I am a big fan of fallouts robots and the mechanist. I wouldnt put it past the tv show to have one episode talking about one of the well know comic heros

probably some strung out super mutant as grognak saying hes dovaking or w/e

what a woahjack momment that would be

[digital copper]

True, but the appeal has also been that the cultures that exist within it are utterly bizarre in very fun ways; the idea of argonians travelling by weird worm things and altmer living in literal glass houses grown from crystal is cool as heck in the same way that dunmer wizards living in mushrooms was, and ESO just kinda goes "yeah actually they live in normal houses and travel in normal ways" which is lame to me lol

[foggy fulcrum]

Argonian’s are rather bizarre enough as it without that whole worm thing

[hexed helm]

part of the reason why I don't care about the elderscrolls tv show is because they announced a long time ago in the lore that everything is just made up and can be bended and flexed at any time. Everything is possibly cannon, even thomas as a dragon or...other things I will not talk about.

[digital copper]

they also humanwash the elves to look less like strange fantasy creatures and more like "dudes with pointy ears and weird skin colors" which i intensely dislike, the crazy sclera, big eyes, and razor-sharp cheekbones were what made TES elves interesting in comparison to other series 🤣 -- but yeah, back on topic

[foggy fulcrum]

Huh?

[foggy fulcrum]

I mean dudes with Pointy Ears is essentially what they were to me lol, and ones more magically gifted and can live longer

[hexed helm]

its just a slime, there is no back bone or something to hold up and map story beats to that adds meaning to me.

its power fantasy the game. Nothing really matters.

[foggy fulcrum]

Made up, you mean like Fallout is? Or any franchise in general?

[hexed helm]

It just feels like it doesn't matter. And its made to be so. Just a fun moddable playground.

And thats great for fun

[foggy fulcrum]

I wouldn’t say that really, a lot of lore getting added matters to many fans of the series, especially me.

[hexed helm]

but not for a tv show or some kind of series of events id care for

fallout you have all these endings but there is impacts felt and cannonicity. There is this evolution over time that can be seen, and while war never changes the world does. Maybe this is due to hardware limitations but the worlds do feel different and change and how they are communicated feel unique to me

for me I never had that level of attachment with the elder scrolls series

[foggy fulcrum]

Actually no I get it now, but Elder Scrolls is less about the impacts of your actions and more about living in the world and discovering it’s secrets and history. Fallout is similar to discovering and exploration of pre war secrets and such but the whole Human conflict is always the center of it’s story.

Elder Scrolls Lore matters in it’s own way of adding upon older lore and such as Fallout does but the direction they take it in is different

However the events of each game have influenced future games in some ways so it’s not like they don’t matter in that essence

[lofty prairie]

Bit of spoiler but I heard that the show is so good that they're gonna ||make a game that good one day

Ah I'm just joking around lol|| where's season two already!

[paper plume]

You jest, but bringing on Jonathan Nolan as a writer would not be outside the realm of possibility. Todd Howard is the executive producer of the Fallout games. I don't think he's on the writing team. They have quest writers and they have writers for the smaller stories (e.g. terminals, notes). So for example if for a future Fallout game, they had Jonathan Nolan write a single quest (side quest), or quest line (faction), or even the main quest... that's not unreasonable. It would just add to the budget of the game... which you know it's gonna make that money back.

To be fair, the "main quest" of the Fallout TV series wasn't terribly original, borrowing heavily from that of Fallout 3. It just had that ||nice little twist|| at the end. Kind of like how Fallout 4 did us. But it wasn't just the "main quest" of the TV series, it was the pacing, the slow reveal of the Ghoul flashbacks, a lot of things that maybe wouldn't work in a game, that made the show hit the way it did.

And Season 2 was greenlit and is in pre-production (writing/planning), I believe. Generally when shows are pitched, the showrunners have a plan that ends it in one season if it doesn't get renewed, but they also have a longer plan. Great example of this is Babylon 5, going back to the 1990s. The show had a great one-season plan and a four-season plan, but the network wanted a fifth season, which was a bit awkward and felt tacked-on at first (but had a way better ending). Somewhat more recently, Supernatural was planned for 5 seasons, and went how many? 14 or 15? The CW really milked that cow dry. (I stopped after season 9.)

Lastly, the show may have been better than some Fallout games, but IMO it wasn't better than Fallout 3. Fallout 3 is still my favorite. Especially after Broken Steel. (Though, equippable Power Armor was only cool until "vehicular" Power Armor in 4, at which point the former became lame.)

[novel plank]

(Babylon 5 actually had a 5 year plan from the get-go! But JMS was told in no uncertain terms that there would be no 5th season, so he packed all of the remaining core plots into Season 4... Then the show was picked up by another network and he needed to cobble together a season 5 from all the left-over storylines he hadn't used. The series finale was actually the original season 4 finale, and the season 4 finale is the first production episode from season 5.)

[little linden]

Nolan doesnt have a writing credit either - he has directing and executive producing credits

[faint schooner]

I’ve been watching this show (with ||sex and nudity|| filtered/removed with Vidangel) and omg. That’s all I have to say is omg. I’m on the last episode. Im actually really enjoying it.

[lofty prairie]

So this isn't necessarily about the show but it's sparked by the show so I'll pop this in here

But with the popularity and sucess of the fallout tv show you think there's plans to expand to the other major titles like TES ? I'd love to see an elder scrolls series especially about the beginning like when humans first came to tamrial or the origins of the dadric gods or just the origins of all gods, or potentially a show set in the future to continue one the story after TES6

And even a starfield show tho I think we'd have to wait for one or two more games to cement the lore to give the show a baseline to start from

[faint schooner]

Saw this earlier:

https://youtube.com/shorts/LfuVMPRQGPw?si=K2IS52UESi3a4VsW

[lofty prairie]

Damn

[novel plank]

Based on other similar statements he's made over the years, it's not that he doesn't want to do things like that, but that he feels forcing them into existence is a recipe for a souless, disastrous endeavor that serves no one.

[ancient parrot]

can somoe help please

[vast lagoon]

Goosey McLain

[iron vector]

Benjamin is love

[cobalt badger]

Maximus is such a hypocrite lol. He literally ||kills Titus|| for being undeserving of his role and for being a bully meanwhile the second he gets into a || position of power|| he behaves just as poorly, ||he’s terrible to his squire and is power tripping hard|| I hope he either gets killed off of has a redemption arc because I find him insufferable lmao

[cobalt badger]

He treats elder scrolls so unfairly it’s annoying 😭

[torpid ermine]

Tbf, Maximus doesn't have his squire do all that bs for him and his squire was abusive towards him so of course there's animosity and power tripping there. But he clearly stopped when he felt like he got him back enough and talked to him.
Also he didn't kill Titus but just let him die

[torpid ermine]

Elder Scrolls adaptation would be weird asf lol

A starfield one would be pretty dope though I'm ngl

[cobalt badger]

Wdym? Maximus’ squire seems like a good guy, he hasn’t done anything deserving of the harassment Maximus is putting him through. He even considered ||killing him|| on the spot for no good reason.
And Maximus was indirectly the cause of ||Titus|| dying, instead of helping him he watched him die so I think he’s at least partially responsible. ||Titus|| was a jerk and arguably deserved it but that whole speech about “you don’t deserve to be a knight” was BS considering he’s awful to his squire too, makes him a hypocrite.

[little linden]

I mean hypocrites can be right

[waxen stump]

I've said it before and I'll say it again

(my personal theory)
||The yao gui scene wasn't planned. A real bear got on set, Moten panicked and grabbed his prop gun, which was most likely just some plastic built around a real gun, and shot the bear. Rapaport quit because of the incident but they kept it in anyway. I don't believe the scriptwiters would have him yell a bunch of swear words, even if Titus was meant to be a cowardly character. Those were screams of fear from Rapaport. I'm just glad the armour protected him. The reason Maximus seems so awkwardly written is because they didn't have enough time to completely rewrite Maximus' and Titus' story.||

[iron vector]

Potato, potato. Max killed Titus for his armor, that much is plain.

I don't know how much more direct you can get short of putting a gun to his head and pulling the trigger. Max literally sat there with the stimpak in hand, watching a guy he swore an oath to protect and defend, die because of his inaction.

[torpid ermine]

Have you finished the show?
Thad was also abusive and a bully, was he just supposed to forgive him on the spot? Not really how things work

[iron vector]

As for his relationship with Thaddy Bear, note that his antics stop entirely the moment he realizes Thaddeus singled him out to get out of getting bullied.

[torpid ermine]

Agreed

It kinda stopped beforehand too though

[iron vector]

Thus, entirely.

[torpid ermine]

Tbf, he may be a hypocrite but knight Titus was a straight up wuss

[iron vector]

Human relationships are complex things. I like the show for exploring that.

[torpid ermine]

I think Maximus used that armor more than Titus ever did

[iron vector]

I interpret Titus as a shell shocked Brotherhood veteran. Only so many suicide runs for a dilapidated toaster you can do before you lose faith in the organization.

You don't become a Knight for nothing, under any variant of the organizations hierarchy.

[torpid ermine]

I think everyone is demoralized by the current BOS, Maximus being an outright sign of that

[iron vector]

That's why I like to think th reason is they|| nuked Shady Sands.||

[torpid ermine]

You were granted title of Knight pretty easily in fallout 4 and 3 idk lol

[torpid ermine]

May want to censor that, but I agree, they were there right after it happened

Pretty sus

The NCR made them irrelevant in California and drove them out, pretty weird for them to be there

[iron vector]

But they didn't actually know what would happen, which means they were going for a knock out punch to seize Shady Sands and force favorable terms of a peace settlement. Except they were misinformed about th device, which wiped out their paladins and most of the veteran knights.

The funny thing is, in episode one we never see any armor until the Prydwen arrives and delivers the T60s

And the aspirants all but spell it out: the Brotherhood out West no longer has power armor.

[torpid ermine]

Yep

[torpid ermine]

Where is this from? We're not told much of anything when it comes to the Brotherhood's role after shady sands

[iron vector]

It me theorizing and extrapolating.

[torpid ermine]

Oh gotcha

Yeah the power armor is basically gone despite being in the flashback

[iron vector]

Huge history nerd. Plus, I feel like I earned after I called the intention to make APA pre-War in origin.

[iron vector]

Anyone not caught in the blast, plus there's years in between, with much of it probably lost to simple wear and tear.

[torpid ermine]

Probably scrapped it too

[iron vector]

Actually, I'll have to do a headcount in the episodes.

[torpid ermine]

Which the question remains, where is the main BOS base now?

[iron vector]

My theory always was that facing imminent defeat, Lost Hills transferred all command authority to Arthur Maxson on the Eastern Seaboard.

Which would be the point of sending the last heir of Roger Maxsons bloodline across a continent when he was a bloody toddler.

[torpid ermine]

That does make sense, now I wonder what happened to him

[iron vector]

Ah yes, Clerics.

A part of me sees the writers keeping it vague enough to keep hisbfate ambiguous.

Another whispers that it's a deliberate move by Maxson after he realized that religion makes for an effective mortar. A secular religion with him as the main prophet, and the clerics - scribes and elders - as his agents, becoming the salvation of mankind.

[torpid ermine]

It's always been kinda religious though

[iron vector]

Oh yes, absolutely.

[torpid ermine]

Fallout 1 and 2 were pretty on the nose with the religious overtones

[iron vector]

But it never really defined what the point of that religion was or how it manifested

It was mostly flavor. I think the Children of the Cathedral were better with portraying the religion and the belief in abetter world

I need a children tattoo.

[torpid ermine]

I think the children of atom or followers of the apocalypse played on it pretty well too

[iron vector]

Followers!

I'm a sucker for underdogs tho. Children of the Cathedral are so underappreciated

[torpid ermine]

Do we ever see them again? I'm pretty sure they disappeared lol

[lofty prairie]

Guys the cannon ending for fallout 4 is the minutemen ending as if you finish the BOS ending you become a sentinel aboard to prydwen and in the show you don’t see the soul survivor so the minutemen ending is the cannon one

[foggy fulcrum]

That doesn’t necessarily mean it’s canon, as they never really do anything with the Main player characters past the game they are in

[lofty prairie]

You never know if they might include them but it should tell you something about the minutemen or the BOS

Besides if the BOS was the cannon ending why is the prydwen in California and not the commonwealth what is it doing far from it’s original place

[torpid ermine]

Fallout 1 and 2

[foggy fulcrum]

That was the exception at the time, last I heard they didn’t like having to canonize events after that time.

[torpid ermine]

Of course, I was just yanking your leg and pointing out one

[dapper swift]

Brotherhood in the TV show would pulverise the minutemen

[torpid ermine]

Maybe the beginning Minutemen but once you join them and do that ending they become pretty legit and have the numbers

[dapper swift]

And the artillery

[ionic relic]

Let me tell you guys, that Fallout show was absolutely off the hook. You guys really nailed it first season. Can't wait to see what you do for the second.

[gusty seal]

Why didn’t the ghoul one shot Maximus when he fought him in power armor

[ionic relic]

Because they need Max still. Besides, he probably was out of AP ammo

[kind forge]

Okie dokie 😉

[terse sierra]

He ran out of explosive rounds, as we can see based on the color of the tip of the projectiles

also, power armor is bulletproof, as confirmed by the courier in vegas when talking with Ricky

so only rifle rounds and bigger would be a threat to power armor

[iron vector]

Bullet resistant, actually, nothing is bulletproof. And with Ricky it only referred to the eyepiece.

[iron vector]

Because he was in a good mood and/or hasn't fought a power armor in a while. It's not like you're instantly perfect with one hundred percent competence after being buried for a while. Also, just look at Goggins, he's laughing his butt off while fighting Max, and when he gets serious, he disables the armor in a few moves.

[torpid ermine]

Tempered lining probably helped

[lofty prairie]

Still looking for that mod.

[shadow heath]

Going to the next place it needs to go to? It is a mobile base - that mobility is what enabled Maxson to increase the Brotherhood's influence across the East Coast.

It wouldn't make sense to just have it stick around in the Commonwealth after its mission there is completed and a new target is acquired.

[ebon oracle]

||https://youtu.be/GttlVvy9fU0?si=ynGC1GYoAx8nKaDK || I got to hand it to TheEpicNate315. He saw this coming 3 years ago, and that video aged like fine wine.

[little linden]

Tbf, we know more they had the intent than an absolute guarantee

[late nacelle]

I just realised we watched a remake of the Wizard of Oz

[torpid ermine]

They had intent and conspiracy to but we don't know for certain

And imo, unlikely considering how they got caught with their cheeks out and unprepped

[polar bison]

|| I mean makes sense, you don't spend billions of dollars for nothing ||

[orchid rune]

It would be really funny if in season 2 it shows ||Vault tec all ready to go and nuke the world but someone else beats them to the punch||

[dapper swift]

Chairman cheng laughing maniacally

[novel plank]

This is more than likely what happened, based on in-game evidence.

[shadow heath]

With some vaults still being under construction, ||I doubt it was Vault Tec dropping the bombs.||

[bold pendant]

If you blindly throw darts at a wall, you’re bound to hit a target at some point. Someone who cranks out “The REAL secret behind [TOPIC] (not clickbait)” videos 24/7 is gonna be right about something eventually.

[ebon oracle]

🤷‍♂️

[lavish cosmos]

Watched the whole series over the weekend. Not bad, I was entertained. But I wasn't excited enough by it to be pumped to see Season 2 either, or to rewatch it. On a scale of thumbs up or thumbs down I give it thumbs up.

[lavish cosmos]

That idea has been around for a LONG time. I think it was at least 10 years ago if not longer that someone released on the web a screen treatment for a Fallout movie and it basically had that idea as well as to who the big bad guy was. Thinking back, the TV series had a number of similarities to that screen treatment, but that's not surprising since they are story elements that anyone could come up with and that make sense. If I had written it, I'd use some of those same ideas too.

https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout_film_treatment

[torpid tapir]

Watched the series twice, became addicted. Re-ignited my deep love for Fallout. Now I am spending countless hours back in the games and taking my sweet time taking in every single bit of information and lore to quench my thirst for season 2.

First time I played on PC since the console days and I just modded New Vegas to essentially Vanilla+ with 4k textures, Titans of The West mod, and some other mods and I literally cannot stop playing it's addicting.

The whole 50's sci-fi atomic-age is just so intriguing to me.

[lofty prairie]

Retro future style is nice

[pallid axle]

I would’ve been excited to see seasons with potentially other vault dwellers when I started the series, not that I didn’t love the characters. But I was still super excited when I learned it got renewed for a second season with the original cast.

[novel plank]

There are certain tried-and-true formulas to narrative drama, and one of them is that it's better if more of the consequences of actions depicted in the series are a result of your shown characters' than anything else. ||So, it's (theoretically) "better drama" if a character you're following is responsible for the Great War, like the Vault Overseer in the movie treatment, than if it were merely outside forces beyond their control and now they just have to live with it.||

The TV show is a far superior, and much less absolute, play on this idea. ||Lots of evidence that Vault-Tec was caught offguard... but knowing they had the motive, and the will, to do it is fascinating. ||

[terse sierra]

Bulletproof is actually a thing, as you can actually make materials heal over time, such as metal, heck, self healing concrete has been a thing for decades

specificly platinum can heal itself over time with 400 nanometers

so making power armor that is bulletproof would be way way pat easy peacey in fallout's setting

since remember, they invented tech that could make matter from nothing, so self healing metal would be easy,

also lead bullets can't penetrate through titanium

TLDR: Power Armor is a foot thick of plating, so it would block bullets without issues

side note, Vault 33 is the scariest vault in the show in my opinion, as holy heck!, that is way too many people in one area

[shadow heath]

||So what's the deal with the Clerics in the Brotherhood? They seem somewhat influential and new role of the Brotherhood.

Also, why are it Clerics teaching aspirants and not Scribes? Could Clerics be a mixture of the Scribes and like a religious view?||

[torpid ermine]

I think they're more of a west-coast brotherhood thing, meant to preserve more stuff and history and teach/learn vs the east coast that was way more militant and grabby

The naming convention and rankings jump around in the series, I wouldn't think too much about it tbh

[crisp grail]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/784546058381688912/1240319110320230501/image.png

[iron vector]

Power armor isn't even remotely near that thick of playing

[novel plank]

It can't be 1 foot thick. World War 2 Iowa Class battleships have armor that is 12.5 inches thick. Power armor is not a battleship, it's not even close to that thick. Even less than an inch of solid, appropriate material would have considerable durability against bullets.

[crisp grail]

https://twitter.com/falloutonprime/status/1790790926354587835

FALLOUT⚡️ (@falloutonprime) on X

Pip-Boys, Stimpaks, Cram—oh, my! The Fallout prop masters have an entire table of goodies to show us.

Twitter · May 15, 2024, 5:06 PM

[shadow heath]

But they got their orders ||from the ''highest clerics'' on the East Coast||.

[novel plank]

Eastcoast Brotherhood has a lot of new ranks in Fallout 4 as well. Could be they are still evolving the form of their new order.

[cunning snow]

||It may be smth that the entire council of elders elected to implement in all chapters going forward, and since Maxson in the Commonwealth would be a sitting member then the Boston boys might also have clerics in addition to proctors||

[bold pendant]

Idk if you know how metal works but the armor would not function if it was that thick

[livid leaf]

Judging by the movie, which FO4 ending would Yall say is Canon?
||Immediately ruling out Institute and Railroad cause the Prydwen wouldn't exist||

[novel plank]

All we know is those two are not Canon, and the others are all potentially possible.

[waxen stump]

Knowing Bethesda it's the Brotherhood

Hey here's a faction that's perfectly fine hiding out in bunkers, hoarding technology and only doing what's necessary to be perceived in a positive light by the average wastelander

But nah we'll just give them an airship, vertibirds, unlimited power armour

[livid leaf]

There's also the Minutemen radio at some point I think so maybe Minutemen?

Since destroying the BOS is optional unless you royally f up

[waxen stump]

I didn't even know the minutemen had an ending

[livid leaf]

Same as the RR and BOS endings except with minutemen and an option to give an evac order to the institute

Before making it go boom

[foggy fulcrum]

You do realize that Organizations evolve to have these types of things right? Midwest Brotherhood had Airships even before Bethesda. The Brotherhood are still Descendants of Pre War Soldiers, it makes complete sense they would evolve in time to become more militaristic.

[sick mantle]

thougths on the show?

[little linden]

They only hide in 2 and New Vegas, Their narrative in fallout 1 very much entails one day participating in the rebuilding of the world. 1 begins with them as isolationist, not hiding, and ends with them rejoining society, one way or another, 3 and 4 portray a second rejoining occurring under non-ideal circumstances.

[little linden]

Think it will never be deliberately emphasized too directly in the script but the direction so far is seemingly. Brotherhood ending portrayed as a terrible thing.

[potent vortex]

This show Incredible so far

[paper plume]

Does the show take place after Fallout 4? I was never clear on when the show took place, with regards to the Bethesda Fallout games

[iron vector]

The first episode states it's 2296.

[novel plank]

It is 9 years after Fallout 4 and is a canonical sequel that Todd has suggested future games may even acknowledge as having happened.

[wind seal]

mmm I have issues with this statement ngl

[crisp grail]

https://x.com/dasNeves_vfx/status/1791146141653897693

dasNeves (@dasNeves_vfx) on X

Fallout Visual Effects breakdown by Rise FX.

Awesome work! 👏

Twitter · May 16, 2024, 4:38 PM

[rancid aurora]

Can we put spoilers in this chat?

[broken crag]

Just please make sure to tag them by putting two | characters at each end ||like this||

[whole basin]

I hope we get to see liberty prime in the series

Or a deatclaw

[shadow heath]

Deathclaw seems quite likely, I also feel like super mutants will show up at one point or another.

||We see a Deathclaw skull in the last episode of season 1, and we see what is believed to be a dead super mutant under a cover in the Enclave base.||

[uncut pumice]

I now have a show Idea: Fallout Origins, based on all the original games. Season 1 takes place in fallout 1, season 2 takes place in fallout 2, season 3 takes place in fallout 3, season 4 takes place in new vegas, and season 5 takes place in fallout 4.

if they do this they better play this intro but changed up a bit for season 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpbEvVj7o3M

They better freaking finish the song from Louis Armstrong. Or at least finish the trumpet solo

That made me triggered when playing fallout 2, they just played the song and didn't finish the best part of it

[jovial stone]

uhhh no

thats too dangerous

[rancid flare]

Just finished the show and i loved it

[terse sierra]

It is a foot thick in the games, and halfa foot in the show, so it is a within logical change ratio

[novel plank]

It's nowhere near half a foot in the show. It's not a foot thick in the games. It's nowhere near that big.

Armor that thick goes on WW2 battleships and modern tanks fueled by jet engines.

Things that don't need to move like people.

[waxen silo]

Tim Cain (the creator of fallout) has a good video about "lore". Every game after fallout 1 "ruins" lore to some degree. https://youtu.be/UDfv3COnfgo?si=nhCqU1GlRKrz3V6V

[crisp grail]

Tim also has a great review of the TV Series

[lunar hawk]

Please remember to use spoiler marks

[clear flume]

Having not played the game before watching the series, I have to say that I enjoyed it. Can’t wait to see what the next season brings

[lofty prairie]

If Maximus could throw a good sized rock super far in power armor why couldn’t Titus have one or two punched the Yao Guai

[foggy fulcrum]

He was clearly not as experienced as we were led to believe, more that he was a pushover and when push comes to shove he couldn’t really fight.

[lofty prairie]

Oh

[clear flume]

It seems to me that Titus was nothing more than a bully and a coward and would use his squires to do his fighting. He would take all the glory when the squires were victorious and he would blame them for any defeat. It’s the classic schoolyard bully dynamic. But then again I’m no psychologist and this is all speculation

[foggy fulcrum]

It was stated he had squires under him who died before Maximus, so it’s clear he didn’t really value what it meant to be a Knight teaching his Squire.

[torpid ermine]

Why skipping fallout 2?

[little linden]

Yeah, it's also an exaggerated example of how the Brotherhood regularly are in Fallout.

Like it's notable Maximus' positive memory of the brotherhood is nostalgia of seeing them as a kid.

[uncut pumice]

crap hold up

[runic rivet]

I feel like Maximus couldve said that all of the stimpaks broke during the fight and said that Titus was dead and he had to use his power armor to continue the mission

[inner siren]

And some super mutants.

[raven wolf]

... what

[lunar hawk]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiR1wqF6IM4

[inner siren]

@lunar hawk Wow looks good.

[meager cliff]

Before playing the Originals and NV. Good. After? Ehh. I can see why people are upset. Still a good show though if you turn your brain off.

[raven wolf]

Really the motto for Bethesda made stuff

Turn your brain off and play

[willow jasper]

I’m excited for the diecast metal pip boy

[meager cliff]

Eh, For background noise. It is what it is.

Not a fan of shiny pip boys. I prefer the tablet 2000s to the wrist mounted ones as is, but making them shiny and silver is stylish sure, but i'd rather something more tactical

[little linden]

There are no tablet pipboys

The first two games just didn't show what pipboys looked like on the wrist. But it was always wrist mounted

[meager cliff]

Doesn't show on the player sprite. + Fallout bible said they're tablets.

[little linden]

Fallout bible isn't a lore bible. It's one writers notes that evolved over time.

Both fallout one and two and their manuals have the pipboy as wrist mounted

"handy device that you wear on your wrist"

[meager cliff]

Sure. Okay.

Looks better as a tablet, since it doesnt show on player sprites and cutscene models.

[little linden]

Sure, but it isn't really a tablet. It was just never rendered as an object till Van Buren development, which had it wrist mounted

[meager cliff]

That's fair.

[foggy fulcrum]

Not for me lol

[novel plank]

Half the fun of Bethesda's versions for me is that the game world as a whole makes sense but doesn't make itself obvious to the player. You need to uncover what is truly happening - Hell, even the Institute makes sense once you piece it all together from across the entirety of the Wasteland (and recognizing that its leader is an impulsively driven, emotionally charged liar in his later years).

In all of their games the player has the opportunity to make more sense of what is happening than nearly any of the NPCs ever will. Relying on the obvious information only tells a fraction of the story.

[foggy fulcrum]

I really dislike this logic of turning ones Brain off to enjoy something. As if one thinks about it this Logic can apply to every Fallout where Lore changes ever so slightly and annoys people or something doesn’t exactly line up in the story, which btw applies to non Bethesda Fallouts as well. Don’t forget there are fans who hated Fallout 2 and NV for their own reasons.

[meager cliff]

Thats like, your opinion man. But turning off your brain and just zoning out is how others can enjoy something. The way people consume things is down to them? Better to just turn your brain off than continue with the classic vs bethesda era total war going on right now.

[foggy fulcrum]

I’m just not one of those people, I prefer having my brain on and consuming while pointing out things that may have changed, especially after watching Tim Cain’s Vid on Lore Drift.

[meager cliff]

People using Tim cain as a stick to silence criticism is also annoying though. People can hold value of something however they want. Tim, todd, nobody can tell them how to consume and how to value it.

[foggy fulcrum]

I’m not using him as a stick to silence criticism, I’m aware he’s his own fan like Avellone is who hated the show and even he says he had criticisms, the difference is as he pointed out is he doesn’t let his criticisms come off as personal attacks to the people involved which I respect about him.

Tim Cain as a Person I love as he’s more calm and less angry, and he’s rather diplomatic in the way he speaks at times with encouraging people to be more respectful in their criticism.

[little linden]

Lore isn't really the core of the series brain imo

It's always been a themes and tone focused series

[foggy fulcrum]

I mean it still is as they connect newer lore to older lore at times.

But sometimes we get small Lore changes like Microfusion Packs I believe were what powered Power Armor in older Lore, but by Fallout 4 we had a Lore Drift and instead it’s Fusion Cores that Power Power Armor.

[little linden]

The connections are there. But it's not like hard sci Fi or similar where say. Those things are story defining or rigid.

Like if i were to explain Fallout as a series to someone new. the technical details arent high in the list of things to mention.

[novel plank]

For sure, I just tell people the general themes of the setting and what it's like. I don't go into minutia about Power Armor or the political machinations of the NCR and how they relate to Mr. House. Besides, the moment Fallout 2 happened splits began to emerge. We can't be the most ardent of lore adhirists or there'd only be one game in the franchise. :P

[little linden]

There are even splits in Fallout 1!

[lofty prairie]

If the prydwen is in the show assuming the brotherhood in 4 doesn’t die, doesn’t that mean Arthur Maxon should be there somewhere

Or does he die between 4 and the show somehow

[sinful scaffold]

I miss Snip Snip

[craggy flax]

Hi guys i want to ask how thadios survived the whole walk while his foot is squished like he was bleeding why not at least he fainted ?

Please answer

[tepid cedar]

Think maybe they worked with game logic, no matter how many broken limbs you have you are still not fainting and still able to move around.

[craggy flax]

Thanks but is there anything else ?

Like any other explanation?

[crisp grail]

irony is, it probably didn't start bleeding like that and falling apart until he took his boot off - that was probably holding his foot together

Now, no way in hell he got it all back on again - thats pure fiction

the other fictitious part was him walking putting any weight at all on it - but thats also game fiction as somehow a magic "stimpack" is gonna heal all ailiments

[crisp grail]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/784546058381688912/1243193715485446297/image.png

New VFX shot from Framestore - looks like most of it was practical for this sequence, just replaced the background

probably animated the tongue but maybe not?

[novel plank]

It's a reference model - the creature isn't practical on screen.

[crisp grail]

It was

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/784546058381688912/1243205681251614760/HON104_028_380_plt_vF009_1054.png

[novel plank]

What I'm saying is that it was digitized over in its entirety. They did a similar technique with Iron Man 1 and other things. It is a model that can move in a limited fashion so the actors can interact with something and it gives the animators a proper lighting/placement reference. The model is too stiff to hold up on its own (but I wouldn't discount that some parts of it probably get through to the final result).

[uncut trench]

Yeah, its a ref model, so it was there when it was shot but just for VFX to have a base to build the final gulper with

[uncut trench]

Just look at it, it doesnt look like the finished product

[crisp grail]

Thank you for mainspaining VFX to me 😂

[uncut trench]

its not Mansplaning. Variis told you it was a reference model and that its wasnt practically done, and then you posted again saying "It Was"

Idk what Mainspaining is

[crisp grail]

please leave me alone

[uncut trench]

The sensative type ok

[crisp grail]

Please leave me alone

Final product:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/784546058381688912/1243207215540867162/HON104_028_380_vF362_1054.png

[novel plank]

Yeah that entire set-model was digitally replaced. Lips are different, sheen is different, jaw muscle is farther back, I could go on.

[crisp grail]

Yup , though its nice when they build it practically versus relying entirely ona digi-double

[crude spear]

I would love to own a set of power armor from the show

Also do anyone know what the city is that the father was traveling to at the end is

[foggy fulcrum]

New Vegas

[crude spear]

I can’t wait for season two

[crisp grail]

Thats legacyefx and they do amaze-balls animatronics
(Baby-Yoda, Groot, Jurassice World, Endgame etc)

[crude spear]

Ah

[crisp grail]

i think I read they made 3 or 4 versions

only one was truly moveable - the others were used for background and whatnot

[lunar copper]

my thing is I wish they had a little better cgi

some parts are not that good

also where tf was all the other sets of power armor. Like wtf bro

[meager cliff]

Yeah, last i checked Ghouls only had extra healing when around radiation, and stimpacks don't heal shattered bones and smashed limbs, at least canonically, since stimpacks are made from stemcells, they're great for healing holes in you and slashes and gashes, but they wouldnt suck someone's bone back into their toe.

I still have no idea wtf the chicken guy gave to the squire.

Emil and the show writer probably had elderscrolls on the brain at the time or something lmao.

[little linden]

Emil didnt work on the show

[little linden]

where are they said to be made from stemcells?

[meager cliff]

He's in the credits as an advisor.

[meager cliff]

Their old lore says its a blank gene, combined with blood clotting and pain medication.

And blank genes are only found from stemcells.

[little linden]

where though?

[meager cliff]

Bible.

And i know it's not canon, but given theres nothing to dispute this. And stimpacks are rapid combat stims. It makes sense, given what stemcells do to injuries and diseses in real life.

[little linden]

not finding it mentioned

[meager cliff]

Doesnt say stemcells exactly, its genetic material, healing agents, stimulants, antiseptic, steel and coagulants.

Genetic material, well. You'd have to get certain stimpacks for certain people. Depending on bloodtype. Unless its a blank slate gene or they're harvesting 0 negetive bloodtype people.

However, given cloning people is something that exists in fallout, cloning a blank cell isn't exactly "Taboo" like stemcells are in our time.

Like, I know interplay liked to push boundries, with same sex acceptence and relations, uncommon in games from the 90s. But obviously saying outright stemcells are the "Genetic material" would draw the ire of fox news.

[little linden]

ye should have elaborated. he doesn't have a writing credit. The writers room was as far as I can tell was largely independent of Bethesda. - advising or producing roles seems to confirm that.

[drifting juniper]

I wonder if this'll ever be on cable or broadcast

[waxen silo]

I highly doubt it.

[whole basin]

Doubt

[novel plank]

I would buy a steel case set so fast though, lol.

[little linden]

It's got spots for commercials but may just be for Amazon ads

[novel plank]

It is.

[raven wolf]

I like how so many people like Walton Goggins' preformance because he is one of the best actors for western movies like Django and The Hateful Eight

[versed yoke]

He's not THE best Western actor but he's up there

Personally the king of westerns is clint Eastwood but goggins goes hard asf

[raven wolf]

hence one of the

[odd rampart]

Liberty prime will be in the tv series

[lavish pagoda]

i finished the series, pretty cool

[silent vigil]

W season 2 finna be w

[odd rampart]

dies

[void fractal]

Guessing I am the only one questioning how the || "overseers(all from vault 31)| did not know that vault 32 was decimated for two years. Especially his wife's Pip-boy was used for entry.||

Not this, they (Howard) claims that this is after the game story line... Fallout 4 began 210 years after < give or take from a few bangs on the old chronometer>

I believe I am confused, How many years have passed since the 'bombs' dropped and lucy's time?

[foggy fulcrum]

When you refer to bombs are you talking when the world ended?

[void fractal]

As inferred in Fallout 4, yes. As Howard has stated 'show is after the fallout games time line.

[foggy fulcrum]

Fallout TV Show is set in 2296, the year the bombs dropped is October 23, 2077

[odd rampart]

Where is everyones power armor

[void fractal]

So 219 years, thinking that there might be some overlap from vault 111, and definitely some conflict with the Brotherhood, ghouls, stim-packs, the Institute, Synths, ect...

[void fractal]

Sold off to finance this TV show

[odd rampart]

The truth is you've lost an expensive piece of army issue equipment

[void fractal]

Agreed, Something that was, and would be, hoarded by any sentient being who wanted to survive the wasteland.

[odd rampart]

Yep

[void fractal]

I would have thought that every ....O.K. MOST Vaults would have some stored away for the eventual exit into what all believed would be a hostile wasteland. Maybe Vault 31-33 has a hidden cache somewhere inside.

[odd rampart]

wanderer plays as I walk away

[void fractal]

I Believe Fallout 4's protagonist tiptoes around the Wanderer even mentioning in passing.

Was thinking that the Walton Goggins' character could be an artificial Ghoul, there was talk of a 'mutagen' serum that would protect against the radiation fallout that ended up making proxy ghouls without memory loss. These 'ghouls' could need to retake the serum on somewhat regular bases to survive. This would sort of answer this plot ploy.

[uncut trench]

Pretty sure its just the shows take on ghouls. Theres 2 other ghouls with the same issue, Rog and the women in the Super Duper Mart.

[void fractal]

And Vault-tec would not ever mass produce and possibly dedicate a vault for such an experiment?

[uncut trench]

Possibly. in F4 Hancock says he took some "experimental radiation drug," So I think its canon that a type of drug like that exists. But he isnt coughing up all the time and begging for meds to stop going Feral.

[void fractal]

Show plot. However, there could be all kinds of elements to this particular issue, such as the more exertion on the body burns up the serum faster. Both Hancock and Bobbi-no-nose, Arlen Glass were mostly sedentary, and whose to say they did not use.

[uncut trench]

Yeah it's possible, it's not a wild Idea for Coop. If I were going to bet on it I think he's just a survivor of the war, maybe we find out in S2 🤷‍♂️

[void fractal]

My hope as well, there are to many holes in the current plot line that beg for answers.

[uncut trench]

You think there are plot holes, as in mistakes? Or just loose ends that need answering in future seasons?

[void fractal]

Both, Howard says that Bethesda had very little input with the writing staff, so.

[uncut trench]

Yeah, they didn't write the show but they were there for any questions regarding lore working as advisors.

[void fractal]

When has that ever worked?

[uncut trench]

So what are you big gripes with the show?

[void fractal]

Time line, definitely an overlap with vault 111 occupant, Brotherhood as ragtag semi-religious (Church of the Children of Atom?), Lucy as a mult-generation breeding pen - why are there still definable races?

[uncut trench]

Why are their Definable races at all or just in vaults or vault 33 specifically?

[novel plank]

There's no overlap with 111 - it's 9 years after Fallout 4 and clearly the Brotherhood wasn't wiped out since that is the Prydwen.

[waxen silo]

I think it would also take a lot longer than 200 years for there to be no definable races.

You're also seeding vault 31 people every few years.

[crisp grail]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGzpfqH4jpw&t=1s

Whole bunch of VfX and SfX commentary w\ Director Jonathan Nolan & VFX Supervisor Jay Worth

[open epoch]

Man so the strip is dead huh

[keen frigate]

There's nobody here

||The strip was shown to be dead at the very ending of the last episode||

[open epoch]

That means nothing

Tho I am curious about the story for new vegas

Unlike most New vegas fans I want to see the story there continue

Km just happy for more new vegas

[iron vector]

It's just a pass through a stylized render of the location, like in every sequence credits.

[keen frigate]

But it’s canon. There’s no reason to randomly show that except to set up season 2

[iron vector]

Like, yeah, it's set up for Season 2. But it's not dead.

[keen frigate]

From what is shown, it is. There might be people inside but the outside area is desolate

[novel plank]

The towns had smoke coming from chimneys with intact homes all around New Vegas in the shot.

[cerulean warren]

hi, have you tried calling that Vault-Tec number?

[crisp grail]

having done post credit work, I guarantee you all the producers and Director Jonah Nolan all looked at that sequence 100 times if not hundreds of times more

Nothing just just thrown up there and there was probably anywhere from 5-10+ versions of New Vegas made

That said, I would not read too much into it and "dead" is really subjective

I know several VFX pods are trying to book VFX Sup Jay worth and hopefully we'll get to see some commentary from him about creating that New Vegas shot

Also worth noting that compression is a major problem in the industry, so that shot can look very different depending on what you are watching it on

[untold knoll]

If you do it in public with your speakerphone on, vault-tec will come and offer you a job, trust me.

[random solar]

I loved the series. I hope they do Season 2, and it doesn't take too long for it to come out

[novel plank]

Season 2 was confirmed a week after the premiere.

[marsh smelt]

mainly because it did so well

[high jetty]

I am re-watching the tv show and this time around I've noticed more mistakes.. the vault door button looks like a cheap gag button you get off amazon. Also when Lucy goes back to her place the controls to the door is a button, Wrong it's suppose to be a switch. There are a lot of things like this they get just a bit wrong, but over all I give the tv show an 7.8/10

also that nuka cola machine in episode 1 is soo bad looking.

One glaring flaw I find In all fallout stuff... Leaders of group A did something bad with most of the people in not knowing what they did and Group B attacks and wipes out Group A even though most of the people in Group A had no idea. Same thing with the TV Show.

You can't hold everyone in Group A accountable for the actions of it's Leaders. Especially if most had no idea.

[little linden]

idk that's a flaw. Collective punishment is a known horror of politics.

[novel plank]

I feel like the word 'flaw' is being dramatically inflated in this context.

[foggy fulcrum]

That’s called being Human, let’s say that Group A and Group B had peace talks going on.

A Select Few of Group A does not want peace with B and tries to kill important Members of Group B, failing or succeeding.

Group A tells them they didn’t plan this and those were renegades of Peace, but Group B doesn’t believe it.

That’s just Human Nature.

[high jetty]

The Right Solution would be to take out the leaders and let's not blame the people who had no clue what the leaders where doing.

Also Human Nature is just wrong in itself. Human nature can be cruel, mean, blood thirsty animals

Not every person on this earth for example gives in to human nature. just the savages

Collective punishment is wrong

[foggy fulcrum]

This is the Wasteland, you’d be surprised

[high jetty]

My character other than institute cause there was no other solution other than joining played the game as peaceful as possible. Only killed when shot at (if surrender option didn't work)

I left Railroad & BOS alone I didn't join and they left me and Minutemen in peace so I let them do their thing.

[high jetty]

Is it just me or at the begining of the show it looks mid-day bombs fell at 9am who is having a birthday party before 9 am ?

Anyone can clearly see the tv show should be loosely based on Fallout not cannon/lore. Like based upon that world not apart of that world.

This shows accuracy to fallout games is 6/10 at best

Great show, just don't call it cannon or set in that world, just based on it.

[foggy fulcrum]

🙄 Uh huh

[high jetty]

LOL you got your 3 types of people.. Die hard Fallout can't do no wrong, 2 people who enjoy fallout games and are sticklers for lore accurate things. 3. can take it or leave it. doesn't matter to them.

[foggy fulcrum]

This is kinda insinuating that those people who love Fallout cannot for themselves see that it is very accurate to the source material

[high jetty]

it's not though, so many inaccuracies

it's somewhat accurate sure but has flaws

[little linden]

fallout is ultimately pulp, lore details are not really the heart of the series.

[foggy fulcrum]

I’m a stickler for Lore Accurate but there’s a difference between expecting the people to remember every single detail and outright not treating the show as accurately as possible.

[high jetty]

like the whole who has a birthday party before 9am? Cause bombs dropped around 9am

[little linden]

especially things like vault details. they are jsut art choices that are very flexible

[high jetty]

that right there is enough for me to call it inaccurate

[foggy fulcrum]

That’s not really an Inaccuracy my guy, and the fact you use that one scene to paint the series as inaccurate is ridiculous

[high jetty]

your telling me people had birthday parties before 9?

[little linden]

have you heard or rich people, they exclucively have weird parties

[high jetty]

"Art style choices" can make things innacurate

[foggy fulcrum]

Considering the people were there early in the morning in the games themselves doing stuff before the Bombs dropped, it really isn’t that inaccurate

[high jetty]

I agree the show is good and is probably as close to accurate as we will get in a game to tv show adaption

[little linden]

im afraid the whole series is screwed then, fallout 2 threw out a lot of art choices in 1.

[foggy fulcrum]

Honestly yeah I was gonna say, Lore drifted as far back as the 2nd game, even Tim Cain admitted this

[high jetty]

I hated the placement of cars and bodies in fallout 4 cause they are not going to be at a drive in at 9am

[little linden]

art style has drifted a lot more than lore details

[foggy fulcrum]

Again I think you forget that people can be meeting up early in the morning.

[high jetty]

I made so many mods moving bodies and cars in fallout 4 to be more accurate LOL

[foggy fulcrum]

Otherwise the whole series is inaccurate, not just the show as you state

[high jetty]

yea I agree fallout 4 is inaccurate on some details

Pretty much where I'm coming from is here is what I expect to see and this is what I'm shown. same goes with fallout 4 and the tv show

[foggy fulcrum]

I wasn’t necessarily speaking about Fallout 4, just that when we get down to it, the games have always had inaccuracies but what is very clear is that people were doing things early in the morning before the Bombs Dropped.

[high jetty]

I guess I try to tie to much realisim into it. That's my problem

[little linden]

plus not everyone died at the precise moment the bobms drop

[foggy fulcrum]

Nothing is wrong with that necessarily, there are genuine complaints but I do think some have more weight than others

[high jetty]

yea, I can see that

That's one thing I never considered was people driving while the bombs fell.

it makes sense now that perhaps like starlight drive in people parked there to take shelter

[little linden]

also not everyone died immediately

[high jetty]

yea that's one thing I don't think about

[little linden]

Especially in fallout 4, Boston shambled for a while, folks died of radiation poisoning

[high jetty]

Now that I think about it, Fallout 4 is just a mess in itself LOL

[little linden]

Fallout's sensibilities are pulpy. a lot of basic parts of it are unrealistic.

[foggy fulcrum]

I mean Liberty Prime itself, Plasma and Laser Weapons… a bunch of it is unrealistic

[high jetty]

I guess taking liberties in the show isn't that bad. I just sometimes focus on things that I think it should be this way when in reality just look back at the games and they have their own issues.

[little linden]

radiation does not make animals big, nuclear bombs are a lot more nihilistic.

[foggy fulcrum]

The Rules of Fallout Work rather differently that’s for sure

[high jetty]

FEV could be real lol

[little linden]

FEV is really a handwave. some writers on the series considered using it as an explanation for all mutation, but thats.... boring

[high jetty]

I have the world of Fallout in my head and see it a certain way and when things don't line up with that vision it makes me pick on it, but in reality it's par for the course with how things have changed from game to game.

[little linden]

and counterintuitive when things are named RAD scorpion

[foggy fulcrum]

I like when it makes more than just Super Mutants which 76 did do and I’m happy they did because it’s cool to see whatever abominations FEV can make.

[high jetty]

Eddie winters.. Ghoul before ghouls where popular LOL

[little linden]

that and centaurs. Fallout 4 had story reasons to be more constrained but yeah

[high jetty]

anyways, back on topic, I think the show is pretty good and has sparked my interest in fallout again. I had stopped playing fallout for a long time then the show got me back in making mods and playing again.

[little linden]

I think what to keep in mind is fallout can be grounded, but its never particularly realistic. elements might ring true or come across as authentic.

[high jetty]

yea

[unkempt oxide]

I just thought of a subtle, but cute way the show can make a reference to Caesar’s Legion in S2. Just show some kid in Vault 21 playing with a Legate Lanius action figure battling Liberty Prime, or Frank Horrigan…

[crisp grail]

https://www.unrealengine.com/en-US/spotlights/magnopus-brings-amazon-s-fallout-series-to-life-with-virtual-production-powered-by-unreal-engine

[lofty prairie]

Wish the power armor didn’t have Ironman wrist boosters as a jet pack

[strong cedar]

same

[lofty prairie]

I just talked to Hancock in 4 abut his past and he said he took a experimental radiation drug that made him a ghoul

Could there be a connection??

[crisp grail]

https://x.com/DiscussingFilm/status/1798381577434812660

DiscussingFilm (@DiscussingFilm) on X

‘FALLOUT’ Season 2 is still in early development but will be “out as fast as humanly possible”

“We are going as fast as we possibly can, and we’ve got a lot of heavy lifting from Season 1 already done”

(Source: https://t.co/UDX9EX3B64)

Twitter · Jun 5, 2024, 3:49 PM

[marble yoke]

So that’s why the observatory set looked so fake

[crisp grail]

Yeah there are definitely drawbacks to using stagecraft/the volume whatever you want to call it

It’s a lot. Cheaper and better for the actors but it’s a thin line between looking good or bad

It’s so new - and the Mandalorian season 1 - the first to ever use it had IILM - not everyone can afford or use them

[little linden]

sort of predated by a handful of movies. sort of

but the show also seems to use it more selectively than a lot of the disney shows

[crisp grail]

It’s mostly the outdoor settings that is a dice roll - there were some shots in Boba Fett that looked equally horrible and it was the same team from Mando

[little linden]

I think Obi Wan had the most trouble with really being obvious how everything was taking place in the a soundstage. Especially city environments

[novel plank]

What killed me with the Obi-Wan series was that all the sets were the same size as the Stagecraft imaging. A duel pagoda? Circular of a certain size. A cave? Circular, same size. A briefing room? Circular, same size. A city street? Length determined by size of volume, thus feeling like the cave and everything else. A ship hanger? Functional space is the same size of the volume... and you could tell! It was painfully obvious for me.

It felt like set design was told the size of the volume and then just set everything to fit without looking for creative ways to differentiate it.

[dapper crane]

moldvader was a good person

[last crypt]

I am currently making a campaign for a fallout TTRPG using the 5e fallout source material and the wasteland wanders source material. i was wondering if anyone has any ideas or things that they wished were in the fallout games. maybe a certain weapon, armor, NPC, plot hook, or place? it is set in Cincinnati.

[crisp grail]

https://vimeo.com/936348626

From Refuge VFX - one of the VFX Companies for Fallout Prime

[subtle rover]

it's a mistake to make Power Armor fly like Ironman suits , it moves the world setting into a " superhero " territory which i doesn't fit the Fallout universe. And it makes bad plot twists , like the Overseer Hank escaping by flying away like Marry Poppins. And don't even get me started on that part where they made Power Armor fly zig zag thru the air like a ballon that's loosing air.

[lofty prairie]

Yeah it was horrible

[foggy fulcrum]

It definitely was strange, I’m so used to the Jetpack

[subtle rover]

a Jetpack is preffered , but still it won't make the suit fly , Jetpacks are tactical instruments , they are used to bypass a roadblock or if the fight would take place in mountain regions with a lot of uneven terrain. If you want Power Armor to fly then you need to look at aircrafts , attack wings , place a jet engine ( not jet pack )

[waxen silo]

I thought the jetpack was wonky in a way that's very fallout.

Also, Fallout 4 had a jet pack too.

[torpid ermine]

The guy who escaped with the tech was from the enclave

[lilac sequoia]

I dont mind the Jet wrists so much but I also hope they dont use it so much

[lofty prairie]

they have the enclave, they will have the X-01 appear, also do you know how many stories deep the enclave base is shown in the show? like 15+ stories

and the X-01 is my pfp

[rain matrix]

You want an oyster they make you feel so good-

[little linden]

The building filmed in is 8 or 9 stories tall

[ebon oracle]

I don't want them to rush creating the second season. I don't want them to mess up season 2, I'm willing to be patient as long as they take time to polish Season 2 of the show.

[true badge]

Given its amazon backed, I’d suspect they already filmed a bunch of season 2 while doing 1. Then they can just fill in stuff based on actor availability and feedback from 1st season.

[ebon oracle]

True, but stuff like rushing it can usually lead to many mistakes. Season 1's already perfect in it's own way that I am happy that Fallout got the treatment of making a faithful adaptation to the games unlike Paramount's hubris principle and the disregard for the Halo games.

[lofty prairie]

you mean deep?

and there was like 15 rooms on each floor

or smth i dont remember, been a bit since i watched the show

[little linden]

In the show it's a bunker. But the location the show filmed in is above ground.

[crisp grail]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZdfwHnFcrk

As always, FrameStore -

[mint comet]

Okay wtf 😳 was that ending?

[lofty prairie]

that doesnt look like a gulper, why there so many thumbs?

[shadow heath]

It's a new kind or something.

||It came from a vault.||

[plush quest]

gulper seems to be a catch all term for any mutated salamander like creature. Similar to mirelurks.

[ebon oracle]

https://youtu.be/z-2_OstpR5c?si=kR8YrJr4RRrfz3t3 I really wish and hope this music plays in Season 2 in case Lucy and Maximus meet again. First heard it in Samurai Jack, now I wish it would play in Fallout Season 2.

[lofty prairie]

what do you mean it came from a vault

[novel plank]

Watch the show.

It's a vault-tec experiment.

[ebon oracle]

I hope and wish the NCR ending to New Vegas is canon and confirmed in Season 2.

[uncut trench]

Does Mr House die in that ending? I dont remember. Ive got a feeling were getting more Mr House in S2

[ebon oracle]

Yeah he does. And the sad part is there was a cut ending in New Vegas where Mr House sides with the NCR. But since it's cut, it's not considered canon in the game and that makes me sad.

So I'm just gonna have to accept the possibility that Mr. House ending is canon. But I still wish NCR ending with factions still alive except the evil ones to be canon. One of the complaints about the House ending was not given the option to co exist with the Brotherhood.

So if Mr House appears in New Vegas in Season 2, then I would feel sad.

[uncut trench]

Maybe we just get more of him in flashbacks and not in current timeline of the show?

But if I were going to bet on it, Id say he's probably still going to be alive in the show.

[ebon oracle]

Maybe, but Hank went to New Vegas for a reason, and I know Mr. House is connected to all this. Mr. House doesn't seem keen on Vault Tec's plans, but might also explain why he was preparing for nuclear attacks on Vegas to defend.

[uncut trench]

Maybe the "Good Vault" That coopers wife is in is around NV and thats why Hanks headed there?

[ebon oracle]

Maybe. That's the possibility.

[uncut trench]

Maybe they setup that Vault over there because they knew about House's defense system against the nukes?

[ebon oracle]

Okay, hear me out. ||What if since the way Lucy lifted the NCR flag and the Fallout 4 theme play, and when she found out about Shady Sands, then suddenly realize what she remembered was not a projection of the fields with her and her mother but turns out she was at Shady Sands with her mother and was gaslighted into believing she spent time with her mother in a vault, and the way she's heartbroken about her father destroying Shady Sands and seems to be out with the Ghoul to seek justice, what if all this is foreshadowing that she might eventually help rebuild the NCR just as the Vault Dweller from Fallout 1 help Tandi and her father found and build the NCR?||

After all, ||maybe Lucy would do her own reclamation day her own way of rebuilding society but not under vault Tec themselves, not following the lies of Hank, but making her own beliefs come true and maybe have her future children help manage the NCR, but not what Bud Askins would want to happen, defying Vault Tec's plans and rebuild America their own way?||

[ebon oracle]

WARNING, TLDR STUFF IN THE SPOILER MARK. I watched Oxhorns videos and other YouTubers about the lore in Fallout. Then I saw one commenter on YouTube comments make an interesting theory, so I pieced it together what the possibility of what is going to happen (though not confirmed) that ||the foreshadowing of Lucy holding the NCR flag might foreshadow her as a Vault Dweller help rebuild the NCR (even though the NCR according to Todd is not eradicated and have not seen the last of the NCR) and maybe in the long run, she avenges Shady Sands, somehow brings her father to justice however it may be resolved, and just as originally intended to help "Save America" by helping the NCR and when she lives in the NCR, she might become elected as President of the NCR, indirectly kinda making Vault Tec's apparent vision of having super managers to rule over the wasteland (but not really) if Lucy who did found out about the apparent lies Hank has been telling her and the real truth about who her father is, will defiantly do what she was apparently taught to believe in, restore civilization and have her own reclamation day her own way, and just like from Fallout 1 and 2, she helps relive the glory days of the NCR, and when she becomes president, she'll be as most revered and beloved as President Tandi was during her entire life as presidency and the NCR would flourish once again. Lucy would also find a way to broker a truce with the Brotherhood as she would've wanted to find a way to deescalate conflicts just like how the Brotherhood were once at peace with the NCR and can possibly be made into a truce in Fallout: New Vegas. Eventually in the long run though, Lucy's presidency and her bloodline will sadly not last and just like Tandi, they would all pass away and once again, the NCR would be in decline and war with other factions such as the Brotherhood would begin once again since it's a never ending war for survival and war for rebuilding civilization, and the wasteland will always be plagued by war because true to the Fallout theme, "War Never Changes".||

[real topaz]

I ❤️ the fallout tv show

[pliant mural]

I watched the show and it’s so bad.

They destroyed progress and the reason they gave was ‘we wanted to keep everything a wasteland’

This is the same company that must not believe in continuity as they can be quoted saying they won’t adhere to something written 20 years ago, even though that’s how you keep consistency

[foggy fulcrum]

Funny thing is you say this and yet the original devs actually planned to destroy Shady Sands

[pliant mural]

And it was ass either way, I would be fine if Bethesda put in the legwork to give them replacements but no, nothing will ever change and it will always be a wasteland

[foggy fulcrum]

I really think it’s whatever, because Humanity is doomed to repeat it’s mistakes as it is. The show being considered bad for that alone tho doesn’t really make sense

[pliant mural]

Still though, the Fall of Shady Sands taking place before NV doesn’t make much sense

[foggy fulcrum]

Actually it didn’t, it was already explained the fall was more the beginning of the end

[pliant mural]

Use the historical context of fall

I also want the standard of writing for Fallout to improve

[foggy fulcrum]

In the Fallout TV series episode "The Trap," a chalkboard in Vault 4 lists a timeline of events. The "Fall of Shady Sands" is dated to 2277, suggesting that some sort of societal decline occurred at that time. The next event is a drawing of a mushroom cloud with no title or date, representing the city's destruction. The show does not provide any further information about the timeframe for the nuclear bombing or the nature of the "Fall of Shady Sands," which many viewers took as an indication that the two events occurred in the same year, contradicting lore established in Fallout: New Vegas. Post-release interviews with Todd Howard confirmed that the city was destroyed shortly after the events of New Vegas, suggesting it happened close to 2282. The detonation occurred after Rose MacLean left her Vault, and Maximus was a child when the city was nuked, now a young man by 2296.

[foggy fulcrum]

People say it did with the show, but at this point I’ve learned to just not take differing opinions on writing so seriously anymore depending on certain factors

[pliant mural]

I just want things to be consistent and interesting, I want to be able to role play like I could on previous Fallout games

[foggy fulcrum]

Because imo it’s not worth it if the opinions widely vary on certain shows/movies, games, exc, while others are more in line to agree.

[sturdy tundra]

The fall of Shady Sands was already going on before NV by Chris Avellone's own statement

He even specifically said that "yeah it's time for it to fall apart, it's gotten too big and powerful"

The NCR was already dealing with corruption in F2 and by FNV Tandi's example was dead in the ground.

Humanity making the same mistakes over and over is literally one of the main points of the series.

War. War never changes.

[foggy fulcrum]

That they do my friend

[sturdy tundra]

The NCR was always going to fall for one reason or another, now it's the Brotherhood's time to be the new major power, which we already know off the bat is going to splinter to hell for much the same reasons that every other corrupt organization has.

Likewise the Enclave, whom the Brotherhood are basically replacing in practice, comes and goes

malignant tumors old and new, growing in the ashes and radiation over and over, resulting in the same issues over and over. War never changes.

It's fundamentally about tribalism, and the attempts to overcome it.

It was never important who launched the nukes in Fallout, the point was why, what created such a messed-up situation.

[pliant mural]

Fallout doesn’t make any sense anymore, I enjoyed the old lore but now I must be constantly reminded it doesn’t exist anymore, the Enclave is back despite being dead in the West, the Brotherhood is back despite being dead in the West, Vault Tec is back despite being dead everywhere.

[sturdy tundra]

The Enclave has never been dead in the west and the Brotherhood was making its expansions during its former height of power before Maxson's reforms

[foggy fulcrum]

Bro… the Enclave was made out of Former US Government and Soldiers, has it ever occurred to you the Government would have multiple branches and not just one?

[pliant mural]

Fallout 2, in NV we meet the Remnants and they’re a bunch of 80 year olds going out for their last glory ride

[sturdy tundra]

We meet the Remnants of the New California Enclave, yes. They have forces elsewhere and did even in F2's time.

The show has been hugely successful and beloved by fans and newcomers alike, it got greenlit for season 2 basically a nanosecond after it dropped. You're the one who doesn't like the show, you don't speak for anyone else.

[pliant mural]

I will say, if you only play 4, the show is great, if you play anything else it sucks

[foggy fulcrum]

Tim Cain loved it lol

[sturdy tundra]

Speak for yourself, I've played most of the games new and classic alike and I loved it.

The show does a good job of actually following through on its lore, not just leaving it to gameplay abstractions.

[foggy fulcrum]

But I guess people will call him a traitor to lol

[iron vector]

Maxson is far more progressive than Lyons, though, who got promoted way above his level of competence and ran his chapter into the ground.

[little linden]

Writers room isn't Bethesda. A few Bethesda leads had advising or producing roles. But the NCR story has been stated to be the showrunners idea fully

[little linden]

Late but think one of the BTS videos explains the choice, they had a stunt actor in an actual jet suit - ie arm mounted:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlDivX4AIis

At the 2 minute mark

[iron vector]

Someone paid attention to Van Buren tbh

[crisp grail]

Yeah, amazing work by Gravity Jet- https://www.instagram.com/takeongravity

with a real jetpack shot on set, makes it so much easier to composite the shot together with the actual power armor , later.

[wise zealot]

Loved the TV show. I wonder if Fallout 76 trailer song wouldn't it be Nice by the beach boys fit for the TV show or not?

[cobalt helm]

I loved the tv show. It would be cool if they used another type of power armor

[sturdy tundra]

It makes sense that they only budgeted for one design given it was season 1 of a major undertaking (a videogame adaptation alone has historically been dicey), they weren't gonna go too all out on a risk

Lore-wise the BOS are moving over to the T-60 as their typical suit anyway so only showing the T-60 keeps things that little bit more within budget (both in terms of money and manpower)

Season 2, though, will likely be much freer, they know they've got a good thing going and they can reuse props and other assets they already made for S1, and given we're off to New Vegas, it's quite possible we'll see T-51's from the Mojave chapter and the stripped-out NCR T-45's

Possibly even X-01's and 02's if the Enclave feel like coming down looking for Dr. Wilzig

[foggy fulcrum]

It’s so weird hearing that name because I know the Enclave has German Aesthetics but they are American, which is the Irony lol.

[novel plank]

Feels like a lean-in to Project Paperclip.

[ebon oracle]

I hope the NCR ending in New Vegas is canon in Season 2.

[storm dock]

I kinda miss the institute

[red forge]

They have no plot presence in the show, yet. They're also based on the other side of the country.

[storm dock]

I know they are in Boston but the brotherhood blimp is here that means the institute was destroyed

[red forge]

There's a conundrum at the moment where some things seem to be implied, but I think some things there's no confirmation yet. The presence of Prydwen is throwing off a lot of people and bring a number of plot arcs into question.

[crude lagoon]

https://youtu.be/-AKgODS2zEo Full comprehensive review of season one.
This has been in production since the show came out and I'm super proud of it. Any viewership would be greatly appreciated.

[sturdy tundra]

Not necessarily, it just means the Prydwyn never ended up destroyed or was rebuilt

And strictly speaking, we don't know that it's still Arthur Maxson flying it, because they never said who gave the orders besides "the High Elders in the east"

And given it's plural, it could well be even Arthur's dead or otherwise out of the picture now. Otherwise it just means he's expanded his council.

They might even pull a fast one and essentially canonize everything to some extent, so the Boston expedition turns out to be a mess for everyone and they don't have to specify what happened when

[wise zealot]

I wonder if the Enclave base where Wilzzig worked at has Enclave Hellfire armor X-02 X-01s if they did then the producers could have added them ||If cooper went to West Virginia Vault 63 I wonder if the residents there these are ghouls/lost will accept him because he is a ghoul like them|| spoiler is added due to Skyline Valley Fallout 76 content

[crisp grail]

https://x.com/ign/status/1805201979389390878

IGN (@IGN) on X

Mr. House "will be involved" in Season 2, say Fallout showrunners. https://t.co/QejnUILMKY

Twitter · Jun 24, 2024, 11:31 AM

[hollow linden]

Alright; people are gonna think I’m some NMA dude for saying this…but I am not thrilled about this given how much I dislike the retconning in the first season of this show

They don’t get Mr. Houses character

The || decision to have him be in on some goofy vault tech conspiracy to end the world || is terrible writing and just ruins his character. The whole point of Mr House is that, he’s not a good guy obviously but also is smart and opportunistic enough that the player may side with him thinking he will be a benevolent dictator that will do some good in spite of the autocracy

The || Vault tech conspiracy reveal || is garbage and I just can’t take the show seriously. I get why people like the show, but it’s not an addition to the universe I like

There seems to be a tendency among some people in the FO fandom to write off anyone who critiques the show or FO4 as some mindless “obsidian fanboy” or something.

It’s okay to not like the current direction of a series. And it’s okay to voice those critiques as long as you aren’t toxic about it

[shadow heath]

Yeah, imo I can kind of get writing House as they do in the show, but it forces us to look at his character in a very different light.

[hollow linden]

The whole point of NV is ”damn all these options are bad in some way” and then the player having to decide whether House or NCR is the less bad option out of the two

I want moral grey in Fallout. I want intelligent writing and world building that makes the player wrestle with moral dilemmas.

I don’t want ||”evil corpo end world for profits”|| reductive writing

Interplay was mismanaging FO. They made that awful Brotherhood of Steel game and cancelled Van Braun.

I am grateful that Bethesda resurrected the series with FO3 and let Obsidian make NV.

But the way they have managed this series since then is not to my liking:

Why turn a beloved RPG into a looter shooter with FO4. Why take away the things people like about this series. Why refuse to let any other studio make an FO, and just sit on the series for 10+ years while you work on Starfield and TES6?

If someone took the Doom IP and turned it into some Point and Click narrative adventure game; of course fans of that IP would be mad.

People don’t like FO4? Of course they don’t, you turned a beloved RPG series into a looter shooter where there isn’t any player agency in terms of narrative design

There are obviously toxic people who share my opinions. And I don’t approve of their behaviour.

But there is also a certain Toxic Positivity I see where anyone who critiques Bethesda fallout is dismissed as a No Mutants Allowed troll

[foggy fulcrum]

Personally I’ve just learned It’s best not to care how certain people feel, because everyone can never be on the same page. Everyone has different ideas on what a person’s character is vs another and at that point I just check out because it starts to get ridiculous.

[hollow linden]

Yeah, at this point, I’ve stopped caring about new FO stuff. I’m probably never getting another game like NV or FO2, but that’s obviously not the end of the world. It’s just a video game series after all, and I’ll just play other games instead

Everything good must come to an end, after all

[foggy fulcrum]

It’s more that I’ve learned from my various times in Fallout and Star Wars, that whatever is considered good is considered bad, and what is considered bad is considered good by so many different camps that at some point you just learn everyone is just so different on how they perceive something.

[hollow linden]

Yeah, I agree. People obviously want something different out of it than I do.

It’s why I don’t put much stock in some new product having the word “Fallout” in it.

[foggy fulcrum]

Even Games that are critically acclaimed have people who don’t like them for specific reasons, same with shows or movies, obviously there can be cases where something can be looked at as bad by everyone all together but outside of that where people are on these different camps

Point is, someone is always gonna lose in what they want vs others, the sad reality is that everybody cannot be happy.

[hollow linden]

I feel like, Atlus kinda proved you can please everyone when they split Persona and Shin Megami Tensei series into two. SMT and Persona used to be the same series, but now different. And it worked out well. Both Persona and SMT are successful and have their own audiences

I don’t get why Bethesda won’t do that. I’d love to see both types of FO fans get the games that they each want. Make a lower budget isometric game for the Obsidian fans and also FO5 for Bethesda fans. Everyone wins

[foggy fulcrum]

I mean yes, but the issue comes from the fact that most spinoff’s they make now are mobile games of some kind, which doesn’t make sense to me

[hollow linden]

I think MS can def afford to do it. Even Sega/Atlus can do it, then def the Trillions dollar companies like MS could

[foggy fulcrum]

They could, but I also think Microsoft has given Bethesda more freedom than directly getting as involved as possible with that they do

[hollow linden]

I’ve heard murmurs that discussions about a New Vegas 2 are happening at MS tho. But I guess it depends on how much MS wants it, and even then, Obsidian and Inxile are busy with their own projects, so I don’t even know who could work on it. It is a bummer they closed Arkane Austin cuz that was a studio that maybe could have done it idk

[foggy fulcrum]

Not necessarily New Vegas 2, but another game on the West Coast is the idea

[hollow linden]

Yeah, a west coast game would be great. And it doesn’t have to be some huge flashy AAA game. It could just be a neat AA game that’s more of an RPG

But that’s unlikely. Eh, I guess I’m done with FO as a series. As the saying goes, All good things must come to an end.

[little linden]

I feel like the answer to this is we have gotten the split people hyped up as a potential of the Xbox purchase: one hand is the show

The other hand is the franchise tie ins

[foggy fulcrum]

Tbh I never expected Fallout to ever go into the realm of TV, it may just open up the door to doing more beyond what we have.

[hollow linden]

So Bethesda is hyping up series for when they sell more games to people? But that only works if we get new FO games soon and not the insane BGS schedule

[little linden]

I'm saying the show is an example of Fallout in non-bethesda hands

But also it is increasing sales of the games.

Biz wise the tv advantage is that, games make more money per customer, but tv draws in more people. And costs less to make than big projects. The games are an existing thing for new audience members to possibly purchase.

My suspicion Biz wise I think the issue is any studio free enough to work on a new project is probably the same sorta studio that might be on the chopping block - ie one without any imminent release to draw in money

[hollow linden]

Yeah, I can’t think of any team that is available. Maybe Obsidian makes one after Avowed? Cuz I know they have two separate teams for Avowed and Outer Worlds 2

[little linden]

Yeah that's where I personally am, I don't feel hungry for more games ATM - but interested where Fallout can go. And more optimistic about tv than games as businesses.

[hollow linden]

It’s been 15 years since NV. Ngl, I’m hungry af for a Fallout RPG ( I don’t consider 4 an RPG imo )

[foggy fulcrum]

The thing is I have said this before but RPG’s are not just about choices as much as people like to harp on that particular aspect

[hollow linden]

I consider JRPGs RPGs but not FO4

It either has to have tactical stat-based gameplay or it has to let the player role play as any character

FO4 is pretty much a shooter with stats tacked onto it. It’s not a knock against the game, it’s fun in its own way if you approach it that way

But I can’t lie. I don’t consider 4 an RPG and sorely miss RPGs set in the fallout universe

[little linden]

I've never approached it as a shooter 🤷‍♂️

[hollow linden]

In order to have a series vary so wildly in genre without pissing people off, you have to split it into sub-series

Imagine if Nintendo decided that after Paper Mario, every Mario game would be an RPG. That’s really silly, right?

But Bethesda have an all-or-nothing approach that just splits the fanbase. Why not give everyone the games they want

[hollow linden]

I tried really really hard to approach it as anything but.

But it is only enjoyable as a looter shooter. Because the writing is so poor imo and the game simply doesn’t give the player any agency in shaping their character or the narrative

[little linden]

I've never clicked with looter shooters. I think fours story is narrow at the start but pretty happy with the range when it opens up. At least for the main three factions. But ultimately I think the base gameplay is an expansion of what I liked starting the series with NV. Exploring, living as a character in the setting. Building mechanics aided that a lot. Survival moreso.

And Far Harbor I was all around satisfied by.

[hollow linden]

And that’s fine. FO4 is enjoyable as a post apocalyptic survival game with base building

I just think it’s so divorced from what NV, that they feel like two games that feel like each is from an entirely different series

Again, I understand the appeal of 4 and why people like it. But it and NV are miles apart

Hence why Bethesda need to just pull an Atlus and split the series into two already. Let both FO4 fans and NV fans get a successor to the games they like. More Fallout games for more types of FO fans

Hey, if Sega/Atlus can do it with SMT/Persona, why not Xbox/Bethesda 🤷🏻‍♂️

[little linden]

Eh, those elements are an extension of things already present in nv

[hollow linden]

But NV clearly puts narrative choice at the forefront whereas 4 does not

[little linden]

I think we just see it differently.

[hollow linden]

Yeah, it’s all just video games at the end of day

MS would be crazy to not capitalize on FO. At the end of the day, if more studios get to work on more fallout games, then the fans win. Instead of having to watch 10 years for FO5 to even get trailer

[errant crow]

Greetings again! It seems I might be asking a very dumb lore-related question but... what was actually the point for mrs. Lee Moldaver to hunt for that "cold fusion powerplant tech" in 2296? That powerplant wouldn't have rebuilt Shady Sands. Nor would it by itself magically solve the problems with raiders, monsters or BoS occupation of Los-Angeles. Either it wouldn't by itself provide food, clean water, basic necessities. Then what was the point of it being treated like "hey thats the very thing that would save everyone"? O.o

[shadow heath]

It may be she wanted to recreate Shady Sands and use infinite free power as an incentive for people to move there.

[red forge]

I was of the impression that it's a ploy to say cold fusion could replace the tech that fusion cores are manufactured.

[little linden]

I think her particular focus is a combination of living pre-war, where energy scarcity was a primary source of conflict. as well as it being something she herself worked on.

[dusk sigil]

I think she may also want to keep it out of the hands of the other factions, because they wouldn't share with the common wastelanders

[unborn notch]

Lucy is bad asl

[sick mantle]

it does not matter if you like or dislike the tv show you cannot deny the undeniable fact that it retconned the ncr

[errant crow]

Well, mr. Todd Howard himself later clarified that NCR took a blow but they still exist. City of Shady Sands (the capital) is shown gone. And that plot twist wasn't actually invented for the show - it was taken from "Van Buren" - Interplay's early 2000-s era attempt at making Fallout 3 (Caesar's Legion's concept also originated from Van Buren)

[sick mantle]

The NCR is now widdled down to a practical group of Raiders
Interplay doing is ok cuz that would have made because It would have been the 3rd game And without much yet

It could have simply been nuked after 2

That dosen't really retcon ANYTHING because 2 was the farthest game in the tl

[errant crow]

NCR was dozen of cities with more than 700 000 people population. Not just the city of Shady Sands

[sick mantle]

It would have been important
And recovery would have been worse

Not only that the fall of shady sands And the ncr wanting to Bring power to it in do nv

Fo*

[sterile torrent]

It is ok to have a lively debate over things, but please refrain from insulting anyone.

[foggy fulcrum]

I honestly don’t buy that, Fallout Fans as it is are rather sensitive about their factions going up in smoke. Honestly them doing it would have likely led to anger on some fans part as well.

Saying Interplay doing it is okay doesn’t work.

[foggy fulcrum]

A Retcon is something like Fusion Cores existing by Fallout 4 when there was no indication they existed in prior games. The NCR’s capital being bombed is not what a retcon is lol.

[sick mantle]

Fall of shady sands i meant

Got confused lol

[hollow linden]

I don’t care if Interplay or Nolan is the one doing it. I hate the idea of nuking Shady sands

It’s boring. It shows that the world can’t change and move past rubble. The decline of the NCR should have been done though the internal socio-political breakdown of its society. In NV, you get a sense that NCR is rotting from the inside from corruption, inflation, dwindling resources etc

The NCR falling apart due to those socio-economic factors is more interesting and compelling than “lmao shady sands nuked lmao”

I do not care about “Interplay vs Bethesda” fanboy wars

The TV show took the simplistic and dumb way to make the NCR fall. And it’s just not interesting or befit for a series that had intelligent writing in NV

My issue is that the TV show is a massive downgrade from NV because it lacks nuanced and intelligent writing

There isn’t any moral grey in the Show

I’ve given up on this IP tbh. NV will never be topped, I feel 🤷🏻‍♂️

The TV show isn’t a “retcon” and there obviously isn’t any silly “conspiracy to retcon” like some Redditors believe

But what I think is happening is that the series is being dumbed down in its story telling. With the TV show and FO4 going for far less nuanced approaches to portraying conflicts and motivations in the wasteland

I don’t think Bethesda has the same priorities when it comes to designing games that work well with Fallout 🤷🏻‍♂️

Intelligent story telling and narrate choice has taken a backseat to open world exploration and looting stuff. And sure; I get many of you like that. But fans like me have been sorta left in the dust. I don’t see why they can’t make games for both parts of the fandom 🤷🏻‍♂️

Imagine, if you will, if Sega decided to just not make any more 2D Sonic after Sonic Adventure came out. Meaning we wouldn’t get Sonic Advance series or Sonic Rush or Sonic Mania. That would have been lame

If you change the formula of a game series without giving the fans of the older formula anything, people get angry. This is not to excuse the toxicity some people have displayed towards other people of course, as that I think is obviously unacceptable

But I do think it’s inevitable people complain when you turn na RPG series into a looter shooter

[little linden]

Bethesda wasn't that involved in the writing - Todd has already mentioned it was a showrunner decision

[hollow linden]

I know that, but Bethesda has engaged in the same dumbed down approach to story telling in FO4

The level of writing in FO4 is not good. It just isn’t. I respect the hard word that BGS put into 4, and it does have a good gameplay loop. But the game completely fell on its face in the writing department, it’s not a controversial thing to say

Fallout as a series now encompasses to wildly different types of games that people expect. And instead of accommodating both sides of the fanbase, the motto seems to be ”if you don’t like post-apocalyptic themed Skyrim with Minecraft mechanics, then too bad” and that sucks

[little linden]

I don't really care for having the same conversation again in the tv show channel TBR

[hollow linden]

I think the series need to split like SMT/Persona, and I keep harping on this point.

And I will continue to do so; cuz like it or not, half the fanbase aren’t happy

[hollow linden]

Well, this is how I feel as a fan

I respect BGS, and think Todd Howard has contributed many great things to gaming

But I am not happy with the direction of FO. I gotta be real

I’m grateful FO3 happened, cuz the IP would have died otherwise

And we wouldn’t have gotten NV as a result

[errant crow]

Quote: "FO4 going for far less nuanced approaches to portraying conflicts and motivations in the wasteland (изменено)" - FO4's BoS - Institute conflict AFAIK is rather good written. Not less than FNV's NCR - Legion was, actually. In FO4's BoS - Institute it was basically the same "battle over valuable resource" that resource being advanced technology and with both faction championing different ideologies and codes of ethics over how to handle power, coming from advance science and tech. However, the Railroad as main faction ... is less logically sound and the Minutemen plotline .... well, that's ..... odd.....

[hollow linden]

You can’t deny that half the fanbase don’t think that the writing in FO4 is a worthy successor to the quality of writing of NV

Even people who are fans of 4 agree that NV has stronger writing, but they like 4 for different reasons

[little linden]

We're not on the admins of the IP. Why would the fanbase polling matter to us

I think the big concern I have writing wise is getting more corporate from above or below. From above that's increasingly a concern in games and less a concern in tv post-strike. - Season one was mostly produced pre-strike where there was a lot of messiness in streaming show writing. From bellow. The less the writers are thinking about their work as in service of the IP the better.

[hollow linden]

Well, this is the official BGS discord, and I’m respectfully expressing how I feel about the direction of series as a fan

[little linden]

We're all fans

[hollow linden]

Yeah, like I said: I’m happy that FO4 has made millions of players happy and was enjoyed by a lot of people

I want both parts of the fanbase to get games that they’ll love. Just like how Shin Megami Tensei and Persona fans are still catered to by Sega. Why can’t Bethesda and MS do the same for both styles of Fallout games

[errant crow]

Well, as for me at least part of it is pretty much on level with FNV. However, not in case of Minutemen .. their story is unfortunately lamely and badly written 😦

[hollow linden]

FO is big enough of a franchise to support two styles of games

[little linden]

IIRC it's basically there was no dedicated minutemen dev team. Or there was at some point but it well apart.

[hollow linden]

If a Sega can do it with SMT/Persona, then MS, the biggest company involved with gaming, definitely can

FF is another good example. FF16 is more an action game, but the FF7 remake is still more for RPG fans

Both types of fans serviced

[little linden]

As I said the other day, think it's unlikely in the near future. MS seems to be looking at gaming as a money sink they are trying to cut down costs on.

[hollow linden]

The bought Activision, and are making a ton of game pass. It’s the physical Xbox consoles they are cutting down on

Less fallout games for less fans seems like a terrible business move. Especially if we are expected to wait 10 years for FO5

Give fans what they want. I want to give Bethesda my money

[errant crow]

AFAIK the move from isometric RPG with turn-based system to 3D-shooter type combat and first person view was due to isometric turn-based games unviable on XBox.... I may be wrong but heard that version

[hollow linden]

https://tenor.com/view/money-dollars-cash-rich-shut-up-and-take-my-money-gif-3555042

[hollow linden]

I just want an RPG with narrative choice, I don’t care if it’s isometric or not

[errant crow]

Narrowed choice?

[lunar hawk]

Let's try to stay on topic please. We have #fallout-general-chat for non-tv Fallout chat

[foggy fulcrum]

I know you say that but Some games have changed it formula permanently, Resident Evil never used to be first person or over the shoulder and now they no longer have the fixed camera angles that was part of classic Resident Evil.

[hollow linden]

But it’s still survival horror tho. Just from a different perspective

They tried to make RE an action game with RE6 iirc and people hated that

[foggy fulcrum]

You’d be surprised the amount of people who want that Fixed Camera Angle style back.

[hollow linden]

I don’t care about isometric vs first person, I just what narrative choice and consequence

A game centred on that

FO4 isn’t centred on narrative design or choice. Its focus is clearly exploration and loot/building. Players love the game for that, and I think that’s great there is a title enjoyed by many people

But I still want the fallout game I’d like also

It doesn’t have to be exactly the same perspective as FO2 and NV. It could be a top-down pixel art game even. But I want a game set in the same universe that has the same design goal that New Vegas had: player choice and consequence

[tidal tendon]

Again, this channel is for the Fallout TV show. Let's move this conversation to the #fallout-general-chat

[crisp grail]

[noble zealot]

i just binged the first season of fallout and oh my, my stomach hurts 🥲

wanted to watch it so bad for walton goggins but i don’t do well with heavy themes

[noble zealot]

idk if i’m supposed to spoiler tag so i will just in case. but in episode 1 ||you see lucy having sex with the man she’s assigned to. i’m assuming it’s unprotected sex? you know to multiply for the vault, and steph with her husband gave that vibe. anyway if it was unprotected, it doesn’t mention pretty much it again, so i’m wondering if it’s going to come back and bite lucy? or if the harsh conditions of the wasteland will play a part.||

[void ember]

STEPH THEORY (Involves spoiler about ep 1 and mentiones the credit scene in ep 2) - ||Steph is the vault girl and the nuka cola girl in the credits of ep 2 there is a a painting of the nuka cola girl but with a missing eye
Steph's haircut is the same as the vault girl's and she worked for vault tec||

[crisp grail]

https://www.reddit.com/r/fnv/comments/1dmz73u/since_folks_still_seem_a_bit_lost_this_was_shot/

Ranger Station Foxtrot maybe?

[pseudo robin]

So im up to the episode where they show shady sands, its pretty cool, but could this link to the Couriers actions within the savage divide, Nuking both the Legion and the NCR as there is not much mention of these Super powers after, meaning that the courier sided with House or the wildcard and siding with Courier 5 (please no spoilers for future episodes)

[sturdy tundra]

Best to finish the series then discuss it.

Anything regarding what happened to Shady Sands is going to go directly into spoiler territory, as it is stuff the show's going to talk about.

[pseudo robin]

Ahh legend!! I thought it was just gonna be a glimpse at what happened to Shady sands! I’ll keep watching and find out thank you!

[lofty prairie]

https://tenor.com/view/fallout-on-prime-fallout-prime-video-bethesda-maximus-gif-341377901427165611

[shrewd abyss]

im hoping the enclave will place a bigger role next season but probably not tho

btw next season gonna be heat

[marsh egret]

Wasnt the enclave destroyed in fallout 3?

[shrewd abyss]

yes

most of it

the oil rig was derstotryed in fo2 and and there is bearly any lefted

[sturdy tundra]

@shrewd abyss Nope

They've been operating in multiple places since even F2. The oil rig and Raven Rock were primary command centers, but they're the US government, they have bunkers all over the country.

[shrewd abyss]

oh ngl I didnt know that thanks

[sturdy tundra]

After the oil rig blew up, most of the remnants moved east to rebase at Raven Rock under President Eden's orders. Even after Raven Rock fell, there's still other facilities like the one shown in the show, F2-era activity down in Baja and F3 mentioning them having a base in Chicago

Plus we see more remnants right there in F4 as of the next-gen update

[shrewd abyss]

well but still the enclave is my fav faction

[sturdy tundra]

they're still around, still trying to make things happen, just they've been taken down a couple pegs.

see also the Whitespring bunker and the Scorched Plague research facility in Appalachia in F76

[shrewd abyss]

I knew about that that's why I said bearly

[sturdy tundra]

Just a question if MODUS and SODUS are still operational post-F76, since we're up to nearly two centuries later after F76's time.

[shrewd abyss]

d

I wasn't trying to type that

[pseudo robin]

Their around but not in Brotherhood numbers, more like smaller groups, I’d say similar numbers to vaulties, as well the NCR or what’s left hunt them, Caesars legion killed them on sight, and well the brotherhood and multiple other factions kill them on sight if their not important.

[pseudo robin]

I’d say if they where maintained by any Robotic butlers, or members returning, due to the Lost and The Plague as I don’t recall seeing many if at all members of the enclave bodies, but it has been a while.

Plus don’t forget there are still terminals and Ironside, and the Big MT and the Sierra Madra all where functioning and they where 15years prior to the show

[shrewd abyss]

I hate the brotherhood

[silent vigil]

Enclave solos

[errant crow]

But unfortunately, now it seems that Brotherhood of Steel become much one of trademark features of the Fallout franchise as a whole. So that means, BoS most likely going to be featured in future installements and play some role in the plot. One way or another.

[lofty prairie]

I wait BoS to appear at Bolshevik Revolution at this point

[remote halo]

They have ALWAYS been a MAJOR part of the plot line i mean hell if it weren't for General Maxon, Elder Maxon's great great great great grandfather then there's a good chance that the Enclave would already be completely in charge of the wastes

[sturdy tundra]

"Now"? They'd been a major part of every single game long before Bethesda came in.

The original game's box art was a T-51 no less

See also Tactics and BOS, both of which were geared around the BOS's expansion across the land

They've always been a trademark of Fallout.

[cyan rock]

New Vegas probably has the weakest BOS influence to its plot.

[half pebble]

They played a relatively small role in Fallout 1 and an even smaller role in Fallout 2, it's really because of Tactics and FOBOS that they've become a major faction in the Fallout universe

[cyan rock]

Werent they part of the main quest in Fallout 1 or 2? I forget which, but one of them has a guy outside a bunker who is all "We have been watching you {player}."

And you have to engage them to finish the MQ I thought.

By joining them.

[shadow heath]

You can get BoS support to defeat the Unity in FO1, but it is not mandatory.

In FO2 their role is very minimal. They've only established small outposts to observe the Enclave and ask you to obtain Vertibird plans so they have a way to counter the Enclave's vertibirds if it comes to war.

But they don't play much of a role in the actual main quest of FO2.

[sturdy tundra]

Of note, one of their possible endings in F1 was if Rhombus died, they would become even more fanatical and imperialist and their reign would become known as the millenium-long Steel Plague.

And by now, mans has long been dead.

F1 was never meant to continue as a franchise technically, but it left several juicy hooks that later games have in fact made use of.

The BOS was always going to become a major faction in the long run.

[errant crow]

In Fallout 1 BoS actually was the most powerful human faction in California region. Then in Fallout 2 we saw them stagnant and in decline while yet still very powerful, and in FNV there is only remnant chapter remaining of West Coast BoS. On the other hand in Fallout 2 we are shown that NCR is the region's superpower on the rise, in FNV we see it as the colossus and powerhouse but already with measure of stagnation and corruption... so series plot twist may somewhat fit that logic o.o