#🎮〕illuvium-arena
1 messages · Page 18 of 1
Sorry I’m going to wipe the floor with your PVP deck?
We both know I am not wiping shit
HEY!!
Did you play today?
is this sorted by importance and place in the line?
Not sure what you are talking about buddy
Your always first
Importance ofcourse
Honestly, I need a first win that's why I put Fubar first
now i like it 
No offence fubar
Let’s be honest neither am I. I picked you cos we seem at similar levels 🥹
I’m gonna get rekt the first month of PVP, but im a fast learner
You should try @opaque cape . If he plays pvp like he plays poker it’s an easy win
not if can help with that 👀
@west plume i need to give you a head start
i will show you something
but DO NOT show to anyone else tho
That was a nice gesture, looking forward to it.
Ur going to help me? Or you also suck?
Is it more PVP gameplay?
||have i told you a story on how i have beaten Kieran today in the tournament? TWICE!!! 🤣 ||
i used this deck:
[disclaimer: **PEOPLE DO NOT WATCH!! **its only for Lars and Zejaq!!]
Looks like a Techsupport position is opening up soon😆
It’s a thing of beauty 🤩
now you both can destoy everyone... or atleast Kieran 🤣
What does the arcane sash do?
its cool, i like it
Can you tell how it’s better? I would think the more the merrier
But why not fill the last 5 slots?
There is 25 max
I thought it was 30
cuz it makes you think about your deck when you make it, you are not ending up with a deck that allows you to use whatever you want
Nevermind says 25/25🙂
Emphasis on was
I see. Doesn’t that make the matchup more decided from beginning though? Cause you can’t adapt in the same manner
Yell first . Ask questions later
I had a boss once who lived by that motto
Those are great😆
hmm, with 25 i still have few ways to open and few ways to react to my opponent
I hope you don’t boss anyone 😂
Was for 8 years, but never like that.
Much better having your kids bossing you around
Awesome. I was hoping each match would play out differently than the last, so you wouldn’t always place the same stuff in the same order 😃
If you play against @tribal glade , you totally can 🤣
but for Lars, i think i will try to surprise him with something new everytime ^^
also
we do have a real new pro in our team
@west plume this is another tip, let me introduce you to best team builder in the Illuvium, @patent slate

Just promise you won't go easy one me.
Well hello Vincent
Is he good?
he will play against you, say some cryptic stuff, disapere for few hours, come back, and destroy you with his new team saying something like "oh i just created this one, not sure if any good"... and you ded 
||also i would ask him for leaks based on his discord tags 🫣 ||
If only us little people could play too
||Oh really👀||
November 20. Reserve that day
||just saying||
did I?
Only checked the black screens 😂
It will be the first day you’ll be able to play PvP, according to my horoscope
the point of them is... it private conversation with lars, ahh this ppl
Really don't like your horoscope
Leaves are usually correct
@limber scroll you officially granted to join the super secret conversations for next 60 minutes 🫡
Thoughts? @zenith mortar
Unfortunately I have to decline. I am cooking
||@west plume be carefull, we are not alone||
I think thats when i'm moving my grandma back home
Oh
if thats what you were asking
I’m getting mixed readings now 🤔
Lost mine way too early.
My wife makes a mean Green Bean casserole
you play right now 👀
In an hour ish
oh daaaamn
@safe valve , just logged in to check whats the comp ^^
It’s now in my calendar
I have already called in sick on work that day
Yes I think I feel a cold coming on for that date myself
was just luck 😄
even a damaged watch shows the right time twice a day 😄
how far did you get peter?
you even play pve anymore if you can play pvp?
i died on 18, saw everyone above 19 and decided its a good time to bail before ppl see that i have tried ^^
i do and i still will, this is different type of fun, i really like PvE, i fire up a podcast in the backgroun and chill with Arena, and every weekend i train with @solemn mountain @brazen quarry and @tulip tiger 
haha... i call that smart play
oh, never saw that... you do on hype server?
Its about to get hot in here.
nope, here iin voice, usually 8am (CET) sat&sun, we stream, we talk, we have fun, join if you can!
damn Volante tier 3 is no joke
Stage 3 T0 ofcourse
iam not a noob
what wave for leaderboard?
19 a few hours ago
you go 27 today, at least
Yes
yup, 28 is where it gets tricky
that peskey 28
Enemy team on 28 if you're curious
everyone should go into Offtopic and rate Linkey new setup
ooof 7 rogue 7 fire
we busy watching your commentary of your game, he can wait 👀
Wave 7 was a bit tuff ngl
End of the day we play for fun not to climb leaderboards.
Dont zoom in
nevermind the picure got alot bigger when pasted
supposed to be a 33 but dident want to over do it.
Thats 8am for me, but yea if it happens i'm awake i'll join for sure 🙂
That means officially #1 right? 🥇
I belive you are correct.
this is the most supportive channel on Illuvium Discord
We should celebrate Rich
With
a
PVP gameplay leak🥳
As soon as Kieran says the word/ we probably have a better chance pushing @low halo though honestly
This is strictly wrong
You should never have less than 30 cards in your deck
*unless you dont have money to complete it rip 😦
Speaking in absolutes about your opinion doesn’t make it right, although I’ll say I’m not sure how I feel about it since the change. I’ve had to adjust my teams def adds a layer of complexity
Sorry to tell you but its just right
Lol once again this is your opinion… sorry this isn’t MTG or whatever you played
Yes and my opinion is worth quite a bit more
Why would you purposely not want more options?
You can put 5 random units in your deck and nothing changes but hey maybe 1 time out of 1000 youll use one
I just told you
This is what Smartass was saying. We try to help people and then get told no lol
This is not helping.
This is a one sided conversation, people had a good time talking to each other before with no issues
This is Arena chat.
Someone is using a bad strategy
I'm pointing it out so others dont follow it
That is my bad if things have been changed. Decks were 30 cards before
you were replying to a conversation talking about this specific change. That's were the confusion comes from
See everyone it's even possible for me to be wrong
Just woke up and scrolled through the long ass talk and thought he was playing 25 just to give himself less options
Although why its been changed down to 25 we can also talk about.....
Cause yes that is worse and hopefully it gets reverted back to the 30 card limit instead

I never thought I’d see the day 🤯
I'm a terrible morning person
The arena is a lot of fun today It seems 32 is a hard wave to pass wondering if @safe valve can smash it again!!
@zenith mortar have f2p decks been tested in PvP yet or you guys just using all illuvials rn? Wondered how balanced/fun PvP feels with just T0s.
Remember there will be free starter decks as well that will contain more than just T0s (although not much more haha)
The intent is still to not have them be very competitive
It should still be more interesting than just playing with the same couple of T0 Illuvials though
Fair point though it's still probably a good idea to run a T0 tournament or two internally just to identify any issues.
Yah there is also the random free rotation which we dont know how expansive it will be
So maybe a testing session with T0s + 3 random illuvials
Oh no
Can't handle the pressure
Will have a look later tonight and report back🫡
Lots to choose from toxic enchanter mystic no tsunami today though! Pick your poison lol
@west plume are you doing the phantom comp to bro? You should join if not it's a lot of fun even some prizes to be won!
No no, I think I can count on one hand how many times I have gone past Wave 20🤭
Won't take ya long to learn the game mate lots of good guilds around all sharing and helping each other learn to get better at the arena! We are streaming most resets in the HYPE guild more than welcome to come chill and watch, ask questions!
I usually have an hour or two to play in the evenings(not every day)
How many guilds are there that's Arena focused?
Xborg and then everyone else
Most days it's the same for me mate 2 little ones keeping me busy! Most of the guilds are about arena until PvP comes out so you should do your research first! This is my first auto battleler and I've only played for 6 months so won't take you long to learn if you got a good bunch of people around to help you for free!
Looks Like i'm gona have to enjoy toxic before @proven ember nerfs them because he can't beat em 🙃
Why what's Ben playin the same deck every game?
Anyone playin 7 fire seems to be in every run atm!
@west plume this tournament is tailored for newcomers.
Wave 20 should be beatable with having just a few hours of Tutorial with a knowlegable community member
Idk, but Looks Like he got humilated by toxic AT least once 😄
Seems legit tarren getting clapped lol
That's actually a slap in the face
Come have a chat no such thing as a silly question!
Even a built like a hulk, equipped with battle axes, bald Viking is allowed to ask for help. 😉
Is PVP close to being released?
Soon
suun
Immanant
Imminent feels like days away?👀
minutes
I would define as hours
Like yours more
Imminent refers to something about to happen. And anything immanent (with an "a" in there) is inherent, like that good attitude you were born with. To keep them straight, remember that an eminent person is successful, like that rapper Eminem. Something imminent is going to happen in a minute.
So PVP today?
I like how you think
Told you
Must be true
That's basically what Ben said
Yea
Taking the day off tomorrow
Spamming F5 as we speak
I'm calling in sick tomorrow to be sure. Thanks Ben
It’s been more than a minute now.
😂😂
What’s the status?
Should we call a mod to give him a warning about spreading misinformation? 
Something has gone wrong in the upload sir.
Ty fixed my typo
Getting a cramp in my finger, but any second now
Ohh it was a typo
But yeah for reals it's not far now. At last
Honest mistake Ben
“It’s all in your head”😂
You should take a few weeks off Ben, these mistakes must come from all the hard work. We can wait
Very kind!
Please stop spreading misinformation
I'm actually gonna go sleep for a month once we've got it out and had a few post release balances passes
I care more about Ben than PvP 🤷♂️
Ok, selling my tokens now. Thanks for the heads up
What's the best setup for early mid game on today's play?
lesser fire atippo
unless you're asking about survival, then I have no clue
Probably not the best, but rogues/figther to Start with and fill up with bullwarks is always a good play if possible.
I'd say either Fighters or Air (pretty cheap to get to 5 of either).
You also have the Toxic Scorpion and Enchanter Chicken which are both pretty strong.
is that animation in the game?
no
in due time
I know I'm late to the party, but do they still give out beta keys? Or are they just going to open to everyone soon
- 1e3fb165-1eb5-4e95-ad6d-0a6785746206
- e71275bd-daa0-426d-8d11-29c3d1f852b2
Immerse yourself into a diverse alien ecosystem. Explore fantastic biomes riddled with extraordinary flora and fauna. Scale misty mountain peaks, cross toxic deserts, and fight your way out of crystal labyrinths. Lift the veil of time and discover the secrets of a fallen world that you now call home.
oh cool. Thanks Rich!
Well I called in sick today @proven ember, let's do this
Sounds like we are going to be watching influencers play pvp before we do and the deck builder is going to come out before the game so wouldn't be quitting the day job just yet bro! Soon though I hear!
I won't be watching any "influencers" I wanna get to know this game myself
Let's just hope and rub our balls made from crystal it's sooner rather than later lol
It's already later 😉
Need to change ur meme then to later than later?
Become an influencer
I'll watch your first stream but youll have to earn my follow
Tarren doesn't like me, I can't
rip
If they are partnering with an esport team wondering if they are going to be the ones streaming and playing?? Maybe you can make an esport team Betty?
I'll join your team for free! I like you!
I don't know any esport team 
Make one!
But then again gamestop is also unknown here
I have one called the Rat Gang but we mostly retired a while back maybe I could get it going again? Wanna be on my team bro?
No, I'm not a competitive player
Neither is GangGang
Why so toxic
With all that talking you could be a good mascot?
Sorry bro I meant it in a nice way! I just wanted you to be part of the team!
I'm just kidding, I don't mind. Let's wait for a full game launch first
The longer we wait the better it will taste!
Sometimes if you wait too long, you picture it better in your head and you are actually disappointed when it finally happens
Just picture sjub in the gym! You will never be disappointed again!
The game is going to be amazing we all know that!
lol yes
You retiring until Q1?
rip Fraggy
I'm talking about guilds, mascots, ...
Ah
Hello, my friends talks about Illuvium Arena all the time, is there a chance you could grant me beta access? Would be awesome. Thanks

b8fbe0de-fef8-4e35-a271-05ab6aa07a48 🪄
Immerse yourself into a diverse alien ecosystem. Explore fantastic biomes riddled with extraordinary flora and fauna. Scale misty mountain peaks, cross toxic deserts, and fight your way out of crystal labyrinths. Lift the veil of time and discover the secrets of a fallen world that you now call home.
thanks 🙂
if slashin gets stunned he does the T-pose btw
Slashin is such a fun unit
its time kickass and chew bubble gum and iam all out bubblegum.
Fing empaths
How far you got?
Used 2x all checkpoints AT wave 26... Fing fliishs
Oh that low
Use Air doka, Air grokko, scorpion ranger-fire-sword, Air rogue... So you get pretty cheap pretty far
If i remember right, i had wave 13 or so 300 MP left to spend
Cheers,will try that one
300left? i think i had like 1
3 Air 3 figther pretty Nest for early game
Your Ranger just sweeps everything
You can even Make him berserker later and add another fighter +berserker
Thanks for that
Good job mate 🙂
Good find. Did you submit a bug report already?
just did it via ingame bug report (:
It only counts preparation time
Not a bug
Rogue team?
I thought you werent going to post here anymore?
Welcome back God of PB2
25 mins seems a lot tbh
this guy is too good at the game
Gorrirra with that 6 min flex
Who is currently the very best Arena player?
@west plume i feel, he just hasn't unleashed his competitiveness yet
Yes saw his win against 43 mindblowing 😜
God of PB2
Nice run
That might be intentional considering how "memeish" the whole line is
its error or something and thhen reconnect and timer resets
or actuually a very fast
doesnt look intentional tho
Lets get it👀
that is a solid RTS play right there
When pvp ?
Wen
wen i still havent recieved my code should i create a ticket?
i hope everyone has a good day 🙂
Wen
Bravo!
Hello there
Hello
Why can't I send screenshots?
Might not be able to post screenshots until you hit a certain Discord level
Damn, and what is it?
Wanted to share todays top 1 😛
Well, guess it will come in time. Thx for fast answer sir, gn
Level 5 I believe
That's a lot of talking 🙂
Woo! Rank 1 arena! Probably last about 5 min, but still! First time getting there 😄
Nice work!
It's all thanks to you and your beta key Rich ;D
Good morning mates
This is madness 🙊
zz
How it comes you've killed 208 units at higher wave against mine 212?
ranking and kill count are bugged since one and a half year.
During PB1 we sayed that if you reach the same wave, it s a tie, because of this bugged leaderboard
I see, thx
He might had one or more rounds that ended up as ties
Also, there's an exploit, that if used will lower your kill count.
exploit called "use the checkpoints" maybe?
Played again. Your move now guys ^^
Where did you rank?
First
Well, I play competetive TFT, but thx dude 🙂
I think when PVP comes its gonna be HUUUGE
Have you been in the cryptonspace for long?
How would you compare it to TFT?
I bought ILV when it costed around 600$ xD
Difficult without the PVP aspect yet but your initial thoughts?
Oh sick, you gonna be competing in December?
Well, there are similar mechanics but they are pretty different for now
Competing in what? If there is some sort of tourney, I'm definitely in
Any information about what’s to come for overworld gameplay ? Sometimes it just feels like a running simulator. There is not much to do in the overworld
Looking forward to your feedback on PVP when the comes the next couple of weeks, right? @tribal glade
Would be cool to see some actual illuvitars walking around and u need to shoot them in order to activate the battle mode
TFT Global Lan tourney in Vegas. A few of the top tier TFT players I know are going there
Man, I'd like to, but I'm from Ukraine xD
and definitely! Keen to hear your thoughts when PVP is out @mental summit. Been speaking to quite a few TFT streamers and they seem very excited for PVP which is exciting to hear.
ah I understand
For sure, I've also detected some nasty bugs
Not sure 100% how to execute them, but I'll give report when I can
Great. Gonna have new pc soon and gonna stream tft and ilv both 🙂
Btw, whom did you talk to?(I mean streamers)
is there a good site to see what all the combo bonuses are? like for fire and bulwark and so
wdym?
Illuvial master explains all of them
np ser
10 Grit & Resolve
what does that really mean?
5 Dodge Chance is that 5% or what
Won't just reveal just yet but it'll be cool to see when PVP drops!
Do you stream already?
Not yet
let me know when you do start!
If you need any help feel free to just tag me in #1023650034593570917 with any questions
Sure thing mate 🙂
I actually don't know what some stats mean(like grit,resolve) only got guesses. Can I read the description somewhere?
Illuvial master
I would look at it like grit is physical defense and resolve is magic resist
If thinking in TFT terms is easier
Then what's the difference grit/phys def and resolve/magic def?
I mean there are already base stats armor mres
Some Illuvials are mostly physical damage and others are mostly "magic" or energy damage
there isnt
Grit
Reduces each instance of Physical Damage received by 1 per Grit.
Resolve
Reduces each instance Energy Damage received by 1 per Resolve.
I think it would be awesome to have ingame description, wouldn't it?
Illuvialmaster website has a dictionary
There will be
just not enough dev time atm and prioritizing getting PvP out to the public is much more important atm
but at release there should be one
for now a lot of that information will be held by 3rd parties
That's pretty ok, tft works like that to
@gentle bronze pls don't spread fake news about stats. tag me if necessary. @mental summit grit is flat physical damage reduction, resolve is flat energy damage reduction. Physical resist is percent physical reduction, energy resist is percent energy reduction.
while you're here,
is there an order in which those applies?
is the flat reduction applied before or after the percentage one?
flat first, percentage second
Thx mate, I've already went deep on the dictionary 😛
TY Lord Kyle! Please have mercy on my dreadful soul it was simply a misunderstanding.
You are forgiven my child
I mistakenly said the team builder would be out today. Could you correct this too with correct information? Thanks
Whats the estimated launch date for arena?
Will "battle in the beyond" be connected?
PvP is estimated for Q4 2023. Open beta is estimated in Q1 2024
Beyond is only a profile picture project
@zenith bough
Kieran and/or grant gave those timelines?
It’s from the roadmap #📣〕announcements message
If you hear any timelines from Kieran, they are quite accurate after adding 200% to it
@zenith bough lol good info 👍
are all these stats viewable somewhere
stuff like precision savegary etc
Better in game descriptions will likely come in the future. For now, IlluvialMaster has a pretty solid dictionary page that covers a lot of things (not necessarily every keyword)
Curious, why was it done this way? Usually it's the other way around so they synergize with each other more efficiently?
that would be too op
if it was the other way, the flat numbers would have to be too small to be meaningful by themselves. With this system, flat reduction is good against small sources of damage and percentage is good against large sources of damage.
alr ty
But raw numbers can be adjusted if they are made to work together.
It just feels better for the player if the stats work well together and creates a better feel building your team. Just my 2 cent
Doing no damage isn't very fun. In a single player game making things synergise really well is usually a positive. But because we're PvP we don't just evaluate from 1 players POV.
Having them be so synergistic would become very very difficult to balance and would sometimes result in unfun gameplay
As I said numbers can be tweaked if this synergy gets reversed. I don't know why you mention single player when games like league and wow apply the % first and then the flat number, it just feels better when you make your build. Anything after that can be balanced additionally
I get it that it will take more effort to balance, but small things like this are worth the effort usually. It brings more soul to the game when things work and behave properly
Applying % first and then flat numbers require additional checks to prevent going into negative damage, basically enforcing a minimum damage dealt (or no damage).
Doing it the other way guarantees you'll never go into negatives (assuming the flat reduction can never go above the weakest Illuvial's attack stat).
It would be pretty rough to do percentage then flat, you could effectively remove the relevance of fast, low damage attackers. Would be super hard to balance for, the result would probably be that just % or just flat in isolation were underpowered, so using both or none could be a more binary decision based on what you were up against.
Examples are helpful when looking at this. 3 scenarios, one for relatively high damage, one for relatively low damage, one for very low damage. Numbers just for the sake of the example. 30% damage reduction, -30 flat damage taken. Relatively high damage = 500, relatively low = 100, very low = 50.
High Damage
% before flat
500 * 0.7 = 350 - 30 = 320 | Total DR = 36%
Flat before %
500-30 = 470 *0.7 = 329 | Total DR = 34.2%
Note: As damage approches inf, these two methods converge to the percentage reduction (the flat becomes irrelevant in either calc).
Low Damage
% before flat
100 * 0.7 = 70 - 30 = 40 | Total DR = 60%
Flat before %
100 -30 = 70 * 0.7 = 49 | Total DR = 51%
Very Low Damage
% before flat
50 * 0.7 = 35 - 30 = 5 | Total DR = 90%
Flat before %
50 - 30 = 20 * 0.7 = 14 | Total DR = 72%
In every scenario, % before flat results in more extreme values of damage reduction. It becomes notably more potent at low damage values than the alternative, and makes scenarios where no damage is dealt at all possible with less investment.
True that. Nice calculations as an example mate
I don't like this arguement cause it is fixable with enough effort, if other games can do it so can we
I didn't have time to type down examples, but Blickter had the same reasoning so look at his post.
You have to take into account that having both % and flat damage reduction takes alot of resources, you cannot go for it from the get go.
You also have to introduce the proper counters, add % defense penetration and flat penetration to work the same, so they cancel each other with the proper counters.
So it will end up being a game of cat and mouse who can outsmart the other with their builds. But to say % first flat later will break the game cause numbers will go negative or smth is just lazy arguement
It's not lazy.
Doing flat last forces unneccesary extra calculations, making balancing more difficult. For no gain whatsoever.
No gain maybe for you, for gamers who like to theory craft and make different builds, this will be appreciated
you can theorycraft just as much on both versions
There's a lot of extra complexity not covered there.
Still, when you boil it down to fundamentals, if you want a reasonable maximum reduction to be in the realm of 70%, using % then flat calculations means each stat will need to be significantly weaker than it otherwise could be. This means less effective options for the player to counter either large damage with only %, or less effective options to counter small damage with only flat reduction.
I acknowledge that stacking damage reduction probably isn't something most people want to actively do (though I absolutely would, I love degenerate gameplay styles).
Yes but if they stack properly it gives u better and more options, it's also more fun in the end
"properly" is a matter of definition
flat reduction before % reduction is just as much "properly" as the other way around
you only have to do your calculating/theorycrafting based on how the system works
it's really no different regardless which you choose
Agreed here, it does add extra complexity on the balance side but I think it's worth it. Like you and me, gamers like that stuff, adds layers to the game.
They work like that in LoL for example and you can go from positive defenses which reduce dmg to actually having negative defenses, having been penetrated by % first flat later and u actually receive bonus damage, from having negative defenses.
It was never that much of a problem since doing that requires alot of resources.
For reference, PoE uses flat before percentage. Acknowledged it's in a different genre, but the core principal is the same, in that you don't want to make it too easy (or trivial) to reduce incoming damage to 0, because that's actually not fun. Anyone who has used cheat codes in older games can attest to that - God mode is a nice idea, but most people lose interest when a system is trivialized. A relatively recent example of that is some of the game breaking behavior possible in New World (a result of their client side calcs, but still, making damage systems trivial is NOT good for a game).
I don't see how damage can go to 0 if there is also % defense penetration and flat penetration to counter balance it. No one is suggesting to create some tank behemoth meta
simple:
100 base damage vs 80% damage reduction, 20 flat damage reduction
I don't really see it as a ton of extra complexity, the reality is that each stat individually would just need to be weaker to account for the way they interact when combined. Maybe there's something big brain that's possible to account for that. The system scales towards extremes more quickly, so the values can't be as large, limiting their individual impact on gameplay.
And then you have 80% armor penetration and 20 armor penetration, problem solved
yes, at the cost of adding unneccesary complexity and making balancing a nightmare
Like I said before maybe unnecessary for you, but most gamers enjoy that part
keep in mind there's more than just the damage calculation
the game is really complex in every other aspect already
Haha, you really routing for mechanic used in Games where people constantly complain about not being balanced and wana do this here exactly the Same, even tho every other is arguing it's Hard to balance... Why?
I gave examples with a moba, which in my opinion is vastly more complex genre. It works there
sure, but what makes you so sure doing something differently can't be better?
Casuals will complain no matter what, will always find something. And they are 99.9% of the time wrong. I've never seen anyone decent complain about something like this
Maybe Times changed, when i was playing those Games every Big Streamer was complaining about unbalanced pvp
I never said different can't be better, I just shared my opinion of why I think my way would work better. It makes theory crafting and building teams more fun.
I think it's an interesting discussion, FWIW. I do see why things are they way they are, but I also see your point - People do like being able to scale mechanics to their extremes. That needs to be balanced against some of the practical things, like your opponent playing a fast attacker with low damage, and you wanting to respond to that in a targeted way. If flat reductions need to be lower to account for interactions with percentage reductions, your counterplay will be less impactful than it could be if calculations were performed differently.
Yes, but you still haven't explained why it would make it more fun.
I did a few msgs up, it gives u more options and also feels better if things work well together. Dunno if that makes sense
Yes, and I pointed out it's exactly the same if you use the other system.
You have the same options, just a different scale to work along.
How is it exactly the same? It's completely different. The choices you make with one system and the other will be completely different
Read blickters last comment, it explains it well
Exactly
Scaling mechanics is fun, I don't know how to simplify it more. Usually it's good if you build fun mechanics in a video game
But both systems scale.
The only difference is that one can achieve numers at or below 0 damage, the other scales to a desired point (for example max achievable 90% final reduction).
What's more fun?
Playing a game where your characters at worst do no damage at all, or where you're at least doing something?
Or should I say, do you want to see a metagame revolving around having max reduction or playing full piercing. And no other viable options.
Why do you keep using that no damage arguement? I already stated that it needs to have the same defense penetration system in place that doesn't allow this to happen. If we wanna keep it simple that's fine, but eSports thrive on complex mechanics
And stuff that the viewer appreciates when watching a stream
Sounds a bit Like it.
Like making a bullwark wiping half the board with 1 stun, cause you pushed dmg stats
It will have those 2 extreme options but mostly it will be a mix of both. Why using only extremes?
The mechanics still scale, they just do so less quickly, allowing for more design space for additional sources and specialization through player actions. If A + B + C is capped at 50, then on average, A, B and C can only be 16% on average. If the scale is different, and A + B + C is capped at 70, then A, B and C can be individually stronger than 16%. You might even have room to include a D before hitting the cap (could be a new Illuvial property or ability, or a new augment, as tangible examples).
Because that's what min/maxing gamers usually end up doing.
If something turns out to be more effective than everything else, ppl wil use it and ignore less optimized stuff.
I'm not saying that won't work, I'm saying it will be more boring in my opinion
How do you know maxing one stat will be the most optimal build? And not mixing them up with different units?
Play the current version of Arena and you'll see certain mechanics being way more effective than others.
Had they used the inverse damage calculations you'd have unbeatable teams.
Definitely possible, but I think more practical. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy "breaking the game" in stuff like Slay the Spire - I used to play 2 healer comps in Arena back in TBC and make the other team ragequit after 20-30 minute games. Degenerate gameplay is SUPER fun for me. I do know where you're coming from. I also know it's not great for players on the other end of those mechanics.
What kind of example is that? Obviously with a change like that it will require re-balancing.
You guys are overthinking this too much, once it is re balanced properly it will feel and play pretty similarly, but have a better feel of the game
I do think we should wait and test it in PvP when that's available to us. We'll have a lot more and better context then.
Right now the best we can do is TC, and the team is actively doing one better with live testing internally.
I love some sweaty TC though ❤️
I've played many games where the % applies first and you never went full ape into one stat, you always had to balance your build properly between flat, % damage/defensive stats so that you have a viable build against the highest number of enemy builds or if it's pve against a certain boss.
If something works better than other thing you just balance it in a patch
wen 
some days ago. I boosted a earth Attipo at 150+ physical resistance with templar.. And the omega should apply 50% of his resistance to ally. Well it was not precised that it's the resistance that the attipo had at the start and you can't scale up that buff 
waiting for PVP to rediscover the game again
I've played games where % applies first and the pvp meta there was going above max reduction on the tank, making them virtually unbeatable even if playing against debuffing classes or damage piercing ones.
Naturally that was changed by imposing a 90% damage reduction cap.
Using that as an example, it'd be far more elegant having a formula that can't attain such results by default.
Which game was that? Sounds like poor design and balance. Tanks can't be op or broken from %armor scaling first if there is also % penetration first mechanic, both negate each other mutually. Then it comes down to building a proper team
Seems that's the problem with this argument.
My perspective is from the game as it's designed now. Flat reduction before % reduction, no reliable armor piercing (only a small set of units has it, 2 augments and Hyper effect on fighters).
Yours seem to be from a perspective on how you feel the game should be rather than what it is.
Or am I missing something?
Yes based on how I think it should work. I asked why it was made like that out of curiosity. I'm not suggesting some kind of complete overhaul and delaying the game for this. But I do think it works better the other way around. If no proper penetration mechanics can be introduced in time, playing with the numbers of % and flat can work too. But ideally you wanna have proper counter mechanics.
I was surprised there are so many stats and penetration wasn't more emphasized. It's a stable stat that you can predict how it affects things compared to a more RNG based stat like crit. Feels weird to have defensive modifiers and not enough options for penetration (which is easier to balance than crit)
I assume they didn't add them as they're not necessary when they do calculations in this manner.
This opens up for more combat effects that affect other things rather than just forcing every unit to have some level of piercing to balance out armor mechanics. Doing this at a math level rather than unit design level makes, in my opinion, each unit more interesting.
Doesn't make sense to me, if that's the case then why do we need 2 defensive stats, % and flat. Remove one, re balance and bam, even easier calculations.
I don't think less complexity is the solution
I don't know the reasoning behind it.
But the effect (since they stem from different sources) is that you have more options to build your team, and it allows for more varied unit designs. You have some that are better against lower levels of damage and some that are better against higher. Which leads to more complex team building.
More options is usually better, agreed
Yeah, more options usually lead to more variation in viable teams. And that's definetly a good thing.
So do we agree if there are defensive modifiers there should be also proper % and flat penetration? Especially when there are stats like crit and dodge, which are much more "toxic", people complain about more and are harder to balance?
Point being it will also create additional build options.
Yes, the ones we currently have are rather limited. It'd be nice to have more options for that.
Bingo, players feeling limited is one thing we dont want for sure. It may sound stupid, but small things like that are important and add up to the full "package" of a game.
you guys are sitting here stating the obvious for 2 hours straight
i can see the quality of the conversations dropping so hard when im not here
it actually improved
a 2 hour discussion that leads to: "more options are better"
i could have told you that within the first 2 messages
thanks daddy tell us more
But you said you wouldn't post here anymore so why don't you just let people enjoy talking to eachother?
im not preventing anyone from enjoying talking to eachother, go ahead
Thank you, carry on with the complaining.
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Hahahahahaha
lol
thats probably in response to your message flaming me, that you now deleted, recommending me to mute you
Did you block me Lars? 
blocking you sounds like a good idea 🙂
Would never block you
I'm going to put one last message here on the topic of flat vs percentage reduction, but I already stated this and it seemed to have been glanced over. I also don't want to get too much into a debate or anything, but it is interesting reading how people are very thoughtful on the matter:
- if you stack them the way @wide eagle wants, the numbers have to be smaller
- if the numbers are smaller, they have less impact by themselves, and are effectively a forced pairing
- if it's forced, this does NOT open up more options, it actually limits them
- OP God Mode is fun in pve games, less so in pvp cause an actual person is on the receiving end of it
This is mostly wrong but I'm tired of this subject so agree to disagree
kyle is never wrong, he's like Spock, if he says it's this way, then thats the way it is
Wen pvp
Can someone explain to me how the hyper system works lol?
I thought it always gave 30% attack speed
Incredibly helpful ty
no leaderboard screenshot brag moment today uh? wonder why
cause the deck is superboring and i dont want to play it lol?
i did a nice little 7 nature + templar run
ew
was superweak unfortunately
Obviously
this wasnt great either
like 4 t1 units?
flare/rake/scarabok/atlas
with a no composite bond ranger and a totally random vermi
so yeah lets say i didnt really try very hard today
How many runs you donwhen you try hard?
1 with main 100 with alts ofc
Did 2 runs today
btw I was not talking bout you SA, you are old story now, others gods are arising
How far did you get?
LOL
big talk coming from a guild who has been routinely embarassed for the last year
This might be the worst enchanter team ive ever seen
its probably the worst deck ive seen in about 6 months
big statement coming from a oneman guild routinely embarassed for the last year on discord with big ego and nothing else
thats why i didnt want to play it cause it felt too weak for my liking and not something i would ever play
nothing else but 90% of days first places
You realize we have multiple people who were #1 on the monthly leaderboards and have won tournaments
true oneman guild true
I don't think you understand what the word multiple means
i cant take a guild seriously that doesnt take me up on a 1v10 for money lol
you retired you are not real, only a presence on discord, like the ancient god farting just to check if he s alive
or 5v5 cause idk how many people xborg has signed
we can 1v5
Can you convince Shabim to start playing again?
anyone of us vs entire hype
Probably
if pvp comes out Im sure he wont need much convincing lol
anyone is only you SA be serious
SJUD, Smart-Ass, Shabim, Martini, and Positivity vs who from Hype? 👀
I see only SA on the leaderboard, useless to bring in ghosts
Why useless when we are better than you guys?
Martini trolled you guys on one of your silly reset tourneys and still won easily
all of us lol
so you and you okkkk
you need new jokes
Prolly not nice disrespecting official ILV team members
Wen 18+ channel
If I remember correctly even @turbid osprey trolled you guys on one of your silly tourneys and still won easily, so? /movealong ancient farting god
He wasn't trolling. He was trying
Martini legit trolled you guys with how bad your rules are and 1 hour runs
And thats also the only thing Hype has ever won in the past 18 months lol
ok enuff now go to gym and relax "god", you deserve it after all this typing. /salute
Atleast HYPE host tournaments 🙂 Phantom has a fun event to
XBorg hosted tournaments for thousands of dollars. Nice try though
Not a couple of standard disks
Wen
Not lately
Yah Illuvium delays have definitely hit hard
When xborg tournament?
Hopefully PvP is good and we can start them back up
When Kieran said there was still a possibility it would come in Q3 alongside the delay, I certainly didn’t think we’d be waiting this long. Makes me concerned they’ll miss the Q1 open beta release, which I think would be a real missed opportunity
While I agree I would be surprised if it's that much longer tbh
When I watched them play PvP it looked very close to finished but that was a few weeks ago
Am I right in thinking for the open beta, things still won't be permanent and will be reset?
Apologies if this is stated elsewhere, I did try to find out 😅
I think with the delay to Q4 it gave them room to add more features and really polish up the PVP most likely why we don't have a date as they are adding more to the scope.
Open beta you start owning, so no it wont be reset anymore. It gets reset for open beta, and then its on
Any test mode for us?
i doubt open beta will be Q1, but keeping hopes up
we haven't even seen any megacities UI design, for example. We have no idea if the illuvial stats and leveling are finished or still just concepts
Pvp release is coming very soon.
Open beta is planned for Q1 24
Wow, Thanks Synix!
That's really awesome
Don't underestimate the "is planed" 😘
True that. But don't underestimate the power of hope 😉
i've been hoping hard for 2 years by now
running low on supplies
and still i keep grinding arena every day 😄
Sure, but I already went this road, and it s more deception 😁
Open beta planned for end 2021, then "no worries guys, we are a little late, but it will be out feb-march 2022" ect ...
Now I am just waiting without hope and I know I LL be very happy when it goes out ❤️
we were too early 😄
eventually we will forget all the delays as long as the game is good and we have the next 10 years to play it
as soon as im holding a 7-figure check for winning the world championship i will forgive them for everything 😄
dont poopoo on my dreams tarren 😄
🎮 Join the Epic Reset Warrior Tournament! 🎮
🛡️ Hosted in the Illuvium Discord Server 🛡️
🔥 Battle it out with the best! Exciting prizes await the victors and participants! 💰
📅 <t:1699056000:F>
89% 👋
has there been any optimization to arena? i couldn’t run it on my laptop with amd radeon 8 and ryzen 5 a year ago
16gb ram too
Crashes are way down compared to a year ago if that was your issue before
nah my graphics card just couldn’t handle it
Yes significant performance improvements
Tech Art guys and Daniel have been going hard on optimization, Beta 3 should be a noticeable difference if you're on a lower end card
quick little first run jpp
wave 35 looks too hard to me, not gonna try again unless someone else beats it and shows its possible 😄
What is Grit and resolve (something like it) ?
flat damage reduction. grit for physical dmg, resolve for magic dmg
why isnt it showing the top 1?
its complicated
oh you mean the top 1
Not why iam not top 1
Not sure who got the top spot today😀
Will need to check unless you can tell me?
no idea
What timezone
Are there sign ups or can anyone just participate
Time is adjusted to your own timezone, its at next reset. Open to everyone 
Open to everyone. No entry fees. Tournament will start in just under 12 hours
Nice run sa
it was good for a first and last run of the day
Mates, the game is a bit luggy today, isn't it? Can't make 1st run, already dced 3 times
4 🙂
i did just one run, but no dc, it s very random, yesterday I had 1 ...
no issues here
@woven flint i took first but lost on checkpoint 😄
how i have to do another run 😦
yeah I had no checkpoint and lost just because of one rogue I underestimated on 34, but easily beatable
I don t have energy to do more than 1 run :/
soon
yeah ... soon ish I gonna try hard, but until pvp just some time some run is already boring enough
Because of the Daylight changes this is a couple hours early I might join in. If I don't get tied down.
Sounds good hope to see you there. We always have a good time and learn something
When PvP ?
can u please link dc channel for tourney?
im working on upgrading that score
how much to gt into top 20?
jeezez
Always funny to see people take like 30 minutes to get to low 20s
nice 1st place copying a build 😄
who was the first using that build? didn t see
and why he lost way before 29? weird
overtime loss
he didnt use any checkpoints though, just took 1st with 3 left
And thats why going last is always a huge advantage
btw jumping in after 2 hours is not a good move I admit
shouldnt be legal in a normal tourney, but who cares
One of the many reasons I refuse to play
as long as he doesnt think he's the better player after seeing 15 runs i dont care really
he didnt even JPP so i dont count the run either way
even then you have players that max stall every wave
and are an hour behind on wave 25
but copying a build, starting 2 hours late, using 2x the time and not JPPing and STILL not taking 1st is kinda bad though
what you mean he took 1st, you were on your second run or third I dunno..but not the first run for sure
he saw like 15 runs, thats way more OP than me JPP trolling 7 fighters/2 mystics
the copycat is hard tbh...didn t see martini was the builder
that 2nd run had a 2:54 runtime lol
High quality JPP
thats all the fartons do every time tbh
yeah the 7 fighter was kind a joke but funny
Fighter is the new JPP for this patch like Rogues were last patch
no positioning required JPP
no monitor required after the login screen
But they arent as good late game as Rogues were last patch
my final comp was pretty good jpp 😄
gtfo
it was amazing and you know it
That comp was a disgrace to the game
i would be so glad if i were you that im on your team
cause having me against you is just auto loss
people said they dont think 25 would be beatable today
i didnt lose a single unit there 😄
here, for all the contestants out there that sweated, the way to not use a single unit
mind the audio was in a voicechat with 10 other people so im still not talking to myself like an idiot 😄
Can not confirm or deny that
overtime was fine, would have won anyway with 0 losses if it just kept going naturally
I was lying in bed rolling around knowing it was possible...Wish I would have tried again.
Verdant "Psion" very interesting.
harbinger ftw
ya I guess you called it with Axon going crazy
if you see so many earth units, the question becomes which water units can i play and what to bond with
Only if the deck sucks
I'm diving back in
otherwise just play good stuff
there was no good stuff in this deck
Exactly
WOW 👀 Lets Gooo @zenith mortar Rank 3
Thanks ser
I had no time to copy others, still learning the game so had to focus on my build lol. Plus no one was using Squizz like me 💀 but I agree there can be better rules to avoid late advantage. I also don’t think I’m anywhere near as good as Martini or others just for tying on 24 😂 just having fun with the community, good vibes while we wait for pvp
uhh that wasnt about you 😄
im surprised to see rich so high with this horrible deck and hard wave 25, stepped up your game from all the pvp matches?
even beating martini 😄
yah but SJUD said id copied and there was like 20 of us on wave 24 lol, i think most spammed fighter
either way it was cool to have XBORG competing
PVP is gonna be hype
soon
ish
rich too powerful
is he beating you everywhere now? pve leaderboard, pvp?
he's coming to take your job
Even a blind squirrel finds a nut every once in awhile
even during no nut november?
No not then
well done copying kyles build 😄
Well done Dr Spoon
did i?
If so... you say kyle not getting as far with the same build as a casual player?
i hate to tute my own horn.. but pretty sure i was the first to suggest and use - martini played it well (no checkpoints used) but dr spoon also used it better
martini didnt use any checkpoints and only had 2 attempts in total
me neither
straigth to 29
So fighters ealy on?
Pvp will sort the boys from the men I guess. 😂
Same
mateeee, i seen you, you sweated over the grind more than anybody during that time period - good broken build for the day
the only one to beat it without abusing mud vamp monkier
going to be so much fun
Fun to watch
Who is on your list?
Oh the melt downs will be epic
all of the phantoms and hypes
Way to aim low
cant wait to see you guys play,just make sure to Live stream
Hans Niemann beats Magnus Carlsen and tells the Magnus Carlsen interview team what he thinks about it.
The only way to find out if it’s aiming high or low is to play
who's on your list then 😄 ?
How many people in xborg have completed in esport tournaments?
Should give a week heads up before each high level match so we can set up a Polymarket
lets go back for 18 months this games been around and how many first places do you have again?
2 or 3?
who was talking about me? get back to your tree
Anyone here?
should rephrase to do they have esport earnings^^
Yah thatd be great to see from all the people with Phantom tags
Because they certaintly havnt won anything in ILV
why do you have to lie?
I got 1st and 2nd in the 2 most competitive survival arena tournaments last year by Polemos and Jimbo
It was an honest question. I dont know much about Xborg. I was just curious.
No need for measure tapes
Remember when Viper played for a month and couldnt even beat Shabim?
I guess I hit a wound point talking about esportearnings
I don´t remember that either, was pretty much highest wave every day in PB2, until I quit cause it was too easy and I played more difficult games again, but you can tell yourself w.e. if it makes you sleep better
I was first until I quit, stop lying
Cool story bro
Is this like our wrestling title belt?
if so i want it
My favorite shirt is still the one you had sent to me.
the doka one?
Team shirt
oh ya that one.
Lars won it in Trivia
that was fun times. winning merch on trivia.
Make Trivia Great Again. Lol
I hope there will be some tournaments with Merch illuvium sponsored.
Would assume that's legal?
Those were good times
If its black and purple i will wear it
Just bought these
Damn I got matching shoes with SJUD, am I one of the cool kids now?
Also have these Jordan 13s
those somehow look very illuviumy
you can even see that circle in the middle on top of the ship
hidden illuvium merch?
They were planning ILV 25 years ago confirmed
or the shoe was ilv's source of inspiration
do you have code for play game ?
Try this d1f748c3-ad04-40f9-9192-772fccd6c5a8
thanks sir, i'm joined
Wonderful, hope you like it!
If you have any questions dont hesitate 
i downloading
i cant register
Try asking in #❓❗〕community-help they will be able to help you there
maybe try deleting browsing cache?
hey guys, any game code perhaps 🙂
hey there
d1f748c3-ad04-40f9-9192-772fccd6c5a8
thank you so much, going to try it just now 🙂
good luck 🙂
Do I redeem in illivium after having my account registered?
play ilv ithink
im trying to do it, but on the support > redeem code area, it does not allow me to login again
idk im sorry #❓❗〕community-help
Have you tried a different browser?
clearing cache and cookies?
tried to use both chrome and brave, on the redeem code area it just wants me to continue logging in
You havent logged in? Or have you created an account?
have both created an account and have logged in, but as soon as I click on support > redeem, it just keeps me on this screen
well, cannot share images here, but it just keeps showing me the connect/register pop-up
someone sniped this code 🙂 thanks whoever you are
hope you stub your small toe
maybe @zenith mortar has more lol
if anyone has a spare code, again, i'd appreciate it 🙂 it seems like I can actually use them now
- e73faccb-9c6d-46e4-b599-7bda4003af3d
thank you my friend! used it 🙂
Yup no problem
have fun 🙂
are you looking forward to playing overworld or arena
arena! i love playing TFT so, definitely something to look forward to. Also going to be exploring overworld. Have been sitting on the sidelines watching ILLU for years
im glad you are here 🙂 lmk if you need any help. feel free to add
thank you so much for a warm welcome. My friend is also going to join soon and he might also be looking for ye ole code 😉
Hey, and here is the friend!
bdc9066d-fe6a-497b-b0e3-946545bd4564
9985cc42-c491-4859-83eb-b157847b394c
c5059a53-11e6-4884-962c-f40bc543fee6
c70a7112-4fde-4df5-9e79-3e15294fc121
e24b6fcf-07af-4c06-ae8c-b41848e22593
https://play.illuvium.io/beta/redeem
Immerse yourself into a diverse alien ecosystem. Explore fantastic biomes riddled with extraordinary flora and fauna. Scale misty mountain peaks, cross toxic deserts, and fight your way out of crystal labyrinths. Lift the veil of time and discover the secrets of a fallen world that you now call home.
see if any of these work still
ty, one work for me, the rest is already used
wave 30 got me
Can you give me a code please?
https://play.illuvium.io/beta/redeem
- 3f8698ac-c88d-455e-ba73-f855532c794b

tks sir ❤️
What does the -1, 0, -4 mean?
Hyper calculations.