40k-book-club

[wintry tinsel]

Book club lets go

[harsh meteor]

Woooo! Party party party! 😄

[wintry tinsel]

||Just wonder if there was confusion about Titus from both mediums at one point||

||I have to say though my head has been feeling itchy since his fate 😂||

||A bit of a sad way to go out, what with how they become friends and whatnot and Titus ending up getting the same treatment as the mentor||

||I just hate worms in general||

||Still, on a offnote it was quite an uncomfortable sequence to read that entire part||

||Some lowkey elements of alzheimer and other stuff||

||But yeah I've been itching my head since that part||

||😰 yuck||

[mellow knot]

I like both. I do a lot of driving and it’s great company.

[wintry tinsel]

Audiobooks are great, when you are doing a passive job, focusing with your eyes can take a lot of energy and can just make it feel like reading is annoying once you get home as well 😛

[drowsy urchin]

Can't read while you paint

[wintry tinsel]

At least audiobooks you can just let your eyes wander and just listen

So no one else but me who had troubles reading after Titus Endor? 😂

[jaunty stratus]

Honestly yes, but I thought there will be a magos channel for the discussion

[wintry tinsel]

Well this is where it redirected me so I guess this is it

||I'm still working though but yeah, after the Titus story it got difficult for me to read further||

||Since a lot of our family works with dementia patients as well||

||Just a sad story overall, from thinking he was still hunting his archnemesis to not knowing of the promotions and whatnot||

||So yeah, that was as far as I could go unfortunately||

[drowsy urchin]

I recon Aqshy or someone will create a dedicated channel once they have the time

[wintry tinsel]

It's release day after all

[jaunty stratus]

Yup, guess so too, because the event got a separate channel listed too

[wintry tinsel]

Wow then all my talks are spoilers 😂

I should probably delete it all?

[jaunty stratus]

Also last time the discussion started around 10 or 11 am cet too

[wintry tinsel]

I was moving stuff from my moms house that day so no time to talk about the previous book 8D

[jaunty stratus]

Just spoiler it and copy it later, I would say

[unreal saddle]

sees the books I suggested in the pinned comment link sniifff...I'm glad to contribute!

[tardy pecan]

i feel like i have to chime in at this point and am going to say that if the infinite and the divine get voted in will be absolutely not be mad because that book rules

[ripe cedar]

oo "Where should I start with reading about the 40K universe?"

that's an interesting topic

[tardy pecan]

but man i have the other two on deck and haven't listened to them yet

[ripe cedar]

how were you guys introduced

or which book was your first

[tardy pecan]

i've been vaguely aware of 40k since high school when one of my buddies press-ganged me into playing a match with him back in probably... 2004?

[unreal saddle]

The Imperium was covered already so I just splurged in a wall of text on chaos and eldar novels. Some of the books I suggested I haven't read but fans suggested them in my research.

[tardy pecan]

but i have not delved deep into it until these last few years

had a baseline knowledge of all the factions, etc, so i just went straight into the cain books to start with

[unreal saddle]

Also I got into 40k reading with gaunts ghost and the HH series

[tardy pecan]

since i've read all the gaunt ones, and a bunch of standalones, including the infinite and the divine

and... yeah the infinite and the divine is probably my favorite 40k book so far it's absolutely bonkers

you are all in for a very good time if that one gets selected

[ripe cedar]

oh yea, i had to leave a review for infinite and the divine. was just too good lol

im relatively new but i think i started backwards

[tardy pecan]

hey there's no bad way to start it!

[unreal saddle]

Honestly just pick and start

40k is too huge to do it right

[ripe cedar]

yea i know that's the cool part, i was so hooked and kept wanting to listen to more and learn about the universe

[tardy pecan]

and honestly, you'll get about seventeen different ideas on how to do it right, and there are so many books... just pick something that sounds fun and roll with the punches

[ripe cedar]

honestly, i dont think i would have been as interested in 40k if i started with gaunt's ghost

[tardy pecan]

we've got the power to look up shit you don't understand anymore on the fly

getting into 40k lore is even easier now than it has even been, and i love it.

yeah lux gaunt's ghosts took me a while to warm up to

but man once it gets good... boy does it get good

[ripe cedar]

oh definitely can see they've been adding a lot to the lore

in the past 3 years

[tardy pecan]

to the chagrin of some people, but i'm here for it

leagues book when black library

give it to me, i want to see space dorfs with sweet tech

very very interested in the current state of affairs in m42

pretty stoked on darktide being apparently set right in the middle of that too

or at least it seems that way

oh wait i'm on the darktide server, preaching to the choir

disregard that i'm going to go get another beer

[ripe cedar]

yea im still muddy about the regular imperium, guards etc. it's where i'm currently stuck at after finishing the horus heresy series, or at least like 40 of em. i finished most of the one's that get recommended by everybody

so now i need more lol

i really want to read more about the dark age and their wars

[tardy pecan]

that would be very cool but alas... salsa

[ripe cedar]

nada eh?

[tardy pecan]

that is lost to the sands of time or the warp or something hahaha

nah it's something they've just kept intentionally vague and i'm totally cool with that

it's a giant blank gap in history where you can come up with any kind of technomagic explanations for deus ex machinas that get yeeted out of continuity after a novel or something

[ripe cedar]

it's definitely one of the great mysteries that keeps you wondering

in 40k lore

[tardy pecan]

it's a super useful narrative device

[ripe cedar]

true

[tardy pecan]

i'm part of the cadre that is somewhat salty about the heresy getting fleshed out and really i do not care about the primarchs that much... but i'm not gonna lie there have been some really cool bits from what i have read from excerpts

but i am just not going to buy 55 books and however many more they have for the siege of terra unless i'm completely hellbent for it, haha

i paid for all the gg and cc shit, and have warhammer+, james workshop already has entirely too much of my money lmfao

[ripe cedar]

oh actually i agree with you on the fleshing out the primarchs but only in the sense about the shorter novels that are stricly dedicated to the primarchs ranging from 1 hour to 6 hours....

think they're the more recent ones

[tardy pecan]

those are standalone thingies or offshoots yeah?

idk regardless, i'm more interested in the post-heresy setting

it's one of those things where i kinda just know where it's going to go, how it ends, and i really don't care that much about the logistics as to how they got there

[ripe cedar]

it's a lot more interesting now that im diving further into the madness of the imperium for sure

but i guess it's the order in which i was introduced to the series

[tardy pecan]

yeah, i really appreciated the gaunts ghosts books for being set somewhere right in the middle of everything

the end result is a foregone conclusion, but you get to see some cool stuff happen along the way

along with ||imperial saints popping up in some of their first iterations i think??||

but the sabbat worlds crusade is long and done with in current times

[ripe cedar]

oh yea. for the sniper

[tardy pecan]

luv you larkin ❤️

man i played a match with an ogryn named bragg the other day

and that one really just had me turn on my mic and be all ||bro did you really have to ruin my day like this :(||

[ripe cedar]

me and my horus heresy stained brain was like, "yo, that statue is sus afffff.... got chaos written all over heerrrrr"

then turns out

she was the real deal

i lold

[tardy pecan]

yeeee hahah

[ripe cedar]

i was expecting a loyalist to eat a sniper round and his reality just falling apart hahah

[tardy pecan]

man, i am now seeing that the magos is the topic of the week

i need to finish the ravenor series before i can comment on this

i am almost done!

[timid cove]

<@&1016281173720309760> The library is open! Go discuss The Magos in #1047432998850674698. Remember that this read counts for two month streaks and will fill any missing months retroactively so you have a streak! The next book will be in January!

[tardy pecan]

i just got.. sidetracked. by... all the imperial guard books, like all 40 of them

praise the emperor i still have time, probably!

[jaunty stratus]

@wintry tinsel lol, looks like you can unspoiler again

[tardy pecan]

so am i correct in thinking that the magos is something to read after eisenhorn and ravenor, but before bequin?

[jaunty stratus]

oh, no I just cant read

[timid cove]

I can actually give BL vouchers this time

[tardy pecan]

i just got totally derailed by the shifting narrative perspectives in ravenor and lost interest

tell me when we get leagues books

[heavy juniper]

just finished crossfire by matthew farrer. enjoyed that quite a bit, goes a bit overboard with the mundane descriptions of religious rites and stuff on that specific planet. but very fun to get the arbites perspective, not much of that. it’s a little older, but all the language is there, mostly. published right after the eisenhorn trilogy I guess.

[tardy pecan]

i know you cannot lmfao

[heavy juniper]

fingers crossed for something announced this weekend at the BL preview!

[tardy pecan]

that's exactly what i am thinking too 🙏 🙏

arbites, like this is a book from the warhammer pdf cops perspective?

[heavy juniper]

yeah

[tardy pecan]

wild, how many of those have been done?

foregone conclusion again, none that i can think of, but that sounds actually kind of rad

[heavy juniper]

https://www.blacklibrary.com/authors/matthew-farrer/enforcer-omnibus-ebook.html

these at least

[tardy pecan]

i don't really have anything lined up outside of finishing up---

neato

yeah i'm wrapping up the devastation of baal's audiobook

i have all the ravenor stuff in ebook format thooooooo

[jaunty stratus]

I'm a bit dumb as it seems, but I cant write anything in the discussion channel, because no rights, or did I miss something?

[copper sphinx]

It's a forum, go out of that post

[tardy pecan]

threads to do be kind of weird, tbh

[jaunty stratus]

ah, so its a bit more sorted now?

[copper sphinx]

Makes it easier to collate the different shorts though

[timid cove]

let me rejitter hang on

try now?

[jaunty stratus]

jup, now I can comment under the posts

ups, was @timid cove

[tardy pecan]

look i'm getting there

i have an important beer to drink first!

i can only give the emperor's blessings to one user at a time

be patient with this old shiphand

[distant bramble]

i Just started with 40k Books, any recommendations?

i read 3. the first 3 from Ciaphas Cain, and want to continue the series.

where should i go on after the series?

[unreal saddle]

If you're interested in Imperium books then gaunts ghost could be a good go to next. If not then there is a pinned message that has a link to some novels on other factions including the Imperium.

[distant bramble]

oh i missed the pinned!
my bad. thank you!

[unreal saddle]

Its fine xD

[distant bramble]

since i am mostly interested in Chaos Space Marines, i now know what to read next 🙂 thank you.

[unreal saddle]

Welcome!

[wintry tinsel]

Heck but I am still working 😂

[cosmic stump]

The Talon of Horus?

and the Black Legion

[vernal bay]

Hey peepz! I'm just wondering has anyone heard of a darktide art book being made or anything like that? I only got to play a couple of hours but i was just in amazement

[thorn bison]

That duo slaps

Great pair of novels

[cosmic stump]

too bad we would never have a third one

[thorn bison]

We can always hope

[cosmic stump]

It looks like that it was planned before GW's Gathering Storm and Primaris stuff

with Guilliman back, Abbadon's claim is now clownish

"The time of Primarch has ended"

then Primarchs popped up like mushrooms

[orchid herald]

With eshinorn dead as it's now m42+ . Would we say that ravnor is the last of his trained successor? Also is ravnor still alive or has he passed to the emperor as well?

[cosmic stump]

I doubt he was dead though

since Alizebeth Bequin made it back

[orchid herald]

It been between 700-900 years. But is the bequin novels set before indomitus or after?

[cosmic stump]

Before I think

but the time period isn't a big thing here

since the Great Rift kinda messed up time here and there

in theory we are still in 999, M41

don't think GW ever shown a date after that

[orchid herald]

They have shown the date with some of the vigilus. Nachman guanlets and indomiyus crusade events as 42m is when the crusade is in full progress.

[cosmic stump]

again, time is not a big problem in Eisenhorn I think

he's not related to much of the main events

[orchid herald]

I would say the events of bequin is a big event in lore wise as it shapes the inqustion.

[tacit raft]

they shown

its M42

plus Indomitus crusade is over and it took roughly 200hundred yers

[cosmic stump]

guess I was wrong then XD

Indomitus lore is rather...boring in my opinion

most of those stories we loved about happened before or during M41

[orchid herald]

Well they haven't really had time to expand upon the story. That what 10th will be. Like raise of primarchs for 7th and vigilus ablaze 8th.

[cosmic stump]

the whole point is about "Primaris good, old type outdated"

aiming at selling their Primaris model rather than telling a good story

one thing I love about Darktide is we don't have to see the Astartes here

[quick moon]

Remember, it took over 9 years from Necron lore being rewritten to us actually getting good stories like Infinite and the Divine and Twice Dead King.

Gotta give the lore time to mature from something they just added to a setting with lots of interesting stories happening around it.

[craggy bone]

will it be just BL vouchers or can we get the GW ones like for the first few book clubs? After buying magos and infinite and the divine I got some change left so it was nice being able to also put in some other GW knick knacks for the couple of euros that were left in the wallet that weren't enough for another book

[quick moon]

Normally takes a pretty long while before new lore becomes old lore and just accepted and the real hits start getting picked out and enshrined as great moments.

[opaque adder]

Wait there's a 4th book in the eisenhorn trilogy and has been for years

[red lagoon]

yeah Magos, it's probably my favorite from the series

[opaque adder]

Well shoot, now I have something to read for the next few hours.

I had only just caught up on Bequin a few months back and I have no idea how far through horus heresy I am anymore.

[rotund junco]

I liked the cawl books for a break from good guys stuff, cawl may be one of the less brainlesslt evil traitors when you think about it (unless you count his whole replace the human race with genetic superhumans plan)

[cosmic stump]

I would say Gaunt's Ghost series are the best so far

I like Cain and Horus Heresy of course

[opaque adder]

I'm only aware of one Cawl book, what are the others?

[cosmic stump]

but Gaunt really work as a military novel series in 40K

[opaque adder]

I might have backed out of 40k books for a bit with the glut of heresy books.

[cosmic stump]

The Great Work

Cawl shown up here and there though

[opaque adder]

Yeah, I've read and own The Great Work.

[cosmic stump]

half of Wolfbane in HH is about Cawl also

when he was...younger

[opaque adder]

And not [spoiler]?

[cosmic stump]

No.

we all know Cawl is over 10,000 years old

[opaque adder]

I was more referring to one of the plot points from The Great Work

[cosmic stump]

which is...?

[opaque adder]

The blending?

[cosmic stump]

Ah, that took place in Wolfbane as well

[opaque adder]

Though I guess if you're in #40k-book-club most things are not spoilers.

[cosmic stump]

The Great Work has connections with the Dark Imperium more than other books though

[river creek]

Hey guys, new to warhammer where should I start? Eisenhorn?

#40k-book-club

[rotund junco]

Eisenhorn kind of relies on you knowing some lore already

[cosmic stump]

Dark Imperium

[main plover]

Eisenhorn series is a great start, but if you wanna dive deep into the lore through reading might as well read the horus heresy and siege of terra

[river creek]

Damnit lol, thats what i was going to start with because of the rec by dungeon and addies

[rotund junco]

Any of the space marine starter book packs are fun short reads

[cosmic stump]

then Horus Heresy

[rotund junco]

The horus heresy is great for endless ammounts of book and lore

[river creek]

Okay, Space Marine > Eisen > Hours

Got it

[rotund junco]

Gaunts ghosts is a nice more grounded story

[river creek]

just ordered ULTRAMARINES

lets go boys

[cosmic stump]

I hope we get a good Eldar book

[rotund junco]

Ultramarines or space wolves omnibus are nice starting reads

[cosmic stump]

I kinda like the pointy ears

[river creek]

u have pointy ears

[rotund junco]

The latter suffers from a nearly commical batman gadget belt of tools though

[torn silo]

I wouldn’t mind another Assassinorum book. Kingmaker was amazing.

[crisp geyser]

The best knight book we have is actually a assassin book lol

[river creek]

oh my gosh vol 2 of the ominubus is like 220$ on ebay

for ultramarines

is that right lol

[drowsy urchin]

it's second hand so the seller dictates the price

so not really

[onyx cave]

Starting Eisenhorn this morning

[cosmic stump]

hmmm, I would also recommend Helsreach

[outer monolith]

Thats wild considering when those books were originally releasing, I read most of them through the library system.

[cosmic stump]

you could buy a few Patrol Packs of models with that money

[timid cove]

It'll be a BL voucher for the next book

[craggy bone]

got it, thanks!

[hearty musk]

This might sound like heresy but for some reason I wasn’t super impressed with Helsreach

It felt like any other warhammer book. With some cool moments

[cosmic stump]

Heresy indeed.

[hearty musk]

Heresy it is

[cosmic stump]

I found the book more impressive after...well, the events that happened this year.

[karmic niche]

Holy cow, we have a book club

Turning books into clubs for the glory of mankind!

I see that today The Magos is teaching us how to attach the handles

Ill be back if I have time after work

[void stirrup]

Like, the book is well written. But agreed. It is a weird book where pretty much no character is likable. Helbrecht especially just reads like a cross between a medieval crusader and an SS officer. Which... Is kind of the point but hardly makes me want to read hundreds of pages from his perspective.

But on the note of Magos my favorite parts are weirdly the short stories. Pestilence, Demise of Titus Endor, and The Keeler Image are fantastic.

Love how the Keeler Image especially packs a punch/throwback when reading the Horus Heresy.

[red lagoon]

Agreed. I felt like the short stories were the best part of the book. They were really interesting on their own. Plus they tied up little bits and pieces of lore around Eisenhorn which was really cool to see. It also made the long form story in the second half of the book more enjoyable for me. Overall, it's probably in my top 3 favorite 40k books.

[nimble jungle]

i started reading the eisenhorn books, the tone is pretty interesting considering i’ve never read a 40k book before

only three chapters in but it was interesting how they name characters who are going to die two pages later, definitely exemplifies the expendable nature of humans in the imperium

[cosmic stump]

well that's Dan for you

he took it as a personal pleasure killing named characters

even better if they were other author's characters, that is

may I introduce the book Saturnine

one of the best Horus Heresy books

[hearty musk]

Saturnine was good but it had its bad moments

[cosmic stump]

which is...?

[hearty musk]

The entire EC being beaten within 1 chapter and then fucking off for the rest of the siege. I feel like that could have been handled better

Or maybe he ran out of time

[cosmic stump]

could be, but the scene is satisfying

[hearty musk]

Idk I feel like the payoff would have been better if they fought more competently and gave the fists more issue

Making it a massive close struggle which led to a EC rout would have been better from a book standpoint in my opinion

[quick moon]

Dan Abnett loves to do that. He'll described a character, how they got to their position, what their hopes and dreams are... and then feed them a bolt round to the head immediately after.

Then the named but supposedly irrelevant person they were with is followed for a while instead.

[tacit raft]

i still cant forgive them for ressurecting Loken

[cosmic stump]

well he wasn't dead in the first place

he's the Jon Snow of the series

[tacit raft]

His psyche died

and mine after that too 😀

[brisk arrow]

I’ve been reading infinite and divine but I stopped cause it was kinda boring honestly

Twice dead king ruin is a better necron book

[thorn bison]

I'll have to respectfully disagree with this opinion and ask you to keep reading it because it gets very intense

Twice Dead King is very good as well

[brisk arrow]

I will keep reading it at some point. Maybe tomorrow.

[thorn bison]

Good enough

[brisk arrow]

I just hit this point where i wasn’t enjoying it.

[hearty niche]

Hastur Sejanus 😢

[hearty niche]

what point if u can remember?

[brisk arrow]

I can check I have the book in my bag

I stopped on page 202

[hearty niche]

ohhh

just keep reading

[brisk arrow]

Okay

I’ll read it now on the train I guess

[hearty niche]

this is when the boys start working together and we get the banter

honestly, I don't think I'll ever find a book like infinite and divine again. Much prefer smaller scale stories then the grander galaxy-spanning epics 40k books tend to be

Give me a small gang of loveable assholes, like Night Lords

[hearty musk]

The Ghosts are like that

[brisk arrow]

I like Ciaphas cain

I like thanquol

[hearty musk]

I actually like that warhammer has both types of stories. Like we have the small scale Ghosts and then we have the massive Horus Heresy. It’s interesting

[brisk arrow]

And I like what’s his face from twice dead king

[grizzled beacon]

I started Gaunt’s Ghosts. Maybe 1/4 into the first Spacewolf book. Any other suggestions for a newer reader?

[zinc path]

Depends on what faction you're intrested in

could give a list depending on your favorite

[zinc path]

Lysicor the Duke of Deathmarks?

[hearty niche]

Night Lords...

[grizzled beacon]

I traditionally was into Space Marines, but obviously Darktide has swung me towards some more "normal" perspectives for now. I did read a bit of a Chaos book and it was pretty gnarly, I liked it. But wanna get a hold on the "big lore" that's taken place and go from there

[zinc path]

Dude. Blood reaver made me cry, especially after the scene with Talos Mom. The "I wanted to be a hero" scene also made me break down into tears like a little bitch

[hearty niche]

i'm still pretty early in it but holy crap man, thats some good writing

all the little nods back to the heresy

[zinc path]

Have you read the Fabias Bile trilogy? its a must read for chaos fans

[grizzled beacon]

negative. I am down but to round out my lore knowledge, should I start with something that talks about the origins of Chaos first? like first contact

[hearty niche]

Have you looked into the smaller short story compilations? There are some incredible little stories hidden away that most people sleep on

[zinc path]

that trilogy genualy made me like the renegade legions (traitor legions who hasn't fully sworn them selves to chaos I.E Night Lords and Iron Warriors)

[brisk arrow]

Try Ciaphas cain

[zinc path]

Named my Veteran Jurgen, now just waiting on the melta

[brisk arrow]

I also named my veteran Jurgen

Although I might make one called ollanius

[hearty niche]

I'm really glad GW actually put the effort into characterizing and humanizing CSMs. it'd be so easy to keep them as faceless villains with no personalities that only exist to get chewed up by blasters (it still depends on the writer ofc but I think BL does it better then most)

[zinc path]

Jurgen = Best boy

[brisk arrow]

Love me commissar, love me melta, love me porno slates, simple as.

[zinc path]

Another good CSM series is the Fabias Bile one

[zinc path]

Tanna sir?

[brisk arrow]

Have you read the short story where he solves a crime

I forget the name but it’s in the third omnibus

[zinc path]

yeah I've read that one, it made me convinced that Jurgen knows Cain is a self serving coward but is genuinely a hero. But sitcks with him cause he knows he is the closest thing Cain has to a best friend

[brisk arrow]

Well no one else would put up with Jurgen

And he can get away with virtually anything being a commissars aid

[zinc path]

would argue Amberly would. hell I'm also convinced the reason why Amberly didn't take Jurgen is cause he's her boyfriend's best friend

[brisk arrow]

She used Jurgen plenty

She wouldn’t take him because she knew other inquisitors would “borrow” him for shit and get him killed

That’s why it was always kept a secret

[zinc path]

cough cough Ordo Malious

[brisk arrow]

Some woul want him dead too

But there’s the sisters of silence

Who is a faction iirc that are based on terra

And are composed entirely of blanks

[zinc path]

lol, had a friend of mine (full warning dude is basically a Slaaneshi cultist, you'll see why) said that if the SoS were to find Jurgen, they would make him give them children to make more blanks

[brisk arrow]

I don’t think two blanks reproducing would make another blank

It’s just an extremely rare thing like pyskers

[zinc path]

well it is called the Pariah gene

keyword, GENE

[flat mesa]

What about for xbox dude

[brisk arrow]

Necron bullshittery

Also what about Xbox

[zinc path]

that got retconned, now its just a "natural phenomenon"

[brisk arrow]

[zinc path]

also what this about xbox @flat mesa

[heavy juniper]

xbox warhammer books 😂

[zinc path]

wtf

[heavy juniper]

only a couple chapters in, but really enjoying this new imperial guard psyker book so far. Witchbringer by Steven B Fischer https://www.blacklibrary.com/all-products/ebook-witchbringer-eng-2022.html

[tardy pecan]

oh that's out now?

that one looked very cool!

[heavy juniper]

it might be next or the week after for normal book store release

[random valley]

Hello,
My younger brother enjoys Necrons and their lore. I have almost no knowledge about books from necron perspective. He know 40k only through games and memes, but would like to get deeper in to the lore and his birthday is coming up. Is there anything you could recommend to me? Thank you for all the replies.

[thorn bison]

The Infinite and The Divine and The Twice Dead King: Ruin are two amazing Necron novels the I'm certain he would enjoy

Twice Dead King also has a sequel called Reign, in case he likes the first one

[hearty musk]

I can also attest that those two necron books are like well liked by everyone in the community

[full trail]

just coming in to spread some love, just finished Krieg's audiobook. starting on the Dark Imperium rn. ❤️

[random marlin]

I'm not attracted by Necrons at all, but I heard so many good things about The Infinite and the Divine that I'll probably end up reading it.

[zinc path]

It’s my favorite 40k novel and one of the few BL comedies

““What awaits us in the Maelstrom? What is the Hell’s Iris?”
Talos shook his head. “You will see with your own eyes, if the ship manages
to hold together for long enough to actually reach the docks there.”
“So it’s a dock.”
“It’s… Octavia. I am a warrior, not a scribe or a literist. I lack the words
to do it justice. Yes, Hell’s Iris is a dock.”
“You say that like it’s a curse. ‘I am a warrior.’” Octavia licked her dry
lips before speaking. “What did you want to do with your life?” she asked. “I
told you the truth: I’d always dreamed of guiding such a warship, and for better
or worse, fate gave me what I wished for. But what about you? Do you mind if I
ask?”
Talos laughed again, that same whispering chuckle, and tapped the defiled
aquila emblazoned across his chest.
“I wanted to be a hero.” A moment later, he masked his scarred face behind
his skulled helm. Red eye lenses stared at her, devoid of all emotion. “And look
how that worked out.””

(Excerpt From
02 - Blood Reaver
Aaron Dembski-Bowden. PG:151)

[random marlin]

Only read Spear Of The Emperor by ADB and I really liked it. Probably one of my favorite BL authors along with Peter Fehervari.

[heavy juniper]

love his horus heresy books. especially Master of Mankind

[thorn bison]

Do you mean Spear Of The Emperor? I'm reading that one right now, It's really good so far

[smoky zodiac]

Where's a good place or two to start into the 40k universe books? I played Vermintide for several hundred hours and am loving darktide so far. Also don't have anything to read currently so seems like a logical step to start in here but the universe is rather deep...

[abstract laurel]

@smoky zodiac Check pins!

[smoky zodiac]

Hah thanks. Always forget about pins on mobile

[random marlin]

Oops! Yeah, that's what I meant. 🙂

[thorn bison]

No problem, most people get the name of that book wrong so it's understandable

[random marlin]

Where are you at in the book?

[thorn bison]

Chapter fourteen, ||I just read how Anuradha killed a space marine and then saw her father asking her for water||, haven't gotten any further

[random marlin]

Ok, I see what part it is, definitely a good one! 😉

[quick moon]

For some reason I hadn't actually read Peter Fehervari's work outside of the short story in one of the AdMech collections and decided to rectify that given how many good things I've heard about Fire Caste

And man that was good.

[random marlin]

Ah ah, another converted joins the flock! 😄 About the story in the AdMech collections, was it Vanguard? Because this one is kind of an epilog to Fire Caste. Although the Dark Coil can be accessed from anywhere, Vanguard hits much harder if you've read Fire Caste before.

[quick moon]

Yup, I went back to reread it after looking into the Dark Coil and it got a lot darker.

Time to get the rest of his novels and start diving into what is no doubt a maddening labyrinth of prose

[rich raptor]

His writing is technically very good, top tier for BL

There's definitely a lot of fun historical references he makes too

I also think there's influecnce from contemporary horror sci-fi like the Vandermeer funguspunk genre

[quick moon]

He's got a really distinct style, it's evocative while being murky and steeped in mystery.

It's a huge contrast compared to Abnett and ABD and their generally more cinematic storytelling styles.

Surprised he isn't more popular given how good everything I've read so far has been.

[random marlin]

There's a great, 2-part interviews of Peter Fehervari on the Track of Words website, here's part 1: https://www.trackofwords.com/2018/05/19/peter-fehervari-talks-40k-and-the-dark-coil-part-one/

In this first part, he speaks about his inspirations, how he wrote Fire Caste and other very interesting stuff.

On the same site, there's a "traveller's guide to the Dark Coil", which shows ties between his various works, as well as a suggested reading order. But that's the beauty of the Dark Coil, you can start basically anywhere, you'll simply have a different experience from someone who has started somewhere else.

[vital owl]

How good are space marines?

[quick moon]

That's the blog post I read to figure out what else to read.

[quick moon]

Depends, good at what?

[rich raptor]

Amazing. The best

You're gonna love these marines

[hearty musk]

Kinda depends on the author as well

[vital owl]

good at fighting and stuff 👀

[hearty musk]

They’re definitely beastly in combat

[vital owl]

like compated to some random citizen

[hearty musk]

A company of marines is said to be able to take over most planets easily

[vital owl]

Oh wow so they not just cannon fodder?

[hearty musk]

Yeah

[vital owl]

Are they friendly with the Empire?

[thorn bison]

A squad could do that depending on the planet class

[thorn bison]

Space Marines are the shock troops of the Imperium

[vital owl]

ohhc

[thorn bison]

Yes, they're friendly

[vital owl]

could they conquer tertium?

[thorn bison]

Unless they're traitors

Easily

But they won't since it's technically still under Imperial control

[rich raptor]

They could, but there aren'tany around

[hearty musk]

The traitor marines are some of the main villains in the setting

[vital owl]

Ohhh

[thorn bison]

The territory is contested

[vital owl]

Why don the empire just make more of em?

[thorn bison]

can't

Also the law says no

Government is scared of them

[vital owl]

👀

[hearty musk]

This is all a big understatement and simplification btw

[vital owl]

Are the Inquisitors a part of them too?

[hearty musk]

The best way to understand marines is through reading

[thorn bison]

Yes, very much so

[vital owl]

I see

[thorn bison]

No, Inquisition is it's own faction

[vital owl]

Oh

[thorn bison]

A sub faction within the Imperium

[hearty musk]

There is like a dozen sub factions in 40k

[thorn bison]

yeah, some would say there's too many

[hearty musk]

Nah

[vital owl]

are the inquisitors meant to stop the traitor space marines?

[hearty musk]

They have several orders that have different jobs

[thorn bison]

The Ordo Hereticus deals with heretics (traitors)

Ordo Xenos deals with aliens and Ordo Malleus deals with magic and daemons

They're the three big ones

[vital owl]

Ohh I see

So the Ordos like marine armies?

[thorn bison]

No, the Ordos are regular humans with a lot of power and tech

[rich raptor]

No ordos are generalized philosophical/administrative groups within the inquisitoin

[thorn bison]

Like the Spanish Inquisition way back when

[vital owl]

ohhh

[thorn bison]

Space Marines are formed into Chapters

They serve and protect

[vital owl]

Do inquisitors act like witch hunters?

[thorn bison]

yes

[rich raptor]

yes

[thorn bison]

Hereticus does it the most

[vital owl]

I see

[thorn bison]

They're known as witch hunters by some people

[vital owl]

and they just normal humans?

[thorn bison]

Generally they are called the Inquisition or "The Emperor's left hand"

yes

[vital owl]

Wont they like get killed by witches a lot 🤔

[thorn bison]

mostly

Well yes, but actually no

[vital owl]

oh?

[thorn bison]

They are the best agents in the Imperium, very skilled at what they do

[quick moon]

Space Marines are heavily augmented to the point that they're not quite human anymore.
Inquisitors meanwhile are drawn from all across the galaxy and vary a lot.

[vital owl]

Or do they mostly just frame innocent people?

[quick moon]

But are mainly just people

[thorn bison]

they do that too

They're very rude individuals

[rich raptor]

A bunch of rude, crude radical dudes

[quick moon]

They're trained to resist psychic powers, tend to have bodyguards or even entire armies, and some are psykers themselves.
They also get all the cool toys to use.

[vital owl]

Like what would stop them from trying to frame some space marine chapters if they feel like it?

[thorn bison]

Nothing

But marine chapters generally don't like being framed

[quick moon]

The theoretically unlimited authority of the Inquisition goes about as far as they can push it.

[thorn bison]

They know the chapters are important though so they usually don't do that

[quick moon]

And the Space Marine chapters have tight bonds of brotherhood that make such accusations hard to pull off.

[thorn bison]

There are only two groups the Inquisition can't really touch, they are The High Lords (highest government in the Imperium) and the Adeptus Custodes (Emperor's bodyguards)

[vital owl]

I see

But other than that they can do whatever? 👀

[quick moon]

They might have the authority to blow up a Chapter's homeworld with barely any justification, but there will most likely be an accounting after, if not by the Chapters of the same lineage as the destroyed one, then by other Inquisitors who worked with that Chapter or are looking for weakness amongst their peers.

[thorn bison]

More or less yeah

There are the Space Wolves chapter who have had multiple wars with the Inquisition and come out on top

But they're a special case

[rich raptor]

it's happened before

[vital owl]

Oh wtf?

[rich raptor]

it's the space CIA

[thorn bison]

and FBI

and SÄPO

[rich raptor]

and KGB

[vital owl]

So if somebodys unhappy being investigated, theres always the try and murder em plan?

[rich raptor]

yes

[thorn bison]

and every other shadow orginasation

yea

[quick moon]

They watch the watchmen, those that watch the watchmen, and also the watchers that watch those who watch the watchmen.

[thorn bison]

A circle of observance

they're all very paranoid

[quick moon]

It's practically a job requirement.

[thorn bison]

Lmao yeah it really is

[vital owl]

Why arent they considered heretics?

[thorn bison]

They are the most loyal and powerful chapter of them all

They love the Emperor more than life itself and have served since the birth of the Imperium

They're also very distrustful of all outsiders and the Inquisition doesn't like that

It makes it very hard to send spies and infiltrators

[thorn bison]

This is debatable btw, some chapters are considered to be stronger but I'm slightly biased

[thorn bison]

The Inquisition do consider them to "be of heretical nature" but it would take ridiculous resources to bring them to their knees so they are generally left to defend the Imperium in their own way

[rich raptor]

They also have a lot of friends and history since they've existed as an institution for 10k years

And are generally one of the more helpful chapters which means they've made a lot of allies as well as having popular appeal

Honestly all the first founding chapters are borderline untouchable since they've been around for so long and have a looot of favors they can call in

[vital owl]

I see how much did they go against Inquisitors?

[rich raptor]

I think they straight up killed one

[vital owl]

Like murdering some witch hunters?

[rich raptor]

They had an escalating series of diplomatic incidents and general brinkmanship

And finally the inquisition showed up with a fleet at their homeworld and they threw down

[thorn bison]

And the Inquisition lost

again

No one can break The Fang

(That's their home fortress)

Also, as a tiny bit of help when it comes to names, here's a list of the original chapters, because why not

The nine original loyalist Space Marine chapters are:
The Dark Angels
The Iron Hands
The Space Wolves
The Imperial Fists
The Blood Angels
The White Scars
The Salamanders
The Raven Guard
The Ultramarines

They're all very old and very respected

All chapters come from them

[vital owl]

Ohh so they the originals?

[thorn bison]

Yeah, they were called Legions but were split after the big civil war

The Horus Heresy

[rich raptor]

There were origianlly 20 Space Marine legions

[thorn bison]

9 stayed loyal and 9 became traitors

don't think too much about the other 2

They don't exist

[vital owl]

💀

[vital owl]

I guess the Wolves also arent on speaking terms witg them either? 💀

[thorn bison]

not really, no

[thorn bison]

They usually tell them to piss off

[thorn bison]

This is great

[rich raptor]

I don't think it's official i think a fan made it

[thorn bison]

Explains the basics very well

Doesn't matter, it's accurate

Legion numbers can vary but more or less on point

[subtle briar]

I recently asked what books I should start with to get into 40k books. Just picked up the new eisenhorn omnibus at the suggestion of some people here. Excited!

[thorn bison]

You should check the channel pins for more great books!

I would personally recommend The Infinite and The Divine as it is an almost entirely unique story and incredible in all ways

[subtle briar]

Yep I double checked the pins before buying 🙂

Unfortunately my local Barnes and noble did not have that one

[thorn bison]

Fair enough

[subtle briar]

But I will order online

[thorn bison]

They should be ashamed

good idea

[subtle briar]

Thank you

[sweet surge]

anyone know which are the best White Scar book to read?

[subtle briar]

I should really utilize my library but I like collecting books lol

[sweet surge]

i feel personally attacked

[thorn bison]

Same lol

I have like 30 unread books on my shelf

And another 110 I have read

[sweet surge]

i recently had someone suggest i shold throw away books to make space in my apartment

what kind of heretic does that?

[thorn bison]

Absolutely ridiculous suggestion

clearly they've never owned a BL collection

[sweet surge]

or any books for that matter

lets be real ... behaviour like that is just despicable

[thorn bison]

Clearly, they've never owned property

[sweet surge]

they probably have never experienced love either

the childhood of a person like that musta been horrible

otherwise i cant imagine turning into one like them

anyways

anyone know which are the best White Scar book to read?

[subtle briar]

I just started reading again as a hobby and it’s become more of a collecting hobby lmao

We have over 100 books in our “library” at home as we call it and maybe 1% read

[thorn bison]

I read most of the books I bought before I got new ones but then BL had to go and release a bunch of really good books all at once and now I'm bogged down lol

[thorn bison]

Kharn: The Red Path

Just kidding

I don't know any books that are specifically about the White Scars that are well known to be good

I'd assume Warhawk from the Siege of Terra series is good

Since it features the big man himself

I've only really read books that feature the White Scars as side characters, I don't think there are that many books that focus on them

[hearty musk]

Scars, Path to Heaven and Warhawk

Those are all during the Horus Heresy tho

And read it in that order lol

[rich raptor]

yeah apparently my colelction of old BL and imperial armour books is worth like several thousand dolalrs now lol

[terse swan]

I've been buying most of my black library books on Kindle ngl

Or I listen to audible but I do sometimes wish I had them all on paper

[torn silo]

I get mine on Kindle too

[glass lintel]

Not a great place to start.

I&D needs a lot of existing knowledge.

[thorn bison]

Yeah? So does every other BL book. It's a good place to start because it's unique and will get you interested in the other books, not because it's simple

[glass lintel]

Yeah, but it uniquely hops into Exodites then Necron Court then Destroyer Cults then Orkz then Human then Genestealers then Dark Eldar then Guardsman then -

Lots of proper nouns and specific model names you wouldn't recognize otherwise.

[terse swan]

I maintain that the best places to start are EITHER Xenos or First and Only as a general rule. However gaunts ghosts come in Omnibus formats and that can be pretty nice.

[steady nest]

Dan Abnett needs to tell me what kinda shit he smokin

I can't piece together what a 30 wheel cargo transport would look like

[terse swan]

Basically a land train thingy? A big ass cargo crate with 15 wheels per side? Idk man the fucking guard will drive anything as long as it burns promethium lol

[rich raptor]

I guess 12 more than am eighteen wheeler

[left ore]

Long truck is long

But seriously though this universe has a walking robot so big it has a whole city on its shoulder and ships so long their underbellies are cities. So a 30 wheeler doesn’t seem too out of scale

[calm venture]

Yeah, trucks can haul a lot

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/58/Road_train_(25).jpg/1200px-Road_train_(25).jpg

Like that's 30 or more tires at least

[thorn bison]

I love how we genuinely cannot tell if something is unreal or realistic cause it's slapped into the 40k setting

[calm venture]

Goes to the old saying

Sometimes truth is stranger than fiction lol

40k just helps blur the line a bit

[neat saddle]

ive got one audible credit left. Im looking for a damn good book. Nothing that focuses on the traitor legions or whos main characters of part of Chaos. hit me with suggestions

[thorn bison]

The Infinite and The Divine

It's Necrons

[onyx crescent]

currently in the search of tau book can anyone recommend some good books to read? Thanks

[random marlin]

I've not read them myself but I heard good things about the Farsight trilogy: https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/02/19/commander-farsight-the-novels/

And another great book with Tau is Fire Caste but, unlike what the title seems to imply, the Tau are not the center characters of it, even if you do have POV Tau characters. Here's a review of the book from Reddit which sums up the book quite nicely:

Today I finished reading Fire Caste and I must say it is really an amazing book which I think all people interested in warhammer novels should try.

While seemingly well regarded among his fans Fehervari seems to be a divisive author and the book apparently didn't sold as much as hoped.

For me this books should be seen as a classic like the Fabious Bile or Nightlord trilogy or the Gaunt/Eisenhorn books.

I really like the personal touch that PF gives to the lore and setting, in many ways I think this may be the most grimdark of the warhammer books I read, here everything is really gritty, desperate and hopeless.

I often saw this book comparised to heart of darkness/apocalypse now in 40k and it certainly gives an idea about what to expect.

And while the real strength for me was in the atmosphere, setting and charachters I think that the combat parts too are very well written and above the average bolter porn of other 40k novels.

Also while almost or charachters were absolutely broken and unlikable I still empathized with and even rooted for them.

And while featuring mainly the imperial point of view the tau and kroot parts are really interesting and both sides are treated with respect and given both flaws and strengths.

And for Tau fans the tau here come off as a deadly and badass enemy to the imperium and the book shows that they absolutely can (also) fit in the darker portrayals of the setting.

So if you haven't give it a try!

[wet plover]

@alpine vale Just posting here for the final excerpt, it is very much left to the reader as to what exactly would have happened: (from Vaults of Terra: The Dark City)

‘You seem proud of your perversion.’

‘Perversion? Really? Your own people seem keen to gain our assistance, after all.’

‘I intend to stop them.’

‘I do not think you can.’

‘We shall see.’

Now it was the xenos’ turn to study him carefully. ‘It would be a mistake to try,’ it said. ‘I understand your loathing of us. In your position, I might feel much the same. But here is the thing – we need you.’

‘You prey on us.’

‘We do. Unavoidably. But that is immaterial here. If you are extinguished, then so are we. The physical galaxy becomes a howling wasteland, consumed by the warp, and we starve. That is what I intend to prevent. We must not starve. We must endure.’```

‘What were you doing, back there on Terra?’ ‘When we first met?

Seeing for myself what needed to be done. Assessing the foundations.’

‘I believed you were mad.’

‘Again, often alleged. But no, I had to make certain observations. For my own satisfaction.’

Crowl found himself becoming disorientated. It was hard to remember how he had felt back then. ‘I do not believe you,’ he said. ‘There is deception here.’

‘There is always deception. Believe me, though, when I tell you this. If the arrangements made here do not succeed, then your race is doomed. Maybe within a few years, maybe even centuries, but the day of destruction will surely come. We ourselves may find some alternative solution to that eventuality, but you will not. I say it again, since you seem to have trouble understanding it – this is extinction. Final, irrecoverable.’ The creature cracked its knuckles unpleasantly. ‘Set against that, I have some trouble understanding why the prospect of this bargain going ahead, with all of its imperfections, continues to vex you.’

‘Because there has to be a better way.’

‘Name it, then.’

‘The Throne was created by the Emperor. He is our guide and our judge – He must show us the path.’

The creature sighed, briefly exposing its blackened needle-teeth. ‘Shall I cushion the blow for you? Or simply tell you here and now that the Emperor did not create the Throne, but adapted it from a thousand different stolen artefacts of older races? Or that its function is misunderstood by your people, and that if you ever discovered the truth, it would, at the very least, rip your deluded empire in half? That worst of all, the Emperor you place so much store by is entirely irrelevant to the machine’s ongoing function?’```

‘Detain him!’ ordered Raskian, and fifty skitarii instantly moved to comply.

‘Hold!’ ordered Navradaran, and he gestured to his companions. Two of them, moving faster than any of the tech-guard, smoothly interposed themselves between the parties, shielding Crowl from assault.

By then, the xenos had reacted too. ‘What is this?’ demanded the archon, her voice still emerging with a fractional delay through the translexers. ‘No more obstructions – all has been determined.’

‘No, he will be heard,’ countered Navradaran, striding down from his high position and to the forefront of the Imperial lines. All around him, Militarum and skitarii zeroed their weapons at the xenos ranks. Two further Custodians moved into position to protect Crowl, leaving four standing vigil close to the caskets. It suddenly felt like one false move, one twitchy trigger finger, might bring the whole thing crashing down around them.

‘All is ordained, inquisitor,’ said Raskian. ‘You are clearly unwell. Withdraw now, and you shall not face further sanction.’

Crowl didn’t listen. He barely seemed aware of the Fabricator General’s presence. To the extent he was talking to anyone now, it was Navradaran. ‘They have made their own. Their own Throne. I have seen it, I have seen the work on it, and it is nearly finished.’ He stretched out a clawed hand, pointing at the archon in denunciation. ‘All lies! You said you wished to keep us alive. Maybe true, but this was never about us, was it? It was about you.’

Then Crowl whirled around to face the Custodian again. ‘Their city is under attack. Just like Terra, just like everywhere else. They are reeling. They are losing. The warp is spilling through every crack in their defences, and they need a way to staunch the flow.’ He began to choke, to throw up blood-spatters, but forced himself to keep going. ‘And that is what the Throne does, isn’t that right? It guards against destruction. It holds back the flood. It is the last, the best, shield against the ruin of the universe.’ He turned on Raskian at last, eyes staring, cloak flying out wildly. ‘And you taught them how!’ he shouted bitterly. ‘Everything you’ve given them, all those exchanges of data and schematics, it was just what they needed. They already know so much more than we do, and we gave away the few scraps they couldn’t work out themselves. You did it, my lord! You sold your birthright cheaply!’```

particularly the line "‘All lies! You said you wished to keep us alive. Maybe true, but this was never about us, was it? It was about you."

Either way, the best writing is always left up to the reader to decide IMO, and the plot point is never really 100% going one way to say "This was 100% a scheme that was completely a lie", or if part of it could be true.

And the part where the DE says the throne doesn't need the emperor would be technically true if they could clone him and keep the clone under their control (thus keeping the astro working in perpetuity, the Imperium lives on, but forever stuck as prey). Which would obviously be the optimal DE ending, so it makes sense that it was the goal they were aiming for.

[cosmic stump]

and we all know it is the brightest idea to mess with the Gods

[wet plover]

Hey, isn't that part of the fun? 😛 And either way the Imperium is kinda screwed as it stands currently if the Throne is failing anyway. This was all from me saying that we should have DE playable characters in darktide (and probably other xenos like Orks), since radical inquisitors have been known to use xenos. Besides, if you could convince a few xenos to go do a suicide runs in a hive city, it's not exactly a big deal (and I'm sure you can hand-wave it around as just individuals who are bored and looking for things to do).

[cosmic stump]

I don't mind playing as a Wych anyway XD

[wet plover]

Yeah, I just want my shade back, might as well make her a Wych haha.

[rotund junco]

The issue with orks

Is that after they get the job done if they decide they wanna stay its hard to remove them

See armageddon for examples

[strange crypt]

If yall looking to dip your toes into the books eisenhorn series is a really good starting place i just finished book 1 and started book 2

[cosmic stump]

I actually prefering Gaunt than Eisenhorn

[wet plover]

@rotund junco I mean it's probably easier to get rid of a few rogue orks compared to an entire nurgle cult, tradeoffs right? XD

You'd only import a few at a time of course, and no warbosses.

[cosmic stump]

Bloodaxes

they were born for this

[wet plover]

Yep, give us dark eldar wyches (low ranking ones), orks, other xenos, it'll be fun to hear all the voicelines from that 😄

The Zealot already doesn't react enough IMO when the loner psyker talks about the "carrion emperor"

[terse swan]

The helsreach one is hella good

[graceful osprey]

Catachan Devil is also a good audiobook. the narrator does a great job of switching between the young recruit protagonist and the catachan veterans, plus the other half is ork POV which is always a fun listen

but you can't go wrong with helsreach

[midnight wind]

Anyone else here from Canada?

I made a discovery the other day at my local indigo/chapters that they release some Black Library books before they're out of pre-order in store. I found Sanguinis primarch book there on the day it went for pre-order

[onyx crescent]

Thanks man 😎

[misty jetty]

I'm in Nova Scotia, our Chapters are slowly getting rid of the Warhammer section, Fantasy/AoS is completely gone and the 40k section restocked in months. Glad to hear this isnt everyhwere

[midnight wind]

Yeah doesn't seem to be everywhere thankfully. My sister who used to work there said they pick up during the holidays. Someone who works there now said she just got orders of stuff so looks like they're picking up. I just hate how the website has nothing

[kindred pine]

Reading the Grey Knights omnibus. On book 2/3. Each chapter starts with a quote. Really wish my zealot would say "The enemy of my enemy dies next." I think they developer stepped back some of the girmdarkness you can find in the books.

[unreal storm]

What's a good book to suggest to someone who hasn't read any 40k books?

[random marlin]

Check the latest pinned message! 🙂

[thorn bison]

I noticed that under the Tau tag in the pins there's a Necron book but no Tau books

Thought it was funny how it says
Tau:
All you could ever need about Necrons!

[frank mirage]

ciaphas cain books

though the third one in the series is actually impossible to get

saviour of the imperium is practically non existent

[glass lintel]

If they know absolutely jack about Warhammer, assign them either Baldermort (my preference) or Adeptus Ridiculous' podcast videos for

The Imperial Guard
Genestealers

• and then send them to Ciaphas Cain, or add-on the Ork and Necron episode, and send them to The Infinite and the Divine.

Otherwise, The Night Lord Omnibus (Soul Hunter, Blood Reaver, Voidstalker) succeeds on it own without needing knowledge of the rest of the setting, like the original Star Wars trilogy.

[nova field]

i've been trying to get my hands on the 2nd gaunts ghosts omnibus. its so expensive. the first omnibus was about 15 quid, but everything online is AT LEAST 50 quid for the second one. i've seen the paperback go for £200. i lucked out and found one for £12 but that got cancelled for some reason and i got refunded. anyone know why that one specific book is so expensive compared to the second

[frank mirage]

reminds me of me trying to get saviour of the imperium i dont know if anyone even owns a paperback version of that book

[midnight wind]

Honestly, and people may disagree, but watch some podcasts or videos first, after that, i feel like you can read honestly anything and not feel too lost. Like was said before, Adeptus Ridiculous is great, but I can't help but feel like I don't enjoy their random videos on a really specific aspect: like tanks, or titans, or orc vehicles. I personally prefer their more narrative ones with several parts, like their Legion/Primarch videos.

Another one I've enjoyed a lot has been Luetin on Youtube.

After that, I've been able to have a good understanding on every book I've read without feeling too lost. BUT, if I had to choose a series to start with, Horus Heresy. I'm loving it so far

[wraith wasp]

Yeah I'd just say start with Horus rising

Not too much lore dumping and it has decent pacing

[rich raptor]

I seriously don't recommend starting with Horus Heresy

The quality of the books is very uneven, they're a prequel series for people who are already superfans, and it's like 30+ books and isn't even finished yet

Far better to start with one of the standalone imperial guard books or the inquisition books like Eisenhonr

[hearty musk]

Yeah the later HH books are good as well as the earliest ones

A lot of the ones in the middle kinda suck ass

[rich raptor]

I think you'd be better off getting one of the Black Library short story collections id you want to get an introduction to 40k

Lots of variety, no big time committment, you get a taste for how varied rhe universe is, and tou can start finding authors you like

Then you can look up the books that writer did

[hearty musk]

Start off with Dark Imperium lol

It’s a gateway to the modern 40k setting with the primarch awaken

Solid action

[rich raptor]

Like uh Let the Galaxy Burn, Best of Hammer and Bolter something like that

Dark Imperium the short story collection?

I think it's out of print now

But it is good

But i think everything from Dark imperium was republished in let the galaxy burn

[noble glacier]

The Cadian Blood short story from the Honour Imperialis collection was a good lead in to Darktide. Its about Cadian infantry fighting a nurgle cult/infected in a shrine world

[quaint siren]

Eh, anyone have a good sisters book to recommend? Already read Faith and Fire, Hammer and Anvil as well as Requiem Infernal (easily the best 40k novel I’ve read up till now)

[heavy juniper]

mark of faith was ok. and the celestine one

[thorn bison]

Book of Martyrs was pretty good

[heavy juniper]

I’ve got requiem infernal. and all the other peter fehervari books and short stories lined up next 😀 doing the reading order they had listed on trackofwords

he’s got a new short story upcoming in the BL advent calendar too. more angels resplendent. a new danie ware sisters short story there with augusta santorus as well 🙂 also enjoyed those short stories I should have said, for the sisters. was collected this year in the book ‘the rose at war’

[random marlin]

@heavy juniper That's great to hear about the new PF short story, that makes my day! And I hope you'll "click" with Fehervari's style as much as some of us do here. 🙂

About the reading order, although I agree about the Phaedra arc to be read in one go, I always thought that the Dark Coil could be approached from any book or short story, simply you'll have a different journey from someone who started elsewhere, with different answers and different questions. ^^ But maybe I should try this suggested reading order, it'll be a new excuse for me to read his books again. :p

And did you finish Witchbringer? How was it?

[heavy juniper]

not yet, about a third through witchbringer. really enjoying it.

yeah, I did see can read those 'dark coil' stories in any order, but since I think I have not read any of them at all yet I figured I might as well go with like a chronological order instead of published order. had managed to accumulate a surprising amount of the different fehervari short stories in different anthology books without realising it. well, like 5. but still lol.

[bleak mauve]

So I tried to check if my local library has "The infinite and the divine", they do not. Luckily enough though they had a few alternatives. I now have the books: "Belisarius Cawl The Great Work", "Yarrik Imperial Creed" and "Sons of Sanguinius A Blood Angels Omnibus". Are these good books?

These are ordered in how interested/excited I am to read them.

[clear dust]

Depends what is your favorite faction Guard, Astartes, etc..

[bleak mauve]

Necrons and Adeptus Mechanicus are currently my tied favourite. Imperial guard 11th and space marines 13th

[clear dust]

Yarrick is about a Commissar , Blood Angels are Astartes fighting for survival you might have characters from Mechanicus but they are going to be side characters 🙂 Don't get me wrong they will be good reads i think Blood Angles are going to be fun since James Swallow wrote them and he is a good writer.,

[clear dust]

The problem is that from necrons you have maybe 5 books, and from the mechanicus you have one book from HH series Mechanicus, newer sereis Rob Sanders( Skitarius, Tech Pries, Adaptus Mechanicus), Graham McNeill ( Priests of Mars, Lords of Mars, Gods of Mars).

[bleak mauve]

Hmm. Makes sense as to why I couldn't find them at the local library then

I'll try to find them on ebay or amazon or something like that in the future

[clear dust]

Well actually it a miracle you found some in a library. They might be $$$ if they are no longer in print look on Black Library and Games Worskhop first if it is cheaper then Amazon, or here

https://www.bookdepository.com/search?searchTerm=warhammer&search=Find+book

[bleak mauve]

I actually found around 8 warhammer books (7 40k, 1 fantasy) alongside other AOS books

[clear dust]

The Twice-Dead King: Ruin 15 Euros Necron

[grim anvil]

For starting books, I'd recommend Gaunt's Ghosts, or any series by Dan Abnett really.

[thorn bison]

The Infinite and The Divine is probably the best Necron book yet, tied for first place with Twice-Dead King

Oh nevermind you know about that one already, mb

Still good tho

[civic rune]

gg

[random marlin]

I didn't find Yarrick Imperial Creed very good, but that may be a taste thing. And if you haven't read a lot of guard/commissar books, there are overused tropes in it that probably won't bother you as much as me.

[bleak mauve]

Actually I haven't read any warhammer books as of yet, these 3 will be the first

[clear dust]

Hardcore start if you ask me

[keen sluice]

Is there any work on a Darktide novelization?

[clear dust]

i havent heard about it

[flat crest]

Why not Horus Rising?

[autumn totem]

Some folks prefer the "modern" 40k stories that cover what's currently happening in the tabletop stuff.

[flat crest]

Ahhhhh makes sense.

I'm a 30k fanboy

[autumn totem]

I don't really care about the heresy stuff but I've got 60+ audiobooks I've listened to of the modern 40k stuff.

[flat crest]

Just finished horus rising and am working on galaxy in flames now.

Are the 40k books not unbelievably depressing?

[lucid plank]

I mean

It's 40k

It's also what you read, Caiphus Cain is pretty light hearted compared to some others

[autumn totem]

It depends.

Books like Cain do add some levity yes.

[lucid plank]

Then you have the night lord trilogy.

[autumn totem]

But then you have books like Brutal Kunnin' which is the orks vs the admech and the mix of dark, admech logic, and ork shenanigans that make it an absolute joy to read.

[crisp geyser]

It has been bothering me so bad to figure out why the bodyguard voice is so familiar. Then I realized it sounds just like gol kolea from the ghosts audio books, sure enough its voiced by toby longworth and that makes me so happy.

[uncut sorrel]

Heyo, I'm trying to figure out what books to read in chronological order for the whole Guilliman arc of ressurection and whatnot.

(audio books would be great as well, I have trouble reading often due to a condition. )

[thorn bison]

The two series you've got to read are Dark Imperium and Dawn of Fire

I don't know the chronology of those books though, so someone else will have to help there

[cosmic stump]

I would recommend you guys give Necropolis from Gaunt's a look

I would say one of the best Gaunt's and one of the best Imperial Guards' books

it got a feeling of Know No Fear

[crisp geyser]

Its not a book, though it should be. all of those books take fire post ressurection but obviously talk about it and focus a alot on him. The story from gathering storm: "rise of a primarch"is the story of his actual ressurection, though its not great imo, but I know some who liked it.

[graceful osprey]

how far into the series are you?

necropolis is excellent but no spoilers there's also some pretty cool payoff in the later stories

[graceful osprey]

Dawn of Fire comes first chronologically. Dark Imperium is set near the end of the Indomitus Crusade first stage (the events of Dawn of Fire), and deals with the Death Guard war on Ultramar

@uncut sorrel if you can find a pdf online the Gathering Storm campaign books from the end of 7th edition describe his actual resurrection

that said Dawn of Fire is an ongoing series while Dark Imperium is a trilogy with a resolution so its not really a huge deal. Dark Imperium released first so I read it the other way around

the events of Gathering Storm sort of appear in the Watchers of the Throne custodes novels, but minus a lot of the cool parts as they pick up when Guilliman reaches Terra

[cosmic stump]

up to Warmaster

[graceful osprey]

ahhh so you're almost there!

[cosmic stump]

yeah, I don't know if there's another book beyond Warmaster

but so far Necropolis is my favorite

[graceful osprey]

I really enjoyed Armour of Contempt and of course when it starts getting into command politics around Warmaster

only Anarch is after Warmaster

[cosmic stump]

since Gaunt ||got the best girl in the sector|| in Necropolis

[graceful osprey]

the Vincula Insurgency was published most recently, but its a novella set very early in the Ghosts timeline

like not long after Necropolis

[shrewd silo]

I don't know why but know no fear audiobook was extremely hard for me to follow and besides a few scenes I couldn't get into it.
That said necropolis is in the top 3 40k books for me

[cosmic stump]

well Know No Fear is my first 40K book

and it is very much like reading a battle report from the beginning

all the chaotic and panic

heavy losses in the first hours

much like Pearl Harbour

[shrewd silo]

Yeah it was actually easy to follow for me but at some point I just lost all the characters after a while and didn't understand what was going on

[cosmic stump]

named characters kept getting killed in the next pages

[shrewd silo]

Like who are these people are they the ones doing this objective or the other ones

I don't even know what happened to the dreadnought that had some great monologuing

[cosmic stump]

Hail, Dan Abbott, GRRM of the 40K

[graceful osprey]

ok I'm glad you said it because while I liked Know No Fear I went into it expecting one of the greatest space marine books that completely changed people's perspectives on ultramarines

what I got was a pretty conventional ultramarines vs. word bearers battle book

[shrewd silo]

But gaunts ghosts and the inquisitor series are some of my favourite 40k series

I only upto book 20 on the HH seires so only 40 more or something

[graceful osprey]

it certainly wasn't a bad battle book. I don't understand why its so highly acclaimed though >.>

I can only conclude that earlier ultramarines books were just that bad

[cosmic stump]

no one expected the U guys nearly got their teeth knocked off that badly

[shrewd silo]

I'm thinking about reading it again just to figure out what happened to half the cast

[cosmic stump]

and damn they are brave

[graceful osprey]

ahhhh. so it's just that the ultramarines take a big L when they hadn't really up until then?

well not just, it's an abnett book its definitely well written

[cosmic stump]

they were pretty much Gary Sues in the old books

all polished and Codex prefect lads

but Know No Fear shown the best of them

[shrewd silo]

I got to say Abbott really makes his hero's just OP as fuck

Like I read traitor general

[graceful osprey]

one of my earliest 40k books was the Uriel Ventris series, which is in part about Ultramarines who fuck up big time

so I guess I never really understood that vibe

[shrewd silo]

||whole squad of obliterates||

[cosmic stump]

"If a victory not won in Codex's way, then it was not a victory but heresy"

[graceful osprey]

yeah I get the complaints about their codex compliance being pretty lawful stupid

[cosmic stump]

"It was I, Cato Sicarius, that is prefect, for I, Cato Sicarius——"

[graceful osprey]

I think part of the problem is I've read too much written after know no fear

[sullen isle]

i was watching lore vid and i see those massive normal soldiers going to battle is there books about them

[graceful osprey]

so instead of being an amazing new take on ultramarines its kind of what I expected from them

[graceful osprey]

if you're thinking of space marines. the guys with big armor and cool helmets, there are a lot of books about them

[sullen isle]

no not space marines

[graceful osprey]

oh ogryn?

[cosmic stump]

I blame GW for making a lot of earlier books just to boost their model sales

[sullen isle]

Imperial Guard

[graceful osprey]

like the big guy from the game?

[cosmic stump]

while wasting the potental of 40K world

[cosmic stump]

Imperial Guard books? a lot

[graceful osprey]

i'm not exactly sure who you mean by massive normal soldiers but there are a lot of imperial guard books

[cosmic stump]

there are Gaunt's Ghosts, and Ciaphas Cain books

Cadia Stands

Cadian Blood

[graceful osprey]

cadian blood just got an audiobook released and its arguably the best book about cadians

[shrewd silo]

I like the cain book but I at the same time I like gaunts ghosts a lot more

[cosmic stump]

Cain books are more easy and funny than the rest of 40K books

like, the dude is the son of Emperor and Slaanesh

[shrewd silo]

That's true I do like them for that

[cosmic stump]

since both blessed him along the way

Gaunts' are more militaristic

closer to Starship Trooper type

[graceful osprey]

this is a little behind the scenes british culture stuff

but Gaunt's Ghosts is more or less an adaptation of the Sharpe novels/tv series into 40k

Sharpe is a recently decorated military officer common born but promoted through the ranks during the napoleonic campaign given command of a troublesome unit of elite veteran rifles. at first they don't like Sharpe at all but over time he wins their grudging respect because he's not an aristocrat and is a good leader

[shrewd silo]

Actually worst GG book I read so far was the WW1 themed one.
Worst CC book is that one with the space hulk.
I have only listed to the current audiobooks tho

[graceful osprey]

the tv show actually holds up fairly well, Sean Bean's breakout role

[cosmic stump]

actually, there are two largely overlooked books

Gothic War: Execution Hour and Shadow Point

[shrewd silo]

Cains last stand and necropolis Are probably the my favourites

But traitor general was also great

[graceful osprey]

the Gordon Rennie books are fantastic

its rare you encounter someone else who has read them

which is a shame because they're awesome Imperial Navy stories

[cosmic stump]

well met, fellow Imperials

[sullen isle]

can anyone become space marines or they create them

[graceful osprey]

also its pretty tough to find physical copies anymore

[cosmic stump]

only males

one in millions

[graceful osprey]

they are recruited at adolescence from the chapter's founding/recruitment world

put through a rigorous training and screening process which can kill or maim you

[cosmic stump]

and you have to get into selection before 10 I believe

[graceful osprey]

if you survive that, they start the surgery and gene therapy

that kills off more

[cosmic stump]

few survived the process

[heavy juniper]

unless it's space marine for world eaters/death guard

[shrewd silo]

It's weird how they sort of have elaborate back stories all the time in HH but they need to be children to get implanted.
Unless your a long fang

[graceful osprey]

basically only the strongest physical and mental candidates make it through everything

[cosmic stump]

in rare cases, adults can

as in the first Dawn of War book

a younger Guardsman officer eventually became a Blood Raven

[shrewd silo]

Yeah the space wolf short in HH had some

[graceful osprey]

the one example I can think of is Kor Phaeron

he was Lorgar's foster father, not a space marine

they slapped a bunch of bespoke implants in him to level him up

[cosmic stump]

they should let him try the process and die in agony

[graceful osprey]

that said Phaeron was often mocked as a "half-astartes" but he was the first captain

[cosmic stump]

same with Luther

[sullen isle]

is warhammer 40k darktide canon?

[cosmic stump]

Darktide is too unimportant to be canon

[graceful osprey]

canon can sometimes change with GW, but more or less yeah

right insofar as it doesn't have any impactful lore moments

nothing about it is clearly non-canon

[cosmic stump]

like, this IS the daily life of Imperium

[graceful osprey]

its a very faithful look at a random Imperial system

[cosmic stump]

800,000 penals got killed while over 4 billion heretics were purged?

Vast Imperium victory

[graceful osprey]

we're making it sound a little like its unimportant but it's a theme of 40k that this kind of apocalyptic warfare is going on all over the place

its a tuesday for the imperium of man

[cosmic stump]

End Times in daily life in 40K

[graceful osprey]

there was a point when tertium hive wasn't an active warzone before the events of Darktide, but these kinds of chaos invasions or cultist uprisings are very common in the setting

[cosmic stump]

4 rejects can banish a Daemonhost

[graceful osprey]

ok so maybe not all aspects are canon faithful

[cosmic stump]

whom can easily wiped out squads of Astartes

[graceful osprey]

but I would argue that wildly different power levels depending on the author is also very on brand for 40k 😛

[cosmic stump]

or the Host is possessed by a very pathetic daemon

[graceful osprey]

if they ever added a chaos space marine boss this community would melt down completely

[cosmic stump]

Ah.

send in four veterans with bolters then

he will be dead before lunch

[rich raptor]

I mean CSM lost their big war

They're just salty and skulk around the eye of terror blaming each other

[sullen isle]

if bolter was so powerful way dont they give it to anyone i only saw it with space marines

[rich raptor]

Anow

[cosmic stump]

Do take a look at the Talon of Horus

[rich raptor]

They're expensive

The munitorum would never authorize the expense

[graceful osprey]

they're also fairly difficult to fire. there's a big kick to it

not a problem for a space marine

[cosmic stump]

those CSMs fight their Long War for 10,000 years

[rich raptor]

Now the ministorum, they love to overspend, that's why everry battle sister gets a bolter snd power armor

[cosmic stump]

making them much more experienced than a common Space Marine

[rich raptor]

The munitorum is the real hero, defending the imperial taxpayer from this kind of waste

[graceful osprey]

the great rift finally gave chaos a win but they sadly haven't done much to follow up on their victory. hoping Arks of Omen is cool

[rich raptor]

Nah way less than 10,000 years has passed for most of them due to the time distortion of the warp

Though maybe occasionally more?

[graceful osprey]

its all relative basically. they're way older than we can understand being space marines but not all of them have 10,000 years of memories even if they were fighting in the heresy

[shrewd silo]

If you check out the night lord series they do that.
Plus they call the current ones thin bloods

[rich raptor]

Yes ive read them

They call em names as a cope

While jealous that they get all the materiel plus still have a purpose

[modern swift]

I wanna start getting some 40k books, what are the good ones and what's the order in reading them? also is it alright if I start with dark imperium? I wanna read it before playing a vet 😄

[surreal solstice]

im reading the Horus Heresy in bursts of 3 books at a time. i finished Horus Rising, False Gods, and Galaxy in Flames this year. which 3 should i read next, and are they any i can skip?

although i guess HH is technically a 30K book series...

[wicked tree]

The Dark Imperium and Dawn of Fire series will catch you up on what’s currently happening in the setting, though they predominantly centre around Space Marines.

You could check out the Ciaphas Cain, Gaunts Ghosts or numerous Cadian novels for a better Vet perspective

[modern swift]

So is there actually an order to it or is every book a different story and I can just go through them however I want?

[wicked tree]

Most of the 40k books take place roughly within a 100 year time span save the newer novels.

So there’s some freedom to jump around between the series. Though said series have an order to read them in

[glass lintel]

@surreal solstice
30k books are all a mythology. Skip the legions and primarchs you don't care for. Worst case, it keeps the Horrid Nofun campaign vague and in your imagination. Best case, you realize the Heresy started because Horus hates taxes.

[random marlin]

ALso check the pinned message for additional info. 😉

[random marlin]

This video may be helpful to you 🙂 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1m8gmu3Nyc

[wicked tree]

Mmm, as Arty said for the HH you can follow the books in order if you want. Or you can jump around in order to follow the arc of a specific legion/character(s)

[nova flume]

Is there any known update on release date for the new siege of terra book?

Other than just 2023 generally

[autumn totem]

Not yet.

[crisp geyser]

GW is terrible about release dates being specific. Until it’s pretty much right Around the corner but pretty solid on keeping to the year they say it will be out

You won’t get “winds of wintered” by them if you are worried about it lol

[nova flume]

😭

I just want to read about big E and the boys tping behind Horus

[shrewd silo]

There's a whole bunch you can skip if you really want to that just have 0 impact on the big picture but make the universe feel fleshed out.
Like nemesis was basically a self contained story that was a really fun read while battle for the abyss was just all round forgettable and made the word bearers look like idiots.
Out cast dead was also a self contained story but it's got a lot of great info on how stressed terror is after the whole gate thing

[nova flume]

Just don’t skip master of mankind

[dreamy ledge]

Bought Luther first of the fallen! I hope I like it

[hearty musk]

Does anyone know any good Imperial navy books?

I feel like they're extremely under utilized

compared to pretty much every other subfaction within the Imperium

other then maybe the Knights

[autumn totem]

The Dawn of Fire books have some good navy scenes.

devastation of Baal has some space marine navy stuff.

Some gunners do so well the marine captain rewards them with extra rations and an extra 6 minutes of sleep. Fucking Christmas has come early.

[hearty musk]

Mhm maybe ive been sleeping on the Dawn of Fire books

just that the first book didnt impress me

[autumn totem]

Avenging son and gate of bones are good.

Wolf time is pretty meh and throne of light was ok.

[hearty musk]

I feel like they could have written the series better

Do the books have continuity?

Like the characters from the first book carry to the next type of thing

[autumn totem]

They do.

You could probably skip Wolftime if you really wanted to. But I don’t like the space wolves so yeah.

[hearty musk]

Im fine with them when written well

If written poorly they might be the worst chapter to read about

[autumn totem]

Yeah.

I don’t like them in general so I couldn’t tell if it’s even decent. XD

[hearty musk]

I liked them in Prospero Burns

and when they fought Horus

but thats not really the chapter per say

[abstract laurel]

The Gothic War ones were a classic. The Night Lords trilogy also has some good writing. And there's some shorts here and there on Navy flyers, plus the Sabbat Worlds books on the Phantine Air Corps.

[hearty musk]

ohhh i like aviators as well

[abstract laurel]

But the only full Navy-centric books are the Gothic War ones and one other I can't remember the name of.

[hearty musk]

Oh yeah what’s the general consensus for the new 2023 Black library reveal

Avenging Son was ok. But I wasn’t impressed. Some here said that it was a good tho so people have conflicting opinions

Ah yeah so read the first few HH books first. They’re pretty well written

I liked Fulgrim a lot

Based

Look for anything written by Dan Abnett, Aaron Dembroksi Borden or Chris Wraight and you won’t be disappointed

[glass lintel]

Eeeeeeeeeh

Dan Abnett doesn't have stakes, and AD-B's talent is still limited by the quality-ceiling of a Primarch Book™️.

[heavy juniper]

yes, beginning of march in normal book stores for the regular hardback. a week or two before that on preorder during black library celebration on gw site, so preorder for limited edition and so on like 18 or 25 february, and start shipping out the week after. they'll probably have all the detailed info on the warhammercommunity site beginning of feb for all the BL celebration things.

[abstract laurel]

meh

[nova flume]

Thank you so much! This is exactly what I was looking for

That’s way sooner than I expected I can’t wait

[quick moon]

Don't forget Sandy Mitchell, Peter Fehervari, and for most of his stuff, Graham McNeil

[thorn bison]

I have never read a book by ADB that I didn't love, he's easily the most consistently good author BL has imo

[glass lintel]

I adore him but Primarch books just . . . strive for mediocrity.

[thorn bison]

But he hasn't written any Primarch books...

At least not any main ones

Guy Haley has written most of them

Well, three

[severe basin]

This where we share black library collections

?

[thorn bison]

This is where we talk books, yes

If you want to share your collection feel free to do so!

[severe basin]

I've been playing Ogryn so I'm illiterate now

[thorn bison]

A pyrrhic victory

[severe basin]

It was organized at one point

[thorn bison]

I was about to say lmao

It's a good collection though

I see lots of older stuff

[severe basin]

Yeah

You should see my other tabletop shelf. Old shadowrun, world of darkness, Mechwarrior, battle tech

I'd recommend Abnetts stuff too.

I can also recommend or give you a run down on pretty much every book on that shelf

Shame some never came home after being lent out. But that happens

[glass lintel]

🥱

[thorn bison]

That's a Horus Heresy book lmao

Primarchs is a different series

Connected sure but not the same

[glass lintel]

It's a book about the primary character motivations and inciting incidents of a Primarch, which is close enough for me.

[thorn bison]

Okay? First Heretic is great so I don't know what you're complaining about

[glass lintel]

Okay, I need to know what you think is great about the First Heretic.

[thorn bison]

The characters, especially Argel Tal, the fact that you get background lore for the Gal Vorbak, we get more information as to why Lorgar does what he does and how he does it, we get to see more Argel Tal and Khârn lore which is great cause their relationship is lovely

We also get to see how Lorgar will sacrifice some of his greatest warriors on a gamble that might work

Also one of the best quotes in Warhammer: “

I will tell you a secret. When the stars fell, when the seas boiled and the earth burned, my faith didn't die. That is when I began to believe. God was real, and he hated us.”

[glass lintel]

. . . I am certain Kharn doesn't appear in The First Heretic.

It had some neat themes, but was just the same book as the opening Horus Heresy trio.

Spoilers:

||Primarch has best intentions.
Erebus cackles evilly and stirs some shit. The Good Marine says this is sketchy, the Primarch and The Bad Marine say "Him? That's just 'ol Erebus! Everybody loves him!"
While out on campaign, they find a Chaos Cult they really ought to know better than to interact with and go through a ritual that corrupts their primarch.
"Ohoho, I am not remotely corrupted!" Has a temper tantrum that gets the Lady Of Religious Significance killed.
The Good Marine narrowly survives but is really say about it, because The Alright Marine died but The Bad Marine is still alive.||
It was crammed too full of no-doubt mandatory references (Cadia, Lost Primarchs, Custodes who are somewhere between a Primarch and a highschool jock in ability depending on which is most convenient at the time) which ruined the flow of the book.

It's exactly what I was worried about and expecting based on other HH novels, which is that everything felt like the only instigator for these actions was that a blurb in a 1990s codes said they happened, so an author was drawn out of a hat to fill a tick on a timeline, and handed am Epic in the historical sense of the word event too radical for any author to botch.

They feel a lot like the Darktide cutscenes, actually.

The action is fine, but anything of plot relevance is achieved by having an interchangeable pawn walk into a room for a written character to exposit to while the Pawn mentally says, "Hey, you seem rude right now," or "Oh, is that why that detail was brought-up four hours ago? It seemed really out of place but I guess this counts as a resolution", before they walk out of the room and right infront of the cash shop where you can get a mini for $28-$60.

[drowsy urchin]

you've gotta be the first person I've seen dislike The First Heretic

and it's like the 5th highest ranking HH novel in audible

behind Betrayer, Horus Rising, False Gods and The Flight of the Eisenstein

[thorn bison]

All of which are also great books and some personal favourites

Along with Galaxy in Flames

I've rarely found anything to complain about content wise when it comes to HH novels

Save for Fulgrim but as I've stated before, I just thought it could have been shorter

It wasn't bad, just very long compared to other HH books

[glass lintel]

If it's behind Horus Rising which I had to restart because I nodded off listening to it, my excitement for Betrayer has plummeted.

[drowsy urchin]

well Betrayer is the highest rated one

maybe the series just isn't for you then

[mellow knot]

I’ve seen others over the years. Just proves the point that different people enjoy different things.

[drowsy urchin]

Of course

[glass lintel]

My biggest struggle has been how they insist on illuminating parts of the universe that worked well as mysteries without providing much to supplement the inability to include Mass Orkz, Tyranids, Necrons, T'au, and so on. Everyone's charachter arcs are severed and left in limbo until their death several books later.

It's like when you learn that most of those ancient statues were meant to be painted.

[mellow knot]

Imagine what they could have achieved with contrast paints

[drowsy urchin]

and I agree, it is unfortunate that most of the mysteries have to be 'solved' but I do still enjoy learning about them nevertheless

I do enjoy me some neat mysteries but I also like to know more, the one won't diminish the other for me

[void stirrup]

By First Heretic there aren't many "mysteries" though.

Mechanicum and Legion both play with some things. Everything else is basically turning old sentences in codexes into full books.

Later stuff like Amar Astartes and Erda? Those are badly answered mysteries.

[jaunty stratus]

So I dived into the Infinite and the Divine, and maybe had some starting problems, which someone might help a bit out: ||I am shortly after the first chapter, where the narrator tells about a time prior Emps, Necronconversion and such and from the creation of a Planet. At the end there is a Predator with green eyes and the plant is no longer unkown. Should I know who and where that is or does this get explained later on? Am confused||

[thorn bison]

It's explained later I believe||, the planet itself isn't that important, it's what a happening on said planet that will be focused on more later||

[random marlin]

So, I contacted Peter Fehervari and he told me he has another story coming after the Advent one, so the Dark Coil is definitely still turning. 😉

[quick moon]

Yeaaah baby!

[jaunty stratus]

OK, I really should have been more patient

[thorn bison]

Haha, no worries, a lot is going on right off the bat so I can understand you'd want some info on it immediately

[violet copper]

Hey all, jumping into the lore for the first time, would Eisenhorn->Ultramarines->Night Lords Omnibuses be a good reading order? Any individual novels I should read first? Would you suggest Horus Heresy before, after, or somewhere in that order?

[thorn bison]

Check the pinned message first, it has a lot of helpful information!

Though I would say the Night Lords Omnibus is a good starting point because you need pretty much no previous knowledge of Warhammer to like it

[mellow knot]

I will get to updating the list again soon, it’s a tough old week at work

[thorn bison]

Don't push yourself Kentucky, take it in your own pace

Always better to do something slowly to be sure it's done right than doing something while stressed and risk making mistakes

[mellow knot]

Thank you. I live in a state of infinite stress. 🙂

[rough pier]

hello! im looking to start reading some 40k books. is there a good start or a list? or could I start anywhere.

[nova flume]

I would say eisenhorn -> ravenor and then Horus heresy

[glass lintel]

Eisenhorn/Ultramarines are at a very different end of the spectrum from Nightlords, tonally and narratively. Might be a bit jarring.

You only need the Horus Heresy if you want more of the vague/mythic history of the setting explained, which I found to be disappointing as the books are usually explaining an origin/answer to a mystery and full of filler around that.

[glass lintel]

The pinned messages.

[nova flume]

I would say this is a pretty reductive view of the Horus heresy books, there are some losers in there but there are also some gems

They basically provide answers to why things are the way they are in 40k so imo they’re pretty important if you want to keep reading 40k stuff

[rough pier]

AH! thanks, didnt even see the pinned messages

[glass lintel]

There are fifty books in the series.

If I only ate trail mix for the M&Ms, I'd just buy a bag of candy.

As for their importance? It just takes a lot of nuance away from the setting. The Horus Heresy doesn't need an explanation to be effective. It's spoken about by renegades from broken chapters in tones of regret, it's spoken of in hushed tones by desperate loyalists, and with venomous pride from warped traitors. From the accounts of a half-dozen marines in a half-dozen chapters/legions, we get a greater feel for it's effect rather than fact, which is improved when conflicting points of view are brought into the fold.

By answering all of these questions, you know exactly how bad the Drop Site Massacre was, and who did it, and why, and what color boxers they put on before it because they really needed to fill more pages since the prompt was just do the drop site massacre again but this time from the Night Lord's perspective.

[nova flume]

Yea I mean I personally think it’s enjoyable to read about an event like the dropsite from different perspectives, I read for pleasure so I’m not too concerned about filler vs non filler, as long as the writing is done well I don’t mind it. I think the last 1/3 of the heresy and then onto the siege of terra is where it really gets interesting, it kinda feels like the first 2/3s are buildup for the last 3rd of the series

Plus imo the primarchs/emperor/perpetuals etc are some of the most interesting characters so I enjoy reading about them

[glass lintel]

They are as interesting as any god. Poseidon is fearsome and mighty when they are unleashing monsters and sinking islands. The scenes with Kurze in Nightlords are chilling when done well.

Most books focusing on the Primarchs are telling you what a Primarch does on their days off. From my experience: Horus bitches about taxes, Lorgar cries and writes, and Sanguinius eats fruit in a toga while everyone falls in love with him.

While I would gladly pay a monthly subscription to watch a literal angel on a lounger sensually eating pomegranates, this doesn't give the rest of the primarchs much to do, because what they do is "be present on this planet 0012.M31, kill this guy on 0013.M31, become a daemon on 0014.M31". They also lose a lot of nuance since the conflict is usually

Do what the Emperor says and be nice.
versus
Listen to your conniving assistant who says to skip school and do drugs behind the Burger King.

Night Lords still has a Primarch in it, but the focus - when it's not centered on what we already know the Primarch decides - is still

Follow in the idealistic interpretation of the Primarch's will, despite it having failed them and is the more difficult approach.
Follow in the indulgent interpretation of the Primarch's will as when we last saw them, and do so as brutally as possible.
Disregard the Primarch altogether: act in your own self-interest and vision.

• which is far more engaging and offers a greater variety of conflict between characters as it's a greater conflict than "listen to the guy in the hood?"

It's also why The Infinite and the Divine and The Twice-Dead King are so terrific. Necrons can easily nuke most threats - except for when it's plot convenient - but what they can't nuke is legacy and tradition. Hence, those books focus on preservation of history versus the preservation of a people.