hivescum-class

[lilac ermine]

The machine pistols is way better

[steep hatch]

this might feel like the most dakka...

[manic wolf]

They're not bad at all, I didnt say they were bad, only that I think the Shredder is better for the same role

[random shuttle]

IAG VRAKS never failed me yet

They are so good I took them into a HAZARD 5 Deep Rock Galactic solo dive and won.

[manic wolf]

I will still take the Stubbies over every other ranged option on a pure Desperado build because they're so much fuckin cooler tho

[wet heath]

I've been running this for past few days and surprisingly this helped me get h40
https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a08724a2-6e32-4aa1-b33d-b46326ed96f6/go-go-gadget-white-stuff-applier

[ripe seal]

i legit never picked up any other IAG because I like the vraks too much

[sturdy linden]

Does anyone use Power DI here

[clever wren]

You can still be Max Payne, call them Dual Ingrams

[high gull]

Was gonna say

[wet heath]

I used it for few days and it was constantly causing out of memory

[high gull]

Max used dual 1911s and macs

[sturdy linden]

Oh I see

[wet heath]

I even installed mod that tries to clear memory over time and now I just have a timer that tells me when I crash with out of memory

[lilac ermine]

Why do they use so much corruption resistance

[sturdy linden]

[wet heath]

With those green puddles everywhere?

[clever wren]

Berettas in the first two, or dual Deagle Brand Deagles lmao

[lilac ermine]

And the blessed stims

[wet heath]

I fucking hated that shit

[lilac ermine]

So just for those missions I should have curios like that?

[wet heath]

with how squishy I am it virtually meant that I instantly get 1 wound

[high gull]

Buddy had to move to Brazil to expand horizons

[wet heath]

I adjust them based on whatever the fuck obesefish made in havoc rotation

feel free to swap them to whatever you like

[lost bear]

Meanwhile, Arby with Rebreather and 1 corruption resist perk permanently blocking a Daemonhost

[spark gyro]

Brazil enjoyers rise up

[zenith pagoda]

I hope they make vultures mark work for needle pistol in next patch

[wet heath]

yea, corruption was never an issue untill now for me

[lilac ermine]

Is float like butterfly and quick and deadly not needed even if they work with desperado dodge

[lost bear]

IIRC one is a good pick up for dodging the slime trail ticks and the like

[next cedar]

56 of 100 runs and at 63 of 66 penances

[wet heath]

I don't use butterfly because I have 35-40% crit with vulture's mark anyway

[lyric spoke]

they didn't fix the stimm supply bug where you just hold it without placing it like they said. Had it happen to me 3 times in one mission when I almost never had it happen to me before.

[dreamy rover]

https://tenor.com/view/omni-man-invincible-look-what-they-need-to-mimic-a-fraction-of-our-power-gif-25672186

[last marsh]

fuck i love rampage

this is what i felt like playing my 5e barbarian

pop rage. everything dies

take a nap after

[lilac ermine]

Oh okay what abt quick and deadly?

[wet heath]

Quick and deadly I probably missed after today's patch

if you don't need blessed stimms you can just get it for more damage

[lilac ermine]

Its first node but like idk what would be replaced with it

Oh tru

[last marsh]

also chat am i a weirdo for wanting to pick up extra pouches for 4 bazookas

[bronze glade]

Honestly all the dodge nodes with 3s uptime are kinda trash

[lost bear]

The way crit strings work 35-40% crit is probably plenty

[random shuttle]

It's Simple.

Just kill the demonhost.

[lilac ermine]

I realize they work with vulture dodge and desperado so there always active if your being shot at

[bronze glade]

Maybe, I mostly run melee

[wet heath]

This modifier is so stupid I love it

You just proc it non stop when you shoot

[lilac ermine]

Oh lol

[last marsh]

its pretty dumb, yeah

really on uzis

[bronze glade]

And a lot of HIV guns don't have much finesse anyway

[wet heath]

You are just immortal as long as you shoot

[zenith pagoda]

Yeah I was saying earlier that it's underrated and some mfs were saying it's pointless

[last marsh]

oh they really fucked w bottom middle notes

i definitely think i can get 4 rockets

[lost bear]

Who???

[lilac ermine]

Is sample collecter bugged cus I think I kill alot of enemies more then 50 and my stim is still on cd

[wet heath]

Tanner I believe

[zenith pagoda]

#hivescum-class message

[last marsh]

https://tenor.com/view/iggyrem-ezefayfer-fayfer-shhh-dont-cry-gif-17469368787637770656

[mighty belfry]

Funny thing is that this is a half truth.

This completely ignores that Tanner being brought up has also caused some particular individuals to say some out of pocket things that led them to getting banned lol

[lilac ermine]

Someone told me its pointless cus they just slide everywhere but I dont want to be sliding every where

[last marsh]

vultures dodge?

[lilac ermine]

Yuh

[median owl]

i'm a tanner lindberg fan

[mighty belfry]

Fuhnee

[last marsh]

ya thats valid, tbh

[wet heath]

It's the same stuff but you just don't need to slide

[last marsh]

play what youre comfortable with lol

[lilac ermine]

They said slippery customer is what to take

[last marsh]

(when it works)

[mighty belfry]

I'll be real. I can't really vibe with Vulture's Dodge or Slippery Customer

[tardy citrus]

slippery customer is so good tho

[random shuttle]

Are you banned yet?

[frigid thorn]

if you're doing a tacaxe Rampage build, is it ok to skip the weakspot damage skill?

[mighty belfry]

Slippery Customer definitely instilled some bad habits in me.

[wet heath]

Idk for me hive scum showed just how fucking unreliable dodge is (at least for me)

[floral mural]

stab stab stab, consume stim that is all.

[frigid thorn]

Ended up with something like this for tacaxe+toxin pistol + Blackout grenades

[median owl]

not yet

[compact oyster]

he lies alot

[limber cradle]

Its defo fucking up my muscle memory tbh

[random shuttle]

Damn, seems it was made up fantasy. Dang.

[grave venture]

The lion does not care his muscle memory is being ruined by slippery customer

[lilac ermine]

this person says slippery customer doesnt work sometimes

[young herald]

The tech adept copium will end when they give me my servo skull goddammit

[manic wolf]

Whoever would have guessed that

[mighty belfry]

Like it's too good to the point where because I can't apply it to the other classes, it's making me really fuck up on them.

[random shuttle]

Next class is Kroot Sommelier.

[median owl]

it wasn't

[tardy citrus]

can def see this happening LOL

[random shuttle]

Next class is Necron Flayed One.

[tardy citrus]

it really is a top tier node imo

[random shuttle]

Next class is Algebra.

[grave venture]

Next class is Servitor (Janitor)

[young herald]

Oh god, this would legitimately be amazing

[mighty belfry]

I tried Zealot after playing Hive Scum for a while

It is night and day in the worst way.

[wet heath]

If something completely fucks up your muscle memory it's not very good imo

[random shuttle]

TBH to address people negative reviews for Scum being "Very weak"

[tight musk]

Sample collector talent gives you your stimm back before the box finishes its cooldown.

Especially with a full tox build, you can get your stimm (and the supply crate) back like every 30 seconds, even faster if you drop a tox nade into a big crowd.

[random shuttle]

the next class is going to be Custodes.

[compact oyster]

next class will be either assassin or techpriest

[random shuttle]

I actually have sneak peak of Custodes stats.

[tardy citrus]

Next class? Eversor Assassin

[young herald]

Just a flayed one with poorly stitched together skin talking in hitching AI voice in full "how do you do, fellow humans?" mode

[spark gyro]

bro found out that zealot doesn't have a rocket-propelled nuclear warhead

[random shuttle]

So he starts with humble 10 000 HP

[mighty belfry]

Yeah I straight up can't recommend Slippery Customer if only because it is 100% gonna instill bad habits regarding the other classes.

[compact oyster]

if we look at the dark heresy ttrpg

[wet heath]

Imo hive scum is not very weak, but underpowered compared to what other classes can offer in majority of ways

[random shuttle]

I completely disagree.

[tight musk]

We have hive police, hive criminal, next we get average hive office worker.

[spark gyro]

same reason I don't use TWBS on zealot

[wet heath]

Desperado tree is fucked, it shouldn't be touched imo, but other trees could use something

[spark gyro]

I played psyker so much, I just got used to not having stun immunity

[mighty belfry]

Hive scum can get stupid strong tbh

[lilac ermine]

Is arbites rlly hive police

[dreamy rover]

Assassin has to be with care. We don't want a stealth zealot 2.0

[random shuttle]

No.

[young herald]

Nah mate, lore accurate custodes would have like 250 hp and infinity+1 toughness

[lilac ermine]

Ok lol, they seem like they can break zealot and veteran in half

[wet heath]

Iirc in universe there's like only 1 arbites per solar system meanwhile we have entire regiment here

[young herald]

Arbites is the taxman

[tardy citrus]

there are literal arbites fortresses on some worlds LMAO

[last marsh]

they did the same thing in rogue trader

[mighty belfry]

I've been running a supply stim db manstopper build and I'm top damaging even against purge psykers in auric at least. I need to take it to Havoc tbh

[tardy citrus]

definitely more than one in a system

[random shuttle]

That's also not true last I checked. THey ain't rarer than marines 😄

[last marsh]

so idk if that holds true?

[tardy citrus]

Arbites are on EVERY Hive world

[mighty belfry]

You just really need to abuse this class's niches.

[lost bear]

Arbites are like NKVD plus IRS

[ripe seal]

how viable would a full parry melee build work? running one of the devil claws and spamming the parry with some of the stamina regen stuff and base regen speed

[sullen ridge]

society if hive scum could reload while sprinting

[eternal crag]

is hyper critical for melee only?

[random shuttle]

Spot on.

[compact oyster]

uhh

[young herald]

Incorrect. It varies by planet and system. Backwaters will only have one or two, but anything reasonably developed will have a battalion or so based out of one or more fortresses local to the system

[random shuttle]

Mostly Arbites are a Terror Squad of IRS 😄

[manic wolf]

I cant wait till we get Ork playable character so Darktide can become Greentide for a week

[smoky aurora]

support build fanatic here. having a hard time fleshing something out: i know sample collector and stimm crate is a cornerstone of one but I have ZERO clue how else to work my build around

[sullen ridge]

ive died a significant amount of times to not pulling back the hammer before i started sprinting

[compact oyster]

you do know theres a presinct fortress on every hive world right?

[wet heath]

He can but other 2 trees feel considerably weaker than desperado one

[tropic crag]

rampage toxin is kind of dumb strong

[random shuttle]

Also disagree.

Rampage tree is fantastic.

[wet heath]

didn't touch rampage and frenzy since I finished penances for them

[manic wolf]

Rampage builds can kill Carapace dudes with toothpicks

[shadow umbra]

erm i dont think the missile is meant to be there

[sturdy linden]

What I play https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a08d9c66-2b84-423c-88c9-cb82d9ea9b38/ripperdoc-2

[tardy citrus]

Rampage build goes crazy

[last marsh]

adrenaline frenzy is just hella awkward to use sometimes. i think melee ppl in your coherency should add to it, even if it is some-- or help it not drop.

[manic wolf]

Rampage tree is giga-stronk

[last marsh]

rampage is super fun and good

[lost bear]

They're internal security troops, which is why so much of their kit is about beating up and terrorising mobs

[last marsh]

but adrenaline frenzy is kinda wonky

[tardy citrus]

I run rampage with chem dependency

[glacial gyro]

thats your secret missile, the enemy thinks you shot your missile but boom, secret missile

gets em everytime

[wet heath]

Idk it doesn't seem to give enough stats to take it over chem dependency imo

[bronze glade]

Wat

[wet heath]

and dependecy is consistent

[bronze glade]

Rampage adren is insane

[tropic crag]

i prefer adrenaline tbh

[last marsh]

thats adrenaline's biggest issue. again i think melee kills in coherency by allies should count

[tardy citrus]

rampage + chem dependency, stay stimmed all match, super low CD on rampage

[mighty belfry]

Rampage is amazing. Stimm supply is genuinely underrated.

[trim wind]

I prefer adren

[last marsh]

mfw my team game doesnt let me be stronger by playing as a team

[tropic crag]

its like... always proccing for me tbh

[bronze glade]

Nah. You stack stupid fast already

[wet heath]

Stimm supply wasn't used much because it was just bugged

[main wagon]

“He killed 3 crushers in a bar…with a pencil. A fucking…pencil…”

[manic wolf]

It literally gives you a quarter extra on your melee damage and an attack speed buff... Its stronger than Dependancy

[south ice]

so any new verdicts after the hotfix?

[last marsh]

i can get it up quick if im the only one in the mud

[tight musk]

Doesn't Sefoni mention Eldar presence or smth?

Maybe we'll get them as a class, and they will go horizontal even more than hive scum.

[compact oyster]

absolute piss missile

[last marsh]

hows your stacks w other melee ppl like a melee vet or zealot>?

[tardy citrus]

No chance we get playable Eldar lmao

[tropic crag]

honestly if theres not enough things to proc adren then you don't need the adren proc

[torpid cloud]

I dunno if this fits here but does anyone know a good bolter using build?
I have never messed with the weapons even though they are a Warhammer 40k staple

[random shuttle]

@wet heath ofc its personal and anecdotal but let me tell you this. I never solo'ed an Auric Maelstrom on any class. With Hive Scum I did that on day 2 of its release. With ease. SO from my exeprience Scum has the power way over the limits of other classes.

[last marsh]

big fair.

[mighty belfry]

And if you have the point for it, passive toughness regen. The only means of that this class actually has other than coherency.

[main wagon]

If you hang out on the Mourningstar they talk on the Vox about Aeldari ships cloaked just out of weapon range

[lilac ermine]

How do I kill crushers with rampage build is it with needle gun

[mighty belfry]

And I suppose the one that procs on ranged damage taken

[main wagon]

Or maybe it’s a Morrow memory idk

[last marsh]

i just keep swinging tbh lol

what weapon are you using

[bronze glade]

Just melee them

[lilac ermine]

Crowbar or shivs

[last marsh]

the actual answer is use bonesaw

[devout sorrel]

i miss the original crowbar mastery skin... looked like the Half Life one :(

[bronze glade]

Melee them

[manic wolf]

P'much, though Precision Violence is a thing an thats just like having always on Confident Strike

[last marsh]

oh shivs or crowbar is good

[tardy citrus]

tbh before i even fight a crusher more times than not i'm shooting it three ttimes with the needle

To soften it up

[last marsh]

canopener from crowbar, power attacks from shivs

[amber sundial]

why is hivescum full of helium

get flung 5 miles

[tropic crag]

attack speed is one of those things thats crazy crazy crazy strong even in small numbers because of how its speeds up certain things

[last marsh]

im big dumb so i just keep heavy attacking lol

[main wagon]

I haven’t checked but is it now HL2 instead of HL1? Most of the red cosmetics got some battle damage, which is cool

[lilac ermine]

Thats what I do too sometimes I run out of ammo with needle gun tho

[last marsh]

just keep swinging

[last marsh]

with shivs or crowbar it shouldnt be an issue. shivs work a lot like combat knife.

crowbar has can opener

[main wagon]

Or did they fully change it, Ash? Ima be sad lol

[tardy citrus]

i use bone saw tho

so

[last marsh]

ya or use bonesaw

[tardy citrus]

armor isn't really a problem

😂

[last marsh]

so you go purple drank and heavy attack

[manic wolf]

Indeed

[last marsh]

i use heavy sword so i just keep swinging dat thang

[lilac ermine]

Idk how to use bonesaw it has different modes and

[tardy citrus]

toggle the purple sludge and swing on them

[mighty belfry]

Max speed shiv literally makes crit chance not even matter anymore because you attack so fast that you're inevitably going to crit a ton anyway

[manic wolf]

People calling Scum weak I dont think are realising just how many options it gets to scale its output

[tardy citrus]

you'll chew their armor to shit

[last marsh]

purple for carapace/bosses. green for trash

[wet heath]

And dependency gives you 15/20% crit chance, 15/20% tdr and most importantly 30/40% ability cdr, which allows you to use rampage more often. I just don't see the appeal in 25% damage and 10% attack speed

[lilac ermine]

One of the heavy attacks stagger enemy carapace and the other one bounces off

[random shuttle]

Its okay

[last marsh]

purple applies brittleness.

[random shuttle]

I have 80% Crit chance anyway

[tight musk]

Purple saw stain also seems pretty good for bosses.

[last marsh]

heavy attack gives 2 stacks

[fast surge]

ok taxe with chem dep's permanent 20% crit feels so nice lol

[random shuttle]

end up games with 71% Overall crit rate

[bronze glade]

Doesn't do much for bosses

[zenith ferry]

Boomer is fun now. 🤠

[bronze glade]

Tox is better

[lilac ermine]

Do ppl light attack the carapace with saw

[last marsh]

also dont forget to say

https://tenor.com/view/bonesaw-ready-spiderman-wrestling-mic-gif-5061365

[tardy citrus]

lightt attack is fine but heavy is better

[tropic crag]

its true

[sharp dune]

I’ve heard people are somehow using the shredder auto pistol as a sniper hive scum

I’d like to ask how

[random shuttle]

Nu uh. Best is use both tox and purple. SMH.

[bronze glade]

Against hordes you want to light attack with saw

[tardy citrus]

yeah i mean i alternate my saw modes p frequently

depending on whats needed

[manic wolf]

I didnt say Dependancy was bad, cos it aint, but a basically always on 25% melee damage and attack speed bonus is good because.. well.. its effectively always on..

[tropic crag]

i mix heavies in, but tastefully

[lilac ermine]

I need to watch a video on how to use saw

[tardy citrus]

the toxin is good regardless

[rustic trellis]

Hey, i wasnt too sure. are the cartel special stimms considered an ability for dependancy cdr or nah?

[lilac ermine]

I think crowbar is simple

[random shuttle]

Don't X me. Purple a boss, shoot it full of Tox with needler.

Best.

[tardy citrus]

just use it cat, get a feel for it yourself

best way to learn

[random shuttle]

Purple gets even better when your team focuses a boss

[lilac ermine]

Do u have a build that uses saw

[mighty belfry]

Admittedly, I'd rather run dependency than adrenaline for tac axe solely for the crit chance

[random shuttle]

and you have other sources of brittle

[mighty belfry]

Since crits matter a lot of tac axe

[wet heath]

So is dependecy, and you can get virtually same attack speed or even more with 2 nodes in your stimm and swift endurance. And crits give you like same 25% damage increase anyway

[tardy citrus]

tbh you only need to hit something twice or three times with purple mode and then swap back

[random shuttle]

yeh

[lost bear]

And tac axe base swing speed is fast enough anyway, more is better but it isn't necessary

[lilac ermine]

Yay now I know what purple does

[tropic crag]

honestly i don't even use purple mode on the saw because i use the needle gun, its faster to just shoot them with that

[viscid sleet]

hey whats a good dump stat for the bone saw?

[compact oyster]

brittleness stacks

and extra armor damage

[bronze glade]

Mob

[lilac ermine]

Whats the max stacks

[radiant swift]

what blessings are recommened on the dual stubs

[lilac ermine]

Like 3 heavy swing?

[tardy citrus]

16 iirc

i think it applies 2-3 per hit?

[compact oyster]

3 on heavy 1 on light i believe

[mighty belfry]

Run n gun and pinning fire.

[lost bear]

Adrenaline lets you get nutty shit going with Hyperviolence though, especially on the Brumentum weapons

[tardy citrus]

run n gun is a huge blessing for scum

[bronze glade]

I'd skip pinning on stub

Doesn't stack quickly enough

And small mag

[wet heath]

Pistols with run n gun are great, but feels pointless on double autoguns

[bronze glade]

Sustained is better

[radiant swift]

that was my feeling about pinning as well

[tardy citrus]

it's awesome with the needle too

[glad latch]

I feel like Chem Enhanced should also boost max stamina (synergy with Swift Endurance) and base chem dep should give some stam regen so it has something else when you use the chem crate, because otherwise base Chem Dep does very little unless you're not using Practiced Deployment for some weird reason. But apart from that I think chem dep is pretty decent, just the base keystone is bad with crate.

[lilac ermine]

Run n gun reduces spread alot isnt that needed for machine pistol

[tight musk]

Wonder if it's worth going for Coated Weaponry for even more toxin on the bone saw.

[lilac ermine]

Oh wait I think I use reload perk

[wet heath]

For autoguns? Not really because your other option is blaze away

[main wagon]

They talkin about stub pistols, silly

[wet heath]

And you just get accuracy through volume

[main wagon]

But you right

They also get it built in

[mighty belfry]

Considering how potent toxins get with higher stacks, I'd say yeah it's worth.

[bronze glade]

DAP runs blaze and pinning imo

[main wagon]

Blaze and Speedload is also viable

[wet heath]

Blaze and load

[tropic crag]

toxin is probably too strong atm lol

[main wagon]

For maximum dakka

[smoky aurora]

does the +5s stims work on the stimm crate effect?

[bronze glade]

Load is good with desperado

[wet heath]

Yea

[mighty belfry]

Would definitely make horde clear more consistent

[radiant swift]

afaik no

[tight musk]

No.

[lost bear]

Are scum lighter in the in-game physics engine

[radiant swift]

I don't believe so

[lost bear]

Saw someone get absolutely fuckin yeeted by an Arbites blowing up a horde

It happened to me and I thought it was a freak accident

[wet heath]

No because iirc you don't get the stimm effect itself, but the stimm pack effect that inherits stats from your stimm

[tropic crag]

lol they were probably dashing when they got blown up, the speed can stack

[radiant swift]

^

[mighty belfry]

Hive Scum's sheer momentum needs to be talked about more

[lost bear]

They were in melee at the time, as far as I can tell

[mighty belfry]

It's a blessing and a curse

[main wagon]

Try dashing off ledges and other inclines with high speed characters like Scum and melee Psyker. It gets silly

You just LAUNCH

[tight musk]

Although technically, the crate with Fast Acting Stimms lasts 5 seconds and then lingers for 15, so if you stay in the crate's AoE until it goes away, you will get 20 seconds of your stimm.

[wet heath]

It feels so good to have high movement speed in darktide

[sullen ridge]

AHHHHH HIVE SCUM WATCH OUT FOR THE METALFAB INTRO CROSSWALKS NOOOOO

[lost bear]

Shivving something -> Arbites shotguns like 20 tentacle heads -> I believe I can fly

[mighty belfry]

I've literally dodged myself off ledges over the slightest inclines.

[wet heath]

Wish MY FUCKING HITBOX could keep up with me

[main wagon]

Dude I’ve watched so many people roll their ankles on that first drop it’s hilarious

[mighty belfry]

OSHA is having a field day over the amount of Hive Scum falling off the map

[sullen ridge]

ive got 3 for the clipdump so far

[lost bear]

Treading too lightly

Need firmer footing

[random shuttle]

okay

[graceful pollen]

does anyone know the difference of between the two marks of the needle pistol?

[random shuttle]

I promised myself to go to sleep like a good lad

so

[main wagon]

Look, it wouldn’t happen if there weren’t ARBITRARY HOLES IN THEIR GUARDRAILS

[random shuttle]

good night shmoopsies

[lilac ermine]

Gn

[tight musk]

I am having a really hard time telling apart normal enemies and the exploding enemies from the event.

[wet heath]

The stinky fart and the loud fart

[sullen ridge]

i had this poor hivescum named whitechapel having the time of his life but WE KEPT SAYING IN TEXT

like the third game having him

YOU GOTTA CALM DOWN DUDE

but no hes off falling in the gap because hes too impatient to wait for the chasm terminus retractable bridge 😭

[main wagon]

GNIGHT MUCKER XOXO

[mighty belfry]

The amount of times I've taken damage at the first drops in maps by just dodging off

It's an addiction. I need help.

[tropic crag]

its the alt fire that changes

[tardy citrus]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a08e1665-2e2a-49f0-a4bf-890b270e1c90/rampage-8 @lilac ermine what im using rn for my rampage

[severe zephyr]

can anyone give me an advice for gas levels, i cannot play without dying on those levels, i can't see where the gas ends/start and i can't mantain a decent hp regen without enemyes while walking on this maps

[turbid fulcrum]

Stimm crate is still bugged 🙁

[lilac ermine]

What if jittery decreased cooldown on dodges so you can dodge 2x faster

[mighty belfry]

What how?

[bronze glade]

Here

[lilac ermine]

Ok ty steals

[turbid fulcrum]

I had the thing where you cannot set it doen and its stuck in your hands two times today

[main wagon]

I love the Enclavum Baross ending bridge because so many people fail the jump

[radiant hedge]

https://tenor.com/view/trueno-armata-gif-4679676768073571887

[sullen ridge]

MKVI 's explosion alt is good for stagger and quick crowd control on melee builds, MKII's alt mode has really good tox spreading for tox builds

[mighty belfry]

Oh rip

[main wagon]

I also saw a psyker whiff the Rolling Steel extraction jump over the summer

[lilac ermine]

Dangg I really want to fit pickpocket

[sullen ridge]

first to ever do it. the amount of clipping they put on that jump to toddlerproof it is crazy

theres like 5 pixels you can actually fall

walking speed can clear the gap

[tropic crag]

it was worse at its release lol

[main wagon]

I feel like Ogryn don’t even have to hit jump

[sullen ridge]

oh i remember

[main wagon]

They’re too thick to fall through the gap

[tardy citrus]

don't need it with needle pistol

you only have 6 in a mag anyway

and it reloads fast

[lilac ermine]

Is adrenaline frenzy not that good of a keystone vs chemical depedancy

[main wagon]

I never felt that ammo hungry on needle pistol while I was grinding my rampage and tox penances

[tropic crag]

but every oggy is still scared of the jump and takes it slow because its an awkward jump with the oggy hitbox

[vernal sluice]

? adrenaline freny is amazing

[tardy citrus]

adrenaline is good

[torpid cloud]

hows scum with the bolt pistol

[tardy citrus]

chem dependency is good for stim upkeep and rampage proc

[tropic crag]

needle pistol ammo economy is super generous

[sullen ridge]

yknow why did they do all this swap speed stuff but have the most boring keystones ever. why isnt there a fun action movie keystone that rewards swapping between weapons by reloading ur mag or buffing a few swings

[tardy citrus]

you get your cd back FAST at 30% CDR

[main wagon]

Clambering over the smallest shoebox is a trial when playing Ogryn so I definitely sympathize lmao

[wet heath]

Does pickpocket even proc off of needle pistol chem?

[main wagon]

Meanwhile my Scum is legit playing Brink

[vernal sluice]

Because that would've been copy pasted from veteran and then people would bitch about fatshark copypasting stuff

[tardy citrus]

chem fortified and chem enhanced are both quite good too

[lilac ermine]

Ty the chem depedency for me feels rlly easy to keep up

[sullen ridge]

oh right i forgot about yawnmode vet

[tardy citrus]

it is. you can always have it up if you just pay attention to your stim timer.

[vernal sluice]

it's only yawnmode if you're voc survivalist metaslaving

[mighty belfry]

Normalize not running a keystone on hive scum 🗣️

It genuinely ain't that bad.

[wet heath]

Here're 20 buffs for weapon swap speed, no we won't give you veteran's keystone that would he PERFECT for it

[main wagon]

Also the failed attempt at “weapon spec at home” that was Terminus Warrant with Arbites

[sullen ridge]

i hate gamers because ur absolutely right. they'd claim laziness despite yknow. the entire REST OF THE KIT making the gameplay feel different

[main wagon]

If they did “weapon spec attempt 3” it would’ve just been comical

[tropic crag]

no i really like adren

[tardy citrus]

max at 30% constantly have 15% toughness damage reduction + 15% crit chance

very nice

[wet heath]

That's like... Normal seemingly

[tardy citrus]

esp for scum a class with the constitution of wet tissue paper

[vernal sluice]

evergreen

[mighty belfry]

I like it too on melee builds.

[lilac ermine]

Vets keystones are still garbage arent they

[wet heath]

Many builds don't use them on hs

[tight musk]

Mk VI applies more toxin on headshots and crits, and alternative mode makes enemies explode with slight stagger and small damage dealt to nearby enemies.

Mk II applies slightly less toxin per shot but alternative mode makes enemies you shot spread toxin on death.

[mighty belfry]

They are not.

[tardy citrus]

Mk 2 is better imo for horde management

[main wagon]

I’m so happy I was there for that live

[vernal sluice]

No, on the contrary all three of them are usable now

marksman's focus is no longer shit

[echo python]

Nah, vet got a touchup. Focus Target stacks faster, Marksman's Focus is fucking cracked with the right weapons

[mighty belfry]

MMF is great but just doesn't have great pathing.

Focus Target is pretty darn good for priority targeting.

[sullen ridge]

appreciation post for the art designers though they made cute animated splash screens for each cartel that you'll see for like 5 seconds ever

[mighty belfry]

Weapon Specialist? Always been good

[lilac ermine]

😮 wow

[mighty belfry]

It's just significantly better now because vet just gets 70% damage for free lol

[lilac ermine]

If vet had the vulture keystone itd fit them too lol

[main wagon]

I use MMF for my Helbore and Focus Target for plasmoid vet

[wet heath]

I wish we could get enemy weapons on all classes

[echo python]

Agri combat shottie vet with a full set of marksman's focus stacks will absolutely demolish a monstrosity

[main wagon]

I was surprised how far the Lucius has come since launch

[vernal sluice]

I would say MMF also possibly maybe gets the most mileage out of its subnodes as well? As in I feel that all the keystones perform just fine without them but MMF gets the most oomph for the talent point investment

[bronze glade]

Yeah Agri goes hard on vet

[main wagon]

It’s absolutely fucking devastating now

[wet heath]

Sniper rifle, las/auto machine gun

[radiant swift]

gestures at my name

[mighty belfry]

It depends l.

[radiant swift]

give me that fucking axe fatshark

[cedar cairn]

Does playing a DLC class disable one's higher reasoning or what
I can't get a single event mission done because none of the fucking Arby/Scum squads can stick together to literally save their lives

[mighty belfry]

Weapon specialist with always prepared enables one of vet's strongest builds by far.

And my favorite vet build

[tardy citrus]

Some of those players are prob brand new Saul

Fresh off the free weekend

[lapis raft]

weapon specialist is also just very fun in general

[wet heath]

Watch it be incest son of heavy eviscerator and regular chain axe with like worse cleave than saw and some dogshit special attack

[cedar cairn]

Budding Interrogators

[rotund agate]

I always forget to check where my teammates are, regardless of what class I'm playing...

[radiant swift]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-hammer-cat-being-hit-on-the-head-with-a-hammer-monjjunirawr-silly-cat-cat-hammered-gif-10390299470246788991

[vernal sluice]

Honestly, probably yes?

[wet heath]

With scum kinda yea

[tardy citrus]

Scum is the Icarus class

[cedar cairn]

You'd think they'd all push ahead together but no four corners of the fucking map

[wet heath]

Many times teammates would just leave me because I just keep clearing horde of pox walkers

[tardy citrus]

We gotta fly high, but be careful not to fly TOO high, lest our wax melt.

[vernal sluice]

I mainly like using chink in their armor and long range assasin subnodes in combination with volley adept to keep exe stance going as long as humanly possible

[wet heath]

Then 20 crushers spawn on me

[rotund agate]

I tend to rush ahead because I wanna play the game by killing hordes instead of wandering around doing no fighting, and suddenly realize my teammates are either just going forwards exceptionally slowly, or took a different path forwards than I did...

[lilac ermine]

Is anyone take loose formation 75%+ coherency

[mighty belfry]

I'll be real. I like stimm supply if only because it also incentivizes sticking with your team way more.

[lilac ermine]

For giving vulture toughness to team

[wet heath]

I feel like it would only be good with ammo aura

[tardy citrus]

no lol

[wet heath]

Otherwise seems pointless

[tardy citrus]

bait node

[wet heath]

But like

[mighty belfry]

The other two abilities ask of way more aggression from you that does kinda make you break coherency more often.

[lilac ermine]

Aww idk how much is 75% rlly

[tardy citrus]

tbh i hope they remove that piece of junk and rework it to something useful

[vernal sluice]

I love helping my team and staying in coherency but I have never used any coherency radius increase node, ever

[tardy citrus]

bc it's worthless

[wet heath]

You can get a better version of ammo aura by using pickpocket and never picking up ammo ever again

[sullen ridge]

what do ur curios look like? i think extra toughness is nice even if ur good

always nice to have mistake allowance

[sturdy linden]

answer me this: would you rather take +75% coherency radius or would you rather take +1 grenade

[lilac ermine]

Depends if im using flash grenades

[tardy citrus]

that boom bringer and chem toxin +1 is pretty juicy..

[sullen ridge]

the goat actually

[mighty belfry]

Also to all supply scum running ability cooldown on your curios.

Stop it. Get some help.

[wet heath]

If you gonna use gunner damage reduction on desperado that will be so funny

[vernal sluice]

2 of the former 1 of the latter

[sullen ridge]

FUCK THEM GUNNERS

[mighty belfry]

I have seen this numerous times already and I don't get it!!!

[tardy citrus]

https://tenor.com/view/kermit-frog-what-excuse-me-what-did-you-say-gif-15481645

[sullen ridge]

THEY CAN ROT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

aw man that carries no weight!

[wet heath]

Yea that's what desperado does

[tardy citrus]

you're only taking one toughness curio?

[tight musk]

I just went three +2 stamina curious for extra melee attack speed.

Gotta upgrade them to +3 stamina when I get those.

[sullen ridge]

this me melee unfortunately

[sturdy linden]

people talking about regular Shredder being better than dual shredders

what's the idea?

genuinely curious

[mighty belfry]

Stagger.

[lapis raft]

i run 3 of these, but probs gonna swap the stamina regen for revive speed now that i dont run rampage anymore

[lilac ermine]

Rn I have 2 stamina curios and 1 toughness curio bc I dont have any other curios

[sullen ridge]

changing to stamina curios seems nice but... i dont know if i use THAT much stamina 😵‍💫

[mighty belfry]

The stagger on regular shredder goes crazy.

[wet heath]

More accurate and stagger but like

[vernal sluice]

yeah, I don't need more. I already use all of hivescum's defensive talents, which are amazingly good

[wet heath]

Double autoguns feel better for me

[tardy citrus]

one +3 stam and two 17% toughness for me

[vernal sluice]

uhh I would only advise it if you are using the attack speed per stamina talent

[sullen ridge]

^

[wet heath]

For fuck sake I ain't giving bloody akimbo guns just because shredder is slightly better

[vernal sluice]

oh and getting more mileage out of the damage resistance per stamina is also very good

[sullen ridge]

yea this just feels so nice to have they should make it the mandatory one

[mighty belfry]

I run 1 toughness, 2 +3 stamina but also put +5% toughness perks in my curios.

[winged dawn]

I never felt the need for Stam Regen on scum Since dodges are so reliable already

[sullen ridge]

sometimes i dont kill a pisser enemy just cus he can keep me alive 😭

[sturdy linden]

I know Vraks IAG is objectively the best Despacito gun but I kinda wanna try other stuff

[tardy citrus]

p essential imo

[vernal sluice]

I feel they kinda did with the way they reshuffled the talents today

[lapis raft]

i was running rampage + mk6 knife push attack so i def felt the need very much :d

[mighty belfry]

The extra attack speed is so worth forgoing the second toughness curio imho

[winged dawn]

Oh yeah I get that

[wet heath]

I feel like some modifiers on hive scum should be base kit

[sullen ridge]

i just feel like you shouldnt be nerfed because the big crowd you were going for just got smacked by a grenade and now you're gunner chow

[bronze glade]

Pussy

[vernal sluice]

You get it

[bronze glade]

Take 9 stam

[torpid cloud]

I feel like inspiring barrage may have potential

[wet heath]

Why every keystone modifier for frenzy is just different way of getting stacks???

[bronze glade]

Or bust

[tardy citrus]

this is fairly negligible tbh

[bronze glade]

Wdym

[tardy citrus]

i sounds like a lot but it isn't so bad

[bronze glade]

It's only two out of five?

[sullen ridge]

it is but Why

[grand jewel]

they're not

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/565672718293401653/1321147766805631129/cat_armor_wiki.gif

[vernal sluice]

because they're upgrades over base way to get stacks in practice

[mighty belfry]

I haven't gotten a third +3 leave me alone 😭

[vernal sluice]

and yeah only 2 of the subnodes do that lol

[sullen ridge]

im such a big fan of hive scum but they just. dont have the sauce that crit psyker does....

[bronze glade]

Excuses excuses

[plush cove]

honestly, bazooka is pretty dang good now

[versed spruce]

Has anyone here tried cowboy revo with Desperado yet? I'm kind of curious

[mighty belfry]

The melk man has not brought the melk yet

[wet heath]

Poorly worded

[mighty belfry]

After like

[versed spruce]

I'm sure it's not meta but it seems neat

[vernal sluice]

I mained right tree psyker before and hivescum is just so much more fun

[mighty belfry]

50k tokens

OTL

[manic wolf]

Its super clunky and not very fun to play

[vernal sluice]

bad combination, avoid

[sullen ridge]

its fun but youll get swamped and wont be able to kill anything you want to through a crowd like the zarona can

the quickdraw's bullets get less powerful per shot in a barrage for zero reason

fatshark likes to nerf fun things 😭

[wet heath]

I meant that 4 out of 5 modifiers are just different ways of keeping adrenaline frenzy going instead of actually doing something

[versed spruce]

Always sad when things like Desperado don't take magazine size into account

[vernal sluice]

high rof guns >>> low rof guns for desperado

[bronze glade]

That's just how strong adrenaline is base

[versed spruce]

Because the cowboy gun on the cowboy ability is weak, actually

[wet heath]

Ehhhh

[versed spruce]

🤮

[manic wolf]

Ehh, yesnt. Stubbies are pretty solid with Desp and people have mentioned the Double Barrel being good with it too

[versed spruce]

High RoF and/or high cleave

Best for Desp

[wet heath]

I don't feel like 25% damage is worth the fucking keystone

[vernal sluice]

imo the killing blows subnode really makes the keystone much better

[sullen ridge]

its just a boring keystone

[mighty belfry]

25% damage is a lot.

[sullen ridge]

its not bad its just

eh

[wet heath]

You get the same amount from crit, no?

[calm aurora]

twbs moment: fire? i can walk through it!... guess not

[mighty belfry]

Don't get me wrong. I do think the keystone in design is lackluster but

[lapis raft]

adrenaline should just be 25% attack speed imo

would be a lot better :d

[mighty belfry]

This guy gets kt

[bronze glade]

Except you crit more with adrenaline too

[novel oracle]

its very valuable when its multiplicitive with all of the power you get from rampage

[lapis raft]

10% attack speed and 25% damage is kind of a joke ngl

[sullen ridge]

adrenaline should give u movespeed and dodge distance so you can farm it up on the group of shitters, then take your speed and go for the backline

[lapis raft]

compared to chem dependency at least

[wet heath]

Only as a side product

[bronze glade]

So?

[wet heath]

Because you attack faster

[vernal sluice]

I would not want adrenaline to just be attack speed. combined with all the other attack speed bonuses you can get I would have to whip out an autoclicker to capitalize on it

[mighty belfry]

In function ya. Still applicable. Attack Speed is really valuable

Except on a very select few weapons

[vernal sluice]

I already had to take a break from scum to rest my weary index finger

[dim moth]

how much attack speed/damage do other classes keystones usually give?

[mighty belfry]

Like I'd rather use dependency for tac axe because that already attacks so fast.

But for something like shivs? Adrenaline all the way

[dim moth]

I ask knowing damn well that adrenaline frenzy is only outdone in raw numbers by fucking Martyrdom

[tardy citrus]

10% is a respectable increase for attack speed lol

[dim moth]

and only barely

[lapis raft]

well im comparing with other keystones on the same class

[vernal sluice]

You love to see an obvious rhetorical question

[dim moth]

ah so with the "only boosts guns by 15% in most stats"

and "doesn't boost damage"

adrenaline frenzy wins by default in the melee damage competition then

easy

[lapis raft]

chem depndency absolutely boosts damage

[dim moth]

it boosts crit chance

[plush cove]

tbh I dont see chem dependency to be superior to adrenaline ngl, 30% cdr is...eh, it's something, but the crit chance bonus it gives is nice...but hive scum already crits like crazy anyway.

[dim moth]

by up to 20% which is a lot

but it's still not a raw damage boost

[grand jewel]

crimt

[vernal sluice]

crimtical chaumce

[wet heath]

For zealot
50 with martyrdom
20 (plus like 2 other buffs) with judgement
15% crit with blazing

[lapis raft]

well damage is damage. and 40% cdr on rampage is a lot

[tardy citrus]

chem dependency real value is in the toughness dr and the cdr

the crit chance is a bonus

[lapis raft]

like that makes your rampage so much more reliable

and rampage is your biggest button ever

[wet heath]

That is with base version of those keystones

[tardy citrus]

that's an always up 15% toughness dr and 30% cdr

[wet heath]

Their modifiers give your more buffs

[dim moth]

you are not going to reach 20 stacks of IJ while in combat without the upgrades

[plush cove]

5% toughness per second on adrenaline is really nice tho

[lapis raft]

yea the 5% toughness would be the main reason why i would click adrenaline

as over time regen is suuper nice

[vernal sluice]

also isn't it kind of disingenuous to state 'damage is just damage' on a class whose whole point is to maximize damage at the expense of almost everything else?

[mighty belfry]

Honestly. You can depending on the weapon. The issue is that the weapons you can do that with, also don't synergies that well with IJ as well

[wet heath]

I'd take not having my ankles removed by slight breeze thank you very much

[tropic crag]

i mostly take adren for the attack speed, the other things are great tho

[mighty belfry]

Like relic blade with IJ. Great. But you do really need the subnodes. Combat knife with IJ. You can run without the nodes but uh, doesn't really do much for combat knife.

[vernal sluice]

well good news adrenaline frenzy can also help with that

[plush cove]

playing low cooldown stimm for stimm supply, turning it into chem tox mine is honestly super fun lol

[lapis raft]

noone said that anyway

[wet heath]

So is dependecy and it does it directly

[junior vigil]

also the hive chaxe build is so fun

[gray wharf]

How does unload work? Trying to test it with a double barrel but not seeing the boost.

[wet heath]

Instead of as a subproduct of you killing enemies faster

[tropic crag]

i need to try the chain axe on this class still

[lapis raft]

both dependency and adrenaline frenzy give a lot of damage, just because one doesnt directly say damage doesnt mean that careful reader cant figure out it indeed gives damage

[lapis raft]

yes, crit = damage also

idk what you managed to read in between non existant lines there lol

[vernal sluice]

alright whatever

[manic wolf]

No, instead its a subproduct of you taking yourself out of the fight, if only for a second, to stim every 45s, its effectively the same in that instance. You are commiting to an action to get your stacks of either

[lapis raft]

my point was that both give damage and not that damage is not important

[bronze glade]

Crit is crit

[nocturne basalt]

so how much did we get fucked by the flip flop of nodes

[manic wolf]

Depends on your build

Some people gained points, others lost them

[bronze glade]

It's a net positive

[vernal sluice]

my point was moreso that calling damage increase boring for hivescum is weird but really it's whatever

[south crane]

2 seconds of work for a dogass meme, enjoy

[gray wharf]

Seems mostly positive

[wet heath]

Ookaaaay that is weird point because you will still be stimming on Hive scum?

Like

[nocturne basalt]

also does the stim crate still consume the stim

[wet heath]

You are stimming anyway, what's your point

[manic wolf]

As you will killing stuff, so yes, your point was indeed a strange one

[vernal sluice]

None? It improved the tree

[tropic crag]

everyone gained some easy survivability... if you went rampage things just got a bit better

[vale garden]

Artsy profile pic for SpaceBook

[spark gyro]

Saw bro saying hive scum is bad for crowds

[wet heath]

You are killing enemies faster with deoendency and get direct improvement to your survivability instead of just killing enemies faster

[lapis raft]

the tree changes pretyt much improved every pathing i think

[sturdy linden]

what are the blessings on regular Shredder for Despacito? Blaze Away and..?

[spark gyro]

deodency

[sturdy linden]

Speedload? Cavalcade? Pinning?

[gray wharf]

Is Unload not working right for shotguns? Should 2 shots not give at least 12% extra damage on the third shot?

[vernal sluice]

new keystone: deodorant dependency

[manic wolf]

The latter

[bronze glade]

Blaze and pinning or speed

[tropic crag]

i think almost every melee weapon has good horde clear lol

[tender forge]

I'm tempted to give a bad review on scum due to the scuffedness of the female scum cosmetics

[tropic crag]

and the not good ones are fine

[tender forge]

give gang based bras

[dim moth]

I really need people to understand that even the "support" scum with the stimm box is entirely capable of outdamaging inferno psyker

[trim wind]

pinning, i also do not see it outdoing dualies at all

better stagger, range, that's about it

[tender forge]

or let the back hang open

[wet heath]

There's virtually no point in taking frenzy over dependency imo

[dim moth]

Their weakest personal damage output build that buffs the party is still inferno psyker tier damage

[manic wolf]

You're not tho. Crit chance is more damage, sure, but its not 25% more damage on every swing, nor is it attack speed which increases your killing potential further

[dim moth]

but with vastly better carapace/bosses

[obsidian crown]

It made a bad switch at bottom left but otherwise fine

[hallow creek]

well hot damn taxe is cracked

[sinful matrix]

Inspiring Barrage isn't a terrible choice when you're using it outside of Desperado - Especially since its a 50 round magazine that only takes a few seconds to empty

[hallow creek]

jesus

[wet heath]

https://tenor.com/view/patrick-star-minor-s-spongebob-spongebob-meme-spongebob-squarepants-gif-10940848928744248792

[sturdy linden]

yeah

[hallow creek]

i was like it can be that good

_>

[bronze glade]

Of all the hills you choose to die on

[vernal sluice]

man.

[manic wolf]

I see you wanna recapture the days of old when Ogryn could stack 1 billion toughness because of Inspiring

[sturdy linden]

ykw this game needs - anybody who plays below Damnation does not get to review the game at all

genuinely

[sinful matrix]

I actually got turned onto it by someone here in the HS chat using it on Brauto I think

[lapis raft]

hey at least its not mostly negative thats an improvement :d

[wet heath]

Dependency allows you to have higher uptime on your rampage, wdym

[lost bear]

I feel like that is the stance of someone who doesn't use Brumentum weapons heh

[sinful matrix]

I genuinely think it's a good choice if you're struggling with toughness management against ranged units outside of Desperado

[amber sundial]

anyone who plays below damnation must fill out a 500 page essay on WHY they arent improving then they are allowed to write reviews

[tropic crag]

honestly, most of my favorite games in the past 4 or 5 years have had mixed to overwhelmingly negative on steam... i just ignore the reviews now because people are really reactive and not very bright

[lost bear]

500 words is a hard enough check these days

[manic wolf]

Thats fair, but I dunno, it could certaintly work, but pitching it against Pinning or Blaze, its kinda a hard sell, at least in the Shredder's case. Icr what blessings BAG do and dont get offhand

[wet heath]

Can you like... Connect the dots and just think for a moment about synergy with other talents and not thinking about them in a vacuum

[nocturne basalt]

I ran into a vet yesterday who did nothing but magdump a lasgun the entire game. Some people just don't really know whats happening

damnantion too

[tight musk]

This with precision violence makes your toughness go up so fast.

[tardy citrus]

some people are definitely not confident in melee

[amber sundial]

dependency gives me yummy crit chance and tdr with near permanent uptime, id say its silly

[tardy citrus]

which is majority of what the game is

[lost bear]

What's new though

[vernal sluice]

which of the games you've played had overwhelmingly negative reviews? just curious

[wet heath]

Yea, that's the point

[zenith pagoda]

Don't read the reviews, some guy said the talents have no synergy

[manic wolf]

The tradeoff is consistency vs burst. I didnt say dependancy was bad, but I would rather have something that juices my damage all the time, on top of everything else im taking as opposed to something thats an intermittent bonus. There is no connecting any dots here, and if thats an insinuation of stupidity, you're instantly invalidating any point you could make.

[lapis raft]

hd2 after getting review bombed by morons lmfao

[wet heath]

Wdym burst

[bronze glade]

Each keystone has its use and it's an incredibly bad take to claim otherwise

[vernal sluice]

true lol

[bronze glade]

Why is this even up for debate lol

[tropic crag]

pretty sure starwars outlaws is in there, that games just fun if you're a starwars fan... i think starfield got that low once... and crime boss also got that low once i think? i love crime boss that games great

[nocturne basalt]

theres a difference between confident in melee and standing there magdumping while a poxwalker continually hits your back

[bronze glade]

This isn't an arbites moment where they only shipped two keystones

[wet heath]

Bro if you are having troubles keeping an eye out on your chem dependency stacks that's up to you, ngl

[tardy citrus]

true

[bronze glade]

Who are you even talking to?

[wet heath]

Stim shady

[tight musk]

I joined a mission at the beginning (but not in the lobby) and somehow I was missing one grenade.

[lapis raft]

i just use chad setup no explanation needed

[vernal sluice]

Damn!

[bronze glade]

I don't think anybody has issues keeping up dependency

[tropic crag]

lol which game was that?

[lost bear]

You can't demand that other people connect the dots and refuse to connect any yourself

[lapis raft]

actually forgot to switch from pocket toxin there gave blinders one more chance on dot build but nty

[manic wolf]

Thats not what I said..

You are using dependancy to get more uptime on Rampage yes? But Rampage has inherent downtime built into it. It doesnt matter if you're getting it back faster, you have bursts of damage by using it, then you have to wait for that burst again, even with improved CDR. You effectively don't have to wait for that with Adrenaline, you just kill shit as you usually would and you're profiting 95% of the time. Consistency vs Burst.

[vernal sluice]

crime boss rockay city

[wet heath]

You are consistently having your main way of getting damage - rampage - up insted of having burst of damage when both your rampage and adrenaline allign

[vernal sluice]

yeah, bad steam reviews are an universal issue sadly

[tropic crag]

oh yeah, lol the devs cut ties with a racist so the racists review bombed it, then it got better

[lost bear]

No, Adrenaline and Rampage represent two separate tranches of damage

[manic wolf]

You are acting like 25% always on melee damage is inconsequential. It is very much not.

[tropic crag]

by got better i mean steam removed all the fake reviews

[lost bear]

Is this Tanner again

[zenith pagoda]

He is one of the top reviews

[obsidian crown]

Trench or branch? 👀

[tropic crag]

lol it was some vtuber

[manic wolf]

The point is, that you have it regardless of if your ability is up or not

[lost bear]

I said what I said

[turbid yarrow]

box still gets stuck in your hands

[tardy citrus]

bash em to death with it

[tight musk]

I was gonna leave a negative review, but I decided to wait a little to see if they fix things, and they did fix most things and now the class feels better to play.

[lost bear]

When Adrenaline and Rampage overlap, great, mondo killy time. When Rampage is offline, Adrenaline buffers you and you aren't rawdogging melee

[tropic crag]

gotta start washin your hands man

[manic wolf]

You kinda are though, again, 25% is not insignificant

[tropic crag]

FS almost always fixes things, sometimes it just takes them a bit, they do like their games alot

[lost bear]

I swear steam reviews need an age limit of 25-30

[manic wolf]

If only they would fix Trappers shooting through one atom wide gaps in walls and other geometry

[lost bear]

I'm refuting Flos' point here. Rampage and Adrenaline are separate sources that also synergise, and Adrenaline has hella uptime in any fight

[wet heath]

True, it isn't, but just through the sheer volume of buffs it's just pointless to take adrenaline. I'd take having +25% damage on every second hit with something that allows me to replenish all of toughness with press of a button, giving me better uptime on both stimm and my main ability and giving me tdr over just +25% damage

[tight musk]

I had an issue using the box with a heavy sword.

I am not really sure if this is related specifically to the heavy sword, but I didn't have this issue with any of the other weapons I tried so far.

The issue was that I couldn't use the box at all unless I switched to my ranged weapon.

[tropic crag]

lol i actually like what epic does, you can't leave a review manually, only after you've played for a while will you get a popup asking you to rate the game, same with tags, you have to wait for random popups to apply tags in epic so it stops troll tags

[tardy citrus]

literally had a trapper pre-fire me on the spiral staircase the other day

my eyes almost popped out of my fucking head

[turbid yarrow]

i had bone saw

[versed spruce]

Looks about right

[tardy citrus]

trapper was at the bottom and i was coming down it

[tropic crag]

lol always dodge the trapper. Is it 100 yards away behind 5 walls but you still heard the sound? Dodge

[wet heath]

Staying longer in the fight contributes to the consistency of damage you deal

[tardy citrus]

and it pre-fired me

[versed spruce]

I see nothing wrong with this

Dogs are indeed made of magnets

[tardy citrus]

i literally said "what the fuck??"

[obsidian crown]

I see “net!”, I dodge

[lost bear]

And 10% attack speed and 25% damage with very high uptime also contributes to you staying in the fight

[turbid yarrow]

probably going to switch back to rampage until they fix that bug, that pretty much ended the run there. granted that whole run was kinda karked

[wet heath]

And with that dogshit debuff you get after rampage i'd take survivability

[tardy citrus]

the debuff really aint that bad tbh

[wet heath]

You can get same or more attack speed through 1 other talent and 2 nodes in stimm

[tardy citrus]

it'd be pretty awful if it also took your dodges away

[turbid yarrow]

i hardly notice the debuff from rampage

[wet heath]

So I don't really count it

[candid flax]

Play perfectly. Oops ran out of dodges bc crowbar only has 3. Die 🙂

[versed spruce]

All fun and games until you dodge INTO the net meant for your teammate

[bronze glade]

It's a nothingburger

[manic wolf]

I cant say I've noticed the debuff ever really playing a part in matches other than when i first got on the class

[tropic crag]

the upside of that is that the team mate is right there (but yeah i know this)

[bronze glade]

If you really want you can even plan around it

[spring umbra]

Hi leggy bird

[bronze glade]

Not that complicated

[versed spruce]

Is that Stan I see

[spring umbra]

It is

[versed spruce]

https://tenor.com/view/starwars-obi-wan-now-thats-a-name-ive-not-heard-in-along-time-gif-11814407

[spring umbra]

[tropic crag]

its like a second of no stam, its just a moment you have to be aware of and not something thats really a debuff

[lost bear]

The same way being a brick (Confident Strike) enables offense, offense enables survivability

[knotty grotto]

pubs with desperado dual auto isnt working out as well as i thought it would

[lost bear]

Why not both???

Adrenaline has genuinely fucking insane uptime in any fight, especially with Adrenaline Smiter (+4 on kill)

[knotty grotto]

i have horde and elites handled but no one else deals with armor unless i use tox bomb lmfao

[astral wing]

people aren't alternating between rampage and str/speed stim?

[wet heath]

But not your rampage

[tropic crag]

yeah adren is up alot, its just a good node, the attack speed buff alone is worth it but the rest is great

[manic wolf]

Mind you, if you have enough damage on this class, you're sort of tanky anyway. Always on Confident Strike from PV, 20% TDR from HCB and taking a stray shot gives you 30% toughness back from Tis But? Like that alone is crazy value if you're playing aggressively as thats all on top of melee kill toughness gains

[bronze glade]

I alternate between rampage and cdr

[candid flax]

I like rampage but why play rampage when I can just play zealot

[bronze glade]

Why play zealot when you can play HIV

[grand jewel]

https://tenor.com/view/tom-and-jerry-what-insomnia-no-sleep-gif-13337078

[vernal sluice]

why play when you can go outside

[radiant swift]

why play

[versed spruce]

Because Scum gets infinite ammo with one talent point

[lost bear]

And I'll take that trade for the chance to stack Rampage on top of Adrenaline

[tropic crag]

yeah it basically takes an overhead at the wrong time to put you down (at the right time it tickles )

[trim wind]

why

[astral wing]

just use stim when rampage runs out and vice versa

[manic wolf]

Yeah.. I mean the shit that kills Scummer is the shit that would kill any other class in 90% of occasions. You absolutely don't need to overstack on defensive buffs to stay upright

[tropic crag]

i use rampage by default and just use stim during any downtime ithink i need a boost

[astral wing]

its not like the best setup imaginable but it plays really well imo

[candid flax]

overheads when you're out of dodges kill anyone. It's just that scum dies to anything when out of dodges.

[wet heath]

But scum barely has any defensive buffs, that's the thing

[lost bear]

CDR stim also keeps abilities ticking with stupid uptime

[tropic crag]

which is almost never

[astral wing]

rampage adren and stim with adren being basically perma up

[candid flax]

happened to me just now

[wet heath]

Okay, defensive buffs that are not tied to dodges

[versed spruce]

Kid mamed Nimble:

[astral wing]

yeah dunno how you're running out of dodges

[versed spruce]

Unironically I spam dodge slide and still get dodges back

[candid flax]

i run pure cdr stimm with the melee capstone. Then 3x strength

[turbid yarrow]

kind of mismanaging if you're running out of dodges. it happens. don't worry about it

[tropic crag]

honestly i've been finding rampage/toxin to be super tanky

[versed spruce]

It's kinda crazy how much you can spam dodge but I fw it

[lost bear]

Had to unlearn a lot of Arby bad habits on Scum

[astral wing]

its all personal preference tbh cdr is probably better for uptime

[north meteor]

tragedy

[young herald]

huh, first mission post-patch as the only scum, and it's an ogryn + 2 arbites

this should be interesting

[candid flax]

I agree but any other class wouldn't flat out die unless you also happen to get overheaded

[turbid yarrow]

that's what i've been doing since stimm supply is buggy. i feel pretty tanky

[wet heath]

Well yes because toxin gives you toughness from that one node

[rustic axle]

love getting stuck in a loop of not having enough money because of rolling for a perfect balance bonesaw while also not having enough money to level up my other weapons so i cant use my other builds on damnation so im stuck on desperado which'll eventually make me fully dependent on that build and rampage/stimm supply is gonna be even harder to learn how to use properly

[lost bear]

Arby having taken 50 damage

[tropic crag]

and theres 1 node that lowers the damage of things you poison if you lean into it more so like... you don't feel ogryn tanky but you feel tanky for how much damage you can push out

[lost bear]

Do you find much value out of that node?

[tropic crag]

so like compared to other classes scum has almost the same amout of tank on the tree tbh

[rustic axle]

like shivs and the autopistols feel that good while im also trying to find a perfect balanced infantry auto because i figure that's also better than the autopistols?

am i going crazy

[astral wing]

ive noticed it feels comfier with it on

[wet heath]

If you lean into chem

[tropic crag]

i face tank alot so probably but i've only recently started trying it out to see how it is

[astral wing]

specifically with dual shivs

[wet heath]

If you don't you don't have much

[tropic crag]

you have some of the best defensive nodes in the game tho

like they aren't alot in number but the few there are crazy, and you can just grab them now

[tender forge]

fast stim build is pretty tanky

[candid flax]

if you play with grit yeah but thats kinda cope

[lost bear]

Imagine a Chaos Wastes analog where one of the boons you could get is a random talent node from another class

[tender forge]

and you get a +25 toughness node

[nocturne basalt]

that would be so much fun

[astral wing]

targeted toxin and hive city brawler make up the bulk of your dr tbh

rampage gives 25%

[lost bear]

As a "shit hits the fan" insurance node it's unmatched in the game

[tawny fossil]

Hello, triyng to do penance "Brutal Bludgeons" where you kill 1000 enemy with heavy attack while cartel special is active. any advice for doing this faster? thank you!

[nocturne basalt]

stim box build is probably a good start

[tropic crag]

dr is good but not as good as the toughness regen on the nodes tbh, in terms of how much health it'll save you per game

[lost bear]

Heavy Sword with Deathblow and Headtaker

[tawny fossil]

do you happen to have a link for such a build? its okay if not i can look one up too 🙂

[rustic axle]

HOLY FUCK IM FREE

[turbid yarrow]

[tawny fossil]

Just saw the edits, thank you! any special mark in that case?

[astral wing]

considering you have near infinite dodges and 0 stamina usage it's really not as bad as people make it out to be. bigger issue is the payoff for playing the class doesn't feel as great

[rustic axle]

I HAVE TRIED FOR DAYS NOW

[astral wing]

dealing with carapace is a pain

[nocturne basalt]

boom bringer goes boom

[candid flax]

so i've been trying rampage today but honestly it just feels like I'm playing a zealot with less TDR and no access to a boltgun. Sell me on rampage

[frank sierra]

How does a hivescum apply a healing stim to stimm supply if he can't pick up stims?

[astral wing]

it is just worse ngl

still fun though

[sleek grove]

it's infinite zealot on bosses, except bosses with a shield

[lost bear]

Mk 9 is probably the most accessible, you just H1 into special for elites (or H1 cancel), and Heavy chain spam into hordes (H2 and H3 are your crowd clearers)

[tropic crag]

naw theres plenty of options for that, just most of them require being comfy dancing with the armor... and one of them is the needle gun lol

[tender forge]

if you dont touch the stimm lab you can pick up stikms

[nocturne basalt]

if your cartel special is empty it should let you take it

[astral wing]

I feel like needle gun on carapace is bait

takes too long to kill

[tender forge]

5 shots doesnt

[candid flax]

what else are you gonna do

[tawny fossil]

Thanks, will give it a shot with the stimm case suggested by the other guy 🙂

[frank sierra]

so the clause about "if you yhave a stimm equipped" is exclusive against having stimm lab?

[astral wing]

finesse dagger or shiv

or chem nade

[candid flax]

knife also takes like fuckin 8 stabs or something

it takes forever

[tender forge]

no, if you have the cartel special ths stim pack uses that

[obsidian crown]

Bro lost me at needle takes too long to kill carapace

[frank sierra]

oh even if it's not equipped?

[tropic crag]

no you're paying attention to a dead crusher too long if you feel that way, you shoot it enough to kill it then go about your day fighting other things, it was dead the instant you shot it man

[astral wing]

its like 3 heavys with finesse

[frank sierra]

cuz you can't equip a cartel special - it's instant-use

[charred bronze]

re talenting after the update. Hyper-Critical has counter-synergy with Hyper-violence, yeah? Because it's an execute without a damage value?

[astral wing]

unless yall are fighting a single crusher every minute or so

[tender forge]

you just cannot pick up map stims, instead you get a stim that when off cooldown is consumed by stimm pack

[lost bear]

If you aren't cleaving like 4 heads in a swing once your bonuses kick in, you've done something wrong defenses is the dump stat btw

[tender forge]

your stim is always equipped

[frank sierra]

gotcha ty

[astral wing]

hey I won't stop you from dumping 5 mags of needle gun into a crusher pack power to yall

[candid flax]

I get meat's point. If you're fighting like 7 crushers along with warks, waiting for 3-5 chem needles to burn down a crusher feels pretty eh

[tropic crag]

actually i usually spread the love of one mag across a group then finish with melee tbh, maybe two if things are really bad

[tender forge]

thing is with needler you can just kite

cuz it has zoom speed

[astral wing]

either combat knife or shiv for crushers but it doesn't feel amazing

chem nade just wipes though ngl

[candid flax]

none of the options feel amazing

[lost bear]

On paper yes, in practice the Hyperviolence fueled Hypercritical kill proc is a thing of beauty

[candid flax]

nothing like what a zealot, ogryn or psyker can't bring and do better 10 times

[tropic crag]

bone saw can take on crushers pretty well tbh, taxe also can when i tried

[astral wing]

haven't touched taxe in a while

[charred bronze]

hah, okay, noted

[astral wing]

actually may be a shout on the rampage setup

ill give it a go

[tropic crag]

taxe felt pretty good on rampage tbh, i just like the bone saw

[candid flax]

so far i've tried rashad and crowbar with rampage

[astral wing]

needle gun is amazing but defo not for crushers personally

[candid flax]

they both felt good but i kept wondering why don't i just play zealot

[astral wing]

I can tag a boss with 5 shots and start meleeing

shivs having nerfed uncanny is such a downer though

[candid flax]

yeah that's imo its best case, it's okay versus carapace but that's mostly bc its pretty much the only thing you can do

[bronze glade]

Still good though

[tropic crag]

like super honest i mostly use it to save/help my team from crushers when i'm some distance away, otherwise i'll melee them

[candid flax]

nothing like an ogryn, or a zealot with either dueling sword or boltgun, or a psyker with breathing in their general direction

[whole pagoda]

game crashing when picking up ammo

[rotund agate]

what about chaxe melee builds? I use one with Chem Dependancy (my attack speed comes from rampage and stimm, because I am a Fervor stimm enjoyer), but feel like chaxe struggles with carapace mostly because rampage duration refund only counts the anti-carapace combos once per start of an attack...

[astral wing]

been running blackout nades with targeted toxin and pocket toxin for mixed hordes

[lost bear]

You occasionally get those insane procs where you light attack twice on a combat axe and 8 ragers fall over stone dead

[astral wing]

pretty decent as well

[tropic crag]

honestly i've just not tried it yet, its next on my list but i'm having alot of fun with bone saw

[astral wing]

I just dislike that I essentially have to greed nade pickups on the map if I'm running chem nades so blackout it is for now

[lost bear]

Who's competing for nades anyway

[astral wing]

just a personal playstyle thing. I like to leave all pickups for the rest of the team if possible

[rotund agate]

spam-happy rocket launcher scum (pre-buff, at least), box/frag ogryns, and that's about it imo...

[lost bear]

Ah fair, was thinking in terms of team value

[astral wing]

pickpocket is crazy though

[candid flax]

mostly ogryns

[astral wing]

actually insane that got through

[lost bear]

Had a game yesterday where I kept telling people I didn't need ammo, they were free to use them all

Never seen such a happy Vet

[astral wing]

wouldn't be surprised if they tweak it

[rotund agate]

happy or triggerhappy?

[lost bear]

Yes

[flat mist]

Gonna be so many people dropping hyper-violence when it would be a huge boon to their hyper-crit build because of people just saying it's anti-synergistic

[spark gyro]

How do people even reach that conclusion?

[tender ginkgo]

Does Unload not work with the double barrel shotgun?
I seem to deal the same amount of damage either way

[spark gyro]

It's more damage, which means the crit is bigger

[flat mist]

As soon as you don't hypercrit on a kill, hyper-violence is going to proc and help you reach that next threshold

[oak bramble]

agree any thing you dont one shot doesnt surivive the second blow

[tender ginkgo]

also unload doesn't seem to reset when reloading while it's already running

[flat mist]

Heavy stab a horde enemy then light slash? That heavy stab will buff the light slash and proc more hyper-crits than it would've.

[young herald]

nade pickup priority is, in order:
tox grenade scum
stun grenade zealot
box ogryn
rocket launcher scum
mine arbites
flame grenade zealot
impact arbites
pocket nuke ogryn
blackout scum
veteran

[flat mist]

Also do we know how multi-target attacks interact with both talents?

[lost bear]

Theorycrafting vs Praxis

[flat mist]

What happens if you overkill your first target, hypercrit the second, and vice versa

[tender ginkgo]

actually unload doesn't seem to work at all

[candid flax]

putting big boom ogryn so low 🙁

[rotund agate]

what happens if you add something like Brutal Momentum to the equation?

[lost bear]

If Veteran isn't making enough nades fron clenching their cheeks, they need more hip thrusts

[flat mist]

Exactly

Bromentum can't be procced after hypercrit triggers tho

[young herald]

hyperviolence will trigger on each individual target, with its damage applying to the next target the attack hits. Not sure about the other one, though I assume it would also proc individually for each enemy hit

[regal trench]

yeah, taxe is kind of insane

[young herald]

yeah, that's why they're last. But if everyone else is capped out, there's no reason a vet can't take one to skip waiting 2 minutes or whatever

[lost bear]

Haven't figured out the mechanical interactions, all I see is that a lot of things fall over at one time with Hyperviolence + Hypercritical + Brutal Momentum

And that's enough for me

[young herald]

that's just hyperviolence + bromentum

hypercritical is anti-synergy with HV

[flat mist]

Yes but does HC kill the bonus from HV immediately at that point in the chain of targets? Or next attack?

[young herald]

when HC procs, it gives 0 overkill and thus doesn't reset the buff and you lose it unless you get another non-HC kill within whatever's left of the 1s window

[lost bear]

I wonder if you could drag a Combat Axe swing to one shot n Ragers with the Achlys

[flat mist]

My guess is that run both will still be the answer

[nocturne basalt]

does HV increase the HC instakill health "window" where a crit will instantly kill?

[lost bear]

Yes

[nocturne basalt]

actually does HV crit at all?

ooh

[young herald]

so the way HV works, when you kill a target, you get a 1s window and all melee attacks in that window get the bonus damage. If you kill a target in that window and get a bigger number, then it refreshes and the window starts over again with the bigger number. If you don't, then the buff runs out and nothing happens.

What HC does is just remove a target that could have given you a bigger number and make it give you a smaller number

[lost bear]

Yep that's why it's cooked despite the nonbo on paper, in relation to HV + HC

[young herald]

HV is just +damage onto the attack

it's not a separate instance of damage or anything

it's literally just increasing the damage you do with a melee attack

[flat mist]

Dude I know all of this, that doesn't answer the questions at hand

[light phoenix]

Is BoomBringer good now?

[candid flax]

does HC work with DN?

[young herald]

it does though. If HC procs and you kill another target immediately after, and it gives you a larger number for HV, then HV refreshes

[zenith ferry]

it's fun.

[young herald]

it's just that a 1s window is quite small

[flat mist]

I'm talking about the same attack.

[young herald]

yes

[radiant swift]

very solid

[young herald]

what matters is the overkill

[candid flax]

wait they buffed boom's AoE or what?

[radiant swift]

aoe and fall off yeah

[young herald]

increased the max ammo, and the aoe, and the carapace damage

[candid flax]

peak

[lost bear]

Does Brutal Momentum keep registering targets as the first target indefinitely if the Hypercritical kill proc registers first?

[candid flax]

i thought they only reordered the talents and bugfix, not actually balance change anythign

[flat mist]

Can you articulate what I was asking?

[lost bear]

Or is it the other way around, that's what we're talking about re: the interactions