veteran-class

[hybrid plover]

Flesh tbh

[slow sky]

Double barrel shovel weapon specialist
Lemme grab a link

[hybrid plover]

But keep uncanny

Riposte ain't really necessary with Vet's high crit chance

[slow sky]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9fad575e-f27e-44fc-bd9f-f62dd7ed4001/how-to-have-fun?utm_medium=website&utm_source=gameslantern&utm_campaign=share_button

[hybrid plover]

At that point you just wanna get as much out of your crits as you can.

[patent raft]

im doing weapon mastery penances and also i just want something generally balanced, not biased to one thing or the other.

[hybrid plover]

It's not at al

[slow sky]

This build involves flip flopping between the two often

[hybrid plover]

You are constantly switching with that build

[patent raft]

im doing weapon mastery penances

[slow sky]

And it takes a fair amount of grenade stuff as a suppliment

[patent raft]

i dont like being glued to one thing too often

as in one loadout

[slow sky]

Theres not really gonna be a one size fits all build you can plug any weapon into and it works
The closest you can get to that are going straight down the middle (aside from aura) in terms of main nodes, but youll still be changing minor nodes to fit the weapons

The honest fastest way to do weapon mastery is via resource dumping

Taking about 300,000 dockets and 3000 plasteel on average

[toxic reef]

buy greys, consecrate to green, sacrifice, repeat

[slow sky]

By buying a blank weapon, upgrading it once, then giving it to mastery

[void dragon]

Mind someone tell me how ok is this build?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q37l7Ws5sxo

[patent raft]

at most i've sacrificed weapons. thats it ;-;

[slow sky]

I mean same thing
Its just using a bit of mats to do that

[tame dragon]

I have never once used the plasma gun because I can't get the roll I want, but I have it at mastery 20. Way better than trying to use a bad one

[patent raft]

i refrain from using my resources thats the thing rlly.

[slow sky]

The difference between a random unleveled green weapon and a maxxed out orange is very minor

[tame dragon]

Resources are meant to be used

[slow sky]

I mean
Youll hit a point when you don't have a use for em

Ive been at the docket cap if 25 million for a couple years

[patent raft]

thats the thing at most ive used them to upgrade a weapon to orange. thats it.

[slow sky]

Hm
Now that expeditions are out, I wonder if you could get a private game running on damnation purely to extract

Since mastery xp is given based purely on the difficulty of the completed mission

And that probably counts

[austere sierra]

Do you fellas max out those three grenade skill nodes

[slow spade]

for Frag grenades, they help a ton

Krak and Smokes don't really care beyond the regen node

well Smoke actually gets considerable value from Grenade Tinkerer

[slow sky]

They start to matter in havoc but if you dont play that then it doesnt matter

[slow spade]

but idk if it's worth it

[slow spade]

indeed, I'd likely take Grenade Tinkerer in Havoc

[tame lodge]

ogryn if he was good

[austere sierra]

Is charging a plasma gun more efficient than just ripping with it

[tame lodge]

nope

just rip it

charge is like

3 times the ammo for the damage of 2 m1s

[austere sierra]

What a fucking shame

[void dragon]

Lascannon when ObeseFish?

[void dragon]

it is STILL that bad the ratio?

[austere sierra]

I only just unlocked it but it seems to be like 3x the damage of an M1 but 4x the cost

[slow sky]

They tried to nerf it that would also buff the heavy a little, thereby defining the role between the two attacks
"Nerf bad" complaints made FS get cold feet and they watered down the change too much and it ended up not changing anything

[austere sierra]

Well they are gross and stupid

Maybe they should have turned the heavy shot into just a brace and make it a plasma thrower

[void dragon]

always were and always will be.

[tame lodge]

Not quite

M1 costs 3 ammo

And the minimum for M2 is 5

Max is 8

So almost 3

[austere sierra]

Damn and the hellbore will out burst damage the plasma?

[slow sky]

Its literally just gamers with their love for kneejerk tantrums and review bombs when a number goes down in a video game
The unfortunate reality is, game companies get severely negatively impacted when they do all that
So they have to ride the line between the game they want to make and keeping the tantrums at bay (a fruitless endeavor)

[tame lodge]

Yes but won't outcleave

[tall torrent]

it's ~2x the dmg but up to almost 3x the cost
the ammo efficiency isn't good enough to justify the lack of immediate reactive dps

[void dragon]

3 ammo for 1300 dmg instantly
8 ammo for 3100 dmg on a charged attack

what the hay?

the charged one has less efficiency of damage than the regular one

Truly an obesefish Math moment

[tame lodge]

first 2 m1

2nd 1 fully charge m2

3rd partial m2

[austere sierra]

Yeah there seems to be zero reason to use it

Unless it's a guranteed crit on a crusher or boss

[void dragon]

5 shots to kill a crusher, 2 charged shots actually fail to do the same

[tall torrent]

not that u shud shoot crusher with this gun anyway

[void dragon]

yeah but the point stands, it eats more ammo and doesnt even has better ADMs vs caparace

[tall torrent]

because it's the same attack

lol

[void dragon]

would expect that for making the ammo efficiency per ammo consumed being WORSE to at least make it penetrate better armor

but doesnt even do that

[tame lodge]

not even bosses btw

BA OC

GH RH m1

GH RH M2

[void dragon]

also isnt the charged shot supposed to have insane cleave? i dont think i can make it pierce a reaper

nvm i think it does, had me scared for a while there

[slow spade]

it does but if you can't kill the target then cleave doesn't really help

[pseudo fiber]

As I've said before. People keep review bombing that risks the bottom line and you know that's the big issue

Negative reviews impact sales

[slow spade]

Doesn't help that Darktide shot itself in the foot at its launch

and DRG is still right there...

[orchid hemlock]

Launch was such a disaster

[austere sierra]

It wouldn't matter if Fatshit had remained decent indie devs instead of just becoming super lazy sellout wanna be AAA devs

[void dragon]

at this rate can we make the first enemy impact on the charged shot to at least splash? there is genuinely no reason to use it

[slow spade]

oh and now Helldivers

[errant carbon]

Which has an even bigger problem with people review bombing when a thing gets nerfed

[slow spade]

if only there was like a Warhammer Fantasy game that THEY MADE where they could learn from their mistakes and improve the quality from

[pseudo fiber]

And got what they want and spread like a disease

I blame helldivers 2

[tame lodge]

it still has 100+ cleave on m2, dont worry

[errant carbon]

Fatshark is institutionally incapable of learning from their own mistakes. Sad!

[slow spade]

To be fair, I think they actually need to buff things like the 500 KG bomb and stuff

[tame lodge]

no but fr

[pseudo fiber]

It's got mostly positive reviews now.

[void dragon]

ObeseFish: Learn? in the 40k universe? IN THIS ECONOM?

[tame lodge]

once nerfdivers happened

[pseudo fiber]

Tbf had them for like 18 months now

[orchid hemlock]

Never ask a man his salary

Never ask a woman her age

And never, EVER

Ask a steam reviewer what communities they are in 💀

[tame lodge]

every other cry bady was like

no nerf

only buff

sure they existed before

but they 100% got louder after

[void dragon]

when i tried with the reaper i had to score the kill for the shot to pass

[slow spade]

yeah you need to kill the target for cleave to matter

[calm shard]

huh

[slow spade]

which is why the M2 cleave on the plasma is basically nothing

as you're not going to charge shot poxwalkers right? Stares at randoms

[tame lodge]

nerfdivers, aka AH just nerfed stuff

[errant carbon]

I'll be honest the darktide plasma gun is just goofy, totally unlike any other depiction of 40k plasma weapons

[tame lodge]

I think it started with Railgun

[pseudo fiber]

They aren't AAA more AA 150 staff across 3 games isn't huge

[errant carbon]

Helldivers plasma weapons feel more like 40k

[slow sky]

I mean they are still self published

[slow spade]

honestly plasma was fine before they gave every Scab like 50-75% more hp

[slow sky]

And with not a big team too

[slow spade]

then it turned sad :c

[calm shard]

you...know that was entirely misinformation right?

[slow sky]

Thats pretty impressive

[calm shard]

Genuinely

[slow sky]

What part
Genuine question

[austere sierra]

It was up until they stopped giving a shit about their product

[calm shard]

There are two patches in the games entire history where nerfs equalled the amount of buffs

Nearly every patch buffs outnumbered nerfs to weapons 3:1

[slow spade]

I hope Helldivers buff Tesla weapons as I really like Lightning weapons

[orchid hemlock]

What if we just stop listening to gamers "criticism"?

[tame lodge]

true

[calm shard]

AH never "just nerfed" things or engaged in monkey's paw balancing ever. They just nerfed overperformers and did sweeping buffs to underperformers the literal entire time

[slow sky]

But it was the one patch that (supposedly) overnerfed all of the top performing stuff which triggered the outrage

[tame lodge]

man I feel sad for the arc weapons

[slow spade]

"I think I WILL make the BoN romanceable " -Fatshark if they locked in

[pseudo fiber]

It was the railgun nerf like 3 weeks after launch

[calm shard]

I don't think they overnerfed Railgun

[tame lodge]

I fuckin love Blitzer

[calm shard]

It sure got slammed but boy was it broken on release

[tame lodge]

and all the customization it gets is fuckin

[slow spade]

Lightning is such fun to use in games but it's always nerfed to shit 😭

[tame lodge]

iron sights

[orchid hemlock]

Gamers will complain about the "gay" route in an RPG when they literally choose to fuck every man in the cast

[calm shard]

They have overnerfed things, and there have been like a few undeserved nerfs to weapons but very very few times

[slow spade]

Poor BG3, they just wanted to get the furry audience

[calm shard]

Eruptor got overnerfed, Crossbow got nerfed for no reason and overnerfed, Slugger probably didn't deserve to get nerfed, release Breaker didn't either

[tame lodge]

like wow im so glad i can modify the iron sights of the weapon that doesnt need to aim

[slow sky]

Whether it was overnerfed or not isnt what im saying cuz i dont know enough
Its that the players thought it was wildly overnerfed
And they threw tantrums until the devs buffed things again big time
And learned the lesson "bitch and whine until the devs undo every nerf" for all pve games

[calm shard]

But like every other nerf has been pretty reasonable from when they actually did nerf things

Yes that is exactly what happened more or less

[orchid hemlock]

Furry got that dough I don't blame them

[calm shard]

Add in that certain youtubers that I've heard apparently have history here like OhDough fanned the flames intentionally for engagement

[slow spade]

They could have at least added some cosmetic stuff like different color lightning. Just something :c I can't recall the last time any of the lightning weapons got anything interesting :c

[orchid hemlock]

Divinity literally pandered to scalies in the trailer

And the game isn't coming out until 2027 💀

[calm shard]

Devs did a good job balancing, but players didn't like that the "only viable weapons on D9" got nerfed so consistently, and then they repeated the same for the next one and the next one and the next one

[slow spade]

"Can we romance the water elemental?" -genuine question to the devs in an AMA

[orchid hemlock]

I checked out of HD2 the moment I got into a lobby and heard some Gen Xer say unironically: "dude I love how there are no politics in this game"

[calm shard]

All while the entire armory was steadily getting stronger and stronger up until the 60 day patch(es) actually happened

[slow spade]

They knew what they were doing when they added the lizardmen race in Divinity 2

[tame lodge]

k9 being the best arc weapon

[calm shard]

And then 60 day patch gave validity to the liars and/or idiots that claim AH only nerfs by releasing the biggest powercreep patch in the games history that fucked up the balance of the game massively

[slow spade]

I remember seeing someone say that Fallout was non-political lol

[slow spade]

yay cccc:

[orchid hemlock]

Tbh I would believe them if they only played Fallout 3 😈

[calm shard]

And that validity to their claims just made them whine more and be even more toxic

So now HD2 is just kind of in this awkward state where the devs try (and fail) to hide nerfs to things they deem overtuned by applying broad changes rather than directly targeting the item to try and avoid controversy

[slow spade]

I wonder if Fallout 3 is still non-playable. I recall it had "issues" with Windows 10

[calm shard]

Like they did with enemy durable damage changes, status strength adjustments, etc.

Haha we don't want to nerf the Coyote we're just broadly nerfing fire status strength across the entire game for...reasons!

What we don't think the Bastion is going to be overpowered we're just tripling enemy durable damage because we feel like it

[hearty panther]

When they gave the Magnum AP4 or 5, I forget, I dipped forever lmao

[slow spade]

Win rate too high? Double Vox Caster spawns UwU

[errant carbon]

More than once in the Helldivers discord I was compelled to defend the fact that Helldivers parodies (among other things) the Global War on Terror

Like I had people explaining to me that it was a parody of Starship Troopers, apparently thinking Helldivers couldn't parody more than one thing, or that the two things have nothing whatsoever to do with each other

[orchid hemlock]

Brother I know you are trying to explain the patch notes

But I am 99% sure that HD2 was just a victim of "controversy" tourism and they all moved on to the next game to shit on because X streamer told them to do so.

[calm shard]

Senator, and yes that was part of the 60 day patch

[calm shard]

Well controversy tourism that gave in to the tourist's demands so they're still around making problems actually

[hearty panther]

What irks me is that D10 could have stayed the sweat difficulty after waiting a full year for more difficult content but AH didn't even wait a full week before nerfing D10 to be easier.

[slow spade]

I hope Metro doesn't catch their attention

I want my hope filled games to stay hopeful c:

[calm shard]

Ultimately a symptom of higher difficulties adding content to missions

[orchid hemlock]

Complain about video games

Instead of playing them 😈

[calm shard]

If you want to actually see all the enemies/mission types/objective you have to play on difficulty 10

[hearty panther]

And on top of that if they had just made thermite grenades good the way they did during the very start of the 60 day powecreep galore it would've solved a lot of grievances.

[errant carbon]

Play video games? In this economy?

[calm shard]

So you get a lot of people who don't belong there playing it because they want to see all the things

[orchid hemlock]

Starship troopers is a parody of the US so it is an overlap

[hearty panther]

D10 didn't add anything new.

[calm shard]

Mega Fortresses

[orchid hemlock]

Well the movie

[hearty panther]

Oh right. Which are frankly not interesting.

[slow spade]

Same issue with Darktide making it so Damnation has like double the resources of Heresy :c

[charred ice]

Alright vets quit getting philosophical and grab every ammo tin you can see even if you're almost full

[slow spade]

a Havoc 20 chest is like 10 games of Damnation worth of resources lol

[orchid hemlock]

Back in my day, we used our mom's credit card to get 2 bit titties on RuneScape

🧓🏻

[hearty panther]

Ah well. I still recommend HD2 to people who haven't played it but it's deffo dead to me. Kinda hurts cause I waited ten fucken years for this sequel and it started pretty strong.

Every match was railgun + bubble shield so they nerfed them, which I was very happy about. Little did I know Arrowhead would die that day.

[orchid hemlock]

There is 0 philosophy here

What makes you think I am even remotely talking like Hegel 💀

[charred ice]

(It was a joke)

Also Hegel is like one dude what does that even mean

[errant carbon]

There were very specific GWOT things though, biggest one being that it was a forever war to secure and extract oil, but the messaging kept insisting it was about Spreading Democracy

Or the propaganda awkwardly shoehorning words like liberty, prosperity, and freedom in front of everything (like Fox anchors telling people to start saying "Freedom Fries" and "Liberty Toast" instead of French Fries because France wouldn't join the invasion of Iraq)

[errant carbon]

The duality of man

[charred ice]

Because of that user's comment I will begin applying Id, Ego, and Super Ego to my vet builds

This plasma gun will surely eradicate my Shadow

[orchid hemlock]

Soo close yet soo far 😔

[hearty panther]

The need to eradicate one's shadow is not inherent to man's nature: the caveman amongst his fellows at the fire does not question whether purpose is elsewhere for he is exactly where everything he has ever known resides. It is the material dialect and the consumption of storied tales which imprint, foster, and forcibly bloom such a desire.

[tame lodge]

Ammo stash shaped mouth

https://tenor.com/view/nothing-just-hanging-around-me-ha-nothing-just-hanging-around-just-chilling-dont-mind-me-gif-743177208550571394

[tame lodge]

You should do that to your life

Me? I'm an egoist

(just like everyone)

[tidal fox]

Ego?

https://tenor.com/view/rin-itoshi-rin-itoshi-rin-itoshi-tongue-meme-blue-lock-gif-15468578079702589964

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/aura-monster-rezero-subaru-arc-6-gif-9878112630416598157

[austere sierra]

I grab ammo to make sure others can't have it, because they do less with it

[tame lodge]

I bet- I bet my ego, on the field

Killing my old self to be reborn

Destroying each hope and dreams

Focusing on one feeling to win

[quiet lark]

hey, i sent u a dm but i was wondering if you could share a psyker build for the vigilant that i saw u mention a while ago while searching up messages

[quiet lark]

ty 🙏

[tame lodge]

Make your choice in the DD part

10 secs or 25 stacks is up to you

[somber axle]

For the Infantry Autogun sure. For the Vigilant Autogun no. Vet gets a lot more damage from Exe Stance and Marksman's Focus to feed the strong finesse of the Vigilant Autoguns. Hive Scum is more spray and pray without the tree giving much to benefit the Vigilant Autoguns. They're not spray and pray weapons like the Infantry Autoguns or Braced Autoguns (even if the Vraks Infantry Autogun does have solid finesse and you always want to aim heads on it too)

Vigilants fill a DMR role and Desperado is the spray full auto Scum ability

Tbh the only thing I think Scum does better for Vigilant Autoguns over Vet is the infinite ammo from Pickpocket/Desperado being better for sustaining ammo through a match over Survivalist

[tall torrent]

no

charge rate is a separate thing from attack interval (attack speed's inverse)

[austere sierra]

I could have sworn I had more than two wounds this whole time without a curio

[tall torrent]

it's difficulty related

[austere sierra]

Now since that is solved

Does the plasma gun do anything better than the hellbore

Piercing maybe?

[tidal fox]

cleave through hordes to get good targets

also has a wider hitbox for the projectile it shoots

makes it easier to kill enemies far away

it can also oneshot maulers

[tidal fox]

if youre beefed up enough

staggers crushers too depending on heat and perk

[austere sierra]

I see

[tidal fox]

I personally prefer it over hellbore

cause it's a quick pull out for high damage

and quick kills

you need half decent aim though

[austere sierra]

Yeah you just have to get use to the wind up from shots

Like how a game might slow down a double action revolvers shots etc

The reload is kind of wild though

[tall torrent]

it's better for melee hybrid builds
helbore is better for backline sniping builds

[tidal fox]

weapon specialist subnode

[austere sierra]

Backline sniping sounds just untenable with most random lobbies

[tall torrent]

just reload cancel

u don't need any reload talent for plasma

including always prepared

just IQ tax rly

[austere sierra]

Well now I don't know who to believe

[tall torrent]

there're specific animation timings where u can sprint cancel to get a much shorter reload on this gun

cuts a 9s reload down to ~5s

which is long but given u can shoot 45 times before reloading and u will usually 1~2 tap most things
and that this is a gun meant for melee hybrid builds where u melee a lot

it's fine

[unreal nova]

Reload cancel also saves you points or lets you go FT. You can also swap cancel if no room to sprint.

[austere sierra]

Is it like, start sprinting the moment you see the ammo refill

[tall torrent]

sprint when u remove flask, put flask back in, and when u rotate the pump thing

[austere sierra]

Oh, that is kind of obnoxious

But I guess it shaves some time off

[patent raft]

i now need to redo my veteran entirely 😐

i've completely reset his skill tree.

cuz the build i got given (the straight down middle biased to the right for Keystones) didnt rlly work out well for me.

[tall torrent]

Just play the build I gave u lol

[patent raft]

you mean the one that goes straight down the middle and when you hit the bottom goes towards the right side for the other keystones that arent the one on the far left?

[tall torrent]

this yea

[patent raft]

yeah that one didnt rlly work out too well

[tall torrent]

how did u play it

[patent raft]

the way i usually play.

balanced between melee, grenades and guns.

[tall torrent]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1046913589614747719/1494910861612028066/walls.mp4?ex=69e453bb&is=69e3023b&hm=b301b96173a518122dfad8a2b3934445957e02e14b17343f46dea31c93241e04&
so like this?

[patent raft]

i aint that skilled but yeah.

[tall torrent]

I'm not that skilled either

but this build is literally made just for that

[patent raft]

im more focused right now on training myself wiht all the weapons and getting all the mastery penances.

i just wanna be all rounded in terms of my ability to play.

[tall torrent]

yea this is incredibly well rounded already

[patent raft]

doesnt really fit that well with how i play.

[tall torrent]

this is about as well rounded as vet can get

[patent raft]

i never really figure out how i play, all i know is i just want something that im trying to find.

[tall torrent]

idk I'd need to see what ur doing to know what ur doing wrong

[patent raft]

and for some reason, most pre-made builds and builds i make dont work, so thats why i just mash things together in the small hope they work.

[patent raft]

no nitro = 5 second clip that i wont even be able to export to the pc im using, let alone be able to do shit with it.

cuz discord without nitro fucking sucks.

[tall torrent]

I don't have nitro either

[patent raft]

oh right. medal exists.

cant use that on the main pc though.

[tall torrent]

u can upload clips under 100mb to this server I think

I use steam record

[patent raft]

im limited to 10 usually.

[tall torrent]

no, this server's limit is 100

[hollow ibex]

lol yeah i use this server to store clips

[patent raft]

okay i guess.

how much time equates to 100 mb?

[hollow ibex]

depends on the resolution and quality of your clip

[patent raft]

im gonna say 720p

[hollow ibex]

you could prob squeeze a few minutes 🤔

[patent raft]

480?

nvm 480 is too low.

unless yall can see through it i aint doing 480p

does steam record default to 720p?

[shy pivot]

I rolled a perfect plasma gun on my second try

I should play the lottery

[narrow frost]

https://tenor.com/view/lets-go-gambling-gif-3937562841362806777

[hollow ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/angry-angry-kid-congrats-nice-happy-for-you-gif-16045257244806990422

[shy pivot]

I guess this is assuming the ideal charge/thermal split didn't change with the expeditions update

[tall torrent]

no changes

[shy pivot]

[tall torrent]

default is ur screen resolution which is prob 1080p for most people on pc?

[patent raft]

im using a TV screen...

i think its 3840 x 2160

[tall torrent]

upload YT then send link then ig

[patent raft]

no youtube

[tall torrent]

or use clipping software and send link

[patent raft]

i dont got no clipping software on that pc since its the fam one.

[tall torrent]

nvidia record?

medal?

[patent raft]

idk how ot access Nvidia record.

and no medal since well its the family pc.

[slow sky]

it makes me unreasonably happy that calvin and hobbes lives on via shitposts, and theyre always good shitposts because its fucking calvin and hobbes

[tall torrent]

what do u have then lol

[patent raft]

nothing

because its the family pc.

[tall torrent]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/396860171541807105/1232138126441582642/mfw_deadass.gif

[hollow ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/one-peak-one-piece-one-piece-cry-its-so-peak-gif-13413926760013023520

[austere sierra]

Is the toughness uptime from constantly using focus target really good

[hybrid plover]

Hive Scum

3 wounds

Wat r we even doin

[desert viper]

he IS the jonkler

[green willow]

does suppressed affect melee enemies

[austere mica]

No

Except for like, groaners I think

[patent raft]

im just gonna recod with the build i got shown -_-

im gonna do this on damnation

[green willow]

what do you put on braced

[patent raft]

this is just with the vigilant autogun. let alone other guns.

@tall torrent

[toxic reef]

maniac, flak
deathspitter, fire frenzy

[tall torrent]

this needs a LOT of improvements lol

[green willow]

ok so i got it right

[patent raft]

this is just with the VA.

i do a lot of subconscious changes i dont notice

[tall torrent]

this is fundamentally wrong on so many levels that weapons don't matter

[green willow]

does braced have more stagger than infantry

[toxic reef]

yes

[dapper coyote]

DSword feels, dumb powerful

[toxic reef]

it's a bit brainless

[dapper coyote]

Anti armor (uncanny), anti boss (parry), anti chaff (light spam)

[toxic reef]

I don't really run it on vet, since I want melees that can handle hordes on vet

[dapper coyote]

I put in on zealot

Give him Martyrdom

Max perc it

[toxic reef]

yeah I run that on expeditions

[dapper coyote]

And every enemy is like butter suddenly

1 tapping ragers? Dawg thats a luxury

[patent raft]

how so?

[dapper coyote]

Vigil autogun, on paper is a sniper

But theres, bolt pistol, big bolter, krieg lasgun, revolvers

[tall torrent]

not running directly at enemies without any movement whatsoever would be a start

[dapper coyote]

Oh yeah

[patent raft]

and also srsly i dont have a truly specific playstyle. now that i think about it, what i was saying earlier about a balanced skil lset is wrong. i just need something that can adapt to playstyles.

subconsciously changes with each weapon i equip, let alone the different MK's

[dapper coyote]

Play zealot martydom

• DS or relic blade

Really brain dead, just swing that shit

For lower diff levels ofc

[tall torrent]

no this is not even a playstyle

ur actual strat is run at enemy, do effectively nothing, and die

[dapper coyote]

You have a head tapper

But you charge in with hip fire

[green willow]

tan braced or blue braced

[patent raft]

i should probably use the burst one.

[dapper coyote]

And don't sprint towards the enemy

With your gun

[toxic reef]

gold braced

[dapper coyote]

Damn, but ill mod that shit in

[tall torrent]

u should learn base game mechanics first

[dapper coyote]

Yeah

Actually

[patent raft]

i have.

[dapper coyote]

You really need to learn that

[dapper coyote]

We don't charge at the enemy with our guns, taking dmg

[patent raft]

and.

i play how i play.

[dapper coyote]

Go play zealot

[patent raft]

no.

[dapper coyote]

Get melee

Charge in

[patent raft]

zealot is one of the last things im gonna play.

[dapper coyote]

Unga bunga your way

[patent raft]

no.

zealot is one of the last ones im willing to play.

[dapper coyote]

Or play scum

Hive scum

[patent raft]

dont have DLC.

[dapper coyote]

He does fit your playstyle abit

Run and gun

Fuck aiming

[patent raft]

i just said

i dont have DLC

[dapper coyote]

Get it, otherwise vet ain't fitting the playstyle

Sorry, he isn't that guy

[patent raft]

well. no.

[dapper coyote]

[patent raft]

im gonna keep suffering if i choose to keep suffering.

[dapper coyote]

Then stuck there pal, nothing else we can help you

[patent raft]

well. all i need is something that can at least adapt.

for a trait build at least.

[dapper coyote]

Yeah, adapting by listening

But you know what, you do you pal

[patent raft]

i mean traits, jackass.

[dapper coyote]

Dunno what to give you

[dapper coyote]

Wdym by traits?

[patent raft]

i forgot the fucking nbame

[dapper coyote]

Traits in the gun? The class? The curio?

[patent raft]

class.

[dapper coyote]

Mr vet there, if you want to play run and gun, get a Double barrel+ Weapon Specialist node

[patent raft]

.....

im not going specific weapon only.

[dapper coyote]

Well ye said trait in class

[patent raft]

im not going only specific 2 weapons man.

i dont do that.

[dapper coyote]

Weapon Specialist node does help you that

Just switch guns to melee from time to time

Don't lock in only on guns, mistake that I've learn the hard way

[patent raft]

dude thats literally what your suggesting with the double barrel

[dapper coyote]

Don't pick db then

[patent raft]

your not making any fucking sense.

[dapper coyote]

Im saying here is WS helps with that playstyle

[patent raft]

the rest of the tree is more what i need.

[dapper coyote]

Just do note that switch guns to melee from time to time

[patent raft]

i do that

i do switch whether or not im using a melee or gun a lot

[dapper coyote]

https://tenor.com/view/no-more-room-in-hell-gif-16972764739143489063

Deal with it

Idk

Idk what you need

Gotta go back to work

[patent raft]

i mean i need a trait loadout for the class that is adaptable to the way i play.

and the weapons i use play more of a part than what it fuckin seems to everyone.

weapon = slight subconscious playstyle change

or well. loadout = slight subconscious playstyle change.

[toxic reef]

I think you might need to learn to play first

[patent raft]

istg

i just need something that helps the way i play

but fine. i'll do the tutorial again if thats what you all apparently fuckin want.

[toxic reef]

play on lower difficulties, idk

[tall torrent]

based on what u showed that's clearly not true

[dapper coyote]

Game Journalist ass gameplay

[patent raft]

done i redid the basic training ffs.

[patent raft]

fuck off with that

[dapper coyote]

A lvl 1 ogryn can do better than that

With prison garb

[patent raft]

js fuck off dude.

you dont need to keep insulting me for hte way i play.

[dapper coyote]

https://tenor.com/view/suggestion-box-gif-9789253898542238680

We advising you belike:

[patent raft]

somehow managed to live better when i was away from my team. wow.

switching to the burst autogun was a good choice.

and im sorry that i dont play veteran to everyone else's standards.

[somber axle]

tbh I think you'd like Arbites a lot more

[patent raft]

I. DONT. HAVE. DLC.

[somber axle]

I'd be down to gift it to you if you want

Arby is just that fun LOL

Plus you can pet the dog

[patent raft]

im on gamepass

[somber axle]

Aww dang

I'm on steam idk anything about gamepass

[patent raft]

i might be able to convince my dad to let me buy it on steam.

otherwise, im stuck waiting till the next time darktide goes on steam.

sale(

[somber axle]

If you get on steam lemme know and I can gift you Arby

[patent raft]

thanks mate.

[somber axle]

I've been enjoying a funny Castigator's build lately where I just walk forward and spam shotgun through mixed hordes to watch everything evaporate

[tall torrent]

that's nothing

u need to learn actual mechanics for staying alive

dodge, slide, melee combos, weakspot hits, etc

all are super basic

[patent raft]

im not doing meta builds and learning al the meta stuff.

[tall torrent]

none of these are related to meta builds

they're as basic as it gets for playing the game

[dapper coyote]

One thing that i don't get it in this game why can't we just swipe horizontally without pushing with the caxe

[dapper coyote]

Forbidden moves otherwise tzeentch claims your soul or sumshit

[patent raft]

i might be stuck waiting until the summer sale

which is 68 days away.

[serene bough]

why are you resistant to advice

[patent raft]

IDFK.

[serene bough]

it takes hundreds to thousands of hours to master the game there's no shame in listening to advice

[slow sky]

ive played this game for thousands of hours, and have even been kidnapped to playtest for it
im typically the one giving advice, but when it comes to things like specific weapons
i literally go to people who use them more than me and ask about stuff

there is always so much to learn, and one of the hardest jumps in difficulty in darktide is the first one

the game just
functions differently to most other games

its gonna take a while

[patent raft]

I dont have playstyles. i dont have anything. okay?

all i know is to just fucking play the game, and hope it works.

[slow sky]

you build that up as you explore what the game has to offer

i started the game thinking id be generic shoot guy on vet, cuz that was what i was most familiar with other games
couldnt be further from the truth, i did a 180 and fell in love with melee playstyles on every class

[dapper coyote]

Same

[slow sky]

and i found out i enjoyed them cuz i just explored what the game had to offer

[dapper coyote]

Started as vet, currently enjoying zealot

Like, kilometres away from playing first vet

[slow sky]

but yeah, just playing the game is gonna be what youre doing right about now
youll start to notice that you enjoy or dislike something, then find alternatives
and stuff will start to fall into place

[patent raft]

i cant really do that. and its a problem.

[dapper coyote]

Why can't you really do that?

[atomic void]

Unstoppable force vs immoveable object

[dapper coyote]

Fr

[slow sky]

is it the choice paralysis of "idk what i want to really lean into"?

[dapper coyote]

Advising him is like:

https://tenor.com/view/suggestion-box-gif-9789253898542238680

Bro, pick up, db and WS, it suits you doing run and gun,

Nah

[atomic void]

Just let bro figure it out some people just wanna bing bong wahoo

[dapper coyote]

Yeah, and ADS or dodging is meta apparently

[dapper coyote]

Also for context, he wants a build that can play any playstyle, not sure if its how he plays or how the guns are

[slow sky]

idk if anyone actually showed you what it looked like, but this is the build i sent earlier today when i was at work

[patent raft]

just watch this. keep in mind this is specifically with the Vigilant Autogun. keep that in mind. #veteran-class message

[dapper coyote]

Why vigi tho?

[patent raft]

mastery.

im just doing masteries atp.

[atomic void]

Holy combo

[somber axle]

No worries the offer still stands if you ever get over to Steam

[patent raft]

[dapper coyote]

Is it fully maxxed or because it your most maxxed mastery?

[patent raft]

i just wanted to get the vigilant autogun mastery out of the way.

because i knew it would be the most annoying.

[dapper coyote]

Sacrifice dozens of Vigilant Autoguns

Like, if you are trying to max ALL mastery, and some guns are just ass to do so, sacrifice them to hadron

Shove Hadron with enough Vigilant Autoguns to arm a Militia

[slow sky]

i mean yeah, the issue isnt the build, its the execution. people were mentioning it before, its just the basics of gameplay. they probably mentioned that it didnt feel very effective due to not aiming down sights, which would be pretty important for a precision gun like the vigilants who really want to hit the head, as well as dodging, the main way of avoiding damage which i dont think you were ever really doing there. the dodging part is especially important on every single build in the game, you cant get away without doing that, i was doing it often in that clip up there and the result was barely anything could hit me even when i was swarmed.

[patent raft]

my mindset when it comes to dodging is weird.

[slow sky]

do you want me to explain the basics of dodging
this isnt like a me talking down to you thing, dodging is weird in this game but understanding exactly what its doing helps you use it (i had to have someone explain it to me so i would stop eating shit early on)

its pretty different mechanically to other games, like dark souls or something idk

[atomic void]

İt's basically mandatory

No dodging = u eat shit

[slow sky]

yeah

[dapper coyote]

Also please use ADS, Aim down sights when using Vigilant Autoguns

[atomic void]

Doesn't matter if you're shooty man or stabby man

[dapper coyote]

Don't hip fire that shit, its a head tapper

[slow sky]

enemies will literally lock on to you
if they start their attack with you as the target, they will hit you unless they are interrupted or you dodge, because dodging breaks the tracking on it

[patent raft]

didnt even get one mastery point out of sacrificing. damn.

[dapper coyote]

Sacrifice vigil only

Don't sacrifice random guns

[patent raft]

i had 2.

[dapper coyote]

Oh yeah

It do be like that

[slow sky]

if you try to outrun an attack, the enemy will literally skate across the floor, staying locked onto you and just hit you anyway

[atomic void]

You'll need to sacrifice shitton
İt's never worth it unless u have lots of money and buy a lot of greys, make them green then mass sacrifice

[slow sky]

its crazy

[dapper coyote]

Also pls gib brittleness bless to Dclaws man

[slow sky]

have you heard what my ideal blessing for it is

[dapper coyote]

Go on

[sly orchid]

You need a certain amount of movement speed to outrun enemy backstabs

[slow sky]

on perfect parry, +50% strength and rending to your next 3 attacks.

[patent raft]

is it power or consecrate increase that i need to do to boost XP

[dapper coyote]

Hmmmmm

[slow sky]

consecrate
just once

[atomic void]

Took me forever to understand this when I started lol it's so weird
My brain couldn't comprehend the I'm not dodging things but I'm making things miss me????

[slow sky]

just turn it to the green rarity

[dapper coyote]

Make it green

[slow sky]

anything higher is a waste

[sly orchid]

Dont do it on low level

[slow sky]

FUCK there was that one youtube guide from like near launch

[sly orchid]

Because youll waste alot of mats

[slow sky]

it fuckin
explained the slot system in the most basic ways and that was the start of me actually getting my shit together

[dapper coyote]

Yeah

[slow sky]

i owe my darktide career to that miniseries

[dapper coyote]

You need like a maxxed out guy to actually start getting decent roll for sacrifice

[atomic void]

İt's like this game doesn't have hitboxes that u can play around things are either locked on to you or they miss

Goofy ass game

[patent raft]

15/20.

[dapper coyote]

Managed to rage bait a beast of nurgle lmao

3 other teammates have a turkey shoot on the weak spot

Dies in less than 2 mins

[sly orchid]

You can also shoot a bon in the mouth

[dapper coyote]

Zealot martydom, my gun was big bolter, but empty mag dumping him

[slow sky]

holy shit i think i found it

[patent raft]

after the vigilant autogun im gonna go for the Infantry then the braced next

[dapper coyote]

Cole got that tech remnant

[sly orchid]

The queu system

[atomic void]

He who shall not be named helped me understand slot system

[slow sky]

this video was before that one

[atomic void]

Oh I'm sure

İt's just the one I found first

[patent raft]

im switching to infantry autogun when i finish the Vigilant.

[dapper coyote]

Infantry is okie, braced is HIP FIRE BOIS

FUCK AIMING I GUESS, JUST BRRRRRR

[slow sky]

infantry autogun is a BRRRRR gun so you dont HAVE to hit the head but it helps, so does ADS for recoil
but yeah brauto is just plug in play, just shoot em

[dapper coyote]

I call braced Bruhto

[sly orchid]

GW deciding to change weapon names every so often

[patent raft]

after that im gonna either go plasma or somethign else.

[sly orchid]

PLEASE CAN SKITARII GET THE PLASMA CALIVER AND TRANSONIC HALBERD

[tall torrent]

because hitbox-based in this game would be computationally too costly to run and u'd be playing at 3fps instead of 30fps

[dapper coyote]

Gib more polearm

[atomic void]

Yep

[dapper coyote]

Also give skin to larp as a late medieval knight

[atomic void]

The current system works it was just hard for me to comprehend

Cause I've never played something like this lol

[sly orchid]

I will manifest the transonic halberd

https://tenor.com/view/gwent-gwentcard-nilfgaard-slave-hunter-gif-13939567

[atomic void]

Gib omni axe

Don't care if it's not given to bumfukshitboom in lore just gib

[sly orchid]

Skitarii in no way will get the omnisian axe

Maybe a power staff

[atomic void]

İt's so over

40k has the coolest shit ever but everything is so controlled man lmao

Errrm the ancient scrolls of shitakawa don't mention the funny haha faction using infant annihilator number 9000

[tall torrent]

omni axe wud be cool

I want more good melee weapons for classes

[atomic void]

İt'd fill in the hallherd rule

[tall torrent]

idk wat weapons they'll add this year

1 class

[atomic void]

That doesn't exist literally

[tall torrent]

then what

weapon (variant) and map

hopefully

[atomic void]

They'll add their fifth undercooked mode!

[sly orchid]

Give me an electro leech stave

[atomic void]

This mf blind!

[sly orchid]

Hopefully power axe

[atomic void]

Powerfist pls?

[tall torrent]

idk

[sly orchid]

Imagine it works like saltzpyre rapier

[atomic void]

Heavy charged attack with 20 meter radius and infinite cleave

[sly orchid]

Where you have a laspistol offhand

[tall torrent]

I rly only care abt good melee weapons atm

[atomic void]

Millions must seethe

[tall torrent]

my perspective is very skewed

[atomic void]

Well power axe and powefist would be good melee weapons

But depends on your standard for good ig

[sly orchid]

Both exlcusive to vet lmfao

[atomic void]

İ don't think they'll add any power sword tier weapons

[sly orchid]

Power axe and fist could be strong but slow weapons

[tall torrent]

the last good melee weapon they made was shiv

[sly orchid]

The powerfist issue could be fixed instantly if it had a power supply integrated into the gauntlet

[tall torrent]

and before that, arb weapons

I think they designed arb weapons better than hvs weapons

[atomic void]

Arb shield my beloved

[tall torrent]

way better identity and clear tradeoffs

[patent raft]

arb melee when i look at it feels like a shrunk ogryn

[sly orchid]

The shotpistol is legit my favourite ranged weapon in the game

It just flows so well

[atomic void]

İ rarely saw scums with crowbar or bone saw xddd

[dapper coyote]

On paper, arb looks like that

[atomic void]

İt was all shivs

[dapper coyote]

Arbites is like, peak crowd control

[sly orchid]

I use crowbar scum

[atomic void]

Tbh rampage makes everything work

[dapper coyote]

Shock go brrr

[patent raft]

Imo, arb is mini ogryn

[atomic void]

Yes but actually no

[dapper coyote]

And dog is based as fuck

[tall torrent]

kinda yes but mostly no

[dapper coyote]

Fuck the other dogs

[tall torrent]

I also wish they could make blessings good

[dapper coyote]

Maul him off you then maul that sniper 50m away

[patent raft]

no sorry imo its a shrunk ogryn veteran hgybrid

[tall torrent]

if decapitator stacked from all melee kills it would unironically make falchion good

no joke

[atomic void]

What do u mean u Don't like that 99% of weapons have clear best in slot options and everything else is filler?

[tall torrent]

99% is exaggerated

it's more like, 70%?

[atomic void]

İ wish blessings actually made things play different instead of ya know

[atomic void]

Yeah ofc

[dapper coyote]

Ilas, buffed, is it good now?

[atomic void]

Comedic value

[tall torrent]

it's funny because the best weapons all actually have good blessing selection

[grand perch]

ok ill implement that but youll have to stay in a room with this guy for a day

[tall torrent]

power sword has 3 choices that all do smth different

and this choice matters

plasma has choice

DS and knife both have choice

FGS sorta has choice

relic blade sorta has choice

[atomic void]

İ just think this game is too dmg heavy so most none dmg blessings take a backseat

And there's a lot of funny impact blessings

[sly orchid]

@slow sky can you tell the testing server that admech needs an electroleech stave

Thank you love you xoxo

[tall torrent]

impact blessings are a bit underrated

it depends

[atomic void]

Hammerblow my beloved

Ok question

Why does devil's claw, a machete

[tall torrent]

idk lol

[atomic void]

Have multiple impact blessings

?????

[tall torrent]

but impact is underrated because it's misunderstood

[sly orchid]

Fatshark is trolling

[tall torrent]

it's all breakpoints

for example

this is elite ball knowledge I'm giving u rn

[grand perch]

i hate that i recognize this series of pictures

[tall torrent]

relic blade with grievous wounds + rampage

can heavy stagger rager with energized heavy sweep

[atomic void]

Grevious wounds me beloved

İ always took it

[tall torrent]

it just barely reaches >30 stagger

for first target heavy stagger

but the remaining enemies all take a lot of stagger still

so they stay staggered for quite a while

and because of this I would actually rate rampage above wrath on RB

[atomic void]

İ first started taking grevious wounds when I played crusher because surely the big impact mace benefits from it

[tall torrent]

I also was looking at more stagger related things

[sly orchid]

It would be hilarious if its actualy an electro priest

[tall torrent]

and as it turns out

slaughterer on power sword

actually isn't entirely worse than BM/sunder due to vet getting a shit ton of dmg from 1.9

it's strictly the best mixed horde dps outside of extreme cases (10+ elites stacked inside each other, etc)

it hits way better elite kill breakpoints than BM or sunder

it puts ragers and maulers into medium instead of light stagger which is SUPER noticeable

[patent raft]

brunt is scary 😐

[tall torrent]

it improves push stagger because it's global strength

[atomic void]

İ always take slaughter If it's on a weapon

[tall torrent]

and it allows u to cleave through bulwark & reaper (which BM cannot do)

[tall torrent]

I also think headtaker + slaughterer + GW on TH is pretty legit

[atomic void]

I'll try your thammer build when my internet is not subhuman

[patent raft]

i kinda want an ogryn personality thats like brunt now

[tall torrent]

in terms of strength blessings this is prob my tier list

t0 = headtaker
t1 = slaughterer, superiority
t1.5 = rampage
t2 = thrust, decimator
t3 = all or nothing

[atomic void]

All or nothing always seemed gimmicky to me

İ tried it on arb msul and didn't like it

[tall torrent]

it would be way better if it lingered for a few seconds

[thorn lark]

People in discord used to say, the best form of crowd control is killing.

That's the reason BM was advocated as meta for so long

[willow prairie]

bm also do first target damage to all enemy affected

💀

so its just bm being op as fuck

[austere sierra]

Bowl Movement?

[dry cloak]

brutal momentum

[pseudo fiber]

Big meta

[toxic reef]

bad manners

[desert viper]

Bald Men

[tame lodge]

Bum Mer

[agile mango]

what bistol mark is best?

[tame lodge]

For vet none

That being said

Just pick one

[dapper coyote]

Imo, the AP one

The - hold up

Mark IV

[thorn lark]

Brutal Mom

[dapper coyote]

Thats the one, Mark IV, your not dumping entire mag fast enough to make it matter so imo, take the AP one because use it as a quick sniper

[turbid ibex]

Who up ramping they age

[agile mango]

wdym dumping fast enough and AP one?

[dapper coyote]

Mk IV is what i called Armor Piercing one, due to reduce AoE but increased dmg also bolt pistol doesn't have fast fire rate

You can still aggro a boss with bleed

But if you are expecting a boss killer or a doom mag dump like the big bolter, this isn't it

If you want an AoE gun just play ogryn with explosive large thumper, don't bother using the HE / Splash variant of the bolters for it

[unreal nova]

If you play lower diff, like malice, honestly doesn't matter. Just run Lethal Proximity and Puncture.

[floral creek]

Any guns out there to break a bulwark's guard?

[dapper coyote]

Plasma, Combat Shotgun Agrippina's special AP slug,

That's all ik

[floral creek]

Yeah I've been using Agripinaa, but I didn't know the plas could do that

[dapper coyote]

Flame from the tan Combat shotgun bypass, zealot flamer also bypass

I think DB dual barrel shot and the blue Combat shotgun special Duckbilled buckshot does it as well?

[dapper coyote]

Not sure if it still does that

[floral creek]

Thank you very much, nonetheless. I'll keep running the Agripinaa Mk VII for now

[dapper coyote]

CShotgun my beloved

[floral creek]

It's not meta, but it's in no way a slouch.

CS puts in work

[dapper coyote]

It works.

It. Just. Works.

[dry cloak]

splash bolter are vastly better on arby

[agile mango]

Is agile engagement worth it on plasma? Or is plasma too slow to get good uptime?

[turbid ibex]

Plasma is exactly the kind of weapon for the playstyle agile incentivizes

[arctic ridge]

How would it compare to Sunder in top Havocs?

[austere sierra]

How decent is focus target

[turbid ibex]

is good

big damage boost as long as you dont forget you have it

[austere sierra]

Yeah it seems pretty great for damage uptime for you plus squad and some toughness regen without much downside

Except for forgetting you have it

And the falchion seems like a less powerful relic blade, I feel like the power sword has it beat

Unless it does something extra sick

[turbid ibex]

nah

falchion is gigamid

meanwhile power sword is legit one of the best melees in the game

[austere sierra]

Yeah free charge, two hits of it

Prefer the heavy sweep mark vs whatever other one

[turbid ibex]

you dont use heavies on power sword lol

and mk6 is a direct upgrade over mk3

[dapper coyote]

Tbf, cops are built for crowd control

And i don't have him

[tame lodge]

Notice how it doesn't say how lethal the crowd control is

#noticing

[dapper coyote]

Its wh40k

[turbid ibex]

#unnoticing

[dapper coyote]

Apperantly riot vehicle have ATGMs

[tame lodge]

Water cannon? Nuh uh
Give it an anti everything gun

[dapper coyote]

stubbers for the lower enforcers and uhhh, heavy bolters or autocannons for the arbites

Why? For pacification, yeah yeah, definitely for pacification

[austere sierra]

Why is that, breakpoints?

[turbid ibex]

theres no point

you just use lights

[dapper coyote]

Psword is just, good

Hahahah, power up and light

[turbid ibex]

and push attack

[dapper coyote]

You can cleave a whole ass crowd pretty easily

[turbid ibex]

push attack light light for single target
light light light for horde

[grand perch]

ive played too much hive scum

vet feels almost sluggish in comparison

[tame lodge]

Power Lightsword

[dapper coyote]

Im currently enjoying waaaaayyyy too much in Martyrdom zealot

Ammo economy? Never heard of it. Anyways here's a bolt that i blessed in the ship, definitely didn't stole it from the ship

[calm shard]

that's why I ping pong between helbore exe vet and shivs toxin scum with dodge range stim

to get maximum whiplash

[austere sierra]

It's a paid class, of course it's super balanced

[strong umbra]

[willow prairie]

arby is like braindead + strong weapon but like they still have issue

meanwhile scum was a glass cannon then they just make them cannon lmao

on paper still the squishiest class but in practice you have so many shit to avoid damage

[austere sierra]

And then pull out a rocket launcher that deletes groups of anything short of monsters

[strong umbra]

both of them are bad in havoc 40 when u play no comm why would i ever play them

[agile mango]

is precisoin strikes good? i've been told that +% weakspot damage isn't very good since apparently its calcualted weridly

[austere sierra]

I think it's because it doesn't apply to all the damage you do

Just the extra amount from the weakspot is increased 30%

[hybrid plover]

Wait

What's bad in h40

[willow prairie]

scum bad in h40?

first time ever

[hybrid plover]

That is

[tame lodge]

Precision Strike is good

It's a must have

Any build without it is a bad build

[hybrid plover]

Yes because the amount from Precision Strikes is actually significant compared to the 10% perk

[tame lodge]

Arbitrarily

[hybrid plover]

Shovel double barrel

[austere sierra]

Also focused cooling, PLUS heat generation on crit, meaning if I crit with the plasma gun it makes me closer to overheat?

[hybrid plover]

Is RIGHT THERE

[tame lodge]

Does it have Precision Strike?

[hybrid plover]

But that's the one build that truly doesn't need it because it doesn't actually benefit much from it at al

[willow prairie]

you can afford precision strike on bleed max build

[tame lodge]

If it doesn't
Refer to my previous statement

[hybrid plover]

Shovel ain't got great finesse

[tame lodge]

It's also

Not good

[agile mango]

cool. i've been using bistol shredder spam so far and I was trying to find something to drop so I could switch from weapon specialist to focust arget

[tame lodge]

Because

It's shovel

💀

So like

It's bad² build ²

Kekw

[hybrid plover]

We can agree to disagree Narc Higuing

[austere sierra]

But shovel bonks hordes

And then flips to stabby

[tame lodge]

You're not going to disagree that shovel is bad though

[hybrid plover]

It's okay.

[tame lodge]

Yeah bad

[hybrid plover]

Rather that than Falchion

[tame lodge]

Okay isn't enough sunny

[desert viper]

shovel has uncanny so shovel good

clearly

[tame lodge]

No that's the worst part

[hybrid plover]

Tbf uncanny really does kinda carry it

[tame lodge]

It has uncanny

And Skullcrusher

2 of the greatest blessings

[desert viper]

i do uncanny decimator but theres skullcrusher ig

[tame lodge]

And shovel somehow still mid

[agile mango]

why do so few peole seem to use agile DS? it's just infinite dodges

[tame lodge]

💀

[desert viper]

the issue is that flip shovels fuckin SUCKS

grah

[tame lodge]

Because agile is dump

[turbid ibex]

cause agile is shit lol

[tame lodge]

[hybrid plover]

You lose out on noticeable dps

I'd say it's okay for like

[tame lodge]

Agile uses 1 blessing slot

[agile mango]

aren't you just losing like 20% crit though?

[turbid ibex]

if you actually need infinite dodges to survive that is a skill issue

[hybrid plover]

A recon las build where you are literally using nothing but that

[agile mango]

uncanny + agile seems really dumb

[tame lodge]

For something that you can get by managing your dodges

[tame lodge]

Or 60% finesse

Or 36% strength

Or 50% strength

[willow prairie]

rampage on ds

[hybrid plover]

20% is actually significant on a weapon that doesn't have a base crit chance

[willow prairie]

😭

[agile mango]

if you need blessings at all its a skill issue. I only play with gray weapons

[tame lodge]

For something that you can already do if you manage your dodges

Simply put

Agile is bad

No wait

Agile is the wrong weapons

If it was like

On shield maybe useful

Because shields have only 2 dodges

[desert viper]

give agile to ogryn shield

problem solved

[tame lodge]

So yeah keep your dps up

And stop dodging for 0.85s to get all your dodges back

[willow prairie]

I mean shield need other blessing more than agile lmao

skullcrusher is basically permanent

[tame lodge]

Ogryn shield only needs skrusher

Arbites shield something idk

[willow prairie]

arby shield need more damage

[tame lodge]

Midbites

[willow prairie]

dodge isn't that bad for a shield weapon

bm on shield help with horde a lot

people tend to forget that bm is weakspot kill you don't need to completely one shot to get the benefit

[austere sierra]

So the hellbore mk3

Is it just a middle ground of a little slower but a little stronger?

Rather than fastest charge weakest burst vs strongest burst slowest charge

[tall torrent]

Sunder better for hyper density
Slaughterer better at dps

[agile mango]

does lethal prox increase smoke grenade smoke radius?

[hybrid plover]

I think Sunder is still better for the sake of being able to cleave crushers but Slaughterer has its place on some builds imho

[willow prairie]

lethal prox doesn't increase incendiary and chem nade dot radius

[hybrid plover]

Was trying it yesterday.

[willow prairie]

only affect initial explosion

[toxic reef]

no

[hybrid plover]

Initial explosion. Just a slightly bigger stagger

Not really worth it.

[tame lodge]

Slightly bigger light stagger

[hybrid plover]

Smokes are particularly good at some things. That's not one of them lol

[tall torrent]

I tried it on melee pressure trials

and slaughterer wasn't much worse

cuz it just killed things faster and staggered elites harder

[arctic ridge]

& the Sunder Heavy melee -- is holding down RMB, yea?

[hybrid plover]

No

[tall torrent]

why rmb

[toxic reef]

heavies are not needed

[arctic ridge]

Right, LMB.

[hybrid plover]

Yeah I was saying no assuming that.

Don't do heavies.

Unless you're doing it as like

Your first attack in a horde to start off

[toxic reef]

I sometimes do it on busy ledges

[gilded wraith]

Is the push attack considered a heavy?

[toxic reef]

to really cut through them all

no

[hybrid plover]

It's overall worse than just light spamming or push attack light light for single target

[hybrid plover]

I still think they're not great even there

[toxic reef]

lining up a push attack against a charging mutant is always so satisfying

[hybrid plover]

Wind up animation go crazy

[arctic ridge]

Yea, sometimes I time Sunder heavy attacks in some situations -- first strike at a horde, first strike at a special if the area is roomy & timely enough for it, ledges, within stunned / paused groups.

[arctic ridge]

S's benefit is, sword only? or the stacked strength, affects everything else?

[toxic reef]

sword only

zealot's knife is one that can take advantage of the blessings of the weapon it's using

[arctic ridge]

Was wondering which, if called for, some high havoc modifiers (& squad makeup) would call for Vet Slaughterer over Sunder.

[toxic reef]

I just always go sunder

[arctic ridge]

Yea, that's my general go-to.

[tall torrent]

wdym

[arctic ridge]

Someone answered me above regarding Slaughterer's accumulated strength affect.

[tall torrent]

slaughterer is global strength

not melee strength

it affects everything while sword is in hand

[arctic ridge]

Global strength, meaning?

[tall torrent]

it affects more than melee attacks

DOT, explosions, push

[arctic ridge]

So like sword hitting barrel.

[hollow ibex]

so slaughterer actually good on PS?

we've gone full circle

[tall torrent]

I think it's better than it used to be since 1.9 gave vet a lot more dmg

[tall torrent]

??

[willow prairie]

how does slaughterer compare to bm

[hybrid plover]

It was never really bad.

It's just that Sunder is a crazy blessing for what it provides.

[tall torrent]

worse horde clear
better mixed horde dps usually
better stagger
better cleave

[turbid ibex]

what about sunder

[tall torrent]

better vs hyperdensity
worse dps
worse stagger

[hollow ibex]

perosnall not the biggest fan of sunder tbh

[hollow ibex]

does it actually give better cleave than BM?

since BM also effectively gives a bunch of cleave too

[tall torrent]

BM cannot cleave through reaper or bulwark period

BM only cleaves through more things when u hit damage breakpoints

[hollow ibex]

well slaught won't help cleaving through bulwark either

maybe reaper

[tall torrent]

Slaughterer at max stacks + 77% or higher Cleave Targets can reach >16.2 cleave

[tall torrent]

Slaughterer can cleave through bulwark and reaper at max stacks

Just not bulwark shield

[hollow ibex]

well yeah

idk how helpful it is to cleave reapers and unshielded bulwarks

but maybe i'll try it out over sunder

[willow prairie]

cleaving through bulwark and carapace is huge

[fading canopy]

is the power sword like actuallyh broken

[turbid ibex]

yes