veteran-class

[drowsy perch]

the mkVIc of recon las is pretty good

with crit build and such

laser minigun basically

[silver patrol]

they should give onslaught to hivescum

doesn't it have shit finesse

[drowsy perch]

idk

doesnt even have it as a stat

[silver patrol]

it's pretty low, something like 1.3 irrc

[hybrid plover]

Recon has like no finesse

[drowsy perch]

but with the blessings and talents that add crit chance while aiming

you can get basically infinite crits

[hybrid plover]

Infernus is strong tho so

[silver patrol]

uhhhh

[hybrid plover]

You take headhunter off right this second.

[hollow ibex]

apparently recon las finesse is .75

[latent star]

The main issue I find with recons is if I fully build into a recon I can make it about as effective as a similar Helbore build except it eats all the ammo.

[hollow ibex]

so actually not as bad as previously thought

[fair shale]

Recon will crit through weight of fire anyway

[hollow ibex]

but it's still not high enough to run with MMF for example

for reference helbore finesse is 2

as is ilas

[hybrid plover]

Headhunter is not very good for recon at all.

[drowsy perch]

nuh uh

[latent star]

Helbore MMF build with the fastest mark (mark 5 iirc) is pretty fun.

[hollow ibex]

yeh

[drowsy perch]

let me upload the video

[hollow ibex]

sorry but dumdum is too strong

[latent star]

I feel like dumdum is better but headhunter does help with ammo economy

[hybrid plover]

No it really isn't.

[hollow ibex]

to not take

headhunter is a good third option

but we only get 2 blessing slots

brauto moment 😭

[latent star]

I think I'd drop infernus before dumdum honestly (not saying to drop infernus)

[drowsy perch]

infernus is just free damage since i just hold m1 and spray

with constant crits too

[hybrid plover]

Honestly I don't think it's a good choice even with dumdum not being there. Because you never get more than +25% crit chance

[wild vortex]

even without HH you can get like 40-50% crit rate on recon easily. Giving up a power blessing for some extra crit makes zero sense.

[drowsy perch]

infinite ammo

[wild vortex]

if you are struggling with ammo on a las weapon with shock trooper and survivalist I have nothing to say

[latent star]

I suspect infernus is overrated because if you're on target most enemies should die before it ticks many times but it stacks super fast and is unique to recon play style so

[drowsy perch]

its fun to shoot forever

[silver patrol]

boss dps i think

[hollow ibex]

i think infernus is also excellent to compensate for recon las' poor range

so it's actually more effective in practice than you'd think

also fire is a strong DOT

not as strong as tox obviously, but stronger than bleed

[drowsy perch]

the issue isnt that i run out of ammo

actually there is no issue

[hybrid plover]

Infernus if anything kinda invalidates Headhunter even more.

[latent star]

Yeah, it's just really inefficient for what vet usually wants to do with ranged (kill specialists instantly).

[drowsy perch]

its just that being able to kill an entire horde with maulers and not even having to reload

so good

[latent star]

It's not a bad blessing in other contexts

[hybrid plover]

You'd be able to do that without headhunter and probably better with dumdum

[drowsy perch]

nuh uh

[wild vortex]

on an average, you had between 2 and 3 stacks of HH at any given time. And it took you 25 seconds and a whole clip to kill the crusher. And afaik this is not damnation HP Crusher, much less auric

[drowsy perch]

that means less crits

[hybrid plover]

Because you're just doing much more damage overall.

[hollow ibex]

i think some recon las vets are just allergic to their primary slot

[drowsy perch]

more crits = more shots

[latent star]

I'm team dumdum (you can tell by my opinions)

[hollow ibex]

reincarnated psyker mains

[drowsy perch]

they do not grasp my silly laser minigun concept

[hybrid plover]

Yes but you kill them, slower

Like noticeably slower.

[drowsy perch]

this was on auric

[wild vortex]

do you use 2 wound curios

[drowsy perch]

yes

[wild vortex]

ok

[latent star]

Sometime I wanna do three wound curio suicide psyker

[wild vortex]

not much point to continuing the convo then

[latent star]

Not because it is good

But because I'm the poxburster now.

[drowsy perch]

its literally just what i rolled bro

i dont have infinite diamantine to replace this shit constantly

also

loser city meta head or smth

have some fun for once

[latent star]

It's fine, check in with the armory regularly for +toughness +16 or higher and stam +3 (that isn't 400 rating)

Vet is very toughness focused and you will feel much better if you can run 2 or 3 good toughness curios

250ish toughness let's you honey badger a bit

[hybrid plover]

I don't even think headhunter actually helps with ammo efficiency that much either.

If it could go to lile

50% extra crit

Say less. That's actually neat.

[drowsy perch]

like, if there was a dense horde

[latent star]

I guess it's an open question if dumdum kills faster enough for it to win on ammo economy

[hybrid plover]

But even then, there's one major issue.

[drowsy perch]

i can clear it without even reloading once

[hybrid plover]

It does.

[latent star]

Probably depends some on what mark and play style you're using

[hybrid plover]

Because Dumdum buffs the fire DoT too.

[latent star]

If you're doing a slower recon with less spread and medium and close range only getting constant headshots is easier

[drowsy perch]

like ive used this build on havoc and its pretty damn good

[latent star]

So does onslaught IIRC

[hybrid plover]

It buffs the ADM

Making it better for crushers for the most part

Dumdum increases the actual damage value.

[latent star]

I think it's a bit better into maniac and unyielding and maybe flak too

Don't remember fire dot adm off the top off my head

[hybrid plover]

Not enough to be really noticeable for flame DoTs tbh

[hollow ibex]

onslaught doesn't help fire DOT except for crushers

[hybrid plover]

But yeah about headhunter

[hollow ibex]

the moment when you realize you're talking to that type of vet recon las player

[wild vortex]

idk why you're posing it like a question... an average of 2-3 HH stacks is +10-15% crit, and a crit string is only 2 shots. So he's getting 20-30 extra shots on average. Dumdum is +30% power, so he's killing 30% faster UNCONDITIONALLY (except literally the first target).

[hollow ibex]

we've all seen that type in our games

[hybrid plover]

The main issue. Is that you usually will be critting before you'll ever see the full benefit of it in the first place.

[hollow ibex]

ironically also a horrible argument for HH

because you're not going to be shooting at mauler heads

so you can't even proc HH

[hybrid plover]

Because once you crit, you lose stacks.

[wild vortex]

I have no idea why people turn into pretzels trying to justify stupid choices instead of just saying "yeah I enjoy this even though its silly / suboptimal"

[hybrid plover]

And it resets on every crit you make.

Which make headhunter kind of a trap blessing

[latent star]

You would need to calculate %weakspot hits and how much more damage you get from the extra crits and faster infernus but I'm pretty sure dumdum comes out comfortably ahead on damage and probably similar for ammo

[hybrid plover]

It doesn't actually do what you'd think it can do because vet's innate ability to crit often just defeats its purpose.

[latent star]

Also variable for your crit when firing but headhunter isn't good enough to merit an excel sheet atm

[hollow ibex]

tbf i guess we're all mob lynching this guy over his very suboptimal build so he went into fight or flight mode

[wild vortex]

wouldn't have happened if he didn't respond to every single thing with "nuh uh"

[hybrid plover]

This ain't even like a meta thing. It's just that the blessing in question is just

Actually not useful for even what one would think it's useful for.

[latent star]

I should hop over to Hive Scum chat and ask about needle blessings, get some real madness started.

[hybrid plover]

I could tell you.

[latent star]

Oh I know

[hybrid plover]

Stripped Down and Run n' Gun are the only real choices

[wild vortex]

hey Stripped Down is nice!

[hybrid plover]

|Not actually but those are my preferences.|

[hollow ibex]

S tier blessings for needle pistol

[wild vortex]

you can actually charge a gun line with it

[hollow ibex]

unironically

[latent star]

Desperately getting a specialist to 1© HP so I can get toughness on my needle kill

[hollow ibex]

i mean what else are you going to run

[latent star]

Stripped Down on a class like Hive Scum is legit good IMO

[wild vortex]

I actually run Riposte with Stripped Dwon

because why not

[hybrid plover]

Desperado (why the fuck are there three different things with the same name) is also pretty good.

And the one that gives crit on melee that I forgor the name of 💀

[hollow ibex]

Desperado?

[hybrid plover]

The blessing

Not the ability.

[wild vortex]

I find it unbelievably stupid that guns have blessings that reward you for meleeing someone with the gun

like who the fuck thought that was a good idea

[hollow ibex]

i forget that's a thing

[hybrid plover]

Actually. I think it's a decent idea.

[wild vortex]

[latent star]

Throw your gun at someone when out of ammo like a real soldier.

[hollow ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/when-no-have-ammo-no-ammo-gif-5440254

god what a movie

[hybrid plover]

If you run a build constantly going back and forth between melee and ranged, it's actually a decent idea.

[wild vortex]

I have heard talk about helbore bayonet spam being a thing

once upon a time

[latent star]

Does DoT damage calculate only when inflicted or does the damage update every tick if your +damage / rending changes?

[hollow ibex]

it does update

[drowsy perch]

i shoot head

always

recon las got no recoil

• perk that uses stamina for better aiming

[candid agate]

carapace armour will destroy your DPS no?

[latent star]

Wouldn't you just go immediately out of stamina on a recon with Deadshot?

[silver patrol]

oh hell no, deadshot

[hollow ibex]

you really shouldn't with maulers

maulers have carapace heads

[silver patrol]

and plasma gunners

[drowsy perch]

yes however it gives me more crits

also i need to swap the 25 flak to carapce

[hollow ibex]

pls don't

[drowsy perch]

no fucking idea why i have 25 to flak on it

[silver patrol]

god don't do that

[hollow ibex]

i strongly advise you

to test shooting at mauler heads vs. mauler bodies

with recon las

in the psyk

[candid agate]

because flak armour is a very common armour type and carapace armour is that strong against ranged weapons

[hollow ibex]

before you make a decision

[drowsy perch]

yea however

more crits on head

its funny infinite ammo build

[hollow ibex]

we got temu hive scum

[silver patrol]

bro is your objective to kill enemies or to get only crits

[drowsy perch]

to keep shooting

[candid agate]

your melee also has infinite ammo and it does way more damage to carapace (usually)

[drowsy perch]

https://tenor.com/view/enclave-fallout1-fallout2-fallout3-fallout4-gif-25785951

this build is the closest to a minigun yet

[distant plaza]

||are they trying to stack brittleness so the other players with actual carapace damage weapons can kill it? ||

[latent star]

It's generally not a great idea to shoot carapace with a recon lasgun, if you have onslaught you can do it but it's still not a great idea just a less awful one.

[drowsy perch]

i should put onslaught on the build

[silver patrol]

you trust recon players too much

[drowsy perch]

also

its fun

who gives a fuck about meta

[latent star]

Fun is meta.

[drowsy perch]

i'll do silly shit in auric/havoc and win

like

this recon las build

easiest havoc i had done

i just had to hold m1 and win

[distant plaza]

were you shooting the crushers with a recon instead of his flak armoured buddies and specialist friends?

[drowsy perch]

no i usually just use kraks for crushers

the video was just a demonstration of how much ammo my ammo has

[silver patrol]

i can see winning havoc 20 with that

it's basically just maelstrom

[drowsy perch]

ive been having some tough havocs lately mainly because psycho shit is happening

you wanted to play havoc 20? 2 captains, 2 chaos spawn, and a plague ogryn be upon ye

aat the start

also i really should put bomber/flamer resistance on my curios

i die to fire more than anything else

[wild vortex]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/396860171541807105/1232138126441582642/mfw_deadass.gif

[silver patrol]

i should really use 3 wounds curios

[latent star]

Oh so you wanna try my psyker build too eh?

[silver patrol]

i am NOT going to do suicide bomber psyker

[latent star]

Look at me. I'm the poxburster now.

[drowsy perch]

man

assault chainsword is actually

so damn good

with crit build anyways

i used to not like it

also infantry lasgun tbh

when you get them working they work very well

[sweet coyote]

literally my first havoc game lol

[slate valve]

Okay the recon lasgun is way better for a gunner build than the infantry lasgun

Noting to self

[drowsy perch]

yea

[drowsy perch]

you know

i built both stagger perks on the infantry las

and its really good

but i realized its probably doing nothing in havoc

so hmm

[tall torrent]

[swift river]

Finally, Cadian Sergeant man is complete

[hollow ibex]

ilas be kinda sad generally

[slate valve]

I like my support sergeant build, chainsword is so much fun

I run chainsword and bolt pistol or heavy las pistol although I’m sure it’s not optimal

[silver patrol]

How could they even fix the infantry las

[analog yacht]

it's got a lot going against it. The most immediate one is that the flak ADM is atrocious

the blessing options are a touch dire, it's super headshot dependent, and the close range damage penalty is very severe

the sights kinda feel bad too ngl

[serene bough]

for starters less recoil and perhaps better dmg across the board (especially flak)

[silver patrol]

Maybe no recoil

[serene bough]

id personally like it if they rehashed the IIb to be a 3-shot burst like the scab stalkers have

then make VII the standard, and give the IX innate rending

[silver patrol]

So just make them the las version of the vigilants

[serene bough]

just one mark, the others can remain mostly the same w/ damage buffs

im a believer in making the marks of weapons functionally distinct

[analog yacht]

the effects of low ADM are kinda exponential. Like recon las has 75% flak ADM which isn't amazing, meaning you need to shoot flak targets 1.33x as much as unarmored. infantry las have 49% at close range which is over twice as many shots compared to unarmored

[serene bough]

dmg fall off is also nonsense

just make it do damage consistently

[silver patrol]

Damn, 49%

[tall torrent]

#veteran-class message

[latent star]

I think they need to decide what it is supposed to be before they can fix it.

Long range high damage? Helbore. Fast firing? Recon. Mobile on the move firing? Pistol.

[steep pier]

the bug in quesiton for the helm

[lunar maple]

Lmao wtf

[patent moth]

OH WTF

[steep pier]

XD

[patent moth]

LOL

[lunar maple]

And I was enjoying the visor bruh

[steep pier]

well

that happend a lot

[lunar maple]

I started wearing the helm cuz of it

[patent moth]

i was thinking like a slight small

[steep pier]

so that helmet visor was removed

[patent moth]

NO THATS HIS EYEBROWS xd

[steep pier]

and they made a different one for commodore

[lunar maple]

It originally didn’t have a visor

So I’m like

[steep pier]

lmao

[lunar maple]

I got visor cucked

Visor teased

I was like ooo visor I’ll change to this helm

Come back to my peepers

[steep pier]

the eyebrows showing outside the visor looks funny asf tho

[lunar maple]

They have a cool lasgun skin in store

In psyker tab

Old faithful

Bought it

[steep pier]

lol

i have that for my helbore

[lunar maple]

Fits the cadian look

[patent moth]

They should keep it, but like label it as error lol

[lunar maple]

No they have to charge us for the visor

[steep pier]

xD

a darktide youtuber someone in their server

showed that to me

so i saved it to show when people mention the helm

[lunar maple]

I bought the helm and pants

I might get the chest piece but I allready have the cadian tanker gear so eh

[steep pier]

i have

blue and black krieg outfits

im waiting for the other 2 common colors

[south river]

Do BigDom's H40 builds on GameLantern work?

[tame lodge]

Idk

[south river]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a0bc06e5-1294-4f8d-82f8-e0371c8c4101/the-born-leader-big-doms-havoc-40-grenade-vet-v2

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9eab90f1-3b4d-4af4-a8f3-265e16ea3e70/big-doms-havoc-40-inf-lasgun-grenade-veteran

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a027e181-5673-420d-a778-43e691b704ba/big-doms-havoc-40-easy-veteran

There's a shitload of these

[tribal tangle]

oop wrong channel

[hollow ibex]

i'm going to bet they're dogshit

[south river]

Welcome Henry!

[hollow ibex]

yup they're dogshit

[void dragon]

they are the most direct source of builds outside of gameslantern so they will remain the best option for people playing into the game

[hollow ibex]

if you need buildsHOTE guide in the pins has them

[hollow ibex]

yeah well iiwii with grifttubers

[south river]

https://tenor.com/view/dog-great-job-poop-gif-10385358

[void dragon]

and 120% of our teammates will be running those

[south river]

I've used most of the builds in the pinned guide so far

but I was looking for a Recon lasgun build

[hollow ibex]

well that's part of the reason why pubs are fun

[hollow ibex]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9e3a17a9-c4c4-4f9b-855b-c37250ad14f2/light-show

this is a hybrid melee-ranged recon las build

[south river]

Does the Recon lasgun still have a build for melting Monstrosities?

[tame lodge]

No precision Strikes

[south river]

or is that long gone

[tame lodge]

Therefore dogshit

[south river]

https://tenor.com/view/dog-gif-20861713

[hollow ibex]

basically any recon las with infernus will do the trick

though preferably mkvi

[void dragon]

funny stuff: the builds are the less detrimental part of the teammates when they are rushing ahead alone to their deaths stupidly

had some players with questionable builds stick together and make runs, even havoc ones, a breeze

[south river]

is your light show build hidden btw?

[tame lodge]

The one with grenade on the name doesn't have enough grenade investments

[hollow ibex]

hmm shows up for me

[tame lodge]

The one with easy in the name has grenade investments

For smokes

[hollow ibex]

from a private window

[south river]

I can use the link but then it doesn't show under your profile link

[hollow ibex]

oh a lot of my builds are unlisted

bc idc about publishing them

[south river]

I'll try this recon one

[hollow ibex]

you can also move ammo to bring it down if you want more boss damage

remember to use melee for hordes

gun is for specials/elites you can't kill immediately

[south river]

Can Rashad be swapped for power sword or similar?

[hollow ibex]

yeah def

rashad's just easy

[south river]

Used to be easier for me

I'm less competent with the twitchier weapons now

[void dragon]

do you find recon with crit instead of flak runs better or its just that you like that way more?

[hollow ibex]

crit's mostly for infernus

unyielding because i'm racist against bulwarks

flakiac is a perfectly valid alternative

[hybrid plover]

wut

the grenadier and plasma ones are fine

inf las gun is

eh

but i mena

that's inf lasgun so

[hollow ibex]

i'm not going to waste time arguing over grifttuber builds

[steep pier]

Lol

[hybrid plover]

what???

big dom's fine LMAO

[steep pier]

Not that

I don't mind builds like that

[hollow ibex]

based on those builds? i highly doubt it

[steep pier]

Just noticed the extra part of their name

[stable socket]

the power sword + plasma build is basically the same as the one in the steam guide with a few questionable exchanges... except i really don't think slaughterer is the play, sunder/bm is probably much better

[steep pier]

Their a lot better

Then mister e's stuff

[hybrid plover]

That's like the one gripe I have with that build

oh my god discord did it again

[hollow ibex]

yeah slaught is a dumb take

[hybrid plover]

But other than slaughterer, that's a pretty solid build

[hollow ibex]

even if it's normally a very strong blessing

[hybrid plover]

and slaughterer isn't even bd

it's just not sunder.

which is severely overtuned

but like

[hollow ibex]

PS is like a bread and butter melee

and he doesn't even know how to build that

yikes

[hybrid plover]

why are they a grifttuber though

[hollow ibex]

cuz i think he is

all DT youtubers are

until proven otherwise

[hybrid plover]

man that's

that's a pretty bleak outlook if ill be honest

[steep pier]

Lol

[hollow ibex]

especially ones that come up with dogshit builds and say HAVOC 40 TRUE SURVIVOR!!!!

[steep pier]

Then sirosky should be a Darktide youtuber and do better

[hybrid plover]

the builds aren't even that bad

[hollow ibex]

nah i'd just be parroting what path and kuli do

people can just read for themselves

[stable socket]

personally i would go for agile engagement instead of redirect fire but that's preference and if you do less hybrid and more shooting i can see redirect fire being better (plus it does work on allies), the build definitely works

[steep pier]

or be like rawk

Use the build randomizer mod

[hybrid plover]

you're acting like this man is out here trying to sabotage ppl or smth

[steep pier]

And do havoc 40 on stream

[hollow ibex]

i don't get why you're trying to start something over this lol

[steep pier]

[hollow ibex]

where do i say he's trying to sabotage people

i don't even claim tanner/mr. e do that

[steep pier]

sirosky do you use dueling sword?

[hollow ibex]

no

[steep pier]

Good

that's just a crutch weapon

[hollow ibex]

any vet that runs DS on my team is automatically assumed to be dogshit

until proven otherwise

and i don't remember the last time i've been proven otherwise

[steep pier]

I like to use mk1 shovel

With helbore

[hollow ibex]

shovel's decent at least

[steep pier]

Helbore can be good

But player dependent

[hollow ibex]

DS just screams "i can't horde clear for shit, and i need my team to carry muh ass"

on vet at least

[steep pier]

lol

My favorite weird zealot build

Double barrel with chaxe

[hollow ibex]

DB on zealot sounds like pain ngl

you have to actually reload the gun

[stable socket]

i run ds/helbore/kraks a lot in h40 but that's just because inferno basically single-handedly clears the entire map so nobody else ever needs to worry about horde clear

[steep pier]

Dueling sword is a cructh that teaches bad habits

[hollow ibex]

if you have a prebuilt team that has an infernus psyker that won't get imploded in 30 seconds, DS is prob fine

[steep pier]

lol

[hollow ibex]

i still don't respect vets that run DS tho

[stable socket]

oh it definitely is a crutch, that's why i use it

[steep pier]

fair

[stable socket]

so i don't need skill

[steep pier]

Lol

[hybrid plover]

at least you're honest

[steep pier]

yep

[hollow ibex]

do what you gotta do for havoc

[steep pier]

I've had fun with soul blaze trauma psyker

[hybrid plover]

i can name like

[steep pier]

Or scrier with illsi

[hybrid plover]

two ds vets that i've encountered that are actually good

[hollow ibex]

illisi is...

[stable socket]

if rashad breakpoints weren't fucked i would use rashad a lot more in havoc

[steep pier]

Deleting crushers before zel with ds can hit it

[hollow ibex]

illisi is very sad

[steep pier]

it's still good

[hybrid plover]

rashad is fine even in havoc tbh

[steep pier]

It is

[hybrid plover]

gotta put that 70% free damage to work

[hollow ibex]

can vet rashad still hit scab bruiser one shot breakpoint?

[tall torrent]

yea

[hollow ibex]

oh yeah true with right side

[steep pier]

You gotta juggle more tho

[hybrid plover]

ofc it can

[hollow ibex]

anything goes

[tall torrent]

it's elites that are worth considering

[hollow ibex]

i don't run right side that often because it feels too powerful

lol

(in auric/mael)

[hybrid plover]

you wouldn't really wanna run rashad without it tbf cuz it doesn't really synergize well with anything but WS for vet

[stable socket]

how many buffs do i need to oneshot bruisers? e.g. if i'm mostly left side without agile/skirmisher/desperado will i still have the damage with just bm/headtaker?

[hollow ibex]

yeah

[tall torrent]

I have a rly dumb working theory atm on cleave

[hollow ibex]

very true

[steep pier]

illsi with scrier

Is a blender

For anything other then a boss in melee range

[hollow ibex]

that's 95% scrier being busted

and hard carrying illisi lol

[steep pier]

I don't use

[hybrid plover]

say wha

[hollow ibex]

try testing illisi horde clear with no buffs vs. say deimos horde clear with no buffs

[steep pier]

The skill for dmg increase o scrier

I use the move speed one

Instead

[hybrid plover]

tbf the actual ability still buffs your damage

[hollow ibex]

well you don't need subnodes, SG by default buffs a bunch of damage-related things

and you prob have warp rider

[hybrid plover]

it's precog that buffs it to high noon

[hollow ibex]

i hope

[steep pier]

No no

[tall torrent]

I don't think cleave stacking for melee matters that much once u exceed 16 cleave

[steep pier]

It has a node

That increases dmg

But gives you extra peril

I don't need that

The big move speed increase tho

[hybrid plover]

i mean i'm already kinda aware there's a point where cleave doesn't really do much because distribution will eventually bring your damage down badly across targets

I just didn't know a specific number.

[hollow ibex]

i always take warp speed as well

because it's fun

[tall torrent]

16 cleave is 4 dreg ragers/gunners/shotgunners

[stable socket]

sunder psword just casually getting 30+ cleave when powered up

[hybrid plover]

Can you hit anymore than that? And does it even matter if you can with cleave distribution?

[tall torrent]

it's 43.6

[stable socket]

it's too much, is what it is

[hybrid plover]

tbf that's not even the truly busted part of sunder

[tall torrent]

if u have 16.1, u can cleave through 4 of them and hit another enemy (any)

however

[steep pier]

Power sword

[tall torrent]

for most sweeping attacks

[steep pier]

Is much much weaker

[hollow ibex]

just enough to cleave through the population of atoma

[tall torrent]

after first 4 targets u just do very little

cuz cleave distribution really sets in

H sweep profiles usually maintain dmg better into 2nd & 3rd

but after 4th it just doesn't do much

[steep pier]

at one point

You could get 9 swings

Per activation

Power sword is so weak now

[tall torrent]

yea and the other thing is
even if u have >16 cleave, vs scab seed ur still not gonna cleave much with most attacks

mauler and scab rager are 10 mass

[desert viper]

I just don't want psword to slow me down to a crawl everytime I charge it

[tall torrent]

not to mention carapace just ending cleave

[steep pier]

that's why

[tall torrent]

the only cleave blessings I think that are actually good are sunder and PF

[steep pier]

Brutal momentum is debatble

[drowsy perch]

there should be a qblessing where melees with special activations doesnt slkow you down

[hollow ibex]

activate during a slide

[steep pier]

Animation canceling

Will fix that

[hybrid plover]

sunder is currently knocking on your door

[steep pier]

It's a trick you have to learn

[tall torrent]

yea, read above

[steep pier]

there's a lot if dt weapons you learn that for

it's good to learn early

[wild vortex]

I hate playing this game on weekends

[steep pier]

I'm working towards

Finishing my killl penances

And the 1 million kills

580 Thousand in

[south river]

@hollow ibex what curio setup do you recommend for that lightshow build?

+max health +max toughness +gunner resist or other?

[hollow ibex]

i usually do 1 hp, 1 tough, 1 stam with 3x tough, 2x gunner resist, and the rest is up to you

[south river]

I have seen for Havoc a lot of builds using +revive speed

[hollow ibex]

revive speed is a valid pick

[south river]

but that feels like a pick for when things have gone wrong

[hollow ibex]

i don't take it for aurics/AMs, but for havoc might be worth it

bc i assume people WILL go down and it could fuck up the run

i don't play havoc much tho so maybe others will have a better sense

[torpid grotto]

even better in havoc

[wild vortex]

have you guys ever noticed this, my Arbitrator always has at least 4-5 curios on sale from Melk

but all my other classes always have at most 1-2

is this normal?

[drowsy perch]

sometimes theres a bunch of curios available

most of the time there isnt

[hybrid plover]

that's... really odd

i've never seen that many curios in melk's before

shit i just got into a game

i need to check that

[wild vortex]

he always has that many, just for my Arbi

no other class

it's very weird lol

seems like Melk has the hots for him or something

[lunar maple]

He has the Melk for him

[hollow ibex]

melk wants to see a thicc arbi

[errant bear]

I don't like using it you either can rescue someone outright or have to use util to get them out of the swarm first in which case nearby enemies will be staggered for the duration of the first rescue

[mortal horizon]

what model helbore do you guys like for a exe stance build?

h40

[obtuse elm]

The biggest one

[mortal horizon]

damn i think i chose medium one

the slowest one really? not too slow?

[hollow ibex]

you can switch anyway

[obtuse elm]

Actually the med or small is best probably

[hollow ibex]

it's preference (V is the best)

[obtuse elm]

Ye small

[hollow ibex]

V has the highest DPS

though III and IV have better breakpoints

III does suffer from a much lower cara ADM than IV and V

so keep that in mind if you plan on shooting crushers

[obtuse elm]

What blessings do yall recommend for infantry autogun

[wild vortex]

What

[hollow ibex]

My reaction exactly

Check the guide

[wild vortex]

Why is this game so fucking STUPID

[hollow ibex]

The ADMs aren’t the same

I mean it might not matter depending on how you use it anyway

By its further proof that V is superior 🙂‍↕️

[hollow ibex]

Dumdum deathspitter

[wild vortex]

Yeah i guess

[hollow ibex]

I’m memeing

I haven’t tested breakpoints

[wild vortex]

Shoots really fast when Weight of Fire gets going

[hollow ibex]

But presumably iii has better breakpoints

Esp havoc

[wild vortex]

I found III to be a good balance

[hollow ibex]

For one shotting non ogryn elites

[wild vortex]

But I'd rather use V over IV if I had to

[hollow ibex]

IV is very funny tbf

And you can use uncharged partial shots a lot

[obtuse elm]

What about perks?

[hollow ibex]

Flak crit iirc

Or unyielding crit

[obtuse elm]

Crit chance or damage?

[tame lodge]

Mk4 is literally the hardest hitting ranged weapon in the game
That being said, not a weapon for everyone

Also it's the best one

Because

Big damage brain happy

[wild vortex]

I didn't like the swap and readying speed

Because I'm not autistic enough to memorize the cancellation patterns or whatever

[obtuse elm]

Also best blessings/perks on helbore?

[mortal horizon]

im using 5 right now, just died sad but first death, doing ok? idk, build feels a lil awk but i may not be running it ideal, i tried MF

i was having ammo issues despite surgical etc

i didnt run out but

i needed pickups was in orange by event

that normal? people say it has "infinite ammo" but i def was burning throughb it slowly

letting surgical stack fully each shot felt too slow

[latent star]

Surgical and Weight of Fire with Unyielding and Carapace. WoF and Carapace can be swapped out for other options if you want.

[obtuse elm]

Ty 🙏

[south river]

@hollow ibex Any infantry autogun builds similar to https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a09c2902-9171-4919-b4f3-ca8c355c9cb3/dn-build-mk2 ?

[stable socket]

very roughly speaking: mk5 helbore has close to 200 charged shots worth of ammo, so each survivalist proc gives you enough for ~2 shots. if you shoot as fast as you can, surgical is something like +20% crit chance, so you're around 30% crit chance total which means you can shoot ~2.5-3 times every survivalist proc and be ammo neutral. there are also crit chance talents like reciprocity that can give you even more crit

often you'll shoot more than this and slowly consume ammo, but you run out of ammo much much slower than other non-lasguns which is what people refer to when they say "infinite ammo"

[mortal horizon]

ya i def had enough to shoot a lot and play

i DID have trouble keeping exe stance up

often reload would kill it

might be building for the gun wrong / slight skill issue on headshot consistancy etc

[stable socket]

if you take the 8s node that highlights ogryns you should be able to chain it as long as there are elites/specials to kill, 8s is a long time

[mortal horizon]

i think i need WoF instead of sustained fire

oh

i took human sized enemies

derppppppp

[stable socket]

that works too but like you mentioned sometimes reload is kinda long or you need to pull out your melee for a bit

so generally i prefer the 8s node, especially in higher difficulty where there's no shortage of elites/specials

[mortal horizon]

ya def swapping

i also wasnt running any reload speed talent idk

i fucked it all up

still did ok tho

[stable socket]

also good QOL for lights out or rotten armor because you can see crushers approaching in the darkness/through the green fart gas

[mortal horizon]

do i want exhilerating takedown

or is confirmed kill enough

[stable socket]

uhhhhhh

the fewer top nodes you can get away with the better

cuz a lot of vet damage is further down in the tree

i think

[mortal horizon]

also wonder if ill notice the breakpoint difference without sustained fire, and i should try not swapping to WoF and first just try the ogryn talent + reload

[mortal horizon]

oh ya, i mean its rough theres alot to want to take, but just not sure if on a build like this exhi takedown is needed toughnes regen

ill try without

[stable socket]

i've given up on breakpoints with mk5 because 1) with weight of fire it shoots really really fast 2) stimms and pus-hardened skin already fuck up the breakpoints

i just shoot until i see the kill indicator

[mortal horizon]

ya i played a pus hardened just now

was miserable

bad modifier to try it on first time

[stable socket]

imagine playing it with a gun that uses ammo

i played one pus hardened with plasma... the gun is already ammo-hungry in good situations

it still worked but it wasn't great

[mortal horizon]

not sure what i drop to grab focus target (or WS i guess)

figure focus target tho would synergize with helbore and exe better tho

drop reload speed? i felt not having it

[silver patrol]

how much do you reload with helbore

[mortal horizon]

maybe i shuold try it, i modified build maybe ill need to reload less

but V has longest reload so

maybe i drop to a lower model?

which keystone you think will work best for this? using shovel mk 1 decimator/uncanny

[silver patrol]

i think marksman focus is the choice to drop crushers with helbore

[mortal horizon]

cant afford the augment tho unless i drop 20% ogryn dmg

is it needed?

[silver patrol]

i think they are cool

[mortal horizon]

im guessing i need the rending node?

not much i can drop tho lol

kind of feeling like the answer is WS or focus target but ill try it without any augments on MF

[silver patrol]

WS is good if you switch between melee and ranged a lot, but i don't think you do that with helbore

since it has slow draw speed and needs to charge

[mortal horizon]

i kind of do bc i just love swapping to melee, but you're right its not really the theme of the build

FT feels natural to me

mark things, more dmg, better breakpoints

ez

i just am not sold on MF being good without its augments

[silver patrol]

it's 75% finesse

[mortal horizon]

alright ill try it

[silver patrol]

on a weapon that always crits

and has a strong finesse multiplier

[mortal horizon]

remember when it stacked standing still?

god that was so bad lol

[silver patrol]

yeah 2 finesse, that's pretty good

[silver patrol]

the linked sample guide does this for a sniper build

[mortal horizon]

the swap time is rough without one motion, but very surprised WIP suggests no longshot on helbore, damn

im also opting into the as/bleed melee node, to make the shovel feel alot better

[silver patrol]

a bit surprised about that too

man, if only you didn't have to take that useless +25% ammo talent

[mortal horizon]

oh, what perks on the helbore you think?

unyielding, cara? or maniac or flak maybe needed for breakpoints?

[silver patrol]

Cara to drop crushers

the other not so sure, i don't think it needs flak to hit any breakpoint, you just kill stuff with headshots

prob unyielding

[mortal horizon]

why would my team in this havoc match not be showing

in recently played

damnit

ok now they're showing nvm

[austere wedge]

is first target important on heavy sword

[pseudo fiber]

Yes

Drop defense

[austere wedge]

interesting

[tame lodge]

Important on every weapon that has it btw

[austere wedge]

aight

guess i should redo my psykers combat blade too then

[pearl oasis]

How does smoke grenade actually work?

does it just act as a los blocker?

[stable socket]

from the pinned guide:

usually you use smoke like psyker bubble

where you throw it down and stand in it and ranged stuff can't see you

[south river]

I dunno if they've changed it

but right now it kills visibility

[austere wedge]

what if u smoke inside a psyker bubble

[desert viper]

dream blunt rotation

[pearl oasis]

Hot box the psyker bubble

[arctic lichen]

I mean I'm pretty sure that's how gas bombers are made

[desert viper]

aren't the bombs... sewn heads?

[arctic lichen]

I mean, presumably there's at least one psyker nearby, and probably two other heads

Seems like the beginnings of a collection to me!

[south river]

yes

[unreal nova]

Shrunken plague infested heads.

Spat out by rot flies.

Those truly hated are left alive to stew in a rot fly's guts, the heads are from those 'lucky' enough to die.

[gusty girder]

Aint no way

One guys a penance hunter and another is an Auric operative

Guess which one i am

[midnight galleon]

me

Im you

Give me your skin

[charred drum]

man I need to save for that helmet

they really got us interested when the test visor was in xD

[gusty girder]

NO

STAY AWAY FROM

ME

[charred drum]

genestealers invading our chat xD

[livid hill]

Tbh I think its dune shield rules. It blocks anything going very fast but lets slower things pass through

Which would mean that the gas wouldnt be contained, and tbh they arent

[livid hill]

Only issue with this theory is that it also blocks lasers while also not totally blocking all light from the outside so like??

Maybe that just implies lasguns arent true lasers? Maaaaybe? Probably not though

[midnight galleon]

uh

don't dune shields explode when shot with lasers

like, nuclear reaction explode

[last marten]

yes

[slate valve]

Voice of command with a chainsword goes so damn hard.

My lot and I were on the back foot, all very low health and a horde was surrounding us when my veteran shouted to the rooftops
”DO OR DIE, RIGHT FRAGGING NOW!!!” bolstering everybody and sending back the front line of the wave on their asses before cleaving and chewing threw a mauler with the chainsword

[livid hill]

Well i wasnt saying theyre SPECIFICALLY dune rules just similar to dune rules

[midnight galleon]

aah

[tired knoll]

It does not matter. For the Emperah!

[gusty girder]

TRUE!!!

[hollow ibex]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a02606aa-11c1-4470-9bb1-fc3f2d315f31/emperors-fusiliers

could try this

if you want to run FT instead of MMF

that's a perfectly valid choice too

just swap it over

[south river]

I'll try this one tomorrow

[hollow ibex]

@steep flower explain yourself

[steep flower]

Do i have to?

[hollow ibex]

Well you cared to leave a react

[south river]

True Survivor boosting you say

[steep flower]

Not boosting; helping
Even the most prominent ppls efforts will be for naught if the person who wants TS fail themselves

[south river]

https://tenor.com/view/titi-thierry-henry-henry-smile-cheeky-gif-5024671417501678836

[south river]

This is true

[steep flower]

I had ppl who i was helping get TS and by how they played they are not ready for that title - simply not good enough yet

For various reasons

[south river]

I'm not good enough for any title

[dry cloak]

i got havoc forged by relic blade book during seson 1

[south river]

I am grinding away at Havoc with FatMangus

but the public climb is brutal

[dry cloak]

it was quick premade with someone who already done h40

archivum sycorax

vet psyker 2 zealots

[wild vortex]

I want to play more havoc but I wanna git gud first

So grinding maelstroms all day every day

Because the players are worse and the mods are harder

[south river]

Everything under 30 is not so bad

[void dragon]

but only if team is not full of stupid

[south river]

Full of stupid, you can manage up to about Havoc 21

[void dragon]

had havocs that felt harder than aurics because team rush to die stupidly

[south river]

Havoc 1-19 is roughly the same as what we've already got

sometimes easier

[void dragon]

to a point that makes me wonder why those difficulties exist

[south river]

Above 20 you then get a bit more thrown at you and boss spawns are more RNG

I've had Havoc 29s that went really smoothly

and Havoc 21s where you get Twins, Pogryn, Chaos Spawn and Captain at the same time

Above 30 you get the toughness grace period debuff and enemies get harder

I'm stuck around 29-31 at the moment

[void dragon]

the spawns arent that random, there are triggers when you progress in the map, the issue is that sometimes Obesefish is compeeting with bethesda for most bugged features

[south river]

Once you're above 30 the team needs to be using voice and communicating

[south river]

They're not that random but you can get unlucky

it can throw in some weakened monstrosities

on top of actual boss spawns

[void dragon]

bugglucky i call it, also know as ObeseFish-ed

[south river]

if you get Twins in the first room you are basically guaranteed to succeed

because then you know they're not gonna be dropped on you later

[void dragon]

I got Twins in the starting area

its quite funny ngl

[south river]

but yeh over 30, I've hit a wall on pubs

[void dragon]

managed around 35 back in the day, but i just dont feel the passion for Havocs because the modifires dont feel like "This is a mechanic that has a counter" but more like "This is a trainwreck of HP go punch it, there is no way around"

[south river]

right now Pus-Hardened Skin and Stimms is not such a bad modifier

[potent talon]

H40 wreaks my shit

[south river]

Pus Hardened Skin is really fucking with my FPS though

[void dragon]

so much Obesefish needs to fix, so many ice ages need to pass for that

me sad

because i know they will find way to not fix sheep

then again, Im a fatalist

[south river]

I think a bit like Vermintide 2 they'll just focus on other modes rather than properly fixing existing ones

Weaves flopped so they focused everything on Chaos Wastes

then Versus

so if they do add another game mode this year, they'll probably just leave Havoc to rot lol

[silver patrol]

I hope they finally add chaos wastes to dt

[wild vortex]

Same

A lot of the mods cross the line from fun to tedious

[void dragon]

Hexbound would've been amazing...if it was not just a fest of bugs that tossed a DH on use because "Get ObeseFish-ed Nerd!"

[wild vortex]

I think hexbound is the least offensive

Worst of the worst are rotten armor and blight spreads

[south river]

Rotten Armour + Final Toll

[wild vortex]

Satanic

[south river]

Rotten Armour Final Toll Crushers

[void dragon]

rotten armor with blue stim eating a full Thammer shroudfield hit like a chimp had me in depression

[wild vortex]

Yeah stimms on their own are fine but in conjunction with other stuff is giga toxic

Stimmed rampaging rager eating hit after hit while not even breaking his stride

[wind gyro]

fellow vet rejects, im doing mastery for the basic lasgun and vibing with a cadian cosplay, whats the better mk outta the 3 to make it the least un-fun? it might just be cuz i run low diff but the IIb seems to kill the easiest cuz pure dps. advice please?

[sharp hamlet]

@jovial wagon, the mention of Balthazar Gelt reminded me of this gem: https://youtu.be/wrRpdJqMC80?si=R4Wn9N97YKYO9F6N

[jovial wagon]

Yeah I’ve seen this it’s a claaaassic

What was the other one

“I hate lizardmen”

I hate kroxigors?

I think it was that

[south river]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a09c2902-9171-4919-b4f3-ca8c355c9cb3/dn-build-mk2

[south river]

this is Ainz video showing how it plays: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qv6KwEWHXB8

[wind gyro]

im running chainsword for the cadian cosplay but tempting. i dont usually touch the maul

[south river]

If you're playing normal Auric or below, I'd just swap chainsword in

[wind gyro]

gotcha

oh yo im finally red by the emperor

[south river]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9f97fff4-0ffe-4138-a1a5-1ecd9a9974f5/chainaxe-deputy-chainsword-rise-up-build

the chainsword perks/blessings here are helpful

and for Auric/lower you could change Field Improvisation to Serrated Blade on the Vet build

to proc more bleed

[steep flower]

If you want i can help

In the future

[steep flower]

Never drop FI

[void dragon]

unless you drop it, then drop FI

(but make sure to pick it up again later)

[south river]

Thankfully most Zealots run Beacon at the moment

[void dragon]

we can praise our lord and savior a.a for that

[steep flower]

Thats what having contacts gives ya

[hybrid plover]

Tough modifiers. Purple changed in a way that seriously makes it obnoxious to deal with. And a significant disparity in skill level in Havoc

It was way easier grinding to 40 through pubs before.

Not saying it wasn't tough but it didn't feel like everything was working against you like it does now

[primal zealot]

yknow its not just the ourple ones

its the dns waking up a mile away n then having ourple

n farting

[hybrid plover]

Final toll and garden together are fucking cursed rn

[primal zealot]

n being unstaggerable

n crashing

yea red uorple sucjs

still better than like farting dn

[hybrid plover]

Shout out to the vet who joined a 40 I was in yesterday with 3 wound curios

[hollow ibex]

ur welcum

[hybrid plover]

Dclaw and double barrel

With focus target

And frags

With a clearance 40.

[wild vortex]

Reminds me of a convo that happened here yesterday

[hybrid plover]

Now tbf

I let it be

Maybe my dude was actually cooking

First drop on Warren and he's immediately overheaded

[wild vortex]

Man taxe7 really is kinda nuts

Took it into a game on the MMF Vet yesterday and it was crazy the kind of insane situations it took me through

[hybrid plover]

He wasn't cooking. He wasn't even just cooked. Dude was burned to the pan.

[primal zealot]

bro became a pancake

[void dragon]

I telling you, its basically knife 2.0

[wild vortex]

I am just unable to like knife

The clear speed is so piss

Even though the single target is unhinged

[void dragon]

and with bromentum taxe just cuts swarms like butter

[wild vortex]

Yeah

[void dragon]

all while with crits it EATS crushers

[prisma crest]

https://tenor.com/view/therussianbadger-meme-five-bullets-left-gif-21645715

[prisma crest]

@dull cargo

[shell knot]

can anyone here help me cheese the "On Overwatch" penance?

[prisma crest]

And dishonour the emperor?

Nah I say

NAH

[shell knot]

Skulls for the Corpse Thone, idc

[prisma crest]

Heretic

https://tenor.com/view/knife-cat-cat-knife-cat-knife-cat-angry-gif-9404759922388476738

[shell knot]

srsly tho, It's like one of 3 remaining penances I got on Veteran and I've been trying to get this done for days now

I'm fed up

[midnight galleon]

which one? oh

Get the talent that marks ranged enemies

it makes it easier

[dull cargo]

i have two penances for Veteran as well and i hate it xD One is Killshot Ready and the other is Adept Assassin

[tall torrent]

I can help in like 2hrs

if ur still up for that

[midnight galleon]

OH killshot ready.

[wild vortex]

can you help me too later please

[midnight galleon]

you didn't read the talent did you

rebind the ping to T and press T before you kill any specialists

I made that mistake, if you did

nope wait thats focus target

So for killshot ready you actually really benefit from a heavy rof weapon

I used the Vraks Infantry Autogun and got many headshots and then while at 10 stacks got as many other kills as possible

I was also informed you could switch to melee once you get the head shots and the buff would refresh as long as you kept getting headshots, so you can do something high cleave like powersword

mixing up the talents 😛

[tall torrent]

U need on overwatch too?

[wild vortex]

yeah

also, I know I said it yesterday but it bears repeating

I hate playing this game on weekends

I just had an Ogryn that did less melee damage than me on sniper vet

and ate every single burster to the face

[thorn lark]

@broken scroll

[broken scroll]

rofl

[thorn lark]

[broken scroll]

wasn't me that time, I wouldn't have died from that

and i can prove it

[tall torrent]

ykw I can prob help rn if it's fast

[wild vortex]

sure. I assume I just have to yeet myself off a ledge?

[tall torrent]

ya

[mystic pilot]

need to be staggered a bit but yeah first explosion would have propelled you clear from others

[broken scroll]

nah, it's the same damage doing it one and a time or all at once

[wild vortex]

thanks a ton

only Killshot and Every Shot Count left now

[shell knot]

...bro what are you talking about...?

did you reply to the wrong person?

"On Overwatch" requires you to do a whole mission on Malice diff or higher without taking a single melee hit

[tall torrent]

I can help in like 40 ish minutes

Dinner rn

[shell knot]

Nah, it's okay, I'm already in bed. Enjoy your dinner

I'll ask again here tomorrow evening after work

[mortal horizon]

how to get good with powersword?

i kill stuff with it fine

but i always feel im way more vulnerable, die easier, cant clutch etc

[hollow ibex]

push more

rely less on dodges

learn how to block cancel

the charge block cancel push combo is especially helpful

[mortal horizon]

ya i use that a lot

how important is having the 10% as node for it?

[midnight galleon]

im being dumb and mixing talents

and penances

sorry

[tall torrent]

What 10%

Atk speed?

It helps noticeably

[mortal horizon]

sorry ya the 10% attack speed

is the answer here to lose the 30% reload node?

wanting to do the revolver/powesword hot swap thing

feels like i should have trench

[tall torrent]

I don’t think u need reload speed for revolver on vet tbh

[gilded raft]

don't need weapon swap speed either

[formal ice]

Replace it with melee attack speed

And swap swap speed with more ammo

[latent star]

The revolver swap speed is already so fast that hot swap doesn't do much.

[vestal lotus]

The spearhead has bleed

Good bleed

Better with my shiv

[warm gulch]

lose everything

im joking

you dont need reload nodes bc ur keystone ones auto reload

[tidal fox]

is swap speed fine when you got helbore?

I cant see a difference between that additional swap speed and having none

feels just as slow drawing the helbore

[tall torrent]

I think it's the default pick tbh

only like 2 guns definitively want longshot over OM

[wild vortex]

dying to the dumbest shit today

so fucking frustrating

[torpid grotto]

I’ve never died in darktide once

[snow sonnet]

Does veteran not have info on all the weapons their blessing and stuff like other classes do or am i dumb?

[tall torrent]

check pinned guide

[snow sonnet]

oh its just a different type of format?

[tall torrent]

wdym different format

it's quite detailed

[torpid grotto]

Proof

[hollow ibex]

checks out

have a nice day

[narrow frost]

real!

[latent star]

The only reason to skip it would be if you intend to basically sit in ranged almost 100% of the time. Which is sometimes viable on Helbore, but the draw speed on the rifle is real bad so the talent is a huge difference.

[ionic quiver]

playing veteran makes me hurt others around me

[snow sonnet]

the ogyrn one was very well put together is all

this one is good but i usually do well with things that are setup with imagery

[tall torrent]

isnt the ogryn one also mostly words

[austere wedge]

does base vet survivalist stack with better survivalist?

[hollow ibex]

it doesn't

[narrow frost]

yes it does

I remeber combine doing that for havoc 1,0

might been changed since

but I dont tink so

[tall torrent]

scavenger does stack with survivalist

[austere wedge]

wait so u had someone with a level 20 build play havocs with u just for the aura?

[south river]

It's some of the map rotations as well. I've had a really high success rate in Havoc on Archivum Sycorax and Relay Station

but some maps cause players to shit the bed entirely

one of the main reasons I've been playing the FatMangus Zealot exclusively in Havoc for weeks now is that eventhough I'm not the best player and I'm not reliable to clutch if overwhelmed, I can reliably use Shroud/stealth to res the team if everyone else gets wiped and I have some kiting space

but then you get into matches where some players just seem to have no idea what is going on at a basic level; they don't funnel enemies into chokepoints, they don't stay inside psyker bubble at all, they ignore priority targets (I've been on teams where 2 players will leave to fight other random enemies during Twins fight so either I or usually psyker end up getting focused by melee twin with no help), etc

[hollow ibex]

i thought that they fixed that because of bots

[narrow frost]

He just took all the talents at the top

Yeah

[austere wedge]

is that really that op to gran ur team 1 bullet every 5 seconds tho?

[tidal fox]

not 1 bullet

depends on the weapons they got

[austere wedge]

well roughly

[tidal fox]

and also in harder missions more elites spawn

so that effect is always occuring every 5 secs pretty much

over a minute youre getting 12% ammo fulfilled every minute pretty much