veteran-class

[red robin]

One can wish

[queen sky]

cinematic trailer for hellbore buffs

honestly the hellbore is not that bad, the bayonet slash is good

you have to use the slowest-firing one for the good bayonet

[red robin]

I just want new weapon blessings

[queen sky]

the bayonet on the faster marks is not as good

[quiet valley]

This has the worst bayo

[queen sky]

i find it generally onetaps trash on the head

[quiet valley]

its the slowest.

[red robin]

Pipe dream is curio blessing system

Miss vt2 slot traits

[elder vessel]

Swift Slaying my beloved

[red robin]

Vt2 50% explosion radius my beloved

[hollow ibex]

It’s the other way around…

[elder vessel]

yknkw maybe not swift slaying crit zealot is strong enough as it is

[red robin]

Or even 25% to not consume a grenade was neat

[faint beacon]

Chainsword buffs never

[red robin]

Curios blessings that affect stims would be ultra baller

Stim share or increased duration pls

[manic badger]

Yo I was watching a video recently where the relic blade was yeeting bosses and ogryns into the sky does it still do that?

[queen sky]

does it need buffs?

[faint beacon]

It’s extremely mediocre

[red robin]

Blunt baton that doesn’t exceed at anything

[queen sky]

it seems to be a pretty good horde clearer with some emergency big boy potential on activation

[red robin]

That’s the chainsword

[faint beacon]

Not unplayable just it’s incredibly mediocre

[queen sky]

that's fair, it's not an exceptional magic wand

[manic badger]

Yes it baits you into thinking it's good bc it has decent horde clear but the special action is a death sentence and it has poor performance almost categorically

[queen sky]

but i love it because it feels good and it works

i mean, all i need is horde clear

what does the vet have for melee horde clear other than complex PS activation cancels

[hollow ibex]

rashad, hsword, knives are ok, taxe

[manic badger]

Rashad Hsword

nvm he said it all already

[queen sky]

Rashad?

[red robin]

Ngl I use weapons with worse hordeclear and I find myself getting hit more when I use the chainsword

[queen sky]

haven't tried heavy sword yet, it's on the list

knife was a clusterfuck, can't stand the knife

[red robin]

Like it hits mobs and just does mid af in cleave damage or group stagger

[queen sky]

getting it to mastery 20 was like pissing blood

yeah i don't need stagger or massive strikedown out of my melee on vet

[red robin]

Like I have more fun on the chain axe than I do with the chainsword

[queen sky]

my melee is for when there's two dozen poxwalkers mobbing me and i need them to fuck off and die

[elder vessel]

Chainaxe my beloved

[hollow ibex]

chaxe hurts me in the soul

[tall torrent]

at least 5

[queen sky]

if i need something to kill a Crusher, i draw my six-shooter and i delete his fucking head with a nice crit

[hollow ibex]

5-shooter

[red robin]

Like I wish the chainsword had an active rev state and passive rev state

[orchid hemlock]

What happens in there is one mauler or crusher in that horde?

[queen sky]

potato potato

[hollow ibex]

rn bruisers are enough to trip up chsword

[queen sky]

i draw the zarona and i delete him and then i switch back

[red robin]

Like the active state would cleave by sawing through chaff

[queen sky]

like mentioned if i had an up-to-date build page i'd just show that and it'd all make sense

[red robin]

But get stuck on elites and specialists

[hollow ibex]

yeah could be cool

[red robin]

Kinda like how eviscerator works with perfect strike

[orchid hemlock]

I mean

You are very brave to pull out the revolver when you have 50+ poxers on your ass

[red robin]

Can mow through a horde and catches high prio elites

[orchid hemlock]

Point is, CS is atrocious at dealing with mixed hordes, which is 90% of all hordes in high levels content

[red robin]

100%

It feels awful to use

[queen sky]

i die anyway if I don't delete that armour boy

[orchid hemlock]

Hey sometimes beast of nurgle is in there blocking them off

[queen sky]

plus as previously mentioned i'm running the full FT suite so i get a big recovery shot when i mark and delete him

[red robin]

Like idk would be cool if the chainsword had an execute mechanic on hp threshold

[elder vessel]

That's called the rev dawg

[queen sky]

also this is primarily a support sniper build so i am not running into hordes, I leave that for the zealot/ogryn players

my job is to delete anything i can ping

and then maybe clear some trash if there's a lull

[red robin]

Lowering their hp to 25% from weapon special would just finish them dead

Instead of leaving them with like 5 hp

[queen sky]

agreed

which is why i do not take my chainsword into mixed hordes

it's for trash only

revolver is for the armour boys

[orchid hemlock]

6 revolver bullets is not gonna cut it my dude

[elder vessel]

A mixed horde is both of those at the same time

[queen sky]

*5 lol

[queen sky]

i don't take the zarona into mixed hordes either

[orchid hemlock]

You can use WS to get another bullet from switching in and out

[queen sky]

i stay away from mixed hordes, they're tarpits

[orchid hemlock]

????

[elder vessel]

you gotta kill the mixed hordes

[queen sky]

yes, by taking them apart

[elder vessel]

they make big problems

[orchid hemlock]

90% of all hordes is mixed in high levels content, who is killing them for you?

3 Ogryns? 💀

[hollow ibex]

mixed hordes means more damage to farm

[queen sky]

i pick off the armoured boys from afar and then clean up the remaining trash after

i am not a frontliner

[orchid hemlock]

I hate to break it to you

But Vet isn't a range class

[queen sky]

are you saying this about auric

i'm not on auric

[hollow ibex]

just in general

[orchid hemlock]

Always in any mode

[queen sky]

nah it makes a great midrange sharpshooter

[orchid hemlock]

I honestly am in melee more than range as a vet

[queen sky]

i'm not like, BACKline

i'm not hanging way back

but i am not getting stuck in, i'm pinging and picking off high-value targets

[orchid hemlock]

Especially with a revolver build, you should be in melee a lot more

[queen sky]

and if i dont see shit, THEN i am clearing trash

[torpid sundial]

The mixed horde comes to you at melee range, you dont get to pick your fights

[queen sky]

i guess i'm playing the special darktide fatshark made where this strategy works

[orchid hemlock]

Like yes, Vet is a specialist killer

But you need to help with wave clear because you actually have a lot of strong melee damage nodes. And you can't shoot thru a horde of 15+ ragers

[hollow ibex]

what difficulty are you normally at?

[orchid hemlock]

Norms

[queen sky]

yes, i am for sure helping with wave clear

[hollow ibex]

asking elizatronic

[queen sky]

heresy so far

[hollow ibex]

you might have to change your style in auric

[torpid sundial]

There we go

[hollow ibex]

esp with QP teams

[queen sky]

yes this is not about auric, as i've said i think three times now

[orchid hemlock]

I'm just telling you ahead of time, that shit isn't going to work on hard content

[hollow ibex]

you'll need to do a LOT more heavylifting

[torpid sundial]

Even in damnation it might be hard

[quiet valley]

You dont need to do any role in Auric under

Just its a free sandbox

you can do whatever you want

[orchid hemlock]

But you seem to be thinking this is "optimal"

Sure I can run norms with grey weapons and zero talent points. But that doesn't mean it is optimal or transitions to harder content

[torpid sundial]

As long as you’re having fun and you can still clear the current difficulty mission ig

[queen sky]

when did i say that?

[orchid hemlock]

The reason why we think CS is mediocre is because in hard content it doesn't perform well in a use case that is extremely common, which is mixed hordes

[torpid sundial]

Also speaking of transitioning I know the power sword and duelling swords are the top dogs and all but is the chain axe usable in havoc

[queen sky]

ah you guys were talking about aurics and stuff

does everyone here just always talk about auric stuff?

[hollow ibex]

so long as you have a psyker or ogryn hordeclearing lol

[elder fiber]

sometimes they talk about havoc stuff

a freak or two talk about morbius trials stuff maybe idk

[queen sky]

should i just assume that any given opinion is meant to be taken in the context of ultra-hardest difficulty, if they don't specify?

[hollow ibex]

you should expect it to be at least damnation

[orchid hemlock]

No

But I feel like everything we say is applicable to all content, even in lower difficulties CS is still mediocre in comparison to other weapons

[queen sky]

yeah that's where i disagree

[hollow ibex]

because that's where the hp scaling stops outside of havoc

[queen sky]

chainsword is great for what i need out of a melee weapon at Heresy

[orchid hemlock]

In comparison to things like PS or Rashad or Heavy Sword?

[manic badger]

He hasn't used them

[queen sky]

in comparison to the Power Sword, absolutely

[manic badger]

has no benchmark

[hollow ibex]

in heresy just use whatever tf you want

[queen sky]

can't stand the PS

terrible cleave

[manic badger]

you could literally pistol whip your way through a heresy

[hollow ibex]

absolutely incorrect

[orchid hemlock]

That's an opinion ig

[queen sky]

i hear the cleave is great if you block cancel the activation to spam it, but that's way too complex for me

[hollow ibex]

but i can understand disliking PS for other reasons

[manic badger]

I never thought I'd see terrible cleave and PS in the same breath

[queen sky]

i never figured it out, what is a rashad

[orchid hemlock]

I don't think that is the problem

But just calling it "bad cleave" is a huge take

[hollow ibex]

it takes some practice but it's very powerful

[hollow ibex]

ultimate braindead do it all melee weapon for aurics and under

[queen sky]

in my time getting the PS to 20 i found it would frequently stop mid-blob

[orchid hemlock]

Even if you don't know a single combo, if you at least know how to turn it on the cleave is insane

[hollow ibex]

it's easier to use than chsword

[hollow ibex]

you only get 3 powered swings and you can lose powered state when hordes hit you so yeah

it's pretty janky

you need to be careful

rashads much easier

[queen sky]

if i activated the PS then it would actually start cleaving through the entire blob, but i have to keep re-activating it each swing

[queen sky]

it's a chainsword mark?

[hollow ibex]

do you have power cycler?

[queen sky]

it's a power sword mark?

[hollow ibex]

it's a combat axe

[queen sky]

RIGHT there we go finally

ty

[orchid hemlock]

You have to do the same in the reverse situation against armor with the CS

[queen sky]

is that a talent?

[torpid sundial]

Tbf in lower difficulties all you need to do with the CS is left click spam and it cleaves through fodder like butter

[hollow ibex]

yeah

it's mandatory on psword

psword is utter dogshit without it

you want brutal momentum + pcycler

[queen sky]

i don't see it in the vet tree

[hollow ibex]

and this is rashad

[hollow ibex]

sorry, blessing

not talent

[elder fiber]

it's a weapon blessing not a talent lol

[queen sky]

again, my zarona is for armour boys

[hollow ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/smg4-smg3-me-spreading-misinformation-spreading-misinformation-fake-news-gif-17450759846009649409

[orchid hemlock]

Why can't it be your melee?

[queen sky]

because the central aspect of my build is Focus Target

and i need to be able to flip stacks at range

[orchid hemlock]

What does that even mean?

Focus target works with melee as well

[queen sky]

i mean i like to not have to rush up and get within touching range of a special to kill them and convert their stacks into buffs

snipers, reapers, flamers, etc.

[orchid hemlock]

They are coming to you

You don't need to get close

[queen sky]

bad to try and close with them, in my experience

[orchid hemlock]

Those are not the targets we have been talking about

[queen sky]

gunners too

[orchid hemlock]

I said, crushers, maulers, and ragers

In mixed hordes, these guys will be moving with the horde

[queen sky]

yes, i am using the zarona for the far away targets so i use the zarnoa for the close-up armoured specials as well

the zarona is my "delete it now" tool

[orchid hemlock]

Ok but we asked what do you do in a situation when a mixed horde is coming towards you and you cant just pick them off from range?

[queen sky]

i need this tool to work at all ranges, so it can't be my melee

[orchid hemlock]

You can't CC them like a Psyker

[queen sky]

break them up with a grenade, pick off the maulers etc. with zarnoa, then clear trash with CS

[hollow ibex]

just take rashad and you can kill both hordes and crushers without breaking a sweat

[orchid hemlock]

What's the problem with taking a melee weapon that can deal with all hordes?

[queen sky]

i had a poor experience with combat axe (too slow) during the road to mastery 20, but i will give the rashad a go

[hollow ibex]

yeah you'll need trench fighter

that's the one downside of rashad in auric and lower

[orchid hemlock]

You seem to be complaining about PS being "complicated" but then are giving me a multi step plan on dealing with a couple melee specialists

[queen sky]

i think there's been a miscommunication, i'm not saying chainsword is the best

or that i MUST use it

i'm saying "the chainsword is my favourite vet melee because it's fun and meets my needs"

"it sounds good and it covers the holes in the rest of my toolkit"

[orchid hemlock]

I feel like this is just deflection

First you say CS is the best melee, then you move to "good enough in my difficulty"

Now you are saying "it's fun to use"

[queen sky]

i'm confused, when did I say it was the best?

[orchid hemlock]

#veteran-class message

You are making comparisons to all melee weapons

Even before you have said multiple times that in your anecdotal experience it has fulfilled your use cases the best

[queen sky]

when i say "chainsword is great for what i need out of a melee weapon at Heresy" i am not saying "the chainsword is best"

i am saying "the chainsword meets my needs"

[orchid hemlock]

You are missing the part where you compare it to other weapons

[lofty rivet]

what's the least needed stat for plasma gun?

[queen sky]

god i can never remember his name

[narrow frost]

71-72 charge, 69-68 thermal

[queen sky]

@tired egret

[queen sky]

"the chainsword meets my needs over other weapons such as the knife" =/= "chainsword best"

[orchid hemlock]

The disagreement isn't that CS is adequate for horde clear, the disagreement is it's comparison to other weapons.

[queen sky]

i'm not even saying the knife is bad

just that i don't like it

these judgements have been opinions for my own experience and play style, not science facts

[orchid hemlock]

Not "liking" something is just anecdotal

[queen sky]

why are you treating my statements of "i like X" and "i dislike Y" as attempts to assert objective facts?

[manic badger]

TLDR- That guy likes chainsword on heresy and it does its job on heresy for him, But chainsword is objectively mediocre across the board even if it works on heresy, and there are half a dozen other melee weapons that out perform it in every metric.

solved

[queen sky]

yeah

[orchid hemlock]

Because you are making direct correlations to other weapons and builds

I have said this 3 times already

You can't have your cake and eat it too

You can't say something is better than another without having some level of objective observation

[queen sky]

amazing

this is exhausting and i'm achieving nothing here, i'm done with this conversation and going to bed

[orchid hemlock]

You can say you have a "preference" sure, but you don't seem to be grasping that your preference is anecdotal

[queen sky]

yes

that's correct preferences are anecdotal

they're subjective judgements

[orchid hemlock]

So why are you making objective statements?

[elder fiber]

they aren't, you just don't have reading comprehension

[queen sky]

https://tenor.com/view/what-huh-confused-john-travolta-gif-16946746

what objective statements?

[orchid hemlock]

Ayo we gonna make it personal? 😈

[queen sky]

also i will never understand why multiple people look at a woman called elizabeth and say "that's a guy! he's a man bro!"

it's happened like half a dozen times tonight alone

[orchid hemlock]

Who?

[queen sky]

most recently cali

others above and in genchat

i cbf finding recipts

[orchid hemlock]

Elizabeth Moore?

[queen sky]

no idea who that is

i am talking about me

[orchid hemlock]

Than I still don't understand

[queen sky]

it literally has my name on my profile, and my username says Eliza-

but this is offtopic

[orchid hemlock]

Oh you

[queen sky]

https://tenor.com/view/matrix-gif-22156354

[balmy flume]

I mean it is the Internet, we cannot truly assume until we know for sure :p

Some guys do use feminine usernames/pfp, and the opposite is also true

[trim badger]

Pfp of a male looking character

[balmy flume]

....and yea that too

[queen sky]

the pfp is a woman lol

[elder fiber]

everybody assuming I'm a vulture baby because of my pfp

[trim badger]

The shading looks like a shaved beard

[narrow frost]

thats what a vulture baby would say

[balmy flume]

I don't know that character/person being depicted, so looks male...

[queen sky]

huh, never realised

looking closer it looks like the artist just did that to shade the faces

[orchid hemlock]

It's probably because of your profile pic

But this a Warhammer server, so I'm sure the majority of people here are oblivious to gender identity 💀

[trim badger]

Well yeah I deffo caught on it was shading, but at a simple glance from your pfp it does look like a shaved beard alas Simpsons style

[balmy flume]

...its also the lip difference. The "thin line lip" is usually lending towards a male interpretation if the character is not known to the viewer.

[queen sky]

yeah i can see it now that it's pointed out

[orchid hemlock]

They see someone with "masculine" features and they just make assumptions

[queen sky]

this i have never heard in my entire life

[trim badger]

Well no shit

[balmy flume]

Fair could just be me

[queen sky]

usually when i gender someone i at least take a single second to mouse over their name and check if they've gendered themselves

[narrow frost]

whats my gender

[trim badger]

Meh I call everyone that I don't know they

Easiest solution ever

[narrow frost]

dorktide time

[queen sky]

idiot

[queen sky]

i mostly do this yeah

[narrow frost]

Loud Correct Buzzer

https://tenor.com/view/hello-wyd-cat-scratching-cat-scratch-cleaning-screen-gif-15994084353171838166

[queen sky]

anyone i can't immediately gender gets They/Them

[narrow frost]

isnt that the point

[queen sky]

to be corrected if they correct me

[trim badger]

Internet culture defaults to he

You already know this

[tame lodge]

I'm starting to think Rashad can genuinely kill 10 groaners at once

[narrow frost]

probably

BM is a beast

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/nervous-waiting-daunting-no-spongebob-squarepants-gif-5281390

[tame lodge]

Not only that

Hotshot 1

[queen sky]

what's good about the rashad? i've never used it

[faint wedge]

Everything

[narrow frost]

2 shotting crushers

[narrow frost]

cleaving through mutliple elites

decent mobility

and a PA to stagger

[elder fiber]

with brutal momentum blessing it becomes a really strong jack of all trades weapon outside of havoc which messes with dmg breakpoints

because that blessing completely warps how it deals with hordes

[queen sky]

i wish trans people were as cool as conservatives describe them

[elder fiber]

up to bruisers you're killing 4 dudes per swing

[queen sky]

all hail our robot overlords

[tame lodge]

No no that can't be
Surely Rashad's minimum damage isn't high

[queen sky]

the infinite cleave is what does it?

[elder fiber]

It's not infinite technically, fatshark has terrible descriptions lol

[queen sky]

ah so they mean "negligible mass" or something?

[elder fiber]

basically, you kill smth with a headshot, it carries that damage to the next target with no dmg dropoff, if they die it does so again etc etc

[queen sky]

is it just the overflow or is the damage cloned?

[hollow ibex]

it allows you to hit 4 enemies with maximum damage iirc

or was it 3

[elder fiber]

4

[queen sky]

ah i see, ty

[hollow ibex]

rashad actually has basically 0 cleave on lights

[queen sky]

what a fantasically convoluted melee combat system

[elder fiber]

also used to work on ogryns but that got killed b/c ogryn folding shovel was 1tapping 4 crushers with one overhead

[hollow ibex]

but brumentum allows it to kill 4 bruisers every swing

[queen sky]

is vermintide like this too

[elder fiber]

yes

[hollow ibex]

which very few melee weapons can do

[agile mango]

is catch a breath good?

[tame lodge]

Yes

[hollow ibex]

decent

[queen sky]

imo yes (THIS IS NOT AN OBJECTIVE ASSESSMENT AND SHOULD NOT BE CONSTRUED AS A FACT)

[hollow ibex]

you just can't get hit in melee, and you can't even block

[tame lodge]

Always up unless you get hit in melee or block an attack

[queen sky]

if you're not constantly running after hordes like a budget zealot, it has pretty good uptime

i like it because I can transmit it to teammates with Born Leader

[agile mango]

I thought it still didn't work if you dodged?

[hollow ibex]

dodging doesn't cause it to stop

just blocking or getting hit

you can push too

[agile mango]

thx

[hollow ibex]

just be careful about blocking

(and actually getting hit ofc)

[agile mango]

is catch a breath better than get back in the fight?

[tame lodge]

Yes

Miles better

[tall torrent]

Not a real competition

[agile mango]

thx

[tall torrent]

GBITF needs a full rework to be considered anywhere near good

[tame lodge]

Hey
Path
Do you know Rashad's minimum damage?

[tall torrent]

Also I’m restarting RT

[tame lodge]

Soft locked?
Or just feeling like it

[tall torrent]

No just

I don’t like the choices I made in act 3

And respec in it sucks so much

Is there a mod that makes respec 0 cost

Just that

Nothing else

[tame lodge]

Probably toybox or something like that no?

[tall torrent]

Toy box has way too many functions

[tame lodge]

I haven't really checked RT modding tbh

https://www.nexusmods.com/warhammer40kroguetrader/mods/105

?

I guess it exists

[tall torrent]

Mods disable achievements??

[orchid hemlock]

I just wish I had a cheap supply of T 😞

[queen sky]

hope you can find one mate

i know a guy who uses under the table bodybuilder gel

T being a controlled substance is such bullshit

[sonic kayak]

They control it to a T

[tall torrent]

Only 3 activations per atk

[tame lodge]

I'm really enjoying Displacement Cassia this playthrough

Pair with Heavy Flamer and watch as the world Heretics burn

[tall torrent]

Cassia is kinda dps/support hybrid for me

I don’t run dedicated support

[tame lodge]

Displacement also let's you set up for some huge Lidless Stare

You could also like

Set Curse of the red something

With Apathy

So basically you're zone denying while also forcing enemies to get into the zone

[tall torrent]

I kinda don’t remember these abilities’ names

[tame lodge]

And if they fail wp check they get immobilized inside the zone

So they keep taking damage

[tame lodge]

Damn, Cassia got some combos

I'm also planning Attack of Opportunity only playthrough on the future
I might need to learn all Cassia combos

[tall torrent]

I only bothered to build my RT kinda

And Abelard kinda

Cassia I just use 2 dps abilities + VoC + BiD

[tame lodge]

You kind of just slowly learns to build them

I still have no idea with Henrix

[tall torrent]

RT has sorta similar issues like DT where most things are not explained very well

Like

Heavy bolter

[tame lodge]

Psyker Biomancer Santic Warrior Muhfuh

[tall torrent]

Does it benefit from boltgun expert’s +10% armor pen?

That’s not explained which is

Weird

Also ngl I don’t like melta weapons

They don’t feel good to use

Shotgun was dealing more damage

[tame lodge]

I dropped melta because they could never hit single target shots

Had to aoe spam everytime

[tall torrent]

Melta pistol had 3 shots

Always had to reload

Enemy health scaling goes way higher and I might not even kill a single dude with 3 shots

[tame lodge]

On my second playthrough
Heavy Stubber Argenta was straight up carrying

Got to like act 4 boss fight

And dealt literally 0 damage

[tall torrent]

Yea u kinda need to take talents to defeat enemies’ deflection

Deflection is way more important than armor in my experience

I’m doing this playthrough with +100% enemy wounds

But +75% skill check chance cuz I’m just too lazy to roll back save over and over

[tame lodge]

I'm just on Daring atm

But the way this game is balanced I can just go hardest diff and feel no difference

[tall torrent]

I’m gonna do normal but with +100% enemy wounds and +75% skill check

[tame lodge]

I'm kinda bummed that my Biomancer RT can't Metabolic Overcharge himself

I was also supposed to be a divinator this run

[tall torrent]

I don’t like playing psyker

Broken enough in DT

[tame lodge]

I played Pyromancer, it held up to the rumors that it was strong af

I could set myself on fire, make it so the fire would never go away

Then my attacks would also receive extra damage from the fire

And if I'm surrounded I can just explode myself

Truly a psyker moment

And because your RT is sanctioned you don't need to really worry about Warp phenomenas and shit

Unlike Idira

RT is peak

Santic Psykers get a cool sword ability

On a side note, I was looking into The Emperor Protects
It's a Willpower% chance of ignoring damage, wonder if I can get it to 100%

[thin minnow]

Know no heresy is

Hilarious to me

You deal more damage to heretics and xenos and shit

But your lore (xenos) and lore (warp) is always 0 lmao

[cunning haven]

which is better on recon lasgun (with onslaught)? rending or bring it down? testing against crusher rending seems to be 1 damage better on crits.

im guessing bring it down cuz most bosses are mostrosities? i wonder if rending effects the captain shields or the captains themselves

[sharp epoch]

bring it down is more consistent

[hollow ibex]

bring it down if you're taking onslaught

[cunning haven]

i just found it funny that rending was 1 damage better on a crusher

[hollow ibex]

yeah well that's what happens when the gun has shit cara adms

[solar valve]

DT psyker wishes it could be RT psyker

[solar valve]

Im pretty sure its WP/10

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/dumb-and-dumber-lloyd-theres-a-chance-jim-carrey-gif-11098164

[serene bough]

I remember playing pre-nerf cass

Navigator talents used to be so broken

[crimson garden]

What’re the y’all’s favourite weapons for veteran?

[tame lodge]

Vigilant 7

Agripina Infantry Autogun

Lasgun 2b

Helbore 4

Agripina Shotgun

[calm shard]

Helbore 4, Bolter, Laspistol

I HATE monstrosities

also the shovel is really fun too

[crimson garden]

What about melee weapons?

[calm shard]

shobel

power sword

the shovel that isn't a foldy shovel is very fun

[crimson garden]

Is the shock maul any good?

[pseudo fiber]

fine

if you're number 1 bulwark hater you'll love it

[tame lodge]

It basically only struggles against monstrosities

[crimson garden]

Would using something like the laspistol or bolter help make up for this weakness?

[hollow ibex]

bolter def would

[tame lodge]

Yeah

[umbral scaffold]

Def shock maul and power sword

Although P sword feels like more risky to use?

[calm shard]

lower mid tier

quite fun to use though

[midnight totem]

Power Fist for Vet, when

[narrow frost]

tomorrow

[umbral scaffold]

Good defense and CC but lacking any real break points

But they make up for that in being able to stun pretty much anything outside of like monstrosities

I pray they buff it greatly

[void dragon]

i want to be exited of the posibility of new melee weapons for veteran but goosh the class just doesnt feel that well suited for melee nowadays imo (the giant gauntlet is cool tho)

[warm idol]

I just want a hellgun man

closest thing you can get to feeling like a kasrkin/scion atm is recon xii

or xiv with it's cleave

but tbh idk how they would balance a hellgun/hotshot aside from giving it worse mobility and a longer reload

since lorewise it's basically a lasgun on crack

a long las with a scope would also be neat to have

imo it's really silly how without mods you can't put any sights on vigilant autos when they are exactly the type of gun you want a scope on

a 2x or a 4x would fit perfectly without feeling cramped

[sharp epoch]

mod = hax

[uncut pebble]

Braced lasgun, basically.

For a hellgun, I mean.

[void dragon]

what niche would a Braced Lasgun fill? no magazine but overheat weapon for horde eradication?

[uncut pebble]

Bingo.

The one gun intended to shoot at hordes.

[void dragon]

what we do with Braced autogun? we shold make it the rambo gun but idk how

[hollow ibex]

more dodges (why does it only have 2), faster reload, decrease to bloom

[void dragon]

2 dodges i imagine because it was supposed to be a heavy damage hose, but that's not the case at all

[uncut pebble]

It's not even a damage hose, the infantry autoguns are better in every way.

[void dragon]

exactly my point, the Brace Aguns feel that they should be more damage focused and probably also good stagger guns due their drawbacks, but they underdelivered

[warm idol]

since it's a hellgun why not have it be also good vs armor?

close range eradication beam

I feel like having a hellgun struggle vs carapace would feel very weird

[void dragon]

mostly balance, they can do ok damage but since they have ammo economy as another advantage, there should be some drawback (unless you want to make a overhead mechanic that is quite punishing)

[warm idol]

altho unless they make the spread really bad I feel like even braced it would be very good at range

since it's a lasgun

[hollow ibex]

lol meanwhile recon las has the staying power of brautos with literally none of the drawbacks

[tall mango]

Yo I'm looking for an actual good kreig build but idk what to do does anyone have any presets I could copy

[elder vessel]

krieg build is normal veteran build with krieger cosmetics you can't acquire atm

[tall mango]

Damn

[elder vessel]

yeah

just put together your own build with the following in mind

•Damage is important
•Resources are important
•The game favors generalists, so cover all your bases in your loadout

[void dragon]

Something I see on the recon is that it's damage is quite average, it pulls damage from its capacity to set infernus quickly, the thing is that other weapons are just not offering even similar damage potential with the ammo efficiency it has

[hollow ibex]

i never tested, but i suspect if you take off infernus and put deathspitter on, it wouldn't be too much worse if at all compared to brauto

[void dragon]

I recall I did that in a test, the damage drop is notorious but doesn't make the gun unusable, but definitely needs infernus to kill targets efficiently (because makes the gun kill better at range too) would have to try if the damage with deathspitter is equal of above Brautos

[lusty ether]

I can never remember the tac axe variants

[narrow frost]

2 7 good

4 bad

7 best

[torpid grotto]

The combos are fast and come from multiple directions so it’s hard to remember them compared to other weapons

[torpid grotto]

Why so

[lusty ether]

partly it's also that the weapon info really conveys diddly fuck all

every one is like 'assassin lights strikedown heavies'

[narrow frost]

PA heavy combo can utlize BM the most

[lusty ether]

and the actual usage is actually pretty different

but with no reference you're like "uhh...one of these..."

[torpid grotto]

I like the chaining diagonal heavies on 2

Simple

Does 4 have any advantages

[lusty ether]

yeah

I was using 6 before

2 is easier

I just want to max out the mastery on the weapons I basically don't enjoy using

and I find doing that makes me appreciate them more anyway

[tame lodge]

Rashad killing 10 targets test 1 failed

4 walkers killed

5th took 369 Dmg

6th took 190

Scheduling groaner tests for later

[fading yarrow]

https://youtu.be/3AlmB8MOL-s?si=3OHPKsM6UhxyqN6s

Boutta make my Krieger my main loadout ngl

[uncut pebble]

Those ones are actually pretty simple.

Assassin - good headshot damage
Strikedown - good single target damage
Obliterating - oneshots most things with its special attack
so on and so forth.

[lusty ether]

...right...but the point I'm actually making is that all the tactical axe variants all roughly say the same thing

despite doing quite distinct things between them

[hollow ibex]

idk, i just go off vibes

[narrow frost]

mk4 doesnt have any cleaving heavies

thats really the only difference between the 3

[hollow ibex]

mk4 has heavies?

[tame lodge]

An uppercut one

That doesn't act (damage wise) as an uppercut

https://tenor.com/view/yakuza-kazuma-kiryu-pissed-off-gif-14586175

https://tenor.com/view/dragon-of-dojima-kiryu-kiryu-kazuma-yakuza-the-dragon-of-dojima-didnt-say-this-gif-2393024760831430572

[tall torrent]

Both are overpowered

[fading yarrow]

Tonight is just not an Auric night

Trying to do a STG AuHer Magistrati Oubliette and my teammates just keep choking

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/true-truth-nuke-squidward-mr-krabs-rock-gif-9714276628674837375

[fading yarrow]

On the plus side: finally killed 1000 Bulwarks

The Reaper penance is going to be the real pain

And 650 more kills will put me at 400K kills total

[ocean spade]

You know, I really hope with the next update, we start getting some proper long range weapons like long-las, an absolution pattern sniper rifle or hell if the Assassin temples allow it, Exitus Rifles

or weapon attachments, I am honestly just sick of using iron sights and want to use a scope or something

[austere mica]

We would not get an exitus rifle by any margin

And we probably won't get dedicated sniping weapons anyway

90% of engagements are within 20m

[uncut pebble]

Any weapons designed specifically for certain factions, we will not get.

Like, we aren't ever going to get arc rifles.

[austere mica]

It would also just be EK staff but gun

[uncut pebble]

Yeah and it would be fun.

As like, an alternative to plasma, I mean.

[austere mica]

Nope

Horrible damage bad cara adm

Weep

[fading yarrow]

Mk III Shock Maul my beloved

[austere mica]

Is that indi or agni

[deep sun]

Yes

[tame lodge]

Indi renamed to Muni

Mk3 is the Muni

[queen sky]

which usually has more benefit - Survivalist or Fire Team? i thought it was Survivalist for better ammo economy, but the Hammer Of The Emperor guide ranks Fire Team higher and i'm not sure why

[hollow ibex]

surv

fire team isn't going to help with breakpoints really

you only ever take it because of pathing

[queen sky]

ahh makes sense

ty

it is pretty miserable trying to get both Survivalist and Kraks at the same time

that one point tax is annoying to find room for

[quiet valley]

You don’t really need survivalist unless you are playing Havoc

Even then you can skip on it depending on your team comp

Non Havoc, just path to the most convenient aura for your build

[narrow frost]

dont need survivalist in havoc

[faint beacon]

Season 1 Havoc? maybe

but current havoc

not really

[narrow frost]

Psword Dbarrel

[faint beacon]

-50% Ammo is not that bad I wont lie

[queen sky]

Catch A Breath is good enough that it tips the balance for me

[quiet valley]

Yeah depends on team comp

[queen sky]

i'm not sure Grenade Tinkerer Kraks are worth losing it AND survivalist

[manic cloak]

You're a convenient aura.

[narrow frost]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/747186322745196665/1345047632669839370/police.gif

[quiet valley]

Come back here when you finish your daily train mission

[hollow ibex]

i just want to shoot more

[quiet valley]

@manic cloak what number are you at

[manic cloak]

20 left.

[quiet valley]

OOF

[inland glade]

I'm getting back after 6 months, so my knowledge might be a bit outdated. I usually run DS+Boltgun with an Executioners stance build. I've maxed them, soI next want to try Shovel and Plasma Gun. Will my exec build work just as well?

[fading yarrow]

Found a fellow tryhard Vet who's clearly been having as much trouble with randoms as me

We were both VoC Focus Target Vets and we just kept spamming pings on the same enemies

We did that for two Daemonhosts our team wandered too close to or fired at

[signal zinc]

I changed my build to a stealth vet and it's pretty useful as a scouting tool

[manic cloak]

What exactly would you be scouting?

[signal zinc]

Running ahead to grab all the goodies and running the fuck back when there's a horde

[fading yarrow]

I find Stealth Vet is at its best for doing objectives mid-horde

Clandestium Gloriana, Rolling Steel, Refinery, etc

[hollow ibex]

you use stealth to do the objective

i use stealth so the crusher wall flattens the freak behind me

we are not the same

[stoic thorn]

EXE STANCE PLASMA

JOIN THE GROUP

[boreal void]

I feel like whenever I use stealth to avoid a dog or mutant, they still get me

Probably just using it too late

[hollow ibex]

Yeah stealth can fuck you sometimes

[boreal void]

It's very funny when the mutant flings me and I land still in stealth

[frank basin]

Me stealth when I bail the sticky situation

[hollow ibex]

Yah exactly

[serene bough]

Brilliant

This is how stealth should be used

[tight plover]

are there any voicelines for the Veteran you could activate, i keep hearing the zealots tweak out and i would like to partake

or was it the psyker? dont remember

[loud falcon]

Silent professional

[sullen jackal]

is mobility still dump stat on devil's claw sword for the 5 people using it

[uncut pebble]

Yeah.

[sullen jackal]

also found for my psyker, for memes :v (ok it's probably what i want on the zealot instead for MAXIMUM DASH DISTANCE but)

[uncut pebble]

If you take dd, get a proc, and have scriers with warp speed going, you can legit throw yourself 20ft in the air with that thing if you dodge up some stairs.

[thin minnow]

Penetration is the dump?

[spice atlas]

Does any1 have a kantreal build without focus target

[sullen jackal]

no defense/cleave damage is but i'm doing a thing

[lofty rivet]

What's the least needed stat for recon lasgun?

[queen sky]

Mobility

which mark of the Heavy Sword are you supposed to use? so far it's struggling to clear poxwalkers on Malice as i try it out

[dry cloak]

any mark

heavy sword gains most when upgraded to the max

also get deathblow and slaugheterer on it

[queen sky]

is there a specific blessing combo required?

ah ok

so it's a good weapon but absolutely miserable to level?

[dry cloak]

its is a good weapon

leveling it will be smoother on zealot

[void dragon]

Isn't better to dump collateral?

[dry cloak]

nope

[queen sky]

does the recon lasgun even have collat?

[void dragon]

Yes

[void dragon]

Why collateral is better to keep at 80?

[queen sky]

not at this mastery level, but yeah i'll level it and see how it changes

right now i miss my chainsword

[nimble canyon]

that fucking bleed veteran build is so much fun

i hate it so much because its so much fun

i hate fun things

[dry cloak]

damage

[nimble canyon]

i wanna try new melee weapons

[void dragon]

Have you embraced the ways of our lord and saviour Heavy sword?

[nimble canyon]

i should!

[void dragon]

Indeed

[nimble canyon]

also axe i wanna try

i only done shovel, dueling, and knife on veteran so far

[void dragon]

Vet's melee repertoire is kinda limited because the class doesn't buff that aspect that much

But there are some weapons that are still fun to use (at least for the Chaxe user maniac that is me)

[queen sky]

Heavy Sword does not have Slaughterer available?

[nimble canyon]

show me your builds

this is directed at everyone

[queen sky]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9eb0b628-a9cb-48a6-b0e9-0276bbe773ec/six-shooter-support

[dry cloak]

my bad. headtaker

[queen sky]

ty

[tame lodge]

Collateral ON RECON basically affects stagger
Recon is not a stagger heavy weapon
Plus stagger makes your target move around making headshots harder

[void dragon]

Yeah, I'm asking why some say mobility it's supposed to be the dump stat when collateral is better

[queen sky]

hm, i stand corrected

i guess i'll stop giving stat reccomendations then

[void dragon]

In doubt, always suggest seeing the pins for the guide there

[slow spade]

Lowering collateral is basically a dps boost

[unreal nova]

To be fair, it barely matters in real gameplay. Things usually die before they even get staggered.

Unless you are shooting crushers and bosses.

[void dragon]

Except in havoc, there even fodder is kinda sturdy

Kinda

[unreal nova]

Who literally just not care.

[unreal nova]

I took my 60 mobility recon to havoc. No real diff barring user issues. Ehm, controller accuracy.

Which is a me thing.

[void dragon]

That make sense I guess, never was a controller player myself

[unreal nova]

And mind you, nothing gets staggered much unless the oggy decided to rumbler spam.

Then uhhh... yeah.

[void dragon]

Then you join it with grenade spam and hopefully one day we replace exe stance with a new skill that allows you to pull a grenade launcher

[fading yarrow]

Hab Dreyko, Lights Out, Vraks Mk V (Columnus)

https://tenor.com/view/me-atrapaste-es-cine-its-cinema-cinema-esto-es-cine-gif-12869046600151364058

There's absolutely no-one playing Auric today btw

Taking me years to find a team

[unreal nova]

Fixed shots or unlimited ammo on timer?

[stoic thorn]

I wish we got an actual plasma gun

Not the dinky one rn

The one with a BRACE

The SIDEGRIP

The CADIAN ONE

Slightly longer coil too

[unreal nova]

That dinky thing has 50 cleave.

[stoic thorn]

Yeah I want more

Flexing

I want that shit with a sidegrip

Longer barrel more heat

[dry cloak]

Remember base aint the model that commisary skins use. So yes theyre is precedent for plasma gun marks

[void dragon]

Fixed shots if i should make the call, unlimited could have an unintended interaction with other perks so it can become hard to balance

[unreal nova]

True. I think a subnode doubles the shots.

[void dragon]

would prefer that subnodes add some stuff like incendiary ammo or more ammo in trade of them being more about crowd control than damage

[unreal nova]

Double the shots is more ammo.

[warm idol]

most bolter skins also use a slightly different model (the magazine is different) so we might get a new bolter mark too

[slow spade]

they should give vet a heavy bolter UwU

[thin minnow]

Movement speed 1%

Recoil, downwards

Pushes you back everytime you shoot faster than sprinting

[void dragon]

Sure, but would not like it to be just more ammo, but be "half damage for double ammo" kind of deal

So more uptime and horde management than burst

[unreal nova]

Eh.

[void dragon]

Prob not the most "engaging" path, then again I ain't a game dev

[lofty rivet]

what are the best perks and blessings for the combat shotgun?

[dry cloak]

Depends on mark

[tame lodge]

No Respite + Deathspitter/Fullbore

No idea about the mark you're using though

🤷

[dry cloak]

Thats for agrip one.

For other 2 its scattershot manstopper

[sleek garden]

zarona spreadshot with manstopper is silly

[dry cloak]

Manstopper is silly

[void dragon]

Silly is good

[umbral scaffold]

Is the mk 12 or mk 4 better between the chain axes? Or is it just preference

[hollow ibex]

4 is better, and by better, i mean slightly less dogshit

[void dragon]

Mk 4 is usable tier

Not to be confused with Good tier

[arctic rampart]

if you want a good axe, use the rashad

[umbral scaffold]

Damn so mk 12 is just cooked then

[hollow ibex]

chaxes desperately need help

most of the human melee weapons do tbh

but chaxes even moreso lol

[arctic rampart]

rashad is S tier

[umbral scaffold]

I like the special activated push attack on mk 12 cuz of the beefy damage it does but

[quiet valley]

Rashad is great until Havoc

[void dragon]

Chain-weapons in general need a tune up and Hadron to stop slacking

[quiet valley]

Then brutal momentum falls off hard

[tame lodge]

Not quite

[arctic rampart]

Havoc's for pimply faced try hards

[tame lodge]

The powerful revved heavy with the Thrust blessing is worth something

But the lights feel

Un-axe

[quiet valley]

Havoc 40 is the gameplay at its peak, but the sandbox at its lowest

[tame lodge]

Know what I mean

[umbral scaffold]

Yeah it’s weird idk lol I was using it in havok like 20 and it didn’t feel bad but like it didn’t feel the best either

The damage was chunky but there’s times the horde clear just felt lack luster lol

[tiny junco]

i just got out of an h30 with a fucking laspistol shroud zealot

somehow managed to out preform an entire team and solo for 90% of the match

[quiet valley]

You? Or the aggro dumping zealot?

[tiny junco]

heh

two vets and a psyker

[quiet valley]

gg no frontline, even if one vet is melee that’s kinda cursed

[tiny junco]

zero frontline

i had to solorush 90 percent of it

[hollow ibex]

was he hoping raking fire would carry him or something lol

[tiny junco]

i dont use raking fire

infernus and dumdum

[dry cloak]

this is the most cursed laspitol ive seen

but if it works for you the better

[hollow ibex]

build sounds cursed lol

[tiny junco]

its supposed to be

i should not run this practically

[dry cloak]

fair enof

[tiny junco]

a laspistol zealot are two words that should never be said in the same sentence

[dry cloak]

laspitol is one of better ranged weapon for zealot

if using heavy melees

like relicblade and thunderhammer

[thin minnow]

Combat axe

[thin minnow]

Why cursed?

Stopping power important?

[dry cloak]

nah

perks and blessings

[thin minnow]

Oh

Sprit efficiency is random yeah

How are burn and bleeding any different

[dry cloak]

burn is better

[thin minnow]

How

[dry cloak]

its just better

[thin minnow]

HOW

I require knowledge

[hollow ibex]

more damage

[quiet valley]

Use Flak Unyielding with Dum Dum Infernus

You can go Desperado Infernus if you are melee heavy (WS)

[tiny junco]

i run a dueling sword

[quiet valley]

Stopping power is Dmg, dump Stability for MkII and Mobility for MkX

[sharp epoch]

throwing knives do the role of laspistol just as good

[dry cloak]

mobility stick

stats it

[quiet valley]

It’s still at good ranged pick for mobile anti ranged/special

But honestly Zealots don’t need to equip a ranged weapon if they have knives

[sharp epoch]

im used to being immobile af with plasma and ps just gotta move with dodges 😭

[severe jolt]

Laspistol is horrible for zealot because the revolver does everything better with just about any build.

[normal bay]

Except for ammo economy + boss dps

It's why a lot of Zealots run Las pistol in Havoc

Has great mobility too

[quiet valley]

Las pistol lets you kill regular shooters with good ammo eco

[sharp epoch]

idk trying to outduel the 20 spreadout shooters as zealot seems like a bad idea

[severe jolt]

Right, but why are you playing Zealot and worrying about ammo? It's a heavily melee focused class.

[quiet valley]

In Havoc the revolver falls off fast, it serves the same purpose as Knives but doesn’t have any of the other utility as the Las-Pistol

You will kill most soft threats with more mobility and less ammo than the revolver, it also gives extra boss dmg in a pinch with Infernus

[sharp epoch]

Zealot with ds does a whole lot more damage just stabbing the thing

well thunder hammer too

[severe jolt]

Huh. I hardly ever use the revolver in havoc either. It's usually recon las or flamer.

[quiet valley]

Las pistol is just recon with a lot more mobility for Zealot

[quiet valley]

Just dodge you get toughness for it

[plain osprey]

I havent played HAVOC in ages. Never made it past level 23. Not that I couldnt, i regularly play auric maelstrom with every class except psyker, i just never get accepted into parties hosting 25+ and higher and i have no friends to play with. I could try my luck here in the server, with an open invite, but with those, youll never know what youll get. Could be 3 crack players playing the game like its nothing, could be weirdos/annoying americans or barely english speaking eastern europeans ....

[sharp epoch]

Use the LFG channels

[orchid hemlock]

get on

lets go

[hollow ibex]

he said he doesn't want to play with annoying americans

[plain osprey]

Dumb German here, what does lfg mean? Are those just normal strike team channels? Ive been meaning to ask that for a hot minute.

I'll try that tmr for i am currently sentenced to be at work until midnight

[sharp epoch]

Yeah people find people for strike teams in the channels like #vox-lfg-emea

that one is specifically for EU and middle east I think

[plain osprey]

Never mind the fact that i blocked him a few day ago because he trolled me. Id rather eat a bucket of nails than to converse with him ever again

[hollow ibex]

[mortal horizon]

what works best on mkI shovel - uncanny/skullcrusher? thrust? i play havoc 30+ a lot

i think its uncanny skullcrusher

[severe jolt]

LFG means "lets' go" it's just something peopl say wehn they want to go play a match

[sharp epoch]

it means looking for group 😭

[mortal horizon]

looking for group ya lol

[tropic notch]

I like uncanny and decimeter

[plain osprey]

Ok, makes sense. I just dont really like the lottery of what kind of person is online to join the lfg at any given time. Dont get me wrong, most of you a solid people and even better players, but some of you....

[hollow ibex]

matchmaking for havoc is fucking aids

[sharp epoch]

It's either that or gasp party finder

[plain osprey]

True. And thats why i havent played HAVOC alot. I can deal with most auric damnation/mael randoms, but i never get chosen for the higher havoc levels. They see my level 16 and discount me right away

[sharp epoch]

imo I'd just host your own party and slowly go up the ranks

if you're trying to join 40s it's gonna be a lot of rejections

[unreal nova]

Thing is, think of it if you are a host. Do you want to accept a fresh 30/ havoc 1 to your 35+ when you risk deranking?

[plain osprey]

Yeah, that might be the way to go. I just wanna get all the havoc related penances and them i am never gonna touch that gamemode ever again

[sharp epoch]

I've played so much havoc 40s now that even auric malestroms feel like malice now 🥹

[plain osprey]

Probably not. Although i am 16, not 1, but yes, i agree, doesnt look good from his perspective

[unreal nova]

More so if you don't know them so you have no idea of their skill level.

[unreal nova]

Well, it was more, if you were 16 hosting and a havoc 1 tried joining.

[plain osprey]

I have yet to decide If that is a sign of skill or ptsd on your side lol

[unreal nova]

Might be both.

H40 is traumatic.

[sharp epoch]

[plain osprey]

Yeah, youre right. I'll probably reject that person

Guess i'll be hosting havoc level 16 tmr.

[quiet valley]

Yeah Auric board is def the chill Malice equivalent for any H40 players at this point

[sharp epoch]

everything that used be to so hard feels easy now 😔

like even 3VEG or whatever that malestrom is

[hollow ibex]

ok cool, we get it, we have a couple of badasses around here

[plain osprey]

I always enjoy playing mael with those of you who feel that way. You make the chaos unfolding infront of me much more bearable. Unlike the fucking psyker who just unlocked level 30, went into auric maelleus monstrum and tries to fucking smite a chaos spawn 🥴🤦🏻

[quiet valley]

The only mod that gets me sweating at little anymore is JIIV, Monstrous Specials, Snipers, and Pox Gas

[plain osprey]

Seems like a fun combo. I usually dont play anything containing poxgas

[quiet valley]

Pox Gas monsters are annoying af

[quiet valley]

Some of us have just been playing a long time now

Power creep + Skill improvement lead us here

[hollow ibex]

how do you know someone is a h40 player?

they'll tell you about it

[plain osprey]

If you go by the title the game gives you for beating havoc 40, you can gaige by their performance in auric mael If they got carried to their title by their teammates or If they actually earned it....

[hollow ibex]

i've been finding that the h40 marker / literally any title in the game (havoc examplar, ASS, poxbreaker, etc) is no indicator of actual skill

[quiet valley]

It doesn’t mean nothing, but it’s not an accurate assessment of skill

It’s a baseline ya, you can beat at least one

[elder fiber]

True survivor means they're gonna throw harder than a professional pitcher

[plain osprey]

Actually one of the reasons why ive put no effort into actually persuing these titles. In the end, especially with the right friends, any of these titles can be cheesed/shortcut towards or people can carry you to it.

My indicators of skill are: how many times did i go down (especially due to my own fault) and did i actually achive something like completing objectives, dealing lots of damage, did i help my teammates, etc.

[umbral scaffold]

I wish Xbox was able to see damage stats the end of the game tbh

But I feel like I can gauge my performance by how many elites/specialists I’m killing off

[plain osprey]

Although i have learned that hard way only to help teammates when it is safe to do so, and i will never help idiots.

If the zealot rushes ahead and gets himself doggo'd or crusher'd i will not drop everything i am doing and rush across half the map to help his sorry ass. Same goes for the psyker who used assail instead of his melee in dealing with a horde and forgot to count to ten for the 11th time in a row....

[agile mango]

what ranged waepons are viable on havoc 40 w/vet?

[void dragon]

plasma gun, bolter, recon lasgun iirc are the favourite ones

[agile mango]

how does recon lasgun work?

[narrow frost]

Dbarrel

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7kb_pMcubw

[umbral scaffold]

Idk if I like bolter over the spearhead tbh

Feels like I do way more with spearhead

But then again I’m not at havoc 40 yet🥀

[frank basin]

5% move speed

[void dragon]

spearhead IS the bolter, the other is the bolt PISTOL, kinda the same but different

[hollow ibex]

spearhead is the bolter no?

[void dragon]

yes

[umbral scaffold]

Ah I wasn’t sure if people said differently for both

[void dragon]

people here call it the Bistol

[hollow ibex]

bistol is a disgrace to the bolter family

[quiet valley]

Crazy take

[void dragon]

its not bad, but is more a movility tool for other classes like zealot or psyker

veteran needs its gun to be the spotlight

[hollow ibex]

i don't want to hear that from the guy unironically running mkxiv recon las

[umbral scaffold]

Yeah like I’ve tried to see the appeal of it but like bolter just feels so much better in every way lol

[void dragon]

but he not wrong, its crazy take

[quiet valley]

Sorry, crazy take from the Malice vet

[agile mango]

I need to try that lol

[narrow frost]

https://tenor.com/view/easter-doe-eating-deer-eating-popcorn-funny-gif-4621167703268332056

[narrow frost]

very fun

been playing it in havoc 40 for the past few days

[hollow ibex]

how about you go jerk yourself off in h40 to a bulwark horde hmm?

[hollow ibex]

nah the gun genuinely has some really annoying problems

i can see why some people like it

[void dragon]

Antelope of the discord, what's your wisdom on the Dbarrel?

[hollow ibex]

but that doesn't mean those problems don't exist

[quiet valley]

It’s a grenade buff stick that doubles as a harder hitting revolver substitute

[void dragon]

definely, but the thing is that you build it as a side weapon, that's why i say psyker (who can guarantee crits for anti specialists) and zealot (favour melee, use it as movility stick and lethal proximity) want it more than veteran

[hollow ibex]

in what world does it hit harder than a revolver

show me a bistol that can one-shot crushers

and we'll talk

it's great as a buff stick, but it's not great as a gun

[quiet valley]

You should try some weapons on a difficulty higher than Malice before you spread misinformation

[agile mango]

is running grenade vet bistol in higher tier havocs a bad idea? I'm tired of plasma and I burned all my plasteel on getting a new cleaver, pick, and rumbler for orgryn so I can't setup d-barrel yet

[hollow ibex]

i main AM and auric, which you're well aware of.

[void dragon]

no need, can stab crushers with me stabby sword and swap the gun to down some fool trappers in quick succession

[quiet valley]

It’s very viable nearly meta

[hollow ibex]

bistol is used in havoc because it buffs vet's best source of AOE damage/infinite cleave

[agile mango]

thats why I use bistol only on grenade vet lol

[void dragon]

I have ran psyker bistol because it buffs my assail and FGS moonblade with bleed

in havoc

[hollow ibex]

full gren build is fun

but the least fun part of it is bistol for me

[quiet valley]

Lethal Proc blessing buffs ALL explosions, that includes your grenades

[void dragon]

it DESTROY a lot of enemies even in havoc

[hollow ibex]

such an annoying gun to use

if it had a bit more damage, it'd be so much better

[agile mango]

reckon I should take the 20% double grenade perk or is it not worth?

[void dragon]

its crazy that you think Bistol is annoying when Revolver is more annoying

[hollow ibex]

it's an ok talent

[agile mango]

the aim feels off sometimes

[hollow ibex]

nah volver one shots things reliably

bistol doesn't

[agile mango]

revolver pierces enemies better so I think its better for special sniping. bistol is nice though with weapon specialist since you can use it as a point-blank stagger stick on hordes while still getting melee specialist.

[hollow ibex]

bistol is just short of some very important breakpoints

kinda gets cucked

hope it sees some minor adjustments in the next patch but i doubt it

[void dragon]

again, the geapon has advantages, real ones, that make it good to pick against the revolver, even in havoc

[quiet valley]

Everytime I see you post in this chat you have some negative polarizing opinion on weapons you clearly have not tested or built properly

[hollow ibex]

lol. i might run only meme builds, but i'm far more familiar with the auric/AM meta than you are.

[warm schooner]

revolver doesn't have enough upside in high havoc anymore, esp not with the cleave nerfs

[agile mango]

do you know why it works when you have your melee equped?

[hollow ibex]

not talking about havoc, and revolver's shit in havoc anyway

[hollow ibex]

fatshart being fatshart 🤷

[void dragon]

obeseFish spagetti code

[pseudo fiber]

it's just a universal buffs some are that way

[agile mango]

lol

[pseudo fiber]

see hotshot

[quiet valley]

Another crazy take, you make an aggressive statement, and then pawn it off as a ‘meme’ then boast about meta knowledge

[quiet valley]

Fat shark code is crazy

PSA about Hotshot

[hollow ibex]

i made the aggressive statement? you're the one that began all this by claiming that i main malice when you're clearly completely clueless

[quiet valley]

T1 is better than T4

[warm schooner]

ah yes, the reverse buff scaling

true fatshark

[quiet valley]

This statement

[hollow ibex]

because it is

bolter feels like a powerful weapon

bistol feels like shit, best used as a buff stick

[void dragon]

ok you 2 ( @hollow ibex @quiet valley ) settle down, both have opinions, and no one presented facts with numbers so NO ONE has any right to call down the others opinion

[hollow ibex]

i mean that's my point. it feels like shit to use.

it's great as a buff stick, but it's bad as a gun

[void dragon]

yeah, "feel"

that's not fact

[hollow ibex]

i'm not presenting it as fact

besides what i pointed out about breakpoints

[void dragon]

but you are arguing like it is

[hollow ibex]

huh?

[void dragon]

my point: why?

honest

[hollow ibex]

i already explained it

it misses important breakpoints, even with puncture

as a result you often need two shots on common elites

which means 4 kills per mag

[quiet valley]

I just dislike Siro immediately dismissing a lot of Vet weapons, even when they preform admirably

[hollow ibex]

and a reload that isn't very quick

[quiet valley]

It’s bad for new players to hear such negative polarizing takes

[hollow ibex]

as you casually assume that i didn't test the weapons first before coming to said conclusion

[quiet valley]

I’m stuck on mobile, and when I’m waiting this is a great time burner

[void dragon]

this is with veteran, right?

[hollow ibex]

you know nothing about me, yet you keep acting like you know my entire DT play history

i even told you last time i had given the deadshot XIV a shot before

naturally, you ignored that too

[hollow ibex]

ofc

[quiet valley]

You should present what you think are the weapons pro/cons instead of just saying it’s dogshit

[hollow ibex]

ask and i'll explain

[quiet valley]

If you actually tried the XIV with a proper build, you should have seen it as it is, one of the highest performing Vet weapons in H40

[hollow ibex]

"proper build"

[void dragon]

What targets does it fail to kill? i believe ragers could count and not headshot on some enemies can happen, but so does with bolter

[quiet valley]

Bolt pistol also hits breakpoints with ease with Deadly Accurate and Surgical

[warm schooner]

what does a XIV proper build look like

[hollow ibex]

ah yes, defeating the whole point of taking it

[quiet valley]

Deadshot Focus Target

[void dragon]

so far i see the same performance on bolter and bistol

[hollow ibex]

not to mention it getting the worse version of surgical

[quiet valley]

I said there’s two ways to build it, grenade stat stick or actual ranged weapon

[atomic void]

bolt pistol is GREAT

[warm schooner]

what blessings on XIV?

[atomic void]

thanks for coming to my ted talk

[void dragon]

im testing the guns and their breakpoints between bistol and Bolter are basically the same