veteran-class

[stoic thorn]

Power Fist should go to the veterans

We should get a plasma pistol too

So I can run the plasma pistol power fist combo and be the in terms of gameplay the most overpowered mf in the veterans

Zealots should get that Chainsaw flamer

As a flamer mark

Forgot what it was called

It's on the model in the Darktide board game

Also the Darktide board game is just misinformation lmao

Veteran is a KASRKIN

WITH A HOTSHOT LASGUN

Zealot has the CHAINSAW FLAMER

Ogryn and psyker have correct loadouts I think

Ripper gun

I love that the Cutthroat is actually from cadia during the 13th black crusade

And wasn't offworld when it happened

[formal ice]

Mucho texto

[stoic thorn]

Like these mfs literally fought in the 13th black crusade

[formal ice]

[stoic thorn]

The rejects should respect the cutthroat more smh

Dawg literally out here facing horrors beyond his comprehension

[formal ice]

Everyone doing that

Whay do you mean

[bronze trout]

I'm pretty sure the npc characters respond negatively mostly to the cutthroat and rejects aren't much better other then the brawler

I guess the savant gets along too

[unreal nova]

The other vets mock/tease the cutthroat though.

[formal ice]

Thats fair

A Soldier that doesn't know the code names of the uhhh heretics beings? What a dumbass!

[surreal gust]

Figure I’d ask, what’s the best Caxe mark

[bronze trout]

Pretty sure the cutthroat makes fun of the professional for being a suck up as well

[iron marten]

Loose Cannon does yeah

"I bet you suck up to the commissar"

Cutthroat calls the Loose Cannon a poor excuse of a soldier lmao

[unreal nova]

Those 6 just mock each other tbh.

[iron marten]

Professional and Cutthroat are pretty neutral with each other tbh

Cutthroat probably likes Professional, scolding them when they take a compliment from the Cutthroat

[iron marten]

Rashad Mk3 (I think?)

[surreal gust]

The default then

[iron marten]

Last time I used it was still called mk2 :p

[hollow ibex]

yes rashad

[surreal gust]

Okay I didn’t waste a shit ton of materials

[austere mica]

Rashad is icky gross

[unreal nova]

You can just swap marks though.

[iron marten]

I also don't use it cause of how boring it is lol

[surreal gust]

Oh can you?

[unreal nova]

So marks don't matter.

[austere mica]

Tactical axe better

[surreal gust]

Idk how to do that

[unreal nova]

Inventory, click weapon, look for marks.

Click that, swap if you have mastery lvls for it.

[surreal gust]

Well then

The blessings and stuff doesn’t change I assume

[iron marten]

I use knife...

[unreal nova]

Yep.

[iron marten]

I'm currently on a psyker phase cause the force great sword just feels good to use

[surreal gust]

Good to know anyways

[austere mica]

Tac axe is like knife but good

And it even has combos

[iron marten]

But muh helbore and knife steel legion cosplay!!!

There's only like 3 mk6 knife combos so fair

[unreal nova]

Actually, too many. it's just you can get away with never using most.

[iron marten]

yeah, the three mk6 combos
crowd damage
single target
single target (stamina edition)

[uneven cloud]

What are some good perks/blessings for tac axe?

Dueling sword isn’t doing it for me

[dry cloak]

as on #psyker-class its more active right now

[remote sonnet]

What build are you using?

[uneven cloud]

... recon lasgun build

[grand perch]

what a weird thing to say when knife was meta since forever until DS came along

[austere mica]

It’s only weird if you take me seriously

[grand perch]

oh ok

[austere mica]

They’re extremely similar

[grand perch]

you want bromentum + headtaker

[austere mica]

You just flip their single target and horde capabilities and it’s the other weapon

MK also matters, 2 or 7 is the pick

And perks depend on your class

[uneven cloud]

ty no1 tac axe enjoyer

[austere mica]

It’s flak and either Unarmored if you have insufficient damage to oneshot a scab bruiser with a pa/heavy or maniac if you can

Cara would be neat if it’s Cara damage wasn’t slow in the first place

Same with unyielding

Luckily bolter exists

[hollow ibex]

Mk IV is good if you want to light spam

Use it with weapon specialist

[remote sonnet]

mk2 is light for single target, heavy for horde
You can run Brutal momentum + Slaughter spree, odd combination but quite effective for me.
mk4 is light for horde, heavy for single target, look at the previous post
Then Brutal momentum + Shred/Headtaker/Decimater.
mk7 has mixed move set for both light and heavy.
The other is Shred/Headtaker/Decimater, whatever combination of those 3.

[winter grove]

nah

[remote sonnet]

I usually run mk7, just personal preference.

Perk can be flak/carapace.

[grand perch]

this is why i dont write guides

you can have hundreds of hours on that weapon, name yourself after it, use it in all kinds of combinations

and still some guy just goes nah

[winter grove]

I enjoy slaughter spree

[faint beacon]

veteran this is literally the best combo

[grand perch]

yeah, on mk IV

[faint beacon]

All of them benefit the most from HT BM

Slaughter Spree would be okay on MkIV and thats about it

[wild vortex]

and then some youtuber comes along with his shit takes and misinforms the whole community

[faint beacon]

You love to see it

[winter grove]

Yeah I meant mk4

[faint beacon]

Guys you NEED to use Agile!

and its literally just a bad habit bait blessing

LMAO

[winter grove]

You NEED to use lacerate

[wild vortex]

Agile is the Charmed Reload of taxes

[winter grove]

Think of ALL the DOT you can do

[faint beacon]

FT/Lacerate + Uncanny is the only exception to that

[calm shard]

I am not using one of the highest finesse melee weapons in the game just to not poke enemies in the head

Get away from me

[faint beacon]

rending bleed is braindead busted

[winter grove]

Mercy Kill my beloved

[remote sonnet]

I find Slaughter spree good on mk2 because of the heavy swing. Heavy spam good.

[winter grove]

Too bad I need serrated blade for that

[thorn lark]

flak unarmored has more valut tbh

[remote sonnet]

Tac axe has high attack speed so you can stack up damage from talent and blessings really quick.

That can take care unarmoured. Vs carapace however, you would need more damage.

[steep flower]

Depends on the mark; I personally use Mk VII with Headtaker & Shred; You literally spam push attack - heavy - repeat. Agile is another good choice; it will make your fight longer cause dodge refreshes, Bromentum ain't the best - this ain't a horde clearing weapon; it is good at horde managing while you do dmg to it (Don't treait it as a main melee weapon tho; it ain't that potent)

But great for classes that want to have something to defend themselves againts hordes + great for book zealots due to high crit chance

[remote sonnet]

Unless you do a meme zealot build like me, tac axe with +5% crits to bleed the hell out of big armoured targets.

[steep flower]

As for perks die to the playstile i listed i unironically use crit chance & stamina/flak

[steep flower]

I have it; its an absolute meme

Up to 92% crit chance

[junior grail]

I would assume knife for Zealots not tacaxe?

[remote sonnet]

Mk7 shred headtaker, mood kindred.

[steep flower]

Knife just like tac axe needs blessing/perk/node combinations help to do massive dmg; tac axe just needs blessings & perks to be a good defensive weapon

You can slap tac axe on a wet that uses mainly range and you will not struggle againts a horde if ti gets to ya when you use for example exec stance

or for pure caster psiker with any staff; the tac axe will stop the chaff

and it has good mobility too so you won't fall behind your team if they ddecide to rush ahead (don't)

[remote sonnet]

Bromentum + slaughter is a very good heavy spam on mk2 tac axe.

[steep flower]

Tac axe does not have slaughterer

[remote sonnet]

Slaughter spree is a different blessing.

[junior grail]

Does Vet need anything specific to make Taxe work?

[steep flower]

no

[junior grail]

I've not touched Taxe in a looooong time, in fear for carpal tunnel hahaha

[steep flower]

Ah that one; too specific to be good imo

[remote sonnet]

If you run bromentum + slaughter spree, you don't even need any base crit for it to work.

[steep flower]

weakspot & a crit together on a weapon with not straight swipes

[remote sonnet]

Mk2 diagonal swing can hit heads easily.

[thorn lark]

what i mean is that you'll encounter more unarmored scabs than crushers, so the bp is easier to achieve with a crit + unarmored

[steep flower]

Might as well use shred & spree together for more consistency

[thorn lark]

tac axe is goated on psyker with sg + dd, it reaches heights zealot can only dream of

[unreal nova]

Oh yeah, Papa... Have you given that guy your Hellbore build? I just remembered the convo earlier.

[steep flower]

He has not responded to my 2 callouts

very sad

[thorn lark]

no, you're wrong, at least on psyker and zealot, bm has more value and i am pretty sure you can achieve the same with vet

[remote sonnet]

Tac axe works very well with no keystone vet. Though having WS is always a plus.

[thorn lark]

you can definitely horde clear a lot with the taxe

[unreal nova]

Oh. Ah well.

[thorn lark]

true

[remote sonnet]

My buddy used tac axe to clear h40 on the 2nd week of havic release.

[thorn lark]

Is your buddy named Heydan?

[remote sonnet]

Nope

[steep flower]

Not denying it; i prefer more synergistic approach to it; why would you not use shred on a crit based weapon to begin with

[thorn lark]

it depends if you have enough crit sources... on bp zealot i would use ht, on marty probably shred

on vet i have used both

[steep flower]

headtaker always; shred for bp sounds great so you get your invo running all the time

[thorn lark]

you already got it running all the time without shred tbh

[remote sonnet]

Slaughter gives you guaranteed crit, it does well with some build.

Like pairing with plasma/revolver

[thorn lark]

shred/ht slaughterspree with ws on a mk4 hm

[steep flower]

depends; in my experience when i had other book zealots with me and having such setups without shred they sometimes did not get the book fast enough; and that sometimes may someday spell doom on your team if you won't be able to protect them

[remote sonnet]

I think people don't give mk2 much love...

[thorn lark]

i was thinking about fotf not book tbh

[steep flower]

ahh ok

then ye

[thorn lark]

yeah wiith book i would think about it differently

the cooldown is sooo high

[steep flower]

lemme count

[thorn lark]

1 every 45s is not the same as 1 every 15 even with iod

[steep flower]

ofc

now

[thorn lark]

have you tried taxe psyker?

[steep flower]

With 3 cooldown redu on curios your book is on 52 sec the moment you cast it

[thorn lark]

it's wonderful

[thorn lark]

it's 60s base not 45??

[steep flower]

yes it is but 3x 4% cooldown reduction on curio perk does that

thats why cooldown redu is mandatory on any class, any build

it does that much

so; if you cast it with those you get 52 sec cooldown; a good strategy is to crit before you cast to get invo running as you cast; cooldown does not tick when you cast but invo is a buff that ticks your cooldwon by 2 secs per second so you end up usually with extra 6 sec upkeep so 52 - 6 = 46sec upon ending your channel

from that point lets see...

[thorn lark]

I did not think about that

[steep flower]

if, theoretically, you would activate your invo the next second yous top channeling so at 45 sec then it will go like this; invo is 2 secs per second + your base cooldown so each second you get 3 sec cooldown so 45 : 3 = 15sec

[thorn lark]

Well maybe not on a Crit build with IOD and FOTF. You get diminishing returns. 12% is meager compared to 200

[steep flower]

15 sec between casts of your book; remember your golden toughness lasts for 10 sec and this is when you are ALONE; if you have psiker with 10% aura cooldown redu & psykinetic aura perk (which every psiker has or atleast should be having) it goes even faster

[steep flower]

It does not work like that

[steep flower]

Invo is active cooldown buff; Cooldown reduction literally shaves off your ability cooldown off the cooldown the moment you cast yoru ability

so; for the foft

it has a base of 30 secs; with 3x 4% cooldown redu you have 26 sec cooldown

it might not mean much

but 4 secs is a long time and ppl died in less time than that

[thorn lark]

At that point it's a trade-off

[steep flower]

the two have no diminishing returns cause they work differently

[thorn lark]

And I can take other modifiers that j value more

[steep flower]

have both & thank me later

[thorn lark]

Well the more CD you have on an ability, the more impactful the CDR perk is.

[steep flower]

and if you have double charges for fotf (which you should); thats 4 secs always and it will pile on in a long run

[steep flower]

lmao no; invo is linear cooldown redu buff

[thorn lark]

CDR perk

On the curios

[steep flower]

ah yeah i read that wrongly my bad

still; 4 secs

ppl died in less

the more you cast the more you win/survive

[thorn lark]

Well. Unless you cast at the wrong time and you don't have your ability when it matters

[steep flower]

thats on you then

but ye; the info about invo before casting; you're welcome

[remote sonnet]

Meanwhile, my zealot runs around with shrouded and IJ. Push attack, bam cdr.

[unreal nova]

When you have crits and backstab cdr on relic and somehow gets random backstab kills fronting.

[solar monolith]

Hits from the side count as backstabs sometimes iirc

It's much more generous than you'd think lol

[unreal nova]

I'm not even dodging. I charged in and swung.

[balmy flume]

Jittery random AI enemy movements can lead to funny things like that

[umbral scaffold]

Could anyone give me some tips for using the plasma rifle? i struggle on when to use it, when to use aimed shots and such, some tips or a video recommendations would be awesome 🙂

[pallid jetty]

never use charged shot

[grand perch]

Here's the neat part about charged shots

You don't use them

Empty your brain and keep left clicking

[tiny valve]

I haven't played in a while but only time I'd use a charged shot was with the keystone extra damage ping on a headshot on a ogryn type enemy.

Don't even do that too often either

It's just funny to one shot them

Most of the time only use left click yeah, and have a good melee weapon cos that thing will not be very good if you're swarmed.

[umbral scaffold]

thanks! i understand the appeal now

[rigid mulch]

how the hell am i supposed to ever get on overwatch?

[dry cloak]

Eh used charged shot with weapon spec crit

[dry cloak]

Tou want the proper way or cheese it?

[rigid mulch]

both

i want to be informed

[dry cloak]

Proper way is shout/infiltrste with taunt ogryn and chorus zealot

Cheese way is train. You stay at the start they blow yourself up with plasma rifle

[rigid mulch]

wdym train?

[dry cloak]

Train mission

Because its short

[unreal nova]

You suicide by hanging or plasma boom, then have them carry you through without ever picking you up.

Can't get hit in melee if in perma rescue.

[remote sonnet]

Or 3x3 stamina curio and parry your way through the map.

Work surprisingly well in malice.

[rigid mulch]

would that also work if i killed myself when the exit valkyrie came to extract the team or does it have to be at the start?

actually, can in stay in the ship we spawn at the whole mission? or does that leave?

[unreal nova]

You do it before to ensure you never get hit in melee.

Staying in ship won't help, you need to extract out or be dead/rescue while they extract.

[rigid mulch]

ah

so i just overheat the plasma gun and have them leave me behind?
if i don't extract with them once dead does that count?

[unreal nova]

If need be, wait for you to die first so a random pox doesn't smack you when downed.

Not extracting or extracting with them doesn't matter.

It will count as long as you don't get hit at the start.

[remote sonnet]

I don't know if the true survivor fix also fix On the Overwatch.

[unreal nova]

I know hanging still works.

I just don't trust myself to solo carry, so yeah.

[tiny valve]

The cheese method I've seen people use is just jump off the map at the start so you're captured then just wait the mission out and instruct your teammates not to revive you at all.

Doesn't matter the map or method of death (unless it involves getting hit in melee) it's just that jumping off is probably easiest.

[unreal nova]

Thing is, doing that in pubs may just piss people off. Not everyone wants to play 3 man.

[tiny valve]

Myself I just used shouty

[tiny valve]

I helped a guy out with it in this discord cos he was trying to do the make every shot count one and then we were talking about other ones and someone that was with us recommended that method. But yeah don't do it in pubs make sure it's with a group that are ok with you doing it

ALso if you do it in pubs they're likely to revive you.

[terse idol]

Don't cheese it

[grand perch]

[mossy oasis]

guys, does the -90% threat when leaving infiltrade ACTUALLY do anything??

like what does it do, enemies target you less? Is that even worth taking, ever?

i think id rather have twinned blast.

What do yall say

[radiant chasm]

yes

[hollow ibex]

It's the best sub node

[radiant chasm]

it's basically more invisibility for everything but poxwalkers

[mossy oasis]

seriously? I dont see many builds taking it

[radiant chasm]

unless you are massively away from allies with no way for them to generate any aggro

[radiant chasm]

many players suck at the game

[hollow ibex]

Where are you seeing these builds lol

[mossy oasis]

gameslantern...

[grand perch]

100% the best subnode

[hollow ibex]

Oh yeah that makes sense

[grand perch]

Oh is it time to post squad leader build again

[radiant chasm]

games lantern is terribl

[mossy oasis]

so what about overwatch? Is that a good or a bad node?

i would assume its okay, lets you hoard an extra charge when you need it, also allows you to bank the cooldown and stuff

i assume its good?

[radiant chasm]

it's good

[mossy oasis]

so i guess when im taking infiltrate im taking the -90% threat, the damage obviously, and the extra charge.

[wild vortex]

Ah yes, the website with zero way to verify how the build actually plays and how skilled or not the build creator even is at the game

[mossy oasis]

Like always?

[wild vortex]

[grand perch]

It's good but it's an extra point and the additional CD can really hurt. I've stopped using it eventually

[mossy oasis]

im not automatically assuming the build is good, i just saw the majority of builds not taking it all im saying

[mossy oasis]

it seems like a crutch, and if it is a crutch ill take it

i was asking because i wanted to cut off a point somewhere for twinned blast... is that node a must have if you are investing in grenades?

The 20% to throw an extra one?

[grand perch]

With frags? Worth it on grenade centric builds

Getting a twinned blast on improved frags clears the room for half the price basically

[wild vortex]

Twinned Blast is great on grenadier setup or if you love gambling

[surreal gust]

Looking at you “best vet build” with a double bleed knife with no dump stat

[grand perch]

Outside of grenadier builds you typically take grenade regen and move on

[mossy oasis]

well, define a "grenade centric" build... like if took every other grenade related upgrade (except the ammo refill trash thing)

is that a grenade centric build then?

[grand perch]

Yes

[hollow ibex]

yeah i hate it

[grand perch]

If you have frags, and not kraks or smoke

[hollow ibex]

i had so much of a better time when i stopped taking double charges

[grand perch]

I don't think they really profit from it

[wild vortex]

That + Bistol with Lethal Proximity

[faint beacon]

give me a second

[grand perch]

I actually take improved field kits on my grenadier build for emergency carpet bomb purposes

[faint beacon]

this is the most grenade spam on Vet you can get, you need Lethal Prox on Bistol to make it more effective

Actually shit let me change the upper pathing

[hollow ibex]

no field improv

literally unplayable

[faint beacon]

Forget One Motion is huge for grenade swap speed

[normal bay]

Couldn't even fit WS

Skill issue

Git gud

[faint beacon]

Grenade Build doesn't need Keystones if I'll be brutally honest

[mossy oasis]

i never new lethal proximity has synergy with any vet skills

fascinating

[faint beacon]

Unless you're building for your BP to actually hit harder

[hollow ibex]

tbf i think it's worth because of BP breakpoints

they're so ass

[faint beacon]

I'd take FT for Bolt Pistol

But look this is more of an Auric Mael/Auric build

if it was havoc i would've put a shit ton more thought into that build

[faint beacon]

https://medal.tv/games/warhammer-40000-darktide/clips/iqGAqYZrwsxo-_dGh?invite=cr-MSx5QVIsMTA3NDAxNTcz

(day 1 lethal prox testing)

[grand perch]

I use ft on my grenadier build it's great

[faint beacon]

we didn't take Grenade Tinkerer, but they synergize with each other

First clip is without Lethal prox, second is with @mossy oasis

as you can see, its a huge difference

[mossy oasis]

huh, fascinating

[mossy oasis]

so this is useless for kraks?

or does it make it a bigger radius also? Because then it might be actually useful for crusher packs.

[faint beacon]

Basically

it does increase its blast radius

but like

Kraks are meant to say "fuck you" specifically to Carapace enemies or bosses

Lethal Prox is banking on Explosion Radius

so shredders are your best option

[tropic notch]

I’d rather take shredder than krak

[faint beacon]

Spamming out like 2-3 Shredders that instantly come back cause of demo team

basically makes up for a Krak or 2

[tropic notch]

The more you learn about the game the worse kraks become

Kinda

Bulwark spam is the only time I love them

[tropic notch]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/580240175632744450/1311833000874348594/caption-6.gif

[mossy oasis]

thats the thing though, kraks have such a small explosion radius that you are LUCKY if you kill ONE crusher... if it increases the explosion radius semi significantly then its surely worth taking!!

[faint beacon]

well seeing its a 25% to its small radius, its not really a massive increase vs lets say like

shredders

which have a big one

so that 25% of it added on

is fucking HUGE

[mossy oasis]

I always thought (and still think) demolition team isnt a genuinely good keystone though

its 5% that doesent add up, its a static 5% no?

[grand perch]

demo team is absolutely bonkers on higher diffs

[faint beacon]

If you haven't played Auric Damnation/maelstrom you see its value decrease

[mossy oasis]

its not like "ok 5% didnt proc on this kill, now its 10% for two kills" its just a static 5%

[faint beacon]

Keep in mind

You or your team

you're constantly rolling the dice basically

[mossy oasis]

i have played it, it just, idk it never felt that good. Maybe i just didnt notice how many nades it gave me back...

[viscid sparrow]

I use kraks regardless of build (I take shredders if I wanna use ammo aura on a shotgun build for example), but then again I never use Bistol...

[faint beacon]

Spam nades into mixxed hordes

aka if a horde pulls up with like

Elites

spam them out

[viscid sparrow]

but would it be better than spending 2 points that could go into something else, just so I can get passive nade regen...?

[wild vortex]

Shredders are just better

[tiny valve]

Shredders are superior but you know the best grenade? Smoke

[grand perch]

its sort of true. only exception is if you need to path through kraks to save points

[faint beacon]

I'd argue smokes are on par with Kraks

[wild vortex]

Smokes are pretty good yeah but Shredders are more versatile

[faint beacon]

Shredders just tramp both Kraks and Smokes

Smokes are literally

psyker dome

on demand

[tiny valve]

I've never used smokes ngl

[wild vortex]

Don't say it out loud though, some Tanner disciple will show up to school us all

[tiny valve]

I tried kraks then went straight back to shredders

[faint beacon]

And I will call them stupid

I will die on the hill that is smokes have use

[normal bay]

Everyone says Kraks suck until they have to clutch against 6 ogryn with a DB

[grand perch]

tanner disciples

[normal bay]

I enjoy the convenience

[wild vortex]

Kraks are ok, but in that situation Shredders are still better

[grand perch]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1046912126746374274/1343214814322757762/Warhammer_40-000-_Darktide_-_2025-02-23_14-33-41.mp4?ex=67cd9947&is=67cc47c7&hm=2552cfbc1bd3428dd3dd4b02c193e718bbd05d5368569fc746ca78c5f452ab14&

having twinned blast trigger juuust right is so satisfying

[faint beacon]

All the Blitzs on veteran aren't bad at all anyone who says they're bad is- ermmm special

They all have certain uses

just the issue is Shredders literally cover everything so its massively powerful compared to Kraks/Smokes

its more a Shredder issue

instead of it being the other two

[hollow ibex]

tbf shredders aren't great against ogryns

[normal bay]

Ultimately, maybe shredders are better on the best builds. But kraks serve their purpose

[faint beacon]

They usually put them below half which is still great

puts them very easily at kill blows or staggers them if they're bulwarks

Also yes Kraks are still great

too much carapace? time to whip out the fuck off button

[wild vortex]

Good part about Kraks is their fire and forget nature vs carapacr

You just throw and ignore them to go kill something else

Knowing full well that whatever you threw it against will cease to exist

[hollow ibex]

yeah it's mainly when there's bulk bulwarks or some shit

that i really appreciate kraks

shredders are just totally insufficient sometimes with ogryn blobs, if you don't have a strong anti-unyielding/carapace weapon

[grand perch]

dunno, ogryn blobs will not be killed by kraks either unless they really bunch up

rather throw them all around and bring them to very low health with frags

[hollow ibex]

well 2 frags only bring them to half health, if you have tinkerer and they're in the initial explosion radius

getting bulwarks to group up for kraks is pretty easy

prioritizing kills is more important on bulwarks given that well... they have a huge shield

between bringing 6 of them to half health each, vs killing 3 of them. killing 3 of them is far more helpful

[mossy oasis]

@faint beacon BTW question, do i have to have the bolter equipped, like hold it in my hand for the 25% explosion radius bonus? or is it enough to just be equipped in on my character.

[faint beacon]

its passive

so you dont need too

[mossy oasis]

epicc

[wild vortex]

Grenadier Vet is wild amounts of fun

[wheat stratus]

bulwarks is def the #1 reason to appreciate krak nades 😌

also sweet is the fact you can throw krak anywhere in their proximity and it homes into them

[acoustic oxide]

True in isolation but in a team of four, other people are attacking those same Bulwarks.
(I don’t think krak is bad but I find frag has more utility).

[hollow ibex]

well if you've got your whole team next to you, most things aren't a threat

and yeah frag def has more overall utility

[junior grail]

Now if only Smokes had the same treatment

[terse idol]

What treatment do you mean?

[grand perch]

theyd need a little extra for most people to use them

like maybe a combat stim component that applies 1 combat stim effect while youre in smoke or sth

TDR would be neat too

or melee enemies would be slowed. so many ideas

[remote sonnet]

The only build that I have Krak is boss hunter.

Smoke, I don't like it as much because if I have grenade regen, I can kite and kill horde quickly with frag.

[tame lodge]

The Hookah

Æææ

[charred mist]

do wounds give you more hp?

[formal ice]

No

Gives you more chances of not dying when down

[charred mist]

thought so

[hollow ibex]

and they also make green stims less useful

wound curios are bad on everything except martyrdom zealot

[patent prairie]

For the keystone focus target, what is redirect fire in simple terms?

[tall torrent]

Kill gold enemy, your team now gets up to +7.5%dmg

[patent prairie]

Cheers

[hollow ibex]

(you should take it)

[patent prairie]

(whys that?)

[hollow ibex]

becauase it's a very very very easy flat damage boost to your entire team for literally just playing the game

[inland orchid]

i like taking it since it encourages you to build up the keystone's stacks

rather than just going autopilot and marking anything that moves as fast as possible

plus the obvious "oh hey we do more dmg for playing the game"

[patent prairie]

True fair enough cheers lads

[tall torrent]

No

[inland orchid]

that doesnt mean my way is right, it just means thats how i play

[tall torrent]

If anything the entire keystone encourages tagging many things as fast as possible

[uncut pebble]

Pretty sure getting a marked kill refreshes your timer on max stacks.

[tall torrent]

Besides the 8 stacks modifier which is abysmal

[inland orchid]

what timer?

the keystone's recharge time?

[uncut pebble]

Like, you kill something that you tag with 5 stacks, then the redirect fire starts ticking down. Killing something else that you tag restarts redirect fire's timer.

Could be wrong and it's just placebo, ofc.

[thorn lark]

i tag for other people to kill, i must defeat my prey fairly

[remote sonnet]

The keystone stacks passively quite fast, I don't see know what you mean by encouraging building stack.

[inland orchid]

theres plenty of enemies to mark so forgive me for making it seem slow by my explaination

[inland orchid]

see this is why i could never make a guide

dont got the brainpower for it

[tall torrent]

just read what I wrote

[inland orchid]

i did

[tall torrent]

there's a 2 stack refresh mechanic

[inland orchid]

doesnt mean i aint gonna be still wrong in my judgement friend

i appreicate u showing me the info tho

[tall torrent]

so there's no reason to build stacks

[inland orchid]

i still sadly will due to habits

[tall torrent]

tag, kill within 2s, repeat

[inland orchid]

oh so THATS where i fall off, the kill time

no worries lads this all equaled to me having a skill issue

cuz when i try that it doesnt go so hot

ty again tho for trying to enlighten me

[arctic rampart]

kill time is just your weapons and talents and where you are hitting the target. IMO if your kill time is as bad as you are implying it's probably a function of you using really bad weapons. easy fix

[inland orchid]

na im using plasma G, it's me thats the issue here

not my weapons

if i cant hit those heads my big blue circle creator dont do much

[arctic rampart]

plasma has some perk & blessing & talent preferences that make a big differences in breakpoints. also, it's a significantly better weapon if you hipfire it and never use the charge.

[inland orchid]

i havent used charge shot since i blew myself up in the past so dont worry on that front

booting up d-tide to show off my crappy plas shooter

[arctic rampart]

T.dmg (Unarmored / Elite) T.dmg (Flak / Maniac) Gets Hot! + Rising Heat / Gloryhunter / Focused Cooling OR Blaze Away + Optimised Cooling

Precision Strikes
Superiority Complex
Bring it Down!
Redirect Fire or Fire Team

[inland orchid]

heres my baby

[arctic rampart]

Yeah get shattering impact off asap and replace it with rising heat

[tall torrent]

yea perks are wrong

[inland orchid]

aye appreicate the feedback

[uncut pebble]

There is only one enemy you should ever considering charging for, and thats oneshotting a reaper.

[inland orchid]

na, thats legit how i blew myself up

[uncut pebble]

Everything else, you just wanna hipfire for.

[inland orchid]

being too greedy trying to go for a reaper kill

[uncut pebble]

Lmao.

That's why I said you should consider it.

If you'd explode, don't do that.

[inland orchid]

my considering of it CAUSED the situation

aint much time to process the consideration during the heat of combat

[uncut pebble]

The risk you took was calculated, but man, you are bad at math.

[inland orchid]

with the amount of variables with this said math, i dont blame myself

[arctic rampart]

this game requires you to put your focus into positioning and dodging you don't want to add calculations that get you killed if you can avoid it

[inland orchid]

hats off to anybody that memorized burn/bleed dmg tables

couldnt be bothered myself

[arctic rampart]

you want to play a game to have fun? pretty sure that's heresey. if this was the zealot channel they'd be foaming at the mouth

[inland orchid]

dang so the shattering impact's support bait

considerin its no where on guide

[hollow ibex]

shattering impact's basically only used on chaxe (memes) or bolter (typically for zealot)

[arctic rampart]

yep. I kind of like elites with gets hot, but it depends on your talent setup

having maniac (etc) live with 1hp is really bad, if u see that you know u probably fucked up

[inland orchid]

that does remind me to try making a meme build on my zealot involving the chain weapons

a beta classic of "Charge at my problems and hack em down"

[inland orchid]

i'd lose my mind if i had the hp bars mod and saw a karker survive my plasma headshot

with a CRUMB of hp

[arctic rampart]

well it'll happen with plasma, since the best perks scale with heat

sorry, blessings.

[inland orchid]

no worries with all these terms i dont blame u for mixing them up

[grand perch]

1st burster doesnt trigger and 2nd one ignores the push so my teammate pushes it into me

this game sometimes

[formal ice]

Peak duo

[fading kayak]

https://tenor.com/view/dog-blown-away-blown-back-gif-22009589

[fading kayak]

I got swarmed with three pox busters successfully pushing two back and a third silent (Obese Fish please fix audio bug) poxbuster came out of nowhere and exploded and caused a massive explosion all three poxbusters killing me in the process few nights ago

[sharp epoch]

skill issue

[gaunt anchor]

Reco lasgun with onslaught and dumdum is so funny against beasts

[uncut pebble]

You'll instantly piss it off. Great way of having it chase you.

(bosses change targets when you deal enough damage to them, dh is the only exception)

[tame lodge]

Remember to yell "bad doggie" as it chases you

[gaunt anchor]

Don't gotta worry if it's turned to mush 😎

[full schooner]

Even Nurgle wouldn't stoop so low to make such a thing

[formal mountain]

NURGLE BEASTTTTTTTTTT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/mrbeast-ytpmv-rap-battle-squid-game-squid-game-vs-mrbeast-gif-25491394

[patent prairie]

For the plasma gun should I get Focused cooling? If not then what should I get for it?

[tall torrent]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1046912126746374274/1348002086515769344/Screenshot_2025-03-08_133842.png?ex=67cde046&is=67cc8ec6&hm=bb7196a3137f97c5b76a460931768804a002f015cf85fed90ed2b599c2439838&

[loud belfry]

https://tenor.com/view/bvndit-dead-chat-dead-group-chat-lol-gif-26075659

[remote sonnet]

Yes, the grass are growing, someone has to touch them.

[bronze trout]

No new weapons, no skill tree update, its a dead class really

[tall torrent]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/985983134275366943/1348071747207041024/Desktop_2025.03.08_-_18.14.54.04.mp4?ex=67ce2126&is=67cccfa6&hm=277ace211146446c730d580a071d7c2615ead75a4fe914bb53e3890220fefd9b&

[tame lodge]

It's not because they spammed VoC

So vet is untouchable atm

Simple as

[south thistle]

Vet is best class

But I can’t find a perfect weapon rn

[uncut pebble]

It's still objectively better than zealout. :)

Tac awareness alone is super broken, like beyond iod level of broken.

[tall torrent]

u got it twisted

IoD is the better scaling one

conditionally easier to achieve, better scaling in vast majority of situations

just because zealot has fewer build paths doesn't mean zealot's existing kit isn't absurdly overpowered

[hollow ibex]

so in other words... we need vet buffs

[bronze trout]

Ayyy

[vernal trench]

we gota get u havoc forged

[bronze trout]

I was falling out of darktide when the update came out and it was a pain to get groups together

[surreal gust]

what's the dump stat on the helbore

[bronze trout]

But maybe tomorrow

[pseudo fiber]

Stability

[surreal gust]

what blessings and perks should I use

[pseudo fiber]

That kinda depends check the guide in pins

[uncut pebble]

I do agree that 200% cooldown speed is a bit overtuned but you've got to consider the abilities in question.

10s timer to oneshot anything that's not ogryn shaped, and sometimes things that are, depending on your weapon.

30s timer that gets 6s shaved off each time you kill a specialist but the ability can save your whole team every time you use it and grants massive buffs.

The true answer here is to rework tactical awareness and reign in iod.

[mellow cobalt]

what causes a burster to just not trigger like that

its so annoying

[uncut pebble]

Iod could be dropped to 150% or 100%, easily, and still maintain its functionality.

I would personally rework tactical awareness to provide 2 different buffs, one being 50% cooldown speed for 4 seconds on elite kills, the other being 50% cooldown speed for 6 seconds on specialist kills, and they stack with each other.

Then increase the timer on voc's cooldown.

Or at the very least, have duty and honor (gold toughness node) increase the timer.

Thoughts? @tall torrent and you too @faint beacon

This would, 1, remove the instant reset that tactical awareness can sometimes provide, see any "waves of x" modifier, and 2, grant vet some cooldown speed when killing elites so they can scale better into endgame content.

[faint beacon]

@uncut pebble If we're gonna go by the mindset of we're giving all classes like 2x speed modifiers instead of flat time removal

then its probably better to make it % based for Tac Aware

and swap Till Death and Duty's timers

aka the revive shout should be the stock shorter time

Duty should be increased no matter what by 15

imo

VOC should have a flat 40 Second CD no matter what

and Duty should bump it up to 55

[uncut pebble]

I think base voc is fine with a 30s timer.

But the gold toughness absolutely needs an increased duration slapped onto it, with how gold toughness works.

Also, unless I'm somehow mistaken, tac awareness is the only cdr that isn't either percentage based or a percentage increase to cooldown speed.

[faint beacon]

I personally prefer they rework duty to just be a TDR for the team

[uncut pebble]

I'm gonna go double check bruiser on ogryn to make sure I'm not insane.

[faint beacon]

its the ONLY

CD based thing vet has

kinda like Ogryn with Bruiser?

[uncut pebble]

Ok yeah it's the only one that does a flat amount of time and isn't percentage based at all.

Bruiser is 4% in live when you or any ally kill an elite, when the ogryn update drops it'll be 100% faster cooldown for 3s when you or any ally kill an elite.

I'm just thinking that my suggestion for tac awareness to get a rework assists vet in endgame scaling while removing some core issues of the talent.

[tall torrent]

Stack with each other without cap?

[uncut pebble]

No, working like iod so getting a new kill refreshes the timer.

Stack with each other like you can get the elite one and the specialist one at the same time.

[tall torrent]

Fair

But still not as good as IoD lol

[uncut pebble]

True, that's why I said iod needs reigned in.

[tall torrent]

Even if u nerf IoD to 100%

It’s still not as good as IoD lol

[uncut pebble]

Yeah it's still gonna be quite strong.

[tall torrent]

Kill-based bonus is just not as good as hit-based bonus

[uncut pebble]

But tbf, still gotta consider the abilities themselves when considering cdr talents.

10s "fuck you" to one guy vs 30s "save everyone"

And with elites being 50% for 4s, you'd have it up almost as much as an iod zealout would have theirs up in endgame content.

[tall torrent]

VoC itself needs nerfs

[uncut pebble]

Like, if you can't kill an elite every 4s in aurics or havocs, then you either broke spawns, you're staying in one place too long, or you're dying every 2s.

[tall torrent]

It’s less related to tac awareness

[uncut pebble]

This is also true.

Hence why Gale and I think it needs to have a longer duration with the golden toughness node.

I should be a playtester.

(this will never happen)

[latent parcel]

[uncut pebble]

I'm just of the opinion that all cooldown reduction options should be strong without invalidating anybody else or any mechanics in the game.

Like, I don't much care that psyk aura is a pretty low %, because psykers whole kit revolves around disabling certain parts of the game. EE gunkers turn shooters off, smite turns off melee elites, etc.

However, terrible cdr options, like martyrs purpose, or overtuned ones, like iod, need to be taken back to the drawing board because they are either utterly worthless or they simply make you too strong.

[tall torrent]

Nah

[uncut pebble]

(it was a joke, sir)

[void dragon]

crusher dies > krag triggers

[lavish lotus]

You aren't krakking right if they die before the grenade

[faint beacon]

me realizing at 12 we gotta set our clocks ahead an hour

Losing an hour of sleep :(((

[hollow ibex]

Fuck

I guess I'll need to sleep early

Well, that's what I'd do if I was a responsible person

[tall torrent]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/925855860557746267/1148583910691836006/JMYS0W5RDOL7U41RPH.gif

[vernal harbor]

I can’t believe the lasgun hit registry bug isn’t even on the radar

maybe no one ever reported it

[uncut pebble]

It's not just lasgun.

Happens with laspistol too.

[faint beacon]

And Vigils

I just

try to refuse to believe it exists till path subtly reminds me

I just say im ass and get better at the dogshit hit registry

[uncut pebble]

I have laughed at you and said "you missed" as I chastise the gunner you just 180'd on, thinking you killed it.

:3

[faint beacon]

You'll literally see

blood

fly out of the fuckers head

he takes 0 damage

and just doesn't care

https://tenor.com/view/scorsese-absolute-cinema-meme-gif-9523375912274476782

[radiant chasm]

it's not really a bug with the guns

it's just hitreg/desync

and las weapons are the most obvious when it happens

[junior grail]

Is it just me or are inf lasguns just... sorta ignored in high difficulty?

[radiant chasm]

basically, recons are much easier

they aren't bad imo, it's just, takes a special person to use em'

[vernal harbor]

they arent bad but every weakspot crit that doesnt register is a very serious blow

[radiant chasm]

i may not see many inflas users, but the ones who are taking it are all at least competent if not good

yee

[junior grail]

Ngl I used inflasguns with FullAuto mod but Recons still feel easier

[vernal harbor]

no doubt

[uncut pebble]

It only hit his brain, nurgle doesn't need that.

[rocky jacinth]

the issue with inflas is that the hipfire is abysmal, it has no punch through and it literally doesn't work as a panic button unlike plasma, boltgun, recon etc.

it's also taxed with talents so while it's really good in its niche as a long range head clicker, you got plasma over here that fills the same role
but can also do a lot more and with no point tax

[hollow ibex]

well ilas is much more efficient than plasma

but yeah ilas has a lot of issues rn

it's just annoying to build for

[rocky jacinth]

I'd agree if it had punch through

plasma just plows through packs of dudes in a few shots

[marsh shard]

YEAH DCLAW BUFFS INCOMING

[rocky jacinth]

i did try it in havoc and it does respectable damage even to pus hardened so it felt really good for cleaning up shooters and gunners

but it's a meme build when you really should just get shout, keep the yellow up and simply run at the enemy instead

because if we're gonna talk efficiency, nothing beats sword, especially with the ammo penalty active

[hollow ibex]

hsword is where it's at if you want sword

[grand perch]

dont know really, i think its because the were targeting some other guy and dont change their target to you fast enough

[grand perch]

yeah dclaw buffs dont include a straight damage buff, which i think they kinda needed?

hsword is like dclaw with actual damage but no parry

[hollow ibex]

yeah

i mean if dclaw got a flak adm buff it'd be a lot better

[bronze trout]

Is mk IIb still the best infantry lasgun?

[grand perch]

p much yeah

[bronze trout]

feels weaker then I remember it

[remote sonnet]

Oh yeah, huge update, not a single thing changed for the Shotgun...

Shotgun is a non lethal crowd control weapon now.

The slug shot in havoc is just a rubber shot.

[pure kayak]

I've been running combat blade/bolt pistol currently. Probably not optimal but I'm not gonna not use a boltgun in a 40k game

Also haven't tried anything beyond difficulty level 5 yet, any tips?

[bronze trout]

I dont think there is any big secret for stepping into the harder difficulties, just gotta keep familiarizing yourself with game. As vet your generally the specialist and gunner killer and you start seeing crazy amounts of them.

[orchid hemlock]

Get better

[surreal gust]

5000 gunners

[bronze trout]

Getting used to breakpoints for knowing when an enemy is going to die before you even hit it keeps you moving from target to target quickly

I do recommend double grenade regen as vet as you'll generally be dealing with endless hordes and they give you a lot of breathing room and you can almost always have one ready

[pure kayak]

I've been using krak grenades for the most part. Might have to change my build for the higher difficulties to be honest.

[remote sonnet]

Auric is mostly the same from my experience. The rest is just know the map, know how to play safe yet quick.

Using krak is fine as long as you set a purpose for the rest of your loadout.

[bronze trout]

You do run into giant crusher packs and people do like running krak but personally I find the shredder grenades are a far more common use case then krak

But yeah like Deinocamo says be sure to keep moving

[surreal gust]

Yeah I prefer shredders, I can kill a crusher no problem

[pure kayak]

Yeah I've been watching Mr Unc or something like that on YouTube. Dude plays havoc 40 and has tons of videos of him carrying solo when everyone else is dead. He never stops moving

[surreal gust]

Havoc 40 you should never stop

[remote sonnet]

Best is still to try out option yourself. Tweak and improve as you go.

[pure kayak]

Honestly tempted to try a horde clearing ranged weapon since I already have kraks and combat knife is more for the mobility than anything else

Just been using a bolt pistol basically since lvl10 on my vet

Also like the duelling sword and devil's claw but duelling sword feels so cheesy with how powerful it is

[remote sonnet]

Oh, if you are using bolt pistol, you get use the blessing Lethal Proximity and Shredder.

Lethal Proximity makes Shredder radius bigger.

[pure kayak]

Damn, I'll have to try that out. I already have shredder but can't remember the other blessing. I think it's the less hipfire spread one because it makes it easy to snipe specialists without having to use the swaying ads

[remote sonnet]

That's how many knife veterans run.

[orchid hemlock]

The way I play Vet is simple

I'm a specialist killer with my gun and I go slaughter everything else with my melee

[surreal gust]

I kill enemies with melee then use my minigun rifle to spray into the crowd like its a tower defense game

[orchid hemlock]

Vet's most powerful value in high level content is being able to take out high priority targets before they become a problem for the team

[pure kayak]

Been really enjoying vet, to be honest. Thought it'd be the most boring and vanilla class but it's really enjoyable. Psyker got really dull stunlocking enemies with smite and ogryn feels a little bit underpowered

Haven't done zealot yet though

[orchid hemlock]

Psyker to me is braindead boring

💀

Zealot is also boring, but it's useful for hyper farming since I can speed run

Vet is fun when you know what you are doing, because you provide soo much value to your team

[pure kayak]

Feels good to clutch with a perk on one of my curios that boosts revive/help speed as well as the perk that helps with it too

Can very easily pick someone up even when a horde's right behind you

[orchid hemlock]

When I play Vet I feel like I'm cycling between scenerios

Either I use my gun to take out a key target, helping the front like kill the horde, or using the nades/shout to give space for the team

[grand perch]

cowboy revolver in maelstrom missions with extra monstrosities gets stupid numbers

[kind scarab]

Tbf regular revolver is great for stupid numbers in terms of just denying specials/elites faster than most people realise they're there if you're unhinged enough

[grand perch]

sure but they dont do the funneh boss delete as well

[kind scarab]

Definitely one of my top three weapons ingame.

As much as I adore the funny boss delete. I still find myself drawn back to the mini pocket sniper.

I really enjoy emptying the revolver and seeing a whole feed of crushers disappearing

[remote sonnet]

You don't have to use smite to play psyker and have fun with that class.

[orchid hemlock]

Revolver prob is one of the best Vet guns in the game

[kind scarab]

Don't think it's arguable that it isn't tbf.

[wild vortex]

Just use a different setup for Psyker. It has actual builds and choices

My favorite is just Voidblast + Dome

[remote sonnet]

I don't even use dome outside of high havoc.

[kind scarab]

Dome effectively turns the game back into vermintide. Coupled with a block build on psyker and you're effectively a better (tank) ogryn.

[pure kayak]

True

Btw, why can't I find the revolver that has ADS on vet? I can only see the quickdraw one

Or is it exclusive to zealot or something?

[kind scarab]

Change the weapon mark

First is hipfire cowboy, second is sharpshooter

[uncut pebble]

If zarona revolver was zealout exclusive, vet mains would've burned down fatshark hq ages ago lmao.

Anyway, revolver is sold from brunt as the agri model, you have to manually swap to zarona in your inventory.

[pure kayak]

I wish I could react to comments atm because durr, that's so obvious. Can't believe I didn't think of it

[grand perch]

[kind scarab]

In your defense. I spent yesterday scrolling through my inventory only to realise the mastery update changed my revolvers mark somehow without me noticing.

[remote sonnet]

The Agri revolver very fun for zealot and melee psyker, but I can't bring myself to use it on Vet.

[iron marten]

The one time I used agri was me picking up 12 small and 5 large ammo in the run lol

[kind scarab]

Agri revolver is fun for a few reasons, but I can't use it on most of my builds without it feeling like I'm landing limbshots

Namely due to not oneshotting everything.

[uncut pebble]

There's a fun but cursed way of running it on vet and it only works because they allow you to draw melee with exe stance still running now.

[remote sonnet]

I run roulette + Sustaining salvo, buff from zealot/DD Psyker allow me to fan the whole 5 rounds and kill pretty much anything.

I run that on my hatchet shrouded zealot.

[arctic rampart]

power sword IMO

[kind scarab]

I hate the roulette nerf they made ages ago. I miss reloading one bullet at a time in my revolver.

[arctic rampart]

kind of want weapon specialist with it though feels kind of clunky without

[uncut pebble]

@remote sonnet try this with rashad and agrivolver.

[iron marten]

A boss killer revolver build, unfathomably based

[uncut pebble]

Not sure if superiority complex actually changes any breakpoints, but if it doesn't, you could do rending strikes instead.

[uncut pebble]

Not necessarily "boss killer" but definitely the elite nuker 9000.

[arctic rampart]

AFAIKT superiority complex always changes breakpoints lul

isn't it additive 15%

[uncut pebble]

I have no idea.

Vet math scares my tiny zealout brain.

All I know is bonk.

[arctic rampart]

the talents are usually additive instead of multiplicative which means its way better

[uncut pebble]

If it does, cool. If it doesn't, change to rending strikes.

[kind scarab]

Tbf revolver does so much innate damage that you'd really only need superiority if you're not landing headshots iirc

And if you're landing crits, rending doesn't really matter.

[uncut pebble]

Could also change ogryn outlines to ranged chaff outlines if you find maintaining exe stance to be hard.

[arctic rampart]

I like the weapon specialist node on that spec for revolver auto reloading it

cause gdamn I hate reloading with revolver

reloading with plasma is easier lul

[uncut pebble]

Rending always matters, that's how you delete ogryns.

[remote sonnet]

It does look cursed.

[kind scarab]

Maybe on agri

[uncut pebble]

On both revolvers lol.

[remote sonnet]

On Agri, you definitely want rendering.

[grand perch]

youd think its very important but loads of weapons dont hit new cara or unyielding BPs with rending added

[kind scarab]

But with my standard one pretty sure I don't grab the 10% node and I still one-shot them

[uncut pebble]

BIS for zarona is surgical hand cannon, BIS for agri is crucian hand cannon.

[arctic rampart]

I never see anyone using IAG anymore. I always just maelstrom or random queue though. Did it just take a back seat cause its too good?

[kind scarab]

Surge handcannon my beloved

[uncut pebble]

Just queueing into nubs that don't know how good it is ig.

Agri inf autogun is unfathomably based.

[arctic rampart]

I'm asking cause I don't actually know, never gave it a fair shake.. I just like higher tech weapon stuff more

[remote sonnet]

All 3 IAR are good as hell.

[uncut pebble]

I dont much like columnus or vraks.

Vraks shoots way too fast so I wind up missing half my shots.

[arctic rampart]

agri is the one with way less ammo?

[remote sonnet]

Though, too ammo hungry for something like havoc.

[uncut pebble]

The heavy hitting, slow fire rate one.

[arctic rampart]

thats the one I remember liking.. dont laugh.. in beta lul

[uncut pebble]

I like it because I can generally oneshot chaff shooters and still be able to mow down elites.

[arctic rampart]

I got absolutely wrecked one match by some other veteran using IAG and I was like dang I'm missing out. But then I got like 4 shotgun vets in a row after and my epeen recovered

[uncut pebble]

Anyway, the idea with that agrivovler setup is to get melee kills on chaff, draw revolver and dumpster an elite, then repeat because you load 2 bullets with always prepared so you can qq and get your bullets back.

Could even forego rashad and take hsword instead.

[arctic rampart]

why do people like hsword it seems pretty mundane to me

you can get a lightsaber

[remote sonnet]

With IJ for zealot and DD for psyker, you can fan crushers in less than 1 second.

[uncut pebble]

Do you want to behead 4 dreg ragers in one swing?

[arctic rampart]

I can do that with my psword brutal momentum

[uncut pebble]

There's an even more cursed setup for agrivolver on zealout but I fear this knowledge will destroy the earth.

[arctic rampart]

maybe it would take 2 swings, but w/e

[kind scarab]

Alternatively, grab yourself claw and parry their heads off.

[grand perch]

i like using this on cowboy revolver, for funneh boss deleting purposes

[uncut pebble]

Ok, now what if you didn't have to turn your sword on and you could just do it?

[arctic rampart]

nah, I like it powered

[kind scarab]

Trickshot, respectable

[dry cloak]

i run similiar revolver on my zealot

[remote sonnet]

Me in the corner with Dclaw... Don't look at me.

[uncut pebble]

Hsword just beheads shit. The only thing it remotely struggles with is carapace.

[kind scarab]

Now you're talking my language funnyman

[dry cloak]

but with carapce instead of crit chance and with run.n.gun

[uncut pebble]

Oh dw I like dclaw too, but it's a shame they didn't buff the flak adm with the patch notes.

[arctic rampart]

now the one I mgiht get behind is chain axe 4 that thing seemed to hit notably harder than rashad

[grand perch]

on zealot i think i would as well, no exec stance to give a little extra accuracy

[uncut pebble]

Mfw one single bucket head eats 3 vanguard heavies:

[kind scarab]

Dclaw probably would have stayed my favourite melee if they hadn't taken dueling sword off psyker and put it in everyone.

[dry cloak]

its my crusher and boss nuster i pair with my hsword 6

[kind scarab]

My ass can't stop pulling a saltzpyre with it and the revolver.

[uncut pebble]

Chaxe requires weapon spec, not for swing speed, but for dodges. That's the only issue with it.

[remote sonnet]

Hsword is over all stronger than Dclaw though. The special also stun and deals ok damage vs armour.

[arctic rampart]

I would always intentionally get stuck with chain axe cause its too fun

so I ahd to stop using it

[kind scarab]

The chain axe?

The one that had a horrible animation that locks you in place?

[remote sonnet]

I can only play Chain axe zealot.

[arctic rampart]

what do you pair with it? laspistol?

bolt pistol?

[kind scarab]

The axe is probably my least favourite weapon in the whole game tbh.

[remote sonnet]

There is the light shredding/normal heavy, and the other is the reverse.

[kind scarab]

Chain axe specifically.

[uncut pebble]

Mk4 has sticky lights, mk12 has sticky heavies.

[arctic rampart]

you like chain axe less than the sniper rifle?

or today's shredder hehe

[kind scarab]

The only real sniper rifle ingame is the revolver. I refuse to hear otherwise.

[uncut pebble]

Dclaw can do the funny chastise parry though and oneshot bulwarks and crushers, which is always funny.

[arctic rampart]

the mk4 where you just push the axe blade into their chest move is fun as hell

[remote sonnet]

Mk12 can at least do horde management. The Mk4... yes you can 1 hit elite with light, but holy shit the stick.

[arctic rampart]

yeah I couldnt keep using it, I'm just not good enough or w/e. but I've seen some other people kick ass with it

[remote sonnet]

It is one of my more used melee for havoc...

[grand perch]

mk4 is weird anyway, wind up attack does less damage than just spamming light on the target

iirc

[arctic rampart]

is there a tac axe that combos well with onslaught

[remote sonnet]

Mk12 special heavy also does more damage than mk4 special heavy.

[grand perch]

no

[kind scarab]

The chainaxes are like, a super gimmicky weapon that doesn't do its gimmick well enough to warrant using imho. The animations are just too long drawn out for higher tier gameplay.

[remote sonnet]

It only works with zealot because of some bs synergy.

[arctic rampart]

I keep trying to make onslaught work for recon 12 but it just isn't as good as taking 10% rending. but maybe with some melee that benefits it could be better

[kind scarab]

Love me some recon. Laser gun go brrrrt. Shame they kept trying to nerf it every damn time.

My beloved crit chains.

[grand perch]

if youre taking it anyway, taxes are one of the weapons better suited for onslaught...but so would be the usually better knife

[arctic rampart]

I dont like knife for horde though

[kind scarab]

Taxes are just knives for the less clinically British

[arctic rampart]

if I got onslaught I'm mostly using melee for horde

well taxes also dont have insane mobility like knife though so you pay the price

[grand perch]

the problem is you dont stack brittleness fast enough to really kill anything faster with melee

[arctic rampart]

that makes sense

[grand perch]

but it will help with crushers, what taxe struggles with so thats nice

[kind scarab]

You pay with ms and slower single target kills, but you get better horde clear

[arctic rampart]

but if Im taking recon 12 onslaught im definitely shooting those crushers with recon lul

[remote sonnet]

Tac axe is good, but you have to pay a little too much on vet to use it.

On psyker and zealot though, it is actually insane.

[arctic rampart]

whats the tackaxe with light attack horde clear

[remote sonnet]

The mk4

[kind scarab]

Crit melee psyker with taxe is just funny

[grand perch]

mkIV with slaughter spree

[arctic rampart]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/weapons/tactical-axe/atrox-mk-iv-tactical-axe

[remote sonnet]

Mk2 is the light single, heavy horde
Mk4 is light horde, heavy single
Mk7 is mix both light and heavy.

[arctic rampart]

oh ok, so mk4 brutal momentum + slaughter spree

[remote sonnet]

Bromentum and head taker

[arctic rampart]

is it fullauto level of spamming?

[grand perch]

not on mkIV

IV you want bromentum + slaughter spree

BM + headtaker is the traditional pick for VII and II

inb4 shred gets mentioned

[remote sonnet]

I find that combo works better on mk2 with heavy spam.

[arctic rampart]

I was about to ask about shred 😉

[remote sonnet]

Mk7, I don't use BM at all.

[kind scarab]

Just to put it out there: Shovel is definitely the best "average" vet weapon. It does everything equally well.

[arctic rampart]

oh cool, it has agile too. can dance around bossies

mk1?

[stiff glacier]

Folding shovel does feel meh

[kind scarab]

Is it the best at everything? No. But it's got you covered at all points.

Hell nah, not the folding one. Standard shovel.

[arctic rampart]

uncanny strike is on one of them right

[remote sonnet]

Yes

[grand perch]

some people like to use shred but i personally dont see it
agile is funny, recommend you try it out for a while, but you usually miss out on important BPs that headtaker provides

[arctic rampart]

I was watching someone on youtube do the tac axes and it looked fun. I remember using them pre-release and liking them, my first 380 weapon

[grand perch]

i ran agile for a while on my ILAS sniper build just to be able to keep dodging when swarmed but youre usually better off killing them faster

[remote sonnet]

Shred is fun, you can light attack everything with mk7.

[kind scarab]

Agile (assuming it's the dodge reset perk, I forget names) is great for the weapons you already hit all the major breakpoints on. Like dueling sword.

[arctic rampart]

when I tried out agile on DS4 I was underwhelmed. the dodge counter just never gets low enough. its probably like that everywhere

like only chaos & pogryn need agile, really

[kind scarab]

Little is as hilarious and curbstomping a horde while infinitely dodging ranged enemies and building up more crits

[wild summit]

any of you vets a clue what his right tree is even meant to reseblme from lore? i mean almost all treees have a clear resemblence to something or were supposed to be, but what in the name of the emperor is the right tree even supposed to be?

[arctic rampart]

oh, even the mk3 shovel has uncanny (https://darktide.gameslantern.com/weapons/sapper-shovel/munitorum-mk-iii-sapper-shovel) but that second blessing seems weaker. but light spam is more my style

heh, you could maybe do some stupid one like thrust though

[remote sonnet]

All weapons of the same type share the same blessings.

[grand perch]

so...you talking about left or right tree?

[wild summit]

right, apologies

[grand perch]

i mean the imperial guard employs trench raiders and melee specialists, those are covered there

[remote sonnet]

It is literally the Krieg.

[grand perch]

krieg would be one, catachans as well

(still waiting on fourth tree bringing explosive specialist, i want my det charges fatshark)

[remote sonnet]

The fact that Helbore melee activates WS and Fat shark never does anything about it is a hint.

[grand perch]

i dont think it does? you mean agile engagement

[arctic rampart]

The fact they removed brutal momentum carrying over to bayonet is a fucking travesty

[remote sonnet]

I don't remember which one exactly. I haven't play Helbore right tree for a bit.

[grand perch]

bayonet stabs give the same stacks ranged attacks do

agile engagement is programmed differently, so you get +25% ranged damage with bayo kills

[wild summit]

i feel like catachan is most sensible and krieg

[remote sonnet]

Agile it is then

[wild summit]

krieg especially since they do actually use smokes

[grand perch]

it could also be some random hive ganger who only had access to a shank and dinky revolver

[remote sonnet]

Just cqb combat troops in general

[wild summit]

doesnt help none of the keystones, aura and ult upgrades has any pin point reference to a class

[remote sonnet]

Left is the regular rifle line, and middle is the leadership.

[wild summit]

infiltrate and overwatch are univeral things available to more than one class

like middle has clear references to comissars and the like

right just exists

would really like word from an official to understand if they drew any references

[grand perch]

cringe commissar goes middle, shouting at his subordinates to do the killing
based commissar goes weapons specialist and does the job himself, inspiring his troops by example

[wild summit]

voc imo is sorely missrepresented

wish it was more about picking big buffs than just gold toughness

[remote sonnet]

https://warhammer40k.fandom.com/wiki/Astra_Militarum_Weapon_Specialist#:~:text=A Weapon Specialist is a,Guard infantryman in most regiments.

[kind scarab]

Based kriegsman yelling at his team that they ain't allowed to die until the killing is done

[remote sonnet]

It actually describes how WS is used in game, lol.

[wild summit]

you, sir, are an absolute fucking legend

i save that page

thanks

what do you guys think of ogryns rework, do you think vet also needs some help? His top tree looks painfully barren

[kind scarab]

Honestly? I've been fine with vet since their last rework.

Maybe a few buffs to underperforming weapons that lack a distinctive niche, and adding a proper sniper.

Ogryns desperately needed love after their last few nerfs, and just in general.

[cerulean vector]

I would like shooty vet to be a thing in higher difficulties but I guess he nature of the game makes that very hard. That plus shout is just so much more powerful than the other two ults.

[kind scarab]

Shooty vet (with high single target damage weapons) is viable in higher difficulties, esp if playing with at least one competent person.

[wild summit]

i was doing once a rework on ogryn, so i was thinking if people were interested in me doing the same for vet

[kind scarab]

Otherwise, ammo economy laughs in your face because of the sheer numbers.

[wild summit]

for anyone incterested, this is my work:
https://assets.adobe.com/id/urn:aaid:sc:US:626efa35-7143-4d5c-9578-f93ffe5019e5?view=published

[grand perch]

dont worry theres already a tanner video that the buff wasnt enough

[umbral scaffold]

I think tanner just hates ogryns to be fair

[kind scarab]

I already read through the patch notes when they came out, I know they're not enough but they're a step in the right direction

[cerulean vector]

I don’t think Vet needs a rework, really. Vet performs fine even in high havocs and you can feel very powerful, especially with certain weapons. But I kind of feel there’s a particular playstyle that’s just very very good and most others just fall off. Which I think is a bit sad.

[grand perch]

im not buying tanners opinions, ill see for myself before judgement

[wild summit]

he performs well, yes, but my reworks arent there to make a class playable

to are to bring either their tree into a close equilibrium, or put them up to snuff

[kind scarab]

My biggest gripes with the changes is that I feel the tankiness won't feel.any different than usual, but I love the light oggy love

[cerulean vector]

However, it’ll never get boring to shout at people that if they can breathe, they can kill, and that they should be getting to it already.

[remote sonnet]

Left tree vet does need a reword, or at least soft rework or tweaking.

[kind scarab]

And ranged changes to ult buildup seriously going to eat my ass

[umbral scaffold]

Vet is my most comfy at the moment I think he's pretty balanced

[kind scarab]

Vet and zealot are arguably the best balanced classes in the game.

[umbral scaffold]

But some of the weapons could use some work

[wild summit]

the issues i see with vet are:
top tree is barren
Smoke
VOC
other two skill are too weak to justify ever taking
left keystones

[kind scarab]

Psykers are close but honestly disrupt destiny is mega ass and needs the warp charge changes applied to it as well

[grand perch]

see, i dont think it really does? its a high skill ceiling keystone, and most people dont realise how much damage you can really do

[kind scarab]

And their shout + gunpsyker ability need buffs to be more relevant at higher levels

Left keystone for vet is my favourite.

[wild summit]

left keystone is funny but super limited to a few weapons

[umbral scaffold]

I think the invincibility can be broken if you know how to use it sadly I don't but

[wild summit]

maybe like 2

[umbral scaffold]

Invisibility not invince my bad lol

[remote sonnet]

MF does big damage, but it has too many trade offs.

[wild summit]

that

[grand perch]

ILAS, helbore, vigi, laspistol if youre feeling funny, IAGs....theres plenty weapons that work well with MF

[wild summit]

on a comparison bases, i see no reason why i should ever not go voc

[cerulean vector]

I am of the firm opinion that invisibility is a meme skill on everything that’s hard enough to play to warrant discussion.

[wild summit]

yes, but the stacking is painful vs tradeoff

[cerulean vector]

Applies to both vet and zealots loner skilltree.

[wild summit]

like from a risk vs payoff, mf isnt worth it most of the time

i rarely looks at things of "is it good enough"

i look at these things differently, cause of my upbringing

[remote sonnet]

No other keystone has such a trade off that keeps it from activating half of the game. Even when it does, its benefit is not worth the hassle.

[wild summit]

from a game deisng perspective, vet needs help

[wild summit]

but i wont do these reworks if people arent interested

[grand perch]

thats helbore mk IV with MF + exec. oneshots literally anything short of bosses. love using this on havoc 40

[wild summit]

ogryns took me months

[wild summit]

nobody claims the damage is bad

if it punished missing instead of being on a timer, i think more would take it

remove the timer, introduce stack loss on missing

[grand perch]

that would punish mistakes even more

the timer is generous enough, so you dont lose stacks for missing now and then

[sharp epoch]

how well do you do with it?

send a leaderboard maybe

[grand perch]

from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LF7nbK2mI9g

[wild summit]

My issue is more that once i am out of engagement, i have to fully restack

[grand perch]

yeah that is an issue. thats why i use camouflage

[wild summit]

Like the one time i use it is the old columnus

[grand perch]

also boss fights

[sharp epoch]

that looks like a 50 minute game damn

without camo I feel like you're gonna be swamped by melee too and you don't have room to use it

Looks like a purely defensive team too probably two bubbles and a relic

[grand perch]

having a smyker helps with this build to be sure

here its 1 bubble psyker 1 wall psyker and 1 book zealot

[sharp epoch]

It's a build that you need a lot of specific builds to basically support it imo which makes it bad for solo queue/party finder randoms

[grand perch]

but when do you not have 1 book zealot and 1 bubble psyker at least?

voc is still the meta choice obviously

[kind scarab]

I like voc if I'm playing with randoms cause you can't really trust them.

But most of the other time left combat ability for the lovely (screw this entire field of enemies) button

Stealth if I'm feeling braindead and will just do objectives

[wild vortex]

what blessings should I put on an autopistol for WS Vet

I know Pinning Fire is one, but what else

[south thistle]

Guys

What y’all think

[wild vortex]

I want to make it not-completely-meme for auric

Powderburn? Cavalcade? Sustained Fire?

[narrow frost]

I take inspiring for free thoughnbess

[wild vortex]

hmm but what if I don't need toughness

[narrow frost]

then blazxeaway

[wild vortex]

my WS setup is pretty tanky already with O4B and CK

[wild vortex]

even if I'm not emptying the whole magazine?