veteran-class

[brave verge]

hmm, thanks

[junior needle]

I just noticed it has me listed as helping at the beginning

My contributions towards the recon section were not unnoticed

[coral willow]

why did they "fix" that smh

sad

deci rn really doesnt do anything better than headtaker

sad

[junior needle]

It's not called brutal so it's not allowed to be nutso busto in every iteration

[tall torrent]

Shotguns in DT don’t have normal dmg profiles like most fps game and instead use a “minimum pellet count” system for calculating dmg, it’s fairly complex and generally you only need to care about breakpoints (how many shots to kill) as opposed to specific dmg values

[coral willow]

deathblow:

[junior needle]

Deathblow is just renamed brudal

For no reason

[coral willow]

is this on normal shotguns too

[mortal orbit]

Ty

[tall torrent]

Wdym

All pellet-based weapons in DT use this system

Lawbringer, Agripinaa & Kantrael shotguns
Kickback

[mortal orbit]

Trying to figure out their spread to get consistent crit procs w/lawbringer special shot. It'll wipe a wave of shotgunners, etc.. or floor them

Then tickle the next

[junior needle]

Doesn't the lawbringer do a horizontal line?

I've never actually used it

But your crits are decided when you fire the shot

[tall torrent]

@mortal orbit this might help u even though I don't have specific per-pellet dmg

[junior needle]

So getting more crit chance is how

Scattershot and deadshot are useful for that

[tall torrent]

TLDR u get better dmg consistency & tighter pellet spread (and in some cases, actually more dmg) when u ADS

[coral willow]

welp thanks

[coral willow]

is this from your doc?

[tall torrent]

didn't I send u a link

[coral willow]

ye

just checking- dont think i checked that part lol

i remember reading about one for kickback but wasnt sure about other shotguns

assumed they didnt exist

[tall torrent]

if u need to make an assumption abt a mechanic first check if my guide has it listed somewhere
most cases it's in there

[coral willow]

https://tenor.com/view/dies-of-death-gif-22568614

[flat crypt]

Can confirm the damage. It's surprisingly big difference between ads and hip damage, something like 20-25% more dmg with ads iirc

[rigid pilot]

I think it's finesse damage specifically

Weakspot shots

Seems to be about the same between ads and hip fire with bodyshots

[flat crypt]

I was taking close range reaper body shots when i played around testing stuff 🤔

With agri

[tall torrent]

It’s most notable on Agripinaa (+dmg when ADS)

[flat crypt]

Yeah I wouldn't be surprised if it gets some bonus for being more precise

Haven't really tested the difference on Kantrael or lawbringer

[tall torrent]

The other 2 don’t get as big of a boost

[rigid pilot]

Ah so it's more than +finesse

Yea agripinna feels really good with ads, can oneshot gunners from 15m away

[flat crypt]

Yep. If you haven't already tried, take elite dmg, MF with rending, ogryn dmg and the other rending talent. See what it does even with normal shots to crushers 😜

Don't remember my perks, only that my agri has full bore

[coral willow]

i am sad that i can no longer oneshot bulwarks with 2 well placed slugs

for zealot

gets like 2 ranged damage talent and that'd be all

[flat crypt]

I feel you 😖

[coral willow]

now im actually comitted to magdump

[mortal orbit]

Sounds about right regarding ads, big chonky damage while messing around in the psych

If only shotguns could get the drum mags, tho

[coral willow]

eh

current mag is fine

wish there was a special reload feature when certain amount of shells are empty the operative reloads with speedloaders instead

[mortal orbit]

I agree, playing shotgun gives me good vibes having to manage the small mag, special, and utility of the gun. But a blessing for an extra ten rounds would be a solid option

[coral willow]

or
we just get a storm-shotgun or whatever with fast firerate(200RPM minimum) and a mag reload just like ripperguns

[mortal orbit]

A vet with a ripper?

[coral willow]

this also in ripperguns i assume, hm

[tall torrent]

Yes

[flat crypt]

Or at least load 2 shells with one motion which is not uncommon in real life

[mortal orbit]

Mk V pattern was fun to learn ngl

Things a sniper

[flat crypt]

Sad that they removed the ability to fire only one shot with sprint cancelling

That's why I like Mk VI more nowadays. Fairly accurate and ammo efficient double tap

[ember tusk]

what is truth

[odd sparrow]

they're fine

[flat crypt]

Dunno about the truth but I like em and I think they are much better than their reputation

[odd sparrow]

having effective counterplay against gunner/shooter nests is pretty nice. Do wish it had a shorter fuse time though

theres litterally no good reason for it to have a long fuse time since when you need it you need it fast

[flat crypt]

Indeed

[tall torrent]

It’s the shortest fuse grenade for veteran

[flat crypt]

Preach

[tall torrent]

But it can be shorter for sure

[odd sparrow]

that 1.5 sec is enough to have your entire toughness bar shredded by a gunner nest

which is pretty feelsbaad

[flat crypt]

I'd really like it to be instant, ninja style

[odd sparrow]

or 0.25

either way shorter

[flat crypt]

Yep

[rigid pilot]

I hate it so much

Grenades in DT have fake fuse times anyway

It's either x time since hitting a surface or y time if it's airborne the whole duration

[odd sparrow]

my main reason for not using it is frustration with the fuse time.

ill just shoot them instead i suppose

also bulwarks are such a pain with revolver

[rigid pilot]

Vets balanced as the only class that doesn't have a melee that laughs at shields

[grand perch]

It should be like the flame grenade for zealot, near instant deployment

[grand perch]

Whaddya mean? Dodge left past their shield when they swing their mace, put revolver bullets in brain

[gilded wraith]

Does agile engagements buff indicator seem to last shorter than the listed duration?

[grand perch]

Or raise your character height to the max and shoot their bald dome over the shield

[tall torrent]

Very unreliable in practice

[grand perch]

It is but I do it now and then

[tall torrent]

U need to be jumping most of the time and it usually doesn’t work well

[flat crypt]

was very delighted that they removed the force field of the shield

[tall torrent]

Just bring a melee that kills unyielding fast

[grand perch]

I think it has to do with the shield moving a tiny bit in their walking animation?

[coral willow]

i liked chaxing their noggin

fun

[grand perch]

Yeah it's a good change but you could shoot above the shield before that. It was just very hard to do

[flat crypt]

It was pure luck

It was so frustrating to shoot even from the side

Firing from almost 90 degree angle from either side and the result was just plink plink

[coral willow]

flamer working from front is also nice tbh

[odd sparrow]

my mistake i was more reffering to when bulwark packs. Which thankfully are less of a problem now

[coral willow]

still a problem imo

least there isnt 12 bulwark phalanx wave now

[odd sparrow]

yeah

that stuff was bs

it also really pushed plasma

[coral willow]

it was plasma pew pew or get a nade

[grand perch]

Barrels

[rigid pilot]

5 seconds isn't it?

[odd sparrow]

ye

says so in the description i believe

[rigid pilot]

Barrels

[odd sparrow]

appears to be 5 secs. When i tested with bolter atleast

5 secs just isnt that long

[rigid pilot]

It's shorter than the weapon spec 10 seconds

[round condor]

Best damage modifiers for agri auto gun?

[agile forge]

Which one? There are three.

The infantry, the Braced or the headhunter?

[round condor]

Infantry

Unyielding and maniacs?

[agile forge]

Probably Flak on one of them, but idk

I just use CIAG personally

[round condor]

Ciag?

Ogryn main trying to learn vet it's different

[junior needle]

columnus infantry autogun

And it's flak/maniac

As is typical for automatics

[agile forge]

You could possibly swap maniac with unyielding if you want

If you want to be a better boss killer

But maniac is probably the right choice

[round condor]

Thanks

[junior needle]

The infantry autoguns already do good damage to maniacs, but that also means the +maniac perk is even better for ammo efficiency value

On top of maniacs just being all around much more prevalent than regular unyielding enemies

[round condor]

Yeah I think also the only enemies that ever give me trouble are maniacs

[flat crypt]

I like the flak + maniac and fire frenzy + dumdum combo

Agri iag makes great wannabe headhunter rifle with full auto capabilities and great cleave for hordes

[round condor]

Does anyone know the best difficulty to exp ratio?

[junior needle]

As high as you can feasibly reasonably complete

Damn gives the best rewards but people generally groan at low levels appearing there, at least when I bothered playing regular damn

[odd sparrow]

Difficulty 3 maelstroms are particularly kind of easy compared to the monstrous exp payout

But otherwise just play as hard of a mission as you can complete

The reward is like 7k exp which is equvialant of 1.75 damnations mission IIRC

[umbral scaffold]

yeah hitchhike a 15k xp maelstrom with your 1k hr friends

[balmy flume]

imagine watching so many levelling up cinematics in one go

[umbral scaffold]

i jumped from like lvl 5 ogryn to lvl 10 and that was the biggest jump i think

[sturdy zephyr]

Which one headhunter are best?do it need talent rework or just same as ciag ?

[flat crypt]

Personally I like vraks VII the most and yeah pretty much same talents works great on both weapon families (iags and hhags) 🤔

Although onslaught is better with iags

[sturdy zephyr]

Ivr tried them before but i found lost quite alot of dps. Whats the blessing?

[snow cypress]

Guys,which stats priority should I use at Plasma gun?

[junior needle]

Depends on the variant, v7 is a dmr while v3 can go basically fullauto

Typically surgical/da for v7, headhunter/da for vraks 3, and agri is just worse than the other 2.

[snow cypress]

Opinions about the weapon?

I think I should change the perks

[junior needle]

The perks are technically most important because consistent breakpoints>inconsistent breakpoints

[snow cypress]

yeah

[junior needle]

So you should probably change those and just accept life without gets hot

At least you didn't get the totally useless blessings

[snow cypress]

Yeah

Someone told me to use Blaze away

I'll prove it

He told me it's better because it does more consistent damage and you don't depend on crits

And which perks should be good?

[junior needle]

Gets hot can get you about 50% crit consistently

Blaze gets you 8% damage on consecutive shots in a very short time period, on a gun you get very few shots with before you have to stop

[snow cypress]

well

That's true

[junior needle]

And which also 1/2 taps most things

[snow cypress]

Anyways i have to change my perks

Because are shitty

[junior needle]

It depends on your setup I believe, as something like the ping keystone and redirect fire can breeze you past some particular breakpoints

Duh pin guide says elite for sure and then either flak or maniac

[snow cypress]

yeah

[junior needle]

But to be sure you can use loadoutconfig and test it yourself

[snow cypress]

I think i'll choose flak

[junior needle]

You could always change them anyway though

[slow spade]

I go Maniac so I can 1-tap flamers without stacks

If only you can reliably 1-shot dreg gunners

Fucking arm hitbox

[sturdy zephyr]

Noted. So i should use surgical and DA?

DA stance for?

[flat crypt]

Deadly accurate

[junior needle]

There's a large damage difference between DA and your other alternative, opening salvo

[sturdy zephyr]

V3 look dmg way under than v7 but v7 ammo cap really challenging

[flat crypt]

With extra ammo and the aura it's usually more than enough

Ofc it's not a horde clearing machine

[coral willow]

8 shots

if you spam m1 yes you get more merit out of

the crit

idk really but its good

[slow spade]

Its got a really low crit bonus but it has super high base damage

So it can still be relevant but I wouldn't build around it

[junior needle]

The thing is, you do not spam that many shots in such a close time for the vast majority of enemies

8 shots also assumes a certain thermal res stat

[slow spade]

8 shots into a poxwalker horde 😎

[coral willow]

69

really not hard to reach but a good elite horde just like to spam one

that said aim for the head and you dont need al 8 shots

[junior needle]

The power will give you a bit more cleave, but the damage increase becomes largely superfluous outside of bosses if you have your breakpoints in order

I think glory is overall better for the second blessing slot, personally.

[slow spade]

Born Leader + Glory c:

Be a team player c:

[coral willow]

if you need more than a 100 cleave you are doing something weird

it helps on bosses + helps to match non-BP guns to kill without being perfect

that said it makes your ammo economy worse so you do you

[proper stump]

Oi what the itemization means

[tame lodge]

Everything

~~regarding crafting and whatnot ~~

At least that's the consensus

[serene bough]

im so neck deep in mats that I forgot what its like to deal with the trash itemization

[bleak bolt]

literally me

i haven't spent a single mat - waiting on itemization rework

[nocturne wharf]

Ammo economy doesnt really exist. Especially with a psyker on your team

[coral willow]

gunpsyker:

[nocturne wharf]

Well yeah obviously, but when was the last time you've seen one?

[bleak bolt]

gunpsykers are just myths

they're not real

[nocturne wharf]

Last SG psyker I saw was 2 months ago. PS. It was me

[serene bough]

even with 4 people running ranged builds i seldom find ammo an issue

[nocturne wharf]

This

[woven oak]

Really? Seems like 20% of psykers are gunkers

[serene bough]

Ive had maybe a handful of games where everyone was completely depleted or almost empty on ammo

after 1k hours

even after the surv nerf i stilldont find it too bothersome

[nocturne wharf]

Really. I dont see them at all

[woven oak]

I see them constantly. Usually they're pretty good

[bleak bolt]

only ever seen one, but can confirm - they were good

ig it takes a special kind of psycho to use guns with psychic powers

[candid mulch]

only need Radiant lasgun to my vet, seems DeadShark jsut isn't working

[junior needle]

Depends on what weapons you're running

Something like mg4 or helbores have really deep ammo pools

Gunpsyker has scriers, which is actually better than exe

[flat crypt]

Oh yeah, SG + DD with vraks mk VII My beloved ❤️

[frank ether]

I find it weird helbore can go ammo positive

I'd happily trade the ammo for old melee

[junior needle]

The 7 is probably not the most efficient gun for scriers since you want to hold shots for one taps rather than spam shots downrange

[frank ether]

the complaints were braindead, people are fine with full on melee knife builds murking bosses but when a knife on a stick does it its a problem

[flat crypt]

You really don't have to hold shots, the finesse bonus itself is already enough to 1tap hs almost everything except maulers and crushers

Just click heads

But yeah, it's not the most efficient. For me the laspistol is prolly the most ridiculous but I like the feel of vraks

Also agri revolver is very fun to use. Far from most efficient but holy sh that thing does damage with full scrier and dd

[tame lodge]

While you might not get much value from Scrier's, Vraks 7 really likes DD
One big shot that would most likely set everything around the target on blaze because Perilous Combustion

Although everything that can hit heads will like DD

Sure some weapons like the Zarona can do that as well, but 22 bullets are more convenient than 5

Learned that the hard way

[flat crypt]

😅

[tame lodge]

[midnight totem]

I used gunker to get the old Warp charges penance

Basically had a super buffed agrippina the entire round

[flat crypt]

Nice

[midnight totem]

Had brain burst node for attacks too

So I could destroy maulers and crushers just shooting them

Pushed hard and got every elite kill to keep Warp charges up and keep pushing

Combined with hit and run blessing, dodge on crit node, deathspitter, and 24 percent more damage from max Warp charges

I was invulnerable

[flat crypt]

Can't go wrong with the Agri iag 😎 In my books it's maybe the best all-rounder in the game. True jack of all trades.

[tame lodge]

On my research on Perfectionism DD, the cleave from Aiag is handy af

[flat crypt]

Oh yes 🤤

[junior needle]

Eh, that node is not very good

15s cooldown and it's liable to proc on random shooters or anything that gets in the way of your shots

[midnight totem]

Yeah but it's funny when it works

[analog mural]

I think it's funny that you can punch something and watch their head explode from it

[midnight totem]

Like vet with serrated punching something and bleeding it to death

[cerulean ridge]

I must've bought this one from Melk at some point - worth putting mats into?
other than the 380 base rating it doesn't look like much

[midnight totem]

It's okay*

[tame lodge]

It's workable

[astral ingot]

It's peepee poopoo

[midnight totem]

Swap punishing salvo to deathspitter or other blessing of your choice

Crit hit to flak or manic or elite

[tame lodge]

Two bad blessings if you're not burst firing

While not optimal, you can burst fire it

But you know

It's full auto

[cerulean ridge]

ye

[tame lodge]

Ideally it would have been Dumdum with DS/HH

Although weakspot damage is garbage because the way it's calculated, that 45% would be okay-ish

Right?

[sturdy zephyr]

Rating are good but perk n blessing are garbage. And you only have 2 changes

Again,perk increase 5% crit,deadshot crit etc, it addup or increase the base crit chance?

[analog mural]

5% Crit perks are usually not worth

Better off with flak or some other armor adm

[thick kestrel]

sadly, though in fairness the 5% crit tends to have more synergy with other classes. psykers in particular have a whole pile of crit proc related stuff going on as well as access to base crit stuff from their tree.

but crit is, mostly, less of a Veteran thing in terms of builds.

now mind, it's not BAD to have, if you're going to be left with a non-specific anti-armour perk +crit is far from the worst

[slow spade]

Iirc there's melee crit talents

[thick kestrel]

yarp

[slow spade]

So at least you got that

[junior needle]

Yeah there's very few weapons where 5% crit is a competitive option

[slow spade]

Hellbore shocktrooper value UwU

[thick kestrel]

in fairness it's a different kettle for melee, veteran has some interesting options there... I mean also technically deadshot? so i'm maybe over simplifying

[junior needle]

You don't want it on helbore because breakpoints

[slow spade]

Turn 1 ammo pick per mission to 0

[junior needle]

It's only on recons and laspee where it's a competitive or preferred option

[thick kestrel]

but, GENERALLY, at least in comparison to Zealots and Psykers... veterans don't do crit as much as a focus thing...

[junior needle]

Maybe mg4

[thick kestrel]

just shove a whole pile of asterisks on the end of everything I said above...

[slow spade]

Omg crit perk and crit damage perk UwU

[steel lagoon]

!Skyfall42

[astral ingot]

::bank

[cerulean ridge]

yeah I know, which is why I think I'll just leave that one as a "display piece" 👍

[radiant chasm]

psykers can maintain their crit bonuses just fine with either other talents or warp nexus blessing

people act like it has synergy and value but 5% is so small it really isn't

[frank ether]

I tried the exe bolter build, the magdump one

Its rather lame on ammo side of things

damage doesnt seem all that bad though

[hearty panther]

its really just for Zealots tbh

https://youtu.be/is1rpZeTiBg?si=-i3Tr2oRPx1i9U7u

[frank ether]

I think this is a common problem for veteran

people just eager to pull the skill issue card on it

but most of the times

hipfire/brace focused weapons

you might aswell use them on zealot

vet has some broken things but it doesn't make for good skill expression

[astral ingot]

They turned bolter into a janky hh autogun

[frank ether]

I think I have the solution to this

Its not a bolter problem

[sturdy zephyr]

Boltpee

[frank ether]

The onslaught-skirmisher part of the vet tree needs to be replaced

[tawny badger]

man

I really be the type of mf to run executioner’s stance and then do bodyshots only

[frank ether]

thing is its better off to just do zealot charge and stack dance of death, duelist etc

[hearty panther]

knife cancel etc yes

but also just having a throwing knife means not needing bolter as much

[bitter turtle]

You can swap bolter out really fast even on vet

[terse idol]

It's really not that bad

[bitter turtle]

The sprint cancel is potentially even faster

Than knife

[frank ether]

I don't ask for vet to be that but onslaught-skirmisher could be nuked to make way for more fun and generally useful talents that open up skill expression rather than cringe rending stacking that only like 2 weapons make decent use of and then whatever the fuck skirmisher does

[hearty panther]

its not

in that video i do both

if youre very lucky the sprint cancel will be as fast as the knife toss

but even with the knife anim having to play out

[terse idol]

I just think surgical bolter is kinda neat,

[hearty panther]

you still have to start the reload before canceling it

[frank ether]

I mean if you're using exe that on its own helps a lot, problem is people grown allergic to exe stan

[bitter turtle]

#veteran-class message

[hearty panther]

So on the whole it's usually longer. And fucking it up hurts more.

[bitter turtle]

This has got to be faster than knife no?

Since there's the knife chucking animation

The time to ads I mean

[terse idol]

Well I domt think they grew allergic

It's just not as easy as VOC

[hearty panther]

thats in the Psykhanium with 0 latency

like hypothetically yes

[bitter turtle]

Ok fair

[hearty panther]

in practice not so much

[terse idol]

All blitz discussion falters when VOC is involved

[bitter turtle]

Yeah I agree practically not so much

[hearty panther]

i pull it off a lot but it's rare that it ends up perfect

[frank ether]

Maybe I am the stupid one here

[terse idol]

Nobody wants to use exe because it doesn't inherently give you back toughness

[hearty panther]

but the Psykhanium is still the best space to practice it

[terse idol]

In an easy way

[frank ether]

I'm miffed a lot more by spread on these guns than swap times

like I take the swap times as part of the weapon

[bitter turtle]

They should just make stuff client side tbh

[terse idol]

Yeah that's valid

[frank ether]

and suppression is another problem but I guess we get a 1 talent cost solution to that

[terse idol]

I just kinda wished plasma gun had a longer draw time

[bitter turtle]

Who fucking cares if you cheat in DT tbh

[terse idol]

Because it really doesn't make sense

[terse idol]

Well and the handful of weapons that also ignore supression

[hearty panther]

meh suppression is easy to counter

i just run at them lul

[frank ether]

what doesn't make sense with plasma is it should have been this unstable weapon with many downsides except it isn't

[terse idol]

Blame gw? I dunno

[bitter turtle]

Yea cause they nerfed the downsides repeatedly

[terse idol]

It's not like

That bad even in lore

[hearty panther]

Nah it just got hyperbuffed

[terse idol]

Like heavy weapon teams use it

[hearty panther]

Bring back the old heat system

[frank ether]

either way bolter really doesn't need huge buffs

[terse idol]

And those are usually elite infantry

[hearty panther]

Of health damage

[frank ether]

its the veteran tree that sucks with this kinda stuff

[bitter turtle]

The only thing I want for bolter is just enough dmg to 1hs ragers

[frank ether]

the marksman bolter meme works pretty well

[bitter turtle]

Kinda dumb that it doesn't without conditional buffs

[frank ether]

when you try the magdump route its just a waste of ammo

[sinful swallow]

Marksman bolter is my main

[dreamy spade]

https://tenor.com/view/perfect-popcorn-michael-jackson-gif-26271837

[sinful swallow]

I'm exec stance though to chase the one shots on all non carapace

[hearty panther]

nerf VoC already ;_;

[sinful swallow]

Ehhhh

[frank ether]

I'm gonna be bored out of my mind with this patch

if all it does is drop few new guns

[sinful swallow]

🧊!!!

[frank ether]

I was hoping crafting fix would let me get a few decent rolls on my psyker and zealot

[hearty panther]

we got a handful of changes with penances so I presume the same

[frank ether]

like %90 of my good rolls are on veteran

and my curios are all bricked on my alts

cant be arsed to fix them

[sinful swallow]

You aren't mega major hyped by 🧊⛏️ and 🛗!?!?

[thick kestrel]

nothing wrong with pivoting over to another title for a bit to keep things fresh. I tend to loop in and out of most games to let them release more stuff and keep things fresh

[frank ether]

I did that 6 months ago

[thick kestrel]

was playing helldivers before coming back into darktide a few weeks ago, planning on heading over to deeprock soon after the patch and mission lands and I get to play for a bit.

[frank ether]

helldivers needs like

[thick kestrel]

then there's a new guildwars expansion on the way... Warframe continues to just pile out releases... plenty to do.

best thing you can do is rotated around if it isn't something you're currently enjoying, no point playing if you're not having fun and that's going to have a bigger impact on fatshark's end than anything else 🤷

[frank ether]

I would need a 40 page long essay on how to unfuck helldivers as a game lmao

I might try new DRG season though

[astral ingot]

It was a mistake to label darktide as a live service

[frank ether]

The real mistake was designing it as one, not the label

[thick kestrel]

I've heard good things! the abilty to roll back to older seasons in particular is profoundly tempting to help get some new greenbeards going

[astral ingot]

I need to get my drg save off my old computer

[frank ether]

GTFO did that too

released all previous content

[astral ingot]

Really been dragging my ass on that

[frank ether]

but GTFO devs are a bit daft

they kinda squandered that game

well not as hard as payday 3 kekw

[thick kestrel]

but that's kind of it. it's easier at this stage to just rotate off and come back later. we've got SO many options for squad based pve coop shooters atm it's not too hard to find something to enjoy, even if for a short burst

[frank ether]

I remember when people were complaining a year ago on like

how balancing isn't content

but balancing and talent rework gave this shit a years worth of content

[sinful swallow]

The talent rework was a completely new way to interact with the game

Penances were a way to enforce trying new things

[frank ether]

penances are side fluff at best, its not gonna bring people back

but its nice to have for people that play

[sinful swallow]

Exactly

But the people that play have been sitting with this stuff forever now

[frank ether]

the penance update was a great update it did great fixes for the game

they fixed ragers, bulwarks

new enemy modifier etc all great

just way too much of a gap between the last update

so people lose interest because thats how live service games are

[terse idol]

I want to say penances do give folks inventive to play mooore, hence more content or at least longer player retention

[frank ether]

When the crafting fix eventually comes its gonna be the same btw

[terse idol]

It might not bring people back but folks who play will play more in theory

[terse idol]

I just never believed darktide to be live service like how live service games operate anyways

[frank ether]

It gives you more incentive to play, its not gonna make you reinstall the game if you've left, which most players did

[sinful swallow]

Crafting fix if it's proper turns this game fully into l4d2 for me

[terse idol]

This is just the standard fs update cycle

[frank ether]

This is the problem with releasing a fucked game lmao

[sinful swallow]

Id never not play even if it's not 24/7

[frank ether]

by the time its fixed everyone loses interest

[terse idol]

Literally feels like the same update cycle like in vt2

But faster

[terse idol]

I just think darktide has a good enough average playerbase

[frank ether]

It has enough whales to keep the lights on apparently

[terse idol]

Nothings gonna change the player base is gonna spike fir major updates

That's normal

[frank ether]

evident from the fact that they haven't shut down yet

or maybe they are eating the money from console port still

who knows

[terse idol]

I mean

[frank ether]

I'm drawn more towards the latter on this

but maybe I'm wrong

[terse idol]

Darktide made signifantly more sales than vt2

They're probably good for as long as vt2 is or longer

[frank ether]

my tinfoil hat theory is

they're working on the next game

vt2 and DT has their own skeleton crews

[terse idol]

And the micro transactions have certainly made it longer

That is like

Illuminati tier

I hope you know

[frank ether]

Its not a hot take to imply that

[terse idol]

It really is

Insane

[frank ether]

not even a niche or new thing in the industry

battlefield 2042 is on a skeleton crew

has been since nearly its release

it had like what? 7 seasons and many other irrelevant reworks and balance passes

[terse idol]

EA has been on deaths door for a while is a broader statement I'd like go make

Battlefront 2

Had the potential

To actually come back

[junior needle]

Wasn't there some thing on linkedn about fatshark having a big new project

[terse idol]

But they got cold feet killed it

[frank ether]

And if I went to battlefield discord and said your game is on skeleton crew

I would be called insane there too

[terse idol]

Battlefield 2042, was unsuccessful since the start

So they cut losses

[frank ether]

someone like you would pop up and call me insane lmao

no offense but thats how it is

[terse idol]

I meani agree with you about battlefield 2042

Because they've literally said like no more large content patches

And the failure of 2042 highlights it

[junior needle]

https://www.reddit.com/r/DarkTide/comments/1chvdhq/fatshark_has_started_to_work_on_an_unannounced/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

[terse idol]

I guess the question I pose is do you believe darktide has failed that it even needs to be pushed under the rug

[junior needle]

It's not a hot take since there's proof

[terse idol]

And ran a skeleton crew

[frank ether]

I fully believe they deemed darktide a failure as far as live service goes and started focusing on the next big thing

which I would agree with.

[junior needle]

From a monetary standpoint it's very likely done better than vt2, but that's only because it's a 40k game and not a warhammer fantasy game

[terse idol]

Because the circumstances surrounding battlefield 2042 running a skeleton crew and the theory that darktide has failed that FS feels the need to also run a skeleton crew is a little wacky to me

[terse idol]

I mean, like soldier said it's already been more successful than vt2

[frank ether]

And that success will not last

if you cant keep a playerbase

[terse idol]

How can you tell

[junior needle]

Likely*, judging by max player count

[terse idol]

We have 4k players average

[junior needle]

I have no objective proof

[terse idol]

Already more than the average for vt2

Through alot of it's life

[frank ether]

Darktide had a HUGE release and then died like a wet fart

[terse idol]

I mean

Yeah cause it released unfinished sure

[frank ether]

it then had a big comeback with console port, which is another huge revenue

then the momentum died down afterwards

[terse idol]

Then it had a massive comeback with the talent rework which drew in more players

[terse idol]

I just

Think that's every game

People tend to lose interest month to month

It's like when hd2 players are dooming how they've lost 300k players

[junior needle]

Oh wait, vt2 actually had way bigger max players than I thought. Might've been from giving the game out for free though.

[terse idol]

People have just moved on

[terse idol]

Well and the sales

[junior needle]

As far as potential goes, darktide has most definitely shit the bed

[frank ether]

VT2 also doesn't run like an abused old car performance wise

[terse idol]

Uh

On release vt2

Ran like shit

[junior needle]

Fatshark has provided a sterling example of how to fumble a ball that's glued to your hand

[frank ether]

what uh? who cares about release we are comparing current numbers

[junior needle]

How to strangle a golden goose

[terse idol]

Like vt2 isn't this old timey gold gem

Vt2 even started out like shit

[frank ether]

nobody said it was

we just said it doesn't run like darktide

[terse idol]

I mean

Darktide gets more stable with every patch

(And then unstable)

[frank ether]

Does it?

[terse idol]

Yeah

[frank ether]

Last time I checked

they were sponsored by AMD for FSR3

which is a fancy fucking gimmick

[terse idol]

AMD just doesn't like

Stingray

[frank ether]

which they didn't even implement in like nearing a year

[terse idol]

Like, amd has had problems with hd2

[frank ether]

AMD and fatshark has a lot in common anyway

promise the world and deliver fuck all

[terse idol]

I mean

Just quit

[frank ether]

yeah let me just

yank out my graphics card

[terse idol]

No I'm telling you

[frank ether]

and magically refund it

[terse idol]

It could be a good idea to move on from darktide

If you legitimately don't think it ever improves

It's better for your health

You've clearly made your hours

[junior needle]

Very good idea

You can always just choose to stop playing

[terse idol]

Yeee

[frank ether]

this is a good mindset

become an ever shrinking closed pond community

all dying games go through this phase tbh

[junior needle]

That's entirely what fatshark deserves

[frank ether]

person complaints

''have you tried fucking off?''

[terse idol]

I mean, I don't think it's a shrinking pool, I like to try to think at least abit positively

[frank ether]

I don't even disagree

[terse idol]

If your grievances boil down to
This game has never improved, never will and patch after patch it gets worse

Why stay

[junior needle]

steamdb says it's shrinking

[frank ether]

I said a lot of up to debate things but this is the one thing where I'm mathematically right lmao

[terse idol]

I'm gonna be the dude watching the player base spike when the new map release fr

[frank ether]

either way my mentality is really simple

fatshark releases content or does anything positivve

I feed the fat fish

fatshark does fuck all? no money

no playtime

[terse idol]

But uh, many of what we talked about it's all negative though

Like the penance update, shit

Bug fixes, shit

[frank ether]

if consumers could all behave like that live service market would be healthier

[serene bough]

Game fun

I play

[terse idol]

When they delay the weapon crafting, shit

[frank ether]

?? I literally told you penance update was great lmao

[terse idol]

Woops

[frank ether]

and then explained in detail why it was received poorly

[terse idol]

Me as I misconstrued arguments

[junior needle]

The low standards for positive changes is why they're so bad at doing it

Clearly it's a highly dysfunctional company

And nothing is going to change if they keep getting away with doing the bare minimum

[frank ether]

tide gamers pay money based on shop rotations rather than content drops

Partially the community is to blame aswell

[junior needle]

Yes, the whales are also to blame

[frank ether]

every shop rota I see clowns in latest slop

[junior needle]

Unfortunately they cannot be reasoned with

And fatshark knows this

[bitter turtle]

Maybe it's bc I play discord fighters and niche games but a stable 3-4k players seems fine enough to me

[serene bough]

Ye

Same

[terse idol]

Yeah I dunno

[frank ether]

Its more than enough, but it also means update cycles will be like this from now on

[terse idol]

What player base are you looking for plush?

[frank ether]

which you'll have to accept

[terse idol]

I just think FS has always ran update cycles like this

[frank ether]

like maybe two updates every year is what you can expect from now on

[bitter turtle]

Hot take

But

[white minnow]

the update cycles have been like this for a hot while

[terse idol]

Like Vt2 has literally been the same

[bitter turtle]

That's fine with me

I don't really care

[white minnow]

it's a pretty clear pattern with fatshark

[bitter turtle]

I got a lot of hours out of the game alr

[wanton dawn]

I dont care, even with 3-4k player 95% of em will play like crap anyway

[serene bough]

All on all the updates that do come out are also pretty solid

[bitter turtle]

If it never updates again

That's ok

[terse idol]

WoM was one of the worst game modes FS released and that never got really fixed for 2 years

[frank ether]

It apparently was even worse for vermintide

[terse idol]

Yeah and darktide got

Marginally better

But the pattern is still the same

[frank ether]

But either way

[terse idol]

FS is slow

[frank ether]

after all these discussions

when the next big thing fatshark working oncomes out

and if its a live service and you pre-order it

you are the clown at that point kekw

[terse idol]

I'll try it

[bitter turtle]

I don't pre-order anything

[terse idol]

Steam gives me a 2 hour refund window anyways

[bitter turtle]

Except anime merchandise

[serene bough]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[radiant chasm]

this

[white minnow]

i knew what i was getting into when i pre-ordered this game

[radiant chasm]

not all complaints are created equal

[white minnow]

and i was right given that i've dumped 3k hours into the game

[bitter turtle]

Yeah I have 1.5k hours

For the price it has paid for itself

If I get bored eventually then the game is just done for me and that's fine

[serene bough]

I dont play darktide (or games in general) with the intent of sitting and waiting for DLC either

[frank ether]

time is a terrible metric to declare worth of a game

[white minnow]

i'm sure i'll figure things out if fatshark's next game happens to align with my interests

[frank ether]

if you feel it was worth it, it was worth it, its that shrimple

[bitter turtle]

Well

[serene bough]

Whenever it comes ill play, but if I get bored and want to play something else I'll take a small break from the game

[terse idol]

Also I will push back on your last point plush but I don't think any singular whales kept the game alive on microtransactions alone,
It's just the thousands of people buying microtransactions that do give fs money

[radiant chasm]

that's why i think the great book of grudges should be put up their queek, it's just people obsessed with a past that obv will never happen

[bitter turtle]

I agree it can be terrible if 1k of the hours was spent tedious grinding

[terse idol]

There isn't enough things in the game to be a whale

[white minnow]

alright, instead of time, i'll say that i got more than enough from darktide

[bitter turtle]

But I never bothered grinding much

[radiant chasm]

even NMS hasn't fulfilled every broken promise

[white minnow]

i'm just using time since it's an obvious and direct metric rather than feelings

[bitter turtle]

It's 1.5k hours of mostly having fun

[frank ether]

Because you could also have spent 1.5k hours playing destiny

[serene bough]

At that point I'd argue that the can't be this awful with such a hefty time investment

[terse idol]

Queen headtaker when he took the head of a dwarf that speaks to him

💀

[radiant chasm]

queen headtaker 👑

[bitter turtle]

Sometimes you play games for reasons other than fun

[radiant chasm]

🐀 👑

[serene bough]

If you can play for over 1k hours there has to be something redeeming about it

[frank ether]

cough cough destiny

[radiant chasm]

estrogen would've saved her from the end times

[white minnow]

like fatshark employees pointing a gun at your head to play darktide

[serene bough]

If you didn't enjoy it you wouldn't play it

[white minnow]

they have my family hostage

[junior needle]

I still regret buying it. I'll amend the "buy it a year later" saying for fatshark to 3-4 at least.

[terse idol]

Queek and Ska, only roomates so sad

[bitter turtle]

Like buying clothes to dress up your virtual character to satisfy your dreams of being a cute girl irl

[radiant chasm]

yea if I had to say one thing i am def glad for, fatshark is not in anyway, demanding you to play the game

[bitter turtle]

At least I'm pretty sure that's why half the ppl still playing mmos do it

[terse idol]

Me as I play wow

[radiant chasm]

you have weeklies, that is it, and you can reroll them to quicker/easier ones, but you don't even need to do thsoe every week, you aren't falling behind or losing out if you don't log in every week

[serene bough]

MMOs have different elements to them for different players I guess

[frank ether]

sunk cost bs and peer pressure stuff for the most part, MMOs that build social ties are dangerous

[terse idol]

WoW is the worst case for it

[serene bough]

But I also detest mmos so I won't comment

[white minnow]

yeah darktide otherwise doesn't have the bells and whistles that gachas otherwise have to make you play daily

[junior needle]

Fatshark can't demand anything from me because I have self respect

[terse idol]

Peer pressure has largely not mattered since blizzard has been on the road to remove social elements from WoW with LFD, and LFR

It's all automated

[frank ether]

Darktide could make much, much more with its cash shop

they do not know how to milk the whales they have, or maybe they're not allowed Idk

[terse idol]

There just

Simply aren't whales

[bitter turtle]

Yea they are pretty bad at the cash shop tbh

[terse idol]

In darmtide

[white minnow]

sure

[frank ether]

I have enough disposable income rn, I could buy the entire shop slop every two weeks

[deft field]

Whats the best lasgun types and variants to go with?

[white minnow]

there's some obvious incompetence going on and the game released unfinished

[radiant chasm]

like, even tho i hate fatshark for clinging onto the live service label, i don't get why some people want more live service if it just means being forced to grind daily

[bitter turtle]

Weapon customization could make a lot of money I bet

[terse idol]

Like any whale on darktide

[white minnow]

such is life

[terse idol]

Would just buy every shop that comes out

On rotation

[frank ether]

but why would I buy low quality slop that I can't even customize as I like?

[radiant chasm]

fatshark didn't make the shop, they likely are limited on what changes they can do

[frank ether]

every once in forever though, they drop something cool and I buy it

[terse idol]

Uh, because some of it is infact not low quality

And many cosmetics that had clipping were fixed later

[radiant chasm]

the only big change they did was having 3 pages per class instead of 1

[terse idol]

Krieg chest piece got reinflated

[radiant chasm]

contracted features are likely protected assets so fatshark can't just dump it and release a catalogue even if they want to

[frank ether]

Thats fatshark's problem

if they want more money that is

[terse idol]

Something something market trends with fomo reinforce market trends

[radiant chasm]

yes, i'm explaining on why they haven't milked better

also, people completely buckled

lack of profit is a good leverage for changes to be made

[frank ether]

they also buckled the weapon customization

whatever the excuse may be

[radiant chasm]

it worked once and then the community gave up. Weapon customization is a completely different beast LMAO

please one topic at a time

level infinite made the cash shop, it is likely protected from fatshark via contract

[frank ether]

So its outsourced to save money

[radiant chasm]

we got 3 pages when 1 page wasn't enough. then the community just buckled

[radiant chasm]

it's outsourced because level infinite is a tencent team, so either tencent or GW put them on the game

[frank ether]

lmao

[radiant chasm]

DT made more in a year than vt2's lifetime of premium cosmetics

[frank ether]

I'm sorry I'm not buying this tale of

GW sitting on a throne over fatshark

dissecting every single thing they do

[radiant chasm]

you don't have to buy shit it's the truth, level infinite gets passed on to a lot of games to do work on

and it's not every single thing, it's just the cash shop

[frank ether]

The same GW that put space marines in cod is allergic to all these things

[radiant chasm]

krieg broke people and made record profits if people want change they shouldn't pay for any slop no matter how nice and sloppy

[terse idol]

Well I mean all I can say is we got good armour

People trying to rally the community to say how good cod got it really were coping

[tiny summit]

Whos someone with the pictures of like 4 pages of powerswords with no PC4?

[terse idol]

Because that armour looked like SHIT

[bitter turtle]

I had 4 pages of chainswords with no bloodletter4

Didn't take a pic tho

[bitter turtle]

Is that the cg where ash was beating the shit out of that sargon duke

Idr

[radiant chasm]

anyways, WC was cut because it could not be finished before launch. Ogryns and psykers would've been left even more unfinished, and melee weapons as well would lack the comparative customization options, and they were just, well unfinished/unpolished. WCM has had to do so many bugfixes just to get things functional, and that hasn't even touched the shit fatshark wanted, like customization tweaking stats, and an acquisition system to unlock more attachments.

[tiny summit]

I just remember there was someone with like 4 pages of no PC4

[bitter turtle]

I meant your icon

[tiny summit]

Oh yea it is

Iconic

[radiant chasm]

they replaced it with the variant system, which while i would prefer free reign weapon customization, it's not going to be anytime soon

[bitter turtle]

Wdym melee don't have options

You can turn everything into a katana

10/10

[radiant chasm]

that's WCM just going wild with hooks

[bitter turtle]

Would mod again

[terse idol]

Can you make a gunblade

[radiant chasm]

since you can put nearly anything on anything if you want to bugfix it enough, funny, but that would never be in the real game

[terse idol]

👀

[bitter turtle]

Yes

[terse idol]

[tiny summit]

Gonna roll for degenbrecher

[bitter turtle]

#veteran-class message

[bitter turtle]

I got her in 30

[terse idol]

God damnn

[bitter turtle]

She also wants to kill gnosis

Just like me frfr

[tiny summit]

Still maintenance for me

[bitter turtle]

Give me back BM bayonet

[tiny summit]

Everyone seeing gnosis being pinned down. "It shouldve been me!"

[bitter turtle]

Fucking cowards fatshark

[bitter turtle]

https://twitter.com/komonogame/status/1804014390825357385?t=KS9QiQzrTlFsL_RfVqa8Lw&s=19

[tiny summit]

She is zoomin in that PV

[dreamy spade]

pray for me yall

[tiny summit]

Hadron rubbing her hands

[dreamy spade]

[bitter turtle]

Tier 3 perk

Delete it and start over

[dreamy spade]

yeah this is better

[bitter turtle]

Lacerate SMH on pepperonchinos

[thin stone]

Bro why am I not red already 😭

[clever estuary]

Mk 3 or Mk 5 Catachan Combat Blade?

[bitter turtle]

6

there is no 5

but 6 is better

[thin stone]

I wish I had a God Roll Columnus IAG

It's like

I got 25 maniac and flak, but the perks are not good

I got Fire Frenzy and Dumdum

[bitter turtle]

those are good

what are you even looking for

[thin stone]

I thought you want Death Spitter

Check DMs

[bitter turtle]

fire frenzy is close enough

dumdum is the big one

and you have it

so

[thin stone]

But it doesn't apply to ranged right?

Like big ranges

Fire Frenzy is close range

[bitter turtle]

close range damage decreases gradually over distance

and im not going to lie

you dont need either of them

[radiant chasm]

close range is 8m falling off to 30m

[bitter turtle]

they arent even necessairly optimal

[tall torrent]

Close ranged dmg

[tall torrent]

30m

[bitter turtle]

the ideal is dumdum + something

[thin stone]

I see

[radiant chasm]

i stand corrected

[bitter turtle]

the something can be a lot of things

[thin stone]

So the roll I have is good?

[bitter turtle]

not just deathspitter/frenzy

yes

25 flak+ maniac and dumdum/firefrenzy is basically an optimal roll

assuming the gun stats are good

[thin stone]

I mean I was reading the veteran guide

Iirc it said Stripped down, Dumdum and Deathspitter

[tall torrent]

Deathspitter is a bit better than FF but the 2nd blessing isn’t that important

Pretty sure I only have dum dum underlined as important

[thin stone]

I see

On Agripinaa Brauto

[radiant chasm]

stripped down doesn't do anyhting for damage so i don't like it

oh boy, running faster, no thanks, for brauto fs+ds. on IAGs you can roll dum dum

[bitter turtle]

stripped down is meh imo

[thin stone]

Hmm

[bitter turtle]

just bc youalready have the sprinting to avoid gunfire effect without it

all it does is let you face the camera at gunfire

[thin stone]

Lol

[tall torrent]

And behind

U only actually have ~65° to the sides where it’s avoided

[thin stone]

What according to you guys is the best class?

[tall torrent]

behold my hand drawing

[tall torrent]

all 4

[thin stone]

Oof

[tall torrent]

None of them are “weak”

[bitter turtle]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RS1xybCT1_g

If you don't see bullet

You don't feel bullet

[tall torrent]

Yes this is under the 65° to the sides

[somber axle]

I don't think there's a best class overall. There are some talent/weapon loadout combos on some classes that excel at doing particular things better than other classes but aside from doing specific things better you will never find a class/loadout/talent set up combo that does literally everything better than any other class/loadout/talent set up

[tall torrent]

Front 50° and back 180° are not ranged atk immune

[bitter turtle]

yeag

but what kind of coward would be running away

[tall torrent]

Stripped down just makes the mechanic a lot more flexible

I think it’s alr for braced autogun since u already sacrificed effective range

[midnight totem]

I'm not running away

I'm advancing in reverse

[flat crypt]

I like it on brautos. You can literally just laugh and run towards enemies and go brrrr

[thin stone]

I play the veteran because I want to play Call of Doody without buying the same game every year and paying $70-100 everytime

[thin stone]

It absolutely shreds 10 gunners or Shotgunners standing up close

[flat crypt]

Got one Boris the bullet-dodger build with stripped down and hit n run slapped on agri brauto, not the most powerful but fun times

[hearty panther]

why do they call him the bullet dodger

[thin stone]

Idk, because he can Dodge bullets

[tiny summit]

Missed my 50/50. What are you doing here Executor Alter!? Then missed it again.

[bitter turtle]

Rip

[cerulean ridge]

https://tenor.com/view/ogryn-darktide-ryback-gif-27166387

[thin stone]

Nice

[cerulean ridge]

[oblique totem]

Bulwark?

[iron marten]

rip

got degenbrecher in 70

[tiny summit]

Happy for you

[iron marten]

lmao

[thorny cobalt]

quite enjoying this look, even if the amount of friendly fire against me has gone up lol

[rapid palm]

like was said, there isnt really a best class, but I would consider zealot to be the most versatile

[somber axle]

I would also consider Zealots to be the most wildcard class to see in quickplay tbh

They're either gods or they are the heaviest player in the team requiring you to get them off their knees, out of a net or out from under a hound every 2 minutes

And you can always tell by how fast they want to rush a level

if they sprint off solo halfway across the map give it 10 seconds and more often than not you'll see them spam pinging the trapper that caught them

[hearty panther]

nah for me thats vet

not in like, the scenario you outlined exactly

but ill see veterans who are seemingly doing totally fine for 95% of a match

but then three poxwalkers corner them when theyre reloading with VoC down and they fold in half

[somber axle]

Yeah Vets can be troublesome too but they usually at least hug the squad so they're less of a problem when they do go down

[hearty panther]

itll just come out of complete nowhere

[somber axle]

Zealots who run off solo force me to try to speedrun the map just to get them back up only for them to immediately learn nothing at all and sprint off solo again

[midnight totem]

Shit goes sideways fast

[hearty panther]

people really dont understand/appreciate how much VoC is doing for them lol

recent reddit thread posed a simple question: is VoC the most busted?

and the answer is yes

[somber axle]

Remove VoC please 😩

[hearty panther]

but there were people saying psyker bubble is 'as strong as' VoC

and it's like

nah dude

naaaah

naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah duuuuuuude

[somber axle]

Reddit people don't have two braincells to rub together. If they had two braincells they'd both be competing for third place. They're arguing the best weapons in the game over there and discussing their strats for Malice difficulty

Ignore Reddit

[hearty panther]

this one is still in my head rent free

[mental cloud]

https://tenor.com/view/puppet-awkward-looking-what-side-eye-gif-15476992

Me rn

[hearty panther]

there's cope
then there's coping
then there's giga cope
then there's GIGA coping

[mental cloud]

Cope maxing

[midnight totem]

Zealot has 15 percent benediction

Give vet 15 percent fireteam

[hearty panther]

god no

[midnight totem]

[hearty panther]

loner should be like

20% backstab damage for the team

would that be so crazy?

why does loner have to be so stupid bad

[midnight totem]

Actually, I think every aura should should have a side benefit for the player alone

Minor

Survivalist with slightly more ammo return for the vet (or ranged damage, I dunno)

Close and kill with a small melee damage buff

Fireteam with a toughness damage reduction

Something like that

[hearty panther]

idk i feel like you're just describing what the trees already do lul

[wanton dawn]

I might be the 1st to say reddit ppl are not good, but I entertain the though that discord ppl are no better

[midnight totem]

True, just spitballing ideas

[hearty panther]

i put discord moderately above reddit because the conversation here keeps moving so if you keep saying dumb shit you eventually get your ass corrected and as long as that flow is maintained then thats that

[wanton dawn]

Yeah but discord conv are also a cycle

[hearty panther]

but on reddit any dipshit can post total lunacy and end up with 300 upvotes entirely by accident and Google will put their thread right at the top if you ask it the right/wrong question

[wanton dawn]

Every week there is someone here asking if rampage is still the best PS blessing

[hearty panther]

which is good cause if they asked anywhere else i dont the response would be better lol

but tbh reddit, discord, the unimaginable shithole that is steam forums, dont actually hold a candle to youtube's disinformation lol

[radiant chasm]

there is also some people who have been caught openly using alt accounts and possibly upvote/downvote buying to steer their narrative

[hearty panther]

people want the easiest to digest answer and YouTube is the go-to for that

if you dont notice the video was posted a year ago and all the info is outdated? well

sucks

[wanton dawn]

There is still a DT youtube scene ?

Haven't they all moved to greener pasture ?

[hearty panther]

not really, but videos exist

and theyre mostly outdated

or god forbid

https://youtu.be/Dgv9M1ow0B8?si=mS5HBRKL82QxikNj

this is where MOST people are coming from with the game

[wanton dawn]

Why you post stuff you know I won't click on ?

[hearty panther]

ie. very incorrectly

fukken fatshark put this dude right on the launcher for

what a month i think?

[wanton dawn]

At least it is not tumor

[hearty panther]

i long for tumor

who's tumor

[wanton dawn]

It is an elaborate pun to avoid name search

[hearty panther]

i have assumptions

that they may be a goblin

[iron marten]

I've stayed away from youtube darktide, thankfully

[hearty panther]

who i am familiar with

[last parcel]

ah, the one who works with animal skins to create leather?

[wanton dawn]

I don't have any idea but I will say yes because it is funnier in my head

[somber axle]

Idk the discord regulars here tend to have solid talent builds and give good advice on recommended perks, blessings, etc.

I might be a Recon main but I'm not like the weirdo from Reddit who was arguing that the Recon is one of the best guns in the game and they were on Malice

I'm a clown and I know the limitations of the gun I love most

But I'm not that silly

[iron marten]

only advice I'm reasonably confident in giving is building a psword lol, but that'd be like to someone who only reached level 30 on vet

I'm still surprised at the amount that still run slaughterer or rampage, at least here in Australia

[wanton dawn]

Am not interested in giving advice anymore. Unless I learn smth in the process

[iron marten]

or the most interesting one I've seen: Slaughterer and Sunder on their psword

[somber axle]

That's fair

I lurk here a lot while at work so if someone's asking for info I know I like to share it

Especially when it concerns penances and meme builds to make them easier

[faint beacon]

That sounds like a PS focused around not using the sole reason people use them

I mean at that point I’d see what BM + Slaughter would do

You know it clicked to me right now after scrolling up a bit does VOC even buff your teammates damage output at all cause I know with Talents it can with the Vet user (Also yes VOC is beyond busted)

[hearty panther]

yes, for the emperor does

[faint beacon]

Guess I never really noticed VOC already carries hard enough

Wondering why they just don’t make that the main thing of it, just be a Damage buff

[hearty panther]

strictly it's not VoC, it's just an ult modifier

any ult could do it

but VoC could also

[faint beacon]

I’ve always wondered what the hell should do with it cause I know it’s agreed it needs either a nerf or rework of some kind

[iron marten]

seeing plasma gun get 100 cleave and fs never touching it since

it's funny how VoC got buffed since it got first introduced

its only nerf was when they brought the +100 gold toughness you get to +50 instead

and the reason they nerfed it was cause of the cooldown going from 45s to 30s

[terse idol]

Wh

[faint beacon]

It… used to be 100

[terse idol]

Eh

I mean I do think FS is a little stuck on the VOC train rn

It is much weaker

Or well

Marginally

[faint beacon]

Ehhhhhhhhhhh Vets Talents make up for it

[terse idol]

It should be 25+ yellow toughness

[faint beacon]

Killing a shit ton of specials instantly gets VOC back

[iron marten]

Yeah.
P13 it was 45s cd, +50
then it became 45s cd, +100
then 30s cd, +100
then 30s cd, +50

[terse idol]

And you need to invest another talent point for a bigger stagger

[hearty panther]

i mean my opinion is it loses gold toughness entirely and only the zealot gets it

otherwise i think gold toughness needs a total rework

that shit does way too fucking much

[iron marten]

voc even without gold toughness is pretty good

[faint beacon]

Exploits me have idea

[terse idol]

I do think 25 is good, but honestly if it just only refilled toughness without yellow health

Thatd be okay

[faint beacon]

Me say…. Damage reduction

[terse idol]

It would be strictly worse when your team is doing better on high health

[faint beacon]

So it’s not golden it just makes you take less toughness damage

[terse idol]

Damage reduction is eh

Oh

Thaat

I mean 25 gold toughness is probably good enough

Or yeah no gold