trench fighter and weapon specialist are the only melee attack speed bonuses from the tree
#veteran-class
last parcel
just always have celery stim active 
somber axle
I don't base my gameplay around stims so I don't care if it feels good with celerity stim
dreamy spade
Well the light is nearly as fast as heavy which is weird
oblique totem
As always, drugs are the answer.
last parcel
replace pilk with celery stim
somber axle
somber axle
replace pilk with celery stim
I'd rather have the pilk right now
dreamy spade
Dont do lsd
somber axle
I've never done drugs tbh
last parcel
you should try ibuprofen
somber axle
my drug is spending money on cosmetics in games
somber axle
you should try ibuprofen
nyquil chicken
last parcel
oblique totem
Wake up before you get put to sleep
oblique totem
my drug is spending money on cosmetics in games
My drugs are caffeine and discontent.
somber axle
My drugs are caffeine and discontent.
caffeine gives me life when I'm working but outside of work I'd never drink it
Starbucks would eat my bank account
oblique totem
Funny, because of ADHD it actually calms me a bit so I can't take it at work or I get sleepy
west minnow
On Overwatch Penance 😢
sage token
oh yeah i forget about that all the time
ocean sundial
black ops 1 guy mains black ops 1 guy
gilded wraith
so does tac axe
What's a good tac axe look like?
somber axle
What's a good tac axe look like?
this is the one I use
the mobility is low but I'm not really bothered missing a dodge
mint robin
The most I've ever been complemented for my gameplay lol
somber axle
I personally prefer the Tac Axe Mk IV
tame lodge
Discord crop moment
serene bough
tac axe not having uncanny is a real deal breaker
hearty panther
not really
just means i dont have to whine about the inevitable nerf
brutal momentum and uncanny strike are both blessings where i think "wow this is ridiculous value and shouldnt be in the game" instead of "wow what an interesting mechanic that more weapons should have"
serene bough
even if you nerf it , having some element of rending is still prefered for assassin weapons
i mean sure you could remove/rework them
but until then tac axe cant compete w/ weapons that have uncanny
terse idol
hearty panther
and taxe really doesnt 'need' it
you can already juice its damage 75% with DC + HT which is close to what Uncanny would do for you on average
its only on carapace that it feels 'lacking' but it actually manages carapace fine. not quickly but can control two crushers easily and you do, in fact, kill them
serene bough
meh
hearty panther
and crits being what they are, thats another avenue to circumvent carapace
anyway i resent uncanny and bromentum deeply
serene bough
i dont mind bromentum but uncanny could definitely get toned down
furthermore, uncanny strikes applying to grenades is really nuts
somber axle
but until then tac axe cant compete w/ weapons that have uncanny
for what specifically
like against armour sure a Mk VI Knife is going to pry open a Crusher/Mauler ezpz
the horde clear is mediocre though
going through a horde with tac axe is magical
serene bough
i wouldnt grab an assassin weapon to prioritize horde clear personally
somber axle
I'm also the rare creature that tends to build my ranged weapons for anti-armour
Plasma and Revolver can kinda just do it by default with the meta builds
you can pretty much delete Crushers with almost any ranged weapon in the game if you care about doing it that much
serene bough
i mean sure if you bring an anti-armor gun then your melee can be a bit more open to variety
but why would i use a tac axe for horde clear
somber axle
because if you bring a melee and don't have horde clear on it, and you bring ranged and don't have horde clear on it, then you're going to spend eternity killing poxwalkers unless you rely entirely on your squad to do it for you
I look at loadouts like this: versatility
Can you do all these things?
Anti-Armour
Anti-Boss
Anti-Horde
Anti-Elite
Anti-Special
Anti-Disabler
if you're missing one
what's your plan when it happens?
serene bough
my point is a tac axe is not good for horde clear
hearty panther
taxe does everything
serene bough
or rather the effort to clear a horde can be better done by other weapons
somber axle
My Tac Axe does good horde clear but idk what yours looks like
Also like yeah other weapons can do better horde clear but other weapons also have other things to consider within the contexts of those weapons
serene bough
VII with bromentum + headtaker
serene bough
Also like yeah other weapons can do better horde clear but other weapons also ha...
thats very vague
somber axle
thats very vague
for example Chainswords
fantastic horde clear
terrible anti-armour weapon
it CAN do anti-carapace
it does it poorly
every weapon has tradeoffs to consider
serene bough
ye but you're bringing an anti-armor ranged weapon
hearty panther
except for taxes
hearty panther
clicking? in my video game?
somber axle
people already spam M1 with Rashad, Chainsword, Bleed Knives, Catachan Swords, etc.
if you don't want to spam click then yeah pick a weapon for your preferred playstyle
Tac Axe is surprisingly effective in my experience though
and I prefer it over Rashad Mk II Combat Axe after playing with both a bit
serene bough
it kills things
but the point that im making is there's much better horde clear options
somber axle
ye but you're bringing an anti-armor ranged weapon
all of my weapons are anti-armour to be fair
except for Lawbringer Shotgun
that's for anti-horde memes and can't hurt Crushers
but I was shocked at how much damage my Lawbringer Shotgun could do when blowing up bosses on my ranged build
Burgle 100-0 and didn't use my whole 10 shots
coral willow
feel like kant does more for a hordeclear but idk havent tested
somber axle
Kant does anti-mixed horde
but it doesn't do general horde clear as well as Lawbringer
the special fire shot is solid for helping clear ragers mixed in
it's not going to insta-delete a horde since they need to burn out
Lawbringer is deleting a wave, loading the next special shot, deleting that wave
Kant is setting the wave on fire with one shot, loading another special shot to stack the fire higher, and then watching it burn out
Lawbringer will have the targets dead before Kant even gets the second shot off
serene bough
wrong
somber axle
I love Recon Mk VId
serene bough
my way is the only way to play
hearty panther
i dont. ur a lesser person.
somber axle
i dont. ur a lesser person.
I'm a cat not a person
somber axle
no
serene bough
last parcel
i wouldn’t know
serene bough
theres actually a lot of cats in vet chat
somber axle
cat chat
serene bough
vet chat cats
last parcel
vet cat a chat jungle vorers
hearty panther
and yea i get not liking the feel of some weapons. like i dont think ill ever love the chainsword no matter what performance it has, because to me it just swings in a way i can only describe as noodle-y and off tempo
coral willow
lawbringer will always suck for me
winter grove
Is it bad that I am enjoying MG12 a lot
hearty panther
but the tac axe, like whats the mystery? of course theyre good weapons lmao
coral willow
when it used to do the funny elite pen kills
it was nice
now anything that comes in a line is the most weakness the weapon has
winter grove
Is it bad that I am enjoying MG12 a lot
Like it oneshots everyone every time
hearty panther
good finesse, crit damage mod, attack speed baked in, workable cleave, during a meta where juicing finesse and crits is the best play? and it can have two power blessings? fuck yea
coral willow
Is it bad that I am enjoying MG12 a lot
wasnt it not buffed alongside the other lasguns while the other two got megabuffs and now match the DPS of MG12
hearty panther
and what's that? the special attack can stop a Mutie dead in its tracks with a headshot? and a crusher overhead? sweet
coral willow
and what's that? the special attack can stop a Mutie dead in its tracks with a h...
tbh never use that proper
its nice that every special that poke can somewhat do this
winter grove
but the tac axe, like whats the mystery? of course theyre good weapons lmao
Taxes on WS are funny
hearty panther
IV has the best special
winter grove
4th is basically best taxe
coral willow
IV has the best special
i like using mk7
hearty panther
since the first two swings are pinpoint outward
instead of an actual swing with direction
makes muties a breeze
somber axle
I love the Tac Axe IV special attack
literally controlling an entire pack of flak ragers without getting hit LOL
coral willow
idk why but i just dont like tacaxe 4
faint beacon
is it cause the Taxes typically revolve around Strikedowns or just that specific Taxe
hearty panther
theyre all 'strikedowns'
junior needle
the mk4 has a good light cleave moveset
coral willow
much prefer the mk7 even with light 2 stupidly disjointed and never hitting anything
junior needle
The 2 and 7 have the weird single target lights
junior needle
That's why I like it
winter grove
the mk4 has a good light cleave moveset
Can't mk4 just basically spam light for everything
junior needle
I autoclick for everything with it
junior needle
Can't mk4 just basically spam light for everything
Yes, it's actually the most efficient way to use it
coral willow
boring for me already did that with rashad
winter grove
Because on taxes the lights do better against armor
Somehow
hearty panther
you can and should throw in push attacks
junior needle
carapace that is
hearty panther
and yes dps is better against carapace using lights
coral willow
junior needle
Taxes are in a weird spot where they don't really excel compared to alternatives and lack a real niche, excepting maybe the 4
coral willow
winter grove
Void staff if it was good
coral willow
like i have a near perfect mk4 and a mk7
junior needle
Also their moveset is off putting and goofy
junior needle
like i have a near perfect mk4 and a mk7
so with the 4
hearty panther
their niche is they are 7/10 against pretty much everything
junior needle
You actually don't bother with brutal
winter grove
Not sure about bronentum on 4
hearty panther
i do deci + ht always
winter grove
It doesn't hit any breakpoints so
winter grove
You go shred/headtaker
^
hearty panther
more importantly none have any particularly good horizontal attack
junior needle
You can go deci but it depends on how much you like gambling about losing your stacks on a whiff
winter grove
so thats bricked?
Not necessarily
junior needle
I like shred for more ease of use and consistency
hearty panther
nah thats unimportant
coral willow
You can go deci but it depends on how much you like gambling about losing your s...
me when mk7 auto-whiffs
i like using mk7 cause i can combo with it
winter grove
Bromentum isn't bad on 4
hearty panther
high potential with deci is nice but the best thing is getting 10% damage up on every swing
coral willow
it still has the stupid disjointed light 2
winter grove
It's just shred+HT is better
junior needle
Bromentum is only gonna feasibly hit poxwalkers and groaners on a 4
Which drags down the value a lot when you get stuck on bruisers
coral willow
actually like the single target on mk7 lights cause it kills quick
coral willow
Bromentum is only gonna feasibly hit poxwalkers and groaners on a 4
it just overrelies itself on crits from what i remember
winter grove
Opening salvo on MG12 is really cool
junior needle
it just overrelies itself on crits from what i remember
You appear to need juice, headtaker, and also a crit with this kind of roll to get one taps.
junior needle
I forgor to reset that dreg bruiser
So he had no health when getting whacked
But yeah you need more melee juice than vet can provide to get non-crit one taps on it
on bruisers
coral willow
mk7 heavy has a fucking cleave
junior needle
Maybe with agile engagement
But if it needs agile+headtaker stacks it's gonna be a smaller window
Maybe with both deci and headtaker
but then you don't have brudal 
coral willow
i just prefer mk7 more
hearty panther
for lights you need everything
precision strikes, desperado, ht + deci, cqkz active, and flak unarmored
if you want to one tap light attack bruisers
my opinion? not worth, just throw a heavy attack
push attacks are the same as heavy attacks as well
coral willow
imho mk7 heavy just cleaves tham regardless so thats why i like it
junior needle
Yeah, the heavy moveset isn't practical for brutal usage on the 4 though. Let me see what the PA on the 4 looks like
Another issue with taxes is that they also require more effort for the same or less results compared to others
Eh, 4 has a diagonal PA
junior needle
Oh yeah you don't even bother using heavies on the 4
I have to deduct points from the taxes overall performance if they require more effort than others to do the same thing
junior needle
If by innate cleave you mean it isn't as reliant on brutal on a baseline
coral willow
ye
junior needle
That doesn't matter much if you have to take brutal for optimal performance anyway
coral willow
kinda
brutal momentum is an actual bonus rather than a nessesity like rashads do makes it more relaxed imho
junior needle
I do agree that weapons shouldnt be entirely reliant on certain blessings
Fatshark did a bad with that
somber axle
Another issue with taxes is that they also require more effort for the same or l...
Is that factoring in the effort to get 2 million dockets and uncountable plasteel to roll a Mk II Combat Axe with ideal stats, perks and blessings
junior needle
Is that factoring in the effort to get 2 million dockets and uncountable plastee...
Just roll better
coral willow
Is that factoring in the effort to get 2 million dockets and uncountable plastee...
why mk2?
junior needle
rashad has the best natural potential of the caxes
hearty panther
checks out
junior needle
Because it has the good moveset and also the finesse stat instead of cleave targets on antax
hearty panther
bm isnt natural its an affront to god itself
coral willow
rashad has the best natural potential of the caxes
nah it cant oneshot bulwarks unlike achylis
:teeth;
somber axle
why mk2?
The Rashad Mk II is arguably one of the strongest of the melee weapons in the game right now up there with Knife and Power Sword but it requires a near perfect roll to even see the performance people tell you it can reach
junior needle
Yeah I dunno about bulwark one shots
coral willow
ah you meant rashad
coral willow
Yeah I dunno about bulwark one shots
had one on the charge H1 with thrust for achylis
big W in my books
coral willow
ye
somber axle
Idk I think Power Sword has better horde clear and better single target kill potential for 1HKO or 2HKO Crusher hunting but the Rashad is like good in lots of things without sacrificing mobility or requiring you to charge up strikes
coral willow
oh i know but you cant brutal momentum one to kill 3 in one swing
i felt dopamine with that one
it was dropping from the ceiling so it was stunlocked regardless but
that was fun to do
junior needle
Is that factoring in the effort to get 2 million dockets and uncountable plastee...
iirc the mk2 taxe is MORE particular about stats and perks than rashad is
hearty panther
what if an ogryn held u up by the ankles overtop their shield
junior needle
I assume the mk7 is as well
coral willow
i felt dopamine with that one
they were in the dropping motion and got kill 3 for bulwarks
really fun
otherwise its good for gunner oneshots
cause my rashad still cant oneshot dreg gunners
probably can do with a near perfect god roll and a unarmored
i use maniac and unyielding
hearty panther
i cannot spend my dockets fast enough
coral willow
no i dont cause i let marty do that
last parcel
finally, another martyr vet
junior needle
Zealots forget the zealot channel is a zealot channel as well
coral willow
tbh i just value more about killing bulwarks/crushers and ragers
with ogryn damage and stuff?
thats fun
vet having yet another better shit than of zealot
gilded rock
Zealots forget the zealot channel is a zealot channel as well
Helps with chat retention tbh
coral willow
dont remember vet having that much
winter grove
oh i know but you cant brutal momentum one to kill 3 in one swing
Rashad feels like cheating on zealot
coral willow
two overall damage nodes and then a quickswitch one
coral willow
Rashad feels like cheating on zealot
that was about achylis zealot
winter grove
Point still stands
gilded rock
Ermmm yeah dude... they've been fighting more
coral willow
overall melee tree is probably more busted than the "never gets used" part of
zealot
i know that
only few stands out in zealot's tree compared to just gem after gem on vet
but dont remember seeing much of melee exclusive damage increase
winter grove
true
Although I feel no impact from killing 4 people in one swing
Feels like I am swinging a lead pipe
coral willow
Although I feel no impact from killing 4 people in one swing
def has a shit
resis
i do like a single fucking non-keystone node on vet throws an entire keystone out of the window for zealot
winter grove
def has a shit
I meant as in I don't feel impact of a weapon
coral willow
imho its so rigid
winter grove
As vet I even feel taxe mk4 being a beast of a weapon
Because my guy swings it so fast and practically becomes a lawnmower
coral willow
i dont even take second wind on half my builds
i just go down the middle one and pray to god emperor
coral willow
cause knife sucks and also its accompanied by one of the best toughness damage reduction nodes zealot has access too
winter grove
The keystones are really good
gilded rock
Veteran is so funny that keystones aren't mandatory at all
Because of the innate value of so many talents, sometimes it's better to NOT take a keystone xd
winter grove
But I don't say you necessarily need them for vet build to be good
winter grove
Because of the innate value of so many talents, sometimes it's better to NOT tak...
Bro fr
coral willow
the other node is also good
winter grove
I've got a keystoneless build for a vet and I am 100% sure it'd be worse if I went for keystones
gilded rock
I've got a keystoneless build for a vet and I am 100% sure it'd be worse if I we...
That's my recon build
coral willow
50% toughness damage reduction is great
hearty panther
speaking of vet being zany, mk12 chaxe on vet is hilarious
austere pine
veteran class
winter grove
Chaxe is funny
gilded rock
veteran class
Much varierty
winter grove
That's my recon build
That's a lasgun build for me
coral willow
imho depends since fotf piety build can get the charge back in less than 10
second wind is def good tho
shame it doesnt work with stripped down
eh
hearty panther
second wind is toughness for free
doing a thing you should already always be doing
yea each time you hear that ranged fire record scratch all i hear is cash money
gilded rock
I think On Your Toes is slept on
coral willow
its the only option for zealot to gain toughness outside of melee combat
vast edge
Warframe moment.
last parcel
payday 2 anarchist players
coral willow
i just infight all the time and get scratches from melee more than i run to enemies
its def good
especially ones that dont have much leeway of toughness
i just value the stray hits being absorbed more in cqc secnarios
little closer yea
vet still has crazy options for toughness tho
winter grove
Vet and Zealot are really similar, although not sure if zealot can make good gun builds
hearty panther
i love out for blood but its no dodge toughness
coral willow
Vet and Zealot are really similar, although not sure if zealot can make good gun...
have made like 1 with braced auto
austere pine
Vet and Zealot are really similar, although not sure if zealot can make good gun...
good flamer but that's not a talent-related build
thing with blaze away can shred tanks
put fury on that and it shreds carapace too
gilded rock
Thammer 
winter grove
have made like 1 with braced auto
With turtolsky?
austere pine
fucking bleed knife not sure where you all are at in your zealot journeys
coral willow
austere pine
a crucis setup is
coral willow
With turtolsky?
no a knife
coral willow
dH is less taxxign since it has lower HP than most bosses
winter grove
no a knife
Womp womp
gilded rock
A thammer built for boss damage with shroudfield or even fury, depending, can one shot them
junior needle
once saw a zealot literally oneshot a damnation dh
thammer shroudfield marty can do funny damage
coral willow
agrapina revolver sucking on every other situation sad
gilded rock
Revolvers are busted as hell on both classes and I would see a nerf coming for them or vets
coral willow
A thammer built for boss damage with shroudfield or even fury, depending, can on...
dont think fotf can hit anything
coral willow
Revolvers are busted as hell on both classes and I would see a nerf coming for t...
idk about agrapina
if it had a cleave i'd say it's a nice alternative
usually the zarona stumps tho
gilded rock
Agree that vet is silly but thammer objectively matches boss dmg
coral willow
zarona oneshotting crushers will never not be funny
winter grove
Agree that vet is silly but thammer objectively matches boss dmg
Thammers feel like specific tool for that
coral willow
can you do good special snipe with agrapina
cause i remember it being suckish
also just spamming power sword 6 on the boss just works and probably deals more damage than your average zealot build
it isnt probably
rashad is nuts
and i dont have one on vet yet
most of my zealot build goes either this or that
i would if i have the points
spent on sustained assault
rashad build obv takes iut
crit
crit
wee
also technically a crit weapon
junior needle
Vet and Zealot are really similar, although not sure if zealot can make good gun...
Zealots can leverage brautos fairly well with that one spread talent
coral willow
dam i have like 3 builds out of
12 that take second wind
junior needle
But otherwise fall behind vet in most regards
somber axle
iirc the mk2 taxe is MORE particular about stats and perks than rashad is
It looks like it needs the same stats, perks and blessings tbh
coral willow
mk15evi mk3knife ironhelm crusher catachan mk4chainsword rashad tacaxe chaxe knife/wagrapionabraced crusis HS9 knife(again)
cant do much of solo maelstroms but i just like more stuff
and unfortunately
zealot kinda lacks melee variety
well "variety"
i spent it all i think
evi15 just has sustainablilty and that about it
might get second wind for chainsword build
since its literally same build as the evi anyway
junior needle
It looks like it needs the same stats, perks and blessings tbh
Similar, but iirc the taxes are more particular (before you get into the particular benefits of light spam for clear vs heavy spam)
I will take a look again
coral willow
why hs7 btw?
isnt that the one with a uppercut heavy as first
right BM
i use headtaker + rampage
for now
usually recommended on korea since if you go for deathblow people just say go for rashad p sure
more decent ones i have
exclude the 2 elites in the category and its fine mostly if the game didnt spam them and zealot having more anti-armor options other tha relying on FotF or bolter/revolver
oh yeah i use
marty with this
for marty second wind is good
5stack marty gives like 40% and momentum gives like 15% max now
used to run momentum instead when it wasnt nerfed tbh
junior needle
It looks like it needs the same stats, perks and blessings tbh
Yeah the taxes are more particular about juice. I can hit both bruisers types without any talent bonuses on a rashad with max headtaker stacks, but can't on a taxe 2 heavy.
coral willow
rashad
rager 2shots or sometimes with dualist oneshot muties cause why not
i get about the BP argument
..i have oneshot many muties
might be cause head
no
actual muties
no
junior needle
5stack marty gives like 40% and momentum gives like 15% max now
Muties do take extra melee damage
oh whoops
coral willow
yeah 3x
junior needle
didnt mean to quote
winter grove
Muties do take extra melee damage
You can even oneshot muties with some melees I heard
I know turtolsky and ds4 can oneshot a mutie
austere pine
i know i have a vet that's from cadia but i've been exclusively a loose cannon main on both of my vet characters. should i try playing a cutthroat for a bit?
winter grove
i know i have a vet that's from cadia but i've been exclusively a loose cannon m...
Cutthroat is the biggest bitch out of all 3
austere pine
Cutthroat is the biggest bitch out of all 3
"b- but cadia!"
coral willow
might be dualist poking?
no
fresh one that was running to me
i use the HP mod to see them anyway
light to the head and dead
junior needle
Shroud can get you some one taps too
winter grove
"b- but cadia!"
We have
· NCO that's tired of everyone's shit
· A lovable asshole
· Cadian that can't stop bitching
junior needle
What about duellist
coral willow
alright wp does 261->384
0.79 wp bonus so 1.79x damage p sure
25% maniac on my axe
6 stack of marty with full multihit buff nets me +90% damage
+5 from tree
and a 3x melee multiplier
so its like 1333 hp
i dont use desperation, i do use backstabber
2 marty stack with 3225 wp light
not sure if i reached it myself but i defeinitely did it before
thats with 5 stack marty?
damn i remember it being more destructive
clear lantern
Doing an olé! on a charging mutie and killing it so it flies with a strong melee weapon is the most fun you can have with them outside of an ogryn rebar brick
orchid hemlock
clear lantern
those are headphones alright
hybrid token
somber axle
Yeah the taxes are more particular about juice. I can hit both bruisers types wi...
idk about the Tac Axe II tbh because I only really play with the Tac Axe IV right now
but I also have no idea what all is required to hit the breakpoints for Tac Axe IV because I kinda just got a near perfect roll for one and don't really plan on doing clown science to check how certain perks for blessings change it
I just know the speed feels really, really good
and the speed on the Rashad Mk II Combat Axe even despite both trench fighter and weapon specialist feels too sluggish for me
junior needle
idk about the Tac Axe II tbh because I only really play with the Tac Axe IV righ...
rashad 2 and tax 4 are very different
junior needle
You don't even go brutal on taxe 4
somber axle
I love the strikedown on the first heavy for Tac Axe IV
junior needle
You don't even use heavies on it
somber axle
the follow up rising strike makes it almost feel like a samurai sword LOL
junior needle
Just light spam because it's just better
somber axle
wdym no brutal
I have brutal on my tac axe and still spam through hordes effectively
junior needle
taxe 4 can't hit bruiser one taps without crits
somber axle
is that with all the funny melee juice
junior needle
So the value from brutal goes down a lot
coral willow
closest one i got was like 3885 on a already damaged mutie it seems
might be wrong
or just that im bad at counting
probably
either way i had like once it was possible
might be not possible anymore
junior needle
I have brutal on my tac axe and still spam through hordes effectively
We were talking about this earlier, you need a LOT of juice to reach one taps on bruisers including on ult activations
And also deci apparently, so you can't even go brutal for it
We're talking about the 4 using lights
somber axle
We were talking about this earlier, you need a LOT of juice to reach one taps on...
you know me
coral willow
least PA-heavy is fast on mk7
last parcel
i never would've guessed
junior needle
But yeah, brudal is not practical for bruiser breakpoints on taxe 4 lights
Or possible if that's correct
Because it needs deci and HT
junior needle
taxe 4 has better cleave on lights
Because its lights dont have those strikedowns
with 1.5 cleave
coral willow
welp another lacerate knife
junior needle
What's nth hit damage?
No target cap?
Neat, werent caxes like that as well back in the day?
The bug was the head hit prioritization right
It would magnetize to the body
junior needle
you know me
But yeah, you'd be better off taking something else instead of brutal on a 4
Same, that's what I recommend for the 4
coral willow
hadron knows how to ruin a mood
somber axle
But yeah, you'd be better off taking something else instead of brutal on a 4
wouldn't that make it worse for horde clear?
junior needle
wouldn't that make it worse for horde clear?
You aren't one tapping bruisers, this hamstrings your overall effectiveness with brutal
somber axle
even without 1 tapping brusiers (though I do think I can juice it into doing that) general horde clear of poxwalkers/groaners feels like it'd be faster yeah
junior needle
even without 1 tapping brusiers (though I do think I can juice it into doing tha...
Someone seems to have tested it and non-crit lights supposedly can't be juiced to that level while taking brutal
I already sent the configuration before
coral willow
wouldve perferred a skullcrusher but thunderstrike is fine
still need to get skullcrusher and thunderous
somber axle
Someone seems to have tested it and non-crit lights supposedly can't be juiced t...
even with CQKZ, FtE, Marksman, Precision Strikes, Infiltrate + Surprise Attack, Desperado, Fire Team, +5% melee damage and +10% melee damage talents?
if this sounds unrealistic
somber axle
and it sounds goofy
junior needle
It wasn't my testing
somber axle
yeah that's not even factoring in half of what I typed
there's more juice
that person tested with some of those
not all of them
junior needle
Yeah uh, feel free to test it but
somber axle
as a juice addict I can juice things into doing impractical nonsense
I mean like
I actively run Tac Axe IV
I've felt it clean hordes
so it's just confusing when I'm told it can't do something I've already done
the person even says that it can do it
just requires immense investment
hearty panther
its a heavy commitment to get faster kill times on an enemy your weapon already trivializes, yeah
somber axle
and they don't believe the investment is worth
junior needle
clean hordes =/= 1 tap bruisers
somber axle
its a heavy commitment to get faster kill times on an enemy your weapon already ...
I live for the speed
hearty panther
its just like
im ok with clicking twice lmao
taxe is always fast, caxe by comparison, is glacial
somber axle
yeah caxe is just too slow on melee swing speed for me
even with all the melee weapon attack speed it feels slow
like it's definitely doing work
it's just slow work
I need the speed
junior needle
Welp, you'll likely be better served by just forgoing brutal instead of going through all that effort to use it in particular
But it's your time
hearty panther
for me its easy, i see a bruiser, i push attack, it's dead, i move on
somber axle
can you do fastest speed
Yes and I have a chainsword with that and a funny talent set up for that reason LMFAO
hearty panther
honestly, too fast
hearty panther
and the old dueling sword one
coral willow
one of the reason i dont use it in my catachan build
(other is spamming relic is more reliable)
hearty panther
i thought it was special spam idr
coral willow
ill try brutal momentum heavy sword later when i get to use it
hearty panther
stripped down does feed into duck n dive but
the game already feeds you enough stamina tbh
coral willow
slaughterer power cycler isnt bad but imma try BM now
nvm i dont have BM 4 on my power sword
i know
time to fix this piece of shit
idk how to think about BM outside of rashad tbh
somber axle
Yes
hearty panther
its just a dummy blessing
coral willow
funny case in korea people dont usually recommend BM outside of rashad
ill make one about later i guess
deathblow for HS
sturdy zephyr
time to fix this piece of shit
This one shoot much slow fire rate? Or much much faster?
tall torrent
idk how to think about BM outside of rashad tbh
it's still insanely strong
coral willow
and something else i cant remember
coral willow
This one shoot much slow fire rate? Or much much faster?
fast one
coral willow
just make it stack on hit as a debuff
thunderous
tall torrent
I think weapons with uncanny should have higher base ADM and uncanny's number reduced significantly
it's such a crutch blessing for everything that has it
next to no build craft variety
tall torrent
I'm just waiting for patch 19 now not gonna finish guide before then
they're gonna update stuff anyways
tall torrent
Huh?
vs isolated smaller groups, knife doesn't kill them that slow
is what he means
vs a big dense horde, no it sucks
tall torrent
Remind me what ft is
flesh tearer
hearty panther
fart tripper
junior needle
I run flesh tearer on my zealot and the horde clear on the mk3 is still pretty slow
But I am using the 3
Yeah I haven't seen that
I'm running FT uncanny
On a shroud/piety setup
coral willow
lacerate exists
junior needle
Lacerate is shit
coral willow
its fine
agile forge
lacerate exists
But it shouldn't
junior needle
It's not
last parcel
here we go again
coral willow
not like it'll stop here anytime soon so
hearty panther
we dont use the L word in this discord
junior needle
You can only hit 1 scab bruiser at a time with mk3 lights, are we using dreg bruisers as a measurement
Heavies on the mk3 have no cleave 
coral willow
ye
hearty panther
but they kill
coral willow
general recommendation from here didnt change much
agile forge
I think the mk3 should get its clear buffed
Doesn't need it imo
coral willow
after my talk over there tbh
junior needle
Someone made a chart on weapon clear times with various setups and the knives were near the bottom by a large margin
coral willow
FT still has its place
junior needle
Was it the japanese characters guy
He was testing talentless I think, on 100 poxwalkers
Some of the setups looked very sus but apparently it was for shits and giggles
Is that with talents?
coral willow
you guys should try to convince a korean to not use lacerate at one point would be very funny
junior needle
Yeah so the testing method didn't match then
Because he was doing a talentless test
I'm very not surprised you could get better times even on bruisers
coral willow
Because he was doing a talentless test
rashad would suck much there
least its poxwalkers so still oneshots
junior needle
I assume it was for testing everything in a vacuum regardless of build
Which is still helpful
late hatch
junior needle
What constitutes a "regular" and a "melee" build are very subjective and people will disagree a lot
I can see why testing talentless is helpful
Even playing field for a baseline
There's plenty of people who just take really bad trees or no melee talents
coral willow
or not take 30% wp
bitter turtle
you guys should try to convince a korean to not use lacerate at one point would ...
i already recorded to show why lacerate is shit tho
coral willow
i already recorded to show why lacerate is shit tho
showed it and didnt flinch sorry idk why
junior needle
i already recorded to show why lacerate is shit tho
Post da chart japanese characters man, I lost it
hearty panther
i accept this challenge
bitter turtle
FT with heavies headshotting
vs Lacerate spamming lights
while making the attempt to headshot at least
it wasnt even close
literally almost 2x as slow
to do lacerate
i can imagine yea
it was literally 20+ seconds vs 13 vs 25 poxwalkers
almost twice as bad
umbral scaffold
Mercy killer/lacerate goo brr
junior needle
Mercy killer/lacerate goo brr
Even worse choice on vet
umbral scaffold
no shit serrated exists
junior needle
I can't tell for sure if someone is being ironic over the internet
umbral scaffold
Good for you man
junior needle
Especially with the sprout icon
The amount of people who unironically say these things
umbral scaffold
🤡
junior needle
coral willow
it was literally 20+ seconds vs 13 vs 25 poxwalkers
did post about it btw noone flinched unfortunately
junior needle
What an awkward conversation
bitter turtle
if lacerate users believed in logic and evidence in the first place
they wouldnt be using lacerate
coral willow
if lacerate users believed in logic and evidence in the first place
nope, other logics
possibly the other half being just recommended to newbie players then
since the community is small
junior needle
Considering knife users are the most complained about
Perhaps that's not exactly true
Especially with so many of them opting to not aim for the head
coral willow
dumb to not aim for the head for heavys
for some lights also
guess thats the difference then
we do have more builds for new players
stoic mantle
Does anyone know what counts for armourbane?
is it just anything that the krak grenades magnetize to
serene bough
Anything armored w/ flak or greater
stoic mantle
So a grenade into a pack of scabs would add progress?
serene bough
Yeah but you'll probably not kill many
stoic mantle
I'm just looking to boost things cause holy moly 73/500
coral willow
cant deny FT is more generalistic if you have the crit chances for it
play maelstrom has that skab facton stuff on it so you can throw at ogryns 24/7
serene bough
Krak penance was irritating
stoic mantle
Whats the worse ogryn penance
depends, grinding alone or with someone?
stoic mantle
this with randoms is agony
serene bough
All I need left is the backstab one
coral willow
this with randoms is agony
just play gungryn
stoic mantle
I was
coral willow
did that in a few hours from what i remember
coral willow
i did that before i got the munitorum favor
serene bough
What about ripper
stoic mantle
But if you get people with the flamethrower staff its 100% every fight
cause the suppression on that staff is unreal
I got the lucky bullet one long before suppression
hearty panther
plug in two mice
stoic mantle
achlys and constantly spraying
hearty panther
twice the shooting
stoic mantle
I did it through maelstroms to get progress on that penance too
which ended up being a lot of 3 and 4
so stuff died too quickly
didn't have time to get suppressed
serene bough
All im understanding here is if you truly go ogryn brain and W+M1 then these penances are doable
Crazy
stoic mantle
I guess i just hit the 12% above average
charmed reload also helped
There were some fights that I held m1 for like a minute straight
yes, but you spend more time shooting less time reloading
MORE DAKKA
MORE DAKKA
It is
but thats all ogryn penances
serene bough
stoic mantle
Like I said, I guess I just hit the 12% more than 12% of the time
serene bough
60% of the time it works 100% of the time
stoic mantle
with the fastest firing stubber
I gotta say, I'm excited to get to the weapons specialist penance
its gonna be a quick one with revolver
clear lantern
this with randoms is agony
You mean inevitable
stoic mantle
indeed
Helps if you play vet like zealot
honestly stand up and fight might be the slowest vet penance
serene bough
Which is that
stoic mantle
restore 7500 toughness to yourself with voice of command
serene bough
Yeah that one is cake
serene bough
I did the MF penance the legit way
stoic mantle
and I've been using the mk1 devils claw
serene bough
only vet penance that sucks is krak, the rest are pretty manageable
stoic mantle
and i can butcher a whole horde never dropping below 95% toughness
elder fiber
I don't get hit
enter pox gas modifier and huff all the weed gas you can manage
coral willow
trying out brutal momentum ps3
stoic mantle
enter pox gas modifier and huff all the weed gas you can manage
I got bored with power sword
tried the chainswords, didn't like the combos, the whipped out the mk1 claw
this is my shit
but its boooooooring
stoic mantle
How's my drip?
coral willow
feel like BM works better with the heavy swings since it has slightly better damage
coral willow
can you reach 1shot ragers?
cool sticking to my ps3 then
stelf oneshots them for some reason
killed 6 in one blow
guess BM is good
i did
idk how
should've screencapped
that was fun
coral willow
possibly the latter two was heavily damaged since i did this on the elevator to vigil station
last parcel
should've screencapped
just do it again
https://www.nexusmods.com/warhammer40kdarktide/mods/25
hearty panther
what if you were four veterans stuffed into one body
midnight totem
coral willow
clear lantern
babby's first visual C++ gui here
coral willow
anyway wierd interaction
i assume ping has nothing to do with it got to NA West server and got that
somber axle
Yeah that's fair LOL
I can't keep up with you, but I do hold my own in my own Auric Damnation matches all the time and enjoy some Maelstroms
I felt like I did ok with the Mk II Helbore even if I flubbed it a bit
and I thiiiiink that third match I did ok? idk
I didn't have Scoreboard active so I wasn't sure
but I was slowly shaking off being nervous and getting back into my usual clown rhythm
Also sorry for late response!
Was in the middle of a movie date
fiery wave
Super low spawns
coral willow
i used stelf and got a good swing to the head killing them all
different game but fun
idk why it worked in front of me, fun
also got very good roll
making shit up with forgetting to screencap
:teeth;
anyway
worked for me situation
last parcel
possibly the latter two was heavily damaged since i did this on the elevator to ...
you know why
coral willow
shrug
with stelf its def possible to oneshot one so BM should work for the 4th rager
hearty panther
did u try with fury of the faithful
coral willow
i can hit you with the "it worked for me" but ill just get more info about it
heres the one i used
hearty panther
one look at ogryns maniac damage tables would psychologically cripple any other class
coral willow
one look at ogryns maniac damage tables would psychologically cripple any other ...
rock exists i guess
hadron only gives lvl 3 forever
that said probably doesnt matter with both BM and uncanny
hearty panther
crusher head blown clean off with a thrust
coral willow
if it doesnt have BM would ie be useful than the shovel tho
old quail
duelling sword with ogryn mobility (and none of the reach)
iron marten
Vet with ds4… I can only dream…
sturdy zephyr
I need opinion on guns. Got sandwiched shock troop gaunlet. Alot of em my pistol cant keep up. Any suggestion?
atomic zephyr
plasma, columnus iag
gilded rock
I need opinion on guns. Got sandwiched shock troop gaunlet. Alot of em my pistol...
Recon VIIa :^) Most special and elite kills per mag in the game (that's a guess)
Or you could go plasma or Columnus V... ig...
tame lodge
Helbore 3 (swap time sucks) hits hard
junior needle
I need opinion on guns. Got sandwiched shock troop gaunlet. Alot of em my pistol...
Show us your weapon and if you have any preferences
Recons are also numerically undertuned at the moment
torn moat
Helbore 3 (swap time sucks) hits hard
HB3 is over kill for Elites. HB2 or HB1 is better. Also stabbier.
radiant chasm
HB3 is over kill for Elites. HB2 or HB1 is better. Also stabbier.
hb3 blasts harder
atomic zephyr
Or you could go plasma or Columnus V... ig...
hey he didnt say he wanted anything original
radiant chasm
just partial charge if you need too, just another layer of skill expression
atomic zephyr
ive taken a liking to vraks 7 hhauto and infiltrate
pop stealth, get to a nice and cozy spot, shoot everything that looks like a problem
plus, very speedy emergency revive when needed
tame lodge
ive taken a liking to vraks 7 hhauto and infiltrate
Same
sturdy zephyr
Show us your weapon and if you have any preferences
I will let me set it
shadow dagger
I wonder what the under the hood reason for clambers just not going through is
somber axle
I need opinion on guns. Got sandwiched shock troop gaunlet. Alot of em my pistol...
Recon Mk VId is my choice but to recommend something a bit more normal... the Helbores. I personally enjoy the Helbore Mk II for the speed and the bayonet thrust. But what kinds of things sandwiched you? Shotgunners? Gunners? Maulers? Ragers? If there's a certain enemy type that overwhelms you when there's a pack of them, I'd recommend a different kind of weapon to deal with them. I wouldn't recommend Lawbringer Shotgun for dealing with Crushers but I do use it to clear other elites/specials while mopping up hordes as an example
sturdy zephyr
Recon Mk VId is my choice but to recommend something a bit more normal... the He...
gunners,flamer. mix type. the melee like mauler n crusher are easier since we can toss krak. ranged one kinda out of control.
this fews i tested just now.
junior needle
Sneaky has very peculiar preferences
somber axle
gunners,flamer. mix type. the melee like mauler n crusher are easier since we ca...
If you like clicking heads then Headhunter Autoguns are very good. Vraks VII, Vraks III are both very good headhunters. I'm also a fan of the shotguns lately too and if you've got the shotguns full when they appear they can be a solid options to put down threats quick. Agripina for bolt action rifle gameplay, Lawbringer for general use. Kantrael is ok too but the spread ends up making it awkward at longer ranges when trying to hit gunners further away. I also really love Boltgun for just one tapping gunner after gunner after gunner
I like recommending non-meta weapons because everyone already knows the CIAG, Plasma and Zarona Revolver
sturdy zephyr
i tried ciag
its fast n good but ammo chugging IMO.
laspistol my fav i like the crits help taking down enemy
but not as fast as ciag.in single clip i can kill max 3 gunner short range.
junior needle
Ciag is actually pretty ammo efficient, just not as much as crit stacking ilas
somber axle
I think CIAG has very good damage so solid ammo efficiency per target but if you spray and pray into a horde of targets the ammo vanishes fast
Shock Trooper and Crit make automatic las weapons enjoy longer volleys between reloads
radiant chasm
If you like clicking heads then Headhunter Autoguns are very good. Vraks VII, Vr...
Kanty also has the worst damage fall off of the shotguns
Hence that it has the highest base damage but is out damaged by agri at any considerable range
somber axle
Yeah
Agri Slug is also insanely strong
The lower damage number on the Agripina Shotgun is deceptive
If you just keep loading special slugs it just takes turns one tapping elites and specials as they come
Click heads and evaporate enemies
junior needle
I like recommending non-meta weapons because everyone already knows the CIAG, Pl...
If someone has to ask what a good weapon is, they probably don't know
somber axle
If someone has to ask what a good weapon is, they probably don't know
Idk they said they had already tried CIAG. I'd probably argue that the Plasma has worse ammo troubles than the CIAG depending on the user so that's probably not a good thing to recommend either. Zarona Revolver is solid though
Like meta is what works for the widest pool of players pushing into hard content but just because it's a preferred and powerful playstyle doesn't mean it's a blanket good playstyle everyone will enjoy and capitalize on the potential of
If someone wants to click heads and enjoy a DMR you wouldn't recommend any of the meta guns
junior needle
The aforementioned ciag is also built improperly
somber axle
If someone wants sniper rifle gameplay you wouldn't recommend any of the meta guns
They just don't fit
radiant chasm
I think fatshark kinda iffy on adding sniper/long las
Same philosophy as why there is no mines and emplacements, they want people moving and playing aggressive and not getting tunneled vision
somber axle
I think fatshark kinda iffy on adding sniper/long las
I think the Agripina Shotgun and the Helbores are the closest things we have to sniper rifle gameplay for strong backline guns that will 1HKO targets on headshot. For DMR gameplay Boltgun (as weird as it feels to say) and the Headhunter Autogun Vraks VII feel the best fits
radiant chasm
And also balancing between the current “sniper”-lite weapons, agri shotgun, revolver, vraks 7, helbores
somber axle
I'm not sure I'd call Revolver a sniper weapon though it is very accurate for long distance shots
radiant chasm
I think the Agripina Shotgun and the Helbores are the closest things we have to ...
Bolter isnt that weird cause that is what the balanced the stats around, so you have a precision weapon with terrible irons
Bolter is suffering from middle child syndrome while being the only child
somber axle
Bolter isnt that weird cause that is what the balanced the stats around, so you ...
It's weird to say the large mailbox that fires exploding rounds is the equivalent of a designated marksman rifle LMFAO
radiant chasm
Hopefully the 2 bolt rifle variants will come soon and help that
somber axle
kinda like saying the revolver, a pistol, can fulfill sniper rifle gameplay
like mechanically sure
radiant chasm
I blame fatshark for that
somber axle
aesthetically and thematically no
radiant chasm
Bolter is just in a crisis
It wants to behave like a magdump power weapon, slow and clunky
But it’s stats want it to be used as a precision weapon? And the best way to do that is to quick scope?
Pls fatshark
somber axle
I've enjoyed Boltgun with Exe Stance as a backline shooter
Feels like everyone short of Psykers are playing very aggressive frontline builds
So fulfilling a backline support fire role feels fine
radiant chasm
Give us the magdump variant, give us the single shot with scope variant, and let this one be the krourk
junior needle
It's also worth mentioning relative power levels
Vraks 7 is a strong gun despite not being "meta"
6d is not a strong gun despite not being meta
somber axle
Rogue Trader has sniper rifles
why doesn't Darktide
I don't even mean Longlas in this case
like literal sniper rifles
radiant chasm
why doesn't Darktide
At this point, im guessing balance and gameplay philosophy over ability to make them
Or hell could just be time restraints
“We got to rush the deadline and get what weapons we need done, why add sniper rifles just let em use a revolver instead”
torn moat
Deathspitter 4 or Fire Frenzy 4 for CIAG?
somber axle
At this point, im guessing balance and gameplay philosophy over ability to make ...
We're finally getting a few new weapons so maybe more new weapons are closer than they feel?
radiant chasm
Could be
somber axle
Vermintide 2 has that PvP mode they're working on but in the last few months Darktide has had a lot of new updates
radiant chasm
I do however enjoy the darktide philosophy of aggressive gameplay and snipers and long las could have been cut because of it
No mines, no turret emplacements, even hold your ground points encourage players to keep moving
somber axle
I do however enjoy the darktide philosophy of aggressive gameplay and snipers an...
It's pretty easy to do backline fire support as Vet tbh
Infiltrate + Low Profile lets me get away with some pretty silly plays on my Mk II Helbore
literally just blasting anything and everything without fear
radiant chasm
Yes, but that’s not what i’m saying they aren’t against backlining and obv not against stealth/aggro drops
Snipers typically encourage the average player to camp and tunnel vision
junior needle
Deathspitter 4 or Fire Frenzy 4 for CIAG?
They both stack to 5, ff has falloff from the close damage but has higher damage potential
Ds gives power, which gives cleave and stagger
It doesnt matter much
radiant chasm
Sure the best players will quick scope/noscope but it could be they don’t want to risk an epidemic of sniper players getting tunnel vision and camping a spot
somber axle
Sure the best players will quick scope/noscope but it could be they don’t want t...
I don't think there would be tbh
Anyone trying to camp/tunnel vision gets the Smiteker treatment but worse
They'll literally just stand still and get 1HKO'd by a Crusher that sneaks up behind them
or get slapped around by the single poxwalker that walked up
torn moat
As long as you have dumdum and your perks in order you're at 95% power
Sadly I'm off one perk 😦 Maniac and Infested. Trying to roll a better one currently.
junior needle
Vermintide 2 has that PvP mode they're working on but in the last few months Dar...
A lot of "new updates" that added basically nothing
somber axle
it'll be the kind of thing that's funny for a few days and surprisingly prevalent as players have to relearn that no you can't just sit there and tunnel vision
junior needle
You'd be better off changing infested to flak instead of the second blessing currently
radiant chasm
I don't think there would be tbh
I do not have faith in the average darktide player, some would learn quick and some will never learn
somber axle
A lot of "new updates" that added basically nothing
You haven't played because of your rule of not touching the game again until a new weapon is added so you haven't really seen all the new stuff outside of like indirectly living vicariously through us, right?
junior needle
You haven't played because of your rule of not touching the game again until a n...
All the new stuff like uh
Fart clouds
And uh
uH
junior needle
What else, penance grinding?
somber axle
LOL
radiant chasm
Soldier is a bit of a person
junior needle
With some extra cosmetics
That were stripped down from a complete and better version
radiant chasm
I feel like if you ask enough people you’d be convinced that any update would not be new content
junior needle
There's content and then there's "content"
torn moat
How bad is 51% stability on a CIAG? Worth trying to roll the blessings?
junior needle
Adding a few free cosmetics and a bunch of grinding is uh
"content"
Adding new weapons and maps is content
junior needle
How bad is 51% stability on a CIAG? Worth trying to roll the blessings?
I can make a video for you, one sec
radiant chasm
We got a new enemy and a new modifier and prestige achievements for the highest difficulties that can include that modfier
radiant chasm
That’s the def
old quail
the puzzles/idols break up the monotony of missions for a short while which is cool
junior needle
It encapsulates how stanky the content updates have been
old quail
what i do not forgive is lying about one of the maelstrom modifiers in the patch notes
mortal orbit
Fart bomber has given us good times. Ever have that hist spawn of 4 bombers that turn an entire room into stank?
old quail
because the patch notes one had unique modifiers
radiant chasm
Yea puzzles are kept once per character so they dont become like vt2 and repetitive? Instead maybe doing them again for a new person every so often
junior needle
Fart bomber has given us good times. Ever have that hist spawn of 4 bombers that...
Give me some taco bell and I can turn an entire room into stank by myself
old quail
something something dregs only + increased patrols and then it was actually like shock troop monstrous gas
mortal orbit
Talking about puzzles, wtf is up with the breakable radios?
sturdy zephyr
Change punishing salvo to dumdum
Ill try to grind dumdum on ciag. Quite a work too to get it.