veteran-class

[faint beacon]

Mainly cause you'll be hitting the head multiple times in a row with it's burst

[slow spade]

You're clearly the only opinion that matters

[bitter turtle]

For gunner critless oneshots

[faint beacon]

Surgical on 7 though

[bitter turtle]

Elite maniac works too though

But you need to tag for dreg

Or have marksman focus stacks

[echo parcel]

You are saying its the worst weapon in the game, when it is objectively not

[wooden brook]

This used to be fun

[echo parcel]

not when guns like agri revolver exist

[slow spade]

Its literally documented and recorded

[echo parcel]

show me

[bitter turtle]

Agri revolver is just a balanced zarona 😔

[echo parcel]

I'd love to see

[slow spade]

Oh you're trolling

Nvm then

[bitter turtle]

You can still dome every humanoid elite in one shot

[slow spade]

Indeed

Casually ignores the other classes

Zealot + agri revolver is pretty comfy surprisingly

[bitter turtle]

Recon has like 50 percent armor modifier on like 4 armor types

[faint beacon]

But yeah had a similar situation, hated the gun till I swapped out surgical for headhunter now it's my go to gun for playing Vet

[bitter turtle]

It's just objectively, with numbers, really qeak

[slow spade]

I thought I'd use kantreal shotgun for lategame

[echo parcel]

I was comparing it to the zarona for vet, its decent on zealot

[bitter turtle]

U need double rending to fix it baseline

Very talent expensive

I can't think of a worse gun on vet

[slow spade]

In general more like

[bitter turtle]

Maybe shredder autopistol is on the same level now that ammo is slightly fixed

[wooden brook]

lawbreinger is good

you might not think so

[echo parcel]

Thats just not true though, it only struggles against carapace

just bring krak

[wooden brook]

but don't use it for elite kills

[slow spade]

Na I know about the crit headshot build

[wooden brook]

use it for hoard kills

[slow spade]

Its just Hadron moment

[bitter turtle]

no

● Armour Modifiers (near, far):

○ Unarmoured: 75%, 100% to 90%, 75%.

○ Flak: 75%, 100% to 75%, 50%.

○ Unyielding: 50%, 100% to 65%, 50%.

○ Maniac: 50%, 60% to 60%, 50%.

○ Infested: 75%, 100% to 100%, 75%.

these wer ethe nerfs

from back then

flak went to 75-50%
unyielding went to 65-50
maniac is still shit

[slow spade]

Don't bother blatantly ignoring the facts

[bitter turtle]

like literally the most uncommon armor types are really bad modifiers

[slow spade]

Its sad seeing people ignore actual data

[bitter turtle]

like

[wooden brook]

I dunno what build this is but it seems to work and It's fun

[bitter turtle]

you can kinda get ok-ish looking numbers

#veteran-class message

but keep in mind this is like

max MF double rending every single talent point is going to unfucking the gun

and before you ask

that is a nearly godrolled one too

dumdum IV headhunter IV max dmg

[echo parcel]

Have you actually played with the gun or do you just look at the stats

[bitter turtle]

yes

[slow spade]

Its weird that recon's damage dropoff is inversed too

[bitter turtle]

sec

i tried it again post patch

after shocktrooper buff

[slow spade]

Clown moment

As if people wouldn't test

[echo parcel]

I've been having nothing but success after shock buff with it

[slow spade]

Near perfect recon and yes it is shit

[echo parcel]

nah but you are using the worst variant

[bitter turtle]

https://i.gyazo.com/2ee7116ad10fb79aeb4cbcc779c04242.jpg

[echo parcel]

VIIa is the good one

[bitter turtle]

its functional but not great

[echo parcel]

offc the VId is shit

[slow spade]

Casually moving goalposts

[bitter turtle]

compare to

https://i.gyazo.com/ede0cca742a3a133630be0534562642f.png

graia iag

similar games, i avoid melee as much as possible

if u look at melee kills

[slow spade]

"Of couse this variant is shit even with near perfect rolls"

[bitter turtle]

same ammo used

[slow spade]

Classic apologist

[echo parcel]

just like a claw is bad unless its mk4, why should it apply differently to ranged weapon variants?

[slow spade]

Thinks the MK7 and MK1 are bad lmao

Its just different movesets for different goals lol

At least look at the differences

[tired hornet]

Person 1 “here is a weapon/build I have”

Person 2 “That’s cool but here is how you can make it even better”

Person 1 “WTF DID YOU EVEN READ MY POST”

[bitter turtle]

why do you say recon 7 is the best one 🤔
most ppl agree 6d is the most usable one bc high rof to stack rending fastest

which

as u can see from the dmg values

is pretty necessary

unless u like having 50% dmg reduction

[echo parcel]

three most recent games with the VII, last game had a plasma vet and I was keeping up in damage numbers

[slow spade]

I wonder if the damage penalty from armor is additive with limb damage

[echo parcel]

You can't convince me this gun is bad

[bitter turtle]

i have kept up with dmg numbers

playing melee only tacaxe

[slow spade]

But we're not, Recon is convincing us lol

[bitter turtle]

"i did well in auric mael" is not an objective assessment of a gun

that just means you're a good player

[slow spade]

If I wanted to convince you, I wouldn't be so belligerent lol

You're in here ignoring data and spreading false data

[echo parcel]

If you are good you can make anything good, thats beside the point

The gun performs consistently in the highest level of difficulty of standard content

[slow spade]

Yeah consistently shit

[inland canopy]

25% maniacs seem like the go to now

considering moments when you get like 10 ragers popping in out of nowhere

[faint beacon]

The army of Ragers waiting for you to get their agro

[bitter turtle]

btw

that setup

i got 2.6k dps on the 6d

[slow spade]

Well maniac + flak due to all the shotgunners and scabs :c

[bitter turtle]

https://i.gyazo.com/4bb8bbdecd86d60eb2c86c38219e5f20.jpg

this is the best the 7 can do

with the same stats

[echo parcel]

You fail to mention that recon 6 has no cleave compared to the other variants

[slow spade]

If recon could fit in unarmored for dreg gunners, that'd be nice

[bitter turtle]

i sure hope you are not spraying poxwalkers with recon

[inland canopy]

that's what i have for all my weapons now

used to be unarmored + flack, or unyielding + carapace depending on the gun - but clearing ragers feel more important

[echo parcel]

There are multiple scenarios where you need to shoot through poxwalkers to reach a special, mk7 can acomplish that comfortably

[untold mulch]

Huh, so even with Shocktrooper working, Recon still bad?

[bitter turtle]

i dont think it has the ammo economy to support that

oh

if u mean for that

yeah that's like

fair i guess?

but its still significantly less dmg

on a gun that already struggles on dmg

[slow spade]

Yeah idk why they tuned up elite spawns like they have

[inland canopy]

hellbore actually has penetration too

[slow spade]

Ammo better, damage the same

[bitter turtle]

all of them are pretty trash dmg ngl

[slow spade]

So its still shit sadly just less so

[bitter turtle]

so pick ur poison i guess, but 6d is not the "bad"one by any measure

relatively speaking

since they're all bad

[untold mulch]

Eh, not worth reinstalling then

[bitter turtle]

playing a few games

[slow spade]

Shock trooper no longer has 20% effective value

[bitter turtle]

i think the ammo is ok enough now

if u hit headshots consistently

[slow spade]

Its now 100% again iirc

[bitter turtle]

and dont spray hordes

[inland canopy]

they turned up hordes on high intensity

[bitter turtle]

but the dmg is still way lower than

just about anything else

[untold mulch]

Soooo

I avoid because my brain demands bodyshots

[echo parcel]

I feel like half of the people playing recon take the wrong build and struggle

[bitter turtle]

besides shredder basically

[slow spade]

I did Hab Dreyko and I was in agony

[bitter turtle]

the vet tree is not that complicated

and i took nearly every talent to make the gun better lol

[slow spade]

Lmao

[untold mulch]

🍿 🪑

[slow spade]

You really think everyone did recon wrong?

[inland canopy]

on high intensity i struggle taking out my hellbore lmao

[slow spade]

Ok main character

[untold mulch]

I need my corpse starch for this convo brb

[slow spade]

Indeed, my plasma was in red heat the whole time

[echo parcel]

I haven't seen anybody combine reciprocity with marksman focus

[bitter turtle]

recip is very unreliable on ranged weapons is why

two things about it

[slow spade]

+30% weak spot damage? Doesn't Recon have one of the worst finesse modifiers?

[bitter turtle]

1. it does not proc on elite gunners

[slow spade]

I actually don't know

[bitter turtle]

2. it does not proc on shooters unless you dodge on startup

[echo parcel]

I maintain high reci stacks in almost every gunfight

[untold mulch]

1.4

[echo parcel]

3 plus

[slow spade]

Yeah recip is for weapon spec builds sadly

[slow spade]

Oof...

[bitter turtle]

either way

[slow spade]

I think that's about plasma levels 😔

[bitter turtle]

the value is rather low when you consider your gun (probably) has headhunter on it

or should have it at least

that's basically the only thing keeping recon's dmg not unusable tier

[slow spade]

Headhunter god bless

Only Recon can run Dumdum + Headhunter and somehow still be shit

[echo parcel]

I would advise anybody that can click on heads to try marksmans focus before trashing on the recon

[bitter turtle]

the build im using

already runs it

[slow spade]

Na marksmen focus is good

[bitter turtle]

how else do u think i get 2.7k on a mutant lol

base recon litearlly does sub 2k

its still bad tho

compared to other things

[slow spade]

No one disputes that

[echo parcel]

a weapon that can instantly stack it and double dips finnese through crit build is good

But you are shootingg monstrosities with it

[bitter turtle]

but yeah here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nIm_mAeX1_k

[echo parcel]

thats not what you use the gun for

[bitter turtle]

u can see recip doesnt proc on elite gunners

[slow spade]

Though I wish the +10 rending upgrade for MF was better

[bitter turtle]

feels bad

😔

i dropped it from a lot of builds when i saw this

only procs from trash shooter

[echo parcel]

When are you not being shot by trash in auric?

[bitter turtle]

with automatic weapons? fairly often tbh

[slow spade]

Stealth + smoke builds 😎

[bitter turtle]

nowadays i only run recip on melee heavy build

[untold mulch]

oh damn I ran it sometimes

[slow spade]

I need to try a smoke build to see the new changes

[bitter turtle]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfYNbFsCIVw

even on trash gunner its unreliable

[untold mulch]

Is kinda dumb only at max stacks

[slow spade]

They seem promising 🤔

[bitter turtle]

only works on teh startup of their attacks

you can see im on 1 stack for a while

[untold mulch]

noted

[bitter turtle]

not the full barrage

[slow spade]

Ikr and then middle tree gets it for no condition

Would have made my MG La build more flexible

[echo parcel]

I'll continue running my trash weapon I guess, but I implore everyone to try the weapon for themselves before writing it off as unusable garbage

[bitter turtle]

believe me

[untold mulch]

I still stand that Marksman Focus was not thought at all for Marksman builds

and that Weapon Spec is unnecesarily restricted to single shot/burst weapons

[slow spade]

Trust me, every vet has tried 😔

[untold mulch]

I have run it so much

[bitter turtle]

i have https://i.gyazo.com/ef89035fcfb842cfce1202dff6c91783.png

two

[slow spade]

Its the only automatic las gun

[bitter turtle]

good recons

[untold mulch]

and it always dissapoint me

[bitter turtle]

lul

i would love for them to stop sucking

[echo parcel]

Try the 7 in a real auric game

[untold mulch]

Recon enters that place of weapon tiers

where I go and apologize to the team midgame

because its so bad

[echo parcel]

there is no way you will think that this weapon is the worst in the game

[untold mulch]

The worst is Recon MK2

[bitter turtle]

i really dont have a problem singling out elite with 6d, so im not sure why i would take even lower dmg for some cleave

[slow spade]

Lol same, I remember actually saying "I'm testing recon don't worry I know how to melee"

[bitter turtle]

@ 7

[untold mulch]

KEK

[umbral garnet]

I think I can safely say for most people here we aren't daft enough to write something off completely. Everything is viable, you can play anything and do well. We're just saying, out of the array of options, it sucks the most.

But hey, props to you for slamming the shit out of an auric.

[echo parcel]

You are not losing dps when you factor in cleave, in fact, you are gaining it by shooting through multiple targets

[umbral garnet]

I have a decent Recon myself.

[idle swallow]

Recon is just like columnus except where it's worse in every way

[tall torrent]

I tried mk13g chainsword and found out that it was indeed garbage

[slow spade]

I find it funny they came in here thinking every Vet here hasn't tested the shit out of recon trying to make it work lol

[bitter turtle]

the cleave only penetrates unarmored/uninfested non-elites, do you really shoot through those enough that that matters? like honest question

u need to aim for head sin the first place with this gun

[untold mulch]

Some people do be like that

[bitter turtle]

MF + headhunter after all

[umbral garnet]

We aren't on high horses spitting at the peasants using Recons while we have our plasmas. No, we are poor souls sobbing at the graves of the Recons while the Autoguns laugh behind us.

[faint beacon]

I think the Recon is cool but for the life of me I can't use it correctly

[sacred spindle]

it has the lightshow so your point is invalid

[echo parcel]

happens plenty in maelstrom with special waves in hordes

[untold mulch]

I've been using Recon since prebeta

[slow spade]

One day Lasguns will rise to pre-patch 13 levels once more 😔

[untold mulch]

Only been useful

twice

[tall torrent]

don't recon lasguns have really bad finesse?

[bitter turtle]

they do

[untold mulch]

1.4

yeah

[bitter turtle]

but there is not much else that boosts maniac damage

[slow spade]

Yes but they don't want to accept the facts

[bitter turtle]

and its... relatively easy enough to maintain\

[echo parcel]

Its still the best 1 point dmg investment

[bitter turtle]

so i usually take it too

[slow spade]

They claimed recon had good armor pen at one point

[echo parcel]

or 2 point technically

[slow spade]

Which is just cope

[bitter turtle]

focust arget + redirect fire gives similar dmg though

from what i tested

[tall torrent]

rending?

onslaught?

longshot, even?

[midnight totem]

I've found 3 21 health trinkets so far and all of them have been bricked

[wanton dawn]

I just had the easiest, chilliest random pubs duo in maelstrom

[slow spade]

Nice c:

[wanton dawn]

I guess the game got easier

[slow spade]

Good to hear you had a good time

[slow spade]

A lot of the shitters left too

[wanton dawn]

Nah, we were 2 from lobby to end

[faint beacon]

Every single Maelstrom I've done has been a perfect cocktail of chaotic and fun

[slow spade]

Oh lmao

[slow spade]

Rip on queues but nice on the win c:

[tall torrent]

yea idk cuz I had to rescue >50 people over 1 week in pubs

[slow spade]

Do not worry at patch 13 launch that would have been 500

[wanton dawn]

Also I learned something: if you leave 2 bot alone they will find a way to blow a barrel and throw themselves to the void

[bitter turtle]

😔

https://i.gyazo.com/4347b32a72c47191ec98b51267968f6d.png

this duo took 50 min last night

lol

[wanton dawn]

This one was 29 min

[slow spade]

Lol yeah I had a duo with 6 deaths

[bitter turtle]

it was actually a normal game but 2 ppl left

[slow spade]

All bots

[untold mulch]

same

[echo parcel]

https://streamable.com/uv70bx
Unusable trash tier weapon btw 😭

[slow spade]

But that is bad dps...

[untold mulch]

Last high tier curio I got that bricked

I just stopped engaging in the store

[echo parcel]

no flak no rending

[slow spade]

A lot of guns can do that...

1400 dps...

1428 to be fair

[untold mulch]

Is always amusing seeing the weekly,

"Recon is actually good"

[wanton dawn]

I have to say though, I like playing with bots

they are predictable

[slow spade]

When does it slip from sad into pathetic 🤔

[slow spade]

And useful

[bitter turtle]

i really

dont mean to rain on your parade

[untold mulch]

Reminds me of HD2 server having people swearing the Scythe is useful if you hit weakspots

Like every other weapon ingame

[bitter turtle]

but my headhunter autogun

[echo parcel]

I get around 1850 on columnus

[bitter turtle]

spamming hipfire into the body

https://i.gyazo.com/a8beaece28503d123f833dd0e661378b.jpg

[slow spade]

I prefer bots over players

[bitter turtle]

does more than that

[untold mulch]

Data is a lie

[echo parcel]

which is a broken weapon

[slow spade]

So true king 💪

[tall torrent]

headhunter autoguns are not broken lol

[wanton dawn]

Wait, we are showing weapon dps ?

2s

[echo parcel]

I was talking about columnus auto

[slow spade]

Are we at the "all the guns are op" stage?

[umbral garnet]

Bro, we are not shitting on it like it's the bane of our existence, what are you smoking. We are comparing it to the rest and objectifying its efficiency. It's serviceable, but utterly outclassed (frankly, fucking buried) under any other ranged weapon.

[tall torrent]

he's not showing a columnus autogun

[slow spade]

Or are we at the "every vet here is wrong" still

[tall torrent]

I'm usually right

[wanton dawn]

Litteral first try

[slow spade]

I meant the recon apologist :p

[echo parcel]

I was talking about how I am getting 350 dps less on a trash unusable weapon compared to the top meta

[tall torrent]

it's not 350 less dps though

[wanton dawn]

I am getting 1k more dps without exe stance nor mark

[untold mulch]

Damn

[slow spade]

350 dps is still significant...

[untold mulch]

Deleted

[balmy flume]

That is…beautiful…

[slow spade]

And this isn't even the plasma or revolvers

[faint beacon]

Alt F4 the gun

[echo parcel]

My test was no deadshot no stance no flak no rendingg

[tall torrent]

plasma 2 shot is pretty fast, 3 shot is slower
revolver 2 shot is fast

[faint beacon]

Thing actually deleted that Mauler

[slow spade]

Charged shot for cheating UwU

[umbral garnet]

@faint beacon Just tried the Mk7. I'm sorry, but I love my overhead heavy Fold heavy too much.

[echo parcel]

if a gun is able to output 1500dps while being incredibly ammo efficient, then it is usable

[umbral garnet]

Still, though, we gotta do that shovel game at some point.

[echo parcel]

there is no other way around it

[slow spade]

We're just in denial now bois lets go

[bitter turtle]

its not incredibly ammo efficient

[untold mulch]

Phases of denial be like

[umbral garnet]

Recon, incredibly ammo efficient? Oh, you fell out of a bus.

[bitter turtle]

recon users have a reputation of hosing ammo for a reason

[umbral garnet]

I'm sorry for your loss.

[bitter turtle]

its

passable now

with the revert on shocktrooper

but still somewhat hungry

[faint beacon]

I can't blame you it's literally, I want to use the Standard Issue, BUT I also want to 1 tap mutants or shred Maulers and Crushers with one key

[slow spade]

He's lost to the Warp, Recon has enslaved another one

[tall torrent]

"incredibly ammo efficient" belongs to helbore lasguns, not recon

[echo parcel]

shock trooper legit gives you infinite ammo what are you smokingg

reciprocity plus headhunter

[umbral garnet]

This man.

[untold mulch]

Infinite ammo build

[wanton dawn]

1790 dps only...

[slow spade]

:c

[tall torrent]

helbore lasguns have infinite ammo without shock trooper

[umbral garnet]

https://tenor.com/view/bullshit-this-is-bullshit-bs-load-of-barnacles-spongebob-gif-15128536

[wanton dawn]

Tbf I have flak on it

[slow spade]

I'm so sorry but Patch 13 recon isn't coming back 😔

[umbral garnet]

Fair. Shovel bois forever, though. 🤝

[wanton dawn]

TBf tbf, having only 1 crit chain is enough to gain like 400 dps on mauler

[bitter turtle]

https://i.gyazo.com/1a4f99041e2ee94c7c16236a7fccab79.jpg

[wanton dawn]

at no talent

[bitter turtle]

naked v7 with 1 crit

no flak

https://i.gyazo.com/3c97e2b3d1ece5c52884ddf50ceacdca.jpg

no crits

[echo parcel]

And how many bullets did it take?

[bitter turtle]

i dont think being on par with a naked v7 firing bodyshots is "good dmg"

[bitter turtle]

if ur trying to imply that the v7 is ammo inefficient

its one of those guns that can ignore survivalist and still pick up no ammo

since it builds to oneshot most light elites but gets like 3 bullets back per kill

if you do run surv

[slow spade]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1046912126746374274/1174883219854864454/2023-11-16_20-23-26.mp4?ex=65693643&is=6556c143&hm=fb28b42001674b5950332e23d728cc91eb89eaafefbfb37bb40e60c9f9f9bfde&

[tall torrent]

2

[bitter turtle]

ok 2

whatever

still positive

[echo parcel]

recon goes 8 ammo negative after survivalist for maulers

[slow spade]

At least Recon got Shock Trooper back

[echo parcel]

you can kill 100 maulers before running out of ammo

[muted knot]

Ah yes

[wanton dawn]

In any case, 1400 dps is quite low. It is the dps i reach on crusher with my no carapace no onslaugh

[echo parcel]

regardless of positioning

[slow spade]

Lets hope it can get back the "rending on melee crit" node again

[muted knot]

The classic auric maelstrom

100 maulers

[slow spade]

"No ranged enemies"

[bitter turtle]

keep in mind

that was a naked one

[echo parcel]

You are easily killing over 30 maulers in a maelstrom

[bitter turtle]

with nothing on it

[slow spade]

I foolishly brought a lasgun into that

[bitter turtle]

https://i.gyazo.com/c681472cdd08ef7c4d1ac9933012a1cc.jpg

[slow spade]

A MK12...

[bitter turtle]

actual v7 with appropriate talents on tree and shit

[wanton dawn]

How many mauler that is ?

[faint beacon]

In the ocean of power swords, our swap modes protect us Fellow Roughneck

[slow spade]

I like that this feels more like vets venting on how bad recon is and how much people want it to work

Rather than informing someone about Recon

[sacred spindle]

right, recons sort of suck

[bitter turtle]

ok

i know why i thought it was 3

[sacred spindle]

but what curios are we all running?

[wanton dawn]

It literally is

[tall torrent]

it needs dps buff

[bitter turtle]

it gives a decimal higher than 2

[umbral garnet]

I can't break 2k DPS with my Mk6 Golden Recon and a profane Columnus can break that without trying.

It's so joever.

[echo parcel]

I am always down to play with people from discord, I would love to show you that this weapon is not as bad as everyone is saying

[bitter turtle]

you get +3 bullets backsometimes

[tall torrent]

yea

[bitter turtle]

i clearly just rounded up

to make my gun look better

[echo parcel]

Columnus is just broken right now, comparing it to other guns isn't really doing it justice

[slow spade]

Pain...

[bitter turtle]

i have been comparing to v7

which is a very balans gun

[umbral garnet]

You think we're talking "It's bad" in a vacuum. We know you can do some plays with it, but compared to the rest? It's child's play, man.

[slow spade]

Triple damage pls

[umbral garnet]

V7, then, like the other guy is saying.

Exact same dps and it's profane, naked.

I have damage blessings and talents active.

It barely exceeds 1900

And that's if I'm lucky.

[idle swallow]

Making recon work in aurics doesn't make it not still worst in slot, cuz it is

[bitter turtle]

keep in mind "shooting into maulers" is not the point of a v7 even

[echo parcel]

neither is the recon

But someone mentioned that it is unusably bad against armor

[bitter turtle]

https://i.gyazo.com/462c66d0c92e7f44726100287b0cc6fb.jpg

this is

so its winning in a battle its not even trying to win

[slow spade]

Surprisingly, its maniac it does terrible against

[umbral garnet]

Exactly, hence why it SUCKS because it's so ammo thirsty for not even being able to justify that ammo use.

[slow spade]

That's weird for Lasguns

[echo parcel]

dont show me the clip of you shooting into a back of a mutant

[bitter turtle]

crazy people are immune to fast lasers

[umbral garnet]

Bolter's and plasma have insane damage output so their ammo thirst can be justified with how ridiculous they are.

The Recon is just sad.

[bitter turtle]

er misquote

but yeah

[echo parcel]

if you do that then you are actually cooked

you are not doing that in an actual game

[sacred spindle]

plasma has ammo thirst?

[slow spade]

Yeah unlike how I would with any other gun lol

[wanton dawn]

I showed that cuz if I shooted the head I would never be able to make recon look good

[slow spade]

Body shot vids are holding back from how shit recon is

[umbral garnet]

If you use it without Surv, yes.

[tall torrent]

it's one of the few veteran weapons where ammo economy is smth u need to think about, yes

[wanton dawn]

Recon has one of the crappiest finesse modifier

[tall torrent]

survivalist gains very little ammo for plasma

[sacred spindle]

I've always run it in surv builds and played a lot of bolter before playing plasma

[slow spade]

At best plasma gets 1 shot per 2 kills

Which is sad :c

[bitter turtle]

i was shooting head remember

[umbral garnet]

900 dps weakspot hits with a mk6 using headhunter 4 and infernus 4 on a mauler LUH MAO

[bitter turtle]

2.7k dps

[sacred spindle]

compared to bolter gulping down ammo the plasma just does little sips

[bitter turtle]

meanwhile the "bad" agrivolver
https://i.gyazo.com/fa9feefcaa11d02dc5cd074a8cadacb8.jpg

[tall torrent]

plasma is always going to be at negative ammo econ

[slow spade]

😔

[tall torrent]

boltgun feels worse because u can magdump it faster lol

[echo parcel]

please dont use the mk6 recon it is terrible

[tall torrent]

but if ur landing 1 hit kills, boltgun has better ammo econ

[slow spade]

I invested so much making a god tier recon only for it to get nerfed lol

[echo parcel]

the mk7 recon is atleast 3 tiers above it

[sacred spindle]

if you constantly magdump plasma you'll be out of ammo but that's also really how not to do it

[slow spade]

that's actually the best recon

[wanton dawn]

In any case, I can probably do a quickplay with weapon of choice. Though that kind of "friendly dps competition" is kinda scuffed

[umbral garnet]

Oh.

Oh wow.

You are DELUSIONAL.

[slow spade]

Yeah

[umbral garnet]

I'm sorry.

[tall torrent]

bait used to be believable

[coral bloom]

Can someone show me a video of them killing a few gunners, grenadiers and snipers at 50+ m with a columnus or meta gun?
Curious how they fare havent really played them

[wanton dawn]

I have that but for bolter

[slow spade]

But how else will I past the time at work?

[junior needle]

Do I need to post it

[echo parcel]

do I need to record myself playing a game to prove to you that it's not the gun holding you back, its probably you as a player?

[bitter turtle]

https://i.gyazo.com/e1a0ba86426378474551105893ff764b.jpg
1a lasgun at close range

[coral bloom]

SPREAD OUT not in a 1 body bunch

[bitter turtle]

basically everything beat recon on maniac

looks even worse when u headshot

[faint beacon]

That explains why when I used it, it felt so.... Fucking terrible even with the right perks and blessings

Tbf I did go from Column V to a Recon

[wanton dawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25eC9HOnQxk&t=9s Find one in that I had 272 ranged elite kill on that game

[untold mulch]

[umbral garnet]

Bro, we aren't crying about being bad players, we are crying that even if you are good, when you use the gun, a noob can outperform you purely with a fucking grey weapon.

It's DISHEARTENING how BAD recon is. It's not useless. it's BAD.

There's a DIFFERENCE between those words.

[bitter turtle]

well i wouldnt say that

some people are really bad

like that game i had with recon

[slow spade]

Kovine managed to awaken the suppressed anger every vet has about recon being shit

[bitter turtle]

someone took as much ammo as me

[umbral garnet]

We don't talk about those.

[untold mulch]

The amount of "I am just plain better" vibe is amazing

[bitter turtle]

and somehow did like 100k damage total

[slow spade]

Actually impressive

[echo parcel]

How come when I play auric I almost never get outperformed with the recon? Am I playing in fantasy land?

[bitter turtle]

bc pugs are really bad

im not gonna lie

so if ur like decent at the game

[untold mulch]

I have seen so many people in a high horse arguing Recon is good and calling people bad that I am just unfazed

[coral bloom]

Just seen a bit and bolter looks sweet, also like the punchthrough.

[bitter turtle]

TAC AXE ONLY will still outdps them most of the time

[umbral garnet]

No, your teammates suck dogwater.

That's why.

[slow spade]

Yeah at one point they basically said "I did well in a maelstrom though"

[echo parcel]

but even a noob can outperform the recon you say

but i dont see it

[slow spade]

And I felt the cope so hard from that

[wanton dawn]

Bolter is reaaal fun in fog modifier

[untold mulch]

I CAN RUN AURIC, SO ITS NOT BAD

🗿

[slow spade]

Yeah...

Its kind of sad tbh

[untold mulch]

At this point I think I can run Auric with a stick from the map

[coral bloom]

Used it a bit, liked it but the clunk. I also found it way easier to recoil control that specific gun with base ironsight rather than modded reddot

[umbral garnet]

Play a game with a person who knows nothing about the meta or tech. Just how to block and shoot. Give them a columnus, and the other player who is good a recon. I'd bet both would be practically equal.

[slow spade]

Give me your finest rock. I'll kill Wolfer in less than a hour 😎

[untold mulch]

[wanton dawn]

Well, I do have a lot of experience with bolter

[tall torrent]

btw I'm gonna rate CS13g as "incoherent"

[slow spade]

Kk got to go but man it was nice to vent about recon for like 2 hours

[tall torrent]

finished combat axe and DC pages

[bitter turtle]

good

its fucking shit

i hate it so much

partially because i got a good one for free

and was so disappointed

[untold mulch]

I for some reason like the CS13g

but I heard enough people hating it to know I am the weird one

[echo parcel]

I disagree, the average player would not be utilizing the columnus effectively enough to outdamage a proficient recon user because they lack fundamentals which allow them to focus on dealing damage instead of surviving

[bitter turtle]

no they really wouldn't

like

idk if you know melee weapons

tacaxe is one of the weakest in game rn

its like if i went to zealot chat

https://i.gyazo.com/f060f81c36e8298f30f8d5cee26c2cc4.png

and posted these

[tall torrent]

combat axe weapon page

[bitter turtle]

and said "omg look taxe onlee topepd score sekritly really underrated?"

[junior needle]

Well, anecdotal evidence based on personal experience in random circumstances is hardly objective or reliable. You could simply be playing better than most average players, or you could be suctioning a ton of ammo and shooting into melee chaffe a lot to inflate your performance. Or your teammates just suck, that's also a possibility.

Here's a fine example of being an ammo goblin and doing exactly that only to still not have the performance to back it up.

[bitter turtle]

u can see i did not even shoot once that game, 0 burning dmg with flamer

ppl are just bad

[umbral garnet]

I am not wasting my breath on you anymore. Please, remain in your bubble of "I am a martyr for the recon".

Have fun, I don't care.

[faint beacon]

Seeing I actually ran that once I can confidentally say I had more fun using the Antax Melee vet than recon vet

[wanton dawn]

Anyway, I am down for a "friendly dps competition", recon vs whatever build I have

[echo parcel]

good talk

[umbral garnet]

I'm up.

I have a decent recon.

I can try it.

[bitter turtle]

i guess i should just let u finish that instead of asking to pin mine at this rate 😔 lul

looks good though

much more detailed than what i was doing

[echo parcel]

I am down

[tall torrent]

merci

[junior needle]

You don't need fundamentals to aim a bullet hose at something in closeish range

[wanton dawn]

kk, I let you ppl chose the rules and diff

[tall torrent]

It’s gonna take me a while to get through the weapons tho

[wanton dawn]

For weapon I have bolter, agri brauto, columnus

[echo parcel]

Im down for damnation duo maelstrom auric, just play to win

[bitter turtle]

well

maybe ill ask to pin mine anyway

just as a quick guide

if ppl dont want to read

[echo parcel]

should give the best results

[bitter turtle]

i should trim it down even further then

[tall torrent]

DC sword page

[wanton dawn]

duo maelstrom auric eh ?

[echo parcel]

You'd be surprised at what you see in pubs

[coral bloom]

Ok just tried my first columnus at all a little bit in meatgrinder.
Is the thing that breaks it that the recoil pattern to be tight with only vertical lift to a point? Seems you can pretty much full auto at any range and land hits if you get accustomed to it

[umbral garnet]

Auric Mael Damn, use melee only when necessary, otherwise, ranged for everything.

Ranged

[tall torrent]

And before u ask, yes I abbreviate combat axe as “CBX”

[umbral garnet]

I'm stupid

[tall torrent]

No I will not change that

[wanton dawn]

Am going in strike 2 anyway

[bitter turtle]

use melee only when necessary but melee everything 🤔

so melee only run

jk

[umbral garnet]

Listen ok

[wanton dawn]

Can i use bayo ?

[umbral garnet]

It's late

Craime, what's your FS number thingy

[wanton dawn]

Whatever

6403417449

[bitter turtle]

im not gonna join voice but you can invite me 👉👈

itll just be like old times sake

the first time i played with ppl here was to prove recon bad too

[junior needle]

Why do an unobjective comparison? You can objectively test performance in the psyk. Here's an example where the 7a generously has onslaught, rending strikes, and 5% damage compared to a gray and talentless ciag. And an additional one for the agri iag (has about the same performance as the graia IAG dps wise).

[bitter turtle]

0554066126

[untold mulch]

Is a trial

[junior needle]

Oh whoops, that's a 6d

Here's the 7a

[echo parcel]

why are you using it to shoot mutants

you must be trolling

[wanton dawn]

Kovine you are joining or what ?

[junior needle]

They are maniacs, and high health pools reduce random variance for testing. Also, some guns have dps that far exceed other units health pools.

This is a dps test.

[tall torrent]

If u wanna test maniac dps, mutant is the largest target available

[wanton dawn]

I have one place left

[junior needle]

Largest and best, for ranged weapons.

[tall torrent]

You can also test on Dreg rager if u want

Results wouldn’t change that much

[echo parcel]

3303088472 my code

[untold mulch]

and that hurts more

[junior needle]

Iag's have more maniac headshot dps than ragers have health

[untold mulch]

becuaser the Rager will kick your ass

[junior needle]

Also ragers wobble quite a bit when shot so it's hard to show actual headshot dps

[tall torrent]

That’s fine, gets a bit of “practical utility” variance in there

[crude fiber]

Could test reaper body shots lol

[junior needle]

Reaper body is flak

[bitter turtle]

reapers are not maniac

maniac is for ocrazy people

ogryns are not crazy ever, apparently

[junior needle]

And the other parts are unyielding

[crude fiber]

Why test on maniac specifically?

[junior needle]

I have unyielding comparisons if you want

Also flak

[faint beacon]

Tox Flamers but they're not really Tanky enough to have a DPS test

[tall torrent]

Can someone who actually spent time playing with Mk13g chainsword tell me how the movesets are supposed to be used I’m actually struggling in coming up with how to use it

[junior needle]

Flak is impossible to get a good read on headshot dps because the "best" target is the scab rager and that has a limited health pool/wobbles

[bitter turtle]

did

"play one game and drop it" count

all i did was light spam

[untold mulch]

anyways, any run with decent use of Recon is gonna show you are picking ammo cosntantly

[junior needle]

So guns that naturally exceed 2000 headshot dps can't be measured well

[tall torrent]

[bitter turtle]

i hated the heavies

so much

[untold mulch]

I actually got used to them

I hated it at start

until I "got" the timing

[faint beacon]

I kid you not when I actively used it I only really noticed it was "good" with Rev heavys and light spam. But like why bother when the original variant is just better?

[untold mulch]

I think is still weird

I do make it work

but, I see why people hate it

[tall torrent]

I wrote these for chainsword rn

[bitter turtle]

oops

i crashed

maybe i should have restarted my client after leaving it open all night

[faint beacon]

Yeah it's not great but that's absolutely the best way to sum it up

You really only pull it out for trash hordes or Carapace

[tall torrent]

It’s not even good vs carapace tho

[crude fiber]

I think I remember if you have a perfect roll mk13 you can 1 shot crushers with the a weak spot crit on a melee build.

[faint beacon]

Exactly

You literally need Bloodletter to make it work

[crude fiber]

Very niche and unreliable though lol

[junior needle]

Here's one for unyielding, with the same generous boost as the maniac test.

[faint beacon]

Honestly thinking about it, the Mk13g is a noob trap

I liked it when I was new cause me spam M1 and kill hordes

Now that I'm nearly over 600+ Hours I realize how shit it is compared to its original

[junior needle]

Actually, it doesn't need it. It has a 100% modifier to unyielding. Here's pure gray.

[idle swallow]

mk7 shovel/mk4 dclaw/mk6 psword are the only melees I do on my vet aside from experimenting once in a while cuz I'm lazy

[tall torrent]

Maybe Cadia wouldn’t have blown up if they didn’t adopt the mk13g chainsword

[faint beacon]

I seriously think the note for it should clarify it's a noob trap till it gets buffed

[idle swallow]

Probably should give the original chainsword another shot

[tall torrent]

That’s why I put “incoherent” as its rating rn

[faint beacon]

Cause trust me I loved it being a clueless new player

[tall torrent]

Others have “great”, “good”, “decent”, etc

[faint beacon]

But my god it's weak compared to the mk4

Im honestly grasping at ideas to really fill In the gaps for the 13g here seeing I really can't do full blown testing to give something for it cause I'm busy

But I think it's trying to fill the role of strike downs on a chainsword and flopping

It's probably meh against any like medium health Elite/Special

But that's about it

[junior needle]

With wrath/shred it supposedly has much better chaffe clear times than the old chainsword

[faint beacon]

Supposedly, probably have to experiment with it to make sure

[toxic leaf]

for cadia?

[untold mulch]

Feels like it

[tall torrent]

Including bruisers or no

[muted knot]

I run wrath/rampage and it's fine

[tall torrent]

Because if I’m looking for a definitive horde clear weapon, I care about those guys much more than poxwalkers

[untold mulch]

Rampage does a funny

That killing 2 enemies pr such

Takes longer thqn 3+

[spring spindle]

How important is collateral as a stat on most guns? If I remember right as long as it’s roughly 50% it’s fine?

40%

[untold mulch]

Not much is only stagger

[muted knot]

@untold mulch what does that even mean ?

[tall torrent]

Boltgun wants 51 or higher

Everything else, irrelevant

[untold mulch]

Rampage doesnt triggers wjen you hit 3 enemies?

[elder fiber]

depends on gun, some really don't care about it and iirc you want slightly above 50% for bolter for bulwark guard break

[spring spindle]

So if it’s not a Boltgun it’s a dump stat?

[muted knot]

Rampage is 3 enemy's yes

[tall torrent]

Yes

[untold mulch]

Wo that in my experience

If you cant trigger rampage

Cs feels a lot worse

[muted knot]

Oh yeah you can't trigger rampage without a cleave buff

On the 13

[untold mulch]

Yeha wrath or similar is mandatory

[tall torrent]

CS4 doesn’t need wrath or savage sweep for rampage

[muted knot]

Its not like you could really skip a cleave blessing on CS anyways

[tall torrent]

CS13g needs wrath

[tall torrent]

U can for CS4

[elder fiber]

and idk mk13 chainsword feels fine to me, attack speed really helps it tho

[muted knot]

You can but why would you ?

[elder fiber]

I think I just wish heavy rev animated faster

[tall torrent]

Bloodletter 1 shots every elite besides crusher

[muted knot]

It's okay yes but it's a bit sad compared to mk4

[junior needle]

No idea, this is going off a chart I saw (with some admittably questionable testing setups for other weapons) and some very brief testing in the psyk

[muted knot]

Now we are leaving chaff clear territory tho

[tall torrent]

Yes but that’s also a very real upside to using a chainsword

[junior needle]

If you want to light spam you do want wrath for ease of use though

[muted knot]

That's fair

[junior needle]

You can get around it with heavies but uh

[tall torrent]

I put savage sweep / bloodletter for CS4, wrath for CS13g

[muted knot]

Ss is overkill

[tall torrent]

Since CS4 has easy sweeping heavies

[junior needle]

Having to heavy every time you want rampage up is not great for a light spam playstyle

[tall torrent]

But cs4 also doesn’t have the best light spam tbh

[muted knot]

Cs4 light spam is pretty damn good

[tall torrent]

It’s alright

[muted knot]

Especially when you run a Melee centric build

[tall torrent]

I mean, for a chainsword it’s alright

[junior needle]

Compared to some things like dclaw light spam

But that's abysmal

[muted knot]

(bonus points for being a very iconic 40k weapon)

[junior needle]

We judge weapons on their merits around here, no special treatment

[muted knot]

Since when lmao

(I'm joking)

[tall torrent]

Well I’m writing a guide here so

[muted knot]

Where would you put cs4 on like a tier list ?

[tall torrent]

Well it’s breaking down talents, & giving guide on how to use weapons, etc

[muted knot]

The question was unrelated to your guide

Just a general question

[tall torrent]

CS4 with rampage + bloodletter, I’d put at A

[austere pine]

i've got 3 points left. do i pick up everything here?

[tall torrent]

Having the ability to flexibly 1 shot all elites except crushers is a really big boost

[wanton dawn]

@bitter turtle This is not a mat run

[bitter turtle]

you fuggers running past everything

every run is a mat run

[junior needle]

(I know)

[austere pine]

also, is any of these besides the one i already have good to pick up? they're just extra info talents but like.. why?

[tall torrent]

Just CS4,
Rampage + bloodletter I’d put at A tier
Rampage + wrath/savage sweep I’d put at B tier

[junior needle]

Shooters and reset are acknowledge as the best parts

[tiny summit]

The 2 side nodes are good. I only take the stacks if I don't want anything else

[fading solar]

yeah as 69 said, Reset and all shooters is basically the best options

[austere pine]

is competitive urge good?

[fading solar]

if you have nothing else for a build, yes

[junior needle]

Ogryn highlight isn't as good as shooters and maphacks sharing can actually negatively affect you from teammates poaching resets

[austere pine]

i have a personal grudge with anything that's competitive

[wanton dawn]

point is usually hard to justify due to not helping bp on a vacuum

[fading solar]

its only 'competative' in the fact it triggers on friendly killing stuff

otherwise its just a buff

[austere pine]

i get it lol. still leaves a foul taste in my mouth

[tiny summit]

Like it's fine. But you probably won't notice it. It does chance proc off everything though

[fading solar]

and there is no range req

someone could kill something miles away from you, and you get buffed

[tiny summit]

If you could keep up comp urge with your own performance it'd be cool

[fading solar]

yeah if it refreshed with kills it'd be perfection

[tall torrent]

It’s one of the best luxury picks

If you happen to have luxury points left

[tiny summit]

Or even just X secs off a kill. It's comp urge...I should have the urge to keep showing off instead of my team giving me a buff randomly

[austere pine]

i have 0 blessings and it's a weapon i don't care for keeping -> what perks do i pick up? flak/maniac?

[junior needle]

It's gonna feel like dog for clear

[faint beacon]

I would say Flak seeing you already have Carapace

[junior needle]

If you don't take at least headtaker

[faint beacon]

But...

Unsure

[tall torrent]

I’d recommend just harvesting either blessing

[austere pine]

i wanna see if i like the moveset

[tall torrent]

Well the moveset is click mouse 1

[austere pine]

.>

[junior needle]

And then heavy with the rev

[austere pine]

well ther ewe go

[tall torrent]

Low shredder, it’s over

[austere pine]

the blessing, karker

too poor to put it on the lvl 4 one but hey

[stable socket]

If I'm looking for a braindead weapon for only horde/trash clear (using ranged for elites/specials), should I be building a rashad combat axe, a shovel or something else? (Power Cycler 4 still eludes me)

[tall torrent]

If you’re looking to build a Rashad you better have a significant amount of resources available

It is (debatably) harder to build than power sword

[stable socket]

oof

[tall torrent]

And Rashad isn’t really a horde clear exclusive weapon

It does well in everything

[stable socket]

makes sense - I really only need my melee to clear stuff that isn't worth spending ammo on, so I guess shovel is the way? Which mark has the easiest horde clear?

[tall torrent]

Pure horde clear probably chainsword / devil’s claw

Shovel doesn’t clear that fast because no cleave blessings

[stable socket]

ah

[tall torrent]

Just bear in mind that bruisers exist

[stable socket]

bruisers are... flak, right?

so I should be building flak/unarmored?

[tall torrent]

Dreg is unarmored body, flak head

Scab is unarmored head, flak body

[stable socket]

(devil's claw sounds good to me since parry seems useful in a tight spot, i'll look into one of those)

[tall torrent]

They have a lot more health than groaners & poxwalkers, and attack much more aggressively

DC swords have bad flak dmg

[stable socket]

oh boy

[tall torrent]

Made a typo
DC7 anti-armor & boss is special > L1/H1 > H2

[stable socket]

Got it, thanks! I'll try out mk1 heavy spam and mk4 light spam and see which one does better against bruisers

(I'm looking for the most braindead combos where I can spam one button to clear horde)

[tall torrent]

Heavy spam

Don’t light spam DC swords

[stable socket]

Got it, mk1 it is then

[faint beacon]

I can confidentally say if you're looking for light spam mk4 is literally

Turn your brain off in trash hordes

[tall torrent]

Mk4 light spam only exists for zealot with crit CDR

The dmg is very low

[faint beacon]

Mk4 wrath + rampage?

Or not worth it

[tall torrent]

DC4?

Savage sweep is better than wrath on DC swords

[faint beacon]

Yeah

[tall torrent]

Because u have naturally high cleave

[crude fiber]

Devil claw parry stamina consumption is also based on how late you do it. You can parry a crusher overhead for almost no Stam if you do it last second

And even if you do it super early it'll just guard break you instead of downing you

[junior needle]

Not on light attacks

[elder fiber]

if your'e spamming for cdr lights then other marks are better b/c they got the overhead swing

its like only reason to pick mk7 probs lol

orc gameplay

[faint beacon]

I recall having decent progress with DC4 Wrath + Rampage but it's kinda just sitting in my inventory now

[tall torrent]

Yea

[faint beacon]

Really only meant for non specials

[tall torrent]

You don’t really want overheads for fishing crit CDR on a horde though

[elder fiber]

on zealot with max attack speed mashing dc lights it doesn't matter

your'e just left clicking and pressing f until everything in your face dies

[tall torrent]

Overheads just hit less enemies which means less crits from cleave = less crit CDR

[junior needle]

Even on zealot with max attack speed, you can still get better performance without overheads

More targets hit is more cdr, although if you're running fotf it can seem superfluous as you only really need enough to maintain permanent buff uptime

[elder fiber]

the overheads are there for stuff like elites but again, this is autoclicker orc gameplay lol

[tall torrent]

Ironically enough DC7 has the most complex moveset in the game

[bitter turtle]

i will say

playing with ppl here is like

less fun than pugs

more smooth but also u fuggers running ahead giving me anxiety

[elder fiber]

I mostly just play pugs, its funny when somebody trips over their own dick into the burster conga line and dies

[wanton dawn]

I was tired !

I need to go sleepy

[elder fiber]

barrel wipes own

[faint beacon]

The pros always just come with one con lmao

[junior needle]

Oh yeah, what was the result of the game

[tired hornet]

This is why I like to lag behind and eventually die

[echo parcel]

Pubs are fun because they are so chaotic

playing with disc people is more chill

[tired hornet]

I play 99% pubs

I hate other people

[wanton dawn]

Surprisingly good showcase, but still lower dmg potential than other option brought imo

[faint beacon]

I enjoy even though admittedly rare playing in groups cause it's always smooth

[wanton dawn]

Can probably give my bolter dps a run for its money

[echo parcel]

I got outdamaged by meta guns but not by a landslide

[junior needle]

Well, as I said, individual performance can fudge perceptions of viability.

[bitter turtle]

i wouldnt say headhunters are meta either 😔

[junior needle]

Or objective performance

[echo parcel]

You make them look good though

[faint beacon]

Will forever be a firm headhunter enjoyer

[junior needle]

vraks 7/3 are good

[bitter turtle]

yeah

[echo parcel]

maybe same way I make the recon look above average but still

[bitter turtle]

but would you put them on volver/plasma tier

[echo parcel]

I think the recon slander goes too far

[tall torrent]

Deep down everybody here wants recons to get buffed

[junior needle]

Objectively speaking, the guns are doing 1/2-1/4 the baseline damage of an iag with worse ammo efficiency even with shocktrooper.

[wanton dawn]

I would have brought the columnus but as I said: tired

[bitter turtle]

ngl

[junior needle]

They're pretty bad by comparison.

[bitter turtle]

i still think u just played better too

craime went down TWICE

[wanton dawn]

THRICE

[bitter turtle]

and i was busy trying to catch up to you mfers

was NOT chill

me: pick up plasteel

[faint beacon]

Was it Damnation or Auric Mael

[bitter turtle]

HADRON: GROUP TOGETHER, AS A UNIT

and i see all u fucks already in elevator

[serene bough]

his bayonet days are over

time for craime to retire

[echo parcel]

It was decent game for me, few mistakes but only makes it more fun

[wanton dawn]

I was kinda trolling

[echo parcel]

auric mael

[tall torrent]

Ok chainsword page done what next weapon should I do

[bitter turtle]

i can post the scoreboard if ppl are ok with it or care

[bitter turtle]

chainaxe

[faint beacon]

Fun, what modifiers did the game throw at you guys

[bitter turtle]

[wanton dawn]

But the 3rd down was not my fault, that mf bomber spawn camped me !

[serene bough]

melee or ranged

[tall torrent]

[tiny summit]

*not far enough

[junior needle]

I want to see ammo used

[tall torrent]

On melee weapons rn

[serene bough]

do shovels

[wanton dawn]

2s i will connect and put the scoreboard

[bitter turtle]

see this is what i actually said

[faint beacon]

Shovels

[echo parcel]

I think I should have waited to rez you there lul

[bitter turtle]

i think theammo is ok now

https://i.gyazo.com/cd02e3e5db454f359f7ef71b51c0de72.png

u can play without slupring everything

[tall torrent]

[bitter turtle]

now that they unfucked shocktrooper

[junior needle]

I literally cannot tell who is who or using what

[bitter turtle]

rightmost is recon

i am v7

[wanton dawn]

I have weapon on mine 2s

[bitter turtle]

craime is left of me

top fragged with brauto

[wanton dawn]

Also top fragged by mobian 6

[bitter turtle]

imagine

picking up less plasteel

than the literal slowest person on team

[wanton dawn]

Cant hear you

[bitter turtle]

😔

https://i.gyazo.com/e5a6335f1d9f74ada0ff5357e9cf7be0.png

[echo parcel]

Recon 7 as it is right now is one finesse buff off top tier

mark my words

[bitter turtle]

to be fair

[wanton dawn]

Both game

[bitter turtle]

that is not a minor buff

v3 was op as fug before finesse nerf

[tall torrent]

Chainsword page

[junior needle]

It's ok, not a stand out performance. You still definitely have to slurp ammo if you're the one doing the heavy lifting on the team but it's much more spread out here.

[bitter turtle]

i didnt post that one cause i dced in the beginning

[wanton dawn]

I know

It show you worse than you were

[bitter turtle]

ya

it hurt my fragile ego

😔

[serene bough]

i dont wanna be that guy to pick out language but incoherent seems like a weird word

[wanton dawn]

Also notice that I removed material taken from my scoreboard

[tall torrent]

How else would u rate CS13g

[serene bough]

medicore

[tall torrent]

Besides “bad”

[serene bough]

incoherent is like, language of something is weird or confusing

[bitter turtle]

mason actually picked up more than me both times

[tall torrent]

I think it has potential but the movesets just aren’t chaining in a coherent way

[bitter turtle]

but u two picked up even less

[echo parcel]

Would you call this performance of the weapon "unusable"?

[bitter turtle]

13g is confusing

confusing why they even made it

[tiny summit]

Well incoherent in this context means "there are good things about it, but it's moveset is questionable"

[serene bough]

i would just call it outright bad

[tall torrent]

But I don’t wanna call it “bad” unless it’s truly awful

Given it’s supposed to be an objective & educational guide

[serene bough]

lackluster?

[bitter turtle]

trying it more

i really dont think there is any trick to the moveset besides light spam too

[wanton dawn]

One thing you can definitely expect about me is to not pick any material that is not directly in front of me

[bitter turtle]

there is a horizontal-ish heavy on h3

[serene bough]

i dont wanna quibble over language but it stuck out to me so i thought id mention

[wanton dawn]

On that good note, good night folks

[bitter turtle]

idk if its worth doing l1l2l3h3 though

[tall torrent]

I heard it’s also not lacklustre at killing poxwalkers

[faint beacon]

Possible

[tall torrent]

It had like insane clear speed for poxwalkers

[bitter turtle]

supposedly top poxwalker mincing speed yeah?

for light spam

[faint beacon]

Only thing of note I've gotten is that

Extremely effective at mincing hordes with light

[serene bough]

what about niche

[junior needle]

I wouldn't use that term because like viable, it has a wildly varying definition to the average person. Because "technically" nothing is unusable provided you can actually do something with it, even a melee weapon that does literally no damage and can only block or shove like other ones can have a use.

The recons are definitely subpar compared to others on an objective measure though, which isn't influenced by subjective factors like random variance and individual performance. They aren't unusable, but they're not good by comparison.

[hollow ibex]

Niche or subpar?

[tall torrent]

Well niche in my book is “think before you take” and I’d gladly put stuff like knife or chainaxe in there, but not a horde clear sword

[hollow ibex]

Oh just saw this lol

[tall torrent]

Especially since veteran generally wants melee weapons that mince hordes

[faint beacon]

Niche is a good word to put it

It fills a role of trash clearing

Other than that it's relatively weak

[serene bough]

underwhelming?

[junior needle]

Niche can be good, great, or even overpowered. Just not popular. Recons are decently popular weapons despite their lower performance because laser light show.

[bitter turtle]

maybe ill give 13 another go

[tall torrent]

You after using it for a game:

[bitter turtle]

yes

[hollow ibex]

I wouldn’t say that. It just means they have limited uses in a context like this one

[bitter turtle]

im sure nothing will change

but who knows

[faint beacon]

Honestly when I'm home I'll give it a spin

See if I discover anything

[bitter turtle]

i just wonder if i can run bloodletter/wrath instead of rampage/wrath

[hollow ibex]

Which has pretty significant implications in a game like this

[tall torrent]

Maybe?

[junior needle]

Another word that has varying definitions and why it's difficult to use any descriptor when talking to people. It can be both.

[bitter turtle]

or rampage/bloodletter

[tall torrent]

Actually, try that