veteran-class

[tall torrent]

Fellow mk12 chainaxe enjoyer

[strange sparrow]

https://streamable.com/dwzu7y

Shred + Rampage

And I forgor I spawn a crusher

[frank basin]

Have fun with practice

Horde with crusher is a thing

[strange sparrow]

You dont really need that much cleaving power imo

[unborn perch]

For it I want thrust and bloodletter or Headtaker/bloodletter or slaughterer/bloodletter. If I get either of those rolls on the mk12 for the vet, its over

[strange sparrow]

But C-Axe I agree

Bloodletter has been really good on it if you fighting boss

[tall torrent]

I think chainaxe for vet is best off with headtaker + slaughterer

[unborn perch]

Thats the whole reason I want one is for carapace and bosses

[tall torrent]

U get a lot of dmg on top of better horde clear from both +power blessings

U can still 1 shot crushers with headtaker + slaughterer

[unborn perch]

you gotta have the BL for awesome boss damage imo

It just sets it over the top

[tall torrent]

Didn’t they nerf bleed dmg for bosses

[unborn perch]

I don't know of any.

[strange sparrow]

3 months ago, from a well detailed reddit post

[frank basin]

Join the Reddit

[unborn perch]

I've been bossing with bloodletter on my chain weapons for a long time and its still good.

[tall torrent]

I remember they writing in patch notes abt nerfing bleed dmg to carapace and bosses

In the same patch that explosion dmg to bosses got nerfed

[autumn wave]

For vet I want rev it up for the vwooms

[strange sparrow]

To some extend, Tide Game Redditor does a great job in explaining hidden game mechanics

I hope that culture start on Darktide soon

[frank basin]

What culture?

[strange sparrow]

Then Again, FS did a great job in explaining a lot of mechanics in VT2

[strange sparrow]

Math Breakdown on how AI work/ what could you learn to play the run better in some way or another

[frank basin]

Can you explain simplify?

[strange sparrow]

Things like this

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1821186836

Also this

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1y7CSzMPlliMTsTjSoxdg4UhOQtu3lRd_E2ju8Tn7zqQ/edit#gid=1772327800

[autumn wave]

Oh

You mean verminscience

[strange sparrow]

Also this
https://www.reddit.com/r/Vermintide/comments/c79roi/vt2_intervention_systems_other_relevant_systems/

Vice Versa

If I ever have problem not understanding the game

Someone would have a spreadsheet or a well-detailed stuff

[frank basin]

Is this some sort of combo to make melee fight effectively?

Rather spam repetitive melee

[strange sparrow]

Yes

[autumn wave]

I still can't find a comprehensive source for vermintide's finesse values

[terse idol]

Folks may be waiting but we doo have random Mish mash or information floating arouund

[strange sparrow]

The first one is Optimal Melee Combo, The second is Optimal Melee Run speed (Mov Tech), The third one is AI director talk stuff

[autumn wave]

And armor mods for specific attacks

[strange sparrow]

Yeah that's not really helpful I would say

[terse idol]

I mean

[strange sparrow]

because difficult of finding those information

[terse idol]

Vermintide 2 has been out for years

Those darktide guides will be made once the game isn't updating as much I imagine, or eventually someone will step up

Community ran effort

[strange sparrow]

I would be expecting FS to explain the game better

[terse idol]

I mean then you have the same problem in v2

[strange sparrow]

VT2 are better explained/comprehensive in some way

[autumn wave]

Aside from pygex and the ogrinomicon there hasn't really been a concerted effort to collate information

[terse idol]

But you still need

[strange sparrow]

technically the math add up with the table

[terse idol]

These player made guides

Also, becuase of modifiers it... it's alot less consistent

[strange sparrow]

But currently, the issue with Darktide is the Math doesn't add up with the table

[terse idol]

Without just programming calculators

[strange sparrow]

and you need to go in to find them...

[terse idol]

Yeah

I mwan you'd probably still need to code dive v2

[frank basin]

Math in video game is really my downside to make

[terse idol]

If what if getting what you're laying down

[strange sparrow]

I don't think so because I vague remember some mods just give all the details that's extracted from the game

bestiar something?

[terse idol]

Again mods

Extracted from the game

Not easily accessible

To the general public

[strange sparrow]

I mean you dont need to create a mod to lay down the foundation to explain the game better if FS do it instead

[terse idol]

I mean we have that Twins spread sheet someone like got

[strange sparrow]

that they could be

[terse idol]

So it just took some cooking

[terse idol]

Yeah

That's true

[autumn wave]

Bestiary is still lacking for damage values for anything but unarmored and the equivalent of flak

You need to load up custom spawns to test monster and chaos armor damage in that game

[atomic zephyr]

mfw someone goes afk at the last section of the carnival

and the other vet is stealth
a good stealth vet, mind you
but still a stealth vet in a horde

[strange sparrow]

Do you ? Since I remember the math do pretty well

but then I play before sienna update which is like the stagnant era

got 2 map in total

[autumn wave]

Bestiary only lists values to armored and infantry

[strange sparrow]

Oh wait

What about Armory

I think I have both installed at some point

[autumn wave]

I meant armory* yes

Bestiary just gives enemy hp values

Damage profiles do not scale with every enemy type the same way

Fireballs for instance do bonus damage to monsters and shotguns to zerkers

[strange sparrow]

Oh no Sienaa

The only class I didn't play

Fuck VT2 Peril System

[autumn wave]

At least Darktide comes with a damage table

[strange sparrow]

I wouldn't give them credit for the damage table thou

[south garnet]

has lag/rubberbanding gotten really bad the last few days for anyone else?

[strange sparrow]

for how wrong is it

[autumn wave]

Still better than arbitary power numbers in vermintide

[autumn wave]

Helbore is one of the few misaligned damage tables due to unique modifiers

With their charge system

[tranquil bronze]

Still frustrating at how useless carapace damage is

[strange sparrow]

Oh it's not Unique Modifiers that is having problem

It's either Stopping power (Math doesn't add up) or some weird hidden mechanics

for the gun

Also Charged Shot on Hellbore doesn't have inverse fall off damage on certain enemy

[frank basin]

Try shot uncharged

[autumn wave]

The charge is one of those weird hidden mechanics

[frank basin]

Yes

[strange sparrow]

Which is bad to some extend because I would be looking at this and say

This is garbage against Crusher

[frank basin]

How much for uncharged shot damage against crusher?

[strange sparrow]

in the 10 something

[raw steppe]

@tall torrent were you able to figure out if you can tank a sniper to toughness without VoC overshield?

[frank basin]

That close enough to table damage

[autumn wave]

Well at least you have quick access to the psykanium

[strange sparrow]

PsyKanium is the thing I would give them credit for

That is a good improvement over VT2

[frank basin]

With iron will?

[strange sparrow]

Would still need creature spawner but it's alright

[raw steppe]

ye

[frank basin]

You could try?

[raw steppe]

don't have the mod

[frank basin]

I think if you have 60% three curio against sniper then yes

[raw steppe]

hm

[frank basin]

With iron will

Iron won’t fully tank against sniper

It take your health about in guessing 20%

[autumn wave]

Not the most elegant method but I'd probably test the helbore on crushers in any case to see how executioner's stance or rending stacks interact with them

[raw steppe]

what about with close order drill + IW

sadly if sniper does any dmg to hp it does full dmg

[autumn wave]

Because when everything is inconsistent

Nothing is

[raw steppe]

so you need to fully tank it to toughness

to avoid the dmg

[frank basin]

Combine that i think it would tank eat 90% your toughness or im thinking 14% of health taken something like that

You simply just dodge it

Sniper easily dodge

If you curious how much damage test you can try some mod if you are a pc person

[raw steppe]

ye

mathematically it should be possible

1225*.5*.67*.8*.8*.8

[strange sparrow]

I could try it if I got enough time sometime later

[raw steppe]

meaning with 3x sniper curios you need 210+ toughness

[strange sparrow]

I got 17.17.16% Toughness Curios

and could easily get 3x sniper adjustmentr

[frank basin]

🤯

[raw steppe]

you get .5 for IW .67 or close order drill, and 3 .8s for curios

sniper shot does 1225 damage to toughness

[frank basin]

Okay

[raw steppe]

but ye not sure if it's worth

it might just be worth to get 1x sniper res

to not die to the oneshot

[frank basin]

Don’t forget exhilarating take down

[raw steppe]

and get other stats

oh yeah it doesnt make u take 30% more damage anymore

it's actually useable

[autumn wave]

Ghost lets me fully tank sniper shots without toughness

[frank basin]

I remember before talent rework my 320 toughness vet tanked sniper shot are about 24% toughness remain with full 60% sniper res

[autumn wave]

Me plinking off a reaper's noggin while snipers in vents plink off the emperor's shield

[raw steppe]

ye but you had unwavering stance

which was op

they took that out now lol

[frank basin]

No I didn’t use unwavering stance

Iirc I stand with large 320 full 60% res sniper

I only take like 40% damage from sniper take down to 24%-13% toughness remain

Have fond memories

[raw steppe]

3x sniper res curios is .8*.8*.8 = you take 51.2% damage from snipers

base sniper damage is 1225 to toughness

so you have to had some extra DR somewhere

otherwise mathematically it shouldn't be possible

[frank basin]

If did use unwavering stance I only take half damage from sniper

[idle carbon]

iron will?

[frank ether]

I think I'd rather have %5 toughness nodes than sniper resist personally

[strange sparrow]

It's just a test on whether it is possible

and looking here, it should be

[frank ether]

probably is

throw shout in there

and enough DR + resistance curio

on my zealot I run 3x gunner resist instead

[strange sparrow]

Shout work differently

Overtoughness op

Someweird funny mechanics with yellow toughness

[dusty jacinth]

what to change?

[strange sparrow]

You dont need to change too much from here, maybe unarmored to Flak/Maniac depend on your liking

[dusty jacinth]

aight thanks

[jolly hemlock]

I'm not really a revolver player but I would like to try out the new revolver how is that one doing compared to the first revolver. Could someone enlighten me?

[strange sparrow]

The New Revolver have gimmick that I would say better on Zealot

[jolly hemlock]

That doesn't answer anything

[shut flax]

It doesn't penetrate, which is a huge loss

[tall torrent]

It’s a lot worse than mk2 in terms of picking off specials in a pinch (no cleave & a lot worse breakpoints), but it can crank out a very high amount of burst damage against larger targets if you build for that

The braced fan-fire is more accurate than you think, if you give it time to reset spread between each shot

But if you just full send rounds after rounds, it’s rather inaccurate

[severe adder]

do you get like an invulnerability from reviving poeple?

[tall torrent]

No, u auto-block attacks

Blocking atks consume your stamina

[jolly hemlock]

can it like 2 shot crusher or something like that?

[frank basin]

@raw steppe (dont have bot dont need close order but can be extra take lesser + 60% of 3 curio sniper dmg resistance, also this is maximum of 17% toughness curio + 3 of extra 5% toughness combine other toughness talents nodes + 15% toughness dmg rdction)

yes you can tank sniper with full curio with maximum damage reduction

[tall torrent]

Not sure, probably could, needs specific build tho

[jolly hemlock]

mhh

will prob craft one and see

def cant put up with the slow one

[tall torrent]

Seems like the best build for it is trick shooter + crucian roulette

With deadshot obv

[jolly hemlock]

ty ^^

[tall torrent]

It’ll prob get buffed at some point

[jolly hemlock]

well im running a melee oriented build

[tall torrent]

Rn the no-cleave thing really hurts it

[jolly hemlock]

so no points on lower left side

[strange sparrow]

Sorry was busy

[jolly hemlock]

its fine

[strange sparrow]

I call it gimmicky because it trade off a lot of damage for reload speed

[tall torrent]

The damage is way lower then you’d expect

[jolly hemlock]

tbh most important would be that i could like oneshot gunners

[strange sparrow]

You would find constraint in ammo for using it a lot also

Oh gunner, should be able

[jolly hemlock]

if that doesnt work then i can stay with heavy las pistol

mhh prob make one then and test it out

thanks ^^

[raw steppe]

nice

[tulip condor]

Quick question: Bulwurks and Reapers are carapace or unyeilding?

[raw steppe]

i dont think it's worth it tho

[frank basin]

is just gimmick and funny

you can dodge the sniper as people told that simple

[strange sparrow]

Bulwarks have armor

So cara + unyielding

[tulip condor]

thx

[elfin stump]

Reapers also have some carapace pieces on them

[placid portal]

And flak shirt

[elfin stump]

I was surprised at how accurate the damage map for them is

[jolly hemlock]

for some enemies it matters where you attack

[elfin stump]

Now if only you could shoot Crusher's exposed bits...

[jolly hemlock]

go into the meat grinder and take look at them

[placid portal]

Reapers have the most Armor variations on bodyparts

Unyielding, Flak, and Carapace

[elfin stump]

Reapers have carapace bracers and boots, bulwarks have bracers, shoulder pads and boots

Does Maniac armor type provide any innate damage resistance?

[strange sparrow]

Yes

[strange sparrow]

Also yes

[elfin stump]

My Lucius oneshots Scab Ragers, but doesn't Dreg Ragers

[strange sparrow]

I keep missing out stuff cuz I’m busy kekW

[placid portal]

Maniac do have some resiliance vs melee usually

[tulip condor]

head

[low oar]

Karnak twins definitely take this cake

[placid portal]

Lucius has 113% dmg modifier on close range but ramps up pretty high on far range

[elfin stump]

Despite having apparently more damage against maniacs

[strange sparrow]

Maniac have lesser resilience over melee imo because some of their innate damage received

For example, Mutants

https://tenor.com/view/toothless-toothless-dragon-lizard-dance-dancing-gif-18147614732076936345

[elfin stump]

Same distance

[strange sparrow]

X3 to melee and x1 to ranged

[placid portal]

Muties, Flamers, Dogs, and Bombers have melee vulnerability

fun stuff

[strange sparrow]

@placid portal hellbore is bugged

[placid portal]

wat

[strange sparrow]

Charged shot have no damage falloff

[placid portal]

Zamn

[tall torrent]

They have flak, unyielding and carapace parts on their body, but generally we consider them unyielding because:

1. They are “unyielding” at their core (DoT effects)
2. Their heads are unyielding

[elfin stump]

Hellebore doesn't have famGe falloff tho?

It deals even more damage at range

[tall torrent]

It has no regular falloff

[placid portal]

Shoot their fleshy bits to do bonus dmg vs unyielding

[tall torrent]

On some armor types it has increased dmg over range

[tiny summit]

Get some MF stacks

[placid portal]

Or just mark em with focus target

[elfin stump]

It's a stock Hellbore, no perks or blessings
MF at 10

[tiny summit]

Be a gamer and not be bound by waiting for your focus stacks

[placid portal]

Why wait? just crit headshot

Mk3 pretty sure does 1 shot with crit headshot

[elfin stump]

It's mk1

[placid portal]

Ah

[tiny summit]

To get even a grey mk1 helbore to 1 tap dreg gunners you need a few or a combination of talents to 1 tap dreg gunners below 80 dmg w/o MF.

[elfin stump]

I can charge non crit headshot oneshot dreg Rager

Wait

Not dreg

Scab

[midnight totem]

What's the uptime on opening Salvo again?

[elfin stump]

I can't with dreg

[elfin stump]

I saw somebody said it's linked to recoil

So it resets when your recoil resets

[tiny summit]

Said I needed more helbores to dump resources into. Spent 2m dockets on cosmetics

[shut flax]

Whew, just played with two psykers and a zealot and was on special duty the entire time. Was pretty fun tbh.

[elfin stump]

My every game is special duty

:D

[shut flax]

Last auric I ran, it was actually kinda relaxing. Everyone was doing a little bit of everything.

Going back down to Damnation is genuinely more stressful

[tiny summit]

Special duty https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1046912126746374274/1194492797332496514/Poxburster.gif?ex=65b08d1b&is=659e181b&hm=11cd17d81a000b2ca6740619011457ff8231c6ebf583d88c1eea1a605b3a0024&

[shut flax]

At least he didn't overpenetrate a mauler and blow up a burster

[elfin stump]

Lasgun gang

No penetrations happening here

Lasgang

[shut flax]

Speaking of, I've been trying to roll Man stopper all day and haven't gotten it once. If you told me it was patched out I'd believe you.

[elfin stump]

Also I seem to be the only person ever to be concerned with watching the squad's back

[shut flax]

Same. Some people just can't fathom that something might spawn behind us.

Then I turn around and the zealot is pulling 6 crushers and 4 gunners

[elfin stump]

Bomber noises

[paper furnace]

worlds heaviest blade

good thing it has 20% se

[shut flax]

Then you hear like 3 trappers and a dog spawn

[elfin stump]

When you start sprinting, inertia carries you

[tranquil bronze]

You know what, am actually happy with the choice of swapping the blessings instead of the perk. The difference of not having flak damage perk is very miniscule.

[tiny summit]

Director: watch this. This'll be funny.

[shut flax]

That thing was too big to be called a sword. Too big, too thick, too heavy, and too rough.

It was more like a large chunk of iron.

[tiny summit]

Making your breakpoints with some talents?

[elfin stump]

Does it body one shots scab shooters?

[tranquil bronze]

I got rending on

[elfin stump]

Rate this tho

[tiny summit]

Longshot or kill zone?

[shut flax]

I genuinely hope that we'll eventually get a mode that lets us play as specials and elites like in L4D. Prolly not gonna happen, but it would be interesting to see what BS happens behind the scenes.

[elfin stump]

Play as a map director

[tranquil bronze]

To put into perspective. On Damnation, the gunner with flak armor will still be a two shot headshot if no crit was procced even if my MG XII had flak perk.

[tiny summit]

10 years and we get a random update. I mean VT2 VS lives

[tiny summit]

Now that would be funny and probably more realistic considering the games balance atm

[shut flax]

Are we posting ours? Here, have this I found in the junk pile.

[shut flax]

True. Here's hoping. I wanna meme together a squad of four bursters.

[elfin stump]

Needs drum mag

[tiny summit]

Been using helbore so long I forgot you 2 tap those with infantry

[shut flax]

I can't stand the weird reload tbh

Even for the meme

[elfin stump]

I one tap them with V7

[tiny summit]

Makes me want to install the mod

[shut flax]

I literally only installed it to adjust sights.

[tiny summit]

Helbore irons good

[tall torrent]

Got a question

Can survivalist refill zealot’s throwing knives?

Since the throwing knives are technically “ammunition”?

[tiny summit]

I feel like a confident no

[elfin stump]

Same, but then I dipped into modding harder

I hate how all the "marksman" weapons have no usable scopes

But the fucking pistol gets one

[tiny summit]

Helbore irons good!

[elfin stump]

Stockholm syndrome

[shut flax]

I'm debating modding even harder. Though, I can't imagine I'd need anything else besides testing shenanigans in the psyk.

[tiny summit]

All WW2 multiplayer gaming is paying off

[elfin stump]

I have a HUD mod that displays everyone's health, toughness, ammo and pocketables so I don't steal ammo from ammo starving people

[tiny summit]

If possible it'd be funny to have recons shoot to the tune of caramelldansen and be RGB

[elfin stump]

I need rgb lasguns

[shut flax]

Have the intro screaming noise just be a distorted carameldansen

Or the organs playing the among us theme

[tiny summit]

Caramelldansen in a heretic obscura den

[elfin stump]

Replace Mutie's scream with 😭

[shut flax]

"UOHHHHHHH"

Or the exploding guy from serious sam

[tiny summit]

Oh the placeholder Lies of P TTS. "Come here you rascal"

https://youtube.com/shorts/16HJOgNeFNk?si=RklFqde4f9KSIVvb

[tulip condor]

Knowing their head is unyeilding is all I needed to know. Thanks

[raw steppe]

the metaslave build is very easy to top damage charts with lol

[shut flax]

What weapon?

[raw steppe]

it's the colum deadshot build

[shut flax]

Ah gotcha.

[raw steppe]

just does an absolutely insane amount of damage

[shut flax]

If there's three meta builds, is it really meta?

[elfin stump]

Darktide is one game I don't care about the stats because I want to win the run more

[raw steppe]

well the runs are pretty easy to win lol

my winrate in auric pubs is pretty good now

[tiny summit]

I care less about stats to be on top. I just wanna make sure I'm pulling weight

[shut flax]

Exactly

[tiny summit]

I definitely did not yesterday with trying Exe MF Recon

[shut flax]

Though, I've recently started playing on Damnation again just for the stress of it. I kinda like not being comfortable in Darktide.

It's legitimately why I play Zomboid. Keeps you focused and keeps it from going stale.

[tiny summit]

Normal damns are chill for me

[elfin stump]

Auric is easier than Damnation?

[shut flax]

The teammates are generally better.

[elfin stump]

Everyone I asked to play Zomboid with me said the game was too autistic

[shut flax]

Last damnation we had to pull a level 20 psyker around

[shut flax]

Barotrauma is high tier tism

[tiny summit]

True but base damn and low intense damns are very chill. You know...when the director isn't Randy Random from Rimworld

[shut flax]

Zomboid is on the line

If you get into modding, yes. (I mod the shit out of it)

[elfin stump]

My last damnation three people fell down with a pogryn running around

[shut flax]

True. It's hit or miss. I only had one or two completely smooth runs today.

It leaves a weird hole when things go perfectly fine

[tiny summit]

My smoothest runs that stand out to me have all been 3 vets and psyker

[elfin stump]

My best runs are usually when 2 or 3 people die and then one mf clutches the win and director lets us have the rest of the map for free

[shut flax]

3 ogryns and me, a vet. Legitimately nothing happened.

[elfin stump]

When it goes smooth for most of it we usually perish instantly at some random point

[tiny summit]

Now others could be easier with some godly ogryn and zealot players but they feel more frantic because everyone is dancing in the mayhem and in between

[shut flax]

I kinda like playing with chaotic knife zealots

and begrudingly, even knife vets

[elfin stump]

I lowkey don't like having ogryns cause they tend to soak half my shots

[shut flax]

YES

I wanted to pick up a revo just to shoot through the fuckin wall of meat in front of me at all times

[tiny summit]

Depends for me. I don't like when the zealots are just completely running through

[shut flax]

Fuckin macros set to stand in front of my LOS at every possible moment

If they're soloing the map, it's boring. Same with a plasma vet.

Like, I'm not running uber meta columnus and I have it set to be as fun to use as possible. It feels great to just get by.

Mainly when I need to jump down a floor and VOC a revive because a psyker exploded somehow

[tiny summit]

My friend played as a voidstrike psyker while I was exe helbore and shared vision and there was a plasma vet. Not a lot of dangerous things got close. And they were dead before he could get a charge off

[shut flax]

Plasma vet is a fun vaccuum

[tiny summit]

While helbore vet basically has a rifle from the immaterium

[elfin stump]

I probably should get shared vision but then I'll have harder time keeping relentless up :<

[shut flax]

I just take Covering Fire and feel good about myself for not sharing vision

[tiny summit]

Letting them shoot my refresh targets sometimes feels I should drop it but eh. Exe is so short it's always popped in an encounter

ET + CK + Catch a Breath + Born Leader + Charismatic + MF Tunnel Vision I'm definitely a toughness generator for the team!

[jaunty tinsel]

It often feels like I'm the only person who can deal with crushers. Do other classes actually have any options to deal with them or am I just getting elaborately trolled?

Yet again we wiped because I ran out of Krak grenades (I have every single grenade perk)

[junior needle]

Ogryns are generally my most reliable teammates

So I can't complain

[shut flax]

Zealots do funny damage to crushers. Psykers need two brain bursts. Purgatus does very little damage against crushers. Ogryns can rock em though.

[tiny summit]

All classes have ways to deal with crushers. All depends on what they bring and what do you mean? Like a complete anti crusher answer?

[shut flax]

And vets have krak grenades, onslaught autoguns, and free damage against ogryns

[jaunty tinsel]

It always seems like whenever I don't have a krak grenade ready everyone spends a solid minute dancing with them

[tiny summit]

I just got a folding shovel for my ogryn. 1 tapping crushers is oh so satisfying

[shut flax]

I think assail also does pretty low damage to crushers, but I could be wrong.

[tiny summit]

Low as in nothing

[jaunty tinsel]

Maybe I'm just venting, lol.

[shut flax]

I only mained purg psyker at launch and refused to re-learn everything else.

[marble bridge]

iirc every class has a “good” melee option for carapace

[junior needle]

You're right, unless handcannon still applies to assail

[jaunty tinsel]

I built to very rarely run out of grenades so when it does happen it's tilting

[shut flax]

Yeahhh. Sometimes a revolver really does come in handy just for those crushers.

zealots love running the oneshot build, but it kinda falls flat in general gameplay

[tiny summit]

Not all classes have your insta delete grenade so yes. They will have to dance to a certain degree save for new ogryn folding shovels

[shut flax]

So melee ad clear also goes to vets with pswords now

[tiny summit]

Psykers with Dueling Swords can 3-5 poke a crusher head to death

[shut flax]

True. Though you're asking a psyker to put away their shock staff or put down assail for more than 3 seconds.

[marble bridge]

i’ve been running knives zealot and it does ok add clear but is actually reasonable against most everything with more than poxwalker

[marble bridge]

scrier’s gaze makes it 1tap

[tiny summit]

At least surge will make the crusher stop in place in a little

[shut flax]

I saw a generalist stealth zealot last run and she did fuckin amazing

I forget what sword she ran, but it wasn't the usual suspects.

[tiny summit]

Heavy swords are pretty goated

Unless they were using a dclaw

[shut flax]

I don't think she was. We basically duo'd most encounters while the other two were doing... something.

[tiny summit]

Lol

[elfin stump]

My vraks five taps crushers

[tiny summit]

Had 2 people leave at the finale last night. Came close to me and the other guy losing.

[shut flax]

Doesn't psword poke twoshot crushers?

[tiny summit]

It can

[elfin stump]

I don't have a solid psword nor do I want to get intimate with them

5 vraks shots take little bit longer than one second

[tiny summit]

If you don't have the optimal setup, if you have PC4 you can use the full push light combo them to death too.

[shut flax]

Tbh I kinda wanna start running knife

[tranquil bronze]

Oooh... Melk got a PC4

[shut flax]

Not like, knife build, but just knife. I ran it on my psyker at launch and the fuckin mobility on it was insane

[elfin stump]

Nice

[marble bridge]

it’s really fun i recommend

[shut flax]

What do you need on a knife? Haymaker and what else?

[tiny summit]

Got a folding shovel for vet. Actually liking it. I just needed a option for horde smacking and for carapace bonking and the folding shovel does that with its sweep lights and folded heavies

[marble bridge]

everyone memes on knife zealots for going fast but you equip one and you’ll be picking up all of the plasteel

[elfin stump]

What's the use cases for knife?

[shut flax]

Mobility

[tranquil bronze]

So how's this power sword so far?

[shut flax]

And I think okay damage

[marble bridge]

i use fleshtearer (whatever’s bleed on crit) and the crit on dodge ones

[tiny summit]

Going fast. Ever see the knife users constantly attacking at match start?

[marble bridge]

it’s good damage but nothing spectacular

not a t.hammer but it’s respectable for killing elites

[tiny summit]

Also pretty good dmg on weakspots with dodging in between.

[formal hamlet]

Where can I find up to date builds for my classes?

[tiny summit]

Pins?

[shut flax]

Probs gameslantern or, for more accurate info, pinned builds.

[tiny summit]

Can always browse gamelantern for new classes

[junior needle]

Gamelantern builds are uh

Usually pretty dog

[shut flax]

Interesting

Yeah

[formal hamlet]

I built a recon lasgun build from Games Lantern that used to be meta, so now I'm kinda paranoid after wasting all that plasteel.

[junior needle]

The recons were never meta, you got jebaited

[shut flax]

Like the top rated one recommends competetive urge for some reason

[tiny summit]

Did auric quick play and landed into lights out with exe helbore last night

[junior needle]

Well, patch 13 I guess

[marble bridge]

lucky for you the game’s comparatively piss easy for how strong you can get

[shut flax]

and charismatic instead of longshot

[junior needle]

But outside of that and infinite stacking infernus around release

[tiny summit]

Yea recons atm...pick another gun. Wait until patch

[shut flax]

Didn't the lasgun burn used to do stupid damage back at launch?

[formal hamlet]

I tried looking up YouTube builds, but hard to tell who actually knows what they're doing.

[marble bridge]

you can literally solo auric maelstrom with a psyker and columnus so nearly anything works

[junior needle]

Stacked infinitely, burn stacked on itself too

Then it was left in the shitter forever

[formal hamlet]

I'll check the pins, those are probably reliable.

[marble bridge]

tanner does but he’s tiny and also very loud

[shut flax]

There's three really strong builds currently. Columnus, revolver, and plasma. Recommend not using plasma.

[tiny summit]

You like helbores?

[shut flax]

Helbores are also really good

[junior needle]

In my ignorance I spent a ton of resources pre crafting patch chasing a well made infernus 6d

[shut flax]

Touch recon if you really want to tickle something

[tiny summit]

You get a free gun with an amazing spear

[formal hamlet]

Love them. My main Veteran class is with a Helbore Lasgun.

[junior needle]

I was very upset after I got it post crafting patch

[shut flax]

I farmed a perfect sword for my psyker and a seamless purgatus staff the hard way. I feel your pain.

[tiny summit]

This is what I run

[formal hamlet]

The build I find works most at higher difficulties for me is one with a plasma gun, but I really like the Helbore even though I struggle on higher content with it. Probably skill issue.

[shut flax]

Eh, depends. Do you like shooting specials a lot?

[formal hamlet]

I like shooting everything.

[shut flax]

And if so, how much do you want to shoot? If a lot, columnus. If a little, revolver.

[formal hamlet]

I was a bit upset when my mate told me at higher levels you don't shoot everything.

[shut flax]

If you like playing blindfolded, plasma is an option

[formal hamlet]

You melee lots of stuff and then shoot the important things.

[shut flax]

Tbh if you have a good frontline, you can get away with maintaining headshots for Born Leader and focusing incoming specials.

[formal hamlet]

I picked Veteran because I wanted to shoot all the damn time.

[tiny summit]

I'm starting to upload my runs, I can plug my auric runs with it

[marble bridge]

just go for a full crit shock trooper/weapon specialist build with a kantrael or something then

[formal hamlet]

Never tried Auric.

I mainly play on the 4 bar difficulty, tried 5 bar on stream the other night with some viewers, was good fun but a bit tough for me.

[formal hamlet]

Honestly don't know what most of that means. I'm terrible when games let me "build" my own class.

[shut flax]

Try this build if you wanna shoot things with an autogun.

[sharp ember]

brauto is my choice for constantly shooting, doesn’t stand up to crusher squads though

[tiny summit]

Disclaimer. Im not amazing https://youtu.be/nMjn4OetlJs?si=Q0A_pgtwbrf8bXui

[shut flax]

It can with onslaught

[formal hamlet]

This one is for Helbore lasgun?

[tiny summit]

Yea

[formal hamlet]

Don't have an autogun yet, not a fan of it but I hear they're really good.

[junior needle]

Damnation (t5) is by far the most efficient difficulty for resources and credits. Auric is just a special board that constantly has missions with harder modifiers for t4 and t5. You don't get more resources from it, but you can get more credits from the mods.

[formal hamlet]

How can I share my current builds?

[marble bridge]

ok so the node that gives no ammo cost on crit with lasgun? you take that, and stack crit with weapons specialist (25% crit iirc) and deadshot (also 25%) so you crit a fuck ton and never consume ammo

maybe not never but

[junior needle]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/build-editor

[shut flax]

I'd recommend the columnus Mk V for getting into autoguns. It's considered the best at the moment, and it feels really good to use.

[marble bridge]

you get much more ammo efficiency

[sharp ember]

my brauto build is almost identical to this, minus focus target keystone and add reload speed nodes

[shut flax]

Perks don't really matter on it, but dumdum and deathspitter do help enable it further

[junior needle]

Perks do matter more than DS on it

Flak/maniac exacerbates the value

[formal hamlet]

Lemme launch Darktide and share my build, see what you guys make of it.

[junior needle]

Generally the priority is dumdum>flak/maniac>second blessing

[shut flax]

Yeah that's fair. I meant to say blessings lol

[formal hamlet]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9a565016-bd70-4fe0-8c82-1080bc73412e/veteran-squad-leader

This build I took from the site, probably the one I think carries me best.

[junior needle]

Dumdum is bugged and uses the zealot anoint in blood code

And is active at much farther range than "close"

[shut flax]

There's a few wasted points in that build

[shut flax]

oh rip. hopefully that gets fixed soon. Or turned into a feature.

[formal hamlet]

Are weapons specialist and deadshot also skills in the tree, or like, weapon blessings?

[marble bridge]

skills from tree

get the crit chance perk on the weapon tho that’s p good

[junior needle]

A lot of blessings have scuffed descriptions. Deathspitter functions identically to fire frenzy and stacks, but the tooltip doesn't say anything about that.

[junior needle]

Those are both talents

Also weapon spec is not good for lasguns

You only get a single crit out of it

[shut flax]

33% for one shot?

[formal hamlet]

I was looking forward to enjoying a good lasgun build because most of my Veteran weapons or semi auto, so felt good shooting the recon lasgun.

Autoguns I didn't like since the iron sights felt a bit gross and the recoil was more than the recon lasguns.

[junior needle]

Hasn't been updated on the website, let me take a picture in game

[shut flax]

Funny enough, people tend to mod the game to change the sights

[junior needle]

It's only ever given crit on the first shot and had that same misleading description

[formal hamlet]

Did not know that was a thing.

[junior needle]

The recoil gets much worse if you move, so the key to IAG's is to shoot and scoot with dodging

[shut flax]

Client side mods are allowed. It's called "weapon customization". Pretty neato.

Also autogun recoil tends to go straight up, so it's fairly easy to compensate.

[marble bridge]

there’s another one that’s just adding crosshair over the ironsights

[formal hamlet]

Ironically friend DMed me at that exact time to tell me about a mod called "Better Melk".

[shut flax]

Yeah! It's actually fairly easy to mod the game. Surprised me a bit when I had it up and running while waiting for feedback at work lol.

[junior needle]

They feel pleasant to shoot but remember, there's a massive performance gap between recons and other guns currently

Don't waste your time (ludicrous amounts of resources) on them like I did

[shut flax]

They may eventually see the light of day again

Possibly in the form of burn

[marble bridge]

why are you shooting at the backside of a mutant

when do you ever do that ingame

[junior needle]

Oh the website has been updated. Yeah on your next shot, and only one. I shouldn't speedread it next time.

[marble bridge]

please do a realistic test aiming vaguely head level at gunners or something

[shut flax]

To be fair I also speedread it and was worried I got it wrong lol

[tiny summit]

The infantry lasguns are in a ok spot. But the Ia and MG4 were buffed so they kinda power crept the XII. The XII wasn't nerfed but the buffs to the other 2 with their fire rates, kinda now make up for it

[junior needle]

The mutie is just a high health punching bag to test maniac dps. All maniacs take the same ranged damage.

Higher HP = less variance in testing

[marble bridge]

you’re also not hitting weakspots which is realistically something that’s gonna happen

[formal hamlet]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9b0eac24-4ee6-45f3-a261-eda015479707/build-my-mate-helped-with

Hope that works.

This is my build.

[shut flax]

While that's true, this is base damage testing.

[formal hamlet]

Mate helped me pick out some perks to use with my Lasgun and Power Sword.

I found a shovel recently and someone on my stream said the shovels are really good, was kinda fun using it.

[junior needle]

I separate videos by weakspot and bodyshot. I do bodyshot comparisons to show performance independent of ability. However, since you want to see a headshot comparison...

[marble bridge]

yea but testing damage like that (even if it’s true that recon worse than auto) feels incredibly disingenuous since that’s not what’s actually gonna happen

[shut flax]

Granted, this testing is also not factoring in any skills or talents at all.

[tiny summit]

I personally don't recommend the 15 stacks on MF. Its not that I can't get the headshots and stacks, I think realistically free stacks are better than 5 extra. Or the rending at only 10 stacks when rending in the middle can be accessed

[shut flax]

Just pure base damage to use as a reference point.

[marble bridge]

thanks

[formal hamlet]

I was using the Accatran Mk VId recon lasgun I think. Was meant to shred through armour, have unlimited ammo and stuff.

[junior needle]

Sounds like patch 13.

[shut flax]

100 damage + 33% modifier will still be 133, y'know? It's good to know the floor of a weapon to see what it can do later.

[tiny summit]

You're not having unlimited ammo anymore. Ammo economy on the recons were shot

[shut flax]

Rest in pieces

[formal hamlet]

Yeah, I only found that out after making the build and wasting all my plasteel on that "god roll" recon lasgun.

[elfin stump]

15 stacks make MF unusable for solo bosses

[formal hamlet]

So now I'm a bit more hesitant about which builds to put time working towards making.

[shut flax]

I wonder if the recon nerf was a kneejerk decision or if it'll always just be... recon.

[elfin stump]

When the Mr. Beast of Nurgle pulls up I don't wanna go look for targets to get my stacks up I wanna burst it down

[tiny summit]

That too. Free stacks are like...free stacks

[formal hamlet]

I can swap that.

[marble bridge]

uptime better than peak (most of the time)

[formal hamlet]

Probably a good sign if that's the main tweak being suggested?

[shut flax]

That's a good point tbh

A good version of peak would be the zealot oneshot build

[tiny summit]

Also this? Get this.

[shut flax]

Great at chunking bosses, not so great at much else.

[formal hamlet]

Problem is finding the spare skill points.

[shut flax]

Iron will is busted. If you pair that with Confirmed Kill, you can chain kill specialists and elites and always be above half toughness even when standing still

Just don't recommend standing still

[elfin stump]

Hammer Zealot is good insurance if your team is dumb enough to trip over Hosts

[formal hamlet]

Uh, see how one of my perks wants me to stay still to get stacks.

[tiny summit]

I think you're safe giving up upgraded grenades and the talent point to get to it. Shredders do good on their own and more so for the stagger they give

[formal hamlet]

Does dodging remove the stacks?

[junior needle]

As someone said, it's purely to provide a baseline of performance. There's many ways to build the talent tree and many disagreements as to what constitutes an optimal "build". I cannot test them all, and a lot of trees are just psykanium warrior setups for beeg number.

I provide both weakspot and bodyshot testing as some guns are better at one or another. Or better at both. The recons have very low finesse modifiers (crit/weakspot) and so perform even worse on headshot testing.

I do it for all damage types to the best of my ability, using the highest statted gray (or essentially gray) guns I can manage. The talent tree acts as a performance multiplier, so typically better performing baselines will be proportionally stronger than weaker baselines.

[elfin stump]

I swapped out confirmed kill for the weakspot kill one

[shut flax]

The perk actually wants you to get headshots

[formal hamlet]

I do be getting a lot of headshots.

[shut flax]

Headshot kills stall stack degredation by 3 seconds

Headshots (without kills) stall it by one second.

[tiny summit]

Don't think about standing still to maximize stacks. Move when you need to. When you have a good firing position ADSing think "do I really need to slowly walk?"

[elfin stump]

Standing still perk is only for when you can't rack the stacks normally

[slate sleet]

https://tenor.com/view/shut-up-cat-monch-cat-monch-spinfal-gif-19376414

marksmans focus

[shut flax]

MF definitely has a place

[formal hamlet]

Gotcha.

[tiny summit]

MF good

[slate sleet]

have you actually looked into what the skill does

in detail

[elfin stump]

I love MF

[tiny summit]

Yea and it slaps

[shut flax]

You need a good finesse weapon to make it shine, but it does do a pretty good job with crit builds.

The thing is, you'll be a bit stamina hungry

[iron marten]

MF is fine, but I prefer TF

[formal hamlet]

So switch long range assassin to camoflauge.

[elfin stump]

75% ranged finesse, 10% reload speed

[tiny summit]

Just play normally and click heads. Most players while ADS are moving far more than they ever need to. You're ADS, if you needed to move you probably wouldn't be ADSing

[shut flax]

TF is great for chaining deadshot. I bound my tag to one of my mouse buttons so I can tag and keep shooting and always have uptime on it.

[elfin stump]

I chucked DS out after learning it turns off on 0 stamina

[slate sleet]

majority of the weapons veteran can use will overkill nearly every enemy at max mf stacks

[shut flax]

DS + Target down = more stamina

[iron marten]

My tag is bound to Q

[strange sparrow]

Marksman focus serve some very niche value

[shut flax]

also 3 +3 stamina curios might help

... and stamina regen

[strange sparrow]

If you running +40% Crit chances

It have positive return overall if you’re using finesse weapon

Also click head

[slate sleet]

if you are standing still and shooting at a boss you either have a taunt ogryn (big L) or you are playing sedition because the boss will auto snap to you after a little while and make you lose all your stacks

[shut flax]

25% is still very reliable for an autogun, especially if you're running onslaught and rending strikes

[elfin stump]

I don't wanna let go of 2x toughness +1 wound

[formal hamlet]

Trying to find that toughness perk you mentioned.

[strange sparrow]

Just use fast shooting gun smh

[iron marten]

Should probably make a vraks3/7 MF build aye

[shut flax]

2 wound gang

[strange sparrow]

If you play full auto columnus into MF

You can easily stack enough

[tiny summit]

And it feels good and dreg ragers drop in 1 shot with a mk2 helbore

[strange sparrow]

And headshot kill give you 3 seconds no stack drop

And headshot hit give you one second

[shut flax]

Also you have access to confirmed kill, ET, Iron Will, and Focus Target

[elfin stump]

Middle tree, right after the voice of command ultimate

[strange sparrow]

It’s not as standing still as people perceive

[shut flax]

You kinda don't need all that toughness

[tiny summit]

Lower middle tree

[shut flax]

But I can see the draw of it

[strange sparrow]

Just run around like a regarded, I tried

[marble bridge]

also moving only eats one stack at a time and not everything immediately

[strange sparrow]

But I would still prefer FT overall because it’s general since I hate CRIT

[elfin stump]

I have 203 toughness on my vet

[slate sleet]

or i could just use focus target, have perma 12% damage for myself and my whole team, make bosses take a massive 32% increased damage globally

[strange sparrow]

Nah fuck that, if you’re losing stack when you move

Just headshot

[shut flax]

You're tougher than me

[strange sparrow]

Auto gun give so much run seconds

[formal hamlet]

I must be blind.

[umbral scaffold]

Wounds are for the weak!!!

[tiny summit]

I gave up the toughness node for charismatic and shared vision

[shut flax]

Headshot kills stall the stack degradation by 3 seconds.

[formal hamlet]

Found it.

[strange sparrow]

That’s what I’m saying

[shut flax]

I mean, when you move

[marble bridge]

wounds are just bad lol they’re only useful if you die or are martyrdom zealot

[strange sparrow]

Yes

[shut flax]

Which allows you to move and not lose stacks

[marble bridge]

and martyrdom zealot is bad

[strange sparrow]

Just move and headshot with columnus

[shut flax]

Oh ye

[strange sparrow]

Not hard

[elfin stump]

I usually just don't care about keeping up the stacks, the way I play usually gives me enough

[umbral scaffold]

The best solution is to not die in scenarios like this

[strange sparrow]

Yes that’s true

[formal hamlet]

Okay, so since I removed Grenade Tinkerer to get Iron Will, I still have 1 spare skill point left.

[elfin stump]

Only times I stand still is either boss or crusher pack

[shut flax]

A build that works for you without thinking much about is probably worth as much as a very micromanaged, yet powerful, build.

[marble bridge]

that’s what i was saying

[strange sparrow]

But fun fact, toughness replenishment work on everything

Which is probably why I would take MF

(Running EC MF columnus)

[shut flax]

ET CK columnus gang

[formal hamlet]

Also in hindsight, do I want to be wasting a talent point on Vanguard?

[slate sleet]

marksmans focus is a giga gamer talent, you need to be really good at the game to get actual consistent use out of it and i really doubt anyone in here is on that level

[shut flax]

What does Vanguard do?

[formal hamlet]

If I remove that, that's 2 talent points free for something better.

[umbral scaffold]

Yea so if anyone reading this is running wounds reconsider health, toughness or stamina curios. Better for survival than wounds imo

[formal hamlet]

-20% sprint cost.

[tiny summit]

Also depending on the difficulty you play consider the node on the opposite of Iron Will. 5% to restock a grenade off elites and special kills in coherency doesn't sound like a lot but it's my only nade regen in my builds and it's quite enough in aurics so I save 2 points from not going grenade 60s regen

[strange sparrow]

Install weapon customisation mod and install become that guy

[shut flax]

You only want that if you want the reload perk

[slate sleet]

id imagine every marksmans focus user in here gets to max stacks only like a few times a mission and spends the rest with either 0 or a few

[marble bridge]

same shit for revive shout

[elfin stump]

Stacking heads on barely moving walkers or immobile shooters is easy as fuck

[strange sparrow]

You know what

[formal hamlet]

Helbore lasgun doesn't need many reloads tbh.

[shut flax]

I ran rez shot to babysit randos for a bit, then turned away from it

[strange sparrow]

I’m probably gonna play a game of auric tonight if I got time

[marble bridge]

just don’t take revive then spam shout on cooldown and people will go down less

[formal hamlet]

It usually doesn't use ammo when I headshot I think.

[strange sparrow]

I would show how fast would I stack

[tiny summit]

I don't feel like a gamer, but I click heads

[strange sparrow]

With CIAG

[slate sleet]

id love to see some full game recordings of people shilling this keystone

[umbral scaffold]

I run revive shout but use shout pretty consistently, it’s not a bad combo if you have tactical awareness

[shut flax]

Yeah then you don't want vanguard. You can go Longshot into Volley Adept for reloads as well, plus it gives you access to Exhilirating Takedown

[strange sparrow]

Full game would cost me 2 GB to upload thou

[bitter turtle]

The stacks only drop 1 at a time

[strange sparrow]

Because 3 seconds already get me like

[formal hamlet]

I have no idea how good players play, but I definitely need to learn to use my builds better.

[strange sparrow]

26 mb

[bitter turtle]

It's not hard to keep them up in an intense encounter

[tiny summit]

whistling shameless plug lmao #veteran-class message

[umbral scaffold]

I also use rez shout to Rez people who up on a different level than me it’s pretty good and saved a few games

[shut flax]

That's how I ran it. I eventually learned that shouting on cooldown in big fights saves more time than rezzing someone.

[formal hamlet]

I don't really get the talent selections since they aren't broken down for me, I just use a build without understanding how to fully exploit it.

[strange sparrow]

Shame

[shut flax]

And saves a wound

[bitter turtle]

Like u have to actively miss repeatedly for 10 seconds straight to drop to 0 in a firefight lol

[shut flax]

The walls need lead

[bitter turtle]

If ur doing that then I suggest a different gun

[strange sparrow]

Then again

[shut flax]

On the upside, DT has very little verticality to it

[formal hamlet]

Gonna throw my spare talent point into Tunnel Vission for now then.

[umbral scaffold]

I mainly run ex stance now because I find it really fun with IAG, but I use shout for the toughness and stagger mainly

[shut flax]

Just have decent cursor placement and headshots will come around

[strange sparrow]

CIAG MF only work well if you have >40% Crit

[tiny summit]

Looking at every poxwalker like a snack for stacks

[strange sparrow]

If you have less than that your E-DMG suck

Against FT

so you must do Crit build to abuse MF

Else E-DMG become negligible

[shut flax]

To do a crit build, you need a shit ton of stamina and it locks you out of Target Down for that stamina regen as well if you go the FT route

You'll be relying on Duck and Dive a fair bit to regen that same stamina, but it can work

[slate sleet]

marksmans focus did literally nothing for you that entire game

you overkilled most enemies

if you had any other keystone it would have been the same damage

[shut flax]

With what gun? A plasma?

[slate sleet]

hellbore

[shut flax]

Ah gotcha. Yeahhhhhhh

That's a good point.

[elfin stump]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9b0eb387-84d7-43ed-84a5-d9fefc35982d/sniper-roleplayer

[tiny summit]

1 tapping rager is nice

[elfin stump]

My current build

[umbral scaffold]

Better to overkill than under kill amen

[slate sleet]

im pretty sure you do that with just exec stance normal hellbore with damage nodes

[shut flax]

Going by that report, you could technically run Focus Target for the same effect

[slate sleet]

also i watched for like 5 min and you spent most of that time below 3 stacks

focus target gives a global damage buff and it makes bosses go down insanely fast

[bitter turtle]

I don't actually agree with mf on hb3 tbh either

I use it on v7

[shut flax]

Does the increased ranged attack speed from Weapons Specialist apply to the charge rate of helbores?

[bitter turtle]

His 1 shot BP for ragers

[slate sleet]

you are trading a purely selfish keystone that is unreliable at best with no actual benefit for most of the meta guns for something that provides your team a constant 12% dmg buff + 20-32% on whatever tanky enemy you mark

[junior needle]

Probably not

[shut flax]

Eh, worth the thought.

[junior needle]

Charge rate and fire rate are separate stats

[shut flax]

True, true. There goes that dream.

[elfin stump]

You have a point there

[slate sleet]

marksmans focus is probably quite ok for lasguns and headhunters but both of those can hit breakpoints without it on nearly all enemies

[junior needle]

Died because I got stuck on a ladder I walked near while a trapper was going by

And it wouldnt let me off

[tiny summit]

I definitely had consistent stacks for actually firefights

[elfin stump]

I need to test if I can do without MF

[shut flax]

One thing to note with Focus Target is that you won't be getting to 8 stacks very often in a fight if you run deadshot with it

[tiny summit]

I like my mk2 helbore

[slate sleet]

what do you mean

[elfin stump]

I definitely can't one tap flamers without the MF

[strange sparrow]

@slate sleet #veteran-class message

We did the math so

[compact oak]

I tried using the hellbores but the pulling out time is so painfully long I didnt really enjoy it

[shut flax]

Bayonet moment

[strange sparrow]

To anyone that is interested on the MF/FT argument

It work well on Finesse weapon

Hellbore suck to demostrate that

I tried that out because Hellbore is not a finesse weapon

[strange sparrow]

It use the Crit E-HP module on Morte Carlo

[elfin stump]

Vrakses are

[tiny summit]

They gave you a bayonet for a reason!

[strange sparrow]

On average >40% crit = performing better than FT

<40% crit, just fuckin do FT

[formal hamlet]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8RAuaHMmSw

Are these good builds?

[slate sleet]

no

youtubers are always wrong

[shut flax]

25% crit is also fine. You can lean into it, but with an autogun or similar weapon, you can rely on that 25%.

[formal hamlet]

I don't know who's right.

[slate sleet]

what do you want to use

[elfin stump]

Lmao, nice mindset

[strange sparrow]

He's not wrong

There's some shit youtube giving shit information

that is very outdated

[shut flax]

Youtubers tend to hyperbolize a bit.

And it's often outdated.

[tiny summit]

Operate on vibes. Except for recons atm. I mean use them if you want but we do have to give some sound advice

[formal hamlet]

I have a decent Helbore Lasgun and Power Sword, so I want to have a standard build for those two I can always fall back on.

[strange sparrow]

Like I could tell you rn that Hellbore Las Charge doesn't have Inverse Fallback

[marble bridge]

realasianrobot saying that smite psyker is better than scrier’s gaze

[strange sparrow]

But Youtuber would say no that's not how it work

[strange sparrow]

[junior needle]

It does, but it depends on the armor type

It doesn't work against flak and unyielding

[compact oak]

Bayonets are just a gimmick imo, when you can pull out a freaking plasma gun faster than a las weapon and then you have to charge it for it to be fully effective on top of that I think the design is flawed. The chargetime is already there to serve that reason, there is no point in having that long of an animation on the weapon considering the time to kill with it is a lot slower already

[tiny summit]

Can do a VoC build helbores they do enough dmg on their own w/o focusing in on the left tree

[junior needle]

But it works against maniac and carapace

[shut flax]

Do you like Executioner's Stance or Voice of Command more?

[junior needle]

I assume someone goofed the falloff table

[strange sparrow]

Yes, goofy ass falloff table

But no one tell me it's depend

[junior needle]

Yeah I tested it earlier

[shut flax]

There are some genuine bayonet users here tbh

[formal hamlet]

I like Executioner for my helbore, but I like voice of command for my plagma gun build.

[strange sparrow]

until I like, huh what the fuck happening in my psykarium

[elfin stump]

Falloff/fallon table

[shut flax]

Gotcha gotcha

[tiny summit]

You mean the rager staggering, safe distance, 4 or less stabs mutant and lower, no need swap weapon bayonet?

[strange sparrow]

Totally this is not the way to play smite

[barren cave]

is recon lasgun still bad with the onslaught talent?

[strange sparrow]

Bandaid on a poor performing weapon

You could try

I find it fascinatingly burning all my ammo

[formal hamlet]

Like, finding builds seems to be easy. People just send me builds on Discord, or there's plenty of YouTubers with builds, and GamesLantern, but I have no idea if those builds are genuinely solid or if some guy's just saying a lot of wrong stuff with confidence.

[strange sparrow]

but atleast it still meet some ttk that I didn't expect

[bitter turtle]

It's usable but basically offers no advantage over doing the same on iag

[strange sparrow]

Do this show that my build is solid?

[bitter turtle]

Use graia if you like the low recoil aspect of recon

[strange sparrow]

Probably not because Build can't just carry you without game knowledge

I play most of them with a shit stuff

[shut flax]

Something like this could work for a helbore, but I'm also not a helbore enthusiast so this is purely from a general standpoint.

[strange sparrow]

Hellbore actually demand you to learn the game

[shut flax]

Either it works, or I call upon cunningham's law

[strange sparrow]

it's super hard to learn, and I play VT2

[elfin stump]

One lost game, build invalid

[formal hamlet]

It shows that you survive more than you die. Maybe the build's mid, but you're carrying it with your massive testicles? 🤷‍♂️

[tiny summit]

Is it actually hard though?

[strange sparrow]

Truly ✊

[shut flax]

Whoops, forgot to post the build

[strange sparrow]

It's hard because I can't go Braindead IAG/Plasma/Ps6

[slate sleet]

you can put the extra points into whatever you want, remove the bottom left 2 nodes if you want more points into wep expert or something

[raw steppe]

lots of ppl say wrong stuff with confidence lol

[strange sparrow]

Do you agree?

[raw steppe]

it's very common

xdd

[vernal harbor]

theres nothing we can do

[tiny summit]

True.

[strange sparrow]

Like Exec HellBore require you to use 2 more braincell than normal

[shut flax]

The good thing about here is that we dispute incorrect or inefficient information

[strange sparrow]

Can't just scream your way out of trouble

[shut flax]

Usually through mindless arguing, but it gets done eventually

[tiny summit]

Idk 1 says to shoot and the other says to stab

[strange sparrow]

Tell me VoC isn't broken af

[strange sparrow]

I need to position where am I standing to not get backspawn poxburster while within EC

[bitter turtle]

Tinker krak

But why

Bayonet already kill monster

[shut flax]

You really don't want tinker trak. It oneshots crushers already.

[slate sleet]

its for killing bosses

[bitter turtle]

Yes

Bayonet already does thst

Insanely well

They also run sword

[elfin stump]

Any suggestions?

[tiny summit]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1046912126746374274/1194492797332496514/Poxburster.gif?ex=65b08d1b&is=659e181b&hm=11cd17d81a000b2ca6740619011457ff8231c6ebf583d88c1eea1a605b3a0024&

[slate sleet]

ok? so change it to shredder

[bitter turtle]

Do u really need even more anti boss lol

Idk just asking lol

[slate sleet]

its template not some must take thing

[shut flax]

It's fair feedback tbh

[strange sparrow]

VoC Veteran Squad spam be like

What is poxburster

I dont know man

can it break my toughness?

[slate sleet]

the core of the build is solid for absolutely any weapon

[strange sparrow]

[shut flax]

Hug a burster and find out

[slate sleet]

you shout to get a bunch of red keystone buffs so its both a defensive and offensive ability that has amazing team utility

[strange sparrow]

Yellow Toughness OP

[strange sparrow]

You cant simply

[weak token]

i mean, it isnt really op

[slate sleet]

its absolutely broken

[shut flax]

Now hug six and pretend your toughness is higher than it is

[weak token]

to be fair this is this cd on elite/specialist kills paired with hunting grounds and weak mutant waves

[strange sparrow]

As long it’s yellow it can tank anything

[formal hamlet]

Man some people don't mince words on these build videos.

[strange sparrow]

This is auric Mael btw

[weak token]

exactly

[strange sparrow]

You get scaled harder for playing harder difficulty

We end up taking less than 200 damage each

I don’t know why you don’t think it’s op

[weak token]

i dont see an issue, columnus mowing down stuff

[shut flax]

I wonder what the creator's reply is

[weak token]

its not our fault the director wanted to stuff higher difficulties full of elites and specialists

[slate sleet]

shitters will try to defend a 30 sec cooldown stagger aoe that refills your toughness, gives you uber toughness, gives your entire team all of that, on top of activating 3 different damage keystones and being essentially a 10 second cooldown looping in on itself in a auric game where you are getting constant cooldown reduction from killing specials (doing your job)

[formal hamlet]

Basically thanks for commenting because even if you're shitting on me, you're helping me get more views on the algorithm.

[strange sparrow]

[bitter turtle]

I don't think it's that much better than ctw tbh

[slate sleet]

its absolutely busted

[bitter turtle]

They have similar effects and use cases

[slate sleet]

i dont even take hp damage in most of my auric games

[shut flax]

Ah, lame. Was hoping for a genuine answer from the guy.

[bitter turtle]

Ctw offers more offensive benefits while voc more defensive

[slate sleet]

and i never feel like im in any danger

whats ctw

[bitter turtle]

Chastise the wicked on zealot

[formal hamlet]

Are there any big Darktide veteran content creators who at least most of you can agree have some decent build videos?

[raw steppe]

not really lol

[shut flax]

... The pinned comments.

[raw steppe]

most of the good players don't "content create"

[strange sparrow]

Yellow Toughness Prevent any oneshot breaking including crusher overhead..

[formal hamlet]

I just want a mf to show me a build, explain to me how it works, and show him using it so I get a good understanding of how to use it correctly.

[weak token]

also believe it or not im fairly sure u can still take dmg when u have over toughness

[raw steppe]

if you want good builds you just talk in here and get them from ppl here

[bitter turtle]

Ctw includes extra charges and an armor downgrade buff

[jaunty tinsel]

Just wait until the 2 AM "VoC is shit" crowd shows up.

[bitter turtle]

Both do an aoe stagger around u

[jaunty tinsel]

The cryptids of the Vet community

[weak token]

there's multiple instances where i've took chip dmg with over-toughness still active

[bitter turtle]

It's pretty comparable skills

[strange sparrow]

Also just skill issue

[slate sleet]

is that the channel aoe relic thing?

[bitter turtle]

Ppl even called voc the ctw on vet

[raw steppe]

no

[strange sparrow]

Can't even I-Frame stuff smh

[raw steppe]

chastise is the dash

[bitter turtle]

Nah its their og skill

[raw steppe]

channel aoe skill is book

[compact oak]

I understand that the bayonet has good utility useage, but at the same time the fact you cant swap to your ranged fast is also a huge tradeoff since for clearing bigger groups you would most likely want something that can cleave well instead of a bayonet. Since usually Vet is the one who focuses backline threats, to me personally that tradeoff feels a bit too much considering currently most weapons can do what it does better minus the extra added utility of the bayonet. I'm not saying it's not viable, just that to me it currently feels a little bit worse with the additional animation time comparative to other weapons.

[bitter turtle]

When voc was released I mean

Cause u basically use them the same way

[elfin stump]

Making a good veteran build
Step 1.) Switch to zealot

[slate sleet]

i dunno much about zealot i only leveled mine to 30 and all i really sumerised from the experience is that its the best boss killer class but its lackluster in everything else

[bitter turtle]

Def not true

[strange sparrow]

Zealot are just extremely tanking when you build crit for my game

it's a super good melee character

[slate sleet]

probably not true but i also dont care i wanna shoot guns

[bitter turtle]

Ya

[strange sparrow]

especially heavy evis

[bitter turtle]

Anyway I don't think voc is that out of line tbh

Like I said b4 more ppl would take infiltrate if it didn't have a 4 pt tax

Exec is just weak

[strange sparrow]

I don't treat Veteran Melee as a thing because how fragile it is for overtuned damage

[bitter turtle]

U ask me if I'd take exec or ctw if it was on vet

I'd take ctw

[raw steppe]

i dont think exec is weak

i think VoC is just overtuned

[slate sleet]

melee vet is disgusting i dunno what you mean

[bitter turtle]

Ask urself this

[weak token]

voc isnt overtuned and exec isnt weak, its just how the game works

[bitter turtle]

If infiltrate was not literally on the worst place possible on the tree

[slate sleet]

full melee talents wep expert vet with rashaad is disgusting

[bitter turtle]

And ate 4 pts

Do u think everyone would still take voc

[weak token]

with exec u need to be on range weapon to gain value, with voc u can gain value regardless

[bitter turtle]

What if infil and voc switched tree spots

[raw steppe]

exec is actually quite strong, but VoC doesnt need to be 30s cd and overshield shouldn't fully block poxbursters and snipers

[slate sleet]

inf will get its place once difficulty 6 comes out

[bitter turtle]

I bet u infil will be taken more than vic

[slate sleet]

its more of a complete the mission guarantee

[raw steppe]

yeah i think if infil and voc switched spots everyone will still take VoC

[elfin stump]

Stealth grenadier

[raw steppe]

VoC is just too good rn

[bitter turtle]

Idk about that

[strange sparrow]

I think I will take Exec Stances instead of Infil

if they switch place

too much talent tax

[bitter turtle]

Voc is carried by having the best spot on the tree and demo stockpile above ut

On top of very little tax

[tiny summit]

Vet too squishy

[strange sparrow]

Not the best

The left is the best

because survivalist rot

[elfin stump]

Exec should be the middle tree since it's direct upgrade to the basic ultimate

[bitter turtle]

No

Bc left

Still has to go to voc tree

To take stockpile

Lol

[strange sparrow]

Why do I need to take stockpile?

[tiny summit]

MOAR

[strange sparrow]

You could just go down and invest more point there?