NEON GENESIS | talk on #nulls-morb-land

[prisma minnow]

No it's been a problem since launch

Maybe they'll at least fix skin breaking in direct light with RT reflections

[hexed urchin]

prob

guess I'm going to start playing with medium RT lighting on though

[prisma minnow]

gotta poke at this lighting thing, that busted shadowing could be a different bug, and not the same as that other one

[hexed urchin]

Perhaps. I asked on the CDPR forums and someone else agreed with my story about it being everywhere now.

They said they had the same shit

So I don't think it has anything to do with mods

they even mentioned the kabuki stairwell where it used to happen too

[prisma minnow]

fix it null

[hexed urchin]

lmfao

It is a bummer that now I'll have to use DLSS, I try to avoid it like the plague because DLAA is a lot hotter

but oh well, better than busted lighting

[prisma minnow]

Could use DLSSTweaks to bump up the resolution a bit

[prisma minnow]

not confident in CDPR fixing a lot of this, some dates back to launch, others to 1.5 or 1.6

[hexed urchin]

I'm not either but I don't know how he'd even begin to fix it

I dislike playing with RT not even just because of FPS but also because it makes things look different. I may be crazy but I actually do prefer the static lighting.

So it sucks that it's busted now

I mean theoretically I guess something within the lighting params for RT is fixing it, just kinda gotta find what it is

[prisma minnow]

probably at the engine level, bugs too

null can fix

[high swan]

lx.s obligatory comment

[hexed urchin]

GET IN THE MOD CAGE WAGIE

nah but it's not a huge deal I can just turn RT on.

Would be worth looking into though because not everyone can just turn RT on

The real question is which mod has the better sidewalk lighting?

[prisma minnow]

subjective imo

I know it's a non-answer but I don't care 😎

[hexed urchin]

True. They both look really good in their own ways.

I love how pale the sun is with the E3 lighting, makes the world really feel sunbleached and real. Neon is more stylized color wise but it also manages to feel real.

I will say, Neon lights things in a way which makes them appear more blended into the scene, if that makes sense. It feels a bit more artistically cohesive.

[prisma minnow]

True, if you want a more cohesive look, Neon is the best option

But if you like E3, well, then your option is

[hexed urchin]

real

this is why I want null e3

best of both

[prisma minnow]

hope it's a comfy cage

[hexed urchin]

real

https://support.cdprojektred.com/en/cyberpunk/pc/sp-technical/issue/2533/patch-2-02-coming-soon

lol

[high swan]

Are these taken at the same time of day

[hexed urchin]

Nah I prob should've

[high swan]

[hexed urchin]

[prisma minnow]

Remember that these are just the highlights, so stay tuned for more details!

[hexed urchin]

if those are the highlights then Jesus this patch must suck

gonna fix nothing

[prisma minnow]

cmon hit up this copium

[hexed urchin]

smoking that copium pack

THEY WILL fix the lighting bugs

copium pack

[prisma minnow]

they'll fix them... in 2.1

2.02 will fix RT reflections

[hexed urchin]

2.63

"This city's always got a patch for you, it might be a lie, an illusion, but it's always there, just around the corner"

[prisma minnow]

okay, did some testing

disabling GI disables the bake, but the GI done by RT or PT remains intact

however, RTX GI is... clearly not meant to be used without the bake

for PT it doesn't matter, as it just overrides all that

[hexed urchin]

[prisma minnow]

have to do more testing still, my eyes lie to me sometimes

where's a place with busted lighting, Kabuki stairs?

[hexed urchin]

Let me pull up the map

[prisma minnow]

nvm found some busted lighting

so, E3 mods ofc, this shot is without RT and GI enabled

turn GI off, we get this

GI bake still enabled, RT now set to Psycho, it doesn't fix this particular instance of whatever the fuck is wrong with this game

GI bake now disabled, RT still set to Psycho

As you can see, it's different from raster/GI disabled, so as far as I can tell, RT's GI pass and other stuff remains intact

[hexed urchin]

lol yeah not too hard to find, sorry for taking forever

[prisma minnow]

it's alright, CDPR will take longer to patch

[hexed urchin]

lmao

[prisma minnow]

from what I gather the lighting bake is just fucking busted

[hexed urchin]

awesome

[prisma minnow]

we can disable it, as you can see, and use RT GI in place of it, but it's not quite designed to be used on its own, though it's still an improvement

[hexed urchin]

May as well

if it fixes it, probably works better

[hexed urchin]

"e3 mods ofc"

[prisma minnow]

Ah, well. Fix. It depends on what the meaning of the word "fix" is.

[hexed urchin]

if it makes it look less fucked up

like in the first screenshot that's insanely bad and distracting

[prisma minnow]

btw null sorry if this is shitting up your thread

but I think this is worthy of further testing, disabling the GI bake and using RT GI as a band-aid

[hexed urchin]

true

plus the potential fix could be included with Neon or whatever

anyway this was the stairway that's been broken forever that I was talking about

holy shit I just keep finding more lmao

[prisma minnow]

let me check that spot

yep there it is

[hexed urchin]

[prisma minnow]

okay I think I see what might be happening

In this spot, turning on RT lighting solves/hides the issue, but not all of it, the wall is still a bit borked

[hexed urchin]

on the stairs?

[prisma minnow]

Not for the stairs, but for your spot there

RT Psycho with the GI bake on

[hexed urchin]

lemme check in my game, I did a fresh wipe

[prisma minnow]

RT Psycho with the GI bake off

And just raster

[hexed urchin]

yeah in that particular spot psycho rt does nothing to fix it for me

all it did was flip the direction of the shaded part lol

[prisma minnow]

fuck me it isn't even consistent

[hexed urchin]

[prisma minnow]

but that's default lighting, no? maybe it's consistent with cyberlighting?

[hexed urchin]

good point, lemme install it rq

NOW ITS GONE LOL

and then this is with RT off

[prisma minnow]

well, there's some consistency there then

it's also dependent on lighting mods

[hexed urchin]

seems to be

happens base game too though

just has minor differences depending on the lighting mod, however that does mean there may be a way to get rid of it and then package it together with Neon for instance

[prisma minnow]

perhaps, you can change the GI values, base env has its own, neon has its own, etc.

[hexed urchin]

I have no idea how to change anything regarding lighting myself ngl

[prisma minnow]

in the env files

[hexed urchin]

never messed with them before

At least we know it's a consistent issue which means the fix won't be random

[prisma minnow]

ahh haha let's not go that far yet

[hexed urchin]

[prisma minnow]

just saying, you never know with this game

[hexed urchin]

nah that's true and good point

whole game is held together with spit and duct tape

which is probably why this issue even exists

[prisma minnow]

spent like 20 minutes screwing with the GI parameters in the env

I can make it worse

But I cannot make it better

[hexed urchin]

W

Make a mod called "Cyberpunk vanilla lighting - worse edition"

but seriously yeah I have no idea why it's so fucked

[prisma minnow]

nah someone else has already got that market cornered

[hexed urchin]

who would that be?

[prisma minnow]

disabling GI in the env doesn't fix the issue btw, only disabling it at the engine level via ini

oh I don't want to name names

[hexed urchin]

[hexed urchin]

[prisma minnow]

browse the nexus for 'lighting' and you might get an idea

[hexed urchin]

lmfao

it depends on how much you hate the vanilla lighting

I really dislike it so for me even the worst mods are a tiny bit better

with few exceptions

[prisma minnow]

oh fuck

the update is live

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/copium-gif-766857345458198993

k if this patch didn't solve all of the issues in the game then i am refundifngh

[prisma minnow]

also null I'm sorry you're going to be coming back to over a hundred messages

[hexed urchin]

we made his thread alive

[prisma minnow]

yes, and in defense, there's not really anywhere else to talk about the game and its lighting

[hexed urchin]

exactly

plus the issue is pertinent to Neon as well

[shadow tartan]

It’s not; this issue is out of my control

I can’t do lighting rebakes

Also, the reason I didn’t change sun pos with NEON GENESIS is because light bakes were made considering vanilla sun pos

This is why mods like CLM have a harder time getting GI to work good

[prisma minnow]

well, shit

[shadow tartan]

If CDPR moved lighting probes and increased light map resolution and put the current one as a settings option, maybe we could get a good result

It’s an issue with positioning anyways, this issue flat-out does not exist in dogtown

[prisma minnow]

Since they didn't touch it with the next-gen patch, and still with 2.0, I doubt that'll be happening

[shadow tartan]

meaning that each probe was placed purposefully and meticulously because of the extra time given

a change like this requires loads of time for only a single location to get fixed

bet you if they didn’t filter GI like they do we’d have a fuck ton more of these artifacts

[prisma minnow]

Disabling the GI bake and using RT Psycho kind of works as a band-aid. Kind of.

[shadow tartan]

we could do it if CDPR did the cool thing and open sourced RED4

I mean ig you can do that

It’ll be single bounce just like the normal GI so there’s really no problem there theoretically

[prisma minnow]

The GI done by RT still applies with the bake disabled, it's just not meant for that, it works better in some locations than others

[shadow tartan]

The set was designed for the harsh lighting afforded by this inaccuracy of baked GI probes

The only reason PT looks great is because of the godly AO given by a unified render step

[hexed urchin]

I saw it in one of the tunnels

[shadow tartan]

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/deus-ex-deus-ex-jc-shame-gif-26245854

[high swan]

Does the angle/path of the sun change at all

Like day to day

(there's a really cool fallout 4 mod for this)

[prisma minnow]

forums saying the RTX bugs I mentioned were not fixed

gonna go find a bridge to leap off

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/cyberpunk-2077-johnny-silverhand-salute-gif-3843907492910555087

[high swan]

https://www.nexusmods.com/cyberpunk2077/mods/2553

idk if the guy who makes this is in here or what but

pls dont make ur film grain like this

those are high intensity and optional ig

but

yeesh

not my cup of tea ig

https://www.nexusmods.com/cyberpunk2077/mods/9138 this gets the highlights and bloom (ig) really right but it blows out the highlights and removes a level of detail, saturation, color and contrast from them as well

[hexed urchin]

MY EYES

[prisma minnow]

That's just how E3 works, heretic

[high swan]

it's a bit much i would say

[hexed urchin]

I just want this to look as E3 as possible

[high swan]

i mean isnt that subjective

[hexed urchin]

E3 was the best looking version of the game and nobody can convince me otherwise, the art assets look perfect with it

[high swan]

idk

this is too desaturated the light

its unrealistically white

it has a good 'feeling' to it

[hexed urchin]

Looks really real to me

[high swan]

as far as not burning ur eyes with the brightness

and theres detail like on the edge of the platform and stuff

but ehhh imo it would be more saturated irl especially in a hazy polluted city like Night City

[hexed urchin]

I live for this

[prisma minnow]

I reject your reality and substitute it with my own

[hexed urchin]

^

E3 mod users are shown to have 40% more testosterone than any other players

[high swan]

it looks good but imo again its quite rare especially in a large polluted hazy city like night city to have like actually straight up pure white light

[hexed urchin]

That's how light works though

Light doesn't change colors based on haze

[high swan]

well no but

[hexed urchin]

Haze would just make it darker

[high swan]

how can i articulate this better

[hexed urchin]

It looks too unpolluted

is what you're getting at

[high swan]

ya basically

but also desaturated

thats whats getting me

and its a bit too bright in the highlights

i need to think how to word it right

[hexed urchin]

I've been to Cali and Vegas and shit, and to me it looks perfect for that climate

[high swan]

i live in NYC, but ive visited LA a bunch...i always imagine and remember the LA light being like, super saturated and cinematic and warm

even like very early morning light which imo would be closest to that, it had more saturation, imo

[hexed urchin]

World is like breaking bad, second you go to mexico, everything becomes organge filtered

[high swan]

well, no

[hexed urchin]

LUT changes

God switches out the LUT

[high swan]

different places have different lighting ya

all the different atmospheric conditions and all the billion of factors that contribute to that

[hexed urchin]

"Fuck it turning on reshade today"

[high swan]

i would definitely say the light in LA is different from, say, morocco

[hexed urchin]

Yeah nah you're right 100%

In the mountainus U.S. it looks very blue, nowhere else on earth looks similar.

Like the distant light is blue

[high swan]

ya stuff like that

[hexed urchin]

The E3 mod currently is broken color wise

it used to be warmer and more in line with E3

[hexed urchin]

E3 is actually very warm

it's very natural

[high swan]

there's a lot of tightly focused rays of light coming in through the overhang of the souk/medina that are made more obvious by like ambient dust and dirt in the air

[high swan]

ya that looks good to me

(still a bit light in the highlights)

like on this guy chest

[hexed urchin]

That was the old version of the mod, new one is borked

[high swan]

ohhhhh

ok

i mostly use vanilla + lut

but i wanna try this nerd's l.xs one day when he finishes it

[hexed urchin]

Holy shit entire opinion invalidated

[high swan]

and this looks cool the og version

[hexed urchin]

[high swan]

why

i think its good

[hexed urchin]

I just hate vanilla lighting lmfao

[high swan]

o idk i like it

vanilla + good imo

[prisma minnow]

you frikkin' dork

[high swan]

i dont use a reshade

[prisma minnow]

gonna shove u in a locker

[high swan]

i also havent played the game in like, idk. 3 months? lol.

just as soon as i get my CPU issues sorted they drop a patch

[hexed urchin]

It's one of the worst butcherings of a game ever and it wasn't even done for a reason

[prisma minnow]

nah they had some reason, old setup didn't support HDR at all

[hexed urchin]

Cyberpunk looks 10x better the second you switch off vanilla

[high swan]

idk it looks good to me

[prisma minnow]

rest was probably to save time somehow

[hexed urchin]

It's lit like a PS3 game, reminds me of the piss filter Deus Ex games

[prisma minnow]

It does have a kind of garish tone to it

[high swan]

this is one bad screenshot from when i had it working

[high swan]

night city is garish

it depicts a realistic yet vulgar future

idk

[hexed urchin]

You'll stand in a dark hallway and shadows will just be fucking green

like what

[high swan]

its not over the top but it suits the tone well

[high swan]

shadows can be green

i havent played since ray reconstruction tho

[prisma minnow]

idk man I didn't see any trees

[hexed urchin]

Everything is green though

[high swan]

i didnt see much that was green tbh

[hexed urchin]

all of the shadows in vanilla are green

they have a green tint

[prisma minnow]

this is all mostly subjective though

[high swan]

i cant find my screenshots folder lol

[prisma minnow]

the green tint isn't imo

[high swan]

but that shouldnt be the case in ray reconstruction

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/bee-dog-dog-bee-dogs-doggy-dance-goobers-gif-23185380

[prisma minnow]

Ray Reconstruction is rather flawed

It solves issues while introducing it's own/making others worse

Apparently Alan Wake 2 has a much, much better implementation of it

[high swan]

its very slightly subtly green in the asphalt in the darkest parts but at this hour of the day on such a dark part of the asphalt

idk

[high swan]

rlly??

2.0.3 hype

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/nick-fuentes-fuentes-nicholas-j-fuentes-speech-bubble-erm-gif-2951859571117619771

[prisma minnow]

idk about that

[high swan]

what these textures bro

[prisma minnow]

RR probably had/has more of a focus on UE5 which doesn't always translate over to Red Engine

[high swan]

the overall tone is warm and imo pleasing and the highlights of the sun are still appropriately bright but not blown out

[prisma minnow]

So I suspect it will just work better with UE5 by default

Though isn't Remedy using their own engine?

[high swan]

this wasnt too green more blueish, despite having green in the image itself

[hexed urchin]

Neon Genesis reminds me that Earth is beautiful

[high swan]

obligatory dork comment about blown highlight detail

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/nick-fuentes-fuentes-nicholas-j-fuentes-speech-bubble-erm-gif-2951859571117619771

[high swan]

granted u looking directly at the sun but the halo around it its too much

[hexed urchin]

it looks really good

[high swan]

imo

yes it does

he change his name every day

but

homie does good work imo

i approve (still hype for l.xs)

[high swan]

what's ur setup

that looks pretty good i would want more contrast and like a slight hair more saturation

but i wasnt using reshade before i think i could tweak it well now

[hexed urchin]

Militech Paraline v6.9, 24 decks of ram, 8 slots

[high swan]

pc

nerd

smh

[hexed urchin]

2080ti, i9-9900k, 64 gb of ram

My computer was built for E3Punk

but it never arrived..

it never came...

[high swan]

ahhh okay

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/facepalm-soprano-really-gif-8277415

[shadow tartan]

This is real though

I remember watching the dawn

It was one of the ugliest things I’d ever seen but I almost cried at the beauty

It’s a weird city

[high swan]

It's very night City in that way

[hexed urchin]

LA is awful I would never go back

Worst city ever

[shadow tartan]

You’re not wrong but there’s something magical about it

That smog

[hexed urchin]

Nah they need to physically seperate it from the U.S.

[shadow tartan]

The morning felt like I could just melt away

[prisma minnow]

with some spice

[shadow tartan]

[hexed urchin]

I'm sure there are plenty of spice addicts in LA

[shadow tartan]

is responsible for the 2008 financial crisis?

[high swan]

That's kinda vibe I'm going for in night City personally

Something close to that but more dystopian but also ya beautiful

[shadow tartan]

I’d need to take a trip there

[hexed urchin]

No that would be the United States Federal Reserve

[high swan]

Also ratings agencies

[shadow tartan]

also wall street

[hexed urchin]

Weird how they all work together like that

[shadow tartan]

it’s called neoliberal economics, or the free market. depends if you are a political philosopher or politician

see if you say free market it sounds american

well I guess you could just say the truth and call it reaganomics

[hexed urchin]

Truth is, it's all dumb, and it's causing society to rapidly decay

👍🏻

I miss when nations were focused on being nations for the people they supposedly were supposed to represent and protect

[shadow tartan]

🤑🤑🤑🤑🤑🤑🤑

[hexed urchin]

but now with globalism it's ALL money

[shadow tartan]

You miss a time that never existed

[hexed urchin]

Oh it did, just before either of us

[shadow tartan]

Except if you were a woman

[hexed urchin]

Social justice is seperate from economics

[shadow tartan]

or a black man more recently

It’s impossible to separate social justice and economics since they are politics; they affect each other mutually

In truth, nations have never represented any more than the status quo

[hexed urchin]

I believe in nation states for every race of people.

[shadow tartan]

are you really that scared of diversity lol

[hexed urchin]

Globalism and the forced combining of populations through manufactured immigration has caused nothing but strife and misery for everyone involved and it has completely erased cultures.

[shadow tartan]

This is not justification for nationalism, especially ethnic nationalism

[hexed urchin]

We can agree to disagree then, it's not a political discourse server.

[shadow tartan]

https://tenor.com/view/true-feel-that-thats-true-feel-gif-26944000

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/laughing-jackie-welles-cyberpunk2077-funny-lol-gif-26943016

[high swan]

damn corpos

[hexed urchin]

real

the one thing we can agree on

corps fuck everything

Adam smasher loves fuckable slabs

[old bough]

[high swan]

now that looks freaking sick

[old bough]

right?

couldn't help but take a pic 😄

[prisma minnow]

I am back to talk about the GI

There is a way to fix, mostly, that busted lighting without disabling GI entirely

What I mean by mostly, the zones that are broken are still broken in some way, but it's possible to make those hard edges/obvious signs go away. The downside is what looks to be less accurate/precise GI.

The answer lies here, in giweights.json, with the "threshold" value, as you can see, by default it's set to 0.28, but by zeroing it, to 0.00, the most obvious issues are made invisible, and doesn't completely kill GI.

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/jc-denton-deus-ex-gif-22280125

jk

[hexed urchin]

yum

[hexed urchin]

fuck

do you have comparison pics?

[prisma minnow]

yes but hold on

might have uhh

found an additional issue from doing this

[hexed urchin]

It definitely is a tradeoff

[prisma minnow]

The other values don't matter much for this, if they do anything at all

If the threshold value is set to anything above 0.00, this issue appears

[hexed urchin]

expert lighting

[prisma minnow]

So, I'm not sure it's just the bake that might be broken, whatever this weights file does just makes it more or less obvious

[hexed urchin]

Would you say it's still worth changing just to get rid of the triangles or will it make the game look a lot worse?

[prisma minnow]

From eyeballing it, it's... better than nothing?

[hexed urchin]

I'll try it then

do I need wolvenkit for that file?

[prisma minnow]

Not sure if it's worth reporting to CDPR, they ought to know by now that the bake is fucked, but they might not know its relation to giweights.json

No, anything that can open JSON will do

[hexed urchin]

May as well try and see if they respond

anyway lemme test

inb4 CDPR just didn't know it was giveweights.json and there is a simple and easy fix

https://tenor.com/view/drake-computer-notebook-explaning-gif-21152267

[prisma minnow]

idk, I do know this file hasn't been touched since the game went gold and likely even before that

[hexed urchin]

that would probably explain it

I love it when my game does not launch even though I only have a single mod installed, thank you CDPR

[prisma minnow]

so, you come to any conclusions?

[hexed urchin]

Had to reinstall my game

I will let you know

[prisma minnow]

I take no responsibility for any of that

[hexed urchin]

Yeah nah it wasn't you

[high swan]

gyatt

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/cyberpun-johnny-silverhand-live-reaction-keanu-reeves-gif-15704640811064903669

[prisma minnow]

Having done some more testing myself: don't do this

GI is effectively disabled in some areas

Just can't fuckin' win without PT

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/greenscreen-room-gif-20485350

I hate how PT looks though

does not look E3

[prisma minnow]

Well no but it works better since it does everything by itself

Just need a 4090

[hexed urchin]

CDPR probably should've just made that the new requirement to play the game after 2.0

Then I could've saved some time

[prisma minnow]

Just buy a 4090

[hexed urchin]

Game is so shitty on CPU that it would probably run no different

Would have to get a new CPU and GPU

Might try one of those path tracing optimization mods

but even then I don't want PT because I don't like how it looks

[prisma minnow]

Eh, those optimization mods make it kind of pointless

[hexed urchin]

Yeah but it'd at least get rid of the triangles

[prisma minnow]

You'll be trading that eyesore for another eyesore

Even then there's artifacts in motion no matter what

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/nick-fuentes-fuentes-nicholas-j-fuentes-finger-gun-gun-to-head-gif-7804642567883191711

UE5 save me

[prisma minnow]

Further development in the AI reconstruction will help, that is happening, but by then I don't think CDPR will be inclined to go back and update the game

Hm, Alan Wake 2 has some of these improvements already, so CDPR can still work on it further before support wraps up. Buuut...

[hexed urchin]

Some people will probably find ways to mod that in

like with DLSS mods

[prisma minnow]

Or we'll get one last big update with the Ultimate Edition

[hexed urchin]

Yeah need another Witcher Next Gen where everything is broken and runs like shit

[prisma minnow]

Nah, still some years down the line, if at all. Ultimate Edition should just be a bundle with PL and (maybe) one last big update, like 2.1.

[hexed urchin]

Game is probably just going to be broken forever

It's okay though because we have E3Orion coming up

Now with 20x the E3

[prisma minnow]

[hexed urchin]

E3 2028

My kids will be making E3 lighting mods for Orion

the cycle continues..

[prisma minnow]

What is E3?

A miserable little pile of lies

Anyway Null, I apologize, I await your next update

Never getting over those lighting "features" however

[hexed urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/bee-dog-dog-bee-dogs-doggy-dance-goobers-gif-23185380

[hexed urchin]

Lighting GI triangles are a feature

Just a glitch with the chip.

[shadow tartan]

lol there are no issues with your pic

looks like super genuine GI

seems to me like this threshold is making it so GI is only applied on areas with lighting values lighter than that threshold

as to preserve more harsh and dynamic shadows ig

it will absolutely have unintended behavior as a result though, evertthing makes sense if you look at it

[hexed urchin]

Sarcasm?

Not versed enough on lighting to tell ngl

[shadow tartan]

my boys that GI looks perfect

you're mixing up shadows and GI

the shadows in the game are not baked

[hexed urchin]

So what you're saying is, I should totally play the game like that and not feel bad?

[shadow tartan]

yeah, i'm sure there are other tweaks to be done to make it better though

messing with the bias'd be a start

also apparently there's distant GI probe values?

gotta try setting those to match the shadows

[hexed urchin]

ty for the info, idk how to change any of that but I'd love to fix that fucking bug

[prisma minnow]

The unintended behavior is some areas just not having GI, easier to see when toggling it on/off

I vaguely recall BabaBooey messing with this a long time ago

[shadow tartan]

If they don't have GI they look dark

if they look unshaded, they don't have shadows

there's a difference there

[prisma minnow]

my brain is smol be patient

[shadow tartan]

negative bias and zero threshold might be our winner

will look over the code to see if bias is additive or multiplicative

it should be multiplicative but uhhh maybe not

[prisma minnow]

yeah that could help

[shadow tartan]

GI looks amazing fym?

bro

[hexed urchin]

Perhaps CDPR should just do that officially

[shadow tartan]

shadows look amazing

AO looks even better

I mean, look at this!

[prisma minnow]

and this is from giweights??

[shadow tartan]

yes

[prisma minnow]

I say damn

[hexed urchin]

We cracked the code

[prisma minnow]

So, is this zero thresold and a negative bias?

[shadow tartan]

nope

just zero threshold :)

[prisma minnow]

What's its purpose then

[shadow tartan]

seems to me like this threshold is making it so GI is only applied on areas with lighting values lighter than that threshold as to preserve more harsh and dynamic shadows ig

[hexed urchin]

Not versed on lighting but that sounds dumb

Also it's obviously extremely broken

[shadow tartan]

no, it does its job

it just doesn't do the right one

[hexed urchin]

Sounds like I was right then

[prisma minnow]

Sorry, I still can't read

How about threshold being above 0 causing bugs? Is it making the problems in the bake visible or is it the problem?

Just curious if CDPR can do anything with this

[shadow tartan]

well it reveals inaccuracies in the bakes by letting the shadows not apply over it

where the bakes overlap, the triangles appear because one bake has a lower value than the other

maybe the threshold is applied across the whole probe and not per-pixel as that would be hella expensive

interiors are a bit fucked though

[hexed urchin]

what the fuck why is this game so broken

[shadow tartan]

and yeah, I get your GI off problems @prisma minnow

there doesn't seem to be an easy solution to this issue

[hexed urchin]

Is it too much to ask for my game to not have broken lines and triangles everywhere? Never seen that shit in any other game.

[shadow tartan]

have you ever played a game with such a dense open world?

[prisma minnow]

RT Psycho GI can kind of fill in, but it's really not meant for it

[shadow tartan]

probably not

[prisma minnow]

Still, spend enough time with the weights and you could find some improvement, maybe

[hexed urchin]

Even if there was one I doubt it'd have these problems.

[shadow tartan]

definitely seems like a GI issue

RT local shadows should get rid of this issue but it doesn't

[prisma minnow]

My problem (or my imagination) is that the bakes seem to have got more unstable over time, I could swear there used to be less of these issues

[hexed urchin]

100%

after 2.0 there is way more of this shit

[shadow tartan]

imo it's placebo lmfao

recency bias

[hexed urchin]

No it's really not

I remember exact locations

[shadow tartan]

ok then, show me objective proof

I think it's probably just recency bias, this problem has been here since release

[hexed urchin]

I'd have to spend an hour or two redownloading the patch 1.6 version of the game

[hexed urchin]

It 100% has but it's gotten worse

[prisma minnow]

It has, but it seems to pop up in more locations

I need to get my hands on 1.03 again

[shadow tartan]

Some areas definitely had rebakes to accomodate differences and additions

They should've rebaked and relit the whole game though

It needs it urgently

[prisma minnow]

And I thought they'd have done that for the next-gen patch

[shadow tartan]

it'd make total sense

[hexed urchin]

These did not used to be in the game

I've replayed that part 20+ times at this point and I would've seen something that obvious

[prisma minnow]

It also doesn't appear to be something entirely consistent across lighting mods, vanilla, CLM, Neon will display this differently

[shadow tartan]

CDPR might've actually determined that implementing PT would be more beneficial overall than relight the game

[hexed urchin]

True although I tested the one inside of the factory with vanilla and 2018 e3 mod and the result was the same

[shadow tartan]

despite the fact that a lot of gamers couldn't run it, they'd get back the spotlight and go down in real time CG history

[hexed urchin]

Probably. Easy bandaid fix. It's why I said earlier they should've just made the minimum requirement a 4090 for the game.

[shadow tartan]

Easy??? Not at all

[prisma minnow]

Technically I suppose they're right, in the next few years any GPU (from Nvidia at least) should run PT in Cyberpunk just fine

[shadow tartan]

implementing that shit must've taken a while and cost them a lot

but it was shorter and cheaper than relighting the game

[hexed urchin]

All of this could've been avoided if lighting stayed internal..

The lighting which many people regard to be better than the final third party product

Probably less expensive too

but idk

[shadow tartan]

Do we even have a source for this third-party lighting rumor?

[hexed urchin]

Bro it was literally done by Treehouse Ninjas

not a rumor

fact

https://www.treehouseninjas.com/project-cyberpunk2077.html

[shadow tartan]

game looks amazing with PT at 7fps

[hexed urchin]

E3 still looked better and I will die on that hill brutally

https://tenor.com/view/bee-dog-dog-bee-dogs-doggy-dance-goobers-gif-23185380

[shadow tartan]

oh makes sense

CDPR hired treehouse ninjas for enviro art and lighting

[hexed urchin]

Their screenshots somehow make it look good

[shadow tartan]

probably using non–real-time in-engine renders

[hexed urchin]

this looks really good but I don't remember actually seeing anything close to this in game with vanilla lighting

[shadow tartan]

ridiculous lightmap and shadowmap res

[hexed urchin]

yeah prob

Either way I think maybe they were in over their heads or just didn't understand the engine or something, I don't hate them for what they did or anything. Ultimately it was CDPR's fault for outsourcing it imo.

[shadow tartan]

They seem to have done dtown themselves though

also seems like they edited the imgs themselves

[hexed urchin]

Probably why dogtown looks better than the base game

to me anyway

Still has the GI issue too but to a much lesser extent

I wonder if anyone has tried making the entire game lit like dogtown

[shadow tartan]

we really don't have these tools

we'd need REDkit

[hexed urchin]

ah ok

[shadow tartan]

I just can't run PT lol

Maybe next year when I get a new PC

[hexed urchin]

Me neither, which is why it's upsetting that without it the game is busted

Like I said in the past though, I kinda prefer non PT anyway when I use lighting mods

[shadow tartan]

I'll make the threshold 0.1 to prevent weird issues like the ones above\

and still keep the great lighting benefits from zero-threshold (at least most of them lol)

maybe this wouldn't be that big of an issue if lightmaps had alterable resolution

[hexed urchin]

Oh so you can just do that? Nice. I'll do the same

I'd say most shit is better than those triangles

[shadow tartan]

oh you'll probably still get those triangles

imo, unshaded areas are worse than triangles

[hexed urchin]

Perhaps

It's a compromise

[prisma minnow]

anything above 0 will show triangles

[hexed urchin]

[hallow vector]

Hello, can I use some LUTS with this mod?

[prisma minnow]

You could, but it'd defeat the purpose of the mod, wouldn't look as it's supposed to

[hallow vector]

what if I'll use realcolorr above this?

[prisma minnow]

I'd wait until Null updates that

[shadow tartan]

@prisma minnow not true

this is zero-threshold, there are still triangle seams

[hallow vector]

is it possible to restore this weather to main game?

[shadow tartan]

when and where is this?????

[hallow vector]

Phantom Liberty mission

I think weather scripted

but, maybe we can use it some-how

looks great

[umbral pollen]

Oh, that's during the MaxTac ambush with Reed, right?

[hallow vector]

Yep

weather is transition ( clouds with sparkles ) to rain

[shadow tartan]

since I'm taking a small break from NEON GENESIS, i'll show off some pics of my CLM + NEON GENESIS mashup soon

call it CyberLighting Genesis ig

y'know what no

taking a quick peek at clm

i can't even fathom how the fuck essenthy has been mentally handling working withi t

i just can't do it with messy projects; ik everyone does it but I like to keep my shit clean

I can commend essenthy's undertaking; but I feel like I'll have to wait and see what Lexar has going on

Never really tried clm before but it feels... uncanny

So close yet so far

[prisma minnow]

Well, it's kind of impossible, ain't it?

Since GI is prebaked you'll never quite get there

[shadow tartan]

well, we got pretty fucking close with R18, didn't we? at least closer in terms of sun pos

he seems to have changed something in his 2.0 update because I can't get the sun to align the same way; illuminating that one street

I like neon genesis more now anyways

[prisma minnow]

Changing the sun position is technically inaccurate to the lighting bake though, yeah?

[shadow tartan]

maybe??? I don't really know

envprobes look more like unshaded baked low-res maps of areas that a shader can calculate faster than 3D tracing

so the lighting dir doesn't really matter

the environmental design aspect really does when you fuck with shit like that though

[prisma minnow]

PT ought to remedy that, if only everyone could run it

[shadow tartan]

It can't remedy going against art direction

and that's the main issue

Dogtown looks very, very, very out of place with CLM

it's designed for the more moody, and admittedly, accurate lighting of later versions

(made even better by NEON GENESIS)

[prisma minnow]

Yeah, making it mesh with the E3 style will be difficult, if not impossible

Just too different

[shadow tartan]

honestly I feel like my own take on 2019-style lighting again wouldn't be that bad of an idea

it's been a while since I've touched that concept, too

and it's still more niche

[prisma minnow]

You had something with R19, a fresh take with what you know now and your own style could be the GOAT

[shadow tartan]

Oh, I did have something with R19

I still think it was some of the most visually interesting content I've ever made

second only to neon genesis

luum, unfortunately, was kind of purposefully uninteresting

the most realistic lighting mod for cyberpunk; but very boring for that same reason

[prisma minnow]

I liked luum

Can only really work with PT tho imo

[shadow tartan]

oh I liked luum too

It's just, you gotta admit, the thing wasn't really interesting as far as style

that E3 2019 dusk is still unbeatable in terms of raw beauty

[prisma minnow]

Old screenshots are still there

[shadow tartan]

just imagine that shot but with the better neon genesis clouds

better neon genesis bloom

and flare

plus that grain

[prisma minnow]

get to work modder

What about that R19 LUT you mentioned, still doing that? Or is it better to just remake R19 now?

[shadow tartan]

oh both can be done

that realcolorr 2019 LMT can be done

in fact, improved

i'd just need a bit more time with davinci and make my own dctl

[prisma minnow]

I look forward to it, not forgetting about Neon Genesis though

Whatever you do is good

[shadow tartan]

thanks

it's hard to keep motivated. taking a light break like I am now is pretty important to the balance i need to do good work

[high swan]

hannukkah approaches....

[high swan]

agree

[high swan]

agree

[shadow tartan]

7 dec. is pretty far away

[hallow vector]

Does any one know what setting in env file accord to light shafts?

[shadow tartan]

vol fog stuff

is that NEON GENESIS? doesn’t look like it to me

[high swan]

https://www.nexusmods.com/cyberpunk2077/mods/10642?tab=posts

@shadow tartan what u think

some pretty amazing clouds here imo

[shadow tartan]

So true

I’ve been talking to sosuine for quite a bit now, think I could collab for NEON GENESIS 2.0

[high swan]

he really did an amazing job

no idea what he did but one of the best ive seen yet

that + l.xs + enhanced weather =

vanilla clouds vs his mod

vanilla vs mod

[zinc abyss]

It's a promo shot from before the game released

[shadow tartan]

thought so

[high swan]

@waxen pike bruh i have to ask are there any issues with your combo x alternative weather visuals so far

bc this shit right here

next level

[waxen pike]

Working on V5 right now. That will support alternative weather fully

I'm working with sosuine on this

[high swan]

https://tenor.com/view/pog-gif-19806504

list of people insanely hype about this:

• me

[shadow tartan]

I might rebase NEON GENESIS soon

just start from the ground-up

got a weekend so 🤷‍♂️

[shadow tartan]

sosuine let me use his alt visuals as a base

changed some things

rebased neon genesis

holy fuck it looks good

[high swan]

IDK what that guy did but I know it's amazing

[shadow tartan]

alright, I can do a bit of testing with PT now

terra cognita in dt isn't that bad :)

[umbral pollen]

Neon Genesis is based??

[shadow tartan]

you know you're doing something right when the light glows like it should

alright

2019 orange for dusk or classic neon genesis blue?

[high swan]

2019 orange

[shadow tartan]

Aight

I have an idea of how to get it done

it's gonna be more of a mix I think actually

[high swan]

Why blue

[shadow tartan]

can't tell me this doesn't look good

[high swan]

Too blue

😂

I have pictures from around the same time I could send

[high swan]

It's a bit blue but not that blue imo

[shadow tartan]

tbh? i don't really care

it's stylization that I really like

in the end, I like neon genesis the most out of a lot of projects because it just lets me go off with as much creativity as I like

[prisma minnow]

noooo you can't do that

[high swan]

oh well im happy for u then

its quasi realistic but then u also just have fun making it look how u want it look in a stylized way

so thats good!!

not for me but still cool

🤝

[prisma minnow]

It needs to be... brown

[shadow tartan]

I love my mod

[umbral pollen]

What've you been tweaking on it lately?

[high swan]

https://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/76286?tab=description

add to cyberpunk imo

[shadow tartan]

fog

@high swan don't you feel silly now?

[high swan]

Is this in the game or in your mod

[shadow tartan]

in the game by-default lmfao

[high swan]

Well make it better then

[prisma minnow]

How's the update going Null

https://tenor.com/2hA8.gif

[shadow tartan]

been taking a small break

crunched some formulas to figure out the correct bloom size though

2x(x)=1 is the general formula I came up with for radius-preserving anamorphic blur

and it preserves the vanilla radius, I mean

bloom looks amazing to me

[high swan]

those lights are way too bright its still daytime out

ig they maybe wouldnt even be on that time of day but still

if its fluorescent tubes u should be able to make them out more than that

[waxen pike]

@shadow tartan Hi! Sorry for the long wait I worked on Version 5.0 and some things. Is your mod on Nexus?

Would love to get a compatible version with your mod out 🙂

[shadow tartan]

No thanks. Twice the work, half the flexibility. I’d love to, but I’d rather keep the astounding flexibility I have with NEON GENESIS

[high swan]

it's a masterpiece

(the new update x awv)

[prisma minnow]

I know this is probably in-engine stuff, but bloom/lights seem different here, yeah?

damn, can look pretty different

[shadow tartan]

working on a NEON GENESIS spinoff, VPV or Vanilla Plus Visuals

very, very light mod focusing on integrating just a few of the neon genesis improvements

while being even more inkeeping with the vanilla visual style

[shadow tartan]

aaand it's done

this is honestly just gonna be a DP farm

it's so subtle yet there that it's very, very hard to capture screenshots

[shadow tartan]

materials were simply different and RT light tech was better

we both know both of these things significantly degraded with time

[shadow tartan]

coming whenever it's ready and its screenshots too (ETA thanksgiving or sumn)

[prisma minnow]

Man, we have to go back, those shots look so much better than what we can get ingame

As for VPVI I will endorse

[high swan]

Enhanced Weather and Alternative Weather Visuals compatibility or riot

[shadow tartan]

No

[high swan]

Why not

[shadow tartan]

discuss more on #null-morb-land

this thread is gonna be deprecated

[prisma minnow]

Ay, got your own channel?

[shadow tartan]

NEON GENESIS | talk on #nulls-morb-land