competitive_discussion

[molten oasis]

im frustrated at the inability to fight any incineroar

with ANY THING I PLAY

which is a skill issue, but its still irritating

[mighty stump]

So what r u gonna do?

[molten oasis]

https://pokepast.es/51cc59885b5dc047 cool team

op, 1 sec

https://pokepast.es/316840e92e2bc31a there we go

chemistry? who cares? if i beat incin i'll be happy

i need to figure out something to remove incin or find smth thats consistent at beating it

[craggy dagger]

stellar zacian hm

[molten oasis]

which atm ive found basically nothing

[molten oasis]

im set on the stellar zac rn

[cyan smelt]

what about ghost tera on urshifu-w

[molten oasis]

it doesnt help

[craggy dagger]

i can try to come up with something though idk if you’ll like it

[molten oasis]

liek sure i dodge fo but incin is likely just going to tera or amoonguss will be on the field to prevent me from doing anything

then i die to knock off

[mighty stump]

You dont die to Knock Off lol

[craggy dagger]

you shouldn’t die to a SE knock off-

[mighty stump]

Then just go Darkshifu

[molten oasis]

my shifu is typically chipped from something or rocky helm

[mighty stump]

you pressure CC/WB

[craggy dagger]

kay then maybe-

[molten oasis]

i need to play better, but any team with incin just constantly immediately has an advantage

[mighty stump]

Tera Ghost Regidrago lol

w Specs

There

Pelipper would fix Incin MUs

[molten oasis]

keeping peli on the field is tricky

[mighty stump]

Incin isn’t some unbearable wall

It has to switch in

[molten oasis]

for me, for whatever reason

[mighty stump]

50% of Incin if not more is pivot/switch based

Knock Off/Taunt Incins basically do nothing to Zacian

Othee than switcch again

[molten oasis]

i feel thats the issue

[mighty stump]

Every switch is a momentum loss

You’re missing that point

Every switch is a play you get to chip with

[craggy dagger]

zacian crowned just struggles a lot with intim imo-

[mighty stump]

Im pretty sure I sent many games

[craggy dagger]

especially since ability nerf

[mighty stump]

Where I dealt with Incin just by clicking buttons into their slots

[molten oasis]

anything that cant have clear amu just struggles

yea, ig

[mighty stump]

So like

If you can’t capitalise on that

Then you’ll never beat Incin

Damage is damage

[molten oasis]

...ig

[mighty stump]

252 Atk Zacian-Crowned Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Incineroar: 93-111 (46 - 54.9%) -- 61.3% chance to 2HKO

Look how much PR still does

[craggy dagger]

oh my-

[molten oasis]

i think honestly might go pao route

pao helps zac a lot with damage

[mighty stump]

252 Atk Sword of Ruin Tera-Stellar Zacian-Crowned Play Rough (1st Use) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Incineroar: 166-196 (82.1 - 97%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Incin unbeatable where

They get one switch in

[molten oasis]

not that i want to go HO route but ik pao can run in balance arcehtypes

[mighty stump]

Taunt can also stop pivots from Incins

[molten oasis]

zac pao amoonguss probably

or wellspring

or both

[mighty stump]

Teal Mask Ogerpon also good

[molten oasis]

oh, amoonguss pao zac is already 3 fire weaknesses

mm

[molten oasis]

yea, superpower hurts incin

and defiant

+1 252 Atk Ogerpon Superpower vs. 236 HP / 20 Def Incineroar: 206-244 (103 - 122%) -- guaranteed OHKO

i'll consider it, i want my grass guy to probably be amoonguss for the ice rider mu

sorry i get, upset, a lot, incin pisses me off rn and i just dont understand how to deal with it but that should help

[mighty stump]

Its cause you’re seeing “Incin screws me” and not the other relevant bits of info

You get to play the game as well

[molten oasis]

yea, fair

[craggy dagger]

oh yeah where did waterpon usage go?

[molten oasis]

amoonguss is kinda just better rn and wellspring kinda explodes a lot

[autumn vault]

And Rillaboom is in a very good spot rn

Being one of the 2 things that can remove electric terrain is very good for it

[molten oasis]

rilla good yea

[craggy dagger]

rilla doesn’t get follow me
but i see your point

[autumn vault]

And Grassy Terrain is in general very useful

[molten oasis]

btw uh, going to pivot to pao zac route

[craggy dagger]

ooo gl gl

i know how to spell…

[molten oasis]

does a lot more damage

and covers for ground types pretty well

[dapper crag]

Pokémon No. 888: Zacian-Crowned

Types

Fairy/Steel

Abilities

Intrepid Sword

HP/Atk/Def/SpA/SpD/Spe

92/150/115/80/115/148

Total

700

Base Species

Zacian

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[autumn vault]

https://pokepast.es/ed8c25511b4a90f8 How is this Koraidon team?

[molten oasis]

what is garg doing there

[craggy dagger]

150 atk paired with pao is cool-
should go through most things

wide guard resists csr

[autumn vault]

Doing Wide Guard shenanigans, i was a bit worried about the MU with multi hit moves

[molten oasis]

ig thats fair

[autumn vault]

And not many looked good on the team

[dapper crag]

Ability: Purifying Salt

This Pokemon cannot become affected by a non-volatile status condition or Yawn. If a Pokemon uses a Ghost-type attack against this Pokemon, that Pokemon's offensive stat is halved when calculating the damage to this Pokemon.

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[molten oasis]

i meaan

[autumn vault]

Garg was like the only good one that has synergy with sun

[molten oasis]

garg isnt exactly great on sun but ok

[autumn vault]

Atleast it removes the water weakness

[molten oasis]

well garg aint great, in general

[craggy dagger]

mienshao tho-
oh nvm 4 fairy weaknesses then

[molten oasis]

ig its fiiine

[autumn vault]

I just don't want to repeat weaknesses too much

[molten oasis]

i feel like sun teams just have to deal with it tho tbh

[autumn vault]

If i went Mienshao, then i would have a 3x fairy weakness to flutter

[molten oasis]

run resists for stuff ig

k well, im gonna continue cooking

to the best of my ability

im just slapping shit on i have to think about members more

[mighty stump]

Clear Body Garganacl when

[molten oasis]

does it get that?

[dapper crag]

Pokémon No. 934: Garganacl

Type

Rock

Abilities

Purifying Salt, Sturdy, Clear Body (Hidden)

HP/Atk/Def/SpA/SpD/Spe

100/100/130/45/90/35

Total

500

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[molten oasis]

oh, interesting

raging bolt gets taunt lol

im kinda considering sludge bomb

on amoonguss

[cyan smelt]

to deal with what?

[molten oasis]

idk, whims and chipping grass kyogre

[cyan smelt]

fair

[autumn vault]

Funniest ally switch ever

Woof is zama

[cyan smelt]

rekt

[autumn vault]

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9vgc2024regg-2125361844 The replay btw, i did another ally switch predict and i won it, i quite needed the edge and you will see why

[molten oasis]

i'll look in just a minute, im scrolling the builder rn lol

[cyan smelt]

is groudon washed? i barely see it

[molten oasis]

its a fraud

precimiss blades, and koraidon is better rn

[cyan smelt]

flame charge is pretty op

[autumn vault]

If only Precipice was 120 BP and 100% accurate and then they both would be on par with each other

Before anyone asks no Kyogre does not need a buff to origin pulse, spout exists

[molten oasis]

kinda meming with this one ngl but

https://pokepast.es/01f3dbb454f651b2

[autumn vault]

Only Dragapult is the meme here

[molten oasis]

yea, thats why i said that

[autumn vault]

The team's name is "Dragapult?" so you are right

[molten oasis]

indeed

[autumn vault]

I will be honest here, you might need a way to buff attack and need a way to consistently counter incineroar

[molten oasis]

no i need to focus down incin

[autumn vault]

And then i can see the big numbers that dragapult might get

[molten oasis]

dragapult was a semi joke

i talked with someone briefly about it saying it could be alright

[autumn vault]

Let me guess, it was someone from the showdown chat room?

[molten oasis]

nope

another sever im in

[autumn vault]

I don't need to know the context, trust me i don't

Just wanted to guess showdown

?, Groudon is worse than Koraidon, no doubt

[molten oasis]

meh

id look at that for like, moves and items

not really the actual usage rates

[autumn vault]

Still though i was surprised at seeing that

And in the tournaments Koraidon sees more usage then Groudon

[mighty stump]

Probably cause the Ground coverage is more significant

not getting nuked electro drift/deny vswitch is nice

Groudon does drop to Draco though

252 SpA Choice Specs Hadron Engine Miraidon Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Groudon: 246-291 (118.8 - 140.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

[molten oasis]

my box is, interesting rn

pults a semi joke, everything else is under genuine consideration

[autumn vault]

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9vgc2024regg-2125371776-xfxfguhuuun550a5gefxd6kz05umtpfpw What kind of CTS Shit is this?

[molten oasis]

im beating people with the dragapult

[autumn vault]

Good for you, i am getting clapped by Tailroom Reshiram with Sableye in the 1300s

[molten oasis]

oof

cts is smth else

so,i hit 1600's with a dragapult

[graceful flare]

Just remember miraidon gets dazlin gleam

[autumn vault]

We all remembered for a long time ago

That's a very good reason why it runs tera fairy

[cyan smelt]

I thought it ran tera electric

[autumn vault]

It runs both

[molten oasis]

so

[cyan smelt]

I always see tera electric

[cyan smelt]

Based

[molten oasis]

with a DRAGAPULT

[autumn vault]

Very nice

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9vgc2024regg-2125379402 So i toasted another Zacian

[molten oasis]

ig pult is uh, not a joke

cuz that should not have worked

[autumn vault]

Definetely not bad

Maybe you discovered some secret Zacian tech

[molten oasis]

maybe

[autumn vault]

like how people discovered that Tailroom fits miraidon best

[molten oasis]

tbf that was bo1

but it was also against real teams

[autumn vault]

true

[molten oasis]

we'll see

[autumn vault]

Ok

[molten oasis]

i think i can put pult under consideration tho

[autumn vault]

I can't see the PC screen that easily because the 10 AM sun is hitting my eyes

[molten oasis]

lol

i mean, pult isnt too bad into incin

[autumn vault]

True

[molten oasis]

clear body, does decent damage into it

worried about knock off but thats really it

[autumn vault]

Atleast Pult can do some good damage into it

[molten oasis]

understandably 44 Atk Incineroar Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Dragapult: 164-194 (100 - 118.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

[autumn vault]

Oh darn, the server is shutting down soon

[molten oasis]

so incin can just remove it

[autumn vault]

The Showdown server

[molten oasis]

what great timing to stop lmfao

[autumn vault]

I am still battling someone rn

[molten oasis]

oh oof, hopefully you can get through it

[autumn vault]

Thanks

i basically won the match but my opponent is stalling

Nvm

[molten oasis]

it happens lol

[autumn vault]

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9vgc2024regg-2125381212 That was close

[molten oasis]

some people do that in bo3 to think

[autumn vault]

They stalled for like 20 seconds

Btw here is the warning

[molten oasis]

that horn leech was huge

for them

[autumn vault]

That predict was so good for them

It sounded smart, until they horn leech'd Kyogre

I depended too much on that sandsear storm

If it missed Terapagos then i would have lost that no doubt

[molten oasis]

the play was fine

[autumn vault]

The electro shot was also a bit greedy

[molten oasis]

that was ballsy infront of a terapagos

[autumn vault]

True

If i clicked B-Press or literally anything but shot then that would have been an easier win

[molten oasis]

mhmm

[autumn vault]

I went for sandsear storm on turn 4 because i wanted to kill both incineroar and Terapagos in one click of a button

Or 2 if it's terapagos

[molten oasis]

idt sandsear kills an incin

ok they have to be bulky

[autumn vault]

252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Sandsear Storm vs. 236 HP / 124+ SpD Incineroar: 174-205 (87 - 102.5%) -- 12.5% chance to OHKO

[molten oasis]

yea so the jolly incins will die

[autumn vault]

That incineroar had pathetic physical bulk

Usually Incineorar suvive surging strikes with no boosts

But that one didn't survive it

[molten oasis]

so

incins are running max speed jolly here and there and are also going more specially bulky

[cyan smelt]

I love when they knock off choice scarf urshifu lol

[molten oasis]

the physical incins arent as common

[autumn vault]

It wouldn't have mattered

[autumn vault]

Isn't that Overkill? Like good for them if they succeed so much but you need to calc to survive atleast some physical hits (that are affected by intimidate)

[molten oasis]

tell that to the pros

thats legit just whats being run rn

tofu suggested it to me and winning the fo wars is honestly super nice

252 Atk Choice Band Sword of Ruin Dragapult Dragon Darts (2 hits) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Kyogre: 176-210 (100.5 - 120%) -- guaranteed OHKO damn

[autumn vault]

And now the servers went offline, again for the 3rd time

[molten oasis]

and then it eats a spout from mystic water for some reason

252+ SpA Mystic Water Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Dragapult in Rain: 133-157 (81 - 95.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

[autumn vault]

Do you think a jolly max speed incineroar in sun is really good?

[molten oasis]

its just good

[autumn vault]

I think so

[molten oasis]

252 Atk Choice Band Dragapult Dragon Darts (2 hits) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Tera-Electric Miraidon: 122-146 (69.3 - 82.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO damn

[autumn vault]

Surviving Surging Strikes is really nice

Without too much investment

[autumn vault]

Now try with SoR

[cyan smelt]

Drago have you faced gloom guy yet, he's around your ranking

[molten oasis]

SOR WASNT ON?

[autumn vault]

What's the best max speed incineroar set? I would like to have one

[autumn vault]

Nope, thats very good damage

[molten oasis]

jesus

[autumn vault]

I faced a gloom + dewgong team a week ago, got spanked

[molten oasis]

252 Atk Choice Band Sword of Ruin Dragapult Dragon Darts (2 hits) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Tera-Electric Miraidon: 164-194 (93.1 - 110.2%) -- approx. 68.8% chance to OHKO why does that do so much

[dapper crag]

Pokémon No. 887: Dragapult

Types

Dragon/Ghost

Abilities

Clear Body, Infiltrator, Cursed Body (Hidden)

HP/Atk/Def/SpA/SpD/Spe

88/120/75/100/75/142

Total

600

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[autumn vault]

·

[cyan smelt]

Secret dragapult tech lol

[molten oasis]

252 Atk Choice Band Sword of Ruin Dragapult Phantom Force vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tera-Fairy Calyrex-Shadow Rider: 172-204 (98.2 - 116.5%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO cough what

[timber falcon]

anyone know which megas are good or not?

[cyan smelt]

Mray, mega gengar and mega kang

[autumn vault]

One follow me away from being redirected

[timber falcon]

ok ty

[gentle crag]

otot8953 has given 1 Gen Rep to kal0sunleashed

[autumn vault]

Mega ray, mega gengar, mega khangaskan, mega scizor, etc.

[molten oasis]

groudon kyogre ray khangaskan mawile salamence and gengar are the ones i know about

[autumn vault]

iirc groudon and kyogre have primals, not megas

[molten oasis]

ok

[autumn vault]

you can have 2 primals and 1 mega in the same match

[molten oasis]

252 Atk Choice Band Sword of Ruin Dragapult Phantom Force vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Clefairy: 106-126 (59.8 - 71.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO still doesn't want to eat that

[cyan smelt]

You could have kyogre and xerneas on the same team lol

[molten oasis]

https://tenor.com/view/namufilms-patrick-star-rifle-gun-gif-25182238

we do not speak of xerneas

xerneas is stupid

(i have never fought xerneas lol)

[cyan smelt]

Xerneas wasn't a thing in swsh because of zacian

[molten oasis]

probably would still hate seeing zacian tbf

[cyan smelt]

Cybertron might have used it

[dapper crag]

Xerneas's moveset:

Physical Moves

Body Slam, Close Combat, Cut, Endeavor, Facade, Frustration, Giga Impact, Horn Leech, Megahorn, Night Slash, Outrage, Play Rough, Return, Rock Slide, Secret Power, Smart Strike, Tackle, Take Down, Zen Headbutt

Special Moves

Aurora Beam, Dazzling Gleam, Draining Kiss, Echoed Voice, Flash Cannon, Focus Blast, Grass Knot, Hidden Power, Hyper Beam, Hyper Voice, Misty Explosion, Moonblast, Psychic, Psyshock, Round, Snore, Swift, Terrain Pulse, Thunder, Thunderbolt

Status Moves

Aromatherapy, Block, Calm Mind, Confide, Defog, Double Team, Endure, Flash, Geomancy, Gravity, Hail, Heal Pulse, Ingrain, Laser Focus, Light Screen, Misty Terrain, Nature Power, Protect, Psych Up, Rain Dance, Reflect, Rest, Roar, Sleep Talk, Substitute, Sunny Day, Swagger, Thunder Wave, Toxic, Wonder Room

Notes

A move displayed with Bold text benefits from Same-Type Attack Bonus when used by Xerneas.

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[autumn vault]

LMAO

[molten oasis]

doesnt get earthpower

[timber falcon]

what-

[molten oasis]

lol

[autumn vault]

No cap

Have you watched 2016/2019?

[cyan smelt]

I think the reason they didn't include xerneas was because of tera fairy geomancy misty explosion next to galarian weezing

[molten oasis]

wolfe had a mega gengar mega ray and primal kyogre

[autumn vault]

Or flutter mane

[molten oasis]

his opponent had both primals and i believe he had mega manetric

oh, common misconception with misty terrain

it doesn't boost fairy moves

i thought i did

[autumn vault]

?

[molten oasis]

then i learned it just hurts dragons more

[dapper crag]

Move: Misty Terrain

For 5 turns, the terrain becomes Misty Terrain. During the effect, the power of Dragon-type attacks used against grounded Pokemon is multiplied by 0.5 and grounded Pokemon cannot be inflicted with a non-volatile status condition nor confusion. Grounded Pokemon can become affected by Yawn but cannot fall asleep from its effect. Camouflage transforms the user into a Fairy type, Nature Power becomes Moonblast, and Secret Power has a 30% chance to lower Special Attack by 1 stage. Fails if the current terrain is Misty Terrain.

Type

Fairy

Category

Status

Power

0

Accuracy

—

PP (max)

10 (16)

Move Flags

​

Protect

Bypasses Protect-like moves.

Contact

Does not make contact.

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[cyan smelt]

No but misty explosion doubles in power in misty terrain

[molten oasis]

ok but who's using that

[cyan smelt]

Idk

[autumn vault]

Also does anyone have a fast incineroar spread?

[molten oasis]

i love going 3-4 first turn because someone double protected

[molten oasis]

252 hp 252 spe 4 att jolly

[autumn vault]

ok, thanks

[gentle crag]

lycopoky has given 1 Gen Rep to drayagedrago

[cyan smelt]

I managed to stall out the last two turns of tr thanks to double protect

[molten oasis]

pog

[timber falcon]

why fast incineroar

[molten oasis]

win fo wars

outspeeding rilla is kinda funny

i think i might make the pult team a rental as its honestly more of a "this is fun team" than anything

[mighty stump]

Taunt Incin on Turbo Incins can deny PS and Wisps

[molten oasis]

fast wisp can also be nice in some situations

[true niche]

got the best mon

[dapper crag]

https://play.pokemonshowdown.com/sprites/afd/incineroar.png

[autumn vault]

This is the best pokemon

[autumn vault]

Also i can tell thats Pokerogue

[true niche]

im sure most people could tell

[mighty stump]

rip PokeRogue it will b missed

[autumn vault]

The server is in a really bad state rn

Because of one idiot

[mighty stump]

multiple idiots

Lol

[timber falcon]

what is pokerogue

[autumn vault]

rogue-like pokemon fan game

[timber falcon]

with a server?

[autumn vault]

Its a fangame

That has a server

[mighty stump]

I don’t even think you can call homophobia/transphobia/zionism stupid because its an active choice

I can call stupidity forgivable since its involuntary most of the time

[autumn vault]

True

But i still call all of the above except stupidity forgivable

[mighty stump]

Sure, but when people want to be actively wrong that just either means they never went searching for more questions/answers or they don’t want to listen to answers/facts

[autumn vault]

But i can see why you believe that

[timber falcon]

anddd pokemon showdown servers down?

[mighty stump]

Case in point on a much smaller, less important scale: this channel

[sharp cobalt]

[timber falcon]

or is it just me

[mighty stump]

If people don’t get the answers they want they just don’t listen

[autumn vault]

Yes

[sharp cobalt]

Understandable tbh

[timber falcon]

has this been happening frequently? i havent played that much since it closed for like a few hours

[autumn vault]

The servers shut down like 3 times already

[timber falcon]

ok

[cyan smelt]

They're restarting the server it's not a provider issue this time

[sharp cobalt]

Huh, the side server I frequent won't let me log in

Oh, nvm, it works now

[autumn vault]

[gentle crag]

lycopoky has given 1 Gen Rep to pocketpoof

[autumn vault]

Wha-

[sharp cobalt]

Thanks

[timber falcon]

whats a gen rep lol

[sharp cobalt]

To this day, I still dont know

[molten oasis]

Guys were free from showdown

For now, be happy

[autumn vault]

[timber falcon]

its back

[molten oasis]

FUCK

Back to hell

[timber falcon]

im just tryna see what natdex is all about

[sharp cobalt]

Bold of you to assume I ever left

[sharp cobalt]

E v e r y t h i n g, all at once

[mighty stump]

General rep is just that lol

A general thanks

[craggy dagger]

there is a rep leaderboard iirc-

[molten oasis]

i wanna see the rep leaderboard

[mighty stump]

-rep

[gentle crag]

**woodtofu's Server Reputation**

Raid Rep: 3
Trade Rep: 6
Giveaway Rep: 5
Breeding Rep: 9
General Rep: 659

[mighty stump]

LOL

[craggy dagger]

damn

-rep

[gentle crag]

**stella_novie's Server Reputation**

Raid Rep: 376
Trade Rep: 15
Giveaway Rep: 19
Breeding Rep: 0
General Rep: 129

[mighty stump]

!rank

[mighty stump]

kek

[craggy dagger]

90 damn

[autumn vault]

-rep

[gentle crag]

**lycopoky's Server Reputation**

Raid Rep: 5
Trade Rep: 20
Giveaway Rep: 0
Breeding Rep: 0
General Rep: 57

[timber falcon]

-rep

[gentle crag]

**otot8953's Server Reputation**

Raid Rep: 0
Trade Rep: 10
Giveaway Rep: 0
Breeding Rep: 0
General Rep: 23

[autumn vault]

!rank

[mighty stump]

Lol

[timber falcon]

!rank

[molten oasis]

-rep

[gentle crag]

**drayagedrago's Server Reputation**

Raid Rep: 1
Trade Rep: 5
Giveaway Rep: 0
Breeding Rep: 0
General Rep: 110

[mighty stump]

I do a lot ig

[autumn vault]

You sure this is OK? because i don't want to break any rules

[molten oasis]

not bad

[autumn vault]

Because if i do, well i don't want to say it

[molten oasis]

!rank

[mighty stump]

I mean the channel isn’t active

[timber falcon]

tch 5 levels lower

[autumn vault]

: )

[mighty stump]

Usually you go to #bot_commands

[molten oasis]

my backround is the dogs too pog

[autumn vault]

I know, which is why i asked

[mighty stump]

Its only a problem if you do it while other discussions are going on

[autumn vault]

Ah ok

[molten oasis]

makes sense

[mighty stump]

its why i dont want people shitposting during questions/advice

same concept

but if nothing else is going on its just chill

[craggy dagger]

:0

[autumn vault]

OK, so Specs Urshifu is goo-

I don't see advice being given out

[molten oasis]

banded fluttermane is po-

[autumn vault]

Scarf Torkoal is ama-

[craggy dagger]

oh btw-
kinda struggling on…
what to add for 6th-
let alone should rework this team?

https://pokepast.es/ab63cbfefba9a3d0

[autumn vault]

Specs Landorus is very ni-

[molten oasis]

ill look in a sec

[autumn vault]

Incineroar imo is too slow

[molten oasis]

turbo incin is where its at

not enough urshifu

[craggy dagger]

mm-
i see-
just using a spread from last reg cause no clue how to play it xD

[molten oasis]

oh sorry, i meant not enough flutter

[mighty stump]

You don’t have to play Turbo Incin all the time

Just as an fyi lol

Its still contextual

[molten oasis]

could go cloak whims and then sash the pao but thats fine

you also need protect on koraidon, prob over swords dance

or flame charge

i also think you jsut go tbolt on bolt, i like the idea cuz of mirai but like

tbolt still does really good damage

[dapper crag]

Move: Rising Voltage

If the current terrain is Electric Terrain and the target is grounded, this move's power is doubled.

Type

Electric

Category

Special

Power

70

Accuracy

100

PP (max)

20 (32)

Move Flags

​

Mirror

Copied by Mirror Move.

Contact

Does not make contact.

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[molten oasis]

IT DOUBLES???

i did not know that i thought it was 1.5x boost

[autumn vault]

I would replace Swords Dance for protect

https://tenor.com/view/cloudy-with-a-chance-of-meatballs-offercial-earl-gif-25906274

Turbo incineroar when they see a set up pokemon/another Fake out user and turbo incineroar can use Fake Out:^

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9vgc2024regg-2125401351 Man that was a bit close

[molten oasis]

FLINT LOCKWOOD

[autumn vault]

252 Atk Orichalcum Pulse Tera-Fire Koraidon Flare Blitz vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Chi-Yu in Sun: 126-149 (96.9 - 114.6%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

252 Atk Orichalcum Pulse Tera-Fire Koraidon Flare Blitz vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Chi-Yu in Sun: 126-148 (96.9 - 113.8%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

Just checking calcs, got eliminated in the third round in a showdown chatroom (the semi finals) and checking if Koraidon Flare Blitz tera fire sun OHKO'd specs chi-yu

Turns out, it does

I lost because i didn't predict tera

The tera was ghost

Performance btw

[timber falcon]

very nice

anyone here played nat dex b4?

[craggy dagger]

yes

it’s horrible-

[molten oasis]

Why would you not play vgc smh

[dapper crag]

Move: Hurricane

Has a 30% chance to confuse the target. This move can hit a target using Bounce, Fly, or Sky Drop, or is under the effect of Sky Drop. If the weather is Primordial Sea or Rain Dance, this move does not check accuracy. If the weather is Desolate Land or Sunny Day, this move's accuracy is 50%. If this move is used against a Pokemon holding Utility Umbrella, this move's accuracy remains at 70%.

Type

Flying

Category

Special

Power

110

Accuracy

70

PP (max)

10 (16)

Move Flags

​

Mirror

Copied by Mirror Move.

Contact

Does not make contact.

Wind

Triggers Wind Power and Wind Rider.

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[timber falcon]

so i can have more of a clue of what singles is like

[willow vault]

A lot of switching, knock off is crazy good, stealth rocks are great, u-turn to switch while getting damage and dependent on the tier a grounded poison mon to eat up t-spikes

[timber falcon]

Also stall is easier to beat that i thought, kill one important mon and they forfeit

[willow vault]

Also regenerator is incredibly good

[timber falcon]

I should try smth like that

Which regenerator mons would u say are worth using?

[pearl wind]

for sure g-slowking

and Boots/AV torn is also really nice

[timber falcon]

Oh tornadus in singles?

[dapper crag]

https://play.pokemonshowdown.com/sprites/ani/tornadus-therian.gif

[pearl wind]

this one

[molten oasis]

but vgc is the only addi- i mean format you need

[pearl wind]

but remember that natdex has mega evolution, z moves and tera so its a lot of stuff

[timber falcon]

I painfully know that

[pearl wind]

[timber falcon]

Lost a game 4 mons up to zmove raging bolt

Rn I’m getting stalled by mega Venasaur

Yeah my team has 0 synergy

Best bet ima spam regenerator team lol

[pearl wind]

kyurem looks super fun in natdex from what ive seen

[timber falcon]

What it do

[pearl wind]

do a fuckton of damage

[timber falcon]

Specs?

[pearl wind]

is super nice into the typical gliscor dozo blissey clod + whatever stall core

[pearl wind]

you can do specs, dd, loaded dice, never melt ice, lots of cool sets

[timber falcon]

Ooo I see

[pearl wind]

also has great synergy with g-slowking

type combo + chilly reception is super nice, can also future sight + chilly into kyurem and stuff

[timber falcon]

Nice to know, I think I’ll start my team with those 2

For the 3rd member I do have my eyes on jirachi

Purely cause of haydunns really fun set

[autumn vault]

For UU? yes

[timber falcon]

garchomp having no dragon dance is criminal

[pearl wind]

eh i not sure about rachi

you can also look at natdex sample teams if you want, its some good stuff (especially the team explanations)

like here https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/national-dex-sample-teams.3714863/ (not the newest teams but still interesting) and especially this https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/national-dex-bazaar.3710928/

[timber falcon]

scarf jirachi goes crazy from what ive used it for so far

60% iron head flinch lol

and trick for stall teams

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nationaldex-2125422238

ik im low ladder but still this is funni

[pearl wind]

comfey is so silly in randbats

[willow vault]

Your playing Nat dex?

If all the singles formats your choose Nat dex?

You know what have fun with it

[timber falcon]

wait is that a bad one to do lol

[willow vault]

I don’t like it but it’s up to you

[graceful flare]

There needs to be 2 comp discussion channels

1 for sv one for showdown

[molten oasis]

no, just, no

[graceful flare]

Yes I despise showdow

It's so cringe

[timber falcon]

lol how

[molten oasis]

ok well that sucks then

cuz there isnt a reason to make 2 chats for that

[timber falcon]

showdown is a better place to play comp than sv itself lmao

[mighty stump]

You’re welcome to not engage then

Lol

No one’s making you

There are other channels/discords

[lofty tartan]

[molten oasis]

cough what r u up to

[polar canyon]

I decided to watch some randoms battling and saw someone kill their farigiraf then proceed to ohko their own urshifu with specs miraidon tera electric discharge

[molten oasis]

Lmao

[willow vault]

Clearly they were cooking at such a high level we couldn’t understand

[mighty stump]

I hope to never understand then

[timber falcon]

All part of their master plan

[sharp cobalt]

Let them have fun lol

[cyan smelt]

Isn't farig supposed to be tera ground in that situation

[solid frigate]

ya know whats funny, he yaps about How Showdown take your teams for data

[mighty stump]

Who cares

[cyan smelt]

Showdown doesn't charge anything

[mighty stump]

You get a few results with that:

• If ur a bad player even the best team can’t carry you
• If it’s an original/unique team only you would be able to pilot it well enough
• If someone actually dedicated enough time to steal your specific team, id take that as a compliment

[cyan smelt]

It's great for practice, I bet TPC does the same thing

They probably use usage stats to determine what comes back in the next game

[autumn vault]

What just happened?

Ik what happened

[mighty stump]

cough Tapus

[autumn vault]

I cringed while reading this

[cyan smelt]

Lol they just got reported for offering probably hacked pokemon

[timber falcon]

Wdym takes teams for data

Data for what ?

[cyan smelt]

It's a conspiracy

[timber falcon]

Oh ok

[mighty stump]

Oh really?

Shiny mythicals

I never understood the interest in the mythicals

You only ever get them after the game and can’t use them competitively

[cyan smelt]

It's mostly because they're rare

For collectors etc

[timber falcon]

Not everyday u just get a mythical

In dlcs legendaries are REALLY easy to get a hold of

[mighty stump]

Mm

I guess the pragmatist in me only ever collects useable ones

That’s a lie

But mostly

[cyan smelt]

Zeraora would've been really good next to miraidon

[mighty stump]

I think I’ll see if Tusk is useable

[timber falcon]

Oml this

[cyan smelt]

Is treads usable

[mighty stump]

Treads is like

“ok”

[timber falcon]

I’ve just remembered how I deleted my shiny zeraora from existence

[molten oasis]

bring talon tusk back

[timber falcon]

Talon flame and great tusk?

[molten oasis]

yea

it was a regulation b duo that was really strong

[timber falcon]

I’m guessing eq

[molten oasis]

one of my favorites too

[mighty stump]

Church of Tusk praise be 🙏

[molten oasis]

yep, eq headlong rush close combat, protect usually

ran sash or life orb i believe, sometimes scarf

occasionally av bulky ones popped up

not much tho

[mighty stump]

Its so goated physically

[cyan smelt]

I miss tusk

[timber falcon]

It’s still good in singles from what I’ve seen

[cyan smelt]

That sp def though

[dapper crag]

Pokémon No. 984: Great Tusk

Types

Ground/Fighting

Abilities

Protosynthesis

HP/Atk/Def/SpA/SpD/Spe

115/131/131/53/53/87

Total

570

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[timber falcon]

Could it run av?

[mighty stump]

You invest it like Hands

[timber falcon]

Uh idk how u invest in hands

Up to 100 or just full on max

[mighty stump]

I’ve repeated this so many times 😭

[sharp cobalt]

[forest arrow]

https://tenor.com/view/ogerpon-pokemon-ogerpon-ogerpon-pokemon-poochyena-ivy-cudgel-gif-5046741278776982481

[timber falcon]

…

[mighty stump]

Anyone else have the answer?

[forest arrow]

156 HP, 100+ Atk, 252 SpD

[mighty stump]

Yes but why

[forest arrow]

Lives moonblast from Fluttermane

[mighty stump]

How do you invest in low spdef high HP mons and why

[timber falcon]

Muchstats shows most being up to 200 but not quite 252

[cyan smelt]

When hp is higher than def stats you invest in def first

[mighty stump]

why

thats 50%

[timber falcon]

to optimise ev usage?

[mighty stump]

How so

[cyan smelt]

Is it because it gives a greater percentage boost

[timber falcon]

Calculating?

[mighty stump]

Il wait for Throw to finish

[lofty tartan]

Sorry. Was playing Diablo and streaming it to the other server lmao

[lofty tartan]

https://tenor.com/view/dont-you-dare-dont-dont-do-it-the-office-michael-scott-gif-14178027

[timber falcon]

Damn he must be cooking

[forest arrow]

Its Atk and Def are its best stats, so you take advantage of that by optimizing bulk in SpD, like Kalos said Hp stat is higher than SpD, so you max SpD optimize HP and attack was a dump? Iirc

[mighty stump]

No

Kalos was closest

[forest arrow]

sorry

[mighty stump]

Youre semi correct

In the sense of optimisation

[forest arrow]

Send me to the backrooms

[solid frigate]

Kalos Attention??

[mighty stump]

like everyone got the gist

[timber falcon]

Does this mean I’m last place?

[forest arrow]

I’m trying papa I promise

lol

[mighty stump]

Kinda, you were vague

[solid frigate]

ummm what are we talking about-

[timber falcon]

https://tenor.com/view/breaking-bad-walter-white-gif-8086630669522815021

[mighty stump]

The reason is you invest first in low stats because it leads to a greater % change

In this scenario your EVs provide more value i.e. “optimal”

well, efficient

[lofty tartan]

And I'm just here watching from the sidelines eating hot dogs

[molten oasis]

Ah no worries

[mighty stump]

Evidence wise just check the difference between the same attack using a 252 HP 0 SpDef AV vs 0 Spdef and 252 HP set

[lofty tartan]

Hot dogs!

[molten oasis]

I want hot dogs

[lofty tartan]

Math is power.

[mighty stump]

252+ SpA Choice Specs Hadron Engine Miraidon Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Iron Hands: 228-268 (87.3 - 102.6%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

252+ SpA Choice Specs Hadron Engine Miraidon Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 252 SpD Assault Vest Iron Hands: 168-198 (73.3 - 86.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

[lofty tartan]

https://tenor.com/view/secdon-try-gif-26810510

[mighty stump]

Nowhere even close

[forest arrow]

Oh damn okay

I’ll keep that in mind

[mighty stump]

So even without AV you’d be doing the same thing: but with AV

you’re also getting 1.5x more value

252+ SpA Choice Specs Hadron Engine Miraidon Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 116 SpD Assault Vest Iron Hands: 195-231 (85.1 - 100.8%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

116 EVs to get that into a favourable roll

[timber falcon]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-patrick-star-notes-noted-gif-26232003

[mighty stump]

vs 252++ to do the same

[lofty tartan]

It's math time

Get your numbers on

[cyan smelt]

This is making sense now, it didn't use to before

[mighty stump]

264 to be exact

116 EVs vs 264

[forest arrow]

Saved this for future reference, that’s actually really gonna help me in the future, I should’ve learned this by now

[mighty stump]

Its why with Flutter Mane, you invest in HP makes you fat SpDef wise

And in turn is why you start with HP as well instead of just going for Defense

Because the HP/Def stats are the same

As an overall value, its better to start off in HP

Obviously: You have other thresholds that are easier to decide first

Like Speed, for example

That’s always set depending on the nature/desire

e.g. if you want speed boosting

[timber falcon]

How would one know when to stop investing in HP?

And go for defence

[mighty stump]

When you hit a calc threshold from SpA you think is appropriate

Keep in mind this is all like as a general approach and theres nuance to it for example

[timber falcon]

Ok I kind of get it

[dapper crag]

Pokémon No. 992: Iron Hands

Types

Fighting/Electric

Abilities

Quark Drive

HP/Atk/Def/SpA/SpD/Spe

154/140/108/50/68/50

Total

570

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[mighty stump]

252 SpA Choice Specs Tera-Fairy Flutter Mane Moonblast vs. 180 HP / 0 SpD Flutter Mane: 130-154 (84.9 - 100.6%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

If this is the roll you want, then you stop there HP wise

But if you have no specific SpA Attack threshold youre trying to live

Then I personally just straight up start with 252 HP and X amount of Def EVs to see if I need to live a hit

Then I start reducing the HP EVs and increasing yhe Def EVs in increments maintaining the same roll

For example

252 Atk Sword of Ruin Chien-Pao Icicle Crash vs. 252 HP / 36 Def Flutter Mane: 138-163 (85.1 - 100.6%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

252 Atk Sword of Ruin Chien-Pao Icicle Crash vs. 244 HP / 44 Def Flutter Mane: 135-160 (83.8 - 99.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

You see how going down/up by 8 EVs already make a difference in the rolls

[forest arrow]

Damn I’m learning

[timber falcon]

Mhm mhm

So then you keep doing that until you hit the best one?

[mighty stump]

252 Atk Sword of Ruin Chien-Pao Icicle Crash vs. 220 HP / 44 Def Flutter Mane: 135-160 (85.4 - 101.2%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO

Here I reduced 24 EVs in HP and it still maintains a desirable roll

you then keep reducing HP until the roll changes

thats when you up the Def EVs again

[forest arrow]

Ahh

[mighty stump]

Hence the concept of “maintaining the roll”

I also personally approach calcing by hitting my nature bumps first

then working around the spare EVs

[timber falcon]

Wdym by nature bumps?

Does that apply for things like jolly and timid?

[polar canyon]

Do you do that for speed natures?

[molten oasis]

There’s a bump in your nature stats where it goes up by 2 instead of 1

[forest arrow]

Bumps add +2 into stats over just a +1

[mighty stump]

^

[molten oasis]

Usually at 156 and, uhhhh

[mighty stump]

Usually it works for your highest base stat

[polar canyon]

196?

[mighty stump]

Thats the most EV sparing

[timber falcon]

Oh I’ve heard of this b4

[mighty stump]

👏 👏 that’s all for today folks class dismissed

[polar canyon]

Man

[forest arrow]

Thank you Papa I’ll be better at calcing now fs

[polar canyon]

My question is still unanswered

[timber falcon]

Well guess I’ll do some proper calcs instead of spamming random numbers

[polar canyon]

I still find it tough to make calcs for both defense and spdef

[mighty stump]

Which one

For both Def/SpDef calcs I usually decide an appropriate HP investment first

[timber falcon]

Oh yeah do nature bumps apply for all the stats? Or just defence

[mighty stump]

then I do the same thing of maintaining a roll

If you need to use your nature to boost your defensive stat to achieve the thresholds you want

Then do so

But do it for the higher base stat

[timber falcon]

Ok

[polar canyon]

I'm doing it for spdef on incineroar

[mighty stump]

In general due to how similar Incin’s stats are its still better to invest in HP

HP investments “invest in both def and spdef”

[polar canyon]

Honestly I made it live something but forgot what it is

It's max hp

[timber falcon]

Lastly, jn case I’m missing something, for a nature bump on defence I’ll need a defensive nature?

[polar canyon]

I'm just wondering if I'm wasting evs by going max hp

[autumn vault]

You know it is outclassed when the damage calculator calls it this

[timber falcon]

Said smth about mitigating the hp until it changes, then slightly upping defence

[autumn vault]

Also that set is shit

[mighty stump]

You use your nature bump@if you absolutely cannot hit that threshold

and you want to

Theres also the nuance of then “playing around” your EVs and the situations you’re setting up for

Some EV calcs are relevant and some aren’t

Its up to you to figure out through playing which ones are and arent

[timber falcon]

Ok so a problem I have with things like that is overcalcing

Cause I struggle with this “relevant” thing

[polar canyon]

Like you calc for something specific and it never actually happens?

[timber falcon]

More like trying to make lando-i survive surging strike shifu

For no really important reason

[polar canyon]

Is that even possible

[timber falcon]

Pretty sure

Idk

[molten oasis]

incarnate? without tera i think you need a signifigant amount of bulk for that

[timber falcon]

Yeah

That’s where I go wrong, using up my evs for things I don’t even need nor know why I’ll need it

For instance tofu using chien pao as a calc for flutter

Why specifically pao over others

Like watershifu

[polar canyon]

You want flutter out vs chien dnite I'm pretty sure

So it makes sense

[mighty stump]

Depends, both are relevant matchups and you have the option of using your team/gameplan to account for those matchups, with your EV investments causing an alteration in your decisions

[timber falcon]

But cheindnite has seen a significant drop from what i can tell

[molten oasis]

its not bad

its still good, i think lots of farigiraf hurts it tho

[timber falcon]

It does, I tried it

[molten oasis]

its good to consider past cores

[mighty stump]

Like if I calced for Watershifu, then id stay in front of Urshifu with a Flutter Mane.

If I didn’t calc for Watershifu, I’d be leveraging something like an Amoonguss to deal with Watershifu and be using Flutter Mane for something else EV wise

[polar canyon]

Ttar lycanroc

[molten oasis]

cough pao pult was a thing in the past

[timber falcon]

Ok so it’s what the mon is planned to actually deal with

[mighty stump]

Hence, relevancy

[molten oasis]

and i just shot that into top 500 so, i think we've come to see this is a very flexible format, weirdly enough

[mighty stump]

Back then having your Flutter Mane be able to live a hit from Chien-Pao, which is one of the few things that can speed-tie it

Would be significant

So you can fire something off like Moonblast/Dazzling Gleam

Its why minimum bulk to consider has to be enough to live Jolly Sucker Punch

I just used it as an example cause thats what Flutter Mane spreads usually accounted for:Chien-Paos

Unless you’re using Sash, obviously

[polar canyon]

You can account for grassy glide

I think that's relevant

Enough

[molten oasis]

you should live most glides unless theyre tera grass or miracle seed

or band

[timber falcon]

Is there a point for accounting for wood hammer on flutter?

[mighty stump]

Then that’s deciding your umbrella calc

[molten oasis]

no

[polar canyon]

It's just gonna die

[molten oasis]

wood hammer just wipes flutter

[mighty stump]

If Sucker Punch from Chien-Pao is stronger than the common Rillaboom set with Glide, you already accounted for it indirectly

This is what I mean by umbrella calcs

Its why you see my set articles showcase fairly high damage calcs that I try to live

Cause then I would feel comfortable living anything I know is weaker

its also my own preference of style to opt for bulkier calcs

Other times you can always adjust if you either need more damage or more bulk as well

Which is why spending a long ass time making EV spreads can also be a bit pointless if you’re not testing its relevancy

play the game: best advice

[polar canyon]

I think I had like 20 spdef on ogerpon for something I can't remember

That's something I think

I think it was specs astral barrage

It felt pretty good when it actually happened and it mattered

[mighty stump]

this extends my point into understanding your calcs

It gives you better eyeballing/information to make better decisions during the match

@forest arrow Thought I would ping you to read above just in case

[molten oasis]

you can make better calls if yo know your calcs

[timber falcon]

Who would’ve guessed that

[mighty stump]

Its why i’m harsh about these tiny minute details because I believe these things should almost be second nature

[timber falcon]

I thought specs caly would be overkill though

[mighty stump]

its holistic to player ability

[mighty stump]

If you think about it

Specs Caly = +1 Calyrex

[autumn vault]

Specs tera electric electro drift modest/timid miraidon exist so no, it isn't

[timber falcon]

Oh so calm mind aswell

[mighty stump]

If I live Specs Caly, I know im living +1 Caly or Helping Hand Caly

The small details

[timber falcon]

I mean I don’t think oger ever lives that

Maybe idk

[molten oasis]

i think specs tera ghost is overkill but just specs is fine

[mighty stump]

I also will disclaim this is my own brain at work, and other players might provide a different approach/insight

[autumn vault]

What is better: Guaranteed to survive the attack or have a 6.3% chance to die to it?

[mighty stump]

But overall at the root of it I believe I’m pretty much accurate

[molten oasis]

6.3 if you need the evs elsewhere

[polar canyon]

If it's not wellspring it probably can

[mighty stump]

6.3% chance to die is most EV efficient

[molten oasis]

i usually go 6.3%

[timber falcon]

Yeah I meant waterpon

[autumn vault]

I pinged the wrong message btw (before), but thanks for that

[gentle crag]

lycopoky has given 1 Gen Rep to woodtofu

[mighty stump]

If you have the EVs to spare then might as well guarantee the roll

But if you you’re cutting it close

6.3% is functionally the same

[polar canyon]

Banking on a 93% chance is hard

Because you know it'll probably happen at some point

Maybe

[mighty stump]

The confirmation of it is difficult though

[autumn vault]

It still is super rare

[mighty stump]

You’re rarely taking full advantage of guaranteed 2HKOs

[timber falcon]

I think I’d always just play it safe tbh

[mighty stump]

Cause of any sort of chip already ruins your calc

And even after all this

Sometimes

252/252/4 is just fine

[molten oasis]

sash mons are typically 252/252/4 things

scarf shifu is also usually that rn i believe

[polar canyon]

252 252 4 incineroar

[mighty stump]

• 252/252/4 EVs are fine
• EVs that are predominantly bulk but do nothing back are just punching bags. You’re not using your bulk to forward your gameplan in that case

So you can’t just go overboard on bulk either

[timber falcon]

Is it possible for a sash mon to be calved to survive water shifu barrage?

[molten oasis]

wha?

[mighty stump]

Yes

[timber falcon]

Like is it worth

[polar canyon]

I mean depends on the mon

[mighty stump]

Tornadus with Focus Sash should run 92 HP to live Surging Strikes for example

from Scarfshifu

[timber falcon]

Flutter for example

[mighty stump]

and for Chien-Pao

PUT YOUR 4 EVS IN DEFENSE

ALWAYS

[molten oasis]

thanks

i didn't know that

[timber falcon]

Ty for info

[polar canyon]

Thanks I was putting it in special attack

[molten oasis]

fixed it hehe

bruh what

[polar canyon]

No I wasn't

Well it could have been naive nature with tera blast

The showdown suggested set

[autumn vault]

https://tenor.com/view/my-goodness-what-an-idea-why-didnt-i-facepalm-the-simpsons-gif-17489109

[mighty stump]

those 4 EVs sometimes matters you guys

And its just about good habits

252+ Atk Urshifu-Rapid Strike Surging Strikes (3 hits) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Chien-Pao on a critical hit: 126-153 (81.2 - 98.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Urshifu-Rapid Strike Surging Strikes (3 hits) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Chien-Pao on a critical hit: 135-162 (86.5 - 103.8%) -- approx. 6.3% chance to OHKO

[polar canyon]

I got them 4 spatk evs on my snarl sassy incineroar set

[mighty stump]

This is a scenario of “I have the EVs to spare”

so THEN you optimise

[polar canyon]

Incineroar @ Assault Vest
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 36 Atk / 140 Def / 4 SpA / 76 SpD
Sassy Nature

• U-turn
• Fake Out
• Snarl
• Flare Blitz

Should I be tweaking the hp and defenses here?

[mighty stump]

Did you account for Intimidate drops when doing the Def EVs?

[polar canyon]

Ye

[mighty stump]

that also almost looks like Rajan Bal’s Incin

[autumn vault]

Also Tofu this rental's Pokepaste doesn't work

[mighty stump]

Thanks

[gentle crag]

woodtofu has given 1 Gen Rep to lycopoky

[autumn vault]

It just directs you to make a new paste

[polar canyon]

Actually I think I just dumped what I had leftover into defense

[autumn vault]

Not a currently existing one

[mighty stump]

@sharp trail You have 24 hours to update your Pokepaste to viable link before your post in #rental_teams gets removed

-remindme 24h check rentals

[gentle crag]

Set a reminder in 1 day from now (<t:1716125697:f>)
View reminders with the reminders command

[solid frigate]

hoi

[mighty stump]

Anyways hope that was useful

[timber falcon]

Very useful indeed

[autumn vault]

Hopefully it is

[polar canyon]

I should start taking notes of what my calcs are for

[timber falcon]

But I’ll probably now need to write down what my calcs are for

lol

[polar canyon]

I always forget what I made them for a few days after

[timber falcon]

🤝

[polar canyon]

What +76 spdef incineroar is for?

Don't ask me

It's something important

[timber falcon]

I just use numbers that look right

For a while with hp I’d always do 212 for absolutely no reason

[molten oasis]

so you have numbers you check

[cyan smelt]

i need to go back and redo my rotom evs i think

[polar canyon]

You're using rotom?

Actually that doesn't sound bad rn

[timber falcon]

Rotom wash

[cyan smelt]

i need to only bring it against urshifu water, torn, pelipper and caly-i

oh and maybe tsareena

[timber falcon]

If that’s ur teams weakness then why not

[polar canyon]

https://pokepast.es/6652d82c128b0339
I've been putting this off for a while out of lazyness but I think it's getting somewhere

[mighty stump]

Goggles + Hydro means you can hit Incins inshallah

[polar canyon]

80% of the time

[mighty stump]

Its ok

They just need to be scared of it

[cyan smelt]

yeah i might take the goggles off flutter and give flutter booster and give goggles to rotom

[mighty stump]

Lol

[timber falcon]

Scarf Koraidon W

[polar canyon]

Now I wonder if it's a good idea to use rotom heat

[timber falcon]

If there’s no purpose i wouldn’t, though it can make a nice caly-ice wall

[polar canyon]

I was just gonna do clear amulet but since I added kingambit for howl strats then might as well

I have something to make incineroar worry about

[timber falcon]

I’ll fix up my Koraidon team later

I ran max max jolly to jump flutters lmao

[polar canyon]

The speed is just enough to outspeed scarf shifu

[autumn vault]

https://pokepast.es/86f83980ea85b430 What is a good 6th member? I felt like Garganacl didn't help with anything much outside of wide guard and now i look for a pokemon that doesn't need wide guard and reliable in and out of sun

Also i will never go back to D-Claw

On Koraidon obv

[timber falcon]

U need more speed I think, speaking of tw

[autumn vault]

Tornadus or Whim?

[polar canyon]

Your incineroar should be faster

[timber falcon]

Cause for a hard sub team you’d also gain a second sun setter

[autumn vault]

I can tell it's sarcasm

[timber falcon]

Depends on what ur looking for

[autumn vault]

Already have grass

I can remove Venusaur for Whim

[molten oasis]

then go torn if you're concerned about type overlap

[autumn vault]

Or just add torn

[timber falcon]

Torn I’d say

[autumn vault]

Tornadus has already done great in my first Koraidon team

[polar canyon]

Speaking of I should probably put torn on my team maybe?

[south shuttle]

did they buff decorate in gen 9?

[polar canyon]

No

[autumn vault]

And since Venusaur is running Life Orb then i can go sash tornadus

[south shuttle]

it always gave +2 in both stats?

[timber falcon]

Mhm mhm

[polar canyon]

Yes

[autumn vault]

Yes

[south shuttle]

i thought in gen 8 it was +1

[polar canyon]

It's a good move exclusive to a mid pokemon so it balances out

[autumn vault]

and smeargle, i guess

[timber falcon]

Alcreamie I wouldn’t call exactly mid

[polar canyon]

2 mid pokemon because of smeargle

[polar canyon]

Yeah just bad

[timber falcon]

Wouldn’t say that either, it’s actually pretty nice when used properly

[south shuttle]

i mean its pretty good

[timber falcon]

I enjoy its ability

[dapper crag]

Pokémon No. 869: Alcremie

Type

Fairy

Abilities

Sweet Veil, Aroma Veil (Hidden)

HP/Atk/Def/SpA/SpD/Spe

65/60/75/110/121/64

Total

495

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[south shuttle]

which one?

[dapper crag]

Ability: Aroma Veil

This Pokemon and its allies cannot become affected by Attract, Disable, Encore, Heal Block, Taunt, or Torment.

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[timber falcon]

Perfect for tr

[polar canyon]

I wish it got moonblast

[south shuttle]

girafarig is perfect for fake out leads

just gotta be careful around incin

[timber falcon]

Farigiraf*

[south shuttle]

is another good ability like this

[south shuttle]

yes farigiraf

[timber falcon]

No they are different

[south shuttle]

i know

[timber falcon]

Farig stops priority, not taunt itself

[south shuttle]

but they are both good abilities

[dapper crag]

Ability: Sweet Veil

This Pokemon and its allies cannot fall asleep, but those already asleep do not wake up immediately. This Pokemon and its allies cannot use Rest successfully or become affected by Yawn, and those previously affected will not fall asleep.

SableyeBot version 4.27.1

[timber falcon]

This could also work for tr against moongus

[solid frigate]

basically Reg F/Reg G be like

[south shuttle]

tornadus 😭

[solid frigate]

I mean,Torn and Whimsicott are fightng for the spot

these 6 are mons that others can't replicate

[polar canyon]

People said ghost was better at the start, now ice is better, next is base form calyrex dominating the meta

[plain drum]

[timber falcon]

Torn atm I would say is better

[polar canyon]

Amoonguss can be replicated, but worse

Spore rage powder eviolite toedscool

Toedscool lovers where you at

[solid frigate]

well and Brute Bonnet but then again

[timber falcon]

This is a pretty L replication, not same typing nor does it get they tr advantage

[cyan smelt]

why are so many of the scarlet paradoxes weak to fairy

[timber falcon]

Oh yeah

[polar canyon]

You know what sounds funny

[molten oasis]

because they wanted flutter to be even stronger

[polar canyon]

Toedscruel + weezing

[cyan smelt]

you have like 0 offensive pressure

[autumn vault]

This is 1300 elo btw

[timber falcon]

Been done seen with my own eyes

[polar canyon]

You have fast spore

[solid frigate]

Ho-Oh i see

[timber falcon]

Looks like a pain

[molten oasis]

3/4 ruins lol

[solid frigate]

Btw Specs Terapagos make me climb back to 1302

[solid frigate]

Chi Yu when

[timber falcon]

lol 4/6 fairy weakness doesn’t loon great

[polar canyon]

Hey drago

[timber falcon]

And 1 tera for those gets hogs

[tawdry urchin]

Should tornadus use covert cloak or mental herb because of taunt?

[solid frigate]

Phew

[polar canyon]

https://pokepast.es/6652d82c128b0339
torn farig or rotom heat

[south shuttle]

sash????

use focus sash on torn imo

[tawdry urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/get-yo-ahh-on-boy-gif-26030997

[polar canyon]

If you don't use herb use tera dark

[south shuttle]

exactly

[solid frigate]

basically me

i think i am the only one uses Tera Dark Amogus

[polar canyon]

No

[tawdry urchin]

Thats just a complete waste of a tera

[south shuttle]

why not tera water

[polar canyon]

It saved me so many times

[solid frigate]

you don't always have to Tera

[solid frigate]

i use Sitrus Berry Amogus

maybe sometimes Rocky Helm

[south shuttle]

me too and i use tera water

[tawdry urchin]

For me is allways a yes for calyrex like that x4 weakness to ghost and dark 💀

[polar canyon]

It was beautiful when I used tera dark to use sunny day on the kyogre while the other torn tried to taunt me

[solid frigate]

ok thats your problem-

[south shuttle]

i mean dark is useful against those psychic types

so i can see the reasoning

[timber falcon]

I’ve seen it plenty

[polar canyon]

And doubles as prankster taunt immunity

[solid frigate]

yeah at least someone knows

[tawdry urchin]

So should I use mental herb or covery cloak?

[polar canyon]

I say covert tera dark

[timber falcon]

For what?

[solid frigate]

amogus?