competitive_discussion

[next stump]

let me check again

could have been toronto

check there

[keen karma]

what is their full name?

[next stump]

Raghav Malivaya

something like that

wait I’m tripping he didn’t use tailroom for that tournament

https://pokepast.es/265d854b50acb3e8

it was this guy

top 16 toronto

[patent marsh]

is there any good speed calculator so far the 2 I found either can't commpared 2 pokemon and inaccurate

[keen karma]

interesting

[patent marsh]

cause I think I can probs drop lando's speed in favour for some bulk since scarf'd lando-t should be able to outspeed chien pao and urshifu rapid strike if they're not scarf'd without the need of max speed EV on scarf

[mighty stump]

What do you mean

You can just compare the final number on the calculator

Or just divide the final speed stat you wanna hit +1/1.5

-calc 206/1.5

[gentle crag]

Result: 137.333333

[mighty stump]

-calc 137x1.5

[gentle crag]

Result: 205.500000

[mighty stump]

so you need 138 Speed in Lando-T

[patent marsh]

oh

[mighty stump]

thats 212 EVs

[keen karma]

Dyk why he ran sunny day

Ohhh

This is durshifu

[patent marsh]

danks

[gentle crag]

kumicharizard has given 1 Gen Rep to woodtofu

[worldly portal]

So I'm using dipplin and maushold. Dipplin enters, lowers evasion, then technician maushold with choice scarf uses population bomb for a guaranteed 10 hits, it's almost always and ohko and you could tera normal if it wouldn't ohko. But I need some supports, because of ghost types and the fact that dipplin can only lower evasion once.

And I wonder what would fit my team?

[chrome knot]

and then a rocky helmet amoonguss rage powders

[worldly portal]

yeah that also sucks

[deep sparrow]

Whatcha mean they ev train?

[next stump]

the best check to flutter mane in the format is probably Heatran or Urshifu with Choice Scarf, if you’re looking for just a single pokémon

defensive tera Iron Hands is great too

[chrome knot]

stupid iron hands

[worldly portal]

urshi won't work, I have choice scarf on maushold

so heatran it is

3 more spots, I'm thinking gholdengo for amoonguss and maybe a flutter mane of my own and then maybe something I have shiny to flex a little

[mighty stump]

You want something to at least stop Priority from screwing up your Maushold like Fake Outs since youre scarfed

Dipplin loses its value once its switched in so might as well switch out into additional utility

Like indeedee-F and Farigiraf

[worldly portal]

or a fake out user of my own

[nocturne holly]

Sitrus or helm on amoonguss? I’m really liking Sitrus as of now

[deep sparrow]

Do any of you run turbo controllers for money farming? If so which ones do ya use? Tired of spam clicking myself

[next stump]

depends if you need an urshifu answer badly

[worldly portal]

it's not worth the 50$ (at least)

[nocturne holly]

https://pokepast.es/56674c73442bf30d I think my urshifu mu is pretty good

Sitrus comes in clutch a ton

[next stump]

you’re good with sitrus then

[lofty tartan]

Just fyi you can get a turbo controller for $20

https://www.target.com/p/hori-nintendo-switch-horipad-wired-controller-black/-/A-86501147?ref=tgt_adv_xsp&AFID=google&fndsrc=tgtao&DFA=71700000012510682&CPNG=PLA_Electronics%2BShopping|Electronics_Ecomm_Hardlines&adgroup=SC_Electronics&LID=700000001170770pgs&LNM=PRODUCT_GROUP&network=g&device=c&location=9002691&targetid=pla-305534446499&ds_rl=1246978&ds_rl=1248099&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAjfyqBhAsEiwA-UdzJHVcbku7YvCwfXg9wnl9CRmLYVbdbov-WYYWVznfk7-ux1_blaIU_hoCmJMQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

[worldly portal]

any turbo controllers for 20 bucks in europe?

[next stump]

isn’t USD more expensive than euro

[worldly portal]

no

or yes, depends on how you see it

1 € is worth more than 1$

[nocturne holly]

Dude just realized
When minikyu Tera’s the hat is tilted lmao

[deep sparrow]

I’ve got the happy hour Zoroark. Which gets me like 67k a match with amulet. But I think I’d rather just AFK with a turbo and chi-yu.

[gloomy crescent]

The bots in battle tower ev train

[mellow barn]

Don't got turbo
But I been grinding with Shards.
Also... watching Path of the Peak and now I wanna make Vileplum viable

[deep sparrow]

Do they? I thought they didn’t give you exp.

[gloomy crescent]

Rhey don't give exp

Do you even know what ev means!?

[deep sparrow]

I do.

[gloomy crescent]

Why would they give exp!?

[deep sparrow]

I’ve had 2 hours of sleep. I’m just gonna walk away Lol.

[keen karma]

for what?

[deep sparrow]

Ahhh I thought you meant you are grinding the tower to EV train your team. I gotcha.

[gloomy crescent]

💀

[deep sparrow]

Honestly the best practice you’ll get is just jumping into casual/ranked. NPCs aren’t gonna help ya a whole lot when it comes to an actual human on the other end.

[lofty tartan]

Farm the Ace Academy Tournament for money

[gloomy crescent]

These NPC'S are hard at ultra ball

[lofty tartan]

One dollar USD equals 0.92 Euros so it's a marginal difference.

(but yes - with expensive being like the raw number cost USD will be higher than Euros - but 20 dollars USD would be like 18.34 Euros, so you're technically spending less because the Euro is worth slightly more individually)

[keen karma]

bruh im stuck at 1500

[near crag]

I have been trying to build a sun team, this is it's current state. Any ideas on how to improve it? https://pokepast.es/4d4a521dd0fd76d7

thanks

[marble coral]

nice

[gloomy crescent]

Heya everyone can someone help me do my rental picture It's idk how to do it

I know move it to my phone

But idk how to

[mellow barn]

Looking at the team Victreebel's sleep powder only has 75% chance to hit. While it's nice to make your opponents to sleep I would say protect to help keep your victreebel alive.
All in all it looks nice. But for torkoal I would suggest a Hissuian Lilligant (Or regular Lilligant) with After you move. Allowing your Torkoal move first and hit with Eruption.

[willow vault]

Also Flutter Mane would fit your team really well

[gentle delta]

Its hard to use properly, but is still very good on hard trick room teams. For example Tom Hayden went 7-0 with it in the first day of Beast Coast with a team made by Pinkman.

I've also used it to great success on ladder but decided only at the last minute to not use it.

Its important to understand the difference between a mon thats bad and a mon thats not used. They're not remotely the same thing.

Not to be "that guy" but I'd like to point out that Harc doesn't threaten Armarouge Indeedee, at all.

While Harc is still very good, I'd suggest against including that tidbit because it just isnt true.

[next stump]

explain because I don’t see your side

[gentle delta]

I say this as the biggest Mimikyu stan in the land. Don't run it until Calyrex is legal.

[gentle delta]

All Armarouge's universally run a tera that is not weak to Rock Slide. So even if you don't have Wide Guard, Rock Slide isn't picking up the KO. You can rely on Flinch chance, but at that point Harc isn't any better than other Rock Slide users.

Any Armarouge player worth their salt these days is going to have Wide Guard though. So on your typically banded or sitrus Harc sets, you literally arent touching Armarouge with Arcanine.

As a career Psyspam player, Harc is something im overjoyed to see on opponents teamsheets.

[keen karma]

Im trying to go above

[gentle delta]

When your best answer to Armarouge Indeedee is the the flinch chance you're already not in a great spot.

[gloomy crescent]

Yall someone pls help

[keen karma]

Why is this the case?

[gentle delta]

Raghav didnt top 8 Peoria, but you may be thinking of Enzos toronto team? one of the better tail rooms Ive seen

[gentle delta]

Mimikyu and Caly-I are best friends

[keen karma]

He meant top 16 toronto

[gentle delta]

then whos the player because thats still not Raghav lol

Raghav was third, he was one of my losses so it was great for my resistance to push me into top 64

[keen karma]

Grant weldon

[gentle delta]

eh, I wouldnt call Grants team tail room

the trick room on it is more for reversal than use

Enzos 6th place team is neat though

https://pokepast.es/ba6ebdbead1eadad

[keen karma]

Any non armadd you saw?

[gentle delta]

Not that are worth using

[gloomy crescent]

How do I do the rental thing

[gentle delta]

actually @keen karma if you want you can have one I was tinkering with and gave up on. I got top 25 Masterball with it but it wasnt good enough for me to want to use in a tournament

[keen karma]

Ooh ill try

[gentle delta]

https://pokepast.es/2376308504b2ba12

I havent touched it in a couple weeks so im rusty on explaining how it works. Can't promise itll be as easy to pick up as it was for me to use it.

But basically the idea is thats its sort of a balance tail room. rather than a hyper aggro one.

Tailwind is for the balance-esque teams or stall teams where you'll pickup the outspeeds on crucial threats. Oger will outspeed scarf lando in TW, Ursaluna will outspeed Chi Yu if its not scarfed, same with Farig. Trick room is for when you cant tailwind or when it wont matter.

Fake Tears next to Ursa is extremely rude to your opponents

[gloomy crescent]

Why do I keep on seeing chestnaught?

It always kills my bax

[gentle delta]

Low ladder things

[gloomy crescent]

But my atales kills it

[gentle delta]

Chesnaught is awful

[gloomy crescent]

Iam seeing intel too

Ice tera intel

[gentle delta]

@keen karma

[keen karma]

Ty

[gentle crag]

iamabigmunch has given 1 Gen Rep to progatog

[keen karma]

Mb went offline

[gentle delta]

np I forgot you gotta ping people since its a big server

[gloomy crescent]

@gentle delta um that's an actual ping 😂

[gentle delta]

lol

[gloomy crescent]

yall this is my team

Gimme a moment

https://pokepast.es/7709281063e7dbf8

[bold geode]

You giving away teams man

[next stump]

I definitely see the wide guard part, but pikalytics has wide guard at around 30-35% usage. I’m pretty sure the player I said that too is purely a ladder player, so I think its not too garbage of a lead. My friend Bobby made top 8 Toronto and his team’s lead into Arma without wide guard was Sharp Beak Torn + Rock slide, covered for most options that Indeedee/Arma had

I don’t think it’s a foolproof game plan at all, but I also don’t think for an average ladder player it’s a bad option

[gloomy crescent]

I did it!

[mellow barn]

Good job!

[gentle delta]

Fair, I get trigger happy when I see people spreading false info about Armarouge as its my bread and butter. Thats all.

And I find the idea that Rock Slide = counter, to be false info.

No harm in decent discussion

Also funny you mention Bobbys team, im testing it for a PC atm

[next stump]

Yeah I think at high levels, it’s not a great idea

it does create a mind game where banded flare blitz can do some damage to indeedee if you have something to handle the TR stuff once it goes up

[mellow barn]

Though it will be some time for that, anyone interested on testing when the new DLC comes out?

[gentle delta]

My team is already ready to go unless theres a new mon/move/item that tickles my fancy

just gotta keep breeding Littens til I get that shiny Lux ball Incin

[bold geode]

Armarouge propaganda funny moments

[gloomy crescent]

Yall posted it

#rental_teams

It's a snow based team

With the bax and atales I mean

[mellow barn]

From the leaks (Though unconfirmed) I saw a pokemon that I really... really think will be viable.
Specially for [Potential spoilers] || sandteams as it will be boosted because of it. Talking about Excadrill.||

[gentle delta]

I already know all the leaks

my team is ready with them in mind

I more meant like, if the new paradoxes are legal/good

or if the leader of the loyal three is legal/good

[mellow barn]

I see, well I do still hope to run it someday

[gentle delta]

drill is fire

you can def run it successfully

[gloomy crescent]

@mellow barn opinions

[mellow barn]

Alright, what you wanna know?

[gloomy crescent]

No what do you think about me rental

[gentle delta]

@gloomy crescent its mostly fine but you want protect on bax over breaking swipe and hands needs a better tera

[nocturne holly]

Oh shit I gotta do that

[nocturne holly]

Yo what there’s a leader?

[mellow barn]

That's why I asked.
General I think it looks good but like TR God said, I would switch few teras around.
Specially some protective ones.

[gloomy crescent]

Ok

I only just noticed the ping

[gentle delta]

spoilers obviously ||If you look carefully around the Teal Mask stuff, theres lots of hints at it. Its visible in the black and white cutscene when all of their faces are on screen looking all sinister, and likely because the village worships the three, theres a plush of the leader in the food stand in town.

its basically a floating pig head thing, and its also what possessed Kieran (if you noticed the purple aura when he was battling you in the plaza)||

[nocturne holly]

oh cool

[bold geode]

|| A floating pig head? Bruh got possessed by Miss Piggy ||

[mellow barn]

[gentle delta]

notably

it has the same eyes as the tera hats

[bold geode]

|| So it gonna have beef with Terapagos prolly ||

[nocturne holly]

👁️

[mellow barn]

Hey, any thoughts about Hatterene in TR team?

[gentle delta]

||Its been a theory for a while since Terapagos was in the anime that its power to create paradoxes is unintentional, and there are leaks supporting this. Its possible Dontaru (one of the possible names of the boss) was involved in the invention of the Tera Orb. It almost sounds like Dontaru grants wishes but with a twist. Kieran wanted power, Munkidori wanted brains, Fezan wanted beauty and Dogi wanted muscles. They were all granted at the cost of corrupting the individual.||

[dull ibex]

What does the new Tera do 🤔

[bold geode]

What would even be it's name

[gloomy crescent]

Hey red

[nocturne holly]

it’s been oinkilogne this whole time…

[gentle delta]

Removes all weaknesses and resistance and gives you a ??? type tera blast

[bold geode]

Lmao

[gentle delta]

according to multiple leak sources

[dull ibex]

Thats insane

[gentle delta]

basically removes type from you entirely

On a bulky mon like hands this is probably a boon, on something squishy less so

[mellow barn]

I knew it! Neutral type

[gentle delta]

Depends if you mean Reg E or Reg F, but its good either way

in Reg E its more of an underdog choice but is perfectly respsectable

[dull ibex]

Is this exclusive to legendary

[gentle delta]

in Reg F its gonna be S tier

[nocturne holly]

You take neutral from everything?
Do you hit anything for SE?

[gentle delta]

the trailer showed ttar with it

[gentle delta]

not with tera blast, its neutral into all types

[dull ibex]

EXPANDING FORCE IS BACK!

[nocturne holly]

What does Tera blast do than?

[gentle delta]

its neutral into all types

[dull ibex]

Oh its neutral to everything?

[gentle delta]

which is VERY good

[mellow barn]

Personal note: Run Farigaraf for possible TR teams 🤔

[dull ibex]

Some mons with immunities will probably want their type still then

[gentle delta]

being neutral into everything sounds meh, but when you consider that Tera exists its very good

prevents trickey and lowers stocks of mons like Roaring Moon and Gholdengo that have such stacked base resistances

[dull ibex]

I could see it not being the only Tera Type anything wants

[gentle delta]

I feel most mons arent gonna use it defensively but itll be incredible offensively

[dull ibex]

Prog do we know any of the teambuilding changes?

Depending on how easy team-building gets is what decides if I get dlc tbh

[nocturne holly]

wdym by teambuilding changes? Like mochi in dlc1?

[dull ibex]

Yes

Someone leaked early on something like pokehex would be added but I also thought that was bs tbh

[gentle delta]

some leakers that have been credible in the past have said stuff thats been debunked, and in the pile of debunked stuff was a mention of IV lowering things

[nocturne holly]

honestly oger oustin is kind of a blast
Have 18 fresh start mochi

[gentle delta]

odds are no more major changes but if we finally get "rusty" bottle caps or something similar ill be very happy

Im very much not looking forward to shiny hunting a 0 speed enam

gonna take me the better part of a year im sure

[dull ibex]

I mean ig it doesn't really matter if I won't get satisfied until it's as easy as showdown lmao

[nocturne holly]

There should be an item that makes a Mon shiny 😈

[dull ibex]

I like how temtem does it

Where they have an official showdown that works with the full game

[nocturne holly]

Temtem?

[dull ibex]

But you can't use shinies in showdown

Something like that would be fantastic

[marble coral]

been using his team alot and a majority of my losses are to psyspam lmao it do be rough out here against hard trick room w it but its not an instant lose match up

[gentle delta]

Never gonna happen

[dull ibex]

I know

[gentle delta]

A big part of the pokemon brand and philosophy is the journey and catching your friends etc

[dull ibex]

I mean you could separate pve and pvp

[gentle delta]

No you cant

because of that brand and philosophy

[dull ibex]

Temtem did

[gentle delta]

And is temtem the largest grossing media franchise in the world where every single decision has to go through 4 companies?

[dull ibex]

I mean having a battle simulator doesn't really effect brand or philosophy

[gentle delta]

It does

[dull ibex]

It just makes comp as simple as knowing what I want to build

[gentle delta]

Im not saying I AGREE with their logic

but 100% having a battle sim officially, would go against their philosophy

Game Freak doesnt even like that people care about IVs and Natures

[dull ibex]

That's stupid on their part

[gentle delta]

thats why it took so long for ways to manipulate them to happen

[dull ibex]

It sounds like they were better off arguing comp altogether then

[gentle delta]

They never wanted comp

It was a byproduct of adding natures and IVs

[dull ibex]

Did it just get too big to ignore?

[gentle delta]

yeah

VGC as we know it didnt really take off til late Gen 5

[marble coral]

also realized they could use it to make money

[gentle delta]

and even then we were talking about Worlds being like 60 people

[dull ibex]

Tbh the only thing that really holds back manual team-building rn is Tera

[gentle delta]

Nah the dlc fixes that entirely

[bold geode]

Yeah no tera shard farming is so easy now

[gentle delta]

it takes like 10 min to get the shards for one mon, thats faster than gathering most other kinds of materials

[dull ibex]

I hear it takes like 5 raids now

With the dlc

[bold geode]

Yeah 5 of you're going like
From 0 shards

[dull ibex]

I also don't have dlc

[bold geode]

Do yourself a favor soon

[dull ibex]

I'm not sure I am going to buy it at all tbh

[gentle delta]

then dont complain

they added a solution if you choose not to use it you cant pretend its not there

You just lost your right to complain about tera shards

[dull ibex]

No I didn't

[bold geode]

[gentle delta]

yes you did

[bold geode]

I wouldn't say that now

[dull ibex]

People with dlc have a solution I simple just forgot they made it so easy

I'm not going to stop complaining because I'm still on the other side of the paywall

[bold geode]

Some people can't afford DLC I guess so y'know

[solid ravine]

[dull ibex]

If I had paid for dlc I would lose my right to complain

[gentle delta]

Anyone who thinks pokemon has a competitive paywall is a joke

[gloomy crescent]

I'm going to hunt for tera shards soon and give bac protect

[bold geode]

You have wandered into my domain, hello

[gentle delta]

even with all the games and dlc its cheaper than almost any other e sport

[dull ibex]

I mean the shard solution does

[solid ravine]

greeting winton

[dull ibex]

It's a 35 dollar paywall

[bold geode]

Today we're arguing about tera shard grinding apparently

[dull ibex]

I get my mons from home and trading 🙂

[gloomy crescent]

Wait Winton is monke?

[bold geode]

Who'd you think it was?

[dull ibex]

It's whatever I just forgot it was so easy because I don't own dlc

[bold geode]

Well own it babe

[gloomy crescent]

New person 💀

[dull ibex]

Maybe that's why Tera change trades are so cheap now

[bold geode]

It's actually good
DLC story is actually good

[dull ibex]

🤔

[bold geode]

Yeah cuz it's so easy

[dull ibex]

I'm not employed

If I wasn't, I would have pre ordered dlc and had it

[bold geode]

You get money

[dull ibex]

I'm working on that part 🤔

[bold geode]

I almost said New York shit expensive but I forgor

[dull ibex]

I'm in NC

[bold geode]

I know
I forgor for sec

[dull ibex]

Oh right I'm gonna need to change my incins Tera Type

Probably to water tbh

Or fairy

[bold geode]

Annihilape time

[dull ibex]

Anyway yeah if gamefreak made it that easy to farm shards there's not much I can complain about tbh

I afk farm money when I sleep and feathers would be easy if I wasn't lazy as shit

[bold geode]

Would restricteds be this format if they were in 2nd DLC or would it be a future regulation?

[dull ibex]

How easy is fresh start to farm?

[dull ibex]

Future regulation

[bold geode]

Oh ok
I didn't know how they did it in SwSh so

[dull ibex]

In swsh we got ioa, then crown tundra

Then restricted

[gloomy crescent]

I like swsh's competitive

[bold geode]

So it'd be Mask, Disk, Restrict

[dull ibex]

Yeah

Unless gamefreak does something strange and changes it

[bold geode]

Ok
Cuz Annihilape probably got no shot in restricted

[dull ibex]

Speaking of dlc i don't get the hate for it

[gentle delta]

Restricteds probably September

[dull ibex]

It's more content and less money then 3rd versions

[bold geode]

September?

[gentle delta]

yeah

[dull ibex]

Yeah it's late in the year

[gentle delta]

They wont want to rush them into legality before Worlds

because GS Cup is a less fun viewing experience for casual players

[bold geode]

Well you see how they did this one so

[gentle delta]

not restricteds

viewer numbers show that people who arent actively into the circuit hate restricted formats a lot of the time

(while most players agree they're the healthiest format)

[bold geode]

Right
Idgaf

[gentle delta]

so for marketing purposes itll be most likely we see restricteds after worlds

so we dont have two worlds with them in a row

[bold geode]

As long as I can get content

[dull ibex]

I honestly think incin is going to be less of a probelm this gen

I think mane will stay the dominate force usage wise

it will probably go back up to 70 with restricted but that's more a symptom of restricted format

[fallen rivet]

all depends on what moves it gets

[dull ibex]

I dont imagine it gets anything new support wise

if it gets a new fancy offensive move maybe the sets diversify

[fallen rivet]

like if it loses parting shot then it's probs not gonna be as used

[gentle delta]

it wont

[dull ibex]

it will be pretty close to the same usage tbh

parting shot is huge dont get me wrong but it was also like 70 with uturn iirc

[gentle delta]

Nah with power creep where its at we're seeing a greater need for role compression than before

[fallen rivet]

very good point

[gentle delta]

I think Incin goes up in usage this gen

[bold geode]

Just shut up and gimme kitty

[gentle delta]

and you'll see more varieties of it like vest

[dull ibex]

Im excited for role compression

previous regs made me miss it alot

[fallen rivet]

what else will get role compression?

[dull ibex]

lando

[fallen rivet]

landoot

[dull ibex]

theres a few role compression mons I think

incin just compresses a bunch of them which is why its so used

[bold geode]

Landnootnoot

[dull ibex]

also its good typing

god i hope we rusty bottlecaps

imagine the ease of getting tr teams

[fallen rivet]

no kidding

[dull ibex]

oh yeah happy thanksgiving everyone

[feral ledge]

https://cut-explorer.stalruth.dev/international-latin-america this was shared in another server it’s great but doesn’t show the EV spread 😒

[fallen rivet]

Oh I used power items for the first time and it was kind of...theraputic for some reason

[feral ledge]

Thank you for the feedback. At first I didn’t know how to process it but after taking a series of losses I do need to rebuild my competitive team…

[gentle crag]

wascos1 has given 1 Gen Rep to mlbd

[chrome knot]

we gotta work on our descriptions

[feral ledge]

The team that got me to Master Ball rank isn’t going to cut it…

[dull ibex]

Usually you recreate the evs yourself i've used a few topcutting teams I just use whatever spreads are common atm

also tbh after playing with tera blast I dont not like head smash harc

one shoting hands is peak

[nocturne holly]

I have 19 from like two grinds

It’s pretty easy
Hard mode

with a group

[orchid falcon]

i wanna run a team with H braviary what should be its build?

was thinking giving it tinted lenses

[dull ibex]

Fair

[nocturne holly]

I think lorb the best item for havisry
Sheer force negates the recoil from it

[dapper crag]

Braviary-Hisui's moveset:

Physical Moves

Acrobatics, Aerial Ace, Assurance, Body Slam, Brave Bird, Close Combat, Crush Claw, Cut, Dual Wingbeat, Facade, Fly, Frustration, Fury Attack, Giga Impact, Metal Claw, Peck, Pluck, Retaliate, Return, Reversal, Rock Slide, Rock Smash, Rock Tomb, Secret Power, Shadow Claw, Sky Attack, Sky Drop, Slash, Steel Wing, Strength, Superpower, Take Down, Thrash, U-turn, Wing Attack, Zen Headbutt

Special Moves

Air Cutter, Air Slash, Dazzling Gleam, Esper Wing, Heat Wave, Hidden Power, Hurricane, Hyper Beam, Hyper Voice, Icy Wind, Night Shade, Psybeam, Psychic, Psyshock, Round, Shadow Ball, Snarl, Snore, Stored Power, Swift, Tera Blast, Vacuum Wave

Status Moves

Agility, Attract, Bulk Up, Calm Mind, Confide, Confuse Ray, Defog, Double Team, Endure, Helping Hand, Hone Claws, Leer, Protect, Psychic Terrain, Rain Dance, Rest, Roost, Scary Face, Sleep Talk, Substitute, Sunny Day, Swagger, Tailwind, Toxic, Whirlwind, Work Up

Notes

A move displayed with Bold text benefits from Same-Type Attack Bonus when used by Braviary-Hisui.

SableyeBot version 4.24.4

[nocturne holly]

Idk you could probably do tailwind, psychic, air slash/hurrixane, protect
With life orb sheer force

[dapper crag]

Pokémon No. 628: Braviary-Hisui

Types

Psychic/Flying

Abilities

Keen Eye, Sheer Force, Tinted Lens (Hidden)

HP/Atk/Def/SpA/SpD/Spe

110/83/70/112/70/65

Total

510

Base Species

Braviary

SableyeBot version 4.24.4

[nocturne holly]

Or ig you could run tinted lens

h bravosry just not good rn

[nocturne holly]

You ohko hands?

[dull ibex]

Tera fairy tera blast

One shots most hands I come across

[nocturne holly]

Damn what

Didn’t know that
I usually do bout 50-75%

and I have max atk

lemme calc that shit

252+ Atk Choice Band Tera Fairy Arcanine-Hisui Tera Blast vs. 156 HP / 0 Def Iron Hands: 194-230 (77.9 - 92.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

[orchid falcon]

sheer force doesnt negate Lorb recoil

[nocturne holly]

against tofus set it misses the ohko

[nocturne holly]

It does

[dapper crag]

Ability: Sheer Force

This Pokemon's attacks with secondary effects have their power multiplied by 1.3, but the secondary effects are removed. If a secondary effect was removed, it also removes the user's Life Orb recoil and Shell Bell recovery, and prevents the target's Anger Shell, Berserk, Color Change, Emergency Exit, Pickpocket, Wimp Out, Red Card, Eject Button, Kee Berry, and Maranga Berry from activating.

SableyeBot version 4.24.4

[nocturne holly]

@orchid falcon

[orchid falcon]

cool

[dull ibex]

Maybe it's with chien?

[nocturne holly]

What’s with chien?

[verbal kindle]

K9

[nocturne holly]

tf

[fallen rivet]

Alright I keep finding myself getting destroyed by rillaboom. How do I fix this? https://pokepast.es/14bf3baa4263658a

[next stump]

acrobatics roaring moon & Arcanine should be enough to manage it

your team does get wrecked by grassy glide though

something like Moon + Hands lead could be good

or add a Farigarif to deny the Grassy Glide

[heady onyx]

Don't they often end up in the same category, like bad mons don't get used right

[gentle delta]

Not even remotely close to true

[heady onyx]

Then when does it correlate with majority of mons ?

[gentle delta]

A lot of underused mons mostly suffer from not being splashable, not that they’re bad

Like there’s obviously bad mons like say, Meganium

But if you look at things like Hat, Glastrier, the less used paradoxes and legendaries, etc.

A lot of them can bring something to the table that other mons cant, the real question is whether that thing is what your team needs

Take, Thundurus-T as a recent example, top 8’d in Toronto

[heady onyx]

Makes sense, but the way smogon does their tiering it's more efficient. That's my singles background perspective, but I get that Doubles has more niche for specific roles like the Cottonee team with Boyt

[karmic temple]

https://pokepast.es/f4013e050a885b1b

I want to replace lando but don’t know who would be a good switch for it

[heady onyx]

why not give a shot to the incarnate variant, would give you a special attacker while not altering the typing

[gentle delta]

Singles has bans, doubles doesnt

That already complicates everything

[heady onyx]

yeah, it's a matter of perspective in the end i get what you say

I'm gonna toy with Brute Bonnet, looks promising if i can make a team around it. I like sunroom

[placid thorn]

Amen

[fallen rivet]

Oh wait that’s so smart

I’ll replace bundle with that

What set for it?

Would sap sipper work too to deny wood hammer?

[heady onyx]

oh yeah Farigiraf is a smart Pokemon

[heady onyx]

you lose Armor Tail then

[fallen rivet]

True

And that’s kind of important

[heady onyx]

That's what makes Farigiraf so appealing

without this, it's just a generic Indeedee

[fallen rivet]

So hh+tr+what?

[heady onyx]

probably psychic for consistent single target damage and dazzling gleam for nice aoe chunk

[fallen rivet]

Ok. And stat spreads?

[heady onyx]

https://www.munchstats.com/gen9vgc2023regulatione/1760/Farigiraf
have fun picking one tbh, I couldn't give you specifics for a Mon I don't use

[fallen rivet]

Cheers thanks @heady onyx

[gentle crag]

wafflefries.787b has given 1 Gen Rep to barbossavgc

[heady onyx]

you welcome, VGC is fun

[fallen rivet]

Indeed (I’m still minority annoyed at losing sneasler lol)

[near crag]

Hello, I'm having trouble on winning with this team, is there anything I could do to improve it? https://pokepast.es/c7856486cfce70ac

thanks

[heady onyx]

the team looks good imo

[fallen rivet]

What are you having trouble with specifically

[orchid falcon]

If a move has high crit does sheer force cancel it out?

[fallen rivet]

Because this looks pretty solid

[fallen rivet]

Iirc yes? Idk

[near crag]

I died counless times to sinescha and crescelia

separately

[heady onyx]

it's not a secondary effect, it's within the attack roll so no

[orchid falcon]

Ok

[heady onyx]

a crit is not happening after the move hits basically which is what an additional effect means for game mechanics

otherwise covert cloak would deny crits lol

[fallen rivet]

Ah makes sense

[heady onyx]

could try the choice scarf set on lando, eveyrone is running that

[fallen rivet]

I am also noticing that you have little special pressure. I’d switch urshifu out for a special attacker imo. Maybe imprison farigiraf

[heady onyx]

regieleki is special attacker

team that won worlds has 1 special attacker + amoonguss

so it's ok

[fallen rivet]

Ah nvm then

Still I think urshi doesn’t synergize completely. I may be incorrect with this

[heady onyx]

Urshifu + Chien-Pao/Amoonguss, good luck

can't protect unless you're very, very confident

[fallen rivet]

Good point

So other than the Landoot being scarfed, what changes should be made?

[heady onyx]

I don't think they need to make changes, this is very good team

[fallen rivet]

I see gotcha

Apologies I’m still new at this lol

[heady onyx]

team is super good, they probably need to play more games or find something different

[fallen rivet]

Makes sense Ty

[gentle crag]

wafflefries.787b has given 1 Gen Rep to barbossavgc

[heady onyx]

I'm new to VGC and I only play the same team xD

[fallen rivet]

lol same

I’ve tried trick room and it’s never worked yet

[heady onyx]

https://pokepast.es/4b3d5f86aa899b1c
this the team I built for switch. only thing I wanted was to use balance with trick room speed control to fuck tailwind spammer

I should correct the speed EV for shroom, I bred for 0 IV one

[dull ibex]

the tera's need work

specifically mane hands and shroom,

[fallen rivet]

Looks good otherwise

[heady onyx]

they're not the same on cart, i need to fix them

[dull ibex]

neat

if you want to do a bo1 or 2 for practice lmk

[heady onyx]

i practice on the ladder rn

trying to break rank 1000

[molten oasis]

Good luck!

Anyway what are y’all doing

[heady onyx]

this correct tera https://pokepast.es/9c760c4b7e235391

fire on shroom fairy on flutter

[molten oasis]

Electric hands?

Why do you have 17 ivs in speed on heatran

[heady onyx]

only one I had

[molten oasis]

Just, give it a bottle cap

[heady onyx]

no I'm trick room

[molten oasis]

This is a trick room team???

[heady onyx]

look the team xD

[molten oasis]

I am

[heady onyx]

shroom hands heatran

[molten oasis]

I do not see trick room archetype anywhere

Shroom hands and especially heatran does not establish trick room at all

[heady onyx]

so far it does for me

[molten oasis]

The ONLY thing saying this might be a tr team is mane having it

Otherwise it looks like balance

[heady onyx]

I use TR for speed control, it's not TR always

[molten oasis]

K then why do you not just do max speed ivs for heatran, you will lose the mirror

Every time

[heady onyx]

no

i do not see much teams using tr like this

[molten oasis]

Because

You don’t

Tr can for sure be used to counter tw

However

It having a tr mode does not mean you need to hurt your mons outside of tr

I think flutter is also a pretty bad tr user and only feels good in CTS cuz your opponent might not expect it

In OTS, it just dies before tr goes up

And it’s not consistent anyway

Mane is too frail, I think it wants to be dishing out damage much more

[heady onyx]

it dishes damage don't worry

[molten oasis]

I’m not, ok

It is booster spA

That’s fine

[heady onyx]

if I wanted more damage I wouldn't run bulky spread

[molten oasis]

Dude

[heady onyx]

I'd go specs or more offensive spread

[molten oasis]

Manes run bulky spreads like that ALL the time

WITH SPECS

without trick room

[heady onyx]

I hear lots of opinions on flutter mane very contested Mon

[molten oasis]

I still think mane is a bad tr setter since if that’s the goal, you want farigiraf or cresselia

From who

[heady onyx]

from the community

[molten oasis]

That doesn’t tell me anything

Did anyone like Prog tell you to run tr mane

[heady onyx]

what

[molten oasis]

Did a specific person say mane is good with tr

Or suggest it in the first place

[heady onyx]

It gets the move and I was looking for speed control

I made the team to suit my playstyle

[molten oasis]

You want speed control with mane you add icy wind and make it booster speed

That is how it does speed control

[heady onyx]

Good for you

Not how I choose to run it

[molten oasis]

Ok dude, I’m trying to help

You’re not listening

[heady onyx]

If I want to spam tailwind, I can run Tornadus

I prefer balance way of doing it and trick room been doing that for me

[molten oasis]

Ok Yk what

You’re right, you’re perfect, any advice I give is fucking pointless

Thanks, I’m out, I tried, you didn’t listen, good luck

[heady onyx]

demolishing the main goal of a team I made isn't helping me sorry if it wasn't clear

[molten oasis]

No no you’re correct, go have fun

I’m not putting in my input

[heady onyx]

you gave input but you missed trick room team 1st time, then you just demolish it

[molten oasis]

Because things can be a lot better

At first glance, this is not built to be a tr team it is more built for balance

Tr setters are much bulkier

Farigiraf and Cresselia are better trick room setters

[heady onyx]

that is hard tr i think

[molten oasis]

No, even in soft tr the setters are bulkier

Specially mane is plenty bulky but it can’t eat physical hits

Well

Mane doesn’t really run tr cuz it wants moonblast to pick up some crucial kos dazzling doesn’t

It rarely has room

If you want to go further into a tr mode

You want a more dedicated tr setter

Cress is a great Mon for balance and I think it would fit in well here

[heady onyx]

i dont like cress

[molten oasis]

Well that sucks, I don’t like hands and I use it

[heady onyx]

no I mean I don't like cress for this team

[molten oasis]

Why don’t you like cress

[heady onyx]

it doesn't fit what I wanted to do

[molten oasis]

…

Did you even try using it?

[heady onyx]

i know what it does

cress been around for a bit, not new Mon

[molten oasis]

Ok tf do you see in mane as a tr setter over something like cress

Mane sucks in tr

[heady onyx]

ok

[weak dune]

Anyone had any luck with Jolteon?

[molten oasis]

Jolteon isn’t very good rn

You would rather eleki or hands for electric coverage

Anyway

You wanted speed control

[bold geode]

Yeah no Jolteon lol

[molten oasis]

CRESS is a speed control Mon

[thick geyser]

How can i fix this team
https://pokepast.es/476a8fb99c9a67cf

[molten oasis]

Gholdengo would prefer a different Tera

Ideally dragon or water

And shadow ball over gleam

[bold geode]

Gholdengo is wasting EVs
Have to invest in 3 or 5 stats

[molten oasis]

You can also do a lot less spA evs to invest more heavy in bulk

As you’re np dengo

Sini oger torn dengo and heat are all wasting evs

I think harc would be a better fit over heat

[thick geyser]

Who

[molten oasis]

Hisuian arcanine

Harcanine

Harc

It is very strong in the meta right now

[thick geyser]

What move set i still want would u run

[molten oasis]

Hachikou (Arcanine-Hisui) @ Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 68 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 4 SpD / 180 Spe
Adamant Nature

• Flare Blitz
• Rock Slide
• Extreme Speed
• Tera Blast

[heady onyx]

https://www.munchstats.com/
I use this to check out movesets idea

[molten oasis]

Bulk is general

Ok

I still think, you should do icy win booster speed mane for speed control

Or add another Mon over something for a more supportive speed control Mon

Also a Mon being slow=/=tr Mon

Like dedicated tr Mon

[heady onyx]

that is an idea

[molten oasis]

Amoonguss and hands are great in tr

[heady onyx]

maybe for another team

[thick geyser]

I have sin fir that and to counter tr

[molten oasis]

Will you change anything if I suggest anything to improve the team

[molten oasis]

I wasn’t talking to ya about your team, my bad

[thick geyser]

Yea im changing now

Oh ok

[molten oasis]

Your team needs evs changed mostly

[heady onyx]

I will not change this team, I have been winning a lot with it and I'm very happy with the state it is

[thick geyser]

Ok

[bold geode]

What even is the team

[molten oasis]

https://pokepast.es/4b3d5f86aa899b1c

Btw I still think the speed ivs on hands and heat are really bad

You either do max or min

[bold geode]

Tf is with the random IVs

[molten oasis]

He thinks it’s a tr team

[bold geode]

God

[molten oasis]

Like, I see a tr mode

however heatran is not exactly meant for tr

[heady onyx]

This is current version https://pokepast.es/402de02ff1c95b32

[bold geode]

Barbossa I hate to say but
Saying Flutter Mane works in TR is like saying it snows on the sun

[molten oasis]

Neither is shifu

[bold geode]

Also Hands can do max speed IVs in TR

[molten oasis]

Would you mind if I adjusted some things in showdown and then sent you a paste?

[nocturne holly]

Not necessarily
On heat they’re decent to speed creep in tw and win the opposing heat mu
Hands spe is alr, good for the opposing hands FO battle

[molten oasis]

Really

17 speed ivs is shit

[bold geode]

The only one there you would even want 0 speed is shroom

[molten oasis]

In or out of tr

[nocturne holly]

oh

[bold geode]

Rest can be max

[nocturne holly]

didn’t check the ivs

Yea dragos right those speed ivs are goofy af

[bold geode]

Is the team winning? Sure. But does that mean the team is optimal? Not necessarily

[nocturne holly]

mb drago mistook ivs for evs

[thick geyser]

Harcine is wanna us willo wis

[molten oasis]

Yea

[heady onyx]

ain't no way I farm 0 speed EV Heatran on switch

[molten oasis]

You want willo on harc?

[bold geode]

It can
But it doesn't have to

[bold geode]

Lmao
Didn't even need to

[molten oasis]

Heatran doesn’t want 0 speed ivs in any world

[heady onyx]

I could do it for Hands

[thick geyser]

What set. Would u use with it

[molten oasis]

It wants max unless it’s on harc tr

[nocturne holly]

31 iv heat is not bad

tbh it’s preferred over 0, like drago said

[molten oasis]

Hachikou (Arcanine-Hisui) @ Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 68 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 4 SpD / 180 Spe
Adamant Nature

• Flare Blitz
• Rock Slide
• Extreme Speed
• Tera Blast
  This one for damage

Arcanine-Hisui @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 212 HP / 124 Atk / 4 Def / 100 SpD / 68 Spe
Adamant Nature

• Flare Blitz
• Rock Slide
• Will-O-Wisp
• Protect
  This one is more supportive

You pick the one you want

[bold geode]

Only thing that might even want 0 speed on your team is Amoongus
Rest can be max speed IV
You're not Hard TR, therefore hunting for 0 speed on stuff ain't it

Unless for SUPER niche circumstances which this team shouldn't need

Honestly here Mane doesn't even want TR in a slot because the only reason you'd play in TR with this team is if the opposing end clicks it

[heady onyx]

oh no it worked to punish opposing tailwind big time

[bold geode]

Unless you had Cress

Which you don't so

You have Heatran Hands and other stuff

Not that big of a deal

[nocturne holly]

How so lol?

[molten oasis]

@thick geyser https://pokepast.es/76926eedcbc7f920

[bold geode]

You position that one out to win

[molten oasis]

Evs are more optimized

[heady onyx]

they click tailwind, i click trick room

[bold geode]

You're running balance rn, which relies on board positioning and reading the board to play, not speed control usually

[molten oasis]

Shifu in this case wants Tera dark black glasses to get the most damage out of wicked blow

[nocturne holly]

like monke said, positioning the team is better imo

[heady onyx]

Yeah I position the team too

[molten oasis]

If you don’t like that you can go sash so it lives a hit from mane

[heady onyx]

I don't bring Flutter every game

[bold geode]

That's all you need

I'd you do it right, you don't need to click TR against TW

[molten oasis]

You can just push through it

I think tr is just not it on mane especially

[bold geode]

I know this, I played that exact six before

[molten oasis]

Hands legit is great into tw

[bold geode]

A lot have

[molten oasis]

And so is heatran

[nocturne holly]

hands feasts on tw

balance positions itself against the opponent to favorable board states

[heady onyx]

yeah I know what positioning is

[molten oasis]

That’s what this team does

[bold geode]

Wolfe brought that six to Pittsburgh and he played TR and TW out, never clicked any speed control instead of Icy Wind

Which Icy Wind Mane would be MAGNIFICENT here

[heady onyx]

good for Wolfey I like him great content, great player

[nocturne holly]

what do you wanna get out of this? Like everyone is giving you advice

[heady onyx]

I see one side you guys don't

I'm happy with the team

[nocturne holly]

Explain your side

[bold geode]

Like I'm sorry but imma be honest
What you got going isn't optimal
You're winning games, but you could be doing SO MUCH better another way

Drago do I bring the God in?

[molten oasis]

I already mentioned it to him

[nocturne holly]

like monke has said multiple times, sure the teams getting you wins, but is it optimized to the best it can be? No

And like icy wind over tr is a very small change

[molten oasis]

Which would be a lot better

[marble coral]

That’s fine but historically trick room flutter is bad
Icy wind + good positioning is much better & more reliable

[bold geode]

The only reason you should ever even put TR on Mane is if your team is weak to TR, then you click it to reset TR

[molten oasis]

Your team laughs at most tr teams

[nocturne holly]

Cigar brother 😈😈

[bold geode]

It does laugh at it
Heatran
Hands
AMOONGUS

[marble coral]

Hiya

[nocturne holly]

amoonguss fucking FEASTS on tr

[heady onyx]

why couldn't I position without that ? this is very black or white mindset imo

[molten oasis]

HUH?

[bold geode]

Your mind is black and white

Fuck it, I'm gone

[nocturne holly]

🫠

[nocturne holly]

Can you? Yes
Is it optimized? No

[fallen rivet]

There are two cigars here I’m quite confused

[chrome knot]

@bold geode

[molten oasis]

They’re different people

[marble coral]

I’m not saying you can’t position it, im saying you’re putting yourself in a bad spot for no reason when other methods have been proven more reliable.

[molten oasis]

Icy wind mane is also really good into opposing balance

[marble coral]

I’m the OG spicy cigar

[fallen rivet]

O I see

[nocturne holly]

I’m 2.0
Fucking better

jk love you

[marble coral]

It’s like Publix vs Walmart

[heady onyx]

ok

[nocturne holly]

yea and I’m legit gucci

[marble coral]

I got a pair of Gucci flip flops recently and they are fucking ass

[nocturne holly]

bruh
How much were they

I’m rolling with my off brand crocs

[heady onyx]

i see little answers vs shroom under TR on my side so far

[molten oasis]

Tera grass heatran

[marble coral]

Sorry what’s your question here

[molten oasis]

Is great into amoonguss

[nocturne holly]

What’s the team?

[heady onyx]

not a question, my analysis so far

[nocturne holly]

I saw it, can you just send paste again

[molten oasis]

https://pokepast.es/402de02ff1c95b32

[marble coral]

Ok, your analysis what is it

[heady onyx]

little answer to shroom spamming spore under TR

[nocturne holly]

yea Tera grass heat

[molten oasis]

Tera grass heat and your amoonguss

[heady onyx]

I'm not answering myself xD

[molten oasis]

Why?

That’s how you handle it in this case

[heady onyx]

ima click side spore on my own grass heatran yup

[molten oasis]

Dude

[nocturne holly]

Tera grass heat next to amoonguss fucks shroom

[molten oasis]

You have amoonguss

Obviously don’t spore your own Pokémon how dumb do you think we are?

[heady onyx]

yeah that is why you don't do the same gameplan vs every team imo

[nocturne holly]

amoonguss and Heat are IMMUNE to opposing amoonguss
It cant redirect or spore or do shit

[molten oasis]

[marble coral]

Ok what about it I don’t get what you are saying here

[heady onyx]

most teams I face have little to no answer into shroom spamming spore under TR

[nocturne holly]

That’s good?

[fallen rivet]

Ok my younger brothers are asking me to teach them vgc principles for the dlc what do?

[molten oasis]

That’s good

[nocturne holly]

isn’t that good?

[molten oasis]

For you especially

[bold geode]

Doge

[tired atlas]

Okay sorry I haven't been paying attention in here, why not Icy Wind Flutter over TR?

[thick geyser]

@molten oasis for urshifu y protect and not detect

[marble coral]

Ehhhh good players will have answers to trick room or ways to handle amoongus before it becomes a problem

[molten oasis]

He won’t optimize the team cuz he’s winning with it

[nocturne holly]

it should be detect for the niche case opponent has imprison protect

[bold geode]

THANK YOU

[gentle crag]

dollarmonke has given 1 Gen Rep to crest_of_thunders

[molten oasis]

It’s kinda niche but yes imprison pretty much

[fallen rivet]

oh that’s why detect is there on all the urshifu

[molten oasis]

No way you click detect that much in a match

[bold geode]

I'm gonna bash my head against wall

[molten oasis]

That you need protect

[bold geode]

Cuz people be trippin

[fallen rivet]

He do be using head smash though 😳

[nocturne holly]

fr

[thick geyser]

Doesn't detect stop the urshi mirror

[molten oasis]

No

[bold geode]

I'm stubborn cuz I got that Rock Head

[molten oasis]

Detect is just fancier protect

[nocturne holly]

rock head your way into making good pictures

[fallen rivet]

Same though

[molten oasis]

Urshi mirror is just positional based

[bold geode]

Fuck you I made better ones

[nocturne holly]

That landot pic 👁️

[bold geode]

I got a better one

[molten oasis]

The heatran “yo u got games on ur phone”

[heady onyx]

lol

[molten oasis]

Anyway

Barbossa it’s just optimization so the team is better

[fallen rivet]

This is my favorite picture of lando-t

[molten oasis]

If you really won’t change anything there’s just nothing we can do if you don’t want ti listen

[molten oasis]

This is great

[fallen rivet]

Thanks. I stole it off of Reddit somewhere

[nocturne holly]

You should see @bold geode picture 😔

[heady onyx]

maybe next month, so far I'm happy with it

[molten oasis]

NEXT, ok

[heady onyx]

I did answer you with the same answer like 40 minutes ago

[molten oasis]

Ok, have fun with an underoptimized team

[bold geode]

Juan

[heady onyx]

''underoptimized''

[fallen rivet]

Juan

[fallen rivet]

Alternatively, caption it with

“Man”

[bold geode]

YES

[molten oasis]

“Good team”

[fallen rivet]

Moving on, my brothers are asking that I teach them doubles principles for the dlc. Do I just battle them on showdown or

[heady onyx]

i think so yeah

[molten oasis]

Good for you

[bold geode]

https://pokepast.es/0bbc643111334bdf
Guys my team is underoptimized

[molten oasis]

Fr

[heady onyx]

thank you

[mighty stump]

Oh

I see

Same discussion

[molten oasis]

Hi tofu

Hru

[bold geode]

Hi Tofu
Wanna see some pictures I took for blog

[tired atlas]

https://tenor.com/view/the-lion-king-lion-king-monkey-talking-rafiki-gif-17580008

[karmic temple]

What do we like as our harc spread again 🤭

[molten oasis]

Depends what you want for harc

[karmic temple]

Band

[fallen rivet]

I did max speed and attack for my Tera band set

[molten oasis]

Hachikou (Arcanine-Hisui) @ Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 68 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 4 SpD / 180 Spe
Adamant Nature

• Flare Blitz
• Rock Slide
• Extreme Speed
• Tera Blast
  This one for damage

Arcanine-Hisui @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Intimidate
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 212 HP / 124 Atk / 4 Def / 100 SpD / 68 Spe
Adamant Nature

• Flare Blitz
• Rock Slide
• Will-O-Wisp
• Protect
  This one is more supportive

[bold geode]

68/252+/4/0/4/180
Outspeeds Adamant Dnite

[molten oasis]

The Tera is usually fairy

I have water for my team specifically

[mighty stump]

I saw one

[bold geode]

I DMed current ones

[mighty stump]

Nice

[fallen rivet]

I’m tempted to run a Tera dragon on showdown for the funny one day

[molten oasis]

Of harc?

[mighty stump]

@bold geode

[karmic temple]

Welp guess it’s time to breed a shiny harc now 😭 bye see yall in 2 months

[molten oasis]

You don’t need it to be shiny

I respect the grind tho

[bold geode]

You want to know the teachings

There's a few that are good
Dragon Harc is amazing defensively
Dragon Hands is good for FWG resist, although can be scary against Pao and Mane
Dragon Empoleon wasn't bad
Dragon Kingambit is also neat
Those are the ones I've tried so far although other good ones are Gholdengo FOR SURE, Tornadus, and Indeedee in some few cases, although I like Fairy Deedee more

[fallen rivet]

Yos

[molten oasis]

Tea

Yea, if you do dragon

Psychic fangs head smash or iron head over Tera blast

[fallen rivet]

Dragon mane /s

[bold geode]

Though if you run Dragon Harc, don't do Tera Blast
You can get technical with it
Head Smash while not as great as for sure usable
Psychic Fangs, Iron Head, and Will O Wisp is niches

[bold geode]

Why did I let you in my shrine

[fallen rivet]

Sorry

[bold geode]

Lol

[fallen rivet]

What item on the dragon harc

[molten oasis]

Lmao

That picture is awesome

[bold geode]

Choice Band, Sitrus
Depends on what you wanna do

[fallen rivet]

Cool thanks

[molten oasis]

There is this for sets

[bold geode]

Yup

[fallen rivet]

Thanks to you both!

[molten oasis]

I’ve used both a lot they are good

[nocturne holly]

banded harc best harc

it does 75% to hands

[fallen rivet]

Banded harc is nutty

[molten oasis]

Fr

[nocturne holly]

Tera fairy blast is great on it

[fallen rivet]

I rlly hope it can stay with incin’s arrival

[molten oasis]

I doubt it’s going anywhere

[heady onyx]

I'm excited for incin

looks so good for role compression

typing looks good into flutter mane, fire dark is great vs both mane STAB

[dapper crag]

incin gonna take over like always, im hyped but I hope the stuff thats added balances out torn urshifu

[bold geode]

Hands

Hands stay winning

[nocturne holly]

hands is the fucking goat

[heady onyx]

ya true hands is so bulky while dishing out considerable damage with great utility

doesn't need an ability xD

[dapper crag]

hands is good, torn urshifu still at the top

[heady onyx]

hands sort of checks them both with that sweet electric typing

[dapper crag]

i just hate playing vs urshifu, anyways, was building a chi-yu balance team and was hping someone could gimme some 6th poke suggestions

currently I got torn, SS urshifu, chi yu, bundle, flutter

[heady onyx]

the shroom !

so great to shut down any bs

[next stump]

^ it’s not a balance team without amoonguss or some other defensive backbone

[dapper crag]

i kinda like the shroom

okay but why shroom over monke

[bold geode]

Dillon how are you

[next stump]

good 🙂

how are you

[bold geode]

Need something defensive and supportive, which Amoongus does
Rillaboom is more offensive
Only other things is it provides terrain and FO support

[bold geode]

Me good
Working on shit for blog

Hopefully once it's done I can get some self promotion (gotta get role first)

[molten oasis]

You’re going for comp helper?

[bold geode]

Which I plan on asking for the role AFTER the blogpost is done, that way it's not just an empty blog page when they look at it

[bold geode]

I have been doing that
But I'm also gonna ask for self promotion role

That way I know for sure I can post blog in rentals as well as pedal it out a bit

[heady onyx]

why the role if anyone can give out help if I may ask ? just for different color ?

[dapper crag]

just calc'd it, amoongus defensive set, aka no spa atk investment can 87 - 104% RS urshifu with 44 hp 140 spdef, without beads of ruin. since im running chi-yu would it be viable to run Leaf storm for coverage with rage powder spore protect? was thinking amoongus already has incentive to switch out with regenerator

[charred saddle]

you could ig, but lots of Uturn Urhshifu's now. and going up against dark wont help much

[bold geode]

Competitive helper is staff role and they help out
Tofu for example is one of those people and he built back this comp chat with his two hands
Self promotion is just so you can promote in the server

[charred saddle]

its a cool tech, but idk if it will help much. pollen puff feels more consistent for support

[heady onyx]

you can slot leaf storm + pollen puff imo

ditch protect

[dapper crag]

plus it still gets beads buff, was thinking that but then id give up something

ill have to see what i like and dont like, LS probably gimmicky but ill test it with chi yu

[charred saddle]

idk about ditching prottect. theres a lot more scenarios where protecting amoonguss feels better than clicking leaf storm

[molten oasis]

Well

Pollen puff spore and rage powder are nonegotiable

[dapper crag]

leaf storm also ohkos bulky blood ursa with beads support

Leaf Storm Amoonguss is gigachad on non-grass team

and amoongus would go before it in TR, long story short i think LS would be gimmicky at best but i gotta try it ya know?

it if works for ya it's great

good thing about VGC is that experimenting with surprises can yield to great success

[charred saddle]

go ahead, i didnt say its bad i just liked pollen puff more haha

and under TR it can deal a pretty significant damage

so go ahead

[molten oasis]

…

[dapper crag]

i mean i only got the idea cause leaf storm amoongus was run in earlier sets of SV and i think its not bad with beads support, i think its only that good under TR tho. and with my team im not setting my own tr just using it as a counter

[nocturne holly]

Lemme handle this, I’m fucking married to the shroom

[molten oasis]

I have more experience than you

In general

[dapper crag]

lol

[nocturne holly]

let the ring speak

I bet I’ve used more moonguss than you

[fallen rivet]

A full team consisting of torn hands rilla urshi incin and Harc

[molten oasis]

Yes but I still think my point stands

[nocturne holly]

Yes it does I just wanted to say that

[heady onyx]

just cut protect for leaf storm

[nocturne holly]

if you want leaf storm you have to give up protect

[molten oasis]

Yep

[heady onyx]

I'm gonna try it on my team

that actually looks dope good suggestion @dapper crag

[nocturne holly]

And even then leaf storm is only used for shifu nd squishy targets

[fallen rivet]

I wish bronnet had a better type

[nocturne holly]

it’s not worth beads of ruin
It’s a support Mon, not an attacker

[dapper crag]

yea i mean i think spore and rage powder are too valuable to give up

[gentle delta]

Decided to pop in to see if I could sway an argument

On the subject of Leaf Storm shroom, it fucks. I approve.

[bold geode]

Lmao

[molten oasis]

Yea it can go crazy

[dapper crag]

i cooked something with my coach yesterday, typing isn't as bad as you think

[fallen rivet]

Do tell

[dapper crag]

i mean with beads support i think you could do good on ladder but idk how well open team sheet

[bold geode]

Hey Jay
See you're back

[nocturne holly]

fr

[dapper crag]

dm how it feels, ima try it too

[dapper crag]

replaced shroom on my balance team with bbonnet

[fallen rivet]

I see. What was the set

[dapper crag]

I need to try three sets since Justin isn't sure about which one is better. rocky helmet loaded dice energy booster

[fallen rivet]

Mhmm

[dapper crag]

what are you EB for?

Seed Bomb or Bullet Seed, always Sucker Punch Spore and either Protect/Rage Powder

[fallen rivet]

What ev spread

[dapper crag]

Brute Bonnet @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Protosynthesis
Level: 50
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 172 HP / 180 Atk / 148 Def / 4 SpD / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature

• Spore
• Sucker Punch
• Seed Bomb
• Protect

i feel like losing regenerator hurts sm tho thats why I dont like him as much

[molten oasis]

That’s a big issue with it, and the typing is bad for a more supportive Mon

It’s not awful tho

[dapper crag]

Yeah you don't run it for being a support

[molten oasis]

You’re immune to taunt and other spore

Well yea, I’ve just seen it on the supportive side more often

[dapper crag]

Hello ? Do I know you ? never seen you here

[molten oasis]

That’s monke

[dapper crag]

You've seen Brute Bonnet ?

[molten oasis]

When I did, in reg b

It was more supportive

[dapper crag]

the set is also using torn + sunny day

and also psychic type so you can switch into an expanding force

to get attack boost

[molten oasis]

Nowadays ya you do attack for bonnet

[dapper crag]

ahhhhh

Nowadays ? It's nowhere to be seen according to my coach lol

[bold geode]

I've never seen you in my life man idk

[dapper crag]

i think if youre setting sun for yourself then the loaded dice set doesnt look bad, although ive never thought those sets were better on other mons, referring to loaded dice bax vs swords dance bax

thing is you kill what you need to impact with Grass move through non proto seed bomb

so loaded dice really is just a luxury set

[fallen rivet]

Not to be confused with a luxray set

[dapper crag]

yea idk the calcs but thats what i was thinking

but I need to test it, been working like crazy past 3 days and I have next few days off

growth + sun sounds cool but gimmicky

I decayed like crazy so not too pressured into running meta stuff xD

was looking at BB and only set up move he has is growth

[molten oasis]

BB?

[fallen rivet]

Brute bonnet

[molten oasis]

Oh lol

[fallen rivet]

Beast ball

Bold nature beast ball brute bonnet

Could bb work on an indeedeerouge sun team?

[molten oasis]

BNBBBB

[fallen rivet]

Or nah

[molten oasis]

Yea

[fallen rivet]

May try that

[molten oasis]

It could work

You just don’t do sucker punch

[fallen rivet]

Right

But indeedee, arma, tork, hlilligant, BB, and what

Harc?

[dapper crag]

can you guys throw flutter mane sets at me?

[molten oasis]

I don’t have one

[fallen rivet]

What kind of sets

[molten oasis]

Mane is the 1 Mon I exclusively don’t run

[dapper crag]

just looking for inspiration

[molten oasis]

It is so fucking boring

[dapper crag]

any set any spread

[fallen rivet]

In worlds there was a max def max hp Tera water rocky helmet to spite urshi

[molten oasis]

[dapper crag]

cause it can do anything

[fallen rivet]

But really the best way is some variation of specs/life orb/be

If it ain’t broke don’t fix it or something idk

[dapper crag]

you wanna run perish trap? tr? offensive specs? speed booster? tanky substitute CM?

[fallen rivet]

Oh yeah perish trap is a thing too

Forgor

[dapper crag]

don't try out perish trap if you wanna remain sane lol

it looks hard to use

[molten oasis]

Perish trap isn’t even good rn

Especially with the rise of gholdengo

[dapper crag]

it's not good for us bad players

[molten oasis]

Who’s IMMUNE to it

[charred saddle]

anyone knows what happened? game didnt update after that match

no win or lose changes

[fallen rivet]

Gholdengo is just a menace

[dapper crag]

it's only good in the hands of really good players