Sega Saturn

[errant crown]

I also really wanna play Tokimeki Memorial: Forever With You

[dusty shale]

Does that have a translation?

I recommend watching the show it's based on first, if you do.

[errant crown]

Too bad its “spaghetti code” makes it really difficult to hack a translation in

[errant crown]

Noted

The Super Famicom has an English translation, but according to Tim Rogers of Action Button, it’s not an ideal way to play the game.

He described it being like watching a movie on mute, with closed captions on

[hardy lodge]

Any news on the smt soul hacker translation on saturn? Latest update I could find was from march this year.

[dusty shale]

That's a full run of Bulk Slash done on MiSTer.

No issues, as far as I can tell.

There was this one part where I took off 90% of the stage 5 boss' health in under a second which caused it to chug, but I'm inclined to believe that would've happened on real hardware.

[errant crown]

Last update I think is that video they posted on YouTube.

It would be cool to see that in English on Saturn, but I actually more want to see the first Devil Summoner game translated, since that game has never gotten a translation.

[pallid pier]

yea

[hardy lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/why-not-both-why-not-take-both-gif-11478682

[errant crown]

True, I would just like to see Devil Summoner translated first

Once the English translation of Soul Hackers comes to Saturn, I’m definitely playing it

Probably the most underrated SMT game imo

[hardy lodge]

It's also insane to me that smt1(ios port doesn't count) and smt2 never got an official translation.

[ripe valley]

I've changed the classification of Gokujou Parodius issue with the KONAMI sign as a long-standing bug.
EDIT : At least, the bug is there since 6 months (or more).

[ripe valley]

For Akumajou Dracula X / SOTN, the Glaring Cloth is flickering during a frame also since at least 6 months (I tried with the original and the translation).
We really need some captures from an original system, maybe it's just a bug on the game originally.

[lofty spire]

Akumajou Dracula X Gekka no Yasokyouku, not to be confused with Akumajou Dracula X Chi no Rondo (Rondo of Blood) which is also not to be confused with Castlevania Dracula X, the SNES port of Rondo of Blood

they made 3 games called Dracula X lmao

[hardy lodge]

The triple x of castlevanias

[dusty shale]

Reminds me of how Sega Saturn Magazine (UK) approximated the title as 'Castlevania X'.

(I have no explanation for the weird trace job they did on the SOTN render of Maria)

[rich violet]

@old pasture Has a weird sound issue in Virtua Fighter 2 on dual ram here: https://www.youtube.com/live/jFyWimguoJo?si=ek2ebPo1fyOT9ike&t=537

[old pasture]

The sound issue was there on my dual RAM MiSTer in both the single and dual version of the core.

[ripe valley]

Have you tried also with the build shared by srg320 ?

That one.

[old pasture]

I only used the one posted in the unstable channel.

[old pasture]

Thanks for sharing this, but it's back to grind tomorrow, so likely no more content until next weekend.

[ripe valley]

No problem.

[old pasture]

Always appreciate you Zet

[ripe valley]

I'm doing also some tests on my side, if I could create a maintenance core tomorrow for Single RAM users.
Taking part of the 10-08-2024 core and cherry-picking parts of the 10-30-2024 for creating something more useful for them.

[old pasture]

Sounds good

[ripe valley]

Won't be perfect, but could have some of the fixes without breaking totally DoA and some 3D fighting games.

Experience seems to be worse for Single RAM users at the moment.

[old pasture]

Cool, I really enjoy the Saturn core on the MiSTer.

[ripe valley]

For the SEGA Ages & Virtua On regressions, if I add the changes to the YGR019 to the previous version of the core (10-08-2024), these games are breaking once more (like on the issue log).
For Sonic Jam manuals, a change in the VDP2 seems to be the problem.
For Grandia on the intro, it's not the VDP chips, neither the YGR019 when I tested them one by one (and combined). Maybe the SCU and/or the SCSP at fault.

[ancient surge]

I think this is just a classic case of new code breaking old code. I think all we can do is wait for srg to make the changes himself.

[ripe valley]

I'm just curious.

[proper prism]

I would capture some video from my Saturn, but my console has been been having audio issues. I don't know what's wrong with my Saturn.

[hearty marten]

Three steps forward and one step back 🙂

[muted cradle]

Am I back?

😃

[ripe valley]

I tried some builds between yesterday and today, mixing various versions of the code and getting everything working together.
Without complete success, but I've shared some of my findings.
I could reverse and fix some issues with the Grandia intro and the SEGA Ages games, but not the 3D fighters.

srg320 will be faster than me for fixing those issues, like he always does.

[hearty marten]

Always appreciate you, @ripe valley 🙏

[celest lake]

Big plus one to that

[small gust]

So with the grandia flickering issue closed on github, I wonder if it's time to just get a second ram module. 🤔
Its probably much more cost and time effective than to get and test alot of different sdcards.

[thorn pagoda]

isn't that only closed for dualram ?

[ancient surge]

Yeah that is the tricky part. Some of the issues are technically fixed on the dual RAM build, but not the single RAM build.

[thorn pagoda]

i don't think that issue should of been closed really, not until srg320 calls it anyway

[ancient surge]

Since the majority of MiSTer users only have a single RAM module, in practice this means the issue isn't really fixed.

[stiff patrol]

but he said it cant be fixed without dual ram

so it has to be closed

[mortal mist]

In the topic of Grandia he certainly did not declare it , unless in another place

[ancient surge]

"The problem can't be fixed, therefore the problem is fixed."

[rich violet]

The readme says:

Note: Dual SDRAM modules is recommended for better compatibility.
Also srg320 explicitly said this: https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Saturn_MiSTer/issues/136#issuecomment-2449438355 4 days ago

[thorn pagoda]

yeah but he wasn't referring to grandia there

and grandia actually used to work fine

[rich violet]

True!

[wise brook]

the original grandia issue tab was a long string of speculation, dead ends, potential (but non repeatable) solutions and other messy comments.

it is now fixed for the cost of $20 ram stick from Taki.

if someone wants to make a issue tab for all the games specially broken on single-ram, which looks to be a fundamentally irresolvable issue, that’s cool.

maybe when the dual ram version reaches 1.0, their can be a “90% compatible” single-ram unofficial core for those who need to stick with their current setup

[ancient surge]

I'm guessing it was an issue with the RAM, since apparently the recent dual RAM build improved it.

[small gust]

What still baffles me though is that even though dual ram fixes the issue (I assume for everyone) is the sdcard bit of the issue, that the game can work without flicker and jumping buildings with the right single ram setup.

It would be easer to grasp if the issue appeared on every single ram setup.

[wise brook]

we will never likely get the definitive answer

my guess, timing edge-cases caused by tiny fluctuations in the pairing of the ram-de10/alt-sdcard

but the bandaid for this whole situation has been pulled off.
more ram bandwidth, more accurate timings.
whatever inaccurate older part of the architecture (that was good enough for a less complete core) couldn’t bear the weight of further expansion and is now gone.

onward and upward, i say

[small gust]

I don't even have a basic understanding of how it actually works.
But my mind can't help but not draw a parallels to the issue of the n64 core that arose on some mister pi's.
Where as I understood it, the pcb lanes differed and made the timings shift a few nanoseconds and messed up when in a cycle the sampling of the ram was done. (I want to note that, I might have gotten that totally wrong)

[burnt matrix]

Never had the flickering Grandia texture on my single sdram

[radiant karma]

Which version should become the official one? Maybe both versions will be downloaded with update all.

[wise brook]

unlikely, even the older Mega Drive core is intended to be phased out

it’ll be like the turbo core.

enjoy, but don’t go reporting issues with it

i could be wrong of course, but i figure the wind is blowing this way

[stiff patrol]

apart from the tiny use case of streaming to HDMI and to a CRT everybody can still use Analog with a dual ram

[solemn grove]

yeah it's just a super limited port relative to the primary versions. missing a lot of features and content

[warped saddle]

(after searching for the magical dac that doesn't fuck up colors AND resolution switching)

[solemn grove]

i feel like i would be pretty surprised if the saturn core officially became dual-ram-only given how it's only edge cases that differ and the install base isn't close to all dual-ram setups

[stiff patrol]

only because there hasnt be a driver to do so yet

[thorn pagoda]

you can always play grandia back on the old build where it worked i guess?

it did entirely work back then iirc

[small gust]

It doesn't run at full speed though?, no?.

[stiff patrol]

think it did

[thorn pagoda]

can't remember tbh

[stiff patrol]

The core is in development we do know that currently 2 or 3 of the fighters will require dual ram

anything else is probably a regression

[thorn pagoda]

which are all 480i60 fps games too i think?

i.e the most timing demanding games imaginable

[radiant karma]

As developers get into more advanced arcade boards, I guess we will end up seeing a wider dual ram user base. Seems Raki will attempt a cv1000 core and has mentioned it would need dual sdram on mister. I really don't think it's much of an issue. Platforms evolve. Just like mister started with 32mb sdram but the neogeo core made 128mb a new "standard".

[drowsy hull]

Is the nightly from 30th Oct. the one which fixed grandia with dual ram?

[radiant karma]

yep

[drowsy hull]

looks like it, all good now with old 128+random amazon cheap 32 combo

all in sync now

[ripe valley]

Good news everyone.
Most of the regressions seem to be related to the YGR019 (IC controlling the CD access) changes.

On my compile tests, with a mix between the 10-08-2024 and the 10-30-2024 versions, by sacrificing part of the accuracy changes against the real HW.
I can fix Virtual On & can't see slowdowns on DoA/Fighters Megamix/Fighting Vipers/VF2 on the Dual RAM build.
And only partially fix the SEGA Ages games : SFX on Space Harrier and After Burner II, roads on OutRun.

There maybe an SCU or/and SCSP bug somewhere else.

Just to say that performance on those games could be improved/fixed.

We will see how srg320 will do the magic once more.

[errant crown]

Yeah, finding the right dac is tough

[visual grove]

I have 3 dacs now, none are perfect. Either color issue, res switch issue, or slight interference in ypbpr for one. Analog IO pro has none of these problems, that combined with the fact having dual output can be handy since not all aspects of mister like scripts are particularly crt friendly and not all crts can sync all outputs makes it so there are definite downsides to digital IO + DAC. That being said I do have two dual ram capable setups now with Mistercade V2 so its nice to have options. Mistercade V2 is a scenario where I don't care about any of that since most arcade games don't res switch and the cabinets are RGB

[ripe valley]

I've seen an issue on the option screen of Battle Garegga, some missing part on sprites.
Issue added on the log.

[wise brook]

it seems that the retrocastle dac will be perfect for my setup

[burnt matrix]

Analog IO Pro is divine

[burnt matrix]

He will because he’s buoyed by an incredible community.

[quick sorrel]

Sorry, fixed what issue?

[errant crown]

Texture flickering, apparently

[lofty spire]

i think Grandia is just haunted on mister

it works for some and doesn't work for others

[errant crown]

Could have to do with what type of RAM modules people have?

Like V1.2 or 1.3 or whatever

[ancient surge]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[errant crown]

I remember hearing early in the Saturn core’s development, that certain games only worked somewhat well if you had a specific RAM module

[lofty spire]

i think i have the latest RAM module and it still gives me texture flickering. i heard certain SD cards might cause it

though it might not be just one thing, a combination of factors might be at play

to quote a youtube video game reviewer i like to watch "troubleshooting computer stuff is like fixing your garage door and then your microwave catches fire"

[errant crown]

lmao who is this

[quick sorrel]

This is true more or less.
If I had the Grandia issue, it would be maddening.

[pine bobcat]

Have you tried the misteraddons I/O direct board?
https://misteraddons.com/products/mister-fpga-io-direct

Does that suffer from any of the 3 issues you mentioned?

[visual grove]

Nope, don’t have that one

[pine bobcat]

I'm considering picking one up now that dual RAM seems confirmed as required

[burnt matrix]

You know what version of Grandia doesn’t have flickering textures?

The PS1 version

[lofty spire]

🅱️laystation...

[quick sorrel]

👏
Jokes aside, is either one the better one to play? I’ve yet to play it

[burnt matrix]

Saturn is better one to play but it’s not important. Play either and you’re in for a great time!

[wise brook]

what y’all think.
should we have srg320 chasing ghosts he couldn’t recreate?

for an issue that is actually fixed with the right ram setup?

[mortal mist]

You can also look at it from the other side. This is information for users that Grandia works with dualsdram. I would keep it open for informational purposes.

[wise brook]

i think if it the issue is to be open, it should be in a single new page without all of the speculation.

none of it ever lead to any fixes.

although i could rename it for clarity

[mortal mist]

The choice is yours. For me, it doesn't really matter if this is open or not. However, maybe someone will look for such information. I don't assume that everyone follows the development of this core as intensively as we do here.

I also never had a problem that people don't close their bug reports on github. If srg320 wants to he will just close them.

[ripe valley]

For me, it's just a force of habit.
And reading more faster what we need to check on the core.

And I've already seen people misusing the issue log for explaining that the MiSTer is 'imperfect' (contrary to the Analog products, those fanboys).

"So much issues opened, boooh!"

[mortal mist]

They will always find something to write about it , no matter what it is. If someone doesn't like MiSTer, nothing will change that. On the other hand, I don't see after a thousand sold MISTer Pi or Qmtech that people somehow care about it.

AND yes , all in all nothing is perfect. MiSTer isn't either.

It should also all be about having fun 🙂

[wise brook]

i can understand why game developers are so secretive.

normies just can’t think beyond the perceived

[soft goblet]

To be fair, you get 2 kinds of developers. The ones that are over the moon when you send them comprehensive bug reports cause they really want to have the best product possible, and the ones that take a bug report as a personal attack on their skill. After hiring you to write bug reports, mind.

[wise brook]

i’m being overwhelmed by the urge to talk philosophy

if nothing is perfect, then even that statement can’t be

[mortal mist]

yeah, true

Also, I will end here and wish everyone a nice day and a good time with MiSTer without taking everything too seriously.

[wise brook]

today might just be the most crazy day on the internet

looking forward to playing some sakura wars

[ancient surge]

kohran li best girl

[wise brook]

https://tenor.com/view/sakura-wars-sakura-taisen-sumire-kanzaki-ohoho-gif-27116215

[burnt matrix]

No and no. SRG is the one who determines what bugs he wants to fix, not us.

[burnt matrix]

💯

[minor shale]

Not to mention, what is the "right RAM setup"? Did I miss that memo? Also hi @wise brook -- it me. 🙂

[burnt matrix]

The “right ram setup” is whatever gets Sega Rally working.

[minor shale]

I lost count of how many "ghosts" were fixed on the N64 core during development, and I'm still affected by the issue, so I kindly asked that it remain open. If srg wants to wipe his hands clean of this one that's his call.

[gloomy hedge]

the G in SRG stands for Gangsta

the boss does what the boss wants

https://tenor.com/view/outkast-gangsta-ghetto-boss-gif-18347480

[sudden pumice]

A lot of folks like the Saturn version better as it has better water effects and textures. I personally prefer the PS1 version though because the voiceover is what I grew up with and so what Im nostalgic for. Really all personal preference. Honestly I would love the Saturn version with PS1 voiceovers dubbed in. Blasphemy for most, but that would be my ultimate version

[minor shale]

Yeah I didn't play any until recently so I didn't have the nostalgia -- I went with the Saturn + English text patch. I compared the two quite a bit before making that decision and thought I'd enjoy it more.

They're subtle differences in some cases but they're things I notice and appreciate.

[proper prism]

We're supposed to close the bug reports? I thought the project author was supposed to close them. I'm sorry. I've never used GitHub before. I'm not really familiar with the way things work. I'll look at the GitHub when I get home later. Sorry, y'all.

[mortal mist]

if the problem has been solved then yes

[unkempt oar]

As one who played the PS1 version when it came out as well I still prefer the Saturn version. It looks nicer and I have a preference for Japanese dubs. If I never hear "oh flame burn 'em!" again it'll be too soon... But play either way! It's a great game.

The combat in Grandia is my favorite RPG combat overall.

[minor shale]

I think it's a bit more nuanced if multiple people have also hit the issue, but in general I agree.

Sometimes I close issues, sometimes I don't. It's contextual and not objectively one way or the other.

[pearl harbor]

Robby dropping truth bombs. 💣

[pearl harbor]

Or you can go full chaos and play the HD remaster with the forced smear filter that isn't even uniformly applied to all sprites and introduced new bugs!

[dusty shale]

Is there a general game compatibility list for the Saturn core?

[hearty marten]

Nope. It’s still in active development so things are changing rapidly. Generally it’s pretty accurate for most things, but there’s the odd issue. You can check the list of issues on GitHub, but otherwise I’d assume games are fine

(This is assuming you use a recent “unstable” core, but even the most recent stable one isn’t that bad now, to be fair)

[gloomy hedge]

Would rather have a SD ram compatibility list

(gotem)

(robby don't ban me)

[hearty marten]

Just buy two of the most recent revisions 😉

[dusty shale]

I currently use the most stable core, or at least whatever version's provided through update_all.

With all the recent back and forth regarding single RAM vs dual RAM performance, it left me more confused as to where the Saturn core currently stands in terms of accuracy and performance.

[wise brook]

hello joe from game sack

[dusty shale]

I'm... not a fan of Game Sack.

[wise brook]

https://tenor.com/view/game-sack-gamesack-nes-zapper-gif-24302706

[celest lake]

to be honest, the latest unstable introduced a lot of regressions so the stable may be the best way to go?

unless you pull an older unstable

[hearty marten]

I dunno. Is there anything that doesn’t work for you on the stable build? If so, try a newer unstable. Dual SDRAM is best. The most recent unstable introduced a few regressions but a few fighting games are better on dual. A few more bug fixes and I expect those regressions to go away, but unless you have a problem with a specific game you wanna play, it kinda feels academic to me

[dusty shale]

I haven't played enough of it to really know what does and doesn't work.

I was playing Burning Rangers on it earlier, but that game barely runs on real hardware anyway.

[hearty marten]

Almost everything runs fine

At least everything that’s been tested

The GitHub issue list is the canonical source and it’s pretty short

[dusty shale]

So everything outside of that list is presumed to work as intended?

[hearty marten]

Yep

[dusty shale]

Oh, well, in that case, unless something major changes, I can probably get on just fine with single RAM.

[hearty marten]

Single ram is good unless you like fighters 🙂

[dusty shale]

I also own a Saturn and a Satiator anyway, for what it's worth.

[hearty marten]

Sorry if I appear dismissive. It’s just that I think people often obsess over compatibility lists and forget to play games 😄

[dusty shale]

Maybe I'd be more hung up on those were it not for the 2012 ports.

[dusty shale]

No, I appreciate your straightforward answers. It's demystified a lot of the discussion I saw that I lacked context for. Thank you.

[hearty marten]

No problem at all. Happy to (try and) help

This channel is generally full of testers, so you find people obsessing (in a good way) over tiny details to try and help srg320 by providing him info. If you look in here without that context I think it’s easy to assume lots of things are broken, when really it’s not 🙂

[dusty shale]

Well, I love the Saturn, so provided I have the time, I'm happy to test things if need be.

[hearty marten]

I’m sure srg320 appreciates as many eyes and ears as possible

[dusty shale]

Is there a way to see if anything in particular needs testing (other than looking at the list of GitHub issues for things that haven't been commented on in a while)?

[hearty marten]

@ripe valley is probably the most informed to comment on where suspected issues might lie, or which parts of the library haven’t been tested as much

[ripe valley]

Not available at the moment, will read and reply later.
Thanks for the consideration.

[dusty shale]

Absolutely fine, there's no hurry.

[ripe valley]

I've not tested the whole Mahjong games apart Idol Janshi Suchie-Pai II, nor the others testers here too.

All major titles have been quite tested and even finished for some of them.
We aren't immune to finding bugs that we may have missed, but the issue log list seems quite exhaustive these days.

Some games won't work, like Lunar MPEG-ban, as it needs a special card to be simulated too and not available on the MiSTer (no more FPGA space)
Tamagotchi Park can't work as it needs a special cartridge (already dumped) from the publisher (the core can't load/save from an external cart at the moment, it should be added at a later time).

[dusty shale]

Speaking of mahjong, do you know if Jantei Battle Cos-Player has been tested, out of curiosity? I own a physical copy of that one.

[ripe valley]

Not tested on my list, so you're free to go if you want to help.

[dusty shale]

Ok!

Which version of the core should I be on when testing? @ripe valley

[ripe valley]

The last unstable one (10-30-2024).

#unstable-nightlies message

I suppose you are on a Single RAM system.

[mossy crystal]

https://x.com/matto_bii/status/1839379461185417317

What the heck, who approved to put such vulgarity in a video game of a kids property?

It's like if the french localization of the Barbie Princess and the Pauper Videogame randomly put explicit viagra jokes.

Matt B (@matto_bii) on X

@burntends2 They'd make Iris crack sexual jokes all the time because WD thought that kind of shit was *hilarious*

Twitter · Sep 26, 2024, 7:00 PM

[burnt matrix]

Is that the official Working Designs localization?

If so then I just assume it was the late 90s and anime was really very niche in the US, mainly watched by young adults. Game translations were also still in its infancy and wasn’t run as professionally as they are today.

Working Designs had a habit of trying to infuse pop culture humor into their games. For some people the jokes landed, for others it didn’t, but they are definitely a product of their time. It’s interesting for that if nothing else.

[tawny forge]

Reminded of this one, for the PSX 🤣 #1046940919607345272 message

[quick sorrel]

What game is that?

[errant crown]

Don’t forget this one

[errant crown]

Magic Knight Rayearth. It’s based on a magical girl animé.

The English localization of the game was so delayed because of higher-ups at Sega of America. Bernie Stolar, the then-president, really did not want 2D games or RPG’s coming overseas. MKR came out in Japan in 1995, and didn’t come out in the US until 1998. There are some stories from Victor Ireland, the head of Working Designs, about how he had to fight for the game to come out.

[burnt matrix]

New Saturn translation - #games-and-patches message

[quick sorrel]

More or less erotic translation? 🤔
(Is it a better translation?)

[burnt matrix]

huh lol

It’s a picross game

[celest lake]

I don't see how that matters...........

[warped saddle]

they made mahjong erotic, they can make picross erotic

[open swan]

I believe

Peepeecross

[burnt matrix]

Don’t you dare sully my beloved picross, that shit is sacred and I won’t stand for it!

[hallow fossil]

Wake me up when I can play strip Scabble on a geriatric console

[vernal sun]

What is the original text? I always see all these poor translation examples of Working Designs games but I never see what they would normally translate to in English

[gloomy hedge]

Poke A Man picross exists

[burnt matrix]

You might be interested in these patches which retranslate the games and undo a lot of difficulty changes - http://stargood.org/unworked/mkr.php

[quick sorrel]

Oh my bad, I thought the new translation was the Magic Knight one
Besides, Konami makes everything erotic now
(I just want a new 2D Castlevania)

[next bronze]

reminds me of the German localization of Link's Awakening that had references to condoms, though they were removed from the color version

[untold heath]

Unworked Designs patches do not alter the text in games. They only revert game mechanics changes.

[quick sorrel]

Are they literal direct translations?

[errant crown]

Yeah, they just fix the messed up rebalancing WD did in their localizations

[burnt matrix]

Oops, I misread the list of changes

Guy was describing the regional changes and I thought it was his changes lol

Working Designs, ladies and gentlemen

[quick sorrel]

It’s quite timely, even in the 90s 🤪

[errant crown]

Jesus, I completely forgot about one

I love domestic violence jokes

[dusty shale]

I am.

[mossy crystal]

Kinda bizzare that Rayearth was a massive childhood classic hit in multiple countries in Europe, South America, Asia etc. back in the 90s but is just merely obscure in the US.

[mossy crystal]

Rayearth was made for like 1st Graders. Jeeez what is this

[proper prism]

I don't know if it's been fixed. I haven't had the chance to look. I kind of assumed that keeping tabs on bugs and fixing bugs would fall to the creator. I didn't know I was supposed to keep up on it. I've never used Github before. I'm sorry. I'll look at it when I get the chance.

[mortal mist]

You have nothing to apologize for. If you are not up to date probably the author (if he feels like it) will close these bug reports when they are fixed. There is nothing to stress about here. The important thing is to report these bugs.

[wild maple]

hi is there a performance difference on the Saturn core with double ram? thanks

[ancient surge]

The dual RAM build as of the 10-30-2024 build date improves performance in certain games. Fighting Vipers, Fighters Megamix, and Dead or Alive are some examples.

[tawny forge]

https://www.reddit.com/r/SegaSaturn/comments/rytb6m/slowdown_on_fighters_megamix_and_fighting_vipers/?rdt=34778

It seems it’s also crappy slow on real hardware

[sacred goblet]

Happy saturn day 😉

[ancient surge]

There was always some slowdown in the more intense edge cases, but the RAM issue with the core made it significantly worse.

[burnt matrix]

[wise brook]

added for clarity

[ancient surge]

Sounds like a lot of regressions are being fixed.

[burnt matrix]

Oh nice, that’s what I was waiting for

[tawny forge]

Time to make my MiSTer Pi a dual ram setup now

[hearty marten]

Retroid MiSTer, you mean?

[visual grove]

Retroid Remake

tee hee

[ancient surge]

They finally fixed the roads!

[high bramble]

It's funny. When I was younger (in my 20s) playing a lot of Working Designs games for the first time on Sega CD, etc., all those pop culture references didn't bother me. Playing those games 20-30 years later, I see those references and just think "Ugh... really?"

It should be clarified that Unworked Designs patches do alter text in several games (mixed case fonts tweaked, spelling/grammar changes, etc.), but there is no re-translation.

[hearty marten]

A bit like watching an old episode of family guy

[ripe valley]

I was testing many obscure JP games when I saw the update.

Will continue later.

[burnt matrix]

Yeah I don't think it would've bothered me either. Even if I knew what was going on I would've rather have had that instead of no translated game lol.

[burnt matrix]

You're a legend, thank you!

[ripe valley]

Someone must test the Super Real Mahjong games...

Great order of sacrifice towards panty flashing.

[vernal sun]

What more is there to test outside of Cho Aniki?

Best Japanese Saturn game of all time!

[ripe valley]

About half of the library.
And some titles not inside the Redump DB + Korean releases.

So far, I've only found 2 issues in the VDP2 with some unreleased games.

And tested 57 games since yesterday.
Simple protocol, I'm playing each game for 10 mins + watching the intro completely.

Old method but the best, for me.

Will ask the acess to the compatibility DB later when I will achieve other tests.

[ripe valley]

Quite a clean-up on the issue log.

[ancient surge]

I only dabbled with the new build, but so far the experience has been pretty excellent.

The regressions have been fixed so a lot of the games run pretty flawlessly now.

At some point I'll need to dig deeper to check if there are maybe obscure bugs much later in the games.

After all it would suck if you played an RPG and there was a game breaking bug that prevented progress.

[ripe valley]

I've chosen to close the issue on Dead or Alive, as with the last Dual RAM build, the core seems to react as the real system as long I've compared side by side.

[ancient surge]

I think the only "major" issue left is the RTC resetting to the default settings every time there is a cold reboot or the MiSTer being turned off.

[soft goblet]

Will there be support for save carts eventually? Or is that not planned? Games like Shining Force 3 run out really quick

[burnt matrix]

That picross game is pretty cool

[tiny prairie]

is it placebo effect or is exhumed also a lot nicer to play?

I know it had slowdown on real hardware but it was like playing through sludge with how laggy the controls got, feels improved?

[sacred goblet]

What about grandia texture flickering?

[mortal mist]

Fixed with dualsdram

I assume it's a timing issue

Works well for everyone ( probably) with dualsdram

Apparently with single sdram it can work better or worse for some users

[burnt matrix]

I should check again, where is it exactly? On that airship thing?

[hearty marten]

That’s amazing news! 🎉

[tiny prairie]

not sure if this was reported, issue with Die Hard Arcade random 3d elements disappearing on dual sdram core is fixed too

random thoughts/findings...
fighters megamix plays really well now it seems.
I am not having any luck getting Die Hard Trilogy to load with the latest sdram core for some reason? just black screen

[pallid pier]

Fighters Megamix is still wierd with the intro movie, but not Fighting Vipers

I don't get it

and it's just random if it's going to work on Fighters Megamix

[ripe valley]

Die Hard Trilogy have some detection issues on somes BIOSes with the region detection.

I had to modify the original game header for it to work on my Hi-Saturn region-free BIOS.

[wise brook]

retrocastle dual ram setup complete

[ripe valley]

So far, I've not seen any new issues or regressions on my side.
I'm testing some JP games collection inside the S & T letters.
And I can confirm, Suiko Enbu - Fuuun Saiki (Japan) & Striker '96 (Japan) work better in BIN/CUE rather than CHD.

[tiny prairie]

Interesting, I'll look into this

[pearl harbor]

It's Saturnday!?

[hearty marten]

So pending anything new that anyone finds, would it be fair to say that this seems like this is the “best” core to date? (Fixed all the regressions in the previous version, but also includes the improvements).

[pearl harbor]

I knew srg would come through to fix the regressions quickly. He's always on top of that. 💪

[radiant karma]

It has even improved Dead or Alive, what little slowdown remained with the last update is now gone. Haven't tested the rest of the 480i fighters yet.

[hearty marten]

srg320 never fails to impress

[ancient surge]

Wonder if there are any plans to have a stable build in update_all in the future.

A lot has changed over the months and some people are probably not aware of it.

[hearty marten]

I think that would be beneficial

[radiant karma]

Maybe we get both single and double sdram cores. Like Megadrive and Genesis. With the option to filter one.

[hearty marten]

Previous ones were 5 and 3 months apart, and a little over 4 months since the last one - so we might be “due” a new stable build. But perhaps srg320 has more stuff he wants to work on first

[hearty marten]

I suspect single will remain the default

[stiff patrol]

I suspect double to be default since its superior

[ripe valley]

I think we should test the core for at least 2-3 days.
If nothing serious is found during time, maybe push it as the new stable one.

[hearty marten]

I would have thought that, but I guess it depends what srg320 thinks. Everyone can use single, but only a few can use dual

[stiff patrol]

and if its default more people will go for a dual setup which will lead to better cores. Same way Neo geo led to 128mb being default

[hearty marten]

I’m willing to be wrong, but I can’t see it happening 🙂

[stiff patrol]

same was said about 32 meg > 128mb for neo geo

[hearty marten]

But did that ever require a separate build?

[stiff patrol]

no

[hearty marten]

There ya go then 😉

[ripe valley]

I've requested an editor role on the compatibility list, so I could update and add my findings with the current core.

It's time to step up our game.

[mortal mist]

access granted master Zet 🙂

[wise brook]

the 480i on sonic jam seems to be uniquely…. inverted?

have to get right up in their to show it but yeah

huh

the playback doesn’t show it

ah, discord must cap it at 30fps

[errant crown]

Yeah. I know the ones for Lunar 1 and 2 on the Sega CD replace the all-caps text with caps and lower-case.

[minor shale]

Doesn't seem to have improved any for me, oh well.

[minor shale]

I provided a save file and videos in town right next to a room where I can 100% repro it, I put it in the GitHub issue that was closed.
https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Saturn_MiSTer/issues/210#issuecomment-2308982564

[ripe valley]

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Saturn_MiSTer/issues/161

I've left some notes here months ago.

[ripe valley]

Yeay, 2% more of the whole library tested.
Waves flag
🇯🇵

[pearl harbor]

I thankfully don't seem to have the flicking texture issue in Grandia. Though I hadn't tested the game in a long time, so I don't know if I ever had it. There is slowdown though.

[errant crown]

https://tenor.com/view/sonic-3d-blast-flicky-flickies-flicky's-island-gif-11167397233981269602

[ripe valley]

I need to restest Teitoku no Ketsudan II.
I can't boot it on the last core (maybe it was never working on the core either).

[thick oriole]

So, skimming the discussion, it sounds like the speed issues in certain games won't be possible to fix in single-RAM configs?

[stiff patrol]

that is what SRG says

[lone mural]

a lot of slowdowns with the unstable core

fighter's megamix, dead or alive

[ripe valley]

If it's on the single SDRAM build, that's 'normal' now.

Those games will work only with a dual RAM build.

I need to check Sakura Taisen - Jouki Radio Show (Japan) (Disc 1) (Yuugi-ban) too.
The core refuses to load it, but the second disc works [(Disc 2) (Kayou-ban].

[mortal mist]

Same for me

[sudden tusk]

NEW BUILD !

https://tenor.com/view/freaked-out-excited-what-freaked-out-gif-5796912

[tawny forge]

Where?

[ripe valley]

I've updated quite a bit the compatibility list with my tests from today (day off).

62 new tested games, 51 updated, 4 new entries.
From 45% to now 49% of the library tested.

[errant crown]

#unstable-nightlies

[errant crown]

Anyone have an idea why I can’t seem to launch any games on the new core?

I just get a black screen. Once, Burning Rangers booted up, but it froze during the opening FMV

The Spmc controller test rom gives me an orange screen

Oh whoops. I think I need to update the MiSTer main. Just a sec.

Nope. Still black screen.

[celest lake]

Power supply?

[errant crown]

Could that be an issue?

I’m using a Trio (I think?)

From Zerohimself IIRC

[woeful quarry]

Maybe you’re using the wrong rbf for your ram configuration?

[errant crown]

I have dual ram, both rbf’s behave the same

Another question, is the Saturn home menu supposed to not show up when you boot up the core?

Because the home menu isn’t showing at all, either

[woeful quarry]

Is your tv on? I’m out of ideas

[mortal mist]

no , only bios

[ripe valley]

Logic Puzzle Rainbow Town ?

[radiant karma]

You might not have the correct bios.

[river wing]

That does both VGA and HDMI, right? I have mine on the way too!

[tawny forge]

Did you flip the switch on the de10 nano that’s required for dual ram setups?

[mortal mist]

Not even the single sdram version works for him

[tawny forge]

I would ask him to provide the md5 of the MiSTer main binary, the RBF and the bios files

[mortal mist]

maybe filezilla attack 😛

[ripe valley]

Space Jam seems to have regressed.

I can't go into the first mini-game and the counter is stuck at 59 secs.

[mortal mist]

still on the list 😛

[ripe valley]

It was working before with another issue, it was freezing during the main basket ball game.

So something else broke with that game.

[ripe valley]

Devil Summoner issue should be closed now.
It was so tough to understand that game, so much kanji that I've not even mastered.
And the user explained so badly on the original report.

[hearty marten]

“Game broken. Make game work”

[ripe valley]

Something like that.
It took 6 months to understand and reproduce the issue.

srg320 was also lost, like me.

BTW, when testing 'Shin Kaitei Gunkan: Koutetsu no Kodoku', I've seen a strange line on the bottom of the screen when you need to choose the difficulty.
It's an original game bug (and mentioned it on the list).

[ancient surge]

Instructions not clear, threw game into wood chipper.

[naive whale]

did you jiggle the handle?

[hearty marten]

I took the sdram out and blew on it

That normally works, right?

[burnt matrix]

Yeah!

[sudden tusk]

New build worth it ?

[ripe valley]

Oh yeah.

From my current tests, very solid release.

Nobody sane would want to play Space Jam too.

[sudden tusk]

Cool!

[lavish laurel]

At the beginning of Panzer Dragoon in the opening cut scene, does anyone else see the text caption a little corrupted on the top? Happens on the latest core (single and double sdram), and I saw it on the previous core, and the 10/3 core.

Not sure if that happens on original hardware too.

[ripe valley]

Maybe something overlooked.

[gloomy hedge]

do you want me to check

if no one confirms I can fire up the saturn

[lavish laurel]

It’s very minor I’ve only seen it on the text in the beginning of the cutscene, I took a video but it really doesn’t show the flickering correctly

[naive whale]

ok core vid tonight at 4 but no more cores this week! Its my birthday soon lol

give me the weekend off 🤣

[ripe valley]

No.

[ancient surge]

If I wasn't busy right now, I could easily check the issue and record my findings.

(Damn car repairs.)

[ripe valley]

I'm not available at the moment.
I let the others test it.

[gloomy hedge]

your pvm be lookin like mine

[ripe valley]

I want one of these 'babies'.

[gloomy hedge]

yeah mine is a 14, 600 liner

I bought it from awbacon

[ripe valley]

But no more space.

[visual grove]

So all the final slowdowns are fixed if you dual ram?

[lavish laurel]

Lol nice it’s a 14-L2 I love it, really took the mister setup to the next level

[gloomy hedge]

literal twins

hi five

[naive whale]

THIEF

you mugged me and took that

[gloomy hedge]

well dont walk down the street with pvms

not in the hood

https://tenor.com/view/darkwing-duck-grin-smirk-evil-laugh-gif-11983688

[hearty marten]

I have it on the PSX core anyway and it’s awful 😂

[soft goblet]

hmm.. virtual cop freezes with a black screen after the AM2 logo if you leave it running at the title screen for a while, on Saturn_unstable_20241106_125057

[hearty marten]

Did he meet you in an alleyway wearing a trench coat?

[gloomy hedge]

no I had the trenchcoat he was just walking to his car

I also had a pipe under my trenchcoat, James Sunderland style

[hearty marten]

Walking to his car carrying a CRT on his shoulder, mumbling “MiSTer is not a cult. MiSTer is not a cult”

[gloomy hedge]

it was really odd he was whistling " I've been workin on the railroad "

[ripe valley]

For Panzer Dragoon, I can't statute as it seems to work on my LCD screen & OLED 4k one.
But it flickers with some CRT for some other users.

[ancient surge]

Is this another RAM situation?

[ripe valley]

Sync on TV for me.

We could send the video to srg320 through an opened issue.

Ok for Virtua Cop, can reproduce the issue.

[ancient surge]

Oh I could do that. I'll just need to set everything up first.

[ripe valley]

Okay, I let you the Panzer Dragoon issue.
And I'm taking the Virtua Cop one.

[ancient surge]

I see the flickering on my end. Now I just need to record it and post it on Streamable like what I typically do.

https://streamable.com/6062n1

[ripe valley]

Quite visible on your video.

[ancient surge]

I'll file the issue.

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Saturn_MiSTer/issues/280

[dusty shale]

Sorry to ask: how do I install an unstable nightly version of a core onto my MiSTer? I've only ever used update_all.

[ancient surge]

You just take the file and put it into a folder, either the _Console folder or create a separate folder like "_Unstable" if you want it organized.

[dusty shale]

Ah, so I can have multiple versions of a system's core on my MiSTer at once?

[ancient surge]

Yes, there shouldn't be any clashing with the different builds. It should recognize the settings, games folder, etc. with no issues.

[dusty shale]

Fantastic. Thank you!

One 'game' I don't see listed at all on the MiSTer Saturn testing Google Sheet is Yoshiyuki Sadamoto Illustrations.

I have a physical copy of that, so I can test that as well and add it to the list.

Same as above applies to Techno Motor.

Vatlva and Digital Dance Mix Vol. 1 Namie Amuro are listed, but haven't been tested. I can test that.

Adding Jantei Battle Cos-Player, which I mentioned the other day, makes five games for me to test.

The only one I suspect having any real issues is Digital Dance Mix, since it's an AM2 game with 3D character models.

I should also make note that Dragon Ball Z: Idainaru Dragon Ball Densetsu was released in mainland Europe (predominantly France) as Dragon Ball Z: The Legend, so it should be marked as not region exclusive.

(Am I allowed to edit this document?)

[celest lake]

Another thing you can do, Indigo, is install Porkchop's unstable updater script. This will download all the latest unstable cores for any projects that wanted to be included. The only downside is that you're going to get a lot of cores that have since been released to stable (like a menu core from 2023). It will put them in their own "Unstable" folder, though https://github.com/misteraddons/mister_unstable_updater_scripts

[dusty shale]

That's handy. Thank you!

[green swift]

On the new unstable core, can anyone test Guardian Heroes? I get a black screen just after the first boss when the sword gets electrified and the gold skeleton dude comes out of the ground. It's been about 5 mins now and it's still on the black screen. OSD still works. I see that it is not on the issues tracker.

[dusty shale]

Single or dual RAM?

[ripe valley]

I forgot to change that this morning, thanks for the reminder.

The compatibility list was for games when it started, so bonus discs and non-game were excluded.
I'm trying to add them back when possible as they could be handy for searching some issues remaining.

Since two days, I'm testing the S & T letters on the JP library.

So, if you are faster, you can try to test & report back on :
Digital Dance Mix Vol. 1 Namie Amuro
Techno Motor
Jantei Battle Cos-Player
Vatlva
Yoshiyuki Sadamoto Illustrations

[dusty shale]

Will do!

[ancient surge]

Yeah when I skim the library, I also try to account the games that aren't really "games". Stuff like the "omake" discs that come with bonus content come to mind.

[dusty shale]

Jantei itself comes with a second 'making of' disc.

Digital Dance Mix is a hard no on Single RAM. The characters don't move at all, but poor Namie's mouth still animates.

I'll film it in a moment.

[green swift]

Single. Thanks!

[tawny forge]

How good/worthy are the games that require dual sdram?

[radiant karma]

I did play using the dual sdram build and have no issues getting past that part.

[dusty shale]

(ignore the sound of the actual Saturn in the background and me quickly turning the volume down)

filming real hardware next

(flashing image warning)

[ripe valley]

I've opened the issue to the log.

[ripe valley]

Works fine on my Dual RAM system.

[dusty shale]

Thank you. I'll test the Sing It and Presents modes, but Sing It is basically just Digital Dance mode but with karaoke.

Minor issue with the menu (videos to follow).

(Saturn)

(MiSTer)

That background pixelation effect doesn't work.

So Namie does move here.

Will test further to see if it's based on mode, song, outfit, background, or something unknown.

[ripe valley]

Okay, I've opened a second issue on the log, will update later with your findings and uploading videos if necessary.

[dusty shale]

@ripe valley I've figured it out. It's the backgrounds that are causing the issue. Namie dances just fine with the plain white background, but any of the other stage options (in either Digital Dance or Sing It mode) will cause Namie (and background dancers depending on stage) to remain stuck in her starting pose, and for the music to keep looping the first few seconds or so.

All that's left now are the minigames.

The minigames, sound test, and Namie's profile all display correctly.

There's no 3D elements in any of that, so I didn't expect any issues.

However, since the main game modes only work with only one of the stage options, I wouldn't consider Digital Dance Mix Vol. 1 Namie Amuro playable currently.

If anyone has a dual RAM setup and is able to test this, please let me know.

[tawny compass]

I've been testing the last 3 single RAM unstables (20241008, 20241030 and 20241106) and here's what I've seen so far with 3D fighters:

• DOA - never noticed slowdowns on 20241008, on 20241030 there are some slowdowns when the combo counter appears or when a character wakes up from a knockdown, on 20241106 seems to run fine with no slowdowns.

• Fighting Megamix - some sporadic slowdowns on walled stages on 20241008, on 20241030 every match runs on slowmo except for replays and on 20241106 walled stages run on slowmo except for replays, non-walled stages seem to run fine.

• Fighting Vipers - basically the same as Fighters Megamix since they share the same engine.

[dusty shale]

One game of mahjong later...

Based on one game of mahjong's worth of play, Jantei Battle Cos-Player runs with no issue. It's basically all 2D sprites and FMVs.

Testing Jantei's bonus disc now, which appears to be entirely an FMV documentary.

[ancient surge]

These girls have tree trunk necks.

[ripe valley]

Shinrei Jusatsushi Tarōmaru have regressed between last June and now, the crash is there once more after the boat scene/boss.
And quite a crash, with hissing sound and the two VDP chips going bananas.

@dusty shale Added to the list for your tests of today.

[dusty shale]

Thank you. Testing Techno Motor now.

Techno Motor is seemingly entirely 2D assets, so it runs fine.

[ancient surge]

Oh by the way, I did test out Vatlva earlier just on a whim. I didn't notice anything strange in particular.

I might double check just in case there is an obscure bug I didn't notice.

[dusty shale]

Oh, nice!

Vatlva is really fun.

[dusty shale]

Yoshiyuki Sadamoto Illustrations works with no issues. It's just an image and video gallery, really.

[ripe valley]

~~BTW, the game was canceled some days before the launch in Europe.~~EDIT : PS1 version, not the Saturn one.

[dusty shale]

Was it? I've seen used copies for sale online.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/235814776180?_skw=dragon+ball+z+the+legend+saturn

Here's one.

[ripe valley]

I was mixing up with the PS1 version, mea culpa.

[dusty shale]

I always did wonder why Europe got it on Saturn but not PS1.

Well, that's my Saturn testing pretty much done.

(at least in terms of games I own physical copies of that I can cross reference)

[ripe valley]

Thanks for the help.

[dusty shale]

You're very welcome!

[ripe valley]

We are passing the 51% of the whole game library tested on the system today.

6% done in 2 and half days; that was something physically (and doing tests at the same time on a single & dual RAM).
Even for me after years of experience beta testing SW emulators.

[naive whale]

Saturnday on #share-media

[dusty shale]

Congratulations!

[naive whale]

Impressive numbers

[errant crown]

Okay, I found the problem as to why my Saturn core would’t launch any games

The Saturn core, no matter what version, for some reason now won’t function when I have my SNAC device plugged in

Anyone have an idea why SNAC being plugged in just stops the core from working?

The BIOS won’t even appear

But, it works perfectly fine when I boot the core without SNAC plugged in to that USB port

Tested both my regular SNAX and my SNAX64, and with both, the core will work fine with no controllers plugged in, but won’t work if I have any controllers plugged in.

[hallow fossil]

What PSU you using? The stock one that came with the DE-10 Nano?

[tawny forge]

The snac adapter is probably in short circuit

[errant crown]

Hmm, lemme try another adapter I have

[errant crown]

Using a Trio, I think that’s the name

[errant crown]

Thank you

This was the problem

Wonder how the hell it short-circuited

Well, into the garbage bin, I guess. I’ll get another adapter soon.

Okay, it turns out it’s something even more odd. Both my adapters work perfecrly fine with my 2D pad. The 3D pad causes it to crash.

[celest lake]

That’s because the 3D pad is affront to God

[errant crown]

OK. I fixed it.

I detached and reattached the cord connector

[tawny forge]

Geez

[errant crown]

There must’ve been dust or something that messed up the connection

[errant crown]

https://tenor.com/view/you-take-that-back-take-that-back-take-it-back-gif-26506942

Real talk, though, the 3D Pad is the only way I can play NiGHTS into Dreams. The circular motions just feel natural in a way no other analog stick can touch imo.

It’s honestly one of my favorite controllers.

[bleak escarp]

I will second the 3D pad is THE controller but it fucked me up getting my first one realizing it's a proto Dreamcast controller

[celest lake]

we have strayed too far from the light

we deserve punishment

[bleak escarp]

Nah, but I am also a GCN controller hater

[errant crown]

OOF

If the Gamecube controller had a better right analog stick and D-pad, it would probably be my favorite controller

[ancient surge]

Think I found a bug with Idol Janshi Suchie-Pai Secret Album.

Game crashed when I went past the title screen.

It's not a fluke either; every time I restarted and tried again it would always crash in the same spot.

https://streamable.com/lzm3au

[celest lake]

More like not ok

[naive whale]

Does anyone have a completed save for Burning Rangers?

I want to capture something for a test but I apparently reformatted the card I had the save on

[quick sorrel]

Gamefaqs has saves still doesn’t it?

[edgy hollow]

Haven't tested it yet

[naive whale]

Didn’t seem like they have any

[quick sorrel]

Too bad. They used to.
Surely someone here does. 🤞

[naive whale]

Saturn saves are always few and far between compared to PS1 and N64

[quick sorrel]

Outside Japan? Yeah…

[ancient surge]

Okay so I found a strange bug with Keiou Yuugekitai - Okiraku Tamatebako

The game seems to have an issue with a variable memory bug of sorts, where I get different results depending on if I start fresh from a cold reboot or restart in the core itself. The opening movie for Keio Flying Squadron is a good example of what I'm talking about.

Here's what happens when I try to play the movie after a cold reboot.

https://streamable.com/13ibrb

Here's what happens after I restart the core itself.

https://streamable.com/ez8rhb

[visual grove]

I kept waiting for the beat to drop

[ripe valley]

I'm stepping down for some days, urgent health matter.
BRB.

[ancient surge]

Get well soon!

[gloomy hedge]

have a good recovery

[cunning citrus]

Back then my friend had a Shinobi Legions disc that would lock on a video after the second or third stage, I think it was damage on the disc. I could skip it and the game would run all other videos ok. The audio also would start looping, but with a longer loop than the footage.

[ancient surge]

So maybe an issue with how the game files are read on the core? Not sure.

It's pretty consistent and this is the only title as far as I know with this issue. Maybe I might try a bin/cue file to see if it makes any difference.

[pastel basalt]

Something seems off with the interlacing on Asuka 120%, especially in menus

Can anyone confirm?

[hallow fossil]

Has anyone raised an issue, or let srg320 know, about older ram sticks no longer working with the latest dual ram core?

It was investigated and discussed a week or so back but I am wondering if this information made it back to him

[celest lake]

I thought that SRG released a version that worked with the older sticks? Maybe it didn't get a new version with the latest fixes

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Saturn_MiSTer/issues/259#issuecomment-2447931077 this build

[ancient surge]

He recently overhauled how the RAM works, so it's possible that was reversed.

[hallow fossil]

Cool, so issue was raised, that's brilliant

[errant crown]

Also PSA: the PAL version of Legions has an entirely different soundtrack composed by Richard Jacques (Sonic 3D Blast on Saturn, Sonic R, Metropolis Street Racing). There’s a mod that puts it into the NTSC version.

[cunning citrus]

The disc I played that had damage back then was an original North America copy, I enjoy that soundtrack because of Nostalgia, played that version a lot and all.

I got that modified version on my mister, amazing soundtrack too! Thanks for the PSA anyways.

[errant crown]

Cool

[uneven pine]

My retrobit Saturn doesn’t register dpad up and right in the core but input test is perfect

Is this a thing?

It’s fine everything else

[errant crown]

SNAC or just USB connected?

[tawny forge]

Just remap it again from the main menu

It’s probably using the xinput VID/PID which is clashing with some existing configuration

[uneven pine]

Usb a 2.4ghz wireless receiver

[uneven pine]

Yeah didnt seem to work. It thinks d up is confirm or sth

But only in games idk

Weird bug

[tawny forge]

Did you also try remapping in the core?

[dusty shale]

Has there been any update on the MiSTer (non-core) issue that prevents L and R from being recognised when input type is set to 3D Pad?

NiGHTS is harder to play as a result.

[brisk ice]

I think i have the same pb with Sega Rally (with the previous unstable)

No way to accelerate

[ancient surge]

There's no analogue inputs, so anything that is sensitive to pressure from the L and R buttons on the 3D pad won't work like intended.

Everything is treated as digital, so either the input is pressed or not, no in-between.

This worked fine for a long time, but with the rise of the PS1, N64, and Saturn cores, this has now become a problem for any games that require analogue inputs.

[pearl harbor]

Analog triggers only work via SNAC still.

[errant crown]

What PS1 and N64 games require analog inputs?

Are you referring to third-party stuff, like the Densha De Go controller?

[thorn pagoda]

on PS1 its the negcon supported games that might benefit

it has one analog trigger and two analog buttons

[errant crown]

Oh yeah, that racing controller

I need to get one

[untold lintel]

NeGcon is effectively just utilizing the dual analog stick axes to accomplish that

There’s a couple non NeGcon games that could benefit too that use the funky dual analog steering+throttle setup

[timber marlin]

Anyone experiencing Sarah in virtua fighter 2 having two mouths?

[frail token]

https://tenor.com/view/james-mcavoy-sweating-fanning-yourself-cooling-off-sweat-meme-gif-25431489

[uneven pine]

Yes both. but Im going to try latest unstable bc this is a core from september I notice

I been out of the loop on whats up to date form update all

Nope its still the same there too

Its strange bc the satyrn pad works perfectly otherwise. Megadrive and segacd cames use all buttons correctly

Its this one using the 2.4ghz usb https://retro-bit.com/pub/media/wysiwyg/Landing-Pages/SEGA-Collaboration/SEGA_RB-SGA-038.jpg

I read some people having issues bc buttons stopped working but thats not the case here its something about the mapping and softwares

Remapped it everywhere like people suggested. im out of ideas

[wise brook]

boot it in a different mode

a & home button

[wild maple]

Hi, in your opinion, is it worth having dual RAM? thanks

[radiant karma]

Depends on the games you play. As of now the only difference I have noticed is the lack of slowdown in fighting games like doa, fighting vipers and fighters Megamix. But the slowdown wasn't as bad in single sdram before the latest changes, so it might still improve. Also grandia texture flickering was fixed and that is huge for me, although not everyone using single ram was affected.

[gloomy hedge]

Sooo has the core officially switched over to dual ram being better vs single ram as a goal?

Or is that temporary

[mortal mist]

we know for now only what srg320 wrote

[gloomy hedge]

Understood thanks!

[ancient surge]

Maybe if the DE-25 is used in the MiSTer successor in the future.

At the very least the upgrade to DDR4 RAM would improve the RAM situation across the board.

[gusty quest]

DDR4 while having more bandwidth also has more latency though

I personally still can't see Agilex being that viable for the hobby market, mostly due to Intel's useless chip fabs

[dusty shale]

Anyone got a quick link to the Saturn testing spreadsheet? Can't seem to find it.

[mortal mist]

check pinned messages

#1046941029296779344 message

[kindred sundial]

On the newest single ram core I get character and sprite flickering on Panzer Dragoon transitions from level end to boss fight start. Anyone else? Or is this true on real hardware? I never had this occur on previous cores from a while back.

[dusty shale]

Couldn't seem to access the pins on mobile. Thank you!

[radiant karma]

Just did a comparison and you are right, Sarah's mouth is not rendering correctly using the latest dual sdram build. Compared to the last stable as that's what I used. Don't know if it was there since the dual core improvements.

[celest lake]

One mouth for each ram stick seems fine

[pearl harbor]

Is the d-pad set to function as an analog stick (within the controller itself)? A lot of new classic controllers like this have options to change the d-pad to switch between functioning as a d-pad, or the left or right analog sticks. Even new arcade sticks have options like that. So maybe that could be throwing it off in the MiSTer mapping?

[mortal mist]

Please report it to github

[dusty shale]

picked up some more games to test from a friend

[radiant karma]

Will do more tests later and report my findings

[mortal mist]

Thanks!

[dusty shale]

Daytona USA: Circuit Edition (Japan) appears to perform on par with real hardware at a glance.

Both are prone to lag spikes when there is a high quantity of cars on screen. It feels like MiSTer experiences these spikes slightly more often, but that could just be down to car placement and CPU behaviour, so I can't confirm this.

MiSTer seems to load slightly faster than real hardware, for what it's worth. Not sure if that's consistent among other games.

[dusty shale]

Dragon Ball Z: Shin Butoden (Japan) appears to perform on par with real hardware at a glance.

[ancient surge]

Loading will be slightly faster on average for the simple fact that there is no physical disc to read from.

[dusty shale]

That makes sense.

Golden Axe: The Duel (Japan) appears to perform on par with real hardware at a glance.

[errant crown]

I know if you use the Saroo on a Saturn, some loading times are greatly cut down, since the game is being loaded through a cartridge, instead of the disc drive.

I wonder if that is feasible at all with the core.

[burnt matrix]

Anyone try the Princess Crown translation update?

[dusty shale]

Grandia Digital Museum (Japan). Reproducible slowdown when walking through some areas.

[burnt matrix]

https://github.com/eadmaster/pcrown

[dusty shale]

(Saturn on PVM, MiSTer on digital display)

There are moments of similar slowdown that are reproducible on real hardware, but the ones I'm showcasing are ones that either do not happen at all on real hardware, or happen infrequently enough that they cannot be consistently reproduced.

[pearl harbor]

Not yet, but from what I've heard, it's quite a bit better already.

[ripe valley]

I've played it yesterday, when resting from my bed.
Some parts aren't implemented yet, like the names under each door in the castle.

It works fine on the core, from the two hours and half played on it.

[cursive ravine]

Played past the first freeze that got fixed in the last patch. It’s not bad. Glitches are getting fixed. Item descriptions are in now but buggy

[dusty shale]

@ripe valley Sorry to bother you. If/when you have time, would you be ok to add the three games I've tested today to the compatibility list?

[cursive ravine]

There was one thing that might be a glitch in the core. When the fairy helps you in combat the glow effect has a vertical line through it. I havnt checked if that’s normal though

[errant crown]

Great news, considering the original devs stated they will never release a beta

[cursive ravine]

It’s been a breath of fresh air to be able to follow the dev of the new translation. Really appreciate the openness

[slate bluff]

Should I be getting the latest unstable Main in order to test the latest unstable dual RAM build?

[warped saddle]

doesn't really matter. no saturn specific main changes since last release

[hardy lodge]

Y'all think it's worth it now to pick up a second ram stick for saturn, especially grandia?

[quick sorrel]

I too am contemplating this as well. 🤔

Does the amount of the second stick matter, like 32 or 64, but rather the version of the RAM right?

[errant crown]

I got a second RAM stick as a futureproofing method, just in case something needed it. I’d recommend getting one especially for that reason.

[severe whale]

How much are the extra ram?

[gusty quest]

Depends where you buy from established sellers have 32meg boards for £18 or so
Taki sells 128meg boards for £20 delivered

[hardy lodge]

Maybe I'll grab one from mister addons, I wanna buy some of his stuff anyway and maybe I wanna do that before trade gets more difficult.

[sharp dove]

Is Dual Ram looking to better for this core over single?

[dusty shale]

Potentially for a small handful of 3D fighting games.

Right now, I wouldn't say it's mandatory.

[cursive ravine]

here's the graphical glitch I encountered in princess crown on the core if anyone wants to test against real hardware. line down the middle on the fairy glow

latest unstable, single ram

[willow siren]

Is this with the translation patch? Just a thought to consider it can be good to test on the original game (if it is). As I understand, these patches can introduce a fair few bugs, especially when still work in progress

[ripe valley]

Yes, it's written 'no power!' on the bottom, so with the translation patch.

[dusty shale]

@ripe valley If I may ask, what would you consider 'sufficient testing' for a Saturn game? I want to make sure I'm doing this properly.

[ripe valley]

In fact, no established value.
You've done it quite properly.

For me testing at least for 10-15 minutes, verifying that no major graphical effects, no major sound issues and nothing can block progress immediately or within the testing time.

If we found issues later, that can be reported on the issue reports and added to the compatibility list (that it is known and due reported already).

[dusty shale]

Thank you. I intend to give Grandia Digital Museum another go to see how often MiSTer lags where Saturn doesn't, and how consistent that is.

[mortal mist]

single or dual ?

[dusty shale]

Single.

[mortal mist]

it's worth checking out the same site with dualsdram. After the recent changes, I am curious if there is a difference in favor of dualsdram.

[dusty shale]

@mortal mist Check out the videos I shared yesterday for comparisons between MiSTer single and Saturn.

I don't intend to get a dual RAM setup any time soon.

[mortal mist]

at the moment according to srg320 declarations i assume that core in single version can have more problems than dualsdram.

[dusty shale]

This is true.

[mortal mist]

Besides, dualsdram probably won't be 100% accurate either

we will see what the future brings 🙂

[hardy lodge]

Yeah but the grandia flicker!

[tawny forge]

Do you have a list of the games that run on par (or not) with OG hardware with single ram?

[dusty shale]

Outside of the testing spreadsheet (pinned), no.

Granted, 'playable' status (as listed in the spreadsheet) can mean many things, and no game is listed as 'perfect'.

I try to be thorough in my testing, but I don't have time to play every game I test in full.

[mortal mist]

send a request for access to the spreadsheet

for me there is no problem to add additional commentaries there

[dusty shale]

You'd like me to send you a request for edit access?

[mortal mist]

yes

so you can edit and add your comments

[dusty shale]

Ah, ok! I will this evening. Thank you!

[naive whale]

yes

[clear condor]

Sarah the Sky Dragon

[craggy horizon]

Pinned where?

[dusty shale]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1BpCRjALSAAe4lQGfaJgoiDZu6aLFrVOLdSEJqN4EgIg/

[craggy horizon]

Weird... that doesn't show up under the channel details in the iPhone Discord app unless I drill down under "Channel Settings". Ohh... I guess that's because this "Sega Saturn" thing is a thread within the channel?

Is there some note or column I'm overlooking that would indicate which titles benefit from dual SDRAM?

Oh, I found it, under "Notes" in the USA games tab.

[dusty shale]

I've sent a request.

[burnt matrix]

Yeah I don’t know why they buried it there, it’s not good

[mortal mist]

access granted 😉

[dusty shale]

Thank you!

[hearty marten]

Cos it’s not like the point of pinned posts is to make them easy to see… right?

[warped saddle]

but it's like a forum!

[gloomy hedge]

This isn't the mister core, I got no snac 😦

so is this all the lightgun games? any others?

Area 51 (1996)
Chaos Control Remix (1996)
Crypt Killer (1997)
Daisuki (1997)
Death Crimson (1996)
Die Hard Trilogy (1997)
Gun Frontier Arcade Gears (1997) (omg I forgot about this)
The House of the Dead (1997)
Jinzou Ningen Hakaider: Last Judgement (1996)
Kochira Katsushikaku Kamearikouenmae Hashutsujo Nakagawa Land Dai Race! no Maki (1997)
Maximum Force (1997)
Mighty Hits (1996)
Policenauts (1996)
Scud: The Disposable Assassin (1997)
Virtua Cop (1994)
Virtua Cop 2 (1995)

[cursive ravine]

That's a fair point. tested on vanilla japanese version. still happening

[gloomy hedge]

So mechanical violator hakaider is wild??? Wtf is this a lightgun visual novel?

dude this game needs an english patch! what a great movie tie in

[serene thunder]

wtfff
"Kochira Katsushikaku Kamearikouenmae Hashutsujo Nakagawa Land Dai Race! no Maki (1997)"

[gloomy hedge]

soooo

thats like a fuckin

board game

I guess maybe one of the mini games can use a lightgun?

I cant even

Mister def needs support for this tho:

It doesn't even need to get aimed. It's just sending a lightgun signal trigger to player 2 to enable the gun frontier secret menu

[burnt matrix]

Did you just type random letters

[ancient surge]

Sorry I don't speak Italian.

[quick sorrel]

Nani ravioli pizza desu ka

[next bronze]

It's a me, Mario!

[dusty shale]

Speaking of all these lightgun games, what is a recommended lightgun for MiSTer?

[errant crown]

For the Saturn core specifically?

[dusty shale]

In general.

[errant crown]

Are you using a CRT or LCD display?

[dusty shale]

Both.

[errant crown]

If you want a one-size-fits-all solution, I hear good things about the Sinden

It has full compatibility with MiSTer IIRC

It’s made for use with LCD screens

Dunno of any ones for CRT’s that aren’t console-specific

[dusty shale]

Thank you! I'd ideally like something that works on both CRTs and LCDs, if such a thing exists.

[errant crown]

Uhh, I don’t know if anything like that exists

The way CRT light guns and LCD light guns work are very different.

[dusty shale]

That's fair.

[errant crown]

With CRT light guns, the game flashes a blank frame when you shoot, and the gun detects your target from there.

LCD displays can’t do the same thing because of the inherent input latency that’s on anything but a CRT.

So, LCD light guns have to work very differently.

AFAIK, LCD light guns didn’t even exist until very recently.

I’ve seen a lot of good reports from people using a Sinden gun with the MiSTer.

[dusty shale]

I see. I'll need one for CRTs and one for LCDs.

[errant crown]

Yeah. Dunno if there are any CRT light guns that are one size fits all.

You’d probably need a light gun for each console you wanna use with one.

[dusty shale]

Oh, ok.

[errant crown]

I have a Guncon for PS1, and a Virtua Gun for Saturn.

Also an NES Zapper somewhere in the garage, but I’m pretty sure it’s busted.

[kind bough]

sinden requires forked main (and cores I beleive), gun4ir is natively supported
guncon3 is a reasonable option with native support
none of these are 'light guns' in the traditional sense, either IR tracking or the whole 'white boarder' method that sinden uses

[errant crown]

Oh wait, so you can’t just use the cores you already have?

Does each core update need to be forked to be compatible with the Sinden?

[pearl harbor]

I rather like my guncon 3s. They work great on MiSTer.

[warped saddle]

yes, sinden requires forked cores

[kind bough]

to add the border

it has a relatively high processing overhead to work out aim from the camera feed the gun provides too

[pearl harbor]

Guncon 3s also work on both CRTs and flat panel displays because they use sensors.

[gusty quest]

I always thought CRT lightguns read the position of the rasterscan ?

Sinden is a right lash up on MiSTer and is really just a glorified web cam

Sony released Guncon for PS3 which is designed for Plasma/LCD and work on MiSTer fine. The support is in Main so covers all cores with light gun support

[errant crown]

Oh, cool

[kind bough]

yep, actual lightguns are CRT only
GC3/gun4ir/sinden are all diff tech to allow for flatscreen support

[errant crown]

Especially since the Guncon 3 only ever officially supported one game on PS3 lol

[kind bough]

I love my GC3s for mister but theyre definately not as responsive as a GC1 or 2 on a CRT

[pearl harbor]

Well three games technically.

[errant crown]

@gusty quest So, the best best is to get a Guncon 3? That’s better than Sinden?

[kind bough]

they're a (relative to sinden/gun4ir) not too expensive option

[errant crown]

Tbf nothing is gonna be responsive as a light gun on a CRT.

[kind bough]

definately not better than sinden or gun4ir in terms of lag

[pearl harbor]

gun4ir is technically more accurate, but way more expensive.

[gusty quest]

Well Sinden needs it's own SDcard for MiSTer and has reduced performance due to everything being done in drivers

[kind bough]

IMO best in class for flatscreen support on MiSTer is gun4ir, but $$ like mario says 😦

[lost totem]

guncon3 is fine but ultimately feels like a laser pointer with a pistol grip imo

[pearl harbor]

I peronally have two guncon 3s though, and they work excellent overall. Accurate enough that I don't need to use on-screen cursors with them. Just point and shoot.

[kind bough]

gc3 is like a better wiimote
gun4ir is a MUCH better wiimote (similar tech to modern arcade gun games)

[errant crown]

Looks like Gun4ir is only available as a DIY kit

Bummer

[kind bough]

point blank single leaf mission....

🙂

[gusty quest]

Yeah if you can find a cheap Guncon 3 it's good enough and replacement LED emitters can be sourced

The position of the LED emitters is important too

[pearl harbor]

I can do it with my guncon 3s no problem.

[kind bough]

they're normally avaialble on ali, but pricey

you have the eyes of a hawlk and offset corredction of a good offset corrector

[pearl harbor]

If you calibrate the guncon 3s correctly, they're extremely accurate in my experience.

[errant crown]

We got the engagement going

[gusty quest]

I think there is an open source solution for the emitters now and MiSTerAddons was selling replacements

[lost totem]

laserbear and misteraddons sell guncon3 emitters for decent price

[kind bough]

ive got a cpl and use them often, but find moving even slightly requires re-calibration

[pearl harbor]

I use the porkchop emitters.

[gusty quest]

Yeah they are fine

[errant crown]

By emitters, do you mean those things you have to tape on top of your TV?

[pearl harbor]

Yes

[kind bough]

never said they werent fine, just noticably not as good as a real lightgun as expected from my use

gc1 is better than fine 🙂

gc3 has 2, gun4ir has 4 emitters

[gusty quest]

I found with original emitters you can tell they were designed for old flat screens with massive bezels and found them best just attached to the top of the panel with blutac

[kind bough]

haha yep, blutac here

better than those random strap things they come with

[gusty quest]

Yup

[pearl harbor]

I like how small porkchop's emitters are. I just keep them on all the time. Their red eyes stare directly into my soul.

[errant crown]

Do those guns work with, say, scanline filters on a scaler?

[gusty quest]

Yeah they don't really read the screen

[lost totem]

minor complaint of the laserbear set is they're light. really needed to finagle the USB cables powering them to keep them in place

also leaf switch mod makes trigger feel better imo

[kind bough]

They work with the screen turned off 🙂

[soft goblet]

Openfire also works on MiSTer, but not in the Saturn core so far, I believe

[errant crown]

Oh, I thought people were saying this was expensive

[dusty shale]

That's out of my price range for certain.

[thorn pagoda]

i really wish guncon3 didn't look so stupid

what were the thinking slapping that blob on the side

[errant crown]

Whatcha talkin’ about, just don’t eat 2 days out of the week for like a month, and you’ll have saved up for it 🤪

[quick sorrel]

just checked sinden pricing... o.O

[wise brook]

openfire might be a more budget friendly option

[soft goblet]

If you're DIY capable and have a 3d printer, OpenFIRE or Blamcon are decent options.. OpenFIRE has Mister support to an extend already.. most expensive part is the camera (~30$). I think my Openfire based gun cost me 75$ all in with mostly parts from aliexpress, I did skip the solenoid for the slide/recoil, though, didn't want to mess with additional power supplies

with some more DIYing, you can even just use a few basic parts and a wiimote camera if you happen to have a wiimote laying around anyways

https://diylightgun.com/lightgun-details/?lgid=506 has a fairly decent build log that gives a rough idea of what to expect electronics-wise

[dusty shale]

I do have a 3D printer!

[soft goblet]

Printed this guy entirely on a Bamu A1, currently working on a second one

[dusty shale]

What material did you print it with?

[soft goblet]

frame and covers are matte PLA, green stuff is standard PLA

[hearty marten]

It’s so beautiful 🥹

[visual grove]

The stuff people can do at home with 3d printers has gotten pretty impressive. I don’t need another expensive space & time gobbling hobby but I think they are cool

[green swift]

I have not committed to the purchase of a 3D printer yet, but then I see stuff like this and, damn, it feels like it's time.

[gloomy hedge]

Yeah that's why I basically gave up, I ain't tryna do all that

[visual grove]

I had a pair of aimtrak shells I gutted and used for mine years back, was able to reuse the solenoid as well so it was pretty easy when you’ve got some old aimtraks lying around 😉

[green swift]

How much does it cost to build a Gun4IR these days if you already have a donor gun?

[gloomy hedge]

https://www.gun4ir.com/collections/gun4ir-official-diy-pcbs

I dunno add that up

🤣

https://www.gun4ir.com/products/universal-new-diy-smd-pcb this plus a compatible camera module plus ...bla bla

Like it's clear as mud

[visual grove]

You need a cheap microcontroller, some wire, shrink tubing, minor solder skills and a WII camera from DFRobot or shucked

Oh and to make some emitters

[ripe valley]

Added.

[visual grove]

Which are just IR LEDs wire, and resistors

[gloomy hedge]

This is like one of those crafting survival games but IRL

Better get the recipe right

[green swift]

I have some dead Wiimotes for donors and a bunch of leftover pro micros from Daemonbites. Seems like it shouldn't be too expensive.

aren't there fisheye lenses needed?\

[visual grove]

I have them on the two I made

[ripe valley]

For the double mouth on VF2, I think that's related with another issue/regression.
I'm waiting for the new build and we will retest at that time.
If the problem remains there, we would do a new issue report.

[visual grove]

BETTER RUN HOME TO MOMMA NOW demonic voice, shrill singing in Latin in the background

The beast with two mouths

[ripe valley]

Futakuchi-onna origins.

[burnt matrix]

I just bought a pair of GunCon 3 and they work great

[green swift]

Yeah the GC3 works well for me if I'm not moving too much. Definitely seems to be the best readymade solution. Maybe Gun4IR will see some mass production to drive the cost down.

Or OpenFIRE, but not sure how mass production could work with an open license. Probably couldn't.

[visual grove]

Hmm the used market for aimtrak is surprisingly still expensive

Figured as old as they are might be a cheaper route that’s pretty easy

[thorn pagoda]

openfire looks neat

[visual grove]

$150 is the cheapest on eBay that includes recoil

Yeah bummer figured these would be more like $50-$75 by now

Think I bought mine in like 2017 or something

For maybe $200 ea. for a multicade build. So the needle hasn’t moved much even though there’s better tech now

[green swift]

AimTrak dominated for years. Probably brand recognition at this point.

[gloomy hedge]

I think all this stuff pales in comparison to VR

VR should just be the path forward for this stuff

Even if the games aren't ported I think you can emulate them in VR and then you're golden

[visual grove]

Yeah VR is way better for gun stuff

[green swift]

VR definitely feels like the next step

[visual grove]

Now convince people to buy into VR so more studios make stuff 😉

[green swift]

Yeah :/

[burnt matrix]

I just play Princess Crown on the Saturn core.

[radiant karma]

Oops, I added it as a new issue. I can close it if needed.

[ancient surge]

I just play strip mahjong, art galleries, and kusoge like a normal person.

[mortal mist]

Why close if this bug exists ? If it is fixed then close it.

The more reports of problems, the better 🙂

[radiant karma]

I thought it was maybe mentioned in another issue, will leave it until it is fixed then.

[ripe valley]

Leave it.

[ripe valley]

@cursive ravine srg320 wants to search on the issue quite quickly, do you have some instructions and a save that could help ?

[slate bluff]

Bad news for my setup and Grandia testing. I bought a new Samsung Pro Ultimate SD card (which is the fastest spec card they have). I rebuilt my MiSter completely. I also got two 3.0 sticks of RAM. Grandia is bin/cue. Everything (OS, core & game) is saved on the SD card. I tested using the latest unstable build for dual RAM. Grandia still had flashing textures 😞

[burnt matrix]

Are the flashing textures in just one spot?

[slate bluff]

Good question. I tested in a known (to me) problem area. I will test more to verify it is flashing in multiple areas.

[burnt matrix]

I mean it should definitely be addressed so I don’t want to minimize that but if the issue is limited then it’s easy to look past. I think anyways.

[celest lake]

@slate bluff do you have a save? I have been meaning to test this on various misters to see if there was a reliable way to reproduce, but haven't had a chance

[hearty marten]

Smells like a random timing issue to me

[slate bluff]

Headed to work, but I can get one tonight. 👍🏻

[wise brook]

did you flip the de10 dip switches?

[slate bluff]

Yeah, I have the very first switch in the 1 position and all the others are 0.

I have the digital IO board.

and I used direct video via HDMI to an external scaler (RT4K).

[stiff patrol]

thats probably the issue

try direct HDMI to a HDMI monitor

the RT4k may be the issue

[slate bluff]

I could try that. Not sure how the internal MiSTer scaler would prevent flashing textures, but worth a try I suppose.

[stiff patrol]

no I mean no Scalar

Just HDMI to HMDI

As soon as you add to the output chain any number of reasons could be causing it

[cursive ravine]

For sure. Give me an hour and I can upload my save. Explanation is after the first boss you can go to the fairy forest and unlock the power for your fairy friend to help you in battle. After that just enter any random battle and get knocked down. There seems to be a 50/50 chance that the fairy will swoop in to help.

[slate bluff]

there has to be a scaler at some point....

MiSTer or display

[stiff patrol]

Well Whatever video mode for 1080P is

nothing else

no scanlines

no filters

just pure HDMi Out to a HDMI in with nothing in the way

[slate bluff]

1080P means the MiSTer is scaling the image (just so you know). Then my display would take 1080P and scale to 4K. I have no way to disable that, but I get what you are saying.

I will have to do more testing tonight.

[radiant karma]

I don´t think using direct video will have any effect on the flashing textures issue. I only tested the intro part of grandia, once the fmv finishes after a new game. Before the dual sdram fixes I had flashing textures right there. Those are gone now, but I haven´t gone further into the game to see if there are more instances of it happening. Your save will save others replicate the issue.

[small gust]

Interesting, in my current setup with single ram, I do experience the flickering and has since the first build that broke it.

But, I ordered a second ram module today. Which I hope arrives within a week or so.
It's gonna be really interesting to see if it could remedy my flickering.

[cursive ravine]

@ripe valley

leave town. walk till random battle starts. get hit a bunch till the fairy comes in

[ripe valley]

Okay, thanks, I'm doing the report later to srg320.

I need a moment right now.

[celest lake]

I hope you're feeling better, Zet. Thanks for everything you're doing

[ripe valley]

Doing what I can, and taking some time off when I can't.

[celest lake]

Well I hope that you're only here because you want to be, and not because you need to be, my friend. Please take care yourself as best you can

[ripe valley]

Never an obligation, just fun and to see the whole project getting better and better.

[cursive ravine]

Thank you Zet-sensei for making the issue and also all your hard work for the project!

[hardy lodge]

I pulled the trigger in a second ram stick. I have a digital io board anyway.

[hearty marten]

Nice!

[hardy lodge]

I also got a green shock+ for my purple aluminum case in the order. So I hope it'll go together well for that evangelion vibe. 😅

[hearty marten]

(Edited comment as what I asked was none of my business). Send a photo when it’s all together 🙂

[celest lake]

those shock cases are so nice

rocking blue/yellow on my misteraddons stack

[hardy lodge]

I'm mildly confused but ok.

[hearty marten]

Ha, I’ll DM you 😄

[hardy lodge]

I've been undecided between grey/purple and green/purple but since I need a second ram stick for grandia it was finally time to decide. Also got the port plugs.

[celest lake]

Green purple was the right choice 100%

[hearty marten]

I quite like those cases but I committed to a fan and a nice chunky heatsink. Kind of feels like a waste to get rid of them, so I’ll stick with what I have… until I get a second setup 😉

[hardy lodge]

My fan broke down so I was destined for an aluminum case.

[pearl harbor]

I'm rocking the red case from porkchop.

That bad boi is solid enough that one could use it as a weapon and nobody would see the...evidence...due to its color!

[hardy lodge]

Did y'all also mute the tv when first time using the mister in the aluminum case just to hear how completely silent the mister now is? 😅

[celest lake]

I have so much vent noise in my basement that the mister fan noise never bothered me

[hearty carbon]

fans are the only way I know my electronics are in pain

That they are suffering.

[celest lake]

its how you tell they have a fever

[soft goblet]

I got a 32GB ram stick in today.. was ~8 bucks off aliexpress. Passed a memtest at 150mhz for several minutes so far and games seem to work with it

[celest lake]

i dunno if the current ustable core has the fixes for non 3.0 ram

SRG did a special build for that when they first released the dual ram optimizations

[soft goblet]

One thing I'm wondering about, did fighting vipers always have this odd scanline effect?

[dusty shale]

It's running at 480i. What you're seeing are called combing artifacts.

[wet hull]

Yes

The core is running weave

[soft goblet]

alright, good.. guess that was just not as visible on a CRT

[wet hull]

Yup

[soft goblet]

been a loooong time since I played FV

[celest lake]

is that with the scanline fix?

[soft goblet]

whatever the latest unstable is

[celest lake]

I see the scanline fix in the commits. Forgot it was analog only

[serene thunder]

The ultimate Nerd Move is to buy a Tink 5x and run analog from MiSTer into it

[burnt matrix]

I forgot how much of an improvement was going away from interlaced rendering modes.

[hearty marten]

One of those things that didn’t seem an issue at the time, but looking back… yeah, no

[clear condor]

CRTs actually help a lot with it. Weave on an LCD gives you maximum interlacing pain

[hearty marten]

Yeah, it’s pretty rough 😔

[hearty marten]

Where all the OLED apologists at? Whatcha gonna do about that, homeboys?

[clear condor]

Well, on an OLED, you're like, "this interlacing is horrible, but at least the motion clarity and black levels aren't bad"

[hearty carbon]

https://tenor.com/view/bridgerton-adjoa-andoh-lady-danbury-annoyed-tea-gif-25222654

[gloomy hedge]

oh everything I create through scanline filters is dope af usually

[hearty marten]

@burnt matrix… Gottem?

[gloomy hedge]

but I have a CRT now so uh

I dunno fuck it 😛

but my footage that I record is still scanline'd up for "the viewers"

[radiant karma]

Lets hope bob deinterlacing can be implemented. It is not perfect but thats the only way I can play 480i fighting games on the psx core.

[gloomy hedge]

why weave when you can bob

[hearty marten]

Why not just use the 480p hack?

[radiant karma]

Because it is a hack really, doesnt work on 2d elements, like the particle effects on tekken 3 hits, and the text in those games, so you can still see distracting artifacts.

[hearty marten]

That’s a good point. I hadn’t really played Tekken 3 much on the core so wasn’t super familiar with how it worked. Thank you

[errant crown]

My experience with the 480p hack on the PS1 core hasn’t been that great

I just deinterlace with my RetroTink 4K

Same goes with CleanHDMI on the N64 core

[radiant karma]

Cleanhdmi looks amazing on the n64 core. Dont think something like that can be implemented on this core though. No resources left.

[hearty marten]

Maybe they already exist, but I’m a little surprised we haven’t seen a rise in “AI” deinterlacers, given all the people jumping on that hype train at the moment

[errant crown]

I’ve tried out CleanHDMI with Legacy of Darkness, and it overall seems buggy to me

Every time I activate it, it gives me a different screen size

[pine bobcat]

That's one area where console mod still beats MiSTer, PS1Digital for example has motion adaptive deinterlace

[errant crown]

And half the time, 2D assets aren’t scaled evenly

[radiant karma]

I can be happy with the bob option, no artifacts, so good for games with movement. Weave is great for menus so rpgs do benefit. I am trying hard not to buy a morph 4k just for deinterlacing on mister.

[burnt matrix]

can add filters and shadow masks, those help a lot with interlaced content