lore-discussion-spoilers

[rigid mural]

Both sides were getting heated.

[tulip aspen]

wha
the cinematic is a fanfiction?

[rigid mural]

Jam. Let's stop with this topic.

[tulip aspen]

highkey looking at my shaking hands trying to imagine them as stone but with little fingernail decal lolol

[hushed steeple]

team literal mitts

[tulip aspen]

w h a t

[hushed steeple]

Its the only explanation for there being both modeled fingers and modeled mitt hands. Sometimes even in the same team.

[tulip aspen]

so that they might be wearing actual mittens?

[nimble ingot]

In the game, there are limitations.
Therefore, skykids have low detail hands that makes animating them easier. Lorewise, skykid can have fingers.

[tulip aspen]

yea, id like to believe so too

[late wasp]

no

[tulip aspen]

same team, like same season you mean?

[timid river]

So... I was playing with a friend earlier and we came up with some thoughts about the reef lab/experimentation on light critters thing.....
What if the lab wasn't trying to hurt the critters, but rather help them? Cure them of the darkness infestation??

[nimble ingot]

That is interesting idea.
Perhaps help them evolve into greater variants of themselves?

Hopefully in the next quest, we can explore more the area and learn more about it.

[tulip aspen]

when does it come out again?

[nimble ingot]

Perhaps ask the guide.

[timid river]

Hmmm....
We never discussed evolution, jut the idea that all the darkness we see in game (Fungus, poisoned water, dark critters) are all just part of a huge environmental disaster of sorts and that the lab we see in reef was actively trying to fix/reverse some of the damage

but evolution is an interesting idea that could possibly be taken either way... good (helping the animals) and bad (experimenting on them)

Like, on the good side, maybe they were trying to give the critters a way to fight the darkness on their own,

On the bad, maybe they were actively trying to twist the critters into darker versions, possibly for war? Like, maybe the krill were 'evolved' into the creatures we see today....

[hushed steeple]

But spirits have working fingers too. Some spirits have mit shaped some have fingers

[frigid tinsel]

this upcoming Monday, so Feb 14
oh that's perfect, instead of going out with anyone, I'll be playing Sky!
and i tagged the wrong person, whoops

[timid river]

NICE (And also totally same)

[frigid tinsel]

spending Valentine's Day lore diving in the deep, perhaps unlocking new trauma for my skids

[timid river]

Yesssssssssssssssss

[nimble ingot]

Yup.
Perhaps the devs are giving certain spirits fingers because it is necessary to whatever they are doing.
For instance, if the camera is going to show their hands doing something specific, then fingers are a must.

However, if the spirit is not going to be doing something with their hands, then mittens it is to save on the polycount budget.
A good example of mitten handed spirits are the boogie kid. He is small and hardly uses his hands specifically, so his outfit is perfectly suited for mittens.

[timid river]

Speaking of Lore, Did anyone else notice that the actual coral reef part of the reef is a giant skeleton?

[hushed steeple]

Like they are right next to each other. I know its actually just sky being inconsistent but I much prefer mit hands just being a different race of spirits. Plus, skykids appear without fingers in official arts too. How do they play stinged instuments? magic!

Yeah it actually is just for whatever the model needs to do :/ but I like it better

[frigid tinsel]

it's a big ol' skull

[timid river]

The rest of it looks like ridges on a spine,
Side note is OOB stuff allowed here?

[frigid tinsel]

if you mean the Abyss OOB, that's iffy. rn people have been discussing it under a spoiler since it technically is in Live but isn't supposed to be revealed yet

[timid river]

okay.... well, the reason I say it's a skeleton is because of abyss OOB features

[tulip aspen]

oh megan

[nimble ingot]

language

[tulip aspen]

yee
if only

[hushed steeple]

I know better than to think little things in sky have lore meaning

[formal skiff]

I hadn’t but that’s awesome

[nimble ingot]

As much it is exciting to see what would happen next in the season. In all fairness, it would be respectable to avoid spoilers.
When it comes to lore, there are few things the game that are sacred. But the rule of what is live and what is beta is a boundary that has its risk when crossing.
Ergo, starting with this season, what is not officially accessible in live, and is considered as a spoiler when it comes to beta content. Should best be left alone until it is officially in live.

It is an edge case I think most skykid have not yet encountered until this season arrived.

[formal skiff]

Yeah, my friend has taken me to the OOB Abyss area and I actually posted some art I drew involving stuff from that area (with an attached message saying I wasn’t sure if it was allowed) and no mods took it down so idk

[nimble ingot]

That is a shame. Hopefully they would be able to post it again when the theme they were drawing is officially live.

[formal skiff]

No I mean it wasnt taken down /lh

[nimble ingot]

oh, 'no mods took it down'
I misread, my apologies.

[formal skiff]

You’re good!

[late wasp]

I believe Cave of Prophecies imply the Elder of the Wasteland used the power of Fire Magic to create golems.

@boreal nebula

[tulip aspen]

what mural is that theory based off? that sounds feasible

what building is above the temple there?

[nimble ingot]

wrong mural.

I assume Starscourged meant this one.
Far left being the wasteland elder with the red light, which is the fire trail.

[formal skiff]

Ohhh is that glowing figure the skid who made it through that you guys keep discussing who you think is the king?

[late wasp]

give me a quick rundown on finger nail lore

[nimble ingot]

to answer the question, as is.
That could either be a floating ruin, or the Valley temple, or even a lone structure above the forest temple.

[hushed steeple]

I would go more turrets than golems, but yep!

[nimble ingot]

There is a theory about the wasteland battlefield could have had golems as soldiers.
They were referencing the mural since it had the elder, the red light and the turrets.
At least, that is how I understood it.

[rigid mural]

could you not

[late wasp]

the final one. you see each elder using their magic color to create different things
rain elder creates rain
wasteland elder creates a bunch of golems with fire eyes
prairie elder creates grass
valley elders create flying rocks and skateboards?

[late wasp]

Yes, this one
in game the king statues have red eyes.

[keen shore]

I want to get on board with the theory that the giant weapons were created for the turrets but the thing is… they don’t have hands to hold them with. The weapons weren’t meant to be levitated because they don’t have darkstone and have visible handles, which have been scaled way up to match the blade and imply whoever held them has large enough hands to need a handle of that size. A bit worried I’m overthinking this, but the swords’ size still baffles me

I still think they’re turrets just because of the lack of hands and otherwise movable parts. The only real part that might be able to rotate is the “head” to aim better. If they were created like golems, you’d think they wouldn’t be stationary, yknow?

Like without the lasers how are they supposed to defend anything? …do they just fall over and crush you to death??

[late wasp]

I don't think what is depicted in that mural is seen in game. the size comparison to the elder implies they are small. i think we simply never met one of those statues.

[keen shore]

I mean, the mural also has a coelacanth (flying with the mantas) depicted much smaller than its actual size in order to fit in the mural, so this feels like another case of the simplest explanation being the best considering we see statues of those exact shape in wasteland

[tulip aspen]

hey salem is that the refinery icon?

[tulip aspen]

^^^
def turrets, i dont think those things could move

i dont think the king (mech) was supposed to walk around either

[keen shore]

YEAH this is another place where it is, I’m starting to wonder if it’s a symbol for boats as well considering this seems like a docking area. Since the entirety of forest is basically one big industrial area with all the materials going to the temple to be refined, I previously assumed it was like a street sign saying the refinery is nearby, although this might not be the case.

Going to check over all the boats I can find soon to see if there’s more with that pattern

Also managed to find said symbol in second area of wasteland. Was bothering me because I knew I’d seen it there, but the whole area was so dark that it was impossible to find again without a glow spell

[tulip aspen]

so there's speculation based off the hand models in the switch cinematic trailer that they visibly have fingernails

i think it's rather the flattened shape of where the nail would be, as i dont see why they would have extra plating there, but as salem inputted, it wouldn't be so odd and would actually be aesthetic for even a golem effigy to have that little layering as fingernails, so i can dig it

[nimble ingot]

That symbols is seen in eden, on the boat at the start of the realms.
I am certain that it is also in day, valley, as well as wasteland.
I would gladly look for the symbols and screenshot them tomorrow.

[tulip aspen]

i had thought it might be more like boats from that dock head straight to the refinery (temple)

[tulip aspen]

ooo yes pls

[keen shore]

Yeah, that as well. Probably both considering the context and how that area seems like it would be an almost loading area to put materials in the boats?

[late wasp]

So, what would you say the fingernail person is? An ancestor or a sky kid?
Also they would be golem effigies of what?

[hushed steeple]

peanut butter jelly goes hard

[tulip aspen]

those are definitely ancestors in the trailer lol

the child in the cinematic is theorized to be the child stargazer found, which means they're also possibly the Chosen One and the Prince, which is b i g

i will note however that IF the child isn't the same child stargazer found, then that means it's kinda just a random ancestor child

the fingernail logic, via Salem's argument, should apply to both ancestors and skykids either way, so yaya

[keen shore]

Playing with the idea that the golem looking kid in the trailer is the king, just because the ancestor next to them looks a lot more human if that makes sense? they move smoother and don’t have the light in their chests (although tbf you can barely see them)

[tulip aspen]

ive never made that connection that they look specially different

ill have to rewatch to see if i see what you mean lol

[keen shore]

The ancestor is in there for like 5 frames so it might just be confirmation bias on my end

[late wasp]

alright, let me type what I think about that, and offer some more evidence that we would have to work with.

[boreal nebula]

LOL, then why is he not jumping inside the painting ? xD

[tulip aspen]

does the child have a light in their chest?
idk why ive never noticed if so or not but do ancestors in game have light in their chest?

[keen shore]

They have a small star representing their actual soul (same appearance as ours after we die in Eden) that’s located in their chest, but it doesn’t resemble our flame at all

[tulip aspen]

who does?
hmm
ill def have to do some digging lolol

[late wasp]

On the child in the trailer being the King:
⠀⠀⠀The Cave of Prophecy mural shows that the King fell from the sky when the Isle of Dawn was already just an isle. Giving a timeline. This is mandatory to have happens years after the Switch trailer, consider all the different lands and biomes that would have to be swallowed by the ocean.

On the child in the trailer being the Stargazer fallen star:
⠀⠀⠀Similar to the first one, the problem lies entirely on the Stargazer kid not having travelled the same amount as the trailer kid. Iirc, Stargazer Sky Kid is immediately sent off to the Elder after falling, having fallen simply in front of the temple.

⠀⠀⠀Meanwhile the Trailer Kid is travelling a couple biomes, for at least an entire day, to arrive at the same cave we pass through at the start of Isle of Dawn. Once again, Trailer seems to have occurred years and years before whatever happened in game.

The Trailer also includes:
⠀⠀⠀Centuries ago before the stars fell

[half shadow]

to be honest i always assumed that the prophecy mural was meant to be You completing all the trails so when i learned about the Deep Mural Lore i was shocked lol

[keen shore]

OH, I MEAN THE ANCESTOR SPIRITS. Sorry, should have clarified, was answering your second question

[tulip aspen]

does it really elaborate on it being an isle? (surrounded by water)

ive never noticed that before

and yes, if stargazer child is the chosen one and prince, that convolutes timeline things a lot; maybe it implies they traveled away from Dawn for unknown reasons.
its definitely something ive been thinking about a lot, but any convolutions we make further borderline on headcanon for now, so we'll have to trust in Ash's WAFOs (sad)

so your main argument is that prophecy shows Dawn as already being an isle, which, if you're right, is the only argument you need to debunk it all frankly

in general, we'll def need picture evidence

[tulip aspen]

same lol

[keen shore]

Am still skeptical about isle ever NOT being an isle, considering in the trailer there are massive clouds over the mountains, which makes me think there’s a source of water/the ocean nearby. Beyond that piece of very speculative evidence (and the fact that the reef flooded which is also very speculative in its connection) we have no evidence for or against the idea, though

• if the kid in the trailer is actually the king we don’t know if it happened before or after the trials so traveling distance is null. I mean, if they’re about to be king, at the very least they should know the geography of the kingdom

[hushed steeple]

Eden beam is already active by time they reach the land. So I really doubt its king.

[half shadow]

honestly I think the switch trailer is just some random ancestor child. they’re adorable tho

[hushed steeple]

I don’t like the hyper realistic skin textures but same

[keen shore]

I’m up in the air about it, but said “ancestor” child looks suspiciously like us

[hushed steeple]

All ancestors kids look suspiciously like us. Skykids are partially based off them

Except proud stance’s egg son

[boreal nebula]

Doesn't it appear on other instrumento tOo ? Beside guitar and ukulele/lute from Father and Teen but what if it isnt just a Belongings emblem, afterall Teen finds that instrument by chance ...

|| maybe Granda knew some other secret tunnel
https://youtu.be/JU1JLxi0ARg ||

[compact shale]

The average ancestor kid height is noticeably taller than ours.

Not sure why we're built shorter, maybe to not waste earthen materials or to allow us to squeeze into smaller spaces because we're supposed to rescue everyone?

[rigid mural]

do they ? or did they know it was already there ? the caverns aren't far from the belonging area

[boreal nebula]

Grandma is ||Batman|| Confirmed !!!

[half shadow]

Another thing: Eden beam is activated but the color is blue. Eden itself could just naturally have that beam as an established feature before the King arrived and certainly before the Storm

[nimble ingot]

It may be to enforce the fact we are children compared tot he spirits.

[tulip aspen]

fascinating

the child has a glowing mark on their tunic!!!!!!

and the ancestor doesnt

something i will note is that the light on yhe child's tunic is on the TUNIC, can be seen flapping with the tunic, so it likely isn't a part of their chest and is some kind of decor

it also appears on their backside in the same way, so while that light can be confusing, i dont think it shows they are an angelic vessel like skykids are

this logic could very well be wrong tho.
that light's glow is very convincing

[nimble ingot]

That may be a visual glitch as fhe beam is yellow when no clouds are infront of it.

[half shadow]

Oh is it? I know it gets red the closer you get to it in Eden. I think it’s pretty clearly blue in the trailer at least. or hell maybe it just changes colors

[rustic heron]

So here’s a question: How do we know that Ancestors have no light? I know it was mentioned that Sky kids and ancestors are different, but how different are they?

[nimble ingot]

Maybe.
I hope the devs consider taking a look to see what it is should be like.

[nimble ingot]

One possibility is how the darkness targets the chests and it tends to feed on light.
So it is either a representation of the soul being fed on, or that's where the ancestor's light is.

Though please take note, I do support the ancestors have chest idea, as even without the darkness, spirits do bot have chest lights.

[half shadow]

If you mean internal Light, I don’t know if there’s direct evidence saying they don’t, but they can clearly work with Light. Instead of it being a physical aspect of their bodies like Skykids seem to be, they could be imbued with its power or blessed in another way. I think that Skykids are sort of like Ancestors 2.0 in terms of Light abilities because it’s actually baked into their physical bodies vs the (probably) biological Ancestors

[tulip aspen]

they clearly have some light, but not as strong.
they weren't born with the intention of projecting Light, but Skykids are, which is why skids have the chest orifice

[gentle pilot]

Hey does anyone know what the land of sky is actually called?

[rustic heron]

Yes, necessarily. They’re spirits, so they’re made up of only light.

[late wasp]

i will wait for lorechat to be slower for me to respond heh

[frigid tinsel]

Sky, just Sky

[half shadow]

speaking of Ancestors. nobody’s talking about this guy, and i think that should be rectified. here’s what i have to say about them:

they are neat

[nimble ingot]

lol, even with slowmode?

[rustic heron]

Is that true? The only highlighted difference between Sky kids and Ancestors is that Sky kids can fly.

[nimble ingot]

they are a bit reminiscent of a priest with that headpiece.

[tulip aspen]

yep that's correct!
we may not have direct statements but there are obvious visual and mechanical anecdotes as stated in my anatomy doc
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1thcKlrpEPO87cz0hgM5rbMZilC97-2chVEe7uC7WI0c/edit?usp=drivesdk

[half shadow]

Yeah! It’s pretty cool. I like that it gives a visual representation about butterflies are more like raw motes of Light able to power other things

[tulip aspen]

their lack of connection to the Light is what makes them so mortal

[hushed steeple]

If you go about everything ever revealed thinking this way....you will never become surprised by new seasons and updates

[tulip aspen]

(true but being surprised is more fun)

[hushed steeple]

I think ansestors had connection to light and lost it and thats their whole story so

[rustic heron]

That’s your doc. It’s a good doc, but not a source of truth. Is there anywhere else that you cross reference for this point?

[tulip aspen]

it's strictly anecdotal as I say

every point I made there is true is it not?

sky kids are inherently more capable, and i listed every way that's true

[rustic heron]

Also, did you source yourself to validate your own points? That’s circular reference.

[hushed steeple]

Careful Jam, if your head gets too big you might fly away!

[tulip aspen]

I don't recall sourcing myself lolol

if you mean the direct quotations of old passages I've said in lore chat then those are just because I don't want to rephrase them and I have no way to know how to, so instead I just put it in quotes to elaborate that it's just an old thing I said

[half shadow]

I guess we don’t have any hard evidence about the in-depth anatomy differences regarding Skykids and Ancestors/Spirits, other than what can be inferred via the environment. Ancestors have places to eat and sleep, leading me to personally think they were biologically mortal. They could fly with their own Light/cape power, they used vehicles powered by Light, pulled by Light creatures, or powered with diamonds/darkstone. Clearly they can manifest and manipulate Light like creating the butterflies out of pure Light and using it for its energy purposes. We don’t have anything directly saying that Ancestors did or didn’t have internal Light the same way a Skykid does; but their respective abilities with it are different, which is what I think most people use to say they are different. Beyond that they’re also confirmed to be more of a subspecies than the same species of course.

[hushed steeple]

I read earthbound and got excited

[rustic heron]

That’s sourcing yourself.

[nimble ingot]

As an ingame observation the ancestors needed food and rest, which explains there are storage rooms and beds. Ancestors fought and were killed, which can be supported with weapons and memories (ex. fainting soldier).

And lastly, ancestors used to travel to eden as a part of their pilgrimage, but now are trapped as spirits in their realms.

Skykids can fly, survive withoit needing food or drink, can rest for candle collection but does not need tofor other actibites. And can be reborn.

[hushed steeple]

Thats pretty much an assumption that ski lifts dont need food and drink they can bee seen eating and drinking and sleeping and we just kinda assume thats only for gmaoleyay gape game play for is the game

[tulip aspen]

if we only worked off direct sources then we'd never know as much as we do at all

the clay shell Theory wouldn't exist
the omnipresence of the sky wouldn't be as understood
etcetcetc

we're starved for actual content, so i and others just come up with logical explanations to fill in the gaps, and that's how we've made much progress

[rustic heron]

I mean, so can Mario in the game, but that’s because if you were playing galaxy and Mario needed to relieve himself or have a snack every 20 minutes, you’d never play the game again.

[tulip aspen]

exactly, and that's all anecdotal

it's not direct sources from TGC because we'll never get that so that's what we have to work off

[rustic heron]

That’s the thing. You don’t know those things. They’re anecdotes, hypotheses at best, and not even that because they’re not built from a source of truth.

[boreal nebula]

As far as I know even the regular piano has the belongings logo , before even the season was released (it appeare d in Sky Light Awaits for the first Time a piano ) bat the Rhythm Piano doesn't have the same symbol instead it has this

So maybe it's not tied simply to string instruments , maybe the Performer is a distant relative like the drunkyard / errand uncle without a family of their own (till They finally drop their pot of alcoholdarkwater? / to collect the tips and they decided to settle in the Village of Dreams )

Harp is string too, but has no sigil

[hushed steeple]

Skykids could easily be confirmed to need food drink and sleep and lorechat would catch in fire and I would just go

Yall didnt know?

[rustic heron]

I mean, they’re fun, but when we get down to brass tacks, they lose worth.

It’s not that we can’t build off of assumptions, but we can’t use that as arguments against opposing points.

[tulip aspen]

but didn't we just established that those things that I noted are actually true

do you deny that most ancestors can't meditate as easily as all sky kids can?

or that ancestors have a lot of material needs when sky kids don't actually need to build structures and survive anywhere?

are you saying those things don't actually make sense?

[rigid mural]

hm hm ! interesting, perhaps this sigil could be associated with artisan work in general then. I recall we see it on the gates of the valley races too.
But yeah, we can agree it's something to keep track of like and ...

[half shadow]

I mean considering this is a theory chat and not a truth chat… yeah, Skykids not needing to eat/drink/sleep is a theory, not a fact. If that’s what you’re trying to say Lapis I don’t think anybody here is against that, I certainly am not. Skykids could not have eating or sleeping mechanics just because it makes for bad gameplay. They could be made of flesh like Ancestors and have mortal needs like they seemingly did. It’s all just speculation, tho I don’t believe anybody came here with any opposing points and were shot down because of them - which if that happened I don’t think that’s fair and they should be heard out

[tulip aspen]

yeah there's certainly a lot of reoccurring emblems

[nimble ingot]

True.
In gaming lore there is a constant battle between balancing realism, and ingame mechanics.
It would be annoying to play mario and mario has to go the bathroom.

While it would be interesting to see a spirit eat a cookie or comically run to the bathroom. It wouldnt be necessary given there are other things the devs would like to show and are particular in what they choose to show and leave up for the imagination.

[half shadow]

Yeah and cus Sky’s lore does a lot of showing vs telling, we pretty much only have ruins and memories to base off what Ancestor life was like and what it consisted of

[hushed steeple]

Said better than I could

[compact shale]

Wait
Ancestors have cape power and can fly?!

[rustic heron]

I can easily take the opposing stance. If Sky kids had to sleep for every 20 minutes of gameplay, that would be insanely frustrating.

And whose to say ancestors had difficulty meditating? They clearly did it, so it’s not as difficult as anything else.

I mean, imagine that you had a 1/10 chance of any meditation your Sky kid does being successful. That’d be terrible a terrible gameplay mechanic.

[half shadow]

Nope, it doesn’t seem like they could the way Skykids can. They have capes as part of their outfits but they use boats or creatures to move through the air just based off of the memories weve seen

[boreal nebula]

If i recall correctly on Flying Race door its 3 squares connected to a central square

If the belongings symbol means Family and Group, while that 3 or 4 squares is a symbol of Unity and of the whole kingdom (uniting all Realms)

[compact shale]

I heard that it was just supposed to resemble a chain and that the belonging emblem and the Vault symbols aren't related

[half shadow]

I guess when it comes to opposing views it’s less like an argument that needs to be challenged, at least imo, like. It’s not like we’re debating anything. It’s just compiling theories and headcanons based off of what we observe in the game. Skykids could totally need to sleep, or they could not. I don’t think it’s wrong to suggest either way. I’d say there’s more evidence for one way than the other, but as you said because game mechanics are involved it’s likely we’re not going to ever get hard confirmation in the way of like a hunger/thirst/sleep meter, cus that’d be frustrating to deal with.

I do think there’s evidence to suggest that Skykids don’t have the same biological needs still, though, just beyond game mechanics. But it’s literally just me theorizing here.

[nimble ingot]

The lack of a food eating mechanic to regain light is one detail to consider. Though I see what you mean still.

The game is not focusing on survival gameplay, but that does not mean a skykid might enjoy eating food.

[tulip aspen]

for the first and third points I really don't believe it's that deep of a problem fam

when i say meditation, i mean connecting to the Light (meditating to connect to the Light is a common theme in Sky and Launch Sky is at it's base form a thematic narrative)

ancestors couldn't connect to the Light and even distanced themselves from it, we know and acknowledge that constantly

in short, you'll never get your tangible sources because they don't exist and jenova chan burned the last remaining lore bible in their furnace in 2019

i never said any of the logic, theories, or solutions i come up with are canon, just logical and sensible, and i elaborate on that ALWAYS lol

my theories, in the end, are just as valid as anyone elses fam

[compact shale]

Skykid anatomy doesn't seem to be that important to devs, so I don't think it would be too incriminating for Ash to answer questions like this

... Or so I thought, Ash came in once while we were discussing breathing and they didn't answer...

Huh.

[boreal nebula]

Afaik, no, they cannot, I really wanted once to think they could or some could learn it (even before Flight) but during Prophecy or Dreams they finally gave a "corporeal" form riding/surfing a manta in Citadel

[tulip aspen]

exactly!

[boreal nebula]

Can you try to remember where you had read it, please?

[half shadow]

I think at the end of the day it’s good to acknowledge that where there could be a number of people who share the same opinion over Lore/canon facts ie: Thinking Ancestors were biologically mortal and Skykids aren’t, which I thiiiink is at least a semi-popular theory multiple people here hold, there’s always people who aren’t gonna hold that same opinion and have their own collected evidence against it.

Meaning that if somebody comes in here with theories about like, for example, what Skykids eat and where they sleep, anybody who thinks they don’t need those things shouldn’t come in and be all “Actually they don’t need to do any of that and here’s the evidence:” because 1. It’s likely not something we’ll ever get canon evidence to confirm either way, and 2. It just discourages others from sharing their ideas.

[compact shale]

Here is where I read it

...yeah...
#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[half shadow]

To an extent we are all just playing Calvinball here

[nimble ingot]

Where is the bot when you need it.

Yes, the canon lore is wacky.
No, there are infact sources that are viable in the game.

And even though using one's own sources are accepted, it is best to include other sources to add support to ones that are self referencial.
As Lapis put it, it becomes a circular refefence.

[compact shale]

*inserts funny abyss rebuttal pic here

[rustic heron]

That’s fine, but they’re not a source of truth, and sometimes they’re presented that way. Your docs are great: organized, well thought out, the works.

But like you said, it’s as valid as anyone else’s. Which is to say it is invalid as proof.

I’ll wait for tangible sources. Ash is one, and however infrequent her drop is are, I’m happy to wait for them.

[half shadow]

Yeah that’s one thing I’d advise against, tho you can totally reference your own theories and collected evidence I’d caution against saying anything along the lines of implying it’s a communally agreed upon Fact™️

[tulip aspen]

indeed, i never want to get lost in an echo chamber, that's why i love this chat, i but heads with kami and alasdair and lapis etc etc so much and i adore that, it keeps me alive, fluid, considering everyone's possibilities and not just mine

the only quotes of 'myself' i could find are in the krill and Light doc

the PRIMARY reason i quote myself is because i can separate that quote from the rest of the actual evidence, because in those quotes im being less logical and more just emotional

[tulip aspen]

i dont like the qna being our tangible source

id much rather logically conclude things with my evidence, because it's more fun and it makes me feel like a philosophical scientist

[boreal nebula]

Exactly, the compiling is just a way to give another prospective came up together to a better shaped theory or theories, even if with opposite conclusion together they make Lore as a whole ☯️

It's like when I came up with the symbol of Bond/Loss and finished to recall how the philosopher Hegel talked about Thesis Anthesis and Synthesis a 3 face that shapes the whole history, as much as any other thing in life (growth of kids into teens and into adults) and during any kind of dialogs/discussions

[compact shale]

Compiling is pretty necessary in lorechat considering how confusing it can get

But yeah citing sources is important too

[tulip aspen]

again i never say it's concrete, just LOGICAL, and i never assert otherwise, because my writings are not canon.

[craggy narwhal]

Hey does anyone know what cultures or locations the game is inspired by?
I remember seeing something about that but I can’t find it anymore

[half shadow]

I do know that all of my theories in here I’m never trying to state what I believe is a truth worthy of canon confirmation. It’s just things I notice and put together in my noggin as what I think is cool vs what I think is logical. I think Skykids being more like artificial vessels without biological needs given sentience is both a logical assumption, but more importantly I think it’s cool.

My evidence is primarily looking at the ruins of communal resting/eating spaces among Ancestor life versus Skykids subsisting on motes of Light to keep energized. With something like the tea-set, they don’t appear to be actually drinking anything but rather miming or “playing pretend” like how kids do. That’s why I believe it’s not a necessary thing, and it’s another example of them learning about the world via mimicking Ancestor spirits (essentially what they do with emotes).

You can also logically state that I could be wrong, it could’ve just been an example of not including something obvious for the sake of gameplay like Lapis’ Mario Galaxy point. I think both could be likely, but I’m not gonna assume one is truth just because I have evidence for one vs the other.

[rigid mural]

late response but

One thing about Ash, I feel like they're not gonna be allowed to drop huge or complicated lore beans, so far I noticed that they:

• seem to come here out of their own volition (thought it was tgc asking them at first, but they look too busy for that)
• are usually pretty tired, see the second last time they came here where they said they couldn't answer more than surface-level lore stuff
• probably don't know about abyss as much as they do with flight because they took care of the latter and the former is up to another artist, hence why they answer stuff about flight more often
• weren't here for the creation of Sky from start to finish, what went on in the mind of other artists designing the vault or sky kids may elude them

conclusion: most of our questions probably can't be answered by ash, but if we make enough noise... maybe tgc could give us a lore stream. that's the kind of thing that will give us deeper answers
we will need to be a lot, but if there's demand i'm sure tgc will at least consider it

[compact shale]

Ash has headcanoned that we're splashing the tea into our faces

Now since it's an event and its canonicity is more ambiguous, you decide whether to trust dev headcanons or not

[tulip aspen]

they definitely have been acknowledging lorechat more so we'll see

[half shadow]

omg yes i love that image

[compact shale]

The message for those who wanna see

[livid pelican]

Who's Ash? Are they an NPC?

[half shadow]

And! Sky’s inspiration comes from a lot of different cultures. For exame: the new spirits in the Season of Abyss are based pretty heavily on historical Scandinavian “Vikings.”

[craggy narwhal]

The concept artist

[late wasp]

theory: Ash dropped by around the time Abyss started. Being a concept artist, and how in recent updates the teams were just asked to "go wild"; Ash actually dropped by to see what was our interest to give her ideas for the next update, which is very likely she is part of the development team.

[livid pelican]

Ah

[timid river]

I fully agree, which is why I didn't say anything more.
In all honestly I don't play beta, but I do explore in every way possible including OOB areas, I get not everyone does tho wchis why I'm not gonna spoil the secrets :)

[half shadow]

as somebody who doesn’t know how to reliably OOB explore i appreciate you

[livid pelican]

I don't how to go OOB

[rigid mural]

I'd rather not try and guess why Ash does what they do, pretty confident they just drop by because they think it's funny since I know from a reliable source they're a huge nerd.

[half shadow]

ha nerd

[late wasp]

my dad works at TGC ||jk, he doesn't. it's a jk||

[compact shale]

I do find it kinda sus that they've dodged the breathing question. Not even a WAFO. Not sure what that means.

[rigid mural]

I wish devs sharing their headcanons wasn't so risky considering people are biased to think what they say is true, because I think their POV is unique in that they are kinda obligated to look at details we may not pay attention to.
Ash's theory GW had a higher water level is so fascinating, and mentioning it sparked an interesting discussion and even art !

[compact shale]

The fact that Ash headcanoned about this either implies there's something they don't know about Wasteland's backstory, or that they know but the actual thing is NDA while their headcanons aren't.

[rigid mural]

or maybe they just headcanon stuff like we all do

[livid pelican]

What's NDA?

[compact shale]

Non-disclosure agreement

[livid pelican]

Ah I see

[tulip aspen]

ik, i was so happy when she shared the water filtering idea with us

[compact shale]

Idk, I just find it weird for a dev to headcanon about something as big as this when they theoretically know the Canon

So I'm assuming it's just an NDA thing

[rigid mural]

Sky's lore is left to be vague on purpose, devs can have headcanons for it without secretely hiding anything.

[compact shale]

Guess so...

But it would be weird if it was vague even for the DEVS

[rigid mural]

I think a statement has been made where yes, there IS a lore bible, but some details are left in the air. I think such details could be Vault's exact nature as a realm and Skykid/Ancestor anatomy.

[half shadow]

to be fair though; is it a big thing if Skykids breathe or not? i guess it count as them being biological, but they could easily just be able to breathe for XYZ magical reason here

[compact shale]

Ah, I guess it's just my assumptions going wild.

Because this was all pretty much built on an assumption that Wasteland's backstory IS in the lore Bible

[rigid mural]

I do concede GW having a higher water level would be significant enough to tell concept artists so they can design the realm accordingly, but tbf, that theory gets decent proof against it too (why was the boat so close to the walls then ? Why was Salute evecuating ancestors if help was right nearby ?).

[tulip aspen]

yee, that was a really strong argument kami pointed out; they don't NEED a reason to do anything: they're a cartoon character in a videogame lol

[half shadow]

i can understand why Ash wouldn’t want to say anything specific especially knowing if it’s a “heated” topic of debate among lore enthusiasts. I also don’t think all devs are privy to the same knowledge as other devs, so it could’ve just been that they didn’t know the answer either

[half shadow]

another reason I could think of is that it’s just to make them seem more alive when standing still. the little subtle movements really make them easier to imagine as real beings

[tulip aspen]

yea the lore bible is intended to work off big story beats, not really the grime and grit

[compact shale]

I do know about the latter part

I guess it's on a need-to-know basis so they DON'T have to catch up with old dev knowledge

[rigid mural]

I think it's less of a "there's elite TGC staff that know the lore bible from A to Z" (I'm exxagerrating) and more of "some artists got in when the themes and story were already picked, so they wouldn't know the exact reason why stuff is this way".

[tulip aspen]

we have to acknowledge they wouldnt care about animating them robotically; over whatever they actually are, skykid's animation as a goal is to allow us to feel connected to them, so that's the primary reason they can be so human

[half shadow]

skykids breathe because it’s cute new 100% canon fact

[compact shale]

Oof

Cartoon logic wins

*anvil falling on head sound

[tulip aspen]

basically
i always acknowledge that before i dare try to talk with anyone about the breathing as if it confirms or debunks anything lolol

[half shadow]

This is more of a headcanon:

I think a lot of behaviors that Skykids are able to do are based off of them mimicking Ancestors/Spirits. They notice that Spirits breathe in memories, so they make their chests rise and fall in the same way. Same with playing pretend with a tea set. Thematic wise I like this idea because it reinforces how real world children learn through mimicking adults in their lives.

At least for me I think I can use headcanon and theory interchangeably tbh

[rigid mural]

Tebkanlo's remark about hairtousle teen finding the ukulele on their own made me think tho... what if the treasure reef (abyss area) wasn't the only area hosting more than one timeline ? perhaps the forest caves were abandoned at some point, and became this really cool secret area spirits visited while on a hike, kinda like defunct train tracks, hence why a teen could find abandoned instruments.
The battlefield area too. Scouting spirit uses the rubble to climb up their vantage point, meaning that the area tells the story of what was here before (what now became ruins) and the aftermath where said ruins are used as a shelter (by the people the Scouting spirit was warning in their memory).

[half shadow]

That’s a good point! We don’t know that every spirit throughout the kingdom was coexisting at the same exact time

[compact shale]

My belief is that theories are (mostly) headcanons that have been ascended with RESEARCH and LOGIC

[half shadow]

I think we need a big brain skykid emote

[rigid mural]

some are featured in the same memories; slouching soldier, fainting warrior, backflip champion and saluting captain can all be seen in slouching soldier's memory, so they are canonically contemporaries.
In bearhug hermit's memory, cheerful spectator and leaping dancer are seen seemingly talking, so these spirits and the dream spirits are also canonically contemporaries.

[half shadow]

I would love to see more spirits from different seasons interacting in memories

[tulip aspen]

yeah, as fruity said I think there is a difference between headcanons and theories because theories actually use (more) defining evidence, even anecdotal

headcanons seek to write a full picture of the story on their own, while still acknowledging that, because they don't know all evidence, they are making their own content at that point

[compact shale]

There are contemporaries (boatmates) in the Flight finale

Apologetic Lumberjack and HideandSeek Pioneer
Rallying Thrillseeker and Chill Sunbather

(I'll try and find the others later)

[rigid mural]

actually, it would be a good idea to revisit memories and keep lists of which spirits are contemporaries; piggyback lightcatcher's memory features the spirit too

[half shadow]

oooohoh that’s a good idea!

feels very much like the “I’ve connected the threads, I’ve connected them.” meme

[compact shale]

We need a spirit contemporaries chart

Kind of like a ship chart without the romance

[rigid mural]

Apologetic lumberjack's memory all the way back in forest features a nameless "totebag" or "book" bald spirit (named after the item they hold) that is also featured dying in tearful light miner's memory.
So that nameless spirit, lumberjack, tearful light miner, hidenseek pioneer, rallying thrillseeker, chill sunbather and possibly the rest of the sanctuary spirits are contemporaries too !

[half shadow]

I remember someone had a theory about the assembly kids relatives but I can’t remember what it was all I know is it made me sad

[rigid mural]

ash confirmed assembly has a link with lightseekers !

ok ngl this is getting really, really interesting

[half shadow]

OOH YEAH it was about Assembly and Lightseekers being family I think!

[tulip aspen]

they're all tied together

[raw crypt]

From my memory, Twirling Champion features Leaping Dancer and Confident Sightseer
and Thoughtful Director features Praying Acolyte and some scholar, im unsure if polite or meditate

[rigid mural]

polite; meditate has a beard

Twirling Champion has other spirits ? hard to see since the models seldom load even when standing near shards...

[raw crypt]

right right

and yeah! at the end

[rigid mural]

..............................................ohhhhhhh, and this is the part everyone just runs through before it loads.

ok im gonna go on a field trip to gather screens of all these instances, thank you for pointing stuff out ! might compile a rough doc of spirit cameos

[tulip aspen]

ope good luck that'd be amazing

[raw crypt]

I’d be happy to help (honestly was heading to twirl to get a ss GDHDHH)

[rigid mural]

ok, i got piggyback, time for the forest spirits

[raw crypt]

Oh I just remembered a huge one, the whole assortment of spirits shown in the dreams village

[rigid mural]

sanct memories all feature the guide so i think it's fair to assume they're all contemporaries

[compact shale]

Season connection virtual pinboard (I only know these 2 connections are Canon so if there are more then tell me)

Edit: the lightseekers connection is wrong, it's supposed to connect to Assembly birddammit

[late wasp]

interesting colors of the glows

[lofty void]

I don’t think there’s a confirmed connection between assembly and lightseekers though…?

[compact shale]

Yes there is

[lofty void]

OH

[tulip aspen]

prophecy is connected to enchantment somehow?

[rigid mural]

got forest spirits, time for twirl

[rustic heron]

Broke: we never get any lore from TGC

Woke: We don’t get lore because we’re the ones writing the lore bible.

[lofty void]

LIGHTseeKER SPIRITs are PARENTS—?!!?
i never even saw that—

[late wasp]

*write that down*

[lofty void]

but that explains the similar clothing, yeah

[tulip aspen]

hm
but we're talking about if each people from each season had relations with one another, not if the powerful Lights from prophecy are connected the collection of spells from enchantment

[sharp lichen]

They’re gonna turn our headcanons into actual canon

[rustic heron]

Also I got a little terse in those previous messages, so apologies for my tone. I have a very scientific background, and My personal approach to things is to validate against a source of truth to ensure I’m not talking out my waste hole.

[compact shale]

Oof

I was just looking for any sort of connection nahsueufjfbfheg

[burnt shoal]

love the way you worded that...anyways carry on everyone

[tulip aspen]

understandable

[rustic heron]

I’m still confused if portals are canon or gamewise-convenience in Sky.

[tulip aspen]

science isn't much different imo, theoretically anything is possible, everything we as a race has affirmed through science could be wrong, and none of it was real or mattered

that's what makes it fun!

that being said i completely understand cos i get like that too xD

[late wasp]

yes

[harsh pecan]

I think the portals at home are just a gameplay mechanic but idk about the others

[rustic heron]

There are universally agreed fundamental truths in science, like that perception of the world around us is real. Otherwise we delve into the realm of metaphysics, which is no longer science.

I tend to look toward something more-or-less irrefutable, something most people would agree is truth and is robust enough to defend itself against critique.

[long thicket]

Hello

[tulip aspen]

Home isn't a real place to me, so for me the only real places there ever are portals in are the exit of 8p area, and the top of vault before Edengate

8p exit is highly just a game mechanic, and if I say that Home isnt 'real' but the portal in vault exit is a literal portal to home, then for my own purposes that portal isn't real either

[late wasp]

metaphysics is science
Mathematics is metaphysical

[rustic heron]

Welcome to lore chat. We’re currently engaged in several conversations at once. Did anything in particular catch your interest?

[long thicket]

Yes

[sly lake]

Don't forget, there are Lightseeker spirits in the murals on the Forgotten Ark.

[tulip aspen]

yee, my docs definitely have the intention of being able to defend themselves, which they do, otherwise i wouldnt write them cos i never had evidence enough to have those theory ideas in the first place!

[rustic heron]

That’s a popular assumption, but ultimately not true. There are universal truths in mathematics.

[compact shale]

oh my fricking goodness we need threads AAAAAAAAA

[burnt shoal]

possibly both ? i mean yes it's really helpful for the game creators in general but i think they might also have a bit of spice to the adding of them. especially since they're highlighted each time you log in for the first time after a reset and the way eden has such a huge portal as well as the smaller ones that are included in the day-to-day realms; or that may just be the part of a skid who likes to include a bit of lore to anything that has potential... honestly haven't really thought much about the portals until now

[rigid mural]

got twirl, interestingly i think they changed their memory

[sly lake]

Also, a Gratitude spirit shows up in Yeti's spirit memory. And I believe Rhythm and Belonging spirits appear in one of the quest cutscenes.

[harsh pecan]

Which one?

[rustic heron]

So, if portals are canon, then I have a solution for The Cave of Prophecy.

[long thicket]

Is a stupid question

[burnt shoal]

do tell

[compact shale]

Yes, they do! (I'll need to make this chart better)

[sly lake]

I think its the cutscene where the skater gets their costume, if I remember right. Juggler and Sparkler are there.

[harsh pecan]

Say it

[long thicket]

What is the eye of Eden

[tulip aspen]

whaaaa

[harsh pecan]

A realm

[long thicket]

I mean, in itself, that thing, in addition to throwing rocks at you, could be the origin of chaos and all that, but how was it created?

[rustic heron]

Each animal monolith in prophecy cave teleports the sky kid to the same vault-like projection room. The room then uses our past memories of when the first child of light underwent the trials, and creates a trial based on the real experience the first CoL underwent.

[sly lake]

The Enchantment magicians look like they used to trade with spirits who had the Lightseeker job. Getting raw material from them to craft their spells? That's how I interpret the boat mural.

[tulip aspen]

likely from that giant crystal of death

[late wasp]

"Eye of the Storm" is an expression that refers to the center of a Storm
Eden is surrounded by a great Storm, and also the source of said Storm.

[harsh pecan]

The realm itself or the chaos? If it’s the chaos then probably that diamond in part where you die

[tulip aspen]

yes!!!

[raw crypt]

dreams village crew

[long thicket]

The end is a loop of life and death

[rustic heron]

Where is that oob?

[harsh pecan]

Yes

[sly lake]

I love that you included the second OOB picture.

[burnt shoal]

okay you've got me all confused- perhaps i'll need to acquire some more insight on the cave of prophecies first

[long thicket]

We have to repeat every path and actions

[burnt shoal]

they look like they're in a conga line

[harsh pecan]

Nice theory

[compact shale]

Djeie8eufhrhbdbdfhufb uuurghhh

[long thicket]

I only play the Bird and abyss...

[burnt shoal]

each time you go may have a similar baseline but it's not exactly the same each time you do follow the path to ascend, hence the whole rebirth-reincarnation thing going on

[tulip aspen]

fruity out here doin megans work

fruit, remember to include an orange arrow to tlp for the spirits that we confirmed appear in slouch's memory

[long thicket]

Because i stop to play a year i and start to play again

[compact shale]

There's no basegame icon Jam

[tulip aspen]

o oka

[long thicket]

And every Rebirth we are more stronger

[sly lake]

Gratitude leaping spirit shows up in Lightseeker's twirl memory as well. Though they both do reside in the Ice rink, so it could be due to proximity.

[compact shale]

the WHAAAAAA WHERE

[harsh pecan]

Those aren’t seasonal tho

[sly lake]

Right at the very end of twirl's memory!

[burnt shoal]

exactly, if you know a little about the theory behind being reincarnated they say that each time you're reborn into a new life, your spirit gains more experience, hence, you grow and become 'stronger'

[compact shale]

Pics or it never happened

[sly lake]

Confident sightseer is there too in the same memory.

[long thicket]

Yes, but, i need a little help in the eye of Eden

[tulip aspen]

making connections across the kingdom is yet another reason dreams stays winning; think TGC think

[burnt shoal]

what do you need ?

[sly lake]

https://youtu.be/o1Xah2Ot_lQ?t=125 Here!

[long thicket]

I need 7 people..., Because a secret antorch in the drain of stones

[raw crypt]

Under the dreams map towards the coliseum! they’re a very small squiggle from afar and you have to table drive over due to the wind wall

https://youtu.be/DK0_orxOcyM

[burnt shoal]

wait wdym ?

[compact shale]

Done! I'm not gonna post the edit because it might be spammy tho :(

[long thicket]

Yes, in the drain of stones are a secret antorch...

[rustic heron]

Bless.

[burnt shoal]

i've never heard of that before... would you mind telling me more ? i'm intrigued

[long thicket]

I see a symbol of fire in midle of the eternal drain

[burnt shoal]

have you been to the middle or did you spot it from a distance ?

[long thicket]

To the middle

[raw crypt]

Oh it’s might be the braziers you saw, since they have them in the endless rain

[rigid mural]

And boom.

Interestingly, both piggyback and miner feature dark plants, so it's probably worth putting their era near the end of the timeline

[long thicket]

I spot the symbol of fire in the middle of the rain

Later i pass a screenshot

[rustic heron]

Thank you. We’re happy to help you out.

[long thicket]

I am on the Golden wasteland now

See ya

[tulip aspen]

might be annoying but ima also point out that it COULD also just be a gameplay mechanic to burn the plant to get to the memory (albeit one we never see again cos TGC lame)

clearest pic of elder ive seen so far

[compact shale]

oh my goodness that picture is amazing fr

[rustic heron]

It looks like a Cadbury cream egg.

Most light creatures look like the inside of a Cadbury Cream egg.

[rigid mural]

i put it in text. Rythm, Flight and Sanct got cutscenes happening outside of home that feature all the spirits together, which I think is hint enough that they are contemporaries. Lightseekers seem to work together so we could fuse the boxxes including lightseekers together as well.

[compact shale]

Oooh nice!

[nova geyser]

Questions on some screenshots I took!!

1. would these be the Valley’s twins’ weapons?
2. do you think we’ll ever be able to get to those islands, and is that one on the left floating or half covered by clouds?
   3&4) these were such a pain to take— King in the middle, but only four elders/gates?

[rigid mural]

the old beta location for the treasure reef (called crystal bay back then) was the shipwreck in fact ! so you could theorize that the season of abyss takes place in one of these islands

[nova geyser]

😮 oh that’s so cool!! It totally makes sense why they moved the entrance— getting to shipwreck to get to the new area would be a huge PITA— but ahhh that’d have been awesome to sail out to those islands ;; <33 Maybe they ||could make a lil animation of a manta swirling above them once you finish the third quest XD||

[tulip aspen]

they could have added a boat on the other side of the island nearer to commodore, and going on that boat for the first time would unlock the boat between social and abyss

that would be really handy for shortcuts too; imagine have a shortcut straight from weslen social to shipwreck

[frigid tinsel]

Alright lorechat, I just read over 300 messages and all I can say is that y’all are amazing

[rustic heron]

I wouldn’t call myself amazing.

[tulip aspen]

youll never learn tgc, youll never learn
(also fr alasdair, the relations documention will help out a LOT)

[tulip aspen]

well too bad lapis, you're an amazing addition to lorchat and this place wouldn't be what it is without you

[formal skiff]

I’ll do it anyway whether you like it or not 😎

[rustic heron]

You guys should be calling Alastair amazing. Madlad just read 300 conversations.

But I’m flattered nonetheless.

[harsh pecan]

Wow 👏👏👏👏

[formal skiff]

Alastair, you’re amazing too

[frigid tinsel]

I’ve had to read more for the Minecraft server I mod
Ah guys

[rustic heron]

My condolences.

[formal skiff]

Entire lore chat, you’re ALL AMAZING

[compact shale]

*insert big high 5 here

[rustic heron]

Except @pastel brook .

[harsh pecan]

Yes

[lofty void]

I second that

[formal skiff]

Lol yeah, sorry @pastel brook, it actually is that deep

[compact shale]

*insert abyss rebuttal pic here

edit: alasdair, just choose the most appropriate one for now

[frigid tinsel]

I have four, which one

[harsh pecan]

Dang 👀

[formal skiff]

All of them

[rigid mural]

i didnt know minecraft had lore tbh

[rustic heron]

Ah, the one theory all of@lore chat has consensus on: hating skybot.

Brings a tear to my eye.

[harsh pecan]

Same

[keen shore]

Me 🤝 Alasdair
having to read entire novels every time we reopen this chat

[formal skiff]

SAME

[lofty void]

THANK YOU MY EYES HAVE BEEN BLESSED

[harsh pecan]

Hating Skybot makes us unified

[formal skiff]

YOU GUYS I HAD TO READ HOURS OF LORECHAT THIS MORNING

[frigid tinsel]

Oh you have no idea. It’s more vague that Sky’s

[lofty void]

I need to talk in here and discuss lore and theories more often

or more specifically, about dark creature facts and stuff

[frigid tinsel]

Krill are corrupted light creatures. We don’t know what they originally were. Now beings of darkness, they “hunger” for the light within skykids.

There’s a theory that crabs might’ve been born as a side product of power diamonds manufacturing since they’re usually found around the golden molds(?) and pipes. There as hostile and passive crabs, hostile ones having specks of darkness on them, so darkness rabies.

[lofty void]

Ooh, yeah!

But I also was thinking of talking about the creatures we don’t see in person, in Sky.
Some people just go “haha funny animal masks go brr” but I think “Why haven’t we seen any of these animals throughout the realms?”
Ofc I know they’re prolly extinct

[frigid tinsel]

Those animals could’ve existed before but all went extinct

[lofty void]

yeah, yeah
but the question is, why? And when? And how?

[compact shale]

Ash has said that the animal masks are symbolic of the wearer's role, or something like that.

Here's my theory

Theory: Most of Sky's creatures are extinct.

Sky has a lot of animal masks of creatures we haven't seen in-game. We could assume that they're mashups of existing animals in the Ancestor's POV, but let's go through a different path for now.

In the Switch trailer, we can see more spider-like crabs with big towers on our heads, and Earth Prophet has a spider mask. Those crabs were probably what inspired the Earth Trial's creation.

So why don't we see the creatures depicted by masks anymore? Well, I think that the Storm/Disaster also caused mass extinction, and only those animals who either had a lot of light (they could endure more) or a lot of darkness (they took less damage) survived. The rest got disintegrated and the masks are the only evidence of their existence.

[frigid tinsel]

Another idea is that our irl animals are imaginary creatures for the ancestors. So they’re not real, more like folkloric creatures in the Sky world

“Krill are corrupted light creatures.”
Wait til we find out that they’re corrupted light bulls or something /hj

[uncut pond]

Most of my Sky lore knowledge I had before knowing this chat was assumptions based on the parallels to Journey

But now every morning I wake up and see several paragraphs explaining the most specific details about this game's immensely vague lore 😩

This chat is crazy and I love it

[lofty void]

i need a bigger better answer than “darkness corruption” and yeah that seems possible Alasdair!
Suppose a group of creatures, who weren’t corrupted, managed to survive the Eden Storm. And I’m not talking about mantas/whales/fish/light crabs either. Some of them might have gotten corrupted from the storm too, and, off topic (kinda) but there is implied evidence that krills existed during the time of Spirits, EG: Stealthy Survivor
So maybe, some spirits survived the Eden Storm but then were ||killed off by krills soon after||

[keen shore]

They can’t be folklore creatures only because a lot of ancestor outfits have fur or pelts in some capacity, implying that either one of the light creatures is meant to be hairy but was turned bald by the storm (funny explanation) or other animals existed to be hunted and harvested (better explanation)

[compact shale]

There are many stupid ways to get bald. Just ask Boatswain.

[frigid tinsel]

Well devs have said that that krill are corrupted light creatures. The means of darkness corruption are unknown, I think it has to do with the pollution the ancestors produced during power diamond manufacturing. I think Salem (manta remains conglomeration) or Fruity (eaten down to the bone) had other ideas on how darkness corruption may work.

[lofty void]

Both theories sound wonderfully dark🥰

[keen shore]

Also, of course there was a mass extinction. Think about it.

Isle used to be a grassland and is now a barren plain full of sand; every animal who relied on eating grass to live and every animal which relied on eating those animals would either miraculously move to prairie - which is floating and hard to get to - or would die out. Prairie’s floating islands make it a difficult place for any creatures without the power of flight to live. Forest is constantly raining polluted water; it’s hard to find sunshine there, and even if darkstone pollution isn’t painful to other creatures when it touches them, having it as your only water source can’t be good. Valley is harder to pin down, but it being a massive city built on top of any existing ecosystems may have something to do with it — plus we don’t know how proximity to darkstone affects animals. Considering it can powerfully levitate things from far away as seen in the Village of Dreams, if it has an effect, can’t be good. Wasteland and Eden no longer have any sunlight for plants to grow and parts of Wasteland have been completely flooded (Treasure Reef). Vault is artificial so the only animals they’d have on there would be captives, which would probably die out from lack of food or care after all the vault spirits died.

Not to mention the corruption has introduced two entirely new species in the forms of krills and crabs; the latter is less important, but the former is a brand new, massive predator you can’t even get close to without hurting yourself, which doesn’t technically need to rest, eat, or drink, doesn’t die of old age, and lashes out indiscriminately at any sign of movement or life it can find. Good luck avoiding that if you’re an animal who’s never seen anything like it before

[tulip aspen]

isnt it just two gods who wanted to make a weird experiment

and then there's species lore about golems, piglins, vexes and allays, enderman civilization, maybe players, witches, villagers and illagers ect ect with each having their own little possible stories, backgrounds and connections to each other

[compact shale]

There's a MOTD stating that the krill is hungry for light, so light is its diet.

As for WHY they eat light, my headcanon is that they're trying to use the light to purify themselves, but it's not working.

[keen shore]

Don’t know much about Minecraft lore but I can safely say that Steve is probably a god of some kind

[lofty void]

It’s safe to say that krills and ||their bigger, much more powerful cousin we see in one of Abyss’s OOBs|| as well as the ones on the murals of Abyss’ area, can be safely classified as “Apex Predators”

[keen shore]

The question here, though, is whether they can identify a light creature vs a biological one just by looking at it. If Jam is right about ancestors not being light creatures, than given Sneaky Survivors memory it’s safe to say they can’t

[burnt shoal]

i would sacrifice myself if this were to be true it's so sad

[compact shale]

Well, I think they can identify if a creature has light in it or not. I know TLP isn't logical or canon-able, but the krill never got aggressive towards TLP because TLP is a different species and doesn't have a light core like we do... I'm assuming

[frigid tinsel]

Message of the Day in question

[tulip aspen]

ive documented the major relevant krill theories but my writing style is admittedly very biased to my own theories
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1tDfirXPurGw4Trp82xKkH43Rk99DCG6wHRLhcI3xWTo/edit?usp=drivesdk

[compact shale]

give the krill a good scrub scrub scrub

[burnt shoal]

okay this is too much sadness but i adore the theory / observation y'all have going on

[keen shore]

Yeah, like you said I’m hesitant to accept tlp stuff as evidence to begin with, much less evidence canceling out something else, but it is possible. Not saying the krills 100% caused mass extinction, I feel like the lack of sunlight in all the areas they’re in would do that job for them anyways

[burnt shoal]

on my way with my washcloth and the good kind of soap

[lofty void]

Perhaps krills are sort of territorial towards beings without light, but (since Angler’s spirit cutscene shows them being wary, as a krill swims in the water behind them) perhaps the ancestor race saw them like sharks in a way, like we portray sharks as bloodhungry monsters in the media (EG: the movie JAWS)

[tulip aspen]

MotD was really all we need to confirm they only attack beings of Light

tlp was just a tiny nod to that fact, which is nice enough for me

[lofty void]

Angler’s cutscene also implies there were smaller variants of krill too

[compact shale]

I guess the corruption got a smaller version of whatever it was

[harsh pecan]

RIP baby krills

[keen shore]

They’re definitely territorial or violent towards ancestors, although this only gives us new information if ancestors are not beings of light

Also, even if they’re only hungry for light, they don’t necessarily have to only attack light creatures. Maybe they indiscriminately attack things that aren’t just crabs (which they’ve quickly learned don’t help) in the hopes they’ll get a light creature

[compact shale]

I'd think they might only attack light creatures. Attacking things that don't have light in them wouldn't be worth wasting energy on. Which may or may not be important considering how scarce light is. And they have no digestive system and I feel (headcanon) that they feel emaciated 24/7

[keen shore]

My argument is that they can’t tell whether something is a light creature before they attack it, so they wouldn’t know until after they’ve speared it. It’s not like we have very much to test this idea with, though

[compact shale]

*crucifies a drained skykid and waves it at a krill

[tulip aspen]

perhaps, but I think that that light shining from their eyes has to do more than just be illumination

I'm not necessarily saying I headcanon that they can scan us......
but I am saying that

[lofty void]

Also, dumb theory that i just made, but maybe ancestors had blood, and krill are kinda like sharks (once again) and they can smell blood from miles away, becoming extremely hostile when they caught the scent, explaining why in Stealthy Survivor’s cutscene, the krill was intensely looking around, and not in the way they look for us when we get out of their sight
However skykids don’t have blood, and this would explain as to why we can hide from them without being scouted out

[keen shore]

Since they sometimes don’t notice me if I stand completely still, I personally assumed it worked like a motion detector. I get the feeling they don’t have vision exactly like we do. Might even have something like heat vision (this would explain why they go after us with Great Eagerness) or have difficulty spotting things that are standing still, but fixate easily on movement

Again, this is all speculation, and not super important. If we desperately wanted to know how krill vision worked we’d probably first have to find the creature it was pre corruption and analyze that as well

[tulip aspen]

why do you assume that they are aggressive to ancestors?

nod is the only ancestor who ever acknowledges krills exist, and that's all we can know for sure about ancestors interacting with krills

[keen shore]

Easy!

Stealthy Survivor hides from them. Courageous Warrior (I think that’s their name) stands frozen in fear when encountering one. Angler gets super anxious when one is nearby

[compact shale]

and whoever painted that krill in the Prophecy mural (though since it is a prophecy they may not have known what it is)

[keen shore]

And if I’m right on the spears, those were created specifically to kill them. I don’t think I’d want to eat krill meat so it was probably a self defense weapon

[tulip aspen]

ngl krills always spot me instantly if i stand out in the open and their spotlight hits me fam

warrior and stealthy aren't confirmed to be interacting with krills, i still believe their memory, along with all the other base-wasteland spirits like faint and salute, are about the war not the post apocalypse

however yes i completely forgot about abyss lol

[lofty void]

Krill meat? Yum 😋

[tulip aspen]

yes, i assume it was part of the prophecy, they didnt know what it was, they just saw it in their vision

[frigid tinsel]

yea, this is hard i have a hard time believing krill didn't target ancestors because in ancestor memories where krill are present, they're in fear of them.

[keen shore]

When both the warrior and the survivors’ spirit memories replay, doesn’t a red krill light shine over them, implying that’s what they’re hiding from? (For example, survivor hides behind a skull to escape the red light; when it hits the warrior, they freeze)

[compact shale]

Do krills even HAVE meat? They're flying skeletons

[opal heart]

Do the Elders have names?

[lofty void]

Yum, krill tendons 😋

[tulip aspen]

i thought the red spotlight was only in stealthy's memory, and when i first played through the game i assumed it was a war spotlight, but that the skykid parallels it with their current situation

we also have to remember with the cinematic trailer they could have used the (theoretical) Light Dragon as war wagons that spotted enemies

[keen shore]

Just listing possible other reasons I would think for ancestors wanting to kill them :-) you could argue their armor plates or horns are useful somehow, but I don’t think we ever see them being used

[compact shale]

Soooorta...? They're long-scrapped concept names, but fandom still uses them because

Isle: Daleth
Prairie: Ayin
Forest: Teth
Valley: Samekh (this name is for both twins, though in the fandom Sah usually refers to and Mekh usually refers to
Wasteland: Tsadi
Vault: Lamed

[opal heart]

0-0 Thank you so much!

[tulip aspen]

is the spotlight really shown in courage too?

[lofty void]

I just realized that in Fainting warrior’s cutscene, said spirit seems to die from blood loss (iirc they were clutching their side as if bleeding out from a wound at said area, as well as limping

[frigid tinsel]

where is Courageous Warrior's spirit? I could go there now to check

[tulip aspen]

the stance in the fake temple with first krill

[frigid tinsel]

wait is that the bloody carry spirit?

[keen shore]

Yeah, new headcanon is that they got speared by krill horns. Imagine a krill rushing at you with those, only instead of being made of hard clay armor, you’re squishy and full of blood (I think this is the worst way I’ve ever described human esque anatomy)

[tulip aspen]

that's faint, not the stance

[lofty void]

Oh wait i misread

[frigid tinsel]

that's Fainting Warrior. I've uploaded their cutscene before: #lore-discussion-spoilers message

[keen shore]

Some poor ancestor has DEFINITELY gotten impaled by a krill before if they attacked them in the same way as they attack us

[lofty void]

i lost too many braincells from reading incorrect quotes that i mixed up two spirits
hey in my defense they have similar names

[compact shale]

there are sky incorrect quotes?

[lofty void]

Prolly, yeah

[frigid tinsel]

guys its Courageous Soldier not Warrior: https://sky-children-of-the-light.fandom.com/wiki/Golden_Wasteland#Courageous_Soldier

[compact shale]

oh, i thought that's what you were reading

[keen shore]

OHHH mixed them up with someone else. Sorry, was just naming them from memory

[frigid tinsel]

there's a sky-incorrect-quotes blog on tumblr

[lofty void]

Don’t worry we all make mistakes

[lofty void]

now there is

[frigid tinsel]

oh yea and the incorrect quotes generator

[lofty void]

it got better

Anyways gonna go back to reading more incorrect quotes (and generating them as well) seeya folks

[compact shale]

no there isn't?

[keen shore]

Help there are so many images in my mural master list that when I opened the doc to update it Google docs crashed 💔

[frigid tinsel]

Courageous Soldier just walks nonchalantly

and stands

[compact shale]

ah yes, standing

so deep

so memorable

[frigid tinsel]

there are no krill or even spotlights in their memory. the spotlight in the one pic is from the krill there in the present

[late wasp]

it is always curious how that krill comes out of the water

[compact shale]

it's just... there

[frigid tinsel]

maybe they're called "Courageous" Soldier is cos they appear cool calm collected despite the fact there are krill roaming about?

[compact shale]

wow much beautiful much stand

[frigid tinsel]

oh there's a sky incorrect quotes tag not a blog, I was mistaken.
not much, just the Elders being gay trainwrecks.

[harsh pecan]

Lmao🧍

[keen shore]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-yA8OdJ2NzwNc8c15sQB3UALYn3psT3c6mWgIV64jFM the mural doc is finally done…

[long thicket]

I have a question

[frigid tinsel]

ask away

[long thicket]

What happens in the Golden wasteland?

since the gold in the name brings to mind a golden age where it was the best place where you could live and at the same time there was no dangerous monster like the Krill, but it happened in an incident and there were warriors where everything was destroyed, more there are areas that were not so affected

[keen shore]

Two things happened to it!

The first is a war, you can see this at the battlefield area just before the temple where there are swords, shields, and spears scattered around and a defensive fort (this is where you relive the lookout scout spirit). It’s currently unclear what this war was against; the two main theories include a civil war or the idea that all the defenses were against krill attacks.

The second is the same disaster that destroyed the kingdom and killed everyone. This one affected it the most, causing the storm clouds overhead and spreading the same corruption that created krill and crabs further.

Additionally, some parts of wasteland were flooded (like the buildings underneath the water in treasure reef) although it’s unclear how widespread this was and when this happened.

Hope this helped!

[long thicket]

Thank You very much

And the secret forest, why the rain cause pain?

[frigid tinsel]

it's also liable that the power diamond/darkstone tech manufacturing created a lot of pollution that was mostly dumped in Wasteland, killing the local wildlife and increasing darkness

[keen shore]

No problem! And the rain in forest is polluted in the same way as the rain in wasteland, which is why they both cause pain

[long thicket]

Oh

And, What happens (sorry for My Bad English) la bóveda del conocimiento?

[frigid tinsel]

that's the Vault of Knowledge in English, btw

[long thicket]

What happens There?

And why we teleport to the eye of Eden?

[keen shore]

This is a hard topic to explain without raising MORE questions, but the short answer is this. Most of vault isn’t real, it’s an illusion. We’re still ascending through it, but everything we see after the second floor is part of the illusion, which is why so much of the landscape doesn’t make sense. The place we teleport to at the end of the elder’s cutscene is the actual, non illusionary final floor of Vault; looking around you can tell it looks a lot more destroyed and solid than the other floors did. Since the majority of Vault is underground below the Eden mountain, this massive destruction was likely caused by an earthquake set off by the disaster I mentioned earlier

[harsh pecan]

Wow 👏

[long thicket]

Thanks

[tulip aspen]

ah gotcha, tysm fam

[tulip aspen]

oh my megan its gorgeous

i recommend either removing the "page split" visual or spacing each section so that each major section are within their own pages

you can also use tables with only two columns to make the images sit inside each column which will allow you to shrink them down and compact the doc a bit, cleaning it up

[keen shore]

Wait is the page split still on there? I’m typing it up on mobile and it automatically gets removed on my end, seeing what I can do to fix that

[tulip aspen]

ah okay
yeah it's there for pc

[frigid tinsel]

page splitting is a user-end view thing

[tulip aspen]

okay i have finished all my finals, i can finally get back to writing in peace!!!!!!!!
(i also finished the cert mastery, ig thats important too)

gonna go play halo infinite for too long for tho lmao, night yall

[keen shore]

night!! I need to sleep soon as well but am putting it off

[frigid tinsel]

Wondering what Lookout Scout saw

They noticed it from below and climbed the broken fortress to get a closer look before blowing their horn, alerting unseen others. Must’ve been some sort of danger. They seemed frightened

[nimble ingot]

That would be very nice.

On a side note:
Knowing the lore is like opening a pandoras box of theories and vague canon lore. One would either love it or hate it.

Knowing what happens in beta is a similar thing. One would either be glad for what made it to live, or become bitter and/or upset at what got changed or cut from beta.

[compact shale]

Pandora's box of honking moths and unbridled krills

[nimble ingot]

I would like to add onto the theory with a possible answer.
There is concept art showing megabird in orbit, the human world below and the sky world (that is probably the name of the world in Sky) in between.

Now while that would be hard to prove with the sky worold having oceans. The world of Sky could verywell exist in a dimension of its own, and the only way a person from earth (the human world) were to reach Sky, would be through the clouds.

It is not uncommon to see Sky have portals around the realms, some are literal and others are meditative.
Whether this technology was there from the start or added by the ancestors at a later stage is unclear. However, there enough magic in the world to connected the realms to each other.

[rigid mural]

I love the part where they take a break to catch their breath

[compact shale]

What does this have to do with Sky's animal biodiversity and how most of it is dead

[pastel brook]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/593565781166391316/832872714967842826/Untitled90_20210416150354.png

[compact shale]

SKYBOT YOU CAN'T JUST SAY THAT ANYMORE (insert funny rebuttal here)

[pastel brook]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/593565781166391316/832872714967842826/Untitled90_20210416150354.png

[harsh pecan]

But it is deep

[pastel brook]

How do you do, fellow Krills Sky kids?

[compact shale]

coffee (credit to Alasdair)

[pastel brook]

Hey @formal skiff, do you think people like me?

[harsh pecan]

“LoOk fAm, iTs nOt tHat dEeP”

[nimble ingot]

I have with my moth assistant.
The krill attacks regardless if the poor skykid had light, or was unlit.

This either implies even when the skykid's light is out, there is a very small amount of light in them.
This could either be the cape that holds the winged light, or possibly an ingame feature.

I would love to know if the devs would consider coding in a scenario where krills would either ignore unlit skykids, or alter its behaviour to reflect the state of the skykid.
Ergo they can switch targets (and reset their aggression timmer mind you) when a skykid with more winged light is spotted.

That or perhaps the devs perhaps explain what about the skykods in particular would be triggering them.
If it is the capes, then it makes sense why the krill repellent thoroughly covers the skykid in darkness dust.

[compact shale]

The krill repellent W H A T

[pastel brook]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/593565781166391316/832872714967842826/Untitled90_20210416150354.png

[harsh pecan]

We don’t

[harsh pecan]

Bruh

[nimble ingot]

Brave soldier took a route that implies they were avoiding krill. That, or understandably, is the best route up there. The brave stance though still supports the idea they had to face something that would frighten him.

Steathly survivor's memory shows them hiding behind a pillar as a red light passes over them.
Currently, only the krill are the ones that has a red light.
I assume the reason why the memory had red light instead of blue would be because the spirit was added in tbe game during light awaits, and the krill back then had red lights instead of blue. And the devs did not think to update the memory since.

[nimble ingot]

I forgot to add the other half. My apologies.

With the connection between the worlds, the human world would be able to influence parts of the sky world.
Assuming this is a viable theory, it mey help enforce the meta details of sky such as how candles and flying boats were one of the earliest creations we see instead of a stone wheel and a torch. Or why the temple in valley resembles that of a colliseum and not like the other temples.
It may also extend to the spirit's professions, where it explains why there are warriors that weild spears, swords and shields, and why the musicians can play instruments ranging from the horn, to a modern piano.

We cannot apply a traditional tiemline of progress in sky, because there are too many gaps in the ancestors evolution from a primitive civilisation to the modern (or an equivalent) of the vault or valley.

If the ancestors were somehow aware of the human world, perhaps they got their ideas from there.

Perhaps the memory cubes in vault were not of the sky world?

[hushed steeple]

I know skybot, I know.

[nimble ingot]

[Last reply to a past message]

I have a theory that the spirit was originally meant to hint to players about a creature lurking about in the clouds above wasteland.

There is concept art that shows this (not the spirit point to it, but a very large creature flying in the clouds). The reason why this not the case in the game is because the plot changed upon the global release.

Some of non-season spirits have not changed since their time in Light Awaits and the scout is one of them.

Some spirits were updated though. For example, the pointing candlemaker (formerly called pointing pilgrim), ushering stargazer, pouty porter, hide and seek pioneer, bowing medalist, backflipping champion and proud victor.

[rigid mural]

Rejecting Voyager.
Could lightseeker orbs be dangerous ? Why is a dark plant growing out of this spirit ?
Tell me your theories, I want to see everyone's take.

What if something in their jar reacted, we see dark plants growing out of pots in the prairie caves.

[compact shale]

Could be. What grows dark plants tho?

[storm herald]

I want to know from anyone here, how do you think the elders came to be or how they were picked to be elders? They're much larger than regular skykids but, I want to see what you guys think and why as to how they get chosen

[compact shale]

some think they're fallen/disgraced gods

[dawn reef]

Any document about the skykids?Please?

[harsh pecan]

I think they were chosen because of their exceptional skills compared to the spirits and connection to Megabird (?) so the spirits made them their leaders, or they were always the leaders idk

[compact shale]

Just a sec, here comes your document... Credit to Jam

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1thcKlrpEPO87cz0hgM5rbMZilC97-2chVEe7uC7WI0c/edit?usp=drivesdk

[dawn reef]

Thank you

[tulip aspen]

eh i still think it's a war spotlight personally

i dont (want to) believe base-game spirits interacted with krill, and ig thats just my personal bias

[tulip aspen]

see i thought scout was about the war too tho

hes looking away from eden and the temple, towards where attackers would have come from

he sees something, and sounds the alarm with his horn

id say its pretty obvious scout is about the war, but it's yet again my personal bias lolol

[compact shale]

too bad because of game limits, we don't get to see what they saw (it's probably too big for the game to render)

[tulip aspen]

id argue that if they were creative enough they could show a low res horde of enemy ancestors and war wagon Light Dragons

however, i also prefer not being able to see it as a moth, whatever it is

left a lot more mystery, and for me to assume he was alerting his people to an incoming army, and for y'all to assume it was some dark creature ig

[compact shale]

oh you're right

if we can see what they saw (it being low-res could be justified by it being from the spirit's pov and not objective pov) then that would change a lot hahhaha

edit: oooh raider essay

[nimble ingot]

I think the reason why we cannot see what the spirit saw was whatever it was supposedly got scraped in development. (Hypothetical, there is not much evidence to work with)

In Light Awaits there was a creature that seemed to have been ised to foreshadow what would happen at the end of the game.
So far, it seems like the whale partly filled in for that role since then.

The creature was as large, if not larger than the whale. And the only ingame proof if have of it is the small creature that I call an eel, though I have seen other people call it a dragon fish or a mosaic eel (TGC please do share the names of these things).

So far the creature may have been intended to briefly appear throughout the realms. In wasteland, it would have been up in the clouds.

[half shadow]

I’m team Mosaic Eel it’s pretty. Anatomy wise it’s more fishlike but Mosaic Eel is dramatic.

[tulip aspen]

is the creature what showed in the scouts memory in light awaits tho?

i am still personally extremely suspicious of taking evidence from light awaits unfortunately, because i have never once heard what it's full narrative and plot was about

i really wish there was fu gameplay footage of it somewhere....

[nimble ingot]

I agree that applying Light Awaits lore to the current game is risky. Seeing that a lot of changed since then.

This is one of the rough theories that has potential. When read in between the lines, there are some parallels.
Light Awaits was a part of Sky once, it is just a matter of rearranging the pieces to comolete the new picture.

I think the creature (mega mosiac eel) would have been in the clouds above the battlefield. Where it would briefly appear and then disappear again.
Perhaps even make a sound to telegraph its eerie presence.

It is either that, or a similar creature (perhaps a corrupted version).

I can link you some videos with its gameplay.
There are some on youtube, though it takes a few minutes to look for good ones. Most of the old videos are interesting, there are few of them had capture noteworthy details.

[silk hinge]

i have a question, are the elders and spirits the same kind of creature? why are the elders so big?

[compact shale]

1. Probably not
2. idk pal

[dreamy fiber]

i have come with a question.

IS THIS THE BIRB
OKAY THANKS AAAA

[compact jungle]

Not exactly lore but..
How do skykids see when their eyes are always closed without their masks?

Why don’t skykids open their eyes without a mask?

[tulip aspen]

i mean a lot has changed since the tom zhao timeline, yet i still consider 60% of it relevant, and even evidence!

i just need to know for myself what actually happens in LA

[night pecan]

hey lore chat

[tulip aspen]

elders seem to be special deities that were sent by the Light to help save the ancestors. They are probably big to notate being higher, godly powers

ancestors (what spirits were called before they died) are weak mortal beings, they came from the Light but don't seem to belong here, and need to return to the Light

[night pecan]

do we know if anything is on the island in the distance? i saw something glowing while i was flying to the shipwreck

[tulip aspen]

ive heard it was a bug or something but im sure someone else could tell it better than i could

[boreal nebula]

Good notes, I think we summed up pretty much all we know or understand of them

[boreal nebula]

Lightseekers seems to be collectors of lost souls from around the realms (iirc there should be a conceptart of that somewhere)

Maybe they saved so many souls that it unintentionally lured the dark plants (Which in other conceptart trapped the souls/tiny sparks we collect daily)

[compact shale]

Lightseekers? More like light morticians! /hj

[night pecan]

lightseekers grim reapers confirmed?

[compact shale]

idunno

Imagine if you just wanted to give some poor bloke a good funeral

But then their soul reached the coliseum and the Valley twins bonked them

[nimble ingot]

It reminds me of home island.
There is even a small flimpse of light there sometimes.

[late wasp]

I would like to make two observations regarding the Golden Wasteland

1️⃣ after doing my eden run yesterday, i noticed how the flowing stream of birds is actually using the pipes to ascend the mountain.
it is my belief that the pipes were installed as some sort of highway/tunnel for the birds, on the path of ascension.
if said tunnels were corrupted for another purpose, it's up for exploration
but all and all, the pipes had living light creatures flowing in them.

2️⃣ one of the many things that bother me in golden wastelands, is the use of walls, because it implies terrestrial warfare. we have been calling the "wooden pikes" palisades, but in fact they are: chevaux de frise. why the distinction matters will be explained in the following:

i realized that the walls could have been used simply to protect the settlements from the sea. walls against tsunamis or floods. that's all for the walls. this would explain why you would have walls, if your enemies can just fly.

now about the chevaux de frise:

These included underwater constructions used to prevent the passage of ships or other vessels on rivers, or as anti-cavalry measure consisting of a portable frame (sometimes just a simple log) covered with many projecting long iron or wooden spikes or spears.

[silk hinge]

ooo i thought the elders are like king in Tom's consept arts, like they were small like prince and then they became big like the king, but of course that version of the king is not canon lolll

[boreal nebula]

LOL, it's not like they ran around the realms with a scythe xD

I added myself into a (lonely skykid on V Day) meme last night and I imagined a saxophone would look a bkt like this in Sky

[spring oyster]

Chipping in on the 'why so many masks of animals we haven't seen?' - wasn't the kernel inspiration for Sky meant to be that it is a kingdom in the sky above the clouds? As in, there is a planet (very likely Earth) below that is unaware of their strife and existence (after all, we have no relevant measurements to scale their size). So I assumed that the Ancestors had just seen creatures from the world below in their travels (possibly after inventing boats) and that's where those motifs arose

[boreal nebula]

I think they simply could fly near those pipes. ( I hope there will be a season based in Eden or that at least unlock a Pneumatic "Postal" system to get us inside Eden from, let's say, Forest Temple secret room, sealed behind a door, which is just a remnant of Light Awaits)

After all inside Eden Giant Pipe there is water with crabs (becuase it got corrupted somehow) and around the last paet of the 1 Eden area you can jump of the cliff of the barrack and find a pipe with water flowing sound (you can land inside and see a little stream but get no effect from that water, maybe it's an approximation but it could be a sign of clean water pumped to Eden for some reasons, I'm fond on watercooling system)

And if you jump of that cliff by walking toward the base of the cliff you get a point wher water sound is so strong you get warped to your last checkpoint (it was there even before Proohecy, but only recently I thought it might be a mechanics similar to Water Trial coolness freeze us... so I have a riddle there)

[jolly anchor]

WAIT WHERE DID YOU FIND THAT?/GEN

[spring oyster]

@jolly anchor that's the last image of the game before the 'thank you for playing' text

[jolly anchor]

OH I SEE TY

[boreal nebula]

About palisades/wooden pikes, I've previously stated my interpreation as anti krillcharges for the fantery (also recallin me how hoplites in Ancient Greek used special shields and long spears as a middle range defencive-offensive strategy)

[spring oyster]

I DID wonder what that constellation was though

[boreal nebula]

The Switch trailer seems to implies pioneers/refugees from distant lands reached Isle, so maybe there is a bit of truth in what you said

Excuse me, how that relates with Lore and Sky? @hushed steeple

[jolly anchor]

I belive its one of those scam discord bot things

[nimble ingot]

Ooh.
I would like to see where these were exactly!
If I recall correctly, most of them are near the base of fhe fortress. Would the battlefied have had a moat?
I wonder where the boats went that would go over the water (would they be the ones in the graveyard?)
And lastly, how would the soldiers have fought? If they were indeed stone golems, then it must have been a fantastical , yet harrowing, battle in the water.

[boreal nebula]

Funny thing, I reacted with :huh: to @ hu

[late wasp]

<@&600489743716712458>

[nimble ingot]

There is no place for dodgy advertisements in the lore chat.

[late wasp]

sanctity of the vault of lore shall not be violated lol

[nimble ingot]

The onluly form art allowed here is Tom Zhao's art, dev art, TGC art and memes.

We dont need some course on how to trace stickfigures.

[noble lance]

I would recommend using #contact-the-mods in the future though

[nimble ingot]

Has anyone done that yet?
It may not be wise to spam them.

[noble lance]

The whole purpose the contact the mods channel is to report stuff like that without having to ping the entirety of mods, so I'm sure they are prepared for instances where people might end up reporting something multiple times

[late wasp]

I will check in an instant, but going by this rough map I collaged together from the wiki, it seems it's only in the battlefield.

[nimble ingot]

Took a look at the contact the mods channel.
Pinging them is for serious matters.

I am sure you did not mean to do it, though.

[zealous sedge]

thank you!

[nimble ingot]

That is a very cool frog you got there. 👀

[grand locust]

Krill. Why.

What is the lore for the krill?

[silk hinge]

king statue with circle?!

[jolly anchor]

Yea what is the lore for the krills

[frigid tinsel]

Old words cos too tired for new words

Krill are corrupted light creatures. We don’t know what they originally were. Now beings of darkness, they “hunger” for the light within skykids.

Well devs have said that that krill are corrupted light creatures. The means of darkness corruption are unknown, I think it has to do with the pollution the ancestors produced during power diamond manufacturing. I think Salem (manta remains conglomeration) or Fruity (eaten down to the bone) had other ideas on how darkness corruption may work.

[jolly anchor]

Ohhh

[late wasp]

I believe the "hunger" part is more subjective though. They can also just "hate" light.
What we know objectively is that they attack light creatures.

[jolly anchor]

Sorry I am p new to sky lore
What is the power diamond manufacturing?

[rustic heron]

Ancestor make battery. Also make pollution.

Maybe make crab? But always make way for doom of civilization.

[late wasp]

On the Tragedy - Part 1
⠀⠀⠀It's subtle and mostly told through level design and mechanics. but if you notice how butterflies (and creatures of light in general) replenish your energy, you can see they can become a source of power.
⠀⠀⠀in Isle of Dawn 🏝️ we also see many flying boats full of jars 🪣. Later in the Daylight Prairie 🌄 we see what's inside those jars: butterflies . We free a few during the Prairie Elder cutscene, and in a few other places in the game. There was this large operation of collecting and exporting butterflies in jars through flying boats.
⠀⠀⠀In the Hidden Forest 🌲, subtitled "discover the source of Ancient Power" we receive the answer what this whole operation was for. Specially the gate to the Forest Elder temple we see how they cut down trees and used these jars of butterflies, to create Power Crystals 💎. These Crystals are even shown in the Forest Elder cutscene, as they craft a new one and put our fire inside. (basically what they were doing with the butterflies). In the Forest we also see that they mined a substance called "Dark Stone". Dark stone is the raw material that can be turned into Crystals.
⠀⠀⠀These Crystals were used to power all sorts of machinery (which we have been using so far, opening gates, creating flying platforms etc). In Eden, the red stone sucking the life out of us, is "darkstone" on overdrive. Similarly, it is implied the huge crystal is a giant Crystal trying to absorb the power of the World.
⠀⠀⠀There is a whole another topic about Wasteland, the Vault and Eden. But these 3 areas (Isle, Prairie, Forest) tells the bulk of the backstory of the game.

@jolly anchor a summary I made a while ago.

[jolly anchor]

Oh I see ty!

[rustic heron]

That’s a high level overview. There’s significantly more nuance, but that should be enough to get you started.

[jolly anchor]

I see I see
Thanks yall so much!!

[nocturne quest]

I’m convinced that the Golden waste lands were probably once apart of the journey world

[jolly anchor]

They look so similar!!!

[late wasp]

Flower/Flow/Journey were games developed under contract to Sony; TGC does not own the rights to those IPs (Intellectual Property).
From a legal standpoint alone, it is near impossible for Sky:CotL or Journey to share an universe, unless Sony wants to partner with TGC, which is highly unlikely, because it would diminish the value of both IPs (Journey and Sky:CotL).

[nocturne quest]

Ah, okay, still a fun thought to have though

[late wasp]

I agree, I prefer to imagine the Journey world is one of the planets we see during the Ending cutscene. Like how in Orbit there are streams of light coming from many different directions, likely many different worlds.
||but sadly this will never be canon, just a nice idea||

[nocturne quest]

Yeah, and I noticed pillars in the golden waste land and there were similar in journey
Could just be a small reference but highly unlikely
Most likely a coincidence

[uncut pond]

A lot of stuff in Sky is straight up copied from Journey, for example the weird mountain we cross that separates Isle from Prairie's social space is the same one that sends you to your next life in Journey.
Also Sky's gameplay and in-game plot are more or less the same from Journey but with more flavour

Sky is mostly references to TGC's previous games

[leaden mesa]

Is there a page where I can read up on lores?

[half shadow]

Well it has been described as Journey’s spiritual successor/sequel, though they can’t officially connect the two games due to Journey no longer being a TGC IP

just realized somebody already said that don’t worry about it

[tulip aspen]

there are actually concept art that the king is just a giant mech, and the prince just climbs into the head to control it

we have no solid evidence on that still being the case and the prince still being trapped inside the corrupted mech somewhere deeper into the storm, but it's just what i personally believe

[tulip aspen]

what enemies would be flying? the warriors on light creatures and Light Dragons?

or are you referring to the "war with darkness" theory

[late wasp]

Dark Dragons mostly. Or even Light Creatures like the original concept by Tom Zhao (which was likely abandoned).

I don't personally subscribe to the Civil War theory, it has far too many problems in my view. One major one being how the two sides are seen coexisting in the Eden Ruins. One room (end of the 1st area) even having "shrines" for the Sun Shield and the Dual Blue Swords.

[tulip aspen]

but the message of the day says they want your Light, not that they hate it

[wise rampart]

boat fighter jets

[tulip aspen]

this is amazing fam

[late wasp]

Ah very good! I didn't know that. But still "hunger" implies the want comes from a lack of light. Which might be something else, rather stay objective and just say they "want" light.

Maybe they hoard light like Dragons would hoard treasures. Not necessarily a hunger, but just a greed, etc.

Given by how the ways of interpreting it can be varied, it's best to remain within objective information.

either way, I didn't know that! thank you, Jam!!

[tulip aspen]

anyone have pictures of these shrines?

also nope sophos, it explicitly says they're hungry

i asked all the questions in my doc before assuming, trust me lolol
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1tDfirXPurGw4Trp82xKkH43Rk99DCG6wHRLhcI3xWTo/edit?usp=drivesdk

[keen shore]

Totally going to explore the known refineries later to see if I can find jars/wood near them, that would confirm the theory that they’re part of the recipe. I will say that I don’t think the wood was part of the recipe, just because it doesn’t seem to have a relation to darkstone itself (for instance, we know darkstone needs light for power, so butterflies make sense) My first guess is that the wood was used for temporary architecture and warped and rotted away over the course of time due to high moisture content in the clouds.

[late wasp]

[tulip aspen]

mood

[keen shore]

I think I have pics of the “shrines” in my mural doc because I counted the carvings on them as important. Both are sun shields, the only difference is that one is broken - they’re not elevated or anything

The swords are put up on the wall though. I call this room the armory for that, just because it looks like you could walk in and grab them

[late wasp]

I wish I could share my Switch screenshots.
But if anyone on mobile can, it is in that room with the first Winged Light in Eden, before the door leading to the second map.

On one wall there is the Sun Shield mounted, on another there are two swords crossed ⚔️ mounted on a wall. Under both there are those small pyres.

I can them "shrines" because later, after entering the 2nd map, we come across that gate with the same relief as the Isle Temple. This gate is activated by lighting two lights, right? but if you look at the pyres, they are placed perpendicular to the floor.

meaning: those pyres were placed after the Eden buildings were ruined.

[tulip aspen]

the fact that krill have changed so much as a concept is why i can never subscribe to the dark creatures/light creatures war

i really dont think the ancestors had significant quarrels with creatures besides them sometimes being hostile nuisances

because of this debunk, that is actually one of the primary reasons i have to subscribe to the TST theory: there's just no other possible explanation to the battlefield; at least with me being certain they couldnt have been fighting krills anyways

[late wasp]

note how the Sun Shield on the left was accompanying the two Blue Swords.

[tulip aspen]

"the second thing, is the creatures

i really like how in this concept of the story, the creatures were sort of like the spirit beings in Avatar TLA and TLo Korra, ancient beings from another plane that live in harmony but are disturbed by the culling of the balance of nature via technology

HOWEVER, creatures have been given a more stagnant and set anatomy past launch

while it'd be so damn cool to see mantas become shrieking demon monsters that fly at you and rip out your eyes if you dare to activate a power diamond, darkness has been given a more set definition than it did before, and is moreso a corruption, corrupting the creatures and ancestors in a pollution way and less of a magic way

darkness is just there theory:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lhsvq0fS9-i2do0pXwoZCmci_42yeVtQOry8jNTpFdM/edit?usp=drivesdk

it's true I'm biased and just prefer the civil war concept of the creature war, but the fact that we know that light creatures dont canonically transform into Korra season 2 anymore shows the creature war cant have been the case anymore SkyLOL SkyLOL SkyLOL"

i dont think krill are intelligent anymore, nor do i think they organize themselves and attack together, but they do coincidentally flock together sometimes, staying in the same places

sure it could just be gameplay that they are so tame, but i dont see them as being so aggressive enough that there's a whole war with them; they're too dead and dying to have the energy now

i also don't like the idea they interacted with the ancestors much in the first place

i see krills as a biproduct of the apocalypse, not a specific antagonist during the end of the kingdom

[tulip aspen]

wow thats actually sick!

yes, i recall people already mentioning this before, and as they leaned towards the TST side they came up with a conclusion that the two factions later may have realized there was a greater threat at hand and took it on together

[late wasp]

Anyways, I just prefer to leave this open, I don't know what happened there, today I mentioned how the Walls could simply function as a way to stop the sea, not really a war thing.

But more importantly, recently I pointed out something very relevant. The gate to the Vault opens only from the outside. As if people outside can imprison the Vault.

if there was a Civil War, I'd imagine it was between the Vault and the rest of the city.

[tulip aspen]

that's scary

[late wasp]

I still can't get over how the Little Prince wasn't attacked by a Krill
I wish they introduced a friendly krill we can examine closer

TGC is sleeping in not introducing Pets. I'd expend my money on that LMAO
*collects light fragments to feed my hungry pet krill*

[frigid tinsel]

Im too dead for an eloquent response but the “hoarding dragons” view is how I’ve been looking at darkness lately. Darkness seems to be a force that latches onto and stops light, growing as it stores more light within itself. This is why melting bigger darkness plants releases more light — they’re big because of how much light they had. It could also explain why darkness plants latch into onto light creatures like birds and mantas and perhaps ancestors. Either darkness flakes land on them and leech out their light like a parasite, growing and slowly weighing them down, or capable of reaching out to light creatures as they grow.

Krill, once light creatures now beings of darkness, may now have a double entendre for “hungering” for light: not only are driven by the dark force to grab and hold onto light, they also retain some of their light force and, in lacking light, strive for more. Perhaps an attempt to rekindle themselves? The why remains under speculation.

If darkness is not able to take over and consume a light being, it can otherwise mildly corrupt them. See crabs with what I like to call “darkness rabies” making them aggression and the quips in Zhao’s work about darkstone corrupting the king/prince and ancestors.

[tulip aspen]

that's a great way compile both ideas!
i think we should work with that

[late wasp]

Sky DnD is getting better every day more
delving into ancient ruins
to loot crystals and the light hoard of the Dark Dragon

[late wasp]

sometimes YouTube reading Discord is creepy
other times, like now, it's wholesome LOL

I need this

[frigid tinsel]

CecieArt is a blessing

[keen shore]

While we’re on the topic of darkness, was thinking that even though we have examples of massive weapons that could definitely be used to bring down krill and an obvious motivation for doing so, we never actually see their dead bodies anywhere. Same with crabs (but to a lesser extent). With how hard and bony their outer shells are, & if they actually are skeletons, you’d expect it to be very obvious when you see a krill corpse. But you never see one.

& someone way earlier (this was a least two weeks ago so I don’t remember exactly who) was talking about how light represents constant change and darkness represents staying in the same state forever. So… combining those two ideas, what if darkness corruption makes you immortal? It provides a clear motivation for corrupting yourself, especially if it’s done early after its discovery and you don’t know about the behavioral changes it causes; all you can see is a substance that, if you let it corrupt you, makes you immortal

[frigid tinsel]

re: possible immortality — there’s this quip in Zhao’s timeline:

Ancients become indifferent and disconnected from the Megabird. The Ferryman Ancestor retires with no new souls to shepherd. (emphasis mine)
“With no new souls to shepherd” gives me the sense that people weren’t dying. Could darkstone tech have advanced medical technology or was darkness such a corruptive force it increased longevity?

Or even if they were dying, as spirits they remained in the Sky world instead of ascending

[late wasp]

Power Crystals are Horcruxes

[nimble ingot]

Perhaps the ancestors did die, they just did not give praise to the Megabird.
Since the souls do not end up in the right places, the ancestor's souls became lost and unable to ascend.
Atleast as a hypothesis.

[keen shore]

I can totally see “your body not dying” and “your spirit remains physically in the world after death” both counting as versions of immortality

[frigid tinsel]

“As spirits, we became many, making our home here in the clouds.”

[late wasp]

wise move, considering spirits don't need to eat

[rigid mural]

perhaps ancestors were no longer completeing the pilgrimage to eden & reborn ?

[keen shore]

It provides an explanation for how some spirit memories exist in the first place, but I’m hesitant to say it’s the case for all of them, considering it doesn’t seem to fit every spirit’s personality. (Although it’s possible that other corruption scenarios would happen accidentally)

[frigid tinsel]

Yes that’s another possibility. I wonder if the Elders ever had tasks to do that required them going outside their realms. Hence Dawn “retiring” to the Isle.

The thing about the word “souls” is that it can apply to living or dead people, recognizing “soul” as “personhood.”

[half shadow]

it could also be a metaphor. if the ferryman guides the ancestors on the pilgrimage of Light and likely some amount of Megabird worship, “no souls left to shepard” could mean that nobody was coming to worship in the same way as they become disconnected from the Megabird

Do we even know if Ancestors can be reborn like Skykids?

[late wasp]

I would imagine they can. Considering they can even have Winged Lights of their own.

[keen shore]

Ancestors have winged lights?

[nimble ingot]

They can become ascended spirits and give skykids wing buffs in orbit.
So some of them can come back, though they might not be able to be reborn, that or are not willing to do so until the skykids are done.

[late wasp]

Yeah, we use our Ascended Candles to receive their Winged Lights.

[frigid tinsel]

Those are called “wing buffs.” Not the same as “winged light.”

It’s unknown whether the ancestors could be reborn or not.

They also didn’t have winged light, which is implied by the absence of winged light in their murals.

Though why they give “wing buffs,” could be a game mechanic or a sign of their friendship or... something.
A lot of things in Orbit confuse me

[keen shore]

Maybe they’re giving you all the light they have left so that you can use it to strengthen yourself in your next life? would explain why they fade away into nothingness immediately after giving it to you & why they can only give you one

[frigid tinsel]

Do the ones that give you tier 2 capes give 2 wing buffs if you unlocked them?

Ugh am I gonna have to go to Eden and die for lore research tonight?

[rigid mural]

light awaits had something about the elders' duty involving guiding the souls back to the skies; this could mean sending them to the constellations, or maybe that they make sure they dont get lost on their way to eden

[keen shore]

I would do it for you if I wasn’t too broke to buy the tier 2 capes myself. (Also if I hadn’t died 2 days ago for the sole purpose of finding neat paintings)

[late wasp]

My understanding is that they only acquire it after Ascending - hence the need of Ascended Candles

[frigid tinsel]

I’ve been saving up for the tier 2 navy cape so I may as well go

[keen shore]

The new intro seems to allude to this as well, though I’m still trying to figure out how that works. Do dead people just have to go to their elders to be sent back into the sky, or do they have to go all the way to Eden??

[late wasp]

The elders do it iirc.

[rigid mural]

upper left corner of this tom zhao concept art implies vault could have been meant to store the memories of ancestors before they went on to be reincarnated
this kind of shows that at some point, the ancestors could have started to value the past (their memories and current state) more than the continuation of a natural cycle (reincarnation).

[frigid tinsel]

From what I gathered, the Elders can ascend spirits from their temples, but you also see said spirits ascending with you after dying in Eden

[rigid mural]

maybe the elders arrange for the spirits to have a place in their constellation, but the spirit has to make their way to it. the orbit part seems to be there to show us we are on the same path as spirits

also here's a crop, i find that very interesting even if its just concept art

[late wasp]

Elders sell tickets to Orbit
but the Beam Station is in Eden

you heard here first

[keen shore]

You could make an argument that the elders can’t do it correctly anymore due to being dead and all, but that still doesn’t answer how it worked before everything happened

Also if this interpretation is correct, then combined with the tidbit about isle elder retiring, it could mean that isle was abandoned entirely

[frigid tinsel]

ik Vela was the one who proposed that idea about light & darkness: #lore-discussion-spoilers message
(yes I had saved the link, it's a wonderful idea eloquently put)

[rigid mural]

observing the light creatures seen flying through the realms like us, it could be possible ancestors went through the realms toward eden on flying boats in the same manner; may i bring your attention to all the elders opening doors during or after their cutscenes ? Perhaps they were in charge of the migration/pilgrimage going the right way so ancestors and creatures dont get lost.
That and if I'm right Isle elder is a psychopomp, than them losing their job means the cycle has been halted, at least for ancestors.

[keen shore]

The guiding them so they don’t get lost makes sense, but the idea of an ancestor getting hopelessly lost despite their destination being a giant glowing mountain visible on the horizon at all times is cracking me up.

• I want to agree on isle elder being a psychopomp because it’s a neat idea, I’m just very confused how that works without the other elders being ones as well. It seems like they have a lot of powers other elders don’t (for instance, only prairie and isle elders can make light creatures out of nothing, but isle elder does it in MASSIVE quantities) and it’s very odd to me

[rigid mural]

i got lost trying to find the litteral tallest building in town tbf, there's worse out there

[frigid tinsel]

At least taking the right path would be the safest. Imagine just walking straight and falling into a pit of vipers

[keen shore]

Do you think the hidden forest was only discovered because someone’s Eden Uber driver made a wrong turn

[rigid mural]

that and some realms don't give a view of the mountain, like forest. Even if it was leafy trees, it would still be easy to get lost.

[frigid tinsel]

Isle Elder, at least, has the most explicit allusions to being a psychopomp, like their “Ferryman” epithet and the boats. But the other Elders could qualify as ones given what you said. It’s a question of whether that was their active, main role versus with Dawn shepherding souls seems to be their main role.

[keen shore]

LITTLE KNOWN FACT: isle elder is the only elder that can shepherd souls. When someone dies in another realm, the elders punt their soul vaguely in that direction and hope for the best. This is what the valley elders paddles are for /j

[frigid tinsel]

I think during the Sky kingdom’s reign, the Elders did exist outside their liminal zones. Perhaps Isle Elders travelled around to help ascend souls.

[rigid mural]

They may have a spark of divinity, so it could work like portfolios where Daleth is a kind of shepherd, be it for birds, souls or skykids. (btw the birds are already in the room you meditate in and at the beginning of the cutscene before they call upon them, so really, they seem to be more like some kind of force directing a flow).
Each elder seems associated with a particular trope/kind of portfolio.
Isle seems to be like the mentor kind (like odin for example, both got bird allies too)
Prairie is likely a livestock protector, or at least associated with agriculture
Forest strongly makes me think of blacksmith/engineer deities like Hephaestus or Brighid
Valley is easy to reduce to jocks, but keep in mind that a few spirits from here look like soldiers, so it's possible that like hunting in some cultures (celtic, aztec), sports was a mean to train for war... though to avoid overlap with who follows, they probably seldom put that training into practice
Wastelands elder could be likened to war god, perhaps more Athena than Ares though
Vault is the wizard. like it's pretty obvious where their niche lies

[rigid mural]

likely ! i like to think that since the realms are based off stages of life, elders all had a role in passing spirits from the farthest reaches of the kingdom to eden, see what i said about them all opening gate, but perhaps isle is the most notable since they take care of souls freshly reincarnated. daleth's job may partially start in orbit, in fact, while the other elders are all below, within the kingdom (although lamed arguably leads us to eden, but they're not the eden elder)

[keen shore]

It’s really hard to find the evidence for them existing outside their spaces in game, although the murals in the vault elder cutscene & the fact that wasteland elder has a massive spear and shield built for them next to their statue basically proves it

[rigid mural]

flight questgiver must have had a mean to regularly see ayin tbh

[nimble ingot]

I suppose the only elders that match the age stage of their realms are the twins in Valley, Tsadi in Wasteland, Lamed in Vault and Resh (the king) in Eden

[rigid mural]

someone said the elders might reflect the way a kid see adults as they grow up

[frigid tinsel]

you explained that much better than I could and the comparisons with other mythos' gods makes senese.

to add, I liken the Valley Elder(s) to Dionysus – while his "drunken party god" epithet is more known and joked about a lot, Dionysus had a more uncanny side with body horror and eldritch means of revenge. given that the Valley Elder(s) look like two but are referred to as one, have swords in Orbit, but are playful sporty types in the Sky world/their pocket dimensions, I see them as having two sides to their personality: the fun jovial side and a more threatening side they dont show to the skids.

[rigid mural]

YOU. YOU GET ME. IN THIS CHAT WE DO NOT UNDERESTIMATE DYONISUS

the frenzy people are in when drinking his wine, being described as possessed by dyonisus himself... people are sleeping on this god
anyway im sure the twins being so eloquent and charismatic could put crowds in a frenzy as well

[nimble ingot]

ooh, that would be cool.

[frigid tinsel]

true. the places I think of them existing outside their pocket dimensions is the maybe meeting room in the Vault and ||that lost Eden OOB|| at least implies they were intended to exist in the Sky world.

[rain pond]

i wanna have more lore on gold - ash said it's the manta's favourite fruit and idk what to make of it

[frigid tinsel]

gold might've birthed crabs

[nimble ingot]

Would TGC make a season themed around mining someday?

Imagine, riding a cart down a cave, and seeing all sorts of things!

[rigid mural]

not the minecraft collab

[nimble ingot]

no no.
no enderdragon, no enderman, no walking pile of leaves that explodes at will.

Just mining gold, finding crystals, finding light miners, avoiding cave ins and the possibility to see more lore.

[frigid tinsel]

More tearful light miners

[rigid mural]

tearful light miner got airpods in, they cant hear us

[keen shore]

I come back after eating and this is the first thing I see

I want a Minecraft season now just to see how ridiculous all the square cosmetics would look. And so I can run around with a diamond sword

[frigid tinsel]

TGC let skykids have swords challenge

[rigid mural]

finally, a season during which i can take a vacation from sky

[lofty void]

We actually tried making something like that once

[keen shore]

Minecraft diamond swords are probably more viable for ancestor on ancestor combat than the golden wasteland swords let’s be real

[lofty void]

it was a collab between me and someone else, heres something i made for it sjbxgsh

[rain pond]

no but seriously why is this stuff

it might be used to make copies of Orbit to confuse creatures because gold might symbolises megabird/orbit (source: Vela, 25 Dec 2021) but it also looks like it's an organic conduit for light???

the press diagram shows that the diamonds get charged in those slot things but where does the light come from?

is there just a manta eternally trapped in there being like "no pls let me ascend" or was it charged by a creature at first and then later diamonds?

[rigid mural]

why am i a source now ?

[frigid tinsel]

no, the Little Prince 200 candle pants don't count. that only give the skids a flimsy sword they don't wield. TGC took Commodore's sword from the season promo art. there are swords all around battlefield buried in sand, too big to even move.
TGC fears what we could do with swords.

[raw crypt]

pvp

[nimble ingot]

Already done with little prince's pricey suit

[lofty void]

Give me a sword, TGC, and I’m gonna defeat all the krills in wasteland with my prowess

[white junco]

tgc should fear what we and specifically i could do with swords

[rain pond]

I didn't mention the creature jebait back then but it might be more plausible than "concentrating light from the sky" because gold is seen attracting creatures

[lofty void]

Gold is a fruit?

[frigid tinsel]

only once

[nimble ingot]

in minecraft terms, yes.
Gold goes well with apples and carrots.

[white junco]

minecraft 👀

[lofty void]

Sky is Minecraft? Does that mean Steve is a skykid?

[keen shore]

The stars itself are the same darkstone scattered throughout the realms (sorry if you knew this, couldn’t tell from your message). What the diamonds are actually charged with are either mantas which are trapped and drained of their light (like the mantas released in forest temple after the elder cutscene and the mantas trapped in treasure reef) OR the butterflies stored in jars that we see in prairie and the underforest, although due to their size and the fact that they fell out of use, butterflies are likely less efficient than mantas.

As for why they’re encased in gold, I have no idea. My best guess here is that some property of gold allows the light charged in darkstone to stay inside the darkstone itself and not dissipate before it reached its destination. The gold covering also interestingly resembles the bells and chimes found in prairie, although whether this is a superficial resemblance or goes deeper than that, I’m not sure

[rigid mural]

i wish i could dig three blocks down to dodge krill

[nimble ingot]

Steve is a human.
There are no skykids in minecraft.

[white junco]

how do we know that for sure

[lofty void]

Not with that attitude

[nimble ingot]

There are...

candles.....

Though.
(braces for impact)

[rigid mural]

they do have elytras in minecraft tbh

[white junco]

both the skykids and steve are living in a beautiful natural world (most of the time) that contains the ruins of a lost civilization

[rain pond]

of course, the attraction of the creatures might be caused by the bells, but then the "orrery = orbit" theory also works because everyone's destination is [100 customers], [HYPERLINK BLOCKED] Orbit

[frigid tinsel]

Minecraft and Sky lore are surprisingly similar. the former is just way too vague even by Sky standards

[rigid mural]

_ _ minecraft lore 🤝 sky lore
often overlooked bc it's not blatant

[rain pond]

keygen.

[keen shore]

Keep in mind that the sky kingdoms relationship with metal is really weird. They only seem to use it for decoration (like the gold ornaments scattered throughout valley) and not for actual weapons or armor* (not a single spirit has armor of any kind and all the weapons, including the blades, are made of stone). (*The only possible exception to this is the king statues in wasteland, which are theorized to work like laser cannons, although there’s little in game evidence for this that doesn’t rely on eliminating their functions as other weapons)

[rain pond]

arent the pipes metal tho? they look metal, especially those in the krill house bit of eden

[frigid tinsel]

at least with Sky lore, there is enough evidence to piece together some plausible story of the past. when the player(s) spawn in the Minecraft world now, so much time has passed since whatever cataclysm happened in the past or said cataclysm was so devastating that there are almost no hints of what civilization(s) existed before the player(s) appearance.

skykids got lucky.

[white junco]

counter point what if everything was turned to stone. there are stone tools that practically attach to the walls. all of the ancestors bodies are encased in stone

[nimble ingot]

there is gold in the mechanisms used to open doors in forest.

[rain pond]

what?

i mean the only one i remember is that "control panel" looking thing at the end of forest

[nimble ingot]

There are the spinning tubes beside the doors and the large golden dome above the forest throne.

[keen shore]

From what I remember, the pipes seem to make the same sound as stone pots do when you walk across them, so I’m pretty sure they’re not metal.

about Spade’s idea of everything being turned to stone — spirits are not encased in stone, but in the same dustlike corruption that falls throughout Eden and from krills. & if everything was turned to stone, we wouldn’t see any metal in the first place

Also the gold encasing the mechanisms in forest proves my possible idea of them somehow helping to conduct or focus darkstone energy further (or otherwise being important in machines) because forest is an area without much decoration in general, meaning that gold probably isn’t there to be fancy, but instead serves a functional purpose

[rain pond]

might be housing darkstones, see "battery" concept

[loud canopy]

What would they need a battery for in a temple? I understand the boats but

[rain pond]

its a press and idk why the forest elder put their statue right under the press

[loud canopy]

[keen shore]

The darkstone is for moving the various mechanisms around that you can see after the elder cutscene.

• the temple was already built in the shape of a darkstone refinery, suggesting that either forest was originally only a factory area without permanent residents and didnt need or have an elder until later, Or the forest elder is just the kind of practical person who doesn’t care about having a fancy temple taking up a ton of unneeded space so decided to make it double as a refinery

[rain pond]

either that or the ancestors found it after and were like "yup looks cool, idk what it does, time to put a statue of our great leader here"

[wind sluice]

I have been silently wondering if their statues are actually more like gravestones.

[rain pond]

mightbe

[wind sluice]

It does seem like some of the spirits have gravestones

[late wasp]

It's very likely they are gravestones. There is even a hint in the "ceremonial conductor" or something like that spirit in the prairie, and spirits awakening from their graves.

the grave with round hole is also used in Journey.

||note: gravestones are not the same as coffins. pointing this out because some people assume we are talking about graves/coffins, etc. it's very common to make gravestones for people who you haven't found the body of too||

[karmic ledge]

abyss should help answer some of these questions 👀

also the gold being mantas favorite fruit was a joke, im sorry 😅

now if its a golden apple....

[nimble ingot]

Ash!

Would cremation be an option for ancestors, by any chance?

[frigid tinsel]

i am so hyped but also afraid of the upcoming quests this season

[pastel brook]

Anyone have a good joke?

[nimble ingot]

What do you call a penguin in a desert?

answer:
||Lost||

[frigid tinsel]

looks like Ash was only here to clarify things and not for a lore beaning

[formal skiff]

It’s lore now. There’s no going back… /j

[keen shore]

Gold being mantas’ favorite food gives me the mental image of a manta robbing a bank and committing a heist in order to eat ALL the money inside

[lofty void]

s h u t

[formal skiff]

YES

[frigid tinsel]

i can see mantas just sucking gold nuggets in their mouths like jolly ranchers

[nimble ingot]

The orrery would not be safe from mantas.

[frigid tinsel]

the orrey must be made of another metal painted gold or it wouldn't be intact

[keen shore]

Imagine working at a bank, and you come in to start your shift, open it up and there’s a manta passed out on the ground in a food coma

[formal skiff]

What do you call a bot who doesn’t know the meaning of humor?

||you know who I’m talking about pal||

[formal skiff]

I LOVE THIS SO MUCH

[keen shore]

Since mantas seem to travel in groups, their bank robbing potential gets even worse. Especially if them clipping through physical objects is a canon thing because they’re made of light and not just a glitch, so they can just fly through whatever defenses you erect against them

[nimble ingot]

A pygmy fakes an injury out front, and a great manta breaks in from the back.
Then the smaller ones carry all of the gold away, while the greater manta eats what the smaller ones cannot carry.

It is full proof!

[formal skiff]

Guys I am obsessed with this idea

[keen shore]

BORING and FAKE lore: mantas and ancestors hate each other because of darkstone tech and climate change and yada yada yada
REAL lore: ancestors hate mantas because mantas REFUSE to stop robbing banks and eating all their money

[formal skiff]

There’s no going back Ash. Behold the monster you have created by your innocent joke! Look at what you have done! This glorious conversation, wrought of but a passing comment by an unsuspecting dev!

[frigid tinsel]

[insert skybot "it's not the deep"]
[insert memey rebutals]

[nimble ingot]

Imagine the Twins asking the elder's help.

Dawn tries to coordinate with is birds.
Day tries to get his mantas under control (hilariously fails).
Forest gets her hammer.
Wasteland gets his shield.
And Vault, well, what can they do?

[frigid tinsel]

telekinesis or something

[keen shore]

Imagine… you are setting a new passcode on the money vault after yesterday’s manta break in, but little do you know… a manta is watching you through the window

[formal skiff]

[keen shore]

Imagine if banks had resident crabs to scare away the mantas, like farms and libraries have resident cats

[nimble ingot]

at least there are no creatures that steals wax instead of winged light.

[frigid tinsel]

broke: crabs were an accidental byproduct of power diamond manufacturing.
woke: ancestors deliberately made crabs to guard their gold from the mantas

[rigid mural]

ASH JUMPSCARE

[keen shore]

New headcanon, only reason the flight spirits obtained enough gold to make all their chimes is by training their manta friends to steal it all. (Unfortunately most of it got eaten in transit)

[rigid mural]

tinkering chimesmith shaking their fist at bird

[nimble ingot]

The big birds were in on it

[keen shore]

(None of the spirits had the foresight to realize that the mantas would just steal it back from them again)

Mantas are like cats. They may LOOK cute, but the only thought they have in their heads is when and how they’ll commit their next crime

[rigid mural]

i am going to wrestle a manta in prairie

[frigid tinsel]

mantas kidnap skykids and pillage gold

[formal skiff]

Those mantas kidnap skids bc they think we’re gold ig

[nimble ingot]

Would that explain why there are so quick to throw me off? hm?

[frigid tinsel]

gold/metals have a really distinct smell, I think (I hope) the mantas could smell the difference between gold and an illiterate skid.

[late wasp]

Ash drops by
"Abyss will clear this out"
refuses to elaborate
leaves

[keen shore]

Fun fact. Once an elder bird wanted to steal some chimes from the wind paths, so they ripped an entire arch out of the ground and flew off with it

[keen shore]

Shaking and sobbing at the concept of a buff and muscular manta

[rigid mural]

they carry buff moths

[hushed steeple]

Lmao

[frigid tinsel]

manta could just pick up their opponents and punt them into the ground

[keen shore]

Horrible concept. The wings are sleeves. The manta rolls them up and immediately starts punching you with its massive fists

[hushed steeple]

If a manta could fight the king krill. Bet the manta will win

[rigid mural]

HELP IM CACKLING

[hushed steeple]

Oh gosh...

[keen shore]

I’m not sure whether I’m laughing at the manta fist concept because it’s actually funny or if it’s just a fear response

[hushed steeple]

Lol

[formal skiff]

Both

[tulip aspen]

ash moment ash moment

[rigid mural]

in mother russia, stingray step ON YOU

[keen shore]

I am filled with terror

[raven wraith]

paper jesus was too stunned to speak

[lofty void]

what the frick frack cracker jack…????

[tulip aspen]

i need an art page of your lorechat memes omg

[half shadow]

”this will be cleared up in Abyss”

i have to wait two days until next quest

[keen shore]

Somehow two days is simultaneously too short (time went by too fast) and too long (want to do it now)

[half shadow]

EXACTLY. like four days is kind of meh alright i get it but TWO? 48 WHOLE HOURS? i’m spiraling

[tulip aspen]

but Minecraft lore is originally just visual themes, and then we can create more elaborate stories from those visual themes, such as piglins and the nether

Sky however already had a base narrative story, and then as we got closer and closer to launch game they stripped down that story until nothing was left but themes

one's lore happened naturally over time because that's just how powerful it's sandbox is both visually and materially

the other's vagueness only happened because they basically cut 90% of the game

[half shadow]

light awaits was like a whole different game tho

[frigid tinsel]

both Minecraft and Sky server as a great platform for fanfic where you can make your own lore to add to or clear up the games' lore fog.
remembers the minecraft server I manage.
cries

[late wasp]

lore withdrawal syndrome

[half shadow]

me when king/eden lore:

me when BIG UNDERWATER FISH:

[late wasp]

now that I know krill are hungry, I will start feeding them moths

I'll become a moth-farmer, I will take them to collect Winged Lights only to then bring them to Krills and feed the poor starved fellows

[frigid tinsel]

moth herding

[rain pond]

i hc that the king has no more hands so he uses darkstone-powered mecha hands

symbolizes that he doesnt have to do anything anymore, that he can command others to do it

also because king is big dumb and decided to continue darkstone experiments up until it blasted civilization to dust

[toxic peak]

Have everyone know where can download the sky beta

[frigid tinsel]

#beta-faq

[toxic peak]

And

no else

[frigid tinsel]

if you have questions about beta, you should go in the beta channels. #beta-faq is a good start

[nimble ingot]

Alasdair answered it best.

[toxic peak]

OK

[tulip aspen]

the reason why i think the Eden diamond is powering a portal into Orbit is because we visually see it shooting a beam of Light into the Sky

i always thought that the Light we fly up into in Limbo to start the ascension phase, feels like it's almost inside the crystal somehow, like our soul/Light got sucked into it

coupled with this concept art and the prophecy showing the Chosen One creating a beam of Light at the top of Eden that all ancestors would migrate to in order to enter it, and that's basically all the 'proof' i need to confirm my bias for myself lol

I'll definitely organize my thoughts over time and hopefully write about it better so i can convince people with l o g i c

[half shadow]

my fave piece of concept art is a picture like this but it’s worded as like “ascend through the kings body” like it was a massive behemoth you flew through

[tulip aspen]

I love it if you could find that concept art for us that sounds awesome

[karmic ledge]

you dont need the future quests, take a look in the environment 👀

-disappears mysteriously again-

[rigid mural]

hi ash

[nimble ingot]

bye ash lol

[tulip aspen]

if it was in a future quest she prolly wouldnt have said it in the first place xD

[rigid mural]

probably meant the murals tbh

[rain pond]

who ghost pinged me

[late wasp]

Ash in a nutshell

[frigid tinsel]

Ash prowling this channel for times to pop in like a manta scanning for gold to munch.

[rain pond]

what have i done to chat with the ash-manta-goldfruit connection

[haughty talon]

This one especially shows you "extraction" possibly

[tulip aspen]

she probably was referencing sucking Light out of mantas, due to our captured friends we save in abyss from their underwater holding cells

it's very identical to what concept art says happens in forest so yeah

[late wasp]

yeah, from the iconic Eco-friendly Manta Batteries joke we had

[rain pond]

also what are those rounded diamond thingies

[late wasp]

teb had some interesting ideas about that, on how some batteries require spinning

[frigid tinsel]

mods: guys, the manta extraction isn't canon and it's uneasy, please stop talking about it. we'll make skybot censor the topic.
TGC: btw manta extraction is canon
mods:

[rigid mural]

TBH

uh oh mod

[frigid tinsel]

i just find it so ironic

[sharp lichen]

WAIT WHERE DID TGC CONFIRM IT??

[rigid mural]

it's kind of the simplest conclusion to get from the abyss murals n latest quest

[crimson grove]

We don't have a problem with dark aspects of the lore or even theories. Sky is actually pretty dark and serious when you think about it. We do have a problem when the community jokes on those dark aspects about making drinks of dead animal parts, though- that is not allowed in any way, fictional or not. It's all about being respectful

[rain pond]

aNYWAYS where did these lanterns go

[wise rampart]

See that’s what I’ve been saying! There’s whole entire pieces of story, how the materials were gathered, how the process worked, all of it!

[tulip aspen]

ig it's moreso kinda obvious at this point

the fact that the concept art goes into detail about it is hard to escape

i was really skeptical it still worked like that just out of spite of angst but i think that really might be what's going on here

[sharp lichen]

huh tgc being tgc

[frigid tinsel]

yea, here it is in Zhao's concept art.

[tulip aspen]

understandable, ig i could see how juicing could be interpreted or abused (or both) as a term

however, it is what is literally going on, so ig our complaints just lie with us not being able to properly name the term.
juicing is the most accurate description

unfortunately, if the term was banned because someone abused it and made it weird on purpose then yeah it should probably stay banned

[rustic heron]

Isn’t that what hotdogs are? Same thing with McD’s chicken nuggets.

Also, fish paste.

[tulip aspen]

lapis where you been, you missed a lot, ash dropped by!

(also did i ping you miri i hope i didntsorryifididaaaaa)

[lofty void]

ASH????

[rustic heron]

I know. My regret is immeasurable and my day is ruined.

[tulip aspen]

yes @lofty void, we got a single lore bean

[lofty void]

LORE??.?.?.?

[tulip aspen]

tbf they weren't actually here for a beaning lolol

thank god cos i wasnt ready or around

[late wasp]

try not getting 1984 again lol

[rustic heron]

I’m about to Brave New World this biz.

[sharp lichen]

Ash is close enough to become a regular of lorechat

[boreal nebula]

Never realized there is a giant pipe right next to corridor to point of no return

[tulip aspen]

they've even made theories with vela

[sharp lichen]

he's almost said as much messages as me!

[late wasp]

Yeah, they go all the way to that temple on top of the mountain

[lofty void]

Awww i missed my chance

[rustic heron]

You know, I just realized I might have made chicken nuggets and hotdogs banned topics here.

I am deeply sorry if this happens.

[boreal nebula]

Ieeven landed upon it but I could get off it easily

[hushed steeple]

Will backread when I have a chance. Was there anything especially tasty?

[frigid tinsel]

buff mantas
birds mantas with arms

[rustic heron]

Abyss has the answers we crave. That’s about it.

[tulip aspen]

just a single lore bean, i replied to it in the message im replying to now @hushed steeple

[tulip aspen]

h o w

actually, dont answer that xD

[lofty void]

[rain pond]

how do we classify different types/sub-species of mantas

[rustic heron]

We don’t have a classification for any creatures at all, I think.

[hushed steeple]

Yeah its strait up manta blend. Hopefully manta energy steal instead but same idea.

[haughty talon]

Surely sky had some form of processed meat(I assume) . If people had lavish lives at some point... History on this planet says rich always go about killing animals around them for game(read :fun) and for luxurious food spreads in their dinner tables.

[rain pond]

did ancestors even eat? didnt they just absorb balls of light

[sharp lichen]

listen, i hate taxonomy enough in real life.

[hushed steeple]

Although Ash replying in the machine specifically......hm.

[keen shore]

Hey, I’m late to this, just wanted to drop the possibility that it’s the other way around, and the power diamond there is sapping energy from the light beam instead :3c

[tulip aspen]

idk, but kami made a really good documentary of all of them

[rustic heron]

Dismayed Hunter does exist. Gotta get that free-range comestible somehow.

[tulip aspen]

what would be the purpose of that, and also the implications and effects caused by that?

i dont think that light beam is going away in live any time soon so-

[frigid tinsel]

in Anxious Angler's memory, they and Abyss guide are fishing, presumably to eat.

[hushed steeple]

Sorta. I kinda. Cherry picked the ones I liked best and left off some mid sized mantas that uh I consider too similar to the more interesting ones

And like added some concept art ones instead

[rain pond]

why is this game do to me this

[rustic heron]

Sky is a cruel mistress. I’m sorry you had to find out this way.

[haughty talon]

They never showed why he is dismayed right? May be it was a light deer! Imagine we get a deer 🦌 that's made of pure light! Glows in the dark as it hoops away

[late wasp]

It's implied in Concept Art that the Light Beam have always been there as a natural part of the world.

The giant crystal was placed on top of it to try and collect all that power.

[keen shore]

The reason that that’s my guess is that we know darkstone needs light to work, right? So it would be a really good idea (in theory) to place a massive darkstone crystal right below the biggest beam of light in the world and use it to power literally everything in a sustainable and efficient manner… until it got corrupted. I think the light beam is just too powerful to be contained within the crystal entirely, so that’s why it’s still there

[rustic heron]

Nope. Presumably they lost their quarry.

[hushed steeple]

Though Perophecy murla had princy proncy use activate and then beam go be

Though Prophecy murals had eden beam only appear after prince approached it with the elements

[crimson grove]

A few terms were only censored when the jokes got out of hand, pretty gross and typically surrounding the lore as an excuse to joke about cruelty. The problem, like many things, was not the terms themselves but how they were used to the point censoring was the best solution. There is a very relevant discussion to be had about cruelty regarding animals IRL and how we approach those topics as a society elsewhere- if you see people talking in an abusive way towards animals (or anything, really) in this server that's something we can intervene in though.

With that said, if people think we're past those issues you can offer us feedback in #contact-the-mods and we'll reconsider. It wouldn't be the first time we've seen improvement and maturity in the community- that would actually be a pretty nice

[frigid tinsel]

you can also see the light beam in Zhao's artwork of a more modern Sky in the city

[late wasp]

hehe yes!

[tulip aspen]

fascinating, but why would that beam of light exist in the first place then

I will admit I can see the prince creating the beam of light but then getting too greedy and instead of just sending everyone home he uses it as a source of power, but I'm not really sold on that I can just see it existing as a narrative

[tulip aspen]

but in the prophecy it shows that beam of light being created by the chosen one

[sharp lichen]

where, exactly? I don't recall anything too specific.

[half shadow]

this is kinda reminding me of yesterday when we were discussing why Ash or devs in general might not talk in here a whole lot or share their headcanons because of the way everybody immediately scrambles to pick their statements apart and say that whatever they said is canon, and while that’s very much not what’s happening now bc Ash pretty much said a very direct statement it just made me hope that they or any other mod/dev doesn’t feel like they’re being dogpiled on when they show up

[late wasp]

" only censored when the jokes got out of hand, pretty gross and typically surrounding the lore as an excuse to joke about cruelty."
"The problem, like many things, was not the terms themselves but **how they were used **to the point censoring was the best solution."

I doubt there are any animal abusers or people who think animal abuse is funny in the lore chat.
to have the mods think that's the case is kinda weird.

but either way, once again... considering a Mod can misunderstand it, it shows that other people could also misunderstand it, so it's better to drop those jokes altogether.
I agree with the decision, but only because people can misunderstand and see evil where there is none.

[tulip aspen]

1:55
https://youtu.be/8EB4KIMWNf0

bringing all elements to the top of Eden somehow created the beam of Light

I want to believe that they added it to the crystal which projected that Light, but perhaps i am wrong and salem is right in saying after the prince created the beam with the elemental Lights he instantly sought to abuse the Light energy

[rustic heron]

Fair enough. I have no idea of the censor has the ability to expire censored words after some amount of time. It might be nice as a stopgap for immediate problems that usually end after a day or two, as there’s a certain amount of effort debt in uncensoring words after the fact that are relatively harmless outside the context.

Regardless, lore chat isn’t the place for that discussion. Maybe we’ll get some consensus on censored words we’d like re-reviewed here and submit that collectively.

Thank you for the suggestion.

[keen shore]

I’m not really sure why the beam of light existed originally, unless it was created really early on in the kingdom and was necessary for the process of ascension in general. I’ll have to think about this a bit. Pretty sure there was a MASSIVE gap in time in between when it was created and when it was abused though

[tulip aspen]

1. i recommend not pinging the mods
2. im p sure it was prolly on significant event or the other when people were being gross on purpose to freak everyone out

[sharp lichen]

Prophecy lore is

[compact shale]

Yeah it's a lot

[keen shore]

I want to explore treasure reef later to see if I can find any mechanisms that would obviously be connected to a certain method of manta harvesting, but since I couldn’t find any after exploring all over before, either I missed one or it’s locked behind quest areas for now

[hushed steeple]

Im so glad yall people understand my nonsense

[tulip aspen]

i doubt it was necessary since the Elders seem to be able to ascend ancestors too (but only after ancestors fully reconnect to the Light, or some condition like that)

but i think the prophecy states the Chosen One would make it fast and easy for everyone

[keen shore]

Again, I may have to take a bit to think over this because low blood sugar is currently making complex thinking hard, but I do agree with it being necessary for ascension not feeling right

[haughty talon]

Like all things it is possibly a cycle. Beams exited and we're created at various times by various generations I assume. Eventually it comes to a stage of darkness where no light gathers back at the top(mega bird of light) so drastic measures are taken to spur the cycle - like sending sky kids to pick WL and ascend to start the cycle again, send them on scavenging hunts to put to rest spirits who can then ascend, clear wind paths so creatures of light can ascend etc...
. So the beam can exist and not exits at different points of time depending on where in the light/ dark - creation/destruction cycle the sky universe is in

[tulip aspen]

tom zhaos concept of the light beam always being there coincides with the ancestors being part of the 'rebirth cycle', which, ad ive stated before, im fairly sure was scrapped, ancestors are not part of the cycle and creatures dont die during that cycle, just ebb and flow through the universe

[harsh pecan]

If most people ascend when they die then the Chosen One technically did the job

[compact shale]

Prophecy states "The Chosen One shall create a sacred elevator to Megabird."
(lorechat rn)

[half shadow]

(not to be hypocritical and pick apart ash’s statement immediately after mentioning it h a h) I’m with you, I think it’s already pretty clear given the facility. I wonder if the Mantas are stored to utilize their Light to imbue Darkstones with power to create the diamonds. going off of environmental details alone, I think the process could be:

darkstone is mined —> darkstone is shaped into power diamonds —> power diamonds taken to Manta storage facility —> Manta’s Light gets “collected” in however way you wish to imagine —> Light is infused into the diamonds —> power diamonds are stored and shipped off across the kingdom.

[tulip aspen]

tom zhaos concept for context @late wasp

and YES @harsh pecan !
ive been thinking about that a lot: that in a way after the Skykids help the king still fulfills the prophecy

[haughty talon]

There are no moving parts if that's what you mean by mechanism... The column of water simply holds manta and we have few buttons on the outside. Rest is left to us to imagine...

[harsh pecan]

Oooo

[keen shore]

No, I mean… I want to see if I can find things like rotating blades to blend mantas, pumps and needles if you’re draining the light inside them, so on

[crimson grove]

Yeah I don't wanna turn a good lore discussion into a discussion about rules, but it felt like a good moment to drop the reminder and clarify. I can't go into detail about what happened in the past (and it's probably best forgotten), but even someone with good intentions can cause harm we as moderators have to prevent- not to mention people with genuine bad intentions out there as well. The invitation to submit any kind of feedback, at any time, will still be open

[tulip aspen]

I think it would be a lot more magical and a little less..... scary

[half shadow]

thanks Mirian!

[late wasp]

whenever you feel lost in life, remember these wise words

[haughty talon]

Nothing of that sort is there. Just a cylinder with effervescence (make be it was ancient Coca-Cola plant + light extraction device)

[tulip aspen]

i hope you feel better btw

pls go rest if u need to

[keen shore]

Oh, like an ancestor using their levitation powers to crush a manta like a soda can?? (This is the only thing I can think of)

Either that or the tools/mechanisms to harvest mantas are hidden inside a larger machine like that massive rotating funnel you see in the forest temple because the ancestors didnt want to think about what was happening

[harsh pecan]

I hope we dont have to see the ancestors putting mantas in a blender-

[haughty talon]

Sky Dark Souls

[tulip aspen]

i hope she sees this lmao that pic is golden

no @keen shore more like holding the darkstone near Light immediately starts absorbing the Light

mantas are pure Light so being around darkstone may possibly be more dangerous for them and not for ancestors with shells

[late wasp]

I don't think we'll see anything close to that. I believe they just absorb the light out of those beings. We talked about Crab barbecue for example, and how cooking them releases fragments of light.

[keen shore]

I have eaten one banana and am once again capable of complex thought

[frigid tinsel]

this reminds me of the meme someone submitted about how many children die in games and at the top was Sky with "don't worry about it"

[compact shale]

Where lmao

[frigid tinsel]

all the other games were dark, deliberately made horror games, then we got cheery-looking Sky outranking them all

[tulip aspen]

duuuuude frrr eating them before exams work and concerts is just 👌 👌 👌 👌 👌 👌 👌 👌 😫

[thin cradle]

Jesus Christ some 1 tell me y I made this again?

[half shadow]

is that baldi from baldis basics? it looks bad dude

[late wasp]

Yeah, I've also tried to wrap my head around it for a while now. But I've conceded in letting those better than me explore it, and focus on acquiring little observations lol!

Which is why I highly appreciate when you go about it, really helps expand my thoughts.

[harsh pecan]

Whose watching?

[tulip aspen]

w h a t

[rustic heron]

Please don’t post my selfies here

[thin cradle]

Nope it's apparently just an old art I drew of a "human"

[half shadow]

this isn’t really the place for that, or the server for that kind of art

[frigid tinsel]

#sky-memes message

[rustic heron]

Lore chat: Sky kids, did you die

Sky Kids:

[tulip aspen]

well at the same time, even if you dont feel like it does, yours and everyone else's thoughts help me see a bigger picture because I won't always have a fully open mind either so never feel like you're not free to share because I adore all the input and seeing this chat so alive with theories

[late wasp]

is there anyone alive in Sky? oh right... the animals lol

[half shadow]

oh my god I need this drawn with two moths asking

[harsh pecan]

What if the animals are dead too

[frigid tinsel]

Sky: kids die, kingdoms die, animals die

[rustic heron]

Die: Children of the dead.

[half shadow]

Back to Manta Discussion:
I don’t think we’ll find anything like… implements or a chute that says “MANTA BITS HERE” obviously pointing out what was done where and how it was done precisely. Honestly I think the murals are pretty much spelling it out to us already. The tanks could be for containment and Light harvest, and the process of harvesting Light could be entirely painless aside from the fact the creatures are trapped in a small space instead of able to fly. The containment of the Manta could be all that’s needed, I don’t think Sky would either spell something out so implicitly rather than leave it open to interpretation as per the usual formula, OR show something so outright violent against what are totally benign creatures. I mean, we see corpses and we see spirits presumably dying in memories and stuff, but I think that mechanical torture implements are something they’d shy away from.

if i’m proved wrong though please @ me and tell me you told me so

[late wasp]

But really, if the animals are alive: "return our lost lights" is very interesting, since we are constantly freeing imprisoned animals in pretty much every realm

[frigid tinsel]

post-Forest Elder cutscene, I imagine that the manta traps were just so effective that they still work even now. so offering light to the Forest Elder isn't just to get them to open the temple door but to release the mantas

[late wasp]

Animals rising from the water is also very interesting subject, like the Jellyfish in the Forest, or the Krill in the Broken Temple.

[rustic heron]

Forest Elder is a furry…

[haughty talon]

Any views on why we are collecting resources in each quest this season? Like last season our aim was to restore the pathways...

[frigid tinsel]

the Abyss spirits need the resources for some reason

[rustic heron]

They’re power diamonds. Mikey used to power their boat to scavenge elsewhere.

[late wasp]

@you ||you are valid and i am happy i joined lore chat when you returned||

[haughty talon]

May be. But they seem to be collecting a lot! By now easily close to 20 I presume

[rustic heron]

.it’s the equivalent of powering an electric car with Duracell batteries.

[tulip aspen]

yeah I feel like they could extract light and even show light extraction without it being overly un-pg so

[late wasp]

lapis lapis lapis
I don't think you were around, but we were talking about Krill, officially "Dark Dragons" and how they are "hungry" for light. And the concept of Dragons hoarding treasures came up.

Mentioning this cause you just mentioned the very DnD-Adventure-like setting, and GW Adventurers going into a Dragon lair to steal its hoarded treasure is cool and I wanted to share. lol!

[rustic heron]

||It’s actually like the melting bodies in Stranger Things||

[haughty talon]

So in the end of season then... We get to dump all the crystals collected in the ship's big boat's engine room, escape from "Jaws" 🦈 vrrrroooom!? 🤔

[sly lake]

Or to sell. The concept of people scavenging old facilities, buildings, etcetera for valuables to later sell is a pretty common one. Like Rey at the beginning of Force Awakens in Star Wars, scavenging the space ships.

[rustic heron]

I remembered that. || Did I successfully seduce the Krill?||

[half shadow]

I cast fireball. You heard me, I said fireball. Yes I know how big the room is.

[sly lake]

Do you think the manta that gives us our swimming power is a manta who has had the light drained from them, and is now a ghost? They appeared to look different from a normal manta.

[late wasp]

more like they ascend and leave us to deal with the sharks by ourselves (and the Spirit Guide)

Abyss Crew except the Guide when things get heated:

[haughty talon]

May be they were hench men for an overlord that intended to build a big machine elsewhere using dark crystals.

[sharp lichen]

SEASON OF ABYSS 2 oh noo

[rustic heron]

Haha, Abyss guide is being trained by Commodore to use The Force The Light.

[late wasp]

let me check a video, interesting idea!

[haughty talon]

Lol... Guys guys what should I do now that the 🦈 is chasing me?

Peace out bruh were freed!
(Wheeee sounds as they ascend)

[pastel brook]

the moderators are broken, but I'm here

[sharp lichen]

the skybot is broken, but the mods are here

[late wasp]

I wish you weren't.

[haughty talon]

Season of abyss 2 : children of valhalla. Finally we get viking costume in sky along with swords and shield props

[boreal nebula]

Loree chat , let's play guess the door . Where are Precisely located each of there doors?

[late wasp]

now i wonder if those manta monuments are honoring dead mantas

[hushed steeple]

Im kinda enjoying how spicy lorechat is to skybot. So spicy!

[frigid tinsel]

no one really sure what the manta is. some of us have been calling it the Upgrade Manta. some think it was sent by Megabird Themself.

I think it's an entity representing the collective mass of the creatures in Treasure Reef. when skykids meditate, they may be tuning into the world, so in turn the marine creatures – including the then-trapped mantas – who respond in kind by giving the skykids the ability to dive.

[pastel brook]

Maybe one day I can be a real Skykid!

[late wasp]

theory: doodlebot actually has an operator that sometimes uses it to spite lapis