lore-discussion-spoilers

[hushed steeple]

I THOUGHT IT WAS JUST A SILLY LITTLE FLY AROUND AND STEAL CLOTHING OF DEAD SPIRITS NOT LORE WTAC

It's 4pm and im trying to eat Ritz crackers I'm not gonna read some 40 page nerd document about lore of this game

[tulip aspen]

i wouldnt expect you too xD

enjoy the crackers 👀

[frigid tinsel]

aren't yall not supposed to dump the lore docs on new people unless they ask?

[compact shale]

The disclaimer at the end lets me know that this is a copypasta

(tis ok tho Jam)

[fickle wing]

this sorta stuff is exactly what got tossing the docs at folks and elder names like
banned at one point 💀

[hushed steeple]

Eh idc it's not that deep lol

[hushed steeple]

LMAO YOUR PFP

[frigid tinsel]

Sky world is very intriguing once you see it more than just a "silly little fly around" game

[fickle wing]

basically lore for the game is some kid fell from the sky and then found this cool rock that did a bunch of stuff and pulled a onceler
that’s like
the basic gist

[hushed steeple]

Never it's a silly little moth game nothing more idc about the prince or king just moth and dead ppl

[compact shale]

Yeah lorechat is pretty hard to handle

[frigid tinsel]

then why are you here

[hushed steeple]

Ouch :(

[fickle wing]

oh yikes that was Rude

[frigid tinsel]

kinda rude to slide in here and go "ya nerds over this silly little game" ngl

[hushed steeple]

Bc the message you replied to was a joke :C

[compact shale]

Pal I

Anyways, Luphina, what would you like to inquire about?

[hushed steeple]

I want the basic lore, why are we collecting dead people?

[frigid tinsel]

cos they're stuck on the surface world, unable to ascend to their afterlives

[hushed steeple]

So how does reliving their memories help with that? And why do we steal their clothes in exchange for money

[fickle wing]

yeah reliving their memories like
frees em or something
and ig the stealing clothes bit is ???? might just b one of those things that’s jsut like
a game mechanic w no super in depth lore reason thing

[compact shale]

We help gather themselves up so that we can burn the darkness keeping them trapped here

The clothes thing is... Well.

[fickle wing]

like there might b something behind it that i don’t remember but like
prob not that deep yeah

[hushed steeple]

Oh lol what about the prince and king? Also what are the elders names and why are they not very active?

[compact shale]

Officially it's Elder of [Realm] but there used to be concept names for them named after Hebrew letters
While they're scrapped most of us believe it says something about what devs planned out their role and personality to be

Isle: Daleth
Prairie: Ayin
Forest: Teth
Valley: Samekh (both twins share the name, but in the Fandom Sah usually refers to while Mekh usually refers to )
Wasteland: Tsadi
Vault: Lamed
Prince: Alef
King/Eden Elder: Resh

[fickle wing]

yeah the names r p much fanon
as for the prince n king they’re like
the same person
dude was like the first skykid from a super long time ago or something

[hushed steeple]

Any way to see alef or resh? Like concept art or in game drawings?

[hushed steeple]

Or so he's the onceler?

[frigid tinsel]

Kamilico made a compilation of king/prince(?) symbolism that appears in game and in concept art.

[fickle wing]

oh those r such crispy pics that quality is. Wow

anyways king statue from light awaits

[hushed steeple]

Eden father is just a tall cloak man??

[frigid tinsel]

probably? might also be a mech suit

[compact shale]

Some think Resh is just Alef in an absurdly large throne/mechsuit

Where's the-
#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[hushed steeple]

Oh that's weird how'd he get corrupt

[frigid tinsel]

in Zhao's concepts, they had a crown of darkstone or power diamonds that warped their mind

[compact shale]

Corrupted by power and darkness overuse

[hushed steeple]

He uses darkness? Is it a drinking the dark water situation like from little prince?

[compact shale]

Well not directly but it's theorized that he took his commands of expanding the kingdom with the Power of darkstone too far

Also we don't know if anything in TLP is canon except that the space where Starlight Desert is real

[hushed steeple]

Can you explain dark stone?

Is the krill looking at the prince and not getting red canon? And why are krill in GW in the first place? Why do they attack sky kids?

[compact shale]

1. So you know those diamonds that are in sockets and mechanisms throughout the game? Those are power diamonds, theorized to be made of darkstone. They're supposed to function as artificial stars and power cells to power stuff like flying boats. The darkstone itself is mined.
2. Again, we don't know if that even canonically happened. However, TLP isn't a skykid and doesn't have a core of light like we do, so the krill has nothing in him to target (it's pretty much stated that krill want to consume our light, it's in a Message of the Day before you start up the game.)
3. Krill are corrupted light creatures, see pics for theories of what it once was (most plausible theory imo is that they're this creature from the Switch creature) and the krill are the corrupted skeletons of that creature
   It's theorized that Wasteland had a lot of darkstone production going on, and that the process involved extracting energy from light creatures, and I guess their bones got corrupted by darkness and reanimated, or the darkness corrupted them alive and dissolved their light flesh
4. They want to consume our light, it's said in a Message Of the Day, my theory is that they're trying to fill in the light they lost, but it won't work because it just gets overridden by their corruption

WHERE IS THAT DARN SWITCH CREATURE BIRDDAMN

[hushed steeple]

Any pics of what they used to be :0

Dunno why it gets crustier with every download and reupload hhhh

[hushed steeple]

Heres switch trailer storyboard

[ember elbow]

diAmoNd

[tulip aspen]

aaaa I'll credit you if i use it again

[hushed steeple]

You gotta have a google account to make the docs right? Bleh. Then updater, I am not.

[tulip aspen]

o o f

you can still view it without an account right @hushed steeple ?

otherwise i should move to a different platform

[hushed steeple]

Yeah I read google docs all the time.

[tulip aspen]

olay great ty!

[steep prawn]

If you haven't read or watch the Le Petit Prince then || the Krill in TLP is a symbolization of the Snake in the Story which so far nothing relating to Sky Lore aside from the usage of Creatures and Ancestors ||

[tulip aspen]

it basically is Canon(theoretically), it tells us they only attack creatures of light

devs can't legally say prince is Canon so my headcanon is it is canon and he's actually an alien being that the skykids met

[tulip aspen]

oh wait it is?

so in the prince story the snake doesnt... bite him? and the krill is a direct parallel?

[steep prawn]

yup it is also for the second question you had, Alasdair has good insight below this message! (Thank you Alasdair! )

[frigid tinsel]

the The Little Prince, the snake does bite him and he dies cos he thinks death will bring him back to his planet

[icy spruce]

psst, who wants a pdf of the little prince?

[compact shale]

There are many ways to interpret TLP's fate. Though I did hear that there's a book compiling Antoine's wife's reflections that says what the ending is or something like that idk haven't finished reading it

When it comes to lore, though, shouldn't we just ignore TLP stuff entirely?

[frigid tinsel]

thing I like about Season of the Little Prince is that the story's ending is less ambiguous. still tore my heart out

[tulip aspen]

oh okay seeeee

so therefore the krill isn't a direct parallel, and it not attacking him could actually mean something for sky and not prince

[compact shale]

TLP isn't a skykid and doesn't have a core of light like we do, so the krill has nothing in him to target (it's pretty much stated that krill want to consume our light, it's in a Message of the Day before you start up the game.)

My guess is that the krill told TLP about Eden or something

[rigid iron]

Hey I was looking at your lore document and I don't think Eye of Eden refers to the crystal, I think it just means the eye of the storm that the crystal is in

[tulip aspen]

yea thats what i mean, the krill scene only secure that!

[tulip aspen]

right, i think i called it cos i liked the sound of it that but that's stupid xD

thanks for giving feedback, i need all the help i can get!

[steep prawn]

is there a document or statement between the difference of the Children of the Light and Sky Children?

[compact shale]

No statement I know of , but this doc might help....
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1thcKlrpEPO87cz0hgM5rbMZilC97-2chVEe7uC7WI0c/edit?usp=drivesdk

[steep prawn]

Oh thank you for this! I'm getting a bit confused with the two names hahahah

[tulip aspen]

no statement, only theories

[hushed steeple]

We have no idea what glowboys are but they sure are......something! Imprints, pieces, who bloomin knows.

[keen shore]

Once again the curse of missing every large conversation strikes me… but yeah, the basic gist of what we know has already been stated. The main issues with trying to find the lore for this game are that it’s hard to tell what’s part of the lore and what’s just supposed to help you play the game easier, the information we were given is from old concept art that might not be canon anymore, and everything is very, very vague.

I think it was stated in the new updated intro that cosmetics are thank you gifts from spirits. Ascended candles also seem to help them in some way but I’m not sure how

[compact shale]

Huh? Where????

[keen shore]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7ICnt_pT_ro it should be somewhere in here, it’s an offhand statement rather than a full explanation. If not, sorry, I misremembered, but I’m like 90% sure it is

[tulip aspen]

wack, ill have to look into it

[keen shore]

Honestly it’s the most simple explanation and kind of cute too. I’m not really sure why they want your candles/hearts though

If you subscribe to the “all cosmetics except masks are light” theory then maybe those are the materials needed to produce them, who knows

[compact shale]

Copyright needs to be paid for /j

[tulip aspen]

my headcanon has been moreso the wax grants the ability to remember that specific form to take, seeing as we can switch it on and off at will, so in my mind producing them is already a capability, the problem is just having the power to shapeshift into it

[rain pond]

Spirit in first krill area uses krill shelter w/brazier

[tulip aspen]

nono, i know they're there lolol, i just mean wasteland wasn't always darkened and gross

[rain pond]

Mould in first krill area, forest temple, Polluted geyser and shipwreck/crab fields

[true grove]

It can also be found in forest temple

[rain pond]

3rd pic is forest temple

[true grove]

Wait i didn't notice

It's smol

[tulip aspen]

awesome!!

[humble berry]

Hi! I'm new to researching about lore of this game and i wanted to thank you all for the great work!

I'm finding interesting watching the old version of the game Sky: light awaits, there are many things that were changed, removed (i actually like how it felt very much) and in those changes we can find things that stayed.

Those must be important lore elements, for example the concept of Megabird, it's like a collective entity that splits into everyone playing. It's both the narrator and the protagonist.

There's an early iconography representing the Megabird right at the start, on the first gate you go through.
There is also the Sun symbol, or Light symbol, meaning that the Megabird very clearly might be Light itself/the journey we go through.

[compact shale]

Whoah, that's so cool

There were lots of features in LA that got removed in Sky LIVE because of the technical limitations of phones

Speaking of Light Awaits old lore, the Eden statues were labeled with your friends' names, with the implication that you were saving your friends in Eden
One could say that implication still exists because in Live Sky, the shiny bois in Orbit have your friends' names on them, but that has a lot more interpretations

[true grove]

In the concepts you can see that isle had rough irregular structures with megabird symbols on them but as you travel through all the realms the structures get more and more refined and smooth with sharp edges with no megabird symbols instead it was replaced by diamond shapes and king's symbols

[compact shale]

Ah yes, the stages of a civilization

[humble berry]

Ohh like ancestors neglected their nature and nature itself

[true grove]

Yes, that was the original concept storyline

[harsh pecan]

Light Awaits is cool

[humble berry]

It is, the ending was a bit rough tho

[harsh pecan]

Yeah

[compact shale]

And then back then wl wasn't even a thing and instead you sacrificed emotes

[boreal nebula]

I'm not very fond on the civil war theory, even because in one concept art I think I saw GW Elder with both the opposite side shield (yeah, that could not very relevant now in "canon") but anyway if the two factions were fighting against each others (like the sunshield with a spear stuck inside seems to imply) why does Tsadi wield both a spear and a sunshield?

And if the factions instead were spear+sunshield VS sword+diamondshield, why there's no spear stuck in a diamon shield (that I at least can remember of, I'd like to know if it's not as I recall) ?

I think the Tsadi cutscene is a good hint at the battlefield being a last stand against a krills invasion (he sort of defends the entrance from them with his spiritual power that we restore). Plus Elder tomb has a base that to remind of Forest Elder's mask (IMHO a simbol of 3 diamonds uniting into 1 kingdom, maybe meaning Unity and/or the Kingdom, rather than the king)

Another hint could be how the buildings are broken there without any trace of warmachinces. Did one faction destroyed those with swords/spears only (Age Of Empire style ) ?

I think only krill could have that brute force. Plus a human faction could have figured a way to lift the rival gate during a siege

Barricade IMHO could be a good sign of a defence againat flying creatures. Why?

Because the inhuman brute force was such a spreading bruteforce that could have been the only defence easy to build in a short amount of time (who could have built trenches on the fly?!)

Plus we know how the flying creatures attack, sudden thrusts/dashes against us even when on the ground

[rain pond]

spear piercing diamond shield, ergo spears are probably indicative of the sunburst/megabird faction

[boreal nebula]

Oh, ok. Thanks

[rain pond]

also im not sure what happened after the war/once the krills got involved

maybe the krills are a third party. it is established by whale call that the bones still contain the consciousness of light creatures. if krill are bones mixed with darkness, then krills would be creatures of eternal rage and pain (like GlaDOS) and would lash out at any sign of light they saw? idk

[boreal nebula]

Though I somehow cannot shake of my idea those spears stuck in shields are ricochet from the chaos of the fight

[harsh pecan]

Thats possible

[boreal nebula]

What do you mean by lash out any sign of light?
Sorry, not native speaker

[rigid mural]

So about that mercenary twin valley elders headcanon some of us have...
Also fun fact, French uses singular masculine for them. Singular. Are they one elder in the end...?

[rain pond]

Sky kids and spirits are both clearly aware of krills (GW spirits hide from krills). Skids clearly contain light, and spirits are implied to be a part light based on the fact that their memories recharge the players. Perhaps the krill recognise this light and attack it because the ancestors hurt them in the past

[compact shale]

There's a message of the day that says something like "The Dark Dragon wants to consume your Light"

My personal headcanon is that the krill are hungry for light, possibly in a futile and desperate attempt to become their former light creature selfs again

[rain pond]

Yes that's what I was thinking too

but i was an idiot while typing the message and forgor that bit of my headcanon 💀

[compact shale]

I don't know whether to feel sorry for the krills or feel like ruthlessly euthanizing them

[rain pond]

there's an HC that krills are the war machines but idk

[boreal nebula]

Fun fact: about flying creatures attack, the other day I was trying to get krill alot in the Shipwreck area and a krill hit me an instant before a crab

I could swear that krill went backward after it krilled me instead of going straight forward

I'm used to see crab pushing us out of krill targeting on us, but game mechanics maybe allowed a tiny crab to push back a crab 🦀

[compact shale]

Agh, krill physics get more and more broken every time istm

Maybe the dark side of us gives us the gravitational powers, because darkness can bend the laws of physics /hj

[rain pond]

wh

[compact shale]

Just one of my... Two joke theories hahaha

[boreal nebula]

Indeed the war could be even more complex than we think

Maybe the krills are a third party that wiped out whoever was locked outside the gate of the temple

Maybe they were the war machines (due to their metallic sounds) of the rival side who went berserk against their masters too

[compact shale]

Didn't Jenova once say they were corrupted creatures? Creatures?

[rain pond]

I HC that theyre corrupted remnants of the consciousnesses of light creatures based on the existence of graveyard and bones apparently still being conscious which is creepy

also can someone send me a photo of the supposed "manta skeletons" that can be seen in Sky

[compact shale]

Uuurghhh... Conscious bones... Are the whale bone honks really... Screams of anguish? Birdus Christ!

[boreal nebula]

Honestly, there's too much we don't know, we in lore are like archeologists/historians digging an unknown civilization from the biblical era... But without any written documents we know literally anything specific, nothing more that the little we have left form the sands of time

And that's why we're like in Stargate

Lore: "In my theory they're the landing pad for alien ships...!"
Sky-memes : "LOL" ```

[compact shale]

Hey Tebanklo can we use you as a ritual sacrifice in case dangerous lore becomes a thing?

[boreal nebula]

Maybe, but I'm not sure I am a perfect pure sacrifical lamb

It would be like using a guinea pig on an altar instead of the scape goat

Btw, does anybody have a good resolution of the poster in Office?
Even now that it's open and with a tablet I cannot read the captions of the Stages of Aging/Life poster😕

[lofty rover]

Oh I haven't been here since last year mehe.
Edit: wow the timer is here since last year.
Yes I came just for that joke. Happy new year lore chat! May we be blessed with a lot of lore. We haven't had any since LAST YEAR

[humble berry]

My god that would be a trauma for me

[tulip aspen]

yes i definitely feel the same way about megabird

a lot of people view it more as some sort of tangible God, but i think it's more of just an energy and a lifeforce that flows through all beings of Light

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1QeIMzNaPz-TzC8ZHrdUYTOZ99zObm1PYx65sejTyIfc/edit?usp=drivesdk

[tulip aspen]

if only ):

[humble berry]

Ye i saw your theories about pantheism and i strongly agree

[tulip aspen]

sometimes i feel unsure and hesitant about believing in the TsT theory as well, but personally the idea of krill being sentient things that actively flock together to attack places at once as an army is even harder to follow

to me, there's a reason the concept of dozens of "forces of darkness" suddenly attacking all at once without warning didn't make it into the game, and it's not just because game limitations, but also because the general personality and presence of krill just changed into wandering half dead creatures desperate for a drop of Light to feed on

[tulip aspen]

there's been theories that they were one being split into two but maybe they... fuse instead

either way would sound pretty cool lol

[tulip aspen]

yeah!

also i didn't originally intend to reference pantheism, the credit belongs to alasdair there ehe

[humble berry]

Maybe the krills were good but the ancestors kept polluting nature and got them angry (?) or maybe big cities shone too much and lured them.
The ancestor story gives a strong feeling of nature exploitation and i wouldn't exclude a war for resources/ethics when the empire started to fall.

[tulip aspen]

well, krills are confirmed to have originally been light creatures but got corrupted and then physically deteriorated

i strongly believe they are the creature we see in the cinematic trailer for the switch launch, but not everyone believes that, or wants to

[humble berry]

Oh that screams exploitation so much! The creature in switch trailer resemble the bone structure of the krill, you might be right (and they also looked tired)

[tulip aspen]

here's the full theory, ive been calling it the light dragon theory

"because of concept art for the cinematic hd trailer, there is substantial (but not full of course) visual reasoning to believe the creature we see in that video is the Light Dragon; before it became the Dark Dragon (krill)

this is because originally the creature was to have horns shaped just like a krill's

((second image fan concept of finished creature from trailer for sake of viewing full body , made by kamilico))"

the theory gets corny with the horn evidence because it implies... what, the one used as a wagon in the video had it's horns clipped?

there's a bit to unravel here

[humble berry]

The krill has only one eye tho

Maybe they forgot too, or maybe it's just digievolved

[tulip aspen]

but the fact that they originally intended it to look a lot more like some mammalian krill, means they're going for the point of expressing that that's what krills looked like before, no matter what it ends up being in the finished product

in fact, the finished product looks even more like a krill in some ways, as the being in the trailer only had one eye, so they likely realized the thing they made in that storyboard concept wasn't "krill" or "light creature" enough

[humble berry]

Oh, makes sense! It has one eye in the trailer after all. And that creature hasn't been seen on the island or elsewhere, maybe it went extinct, or we will see them in abyss season

[rough spoke]

can someone explain me the whole lore of sky cotl im really curious about it and what happened in golden wasteland

[gray kestrel]

Hm

[frozen pivot]

man dead, go boom boom, everyone go boom boom, we sleep, we wake, we fall, we walk, we die

golden wasteland went boom boom

[spice musk]

:o noticed dis today!

i discussed a little of that in cozy chat, how those symbols could represent the 6 realms, minus finale zone of course

[blazing geyser]

are there any more symbols on the boat?

[spice musk]

it's the same ones besides those 6, i'll look again though!

[blazing geyser]

i think those symbols might be in cave of prophecies too. afterall the murals of that cave tell us about sky lore too

[spice musk]

nahh just those 6! this is in forgotten ark area btw!

[true grove]

Yes, because different lights are in different realms and in murals on the boat you can see thek collecting them from different realms

[spice musk]

yeee, i wasn't around for that season so perhaps that may be why i'm a bit of a noob with discovering some stuff that people already know xDD ^^'

[true grove]

Also many people have theorized that enchantment and lightseekers are connected

[blazing geyser]

why's that? (I'm new to lore chat oop)

[true grove]

Because lightseekers also catched the lights
The "catch the light" quests are from season of lightseekers

[stark marten]

Also because the murals on the Ark kind of seem to depict people going out and collecting the lights, then bringing them back to have them transformed into the colored lights and used in the creation of spells. So the Lightseekers collected it and other spirits did stuff to it (like alchemy or something similar)

[spice musk]

i'ma research which seasons those are cause i'm new to dis xD learning which seasons of which area and such

[blazing geyser]

andd we kind of have an alchemist spirit in season of enchantment soo lightseekers spirits brought the alchemist lights and he proceeded to transform them into spells (and also selling them cuz forgotten ark is a spell shop)

[spice musk]

aight i see which those are now :O

[stark marten]

There's also the little easter egg in the cave where the piggyback spirit from Lightseekers is, that depicts a trio of light orbs on a boat, which could be seen as a tie-in to Enchantment (even though Enchantment season came later, it's still a little connection)

[spice musk]

yeah! i remember i found that and was like ??? xD

[blazing geyser]

all seasons are connected to each other, we haven't found out the reason yet 👁️

[true grove]

In concepts it looked like the lightseekers were collecting the light from dead people
My theory is that when light orbs detach from megabird and fall on earth they take form of creature based on the environment and that's how sky ancestors and skykids are born. When people die their light is too weak to return to megabird to get reborn so lightseekers gather these lights and bring them to elders for them to send it back to sky.

However sometimes the light detached from the megabird doesn't take any form and just flies around, these lights are collected by alchemists (enchantment people) and then made into different spells and potions.

Enchantment people seem to ve using these spells to purify the land , air and water.

[blazing geyser]

that makes complete sense imo^^^^

[boreal nebula]

Yes and no

They are the same 4 elements plus red and purple but in prophecy they have differnt symbol

[true grove]

About the prophecy and enchantment connection i think ash or one of the devs said that the same color is used for elements in prophecy as the ones in enchantment for the lights

[boreal nebula]

When the mission of orange light comes up in dailies, the icon used is fire from prophecy even if it used to be flames from enchantment!

[blazing geyser]

i think some of the lights' colours are used in trials as well. maybe they are 2 separate things

[true grove]

Ye, whoever did that needs to get stuck in eden forever

[boreal nebula]

Btw also the orange orb from the last TS from enchantment changed the icom into Fire from Prophecy

[blazing geyser]

i thought it was yellow ok nvm i am colour blind

[true grove]

There's no yellow light, only orange in enchantment

It doesn't look orange probably because it's one of those lightseekers lights
Iirc playfight was the one with orange lights
Whoever works on this stuff loves to mess up the lore

[boreal nebula]

I see the same colors for all beside earth which is a green closer ti GW green cape tier 1, but the recent icon update is the final lpre bean they splilled for us. It proves the 4 elements from trials were later lost from envhantment and ended up on the spot we find them for their quests (which IMHO were also forseen by the 4 murals of the prophets in the Cave corridor)

[boreal nebula]

Dont worry, they use nuance quite blended.. for example warm yellow cape on spirit which looks almost orange on you

[blazing geyser]

another question since I don't come here often, any juicy facts about eden's lore???

[true grove]

Shhh.. don't wake up the king enjoyers

[boreal nebula]

What bother mw the most tho is the green on Earth Trial... the moment the spider totem gives us that light that color doesnt match the green on the QG pillar( (the laat one is GW yellow1green, while spider give me a yellow-orange light )

[boreal nebula]

The only one I can think on the spot is the Scholars statues there, the one holding a diamond on their hands🤲

They are seen clearly when you enter the shiny part after you complete Point Of No Resturn, and have a sorto of halo on their back (whch almost look like wings too me 🎡 0

Buuuut...

[true grove]

I'll share something i was thinking about eden recently
Eden is where the megabird's connection is strongest that golden light is a "arm" of megabird or pure light. Every planet in the universe has a place where megabird's connection is the strongest and at these places are where the creatures go to die to reach megabird.
King tried to absorb this power via the huge darkstone diamond and become stronger but something happened and king and elders all got trapped in a void unable to get reborn or die forever.

[restive shore]

Wait, is megabird that giant thing that shows up after you're done in Eden and are just a spirit of light?

[true grove]

Yes

[boreal nebula]

...those giant statues can be seen even in PNR, you need to look up, they are eroded from winds and the halo fell on the ground in the area where there is perpetual rock rain

[true grove]

If you watch the full credits you can see the full megabird at the end she's also visible in orbit

[true grove]

If you notice they break and fall as you move towards the diamond

[restive shore]

Could there be any connection between that diamond (which I suppose is what you see when you rescue the statues) and the statues that seem to be impaled with some crystals while going through Eden? I don't remember exactly where they were but I saw them but I didn't pay much attention to it

[boreal nebula]

Some of these are 1 year old, so you might notice the castle is a little bit different

[true grove]

The statues might be children too corrupted to be rescued

[spice musk]

omg i never noticed those before :O

[restive shore]

But like, I wouldn't imagine why they would have crystals coming out from their body in all directions

[boreal nebula]

During the last climb before reaching the corridor to PNR there are a couple of old skykids (we nicknamed generation 1.0)

And they seem like us when we die, but due to being old version they petrified and crystalized (dying completely without any more light to be saved) while the fallen we save just petriefied.

We consider us to be the generation 2.0 which maybe is perfectly made to go there sacrifice and fracture perfectly to save them all and ascend

Anyway this is a working theory we seemed to agreed here in lore, but feel free to share your idea about it

[restive shore]

So basically, evolving?

[boreal nebula]

The game is made vauge just to let us free to give interpretations, after all

[boreal nebula]

Maybe it's evolving yes, or maybe there could be a deeper meaning... We somehow lived something different from others and learned more about emphaty that maybe accept our fate/role to save the others

For example some think the Shiny Boy we hug in the Pity Room is the Prince/King

But I'm not very fond on this theory which is commonly loved here in Lore

You might have seen some "King Propaganda" memes too

[restive shore]

I wanna say that there could be some god shaping the sky kids so we could be reborn when going to Eden but it's conflicting in my head

[tulip aspen]

👀 👀 👀 👀 👀

[boreal nebula]

My main theory about the diamond is indeed a way to imprint a light like our flame in them in order to let Forest and Vault Elders send those poor soul into Ascension (but many are fond on diamonds = darkstone energy)

Can you share this Lightseekers concept? I don't think I've ever seen it

[true grove]

Here
https://imgur.com/a/9T4PmQC
It's in pins under concept art on social media

[boreal nebula]

In the case of our flame, it's not sending just a "fragment" of our soul but all the emotions, people and memories out candle/heart got in touch with

I think I got into this idea because of all the diamond holes on the chest of the tombstones. It might have a spiritual meaning to them (sort of like the Canopy Vases for Ancient Egypt)

Scratch the Egyptians canopy vases, I recalled they put all organs there but the hearth, that one was the link to their spirit/soul and they couldNt go to afterlife without it on the mummy's chest😅

[boreal nebula]

I really like this more spiritual tune concepts rather than the industrial twist, thanks!
You really shade a light onto my understanding of Lightseekers

btw I once wondered it this could be a symbol of a soul diamond hold between two hands 🤲

🤲

[restive shore]

The first one is definitely that

[true grove]

Oh, the diamond between < > can be found on elder's and skykid's chest
Personally i think that means that they aren't pure light like light creatures but a mix of darkstone and light
So the light (•) is held in the outer impure shell (<>)
<•>

Belonging symbol us really similar but it could simply mean reunion

[boreal nebula]

The symbol is on our chest and we usually grab a WL 👐 when we gift one to save a fallen

[true grove]

It's not the same symbol

A bit different vault also has some similar symbols around the elevator and some platforms

[boreal nebula]

Yeah, I like reunion, btw I tend to conside the 4diamonds together a symbol of Unity or kingdom, rather than about King

[true grove]

I can see the wl one

[keen shore]

Reposting this as it seemed to get passed over last time and I feel like it’s important

[keen shore]

What if the impure shell is the reason the first generation of cotl got crystallized??
I mean the crystals are the same color as refined dark stone

[pastel brook]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/593565781166391316/832872714967842826/Untitled90_20210416150354.png

[tulip aspen]

what if the light imprints into those moulds we were talking about in order to form these crystal/diamonds

so the diamonds are made out of some sort of crystallized enchanted solid light-mass

[keen shore]

I feel like if that were true I feel like it wouldn’t need our light to work / sap it away, because it would already have it…

However it could add on to my theory above and say that the first gen cotl were artificial and the only way to get them to store light inside without the power of a god was to make their outer shells out of dark stone which naturally holds in and absorbs light, but is not the best solution as it gets corrupted in the Storm

[regal phoenix]

hii lore chat

[rigid mural]

Anyone from king propaganda up ? I'd like to now who made the collage of the king patterns in the realms and DM them a few questions

[keen shore]

Hello! I’m glad other people are on, I always seem to miss them

What is king propaganda?? Is it like a separate server??

[rigid mural]

It's an inside joke here because a figure we call the king has its face plastered all over the kingdom (look out for diamonds). I have been informed kamilico is the one that compiled most instances of this, so I hope to catch them next time they are online.

[keen shore]

Oh, okay. The way you phrased it made it sound like a separate server, so I was a bit confused for a second

[rigid mural]

There is a king propaganda server lmao but i'm not in it

[keen shore]

OH okay

[tulip aspen]

just ping kami for the image collage lmao idek if theyre in KP

weird, it wont let me ping or search for kami

[rigid mural]

😂 yeah seems like the fastest option
@hushed steeple can I DM you about your king propaganda and megabird collages ?

[tulip aspen]

they're usually up late PST (my time) so we'll sit on that for a while lolol

[rigid mural]

Not particularly in a hurry either, they're still a regular here.

[frigid tinsel]

i'm not kamilico but i saved their collages

[tulip aspen]

me too lol, vela just wants permission

[hushed steeple]

Im in KP what you talkin about

[rigid mural]

Hi ! can I DM you ?

[frigid tinsel]

oh i can't read today

[tulip aspen]

HI KAMI HOW U DOIN HOWS IT GOING BUDDYCHUMPAL

[hushed steeple]

Sure deal! Heres the ogs in case the copys are blurry. Thats been happening lately.

[keen shore]

I am adding on to this to say that once you start looking for references to the spirits being stars in game, it’s hard to stop seeing them; they even turn into stars when they head to the temples and ascend, it’s just weird considering how that works in this world because. Stars irl don’t work like that to say the least

[tulip aspen]

xD we're all just downloading off each other

(ur amazing btw )

[frigid tinsel]

image degradation occurs usually when people screenshot the pics rather than downloading them, though frequently downloading & reuploading also contributes to it, tho not as bad.

[keen shore]

is the kp server more active than this one?

Just struggling to find places where I can talk about lore sorry

[frigid tinsel]

unless there's 370k+ people in that server, i'm gonna go with no /lh

[hushed steeple]

Nah. Lore talking is not too common. But theres way more lore jokes.

Plus just sharing lore art and stuff to a smaller place where its more likely to be found.

[keen shore]

True but it feels like only 10 or so post here regularly

[tulip aspen]

this and skyblr is basically it but skyblr is dang near unmodded so it's pure anarchy and there's a lot of awful things and hate

[keen shore]

Okay, thank you

[frigid tinsel]

Tbf that’s just tumblr.
Tho in my experience a lot of drama has blown over and people have chilled out there

[hushed steeple]

How is there....hate and drama.....over.....liquid, sky lore?

[tulip aspen]

tbh, especially with a discord format, i prefer that, that it's basically a group chat, but one that anyone can walk into if they feel like it

imagine if it was as busy as general or cozy and was basically just a twitch chat

[keen shore]

Online discourse in general is just… no. It’s something I don’t want to touch with a ten foot pole, somehow keeps coming back to bother me anyways, and seems to be way too common on tumblr for me to go near it

It’s always over the most ridiculous and insignificant things too

[frigid tinsel]

antis
also queer discourse

[tulip aspen]

liquid?

[hushed steeple]

Not solid.

[frigid tinsel]

Implies that skykids are a gas

[tulip aspen]

oh fr lmao

cos back then people wanted to secure their theories as the "right ones" and there was a "lore god" phase where people were put on pedestals and its just... yeesh

[hushed steeple]

How else do you think they dissipate into the sky when teleporting

[tulip aspen]

here, in this chat, you guys have all been my friends, and we've all been a team, equals, and it feels like we're all working constantly over time to slowly uncover the history of sky, and we'll never know the full truth, but it's just so fun trying, especially with all of you here

like legit, thank you guys

it means a lot to interact with you

[ember elbow]

me. just lurking:

JAM

[tulip aspen]

i mean, technically, what if the Light and the Sky could be scientifically explained even with my "its just magic light bruv" theory

if the Light is just StarMatter, some kind of nebulaic gas, the energy flows formulaically in and out of the atmosphere

imagine that; that we literally are stardust energy

[frigid tinsel]

thing about magic in fiction is that there has to be magic system to keep things in order or else you and your audience will go insane.
of course you can just hand wave everything, just say "magic," but that doesn't make sense half the time and tends to get people angry.
granted the rules of the magic system can also make you go insane, something i have personal experience with, but at least there's a predictable structure for things to make sense with

[rigid mural]

jesus shrist not the lore god

Sky's lore is also hard to parse because some stuff is here for gameplay (like the spirits now staying there, when back in the day veterans needed moths to relive non-seasonal spirits) and thus probably isn't canon, and other stuff is here to reinforce the themes of each realm more than add to actual lore (such as some seasons).

[tulip aspen]

people can go insane
that would be realistic

we'll never be able to explain the universe far beyond our reach, we'd never be able to understand God

i like the poetry of something so completely beyond us we could never comprehend it and if we tried our heads would explode

that remains the same and just as beautiful be it science or religion, and i adore that prospect

[frigid tinsel]

lore bible prob has the rules of the Sky magic system(s)

[tulip aspen]

and thats why i dont ever want to see it

we are not supposed to know fam

[boreal nebula]

[rigid mural]

Since the game has themes about moving on from the past and trusting the new generation with the future, it does make sense for spirits to be gone for good when they are saved (in the case of non-seasonal ones) or ascend (at the end of seasons), but from a player standpoint, things needed to be implemented so moths aren't locked out of widely used expressions (such as blow kiss or confetti) and cosmetics.
So canon deviates from player experience for sure.

[tulip aspen]

tbh i wish the ts system would go away

we should be able to experience actual gameplay once (still being able to replay the memory of said gameplay) and then for grinding do (interesting actual) quests for spirits who would stick around indefinitely, like guides

[rigid mural]

I like the TS, they liven up Home and past cosmetics aren't going to waste thanks to them, they're just overpriced imo but that might be because they are targeted toward veterans who sit on loads of candles and hearts.

[tulip aspen]

~~i dont like home, either
and home should be able to liven itself up without living cosmetic stores smh

oh wait this is why people in cozy block me~~

[keen shore]

I wonder how astronomy works in Sky in general. I had this theory that the stars were… not stars but something that looks similar given how they can fall into the earth, and the world existed late in the lifespan in the universe when all the existing stars we would see had already died out. It sounds so much like a conspiracy theory though that I’m reluctant to accept it as true. I’m not very used to fantasy worlds extending fantasy logic outside the bounds of the planet and into the universe itself

[compact shale]

Awh, that's pretty awful

And it's pretty awful that some guides aren't canonically ascended

[tulip aspen]

the world of sky actually doesnt have stars (if you look up i mean) so yes giant balls of gas millions of lightyears away basically dont exist in this universe

[keen shore]

I mean they did at some point, but they all fell. Which is weird because stars can’t do that, they just implode. So… what were the “stars”?

[tulip aspen]

well they aren't stars by the literal definition, just by the cultural; constellations, spirits in the sky, light in the darkness

the Light is just an intelligent semi-hivemind of magical energy, by my views

[compact shale]

So why did they fall?

[keen shore]

The ending of the switch trailer seems to imply a very literal interpretation of the whole stars falling thing, along with a handful of isle of dawn murals, which is what made me think of theory above. Because it first I assumed it was metaphorical too

[rigid mural]

oh no i get you, i think the old aviary organisation was cool and justified why isle is apart from the other realms ! I wish we landed directly in isle when we return from eden...

[keen shore]

Apparently the reason is supposed to be evident and discoverable in the game but I’m not really sure about the answer yet to be honest. It was definitely something with a cause though and not just a random event

[tulip aspen]

we don't know

og intro was supposed to explain that for me but that got debunked so we just... don't know
anything

it was supposed to make them being born concrete, it was supposed to tell us so much

but for now, they just fell

that's all we know /:

[frigid tinsel]

just musing, idk, on one hand, there's a strong rational for the spirits canonically not coming back after they're ascended, like what Vela's saying about entrusting the world in the new generation. I too lean on the ts and such prob being a game mechanic idea.

but I also don't want to easily dismiss it. For one thing, it looks like spirits can only be drawn back under few specific circumstances (at their graves, on the constellation table) and, especially in the case of traveling spirits and Granny, not for long. Yes, very likely these are just game mechanics. but the spirits also give wing buffs in Orbit, so they sorta still exist as themselves ever after ascending instead of being integrated into Megabird's hivemind (if there is one)/

something I've been thinking about in regards to seasonal spirits is that irl the night sky does not look the same throughout the year. As the Earth and the solar system moves throughout the universe, we face different parts of the universe, and the night sky changes. There's such a thing as the winter sky and the summer sky and so on where different constellations are visible.

What if, in Sky, something similar is occurring? If all spirits are part of a constellation, but only when their constellations are visible in the night sky that those spirits could be "drawn back" not just by skykids but by other ancestors in the past? in fact a lot of cultures had an idea that the spirits of their ancestors could be invoked and called back by their descendants.

[tulip aspen]

actually, my concept is that we shouldn't have a level hub at all, and the realms should be area-split open world

[keen shore]

It sounds so much like a tinfoil hat theory to say stars aren’t real so that’s why I’m kind of reluctant to say it’s true lol

I already mentioned my spirits being the souls of stars headcanon, which adds to the weird implication that something is up with the “stars”, but I’m not sure how canonically true that is, although spirits and stars have some very strong parallels

My ideal version of Sky is just a massive open world with tons of ruins and beautiful environments and different realms and all but. That’s just me, I like to explore

I think the level hub is needed functionally for easy traveling between realms

[rigid mural]

I agree with Salem, a level hub would be needed. Perhaps the aviary was removed because that hub itself wouldn't be canon, but i dont get why we land in Home instead of Isle, the latter option would land the rebirth symbolism perfectly

[keen shore]

In my head version of lore I consider Home more a gameplay mechanic than anything canon, although who knows

[rigid mural]

Yeah me too, it feels kind of like a middle point between our world and Sky's, kinda like early early early isle with all the modern buildings before we take flight to the clouds

[compact shale]

Yeah, but the human world connection is a concept that doesn't seem to have any bearing on the current Sky

[tulip aspen]

its not that they aren't real, it's that they aren't the same kinds of stars in our reality

there is still balls of light up there in the sky, but they just aren't massive gas ovens

[frigid tinsel]

still ruminating over the "as spirits, we became many" line in the intro tho

[tulip aspen]

well in my concept of no hub, every single area is connected, and backtracking feels more natural

it was this whole dumpster fire wishlist i made a while back
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1NvdRk-w6DROP09YRvbZ-yaAwVr7LCfSmOw3SMHbLyck/edit?usp=drivesdk

i got the feeling of open world the most from the wind patha

[compact shale]

Was the descent of the ancestors intentional or not? What evidence do we have in favor of one or the other?

[tulip aspen]

"in terms of evidence, we have no evidence"

literally the only argument for it is that

1. they're weak and dumb compared to skykids, who are intended to be there
2. they're meant to "return" to the sky, so they don't belong here for sure
   (but even if they dont belong here, it doesnt prove that they weren't allowed to fall down to earth in the first place)

[compact shale]

Okay, time to pray to a big pile of ashes to give us a clue

[tulip aspen]

"hey ash, can you just explain God for me real quick? it's just God, should be easy"

[keen shore]

This I think just means a lot of spirits fell. It could have a double meaning with the whole hivemind theory but I think the simplest explanation is best in this case.

[rigid mural]

you think compiling a list of questions to ask ash would be very rude, mostly stuff to clarify wording and what is canon or not within player xperience

[keen shore]

I don’t see how it would be honestly, just say it’s fine if they don’t want to answer and you should be good

[compact shale]

I think that's too big of a question for them to answer, I already said one of the questions I wanted to ask

@rigid mural birddamit, I was JUST doing that!

[frigid tinsel]

part of me thinks we're relying on the devs to answer questions they won't too much

[tulip aspen]

not at all, but ash loves giving out non answers and WAFOs (understandably)

those hurt more than if the TGC lords stayed quiet, personally, but we have to try

[rigid mural]

It's against the rules to message a TGC staff member, so when they come here, it's usually because they've been told to/feel like answering questions so...

[tulip aspen]

yeah, small questions lol

their NDA and not damaging the veil over the lore bible is risky

ash is playing floor is lava every single time she interacts with us, i personally wouldn't have the sanity to interact with my community like that lolol

[keen shore]

Plot twist they’re watching us right now

[rigid mural]

WAFOs are because you ask questions about stuff that could be explained in a season imo, such as "who's the king" etc, what they probably have more reasons to answer clearly is on where we can look for lore, such as "is this mechanic something canon or was it something implemented for the player experience"

[frigid tinsel]

[insert skybot here]

[tulip aspen]

she most certainly is xD

we know the staff watch us in here

[rigid mural]

Ash also seems to have a wildly different gaze on the game, their theory on the wastelands being a dried out harbor is fascinating, so while it's not crumbs, there's potential for some excellent food in asking them about their theories, as a player.

[compact shale]

I guess that since those are personal theories, they're not bound by the NDA, but we can't tell if THOSE are canon.

[tulip aspen]

they also dont impact the story much (or do they dun dun dunn)

like sure its cool to know they had water doors and that shipwreck's coast was 50 feet higher once, but it doesnt tell us anything lol

[rigid mural]

maybe but it's a theory i never saw before, and it holds some decent ground

[keen shore]

It could help sort of because it means the water had to go somewhere

Also question, what does WAFO stand for?

[frigid tinsel]

Wait And Find Out

[tulip aspen]

yes true so it does show canals ran into wasteland, which meant wasteland truly did used to be pretty and wet and alive

what wording

[rigid mural]

the wording is killing me

[compact shale]

Golden Wetland?

[keen shore]

Side note sort of relating to this. The forgotten ark has tree murals on it, is this supposed to mean wasteland was once a forest or they went through hidden Forest? we know isle suffered desertification so it’s not too far fetched

[frigid tinsel]

dumping your manufacturing crap in the woods/marshes or a body of water is a common phenomena

[keen shore]

this is why the twins blocked it off

[compact shale]

*casually dumps uranium into the sea

[tulip aspen]

car batteries in the ocean

[keen shore]

Maybe it was once a forest, but due to being located downstream from all the areas pollution was dumped, it slowly became infertile
Why is it hard to avoid describing GW without sounding like a creep

[rigid mural]

hmmm irl Mexico, Amsterdam and countless other cities are built on wetlands.
Perhaps it's the case with GW !

[frigid tinsel]

and they could've cut down the trees/leveled the ground to make way for buildings

[compact shale]

Water and darkness are the enemies of arson in a human-shaped can (in other words, us)

[frigid tinsel]

unless its a grease fire
FYI: don't throw water on a grease fire

[rigid mural]

You think asking for a Lore QnA specifically would be too much ? Not everyone is as deep as this chat but hey, it could officialise some stuff & maybe give us more crumbs

[frigid tinsel]

a Lore Q&A would be fun

[keen shore]

As long as you’re nice and not demanding about it it can’t hurt to try… I will ask that it be requested to be a text based one instead of answered in voice chat

And most of the questions will be revolving around what’s a game mechanic and what’s not probably? since we don’t know how much is answerable

[rigid mural]

I think the devs already know how to pick and choose what gets answered so...

[keen shore]

Fair but it might be more helpful to just focus on the ones we for sure know are answerable

[rigid mural]

Ehhh I wouldn't sweat that, like I said, the devs (with the help of mods) can take care of themselves. AFAIK nobody tried to push Ash to drop a crumb when they said WAFO

[compact shale]

I mean I HOPE our fire is like a grease fire but if not... Then no Golden Wetland exploration for us

[keen shore]

Okay good, I’m new to this server so I didn’t know if people here had a reputation for being pushy when asking for lore or whatever

[rigid mural]

ehhh i've seen worse in terms of community, to say the least

[keen shore]

One more thing I just remembered, so pants (I think it’s pants. It might be masks and I’m remembering wrong) can change your skykids skin color right? Usually the seasonal spirits’ pants make it darker, while the ones you get in the base game keep it a slightly lighter shade

I have a headcanon this is meant to show your skin gets slowly darker as you continue to exist because you usually get the seasonal pants later on. I don’t know if this is true but it’s a neat little idea

[tulip aspen]

demanding
aaaaaaand that's why fruity does the talking

[keen shore]

I didn’t mean to imply that you guys seemed like the type to be demanding at all, sorry if it came off that way. I just meant that unless you’re super pushy you shouldn’t be too worried about a negative reaction to asking for lore bits

Relaying tone and intention in text is HARD

[tulip aspen]

i have a headcanon that because seasonal clothing has so much detail on it, it's much more taxing to project that form, so the clay glows a lot less as the flame is all concentrated in the clothing

[tulip aspen]

no i was joking lol sorry

its just the last time i asked ash a question i was very rude

[keen shore]

Ooh maybe, it’s certainly a less roundabout implication than my idea!

It’s fine, I thought you were I just wanted to clarify because I quickly realized there might be confusion

[rigid mural]

I just feel like there are lore questions that can be asked, not everything can be explained in a season. For example, the Valley elders are refered to as a singular entity, but the Valley of Triumph represents them as two entities (so even if they are siamese twins or came from one entity, they still were recognised by their dual nature). Unless there's a season centered on them (very unlikely, it seems the elders are voluntarily elusive) then we will not know wether to refer to them as "the valley elder", "the valley elders" or if both are somehow correct.

long winded way to say "should the valley twins be refered to as a single or as two entities ?"

[frigid tinsel]

Valley Elder(s)

[keen shore]

It’s just one valley elder but they’re really fast

[rigid mural]

Ash once called them the "valley twin elder spirits" so it's possible they are two entities, but in the game, they are referred to as the "valley elder" when you summon them in orbit and go buy their hairs.

[compact shale]

Wait, are there any official names distinguishing from

No, the Sah/Mekh thing isn't official

[frigid tinsel]

i've been ruminating on the thought that they're one entity with two bodies. perhaps not originally, but they are now and had to adjust to be as coordinated as they are.

[rigid mural]

kakashi and dora

[keen shore]

This is also possible. I just like to imagine them as normal twins because it’s a sweet idea.
I wonder how something like that would happen?

[compact shale]

Wow that's trippy
Imagine how easily any attempt at moving could end up as a pile of tangled body parts that forest/wasteland elder has to hammer/spear apart

[frigid tinsel]

yea, i'm fond of the sweetness and hilarity of them being twins or two separate entities, but i also like the esoteric vibes and speculation of one entity with two bodies

[rigid mural]

oh yeah ! hermaphrodite in alchemy ?

[keen shore]

Honestly even if they are normal twins this occurrence probably still happens regularly

[frigid tinsel]

i'm unfamiliar with that, could you explain?

[tulip aspen]

ah yes, i love making my arms fight each other

[compact shale]

Stop hitting yourself! Stop hitting yourself! OH OH OH NO OH BIRDS AAGH FORESTY HELP AAAGGHHH

[tulip aspen]

that's uh
naked

OH GOD NO THE CASTLEVANIA PTSD

VELA DM IT PLS NO

[rigid mural]

they dont have a detailed crotch, chill out

[tulip aspen]

rebis nightmares

[rigid mural]

it's like a ken doll

[frigid tinsel]

i'm still sorta confused but intriqued

[keen shore]

These are all valid theories but trying to explain them to someone outside this chat..

[rigid mural]

Rebis is the child of the sun and the moon, alliance of opposites, yadda yadda

[tulip aspen]

it's a man and a woman sown together
its cursed as eden

[rigid mural]

they are not sown ????? buddY 😭 stop freaking out

[frigid tinsel]

gender

[tulip aspen]

im partly joking lol its from a show about the game castlevania

id explain but it's..... not pg
at all

[compact shale]

FacePlant

Do I even want to know what that FacePlant to the left is

[tulip aspen]

anyways
for one entity with two bodies i don't think it's quite like a rebis, moreso that one mind controls both like puppets (but dont think weird about it it doesnt have to be cursed)

[rigid mural]

Anyway, "true" twins (aka they are the exact biological copy of eachother) happen when the egg is split in two, just like their realm is split in two. There's a pattern going on there, with stuff split in two.

[tulip aspen]

they're too busy 💡

[keen shore]

Imagine we ask the devs about this theory and the orbit spelling just turns out to be a typo

[rigid mural]

would be a funny story

[frigid tinsel]

i think i'd go mad if it was a typo

[keen shore]

I do have to wonder how uh… baby creation works in this universe, like if that holds true for the skyverse as well, but I don’t know if we’re allowed to talk about that

[rigid mural]

some trolls ask about that topic to bait people into talking about reproduction, which frankly makes me uncomfortable especially knowing what the target audience for this game is.

[frigid tinsel]

why reproduce when your god does it for you? /hj

[rigid mural]

😬

[frigid tinsel]

but, yea, same

[keen shore]

Like maybe twins are just people who spawned (for lack of a better word) at the same time and there’s not really much to it.
Yeah that’s true, I don’t think it’s too important to know about, although the usage of twins implies genetic relation which is interesting

[frigid tinsel]

it's the community who calls them twins, we dunno if they're actually twins

[keen shore]

Huh I thought it was confirmed for some reason, never mind then

[rigid mural]

symbolically wise, twins are equal and similar but separate forces. The elders are almost identical, of course they are called twins

[keen shore]

Yeah it’s probably just a symbolic relation

[tulip aspen]

we should def ask ash

funnily enough chances are they've already seen the question today and are now mulling it over

[compact shale]

Which question are you talking about?

[pastel brook]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/593565781166391316/832872714967842826/Untitled90_20210416150354.png

[compact shale]

Yeah, someone's definitely watching

[tulip aspen]

HAH

IT WAS COMING EVENTUALLY

[tulip aspen]

the twins being one elder or not

[harsh pecan]

[thin dirge]

I do see the twins being seen as one elder

[fickle wing]

that’s wrong actually one of the devs referred to em as twins
gimme a sec 2 pull up the proof

https://youtu.be/FwcNVlpymNk
27:40 mark in the gnomon presentation

[thin dirge]

They're like two halves of a whole. There's two, but from what I can see so far, they seem to be considered as one elder so far in Sky. Sharing the same constellation, the same realm, pretty much the same star.... But at the same time, they're seperate ppl as well?

[harsh pecan]

Same

[keen shore]

It’s really interesting to see how the forest elder specifically changed so much. Everyone else is recognizable from their original except them. (although that might be them in a different outfit lol)

What’s everyone’s headcanons on the prophecy guide’s relation to the prophets? Was it ever confirmed? I’m curious as it’s my favorite season

[compact shale]

Sadly we don't see any spirit memory interactions of them but I guess they're the leader

I hope TGC can find a reason to give infocards to the previous seasonal spirits like they did with Flight

[frigid tinsel]

My headcanon is that they were the prophets’ PR guy

[keen shore]

YEAH I loved that so much, I really like when the spirits are given more character. It just makes the entire experience including emotions more immersive

[tulip aspen]

they're the main prophet (too deep ik ik)

[keen shore]

I didn’t analyze too much into it but I imagined them as their adoptive kid just because it’s hilarious to imagine them having to switch between Mysterious Prophet Mode and Parent Mode

[fickle wing]

honestly w the prophets n the guide i like to think they were all like
the guides sorta older sibling figures or something along those lines since like
w the teaser trailer the fella is Way shorter than we see now ingame
maybe younger or. Something which
kinda paints a picture 2 me of this kid w the gift of prophecy being sent off 2 some strangers who also happened 2 b able to get prophecies n stuff but overtime they all like
yknow become a funky little family of sorts

ESPECIALLY after the whole prophecy writes screenplays bit we got from ash like km sorry but the mental image of the prophets trying to act n support the qg is killing me

[keen shore]

YEAH that was sort of what gave me the adoptive kid idea and then I just kept it because the idea and imagining interactions is just really cute and hilarious

even funnier if you imagine the prophecy qg having an emo teenager phase

[fickle wing]

oh my god the emo phase

[keen shore]

They all try really hard to support them but they don’t quite get how to act around teenagers in general [EDITED FOR PRONOUNS]

I was thinking about my cat while typing this and that’s why I used him lol

[fickle wing]

y’all wanna know a fun little bit abt water n air prophet
for waters ts hints they included stuff like their fav color being purple
n that they were scared of heights
meanwhile air has a purple cape n a trial involving heights like 👀
im just saying🏳️‍🌈

[keen shore]

👀 where do you find hints like this

[fickle wing]

usually for the ts hints you can look em up from ash’s old messages in general but some folks have lists made w em all

honestly they’re my fav part abt ts tuesday just because it adds those funky little personality crumbs onto the spirits that we rlly need

[keen shore]

Ohhh I thought they were posted in a specific channel or something, I was confused as to why I couldn’t find them lol. I live for small tidbits of lore about the spirits they make me very happy

[tulip aspen]

damn fire prophet finna be devastated

[fickle wing]

YEAH SAME
rlly hope we get something similar to those for basegame spirits or something cause that’d b rlly funky even if it was something small
like
sometimes folks get too caught up in the big lore chunks and stuff to dig into the smaller things n details that add to the characters that make em feel more alive n stuff even though. They’re dead n all that jazz but like yeah

hold on just gonna pull up some ts hints i think r funky cause. That spirit brainrot is hitting rn

[compact shale]

maybe most of Ash's hints about the prophets are their pre-prophet time when they were just a normal citizen or something

[fickle wing]

love these 2 for spin dance
they’re allergic to dairy right
but. Lattes have milk in em
and i know there’s options 4 em w out dairy n all that but the rlly silly joke hc that spin dance passed away from having lattes just takes me out

[harsh pecan]

They’re just coworkers

Prophecy Guide also hides the bodies of the fallen people after the Prophets do their work

[tulip aspen]

milk........?

but...

[compact shale]

If the Prophets had family, imagine how hard it would be to explain if the family found out that they've killed someone

Oh wait, maybe they get shut out from their loved ones once they become prophets

NO NO TOO EDGY AERHEGN

[keen shore]

Why does everyone think they killed people?! They’re just sleeping, don’t question it

[harsh pecan]

They’ll probably get divorced after that

[keen shore]

The prophets deal with having unnatural knowledge of the future on a daily basis… but can they deal with The Divorce

[harsh pecan]

If no one got killed or just died, i don’t think people would try their best to finish the trials

So the prophets might’ve killed them to motivate the contestants

[compact shale]

Eternal coma inside Water Trial Permafrost? (yes I think the Water Trial has some permafrost somewhere)

[fickle wing]

i mean they might’ve not
left the cave much so contact w loved ones n friends n stuff could’ve been limited
ash did say they were trapped together after all
even if it a joke it’s still an interesting thought

[keen shore]

They probably got rewarded with.. something afterwards I guess? I wonder how the trials worked for the spirits, considering our explanation for them is literally just “it’s all a dream constructed from your sky kids MIND POWER”

[compact shale]

Maybe the acting is just part of them dealing with isolation insanity

I have written a thing where one of the Mischief Guides is Earth Prophet (Insanity Ver.)

[fickle wing]

w the prophets killing thing are we talking like
directly killing or folks passing away from trying to complete the trials cause the former is kinda ???Huh???

[keen shore]

Is there a link to a doc with all the ts hints by any chance?

[harsh pecan]

I was making one but I gave up

[harsh pecan]

I feel kinda bad for them now

[compact shale]

I guess the latter

There's also a thought that they could be watching the mindspace and when they fail in the mindspace they... kill them irl but that makes no sense

[keen shore]

I still don’t understand why people are saying they killed people

[harsh pecan]

If the people in the murals are dead then they killed them either way

[compact shale]

Well it's more of the trials killing them, but if you think that they created the trials, then... well...

[fickle wing]

fire prophet hugged someone too hard and they went

[harsh pecan]

RIP

[keen shore]

Oh are we talking about the horizontal people in the murals? I thought that was them passed out while doing the trial, I feel like it would be weird for them to actually kill people considering this is isle of dawn era, when spirits are more conscious of how things are “supposed” to work so NO MURDER ALLOWED

[compact shale]

Or you know, ethical insanity for creating places that fricking killed people

[harsh pecan]

True

[compact shale]

ethics is a delusion
-Shidou Kirisaki

[harsh pecan]

Yea but the cave is secluded, they could kill someone and get away with it

[fickle wing]

w the prophets killing thing i rlly cant see it cause like
u rlly expect me to look at fire prophet
a fella who says zoinks and wears socks to bed (according 2 those ts hints) and is super silly during their spirit memories
and believe that they killed someone

[keen shore]

Why do those knowledge tidbits about the fire prophet not surprise me at all

[fickle wing]

there they go

[harsh pecan]

Maybe the prophets were actually good people before, but they started killing because of some reason

The memories that we relive might’ve taken place before the killing

[keen shore]

I doubt they killed people honestly, I just can’t see it

[compact shale]

Yeah I mean, they were probably normal citizens before...

The memories of them are them teaching ancestors, so they were probably training them for the trial

IT'S NOT DIRECT MURDER IT'S THE TRIALS

[keen shore]

But how do we know the trials actually kill people?? I thought them teaching ancestors was just… them telling them about their prophecies

[fickle wing]

honestly we don’t know if they did or not
for all we know the folks in the trial murals could just b passed out
which is prob the more likely option since
yeah

[harsh pecan]

I don’t think they were just teaching them about the prophecies

[frigid tinsel]

i mean, the trials look deadly

[fickle wing]

even if folks did die it was prob accidental

[keen shore]

I mean maybe, earth and water spirits seem to be doing some sort of demonstration? We know the trials are not deadly because otherwise every time we died we’d get sent into orbit

[harsh pecan]

Maybe we’re just built different

[keen shore]

I’m imagining this conversation between a group of skykid police officers investigating the prophecy caves and enjoying the mental image very much

[compact shale]

Well, remember that these are ancestors we're talking about. We're probably built different from them, and Alef as well, if we assume They're the chosen one.

[harsh pecan]

Ye

[keen shore]

We are not immune to dying, just dying permanently

[fickle wing]

i think my fav part abt the trials ingame is the fact that the prince had to go thru this all and everyone was like wow he finished the trials he’s so powerful or whatever and then god knows how long many years later a bunch of glowing flying toddlers zip through the same trials

[tulip aspen]

thats why i still think everyone else died to them but skids cant

[compact shale]

I guess we have special mindspace powers but...

JAM WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO SAY ABOUT THE MINDSPACE

[harsh pecan]

Yes

[tulip aspen]

tiredly reaches for link

salem is so smart thinks like me

[keen shore]

I mean we know the trials aren’t a physical location, they’re mental. It wouldn’t make any sense really for them to kill people, it’s like when you die in a dream; you don’t wake up dead

[compact shale]

Maybe they fainted from shock or got put into an eternal coma or something

[keen shore]

but why???

[tulip aspen]

enjoy ig idk pain
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1B5N140v47F1FLuWHHRITYwEiLbptLZQFf0Lph-57XDE/edit?usp=drivesdk

[fickle wing]

maybe instead it was the equivalent of waking up from a Real bad dream or something
not everything abt lore and theories has to b grime w death yknow
after all this is a general audiences game so

[compact shale]

Well, falling off a slippery ice structure 432347234 meters in the air could shock the frick out of someone

[harsh pecan]

The trials probably worked differently tho

[frigid tinsel]

mindspace or not, they prob killed people

[compact shale]

Can you die in your hallucinations?

[keen shore]

I’m gonna be honest no one has given solid evidence that they’ve murdered people, just hunches and maybes, so I still doubt it

[harsh pecan]

Yea

[fickle wing]

once again taps the sign that the ppl dying w the trials thing is VERY unlikely since
yknow general audience game that yeah while it does dip into more serious themes w the whole death n spirits thing i rlly don’t think. This is something that’d go down
besides like salem said there’s no real solid evidence for that whole biz

[frigid tinsel]

you can die by being way too freaking stressed, broken heart syndrome is a thing – the mental is just an imperative for your health as the physical so yes, if they hallucinated hard enough, they could've died.

[compact shale]

Yeah, I guess... A S H ? !

[tulip aspen]

huh?
did Ash delete a message or something

[keen shore]

We need to take them to Spirit Court over this

[harsh pecan]

Wait if we interact with a wl in the trials and then get one after finishing it, does that mean at least some parts of the trials are real? So it’s possible that they could’ve died from the trials

[keen shore]

We have no idea what WL are, they could just be a gameplay mechanic at this point

[compact shale]

Well, some say that WL represent the memories of skykids who passed there before, like footprints of many explorers converging at a point

Not sure how that would work for the trials tho...

[tulip aspen]

krii, we're talking about an abandoned civilization where millions of people were killed suddenly, where some kind of warfare happened and blood was spilled

I understand the distaste of such a concept, but the history of this Kingdom isn't very general audience in the first place

[tulip aspen]

in trials, I would believe it so personally

[fickle wing]

dude
it’s possible to go into those things w out making it super brutal yknow that right
plus saying this again
no solid evidence for the death thing
jeez for someone so bent on canonchasing u rlly don’t elaborate when folks ask for concrete proof huh

[tulip aspen]

no solid evidence for the alive thing not going to lie I think you're just really intent on putting me down in any way you can like the literal tension of you coming into this chat it's just insane

[keen shore]

Just going to say I don’t want this to turn into an argument, I’m fine with people having different interpretations, I am just genuinely confused on where the idea of them killing people comes from

[compact shale]

When there isn't good evidence in favor of any side, the only thing to do is to wait for a Dev to drop a clue to help us

[tulip aspen]

short and simple we genuinely can't know either way yeah

[harsh pecan]

Someone should summon a dev rn

[tulip aspen]

didn't vela do it once 👀

[keen shore]

Can someone tell me why we thought they were killing people in the first place???

[harsh pecan]

Cause they’re dead?

[fickle wing]

but we don’t know
they’re dead bro this is rlly just going in circles huh

hold up nvm misunderstood thought this was abt the murals again
unless it is and my brain is just scrambled rn idk

[frigid tinsel]

Occam's Razor. The trials look really deadly. The cave murals depict horizontal ancestors. It looks like they died. Simple as that.

[tulip aspen]

im not sure you can say that for sure

[compact shale]

Yeah, this doesn't seem to be going anywhere. Sigh...

[keen shore]

…everyone is dead, what do you mean?

Also once again we know the trials aren’t deadly, they have some kind of checkpoint mechanism built in from the beginning, where you go back to the checkpoint after making a mistake. I doubt these would have existed in the trials if they were meant or even had the possibility to kill.

[fickle wing]

oh hey seems like good time to remind folks that
the canon of sky is straight up up 4 interpretation according to the devs so like

[keen shore]

Also keep in mind that this happened in the era of isle of dawn, when dying meant traveling to eden to get reborn. I really doubt prophets who are supposed to be holy would be allowed to kill even by accident.

I’m not trying to be aggressive I’m just stating my reasoning on why it doesn’t really make sense once you think about it

[harsh pecan]

Next time a dev comes y’all should make sure to ask about this

[hushed steeple]

They say that.....then reveal concrete details every now and then.

[harsh pecan]

What about

[keen shore]

Can you elaborate? I’m not really sure what this question is asking

[hushed steeple]

We always assumed checkpoint where only for skykids (and possibly even the victor) Since, skykids respawn everywhere else, and the sideways figures look.....pretty dang ominous.

[compact shale]

Hm. . . gameplay mechanic?

[harsh pecan]

The shadows in the fire trial could kill someone, they also wouldn’t have existed if they prophets didn’t want the trials to be deadly

[neat flint]

So you want trials to be harmless?

[hushed steeple]

I never assumed the prophets made the trials. More that the elements themselves did. The propthskajas are thist there to represent the mepresent tnsaa

[compact shale]

The what?!

[hushed steeple]

The mepresent of ta propectsf

[frigid tinsel]

Kami, you having a stroke?

[harsh pecan]

No

[fickle wing]

thinking. Abt how the entrance to the cave is one of those portals
same type we see in homespace
they could’ve just done the same they do w other entrances to season areas but

[keen shore]

I mentioned earlier that they’re probably just passed out going through the trials mentally. The thing with this game is that it’s really easy to make assumptions, but you have to think through everything.

For instance:
Why would they add checkpoints for beings that wouldn’t exist for centuries other than just one?
Why would a group of prophets be allowed to continue to exist, to teach others, and to put others through a trial in a time where any sort of violent death is unnatural?

The shadows in the fire trial are simply another obstacle to overcome. They make the trial more challenging. Also the prophets most likely made them or at least have experienced them themselves due to their masks also being present on the checkpoints and endpoints.

Oh! And also! The very end of the trial, how you win, is lighting a checkpoint. How would spirits even beat these in the first place if they’re just for skykids??

[hushed steeple]

Just a torch for normy norms. Expert pro gamer skykids hack them to be save points.

[fickle wing]

hold on
do we have any proof that the other folks in the trial even were spirits or??

[harsh pecan]

Yes, they have two lines, which represent spirits

[frigid tinsel]

well the only other humanoid species in the game beside elders are the ancestors so

[keen shore]

Yeah this is also an interesting subject to me. It implies portals existed in the real world and not just as convenience in our heads, but it’s also weird because this is the only portal outside of home in the game iirc. All the others are constellation gates or other methods of entry like the boat you ride to the forgotten ark. I wonder what it’s meant to imply

[hushed steeple]

Honestly it could go either way. I think they died cause sideways figures on the ground and in water look not alive to myself. But it could easily just be to rep that they failed. Bbbbbb

[tulip aspen]

owa tadats reecola

[keen shore]

Eh honestly them dying just doesn’t really make any sense to me. I get why people would think that but with the evidence above I just can’t see it.
The idea that the elements rather than the prophets created the trials is a really interesting idea though. If the prophets did create them it is also interesting that they have the power to do that in the first place. Maybe skykids aren’t the first generation with their level of mindspace abilities

[tulip aspen]

I have a headcanon the prophets hid this operation from the elders

[keen shore]

Why would they? I feel like the information would get out one way or another, it’s not like the cave of prophecies is super well hidden
Not trying to be rude I am just curious

[tulip aspen]

I mean we can see priests from vault and such having very strong influence over mindscapes and illusions caused by the Light

the priests did it with technology as an aide, but who's to say there aren't special rituals that would allow the profits to tap into it a bit more naturally with magic

[thin dirge]

I always interpreteted it just means they failed. How else would they show it?

I think whatever happened to those ancestors that failed are def up for interpetation. Not everything TGC leaves behind has a detailed reason behind it, some are just there for the players to have their own interpretation

[tulip aspen]

no yeah no you're not being rude at all
for me it's just a theory I personally believe in because it just wouldn't make sense for it to just be a fun little game that the ancestors had to go through

if this was the ritual that allowed them to choose a king, then in my opinion it would have to be much harder than what the sky kids had to go through, and I can only see that being true via the idea that the ancestors would only have one chance

maybe that doesn't mean they died, but if they got multiple chances I just don't see it being enough of a challenge to make sense that that would be the ultimate test

because otherwise, everyone would get through it eventually after enough deaths

[compact shale]

I guess so, but it doesn't seem like we can find in-game evidence for either side, so I await the day when we can have some questions answered

[fickle wing]

priests? do you mean the scholars or

[harsh pecan]

Mhm

[thin dirge]

Or they just failed because they didnt understand that you need to learn and have certain attribute to pass like Water is patience, etc etc

[tulip aspen]

indeed

[keen shore]

True, I just read the mindspace document and just kind of assumed it was something unique to skykids based on its phrasing, so after rethinking the trials I thought it was interesting

I believe everyone else just kind of gave up, or though they didn’t kill people, the trials were just mentally and physically draining to complete. I mean, the prince didn’t really die ever, so he could have just been the luckiest first one to complete it. And honestly, if I was faced with pre-nerfing Trial of Air I would give up as well

[compact shale]

Weren't the prophets supposed to teach that? And the traits are there because I guess they're good for someone who's gonna be ruling a whole damn kingdom?

[fickle wing]

that priests bit confused me for a sec cause
iirc the only similar thing we got a directish mention of priests for is the scrapped valley elder who was a priestess

kinda a girlboss

[tulip aspen]

my head Cannon, that does in fact run into the minescape theory, is that ancestors could meditate, but it would be more like humans trying to meditate, like experiencing true enlightenment into a different reality, which would be intense and very difficult to actually pull off

meanwhile for sky kids they do it casually, and further into my head Cannon that's because tapping into mind spaces is connecting to the light which is very hard

[keen shore]

Side note have we ever figured out how the scholars of vault can levitate things? is it something connected to the whole thing about light creatures in this world having weird gravity effects?
I can totally see the trials as being not deadly but really disorienting and headache inducing because of how real they feel. Especially in trial of air where you feel like you’re falling to your death each time even though it’s not real, it would just be really stressful to endure

[compact shale]

Some of us had a headcanon that even if Alef did finish all the trials, the experience still messed their mind up, and combine that with the fact that they're still a child and you get a really (expletive) bad king

[tulip aspen]

yeah I know I just called them my bad my wording can get really stupid sometimes

[thin dirge]

Hmm, true, but I guess its called a "Trial" for a reason, so it tests people if they really have tose attributes.

Also, I dont even know if those students really even went to the trials, or if the Prophets teaching them were before or after Sky child came and did the trials, so theres that.

Also, I dont think thats actually what those trials were for.... In the concepts, it feels kinda implied Prince wasnt really meant to become King....

[compact shale]

Yeah, I think the Fallen was there for another purpose

[thin dirge]

Like, still meant to be a leader, but I dont think in a "King" like way.

[harsh pecan]

If he wasn’t meant to, then who was?

[fickle wing]

maybe???? a handful of things in sky r p wonky when it comes to ancestors n powers n magic n stuff like
it’s there ig

[keen shore]

Yeah adding to my comments above, feeling like you’re dying of various things whenever you fail a trial, even if it’s not real, is pretty good motivation to say “this isn’t worth it”

[thin dirge]

Remember Sky is sort of based off of TLP, and in it talks about how "grownups" tend to forget whats important, etc etc and Prince just criticizes the adults for that. With this, I dont think Prince was meant to become King in Sky, since this seems to be the theme that Sky has

[tulip aspen]

I think it would have to be more so that the dark crystals levitate things for some reason, and the scholars have just trained themselves to be able to manipulate the lamps that hold those crystals via light or whatever

[keen shore]

Maybe they got through through sheer determination and cleverness (like figuring out the patterns in trial of air) instead of having those good traits to begin with

[compact shale]

Electromagnetism can do some weird stuff, maybe the light and darkness in darkstone thing can do some stuff similar to that?

Maybe the ancestors were holding light in their hands while doing levitation and the

Edit: It's cut off because at some point I realized I have no idea what I'm talking about

[keen shore]

What? That’s only in the TLP spin-off season, I think

[tulip aspen]

that sounds too big brain for me lolol, which is why i personally keep my "dark crystals float" and "we see scholars control crystals"

[thin dirge]

Sky is based off of TLP tho... Its the reason why the collab happened in the first place. Jenova said so in "Behind the Making of TLP" series part 1

[tulip aspen]

sure butter, but we shouldn't take that so literally for anything more than interpretation

[keen shore]

I didn’t realize he said that, but honestly it doesn’t help too much because we don’t know how much of the original inspiration persisted, it could have changed drastically from its original ideas

[tulip aspen]

i should definitely note ancestors using it as a theory addendum at the bottom, ty for pointing that out!

[fickle wing]

off topic but these concept vers of prairie forest and isle live rent free in my head I love how you can tell who is who still even if 2/3 of em look p different
like
the key thing w prairie stuck around for a bit n their shape in general
then there’s forest w the umbrella that shows up so much in their concepts
n then isle w the whole bird thing going on

[keen shore]

(3) Bell absolutely killed me when I read it

[gleaming fog]

I actually love how the ancestors look a bit more alien in the concept art, really adds to the mystery

[thin dirge]

This isnt just TLP, but also looking into the concepts of Sky where Prince becomes King in the timeline. Of course this could've changed, but I dont know... A sky kid always seem to meant to stay as a sky kid. Prince becoming King seems to happen after ppl started straying from their original values like the Manta crusher or something like that

[tulip aspen]

wth theyre so creepy i love ot

[gleaming fog]

wait what is a manta crusher?

[thin dirge]

Uhh, the factory in Forest. The Forest Temple.

They uhh, crush mantas into diamonds. Yeah.

Thats why those mantas were caged there, and were released after talking to the Elder

[compact shale]

Yep, definitely inspired from ghibli

[fickle wing]

geezer my beloved

[gleaming fog]

lol wut, there's a thing in the door that literally explains it, they take the butterflies + rocks they mine, and refine that stuff up

(talking about the door leading to the forest final area)

How is that crushing mantas?

[keen shore]

I thought the diamonds were just mined from the ground and then refined

[tulip aspen]

ngl it being way more mentally draining for ancestors than skids would still fit well into my mindspace theory

it just gave them a massive headache every time they failed, until they couldnt take it anymore, while skids would be wholly unaffected (skid/player still gets headache tho lololol)

[thin dirge]

Yeah, but there's more concept art that goes further in detail what those factories are for. The ones on the door is probably how they did it at first, until they needed more resources.

Plus, those mantas were caged for a reason, which were released after Elder cutscene.

[harsh pecan]

[gleaming fog]

What if the mantas are a biproduct of the refining process? Do we know that the mantas were there before the cage opened?

It would also explain why we see trapped mantas, they're made poorly

[thin dirge]

They're called diamond pressers which crushes mantas into small rocks and uhh, combine them with rocks to turn into diamonds

[compact shale]

Yeah, that theory about extracting creatures' light for fueling/refining/making the darkstone

[fickle wing]

forest elders fursona moment

[keen shore]

Can’t believe Forest elder has a cooler fursona than me
I love lynxes and I love the idea of giving them extra fluffy tails :-)

[thin dirge]

I think the art was posted here before, Im gonna have to search high and low for it again tho but uhh, yeah. They crush Mantas into light material. The devs have said the mantas are made from clouds, not from the process of making diamonds

[gleaming fog]

Wait,

In the prarie, we see them create/build butterflies from nothing and store them in boxes. At the start of the forest, we see a dock with said boxes. There's also a mural on the wall saying that the boats would load the boxes of butterflies (not manta).

In the forest we see mines and tree cutting (the trees are petrified and probably artificial since we see that tech in the vault) which gives us the stone. The cinematic of the forest door shows us the butterfly boxes being combined with the rocks that were mined to create the blue crystal.

NGL, not seeing how manta fit in

[tulip aspen]

that just proves to me the clouds are made of light :0

[keen shore]

I had this idea that mantas have a kind of core which is what the ancestors were after and the rest of their body was a really solid looking illusion about the same solidness as cloud vapor. Hence why we can just fly through them, which is probably a game error with clipping models but it’s a neat idea anyways

[frigid tinsel]

imagine crashing into mantas and taking them down with us

[gleaming fog]

What if the mantas fly in to transport the crystal from the forest to the valley?

[fickle wing]

one of my fav part abt the concepts is that it listed prairie n forest as friends since
prairie used to b a whale in the concepts
and there’s the teth(forests concept name) friend bit

at the same time though it is interesting since forest is where all the creature juicing went down
and the prairie pin poem says that their elder protected creatures of light so

[harsh pecan]

That person has a mask similar to Resh’s

[thin dirge]

This

[gleaming fog]

Ty, but doesn't it make sense that they'd be using the butterflies for that?

The butterflies that seem to have dedicated breeding grounds/be engineered to be docile/follow our voice?

[thin dirge]

Also, those were caged. If you look there, those gates were closed. And that area is directly connected to the presser/diamond maker.

[keen shore]

This is making me wonder about the elders’ relationships and how they feel about each other

The butterflies aren’t powerful enough

[thin dirge]

It would, but tbh, butterflies seems to be much weaker than mantas when talking about light concentration.

What they're focusing here is their light energy, since light creatures are made of light. But butterflies seems to be made of only very small amounts, even with a group of them compared to a group of mantas

And also, consider the fact that their kingdom was growing at the time

More ppl=more resources to sustain population

[gleaming fog]

I only kind of agree with you there, the mantas, birds, jellyfish, and most other light things seem to have some light (typically in the glowy golden "eye"), but also be made of wax. while the butterflies seem to be purer light (since they're completely gold), It seems weird to say that (in our world for example) the Chicken can't be a good source of meat because they're very small. Even a small bottle of butterflies contains a whole tonne of butterflies that seem to last virtually forever

Like the chicken, Butterflies can be numerous, and seem easy to produce (the elder does it with one wax)

[frigid tinsel]

just an fyi, "wax" is a community term. it's actually just called "light" in-game.
I only learned of that recently. don't know how widespread that is

[thin dirge]

Yeah, but very small in comparison. At this point, were not talking about chickens, were more like talking about insects compared to chickens.

[keen shore]

Side note has anyone figured out why all the ancestors wear masks? Is it just a cultural thing or is there more lore behind it?

[frigid tinsel]

it may be a cultural thing, we don't know

[gleaming fog]

But we have a tangible way to monitor how much light they output (light being the energy, instead of the white wax that we see in disposable candles/the manta),

If you do the butterfly emote, you'll recharge faster than if you fly on the large manta in the prarie/sanctuary area. I assumed this meant that butterflies were more energy-rich/energy-dense than their manta counterparts

[fickle wing]

might just b a cultural thing i think
but at the same time ash did say animal masks for ancestors had something to do w their role while they were alive 👀 so maybe a mix of cultural and lore

[compact shale]

So butterflies are concentrated flappy things of light energy?

[keen shore]

I think it’s both a cultural thing and meant to signify your job, but I don’t have any ideas on what jobs the spirit masks represent

[frigid tinsel]

okay, but why did almost everyone wear masks?

[thin dirge]

I think the reason why Mantas dont charge as fast because most of their energy is concentrated inside them. They're made of light, it holds the manta together and maybe like us, they can store that energy too. Just because butterflies can just give away energy much easier doesnt mean they have more than mantas, they just give them away much easier because of how small they are.

[compact shale]

Well, a method we've found to work on this lore crumb and turn it into something cool is to figure out which cultures the season is based on, then find out what those animals mean to that culture

[thin dirge]

Well, thats just my interpretation, idk if that made sense

[gleaming fog]

I see what you mean, I personally think that the elders found more use for manta as beasts of burden rather than as sources of energy, especially since the butterflies are made by the elders.

Also in the vault, it looks like they artificially create mantas from wax (the white stuff) and light with varying degrees of success to create the night mantas. I thought they were doing it to get around their lack of freighter boats (which were maybe pulled by Krill or something)

[compact shale]

Doesn't SoF confirm that mantas are also strong enough to pull boats?

[gleaming fog]

SOF?

Also I was referring to the switch trailer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBQRCHusYyU

Though that might not be a manta lol

[compact shale]

Season of Flight

But whatever

Most of us think that creature is what krill used to be

[tulip aspen]

that would make sense

butterflies are jolts of energy, little wisps of flame

mantas have bodies, their light is solid and sealed and shaped

[tulip aspen]

yeah idk why it's often called a manta lol

[thin dirge]

I think they later got replaced by flying boats with diamonds powering them instead of mantas

[pastel brook]

Ktjn clone reporting for duty!

[tulip aspen]

disgusting

[gleaming fog]

omg you just blew my mind,

I always thought that Krill were the many legged manta from the vault + the blue crystal sapping their energy/embedded into their head, causing them to shrivel up/be covered in darkness. (since both crystals shine a circle of light that saps light energy to prime and "activates" once a player is underneath, and the krill move in predictable patterns like the many legged manta)

It makes sense that that creature would be it since it's not made of light/has a mouth and maybe needs to eat real food (instead of just subsisting on light)

[keen shore]

I wonder if the creatures in vault of knowledge are spirit versions of other light creatures because of how different they look and the fact they’re called “memories”

[gleaming fog]

Is it possible that both are true? Maybe the manta power the crystals? (for extra heavy loads)

[keen shore]

The crystals seem to need light to work since we have to give them light via our candle, so maybe the mantas light was one way of continuously powering them as spirits didnt have candles like we do

[tulip aspen]

"krills are confirmed to have originally been light creatures but got corrupted and then physically deteriorated

via an idea I've been calling the "Light Dragon Theory", I strongly believe they are the creature we see in the cinematic trailer for the switch launch, but not everyone believes that, or wants to

because of concept art for the cinematic hd trailer, there is substantial (but not full of course) visual reasoning to believe the creature we see in that video is the Light Dragon; before it became the Dark Dragon (krill)

this is because originally the creature was to have horns shaped just like a krill's, as well as the obvious bait-like evidence that it has a beam of light emanating from it's eye akin to a krill

the theory gets corny with the horn evidence because it implies... what, the one used as a wagon in the video had it's horns clipped?

there's a bit to unravel here, but the fact that they originally intended it to look a lot more like some mammalian krill, means they're going for the point of expressing that that's what krills looked like before, no matter what it ends up being in the finished product, which was mostly heavily changed from the storyboard due to the fact they needed to keep the theme of light creatures looking similar

in fact, the finished product looks even more like a krill in some ways, as the being in the trailer only had one eye, so they likely realized the thing they made in that storyboard concept wasn't "krill" or "light creature" enough

((second image fan concept of finished creature from trailer for sake of viewing full body , made by kamilico))"

[compact shale]

If SoF took place later into the timeline, they could be part of the side against the (over)use of darkness and creature blending

Remember Flight Guide was Prairie's apprentice, so I guess they were on Prairie's side

[rigid mural]

WHEEZES

[keen shore]

I thought krill were mechs for the longest time due to their predictable movements, the fact that their light just looks like a flashlight rather than bioluminescence, and the fact that they just looked like machines. I had this headcanon about pilots’ spirits being trapped in them forever due to corruption and that’s why they were still functional… I’m really glad it isn’t true, that idea made me really sad

[gleaming fog]

Oh wow, seeing a lot of new details,

The one eye/beam of light makes a lot of sense, the Horn thing makes sense too since it could be a smaller/juvenile version of the much larger dragon since the one in the trailer looked a bit smaller than a Krill.

The only weird part could be the armor, but...That's probably just what it is. Literal armor placed by the elders. Krill might not have even changed/mutated at all since "armor" in this world would be something that both protects yourself AND prevents other people from healing from the beast's light energy, so it would have to look dark.

I still think the Crystal is embedded in the eye though. The way Krill behavior/their spotlight color is similar to that of the vault crystal makes me think they're being controlled by it somehow

[thin dirge]

SoF to me seems to take place before the diamond stuff happened. Remember in the concept timeline, there was actually an era where ancestors and creatures were in harmony with each other, which was before they discovered Hidden Forest. I think Season of Flight takes this concept, and happened before diamonds took center stage

[ember elbow]

i hate to be the stick in the mud-- but didnt a dev say the switch creature doesnt have an in game form yet? wouldnt that apply to it not being the non corrupted krill?

[tulip aspen]

I don't think it's literal armor, as the whale and King tuna also have similar rocky structures on their front face

[tulip aspen]

is that a direct quote?
perhaps it means it's not the whale; that it's not something we've already seen in game as it looks in the trailer

[ember elbow]

directly mentions the switch creature not being featured in game yet

as much as i want it to be the krill, who knows really

[tulip aspen]

yeah, I think it might just mean that form but obviously I do have a bias as any other meaning might crush the light dragon theory

(maybe it's talking about the spidercrabs...... )

[ember elbow]

i do still think theres light dragons. but maybe it doesnt resemble the switch creature at all. which honestly as much fun as hunting canon or lore bits down is, i do like the idea that if/when we see real light dragons theyre gonna blow our minds

[tulip aspen]

ngl i don't see anything else they could confuse concoct ever looking as close as that did to the krill

they put that beam of light on it's eye to make it obvious, and the fact that it's now a controversy lore wise is prolly hilarious to them smh, but ah well

[ember elbow]

and the concept art as well

[tulip aspen]

seriously, especially with the direction they went coming from the concept art towards the final product, it literally looks like they went
"hmm, it's not krill nor light creature enough"
so then they made it a literal giant shrimp with one eye and then thought that still wasn't obvious enough so they put a giant Spotlight on its eye just to make sure we got the message

and yet of course we have to deal with the fact that to a majority of people it's still not going to be enough

I'm assuming that's because, if I'm right, a lot of people's theories would be shattered by that being the light dragon

we understandably have to keep it up to interpretation after all

[ember elbow]

if it is a light dragon, it is baby

like as in literally probably a very young dragon. just judging by how massive krill are.

i cant imagine the kid on top of it would be much bigger than a sky kid

[tulip aspen]

imagine bigger versions of the (possible) light dragon being able to hold entire towns of people

[tulip aspen]

the kid and the ancestor were pretty miniscule tho, i thought

it was basically carrying an entire 3 floor compound on it's back, complete with a front patio they sat in

[tulip aspen]

[compact shale]

What the g-

[thin dirge]

[tulip aspen]

that's what I'm saying!!

hello reshfolk
i will proceed not to give my rancid opinion

[slate saffron]

HEY UH QUICK QUESTION ||do yall think that sky kids have bloodor any internal organs for that matter? If they did what color would it even be? would it be something similar to what we have or totally different?||

{mentions blood}

[slate saffron]

Hello friendshaped person

[frigid tinsel]

Short answer: no, they’re prob hollow little people full of light.

Long answer: here’s my working theory on the composition of a skykid:
—clothing, hair, masks & other cosmetics made of light.
—a humanoid physical shell made of some magic-induced earthen material (i.e. clay, ash, or charcoal) that has a hole in the chest.
—this hollow shell is full of light, such as winged light.
—their flame, manifesting as their red candle and the light in the hole in their chest.
—their soul.

[compact shale]

Hmmm let us sacrifice a poor soul to the operating table /no

[hushed steeple]

The flame could be the skykid's soul

[harsh pecan]

Nope

[true grove]

@coral spindle

From what i can think only forest tree houses are made of wood

[coral spindle]

thats rly odd 🤔 youd think theyd use wood more

[true grove]

True, especially in forest but wood decays fast to its possible that wood structures decayed overtime

[coral spindle]

im designing a season as a concept exercise and its gonna be a farm but i realised i rarely see wood used in the buildings of sky. maybe they have more access to stone? or its easier to harvest?

[true grove]

I think they mostly used stone as it was easily available and as the civilization progressed dark stone was found so that could've also pushed back the wood structures

[coral spindle]

so itd be more likely for the houses to be made of stone 🤔

[true grove]

Maybe devs simply haven't thought about it, i think it'll be cool seeing wood houses
Maybe in a area with a swamp where houses are built on pillars, it would neatly fit forest theme

[coral spindle]

im thinking more mountains! itll be a farm in the mountains, and with the introduction of stone im thinking of leaning towards more nordic houses

[true grove]

In concepts as we move towards forest the darkstone was found so maybe that's why forest doesn't have many wood structures. Each realm represents different stages of the technology and civilization that's why isle and prairie has more irregular stone structures.

[true grove]

Ooo that'll be cool

[tulip aspen]

its very odd
we see them harvesting wood, but no, ancestors have never been seen by us skykids to have used wood in any of their architecture except for the scouts in forest and maaaybe as support beams in docks and bird's nests at prairie
the possibilities for the reasons why are certainly so mundane

1. it's just not the ancestor style of architecture to use wood for full structures
2. (realism) wood is temporary and they wanted to build the kingdom to last; while using wood for temporary set ups like we see in the marketplace at Isle before the Fall
3. we do see wood used early on i believe, in the little docks that hang off the islands in prairie village, and maybe as little supports in bird's nest, so yash may be right and areas more affected by the darkstone industrialization preferred using rock left over from mining as material, to save time and labor
4. perhaps wood is actually quite hard for them to build bigger structures with for some reason, or hard for them to work with in general? that would require some odd excuse from their anatomy, an anatomy we dont know many solid facts about
   [totally my new headcanon: ancestors would spontaneously combust from a single splinter]

[delicate osprey]

I have a theory about something absolutely random!! or a headcanon! see it as whatever you want

[delicate osprey]

If I remember somewhat well, you're told to save the stars at the start of the game, right? But, later on, you realize you're a star yourself, so I just felt like you were lied to to start a journey to The Light, you were lied to, to give you a chance to go back home, your true home, in the sky. But you're given a choice too, stay in the sky, or reborn once more.

[delicate osprey]

.... wait I sound stupid, don't I?

[icy spruce]

Cool, imagine the angst

[delicate osprey]

NO I MEANT A WHITE LIE, LIKE A LIE BUT IN A NICE WAY

[icy spruce]

Oh wait, I thought sky as in orbit

noooo the angst :(

[delicate osprey]

no it IS orbit
obviously

[icy spruce]

Oh

[delicate osprey]

BUT NO ANGST

[icy spruce]

Well there’s still angst because you went all that hard work when you could’ve stayed or smthn

Since skids assumably fell from orbit cause sky

[delicate osprey]

no you're given a choice to stay or leave as I said

most people leave

[icy spruce]

oh okay

Now I’ll make it angsty

What if there’s 2 best friends and one of them wanted to stat while the other wants to leave evil laughter

Well, they can still see them after watching their friend suffer in eden evil laughter

/j

[delicate osprey]

but how's that theory? much shorter than everyone else and stupid, not much evidence, but it just came to me right now

[icy spruce]

Well, it’s a headcanon

And like, everyone has a lot of headcanons that doesn’t have evidence. Also, just because it’s not a 10k testwall doesn’t mean it isn’t good

There’s a lot of good theories that only have 1-2 sentences

[delicate osprey]

one friend watches from the heavens while the other just know their friend's still there, everytime they look at the sky

here, as a star

[icy spruce]

Wait what, why is /positive (the short term) censored

Oh well

[delicate osprey]

anyways yes I'm good at making fluff

[restive shore]

If you mind that I make an addition to this

I feel like they would lie for a reason, like, it's not like they would lie to the sky kids just for them to meet their doom at Eden, but instead to go to Eden to save the statues and start the "cycle" (if I can call it that) again, ending up in a constant loop of this

[delicate osprey]

I'm good at making fluff cuz im a roleplayer

[icy spruce]

Thank you

[delicate osprey]

wait what
why would there be a cycle

[restive shore]

Like, if there wasn't a cycle there would be a point where there's no more sky kids to go around, go to Eden, save the statues and then start again

Or I could always be mistaken about what I'm saying, it's always an option

[delicate osprey]

Wait, to me,

Our goal is to save the stars, not only the statues but also all the spirits and light creatures we meet in our journey, there isn't just eden, but everything else, and I (sorry if I'm mean) don't see the cycle idea in this once you acknowledge that there's more than just eden when saving the stars.

[restive shore]

Yeah, I guess you're right, my head was just thinking that Eden was the end of it all and that was it but that's pretty much not true
(Also you're not mean, dw)

[delicate osprey]

isn't it mean to DENY completely a theory without even thinking about it a little

[restive shore]

Not if it's wrong in multiple ways
To me at least

[delicate osprey]

It's wrong in multiple ways?

[restive shore]

Like, the supposed theory I had, that is off the charts since of what you said after I said all of that

[delicate osprey]

Well it is true that while ascending, you see the spirits and light creatures, and not just the sky kids in the statues, when you think about it..

[icy spruce]

Well I mean, the skids when u’re going to the light

[tulip aspen]

for your own personal reasons no, as long as you kindly admit your differences; there's nothing wrong with having that differing opinion

the only time there's ever problems is when you go out of your way to tell someone they cant be allowed to have their own theory or headcanon on something, and that happens very rarely

[delicate osprey]

oh ok

[tulip aspen]

going to the light [mode]

[rough spoke]

was the golden wasteland the kingdom? bcus ive read theories about the lore and it said that darkness corrupted the king. by the looks of it the only place thats reaallly corrupted is the golden wasteland and theres a golden wasteland area too that looks like a fallen(broken) kingdom

[delicate osprey]

I have a theory about the fact that Golden wasteland might've been a part of Valley but a war broke out in the area but I can't elaborate further cuz I have no idea what happened

[hushed steeple]

Hi lorechat. I was wondering why yall where not talking about the giant megabird tablet placed jn the new home on the ladder. How mega kinda looks like a big fish. How it has faces of characters we never seen before, and text that can be decoded, and I accidentally knocked the ladder over.....

Till I remembered that was a a dream.

[keen shore]

Don’t we all…

I hope someday we get a map or jsut art of what the kingdom looked like pre-disaster.

Also I just realized this but interesting to talk about, lots of the realms are basically surrounded in clouds, esp. daylight prairie and hidden Forest… I wonder how they dealt with storms. That might be why they used stones just so if lightning started a fire their house wouldn’t burn down, who knows

[keen shore]

Along with any of the reasons listed here obviously, all of which seem reasonable. One thing to add though I think the docks are made of stone though I could be wrong.

Maybe because clouds passed through all the time, and wood rots with excess moisture, it was just smarter in general to use stone instead

[sharp lichen]

Now that I think of it, despite having an entire forest to themselves, there are very few buildings in Sky that seem to use wood

[keen shore]

Yeah it wasn’t exactly hard to get… although as jam mentioned earlier wood seems to be reserved for temporary structures that aren’t part of the main living space. Probably the moisture reason and the fact that they already mined a ton of stone so might as well use that instead.

Also keep in mind that we see dark stone located inside stone several times, usually in boats. Maybe wood didnt.. “conduct” that energy as well??

[tulip aspen]

wait what

[tulip aspen]

yeah i think they might be too i just added that in case they were indeed wood as i couldnt remember

[tulip aspen]

I SEE NO LADDER AT HOME
CONFUSION
AND THE MOMENT I LOG LIKE 5 PROPLE WARP TO ME
LET THE DEAD VET SLEEP

[keen shore]

They said it was a dream so that’s probably why, I was confused at first because of the phrasing

[tulip aspen]

oh lol okay

[sharp lichen]

Here’s my foolproof conclusion: The Meditating Monastic stole all the wood in the land to make her new line of tables that she could sell to Skykids.

[keen shore]

They’re the real villain in this story, not the king/prince… they may hide their true nature but WE KNOW THE TRUTH

[keen shore]

Question: does everyone think the pots in daylight prairie (and other realms too, just most obviously there) are made out of stone or clay?

I was thinking about my “stone conducts dark stone” theory earlier and I think it’s the opposite, it doesn’t conduct it at all and instead focuses the energy, while other materials make the energy just dissipate. It would make sense to store dark stone relatedthings in stone to keep them from losing their power

[rigid mural]

So I took the opportunity of my winged light run to investigate the Golden Wastelands following one of Ash's old theories that the waters receded over time and at least the shipwreck area had a higher level.

First off, I would like to point out numerous areas are sunken in the sand, meaning we can't know for sure how high they were above the sea water level unless there's somehow a digging mechanic implemented.

In real life, sunken cities happen when they are built on unstable grounds such as marshlands; this is the case of Mexico, Amsterdam and many others who would be quickly reclaimed by the land without us.

Last picture makes me think of the bridges in the forest boneyard, so maybe the wastelands indeed were a pretty humid area in the past.

(I have more screenshots coming...)

The graveyard is interesting; if it were filled with a bit of water, there's a way both exits with stairs (=they were areas ancestors could have passed by) would still be above water. It could explain the presence of crabs, but the area is too small for creatures as huge as the squeletons imply to even comfortably move. (tw animal abuse mention) ||Perhaps it was an industrial farm of some sort, where light creatures were raised like we raise cattle and poultry for meat ? Though I doubt the product here would be meat,|| given the similarity of the previous building with forest's refinery.

[tulip aspen]

ahh very true, like rubber!!

[rigid mural]

Finally, the shipwreck. Not much can be found that hints of buildings or stuff to disprove this area being like a port or dock, that first pic looks like an Harbour boundary to me even (to stop boats from entering from anywhere but a designated gate). From farther away beyond the wind walls, you can see some islands that could have been used to build lighthouses and sentry points too...

[tulip aspen]

DOES ANYONE HAVE THAT FAN CONCEPT OF THE WHALE MELTING INTO A KRILL

[rigid mural]

TL;DR: Inspired by a theory of Ash, I concede the Golden Wastelands were likely not a desert from the start. After investigating, I think they were built on a marsh near the seaside.

I would like to point out some ruins are used as is by spirits; Sneaky Survivor doesn't look like they are walking underwater, Scared Refugee seeks shelter in a building that's already crumbling during their lifetime and Lookout Scout climbs up ruins to reach their vantage point.

Interestingly, the Elder's statue is also the only one broken among its peers.

I think the Golden Wastelands suffered two disasters; a first one that could have been a natural disaster, such as a tsunami or earthquake, that may have destroyed walls, left the fortress in ruins and could have beached a few large aquatic creatures if they weren't originally here.
Following that, the spirits could have fought for ressources, hence the traces of battles and life among the rubble, but maybe the second disaster was just straight up whatever happened in Eden.

[frozen pivot]

thats interesting, that receded water theory for gw does seem plausible, especially now that i looked into how shipwreck actually looks like some sort of bay port or smth because of the high walls surrounding it

the tunnel that connects graveyard and shipwreck functioning as a water way, i find it fitting now how were seemingly thrown out the tunnel as if carried by a current when going through it

i think it somehow explains how the whurtle bones got in there too despite being a closed area, or perhaps graveyard was constructed with those bones already existing there which is very possible aswell

basically a mini dam of sorts, controlled flooding type of thing

[keen shore]

I feel like the water evaporating and the wasteland having the power of fire might be connected somehow.

My theory is that the wasteland was an estuary/coastal region because the sea is really close by (seen when we travel to forgotten ark) and there seems to be too much sand for a regular marsh. It also means golden wasteland was once a sunny, beachy area which is really interesting to think about

There’s like a specific name for the coast near the ocean when it starts to get marshy, but I can’t remember it

[frozen pivot]

wat purpose or why, maybe aesthetic purposes, there are traces of brick paths running towards battlefield's stairs after all

[rigid mural]

These bad boys perhaps ?

[frozen pivot]

yes, but the tunnel

[rigid mural]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salt_marsh

Salt marshes have historically been endangered by poorly implemented coastal management practices, with land reclaimed for human uses or polluted by upstream agriculture or other industrial coastal uses. Additionally, sea level rise caused by climate change is endangering other marshes, through erosion and submersion of otherwise tidal marshes.

[frozen pivot]

shipwreck does not resemble a traditional beach at all, atleast as far as i know, beaches are commonly sloped, a sign of continuous receding water, thus how i got the idea of it being a bay to support ash's theory

[keen shore]

I FOUND OUT THEIR NAME THE EXACT MOMENT YOU POSTED IT HERE LOL

I really like the idea of ancient golden wasteland being a series of small marshy islands barely above the waters surface, with travel being mostly in boats like in valley of triumph or how some cities use them to travel in canals. And the graveyard would be a drained out area that was once an artificially closed off lagoon

I have tons of art commissions at the moment but I totally want to draw this in the future

[frozen pivot]

and industrial pipes are more commonly placed on open waters for easy waste disposal

hence the big pipes that ends outside shipwreck's walls

[keen shore]

Maybe since it was so near the sea, the ancestors figured there was no risk of pollution running downstream to any cities where they lived, so it became the perfect waste disposal spot. Also because very few people lived there compared to other regions due to the fact most of it was underwater

I assumed GW used to be a forest due to forgotten ark murals but I like this idea much better and it’s really fun to imagine

[frozen pivot]

gw and isle are 2 known realms to be at ground level, point is gw is smacked dab perfectly to be an industrial city

[frozen pivot]

you never know, i mean these people can make floating airships, how is floating structures any different

[keen shore]

True but it might require more energy to hold up

[frozen pivot]

it isnt called 'golden' wasteland for no reason, similar to golden valley

[frozen pivot]

they have it all, folks literally died from an overloaded powercell, or atleast thats the common theory

they are the last chain where powercells/diamonds are produced and made. i assume itll take a serious problem for them to have an outage

first area looks like a tidal marsh or/with a canal connecting over to the west. elevated bridge and all, submerged ruins/ structures, maybe due to weak soil. werent constructed as is

[tulip aspen]

^^^^^^PLEASE THANK YOU

[tulip aspen]

this is amazing and ive already theorized about it being a swampland, but there's one big question to answer, then

where did all that sand come from?

[tulip aspen]

i cant find it pls...

[rigid mural]

Maybe was already there, just below the waves. With them receding and the winds picking up, it could have spread it around the realm, even outside of it. I have a headcanon about isle...

[tulip aspen]

pls do share, and yeah i had an answer to my question too, with the storms blowing debris from Eden's mountain down the landside, leaving all that sand

after all, we already know thanks to starlight there's an entire actual desert in between wasteland and eden, that starlight is just a small part of, do i think it could've all came from there, being thrown in a massive explosion of wind down into the gaping ravine where wasteland is

[rigid mural]

Oh it's just that the sand in isle could come from the wastelands

[tulip aspen]

hmm maybe

[dire flint]

Oh yeah just a thought noticing all the spirits and everything and reliving some of their memories I feel like the miner in the Hidden Forest watched his friends die in the mines and then buried their bodies. Then slowly started to suffocate to death himself unable to escape.

[compact shale]

Mmm angstea

[dire flint]

I mean some of the scenes were some of his friends were trapped in rubble then last scene is him over some grave stones

[compact shale]

Yep Tearful's story is really sad

[dire flint]

: |

nvm i guess haha

[frigid tinsel]

Anyways I remember someone asking for these but can’t remember who so here’s the concept boards from the Office. Should note that the small text is illegible

[keen shore]

Forest elder is emo teenager confirmed?

[keen shore]

The tearful light miner story is one of the reasons why I believe we should be able to give ALL spirits, not just seasonal guides, hugs

[compact shale]

Yes yes
TGC should use the full potential of this feature
Give it to regular and seasonal spirits
Give it to TS (for free)

[tulip aspen]

@compact shale do you know who posted that picture of the whale melting into a krill last

i cant find the pic anywhere

[tulip aspen]

well the elders are the role models, so she's basically just the mom who has to deal with the emo teen

[tulip aspen]

yea it sucks
suffocating is new to me tho

for me i took it as trapped in and starved to death

[keen shore]

I feel like if it was suffocation they would have died too, plus there’s a hole in the top that people can’t fit through so that probably let in oxygen. You can see in the spirit memories some of them died because the rocks fell on top of them and after that there was just one left with them :(

[tulip aspen]

i feel like that hole may not have always been there and the cave fell apart due to degradation

[boreal nebula]

I wondered too about astronomy work in sky too one year ago, and my idea was abit conspirary too

It all started because since before Dreams was released they tweaked the lightings in Valley Ice Rink (underwater was made less darker) and I wondered if they were trying to pull something like solstice in Sky 😅

[compact shale]

Starvation/dehydration is also a pretty plausible cause for Tearful's death

[boreal nebula]

Finally!! I knew there were some concept of her Kitsune (japanese 9tailed fox) form somewhere but I onky saw the art resembling the easter egg mask we have in game...

[harsh pecan]

Must’ve been a slow and painful death

[boreal nebula]

@compact shale @tulip aspen despite the common first idea of them all dying there I think only 3 of the 4 miners died

The 3rd probably out of an infection or out of depression which poisoned his heart (the plant looks oddly centered on his chest) but I dont think the Tearful Miner died there.

There are slabs/platforms or well made rock forming a stairs upwards. I dont think just one or two people could make them easily of trapped with the risk of starvation

Plus those slabs are too much clea shaped.. while the 3 stone piles where she cries (since I think their tombs) are very rudimentals!

After all it was deduced alot of times... the memories we see from any spirits isnt per se their last memory for sure (for example in Village there are too many things that couldnt have happened in a short time before a cataclysmatic death of all tehe kingdom

Maybe we can see their meaningful memories, those that had a big impact on their psyche

[compact shale]

That doesn't mean it's NEVER their last memory, it just means it USUALLY isn't their last memory

If this moment was Tearful's most impactful memory their life might've been pretty uneventful/ordinary before then

[boreal nebula]

Btw I asked, but thats exactly the small text captions that I'm curious to read about

[boreal nebula]

Maybe yes, maybe no.. One can have an ordinary good life full of happy meaingful moments... till a traumatic event that put things into another perspective and torn someone apart 😕

[compact shale]

Yeah, that could be the case for them :D

[harsh pecan]

What do you think happened to them after they escaped?

[frigid tinsel]

they prob didn't escape. they died

[boreal nebula]

I dont remember who showed me yesterday the concepts of the Lightseekers looking for souls of the dead around the world... but now I really hope they passed there and helped those lost souls

[compact shale]

Maybe they were trying to help in the ascension process or something

[frigid tinsel]

maybe the memories are a mix of significant to them and the area they died in. would explain the more milquetoast memories some spirits have.

[boreal nebula]

I hope that miner got a life, a family... infact I once thought the Tearful Miner was the wife seen in Slouch Soldier's memories (till I noticed there she has a slightly different long hair, Vault style)

[harsh pecan]

What if they got really traumatised by the event

[boreal nebula]

Plus any spirit we see in TLP Season, even if it really seems the same from another realm, somehow it is not golden if ylu have already Ascended... but they also dont have any of their usual props... so I think that might be just a slightly hint about Starlight Desert not being fully canon. Maybe just a similarity about "worlds collide" type

[compact shale]

If Starlight Desert was an experiment in Vault, the 3 "Real" spirits in Slouch's memory might've been people who might've accidentally walked into the experiment and got recorded

[boreal nebula]

Concepts of the Lightseekers collecting souls of the deads

[compact shale]

The light they collect also appears in places like the coliseum, as seen in the top right pic of the 2nd compilation pic. Maybe they collect the essences of emotion as well.

[boreal nebula]

Idk why but I strangely thought they were releasing those lights in the colliseum, sort of like the Twins push our flame onto the sky

But for what it worth it could also be as you see it

Gotta go, cya Lore

[keen shore]

Shepherding souls so that the twins can use them as tennis balls in the coliseum

[compact shale]

Lightseekers: Ascend in peace, Miner Friend #2. *releases Miner Friend #2's soul
Valley Twins: PLAY BALL! *bonkbonkbonkbonkbonkbonkbonk

[keen shore]

It’s not the soul’s intended use, but the twins just act like cats seeing a laser pointer and go after it anyways

I really hope we get more spirit lore tidbits like in general… they have the potential to make me either really happy or really sad

[compact shale]

PLEASE TGC FIND AN EXCUSE TO GIVE MORE SPIRITS INFOCARDS ANDFNSDFWNR;W

[tulip aspen]

im.... not sure

[icy spruce]

what

[compact shale]

JAM WHY NO

[icy spruce]

wdym u’re not sure

[harsh pecan]

YEA WE NEED MORE OF THOSE

[tulip aspen]

I'm not sure that that's transparently what happened, i meant

[thin dirge]

Ooh, I actually thought this was the case. In fact, kinda implied to be the case in '7 Days Of Sky' when talking about the concepts of the areas. Valley there was called 'Golden Valley' (combination of Golden Wasteland and Valley of Triumph) and I think it shown a map of Valley being the upper class while GW was the lower class

[keen shore]

That idea kind of makes sense but we can’t really see any residential buildings in GW so hard to confirm if a lot of people even live there

[harsh pecan]

Maybe the houses got destroyed

[compact shale]

Well it's a concept so maybe that's not the case anymore

[tulip aspen]

well no, it showed the rich split from the poor but both still lived in the valley ranges, i think you're possibly getting confused with the thing about wasteland once being the industrial center of the massive city that valley and weslen combined were

[thin dirge]

Oh, hmmm... Wait, I think it was split between working class and upper class actually....

Im gonna have to look for that again, but I think it was between working class below and upper class at the top.
I actually had a theory the war was like a Workers' Revolt and stuff

[sharp lichen]

Introducing the Prophet of Fire, the final Season of Prophecy spirit to BEFRIEND:⁣
⁣
🏳️‍🌈 You already know their sexuality
🗿 Constructed statues of his glorious face in the Fire Trial before the Prophet of Water removed it
❤️‍🔥 Will cook a warm meal to lift your spirits when you’re feeling down
🥢Tried to impale Resh with a pair of chopsticks

[thin dirge]

It was still called 'Golden Valley' in '7 Days of Sky', so its easy to assume they were both connected as one whole area, but still working as two seperate realms.

[tulip aspen]

I'll summon chesca

[keen shore]

fire prophet has massive dad energy in general

[hushed steeple]

Heres everything (heavily paraphrased) from the launch livestream:

• creatures born from light
  -children of light/imprints (glowboys) are a character you are connected to.
• spirits where united in the stars, something bad happened, now they are trapped, but returning them does not mean they cannot come back down.
• sky’s ecology is messed up between light and darkness
• spirits are only able to be sent back to the stars in temples (duh)

[compact shale]

Maybe that was what they were before they became a prophet, the big cool dad

[keen shore]

Wait a minute. Is the implication supposed to be that the disaster that trapped the spirits in the world is a completely different one and happened later than the destruction of the kingdom itself?? would explain why they were in the stars in the first place due to it seeming to be the afterlife …

It also could be some sort of aftermath of the first disaster that happened later but hmmm… them being two separate events would explain a few things. I think the reason they’re trapped is because only the elders can send them back and they were somehow asleep? or out of operation before us. This might be obvious though lol

[keen shore]

They totally still are one

[compact shale]

By character but not necessarily by profession I guess

[tulip aspen]

it explicitly says spirits aren't barred from coming back down?

also, what does the ecology note mean, i dont get that one

[keen shore]

Probably that there’s a lot more darkness in the ecosystem than there’s supposed to be, and since the disaster was a mass extinction event, probably that as well

[tulip aspen]

if "spirits were united in the stars, but something bad happened" does that mean my og intro analysis about something knocking them out of the sky might still possibly be valid....?

fruity im so confusd idek anymore

[compact shale]

In-game it seems to be that way but we don't know if that's really them or just their memory/hologram (a hologram of a holographic being? what the m-)

Yes Jam I'm getting confused

ash come back

[tulip aspen]

wha wym a hologram

the og timeline made by my og intro study was

"stars fall from giant sentient mass of light floating in space, land on world turning humanoid and gain shells from ground around them becoming Ancestors, Elders sent by Light to save ancestors, Ancestors refuse help, they build kingdom, wars happen, bad things happen, long time after skykids are sent by Light to save everyone"

it generally got debunked because someone had a massively convincing argument that "stars falling" referred to apocalypse that destroyed kingdom, and not light being knocked from Sky that eventually forms ancestors

but this launch stream thing is explicitly saying exactly what my original assumption said

what do i do anymore

.
iirc ash telling me intro is perfect english and a straight message to those who have read the lore bible

guys, we take for granted so damn much just how important that quote from them was

if it should be able to piece together the main secret via reading the intro, then through enough logic and common sense, we don't have to WAFO for anything, we just have to actually put our heads together for once la sigh

[compact shale]

What launch stream?

[tulip aspen]

this

[compact shale]

Yubi yubi confusion... sorry Jam

[tulip aspen]

kami is paraphrasing direct quotes from devs from a stream directly after the og launch of the base game

[hushed steeple]

I guess I could find the exact time stamp. Uhhhh for spirits coming back yeah uhhh holdon...

[tulip aspen]

please ty ur amazing

idk how yall browse these vids like that i already have enough trouble trying to find where my professor said something important in a lecture video smhh

[hushed steeple]

https://youtu.be/wZ0qBJQ0auw

22:17

[tulip aspen]

why does the lighting and graphics in that video look better than it does on my switch at 60 fps

excusè moi?

[hushed steeple]

Another topic about it starts at 24:12

[keen shore]

Hey which intro does she mean? The old or updated one?

Trying to piece lore together for this game either makes me very excited or makes me feel very stupid lol

[thin dirge]

The lore hasnt changed at all since Launch... Hmm...

And also, I always saw the stars falling being a seperate event from the Kingdom's fall, seemingly happening afterwards

[compact shale]

But here's a question

Did the ancestors have the first descent voluntarily/deliberately/intentionally or not?

[thin dirge]

I guess its like spirits of the ancestors coming down to visit, but when they're alive, no?

[hushed steeple]

Yeah. I am starting to think the stars and the people on the ground where there at the same time (as a cycle of life and rebirth) and when the rebirthing ansestors fell, it was as stars, but living people needed stars to live too? Or somethn?

[tulip aspen]

fruity, can we add that to the qna list?

"is what a dev in the livestream for Sky's launch said about spirits being able to be freely called back down from the Sky to be with us, still true?" (can someone word this better im having a migraine)

ash told me to my face (not literally) that despite the wording changing, the meaning of the intro hasn't changed from the first to the updated version @keen shore

[hushed steeple]

I mean you still see it in the game every day :/

[thin dirge]

It seems they were always able to come, if you summon them by their graves/constellations.

Stars seems to be the same as spirits. Wheb they're alive... I actually imagined it to be just like our Sky kid...

[tulip aspen]

canonically, i mean

[hushed steeple]

Im not sure why story wise it would change without also changing in the game. But cool.

[compact shale]

Is it them in person though, or just a hologram of their appearance to us while their consciousness stays in the sky?

[tulip aspen]

there was like an entire month where i refused to believe it and was adamant ash had lied to me xD @keen shore

[tulip aspen]

wym hologram?
as in, astral projection?

technically, grammatically, spirits already are... projections? in general?

[keen shore]

Yeah stars = spirits but we seem to be stars as well?? Maybe stars are just meant to represent souls in general

And yeah the bit about the meaning of the intro not changing does make sense. If I get a chance I’ll transcribe the two intros into a Google doc we can over analyze at will, it would be more convenient than watching a 14 min long video every time we wanted to remember

If you guys have Google docs I can also set it so you can comment and not edit it, and you can put different interpretations in the comments of it

[hushed steeple]

Another thing I didn’t think worth mentioning, since its pretty known, that the spirits trees rep the level of relationship you have built with them.

[compact shale]

Pal I think that's called a crisis

Wait can you astrally project if you're already dead?

[thin dirge]

Looks like the actual spirit tho. Look when you summon, their light/soul is seen coming down from above. When you look at it in one way, all the appearances of the spirits are actually holograms of how they appeared to when they were alive. The actual spirit is the light in them in the middle.

[hushed steeple]

Either way they are kinda there

[tulip aspen]

remember, we dont do anything without the will of the Sky (yes i am absolutely religious about this)

[thin dirge]

To me, them coming down seems canon, but idk... I think thats another part of Sky's lore that's left for interpretation

[compact shale]

Is it true that Devs deliberately don't have answers for some things?

Edit: Even internally? Like, the Devs decided not to establish an internal reason for something on purpose?

[keen shore]

I wonder if the whole thing about giving spirits candles and hearts to exchange is canon, or if in canon they give them to us as free gifts of gratitude and the currency collection function is just gameplay stuff to keep you playing.

I also think it’s important how the spirits look like galaxies if that makes sense - like the starry patterns on their bodies

[tulip aspen]

and that latter thing is prolly exactly what ash will say if we try to ask la sigh, p a i n

[hushed steeple]

I don’t understand thinking spirits cannot return after ascending. I think they said something like, still wanting to include the spirits in the world after you free them. But even then its always been a part of the game and world.

[tulip aspen]

ndas be like that fam, and they seem to have a special rulebook when it comes to public lore bible disclosure

[keen shore]

It’s strange because we know there’s probably a canon answer that’s obscured for freedom of interpretation
as in the devs have a specific explanation for what happens but it isn’t too important to lore so it’s left hidden

[hushed steeple]

You will get another king is gran gran >:]

[compact shale]

I guess because it breaks the idea of what the cycle of life is? The trope of reincarnation is that you become something else, while in Sky you stay yourself AND dead

[hushed steeple]

Yeah. It does pretty much break logic. I guess they just mill about to keep over the new gen.

[keen shore]

I think the fact that they stay in that shape if that makes sense? is meant to just drive in how it wasn’t supposed to happen since normally they would reincarnate, but now they’re stuck in that form, and the light used to create them can no longer be recycled

[thin dirge]

Well, this seems like something they do. It was something I noticed when I looked into Valley's concept art. In the concept, they were gonna imply there were more Elders, but there's no further backstory behind it. Only for players to theorize for themselves.

With that idea being there, its not farfetched to think they also have done that a few times in Sky.

[compact shale]

Maybe preserving their current personality and state (being dead) is the Sky's punishment/reward for them.

[tulip aspen]

all of this is a tangent from the big problem la sigh

ash says the intro is perfectly readable and should explain the whole story

idk why that doesn't affect anyone else as dramatically as it does me, but ah well

ima go get some pieology, have fun yall

[hushed steeple]

WHY the darkness came is still question #1

[keen shore]

It is affecting me I just got distracted lol sorry
It explaining the whole story is.., I don’t know? hard to believe because it’s super vague about what some things are and I want more detail

[tulip aspen]

i mean, spending time in the world was meaningful, whether im right about them being not-supposed-to-be-there or not
it has given them wisdom beyond anything they could have ever achieved just being a being of Light swimming in Orbit

[keen shore]

Like I want to know the reason the stars fell, not just be told they did, I want to know who’s talking, etc. But then again I am very nosy about lore stuff so it might just be me

[tulip aspen]

my og intro analysis was controversial because i thought it was obvious it stated things clearly and everyone else just supposedly didnt pay as much attention

and then from there i made my assumptions and then put evidence on it, and that was how my research started as a platform

[compact shale]

I mean, if the cycle's true next stage is to be reborn in a new body and new self, depriving ancestors of that fate could be seen as a punishment from their point of view, but all-okay to us

The ancestors may be able to come back but they can't be reborn

[keen shore]

It does mean they have to deal with their trauma and guilt for all eternity though, especially evident in memories like the light miner’s and likely the most applicable to spirits who had a direct hand somehow in causing the kingdoms downfall

[thin dirge]

Hmm, I actually have a theory that actually now goes in sync with the old intro.

The reason why spirits fell in the first place to be born and live their lives was because of darkness. But it wasnt in a harmful way. The cycle was broken because more light=more darkness, which is how the Sky Kingdom fell.

And this itself led to the fall of all the stars. If darkness is what allows stars to fall and live in the material world, what do you think an over-abundance of it would do?

[hushed steeple]

But they so nice

[tulip aspen]

yes, and that's meaningful
that's life

this is why i believe in the enlightenment theory, they have to have learned something, to have gained something powerful

[hushed steeple]

It mentioned light was the “good loving warmth” and dark is the.....well it just takes away light

[thin dirge]

But with there being too much darkness, also can invite light to come in to counteract. Suddenly, there's thousands of Sky kids around

[tulip aspen]

why would they be reborn? they belong to the Sky

thats a very trippy theory butter ur blowing my mind

[hushed steeple]

There was people on the ground when they fell though.

[rigid mural]

Do you think spirits had a kind of link with stars before the civilization fell ? Maybe them joining constellations is them becoming stars like the ones they used to look up to when they were alive

[compact shale]

Maybe so, maybe giving them the ability to come back is them being kind

[keen shore]

Yeah I’m not saying it’s necessarily a bad thing, I might be wrong? but it just shows there’s good and bad sides to it; they have gained something meaningful by being a person and existing and all but their trauma is probably more immediately important to them if that makes sense. It’s hard to be happy that you’ve been allowed to remain a conscious being with your own thoughts and emotions when all you can think and feel is sadness over your actions and fate

[tulip aspen]

... we have no evidence of that ohgodingoingintocanonchasingmodeimsorryBYEEE

[compact shale]

ITSFINEITSFINEITSFINEITSFINEAARGEREN

[hushed steeple]

Well the new opening mural is like “and with them our light also faded” and shows people on the ground...sooo

[thin dirge]

I think ancestors' souls are pretty much stars. Their physical bodies are sort of darkness that ground them I guess

[rigid mural]

Dead or praying tho

[keen shore]

They’re similar? to stars in some way, it’s really hard figuring out whether it’s just a symbol, whether they’re actually stars, or something in between the two

[hushed steeple]

I don’t canon chase. I canon BIG OL RAM.

[rigid mural]

They do take on the shape of a star when going to their temple when you free them...

[compact shale]

Hey Vela where's that theory you made where dark represents things being preserved and light represents things being swept away/changed and that's why there needs to be a balance?

[tulip aspen]

time changes, it heals, it teaches

pain doesnt teach us fam, meditating on that pain does

im a young man, and you're prolly young too, we havent experienced time, and it's so easy to be scared of what happens

for me personally, i know i havent experienced time, but im confident i will eventually, and with that time, i will use it to shape myself to be better, for me and those around me who i love

[rigid mural]

I like to think ancestors losing the stars is like losing sight of their hopes and dreams, and being lost

[thin dirge]

There's also this belief about how stars are people who have passed on. I always believed Sky takes this principle into its worldbuilding

[compact shale]

So the world of Sky is accidental purgatory or something?

[keen shore]

Yeah I was thinking about that! I swear it has a name but I can’t remember it

[hushed steeple]

OH GEEZ OH MAN ITS RAINING DEAD PEOPLE

[thin dirge]

Ikr, it must be horrifying tho. Its the equivalent of getting knocked out of heaven after you died.

[tulip aspen]

that was likely mid kingdom tho-

[hushed steeple]

Like looking at it, fulfilling lost souls, flying sea animals, being a hopeful child...its all.......

REALLY COMMON TROUPES

OBJECTION. NOTHING SHOWS THAT THE MURAL ISNT MID TO LATE KINGDOM.

[tulip aspen]

more like you were an angel in heaven then suddenly forced to live as a human (in my views and research tho which is not canon so it's fine yesindubatblyverysgood)

[keen shore]

OH NO THE RETURN OF SPIRIT COURT

[hushed steeple]

Fallen angels you say?

[tulip aspen]

well yes, cos the beings of light in the Sky and-

[thin dirge]

I always saw the timeline based off of the realms, what is in it and the chronological order of them

[keen shore]

Implying that the spirits were never “human” but just created as extradimensional servants of Megabird

[hushed steeple]

I think the spirits are dead ancestors that where in the process of rebirth when they got tossed

[thin dirge]

Fall of kingdom - GW
Fall of the stars - Eden

Thats my view of that

[tulip aspen]

guys make the mods ban me or I'll never stop please ban me help

yes Salem it's in my analysis of the sky
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1QeIMzNaPz-TzC8ZHrdUYTOZ99zObm1PYx65sejTyIfc/edit?usp=drivesdk

[compact shale]

WHY

[hushed steeple]

I am starting to question if elders ever fell. It was the japenese livestream we got that from.

[tulip aspen]

I already have strong arguments that the elders never fell yeah they were sent by the sky

[hushed steeple]

Its starting to looking like getting tossed into orbit was just kinda part of (the end of) ancestors life.

[keen shore]

Maybe darkness is comparable to death in that it’s something people often hate and see as evil, but isn’t necessarily bad and is needed for the lives of others to continue

[thin dirge]

Tbh, I was always uncertain about the Elders falling as well. Because as far as I can see, they seem to be higher beings than the rest. Probs only second to the Sky child in my view. So them falling never made sense to me somehow...

[hushed steeple]

Balenece of light anf darkness is also A COMMON DROMMON

[thin dirge]

I guess thats why I kinda tried debunking the idea that the Elders fell cause they bad and stuff. It just didn't make any sense to me

[tulip aspen]

I need to make a lot of addendums and additions to my darkness document but basically I don't believe darkness is some kind of force of evil like the original concepts had I think it's just there as some kind of force of nature that just imbalances the level of light in the universe
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lhsvq0fS9-i2do0pXwoZCmci_42yeVtQOry8jNTpFdM/edit?usp=drivesdk

[keen shore]

I see them as spirits who became elders due to some sort of process later, it just makes more sense to me. We have next to no info on them though so there’s no evidence I can back this up with besides old concepts, which are unreliable

[hushed steeple]

I see darkness as representing instinct. Instinct does not feel, it lacks emotions.

[thin dirge]

Oh, thats the case in the Concepts, actually. But now in Sky, they seem to just be that way naturally. But you could see it that way tho....

[rigid mural]

Aw man, at 5am ? Ok 😂

Light, through megabird, is associated with the cycle of journey, death and rebirth. Think of the ancestors who could have been nomadic, as seen on the switch trailer where the tents in isle aren't set to last. Light creatures are also notably migrating to Eden for most. Light shows you the way to the end.
Light is not "good", it's just a natural force like time or the cycle of water.

Darkness is mostly seen with stuff that refuse change. Could be associated with ancestor sedentarisation, making them build sturdier buildings that withstood the passage of time with some erosion. Darkstone enabled ancestors to leave their mark on the world, for the better or the worse. Crabs and Krills don't migrate, they patrol a territory and even attack Light creatures and sky kids, harbingers of change.
Dark is not "bad", it's just an opposition to the current of time like ink on paper recording stuff so it may not be forgotten. Something that can be both beneficial and destructive depending on context and quantity.

Too much change, and you lose your integrity to be one with the mass.
Too much stubbornness against change, and you cause destruction when not simply swept away by the current.

[hushed steeple]

Darkness is evil eat it punks >:] jk

[tulip aspen]

actually I'm afraid the only concept where they are shown to be ancestors was very late in the games development and then that was scrapped too

in many of the old concepts they are expressly described as deities or some kind of ancient mysterious gods, even when they were originally supposed to be animals!
(but some of the animal concepts had them be more physical, but still godly powerful) ((elders were legendary pokemon???)))

[hushed steeple]

But instinct really does fit all behavior norms of darkness

And like it, instinct is not evil, unless you have a choice to be sentient

[tulip aspen]

....im going to Privately archive this for myself yoink (ill ask you if i put quotes from it anywhere)

[thin dirge]

Hmm, I also thought darkness may have been bad, but with the accidental theory I made with how there may have been a previous cycle between light and dark that was just thrown out of balance, its not really that bad. Its just the opposite to the Light.

Plus, it goes with one of that statement that light and darkness has always existed with each other. This statement would mean that darkness was never that harmful in the first place and only did because of what the Kingdom did.

[keen shore]

Yeah it’s a weird discussion because the entirety of our game experience revolves around fighting darkness in some point or another so it seems obvious we’re supposed to hate it, but we don’t know what the true nature of it is

To above comment, I did not know that, it was on the timeline shown earlier however, I do have to question why gods other than megabird would be created in the first place. there’s not really a need for them and it seems weird to do I guess? just intuition here obviously

[compact shale]

When you call a spirit back, they're bound to their tombstone. Does that mean Belonging Gran is bound to the dinner treehouse? (events don't count l don't consider them canon)

[hushed steeple]

Did gran not appear at the quest realm during belonging?

[rigid mural]

Baby I would talk for hours about the deep topics I see in sky, this game is ripe with interesting themes

[keen shore]

Side note because fruity made me think of this, those stones with diamonds in them that summon spirits are 100% gravestones right? like we didn’t all just collectively assume this for no real reason
I thought they were but I am VERY cautious abt assuming lore stuff in this game so doesn’t hurt to ask

[compact shale]

More likely memorial stones. What's the odds they're actually buried there?

[hushed steeple]

They called them gravestones in the launch stream. I doubt all the fellas are buried right there in the same place though.

[thin dirge]

This part might be left to interpretation, about the Elders. We dont even know their ages and has always existed. We do know they can sends spirits back to the Light, so its possible thats their purpose

Also guiding the ppl somehow in different ways

[keen shore]

I could talk for hours about Sky, just in general. Like lore and stuff. I am doing so right now
We know almost nothing of use about the elders besides the fact that only they can send spirits back to the stars and what they look like. Also maybe that prairie elder is obsessed with pots for some reason

[thin dirge]

Prairie is known to be a protector of the kight creaturrs Isle seems to leads people to the ascension point with birds, etc

[hushed steeple]

They are granted elemental powers. We know that.

(Cept for lamed n daleth)

[rigid mural]

Ayin loves his pot

[rigid mural]

We don't exactly know what the Prophecy lights exactly are, the star patterns could be an euphemism for something else

[hushed steeple]

And whats off about elders never fell theory is HOW MUCH THEY ARE DEPICTED BEING PHYSICALLY THERE

[thin dirge]

I used to think it was given to the wrong people but when I look at the Nintendo trailer, I dont think thats what happened. Perhaps just wrongfully used.

I had a theory that the reason why those Elders were gived those lights was because of their attributes, which was later forgotten by time

[keen shore]

Oh!! Interesting thing I just remembered!! Are the pots in daylight prairie stone (they seem so to me) or ceramic and actual pottery? Small question but an interesting one
Also how do these spirits manage to shape stone so well, normally it would be quite hard

[thin dirge]

Looks like it

[hushed steeple]

The elders seem to have opposite personality to their granted elements. ITS KINDA FUNNY

[compact shale]

Swing you sinners

Maybe one reason the lights were given was to fix them idk

[rigid mural]

@hushed steeple
👀

[tulip aspen]

ohhhh
i personally think, yes they were physically there, but they werent mortal like ancestors, because they were sent by the sky to help spirits be happy and ascend

thats what i mean by not fell

[keen shore]

That’s true, I think it’s physically confirmed when you encounter them it’s in a place “beyond space and time”
… do we know if they ever had physical forms to begin with or did everyone just meditate like we do when we need to meet them

[hushed steeple]

Maybe they did physically stay on ground, but died like in blue eden

Its just so odd they get stick figures with everyone else in prophecy mural

[rigid mural]

Blue Eden I miss u

[thin dirge]

I think thats what happened when the Kingdom fell or when they strayed from their path.

Prairie Elder used to be hardworking. Heck, he's the Elder of the area where peopme were farmers, he's big, tough and carries a big pot. Its clear he's some hardworker in the past.

Forest Elder was patient, because crafting and working needs patience, but later became impatient due to her greed of producing diamonds.

Twins used to be cooperative. They represent balance. But after the competitions and the entertainment, they eventually drifted from each other and now there's an imbalance between the two.

And GW elder.... Its hard to see how he lost his trait (bravery), but I think that may have been related to the war. His side lost, and they retreated, showing cowardice.

[tulip aspen]

it shows tsadi going to war alongside their soldiers, so i personally believe they were physically around, but perhaps often times they ascended back up to the Sky, and during those times people would have to meditate at their thrones to talk to them

[keen shore]

ash: everything you need to know is given in the intro
me: how did the ancestors make pots? are stars real?

[thin dirge]

In other words, I think the virtues of the lights were what the Elders used to excel at which is why they had those lights, but eventually strayed from those virtues by time

[tulip aspen]

yes! they got corrupted just like the ancestors did!!!
it truly takes childlike wonder to not become like them, which is why the Sky sent us

[thin dirge]

Well, not corrupted, just strayed from those values. They just forgot

[hushed steeple]

Even the last kid they threw wanted to be a grown up so bad he made eden boom

[thin dirge]

Was it really the Prince/King, or the Elders....?

[tulip aspen]

not literally corrupted fam

there's a figurative darkness, and a literal dark pollution

[hushed steeple]

Most likely suspect yeppy

[keen shore]

The lore of this game:

“Last time I sent down a glowing flying magical child, the kingdom exploded and everyone died. I think the issue here is that I didn’t send enough of them”

[thin dirge]

Sending more wouldve knocked out the balance. It just so happens that there's so much darkness that now there needs to be more light to balance it out. So now we have millions of sky kids roaming around....

[hushed steeple]

Or more cause, there wasent that much that needed fixed before. More broken pipes need 10 mill lil star plumbers

[keen shore]

I wanted to quickly mention two headcanons because I thought of them and I think they’re neat.

Ancestors/spirits in general? Didnt have problems being around corrupted dark stone or dark stone in general, maybe effected mentally instead of physically, which is why they didn’t notice what was happening until it was too late. We were specifically given a lower tolerance to keep us away from the material and ESPECIALLY away from corrupted versions of it.
The reason Sky kids honk and can’t talk, forcing them to rely on body language and chat (maybe not a canon feature) is because our abilities to communicate were similarly taken away to be EXTRA safe

[thin dirge]

Wait, arent all communication and sound in Sky are honks?

So pretty sure Sky kid can talk. We just dont see it like how we do as humans

[keen shore]

I think how it works is others can understand their basic meanings: “come over here! I need help!” like a distress call, but we purposefully can’t communicate anything more complex than that

We can also use emotes, but they demonstrate basic emotions, not really higher concepts. One Sky kid wouldn’t be able to tell another “Hey, I think this dark stone stuff is pretty cool. What if we built tons of technology with it?”

I’m not saying those ideas are 100% canon but they explain some things and are just neat little tidbits

[compact shale]

Thanks to the Level 4 Sparkler emote, we can now do letters and possibly make up written characters! Only problem is that it could take a long time to write, but at least it can be more understandable than morse code!!!

[thin dirge]

When we chat, we pretty much honk. When ancestors seemingly talk in memories, they seem to do something similar to a honk. My view is that sky kids can talk, but its just honks to us.

My hc is that animal calls are actually onomatopoeias of animal sounds in Sky.

Like bird call is actually our Sky kid going "Chirp chirp", but to us sounds like a high pitched honk instead

[keen shore]

Maybe, cool idea! this just reminded me of how you can honk as a ghost following others around on eden, and then when you go back and relive spirit memories you can also recognize when they’re yelling at you too lol

[compact shale]

Kingdom explodes and the celestial fire alarm goes off

[keen shore]

“OH NO THEYVE DISCOVERED MORSE CODE. I NEED TO REMEDY THIS”
makes it impossible to relive sparkler spirit
“PERFECT”

[compact shale]

Morse code can be done with honks, language can be achieved by becoming Sparkler's best friend (you need lvl4 for it to work)

[keen shore]

“OH NO… WHAT DO I DO NOW”

[frigid tinsel]

somehow i read nearly all these ~200 messages

[tulip aspen]

ASL: American Sky Language

[keen shore]

Same when I sleep this chat seems to explode with activity and I have to read it like a chapter of a novel each morning

[pastel brook]

You want me to play you a lullaby or what?

[tulip aspen]

that would be so damn cute if ancestors and sky kids canonically used sign language

[keen shore]

I had an idea like this. The ancestors don’t seem to be able to speak as spirit forms so it would be really cute if they talked with us using sign language. Hey, maybe that’s how some seasonal guides communicate with us in seasonal quests!

[frigid tinsel]

unfortunately i can't respond adequately cos it's so much info and i have a killer headache, i will just say nice going Kami, I do appreciate those notes from the launch livestream 👌 and yall got interesting ideas thrown about

[compact shale]

We'd make sign language eventually IF WE DIDNT HAVE MITTY HANDS

[frozen pivot]

knife hands

[keen shore]

Absolutely hate headaches, hope you get better soon!

also @/fruity that’s why we have mitten hands

[tulip aspen]

KHCKHCLHCLJ LJCOHCKHC

@keen shore technically flight guide did gesture signs at us to communicate and we just guess the message and that guess showed as words on our screen lolol

[frigid tinsel]

flight guide uses sign language confimred?

[keen shore]

I HOPE SO that just makes me really happy

I mean, we communicate almost exclusively with emotes, sign language is just a continuation of that!

[compact shale]

We must be really good guessers

But realistically only Scold, Bloom Guide, and the other fingered spirits can do sign language

Sparkler lvl 4 is like having a whiteboard but it only fits one letter lmao

[tulip aspen]

as a former interpreterr for my Deaf friend that fills me with joy

[compact shale]

I guess emotes are sign language but with more body and less hand

[frigid tinsel]

i mean, if youre Deaf and everyone around you wears masks rendering it impossible to lip read, sign language would be really useful

[tulip aspen]

idk about other nations but american sign sure uses body lolol

there's a lot more to it than just hands