lore-discussion-spoilers

[unreal wren]

The game lore is comprised of basically everyone here rubbing brain cells together and coming up with theories we can all collectively decide is true until it’s proven otherwise

[spiral vault]

Or just looking at the game and seeing what happens. It really isn't that hard

[grizzled vector]

The thing is, most of what we call "lore" is really speculation based on, at best, early concept art. Whereas the game itself was deliberately designed to be "up to interpretation" and to make you feel like you are exploring a lost civilization and think about what it may have been like

[spiral vault]

Besides the word "shattering" being specifically used, all of this is literally explained in the first 15 minutes of the game.

[narrow marsh]

I completely agree! Perception is such a crucial part of this story, especially as part of how we interact with it all from within the game.

My scientist friend and I were arguing about whether Sky as we see it in-game, from the map to the assets used, represent this story’s world, or is just a caricature of it.
In my opinion, I don’t think any of what we’ve seen in game has to properly represent the world that will be and or could be presented by The Two Embers. I’d like to think there are dozens of villages in the Prairie, hidden by the clouds. That the scale and size of structures like Eden and Vault are going to be completely different between the show and the game. They think the smaller room we teleport into has to be canonical, while I think that it’s possible for it to just be the representative version of the floor we see Stewie and the Vault Elder eventually rise to. We are shrouded in uncertainties and ambiguities created by the design choices of a team steering through difficult choices and aggressive deadlines. But most importantly, Sky as a game is an artform that is ‘limited’ by the freedom it gives us to express and personally perceive.

Though when it comes to the Spirits and the Elders, we see that these don’t have to be limitations at all, but actually blessings! To be able to see this as characterized, portrayed, and perceived. So much potential in this medium. 🕯️

[trail drum]

Exactly! We dont know how the elders actually act but how WE view them from OUR perspective, while we see them as tall, mighty beings, there is more to them than how we see them, we just need to see it in THEIR point of view

[grizzled vector]

And yes, we have gotten some additional "lore" over time with more seasons, but even those essentially hint at things rather than explain. There isn't really an explicit official history/timeline. The Two Embers series is the closest thing we have to that (and so far Part 1 literally just covered one location and the very end of the civilization)

[narrow marsh]

So here’s the gist.
In the beginning, this special living substance called Light took the forms of living beings and traveled the world before returning to the Sky from the very top of Eden, where they would be reborn!

Humanoid beings of Light, who we call "the Ancestors", watched over this Light and shepherded the creatures of Light on their way to Eden.
But the Ruler of the Ancestors realized they could steal the power of the Light for themself, and so they captured creatures and stole their Light using the giant red diamond you see at the end of the Eye of Eden. ♦️
Some of the kingdom didn't like this, and they rebelled. There was an entire war between the rebels and the Ruler's kingdom, and in the end, the red diamond overfilled with Light and Shattered, sending dangerous debris across the kingdom, spreading Darkness everywhere.

500 years after all of the Ancestors had died out, a new type of Being formed from The Light in the Sky, called a Descendant, which you know as skykids! Our purpose is to save the trapped Souls of the Ancestor Spirits, so that their inner Light can be freed and rejoin that Light in the Sky.

Hope this helps! 🕯️

[grizzled vector]

As far as the whole "Scarred Sentry actually being Wasteland Elder" thing – this would contradict what has been revealed of "the lore" so far. But at the same time, again, what has been revealed of the lore so far is concepts and original ideas. Strictly speaking, they could decide that Scarred Sentry somehow becomes the Wasteland Elder spirit, and it wouldn't contradict anything that's been revealed as official canon so far. But at this point folks dismiss it out of hand simply because there's this inertia of knowing what the Wasteland Elder was "supposed" to be. On the other hand, people tend to assume that the Dusk Ember is Hopeful Steward even though it hasn't been confirmed. So, "lore" in this game is kinda subjective and vague

[sharp shore]

which is why i like lameds nuance in her character and her actions within the span of the chapters (and with her body language)

how someone could be so (understandably) spineless yet so powerful is quite... something

[trail drum]

I would like to also call back on the photo of the Nesting guide and Forest Elder, while its only a photo of the both of them looking at the forest outside of the temple and we dont know for sure the relationships between the elders and the guides themselves im sure the elders were probably on good terms with the guides but we never know

[narrow marsh]

The turmoil of the entire Lore pantheon that that person’s question caused is so fascinating. 🕯️

[grizzled vector]

I find it interesting that everyone jumps to the conclusion that "Lamed" is "spineless"

[sharp shore]

look shes spineless for good reason against Resh i would say

for lack of a better term

maybe just compliant for the sake of everyting going to crap and theres nothing else that can be done

[coral oracle]

Scarred Sentry is the strongest character in all of sky because they can flip the crabs with crystals on their back

[lilac cliff]

Thank you so much! It helped me become more immersed in the game's universe.

[unreal wren]

Basically the lore is like someone handed you a bunch of tools and said find it on your own, and I think that’s beautiful to see how everyone’s perspective colors how they perceive the lore

[sharp shore]

okay can i be real

this season deals with probably the most horrific things ive ever seen in this game but the crab blasting mechanic in the quest killed me

[gilded socket]

See here's a simple fix

"Can you explain Sky for me?"
"no" /j

In all seriousness this is not just about willingness but also ability. With how vaguely the lore presents itself, it is designed so that you can't entirely explain Sky. That is something I have learned to accept as it is the intended experience.

[trail drum]

Yeah the only power she has is the power to look through memories and to preserve them so they arent lost or forgotten forever, no powerful spear, hammer or staff, she wields no weapon or shield to defend herself

She would rather obey and do as she is told unless she wants to suffer

[grizzled vector]

Honestly yea. The quest overall was pretty dark but going around bonking the crabs with the shield cracked me up honestly

[sharp shore]

yeah i dont think shes necessarily bad for what shes doing

like i said shes nuanced surprisingly with 0 dialogue and with a mask on too

[trail drum]

Okay if im being honest I thought Vault Elder's diamond on her headpiece was gonna show Resh what is happening when it glowed, almost like a way to communicate but I was wrong

[trail drum]

Oh yeah absolutely

CAPTAIN AMERICA MOMENT

[sharp shore]

i dont want to assign my morals to the characters, im just watching crap go down by their own actions this was just a domino effect of things that (literally) blew up in their face in the end

its horrific yes but i am not going to point "good" or "evil" to anyone (yet)

[sharp shore]

the shield throw got me rolling dear lord WE ARE NOT IN THE MCU WE ARE IN THE END TIMES 💔

[gilded socket]

Sometimes events happen with such a catastrophic domino effect that you just throw morals to the wind and grab a popcorn to watch it unfold

[spiral vault]

Well, the revival question has the basic outline of the story. Then, the seasons and extra content can be used to build things up.

For example, we found out that power diamonds helped to stave off the darkness temporarily, that the Eden Diamond's explosion destroyed all the elders, and that krills were creatures born of the darkness. The additional stuff can help fill in the story, so that we can get a clearer picture.

[trail drum]

Can we talk about that moment with the parent hugging their child tightly, plus that child also has the shard disease

Oh no....that just makes the season even tragic

[spiral vault]

The Dusk Ember=Hopeful Steward, I agree, is mosly based on similar looks and personality. But we literally see the Wasteland Elder in-game, they dwarf the Scarred Sentry and look very different.

[sharp shore]

this is the part about being archeologists in a dead nation whose history is written in a language we dont fully understand

it feels vague before the true story hits

[spiral vault]

We know the what, but not the why.

[trail drum]

So not only is the shard disease is happening to grown ups, its also happening to children, CHILDREN!!

[gilded socket]

Actually I do want to note something really interesting about the darkstone

When you light it up, it momentarily charges you as well as charge itself. While only for a moment, it's as if it becomes a net positive energy machine.

Does the darkstone defy the law of conservation? (I mean ok its usage is definitely breaking conservation laws but regarding energy conservation)

[sharp shore]

id argue it would target them first

weaker immune systems and all.

would not be surprised if the babies go first

[gilded socket]

It's happening to every living being that is not of darkness. Not a great time to live in for sure.

[celest birch]

Wait until they (Scarred Sentry) decide to manifest in all their spiritual glory in front of a Sanctuary red shard, bonking its Shard Crabs off the cliffs!

[trail drum]

Now that I think about it, im sure that they made the statues cause of how the people see the elders, tall, mighty and fierce, but in reality, they are just like everyone else

[grizzled vector]

We do not strictly know what power the Vault Elder had or did not have. There probably isn't another person in Sky who understands the technomagic of Sky as well as they do. Even if they wouldn't win in an outright fight against the Ruler, they could potentially know how to undermine the Ruler in any number of ways, or even render them powerless through diverting the Light from the crystal or whatever. But standing up to the Ruler (or even deposing the Ruler) does not solve the fundamental problems the Kingdom is facing

[narrow marsh]

These stages of grief both you and Tem are processing are very powerful and very important to our journey as Sky archivists.
In many things in my life, I used to believe it was about the ability to explain things, and for me personally it destroyed my joys and took away all the love from everything, resulting in me hurting the people around me. At the point in my life that I am at now, wherever that is, I do not believe it to be about ability, but rather humility. We need to be able to take each step slowly learning to embrace ambiguity. To be able to let go of needing to Control; controlling the narrative, controlling the motivation, controlling the community. It truly takes a gentle touch, and I am glad to know to remind myself when and how I need to take a step back from things.

That’s where that post in the screenshot has led me to this point in my life, anyways. 🕯️

[spiral vault]

Well, we see the Elders in the in-game cutscenes and sometimes in Orbit.

[sharp shore]

if i may, on this same line of thought

id like to know less about the atrocities in this kingdom thanks 😇 /j

but in all seriousness i agree, sorry i dont have anything else to contribute

[trail drum]

Sadly, we dont see babies anywhere, mostly just children

[spiral vault]

The moment the Eden Diamond is constructed, there is nothing anyone can do. The Sky kingdom starts its doomsday clock at that point.

[celest birch]

Orbit versions of Elders aren't as colossal as Temple-cutscene variants tho. I know, game limit, but still. :)

[trail drum]

Yeah, plants, animals, people, children, yep they were living in the dark times

[gilded socket]

actually not sure about the plants

[coral oracle]

The size of the Elders could also be a thing of forced perspective, to emphasize the adult-(sky) child difference

[grizzled vector]

We see the spirit of the Wasteland Elder in-game but we don't really know who they were or how they became that. Or at least I don't think we know. Honestly I may need to make a new account to see what new player experience looks like at this point because they may have changed the intro for the new player like three or four times by now for all I know

[celest birch]

Plants too, as seen in Chapter 2 with that one branch at Crab Fields.

[sharp shore]

if we had baby game character sprites that would be adorable but i dont think tgc has those assets lol

but id like to think that apart from game mechanics the babies all died first which is painful to think about, since i adore babies

[gilded socket]

At least the fun part about exploring this lost civilization is that we actually get to live alongside the ancient inhabitants

[sharp shore]

you and i have VERY DIFFERENT DEFINITIONS OF FUN (but i understand how its a good immersive experience )

[coral oracle]

I feel like whatever happens, this channels gonna run wild in 20 days, 2 whole season quests at once

[gilded socket]

I meant as spirits, not getting clocked by a krill with everyone else in real time

[spiral vault]

I think we've been literally exhausted in terms of heartbreaking content. There's nothing else that can surprise or shock us

[gilded socket]

Do not say that, they absolutely can and will do that

[coral oracle]

There's nothing else that can surprise or shock us yet

[trail drum]

From a skykids perspective, looming eldritch beings, from an actual perspective, just normal looking elders who have been dead for 500 years

[sharp shore]

yeah ive presented some atrocious theories man it can get worse

DOES NOT MEAN IT SHOULD, THIS SEASON IS GIVING ME A DAMN HEADACHE

[trail drum]

I cant imagine that

[coral oracle]

Would a baby skykid be like 90% mask /j

[sharp shore]

it hurts having children see this

no child deserves to see that SCRATCH THAT NONE OF THIS SHOULD BE HAPPENING IN THE FIRST PLACE

[unreal wren]

10 percent chubby wrapped in cloth, 90 percent mask set next to comically small swaddled baby

[trail drum]

Wait now that I think about it
Did Toymaker adopt Steward when they were a baby or when they were a toddler? Remembering Steward is an orphan and Toymaker is their new parent

[sharp shore]

for the record i dont mean children that play this game... which lets be honest are roughly teens or tweens and can handle the content to a surface level degree at least

I meant the children playing in the last city 500 years ago

[gilded socket]

way to make Stewie's backstory more tragic than it already is

[trail drum]

Toymaker holding a baby Steward

dies of too much wholesomeness

[sharp shore]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO DONT DO THISD TO ME

[unreal wren]

Do you think that the ancestors made little cloth masks for babies until they could have regular masks?? Actually what’s up with the masks. Why does everyone have a mask?

If I could have one wish answered, it would be to ask why the ancestors made masks a culturally important thing in their society to where even orphans have one

[grizzled vector]

I think one of the things that's worth keeping in mind about Chapter 3 is that for us it was the first time actually seeing light creatures get harvested to power darkstone, and in the context of the series it seems like this huge step up from just harvesting this magic dust falling from the sky. But in game and concept art it's heavily hinted that their whole industry was pretty much built on harvesting living creatures for light. The Elder didn't make a stand because it wasn't really some unthinkable, unheard of escalation. They have already accepted and done worse in the name of "technological progress" or whatever they would call it. And in any case, that particular moment wasn't a great time for a debate anyway

[trail drum]

Maybe Toymaker mightve found baby Steward abandoned somewhere

[grizzled vector]

The "body language" between them did come off as the Ruler being on a brink of throwing a fit, which is notable, but I think that's not the only factor in what happened and how the interaction played out

[sharp shore]

this is probably one of the most pressing questions i have too

i know its their culture but why? beauty standards maybe? preserving anonymity

[trail drum]

Huh that hasn't occurred to me why masks were made and important to have and wear

[restive locust]

Great now I’m imagining baby Stewie learning to speak and talking to Toymaker singing little nursery rhymes and making toys for Stewie

[unreal wren]

Exactly. Why masks specifically, if it was a beauty standard, why does even a poor orphan have one??

since dusk was on their own after toymaker died and while the manatee grew up, who supplied them with the masks to keep up with the way a child’s face changes as they grow?!

[trail drum]

If wearing the maskless one, our eyes dont shine and they are closed, wearing a mask our eyes are open, so its a mystery how and why they were made

[celest saffron]

If this were real life we're literally just gonna die from hitting things because our eyes are closed the entire time

[grizzled vector]

In fairness, even the Vault Elder is a bit of a "looming eldritch being" compared to a regular Ancestor. Someone like Wasteland Elder would look terrifying even to them, not just skykids

[trail drum]

Omg yes! I wanna see that right now, omg and Toymaker carrying baby Steward on their back like a baby carrier

[unreal wren]

Why was this one specific tradition SO important that us sky kids, descendants who know next to nothing also see it as important to uphold??

[coral oracle]

From a meta standpoint, i imagine the masks are at least partially to avoid having to put a lot of work into designing a face (there's a lot of kinda uncanny proto-skykids), and the few spirits without masks have little dot eyes

In setting however... This is definitely the realm of pure hypothesis, but there's a running theme of connection within the game - masks could potentially be a way of making everyone look similar, in an attempt to make it easier to empathize with them.

It could have also potentially been an end of the kingdom thing, people trying to stop the spread of the dark sickness any way they could, and this one just so happened to catch on

A potential third alternative is that since everyone is a light creature to some degree, it quite literally allows their inner light to shine out in the case of the ancestors (using sky kids as a reference this time, our eyes are completely shut when maskless)

[gilded socket]

But from what I've seen, masks seem to be a thing even since the beginnings of the kingdom. Even the teaser for the Dawn segment of 2 Embers shows everyone wearing masks.

[unreal wren]

Ok I see where your coming from and I definitely think it has some merit, I’m just endlessly plagued by needing concrete in word/text answers to this

[grizzled vector]

From the meta standpoint TGC added masks as 1) way to offer intuitively understandable character customization to the players, and 2) way to avoid "uncanny valley" effect of having the faces look not quite human

[restive locust]

Ok so we know with skids that mask = eyes open

But, when we see the maskless spirit, their eyes are fully open (and they look a bit like an egg)

We also see some spirits (I think in quest 4???) without masks (guards)

I think masks are a form of protection, like so they don’t hurt their faces or something

It probably also turned into fashion, judging by how there are different designs, sort of like jewelry!

Perhaps even a status indicator…

I think they’re likely carved from wood, stone, or clay, judging by the animated close-up textures!

Oops holy text wall chat

[celest saffron]

What if we're maskless and our eyes opened? Do we automatically get corrupted from the darkness?

[coral oracle]

So we can probably rule out hypothesis 2

[sharp shore]

lmao but bro she had to S T R E T C H to tap the sentrys shoulder

you gotta admit it was kinda... cute

[celest saffron]

"And they look a bit like an egg" is an unnecessarily funny reminder

[restive locust]

No one out-eggs lamed or at least her in game version

[grizzled vector]

Keep in mind though, even Sentry is technically a "normal" Ancestor, compared to the Wasteland Elder. Or the Prairie Elder. The two of them would probably not fit on that elevator together

[celest saffron]

Some call it an egg
Others call it a hijab
Several think it's both (if I know who that several is)

[coral oracle]

This would be pure hypothesis since the closest we could get to this would be maskless + an elder headgear which makes the eyes glow brighter/appear open on a maskless skid

[unreal wren]

There’s eggs, and then there’s lamed

[sharp shore]

oh no i do not doubt that

But you mentioning that made me remember her stremtch lol

[celest saffron]

Ice-cream of Dawn
Daylight Dairy
Hidden Froot Loops
Someone continue

[trail drum]

Scarred Sentry: hey Toymaker where are the kids?
Toymaker: turns around, carrying baby Steward and child Alef on his back

[narrow marsh]

I love this!

[restive locust]

I think in game it could be both an egg or hijab/other sort of head covering (looks like a khimar also), but in the show it def resembles a fabric head covering

[celest saffron]

What is that headscarf nuns wear?

[sharp shore]

i think its a headscarf and i think theres a lot of hair underneath

shes related to teth anyway so

[unreal wren]

Nobody out egg’s lamed, not even the most bald of spirits, she’s simply.. unmatched

[restive locust]

Lamed: where’s the prophecy kid

Toymaker, with a suspiciously alef-shaped bag: great question

[celest saffron]

Wait fr
Where did that come from?

[grizzled vector]

Probably not. We see various Ancestor spirits who do not wear masks. Skykids probably have their eyes closed for the same reason their hands do not have individual fingers modeled. Phones were significantly less powerful when the game came out, so optimization was kinda important, and open eyes would be pretty complex geometry for something that would likely be hidden under a mask most of the time

[gilded socket]

Vanilla of Triumph
Lemon Wasteland
Blueberry of Knowledge?

[restive locust]

A coif

[coral oracle]

Valley of Cheerios (sounds similar enough dont @ me)
Golden Crisp
Vault of Chocolate (could not come up with anything spectacular for these)

And of course

Eatin'

[celest saffron]

Vault and blueberry is such a drastic difference

[gilded socket]

ran out of ideas honestly. just used blueberry because the entire area is b l u e

[restive locust]

I remember when skids had actual hands for a short time… but we were too powerful hehe (never give a creature of chaos opposable thumbs)

[celest saffron]

Vault of Koolaid

[coral oracle]

We still have thumbs we just have mitten fingers U_U

[restive locust]

Malt of knowledge!

I think it’s a type of milkshake

[coral oracle]

Malt of Chocolate....

[celest saffron]

Oh yea I forgot about malt

[unreal wren]

Wait we had actual fingers once?!

[restive locust]

Mhm! I was like “whoa where did this come from” and then they were gone

[coral oracle]

If i had to guess we lost our fingers in a moment of game optimization

[celest saffron]

Mitten hands don't stop us from causing disaster around the kingdom

[trail drum]

Yeah its a hijab of some sort, you can see there are folds around the neck area similar to how Resh has a hood covering up his hair

[grizzled vector]

But yea, as far as in-universe reasons it's anyone's guess, but whatever it is it must be important enough (practically or culturally) that yea, presumably everyone would get a "free" mask. You wouldn't necessarily get a fancy looking one but you would get one if you needed it

[restive locust]

Yeah but imagine if skids learned how to throw a fastball baseball-style

[celest saffron]

I mean the part where Lamed and Teth are related
What relations do they have

[coral oracle]

Baby shower with a huge stack of masks to choose from...

[trail drum]

Omg Toymaker would be the one person who doesnt want more kids but has like 6 kids playing with him including the begging child

[restive locust]

I need to up my woodcarving game and make myself a mask

[celest saffron]

I wanna learn sewing
Mainly cause clothes rn suck and I need something that fits me

[restive locust]

I can embroider but I can’t sew to save my life 😭

[grizzled vector]

I believe it's one of those things mentioned in that one Japanese livestream. It's unclear if they meant they are related as in family, or their responsibilities are related, or some other sort of relationship. The actual quote was something along the lines of "their headpiece diamonds look similar because they are related" so it's not even clear if it meant the Elders or the headpieces

[sharp shore]

sorry took long to find the link

https://discordapp.com/channels/575762611111592007/632004389137154048/1401701608256962662

honestly it tracks its like my more passionate older sister and me being the chill younger sister

[celest saffron]

They do look similar lowkey

[sharp shore]

fr they do

[celest saffron]

Same thought
Something tells me they're sisters, Lamed being the older one and Teth the younger one

[grizzled vector]

In fairness everyone looks similar when they have basically no features other than having two eyes on their face

[sharp shore]

it works opposite in my family

i keep calling lamed spineless as a mostly joke but if im being real, if i were her... id just do the exact same thing

i mean kings up to some stuff, do i really wanna risk something dumb lol

[celest saffron]

Sure but something about the vibe they give makes me think they were somehow sisters

[grizzled vector]

I'm pretty sure it was mentioned at some point that all of the Elders are technically "related" (the original concept for them being, they were all "stars" fallen from the sky). Fun fact though, the Valley "twins" are not actually meant to be siblings but two halves of a star that was somehow split in two (it was never elaborated on)

[sharp shore]

being celestial beings i have no idea what it means for them to be ""related""

to them its probably more on an emotional point, like "chosen" family

genes dont make no sense here lol (for the elders i mean)

[trail drum]

Child Steward: I the mighty ruler of light shall uh take you down, you meanie ruler
Child Alef: you shall never defeat me for i am the ruler of darkness and I shall destroy you, fear me and my loyal companion holding a toy manta
Steward: well me and my friend will stop you holding a toy manatee

[celest saffron]

Two halves of a star makes it more clear that they share half of everything, including their intellect
Basically half a braincell like always

[sharp shore]

DO NOT UNDERESTIMATE THEIR PSYOPS

[celest saffron]

I WILL TAKE THEM MORE SERIOUSLY IF THEY STOP PLAYING CRICKET WITH MY CANDLE

[restive locust]

TWO HALVES OF A STAR??? BOY OH BOY WOULD YOU LIKE TO HEAR ABOUT THE PRIESTESS???

Disclaimer that I don’t know everything about her, I got most of my info from another post on the server, but I don’t remember who

[grizzled vector]

I mean, they share an origin, in a sense, I guess? It probably wouldn't be accurate to call them siblings but they are kinda similar to each other in a sense. I guess you could compare them to the Maiar from Tolkien's lore?

[sharp shore]

me coming from an indian family i will say that whenever i think of their bats i first think of cricket

they hit a 6 with our light in the cutscene LOL /j

[sharp shore]

awwwwwwwwwwwww (this is killing me )

[celest saffron]

How does a human in this kingdom have no mouth but have eyes
While a manatee has a mouth but no eyes

[restive locust]

To bring balance to the force /j

[sharp shore]

they have a mouth they just dont show it in game due to being low poly lol

[valid dagger]

They complement each other

[restive locust]

I mean we know they breathe (underwater mechanics) and eat (food! Everywhere there is life) uhhhhhh and I sure hope they have a nose. ||Voldemort||

[cobalt palm]

My profile pic is proof they have an anime like nose

[restive locust]

Oh my gosh it’s only just clicked for me that your name says “Returned” not “Retired” lollll

[sharp shore]

i will forever headcanon that they llook like they have our faces like we humans do

with varying facial features and bone structure and theyre all diverse people

the masks are more cultural, but i will forever see them as that

[celest saffron]

Well since TTE already came out I think I should lol

[cobalt palm]

Part 2 pending

[celest saffron]

I would explain what the Malevolent part is but I'm not being annoying for the sake of an explanation

[restive locust]

And we know their skin can be physically wounded, as seen by the mask with the bandage, the bandages on warrior, scars on some spirits (don’t remember which ones, maybe I’m wrong and it’s just their masks)

So I think they def have variety

Also interesting that some, like uhhhh cannoneer? Maybe? Have not replaced damaged masks!

[sharp shore]

i also think they modified their masks to account for disabilities too

or just facial hair, probably carved out space for those parts of their faces

[restive locust]

Yesss I’d love to see that

I wonder if nestie has a mask mount for her glasses

[sharp shore]

though id think some folks went maskless

unconventional cultural/beauty standard

they seem to be very inclusive of diversity too which is interesting to see

[trail drum]

Ruler Resh: STEWARD!
Ruler Steward: What?! What happened?!
Ruler Resh: I just found.....THIS!! holding a baby krill isnt it adorable?
Ruler Steward: HOW CUTE!!!

[celest saffron]

Speaking of maskless do y'all notice that spirits like Pointing Candlemaker and Frightened Refugee now have their eyes closed?

[trail drum]

Yeah i think they made some changes to the spirits who dont have the masks

[cobalt palm]

The whisperers and a few others have diamond eyes

[celest saffron]

Yes
So why did those two suddenly had their eyes sealed tight

[restive locust]

I think the maskless spirit giver has open eyes still… odd

[trail drum]

Ruler Resh: hey Duke, do you want the ball?
pet krill waiting
Ruler Resh: throws the ball
pet krill yeets itself into the table

[restive locust]

skykid headbonk ding noise

[sharp shore]

I think thats almost like a fabric mask to me?

[restive locust]

Oooh interesting!

Like a ski mask?

[sharp shore]

Idk man probably some fabric to make it breathable

Probably what soldiers wore during basic

or like athletes too cus the buff valley dudes wore them

[celest saffron]

Valley spirits either have ice cream for hair or look like a thumb fr

[sharp shore]

I just wanna know what that bath oob is about

Resh’s indoor pool yoooooooooo

[trail drum]

Steward: has a pet manatee
Resh: has a pet krill

[celest saffron]

Elaborate
I'm interested

[restive locust]

It’s the hot tub meeting room where all the elders have a jacuzzi yap session

[sharp shore]

Dunno how relevant it is lorewise but if you go to the secret hideout near recluse and you rocket near the exit hole high enough you’ll see a pool down below (some square lookin thing) and you can land in it

Last time i tried tho i think windwall prevented me and my friend but yeah… its a freaking jacuzzi out of nowhere

[umbral tiger]

I don't think i'll be emotionally prepared for the next anniversary parade in Aviary. Stewie with manatee joining Toymaker, Recluse , Shepherd and Sentry just strolling in this new era. What iffff

[celest saffron]

And Stewie holding Toymaker's hand while Brian is floating happily around them

[restive locust]

I WILL CRY

[gilded socket]

Meanwhile the other elders are panicking and the entire palace is in chaos

[sharp shore]

I love how ever since i called the manatee brian a few people started calling it brian too

Trendsetter

[gilded socket]

I do hope we get to give closure and maybe bring the manatee back to our era

[restive locust]

Iconic

[umbral tiger]

we loveee brian

[sharp shore]

IN ANOTHER LIFE THIS MANATEE COULD BE WRITING A BOOK 💔

[restive locust]

Mate I don’t think he has hands

or can read

Or write

[gilded socket]

Does he know he exists

[sharp shore]

In family guy brian was trying to write a book 💔 that couldve been our sweet baby boy manatee

The fact that we watched it grow from a baby to DEAD is awful why

[celest saffron]

Did you really have to mention that

[coral oracle]

Stern Shepherd never got to buy the manatee toy..

[severe fjord]

I saw someone say they think Scarred Sentry is the wasteland elder. What do you guys think?

[sharp shore]

Yeah. 😇

[gilded socket]

the sentry can only dream of carpenting...

Also that doesn't feel very plausible tbh

[coral oracle]

I am the no.1 proponent of this theory, i mean, they even have the same equipment as is at the elders shrine

[sharp shore]

The duality of man

[twilit jasper]

Mega bird imagery!!! (Or aurora wings or both haha)

[restive locust]

OMG YOURE SO RIGHT

[severe fjord]

I think I would love it! But I’m not sure I also noticed today when I was watching the chapter 4 I don’t know if anyone else saw it this way. But when it zoomed out at the end it looked like the ancestors turned into the stars in the constellations

[sharp shore]

Based on the confirmed memory storages in we saw in vault in ch4 do

Do yall think Lamed internally cringes at the embarrassing memories some of the people had in their lives lmao

[severe fjord]

I don’t know about that but I love the idea that as I walk through vault I’m walking through peoples beautiful stories and memories and one of those lanterns belongs to Stewie and the manatee

[umbral tiger]

I realized that Nesting Guide would likely invite Sentry to be an apprentice to help around making furnitures if they found out Sentry wanted to be a carpenter

[valid dagger]

dang, so scary if that true, just imagine lamed recording everyone's most embarrasing moment (I wonder if resh had some too in lamed lantern collections, secretly recorded by lamed of course)

[severe fjord]

Where did we learn sentry wants to be a carpenter? Cause that’s so cute! and sad tho

Oh I missed that! That’s so cute but so sad that they couldn’t peruse their dream

[grizzled vector]

Who knows, there's about to be lots of demand for carpenters ||given how many coffins they're going to need||

[severe fjord]

Stawppp that’s so sad

[restive locust]

I was in vault for a wl earlier and the second I stepped into first floor it was like getting hit by flashbacks ||I couldn’t stop remembering the body bags and the manatee and shdhagfsjdhs I’m gonna cryyyy||

[umbral tiger]

i criiii 😭

[severe fjord]

It was so sadddddddddd

[restive locust]

Oh wow there goes my heart! Right down the wasteland tornado

[sharp shore]

Like just imagine

: Alright figure skater from Valley, you can view a select memory of you and your late friend, like this one—

Figure skaters memory: steps into the rink and not even one minute later falls face forward and doesnt get up

: ive seen enough put this back yo 😭🙏

[severe fjord]

I wonder how the memory storing works and what the purpose was

[restive locust]

Probably to record info for future generations! Same as how there were the murals, good for record keeping

Also, good for visiting loved ones who passed

[sharp shore]

Imo i say its to prepare for doomsday (rhe shattering)

As if lamed had visions of the end of what life would be, guided by megabird, and so the memories were stored to prepare for the atonement that is us skykids descending from resh to teach us

[severe fjord]

I’m realizing I’m so lost on sky lore cause I have no idea what a mega bird is

[sharp shore]

I can never step foot in vault the same.

[restive locust]

I’m cackling over the fact that we call her “MEGABIRD” like yeah. The divine source of light and life? She a BIG BIRD

[grizzled vector]

That reminds me, what is up with the Proud Victor memory in the Coliseum? The memory literally looks like they fall flat on their face and never get up until the end 🫠

[restive locust]

Maybe a bug, maybe they’re just. Slidin.

[sharp shore]

Plot twist its bros memory she gave for them to see then she got secondhand embarrassment

[sharp shore]

Its God in this game

[severe fjord]

Ohhhh

[spiral vault]

It's just a strange nickname for the all encompassing structure of light found at the end credits

[grizzled vector]

Technically that's what the concept art called it. Probably not the canon in-universe name but also not something lorechat came up with

[severe fjord]

Did mega bird create Skykids? And the ancestors?

[sharp shore]

If i were a spirit in sky and i had to get my memories preserved bro id just ask Lamed to leave the room so i can cringe in peace 😭✌️

[restive locust]

I think so, she might have sent light to become skykids and do light stuff

Some people say (maybe joke?) that AURORA is megabird uhhh but I don’t remember why

[grizzled vector]

It's less of a "god" and more of a "when living beings die they rejoin the "megabird" for a while before being returning to the world below"

[trail drum]

Omg im sure she probably has many memories of embarrassing moments and same with Resh's

[severe fjord]

Ooo thank you, I’m learning so much

[restive locust]

Reminds me a bit of how some religions have a term for an all-encompassing being/force that governs life and death and existence and is in everything

[crimson rover]

Same

[grizzled vector]

Inhale/exhale kinda sounds like it could be written from the point of view of the "megabird" and also the vocals in the end credits are hers. I don't think she's canonically meant to literally be megabird, but it would kinda make sense as a headcanon tbh

[sharp shore]

Yeeh same

Im Hindu so some beliefs are like that (im not that religious though so i cant say much)

[spiral vault]

Brahman

[sharp shore]

She would uncover years of brainrot from my spirit memories

Dear god all the YTPs ive watched as a kid would flash before my eyes

[grizzled vector]

If you're saying that some religions might call it "god" then... maybe, I guess? But I don't feel like "megabird is basically God in Sky" is really the best way to explain what "megabird" is supposed to be

[cobalt palm]

"take from my world no more... Resh I'm talking to you..."

[restive locust]

Nah, not a god, but something else if that makes sense

[sharp shore]

Unironically goes hard (hi mael how we doin)

[spiral vault]

The origin of all light

[cobalt palm]

"I'm sorry you did what with my light creatures?" 🤢

[sharp shore]

Like the “take from my world no more” part

[cobalt palm]

I just watched all 4 chapters back to back, now I has a sad

[sharp shore]

I dont even wanna imagine part 2 man

[cobalt palm]

||Lameds "hands on" grief counseling is something else though||

[sharp shore]

Yes very interactive id say

[spiral vault]

Well, I wonder if part 1 ended with a slightly bittersweet ending, then part 2 would be all bitter, no sweet?

[cobalt palm]

From anger to acceptance in just 3 memories

[restive locust]

We should get all sweet no bitter 😔

[spiral vault]

It's not just that, I think they understood that the manatee was connected to the Light, like all beings, living or dead. That caused the Steward to understand the importance of connection and stuff like that

[cobalt palm]

"the ancestors didn't die after all, you're just seeing their memories from Vault...
Here they all are, safe and well in an unforseen realm"

[twilit jasper]

A little off topic but if Resh really is the first ever “descendant” type being, then he is sky’s most powerful wingless player.

[sharp shore]

dusk ember: OOOOOOOOH RESH WHEN I GET YOU—

Lamed: nah just chill fam… relive that one time brian died in front of you

Dusk ember: … yk what… hell yeah…

Me watching this:

[river veldt]

Can somehow levitate, even though he has no capability to properly fly!

[cobalt palm]

Could steward have ignited the first spark for a new Megabird that we see ingame today possibly?
They are the first spark of connection which leads back to The Light

[grizzled vector]

They do have a cape in that levitating scene

[valid dagger]

He doesn't need any wl or cape to fly, after all, all of that originally his property and belong to him

[restive locust]

Oooh I love that take! Bros on a speedrun

[spiral vault]

Hear me out:

DARKSTONE HEELS

[cobalt palm]

Talking of juxtaposition in episode 1 and 3, the way they storm into wasteland temple, and then carefully carry the candle back out...
Absolute Cinema

[valid dagger]

Resh also doing speedrun on how fast you can built a kingdom, be its first ruler, and destroy it all together

[restive locust]

A whole record!

[sharp shore]

Dude built and griefed in his own minecraft server

[upper mortar]

Also how much aura he can farm in just 20 second screentime

[sharp shore]

So this is called UNsustainable fashion huh…

[restive locust]

Anyways lorechat it’s been lovely theorizing (and coping) with y’all, but I’m eepy and am off to bed, see y’all later!

Watch me say this and end up back here in 20 min

[valid dagger]

He broke two world record, just wow

[grizzled vector]

It's kinda unclear how much of that whole scene takes part in reality rather than "mindspace" but also... the weird part is that in the end, even that memory turned into light turned into butterfly – still got absorbed into another darkstone. It's almost like that scene tries to suggest that technically there's more to darkstone than just painfully sucking souls out of bodies, and it's not all horrific and evil

[river veldt]

But no cape stars, so no flight energy

[spiral vault]

I think it's a memory lantern, which is technically different

[sharp shore]

His actor was told to give it his 110% due to a lack of screentime (we are still going with the actor AU yes)

[grizzled vector]

(Except of course for the part where the manatees are still dead and the world is ending and everyone is dying and stuff)

[river veldt]

I once heard that all skykids have a part of Resh in them, because all other skykids were modeled from the first skykid, who happens to be Resh

[grizzled vector]

It still seems to work using darkstone though

[cobalt palm]

I think that's the thing, darkstone holds light,
It seems to be effectively a tool.
It can be used to help or hurt, depending on its application.
Darkstone isn't "evil" of itself, but what can be done with it can be, likewise it can be used to help others, in storing memories, or protecting them with light.
The issue I think is trying to keep it all to yourself rather than sharing it.

[spiral vault]

Well, I think it's weird, darkstone can help people but its very nature causes the light of the world to slowly decrease. People could try to use it responsibly, but taking away light creatures' light unnaturally will lead to a slow demise of the kingdom no matter.

[river veldt]

Skykids use shared memories and shared spaces, which happen to be dark stone-powered, but they use it to help each other

[spiral vault]

Now that skykids have basically an infinite source of light, they can combine the best parts of all stages of the kingdom.

[grizzled vector]

Darkstone by itself isn't technically evil, it's just stone. Even darkness technically isn't evil in itself. But darkstone does seem to trap the Light in it, taking it out of the circle of rebirth. At best. At worst, it seems to do something else to it, possibly corrupting or destroying it entirely

[river veldt]

Dark stones are used in treasure reef to make mantas to grow more wings, but this mutated them into krills…

[grizzled vector]

Right

[supple sluice]

so...how did the kid get all that wax for the candles
i legit thought they broke the lanterns to get more wax

[cobalt palm]

I think they collected small motes of light after the guards collected the big amounts (chapter 2)

[spiral vault]

My theory brain says "themselves!! they finally realized they're a skykid!!" but I think it's more mysterious

Or at least for finding the light for the candle

[river veldt]

They likely have been hording it

We saw them forge a candle in episode 2, and they packed their belongings in episode 3, so they probably brought a lot with them

[minor loom]

Something I’ve been pondering; What’s the thought on the eight player thing? Outside of simple gameplay thing does it imply there’s only eight skids at any given point? Or does it mean that there where 8 originally, and as that one restores skids in Eden that number grows? Idk just something I’ve been wondering about

[supple sluice]

that makes more sense than public property destruction

[river veldt]

(Paraphrased, since I don’t remember entirely)

Episode 2 intro text:
light grows scarce

Episode 3 intro text:
the child flees, desperate to protect what light remains

[spiral vault]

It could literally just mean eight ancestor spirits originally

[supple sluice]

I think of it more 8 points to a star (though it's true all stars in Sky have 4 points)

also there's a theme of 8 in the realms too
Isle, Prairie, Forest, Valley, Wasteland, Vault, Eden, Orbit

[cobalt palm]

8 does seem to be a pretty special number in the realms

[river veldt]

Wasteland’s octagonal shields…

[trail drum]

Now we know why he is tall and menacing and never fully reveals himself, hes got heels

[grizzled vector]

Basically Chapter 4 seems to try to say "well, darkstone isn't just all evil, it has different uses and it's actually kinda complicated" which makes sense in the context of going from Part 1 to Part 2, since Part 2 is going to explain how they built a kingdom on darkstone technology. But it's still kinda confusing what Chapter 4 is trying to say from Stewie's point of view. Like, the kid lost everything and everyone that mattered to them, directly or indirectly, to corruption caused by darkstone use. Then even the memory of it gets absorbed by darkstone. And then they suddenly decide that somehow that makes it ok? Or at least isn't worth being angry about anymore?

[river veldt]

Yes

Ancestors can use light, too, even though they do not have an inner flame (stewie is a great example)

[cobalt palm]

I think most of the forged darkstone diamonds have 8 sides too, 4 top, 4 below

[minor loom]

Right? I’ve been seeing the theme of 8 everywhere so I wanted to mention it here, so more people can ponder it

[grizzled vector]

I think Chapter 4 is trying to say a lot and doesn't have enough time for it and also is further constrained by no spoken dialogue (and even without that, it's the kind of narration that would have made more sense in a book). But yea I can only say I'm honestly confused as to what exactly Stewie's thought process was. Granted, I'm also confused as to what their original intention was to start with, with that shard. Were they literally just going to stab the Ruler? But it's even more confusing that they suddenly did a 180 from seemingly wanting to do that to not even wanting to confront them at all 🫠🤷

[cobalt palm]

I think it was more that they got to say goodbye properly, rewatching episode 3 with the context of episode 4, stewards laying next to the manatee could be just that they missed their final opportunity to be together.
In the memory, he got that and realised that perpetuating violence would only cause more loss and grief rather than healing.

[spiral vault]

I have a theory that Stewie will be able to find some form of inner flame at Orbit, but that's a longshot

[cobalt palm]

Not only did they get to say goodbye to the manatee, but also the toymaker too, who disappears off screen before we get to see them outside of a memory or dream

It's a lot to pack into a 14 minute episode though

[grizzled vector]

Technically I think in the original concept art it was specifically mentioned that Ancestors weren't able to hold the motes directly. Which may have just been retconned by the series, but it could also be a hint that Stewie is in fact a "skykid" after all

[supple sluice]

But that'd mean that skykids aren't the reincarnated king who sacrificed themself to save the sky realms then, as suggested by concept art

If Stewie is a skykid (which I doubt myself, they're clearly a spirit by the time we're around) and the king is alive the theory goes out the window

[river veldt]

i know which image you're referring to!

that is a very early beta concept, and has been retconned very early on.
note that the ancestors also look different!

[river veldt]

we'll have to wait to see what the king does when the world is ending, which will not be shown until part 2

[supple sluice]

I wonder if the next part'll be the next season or further along, cuz there's clearly 2 heads in the icon and we haven't met the second child

[grizzled vector]

It doesn't necessarily go out of the window. The Ruler's sacrifice released the Light and allowed it to reenter the cycle, which allowed more skykids to be "born" but that doesn't mean Dawn and Dusk couldn't have been "skykids" to begin with

Also I'm not sure if it's accurate to say that skykids are "reincarnations" of the Ruler, since they seem to be their own persons. But that's getting into philosophy of reincarnation and I should probably just go to bed tbh <_<

[copper saffron]

just did the quest IM NOT OKAY

so that’s it. Theyre just. Gone.

[grizzled vector]

Well... technically this isn't the last quest, apparently. So there may still be more plot coming. But also technically every non-player character we see has been gone for at least 500 years or so <_<

[trail drum]

Well since we still haven't seen Alef's perspective yet, Part 2 will be on Alef's storyline, but the question is, who will be the guide for that season?

[copper saffron]

so vault elder can just read minds? Is this a darkness thing via the stone in the headress or can they just do it

[grizzled vector]

Yes 🤷

[grizzled vector]

Isle Elder's Staff? Prairie Elder's Jar? Forest Elder's Hammer?

[wintry matrix]

Could be just Alef himself.

[gilded socket]

[grizzled vector]

Supposedly whatever happened to the Ruler in the end was so final that there literally isn't anything left (other than the Light that that became the next generation of skykids)

[wintry matrix]

Yes I know.

[grizzled vector]

Imagine if it will be the Spirit of the Giant Crystal

Just hanging there for the entire season like the spirit of Aurora was but larger

[trail drum]

Possibly his child self but who knows what they prepared for us in store

[wintry matrix]

That would be too simmilar to void of shattering.

[grizzled vector]

They already reused a Season Guide for the Season of the Blue Bird though

[trail drum]

Yeah they used granny for the season and dont forget they also reused the spirits to participate in the season

[grizzled vector]

Seriously though, it will probably just be Vault Elder's Other Lantern

Or maybe even the same lantern will just get more season quests added on top

Ok I seriously should go to bed. Take cares lore chat! 🫶

[quick nymph]

Can anyone explain the universe at the end of chapter 4?🤔

[serene pollen]

Aleph is Anakin
Stewie is Luke
Resh is "I am your father"
Lamed is Yoda

[trail drum]

Alef/Resh: Anakin/Vadar

[grizzled vector]

That scene references a whole bunch of symbolism from the game's lore and concept art and the game itself but basically people started to make connections and come together in those final moments, and that kinda parallels how in the world of Sky the souls of living beings ascend and return to The Light/universal consciousness/megabird/whatever you call it before being reborn back on earth

It also probably segways into the beginning of Part 2, which is probably going to start with a shot of the sky (and Dawn Ember falling out of it)

[copper saffron]

I found the ost for two embers part 1 and im not okay

[grizzled vector]

None of us are

[copper saffron]

no wonder its so good the composer worked on anime

[grizzled vector]

Ok seriously though I'm off to sleep. Take cares everyone!

[sharp shore]

Real

[rough anchor]

.. boy oh boy the episode hit hard
But this confirms the squared thingies in vault are memories of ancestors that they left before whatever happened afterwards?

[copper saffron]

in a show with no dialogue the music has to hit hard and it DOES

[river veldt]

ost can be found here: https://www.thatskygame.com/ost/thetwoemberspart1

[serene pollen]

Oreo approved

[serene pollen]

Yeah
It surprises me a few noticed this in Season of Remembrance unless y'all thought it was not cannon or you actually havent done the quests.

(not you specifically btw, and Im also not mad xp just curious)

[serene pollen]

To add to it
These devices are still used, by us skykids whenever we record memories or save up shared spaces.

I will share a doc soon tying all of this together

[rustic flax]

Do we see any seasonal spirits in chapter four of two embers (from any past seasons) and is this the last episode for this season?

[serene pollen]

I havent recognized anyone and idk if someone has, very unlikely tho.

yes last episode

[rustic flax]

Thank you very much for the info!

[serene pollen]

Oh btw I gotta share smth w you all cause I saw someone wearing a cape! Or what looks like it...

[river veldt]

some spirits wear capes, but they're not functional.
ancestors cannot fly.

[peak tangle]

ok so i have a question, if everyone died, who erected the wasteland elder statue??

[wild pasture]

We don't know if everybody died. We just know everybody in that room died. It's possible some last few stragglers erected it as a monument before inevitably meeting their end, as well, some time later. 😔

[wintry matrix]

I can tag you once i finish my thesis about that if you want. I have slightly different explanation for that scene than others

[quick nymph]

Oh my God yes please

[ornate sorrel]

wait we are in the vault. thats sick

[serene pollen]

True, although in Last City we dont see it as common. And I got these two characters who are wearing what looks like a cape. I’ll get better shots from ep 1 (I think) when he was being chased, one of these characters is seen walking by two times actually.

[wintry matrix]

Thats just fabric cape. Our capes are made out of light and that allows us fly. Notice the feather pattern when it is recharging/discharging, thats connection/blessing from the Megabird.

Stargazer (and later Alef) wear cape too but cannot fly with it.

What spirits wear is more like pelerina or poncho rather than functional cape for flying.

[river veldt]

please tag me as well 🙏

[wintry matrix]

I will likely make it either today or tommorow, Im currently still slightly overhelmed and burned out from lorechat so I might need bit more time to process stuff. It will for sure be another google doc and shortly after that on my blog as well.

[trail drum]

Wait a minute...
Look at the first pic, her arms dont have the shard disease, also the capes or ponchos, exact same poncho and same color, thats his mother!!! Alef is wearing not just his mother's brooch but also her poncho!!! Also she looks healthy in the first pic probably before the shard disease happened, in the scene when she puts the brooch on her son's poncho that belonged to her, we see she has shards coming out of her arm, something happened

[wintry matrix]

Yes.

#lore-discussion-spoilers message

#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[trail drum]

Im also wondering who that standing next to Alef and his mother

[river veldt]

rejecting voyager

you see voyager + stargazer sitting together in aviary

[wintry matrix]

It is stargazer and voyager, alefs caretakers.

You can find them in spirit memory too.

[river veldt]

you have a blog?

[wintry matrix]

Yes.

[trail drum]

But the question is, how did his mother get the disease and Alef didnt? In the scene where it seems like Alef is saying goodbye to his mother, the background is dark

[river veldt]

knowing TGC, it must be because of attachment/comfort rather than to make a connection alone

[wintry matrix]

One of the theories says natural calcification. Unlike dying from old age and leaving decomposing body behind, the ancestors calcify when end of their life is near, be it age or sickness.

[trail drum]

Yeah i like to think its to still remember his mother and the poncho she wore, so her memory doesnt fade away

[river veldt]

alef is a skykid
he is more resilient than the ancestors

much unlike how ancestors get one-shot by krills, skykids only get extinguished + lose their WLs when krilled, and not die outright

[wintry matrix]

Please check the message links i sent you

[trail drum]

Sorry if im not aware, im pretty oblivious when someone already mentions it

[wintry matrix]

Is this more obvious then?

[trail drum]

No no not what I mean, I may not explain it in a descriptive and precise way as I might just make it more confusing and plus no one might understand what I mean because I might sound like im just speaking in riddles

I get oblivious about what someone is discussing about

Please dont get confused about what I say, I cant say the right thing let alone say the wrong thing

And before anyone says to "scroll up" or "reread to get better context" im doing my best looking at the messages so im not getting context mixed up

[wintry matrix]

Same scenes, different lighting temperature. It is the same fabric

It changes a lot depending on temperature (none of those two are edited, screenshots straight up from trailers)

[river veldt]

I think Kaleb is confused about something else, and not the cape

[river veldt]

Are you curious about what happened?
Don’t worry, the rest of the lorechat is, too!

While we can’t say for sure what happened, there are a few implications from that scene:

I think it’s the same darkness disease that is spreading in the Last City

And the fact that this disease has always existed, before Alef was crowned king and the atrocities began, shows that darkness has always been a thing

It’s the king that threw light and dark out of balance even further, which led to the end of the world

[copper saffron]

tag me pls too

[serene pollen]

Yup, I am talking about fabric capes not light capes and also not saying they can fly with them, I brought it up because it seems like a rare attire at least there at that time.

Also that poncho is not as similar as those I sent, I get the point but they are not similar, that poncho only looks like a cape when Aleph, w the body of a kid, is wearing it

[copper saffron]

so the running theory is, correct me if im wrong
the child we see in the light side of the two embers, the one with the poncho up there, is actually a skykid, the first of them. The people saw them (him?) as a messiah of sorts and crowned him king. stuff happened, an industrial revolution of sorts, and he threw the light out of balance, causing the darkness to take over and eventually cause the collapse. The eden diamond was a last resort? Of some kind? that backfired and ultimately caused the end.
and memory is stored in darkness, so they used the memory lanterns in vault to record the memories of the people who died. just before they did.
but the darkness also stored the spirits? Like the reason we have the spirits is also because of the darkness?

[plush timber]

ushering stargazer

[pure panther]

Okay now any theories yet about what and who the smoke giants were

[plush timber]

ok but imagine if resh still has ushering's cape.

[pure panther]

These guys that showed up last night

[wintry matrix]

Bug that has nothing to do with lore.

[wintry matrix]

well #lore-discussion-spoilers message

[plush timber]

LUCA WHEN I GET YOU/NRS

[pure panther]

Am I the only one who thought she was trying to collect a little more light from the temple (from other dark stones or maybe resh?) cause the crystals can charge far more than candles, I think, to potentially bring back and heal the manatee. I think maybe the memory was supposed to console them about the finality of the manatees death that was then accepted by the child, but maybe that's just me misinterpreting

[serene beacon]

So we know that all the elders were pretty much implicated in siphoning light towards their goals, some obvious like forest and vault, for prairie it seems they were packing light as butterflies into pots and shipping them around to other areas that used it, for valley the two elders don't seem to use light for a specific purpose but they might have overseen the construction of all the architecture in valley which uses a LOT of darkstone, what about isle and wasteland? Isle elder seems to be directing birds to orbit in their cutscene which seems to actually upholding the cycle of light in the lore, and the wasteland elder is just there

[wintry matrix]

i have been talking about this for past few weeks

[river veldt]

Not everyone is chronically online in lorechat, Luca

[pure panther]

That was a bug??? Seemed like a proper event considering everyone was a bird and we had that emote thing

[wintry matrix]

Wasteland uses light for power and defense. Tsadi seems to have darkstone powered spear just like other guards.

Teth for example works with hands a lot and has darkstones in her palms. Lamed can read minds, as seen in chapter four, and has darkstone on her tablet.

Elders darkstone placemenmt seems to be somewhat related to their powers just like their mask resemble the same power.

Ironically enough, the "elder" whose realm is called EYE of Eden, has darkstone placed where eyes should be.

[wintry matrix]

Devs were likely testing something out, possibly for days of mischief (as we saw other shadowy entities there) and it made its way to live by accident

[pure panther]

Ah, well at least I got a candle out of it

[pure panther]

Also what other entities, I didn't see any others? Got any screenshots?

[wintry matrix]

There are other "oopsies" since last patch updates, like memory lanterns on turtle island, possible for days of moonlight or upcoming season quest (remember the last one put us back to present).

[wintry matrix]

Dark shadows from days of mischief. The same ones you can find in fire trial.

[pure panther]

Ohhh

[river veldt]

Actually, what do the dark stones on spears do?

We have never seen the spear stones’ powers in action

[pure panther]

Are they all still active or patched now?

[pure panther]

Possibly absorb more light from the creatures to further weaken them maybe, or maybe make the soldier's blows stronger, or both

[wintry matrix]

In Tsadi cutscene we give light to his spear which powers him up and allows him to fight again. With that logic, it likely powers up the person holding it.

[pure panther]

So it's sort of like the hextech crystals from arcane

[wintry matrix]

The lanterns are still there. The one OOB in seasonal area was put behind wind wall in last hotfix update.

[wintry matrix]

I dont know arcane so I cant compare.

[river veldt]

Giving light to elders always power them up, even in the absence of dark stones

See daleth and ayin

[pure panther]

Ohh

[pure panther]

If you like sky and you like steampunk and action you should definitely watch arcane

[river veldt]

In Arcane, someone tried to save the world with the crystal, but got corrupted by it in the process

Same thing that happened to Resh

[pure panther]

Not to mention turning things evil and monstrous

[river veldt]

Hence ‘corrupted’

[pure panther]

Damn I should watch arcane again, it's strangely what got me into sky

[river veldt]

Anyway, i doubt dark stones on spears power up the wielder

But making strikes more destructive? I can see that happening

[wintry matrix]

Yes. But we specially give the power to his spear and not him. For example Teth snatches it from us with her bare palms (where she has the darkstone by the way), Ayin also grabs the flames from the candles. Daleth grabs the flame with his staff, those staffs can be found in other realms too and were used to carry the embers. There was concept art showing it in action more than the isle elder cutscene but i cant find it now unfortunately. Lamed wants us to give the light to the darkstone rather than her which kinda maes sense considering she needs it to record memories. Twins do whatever but it seems that their paddles are powered by our flame and rthey grab it with it too.

[wintry matrix]

Could also work to suck more light if it impales light creature

[river veldt]

How would the stone power up the wielder, if the wielder is a light creature, like Tsadi?

We’ve also seen that stones are even more detrimental to ancestors. Recluse immediately got sick after knocking over the siphoner. This is probably why the stone had to be put on the blade of the spear: to create distance so that the wielder is not harmed.

[lost pecan]

Might I suggest: at least one of the races in the Valley involved the ancestors riding light creatures(specifically mantas). It's possible that the Twins take their jobs as Elders just a little less seriously since their realm is dedicated to enjoyment and revelry more than anything else, and the way they play a literal game with our light kinda shows this

[wintry matrix]

Maybe it is special darkstone or theres some other magic behind it. We can see not all darkstones drain the light or not that much. Memory lanterns for example are powered by darkstones too and they dont actively drain light or cause harm. If you consider memories and everything we saw happen in vault in chapter four to be light then yes it might to some degree "suck" light but it is unlikely. It still glows so it is not dead darkstone like that shard Stewie picked up. And both Lamed and Stewie are light creatures as well.

Just like Lamed "connects" with her forehead darkstone to read minds, maybe Tsadi connects with the one in spear to gain more power. Needless to say, he did gain power from us lighting the spear and him grabbing it, not us giving the light to him.

[river veldt]

perhaps, it is precisely due to the fact that stewie and lamed are light creatures, that they are relatively unharmed by darkness?

edit:

skykids and elders are stronger than regular light creatures, that's for sure
they don't instantly die to krills

[wintry matrix]

That goes aganist what we saw it do to the manatees.

[river veldt]

skykids and elders are stronger than regular light creatures, that's for sure
they don't instantly die to krills

[river veldt]

i also want to learn more about this!

was that stone pre-charged with light, or did lamed have some special ability to power up dark stones directly?
(unlike skykids, who have to light dark stone mechanisms with their flame to power it up?)

.
i got some answers!
one unserious, one serious

thank you @sharp heart and @zinc sandal

[wintry matrix]

The krills do indded seem to turn on the activated towers in thrid quest, I did notice that too

[sharp heart]

i was semi serious with the krill repellant thing, the light from the towers was holding back darkness

[serene beacon]

It seems wasteland got the short end of the stick in regards to the distribution of darkstones, all the piping and corruption when we see it in the present and very little in terms of darkstones structurally, wasteland feels like it was a hub to siphoning and processing light for other realms to use, and obviously taking that much light required defense from dark creatures and that's all that darkstones were delegated to for wasteland
What about daleth though? Like I said he is seen using the light to guide the birds to the sky, which seems like he's upholding the cycle of light rather than exploiting it

[river veldt]

• also in episode 3.
  Sentry was face to face with a krill, and it was about to charge, but the lit beacon diverted the krill's attention & saved their life

I think it’s because the stones are charged with light. Krills seek out light.

[river veldt]

THIS MAKES SO MUCH SENSE NOW.

in modern-day battlefield, lighting the dark stone at the podium opens up the gate to the temple, but it also releases 3 krills.
the krills must've been drawn to the lit dark stone.

[sharp heart]

krills were the real moths all along

[river veldt]

how to bait moth:

1. bring fire prop
2. wait for moth to go light it
3. profit

how to bait krill:

1. activate dark stone
2. wait for krills to seek out the light
3. profit

[dull night]

I have a theroy about the dark stone. What if they used to mine natural dark stone, like what we see now in Parie Peaks and in the aroura concert where we are jellyfish. But they ran out and had to make artificial darkstone from the light of the world and animals of light like the mantas and butterfly

[zinc sandal]

yea pretty sure we knew krills are drawn to light for a while now, tte just confirmed it

[river veldt]

so, it's less 'holding back', and more 'attracting'

explains why the beacons are built at the outskirts of the city
and they let the outer ring of beacons die before the inner ones do

(the ones near the temple are shining very brightly throughout ep3 & didn't die until ep4.)
(meanwhile, the outer ones kept on dying in ep3.)

[zinc sandal]

dang now i wonder if they're also drawn to eachother cuz of their searchlight

we never see 2 krills in an area, it's either 1 lone krill or 3+ in an area at once i'm pretty sure but i may be wrong

[river veldt]

there has to be a difference between light (illumination) and light (life force)
krills are likely attracted to the latter, not the former

[zinc sandal]

they're territorial too tho so i dunno if that wouldn't lead to fighting between them

imagine you're collecting wax only to see 2 krills in graveyard fighting to the death over 2cm of land

[river veldt]

since you know about krills a 'normal' amount:

do any of the krill paths overlap?
(of course, two krills can't patrol at the same place at the same time, but can one krill wander into another krill's path while the latter is not around?)

[wintry matrix]

Couple of other possibilites:

Potency:
Maybe the darkstones used for absorbing light are more potent (stronger) than the ones used in weapons. Just like you have different kinds of radiation or different qualities of gold. Something like that.

Size:
The stones used for light absorbtion are noticeably larger than the small gems in the weapons. Tsadi obviously has bigger one but maybe it is just "equal to his size", maybe if he was big as regual ancestor or wasnt light creature (or both), the stone on his spear would be deadly to him too.

The "chosen ones"
We dont know when exactly elders got their darkstones. It could be during darkstone era, it could be during fire era, who knows. Maybe their darkstones are not the same darkstones used anywhere else. Dont forget they were always elders, they were tasked by megabird to guide little Alef the Chosen One. Maybe megabird gifted them those stones, either from the begining or later.

It lowkey reminds me of visions and delusions from genshin. If a god gazes upon you, you obtain vision that grants you elemental powers. It does not harm you. But those who are not lucky enough can use delusions, artifically created visions that work the same, but they rapidly drain your life force. Vision holders are more (but not completely) resistant to delusions.

Artifically created (ties to chosen ones)
Humans are able to simulate certain conditions with modern technology to create synthetic diamonds. Maybe originally the darkstones were harmelss once charged with light, just like the unrefined darkstones in peaks are. Unrefined darkstones also glow unlike the completely dead ones.
The industrial boom quickly made darkstone ore scarce, so the ancestors might have figure out how to make synthetic darkstone (they were also experimenting on and possibly trying to create synthetic light creatures too as seen in treasure reef) but with downside of it being "radioactive" and deadly.

[sharp heart]

i like this, but how does that work with the twins?
yippe genshin menshin

[zinc sandal]

yeah i got diagnosed with mental krillness at 3

anyway pretty sure there are 2 krill paths that overlap or come close to overlapping in graveyard, i'm talking the krill that comes near respectful pianist and the krill patrolling the big dark tree but they never set foot on the other's land when the other can see it happen, or at least i've never seen it happen

[river veldt]

Found this map
https://twitter.com/lyjii/status/1186300099128774657

The paths don't seem to overlap; they stay at the edge of each other's territory without trespassing

[zinc sandal]

can we talk about the clean friendly krills tho i love these little guys

and no they aren't fake as the krill hat star feature works on them (tested during days of mischief)

they're real krills but no longer stinky and well fed

domesticated krills! found in office during DoM

[sharp heart]

theres kind krills? where???

[wintry matrix]

ah I was about to send it to you. The source is here: https://x.com/lyjii/status/1186300099128774657

Reddit is just repost without credit.

[river veldt]

there is credit, if you scroll down to the comments

[zinc sandal]

yeah u gotta wait for days of mischief but yes they do exist, on top of the office like 3 of them fly around, they invade eachother's territory and u can fly over them and they don't mind ya, they're sweethearts

we need to start a "clean and feed krills" movement they all deserve love and we now know that they can in fact be domesticated

[wintry matrix]

Heres also link to the original message: #questions-and-help message

Heres also map of battlefield krill from same people: #questions-and-help message

[river veldt]

wow! i never knew the krills wander so far away.

[zinc sandal]

i think i had clips/photos of them somewhere actually, i'll try to find them, if not we'll have to wait till days of mischief

[wintry matrix]

here is map of Eden krills as well by ezpz (eula1998 on reddit)

higher quality: https://imgur.com/a/sky-eye-of-eden-maps-ke4wqRW

Forgotten Ark krill just goes in circles, no need of map for that.

[wintry matrix]

I heard they got removed or made agressive last year.

[zinc sandal]

did they? i think i did go messing around with them last year aswell, i dunno then

[wintry matrix]

Speaking of krills, I have this to share, I dont think they can really be domesticated in any way. Office is not real place in sky kingdom either, anything is possible in office.

Source is official japanese sky twitter post: https://x.com/thatskygameJP/status/1284314533440311296

The concept art states them to not be evil but also really hungry. Which can go with the theory someone presented here, that krills are natural part of darkness just like mantas are natural part of light.

Theres also first idea of them being based on shrimp.

It could mean that whatever ancestors created in treasure reef was not krill but rather leviathan and its darkness worms we see during days of nature.

[zinc sandal]

yeah artbook also says that aswell, the artbook also calls gw a place where dark dragons "nest" which further proves that they aren't exactly artificial, but i do like to imagine that they WERE at first created by the ancients to be killing machines but after everything died they started mutating and somehow developed the ability to reproduce, based off the fact in tte they are fast and viscous, the second it sees you you're done for, but now they're quite slow and sluggish in comparison

and in nature if something isn't needed it slowly fades away, meaning krills were so powerful that, over the generations, they lost their true strength because they had no competition for food and are much tamer than they once were

[deep ingot]

Learning this much about the lore and seeing the episodes has drastically changed my opinion of Golden Wasteland.

It used to be my least favourite realm but now I find it so tragically beautiful. I want to spend so much time there in-game now. I hardly ever used to.

[deep ingot]

So to confirm, this IS the Vault elder in the episodes ?

[zinc sandal]

(forgive me for my dusty switch haven't used it in a year) RAHH I KNEW I HAD THEM SOMEWHERE!!! ( @sharp heart @river veldt cmere besties pspspspsps)

friendly krills from a year ago with anniversary hats! curiously after i scanned my keychain it showed a "network error" but idc it worked so these are REAL krills so while office is not exatcly "canon" they CAN be friendly, we just don't know what causes them to be friendly...

[sharp heart]

its the devs immaculate vibes

[zinc sandal]

(sorry luca didn't know you don't like being pinged!)

maybe but let me believe my little babies can be saved from endless hunger

[wintry matrix]

(its more liek that the ping is not really related to me)

[zinc sandal]

(ah, alr!! i replied to your message cuz these screenshots are from last year to clear up what ya said about them being removed as they weren't!)

[deep ingot]

Is there a reason why we only see Krills at Golden Wasteland / Eden ?

Technically all cities fell to the darkness but the Krills seem to have settled in and stayed in those two realms ?

Is it because in our present times the light / light creatures have done work to keep the Krills out of realms like Daylight Prairie ?

[zinc sandal]

it's probably because darkness needs, well, darkness and moisture to thrive, kinda like mold
golden wasteland is polluted, dark and moist as seen by all the dark water

eden too has waterfalls and is dark

[wintry matrix]

Eden "waterfalls" are actually just waste water from the pipes.

[zinc sandal]

waste water still do be water tho!

[wintry matrix]

Just pointing out it is not really waterfalls.

[zinc sandal]

true true

anyway eden is also the original home of the krills so maybe some krills just never migrated to other realms and stayed where they were born or lived for most of their lives

but for wasteland it's because it's dark and moist, dark dragons even are covered in the grime and are constantly dripping with it, they even rise from it when spawning aswell

so krills like to stay hydrated, we should be more like krills and stay hydrated tbh, remember to drink water folks!

[river veldt]

At the end of quest 4, it fast-forwards us to the present, and the placement of the WL is suspiciously close to where our character + the manatee + the spear is

https://x.com/yukitotakahashi/status/1954882262383956243?s=46&t=MYDLcMXKBObZsJ1MRpy0iw

[plush timber]

this!! Plus lowkey learning not being afraid of krills

[mellow marten]

Hey I realized if a forth dimensional beings examine Skykids in particular, they're can't exactly see their past and future them right?

Cause in the end, they are not mortals- they're Vessels. And they all generally not made of fleshes- just pure light within and a 'artifical' body from a dying star leftover, time don't necessary impact present Skykids (who have to go through the eternal cycle) because of a paradox, their body is 'young' but their soul continues to 'age', making it impossible for Any fourth dimensional beings to actually see what those Skykids are in the past or future, only the Memories hold in their soul can show the truth. have fun with that little thought

[scenic pebble]

what the hell are you talking 'bout
they have a past, present and a future. just because they don't age doesn't mean time doesn't pass for them

[wintry matrix]

i was about to say something and then i remembered i didnt say it on this server lol

[mellow marten]

I meant their physical form- like they do, just not a way it is perceive as normally- they don't age but time does pass, they just exists in... The present. I really need to get better at words- or I should really go to sleep soon

[noble ferry]

Yeah i think that's a sign that you may need to head to bed 😭

[wintry matrix]

hi neko

[noble ferry]

Luca hi!

Planning on updating my resh lore doc soon.
Gotta double check some stuff especially stuff related to the supposed civil war

[plush timber]

Reah lore doc??

[wintry matrix]

do you need any refference pictures? im working on analysis of last chapter rn, there was lots of hints to lots of stuff

[noble ferry]

Nah i'm fine 👍

[noble ferry]

Oh yeah i have a lore doc around resh but it is outdated with the release of two embers :(
And i still have to figure out the image not uploading issue too

[wintry matrix]

hey @narrow marsh

you cant really see it on daylight

[grizzled vector]

I don't think darkstone works like that. My impression is that it absorbs Light (the "life force") but only releases light (illumination). Like, it may still release energy in some form but I doubt it would heal anyone, let alone resurrect them

[scenic pebble]

why does the second picture look bald?

[river veldt]

Because light creatures are smooth and bald
Not a single hair on them

[wintry matrix]

turn the screen on /lh

[versed trout]

If manatees can levitate then why do they just kind of chill out in pens as if they were cattle? When doing the recent quest, I noticed manatees flying far above other structures, yet they still seemingly allow themselves to be imprisoned within fences, no taller than they are.

[scenic pebble]

sorry, i meant that it looks like it's balding

[versed trout]

If living things are turned into energy, there’s gotta be some way to keep the manatees from flying or something. What I’m confused about is these manatees weren’t tied down they were just kind of floating freely but still go into the pen in the quest.

[wintry matrix]

Shepherd raised those manatees from calves, so its possible that they just want to be there cuz they know they are safe and fed.

Other theory says that because they are domesticated, they cant fly that good and high like wild ones.

[versed trout]

I guess that makes sense, but I’m also wondering like what kind of planet this is or if there’s even a planet at all and this is some sort of heaven space, we’re the only thing really constant is gravity and even that’s loosely dependent on certain things liek charactwrs

In the end credits of the game it looks as if it’s in space but I’m just really confused. Maybe it’s some sort of ancient space station? The overall style of the game just sort of confuses me. They have all of this advanced technology and transportation methods, but it all looks ancient and built from primitive materials. Perhaps an apocalypse happened in the past and they’re just reusing old technology with only materials available because their race got “reset”? Another thing is how do they eat or communicate? Are they born with the mask on, and because there’s children does that insinuate that they’re born in someway?

[wintry matrix]

Lorechat estimated the etmosphere density to be much densier than on Earth based on how light reflects in game. The gravity also seems to be lower, close to Moon one, based on how us and various things bounce around. Think of it as super thick atmosphere and low gravity on Pandora, big creatures on Pandora can also fly thanks to those two factors (canon according to guide book). Manatees are also creatures of light and so are we, the physics doesnt really apply to us.

Hi Ayn

[versed trout]

So are characters kind of just born from light? Sorry if these are really stupid basic questions I haven’t really talked to anybody about lot in this channel

[wintry matrix]

End credits are Orbit which yeah, it is "space" but more akin to mental space rather than actual vacuum.

[serene pollen]

Idk enough to confirm smth about that but at the credits after Orbit and before reincarnation, we can see a planet right next to the core of Megabird (the sun?)

[pallid jetty]

the concept of megabird is that it is a cluster of stars

[pale estuary]

Hi hello lorechat
Please tell me the ||kid we hug at the end of Eden before going to orbit|| is the King of Eden who's trapped inside the crystal itself

[celest birch]

Welcome. 🫂

[wintry matrix]

Not all characters. Crabs for example are neutral creatures and so do seem to be ancestors as well. They might have some light in them as we see them being affected by darkstone, but they are still grounded creatures, the "normal" ones. While light creatures are made out of light and born from the Light / Megabird. Their flesh is made out of light too. We are light creatures as well and everything we wear is made out of light, we copy what ancestors wore. Elders are also light creatures. Dark dragons/krill are dark creatures.

[wintry matrix]

We dont know yet.

[pale estuary]

It'll just be poetic if we (the player) is actually the reincarnation of Dusk. And we're the one who saved them from the Eden crystal after the Shattering happened

[serene pollen]

Not confirmed but very likely
There's a lot of clues that point to being him

[pallid jetty]

there is a lot of interpretations for that one, my favourite is that it is the your last skykid that got stuck in eden and its an endless loop of you saving yourself

[wintry matrix]

Dusk live reaction:

[pale estuary]

Wow, that's actually a good one, but before we know the story of the two embers

[wintry matrix]

you might be interested in those two theories

the "two parts of yourself" paradox theory: #lore-discussion-spoilers message

body of steward, soul of resh theory: #lore-discussion-spoilers message #lore-discussion-spoilers message

[pale estuary]

Thankyou!!

[serene pollen]

Wait we are hybrid
not just pure light
I mean the essence is pure light, but the body is the aspect of darkness manifested?

Wait how? Well when light forms patterns, shadows form, and those shadows are what we see as matter. And if you don't wanna believe that well then ask them why they put us in the middle in the Light-Darkness Connection Spectrum?

[wintry matrix]

Why would our body be darkness?

[pale estuary]

Because we turn to stone when out of light? (Life)

[pale estuary]

Anyways, I like your theories aswell. I can't wait for the 2nd part of the two embers.... Whenever that may be

[wintry matrix]

Complete calcification is result of the darkstones growing on the body, we can see that happening on other light creatures, it is not only ancestors who get affected by that. We eventually succumb to lack of light and change from "liquid" state to "solid" one.

Ancestors are also statues after we relive their memory. Even the two embers eventually turned into stone as seen in PNR. They are only statues without darkness on them and we also dont get any darkness on us when we petrify.

[serene pollen]

I will share a doc soon. But just look at this concept art image we have seen before

[tall chasm]

Maybe that kid is actually the Stewie who is roleplaying in two embers

[versed trout]

But how do characters in the films communicate? My best guess is semi-telepathic dialogue with basic noises to accentuate an emotion, like laughter.

[wintry matrix]

Yes I know what you mean. That hybrid concept art comes from early light awaits era when the entire rebirth process and everything around it was little bit different, there were supposed to be "ghost kids" and more variety overall and since then we learned that elders come from same origin as we do (megabird) from official japanese livestream. That concept art still portrays them along ancestors. It also lacks any dark creatures outside darkstone. The more canon way of explaining this could be this: #lore-discussion-spoilers message

[versed trout]

So how do they eat things, or do they need to? Is food optional? Like the characters in the movie I mean

[tall chasm]

I think they mostly are like Prehistoric person, can understand each other with actions I guess

[versed trout]

I’m also confused with the mask is even from, the emotes in games suggest that they probably had an advanced visual communication, but that doesn’t explain the noise expressions

[tall chasm]

I think they have the power of absorbing, like u know how skykids absorb wax

[versed trout]

I guess my scientific mind is going crazy trying to figure out how this works in a biological sense but I’m finding that this is a video game not real life

[tall chasm]

Of all things, I wonder how they are actually born to begin with?

[wintry matrix]

They do have some form of written language as we can see on some vault acolytes and vault elder tablets, however most of the "written language" are pictograms and murals. They seem to be communicating mostly nonverbal with chance of telepathic communication to some degree, possibly also in nonverbal way (projecting pictures of actions into other person mind). We seen vault elder do that in chapter 4 and it is yet to be confirmed if it is unique trait or other ancestors can do so too.

[versed trout]

I agree, but that also doesn’t explain why some NPC‘s in the new daily quest seem to be “talking”, they appear to just be standing there, having a conversation the player cannot hear

[tall chasm]

Prolly its an understanding like how deaf ppl talk to each other

[wintry matrix]

Telepathy then likely. Lot of things can be said with just body language and facial expressions, even eyes alone can tell lot of things. Autistic people do that and it works.

[narrow marsh]

That’s incredible, good catch

[wintry matrix]

hi tom

[versed trout]

But I think it’s likely a complex telepathic language to a degree allowing them to build such a complex civilization

[wintry matrix]

There are ton of murals and pictograms everywhere, that might have been main source of their non-casual conversations. Ancestors are way more "religious" than huimans are, they worshipped the light for ages and the light might have guided them rather than "spoken" word between each individual.

[sharp shore]

Id say the elders mainly do that, the regular people really do talk (though its muffled in chapters)

[narrow marsh]

Multiple planets are there, actually!

#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[tawdry delta]

Also we hear chatter in fest tech, like people are talking

[versed trout]

Yeah that’s what I was about to mention, but based on how when you do a loud honk with the player, the surrounding characters shush you and act surprised as if they don’t usually hear that.

My guess is that characters are capable of making loud sounds, but they preferred telepathy because it’s easier. As for how, I’m not sure,

[wintry matrix]

You can hear lot of stuff in those "chatter" background noises, even police siren in Last city. Chances are TGC recorded random urban sounds and then made them muffled to barely sound like spoken words and other things and added them to game like that. It wont be first instance of this happening, Spore does the same thing.

[sharp shore]

Now i wanna try spam emoting a kid with their mom (after doing q1 or 2 not the doom and gloom part) to see how they react

[sharp shore]

Indeed

You gotta admit they planted it so that it fits the lore

[versed trout]

Earlier I was walking up to random groups NPC‘s

[tawdry delta]

Well I mean
If someone walked up to you in the street and just went
AAAAAA

[wintry matrix]

screaming =/= talking

[sharp shore]

NOOOOOO TOMTE GOT BEANED

nevermind

[narrow marsh]

I personally believe so but we can’t be completely sure of anything, some theorists believe entities like crabs and Ancestors are ‘neutral’ because they have less Light in them. In my eyes, their affinity for not being able to fly or use their inner Light well is not because they don’t have their own Light, but because their body is made of a lot of earthen material. On the Spectrum of “physical vs. metaphysical” that dictates Sky’s world, that ‘earthen material’ translates to ‘darkness’. (Since it is not Light.)

Much to think about! 🕯️

[versed trout]

This is what I was talking about with the NPC‘s reacting

[sharp shore]

Damn even the sick people react?

I recommend doing the narcissist gloat emote around them, they hate it

[versed trout]

Am I relatively new to test this? Probably not.

[wintry matrix]

Yes we know they react. They even react differently based on what emotes you use near them. Kids, adults and soldiers all have different reactions to different things.

[sharp shore]

Now i dont really feel like bothering them considering yknow

I know its just a game but damn tgc

[wintry matrix]

You can get the gloat emote in starlit desert after you have been in eden atleast once.

[serene pollen]

I'll go w this one:

this one is meant to be current sky kids while the second one is closer to what alef and elders likely are, still light creatures but more like proto-sky kids, they were unable to fly like us

another explanation of this could be that in current state of lore, the "hybrids" though not being hybrids or descendants anymore are meant to be skids while the "connected" one is what we become while ascending to orbit, pure form of light without any bodythis one is meant to be current sky kids while the second one is closer to what alef and elders likely are, still light creatures but more like proto-sky kids, they were unable to fly like us

another explanation of this could be that in current state of lore, the "hybrids" though not being hybrids or descendants anymore are meant to be skids while the "connected" one is what we become while ascending to orbit, pure form of light without any body

[versed trout]

To me it’s entertaining

[wintry matrix]

The manatee also reacts to you, it lays down all sad until it sees you, then it starts wagging tail. It does that after you open the gate or after standing outside near the fence for a while (you have to be in its field of vision). After you turn your back to it and do 3 or more steps away, it lays down all sad again.

[narrow marsh]

Well, all of the random people in the City use that cough emote

[narrow marsh]

Oh, to ponder why the transformative substance takes on many forms across multiple extremes 🕯️

[narrow marsh]

Growing on the body, maybe. But as the Deficiency theory suggested, it may also be from the body

[grizzled vector]

Dang it didn't even occur to me to use the narcissist emote next to people in those quests. Not surprised they hate it 😂

[sharp shore]

I think its from personally

Btw brb im gonna make my friend watch the chapters with me

[wintry matrix]

Oh we see it growing under the skin in movie too. #lore-discussion-spoilers message

[wintry matrix]

tgc made whole season about sick boogie kid just to have excuse to introduce the coughing emote

[trail drum]

Thank you, now that clears it up

[brisk python]

me, trying to figure out what chapter 4's ending is all about-

[narrow marsh]

Oh geez…. Definitely not “on” then, how gruesome….

[trail drum]

Since people are mentioning the ending, the ending almost looks similar to basically the ending credits of the game, it zooms out to show orbit and all of the creatures and skykids who have all Ascended to orbit and as the credits roll Orbit gets farther and farther away to the point we see an entire constellation of galaxies, it just seemed very familiar when I saw the ending of Chapter 4

[celest birch]

You know, 2E-season is actually using almost every previous season´s assets since at least Abyss.

[celest birch]

Now that you´ve said it, absolutely ... and the situation Dusk Ember was in with these people when they shared light is almost exactly matching our situation in Storm Lock.

We know we´ll die and there´s no stopping it. But before we do, we can save the Lost Ones with our own (winged) light, so that they might ascend to Orbit with us.

[wintry matrix]

Im surprised no one still made same connection as I did, heh. Be ready to have your mind blown once I finish that thesis

[celest birch]

Also, Storm (Eden) Lock (portcullis of the Temple).

"PNR" also fits as well, since once back at the Temple, that truly is a point of no return anymore.

[celest birch]

Heh and honestly, you know all these "regular" outfits we see people (+ sentries) wear? I´m really imagining it that maybe later down the line we´ll actually able to get them ourselves.

[wintry matrix]

I do hope this outfit is cosmetic from dawn season, I really like that one

i can already see the dyeable areas being the scarf and stripes on the scarf

[trail drum]

I wonder if those outfits were for the students that were learning something

[wintry matrix]

it does look like school

[deep ingot]

Thank you !! ✨ I appreciate the welcome.

[trail drum]

And there are lots of butterflies coming out of the pots, I wonder if that scholar/teacher is teaching them about something

[unreal wren]

Could be teaching about the light cycle

[trail drum]

Probably, looks like some kind of academy these kids are in and look at the hairstyles of the kids

[spiral vault]

THE LOSS

[wintry matrix]

might be the same school where alef was sent to before the trrials

[copper saffron]

PLEASE I NEED THAT AS A COSMETIC

[trail drum]

Oh! Would make sense! But why send a child to do these trials in the first place? You think they had the idea of sending a child to do the trials? And why Alef out of everyone else who would do the trial?

[wintry matrix]

They had prophecy about Chosen One and were trying to find who it is.

[spiral vault]

I don't think that scene directly showed that everyone died. I'm not sure. It kinda shows that thanks to Hopeful Steward's connection, they are all working together to help the Light

[trail drum]

Oh sure yeah, the typical "the chosen one is the child who is VEEEEEERY special apart from everyone else who isnt special" of course pick a child who had their entire life to live a normal life like every other child, nope drag him into this because he is the "chosen one"

[spiral vault]

I think this is basically true. But the darkness petrified the spirits, kind of like what happens in pompeii, where they're frozen in time

[copper saffron]

that's even scarier. they’ve been calcified and ig stuck in their stone prison, and you free them with your light when you relive their memories.

[versed trout]

You know, I just find it fascinating that characters gender is really only described by context, like their hairstyles, clothes, or vocal expressions

[copper saffron]

I love this game but man
behind the cutesy family friendly exterior you get

[celest birch]

You know, seeing that outfit it makes me think of Remembrance Guide.

[serene pollen]

Oh wow
I want it too
Specially if its gonna look oversized on my chibi self

[celest birch]

You´re never alone in GW. ^-^

[brisk python]

chapter 4 made me love prophet elder so much 😭

[wintry matrix]

But Sedd of Hope is. Standin alone in the field.

Not all wanderers are lost but he sure is

[celest birch]

I absolutely think it´s Vault scholars, since the Vault door was open.

[celest birch]

Well, given their AURORA quest I wouldn´t be surprised that they died there later down the line. </3

[wintry matrix]

Bro woke up 500 years later and wonders where his house go

[celest birch]

Just like how I think that Tender Toymaker died inside the Medical Center as well, which we can see as "Battlefield Citadel" 😭

[celest birch]

Even better is that if you relive the AURORA quest with them, they disappear!

[copper saffron]

wait why and since when has this spirit just been there

[spiral vault]

My friend told me their resh lore video is actually pretty accurate still, the only thing is the name of "ruler"

[spiral vault]

That happens to all light creatures, doesn't it?

[spiral vault]

I have to wonder though, if Resh really was a skykid, then the chosen one takes on a different meaning. It makes the chosen one prophecy be technically right- there is indeed a child separate from the rest- but it's pointless as the civilization crumbles from the darkness anyways

[pure panther]

Maybe Stewie didn't know that, they are a kid after all and not raised in the same economic class as the soldiers and those who use dark stone the most often, but I digress as it's less likely than your interpretation

[wintry matrix]

lemme just slide this here #lore-discussion-spoilers message

[pure panther]

In religion and mythology the concept of the chosen one is not always positive, with some chosen ones being those to bring about the end of a civilization or of humanity and/or earth itself. Whether intentional or not, it's a sort of self fulfilling prophecy as maybe this happened despite resh's attempts at the opposite with what he believed was his prophecy

Also it's a trope in alot of mythology that the way in which a chosen one fulfills the prophecy is always less clear and more convoluted than initially thought, sometimes achieving the opposite before they achieve what they need to

[tawdry delta]

What's everyone's opinion on Tsadi being the Scarred Sentry

[wintry matrix]

Hes not.

[tawdry delta]

O ok ;-;

[wintry matrix]

Elders were always elders since they came to exist. Scarred sentry is not elder. Final shattering memory and beta version of The Seed shows Tsadi already being present at this time.

[grizzled vector]

Ok but that's from a livestream from six years ago. It is possible that they have changed their mind on it since then. Whatever existed in beta is definitely not canon one way or another

[cobalt palm]

Could this be the resting place of our dear manatee memory?

[grizzled vector]

I think it's unlikely that the Sentry is in fact Wasteland Elder but... they could have decided to do that and they could do it if they wanted to 🤷

The season's quest almost implies it at this point tbh

To the point where if they decide to clarify that that's not what happened then they'd have to introduce an explanation for what that statue was and how it came to be there and I'm not sure there's enough story time left to do that

[wintry matrix]

Considering|| Lamed 500 years ago model ||exists in game it would not make sense to have ||two "kinds" of models|| in same season. Plus Tsadi doesnt have scar on his eye.

[grizzled vector]

In any case, it's going to be hard to be sure one way or another until Part 2 concludes

[grizzled vector]

||It could make sense if they specifically wanted to keep it ambiguous, or as a plot twist. Or even for stylistic consistency, because the original Elder models are several years old now and would look out of place next to the ones from the more recent seasons||

[wintry matrix]

No it really doesnt make sense from design perspective. That stream might have happened 6 years ago but season of shattering was 3 years ago and shows the same models.

[tawdry delta]

If that's at Vault summit it could be :O

[tawdry delta]

We can't see around Tsadi's eyes much. Because he has a faceplate.

[wintry matrix]

we can very much do?

[grizzled vector]

The models could be updated later if they decided that's what they wanted to do all. They "retcon" Sky geography all the time when they add new season areas (or even just move stuff for no reason)

[tawdry delta]

I can see sod all of his eyes he looks like lego batman

[grizzled vector]

We see low-poly diamond eyes. That's not really proof of much one way or another. On that level of detail they wouldn't have bothered with adding a scar just for the sake of keeping the poly count low

[wintry matrix]

Thats not how tgc does models. You cant observe him in cutscene much but you can on orbit an he looks the same on orbit too. All other elders have details you cant normally see in cutscenes either.

[trail drum]

You need help putting a moth to sleep? Here I'll help you

Go to sleep, go to sleep

Help😭

[grizzled vector]

Point is, if they decided that Sentry getting "ascended" to an Elder made more sense from a narrative perspective, they could do that, and from the real-life storytelling perspective it would make sense for them to do that if it makes for a better story, instead of adding some other convoluted explanation for how that altar got there and why it had the sun shield, and so on and so forth, just to make sure they don't contradict that one Japanese livestream from 2019 that most Sky players have no clue about

They straight up changed the intro that the new player sees when first creating an account. And they may have done it more than once by now, for all I know. They have changed the Aviary to be the "home" they land at from the start. I wouldn't be surprised if they are willing to straight up retcon what's explicitly in game, let alone stuff that was only mentioned in lore-related chats out of game

The original concept for the Elders was different but the original concept for the Elders was them being some corrupted half-animal demigods and a lot of things have been changed or scrapped since then, so I don't really see why they couldn't change who the Elders are as well at this point

[wintry matrix]

It literally doesnt make sense, buddy. You are just spitting "what if" nonsense. We can see wasteland elder on prophecy murals, many years before darkstone era even started and even more years before we came to the memory.

If wasteland elder did not exist back then he wouldnt be included in the murals and no one would get the red light.

[grizzled vector]

We can see a lot of stuff on the Prophecy murals years before they happened. That's kinda the point of them being Prophecy murals

[wintry matrix]

This mural visibly shows people arriving on the mountain for the first time before vault of knowledge existed. Tsadi is on the same mural. He WAS elder during fire era already. Scarred sentry is NOT wasteland elder.

Every other instances of eden being on mural always shows vault inside it.

[grizzled vector]

Those doodles could be anything and mean anything, and for all we know could be changed or retconned at any point. All I'm gonna say is, I think that strictly from the storytelling point of view, Sentry becoming an Elder would make at least as much sense as Dusk becoming Steward. But in any case, until any of it is explicitly confirmed all of it is personal opinion and up to interpretation

[normal ermine]

The prophecy murals depict that "whoever completes all of the trials, would be seen as the ruler of the kingdom."

The elders gave the power needed to rule after all the trials were completed.

(I'm just yapping)

[wintry matrix]

@grizzled vector You are denying the literal ingame proof. This "doodle" has wasteland constellation. Second one is same person from different angle.

[normal ermine]

Dorito with a STICK

[wintry matrix]

"We must defeat the dark dragons!" ahh pose

[restive locust]

Hehe tsadi looks like he’s having a shouting match with his constellation

[celest birch]

He is embodying the virtues of the Elder after he regains his bravery back. :)

One might not be the Elder oneself, but who says that they can´t be just like one in their choices and acts?

[grizzled vector]

It could be Sentry before becoming an Elder. It could be one of the earlier rulers/chiefs/whatever of the Wasteland realm. The idea that that's specifically the same exact Elder who always existed is not directly proven or disproven by any of those murals

[plush timber]

oh people are arguing abt sentry being an elder

[celest birch]

After seeing both Chapter and Quest 4, I´m pretty certain that Scarred Sentry asked themselves "What would Tsadi do in this situation?" and acted within their personality hints.

Which do show them to be a much nicer person than their intimidating outer appearance might lead you to believe. 🥺

[plush timber]

OH. thats pretty cool ngl

[celest birch]

They might not be Tsadi, but their actions are like Tsadi´s, based off Wasteland Elder cutscene.

Almost as if Wasteland Elder is their role model/inspiration.

[wintry matrix]

Tsadi could be sentry teacher. Just like ayin was to flight guide and teth was to nesting guide.

[celest birch]

Y E S

[wintry matrix]

Its definitely not Tsadi incarnation at any point in time.

[celest birch]

That is ABSOLUTELY possible, given their connection with the Elder statue; they might as well be their apprentice for all we know. :D

And no kidding, especially given the Elders-memory from Shattering; Tsadi probably didn´t show up because they be with other Elders at the Ruler´s area. 👀

[wintry matrix]

If stew lived longer Im positive Lamed would be their teacher. That leaves only twins without any students then Maybe they teach owl twins (triplets if we count thoughtful director in but I hc thats just younger performance guide and he somehow both died and then ascended to become guide or something) even though their introduction doesnt mention that

[celest birch]

Hopeful Steward´s personality hints do say that they´re "patient and wise beyond their years" ...

[wintry matrix]

Yeah they had to grow up fast being orphan. Just like Alef... who took a bit different approach to all this growing up unfortunately.

[celest birch]

Indeed and yet I wouldn´t be surprised if part of that was contributed by Lamed too.

If we follow the "Dusk Ember = Hopeful Steward" theory, that is.

[wintry matrix]

More like denying obvious proofs.

[celest birch]

I´m taking "Scarred Sentry is Tsadi´s pupil" as a headcanon.

[wintry matrix]

Student yes. Not elder himself though.

[trail drum]

Yeah, they were scared and afraid after what happened to their soldiers but decided to snap out of it and to stop being afraid, Scarred Sentry will always be remembered, we might see Tsadi as this mighty and powerful elder but there will be flaws, as we see Tsadi fall feeling weak after being gone for years

[sharp shore]

LMAOOOOOOO

[sharp shore]

Yeah i can agree with this actually

[celest birch]

Exactly, thus no wonder why would Elder´s statue be connected to their quest, since both of them show exactly same flaws ... kinda. And I can totally imagine that terror (totally PTSD here if you ask me) would be seen as a weakness in the army (think on how WW1 treated PTSD with this, which was known as "shellshock" instead).

And since they´ve become a seasonal spirit this does spell a chance that we might see them again post-season too. 👀🥺 Only gotta mind that they didn´t snap out of it themselves. We did. 🥺!

[trail drum]

Tsadi: come at me you coward!
His constellation: star sounds
Tsadi: DONT YOU BRING MY MOTHER INTO THIS
His constellation: star sounds
Tsadi: OH YOU DONE IT RIGHT NOW!!

[celest birch]

Tsadi after more than enough barrels of Sky-beer.

[trail drum]

Dark water
Lamed: Tsadi I think thats enough dark water for you
Tsadi: let go of me you HOOOOOOOOOOOOOONK
Lamed: What did you just say?!
Tsadi: HOOOOOOONK

[sharp shore]

The word beer isnt banned?? Well damn

Resh: DRIVING IN MY KRILL

AFTER A BEER

HEY THAT SPEED BUMP IS SHAPED LIKE A 9 colored DEER

[celest birch]

I´m surprised too, hahahaha!

@trail drum Ok, that really reminds me of a HILARIOUS comic of Teth asking the moth from where did they learn that horrible curse word from while Tsadi was with them too only for the moth to say "Both of them", ending in both of them shouting a loud cuss. 😆

[sharp shore]

Resh’s honk would sound like spongebobs alarm horn

[trail drum]

All the elders running away

[wintry matrix]

Every time I read or hear this I remember the masterpiece @noble ferry sent me 😭

That video is alternate ending of chapter 4 fr

[sharp shore]

Yes please

[wintry matrix]

its not server friendly though

[sharp shore]

Can you dm me it

[wintry matrix]

Im sorry but I cant unsee

[plush timber]

just like nesting guide's teth pupil

[sharp shore]

That would be so nice ngl

[wintry matrix]

nesting is canonically student of teth

[sharp shore]

No i know i meant the sentry thing

[plush timber]

first thing ppl learn of a new language: curse words

[vapid drift]

Ok so I never really got the whole thing about the polluted water being harmful to us sky kids. We are literally beings of light, so wouldn't the oil/polluted water super charge our skids?

[coral oracle]

well. Darkness in general doesn't supercharge us, so why would dark water?

[vapid drift]

Well we know it's not really darkness, it's oil. Oil always causes a "rainbow" affect on water, which we can see if we look at the polluted water just right. Oil is used to keep flames lit, so why would it douse ours out?

[wanton turtle]

It is oil but from what I understand, its a substance made from the 'leftovers' of darkstone refining and the activities of industrial light draining.

It hurts us because it drains our light too.

[restive locust]

But... tasty darkwater

[spiral vault]

Yeah. The mystery of Wasteland Elder is the same mystery as the other Elders. We'll probably see it in part 2.

[spiral vault]

I think Stewie was quite literally raised by a village. Toymaker helped show the value of craftsmanship and care, Recluse showed them a way to beat back the darkness, and we have Enchantment and Rhythm Guides as well

Two embers is very much a story of nature vs nurture, Stewie and Alef started off the same, but they were raised by different factors that caused them to lead different lives

[trail drum]

Hopefully we get to see more on the Elders and how they treated Alef

[worn rapids]

Drink responsibly

[trail drum]

So far we saw how Lamed treats Steward, she's very gentle and understanding, around Resh, she is very obedient and loyal and reports back to Resh of any news like a messenger

[hushed steeple]

so, the darkness won?

[nimble ingot]

late reply, though needed context with the image of the wasteland elder in the war image.
That was a leaked beta image from the season of Aurora concert at the time. It is not considered canon as the official release does not include the elders themselves.
The image was part of a series where it showed other elders namely the valley twins (twice), the forest elder and the day elder (if I recall correctly)

It is an interesting idea to consider whether the elders themselves would have taken part in the war. And it may still be plausible. It is still important to consider the context and history of these old beta screenshots.

It is similar to when Eden was in development during the Light Awaits era of the game (the first beta before the full release in 2019)
There was a part of the level that was nicknamed as Blue Eden because the crystal was blue, and resembled the crystal we see in the Vault elevator. It still shook violently and was surrounded by a choatic storm. However there were also the stone bodies of the elders floating in the air, frozen in the moment of its shattering.

The models of the elders we see in the season of Shattering elder memory are the same ones.
That is, except for the forest elder becuase their model did not exist in the blue eden version. This is why the forest elder model in the elder shattering memory is different in quality compared to the other elders.

One last note.

The different to the old beta leak of the aurora seed of hope image with the elders in the battlefield, and the blue eden.
The blue eden statues of the elders were reused for the red shard memory. This makes them canon.
The elders in battle are not with the seed of hope memory because they were not released to the live game.

The beta may include content that does not make it to the live game. Which makes them difficult to confirm as canon.
If it makes it to the live game, it is much easier to confirm.

This is what makes lore in sky interesting, albeit a bit finicky with what is canon.
Although, with the lore being open to interpretation, people have more freedom to explore their interpretations and share their findings.

[rough anchor]

Another succesfull lorechat backreading fr fr /lh /offtopix

[serene pollen]

Good question, well actually at Forest after turning on the bells, rain stops and strangely the light depletion as well, so then is the water not really toxic but the rain is? Or is it that the bells sorta purify the water? That would make sense considering what sound can do to liquids, specially harmonic sounds.

Here the evidence, also the rain is def the one being toxic because, the water inside the cave, where Tearful Light Miner is, wont take your light away, so not toxic nor dark…

[serene pollen]

Maybe cause we are not candles, we are made of light and it makes sense that light feels attracted to a candle or to materials that make up a candle. But I dont think it has something to do w this and more with the fact that it might be just darkstone residue, some sort of oily substance/chemical.

[sharp shore]

Hello lorechat im back after a hilarious eden run whats going on

[sour ember]

In two embers chapter 4 what exactly happened in the ending?

[sharp shore]

I hope so too

I have my own speculations about their relationships and there was a discussion of it afterwards (if u saw this already i apologize)

#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[sharp shore]

I think that the vault elder finally gave them the closure the dusk ember needed after suffering immense loss thru allowing them to view their memories

Afterwards its kind of ambiguous where dusk ember got their candle lit from but perhaps they were given a small mote of it by the vault elder (probably because she was like “why not, the worlds ending anyway”) and allowed the kid to share what small amount of light is left as comfort

I doubt it will be something that shows overcoming challenge, but its more or less showing having comfort in the final moments

[trail drum]

But not only that, it connected everyone together to lessen their worries, they didnt care if the world ended, what matter is that in the end, they would all be together, in Sky and in orbit, family will always stick together

[sharp shore]

You’re right on this too

To me when i was watching it it seemed like Lamed was both sad yet so tender

It doesnt help that the mask makes her look like ಠ_ಠ but i can tell based on her body language to me

[vapid drift]

If thats the case that the world is ending and she's sharing light as the last comfort, what is Two Embers Part two gonna be about? 👀

[sharp shore]

Probably pieces of flashbacks as aleph while also being a continuation of whatevers going on, but instead of Dusk ember’s perspective we get it thru resh’s (dawn) perspective

[vapid drift]

Bout the same as I was gonna say: "See how Alef becomes Resh"

[trail drum]

The flame burning out (Part 1, the fall of a kingdom and the last remaining light)
A tiny spark of flame igniting (Part 2, the start of the rise of a kingdom and the light shining throughout the lands)

[vapid drift]

Ooo trueee

[sharp shore]

You know how Lamed can read minds…

… man i really wouldnt wanna be a person there lmao i wanna say at least 20 ft away from her

[trail drum]

Thats basically how I see two embers, two different types, one still trying to burn, the flame struggling but darkness will end up consuming it, while the other is the beginning of the ignite of the ember to where it will start to burn so bright it becomes a flame

[sharp shore]

Essentially why they were called embers and not something else i think

[trail drum]

Yep exactly, a tale of two flames

But the story for Part 1 isnt over, we just have the final quest and thats it, but we wonder whats gonna happen next, while yeah Chapter 4 ends with us seeing stars and the people fading out, who knows if they got something for us waiting

[crimson gate]

So who else cried during the movies

[trail drum]

Me

[sharp shore]

Oh my godddd the vault of knowledge music from ch 4 😭 😭😭😭😭😭😭

Genuinely hurts

[sharp shore]

For the first time in a while i teared up a little

Im listening to the vault of knowledge music again please its so painful i dont know why

[restive locust]

Me

[celest birch]

You're welcome!

[celest birch]

If Lamed would try to read my mind, then they'll so think I'm more insane than any sick person seen in the movie. 🤭🤭

[sharp shore]

For me itd be like me getting a memory to relive from my childhood.

Lamed: turns on headpiece

My memory: me throwing royal tantrums at 5 years old because I was mad other kids could blink and i couldnt see myself blink

Lamed: 😐 (😂😂😂😂😂😂😂🫵🫵🫵🫵)

[restive locust]

Lamed watching me stare in the mirror at daycare for an hour trying to catch my eyes as they moved (I had no idea how eyes worked):

[sharp shore]

Nah this was me too 😭 😭 😭

[celest birch]

Hahaha, classic. Even if on the other hand they would also get a chance to see what I can only call a termination attempt inside my mind as well. 😔 That's how broken I was as a teenager.

And yes, as someone whose pet died in one's arms as well even if it was needed to end their suffering, I understand Dusk Ember too much, especially given how they lost their own. In their place, I'd be just as enraged.

[celest birch]

Imagine the ending as the end of a Storm Lock/PNR run of Eden.

[sour sphinx]

I am starting to see what was before and after in the Wasteland Temple after quest 4

The ending of the fourth quest, ||after the Krill burst in uninvited, we duck for cover and wake up seeing the temple empty||

[willow falcon]

Hey guys I just need to clarify something
Is sentry supposed to be tsadi?
Sorry if it’s asked too often, it’s something that was boggling me personally

[coral oracle]

the parallels are there, but its a very divisive topic here

personally i believe it to be the case but it doesn't seem to be a very popular theory

[willow falcon]

I mean if it was the case, does this mean that the elders we see when awakened are more idealized perceptions of them compared to how they actually looked like?

[coral oracle]

thats my belief yeah

[sour sphinx]

I have seen a theory from a few people that the Recluse could be the Isle of Dawn Elder. Personally to me the beards from both of them are a bit different

[coral oracle]

yeah

[sour sphinx]

I haven't gotten anything from the Recluse yet 😆 But I will because I'm planning to get everything from the current season

[grave laurel]

it’s funny that people see a beard or soldier and immediately equate it to isle or wasteland elder. Fun theories to play with in terms of an au, but in canon the elders were elders from the beginning and were the first to land (i think it was the art book that stated that)

[coral oracle]

i would like to note that the artbook is from the early development of the game, and while it is treated like a lore bible not everything in it might be accurate

[sour sphinx]

I've probably seen that too but can't remember. I happen to see them as parent figures

[grave laurel]

true that, but some of it is definitely canon, further backed up by murals at the starting ‘tutorial’ of the game where it talked about the elders being the first to fall

however, no matter what is true, it’s fun to theorise and sentry becoming the wasteland elder is definitely an interesting idea for an au. But since the wasteland realm existed before sentry, i really don’t think it’s canon

[grave laurel]

ya personally i don’t think we should be getting so aggressive to eachother about a video game story, it’s fun to come up with theories and at the end of the day it doesn’t harm anyone if one person believes in something that another doesn’t

at the end of the day, you have your theories and i have mine, you’re probably not gonna change my mind and i’m probably not gonna change yours, so let’s just have fun and theorise

[coral oracle]

i think it's probably a 50/50 tossup as to whether or not its what we're intended to interpret tbh, there's sooo many parallels

[willow falcon]

Pretty sure tgc also made this so everyone would have their own personal interpretations

[grave laurel]

speaking of theories, from what was shown in episode 4, i think i finally understand how vault works, so the floors with all the floating islands and big starry area (including the elder area) seem to actually be an illusion, like how stewie was transported to a similar looking area but actually came to in that level before entering eden

makes so much more sense, i always wondered how they fit such a large area at the foot of the eden mountain

[willow falcon]

Maybe the vault is partially inside the eden mountain?

[restive locust]

Both theories i think are right iirc

[coral oracle]

thats what it seems like to me, i don't think i've ever actually seen the exterior of the vault, aside from the tip of the iceberg we exit from on Eden

[hushed steeple]

I kinda thought part one would be more eventful.

Kinda just answers a few questions, but spends a lot of time just milling about how sad n bad things are. I kinda wanted to see eden blow up, but I guess it needed a hopeful ending. But we all know, they all die, and only get real hope coming to fruition afterward. I guess that would be a bad message too.

Most exciting things are 20 seconds of RESH and Lamed showing how and why memories are made. But I really hope for more events happening in part two.

[coral oracle]

who is this spirit and why are they hanging around battlefield?

they're just standing there!!!

[hushed steeple]

Also theres no Tsadi? In the wasteland the entire time. About fighting krills and protecting people? Where is your general y'all?

Was he too expensive? 😭 too much too animate? Was he cut fr fr?

[coral oracle]

absence of the elder is one of the contributors to the theory that scarred sentry is/becomes the wasteland elder

[hushed steeple]

Whabout the eye

[sharp shore]

This topic again huh

[coral oracle]

its a hot topic

[hushed steeple]

Also the time this is taking place. Should be after any civil wars.

[river veldt]

i have a long-winded thoery about this: one that would require a text wall

[hushed steeple]

Giant Tsadi was already giant when people were fighting eachother I think. So I don't think it makes sense he becomes giant after.

[hushed steeple]

If you already wrote it up somewhere, link it n I'll read.

I'll make a cool little pros and cons list after.

[river veldt]

i haven't.
so, now would be a good time to share it with lorechat!

(based on several of my other messages here, but linked together)

please wait a moment while i organize my thoughts

[hushed steeple]

Im not against elders evolving from normy norms. But it seems like the wrong timing (ch 4 seems right before eden explodes) right when I would expect giant Tsadi to exist.

[hushed steeple]

Pls Its been one day, I didn't feel like watching the thing or coming here to yap yap last night 😭

Topics move so fast but they also always come back.

Maybe more "where is he" then "are you little wimpy him?"

[sharp shore]

Nah its ok its just around the 6th time i saw someone asking if sentry was wasteland elder lmao

Its kinda funny

Thats true everyones wondering where bro is

[hushed steeple]

Ok quick cons list before Tristan makes good points I can consider:

•Evolving would have to have healed his eye
•Ch 4 seems after civil war, which is where we see him as general (oh wait was that cut?)
•Lamed alive, we see them all die together in eden explosion memory, so he should still be alive before explosion.
•he should be giant before explosion.
•prophecy mural shows buff triangle which is waaaay before people hiding in GW.
•prophecy mural shows buff triangle in leadership position Scared, seems one of many normal soldiers.

[sharp shore]

Hang on you think he isnt the elder right

In that case i agree w you

[hushed steeple]

Leaning that way.

[coral oracle]

i feel like i'm about to create a conspiracy theory, it's now two different spirits i've seen just standing around. What are the seed of hope and jolly geologist doing!!! what does it mean!!!

[gilded socket]

Oh wait dang it I just remembered why that word would be beaned here augh

Anyways yeah between that and the smoke giants, something is up for sure.

[sharp shore]

There so many eerily placed bugs idek man

[trail drum]

MENACINGLY!

[river veldt]

as i want to cover all points that i can think of, the essay is turning out to be longer than expected...
please be patient 🙏

[distant turtle]

I think the Wasteland Elder was most likely outside in the thick of danger and never meets the dusk ember.

[sharp shore]

lets hope he was just riding in his car palanquin or something on his way there the whole time

[distant turtle]

It would be fun to have a next animation project dedicated to telling the tale of the explorers from the Season of Abyss

[trail drum]

DRIVING IN MY CAR

[sharp shore]

RIGHT AFTER A BEER

HEY THAT BUMP IS SHAPED LIKE A DEER dead body

[river veldt]

me: writes thousand-word document explaining lore
lorechat, while waiting for me: MEMES

/j /nm

[wintry matrix]

Honestly same though I might wait before posting cuz it is still quite lively here.

[trail drum]

Exactly passing the time of people making memes in here makes the wait worth it

[wintry matrix]

Bugged event assets. They are supposed to be stored underground and spawn only when you relive their memories.

[river veldt]

i don't mind the memes at all

lore enthusiast humor is so different from the 'mainstream sky humor', and i'm glad i have this circle of people whose memes i understand and relate to!

.
i would post the same meme to #sky-memes and #lore-discussion-spoilers
in the former, people are confused and leave no reactions
in the latter, 10 people react with laughing emojis

[wintry matrix]

Someone pinged me in #sky-memes in the middle of the night but nothing is there.

[sharp shore]

Maybe accidental

[sharp shore]

Its way more morbid humor since it deals with yk… lore

Sky memes is mainly on gameplay

I am personally a dark humor enjoyer so long as it isnt horribly abhorrent so the jokes here are funny to me

[river veldt]

Joking about horrible/serious things is a great way to regulate & release our negative emotions, too.

[river veldt]

i'm sorry for the essay taking two hours. i kept on being bothered by irl folks.

[narrow marsh]

I’d say its best to stay focused on the rain turning off, in terms of what happens when the bells ring. To be honest, it could just be a story function; that the rain just happens to stop for the ‘main character’ as you summon the jellies with the bells. There’s multiple possibilities. 🕯️

As for the rain, the phenomenon we experience with the water not being harmful even though the water understandably comes from the rain is certainly a tricky one. We could have said the water is different from the rain, but that’s just not how a realm situated around a creek pouring into a lake in a place consistently pelted by rainstorms would work out.
So from there, it stands to reason that the exact moment the rain droplets change from evil polluted acid rain… is the moment it hits the floor.
But… why? 🕯️

[sharp shore]

So real man

[narrow marsh]

Abhorrently relatable. Take your time, so that the love is kept. This place will always be here

[trail drum]

Huh now that you mentioned that, it doesnt make sense how the water doesnt take away our energy like how the polluted water does in Golden Wasteland but the acid rain does

[wintry matrix]

Same but being burned out from this channel instead.

[serene pollen]

Im inclined to give it to sound fixing the water.

@trail drum
Maybe another reason to consider the bells being responsible for that difference.

[sharp shore]

How could the sound of bells fix the water though? Its interesting but how

[wintry matrix]

Yesterday sentry-tsadi convo even escalated that, might seriously take longer break now.

[wintry matrix]

The water never drains you out even before activating the bells.

[serene pollen]

Look on YT for cymatics and sound therapy
but basically sound changes the shape of water, more technically the frequency of sound.

[sharp shore]

honestly im with you… i didnt want to sound rude, but that topic is making me die inside

[river veldt]

This. It is only the rain that hurts, not the water on the ground.

[wintry matrix]

you dont even know how much im holding back when people are spitting total misinfo

[serene pollen]

That is true so likely that the only polluted water is the one where the acid rain falling and maybe the one at the cave not even polluted? I would have to check next time im there to see if the water there looks oily

[wintry matrix]

Muting this channel now. See you maybe one day.

[sharp shore]

Though ill still read theories, my brain just stops working when it comes to certain stuff and i just idly read stuff/react to messages until i come back fresh

[serene pollen]

See ya, it is indeed getting overwhelming
And yeah me too Ayngarp

its hard to keep up sometimes and lately its too chaotic

[sharp shore]

Yeah

Ill still interact and stuff though lately its hard for me to say anything substantial

[serene pollen]

This is how you "fix" water

[potent dawn]

Is there going to be another cinema for up upcoming season? I kinda curious if tgc will made another lore-based story on seasonal like the current one

[sharp shore]

Very plausible with how sky’s environment is like

[serene pollen]

Well next season is likely gonna be part 2 of Two Embers and who knows if they will start doing more animations like this one but I doubt it, at least for now.

I sent a suggestion for them to do short clips like cartoon network used to do as their commercials, creators can jump in and send their contributions to be aired on-screen. Maybe tgc could make short lore animations and make good use of the screen. (maybe they already have this idea, I really hope so)

[serene pollen]

Yeah I mean sound its basically the same as light but lower frequency...
you can actually follow a color down the ladder and find the matching sound(s)/tone(s)

So if you can change the sound frequency of water you can also change its behavior...
or color but I dont wanna say color because you would likely think you can turn water pink or smth 😆, what I mean is that the tone changes and so that implies it's interaction with light is a little different.

We still have much to remember, and so much of this knowledge is being safeguarded, just recently it has become more mainstream knowledge, but our ancestors did know so much more about sound, as well as magnetism.

how many honks or kiddos honking does it take to fix water?

Skybot I need to know
show yourself

[river veldt]

they don't!

oily water is only ever shown on in GW/Eden/slouching soldier's jar in Starlight Desert

• also on dark plants. both dark plants and dark water are iridescent

[serene pollen]

Sure sure?
if that's the case then idk
That might then prove more in my view that bells fix the water at Forest, even if the ground water alone isnt polluted the rain is polluted and just making the ground water polluted as well.

[serene pollen]

Btw what about the water at the Radiance underground area?
and that same water coming out next to the bridge in Prairie

[river veldt]

I'll go check later

(for now, i'm wrapping up the essay)

[potent dawn]

I like that one. An Idea is still an idea (you probably expand it, who knows). Honestly, this season is probably the reason I play it again. Its kinda hard for a player like me to stay & invest the story. I just like the new concept they put in it. Reminds me with the switch animation one (🤔 I think). I was too excited for it XD

[serene pollen]

Sure
It's not toxic for us as it doesn't take away light (from what I remember) but I still wonder about it because it has that same oily look

[river veldt]

i'm not sure about the bridge water in prairie (where is it? caves?)
but the workshop can simply be wastewater from dyeing. after all, dye is collected from dark plants.

(notably, the irl chemicals used to dye things are often very toxic and dangerous.
i'm glad the dyes in Sky are safer & more organic.)

[trail drum]

But why tho? Why would there be acid rain in the first place?

[serene pollen]

Yeah and I would be delighted if they take my idea and make it true, not just for me ofc, for all of us.

Yeah I get it. Even though I love Sky and all my friends that are part of it (as well as this amazing lore community) I almost quit, but these new additions (like meditation space which is a dream come true for me) gave me only one answer: to stay and have fun.

Haha I bet you were excited, well stick around for longer, I feel like it's only gonna get better, because there are so many more collaborations to come as well (maybe Snoopy one day? Mark my words )

[willow falcon]

Literally sat down and watched this hypnotically

[serene pollen]

its coming out from the sewer

Here
#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[trail drum]

swimming in the water man this water looks so pretty
comes out of the water that was a nice dip
Random Skykid: hey dude your purple
Purple? No no that cant be right, also why are you so tall?

[river veldt]

courtesy of @sharp heart:

the colors are not extracted from dark plants directly
but extracted from light butterflies that are caught in dark plants

courtesy of @zinc sandal:

we also know that dye is light.
the way that dye colors mixes in the game is the same way that RGB colors mix, and RGB is the color space of light.

my add-on:
in the Japanese localization of Sky, the dyeing function is translated as 'light-dyeing function'

[clear arrow]

so im not sure if anyone else has this dreadfull feeling or if im just overanalyzing but during part 1, chapter 3 ||the part where poor stewie has to see his friends life sapped before him...looking at the old man before and after he knocked the totem thing down...he got the same darkness flakes as the poor animals that got their life sapped out of them...before he knocked it down, he was fine, but afterwards, some of his face and body/arm got covered in them...|| im not taking risks so im just gonna cover this here...but...you guys...do you think the king will..?

[river veldt]

what are you implying? /genq

[sharp heart]

i think they mean using people as a fuel source

[clear arrow]

if the king goes as far as sapping life from the creatures and that its shown the people can also be affected...yea

[river veldt]

if Resh runs out of options, they might...

it might be better to use soldiers as fuel, instead of letting them get eaten by krills
they'll die regardless of the outcome, but might as well extract some energy out of them while they're still alive

[trail drum]

So are we not gonna mention the singing that happens towards the ending part of Chapter 4, it sounded so similar to Aurora singing

[clear arrow]

could be an explanation why everyone in the game is canonicly dead

[sharp heart]

i thought it was her too, but i didnt see her in the credits at all

[trail drum]

Maybe they had someone else have almost the same vocals as her, but when I heard the singing, I was like "is that the angel, Aurora....?"

[pastel brook]

When the last tree in Hidden Forest has fallen and the rivers in Golden Wasteland are poisoned, you cannot eat darkstone oh no

[sharp heart]

wait i thought gw was coastal, not a riverbed

[viral bay]

Tgc hasn't done much marketing for part 2 of the Two Embers (other than a sneak peek of the King's past), which makes me doubt that Part 2 Season would be the next one 😢 Part 2 could still be in production right now and it would be premiered on 7th anniversary

[river veldt]

The singer is called Ari Mason!

[trail drum]

Thanks for the info, it would've made every skykid go nuts if they did have Aurora singing for that part, we all would've Ascended to orbit and back

[river veldt]

in present broken temple, you can see dark water running along the sand, and broken bridges built over them

[hushed steeple]

all hi-res and better music ahh

[muted salmon]

surprised the theory of Sentry becoming/is Wasteland Elder is still alive out of all possible evidence... did I do that?

or was the idea surfacing on other channels?

[valid dagger]

Idk which channels assumed that theory first, but one thing for sure, they saw the last scene of quest 4 and immediately assumed that sentry is wasteland elder

[muted salmon]

I mean my theory is that Scarred Sentry becomes Wasteland Elder but I just silently stopped supporting the silly idea

[river veldt]

(sorry for cold ping)

now that we know sentry wanted to be a carpenter, this quote (originally intended as a joke) hits much harder 😥

[winged bison]

it has surfaced everywhere, everywhere I look I see "Is Scarred Sentry GW elder?"

I was looking at Eden's gate earlier today, then remembered that not only is GW elder's patterns are already carved in that stone for Eden's gate/entrance [both in aviary, home, and eden itself], they also have their throne[?] statue thing in both the top of vault, along with the other elders, and in eden when flying up to orbit. Going off the Scarred Sentry becoming GW theory, the timeline of events is that it is so close to shattering event, the time gap is way too short and with the near apocalyptic events it is the least of people's minds to quickly go sculpt a statue/throne and carve the new GW elder's face on a wall - idk I get their grave being built after shattering event, but the other stuff especially the one floating near the top nope

[uneven spear]

Hahaha yes exactly! Also that ping surprised me XD

[scenic pebble]

wasn't it stated somewhere that the Elders were always Elders?

[neon nest]

I just realised that the elder statue in the temples are just bigger gravestones… The transition from Quest 4 to gw temple is strong

[river veldt]

Wrote a doc on what 2E showed us so far
(i'm still working on the doc of Sentry vs Tsadi)
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dYoKbMSKzpL7irvwFQDJE_49QQm9WcfF3a7YtZzOoYU/edit?usp=sharing

[winged bison]

yes, during an interview I believe. Also have the murals in cave of prophecy shows them being around if I recall

[scenic pebble]

one could argue that the prophecy murals showcased their inevitable coming into existence instead

[muted salmon]

you know, maybe the shield and spear is Scarred Sentry's while the visage of the GW Elder came from somewhere else during that candlelight finale

there'd probably a lot more time between quest 4 finale and our little boi's candlelighting, because the quest 4 finale does not have that grate

[hushed steeple]

The mighty lore chat of old gets sick of hearing the same topic again and again after YEARS.

MY BROTHERS IT HAS BEEN TWO DAYS. If a topic is boring, let the boring people swarm about it without telling them how boring to you they are.

[river veldt]

what grate? /genq

[celest birch]

Portcullis.

[hushed steeple]

I found part 1 kinda disappointing though. That might catch heat. But I don't think its emotional hook, Stew losing his pet, was deep enough, (I think it was obvious) and the rest of it was him just being sad and remembering his mum n pet. The ending, I thought about, I think it should have ended with the vault assent being more grand, seeing memories of not just his own sad life, but the memory mantas and let him float about and other peoples memories too. Letting him see hes not alone. Still about keeping memories alive, but the end we got was so...:.subdued? Like You really gotta suspend your belief to think a few extra candles gonna help em now 😂 cue the cosmic music and space zoom out.

[river veldt]

the portcullis is there in episode 4, just not quest 4

[celest birch]

It´s actually there as well, only a loading screen away, since it´s inside the Temple. :)

[river veldt]

not that you can directly see it

because, even in the base game, after you enter GW temple, if you look at where you came from, the portcullis is gone

[muted salmon]

the portcullis is closer to the altar room in the episode, while in-game it's closer to the darkstone switch, so my assumption goes that there was still another the krills had to go to which fell on quest 4

at the same time, the reason we start with sentry running away from the gate is because the chapter 4 finale krill started breaking it down, and the other guards had went to close the doors in a futile attempt

GW's temple is the entrance to the Vault, and the thing had like three/four layers of protection (market, main gate, darkstone portcullis, and probably the episode 4 portcullis)

...considering when the emitters finally fell and most of the buildings crumbled to sand however...

this reminds me, is it just me or are the temples not a temple past prairie? it becomes a workshop (forest), a coliseum (valley), a gatehouse (wasteland) then the upper floor (vault)

...actually there could probably just one portcullis and the guards closed the main door and raised the thing to prevent it from being useless thinking the thicker doors would hold

[river veldt]

isle temple has murals telling stories and showing you the rest of the temples

prairie temples are full of jars (butterfly storage?)

forest temple has a dark stone refinery mechanism

coliseum is connected to valley temple, but OUTSIDE the it.

GW temple is fortified for war. it's definitely we see hundreds of soldiers pouring out of it when the alarm sounds, so we know it's got barracks for soldiers to live.

but, keep in mind that, in the past, those temples probably looked different & had different purposes

• someone mentined that the eden second area gate + mural is similar to isle temple?

[muted salmon]

more like the light awaits version of isle temple for the second eden area it seems

from what I remember of light awaits playthroughs, the second eden area start used to be the eden entrance area

[river veldt]

if someone has any screenshots/footage, please @ me 🙏

[river veldt]

GW temple portcullis, as seen in battlefield

waiting for a rando, because we server merged into a lobby where the switch is already lit

[fast siren]

I have a link with tons of light awaits screenshots!!

[muted salmon]

I went to check a sky light awaits video with original dawn, and uh... looks like it's just the same as cotl version whoops

[river veldt]

can you please send me those in dms?

• perhaps, pick out the relevant screenshots and share them with lorechat?

[celest birch]

Funny, since most castles actually have double portculli.

[muted salmon]

it's a nice thought though since if the inner portculli fell and the guards had to close the big door, that would mean that Chapter 4 happens immediately before Quest 4 because the Sentry's shaking like mad staring at a closed door

...oh. GW Temple only had one and then they closed the door to that entrance corridor

okay I need to rewatch chapter 4 in full to map out the guard movements but from what I see:

1. krill looms over the portculli
2. guards rush in
3. our good boi does his little candlelighting (end of chapter 4)
4. the guards (with scarred sentry) close the inner door locking the corridor
5. scarred sentry gets scared to the bone
6. quest 4 start

[celest birch]

Still impressive that the outer portcullus still holds the Krills at bay tho.

Almost as if they busted through the ceiling inside.

[muted salmon]

I mean, we arrive at the present with the switch and the portcullis still working, and activating it called upon the krills...

[celest birch]

Yet the Krills don´t follow us into the Temple. Even though given how do we repel Guardians/War Machines in Journey, I wouldn´t be surprised if Vault/Night Magic is involved with it.

[muted salmon]

probably the remnants of GW Elder's magic... or the fact that the columns actually have flickering darkstone which could work as emitters on quest 4 :>

[muted salmon]

at the end of the day though, that portcullis did raise up and let the krill in, which then booted us out of the memory

booted isn't the right word, more like it was all the memory lantern can show us as it was then our good boi's demise

[river veldt]

If you look up at GW temple (both past and present), there are holes in the ceiling to let light in

Now, I wonder if a krill can fit in through them, too?

[celest birch]

Do I then wonder what will the final quest be.

[river veldt]

Final quest from vault elder’s lantern + one quest (even later than the ‘final’ quest) from caring companion, our manatee

[celest birch]

If it´s small enough ... which, per AURORA quest in Battlefield, can totally be possible.

Which apparently died in that memory too, thus maybe we´ll get to see them as a ghost?

Even though another hypothesis is that the Krills don´t follow us into the Temple because they never saw us.

[coral oracle]

Ahh

It's been driving me nuts for like a month now so it's good to have a concrete answer

[river veldt]

in ep4, the krills definitely saw people inside

which is why, as per quest 4, it barged in and killed everyone

but it busted in through the front door, instead of using the sunroof

[celest birch]

Yep; what I´ve meant is present-day Krills that never follow us into the Temple.

When it comes to that, given the intact portcullis I can only imagine that the Krill busted into the hallway between both portculli, actually.

[muted salmon]

btw the entrance hallway is just a portcullis and a large (now missing/destroyed) stone door

[river veldt]

in-game, krills are coded so that they cannot see you once you're near a loading zone, so you'll be safe

in the case of GW temple, once the portcullis is down, you can be in the krill's spotlight & they still won't target you.

[celest birch]

Thus the second one had to be closed until it finally managed to destroy it. One way or another, that thing got a feast and especially if others then managed to come in through the roof, together with Shard Crabs. 😔😔

[celest birch]

When it comes to being in Krill´s spotlight behind the portcullis, I like to imagine they don´t see our Skykids because we´re hiding behind it. 🤭

[sharp shore]

Id like to think they were holding back for the insanity that will be part 2

I will hope so

[river veldt]

here's some better footage
#screenshots-and-videos message

[celest saffron]

One question
If Dusk is Hopeful Steward
Where did she get the cape and staff from

[river veldt]

magical girl transformation /hj

[celest birch]

During Season of Revival.

[muted salmon]

gifted by the other ancestors at the end of the season

[celest saffron]

Did she always have them?

[sharp shore]

Nah those came at the end

[celest saffron]

Do you think they'll show that in like part 2 or smth

[celest birch]

We can only WAFO.

[sharp shore]

Part 2 is Alef shenanigans probably so maybe not

[muted salmon]

unless the ending of Part 2 is what happens after Part 1 Finale, but WAFO

[river veldt]

i'm sorry, but legends!?

[muted salmon]

I mean... four legends?

[celest saffron]

"What are we? Some sort of...league of legends?" ahh sentence

[muted salmon]

hey, we're children of light flying in the sky

[spiral vault]

I think the word choice is very intentional

[river veldt]

myb
i'm not a native speaker, and the 'legends' that i know of are often fake and made-up

[muted salmon]

Part 1 quests focuses on four key figures that helped the Dusk Ember, those are the "legends"
Part 1 chapters is the main legend of the Dusk Ember

[celest birch]

This would definitely answer the end of Quest 4.

[celest saffron]

If Dusk grew up she would be a bigger legend than she already is

[river veldt]

unfort, world blew up before she could grow up

she is also a skykid. she would make a really good Ruler...

[celest saffron]

Au where Dusk is a warrior from Prairie fighting against Dawn/Resh from Eden

[celest birch]

And yet despite these tales being legends, 4 of them are very much alive now as seasonal spirits.

[sharp shore]

Based on how they got the candle at the end of ch 4, which they havent shown (though the live cinema might have shown it), she probably learned how to get it from within herself like a skykid

Not saying they are a skykid but its odd

[celest birch]

I think it´s Vault candles. 😏

[muted salmon]

honestly yeah probably vault candles

[river veldt]

the butterfly toy became a real butterfly, so she can somehow manifest light (or was it another one of lamed's magic?)

• how did she realize she was a skykid?

[celest saffron]

Now I'm tempted to draw Dusk as a warrior of light

[sharp shore]

Lamed can induce hallucinations to relive memories is what i think

Idk she can just do some crazy crap

[muted salmon]

probably part of the memory absorption process Lamed does with her helmet/prophecy powers

[celest birch]

Probably Memory Lantern´s effect, since the butterfly toy served as a memento of Tender Toymaker as well as manatee. It had memories attached to it. :)

[muted salmon]

imagine it though, your best memory of the dead and something which ties to the dead is taken into a lantern to become knowledge

[sharp shore]

Yeah that

[celest saffron]

Lamed gained the knowledge of compassion

[sharp shore]

I think she was always very kind just in a different way

Which is surprising for a politician ngl

[muted salmon]

anyway so I was watching someone's very poor recording of chapter 4 on youtube and uh... towards the end when Dusk had that lit candle and cradling it to not let the fire go out, it screams skykid lookalike

[celest saffron]

I'm surprised there's no lore about the default moth hair and cape

[sharp shore]

yo dont say that youtube stuff theres tgc staff here im so sorry

[celest birch]

Dusk Ember became Child of the Light, but not a Skykid like our avatars are.

[muted salmon]

they recorded only the last seconds of the video

[celest birch]

An Ancestral Carrier/Bringer of Light.

[sharp shore]

Nvm then lol