If I was good and evil pulled that off, I'd be impressed.
#Ride the Cyclone
patent parcel
smoky summit
Yeah in our game boffin Amne ability was “After you pick your kills, you learn the character of your first pick, and you may choose to re-pick that person. You learn this” (inspired by someone in this thread) so demon found out who the banshee was but missed the chance to pull it off even though the conditions were all met
Not a criticism of the script, just thought it was a really cool interaction
On a separate note, our group’s meta has been town truthfully claiming their roles (even bait roles) during role calls in final 3/4/5
karmic kindle
on this script in particular it’s amplified by boomdandy
soft plinth
Evil win on a d2 boomdandy explosion
f3 were the philo banshee who was just lifted off of, the demon and the Puzzlemaster implicated in a piece of savant info
the poor xaan poisoned princess nominated and killed the savant but the alhad chose not to use their ability
fast leaf
let me guess this was like 2 minutes after the rerack timer
karmic kindle
almost definitely
actually I can check
yeah it was like 5 minutes after rerack lol
soft plinth
good wins on mastermind day
smoky summit
Has evil ever won a mastermind day? lol
patent parcel
Yes
They won the first ever playtest game for this version that way
Here it is!
Apparently the stats show it's about 50/50
Here's another MM win
And another
Those are all the documented ones, there are about as many documented MM losses
buoyant moth
and tbc, turning even 30% of demon executions into wins would be insane
abstract socket
Played it here today irl, and what a wack game it was, 13p.
First; the preacher did his thing by 3 straight night and chose all minions. First night the Boomdandy who was d1 nominee and executee.
Princess succesfully chose, nominated and executed said Boomdandy.
Amnesiac had a once per game; choose a player. If evil, that person is turned good and mad that nothing happened. If madness breaks, good loses, even if you are drunk, poisoned or dead. Chose the now dead, useless Boomdandy. More chaos.
Night 3, Al Had chose (good) dandy for a resurrect. And choose Banshee for instant confirm
Game ended at final 7 with correct alsaahir guess
Never in my wildest dreams did i think this would all happen 😂 😂 😂
soft plinth
i love guessing the evil team as the alhad
abstract socket
Shite, alsahir hahsha
torn turret
Is there a file for night order?
lusty moon
A generic one?
lusty moon
Is there a file for night order?
soft plinth
alhad win
quaint dew
Alhad is the highest wr demon on the script
thorny moss
Yeah, though I think it needs some buff, since it has lowest WR 🤔
stone breach
I think it should be put in play more before we decide how strong it is since its the demon with the least data
patent parcel
IDK, it's gone in the bag more than any other demon. We need more reference info
trail fable
Alhad is my least favourite demon on script so im of the opinion that removing it would fix all problems
quaint dew
"Welcome to Ride the Cyclone, Irish edition!"
"Congratulations the good team has won!"
dull gyro
Since it was talked about earlier in the thread - I just ran my first game of this script and had the 'Banshee guarantees a win' scenario.
After executing the Balloonist in final 5, the Al-Had picked:
1st pick: Banshee, 2nd pick: Boomdandy, 3rd pick: Snitch
Banshee chose death, got announced and Boomdandy then chose death for the win.
smoky summit
If the Al had knew for sure who the banshee was they should self pick for the 3rd pick for a true guaranteed win no matter what the banshee chooses
stone breach
How so?
If banshee picks live, doesnt matter what boom and al had do, theres no auto win
At least with snitch as number 3 when the banshee picks live, theres still a 50% chance of a win
thorny moss
That happens because Al-Had "if all live, all die" kills still happen in order and not at same time. So that'd be if all 3 choose to live:
- Banshee dies (and is announced)
- Boomdandy dies
- The game ends as there are only 2 players alive, right before Al-Had would die.
stone breach
Oh wild ok
thorny moss
Yeah. Pretty much every multideath happens in some order (Po kills in order of choice, Grandmother dies right after grandchild, Boomdandy explosion) with exception of Lleech dying with host at same time.
patent parcel
Oh this is an old edition.
plucky mantle
al-had win
fire colorblindness filter
soft plinth
Oh this is an old edition.
yeah i was about to say i dont remember a BH or VIs on RTC
stone breach
Oh this is an old edition.
Oh fuck youre right
I need to update gs recomended sheet
amber plank
The fact that VI is no longer on the script and that change was made so long ago demonstrates how long it’s been since I’ve played a RtC game ;-;
waxen edge
How is Princess balanced on this script?
plucky mantle
If you out princess:
The demon sinks(you are no longer confirmed)
Boffin princess
Xaan 1
Also, you could exe the boomdandy
waxen edge
How does Xaan 1 balance Princess?
maiden jolt
yea it'd be xaan 2
waxen edge
How does Xaan 2 balance Princess?
quaint heart
How does Xaan 2 balance Princess?
The Princess is backwards looking so if it’s drunk or poisoned on Night 2 it loses its ability to prevent the demon killing
And also tbh Princess isn’t that strong in context if RtC and this sorta setup is where it thrives in general. Confirming yourself is good and giving town more time to ise abilities is fantatsic but Al-Had/Boom and other factors mean evil bounce back strong as well
Plus the dilemma of a princess in Al-had picks tossing up between living as a confirmed player (but could kill all 3) and dying as a “spent” role is really delightful
waxen edge
How did you create the PDF here, with a unique background, gold on the side, and fonted title?
quaint heart
How did you create the PDF here, with a unique background, gold on the side, and...
Designed it on Adobe InDesign and Photoshop
waxen edge
The Mastermind/Alan jinx seems unnecessary and counterintuitive to the abilities
From playtesting, how often does evil win those games? Isn't it rare for all three chosen players to choose "live"?
quaint heart
The MM/Al-Had jinx has proven to be very crucial to the intent of the script and flow of the game! The intent here is that players are always trying to fiugure out whether it's worth living or dying both in executions and at night with Al-Hadpicks with no fluff in terms of death survival other scripts like Reptiles uses. Because all players want to live, the MM jinx encourages players to die "just in case" which benefits evil. As for wins through MM, they are rare but that's the point. MM and other win cons like that (think Fearmonger, Evil Twin, Goblin) arent really supposed to be reliable triggers but detterants good need to overcome. As for how rare it is for all players to choose live it varies somuch from game to game and player to player; you'll get games where everyone'ss greedy and it lasts like 3 days and others will high sacrifice and slower
The script isn't perfect but i think only unreleased roles would reallyelevate it further without a full rework or something but it's proved to be a lot of fun, balanced, and consistent
waxen edge
Have you noticed a substantial difference in win percentages when comparing Mastermind games to non-Mastermind?
quaint heart
i have not tracked nor will track win percentages 👍 it's felt fine in games I've known about
patent parcel
From playtesting, how often does evil win those games? Isn't it rare for all thr...
I have been kinda following data, and it's about 50/50 on whether it works.
There's probably not enough data for it to be statistically significant, but keep in mind making even a third of times the demon is executed into a win is insanely good.
waxen edge
I have been kinda following data, and it's about 50/50 on whether it works.
The evil team wins 50% of Mastermind nights?
patent parcel
The evil team wins 50% of Mastermind nights?
Yep! This script encourages people to be greedy.
waxen edge
What's your sample size on that john
bleak yarrow
mastermind is like vortox where its script presence matters way more for helping evil than its actual power when in play
patent parcel
What's your sample size on that john
I mentioned, nowhere near enough to be statistically significant. Around 16 games, I think.
But its still a trend worth mentioning
I will be honest, when MM was added, if someone told me it'd be 50/50, I wouldn't believe them either.
void kraken
gigachad move
wide delta
Played the first 2 games of Ride the Cyclone yesterday, and it was a blast! Do you have some examples which Amnesiac abilities and which Fisherman advice you gave in this script? Never played with these characters and I struggled a bit 😅
But the script is amazing, banshee seems REALLY strong (hard confirm PLUS insane vote/nomination power), surprisingly Knight seems very strong too on this script. And I am wondering if golem isn't a little bit too powerful either as it is basically a townsfolk info role..?
The second game was insanely close ending with a Boomdandy execution and the following vote was decided by the one Politician vote, who voted for the Puzzlemaster instead of the demon, so he turned and won with evil 😅
patent parcel
Golem on RtC is a townsfolk if and only if you punch yourself. If you don't, you have to hit and evil or you cost good two nominators. On an al-had script. Knight gets run over by xaan here. As for banshee, banshee has always been +2 evil votes.
All you have to do is fool the banshee.
wide delta
Golem on RtC is a townsfolk if and only if you punch yourself. If you don't, you...
"banshee has always been +2 evil votes" what do you mean with that?
Golem more or less won Good the game as they nominated the demon in Final 4 or 5, dont remember, and he didn't die
patent parcel
The banshee can be fooled into voting on a good like any other player.
patent parcel
Golem more or less won Good the game as they nominated the demon in Final 4 or 5...
The golem got lucky.
I've seen games where the golem got unlucky and lost the game on the spot.
quaint heart
Fighting tempo is really what the script is about yeah. You can trade powerful confirmation or worlds for speeding up or slowing down the game. Golem can be very strong but gives the Al-Had 2 kills for free ehich on top of possibly 3 more means you can lose half of town in one day. Banshee is intentionally hard confirmed but as lemon says isn’t the strongest demonbane as the voting still needs to be used correctly
As for Amne and Fisherman that comes with experience and time that basically all STs struggle with Dw! I’d recommend Amnes having simpler more guessable sources of info and fisherman to help execute the right people build the tight minions etc etc.
wide delta
alright, fair, thanks for the replies 🙂 next time well play it again
patent parcel
Golem more or less won Good the game as they nominated the demon in Final 4 or 5...
Interesting thing to note is if the golem nommed anyone else at this point, evil probably TPKs.
muted notch
livetext good win yesterday
amne ability was "once per game, pick any number of players. you learn if it contains the demon."
boffin granted balloonist
lusty moon
What does "if it contains the demon" mean?
covert knoll
Learn yes or no depending on if you chose the Demon or not
buoyant moth
everytime i run this script i can't help but make an Amne ability that interacts with the Al-Had choices
patent parcel
everytime i run this script i can't help but make an Amne ability that interacts...
Waiter! One more "EN*, learn it the al-had picks are valid noble pings", please!
cunning phoenix
Waiter! Waiter! Can i have a "EN* learn how many character types the Al-had picked before he kills (you get this info before you and they die)"
quaint heart
lol
amber plank
Funny scream during the day is funny
waxen edge
Taking another look at this, what are the roles of Knight, Snitch, and Golem?
Overall it seems quite a good script
patent parcel
Taking another look at this, what are the roles of Knight, Snitch, and Golem?
Golem is cool here with the fact that boffin can fake it and it's extremely damaging with al-had. Snitch, I believe, is boffin fodder, and it makes the boomdandy easier to get exploded. I can't speak for knight.
halcyon topaz
knight has good interaction with boffin, letting you eliminate confirmed options
waxen edge
Why is Golem damaging with Alan?
patent parcel
Why is Golem damaging with Alan?
Increased speed. The loss of two nominators really hurts when at night you lose two more.
cunning phoenix
Golem is a free kill.
They will likely choose die entering a night with 6/5 players.
Perfect moment to choose a minion who will die too.
patent parcel
Of course, golem IS a townsfolk here, but only if they self-nom. And no golem under the sun ever does that.
waxen edge
If Golem functions like a TF when they self-nom, then I would self-nom D1
patent parcel
If Golem functions like a TF when they self-nom, then I would self-nom D1
You'd be delighted to know most golems haven't even considered the possibility
And let's keep it that way, lest witch become a must on any golem script.
waxen edge
Game design shouldn't be concerned with the current strategy level of players, it should withstand all strategy developments
patent parcel
Game design shouldn't be concerned with the current strategy level of players, i...
||Well, TPI will fix that as soon as The Tomb is released. But for now, golem is a fundamentally broken character that most players thankfully haven't realized how to break||
plucky mantle
If Golem functions like a TF when they self-nom, then I would self-nom D1
Tbh this still isn’t helpful
“You start dead” the character
waxen edge
Tbh this still isn’t helpful
Publicly clarifies Outsider count, confirmed dead good player
This is pretty friggin good for an outsider
plucky mantle
Publicly clarifies Outsider count, confirmed dead good player
This is pretty fr...
See that’s why “clarifying outsider count” is the tf part
Because otherwise that’s kind of “realistically every psychopath kill ever”
which is why sentinel is good with golem.
Solved it folks
Oh anyway
plucky mantle
which is why sentinel is good with golem.
Actually yeah no So it doesn’t conf o-count here
So it’s less good
halcyon topaz
does this script have a sentinel on it??
halcyon topaz
yeah
patent parcel
I see it as a self-nomming virgin that doesn't waste an execution.
Which is pretty good! Especially since even boffin can't fake it. Not useful for solving o-count, but there's a reason virgin is a tf.
azure jewel
A self-nominating Virgin is not a very good Townsfolk — it's using an execution to confirm a dead player
a self-nominating Golem is only marginally better, especially on this script when it can be legitimately useful to try and golem-punch players like a Boomdandy or Politician
waxen edge
The presence of better options doesn’t make one option less useful for the character. Also, a Golem is unlikely to actually hit the Boomdandy or Politician, which are likely not even in play, or hidden.
jade dew
I have seen the boffined golem demon self nom on d1, was an interesting game
quaint heart
I have seen the boffined golem demon self nom on d1, was an interesting game
Yeah but didn’t he forget he had it 😂
tacit rune
The presence of better options doesn’t make one option less useful for the chara...
It does via the very notion of opportunity cost
jade dew
Yeah but didn’t he forget he had it 😂
Well yeah, and he had to spend the whole rest of the game not nominating, no idea how no one even commented on it
ruby sapphire
Trying to run this script this weekend. Anyone have some good amne abilities?
(Also, would this be a good amne ability? “Each night, choose 3 players: if your choices exactly match the Al-Had, nobody dies tonight.”)
quaint dew
Hard confirms the Amnesiac which might be quite rough. And has a pretty high chance to not happen
I think some information based Amnesiacs are usually the way to go
tacit rune
think about some minor informational upgrades on a different townsfolk
either on script or not
like basically an ft minus a red herring
or a point to a player and learn thier empath info
soft plinth
Trying to run this script this weekend. Anyone have some good amne abilities?
a favorite of mine on this script is "YSK the Alsaahir player. Each Night*, learn how many characters they guessed correctly. [+the Alsaahir]" but it can be very swingy depending on how long the alsaahir lives. if the amne can solve it tho, it creates a very cool alhad dynamic with the amne and alsa
ruby sapphire
for a hot second I thought alsaahir == al-had and I was like "why on earth would the amne learn the al-had?????"
ashen mango
Trying to run this script this weekend. Anyone have some good amne abilities?
general information abilities work well but if you want smth al had specific i always enjoy smth to do with the players picked by the alhad each night
patent parcel
Waiter! One more "EN*, learn it the al-had picks are valid noble pings", please!
@ruby sapphire I'm just going to shunt these two classics down...
ruby sapphire
Oh shit those are 🔥 🔥
ruby sapphire
Managed to run a game! Ended with good winning because the Al-Had's Boffin chose to die instead of live on the final night ;-;
patent parcel
Managed to run a game! Ended with good winning because the Al-Had's Boffin chose...
Do we have the final grim?
ruby sapphire
yep!
amne ability was "Each night, learn how many character types the Al-Had picked with their ability."
was originally going to go for "Each night, learn if the Alsahiir correctly guessed the Minion or the Demon" but then the Al-Had with Philo Boffin picked Alsahiir
so I pivoted
the Poli, uh... played one of the games of all time
talks to the Fisherman D2 and says "the three you gave me sounds like demon bluffs, I'm your Politician, lets win together"
quaint dew
What a play
ruby sapphire
won my first game on this script as the Al-Had!
got the Puzzlemaster ability, D1 guessed my puzzledrunk correctly (SS with no between HP and fish)
golem punched the preacher, got exe'd by the princess, then I rezzed them on the princess day and they punched the banshee
anytime someone asks me why golem is an outsider I'm going to think about this game
patent parcel
What did the poli do to flip?
ruby sapphire
F5 was the entire evil team, a spent golem, and them
They just nommed the spent golem
torn turret
Imo prob not a Poli flip as Golem did more to help evil than them, but thats neither here nor there
patent parcel
Hey, uh. What are the recommended travelers here?
covert knoll
Hey, uh. What are the recommended travelers here?
my json says
"thief","judge","deviant","gnome","voudon"
patent parcel
my json says
"thief","judge","deviant","gnome","voudon"
Thank you!
vital steepleBOT
Gave +1 Thanks to @covert knoll (current: #61 - 708)
covert knoll
hmm but the version pinned has the same non-travellers but "thief","voudon","judge","matron","apprentice"
so maybe go with those
ruby sapphire
Evil win after Boomdandy explosion!
Al-Had with 2 evil abilities is fun
: OPG after dying at night, you may choose the Al-Had picks. You learn your ability activates when you die.
Also funny: TC was bluffing Savant with fake info, so I gave that fake info to the Philo Savant on the Xaan night
quaint heart
Ran it twice with Princess (Bluff) blowing up Boom D1 and Evil winning; and then Princess (Real) executing Demon bluffing Knight where good won MM night
pseudo gyro
I ran a few games of it today!!
All 13 player+ 1 traveller
First two games had boomdandy explosions
patent parcel
All 13 player+ 1 traveller
First two games had boomdandy explosions
Who won these games?
pseudo gyro
Who won these games?
Evil won both games where the boomdandy went off, good won the other game via Mastermind
There were 2 other games in addition to that, but both of them were scuffed in various ways (not due to the script)
open panther
How often does evil actually win off Mastermind on this script? I feel like it always ends in a good win…
cunning phoenix
50%
The last time i check it really was 50%
But yeah human error the demon can just miss judge and select a banshe/YSK and they kill themselves and screw over everything
patent parcel
Yeah it's somewhere between 30%-50%, which is absurdly good for games where the demon got executed
cunning phoenix
And the good team doesnt know when it happends but it happens
pseudo gyro
How often does evil actually win off Mastermind on this script? I feel like it a...
in this particular game, it was final 3, so good knew to pick die because mastermind was their only shot at a win
midnight wharf
looks like arif is streaming this shortly
soft plinth
arif has a great taste in scripts fr fr
ruby sapphire
Evil win!
Boffin fish advice was "do everything in your power to convince Ja Crispy the Politician to win with evil"
this had happened because the Golem killed the Xaan on the first day, meaning that the Xaan's ability this game was just [+1 Outsider]
...this also meant the amne ability went unsolved, because they never got a "no". Because the Xaan was dead on the Xaan night.
cunning phoenix
Huh xaan 1 is still poisoning everyone
quaint dew
It's xaan 2
Politician and Golem
In an 11 player game, there is usually 1 Outsider
hence the +1 Outsider
But yeah it was a bit confusingly worded
ruby sapphire
yeah
there was also another game where I randomly selected a traveler from the recommended list to use, and ended up with Voudon
and well. Good news! I have learned to not make a Voudon evil in a Boomdandy bag!
ruby sapphire
: OPG after dying at night, you may choose the Al-Had picks. You learn your ability activates when you die.
reused an old amne ability... and the amne picked the poli, the al-had, and the boomdandy. they all chose to live.
patent parcel
If this isn't a breakout script, I don't know what is.
void kraken
oh what’s this?
thorny moss
List of some popular scripts that appears in .live when choosing customs.
void kraken
woah!!
quaint dew
Ran 2 games of this
Really fun! It is tricky to run, but not excessively
One was a D1 boomdandy explosion (between the 3 people with the thumbs up markers.) Evil won
The second was a game where good won due to the philo high priestess and the balloonist solving who the Boffin was.
quaint dew
Also A3's Amne ability was
Each night*, learn which characters the Al-hadikhia chose. 1 is false.
pliant silo
ran this! evil won by evil outting to tie the vote
al-had hit the banshee on n2, sacrificed a boffin on n3 followed by the mastermind's execution, but was brought back by a n4 triple kill and puzzlemaster guess on a minion
livid moth
Finished a 12p longtext, game ended d2 with a boomdandy hang, good won with a solve from the fish info, info was "the demon is smarter then they appear, don't be fooled" because there was a n2 banshee kill on purpose bc the only person the banshee claimed to was the demon.
midnight wharf
How does boomdandy work in longtext?
soft plinth
How does boomdandy work in longtext?
usually a word limit
cunning phoenix
Evil wins
cunning phoenix
I dont know how build a bag in this script lol
split crane
Have you tried the random button? 🙂
soft plinth
Good win on the app today, didn't grab the grim
soft plinth
evil win in f3
alhad got a triple kill n2
boffin philo who went preacher because i was bluffing preacher n1
both minions bluffed outsider very cool game
wide delta
evil win in f3
what was the amne ability?
soft plinth
what was the amne ability?
ENCAP, learn how many steps to the nearest outsider
wasn’t solved unfortunately but it would have been devastating since evil was bluffing outsider
quaint heart
ENCAP, learn how many steps to the nearest outsider
Living?
trail fable
first time running boffin amne
it was the evil team has a private discord to communicate in
also evil won
split crane
Has anyone else noticed that Good Amne's bingo rate is like 5% while Evil Amne's is 99.9% 😭
trail fable
knight ping on the boomdandy is kinda mean
plucky mantle
knight being a TF
quaint heart
knight TF
wide delta
recently played 3 rounds of ride the cyclone again. I think this is so far my favorite script of all I've played. So many fun interactions, every game is rly wild!
First one was VERY fast as the Al-Had chose himself in the second night and everyone chose live haha
Second game was pretty much decided by the boomdandy. Puzzlemaster guessed the demon (who bluffed seamstress) was drunk, so I showed him the Boomdandy as the demon. They killed him and the Al-Had "won" the pointing game. VERY fun game, I stole the Amnesiac ability of someone up here and it was really cool (even though the Alsaahir forgot who he chose most of the time).
Third game was wild as well. Al-Had got Philo through the boffin and chose Savant in N1 which got the real Savant drunk and the Politician bluffed Savant as well. So I had to come up with 4 Savant infos each day and with the politician the town tried to go through 6 Savant Infos each day haha. Well, it went bad and even with the mastermind the Al-Had ha no chance through self-confirmed Golem, a mastermind that was very obviously evil and a Fisherman that had a lot of trust...
cunning phoenix
Evil wins!
azure jewel
Xaan as "Baron with a gun" is lowkey vile
cunning phoenix
What type of savant info do i give in this script?
plucky mantle
Xaan as "Baron with a gun" is lowkey vile
in fairness it's puzzledrunk golem
azure jewel
in fairness it's puzzledrunk golem
yeah drunk the Xaan or something
don't puzzledrunk a townsfolk!
cunning phoenix
What type of savant info do i give in this script?
Hwllo
soft plinth
don't puzzledrunk a townsfolk!
plucky mantle
try "longest line of TF is X players long"
cunning phoenix
Thats chef X reframed
cunning phoenix
Yeah its a slightly stronger but meh
I dont know im running out of generic savant info in my games
plucky mantle
B: 2 minion games exist, and chef pairs aren't exactly counted
cunning phoenix
Yeah
plucky mantle
I dont know im running out of generic savant info in my games
try "longest line of alternating character types is X players long" today
one of my favorites
really good info if you figure it out
cunning phoenix
try "longest line of alternating character types is X players long" today
I use that one more for fishermans
plucky mantle
fisherman isn't info....
cunning phoenix
It kind of is?
plucky mantle
wait how have you been running fisherman
cunning phoenix
Riddles
cunning phoenix
Very simple ones really
plucky mantle
fish is supposed to be "DO X THING NOW"
like very much "tell X to bluff Y" or "execute X" or "trust Y" or whatever
"They are strategy tips that the Storyteller believes will help the Fisherman win, if they are followed."
per the wiki
cunning phoenix
"Execute into the farest sea of the most pure"
cunning phoenix
Yes
cunning phoenix
Yeah but the riddle adds a social aspect because who is the so called "pure"
The group guesses its the youngest folks.
There are 4 of them
plucky mantle
Yeah but the riddle adds a social aspect because who is the so called "pure"
why are we adding inbuilt misinfo
it's not that strong
plucky mantle
to be not better steward
cunning phoenix
I literally giving it Sage Pings
plucky mantle
and to allow evil double claims to be viable and junk the info
plucky mantle
I literally giving it Sage Pings
don't do that?
just like give them an order that doesn't delete the demon off of the face of the earth it's not
crazy
cunning phoenix
Its not actually sage pings its like more like the host its between these 4 players
cunning phoenix
They then get executed because i have built this meta of fisherman being riddles
plucky mantle
do it until they don't get executed
or announce that you're running it a new way now
if you want fasttrack to meta swap
cunning phoenix
My players are super smart that why the i do riddles too
They are most likely to stomp evil if i give simpler info
plucky mantle
but like
use that for savant
shit there's a homebrew character that's just intended to do riddlefish
also it's just a lot easier to bluff but
cunning phoenix
I honestly at the level of play my group its at i find the semi-riddle fish stuff more viable and safer that more direct actionable stuff because they might stomp the game to much
plucky mantle
then give weaker direct actions
cunning phoenix
I am bad at mesuring that
plucky mantle
"Find the droison" in a Lleech game is balanced
"don't trust X" : they're poisoned, they're evil, they're lying to you for some reason
heck just telling the fish to give someone a bluff is a valid option
the wiki even has a "Oh yeah btw stop tunneling on this world" advice
cunning phoenix
"each odd step gets wet" in a double lleech puzzlemaster game i ran a while back
plucky mantle
wtf
cunning phoenix
Good managed to won haha
plucky mantle
I dunno this just feels like the pacifist "it's not a TF because good is winning"
cunning phoenix
No its more like good team its too smart
plucky mantle
make more fucked up bags
cunning phoenix
Grinding those cluesbysam puzzle's every day
plucky mantle
does the evil team do wild plays?
cunning phoenix
Yeah
cunning phoenix
No, they wont want that
cunning phoenix
They hate heretic for how it warps the whole game
cunning phoenix
Doesnt feel natural for them
plucky mantle
damsel then
use damsel
"Oh here's all the info" damsel just gets guessed and good dies
great way to win folks
cunning phoenix
I mean the problem its more of the savant and fisherman being overpowered in my games
plucky mantle
I mean yeah a sage ping is too strong
cunning phoenix
And the fact that they are harder to bluff because of how they know me as a ST
plucky mantle
And the fact that they are harder to bluff because of how they know me as a ST
give off meta shit
to real savants so they get exed
and fishermen too fuck it
break the metas
cunning phoenix
They will complain that the info i give them frames them
plucky mantle
let town lose 
cunning phoenix
But maybe thats okey
plucky mantle
They will complain that the info i give them frames them
then stop metaing the ST
cunning phoenix
Ok
plucky mantle
crazy I know
(I just help evil bluff Savant. But like if you need a weaker savant/fish just give new offmeta shit)
cunning phoenix
Do you have any resources for savant info that isnt the website that give off those generic statements
plucky mantle
Do you have any resources for savant info that isnt the website that give off th...
I mean I suggest longest line of alternating char types
cunning phoenix
Also my group really doesnt like the "youre witch cursed" type statements because its actionable
plucky mantle
"X people woke last night."
plucky mantle
Also my group really doesnt like the "youre witch cursed" type statements becaus...
you have to die tho
actually
cunning phoenix
Evil team complains that it is optimal to die there
Because it confirms "no vortox"
plucky mantle
bluff that
plucky mantle
Because it confirms "no vortox"
ok so don't give it early right
cunning phoenix
Okey
plucky mantle
(yeah it's uh, a lategame thing)
cunning phoenix
Soo i see where i am going wrong
ruby sapphire
What type of savant info do i give in this script?
“An evil player was picked by the Al-Had”
“One of X, Y, Z is puzzledrunk/politician”
(mildly evil) “Today is a Xaan day”
“An executed player neighbors the Boomdandy”
“Nobleping.exe”
quaint dew
"The Preacher has chosen a Minion this game."
"The Princess' neighbours are good."
"The Snitch & Golem are in play."
"The Demon nominated yesterday."
"The Alsaahir guessed exactly 1 Minion correctly yesterday."
midnight wharf
~~golem isn't even a townsfolk on alhad scripts but aight~~
Golem isn't a townsfolk on alhad scripts, but puzzledrunking a golem still hurts town just as much as puzzledrunking a townsfolk does here.
A townsfolk has 2 utility points
A puzzledrunk townsfolk has -1 utility points
(on this script)[elsewhere]:
Golem has (-1)[1] utility points
A puzzledrunk golem has (-4)[-2] utility points
In contrast,
A sweetheart has -2 utility points
A puzzledrunk sweetheat has -1 utility points
azure jewel
I feel like it might be useful to move this to #experimental-chat given we're just talking about running Savant on customs in general and not about the design of RtC in particular? not speaking in modvoice here though i'm not your mom
midnight wharf
Golem isn't a townsfolk on alhad scripts, but puzzledrunking a golem still hurts...
"What is a utility point?", I hear you ask. "Surely it is a well defined concept that will stand up to scrutiny!"
-# (it isn't)
azure jewel
"What is a utility point?", I hear you ask. "Surely it is a well defined concept...
that's how all well-defined concepts started out, man, go nuts
just make shit up and eventually either:
a) people will define it for you, you realize they're wrong, and then you define it correctly
b) you go on a hero's journey involving a little bit of caffeine to figure out the magical words you can say that help everyone understand the concept and then post it in a fugue state like archimedes in his bathtub
midnight wharf
Fr i think having some hard-to-grapple-with abstrac concept and squishing it into a nice well defined concept is probably why I like maths so much
plucky mantle
Golem isn't a townsfolk on alhad scripts, but puzzledrunking a golem still hurts...
... this feels like my source is I made it up
azure jewel
no hear him out
plucky mantle
not until the wall of text
midnight wharf
... this feels like my source is I made it up
Yes but it is also legit!!
Golem has a pretty strong upside (can clear a demon candidate/ be pretty sure someone is the demon before they are executed) and a downside (can only nominate once). This downside lets evil TPK much easier, and is the most damaging when evil has multiple nightkills.
A puzzledrunk golem still has this downside - the downside is completely unchanged by their puzzledrunk status. But their upside is severely weakened by being puzzledrunk, and I now reckon that this weakening is even greater than the amount a townsfolk is weakened when puzzledrunk. This is because a puzzledrunk golem is very likely to cause town to waste an execution, and very few townsfolk are quite that likely to waste an execution.
-# (Maybe like... investigator, but even then, not really imo - since town knows they're not getting a minion or whatever)
This means that puzzledrunking a golem is incredibly damaging for town - probably more so than most tf being puzzledrunk.
In contrast, puzzledrunking a sweetheart partially negates the downside of the sweetheart (only partially, since the threat of SH-drunkenness remains) so it is a puzzledrunking that helps town.
plucky mantle
Yes but it is also legit!!
Golem has a pretty strong upside (can clear a demon ...
but like
... yknow you could puzzleguess the golem
midnight wharf
I've never met a golem that nommed earlier than d3 in a 2 minion game (well I have but he is just an idiot and knows it)
It happens
plucky mantle
I've never met a golem that nommed earlier than d3 in a 2 minion game (well I ha...
damn
I've never seen one spend past d1
midnight wharf
Huh fair
quaint heart
cunning phoenix
Evil Wins, people played like they were in Trouble Brewing so evil was stomping whole game.
Even thou the demon nominated the Gnome's friend like 2 times thou
It was a fun game thou
Evil won off boomdandy on 7 players alive
Boffin philosopher fisherman with recommended first 3 alhad picks in their order for them to all dieeeee
And they did all 3 die hahahahahahaha
cunning phoenix
Fisherman made it alive to be sober and used their ability in a framed Xaan Day.
Their info if sober confirmed 4 players on the spot
But that was the brilliant part about it, it was a framed Xaan day hahahaha
amber plank
Who was dead vs not?
cunning phoenix
Banshee (one of the players confirmed by the fisherman)
Town Crier (framed by the demom)
Ballonist (Alhad framing Town Crier as Demon)
@amber plank
I coop storytold this game, most savant information i didnt make it.
Also the amnesiac ability was an each night choose your own noble pings
Amnesiac solved it day 1
Shame they died in the next night hahahahahaha
cunning phoenix
Banshee (one of the players confirmed by the fisherman)
Town Crier (framed by th...
Banshee died
cunning phoenix
There were 3 travellers if you couldnt tell
halcyon topaz
Wdym by "played like they were in trouble brewing?"