paleontology

[manic beacon]

Anyone here has a little more than a guess to what this tooth (like 1cm in length) may belong to? Found in Germany near the place Archeopteryx, Compsognathus etc were found. I would like to know how to differentiate between a fish, ichthyosaur, plesiosaur or if it could even be from one of the few dinosaurs that lived their

[balmy oyster]

“fake spinosaurus species”
Looks inside
AI slop

[spice latch]

spinzo

[small geyser]

Was it possible for non-avian dinosaurs that were fully feathered as adults to have sparse or no feathering as hatchlings like most altricial birds?

[true juniper]

Very aesthetically pleasing curves from the top

[stiff osprey]

Yes, but most (all?) known feathered dinosaurs had precocial young, and so were likely feathered from birth

[outer tusk]

It's so sad because the guy who did this seems very passionate about spinosaurus but it's moreso just to have a JP3 and Paleo-accurate spino combo

[small geyser]

Thanks!

[outer tusk]

except for spinosaurus

[stiff osprey]

spinosaurus can already barely function bro do NOT take precocial young away from it

[fossil ingot]

Okey this lowkey Peak

[lofty furnace]

This is good news, If his Babies have more time to develop he will be more prepared and smart, have you ever seen Albert Einstein being a well developed infant when he was born?

[gleaming talon]

Alioramus

[cerulean elbow]

Alberta my beloved

[gleaming talon]

[balmy oyster]

Yes, my source is I was there when it happened

[lofty furnace]

No you didn't, because i was also there, i was the baby Albert Einstein

[balmy oyster]

[spice latch]

Bro please let it have SOMETHING

Gonna have to go with either oxalaia (because it’s so unknown) or magnapaulia (I like big hadrosaurs)

[outer tusk]

both by TPixel

[spice latch]

…Alr that’s pretty good
Hold the babies in its mouth like a gator mama

[fossil ingot]

Prob Gorgosaurus or Suchomimus

[runic heart]

Best baby spino I’ve seen

[queen oar]

Scipionyx

[lofty furnace]

Is it possible that baby Spinosaurus were quadrupedal like baby psittacosaurus? Perphaps It had a slimer tail that made the balancing harder or something
I know It's unlikely but like, is It at least hypothetically possible?

[queen oar]

depends on how you reconstruct a hatchling or infant Spinosaurus, I guess.

[little mauve]

theropod arms pretty much preclude them from being quadrupedal

[stiff osprey]

also, baby Spinosaurus would have a much easier time being bipedal than the adults, because as a baby falling on its face wouldn't obliterate its bones

[runic heart]

Is there still any kind of chance that Spinosaurus could walk or at least stand on all fours? Cause we don’t exactly have the arms.

[stiff osprey]

possible, sure, but it would need some strong evidence. ''It's poorly balanced with current models'' isn't that

[runic heart]

We need them arms, which the new Brazilian spinosaur might have?

[outer tusk]

Are we really that desperate?

[runic heart]

None of it is desperate. It would just be nice to have the stuff.

[outer tusk]

looking at the rumored thing. it's not looking good at all

[runic heart]

Eh

[charred hearth]

https://x.com/NatSciChannel/status/2036212004160163974 thoughts?

EDGE Central (@NatSciChannel)

🚨NEW STUDY DROP🚨

Chasmosaurus russelli is no more! The species has been assigned to a new genus, Cryptarcus! They found the features that were used to put it in the chasmo genus were not strong enough to keep it there.

🎨: Tuomas Koivurinne

X · Mar 23, 2026, 10:42 PM

[tough parcel]

It's true

[little mauve]

Dinosaurs are ancestrally bipedal and thats why theropods are too, they inherited the default mode. Quadrupedality developed in sauropods and ornithiscians but it was a multi-step process for each group with lots of intermediate forms. We have nothing like that for spinosaurus or spinosaurids in general.

[charred hearth]

how does the mojoceratops nmation feel https://x.com/omegafreelancer/status/2036214322674708594

Omegafreelancer (Commissions OPEN!) (@omegafreelancer)

We lost Mojoceratops for NOTHING

X · Mar 23, 2026, 10:51 PM

[tough parcel]

Saying that as if anyone cared about Mojoceratops

[frigid delta]

and yet still no papers/news abt my goat Agathaumas

[balmy oyster]

Any ceratopsian without a skull is sent to the shadow realm for all eternity (until a specimen with overlap is described (never))

[charred hearth]

her thick was your average ceratopsian frill?

[balmy oyster]

Also wait why is mojoceratops no longer a thing again

[charred hearth]

idk, but the first skull is now a new ceratopsian

[balmy oyster]

Tbf it sort of was for a while, it’s now just not a sister species to chasmosaurus belli

[novel trellis]

[icy lagoon]

I was tracking we had arms, why do people always say this

nvm apparently it can't be associated to spinosaurus because there isn't any overlapping material of the arms they found

[woeful falcon]

someone can correct me if I'm wrong but I believe only the holotype of Chasmosaurus russelli is a new ceratopsian, while that skull isn't the holotype. It's just one of the specimens (CMNFV 2280 I believe) that was previously referred to C. russelli and will now need reassessment.

[stiff osprey]

correct, only the holotype is reclassified, but given it's the holotype the species now explodes

[woeful falcon]

yeah. maybe some of the referred stuff will find its way back!

[frigid delta]

ok but what abt Monoclonius???

[balmy oyster]

it...depends

[frigid delta]

how's Nedoceratops/Diceratus?

[frigid delta]

ig sm ceratopsians are fated to meet their demise

[limpid sun]

I'm reading this book from 2016, and I was wondering if there's any new or outdated info in the last 10 years since this was published.
So far I noticed that in the book Nanotyrannus isn't an established genus, and this was before skin impressions of Tyrannosaurus were discovered.
But is there anything other new info?

[queen oar]

Just out of curiosity, how large would H. gorgops be there?

[hardy sentinel]

slightly bigger than a modern hippo

[queen oar]

Bigger, no?

[runic rover]

"grizzly bear is faster and smarter"-Aah take

[outer tusk]

another one

[spice latch]

HIPPO MY GOAT

[jagged trellis]

why do people direly wish to watch a hippo get violated

[charred hearth]

How much faster is a hippo then a sucho though?

[spice latch]

it won

Chunky bird?

[fossil ingot]

Slightly yeah

[fossil ingot]

Prob depends the size of the Hippo and Sucho, Hippo may be faster in short Bursts simply due to how much heavier Sucho is at max sizes

[fossil ingot]

Lowkey wished the Holotype had more Material

[spice latch]

Last time I put that chunky hatz here I got chewed out

[jagged trellis]

unless i watched a different one, he did outright say sucho would win more times than not
....which is just underselling sucho still and AvA slop but eh

[novel trellis]

[hardy sentinel]

Because Jurassic world decided to show a hippo having an even fight with a Suchomimus

[tough parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/suchomimus-suchomimus-primitive-war-primitive-war-dinosaurs-gif-17478360761096002050

[crisp matrix]

Not really, the species just moves into the new genus and the rest of the referred material gets put into Chasmosaurus indet. I guess that kinda counts as “exploding” but it happens a lot.

[hardy sentinel]

"I believe this matchup is surpisingly close"
https://youtu.be/UQlbvkkieZQ?si=ex0Gv_HmeI-OCFlB

[fossil ingot]

Well even to an extent yeah

[dapper spoke]

Zuko is NOT that big

[steep atlas]

Hippo dies horribly

[runic heart]

Out of all the animals in prehistoric planet, the best and most consistent cgi and animation HAS to go to Tarbosaurus.

Such an awesome design for the creature as well.

[coral forge]

it is

[dapper spoke]

The image shows zuko being almost twice the height of a person

[coral forge]

the image is the exact same size as the skeletal

[tender dove]

Hello, Zuko here

[brave nova]

Yea that’s roughly the same size Eventhough it’s an old look for Sucho

[dapper spoke]

Ur image makes zuko look taller but maybe thats because its heads up

[queen oar]

Did you know I drawed a H. gorgops? :trollface:

[brave nova]

The person in the comparison is just a different size

[dapper spoke]

Lemme get another one

[brave nova]

Use actual Skeletals and not just google images

Hartmans, serenos or Dans. Hartmans and serenos are basically the same anyway

[dapper spoke]

Wait mb ur actually right, zuko really is huge lol

[steep atlas]

Let's see it

[fossil ingot]

Thats an Old Sucho

[lavish frigate]

What piece of media does this originate from?

[fossil ingot]

That too

[tulip dove]

Primitive War, I believe

[lavish frigate]

Primitive war has a sucho?

[tulip dove]

Think that's the only cameo it makes in the entire movie

And another scene where it's squaring up against some soldiers for 4 additional seconds (It doesn't do anything really)

[fossil ingot]

Peak Animal

[fossil ingot]

Yes
And that is its only Cameo

[charred hearth]

Hi

[queen oar]

I did it on Paint, so I unfortunately had some limitations, the body is more based on " Hippopotamus tiberinus ", but that guy seems to have been lumped into H. antiquus, so it's more based on H. antiquus now ( I guess )

[steep atlas]

Hey that's really good!

[outer tusk]

you mean Cristatusaurus

[remote mauve]

Y'all heard about those Spinosaurid neck vertebrae they found in Australia a while back

[spice latch]

https://tenor.com/view/neuron-activation-neuron-gif-1455356329209493514

[remote mauve]

Hey it's only neck vertebrae so idk it could be something else

[slow stirrup]

I just saw this and we need it

[wicked horizon]

U lost me at generated with ai

[zealous ravine]

That art is probably not entirely right. It depicts the animal as younger than it actually was

[full lagoon]

Unfortunately it throws AI generated responses every search

[wicked horizon]

Sad

[slow stirrup]

Yeah boo at the AI I didn't see that until after I posted it

[outer tusk]

as mentioned before something like Fona would be a GREAT reference for this guy

[inland silo]

Hey yall, im going to be writing about the history of the appearance of Spinosaurus for one of my college english essays. Do yall have any recommendations for videos or articles that go in-depth about how its depictions have changed over time?

[tough parcel]

https://youtu.be/KbbFfFeC_vk
Might help

[charred hearth]

thoughts? how accurate are tierzoo's video's on paleontology btw?

[spice latch]

HELLLL NO, STEGO AT C????

[outer tusk]

terrible

[full lagoon]

Don't take anything this guy says seriously + ranking animals will always be terribly biased

This is supposed to be in the context of combat?

[spice latch]

survival overall

[jagged trellis]

tier zoo claims cheetahs have horrid klepto handling issues despite having one of the best ratios for a mega fauna on it lmao

https://youtu.be/yoJOWOnbvzU?si=RssoDr54PqU4WDJH

[winter marsh]

half of centrosaurine crying in the corner rn

[dreamy lance]

@mental mural please do not post explicit images of injured or dead animals on this server.

[ashen wedge]

It’s bad, although I get the thought process

[balmy oyster]

No

[charred hearth]

i remember hgim saying that tail weaponary is worse then frontal weaponary ( like horns and antlers ) and i feel like thats a lie

[tough parcel]

I think we have ample proof that both work very well 🥀 he just made stuff up for clicks

[balmy oyster]

The entirety of that channel is AvA for modern day animals

[outer tusk]

Yuannosaurus

[spice latch]

That’s not a dinosaur that’s just a sausage with legs

[charred hearth]

how accurate is this Megistotherium? https://x.com/Visceral9000/status/2036599767543734726?

🦎Visceral🪶 (Tomistoma enjoyer🐊) (@Visceral9000)

This paleoart piece called “Megistotherium & Karianne” or “Karianne's Pet” by Carl Buell is one of the most wholesome art pieces I’ve seen period.

Just a girl and her (very large) strange dog :)

X · Mar 25, 2026, 12:23 AM

[frigid delta]

do y'all love your Maip feathered or scaled?

[opaque quail]

Hadrosaurs being hugely succesfull yet still being in D tier like actually what

[hardy sentinel]

Why is Coelophysis above Campto bro

[runic rover]

Both tbh, depending on the depiction.

Sometimes it just can't be without the horse-like mane, sometimes it's beautiful in its scaly glory.

[coral forge]

Being successful doesn't automatically make you good at fighting
Though ig it depends on what they defined as fighting for the tier list

[opaque quail]

Wait wait wait now i've both heard its a tier list for combat or for survival. Which is it?

[odd lintel]

I think that tier list what abt combat and survival

[ashen wedge]

Probably cause of its numbers and widespread over the world

[scenic flame]

No.

[spice latch]

Gaw dam I forgot how huge that mf is

[ashen wedge]

Why does everyone forget Campto be a hecking chonker

[runic heart]

Where is zhuchengtyrannus’s placement within tyrannosaurini? And is there a decent skeletal for it?

[undone rapids]

Its usually just outside of rex/tarbo iirc. But there's just two bones described so far

[neon flower]

I have question , since kelenken was technically an non avian bird yet still a bird would that make it technically a dinosaur? Even tho it do live in a Cenozoic era would that be considered a modern dinosaur?

[coral forge]

Kelenken was an avian, and all birds are dinosaurs, so it would be a dinosaur regardless

[neon flower]

Oh it was an avian?

Would it technically be pre modern avian

[runic heart]

Interesting. Is the head shape more akin to Rex or tarbo?

[topaz shell]

No

[neon flower]

Oh i see

[coral forge]

Yes, their closest living relatives are seriemas

[stiff osprey]

it would be closer to something like a falcon than an ostrich or chicken, so it's a pretty derived bird

[undone rapids]

idk, you'd wanna compare the maxila and dentary to the holotypes to know

[neon flower]

Yeah that’s what I mean like technically wouldn’t it be more close of a modern bird

[coral forge]

it was very close to modern birds

[neon flower]

So it’s like a grandpa to modern birds

[stiff osprey]

part of them in fact

In some way it was more "modern" anatomically than a chicken is

[neon flower]

Ok that was a dumb ass anology

[coral forge]

more like a cousin a few times removed but still part of the family

[neon flower]

Don’t get me wrong but I THINK you might enjoy hadrosaurs like lambeo

[neon flower]

Ohhh that makes sense like an older cousin

I have another question this one might be stupid (I’m not the best with my cenozics ) but would inostrancevia be considered a canine or like reptile

[stiff osprey]

It's neither a mammal nor a reptile but it's closer to mammals than to reptiles

[neon flower]

What would it be then

[coral forge]

Neither. It was a stem mammal, a relabive of mammals that isn't quite a mammal

[stiff osprey]

synapsida is the group that includes mammals, dimetrodon, inostrancevia, and all these other guys

[steep atlas]

Yes since it was prehistoric

[neon flower]

Thanks guys I just need more help with cenozic I’m usually pretty good with my dinosaurs tho

[steep atlas]

Always plenty more to learn. I love evolutionary relationships so feel free to ask me about them... anyone else here, feel free to correct me if i'm wrong

[steep atlas]

Maybe sparse filaments among scales

[scenic flame]

what is your opinion on the giga baboon and lock ness monster

[polar rain]

The loch ness monster got debunked a long time ago, it doesn't even have correct plesiosaur anatomy

[tough parcel]

Observe

[steep atlas]

No.

[sturdy kettle]

Eggs

Lochness reminds me of the Plesiosaurus that was found in Svalbard

My country!! 🇳🇴

[scenic flame]

https://tenor.com/view/tf2-spy-medic-kill-me-team-fortress2-gif-21078154

[runic heart]

Those supposed to be scales on the underside? I thought plesiosaurs didn’t have scales.

[stray wren]

Icthyosaurs didn't have scales, Plesiosaurs do last I remember

[craggy trench]

PK new baby stego

[ashen wedge]

So what’s the consensus for it?

[fossil ingot]

We will prob know more Soon once Suecheng gets described

Specially since Zucheng is more complete than the Holotype

[runic heart]

On the ends of the fins I believe. That might be it though, I’m not sure.

[outer tusk]

A couple more bones complete

[undone rapids]

Don't think there is any at the moment

[green helm]

new prehistoric crocodile, the crocodylus lucivenator

[outer tusk]

OH WHAT THE HELL it's actually complete

Nice

[ionic crescent]

Old countryside uncle croc

[odd lintel]

Peak

[obsidian tangle]

Anything that end in venator is automatically awesome

[oblique torrent]

Hiii, Did one of suchos fingers act more like a thumb or was it more like 3 big fingers cuz google is not helping me

I’m tryna draw one holding a controller for a meme but the question on everyone’s mind is… how would sucho hold a controller 🤔

[stiff osprey]

It would need to pinch it between two hands, all theropod fingers face inwards

[oblique torrent]

Thank you uwu✨

[fossil ingot]

Seems theres more
Rommel Mentioned they have a Good Idea of its size and even more stuff was been discovered with passing time
So its def more complete
Probably more Complete than what Spinosaurus Mirabilis was lol

[orchid lynx]

is it big?

[green helm]

it says its up to 4.5 meters or 15 feet, its smaller than todays nile crocodile and 1300 lbs

[outer tusk]

Can't wait for it to be publish in the next 5 years

[orchid lynx]

oh thats boring i only like big ones or weird looking 😄 maybe it was young tho

[outer tusk]

it was not young

[hardy sentinel]

it was a pvp tierlist

[charred hearth]

does anyone know what prehestoric animal sceptile is based off of? ( if the "grass type starters are based on prehestoric animals " theory is true ) i heard Sinosaurus but i dont see it

[ashen wedge]

Double crests…. So most likely Dilophosaurus

[outer tusk]

dilophosaurus

[warped peak]

Honestly could be nearly any theropod, 90% of them have crests over their eyes

[spice latch]

I’ve got a lil question

Yknow how wolves and cougars and such are so much smaller then their prey

How come so many dinosaurs don’t seem to follow this rule?

[queen oar]

which dinosaurs?

[fossil ingot]

Rommel said Paper was meant for this year
Wonder if the new added Material delayed it

[spice latch]

mainly in my head im thinkin about how absolutely massive tyrannosaurs are (rex and tarbo specifically)

[stiff osprey]

Many dinosaurs did hunt prey larger than themselves, like allosaurids, carcharodontosaurids, megalosaurids, dromaeosaurids, (probably) metriacanthosaurids

Tyrannosaurs have jaws evolved to kill prey with a quick crushing bite, which is different from 'normal' theropods. It doesn't work as well when your prey is much bigger than you are, because vital areas become harder to reach and tougher to bite through, and unlike cats, tyrannosaurs can't leap on top of prey

[orchid lynx]

how fast could triceratops run?

[outer tusk]

don't worry I will be the first one hating for no reason

[outer tusk]

OOH OH don't forget some more "basal" theropods like Dilophosaurus

[stiff osprey]

That said, of all tyrannosaurids, T.rex is really the only one that is larger on average than all its prey items. Tarbo hunted Saurolophus and Nemegtosaurus/Opisthocoelicaudia which were larger than itself, and Zhuchengtyrannus had Zhuchengtitan/Shantungosaurus

[queen oar]

Most of those theropods have adaptations for grasping and pinning down prey items that would have to be relatively or very small compared to their overall size and mass. Not to say that: " They can't hunt animals relatively large than them ", but I also feel like that sorta of scenario will only occur in very desperate circunstances.

[jolly spade]

Hi there, I'm barging in randomly but do we have any paper about the exact preys Giganotosaurus, Tyrannotitan and T. rex hunted respectively? I imagine T. rex has a lot but I suspect those for the first two are rarer.

(I didn't even notice the convo was almost about my question )

[stiff osprey]

Not about Giganotosaurus specifically but there is an abstract somewhere about how carcharodontosaurids preferred to eat titanosaur sauropods, let me go find it

here it is

[little mauve]

They all have ziphodont dentition which is specifically an adaptation for large prey

[queen oar]

How so?

[stiff osprey]

and aside from dromaeosaurids, they all have small arms, which is specifically not an adaptation to grasp small prey

grasping much smaller prey requires you to have a lot of downward reach and agility, most easily reached by long arms (or a long thin neck like spinosaurids)

[runic heart]

And Spinosaurus has both.

[stiff osprey]

spinosaurids, unenlagiids, noasaurids, dromaeosaurids, troodontids, and (maybe) megaraptorans are well adapted to hunt small prey

[queen oar]

Most Theropods with short arms, have claws, meaning that they have not made those traits dormant or mutated to completely or mostly lack them, like Abelisaurs. Meaning that those claws still are important to how those animals function. Also, the short arm argument, is only smart, if you do not consider that having shorter arms means that a lot of those theropods can pin smaller prey against their chest, which tends to be a range where they can bend their necks and reach that prey with their jaws.

[native kindle]

they do, and arguably just as often if not way more often

[little mauve]

They're for inflicting debilitating wounds and causing massive shock through blood loss, which is a strategy only applicable to large prey. Small prey specialists have more conical teeth for quickly grasping prey and likely swallowing it whole

[outer tusk]

oh hey Random, you might not care but have you seen a ai spinosaurus skeletal?

[stiff osprey]

i probably have during the early days, although real artists can make similarly bad skeletals

[queen oar]

If only we did not had a paper commenting on Allosaurus feeding mechanisms, hinting at Theropod, or if not, mostly Carnosaur feeding tends to be pretty similar to birds of prey like falcons, who eat piece by piece of their prey item. What else they do? Oh idk? Often pin their prey down and eat them alive sometimes? Curious.

[stiff osprey]

I too have various numbers of toe bones depending on which foot i'm looking at

[outer tusk]

more context

[stiff osprey]

of course it was S.dorsojuvencus

[queen oar]

Also, i'm gonna be honest here, most evidence we have for Carnosaurs and Dromaeosaurs hunting large prey item, tends to be evidence that often times can be contested to being damage being done post-mortem, rather than definitive evidence like Ceratopsians and Hadrosaurs surviving Tyrannosaur encounters.

[outer tusk]

wait you've heard of it before? like am serious what does the species name even mean

[little mauve]

All that paper really supports is that the main driver of an allosaur's bite whether attacking or feeding was in the neck, which is the same for komodo dragons that hunt large prey with similar dentition

[queen oar]

If we oversight anything else, indeed.

[stiff osprey]

idk, but I was there when Eng first made up the specimens

it's unfortunate because there is probably some interesting Spinosaurus material mixed up in there

[tough parcel]

Isn't this the guy whose comments called you a bunch of weird stuff cause you downsized Deinosuchus

[stiff osprey]

Is it? I don't think Eng has ever talked about Deinosuchus

[tough parcel]

No I mean this guy

[queen oar]

It's also not ecologically pratical to your only surviving strategy as a carnivore being to kill a idk how many tons animal, with the risk associated with that, and often times being more benificial to feed on the offspring of those animals ( Or older individuals, have to add that, or someone is gonna ask it )

Truly, Carnosaurs and Dromaeosaurs went extinct, due to how much meat they wasted and effectivelly killing off all of the herbivores in their ecosystems, driving them to become non-functional ( being sarcastic btw )

[stiff osprey]

Oh then maybe, I didn't open the link last time the comments were sent and I don't want to

[outer tusk]

https://youtu.be/MOzPnRnmelE?si=CXv6DJwCYPod9n-r he also made this masterpiece

he also made 11 species of a footprint

[tough parcel]

Sounds about right to all three messages

[outer tusk]

like how do you just make 11 speices out of nothing but a print

[little mauve]

How is an adult Torvosaurus going to compete with a Marshosaurus as a small prey specialist? It isn't

[stiff osprey]

Those are real I think, ichnotaxa can be cracked

[outer tusk]

yeah I know just still find it very baffling that bro would do all of this

[little mauve]

And why is there a concurrent trend towards gigantism between theropods and their prey consistently throughout the Mesozoic?

[queen oar]

truly, I used the word small prey specialist, didn't I? Besides the fact that I didn't, and explicitly said " Relatively or very small ", so never really specifying how small that is, other than it's " Smaller than that animal ". Also, I don't think that doesn't respond to anything that I said in that specific comment, not that there is, the logic is like Lions hunting down adult elephants.

[queen oar]

Also, so true... Let me see... Deinonychus- No, that guy is too small compared to most animals there. Allosaurus...? - Damn it! Everything is Sauropods! What about Dilophosaurus... Oh for f*ck's sake! Why are you bigger than everything in your formation?!

[spice latch]

It’s true though

[little mauve]

A trend towards gigantism, not that they were equal size. In fact your explanation would predict the largest herbivores in a given ecosystem would be only as large or slightly smaller than the largest predator, if that was sufficient to their defense. In fact we see the opposite as demonstrated by deinonychus and allosaurus and others, i.e. ecosystems where the largest herbivores are significantly larger than the largest predator

It's only in tyrannosaur faunas that we see somewhat of what you're predicting, because tyrannosaurs were hunting differently than earlier groups of theropods and their prey was defending itself differently

[queen oar]

True. If you don't count ontogeny, truly they were always the largest than their contemporary predators. Also, I get that I also was very selective there when joking about it, but reality is that, is only true if you count those herbivores, and not count any other herbivore or potential prey item ( significant, as not every prey must be a herbivore ) being significant to those carnivores life-cycle or function in that ecosystem. Realistically speaking, Carnosaurs are mostly hypothesized on functioning by hunting sauropods, because that's what is given the most emphasizes, Allosaurus hunting a young Camptosaurus, instead of a Adult dangerous Stegosaurus or Apatosaurus, is very less " Cool ", so the opposite scenario is prioritized over anything else.

[stiff osprey]

It's particularly interesting that even when offered prey their own size or smaller (rebbachisaurids), carcharodontosaurids prefer to eat the larger titanosaurs anyway

[queen oar]

I don't think I have to repeat it.

[stiff osprey]

Possibly because large carcasses are just more attractive to scavenging, but could also be because a larger sauropod is less agile and therefore easier to catch, or that the risk of hunting a bigger animal is offset by the larger amount of food given, or that a 10t juvenile titanosaur is less ''experienced'' at defense than a 5t adult rebbachisaur

[queen oar]

Random, that is literally the meme of like " Thanks to my agility, i'm sure to win! ", but I agree with the latter part.

[stiff osprey]

Likely all of the above

[queen oar]

Also, to explain this, it's like saying that " Hypothetically a 50 ton steel ball would be too slow, and I would be sure to dodge it, thanks to my agility! ", unless you don't emphasize gravity, and forget that by how much strength associated with that object being thrown and relative weight of that object, you would in most scenarios: ||Die||

[little mauve]

Really has nothing to do with what's cooler or not. You still haven't sufficiently explained ziphodont teeth repeatedly evolving in large bodied theropod lineages, an adaptation specific to large prey. Or their trends towards gigantism. Or how they'd compete with smaller mesopredators on the same prey base

[queen oar]

So true, do you want to explain how unlike Ceratopsians and Hadrosaurs we do not see evidence of Sauropods surviving encounters with Carnosaurs, or to make it more easy, why we don't see evidence of Tenontosaurus surviving encounters with per say, Deinonychus?

Also, I think this is just very bad reasoning, because if it was not the case, and a lot of these theropods did not grow any larger, which some of the theropods of these formations didn't do, then you would make up another point that would have nothing to do with this.

[stiff osprey]

The smaller mesopredators actually only hunted microscopic prey, thus avoiding competition with large predators hunting small prey

[queen oar]

Also, just to refresh what I brought earlier, if those theropods are only hunting animals larger than them, and therefore animals that they cannot physically, not even nearly possible, pin down or grasp, why do they still have handclaws for that sorta of function? And did not went to a similar route like Abelisauris or idk, Elaphrosaurines?

[little mauve]

Pathologies of any kind are very rare, but especially hunting related. If you're waiting for that as the only evidence you'll accept you'll wait a long time

[stiff osprey]

Reminds me of a trend i've seen with some herbivorous dinosaur fans

healed pathology = the prey escaped, therefore the predator could not hunt that prey
non healed pathology = it must have been scavenging, therefore the predator could not hunt that prey

conclusion: predators can't hunt anything

[queen oar]

I would, patiently wait for that, rather than imagining the " Lion hunting Adult Elephants " scenario. Also, unlike every other point, this is the only one that you cannot offer any reasonable explanation, which doesn't mean anything, we don't have answers to every argument, but it just shows you don't have one.

[little mauve]

I could also say that bone related predation pathologies are going to be even rarer when it comes to gigantophagy because soft tissue is the primary target, indeed probably the only possible target

[jagged trellis]

you shoulda see gen chat w this earlier today lmao

[little mauve]

I just answered it in my previous response

How is an allosaur going to inflict damage to bones with a sauropod also escaping the encounter?

[jolly spade]

Oh thanks, do you happen to have a link or at least the full title (with datation) of the abstract? And did Carcharodontosaurids only target animals at least as big as them or did they hunt smaller prey too?

[queen oar]

True. Also, I'm gonna just point out this, if Carnosaurs were so commonly hunting Sauropods, and per chance, Carcharodontosaurs are hunting Titanosaurs so much, why is it that all odds are against showing pathologies that would confirm prey and predator interaction between those two?

It happens with a reasonable frequency for Tyrannosaurs and their contemporary prey, so, what is the difference here?

[little mauve]

Because carnosaurs are attacking soft tissue and not inflicting damage to the bone in their initial attack like tyrannosaurs are

[queen oar]

But then we cannot confirm that Gbones, that would just be a hypothetical, where it could or couldn't happen. C'mon buddy!

[light osprey]

Fascinating examples chosen

[little mauve]

Gape studies support it

[sullen cairn]

arent most healed predator-induced pathologies in ceratopsids/hadrosaurs in the skull regardless

[queen oar]

I like the stupid size of Dilophosaurus ( I'm biased )

[sullen cairn]

hypothetically if we were looking for something similar in sauropods thats gonna be at least somewhat impacted by there being relatively way fewer sauropod skulls

[queen oar]

Believe so, yeah.

[thorn grove]

Also Sauropod skulls seem an unlikely target for most Carnosaurs...

[little mauve]

Thats a really interesting idea

[sullen cairn]

i'd kinda suspect this might just be the case as well but in that scenario the comparison with pathologies in ceratopsids/hadrosaurs falls apart in any case

[stiff osprey]

It was posted in 2023, not sure which convention but I'll try to find out.

And carchs most certainly hunted smaller prey too, juvenile sauropods primarily, which were slower and less agile than other small animals and less well-defended. They just would be competing with tons of more abundant and faster predators when doing so, while larger subadult and adult sauropods would be something only the carchs could tackle

[queen oar]

tbh, I was requesting for pathologies, but hypothetically, if any Carnosaur hunted a Sauropod, they would most likely just bite the tail, or the legs right? Which, at least for Titanosaurs, I don't think there is a lot.

[jolly spade]

I see. I'm surprised they only hunted sauropods in the vast majority of cases.

[little mauve]

Caudofemoralis, the femoral artery, tendons in the legs probably, the belly is right there too. Komodos tend to go low first to bring the animal to its knees or side then they attack the throat or eat it alive. Low browsing and grazing sauropods would have very vulnerable throats as well even when standing

[light osprey]

Your first two examples I don’t think disagree with the idea of concurrent trends in gigantism between theropods and their prey, kayenta is probably just an incomplete picture of the megafauna

[undone rapids]

Could you also find that one small sauropod tail pathology citation.

[queen oar]

Okay but like, if you tried to bite the belly, you would only start to sing that song by Frank Sinatra, " I bite off More than I can chew! "

[balmy oyster]

Fast food

[queen oar]

" Can I eat some sauropods? "
" Only a spoonful! "
comically large spoon

[stiff osprey]

Carchs are mostly found in environments that are very sauropod dominated; differs from tyrannosaurs which had plenty of other groups of large herbivores to hunt

[little mauve]

Allosaurus again showing development of an extreme gape

[jolly spade]

Interesting. If you can just find more info on the 2023 paper it'd be perfect, but thank you already!

[light osprey]

The hadrus bides it’s time until a sea level drop when they too can takeover the southern hemisphere home of the sauropodus

[undone rapids]

I don't think that sauropod-carch paper has been published yet, its just an abstract atm

[stiff osprey]

it hasn't, I have been trying to find which abstract book it's in, but finding the source of an abstract from a title is hard

[stiff osprey]

Titanosaurs were outcompeted by hadrosaurs during the late cretaceous due to their superior chewing. This is why they were still regularly producing giant taxa and successfully crossed over to hadrosaur-dominated north america

[queen oar]

Okay, but like, isn't that just testing how much, hypothetically, the mouth of theropods could spread open? And like, let's say you are a Allosaurus, and you bite at some Apatosaurus belly, you better wish you can spread your jaw even further, because you gonna be stuck!

[little mauve]

The extreme gape of allosaurus is an anomaly that calls for explanation. And no they won't be stuck thats precisely what ziphodont teeth are good at, slicing through flesh and not getting stuck

[light osprey]

A desperate last-ditch attempt to preserve their presence before the asteroid kills all the dinosaurs, a group that were clearly going into decline in the end Cretaceous

[thorn grove]

Mammalian cunning would have defeated them all within a few million years regardless, the asteroid was simply a mercy

[jagged trellis]

the mammalian cunning when taxation

[stiff osprey]

To be honest I think it was a viable, if rare, strategy. You can easily kill a sauropod much larger than yourself by suffocation if you catch it with its head low. The difficult part would be finding one, presumably you would have to wait until one laid down to sleep (as even animals that sleep standing up have to lie down once in a while to get proper REM sleep)

[charred hearth]

how concrete would y'all say the rest of the connections between grass starters and prehestoric animals are?

[thorn grove]

That's a fair enough point tbh but I can't imagine it would be nearly as common as Tyrannosaurs going for Ceratopsids and Hadrosaur skulls as a killing blow

[stiff osprey]

definitely not, as gbones said your average theropod is going for soft tissue damage when trying to kill things, not bone crushing (or airway crushing i guess would be the term here)

[true juniper]

Should I watch this and risk a cortisol spike

[outer tusk]

WATCH IT!

[true juniper]

After watching the videos and browsing over the sheer hubris in the comments section I am gonna huff a Tank of copium and convince myself that this is All satire

[outer tusk]

it's not

[true juniper]

Don't ruin my fantasy kuitaran-san

[jolly spade]

I see. Is the full title the one in uppercase in the screenshot Random showed earlier?

[obsidian tangle]

I’m bored, why was saltasaurus so fat?

[stiff osprey]

probably ate mainly plants that were difficult to digest and so needed very long intestines

[true juniper]

R o b u s t

[obsidian tangle]

Oh that’s neat, long intestines, do we know why it’s so wide from the ribs or something else?

[stiff osprey]

I don't know if salta has ribs preserved but its hips are ultra wide (also seen in other titanosaurs but not to the same extent)

[obsidian tangle]

Dang saltasaurus be thicc

[true juniper]

Simply too rotund for predation

[stiff osprey]

Also it seems like many depictions of it are exaggerated, it's not THAT wide

[obsidian tangle]

Oh wow, the hips are still super wide

[ionic crescent]

But people do like the mighty Saltapotamus

[obsidian tangle]

I like the saltopotamus too

[fossil ingot]

Eotriceratops and Titanceratops? Appreciation Post

[light osprey]

Saltasaurus isn’t beating the allegations unfortunately

[stiff osprey]

someone please measure eotrikes postcrania we cant let it be smaller than the average horridus with a 2.7m skull

[fossil ingot]

Why is bro drawn as a Balloon

[fossil ingot]

Adam lite
But its Actually small this time

[obsidian tangle]

Because it’s a speculative exaggeration

[sullen cairn]

the fate of the free world hinges upon a single gat skeletal

[obsidian tangle]

Ain’t no way titanoceratops used that strong jaw and sharp beak only for plants and roots

[fossil ingot]

Suffer

[sullen cairn]

where did he even get 90% of the postcranial dimensions? who knows

[stiff osprey]

every time i see this photo i remember an ancient day in the PK server where someone said ''it's interesting how eotrike is smaller than trike since its skull looks bigger'' but typed an N instead of a B

[sullen cairn]

ngl if it werent for pot that'd probably be the most cultural relevancy eotrike would ever have after the gat skeletal

[jagged trellis]

erhm the random jw figure

[queen oar]

me when the skull reconstruction that I hate.

[stiff osprey]

maybe big john is a late surviving eotriceratops and thats why it has a comically large head

[fossil ingot]

Ngl is Scary how big this Skulls Get LOL

[fossil ingot]

Big John wasn't getting trike ladies so it hide itself as a Torosaurus and get Toro ladies

[balmy oyster]

This is one of my greatest fears

[balmy oyster]

As punishment it got sold off never to be studied for its transgressions

[fossil ingot]

True

[severe yew]

so do this means there is an "anti-dinosaur" ?

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-026-00950-w

[tough parcel]

Yea, it's called asteroids

[queen oar]

" The patient needs mouse-bites to live "

[tough parcel]

The medicine drug..

[true juniper]

How gassy would Saltasaurus get
This is a genuine Paleontologian question

[stray wren]

Triceratopsine Titanoceratops truther

[sullen cairn]

this guy gets it

[fossil ingot]

Fadeno's Titanoceratops
Its been a while

[outer tusk]

I stilll have that old skeletal

[balmy oyster]

https://tenor.com/view/lego-boombox-pharrell-williams-gif-7428481373525741618

[charred hearth]

what would've moved faster in the water ( assuming the animals are the same size )

ichtyosaurs or plesiosaurs?

[wary heath]

I'd say ichthyosaurus just because it's built more like a fish.

[rich vessel]

https://tenor.com/view/ichthyosaur-swimming-turning-rotating-natural-history-museum-alive-gif-5770430960534163229

[queen oar]

What's the deal of the hype over a giant pentaceratops?

[spice latch]

Big dino cool

[stray wren]

Triceratopsine Titanoceratops is the one truth

[sullen cairn]

beyond the charm of early triceratopsini there is the dual benefit of ending anagensis conversations with one simple step

[queen oar]

Yeah, gonna dip it into some bbq sauce and eat it

[queen oar]

Also elaborate, you got me curious

[fossil ingot]

I love how it looks

[bronze storm]

Personally my favorite ceratopsian but larger

[sullen cairn]

the whole agujaceratops->utahceratops->pentaceratops->navajoceratops->terminocavus->coahuilaceratops->arrhinoceratops->triceratops uninterrupted lineage idea kinda falls flat if there's an animal closest to triceratops contemporary with pentaceratops

[fossil ingot]

Torosaurus is and will always be my Favorite
And Adam will just make that go even higher
Tho Fadeno Titanoceratops more specifically its pretty much my 2nd Fav

[queen oar]

Actually you can have that, without Titano

[sullen cairn]

i suppose a grade one would expect under that model has never actually been recovered in the first place tmk but in any case titanoceratops is so comically incongruent with the idea regardless its hard to dislike it

[queen oar]

Guess who lives with Anchiceratops, chasmosaurinae with the first epiparietals fused and Arrhinoceratops a chasmosaurinae with the first epiparietals not fused

[sullen cairn]

yeah most of the transformations that are supposed to be critical to the anagenesis model just kinda have random reversals apparently going on which is moderately amusing

[queen oar]

Tbh, similar thing with Centrosaurinae anagenesis where supposed " More Derived " and " Less Derived " forms are found at random in the same formation

[balmy oyster]

ComeAlongPenta

[foggy crypt]

Can someone please explain, I don't remember baby stegos being plate and spikeless

[fossil ingot]

Tbh making a Stego like this beauty is hard unless you bring Dr Latt Demphy himself like PK Did
But ngl trying to atleast make it similar can't be to hard, can it?

[tough parcel]

@hallow spear Explain.

[balmy oyster]

tbf fitting 4 thagomizers and an entire set of plates is a hard feat to accomplish inside an egg, makes sense they'd gradually have everything be built up over the course of the animals life

[foggy crypt]

Oooooooh, that's why

[little mauve]

the smallest juveniles we know of have plates iirc

[stiff osprey]

the plates at least are likely not something that the animal was born with, although they did develop quickly after birth (we have a pony-sized juvenile stego with a pretty normal looking plate)

At the size of PK's baby they should definitely be a lot more developed than this but it'd be a reasonable hatchling design

[little mauve]

THe long shadow of Land Before Time

[stiff osprey]

I do wonder if they play a bigger role in antipredator defense than we think given that pony-sized juvenile is definitely nowhere near sexual maturity

[little mauve]

the question is why does a baby develop display structures slash thermoregulatory structure slash whatever Edit: jinx

[charred hearth]

where do you guys think dinosaurs lean on the sexual dimorphism graph?

reptile ( not much )

or

birds ( extreme in some species )

[little mauve]

Antipredator seems like a likely possibility given they acquire them so early. In a small stegosaur it could disrupt the silhouette at a distance making it a harder target, we don't know how they were patterned there could be a camoflage element as well. In general it would make them harder to tackle and handle as prey items

[little mauve]

crocs are the exception to this rule in reptiles, but so are komodo dragons and others

[charred hearth]

is it just mainly size for them?

[little mauve]

pretty extreme size differences and behavior, yeah

[charred hearth]

behavior?

[little mauve]

male crocs disperse over large distances, females less so if at all

[charred hearth]

ah alright, im gonna assume komodo's are the same?

[little mauve]

Komodos have limited their territoriality in their artificially tight environment but general hierachies at kill sites and points of interaction are the same with large males dominating

females actually disperse in komodos I think

[stiff osprey]

I suspect the really large sauropods would select towards larger females because a) larger mom typically means more egg production in reptiles and b) less strain on the female when/if mounted by a male if she's bigger than him

but given the total lack of concrete sexual dimorphism in dinosaurs we can't ever tell

[little mauve]

in a thousand years we'll have big enough sample sizes

[charred hearth]

are pterosaurs the only mezosoic group we have some evidence of sexual dimorphism for?

[little mauve]

if she's too big though she can't be mounted, which may select for very narrow differences in size between the sexes. Just a possibility

[little mauve]

it's been controversially detected in dinosaurs, this is one of the more recent claims of detection (https://elifesciences.org/articles/89158)

[stiff osprey]

Huh male komodos are bigger than females, why did I think it was the other way around

[little mauve]

male-male combat partly selects for larger males in all varanids afaik and they're all highly dimorphic in size

[stiff osprey]

you could suggest ankylosaurs and ceratopsids had larger males given all the intraspecific combat but 100% of individuals have those display features so who's to say the females weren't fighting just as much

[little mauve]

they have an incredibly skewed sex ratio at adulthood too 3+ males to every female

Mutual sexual selection seems like a good model for dinosaurs given we don't have a bunch of bald ceratopsids and ankylosaurs

[jagged trellis]

insert barnacle joke here

[little mauve]

I think that speaks as well to those structures also being heavily antipredator in their evolution and function

their development doesn't seem to coincide with sexual or skeletal maturity

[balmy oyster]

considering the thing that hunts them gets larger than modern day elephants on average with adaptations specified for crushing everything ever I'd imagine both you and your gf would also be well armed and bulked out

[candid cove]

How do you guys feel about this 1979 interpretation of ceratopsians

[balmy oyster]

the triceratops is horrible but this is funny

[little mauve]

rare miss for McLoughlin, who was putting feathers on theropods in the 70s

[candid cove]

I guess considering the time this book isnt too bad but there's still alot of strange things in it

[little mauve]

It's very advanced for the time, dinosaur heresis wouldn't come out until 86 and digging dinosaurs 88 both are considered the seminal popular texts of the dinosaur rennaisance. There are some silly ideas in all of them though for sure

oh and predatory dinosaurs of the world should be included there, also 88

[candid cove]

Thats interesting, now im gonna have to look into this more lol

[little mauve]

there's a copy on archive.org (https://archive.org/details/archosaurianewlo00mclo) truly one of my favorite dinosaur books ever

[queen oar]

tbh isn't it just partially right? Because yeah, the execution here is not correct, but we did find that the neck tissues did attach a lot more onto the frill, no?

[little mauve]

It did but only to the base of the frill I'm pretty sure, nothing like he reconstructed, but fair enough I'll give it to him. McLoughlin rules

[queen oar]

still crazy that Paleoartists who think out of the box tend to predict something eventually... But to be honest, it's like... Uuuuuuuuh... How do people say?

Suggesting 100 different scenarios, eventually one of those scenarios will be right ( something like that )

[little mauve]

monkeys on a typewriter

[queen oar]

yup.

[little mauve]

Gerhard Heillmann was doing perfect paravians in the 20s

[candid cove]

I got the book from a thrift store as a gift aswell as some others

[little mauve]

Nice!! You have an underrated classic in your hands friend, what edition is it?

Heillmann's art, look at that hand anatomy

[candid cove]

First?

[candid cove]

That is incredible

[little mauve]

yep that's a first edition, very cool I'm jealous. Been meaning to pick up a copy off of ebay all these years but never pulled the trigger

[candid cove]

I wasn't even aware, thats really cool thank you

[little mauve]

Read it! Enjoy 🙂

[queen oar]

Would you eat Archaeopteryx wings?

[little mauve]

only if I was marooned in the Solnhofen archipelago

[queen oar]

@little mauve What if we invaded the museum housing the Neotype of Spinosaurus to get exclusive photos of the material? ( Ibrahim only offered atoms of bread in his paper )

[little mauve]

I generally view Spinosaurus with detachment and wouldn' risk life and liberty to do so

[queen oar]

What if we invaded the museum housing the holotype of Agathaumas sylvestris to get exclusive photos of the material? ( Cope's illustrations and measurements are still fine )

[little mauve]

still a hard pass from me

[queen oar]

What if we invaded the museum housing the holotype of Giganotosaurus to get exclusive photos of the material?

[little mauve]

It wouldn't be exclusive for long, knowledge belongs to all mankind

[queen oar]

True... But it doesn't mean that one shouldn't get it first

@little mauve what if we went to hunt Edmontosauruses?

( There's too many of them, so you can't say that I would negatively impact the ecosystem )

[charred hearth]

https://x.com/rlatkdwls/status/2036850160387653881 thoughts?

김상진 (@rlatkdwls)

Maipsapien

X · Mar 25, 2026, 4:58 PM

[woeful falcon]

What uh, what thoughts could someone have lol

[tough parcel]

I love how in order to achieve sentience, animals need a human brain and similar anatomy

Literally no other way to achieve it apparently…

[queen oar]

True, let's level up the game, and get two brains instead, like Legacy Stegosaurus

[little mauve]

how else are they gonna design cars and vroom vroom go fast

dinosaur brain development is like this: smalll brain small brian small brain small body flight dense neurons small brain lots of neurons holy crap look at how many neurons there are. Without miniaturization they're never getting off the ground with respect to brains

[hallow spear]

What random said is correct, the plates should be more developed at that size thagomizers probably as well

[dense spindle]

@delicate scroll can I ask why ino got smaller?

[balmy oyster]

iirc it was a miscale at first

[queen oar]

" Small Brian "

[zealous ravine]

I laughed way too hard at this lmao

[sullen cairn]

i still maintain that at least 90% of people visiting the wcs have absolutely no clue what the ornatops skull actually is

[zealous ravine]

Never been but based on that photo I can see why, really need some sort of silhouette at the very least

[sullen cairn]

yeah the only thing actually conveying anything is the single rod

[queen oar]

hey @sullen cairn what if someone named a dinosaur after you?

[queen oar]

is that a Predentary?

[sullen cairn]

mesasaurus butacensis gen et sp nov

[sullen cairn]

premaxilla but that also took me way too long to figure out when i was there

[queen oar]

Do not fret, I've solved the mystery!!!! /j

[queen oar]

What do you think it is? Phylogenetically?

[sullen cairn]

i dont think the brachylophosaur identity has ever been contested
unless you mean within brachylophosaurini in which case no clue outside whats been published
i think mcfeeter's thesis might've included it as well iirc

[queen oar]

yeah, there seemed to have been no new attempts or contest of it's first placement

@sullen cairn What if I did a Ornatops skull reconstruction instead of the Nanuqsaurus one? ( I don't have access to nor permission to use work that includes the undescribed quadratojugal )

[sullen cairn]

you'd have a lot more to work with than nanuq in any case so probably would be preferable

[queen oar]

True. But would you be happy?

[sullen cairn]

ornatops deserves more love for being an >80 Ma hadrosaur so i'd say go for it

[queen oar]

You see, now I just tell you, what a certain demonic clown from a certainly not popular DnD Campaign has said once...

" Careful what you wish for!!! "

[sullen cairn]

https://tenor.com/view/monkeys-paw-paw-monkey-gif-17535679

[light osprey]

Have we ever considered the dinosaurs we already know show the trajectory of cerebrum expransion would the ones to evolve “sapience”

[stiff osprey]

The bird... develops intelligence? Impossible

[queen oar]

Also, the contract includes your soul and it will be stored in this bird cage.

[sullen cairn]

hate it when that happens

[balmy oyster]

you know how many of these things table has?

[queen oar]

Yah, because it's like the ending of Chainsawman?

Ornatops goes " Keep Dreaming, Table! ", and the world resets ( The author has definetly not gotten bored and ran out of ideas at the same time )

[runic heart]

Is it possible that more derived ceratosaurians like Carnotaurus still had a singular row of feature scales along the back, or do we actually have material of the randomly scattered feature scales on carnos back?

[undone rapids]

We don't find osteoderms on any abelisaur like Ceratosaurus, except Eoabelisaurus which might have a few on the back of the hip. Other than that we just have carnotaurus skin impressions which show a bunch of feature scales randomely scattered.

[spice latch]

https://tenor.com/view/chuckles-the-clown-dnd-gif-7199959581989019233

[runic heart]

Oh and speaking of Carnotaurus, I’m disappointed by the lack of South American maastrichtian stuff in documentaries. Surviving Earth could have gone a new route and done South America for their maastrichtian extinction episode, but they chose Prince Creek cause it’s got a T. rex parallel.

[runic heart]

Alrighty then

Fascinating how many familiar groups of dinosaurs evolved so early on.

Makes you realize how “loosely” related something like allosaurus is to say carcharodontosaurids, if that makes any sense.

[undone rapids]

Yup, Asfaltovenator from Early Jurrassic for example is usually found more closely related to allosaurus from late jurrassic than any of the other late jurrassic Carchs from Europe

[runic heart]

And it’s apparently not even “allosaurid”? Crazy.

[undone rapids]

It is sometimes, sometimes not. Since it shares features with megalosaurs and piatnitzkysaurids. Really cool animal

[outer tusk]

It really is not to mention it's very complete

[runic heart]

Wow you weren’t kidding

[steep atlas]

I love asfaltovenator. Its paper sorta revived Carnosauria

[granite thicket]

Its skull looks like neovenator's

[queen oar]

how?

[fringe glen]

Idk where else to put this question so Does anyone know a good list of prehistoric marine reptile species? Like mosasaur species? Google doesn’t give me a definite answer especially with the mosasaurs and I’m not knowledgeable enough to know what’s right, I found lists online for the pterosaurs and dinosaurs so i could get a full list of them but I’m struggling with these

[runic heart]

There’s probably a Wikipedia thing listing mosasaurs

[balmy oyster]

Wow, when you sum it up like that I can fully understand why the entire community has lost it!

[wary heath]

What anatomical features makes oxalaia a distinct species from spinosaurus?

[runic heart]

Nothing. Cause it was a little skull nub that got turned to ash.

[undone rapids]

#paleontology message

[charred hearth]

are therapods just the smartest out of the dinosaur groups and thats why their always depicted as becoming sapien?

[novel oxide]

Did you know that fish that can leave the water and survive for weeks without it? His evolutionary path is already complete. If the world doesn't end before then, those fish could become... Anfibians g2

[tough parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/invulnerable-gif-22484955

[light osprey]

Birds are the smartest dinosaur group

[balmy oyster]

Birds are also theropods….

(Unless that was what you were adding on and I said this for no reason )

[light osprey]

They are indeed theropods, but curiously enough the little timmies doing spec evo never depict their sapient dinosaur as a regular bird, it’s always anything but that.

[balmy oyster]

It just HAS to be hominid knockoff because humanity best evolutionary finale of all time!!!

[queen oar]

well, what if you made that change?

[light osprey]

Here is my spec evo sapient dinosaur I call it Aves neanderthalensis

[charred hearth]

what would this thing specalize in with its type of teeth arrangement ? @ancient crystal i know your a marine biologist so do you have a answer? https://x.com/NatSciChannel/status/2037027761026719772

EDGE Central (@NatSciChannel)

🚨NEW STUDY DROP🚨

New whorl-toothed "shark" from lower Carboniferous Russia has been named Tuyuria insolita. It's whorl is not very tight and the teeth look superficially like modern great white teeth! Imagine getting bit by a conveyor belt of those!

🎨: @JoschuaKnuppe

X · Mar 26, 2026, 4:43 AM

[eager shoal]

Collect clams 1/35

[tough parcel]

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-026-10291-3

[full lagoon]

Yeah I've heard about that recently

[balmy oyster]

Very important

Hopefully this means we can cull off the “more oxygen made stuff larger!!!” argument

[full lagoon]

Apparently it's more about energy efficiency and simply being less practical

The function of the circulatory system can make a big difference though, which is why arthropods with more closed systems tend to have larger maximum sizes

[winter marsh]

cant lobsters grow forever and only die because they fail to molt

[full lagoon]

Yeah, though I'm not sure if that's because of circulatory, metabolism, or both

[tough parcel]

I also wonder if that's as much of a myth as "Crocodilians can grow forever"

[winter marsh]

iirc their cells dont age or sum shi like that, so tecnically we can make a behemoth if we help it molt and feed it forever

[full lagoon]

https://tenor.com/view/godzilla-ebirah-horror-of-the-deep-ebirah-catching-catching-a-boat-gif-27244369

Also I think it's more about their bodies being more resistant to breaking down over time thanks to specific aspects of their genetics, but I'm not 100%

[winter marsh]

one the best kaijus fr

[jagged trellis]

never forget in canon, showa ebirah is stronger than current hulk
my goat

[full lagoon]

I could easily see that

Getting off topic tho (wish there was an actual place to talk about things like this)

[jagged trellis]

anyways on it, does anyone have some biology papers for the flora of later permian upper....earth lmao

[queen oar]

funny how this implies there may be other factors into play.

[queen oar]

Coincidentally, after we had a conversation yesterday about the supposed " Trends of Gigantism " in certain groups of theropods.

[charred hearth]

thoughts?

[tough parcel]

Yea

[undone rapids]

It Happens

[charred hearth]

thoughts on this discussion on twitter about the dinosaurs allos? it is about the dinosaurs allosaurus

[full lagoon]

I will say it's probably not as unlikely or horrible as people say it is (in this context), if you think about it we make most of our modern dinosaurs very smooth out of habit and conservancy.

[little mauve]

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0012825217302581

[jagged trellis]

thank you very much:D

[zealous ravine]

Aren't they technically scutes? Don't think those count as feature scales

[charred hearth]

whats the difference between scutes, feature scales and osteoderms...

[zealous ravine]

Also for the record I have no problem with the fact that the LOOP Allo has feature scales, but rather that they look nothing like any known dinosaur feature scales and more like crocodile osteoderms. I also believe they extend into an area we know didn't have feature scales

[zealous ravine]

From my recollections, feature scales are just big scales, scutes are separate structures embedded in the skin, and osteoderms are another thing entirely and made of bone.

[ashen wedge]

https://tenor.com/view/kick-dropkick-godzilla-fight-gif-14788399

[full lagoon]

Lmao

[charred hearth]

thoughts on this whole thread? https://x.com/raftingzalmoxes/status/2037216506124399086

Palaeoncryptozoologist Briton (@raftingzalmoxes)

HOT TAKE THREAD:
I DON'T think that paleo docus NEED to explicitly distinguish between 'fact' and 'speculation', and I also don't think 'not presenting speculation as speculation' 'disqualifies' a paleo docu from 'being a docu'.
(Shots are from #TheDinosaurs; 1/6)

X · Mar 26, 2026, 5:13 PM

[jagged trellis]

its a hot take for a reason given info shifts and you can very easily just say: maybe insert did insert and still show vs: we know insert had insert feature

[tough parcel]

Dumb as hell

https://x.com/raftingzalmoxes/status/2037216729978577303

Palaeoncryptozoologist Briton (@raftingzalmoxes)

The audience (including children) can google stuff and identify incorrect and speculative elements. It's wrong, condenscending even, to assume that they are mostly simple-minded and gullible, must be spoon-fed, and will take everything the docu presents for granted. (3/6)

X · Mar 26, 2026, 5:14 PM

[jagged trellis]

me when the show about giving info gives misinfo( its ur fault actually)

[tough parcel]

That’s not at all what they’re saying

The whole thread is “Why should a documentary actually be a documentary when people can just search it up themselves”

[lavish frigate]

Are there any renditions of what baby Tyrannosaurus looked like post nano? I want to draw T.rex families again 💀

[jagged trellis]

...which would be that
giving debatable or outright false info and requiring the audience to verify it when the whole point of a documentary is to be where the info comes from
also hai falcon

[balmy oyster]

Tarbo’s our best reference for now

[balmy oyster]

Definitely a hot take, burnt the food with this one. They should absolutely specify what is made up and what is backed by our current research, or else people will take everything at face value and assume all of it is true, when that won’t be the case.

[tough parcel]

It’s not even verifying information

It’s “Oh, you found this idea cool? It’s your job to actually learn about it” instead of presenting any information about the initial subject

Hello

[jagged trellis]

ja

[queen oar]

True, we shouldn't have speculation in paleo-documentaries at all. Because, certainly, Paleontology is full of definitive answers... And certainly, those answers will not change or correct themselves in the future, so we shouldn't encourage our viewers to research or discuss about those topics. And that's how we fail at basic education.

[tough parcel]

All-in-all, the thread is a lovely example of why you need to interact with individuals outside your comfort zone to get a well-rounded view of the real world

[balmy oyster]

I don’t think having no speculation at all will be any more beneficial, but at the very least there should be disclaimers and narration about it to not confuse anyone

[queen oar]

I was being sarcastic, because it's really the pinnacle of " Not understanding Paleo " and therefore failing at communicating Paleo. Yes, maybe there should be disclaimers, but I think documentaries just fail at explicitly saying that our perspective or impression of how extinct animals look has a margin or is entirely subjective ( Subject to which animal we are talking about ), if you pass your information ( in this case, reconstruction ) as " What these dinosaurs looked like " ( implied " definitiveness " ) , you essentially do not prepare the viewer to how information about that animal will change in the future. As I said " Failing at basic education ".

Sorry, Moderator removed that, let me rephrase that last part, to fit the rules: You are just creating a generation of " People who do not really understand that topic and do not accept the new reality surrounding those topics. "

[severe yew]

i ain't reading all that

[tender dove]

That's what tts tool is for

Brian is great at reading stuff

[severe yew]

https://tenor.com/view/long-list-b-scott-twenties-receipts-naughty-and-nice-list-gif-23745459

[tender dove]

Here, I narrated it for you, using Brian, so you don't have to read it

[severe yew]

🍻

[tender dove]

🍺 🍻

I love Microraptor because to me, being a gliding dinosaur in the canopy is the coolest thing ever, and I also love dense forests and arboreal animals and the thought of being arboreal and only living in the canopy or emergent layer your entire life

[opaque quail]

Cuts to prehistoric planet and the cave diving triceratops herd in the corner

[queen oar]

I was hoping for some Voice Acting... 😔

[tender dove]

I can do accents, so maybe next time

[queen oar]

💎 🔍 🧐

[halcyon iron]

I can’t heal or recover stamina for some reason

[tender dove]

Wrong channel

[queen oar]

cool pfp btw.

[halcyon iron]

I’ve tried relogging for over an hour even in hopes I could heal or recover stamina but it is still not doing so
oh oops

[runic rover]

I think it's kinda impossible to separate speculation from actual proof, because imagine if every two seconds a documentary went "idk tho".

[delicate scroll]

Made the scale bar the wrong size by accident

[dense spindle]

wait did u hear about the usili formation gorgonopsid, its as big as your miscaled version of ino

I think its as big as your miscaled version

[outer tusk]

Ironic

[orchid lynx]

yeah if you want Dino knowledge discord is probably the worst place to get it anyway 😁

[steep atlas]

Unless you're asking me of course. I know everything, and anyone who disagrees with me is wrong.

[steep atlas]

@brisk quiver Give me a reason to think T rex wouldn't hunt the larger herbivores in its environment.

[unreal rampart]

Hello fellow fossil enjoyers

[steep atlas]

There is evidence it fed on them, and evidence that it attempted to hunt them. Logically, if it attempted to hunt something often enough for it to appear in fossils, then it must have been able to hunt them. There's nothing preventing it from hunting them either.

[half vessel]

Also to grow the sizes it did, it would need to hunt large prey. It would not be able to sustain that size off of small animals

[brisk quiver]

I can't say it didnt, but was clearly going for them in very very rare occasions. It's jaws weren't even made for clamping and holding on big animals. Watch how croc tried to grab the back of Borneo elephant and failed, now imagine rex trying to hold onto a big trike after ambush (impossible head on already) which is literally a ball
https://youtube.com/shorts/3lKqg4mMA_Y?is=zdIoUA4n4tmaplwg

[echo ridge]

While I am not Mr.Triceratops maybe the threat of damage could have stopped it from attacking most of the time but at the same time because of the size of the T rex I find it hard to believe that it wouldnt go after the bigger dinosaurs as it wouldnt be able to survive just based off a scavengers diet. But im a dummy so ignore my words

[queen oar]

Tbh, I'm leaning to the idea that at least with E. annectens ( and perhaps E. regalis, if you count the campanian record of Tyrannosaurus ) it probably wasn't very good at it.

[light osprey]

Honestly more a missed opportunity to depict places we’ve actually found paleokarst landscapes

[echo ridge]

or even scavenging honestly its just way too damn big for it to be able to do that and reach maturity

[brisk quiver]

Also large size means it ate proportionally large prey, doesn't mean it went for large healthy adults
2-3 ton edmont or trike is already a massive animal

[steep atlas]

A few things here: the assertion that it "was not made to clamp onto big animals" is outright false and it shows clear adaptations for it. There's no evidence it was particularly uncommon. And, your video is not a suitable allegory. Very different animals with a much larger size difference

[brisk quiver]

Its an example of rex like jaws failimg to hold onto a large round animal
Name me adaptations for holding onto big round things in rex

[steep atlas]

Of course predators will target easier prey items when they can. But adult T rex show clear adaptations for focusing on prey with a large body size

[stiff osprey]

the croc is unable to hold onto an elephant four or five times its size - evidence that t.rex could not hold onto a triceratops of the same size as itself

[brisk quiver]

2-4 tons is already a large body size. And allosaurids or charcharodonrosaurids clearly were more suitable for hunting large prey.

[half vessel]

Clearly? You think the 8ton predator with the strongest bite force of any land animal wasn’t suitable for hunting large prey

[brisk quiver]

What size has to do with ability of jaws to clamp onto a big round animal
Croc can't grab onto smth as round as elephant from above
Hows rex holding onto trike's back after ambush?

[steep atlas]

These are not "rex like" jaws at all. None of T rex's prey items were that relatively large. T rex shows increased body size, a robust and solidly sutured skull, large jaw and neck muscle attachments, a robust neck, increased agility and decreased speed. These are adaptations for dispatching relatively large prey, i would argue approaching the t rex's own body size

[echo ridge]

So then more possibly could it have done something like that wolves and lions do where they will chase down a herd and go after the weaker animal? After all they would be the last to run and and the last to be able to react

[half vessel]

What exactly do you think the Rex was predating on? What caused it to have those adaptations if not large prey?

[queen oar]

Carnivores only tend to get large individuals when they've grown or established themselves in areas where prey density is not only high, but where availability is practical for it. Because beyond that, a lot of Tyrannosaurus specimens don't tend to get pretty large.

[brisk quiver]

Being robust is not adaptation for large game hunting, otherwise giga or allo should be worse at it than rex (they were better at it)

[steep atlas]

You have no reason to place an arbitrary limit on T rex's prey range like that. Carchs and tyrannosaurids simply evolved different strategies of predation

[brisk quiver]

Tiger is more robust than leopard yet tiger goes for proportionally smaller prey than leopard.

[steep atlas]

They are adaptations for T rex's method of taking on prey. Allosaurus was a generalist, and carchs had adaptations for attacking vastly larger, fleshy prey. Not similarly sized or slightly larger, often armored prey

[brisk quiver]

Basically this and also keep in mind big healthy adults were the a very small portion of large herbivore populations

[echo ridge]

Well tigers are more aggressive then leopards and will take down the prey in a more open style then leopards who quite literally jump down from a tree onto the backs of its prey

[brisk quiver]

A lot of sauropods were armored as well as nodosaurids they went after

[warped peak]

snow leopards in the corner being the smallest big cat but hunting the largest prey

[stiff osprey]

most predators will do this and it was probably the case for rex as well, there is no reason to believe it would be scared of or unable to hunt adult Triceratops (fossil record clearly shows the contrary), but if the Triceratops stood its ground and fought back instead of running, the rex would most likely give up the hunt

[brisk quiver]

Leopards very rarely jump on a prey from a tree. They are not clouded leopards to do that.

[echo ridge]

Yup yup realized my mistake when I wrote it my bad

[brisk quiver]

Triceratops rarely ran cuz it wasn't able to run. With those legs and pelvis it fast walked at most and why would it try to fast walk away from rex literally killing itself to it

[steep atlas]

Nodosaurids that carchs went after were notably smaller. Also, you may be thinking of Acrocanthosaurus, who was perhaps more robustly built tham T rex. Giant carcharodontosaurids were very robust animals, but to a lesser degree than T rex, reflecting their different method of attacking prey

[warped peak]

This is what separates hunting from combat or AVA

Hunting is fear tactics intended to force a mistake that leaves a fatal weakness. It is not supposed to be combat, it is supposed to be a mauling where they cannot fight back.

[echo ridge]

that was my thinking as well as I cant see a reason why a T Rex would think its a good idea to approach a dinosaur that has 3 spears for a head honestly.

[brisk quiver]

Trex had close to none chances vs defending triceratops in direct combat btw

[steep atlas]

Triceratops is a dangerous prey item. T rex would most likely try to ambush and cripple it before it can react or face it. Otherwise, it's not really doable

[warped peak]

ehhh thats a bit of a stretch (the "no chance" thing)

[echo ridge]

so then are we discussing a hunting situation or a combat situation? Cause even then a more careful rex could potentially take down a Triceratops I feel like in a combat situation

[brisk quiver]

This i agree, theres a reason rex was ambush predator

[queen oar]

A lot of prey items within Tyrannosaurus' pre-historical range aren't that big or generally tend to have a pretty poor sample of large individuals preserved

This includes non-triceratopsini chasmosaurines, lambeosaurines, nodosaurids, ankylosaurids, triceratopsinis, ornithomimosaurs, oviraptorsaurs, pachycephalosaurs, etc.

[steep atlas]

I would say head-on, T rex most likely loses. But it has a good chance of pulling off a kill if it can get in behind the triceratops. It could cripple its hind limbs or bite into its spine outright

[warped peak]

Tyrannosaurus could almost certainly still overpower a Triceratops in actual combat often.

Only the absolute largest specimens would have a good chance at fending it off, but the internet seems to ignore that not every animal is the record largest specimen

[steep atlas]

It is possible for T rex to overpower a triceratops from the front, depending on the size/strength of both individuals, but it is still risky

[echo ridge]

that was my thinking as well. A predator is a predator for a reason and depending on what it preys on more it has very specific tactics for it even if the prey also has tactics to defend it from being eaten.

[stiff osprey]

Even in herbivores that can easily kill their predators in outright combat their first instinct is often to run, especially if they live in herds where it is safer to run away and hope the predator eats the guy next to you

[warped peak]

It is risky but its not like horns are the end-all, be-all of natural defense

Look at animals today, if that was the case, EVERYONE would have horns

[echo ridge]

Is it weird I was thinking a tail swipe horizontally from a t rex to a charging triceratops would knock it on its side?

[steep atlas]

If I had to wager, I'd say that Triceratops is the most dangerous prey item a T rex could target (in its northern range. Alamosaurus is a different story)

[brisk quiver]

Internet also seems to ignore frill+3 horns and literally no armor on rex's front

[queen oar]

I think, to be fair it does not make a lot of sense to insinuate a scenario where T. rex goes head on with a Triceratops, only if so the individual is inexperienced, because it is ignoring principles of how carnivores will always prefer to approach prey with less risk associated with them.

[warped peak]

Thank god Rhinos are immune to predation attempts by lions because of their giant horn and armored leather

[brisk quiver]

This is true, anky is not even close with how small it actually was

[queen oar]

Seems to be the case with any Ceratopsid.

[steep atlas]

I think they'd be better off leading with a bite. I imagine tail swipes coming into play more in combat between t rex individuals

[echo ridge]

In this case I believe the discussion is what would happen if a fully grown T Rex and triceratops were forced into an open confrontation like say a Triceratops defending its offspring

[steep atlas]

Yeah it's a little overrated. Would probably not be easy to kill as an adult, but probably less outright risk

[steep atlas]

Rex would do best to leave. Getting gored is the last thing it wants

[brisk quiver]

Yeah ppl genuinly thinking rex had 50/50 head on fight with trike baffles me

[warped peak]

Depends really on the size of the specimens IMO. An 11 ton Rex is probably able to handle a 7 ton trike

[steep atlas]

Yeah that's a little silly. Even with T rex's agility it would be hard to get around the head

[echo ridge]

but wouldnt that leave its neck open to potentially being speared by one of the triceratops horns?
Also there is the matter of attacking angle since the T Rex would would (im assuming) be coming at it from a higher angle

[brisk quiver]

7 tons is already too much to easily push away

[steep atlas]

If your pelvis or femur is shattered before you know what hit you, you're not gonna turn around to fight back

[warped peak]

What does pushing away have to do with this?

[echo ridge]

I dont know thats still a really big dino for a TRex to safely attack

[queen oar]

Although it's possible, I personally tend to lean to the idea that Lions hunting of larger and realistically more risky prey is more so influenced by our intervention. Density of herbivores has been largely affected, and extant evidence seems to suggest that lions attempt to hunt animals that although possibility was on the table, the risks associated with it should make those options only available in cases of desperation ( Not really a " Walk in the Park " scenario )

[brisk quiver]

How is 11 ton rex killing 7 ton triceratops for you?

[steep atlas]

Rex's safe approach would be an ambush from behind. The front is simply not doable, and the side risks it seeing or turning in time more.

[echo ridge]

True true

[warped peak]

By being 50% larger and simply manhandling the prey animal like how the majority of predation happens in the real world

[queen oar]

Don't think so honestly.

[echo ridge]

but its not its 40%?

[steep atlas]

Not saying it's impossible, but there's no situation where attacking an adult Triceratops headon is a good idea

[echo ridge]

And honestly for predators even 50% larger then the prey can still be kinda risky depending on the prey

[steep atlas]

The frill makes it nearly impossible to get a killing bite. The head is on a ball joint, it can turn the horns to you really quickly. The only real chance is to try to use the horns as a lever to turn its head but that's pretty risky too

[queen oar]

I think it's kinda funny that we are suggesting that Triceratops could be less risky on dependence of the specimen, as if a 7 ton trike would be any different than a 13 tons ( Exaggeration for effect ) Trike. It's like saying you can beat a 1.53 m tall person with a knife than a 1.90 m tall person with a knife, my brother! The problem is not the person, it's the knife! And in Triceratops case it's the horns!

[steep atlas]

Y'all have made a boring day at the office entertaining lol

[brisk quiver]

Good to hear xd

[echo ridge]

I wouldve completely missed this if I hadnt called in sick so im happy lmao

[queen oar]

I will even add to this, but the general lack of more widespread samples that conclude a overall presence of " Gigantic " Triceratops and Torosaurus individuals should tell that they are doing pretty fine.

[steep atlas]

Lol my job just doesn't have me very busy. I get free time at my cubicle

[harsh forge]

trike's biggest flaw was not evolving the musth that made edmontosaurus immune to all predation

[brisk quiver]

Horns exactly where rex's chest and neck are

[steep atlas]

The front is the absolute last angle it should try to attack a Triceratops from, lol

[little mauve]

The rex can bite basically anywhere from the neck to the hips and the trike is going down, you're not fighting anything with a crushed spine or hips

[steep atlas]

Yeah, hence the importance of pulling off an ambush AND bite placement

[queen oar]

True, as such there's abundant evidence of that scenario happening so easily.

[warped peak]

I'm just pointing out that Triceratops is not nearly as large compared to Tyrannosaurus as people tend think it is. It's not like a single horn stab is instant death

[steep atlas]

Instant death is not the only bad outcome here

[brisk quiver]

Its fatal wound at the slightest with rex retreating and dying after

[queen oar]

Do me a favor, replace that with AMNH 5027 or BHI 3033

[little mauve]

Just like we have abundant evidence of Triceratops successfully defending itself from attack

[steep atlas]

We only have a few dozen triceratops specimens total lol

[brisk quiver]

Good luck surviving spear to your organs

[queen oar]

See? Lol

[steep atlas]

If the horns go all the way in, it's game over. A shallow stab would still suck and could get infected, etc

[brisk quiver]

We at least have 3 triceratops/torosaurus individuals with healed bite marks on their front

[brisk quiver]

Triceratops is short, still big tho

[steep atlas]

So, we do know T rex attempted to hunt them and that T rex ate them. That's plenty of evidence right there

[little mauve]

They're the most common large animal in the environment of course it hunted them

[warped peak]

Realistically, we would be expecting a grapple type of combat

oop you changed sentence lmao

[brisk quiver]

Rex is also very common for a large macrocarnivore

[steep atlas]

I believe their primary prey as adults would have been edmontosaurus

[brisk quiver]

Primary prey was anything up to 2-4 tons, like young trikes, edmontos, toros etc

[warped peak]

We also have many Edmontosaurus with healed bitemarks from Tyrannosaurus clearly indicating that they were able to successfully defend themselves from this "tyrant lizard"

[steep atlas]

Source for that number?

[queen oar]

True, more like successful at escaping.

[little mauve]

Wishful thinking

[brisk quiver]

Its not exact number, up to 4-5-6 tons

[steep atlas]

Escape =/= defeat in combat

[warped peak]

No I chose that wording on purpose to comment on the fact that a healed bitemark doesn't necessarily mean they fought them off into submission or anything like that

[brisk quiver]

Healed bite mark on the face surely means that.
Thats why I said "on the front"

[warped peak]

Healed bite mark on the face could plenty well mean that the Tyrannosaurus aimed for the neck and got intercepted by the shield.

[steep atlas]

We can say that, based on modern predators, it would probably prefer easier prey items

[queen oar]

Shocking.

[brisk quiver]

And easier prey item is anything smaller than rex itself and slow enough to not escape it.

[warped peak]

Ambush predator's prey range is anything that gets close basically. They are extremely well documented to be capable of taking on much larger prey than is reasonable when surprise is involved

[brisk quiver]

Doubt 3 ton trike will run fast enough to avoid adult rex

[steep atlas]

To an extent, sure. Too small would be more difficult to catch and not provide as much food

[steep atlas]

Yeah, I believe even the really large edmontosaurus could have been targeted by T rex. It had the equipment to kill them and ambush could put it in a position to do so without getting bulldozed

[brisk quiver]

Ambush hunting is not only the ambush itself but also about killing prey fast enough.

[queen oar]

that is also assuming that carnivores will always have a full meal, which often they do not. You get pretty heavy when you are full, surprisingly.

[steep atlas]

T rex, luckily, had a biological instant kill button for whatever it'd fit its jaws around

[steep atlas]

Great time to go lay in a sunny patch and take a nap. I'm sure it would target relatively small prey at times

[queen oar]

Nothing wrong with that, mind you, but it's pretty documented that carnivores who often engage on eating more than necessary, tend to often develop a pretty unhealthy habit, and develop obesity from it, oftenly disabling a lot of their capabilities in the process. It also happens in Extant Dinosaurs, some bald eagles have to go through rehabilitation to often loose the habit of eating constantly.

[brisk quiver]

Not like that, thats why there are healed rex bite marks. It's all about how it bit and where it bit

[steep atlas]

Yep, very true. Bite placement is key for Rex's equipment. Too shallow of a bite or biting an area that won't cripple or kill could ruin a hunt

[steep atlas]

That's funny. Sign of a successful predator though, yeah?

[queen oar]

I guess.

[little mauve]

Yeah all those obese wild lions and tigers, very much a thing

[steep atlas]

Don't try telling Sue to go on a diet

[queen oar]

What do you mean? They have a perfect diet. They literally just had a Juvenile Edmontosaurus on their mouth the other day ( What you should expect )

[ocean berry]

On the flip side of that, predators tend to have a pretty low success rate when hunting, so it makes sense for them to eat as much as possible when food is available, because they aren't guaranteed a next successful hunt, or the next five after.

[steep atlas]

Yeah I hear they're low in fat. We should be proud of her

[little mauve]

Gorging is pretty much a universal predator behavior for that reason, it doesnt cause obesity

[ripe walrus]

is this the biggest Triceratops?

[queen oar]

Not disagreeing with that, I'm just saying that, realistically a lot of carnivores don't tend to eat to the point of becoming full, that is observable in African Carnivores, they often do not eat to the point of getting full, even though it's completely within their possibilities.

[ripe walrus]

and tbh one stab from the horns is enough to make T.rex back down

[steep atlas]

I've seen them eat an insane amount at once too. I think it would be more common when they're targeting relatively large prey, since there wull be fewer opportunities for those kills

[queen oar]

yup, also can happen.

[patent mist]

i am curious if ornithopods would react to predation differently than mammals.
I've noticed on a lot of kreuger park cams buffalo just sort of forget they can body the predators and sit there and get eaten

[steep atlas]

Mammals are allegedly smarter

[queen oar]

I'm trying to find a video, of a youtube channel of a guy who worked at a place meant to rehabilitate birds of prey, in America, but I can't find those ( that and the AI Slop flooding the results also doesn't help )

[steep atlas]

Tag me when you do

[brisk quiver]

Mammals always fear of getting wounds, even elephants occasionally just avoid confrontations

[little mauve]

No, predators typically eat as much as they can as quickly as they can in a sitting due to low success rates of hunts and high rates of kleptoparasitism. The latter is the main reason why a predator would abandon a carcass. Don't know why youre being contrarian on this

[brisk quiver]

Also in buffalo' case, they get tired after 3 lions basically sit on their back and can't really fight back after they are tired

[steep atlas]

I think what they mean is that predators will also sometimes just grab a much smaller animal and eat it, like a snack

I remember a video following some African hunter gatherers. While they were on the way searching for big game, they also shot small birds and stuff and ate them.

[queen oar]

@steep atlas So, I was wrong with the species only when I was trying to remember the video:
https://youtu.be/jOx6JmhH3-0

But the specific video I don't think I'll find.

[steep atlas]

Thanks anyway! Need a cool video

[queen oar]

@steep atlas I did find this too:
https://youtu.be/Dhlg07NeuwE

[steep atlas]

That's hilarious lmao

[quasi axle]

[warped peak]

No, a larger Triceratops specimens alongside a large Tyrannosaurus specimen

[jagged trellis]

( said crocodile is literally 4x smaller vs being outright bigger than the elephant)

[steep atlas]

raccoon roadkill... how appetizing.

[obsidian tangle]

That’s neat, I never knew obesity could happen naturally in the wild

[steep atlas]

it's a little weird how it's all just in the crop

[polar rain]

Im actually so happy rn

[steep atlas]

i am immediately buying this when it comes out

[fossil ingot]

AMNH 5027 is a Pretty small Rex, not even close to what can argue is the average

[queen oar]

How many large Tyrannosaurus specimens are there?

[undone rapids]

Atleast 1

[fossil ingot]

Depends what you wanna count as Large, AMNH is maybe 7.9t based on Demphy's, which gets smaller than Stan, The Holotype, Sue, Scotty, The Rex I forgot from the Growth Paper, and Probably few others I am forgetting
Trike is a "small" Rex for what seems to be average, Trike is smaller than Rex on Average
But like, its still a Massive Animal lol

It been short is helpful

[queen oar]

1 that is nicely preserved, yeah. The rest is either a partial skeleton, or just 1 isolated or fragmented bone.

[fossil ingot]

All this Trike and Rex Convo only for Toro to Mog Them

[steep atlas]

toro is trike lite

[queen oar]

so by whatever metric, how many Tyrannosaurus specimens are around AMNH 5027's size? Approximately?

[polar rain]

My parents are getting it for me 🤭

[fossil ingot]

Kinda better than most large Trikes tbh
Which are Mostly just Skulls/partial skulls
Unless you wanna add the undescribed willard

[queen oar]

actually, it's 1 skull from T. prorsus and " Triceratops maximus " doing the " Potential Man " meme.

[polar rain]

Do yall think the articulation is gonna be comparable to the first T. Rex or have they improved the articulation since? Cus that one was basically a brick from what I've heard

[fossil ingot]

Can't wait for Adam to be out Publically so ppl stop calling Toro "Trike lite"

@queen oar would had to check the list but most are closer to the Holotype or even Stan size than AMNH 5027, and "Maximus" can be Considered Horridus tbf
All Mogged by Adam

[queen oar]

also, I get this, but I don't think either Trike or Toro are doing pretty well by the time they were around. Don't get me wrong, I hate Triceratops, and love Torosaurus, but it's pretty clear that, Torosaurus at least and other Triceratopsinis, have a much denser population by the south, than the Hell Creek or any formation around the north.

[fossil ingot]

Toro is pretty rare yeah

[queen oar]

like, the north is essentially just Edmontosaurus land.

[steep atlas]

as it turns out, they discriminated heavily against other dinosaur species. they had a lot of slurs too

[fossil ingot]

Edmonto decided to Dominate Hell Creek

[queen oar]

I have my own suspicions of what " Triceratops maximus " is, but I'd rather not share them, or I'll likely get crucified. But, given that what Adam's discovery would imply, it's that Triceratopsini postcrania can be a lot more variable, and a lot more indicative of what sorta of animal it can be, and maximus does have part of the vertebrae preserved, but probably not enough to identify with 100% certainty. Realistically, I'm of the opinion that we need more studies on Triceratopsini postcrania, rather than Triceratopsini cranial material.

[fossil ingot]

The Triceratopsini Post Crania is...

[queen oar]

hit or miss?

[fossil ingot]

Hit take?
We need more of it

Sure Skull are cool and all
But knowing what the body actually was is cooler lol

[queen oar]

not only that, but we do definetly need more Triceratopsini researchers. Triceratopsini reseach is taking long, mainly from what I heard, there not being enough people or enough motivation to really go in-depth about Triceratopsinis.

[little mauve]

Edmontosaurus doesn't dominate the Hell Creek, it's an equal or smaller percentage of the faunal composition than Triceratops in most studies

[fossil ingot]

Hopefully with Adam more ppl get motivated

[queen oar]

Don't think I see a lot of Ceratopsid researchers discuss about this guy:

[fossil ingot]

Agathaumas the Forgotten

[queen oar]

the only one from Lance Formation that has a good description.

[fossil ingot]

Lol

[frail robin]

Yoooooooo I am GETTING that

[orchid lynx]

maybe he got them later in the neck or wherelse? we dont have all bones :p

[steep atlas]

common torosaurus L

[full lagoon]

That's gruesome af

[brisk quiver]

Mark Witton is known for rex glazing so its not something thats really gonna happen :/

Mark Witton has a literal post about ceratopsian horns being bad at combat vs predators cuz "deer don't use antlers to fight wolves" yet ppl still use his art as example in 2026🥀

[tough parcel]

Perhaps the person named Mr. Triceratops is biased towards the ceratopsids

[brisk quiver]

At least im not saying triceratops decapitated live tyrannosaurs

[charred hearth]

its what your not saying

[stiff osprey]

We ignore the paleontologist's art because he drew my favorite dinosaur losing a fight

[brisk quiver]

You give rex fans the idea and they are gonna twist it 100 times so it looks like rex is even more dominating alpha king animal of the world

[outer tusk]

so is the trike guy butthurt about animal that isn't even triceratops being hunted?

[charred hearth]

theres a difference between being a dinosaur fan and being a paleo-fan

[brisk quiver]

Mark Witton drawing rex killing smth in a most rex fan'ish way possible is as accurate as I'll draw triceratops decapitating live tyrannosaurus

[stiff osprey]

do you mean the art where rex decapitates an already dead trike which we have fossil evidence actually occurred

or the art where it rips a chunk off the thigh of a torosaurus which is a common strategy for many predators

[brisk quiver]

Mark Wytton is a tyrannosaur fan.

[undone rapids]

It's rex's fault for having such a huge head to bite big things, was clearly just trying to get more fans

[charred hearth]

are ypu saying hes not a paleotologist fan?

[little mauve]

He's literally a published paleontologist. What is this fan stuff, get outside of that world for your own sake

[brisk quiver]

Rex fans say rex decapitated live trike
There is no common strategy involving ripping a leg off a live same sized animal with defenses which Mark Witton literally said are bad cuz "deer antlers are not used to fight off predators"

[charred hearth]

facts

[tulip dove]

We'll either have Rex mauling the absolute life out the herbivores it lived with or Triceratops bull in musth goring the animal evolved to take down the animals it lived with

And I'm ngl
The whole % chance thing getting real old because there is practically no real way to tell how often each side could have either killed or defended themselves against their opponent

It can go either way
The predator gets the meal or the prey gets to live another day
It all comes down to the situation they're in
How healthy they are, where they are and etc.

[tough parcel]

Shout-out to the Tyrannosaurus tooth lodged in the Triceratops vert

[brisk quiver]

Well Mark Witton only draws rex dominating the hell out of smth so ig it's very paleo accurate and cool cuz rex glazer is also shockers a paleontologist

[stiff osprey]

It just seems like you didn't read the post then

Witton says "A caveat to all this, and a particularly necessary one in case we get swept along by the T. rex hype train, is that we shouldn’t imagine major dismantling of Triceratops carcasses taking place with freshly killed or otherwise untouched bodies. Neat as it is to imagine Tyrannosaurus ripping the head from a freshly-vanquished Triceratops, waving it aloft and roaring triumphantly like some kind of 8-tonne Predator, modern animals generally follow reliable carcass consumption patterns where easily accessed and nutritious tissues are eaten before difficult-to-access or less-nutritional parts (Blumenschine 1986). "

[light osprey]

He’s a big fan of dinosaurs, that’s why he spent all this time getting the phd, so he can fan-out

[brisk quiver]

Btw Jack Horner is also paleontologist

[tough parcel]

Randomdinos makes a very good point and citation

[little mauve]

T. rex posters in his locker....

[charred hearth]

why are ytou bringing up[ jack horner and comparing him to someone no where near as bad as him tahts mad disrespectful

[balmy oyster]

Who says it’s something that can’t happen? Tyrannosaurus was a pretty huge and powerful animal, and usually larger on average to most of its prey items

[brisk quiver]

Both Jack Horner and Mark Witton are phd paleontologists, nothing wrong here.

[charred hearth]

jack horner is alot worse

[little mauve]

Lmao this is absurd

[balmy oyster]

You brought him up for another reason though, to discredit what was being said as saying “well THIS guy is a paleontologist so what does THAT mean??”

[brisk quiver]

Witton also said triceratops horns were bad at inter species combat cuz deer dont fight

[compact leaf]

I’m not sure Witton ever said that but if you’re claiming he did you should at least give the actual quote

[stiff osprey]

This is also false, he says horns evolve primarily to fight other members of the same species (true) and can be secondarily used to fight predators

Triceratops horns being bad at defense is based on the idea that the adult horns had backwards curved tips, which is supported by fossil evidence, but not confirmed

[brisk quiver]

https://markwitton-com.blogspot.com/2023/02/horned-dinosaurs-vs-theropods-how-much.html?m=1

[brisk quiver]

Which is bs cuz he based it off antelope and deer

[stiff osprey]

If you read the post you'd know there was a wider basis than that

[light osprey]

An animal with prominent head ornamentation, which differs from the triceratops which also has prominent head ornamentation

[brisk quiver]

Surely if smth has horns or antlers they are all same, at least dear Witton thinks like that

[balmy oyster]

@brisk quiver you keep trying to cry “rex glazer” but based on context clues it seems you’re incredibly biased towards a certain other animal, primarily one that was hunted by rex. 🤪

[little mauve]

"So, in sum, the take-home here isn’t that anti-predator roles for ceratopsid horns are a non-starter, but that the behaviours of living animals complicate this seemingly simple hypothesis"

[tough parcel]

Don't mess with us herbivore fans...

[tulip dove]

While he does have quite a few pieces of Rex hunting or tearing something apart, it ain't always one sided in his art
(Additionally there's that piece where Quetz pair bullies a Rex off of a carcass)

[brisk quiver]

Im biased towards triceratops, which, indeed, got hit hard by rex glazing

[stiff osprey]

Also quoting the post: The message from the modern day is that horn-like structures can and might be used against predators, but that this behaviour is by no means ubiquitous. It may not even be that common, according to some researchers. It seems that intraspecific selection is more than sufficient to explain most horn-like structures among living species and that predatory influences, if present at all, are relatively minor for most species. We can’t know how much of this insight can be transferred over to dinosaurs, but if ceratopsid facial anatomy was being shaped by intraspecific factors (and we think it was; see above), then we have to entertain all that this brings. This means, in addition to the traditional view of horned dinosaurs being effective foils of predatory theropods, we have to consider some other possibilities suggested by their modern analogues. These could include, for instance, that only some horned dinosaurs actively fought predators; that their retaliations against attacks may have been ineffectual; and that some species may have rarely, and maybe never, turned their horns against other species.

[light osprey]

He’s right, in the real world, the herbivores are underglazed! They are so strong, often killing their predators, who are rarely successful in the hunts!

[balmy oyster]

So you admit to arguing & discrediting arguments against tyrannosaurus because of bias towards it….?

[brisk quiver]

See the difference, rex tearing everything and triceratops looking angrily at trex at most
Only rex has the right to gore

[charred hearth]

" Only rex has the right to gore "

[outer tusk]

omfg

[light osprey]

The triceratops will have to unionise for the right to gore

[stiff osprey]

Going to break character here and say if Witton glazes anything it's azhdarchids

Two quetzalcoatlus scaring off a rex in PhP was absolutely his idea lol

[brisk quiver]

I'll say Witton should def see more cape buffalo defensive behavior, then say "horns are used for inside species combat"

[balmy oyster]

Is it wrong that I can see this happening

[brisk quiver]

So cool, rex actually ate triceratops, wow

[charred hearth]

wowwww

[balmy oyster]

Can we just not engage with this guy anymore

[little mauve]

"It’s absolutely true that some species, like muskox, African buffalo, various rhinos and red deer use their cranial ornament aggressively against predators (Geist 1966, 1999; Schaller 1972; Kruuk 1972) and it is assumed that predator deterrence may explain the presence of horns in a great number of bovids (e.g. Packer 1983; Bro-Jørgensen 2007; Stankowich and Caro 2009; Metz et al. 2018)" read the damn post

[stiff osprey]

I was gonna say basically that yeah

[outer tusk]

OMG RANDOM, DID YOU JUST BREAK CHARACTER (big paleo scandal)

[brisk quiver]

Out of all dangerous herbivores of Hell Creek which clearly were able to kill rex, they chose the 250 kg pterosaur to actually fight it. And triceratops was killed off screen leaving a scratch on rex
Adds to global rex glazing issue

[open compass]

"rex is a scavenger, it didn't kill it, just found a dead one"

[charred hearth]

https://tenor.com/view/walking-with-dinosaurs-2025-bbc-nature-documentary-the-orphan-tyrannosaurus-rex-gif-11421796807316587425

[balmy oyster]

Breaking news dinosaurus

[brisk quiver]

Rex is not scavenger but there are no certain cases where it actually killed smth above 2ish tons

[light osprey]

‘global’ yes I’m sure the world outside North America cares about triceratops

[stiff osprey]

Anyway if we want to talk about antipredator adaptations in triceratops I think the frill is a pretty solid one. Triceratops is the only ceratopsian to not have two giant structural weaknesses in the middle of its frill

[brisk quiver]

Most based dinosaur media btw
Of only they weren't trying to hype on Walking with Dinosaurs name

[tulip dove]

I mean
It certainly did try and hunt big animals
We can't forget about the healed tooth marks found on lot of the animals it ate

[outer tusk]

Is this image tuff or should I do a different pose

[brisk quiver]

This and predator with density this high will less likely go for smth big btw
Otherwise it would eat herbivores to extinction lol

[remote mauve]

Exactly

[light osprey]

Is clearly inaccurate, the pachus should have cheeks!

[balmy oyster]

https://tenor.com/view/squid-game-oh-my-god-bruh-saleswoman-oh-my-god-bruh-gif-2398788864743270124

[stiff osprey]

Of course torosaurus with holes in its frill was still able to survive rex attacks, but it only needs to survive often enough, and that doesn't mean trike's solid frill wasn't an advantage

[brisk quiver]

Trike horns were literally pointing upwards

[remote mauve]

I think frills are kinda useless against rec

[balmy oyster]

The pachyrhino should be eating the rex alive because the trikerasock was the ultimate predator, aside from edmusthosaurus annectens of course

[outer tusk]

Cameron is such a good rex, he looks pretty well with my "alamosaurus" (apatosaurus)

[brisk quiver]

"Rex is so cool and im so original to glaze it"

[charred hearth]

your doing to much rn

[remote mauve]

Son

[brisk quiver]

PNSO alamosaurus is pure bs

[balmy oyster]

“I only care about dinosaurs to powerscale them and argue against people that disagree with my worldview without providing ample argumentation points, despite doing nothing but said powerscaling to real animals that provide and showcase so much more about prehistoric ecosystems that came before us”

[stiff osprey]

I mean they can't stand up to a full power bite but anything that gets in the way of a bite to the neck is good

Rex missing the first strike due to the frill gives the ceratopsian a chance to stab it

[remote mauve]

I guess

[outer tusk]

@stiff osprey sorry to tag but PNSO Cameron is offically my first PNSO figure

[light osprey]

If they’re getting upwards of ten tonnes they must be eating a whole lotta fish or something

[brisk quiver]

Im sitting quiet until some guy decides to taunt me with rex glazing art

[charred hearth]

how heavy would the average adult trike horn be?

[half vessel]

Are you dense

[tulip dove]

Idk what's the real issue with a macropredator preying on large herbivores
The thing is adapted to prey on the animals it lived with
Big, agile, bone crushing bite, forward facing eyes, what else am I missing
And if it can get the jump on them, it certainly can hunt and kill them given what it has against large, slow moving, armored herbivores

[stiff osprey]

Baller, the unarticulated one is my favorite mass produced rex figure

[brisk quiver]

There is actually a weight limit for predators going after smth their size or bigger (active macropredators) which is 1600ish kg iirc

[balmy oyster]

If you get triggered by a artwork of animal predation even when not directed towards angering you, then that’s a you issue

[undone rapids]

Trike and Anky's defence against rex was basically this, can't bite if you can't grip

[outer tusk]

as of right now what are your recommendations for PNSO when it comes to accuracy (as of current 2026)

[brisk quiver]

Im triggered by rex overhype

[stiff osprey]

my favorites are the Stego, Tsintao, Cameron, Aymen spinosaurus, Yangchuanosaurus, "Saurophaganax", Tylosaurus and Camarasaurus

all of which I own except the tsintao which was too expensive

[charred hearth]

well you've been doing to much

[half vessel]

If anything you’re overhyping ceratopsids. You’ve been doing this since like 11am lmao

[brisk quiver]

PNSO edmonto is the best thing happened to humanity

[little mauve]

Thats relative to the size of the predator not an absolute number. Predators preferentially take prey between half and twice their size.

[brisk quiver]

Saying rex didnt go for large adult healthy triceratops is overhyping alright

[runic heart]

PNSO articulated giga is next id assume. They wouldn’t risk a species any more obscure for their new line of figures.

[undone rapids]

Ceratopsians are a bit overhyped tbh, the Real Horned Stars were always the Abelisaurs!!!

[light osprey]

1600kg what. What does that mean

[balmy oyster]

The nanotyrannus became victim to the tyrannomusthosaur

[brisk quiver]

Weight limit for active land macropredator

[half vessel]

Not at all. Just blatantly wrong. It most likely didn’t make a large part of its diet, but it did hunt them. Rex is our most studied dinosaur, and the consensus is that they would target a triceratops as part of its diet

[balmy oyster]

Lion pack hunting a elderly elephant: “don’t mind me”

[brisk quiver]

Name me at least one case where lions actually attacked adult elder elephant

[outer tusk]

trying to send it again

[charred hearth]

when their dying

[undone rapids]

A few weeks ago there was an big edmonto skull published with a rex tooth in it iirc, probably a teenage rex taking it down

[brisk quiver]

Predators will never go for the hardest to kill prey possible.
Another overestimation by carnivore bias

[balmy oyster]

ok maybe/maybe not elderly but you gotta admit this is impressive

[brisk quiver]

Or a teenage rex that was just eating it

[charred hearth]

mr trike you talk with such arrogance why is that?

[half vessel]

That’s not necessarily true. We can look at jaguars going after cayman. There was a documented hunt of a jaguar killing a large cayman, weighing more than itself

[little mauve]

Predators routinely hunt animals twice their weight

[open compass]

https://youtu.be/x4nG4JsAyKY?si=djIn7DXsadJ3J4xa

[light osprey]

any predator you can see with the naked eye is a macropredator.

[brisk quiver]

This is a sub adult female bush elephant
@little mauve mammalian predators*

[balmy oyster]

Oh mb let me grab my time machine to go record a rex V trike fight

[open compass]

Eating the skull? Yum

[brisk quiver]

This is a sub adult female bush elephant x2

[full lagoon]

Oh yeah I've seen this. The lions were very clever to attack in the darkness and isolate her.

[balmy oyster]

Also the point still stands that elephant is HUGE compared to the lions!! And they aren’t 10 tons with a gigantic jaw to crush bones!

[undone rapids]

Cannot be ruled out, but the authors consider it less likely.

https://peerj.com/articles/20796/

[little mauve]

A komodo dragon can kill a buffalo several times its own size, crocs can take equivalent sized bovids and equids. Look up any survey of prey preference of wild predators. 1/2 to 2x their size is the preferred prey size

[brisk quiver]

Cayman or other reptiles are actually the easiest prey for jaguars. Reptiles with slow reaction which still take 1 bite to the skull to kill them are easier to obtain than capybaras running to the water the moment they sense danger or tapirs which literally tank jaguar's claws and still escape in the water

[half vessel]

So you proved my point. Those are examples of an animal going for the hardest thing in its ecosystem

[scenic flame]

Are the rex fans in the room with us?

[open compass]

We are talking about " weight limits", wdym "it's a female so it doesn't count", that elephant is still huge and has tusks.

[balmy oyster]

Aren’t capybaras notorious for doing nothing even in the face of certain doom

[tough parcel]

I wonder if we'll ever get discussion that never brings up jaguars hunting caimans

[undone rapids]

Snow Leopards are very cool(and fluffy)
https://vxtwitter.com/wildlifewire/status/1959326479877071325?s=20

Wildlife Wire (@wildlifewire)

↪️ Replying to @wildlifewire

It’s been previously known that snow leopards on average hunt proportionately the largest prey relative to body size of any pantherine, but these results show something new: snow leopards preferentially hunting the demographic of prey with the largest body size!

vxTwitter / fixvx · Aug 23, 2025, 6:46 PM

[brisk quiver]

I'll say, try to not loose your footing when 5 200 kg cats jump on your back, and you weigh 2 tons

[full lagoon]

I'm pretty sure this was thought to be after death only

[half vessel]

Also caiman do not have slow reactions at all. They can whip and turn fast, especially in water.

[scenic flame]

Great point actually! and to go even further it must be impossible to keep a steady footing when a 8-10 animal gets a firm hold of you when you weigh 6 tons!

[full lagoon]

It's less about reaction and more so about striking fast and powerfully, and being very good at it.

[brisk quiver]

This is inexperienced sub adult elephant. I'll say there are cases where lion failed even at that
https://youtu.be/MbV7WuNWHe4?is=fPJWnGulh3L8CbVf

[undone rapids]

Bigger prey were less agile in such terrain, so they were preffered, also more meat

[balmy oyster]

I mean i haven’t seen anyone bring this up surprisingly but tigers have been known to take down guar and indian rhinos solo despite being normally smaller than these prey items, let alone get close for a proper mauling

Almost like a predatory animal is efficient with how it dispatches prey instead of charging headfirst towards the prey, almost like these are real animals with real stakes and life or death….

[full lagoon]

It's important to note that the circumstances in the last video differ greatly from that

[brisk quiver]

Reptiles are overall easier to catch than mammals
Try to catch lizard vs try to catch a mouse with bare hands

[charred hearth]

how did we get to this point in the arguement / debate

[outer tusk]

what

[compact leaf]

nuance is dead and this chat killed it

[balmy oyster]

We didn’t take the red flags seriously

[half vessel]

I absolutely can catch a mouse faster with my bare hands. Have you not seen countless videos of lizards in the desert escaping with quick reactions?

[full lagoon]

Nobody is saying both couldn't kill the other so uh I'm confused

[queen oar]

Tyrannosaurus more like Fraudsaurus.

[brisk quiver]

There is a case where tiger killed baby elephant and fatally injured a female protecting it
Doesn't mean this is something ordinary

[scenic flame]

Is the nuance in the room with us?

[charred hearth]

in a casket probably

[balmy oyster]

Yes it is in Mr. Triceratops belly

[queen oar]

@undone rapids hey Glaive, let's go make some Tyrannosaurus jerky!

[undone rapids]

Well it was the Elephant in the room, but a lion pride killed it.

[half vessel]

When a lizards body temperature drops of course its reaction time is delayed so it’s easier to catch than a mouse

[brisk quiver]

And im actually agreeing on that, now imagine if you weigh 10 tons and 8-10 ton animal gets a hold on you
You turn your horned face to it and smth bad happens.

[queen oar]

well, the elephant was sick or a juvenile, so that explains it lmao

[full lagoon]

It was also due to the time of day and strategy employed by the lions

[queen oar]

The Lions had Rocket Launchers, you see.

[light osprey]

now imagine if you weigh 5 tons and 8-10 ton animal gets a hold on you

[brisk quiver]

It was due to 5+ lions' combined weight is more than elephant can bear.

[scenic flame]

https://tenor.com/view/nightmare-what-youre-about-to-watch-gif-5789112

[charred hearth]

https://tenor.com/view/kaden-bear-walk-gif-15031442544519350917

[full lagoon]

They chose the best possible moment to strike and it definitely rewarded them, specifically attacking at night and away from the other elephants.

[undone rapids]

Well that is the difference, if it gets a good hold on your leg you don't get to turn. But if it fails then yeah you do turn to face it and it probably prefers to back off. Just depends on how you make the scenario play out

[brisk quiver]

https://youtu.be/2lU8HcxIAw8?is=9fgu9XAXMaWrBVcc theres a literal vid of 10+ lions going head on into young elephant cuz they know it cant do sht lol

[light osprey]

https://tenor.com/view/twilight-zone-nigtmare-gif-434579754875781999

[queen oar]

I think that it's kinda funny how we are imagining the Triceratops with all of the potential disadvantages ever, and then Tyrannosaurus with all of the perfect conditions ever

Like, not to say it ain't possible it's just literally: Coughing Baby vs Hydrogen Bomb

[balmy oyster]

If you payed attention to chat this is the complete opposite of what is happening but go on

[scenic flame]

Are the people imagining this in the room with us?

[brisk quiver]

Cuz rex has to dominate

[undone rapids]

What if rex had the flu!!

[queen oar]

Are you in the room with us?

[undone rapids]

No, he's in substance painter

[scenic flame]

answering a question with another question

[light osprey]

Have we considered the tyrannosaurus may have been obligate scavenger? Or due to its cursorial nature, perhaps pursuer of small prey like the Sphaerotholus and Meniscoessus

[queen oar]

answering the question that answered another question with a non-answer

[balmy oyster]

Gonna answer a question with another question to the question:

do you like waffles? Do you like pancakes? Do you like french toast?

[tulip dove]

The Nanotyrannus was the real apex predator of Hell Creek

[brisk quiver]

Im surprised poor elephant even fought for some time after a literal avalanche of lions casually went for it
But ppl will still say how impressive it is for lions to kill smth "this big"

[light osprey]

It’s hard to imagine such an organism being a hunter of the large megafauna in its biota.

[queen oar]

Hello Jack. Not nice to see you.