dnd-discussion

[inner silo]

Nah that's diabolical cuz you can get like soldier on a sorcerer with mid stats and now you're just a liability to your party

[burnt valley]

Cape of Billowing 🔥 🔥 🔥

[rough basalt]

Fits with the story

[knotty pasture]

The Tankard of Plenty:

This golden stein is decorated with dancing dwarves and grain patterns. If you speak the command word (“Illefarn”) while grasping the handle, the tankard fills with three pints of rich dwarven ale. The tankard has 3 charges. Using the tankard’s property expends 1 charge, and the tankard regains all expended charges daily at dawn.

[rough basalt]

The Transportation Guild needs cannon fodder to help them get train lines through a jungle

[lavish flame]

my goat the Charlatan's Die💯 💯 💯

[inner silo]

Getting plate armour on session 1 while being a wizard soldier with not a single stat above 12

[jovial badger]

what the hell

[lavish flame]

just got blindsided by a nonsequitor

[inner silo]

@rough basalt do you allow multiclassing? And is it also rolled?

[flat steeple]

Randomized stats do imply you won't exactly get what you want, though. So at which extent is it reasonable to simply refuse joining a table because you aren't satisfied with the results of said risk

[rough basalt]

Didn't think about that.
Now it's rolled

[jovial badger]

howd you get plate armor session 1

[burnt valley]

so like Suicide Squad?

[knotty pasture]

Free ale daily sounds like a dream, I'd take bad stats just to be everyone's bartender

[rough basalt]

Pretty much

[inner silo]

Scam people with charlatans die the whole session 1

[flat steeple]

I do not roll stats, but would I let in a person that tells me "if I roll bad I'm leaving?" The answer is no, probably not.

[rough basalt]

Gonna call the campaign "Rage of the Earth" or some crap

[burnt valley]

Lmao, now rolled stats fans get to feel how its like to get bent from character creation

[rough basalt]

Btw it's a Dinosaur jungle

[inner silo]

Tbh if you roll badly just pray the campaign isn't combat heavy or just die on session 1 and roll up a new character

[rough basalt]

Let your 8 stat all Wizard fight the T-Rex

[burnt valley]

Stegosaurus swarms

[rough basalt]

Evil Druids who summon dinosaurs

[glass granite]

I feel like there’s rolling badly, then there’s rolling atrociously bad to the point you’re actually pitiful

[lavish flame]

Why are you asking me? Thats a person-to-person thing. Personally, I'd avoid joining a game with rolled stats.

[jovial badger]

dudeeee

your dm let you do that

[lavish flame]

thats the point of the item, so hopefully yeah

its basically called "scam artist's die"

[rough basalt]

Nature's Fury might be a good name for the campaign

[jovial badger]

but like for 1500gp

[burnt valley]

Jungle Fury

[rough basalt]

Oh God jungle fury

[inner silo]

Worst case you're killed and roll a new character

[flat steeple]

Why am I asking you? ...because we were discussing the topic?

[rough basalt]

Sora's Hardcore Raging Jungle Boogaloo

[burnt valley]

Featuring Dante from the Devil May Cry series™

[lavish flame]

that seems a bit excessive. I can't imagine anybody betting several years' salary on a dice game.

[rough basalt]

Two people roll the exact same characters but one has superior stats
"The Jungle Agent"
"The legendary Jungle Agent"

[lyric viper]

I think that because it was a reply that question seemed aimed specifically at one user, instead of the whole chat.

I know I've been caught off guard before by something like that.

[inner silo]

Is there a sneaky fighter subclass

[rough basalt]

fighter who takes skilled for stealth and skill expert for expertise

[jovial badger]

fair

[lavish flame]

Best you got is using Fighter's progression to boost your Stealth skill

[glass granite]

Depends. Light or heavy stealth?

[rough basalt]

Fighter be very much the build a class character

[lavish flame]

They get more Ability Score Increases than usual, 2 more, so you have a little more wiggle room

[glass granite]

Because they are very good at heavy stealth

[inner silo]

Any level of stealthiness would work

[glass granite]

Well, they may not be able to commit an act without being seen, but they may be able to remove the witnesses

[jovial badger]

mod rah

[inner silo]

I see

[glass granite]

Though, fighters can be alright at stealth, depending on the build

[burnt valley]

They'd be great for Bugbears

[inner silo]

Alrighty, I'll stick to ranger. Thanks for help!

[glass granite]

They’re not beating any of the expertise classes though, or anyone with Pass Without Trace

[hollow stone]

you could play a Drow so you can just cast Darkness over the crime you're comitting

[glass granite]

Yes, because the giant black blob isn’t suspicious at all

[snow agate]

You play Druid so you can eat the corpse then turn back into a normal elf and nobody suspects anything

[hollow stone]

you can say the blob murdered them

[inner silo]

Food poisoning

[glass granite]

With what deception

[lavish flame]

This ruins the subtletly of most crime tho

[hollow stone]

oh no

i mean there is a way to play a CHA fighter if you have Eldritch Adept or one level in Warlock for Pact Of The Blade

[snow agate]

You could also just turn into a venomous animal and bite the enemy until they die to poison

Druid deaths can be often confusing

“Did you hear a horse killed Michael in his quarters yesterday?”
“….. huh?”

[humble cairn]

They don't need to beat anyone as long as they can prevent a failure on a Stealth roll with their indomitable thing.

[glass granite]

True that

[lavish flame]

Honestly I hadn't considered the applications of Wild Magic for crime. Getting away with murder by virtue of being a predator animal is pretty cool.

[snow agate]

Druids are ridiculously exceptional spies, smugglers, murderers, brigands, stalkers, and thieves

[jovial badger]

i hate those guys

[jovial badger]

ranger...

[inner silo]

But your honour, I didn't cast that fireball, my wild magic did

[jovial badger]

subtle spell

[inner silo]

Best class, ik. After artificer ofc

[lavish flame]

Oh shoot. I did say Wild Magic instead of Wild Shape. Lmao

[inner silo]

Yup

Happens to the best of us

[lavish flame]

Ah, regardless. Either one is pretty cool

[jovial badger]

(/j)

[lavish flame]

"I couldn't have killed that guy! At the time, I was a potted plant!"

[inner silo]

No I'm fr

[snow agate]

It’s better if nobody knows you’re a Druid

[inner silo]

Just tell the ranger so no incidents happen

[snow agate]

Have a fancy urban persona like an aristocrat so they’re none the wiser. That way you don’t even become a suspect

[red steppe]

Nah Ranger is 3rd, Blood Hunter is 1st /j

[inner silo]

Nah blood hunter is 3rd

Paladin is 4th

Halfcaster supremacy

[flat steeple]

Let's be real, the true caster fantasy secretely is polymorphing into one of those elden ring sentient steel balls to jumpscare unsuspecting guards

[snow agate]

The true caster fantasy is playing above level 9

(Very hard)

[inner silo]

True caster fantasy is playing along side an artificer

[flat steeple]

Is it the case for a lot of people? I've never played a caster below level 8

[inner silo]

So they give you the rock of fireball with 10 charges

[inner silo]

I'm playing one rn, it's a lot of fun

[flat steeple]

I've played most of the classes by now, and I gotta say, although cleric, sorcerer and druid were all fun...
I just prefer martials

[red steppe]

Peak

[inner silo]

I'm playing a level 4 sorcerer in one campaign and level 4 rogue in another so I'll soon know ig

[humble cairn]

So far I've fun had with every class I've tried. I have Sorcerer and Cleric left to try.

[red steppe]

I would like Martials more if they go full anime or DMC at higher levels, mid air solo combos would've been so sick

[inner silo]

My first two classes

[snow agate]

The majority of dnd games out there end before the high levels because they start at low levels and to maintain a campaign to lvl 10, if you start at lvl 1, requires generally like 30 sessions

[lavish flame]

we have some numbers floating around somewhere that indicate that most D&D games peter out around level 8

[humble cairn]

Like an Elements Monk?

[snow agate]

At least 30

[flat steeple]

Oh sheesh.

[humble cairn]

Huh, I thought it was level 12.

[red steppe]

Yeah kinda like that, juggling an enemy in the air but with weapons

[still plover]

There's always Masks, the superhero game.

[red steppe]

Masks?

[lavish flame]

it might be? I thought I remembered it being single digit

[humble cairn]

I mean with an Elements Monk you can make weapons out of the elements.

[humble cairn]

A PBtA (Powered by the Apocalypse) game.

[hollow stone]

idk, the problem with aerial combos is that nobody can intervene and you can't be in the way of anybody else, so an enemy could just walk right under you to get your squishies, which is gonna really suck in like 2 minutes

[flat steeple]

Yeah, it's hard to moderate expectations with dnd so I understand

[snow agate]

Add the consideration that there’s canceled games or scheduling issues, and you can easily have it take 40 weeks, so it can be faster to get pregnant and have a baby than to actually get to lvl 10

[humble cairn]

What I'm saying is that a full anime martial is available. Elements Monk is one of them.

[lavish flame]

I've got a 1-9 thats been going for 39 sessions

[inner silo]

Don't forget about champion fighter

[lavish flame]

I intend for it to go to 20, but who knows, yknow

[inner silo]

No i don't sadly, if you're referring to me

[humble cairn]

and that's not even counting reflavoring. I reflavored Beast Barb to be a Wuxia style Animal Style Kung Fu practitioner and it worked great!

[inner silo]

But I'm sure if you ask around there's bound to be someone who does

[snow agate]

Bonk

[inner silo]

I'm really sorry, just you saying yknow after who knows is really funny to me

[inner silo]

Unarmed barb?

[humble cairn]

Both unarmed and weapons. Mechanically they were shapeshifted claws, but I flavored them as Eagle Claw Style. then I added Light Hammers (iron rings worn around the forearms) with Nick Mastery.

[hollow stone]

aerial combos work in Devil May Cry because you don't fight alongside anybody else and you are the entire party, so being able to isolate an enemy is really strong, and the easiest way to do that is take them into the air for murder, because you have that damage output, but in a team game, if you're fighting more than one person, isolating a fight is only really that handy if you're designed specifically to do that and being the meat shield isn't your role, but a lot of the martials are not that, they are the meat shield. Monk and Rogue and Ranger are good for dive (the playstyle where you get where you get one person alone, stab them, and run), but Barbarians, Rangers, Fighters, and Paladins are more poke/brawl, where isolating the fight also means that the wall is gone, and that's bad

[inner silo]

I see

[humble cairn]

Hammer > Hammer > Claw > Claw was very fun. Could have had another attack if I went with Dual Wielder.

[humble cairn]

Making a wall for allies is not really that supported a mechanic, tbh. I mean it's better now in 2024, but it's still difficult to stop enemies from just ... walking past you.

[snow agate]

As a suggestion if you play a dhampir monk you can grapple an enemy, run them up the wall and carry them to the ceiling of the room, then do the most brutal people’s elbow of all time at lvl 3

[red steppe]

Aww man darn

[humble cairn]

Elements Monk does the same, but just dropping them from 60ft up.

[snow agate]

But then I’d have to play elements monk

[flat steeple]

Best of luck!

[hollow stone]

i mean even since 5e there's been a tech for that with Opportunity Attack > Unarmed Strike: Grapple, the whole You're goin' nowhere, I got you for three minutes. Three minutes of me time~

[humble cairn]

No, that didn't work in 2014.

[hollow stone]

oh it didn't?

[snow agate]

No

[hollow stone]

nvm then

[humble cairn]

You could only Grapple using the Attack Action in 2014, meaning couldn't do it on OA.

[flat steeple]

2024 made grappling a lot more efficient

A LOT more.

[humble cairn]

Only very specialized builds could stop enemies from walking past them in 2014. It got much much easier in 2024.

[lavish flame]

extend wall down, trust. problem solved

[hollow stone]

i guess it's also dependent on the DM having enemies tunnel vision appropriately, yea

[lavish flame]

I had a Monk from Baldur's Gate and I'm so sad I missed out on the new Forgotten Realms Feat Street Justice cuz that has a sweet Grapple buff.

[humble cairn]

This is why "tanking" doesn't really exist, because it relies on enemies falling for it, there's no actual mechanic. Again, it became closer to a reality in 2024.

Oh gosh yes, Street Justice! I want to make a grappling monk so bad.

[hollow stone]

but anybody who plays enough shooter games knows that looking up is a very rare occurrence, which also means if the tank is airborne and the enemies aren't looking there, they aren't gonna look there and they're gonna find someone who isn't levitating

[humble cairn]

Just grab and enemy and allow my allies to wail on them.

[lavish flame]

Lemme tell you, its pretty sweet

I got to dunk Zariel in the River Styx like an Oreo into milk.

[humble cairn]

This ... doesn't work like that in D&D, honestly.

All creatures in combat are assumed to see everything in view, that's in the rules.

[snow agate]

When it’s noon so I fly above the enemy since they won’t like to look up

[hollow stone]

yea it doesn't transfer mechanically, it's more like a behavior coding phenomena

[hollow stone]

also attacking from where the sun is is actually lore accurate, Vlad The Impaler's forces used such very tactic by travelling West at night so that, when they arrived, it'd be dawn, causing the sun to be in the East, which would be their angle of approach

[hollow stone]

at least it's how i'd run it, that the enemies don't look up until someone does something from up that would mandate their attention

[lavish flame]

did you just say "lore accurate" in reference to real world military strategy?

im stealing that

[hollow stone]

i have been doing that the entire time i have been here

lmao

[flat steeple]

That makes me think, actually. Would view cones in dnd work on tabletops

[hollow stone]

i use it for sword fighting, military strategy, biologic accuracy, other forms of scientific accuracy, i do that a lot

[hollow stone]

i mean DND, RAW, essentially establishes LOS as an orb that sees infinitely far and trusts the DM to make certain things impossible to perceive

[flat steeple]

No, I know that.

[hollow stone]

i mean you could do view cones, which would actually be really good for a horror campaign

it'd be lore accurate, for certain, but i'm glad that isn't RAW because that would mean virtual tabletops need more buttons for rotation

[flat steeple]

Lore accurate is cracking me lmao

[lavish flame]

Check out the DMG 2014 for Facing rules, right next to Flanking rules. Its just "you can see in front of you and to your sides, but not behind you" so Unseen Attacker rules apply for attacks from behind

As for a 3d cone of vision also extending upward and downward, might not work well when represented in 2d

[flat steeple]

Okay yeah that could be a hurdle

[knotty pasture]

Shame these 3d tabletop simulators aren't widespread yet

[knotty basin]

I mean, they don’t run that well and are hard to use

[hollow stone]

the human mind is not platformed to perceive all three dimensions at once

[knotty pasture]

No? Shame

[knotty basin]

I’m pretty sure it is

[hollow stone]

we are three dimensional beings, but we see in but two

[knotty pasture]

Whatever bg3 had was the pinnacle of a top to down combat system

[lavish flame]

Sorta comes with the territory though. People play D&D using like work laptops and stuff. Talespire or Project Sigil would melt my players' computers.

[knotty pasture]

That's another hurdle that I hope will be addressed

[knotty basin]

Last session I one-shot a zombie at level 3 (rogue) because of the massive damage rules

So that felt pretty good

[flat steeple]

True, our eyes can only see 2d, it's the mind that subjectively interprets depth

[burnt valley]

How?

wait nvm found it

[lavish flame]

I wish it had a grid tbh

[flat steeple]

Eh, grids can be equally as wonky in videogames

[lavish flame]

I don't like how nebulous the distance between things is in BG3. The difference between hitting and not hitting in melee was never clear to me

I intuitively know from D&D5e that its 5ft or 10ft reach, but man it never felt like that

[flat steeple]

Flying is a problem in both d&d games and the ttrpg itself

[lavish flame]

how do you mean? I've never felt flying really harmed the game

[flat steeple]

In regards to placing creatures on a 2d map

[rough basalt]

Eh

[snow agate]

We just put an elevation number next to the token

[rough basalt]

If you're playing IRL you can use an upside down glas

[flat steeple]

Or in the case of bg3, simply trying and failing to get the height right

[snow agate]

“55 ft” and now you know how high it is

[rough basalt]

If you're on a VTT some VTTs have elevation markers

Or ways you can modify your token name on the map to say you're so high up

Like in Tis games, if there's a flyer it'll be like character name (55ft), he uses ddb maps

[lavish flame]

I've got a Roll20 sticker thing that can add onto a mini a little up or down arrow with 5' increments up to 200. Those are a godsend. I recently did underwater adventuring where those got employed to great use.

[rough basalt]

Foundry has a little number on tokens that's for elevation.
You just put like 20 or -20

And it says + or - number above the token in white bold text

[fickle current]

guys looking for some help. please check #dnd-newcomers anyone whos willing to help, thanks!

[lavish flame]

In water, everyone can freely move up and down as they please, so knowing which characters are deeper or shallower is great. I freaking love elevation changes

[rough basalt]

I wanna run an underwater game

[lavish flame]

Your martials will hate it

Or they'll pick up spears, tridents, and pikes and adapt

[eager marsh]

It will still be worse and more restrictive to martials than casters

[lavish flame]

I giess you could blanketly give everyone a swimming speed and then it'd be mostly fine

You'd run low on monster variety quick though

[knotty basin]

Homebrew time

[rough basalt]

Sounds like the martials need to get their skills up then

[snow agate]

well you ought to tell them in advance or else the paladin will cry

[rough basalt]

Too bad, if you're good enough, you won't have any issues

[snow agate]

the 8 dex paladin with charisma stats looking at you as you announce at session 10 that you're gonna be spending the next arc in the ocean

[rough basalt]

Forgot the j

Nah, underwater game would be from the getgo

So they'd know what the breaks are

Whenever they come across underwater Bandits riding Sharks they'll get ideas

[snow agate]

can a druid wild shape into coral

[humble cairn]

On the other hand ... three dimensional combat means more space for the Aura of Protection to cover.

And I did make a very viable thrown weapons build, so a Javelin Paladin .. Javedin? .. could work.

[snow agate]

i question the rules if throwing anything underwater is effective

[rough basalt]

The guy who wants to playtest my Gunslinger when I tell him the game it's greenlit in is an underwater campaign:

[humble cairn]

As long as it's piercing I think it works fine within the normal range.

The rules are not even trying for realism. And this is a good thing for actually playing the game.

[raw ocean]

You just gave me PTSD flashbacks to when I ran an underwater campaign where some dude was dropping 40 damage at level 3 per shot

First time DMing too

[knotty basin]

How???

[raw ocean]

Warforged + home brewed guns

[knotty basin]

Why did you let him use overpowered homebrewed guns?

[raw ocean]

It was my first time DMing

[rough basalt]

Yeah my first game I had a level 3 homebrew class dude do like 160 damage on a crit

Cause of other homebrew rules from that server I felt pressured into using

[fickle current]

guys need some help, which class is like a druid but has a cosmic entitiy sort of feeling?

[rough basalt]

Circle of Stars ig

[knotty basin]

Warlock, great old one subclass

[rough basalt]

Not a cosmic entity, but it is cosmic

[knotty basin]

Or you could reflavor a druid

[raw ocean]

We can bond over never playing with gun crit builds again 😔

[rough basalt]

There is no druid sub that has any outer entity, that's pretty much Cleric and Warlocks thing.

[fickle current]

can druids shapeshift to animals?

[knotty basin]

Yes, they can.

[rough basalt]

Yeah that's one subs whole shebang

As long as the animal has the Beast creature type

[raw ocean]

I remember when my DM gave me the power to shift into a black adult dragon and then said “You take the damage you took in dragon form into your regular form”

[fickle current]

hmm i need a character that allows flying. druids can turn into eagles

[raw ocean]

I got scammed

[knotty basin]

They can, but they have limited uses of it

If you just want fly speed, aarakocra have a base fly speed

[rough basalt]

Or faeries

Owlin if Strixhaven options are on the table

[fickle current]

yea but i also want a celestial vibe to my character. i imagine my character as it is in my profile picture

[buoyant oar]

Yeaaaa tis why I tell people to restrict to the PHB for your first game

[knotty basin]

I’d play some kind of warlock then

[fickle current]

hmm okay, what are subclasses?

[buoyant oar]

Aasimar get limited flight as part of their Species. And are the celestial person species to boot.

[rough basalt]

I suggest reading the PHB

[knotty basin]

Or just the core rules

[fickle current]

?

[civic blade]

Do we got any Mighty Nein fans here

Or just critical role in general

[knotty basin]

There’s #critical-role-spoilers if you want to talk about it

Just be mindful of, well, spoilers

[hollow stone]

we need a druid subclass that turns into many smaller animals rather than just one

lemme transform into 4,000 ants

[civic blade]

Like a circle of the pets?

Oh

[hollow stone]

lemme explode into a flock of crows

[pliant sapphire]

"Rol iniciative for the 4000 ants"

[hollow stone]

4,000 ant-sized D20s clatter onto the floor

[burnt valley]

Fathomless Warlock

[burnt valley]

Is that a curse or something

[fickle current]

if i use a warlock, does my patron come next to my class?

[burnt valley]

4000 ants with conjure woodland beings kek

[knotty basin]

What do you mean by this

[stuck shuttle]

Warlock subclasses are their patrons

Fiend, Celestial, Fathomless, etc

[fickle current]

well for warlocks there are patrons right? such as the great old one

[stuck shuttle]

Yes, and those patrons will determine your subclass

It's not the end-all be-all though. If you like the mechanics of one subclass but not necesarily the default patron flavor it should be pretty easy to reflavor

[fickle current]

So i put "great old one" in the box of sub class?

[buoyant oar]

All at all, I totally understand the summoner fantasy. At the same time I beg every druid. Please please do not make a round of combat last 2 and 1/2 hours if you're going to summon you got to be done in 60 seconds

[stuck shuttle]

If that is the subclass you chose, yes

[fickle current]

great

[humble cairn]

Uhh .. you pick your Patron at level 3. Patron is the subclass, kind of the class specialization.

Oh chat was lagging, I was behind.

[orchid root]

Hi

[fickle current]

what is proficency?

[humble cairn]

Oh, you should maybe check out #learn-to-play

And then read the Basic Rules which are available to read for free: https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/dnd/br-2024

[orchid root]

Is there a free handbook online? im still pretty new to d&d

[buoyant oar]

That is the free handbook

[humble cairn]

Yes. It's the thing I linked.

[orchid root]

thanks

[knotty basin]

Are you in a campaign yet?

Or just checking things out for now?

[orchid root]

no im trying to kinda make a online version of it because all my friends live in different city’s

[knotty basin]

You can use roll20 for that

[orchid root]

Wdym is that a site?

[knotty pasture]

Choices you can make towards your class that makes them specialize into a certain gimmick, you have to pick a subclass by level 3 at the latest

[knotty basin]

Yes, it’s for running D&D online

[buoyant oar]

It's one of many sites that can utilized for such a feat. Some are free. Some are not

[knotty basin]

Roll20 is free, though

[orchid root]

Cool I will check it out it’s hard because all my friends live in different city’s and IVE seen thembefore but it’s sometimes annoying that we can’t play irl

[buoyant oar]

It has a free tier, if you're running, it's never a tier I recommend

[knotty basin]

Not everyone has money to spend on subscriptions

[buoyant oar]

For new dungeon Masters, I would always recommend D&D Beyond maps or owlbear rodeo first

[knotty basin]

The free tier is fine

[buoyant oar]

I'm not saying that everyone has to pay money. I'm saying that for that particular service if you're going to stick to the free tier I would go to a better free service

[orchid root]

im still kinda new and my friends parents hate magic so I wanted to ask if the mage and wizard class is necessary?

[knotty pasture]

No its not necessary but spellcasters are the backbone of a good team

[toxic kraken]

Hey, I’m unsure if this is the right space to ask this, but after 5 years a player, I’ve decided to give DMing a try

Does anyone have recommendations for: resources (the cheaper the better 🤣), videos to help get started, and anything else that may make this incredibly daunting task easier?

[knotty pasture]

But feel free to go 4 Warriors and just melee attack everything your way

[stuck shuttle]

No class is necessary to play, but magic is a fairly integral part of the game whether that's via fighting magical monsters, using magical equipment, living in magical worlds, etc

[knotty pasture]

Also you have to eventually deal with enemy mages, what then

[buoyant oar]

Matt colville's running the game series episodes 1 through 10 though all are valuable

[orchid root]

Fudge sticks is it possible to skip them or would it be necessary for the story/plot

[buoyant oar]

When you have some disposable cash, the 2024 dungeon Masters guide is a great resource. I will also say about that book. While it is great, he doesn't particularly say anything that the wider D&D community has not been saying for the past 10 years.

[knotty pasture]

As the DM you can cut them out but the game will be a lot more dull

Cuz your only choices are like, Fighter/Barbarian/Rogue/Monk

[stuck shuttle]

If you're the DM whatever is necessary for the plot is up to you.

[burnt valley]

💀

[knotty basin]

And presumably cleric in this situation

[knotty pasture]

I can't wait to see how you'd react to the fact that 1/4 of the classes are religious based

[orchid root]

True but it’s that almost all my friends parents including mines hate magic i don’t think the magic world would be a problem tho

[lavish flame]

I'd be pretty confident in saying that D&D5e absolutely assumes magic is part of the game and will probably not function if magic is removed from it.

[knotty pasture]

Does holy "magic" count as magic

[burnt valley]

Why do they hate Magic?

[orchid root]

My parents would just call it fantasy

[knotty basin]

Yeah, I have a feeling his parents won’t be so happy about a druid

[toxic kraken]

May I recommend possibly looking towards a different system? DnD is very magic oriented and you might want find a ttrpg more suited to your players if magic is an issue

[stuck shuttle]

Is D&D possible without magic or any magical or magical-like elements? Sure. But the game is meant to represent high fantasy themes and tropes. It won't represent a non-magical world mechanically as well as a different TTRPG built for it

[knotty pasture]

Oh no, my kid is turning into one of those fur-whatevers 😔

[buoyant oar]

If magic is a no-go, you are much better served by going to a different system

[orchid root]

well maybe I just wanted to play dnd with my friends

[knotty pasture]

/s for the record

[orchid root]

Wym different system

[stuck shuttle]

A different TTRPG

[lavish flame]

There's other tabletop games in other genres, but magic is pretty core to the fantasy genre. D&D is a fantasy tabletop game at its core.

[knotty pasture]

Starfinder is sci fi based

[buoyant oar]

Yes but trying to strip magic out of Dungeons and Dragons, is like trying to tow a boat with a Kia Soul. There are other games out there that aren't Dungeons& Dragons that do different things

[orchid root]

Table top rpg?

[knotty pasture]

@orchid root let us know how you think

[knotty basin]

I know paladin, druid, and cleric, what’s the fourth?

[knotty pasture]

Its just those three

[knotty basin]

Oh, I forgot how to count for a second

[knotty pasture]

I rounded down lol

[knotty basin]

No… there’s only 12 classes

[knotty pasture]

I counted artificer

[pliant sapphire]

Paladin is not entirely religious based

[knotty pasture]

Paladin falls under the priest genre in Forgotten Realms

[stuck shuttle]

It came from religious origins

[orchid root]

Well I don’t know I think me and my friends could still play dungeons and dragons with out magic but playing other ttrpg but yeah I think maybe I still feel maybe but if you guys say so aight
My parents are just very strict when it comes to magic and etc

[knotty basin]

What if you just call all the magic classes “clerics”

Wizard? Nah, book cleric

[knotty pasture]

Does holy magic count as magic

[orchid root]

well idk my mom strict in everything so idk

[knotty pasture]

If not you can play it just fine, otherwise you're really strapped for options

[buoyant oar]

Divine magic is magic

[knotty basin]

I’m guessing holy magic is not what his parents are concerned about

[orchid root]

welp.

[knotty pasture]

No no like I wanna hear it from him, or rather how he thinks his parents would take it

[stuck shuttle]

Yeah I mean you could just come up with different names for everything to make it appear non-magical to an outsider but that's a lot of work

[orchid root]

Are we allowed to talk about religion? So I can explain it in a better manner

[knotty pasture]

If your fictional character uses holy miracles via worshipping fictional gods is it magic

[lavish flame]

Yup! D&D is just one of many TTRPGs out there, and it aims for fantasy. If your friends' parents would rather not have magic involved in their play, then something like LANCER (a sci-fi mecha TTRPG) or Mutants and Masterminds (a superhero TTRPG) might be more up you groups' speed.

[knotty pasture]

Best to not talk about real life religion but you can just say yes or no

[orchid root]

Well it’s kinda to explain a bit better but idk

[humble cairn]

Uhh ... how about a game that is set in science fiction instead of fantasy?

[orchid root]

Hm that DOESNT sound bad i like sci-fi too.

[buoyant oar]

Star finder might be up your alley then or Traveller

[humble cairn]

So there are other games besides D&D.

[orchid root]

maybe

[buoyant oar]

And of course Cyberpunk

[lavish flame]

Or Mothership if you want Alien style sci-fi horror. There's a wide breadth of options

[orchid root]

my mom is a jw and I live in a divided house hold I don’t wanna get hated for being a jw im just explaining why too
I always wanted to play d&d but my mom is kinda strict in magic in particular so I just wanted to say that

welp im cooked.

[stuck shuttle]

If it is literally just the label of magic that's concerning to your parents it might be easy enough to just call things something else:

• Wizards --> Theologian
• Clerics --> Apostles
• Paladin --> Templar

[knotty pasture]

That's v smart, good thinking

[buoyant oar]

Well.... Technically

Paladin --> Paladin

[knotty pasture]

Enemy apostles worshipping Booooal are planning something evil, go fight them off

[stuck shuttle]

Yeah yeah bad example using Paladin

[knotty pasture]

I may have just called Paladins Justiciars

[lavish flame]

This Isn't Advice And Shouldn't Be Taken As Such, but there's a very long history of hiding that you play D&D from friends and family.

[sleek cloud]

The already aptly named monk:

[buoyant oar]

Paladins are just paladins though lol

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paladin

[orchid root]

I just explained why and you guys are talking about the names 😭

[lavish flame]

Yeah idk either dawg

[knotty pasture]

What is dnd if not reflavoring

[stuck shuttle]

I mean it's fictional magic, not actual rituals you're performing

[orchid root]

well I don’t play it because I don’t have a play set yet but I would like to learn about it

[knotty pasture]

Or just play starfinder lol its a free world

Maybe aliens are more up your family's alley

[sleek cloud]

It’s mostly math and imagination

[orchid root]

maybe. but thanks tho

[buoyant oar]

Yeap DnD isn't a FOMO endeavor you can play other RPGs and then. When you become a free adult in the world (Do not share your age here plz) do whatever you want.

[orchid root]

I might try out other games but I still kinda wanna try dnd but with out the magic

But thanks guys

[knotty basin]

Actually, I’m pretty sure monks would be off the table too

[orchid root]

Am I still allowed here even if I play other ttrpg games 😭

[knotty basin]

So just fighters, rogues, barbarians, clerics and paladins

[orchid root]

Why?

[buoyant oar]

Again. You can do that. But it's not recommended. Like you can bike through a swamp. Or you can use the Bike lane.

[lavish flame]

You're probably gonna sour the experience in this process. You're taking a cake recipe and removing the flour. Call of Duty games need Guns like how D&D needs Magic.

[knotty pasture]

Monks channel their ki through harnessing the magical energy in their body

But its less about throwing fire at people but more punching people epicly

[orchid root]

welp. what if I as a dm use different things that wouldn’t be considered as magic

[knotty basin]

That’s what we’ve been telling you to do

[orchid root]

😭

[buoyant oar]

That's a level of homebrew I would not recommended for first time DMs

[knotty pasture]

If holy magic is not magic you're safe

[orchid root]

im stupid lmao

[knotty pasture]

If holy magic is still magic you're crap outta luck

[orchid root]

Well idk I would have to check w my mom

[knotty pasture]

I guess an easy question to ask would be, are your parents fine with fictional characters worshipping fictional gods and getting power from them

[stuck shuttle]

We are talking about the names because the magic of a D&D world is fictional. It's certainly not real magic, and it's certainly not having you perform anything resembling magic.

As an example, mechanically a fireball is just summoning a ball 8d6 fire damage + some other requirements. You could easily describe it as coming from a miracle, innate ability, technology, etc as long as the actual mechanics don't change.

[orchid root]

I would have to ask them

[knotty pasture]

Yeah go ask them that its the easiest I can make the question

[lavish flame]

Yeah, this isn't a server of devotees to D&D. Most people here play only D&D, but we aren't like... beholden to it, its just a game. I freaking love Mutants and Masterminds cuz I love sueprheros

[knotty pasture]

I'm just gonna ignore all the implications behind sacred flame and toll the dead

[lavish flame]

This is narcing on yourself

[orchid root]

Cool so I could say maybe like
If I roll a 8d6 I could say I use technology?

[orchid root]

im cooked.

[knotty pasture]

Sure you roll a 8d6 to summon a cannon out of thin air to fire at the enemy

[lavish flame]

"Are you okay with magic in the context of a person of faith wielding divine power?" Is a question thats clearly pointing to "This kid is trying to get away with something"

[stuck shuttle]

You'd probably want to make it more narratively descriptive than that but as long as the mechanics don't change you're fine

[knotty pasture]

Why are you cooked they're just holy magic

[stuck shuttle]

Like I said it seems your parent(s) are just concerned with the label of magic & related terms and not the actual content that comes under that label

[orchid root]

Okay so what if I play dnd but with different elements like instead of wizard i out technologist that has same stats as them like if I put fireball and the technologist has a cannon then could that work?

[hollow stone]

i mean yea it isn't not a concept that magic can't be reflavored into anything else, but magic is like, core to how DND works and half of anything at all is probably a spell and you will probably need to imagine a third thing that isn't magic but mechanically identical to it to serve the designated purpose

[knotty pasture]

Sure

[knotty basin]

Yes, that’s what we’re saying

[knotty pasture]

Starfinder is legit less exhausting than this fr

[burnt valley]

just say you force a target to pay a toll til they die

[hollow stone]

exemplary you can reflavor the Light spell to a little drone with a lightbulb strapped to it that flies somewhere and brights

[knotty pasture]

Good thinking

[lavish flame]

I feel like I'm going crazy, this isn't how beliefs work.

[orchid root]

Thats pretty cool

[humble cairn]

Well sure, but also the rules of this server are that conversation is supposed to stay on topic for the channel. The only channel you can talk about other games extensively would be #non-dnd-topics.

[knotty basin]

From experience, I can say for some people it definitely is

[orchid root]

DIDNT I say what I was in before?

[hollow stone]

you could also do the same with darkness and sci fi into having a backwards lightbulb

[orchid root]

😭

[knotty pasture]

I'm not gonna comment on one's religious upbringing else I would start using choice words

My character's one true god is Moradin, praise be

[orchid root]

Well I think that would work but yeah

Welp I feel like I’m getting cooked by everyone here 😭

[humble cairn]

Magic is pretty fundamental to a fantasy game. You can take D&D and reflavor all the magic as non-magic, but at that point it would probably be easier to just pick up a different game that doesn't involve magic.

[humble cairn]

It's a big room, and everyone has opinions. Pretty sure no one means anything badly, it's just a lot of people talking to you all at once.

[knotty pasture]

No its just that rather than walking a path with jagged rocks there's a smooth path right there

[stuck shuttle]

What I mean is just that they are concerned with the thing being called magic, wizard, etc, rather than the actual substance.

[hollow stone]

yea then it just comes down to experiences and things you can lowkey plagiarize from people smarter than you, like Rainbow Six: Siege and Deimos' DeathMARK Tracker and Hunter's Mark and suddenly my ranger had a little bug creature that would stare at who they Hunter's Marked

[orchid root]

sighs okay. is there any similar dnd games w the DM similar type

[knotty pasture]

Starfinder

Instead of fantasy its laser guns and aliens

[orchid root]

if I added Deimos death mark tracker wouldn’t that be kinda OP for a dnd game?

[lavish flame]

A human being isn't a computer program that reads "label = magic, banned". This person has an understanding of magic that is more than skin-deep, just scrubbing a label away but maintaining everything else about it isn't gonna work. Thats just gonna be Magic But These Kids Are Covering It Up And Lying To Me.

[orchid root]

I wonder if I can make my own dnd game but with out magic and just make it cool ig

[hollow stone]

that depends entirely on whether or not you know what it is, because that sounds scary but in reality it's just a little drone that reveals an enemy's location to Deimos and Deimos' location to them

[humble cairn]

So D&D is a Tabletop Roleplaying Game, that is the generic term for this kind of game. And yes, there are a lot of them out there, you will easily find them just by searching. Here is one that you can get the rules and the whole game for absolutely free, FATE, I won't discuss it at length since it's off topic for this channel, but you can try that one.

[hollow stone]

it also depends entirely on how you invent it, like mine was entirely flavor and just a physical manifestation of a spell

[humble cairn]

Ehh ... much easier to pick a game system that already exists and use that, all the work has been done already.

[orchid root]

makes sense

[orchid root]

Yeah but I like making myself do challenges so I might make it someday when I have the time and chance but would still be cool tho no?

[orchid root]

hm cool I will give it a shot

[humble cairn]

The game I linked you is a generic system that can be used for any genre, fantasy or science fiction or horror, it's already kind of a build-your-own game. Take a look at that.

[lavish flame]

Kids on Bikes (a coming-of-age mystery TTRPG, I guess) is fairly magic-less iirc. There's weird happenings, but its the same weird happenings that appear in like... E.T.

[orchid root]

Ok

Fate looks cool and it even has similar dnd type dices

[humble cairn]

It very much does not.

It has dice yes, but not like D&D dice at all.

[lean wigeon]

fate mentioned
so peak

[orchid root]

oh wait nvm im stupid

[stuck shuttle]

Plenty of people have and do make spot judgements of something without enquiring or investigating further.

Using the fireball example, if one describes 8d6 the fire damage as coming form a fired cannon a man is wielding vs. VSM from a wand, someone not okay with "magical content" is much more likely to be ok with the former descriptor.

[humble cairn]

Nope, none of that negative self talk.

[orchid root]

I have tons of dices in my house

[orchid root]

what lol

[lavish flame]

thats just genuine life advice

[humble cairn]

Don't call yourself stupid, that's unhealthy.

[orchid root]

oh thanks

[stuck shuttle]

Granted it is much more laborious and complicated when we get to how much stuff is expected to be magical in D&D, and at a certait point it's much more work to reflavor everything than it is to just learn a non-magical TTRPG

[lean wigeon]

Fate is a weird system if you come from traditional TTRPGs in that it doesn't simulate anything. That might be something to consider if immersion is something you value in a TTRPG because Fate is kind of an antithesis to that sort of play

[humble cairn]

Ehh, I find that style to be more immersive.

[orchid root]

I like sci-fi

[humble cairn]

Different things cause immersion for different people.

[orchid root]

you guys are cool thanks for the advice btw

[lean wigeon]

have you checked out starfinder by any chance

[orchid root]

I am now

[lean wigeon]

cool

[orchid root]

Does it have dices too?

[lean wigeon]

yes, it uses d20 for checks and most rolls as well as the other polyhedrals

[orchid root]

Hm okay

I like ttrpg so I might pick it up

Im a nerd for other games like video games tbh but this is my first time getting into ttrpg so I thought a good beginner would be dnd

[lavish flame]

TTRPGs usually all have dice, but there's some other resolution mechanics. I'm super fond of TTRPGs that use a jenga tower to resolve outcomes

[orchid root]

JENGA??? lol

[lavish flame]

Yup. If the tower falls, your character might keel over dead.

[umbral girder]

Yeah the new DnD is a good baseline for new players getting into TTRPGs, but not required of course.

[orchid root]

Bru

[burnt valley]

what would a boss fight with jenga towers be like?

[orchid root]

Ngl you guys seem very nice for a community i like you guys ❤️

[lavish flame]

D&D is definitely most ppl's first TTRPG, but it isn't necessary the easiest to get into

Most TTRPGs do not have 1000 pages of core rules text

[buoyant oar]

Yeah DND is still high on the complexity scale

[orchid root]

probably hell.😭 I already struggle with jenga

[orchid root]

I like complex things

[buoyant oar]

DND is far from the most complex. But it is still complex.

[lavish flame]

Its resolved in one or two pulls. The pulls represent a larger course of action than a D&D dice roll

[orchid root]

welp is there ANY ttrpg games that are literally LIKE dnd but without magic ig and COMPLEX

[burnt valley]

Ngl, my fingers would accidentally bump the tower at the most unstable spot sometimes

[orchid root]

Yup i struggle enough

[inner silo]

I think rp stuff is more difficult about dnd then it's mechanics

[lavish flame]

I can't imagine many fantasy TTRPGs that don't feature magic in some capacity.

[burnt valley]

This'll make combat faster nice

[hollow stone]

tbh you can absolutely just choice select specific enemies to spawn and reflavor everything until you're playing DND but it doesn't have the aesthetic of fantasy

[buoyant oar]

You mean mechanics like renown, loyalty, influence and more that center around RP?

[lavish flame]

I love renown so much

[orchid root]

I might do that thats cool

[inner silo]

I mean the actual rp. Like role playing your character and making their personality

[lavish flame]

I like when my fantasy heroes are recognized by local powers, that shit is awesome

[buoyant oar]

Well there is a reason the most famous DM currently is a full time improv actor.

[hollow stone]

like i've been, and for a long time, been plotting out a modern-futuristic DND that's shaped more like counter-terrorism than whatever adventurers do that isn't some metric of being a terrorist

[lean wigeon]

i guess Mythras?

[orchid root]

May I get a sample of it pls😭

[buoyant oar]

GURPs doesn't have magic

[hollow stone]

DND is actually a pretty good system for adapting magic into devices because your total spell list and total spells you have prepared are not the same number and are not the same thing

[lavish flame]

Does Savage Worlds? I've never played it but I've heard good things

[lean wigeon]

savage worlds has magic in the form of "powers"

[orchid root]

il check it out

[still plover]

You can run SW without magic just fine.

[stuck violet]

Hey

[orchid root]

my parents don’t consider magic as powers

[buoyant oar]

There is a Game of Thrones TTRPG. The world has magic but I don't think it's featured heavily.

[lavish flame]

Like marvel movies are cool?

[orchid root]

Ye

[stuck violet]

Who has any active campaign presently

[stuck shuttle]

Check #find-a-game

[hollow stone]

i mean it's pretty regular, bow is gun and gun is gun and spells are gun that does something else than gun and sometimes a grenade that's something prettier than bomb

[orchid root]

Marvel movies are ok for my parents

[stuck violet]

Thanks

[buoyant oar]

Traveller is also a good no magic system, and has a lot of 3rd party support.

[orchid root]

GRANADE

Welp thanks guys. if it’s to expensive then im fuc-

[lavish flame]

Deadlands is fantasy wild west, that might be cool

[orchid root]

Awsome I might listen to Metallica while playing it

Metallica is so peak lmao

[lavish flame]

Oh yeah some of these are not free and will run you a pretty penny if you want to buy them. My advice for that is Try Before You Buy. Look around online for anybody running one of these games, see if they're open to a new player joining, see if you enjoy the game.

[orchid root]

[hollow stone]

the funniest one of these is Color Spray because that's either a 120,000 Lumen flashlight (which is real) or Mace (which is real)

[orchid root]

Okay I didn’t know you could play ttrpg games online

Nice

[lavish flame]

While we can't advocate for piracy here per server rules, uhhh yeah. you figured it out Nail on the head, even.

[buoyant oar]

Yes. There are a myriad of tools from freemium services like Roll20 to buy once own forever services like Foundry, and many more.

[lean wigeon]

some of them do offer some sort of quickstart or demo for people who want to check the system out

like, Savage Worlds has the Test Drive rules over on DriveThruRPG for free

[orchid root]

cooked that would blind a person I think instantly

[buoyant oar]

Pro tip. Piracy is bad. And don't do it. There is enough free material in the world to not engage in theft

[orchid root]

Hehe okay

[lean wigeon]

starfinder is free though

[lavish flame]

There's a number of services that host "Virtual Tabletops" (VTT) that you can play TTRPGs using. A common free one os Owlbear Rodeo, a website anyone can use.

[lean wigeon]

though i dont think sf2e is on aonprd yet

[orchid root]

Is it possible to play roll20 w out magic or smh

[buoyant oar]

Yes

[lean wigeon]

oh wait nvm, it's on there as well actually

[buoyant oar]

Most VTT are system agnostic

[lavish flame]

Yes but thats because Roll20 is a website designed to host many different TTRPGs

[orchid root]

Hm awsome

[lavish flame]

Its not a D&D engine, its just a Virtual Tabletop

[orchid root]

Who wanna play roll20 with me later 😭

[noble basin]

You don't play roll 20 you use it as a platform to play a ttrpg

[orchid root]

Ahh okay

[snow agate]

i forgot how hard it can be to find art of some dnd races

[lavish flame]

Its a gathering space to play a TTRPG game, not something you directly play. If you want to figure out who would like to play with yoi on R20, they have a "Looking-For-Game" section which is bsaically a matchmaker for a gaming group.

[rough basalt]

Yeah most people only play Humans, Elves, Dwarves and Tieflings so they got the most art.

[orchid root]

Hm okay

I might play it w my friends later maybe magic less dnd or just diff games

[hollow stone]

yea that's what Color Spray does

[rough basalt]

Not to mention trying to find human dnd art is an adventure in itself

[snow agate]

looking for drow art rn and it falls heavily into two categories 😫

[hollow stone]

they do a CON save and if they fail they're blinded

[orchid root]

WHAT

[rough basalt]

If you don't want magic then you should play a different system

[orchid root]

wait what if they make a space dnd lmao

[hollow stone]

not forever but for a time

[still plover]

Look for elves, throw a greyscale filter over it.

[stuck shuttle]

That's the Spelljammer setting /hj

[snow agate]

genius actually

[buoyant oar]

Player: I am going to play a tiefling
Dm: Good
Player: Who is a Warlock
Dm: How original
Player: Who is just a silly guy!
Dm: Daring today aren't we?

[hollow stone]

that's just Spelljammer which is also DND in a very literal "it is both made by WOTC and uses the DND system" way

[orchid root]

[rough basalt]

Where you fly magic ships through space using magic spells and items to pilot them

[stuck shuttle]

This is my experience with goblin artificers with crazy ideas. Bonus points if they love explosions

[orchid root]

Aah shi-

Is warlock as a class magic too?

[lean wigeon]

yes

[stuck shuttle]

Yes

[rough basalt]

DnD is intrinsically magical

[orchid root]

Damn it

[stuck shuttle]

Their magic comes from a pact with a powerful being, such as a Fiend, Celestial, Archfey, etc

[orchid root]

Ah okay

[lean wigeon]

i would check out something like Mythras for low/no-magic fantasy

[snow agate]

im thinking of a catfolk...whos a rogue...is a thief...

[buoyant oar]

Warlocks are specifically magic that has illicit origins.

[orchid root]

Wdym

[snow agate]

oooh or how about the dwarf fighter whos an alcoholic

[orchid root]

what.. do you mean by illicit..,

[lean wigeon]

or Barbarians of Lemuria
or Pendragon

[buoyant oar]

It's literally occultism gameifed

[stuck shuttle]

Gentle giant / parentcore Firbolg

[orchid root]

Is Mythras on roll 20?

[still plover]

My barbarian wears the furs of animals they killed in single combat and communicates in grunts.

[lavish flame]

Its been around since like 1987. Spelljammer is D&D in space!!! People travel from planet to planet and system to system on fantastical boats, some which look like a standard seafaring ship, some of which look lile dragonflies or turtles or a hollowed out asteroid. Its pretty sweet.

[rough basalt]

If there's no magic at all, then nothing in the dnd books will work as intended as the dnd system assumes magic exists

[lean wigeon]

roll20 should support Mythras i think

[snow agate]

i actually havent seen someone do that yet so id find it original

[orchid root]

Awsome if I can play it magicless then cool if not then im cooked

[rough basalt]

No it's inherently magical

[orchid root]

Okay il play it w my friends

After I finish school

I can’t use my PlayStation on weekdays smh

[hollow stone]

yes, BUT if you know enough words and have enough letters then you can make it without magic

[still plover]

Yeah, you're best off looking for another system. As above, check DriveThruRPG, search for quick starts, there are a range of free options there to try out.

[stuck shuttle]

roll20 requires mobile or PC

[orchid root]

Yeah I know im on my tablet

[stuck shuttle]

I don't think playstation's browser will support the website

[hollow stone]

it is a lot of reinventing but any sufficiently DND person can do it

[rough basalt]

Yeah it just uses a fictional force that can't be explained through scientific meaning that can also be called a certain M word

[orchid root]

M word?

[lavish flame]

You're using "magicless" to mean "we give the magic powers and stuff some other non-magic coat of paint", right? D&D as a game assumes that magic will be in play. If you are planning on ripping magic out of D&D, you're gonna have a terrible time.

[buoyant oar]

I know the Xbox browser can support roll 20.

[hollow stone]

this is true, but you can replace it with a new M word, money, to explain a lot of things, actually

[orchid root]

nah I might just make my own dnd with a different plot😭

Lmao

[rough basalt]

Yes money would get you a flying magical ship

[stuck shuttle]

D&D isn't tied to a specific plot

[buoyant oar]

That sounds like a monumental task.

[hollow stone]

yes, with enough funds and research you can make a ship fly

[orchid root]

I like my self a challenge.

[rough basalt]

Yep using magic

Eberron does it with airships

[hollow stone]

this is an actual thing that actually happened, you don't need magic with enough words

[rough basalt]

You do in dnd

[orchid root]

Welp thanks guys I might play other table top games but thanks

[buoyant oar]

Faerûn has airships too air ships are fairly common in DND worlds

[rough basalt]

There's no FTL drives.
There's dudes with funky hats.

[rough basalt]

Right Halruaa I think has them right?

[orchid root]

I love cyberpunk tbh

[hollow stone]

yes, but my point is that if you have enough reflavoring you can remove all magic and make it sci-fi

[rough basalt]

Then you can't use the dnd books

Cause dnd as a system functions around magics existence

[hollow stone]

you can use the mechanics of them but yea you wouldn't use the settings

[true kelp]

Hello

I’m new here, so nice to meet you all!

[buoyant oar]

Halruaa had a lot of them. Though most were destroyed when they land got brutalized by the Spellplauge. Slowly they are rebuilding their fleet. But so does Shou Lung, Nimbral, and more.

[orchid root]

WAIY roll20 has like integrated voice chat and 3d dice! Sick

[hollow stone]

this would be inventing a whole other setting

[orchid root]

Nice to meet you too

[rough basalt]

And you'd need a lot of homebrew enemies

[orchid root]

Wdym home brew

[rough basalt]

Cause you can't use most of the bestiaries as they're magical creatures

[lavish flame]

Halruaa and Lantan should, before considering any loose Spelljammers floating about

[buoyant oar]

Brew your own rules. At home.

[hollow stone]

this is true

[buoyant oar]

Spelljammers are also very common on Toril.

[rough basalt]

Can't use a lot of features as they're magical too

[orchid root]

ah. thats easy I already draw a lot of creatures

[lavish flame]

Its a term for something you personally made and added to a TTRPG. You brewed it at home.

[orchid root]

In my free time

[hollow stone]

reflavor the features to have a technological explanation

[orchid root]

WAIT I MIGHT COOK UP SOMETHING

[hollow stone]

you are coming at this with a very short mind, sora

[buoyant oar]

Nimbral is home to a Spelljamming Cadet School. The Yehmial Mountains hosts a floating drydock for Spelljammers.

[lavish flame]

Are there like... ports for spelljammers in large enough cities?

[rough basalt]

Nah I'm just not so stubborn to spend a lot of unnecessary work to make something that doesn't work partially work for a limited time

[lavish flame]

Do the people of Neverwinter have Close Encounters With The Third Kind?

[buoyant oar]

Yes. In Waterdeep the law states Jammers must rest in the water and sail into dock.

[rough basalt]

Yes, Lord Neverember makes them pay Spelljam taxes

[true kelp]

Soo, how much can you get away with home brew?

[orchid root]

Now image a creature with fire balling powers that has a 100+ attack damage similar to a 3headed hydra basically but it’s weakness is water

[lavish flame]

siiick

[orchid root]

I had this in my book already

[hollow stone]

oh, yea, no, if you don't wanna do it, you shouldn't

[rough basalt]

The harder you brew the less the system applies to you and the harder it gets to make the game function

Light stuff works best

[hollow stone]

but my objectives are that i wanna do it, so i will

[lavish flame]

Your Mileage May Vary is the key. I don't really like super heavy homebrew, I'd rather just switch systems.

[true kelp]

Examples?

[rough basalt]

Reskinning statblocks, feats, weapons

[stuck shuttle]

As a player? As much as your DM approves.

As a DM? Unlimited, but as Sora said the harder you go the harder it is to make the system work in a balanced way.

[buoyant oar]

The great city of Akkadio on Wa's Tsukishima island is also a large Spelljamming port on Toril

[rough basalt]

The more drastic the brew, the more the game breaks and you won't have anything to help you fix it cause you turned your game into an abomination.

[true kelp]

Ah, I see! Sorry for asking that seeming simple question, as the two campaigns that I had been in were completely homebrew. As such, I don’t really know a lot of the official stuffs.

[orchid root]

how did we go from magic less stuff to homebrewing stuff

[rough basalt]

And you also lie whenever you advertise it as 5e once you get to a certain point imo

Cause magicless would be homebrew

[orchid root]

In mythras is there homebrewing?

[stuck shuttle]

This server and channel are open forums, so we're not tied to one topic at a time

[buoyant oar]

However trade with the surface did decrease when The Batship arrived.

[orchid root]

Ah okay

[stuck shuttle]

Homebrewing is just an umbrella term for "custom changes/content" so it can be made for any TTRPG

[orchid root]

Well guys I have a free class im gonna see if I can play roll20 to gey a hang of the game

[snow agate]

you would also imo be better of just playing a modern or scifi system instead of dnd, since they exist and have had teams work on them instead of just you at 2 am

[orchid root]

ah okay

[uncut zenith]

The analogy I’ve always used is that homebrew can be like remodeling a home. Painting the interior walls a different color (reskinning/minimally changing existing rules and options) is simpler, easier, and less time consuming than expanding the entire foundation (introducing brand new changes and subsystems to the existing base rules).

[rough basalt]

Like if your advertising a game as 5e and you got a 120 page Google doc of homebrew changes I'm heading out.
That ain't 5e, that's d20 fantasy

[true kelp]

Say, what is a 5e?

[rough basalt]

DnD 5th edition

[stuck shuttle]

Along with what Sora said, homebrew can be deceptively complex. What may seem like a simple change may actually have much grander implications for the game and its balance. For example, messing with concentration requirements or adding "called shots"

[buoyant oar]

5e is DND's 5th edition which is the 9th version of the game.

[lavish flame]

the 5th edition of the Dungeons and Dragons ruleset. They've been modifying and changeing the game for 50 years. In that time they've made (more than) 5 editions of the game

[rough basalt]

Tho you can get funny with it.
You say your playing homebrew 5e then send the players the Pathfinder 2e character builder

A lot probably won't realize it funny enough

[snow agate]

the illiteracy of dnd players ought to be studied

[lavish flame]

for simplicity's sake its the 5th edition. if you're a real one, it could get to double digits.

[true kelp]

I remember the time when my past DM added literal gambling through his campaign via the Gacha system. Yes, you heard that right. He added the very same system found on Genshin Impact and stuffs.

So, I give up and quit.

[rough basalt]

I almost threw up

[orchid root]

GUYS WHEN DID THEY ADD FALLOUT TO ROLL20

[buoyant oar]

The 2024 refresh if you count it is the 11th version of the game

[rough basalt]

There's a fallout tabletop system.
Couple of them actually

[orchid root]

there’s so many awsome systems online

[hollow stone]

yea homebrew rules are weird but flavor is really easy

[lavish flame]

when they made a Fallout TTRPG. probably a few months afterward actually

[orchid root]

This is inspiring me to play more ttrpg 😭

[rough basalt]

An old one, one that's recognized by Bethesda, and one made by a Yter

[buoyant oar]

Fallout is based on the GURPS trrpg

[lavish flame]

Its the most fun you can have with your mind

Oh yeah, Fallout 1's title screen even mentions that its a GURPS thing

[rough basalt]

Tho the yter one is probably just a 5e abomination

[orchid root]

Awsome my dads not in my moms religion so we usted to play a lot of fallout when I was smaller

[orchid root]

WHats gurps?

[idle oar]

A different ttrpg system

[lavish flame]

Generic Universal Role Playing System

[rough basalt]

It's basically the system for whatever you wanna run under the sun

[lavish flame]

Its a generic... universal... you know the rest.

[orchid root]

Thanks

[buoyant oar]

Generic Universal Role Playing System

[orchid root]

I got a reminder by dyno lmao

Not to use caps

[minor cargo]

Yeah, it's indoor voices only here. 😉

[lavish flame]

that checks out, iirc it messes with screen readers

thay might be strikethrough text, actually

[orchid root]

lol

Gwyn sounds like a cool person to play roll20 w

[hollow stone]

yea some TTS systems interpret caps like acronyms, which kinda sucks if you're blind and need TTS systems to know how to read

[idle oar]

Yeah it can be an accessibility issue - some text to speech tools will read out the individual letters instead of the words and thus it can really be problematic for our folks who need to use them to participate online.

[lavish flame]

I think some ppl here have had the luxury, actually. I can't remember who all tho

[uncut zenith]

One doesn’t typically play Roll20. You play D&D or another TTRPG on Roll20

[hollow stone]

this server is very disability friendly and that is really cool

[orchid root]

Ahh okay

[humble cairn]

Try not to use all caps, it messes with people using assistive technology to read the chat.

Oh, someone reminded you already, sorry my chat is lagging.

[shy stirrup]

Roll20 hosts a boatload of TTRPGs, if you can think of one, probably there's a table for it

[buoyant oar]

Strike through text is the bane of my existence. We had a player that would send spite remarks with strike through

[orchid root]

hm okay

[lavish flame]

Corny

[orchid root]

what is?

[snow agate]

is discord itself accessible for blind people

[lavish flame]

I like strikethrough for one off jokes. Using it for spite is so wack lmao

[orchid root]

bruh i have to buy games from roll20 😭

[humble cairn]

Yes. Through text-to-speech programs, I believe.

[hollow stone]

i use strike through to represent when i'm not being genuine, like saying something explicitly because it's funny and not a thing that i mean with any hostility

[snow agate]

hm

[lavish flame]

yeah, screen readers

[humble cairn]

Yeah except for the limited free rules, D&D isn't free.

[uncut zenith]

There are screen reading programs that work on the entire computer without having to be directly connected or extended to specific programs

[hollow stone]

i don't know if they have built in TTS, but there are programs for screen reading like everybody else has said

[humble cairn]

There are other games which are free, however.

[orchid root]

Oh wait mb I deleted it

[rough basalt]

The only free RPG I can think of is Pathfinder

[lavish flame]

they read the text on screen. Hence why we have rules about emoji spam and strikethrough text and all that jazz. Screen readers get wombo combo'd by weird text and emojis

[orchid root]

Sorry

[rough basalt]

All of its content aside from adventures are free

[idle oar]

Yeah posting single character posts (including emojis/stickers/reacts) is also problematic as it can disrupt the flow of the discussion and some of them, if not in line with text, can be very confusing as it may not convey the context and meaning.

[humble cairn]

Fate is free as well.

[uncut zenith]

I worked with a blind man once whose computer had a screen reader loaded directly onto his computer provided by the School for the Blind that worked on whatever he needed, without having to serve as like a browser extension

[orchid root]

Okay guys im gonna go play my first roll20 game

[buoyant oar]

DnD core rules are free. Same with Draw Steel

[orchid root]

Wish me luck

[lavish flame]

Wishing you the best gang

[snow agate]

i dont know if ive seen a person with one talk here but i suppose there are lurkers

[stuck shuttle]

I am surprised you found a game that quickly

[rough basalt]

Ah yeah draw steel

[shy stirrup]

Gygax v. Arneson - you can't copyright rules

[orchid root]

Im gonna play the fallout one

[idle oar]

Many TTRPGs have free starter rules

[hollow stone]

i love legal precedent ❤️

[idle oar]

But yeah the creators do need to be paid to keep the lights on and all that

[shy stirrup]

It's the legal precedent for OGL, basically

[hollow stone]

not all the time, sometimes judges choose to be evil on purpose, but it makes things consistent

[lavish flame]

Its not exactly something that gets advertised to the other users

[orchid root]

Oh wait how do I look for games again? I might just wait later to play w my friends

[buoyant oar]

One of my favorite things MCDM did recently was highlight bunch of Community content for Draw Steel. DND used to do that with the Guild but hasn't in a long time. A periodic blog post in DDB would do wonders for smaller DND creators.

[idle oar]

Read the information in #find-a-game carefully as it explains how to use the Looking For Games channels

[idle oar]

Maybe toss that into #server-feedback? sounds like a great idea.

[orchid root]

Thanks btw cool username

[uncut zenith]

That’d be cool. Hopefully WOTC has the manpower to keep up with something like that after all the layoffs they’ve had these past couple of years.

[orchid root]

wait guys does stranger things have magic? Idk

I thought it was like defeating monsters and etc w powers

[hearty bay]

I wonder if a gestalt character could work as an enemy npc

[snow agate]

what kind of powers?

[hearty bay]

Had an idea involving mixing a barbarian and a warlock

[lavish flame]

i mean yeah. its got pshchic powers thay are just telekinesis

[orchid root]

I think like telekinesis

[orchid root]

DOESNT proffesor x have telekinesis?

[lavish flame]

there's like scrying magic and telekinesis and other worlds, its fairly magical

[hollow stone]

i mean the problem is that Rage doesn't let you cast spells

[orchid root]

Im a huge comic nerd

[snow agate]

that sounds like magic...

[lavish flame]

telepathy. jean gray has telekinesis

[hollow stone]

no that's telepathy

[fleet jay]

Is there any point in making throwables based character?

[orchid root]

Mb yeah

[fleet jay]

Or they re gonna be weak?

[humble cairn]

Yes, it works better in the most current rules.

[hearty bay]

It's a melee breed of warlock, anyways, and it would be an enemy, so not necessarily bound by such rules

[lavish flame]

they're pretty sweet

[fleet jay]

Huh? I thought it was bad

[orchid root]

Idk maybe it’s just powers and etc

[humble cairn]

It's not.

[buoyant oar]

Highlighting DnD Creators on the Guild > more influencer third party live plays plz

[hearty bay]

The gestalt would be a base for what it can do

[lavish flame]

I aspire to make the classic greek hero, spear+shield+javelins. That fantasy isn't complete without throwing javelins

[humble cairn]

There was an update of the rules in 2024. They changed a few things, and those changes made thrown weapons better.

[hollow stone]

tele is remotely, kinesis is move and path is mind, a telepath can remotely mind, otherwise read and transmit thoughts like a telephone can allow you to hear and transmit sound over otherwise impossible distances, and telekinesis is to remotely move objects

[uncut zenith]

Honestly I’d even be happy if they sent out a monthly newsletter via email blast like DMs Guild does

[humble cairn]

I made a Glory Paladin who throws Olympics style discuses (light hammers) and javelins (mechanically tridents). It was well .. glorious.

[buoyant oar]

Like Ed Greenwood's Announcement of 4... Yes 4 full books focused solely on taking the Dalelands Chapter from Adventures in Faerûn and really getting in deep with it.

[hollow stone]

i thought we had throwing javelins? the only problem was that they had terrible ammo economy

[lavish flame]

we do

[humble cairn]

Smiting on a thrown discus was very fun.

[lavish flame]

light hammer discus is genius

[humble cairn]

Javelins are and have beena thrown weapon.

[orchid root]

Well i dont think telekinesis is magic

[hollow stone]

yea they just have terrible ammo economy compared to tool + projectile because in that case the tool is the projectile

[orchid root]

Idk if im wrong

[silk hare]

it can be both magical and not magical in nature, just depends on the setting

[humble cairn]

Light Hammers are so so reflavorable. They can be discuses, iron rings worn on the forearms, brass knuckles, nunchaku .. really anything fast and bludgeoning.

[orchid root]

I think stranger things was set not to be magical

[hollow stone]

telekinesis can be magical, but powers often have different causes

[orchid root]

Can you give an example about it being magic?

[humble cairn]

I mean, they're not that expensive. I would dare say most D&D games get to the point where their cost is negligible.

[lavish flame]

thrown weapons got a very roundabout biff in 2024 when monsters lost out on nonmagical resistances and immunities

[silk hare]

maybe, I wouldnt know, but doesnt stranger things work a bit on DnD rules? and considering that the "spell telekinesis" is magic and the feat also increases spell casting, you could argue it is

[humble cairn]

There is literally a magical spell in D&D that gives you telekinesis.

[orchid root]

Makes sense

[lavish flame]

in the movie Lucy, Lucy develops a bunch of abilities after undergoing a lab experiment that allows for 100% usage of her brain. its a pretty dumb movie, but there its a sci-fi explanation

[orchid root]

Well it wasn’t confirmed by the duffer brothers i think so it might just be a theory

[humble cairn]

"Magic" is just a label, anything not well understood can be called magic.

[orchid root]

Ive seen that one i lost brain cells watching that one

[hollow stone]

like how Aladdin's carpet could fly because it's magical and Omni Man can fly because his ears have balancing organs in them that allow him to create his own leverage and abandon the ground

in the case of non-magical telekinesis, you can say that you're using electromagnetism to manipulate the position of the electrons in the atoms and, by law of magnetic attraction, are also dragging everything attached to the electrons with it

[silk hare]

I mean "Vecna", "Demogorgons" etc etc, there deffo is a similarity there

[orchid root]

Yeah so like elevens powers is used by a electro magenetic field no?

[hollow stone]

or that you're making gravity do things that are highly abnormal, that's also an explanation for telekinesis that isn't necessarily magic

[hollow stone]

i have no idea i don't watch stranger things

[humble cairn]

Most powers can be attributed to magic, but can also be attributed to just about any other kind of power. Mutant powers, psionics, alient technology, quantum manipulation ... magic. All of it.

[hollow stone]

they probably don't explain it at all

[orchid root]

Is Vecna in dnd? If it is then im buying that sh faster then i can eat bread

[silk hare]

tbh questionening the logic of sci-fi and fantasy doesnt make sense in the first place, even if you only have rudimentary understandings of physics

[silk hare]

a different one, but yes A "Vecna" does exist

[orchid root]

Awsome

[lavish flame]

Imo, any phenomenon that goes unexplained, that you could not replicate irl, thats magic to me

[humble cairn]

Yes, Vecna is an iconic D&D villain, though the character is Stranger Things is .. not the original and isn't really very much like the original, either.

[lavish flame]

Vecna originates in D&D.

[silk hare]

at the end of the day, high enough technical prowess is indistinguishible from magic

[orchid root]

Maybe but for it to work i think it would usually need electromagnetic powers as explained in the show

[shy stirrup]

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

• Arthur C. Clarke

[snow agate]

i think anyone could distinguish normal vs magic in the context of dnd if they're not being pedantic and suspicious about it

[silk hare]

thats the one

[orchid root]

And eleven was made in a lab

So who knows atp

[lavish flame]

I just sorta think "if you explain it, then its probably technology, if you don't its probably magic" and call it a day

[uncut zenith]

Yeah, the D&D IP used in Stranger Things are more like the kids using D&D characters to name/identify their enemies. The Vecna/Mind Flayer/Demogorgon in ST aren’t exactly like their D&D counterparts.

[lavish flame]

well no, she was born from a human the regular way

[silk hare]

research and magic arent mutually exclusive

[orchid root]

Yeah but was raised in a lab we honestly never got the backstory so I can’t really say much

Of how she got it

[silk hare]

wasnt it said that bc they experimented with drugs to expand her mothers mind

[opal kraken]

Hello

[humble cairn]

And it's Scifi inverse: Any technology that is distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.

[silk hare]

she got the powers or sth, isnt that like one of the first episodes?

[orchid root]

I think I can’t remember

[lavish flame]

They're basically nothing like their D&D counterparts. The Mind Flayer is either an Elder Brain or Gibberith Mouther, Vecna is just a telekinetic, Demogorgon is basically any monster

[umbral girder]

If it wasn't for the "She" pronouns I would have thought yall were talking about Sephiroth

[orchid root]

So the final answer

[hollow stone]

there's also
"Sometimes magic is just science we don't understand" by whoever writes Zenyatta's lines in Overwatch

[orchid root]

Is that eleven is telekinesis but without magic because they were experimenting with her mothers mind w drugs

[silk hare]

again, neither confirmed nor denied if its magic or not

[lavish flame]

Stranger Things uses the MK Ultra experiments (a very real, very disgusting bit of government sanctioned torture) to explain why the characters have telekinetic powers.

[orchid root]

True

[umbral girder]

Pretty sure physic powers are still magic

[silk hare]

yup, didnt remember the name of it but I read up on it some time ago

[hollow stone]

yea, or like anything named for a Greek god whatsoever at all, like Rainbow Six: Siege's Deimos, Keres, Phobos, Skopos, Talos, and Collosus

[orchid root]

True mk ultra powers were used w drugs no?

[hollow stone]

they're vaguely thematically similar but aren't the same thing by any accurate measure

[lavish flame]

yeah like this is absolutely magic still. the people of small town indiana would not see this girl flip a van and say "clearly she must be using technology!" she flipped that shit with her mind, thats magic

[silk hare]

agreed

[orchid root]

So final answer is that its neither its magic or non magic

Because its not confirmed

Welp that puts the final nail in the coffin

[uncut zenith]

Yeah, the kids only named the Demogorgon that because it was the only monster they had ever seen and they had just been leading up to fighting Demogorgon in their campaign. They called the Mind Flayer that because of its ability to enthrall people, and Vecna’s just Vecna because he’s the closest thing to a humanoid creature of death. The naming of the monsters in ST is purely diegetic.

[shy stirrup]

What is "magic"?
What are "powers"?

[hollow stone]

it's magic in the comprehension of we having literally no idea how it works but it does

[torpid ocean]

bro WHY is vecna in dbd

[opal kraken]

How are you guys doing?

[orchid root]

Good you?

[idle oar]

That’s where vecna came from

[opal kraken]

Good

[knotty pasture]

I guess magic's basically anything supernatural that can't be explained with science

[orchid root]

Honestly idk dont ask

[torpid ocean]

I meant dead by daylight sorry

[orchid root]

Maybe in the future

[orchid root]

Bruh

[knotty pasture]

Nah at that point it'll just be science still

Magic theory within fantasy is really just a fictional branch of actual science

[idle oar]

Maybe because they are such an iconic villain. 🤔

[orchid root]

Maybe unless they develop something thats actually gonna help

[uncut zenith]

Marketing and cross-promotion. Same reason why other killers/slashers from different IPs like Michael Myers is in the game.

[torpid ocean]

why not strahd?

[hollow stone]

like how the norse used blood "magic" to forge better swords, what they knew was that the greeks did that and what they didn't know was that by plunging the hot metal into the blood they were infusing the steel with carbon, making a better sword than the steel they were originally using

[knotty pasture]

I think you're consuming too much dnd media lol

[lavish flame]

This is my stance tbh. If the phenomenon goes unexplained, some magic stuff just happened. If it goes explained, there's probably science and technology involved.

[lavish flame]

he's busy being imprisoned in his fiefdom

[orchid root]

Maybe so it’s magic/technology

[uncut zenith]

By using Vecna, they get the benefit of targeting two different audiences: D&D players and Stranger Things fans. Because even if Vecna in DbD is the D&D version, the name is still recognizable by ST fans.

[silk hare]

didnt they just use the bones of their ancestors in the kiln?

[hollow stone]

they thought and had every right to believe they were doing magic but with the modern knows we know what was happening

[orchid root]

Imagine if they add the mind flayer in Dbd

[hollow stone]

oh, i heard they used the blood of lambs to quench the sword

[opal kraken]

Are stickman drawings of D&D characters ok?

[idle oar]

Also Strahd might not have the right vibes for the target audience

[orchid root]

The hit box would be too big if im not mistaken

[hollow stone]

lambs and sheep, obv, not just lambs

[shy stirrup]

Strahd is just a reskin of Dracula, Vecna is a little more...exotic and original

[hollow stone]

that's a your table thing

[silk hare]

to be clear I dont have a credible source, just sth that I remember reading some time ago

[opal kraken]

Ok

[hollow stone]

oh same lmao

[umbral girder]

Why not?

[opal kraken]

Which channel can I ask tho?

[lavish flame]

Strahd is such a cool villain, its a shame he's so awful

[orchid root]

WHats strand?

[umbral girder]

Also Vecna is kinda a cooler villain than Strahd

[hollow stone]

just ask your DM, it's different standards among different people

[uncut zenith]

Strahd is cool, but by virtue of just being Dracula with a different name, he’s not as original a villain as Vecna

[orchid root]

Ive been talking to you guys for 2 hours already lmao

[opal kraken]

Ok

[silk hare]

vampire

[umbral girder]

A vampire who took chasing after a girl, who said No, too far.

[lavish flame]

Strahd is D&D's take on Dracula. He lives in Fantasy Transylvania (Barovia) and dwells within a big scary castle (Castle Ravenloft). He's got a few notable adventures about him throughout D&D's history. He's a great villain because Dracula is a great villain.

He almost literally shares all of Dracula's history, just with new names for things

[nova trellis]

Whatever works, works buddy. You're simply using a medium to get across a scene.

[nova trellis]

Strahd is so silly.

[hollow stone]

i know one party i had used a projector and a whiteboard for maps, so i named all of my characters for symbols and then put the symbol on the map

[snow agate]

certainly leaves it up to the imagination

[opal kraken]

Ok

[nova trellis]

Without spoiling, I feel every group goes thru a change in perception on Strahd where it goes from fear and respect to "wow, this guy is such a incel" and the rest of the campaign turns into the flanderization of Strahd.

[opal kraken]

Ok

[snow agate]

ngl i just thought he was bored and lonely

[limber trail]

I’m gonna be running knockoff strahd in my homebrew world as a one shot in a few weeks, it’ll be fun

[silk hare]

even worse if people actually know some vampire lore like the flowing water thing which is less commonly known

[uncut zenith]

Yeah with a few minor exceptions, he’s almost a 1:1 stand-in for Vecna

[nova trellis]

Doesnt help that Strahd loves showing up in person when he's.......just not great at fighting groups.

[silk hare]

true that, I mean in his castle thats different, but yeh outside its just dumb

[hollow stone]

tbf that's how a lot of authoritarians go, they're scary and demand respect until you discover why they're doing that and then it's just "damn man, that's like, pathetic."

[snow agate]

its hard to take a bad guy seriously if they just show up to talk about random stuff

[pure tapir]

btbtW if dm says roll for consitution something bads about to happen

[snow agate]

its like i thought you were gonna kill me but now were just yapping

[uncut zenith]

He didn’t love showing up in person unless it’s an unexpected ambush, and usually it’s just for temporary tormenting of the party. Typically for lasting damage outside of the castle, he sends his minions. Wolves, undead, weaker vampires, etc.

[shy stirrup]

Strahd, like any BBEG, can depend on how the DM is playing them

[limber trail]

Typically true of most saves

[pure tapir]

Lol

[nova trellis]

Like, I love Strahd, I really do. But its so easy for the campaign to turn into a spooky Saturday morning cartoon.

[silk hare]

yeh but constitution is usually worse

bc most dms use it for poisons etc, that might lead to other things

[limber trail]

I usually associate wisdom with being the scary one. Con is bad but not terrible.

[silk hare]

wisdom just means spell imo

[snow agate]

charisma save means ur cooked

[pliant sapphire]

Wisdom is more common

[silk hare]

how so? xD

[uncut zenith]

The issue with a campaign like Curse of Strahd (or any horror campaigns tbh) is that D&D is inherently a heroic fantasy game. So it’s kinda hard to scare the players. But the other goal with horror in D&D isn’t to make the campaign scary for the players, it’s intended to be scary for their characters. So unless the players lean into the narrative horror, it doesn’t land.

[snow agate]

it is often representative of corruptive forces

[limber trail]

Mental saves typically come with some kind of loss of control of your character

[silk hare]

oh ok, thats a new one

[hollow stone]

an Int save sounds funny in the right context, especially with Int saves being so rare

[limber trail]

Int saves can be horrifying used properly

[snow agate]

players will be more scared of an empty hallway with a door at the end than they will be of a vampire tbh

[hollow stone]

i don't even know of anything that uses Int but i know it'd be funny if they had to roll an Int save to remember a password

obviously, as a DM, you need an additional route if you wanna do that to someone

[uncut zenith]

Yeah, a lot of times the natural reaction to an empty room in a dungeon is, “…why is this empty? There must be something else going on.”

When really it might just be… an empty room.