#dnd-lore

1 messages · Page 9 of 1

iron saffron
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What you recommend then?

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Sure, but it lists the books referenced.

viscid jackal
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did someone say stake? *hungry * (yes, i know the spelling)

mystic merlin
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Who often miss the actual nuance and even when they don’t, it gets filed down by multiple wiki operators competing for the bare minimum of verifiable, etc

iron saffron
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That's why you can look up the books themselves for more details.

mystic merlin
mossy dust
mystic merlin
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And why you should tell someone “look up the books cited in the wikis” instead of saying “read the wikis”, aye

iron saffron
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Of course, the original source is better but not everyone has access to the original books (I will never sell my 3E and 4E books! :P)

mystic merlin
stuck breach
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prom steak

mossy dust
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not unless I put it through a blender

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had dental surgery awhile back...cannot chew much right now

viscid jackal
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my dentist resculpted the sides of my lower teeth. its like they are turning to dust/disintegrating. but unknown reason. so using the stuff for fillings, resculpted to mak ethem wider and is getting a bite guard. we dont beleive i grind my teeth but they are showing this wear/tear far beyond what they should (espec considering i dont drink coke every day, i dont drink coffee/tea, and no alcohol)

zinc birch
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I just want to write something about traveling down the River Styx but am struggling to think of a plot hook or a good premise.

viscid jackal
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vacation to the lower planes?

zinc birch
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Like why would anyone even be doing that and how could they have any chance of surviving.

viscid jackal
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(and yes, i beleiv that was metnioned in one of the old PS modules) 😛

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well it was a common mode of travel

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pay the boatman and go for the ride

zinc birch
zinc birch
viscid jackal
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jsut dont fall in. (before it removed your memories). oh and the styx dragons .. beware. i think their breathe weapons were water from teh styx 😛

zinc birch
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There’s like so many other hazards too. I think you would just have to skip the Abyss entirely.

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It’s just too dangerous.

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And also the path of the Styx in there gets really confusing

viscid jackal
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the Abyss is sad 😦 its a fun place

iron saffron
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The River Styx itself is dangerous. Mortals could lose their memory if they fell into it.

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Various aquatic yugoloths and demons inhabit Styx too

zinc birch
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Oh yeah it’s all dangerous. But like the Abyss is just too extra. I wonder if even the Boatman goes there.

zinc birch
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uhhh

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Merrenloths?

viscid jackal
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yeah the styx did flow thru before.

iron saffron
viscid jackal
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the boatman back in 2e, was a unique? well not unqiue but maybe a more powerful altraloth

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hezrou?

iron saffron
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There was Charon and charondaemons

zinc birch
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or sorry I was thinking of Hydroloths

zinc birch
viscid jackal
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tehre's also a piscoloth 🙂

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water based

zinc birch
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Seems like the Merrenoloths are actually Boatmen too so maybe one of them could be a guide if paid well enough.

zinc birch
viscid jackal
iron saffron
zinc birch
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I mean I guess in theory the protagonist could be a Yugoloth themselves but I dunno if that would work from a writing perspective

viscid jackal
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raelly? tehy have an actual charondaemon for charon? that is , not sure y, but so cool to me 🙂

zinc birch
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well I guess that’s a good answer for how to travel the River Styx, but I guess the harder question is why.

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Like I had some ideas but they were all too grandiose. I feel like something more grounded would work better.

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Then again maybe the whole concept is inherently grandiose.

viscid jackal
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im still going for the vacation card 😛

zinc birch
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I mean the Lower Planes are so freaking dark that having a comedy plot to balance the mood would be useful.

viscid jackal
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no no. i dont mean comedy. i mean legit. there are some places in the lower planes that are cool. and more powerful beings would go there just to see it

iron saffron
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A D&D take on Dante's Inferno?

zinc birch
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That’s not a bad idea.

zinc birch
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The original idea I had was escaping from Carceri along the river styx through the other lower planes, but that’s just inherently doomed to failure isn’t it?

viscid jackal
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i thought. maybe oldman knows, other beings leave the boatman alone.. so if u paid him, u can travel relatively safely

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so a trip isnt that bad. once u get to the destination though u beter be able to survive

scarlet sierra
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Cheese?

zinc birch
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Are there any cheese themed fiends?

scarlet sierra
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That’s what I’m asking.

zinc birch
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I mean the abyss has infinite layers so there COULD be a cheese layer

scarlet sierra
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Make it official, WotC!

zinc birch
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I mean wasn’t the whole idea with the infinite layers of the Abyss that people can homebrew their own layers?

scarlet sierra
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I’ll add it to me list, then, see you in 4-7 months.

stuck breach
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Demon Cheese!

scarlet sierra
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Exactly.

zinc birch
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Maybe the layer is made of Cheese and the Demons are just cheesemongers

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Or maybe there are malignant cheese elementals

stuck breach
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I can imagine some plot line in which some agent of Zuggtmoy is causing demon-tainted cheese to happen

zinc birch
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Only thing I can say with certainty is that a cheese layer MUST have rat/mouse demons

scarlet sierra
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We’re get off topic, I think. But exactly.

zinc birch
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I mean the infinite layers of the abyss being unknowable is a real lore thing right?

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This does raise a real question though, how much do fiends actually like delicate human foods such as cheese?

stuck breach
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I mean if the Abyss really is infinite, then there absolutely has to be a cheese layer, because if there weren't, it couldn't by definition be infinite.

zinc birch
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that’s actually true

stuck breach
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Though is it truly infinite or is it infinitely spawning, in which case there doesn't have to be a cheese layer, but there would have to be at some point.

zinc birch
stuck breach
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If you go by the 1e core books, then the Abyss has 666 layers.

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It's well established that the game's lore is inconsistent from edition to edition.

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And the inconsistencies can't always be reconciled. The sum total of the game's lore isn't frankly meant to be consistent.

iron saffron
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I believe 2E Planescape introduced the Shard of Ultimate Evil and it's continuously drilling into the Abyss and creating new layers. Asmodeus has part of the shard in his Ruby Rod and wants the rest of it, hence the Blood War (this is from memory)

zinc birch
zinc birch
stuck breach
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There are fans out there who really want it to be, but the fact of the matter is, it just isn't

iron saffron
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2E's lore changed from book to book. In one book the demon lords were just that but in Monster Mythology some of them gained godhood only to be back as demon lords in another book...

stuck breach
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tbh, that pleases me.
"Are demon lords gods?"
"Depends on who you ask"

mellow ferry
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Unreliable narration ftw

stuck breach
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Fallible and inconsistent scholarship suits a setting which is in some degree medieval

iron saffron
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3E was no different. The monster statblocks of demon lords and archdevils changed from book to book. I think the archdevils were just their aspects (their true forms were quasi divine)

stuck breach
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Standardization is the realm of post-industrial revolution

raven needle
zinc birch
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If the Shard of Ultimate Evil is up for debate does that mean that Obyriths don’t exist in every version?

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I mean besides the first edition which obviously didn’t have them I assume?

raven needle
zinc birch
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I mean I guess Obyrith lore isn’t really THAT important but it’s kind of cool

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I guess they just rendered all three types into general “demons”?

iron saffron
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Wastriliths were obyriths

zinc birch
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Looks like they got rid of all Loumara types entirely except for the Dybbuks

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maybe they will be in the Planescape 5e

stuck breach
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Suits the "simplified" aesthetic of 5e

zinc birch
# iron saffron Wastriliths were obyriths

I guess there aren’t that many Obyriths that actually have an active role in the lore but I like the idea of Obox-Ob just being down there somewhere waiting to conquer the Abyss again

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The only really important ones are Pazuzu and the Sibriexes and they don’t need a special origin story really

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Although it’s kind of important for the Sibriexes

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Because it explains why they work for Demogorgon

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well and Dagon too

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But at the same time it also doesn’t really matter

white ravine
viscid jackal
viscid jackal
# iron saffron 3E was no different. The monster statblocks of demon lords and archdevils change...

they had aspects but also true forms. the book or another book then said you can give them divine ranks/epic rules if you want them to be more powerful. the, hordes of the abyss IIRC says, in a sidebar, that they are weaker than the versions published previously (in the book of vile darkness) so that they are easier to use in msot campaigns but feel free to either use the vile versions or add the extra high level rules. something to that effect

iron saffron
iron saffron
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But yeah, the Book of Vile Darkness also has statblocks for the archdevils but not as aspects.

Again, inconsistencies between books within the same edition.

viscid jackal
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well vile was 3e. the codexes were 3.5 and they explained the reason was on purpose to make them usable in more games. the CR 30 stuff in vile. if u convert that as is into a 30+ for 3.5e, how many would use it i guess? shrug

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they are similar at least. not like a total redo at least

spiral depot
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Are there any other temptation fiends in d&d other succubi (and Erinyes)?

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I can take ideas that aren't D&D, such as folk lore.

iron saffron
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Yes.

spiral depot
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Are you going to give ideas?

zinc birch
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Maybe that would work. Not sure if there is an analogue in DND you could use or maybe you could homebrew something based on a similar stat block

iron saffron
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They're the stereotypical devil with a contract

spiral depot
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Ooooo, thanks you two.

steel pagoda
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Lots of fae creatures use charms. Hag, pixie and satyr to mention a few.

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Night hags for exemple can change appearance to trick people. Pixies are mischevious. Satyrs can enthrall with their music.

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Or a dryad could charm someone if they deemed them a threat to the forest.

hazy fox
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So something popped into my head.
Despite Eberron Drows not being “that evil”, they don’t seem to have playable character option (aside from isolationism) or any notable NPC.

unkempt merlin
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? They are playable

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There are multiple prominent drow cultures in eberron as well

hazy fox
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I see, just don’t see them mentioned in adventure save for “reclusive jungle tribe, secret war against abyss, and totally not Sun Warriors”.

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That and lack of drow adventurers art as well.

unkempt merlin
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What adventure?

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And the reason they are on the periphery in most eberron content is because largely they are from an entirely different continent than where most eberron stuff focuses

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Which is to say, not Khorvaire. There are drow on khorvaire, but they are rare-er and not really seen as different than other elves for the most part by most people

cunning girder
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But I think the majority of drow are on Xendrik

zinc birch
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Drows are almost uniformly secretive as a race right?

unkempt merlin
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Setting dependent

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In eberron? Not exactly

unkempt merlin
mellow ferry
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Yeah, 5e Eberron very much focuses on Khorvaire, not Xen'drik, so you won't see a lot of drow in more recent books

hazy fox
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Good point.

hazy fox
unkempt merlin
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That kind of art doesn't exist for.... so many things. That doesn't mean those things aren't playable

runic cave
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What’s up with zariel’s design change?

scarlet sierra
eager bay
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Are the fey primordial?

unkempt merlin
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they could be described as primordial in some definition yes. But they would not generally be considered Primordials in most settings. (Those are typically Elemental in nature)

zinc birch
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The Feywild is probably my least understood plane

iron saffron
storm dagger
zinc birch
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So did Morwen make the Feywild kind of like how the Raven Queen made the Shadowfell?

nova hill
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idk

unkempt merlin
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The Raven Queen didn't make the Shadowfell

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also who is Morwen?

eager bay
unkempt merlin
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no, there are plenty of fey that aren't a part of any court

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there are also other courts

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ofc, this also varies dramatically per setting

zinc birch
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Oh sorry I was thinking of Morwel but seems I got the wrong backstory for the Shadowfell and made the wrong assumption about the Feywild

white ravine
white ravine
mellow ferry
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Also, until Witchlight and Domains of Delight were released, it was probably the plane with the least amount of lore.

white ravine
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I wouldn't say that (at least in 5e's terms that's true) but it's just that feywild lore is convoluted

iron saffron
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Feywild was introduced in the 4E Manual of the Planes with 15 pages.

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I have the book in front of me.

mellow ferry
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Yeah, but even it's precursor, Faerie, didn't get more than a paragraph or so before 4e

iron saffron
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Huh, the Isle of Dread is part of the Feywild now...

mellow ferry
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You wanted Feywild-type stuff before then, you went to Arborea

iron saffron
mellow ferry
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The myths associated with the history of the fey stated that they'd lost their actual home plane - Ladinion.

magic jackal
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I would be kinda disappointed if the lore of the chaotic feywild was easy to untangle and not at all confusing.

jagged apex
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does anyone happen to know how much the skull of a white dragon wyrmling would weight?

dusk quail
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Here know the way there's lots of god's in different domains in DnD other than real life pantheons what are some dnd gods/goddesses of war

iron saffron
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Which campaign setting?

dusk quail
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Regular I guess

iron saffron
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There isn't really a default setting...

dusk quail
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Don't quite get what ya mean

iron saffron
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There isn't a default / regular setting.

dusk quail
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Sorry that sent late

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Meant to send that after my initial message

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Like wdym by setting

iron saffron
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Campaign setting like the Forgotten Realms or Greyhawk.

dusk quail
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Ah

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Forgotten realms but ya already linked that so it's G

undone kelp
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Anyone know why DnD Vampires are effected by running water?

Not asking for the reason because of the lore irl, but the in game lore reasoning.

iron saffron
undone kelp
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So your so saying their is no DnD justification

cyan jay
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im looking for a dm for a solo campaign

iron saffron
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In European folklore water was seen as a barrier that prevented the crossing of unholy beings, however running water was generally the strongest in this sense. Since running water is much cleaner and less likely to harbour diseases, it was considered holy.

undone kelp
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So excluding irl

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Is their a DnD reason

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That's what am attempting to ascertain.

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If not then their is none?

iron saffron
undone kelp
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Ah, ok.

iron saffron
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Again it's loosely based on the European vampire folklore, similarly to their weaknesses to garlic, holy symbols, and mirrors.

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If you want to know exactly why then ask European folklore historians.

dusk quail
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Didn't know mirrors where a weakness be it folklore or real life, thought they're just invisible in reflections

raven needle
spark haven
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Gotta remember, most of the time monsters are metaphors for people who hurt us or people we don't understand. There's not a lot of logic to it

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Or at least, not a lot of evolutionary-biology to back it up

dusk quail
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Fair

jaunty holly
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Since Fey always ask for the character’s names. What would could you do or what would happen if you got the fey’s name?

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Also let’s say one of your party members is a fairy or some other fey creature. Would having their name be different from a normal human or ork name?

spark haven
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I think there's two angles to it.

  1. There's the concept of creatures having true names, and those names having power
  2. Making a deal with a Fey is binding, and they rarely state what they want directly
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If a Fey asks you "Hey, can I have your name?" and you say "Yeah, it's Jeremy", you've just given them your mundane name

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figuring out which name is being given/taken is probably the first step

lilac oracle
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Are there any good/benevolent ice/snow/winter Dieties?

crude blaze
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What setting?

lilac oracle
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5e

crude blaze
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That’s not a setting, that’s a system.

lilac oracle
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My bad i guess in general im pretty new

crude blaze
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Settings are different worlds, like Forgotten Realms, Eberron, Exandria, etc.

raven needle
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the Norse gods are imported wholesale

crude blaze
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The (until recently) base setting was Forgotten Realms, which had a bunch of gods. Pretty much any good nature god could sell as a benevolent winter/ice god, what with winter being just a specific facet of nature.

slow sleet
chrome ore
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Hi. Am looking for help from those more lore-savy with creating a backstory.
Where in Faerun are some common places for Orc/Half-Orc villages?
And where are some famous and obscure temple and monastery locations?

iron saffron
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Spine of the World has the orc Kingdom of Many-Arrows (they have peace treaties with the surrounding human and dwarf settlements).

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There are gray orcs in High Imasker.

chrome ore
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How ... advanced? ... is the kingdom?
Is it as far along as a human kingdom would be?

iron saffron
chrome ore
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Awesome.
What about Temples and Monasteries?
Or would I also find a list on that site?

iron saffron
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Temples and monasteries of whom?

chrome ore
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Anyone and everyone.

iron saffron
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Vague question, dude.

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I'm not Google...

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The Forgotten Realms wiki is a great resource.

chrome ore
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Yeah sorry.
My Half-Orc believes their Shadow Sorcerer powers are a curse and went on many pilgrimages to try learn anything he could.
So no specific deity or order mattered.

iron saffron
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Shar, the goddess of darkness and night, has sway over the Shadow Weave. She has believers, called the Shadow Adept, who try to tap into the Shadow Weave but they pay a very high cost for accessing such powerful magic.
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Shadow_Weave

slow sleet
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Shadow weave is big scary.

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Cause Shar is big grumpy

raven needle
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how widespread is knowledge of bhaal and myrkul? if someone showed up at candlekeep with a picture of a skull in a triangle would they immediately associate it with myrkul? or would this require quite a lot of digging through books to find that that is the symbol?

iron saffron
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They were dead gods but are, as of 5E Descent into Avernus, resurrected with just a spark of divine power.

raven needle
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so what you're saying is that it'd merit some digging

iron saffron
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They have cultists now trying to revive their powers (gods get their divine powers from worshippers and the more worshippers, the more power).

slow sleet
iron saffron
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5E divine powers were changed. 3.5E had divine ranks from 0 (demi-gods) to 20 (lesser, intermediate, and greater gods).

Now in 5E, it's exarchs, quasi-powers, lesser, and greater gods.

slow sleet
stuck breach
zinc birch
iron saffron
iron saffron
stuck breach
slow sleet
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Wanna know about this? There’s an entire supplement about it.

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My forgotten realms campaign guide is worth like 400$

iron saffron
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I reference my 3E FR campaign book all the time.

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I have the Deities and Demigods and Faiths & Pantheons as well.

slow sleet
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I have most of them as PDF’s currently.

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But I have “Shining South”, “The Underdark”, the Campaign Guide and Players Handbook as hard backs.

grim siren
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the 3e campaign guide is so good. A great book for DMs to immerse themselves in the Realms is A Grand History of the Realms which in son DMsGuild in PDF and PoD

slow sleet
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I won’t lie I was a huge snob towards 5E for a while.

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“3.5 is so much more complex and in depth” for years was my mindset.

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I didn’t switch until probably a year ago.

grim siren
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I have moved from 5e to PF2e and the lack of real FR lore is disappointing but then I found a lot of lore written in the AL modules for 5e so we have that which is nice.

iron saffron
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5E's SCAG is criminally thin.

raven needle
# iron saffron They have cultists now trying to revive their powers (gods get their divine powe...

yeah, that's one of the core plot points of the module. Just trying to deep dive into the background for a prelude. I guess it's reasonable that the symbolism is almost completely forgotten, but there are also cultists who use it. I read an old (3.5?) module that said myrkul's power waxed every time a weird constellation called the eye of myrkul appeared in the sky. so it's fair that this hasn't happened in ages and people don't really remember the specifics about him. but now the cult is starting to rise again

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crazy how adventure modules have changed. that was a 60 page module and the first 6 pages were a whole bunch of lore about how the world ended up where the adventure starts. a modern module would give you a paragraph. now, TBF, I don't have a clue why I need to know all about the kings who built uthtower and their war with the illithids thousands of years before to understand a dracolich moved in after they were all dead, but it does flesh out the area

zinc birch
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So how does everyone feel about PC Gnolls?

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Does the lore permit it to work in any possible way?

stuck breach
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Newer lore - not so much, older lore - they were just another type of humanoid

zinc birch
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Same with Hobgoblins?

slow sleet
slow sleet
zinc birch
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so PC Hobgoblins are fairly normal?

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But not Gnolls?

stuck breach
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In 5e lore, gnolls are specifically created by the god of gnolls to be evil demon spawn hyena creatures

slow sleet
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Gnolls being worshippers of a demon gnoll god and routinely allying with Trolls and other evil goblinoids. Not so much.

stuck breach
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Gnolls not only worship the demon god, but were created by him to be evil. The 5e lore of them preserves them as an enemy-only creature lacking the sort of free will that many other humanoid creatures would have.

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Though obviously, in your game, do what you want. Remove Yeenogu and his lore entirely from your game if you want and have gnolls who run candy shops in the town and are pillars of their community. Not the official-content lore of the current edition of the game though

white ravine
# zinc birch But not Gnolls?

Accounting for how gnolls are as a whole, its mentioned that even orcs cant stand to be around them due to how vile they typically are. Both themselves and their actions.

zinc birch
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So you couldn’t have a Gnoll who rejected Yeenoghu and had good hygiene?

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I mean I guess you are saying that they are more like Half Fiends than evil aligned demihumans now

hazy fox
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Maybe.
But on the other hand, Lizardfolk in 2E was more nuanced in that their god wanted to let them learn emotions by literally splitting into two but other wanted to be one again before 5E moved towards "cold and emotionless reptiles".
Not sure if they try nuanced Gnoll origin for player hook aside from Red Wizards book.

zinc birch
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Like maybe PC is too far but it would be cool to have an NPC gnoll with perfect hygiene

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Like they hate other gnolls and yeenoghu because they can’t stand the filth

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but I guess being a filthy demon is their nature

stuck breach
hazy fox
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That or DND along with fantasy dislike canine (at least "dog-looking") anthromorphics except setting that is one (ala Pugmire) or Furry Fantasy.
There is Kobold, but it became more reptillian.

eager bay
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Where does the divide between high, wood, and drow elves usually come from?

iron saffron
zinc birch
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Oh they are literally fiends now?

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I thought they came from the Prime Material Plane

iron saffron
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https://www.dndbeyond.com/monsters/16904-gnoll

Demonic Origin. The origin of the gnolls traces back to a time when the demon lord Yeenoghu found his way to the Material Plane and ran amok. Packs of ordinary hyenas followed in his wake, scavenging the demon lord’s kills. Those hyenas were transformed into the first gnolls, parading after Yeenoghu until he was banished back to the Abyss. The gnolls then scattered across the face of the world, a dire reminder of demonic power.

eager bay
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Though, while on this discussion, I generally am reluctant to support having a humanoid race that be strictly evil unless they were intentionally designed that way (i.e. Melkor/Morgoth and Sauron's creations)

stuck breach
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5e has gnolls as being specifically created to be evil by their demon lord creator, yeah.

iron saffron
stuck breach
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They (gnolls) lack the same free will in regards to alignment that other humanoids have, in 5e

eager bay
zinc birch
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Or like just a non evil one

stuck breach
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Creature statblock language has been changed in newer publications to say that a given creature will "tend" toward an alignment or something to that effect. Newer books which update old material will have that. I'm not sure what the future plans are for gnolls, but it's fairly clear that the vast majority of humanoids will have individual variance in alignment, but this isn't true of gnolls in the current version of the game.
It's absolutely clear that a goblin PC could be any alignment the player so chooses for their character, while there is no PC option for gnolls.

white ravine
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To describe without describing...theyre 7 feet tall, immensely strong, and not keen on mercy.

eager bay
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But like, do you see all three main kinds of elves being immortal?

static smelt
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Is Shar's Dark Weave still a thing in 5e/One DnD?

stuck breach
eager bay
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oh of course

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What about the eladrin though

stuck breach
white ravine
eager bay
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I see

stuck breach
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I'm also fairly certain that elves have never been described as "immortal" in any edition of D&D

eager bay
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No they haven't

eager bay
white ravine
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True fey typically are immortal

eager bay
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Wouldn't eladrin be true fey?

white ravine
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More fey adjacent. Think of it like...a glass of soda.

The soda represents the fey in an elf, and as we add water (mortal nature) over time the soda dilutes.

Eladrin are when, after adding in a decent bit of water, you add back in more soda of a different flavor. It's not the same as an elf or a fey, but it's somewhere along the line between the two.

eager bay
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I see

#

Then in that case I'm trying to find where their pure fey ancestor be

stuck breach
#

That would be Corellon Larethien

white ravine
#

Most likely yeah

stuck breach
#

Elven lore states that the race of elves sprang from drops of blood shed by Corellon in battle

eager bay
#

I see

magic jackal
#

You could conceivably argue that the way elven souls work is a form of immortality when compared with the other humanoid races

eager bay
white ravine
# eager bay Hmm, elaborate

When an elf dies, their soul returns to Arvandor (home plane of the elves) until Corellon sends their soul back to the mortal world to be reincarnated. Elves remember this whole process, which is how Trance works. Technical death, but would you call a phoenix dying to be the end?

eager bay
#

Aah

#

Wait, what about Trance?

white ravine
#

What about it?

eager bay
#

about how Trance works

eager bay
white ravine
#

Trance is roughly an elf...reflecting. On both their current life and past lives.

#

Think of that one scene in avatar where Aang contacts all of the past avatars to get advice. That's similar to how trance works.

eager bay
#

Aah kk

magic jackal
#

^ you can't recall your past lives fully, but through trancing you can call upon a sliver of them.

#

something like that, I think.

#

also don't elves have perfect recall of arvandor until they reach roughly 100? @white ravine

white ravine
#

Yeup. Then they forget what total harmony and true peace feels like! :D

magic jackal
#

Hell yeah! Existential nightmares!

storm dagger
storm dagger
#

On Gnolls they are listed as monstrosities now instead of humanoids.

white ravine
#

Makes more sense, at least by how monstrosities are defined

iron saffron
# eager bay Fey finch?

Darwin studied the finches of the Galapagos Islands and realized that they evolved into sub-species to adapt on each island

eager bay
#

Aah yeye

#

Do you see kobolds as more reptilian or wolf-y?

iron saffron
#

Corellon cut off the drow souls from returning to Arvandor but Eilistraee appealed to her father that not all dark elves were corrupted by her mother, Lolth.

#

Kobold since 1E were depicted as reptillian

white ravine
unkempt merlin
stuck breach
mellow ferry
umbral citrus
#

do chimera exist?

slow sleet
umbral citrus
#

nice thanks

sharp owl
umbral citrus
#

can your character be a chimera by the definition of "an individual whose body is composed of cells that are genetically distinct, as if they are from different individuals" ?

sharp owl
#

Given that none of the lore of DNA uses that notion of genetic chimerism (or genetics in general), no

#

There are humanoid and human-like lineages that are a combination of different species; half-dragons are the product of various forms of draconic magic of influence, cambions are the children of a fiend and a mortal, and then you have dragonflesh grafters that attach parts of dragons to themselves

umbral citrus
#

aww man that sad

#

Thanks tho imma go rethink my character

sharp owl
#

Remember that this is the lore channel, it's for talking about what the official lore says. If you have a character concept, don't ask us, ask your DM

spark haven
#

There's no reason the character can't work, but there's no official setting where Watson and Crick stole the credit for discovering DNA is all

umbral citrus
#

oke thank you🫡

spark haven
#

Well, I'm not too familiar with Planescape but I've heard it described as a deliberately all-encompassing envelope reality that contains all others. So maybe not entirely true

stuck breach
iron saffron
iron saffron
mellow ferry
iron saffron
unkempt merlin
#

Kobolds on western ttrpgs are generally the more draconic or reptilian version (although they do have a dog/rat-like ancestry that is more prevalent in older editions of dnd. 5e did bring back some of the doglike elements in the facial designs, particularly the nose)

Kobolds in eastern ttrpgs are often more or less just small dogs

crude blaze
#

Then you got whatever the heck WoW did

unkempt merlin
#

It pulled on the ratlike version, which iirc came from the original German stuff

slow sleet
#

Ancient Roman’s thought giraffes were chimera.

covert island
#

German Kobolds look more like Gnomes then anything and were known as helpfull house spirits who like to play harmless pranks for fun

slow sleet
obsidian gate
#

In fact, Goblin and Kobold mean the same thing in german

covert island
#

This is also true

slow sleet
#

German Fairytales. Best C+ I ever got in college. Lord, those fairytales were metal.

storm dagger
storm dagger
next wave
#

any recommended deities for a zealot tempest cleric?
I want to purge chaos, evil from the realms. Heresy and corruption needs to be purged and the roots scarred so that they never can blossom again

#

Evil needs to be eradicated. Corruption needs to be purged.

iron saffron
next wave
#

custom realm but with all the dnd deities' available

iron saffron
#

All D&D deities is a lot...

next wave
#

yeah it's a lot

iron saffron
#

This is an "Ask your DM" question rather than a lore question then.

next wave
#

getting lost in all of the mlol

inland bloom
#

Yeah, there's like... 200...

next wave
#

and said everything is available lol

iron saffron
#

You should work with your DM.

next wave
#

Doesn't mean npc's follow them tho

crude blaze
#

Any nature and/or storm deity in that list should be fair game though, but yeah. Like OldMan said, it sounds more like you should be working on your character with your DM at this point.

thorn iron
#

Hello, just wondering: can i post up my lore here, my document has a different writing style and just want some feedback

iron saffron
iron saffron
thorn iron
#

it's not DM related, just some character lore that i did

iron saffron
thorn iron
#

ok thanks, sorry for my disturbance

next wave
raven needle
#

is there a good aligned god for a death domain cleric? best I can see is the lawful neutral ones

iron saffron
#

Which setting?

raven needle
#

FR

#

but if elsewhere I can probably import them

iron saffron
#

Kelemvor is LN. I think that's the closest you'll get.

raven needle
#

yeah, he was kinda who I ended up with. And classical mythological ones like Hades or Anubis. I also saw the Raven Queen, who's apparently also LN. I guess they'll have to do. I mean... a good PC really shouldn't be worshipping Bhaal, Shar or Vecna or so 🤣

crude blaze
#

There’s Naralis Analor of the Seldarine

#

NG elf god of healing, suffering, and death

iron saffron
#

Doesn't have the death domain though.

crude blaze
#

I personally think an argument could be made for Ilmater as well, the Grave cleric domain just didn’t exist yet when he was first mentioned in the 5E PHB.

crude blaze
#

Oh, asker explicitly asked about death domain lol

#

It’s been a long day

raven needle
#

He's playing a death domain cleric. I guess it's fine to be a death god

#

so Naralis Analor in particular is a great option (especially if he wants to be an elf). Ilmater is decent too

#

thanks!

eager bay
#

How old is Toril?

iron saffron
eager bay
runic cave
#

Lore got bumped down 😢

stuck breach
#

rabble

zinc birch
#

Is Nerull dead in every version of DND or was he alive in past versions?

#

Well "alive" in quotes because I guess he is undead right?

#

Related question, why does DND have so many death gods?

grim siren
#

many different settings and little overlap in gods.

the realms has a lot because its like 4 different people fighting to be the Lord of the Dead.

iron saffron
#

You can have a god dead in one setting but alive in another.

next wave
iron saffron
#

Nerull is the god of death in the Greyhawk setting

next wave
#

I find it kinda weird, since Selune is more on the good allignment and she would probably accept neutral ones. Since she is quite forgiving of her membership

#

I mean you have the lunatics. But they are more on the chaotic good I would say. Chaotic neutral borderlines murder hobo. Tho that's probably more chaotic evil

iron saffron
#

Normally there's only one alignment chart but there are three because there are three source references.

next wave
#

yeah. Sadly I don't have Faiths & Avatars or Netheril: Empire of Magic lol

#

For now I see it as a weird quirk tbh. I don't see Chaotic netural in Selune's wiki or the church

iron saffron
#

Depending on the edition the rules for clerics' alignment vary. One edition has to be at most one step away from their god's alignment.

next wave
#

I could see her members being more chaotic neutral against shar. But need to check sources

iron saffron
#

I have Faiths & Pantheons.

Clerics' alignment: CG, CN, NG

It's the one-step rule.

next wave
#

hmmm Interesting

zinc birch
#

Are there any actual Chaotic Neutral races?

#

The Slaadi maybe?

iron saffron
#

Slaadi are outsiders, born of chaos.

zinc birch
#

So they can be any chaotic alignment?

iron saffron
#

Slaadi are CN, they are beings born of Limbo.
Demons are CE, they are beings born of the Abyss.
Devils are LE, they are beings of the Nine Hells.

#

There are exceptions to the rule of course. Like angels can fall from grace, fiends can rise to grace (but they'll probably be killed by their evil brethren).

zinc birch
severe storm
magic jackal
#

Races don't generally fall into one alignment category exclusively, rather tending towards a particular alignment because of culture or external supernatural influence but still having free will and individuality.

#

Fey for example do tend towards chaotic alignments because the Feywild influence is inherently chaotic. The whole Paarthurnax dilemma applies.

iron saffron
#

Outsiders (3E term for creatures native to the Outer Planes) are heavily influenced by their native planes, a lot of times they're literally born from the planes and thus take up the alignment of the plane.

#

But again, there are exceptions to the rule. Celestials can fall from grace. Modrons can go mad and be chaotic.

zinc birch
#

If you imprisoned a demon on Mount Celestia would they eventually become good?

night hollow
#

They would probably be very angry

mystic canopy
#

calling all lorekeepers
i need help for a character's backstory

are there any gods in the forgotten realms that are both:
a) Heavily opposed to fiends of any kind,
b) Would have paladins/clerics devoted to them, and
c) Would generally be considered good-aligned

and if so, what town/city/village would work best for them

i got a tiefling who was run out of town by a... less-than-welcoming sect of [insert god here]'s followers as part of his backstory but i still haven't picked out an actual god or town yet and i wanna think of something before it becomes relevant

iron saffron
#

Which portolio/domain?

serene crater
#

I mean Lathander or Tyr could fit the bill depending, though Tyr being the god of justice might fit better

iron saffron
#

Which pantheon?

serene crater
#

it was either tyr or torm that was justice

iron saffron
#

Tyr, Torm, and Ilmater are part of the Traid.

serene crater
#

I thought it was first two and lathander

#

though I'm mainly going off of DIA

iron saffron
serene crater
#

weren't Myrkul and Lathander part of another triad?

iron saffron
#

Myrkul was with Bhaal and Bane

serene crater
#

I knew that one, but I've heard those two gods were in another trinity, alongside the trinities they're already a part of

snow laurel
#

What would be a good fantasy version of a "ship's computer" aboard a spelljammer vessel? Aside from just having the ship be possessed by a ghost or it being an intelligent magic item, any other weird bits of D&D canon you guys know about?

iron saffron
#

Not all spelljamming ships are constructed ships. Some are living creatures that don't require a helm to spelljam.

mystic canopy
# snow laurel What would be a good fantasy version of a "ship's computer" aboard a spelljammer... 

This ship's main distinctive feature is the fully grown treant on the aft deck. The treant has a speed of 0 because its roots are woven into the deck; it and the ship are inseparable. If the ship is reduced to 0 hit points, the treant dies of shock. The ship can function if its treant dies, but the treant can never be replaced with another.

When the treant finishes a long rest, it repairs the ship's hull, enabling the ship to regain 4d12 hit points, and refreshes the ship's air envelope (turning deadly air into foul air, or foul air into fresh air).

A living ship can float on water and sail across it, but it can't land safely on the ground (its keel would cause it to roll on its side). Its standard weaponry is an aft-mounted ballista.```
mellow ferry
iron saffron
#

They weren't a formal triad but rather worshippers believe they were a triad. Lathander opposed the undead

snow laurel
#

Oh hm weird idea tangentially related to the above; does there exist stats for a "living painting" or "haunted painting" like the paintings from harry potter in D&D, as either a creature or magic item?

iron saffron
#

Not really a lore question.

#

There's probably one in 2E Ravenloft. I don't know if there's a statblock in the 2E Monstrous Manual (I would have to look but I'm working)

#

Again, not a lore question.

snow laurel
zinc birch
#

Closest thing I can think of is the Plane of Mirrors

iron saffron
#

Spelljammer has a living mirror, the fractine

snow laurel
#

I actually just found out that a living painting is a magic sentient item in the new keys from the golden vault book, so I'll pattern it off that

#

(for the record I'm going to have the spelljammer ship in my campaign have a wizard painted on the side like an airbrushed van)

eager bay
#

Are most D&D settings creationist in nature? The main ones with print material, anyway

spark haven
#

Most settings were created by someone, sure

#

But "creationist" is kind of a term describing an individual's relationship with their idea of how the world came into being

#

and that exists independently of what actually created the universe, so

#

it's a case-by-case thing

iron saffron
#

You keep asking this question...

eager bay
iron saffron
#

Humans are one of the few exceptions as they don't have one pantheon, unlike the elves, dwarves, halflings, etc who have their own specific creator deity

eager bay
iron saffron
#

Your table, your lore.

#

In official D&D settings like Greyhawk and Forgotten Realms they have specific lore on the creation of the multiverse/world.

#

You can speculate and change it however you want at your table.

latent patio
#

Does anyone know how a undead warhorse is created?

iron saffron
#

Animated Dead?

latent patio
#

But you have to recast animated dead at the end of the day just to keep that correct?

iron saffron
#

That's outside the purview of this channel.
https://www.dndbeyond.com/spells/animate-dead

The creature is under your control for 24 hours, after which it stops obeying any command you've given it. To maintain control of the creature for another 24 hours, you must cast this spell on the creature again before the current 24-hour period ends.

latent patio
#

That’s what I’m trying to avoid, I don’t want to keep saving my spell slots just to keep a undead horse, but I want to keep the look of my oathbreaker paladin

#

Best bet is to try to find a undead knight or something along the lines of that and just steal there horse from the look of things 🤣 I cant find anything on it

white ravine
#

Undead horses arent particularly very useful

#

Theyre sluggish and fairly incompetent beyond basic riding

#

As for making undead horses though, there are more methods to making undead than slapping an animate dead spell onto a carcass

#

Though if you want to actually employ that in a game thats on your DM to decide

formal agate
#

hey I'm working on my first campaign and I'm trying to come up with names for the months

#

please help

eager bay
#

Sure

#

What kinda theme do you have in the naming for months?

formal agate
#

I don't really have a theme

eager bay
#

Well yeah you should definitely have some kind of theme to make the naming less hard

formal agate
#

ok lemme do that

eager bay
#

Yee

formal agate
#

I'm also really proud of the name I came up with for the land

#

I called it Inacia

eager bay
#

Am where did that name come from

formal agate
#

I pulled it out of my buttocks

eager bay
#

Lol

formal agate
#

it's not related to anything I just went "hmm yes letters"

eager bay
#

Maybe use different alphabets from other cultures

#

Greek or latin would be a starting place

spark haven
#

who named the months?

formal agate
#

oh yeah i can use Latin for the names

spark haven
#

it's worth keeping in mind that months are made up

eager bay
#

Bruh

formal agate
spark haven
#

sentient creatures invented them, which means that their names are informed by the people using them. are these people who live underground, or in a place with three moons?

#

etc etc

eager bay
#

Oh

formal agate
#

ohhhhh

#

that makes sense

#

I gotta think about that

spark haven
#

"January" isn't some universal truth like the number of protons in a hydrogen atom

formal agate
#

I have to think about a lot of stuff actually

spark haven
#

it's just some noises some monkeys made one day

#

that stuck around

#

specifically noises that referred to an ancient emperor

formal agate
#

like how many planets are in between my planet and the sun

#

how many moons there are

spark haven
#

That could be a factor! If the celestial cycles bring different objects into view over time

formal agate
#

different cultures

#

oh my lord I have to do so much world building

spark haven
#

Different sides of the planets see different constellations at different times and with different orientations

formal agate
#

I'll get back to yall tomorrow this is a lot

polar patio
#

Does anyone know of any archdevils that have very explicit goat themes besides from the typical hooves and horns of most devils?

iron saffron
iron saffron
fringe dagger
#

I have a question to ask. In the first episode of the Dungeons And Dragons Cartoon, there were dragons ravaging the village. However, these dragons weren’t explored further and it left me with little that is known about them. What are those dragons anyway?

stuck breach
fringe dagger
#

Brown. Also, they were wyvern-like in appearance.

#

But they weren’t even referred to as wyverns.

#

They also had scorpion-like stingers at the end of their tails.

mossy dust
#

stingers on tails = wyverns

fringe dagger
#

They had a fire breath though.

mossy dust
#

Creative license

fringe dagger
#

Wish I could post it, but it’s not allowing me too. All those screenshot taking for nothing.

mossy dust
#

There are and were so many variants of a creature that it really could be anything from: creative license from the cartoon makers to a wyvern variant they saw.

#

I gave up my early D&D books decades ago, so I cannot check them.

#

But my bet is probably on the cartoon writers

fringe dagger
#

https://youtu.be/D66n31vUeyI

They first appear when Dungeon Master explains Helix’s history and how it was at the mercy of flying dragons. Presto later ||accidentally summons them at the episode’s climax||.

mossy dust
#

And remember, something doesn't exist...until someone does it. Then poof, it exists.

#

All it takes for a creature to exist is someone to imagine it.

stuck breach
fringe dagger
#

You saw the scene already?

stuck breach
#

I just watched it

fringe dagger
#

OK.

queen sand
#

Ok, so Infernal tiefling Ancestry can often be traced back to one of the main Arch Devils, right?
When it comes to demonic bloodlines, is it much the same? Or as the chaotic nature of the Abyss indicates, are these subrace/variants of tiefling based on the specific caste of demon, rather than a specifically named one?

In other words, if we were naming a subrace of tiefling, like a Rakasha for instance, would it simply be a rakasha tiefling, or their main progenator/god Ravanna?

Sorry if it's getting complicated, I'll try to break it more down if you need.

white ravine
#

I'd imagine the demonic tieflings are the same deal as the ancestry to archdevils, however not extrapolated on since the tiefling subrace list is already a mile long.

formal agate
#

my bad

humble shard
#

what started Dragonborns?

#

are they like Half-dragons?

unkempt merlin
#

Depends on the setting. You have a particular one in mind?

white ravine
# humble shard what started Dragonborns?

Nobody's really certain. Some people think they were created by Io (Big dragon god) to serve the original dragons, or that they were born from Io's blood when he was injured. Overall though, it's a mystery.

humble shard
white ravine
#

Oh...that. Nobody's really sure and there's nothing that gives a solid answer for that

modest badger
#

I think it's implied from 4e lore that they were bred to be a slave race- growing up quickly to be soldiers, but then dying off 'young', making it easier to manage them. it's pretty grim icky lore, and 5e didn't want to commit to it.

white ravine
#

Frankly dragonborn have like...6 possible origin stories now?

modest badger
#

Also I think they have the same lifespan as humans?

magic jackal
#

I think part of their origin is left purposefully ambiguous and there's multiple equally likely theories that exist in-universe.

My theory is akin to like, Carcinization, the underpinning magic of world just keeps converging on making Dragonborn in different ways.

modest badger
#

Just that they're more likely to die young in battle because of the whole martial race coding.

magic jackal
#

They're all true and Dragonborn just keep happening for different reasons each time.

white ravine
#

Magically transformed humanoids via Spellplague
Experiments by Tiamat
Made by Io as draconic servants
Spawned from the blood of Io
Bred as slaves for dragons

#

Frankly, I'd buy any of these.

However, god knows which one is real.

magic jackal
#

Also Bahamut Ritual ones no?

#

That's 3.5 i thinm

white ravine
#

Yeah but even the dragonborn hate that theory

magic jackal
#

Well it's not even a theory, it's provable because it happened.

modest badger
#

Dragonborn are oviparous (egg-laying), and youngsters are generally referred to as hatchlings for the first few months of life. However, young dragonborn grow much faster than human children do. They walk hours after hatching and master the rudiments of speech within three months. By the time a dragonborn child is 3 years old, he or she has reached the size and mental and emotional development of a 10- year-old human child. By 12 years of age dragonborn attain their adult stature, and by 15 they reach maturity and are accounted adults by other dragonborn. They live about as long as humans do, although dragonborn much prefer an honorable death in battle to a long senescence and will seek out such an end when the infirmities of age begin to appear. Few live to see their 70th year.
-Wizards presents races and classes (4e)

Age. Young dragonborn grow quickly. They walk hours after hatching, attain the size and development of a 10-year-old human child by the age of 3, and reach adulthood by 15. They live to be around 80.
-5e PHB
Compare to human PHB:
Age. Humans reach adulthood in their late teens and live less than a century
(I swear 80 used to be the norm but ey)

Post Tasha though most races are 'They live less than a century'

#

As for origins:
3.5 (Dragonborn of Bahamut- any race can become a dragonborn)

The dragonborn children of Bahamut are a unique race in that they are not born; they are reborn. Each one enters the world as a halfling, an elf, a human, or a member of some other humanoid race with all that race’s propensities and traits. Bahamut beckons to his would-be followers, and those few who might choose to serve him.
(...)
When dawn comes, the prospective dragonborn crawls inside an egg-shaped structure that she has built (see Cost) in order to sleep for the last time in her original form. This symbolic act represents her acceptance of the transformation. When the next dawn arrives, she is transformed into a dragonborn. After awakening inside the sealed egg, she breaks out of it as a glorious, draconic child of Bahamut.
-Races of the Dragon

#

4e (Distant dragon relatives said to be made fro 'lesser spirits' or the blood of Io or were a created slave race >.>.)

Of all mortal creatures in the world, dragons are the most awesome and powerful. In the beginning of days, the ancient deity Io created dragons by fusing brilliant astral spirits into the unchecked fury of the raw elements. The greater spirits became the dragons, creatures so powerful, proud, and strong-willed that they were lords of the newborn world, masters of all they surveyed. The lesser spirits became the dragonborn. Although smaller in stature than their mighty lords, they are no less draconic in nature. Dragons arose as the kings and princes over the dragonborn, who gladly followed their nobler and more powerful kin and in turn served as leaders and champions to lesser mortal races. In this dark and diminished age, dragons no longer rule over dragonborn realms, and dragonborn must struggle to make their way in the world as all mortals do—but in every dragonborn a hidden furnace of draconic blood burns with the same fury and pride all dragons know.

Dragonborn are a humanoid race of draconic origin. One dragonborn legend claims that when the gods warred with the primordials, one of the mighty primordials cleaved Io, the progenitor dragon god, in two. The two halves of the dead god’s corpse rose up to become Bahamut and Tiamat, but where the god’s blood fell, the dragonborn were made.
The legend more commonly told among other races is that Io created the dragonborn to serve and defend the dragons. In any event, the dragonborn are a martial race that forged a great empire of united city-states when the world was young. Their empire of Arkhosia fell after several terrible wars against Bael Turath, the infernal empire of the tieflings.
-Wizards present races and classes

unkempt merlin
modest badger
#

Also note though that 4e says that while they did look to 3.5 Dragonborn for inspiration, then don't consider 3.5 chosen of bahamut to be dragonborn as they intented- it's just that they wanted to use the name again. Similarily 4e didn't consider Kolli (a very old dragmag race) or Draconians to be 'dragonborn', but 5e has tried to merge some of these concepts again

lapis slate
#

Half dragons got tails (but tbf Exandrian Dragonborn can have some too)

humble shard
#

Exandrian?

#

is that just a setting or?

lapis slate
modest badger
#

New 5e Dragonborn in general seem to have tails according to the art

lapis slate
covert island
#

The art from the MTG set has them with Tails and I think those in Fizbans also have Tails

modest badger
#

So admittedly, it's more 'They appear to be able to have tails now if you want' but most art depicts them without even in the newer books.

#

COuld have sworn one of the new UAs or errata also gave them tails..

covert island
#

I think the One D&D Playtest for them just don't mention tails in general so its open to the players

magic jackal
magic jackal
covert island
#

With how little Dragonborn are used in the books themselves I think thats not so important that it's settings agnostic tbh

crude blaze
#

And setting agnostic would technically mean it can be true for FR too

covert island
#

Indeed

oblique arrow
#

After spending the past 3 hours reading up on goblin lore to help me roleplay my fighter, I have come to a conclusion.

#

I miss the great wheel cosmology :<

grim siren
#

Isn't the great wheel what it is in 5e? Or have I been playing the last 10 years incorrectly?

#

yea the dmg says the Great Wheel is the default for 5e

oblique arrow
#

oh cool, I guess it's just hasn't come up in my games as of late,

storm osprey
#

What would happen to a blind beholder?

lapis slate
lapis slate
lapis slate
modest badger
lapis slate
modest badger
#

It's labled dragonborn bard in the image.

lapis slate
#

Oh wait that might be my bad

grim siren
lapis slate
#

Ah my b

magic jackal
lapis slate
#

Is there a bigger pic of the green dragonborn where you can see the tail?

lapis slate
grim siren
#

According to the forgotten realms wiki, Page 200

lapis slate
lapis slate
#

In the full art i also see no tail

modest badger
lapis slate
lapis slate
modest badger
covert island
lapis slate
#

Yeah it is the leather of the guys shoe, cause it goes upwards to the top

modest badger
#

It's... really not, but okay.

lapis slate
#

Oh my bad actually, the red line kinda hides it actually

#

By pointing it oht it actually makes it less clear 😂

modest badger
#

It's also why I gave the original link again to compare

grim siren
lapis slate
#

Yeah, you right! Well TIL lol

modest badger
#

But in general it's a bit of an odd one for sure. 5e started off firm 'no tails', AI gave their dragonborn a tail because it looks cool, then the MTG dragonborn art specifically have tails, and some of the art is used in the books but with the tail covered over, and now in oneD&D there is nothing saying they don't have a tail.

covert island
#

Well, they also used to have breasts on female dragonborn in 4e so it's not very consistent throughout the ages haha

#

But I think the tail being so inconsistent just boils down to "The players do it anyway so just let them do what they want."

lapis slate
#

I kinda hope they do something to make half-dragons more diffrent ngl

#

Also the AI tail checks out too

modest badger
#

I.. really disliked a lot of the 4e art design for female characters because they literally said for dragonborn "Oh when it came to design, we made the guys first, and that was easy, but the woman were harder we needed to make them more feminine and curvy" so stuck boobs on.

#

Same book explained 'Oh yeah we took away the bearded female dwarf thing, because we wanted them to be sexy'

strange ice
#

They really think bearded dwarves arent sexy? damn

lapis slate
#

Hate to be a stickler but could the Mordenkainen tail being cropped out by text be an intentional choice to make it not the case?

modest badger
#

Could def be yeah

lapis slate
#

Cause the miniture doesnt have the tail weirdly

#

Could be a lost in communication thing too ofc

modest badger
#

It's interesting that for the MTG crossover they were like ;give 'em tails', but then actually looking through no art in the book actually shows a tail (even when the full artwork actually has them).

lapis slate
#

Weird choices

#

Also where is this MTG art btw?

modest badger
#

Designing the male of the race was easier than the female. Like the earlier versions of the dwarves, we did not want the females to look so similar to the males. We wanted them to be more feminine and recognizable as female dragonborn. We gave them the curvy figure of a female and while they are more slender then the males, they are still stronger and bulkier than a human.
-Wizards present races and classes

lapis slate
#

Oh is it the wandering troubadour art?

modest badger
covert island
#

Yeah the mordekainen one is deffinetly differently cropped

#

gonna use my mod powers here in a moment

lapis slate
grim siren
#

I mean WOTC has not ever been consistent. The PHB says tieflings have human skin color, or shades of red.

And then the artist have a canonical pale white skinned tiefling purple skin

modest badger
#

And gnomes should be tan to brown skin, but pre tasha/mordy's most I've seen are pale skinned.

lapis slate
#

Like Purple being a mix of red and blue, Im no artist so i dunno the exact word

grim siren
#

or how Firbolgs in Volos are completely inconsistent with anything surrounding firbolgs.

modest badger
#

I kinda like the fuzzy blue Firbolg, they've grown on me. Def more interesting than just 'big dudes with red hair' from earlier editions. They give me more huldra or troll vibes, which works for a 'nature spirit' type folk.

lapis slate
#

Blue? Arent they grey?

#

Am i colorblind? 😂

grim siren
#

imo I will take fuzzy forest friend over Great Value Minotaur critical role has made them to be

modest badger
#

blue-grey 😛

#

I can dig the furbolgs too, but there def seems to be a sliding scale for CR art of 'Firbolg' to 'Minotaur'. Including hooves and such as well.

versed shell
#

Firbolg are supposed to be giant-kin, like trolls, ogres, verbeeg, etc

#

I think they were originally also called forest giants, and we’re about the size of Goliath or half giants

grim siren
#

yep and Firbolgs are very clearly based on the Fir Bolgs of ireland. who were just big dudes dudettes and dudexes

slow sleet
iron saffron
#

They're not true giants but giant-kin

magic jackal
ebon holly
#

I think it got started when some art in volo's displayed them as fey cowlike peeps and then there were the firbolgs in critical role and now firbolgs are hippie cow giants

#

Which honestly, I think is p cool. They're like less intense minotaurs

crude blaze
#

To be fair, I think the bovine firbolgs are still mostly attributed to Critical Role. But 5E has only used like a single piece of official art for firbolgs, so who knows?

iron saffron
#

Firbolgs have been just "bigger humans" giant-kin up to 5E.

unkempt merlin
modest badger
#

There's also firbolg art in.. Tasha's? Mordys?

fresh axle
#

Neither Mechanus nor the Outlands feels like a punishment but Limbo does. Why are 2/3 of the neutral afterlives decent but the other seems closer to a lower plane?

fleet cargo
#

Tortle lore?

fresh axle
#

I mean maybe my assessment is less objective than I think and Limbo just sounds miserable to me personally?

modest badger
fresh axle
#

But like it sounds to me like almost anyone would hate it.

crude blaze
fresh axle
#

Are we talking the middle one?

crude blaze
#

Ye

fresh axle
#

I thought that was a Firbolg

modest badger
crude blaze
# fresh axle I thought that was a Firbolg

It is, that’s what we’re talking about. Critical Role has made their interpretation of firbolgs more cow-like (I think the TCSR actually explicitly states they have bovine features), but I don’t think that has expanding into any other setting.

fresh axle
#

The way I see it, Firbolgs are to Goliaths what Elves are to Humans

hazy fox
#

Like “Chill Cow” from Jo Cat music video and Kimmy’s bard character.

modest badger
#

So def going blue-grey skin, fuzzy animal like ears, and broad flat noses and wide bridges.

But I wouldn't really say bovine . I think it went that way because Mercer tried to describe the nose/ears as 'bovine' and artists went with that? but it's mostly ..fluffy ears and broad noses.

iron saffron
#

I'm personally okay with the different look of the firbolg. It makes the stand out from the rest of the giant-kin.

fresh axle
#

Also fun fact, Firbolgs are the only 5e player race to reach over 8 feet tall according to the size charts making them the largest known medium creatures

crude blaze
hazy fox
#

Taking cues from them.

crude blaze
iron saffron
#

Never read that series.

modest badger
fresh axle
#

Goliaths max out at 7’10” while Firbolgs max out at 8’2”

modest badger
#

They made the ears and face far more bovine

iron saffron
#

How tall are the PC minotaurs?

fresh axle
#

Does Ravnica have a size chart?

#

I’m 99% sure Theros didn’t

modest badger
#

And fanart often gives a tail or even hooves to the firbolg characters

#

But fans interpretation of races is often affected by other media see: Green goblins, green orcs, gnomes with brightly coloured hair...

crude blaze
#

(I don’t like the way that link formatted)

iron saffron
modest badger
#

And Pathfinder too

#

But yeah, mostly WOW

fresh axle
iron saffron
#

AD&D goblins were red, orange, and yellow I believe.

fresh axle
#

I don’t care what the Monster Manual says, they’re green.

crude blaze
#

I don’t like the goblin art that D&D uses either

fresh axle
#

(I’m being mostly facetious and in my setting green is one of several possible skin tones for goblins)

crude blaze
#

But on the other hand, I don’t like that Pathfinder’s hobgoblins are just tall goblins

fresh axle
iron saffron
modest badger
#

Who's hobgoblins are just tall goblins?

fresh axle
#

Also probably part of my affinity to green goblins is that I read Order of the Stick for years before I played a single game of D&D

crude blaze
#

Their hobgoblin art is literally just tall goblin

modest badger
#

Ah, so they are

fresh axle
#

Oh really? Best of both worlds, dnd hobbo art and Pathfinder gobbo art (I love the PF2e gobbo art)

crude blaze
#

Which I don’t think is bad art, I just like that D&D makes hobgoblins more different from goblins, even though they’re goblinoid.

fresh axle
#

Yeah I can see that. I wonder if 1DD will every give us any of the obscure gobbo races 5e skipped

#

We got the core three which is good but we never saw say Blues for example

#

(Though if Blues ever return I doubt many people would complain if they got a more creative name)

#

I guess we got Nilbogs at least

crude blaze
#

Nilbogs are both fun and horrible lol

iron saffron
#

I loved the original 1E nilbogs because they were immune to all damages and could only be hurt by healing magic.

#

I had one as a BBEG.

fresh axle
#

Were they undead?

iron saffron
#

Nope.

fresh axle
#

Wacky

iron saffron
#

They were blessed/cursed by Maglubiyet, the goblin god

fresh axle
#

I don’t know a lot about 1e-2e lore. So I guess Maggie is an OG then.

iron saffron
#

Maglubiyet isn't the creator god of the goblins but took over the mantle from their arch-fey creator.

fresh axle
#

I thought that was new 5e lore, is that old edition lore?

iron saffron
#

Yes, sorry that's the updated lore.

#

(I get edition confusion at times)

fresh axle
#

By OG I meant irl

#

As in been around since ye olden days

iron saffron
#

OG = over god? original ganster?

#

Maglubiyet has been around since 1E.

fresh axle
#

Original Gangster I guess

#

What about the bugbear god

#

Hruggek I think it’s spelled

iron saffron
#

I'm at the office so I don't have access to my 2E Monster Mythology book

fresh axle
#

Well looking him up just found something funny. In one of the 3e sourcebooks due to a misprint the Chaotic Evil bugbear god Hruggek was given the domains of Knowledge, Magic, and Law

#

A 3.5e book gave him Chaos, Evil, Trickery, and War which makes a lot more sense but that is one funny misprint

unkempt merlin
#

Goblinoids have always had a close connection with the fey, even in past editions

#

Particularly as members of the unseelie court

modest badger
#

Types like Fey and Goblinoid were introduced mostly in 3rd edition, and so before that it was wishy washy and really things could be multiple things.
Unicorns have celestial, fey and magical beast vibes.
Nereids are water elemental but also fey?
Goblins are mischievous spirits (fey) but also just li'l guys.

Types both helped with mechanics, but also meant you had to pick a box on where something went.

unkempt merlin
#

Oh yea I wasn't even talking about creature type, just the creatures themselves

gray ember
#

Do we have any further elaboration on the physicality of warforged?

#

Like what they look like inside and what makes them animated type stuff

zenith dust
#

They are made of living wood and stone, and there is a fluid that pumps through them similar to but distinct from blood

eager bay
#

How does one exactly go beyond normal priests and become a cleric?

gray ember
#

I’d think that depends on what god we’re talking about

#

I think it’s left purposely vague but it’s probably ritualistic I.E. Christian Baptism
Or maybe it’s a position earned nuns probably are clerics idfk

white ravine
#

Thats usually the inciting incident.

oak gale
#

its also a matter of having the capabilities to wield your power

#

otherwise gods would be able to just make all their priests level 20 clerics

stuck breach
#

Takes time to build up to being able to handle all that power

oak gale
#

as clerics become wiser and gain experience, they can become stronger clerics, and there is a certain level of experience and wisdom needed to first become one

white ravine
hoary plinth
#

Are there Warforged in Faerûn?

stuck breach
hoary plinth
stuck breach
hoary plinth
#

If they're not here, they're not there. I'm not looking to force anything.

mossy dust
#

get on ship in Eberron, get off ship in Faerun

white ravine
#

Given how eberron is though, thats not as feasible

#

The big draco-sky ring wouldnt be too happy about it

crude blaze
raven needle
#

or maybe there's a bunch of warforged somewhere in my game's version of faerun

hoary plinth
modest badger
#

There are things similar to warforged in FR, such as Nimblewrights, but warforged are more an Eberron thing.

#

And Nimblewrights are less playable and more fancy construct assassins

#

https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Nimblewright
So possible to work with the idea that in FR Warforged are not called 'warforged' (As in Eberron as they were forged for war), but 'Nimblewrights', but lore wise Warforged have always been a mix between construct and humanoid, leaning more humanoid just 'constructed' where as Nimblewrights are very much Constructs mechanically.

sharp owl
lapis slate
#

Tbf Dream of the Blue veil can be used to explain how warforged reached any setting right? I know one of the adventures has a lot of items from diffrent settings, is ebberon one of them?

sharp owl
#

There is no in-lore use of the spell, and it also requires something from the destination world (person or object) to be on the departure world already

lapis slate
#

Yeah but since there are objects from it in that adventure they could use those ones, or even the fact that item exists sets a precedent that more should exist

#

||that adventure being witchligh||

sharp owl
#

That adventure doesn't connect to Eberron

lapis slate
#

Im not sure if there is an item for Eberron there, but i know there are defo ones

sharp owl
#

Per the current lore

lapis slate
#

Damn is eberron the only main setting that isnt connected to it?

sharp owl
#

I dunno, just that Eberron doesn't connect to the Feywild per lore

#

It has it's own version of the feywild

lapis slate
#

That fact they have seperate versions of the feywild necesarrily exclude it though tbf I think, after all the adventure has connections to MTG and Exandria and they also have seperate versions of the feywild iirc

sharp owl
#

It doesn't exclude it, eberron is explicitly stated not to connect to the other material planes such as the feywild or shadowfel

#

It has parallels to those planes, but doesn't connect to them

#

Exandria connects to the feywild in the same cosmological sense as other settings

lapis slate
#

I think we might be using diffrent meaning by “connection”

sharp owl
#

Connection as in travel is possible

lapis slate
#

Im talking about like storytelling refrences

sharp owl
#

In the lore, you cannot travel to the Feywild from Eberron

lapis slate
#

Like the idea of an item from Eberron being able to find its way there

sharp owl
#

This is the lore channel, it's for discussion about what the official lore says

#

Not what is narratively possible for a DM

misty kestrel
#

ok - very obscure question - does types of blood (a, ab, b ,0) taste diffrent for vimpires?

lapis slate
#

Yeah im saying that isnt there an item in witchlight from Eberron is my point though, there definitely isnt?

sharp owl
#

Can you point to an item stated as being from Eberron?

lapis slate
#

Reading now to double check

sharp owl
misty kestrel
#

so im free to make it as i want too

sharp owl
#

You're always free to make it as you want. Lore isn't law

#

easy on the spoilers

#

(at least bar them)

lapis slate
#

||/spoiler Toril, Mystara and Torol are also mentioned for sure||

#

||Ok so its actually Npcs from diffrent settings but I assume they didnt travel naked so whatever clothes from them would be worthwhile items. Elegy from Sigil, Klee from Taldorei, theres a planewalker too and apparently someone from Eberron, still trying to find their name tho||

lapis slate
sharp owl
#

But I've found who you're referencing, so yeah, that would allow someone to travel from Toril to Eberron assuming that person came from the Feywild to Toril

lapis slate
#

||theres a few mentions online of some of the npcs being from Eberron||

sharp owl
#

And then a warforged could travel back

lapis slate
#

Is Toril in Eberron?

sharp owl
#

Toril is Forgotten Realms

#

If you have a person from Eberron, you could use them to convey a person from Toril to Eberron

lapis slate
#

Who was trying to refrence then lol?

sharp owl
#

Then that person from Toril could convey a warforged back to Toril from Eberron

lapis slate
#

Noiceee

sharp owl
#

The original question was about canon ways for there to be a warforged on Toril

#

It's possible only if you're playing Wilds Beyond

lapis slate
#

Im not sure what wilds beyond is

sharp owl
#

The adventure you referenced

#

Wilds Beyond the Witchlight

lapis slate
#

Oh! Now i feel dumb 😂

sharp owl
#

lol

lapis slate
#

||So there is definitely an npc from Eberron in witchlight then? Who is it?||

sharp owl
#

Although this does overlook that Dream of the Blue Veil isn't referenced in the lore at any point afaik

sharp owl
#

Oh, tell a lie, I still have the tab open

lapis slate
sharp owl
#

||Majera d’Valzey, Zurrash, and Granam||

lapis slate
#

I was gonna say it would make sense if it didnt since there isnt much in lore of that sort of travel happening and largely affecting the world, but then again it is a high level spell

sharp owl
#

Something has to be in the lore to be in the lore

lapis slate
#

True true

sharp owl
#

It being in the game means that it could be the in lore, but that's not really saying much

zinc birch
#

Was Fraz Urbluu originally a devil?

sharp owl
#

What makes you ask?

zinc birch
#

I was watching a lore video that talked about that backstory but I am not finding any references to that independently

crude blaze
sharp owl
viscid jackal
#

the grazzt thing was first mentioned in 4e i beleive. before that he was a straight up demon

#

(being a former devil)

zinc birch
sharp owl
#

Ah, well I'm not aware of any such lore

zinc birch
iron saffron
#

I never heard that before.

#

4E lore said that Graz'zt was once a devil who was sent to the Abyss but he eventually got corrupted and became a demon lord (why serve in Hell when you could be a lord of three Abyssal layers?)

crude blaze
#

Yeah, I never heard of him being the son of Asmodeus, just a devil or archdevil.

stuck breach
#

Glasya is the daughter of Asmodeus

zinc birch
#

Seems like there is a lot of bad youtuber lore out there and I should avoid Rhexx specifically

#

I mean I already wasn't a fan tbh

#

The story I heard, can't remember from whom, was that Grazzt was the son of Asmodeus and Pale Night

iron saffron
#

I've never heard that before and it doesn't make sense.

#

Pale Night is an obyrith demon lord (obyrith are the older demonic race, older than the tanar'ri). Asmodeus wants nothing to do with demons because they hinder him from getting the Shard of Ultimate Evil, which is at the bottom of the Abyss.

chrome ore
#

What's a good grave cleric deity that won't be mad at their follower not dying?
Half-Orc if that matters.
They'll always be on the brink of death but never actually die.

sharp owl
#

What setting?

iron saffron
#

Ask your DM which deities are available in their campaign setting

chrome ore
#

Sorry. Faerun. We're about to start Decent into Avernus.

chrome ore
iron saffron
#

And what do you mean by "won't be mad at their follower not dying"? Are you trying to become undead?

chrome ore
#

No. They just have many ways to drop to 1 instead of 0.

#

Or at least plan to.

iron saffron
#

That's not really not dying... just not going unconscious...

#

Kelemvor is the main Faerunian god of death (LN)

chrome ore
#

Yeah I looked at them but they sounded like they wouldn't like my guy.
Unless I misunderstood.

sharp owl
#

As pointed, going to 0 hit points isn't dying, it's being knocked out

iron saffron
#

The other gods with the death domain tend to be evil...

sharp owl
#

There are no FR deities who are opposed to that

iron saffron
#

Kelemvor doesn't like undead.

sharp owl
#

Which is a whole other kettle of fish

iron saffron
#

That's why I asked "won't be mad at their follower not dying"

chrome ore
#

Oh cool.
That opens up way more options.
I just figured they'd treat not dropping to 0 as avoiding death and not like that.

grim siren
#

Kelemvor doesn't like a lot of things particularly his current job

iron saffron
#

He didn't have much of choice on taking the gig.

grim siren
#

thanks Cyric

#

Without Cyric, Kelemvor could have been happy with his lady love Midnight, and Adon could continue third wheeling his way through life.

zinc birch
#

Which planetoid in the Prime is the most pleasant to live on?

iron saffron
#

That's a vague question. There are countless worlds in the Material Plane. Whichever campaign world you play in.

zinc birch
#

Ahh I was thinking maybe some planets are nicer than others

iron saffron
#

The two main official campaign settings, Greyhawk (Oerth) and the Forgotten Realms (Toril), are loosely inspired by Earth, so read into that how you will.

#

There's Dragonlance (Krynn) but it suffered a major Cataclysm centuries ago.

runic cave
#

I like earth. We have internet

zinc birch
runic cave
#

Well there’s 3 “main ones”

#

Eberron is not one of those 3

iron saffron
#

I don't know much about Eberron's lore.

zinc birch
#

Oh got it. So Eberron is like a minor spinoff planet.

iron saffron
#

Eberron is an official campaign setting onto itself.

runic cave
mossy dust
sharp owl
#

The following planes have received moderate to significant attention in official products

  • Eberron: Magitech world, world war happened a few years ago (the last war), quality of life is generally quite good. Think something around industrial revolution earth
  • Toril: Generic fantasy world, closer to Renaissance era than medieval. Most people live agrarian lifestyles, but a lot of people live in cities like Waterdeep. Regular world threatening events occur
  • Krynn: Medieval adjacent fantasy setting, massive war happened in recent history (war of the lance) and tore across the landscape. Before that a big cataclysm involving gods and dragons
  • Exandria: Between Toril and Eberron in terms of developmental analogues. Has multiple regions of varying levels of stability, each one recovering from various catastrophic events in recent ish history
  • Athas: Mad max hellscape. Literally the worst, 0/10
  • Oearth: Typical medieval fantasy. Knights and kings and lords.
sharp owl
#

The Ethereal Plane is a border plane between planes and is often likened to an ocean. It laps at the shores of the material plane, but you can go deeper and deeper and risk never finding your way back. Eberron resides in the deepest depths of this plane

zinc birch
#

Ahhh got it. Thanks for the explanation yall.

lapis slate
#

Damn i gotta check out Athas and Oearth, not sure ive even heard of em before

iron saffron
#

Oerth, aka Greyhawk, was Gary Gygax's campaign setting. Most of the named archmages (which a lot of the spells are named after) were PCs from his campaign.

sharp owl
lapis slate
grim siren
#

Eberron is the cool kid who doesn't like playing with the other kids

iron saffron
#

I finally introduced a spelljamming helm (or at least alluded to it) to my players last night. They were tasked to retrieve one on a small Tear of Selune. "Um, do we need a spacesuit because there's no air there, right?"

crude blaze
#

But I believe Davyd is correct, as far as lore goes, the MtG worlds are sort of their own separate beast.

lapis slate
#

It still takes place canonically in FR in the book too though iirc

#

Granted the connection is in a trinket which probs makes it a bit more murky in terms on canonicity

crude blaze
#

The adventure does, but the book itself is mostly just a guide on how to turn any adventure in any setting into a workplace comedy.

#

I could also be wrong, I’m just stating based off what I remember of it. I haven’t cracked that book open in a while.

lapis slate
#

You probs right tbh, at least in terms of the connection not being proof of a connection

#

Since its like one number on an optional trinket table

#

But damn if only that Ravnica postcard appeared in the adventure 😂

#

Oh wait!

sharp owl
lapis slate
#

There is a connection in one of the adventures, not necesarrily sure if Ravnica specifically but there is a planeswalker

#

||Thank you witchlight my love||

grim siren
#

I am super excited for book 39 of drizzt this year its teasing some major major drow lore updates. That is more than three paragraph from WOTC

magic jackal
lapis slate
# magic jackal Wait who?

||The gnome or halfling woman that helps you in the carnival…something…strings? I think her name was, she uses an instrument||

#

||Ellywick Tumblestrum||

magic jackal
#

||She's a Planeswalker in a D&D Crossover MTG set, that's not an MTG Planeswalker Lorewise. Tasha is another "Planeswalker" in another D&D Crossover MTG set, but she is not an MTG Planeswalker.||

scarlet sierra
#

I think this is the right channel for this question, what does a mimic look like when not disguised as something?
There any lore for that?

lapis slate
crude blaze
#

The FR doesn’t get super detailed, but states that in their natural state, they’re grey colored like granite. Though I’ve always just imagined them as big purple blobs to match the official 5E art.

scarlet sierra
#

Sad.

magic jackal
lapis slate
magic jackal
#

Sorry it's the boon of planar travel, but point stands.

#

MTG multiverse is separate from the D&D one, crossover sets are not canon to either.

lapis slate
lapis slate
magic jackal
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Okay do you know anything about MTG?

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Have you played it or read the books or the story articles?

lapis slate
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A Lil bit i guess?

runic cave
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Magic: the gathering: Adventures in the forgotten realms

lapis slate
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Some, read some plane shift mainly

runic cave
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And commander legends battle for Baldur’s gate

magic jackal
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Yeah that's not really informative.

lapis slate
magic jackal
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I've been playing MTG for 12 years, and DND for 9.

lapis slate
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Even so it doesnt dismiss the point

runic cave
lapis slate
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It specifically calls out planeswalker as a term that hasnt been used in a non MTG book in 5e before, in a book with nocs from a large variety of diffrent settings that werent connected before and calls her out as being from a diffrent world too

magic jackal
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The MTG and D&D IPs are owned by the same company so they make crossover material, there's MTG sets that are set in D&D universes, and there's D&D books set in MTG planes, neither of them are canonical to their respective IPs, they exist in their own nebulous bubbles. You can headcanon them to be canon in your own games of either, but that is just your games.

lapis slate
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Im not talking about those things though

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Im talking about an adventure set in the Feywild with npcs of many diffrent world, where one is described as a planeswalker from a diffrent world

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An official book

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||wild beyond the Witchlight to be clear||

magic jackal
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Planes in MTG are different universes entirely, to put it simply.

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So Planeswalker is an in-universe term in DND because people can literally walk between planes.

lapis slate
magic jackal
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And people can additionally be from different worlds in DND, it's not that hard. I mean it is, but point stands.

lapis slate
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Eberron wasnt connected to FR til that same book

lapis slate
magic jackal
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It's self explanatory.

lapis slate
magic jackal
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Planes exist, the witch light book takes place in the feywild, someone who can walk through the planes would be a Planeswalker.

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That is not the same as an MTG planeswalker.

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I don't even really understand your confusion here. This is not an opinion, this is a set of facts I am telling you.

lapis slate
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||Witchlight os the crossover book in dnd, woth 5 pther settings being linked to FR through this book alone not including MTG settings||

magic jackal
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Witchlight is not a crossover

lapis slate
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They arent facts

magic jackal
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It's a mainline DND adventure, it takes place in the feywild adjacent to the material plane of the forgotten realms.

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Neither of those are outside the DND ip.

lapis slate
runic cave
magic jackal
runic cave
lapis slate
runic cave
lapis slate